Kyiv

[QUOTE=NewMongerer; 1287893]I will be in Kiev in two weeks and as I read in this forum, Rio is the most easy way to find a hottie.

Go home with me. I also learned, price will be $300 to 400, but there are still some questions, I could not find the answer here till now. Is it necessary, to book private dances before you can go out with a girl? And if so, how much of this dances I have to spend out before I can leave? And is there any chance to find out, who finally will go out? I am afraid I waste a lot of time (and money) for chatting and private dances with girls, they finally will not follow me to my hotel.

Hope you experienced guys can give me some help for that.

Thanks[/QUOTE]Private lap dance is not mandatory for take out nor buying drinks for dancers. Private dances cost $25 for 2 songs and most time you could interview dancers for possible take out without buying any drinks. I suggest going there before 10pm, and weekdays.

I personally like to get a lap dances to get some clue on their performance once they are on your bed. I also enjoy getting lap dances from strippers, so it was no brainer for me. From my experiences in Rio, laps dances vary greatly from dancers to dancers. I took out a dancer who gave me an awsome private dance and she was also hot as hell. 8+ and she didn't disappoint once she was in my apartment, one of the my best experience with WG. I also was with couple a guys who has been in Rio quite a few times and non them got lap dances before taking a girl out. As I said on my previous report, Kiev is quite expensive for newbie, especially if you don't have 1800 numbers in your Android phone like Cruiser D, and prefer to have sex with above average looking girls. I could only wonder what kind of mutant looking girls are in his 1800 list in his phone.

Jerseyguy

[QUOTE=Kirch;1288037]May be you don't know this kind of girls. Good education etc[/QUOTE]You're talking out of your ass. One of my long-term Russian GFs has a Master of international law and is teacher at MGU. Another one is executive for Merck Moscow. Another one is sales manager at the most luxurious 5 stars hotel in St Pitersburg. Another one is divorced from a well-know oligarch. Ect.

[QUOTE=Barba; 1287065]1. I was in Vodka Bar and Shooters and the only thing missing from many wgs was a green sign around the neck stating the price.

2. So despite my limited experience of Kiev in specific, my tip to you LJ is not try to "recognize them" but to talk to them. All of them, one after another. Smile and ask "are you a girl that like some fun or are you more the conservative type that likes a long term relationship with a man?".

3. Good luck in exploring new and fun grounds where you do not only hunt lions that are sedated and placed on the savanna the night before you arrive with your sperm-gun.

4. If you are incapable of talking to unsedated females, I suggest you sedate yourself with some vodka instead. Better to get up on the horse a bit drunk, than to walk all your life.

B.[/QUOTE]Some great lines and good advice. Thank you.

1. A great line, but my experience on one foray to D'lux on a Saturday night in early 2011 was more like Poker Player 2's experience. I looked around the D'lux dance club for unattached females and looked for some clues they might be Working Girls, and it was not at all obvious to me. Is it possible there were no WG's there the night of my visit? Very unlikely. Although admittedly I spent most of my time trying to hit on girls on the circumference of the dance floor, and I have understood that I should have been hanging around the bar area more. Nevertheless, I did make several circuits through the bar area and was obviously unattached and looking, and no WG brought herself to my attention. So it seems that unexciting outcomes like what happened to Poker Player 2 on the date he posted about, or to myself in the visit to D'lux I just described, can happen. Believe me I am observant enough to know what a WG on the make looks like, and had no problem spotting them at Buddha Bar. So your advice to simply begin hitting on all girls with a differentiator line that will give any WG an opportunity to respond, is good advice, although it sounds like a lot of work.

2. See above.

3. A great line that I am savoring each time I read it, and then laughing at myself, the Great Hunter. LOL.

4. A nicely turned phrase, and solid advice that I've been following to get the edge off at any setting that involves hitting on hit girls in a social setting, where a man faces the risk of rejection.

LJ

[QUOTE=Jojosun; 1287984]LJ. Anyone who can't spot WGS in Clubs in KIEv, must be a complete newbie from Salt Lake City UTAH, or a Dumb Ass Retard.

WGS will approach you, or give you the looks.

So very obvious. It doesn't need Action Reports in Detail.

How to Speak, What to Say no diferent from here below. .

[url]http://www.wikihow.com/Pick-Up-a-Girl-in-a-Club[/url]

Note Points 11, 12, 13. Be friendly and grease the palm of the Bouncer with 100UAH, and he will sort you out.

I do point 13. Which is the best one, ie a Really Attractive Bubbly Wingwoman and not just in Kiev. It helps a lot if she is BI.

Gave this very obvious tip to Asian Chaos, and he posted later a quick clear success with the WG that his female guide chatted up for him in Buddha Bar.

He posted later that not only he had the WG on the night, but he also banged his beautiful Guide on another night.

But when he was asked to provide the details of his Female Guide and the company that he used, he disappeared from the Kiev Thread.

You are asking leading questions in your detailed report, which I doubt you will ever get straight answers.

Simply because it means then that whoever answers you, have to PUT UP the INFO, including Digits, details etc. Is this your point in the report?

And if she is such a Hottie at the price said, why do they need to post about her.

Here if they don't want to share? You know the answer.

And another question to you. I would really raise my hat 4 you, if I was wearing one for all the time & effort that you put in guiding newbies in Kiev Mongering and the grey area of WGS in normal Clubs and their prices. BUT quite honestly why dp ypu Bother being the KIEV SEX SAMARITAN to everyone here.

I would have summed up what you said in your detailed report in 5 words only.

PUT UP OR SHUT UP.

And you just carry on enjoying your mongering in the ways and the budget that suit you.

The others can go and find their own pussies.

U.

, [/QUOTE]In general I don't perceive of myself as the "Kiev Sex Samaritan" in answering newbies questions. I think that is what being a member of a hobby forum is supposed to be. One is supposed to post their experiences to provide a pool of information for the other forum members, and one who has some experience is supposed to try to be helpful to newer members within reasonable limits of patience. Posters should try to make their posts entertaining and / or informative. I don't like the cat fighting or the ornery approach of some to others that is divisive and counter productive to the purposes of the forum. Why do I bother to be helpful to others? It's in the nature of the forum, as well as that I enjoy writing about and reliving some of my experiences.

As to action reports, I am not asking anyone to give up "digits" or contact information of some hotties they found and may want to keep for themselves. However, I do think that if the pool of information on the thread does not include action reports by members who claim to have gotten dates with hot WG's for $200/2 hrs or less, then a reasonable inference should be drawn that the facts are otherwise.

LJ

[QUOTE=Jojosun; 1283715]"Mid Eastern Girls in Odessa too ". Are you sure?

It begs the question, what the hell are they doing there/

Irish Lad is another expert on the subject and know Odessa well.

It would be interesting to hear their comments on the subject.[/QUOTE]Yeah, I remember in Odessa meeting several Middle Eastern and Chinese. They are there for different reasons but a pssoible one in this case is some educational reason. You might find there's a reknowned clothes designer academy or something simlar. A few Chinese we met are there to learn Russian. Or so they said)

[QUOTE=Poker Player 2;1285473]At about 12:30 Am on Tuesday May 22nd. 2012, I went to Shooters club. I arrived with a taxi and I noticed there were a few girls waiting outside to get in. I was shown unusual respect and courtesy by all the staff at shooters. Security wished me a good evening and the doorman opened the club door and invited me to go in. There is a100 UAH fee to get in and you are given a juice can and a receipt to get either whisky or vodka from the bar inside. I missed the KASSA sign and the hostess sweetly led me to the window to pay. The disco is not large and is terribly crowded. It was previously reported that the bar is owned by some Scottish folks but I have on good authority that it is now owned by a Turkish man called Ozzy! Certainly, our Turkish\Middle Eastern friends appeared to be well represnted in the Disco on this evening. The place if full of young, mostly beautiful girls dressed to impress but perhaps not the most appropriate place for a man of my age. Nevertheless, I tried to engage two different girls in dance and conversation who appeared unattended only to be ignored. I went upstairs to the resturant which I understand has good food but I was not hungry and I also went to the bar downstairs which was mostly empty. I had a beer and was also given a choice of vodka or whiskey. I suggest you go with the whiskey; the Vodka, I did not like. The beer which I paid for appeared to be rather less expensive than other clubs. There are many things I do not get about this club- I am sure that is a function of me being uninformed mostly. There is face control but I saw many girls and boys dressed in Jeans inside. In general, I did not get the fuss about this club. What distinguishes this club for some members, I can not tell.![/QUOTE]What distinuishes this club? Tuesday night and terribly crowded.

Ozzie doesn't own the club. Your "good authority" is wrong.

Face control in shooters doesn't mean "Armani". It's a fun club where drunks are excluded.

The names are stored - First Name Age City and SP if she is a semi pro. For example Natsha 21KyivSP or Dasha 20Sevastopol.

A photo of the girl is a must, it pops up when she calls or sms's.

I use ms outlook to flesh out information on the girls I have known for a while. Birthday, etc.

Technology is awesome.

Oh, and that is just my Ukrainian phone. My US phone has around 300 contacts for girls in it. It's a WM 6 phone. Haven't been spending too much time in the US - I need to upgrade.

Not too many girls in my Middle East phone. :(

[QUOTE=Prosal; 1287859]BTW, how do you manage 1200 girls numbers on your smartphone?

I have barely 100 girls numbers and I already get lost among a good dozen of Tatianas, some 10 Ksenias, a big handfull of Evgenias, ect. I can't imagine how I could handle 12 x more.[/QUOTE]

On a closely related tangent.

On one hand. What kind of Ukrainian girl would ask you to pay for her taxi (coming and going from a date)? It's just not something a good girl would do.

On the other hand, maybe it's not a big deal assuming it's 50 uah and not 500.

I dunno, it's just not something a serious good Ukrainian girl does, maybe once she is your girlfriend.

[QUOTE=Prosal;1287862]Seconded. This is against all the rules of male courtesy. Sounds strange anyway, I have never ever met a slavic girl who could endure such a boorish behavior. Weird.[/QUOTE]

Go to D'Lux and hook up with a semi pro. You'll have a better time.

[QUOTE=NewMongerer; 1287893]I will be in Kiev in two weeks and as I read in this forum, Rio is the most easy way to find a hottie.

Go home with me. I also learned, price will be $300 to 400, but there are still some questions, I could not find the answer here till now. Is it necessary, to book private dances before you can go out with a girl? And if so, how much of this dances I have to spend out before I can leave? And is there any chance to find out, who finally will go out? I am afraid I waste a lot of time (and money) for chatting and private dances with girls, they finally will not follow me to my hotel.

Hope you experienced guys can give me some help for that.

Thanks[/QUOTE]

Where did all the River Palace girls go? The answer is still the same when I replied to you when you first asked. D'Lux. Why you ignored it then and ignore it now I have no idea, maybe your apartment is right next to Rio and you find it easier to go there.

All the girls weren't towed away with The Boat. They just went to other clubs. Actually they had been rotating with other clubs for quite some time before the Boat went away.

[QUOTE=LilJoey; 1287212]Compared to the regular nightclubs where it was difficult to find a high concentration of hot WG's available for p4p in one spot, it was easy to go fishing in the strip club. And the prices too, were lower at the strip club ($300/3hrs) than what the really hot working girls at the nightclubs were asking ($400 and $500 and sometimes negotiable down to $300/2hrs). And so I lamented the loss of all the River Palace girls and the lack of direction in this thread about where to go and how to best monger in the post- River Palace era in my first post entitled something like "where have all the river palace girls gone?".

Then I focused in on figuring out the way to get the best result at the lowest priced venue where you could see the girls in advance, which was the strip club. This premise that the strip club was the lowest priced venue for high level p4p girls that you could see in advance remained unchallenged in 2011. No one was posting different information about prices. Until about March of 2012 when a vehement opposition to the strip club option was espoused. It was claimed that the strip club was not the cheapest venue, and one should not go there and pay more, when the same or better results could be had in the regular nightclubs. This claim is either factually true or false.

But I took note of the vehemence with which it is stated. Why would anyone lie about such a fact when the truth is easy to discover with time. It is this inference that leads me to assume that he is telling the truth about the prices being lower in the nightclubs and it being better to monger in the nightclubs than in the strip club. Why else the vehemence? It doesn't make sense. So my conclusion is that those who are saying that prices for P4p are lower in the regular nightclubs than in the strip club, really believe what they are saying. So I will give them the benefit of the doubt, until I arrive for my next visit and see for myself where the prices are cheaper and which venue makes it easier and more efficient to find what one is looking for.

All of us can puff a little or even exaggerate sometimes to make a point. If he is relying on his 1200 telephone nUmbers in any way to get girls it would. Of be a fair comparison to what a newbie can expect and can achieve, and this will become apparent over time. So the more mongers that go to the regular nightclubs and post action reports the clearer and more detailed a picture we will have. Let the truth be accepted from the one who says it, whoever he may be.

LJ[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Kirch; 1288037]Just just don't get my point (but anyways will never do)

SHE wants to show me that she likes me and pays for the taxi or at least she wants to! May be you don't know this kind of girls. Good education etc. Again, just a joke.[/QUOTE]Achtung, Achtung, London Calling.

LOL. You are not Liljoey (The Master Of All Disguises) , with yet another disguise and script, are you.

Climamxnow, Muddy 7, and others have confused me lately, LOL.

I am the one here who gets your point. The kind of girl you are talking about does exist, and she could have fallen for you in a big way. So she settles for a night in with a Pizza and she pays for the taxi.

A beautiful UA girl in KIEV, who as you say was an ex Stripper. And not only you get to Ride her for free, but she pays for you and her for Taxi rides as well.

What a better love story than that. Hey "Gone With The Wind " in KIev.

Not for me though. For a start I don't like to spend a night in Kiev slumped on a sofa eating Pizza for dinner, even with a girl. And secondly I wouldn't let a woman pay for a taxi ride. It will end up costing me more. .

Even the US$300 plus spent at RIO (Which I would never do) would seem a bargain then, LOL.

But on the other hand, if as you say she is of "Good Education " she could be a Conniving, Scheming woman on a mission, disguising herself as if Butter wouldn't melt in her mouth.

These kind of women do exist as well. Every one loves a bargain when they see one,

But it could be a classic case of "Cents Wise Dollars Foolish ". .

BTW. You have a good sense of HUMOR for a German, is it an Acquired one? LOL.

Or is it a case of " I have ways of making you Laugh " LOL.

Auf. Wiedersehen.

[QUOTE=Cruiser D; 1288276]The names are stored. First Name Age City and SP if she is a semi pro. For example Natsha 21KyivSP or Dasha 20Sevastopol.

A photo of the girl is a must, it pops up when she calls or sms's.

I use ms outlook to flesh out information on the girls I have known for a while. Birthday, etc.

Technology is awesome.

Oh, and that is just my Ukrainian phone. My US phone has around 300 contacts for girls in it. It's a WM 6 phone. Haven't been spending too much time in the US. I need to upgrade.

Not too many girls in my Middle East phone. .[/QUOTE]I only keep the phone numbers of long-term GFs, or "prospects" that I am almost sure to visit within the next months, or of girls with who I have "relationship building" on a large scale. I could have kept many many numbers of one night stands or of girls with who I've had short adventures, but it would have been only to boost my own ego, which I don't need. That said, as usual to each its own.

[QUOTE=Jojosun. .

BTW. You have a good sense of HUMOR for a German, is it an Acquired one? LOL.

Or is it a case of " I have ways of making you Laugh " LOL.

Auf. Wiedersehen.[/QUOTE]Kirch, LOL, it is not a case "VEE have Vays of making you Laugh" is it.

No offense intended, but I am in the middle of a Street Party celebrating with thousands of Londoners of all colors and sizes Her Majesty's Diamond Jubilee. Year. .

Everyone is pissed drunk, and in doing this they are taking the [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140][CodeWord140][/url] out of every country across the sea and the occean, including my country of Birth across the Atlantic.

Before I sign of for today, When are going to RIO again.

[QUOTE=Cruiser D; 1288288]Where did all the River Palace girls go? The answer is still the same when I replied to you when you first asked. D'Lux. Why you ignored it then and ignore it now I have no idea, maybe your apartment is right next to Rio and you find it easier to go there.

All the girls weren't towed away with The Boat. They just went to other clubs. Actually they had been rotating with other clubs for quite some time before the Boat went away.[/QUOTE]Cruiser D, I would not ignore you. In my trips at beginning of 2011, I went straightaways to clubs like Avalon and Buddha Bar, and then when D'lux became a happening place, I went there to check it out too. At the time I wrote about the difficulties I had in finding the p4p WG's at D'lux, and how there were not so many people in general at Avalon at the time I visited, let alone obvious WG's, and how I found some but not very many WG's at Buddha Bar when I went. Later I found out through exchanges and info posted here on the thread that I was probably at Buddha Bar too early in the evening, and at D'lux I had made the mistake of spending too much time on the dance floor area and not enough time at the bar area. So I had an experience at regular nightclubs back in 2011 that was similar to Poker Player 2's experience at Shooters that he recently posted about. Even allowing for these mistakes, it is clear that there was no location where hot WG's were gathering in anything remotely resembling the large numbers they had gathered each night at RP. I was told by a WG from RP whose number I had that many girls had gone to Moscow to ply their trade at pricey places like Night Flight. Wherever they went, they were not evident in the same large numbers they had been at RP.

I point out also that in a lot of posts you are talking about "semi-pros" rather than dedicated p4p WG's. Are we even talking about the same thing? I'm speaking of identifying, approaching and negotiating with "WG's" of the sort one would have found at River Palace.

Perhaps it would be helpful if you explain exactly what you mean by a semi-pro, and the process of identifying, approaching, seducing, negotiating is to be handled with such a type of girl?

I would suppose that the way to recognize a WG, and the approach to talking with her, would be different than the approach used with a "semi-pro" girl, since I am understanding the term "semi-pro" to mean someone who is not a WG and who did not go to the nightclub with the premeditated idea to pick up a guy and fuck him for money, but rather a regular girl who went to the nightclub to simply have fun with her friends, whom one approaches like one approaches any girl and has to "seduce" in the same way as one would have to seduce any regular girl, but that somewhere along the way, in the conversation the idea of having sex comes up, and she agrees, with the spoken or tacit understanding that she will receive some money afterward. Obviously, such a type of "semi-pro" has to be regarded as part of the general pool of females in a nightclub, and approached as such.

So identifying WG's in a nightclub would necessarily be a completely different thing, than trying to get regular girls who turn out to be interested in money, I. E. Semi-pro.

Also the existence of a semi-pro category raises a further inquiry about how to differentiate a semi-pro girl from a regular girl at a nightclub?

The few WG's that I did spot in the nightclubs in 2011 we're also not so hot for the most part. So whatever I found was not an adequate substitute for RP.

And the prices I was being quoted by those WG's whom I thought hot enough to bother talking to were higher than what was possible at RP, where I was usually able to get something good for $200/2hrs.

As for your claim since you began posting again in or about March 2012, that prices of $200/2hours or less are possible with very hot WG's (8+) in the regular nightclubs with not too much difficulty, and very importantly, not too much time, (making it a lower priced venue to monger than the strip clubs) , I have accepted it as a working premise for the time being, and do not ignore you, because I can see no sensible reason for you to have stated this if it weren't so. I have no way of assessing that claim save by ongoing credible action reports by members about their activities and successes in the nightclubs and the rates they report, or when I get a chance to try myself again in the nightclubs on a future visit to Kiev, maybe in September / October.

If you care to, I am sure there is interest in you discussing the courtship of the semi-pro girl, which I surmise make up a significant portion of your numbers in your by now famous Android phone. Including the definition of, how to identify her from among all the other regular girls in a nightclub, the best approach to use to succeed in scoring with her, or getting her to the point of discussing money, after which presumably she can be handled as a WG, etc.

LJ

Pro,

I tap more girls each month I am in Kiev than most guys do in their life (including the keyboard commando's on here). It's not my fault you don't have the skills to juggle or have the same interests as me. Oh, and I never lied about anything, when a girl asks me if I am seeing other girls I reply, Yes I do, want to join? Being with one or two, or ten or twenty girls is unfair. Who am I to deprive the poor girls of the world of Cruiser D.

Is my action in Ukraine as mind numbingly insane as it was when I was in 30's, no. Is it still super awesome, yes.

Could I shed some girls from my phone book, sure. I hope to get it down to 1k. It's not usual for me to drop $500 per month on phone cards while I am in Ukraine.

I thought a Mac Daddy like you in his fur lined 6500e pimp coat understood how the game is played.

[QUOTE=Prosal;1288335]I only keep the phone numbers of long-term GFs, or "prospects" that I am almost sure to visit within the next months, or of girls with who I have "relationship building" on a large scale. I could have kept many many numbers of one night stands or of girls with who I've had short adventures, but it would have been only to boost my own ego, which I don't need. That said, as usual to each its own.[/QUOTE]