Seeking Arrangements

Just ran across this report from a few years back. Best pure sex of my life — to this day. True lesbian lovers who needed some dick in the mix and I was the lucky guy! Hope some of you enjoy it.

Cincinnati -- Sometimes It's Just Sex!

(not that there's anything wrong with that! LOL).

OK I am definitely on a black girls run. Confirmed tonight with a last minute duo score. Of course I was just with Kayla in Florida, but have traveled to Cincinnati. I had researched it before and had some prospects but honestly I was fucked out. Just couldn't muster the energy.

Till night three. LOL. There was a work event and after a couple glasses of wine, I start thinking "why not" and start texting girls randomly from my playlist or brand new prospects from SA. Very aggressive opener — like "I'm going out tonight to a nice dinner and drinks. Want to join me?" I had used this approach in London with some success and generally recommend it.

A few nibbles but really no bites and I am now back in my hotel room half heartedly sending out inquiries, when I get a response from two black girls. "Sure. $500 for us both". They aren't quite my type but marginally cute and I haven't had a duo in a while so I say let's do it. I'm a little wary of course because you rarely get that direct a come on. But I go with the flow — carefully.

Originally, I suggest we meet at a bar, but they remind me they are both only twenty and underage for drinking. LOL. So better to come to the room. Of course my scam radar is on high. Because they are driving 30 miles to see me and coming straight to the room. Not exactly standard offering. We are texting and they say they are on their way. I am certain I am going to get the "oh we are out of gas can you send money" text and resigned to jacking off. But the text never comes and sure enough they show up! WTF?

Amara is a rail thin tall dark black girl and Kayara is a thick light black girl. Couldn't be two more different looking black females. Turns out they are girlfriends and have been dating nine months. This ends up being very important to the vibe and what all we do. Amara is clearly the alpha and Kayara enjoys being a sub.

We chat amiably over some wine and I learn lots of interesting things. They are both freshman in college (skipped a year after HS) so there's that fantasy to check off. They tell me about their relationship. And I also learn that they have tried Seeking twice and were stood up both times! One time they drove two hours and were stood up! Poor things — all they want is a daddy to fuck! So I am their first SD and boy do we make it memorable.

You can tell they are both a little nervous but the wine is helping Amara. Kayara doesn't drink and def seems a bit more shy. We actually have a really good conversation— what are they studying and why, what do I do for work etc. Eventually I excuse myself to go pee and say for them to get more comfortable if they like. They are both just in sweats because this was a last minute deal and they just came on. But in a way it's great because I'm going to be fucking two freshman coeds you might see on the the quad! LOL.

On returning, Amara is under the covers but sweatshirt still on and Kayara is slowly undressing. When Kayara is down to her bra (nice big the Cups) I come over and embrace her and go for the kiss. At first I get a cheek, then two small pecks on the lips. Hmm, this seems like a bad sign but I just go with the flow. Glad I did!

I say "it's really cute that you are both so new to this" and they say why do I say that. And I say just by the way you kissed, I could tell you are really nervous. So Amara, the skinny one — and I mean she must be 5-10 and weigh 80 pounds — really amazing in an odd way — she gestures for me to come to the bed where she rears up and plants a deep and passionate French kiss on me — like this is how it's done baby. I find that even though she is in her sweatshirt she is naked down below. I squeeze that amazing tight ass with both hands and start to grow hard.

Pretty soon I am naked standing at the side of the bed, Kayara has finished undressing revealing a thick but attractive bod and Amara pulls her sweatshirt off over her head. Kayara starts blowing me while I make out with Amara but soon they are both blowing the fuck out of me and I remember why I like duos!

The double BJ is absolutely epic. They seem to be totally in sync. Two mouths on shaft side to side. Kayara on shaft, Amara on balls. Amara on upper shaft, Kayara on lower. After a while I stop paying attention to what's what. There is so much sloppy shit going on down there that it's mind blowing and I can't keep track of all the sensations.

A couple of times I get the urge to fuck, but then think bloody hell why would I stop this? They must blow me easily for 20 minutes before I decide I've got to fuck one or the other. First up is Kayara in doggie style where she can eat Amaras pussy. Of course girls are pros at eating pussy, so she is driving Amara absolutely bat shit crazy as I fuck her from behind. She has a nice thick butt to grab on to and as she gets more and more lost in it (she likes fucking) she's whispering "fuck me daddy. Yes, like that. Harder. " LOL.

After an eternity of this (I had jacked off earlier that day thinking it was going to be a celibate night) I decide to try out Amara and I swap them up. No need to change condoms because they are lovers! Amara is still on her back so Kayara moves up to sit on her face and I plunge into mish with Amara. She's very tight as you might expect given her body type. Some light bites and kisses on Kayara's back since it's right where my face lands. And some great mish pounding of Amara.

I eventually decide I want to cum, hoping to even do a round 2 but that's never guaranteed. So I lose the condom and lie on my back and they go to work. It's spectacular again and a lot of it but not quite cumming. So I move to standing again where they are on the edge of bed and I get a great visual. After quite a bit more I start to cum in Kayaras mouth (she is better on shaft) and she pulls me out of our her mouth. So I start to shoot on Amaras shoulder as she is on ball work. Good girl she is, Amara doesn't want to waste good cum, so she gets me in her mouth for a few pumps of finish CIM. Damn. Like that girl's swagger!

They start working me and kissing me for round two instantly but I say I need to rest a bit. So we cuddle, but after a minute, Amara starts to finger Kayaras pussy and they are off to the races for the best girl on girl I've ever witnessed. I learned a lot!

Amara is using her two middle fingers inside Kayara and fucking her aggressively and hard while slathering her clit with her tongue. Kayara is off in space somewhere and squealing and moaning. Then Amara switches to fingers side to side on clit. Her hand is moving so fast it's a blur -- I mean literally a blur. And Kayara is going nuts. She has a clenching O but Amara is merciless and drives her for another O right after and then another.

I join the fun as we are just using Kayara like a fuck toy and she is sooooo down with that. So Amara starts finger fucking her again and I simultaneously do the furious clit side to side rubbing so she is getting doubled up. And fuck she goes thru two or three more Os. She's convulsing and shaking and eventually swats both our hands away (literally). It's like she's had electroshock and is just totally wiped out.

I only let her rest a minute or so and bring Kayara to the edge of the bed for mish with me standing (The Steve). So now Kayara can do Amara for a while when Amara sits on her face. She's a lot more gentle but Amara seems to like it and has some face scrunching Os. The fucking of Kayara goes on a long time- and I love that position. Even though I think Kayara is all fucked out, not so. Her legs are straight up in the air as I fuck her deep and she has a couple Os one right after the other. Her right leg goes stiff and vibrates like a motherfucker and then subsides and then about 10 strokes later she's hit by another wave and the leg goes batshit crazy again. Can't fake that shit!

At some point I get the desire to finger fuck Amara the way she did Kayara. So while Kayara is curled up in a fetal ball resting, LOL, I start making out with Amara and finger fucking her with my middle and ring finger as I learned from her. I am going in and out aggressively but she hand signals to do the same; but not in and out — but instead, aggressive gspot tapping. This is prob what she was doing inside of K — finger fucking and gspot tapping both look similar from outside. So I am tapping her gspot like a madman and she has some crashing Os.

I've had pussys clamp down on me before but hers it like a full pushout. It feels like her pelvic floor is coming down and absolutely drives my fingers out. Then it relaxes and back in I go. And tap tap tap and boom another wave. Normally I would stop but I learned from watching them, that a girl can have a connected string of Os. So I go again and give her a couple more where she totally clamps down and pushes me out with her pussy. It's really something. Wow.

Ok time to fuck Amara again so I fuck her in doggie and she eats Kayaras pussy some more. Eventually we all kinda tire and they slide under the covers and create a little space between them for me. I squeeze in and we doze and snuggle for a while, a girl's head on each shoulder. King of the world.

They are lightly playing with me by hand under the covers and I say I think I have one more shot in me if they are game. So we pull back the covers and down they go. A true labor of love -- they must be at it another ten minutes or more and it is truly great. I think I might have to go to a hand finish but when Kayara is on shaft and Amara on balls. OMG. It's soooo good. Eventually I shoot a load — again Kayara backing off but Amara quickly slurps up the goods! What a team.

So then we just doze and cuddle but eventually they have to go. Amara has class at 10:30 AM but Kayara has a 7:00 AM class. College girls! Def one of my best pure sex experiences ever. Never been with two girls so passionately into each other but still with the right focus on me. It was a two hour blur of nonstop fucking and sucking and fingering. Five stars!

Been a while.

A close family member was not well and I had to drop it all to take care.

Returning after a long hiatus. Excited to be back but I quickly realize how fickle things are in the US.

I did not fall off the radar but informed those girls that I will be out for so and so reason. Coming back 3 out of 4 girls don't give a damn. Don't get me wrong. I don't expect them to. These are quid pro quo.

But I can't help not comparing my Europe bases. All the three of those. Messaged me right back saying "I know it must be hard coming out of what you are coming out of. If you need to talk to someone, just call me. I a here to listen".

Such Atlantic sized gulf of difference in attitude and approach. Now, why wil I not help EU SBs even if we don't fuck! That personable non-transactional interaction doesn't seem to exist in consumerist US.

[QUOTE=Gfefan;2944203]Been a while.

A close family member was not well and I had to drop it all to take care.

Returning after a long hiatus. Excited to be back but I quickly realize how fickle things are in the US.

I did not fall off the radar but informed those girls that I will be out for so and so reason. Coming back 3 out of 4 girls don't give a damn. Don't get me wrong. I don't expect them to. These are quid pro quo.

But I can't help not comparing my Europe bases. All the three of those. Messaged me right back saying "I know it must be hard coming out of what you are coming out of. If you need to talk to someone, just call me. I a here to listen".

Such Atlantic sized gulf of difference in attitude and approach. Now, why wil I not help EU SBs even if we don't fuck! That personable non-transactional interaction doesn't seem to exist in consumerist US.[/QUOTE]

First. Great to have u back GFE. U are a great SA slayer and I always enjoy ur write ups.

So agree the US bites and are all entitled biatches. But there are exceptions if you look hard enough. Nerdy Girl was a nice find locally. And now Hood Girl is likely to replace her just a few weeks later. (I call her Hood Girl because she grew up dirt poor and lives very low income today). But damn she's a sweet soul! Such a nice girl. So grateful for any kindness. Shy and submissive. I predict greatness here.

And not to count chickens too much but last night I FINALLY after a month of looking scored a gem in a large US city. Still got meetup but we've done a lot of voice and she is 100% reall. Doesn't know what to ask because she doesn't want to feel like a pro. Going to take kid gloves but she's one in a million. Smokin hot and unspoiled as a newborn. Crossing fingers. But that was after a solid month of looking nightly. You got to be on it and pounce because they aren't going to be on next time youre on. (Hood Girl hasnt been on in the past month once we agreed a meetup). I know you know this GFE but daily persistence is essential in the US.

Hoping there can be some contribution on the range of cost of dates in some city in Europe. Trying to decide where to visit next.

Last year Italy and Milan were overall not worth it dates were typically 4-600 eu. Some asking more than that, not sure anyone agreed for less than 400.

I am trying to get some info on the cost of dates in Portugal, Spain, maybe some other places that may deem themselves affordable.

Recently had a nice time in Guadalajara and found dates to be nicely priced.

The standard of living in Mexico vs Europe is generally not comparable. There are always exceptions and I'm sure there are guys that claim they've pulled a girl off seeking for nothing but as a general rule 4-500 is the number in western Europe. Maybe 3-500 in eastern Europe. How hard you want to look for something cheaper than that who also meets whatever criteria you want is entirely up to you, both your patience and your game.

[QUOTE=MrBuckley;2944480]Hoping there can be some contribution on the range of cost of dates in some city in Europe. Trying to decide where to visit next.

Last year Italy and Milan were overall not worth it dates were typically 4-600 eu. Some asking more than that, not sure anyone agreed for less than 400.

I am trying to get some info on the cost of dates in Portugal, Spain, maybe some other places that may deem themselves affordable.

Recently had a nice time in Guadalajara and found dates to be nicely priced.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=MrBuckley;2944480]Hoping there can be some contribution on the range of cost of dates in some city in Europe. Trying to decide where to visit next.

Last year Italy and Milan were overall not worth it dates were typically 4-600 eu. Some asking more than that, not sure anyone agreed for less than 400.

I am trying to get some info on the cost of dates in Portugal, Spain, maybe some other places that may deem themselves affordable.

Recently had a nice time in Guadalajara and found dates to be nicely priced.[/QUOTE]I always used escort prices as a guide and Spain and Portugal are cheaper than Italy, and I was just in Spain and Italy with my gal and daughter. All of Western Europe have had shrinking populations and using immigration to compensate. Of all the countries in Western Europe, Spain may have had the easiest of time of it as they have been importing Spanish speaking people in from Latin America and trying to keep the others out, and as you can imagine, the Latinas are going to have less of an issue with escorting than Muslims for example.

The other Latinas are also going to have an easier time in Spain and Portugal than Italy is the language. I thought Italian and Spanish were comparable and boy they were not. I had to translate for us more often than not because so many Italians knew English and not Spanish.

So you have that influx of not just Latinas but I would venture to say the top Latinas looking for a better life. I want a lover trying to be better all the time and that is what the Latinas who have gone to Europe were doing, looking for better. I wondered why all of them preferred Europe to the USA though. I realized that was because so many only consider NYC, California, and Orlando, Florida the USA, and I do not want to be in those places either. I swear you spend half your life in traffic or in line if you live there.

It is funny when I went to Venezuela I was underwhelmed by the beauty of the women and yet outside the country, I saw some of the most beautiful women, who were Venezuelans, I had ever seen. So it would not surprise me if some if not most of the best looking Latinas are in Spain and Portugal now.

I was surprised going that I thought the women in Italy and Spain were better looking than those in Mexico and Colombia. I certainly did not expect that.

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2944553]The standard of living in Mexico vs Europe is generally not comparable. There are always exceptions and I'm sure there are guys that claim they've pulled a girl off seeking for nothing but as a general rule 4-500 is the number in western Europe. Maybe 3-500 in eastern Europe. How hard you want to look for something cheaper than that who also meets whatever criteria you want is entirely up to you, both your patience and your game.[/QUOTE]+1 got to go with FB on this. You might find a Spain girl will take 300, which is less than Milan for sure. But doubt anyone's going for 200 anywhere in Europe. Got to go Brazil or Colombia or Thailand to hit the basement prices.

I'll add that I don't think seeking in general is for bargain hunters. There are pros there but if you're looking for a quick lay there are lots of options. If you want to dine, dance, build some kind of connection, etc then seeking is for you but it's been said a million times, it's a ton of work.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2944743]+1 got to go with FB on this. You might find a Spain girl will take 300, which is less than Milan for sure. But doubt anyone's going for 200 anywhere in Europe. Got to go Brazil or Colombia or Thailand to hit the basement prices.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=MrBuckley;2944480]Hoping there can be some contribution on the range of cost of dates in some city in Europe. Trying to decide where to visit next.

Last year Italy and Milan were overall not worth it dates were typically 4-600 eu. Some asking more than that, not sure anyone agreed for less than 400.

I am trying to get some info on the cost of dates in Portugal, Spain, maybe some other places that may deem themselves affordable.

Recently had a nice time in Guadalajara and found dates to be nicely priced.[/QUOTE]I was able to find girls for less than 200 in EU, but it wasn't for the whole night. If you want dinner starting at 6 PM, and dessert after midnight, I think for 6+ hours you'd be hard pressed to find a girl willing to go much below 300. I'm sure you could in Greece, possibly Romania, or some of the really poor parts of the Eastern Bloc such as Latvia, etc. But I personally don't find those run down countries very appealing, and I'm guessing you don't speak Greek or the other obscure languages. Not like there's a whole lot to do in those places anyhow, and I wouldn't feel exceptionally safe wandering around alone. Turkey definitely below 300 equivalent, possibly below 200 for the whole night.

Hey guys, when do you normally assume that you won't hear back from a Seeking member. If their profile says "last active 3 weeks ago" Do most of those not respond to messages? Or do you normally see them off market when it says 6 months or more?

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2944829]Hey guys, when do you normally assume that you won't hear back from a Seeking member. If their profile says "last active 3 weeks ago" Do most of those not respond to messages? Or do you normally see them off market when it says 6 months or more?[/QUOTE]I never contact a girl unless she's online. Too many girls come on and never come back. Plus sometimes you get a relatively real time conversation going which is best.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2944859]I never contact a girl unless she's online. Too many girls come on and never come back. Plus sometimes you get a relatively real time conversation going which is best.[/QUOTE]So even if it says she was last online 4 hours ago, you still don't reach out?

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2944879]So even if it says she was last online 4 hours ago, you still don't reach out?[/QUOTE]Yeah but maybe that's me being lazy. You can see their green dot without even going in their profile. So I just contact green dot girls. I suppose if the market is very thin I browse the next ones down that aren't green dot. But that's pretty rare. It's just a lot more productive mining amongst the online girls.

I'm picky, like really really picky. My only limit is I don't contact anyone that hasn't been on in more than two weeks. 1) there really aren't that many girls that fit my criteria anyway and 2) the girls who are on a lot usually have a whiff of pro, semi-pro, or scammer about them.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2944859]I never contact a girl unless she's online. Too many girls come on and never come back. Plus sometimes you get a relatively real time conversation going which is best.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2944935]Yeah but maybe that's me being lazy. You can see their green dot without even going in their profile. So I just contact green dot girls. I suppose if the market is very thin I browse the next ones down that aren't green dot. But that's pretty rare. It's just a lot more productive mining amongst the online girls.[/QUOTE]That has to be what is getting me; I'm looking at a somewhat obscure city. Not too many girls to choose from; especially given I have other criteria on the filter, like age, etc.

Hi all, I'm a relatively new poster but have observed for a bit. I spent almost a year in Bogota and Medellin with Seeking. Happy to share some experiences there.

I'm thinking about heading to check out Panama City or another nearby country next. Any experiences for folks in those parts?

Recently checked some things off the sex wishlist with the girl I've been seeing for awhile.

Backshot. I know this is standard for some of you but I'the been too scared to try but pulled it off one night. Still makes me a little nervous but curious how you guys make sure you pull out in time?

Swallowed. Mentioned she always swallowed (never been with a girl who did that) and had been kicking myself for not doing it. CIM has gotten harder for me for some reason and finishing from BJs in general. While I enjoyed it it's almost a little too degrading for me / I feel like porn makes it seem better than it is ie you don't really see much.

Road head. Coming back one night she got super horny did it after I made her come in the car. I enjoyed it but the driving was hard. Probably best not on the highway. She really wanted to fuck but I didn't know where to pull over. Should've tried harder haha.

Now the bad. Noticed she disappeared from my messages and found she blocked my account. Paid for premium with burner account I use to browse and found her no problem. Had it set to hide views so I hope it worked w / the burner but still not a great feeling. Could be something, could be nothing but I guess all I can do is enjoy it.

Think I mentioned I got a new number one at home. But don't think I posted the full sexcapades. Here's the report out from date 1. Date 2 was even a bit better in the bedroom. Since I knew she wa submissive I gave her blow by blow blowjob instructions and she took to it like a fish to water. Plus added in some improv and finished CIM swallow w a smile. Def a keeper.

I have a new favorite local girl. Still not up to par w my Brazilian nor my Italian girl but seems quite promising for my smallish city. And beggars can't be choosers. Better optics than Nerdy Girl and much better kissing and BJ than Fuck Bunny. Though they both remain on the backup roster and I'the probably make a date if they show any initiative.

I met Gina on Seeking about a month ago. Nice little chat and quick to WhatsApp. Some nice girlfriendy back and forth and she seemed a legit girl just looking for a bit on the side. At barely 21 she's a bit on the younger side but had a good girl next door vibe.

She signed up easy to my proposed dinner and intimacy menu but when discussing allowance she said she didn't really like asking for things and I should do what she deserved. This was a little bit of a red flag but I let it roll.

Took a bit to arrange a date between my travel and her work schedule (two jobs) but we finally worked it out. She said she likes Mexican and Chinese so we found a great taco place.

Day of the date she says will we meet there or will I pick her up and she says either works. So I say ok I will pick her up. But when she sends her address I am a bit sketched out because it's in a rough part of town and a really run down multi unit.

I don't really want to bail but I think it could be a setup because girls don't usually get in cars with strangers. After a bit of thought I have the epiphany and say babe I will send you an Uber and she is down with that. So it's on!

I arrive at the taco place a few minutes early and track her to the door. Very pleasant surprise when she walks in. She's looking smokin in low rise corduroys and a crop top sweater. She looks like her best picture yes but even better in person and love the sexy outfit.

Turns out she is basically a girl from the hood. Her current low income living conditions are a big step up from how she grew up. But the amazing thing is instead of being sad and bitter she is humble and grateful for the smallest kindness. Shockingly, despite our quite different backgrounds the conversation flows super well. It's darn clear that not only is she a solid person I can def improve her life.

We both order three tacos and they are pretty big. For a skinny girl that girl can eat. I only eat 2. 5 of mine and she asks if she can finish the third one and then asks super politely if I mind if she orders another. Damn she can put it away. And is still super slim.

At some point she mentions she hopes I don't mind that she vapes tho she didn't bring it with her. I say not only do I not mind but let's get you one on our way. So after the "want to get out of here" I take her to Shayla's (former SB) favorite smoke shop and get her a new vape. She is of course thrilled and I am so happy to do her small favors.

I get kind of a laugh when I pull into the hotel parking lot and she says "oh are spending the night? I woulda brought my PJs". Hahaha no girl only and hour or two. Checkin is easy and we are soon on the bed together making out.

At first it's a bit of dry humping and making out which frankly I love. I push my hard dick rhythmically against her pussy and we both are loving the kissing and rhythm. But soon enough I say it seems like we have on too many clothes and both get naked.

Often the girl initiates BJ but she's on her back. So I move to the side of the bed and position for Steve 2. I start fingering her and position my dick near her head, me on my knees. She takes the hint and starts a really nice slow in and out BJ.

Fingering her is great fun. She's sloppy wet from the get go and I start with my middle finger but soon have two fingers in stroking her gspot. She's left on her little no-show socks and I am enjoying watching her curl her toes as I pleasure her. Of course she is blowing me (the magic of Steve 2) and it feels absolutely great.

We must go at this for at least 15 minutes because we are both getting what we want but I'm getting a bit tired in that posture and flop to my back where she mounts up cowgirl. She has a great time riding and makes the ugliest faces like she's at a funeral so I know it's real. LOL.

After a while I switch to the Steve and give her a real pounding at the edge of the bed. It feels absolutely great but I don't threaten to blow a stack having whacked off day before and had several drinks. After a while I say "let's take a rest". I was thinking a short rest but she rolls over to spoon position like we're kinda done.

Of course here is where it's great she's a seeking girl and not a GF because I'm def not going to just be ok packing it in. So I let us both rest a bit and say "Can we do some more blowjob" and she says sure!

I position her between my legs (any of the rest of you care about symmetry? I don't like it from one side.) and she goes to town. Very credible in and out work. But then I ask her to do my balls. You can tell she doesn't do this a lot but she's earnest in her task. She's just licking away and I say you can suck too. So she does but not like the big ball suck of some girls. She's just doing a very thoughtful and gentle worshipping of my sack and it feels amazing. Like 10+ minutes of amazing and I am hard as a brick again.

I consider finishing in her mouth but honestly I want to fuck her again so I ask her to go doggie at end of bed and I slide in. She's not as wet as before so I start gentle but after a bit of fucking she is super wet again and I am pumping away.

I love that she says "You can be a lot rougher with me if you want, Steve" Ilove the way she used my name there in mid sex. It was just so endearing. And so I really start hammering. Making sure I hit hard and balls deep on every thrust. And man I can feel the build. I just keep hammering away and then pull and shoot a load on her butt and back. Niceeee!

Lovely wind down where she says "I'm sorry I'm not very good at blowjobs". Don't you love this girl? I assure her it was fine but going to let her take that humble submissive attitude and train her up just the way I like it next time!

As we wrap things up I ended up giving her $350 (sure she would have taken less but I wanna help her) which was in an envelope sight unseen. And even though she didn't even know what was in there, she said "I knew you were a nice guy Steve but I didn't know you would be this much fun. I'd love to see you again!" Again she has no idea how much I gave her and she wants to see me again — that’s my kinda girl. Definite repeat and hopefully a keeper for a bit.

Out of curiosity how do you keep a roster so big? Not all, but I'd say most, of the girls I've seen are somewhat reliant on our meetings. Especially the legit college girls. I have known girls that I call once every blue moon but that is definitely the minority. I would think most would move on if they weren't getting the sugar regularly.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2945801]Think I mentioned I got a new number one at home. But don't think I posted the full sexcapades. Here's the report out from date 1. Date 2 was even a bit better in the bedroom. Since I knew she wa submissive I gave her blow by blow blowjob instructions and she took to it like a fish to water. Plus added in some improv and finished CIM swallow w a smile. Def a keeper.

I have a new favorite local girl. Still not up to par w my Brazilian nor my Italian girl but seems quite promising for my smallish city. And beggars can't be choosers. Better optics than Nerdy Girl and much better kissing and BJ than Fuck Bunny. Though they both remain on the backup roster and I'the probably make a date if they show any initiative.

I met Gina on Seeking about a month ago. Nice little chat and quick to WhatsApp. Some nice girlfriendy back and forth and she seemed a legit girl just looking for a bit on the side. At barely 21 she's a bit on the younger side but had a good girl next door vibe.

She signed up easy to my proposed dinner and intimacy menu but when discussing allowance she said she didn't really like asking for things and I should do what she deserved. This was a little bit of a red flag but I let it roll.

Took a bit to arrange a date between my travel and her work schedule (two jobs) but we finally worked it out. She said she likes Mexican and Chinese so we found a great taco place.

Day of the date she says will we meet there or will I pick her up and she says either works. So I say ok I will pick her up. But when she sends her address I am a bit sketched out because it's in a rough part of town and a really run down multi unit.

I don't really want to bail but I think it could be a setup because girls don't usually get in cars with strangers. After a bit of thought I have the epiphany and say babe I will send you an Uber and she is down with that. So it's on!

I arrive at the taco place a few minutes early and track her to the door. Very pleasant surprise when she walks in. She's looking smokin in low rise corduroys and a crop top sweater. She looks like her best picture yes but even better in person and love the sexy outfit.

Turns out she is basically a girl from the hood. Her current low income living conditions are a big step up from how she grew up. But the amazing thing is instead of being sad and bitter she is humble and grateful for the smallest kindness. Shockingly, despite our quite different backgrounds the conversation flows super well. It's darn clear that not only is she a solid person I can def improve her life.

We both order three tacos and they are pretty big. For a skinny girl that girl can eat. I only eat 2. 5 of mine and she asks if she can finish the third one and then asks super politely if I mind if she orders another. Damn she can put it away. And is still super slim.

At some point she mentions she hopes I don't mind that she vapes tho she didn't bring it with her. I say not only do I not mind but let's get you one on our way. So after the "want to get out of here" I take her to Shayla's (former SB) favorite smoke shop and get her a new vape. She is of course thrilled and I am so happy to do her small favors.

I get kind of a laugh when I pull into the hotel parking lot and she says "oh are spending the night? I woulda brought my PJs". Hahaha no girl only and hour or two. Checkin is easy and we are soon on the bed together making out.

At first it's a bit of dry humping and making out which frankly I love. I push my hard dick rhythmically against her pussy and we both are loving the kissing and rhythm. But soon enough I say it seems like we have on too many clothes and both get naked.

Often the girl initiates BJ but she's on her back. So I move to the side of the bed and position for Steve 2. I start fingering her and position my dick near her head, me on my knees. She takes the hint and starts a really nice slow in and out BJ.

Fingering her is great fun. She's sloppy wet from the get go and I start with my middle finger but soon have two fingers in stroking her gspot. She's left on her little no-show socks and I am enjoying watching her curl her toes as I pleasure her. Of course she is blowing me (the magic of Steve 2) and it feels absolutely great.

We must go at this for at least 15 minutes because we are both getting what we want but I'm getting a bit tired in that posture and flop to my back where she mounts up cowgirl. She has a great time riding and makes the ugliest faces like she's at a funeral so I know it's real. LOL.

After a while I switch to the Steve and give her a real pounding at the edge of the bed. It feels absolutely great but I don't threaten to blow a stack having whacked off day before and had several drinks. After a while I say "let's take a rest". I was thinking a short rest but she rolls over to spoon position like we're kinda done.

Of course here is where it's great she's a seeking girl and not a GF because I'm def not going to just be ok packing it in. So I let us both rest a bit and say "Can we do some more blowjob" and she says sure!

I position her between my legs (any of the rest of you care about symmetry? I don't like it from one side.) and she goes to town. Very credible in and out work. But then I ask her to do my balls. You can tell she doesn't do this a lot but she's earnest in her task. She's just licking away and I say you can suck too. So she does but not like the big ball suck of some girls. She's just doing a very thoughtful and gentle worshipping of my sack and it feels amazing. Like 10+ minutes of amazing and I am hard as a brick again.

I consider finishing in her mouth but honestly I want to fuck her again so I ask her to go doggie at end of bed and I slide in. She's not as wet as before so I start gentle but after a bit of fucking she is super wet again and I am pumping away.

I love that she says "You can be a lot rougher with me if you want, Steve" Ilove the way she used my name there in mid sex. It was just so endearing. And so I really start hammering. Making sure I hit hard and balls deep on every thrust. And man I can feel the build. I just keep hammering away and then pull and shoot a load on her butt and back. Niceeee!

Lovely wind down where she says "I'm sorry I'm not very good at blowjobs". Don't you love this girl? I assure her it was fine but going to let her take that humble submissive attitude and train her up just the way I like it next time!

As we wrap things up I ended up giving her $350 (sure she would have taken less but I wanna help her) which was in an envelope sight unseen. And even though she didn't even know what was in there, she said "I knew you were a nice guy Steve but I didn't know you would be this much fun. I'd love to see you again!" Again she has no idea how much I gave her and she wants to see me again thats my kinda girl. Definite repeat and hopefully a keeper for a bit.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2945993]Out of curiosity how do you keep a roster so big? Not all, but I'd say most, of the girls I've seen are somewhat reliant on our meetings. Especially the legit college girls. I have known girls that I call once every blue moon but that is definitely the minority. I would think most would move on if they weren't getting the sugar regularly.[/QUOTE]I think we have to break this down into travel and home girls. With travel, the expectation is set from the start that I am a flyin guy and only going to be a couple times a year at best. This works fine for most girls. They are thrilled to have me show up and drop some nights out and cash on them. Maybe they have another SD more regular or a BF and I don't really care but they seem VERY happy to see me. I have girls on the roster that I met in 2018 that I still see (though that is a small number now). And the ones I really like I travel somewhere and that seals the deal. These girls are not going to be traveling in their own.

At home I am generally a one girl guy. It's just been hard to find a replacement for Shayla (and doubt I ever will that moved into the serious love category). So I've been balancing the three local girls of late. But as you say it's not always easy. Nerdy Girl and Gina are happy to get slices as they can. But had a serious convo w Fuck Bunny who wants me to be mor regular but I can't. We will see if she will take what she can get (I do like her!) or want to fade things out. She wants something regular and I thought she had that with another SD and I just filled the space but turns out she was exclusive w me (and her live in BF of seven years. LOL.). So we will see if I can keep her on the roster from time to time. But right now Gina has the ball. She’s never gonna be Shayla but I like her and the sex is good.

When I've met girls away from home I've always made an effort to give them more than usual if I want to see them again. I want them to drop whatever they're doing when I return to make themselves available to me. It's mostly worked.

At home, I've always believed that once a girl fucks you she'll always be willing to fuck you. Problem is I'm only good for once maybe twice a week these days and a girl that fills that need is more than enough if she's the right girl. I've let the others go. I couldn't imagine trying to juggle 3 girls on an even semi regular basis, it just hurts my head. I'm fairly confident I can text a girl I haven't seen in a year and she'd be up for a meal and a fuck. Don't care to try it but I'm sure it'd work out.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2946224]I think we have to break this down into travel and home girls. With travel, the expectation is set from the start that I am a flyin guy and only going to be a couple times a year at best. This works fine for most girls. They are thrilled to have me show up and drop some nights out and cash on them. Maybe they have another SD more regular or a BF and I don't really care but they seem VERY happy to see me. I have girls on the roster that I met in 2018 that I still see (though that is a small number now). And the ones I really like I travel somewhere and that seals the deal. These girls are not going to be traveling in their own.

At home I am generally a one girl guy. It's just been hard to find a replacement for Shayla (and doubt I ever will that moved into the serious love category). So I've been balancing the three local girls of late. But as you say it's not always easy. Nerdy Girl and Gina are happy to get slices as they can. But had a serious convo w Fuck Bunny who wants me to be mor regular but I can't. We will see if she will take what she can get (I do like her!) or want to fade things out. She wants something regular and I thought she had that with another SD and I just filled the space but turns out she was exclusive w me (and her live in BF of seven years. LOL.). So we will see if I can keep her on the roster from time to time. But right now Gina has the ball. Shes never gonna be Shayla but I like her and the sex is good.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2946321]When I've met girls away from home I've always made an effort to give them more than usual if I want to see them again. I want them to drop whatever they're doing when I return to make themselves available to me. It's mostly worked.
.[/QUOTE]This. 100%. I always give generously and then give more than asked. Our time is the most valuable thing at this point. A day lost to a flake is a horrible expensive waste.

You know what's a nice touch? When I take a girl to dinner, if she really liked what she ate I get her one to go. She walks out with a boxed plate of what she likes and the next day she eats it. And I always hear about it. And it helps ensure I'm always at the top of the list when my text comes in. And it's not an expensive cherry on top.

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2944755]I'll add that I don't think seeking in general is for bargain hunters. There are pros there but if you're looking for a quick lay there are lots of options. If you want to dine, dance, build some kind of connection, etc then seeking is for you but it's been said a million times, it's a ton of work.[/QUOTE]Yes definitely leg work. I'm starting to figure out the routine. Dinner / Lunch then fun I'll been using pros outside seeking for quick fuck so it's a bit more adjustment for me to figure out how these semi pros work One thing I still have trouble with is photos of hot looking ones that I know are red flags possible flakes / scams / but still obsessed and hold on to the possibility that they are real and I continue to probe to see if they will meet or video chat and that's where the chat ends.

After a long hiatus, due to personal circumstances, I was out of game for last few months.

Back now and reinitiated membership. As cited by many, SA has gone downhill. Becoming increasingly difficult (later learned its same for girls too).

Signed up last week, messaged the "favorites" I had been accumulating over weeks before. Quite a few responses but many were right away $ (pros) or the babysitter story (scam).

Two progressed to meet. One was relatively fast and met quickly but seemed like she came for free lunch. Weirdly got food to go, had a drink with me and would not even let me touch her hand. Oh well, I am ok with a $75 waste.

The second one was more charming. Showed up casually in her work clothes. We had a great connection, though. Lot of talks, flirts.

We agreed to exchange test results this week and then meet up few days later. I have a feeling this is going to be a fuck fest. Can't wait. Wish me luck.

[QUOTE=Gfefan;2947520]After a long hiatus, due to personal circumstances, I was out of game for last few months.

Back now and reinitiated membership. As cited by many, SA has gone downhill. Becoming increasingly difficult (later learned its same for girls too).

Signed up last week, messaged the "favorites" I had been accumulating over weeks before. Quite a few responses but many were right away $ (pros) or the babysitter story (scam).

Two progressed to meet. One was relatively fast and met quickly but seemed like she came for free lunch. Weirdly got food to go, had a drink with me and would not even let me touch her hand. Oh well, I am ok with a $75 waste.

The second one was more charming. Showed up casually in her work clothes. We had a great connection, though. Lot of talks, flirts..[/QUOTE]You mean to tell me somebody showed up for a date and got food to go? Now that's a new shameful low in unacceptable behavior by these "soft-core" prostitutes! Unbelievable!

It is pretty funny I have a friend who wants what I have, and he tends to focus on one woman for too long. He needs to cast a wider net. I think with SBs, I only did long term with one out of every 10 seeking dates or maybe even less. I thought about the high quality women my gal hangs around and I realized the only way they would meet him is if they were looking for work.

I was pretty sure banging the boss is acceptable in Colombia but my gal has a friend who is a lawyer and we were talking about something else, and I brought it up. If my gal had not know my friend, I am not sure the asking for the friend line would have worked. When I asked the lawyer, ironically, her husband jumped in. He was like, "Oh yeah, it is fine. One, two, or three. Most of my friends do it. It is fine, perfectly fine here in Colombia". He went on for like 5 minutes, and it took all my willpower to not say, "Dude, your wife is sitting right there. You might want to shut up."

But yeah, the sexual harassment laws in Colombia per them were practically nonexistent. My friend told me to look at hiring my gal as an assistant, and I was like, "Yeah, that makes sense. " so I looked into it and was shocked at how easy it was. From my POV, I just have to have her fill out IRS form W-8 BEN. Ironically, you just have to have the person you hire fill this out every 3 years. You do not have to submit to the IRS; you just need it if audited.

Countries have independent contractor agreements that you have to follow but Colombia does not. Thing is she has to pay taxes on what she collects if the work she did was in Colombia. However, unlike in the USA where you are often required to pay taxes on what you earn abroad, if she can claim to have worked in a country without income tax (Bahamas, Cayman Islands) then she would not pay any tax. That makes a nice excuse to head out to a fun tax haven, but ultimately, the tax burden is on her and not you.

Thing is this guy has oodles of paperwork and he is paying $40,000 a year to an American. I laughed and said he could probably get 3 or 4 Colombians for that. So not only would you have more women working and you can be banging them, each would probably do a better job than what you are getting now.

I told him I could get him a translator and figure out the best places to put the help wanted ads. He wanted them to speak English but I said he could pay for English language schooling as a cheap perk. They are ample on line classes in Colombia. But I am kind of anxious to see if this works out. Has anyone ever heard of this before or done this?

Mark Cuban described the natural phase of a fad is first the innovators, then the imitators, and then the idiots. After reading the comments, I wonder if we are the idiot phase now. It sure seems like that in the USA.

[QUOTE=Gfefan;2947520]After a long hiatus, due to personal circumstances, I was out of game for last few months.

Back now and reinitiated membership. As cited by many, SA has gone downhill. Becoming increasingly difficult (later learned its same for girls too).

Signed up last week, messaged the "favorites" I had been accumulating over weeks before. Quite a few responses but many were right away $ (pros) or the babysitter story (scam).

Two progressed to meet. One was relatively fast and met quickly but seemed like she came for free lunch. Weirdly got food to go, had a drink with me and would not even let me touch her hand. Oh well, I am ok with a $75 waste.

The second one was more charming. Showed up casually in her work clothes. We had a great connection, though. Lot of talks, flirts.

We agreed to exchange test results this week and then meet up few days later. I have a feeling this is going to be a fuck fest. Can't wait. Wish me luck.[/QUOTE]Tell more more about the babysitter scam. Is that when they ask you to send them money electronically, saying they can't meet in person without funds to hire a sitter?

Been getting a surge of messages lately from long since seen SBs. Of course I'm curious as to why. So I ask each one. It's a range. This one needs money for school which is starting. That one feels sick and needs money to see the doctor (no universal care in her country). The next one has her phone turned off.

It's funny and sad at the same time. There's a notion in the US that half the country couldn't come up with 400 dollars if they needed it. This is that population. It's like they need a quick infusion of cash and must be thinking "what about that guy from 1.5 years ago who gave me 6000 pesos or 500 bucks that one night. Maybe he'll do it again. " Honestly I don't hate this.

To be fair, $400 was a lot of money to me in my early 20's. I remember losing $300 in Vegas back then and my friend freaking out because it was so much money 🤑.

Not sure I'd see any of them but reinforces my point from a few days ago.

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2947762]Been getting a surge of messages lately from long since seen SBs. Of course I'm curious as to why. So I ask each one. It's a range. This one needs money for school which is starting. That one feels sick and needs money to see the doctor (no universal care in her country). The next one has her phone turned off.

It's funny and sad at the same time. There's a notion in the US that half the country couldn't come up with 400 dollars if they needed it. This is that population. It's like they need a quick infusion of cash and must be thinking "what about that guy from 1.5 years ago who gave me 6000 pesos or 500 bucks that one night. Maybe he'll do it again. " Honestly I don't hate this.[/QUOTE]

Does anybody here have any ideas / suggestions / thoughts on finding sugar babies 'off the beaten path'? Preferably in first world countries, because third world countries have a different 'dynamic'.

I'm not really too satisfied with the 'quality' of women on the conventional platforms (Seeking Arrangement, SDM, MSD), so I figured: why limit myself to those platforms? I've already tried quite a few things, so I'll share the results of those 'experiments'.

My most successful attempt was a video on TikTok (LOL). Basically, I took a picture of a stack of cash in a luxury hotel room (along with a handwritten note with my username on it) and put a line of text on it along the lines of 'Are you interested in a sugar daddy?' (in my native language, however). It went 'viral' (over 10 k views within a few hours, and then it got deleted) after a lot of trial and error, and I got quite a lot of messages. I can elaborate on this approach some more, but I'll leave things here for now.

I tried 'advertising' on dating apps like Tinder and Badoo, but I feel as if this approach is pretty much impossible. First of all, your profile will barely have any visibility in the first place (unless you're significantly above average, in terms of attractiveness). Secondly, the word filter will probably catch any references to 'dating for benefits' in your biography (and if not, you'll get reported at some point).

I've also toyed with the idea of simply messaging random women on social media (Instagram, TikTok). I've never actually done this, but I think that this method could be quite successful (with the right preparation and the right approach). You'd need an Instagram account that exudes wealth and looks legitimate / trustworthy (bonus points if you're relatively young and look decent). You pick your 'target', send her a flirty message to break the ice (a specific compliment, for instance), and then you ask her how she feels about 'sugar dating'.

I actually posted this on USASG but figured I'the post here too because people need to know.

I am traveling to a 3rd tier us city so the seeking pickings were slim. So I figured I'd try out a backup site. Signed up for Secret Benefits.

It's a different model. You pay to send messages.

One thing you learn pretty quickly is that all of those users with the green "online now" sign are totally a lie. They aren't online and they probably haven't been for a long time. They had like 40 people "online" in this midwestern city when even the great seeking only had like 6 people that had even logged in in the past 2 days.

You will be shocked, shocked I say, to learn 2 things.

1. I got a steady drumbeat of girls, like 3 per day, in that city messaging me directly. Surprise: you have to pay to read the messages.

2. Not one person ever returned a message I wrote, either directly or in response to the girls reach outs.

It doesn't take long to realize this site is 99.9% fake and just honey potting its users.

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2948480]I actually posted this on USASG but figured I'the post here too because people need to know.

I am traveling to a 3rd tier us city so the seeking pickings were slim. So I figured I'd try out a backup site. Signed up for Secret Benefits.

It's a different model. You pay to send messages.

One thing you learn pretty quickly is that all of those users with the green "online now" sign are totally a lie. They aren't online and they probably haven't been for a long time. They had like 40 people "online" in this midwestern city when even the great seeking only had like 6 people that had even logged in in the past 2 days.

You will be shocked, shocked I say, to learn 2 things.

1. I got a steady drumbeat of girls, like 3 per day, in that city messaging me directly. Surprise: you have to pay to read the messages.

2. Not one person ever returned a message I wrote, either directly or in response to the girls reach outs.

It doesn't take long to realize this site is 99.9% fake and just honey potting its users.[/QUOTE]Yeah 100% scam. In addition to all those girls messaging you, they weren't even doing it! A seeking GF of mine said she went on there and there were guys contacting her and saying thanks for contacting them! She never sent any messages! Site was sending them for her. Total 100% scam.

I still stand behind my statement that Seeking the USA god awful, beyond any measure. The sense of entitlement and sheer vanity of most girls in America on the site, compared to girls in South America, is off the charts. This country corrupts women. I sure hope the US is not spreading it's cultural influence regarding "feminism" to the rest of the world. If so, everyone is doomed.

Met Lila on Seeking earlier this year. Was a bit of an odd date because we met up for sushi lunch but then she had to go to the doctor w her Gran. And we met up again at 6 PM and had an amazing session at the hotel. Not the usual start!

But I could tell from minute one this girl is a ball of bubbly chatty energy and perfect for me. So a month or two later I flew her to Vegas and we had such fun. Great dinners out. Lounging in the pool. But the highlight was Latin dancing for four hours the last night. OMG it was soooo fun. Couldn't wait to hook up with this force of nature again.

As luck would have it, I was flying to her home city for a work event. She could only get off two nights from work (classic seeking girl, non pro, with second shift low wage job). But they were a great two nights.

First night we went to a vibey Asian fusion spot. I knew we were going to pickup where we left off when she got of the elevator and squealed and rushed over to kiss me. The waitress seated us same side of table which I love. And such amazing animated conversation. Nothing off limits. We talked spouses and girlfriends (her also!) and Scandallo and FKK and she was just fascinated and said she loved the idea of such places. Just an amazing force of life.

After dinner we bounce to a Latin dancing place. I love how Mexican restaurants convert to dance floors late night. And it being her hometown she knows them all. So she picks something close to my hotel and we are off. We both have vehicles so we drop mine at the hotel and she drives her monster truck! Nothing like a smokin hot Mexican blasting thru town in her monster truck. It was hot as fuck.

At the club we have an amazing time. It's just a small place but there is a local dance celeb there making the dance floor fun. We dance on the other side of the bar more intimately and what fun. She is teaching me bachata and I am catching on fast and she is thrilled. We just have a great time and kill a few ranch waters (tequila and soda) before heading to the hotel.

Lovely time in the room. We both get naked fast and it's me on top making out and grinding junk. She likes to kiss which I love. After a bit I head down to her tits which are lovely firm Bcups. She's the type where her tits are connected to her pussy so I know as I suck them hard and deep she is moaning and writhing and I know she's getting wet.

Eventually I work my way down and tease her good with kissing and licking everywhere but her pussy. And when I do finally touch her clit it's electric. I recall that she likes clit sucking / licking with gspot circles (pays to write this down!) and so that's my plan. She has quite meaty lips so I suck on them some and move them aside to give direct clit access. A lot of sucking and bottom lip slip side and she is going nuts.

I learned in vegas that I don't want her to quite get her nut. Some girls go into grateful pleaser mode after they cum. And others feel a bit exhausted and done and she is the latter and I'm having none of that! So I don't let her quite get there and instead mount up. Fuck she feels amazing. I focus mostly on missionary and the Steve as my faves. Damn I fuck her good!

I can't quite recall all the sex or the order. There is def some BJ in there. And we do 69 for quite some time. Some cowgirl and a ton of mish and the Steve. That said as some point she does tire and kinda rolls on her side facing away from me. She'the done this in vegas and I let it just die there. But not this time.

So I lightly stroke my dick against her. And then grind a bit. And put her hand on my dick. Eventually she catches her breath and knows I want to finish. So good girl that she is she rolls back over and starts a between the legs BJ. Very solid and I am directing her a bit on ball work. Eventually I feel the build and get her on consistent shaft work. That long black hair in my hands. The view of those thick natural Latina lips up and down my shaft. And boom! A beautiful CIM blast. Ahhhhhh.

We sleep the sleep of the dead and she slips out some time early morning to take her Grampa to the airport but lets me sleep on. We already have plans to meetup night after next and it's even more epic. Stay tuned! This girl is my number one seeking crush right now — and that despite my three home girl rotation and my solid euro and Brazil GFs. She's just a wonderful amazing human and joy to be with in all ways. Can't wait to see her again!

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2948663]I still stand behind my statement that Seeking the USA god awful, beyond any measure. The sense of entitlement and sheer vanity of most girls in America on the site, compared to girls in South America, is off the charts. This country corrupts women. I sure hope the US is not spreading it's cultural influence regarding "feminism" to the rest of the world. If so, everyone is doomed.[/QUOTE]Totally agree with this. Seeking is shooting fish in a barrel outside US. And shoot urself in the head in the US. But to be fair that is a generalization. Yes 99.9% suck but that. 1% can be amazing. It's just exhausting but as I said I am stunned to have three girls in my local smallish city competing for my $$/ affection so it def can work still.

I have recently completed my holidays in morocco and I spent nights with total 3 girls on my entire trip.

1st girl for 2 days completely in Rabat, 2nd girl for 2 days in marekesh, and final one for 2 day Casablanca. Surprisingly all the girls have looks which is mix of arabian and spanish looks and prices for first 24 hrs is around 300 to 400 usd, as I booked for 48 hrs so got them at 600 to 700 USD. Very nice behaviour, awesome intimacy and cooperative.

I plan next to central europe and talking to some ukraine or polish girls. Ukraine girls are proposing they will come to warswas by a cab and then can fly to any european city and ask rate is 200 to 350 USD max for 24 hrs and discounts on multiple days. Looks genuine from conversation but ukraine girls ask for cab and flight fare to their paypal before leaving their country and polish girls want money or I can buy tickets for them.

For ukraine girls asking money for tickets by paypal is this normal or some scam. Can anyone elaborate.

I would love to meet the girls as they chat well and damm hot. If anyone has experience kindly write here.

Don't ever send money to someone you've never met in person. I assure you they will gladly take it and never speak to you again. If you don't believe me, send me $500 and I'll send you a 10 for an entire week to do as you please. I must warn you that she hates condoms, clothes, and fancy food.

FYI, that "damn hot" girl is a guy named Boris.

[QUOTE=Laj505;2948701]
For ukraine girls asking money for tickets by paypal is this normal or some scam. Can anyone elaborate.

I would love to meet the girls as they chat well and damm hot. If anyone has experience kindly write here.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Laj505;2948701]
1st girl for 2 days completely in Rabat, 2nd girl for 2 days in marekesh, and final one for 2 day Casablanca. Surprisingly all the girls have looks which is mix of arabian and spanish looks and prices for first 24 hrs is around 300 to 400 usd, as I booked for 48 hrs so got them at 600 to 700 USD. Very nice behaviour, awesome intimacy and cooperative.[/QUOTE]Did the Hotels allow you to bring them to your room? Or did you book a second room? I would love to try out Morocco, but the hotel problem has kept me away so far.

[QUOTE=Laj505;2948701]
For ukraine girls asking money for tickets by paypal is this normal or some scam. Can anyone elaborate.

I would love to meet the girls as they chat well and damm hot. If anyone has experience kindly write here.[/QUOTE]These are scams. Don't fall for it.

So despite the fact that Seeking mostly sucks balls in the US, it can deliver the rare gem if you put in the work. And once you find the gem, repeating is easy and comfortable and frankly better than any unpaid GF you ever had and def better than the hourly escort gig. It's unique and wonderful and worth every ounce of bullshit (which is measured in pounds if not tons). Here's how day 2 went down.

Yes. She's absolutely beautiful. And yeah she's a bubbly ball of fun. But damn she's just a nice person and great GF as well. As we are planning our date that night by text, she offers to help me dump my rental car since I have an early morning flight and just drive me after the club. What a great and thoughtful idea.

So I drive to the Rental Car center at the airport and drop my car and she picks me up there. I can't tell you how fun it is to be the passenger for a change. My girl driving us all over the city catching great food and dancing.

We start at an amazing Mexican restaurant with rooftop dancing late night. It's high end Mexican with valet parking and amazing food. I change the table setup to sit adjacent again and she likes that, putting her hand on my thigh and holding hands quite a bit. Food is excellent and it's very romantic.

After dinner we head up to the rooftop. Unfortunately it's dead with only a handful of people. It's a lovely place but just no one there. Shame. Of course one thing I love about her is she is not shy. I can't tell you how many girls would be "no one else is dancing I'the be embarrassed ". Not her! We get some ranch water and a margarita and start cutting a rug right there at the bar.

Of course we can only generate so much vibe ourselves so we are considering a move when they announce last call and they are closing at midnight instead of 2. Damn. Well that turns out to be great. She's consulted her phone and lightly suggests a gay club thinking I will not be down as the old white dude but I am all over it and she is thrilled.

Side note: if you haven't taken your girl to a gay club you are missing out. They are off the hook free and fun and not to be missed. Put all your homophobe shit in a box for a night. You won't be sorry.

Anyhow we find a vibey Latin gay club on the gay bar strip part of town. Not packed (like Heaven in London will have 400 people midweek!) but prob 30 people having fun. We are one of the only pure straight couples but it's a hugely accepting place and no one even gives us a glance. I change to Red Bull vodka to make sure I can keep up w my girl and we hit the floor.

Both of us are pretty lit by now so the dancing is off the hook sexy. She does show me a few more moves and I do a credible job but mostly I dance like I don't give two fucks. As she dances a lot and has taken lessons the small compliments she gives me mean a lot. And the grinding is on point. She will turn around and back into me and I will pull her close hands on hips and we will grind and slow fuck there on the floor. Damn she's a hottie. I took some videos which I will watch daily!

Although we would both dance for hours we are painfully aware of my early AM flight and decide we best make a break to have time for lots of good fucking before the flight. But not before a bit of late night comedy. She's left the lights of her truck on and the batteries dead.

This leads to me flagging down trucks full of gay Mexicans leaving the club scene late night and trying to find jumper cables. Of course they don't speak English and the old white dude doesn't know jumper cables in Spanish so when I get one to stop she rushes over and talks animatedly in Spanish till we hit pay dirt. The guys are super nice and do all the work and voila we are back in business.

Damn back at the room we are so comfortable. We get naked and flop on the bed. Very similar routine. Making out. Damn I loooove kissing. And then awesome tit work. I know just what she likes and I love fingering her and feeling her respond. Once again quite a bit of awesome DATY but not till finish.

The fucking in Mish and the Steve is divine and her blowjob is on point tonight but damn we are drunk as fuck and eventually sorta pack it in. She goes to shower and I realize I'm not quite wanting to finish without finishing! So I just wank lightly to stay hard.

When she returns from the shower she flops on her back looking sexy as hell. I am still wanking lightly. So. I rear up on my knees between her legs so she is watching me. And after a bit I put her hand on her pussy. This is really for me but she starts the slow circles and I can see she's starting to enjoy herself. I slide in my thumb into her sloppy goodness and that is making me hard as a brick.

Despite some really enjoyable spit wabking and pussy feeling I am hard but not going to cum. But I have an inspiration. Why not go again? I move her hand and put my hard dick on her clit and continue the clit massage. It feels great but I want her around me. So I push my dick down just an inch or two and slide in.

Damn she feels fine. And my hard cock is soooo ready now. It must feel great to her also because she starts to clamp. She has what I call a paint roll style orgasm where her pelvic floor pushes down hard. I've only felt it with girls before when fingering. But she starts orgasming and it's pushing me out and making it hard to fuck!

Fortunately I keep the slip slide going long enough for her O to pass and mine build. I start to build and can feel a massive shot coming which I pull out and shoot on her stomach. Damn I am glad I started that extra round. It was a drink inspired moment of greatness and we both got a massive O in the end. Win win.

Damn this girl is solidly my new crush. Yes I have GFs that are prettier and yes some better on the sex front. But damn for a bubbly chatty dancing machine and solid fucking I am all in! Love this girl!

[QUOTE=Ailton;2948767]Did the Hotels allow you to bring them to your room? Or did you book a second room? I would love to try out Morocco, but the hotel problem has kept me away so far.

These are scams. Don't fall for it.[/QUOTE]You have to book two hotel rooms but can stay in one. Also no PDA in public spaces. But inside room the girls are hot and deliver good. Complete crazy sex.

But buddy, those ukraine girls are damm good at convincing. They continuously texting and sending screenshots of flights and all. Looks like interested but I guess better not to waste money on a scam.

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2948709]Don't ever send money to someone you've never met in person. I assure you they will gladly take it and never speak to you again. If you don't believe me, send me $500 and I'll send you a 10 for an entire week to do as you please. I must warn you that she hates condoms, clothes, and fancy food.

FYI, that "damn hot" girl is a guy named Boris.[/QUOTE]Should I ask for video call? Few even agreed for video call.

Also looks like flying any girl is risky. Always meet them at their country and then maybe can bring them as my holiday partner.

Any opinion on polish girls? Any ukraine girls Whats their standard charges?

Who is that girl you mentioned who is a 10.

[QUOTE=Laj505;2948701]I have recently completed my holidays in morocco and I spent nights with total 3 girls on my entire trip.

1st girl for 2 days completely in Rabat, 2nd girl for 2 days in marekesh, and final one for 2 day Casablanca. Surprisingly all the girls have looks which is mix of arabian and spanish looks and prices for first 24 hrs is around 300 to 400 usd, as I booked for 48 hrs so got them at 600 to 700 USD. Very nice behaviour, awesome intimacy and cooperative.

I plan next to central europe and talking to some ukraine or polish girls. Ukraine girls are proposing they will come to warswas by a cab and then can fly to any european city and ask rate is 200 to 350 USD max for 24 hrs and discounts on multiple days. Looks genuine from conversation but ukraine girls ask for cab and flight fare to their paypal before leaving their country and polish girls want money or I can buy tickets for them.

For ukraine girls asking money for tickets by paypal is this normal or some scam. Can anyone elaborate.

I would love to meet the girls as they chat well and damm hot. If anyone has experience kindly write here.[/QUOTE]Avoid Ukraine girls at all cost. 99% of the time it is just a scam.

As others said do not fly girls in unless you have already met a few times.

[QUOTE=Laj505;2948857]Should I ask for video call? Few even agreed for video call.

Also looks like flying any girl is risky. Always meet them at their country and then maybe can bring them as my holiday partner.

Any opinion on polish girls? Any ukraine girls Whats their standard charges?

Who is that girl you mentioned who is a 10.[/QUOTE]Definitely never send a girl cash that you haven't met. Whether she is local or fly in doesn't matter. Never send cash ahead. Never ever. Also tho never fly a girl you haven't met and slept with. Fuck you will be together a few days. You better like each other for more than sex.

That said once you have met up and fly a girl there is nothing better. Fair warning I was even burned once on a girl I thought I knew well back in 2019. But prob 10 trips since then with flying in a girl I know and damn. It's the best.

Ps video call solves nothing. Just means she’s a real person. Doesn’t mean she’s not gonna just keep ur dough and go fuck her bf.

Hi guys,

I am not new to seeking since I have been using it-on and off-in SoCal, and when the fat women started asking for 1 k USD ppm, that's when I knew I had to bail, LOL. So I started testing the waters on Tijuana seeking and this lady asked for 25 k pesos per month. She also added that this is apart from the hotel and travel fees I would also be responsible for.

We would be meeting weekly. I can afford it since it comes down to $361 per meet, which is a bargain here, but the manner in which she just threw out the number just left a bad taste in my mouth.

[URL]https://members.seeking.com/member/398b646d-77fc-4672-be9e-d11204653be2[/URL]

Exactly what happened. She was quick to respond texts. Didn't ask for $ to m&g. I followed the "let's meet and close the deal" and agreed to meet at a restaurant. She came, chatted a but, ordered food to go. I was like "hmmm. Maybe she doesn't like me" but she was upset that I closed the check and prepared to leave because she wasn't trying to communicate she doesn't like me. But, she wouldn't allow me to even touch her hand.

Weird. Cut my losses and left.

[QUOTE=TheCane;2947530]You mean to tell me somebody showed up for a date and got food to go? Now that's a new shameful low in unacceptable behavior by these "soft-core" prostitutes! Unbelievable![/QUOTE]

They will talk sweet, setup a M&G. But the will somehow have a kid that magically appears or a grandma who needs a caretaker and ask you for $ to cover.

This has always been the case but now that I return after a long hiatus, he frequency if such scams are alarming. If seeking doesn't fix this, I am sure it's going downhill from here. For now, I have found a sweet one (1 to fuck from nearly 40+ leads) and going to keep her. Seeking is becoming more and more work as days pass. Sad but true.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2947625]Tell more more about the babysitter scam. Is that when they ask you to send them money electronically, saying they can't meet in person without funds to hire a sitter?[/QUOTE]

Have a friend who plays internationally at clubs but doesn't do Seeking. Too afraid of blowback w the wife. But he's in Mexico looking for action in a college town. So I pulled my pics off the site and went gem mining. Snagged two hotties for him and sent over to his Whatsapps to seal the deal. Has one on for tomorrow night!

What are friends for after all?

Wow. Seeking can be so interesting. Because it's real world. So as you know I been kinda juggling three home girls trying to find the one. It kinda settled on Gina because she's a nice compromise all around. Attractive. Sweet. Submissive. Great BJ. What's not to like.

Then tonight. I reunited with Fuck Bunny who I hadn't seen in two months. And damn I like that girl! Yes her kissing and BJ are mediocre. But we met up for a platonic reunion just to reconnect and DAMN I like that girl. Solid nine with spectacular dcups on a petite Mexicans frame. And we literally chatted and laughed and drank for three hours with no sexual connection except making out twice at the bathrooms. LOL. And it was an amazing. Best three hours ever with a girl with her clothes on. She's really keeper.

Got to make her my prime. No question. Going to meetup and fuck Sunday. Damn I like this girl!

[QUOTE=Gfefan;2949218]They will talk sweet, setup a M&G. But they will somehow have a kid that magically appears or a grandma who needs a caretaker and ask you for $ to cover.
[/QUOTE]I simply hang up the phone if they want money to meet. Not worth wasting my time, it never ends. If you agree to help them with gas money, then they need money for a babysitter. And not $30, more like $200. So best just to hang up the phone.

Your time has to be worth more than theirs anyway, are you supposed to be the one supporting them financially because you earn more? When I have told them that I get more argument, so JUST HANG UP!

[QUOTE=Laj505;2948701]For ukraine girls asking money for tickets by paypal is this normal or some scam. Can anyone elaborate.

I would love to meet the girls as they chat well and damm hot. If anyone has experience kindly write here.[/QUOTE]NEVER send money to a woman you haven't had sex with before, and are established with. If you want to take that level of risk, then you tell them to send you their passport, and you will buy the ticket for them, and the cost of getting from their house to the airport is their responsibility. And no, they cannot have cash because they don't have a suitcase to travel with, or for any other "bullshit" excuse.

She can't do anything with a ticket in her name, other than possibly take the flight and attempt to dodge you on arrival. Which, if they are as financially strapped as they appear / claim, that would be stupid. They would be stranded in a foreign country with barely enough money for food and uber / taxi. Plus you could immediately cancel the hotel reservation and end the return portion of the round trip flight. They would be quite thoroughly butt fucked at that point; possibly sleeping at the airport and asking for food handouts from strangers who might not even speak their language.

Even if it is a refundable ticket, and she cancels it, the money goes back to your credit card, and not to her as cash.

NEVER EVER EVER send cash to someone you don't have a physical rapport with. If they don't have the wherewithal to find someone to watch their kid, get basic travel supplies, or anyone else they would request money for, then you need to move on to the next girl.

I have sent money to girls I've hooked up with in the past, and the results have been mixed. Some were honest and kept their word; others were cheats. But you have to be prepared to lose the money either way; just like investing in a high risk security.

Wise words you wrote.

The few times I was stupid enough to send an advance gift I regretted it. Even if I wasn't breadcrumbed, which I was, it would've set the precedent that that's how things go. Pay first and then we'll talk about what's next.

The other many times I said I'm sorry I don't or can't send digital cash before I meet someone, I was rewarded for it. Eg a girl immediately blocks you and you realize oh it was in fact a scam.

Wisdom is the ability to learn from the mistakes of others and not need to learn them yourself.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2950606]NEVER send money to a woman you haven't had sex with before, and are established with. If you want to take that level of risk, then you tell them to send you their passport, and you will buy the ticket for them, and the cost of getting from their house to the airport is their responsibility. And no, they cannot have cash because they don't have a suitcase to travel with, or for any other "bullshit" excuse.

She can't do anything with a ticket in her name, other than possibly take the flight and attempt to dodge you on arrival. Which, if they are as financially strapped as they appear / claim, that would be stupid. They would be stranded in a foreign country with barely enough money for food and uber / taxi. Plus you could immediately cancel the hotel reservation and end the return portion of the round trip flight. They would be quite thoroughly butt fucked at that point; possibly sleeping at the airport and asking for food handouts from strangers who might not even speak their language.

Even if it is a refundable ticket, and she cancels it, the money goes back to your credit card, and not to her as cash..[/QUOTE]

Wise words.

I do NOT send money in advance at all. Unless I have known, met many times and have a connection with the girl.

My best ever in Spain. We know each other for nearly 3. 5 years now. Met, dated, and fucked many times in first two years. Then, I moved.

These days, while traveling, I go to Spain to see her but that is more like once in six months.

Last year, I learned from. Her friend that she had a minor accident and insurance did not cover about 1 k EUR. Lot for her but this girl never asked me.

I sent it over without she asking me. And she first refused before reluctantly agreeing to keep it on the condition that it's a loan and she will return it. As we were on different continents, I said OK andshe used it for paying debt.

3 months later, when we met, this Cutie gave me 500 EUR and said she will pay remainder when we meet next.

I left the entire 500 plus her allowance in her bag beforei left Spain. I later was chided for doing so. She simply wants to return my money.

I am going to take it next time we meet because she doesn't want to feel indebted to someone. I understand that sentiment.

But, boy, I must admit. The tender girl friend experience with her only keeps getting better and as a result our sex keeps getting better. If I met her more frequently, I think we will lose it. So, deliberately keeping it once every 4 months or so.

Best girl, best sex, and she will do me even if I don't pay her.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2950606]NEVER send money to a woman you haven't had sex with before, and are established with. If you want to take that level of risk, then you tell them to send you their passport, and you will buy the ticket for them, and the cost of getting from their house to the airport is their responsibility. And no, they cannot have cash because they don't have a suitcase to travel with, or for any other "bullshit" excuse.

She can't do anything with a ticket in her name, other than possibly take the flight and attempt to dodge you on arrival. Which, if they are as financially strapped as they appear / claim, that would be stupid. They would be stranded in a foreign country with barely enough money for food and uber / taxi. Plus you could immediately cancel the hotel reservation and end the return portion of the round trip flight. They would be quite thoroughly butt fucked at that point; possibly sleeping at the airport and asking for food handouts from strangers who might not even speak their language.

Even if it is a refundable ticket, and she cancels it, the money goes back to your credit card, and not to her as cash.

NEVER EVER EVER send cash to someone you don't have a physical rapport with. If they don't have the wherewithal to find someone to watch their kid, get basic travel supplies, or anyone else they would request money for, then you need to move on to the next girl.

I have sent money to girls I've hooked up with in the past, and the results have been mixed. Some were honest and kept their word; others were cheats. But you have to be prepared to lose the money either way; just like investing in a high risk security.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Laj505;2948701]For ukraine girls asking money for tickets by paypal is this normal or some scam. Can anyone elaborate.

I would love to meet the girls as they chat well and damm hot. If anyone has experience kindly write here.[/QUOTE]Echo the thoughts of others here. Never, ever, ever, no matter how hot the girl, how harrowing the apparent bind she is in give her money in advance for anything. Unless you have a very well established relationship / arrangement. And even then. I've made the mistake of giving advances to girls I thought I knew and who I'd fucked multiple times, only for them to ghost me.

As for Ukraine girls, I just wouldn't entertain them. Unless they are in your country and down to meet, trying to set something up involving international travel for a first meet is just going to be a waste of your time, unless you are the one doing the travelling and the girl is for your entertainment. Hence I quickly bin Ukraine based girls who come into my matches / orbit. Both my time and my money are valuable to me.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2950606] She can't do anything with a ticket in her name [/QUOTE]Depending on the ticket and airline rules, if she misses the flight or cancels it, she might get flight credit -- in her name. I. e. It doesn't go back to your card. Then the scammer can cash it out by buying another plane ticket for someone else. I've had girls ask for train tickets and I assumed it's some scam, then I found the explanation on reddit.

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2951254]Depending on the ticket and airline rules, if she misses the flight or cancels it, she might get flight credit -- in her name. I. e. It doesn't go back to your card. Then the scammer can cash it out by buying another plane ticket for someone else. I've had girls ask for train tickets and I assumed it's some scam, then I found the explanation on reddit.[/QUOTE]I guess that's possible, but if you are the authority on the ticket, that would make it very difficult. If the flight credit went back to my email address, I would still have the redemption even if it's in her name. If someone did something like that, then I would sell her passport info on the dark web to help cover the loss, then file a chargeback with my credit card company. I can see a scammer potentially poking holes in a plane ticket, but it's way less risky than sending cash.

I think we all agree. Never ever send money or tickets to a girl you don't know. But a couple cautionary tales about being too trusting with girls you DO know.

I spend a weekend with a seeking girl in Buenos Aires. She was amazing. I dug her. She dug me. It was the real deal. So I flew her to London. And once she got there she dumped me. Had some other guy in BA put her up at a $600/ night hotel so she wouldn't stay with me. And she fucked guys all over town after I flew her there! What a biatch. Thought I knew her. Was wrong.

And more recently. A girl I have know for five years. She borrowed 200. Paid it back. She borrowed 500 paid it back. Now she's into me for 2000 and has ghosted me. Thought I knew her. I was wrong.

Now that said these are a couple fails amongst a mountain of successes. But you never even know with girls you know. And you sure as he'll don't know with girls you don't know. So just keep your wits about you and enjoy the ride!

This kind of shit happens all the time. I would bat a lash over it. If they ever ask for something above and beyond our status quo, I make it clear it's a gift. Anything else and you're just setting yourself up for disappointment. Or worse, losing someone you really like.

Short on rent money? Fine so long as it's occasional. Need an advance on the next liaison? Fine. When and if they try to remind me the next time we meet that I have credit I give it to them anyway. I pat myself on the back and know I've got an honest one.

I don't let anything come up that I don't mind losing. One time I met a girl for dinner and it went awesome. She was hurting for tuition money and I agreed to give her what she was short to just have dinner with me (which was dumb but I don't regret because we ended up having a good time). We were supposed to continue at my place but she ended up getting too drunk to drive herself. Next day we meet again and I offer her a 4 digit sum to spend the weekend with me. Mostly knowing she needed the help and she was cute enough to really do it for me. She agrees, I give her the money, and a few hours later she "feels sick" and wants to go home then proceeds to ghost me. Oh well, cost of doing business. If I let it upset me I'd miss out on the positive experiences and there are way more of those.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2951285]I think we all agree. Never ever send money or tickets to a girl you don't know. But a couple cautionary tales about being too trusting with girls you DO know.

I spend a weekend with a seeking girl in Buenos Aires. She was amazing. I dug her. She dug me. It was the real deal. So I flew her to London. And once she got there she dumped me. Had some other guy in BA put her up at a $600/ night hotel so she wouldn't stay with me. And she fucked guys all over town after I flew her there! What a biatch. Thought I knew her. Was wrong.

And more recently. A girl I have know for five years. She borrowed 200. Paid it back. She borrowed 500 paid it back. Now she's into me for 2000 and has ghosted me. Thought I knew her. I was wrong.

Now that said these are a couple fails amongst a mountain of successes. But you never even know with girls you know. And you sure as he'll don't know with girls you don't know. So just keep your wits about you and enjoy the ride![/QUOTE]

At a restaurant, tonight I met a fatty who posted that her body type was "slim" and some of her photos were large in the butt. I passed on her a month ago, recently she said she had had "liposuction" a few weeks ago, another lie. On the way to dinner she called me lying that she was almost out of gas and was wondering if I had Venmo or a cash app to give her some gas money, another lie. I said no, I do not do those. So she wanted to change the restaurant and meet closer to her house, claiming she only had 20 miles left on her gas, another red flag.

I met her at the restaurant and saw the same fat belly. Said she was 33 years old, in person, when her profile said 28, another lie. She said she wanted $500 PPM and we had discussed it before and she had come down from $700, which was a lie. I said the most I would do for PPM was $400. Then she argued, the women in your county get $1,000. She asked me why I would not do another hundred more? I said I did not value it at that. I did not call her a fatty nor mention her weight, but should have been honest with her. Then she tried to get $450. I said "no. " She got up and left the table. I enjoyed finishing eating her pizza and cancelled the desert she ordered. The bill came to $57 and I left a $7 tip. What a Heffer.

My best decisions are the women I pass on! It is necessary to meet them at a restaurant to evaluate them, just like a job interview. So on the way home I texted my regular, a slim tall blonde, who is coming over tomorrow for $200, I have been with her for about 5 years. I would post photos, but do not have permission of the fatty or my slim regular.

Go direct on the request. I know a girl in Antioquia who is basically destitute. Living in an overcrowded home with her mom, son, and siblings. The family shares food. But, before things got this bad, she was able to enroll in the local university with assistance for tuition (not from me). Her phone is damaged and she has to use a borrowed laptop for school and to communicate with me. She tells me the desks at school don't support the laptop very well and she's starting to get carpal tunnel in her arm. She asks if I can assist with a wireless mouse and a laptop stand. I have a Colombian friend who speaks Spanish obviously much better than I do, reach out to the university with a ruse to verify her enrollment. Turns out she is in fact really a student and going to classes.

I don't give her any money. Instead I get on Amazon and find her a wireless mouse for $8. 99 USD and no frills laptop stand for $8. 60. Total item costs $17.59. Shipping $9. 63. Collectively I just paid 115,000 Colombian pesos to Amazon, and she responds with "Estoy muy contenta! When they arrive, borrowing her sister's phone to take pictures. What could she possibly do with $17 USD? Try to sell a cheap mouse and laptop stand to a neighbor who probably doesn't need them to begin with, and get 15 USD? What can you do with 15 USD, go to the grocery store and get food for your son?

I would so much rather shell out $27 to a struggling girl I know is willing to work and trying to improve her life, than give spare change to a stupid, drug addicted bum on an American street who goes around stealing from people.

Mind you, if she had given me the story that her grandmother was in the hospital with kidney failure, and she needs $1,000 USD. Rather than sending $1,000 to a Colombian hospital, I would have just responded by saying "Sorry, I guess your grandmother is just going to have to die. " Sometimes there are ways to confirm the validity of the request, and not send money directly to the girl.

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2951306]This kind of shit happens all the time. I would bat a lash over it. If they ever ask for something above and beyond our status quo, I make it clear it's a gift. Anything else and you're just setting yourself up for disappointment. Or worse, losing someone you really like.

Short on rent money? Fine so long as it's occasional. Need an advance on the next liaison? Fine. When and if they try to remind me the next time we meet that I have credit I give it to them anyway. I pat myself on the back and know I've got an honest one.

I don't let anything come up that I don't mind losing. One time I met a girl for dinner and it went awesome. She was hurting for tuition money and I agreed to give her what she was short to just have dinner with me (which was dumb but I don't regret because we ended up having a good time). We were supposed to continue at my place but she ended up getting too drunk to drive herself. Next day we meet again and I offer her a 4 digit sum to spend the weekend with me. Mostly knowing she needed the help and she was cute enough to really do it for me. She agrees, I give her the money, and a few hours later she "feels sick" and wants to go home then proceeds to ghost me. Oh well, cost of doing business. If I let it upset me I'd miss out on the positive experiences and there are way more of those.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2951306]She agrees, I give her the money, and a few hours later she "feels sick" and wants to go home then proceeds to ghost me. Oh well, cost of doing business. If I let it upset me I'd miss out on the positive experiences and there are way more of those.[/QUOTE]When you've been doing this long enough you definitely see patterns. A girl tells you something in earnest, but it's the fifth time you've heard it.

On 3 occasions in the past with an overnight arrangement a girl said she had to leave. One made this concerned face as she read her phone that her brother was in an accident and she had to attend to him.

In every case I said the same thing. Totally fine, life happens, so sorry to hear it. But you're not getting the full amount then. In every case the girl stayed. Turns out the brother's emergency could be put off for the 6000 pesos.

Most girls I meet on seeking are quite happy to spend all our time together and more. There's good chemistry. But it's clear when someone would rather be elsewhere and it's all about the money. I get it. I'm middle aged and I prob wouldn't want to bang a 45 year old woman when I was 20. I'm thrilled that so many of the girls are really into it. But when one isn't, I'm not about to part with the entire arranged amount for half the time. I think this is good policy.

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2952088]When you've been doing this long enough you definitely see patterns. A girl tells you something in earnest, but it's the fifth time you've heard it.

On 3 occasions in the past with an overnight arrangement a girl said she had to leave. One made this concerned face as she read her phone that her brother was in an accident and she had to attend to him.

In every case I said the same thing. Totally fine, life happens, so sorry to hear it. But you're not getting the full amount then. In every case the girl stayed. Turns out the brother's emergency could be put off for the 6000 pesos.[/QUOTE]I do not pay before the deed. If they want money before I say no, you can go. And that is the only way to handle it. It is a hard and fast rule. You would not pay an employee at the beginning of the week before he had done any work, would you? I have walked out on a few hoes and shown a few the door. But they are scammers for sure.

In Vegas one time I paid the girl and she went into the bathroom and immediately came out saying her period had started. Typical lie. Problem.

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2952088]When you've been doing this long enough you definitely see patterns. A girl tells you something in earnest, but it's the fifth time you've heard it.

On 3 occasions in the past with an overnight arrangement a girl said she had to leave. One made this concerned face as she read her phone that her brother was in an accident and she had to attend to him.

In every case I said the same thing. Totally fine, life happens, so sorry to hear it. But you're not getting the full amount then. In every case the girl stayed. Turns out the brother's emergency could be put off for the 6000 pesos.

Most girls I meet on seeking are quite happy to spend all our time together and more. There's good chemistry. But it's clear when someone would rather be elsewhere and it's all about the money. I get it. I'm middle aged and I prob wouldn't want to bang a 45 year old woman when I was 20. I'm thrilled that so many of the girls are really into it. But when one isn't, I'm not about to part with the entire arranged amount for half the time. I think this is good policy.[/QUOTE]Pi. That makes a lot of sense. Def a good idea if you have negotiated certain timeframe. My approach I never negotiate time w seeking girls and just let it happen organically. This has been great for me. But I could def see in the case of specific overnight agreement your method is kind and balanced and fair even tho U know she's spinning BS.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2952116]Pi. That makes a lot of sense. Def a good idea if you have negotiated certain timeframe. My approach I never negotiate time w seeking girls and just let it happen organically. This has been great for me. But I could def see in the case of specific overnight agreement your method is kind and balanced and fair even tho U know she's spinning BS.[/QUOTE]I know a lot of guys don't specify time because they're actually happy for the girl to leave. They want to bang but get a good night sleep.

I'm a little bit different. I will usually go about four rounds between a night and the following morning. But my favorites by far are the first round and then the morning sex. I am not ready to give up the morning sex.

Hey guys! I am traveling after a while to two European cities. Fired up SA starting two weeks ago and am in an interesting situation. The first city I have finalized prices with 11 girls though I'm staying only 7. The second 5 girls for 4 days. More being added as we speak. Now I'm happy to have the choices but am honestly starting to feel overwhelmed with dates and times and balancing them all. A couple have been chattier with better chemistry but for the most part all have been nice. I do want to experience as many as possible but also repeating a couple that I like after meeting in person. I know it's a bit self explanatory but how would you handle this? Any pointers are greatly appreciated.

Also, random question. What's the starting dose of vitamin see? Better to take every morning regardless of play time? Or take an hour before play time but obviously no more than once every 24 hours? Only taken vitamin V before and not a fan of mild headache almost always. Thanks!

Depends on what your personal taste is Beauty of seeking is that there is room for every taste.

I had always been (and will be) quality over quantity. I keep number of girls finalized for less than number of days. Some are good enough to repeat.

Have I been burned and ended up sleeping alone? Yes. ID rather sleep alone than fuck someone I am not happy with.

Also, I don't book mlre than one girl and ditch the other. If I did that, I have no rights to complain about girls that ask for $ for M&G or advance pay scammers. The more we guys stand girls up, the more we are driving prices up for ourselves.

Now, that is something I don't do but I don't advocate or preach othersi know I can't change the system.

About Cialis and Viagra (no need to use hidden phrases about those. Entitely normal and legal drugs those are) there was a thread that discussed this at length. Best is consult a physician. As far me. The girl os Cialis and chemistry is viagra. Once I tried half of a Cialis tablet in US and actually my orgasm quality dropped although I lasted longer. No fun. So, stoped it.

[QUOTE=Chola;2952482]Hey guys! I am traveling after a while to two European cities. Fired up SA starting two weeks ago and am in an interesting situation. The first city I have finalized prices with 11 girls though I'm staying only 7. The second 5 girls for 4 days. More being added as we speak. Now I'm happy to have the choices but am honestly starting to feel overwhelmed with dates and times and balancing them all. A couple have been chattier with better chemistry but for the most part all have been nice. I do want to experience as many as possible but also repeating a couple that I like after meeting in person. I know it's a bit self explanatory but how would you handle this? Any pointers are greatly appreciated.

Also, random question. What's the starting dose of vitamin see? Better to take every morning regardless of play time? Or take an hour before play time but obviously no more than once every 24 hours? Only taken vitamin V before and not a fan of mild headache almost always. Thanks![/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Chola;2952482]Hey guys! I am traveling after a while to two European cities. Fired up SA starting two weeks ago and am in an interesting situation. The first city I have finalized prices with 11 girls though I'm staying only 7. The second 5 girls for 4 days. More being added as we speak. Now I'm happy to have the choices but am honestly starting to feel overwhelmed with dates and times and balancing them all. A couple have been chattier with better chemistry but for the most part all have been nice. I do want to experience as many as possible but also repeating a couple that I like after meeting in person. I know it's a bit self explanatory but how would you handle this? Any pointers are greatly appreciated.

Also, random question. What's the starting dose of vitamin see? Better to take every morning regardless of play time? Or take an hour before play time but obviously no more than once every 24 hours? Only taken vitamin V before and not a fan of mild headache almost always. Thanks![/QUOTE]Seems to me like you have too many girls on the roster. Let's suppose I have a five day trip. I will line up different girls for days 1 2 and 3. So I can try them out. As GFE says no more than one girl at a time. Never double book. That's just rude. But you can cancel a day in advance. The general plan is try the three girls and then repeat the favorite the last two days. But I have also repeated two. Or been slain by girl one and canceled the rest. Basically you want a small buffet but then go load your play once you find what you like. My general experience is that dates 2 and three with a girl are amongst the best in the relationship. Date 1 you don't know each other well enough and dates 4 plus maybe you know each other a bit too well. LOL.

As far as Cialis you really should do a consult. I use K Health which is totally online. If you are doing occasional use they will recommend 10 MG and good for three days. But I sometimes AMP up a bit on day 2 or 3.

Thanks Steve and GfeFan. Yeah, I definitely hate being stood up (almost never happened) so am not going to double book. I have kinda come up with a stack ranking of most desirable to least so in case I miss a few it'the be fine. Will report back!

Thinking of trying Cialis 5 MG daily for one or two days. If it doesn't work it will be back to Viagra. Fortunately available without prescription where I'll be.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2952642]Seems to me like you have too many girls on the roster. Let's suppose I have a five day trip. I will line up different girls for days 1 2 and 3. So I can try them out. As GFE says no more than one girl at a time. Never double book. That's just rude. But you can cancel a day in advance. The general plan is try the three girls and then repeat the favorite the last two days. But I have also repeated two. Or been slain by girl one and canceled the rest. Basically you want a small buffet but then go load your play once you find what you like. My general experience is that dates 2 and three with a girl are amongst the best in the relationship. Date 1 you don't know each other well enough and dates 4 plus maybe you know each other a bit too well. LOL.

As far as Cialis you really should do a consult. I use K Health which is totally online. If you are doing occasional use they will recommend 10 MG and good for three days. But I sometimes AMP up a bit on day 2 or 3.[/QUOTE]

Shout out to the regular posters in this thread.

I don't think I would gotten a seeking membership without reading your experiences.

I'm doing my third month in seeking (on and off over the past year).

Feeling that the work starting to pay off.

There is learning curve to this app dealing with nuisance from scammers.

And aggressive pro escorts.

My screening process is better now.

I am beginning to find the young gems that are not escorts.

Horny young woman who love sex and the money is just extra cherry on top for them.

Really addicted to this pick up app at the moment.

The Cane is back in more ways than one! I'm giving Seeking another try. I relocated from a Tier 1 city to one that I consider to be a Tier 3 town that punches above its weight. It's a capital city with a [B]very large[/B] university student population. I reached out to and already heard back from the kind of pretty, white, blonde coeds I have lust in my dark heart for. Here's hoping for another great experience like the only other one I had the first time around! Although, that (a walk-off, grand slam home run) will be hard to match! Hopefully my screening skills will be better. We shall see. Anything good or exceptionally bad happens, and I will report.

I am leaving on Saturday for 2 plus weeks in Buenos Aires. Started a few weeks ago reaching out and have six or seven whatsapp numbers. They are all asking for 100 -125 usd. Will report back.

Good to know that. BA is on my list for next vacation. Looking forward to your reports.

[QUOTE=Jbj64;2953465]I am leaving on Saturday for 2 plus weeks in Buenos Aires. Started a few weeks ago reaching out and have six or seven whatsapp numbers. They are all asking for 100 -125 usd. Will report back.[/QUOTE]

Nothing beats Uni students lookin got make quick bucks. Long back I used to travel Montreal for project and had dates with many Uni girls. Perfect combination, Young, Reasonable and excited to see cash. And they loved to stay in Sheraton instead of their dorms with great breakfast. Miss those days.

[QUOTE=TheCane;2953380]The Cane is back in more ways than one! I'm giving Seeking another try. I relocated from a Tier 1 city to one that I consider to be a Tier 3 town that punches above its weight. It's a capital city with a [B]very large[/B] university student population. I reached out to and already heard back from the kind of pretty, white, blonde coeds I have lust in my dark heart for. Here's hoping for another great experience like the only other one I had the first time around! Although, that (a walk-off, grand slam home run) will be hard to match! Hopefully my screening skills will be better. We shall see. Anything good or exceptionally bad happens, and I will report.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Jbj64;2953465]I am leaving on Saturday for 2 plus weeks in Buenos Aires. Started a few weeks ago reaching out and have six or seven whatsapp numbers. They are all asking for 100 -125 usd. Will report back.[/QUOTE]Interesting to hear feedback as well. I've heard before that rates are higher in Argentina because prostitution is more frowned upon that most other South American countries.

[QUOTE=Jbj64;2953465]I am leaving on Saturday for 2 plus weeks in Buenos Aires. Started a few weeks ago reaching out and have six or seven whatsapp numbers. They are all asking for 100 -125 usd. Will report back.[/QUOTE]Nice Place. Some of those girls have german genes. Price I found around 250 to 300 for entire day. For 3 day weekend its 700/800 max. But I would prefer changing girls everyday like I change clothes everyday.

Enjoy Buddy.

Hello Gents,

I regularly post in the LA seeking thread at usasexguide, and it is customary to post links of seeking girls; however, I rarely see any links being posted here. Is it against the rules to do such? I have never used seeking outside of the States, but I will be embarking on a journey to London in December, and to that end, I have secured the contacts of potential SBs. One Japanese lady, 36, is asking for 500 pounds for 5-7 hours consisting of drinks and intimacy. She said that verbatim. [URL]https://members.seeking.com/member/9b3eac1e-1ba2-4464-966f-9a9893b48893[/URL].

My PPM is usually $400, but of course, I have done way more than that for the occasional unicorn.

My question is: is London that expensive, especially for a 36 year old, and what is the average PPM? I will post my reports after I come back in Jan 2025. Thank you all.

[QUOTE=Uncountable;2954077]Hello Gents,

I regularly post in the LA seeking thread at usasexguide, and it is customary to post links of seeking girls; however, I rarely see any links being posted here. Is it against the rules to do such? I have never used seeking outside of the States, but I will be embarking on a journey to London in December, and to that end, I have secured the contacts of potential SBs. One Japanese lady, 36, is asking for 500 pounds for 5-7 hours consisting of drinks and intimacy. She said that verbatim. [URL]https://members.seeking.com/member/9b3eac1e-1ba2-4464-966f-9a9893b48893[/URL].

My PPM is usually $400, but of course, I have done way more than that for the occasional unicorn.

My question is: is London that expensive, especially for a 36 year old, and what is the average PPM? I will post my reports after I come back in Jan 2025. Thank you all.[/QUOTE]Prices in much of England will be higher, not just London. Also prices in France tend to be higher too. Some of the worst countries in Europe to pickup women; especially England.

[QUOTE=Uncountable;2954077]Hello Gents,

I regularly post in the LA seeking thread at usasexguide, and it is customary to post links of seeking girls; however, I rarely see any links being posted here. Is it against the rules to do such? I have never used seeking outside of the States, but I will be embarking on a journey to London in December, and to that end, I have secured the contacts of potential SBs. One Japanese lady, 36, is asking for 500 pounds for 5-7 hours consisting of drinks and intimacy. She said that verbatim. [URL]https://members.seeking.com/member/9b3eac1e-1ba2-4464-966f-9a9893b48893[/URL].

My PPM is usually $400, but of course, I have done way more than that for the occasional unicorn.

My question is: is London that expensive, especially for a 36 year old, and what is the average PPM? I will post my reports after I come back in Jan 2025. Thank you all.[/QUOTE]Wow. I didn't know there was a Seeking thread on USAsexguide but I checked out a few pages of discussion. Looks like overpriced, overaged, overweight pros and warnings about who to avoid. Interesting. I guess the difference between that forum and the main contributors here has to do with girl type.

Because 99% of girls on Seeking are in fact scammers or not worth your time none of us would take the time to post about such things. It would just be too exhausting. We weed them out, avoid spending time beyond a message or two and try to find the gem. And once you find a gem on Seeking it becomes more a relationship thing albeit non traditional. So for me I would never pass around the Seeking girls I grow attached to. I did one time with another forum member and it felt really weird. Because the girls we seek are not pros. And most of us therefore don't want to treat them like pros. At least that's my perspective.

As to London yeah I think you will work pretty hard these days to find someone worthy at 400-500 . But as with all parts of the world if you put in time to find a Seeking gem there is absolutely nothing better. Closest thing to a no drama GF that the world has to offer. IMO.

[QUOTE=Laj505;2953630]Nice Place. Some of those girls have german genes. Price I found around 250 to 300 for entire day. For 3 day weekend its 700/800 max. But I would prefer changing girls everyday like I change clothes everyday.

Enjoy Buddy.[/QUOTE]Do very many of the girls in BA speak English? Thanks.

[QUOTE=Uncountable;2954077]Hello Gents,

I regularly post in the LA seeking thread at usasexguide, and it is customary to post links of seeking girls; however, I rarely see any links being posted here. Is it against the rules to do such? I have never used seeking outside of the States, but I will be embarking on a journey to London in December, and to that end, I have secured the contacts of potential SBs. One Japanese lady, 36, is asking for 500 pounds for 5-7 hours consisting of drinks and intimacy. She said that verbatim. [URL]https://members.seeking.com/member/9b3eac1e-1ba2-4464-966f-9a9893b48893[/URL].

My PPM is usually $400, but of course, I have done way more than that for the occasional unicorn.

My question is: is London that expensive, especially for a 36 year old, and what is the average PPM? I will post my reports after I come back in Jan 2025. Thank you all.[/QUOTE]I am also on the LA seeking section. It's easy to figure out who I am there.

I have done seeking in London twice. In my experience 500-600 pounds is the price point where nobody will say no unless they are basically high end call girls. Most normal girls will be totally happy with that. Last time in was there I had a 23 year old graphic designer, Russian, tiny little thing and she was totally fine with 500. Kept on messaging me nudes and stuff once I got back home, I think because I told her I come often (a lie) and she wanted to keep it all going.

[QUOTE=TooPicky2;2954231]Do very many of the girls in BA speak English? Thanks.[/QUOTE]Total crap shoot. But you can figure it out during your text interactions. Two of the three girls I have seen there had great English. But the last one (a last minute find) had ZERO. We actually had a great time. We just used Google translate but would actually SAY what the Google translate said. It was fucking hilarious for her to try to read the English out loud. She literally could not pronounce the English sounds. We both about died of laughter. So you can have a good time regardless.

Guys,

I wanted to talk about an emotion I experienced when I had my sugar baby, and that would be one of resentment, which is something I have never felt so much when dealing with tutes. I mean, with a tute we both know exactly what it's all about. It's essentially transactional, which is fine by me. But with a sugar baby, what exactly is it? I mean, it's certainly not purely transactional (at least it wasn't between me and my sugar baby). But at the same time, the relationship certainly has a transactional component to it. I mean, she's not there if you're not putting out the money. And, I'm not there if she's not putting out the pussy. So, I guess my relationship with my sugar baby was something in between being purely transactional and a "full" relationship.

But at times, I just found myself feeling resentful to feel like we were "dating", but then we really kind of weren't. So, why do I have to keep giving her money to fuck? I'd be thinking, "Hey, I want to travel here and there. I can put the money aside to pay for that, or I can give some of it to her making it harder for me to save how I want to. Fuck that! I'm not giving it to her"! And so, with time I would get together with her less and less. I'm sure that contributed to her decision to move. She knew she couldn't count on me to keep giving her money all the time. I don't blame her. I would have done the same thing! She moved. Got married. She's hot. Lots of (stupid) guys would wed her just for that alone. I've tried to analyze why having transactional relationships with tutes doesn't bother me, but it did with my sugar baby. Why should it be different?

Any of you guys have this same feeling? One of resentment towards sugar babies, but not towards outright tutes? I did, and I didn't expect it. It just kind of happened and surprised me. I'm wondering if that's true for some of the rest of you here as well. Anybody else experience this emotion?

I don't know you and don't want to judge but it sounds to me like you are bringing up two different issues.

1) Relationship fatigue.

2) Financial resentment.

1) Is natural in any relationship that starts off as quid pro quo, hell I had it toward every job I worked at before I became self employed. Not to mention the marginal SBs (those that I stopped seeing or let die out rather than them dumping me).

2) Sounds like you extend yourself maybe a little past your means to see her.

If you're done with her the answer is easy, if not, you need to make a hard choice about what you want vs what's best for you.

I've been hard dumped by two SBs that hurt, like a real relationship hurt. Tons of chemistry, we'd text daily and banter back and forth. Not once did I ever think about the money other than to make sure I had it before I saw her (never did venmo or the like, didn't want a trail so having cash is a bit of a chore).

I've seen maybe 3 or 4 that I just stopped contacting and they may have attempted a few times to get my attention but it eventually died without any formal closure. I never saw any of them regularly anyway so I'm guessing no feelings were hurt anyway.

I've been with my current SB for 1. 5 yrs. She's a total babe. Absolute doll, she could literally get anybody she wanted. I ask myself why she sees me weekly and I don't have a good answer. I don't particularly give her any more or less than any of the previous SBs, she drives a long way to see me in So Cal traffic, has a million things going on in her life but still makes time for me. There has to be a thousand guys between our houses that would happily give her what I give her. I feel the opposite of resent, I feel grateful and the feeling has gotten stronger with time. I'd like to think that I won't get hurt when it ends because I've got some experience to learn from but who the hell knows.

I guess if I started resenting a girl, that would be a signal that my mind is checking out on her and it's just a matter of time before I won't want to bang her.

[QUOTE=TheCane;2954356]Guys,

I wanted to talk about an emotion I experienced when I had my sugar baby, and that would be one of resentment, which is something I have never felt so much when dealing with tutes. I mean, with a tute we both know exactly what it's all about. It's essentially transactional, which is fine by me. But with a sugar baby, what exactly is it? I mean, it's certainly not purely transactional (at least it wasn't between me and my sugar baby). But at the same time, the relationship certainly has a transactional component to it. I mean, she's not there if you're not putting out the money. And, I'm not there if she's not putting out the pussy. So, I guess my relationship with my sugar baby was something in between being purely transactional and a "full" relationship.

But at times, I just found myself feeling resentful to feel like we were "dating", but then we really kind of weren't. So, why do I have to keep giving her money to fuck? I'd be thinking, "Hey, I want to travel here and there. I can put the money aside to pay for that, or I can give some of it to her making it harder for me to save how I want to. Fuck that! I'm not giving it to her"! And so, with time I would get together with her less and less. I'm sure that contributed to her decision to move. She knew she couldn't count on me to keep giving her money all the time. I don't blame her. I would have done the same thing! She moved. Got married. She's hot. Lots of (stupid) guys would wed her just for that alone. I've tried to analyze why having transactional relationships with tutes doesn't bother me, but it did with my sugar baby. Why should it be different?

Any of you guys have this same feeling? One of resentment towards sugar babies, but not towards outright tutes? I did, and I didn't expect it. It just kind of happened and surprised me. I'm wondering if that's true for some of the rest of you here as well. Anybody else experience this emotion?[/QUOTE]

Going to shoot you straight here. You are being unreasonable.

As a guy with 6500 posts you know the deal. A guy might like his job, like his boss, like his coworkers. But does that mean he's showing up if he doesn't get paid? No. That's part of the arrangement with a job.

I sometimes call out guys here for referring to their sugar babies as their girlfriends. Because the girl likes them, they have good times together, they both enjoy the sex. And I'm always the ahole who jumps in and says what needs to be said. If getting money is part of her being there, she's not your girlfriend. She might feel like one. And that's a wonderful illusion to indulge in. But it's a temporary illusion.

None of this is bad. Seeking is awesome. You get a rotating cast of younger women to indulge in, and all it takes is a little effort and some time. What a wonderful world this is. But live in this world. If you want a girlfriend, you can get a girlfriend. It just probably won't be a generational gap relationship that starts with paying her for dates. If we are being honest.

[QUOTE=TheCane;2954356]Guys,

I wanted to talk about an emotion I experienced when I had my sugar baby, and that would be one of resentment, which is something I have never felt so much when dealing with tutes. I mean, with a tute we both know exactly what it's all about. It's essentially transactional, which is fine by me. But with a sugar baby, what exactly is it? I mean, it's certainly not purely transactional (at least it wasn't between me and my sugar baby). But at the same time, the relationship certainly has a transactional component to it. I mean, she's not there if you're not putting out the money. And, I'm not there if she's not putting out the pussy. So, I guess my relationship with my sugar baby was something in between being purely transactional and a "full" relationship.

But at times, I just found myself feeling resentful to feel like we were "dating", but then we really kind of weren't. So, why do I have to keep giving her money to fuck? I'd be thinking, "Hey, I want to travel here and there. I can put the money aside to pay for that, or I can give some of it to her making it harder for me to save how I want to. Fuck that! I'm not giving it to her"! And so, with time I would get together with her less and less. I'm sure that contributed to her decision to move. She knew she couldn't count on me to keep giving her money all the time. I don't blame her. I would have done the same thing! She moved. Got married. She's hot. Lots of (stupid) guys would wed her just for that alone. I've tried to analyze why having transactional relationships with tutes doesn't bother me, but it did with my sugar baby. Why should it be different?

Any of you guys have this same feeling? One of resentment towards sugar babies, but not towards outright tutes? I did, and I didn't expect it. It just kind of happened and surprised me. I'm wondering if that's true for some of the rest of you here as well. Anybody else experience this emotion?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=TheCane;2954356]Guys,

I wanted to talk about an emotion I experienced when I had my sugar baby, and that would be one of resentment, which is something I have never felt so much when dealing with tutes. I mean, with a tute we both know exactly what it's all about. It's essentially transactional, which is fine by me. But with a sugar baby, what exactly is it? I mean, it's certainly not purely transactional (at least it wasn't between me and my sugar baby). But at the same time, the relationship certainly has a transactional component to it. I mean, she's not there if you're not putting out the money. And, I'm not there if she's not putting out the pussy. So, I guess my relationship with my sugar baby was something in between being purely transactional and a "full" relationship.

But at times, I just found myself feeling resentful to feel like we were "dating", but then we really kind of weren't. So, why do I have to keep giving her money to fuck? I'd be thinking, "Hey, I want to travel here and there. I can put the money aside to pay for that, or I can give some of it to her making it harder for me to save how I want to. Fuck that! I'm not giving it to her"! And so, with time I would get together with her less and less. I'm sure that contributed to her decision to move. She knew she couldn't count on me to keep giving her money all the time. I don't blame her. I would have done the same thing! She moved. Got married. She's hot. Lots of (stupid) guys would wed her just for that alone. I've tried to analyze why having transactional relationships with tutes doesn't bother me, but it did with my sugar baby. Why should it be different?

Any of you guys have this same feeling? One of resentment towards sugar babies, but not towards outright tutes? I did, and I didn't expect it. It just kind of happened and surprised me. I'm wondering if that's true for some of the rest of you here as well. Anybody else experience this emotion?[/QUOTE]You are spot on that SB is different from pure transactional sex and you def develop some feelings around it. But I do think the way you thought about it is a little odd / unhealthy. From my perspective an SB should be dating you because she enjoys being with you. But no hot 23 year old is going to naturally date an old man even if he's handsome and charismatic. So the $$ is to bridge the age gap. The $$ doesn't make her like you. But it does help her to justify dating someone she otherwise would never date.

So I end up looking at it as just the opposite. I am amazingly GRATEFUL they for a few hundred dollars I can date a girl that's 30 years younger than me that other guys can only dream of dating. Absolutely fucking grateful. 💯.

That said I think all of us resent the girls we don't a date that use pussy like a weapon to scam and charge ridiculous arrogant prices. But that's another thing. I've never felt anything but gratitude and affection for the girls I date on the regular.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2954537]You are spot on that SB is different from pure transactional sex and you def develop some feelings around it. But I do think the way you thought about it is a little odd / unhealthy.

So I end up looking at it as just the opposite. I am amazingly GRATEFUL they for a few hundred dollars I can date a girl that's 30 years younger than me that other guys can only dream of dating. Absolutely fucking grateful.[/QUOTE]I knew you would offer some helpful advice Steve. I agree that it's "odd / unhealthy". That's why I decided to ask about it as I go into this thing again. Like I said, I was surprised that I even had those feelings. Guess it would be best to just let those feelings go, and like you say, just enjoy the fact that I'm still out here fucking hot girls, whether they be tutes or a sugar baby. One thing that helps me to get those girls, besides the money, is that I don't look my age. People routinely guess 20 years younger! No smoking, no heavy drinking, exercise, weight control, eating better, and just plain genes!

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2954537]You are spot on that SB is different from pure transactional sex and you def develop some feelings around it. But I do think the way you thought about it is a little odd / unhealthy. From my perspective an SB should be dating you because she enjoys being with you. But no hot 23 year old is going to naturally date an old man even if he's handsome and charismatic. So the $$ is to bridge the age gap. The $$ doesn't make her like you. But it does help her to justify dating someone she otherwise would never date.

So I end up looking at it as just the opposite. I am amazingly GRATEFUL they for a few hundred dollars I can date a girl that's 30 years younger than me that other guys can only dream of dating. Absolutely fucking grateful. 💯.

That said I think all of us resent the girls we don't a date that use pussy like a weapon to scam and charge ridiculous arrogant prices. But that's another thing. I've never felt anything but gratitude and affection for the girls I date on the regular.[/QUOTE]This. Spot on. That's a good way of saying it.

Live in reality. But also recognize how special that reality is and appreciate it. It's a privileged life we lead that the kinds of girls who turn heads are regularly across the table from us and then under us, and all it takes is a little effort and some money. Appreciate how unique and truly special that is. I'm getting more quality puss now than I did when I was a hot 22 year old. With far less effort. I don't need them to be my girlfriend to appreciate that.

The recent exchange made me want to write this for the newer folks who are getting their bearings. These are the rules of the game. Or at lease they should be.

1. She is not your girlfriend. You might like each other and have great sex. But if you're paying, it's not a GF.

2 Always wear a condom. I know you like bareback. We all do. But by the time a girl is doing this, she's been around the block plenty.

3. don't believe her great story. She's as good a liar as you are. Maybe better. This is not her first time because she just didn't find the right guy till you came along.

4. Don't give money in advance. Ever.

5. Always end cordially. Even if she's an awful person who screws you. A woman's accusation, warranted or not, can make your life hell. Just pay the fine and move on.

6. Listen to your instincts. If you're getting bad vibes, listen to your intuition. There's a lot of crazy out there in this game. It doesn't attract women with zero issues.

There are prob more. But that's a good core.

[QUOTE=TheCane;2954356]Guys,

I wanted to talk about an emotion I experienced when I had my sugar baby, and that would be one of resentment, which is something I have never felt so much when dealing with tutes. I mean, with a tute we both know exactly what it's all about. It's essentially transactional, which is fine by me. But with a sugar baby, what exactly is it? I mean, it's certainly not purely transactional (at least it wasn't between me and my sugar baby). But at the same time, the relationship certainly has a transactional component to it. I mean, she's not there if you're not putting out the money. And, I'm not there if she's not putting out the pussy. So, I guess my relationship with my sugar baby was something in between being purely transactional and a "full" relationship.

But at times, I just found myself feeling resentful to feel like we were "dating", but then we really kind of weren't. So, why do I have to keep giving her money to fuck? I'd be thinking, "Hey, I want to travel here and there. I can put the money aside to pay for that, or I can give some of it to her making it harder for me to save how I want to. Fuck that! I'm not giving it to her"! And so, with time I would get together with her less and less. I'm sure that contributed to her decision to move. She knew she couldn't count on me to keep giving her money all the time. I don't blame her. I would have done the same thing! She moved. Got married. She's hot. Lots of (stupid) guys would wed her just for that alone. I've tried to analyze why having transactional relationships with tutes doesn't bother me, but it did with my sugar baby. Why should it be different?

Any of you guys have this same feeling? One of resentment towards sugar babies, but not towards outright tutes? I did, and I didn't expect it. It just kind of happened and surprised me. I'm wondering if that's true for some of the rest of you here as well. Anybody else experience this emotion?[/QUOTE]If you are married, just accept that the SB thing is the closest you are going to get to a GF and keep the illusion alive. She is a hooker you are friends with it and it is nothing more. You can play around with words like love and the like but you are not leaving your wife for her.

If you are single and you want the relationship to advance, consider talking about it because SBs look for the same thing in a SD that they do in a BF or husband. Just keep in mind that if you have been paying a SB and want her to be your GF you are going to have to only see her if you want to be her BF. So guys who think they are going to advance with a hottie and not offer that up are nuts.

In the USA, the concept of seeing a woman and not paying her never happened. It did happen a little in Mexico and a lot in Colombia. That is when the woman is interested in you from the get go and does not bring up price or in one case I had a woman give me what we agreed on back. That is the only instance you can meet a seeking woman and play the field.

If you say of the woman, another guy is a sucker for marrying her to get pussy, then that tells me you really were not that serious about her. When you really care about someone, you are not going to be rationing our the money, and if she cares about you, she is not going to be rationing out the pussy and time. In fact, the women will demand more of your time if you are their one and only, and you enjoy them for more than just sex.

Of late, SA has reached out to me twice with an opportunity to speak about SA experience in media. Apparently, if selected they'd pay me.

I wonder how may of us will take that up given our desire / need for discretion.

I won't as I have more to lose than gain from such non-anonymous experience shring.

Review overdue.

Recently got back on SA after a hiatus. Tried local. Tier 2 city.

As usual, conversion ratio was poor. May scammers and way too many platinum pussies.

Narrowed to two.

Met the first one for a M&G knowing fully well there was going to be no action. Nice coffee and chat. Conversation flowed well. We liked each other. Discussed specifics. Settled on 250 and exchanging test results.

A week later, we had our test results and planned an afternoon date.

Met for brunch. Not too expensive but not a dive in either. More chat, more chemistry.

Then, we grabbed some beer / wine and headed to my dayuse room. I checked in first and texted her the room number.

She walks in, we opened a drink but before I could take a sip, she pounces on me, pushes me on bed, and whispers "I have been waiting for this".

She proceeds to unbutton my shirt, kiss me all over and gently nibble my nipples. Continues kissing down and unzipped me. Before I knew, she had me in her mouth. Given I have gone sexless for nearly 6 months, it was phenomenal. Within seconds, she climbs on me, undressed herself and took me on cowgirl. Quite a ride and within minutes I was nearly there. Pulled out forcefully and shot my load all the up her chin and falling back on my tummy. Sweet one, she cleaned me up and goes "I wanted to taste it. You shot soon". I explained her why I came early (6 months) while continuing the drink.

We chatted but about 15 minutes later, she was lying naked on her tummy. This time, I climbed on her from behind and slid inside. Epic fucking in this position for nearly 15 minutes. Then, swapped to Mish. Another 10 minutes. We stopped for rest and went doggie. She wanted to ride again and told me to warn her early. She rode me for a good 10 minutes and grew tired. I suggested finishing me blowjob. She gladly obliged. Sucked me balls and shaft for a good 10 minutes before I shot a load in her. She swallowed.

She went "I had been dreaming how you would taste ever since we met at the coffee place. You taste good".

She was concerned when I came quick first round but after the second she now thinks I'm the perfect long laster for her.

We are meeting again this week.

But before that, I have my meet and greet with the other girl today.

[QUOTE=Gfefan;2954859]Of late, SA has reached out to me twice with an opportunity to speak about SA experience in media. Apparently, if selected they'd pay me.

I wonder how may of us will take that up given our desire / need for discretion.

I won't as I have more to lose than gain from such non-anonymous experience shring.[/QUOTE]You are going to be talked into giving the story they want to put out.

There was the Vice show on seeking. The reporter kissed Brandon Wade's ass. Then some woman is thanking guys for giving her thousands every month and she is hot but claims to not have sex. They cut to two huge women in Las Vegas who have a dozen sugar daddies and are getting paid tens of thousands per month. They are having sex and are being physically abused. Of course, we do not see that on camera.

Reporter gets on the site and she does a video call. A guy asks her to stand up to look at her body and then does not pay her or see her. She says that she is so humiliated. OMG. A woman got rejected. Gee, I wonder what that feels like. Finally, she goes on a date and gets paid but without having sex. The ending is cliched. The reporter is going to go back to regular dating.

I am not sure what the point of the story was. If you are anti-sugaring, I wonder why you let Brandon Wade have a soap box. I wondered if he paid the reporter. Was the point of the story fat women don't bother with seeking but we want the hotties, and hot women are not having sex?

I had used the site for a decade and there was nothing in it that I recall having done. The only realistic part was the grateful female.

[QUOTE=TheCane;2954356]Guys,

I wanted to talk about an emotion I experienced when I had my sugar baby, and that would be one of resentment, which is something I have never felt so much when dealing with tutes. I mean, with a tute we both know exactly what it's all about. It's essentially transactional, which is fine by me. But with a sugar baby, what exactly is it? I mean, it's certainly not purely transactional (at least it wasn't between me and my sugar baby). But at the same time, the relationship certainly has a transactional component to it. I mean, she's not there if you're not putting out the money. And, I'm not there if she's not putting out the pussy. So, I guess my relationship with my sugar baby was something in between being purely transactional and a "full" relationship.

But at times, I just found myself feeling resentful to feel like we were "dating", but then we really kind of weren't. So, why do I have to keep giving her money to fuck? I'd be thinking, "Hey, I want to travel here and there. I can put the money aside to pay for that, or I can give some of it to her making it harder for me to save how I want to. Fuck that! I'm not giving it to her"! And so, with time I would get together with her less and less. I'm sure that contributed to her decision to move. She knew she couldn't count on me to keep giving her money all the time. I don't blame her. I would have done the same thing! She moved. Got married. She's hot. Lots of (stupid) guys would wed her just for that alone. I've tried to analyze why having transactional relationships with tutes doesn't bother me, but it did with my sugar baby. Why should it be different?

Any of you guys have this same feeling? One of resentment towards sugar babies, but not towards outright tutes? I did, and I didn't expect it. It just kind of happened and surprised me. I'm wondering if that's true for some of the rest of you here as well. Anybody else experience this emotion?[/QUOTE]All romantic relationships eventually lead to sex. Even if one partner is a hardcore fanatical catholic who thinks they will burn in hell if they have sex before marriage. It may takes multiple years for that relationship to lead to sex, but it eventually will if they stay together long enough to get married. The only exception to this outright is if at least one party has a physical lesion that deters sex, such as having the prostate removed, low testosterone, vaginitis, etc. Or possibly some other averting psychological factor, such as past sexual trauma. Have we established this as a fact yet? Okay, that's fact 1.

If you believe in fact 1, then you must also believe that any woman who wants to know specifics about a man's income or assets as a determining factor as to whether she will date him, is therefore actually in fact, a prostitute. Because if the woman had the ability to stand on her own two feet financially, then the ONLY thing at all she would be concerned about is whether or not he is gainfully employed. Is he covering all the expenses to support his own lifestyle? If he's living in his mom's basement, and the only thing he pays for is his food, then the answer to that is clearly no, when his mom is paying for his car insurance, cell phone bill, medical expenses, and pretty much everything else other than his frozen pizzas.

But, if a man is paying entirely for his 600 square foot studio apartment in the ghetto, then he is no less gainfully employed that the other man who is paying for an 8,000 square foot estate in hills of New Hampshire.

There is no argument against this. If a woman is looking for a man who has a higher than average salary, that means she wants to benefit from his money. She would not be taking his salary into account because she she wants to know how much of it he will donate to charity. No, ONLY reason she wants to know how much money he has is because she wants access to that money. And if we go back to fact 1, we know the relationship eventually at some point will lead to sex. I don't know if this is the Merriam Webster's definition of "prostitution" if you were to look in their dictionary, but this is the real definition of prostitution.

Now, you could cite other factors that are indirectly related to money. For instance, if you look at the example above. Maybe the woman does not feel comfortable staying overnight in the 600 sq foot apartment because the ghetto is typically a high crime area. Or maybe she does not want her children going to school in the hood. So maybe if the guy living in the 600 sq foot apartment made more money, he could move to a safer area. But that's not what the prostitute wants to know. She might want to know what neighborhood he lives in, and how safe it is. But she also wants to know about his finances; that's what makes her a prostitute.

The reason very few people want to accept this is because of the stigmatization of prostitution in general. That and the fact that many women either don't feel financially stable, or are willing to trade sex for a more luxurious lifestyle. Even if it's through years of waiting until marriage.

Bottom line for me: I see very little difference between a prostitute, sugar baby, and many other women who don't advertise on prostitution websites, work in brothels, or stand on street corners. Not in regards to the underlying motive (money), and the means to achieve it (primarily sex). The difference between women on eHarmony and Eros is that the ones on eHarmony want a lot of other stuff from the men to go with the money, whereas the ones on Eros are less discriminating, and mainly just looking for the money.

So to answer your question, I wouldn't be any more resentful of a woman I met at a dance studio, than I would be from a woman I met off of Slixa. Nobody likes being manipulated or screwed off. A formal prostitute is not only paid for sex, but paid to make you feel good. She is an actress who is either authentically enjoying her time with you, or pretending to do so, one or the other. If the prostitute enters the bedroom with a bad attitude, lays down on the bed, and goes "Okay, let's get this over with!! You've got exactly 60 minutes, not a second more! I'm not going to feel any less resentful than the girl I meet at the dance studio who stands me up for a coffee date we scheduled. Either way it's an unpleasant experience. The prostitute can choose to put effort into her job, and the coffee date can choose to be decent and respectful. That's my 2 cents.

[QUOTE=Gfefan;2954859]Of late, SA has reached out to me twice with an opportunity to speak about SA experience in media. Apparently, if selected they'd pay me.

I wonder how may of us will take that up given our desire / need for discretion.

I won't as I have more to lose than gain from such non-anonymous experience shring.[/QUOTE]Hmmm, that depends. Can I wear a mask and use a pseudonym for the media appearance? How much are they offering?

[QUOTE=Gfefan;2954859]Of late, SA has reached out to me twice with an opportunity to speak about SA experience in media. Apparently, if selected they'd pay me.

I wonder how may of us will take that up given our desire / need for discretion.

I won't as I have more to lose than gain from such non-anonymous experience shring.[/QUOTE]Yeah I got that. Also invitation to be in focus group a few weeks ago.

Zero chance.

Maybe some guys are out and proud with this sugar thing. For me it's under wraps. I'm not going to take some nominal amount of money to have my identity potentially undermined.

[QUOTE=Gfefan;2954859]Of late, SA has reached out to me twice with an opportunity to speak about SA experience in media. Apparently, if selected they'd pay me.

I wonder how may of us will take that up given our desire / need for discretion.

I won't as I have more to lose than gain from such non-anonymous experience shring.[/QUOTE]Hell no, that is a definite accident waiting to happen. I do not really care about my identity, only when it comes to work, but nevertheless I would never give any unnecessary information about myself. . I do not even use Social Media, nobody needs to know what I do on my off time.

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2954560]The recent exchange made me want to write this for the newer folks who are getting their bearings. These are the rules of the game. Or at lease they should be.

1. She is not your girlfriend. You might like each other and have great sex. But if you're paying, it's not a GF.

2 Always wear a condom. I know you like bareback. We all do. But by the time a girl is doing this, she's been around the block plenty.

3. don't believe her great story. She's as good a liar as you are. Maybe better. This is not her first time because she just didn't find the right guy till you came along.

4. Don't give money in advance. Ever.

5. Always end cordially. Even if she's an awful person who screws you. A woman's accusation, warranted or not, can make your life hell. Just pay the fine and move on.

6. Listen to your instincts. If you're getting bad vibes, listen to your intuition. There's a lot of crazy out there in this game. It doesn't attract women with zero issues.

There are prob more. But that's a good core.[/QUOTE]Def a pretty good list but I might add some color on a few.

On the GF thing. No she is not your GF. And that's a good thing! Because GFs are trying to figure out if you are THE ONE and lock you down. And that leads to lots of unfortunate drama. So count your lucky stars she's not your GF. But neither is she a pro or a working girl (I suppose some are but not the ones most of us gravitate to). And the "she takes money for sex" argument is soooo lame. Its my opinion that nearly every woman married to a successful man is indirectly taking money for sexual and we don't call them pros and hos. So let's stop denigrating the hot young women in our lives! Plus if you treat her like a ho she will act like one and if you treat her like a GF she will reciprocate. That is my experience. Ymmv.

On the condom thing I would never lobby other guys to do bareback. But I will point of the odds of getting HIV from vaginal sex are 10,000:4. And that is IF the girl is infected. Then you have the odds that the girl you chose has HIV. Even at 100:1 we are now talking nearly a one in a million chance of getting it. Just sayin.

On the always end cordially I totally agree. But even better is never end it. Just let things fade out. You never know when you might want her back. So I never explicitly end things. Heck just yesterday an SB from 4 years ago texted me what's up. And I'm sure we could fuck if I wasn't already juggling. So def let it fade rather than an explicit ending.

Happy hunting!

[QUOTE=Gfefan;2954866]Review overdue.

Recently got back on SA after a hiatus. Tried local. Tier 2 city.

As usual, conversion ratio was poor. May scammers and way too many platinum pussies.

Narrowed to two.

Met the first one for a M&G knowing fully well there was going to be no action. Nice coffee and chat. Conversation flowed well. We liked each other. Discussed specifics. Settled on 250 and exchanging test results.

A week later, we had our test results and planned an afternoon date.

Met for brunch. Not too expensive but not a dive in either. More chat, more chemistry.

Then, we grabbed some beer / wine and headed to my dayuse room. I checked in first and texted her the room number.

She walks in, we opened a drink but before I could take a sip, she pounces on me, pushes me on bed, and whispers "I have been waiting for this".

She proceeds to unbutton my shirt, kiss me all over and gently nibble my nipples. Continues kissing down and unzipped me. Before I knew, she had me in her mouth. Given I have gone sexless for nearly 6 months, it was phenomenal. Within seconds, she climbs on me, undressed herself and took me on cowgirl. Quite a ride and within minutes I was nearly there. Pulled out forcefully and shot my load all the up her chin and falling back on my tummy. Sweet one, she cleaned me up and goes "I wanted to taste it. You shot soon". I explained her why I came early (6 months) while continuing the drink.

We chatted but about 15 minutes later, she was lying naked on her tummy. This time, I climbed on her from behind and slid inside. Epic fucking in this position for nearly 15 minutes. Then, swapped to Mish. Another 10 minutes. We stopped for rest and went doggie. She wanted to ride again and told me to warn her early. She rode me for a good 10 minutes and grew tired. I suggested finishing me blowjob. She gladly obliged. Sucked me balls and shaft for a good 10 minutes before I shot a load in her. She swallowed.

She went "I had been dreaming how you would taste ever since we met at the coffee place. You taste good".

She was concerned when I came quick first round but after the second she now thinks I'm the perfect long laster for her.

We are meeting again this week.

But before that, I have my meet and greet with the other girl today.[/QUOTE]Absolutely love this story. This is why we do Seeking. More of this fellas!! Keep it coming.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2955099] And the "she takes money for sex" argument is soooo lame. Its my opinion that nearly every woman married to a successful man is indirectly taking money for sexual and we don't call them pros and hos. So let's stop denigrating the hot young women in our lives! Plus if you treat her like a ho she will act like one and if you treat her like a GF she will reciprocate. That is my experience. Ymmv.
[/QUOTE]I don't really consider it denigrating anyone. It's merely a fact. But suppose it were denigrating, then by the opposite side of the coin, it would have to be that all men pay women for sex. So we're all losers that can't get real love. :D

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2955099]Def a pretty good list but I might add some color on a few.

On the GF thing. No she is not your GF. And that's a good thing! Because GFs are trying to figure out if you are THE ONE and lock you down. And that leads to lots of unfortunate drama. So count your lucky stars she's not your GF. But neither is she a pro or a working girl (I suppose some are but not the ones most of us gravitate to). And the "she takes money for sex" argument is soooo lame. Its my opinion that nearly every woman married to a successful man is indirectly taking money for sexual and we don't call them pros and hos. So let's stop denigrating the hot young women in our lives! Plus if you treat her like a ho she will act like one and if you treat her like a GF she will reciprocate. That is my experience. Ymmv.

On the condom thing I would never lobby other guys to do bareback. But I will point of the odds of getting HIV from vaginal sex are 10,000:4. And that is IF the girl is infected. Then you have the odds that the girl you chose has HIV. Even at 100:1 we are now talking nearly a one in a million chance of getting it. Just sayin.

On the always end cordially I totally agree. But even better is never end it. Just let things fade out. You never know when you might want her back. So I never explicitly end things. Heck just yesterday an SB from 4 years ago texted me what's up. And I'm sure we could fuck if I wasn't already juggling. So def let it fade rather than an explicit ending.

Happy hunting![/QUOTE]For the sake of conversation and not debate let me respond to 2 things.

I've always disagreed with the notion that at some level all women with successful me. Are in it for money, even if during marriage, so all such women are prostitutes on some level. It's a reductionist belief. A man's bank account is part of his package, no doubt. But within the social circle of educated people in highly powered careers (law, consulting, finance, etc) everyone is more or less guaranteed a certain minimum standard of living. The hot law associate wasn't about to marry the waiter or police officer anyway, or it seldom happens. Among the set of people who have enough money to do Seeking, they prob are not in social circles where their paycheck is their leading quality.

Regarding condoms, I'm not worried about HIV. I know that's rare. I'm worried about the lifelong incurable stuff that doesn't kill you and is incredibly common.

To me, love and sex are two different things. Yes, there is overlap between the two and some of us are lucky to be in that overlap.

When it comes to sex, I seek variety. And, that's what I pay for.

When it comes to love, I don't seek variety. That's what I marry for.

[QUOTE=Kazeu;2955105]I don't really consider it denigrating anyone. It's merely a fact. But suppose it were denigrating, then by the opposite side of the coin, it would have to be that all men pay women for sex. So we're all losers that can't get real love. :D[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Kazeu;2955105]I don't really consider it denigrating anyone. It's merely a fact. But suppose it were denigrating, then by the opposite side of the coin, it would have to be that all men pay women for sex. So we're all losers that can't get real love. :D[/QUOTE]Miami Boy talked about a hooker who was not comfortable taking money from him. So she made the choice to go from hooker to someone he dated / a GF. He was cool with it. I had a woman tell me she loved me and tried to give $300 back, but I did not want her love / her as a GF so I made her take it.

With all the beauties I had in the USA, I bet over half would have been a GF had I asked them, but I did not want to. For the most part, I wanted sex and a little bit of company and that is it. When you flip from SB / hooker to GF / s. O. , the women change their time perspective. They go from restricting time to almost giving you too much. You are going to hear every little detail of their life so you better like that person if you go GF with her.

I thought "paying for it" was cheaper time wise and emotionally with most women. Do you remember when we were out and you had a GF reading you the riot act? I think you dumped her shortly after that, but you were paying for it even if it was not with money.

So the three home girls situation has sorted itself out. After two years of struggling and settling for fatties, then two years of bliss with Shayla my mistress, I found myself suddenly with three pretty good options:

Hood Girl - from the hood for sure. Super shy. Super appreciative of the smallest kindness. Submissive and moderately pretty. OK BJ but willing to be coached up.

Nerdy Girl - talkative nerdy girl with glasses and all. Actually quite good in bed but only sorta attracted to her.

Fuck Bunny - super pretty girl who fucks great but little kissing or BJ and not willing to step up her game much.

It was hard to not like spending time with Fuck Bunny because she's so pretty and we laugh a lot at dinner. But room time sorta Meh and rushed sometimes. And I quickly found on date 2 that Hood Girl takes direction well moving her BJ up from. 5 to an 8 in just one session. So Nerdy Girl quickly took a back seat. I told her I was really busy and couldn't meet for a while and she read it and didn't respond. One down!

Hood Girl moved quickly to the front of the pack with two key events. First after our third session she said she was struggling a bit and her mom was coming to visit and could I give her a bit more just this once. Well she was so sweet and embarrassed to ask I said sure I'll give you 500 instead of the usual 350. She said. Damn I was just going to ask for $25! Wow. $25. She's the real deal girl from the hood and 25 makes a difference. Just wow.

And second on our fourth date she says she's been starting her period but she can make me happy. No fucking lie! She gives me a SPECTACULAR 20 minute BJ to CIM swallow using every trick I showed her and then some! I mean epic. And I say thanks and she says "No. Thank you! I really enjoyed that!" What a keeper.

So then I'm still trying to juggle Fuck Bunny because I do like her. But she wants to meetup at least once a week at 400 and gets really exasperated when I can't do that. We get into it a little bit and frankly she's being a bit of a biatch and long story short we agree to step away.

So now I am all in on Hood Girl, who has a nice bod, very submissive and grateful. who gives a great BJ and is thrilled to be with me. What's not to like? Seeking still rules.

(PS These three were all Seeking girls I met in the last three months in my second tier city. So Seeking still delivers despite the scams. )

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2955949] ...could I give her a bit more just this once. Well she was so sweet and embarrassed to ask I said sure I'll give you 500 instead of the usual 350. She said. Damn I was just going to ask for $25! Wow. $25. She's the real deal girl from the hood and 25 makes a difference. Just wow.

[/QUOTE]Sadly I have witnessed the present internet "arrangement" girls are all asking for $500 a session, now. Before Covid they were asking $350.

My hood girl is still getting $200 a session after 3 years and still texts me, to see me. My slim blonde, former professional pole dancer / stipper still is getting $200 a session after 5 years, and we generally get together once a week. They have each gotten older over the past 3 and 5 years, respectively, and have not brought any new effort to the table, so their value has not increased.

Unfortunately throwing out such large $150 raises, for no increased value, is ruining it for all of us, Steve.

Hi all!

Long-term lurker here on the forum, and thought it would be time to give back a little bit.

I'm M30, and started on seeking autumn 2020, and I'm based out of one of the Nordic countries.

Nordics and Baltics is a place that is often overlooked, and I find it to be a little gem. Been using it to have fun weekends. Booking a spa hotel, having some nice dinner, and a lot of fun in bed.

What I've noticed so far is that the market is there, but it is not that many super Nordic girls. Instead there's a lot of exchange students, aupairs, and people that recently moved with their families for other reasons. The Nordic girls often want about 500 for a few hours. However, there are lot of gems, that are happy to either just getting a weekend away, or with a weekend contribution of about 200 in addition to the weekend away.

Here's my current list of meets in the region.

Age. Nationality. Meet location.

21 - Polish (Sweden).

25 - Swedish (Sweden).

20 - Colombian (Sweden).

25 - Peruvian (Sweden).

26 - Brazilian (Sweden).

21 - Romanian (Sweden).

30 - Indonesian (Hungary).

20 - Thai / Swedish (Sweden).

22 - Filipina / Norwegian (Sweden).

19 - Estonian (Estonia).

19 - Irish (Sweden).

22 - Brazilian (Sweden).

The last was was a Brazilian au-pair. She asked me to take her out to Sushi, and then we went home and just f*cked all night, before I drove her home. Now she is asking me to re-do it, but rather wish to have an other au-pair friend join her next time, as she mentioned she want to explore more, and never had a threesome. Sometimes you just know when you found a gem.

Any other Nordic hunters here? What is your take on this, in my opinion, underrated region?

The girl needs help, he helped her. How that impacts you or anybody else in any meaningful way [blue][Deleted by Admin][/blue] Frankly, I would have given her more so she wouldn't have to embarrass herself and ask again in a week. It's obvious she's a keeper from everything he's written and she's proven to him that she's an SB not a prostitute. Negative comments like this serve no value.

[QUOTE=HumbleHal;2955966]Unfortunately throwing out such large $150 raises, for no increased value, is ruining it for all of us, Steve.[/QUOTE]

I spent a month before my trip getting names and WA numbers. This is my first time here. I've only been with 2 women. They both accepted 100 usd. Many have asked for $200 - 300, which for South America not willing to pay.

The first one I met named julie is thirty one and does everything I want including anal.

The second one I met was twenty one and did BBFS.

Went to an online provider she was 18 $150 and was BBFS.

Hope this helps.

[QUOTE=Jbj64;2956094]I spent a month before my trip getting names and WA numbers. This is my first time here. I've only been with 2 women. They both accepted 100 usd. Many have asked for $200 - 300, which for South America not willing to pay.

The first one I met named julie is thirty one and does everything I want including anal.

The second one I met was twenty one and did BBFS.

Went to an online provider she was 18 $150 and was BBFS.

Hope this helps.[/QUOTE]Yes, BBFS is pretty common on sugar sites. I've been on Seeking and SugardaddyMeet for a few years and only had 2 or 3 girls who were dead set against BBFS even after a second meetup.

[QUOTE=Bromigo;2956029]Hi all!

Long-term lurker here on the forum, and thought it would be time to give back a little bit.

I'm M30, and started on seeking autumn 2020, and I'm based out of one of the Nordic countries.

Nordics and Baltics is a place that is often overlooked, and I find it to be a little gem. Been using it to have fun weekends. Booking a spa hotel, having some nice dinner, and a lot of fun in bed.

What I've noticed so far is that the market is there, but it is not that many super Nordic girls. Instead there's a lot of exchange students, aupairs, and people that recently moved with their families for other reasons. The Nordic girls often want about 500 for a few hours. However, there are lot of gems, that are happy to either just getting a weekend away, or with a weekend contribution of about 200 in addition to the weekend away..[/QUOTE]Thanks for this, yes I definitely don't hear much about this part of the world. I think for some of us, the term "nordic model" (ie the purchase of sex is illegal, but being a hooker is legal) comes to mind so it's overlooked. Glad to hear the your have good luck over there. What platforms are you using mostly? Seeking / SDM something else?

[QUOTE=HumbleHal;2939019]Having been banned from [url=https://seeking.com/]SA[/url] after several years, I have been on [url=https://www.sugardaddymeet.com/]SDM[/url] which is about the same. I was banned on Seeking for discussing the $$ of PPM in response to a woman's question, and she reported me. However, you can discuss PPM on the SDM site without being banned. The problem is that Craigslist banned prostitutes several years ago, so now the scammers and hookers are on Seeking and SDM. Unless you want that activity you need to weed them out.

I have always found the women I want to be with by requiring a meeting in a restaurant. I do not discuss monthly allowance or amount of PPM until I meet in a restaurant. They I get prepared for an argument, like they want to be on the same page before they waste their time. These women are not interested in anything but money, so I say "bye. " I try to find out about their last arrangement and do the same, pay the same amount and usually they will tell me the amount. I do not make an offer until the end of dinner, and only if I genuinely like the woman. I am not interested in overweight, nor bossy ***** es. And I do not try to have sex with them that same meetup night for 2 reasons: first I want no pressure and want to give them time to decide if they genuinely like me and I really like them. Secondly, I am too tired from having sex with the roster I have of 5-6 women I am already having arrangements with, unknown to them. I have 2 who are happy with $200 a meeting and I have been seeing one for 5 years now, the other for 2. Recently I have increased my PPM to 400-500 for a weekly meeting with bedroom time, and have found this to be more appropriate for the top teer women, and they are more affectionate knowing they will be better taken care of.[/QUOTE]Yes, I think once you've been banned from Seeking you have basically get a new email / credit card payment and they might still try and track you by address. I honestly don't know why they are so bent on driving away customers, but I guess it's about being really worried they'll be targeted like Backpage was a few years ago. Personally I have accounts on both, but I prefer [URL]sugardaddymeet.com[/URL] too becasue of the same reasons: cost and not having to worry they're going to ban me becasue one of the girls complains about me or I say something that sounds too much like an offer for PPM. The good thing is, once you get them off the Seeking, most seem to prefer PPM. I, too, started off with $220 per meeting, but it seems like $3-400 is now the starting point.

I like the restaurant idea and yes that what I try with someone new as well to get an idea what they are like, that way you have an out if she doesn't give a good vibe. I think when I first started using Seeking about 8 years ago I clearly missed a lot of the signs when things were going to go south. Thanks for this, this is good advice.

[QUOTE=BerolLoz;2956130]Yes, BBFS is pretty common on sugar sites. I've been on Seeking and SugardaddyMeet for a few years and only had 2 or 3 girls who were dead set against BBFS even after a second meetup.[/QUOTE]The one and only sugaring arrangement I ever had was BBFS with cum inside (her tubes were tied). And that was at $250 per meet in a Tier 1 city. Was a steal of a deal with a real hottie!

[QUOTE=Vendelo;2943101]When using Seeking, I message back and forth and wait for the girl to ask about what I am proposing. I always reply: with intimacy or not? That sets the expectation that there will or will not be sex.[/QUOTE]Honestly, this is one reason I prefer SDM over Seeking; you don't have to worry too much about talking about sex or mentioning compensation. Though I think these days girls know what these sites are about, when you say "spend time with", they usually assume that it involves sex. The girls who tend to be looking for non-sexual meetings put something in their profile or mention it when messaging.

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2954560]The recent exchange made me want to write this for the newer folks who are getting their bearings. These are the rules of the game. Or at lease they should be.

1. She is not your girlfriend. You might like each other and have great sex. But if you're paying, it's not a GF.

2 Always wear a condom. I know you like bareback. We all do. But by the time a girl is doing this, she's been around the block plenty.

3. don't believe her great story. She's as good a liar as you are. Maybe better. This is not her first time because she just didn't find the right guy till you came along.

4. Don't give money in advance. Ever.

5. Always end cordially. Even if she's an awful person who screws you. A woman's accusation, warranted or not, can make your life hell. Just pay the fine and move on.

6. Listen to your instincts. If you're getting bad vibes, listen to your intuition. There's a lot of crazy out there in this game. It doesn't attract women with zero issues.

There are prob more. But that's a good core.[/QUOTE]Good advice here, especially number 6, for Seeking / SDM or any other sugar site too.

I'm calling it here. I work in strategy and I know the signs.

Seeking has been asking people to participate in focus groups. They have also been asking people if they want to be featured in news coverage about the site. And lately promo codes aren't working as much (none are active as this minute).

They almost certainly have a marketing consultant or inside team working on optimization. I know because I actually do this for a living.

Things will change. These things are usually done poorly because there are a lot of hucksters in the strategy game. It's hard to tell unless you're good at it but there are a lot of simpletons who deploy nonsensical aphorisms and simple fixes and they often go badly.

But I'm seeing the signs. It's coming.

[QUOTE=BerolLoz;2956163]Good advice here, especially number 6, for Seeking / SDM or any other sugar site too.[/QUOTE]I'm adding one.

7. Fish where the fish are. Use the site where there are plenty of options and you'll do well. If you use the site where it's not popular you're basically hiring an escort because those are the only girls on there.

Empty your inbox please.

[QUOTE=HumbleHal;2955966]Sadly I have witnessed the present internet "arrangement" girls are all asking for $500 a session, now. Before Covid they were asking $350.

My hood girl is still getting $200 a session after 3 years and still texts me, to see me. My slim blonde, former professional pole dancer / stripper still is getting $200 a session after 5 years, and we generally get together once a week. They have each gotten older over the past 3 and 5 years, respectively, and have not brought any new effort to the table, so their value has not increased.

Unfortunately throwing out such large $150 raises, for no increased value, is ruining it for all of us, Steve.[/QUOTE]I agree with Humble Hal. Things have gotten ridiculous with women trying to ask for and get more $$$ now. One told me she wanted $1,000 per meetup. Another $700. I quickly say, "You must be on another planet!" and discontinue. Its all about supply and demand. The women need to know that they are replaceable if they ask too much or perform too little. Some of you guys just throw money around, for no reason. Maybe you are incredibly rich and inherited your money and did not have to work for it! It still represents alot of work to give $150 to a girl who would accept $25. It shows stupidity.

1. Steve should have asked her "how much do you NEED"? Instead of just throwing money $500 at her like he is Richie Rich, Santa Claus, unless he has money to throw away. All girls WANT $$ The real question is how much do they NEED, and that is after they have a JOB and work. I ask how much do they earn at their regular job first. I am only a supplement, not they main provider for them. They also need to be kept dependent on your arrangement, so they will come back each week if you want them to. I don't want to get involved with hookers that have no real job, make their total living on their back, have multiple guys and all they do is roam around spreading herpes, STDs and other VD. I want a clean, exclusive employed woman, that only I can fuck and who has her own regular job and income. My gift should only be to supplement their normal job's income.

2. Steve should then have said, "Are you willing to do Anal or something new and perverted with me for the extra money?" Whenever I get a woman that wants more money I tell her I am on social security, may need help with my rent sometime, and may be able to give them more money if they perform above and beyond what they are now doing, but they need to understand that they need to perform more if they want to be paid more. When I mention "Anal sex" they usually shut up and are happy with what I have been giving them.

IT sounds like Steve has an unlimited amount of money and needs to learn how to negotiate with his women. I know some of you defend him all the time, but this is the truth. We all make mistakes and I cannot go along with his advice to just throw $150 at them when, if he would slow down and ask what they NEED he could have saved alot of money in the long run with this regular girl. We all are here to learn from eachother, so please take my advice next time. Thank you gentlemen.

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2956237]Empty your inbox please.[/QUOTE]Done and done.

Easily the most bass ackward, misogynistic comment I've ever read here. Thank you.

[QUOTE=NeilGeorge;2956253]I agree with Humble Hal. Things have gotten ridiculous with women trying to ask for and get more $$$ now. One told me she wanted $1,000 per meetup. Another $700. I quickly say, "You must be on another planet!" and discontinue. Its all about supply and demand. The women need to know that they are replaceable if they ask too much or perform too little. Some of you guys just throw money around, for no reason. Maybe you are incredibly rich and inherited your money and did not have to work for it! It still represents alot of work to give $150 to a girl who would accept $25. It shows stupidity.

1. Steve should have asked her "how much do you NEED"? Instead of just throwing money $500 at her like he is Richie Rich, Santa Claus, unless he has money to throw away. All girls WANT $$ The real question is how much do they NEED, and that is after they have a JOB and work. I ask how much do they earn at their regular job first. I am only a supplement, not they main provider for them. They also need to be kept dependent on your arrangement, so they will come back each week if you want them to. I don't want to get involved with hookers that have no real job, make their total living on their back, have multiple guys and all they do is roam around spreading herpes, STDs and other VD. I want a clean, exclusive employed woman, that only I can fuck and who has her own regular job and income. My gift should only be to supplement their normal job's income.

2. Steve should then have said, "Are you willing to do Anal or something new and perverted with me for the extra money?" Whenever I get a woman that wants more money I tell her I am on social security, may need help with my rent sometime, and may be able to give them more money if they perform above and beyond what they are now doing, but they need to understand that they need to perform more if they want to be paid more. When I mention "Anal sex" they usually shut up and are happy with what I have been giving them.

IT sounds like Steve has an unlimited amount of money and needs to learn how to negotiate with his women. I know some of you defend him all the time, but this is the truth. We all make mistakes and I cannot go along with his advice to just throw $150 at them when, if he would slow down and ask what they NEED he could have saved alot of money in the long run with this regular girl. We all are here to learn from eachother, so please take my advice next time. Thank you gentlemen.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2956378]Easily the most bass ackward, misogynistic comment I've ever read here. Thank you.[/QUOTE]I thought it was quite educational, actually.

The same way that the FKK guys spent years complaining about the price increase from 50 to 100 or 150 euros and trying to convince others to only offer 50 euros.

If you are in your 50's or 60's and want to continue doing this until you die, either don't retire, or at least work part time.

There was a an old guy at a party once who had a sign that said Will Work For Sex. Everyone thought it was a play on those bums with Will Work for Food signs. Now I realize he might have been a John.

[QUOTE=Mongerer88;2956448]If you are in your 50's or 60's and want to continue doing this until you die, either don't retire, or at least work part time.[/QUOTE]Or have an outstanding retirement income hahaha!

So you're comparing an FKK to sugaring. There's your problem. And you assume a pensioner can't afford some arbitrary amount. You two aren't learning anything from the experienced posters here. If the op really thinks he's going to have a relationship above and beyond anything transactional he needs to start by not demeaning a girl whom very humbly asks for his help. There are a million and one ways to get laid on this planet for money and if you (or he) are worried about money seeking doesn't break the top twenty of them.

[QUOTE=Mongerer88;2956448]I thought it was quite educational, actually.

The same way that the FKK guys spent years complaining about the price increase from 50 to 100 or 150 euros and trying to convince others to only offer 50 euros.

If you are in your 50's or 60's and want to continue doing this until you die, either don't retire, or at least work part time.

There was a an old guy at a party once who had a sign that said Will Work For Sex. Everyone thought it was a play on those bums with Will Work for Food signs. Now I realize he might have been a John.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2956478]So you're comparing an FKK to sugaring. There's your problem. And you assume a pensioner can't afford some arbitrary amount. You two aren't learning anything from the experienced posters here. If the op really thinks he's going to have a relationship above and beyond anything transactional he needs to start by not demeaning a girl whom very humbly asks for his help. There are a million and one ways to get laid on this planet for money and if you (or he) are worried about money seeking doesn't break the top twenty of them.[/QUOTE]No, what I meant was as soon as someone retires, they start viewing everything from a lens of what others "need", and what things used to cost. When you are working, you earn more yourself every year and are more willing to pay market rate in each particular market because you are aware of inflation. I used the FKKs as an example. There was a period of time when there were endless posts from retired guys who were disappointed that the 50 euros per session they had planned out during their retirement wasn't going to be the case. I am sure Steve9696 is paying the market rate for Sugaring and not somehow spoiling it for others. The cost of independent escorts in the western world has gone up considerably in the past few years, so logically the cost of Sugar Babies has also, along with everything in the service industry. For what it was worth, I was agreeing with you. Sorry you misunderstood my post.

[QUOTE=HumbleHal;2955966]Sadly I have witnessed the present internet "arrangement" girls are all asking for $500 a session, now. Before Covid they were asking $350.[/QUOTE]And a stripper I talked to said that $500 was a good night before Covid and after it, she said a bad night was anything less than $1000.

[QUOTE=HumbleHal;2955966]My hood girl is still getting $200 a session after 3 years and still texts me, to see me. My slim blonde, former professional pole dancer / stipper still is getting $200 a session after 5 years, and we generally get together once a week. They have each gotten older over the past 3 and 5 years, respectively, and have not brought any new effort to the table, so their value has not increased.

Unfortunately throwing out such large $150 raises, for no increased value, is ruining it for all of us, Steve.[/QUOTE]Not only do you have hookers on retainer, you assume everyone else does too. You are paying a wage for sex. A sugar daddy is giving a gift to help out a friend. I handled strippers or hood girls differently than sugar babies. They are not raised on generosity and think any men giving them a gift is a sucker.

The goal for a SB is a long term relationship. As someone said about Colombians, when you talk long term with strippers or people in the hood, that does not mean months or years but an hour.

When I went on P411 in my area, there were like 700 hookers. Seeking had 10,000+ women within 10 miles of my house. You are flattering yourself thinking you are going after the caliber of women Steve is going after, and that he is "ruining" things for you and other guys like you.

No offense taken. I too am one of those who criticize people who complain about costs rising with time. These simpletons don't understand basic math, the time value of money, or real estate. Every business has an overhead that is a direct function of their rent or, if they own the place, what they expect to get for their land outside of the performance of the business. Additionally, these are the same simpletons that scoff at their yearly 3% raises and wonder why they can't keep up with the rest of the world but keep going back to the shit job day after day and year after year. Or, if they're really bright, they hold their employer hostage by going on strike and demanding shit that is completely impossible from a business prospective. This is because they've never owned a business (and don't care to because they'd have to the the risk of losing their shit job) and don't understand that their employees are already taking care of their best employees and the bottom 80% are cannon fodder. If they don't understand that the price of everything goes up with time, they are morons for accepting any kind of defined benefit pension as their only source of income and expecting they can live the life they lived while they worked their shit jobs.

[QUOTE=Mongerer88;2956500]No, what I meant was as soon as someone retires, they start viewing everything from a lens of what others "need", and what things used to cost. When you are working, you earn more yourself every year and are more willing to pay market rate in each particular market because you are aware of inflation. I used the FKKs as an example. There was a period of time when there were endless posts from retired guys who were disappointed that the 50 euros per session they had planned out during their retirement wasn't going to be the case. I am sure Steve9696 is paying the market rate for Sugaring and not somehow spoiling it for others. The cost of independent escorts in the western world has gone up considerably in the past few years, so logically the cost of Sugar Babies has also, along with everything in the service industry. For what it was worth, I was agreeing with you. Sorry you misunderstood my post.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Elvis2008;2956502] A sugar daddy is giving a gift to help out a friend.[/QUOTE]Bizarre to hear this. Sugar Daddy always wants Sugar Baby to fuck him good. Always a quid pro quo.

A gift refers to a voluntary transfer of a benefit without the need for any compensation and consideration.

What planet are you on?

[QUOTE=Kazeu;2955105]I don't really consider it denigrating anyone. It's merely a fact. But suppose it were denigrating, then by the opposite side of the coin, it would have to be that all men pay women for sex. So we're all losers that can't get real love. :D[/QUOTE]Hey, Kazeu, your inbox is full.

Hmmm, can we all agree on one thing? If any of us were satisfied with what we had, then we would not get on Seeking? If we all had wives who looked like they were 20 year old super models, and had a stronger sex drive than us, then what would our motivation be for getting on the site?

To be honest, I think all this relates to a bigger issue. And that being people not wanting to accept reality, or not being willing to adapt to adverse circumstances in life. There is no magic bullet; things are constantly evolving.

Just my bad luck the Amazonense girl appears to be a thief. Oh well, on to the next girl; there are tens of millions to choose from.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2956813]Hmmm, can we all agree on one thing? If any of us were satisfied with what we had, then we would not get on Seeking? If we all had wives who looked like they were 20 year old super models, and had a stronger sex drive than us, then what would our motivation be for getting on the site?

To be honest, I think all this relates to a bigger issue. And that being people not wanting to accept reality, or not being willing to adapt to adverse circumstances in life. There is no magic bullet; things are constantly evolving.

Just my bad luck the Amazonense girl appears to be a thief. Oh well, on to the next girl; there are tens of millions to choose from.[/QUOTE]One of the most thought-provoking passages from the book The Godfather is Michael Corleone's analysis of what his father would have become had he not chosen to struggle against his fate. The comparison was to the ordinary Italian-American laborers.

For most guys seeing sex workers is a form of struggling against his fate. Which would be a less satisfying sex life for him without sex workers.

What I have never understood is this mentality that someone spending $500 on an adventure should either spend $200 or not spend anything at all, just because some other guys are only able, or willing, to spend $200, That is hardly struggling against one's fate. It is as much of a constraint as being dateless or accepting a lesser sex life with someone you are not attracted to.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2956813]Hmmm, can we all agree on one thing? If any of us were satisfied with what we had, then we would not get on Seeking? If we all had wives who looked like they were 20 year old super models, and had a stronger sex drive than us, then what would our motivation be for getting on the site?.[/QUOTE]I don't know. I think a lot comes down to just wanting variety. I often see a girl who's pudgy or maybe just has one asset on her I find attractive. I wouldn't like her long term. But I'd do her in a minute once or twice just because she'd be new and different. And I had pretty hot girlfriends in my twenties who after a year of dating just became the girl I was banging and I over noticed any flaws they had. I think this is how it goes for a lot of us. It's the excitement of new.

[QUOTE=NeilGeorge;2956718]Sugar Daddy always wants Sugar Baby to fuck him good. Always a quid pro quo.

A gift refers to a voluntary transfer of a benefit without the need for any compensation and consideration.

What planet are you on?[/QUOTE]The planet where I got over thinking I had to be a john. That is actually the problem with seeing prostitutes all the time. You condition yourself that it is always has to be about money for sex. The reason I went into sugaring is that hooker sex got old.

In the USA, the price had to be mentioned up front all the time. Once the women understood they were going to be compensated, they could let their hair down. Even when the relationship is over, I have had many, many SBs reach out to me later and be FB friends.

In the Latin American countries, there were times I was getting women in bed without mentioning price. The conversation was so smooth that it did not even come up. What I found was that if I presented myself in a wealthier fashion with clothes and where I was staying, women were much less likely to ask for money. It got to the point that being asked how much was a huge turnoff.

I have had this topic come up numerous times before with guys. I always say the same thing, "Keep an open mind and let her bring up price. She may not. " Guys argue with me all the time, say it cannot be done, finally try it, get a woman into bed, and then think that was a great idea they had. LOL.

The paradox of the situation is the less greedy girls have always gotten more out of me than the women who demand cash up front, and that is because I care about the whole person versus what is between their legs.

I did not really understand why American women were so adamant to get $ up front versus the Latin ones until I saw the phone of an American SB. She showed me all her seeking response. There were a few legitimate guys but the overwhelming amount were guys trying to trick her and get into her pants for free.

Cleared my inbox.

[QUOTE=Elvis2008;2956762]Hey, Kazeu, your inbox is full.[/QUOTE]

So I help out a few women in mexico and a few in Colombia and have a regular in Colombia. I don't.

Know the reason, but they said they were going to put a hold on my account until I called them. I called them and answered all their questions. And they said they were escalating it to be reviewed. The next day I called and asked about my transfer and they said my acct has been suspended but would not tell me why.

I am currently using western union, but their rates are much worse.

[QUOTE=Jbj64;2956987]So I help out a few women in mexico and a few in Colombia and have a regular in Colombia. I don't.

Know the reason, but they said they were going to put a hold on my account until I called them. I called them and answered all their questions. And they said they were escalating it to be reviewed. The next day I called and asked about my transfer and they said my acct has been suspended but would not tell me why.

I am currently using western union, but their rates are much worse.[/QUOTE]Try Wise. I really like it. Good rates low fees. Fast.

[QUOTE=Jbj64;2956987]So I help out a few women in mexico and a few in Colombia and have a regular in Colombia. I don't.

Know the reason, but they said they were going to put a hold on my account until I called them. I called them and answered all their questions. And they said they were escalating it to be reviewed. The next day I called and asked about my transfer and they said my acct has been suspended but would not tell me why.

I am currently using western union, but their rates are much worse.[/QUOTE]Out of curiosity, what's the backstory to helping these women? Some guys on here would say any number of things. You're being fed sob stories. They're giving the money to Sancho. You're being played.

I'm not saying those things. I'm just curious how you ended up in a situation where you have multiple people waiting on remittances.

[QUOTE=Jbj64;2956987]So I help out a few women in mexico and a few in Colombia and have a regular in Colombia. I don't.

Know the reason, but they said they were going to put a hold on my account until I called them. I called them and answered all their questions. And they said they were escalating it to be reviewed. The next day I called and asked about my transfer and they said my acct has been suspended but would not tell me why.

I am currently using western union, but their rates are much worse.[/QUOTE]Paypal has a horrible rap for slow transfer times and high fees on currency exchange. For any service, any time you use ACH or debit card, the fee will always be way less than using a credit card, because of their processing on the backend, among other things.

I have Wise, but my account has been frozen. I found out a girl was lying to me and trying to manipulate me, so I filed a chargeback on the funds I sent her. Which I would have never sent in the first place had I not the option to dispute the transaction. Wise, being the idiots that they are, absorbed the loss, rather than reclaiming the funds from her bank account, even though they have tantamount to her routing and account number (all her banking info from Pix). I could just imagine her reaction if she opened her bank account and saw a negative balance; screaming and cursing at me. Right now I could not care less about having Wise because I don't really use the service. If you get a Schwab debit card from their checking account service, any foreign ATM fees you are charged are refunded, and on top of that you do not a conversion fee for other currencies. You can just withdraw foreign currency at the same exchange rate that Visa gets, because it's a Visa branded card. Basically a forex rate without a penalty or profit for the otherwise. Of course, getting foreign cash is a bit different than sending someone money.

Unless I start using Wise, I probably won't care except if they were to try and hire a collections agency. There are other services, but not all of them allow transfers between numerous countries and currencies.

100% agree. It is the variety and wanting something new.

I have a mental roster of girls I bang (real roster is risky). Sometimes I wonder if something is wrong with me but then, I go back right to it.

Oddly though, there are few girls (particularly in Europe) I keep going back to because they are super nice persons to beginwith. So, they have breached the barrier and moved into friends with benefits category.

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2956900]I don't know. I think a lot comes down to just wanting variety. I often see a girl who's pudgy or maybe just has one asset on her I find attractive. I wouldn't like her long term. But I'd do her in a minute once or twice just because she'd be new and different. And I had pretty hot girlfriends in my twenties who after a year of dating just became the girl I was banging and I over noticed any flaws they had. I think this is how it goes for a lot of us. It's the excitement of new.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2956900] I often see a girl who's pudgy or maybe just has one asset on her I find attractive. I wouldn't like her long term. But I'd do her in a minute once or twice just because she'd be new and different. [/QUOTE]Life is too short to be with fatties or fugglies. Unless they pay you?? I do not mind asking women this if they are not my type, because I would need to be compensated. I do not wrestle outside of my weight class. And my car has a bumper sticker saying, "No Fat Chicks, Will Scrape!" Used to be if a woman was really butt ugly we could put a bag over their head and fuck them doggie style, but now most women complain about that.

I have had a couple women that I put a pink dog collar around their neck and attached it to a pink leather leash I bought from Petsmart. They thought it was a fetish, but I really wanted to see them crawl on the floor on all fours to my bedroom like a dog. True!

Question for the older guys: how do you usually finish? I've been going bb with the same girl and can't finish with a condom on anymore. She's not on bc so cip is no go. Recently been CIM, her on BJ and using my hand but worried I'll get or already have death grip and not be able to finish cip anymore.

[QUOTE=GoingDumb;2957169]Question for the older guys: how do you usually finish? I've been going bb with the same girl and can't finish with a condom on anymore. She's not on bc so cip is no go. Recently been CIM, her on BJ and using my hand but worried I'll get or already have death grip and not be able to finish cip anymore.[/QUOTE]Not quite sure what your question is, but blindly offer the following:

It's relatively common in older guys to not shoot a load from pure fucking. Even bareback. Odd but true.

BJ is absolutely key. Have to have a great warm up BJ. If it's good enough then may be able to finish fucking. If it's not enough then stop fucking and have interim BJ and then finish with fucking or CIM. All good. This is the way a lot of guys go.

If I REALLY can't cum say from fucking 8 girls in three days 😝 then her doing BLS and me on hand work is the ticket. Almost never fails.

Back on the BJ point. My girl Fuck Bunny was not much of a BJer and that made it hard to finish sometimes. My girl Hood Girl I trained up on BJ and wow what a difference an EXCELLENT BJ makes. Night and day.

I try not to bang any girl that doesn't make me want to cream by just looking at her. Makes me really picky and have a mediocre pull rate from even an FKK or big soapy. Also means I pay more than most I just pay less often. I'm prediabetic and never had ED problems with condoms until my late 40's. Now it's about 50/50 and I don't like the ED pills because they cheapen the intensity of the nut. I won't go bare unless I've been with her for a while (sb), never with a straight prostitute, it's not worth my health.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2957170]Not quite sure what your question is, but blindly offer the following:

It's relatively common in older guys to not shoot a load from pure fucking. Even bareback. Odd but true.

BJ is absolutely key. Have to have a great warm up BJ. If it's good enough then may be able to finish fucking. If it's not enough then stop fucking and have interim BJ and then finish with fucking or CIM. All good. This is the way a lot of guys go.

If I REALLY can't cum say from fucking 8 girls in three days 😝 then her doing BLS and me on hand work is the ticket. Almost never fails.

Back on the BJ point. My girl Fuck Bunny was not much of a BJer and that made it hard to finish sometimes. My girl Hood Girl I trained up on BJ and wow what a difference an EXCELLENT BJ makes. Night and day.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=GoingDumb;2957169]Question for the older guys: how do you usually finish?[/QUOTE]Yes. If she is on Birth Control then its a free shot, CIP or anywhere I want. If the pussy is big and I do not want it, then CIM.

If she is not on BC then cum outside is the answer. Unless you want to pay child support for 18 years. When you are dead, then it stops but a child could inherit from your estate, so watch out.

[QUOTE=HumbleHal;2957226]Yes. If she is on Birth Control then its a free shot, CIP or anywhere I want. If the pussy is big and I do not want it, then CIM.

If she is not on BC then cum outside is the answer. Unless you want to pay child support for 18 years. When you are dead, then it stops but a child could inherit from your estate, so watch out.[/QUOTE]I hope this isn't too personal a question. If you're an older guy, presumably you don't want to start a new 18 year clock by having kids. But you like to go bare (which I am on the record as saying is a bad idea with girls you pay for sex but that's a different topic entirely). But my question is why not cut your tubes and eliminate the possibility entirely of an unwanted pregnancy at this stage in your life?

Just turned 41. Not sure if that is old.

No ED issues. Used Cialis a couple times, just to feel how it is. But felt less orgasm and a slight headache next day. So, no more.

Here is my order.

1. Vet the girl and filter out. Test results. So, my conversion ratio is low but a price I am willing to pay.

2. Pull out and finish elsewhere, mostly tummy or boobs even if she says she is on BC.

3. Once I gain trust, there are occasions I CIP but it's rare.

4. Enjoy a really good CIM if in the mood for it.

So, 70% finish elsewhere, 20% CIM, 10% CIP.

CIP is mostly with girls I have known for 3 years and have IUD. There was one occasion of CIP with a girl in California. But I felt nervous next day. So, stopped doing it early on until I have trust that she is genuinely on a reliable form of BC.

[QUOTE=GoingDumb;2957169]Question for the older guys: how do you usually finish? I've been going bb with the same girl and can't finish with a condom on anymore. She's not on bc so cip is no go. Recently been CIM, her on BJ and using my hand but worried I'll get or already have death grip and not be able to finish cip anymore.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Gfefan;2957351]Just turned 41. Not sure if that is old.

No ED issues. Used Cialis a couple times, just to feel how it is. But felt less orgasm and a slight headache next day. So, no more.

Here is my order.

1. Vet the girl and filter out. Test results. So, my conversion ratio is low but a price I am willing to pay.

2. Pull out and finish elsewhere, mostly tummy or boobs even if she says she is on BC.

3. Once I gain trust, there are occasions I CIP but it's rare.

4. Enjoy a really good CIM if in the mood for it.

So, 70% finish elsewhere, 20% CIM, 10% CIP.

CIP is mostly with girls I have known for 3 years and have IUD. There was one occasion of CIP with a girl in California. But I felt nervous next day. So, stopped doing it early on until I have trust that she is genuinely on a reliable form of BC.[/QUOTE]Ima going to call you a youngster. Take your age. Add my standard GF age and you have my age. LOL.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2957359]Ima going to call you a youngster. Take your age. Add my standard GF age and you have my age. LOL.[/QUOTE]Hahah no wonder girls are attracted to you, you have an amazing sense of humour.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2957170]Not quite sure what your question is, but blindly offer the following:

It's relatively common in older guys to not shoot a load from pure fucking. Even bareback. Odd but true.

BJ is absolutely key. Have to have a great warm up BJ. If it's good enough then may be able to finish fucking. If it's not enough then stop fucking and have interim BJ and then finish with fucking or CIM. All good. This is the way a lot of guys go.

If I REALLY can't cum say from fucking 8 girls in three days 😝 then her doing BLS and me on hand work is the ticket. Almost never fails.

Back on the BJ point. My girl Fuck Bunny was not much of a BJer and that made it hard to finish sometimes. My girl Hood Girl I trained up on BJ and wow what a difference an EXCELLENT BJ makes. Night and day.[/QUOTE]I was worried I wouldn't be able to CIP since I've been finishing myself and CIM recently. And that seems to have killed any chance of finishing in a condom anymore. Even when I could finish in a condom it was a lot more effort though. Good to know it's normal for it to get harder to finish even bb inside. I've pulled out once for a back shot but it makes me nervous I won't time it right and the first little squirt will still be inside.

Are any of you snipped?

[QUOTE=GoingDumb;2957415]I was worried I wouldn't be able to CIP since I've been finishing myself and CIM recently. And that seems to have killed any chance of finishing in a condom anymore. Even when I could finish in a condom it was a lot more effort though. Good to know it's normal for it to get harder to finish even bb inside. I've pulled out once for a back shot but it makes me nervous I won't time it right and the first little squirt will still be inside.

Are any of you snipped?[/QUOTE]Pulling out is not a reliable form of contraception, based on numerous studies finding that pre-ejaculate fluid often, though not always, contains sperm. Despite the prior mistaken belief that urinating in between orgasms would flush sperm from the urethra, thereby eliminating the problem. If I wanted to avoid pregnancy, I would never rely solely on that method. Where's Wes tried that, and even had the girl take the morning after pill, and she STILL got pregnant. I don't think that speaks very highly of the method. Granted, if you are 60+, the quality and quantity of your sperm has probably deteriorated so badly that it may not matter. I am not 60+.

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2957336]I hope this isn't too personal a question ... But my question is why not cut your tubes and eliminate the possibility entirely of an unwanted pregnancy at this stage in your life?[/QUOTE]Yes, it's personal, but funny now in hindsight.

In 1995 I went to the urologist to get a vasectomy after 2 kids. While in the back examination room, a fairly pretty, young woman came in, unannounced, in street clothes, and pulled down my zipper and started massaging my nut sack. She did not say who she was, nor what she was doing, nor was she wearing a white coat or uniform, nor was there another person in the exam room.

Then the doctor came in. I asked him, what was that fairly attractive young women doing to me, playing with my scrotum, did he know? He said that was his Physicians Assistant and she was checking to see if my sperm cord was long enough to pull through a slit and cauterize. Then he said he would not do the surgery because I had some emotional issues. Fuck him. Would have done his PA if she would have kept playing with me!

So later I have had 2 women approach me, wanting me to sire children with them. Neither one was wife material, but they were both very serious about it. One was my attractive banker, who knew I had some money in my accounts, and wanted me to sign a co-parenting agreement with her and make a baby. The other was a long-time very cute lady friend of age 40 that had been interested in me for 20 years, but was too independent to make wife material or live with.

Recently I have met a couple of sugar babies that would make good babies, both in their mid 20's and both slightly confused, which is what I like. I could probably make babies with either, if I wanted. Time will tell. All is good. Abraham had kids with Sarah when they were 100 so maybe I will. Alla Akbar.

[QUOTE=HumbleHal;2957545]Yes, it's personal, but funny now in hindsight.

In 1995 I went to the urologist to get a vasectomy after 2 kids. While in the back examination room, a fairly pretty, young woman came in, unannounced, in street clothes, and pulled down my zipper and started massaging my nut sack. She did not say who she was, nor what she was doing, nor was she wearing a white coat or uniform, nor was there another person in the exam room.

Then the doctor came in. I asked him, what was that fairly attractive young women doing to me, playing with my scrotum, did he know? He said that was his Physicians Assistant and she was checking to see if my sperm cord was long enough to pull through a slit and cauterize. Then he said he would not do the surgery because I had some emotional issues. Fuck him. Would have done his PA if she would have kept playing with me!

So later I have had 2 women approach me, wanting me to sire children with them. Neither one was wife material, but they were both very serious about it. One was my attractive banker, who knew I had some money in my accounts, and wanted me to sign a co-parenting agreement with her and make a baby. The other was a long-time very cute lady friend of age 40 that had been interested in me for 20 years, but was too independent to make wife material or live with.

Recently I have met a couple of sugar babies that would make good babies, both in their mid 20's and both slightly confused, which is what I like. I could probably make babies with either, if I wanted. Time will tell. All is good. Abraham had kids with Sarah when they were 100 so maybe I will. Alla Akbar.[/QUOTE]That's interesting. Thanks for sharing. It kind of amounts to your saying well, never say never. Leave a back window open.

I don't know how old you are. I'm mid 40's. I also have 2 kids. After that, and I love them, but I'm not looking to start the clock over again. I don't want to be going to kindergarten plays at 60. It's ok to close one chapter of life and open a new one. Only reason I don't get snipped is I'm married so it'd be super suspicious. And anyways I'm a huge proponent of using condoms when banging girls you're paying for sex.

I know it's odd but after a multi day multi girl seeking trip I always have that outside fear that in 3 months I'll get a call from some faraway girl saying she's pregnant. And I'll have to basically say look my sperm is already weak and we always used a condom so it's not me. But the fear is always there. Just a little bit.

[QUOTE=GoingDumb;2957169]Question for the older guys: how do you usually finish? I've been going bb with the same girl and can't finish with a condom on anymore. She's not on bc so cip is no go. Recently been CIM, her on BJ and using my hand but worried I'll get or already have death grip and not be able to finish cip anymore.[/QUOTE]I've been doing pull-out since probably my 20's, so either I have a low sperm count, or I just lucked out for close to 30 years. I get a feeling when I'm about to go and make sure I'm clear at least 2-3 seconds before. If I'm going a second round I'll usually wash off with soap when I go to the washroom. As someone else pointed out, just peeing is not a guarantee, but so far, so good.

As you know I sorted out my three girl local dilemma. I had Fuck Bunny, Nerdy Girl, and Home Girl, who I will call G. G won out for best overall package of sweet girl with strong BJ and very submissive and grateful. Turns out to be a great choice.

G and I met up tonight and it being off season I was able to grab the Hyatt on Hotwire for less than $100 all in. Woo hoo! G was super stoked. She'the never been to a nice hotel before. And this is part of her charm. I am introducing this girl from the hood to the finer things in life. Feels a bit like Pretty Woman to be honest, tho I will not be White Knighting her.

I picked her up at her place and we planned to go to Thai because she had some Mango milk tea last time that she loved. But it was closed so we rocked on to the Hyatt. It has an amazing rooftop bar with a great view and pretty good tapas. She dressed up in a nice slinky black dress and some light jewelry knowing we were headed upscale. And she looked great.

After checkin we bopped on up to the top floor and got a table by the window. She of course was smitten with the view. But equally smitten with the drinks and tapas. Having just turned 21 she is quite enamored with mixology and was totally taken by the French 75, a concoction of gin, lemon juice and champagne. I grabbed Negroni and we settled in.

We ordered three different plates and one was a charcuterie tray. She of course didn't know this word but was happy for a meat and cheese tray. In Pretty-Woman-mode she really doesn't know the etiquette and it's rather endearing as she dips the prosciutto in the honey. I follow suit and damn it's really good! But it's just so fun to see this girl so full of life, experiencing it more fully.

She slugs down her drink and orders another. She's def getting a bit tipsy but that's all for the good as she's great fun in bed when inspired by drink. I get an Aperol Sprtiz to slow things down a bit (don't want to be too drunk to cum). The meal is quite excellent and she is on cloud nine being treated like a princess.

In the room of course we are quite comfortable by now. We start with a joint shower because of course the Hyatt has a nice glam bath. She's clearly never done this before and there is no preview BJ and her hands on is a bit awkward but honestly it's quite endearing to be with this babe in the woods and soaping her tits has me hard as a brick.

Back in the room we dive under the covers because we are chilly and just spoon naked for a bit. It's not long before I am reaching between her legs to work her clit and she is very receptive. I find her pussy surprisingly wet already from the bit of kissing and warm up.

Of course it's time to get me in the game so I get up and go stand at side of bed my hard cock just inches from her face. She rolls a bit more to her stomach and takes me in her mouth. You may recall I coached up her BJ from a 4 to an 8. Damn she caught on fast and loves to suck dick it turns out!

Her BJ these days is totally fabulous and clearly she enjoys it. We go on and on, with a buffet of harmonica and BLS and shaft pumping. Just super good. I start fingering her from behind and she is slippery wet and getting wetter.

She must BJ me for at least twenty minutes and I think she would gladly keep on more but I am now dying to fuck her so I pull her into bedside doggie. I fuck her really good like this for at least ten minutes. There is a mirror on the opposite wall and it's very sexy to watch myself impaling her!

After that I switch it up to The Steve and pound good with her on her back. She prefers it fast and rough so I am really slamming her hard and she is squeaking and throwing her head to the side and grimacing and all the pre-O behavior.

In the past I've always gotten her worked up to this level where she is clearly in another world but could never quite get the O from fucking. So in a stroke of genius I break from fucking and go down on her. Using my best tricks from my buddy Mark I have her going wild almost instantly and it can't be more than 3 minutes when she has a crashing O, pushing me out of the way as it overcomes her.

Well that was a damn lot of fun but I haven't cum yet. And she rolls on her side away from me. She always does this when spent and I give her a bit of time and then roll her back and put her on BJ. But since she's such a limp fish right now I have a great idea and let her rest as I pop onto the elevator and grab another round of French 75's to go.

Back in the room we enjoy our drinks and relax a bit before I put her back on BJ. Same setup with me at edge of bed and pussy fingering as she sucks me on her stomach. Damn she has gotten good! She must surely suck me for at least another 10 minutes before I start to feel the urge to fuck her to completion.

Even tho she's still BJing like a goddess I pull out and set up for mish. She feels like absolute heaven and I feel the build quickly after all that warm up. We both start kissing urgently, tongues tangling while I build. Doesn't take much of that till I shoot a hot load inside her. Damn that was one fine evening!

I'm having lots of login problems and wondering if anybody else is as well? The site keeps asking for my login credentials over and over and over again, and doesn't let me in when provided, as if the site is stuck in a loop or something. Contacted customer support, but of course that's shit on Seeking! Anybody else experienced this, and if so how did you resolve? I've already cleared the cache and cookies, tried different browsers, updated browsers, tried different devices, updated devices, etc. Nothing has worked. Pretty ticked off as I dropped good money for a new subscription and was developing all kinds of great contacts and prospects!

What are your opinions on girls that live far away? I'm trying to use seeking in Brazil. Every once in a while I'll see a girl that looks pretty good, then start chatting and realize she lives out in the boonies. Then I start the internal debate. Is it worth it to pay for her fare and take the risk that it will all go well? How much are you guys willing to pay for a meet and greet with a girl? Most girls want an uber, but uber adds up, especially when the distance is considerable and you're paying for round trip. How do guys handle this? Do you guys just forget about any girl that is more than X distance away? Do you get her to take the bus?

[QUOTE=Kazeu;2958973]What are your opinions on girls that live far away? I'm trying to use seeking in Brazil. Every once in a while I'll see a girl that looks pretty good, then start chatting and realize she lives out in the boonies. Then I start the internal debate. Is it worth it to pay for her fare and take the risk that it will all go well? How much are you guys willing to pay for a meet and greet with a girl? Most girls want an uber, but uber adds up, especially when the distance is considerable and you're paying for round trip. How do guys handle this? Do you guys just forget about any girl that is more than X distance away? Do you get her to take the bus?[/QUOTE]Paying Uber to get a girl to the date is totally 100 percent normal. Especially in poorer countries where it sucks to take public transport all dolled up. Be happy it's Brazil. Uber should be cheap there. Girls who do this usually don't live in the town center. It's normal for them to spend 45-60 min taking an Uber and you're paying 20-25 bucks for them to do so. Here in the US it's often like 30-50 bucks.

That said I find it annoying when I don't learn I'll be incurring a new expense until just before the date. I hate surprises.

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2958975]Paying Uber to get a girl to the date is totally 100 percent normal. Especially in poorer countries where it sucks to take public transport all dolled up. Be happy it's Brazil. Uber should be cheap there. Girls who do this usually don't live in the town center. It's normal for them to spend 45-60 min taking an Uber and you're paying 20-25 bucks for them to do so. Here in the US it's often like 30-50 bucks.

That said I find it annoying when I don't learn I'll be incurring a new expense until just before the date. I hate surprises.[/QUOTE]True. I guess I'll just need to try to vet them harder before deciding to meet up. I think 50 bucks round trip is fine. When it becomes questionable is when its more like 80 to 100 round trip due to distance.

I have a problem with this. If she doesn't at least own a car I'm generally not interested. Not that I care about can fare it's that there will always be "something. " Sick mom, sick dog, friend owes her, babysitter sitter bailed, blah blah blah.

I met 4 girls that didn't own a car and it never got past a chat or a first meet. That said, it's normal to have car in most of the US. In a place where it's not so common then it's ok but buyer beware. Think about the service businesses you frequent and how many ask for money up front? Aside from the shady AMPS I can't think of any. Even strippers wait for the songs to end.

[QUOTE=Kazeu;2958973]What are your opinions on girls that live far away? I'm trying to use seeking in Brazil. Every once in a while I'll see a girl that looks pretty good, then start chatting and realize she lives out in the boonies. Then I start the internal debate. Is it worth it to pay for her fare and take the risk that it will all go well? How much are you guys willing to pay for a meet and greet with a girl? Most girls want an uber, but uber adds up, especially when the distance is considerable and you're paying for round trip. How do guys handle this? Do you guys just forget about any girl that is more than X distance away? Do you get her to take the bus?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2958975]Paying Uber to get a girl to the date is totally 100 percent normal... taking an Uber and you're paying 20-25 bucks for them to do so. Here in the US it's often like 30-50 bucks.
[/QUOTE]Until you find out they have stolen your information and are taking Uber at your expense all around. Somehow if you uber someone to you they can get your app information and continue to use your Uber wherever they want to go. They get on and off a block away from their true destination so the police cannot find them and you have to cancel your credit card to shake them!

Better practice is to make them use their own uber app and credit card, then reimburse them in cash when they show up. Never pay for airplane tickets for someone else, they will cash them in and keep the refund.

[QUOTE=HumbleHal;2959031]Until you find out they have stolen your information and are taking Uber at your expense all around. Somehow if you uber someone to you they can get your app information and continue to use your Uber wherever they want to go. They get on and off a block away from their true destination so the police cannot find them and you have to cancel your credit card to shake them!

Better practice is to make them use their own uber app and credit card, then reimburse them in cash when they show up. Never pay for airplane tickets for someone else, they will cash them in and keep the refund.[/QUOTE]I do not see how this is possible. I don't use the feature where I add another rider. I simply order for myself and then send a message to the driver saying actually it's for my friend and she's wearing whatever she's wearing that day. And I text her as the driver is coming closer to wait outside. Never had a people. Actually only problem has been stupid girls making it hard for the uber driver like not being ready and waiting and scanning for him. I swear some of them must think the Uber driver is just going to magically pull up in front of them and know it's them.

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2959030]I have a problem with this. If she doesn't at least own a car I'm generally not interested. Not that I care about can fare it's that there will always be "something. " Sick mom, sick dog, friend owes her, babysitter sitter bailed, blah blah blah..[/QUOTE]This is really limiting. Outside the US it's totally normal to not own a car. If you make like 500 bucks a month you're not a car owner but you're perfect for seeking.

Here in the US I've had several girls who don't own cars. They uber when they need to go to work. In California I suspect that's actually cheaper than buying and insuring a vehicle. If you're a waitress as my current seek slit is, that seems totally ok choice.

Quick side story. In Mexico once had a girl stay over. She did drive over which I was surprised by. In the morning she asked me for a bottle of water. I watched her leave through the window and she proceeded to open the trunk to her decayed, decrepit old car and pour the water into the radiator to get it going. I swear girl should just be using uber. I'm sure that car must have stranded her shortly after.

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2959030]I have a problem with this. If she doesn't at least own a car I'm generally not interested. Not that I care about can fare it's that there will always be "something. " Sick mom, sick dog, friend owes her, babysitter sitter bailed, blah blah blah.

I met 4 girls that didn't own a car and it never got past a chat or a first meet. That said, it's normal to have car in most of the US. In a place where it's not so common then it's ok but buyer beware. Think about the service businesses you frequent and how many ask for money up front? Aside from the shady AMPS I can't think of any. Even strippers wait for the songs to end.[/QUOTE]In Brazil, I don't think a women with a car would be on seeking. I could be wrong though, maybe girls have cars because they're on seeking.

It's a cart / horse, chicken / egg problem. Don't disagree with AmericanPi but if a girl is resourceful enough or gets enough family support to drive a car I don't feel like she'll nickel and dime me and I don't want to be in a position to tell her no all the time. It kills the vibe to say the least.

[QUOTE=Kazeu;2959288]In Brazil, I don't think a women with a car would be on seeking. I could be wrong though, maybe girls have cars because they're on seeking.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Kazeu;2959288]In Brazil, I don't think a women with a car would be on seeking. I could be wrong though, maybe girls have cars because they're on seeking.[/QUOTE]Sounded like you were asking whether you should send money for an uber. Definitely do not do that! Ever. I love sending girls Uber. As someone said it can be a pain hooking them up but more recently uber added ability to send for someone else and they can communicate which is better. I love that I can track her right to the door and pop out and meet her.

And yes uber is cheaper than dirt in Brasil.

On the car owner aspect I'the say there are def great girls who don't have cars. G doesn't. She walks to work. And catches rides with friends. And Fuck Bunny only had her boyfriends car but couldn't always use it.

[QUOTE=Kazeu;2958973]What are your opinions on girls that live far away? I'm trying to use seeking in Brazil. Every once in a while I'll see a girl that looks pretty good, then start chatting and realize she lives out in the boonies. Then I start the internal debate. Is it worth it to pay for her fare and take the risk that it will all go well? How much are you guys willing to pay for a meet and greet with a girl? Most girls want an uber, but uber adds up, especially when the distance is considerable and you're paying for round trip. How do guys handle this? Do you guys just forget about any girl that is more than X distance away? Do you get her to take the bus?[/QUOTE]See my post on the Floripa board. I literally did this in Brazil. And no, a girl cannot hack your Uber account unless you hand her your phone, or she knows your user name and password. If you send an Uber for a girl, you screen shot the page that shows the driver, car, and license plate. She doesn't have access to your app. She may have her own Uber app, but that links to her account, not yours. If you use the 4 digit safety feature, make sure she knows the PIN when the driver picks her up.

Uber is super cheap in Brazil. Outside of major cities, it sometimes can be hard to hail a driver in a timely manner. Girls who trapped in small towns, like Blumenau for instance, love getting out of those places. They were usually born there, and don't have the money to leave. They are thrilled with the chance to escape the mundane, and this is a major lure if you want to see someone for more than an hour. Such as a multi day trip. A lot of these girls are broke students, and some of them speak English pretty well. Also, my personal opinion is that Brazil is significantly safer for seeing girls than other South American destinations such as Colombia.

It all depends on what you want, and how much you want to pay overall. Sometimes the selection of the immediate city is no good, especially in Brazil when girls ads / profiles come and go often. Here, take a look.

[URL]http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?560-Florianopolis&p=2917517[/URL]#post2917517.

Anyone else not seeing pics show up on thumbnails? This is happening to me across search, and message center.

If I restart the phone, it works for a while and returns to same problem a little later.

Also, re-installed the app a couple times.

[QUOTE=Gfefan;2960478]Anyone else not seeing pics show up on thumbnails? This is happening to me across search, and message center.

If I restart the phone, it works for a while and returns to same problem a little later.

Also, re-installed the app a couple times.[/QUOTE]I had this issue off and on, but has been fine for a few weeks now (yes, I managed to get back in after like 24 hours).

[QUOTE=Gfefan;2960478]Anyone else not seeing pics show up on thumbnails? This is happening to me across search, and message center.

If I restart the phone, it works for a while and returns to same problem a little later.

Also, re-installed the app a couple times.[/QUOTE]Use web version. I think their servers are overloaded or something. Web version works after refreshing few times. I stopped using phone app version long ago.

[QUOTE=DwayneJohnson;2960490]Use web version. I think their servers are overloaded or something. Web version works after refreshing few times. I stopped using phone app version long ago.[/QUOTE]It was the web version I was having a problem with. The phone app version always worked fine. Now both are good!

I have a better job offer than current one from a Swiss company. However, at the moment I am knee deep in pussy. So I'm contemplating move to Zurich. Personally I don't have any problem in moving and offer is very tempting from career perspective. However, since most of my monthly expenses are on hot girls, I wonder how expensive would be seeking thing in Zurich? Right now getting a pretty university girl for less than 400 euro per meeting is easy. I am calculating my actual spending capacity based on this and thinking even if I earn 50% more than present there will be effectively no real increase in purchasing power. Thanks in advance for any inputs.

I try to be open to new talent, though I have 2 regulars and I give them each $200 a session, have done so for years. Recently I have seen the prices asked go up to $1,000 although most of the time the girls will settle for $400 to $500. This is supposed to be for top talent, 25 year old, pussy that is on birth control so I can take a free shot.

Problem is that most of these girls think they are top talent and can command what they ask, but they have moderately saggy tits and saggy ass. Or they may be fatter than their photos and what I like. I like slim, all natural and a good attitude of submission. I prefer to take the lead, I do not want a woman directing the bedplay action.

I find out in bed when they are naked. Sometimes they underperform, or are mechanical. Usually I can tell after a couple of visits if I feel like repeating and working them into my rotation schedule. I only fuck every other day, due to age and lower testosterone.

Normally I can unhinge from seeing them. Normally they have an anger issue and are rude, so I simply do not contact them again, and move on to the next fuck online. Sometimes I try to delay getting together with excuses, like I am out of town for a week or so visiting family. It is hard to tell them the truth, that they are too fat, rude or saggy tits and ass, so I try to be gentle and let them go with diginity, or gradually.

[QUOTE=HumbleHal;2960692]
Normally I can unhinge from seeing them. Normally they have an anger issue and are rude, so I simply do not contact them again, and move on to the next fuck online. Sometimes I try to delay getting together with excuses, like I am out of town for a week or so visiting family. It is hard to tell them the truth, that they are too fat, rude or saggy tits and ass, so I try to be gentle and let them go with diginity, or gradually.[/QUOTE]My best option to get rid of unwanted sugarbaby was saying that I am moving out of country and just change apartment. However in smaller cities in Europe it's difficult. Recently discovered the zoomer method of just ghosting or going silent on WhatsApp, Telegram, Phone etc works best. Younger generation seems cool with ghosting technique, few of my SBs told me they do this often with SDs they don't want to see again.

[QUOTE=HumbleHal;2960692]I try to be open to new talent, though I have 2 regulars and I give them each $200 a session, have done so for years. Recently I have seen the prices asked go up to $1,000 although most of the time the girls will settle for $400 to $500. This is supposed to be for top talent, 25 year old, pussy that is on birth control so I can take a free shot.

Problem is that most of these girls think they are top talent and can command what they ask, but they have moderately saggy tits and saggy ass. Or they may be fatter than their photos and what I like. I like slim, all natural and a good attitude of submission. I prefer to take the lead, I do not want a woman directing the bedplay action.

I find out in bed when they are naked. Sometimes they underperform, or are mechanical. Usually I can tell after a couple of visits if I feel like repeating and working them into my rotation schedule. I only fuck every other day, due to age and lower testosterone.

Normally I can unhinge from seeing them. Normally they have an anger issue and are rude, so I simply do not contact them again, and move on to the next fuck online. Sometimes I try to delay getting together with excuses, like I am out of town for a week or so visiting family. It is hard to tell them the truth, that they are too fat, rude or saggy tits and ass, so I try to be gentle and let them go with diginity, or gradually.[/QUOTE]If you are that concerned, just block them. Hopefully they do not have your personal info.

I saw a profile. Very attractive. Quite tall. To my liking. Located about 10 miles from me.

Age 41. Beyond my usual filter but willing to overlook that due to the attractiveness and fit body.

We exchanged few chats, doesn't seem like a scammer. I left my phone number for her before my subscription expired (left it only because she seemed legit). She has responded but I can't read now unless I renew.

Now, casual browsing tinder. Wife is going to be away for a few days. LOL.

I see the exact same person on Tinder. Although age says 51. And location is 25 miles from me. Looking for long term relationship (not my thing) VS. NSA on SA (my thing).

I am so curious I almost want to renew subscription, get back the convo and figure if she is a scammer.

[QUOTE=Gfefan;2961147]I saw a profile. Very attractive. Quite tall. To my liking. Located about 10 miles from me.

Age 41. Beyond my usual filter but willing to overlook that due to the attractiveness and fit body.

We exchanged few chats, doesn't seem like a scammer. I left my phone number for her before my subscription expired (left it only because she seemed legit). She has responded but I can't read now unless I renew.

Now, casual browsing tinder. Wife is going to be away for a few days. LOL.

I see the exact same person on Tinder. Although age says 51. And location is 25 miles from me. Looking for long term relationship (not my thing) VS. NSA on SA (my thing).

I am so curious I almost want to renew subscription, get back the convo and figure if she is a scammer.[/QUOTE]Don't do it! Don't waste your money. Red flags a flapping in the wind! In the meantime, I have connected with a more "mature" blue-eyed blonde whose intro was, "Do you want to fuck"? LOL! And she is for real. I know it after checking her out carefully. And because she is older, she offers a discounted rate of $350 per meet. The young hotties in my new college city are commanding $500 and up pay per meet.

[QUOTE=Gfefan;2961147]I saw a profile. Very attractive. Quite tall. To my liking. Located about 10 miles from me.

Age 41. Beyond my usual filter but willing to overlook that due to the attractiveness and fit body.

We exchanged few chats, doesn't seem like a scammer. I left my phone number for her before my subscription expired (left it only because she seemed legit). She has responded but I can't read now unless I renew.

Now, casual browsing tinder. Wife is going to be away for a few days. LOL.

I see the exact same person on Tinder. Although age says 51. And location is 25 miles from me. Looking for long term relationship (not my thing) VS. NSA on SA (my thing).

I am so curious I almost want to renew subscription, get back the convo and figure if she is a scammer.[/QUOTE]Are the photos 100% identical? Or could she just be very similar looking? I usually won't meet without a video chat first, for this very reason. I don't get too excited about potential prospects until I've vetted them.

100% identical.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2961180]Are the photos 100% identical? Or could she just be very similar looking? I usually won't meet without a video chat first, for this very reason. I don't get too excited about potential prospects until I've vetted them.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Gfefan;2961220]100% identical.[/QUOTE]Yeah but subscriptions to Seeking are expensive. Why blow the money when there's another ad posted with a 10 year age difference? Unless you think someone stole her pictures on tinder.

[QUOTE=Gfefan;2961147]I saw a profile. Very attractive. Quite tall. To my liking. Located about 10 miles from me.

Age 41. Beyond my usual filter but willing to overlook that due to the attractiveness and fit body.

We exchanged few chats, doesn't seem like a scammer. I left my phone number for her before my subscription expired (left it only because she seemed legit). She has responded but I can't read now unless I renew.

Now, casual browsing tinder. Wife is going to be away for a few days. LOL.

I see the exact same person on Tinder. Although age says 51. And location is 25 miles from me. Looking for long term relationship (not my thing) VS. NSA on SA (my thing).

I am so curious I almost want to renew subscription, get back the convo and figure if she is a scammer.[/QUOTE]I'd only go back on if you actually want to go back on. That means you're in the mood for a sugar baby in general, not this particular woman. I've learnt from experience not to attach any value to a girl from Seeking until she's earned it. Even then, I do so reluctantly!

The plain fact of the matter is, the vast majority of interactions you have on Seeking are a waste of your time. By the time you filter through the scammers, the flakes, the ones who you meet and who you're not interested in, the ones you lije, but who drop you, you're into the 1/2 per hundred territory! The lesson being, always be ready to move on abd Never change your plans to chase or suit someone from Seeking.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2961249]Yeah but subscriptions to Seeking are expensive.[/QUOTE]Try SugarDaddyMeet its much cheaper and about the same, and they do not kick you off for negotiating price on the site.

I know this is the Seeking thread but you guys are my buds so thought I would give you a heads up to check out my upcoming posts in the São Paulo and Rio threads. To summarize: 1 week. 15 girls. 14 new. Repeated with three. Had an amazing dupla. Did three girls on two of the days and four on another. Took my Rio Seeking girl on a helicopter ride. Epic. Brazil is def best girls locale on planet earth. Happy to share tips if you like.

I know this sounds like total BS but you guys know me and it 100% just went down. Amazing. Best trip ever and that is a high bar.

[QUOTE=TheCane;2961155]In the meantime, I have connected with a more "mature" blue-eyed blonde whose intro was, "Do you want to fuck"? LOL! And she is for real. I know it after checking her out carefully. And because she is older, she offers a discounted rate of $350 per meet. The young hotties in my new college city are commanding $500 and up pay per meet.[/QUOTE]Beyutch thought I was going to give her rusty ass $300 just to show up and meet and greet and eat and drink and be merry on my dime at the same time. I don't pay out allowance-level money the very first time I meet somebody who I don't even know and may not like. That's just throwing money away. She's now out while I set meetings up with much younger and much hotter "snowbunnies". Like somebody just said. Seeking is mostly a waste of your time. At least it's not an efficient use of time as you seek the right one for you.

[QUOTE=TheCane;2961358]Beyutch thought I was going to give her rusty ass $300 just to show up and meet and greet and eat and drink and be merry on my dime at the same time. I don't pay out allowance-level money the very first time I meet somebody who I don't even know and may not like. That's just throwing money away. She's now out while I set meetings up with much younger and much hotter "snowbunnies". Like somebody just said. Seeking is mostly a waste of your time. At least it's not an efficient use of time as you seek the right one for you.[/QUOTE]One reason I always start off with sex. If they aren't willing to meet in the bed room first, then they shouldn't be on Seeking, or pretty much any "dating" website with the possible exception of eHaromny or the like.

[QUOTE=HumbleHal;2961349]Try SugarDaddyMeet its much cheaper and about the same, and they do not kick you off for negotiating price on the site.[/QUOTE]Yeah but how's the database? Are there a lot of girls who will join Seeking but not SDM?

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2961482]One reason I always start off with sex. If they aren't willing to meet in the bed room first, then they shouldn't be on Seeking, or pretty much any "dating" website with the possible exception of eHaromny or the like.[/QUOTE]Yeah, women who expect to show up and be paid just to meet and greet are on the wrong site. They aren't seeking an arrangement. They're seeking free money! And guys who pay out like that are suckers! Unfortunately, I can't start off with sex. I'm really, really picky! I have to meet somebody in person first to see if I really am attracted to them. I don't try to fuck somebody I'm not attracted to. And I'm not confident I'm truly attracted unless and until I see someone in person. This is a key reason I don't deal with escort agencies with all their bait and switch tactics. So still looking for the one. Like I said, I've got some real prospects one hell of a lot younger and hotter than her. Her loss and not mine!

[QUOTE=TheCane;2961584]Yeah, women who expect to show up and be paid just to meet and greet are on the wrong site. They aren't seeking an arrangement. They're seeking free money! And guys who pay out like that are suckers! Unfortunately, I can't start off with sex. I'm really, really picky! I have to meet somebody in person first to see if I really am attracted to them. I don't try to fuck somebody I'm not attracted to. And I'm not confident I'm truly attracted unless and until I see someone in person. This is a key reason I don't deal with escort agencies with all their bait and switch tactics. So still looking for the one. Like I said, I've got some real prospects one hell of a lot younger and hotter than her. Her loss and not mine![/QUOTE]Yeah I am same. I don't want to just meet at the hotel and fuck. I will in a pinch but def not my preference. I want a real date with dinner and wine and laughter (or bare minimum a drink). But then I def want sex that first night while the momentum and attraction are there. I haven't done the date then sex the next time thing much at all and have had a few fails that way. Always take it to the bedroom while the iron is hot!

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2961620]But then I def want sex that first night while the momentum and attraction are there. I haven't done the date then sex the next time thing much at all and have had a few fails that way. Always take it to the bedroom while the iron is hot![/QUOTE]Not all girls are experienced players and some of the 19 and 20 year olds do not even kiss on the first date, which is a bad sign. Nor are all of them hot, either. Some are iffy. Some want too much money for their sex. So sometimes its better to go home and think about it, maybe the next day they will come down in their price. There are always better ones there unless she is a 10/10/10 in face, body and attitude.

Its like fishing, not all are worth taking home, some have to be thrown back because they are overvalued in their own mind, and not worth it for one reason or another.

Lately I have come across many who are heavier and larger than their photos, and they think they are worth top dollar. I have even rejected a few at the restaurant door, saying "I prefer slim and you are too large, sorry. " Then I walk away.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2961620]Yeah I am same. I don't want to just meet at the hotel and fuck. I will in a pinch but def not my preference. I want a real date with dinner and wine and laughter (or bare minimum a drink). But then I def want sex that first night while the momentum and attraction are there. I haven't done the date then sex the next time thing much at all and have had a few fails that way. Always take it to the bedroom while the iron is hot![/QUOTE]If it's a matter of looks, I would agree. But I've found most women aren't willing to do that (ie pay me cash in exchange for dinner; my response: FUCK OFF! If she is pretty, she'd have to be a total moron for the sex not to work. I've only encountered a few of those in my lifetime. But, I have had more than several instances of shitty services. Rushed, no kissing, poor attitude, etc. I'm not 100% sure that would change if I had dinner with them first, but maybe.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2961679]If it's a matter of looks, I would agree. But I've found most women aren't willing to do that (ie pay me cash in exchange for dinner; my response: FUCK OFF! If she is pretty, she'd have to be a total moron for the sex not to work. I've only encountered a few of those in my lifetime. But, I have had more than several instances of shitty services. Rushed, no kissing, poor attitude, etc. I'm not 100% sure that would change if I had dinner with them first, but maybe.[/QUOTE]Maybe we are looking for different things or vet them differently. I'm looking for a regular girl who is trying this out for extra cash. Waitress. Customer service. Admin. Clothing store clerk. Pretty girls. Nice girls. A girl I want to make my "girlfriend" in a given city. Someone I enjoy spending time w outside the bedroom. These girls often end up being much cheaper too because they aren't straight up hourly pros.

I should note also that such girls disappear fast. They are only on for a few weeks before some many douche bags scare them off. So u have to be constantly mining for gold.

Yeah, makes sense. Dropping the idea.

Thanks for putting sense into my head.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2961249]Yeah but subscriptions to Seeking are expensive. Why blow the money when there's another ad posted with a 10 year age difference? Unless you think someone stole her pictures on tinder.[/QUOTE]

You are right. There's plenty of fish in the bowl.

I normally subscribe, fish, take contacts, play with those girls until I am bored and then, return to subscribe. Cycle repeat. In an average I spend 3 months a year on seeking with a subscription.

So, no point returning for this specific girl. Next time when I return, if she is still around, maybe I will hit her up.

If not on to the next fish.

[QUOTE=Indy69;2961298]I'd only go back on if you actually want to go back on. That means you're in the mood for a sugar baby in general, not this particular woman. I've learnt from experience not to attach any value to a girl from Seeking until she's earned it. Even then, I do so reluctantly!

The plain fact of the matter is, the vast majority of interactions you have on Seeking are a waste of your time. By the time you filter through the scammers, the flakes, the ones who you meet and who you're not interested in, the ones you lije, but who drop you, you're into the 1/2 per hundred territory! The lesson being, always be ready to move on abd Never change your plans to chase or suit someone from Seeking.[/QUOTE]

What is it with advance payment and $80?

This figure keeps coming up. I need to find a babysitter. $80.

I need to find someone to take care of my grandad. $80.

I need gas and some commitment from you that you are real. $80.

Perhaps, it's high enough and yet is below 100 that scammers think guys will dole out?

[QUOTE=HumbleHal;2961654]Not all girls are experienced players and some of the 19 and 20 year olds do not even kiss on the first date, which is a bad sign. Nor are all of them hot, either. Some are iffy. Some want too much money for their sex. So sometimes its better to go home and think about it, maybe the next day they will come down in their price. There are always better ones there unless she is a 10/10/10 in face, body and attitude.

Its like fishing, not all are worth taking home, some have to be thrown back because they are overvalued in their own mind, and not worth it for one reason or another.

Lately I have come across many who are heavier and larger than their photos, and they think they are worth top dollar. I have even rejected a few at the restaurant door, saying "I prefer slim and you are too large, sorry. " Then I walk away.[/QUOTE]Try Ruthless Hal hahaha!

Just had a seeking girl spew profanities at me for asking her if she had any kids. After repeatedly asking me why I would ask that, I told her straightforwardly, I don't like stretch marks on my women. She got really pissed after that and told me I should go find a prostitute. Am I the asshole here? Do women really think that having kids doesn't devalue them?

[QUOTE=Kazeu;2961729]Just had a seeking girl spew profanities at me for asking her if she had any kids. After repeatedly asking me why I would ask that, I told her straightforwardly, I don't like stretch marks on my women. She got really pissed after that and told me I should go find a prostitute. Am I the asshole here? Do women really think that having kids doesn't devalue them?[/QUOTE]Personal topic, and most women are protective of their kids. They don't want clients knowing about their families, nor discussing them, as it's "none of their business" and a potential safety issue. Also there is a stigma associated with being a single mom. I can't even count the number of profiles that list "prefer not to answer" on the line for "has kids".

[QUOTE=Gfefan;2961707]What is it with advance payment and $80?

This figure keeps coming up. I need to find a babysitter. $80.

I need to find someone to take care of my grandad. $80.

I need gas and some commitment from you that you are real. $80.

Perhaps, it's high enough and yet is below 100 that scammers think guys will dole out?[/QUOTE]Two things I can think of.

First, it could be a protocol that scammers are passing around the dark web. Maybe some psychological study shows that numbers at or below this amount don't arouse suspicion. Perhaps since it is not a round number, it stands out less, or makes the story more believable.

Secondly, it could be that over 80 triggers a red flag with the payment processors such as Venmo, etc. Or that under 80 most consumers lose disputes / chargebacks due to some obscure regulation about lower amounts.

Do you mean 80 US dollars?

[QUOTE=Kazeu;2961729]Just had a seeking girl spew profanities at me for asking her if she had any kids. After repeatedly asking me why I would ask that, I told her straightforwardly, I don't like stretch marks on my women. She got really pissed after that and told me I should go find a prostitute. Am I the asshole here? Do women really think that having kids doesn't devalue them?[/QUOTE]Probably she would be thinking you are a psychopath. Try to pick slim women, fatter they are more likely they have stretch marks. Most of the eastern Europe women are well maintained and stretch mark free even after couple of kids.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2961737]Personal topic, and most women are protective of their kids. They don't want clients knowing about their families, nor discussing them, as it's "none of their business" and a potential safety issue. Also there is a stigma associated with being a single mom. I can't even count the number of profiles that list "prefer not to answer" on the line for "has kids".[/QUOTE]Oddly enough she claimed to not have any kids, but then continued to feel insulted about me asking.

Usually when they answer "Prefer not to answer" It means yes they have kids.

[QUOTE=DwayneJohnson;2961742]Probably she would be thinking you are a psychopath. Try to pick slim women, fatter they are more likely they have stretch marks. Most of the eastern Europe women are well maintained and stretch mark free even after couple of kids.[/QUOTE]All the women on seeking use filters to remove any sort of marks they have.

[QUOTE=Gfefan;2961707]What is it with advance payment and $80?
This figure keeps coming up. I need to find a babysitter. $80.
I need to find someone to take care of my grandad. $80.
I need gas and some commitment from you that you are real. $80.
Perhaps, it's high enough and yet is below 100 that scammers think guys will dole out?[/QUOTE]They are scammers, wanting you to send them money before you meet them, then they do not show up. Another popular request is their car is in the shop and not working so they need $$ to get it fixed to come to meet you at a restaurant. If you send money on Cashapp or elsewhere, then they do not show up. Sometimes I tell them I will give them $20 for gas at the restaurant where I meet them, but usually they are scamming me. Its a red flag that more fraud is coming, likely they are using 5 year old photos also, when they were slim, and when you meet them in person you will see they are fat.

I don't think you are an asshole for asking that but a lot depends on the context.

Context of first and foremost how you asked. It depends on what you both were discussing when you popped the question.

Secon, there is this culture element. Where is the lady from? I usually have seen European women open a out it VS. US women are cagey. Unless they need $ to babysit. LOL.

It also depends on what mood she was in. Perhaps, she was mad at something else at that time and you just happened to ask it at the wrong time.

So, don't feel bad about it. Next time, choose carefully when and how you ask.

There's plenty of fish out there. Put this lady behind you and move on.

[QUOTE=Kazeu;2961729]Just had a seeking girl spew profanities at me for asking her if she had any kids. After repeatedly asking me why I would ask that, I told her straightforwardly, I don't like stretch marks on my women. She got really pissed after that and told me I should go find a prostitute. Am I the asshole here? Do women really think that having kids doesn't devalue them?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Kazeu;2961729]Just had a seeking girl spew profanities at me for asking her if she had any kids. After repeatedly asking me why I would ask that, I told her straightforwardly, I don't like stretch marks on my women. She got really pissed after that and told me I should go find a prostitute. Am I the asshole here? Do women really think that having kids doesn't devalue them?[/QUOTE]This is a really interesting topic. I also screen out girls with kids. For a few reasons. They tend to be looser down there. Unless they've had a see section but then they tend to have a visible unsightly scar. None of these reasons would be deal breakers except for the fact that there are so many girls on seeking that if it bothers me why even consider it.

Then there's the problem that single moms need child care. You don't really have their full attention. They can only stay so late because they're paying a sitter. Or their mind is elsewhere. I don't fault that of course. I just don't need to deal with it so why would I?

And of course women hate being told that having kids disqualifies them. Why wouldn't they? It's like telling a guy he's disqualified because he's bald or too short or whatever. It's insulting because it's something you can't change. But once again, it's your money so it's your choice.

The one thing I'll say however is I would never tell a woman that's why. It's just impolite. There are other ways to part ways with someone that leaves her feelings intact. Sometimes lying is the ethical thing to do.

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2961903]
The one thing I'll say however is I would never tell a woman that's why. It's just impolite. There are other ways to part ways with someone that leaves her feelings intact. Sometimes lying is the ethical thing to do.[/QUOTE]That's a good way to put it. Once on seeking I had this great rapport and we exchanged pics and she said "I don't think I could get with anyone that old". Damn that stung. Would rather have a white lie or a ghosting!

In the end we became Penpals and I helped her with her med school application. You just never know where this world will lead us.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2961929]That's a good way to put it. Once on seeking I had this great rapport and we exchanged pics and she said "I don't think I could get with anyone that old". Damn that stung. Would rather have a white lie or a ghosting!

In the end we became Penpals and I helped her with her med school application. You just never know where this world will lead us.[/QUOTE]I once told a courtesan I wouldn't be able to make the appointment I scheduled rather far in advance. She got pissed as shit and snapped back at me. Looking back at it, it might have been better to block her. Not ideal either way; but remember, you don't owe these people anything.

[QUOTE=Kazeu;2961729]Just had a seeking girl spew profanities at me for asking her if she had any kids. After repeatedly asking me why I would ask that, I told her straightforwardly, I don't like stretch marks on my women. She got really pissed after that and told me I should go find a prostitute. Am I the asshole here? Do women really think that having kids doesn't devalue them?[/QUOTE]If you are an asshole for caring how a woman looks, then we are all assholes.

The funny part is that it goes both ways. There was a female gorilla in a lab being shown videos of a potential mate. The first one was so ugly to her that she ran from the screen. With the second one, she was kissing the screen. Women are just better at hiding it than men are. I saw on a talk show once with this geek named Blayne. There was a hottie on the show and she was asked if she would date Blayne, and she said it was his name not what he looked like that she had an issue with. If Blayne were an adonis, I doubt the name would have stopped her.

The reality is you have a pool of women wanting to date you, and you have women in that pool you are attracted to. So when a woman says she should be in your attractive pool, that just tells me she is insecure. The mature response is "Oh, you do not like me. Thanks for being honest" and she goes on and looks for a guy who does not mind stretch marks. Instead of saying this one man does not like me, she is thinking all men do not like her which is a sign of immaturity.

I think the biggest mistake guys make is not focusing on their own pool and getting bogged down on those outside of it. Even when I worked my way into a woman's pool, the juice was never worth the squeeze.

I wonder if Seeking has "ringers" on the payroll just to try to get guys hooked on paying those high membership fees? I'm talking women (or could be a guy pretending) who have no intention of meeting you, and are just there to try to keep you as a paying member. I know other types of dating sites are guilty of this unethical practice, and even knew a girl who did that kind of work for a dating site once. Keep them hooked! I mean I was talking to somebody supposedly from a little town not too far from me, and we had some good conversation on the site. Then next thing I know, several days later her profile shows her in another little town all the way across the country! Definitely something fishy going on. Blocked! Also, beware if you drop your membership on any dating site, and then all of a sudden you start getting all of these messages you have to pay for to read. It's a scam! So don't fall for it.

[QUOTE=TheCane;2962111]I wonder if Seeking has "ringers" on the payroll just to try to get guys hooked on paying those high membership fees? I'm talking women (or could be a guy pretending) who have no intention of meeting you, and are just there to try to keep you as a paying member. I know other types of dating sites are guilty of this unethical practice, and even knew a girl who did that kind of work for a dating site once. Keep them hooked! I mean I was talking to somebody supposedly from a little town not too far from me, and we had some good conversation on the site. Then next thing I know, several days later her profile shows her in another little town all the way across the country! Definitely something fishy going on. Blocked! Also, beware if you drop your membership on any dating site, and then all of a sudden you start getting all of these messages you have to pay for to read. It's a scam! So don't fall for it.[/QUOTE]You mean live people are doing the communication instead of bots?

About 10 months ago, I met this chick via SA.

Slim, fit, blonde. Totally my type. We met for a few drinks, conversation flowed well. We discussed what each of us expect.

There were slight differences but nothing deal breaking. I walked with her after drinks and we had this tender moment of a deeply passionate kiss. And we parted ways. It was no expectations meet and greet anyway. But I walked with a bulge in pants after that kiss.

Few days later, she texted me that she was expecting around 600 to 800 per date and that I was offering half. I told her my upper limit and mentioned to her that 600 is a deal breaker. And, it kinda went cold.

But, she would text me once a while and just have random chats. Like just two friends checking in and neither of us mentioned $ or meet up.

Last week, I checked in on her because I know she had a rough few weeks. She responded that she is doing OK.

This morning, I woke up to text "hey, you got any plans for tonight? If not, maybe, we grab a drink and see where it goes?

I am headed for that drink. Excited. But holding my horse (s) back.

Will post back how this night goes.

[QUOTE=Gfefan;2962192]About 10 months ago, I met this chick via SA.

Slim, fit, blonde. Totally my type. We met for a few drinks, conversation flowed well. We discussed what each of us expect.

There were slight differences but nothing deal breaking. I walked with her after drinks and we had this tender moment of a deeply passionate kiss. And we parted ways. It was no expectations meet and greet anyway. But I walked with a bulge in pants after that kiss.

Few days later, she texted me that she was expecting around 600 to 800 per date and that I was offering half. I told her my upper limit and mentioned to her that 600 is a deal breaker. And, it kinda went cold.

But, she would text me once a while and just have random chats. Like just two friends checking in and neither of us mentioned $ or meet up.

Last week, I checked in on her because I know she had a rough few weeks. She responded that she is doing OK.

This morning, I woke up to text "hey, you got any plans for tonight? If not, maybe, we grab a drink and see where it goes?

I am headed for that drink. Excited. But holding my horse (s) back.

Will post back how this night goes.[/QUOTE]This is soooo exciting. Best of luck to you. Yeah girls circumstances change. Rents due. Broke up w BF whatever. You have to be constantly in touch because you never know when is the right time. Fingers crossed.

A wise man once explained it to me this way. Guys make decisions based on facts. And facts don't change. So guys decisions are consistent. Girls make decisions based on emotions. And emotions change. So other decisions. Suddenly the world made total sense! Plus their facts (situation) do change over time.

[QUOTE=Gfefan;2962192]About 10 months ago, I met this chick via SA.

Slim, fit, blonde. Totally my type. We met for a few drinks, conversation flowed well. We discussed what each of us expect.

There were slight differences but nothing deal breaking. I walked with her after drinks and we had this tender moment of a deeply passionate kiss. And we parted ways. It was no expectations meet and greet anyway. But I walked with a bulge in pants after that kiss.

Few days later, she texted me that she was expecting around 600 to 800 per date and that I was offering half. I told her my upper limit and mentioned to her that 600 is a deal breaker. And, it kinda went cold.

But, she would text me once a while and just have random chats. Like just two friends checking in and neither of us mentioned $ or meet up.

Last week, I checked in on her because I know she had a rough few weeks. She responded that she is doing OK.

This morning, I woke up to text "hey, you got any plans for tonight? If not, maybe, we grab a drink and see where it goes?

I am headed for that drink. Excited. But holding my horse (s) back.

Will post back how this night goes.[/QUOTE]How odd, I've only had it go the other way around. Except they would always offer extras first, then later on it would go to shit. Bad luck for me, I guess.

[QUOTE=Gfefan;2962192]About 10 months ago, I met this chick via SA.

Slim, fit, blonde. Totally my type. We met for a few drinks, conversation flowed well. We discussed what each of us expect.

There were slight differences but nothing deal breaking. I walked with her after drinks and we had this tender moment of a deeply passionate kiss. And we parted ways. It was no expectations meet and greet anyway. But I walked with a bulge in pants after that kiss.

Few days later, she texted me that she was expecting around 600 to 800 per date and that I was offering half. I told her my upper limit and mentioned to her that 600 is a deal breaker. And, it kinda went cold.

But, she would text me once a while and just have random chats. Like just two friends checking in and neither of us mentioned $ or meet up.

Last week, I checked in on her because I know she had a rough few weeks. She responded that she is doing OK.

This morning, I woke up to text "hey, you got any plans for tonight? If not, maybe, we grab a drink and see where it goes?

I am headed for that drink. Excited. But holding my horse (s) back.

Will post back how this night goes.[/QUOTE]I'm talking to a smoking hot 21 year-old baby who knows it too. Slim, beautiful, blue-eyed, and blonde. Really pretty face! A freaking 10 on my optics scale. And she wants to bareback! She asked for a ridiculous $1,000 per meet, twice the going rate in this town, and I said hell no! I countered with $500 per meet plus if she needs something like some clothes, groceries, something for her apartment, shoes, etc. She thought about it for a day and came back and said OK. We're going to both get recent testing so we can go bareback. She wants me to cum in her! This girl is so, so hot! Even more than my last one and only baby (we were also barebacking). My dick is so hard right now it hurts! My god! When you score on Seeking you really fucking score! Man! All I can say is cast a wide net, be persistent, and swing for the fences for the home run! Wow!

[QUOTE=TheCane;2962203]I'm talking to a smoking hot 21 year-old baby who knows it too. Slim, beautiful, blue-eyed, and blonde. Really pretty face! A freaking 10 on my optics scale. And she wants to bareback! She asked for a ridiculous $1,000 per meet, twice the going rate in this town, and I said hell no! I countered with $500 per meet plus if she needs something like some clothes, groceries, something for her apartment, shoes, etc. She thought about it for a day and came back and said OK. We're going to both get recent testing so we can go bareback. She wants me to cum in her! This girl is so, so hot! Even more than my last one and only baby (we were also barebacking). My dick is so hard right now it hurts! My god! When you score on Seeking you really fucking score! Man! All I can say is cast a wide net, be persistent, and swing for the fences for the home run! Wow![/QUOTE]Many of these level 10 girls are "Dead Fish" in the bedroom. It comes down to their attitude. Its all about them and very little about you.

I always tell them I cannot wear condoms because I cannot feel anything, so I get checked often, just recently, I might add, and never have had anything. I offer to let them see my test results, but they never have taken me up on it, they trust me. I also tell them I have only had sex with 7-8 women in my life. In reality, add 2 zeros at the end, more like 700 to 800.

Unless they have an IUD, I always do the pull out method and cum on their ass. I prefer not to make a baby and pay child support for 18 years, although I have had 2 women that wanted to and asked to have babies with me.

So after a few fucks I get tired of them and ghost them and get something different.

[QUOTE=TheCane;2962203]I'm talking to a smoking hot 21 year-old baby who knows it too. Slim, beautiful, blue-eyed, and blonde. Really pretty face! A freaking 10 on my optics scale. And she wants to bareback! She asked for a ridiculous $1,000 per meet, twice the going rate in this town, and I said hell no! I countered with $500 per meet plus if she needs something like some clothes, groceries, something for her apartment, shoes, etc. She thought about it for a day and came back and said OK. We're going to both get recent testing so we can go bareback. She wants me to cum in her! This girl is so, so hot! Even more than my last one and only baby (we were also barebacking). My dick is so hard right now it hurts! My god! When you score on Seeking you really fucking score! Man! All I can say is cast a wide net, be persistent, and swing for the fences for the home run! Wow![/QUOTE]I hope you're snipped man. You are playing with fire if not. A girl telling you she's on birth control means nothing unless you are 100% sure. Don't let a few nights of passion stick you with a child. You don't know that a girl doesn't see you as an 18 year early pension. Just do your due diligence and don't trust the word of a girl you don't know.

[QUOTE=TheCane;2962111]I wonder if Seeking has "ringers" on the payroll just to try to get guys hooked on paying those high membership fees? I'm talking women (or could be a guy pretending) who have no intention of meeting you, and are just there to try to keep you as a paying member. I know other types of dating sites are guilty of this unethical practice, and even knew a girl who did that kind of work for a dating site once. Keep them hooked![/QUOTE]The day you first join they feature your profile to other women, and give you priority to interact with women all around the world. Also on the day or two before your membership expires. So you get all kinds of hit and attention on those days.

On the days in between your profile and photo is shuffled in the middle with everyone else and you get much less exposure. Its all designed to boost renewals. All the dating sites do this.

[QUOTE=HumbleHal;2962341]The day you first join they feature your profile to other women, and give you priority to interact with women all around the world. Also on the day or two before your membership expires. So you get all kinds of hit and attention on those days.

On the days in between your profile and photo is shuffled in the middle with everyone else and you get much less exposure. Its all designed to boost renewals. All the dating sites do this.[/QUOTE]If that is true, that's not exactly unethical, compared to deliberately filling the site with bots, or having a human pose as an interested party.

I recently acquired a new sugar baby named HOpe. Another in my rotation is named HOlly. They both have the same birthday, Monday November 18th of this week. What are the chances / odd? 1 out of 365. Less than. 003 chance. They are identical according to horoscope and both easy to get along with, but one gets twice the $$ what I give the other.

I took one for lunch today and shopping, the other one goes for lunch and shopping next Monday. They do not know about each other but are both my HOes. What are the odds they would do a 3-some with me? Afraid to tell them about each other to suggest it. True.

Last day of a 5 week trip, started in BA and ending in SP.

I only had 1 girl in BA because I found a gem on the first date.

Guili, 33 why. O fake blonde, all natural tits. I kept going back to her because I felt the price was fair a one hundred dollar bill for 2 hours.

She does BBBJ, bb anal BUT covered in pussy, afraid of babies. She also does CIM, great attitude, does golden showers too, not on her face. Saw her five times in three weeks, will probably fly her somewhere to meet for vacation.

I went to Rio but did not use seeking. Then I went on to SP, have seen 3 ladies here, all in early 30's.

Mary was first, when I asked her how much she wanted. She just said whatever I feel is fair which turns out to be not. The case she wanted four hundred for the full day but I wasn't willing to give her that, so I was planning on giving her two hundred and we agreed on two fifty and then she tried to get another fifty which I denied will not see her again.

The next one is renata who is a thirty two year old attorney all natural, paid $200 usd, totally a traditional date with sex at the end all covered, no anal, speaks perfect English. Fun to be with, but sex was not worth it. If I could convince her that I was s. T. the free and away to figure out how she could not worry about getting pregnant. She might end up going bareback.

Last night saw Cris, another thirty something professional that speaks perfect english this one did everything bare including CIM.

In s p I might have paid a little bit more, but it was worth it for me.

[QUOTE=HumbleHal;2962456]I recently acquired a new sugar baby named HOpe. Another in my rotation is named HOlly. They both have the same birthday, Monday November 18th of this week. What are the chances / odd? 1 out of 365. Less than. 003 chance. They are identical according to horoscope and both easy to get along with, but one gets twice the $$ what I give the other.

I took one for lunch today and shopping, the other one goes for lunch and shopping next Monday. They do not know about each other but are both my HOes. What are the odds they would do a 3-some with me? Afraid to tell them about each other to suggest it. True.[/QUOTE]Sometimes life is stranger than fiction. I have had two sugar babies turn from 23 to 24 in my hotel room in London. I shit you not. We fucked on their birthday in my room and I barely knew either one. Seems like they could be making hit up but no. The first was Thifany who I flew from Brazil. I had her passport to book her flight so I know it was factually her birthday. The second was a local London girl of Viet descent. It was our very first date, and she took "the birthday call" from her mom while sittting on my bed as I removed her leather fuck-me boots!

You cannot make this shit up!

So, this turned out to be a good date but I consciously ended with no action.

We met at a bar, grabbed a few drinks, cozy place given the storm outside.

Chatted a lot. She walked me through all goods and bads in her life. She has a startup now and we discussed some feedback on her approach and website.

(Yes, I know her real name and place etc. ,

She has had a rough few months due to a personal loss. As she drank more, she opened up more. I was happy to lend her a listening ear.

Two hours of chit chat and hugs and few kisses.

Neither did I push for taking it to the room (didn't feel like it. Felt like I would take advantage of her vulnerability that night. Just didn't feel right) nor did she offer.

A deep lingering kiss by the corner where we waited for her uber. Uber arrived. A warm hug and we both went our ways.

Next AM got a text from her that she felt good after letting it out previous night.

Spent $70 on our snacks / drinks but I have this good feeling that the money didn't go waste. If I could make someone feel better, why not!

[QUOTE=Gfefan;2962192]About 10 months ago, I met this chick via SA.

Slim, fit, blonde. Totally my type. We met for a few drinks, conversation flowed well. We discussed what each of us expect.

There were slight differences but nothing deal breaking. I walked with her after drinks and we had this tender moment of a deeply passionate kiss. And we parted ways. It was no expectations meet and greet anyway. But I walked with a bulge in pants after that kiss.

Few days later, she texted me that she was expecting around 600 to 800 per date and that I was offering half. I told her my upper limit and mentioned to her that 600 is a deal breaker. And, it kinda went cold.

But, she would text me once a while and just have random chats. Like just two friends checking in and neither of us mentioned $ or meet up.

Last week, I checked in on her because I know she had a rough few weeks. She responded that she is doing OK.

This morning, I woke up to text "hey, you got any plans for tonight? If not, maybe, we grab a drink and see where it goes?

I am headed for that drink. Excited. But holding my horse (s) back.

Will post back how this night goes.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Gfefan;2963102]So, this turned out to be a good date but I consciously ended with no action.

We met at a bar, grabbed a few drinks, cozy place given the storm outside.

Chatted a lot. She walked me through all goods and bads in her life. She has a startup now and we discussed some feedback on her approach and website.

(Yes, I know her real name and place etc. ,

She has had a rough few months due to a personal loss. As she drank more, she opened up more. I was happy to lend her a listening ear.

Two hours of chit chat and hugs and few kisses.

Neither did I push for taking it to the room (didn't feel like it. Felt like I would take advantage of her vulnerability that night. Just didn't feel right) nor did she offer.

A deep lingering kiss by the corner where we waited for her uber. Uber arrived. A warm hug and we both went our ways.

Next AM got a text from her that she felt good after letting it out previous night.

Spent $70 on our snacks / drinks but I have this good feeling that the money didn't go waste. If I could make someone feel better, why not![/QUOTE]Yep. Genuine human interaction with these women is underrated. Fuck bunny even told me she enjoyed hanging out with me more than her BF because I listen to her shit. You could tell she just needed to let it out. And then a very grateful fuck later that night.

[QUOTE=Gfefan;2963102]So, this turned out to be a good date but I consciously ended with no action.

We met at a bar, grabbed a few drinks, cozy place given the storm outside.

Chatted a lot. She walked me through all goods and bads in her life. She has a startup now and we discussed some feedback on her approach and website.

(Yes, I know her real name and place etc. ,

She has had a rough few months due to a personal loss. As she drank more, she opened up more. I was happy to lend her a listening ear.

Two hours of chit chat and hugs and few kisses.

Neither did I push for taking it to the room (didn't feel like it. Felt like I would take advantage of her vulnerability that night. Just didn't feel right) nor did she offer.

A deep lingering kiss by the corner where we waited for her uber. Uber arrived. A warm hug and we both went our ways.

Next AM got a text from her that she felt good after letting it out previous night.

Spent $70 on our snacks / drinks but I have this good feeling that the money didn't go waste. If I could make someone feel better, why not![/QUOTE]So, are you going to follow up with her?

Yes. We text each other.

I am open to fucking her when she is out of her vulnerable zone and is consciously OK fucking. Thumb rule is neither I nor her should regret the fuck next AM.

Until then, a few texts here and there or a few drinks is totally fine with me. After all, a $40 for a weekend drinks at a bar is something I would do anyway. Picking up the tab including her drinks is no big deal. To be clear, I will not pay her for her time on platonic dates. I will not cause that inflation or encourage that behavior...but picking the tab for an additional 30/40 bucks, once a while, is no biggie.

Fuck or no fuck. I think what I like about this girl is that we both know the ppm is not something we are aligned. But, she is mature enough to see beyond just ppm. So, that itself is a win in terms of neither of us taking it transactionally. As long as those good vibes last, why not?

It costs nothing to make someone feel good. I guess that's what we are doing to each other.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2963126]So, are you going to follow up with her?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Gfefan;2963352]Yes. We text each other.

I am open to fucking her when she is out of her vulnerable zone and is consciously OK fucking. Thumb rule is neither I nor her should regret the fuck next AM.

Until then, a few texts here and there or a few drinks is totally fine with me. After all, a $40 for a weekend drinks at a bar is something I would do anyway. Picking up the tab including her drinks is no big deal. To be clear, I will not pay her for her time on platonic dates. I will not cause that inflation or encourage that behavior...but picking the tab for an additional 30/40 bucks, once a while, is no biggie.

Fuck or no fuck. I think what I like about this girl is that we both know the ppm is not something we are aligned. But, she is mature enough to see beyond just ppm. So, that itself is a win in terms of neither of us taking it transactionally. As long as those good vibes last, why not?

It costs nothing to make someone feel good. I guess that's what we are doing to each other.[/QUOTE]Hmmmm. What if you find yourself in a similar situation, but the girl is over an hour drive away? What if at the end of the date, she requested $50 to go fill her tank with gas; would you do it?

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2963391]Hmmmm. What if you find yourself in a similar situation, but the girl is over an hour drive away? What if at the end of the date, she requested $50 to go fill her tank with gas; would you do it?[/QUOTE]You are NOT obligated to give them $50 gas money or any money unless you start an arrangement at an agreed price, other than pay for the meal if you offer to meet them in a restaurant. Get over this. I have just gotten rid of one Mooch that otherwise had good talent (firm boobies) because she keeps begging and asking for more money for gas, groceries, baby sitter, etc.

I have had enough of the Mooching. Then when I go to the gas station, grocery store checkout or 7-11 Cashier they always ask if I would like to donate for someone else's kids. Come on, man! Stop asking me for money, mooches! Just say NO! Then BYE. Just like the pan handlers on the street corner, you are NOT obligated to give them shit! And you are not obligated to tip at a restaurant if you get shitty service or no walnuts on your salad, like they did to me today.

And when I am tired of the woman or want to take a break, I simply say "I am short of money this week, babe! Or "going out of town this week to visit family" "Maybe next week!" And then I can cut them loose if I want and get another. Sometimes the chase is the fun. And most women are not worth the aggravation they cause! You need to be able to say NO and cut them off when YOU are tired of them!

That is not similar situation.

The moment she asks money for "her time" but no intimacy, deal is off the table.

I entertain only those girls who are non-transactional. For example, my Europe SB got into an accident and I helped her with money although we areon different continents. And that sweet one returns the money to me the next time we met. The AM after sex at hotel she was returning my money and I actually joked "wait. Am I the SB now?

Needless to say, I refused to take it back but you get the point. It is not the distance that matters. Nor the $. It is the overall package.

And, if they are after gas / baby sitter money, they don't make the cut of being my SB. I pay. What they do with it is upto them.

Wise ones use me well. Rest. I just don't give a fuck.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2963391]Hmmmm. What if you find yourself in a similar situation, but the girl is over an hour drive away? What if at the end of the date, she requested $50 to go fill her tank with gas; would you do it?[/QUOTE]

Hey All,

I have a potential trip coming up to Amsterdam. Thinking of seeing what's out there on Seeking and looking to see if I can have a fun evening or two. Anyone had any recent experience here? Would be good to know what the going rate is allowance-wise and if it's generally worth the hassle. My expectations are actually pretty low, as I'm expecting girls to be demanding and possibly for not a great experience. Just thought I'd reach out and see how others have done here first though.

Not sure about Amsterdam city but overall NL is good.

I have done 300 date, dinner, overnight stay. Maastricht is where my regular is from. It is a university town couple hours drive from Amsterdam.

The Hague also has given me great experiences at the same price point.

Tall, athletic blondes.

[QUOTE=Indy69;2964201]Hey All,

I have a potential trip coming up to Amsterdam. Thinking of seeing what's out there on Seeking and looking to see if I can have a fun evening or two. Anyone had any recent experience here? Would be good to know what the going rate is allowance-wise and if it's generally worth the hassle. My expectations are actually pretty low, as I'm expecting girls to be demanding and possibly for not a great experience. Just thought I'd reach out and see how others have done here first though.[/QUOTE]

Thanks for the info Gfefan.

Maastricht is quite a bit removed from Amsterdam. I don't think I'll be able to make it that far down.

I've had a little scout on Seeking and yes it looks tempting. 300 per date would be absolutely fine. I've not been on Seeking for some time. This trip might entice me back in.

Looking to subscribe Seeking through Gpay option using a gift card. Has anyone tried this in the UK, if so please can someone advice which prepaid / cash cards work best for this.

[QUOTE=ADI1598;2964890]Looking to subscribe Seeking through Gpay option using a gift card. Has anyone tried this in the UK, if so please can someone advice which prepaid / cash cards work best for this.[/QUOTE]If you are referring to Google Pay, it's just linked to a card. If the merchant forbids prepaid cards, then it likely will not allow you to bypass this.

So on Amazon Prime there's now a movie called "Sugar Baby." It's not a series; it's a 2 hour fictional work. From the trailer, it seems to start off with some girls exploring the "lifestyle", and appears to culminate with a woman ending up in dangerous situation with her sugar daddy being discovered too late as a violent criminal. There are no reviews on Rotten Tomatoes yet, but the ones on IMDB seem to be positive. Of course, just like reviews for sex workers, it's very difficult to authenticate movie reviews as being legit. I'm most curious to know if the producers of the film consulted with an actual prostitute to get accurate info to put into the movie, jaja.

Any recommendations on interesting and fun destinations for New Year's Eve, preferably someplace warm and with a beach, and with a vibrant SA community? For example, Rio was great for me, but always looking for somewhere new, that also has cultural / historical interest and a good food scene.

[QUOTE=CarloRogue;2966093]Any recommendations on interesting and fun destinations for New Year's Eve, preferably someplace warm and with a beach, and with a vibrant SA community? For example, Rio was great for me, but always looking for somewhere new, that also has cultural / historical interest and a good food scene.[/QUOTE]Punta del Este is warm this time of year. But, its tourist season, so the prices will be higher. Surrounding areas like Buenos Aires might also work.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2966089]So on Amazon Prime there's now a movie called "Sugar Baby." It's not a series; it's a 2 hour fictional work. From the trailer, it seems to start off with some girls exploring the "lifestyle", and appears to culminate with a woman ending up in dangerous situation with her sugar daddy being discovered too late as a violent criminal. There are no reviews on Rotten Tomatoes yet, but the ones on IMDB seem to be positive. Of course, just like reviews for sex workers, it's very difficult to authenticate movie reviews as being legit. I'm most curious to know if the producers of the film consulted with an actual prostitute to get accurate info to put into the movie, jaja.[/QUOTE]How about they consult with an actual sugar daddy to get our views on the lifestyle? I mean sometimes the crazy, dangerous one is the baby and not the daddy. Using the same old tired tropes and storylines they are!

[QUOTE=TheCane;2966154]How about they consult with an actual sugar daddy to get our views on the lifestyle? I mean sometimes the crazy, dangerous one is the baby and not the daddy. Using the same old tired tropes and storylines they are![/QUOTE]I decided to give it a watch. It's mainly just a parody on modern social culture. Satire against people doing stupid shit like being addicted to OnlyFans.

On your note though, I am finding it more and more difficult to trust women in general; particularly when it comes to anything amorous.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2966166]I decided to give it a watch. It's mainly just a parody on modern social culture. Satire against people doing stupid shit like being addicted to OnlyFans.

On your note though, I am finding it more and more difficult to trust women in general; particularly when it comes to anything amorous.[/QUOTE]A lot of the women on Seeking have all kinds of troubles going on in their lives, financial and other, and that's often what brings them to the site in the first place. Leads to a lot of them being very flaky and unreliable. Never travel long distances to meet one of these "soft core hoors" for the very first time unless you had some reason for going to that destination in the first place. Because the odds that they will flake out on you are just too high. Don't waste your time or money!

I have a strong appreciation for Steve's advice to always strike while the iron is hot. I mean these birds on Seeking can be so flaky that if you don't make a hard charging move right then and there, then you might lose your "shot on goal" with that particular girl forever.

[QUOTE=TheCane;2966748]I have a strong appreciation for Steve's advice to always strike while the iron is hot. I mean these birds on Seeking can be so flaky that if you don't make a hard charging move right then and there, then you might lose your "shot on goal" with that particular girl forever.[/QUOTE]Sometimes our iron is not real hot about the woman. Sometimes I prefer to wait and think it over because the woman is fatter than her photos or not really pretty in person or rude in person. Or the girl may be overvaluing her benefits. Waiting a day may bring her price down to a match point or bring another woman into play. Other days I am in a recharge mode and not real horny. Its best to go with your feelings, not mandatory to fuck every woman that walks. Some of the overvalued women are simply not worth the aggravation, you will find out after a few mechanical unloads, that there is nothing but a shallow blowup doll there and you may ultimately prefer looking at pornography and playing with yourself.

[QUOTE=TheCane;2966154]How about they consult with an actual sugar daddy to get our views on the lifestyle? I mean sometimes the crazy, dangerous one is the baby and not the daddy. Using the same old tired tropes and storylines they are![/QUOTE]Women admitting to their own faults? Women having accountability? LOL come on now.

Seeking has sent an email that new users will now require a selfie verification process to curb scammers.

What do you all think?

On one side, I'm glad scam is being addressed. On other, I think some authentic girls will stay away.

Like I would stay away if they asked for my selfie.

[QUOTE=Gfefan;2967182]Seeking has sent an email that new users will now require a selfie verification process to curb scammers.

What do you all think?

On one side, I'm glad scam is being addressed. On other, I think some authentic girls will stay away.

Like I would stay away if they asked for my selfie.[/QUOTE]Stolen pictures are not uncommon on many internet sites. With photo editing software, even unskilled computer users can use programs offered by companies like Adobe to make reasonably convincing fakes. It may slow down or deter some scammers, but many others will just find a way to bypass the system.

[QUOTE=Gfefan;2967182]Seeking has sent an email that new users will now require a selfie verification process to curb scammers.

What do you all think?

On one side, I'm glad scam is being addressed. On other, I think some authentic girls will stay away.

Like I would stay away if they asked for my selfie.[/QUOTE]I got the email. It's not just a selfie but a VIDEO selfie. And it didn't say it was only for the girls. Seems to me like it's going to severely scale back the platform. From my perspective it's not that people are using fotos of others. It's that pretty girls are scamming guys. Seems like they are solving the wrong problem.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2967254]I got the email. It's not just a selfie but a VIDEO selfie. And it didn't say it was only for the girls. Seems to me like it's going to severely scale back the platform. From my perspective it's not that people are using fotos of others. It's that pretty girls are scamming guys. Seems like they are solving the wrong problem.[/QUOTE]I have no clue who many Nigerian dudes are sitting behind desks pretending to be women. Seeking wants business. They want new members registering, because old members drop off for a variety of reasons. It all comes down to how stringent they are with the "selfie. " Eros would ask girls to hold up a postcard with a date and some text written on it. If Seeking asks for a video holding today's newspaper, and wants the person to jump up and down and clap their hands 3 times, that will be much harder to replicate. If they store the videos, then they might be able to identify duplicates, but that process takes time. Otherwise a selfie video or photo just proves that someone likely unique is behind the account. It does not prove that the identity being presented in the selfie is in fact the person behind the keyboard. I could walk up to a bum on the street, offer him $10 to take his picture holding his state issued ID, and bingo I have a photo. Of course, that might not work very well as you'd have to upload photos to the profile of a man resembling a homeless drifter.

These kinds of measures might stop a certain percentage of people. But they likely won't stop people who are determined to commit scams, and have a bit of time and patience to mess around with digital editing software.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2967254]I got the email. It's not just a selfie but a VIDEO selfie. And it didn't say it was only for the girls. Seems to me like it's going to severely scale back the platform. From my perspective it's not that people are using fotos of others. It's that pretty girls are scamming guys. Seems like they are solving the wrong problem.[/QUOTE]That would be a dealbreaker for me. I'm tapping out if that's true. Not trusting them with that. That's just waiting for another Ashley Madison situation.

They say it's for new members.

So, I see a lot of potential good girls, regular girls balking at this. So, a slow burn end is coming.

They say it's for new members. If that changes and / or my account gets locked and need to sign up new. I see myself tapping out.

So, base case. Quality girls are kept out. Worst case. I get out.

Damn!

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2967638]That would be a dealbreaker for me. I'm tapping out if that's true. Not trusting them with that. That's just waiting for another Ashley Madison situation.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Gfefan;2967679]They say it's for new members.

So, I see a lot of potential good girls, regular girls balking at this. So, a slow burn end is coming.

They say it's for new members. If that changes and / or my account gets locked and need to sign up new. I see myself tapping out.

So, base case. Quality girls are kept out. Worst case. I get out.

Damn![/QUOTE]Yeah this could kill the business. But maybe they will realize it before it's too late.

It's like this Mexican restaurant I used to go to that had a buffet. Including unlimited queso and chips. One day I show up and the unlimited queso is gone. I ask about it and they say it was too expensive and people wasted it. Guess what? Everyone stopped going! Total ghost town. So they put it back. And six months later regained their clientele.

So it was a decsison that made sense in the abstract and was a 100% fucking disaster in pratctice. Hopefully Seeking recognizes it before it's too late.

[QUOTE=TheCane;2966748]I have a strong appreciation for Steve's advice to always strike while the iron is hot. I mean these birds on Seeking can be so flaky that if you don't make a hard charging move right then and there, then you might lose your "shot on goal" with that particular girl forever.[/QUOTE]This, especially with women who log in once every few months. If she ever logs back on at all. I've seen quite a few who would I have absolutely loved to keep around and they haven't been on in months or years.

Most crypto exchanges that enforce KYC require the same thing: a clear picture of the person holding their government issued ID. I'm not sure that the girls have the same concerns that the guys do. Many don't blur their face pictures, I guess because the site gives the public appearance that it's not dedicated to prostitution in various forms. Therefore it's less controversial than being on a site like Eros. But if many guys start dropping out, there wouldn't be many people left to pay Seeking's overhead; as I would highly suspect the overwhelming majority of their funds come from Premium subscriptions from male members. It's very uncommon for girls to have Premium subscriptions. The only reason I'm on Seeking is because it's a worldwide site. I have yet to meet an American girl from the site. Since P4 P in the USA has become a crock of shit, any site that has a significant presence in other countries could work. Scammer aside, most of their problems arise from trying to skirt prostitution laws. Sites that are hosted and operate primarily in other countries rarely have to worry about that shit because most cops and governments tend not to pursue these kinds of businesses, unless it involves underage individuals or is politically motivated.

What is SP?

[QUOTE=Jbj64;2962552]Last day of a 5 week trip, started in BA and ending in SP.

I only had 1 girl in BA because I found a gem on the first date.

Guili, 33 why. O fake blonde, all natural tits. I kept going back to her because I felt the price was fair a one hundred dollar bill for 2 hours.

She does BBBJ, bb anal BUT covered in pussy, afraid of babies. She also does CIM, great attitude, does golden showers too, not on her face. Saw her five times in three weeks, will probably fly her somewhere to meet for vacation.

I went to Rio but did not use seeking. Then I went on to SP, have seen 3 ladies here, all in early 30's.

Mary was first, when I asked her how much she wanted. She just said whatever I feel is fair which turns out to be not. The case she wanted four hundred for the full day but I wasn't willing to give her that, so I was planning on giving her two hundred and we agreed on two fifty and then she tried to get another fifty which I denied will not see her again.

The next one is renata who is a thirty two year old attorney all natural, paid $200 usd, totally a traditional date with sex at the end all covered, no anal, speaks perfect English. Fun to be with, but sex was not worth it. If I could convince her that I was s. T. the free and away to figure out how she could not worry about getting pregnant. She might end up going bareback.

Last night saw Cris, another thirty something professional that speaks perfect english this one did everything bare including CIM.

In s p I might have paid a little bit more, but it was worth it for me.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Orgasmomo;2968290]What is SP?[/QUOTE]Sao Paulo Brazil. Heaven on earth for the girl buffet.And I know this is the Seeking thread but as a man if u dont visit Scandallo with its luxe environment and 200 girls for hire u def have missed a life experience. Its not cheap but it is the most amazing girls buffet on planet earth.

Did seeking get rid of them?

Wanted to share this here in hopes of others helping me report this scammer enough to get her booted off the site. She tried to rinse and scam me earlier this year and the kicker is that she doesn't even remember. Claimed she was brand new to the site but I still had her contact saved. Before, she claimed she was single and about to give birth and that the father of the kid had passed. Insisted Canada's public services weren't enough LOL. Even had the audacity to give me her door dash log in to order things. Fuck that.

Fast forward to today and she has a different sob story and the dad of the kid is alive and well just "not involved" after 10 years LOL. So I call her out on her shit. She says that's not her. I just point out then how tf did I know her name and already have her number and she plays dumb. I'm so sick of these clowns and seeking taking our money and doing nothing about it. Beware.

[URL]https://members.seeking.com/member/ddfe0512-1fba-409b-adbe-62d9aeface12[/URL]

[QUOTE=WaltoDerri;2968532]Did seeking get rid of them?[/QUOTE]No, they still have them. But generally only display them AFTER your membership expires, in an effort to get you to rejoin.

The very desirable ones are snatched up quick. Make no mistake, there are whales out there that anipe the most desirable girls and they are gone as fast as they showed up. Years ago, I met two absolute stunners in (person) with brains on top of that. Unfortunately I met them just before a two week overseas. They came to my gorgeous house, saw my car, saw I was legit, we discussed terms with the only caveat being I couldn't see them regularly until I got back. Guess what, ghost town when I got back. I had them at my house, they are obviously interested but I'm some weird stupid way that only makes sense in my mind, I decided not to bang them on the spot as they were definitely open for business.

It occurred to me later that I had just given them 2 weeks to do better than me and apparently they did. Once consolation is that I did see one of them months later on seeking again and we did end up in a 9 mo arrangement but the one that got away was an absolute stunner. I hate myself to this day for letting her slip out of my fingers.

[QUOTE=WaltoDerri;2967722]This, especially with women who log in once every few months. If she ever logs back on at all. I've seen quite a few who would I have absolutely loved to keep around and they haven't been on in months or years.[/QUOTE]

So a few months back before trip to Poland I signed up for GBC again. I have a very detailed post from my last outing earlier this year. GBC is a sugaring site primarily for Polish girls but there are some stray Germany and Czechs if you're looking close to the border. I didn't re-read my previous post but I suspect the content is roughly equivalent as we're my results.

1) They only recently started taking credit cards again. When I wanted to sign up they would only deal in transfers from a polish bank. Through some ingenious sleuthing and a very helpful ISG menber, I sent him to some money and he opened an account for me. Shout-out mate.

2) The place is crawling with thin to super thin Slavic dolls. IMO the hottest on the planet in looks and just below north west Thai women as a total package (looks and attitude).

3) The place is every bit of a slog as Seeking with the added fun of a language barrier sometimes. I go for early to mid 20's and they all speak and write very good English. I'd say I get a reply about 10% of the time, 5% of those turn into an actual conversation that doesn't involve what I'm prepared to give them and about half of those I actually want to see once I get a pic from them.

4) Catfishing is the norm. Do not believe a single pic you see on the site or a picture they dm you. Insist they send you a pic standing next to some mundane house appliance or multiple fingers held you so you know you're not getting shafted. Serious girls won't care, pros and scammers will be insulted and tell you to fuck off.

5) The serious civies have always asked me to name an amount after we've chatted for a while and established a repoir. I've never been turned down on what I offered. That said, I pay what I pay at home, or almost with currency conversion. I don't care because I'd be paying it at home anyway. I don't go to eastern Europe to bargain in pussy, I go because I love the look of slavic girls. Any teenager from the 80's and early 90's remembers all the supermodels from that time period. Guess what? They're made here! 5'6" 110 lbs is the rule rather than exception, even if their lying theres plenty of margin for her to be extremely hot. The pros will always throw out a number first, generally 500 euros+. I don't do escorts or pros.

6) I generally don't post specifics about dates or girls but I chatted up several, found one I really liked and will probably spend the whole or most of my 12 days with her. Last year I had backups and a back up to a backup in Krakow but I don't feel the need to do that this year because I have a winner early on. I do have two backups for her from before I met her but as long as she shows up the first date I'll ditch the other two. Also have a girl in a remote part of the country with some interesting siteseeing so I'll hook up with her once the goodbyes have been said with girl 1.

7) don't sign up too early. Made the mistake last year and was too stupid not to this year. Nobody takes you seriously more than a month out, maybe two weeks or less. They don't want to waste their time talking to someone to have him disappear. I get it. Next time I'll sign up for a min month membership because I get more action in the last two weeks than the prior 10 weeks combined. There is a gold membership that allows you to contact "model" profiles. Never felt the need to do that. Platinum wmhascworked fine for me.

So in short, the place is still a good mine and just like a gold mine it's a fuck ton of work to get a nugget of any value. Only you can determine if it's worth it to you. For me it's an unequivocal yes!

Happy hunting boys. I may post some exploits later.

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2969059]3) The place is every bit of a slog as Seeking with the added fun of a language barrier sometimes. I go for early to mid 20's and they all speak and write very good English. I'd say I get a reply about 10% of the time, 5% of those turn into an actual conversation that doesn't involve what I'm prepared to give them and about half of those I actually want to see once I get a pic from them.

4) Catfishing is the norm. Do not believe a single pic you see on the site or a picture they dm you. Insist they send you a pic standing next to some mundane house appliance or multiple fingers held you so you know you're not getting shafted. Serious girls won't care, pros and scammers will be insulted and tell you to fuck off..[/QUOTE]Ah so you made it out there!

Hope you have more luck than I did. I'm used to going to places where I can stack girls on different days. Poland for me was a slog just trying to get one girl worth the effort. There just isn't a huge sugar culture there.

Your approach of bagging one winner for 12 days might be the super smart play. Well done.

Keep sharing your exploits dude. Eager readers want to hear.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2969026]No, they still have them. But generally only display them AFTER your membership expires, in an effort to get you to rejoin.[/QUOTE]I wonder if only certain people get them. My membership has been expired for like 3 months. I have a stack of 90 dollar prepaid cards I have for this purpose and now I can't use them. I used to google promo codes and use the main one and now that doesn't work anymore.

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2969052]The very desirable ones are snatched up quick. .... They came to my gorgeous house, saw my car, saw I was legit, we discussed terms with the only caveat being I couldn't see them regularly until I got back. ... I had them at my house, they are obviously interested but I'm some weird stupid way that only makes sense in my mind, I decided not to bang them on the spot as they were definitely open for business.
[/QUOTE]If you have a gorgeous house they saw I am sure their fuck price quoted to you doubled.

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2969059]So a few months back before trip to Poland I signed up for GBC again. I have a very detailed post from my last outing earlier this year. GBC is a sugaring site primarily for Polish girls but there are some stray Germany and Czechs if you're looking close to the border. I didn't re-read my previous post but I suspect the content is roughly equivalent as we're my results.

1) They only recently started taking credit cards again. When I wanted to sign up they would only deal in transfers from a polish bank. Through some ingenious sleuthing and a very helpful ISG menber, I sent him to some money and he opened an account for me. Shout-out mate..[/QUOTE]I scored there too via seeking and luckily via reddit also. Awesome looks and for 1000 euro they stay for entire weekend.

How much you are splurging on her per day or entire trip .

How much do you pay at home?

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2969059]So a few months back before trip to Poland I signed up for GBC again. I have a very detailed post from my last outing earlier this year. GBC is a sugaring site primarily for Polish girls but there are some stray Germany and Czechs if you're looking close to the border. I didn't re-read my previous post but I suspect the content is roughly equivalent as we're my results.

1) They only recently started taking credit cards again. When I wanted to sign up they would only deal in transfers from a polish bank. Through some ingenious sleuthing and a very helpful ISG menber, I sent him to some money and he opened an account for me. Shout-out mate.

2) The place is crawling with thin to super thin Slavic dolls. IMO the hottest on the planet in looks and just below north west Thai women as a total package (looks and attitude).

3) The place is every bit of a slog as Seeking with the added fun of a language barrier sometimes. I go for early to mid 20's and they all speak and write very good English. I'd say I get a reply about 10% of the time, 5% of those turn into an actual conversation that doesn't involve what I'm prepared to give them and about half of those I actually want to see once I get a pic from them.

4) Catfishing is the norm. Do not believe a single pic you see on the site or a picture they dm you. Insist they send you a pic standing next to some mundane house appliance or multiple fingers held you so you know you're not getting shafted. Serious girls won't care, pros and scammers will be insulted and tell you to fuck off.

5) The serious civies have always asked me to name an amount after we've chatted for a while and established a repoir. I've never been turned down on what I offered. That said, I pay what I pay at home, or almost with currency conversion. I don't care because I'd be paying it at home anyway. I don't go to eastern Europe to bargain in pussy, I go because I love the look of slavic girls. Any teenager from the 80's and early 90's remembers all the supermodels from that time period. Guess what? They're made here! 5'6" 110 lbs is the rule rather than exception, even if their lying theres plenty of margin for her to be extremely hot. The pros will always throw out a number first, generally 500 euros+. I don't do escorts or pros..[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2969026]No, they still have them. But generally only display them AFTER your membership expires, in an effort to get you to rejoin.[/QUOTE]It seems the offers only come via email or a pop up advertisement that shows every now and again. Even when I click, the discount did not apply as they usually do. I emailed support and have yet to receive a response as I ended up being charged a full amount. At the very least I found a local cutie who looked even better in person and was so into it that she spent the night and I got 2 rounds out of her. Guess I'm ending the year on a good note.

You found the BA girl on SA? In BA I've had good luck with the XP sites, never really got around to trying SA. It would be great if there were an active Argentina forum to share info.

[QUOTE=Jbj64;2962552]Last day of a 5 week trip, started in BA and ending in SP.

I only had 1 girl in BA because I found a gem on the first date.

Guili, 33 why. O fake blonde, all natural tits. I kept going back to her because I felt the price was fair a one hundred dollar bill for 2 hours.

She does BBBJ, bb anal BUT covered in pussy, afraid of babies. She also does CIM, great attitude, does golden showers too, not on her face. Saw her five times in three weeks, will probably fly her somewhere to meet for vacation.

I went to Rio but did not use seeking. Then I went on to SP, have seen 3 ladies here, all in early 30's.

Mary was first, when I asked her how much she wanted. She just said whatever I feel is fair which turns out to be not. The case she wanted four hundred for the full day but I wasn't willing to give her that, so I was planning on giving her two hundred and we agreed on two fifty and then she tried to get another fifty which I denied will not see her again.

The next one is renata who is a thirty two year old attorney all natural, paid $200 usd, totally a traditional date with sex at the end all covered, no anal, speaks perfect English. Fun to be with, but sex was not worth it. If I could convince her that I was s. T. the free and away to figure out how she could not worry about getting pregnant. She might end up going bareback.

Last night saw Cris, another thirty something professional that speaks perfect english this one did everything bare including CIM.

In s p I might have paid a little bit more, but it was worth it for me.[/QUOTE]

The serious ones want to know a number before they waste their time meeting you. They commit long term as soon as they see you have the means.

[QUOTE=HumbleHal;2969310]If you have a gorgeous house they saw I am sure their fuck price quoted to you doubled.[/QUOTE]

That sounds about right but as everything else in life, it depends. 1 kusd for 3 to 4 days is hard to turn down by a student. I was quoted 1 k zl ($250) by a second or third teir girl by looks, not interested. I generally say something to the effect of "I don't like to set expectations because someone almost always ends up disappointed but I usually provide x for a dinner date or sightseeing and if we head back to my place there would be something extra, maybe 2 x" works a lot because they don't want to commit to bedding some fat slob they've known for 5 min once they've met you.

The direct answer to your question is somewhere between 1500 and 300 usd depending on 1) how hot they are, 2) our vibe and personality connection, 3) how horny I am, 4) if I see long term potential and want to impress her and 5) when I'm on a trip and behind on my self imposed pussy quotient.

[QUOTE=Laj505;2969364]I scored there too via seeking and luckily via reddit also. Awesome looks and for 1000 euro they stay for entire weekend.

How much you are splurging on her per day or entire trip .[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=DwayneJohnson;2960688] ... I wonder how expensive would be seeking thing in Zurich? ... Thanks in advance for any inputs.[/QUOTE]I found Zurich to be among the most expensive anywhere. 1 k euro ask. Selection is limited. This was 2 years ago.

[QUOTE=TropicanGeorge;2969551] In BA I've had good luck with the XP sites, never really got around to trying SA. It would be great if there were an active Argentina forum to share info.[/QUOTE]Which XP site did you use: ArgentinaXP? EscortsXP?

SA was ok for me in BAires. 200-300 usd, 19-24 yo, mostly non-pros, good energetic sex.

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2969713]I found Zurich to be among the most expensive anywhere. 1 k euro ask. Selection is limited. This was 2 years ago.[/QUOTE]Thanks. Selection seems better than Nordic region on just window shopping.

I hit the absolute freaking jackpot. 5'8" 115. Total stunner. I'm re-reading our dms to try to figure out how it happened but I'm at a total loss. It started horribly, she said she didn't speak English, only wanted to meet for sex (deal-breaker for me as I like dates) zero commitment until I rolled into her town and proposed a day. No mention of money at all. Every one of those is a red flag for a no show but she showed and blew my doors off. Total Slavic babe if I've ever seen one and I consider myself a connoisseur.

Night 1 was wine, tons of talking (English is more than passible if not fully proficient, she's just a little self conscious). Mind blowing sex.

Night 2 was more wine and talking, mind blowing sex, and another 6 hrs of talking with maybe 2 hrs of sleep in between. Plus discussions about meeting for activities in town and staying together for the rest of my trip. I must have been a very good boy this year because Santa has done me a total solid. All the BS I went through to meet her was 1000% worth it. Don't ever give up, it is very possible to bat out of your league, I am exhibit A.

Merry Christmas boys, mine certainly will be. Nothing better than clicking with someone half your age that everybody stares at when you're walking together.

FB.

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2969195]Ah so you made it out there!

Hope you have more luck than I did. I'm used to going to places where I can stack girls on different days. Poland for me was a slog just trying to get one girl worth the effort. There just isn't a huge sugar culture there.

Your approach of bagging one winner for 12 days might be the super smart play. Well done.

Keep sharing your exploits dude. Eager readers want to hear.[/QUOTE]

Just met a 19 year old girl last night who had been told "by a doctor that he would pay her $800 each meeting". So she thought $800 was her value. Of course he lived an hour + away and I asked if they had met in person and she did not answer.

She was slim and dark skinned, I had offered her $250 and that is my starting point. Most women want to get a $$ amount from us before they will agree to meet, and it probably is best not to respond, since its like renting an apartment you have not even seen in person. Most of these women are just flattering themselves and want the highest amount of money without any connection. Wondering what you guys say to women who want to know "if we are on the same page" "so we do not waste each others time".

She looked amazing, slim and pretty in person. A black barbie doll in person. Of course she was a real pain in the ass, constant whiner and complainer. After dinner I took her to my home and tried to fuck her but she complained she was tired and wanted a nap, promised to have sex at 2 am. I woke her up at 2 am and she came to my bed and took her clothes off, but was a constant complainer in bed. I did get Mr. Happy wet, but her attitude was bad and I did not cum. I told her I would take her home and swing by the ATM for her 250. Fortunately the ATM denied my withdrawal, I had already taken out my withdrawal limit that day! So I let her view the screen and took her home. Will never see that whiner again, thank God.

Normally I try not to respond with any $$ amount, however most girls are relentless in wanting to know what I offer based only upon a few photos, which may not be current or accurate, and their profile. I say I do not know until I meet them in a restaurant, because there are fake photos and old photo of slim when fat, and I must see if we like each other / feel a connection. But some are just trying to screen out the Cheap Charlies and go for the highest bidder, who in reality may try to down price after meeting. Often they try to pick the restaurant and pick an expensive restaurant to see if $$$ is there for their taking. Women are conniving and want the most money while putting out the least, they are not stupid.

I would have cut it at the first whine. I pay them so I don't have ro listen to that shit. And leave.

[QUOTE=NeilGeorge;2970691]Just met a 19 year old girl last night who had been told "by a doctor that he would pay her $800 each meeting". So she thought $800 was her value. Of course he lived an hour + away and I asked if they had met in person and she did not answer.

She was slim and dark skinned, I had offered her $250 and that is my starting point. Most women want to get a $$ amount from us before they will agree to meet, and it probably is best not to respond, since its like renting an apartment you have not even seen in person. Most of these women are just flattering themselves and want the highest amount of money without any connection. Wondering what you guys say to women who want to know "if we are on the same page" "so we do not waste each others time".

She looked amazing, slim and pretty in person. A black barbie doll in person. Of course she was a real pain in the ass, constant whiner and complainer. After dinner I took her to my home and tried to fuck her but she complained she was tired and wanted a nap, promised to have sex at 2 am. I woke her up at 2 am and she came to my bed and took her clothes off, but was a constant complainer in bed. I did get Mr. Happy wet, but her attitude was bad and I did not cum. I told her I would take her home and swing by the ATM for her 250. Fortunately the ATM denied my withdrawal, I had already taken out my withdrawal limit that day! So I let her view the screen and took her home. Will never see that whiner again, thank God.

Normally I try not to respond with any $$ amount, however most girls are relentless in wanting to know what I offer based only upon a few photos, which may not be current or accurate, and their profile. I say I do not know until I meet them in a restaurant, because there are fake photos and old photo of slim when fat, and I must see if we like each other / feel a connection. But some are just trying to screen out the Cheap Charlies and go for the highest bidder, who in reality may try to down price after meeting. Often they try to pick the restaurant and pick an expensive restaurant to see if $$$ is there for their taking. Women are conniving and want the most money while putting out the least, they are not stupid.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=NeilGeorge;2970691]Just met a 19 year old girl last night who had been told "by a doctor that he would pay her $800 each meeting". So she thought $800 was her value. Of course he lived an hour + away and I asked if they had met in person and she did not answer.

She was slim and dark skinned, I had offered her $250 and that is my starting point. Most women want to get a $$ amount from us before they will agree to meet, and it probably is best not to respond, since its like renting an apartment you have not even seen in person. Most of these women are just flattering themselves and want the highest amount of money without any connection. Wondering what you guys say to women who want to know "if we are on the same page" "so we do not waste each others time".

She looked amazing, slim and pretty in person. A black barbie doll in person. Of course she was a real pain in the ass, constant whiner and complainer. After dinner I took her to my home and tried to fuck her but she complained she was tired and wanted a nap, promised to have sex at 2 am. I woke her up at 2 am and she came to my bed and took her clothes off, but was a constant complainer in bed. I did get Mr. Happy wet, but her attitude was bad and I did not cum. I told her I would take her home and swing by the ATM for her 250. Fortunately the ATM denied my withdrawal, I had already taken out my withdrawal limit that day! So I let her view the screen and took her home. Will never see that whiner again, thank God.

Normally I try not to respond with any $$ amount, however most girls are relentless in wanting to know what I offer based only upon a few photos, which may not be current or accurate, and their profile. I say I do not know until I meet them in a restaurant, because there are fake photos and old photo of slim when fat, and I must see if we like each other / feel a connection. But some are just trying to screen out the Cheap Charlies and go for the highest bidder, who in reality may try to down price after meeting. Often they try to pick the restaurant and pick an expensive restaurant to see if $$$ is there for their taking. Women are conniving and want the most money while putting out the least, they are not stupid.[/QUOTE]So she didn't get paid the agreed amount, and she knows your address? Sounds like a high risk situation. Just out of curiosity, how long was it between the time she fell asleep and 2 AM?

On a slightly unrelated note, a psychologist recent published a book called "The Value of Others. " While not everything he describes can be cited in scientific studies, much of it can be proven by 1st hand experience. He makes the assertion that essentially by nature, all women have prostitute tendencies, and the only thing that makes street hookers different is that they do not necessarily desire commitment from a particular man. And men in turn trade resources for sexual opportunity. And the only aspect "ethical society" concurs with him, is that there's nothing wrong with a man offering a lifetime commitment to a specific woman. And all "moralist" attempt to deny that women trade sex for money in some capacity, even if it is under the guise of being less direct.

While I don't agree with the entire book, I agree with much of it. Look at biology. Even if you did happen to be an exception to the rule. Let's say you were one of those rare women who genetics meant you were born more muscular and had more stamina than most men of the tribe. Even if that were true, would it really make sense for you to be running around the jungle trying to shoot arrows at monkeys if you were 6 months pregnant? We all know that a huge belly and morning sickness are not conducive to hunting in the jungle while trying to wield a bow! And even if you were not pregnant, a quarter of the month you are going to be on your menstrual cycle, which means you can be tracked in the forest by potential predators due to smell of your blood. And what happens after birth? You are sitting by the camp fire, breast feeding your baby. Does this really sound like the better of the 2 genders to pick up a weapon and go out to accomplish physical tasks? If you believe that women are more suited to raising a child, then it's hard to argue with his point. The men are the ones who bring the meat back to the family, and they are the ones who request sex.

But now we live in the modern era. And I'd be the first person to say that the church / religious extremist were the ones who originally vilified prostitution centuries ago, and the general public was never able to refute that vilification. Even if we live in 2025, what happens to the ambitious woman who heads to a University when she is 20? Okay, maybe she's graduated by the time she is 30, probably with a lot of student debt. And maybe by 35 she is established with her career. Okay, and how does the 35 year old compete with the 19 year old girl in terms of beauty and fertility? Whereas the reserve is much easier to accomplish. A woman can always go back to school and advance her professional life when she is 40, but it's too late to turn back the physical clock at this point, which is what men desire. But any person or group out there who preaches to never judge a book by its cover is always going to attempt to downplay all this, without looking at the facts.

I'm not saying that "feminists" are wrong, or that women should go back to being housewives. I'm just saying he makes some very interesting points. I'd say it's a good read / listen if you're interested in the unpopular opinion about the modern dating market.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2970782]So she didn't get paid the agreed amount, and she knows your address? Sounds like a high risk situation. Just out of curiosity, how long was it between the time she fell asleep and 2 AM?

On a slightly unrelated note, a psychologist recent published a book called "The Value of Others. " While not everything he describes can be cited in scientific studies, much of it can be proven by 1st hand experience. He makes the assertion that essentially by nature, all women have prostitute tendencies, and the only thing that makes street hookers different is that they do not necessarily desire commitment from a particular man. And men in turn trade resources for sexual opportunity. And the only aspect "ethical society" concurs with him, is that there's nothing wrong with a man offering a lifetime commitment to a specific woman. And all "moralist" attempt to deny that women trade sex for money in some capacity, even if it is under the guise of being less direct.

While I don't agree with the entire book, I agree with much of it. Look at biology. Even if you did happen to be an exception to the rule. Let's say you were one of those rare women who genetics meant you were born more muscular and had more stamina than most men of the tribe. Even if that were true, would it really make sense for you to be running around the jungle trying to shoot arrows at monkeys if you were 6 months pregnant? We all know that a huge belly and morning sickness are not conducive to hunting in the jungle while trying to wield a bow! And even if you were not pregnant, a quarter of the month you are going to be on your menstrual cycle, which means you can be tracked in the forest by potential predators due to smell of your blood. And what happens after birth? You are sitting by the camp fire, breast feeding your baby. Does this really sound like the better of the 2 genders to pick up a weapon and go out to accomplish physical tasks? If you believe that women are more suited to raising a child, then it's hard to argue with his point. The men are the ones who bring the meat back to the family, and they are the ones who request sex.

But now we live in the modern era. And I'd be the first person to say that the church / religious extremist were the ones who originally vilified prostitution centuries ago, and the general public was never able to refute that vilification. Even if we live in 2025, what happens to the ambitious woman who heads to a University when she is 20? Okay, maybe she's graduated by the time she is 30, probably with a lot of student debt. And maybe by 35 she is established with her career. Okay, and how does the 35 year old compete with the 19 year old girl in terms of beauty and fertility? Whereas the reserve is much easier to accomplish. A woman can always go back to school and advance her professional life when she is 40, but it's too late to turn back the physical clock at this point, which is what men desire. But any person or group out there who preaches to never judge a book by its cover is always going to attempt to downplay all this, without looking at the facts.

I'm not saying that "feminists" are wrong, or that women should go back to being housewives. I'm just saying he makes some very interesting points. I'd say it's a good read / listen if you're interested in the unpopular opinion about the modern dating market.[/QUOTE]So you missed the main point, Vanessa, and now Hal is supposed to answer your off-point questions? Why do your questions matter?

Issue One: If the guy penetrates the woman's oral cavity and vaginal cavity but does not achieve orgasm, that is not "to his completion. " So has the bilateral contract been fulfilled? I would argue, no. Completed sex for the male means orgasm and ejaculation of the cum guz. The woman did not perform sufficiently on her part so Mr. George could get his rocks off. It's called "partial performance", not complete performance. And unless the contract obligation of one party has been fully performed, the wench is not entitled to her financial reward. Now in a court of equity partial performance could be called substantial performance. But you would need to take the matter to a Court of Equity and then all you would get would be an opinion, which could be reversed on appeal. So who gives a shit? The ***** got nothing and Mr. George felt that was sufficient.

Issue Two: Mr. George took her to his house. That suggests he was driving. So the wench probably did not pay attention to the directions or location. Mr. George also took her home. Does he indicate in his play by play that, at any time, he was afraid of the wench? She was only 19 years old and he is a grown ass man. There was no fighting at the ATM nor did the teen queen protest not being paid, it appears she accepted her pennyless reward as her fate for poor performance. So all is well in Dickland. And I would rather read a book like "Mary had a little lamb" than some shrink idiot in an ivory tower who says we should Value Others. The man has to value his Mr. Happy and be true to Dick.

So this is for gold bikini club in general followed by a small anecdote on my situation.

I contacted no less than 100 women over the last three months (90 day subscription). Dead space for the first two months easy. Maybe 3 contacts, 1 or 2 semi interesting, none to my standards. T-30 comms start rolling in. Mostly time wasters but discussions get more serious, date, time, expectations, etc. Two weeks in the serious ones start to make contact. Mostly pros which I am not into but hey, it's practice for the big game. T-7 days and less, the non-pros are starting to convince themselves this might work for them. That's when you strike. Propose amazing dinner, drinks, something exclusive or expensive they wouldn't normally go to, basically whatever some 22 yr old dude can't offer her and it's on! Met my trip partner on T-0 (yes, day of and no commitment before that). She is engaging, gorgeous, sweet, and humble in the very best sense of the word. Appreciative of everything. Spent every day together before Christmas and will spend every day together until I leave. This is what sugaring is all about and I blew this one out. Results car better than last year.

I've got one surprise after another once we reach civilization again and she's going to blow her mind. So fucking happy this worked out I don't have the words.

I've said it before, THIS IS WORK, but God damn if it doesn't pay off with lots of patience and a little bank. You only live once and you're not getting any younger so spend it!

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2969716]Which XP site did you use: ArgentinaXP? EscortsXP?

SA was ok for me in BAires. 200-300 usd, 19-24 yo, mostly non-pros, good energetic sex.[/QUOTE]To clarify, SA was ok in BAires around two years ago. On a more recent brief visit it seemed worse. Fewer girls, more pros. Having escort site backups would be a good idea.

[QUOTE=DwayneJohnson;2969718]Thanks. Selection seems better than Nordic region on just window shopping.[/QUOTE]Selection in Zurich might be worse than it looks because many girls are not local, based on login location.

Re Nordic, I only did sugar dating there once. Super hot profiles were scams, and I mean elaborate multiday scams, even with video calls. Amazing, actually! There were a few average looking Scandi girls, and they were picky, expensive and not easy to meet. I only met one. Drinks felt like a real date in that if I said the wrong thing, she would've left because she didn't really need the money. A Tinder element to it. Sex was very good.

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2970846]So this is for gold bikini club in general [/QUOTE] I'm happy for you! Report would be more useful for us with some details. Good bars, lounges and restaurants for dates in Warsaw, Krakow etc? How much are you paying per day and approximately how old is she? How is gold bikini better than SA?

[URL]https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Michelin-starred_restaurants_in_Poland[/URL]

Eaten at 5, you want to impress a 24 yr old, this is a no brainer. Rozbrat 20 is by far my favorite. But there are fine tasting menus all over the country without the stars. Not at all hard to find. One in Krakow (not on this list) was excessively long and I said something to the maitre'd) but no complaints orherwise. We've discussed finding some rooftop bars but as we're not in her city we've decided that coming back to bone is a far better use of our time plus I'm old enough now that alcohol can be a real drag on little beaver if I'm not careful.

You probably won't believe me but price rarely comes up with a civie. They usually ask me to propose a number and I've never been turned down. 500 is my usual, subject to vibe and my spidey uncertainty sense. This girl has never asked for anything I just give it to her and not everyday but I'd say we spend at least 4-500/ day on activities, food, shopping, whatever. I did rent a hell of a car that she loves driving and costs us 100/ day to fill up so that's in that number too.

Again, this isn't rocket science. Be a nice guy, polite, don't bring up whatever fucked up kinks you have in the first 3 minutes, be willing to spend money, even better if it's stuff you like to do anyway and I swear you will never "date" someone anywhere near your age ever again.

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2971092]I'm happy for you! Report would be more useful for us with some details. Good bars, lounges and restaurants for dates in Warsaw, Krakow etc? How much are you paying per day and approximately how old is she? How is gold bikini better than SA?[/QUOTE]

Lot to unpack here.

First, in the seeking game, black chicks, go for less. I'm not saying that's how it should be. I'm sure there's some reason it's tied to systemic racism and what not. But it's true. And it's also true that the lighter skinned the girls, the more she is cocoa than dark chocolate, the more she can command. 800 is a lot for a black chick.

Second, taking a girl to your home is a bad idea. As I've said many times on here, the girls who end up on the site or not the most normal. Many are one trigger away from a psychotic move. That was just not smart.

Third, someone saying they are tired, but wake me up at 2 AM for sex is not a red flag. It's like a three alarm fire going off. Nothing good will come from that.

[QUOTE=NeilGeorge;2970691]Just met a 19 year old girl last night who had been told "by a doctor that he would pay her $800 each meeting". So she thought $800 was her value. Of course he lived an hour + away and I asked if they had met in person and she did not answer.

She was slim and dark skinned, I had offered her $250 and that is my starting point. Most women want to get a $$ amount from us before they will agree to meet, and it probably is best not to respond, since its like renting an apartment you have not even seen in person. Most of these women are just flattering themselves and want the highest amount of money without any connection. Wondering what you guys say to women who want to know "if we are on the same page" "so we do not waste each others time".

She looked amazing, slim and pretty in person. A black barbie doll in person. Of course she was a real pain in the ass, constant whiner and complainer..[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2971262]Lot to unpack here.

First, in the seeking game, black chicks, go for less. I'm not saying that's how it should be. I'm sure there's some reason it's tied to systemic racism and what not. But it's true. And it's also true that the lighter skinned the girls, the more she is cocoa than dark chocolate, the more she can command. 800 is a lot for a black chick.

Second, taking a girl to your home is a bad idea. As I've said many times on here, the girls who end up on the site or not the most normal. Many are one trigger away from a psychotic move. That was just not smart.

Third, someone saying they are tired, but wake me up at 2 AM for sex is not a red flag. It's like a three alarm fire going off. Nothing good will come from that.[/QUOTE]Fourth. Sticking your dick in any orifice and then not paying her is not cool IMO. Of course not full price but damn. That’s cold.

Thanks for the great reports FB. I love reading your antics along with Lshoomer, Pi, and other regulars. Seems like some guys just bop in here to editorialize or troll with controversial opinions. A shout out to the real Seeking patriots. Out there running the game, fucking the hotties, and bringing back the stories!

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2971275]Thanks for the great reports FB. I love reading your antics along with Lshoomer, Pi, and other regulars. Seems like some guys just bop in here to editorialize or troll with controversial opinions. A shout out to the real Seeking patriots. Out there running the game, fucking the hotties, and bringing back the stories![/QUOTE]Well said, I'm not here for the politics either. I want actionable information or at least a good story (with pictures!

Well this being the sugar section, maybe not pictures.

So out of curiosity, I'm on Seeking and SDM, and I'm finding there are usually a lot of new ladies (or at least aren't hanging around for long) on these sites this month. Anybody finding the same?

Personally I found a lot of new faces on all though November, but December has been kind of slow.

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2971066]To clarify, SA was ok in BAires around two years ago. On a more recent brief visit it seemed worse. Fewer girls, more pros. Having escort site backups would be a good idea.[/QUOTE]Just returned from BA and it was an absolute goldmine for me. Real GND hotties, 21-24 yrs old, extremely friendly and cheerful and an all round great time, 120-150 USD per meet, with meets being quite easy to set up. I was really surprised by the warmth and friendliness of Argentines in general. Great city.

Feedback from a master like you is the highest form of compliment here. I couldn't care less what others pay, don't pay, lie, don't lie about their antics. I'm not the creative Penthouse forum author that you are but when I say I have incredible sex and she blows my doors off you can fill in your own 2 or 3 pager. I don't know how the sugaring world was surviving before the internet but I am damn glad I'm this age, at this time, in this world. To think we be collapsing into each other's arms every night for a week plus with no breath, sore and aching muscles and a grin from ear to ear is just not possible to put into words. This girl is quite literally half my age and a total stunner who knows it and owns it. So much fun in public.

And to those of you that want to learn, practice, practice, practice. Plenty of us have given actionable game plans and huge head starts. It costs money and common sense. That's it. Haters go make some more money and come back when you can beat out a Steve story. I'm no catch, fit but short, some ethnic features that some Caucasian girls wouldn't look at twice, graying since my twenties but salt and pepper on top with a bit of receding receding hairline these days and I walk into a very high end sushi place most if you would recognize the other day and the whole place (including the entire open kitchen staff) stops dead in it's tracks watching us walk through the entire restaurant all the way to the very back. And sit not across from each other but side by side. Those that judge get a well placed eye rub with my middle finger, those that smile get a wink and maybe a nod. Great fuckin fun! I do dress appropriately, stay in the nicest hotels and make damn sure she knows we can do just about whatever we want. The power is right here, you have them as soon as they see this stuff. You don't even have to open your mouth.

I can't imagine doing any better than this in the future so I'm claiming expert status now. All the bitching & whinning about how much work sugaring is has been damn worth the time.

Also, as we've gotten closer I've picked up a few tools of the trade and what goes through the mind of a mindblowingly hot girl looking for some sugar. So as to not give away my exactly location or out myself, I will probably post them in a few months.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2971275]Thanks for the great reports FB. I love reading your antics along with Lshoomer, Pi, and other regulars. Seems like some guys just bop in here to editorialize or troll with controversial opinions. A shout out to the real Seeking patriots. Out there running the game, fucking the hotties, and bringing back the stories![/QUOTE]

The desirable ones get sniped by whales or snipe themselves and they're off the market quick. It's happened to all of us whether we know it or not. I had a trophy of a girl disappear and reappear about 9 months later at which time I found out that she was hands down the best lay in my life. Our anatomical features complimented each other perfectly.

The few weeks before Christmas is usually the best because they're looking for Christmas money to spent on their friends and family. I'd have to know a lot more to guess at why your situation was untenable.

That said, I am very disappointed with seeking quality these days. Tattoos, nose piercings that make them look like the Borden cow (yes I'm that old), grungy looks that you just can't take on an upper class date).

[QUOTE=BerolLoz;2971279]Well said, I'm not here for the politics either. I want actionable information or at least a good story (with pictures!

Well this being the sugar section, maybe not pictures.

So out of curiosity, I'm on Seeking and SDM, and I'm finding there are usually a lot of new ladies (or at least aren't hanging around for long) on these sites this month. Anybody finding the same?

Personally I found a lot of new faces on all though November, but December has been kind of slow.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=HumbleHal;2961349]Try [url=https://www.sugardaddymeet.com/?tid=af100011222-m]SugarDaddyMeet.com[/url] its much cheaper and about the same, and they do not kick you off for negotiating price on the site.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2961488]Yeah but how's the database? Are there a lot of girls who will join Seeking but not SDM?[/QUOTE]It's smaller. Seeking is the name brand for sugar dating and the best choice if you go outside North America. That said, many girls post on both Seeking and SDM; some just post on one.

Besides the cost, the other advantage SDM has is they're fine with you talking about PPM or money matters with the girls.

The problem Seeking has is its high profile, so they want to be really careful the kinds of people who went after Backpage a few years ago don't look in their direction. SDM is (I think) based in Canada and keeps a lower profile. I hope!

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2971343]

Haters go make some more money and come back when you can beat out a Steve story.
. All the bitching & whinning about how much work sugaring is has been damn worth the time.
[/QUOTE]This. Totally.

If you would have told me, this would be what I would be doing my 40's I'the never believe you. Never. Banging girls I was too old to bang when I left college? No way.

This little hobby probably costs me 5 a year in allowance and 20 all in with these fake little work trips that I take. And there is very little I would change about it. It's honestly the best money I spent. It directly accrues to to my happiness. And if I did it more It probably wouldn't be aa special. And if I did regular dating girls my age I'the be lusting after the 23 year old. This is just plain good for me.

[QUOTE=BerolLoz;2971354]It's smaller.![/QUOTE]Other great thing is fewer obvious bots and scammers on SDM.

[QUOTE=NeilGeorge;2970691] told "by a doctor that he would pay her $800 each meeting". So she thought $800 was her value. .
...
Wondering what you guys say to women who want to know "if we are on the same page" "so we do not waste each others time".
...
she complained she was tired and wanted a nap
...
Fortunately the ATM denied my withdrawal
...
[/QUOTE]There possibly was no doctor, it's just her way to ask for 800.

On the other hand, I once met a girl who wanted approx 3 k, converted to usd. Eventually we met for around 300 because she had bills due. But to meet again, she wouldn't go below 1. 2 k. Said she'd only had one sugar date and that rich old guy did pay her $3 k. Given the location and the girl's style, I think she was telling the truth.

If I hear "on the same page" or any similar language, I tend to block and ghost on the spot. These are professional SBs, which feel like escorts except sex is worse.

As soon as she complained, I would have offered her a ride home, without ppm of course. If a new girl is in my room at night, whether sugar or vanilla, and she isn't in the mood, I usually ask her to leave and maybe meet another day.

In your place, I would have still venmo'ed her something. 5 minutes of lame sex at 2 am doesn't deserve the full ppm but zero would feel unfair to me. I've run into this too, also with a Black girl, I regret to mention. They ask to get room service, then "get tired" and try to short you on sex. Maybe they've all read that Hoe Tactics book. Girls who play this game also tend to ask for their money upfront, in which case I offer and prefer to send them home right away.

Anyone had any relatively recent experiences using Seeking in Brazil? I'm currently talking to a girl from So Paulo just by chance on the site. It might be nice to meet her when I'm down next (early 2025) if she proves to be "real" and not just another scammer.

I absolutely adore the Seeking game, despite all its flaws. It is totally worth the trouble. But I also enjoy the girl buffet and picking from many hotties at a club and enjoying time together. This trip to Brazil was the best of my entire girls-career, with 15 girls in 8 days, including an amazing Seeking "girlfriend" who I found in 2023 and have repeated four times with including traveling her.

Feel free to skip this slightly OT read if it's not your thing but I would suggest any man with a dick find his way to Brazil. It truly cannot be beat for passionate women and a target rich environment.

[URL]http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?2204-Sao-Paulo-Reports&p=2971446&viewfull=1[/URL]#post2971446.

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2969601] ... I usually provide x for a dinner date or sightseeing and if we head back to my place there would be something extra, maybe 2 x ... [/QUOTE]

Thanks for being so candid about your looks, age etc in your earlier post: lots of respect to guys who succeed in using SA to date out of their league.

I didn't quite understand what you said above. Do you mean you offer money for a dinner date or sightseeing only, ie for platonic dates? I can see how this would filter out escorts, who want to make $250 / HR and don't mind the sex part. But won't this offer attract girls who just want to collect the $250 and have no intention of being intimate with you? How exactly does it work: you do dinner or a castle tour, then you give her $250, and then you find out if she wants to head back to your place? I consistently block-ghost girls who ask for such a setup. Your style is very different than mine so I'd like to learn.

Any tips on this fake work trip?

One area I had been struggling with. I am probably being too careful but I am also aware I can do more hotties if I manage to travel, without evoking suspicion, more often.

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2971365]This. Totally.

If you would have told me, this would be what I would be doing my 40's I'the never believe you. Never. Banging girls I was too old to bang when I left college? No way.

This little hobby probably costs me 5 a year in allowance and 20 all in with these fake little work trips that I take. And there is very little I would change about it. It's honestly the best money I spent. It directly accrues to to my happiness. And if I did it more It probably wouldn't be aa special. And if I did regular dating girls my age I'the be lusting after the 23 year old. This is just plain good for me.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Gfefan;2971502]Any tips on this fake work trip?

One area I had been struggling with. I am probably being too careful but I am also aware I can do more hotties if I manage to travel, without evoking suspicion, more often.[/QUOTE]Do you already travel for work? That is prob key. And can U siphon off money to fund the trips without her knowing? Those are the keys. After that you just say you have a trip to xxx and make it happen. Be careful tho about going somewhere different than you say. I have done that a couple times but once it went sideways. Always try to stay as close to the truth as possible.

Another tip is to get away from the company travel system reporting. I used to send her the itinerary straight out of SAP or whatever. But then instead I would send it to myself as rich text and then maybe edit a bit for brevity. Then when I started self funding and booking outside the travel system nothing looked amiss and I could edit little details like number of occupants.

Ps I did the math on self-funded Bangkok, So Paulo, and Europe and it all comes out about the same for a ten day trip. About $5000-6000 USD the way I roll. Yes girls are cheaper in Thailand but not enough to offset the flights. And yes Brasil is cheaper than Europe but not so much at the clubs I go to. FWIW I rank them Brasil, Thailand, Europe. But that wont keep me from going to Europe! Its all good!

[QUOTE=Gfefan;2971502]Any tips on this fake work trip?

One area I had been struggling with. I am probably being too careful but I am also aware I can do more hotties if I manage to travel, without evoking suspicion, more often.[/QUOTE]I'll DM you.

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2970846] Met my trip partner on T-0 (yes, day of and no commitment before that) [/QUOTE]FB, I got a few more questions for you if I may:

1. Do you adjust your travel plans to visit the most promising contacts? Or stick to your itinerary and tell them eg "I'll be in Krakow on December 15, join me for dinner" and hope it happens?

2. Repeating my earlier question: if you offer sugar purely for dinners and day tours, how do you filter out girls who have no intention of having sex with you and just want to be paid for platonic company?

3. Account type MODELKA (model): does that correspond to the most attractive girls?

4. Is it ok to discuss money in the gold bikini chat, unlike SA?

5. Can you exchange photos in the chat or need to move to whatsapp? Did you post your own photo there?

[QUOTE=TheCane;2971449]Anyone had any relatively recent experiences using Seeking in Brazil? [/QUOTE]I met a girl from SA in SP this year. Pretty straight forward. Asked 1500 iirc, agreed to half that, same day meet. Would have been good but not great by Scandy standards, just happened to have the look that I wanted on that day. Some other girls won't go below 300 usd. Not many scams ime. It's a good place to find a girl who speaks English and maybe a "model. " True non-pros are few.

1) First off, I travel for fun. I like history, palaces and castles. I like big regional cities because I can always find something that piques my curious mind. So I book an in and out of country airfare, not necessarily the same airport and get a car for maximum flexibility. Then I'll look at hotels and decide how many days I'll spend in each place. London can be a week, Frankfurt might be a couple days. There is no such thing as a promising contact. Women are women and they'll say one thing today start ovulating tomorrow and you are SOL. Accept it. To mitigate as best I can I try to establish contact and chat her up so she knows, I'm real, have money, and not going to be one of the million flakes that tries to get her for nothing. That works in seeking reasonably ok. In eastern Europe you're just another time waster and lier. I haven't cracked that nut successfully so I get more aggressive with contacts as the trip gets closer. It becomes a straight numbers games. There are VERY few times I've taken a girl out and not had sex. Again, a tasting menu at an expensive restaurant is not something they've ever done and it's just as good as buying them a Mercedes. That said, there are girls I didn't want to bed for whatever reason, attitude chemistry, who knows. I am extremely picky and I can safely say that beside one other member here my standards are impossibly high. I don't want a nut, I want a nut with the hottest girl in the room.

2) if they meet for dinner for money they will have sex. I leave the door open to give myself an out. If she doesn't look like her pics or repulsed me somehow I give her a couple hundred and go home with a clean conscience understanding that she probably needs the 200 more than I do so whatever.

3) Don't know. Only ever had one modal contact me and I wasn't going to pay more to be able to talk to her and get catfished. My guess is they are mostly pros and ask for more that the usually. No thanks to both points from me.

4) Yes but the serious one will be willing to move to telegram or whatsapp fairly quick where they can send you disappearing pics (that buga the holly fuck out of me BTW). I usually dump them when they do that shit.

5) yes, directly from gbc and you can delete it whenever you want as well. I'm not talking profile pics I'm talking private chat pics per your question.

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2971605]FB, I got a few more questions for you if I may:

1. Do you adjust your travel plans to visit the most promising contacts? Or stick to your itinerary and tell them eg "I'll be in Krakow on December 15, join me for dinner" and hope it happens?

2. Repeating my earlier question: if you offer sugar purely for dinners and day tours, how do you filter out girls who have no intention of having sex with you and just want to be paid for platonic company?

3. Account type MODELKA (model): does that correspond to the most attractive girls?

4. Is it ok to discuss money in the gold bikini chat, unlike SA?

5. Can you exchange photos in the chat or need to move to whatsapp? Did you post your own photo there?[/QUOTE]

Thank you! Very informative!

I need to be clear, I have never and will never offer money to someone for a first meet at home. Without exception, everyone who's ever asked at home and still met after I told them no, I wouldn't have banged with your dick and I don't know you.

Overseas I see things a bit different. Time is money. If you roll in hotel stays and airfare, you're easily in the hole 4-500/ day just for the opportunity to probably be let down (at least at the kinds of hotels I stay at). So I play coy knowing my targets are civies that are trying to convince themselves they're not prostitutes rather than engaging actual pros. BTW and for the record sugar babies are not prostitutes in my book and I don't treat them that way, or anyone for that matter. Also, once they've convinced themselves they can do this they ALL want a long term guy to wash themselves of the psychological stigma. Knowing that I can't offer long term I say something like, "Hey I got a reservation at "insert name of some famous expensive place here" but I don't have a date, interested? A hot civie will jump on that like Shaqs dick. Once they see me aa a normal presentable guy with manners and no pressure to do anything, if I'm feeling it I'll ask them to my room and I've never once been told no. Again it's about what I want and I am impossibly picky.

It's not uncommon for me to shell out 1 k as an opening salvo for food, show, drinks, whatever but if I like them the price is reasonable because I know I don't like most of what else is out there.

Now, to sound like a complete asshole, my last three babies were under 26, all taller than me by several inches, model physique, and the sweetest nicest humble girls you'd ever want. I've convinced myself I have a gift and most of it is common sense and some disposable income. It's not too hard to outsmart a girl half your age and to have some disposable income you need to be reasonably intelligent so at the end of the day it really comes down to persistence (putting up with the considerable bullshit on any dating site) being smart enough to not get caught if you're married I'm not), and common sense.

Class dismissed, good luck and keep us posted. I went to a less popular European country to hopefully meet a few hot girls for dates and sex. Ended seeing 1 with little to no chemistry, the second has followed me around the country for the last 7 days and 4 cities, has asked for nothing and fucks me dry nightly as I stare at the walls wondering how the hell this happened. She is so far past hot in my book I can't describe her and no I will not send pics. Believe me or not, I don't care.

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2971455]Thanks for being so candid about your looks, age etc in your earlier post: lots of respect to guys who succeed in using SA to date out of their league.

I didn't quite understand what you said above. Do you mean you offer money for a dinner date or sightseeing only, ie for platonic dates? I can see how this would filter out escorts, who want to make $250 / HR and don't mind the sex part. But won't this offer attract girls who just want to collect the $250 and have no intention of being intimate with you? How exactly does it work: you do dinner or a castle tour, then you give her $250, and then you find out if she wants to head back to your place? I consistently block-ghost girls who ask for such a setup. Your style is very different than mine so I'd like to learn.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=TheCane;2971449]Anyone had any relatively recent experiences using Seeking in Brazil? I'm currently talking to a girl from So Paulo just by chance on the site. It might be nice to meet her when I'm down next (early 2025) if she proves to be "real" and not just another scammer.[/QUOTE]Yes, Seeking definitely works in Brazil. I used it earlier this year; you can check out my Floripa post. But, if you are inviting them to your place, you will have to pay for transportation. Rather than sending them money directly, I just suggest sending a car to them from your Uber account. Most of the Brazilians on Seeking are friendly and open, and do not mind chatting with you.

But, I will say things will vary from area to area. Using Seeking in Fortaleza will not be the same as using Seeking in Belo Horizonte.

Probably need to use extra caution in Rio. Good luck.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2971797]Yes, Seeking definitely works in Brazil. I used it earlier this year; you can check out my Floripa post. But, if you are inviting them to your place, you will have to pay for transportation. Rather than sending them money directly, I just suggest sending a car to them from your Uber account. Most of the Brazilians on Seeking are friendly and open, and do not mind chatting with you.

But, I will say things will vary from area to area. Using Seeking in Fortaleza will not be the same as using Seeking in Belo Horizonte.

Probably need to use extra caution in Rio. Good luck.[/QUOTE]And to NoBuglyFitches as well. I was thinking about using it in Curitiba and Florianopolis where the puta opportunities won't be as strong as in Rio and Sampa.

My Seeking membership is about to expire. They offered me 15% off and I didn't bite. Now with a week to go they offered me 25% off. I decided I'm going to go ahead and re-up. But, is a 25% discount as good as it gets on Seeking these days? Should I go ahead and bite now, or hold out for a bit longer? Would appreciate feedback from anyone here with any recent experience regarding this. Thanks in advance.

No, I'm not talking about how long you can keep your dick hard pervs. I'm talking about waiting them out on Seeking until they return. I'm finding the end of the year / start of a new year to be a great time to find girls who have not been on the site for awhile who are coming back looking for new daddies. Talking to someone now who contacted me when I was busy and not on the site. When I finally joined again she was gone, and I thought I had lost the opportunity for good. Well now she's back! Red head with a nice ass! At least four months have probably passed since the first communication between us. We shall see. We shall see!

[QUOTE=TheCane;2972007]My Seeking membership is about to expire. They offered me 15% off and I didn't bite. Now with a week to go they offered me 25% off. I decided I'm going to go ahead and re-up. But, is a 25% discount as good as it gets on Seeking these days? Should I go ahead and bite now, or hold out for a bit longer? Would appreciate feedback from anyone here with any recent experience regarding this. Thanks in advance.[/QUOTE]The highest I've ever seen is 30% If you buy 3 months at a time, they may give you a better rate than month to month. I once asked them if they have a lifetime membership, and they said they do not offer one. Even if they did, it would probably be at least $2,000+ if not higher, would be my guess. Too risky of an investment for a site who has banned male members arbitrarily in the past.

A petite New Girl came over and jumped in bed with me. I noticed under her dress, when she left, the New Girl did not have any panties on. I did not notice any panties were laying in the bed, so I figured she did not wear any over to my place, but I did not totally do a dilligent search around the bed.

Two nights later my Regular girl #3 came over and we went to bed. During sex while doggying her, I noticed a pair of small women's undies alongside my bed. Scared, were these small panties from Regular #3 or from the New Girl? I had no clue.

So I kicked the panties under the bed for the time being. How was I supposed to know which girl they belonged to?? The panties did not have anyone's name written on them. And if I asked Regular girl #3 if they were hers, what if she said "No"? Then I could have alot of explaining to do, that I was fucking multiple girls and they must be from another women.

I left the small women's panties under my bed and waited. I watched my Regular #3 get dressed after sex. Was very relieved when she said she could not find HER panties. So I turned on the lights and went to the other side of the bed and looked at the panties. They were lillac purple in color and matched her bra. Had to be hers, unless it was a coincidence.

I got brave and pulled out the lillac panties from under the bed and sheepishly said, "Are these yours?" Hoping she would say "Yes. " She grabbed them and Yes I was correct! Relief. I did not want to mess up and pull out the panties from New Girl. Women need to put names or labels on their panties!

I posted elsewhere but the support on this board can get sketchy at best so not expecting a timely answer. Want to share some extra details (pics) with a very small selection of my Seeking mates but can't figure out ho to send them. My recently posted trip apparently still hasn't ended. Any help, Pi / Steve? The reward and rest of the story is worth the price.

FB.

[QUOTE=TheCane;2972042]No, I'm not talking about how long you can keep your dick hard pervs. I'm talking about waiting them out on Seeking until they return. I'm finding the end of the year / start of a new year to be a great time to find girls who have not been on the site for awhile who are coming back looking for new daddies. Talking to someone now who contacted me when I was busy and not on the site. When I finally joined again she was gone, and I thought I had lost the opportunity for good. Well now she's back! Red head with a nice ass! At least four months have probably passed since the first communication between us. We shall see. We shall see![/QUOTE]I think many of them come back when either their current arrangement ends / does not work out, or they lose their conventional job or their financial situation changes. But yeah, money for the holidays may be a motivating factor.

I also think some of the girls are completely delusional about what they think they may get out of a guy. So maybe they were getting 800 from a 75 yr old and when that ended wanted the same 800 from a 45 yr old. No offense to guys in their 70's but this is not a fair comparison for the most part. I wrote a summary of the 4 or 5 types of girls on seeking a while back. I think that's a comprehensive review of this topic.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2972550]I think many of them come back when either their current arrangement ends / does not work out, or they lose their conventional job or their financial situation changes. But yeah, money for the holidays may be a motivating factor.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2972550]I think many of them come back when either their current arrangement ends / does not work out, or they lose their conventional job or their financial situation changes. But yeah, money for the holidays may be a motivating factor.[/QUOTE]I saw where one girl who already had a profile created a new one at the start of the year. I know it's new because I blocked her a few months ago for being a flake, but here I am seeing her showing up again on my new profiles page. She's not new. Just another flake doing the same old bullshit I'm sure!

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2972600]I also think some of the girls are completely delusional about what they think they may get out of a guy. So maybe they were getting 800 from a 75 yr old and when that ended wanted the same 800 from a 45 yr old. No offense to guys in their 70's but this is not a fair comparison for the most part. I wrote a summary of the 4 or 5 types of girls on seeking a while back. I think that's a comprehensive review of this topic.[/QUOTE]In my town, the basic going rate for most girls is around $500. If she's older or a little desperate, then I've seen the ask go as low as $300. But the real hotties (you get hard jut looking at them) are pushing for $1,000! I think that's a bit much really.

I have a secret email for these. My long term SBs send pics / videos there.

Let me know if I am part of that select group (Happy to share.

No offense if I am not.

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2972526]I posted elsewhere but the support on this board can get sketchy at best so not expecting a timely answer. Want to share some extra details (pics) with a very small selection of my Seeking mates but can't figure out ho to send them. My recently posted trip apparently still hasn't ended. Any help, Pi / Steve? The reward and rest of the story is worth the price.

FB.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2972526]I posted elsewhere but the support on this board can get sketchy at best so not expecting a timely answer. Want to share some extra details (pics) with a very small selection of my Seeking mates but can't figure out ho to send them. My recently posted trip apparently still hasn't ended. Any help, Pi / Steve? The reward and rest of the story is worth the price.

FB.[/QUOTE]Check your inbox FB. I sent you contact info.

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2972600]I also think some of the girls are completely delusional about what they think they may get out of a guy. So maybe they were getting 800 from a 75 yr old and when that ended wanted the same 800 from a 45 yr old. No offense to guys in their 70's but this is not a fair comparison for the most part. I wrote a summary of the 4 or 5 types of girls on seeking a while back. I think that's a comprehensive review of this topic.[/QUOTE]That may be true, but I don't think they would get out in that case. I think they are absent from the site because they are attached to a specific guy, be he 30 or 80 years old. Or they found another way out that didn't work in the long run. Either way, once the cow's milk runs dry, they have to return, unless they have an alternative. Of course, I think many of the girls play multiple guys at a time, so some of those with more than one sugar daddy may continue to log in.

An ex sugar baby (I moved out of Bangalore) needs some one to pay her 20 k a meet. She can be little difficult to manage and not worth the price. If anyone is still interested do let me know.

[QUOTE=Psybram;2972830]An ex sugar baby (I moved out of Bangalore) needs some one to pay her 20 k a meet. She can be little difficult to manage and not worth the price. If anyone is still interested do let me know.[/QUOTE]With all due respect sir, why would you bring her up if she not worth the price and a little difficult to manage? Who would want such an SB?

[QUOTE=Ailton;2511138]I have updated the table with new entries, thank you all for the additions. To all the silent readers: we know you are there. Please consider telling us about your experiences, the setting and how much it set you back.

[B]EUROPE[/B]

[B]Austria[/B]

Vienna [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2449952&viewfull=1#post2449952]300 EUR for the Night[/URL].

[B]Czech Republic[/B]

Prague [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2491118&viewfull=1#post2491118]300 - 350 EUR[/URL] [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2449952&viewfull=1#post2449952]200 EUR for the night[/URL] [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2445539&viewfull=1#post2445539]150 - 300 EUR[/URL].

[B]Germany[/B]

Berlin [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2491118&viewfull=1#post2491118]300 - 350 EUR[/URL] [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2449952&viewfull=1#post2449952]500 EUR for the night[/URL].

Munich [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?683-Munich&p=1828248&viewfull=1#post1828248]300 EUR[/URL].

[B]Netherlands[/B]

Amsterdam [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/archive/index.php/t-4144-p-5.html?]200 EUR for a couple of hours. 300 for a whole night[/URL].

Generally [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2503694&viewfull=1#post2503694]200 - 300 EUR[/URL].

[B]Poland[/B]

Warsaw [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2491118&viewfull=1#post2491118]300 - 350 EUR[/URL].

[B]Portugal[/B]

Lisbon [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/archive/index.php/t-4144-p-5.html?]150 - 200 EUR for a couple of hours to a whole night, depending on girl[/URL] [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2499125&viewfull=1#post2499125]100 - 200 EUR[/URL].

[B]Russia[/B]

Moscow [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2503849&viewfull=1#post2503849]150 - 300 USD, Stunners from above 200 USD[/URL].

[B]Serbia[/B]

Belgrade [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?774-Belgrade&p=2135044&viewfull=1#post2135044]50 - 300 EUR - the worst looking on the lower end, playmate class on the high end[/URL].

[B]Spain[/B]

Barcelona [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2449952&viewfull=1#post2449952] Full weekend: 300 EUR. Generally 200 - 500 EUR for a weekend. [/URL] [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2503687&viewfull=1#post2503687]200 EUR for standard[/URL].

[B]Ukraine[/B]

Kiev [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?816-Kiev&p=2493582&viewfull=1#post2493582]250 USD, disputed, several data points lower than that[/URL] [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?816-Kiev&p=2497541&viewfull=1#post2497541]140 - 180 USD (4000-5000 UAH)[/URL].

[B]United Kingdom[/B]

London [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2491118&viewfull=1#post2491118]300 - 350 EUR[/URL] [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2411854&viewfull=1#post2411854]350 Sterling[/URL].

[B]NORTH AMERICA[/B]

[B]United States[/B]

Atlanta [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2449909&viewfull=1#post2449909]200 - 350 USD for a solid 6 to 8[/URL].

Austin [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2438062&viewfull=1#post2438062]400 - 500 USD[/URL].

Boston [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2417099&viewfull=1#post2417099]300 - 350 USD[/URL].

Chicago [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/archive/index.php/t-4144-p-5.html?]Under 300 USD is doable[/URL].

Denver [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2491118&viewfull=1#post2491118]200 USD[/URL].

Detroit [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2449167&viewfull=1#post2449167]300 USD[/URL].

Houston [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2438062&viewfull=1#post2438062]400 - 500 USD[/URL].

Jacksonville (FL) [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2449459&viewfull=1#post2449459]150 - 200 USD for a 6/7. 200 - 250 USD for a 7/8 college aged. 400 USD solid 9[/URL].

Las Vegas [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2449167&viewfull=1#post2449167]400 USD[/URL].

LOS Angeles [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2449167&viewfull=1#post2449167]200 USD second tier. 300 first tier.[/URL] [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2450228&viewfull=1#post2450228]300 USD[/URL].

Miami [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2449167&viewfull=1#post2449167]300 USD[/URL].

Milwaukee [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/archive/index.php/t-4144-p-5.html?]Under 300 USD is doable[/URL].

Nashville [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2449167&viewfull=1#post2449167]200 USD second tier. 300 first tier.[/URL].

New York City [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2491132&viewfull=1#post2491132]500 USD[/URL] [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2449167&viewfull=1#post2449167]400 USD second tier, 500 USD first tier[/URL].

Philadelphia [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2444165&viewfull=1#post2444165]200 - 300 USD[/URL].

Portland [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2413337&viewfull=1#post2413337]300 USD[/URL].

San Antonio [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2438062&viewfull=1#post2438062]300 - 350 USD[/URL].

San Francisco [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2491132&viewfull=1#post2491132]500 USD[/URL] [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2448844&viewfull=1#post2448844]500 USD[/URL] [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2448831&viewfull=1#post2448831]300 USD for exchange student[/URL].

Savannah (GA) [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2449459&viewfull=1#post2449459]150 - 200 USD for a 6/7. 200 - 250 USD for a 7/8 college aged. 400 USD solid 9[/URL].

[B]Canada[/B]

Montreal [URL=http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:QaWB7CxlZlwJ:www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/archive/index.php/t-4144.html%3Fs%3D6cb4edc971ca5ed61f0af1cf65f24f75+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=de]300 CAD (now with revised link, member account of source deleted)[/URL].

Niagara Falls [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2503912&viewfull=1#post2503912]250 - 300 CAD[/URL].

[B]Mexico[/B]

Cabo San Lucas [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2510393&viewfull=1#post2510393]2500 MXN[/URL].

Guadalajara [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?420-Guadalajara&p=2488711&viewfull=1#post2488711]2000 MXN+[/URL].

Mexico City [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2485508&viewfull=1#post2485508]1500 - 3000 MXN, possibly 4000 MXN for high-end.[/URL].

Monterrey [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2503849&viewfull=1#post2503849]3000 - 4500 MXN[/URL].

[B]SOUTH AMERICA[/B]

[B]Brazil[/B]

Sao Paulo [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2448768&viewfull=1#post2448768]800 Rs for model quality[/URL].

[B]Colombia[/B]

Medellin [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2448768&viewfull=1#post2448768]7-8 girl 100 USD todo la noche, 8.5 - 9 girl 100 - 200 USD all day[/URL] [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?583-Medellin-Reports&p=2419466&viewfull=1#post2419466]100 USD[/URL] [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?583-Medellin-Reports&p=2480746&viewfull=1#post2480746]200 - 500k COP[/URL].

[B]Peru[/B]

Cusco [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2448824&viewfull=1#post2448824]100 USD for whole weekend[/URL].

Lima [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?597-Lima&p=2194339&viewfull=1#post2194339]100 - 150 USD[/URL].

[B]AFRICA[/B]

[B]Egypt[/B]

Cairo [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?882-Egypt&p=2301374&viewfull=1#post2301374]2000 - 7000 EGP | note: prices for private escorts in CAI (college aged girls) run between a mere 1,5 k to 2 k for 2 hours which they have to share with a madame, a rate above 3k should be unreasonable[/URL].

[B]ASIA[/B]

[B]India[/B]

Note that many of the allowances referenced below might not sound like a lot to us but often exceed an entire monthly salary in India. Based on several opinions in the different threads, there is ample reason to assume that this has turned a lot of non-pros in to pro SBs. Scoring a gem in large metropolitan areas will require considerable effort. The low amount of profiles is also puzzling me. New Delhi (Radius 80 km): 1 k. Mumbai (Radius 80 km): 800.

Bangalore [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2448607&viewfull=1#post2448607]350 USD[/URL].

Delhi [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?959-New-Delhi&p=2490364&viewfull=1#post2490364]15.000 INR[/URL] [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?959-New-Delhi&p=2491116&viewfull=1#post2491116]8.000 - 30.000 INR[/URL].

Mumbai [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?954-Bombay-Mumbai&p=1901903&viewfull=1#post1901903]10.000 INR +[/URL].

Pune [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?954-Bombay-Mumbai&p=2499115&viewfull=1#post2499115]15.000 INR[/URL] [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?954-Bombay-Mumbai&p=2499046&viewfull=1#post2499046]40.000 INR for whole night[/URL].

[B]Japan[/B]

Tokyo [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?977-Tokyo&p=1900088&viewfull=1#post1900088]300 USD - 90 minutes, likely freelancer[/URL].

[B]Singapore[/B]

Singapore [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4020-Seeking-Arrangement&p=2219466&viewfull=1#post2219466]500 - 1000 SGD[/URL].

[B]United Arab Emirates[/B]

Dubai [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?3910-Sugar-Life&p=2381783&viewfull=1#post2381783]Depending on Tier: 400 - 800 USD[/URL].

[B]OCEANIA[/B]

[B]Australia[/B]

Sydney [URL=http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/archive/index.php/t-840-p-28.html?]400 - 500 AUD[/URL].[/QUOTE]Is this still the going allowance in many countries? I was recently in Germany closer to Netherlands and Belgium. Allowance quoted few hours were 500 For couple of hours. I did meet one for 200 Euros for couple of hours a student but rare to find such. I guess rates almost doubled or I didn't explore much? I didn't know about existence of this subforum will RTTF before my next travel.

[QUOTE=RoniG;2972903]Is this still the going allowance in many countries? I was recently in Germany closer to Netherlands and Belgium. Allowance quoted few hours were 500 For couple of hours. I did meet one for 200 Euros for couple of hours a student but rare to find such. I guess rates almost doubled or I didn't explore much? I didn't know about existence of this subforum will RTTF before my next travel.[/QUOTE]Yeah this list is waaaaay out of date. No way you are getting those prices. Yeah approx double will be close. SB in Western Europe 500 not surprising. You can get 300 in Spain.

The only correct one on the list is Brazil. I think you can still get a nice girl for the evening for 800-1000 R.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2972916]Yeah this list is waaaaay out of date. No way you are getting those prices. Yeah approx double will be close. SB in Western Europe 500 not surprising. You can get 300 in Spain.

The only correct one on the list is Brazil. I think you can still get a nice girl for the evening for 800-1000 R.[/QUOTE]I don't think any of the rates on those tables are accurate today. In Brazil I can get half day or half night (entire afternoon or evening without sleep over) for 600 reais, but I'm good at shopping around. It may depend on the girl's financial situation at the time; ie when is the rent due.

With my established chica, it's usually a 500 USD exchange for a 1 week trip, depending on the destination and how generous she or I are feeling at the time. She's offered as little as 100 for places she REALLY wants to visit, and 600 when in extra need. I had to cultivate that relationship though; I did not get such good privileges on an initial offer.

I don't know the date of that post, but the US rates are astronomically low.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2973016]I don't think any of the rates on those tables are accurate today. In Brazil ... 600 reais [/QUOTE]Dubai is actually about right. I paid 4-500 usd, though I got asks as high as 4 k usd (10-15 k aed). Not sure but Tokyo might be right too due to weaker yen.

Who do you meet for 600 reals in Brazil? I mean, age, location, ethnicity as in white, indigenous, afro? For reference, how would you compare them in terms of looks to the hottest girls at Scandy on a Thursday night?

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2973043]Dubai is actually about right. I paid 4-500 usd, though I got asks as high as 4 k usd (10-15 k aed). Not sure but Tokyo might be right too due to weaker yen.

Who do you meet for 600 reals in Brazil? I mean, age, location, ethnicity as in white, indigenous, afro? For reference, how would you compare them in terms of looks to the hottest girls at Scandy on a Thursday night?[/QUOTE]Early 20's, Amazon heritage (think Manaus area) so brown skin, not black, and in my last case, Santa Catarina. She's beautiful, especially if you are okay with more traditional features, such as a wider nose or possibly pronounced jaw. But importantly, definitely height to weight proportionate, without sagging breasts. Honestly I have a strong preference towards darker skin, but will see pretty gringa girls if no other options are available. Never been to Scandy so I can't comment on that.

Now, as far as getting them for half the day, that also depends on the circumstances. I "imported" her by Uber from over an hour away. So, if you were a woman, would you really want to sit almost 90 minutes in a car, hang out with a guy for an hour, then go back to a car and sit on your butt another 90 minutes to go back? Yes, you would be getting paid, but that's a back to back car ride lasting 3 hours total in exchange for hanging out in a hotel room for an hour. I offered to take her out to go food, and we hung out afterwards, so basically it amounted to half a day. I think if they are not working or have no other obligations, they are more likely to do this. Anyone on a limited budget, as many Brazilian girls are, doesn't want to have to spend more than they need to for food, so if you offer to take them out to a nice restaurant (cheap by US standards), they will usually be eager to get lunch or dinner at no cost, especially if they like you.

If they are accustomed to only getting 500 reais or even less from Brazilian guys, and you offer 600 or 700, they won't tell you they are thrilled, but they should gladly accept the offer, and be a lot more inclined to spend extra time with you. BTW the 1 US dollar is currently worth 6. 18 reais. On Christmas it was worth 6. 75 If you think it will go higher, wait until you arrive in Brazil. If lower, just exchange some dollars for reais now and keep them for your next trip to Brazil. In April of 2022 the dollar was only worth 4. 5 reais.

[QUOTE=RoniG;2972903]Is this still the going allowance in many countries? I was recently in Germany closer to Netherlands and Belgium. Allowance quoted few hours were 500 For couple of hours. I did meet one for 200 Euros for couple of hours a student but rare to find such. I guess rates almost doubled or I didn't explore much? I didn't know about existence of this subforum will RTTF before my next travel.[/QUOTE]Well, the original post was from 2020, but in 5 years, I'd say the Canadian rates have gone up a bit, too; instead of $300 (Canadian), I'd put it closer to $400-$500 is the average now. Mind you, our dollar has tanked in the last year, so Americans get at least a 30% discount.

Also, like anywhere else, if you're going date in major cities the rates are going to be higher than if you're meeting girls from smaller towns.

I think it's simpler than this. Sure the situation made it a lot more sense to spend more time together, all things being equal (no babysitter, job, sick dog issues).

But I've been doing the SB / SD game long enough now (it's the only way I meet people nowadays) that I've come to a fairly reliable conclusion. They all need money (for car payment, babysitter, rent, tuition, whatever). Some of them just want money for an overpriced purse or fun money that doesn't come with daddy's tuition check.

Some of them love sex and see the money as a huge bonus, some accept sex as a means to an end.

Here's my conclusion: they all want security and a guy who isn't a jerk. If you are these things everything else is negotiable and the clock means nothing. The amount means a lot less if she knows she can count on you and you meet whatever her basic threshold is. Next time you hunt in SA note the number of profiles looking for a "long term" arrangement. It's almost 100%. They can get themselves to like you over time but very few are willing to sleep with multiple guys unless they're just straight prostitutes.

So I wouldn't be too surprised she spent 4 hours with you when the discussion was for 1 HR. It means she wasn't repulsed by you, was hungry enough to eat with you, and could be the start of a great if you're into it.

When we first met, my current baby was cold, wanted to meet in the middle of the day, and really wasn't into anything other than getting naked. She was hot as fuck so I went with it. 18 months later of seeing each other weekly and we meet every day of the week, do fun stuff together, say fuck the babysitter more than we should, have sex without a condom, and know just about everything there is to know about each other. If that's not GFE I don't know what is. I wouldn't say I was looking for it in the beginning but I'm happy were here because she still does it for me every time I see her and no girl is going to sleep with you just for money for a year and a half unless there's something else there.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2973152]Early 20's, Amazon heritage (think Manaus area) so brown skin, not black, and in my last case, Santa Catarina. She's beautiful, especially if you are okay with more traditional features, such as a wider nose or possibly pronounced jaw. But importantly, definitely height to weight proportionate, without sagging breasts. Honestly I have a strong preference towards darker skin, but will see pretty gringa girls if no other options are available. Never been to Scandy so I can't comment on that.

Now, as far as getting them for half the day, that also depends on the circumstances. I "imported" her by Uber from over an hour away. So, if you were a woman, would you really want to sit almost 90 minutes in a car, hang out with a guy for an hour, then go back to a car and sit on your butt another 90 minutes to go back? Yes, you would be getting paid, but that's a back to back car ride lasting 3 hours total in exchange for hanging out in a hotel room for an hour. I offered to take her out to go food, and we hung out afterwards, so basically it amounted to half a day. I think if they are not working or have no other obligations, they are more likely to do this. Anyone on a limited budget, as many Brazilian girls are, doesn't want to have to spend more than they need to for food, so if you offer to take them out to a nice restaurant (cheap by US standards), they will usually be eager to get lunch or dinner at no cost, especially if they like you..[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=RoniG;2972903]Is this still the going allowance in many countries? I was recently in Germany closer to Netherlands and Belgium. Allowance quoted few hours were 500 For couple of hours. ... I guess rates almost doubled or I didn't explore much? I didn't know about existence of this subforum will RTTF before my next travel.[/QUOTE]I wouldn't say doubled, maybe +33-50%. It was 300-350 back then, now it's 400 around Berlin and Prague and 500 closer to Amsterdam. Some guys can probably still get 300 if you talk to many women who are not blonde college girls. But "model quality" in Brazil for 800 Rs still sounds unrealistic to me, but only if by "model" you mean tall, thin, white etc

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2973204]When we first met, my current baby was cold, wanted to meet in the middle of the day, and really wasn't into anything other than getting naked. She was hot as fuck so I went with it. 18 months later of seeing each other weekly and we meet every day of the week, do fun stuff together, say fuck the babysitter more than we should, have sex without a condom, and know just about everything there is to know about each other. If that's not GFE I don't know what is. I wouldn't say I was looking for it in the beginning but I'm happy were here because she still does it for me every time I see her and no girl is going to sleep with you just for money for a year and a half unless there's something else there.[/QUOTE]You are pussy whipped, young man. Admit it. You probably would settle down with her if she would do it. Then divorce her in a few years. The grass is greener.

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2971088]Selection in Zurich might be worse than it looks because many girls are not local, based on login location.

Re Nordic, I only did sugar dating there once. Super hot profiles were scams, and I mean elaborate multiday scams, even with video calls. Amazing, actually! There were a few average looking Scandi girls, and they were picky, expensive and not easy to meet. I only met one. Drinks felt like a real date in that if I said the wrong thing, she would've left because she didn't really need the money. A Tinder element to it. Sex was very good.[/QUOTE]Which Nordic country was it?

Man these "softcore hoors" as I call them. More like hardcore scammers! A girl I was communicating with (she contacted me) said she expected to be paid at the initial meeting. I replied that women who want to be paid to meet and greet don't want an arrangement. They want free money, and I don't dole out free money. She got pissed and said men pay her $1,000 for 30 minutes of her time. Oh really? Well not this man! I blocked her no more than a 7 looking ass!

But, I'm wondering if I should change my approach? I'm talking lead them on the way they string us along. Say I'm OK with making a payout during the meet and greet, but if I get there and don't like her just refuse to pay. What's she going to do? Sue me? Or, if I do like her then be prepared to pay whatever we agreed upon. As long as she comes back to my room and puts out. If not, then again just refuse to pay her shifty, theiving ass. Again, what's she going to do? I suppose I could be reported to the site, but I wouldn't give a damn as long as I've still got my money in my pocket!

[QUOTE=TheCane;2973423]Man these "softcore hoors" as I call them. More like hardcore scammers! A girl I was communicating with (she contacted me) said she expected to be paid at the initial meeting. I replied that women who want to be paid to meet and greet don't want an arrangement. They want free money, and I don't dole out free money. She got pissed and said men pay her $1,000 for 30 minutes of her time. Oh really? Well not this man! I blocked her no more than a 7 looking ass!

But, I'm wondering if I should change my approach? I'm talking lead them on the way they string us along. Say I'm OK with making a payout during the meet and greet, but if I get there and don't like her just refuse to pay. What's she going to do? Sue me? Or, if I do like her then be prepared to pay whatever we agreed upon. As long as she comes back to my room and puts out. If not, then again just refuse to pay her shifty, theiving ass. Again, what's she going to do? I suppose I could be reported to the site, but I wouldn't give a damn as long as I've still got my money in my pocket![/QUOTE]If it's at a restaurant, she could say "I need to use the ladies room" , then proceed to go to the host and say to put the entire bill in the "gentleman's name. " After that she could order the most expensive bottle of alcohol the place has to offer. That's one of many things they could potentially do to wreck havoc. If you drove to the restaurant, then presumably your vehicle is there with a license plate on it. If she's working with a pimp, then who knows. Whether the particular lady has the sophistication or willingness do engage in vindictive behaviors is another story.

I don't like kids, never liked kids, even when I was a kid. She has two. I never wanted my own kids why would I want someone else's?

She is definitely GF material but the big head is firmly in control. In fact someone I met on a recent trip on their way here to stay with me for a month.

Try again.

[QUOTE=HumbleHal;2973360]You are pussy whipped, young man. Admit it. You probably would settle down with her if she would do it. Then divorce her in a few years. The grass is greener.[/QUOTE]

Please clear your inbox. Messages aren't going through.

Just tell her you don't pay for meet & greets. You don't know how crazy she is and is it worth a scene in a public place? Any girl that wants money just to meet you is a prostitute that hasn't convinced herself she's a prostitute yet. There's nothing wrong with prostitutes if that's what you're looking for but this is the seeking thread. Move on, there are plenty of serious girls imagine what else she'd ask for later if you agree to a first meet payout and decide to start seeing you regularly.

[QUOTE=TheCane;2973423]Man these "softcore hoors" as I call them. More like hardcore scammers! A girl I was communicating with (she contacted me) said she expected to be paid at the initial meeting. I replied that women who want to be paid to meet and greet don't want an arrangement. They want free money, and I don't dole out free money. She got pissed and said men pay her $1,000 for 30 minutes of her time. Oh really? Well not this man! I blocked her no more than a 7 looking ass!

But, I'm wondering if I should change my approach? I'm talking lead them on the way they string us along. Say I'm OK with making a payout during the meet and greet, but if I get there and don't like her just refuse to pay. What's she going to do? Sue me? Or, if I do like her then be prepared to pay whatever we agreed upon. As long as she comes back to my room and puts out. If not, then again just refuse to pay her shifty, theiving ass. Again, what's she going to do? I suppose I could be reported to the site, but I wouldn't give a damn as long as I've still got my money in my pocket![/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2973466]Please clear your inbox. Messages aren't going through.[/QUOTE]All clear.

Steve9696 has chosen not to receive private messages or may not be allowed to receive private messages. Therefore you may not send your message to him / her.

If you are trying to send this message to multiple recipients, remove Steve9696 from the recipient list and send the message again.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2973593]All clear.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=BaltiX;2973402]Which Nordic country was it?[/QUOTE]Hate to call you out but all your posts in this thread are questions, no information shared.

For example, here's your reply to Steve: "The sex scene in Milan is better than you think, but like many places you have to know the right websites. I guess the lack of popularity in ISG makes it more difficult than more popular cities. ".

So what are the right websites in Milan?

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2973723]Hate to call you out but all your posts in this thread are questions, no information shared.

For example, here's your reply to Steve: "The sex scene in Milan is better than you think, but like many places you have to know the right websites. I guess the lack of popularity in ISG makes it more difficult than more popular cities. ".

So what are the right websites in Milan?[/QUOTE]I admit I'm not activate on any sugaring website, just want some info for future reference. For Milan (and Italy in general) there are many websites, but the best ones from what I could found:

EscortForumit ([URL]https://www.escortforumit.xxx[/URL]).

TantraLux ([URL]https://tantralux.com/[/URL]).

Escort Advisor ([URL]https://www.escort-advisor.com/[/URL]).

Moscarossa ([URL]https://www.moscarossa.biz/[/URL]).

Escort Inn ([URL]https://escortinn.com/[/URL]).

Massaggia Milano ([URL]https://www.massaggiamilano.it/[/URL]), this one is focused on erotic massage parlors, but many of them offer extras including FS.

There are 2 Italian forums for the local sex industry: Gnoccaforum and Punter Forum.

Hey everyone,

I haven't been here for years, so please forgive any unwitting breaches of rules or etiquette.

I got the dreaded warning that "your account has been suspended for breaching the rules (soliciting sex for money). Thankfully it was just a warning, and they let me back on after I had watched their videos about "what you must not do".

No mentioning sex. No mentioning "pay per meet".

I'm not sure if it was because my profile suggested that I was looking for a "compensated friendship with benefits", or that I "couldn't afford escort-level rates for your time" (the word "escort" triggering some filter).

Well, fellow users, what AM I allowed to say, to discuss our financial expectations of each other? I'm even too scared to say something as generic as "what are your expectations, financially?

Some girls, once we'd messaged each other, I'd ask if we can continue the discussion off-site. Some said yes; but others were wary and refused, and I don't completely blame them.

Any tips about how to negotiate the minefield of the rules as to "seeking's new direction"? Any tips on what I safely CAN say? Or how to smoothly move the conversation off-site?

It's a great question. I've been doing this for years and I've never been suspended. Here are the rules.

Never use trigger words. PPM, only fans, escort, etc. Speak in euphemisms like say a good time, a night together.

Never even discuss intimacy on the app. Think about it from their perspective. They are guarding against needing to defend that they are not a prostitution front. Choose language that supports that cause.

Always always discuss specifics on text or WhatsApp or telegram or snap. Anywhere but the seeking app. Just say can we continue this conversation on text. There are some girls who insist on discussing in seeking because they don't want to give out their contact information. I usually just say a number and for your company and then say we need to take it off-line to talk about specifics.

[QUOTE=ElijahB;2975459]Hey everyone. I haven't been here for years, so please forgive any unwitting breaches of rules or etiquette.

I got the dreaded warning that "your account has been suspended for breaching the rules (soliciting sex for money). Thankfully it was just a warning, and they let me back on after I had watched their videos about "what you must not do".

No mentioning sex. No mentioning "pay per meet".

I'm not sure if it was because my profile suggested that I was looking for a "compensated friendship with benefits", or that I "couldn't afford escort-level rates for your time" (the word "escort" triggering some filter).

Well, fellow users, what AM I allowed to say, to discuss our financial expectations of each other? I'm even too scared to say something as generic as "what are your expectations, financially?

Some girls, once we'd messaged each other, I'd ask if we can continue the discussion off-site. Some said yes; but others were wary and refused, and I don't completely blame them.[/QUOTE]

Hi bros,

I have been chatting to Flowergirl and Lizelle. Flowergirl looked better in pics than Lizelle. Can any bro help me out by sharing a recent review if you have tried out both. How are they and who is better (in service and hygiene) at same price?

Thanks.

[QUOTE=ElijahB;2975459]Hey everyone,

I haven't been here for years, so please forgive any unwitting breaches of rules or etiquette.

I got the dreaded warning that "your account has been suspended for breaching the rules (soliciting sex for money). Thankfully it was just a warning, and they let me back on after I had watched their videos about "what you must not do".

No mentioning sex. No mentioning "pay per meet".

I'm not sure if it was because my profile suggested that I was looking for a "compensated friendship with benefits", or that I "couldn't afford escort-level rates for your time" (the word "escort" triggering some filter).

Well, fellow users, what AM I allowed to say, to discuss our financial expectations of each other? I'm even too scared to say something as generic as "what are your expectations, financially?

Some girls, once we'd messaged each other, I'd ask if we can continue the discussion off-site. Some said yes; but others were wary and refused, and I don't completely blame them.

Any tips about how to negotiate the minefield of the rules as to "seeking's new direction"? Any tips on what I safely CAN say? Or how to smoothly move the conversation off-site?[/QUOTE]AmericanPi is spot on in his response. After some casual chat about nothing take her to WhatsApp. If she's not willing to go there just move on. Most girls understand the basic game plan here. Even in texting on WhatsApp there is no profit in asking girls PPM rates and generally treating her like an escort. The best girls will ghost right away if you make them feel at all like a pro. In Nampa (Japanese street pickup) they have a thing called Anti-**** defense. That is no girl wants to feel like a **** and you need to help her feel like this is not that.

My usual patter goes more or less like:

Let's plan to go out to dinner and drinks and if we vibe well we could spend some private time together. How does that sound for you?

Once they say yes you say "Of course I'the want to give you a gift / allowance at the end of the date. Did you have some amount in mind?

This is the same as saying "what ppm do you want if we fuck". You just don't say it that way!

Many girls don't want to let you contact them off the site unless they feel like you meet their criteria. If they want $600 an hour, but feel like you're the type of guy who would lowball them with $200, then it's a waste of their time to communicate. The best thing to do is open up with small talk. Let's say there's a photo of her below the Eiffel Tower. If you recognize a location from one of their pictures, you can say something like "I see you have been to Paris before. " Or you can ask if they have any pets. Just a brief, casual conversation. Once you've spent a bit of time chatting, they will be less reluctant to give you a way to contact them off the site. If they insist on discussing business on the site, then just move on to the next girl because she's likely a snob anyhow.

[QUOTE=ElijahB;2975459]Hey everyone,

I haven't been here for years, so please forgive any unwitting breaches of rules or etiquette.

I got the dreaded warning that "your account has been suspended for breaching the rules (soliciting sex for money). Thankfully it was just a warning, and they let me back on after I had watched their videos about "what you must not do".

No mentioning sex. No mentioning "pay per meet".

I'm not sure if it was because my profile suggested that I was looking for a "compensated friendship with benefits", or that I "couldn't afford escort-level rates for your time" (the word "escort" triggering some filter).

Well, fellow users, what AM I allowed to say, to discuss our financial expectations of each other? I'm even too scared to say something as generic as "what are your expectations, financially?

Some girls, once we'd messaged each other, I'd ask if we can continue the discussion off-site. Some said yes; but others were wary and refused, and I don't completely blame them.

Any tips about how to negotiate the minefield of the rules as to "seeking's new direction"? Any tips on what I safely CAN say? Or how to smoothly move the conversation off-site?[/QUOTE]

I renewed my Seeking membership recently, but that's it! I won't renew again. It's not just about the fakes, flakes, fraudsters, and scammers. We all know that's bad enough. But, it's also all of the girls with totally unrealistic expectations around here in this town. The absolute hottest ones want to extract $1,000 a meet without doing much of jack shit for that money! For their "time" (rolling eyes). There are plenty who will go for $300 to $500 per meet, but I tend to not be nearly as attracted to those girls, either due to their looks and / or age and / or ghetto attitude and behavior. They're not getting my money. None of them! I'll keep working it while I have an active membership looking for a jewel in a pile of shit, but once done I will be more than happy to stick with the straight up tutes. I can travel abroad and find what I want at far more favorable pricing and get exactly what I want in terms of services too (including anal sex) with no bullshit games and no gouging. Of course, there's the price of overseas travel right? Well, I was going to do that anyway, and now that I'm retired I have the time to go along with the money. I love to travel in the first place, and being able to combine that with hooring and wenching? Well, for me that's just having la pura vida! The good life! Goodbye Seeking and hey, hey mongering! Once my Seeking membership expires next time, I will probably just go ahead and delete my account. Tired of wasting my time, and won't blow my money on a bunch of greedy "softcore hoors"!

[QUOTE=ElijahB;2975459]
I got the dreaded warning that "your account has been suspended for breaching the rules (soliciting sex for money). Thankfully it was just a warning, and they let me back on after I had watched their videos about "what you must not do".

No mentioning sex. No mentioning "pay per meet".

I'm not sure if it was because my profile suggested that I was looking for a "compensated friendship with benefits", or that I "couldn't afford escort-level rates for your time" (the word "escort" triggering some filter).

Well, fellow users, what AM I allowed to say, to discuss our financial expectations of each other? I'm even too scared to say something as generic as "what are your expectations, financially?
[/QUOTE]I got banned also a few years ago. Now I use SDM, sugar daddy [URL]meet.com[/URL] which is 1/3 d of the price. I still get the same scammers, but not as much. I always use the word "intimacy" instead of sex. It sounds better. Sometimes PPM is ok. "friends with benefits" is good too. Some younger women still think / expect they will get $$ from you and not put out! LOL Others say they want $800. I say for that they would need to do a threesome and anal! Haha. And I hang up. These be-itches are getting professional on these sugar daddy sites since Craigslist got stopped.

[QUOTE=TheCane;2975766]I renewed my Seeking membership recently, but that's it! I won't renew again. It's not just about the fakes, flakes, fraudsters, and scammers. We all know that's bad enough. But, it's also all of the girls with totally unrealistic expectations around here in this town. The absolute hottest ones want to extract $1,000 a meet without doing much of jack shit for that money! For their "time" (rolling eyes). There are plenty who will go for $300 to $500 per meet, but I tend to not be nearly as attracted to those girls, either due to their looks and / or age and / or ghetto attitude and behavior. They're not getting my money. None of them! I'll keep working it while I have an active membership looking for a jewel in a pile of shit, but once done I will be more than happy to stick with the straight up tutes. I can travel abroad and find what I want at far more favorable pricing and get exactly what I want in terms of services too (including anal sex) with no bullshit games and no gouging. Of course, there's the price of overseas travel right? Well, I was going to do that anyway, and now that I'm retired I have the time to go along with the money. I love to travel in the first place, and being able to combine that with hooring and wenching? Well, for me that's just having la pura vida! The good life! Goodbye Seeking and hey, hey mongering! Once my Seeking membership expires next time, I will probably just go ahead and delete my account. Tired of wasting my time, and won't blow my money on a bunch of greedy "softcore hoors"![/QUOTE]While I could be assuming incorrectly, I'm guessing most of your experience on Seeking has been within the USA? If so, I felt the exact same way when I registered a few years ago. Which is why I never renewed until 2024. I NEVER had any luck with Seeking in the USA. But I've had amazing success outside of the USA. It's one of the few centralized places to find women. For example, you can find excellent girls on Apartado X in Portugal, but Apartado X does not work for Cyprus, France, Germany, or anywhere else in the world outside of Portugal and Spain. Same thing with Euro Girls Escort; it works for many part of the EU, but very few people use it in South America. Girls from all over the world use Seeking, partly due to all the media attention it used to get. And while I know there are scammers on there, I feel like many of the girls outside of the USA are legit. Hell, I feel like most of the scammers on there are ugly ass Nigerian men masquerading around as girls. And those types of idiots are far more likely to post ads in the USA; where they know men have money. You won't see a lot of Nigerian men posting scam ads for a place like Paraguay, because they know most Paraguayan men are impoverished and have no money to send them.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2975817]While I could be assuming incorrectly, I'm guessing most of your experience on Seeking has been within the USA? If so, I felt the exact same way when I registered a few years ago. Which is why I never renewed until 2024. I NEVER had any luck with Seeking in the USA. But I've had amazing success outside of the USA. It's one of the few centralized places to find women. For example, you can find excellent girls on Apartado X in Portugal, but Apartado X does not work for Cyprus, France, Germany, or anywhere else in the world outside of Portugal and Spain. Same thing with Euro Girls Escort; it works for many part of the EU, but very few people use it in South America. Girls from all over the world use Seeking, partly due to all the media attention it used to get. And while I know there are scammers on there, I feel like many of the girls outside of the USA are legit. Hell, I feel like most of the scammers on there are ugly ass Nigerian men masquerading around as girls. And those types of idiots are far more likely to post ads in the USA; where they know men have money. You won't see a lot of Nigerian men posting scam ads for a place like Paraguay, because they know most Paraguayan men are impoverished and have no money to send them.[/QUOTE]I have only used it in the USA. I have a big trip to Brazil coming up. I know Steve says he has had some amazing experiences using Seeking there. Have you (or anybody else here recently)? I have never felt the need to use it in a place like Brazil. I still have a few months left in my membership. Maybe it's just time to say good riddance to "gringaland" where the Nigerian men are scamming in overdrive!

[QUOTE=TheCane;2975766]I renewed my Seeking membership recently, but that's it! I won't renew again. It's not just about the fakes, flakes, fraudsters, and scammers. We all know that's bad enough. But, it's also all of the girls with totally unrealistic expectations around here in this town. The absolute hottest ones want to extract $1,000 a meet without doing much of jack shit for that money! For their "time" (rolling eyes). There are plenty who will go for $300 to $500 per meet, but I tend to not be nearly as attracted to those girls, either due to their looks and / or age and / or ghetto attitude and behavior. They're not getting my money. None of them! I'll keep working it while I have an active membership looking for a jewel in a pile of shit, but once done I will be more than happy to stick with the straight up tutes. I can travel abroad and find what I want at far more favorable pricing and get exactly what I want in terms of services too (including anal sex) with no bullshit games and no gouging. Of course, there's the price of overseas travel right? Well, I was going to do that anyway, and now that I'm retired I have the time to go along with the money. I love to travel in the first place, and being able to combine that with hooring and wenching? Well, for me that's just having la pura vida! The good life! Goodbye Seeking and hey, hey mongering! Once my Seeking membership expires next time, I will probably just go ahead and delete my account. Tired of wasting my time, and won't blow my money on a bunch of greedy "softcore hoors"![/QUOTE]If you do end up quitting seeking and only mongering can I politely request you not become one of those people that drops by periodically for no reason other than to say how stupid this is, how unrealistic the girls, how much it's changed, how much better it is doing something else.

Not that you would. But there is some pattern of people leaving this little hobby and then sour grapes it thereafter.

It's a choice. Nobody has to do this.

Best of luck to you. It sounds like your retirement is going to kick off with a bang. Or many. May we all follow in your footsteps. Share stories of your last hurrah.

[QUOTE=TheCane;2975830]I have only used it in the USA. I have a big trip to Brazil coming up. I know Steve says he has had some amazing experiences using Seeking there. Have you (or anybody else here recently)? I have never felt the need to use it in a place like Brazil. I still have a few months left in my membership. Maybe it's just time to say good riddance to "gringaland" where the Nigerian men are scamming in overdrive![/QUOTE]Just to be clear I have only scored once on Seeking in Rio as I am of sorta like minded. It's a candy store. I don't need Seeking really. But this seeking girl was total home run. $100 usd and a smokin hottie. Have seen her a total of 11 days this year in Rio SP and Barcelona.

The main reason for Seeking in Brasil is Sunday. It's a ghostown day. You really need a chica on the side for Sunday. You can get this on Seeking. You can also get this by locking up a Boate or clinics / terma girl. So it's not strictly necessary. But it's nice to have in your pocket. I scored Manu sat night about midnight for a Sunday 8 pm date.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2976010]Just to be clear I have only scored once on Seeking in Rio as I am of sorta like minded. It's a candy store. I don't need Seeking really. But this seeking girl was total home run. $100 usd and a smokin hottie. Have seen her a total of 11 days this year in Rio SP and Barcelona.

The main reason for Seeking in Brasil is Sunday. It's a ghostown day. You really need a chica on the side for Sunday. You can get this on Seeking. You can also get this by locking up a Boate or clinics / terma girl. So it's not strictly necessary. But it's nice to have in your pocket. I scored Manu sat night about midnight for a Sunday 8 pm date.[/QUOTE]Thanks for the clarification and suggestions. I think I will go with trying to hook up with a clinica or boate or termas girl on Sundays, or even just take a break. After going hard Monday thru Saturday sometimes I don't mind taking a break on Sunday. I do miss L'uomo though. It was the only termas in Rio I recall being open on Sundays. Changed my life. Forever. It was there on a Sunday of deep reflection that I decided to become a lifelong monger. A decision I do not regret.

I don't think anyone (you or her) should be thinking in terms of time other than something very general like "overnight. " You need to be speaking in terms of activities. Dinner, show, drinks, sightseeing, any or all of stuff like that. Agree to a price for a list of things that you want and let them tell you they are or are not comfortable with all that. If you're both thinking in terms of time, you're looking for a prostitute and she IS a prostitute. It's nuance but it is quite different from what sugarbaby is. The ones that are open to other activities are generally more open to GFE in my experience. You don't have to ask for it. You spend 3 or 4 hours doing whatever and if she's still around at the end of it she doesn't think you're a creep and mostly treats you like a normal guy and not a customer. What I'll do is offer some amount for a date and say there will be something extra if we get intimate at my place. That way she knows she's getting something and we both have an out. If she's not into you you probably don't want to bang her anyway and the only way to know that is do more than chat online.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2975665]If they want $600 an hour, but feel like you're the type of guy who would lowball them with $200, then it's a waste of their time to communicate. [/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=TheCane;2976014]Thanks for the clarification and suggestions. I think I will go with trying to hook up with a clinica or boate or termas girl on Sundays, or even just take a break. After going hard Monday thru Saturday sometimes I don't mind taking a break on Sunday. I do miss L'uomo though. It was the only termas in Rio I recall being open on Sundays. Changed my life. Forever. It was there on a Sunday of deep reflection that I decided to become a lifelong monger. A decision I do not regret.[/QUOTE]You know there are places open on Sunday (I am mostly talking about SP). The price has gone up a lot for quite a while. I think there is a cartel or agency behind many girls. Unlike men who don't share, these girls work together so they know who can pay 2000 or 3000 and they all can target these customers. I guess if you pay for one of the girls from the cartel, then there will be more girls coming your way. This is just a theory attempting to explain the price rise, and some other observations.

Two years ago, you can get freebies from time to time, and the price for more desirable girls is what one would expect to be reasonable but it has changed. You may get one or two that are reasonable but in the long run when you talk to enough of them then you may see a different or more complete picture.

Why people don't post, because it is a very small world and people who frequent don't want it to get to where it is today. That thermae place is called black cat, and I tell you here because this is not an obvious place for this information. LOL.

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2976273]I don't think anyone (you or her) should be thinking in terms of time other than something very general like "overnight. " You need to be speaking in terms of activities. Dinner, show, drinks, sightseeing, any or all of stuff like that. Agree to a price for a list of things that you want and let them tell you they are or are not comfortable with all that. If you're both thinking in terms of time, you're looking for a prostitute and she IS a prostitute. It's nuance but it is quite different from what sugarbaby is. The ones that are open to other activities are generally more open to GFE in my experience. You don't have to ask for it. You spend 3 or 4 hours doing whatever and if she's still around at the end of it she doesn't think you're a creep and mostly treats you like a normal guy and not a customer. What I'll do is offer some amount for a date and say there will be something extra if we get intimate at my place. That way she knows she's getting something and we both have an out. If she's not into you you probably don't want to bang her anyway and the only way to know that is do more than chat online.[/QUOTE]If they are not offering sex, I'm not interested. I wouldn't go to Seeking, I'd go to another site. I can get girls outside of the USA to hangout with me or go to dinner for free. They are the same type of girls who likely won't have sex within a week of meeting ANY guy, not matter how attractive or how "good of a catch he is. " Either because their parents raised them as diehard catholics, they are very conservative about their bodies, had a bad sexual experience in the past, or for any number of dozens of reasons. While they are not common, there are still girls in the USA who refuse to have sex before marriage, though most of them are religious fanatics. And nobody but a lunatic gets married within a month of meeting someone.

The last 2 girls I met from the Caribbean and South America off Seeking were more than willing to spend multiple hours with me after we hopped off the mattress. And I didn't offer them money for anything other than sex. No time specified, and no activities. We just came to an agreement on a price for getting into the sack, and they choose to stick around for awhile afterwards. If I were to offer money to a girl to go to dinner with me, with the "possibility" of additional activities later in the evening, then that's not different than saying to myself "I'm not good enough to get a traditional date. ".

Only in the USA do I face such a conundrum. Partly because my standards of beauty are quite high, but more obviously because at least 70% of American women, if not substantially more, are a bunch of entitled tards, especially the ones in their 20's or 30's, which is the only age bracket I would consider dating. If I wanted to get a date with an ugly girl and not pay for it, I could, but have no desire to. The entire point is: I'm not going to spend years trying to find an American outlier, and then several months traditionally courting her, with only the chance that it might lead to sex. Paying for it, for better or worse, produces instant results. The only difference is that formal sex workers overtly simplify the engagement, because they've been willing to make a cost benefits analysis that informal sex workers (95% of other women) choose not to make. Maybe you believe that prostitutes are significantly different from "sugar babies. " The only different I see between the two, other than the terminology used, is that many girls from Seeking are willing to offer things other sex, but they also expect more in return from the man. Which is fine. But other than that, no amount of information will ever convince me there is an empirical difference between the two. You are either trading sex for money in some capacity, or you aren't; there are no two ways about it.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2976494]Paying for it, for better or worse, produces instant results. The only difference is that formal sex workers overtly simplify the engagement, because they've been willing to make a cost benefits analysis that informal sex workers (95% of other women) choose not to make. Maybe you believe that prostitutes are significantly different from "sugar babies. " The only different I see between the two, other than the terminology used, is that many girls from Seeking are willing to offer things other sex, but they also expect more in return from the man. Which is fine. But other than that, no amount of information will ever convince me there is an empirical difference between the two. You are either trading sex for money in some capacity, or you aren't; there are no two ways about it.[/QUOTE]We see eye to eye on this. Thus, my moniker for them being "softcore hoors".

If you talk to them in terms of time, you will get answered in terms of time which is how an escort thinks. There's nothing wrong with escorts if that's what you're looking for and there are plenty on seeking. We're all on seeking for sex. Actually we're all on the planet for sex for that matter. How you go about pursuing it is what this site is about. I'm just saying a sugar baby shouldn't be thinking in terms of time and encouraging her to think that way means she's not a sugar baby. It's all fansty at the end of day. How you chose to look at the situation vs how she chooses to look at the situation can start out differently but the closer you get to each other's viewpoints the better the fantasy.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2976494]If they are not offering sex, I'm not interested. I wouldn't go to Seeking, I'd go to another site. I can get girls outside of the USA to hangout with me or go to dinner for free. They are the same type of girls who likely won't have sex within a week of meeting ANY guy, not matter how attractive or how "good of a catch he is. " Either because their parents raised them as diehard catholics, they are very conservative about their bodies, had a bad sexual experience in the past, or for any number of dozens of reasons. While they are not common, there are still girls in the USA who refuse to have sex before marriage, though most of them are religious fanatics. And nobody but a lunatic gets married within a month of meeting someone.

The last 2 girls I met from the Caribbean and South America off Seeking were more than willing to spend multiple hours with me after we hopped off the mattress. And I didn't offer them money for anything other than sex. No time specified, and no activities. We just came to an agreement on a price for getting into the sack, and they choose to stick around for awhile afterwards. If I were to offer money to a girl to go to dinner with me, with the "possibility" of additional activities later in the evening, then that's not different than saying to myself "I'm not good enough to get a traditional date...[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2976273] What I'll do is offer some amount for a date and say there will be something extra if we get intimate at my place. [/QUOTE]When do you actually give her that amount for the date? As soon as you meet, after dinner, or only if / when she's back your hotel?

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2976548]When do you actually give her that amount for the date? As soon as you meet, after dinner, or only if / when she's back your hotel?[/QUOTE]Not addressed to me, but I'm still going to answer. The answer is none of the above. The gift is given after all is said and done. Preferably discreetly. I usually put in her purse or jacket pocket and say I left you a gift. But doing before the end is just asking some to say they have to leave early.

I met a young woman yesterday at a restaurant and everything checked out. Said she wanted to stay with me overnight. $500. Bought a bottle of wine and went back to my place, she followed me there, I did not give her the address. Did a session in the bedroom. Then she got a phone call (probably one of her girlfriends that was training her in on how to play with guys and rip them off.) Someone was coaching her on the phone.

She said she needed to go outside. Then I did not hear from her for 10 minutes and got a phone call from her. Said her grandmother just died and she had to go home. I knew this was a LIE! So I pretended to be sympathetic. Then she asked for her money, said she completed her part of the arrangement. Wanted me to zelle it to her, I told her I did not know how to Zelle. I said why don't you come back and we can go to the ATM at the bank. She said she was circling around the neighborhood and did not know my address. GOOD TO HEAR! I said, lets meet at the wine store where we had bought a bottle of wine, the bank was across the street.

Wondering if she would show, or if I really owed her the $500 since the deal was for her to spend the night. So I went thru the bank drive thru and got the cash out and sat in the parking lot for several minutes. Did not see her, nor hear from her again on the phone for about 10 minutes while I waited for her.

I thought to myself, this is stupid. I have a runner, and then she wants me to wait for her to pay her $$ when she did not stay the night! Screw her. She does not know where I live, nor my real name. So I left and went to a movie.

Apparently she wanted her $500 and called me while I was at the concession stand. I blocked her number on my phone. Immediately I got another call from another number, and blocked that number, it probably was her girlfriend's cell number. Then she called several times "restricted caller" showed up on my phone. I finally reported this number to google as spam, asked if they could block it because it was an old girlfriend! And they blocked her.

Think I did the right thing. She was a runner. Fuck her. I fucked her and she ran, and she got fucked again because she got nothing! No $$.

Not sure I understand but I assume you're talking about the part before we're intimate. I usually give it as soon as I get a good read on the vibe. If there's banner and chemistry and I know I want to bang her and reasonably believe she'll bang me, I'll slip it into the her or under her plate when she goes the the bathroom because they all do at some point. When they come back, I'll excuse myself so they can collect and stash it without me seeing anything. If we bang too then it's after the deed.

If I don't want to bang her, I'll finish my meal, hand her the money and say goodnight.

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2976548]When do you actually give her that amount for the date? As soon as you meet, after dinner, or only if / when she's back your hotel?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2976540]If you talk to them in terms of time, you will get answered in terms of time which is how an escort thinks. There's nothing wrong with escorts if that's what you're looking for and there are plenty on seeking. We're all on seeking for sex. Actually we're all on the planet for sex for that matter. How you go about pursuing it is what this site is about. I'm just saying a sugar baby shouldn't be thinking in terms of time and encouraging her to think that way means she's not a sugar baby. It's all fansty at the end of day. How you chose to look at the situation vs how she chooses to look at the situation can start out differently but the closer you get to each other's viewpoints the better the fantasy.[/QUOTE]Bearing in mind I am mostly Seeking US, but I am with FB on this. Treat a girl like a hooker and she will act like one. Or feel disrespected and ghost. I always try to treat them like a date. When did you ever say to a real girl "we will spend four hours together". Never. I treat SA girls the same. We have dinner and drinks. Go fuck. Some girls say they need to get home. Other girls stay overnight. It's a lovely way to roll because it's HER choice. If she can make the same $ by going home or staying you know there's something there when she stays.

On the other thread as PI says always $ after. Preferably in a little card discretely slipped in her purse. Most girls understand this game and appreciate it not appearing so transactional. Newbies sometimes say "did U have a gift for me?" And I let them know it's in their purse. A couple times we've had such fun I forgot to do it and she forgot to ask so we settled up later. LOL. Even happened with a full on pro in New Zealand. That was surprising.

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2976581]Not addressed to me, but I'm still going to answer. The answer is none of the above. The gift is given after all is said and done. Preferably discreetly. I usually put in her purse or jacket pocket and say I left you a gift. But doing before the end is just asking some to say they have to leave early.[/QUOTE]Yes, of course, I always pay after sex as well. But FB said: "What I'll do is offer some amount for a date and say there will be something extra if we get intimate at my place. " So my question was when and how does he actually pay that amount that he offered just for the dinner date? And if no girl ever said to him after dinner "Thank you, I had a wonderful time. May I have my gift now, please?

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2976685] We have dinner and drinks. Go fuck. Some girls say they need to get home. Other girls stay overnight. It's a lovely way to roll because it's HER choice. If she can make the same $ by going home or staying you know there's something there when she stays. [/QUOTE]If I may, the same question as for FB: when do you actually give her the money? Right after you fuck, you give her the money, and then ask if she'd like to stay overnight? Or do you wait for her to say that she needs to go home and only then give her the money? If the latter, some girls might be staying overnight because they're afraid they won't get paid otherwise.

Ime, at least for the under 24 age group, once they have the money in hand, they got places to be. Are you seeing different?

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2976728]If I may, the same question as for FB: when do you actually give her the money? Right after you fuck, you give her the money, and then ask if she'd like to stay overnight? Or do you wait for her to say that she needs to go home and only then give her the money? If the latter, some girls might be staying overnight because they're afraid they won't get paid otherwise.

Ime, at least for the under 24 age group, once they have the money in hand, they got places to be. Are you seeing different?[/QUOTE]To answer your specific question, I prepare a card with the money and put in an envelope and put in plain sight but not quite for the taking — like under the ice bucket or something. After fucking when she is in the bathroom I will often slip it in her purse. Though sometimes if that's not convenient just give it when they are leaving. As far as sleepover it's never a discussion. We just crash like big dogs after fucking and that's that.

Now that I think about it tho I don't suppose recently many girls have stayed overnight on the first date. I supppse that goes back a couple years. At one point I wrote it was fifty fifty but that was a couple years back and I ran through more seeking girls. Recently when I find a girl I like I tend to glom onto her and fly her to me when traveling. My goal is to have a home girl, a US travel girl (my current home girl can't travel and our non-sex relationship is a bit meh), a Brazilian girl, and a European travel girl. I was all set till recently my Milan girl ghosted me. Boo. Landed sunny side up tho as one of the most beautiful girls I know came out of the blue (broke up w her boyfriend) and is going to travel w me. These girls lives are constantly changing and staying in touch always pays off.

After sex she goes straight to the bathroom I put it in her purse then. Never been asked for the money, even on a first date so maybe they peek inside. I will say that I come across as a straight and honest person person, been that way my whole life. I also present very well, I usually look like I have a few bucks. People tend to trust me fairly easily if they've already spent a couple of hours with me.

I never ask for overnight, that's all completely different vibe. Just because I want to bang someone doesn't mean I want them to stay the night. If the chemistry is off the charts and she looks like she's in it for the long haul I just go with it. If she's in a rush to get out so be it. I don't negotiate two pops, over nights, etc. I just go with the flow.

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2976728]If I may, the same question as for FB: when do you actually give her the money? Right after you fuck, you give her the money, and then ask if she'd like to stay overnight? Or do you wait for her to say that she needs to go home and only then give her the money? If the latter, some girls might be staying overnight because they're afraid they won't get paid otherwise.

Ime, at least for the under 24 age group, once they have the money in hand, they got places to be. Are you seeing different?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2976814] staying in touch always pays off.[/QUOTE]When I stay in touch, many try to hit me up for money, or a hotel booking, or rent payment etc. Like in that Ho Tactics book.

And if we do meet again, it's usually worse than the first time both in terms of connection and sex. Plus, unless she is a pro sugar baby, most regular girls have tight schedules with school and work so they can't usually go with me when / where I want.

Do you find similar?

BTW, part of the reason I ask these questions is for the benefit of lurkers and first timers who might be learning from this forum.

Hello all,

I tried searching about Zurich but couldn't find much about it.

If any of you has used Seeking in Zurich plshare your experience.

I have a week long trip coming in about 6 weeks.

Can one find non pros there on Seeking? And would they be open to a one off meeting? Especially with an Indian on travel.

I understand that Switzerland is expensive, what's the range of allowance?

Should I start chatting up 2 weeks in advance?

Any other advice would be appreciated.

Thanks.

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2976911] After sex she goes straight to the bathroom ... [/QUOTE]Actually, overnights was a question for Steve. What I don't understand about your approach is you say: "What I'll do is offer some amount for a date and say there will be something extra if we get intimate at my place. ".

So when do you actually pay that "some amount" that you offered just for the dinner date?

Sounds like you don't volunteer this payment right after dinner? And none of your ladies, none that you wanted to bang, ever said to you "Thank you, I had a great time but I need to go now. May I have my dinner date present now, please?

As advice to first timers, it'd be good to have this clarified or they'll get rinsed.

I thought I was clear but maybe not not. When they go to the bathroom at the restaurant I will slip the money under her napkin or plate. When she comes back I'll excuse myself to the bathroom and whisper to her that I left her a gift under her plate. Not once has any girl asked me for the money, I always give it before they get the chance. I've always been the one to propose the end of dinner even if she's a dud. That daid I've only had 2 dud dates. Everyone else I've fucked sooner or later. If I like them I'll invite them to my place where they know they'll get more as I've just proven I can provide for her. If I don't like them I'll give them a hug and say good luck. They know what that means.

As for the amount, it depends. Maybe 2-300 if I really like them, one time I gave 400 because she had some sob story about tuition.

I also need to be clear that I mostly do this while traveling overseas. Because my time is very valuable and I need to close the deal quick. I don't offer money for meet and greets at home. There are too many girls at home to play those kinds of games. I flat out tell them no when they ask for a gift for meeting. About half will meet me anyway and the other half will tell me to fuck off.

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2977069]Actually, overnights was a question for Steve. What I don't understand about your approach is you say: "What I'll do is offer some amount for a date and say there will be something extra if we get intimate at my place. ".

So when do you actually pay that "some amount" that you offered just for the dinner date?

Sounds like you don't volunteer this payment right after dinner? And none of your ladies, none that you wanted to bang, ever said to you "Thank you, I had a great time but I need to go now. May I have my dinner date present now, please?.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2977069]Actually, overnights was a question for Steve. What I don't understand about your approach is you say: "What I'll do is offer some amount for a date and say there will be something extra if we get intimate at my place. ".

So when do you actually pay that "some amount" that you offered just for the dinner date?

Sounds like you don't volunteer this payment right after dinner? And none of your ladies, none that you wanted to bang, ever said to you "Thank you, I had a great time but I need to go now. May I have my dinner date present now, please?

As advice to first timers, it'd be good to have this clarified or they'll get rinsed.[/QUOTE]I would like to know the answers as well. I mean, how often does a girl say thanks so much I had a great time, but balks at intimacy and expects to get paid? And what do you pay her? Say the going rate in your town is $500 per meet and that's what you agreed to. So, if she wants to skip intimacy you pay her the $500, and if she does agree to intimacy then you pay her the $500 plus some additional unspecified amount as some kind of bonus or something? I mean how does this work?

I was looking at a Seeking thread in the USA version of this site and saw where guys were discussing how some of the girls trying to sell themselves as "babies" were known strippers in some of the clubs around the metro. So, they weren't making enough to pay the bills from stripping and looking to make additional income as sugar babies. Of course, they never say in their profiles that they're strippers. They're "self-employed" LOLOL! No wonder all the tattoos and body piercings some of the girls have giving them that "stripper look". I bet if you approached some of them in the club about an arrangement they would get pissed off and accuse you of treating them like a prostitute. And if next you whipped out their Seeking profile then they would get even more angry LOL! Such are these irrational softcore hoors!

[QUOTE=TheCane;2977103]I would like to know the answers as well. I mean, how often does a girl say thanks so much I had a great time, but balks at intimacy and expects to get paid? And what do you pay her? Say the going rate in your town is $500 per meet and that's what you agreed to. So, if she wants to skip intimacy you pay her the $500, and if she does agree to intimacy then you pay her the $500 plus some additional unspecified amount as some kind of bonus or something? I mean how does this work?[/QUOTE]The girl who does not want intimacy, but is in your house, would scream, "I am NOT a prostitute, you must pay me for my time! Or she will say, "I need to get you better before I agree to go in the bedroom, I just met you and do not know you!

Then you have to pay her $500 or she will call the cops on you for assignment of prostitution! Or rape! Just ask President Trump about Stormy Daniels!! Or the **** will come back later and break your windows or key your car at night! Or enter your house!

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2976998]When I stay in touch, many try to hit me up for money, or a hotel booking, or rent payment etc. Like in that Ho Tactics book.

And if we do meet again, it's usually worse than the first time both in terms of connection and sex. Plus, unless she is a pro sugar baby, most regular girls have tight schedules with school and work so they can't usually go with me when / where I want.

Do you find similar?

BTW, part of the reason I ask these questions is for the benefit of lurkers and first timers who might be learning from this forum.[/QUOTE]Absolutely agree. Further meetings have always been the same or worse than the first, often worse. First meet is when they will try hardest to secure long term. And this leads to the other item, staying in touch. Couple of nice texts from them, maybe sexy photos, then come the money requests. Last one told me her cousin had lost a testicle in an accident, needed money for xrays. And you know what, even when I helped others, still didn't change their behavior nor performance, and even went with others when we had a meet setup. So, don't send money, if you didn't like first meet, ditch. Boy, do I miss those early days of misstravel, before the working girls from seeking destroyed it.

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2977088] When they go to the bathroom AT THE RESTAURANT I will slip the money under her napkin or plate... Not once has any girl asked me for the money, I always give it before they get the chance. [/QUOTE]Wait, so you DO actually volunteer her dinner fee, and with 200 usd already in her purse she still chooses to fuck you for maybe $300 more?! Even knowing that you're a tourist, so it's likely a one-time thing?

Was she open to sex when you first messaged her? For example, she says "I just want to meet at your hotel. " Then you say, "No, I'd like to start with dinner and I'll give you 200 just for your time, plus more if we have sex."

How many times have you done this money under the napkin thing successfully? What countries, locations and approx how old were your dates?

If an average American tourist texted a random hot college girl on a sugar site saying "I'll give you $200 for a dinner date at Michelin3, plus more $$ if we have sex," I'm nearly certain he won't get sex. Am I wrong? I feel that there's some secret sauce here, absent which first timers are going to get many dinners and no pussy.

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2977184]Wait, so you DO actually volunteer her dinner fee, and with 200 usd already in her purse she still chooses to fuck you for maybe $300 more?! Even knowing that you're a tourist, so it's likely a one-time thing?

Was she open to sex when you first messaged her? For example, she says "I just want to meet at your hotel. " Then you say, "No, I'd like to start with dinner and I'll give you 200 just for your time, plus more if we have sex."

How many times have you done this money under the napkin thing successfully? What countries, locations and approx how old were your dates?

If an average American tourist texted a random hot college girl on a sugar site saying "I'll give you $200 for a dinner date at Michelin3, plus more $$ if we have sex," I'm nearly certain he won't get sex. Am I wrong? I feel that there's some secret sauce here, absent which first timers are going to get many dinners and no pussy.[/QUOTE]Plenty of American women will happily eat the food and down the drinks that you paid for, then expect you to pay them "for her time" that she just spent enjoying a meal that she ate for free on your dime. Then split with a smile on her face, your food and drink in her belly, and your cash in her purse. And the next day tell her best friends how she made out without having to put out. And then go bang some guy she likes for free! That's what being a "gentleman" gets you from a typical, self-entitled gringa full of herself. Well fuck that! I would rather just "regular" date then. Or even better than that fuck young, hot prostitutes. That pretty tute got what she wanted (money), and I got what I wanted (puss and ass). All the dinner dating stuff I can take it or leave it. The fact of the matter is that I have indeed had many dinner dates with the working girls. I don't mind it when I know I'm going to be tapping that ass later (and she knows it too). No games! I'm just not up to letting gringas play me with "her time is valuable" bullshit. Maybe so, but my time is worth more than her inflated, delusional valuing of herself. That's for damn sure! These hoors soon learn to think again if they believe The Cane is going to give them my hard earned cash just to have them show up and have a good time eating and drinking on me. They have another think coming is what. No deal!

[QUOTE=NeilGeorge;2977153]The girl who does not want intimacy, but is in your house, would scream, "I am NOT a prostitute, you must pay me for my time! Or she will say, "I need to get you better before I agree to go in the bedroom, I just met you and do not know you!

Then you have to pay her $500 or she will call the cops on you for assignment of prostitution! Or rape! Just ask President Trump about Stormy Daniels!! Or the **** will come back later and break your windows or key your car at night! Or enter your house![/QUOTE]But she knows you well enough to take money ($500 or more) from you doesn't she? I say again. Fuck that! No gash no cash! WTF do you think this is?

Here's an example. I see seeking girl, I text seeking girl, we move ro whatsapp. I say I want our time together to feel like a date with examples of what a date is to me. I ask her what she might want for such things. She'll give me a number or ask me to propose. I then tell her if we vibe and head back to my place I'll give her something extra.

We go out, I give her the money before she asks and we either peck good night or go back to my place to fuck in which case I give her the money before she leaves. It's really that simple but there is game and being able to read her involved so it's not an exact science.

Again, this is mostly overseas because I'm usually paying 400+/ day to be wherever I'm at (not including food) and I don't want to waste my time with a maybe.

To be fair my last liason wasn't so cut and dry I think I posted it but I'll summarize it again. Met on a sugar site. I said I wanted a date, she said she only wanted sex for money. I'd been in the country for 4 days without a hit so that's about $1600 in expenses that don't include pussy. I asked to see her pic, she was hot as fuck and I was horny so I agreed to meet. She let me propose the amount as every girl has in that country. We meet in the lobby, instant chemistry, locked eyes, big smiles, the whole bit. She hung out for about 4 hrs. Next day she hung out for about 8 hrs, spent the next 6 days together traveling all over the country on a complete whim. Gave her 500 first day, 500 second day and 500 on the last day and she didn't want to take it. Not in a million fucking years would I have been able to expect anything like this to happen on a sugar site.

Oh and BTW, she's flying to my house in the near future and staying for an entire month. No money discussed but I'll give her something just so she doesn't need to ask me to buy this or that.

I do have plenty of one night stands while traveling. At the end of the day, they all want long term but there are a lot more travellers than guys wiling to commit to them long term so they compromise. Every woman on the planet wants stability and a nice guy. Everything else is negotiable. If you have a big hairy wort growing out the tip of your nose you may need to negotiate a little harder or pay a little more but you'll find someone if you've got the money and aren't an asshole.

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2977184]Wait, so you DO actually volunteer her dinner fee, and with 200 usd already in her purse she still chooses to fuck you for maybe $300 more?! Even knowing that you're a tourist, so it's likely a one-time thing?

Was she open to sex when you first messaged her? For example, she says "I just want to meet at your hotel. " Then you say, "No, I'd like to start with dinner and I'll give you 200 just for your time, plus more if we have sex."

How many times have you done this money under the napkin thing successfully? What countries, locations and approx how old were your dates?

If an average American tourist texted a random hot college girl on a sugar site saying "I'll give you $200 for a dinner date at Michelin3, plus more $$ if we have sex," I'm nearly certain he won't get sex. Am I wrong? I feel that there's some secret sauce here, absent which first timers are going to get many dinners and no pussy.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2977306]
We go out, I give her the money before she asks and we either peck good night or go back to my place to fuck in which case I give her the money before she leaves... If you have a big hairy wort growing out the tip of your nose you may need to negotiate a little harder or pay a little more but you'll find someone if you've got the money and aren't an asshole.[/QUOTE]Sounds like you give them money just to meet. You must have a hairy wart on your nose. I never had to pay them to meet. Ever. Never will. I pay for the meal and that's it. Its like a job interview, the interviewer's do not get paid to show up. They are looking for an opportunity.

Remember, your time must be worth more than theirs if they expect you to help them financially.

There is no better way to get a girl into bed than a mind blowing tasting menu. I've done it countless times and it never fails.

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2977184]


If an average American tourist texted a random hot college girl on a sugar site saying "I'll give you $200 for a dinner date at Michelin3, plus more $$ if we have sex," I'm nearly certain he won't get sex. Am I wrong? I feel that there's some secret sauce here, absent which first timers are going to get many dinners and no pussy.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2976998] And if we do meet again, it's usually worse than the first time both in terms of connection and sex.[/QUOTE]The times I let a SB back into my life, I regretted it. At first, I was like. Oh she is so nice, hot, and great in bed. Why did I leave her? And after that, I was like, oh yeah, now I remember. It would always be some combo of a greedy, BSC druggie.

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2976998]When I stay in touch, many try to hit me up for money, or a hotel booking, or rent payment etc. Like in that Ho Tactics book.

Plus, unless she is a pro sugar baby, most regular girls have tight schedules with school and work so they can't usually go with me when / where I want.

Do you find similar?

BTW, part of the reason I ask these questions is for the benefit of lurkers and first timers who might be learning from this forum.[/QUOTE]So this is the part of being a SD that I went through in the beginning and had to learn to get better at. So let's say you make low to middle six figures a year. Unless you have a huge amount of assets and / or are perfect in every other way, you are not that special and a woman is going to be more interested in the gift you can give than you.

If a guy is worth a $100 million plus, the woman is not going to pull this I have work or school crap. She has to eat and sleep and she will eat and sleep with that guy, and she will fuck the shit out of him to have a chance at that guy. Because if she does not do it, she knows another hot woman will.

The point is not to have $100 million but to get what he has. The woman is fucking him out of genuine burning desire, GBD. She is fucking you for money. She is treating him like an alpha seed.

If you are saying, "Oh, I understand baby, I wish you well in school or at work", you are a beta needs guy. You are letting a hooker off by buying her bullshit line and not making her feel like a hooker, and you are lying to yourself and saying she is not a hooker. She has to sleep, and she has to eat. Why is she not doing that with you?

There is nothing wrong with seeing a hooker as long as you know that is what she is.

And if you respond to the hooker as an alpha and give the impression she is a hooker, there is a chance she will not care but there is also a chance that she will respond in a non hooker way and actually try to prove to you she is not one. You do not even have to say anything. You just act like what she is saying is total bullshit. It is the same with the sick father / mother / kid bullshit excuse. You do not say "Oh, I am sorry about your dad. " You act like they are full of shit because they usually are. If they are not full of shit, they will respond like this, "My father is sick, but I can see you later. ".

Accepting the bullshit excuse of women is a beta act. This is the video on being an alpha: [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xk5cB_wZRV4[/URL].

And the one being a beta: [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DG_Kp61sdsQ[/URL].

The goal of having a SB is to get one who wants to fuck you and has GBD or genuine burning desire to do so. The money is a gift to help her out and not payment for sex. I repeat there is nothing wrong with seeing a hooker as long as you know that is what you are doing.

[QUOTE=TheCane;2977193]Plenty of American women will happily eat the food and down the drinks that you paid for, then expect you to pay them "for her time" that she just spent enjoying a meal that she ate for free on your dime. Then split with a smile on her face, your food and drink in her belly, and your cash in her purse. And the next day tell her best friends how she made out without having to put out. And then go bang some guy she likes for free! That's what being a "gentleman" gets you from a typical, self-entitled gringa full of herself. Well fuck that! I would rather just "regular" date then. Or even better than that fuck young, hot prostitutes. That pretty tute got what she wanted (money), and I got what I wanted (puss and ass). All the dinner dating stuff I can take it or leave it. The fact of the matter is that I have indeed had many dinner dates with the working girls. I don't mind it when I know I'm going to be tapping that ass later (and she knows it too). No games! I'm just not up to letting gringas play me with "her time is valuable" bullshit. Maybe so, but my time is worth more than her inflated, delusional valuing of herself. That's for damn sure! These hoors soon learn to think again if they believe The Cane is going to give them my hard earned cash just to have them show up and have a good time eating and drinking on me. They have another think coming is what. No deal![/QUOTE]You are goddam right Cane! My time is worth much more than those scanks! They want me to pay them money because I make much more. Probably 20 times more. So my time is worth way more than their fukking time! These stupid girls come up with stupid arguments. I agree with you 110%.

As I've said several times, I give them money to meet when I'm traveling. My time is at an extreme premium and I don't have time for a maybe or to play games. If they're hot and I want to fuck them I will pay them to show up. I do not pay to meet at home, that's stupid.

[QUOTE=NeilGeorge;2977393]Sounds like you give them money just to meet. You must have a hairy wart on your nose. I never had to pay them to meet. Ever. Never will. I pay for the meal and that's it. Its like a job interview, the interviewer's do not get paid to show up. They are looking for an opportunity.

Remember, your time must be worth more than theirs if they expect you to help them financially.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2977306]We go out, I give her the money before she asks and we either peck good night or go back to my place to fuck in which case I give her the money before she leaves. It's really that simple but there is game and being able to read her involved so it's not an exact science.[/QUOTE]In your experience, how often does that happen (peck on the cheek and good night) versus back to the room for sexual relations?

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2977306]Here's an example. I see seeking girl, I text seeking girl, we move ro whatsapp. I say I want our time together to feel like a date with examples of what a date is to me. I ask her what she might want for such things. She'll give me a number or ask me to propose. I then tell her if we vibe and head back to my place I'll give her something extra.

We go out, I give her the money before she asks and we either peck good night or go back to my place to fuck in which case I give her the money before she leaves. It's really that simple but there is game and being able to read her involved so it's not an exact science.

Again, this is mostly overseas because I'm usually paying 400+/ day to be wherever I'm at (not including food) and I don't want to waste my time with a maybe.

To be fair my last liason wasn't so cut and dry I think I posted it but I'll summarize it again. Met on a sugar site. I said I wanted a date, she said she only wanted sex for money. I'd been in the country for 4 days without a hit so that's about $1600 in expenses that don't include pussy. I asked to see her pic, she was hot as fuck and I was horny so I agreed to meet. She let me propose the amount as every girl has in that country. We meet in the lobby, instant chemistry, locked eyes, big smiles, the whole bit. She hung out for about 4 hrs. Next day she hung out for about 8 hrs, spent the next 6 days together traveling all over the country on a complete whim. Gave her 500 first day, 500 second day and 500 on the last day and she didn't want to take it. Not in a million fucking years would I have been able to expect anything like this to happen on a sugar site.

Oh and BTW, she's flying to my house in the near future and staying for an entire month. No money discussed but I'll give her something just so she doesn't need to ask me to buy this or that.

I do have plenty of one night stands while traveling. At the end of the day, they all want long term but there are a lot more travellers than guys wiling to commit to them long term so they compromise. Every woman on the planet wants stability and a nice guy. Everything else is negotiable. If you have a big hairy wort growing out the tip of your nose you may need to negotiate a little harder or pay a little more but you'll find someone if you've got the money and aren't an asshole.[/QUOTE]Much respect player!

Assuming you're from a western country, with your finances, why go abroad at all? If you're spending 400 a day to stay somewhere and another 500 for company, you can afford to pay 900/ day at home. I'm pretty sure 900/ day can buy some pretty fine pussy in most parts of the western worlds, and you don't have to bother flying anywhere. If your time is so valuable, that seems like the most reasonable option. That's what I would do.

[QUOTE=Kazeu;2977608]Much respect player!

Assuming you're from a western country, with your finances, why go abroad at all? If you're spending 400 a day to stay somewhere and another 500 for company, you can afford to pay 900/ day at home. I'm pretty sure 900/ day can buy some pretty fine pussy in most parts of the western worlds, and you don't have to bother flying anywhere. If your time is so valuable, that seems like the most reasonable option. That's what I would do.[/QUOTE]For me it's the principal of the matter. I will not pay above $500 for a girl anywhere in the world. It's just too crazy. US is highest and Europe next but I can always find a hottie for $500 or less. So even if the math says it's the same I'the rather fly somewhere and pay less than pay over $500 in US. Just won't do it. Plus when you travel you can mix nightclubs and fuck spas and brothels in with Seeking and get the best of all worlds. Anyone who is not getting out of the US is seriously missing out.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2977616]For me it's the principal of the matter. I will not pay above $500 for a girl anywhere in the world. It's just too crazy. US is highest and Europe next but I can always find a hottie for $500 or less. So even if the math says it's the same I'the rather fly somewhere and pay less than pay over $500 in US. Just won't do it. Plus when you travel you can mix nightclubs and fuck spas and brothels in with Seeking and get the best of all worlds. Anyone who is not getting out of the US is seriously missing out.[/QUOTE]Forgot to mention that international girls are also much easier to find a good fit. Not fat. Not entitled. Good attitude towards sex and pleasing their man. Not afraid of PDA.

Not saying it's true everywhere. But generally the girl scene outside the US (Brazil, Spain, Thailand etc) is soooo much better. Just go on your city in the US or one you travel to and see who's got a green dot. Now go to Madrid. Holy fuck. Night and day.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2977616]For me it's the principal of the matter. I will not pay above $500 for a girl anywhere in the world. It's just too crazy. US is highest and Europe next but I can always find a hottie for $500 or less. So even if the math says it's the same I'the rather fly somewhere and pay less than pay over $500 in US. Just won't do it. Plus when you travel you can mix nightclubs and fuck spas and brothels in with Seeking and get the best of all worlds. Anyone who is not getting out of the US is seriously missing out.[/QUOTE]I guess that's where we differ, I don't travel to go to exotic places. Colombia is a dump compared to most western countries, same with Philippines. Maybe at first, you go there and experience something new and enjoy the cheap pussy. But after a while, I don't want to travel, I just do it for the cheap pussy. If I had the finances, I would just stay in the US where the girls speak english. No communication barrier, better rapport. Airports, 24 HR flights with layovers, hassle, visa extensions. All things I'd rather do without.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2977624]Forgot to mention that international girls are also much easier to find a good fit. Not fat. Not entitled. Good attitude towards sex and pleasing their man. Not afraid of PDA.

Not saying it's true everywhere. But generally the girl scene outside the US (Brazil, Spain, Thailand etc) is soooo much better. Just go on your city in the US or one you travel to and see who's got a green dot. Now go to Madrid. Holy fuck. Night and day.[/QUOTE]This is so true. I've seen seeking pages in the USA and seeking pages in Brazil and Colombia. Night and day.

In percentage terms maybe 10%. I'm extremely picky, I won't even meet with them unless I think they're hot. If their personality is a dud I wish them luck and leave.

[QUOTE=TheCane;2977557]In your experience, how often does that happen (peck on the cheek and good night) versus back to the room for sexual relations?[/QUOTE]

That's the reason. Seeing the sane shit and eating at the same restaurants with different girls gets old after a while. Everytime I travel I learn something new. Budget is only over of the problem. I'm generally very unimpressed with the selection in my city so if I want Asians I go to Asia, if I want a slav (my present fettish) I go to Europe.

[QUOTE=Kazeu;2977608]Much respect player!

Assuming you're from a western country, with your finances, why go abroad at all? If you're spending 400 a day to stay somewhere and another 500 for company, you can afford to pay 900/ day at home. I'm pretty sure 900/ day can buy some pretty fine pussy in most parts of the western worlds, and you don't have to bother flying anywhere. If your time is so valuable, that seems like the most reasonable option. That's what I would do.[/QUOTE]

Well said. The US is sex he'll. Why it's so holy and people give a shit about who you fuck I will never understand and don't tell me we're all still the same lame puritans that founded the country. It's politics and I'm better than thou. Thou can fuck off. If you're not seeing the world you're missing out on way more than pussy.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2977624]Forgot to mention that international girls are also much easier to find a good fit. Not fat. Not entitled. Good attitude towards sex and pleasing their man. Not afraid of PDA.

Not saying it's true everywhere. But generally the girl scene outside the US (Brazil, Spain, Thailand etc) is soooo much better. Just go on your city in the US or one you travel to and see who's got a green dot. Now go to Madrid. Holy fuck. Night and day.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2977417]There is no better way to get a girl into bed than a mind blowing tasting menu. I've done it countless times and it never fails.[/QUOTE]How many times exactly if I may ask? For example, in the past two years, how many times have you done this money-under-the-dinner-napkin thing? What age groups? What countries / cities? Success rate? Thanks again for taking the time to describe your method!

Home girls excluded (I've been with her for more than 18 mo now but we still do it semi-regularly as a fun date). So we are only talking about my travels for fun. I've done it with every girl I've met, 2-3/ trip, 2-3 trips / yr. I won't tell you where because that may help someone make me. I will say I like Europe. No one over 26, all but 1 were legit college students. I banged all of them but some with more enthusiasm than others. I don't do escorts, prostitutes or massage parlors unless I'm in Asia where everything is one big blurry line.

The restaurant can be a massive icebreaker. If you have absolutely nothing in common 1) you can always talk about the course and the next and the next 2) I guarantee she's never done anything like it before 3) if she knows you can spring that much on a dinner and give her whatever you agreed to she's going to want you in her contacts list.

Almost all have sent me messages after we've split thanking me for the experience and how they'd love to see me again and I know god damn well it's not because of my good looks. And as I've already said at least twice I have one coming to me for a month to continue where we left off.

Note: I've never claimed this is cheap or I can get this for that. This is what I do. Do with the info what you will. I couldn't care less about the money. If one girl wants a couple hundred more than another girl it's not going to affect my life one bit and if I want to fuck her I'll pay it in a heartbeat. The money means a lot more to her than it does to me.

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2977671]How many times exactly if I may ask? For example, in the past two years, how many times have you done this money-under-the-dinner-napkin thing? What age groups? What countries / cities? Success rate? Thanks again for taking the time to describe your method![/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2977695]
The restaurant can be a massive icebreaker...

I couldn't care less about the money. If one girl wants a couple hundred more than another girl it's not going to affect my life one bit and if I want to fuck her I'll pay it in a heartbeat. The money means a lot more to her than it does to me.[/QUOTE]1. The restaurant is a qualifying step. Like an interview for a job. Evaluate her body mass index. Use your penile erection for that. If no erection in the restaurant, she's not worth taking home. Disqulify the ones who are not worth $$ or your time. Common problems: Woman is fatter than her photos. Woman has a bad attitude. Woman steals your cell phone when you turn your back (yes it has happened). Do not trust these biches. Do not go to the bathroom and leave your cell phone on the table.

2. We call care about money, because we work to get it. And that is how we value pussy. And I probably have more $$ than anyone on this site. My net worth is more than most professional athletes, because I grew up poor and appreciate the value of money. There really is an inverse relationship between price per meet and value of pussy. My best girls, that I keep around for years, one charges me $0 and I buy her clothes every other month, about $150 each time. She spent the night with me a day ago and I gave her nothing, bought her a pair of pants at a discount store and took her to a Mexican fast foot place. And I give $200 for the other two women. And I / we have the best relationship / arrangements where money is not an issue. So there is an inverse relationship between the PPM and how long you will keep them. The most transient hoors are asking the most $$ and are doing multiple guys and they will flake off and not show up if they get a higher $$ offer from someone else.

Good luck. The women are trying to ask "how much will my gift be when I meet you at the restaurant?" And I message them $0. A gift comes from non-requested generocity and is not panhandles or asked for. You men who throw money around are really stupid and poisoning the system for us ALL. Stop it.

[QUOTE=TheCane;2977557]In your experience, how often does that happen (peck on the cheek and good night) versus back to the room for sexual relations?[/QUOTE]FB said he had a 10% fail rate but I suspect there is a key difference here.

His (and Steve's) overseas dinner dates are open to fucking from the beginning. They would meet directly at the hotel if asked. The dinner itself is not necessary to fuck them. FB and Steve, do you agree?

But the girls you (Cane) mentioned, those that ask to be paid for their time to have dinner with you, are trying to sell non-sexual companionship. So it's likely to end with a peck on the cheek and good night nearly every time.

If you believe what I give affects what you give you are completely delusional. At most, she'll demand the same from a few others and get laughed back into her place. There's no site where they collude and set prices like a pussy cartel.

I wouldn't go anywhere near a girl that would be happy with $150 worth of clothes every other month or someone who comes over for free for my charming company and dashing good looks. My standards are a hell of a lot higher than that.

[QUOTE=NeilGeorge;2977874]Good luck. The women are trying to ask "how much will my gift be when I meet you at the restaurant?" And I message them $0. A gift comes from non-requested generocity and is not panhandles or asked for. You men who throw money around are really stupid and poisoning the system for us ALL. Stop it.[/QUOTE]

I summarized the types of girls you'll find a year or two ago on this thread, there are 4 or 5 types, only one I'm interested in. I stay away from the ones who think they'll get paid just for platonic time. So generally, yes, I won't meet them unless we've had enough discussion to be reasonably sure they're going to be willing to jump in bed. There are some duds though. I hate nose rings, I mean really hate nose rings. A girl who was otherwise really cute showed up with one and I should have cut it short after dinner but we ended up in bed anyway and I just couldn't perform. It's crazy I know but I think they're stupid and do nothing to enhance their appearance, complete opposite.

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2977973]FB said he had a 10% fail rate but I suspect there is a key difference here.

His (and Steve's) overseas dinner dates are open to fucking from the beginning. They would meet directly at the hotel if asked. The dinner itself is not necessary to fuck them. FB and Steve, do you agree?

But the girls you (Cane) mentioned, those that ask to be paid for their time to have dinner with you, are trying to sell non-sexual companionship. So it's likely to end with a peck on the cheek and good night nearly every time.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2978045]If you believe what I give affects what you give you are completely delusional. At most, she'll demand the same from a few others and get laughed back into her place. There's no site where they collude and set prices like a pussy cartel.

I wouldn't go anywhere near a girl that would be happy with $150 worth of clothes every other month or someone who comes over for free for my charming company and dashing good looks. My standards are a hell of a lot higher than that.[/QUOTE]I agree with Mr. George on that one. Its sad some of you men have to pay to meet a woman. You pay for their meals at the restaurants. And some of the women order steak and lobster. They think it is a test of how generous and easy you are to get things from. And I always decline a Mooch. My standards are too high to let me pay these prostituting sluts who roam around collecting meetup fees from you dumb guys. My time is worth much more than theirs's, especially since they think I make more money than they do and can support them financially. Isn't my time worth more?? They should pay me a $200 meetup fee for my time.

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2978046] I hate nose rings, I mean really hate nose rings. A girl who was otherwise really cute showed up with one and I should have cut it short after dinner but we ended up in bed anyway and I just couldn't perform. It's crazy I know but I think they're stupid and do nothing to enhance their appearance, complete opposite.[/QUOTE]I have a pink dog leash and a matching pink dog collar. For a while I would get the girls to wear the collar and clip on the leash and make them crawl on all fours into my bedroom. I should attach the leash to their nose ring and lead them to my bedroom by their nose ring!

I need to start doing that again. It teaches the hoors to be submissive and reminds me of the new Nicole Kidman "Babygirl" movie where she got down on all fours like a dog, the guy then masturbated her. Sad what they put in movies now days. I need to be more perverse.

I don't know why I keep feeding you trolls but here goes.

As a dumb guy, I can very safely say you obviously have no idea what having a sb means. If you want a prostitute go get a prostitute why are you on the seeking thread? In my entire life I have never, not once, not ever, had a date or sb or potential sb order steak and lobster. That's a cliche from 40 years ago.

And as your reading comprehension appears to need some assistance I only offer money when I'm traveling as a way to speed up the cursory BS as my time is at an extreme premium. Your time may well be more valuable than hers but she deserves way better than you. Stick to AMPS and *****houses, you'll be happier and spend less money.

[QUOTE=HumbleHal;2978121]I agree with Mr. George on that one. Its sad some of you men have to pay to meet a woman. You pay for their meals at the restaurants. And some of the women order steak and lobster. They think it is a test of how generous and easy you are to get things from. And I always decline a Mooch. My standards are too high to let me pay these prostituting sluts who roam around collecting meetup fees from you dumb guys. My time is worth much more than theirs's, especially since they think I make more money than they do and can support them financially. Isn't my time worth more?? They should pay me a $200 meetup fee for my time.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=HumbleHal;2978121]I agree with Mr. George on that one. Its sad some of you men have to pay to meet a woman. You pay for their meals at the restaurants. And some of the women order steak and lobster. They think it is a test of how generous and easy you are to get things from. And I always decline a Mooch. My standards are too high to let me pay these prostituting sluts who roam around collecting meetup fees from you dumb guys. My time is worth much more than theirs's, especially since they think I make more money than they do and can support them financially. Isn't my time worth more?? They should pay me a $200 meetup fee for my time.[/QUOTE]One time a woman on Seeking told me I couldn't afford her. But you see, she was the one standing there with her panties down and her hand out (metaphorically)! LMAO! And she's going to have the nerve to tell me what I can and cannot afford? GTFOH! Nobody tells me what I can and cannot afford. No, I'm the one with the money here, and you're the one in need of some. That's why you're here. The arrogance! Horny, desperate men allow themselves to be taken prey by succumbing to this kind of entitled, arrogant female behavior exhibited by attractive women who expect guys to kiss their asses to get with them. Like you said, they ought to be paying me a meet-up fee! Other than the food and drink itself, I have never paid out for a straight meet and greet. And I never will! You want that cash? Then give me that gash! What's fair is fair. I'm not going to literally pay a woman to feed her, then she goes off and fucks guys she likes for free! We're talking about being a Super Simp LOL! Not going to happen.

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2978195]I have never, not once, not ever, had a date or sb or potential sb order steak and lobster. That's a cliche from 40 years ago.[/QUOTE]I did have a tute in Panama try to pull that shit one time though about 20 years ago. Tried to order expensive lobster, and I told her big ass no hahaha! She got shrimp instead. Fucked her, and the sex was good, but after she left I noticed that a tiny little bottle of alcohol (think it was Bailey's) was missing from the open-style mini bar (versus the types you can lock). That's the only time a girl, tute or other, has ever stolen from me too.

[QUOTE=HumbleHal;2978121]I agree with Mr. George on that one. Its sad some of you men have to pay to meet a woman. You pay for their meals at the restaurants. And some of the women order steak and lobster. They think it is a test of how generous and easy you are to get things from. And I always decline a Mooch. My standards are too high to let me pay these prostituting sluts who roam around collecting meetup fees from you dumb guys. My time is worth much more than theirs's, especially since they think I make more money than they do and can support them financially. Isn't my time worth more?? They should pay me a $200 meetup fee for my time.[/QUOTE]Dude I'm not sure how you are in real life but you definitely come off as combative and angry and dismissive here. This game might just not be for you.

I know it's a forum. Anything you say is true. I'm sure you're unbelievably wealthy, so charming girls buy you dinner and pay you to bed them, pick and choose girls at your personal buffet and on and on. Go ahead and say it so we can all roll our eyes.

You just bring such a negative energy here that if you're really like this is person, more than anything I just feel bad and hope you get whatever you need to find some peace and calm that pain (which I'm sure is nothing because you have everything you need and want for nothing and are the king of your domain and call all the shots. I know. We all know).

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2978045]If you believe what I give affects what you give you are completely delusional. At most, she'll demand the same from a few others and get laughed back into her place. There's no site where they collude and set prices like a pussy cartel.

I wouldn't go anywhere near a girl that would be happy with $150 worth of clothes every other month or someone who comes over for free for my charming company and dashing good looks. My standards are a hell of a lot higher than that.[/QUOTE]NG's guide is great if you are using seeking to get hookers. Thing I see in the responses is hostility. The guys are playing a zero sum win-lose game of hooker v. John. If you are worried about a SB prospect stealing your phone, you need to screen better. If a woman says how much to meet for dinner and you say zero to her, you are trying to win that hostile game. She is a tease. Say nothing and move on.

So I admire the guy who has a hooker he is banging at a discount. A hooker is just good in the bedroom. The best sugar babies are the best in and out of the bedroom, and that often leads to the paradox that the best sugar babies may ask for the least but get the most because if a woman is good company, you are going to spend a lot on her for dinner, trips, shows ETC.

What gets me is hearing, "well, you are still paying for it". Do you pay your doctor, lawyer, real estate agent, and your kid's teacher? If you are saying about them, I got the best doctor, lawyer ETC and brag about how little you are paying them, then I doubt you have the best.

In fact, every time a guy comes on here and brags about how little he is paying and shows a photo of a woman, my visceral response is the same. I would not fuck that woman for free.

OTOH, if a guy says, I have this great doctor or lawyer ETC and he likes to fish. He is really busy but I let him have my fishing boat when he has time, and he is always free for me and gives me a break on the price. If I am told that, maybe you do have the best doctor, lawyer ETC. That kind of relationship is friendly, mutual, sugar like, and it goes beyond just money for services.

So NG gave a great guide for banging hookers on seeking. But as a guide for landing sugar babies? Not so much. If your relationship is hostile, it is not a sugar one.

I am not the moderator here (Midwestern is) but I'm def one of the OG guys as is Elvis. And I think it's a shame that this forum has degenerated into criticism and name calling. Appreciate the recent post from Elvis def trying to point this the right direction. Let's contribute stories and try to make everyone here more successful at Seeking.

When I was looking to see the origins of this thread (we miss you MW!) I came across a post from me from 2020 when this thread started and I was just getting into Seeking game. Much of it still applies. Interesting that I did indeed offer a Colombian hottie $100 to cover travel costs if we didn't vibe. Haven't done that in forever but it worked out great back then and she def wasn't showing up without it. And it ended up in a threesome w her best friend for no extra charge. Sigh. Seeking is so great despite the roadblocks.

[URL]http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2411854&viewfull=1[/URL]#post2411854.

The post I am referring to is a ways down this page. Although the Vegas story at the top is a fun read.

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2977644]That's the reason. Seeing the sane shit and eating at the same restaurants with different girls gets old after a while. Everytime I travel I learn something new. Budget is only over of the problem. I'm generally very unimpressed with the selection in my city so if I want Asians I go to Asia, if I want a slav (my present fettish) I go to Europe.[/QUOTE]Thats true. I always say Asian women in the USA get overrated. I see asian 3's in the USA get drooled over. If you want asian beauty, you should go to asia. Although one thing I think really affects beauty and gives american women an edge is access to decent food. Many poor women in asian countries don't have access to decent food and end up less attractive then they could be.

[QUOTE=Kazeu;2978614]Thats true. I always say Asian women in the USA get overrated. I see asian 3's in the USA get drooled over. [/QUOTE]Asians in west are overrated cause men like to imagine that those girls are not damaged by feminism (or in general Americanism).

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2978568]I am not the moderator here (Midwestern is) but I'm def one of the OG guys as is Elvis. And I think it's a shame that this forum has degenerated into criticism and name calling. Appreciate the recent post from Elvis def trying to point this the right direction.[/QUOTE]Yeah, my first reaction was the same as FB. I just remembered when I first started the sugar daddy game and the baby steps it took to get where I was. That telephone line really hit home for me because if you feel the need to hide your phone with a woman, you have a hooker not a SB but how long until a guy feels comfortable finding women where he can leave his phone out? There is no right answer.

I really liked this talk and the case to be made for seeing escorts is made beautifully here, [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Z62YOHP1uc.[/URL] What is more relevant to the discussion here is talk #2 and the $50,000 beer. [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mKCg3amDDy8[/URL].

What that discussion shows is what is best for a guy is often best based on his time and how much his time is worth. There is no one best size fits all. If you get off solely on sex with a woman, then I do not know why you would want a SB over an escort. But with me over time, I wanted more than just sex. Still, even then, I enjoyed fucking the seeking escort types.

I met this stripper in Colombia from Venezuela. She was really beautiful, danced well, and she liked the sex so much that there was not the usual feeling of paying for it. I got to talking to her, and she seemed together, said she was a lawyer back in Venezuela, and showed me where she lived. It was a tiny place but when she showed me her bed, I just could not take it. My back just hurt looking at it, so I bought her a bed. I do not even remember how much it was, something like $100 or $150, and she texted me a photo when it arrived and told me how happy she was.

So we are at a point now where she can really like me as being a nice, generous guy and want to hang out with me more or think I am a sucker that she can fleece more out of it. She tried the latter approach and I spent a lot of time trying to get her to the mutualistic, sugar POV, and it was like I was talking to a brick wall. There was just one push after another for more money, and I was done being generous. My final text to her was, "I am really sorry you do not get where I am coming from. " I was kind of sad about it. You want to choose the stripper lifestyle? Really?

If I posted that here back then, I was sure I would get the usual catcalling about strippers, and how I would never do that, or I screen better ETC. You can debate what a 10 is but let's just say she was a 10 type meaning when she walked in a room every guy stopped what they were doing and stared. That quality is hard to find and spending a $150 to land a SB like that and is great in bed is not that much. So if you say, I would never do that, I would wonder if you are going after the 10 types.

About a year later, I talked to a female friend of mine who is great at giving me the woman's POV. I have noticed women are actually more realistic with relationships and when I told her about this gal, she said that this girl was too smart to not understand my offer. She said this girl thought you two were not compatible and just played dumb. She did not want to be your SB because she thought when you met the real her, you would not want to be with her. I got it immediately. She had tattoos and admitted to smoking pot but in reality, her drug use was probably worse than that. I fucked up because I did not address the self-esteem issue.

As far as the forum then, I wish we would have less of guys who say they have it all figured out (you can only have it all figured out for you) and more of I fucked up but here is what I learned and how I did better. I mean, how many 10 types have self worth issues? Like all of them right? Thing is how many guys are going to say I screwed up by buying the bed versus addressing the self esteem? I cannot recall anyone here EVER mentioning self-esteem but it affects so much.

Thing is self-esteem goes both ways. We have been trained to think the hottest women like the athletic studs or rock stars. One of the hard parts for me with my current gal was my self-esteem as in WTF are you doing with me? You can get a pro soccer player ETC. The issue with hookers is they are just there for your money, and guys get used to that. It takes a rise in your self-esteem to really believe that hot chick likes you for more than money.

And on that front, Steve, the divorce lawyer you introduced the forum to had a great talk with the psychiatrist I mentioned on that channel you listed. They talked for 3 hours and when I listened, it felt like 5 minutes: [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fnj_63ZHNq8[/URL].

My favorite part was the divorce lawyer had a client who totaled up the expense of his wife and the cost of each time they had sex, and the final tally was each time he had sex with her, it cost him $50,000. So on the self esteem front, do not feel like you are a loser for paying for it. Often the men who are not "paying for it" are the biggest losers going.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2978568]I am not the moderator here (Midwestern is) but I'm def one of the OG guys as is Elvis. And I think it's a shame that this forum has degenerated into criticism and name calling. Appreciate the recent post from Elvis def trying to point this the right direction. Let's contribute stories and try to make everyone here more successful at Seeking.

When I was looking to see the origins of this thread (we miss you MW!) I came across a post from me from 2020 when this thread started and I was just getting into Seeking game. Much of it still applies. Interesting that I did indeed offer a Colombian hottie $100 to cover travel costs if we didn't vibe. Haven't done that in forever but it worked out great back then and she def wasn't showing up without it. And it ended up in a threesome w her best friend for no extra charge. Sigh. Seeking is so great despite the roadblocks.

[URL]http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2411854&viewfull=1[/URL]#post2411854.

The post I am referring to is a ways down this page. Although the Vegas story at the top is a fun read.[/QUOTE]It isn't just Seeking. You participate in many threads and I suspect you would agree that almost every thread has more negativism and negative posters than in years past.

Prices have gone up. I don't know if people are really spending a larger portion of their income / wealth on sex. But most people don't look at it that way. There is no fourth orifice into which to ejaculate. So they don't like paying more for the same thing. And I suppose there are retirees whose income hasn't kept up with inflation and whose wealth is depleted more each year due to spending but not earning. Personally, I have little patience with this. Young enough to fuck, young enough to still work. Another factor for the seeming bitterness of middle-aged posters is the higher travel costs. There is less business travel now. So employers are not subsidizing all this sex with airfares and hotels that are paid for by someone else. And airlines and hotels have raised the redemption levels for free travel, at the same time there are fewer spectacular offers to get miles and points for credit card sign-ups.

It is great if a guy is into high-performing slightly older ladies with a little meat on her bones. But for the guys into 18-25 year-olds, there are less of them entering the scene every year. A possible exception are South Americans both those who stay at home and those who go abroad to study, but in the Western World, the extended childhoods and the psychobabble that you don't reach adulthood until age 25 has ended the system where most everyone moved out at 18 and had to make it on their own. Some say all the youngsters went to OnlyFans, but I don't think that is the case. The youngins I see on OnlyFans are often the very Colombians who film during the day and do commercial sex in the evenings. Let's face facts. The world populace is getting older and fatter. It isn't just the commercial sex market. I stood in line a couple of hours to vote and noticed few, if any, ladies I wanted to fuck. Same thing happens in restaurants and supermarkets.

While we notice the lack of 18-25 year old women entering the industry, there are also a lack of young men in their 20's and 30's doing reports. Those reports would inevitably be favorable and bring infectious positive energy to threads. I am not sure what happened there. The media and governments have brought a lot of negative propaganda regarding sex work for years. I think some young men buy into some of that nonsense. Of course they are the most affected by the disproportionate increase in housing costs. After making rent, maybe there is just nothing left to purchase sex.

The trend away from sex at large facilities and away from large escort agencies, and toward women working independently or together in small numbers, increases the hassle factor for most guys and some of them resent it deeply. For their safety, screening is required in many situations and in practicality sex must be scheduled well in advance when dealing with a specific sex target. For Seeking in particular, any given lady can only be at one place at one time. When things go wrong, there is often no back-up plan. You just have to accept that the evening is wasted.

So many threads on John message boards have trended negative when compared to five to ten years ago. They sometimes devolve into the same angry old men complaining and complaining, and talking about the good, old days.

Great point. I in fact do have a relationship like that with my personal gp. I own a business almost everyone utilizes at some point in their lives. I do lots of stuff for him for free or almost free and in turn I get email and text message prescriptions at any time day or night and attention for whatever ailes me almost on demand. We see each other more at my business than I see him at his practice because I'm generally healthy and he needs me more that I need him. He can still hit my insurance, I don't care, I already pay for it, but to send an email on Fri night and to be able to go the pharmacy on Sat am to get my Rx is priceless to me.

[QUOTE=Elvis2008;2978399]


OTOH, if a guy says, I have this great doctor or lawyer ETC and he likes to fish. He is really busy but I let him have my fishing boat when he has time, and he is always free for me and gives me a break on the price. If I am told that, maybe you do have the best doctor, lawyer ETC. That kind of relationship is friendly, mutual, sugar like, and it goes beyond just money for services.
[/QUOTE]

Was talking to an attractive, older baby (35) the other night and she went off on the 20-something year-olds who want to charge guys ridiculous amounts of money just to meet and greet, and who even ask for as much as $1,000 per meet! She laughed at women who ask for that much, and even harder at desperate, horny men who pay that much just to meet up with a hot girl. You see, even the women with some sense know the truth. All these hoors know these asks are outrageous! Don't get "rooked" by these greedy hoors men! Don't let them take advantage of you! Remember. It isn't pussy that makes the world go around. It's money, and you my brothers are the ones carrying the money. So remember to act like it. Money rules and not pussy! You [B]do not[/B] pay a greedy, shifty softcore hoor one thin dime just to meet and greet. Not one red cent! Not ever!

Just so I'm clear with definitions. Every girl on seeking or any sb site is a soft core hoor?

[QUOTE=TheCane;2978687]Was talking to an attractive, older baby (35) the other night and she went off on the 20-something year-olds who want to charge guys ridiculous amounts of money just to meet and greet, and who even ask for as much as $1,000 per meet! She laughed at women who ask for that much, and even harder at desperate, horny men who pay that much just to meet up with a hot girl. You see, even the women with some sense know the truth. All these hoors know these asks are outrageous! Don't get "rooked" by these greedy hoors men! Don't let them take advantage of you! Remember. It isn't pussy that makes the world go around. It's money, and you my brothers are the ones carrying the money. So remember to act like it. Money rules and not pussy! You [B]do not[/B] pay a greedy, shifty softcore hoor one thin dime just to meet and greet. Not one red cent! Not ever![/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2978718]Just so I'm clear with definitions. Every girl on seeking or any sb site is a soft core hoor?[/QUOTE]But you have to start with the assumption that she is unless and until satisfactorily proven otherwise. Unfortunately, there is no one formula for accomplishing this. Otherwise it would be easy for the daddies wouldn't it?

And now back to your regularly scheduled programming! 😝.

Aside from all the back and forth in here, I know many of you are out there killing it. Do tell! I was fortunate to bag a real hottie. Just my type. My few summary tips are:

The chat vibe is everything. A pro won't stick with an ongoing chat. They want to meet up right away and may respond with a word or two. A real girl will stay in girlfriend like touch. Don't over do it but chat enough to get this distinction.

Treat her like your GF and she will reciprocate. Respect will get you everywhere.

Dont pre negotiate time. Let ur vibe do the talking. We were together 6.5 hours. She will prob sleepover tonight.

Here's how it went down:

I suppose it's been 6 months or so since my last first date. I've been repeating a lot with girls I am already into. But as I have a couple days before my Brasileira arrives I'the been hitting Seeking for about a month now and trying to find a euro hottie.

I ended up with maybe 5 girls willing to meet and with price settled (250-350) but two stood out as very NON pro and just that great girlfriend vibe. Not as glam as some of the semi-pros but soooo much more engaged in the convo the true sign of a real girl.

I was darn locked up with Michaela but when she said she was going to be on her period (nice of her) I moved her to the following week and then she dropped off the schedule when Mya decided to come from Brazil to join me that week. Meantime Ariana came on strong with the sweetest little chat vibe.

She's Asian living in Europe and very much a real girl next door vibe. Almost all her pics were casual no makeup and goofy stuff. So my expectations were tempered on the physical front but was def down with her vibe.

We met up at this well reviewed sushi restaurant and WOW was I surprised when she walked in the door. Beautiful petite (but w curves) girl and an amazing alt / goth vibe while still being very classy. Really my perfect type.

Dinner itself it an amazing 7 course tasting menu but more importantly the vibe is off the charts. Her English is absolutely stunning, basically like a native speaker, so no awkward google translate. Just flows.

Thinking about all the girls I've dated, the ones I truly adored had three things in common: They were chatty, bubbly, and affectionate. And she hits it out of the park on chatty and bubbly. Affectionate? We will soon see!

After dinner, we decide to bounce to a bar about ten minutes walk. As happens when you vibe, the flow is natural. When I put my arm around her she reciprocates and leans in. Or she takes my arm as we stroll. Yep. Affectionate also. I can just feel it. At the bar, very chill vibe and we can cuddle and continue to vibe. Some dancing. Just effortless.

Guess we are about 4-5 hours in at this point, which is what I love about Seeking. No rush. No per hour fees. Just two people (with a 35 year age gap!) who really enjoy being together. But yep room time still to come! So we bounce to the hotel and right up to my room. No front desk issues (booked for two persons just in case).

In the room, the vibe is 100% comfortable. We start by making out and damn she can kiss. None of this open mouth but no tongue or the quick tongue in / out like you get w some pros. This is full-on tongue tangling, tongue sucking magic! We are super in sync on our kissing style. And passionate it is.

We have a solid one foot height differential so it's not long before I push her on her back on the bed and get on top, making out and grinding fully clothed. She's def getting worked up and I love it.

I love a slow build and getting undressed so I let her undo my belt and pull me out for some stroking while we make out. Yum. And then we get down to skivvies but still just grinding and building the anticipation. I pull her on top of me and she starts grinding like she means it! I undo her bra and find spectacular firm be cups. Super fine and I massage the fuck out of them as she grinds.

After a bit we get naked and it's on! Her BJ is super excellent. Nice ball massaging while working the shaft in mouth. Some very nice tongue wiggles at base while deep throated (uncommon!) and some amazing sloppy BLS. I reciprocate and really do some amazing DATY if I do say so myself. Can't get the crashing O but get plenty of squeaks and jerks and build up, but eventually pack in and move to fucking.

I roll her on top and we grind naked junk to lady parts, giving her the opportunity to go bare. But alas she opts for the condom option and I don't push her on this. Of course I could fuck till the cows come home after a few drinks and a condom and we do go at it for quite some time. Cowgirl, the Steve, doggie. With plenty of making out when facing each other. I love a girl who loves to kiss.

Eventually we lose the condom and go for the BJ to finish it out. Thank god her BJ is on point with the late hour and many drinks. But it is in fact epic and those tongue tricks and BLS lead to a great climax CIM. Wow. I wasn't keeping track of time but we were def at it for an hour or more!

She has several hours of work in the morning so we find her a taxi at 2:30 AM and off she goes. We plan to meetup today and stroll the city and dinner again tonight. When the chemistry is there there is no time limit. Seeking still rules if you put in the effort.

Always love your reports Steve. How about some missing specifics. 250 to 350 dollars? Or euros? At first I thought it was USD then you talk about one of the girls flying up from Brazil. Man that's a long way to go for a date. Then you switch over to an Asian living in Europe. Got my head spinning.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2979322]And now back to your regularly scheduled programming! 😝.

Aside from all the back and forth in here, I know many of you are out there killing it. Do tell! I was fortunate to bag a real hottie. Just my type. My few summary tips are:

The chat vibe is everything. A pro won't stick with an ongoing chat. They want to meet up right away and may respond with a word or two. A real girl will stay in girlfriend like touch. Don't over do it but chat enough to get this distinction.

Treat her like your GF and she will reciprocate. Respect will get you everywhere.

Dont pre negotiate time. Let ur vibe do the talking. We were together 6.5 hours. She will prob sleepover tonight.

Here's how it went down:

I suppose it's been 6 months or so since my last first date. I've been repeating a lot with girls I am already into. But as I have a couple days before my Brasileira arrives I'the been hitting Seeking for about a month now and trying to find a euro hottie.

I ended up with maybe 5 girls willing to meet and with price settled (250-350) but two stood out as very NON pro and just that great girlfriend vibe. Not as glam as some of the semi-pros but soooo much more engaged in the convo the true sign of a real girl.

I was darn locked up with Michaela but when she said she was going to be on her period (nice of her) I moved her to the following week and then she dropped off the schedule when Mya decided to come from Brazil to join me that week. Meantime Ariana came on strong with the sweetest little chat vibe.

She's Asian living in Europe and very much a real girl next door vibe. Almost all her pics were casual no makeup and goofy stuff. So my expectations were tempered on the physical front but was def down with her vibe.

We met up at this well reviewed sushi restaurant and WOW was I surprised when she walked in the door. Beautiful petite (but w curves) girl and an amazing alt / goth vibe while still being very classy. Really my perfect type.

Dinner itself it an amazing 7 course tasting menu but more importantly the vibe is off the charts. Her English is absolutely stunning, basically like a native speaker, so no awkward google translate. Just flows.

Thinking about all the girls I've dated, the ones I truly adored had three things in common: They were chatty, bubbly, and affectionate. And she hits it out of the park on chatty and bubbly. Affectionate? We will soon see!

After dinner, we decide to bounce to a bar about ten minutes walk. As happens when you vibe, the flow is natural. When I put my arm around her she reciprocates and leans in. Or she takes my arm as we stroll. Yep. Affectionate also. I can just feel it. At the bar, very chill vibe and we can cuddle and continue to vibe. Some dancing. Just effortless.

Guess we are about 4-5 hours in at this point, which is what I love about Seeking. No rush. No per hour fees. Just two people (with a 35 year age gap!) who really enjoy being together. But yep room time still to come! So we bounce to the hotel and right up to my room. No front desk issues (booked for two persons just in case).

In the room, the vibe is 100% comfortable. We start by making out and damn she can kiss. None of this open mouth but no tongue or the quick tongue in / out like you get w some pros. This is full-on tongue tangling, tongue sucking magic! We are super in sync on our kissing style. And passionate it is.

We have a solid one foot height differential so it's not long before I push her on her back on the bed and get on top, making out and grinding fully clothed. She's def getting worked up and I love it.

I love a slow build and getting undressed so I let her undo my belt and pull me out for some stroking while we make out. Yum. And then we get down to skivvies but still just grinding and building the anticipation. I pull her on top of me and she starts grinding like she means it! I undo her bra and find spectacular firm be cups. Super fine and I massage the fuck out of them as she grinds.

After a bit we get naked and it's on! Her BJ is super excellent. Nice ball massaging while working the shaft in mouth. Some very nice tongue wiggles at base while deep throated (uncommon!) and some amazing sloppy BLS. I reciprocate and really do some amazing DATY if I do say so myself. Can't get the crashing O but get plenty of squeaks and jerks and build up, but eventually pack in and move to fucking.

I roll her on top and we grind naked junk to lady parts, giving her the opportunity to go bare. But alas she opts for the condom option and I don't push her on this. Of course I could fuck till the cows come home after a few drinks and a condom and we do go at it for quite some time. Cowgirl, the Steve, doggie. With plenty of making out when facing each other. I love a girl who loves to kiss.

Eventually we lose the condom and go for the BJ to finish it out. Thank god her BJ is on point with the late hour and many drinks. But it is in fact epic and those tongue tricks and BLS lead to a great climax CIM. Wow. I wasn't keeping track of time but we were def at it for an hour or more!

She has several hours of work in the morning so we find her a taxi at 2:30 AM and off she goes. We plan to meetup today and stroll the city and dinner again tonight. When the chemistry is there there is no time limit. Seeking still rules if you put in the effort.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Kazeu;2979391]Always love your reports Steve. How about some missing specifics. 250 to 350 dollars? Or euros? At first I thought it was USD then you talk about one of the girls flying up from Brazil. Man that's a long way to go for a date. Then you switch over to an Asian living in Europe. Got my head spinning.[/QUOTE]Yeah Europe. 250€. My Asian girl went to international school and came here for her masters. She's in marketing now. Like I say the best ones are real girls with real jobs. We went out again last night and walked the city for a few hours before closing it out in the room. She left around 1 AM. And horn dog that I am I checked out the Haima clubs and pulled a Colombian hottie at 3:30. It was a good night.

In other news it's not always roses for me. Just usually. My Brazilian cancelled and I am out plane tickets. Boo. But sooo many options plus sugar babies. I will drown my sorrows in pussy. Already over it!

Every time I think I've seen it all! Was perusing the site recently when I saw a woman's profile that said she wasn't there to date, but to try to find her husband's profile on the site LOL! Her profile included a few pictures of her with the same man in them, who I assumed to be her husband. Which I have a question about since I thought the rules state that only the identity of the owner of the profile could be seen in any photos associated with the profile. In any event, guys you better cover your tracks because your wives are creating profiles and looking for you on the site! LMFAO!

Thanks for the shoutout, Steve. And thanks for keeping this forum on point. Glad you and everyone else in here are having great successes. I don't have anything to report, but I love reading the reports.

My most recent arrangement ended this past April. We were meeting 5-8 times per month, for a year, then one day she suddenly told me she was getting married. Next day, I saw her wedding picture on her WeChat moments. I was barebacking her all the way up until she got married. Was probably my best arrangement. She was just a girl next door type, and just someone I met many years ago, and was able to convert her to a sugar babe with a ton of relentless patience. Haven't been able to get back into the saddle since.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2978568]I am not the moderator here (Midwestern is) but I'm def one of the OG guys as is Elvis. And I think it's a shame that this forum has degenerated into criticism and name calling. Appreciate the recent post from Elvis def trying to point this the right direction. Let's contribute stories and try to make everyone here more successful at Seeking.

When I was looking to see the origins of this thread (we miss you MW!) I came across a post from me from 2020 when this thread started and I was just getting into Seeking game. Much of it still applies. Interesting that I did indeed offer a Colombian hottie $100 to cover travel costs if we didn't vibe. Haven't done that in forever but it worked out great back then and she def wasn't showing up without it. And it ended up in a threesome w her best friend for no extra charge. Sigh. Seeking is so great despite the roadblocks.

[URL]http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4144-Seeking-Arrangements&p=2411854&viewfull=1[/URL]#post2411854.

The post I am referring to is a ways down this page. Although the Vegas story at the top is a fun read.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Kazeu;2978614]Thats true. I always say Asian women in the USA get overrated. I see asian 3's in the USA get drooled over. If you want asian beauty, you should go to asia. Although one thing I think really affects beauty and gives american women an edge is access to decent food. Many poor women in asian countries don't have access to decent food and end up less attractive then they could be.[/QUOTE]I can confirm that, low quality asians in USA get overrated. Here in western China Chengdu, a lot of stunners in the streets. However women are not as desperate.

[QUOTE=Midwestern;2979700]
My most recent arrangement ended this past April. We were meeting 5-8 times per month, for a year, then one day she suddenly told me she was getting married. Next day, I saw her wedding picture on her WeChat moments. I was barebacking her all the way up until she got married. Was probably my best arrangement. She was just a girl next door type, and just someone I met many years ago, and was able to convert her to a sugar babe with a ton of relentless patience. Haven't been able to get back into the saddle since.[/QUOTE]MW, when I was married and on seeking, the discussions of my SBs having BFs were much more honest. Obviously, I was still sleeping with my wife and they felt more comfortable sharing if they were sleeping with someone else too.

The funny part is one SB had a 10 type BF who was constantly being hit on by other women. The SB said, "If he cheats on me, I will cut his dick off. " I suspect she had said this before amongst her GFs and gotten a chorus of "you go girl". With me, the line got a belly full of laughter and she asked why I was doing this. I said, "Because you are fucking me" and her jaw dropped as she hemmed and hawed as to why her fucking me was okay but his fucking others was not.

I have to laugh as to this woman's morals, fucking a guy all through the courtship process but breaking it off when married. That is your definition of moral? Really? If I were to learn of a wife doing that, I hope I would say, "Well, why stop now? How about you take the money he is paying you and buy me a wardrobe of new suits? But from what I have seen, most women cannot turn on and off their passion. They are going to fuck with passion the men they are more into and so it was with my SB. When she was dating her BF, our sessions were much less passionate than before they hooked up.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2979561]Yeah Europe. 250. My Asian girl went to international school and came here for her masters. She's in marketing now. [/QUOTE]250 euros seems low. You offered 250 and she accepted or was there some offer, counter-offer type game? What part of Europe?

[QUOTE=Midwestern;2979700]
My most recent arrangement ended this past April. We were meeting 5-8 times per month, for a year, then one day she suddenly told me she was getting married. Next day, I saw her wedding picture on her WeChat moments. I was barebacking her all the way up until she got married.[/QUOTE]Sounds like she was unfaithful to you and her fiancé. Playing you both! You know she was screwing her future husband! Did you get her to sign a written consent and exclusivity agreement? If so you might get her to pay the cost of VD testing. Now you need to get yourself tested for STDs, herpes and hiv, since she was a proven double barebacker.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2414592]
After I cum, we are laying side by side I go to take the condom off and its not there! WTF? I go uh oh baby I seem to have lost something. She doesn't panic at all. She hops up, goes to the bathroom, and comes back bubbly as can be: "Yep, it was just inside. Theres cum in it so we should be good. But if you want I'll get a morning after pill, they cost like $40 if you don't mind paying -- I'll send you a pic of the receipt".[/QUOTE]Thats an old trick to get another $40 from you. They also keep your number and call you a couple months later and say they missed their period and tested pregnant with a pee on the stick, and need $1,000 for an abortion! And of course they are not pregnant, just want the wire of $1,000 as their tip! And many guys do that because they do not want a baby.

All these Vegas hoors are on the pill, the shot, an IUD and probably all sterile anyway from gonorrhea!

[QUOTE=Elvis2008;2979761] They are going to fuck with passion the men they are more into and so it was with my SB. When she was dating her BF, our sessions were much less passionate than before they hooked up.[/QUOTE]I second that. I experienced the same with my SB after she'd apparently met someone.

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2979805] I experienced the same with my SB after she'd apparently met someone.[/QUOTE]The women get more hurried and want to leave earlier as time goes on and the original connection wears down. You find out that it's all about the money and they try to get you to cum faster and they split quicker. That's when it's time to broom them permanently and get another!

[QUOTE=HumbleHal;2979785]Thats an old trick to get another $40 from you. They also keep your number and call you a couple months later and say they missed their period and tested pregnant with a pee on the stick, and need $1,000 for an abortion! And of course they are not pregnant, just want the wire of $1,000 as their tip! And many guys do that because they do not want a baby.
All these Vegas hoors are on the pill, the shot, an IUD and probably all sterile anyway from gonorrhea![/QUOTE]Another Vegas trick is the girls excuse themselves to go to the bathroom. Then they come out and announce, I just started my period! You are supposed to be confused. The girl then says, I can't have sex then, but you have to pay me for coming here! If they do not get money they start screaming.

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2979780]250 euros seems low. You offered 250 and she accepted or was there some offer, counter-offer type game? What part of Europe?[/QUOTE]This girl was in Barcelona. She offered 250 right out the gate and I accepted since it was fair. She's not a model. More girl next door but very pretty. Mostly because she's a non-pro she offered less. But she's the perfect seeking girl. Smart. Has a job. Enjoys going out and fucking and why not get a few bucks while you're at it?

I found most girls not going below 350 in Madrid and 300 in Barcelona.

Hello, wanting to know if it's a good deal to use seeking in either city. Some reporters have said that Buenos Aires sometimes it's a hit or miss. Looking for an all day date type and overnight fun.

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2979805]I second that. I experienced the same with my SB after she'd apparently met someone.[/QUOTE]I didn't demand exclusivity from my SBs. A lot of guys demand exclusivity because of STDs, but I thought worrying about STDs was kind of foolish because the worst thing I ever got in the hobby was strep throat after kissing a girl which was worse than most STDs. And I thought demanding exclusivity while banging others was hypocritical and could not be enforced.

Now I wonder. As for being a hypocrite, I am paying, and we are not equal members in a relationship, so that was wrong. If she is performing less well when banging someone else, I should have thought it was not okay.

As far as enforcing the exclusivity, I could easily check if she kept her seeking profile up, pay for her phone and track where she went, and look at her social media. One SB told me every time you see a woman at a fancy restaurant or location and she is alone, she has a SD paying for things. I could not believe how many women were full of it when I looked at their social media pages. My favorite was seeing the woman who broke a date due to a sick father and seeing her on Facebook that same night with another guy at a Bruno Mars concert. I guess that was her dad and he got better really quickly and took her there.

Then there was the Julia Roberts / Pretty Woman no kissing sign. If a woman says she does not like kissing or it is icky, that is not because she does not like to kiss most times. It is because she is kissing someone else. With Julia Roberts in Pretty Woman, fucking a stranger was okay but kissing him was too intimate. I think that is most women.

If I did track women and demand exclusivity, I am not sure what I would have done. Maybe not directly confront them but imply I knew they were with someone else. Is your dad any better? BTW, does he happen to be a Bruno Mars fan? Just curious.

Is it better to push or nudge someone into exclusivity, let them go, or live with it if you learn she is seeing others? I am sure it varies case by case, but I think in hindsight I probably should have made exclusivity a goal with at least some of my SBs.

[QUOTE=KCK12;2980382]Hello, wanting to know if it's a good deal to use seeking in either city. Some reporters have said that Buenos Aires sometimes it's a hit or miss. Looking for an all day date type and overnight fun.[/QUOTE]Buenos Aires is Seeking heaven. Really friendly, bubbly and easy going girls, despite the language barrier. They love USD due to currency fluctuations there, so I managed to snag 150-200 USD for a several hours (3-4) meet with real hotties. Not too sure about overnights, not my thing.

Can't see the use of seeking in São Paulo with places like Scandallo. Not worth the seeking headache of getting to know virtually / filtering out timewasters etc. Just go to Scandallo, get their numbers and ask them to spend the night with you. And besides, for some some reason, the selection in São Paulo on seeking never seemed tempting anyway.

[QUOTE=Elvis2008;2980419]I didn't demand exclusivity from my SBs. A lot of guys demand exclusivity because of STDs, but I thought worrying about STDs was kind of foolish because the worst thing I ever got in the hobby was strep throat after kissing a girl which was worse than most STDs. And I thought demanding exclusivity while banging others was hypocritical and could not be enforced.
...

As far as enforcing the exclusivity, I could easily check if she kept her seeking profile up, ...If a woman says she does not like kissing or it is icky, that is not because she does not like to kiss most times. It is because she is kissing someone else. With Julia Roberts in Pretty Woman, fucking a stranger was okay but kissing him was too intimate. I think that is most women.[/QUOTE]The worst I got was scabies from Blackbeards in DR. Had to get some special lotion when I got back and use it for 2 weeks. The bugs lay eggs inside your finger joints. Never got any STDs, thank God.

Everyone has herpes, so that is a minor thing.

If the woman still has her profile up, that indicates she is still roaming. If they quote you PPM before meeting, that tells you they are a pro. I avoid these kind.

Many of the women require condoms. That is an indicator that they fuck multiple guys. If they do not kiss, that means they are not really into you, just fucking for the money. I require bareback and tell them it is exclusive only. Of course, I have 4-5 exclusives in my arrangement harem. Have never gotten any STDs.

[QUOTE=Elvis2008;2980419]I didn't demand exclusivity from my SBs. A lot of guys demand exclusivity because of STDs...
As far as enforcing the exclusivity, I could easily check if she kept her seeking profile up...
Is it better to push or nudge someone into exclusivity, let them go, or live with it if you learn she is seeing others? I am sure it varies case by case, but I think in hindsight I probably should have made exclusivity a goal with at least some of my SBs.[/QUOTE]Ask Bill Clinton if people lie about their faithfulness. I am sure the women would lie, if pressed, as would you. There is no way of telling. You could say a friend / cousin of yours saw their profile up and you were wondering if they were still roaming around or exclusive with you. I had a SB tell that to me and of course I lied, said it must have been an old profile because men have to pay and I did not want to waste my money on that site again. LOL.

And even if you give them a car, diamond ring, they still will dump you if they want. Never trust a bar girl from the Philipines nor a women from a sex site. If you fish in a toilet you will end up with a turd!

For those of us out for GFE or the fantasy of GFE, I would guess knowing vs thinking vs assuming they were seeing other people at the same time would be some form of self protection. I think it's safe to say that none of us is special and if she met us there she would also meet others there. That's just common sense. I'm my experience, the legit college students have all been exclusive just because of their commitment to school. The non students I would believe in a heartbeat that I was just one in a rotation. I'm smart enough to not want to know the answer to that question so I don't ask but I will share the results of an std test as a subtle hint that I care enough to not fuck with her health and I hope she does the same. Maybe a huge, false assumption but don't fuck with the fantasy. If I'm otherwise happy and she's otherwise happy, again, don't fuck with the fantasy.

I do think it's not realistic to demand exclusivity if I'm not so I don't. As I write this I'm laying next to an imported SB while my regular is in the bullpen. I did decide I'd probably push for exclusivity with one of them in the near future as I complete this extended test drive but I'm having second thoughts. Don't fuck with the fantasy.

[QUOTE=Elvis2008;2980419]

Is it better to push or nudge someone into exclusivity, let them go, or live with it if you learn she is seeing others? I am sure it varies case by case, but I think in hindsight I probably should have made exclusivity a goal with at least some of my SBs.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=NeilGeorge;2980532]

Everyone has herpes, so that is a minor thing.
.[/QUOTE]Thats just not true. It's easier to get with a condom than some of the others. But it arguably sucks way more because you can't just take a pill and have it gone.

When you date outside this world, do women just really expect you have herpes and it's no big deal because everyone has it? That's been your experience?

(Written Jan 9, posting late).

Wrapping up 2 months in Lisbon and the sugar dating scene, I wanted to share some of what I learned to make the overall experience more comfortable than before. Previously I stayed towards the center of Lisbon, and was upset about the crappy roads / sidewalks and poorly constructed houses. This time, I decided to rent a car and stay farther away from the center and this made the experience much better. Still have problems with the poorly insulated houses, but I started to see why people like it here.

On the sugar dating scene, I've started connecting with the girls via video call before landing at my destination. For great candidates, I typically offer a monetary gift transferred via Revolut. I got this idea from the board and used it successfully in Medellin as well. This time I landed with a solid contact in an Angolan girl, currently working but wanting to save up money so she can study. I ended up seeing this girl almost weekly during my stay and being very happy with each date. I tried this same approach in my next destination (Rio de Janeiro) and it flopped pretty badly, even eliminating some girls that may have been decent dates. So, for now I'the say this tactic is safest to use in Europe (although it worked in Medellin too).

Given the scarcity of options in Europe compared to LatAm, I've also messaged girls with only one picture (which I previously disregarded as low effort sugar babies). One of these turned out to be a hot Portuguese girl, former Instagram influencer. Once we made contact, she shared her real photos and I was pretty happy. In the future, I'll likely reach out to these lower effort profiles more often and request pictures. We had a few dates which were excellent. Portuguese girls can be quite curvy and she had one of the most phenomenal asses I've ever seen on a Caucasian girl.

Speaking of body types, I spent a month last year in Paris, Vienna, Bucharest and Athens each. During this experience, I've learned that I don't like the thin European body types. They look good in pictures and generate some initial excitement, but don't hold my interest as well as the thicker Latina (and African) body types. I'm tempted to do a month in Italy (Rome or Milan) and France (probably near Geneva) next year, but expect my tastes will not change. And I expect those destinations will be less satisfying both to live in and for the sugar dating scene than Spain / Portugal, so I'll be back there and consider the area "home" for the foreseeable future.

On a personal level, I've also been taking better care of my health, really getting into longevity medicine and following people like Bryan Johnson, Peter Attia, Siim Land. Doing blood tests every 3 months and working with a trainer / nutritionist to optimize the metrics. I haven't cracked 40 yet, but I want to be banging 20 year olds beyond my 60's and as long as possible. Good health and happiness to you all.

[QUOTE=Elvis2008;2980419]IWith Julia Roberts in Pretty Woman, fucking a stranger was okay but kissing him was too intimate. I think that is most women.[/QUOTE]I have always found this kind of thinking to be absurd. I mean, the same woman might let you cum in her face and fuck her in the ass. But then she won't kiss because that's too intimate? Well I kind of get it. But mostly I don't. Some of these tutes watch too many (bad) movies!

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2980640]
I do think it's not realistic to demand exclusivity if I'm not so I don't. As I write this I'm laying next to an imported SB while my regular is in the bullpen. I did decide I'd probably push for exclusivity with one of them in the near future as I complete this extended test drive but I'm having second thoughts. Don't fuck with the fantasy.[/QUOTE]The SB I was talking about having a BF I saw a long time. I saw her twice a week and gave her a few hundred but she would have had to have a mid five figure job to make the same as I was paying her. Compared to escorts, I thought it was a great deal.

And she would have been the most popular escort in town if she went that route. One of my SBs who was not as pretty did the escort route and DID become the most popular escort in town. Thing is the SB turned escort was miserable. The shit she had to put up with from guys was unreal, and she lost her kid when she became an escort. As is so often the case when you are not happy, she overspent. She told me that she was making $15 k a month but spending $16 k. I have a feeling it was actually more than that.

So that one route I thought as being open to her was not really open. She did work. On the job front, she finally found something decent but in general, low wage jobs suck.

Well, she could get another SD, but I am not sure how enjoyable that would have been. These relationships fizzle out quickly, and sometimes, the guys get weird, cheap, or unreliable. I thought it would have been a snap for her to get a SD but getting a good one would not have been so easy.

And now I think about it at her age, mid 20's, she is spending 8 to 10 hours a week with me and having her financial needs met. Was she really going to risk that on some BF?

I was much younger then and has been trained to think a woman like this was way beyond me, and she was not. Not by any means. In fact, a huge part of the issue at the time was a wife taking a chain saw to my self-esteem, and I see that with a lot of guys. It is hard to see when you are in it, but it is so obvious once it is gone.

As for the fantasy, don't you want the fantasy that she does not want any other man but you? When we talked, she talked about her BF, and it was interesting so I did not mind it, but looking back on it, he and not I was the focus of her life, and that really was not okay.

The first few women I met in South America on seeking videoed me showing me they were taking down their profile. They WANTED to have one man in their life, and after I read some studies that the government was trying to bury about how lame condoms were for STDs, I decided I wanted to go bare from then on (if the women were on birth control). The women have a sixth sense in accommodating men and I ran into almost no resistance on this issue. So yeah, the biggest hurdle to my getting BB sex was me. LOL.

And I think it could have been the same with this. Make exclusivity an expectation. I would never do it with the seeking hooker type but with a younger one with whom I had chemistry? Of course, I could have and should have. I could say "I know you are not an escort because seeking bans escorts. Thing is there are some hookers on there who bounce from bed to bed. I doubt you are a woman like that. The reason I am on seeking is to find a woman who is exclusive to me. I almost hate to ask this, but you are an exclusive girl and not a hooker right?" Put it like that and very few women will answer they are a hooker.

And women are not geared to be fucking multiple men. The worst names are used to describe such women and long term, I am not sure it is good for them to be doing it. Divorce rates sky rocket the more partners a woman has. I know it sounds like bullshit to say, "I know deep down you want to be to be exclusive with a guy and I am going to help you be like that", but I think some women would have responded to it.

The funny part about this was how MW's story reminded me of my flawed thinking. Oh, I cannot control things and was flattered the woman is willing to fuck me. Oh, I would have been a hypocrite for fucking other women and expecting her to be exclusive but now I am like, if the woman is giving her best pussy to another guy and I was giving her the money such that she has the time to do that, wasn't I a simp? I kind of think I was.

I wonder what would have happened had I changed my default settings. I changed my default from condoms to bareback and it worked great. I wonder if I checked exclusivity as my default setting what would have happened. Maybe you guys can try it and let us all know, but I think it would have enhanced my relationships. I should not have been giving these women money such that they spent it on other guys or that it enabled them to hang out with other guys.

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2980703]Thats just not true. It's easier to get with a condom than some of the others. But it arguably sucks way more because you can't just take a pill and have it gone.
When you date outside this world, do women just really expect you have herpes and it's no big deal because everyone has it? That's been your experience?[/QUOTE]In the United States, 50–80% of adults have oral herpes (HSV-1), and 1 in 6 people aged 14–49 have genital herpes (HSV-2). Prevalence is higher among Mexican-Americans. Co-infection with both HSV-1 and HSV-2 is rare. Its surprising because many women give blow jobs on your dick, but yet the dick does not get HIV. I am a doctor.

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2980703]Thats just not true. It's easier to get with a condom than some of the others. But it arguably sucks way more because you can't just take a pill and have it gone.

When you date outside this world, do women just really expect you have herpes and it's no big deal because everyone has it? That's been your experience?[/QUOTE]AP, when I did a STD test, I tested + for HSV 1. Like NG mentioned, I knew about the 50 to 80% stat and was not surprised by at all. I have not even had a cold sore I can remember but given how many years I was in the hobby, it would have been a surprise if it were negative.

Still, I got this bold note on the testing, YOU NEED TO SEE YOUR DOCTOR IMMEDIATELY! So I get why there is hysteria, I just was not sure where it came from. I found an article that did a good job tracing the HSV origins.

[URL]https://slate.com/technology/2019/12/genital-herpes-stigma-history-explained.html[/URL]

According to Guinan, she was also roped into appearing on an episode of The Phil Donahue Show in which Donahue accused Guinan of "covering up" the herpes epidemic as the live studio audience heckled her.

Yeah, it was all Phil Donahue's fault. That bastard!

When I came out with my sugaring life style to people, there was a positive feeling of whatever makes you happy makes us happy but a negative one of envy as well. I probably should have been less open than I was, certainly about the amount of sex I was having.

Thing is the couples who married in the 1950's and early 60's had to be careful about her getting pregnant. The pill comes out in the early 60's, and in a few years, everyone is fucking like bunnies. You can imagine the people who missed out on the free love era were not happy and maybe a little envious.

If a guy is getting laid and the other one is not, the one not getting sex will often bring up diseases. Similarly, the people having less sex or fewer partners wanted there to be consequences for those having more sex, and herpes was latched onto as punishment for sexual promiscuity.

And that is how a little painful blister that was viewed as trivial in the medical profession in the 1960's became associated with "being diseased" and an epidemic in the 1980's. If only those free love children had been a little more discreet, we might have avoided this.

I know you might not feel comfortable with this. The harder something is drilled into your head, the more difficult it is to let go of. But with herpes, it is not what the women think but what we know that matters. It is really not a big deal.

My trip ended up being a nice blend of clubs and Seeking-type interactions. See the Madrid and Barcelona sections for the full reports. Some pretty epic stuff.

A few summary thoughts in the context of Seeking. First. I wrote about my first date with Ariana below. I ended up having three more dates with her including a helicopter ride for her birthday. We spent anywhere between 10-16 hours together each day. I did buy her presents and take her nice places. Honestly that's the way it should be. If you want to be a salt daddy then go for it. But it's way more fun being a sugar daddy if you can afford it and I can.

I also had an 11 hour Seeking-like date with a girl I met at Vive. Absolute stunner. Top five girls ever for looks including possibly best body ever. Its not everyday you can pull a club girl or a pro off the books and have a real date. I've done it a few times and honestly it's been amazing each time, this one included. They soooo much appreciate being treated like a GF and not an object. And they pay it forward in spades. Such a stunner and an amazing time.

I know I won't change the minds of the doubters. And really couldn't give one fuck. But if you are a lurker in here let me offer the following a few semi related pieces of advice.

1. Treat her like a hooker and she'll act like one. Treat her like a GF and she'll act like one.

2. Never make it a price and hours negotiation (or rarely). If she wants to hang with you she will. And that's the best way.

3. Confidence confidence confidence. It's the ultimate aphrodisiac. Does it take some balls to say "You should go to dinner with me. Let's meetup tomorrow. " to a club girl or pro? Yep. But if you have some game and a bit of looks you might just pull a stunner off the books. And confidence is everything st the dinner table as well. It just takes practice. It's actually a learned skill.

4. Don't treat gifts like part of a transaction fee. The allowance is for the differential in your age or looks or both. Otherwise just treat her like your GF. It's sooo much better when you don't pinch every penny and try to make it $/ fuck. They can feel the difference and ultimately your experience will be better. Plus then you get sexy photo follow-ups!

Good luck out there! PS Spain rules esp if u like Latinas.

Totally agree with you. I don't expect exclusivity from an SB whatsoever.

This is someone who I met about seven years ago. She worked a regular job and I tried to turn her into an SB and she was disgusted at my suggestion and deleted my contact, but after years of persistence, and eventually due to her poor economic situation, a couple of years ago she finally agreed to be my SB. It was going well, though she hated herself for being a SB, she was great in the sack. But meanwhile, since she was 26, her parents were pressuring her to get married and they found someone for her. She was devastated, but she finally did what her parents asked and we were suddenly done.

[QUOTE=Elvis2008;2979761]MW, when I was married and on seeking, the discussions of my SBs having BFs were much more honest. Obviously, I was still sleeping with my wife and they felt more comfortable sharing if they were sleeping with someone else too.

The funny part is one SB had a 10 type BF who was constantly being hit on by other women. The SB said, "If he cheats on me, I will cut his dick off. " I suspect she had said this before amongst her GFs and gotten a chorus of "you go girl". With me, the line got a belly full of laughter and she asked why I was doing this. I said, "Because you are fucking me" and her jaw dropped as she hemmed and hawed as to why her fucking me was okay but his fucking others was not.

I have to laugh as to this woman's morals, fucking a guy all through the courtship process but breaking it off when married. That is your definition of moral? Really? If I were to learn of a wife doing that, I hope I would say, "Well, why stop now? How about you take the money he is paying you and buy me a wardrobe of new suits? But from what I have seen, most women cannot turn on and off their passion. They are going to fuck with passion the men they are more into and so it was with my SB. When she was dating her BF, our sessions were much less passionate than before they hooked up.[/QUOTE]

I agree entirely about confidence. Too many reports here scream of the Cheap Charlie that is fearful of putting out money. Part of confidence is the attitude that you have so much money that what you give her does not matter, or at least you don't expect reciprocity. Sure, there are a few women that will take what you give and treat you like a chump. It takes a little game to spot these women and to avoid them. But for many women, the prospect of a much bigger payoff, gets them to play the long game. This allows both parties to relax since both sides will get what they want. The women will get paid and the man will get a genuine experience.

That being said, I recently can across an older, but very pretty and fit woman, who happens to be quite wealthy. I did not know this and expected it to be a SD relationship. We did not have sex right away, but then again she was not expecting me to pay all the bills. So, I decided to play the long game and see where this leads to. After a few "dates" she got a bit tipsy after a few drinks and a smoke and boy was she horny. We were dancing a bit in an upscale club and before you know it she was all over me. I pretty much knew that was going to be the night. What I thought was going to be a few hours turned into a weekend of debauchery. I'm not the perfect lover with the perfect looks, but when a woman trusts you and feels safe she will let down her guard. And if she is emotional, she will seek pleasure just like any man. It's a heck of an ego boost when she whispers in your ear: "when you are ready, I'd like to go again. ".

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2981019]My trip ended up being a nice blend of clubs and Seeking-type interactions. See the Madrid and Barcelona sections for the full reports. Some pretty epic stuff.

A few summary thoughts in the context of Seeking. First. I wrote about my first date with Ariana below. I ended up having three more dates with her including a helicopter ride for her birthday. We spent anywhere between 10-16 hours together each day. I did buy her presents and take her nice places. Honestly that's the way it should be. If you want to be a salt daddy then go for it. But it's way more fun being a sugar daddy if you can afford it and I can.

I also had an 11 hour Seeking-like date with a girl I met at Vive. Absolute stunner. Top five girls ever for looks including possibly best body ever. Its not everyday you can pull a club girl or a pro off the books and have a real date. I've done it a few times and honestly it's been amazing each time, this one included. They soooo much appreciate being treated like a GF and not an object. And they pay it forward in spades. Such a stunner and an amazing time.

I know I won't change the minds of the doubters. And really couldn't give one fuck. But if you are a lurker in here let me offer the following a few semi related pieces of advice.

1. Treat her like a hooker and she'll act like one. Treat her like a GF and she'll act like one.

2. Never make it a price and hours negotiation (or rarely). If she wants to hang with you she will. And that's the best way.

3. Confidence confidence confidence. It's the ultimate aphrodisiac. Does it take some balls to say "You should go to dinner with me. Let's meetup tomorrow. " to a club girl or pro? Yep. But if you have some game and a bit of looks you might just pull a stunner off the books. And confidence is everything st the dinner table as well. It just takes practice. It's actually a learned skill.

4. Don't treat gifts like part of a transaction fee. The allowance is for the differential in your age or looks or both. Otherwise just treat her like your GF. It's sooo much better when you don't pinch every penny and try to make it $/ fuck. They can feel the difference and ultimately your experience will be better. Plus then you get sexy photo follow-ups!

Good luck out there! PS Spain rules esp if u like Latinas.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Akibono;2981692]Sure, there are a few women that will take what you give and treat you like a chump. [/QUOTE]Taking girl shopping is not as straight forward as one think. Often the store will take advantage of the situation you are in so one needs to be prepared to handle those.

[QUOTE=Nounce;2981789]Taking girl shopping is not as straight forward as one think. Often the store will take advantage of the situation you are in so one needs to be prepared to handle those.[/QUOTE]Her take on the mentality of Ukrainian women applies to many a sugar baby: [URL]https://youtu.be/5KcIeCh-cus?si=L1IreAl14-S0rUOy[/URL].

Exclusivity on Seeking that's funny, they probably also believe when a woman tells them they have a brand they work on or they donate their money to animals in need. I find older men to be more gullible when it should be younger men that are less experienced. Yes there are some wonderful women on Seeking, but you should always expect them to say what you want to hear. Stay smart, don't fall in love, and have a great time.

[QUOTE=Josh44;2981850] I find older men to be more gullible when it should be younger men that are less experienced. don't fall in love.[/QUOTE]Seeing as you are so far from naive, Josh, do you think your not falling in love with seeking women is the quality you have experienced is sub par or do you think it is because of your amazing self control?

The exclusivity I was talking about was not some random hooker but a woman a guy sees on a regular basis. If there is a dip in her performance, there is a pretty good chance that she has another guy she has started fucking and whatever price you agreed on, you are getting less for your money.

And yes, when you meet some women, they will fuck just as many guys as before they met you no matter what they say. Some already planned on fucking just you, but there are some women, a lot in fact, that are on the fence and what keeps them from fucking other men is they are putting at risk the reward that you are giving them.

So the goal is not exclusivity or honesty or love but continued great sexual performance. So when you are banging the head cheerleader on a regular basis and she is thinking about getting back with the QB, she hesitates a little because of the expected exclusivity with you. You know what it is like banging the head cheerleader after she saw the QB for a late night fuckathon? You know what I mean by that dip in desire and performance right Josh?

Or is the sex you are having with seeking women so fucking amazing it never takes a dip? Yeah, I bet that is it.

Afraid this may come off as bragging but that is not the intent. Rather, I want to express how grateful I am for true Seeking GFE and tell any guy here it's completely possible to do as well as I did this past year if you put in the time, find the gems, and treat them like GFs. The below are the major relationships I had last year and doesn't count the myriad of one or two day affairs.

Wound it down with my mistress and she moved out. Damn that was painful. Still love that girl but it was not meant to be.

Picked up a new home girl who was often DTF but frustrated by my I consistency due to travel and me distracted by her not being a big BJ girl. So it was great for several months but always on the prowl.

Found a new home girl and trained her up. Still going strong whenever I'm in town.

On the travel front I had three long term home runs:

M. Brasilian living in Rio. Met two years ago now. Flew her to So Paulo for three days, Barcelona for five, and then spent three days in Rio together. Total GFE and affection. Still a thing.

L. Mexican living in Dallas. Met in April. Flew her to Las Vegas in May. Spent time in Dallas in the fall. Dancing Queen. We dance for hours. Still a thing.

T. Mixed race girl living in Milan. Met in Milan. Spent time together in Rome. Flew her to Prague for 5 days. In the wind.

There were tons of other girls and clubs. But to think I could find three girls that I want to spend days at a time with is just stunning. Plus my home girl! It was a banner year. Thank you Seeking. And my undying thanks to the girls I e shared time with.

PS for the guys about to say it’s much easier with dark and mixed race girls I will simply say Yep. 100% true. Thankfully I have no interest in pasty white girls. Latinas. Jungle Asians. Mixed. Black. That’s my thing and happy Seeking slants my way.

[QUOTE=DwayneJohnson;2982096]Good to know you are leaving white girls for rest of us.[/QUOTE]I know that's right LMAO! I want that "paste" with a bright pink butt hole between those alabaster cheeks hahahaha! Anyone have a lot of experience using Seeking in Germany? I plan to go there later this year and would like to have more opportunities for sex with attractive German girls. I love the FKKs and the Romies, but really want more of the "indigenous" German arsch as well. Come on somebody has to know something about Seeking in Germany! Do tell.

[QUOTE=Midwestern;2981570]Totally agree with you. I don't expect exclusivity from an SB whatsoever.

This is someone who I met about seven years ago. She worked a regular job and I tried to turn her into an SB and she was disgusted at my suggestion and deleted my contact, but after years of persistence, and eventually due to her poor economic situation, a couple of years ago she finally agreed to be my SB. It was going well, though she hated herself for being a SB, she was great in the sack. But meanwhile, since she was 26, her parents were pressuring her to get married and they found someone for her. She was devastated, but she finally did what her parents asked and we were suddenly done.[/QUOTE]I think anyone who expects exclusivity from a prostitute, is the same person who is playing a game of rugby with a hockey stick. A prostitute's number 1 motivation is ALWAYS money; that's why she is working that particular job. If her most important motive was sexual gratification, fame from being a well known porn star, or revenge against a lover / ex lover, then she could have sex with as many guys as possible for free; without bringing money into the equation. Sure, she can have secondary motives, but by very definition, money will ALWAYS surpass all other motives.

Thus leaves the question: if more than one customer is willing to pay, then what is the incentive to be exclusive with anyone? She is trying to make as much money as possible; she's not trying to reduce her income potential by staying with only 1 guy. Why would a drug dealer only sell his goods to the richest guy in town, when the 2nd richest guy in town still has more than enough money to pay $100 for a gram of cocaine? You really think the dealer is going to approach the richest guy and say "All right, I'm raising your price to $130 a gram, because I know the 2nd richest man in town can't afford that. And to top it all off, I'll make only $130 a day by selling to 1 person, instead of $200 by selling to 2 people!"

People who think like that are playing the wrong game. Sex worker / client relations are held together by money. The divorce rate in the USA is about 50%. If love cannot ensure exclusivity, then why would a business woman who never took the vow of "till death do us part" even consider a concept like that? No matter how much money is offered, chances are the sugar daddy is not living with the woman long term, and would never have the time to observe all of her movements to verify that she was not "cheating. " And even if so, the only thing the daddy could do to enforce it is cut off the money supply. Since the woman can always find another daddy who has money, then she has no fear of punishment, and therefore all the reason not to be exclusive.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2982202]I think anyone who expects exclusivity from a prostitute, is the same person who is playing a game of rugby with a hockey stick. A prostitute's number 1 motivation is ALWAYS money; ..

Thus leaves the question: if more than one customer is willing to pay, then what is the incentive to be exclusive with anyone? She is trying to make as much money as possible; she's not trying to reduce her income potential by staying with only 1 guy.

Sex worker / client relations are held together by money....sugar daddy is not living with the woman long term, and would never have the time to observe all of her movements to verify that she was not "cheating. " And even if so, the only thing the daddy could do to enforce it is cut off the money supply. Since the woman can always find another daddy who has money, then she has no fear of punishment, and therefore all the reason not to be exclusive.[/QUOTE]I have a Sugar Baby who was a strip / pole dancer when younger. I met her on Seeking, about 5 years ago. She has code words she uses, says she is going to an "Antique Auction" when she travels to other cities looking for new Johns and an "Antique Sale" and is looking for "Antiques". Its pretty clear to me that she is doing multiple older guys, she enjoys the sex more than I do. And is very talented at it!!

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2982202]Ancheating. And, the only thing the daddy could do to enforce it is cut off the money supply. Since the woman can always find another daddy who has money, then she has no fear of punishment, and therefore all the reason not to be exclusive.[/QUOTE]If you want to make your relationship all about money, the women will likely accommodate you. If you talk money before you meet the girl, you will never get laid for free. If you reach for a condom when you want sex, you will never get BB sex. If you tell her it is okay that she is fucking other guys, she will likely do so.

If you think that a woman is into you for more than just $, you might be right. If you do not bring up price, maybe she fucks you nothing. If you do not go for a condom, maybe you get BB sex. If you indicate to a woman that you are not okay with her fucking other guys, maybe she is exclusive to you.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2982202]I think anyone who expects exclusivity from a prostitute, is the same person who is playing a game of rugby with a hockey stick.[/QUOTE]You are not playing the game. You are conceding defeat.

This is more of an observation than a criticism but why wouldn't you give a girl half your age (or more) something when she spends time with you? You're obviously on different planets financially and she'll really appreciate it at a minimum, who knows what kinds of doors it will open with her. The money probably doesn't mean anything to you but it means a lot to her. Why is that a bad thing? You guys calling the girls hoors pr whatever are missing the point. If you want free pussy date your own age or build a time machine and walk through it. Aside from that the quickest way to get it is a quid pro quo. If you're proud about getting a girl half your age for a dinner or a trip to Walmart that's great for you but that doesn't work for me and I would never brag about it.

Not about you Elvis, just an observation on the last few posts.

[QUOTE=Elvis2008;2982388]If you want to make your relationship all about money, the women will likely accommodate you. If you talk money before you meet the girl, you will never get laid for free. If you reach for a condom when you want sex, you will never get BB sex. If you tell her it is okay that she is fucking other guys, she will likely do so.

If you think that a woman is into you for more than just $, you might be right. If you do not bring up price, maybe she fucks you nothing. If you do not go for a condom, maybe you get BB sex. If you indicate to a woman that you are not okay with her fucking other guys, maybe she is exclusive to you.

You are not playing the game. You are conceding defeat.[/QUOTE]

It's not very good. I did hit a very expensive home run in Frankfurt and met an otherwise fuckable girl in Munich that I didn't fuck, just had dinner, but it was a hell of a lot of work as the pool is small and there are just as many time wasters as there are in the states.

[QUOTE=TheCane;2982099]I know that's right LMAO! I want that "paste" with a bright pink butt hole between those alabaster cheeks hahahaha! Anyone have a lot of experience using Seeking in Germany? I plan to go there later this year and would like to have more opportunities for sex with attractive German girls. I love the FKKs and the Romies, but really want more of the "indigenous" German arsch as well. Come on somebody has to know something about Seeking in Germany! Do tell.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2982484]This is more of an observation than a criticism but why wouldn't you give a girl half your age (or more) something when she spends time with you? You're obviously on different planets financially and she'll really appreciate it at a minimum, who knows what kinds of doors it will open with her. The money probably doesn't mean anything to you but it means a lot to her. Why is that a bad thing? You guys calling the girls hoors pr whatever are missing the point. If you want free pussy date your own age or build a time machine and walk through it. Aside from that the quickest way to get it is a quid pro quo. If you're proud about getting a girl half your age for a dinner or a trip to Walmart that's great for you but that doesn't work for me and I would never brag about it.

Not about you Elvis, just an observation on the last few posts.[/QUOTE]FB, first off, everything I mentioned, I have gotten. Except for the BB sex, it was a minority of women I saw though. This was not by some grand plan but trial and error. I literally slept with women and price did not come up. If I liked the woman, I actually would not give her payment and typically spent way more on her than the hooker types in the long run. It would almost have been an insult to have paid her in some cases.

As for the women I was not interested in as SB, I would insist they take payment even if they did not want to. My message was this is P4P even if you do not want it to be.

But yeah, the goal is to get a woman to fuck you without payment because she likes you more so than getting it for free.

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2982484]This is more of an observation than a criticism but why wouldn't you give a girl half your age (or more) something when she spends time with you? You're obviously on different planets financially and she'll really appreciate it at a minimum, who knows what kinds of doors it will open with her. The money probably doesn't mean anything to you but it means a lot to her. Why is that a bad thing? You guys calling the girls hoors pr whatever are missing the point. If you want free pussy date your own age or build a time machine and walk through it. Aside from that the quickest way to get it is a quid pro quo. If you're proud about getting a girl half your age for a dinner or a trip to Walmart that's great for you but that doesn't work for me and I would never brag about it.

Not about you Elvis, just an observation on the last few posts.[/QUOTE]Not only should "getting it for free" not be the goal it is in fact counterproductive! I have made this mistake. I had a lovely non-pro that I met several times in London and elsewhere. Always did the allowance SB thing. Flew her to LA and agreed no allowance. Just covering her trip was enough. This was a big FAIL. She began acting like a GF and not in a good way. "I'm too tired". "I have a headache". All thing she's quite entitled to say as a GF not an SB.

Well I fucking learned my lesson. I don't want a girlfriend. I want an SB and that means paying is not only on the table but part of the deal so both parties are happy. No free sex for me. Thank you.

[QUOTE=DwayneJohnson;2982096]To some it's taking sand to beach and to some it's Epsteinesque elite lifestyle of trafficking for a weekend. YMMV, good to know you are leaving white girls for rest of us.[/QUOTE]It seems like you have problem with rich people and luxury girls. Do you some Post Sex PTSD by some rich escort insulting you?

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2982633]Not only should "getting it for free" not be the goal it is in fact counterproductive! I have made this mistake. I had a lovely non-pro that I met several times in London and elsewhere. Always did the allowance SB thing. Flew her to LA and agreed no allowance. Just covering her trip was enough. This was a big FAIL. She began acting like a GF and not in a good way. "I'm too tired". "I have a headache". All thing she's quite entitled to say as a GF not an SB.

Well I fucking learned my lesson. I don't want a girlfriend. I want an SB and that means paying is not only on the table but part of the deal so both parties are happy. No free sex for me. Thank you.[/QUOTE]I have had a few freebies from SA. A long time ago in the US when SA was new, there were a lot of girls on there who were happy to be taken on a nice date where the guy didn't split the bill. More recently in Asia I have had several freebies. For example a married girl whose husband had cheated on her and she wanted some side fun. She had her own business and car and clearly wasn't the type to react to a hundred bucks (this is Asia not the West) that others would. Another was a Muslim girl, hyper sexual, divorced and super horny. She can't fuck local guys in her culture and I was an easy way to get her rocks off. Didn't even have to buy dinner. I don't mind paying for it, but getting it for free from a girl 30 years younger is an ego boost you have to admit. You wouldn't expect to pay a Tinder date and these girls are fucking someone for free, so why not me? I consider it a win.

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2982485]It's not very good. I did hit a very expensive home run in Frankfurt and met an otherwise fuckable girl in Munich that I didn't fuck, just had dinner, but it was a hell of a lot of work as the pool is small and there are just as many time wasters as there are in the states.[/QUOTE]Yeah, EU seems to be requiring more effort and time when compared what everyone is posting about South America. Also since in Germany paid sex is easily available with large variety from FKKs to flat rates, there are less regular girls on seeking. It's mostly professionals who try to score extra money by acting like a virgin.

I've been to sharks a few times, wasn't really my thing but what I was attracted to out of all the girls were the Romanians. I don't think the FKKs make it any easier to find actual Germans. Like I said, the two Germans I did meet were very doable and I overpaid but I wanted a German and my time was valuable. I don't / can't spend endless hours looking for a bargain. I had a great time with both. The one I didn't have sex with made amazing dinner conversation and I still text her occasionally to this day.

[QUOTE=DwayneJohnson;2982662]Yeah, EU seems to be requiring more effort and time when compared what everyone is posting about South America. Also since in Germany paid sex is easily available with large variety from FKKs to flat rates, there are less regular girls on seeking. It's mostly professionals who try to score extra money by acting like a virgin.[/QUOTE]

Nothing wrong with that at all. I'm in the middle of a month long house call with someone I knew for 6 days overseas. No one is going to commit to meeting a stranger on his turf half way around the world unless there's more than just money involved. It takes chemistry and trust and you can't buy either of those.

[QUOTE=ExpatAmerican;2982652]I have had a few freebies from SA. A long time ago in the US when SA was new, there were a lot of girls on there who were happy to be taken on a nice date where the guy didn't split the bill. More recently in Asia I have had several freebies. For example a married girl whose husband had cheated on her and she wanted some side fun. She had her own business and car and clearly wasn't the type to react to a hundred bucks (this is Asia not the West) that others would. Another was a Muslim girl, hyper sexual, divorced and super horny. She can't fuck local guys in her culture and I was an easy way to get her rocks off. Didn't even have to buy dinner. I don't mind paying for it, but getting it for free from a girl 30 years younger is an ego boost you have to admit. You wouldn't expect to pay a Tinder date and these girls are fucking someone for free, so why not me? I consider it a win.[/QUOTE]

I've often thought about the difference between the sexes. It'll always be a mystery to me but I'm pretty sure that if I was used to pissing blood out of my dick every 28 days and my gut cramped up to make that possible, I wouldn't want to fuck anybody either. Not saying you're wrong, just sayin'.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2982633]Not only should "getting it for free" not be the goal it is in fact counterproductive! I have made this mistake. I had a lovely non-pro that I met several times in London and elsewhere. Always did the allowance SB thing. Flew her to LA and agreed no allowance. Just covering her trip was enough. This was a big FAIL. She began acting like a GF and not in a good way. "I'm too tired". "I have a headache". All thing she's quite entitled to say as a GF not an SB.

Well I fucking learned my lesson. I don't want a girlfriend. I want an SB and that means paying is not only on the table but part of the deal so both parties are happy. No free sex for me. Thank you.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2982485]It's not very good. I did hit a very expensive home run in Frankfurt and met an otherwise fuckable girl in Munich that I didn't fuck, just had dinner, but it was a hell of a lot of work as the pool is small and there are just as many time wasters as there are in the states.[/QUOTE] I agree: not very good. I paid 400 euros, though some others with very GND looks did ask 800. 800 can come down to 400 if you got time to wait. As a whole, I thought (white) German women on SA were entitled / full of themselves, not warm, picky regarding looks, and sex was meh

Why didn't you fuck the Munich girl, was she one of those that took the dinner fee and left?

[QUOTE=Akibono;2981692] I recently can across an older, but very pretty and fit woman, who happens to be quite wealthy. I did not know this and expected it to be a SD relationship. We did not have sex right away [/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=ExpatAmerican;2982652] More recently in Asia I have had several freebies. For example a married girl whose husband had cheated on her and she wanted some side fun. She had her own business and car and clearly wasn't the type to react to a hundred bucks (this is Asia not the West) that others would. Another was a Muslim girl, hyper sexual, divorced and super horny.[/QUOTE]How do you (and Elvis, and Akibono) score these freebies on Seeking? Do you agree to meet without discussing price, then you have sex, and she doesn't bring up money and you don't offer money either? If they are older, say 35+, does that mean you are contacting many older women until you find a potential freebie?

To be clear, my question isn't how to get laid for free in general, or whether it's better to fuck a 40 yo for free or to pay a 20 yo etc, but specifically how do people use Seeking to get laid for free?

I didn't feel the vibe. Just a feeling it wouldn't work out so I walked away. I asked her what she wanted and she said she didn't care so we had a great dinner, I think I slipped a couple hundred euros in her coat when she went to the bathroom.

We made contact a couple weeks before and she didn't commit to anything. On the day of she texted and asked if I wanted to grab dinner.

So it was a little weird. Maybe something fell through, maybe she just wanted a nice dinner but I wasn't picking up a sexual vibe.

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2982725]I agree: not very good. I paid 400 euros, though some others with very GND looks did ask 800. 800 can come down to 400 if you got time to wait. As a whole, I thought (white) German women on SA were entitled / full of themselves, not warm, picky regarding looks, and sex was meh

Why didn't you fuck the Munich girl, was she one of those that took the dinner fee and left?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2982729]How do you (and Elvis, and Akibono) score these freebies on Seeking? Do you agree to meet without discussing price, then you have sex, and she doesn't bring up money and you don't offer money either? If they are older, say 35+, does that mean you are contacting many older women until you find a potential freebie?

To be clear, my question isn't how to get laid for free in general, or whether it's better to fuck a 40 yo for free or to pay a 20 yo etc, but specifically how do people use Seeking to get laid for free?[/QUOTE]None of my freebies were over 30. Mostly late 20's. In most cases they reached out to me first. I connect with them off the site and start chatting with them as if I met them on any dating site. Get to know them a bit and then meet. You get to know the reason they are there, if they mention that they have some pressing financial need then of course money is expected. But even then with the Muslim girl she was telling me she was behind on her scooter payments by a couple of hundred bucks and I offered to help her and she said no, she can do it herself. So clearly she wasnt looking to get paid (or at least not from me). It is less likely with the 20-25 set but I don't like them that young if I want to have a date with the girl. In a brothel I usually just go for the cutest 18 or 19 yo but on SA I try to build a connection. I do try to keep it as non transactional as possible and sometimes that ends up non paid. I always avoid any girl that brings up money without any effort to get to know each other first.

[QUOTE=TheCane;2981810]Her take on the mentality of Ukrainian women applies to many a sugar baby: [URL]https://youtu.be/5KcIeCh-cus?si=L1IreAl14-S0rUOy[/URL].[/QUOTE]I have not clicked on the link. I am guessing based on your post and description. I just want to remind others that there are situations that is not exactly under girl's control and you are bring a young girl to a candy store. A good salesperson who is doing the job right is going to make you spend more so just be aware of this and don't be forced into a situation that you are not comfortable with.

I am more of a pay after guy. I only take them shopping when we have already met numerous times and usually it is not associated with sex and I don't expect things in return. If my goal is so they have a great day, then I won't let money to limit that.

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2982729]How do you (and Elvis, and Akibono) score these freebies on Seeking? Do you agree to meet without discussing price, then you have sex, and she doesn't bring up money and you don't offer money either? If they are older, say 35+, does that mean you are contacting many older women until you find a potential freebie?

To be clear, my question isn't how to get laid for free in general, or whether it's better to fuck a 40 yo for free or to pay a 20 yo etc, but specifically how do people use Seeking to get laid for free?[/QUOTE]The reason I brought all this up was about guys getting what they want. We were talking exclusivity but getting it for free is what has come up. While I hope guys see it is possible, that was not my intent. The reason you get laid "for free" is the woman likes you and sees you as a potential quality mate.

And I have had an experience or two as Steve described. It is not all fun.

In the USA, when seeking first came along, I heard of guys getting it for free so what Expat said has been confirmed by others, but I think a guy would be unlikely to get it with the current crop. In other countries, it is much more doable.

For the most part, it was just showing the women a good time that mattered. If you are fun, interesting, and a decent lover, a lot of times that is enough to beat most men. You just do not mention price and behave like you are on a date. Many if not most times a woman has it in her mind that she is going to have sex with you before you even meet.

But you should always be able to appeal to the long term financial interests of the woman if she has a brain in her head. Potential marriage is one way. If you are single, you can tell them, "Well, I do not plan on getting married unless I meet the perfect woman" and let them try to be that woman.

And she may not be focused on your money. If the woman is young and can work in the USA, some will make millions more over a work career than in their home countries.

I was in Colombia and talked to a woman whose goal was to work, build apartments, and rent them out. I told her in Colombia there is currency risk. Most Latin currencies are down by 50% versus the dollar in the last 20 years. So I told her bonds in the USA are paying 5% or so and Colombia is 10% to adjust for that currency risk. I also told her that there is little risk to the equity with bonds and there is no work in comparison to renting out buildings. I told her for me to take on that added risk and work that I would want a 30% return. Her jaw dropped. These were dimensions no one had ever told her existed.

So when guys are talking all women care about is money, they always mean short term. If you have a woman interested in a long term plan, and so few are, then I would fuck me and a lot of guys here for free. I just think guys are perpetually undervaluing themselves or looking for the wrong kind of women. A SB should be interested in learning and achieving long term wealth.

And the age range on these women was like 22 to 32 and most were in their 20's. From a sexual market place POV, which I hate but is reality, women's peak value in all cultures today is 23. After that, their value as a mate on average goes down. So that 27 or 28 year old without a marriage and family is feeling the heat and the decline.

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2982485]It's not very good. I did hit a very expensive home run in Frankfurt and met an otherwise fuckable girl in Munich that I didn't fuck, just had dinner, but it was a hell of a lot of work as the pool is small and there are just as many time wasters as there are in the states.[/QUOTE]Isn't there a SA alternative that is more popular in Germany or Europe in general?

[QUOTE=FilthyBeaver;2982745]I didn't feel the vibe. Just a feeling it wouldn't work out so I walked away. I asked her what she wanted and she said she didn't care so we had a great dinner, I think I slipped a couple hundred euros in her coat when she went to the bathroom.

We made contact a couple weeks before and she didn't commit to anything. On the day of she texted and asked if I wanted to grab dinner.

So it was a little weird. Maybe something fell through, maybe she just wanted a nice dinner but I wasn't picking up a sexual vibe.[/QUOTE]Yes, I also read other SDs saying they didn't proceed because they didn't feel the vibe. But for me, some of my best fucks were with SBs whom I initially didn't like. They just turned out to be tight, wet and energetic. Unless you meant that she was the one who didn't want to proceed

[QUOTE=ExpatAmerican;2982766] None of my freebies were over 30. Mostly late 20's. In most cases they reached out to me first. [/QUOTE]Was this in SEA countries? This method requires someone to reach out to you so a big Tinder element to it.

[QUOTE=ExpatAmerican;2982766] You get to know the reason they are there, if they mention that they have some pressing financial need then of course money is expected.[/QUOTE]Makes sense.

[QUOTE=ExpatAmerican;2982766] In a brothel I usually just go for the cutest 18 or 19 yo but on SA I try to build a connection. .[/QUOTE]What brothel has so many 18-19 yo, Jakarta?

[QUOTE=ExpatAmerican;2982766] I do try to keep it as non transactional as possible and sometimes that ends up non paid. I always avoid any girl that brings up money without any effort to get to know each other first.[/QUOTE]Yes, same here.

[QUOTE=Elvis2008;2982896] You just do not mention price and behave like you are on a date. Many if not most times a woman has it in her mind that she is going to have sex with you before you even meet. [/QUOTE]Most or all of my dates bring up gift / allowance at some point before we meet if I don't bring it up first. As of 2025, are you still seeing many SA dates that don't bring it up before meeting?

Would this be in Colombia and with older ladies, meaning 30+ and close to you in age?

[QUOTE=Elvis2008;2982896]
If you have a woman interested in a long term plan, and so few are, then I would fuck me and a lot of guys here for free.
[/QUOTE]Getting a bit off topic. I heard this idea on a podcast you linked here. Thing is, free sex in exchange for long term prospects works out for the woman only if -- one -- she can correctly identify the guy who would settle down with her; and -- two -- every other woman isn't fucking that guy for free as well.

And fucking for mentorship and financial advice doesn't make sense for them because they can get it for free -- you fuck, pay, and then over dinner she gets to learn about stocks, bonds, inflation etc.

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2983010]Yes, I also read other SDs saying they didn't proceed because they didn't feel the vibe. But for me, some of my best fucks were with SBs whom I initially didn't like. They just turned out to be tight, wet and energetic. [/QUOTE]Yes, they fuck good. But you will have problems later. Best to follow your feeling. There is a reason you do not mesh well. They may try to steal from you later, be strung out on drugs regularly, or alcohol. I had one who fucked good but used a lot of alcohol and marijuana, showed up at my house with a pint of Jose Cuervo and had marijuana on her clothes and hair. She fucked good, then too a shower and dropped the handheld sprayer on the shower floor, it sprayed the bathroom wall and floor for 3-4 minutes and flooded the floor while she stood there in a daze. Then she did not want to give up her towel so I could wipe the floor, claimed I hollered at her, and I finally had to tell her to get the fuck out. I will never repeat. There is a reason you do not feel good about women when you meet them, and you will Never feel good about some of them.

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2983065]Would this be in Colombia and with older ladies, meaning 30+ and close to you in age?[/QUOTE]No, they were all 25 to 35 years younger than me.

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2983065]And fucking for mentorship and financial advice doesn't make sense for them because they can get it for free -- you fuck, pay, and then over dinner she gets to learn about stocks, bonds, inflation etc.[/QUOTE]Well, they would have to be with you to get citizenship, and nothing would bore the shit out of me more than someone lecturing me nonstop. That is one thing. It is another for her to tell you her plan and you suggest several viable alternatives that she has never thought of. When it comes to money and women, it is not that they lack the intelligence but they lack the confidence. You are there to lovingly help them with their plan not lecture them on what to do and most women do not have plans that extend beyond a few hours.

In the lives of most people that I like to be with, things go well most of the time, but there are times they get stuck or cannot decide what path to take, and they will ask for your help if they think you can help. With the hottest of women, they are always worried someone is giving them advice such that they can get in their pants. Well, I am already in their pants. This is where a SD is like a daddy. Your SB should trust you, and most SBs I have met have a lack of people / men in their life they can trust.

[QUOTE=DwayneJohnson;2982662]Yeah, EU seems to be requiring more effort and time when compared what everyone is posting about South America. Also since in Germany paid sex is easily available with large variety from FKKs to flat rates, there are less regular girls on seeking. It's mostly professionals who try to score extra money by acting like a virgin.[/QUOTE]US and UK or anywhere would require a lot of time and effort too if you don't have enough dough. If time is object, then knock yourself out.

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2983015]Was this in SEA countries? This method requires someone to reach out to you so a big Tinder element to it.

Makes sense.

What brothel has so many 18-19 yo, Jakarta?

Yes, same here.[/QUOTE]Yes Jakarta is where I have had more recent experiences. Asian girls are different than European or Americans. Don't get me wrong here and have unrealistic expectations. If you want the hottest 20 yo on the site, you will pay western prices for it. But if you look for certain characteristics in the profile like discreet pictures or better written text etc you can uncover some gems. Again I don't mean to say freebies are that common, but they are not unheard of either.

I've always just given girls cash. Amount arranged in advance. But another poster on here has convinced me that taking a girl shopping gets things next level. I've never done that because I think if you take a girl shopping, you kind of give carte blanche on her choices. I mean what if she goes in a store and picks out a 500 dollar sweater, or just wants to walk out with a new wardrobe. I can see it backfiring to have to tell a girl no I meant you can choose one item under 150 dollars. Put that back please.

How do people handle this?

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2982633]Not only should "getting it for free" not be the goal it is in fact counterproductive! I have made this mistake. I had a lovely non-pro that I met several times in London and elsewhere. Always did the allowance SB thing. Flew her to LA and agreed no allowance. Just covering her trip was enough. This was a big FAIL. She began acting like a GF and not in a good way. "I'm too tired". "I have a headache". All thing she's quite entitled to say as a GF not an SB.

Well I fucking learned my lesson. I don't want a girlfriend. I want an SB and that means paying is not only on the table but part of the deal so both parties are happy. No free sex for me. Thank you.[/QUOTE]This is wisdom right here. Spot on.

I very specifically want to pay. And I want to pay well. Why? Because my time is valuable and I don't have endless opportunities to do this stuff and when I do I want it to count. I want to go into the date knowing I'll get what I want, and will define how and when it starts and ends. Price you pay for that is quite literally money.

This is also why I pay very generously in countries where money is cheap and I could get away with paying far less. Because why. The worst possible outcome is she doesn't show up and I lose a night in a foreign country after all, it took to get there. I want to pay at a level where I'm basically assured she'll show up and I will have the night I planned. There's a price for that. It's worth paying.

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2983120]I've always just given girls cash. Amount arranged in advance. But another poster on here has convinced me that taking a girl shopping gets things next level. I've never done that because I think if you take a girl shopping, you kind of give carte blanche on her choices. I mean what if she goes in a store and picks out a 500 dollar sweater, or just wants to walk out with a new wardrobe. I can see it backfiring to have to tell a girl no I meant you can choose one item under 150 dollars. Put that back please.

How do people handle this?[/QUOTE]It is a red flag. In Cali, Colombia once, I took a young lady to the mall and told the young lady I only had enough money on my credit card for 2 pair of pants. Of course she took the most expensive pairs. And ghosted me afterwards. I learnt my lession.

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2983124]This is wisdom right here. Spot on.

I very specifically want to pay. And I want to pay well. Why? Because my time is valuable and I don't have endless opportunities to do this stuff and when I do I want it to count. I want to go into the date knowing I'll get what I want, and will define how and when it starts and ends. Price you pay for that is quite literally money.

This is also why I pay very generously in countries where money is cheap and I could get away with paying far less. Because why. The worst possible outcome is she doesn't show up and I lose a night in a foreign country after all, it took to get there. I want to pay at a level where I'm basically assured she'll show up and I will have the night I planned. There's a price for that. It's worth paying.[/QUOTE]Agree with you guys on freebies being overrated. And this is from my experience. When I was on Seeking in the states, half of my gals were freebies, and most of those ended horribly.

I also pay a premium. This makes them really want to see me. They will usually drop everything to meet.

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2983120]I've always just given girls cash. Amount arranged in advance. But another poster on here has convinced me that taking a girl shopping gets things next level. I've never done that because I think if you take a girl shopping, you kind of give carte blanche on her choices. I mean what if she goes in a store and picks out a 500 dollar sweater, or just wants to walk out with a new wardrobe. I can see it backfiring to have to tell a girl no I meant you can choose one item under 150 dollars. Put that back please.

How do people handle this?[/QUOTE]It's hit or miss, but for me it was mostly a miss. There's usually some uncertainty because she doesn't know what the spending limit is. If you set a limit, then it's weird because why not just gift them that cash amount and let them spend it how they want. If they're shopping with you, then it's usually for cosmetics or jewelry, as most gals prefer to go clothes shopping with their GFs. One cosmetic won't break the bank, but they're not going to buy just one lipstick if you're taking them shopping, and so it'll end up being a lot. I bought a purse for a gal once and it cost thousands. Another wanted a bracelet and it was for over ten thousand and I said no and we got into a big fight.

[QUOTE=Midwestern;2983226] I also pay a premium. This makes them really want to see me.

..If you set a limit, then it's weird because why not just gift them that cash amount and let them spend it how they want. If they're shopping with you, then it's usually for cosmetics or jewelry, as most gals prefer to go clothes shopping with their GFs. One cosmetic won't break the bank, but they're not going to buy just one lipstick if you're taking them shopping, and so it'll end up being a lot. I bought a purse for a gal once and it cost thousands. Another wanted a bracelet and it was for over ten thousand and I said no and we got into a big fight.[/QUOTE]I told my SB I would give her $200 for Christmas and we would go to a name-brand discount clothing store which I identified. We went together and she bought 6-7 items that were really discounted for her $200. A few weeks later she wore some of the clothes and modelled them for me.

I went to the dollar store for Valentine's day and bought her a box of chocolates for $1. 25. I felt proud because I wrapped them in wrapping paper that I had been using for 10 years. Then I took her out for lunch at a steak house after giving her my weiner. She was happy. She has been my SB for 5 years now and I have been giving her the same gift amount for 5 years.

[QUOTE=NeilGeorge;2983229]I told my SB I would give her $200 for Christmas and we would go to a name-brand discount clothing store which I identified. We went together and she bought 6-7 items that were really discounted for her $200. A few weeks later she wore some of the clothes and modelled them for me.

I went to the dollar store for Valentine's day and bought her a box of chocolates for $1. 25. I felt proud because I wrapped them in wrapping paper that I had been using for 10 years. Then I took her out for lunch at a steak house after giving her my weiner. She was happy. She has been my SB for 5 years now and I have been giving her the same gift amount for 5 years.[/QUOTE]True story here. I have a soft spot for Cuba. It's so dirt poor. One time I asked a girl I was going to see there if she wanted anything. She sent me a photo of these new balance sneakers. I looked them up and they were 200 dollars. In Cuba that's like months of salary. And I wasn't going to for a girl I'the never met. So I went to big 5 and took a photo of similar new balance sneakers that were like 50 dollars. She said no those aren't the same, can't I find the other ones?

I didn't end up seeing her. I was so disgusted.

[QUOTE=Midwestern;2983226]
It's hit or miss, but for me it was mostly a miss. There's usually some uncertainty because she doesn't know what the spending limit is. If you set a limit, then it's weird because why not just gift them that cash amount and let them spend it how they want. If they're shopping with you, then it's usually for cosmetics or jewelry, as most gals prefer to go clothes shopping with their GFs. One cosmetic won't break the bank, but they're not going to buy just one lipstick if you're taking them shopping, and so it'll end up being a lot. I bought a purse for a gal once and it cost thousands. Another wanted a bracelet and it was for over ten thousand and I said no and we got into a big fight.[/QUOTE]Ok that's validating. Honestly, that's what I expect to happen. You give and inch and they take a mile. Never mind. Not going to do the shopping trip thing.

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;2982729]How do you (and Elvis, and Akibono) score these freebies on Seeking? Do you agree to meet without discussing price, then you have sex, and she doesn't bring up money and you don't offer money either? If they are older, say 35+, does that mean you are contacting many older women until you find a potential freebie?

To be clear, my question isn't how to get laid for free in general, or whether it's better to fuck a 40 yo for free or to pay a 20 yo etc, but specifically how do people use Seeking to get laid for free?[/QUOTE]One thing I would mention. ISG is a site dedicated to P4 P. Thus, if someone were "able to get sex for free", then why would they even be registered on here? Unless they are getting sex with women that aren't really up to their standards. I'm sure it's happened before in the past, and I'm sure on an exceedingly rare blue moon, it will happen again in the future. But it is not at all normal for 20 year old girls to be turned on by 70 year old guys, unless she's incentivized by money. Remember, the status quo is what prevails at the end of the day; and not the extreme outlier. Also remember a lot of men have a tendency to boast of bravado and masculinity. That doesn't necessarily mean 100% of the stories are true.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2983278]One thing I would mention. ISG is a site dedicated to P4 P. Thus, if someone were "able to get sex for free", then why would they even be registered on here? Unless they are getting sex with women that aren't really up to their standards. I'm sure it's happened before in the past, and I'm sure on an exceedingly rare blue moon, it will happen again in the future. But it is not at all normal for 20 year old girls to be turned on by 70 year old guys, unless she's incentivized by money. Remember, the status quo is what prevails at the end of the day; and not the extreme outlier. Also remember a lot of men have a tendency to boast of bravado and masculinity. That doesn't necessarily mean 100% of the stories are true.[/QUOTE]Great insight, I completely agree and the more and more we go, the less true some stories sound LOL.

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2983252]Ok that's validating. Honestly, that's what I expect to happen. You give and inch and they take a mile. Never mind. Not going to do the shopping trip thing.[/QUOTE]I have a few examples, here is one. It's the girl's birthday. She already picked a gift so we knew exactly what she wanted. Once we were in the jewelry store, she pointed out her choice. I had no problem buying it as it was within the budget I had in mind, but the salesperson brought out some other choices that were much more expensive. The girl turned to me and asked me which one I liked. I told her to pick what she wanted. I hope you get what I am saying. The girl doesn't have to do it. The salesperson that is doing her job right will do it for the girl. I normally choose to have the girl that provides the best experience so I frequently repeat many times with the same girl until I find someone that is better. Buying a gift in my case is more like paying after and I expect nothing in return regardless how much it is.

I don't like others to have power over me. I consider buying a girl gift and expected something in return as giving away power.

A couple of months ago, I was in a small quant town. I met two 20 yrs old around midnight. They didn't have money to get into a club and wanted me to help them. My immediate response was "in exchange for sex"? They said I can do whatever I want after the club. I said let's find a place to make out first to seal the deal, then I would give them money for the club, and sex after. They agreed. LOL. There is no P4 P in this city and in the area. They absolutely had no idea of what P4 P was until they met me. Luckily my flight got cancelled the next day so I spent one more day there. Now they were asking me to return.

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2983251]She sent me a photo of these new balance sneakers. I looked them up and they were 200 dollars. In Cuba that's like months of salary.
[/QUOTE]Last time I was there a medical doctor made the equivalent of $20 US a month. $200 would be about 10 X the monthly salary of a highly educated Dr.

Have you ever shopped in their government store and seen what they get with their ration cards? Not much. And they only can shop there 21 days of the month, the other days they must steal / borrow or tradel from others.

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2983252]Ok that's validating. Honestly, that's what I expect to happen. You give and inch and they take a mile. Never mind. Not going to do the shopping trip thing.[/QUOTE]Good. I have done this many times, and it was never worth it. The best sugar babies want to show they are values / assets and not costs / drains. So they point out to me when I am looking to buy things where my money stretches further. When I come to town and ask if they need something, their response is, I do not need anything just you being here.

I would say though that do not confuse not going shopping with giving gifts. A nice gift that you pick out that she wants / needs will enhance your relationship.

[QUOTE=Elvis2008;2983726]Good. I have done this many times, and it was never worth it. The best sugar babies want to show they are values / assets and not costs / drains. So they point out to me when I am looking to buy things where my money stretches further. When I come to town and ask if they need something, their response is, I do not need anything just you being here.

I would say though that do not confuse not going shopping with giving gifts. A nice gift that you pick out that she wants / needs will enhance your relationship.[/QUOTE]I have one SB I see every month or so. I keep going because she's really compliant. I'll leave it at that. But she does this annoying thing. I ask if I can bring things to make her stay more comfortable. And she always asks for things. Nothing major. Some nice shampoo and body wash, a box of chocolates, a bottle of wine. But the annoying thing is she doesn't end up using them on our stay. She just puts them in her bag. The time I brought a huge Costco box of those Ferraro Rocher chocolates I ate one after we had dinner and she took the box and moved it to the other side of the sofa where I couldn't reach it and then later put it in her bag. I'm an empathetic guy and figured this was something she wanted to savor later maybe with family and friends but it was just so absurd.

I'm in São Paulo right now and the selection on Seeking is pretty slim. Not a lot of active women compared to Colombia and Mexico. I usually start messaging 2 weeks out and I had the least amount of potential dates here. It's only my second day, but when I previously used Seeking, I would have a surplus of leads and would have to cut some loose. I got quoted $500 for a date but there are more and better looking working girls who charge $50/ HR. Of course, you will always get better prices from them vs. Seeking in any country, but still disappointed with Seeking in SP so far. Might just see 1 or 2 during my week here. Even if I don't, I wouldn't feel like I missed out.

Rio looks to be a lot better and I'm headed there next week, so I'll see for myself.

[QUOTE=VoodooJones;2983965]I'm in So Paulo right now and the selection on Seeking is pretty slim. Not a lot of active women compared to Colombia and Mexico. I usually start messaging 2 weeks out and I had the least amount of potential dates here. It's only my second day, but when I previously used Seeking, I would have a surplus of leads and would have to cut some loose. I got quoted $500 for a date but there are more and better looking working girls who charge $50/ HR. Of course, you will always get better prices from them vs. Seeking in any country, but still disappointed with Seeking in SP so far. Might just see 1 or 2 during my week here. Even if I don't, I wouldn't feel like I missed out.

Rio looks to be a lot better and I'm headed there next week, so I'll see for myself.[/QUOTE]500 dollars or reais? In that area, if a woman requested 500 USD from me, that individual would be immediately blocked, regardless of the circumstances. There is plenty of poverty in SP, but there are also more business opportunities. In Rio the poverty spreads further. But I really don't think you want to pick up a girl from the favelas. I'm surprised you weren't able to find what you were looking for in SP. It could be the girls who are inclined to go that route are using other websites instead of seeking. The women in SP are raised by their parents to be bull headed. They are encouraged to go out and be entrepreneurs. But there's still not enough economic opportunities to go around, so plenty of women still choosing the quick path to fast money.

Spot on here. My last three were all frugal always pointing out how I could do this or that cheaper or where to find x for the best price. Of course they don't complain if I decide to blow serious money on a dinner for a special occasion but it's always nice that they think enough of me to share whatever tips they have to save money. I'm generally against shopping trips for all the obvious reasons and cash is king anyway, no way for any kind of surprise to occur.

[QUOTE=Elvis2008;2983726]Good. I have done this many times, and it was never worth it. The best sugar babies want to show they are values / assets and not costs / drains. So they point out to me when I am looking to buy things where my money stretches further. When I come to town and ask if they need something, their response is, I do not need anything just you being here.

I would say though that do not confuse not going shopping with giving gifts. A nice gift that you pick out that she wants / needs will enhance your relationship.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2984072]500 dollars or reais? In that area, if a woman requested 500 USD from me, that individual would be immediately blocked, regardless of the circumstances. There is plenty of poverty in SP, but there are also more business opportunities. In Rio the poverty spreads further. But I really don't think you want to pick up a girl from the favelas. I'm surprised you weren't able to find what you were looking for in SP. It could be the girls who are inclined to go that route are using other websites instead of seeking. The women in SP are raised by their parents to be bull headed. They are encouraged to go out and be entrepreneurs. But there's still not enough economic opportunities to go around, so plenty of women still choosing the quick path to fast money.[/QUOTE]It was USD and that ended the conversation. Apparently she's from Brazil but living in Dubai so she thinks she can charge Western prices.

I'm definitely not trying to pick up some girl from the favelas. If I don't have any luck with Seeking in SP (I do have a couple more prospects), I'll stick to hourly women and try again in Rio. The good news is that I hooked up with a hot pro on my first day. I thought she was going to be a catfish because she looked way too good to be true at 180 reais. There are more like her from what I can find, so silver lining at least.

I think the biggest problem with SP is the slow activity on Seeking and many women will not check the site for weeks or months at a time. So the best looking ones won't see my message until I'm long gone.

And I was surprised too because I've had a lot of luck in other Latin American cities. I know there are other SD sites catering to Brazilians, but from what I've read from locals, those women are pros hoping to charge more than their normal rate. If anyone else has experience in SP, I'the like to hear it. Maybe it's just bad timing with Carnival next week?

[QUOTE=VoodooJones;2984132]It was USD and that ended the conversation. Apparently she's from Brazil but living in Dubai so she thinks she can charge Western prices.

I'm definitely not trying to pick up some girl from the favelas. If I don't have any luck with Seeking in SP (I do have a couple more prospects), I'll stick to hourly women and try again in Rio. The good news is that I hooked up with a hot pro on my first day. I thought she was going to be a catfish because she looked way too good to be true at 180 reais. There are more like her from what I can find, so silver lining at least.

I think the biggest problem with SP is the slow activity on Seeking and many women will not check the site for weeks or months at a time. So the best looking ones won't see my message until I'm long gone.

And I was surprised too because I've had a lot of luck in other Latin American cities. I know there are other SD sites catering to Brazilians, but from what I've read from locals, those women are pros hoping to charge more than their normal rate. If anyone else has experience in SP, I'the like to hear it. Maybe it's just bad timing with Carnival next week?[/QUOTE]I guess my advice would be save Seeking for places that don't have clubs like SP. Sp has the very best girl clubs on the planet. When in SP I would stick with that. And u can go to the club and take a hottie for overnight. And next couple days too if you like. Like Seeking style. But you find her face to face in the club. All my buddies that travel to SP have multiple day GFs just like a good seeking girl. But they established this all in the clubs.

[QUOTE=VoodooJones;2984132]I think the biggest problem with SP is the slow activity on Seeking and many women will not check the site for weeks or months at a time. So the best looking ones won't see my message until I'm long gone.[/QUOTE]This happened to me with Cuba. I was on some normal dating site. Put out some feelers because seeking isn't big there. This was a year ago. To this day I sometimes get girls responding to my reach out a year later. A year for f sake. Why even respond to a message sent a year earlier. I never respond back but part of me wants to write back and be like what kind of backwards ass stuff is this. You think a year later I still want to hear from you? I told you in my message I was coming in 2 weeks and that was last January!

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2984355]This happened to me with Cuba. I was on some normal dating site. Put out some feelers because seeking isn't big there. This was a year ago. To this day I sometimes get girls responding to my reach out a year later. A year for f sake. Why even respond to a message sent a year earlier. I never respond back but part of me wants to write back and be like what kind of backwards ass stuff is this. You think a year later I still want to hear from you? I told you in my message I was coming in 2 weeks and that was last January![/QUOTE]I had a girl I had fucked several times in the Philippines calling me up at 3 and 4 in the morning my time! I sent her a message and told her I didn't mind if she called but to please be cognizant of the time difference as she was calling and waking me up in the wee hours of the morning (I was awoken but refused to answer at those hours). Well she did it again! So I blocked her dumb, country, backwards ass for good! Had fucked the cowboys shit out of her something good too (bareback).

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2984355]This happened to me with Cuba. I was on some normal dating site. Put out some feelers because seeking isn't big there. This was a year ago. To this day I sometimes get girls responding to my reach out a year later. A year for f sake. Why even respond to a message sent a year earlier. I never respond back but part of me wants to write back and be like what kind of backwards ass stuff is this. You think a year later I still want to hear from you? I told you in my message I was coming in 2 weeks and that was last January![/QUOTE]Internet access in Cuba is very slow, like dial up. And the girls have to pay for internet. And the government monitors their accounts. Some students have access through their university, but personal use is forbidden.

Cuba is not a normal country. Total control. And you are required to pickup hitch hikers if you see them on a road- share your wealth.

And the neighbors tattle on each other if you bring girls over too much. They can get one's private casa license revoked by complaining to the neighborhood council. I was asked to leave a casa particular (private residence) when I brought a girl over for sex.

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2984355]This happened to me with Cuba. I was on some normal dating site. Put out some feelers because seeking isn't big there. This was a year ago. To this day I sometimes get girls responding to my reach out a year later. A year for f sake. Why even respond to a message sent a year earlier. I never respond back but part of me wants to write back and be like what kind of backwards ass stuff is this. You think a year later I still want to hear from you? I told you in my message I was coming in 2 weeks and that was last January![/QUOTE]Not sure what is wrong with that AP. If the women were not having money issues but now are, it would make sense for them to reach out to you. Maybe they had a BF or SD and exclusivity was expected.

One fun thing with whatsapp is looking at the section called updates, and the people but mostly women post updates all the time. With the videos, you get a much better glimpse of what the women look like but it is also fun to follow their lives. Some have BFs. Some are obviously with SDs in exotic locales.

One woman I met a few years ago had a kid. That made me think back onto the dates I had. One guy on here said it is not normal for a 20 year old to want to date a 70 year old, and it is true if the girl is single and the biggest influencers in her life are her friends. But this girl who is a PE teacher with an amazing body and little body fat even after having birth is probably 25 now, and it is obvious her whole life is this kid. So who is she going be interested in, the unemployed guy with the washboard abs or the older guy who can give her a kid a better life?

In the manosphere, the single mom is a huge red flag as far as having her as a GF or wife. The reason is the woman will always choose the kid over you, and if the father is in the kid's life, that is potentially double the trouble. So for the guy, the SB thing makes a lot more sense with the single mom than having her as GF / wife, and the woman has an added incentive to perform. She is pleasing you for her child's sake versus the latest makeup, drugs, or shoes.

What would have been interesting would be to see this woman now. She had only been with like two guys when I had met her, and for her, the whole sugar thing was just a fun lark to get a few extra bucks. We had a good time and she was a nice enough girl but there was zero long term interest from her or me. For me, I liked her character, personality, and looks but sexually her lack of experience showed in her performance, and she was not worth my going out of my way to see her.

Now who knows? I think she would be a much better SB prospect now than she was at 21 or 22.

[QUOTE=Elvis2008;2984409]Not sure what is wrong with that AP. If the women were not having money issues but now are, it would make sense for them to reach out to you. Maybe they had a BF or SD and exclusivity was expected..[/QUOTE]I don't know. After a year writing just hola. No hey sorry it took me 13 months to write back. Felt like a deal breaker to me. Too little time to deal with that stuff when I'm on the ground.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2984215]I guess my advice would be save Seeking for places that don't have clubs like SP. Sp has the very best girl clubs on the planet. When in SP I would stick with that. And u can go to the club and take a hottie for overnight. And next couple days too if you like. Like Seeking style. But you find her face to face in the club. All my buddies that travel to SP have multiple day GFs just like a good seeking girl. But they established this all in the clubs.[/QUOTE]Yeah, I think you're right Steve. I had a couple more conversations since my last post. One wants $300 USD for a meet and another wants to discuss a lump sum for several days at a time for around the same rate. And get this: she also wanted the first date to be just dinner and get paid for it. I'm not going to haggle. If that's the price they want, I'm not going to waste my time or offend anyone by asking for less. SP women really think they can charge Western prices on Seeking.

[QUOTE=VoodooJones;2984643]Yeah, I think you're right Steve. I had a couple more conversations since my last post. One wants $300 USD for a meet and another wants to discuss a lump sum for several days at a time for around the same rate. And get this: she also wanted the first date to be just dinner and get paid for it. I'm not going to haggle. If that's the price they want, I'm not going to waste my time or offend anyone by asking for less. SP women really think they can charge Western prices on Seeking.[/QUOTE]Just for some perspective tho top shelf girls in SP can definitely command $300-400 for a longer date. I have several buddies who take Scandallo girls for overnight and day long dates and your going to be in that price range for sure. But I also took a Casarao girl for a lunch and more date and gave her $125 and she was super happy. Can prob get a dinner and more date with a CLnica or 57 Friends girl for even less. But don't be surprised by a $400+ quote from a Scan girl. But she will be top shelf elegant and probably good English which you pay a premium for. Plus you checked chemistry in the club. No bait and switch.

Ps if u dont go to Scandallo to check out the experience u will kick urself later. Something all red blooded men should experience at least once. If funds are tight, go before seven. Drink beer. Spend a couple hours just enjoying the vibe and stalking ur prey. Then grab an hour room with the right girl. This can be done for $300-350 properly managed. U can thank me later. 😆

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2984658]Just for some perspective tho top shelf girls in SP can definitely command $300-400 for a longer date. I have several buddies who take Scandallo girls for overnight and day long dates and your going to be in that price range for sure. But I also took a Casarao girl for a lunch and more date and gave her $125 and she was super happy. Can prob get a dinner and more date with a CLnica or 57 Friends girl for even less. But don't be surprised by a $400+ quote from a Scan girl. But she will be top shelf elegant and probably good English which you pay a premium for. Plus you checked chemistry in the club. No bait and switch.[/QUOTE]Those prices weren't for overnight or day long dates, but dinner and sex. And when to take into consideration the price of dinner, it's just not worth it imo.

Today I was perusing profiles on the site and saw one for a guy. Occasionally that happens, and I usually just attribute it to a glitch or something. But this guy said he "accidentally" signed up for a woman looking for a man, and that he found it impossible to fix so, "I'm down with it if you are". WTF? I should have reported his ass. As much as the site sucks, I'm glad that at least the gays have not been able to ruin it like I've seen them do to others. The straight women on Seeking do quite an adequate job of ruining the place all on their own!

[QUOTE=VoodooJones;2984643]Yeah, I think you're right Steve. I had a couple more conversations since my last post. One wants $300 USD for a meet and another wants to discuss a lump sum for several days at a time for around the same rate. And get this: she also wanted the first date to be just dinner and get paid for it. I'm not going to haggle. If that's the price they want, I'm not going to waste my time or offend anyone by asking for less. SP women really think they can charge Western prices on Seeking.[/QUOTE]Seeking is for foreigners in SP but more girls who can probably speak English which ideal for a date. Locals use meu patrocínio. The going rate on MP is about r800 for a meet. But very few girls speak English. I got a subscription to MP on my most recent trip. I didn't go on a meet because in the end I thought going to dinner with a girl who doesn't speak English with unknown chemistry was going to be a waste when you can go to a boate for similar fees. There you can have a drink and even dinner before going to a room and if she doesn't check your boxes, switch to another girl. I met a girl on this trip who was doing MP and she gave me the low down.

[QUOTE=VoodooJones;2984669]Those prices weren't for overnight or day long dates, but dinner and sex. And when to take into consideration the price of dinner, it's just not worth it imo.[/QUOTE]Yeah that is def waaay to high for an unknown girl and a few hours. Those are European prices. My point was only don't expect a lot lower from a top notch girl. You can def get amazing low priced girls in Brasil. But the cream of the crop can command surprising prices at the high end venues.

[QUOTE=TheCane;2984685]Today I was perusing profiles on the site and saw one for a guy. Occasionally that happens, and I usually just attribute it to a glitch or something. But this guy said he "accidentally" signed up for a woman looking for a man, and that he found it impossible to fix so, "I'm down with it if you are". WTF? I should have reported his ass. As much as the site sucks, I'm glad that at least the gays have not been able to ruin it like I've seen them do to others. The straight women on Seeking do quite an adequate job of ruining the place all on their own![/QUOTE]I've seen this too occasionally over the years. Just the other week someone weirdo with the name "BabyBoy" favorited my profile, so clearly it wasn't a mistake when he set up the profile. There also needs to be an option to filter out trans people because I assume 99% of users are not interested. Some of the ones who have messaged me have jawlines like Alex Pereira.

The new verification system works like this. You click on the link in Seeking and your phone takes a comprehensive scan of your face that has to be in good lighting, and you have to hold still. Once finished, you upload a picture, and the system compares your scan to the picture.

I believe it is similar to face unlock for phones. Using someone's face as a "password" can be fooled by various methods, such as similar looking people like relatives or twins, a face of a mannequin, or certain kinds of high quality photographs, depending on the facial recognition technology being used. Depth perception technology would make it harder to use images, but some old phones and even a few newer ones don't support this, and no guarantee Seeking is using this technology.

Certainly not 100% fail safe proof, but just one more step scammers will have to take to cheat the system.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2984803]The new verification system works like this. You click on the link in Seeking and your phone takes a comprehensive scan of your face that has to be in good lighting, and you have to hold still. Once finished, you upload a picture, and the system compares your scan to the picture.

I believe it is similar to face unlock for phones. Using someone's face as a "password" can be fooled by various methods, such as similar looking people like relatives or twins, a face of a mannequin, or certain kinds of high quality photographs, depending on the facial recognition technology being used. Depth perception technology would make it harder to use images, but some old phones and even a few newer ones don't support this, and no guarantee Seeking is using this technology.

Certainly not 100% fail safe proof, but just one more step scammers will have to take to cheat the system.[/QUOTE]They are requiring this for all accounts or just new ones.

If all accounts I'm out and moving to a different site. Not worth having my face on file. Going to nope that.

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2984827]If all accounts I'm out and moving to a different site. Not worth having my face on file. Going to nope that.[/QUOTE]Seeking cooperates with law enforcement whenever requested. I would avoid.

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2984827]They are requiring this for all accounts or just new ones.

If all accounts I'm out and moving to a different site. Not worth having my face on file. Going to nope that.[/QUOTE]I think [URL=https://www.sugardaddymeet.com/?tid=af100011222-m]SugardaddyMeet.com[/URL] is doing this for new accounts, but it's still optional for now. I've had an account with SDM and Seeking for a few years, usually just pay-up for a month if there's a girl I want to get her contact into. Didn't to get verified on SDM last month, will see if Seeking wants my photo next time.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2984803]The new verification system works like this. You click on the link in Seeking and your phone takes a comprehensive scan of your face that has to be in good lighting, and you have to hold still. Once finished, you upload a picture, and the system compares your scan to the picture...

Certainly not 100% fail safe proof, but just one more step scammers will have to take to cheat the system.[/QUOTE]Yes, I'm sure scammers will find a way around it, but maybe it slows them down for a bit.

It's not mandatory if you already registered before they starting self verification. But, I think girls may be less likely to communicate with guys who don't have the badge. You can make the verification picture private, but if you remove it all together, then the badge disappears. I don't know how complex the technology is right now, but some articles online claim there are certain types of masks that can fool facial recognition. Others claim that it's very difficult to fool with the newest iphones and face recognition technology. The government wants the technology anyhow to help them identify people, be it criminals, or other "unwanted" individuals. I'm sure that with time, it will become harder and harder to spoof. Just like the old $100 US bill did not have color changing ink. When counterfeiting became more of a problem, they released a new bill, which made it that much more difficult to forge.

Just wanted to share my take on seeking after being on it for a few years (on and off).

Within US. Works in a choppy fashion on both East and the west coast. Most of them have been PPM (350-500 range). Best profile suited for long term seems to be a single working mom (with a majority of them Latina) that is in the 26+ age group. Most of them have a job (or two) and are looking to supplement income. These are not the ones that want to go to fancy restaurants as they are so busy with their kids life -but want to just go out for a few hours and then go inside for action and get paid for it.

Outside of US.

Jakarta is the best by far. Women in all price ranges (and even close to free as someone else mentioned elsewhere in Jakarta forum) short term or long term (in this case length of the trip). These girls can talk great English, great company and are awesome in bed.

Madrid. Pretty decent. Mostly PPMs.

Panama. Mostly Colombia / Venezuela chicas but quite a few are good company and can speak English and Latinas are always solid in bed.

San Juan. Decent but the girls here don't respond that fast for some reason.

Morocco. A lot available and found at least 2 that you could negotiate for the entire trip. Complexity here is that you can't Airbnb and you have to book two rooms in a hotel (your SA girl can actually help here).

This year I am planning on exploring Slovakia / Hungary / Warsaw area and could use some Intel from the forum.

Been a while since I've done a home girl writeup and the other night was super great so thought I'the write it down.

G is my home girl and has been for about six months, having beaten out nerdy girl and fuck bunny for my full time attention when in town. What broke the tie and has proven critical to us continuing is her outstanding BJ and submissive nature, having coached her up on BJ at date 2. She is truly great now and loves to do it. So intro BJs of 20+ minutes are common and finishing CIM swallow a standard finish.

Our last date was epic. We'the been itching to do Korean BBQ which she had never done and it lived up to expectations. We ordered more than enough food (she likes to have take home since she's from the hood and food is precious) and I even sprung for the Waygu which turned out to be a whopping $130 for a small portion. It was legendary tho and she saved a piece of Waygu for her mom since she's of course never had it.

Finishing dinner I am reminded that she is just 21 in her drinking habits. She's on her second strong cocktail and we are readying to go. She says "oh let me finish this", pointing to her 2/3 full drink. So I settle in for a few more minutes. Nope! She chugs it in five seconds! So 21.

We bop over to the rooftop bar at the Hilton which is a favorite venue. She's got her ID which she proudly gives to the reception girl who gives us the stink eye throughout the seating process. I don't think G notices and I couldn't give a fuck. The waitress on the other hand is nonplussed by our 40 year age gap and very attentive.

G orders a Pinot Noir as she is trying to get used to wine especially red wine. Well it must agree with her because she slugs it down in no time and orders a French 75. She's getting a bit loopy but in a fun and affectionate way. And it's off to the room we go after finishing our drinks.

She's definitely lit more than usual but that's good because her inhibitions have lowered and her fun side comes out. They've given us a large room with a lounge chair and she says won't that be fun and climbs on in doggie postion with her dress tight against her ass.

Well you don't have to ask me twice. I take the hint and start dry fucking her from behind and get her to rear up so I can feel her tits. Damn. This feels nice but would be even better naked.

So we lose the clothes and she says "do u want me to give you head in the chair?" She's a shy girl and would never normally say this. But I like G a little tipsy. Yes Maam. I will have some head. Thank you maam.

So I settle in and man this is one super great head session. Shaft gobbling. Harmonica. BLS. The whole buffet. And I know she loves this because she will do it till I stop her. But that's not now! I let her go at it for quite a few minutes and I ask her to open her eyes and look at me while she blows me (normally an eyes closed girl). She does and it's great. Eventually she swaps back to eyes closed but that's fine too. I didn't clock it but at least 20 minutes of outstanding BJ.

I feel it's time to reciprocate and tell her it's her turn in the chair. But to my surprise she goes into doggie. I attempt a slide in but damn she is tight tonight for some reason so I tell her to sit and let me do her. I've gotten to know what she likes in DATY and she's gotten more involved, pulling up on the skin above her clit to give me better access. So it isn't long before some sloppy gspot work and lips tongue clit circles give her a good O.

It's not her most earth shattering O but that is good because that usually puts her in a fetal position nap for 10 minutes. LOL. And I know that if I fuck her now she can continue to build. So I have her mount up RCG. I hate RCG in the bed due to my upswing but in a chair it's heaven. We hadn't done it before but damn she fucks me good.

At one point I have her lean back so I can feel her tits and she is literally on her back on top of me. Neither of us can move but this is kinda sexy just being inside her and feeling her tits. I can feel myself grow harder and eventually get back to RCG.

I can feel the build in RCG but there is something about me driving the finish that is viscerally more satisfying than a girl getting you off from on top. So I swap her to the bed for a mish finish.

I mount up and start a nice moderate pace. I pull her face to mine and we make out as I drive myself in and out. Oh fuck. This is so fine. I feel the build and she is squeaking and moaning too and I let er rip. Damn that was a fine night!

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2986020]Been a while since I've done a home girl writeup and the other night was super great so thought I'the write it down.

G is my home girl and has been for about six months, having beaten out nerdy girl and fuck bunny for my full time attention when in town. What broke the tie and has proven critical to us continuing is her outstanding BJ and submissive nature, having coached her up on BJ at date 2. She is truly great now and loves to do it. So intro BJs of 20+ minutes are common and finishing CIM swallow a standard finish.

Our last date was epic. We'the been itching to do Korean BBQ which she had never done and it lived up to expectations. We ordered more than enough food (she likes to have take home since she's from the hood and food is precious) and I even sprung for the Waygu which turned out to be a whopping $130 for a small portion. It was legendary tho and she saved a piece of Waygu for her mom since she's of course never had it.

Finishing dinner I am reminded that she is just 21 in her drinking habits. She's on her second strong cocktail and we are readying to go. She says "oh let me finish this", pointing to her 2/3 full drink. So I settle in for a few more minutes. Nope! She chugs it in five seconds! So 21.[/QUOTE]Whatever happened to her?

Great report KM and so good to see using Seeking all over. I am aligned on your view of the US tho I target the 22-25 age group. Very interesting about Jakarta. I was going to go there because the clubs sound amazing but I got the vibe that a lot of the girls are trafficked and that turned me off to it. But if Seeking is good maybe I will go. Love me an Indo girl but never been with one.

I have been just browsing for the past month so far and my primary targets are South America countries. There has been less and less women and what I expected are a lot more pros maintaining there own profile. How do I know because they are the same ads in escort sites. I might want to try sometime later to buy a membership and give a review in other countries.

[QUOTE=Elvis2008;2984409]In the manosphere, the single mom is a huge red flag as far as having her as a GF or wife. The reason is the woman will always choose the kid over you, and if the father is in the kid's life, that is potentially double the trouble. So for the guy, the SB thing makes a lot more sense with the single mom than having her as GF / wife, and the woman has an added incentive to perform. She is pleasing you for her child's sake versus the latest makeup, drugs, or shoes.[/QUOTE]My views on this are so exactly identical to yours. I have delusionally "loved" these single moms in the past, because they performed so well, but then I eventually realized they didn't give two sh! Tz about me. They were just performing superbly for their kid's sake. But now it's all good. I now keep seeing these single moms and enjoy it. They are very reliable.

[QUOTE=Midwestern;2986210]My views on this are so exactly identical to yours. I have delusionally "loved" these single moms in the past, because they performed so well, but then I eventually realized they didn't give two sh! Tz about me. They were just performing superbly for their kid's sake. But now it's all good. I now keep seeing these single moms and enjoy it. They are very reliable.[/QUOTE]The other thing is. Most of the single moms don't want to get themselves into trouble. Because if they wind up in jail, or some other trouble, then they won't be able to look after their kid, leaving the only potential alternative to turn the kids over to family or relatives to be raised. Not all the single moms are cautious, but many of them are. By the way, Seeking just removed their Instagram verification badge, and redesigned their desktop site. IT might be part of new changes.

[QUOTE=KrisMonger;2985946]Just wanted to share my take on seeking after being on it for a few years (on and off).

Within US. Works in a choppy fashion on both East and the west coast. Most of them have been PPM (350-500 range). Best profile suited for long term seems to be a single working mom (with a majority of them Latina) that is in the 26+ age group. Most of them have a job (or two) and are looking to supplement income. These are not the ones that want to go to fancy restaurants as they are so busy with their kids life -but want to just go out for a few hours and then go inside for action and get paid for it.

Outside of US.

Jakarta is the best by far. Women in all price ranges (and even close to free as someone else mentioned elsewhere in Jakarta forum) short term or long term (in this case length of the trip). These girls can talk great English, great company and are awesome in bed.

Madrid. Pretty decent. Mostly PPMs.

Panama. Mostly Colombia / Venezuela chicas but quite a few are good company and can speak English and Latinas are always solid in bed.

San Juan. Decent but the girls here don't respond that fast for some reason.

Morocco. A lot available and found at least 2 that you could negotiate for the entire trip. Complexity here is that you can't Airbnb and you have to book two rooms in a hotel (your SA girl can actually help here).

This year I am planning on exploring Slovakia / Hungary / Warsaw area and could use some Intel from the forum.[/QUOTE]Demographically, the ideal is to find a country with a lot of 20 something females and few men in their 40's, 50's, and 60's. If you look at the 10 to 20 range, and there are more 10 year olds than 20 year olds, you can see if a good country is going to stay good as the crop of 20 somethings will continue to grow in the future.

An expert in demographics and the future told farmers to cut down trying to sell to China and look to sell to Mexico, Colombia, Vietnam, and Indonesia. That made my jaw drop as I had so much success in Colombia and Mexico. I had been to Indonesia before and understood why it would be so good and there was the occasional anedote here about Vietnam.

I am hearing reports about how good Spain is and how bad Italy is which is interesting given their same demographic pattern. Thing is Spain has liberal citizenship and work visa rules for many South American countries and I think it is the influx of South Amerians that may be the reason why Spain is so much better than Italy.

Thing is I had a friend who was into demographics as well. He was disgusted by the scene in the USA around 2007 before the great recession and decided to move to Russia. Given the demographics, attractive women, and their morally loose attitude (he said Russians view sex as intimately as we think of hand shakes) he was in pussy heaven.

He has since married and had sons and was a little depressed looking at mates for his sons. He told me the only continent with an expanding populaton was Africa. When he mentioned that, I thought about subsaharan Africa and not the Northern Arab part of Africa. What is interesting there demographically is how women quit having women there 10 years ago with the Arab spring uprisings and are back to shooting out kids like crazy now. The only country in that region not to have fit that pattern? Morocco. LOL. So the other countries (Algeria, Tunisia, Egypt, and Libya if it gets it shit together) will be great sugar destinations in 10 or so years.

In real life, I saw an average guy here in the USA with a smoking hot wife, a 10 type from Tanzania. I also saw another average looking guy with a 10 type from Uganda and I was smitten with how many beauties there may be in Northeast Africa. Apparently, Northeast Africa is a genetic melting pot. It is close to the Arab penisula and the Italians not only had Somalia as a colony, it was the first place in the world where Europeans mingled and even married darker skinned people out in the open. Before WW2 began, Mussiolini sent troops in to conquer Ethopia, and women are often the spoils of war.

All in all, it should come as no shock then that Somalia and Ethopia have been reported to have the best looking women in Africa, [URL]https://www.africanexponent.com/african-countries-with-the-most-beautiful-women/[/URL].

The demographics in both countries are crazy strong and the GDP per capita is less than $2000 per year in Ethopia and under $1000 per year in Somalia which was not a surprise.

Somalia has around 20 million people which is about what I expected. What stunned me was Ethopia has nearly 130 million people which is more than Egypt.

That combination of low wages, huge young population of women with few older men, and hot women should have made Ethiopa the #1 monger destination in the world, but it is not. Reports are that the women are not that pretty, and Ethopia is dangerous, filthy, and corrupt.

The near unanimous recommendation of mongers were the counries close to Ethopia were much better mongerer sites. That would be countries like Kenya, Rwanda, Uganda, and Tanzania. This kind of reminded of Venezuelan women. I have seen some uber goregous Venezuelan women but I have seen them in Colombia, Peru, and Mexico and not in Venezuela itself.

Guys are seeing hookers in those countries and getting laid for $10 or less. I wonder if it is similar in those countries as it was in Jamaica back when I went in the 1990's. I would go to a Jamaican bar and wonder what women were for sale and soon realized they all were. I am sure there was an exception in those bars, but I have to wonder if in those African nations, the bars are Jamaica like. If so, these countries seem like they should be the best mongering / sugar destinations in the world.

[QUOTE=TheCane;2986052]Whatever happened to her?[/QUOTE]Shayla was awesome for about 18 months. But she has always had 5+ day horrible painful periods. She started taking Depo Provera to control them and it did. But it killed her sex drive. She went from beast to zero very quickly. It also exacerbated her depression so it was a lose lose. We tried to hold on for a while hoping it would change but it didn't. So she moved out last May.

I knew it was winding down so that's when I struck things up with fuck bunny and I really enjoyed that girl. But eventually G won the home girl gig. Looks like she's going to keep it. Just got an impromptu half hour blowjob to CIM swallow in the church parking lot. That's the kinda girl that can hang onto her man!

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2986315]Just got an impromptu half hour blowjob to CIM swallow in the church parking lot.[/QUOTE]LOLOLOL! And thank ya Jesus for these plump, round Brazilian butts! Even the brancas got back LMAO!

[QUOTE=KrisMonger;2985946]Just wanted to share my take on seeking after being on it for a few years (on and off).

Within US. Works in a choppy fashion on both East and the west coast. Most of them have been PPM (350-500 range). Best profile suited for long term seems to be a single working mom (with a majority of them Latina) that is in the 26+ age group. Most of them have a job (or two) and are looking to supplement income. These are not the ones that want to go to fancy restaurants as they are so busy with their kids life -but want to just go out for a few hours and then go inside for action and get paid for it.

Outside of US.

Jakarta is the best by far. Women in all price ranges (and even close to free as someone else mentioned elsewhere in Jakarta forum) short term or long term (in this case length of the trip). These girls can talk great English, great company and are awesome in bed.

Madrid. Pretty decent. Mostly PPMs.

Panama. Mostly Colombia / Venezuela chicas but quite a few are good company and can speak English and Latinas are always solid in bed..[/QUOTE]That's interesting, please explain the (Best by far) comment for Jakarta. As I am here now with boots on the ground and there are less than 50 women in the age range of 18-24 that have been active on seeking in the past week. In a city of 11 M+ people seems more like one of the worst big cities ever for SA than the best!

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2986294]The other thing is. Most of the single moms don't want to get themselves into trouble. Because if they wind up in jail, or some other trouble, then they won't be able to look after their kid, leaving the only potential alternative to turn the kids over to family or relatives to be raised. Not all the single moms are cautious, but many of them are. By the way, Seeking just removed their Instagram verification badge, and redesigned their desktop site. IT might be part of new changes.[/QUOTE]Yes! Another excellent point in favor of single moms. They won't cause trouble or get into trouble. If they hook, either full time or on the side, they'll take this "job" seriously. They want repeat business.

[QUOTE=Midwestern;2986643]Yes! Another excellent point in favor of single moms. They won't cause trouble or get into trouble.[/QUOTE]I had an arrangement with a single mother of 3 for 5 years, off and on, from Seeking. She dumped me without warning for a married guy and charged 2 car payments to my credit card without my knowledge right away. I had paid her dentist for a visit and she got my card from there, used it later without my permission.

She was on pre-trial release for starting a violent fight with her daughter's dad, and I filed a police report about the theft of unauthorized use of my credit card. Her mother lent her the money to repay me in return for me dropping the criminal theft police report.

Would like to believe you Midwestern, but experience has been opposite.

Sequel, I saw the woman at the gas station last week, she had dumped her last live-in boyfriend and wanted a hug and to have an arrangement with me again. No thanks!

[QUOTE=HumbleHal;2986656]I had an arrangement with a single mother of 3 for 5 years, off and on, from Seeking. She dumped me without warning for a married guy and charged 2 car payments to my credit card without my knowledge right away. I had paid her dentist for a visit and she got my card from there, used it later without my permission.

She was on pre-trial release for starting a violent fight with her daughter's dad, and I filed a police report about the theft of unauthorized use of my credit card. Her mother lent her the money to repay me in return for me dropping the criminal theft police report.

Would like to believe you Midwestern, but experience has been opposite.

Sequel, I saw the woman at the gas station last week, she had dumped her last live-in boyfriend and wanted a hug and to have an arrangement with me again. No thanks![/QUOTE]She's a mother of three. Is this in the USA? I would never trust a *desperate* white chick, especially if she's on Seeking. So at the end of the day, it all depends and YMMV.

Hope you got your stolen money back.

I recently got shafted big time. Someone I've known for a long time said she could come to my city to see me, and stay for five days. I said okay come. She came without me fronting her any cash. I was touched. And so I repaid her trust by giving her way too much cash when we met. But that was the only time that I saw her. She said she was busy the next day. I couldn't understand why she was busy. I soon found out that she was actually on a business trip and so she had to come. Then she said she had to leave the next morning. I cannot believe she played me like that. Oh well. As a monger, I know I'll get ripped off sometimes.

It's not a hard and fast rule without exception, it's just a general statement. I'd be way more likely to trust a single Latina mama, than a gringa for several reasons. First of all, they are known for fiercely defending their children, and taking much better care of them, than we do ours. Secondly, it is much harder to access reliable social services in South America, like welfare and child support, plus it's not as easy for women to game the judicial system down there. It's also easier for American women to turn law enforcement again men with false charges of things like domestic battery, etc. I'm willing to bet that when you see those girls in Colombia getting arrested for scoping or kidnapping guys that turn up dead, most of them don't have kids. Some do, but when you look at stats, I'd wager you will find most do not.

Also having multiple kids is usually a red flag. Any single mom knows the difficulty of taking care of 1 alone. To go and be so reckless as to have another without using contraception or resorting to an abortion, indicates something is wrong mentally.

I still think most American moms get on Seeking as more of a luxury than necessity.

[QUOTE=HumbleHal;2986656]I had an arrangement with a single mother of 3 for 5 years, off and on, from Seeking. She dumped me without warning for a married guy and charged 2 car payments to my credit card without my knowledge right away. I had paid her dentist for a visit and she got my card from there, used it later without my permission.

She was on pre-trial release for starting a violent fight with her daughter's dad, and I filed a police report about the theft of unauthorized use of my credit card. Her mother lent her the money to repay me in return for me dropping the criminal theft police report.

Would like to believe you Midwestern, but experience has been opposite.

Sequel, I saw the woman at the gas station last week, she had dumped her last live-in boyfriend and wanted a hug and to have an arrangement with me again. No thanks![/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=MaximusV;2986424]That's interesting, please explain the (Best by far) comment for Jakarta. As I am here now with boots on the ground and there are less than 50 women in the age range of 18-24 that have been active on seeking in the past week. In a city of 11 M+ people seems more like one of the worst big cities ever for SA than the best![/QUOTE]My age range is up to 30. I have easily found great company that will come out hang around in bars / restaurants and come to the hotel and provide you a great time. We are talking no more than 2 M IDR in most of these cases. Best so far, ease of hunt, dollar value and company. Good luck!

Have a strong feeling I'm being played. I have an exclusive arrangement which I'm very happy with, but I have a strong feeling I'm being played. Which is a shame, but hey ho. I just want to know if the girl in question is up for meeting anyone else in which case I'll just walk away and cut my losses.

[QUOTE=Mawgan;2989035]Have a strong feeling I'm being played. I have an exclusive arrangement which I'm very happy with, but I have a strong feeling I'm being played. Which is a shame, but hey ho. I just want to know if the girl in question is up for meeting anyone else in which case I'll just walk away and cut my losses.[/QUOTE]Is her account active? If so she's taking offers. There's zero chance a girl has an active account (like if you sort by recently active and see her) she's not taking offers. And if she is not active she's not getting messages.

It had been quite some time since I logged into SA and went on the prowl. I was heading to Montreal, so I dusted off my profile, made some edits and started sending out feelers.

I usually start sending messages about 3-5 days before arriving, as some girls like to move fast, while others exercise more caution.

I arrived Sunday night and had dinner plans with girl 1. After moving to text, I talked to her once a day or so, just to keep the connection alive. I was busy Saturday, so no comms, but I wrote her Sunday morning asking if we were still on. These girls can be so flaky and fickle. She said that she hadn't heard from me (for one day!) and thought that I may have changed my mind; therefore she decided to sleep with her mom. I wasn't upset, but I didn't have a replacement for the night. I had dates lined up for the rest of the week (some even double booked), but everyone seemed busy this particular Sunday?? It was arrival day, so I ended up relaxing, getting my bearings, and having some bad Japanese for dinner. : (.

Monday was double booked and I usually make a decision the night before regarding which girl will be cancelled. It came down to Kat and Ava. These were two very different specimens. I didn't think Kat would respond when I reached out. She was just my type, thin (not skinny) light brown hair, cute, and about 5'7", grayish colored eyes. Ava was the normal sb with semi-sexy pics from hotel lobbies and bathrooms that one of us have probably taken them to. It came down to an interesting decision. Do I take Ava that seems to know the ropes and wants 600 or Kat that seems more cultured (not in a travel sb sort of way haha) and modestly dressed, but at this point, the cash conversation had not come up. How much would she want?? I decided to take the risk and went with Kat.

We met at a bar and as I was getting out of the Uber, she was walking down the steps from the bar saying that we had bad luck. The place was closed. We hugged and being as though it was 8 degrees outside, we quickly found another place right around the corner. It was a nice place. We walked in and they asked if we had reservations. No res, no problem, let's just hit the bar. With these girls, if you are charming, smart, and conversational, you are usually good to go. She was dressed office sexy. An above the knee black shirt with long leather boots and a black blouse with a burgundy sweater. I sat there drinking my old fashioneds still not sure of what to make of the situation. Am I going to smash this chick? All signs point to yes, but what does she want? Once she loosened up, she started to steer her body toward me, instead of the bar, which is at least a sign of interest in the conversation and dare I say, sexual attraction 😀. She told me her motivation and it wasn't actually financial. She has an office job and does okay, for Montreal. What she wanted was access. She wanted access to our lifestyle where spending $200 on drinks is less than an afterthought. She also likened typical success with spiritual development and was looking for that as well. It was getting late so the response to my next statement would let me know how the night might go. I said that we should get out of there and head to my place and that I had a new bottle of beer that I wanted to try. She agreed like it was already planned.

We ended up back at my place and she wanted to share the beer. I thought that was cool. I also noticed her watching me, and following my lead. She was really comfortable in the apt. It felt like you just came home with your new girlfriend and you guys are building up the tension before you put it in her. LOL. She stood looking over my shoulder, literally her chin on my shoulder as I pulled the cork out of the bottle. Standing in front of me with her black thigh high stocking and crossed legs, we continued to chat. , she followed when I moved to sit on the couch and she sat close. She asked a lot of questions and the conversation was flowing. It was flowing a bit too well. I found that I was enjoying the conversation and had not put my mind into the "let's bang this chick" mode. Hahahaha.

She must have had the same idea. I was facing her while she was leaned up against the arm of the couch. There was a small area of exposed skin in between her thick thigh highs and her skirt. After a few touches and light massages to that area, she reached out both of her legs and put them on the sides of my waist. I grabbed both of her ankles as I bent both her legs back coming in for the slow kiss. She took a deep inhale and it was written all over her face that she was into it. She was a smiler. I've only come across maybe 1 or 2 other smilers before. They smile during sex, foreplay, in between kisses, etc. Now, I'm holding the arm of the couch that her head is resting on and the kisses start. She has her legs wrapped around my waist as I stroke her sides, stomach and hips. Without skipping a beat, I picked her up while we kissed, bumping into the walls and corners as I carried her to the bedroom. She felt almost weightless. When I laid her down, I went right for her nipples, pulling down her blousy tangtop. I love small tits (small, not nonexistent, just saying). She also has small nipples, but I would find that they were very sensitive. When I touched her pussy, it was like all her tension was released from her body and she just melted, like she had been holding her breath and finally exhaled haha.

She came up for a blowjob, but took her shirt off first. I stood at the edge of the bed and she gave a heartfelt BJ. Definitely GF and not P.S. She cupped my balls while doing deep (not deepthroat) slowly, keeping in line with the sensual lover vibe. Hahahah.

Our vibe felt like we had known each other for a time. She likes to have her nipples pulled and each time I pinched them she would moan with my dick in her mouth and seemed to get more excited. That alone almost finished me multiple times hahaha. We were already at th edge of the bed, so I laid her on her back, covered up, and started in mish. Wait. What is that?? Past the first 3 inches or so, it got tight, like squeezing between two tightly packed sofa cushions. Everytime I would push into the tight area, her reaction made her breathless. I wanted to see if I would still feel it in doggy. Made the move and it was even more pronounced. Her thin ass in the air and her hair in my hand as I pound away. Bust in the bag and when I returned she was laying face down on my pillow and had taken off all her clothes, including the stockings. I laid next to her figuring we would pillow chat for a second, but we didn't talk. For the first 5-10 minutes, she laid next to me with her hair in my face, rubbing my back and kissing my face. It was sensual AF. I started to rub her back too and her skin was smoother than I had recognized. There was no hair and it was oddly, pleasurably smooth. 10 minutes of that got the rocket back in position. If I were a lesser man, I would have poked it rawdog, hell, I really wanted to, but discipline prevailed. . She had a thin girl's ass, so you could see her pussy while she laid on her stomach. I threw on another cover and went right in. As soon as I did, the pillow cushions were there. This time I varied how often I would open them and that was driving her crazy. She started using her fingers on her clit and with some nicely placed strokes, she came twice, and possibly a third. Bust in the bag, game over. We went back to the face kissing and crazy sensual back rubbing and after we both fell asleep briefly before she mentioned that she had to go. I offered to walk her to her car, she declined. I told her to buy herself a gift from me as I slipped 350 into her purse. Goodnight kiss and we were done. I was supposed to see her again before leaving but I got sick on the day of. I need a day 2 or 3 with Kat. Looking forward to my next trip to Montreal.

Thanks Lshroomer for making my day. That's the way Seeking is supposed to be. Always a good call to pull the GND vs the pro. Real GFE cannot be beat. Thanks for sharing in detail!

I've been to Montreal plenty of times, but never played in the sugar bowl, so I really didn't know what to expect.

What are the going rates?

Are the girls aggressive (like Madrid)?

What are the typical age ranges?

Is language actually a problem (like parts of Czech Republic)?

Is it a shitshow like the US (I have a very low opinion of SA in the US. I hardly use it)?

So here is what I subjectively found, for those guys that may find themselves in Montreal anytime soon.

* You will win everytime with a 600 offer, but don't get the impression that this is the standard from which all offers should deviate. From what I saw, the standard is about 450/500. Only the experienced (bad in this case) sbs will ask for 600 when you offer 500. Many are cool with 400 and I didn't' try 300 because of the trend I noticed. My line that I tried out that worked well was, "I typically like to put at least 400/500 in my sb's pockets for whatever she wants". To give the impression that this is just the base. If things go awesome, I might give you more, but never less. If they negotiate from here, then I never give more, only what they negotiated. Their loss.

* Most girls were not looking to meet same day. Unlike Madrid, where if you send messages on Saturday and they like you, they will be asking what you are doing on Sunday. You don't want to put it off bc you are out of town. You'll seem not serious.

* Lots of bad SD experiences. If you show you are solid, I find they gravitate toward the vibe. Many just want a cool experience with a safe, reliable, dare I say attractive (not a requirement) guy.

* Very few "official" working girls. I literally found 2 that wanted to skip an outing and head directly to my apt. I don't need that. I personally like the buildup, the questions, the vibe, her having to leave because she has work in the morning. Not her having to leave to blow the next guy.

* 1/2 and 1/2 experienced sbs and rookie sbs. I find you can have the same fun, but I have started to gravitate away from the experienced Sbs. They tend to have sugar baggage and give me low level prossy vibes. I also saw that they have a certain look and from my sampling, I noticed a loose correlation between the look and their typical ask, which was usually 600.

* The age range is weighted heavier in the late twenties and thirties. I NEVER GO OUT WITH 30's. I find they typically overvalue themselves. This was not the case in Montreal. I had a fantastic time with Kat and she is 34. The average SB was in their 30's.

* Girls are slim, especially the french ones. They were generally my type, kinda like being in Lisboa. Attractive spinners, slim, nice curves (curves don't mean meat, it more means she has a shape) small / med boobs, ass of an in shape girl.

* Language is not an issue. Only a handful of girls didn't work out because of my lack of french.

* I personally don't like descriptions that mention princess treatment and I found that the more they talk about what they offer, the more down to earth they are. They realize that there are more of them than us, which means they are lucky to go out with us, not the other way around. WHenever I get the vibe that she believes she should be treated like gold because she has had control of a simp before, I cut the bait.

* Delusion factor is fairly low. You don't' have a bunch of sbs that expect helicopter rides, lavish gifts, and findom from a simp. There were a few that responded with that princess crap. I delete those immediately. When I see Kim kardashian lookalikes, too much makeup, fake ass / tips / lips, I don't even message / respond to them. I like unique looks and a girl that looks like fun. A chick in an evening gown taking a picture in a nice hotel or standing with her designer bags isn't my kind of girl. We can all afford the suites and the designer bags, but for me, that comes along later after we're establish, not from the beginning. We would not go shopping on a 3rd date. Hahaha.

* Standard flakiness to maybe a little less. Not a significant deviation.

These are just my subjective observations and as always YMMV. Keep the info flowing.

02.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;2989234]Thanks Lshroomer for making my day. That's the way Seeking is supposed to be. Always a good call to pull the GND vs the pro. Real GFE cannot be beat. Thanks for sharing in detail![/QUOTE]HAHAHA. Steve, that's funny. I was laying there after she left thinking the same thing. That though it's a lot of work, it's a home run touchdown (LOL) when you find a good one! Kinda makes all the work worth it!

I found this time around that I saw a clear distinction between the experienced and rookie SBs. I had noticed it before, but it was more tangible this time around. Choosing the GND is already paying dividends. Kat has been in touch multiple times after I left asking when am I coming back. I don't have much "business" in Montreal, but I just might take a short trip to secure her and maybe another SB or 2. .

Be safe out there.

02.

I am not sure. I binned my account as we'd agreed to something and I just have a feeling that all is not what it seems.

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2989214]Is her account active? If so she's taking offers. There's zero chance a girl has an active account (like if you sort by recently active and see her) she's not taking offers. And if she is not active she's not getting messages.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Mawgan;2989498]I am not sure. I binned my account as we'd agreed to something and I just have a feeling that all is not what it seems.[/QUOTE]If only there was a community of like minded individuals, and that community had a private direct messaging system, and that system could be used to ask a simple favor like "can you just see if xyz account is active. " Alas, fantasies. Back to life.

How did you end a relationship with a SB without to much drama and backlash response from her?

[QUOTE=Nachoy;2990495]How did you end a relationship with a SB without to much drama and backlash response from her?[/QUOTE]I'm not sure if this was address to someone specific, or a general question. But one important thing is to not give out your personal info. If you never want to see her again, you can just say "Sorry, but things are no longer working out" Then block her.

Heading back to Vienna in a couple of weeks. I've used Seeking in a few European cities before with some success, and typically reactivate my account when I know I'll be traveling. I've been chatting to 2 ladies in Vienna, both early 30's. The response has not been what I expected. Tonight one of then asked for 2000 Euros for the evening and the other one 1500. WTF. Am I missing something here. No way am I going that high.

Stirling.

In my experience the only girls who ask for that kind of money are pros. Keep looking, it's not supposed to be easy except for a few exceptions in the world. Those of us with credible reports can attest to that.

[QUOTE=Stirling;2992363]Heading back to Vienna in a couple of weeks. I've used Seeking in a few European cities before with some success, and typically reactivate my account when I know I'll be traveling. I've been chatting to 2 ladies in Vienna, both early 30's. The response has not been what I expected. Tonight one of then asked for 2000 Euros for the evening and the other one 1500. WTF. Am I missing something here. No way am I going that high.

Stirling.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Stirling;2992363]Heading back to Vienna in a couple of weeks. I've used Seeking in a few European cities before with some success, and typically reactivate my account when I know I'll be traveling. I've been chatting to 2 ladies in Vienna, both early 30's. The response has not been what I expected. Tonight one of then asked for 2000 Euros for the evening and the other one 1500. WTF. Am I missing something here. No way am I going that high.

Stirling.[/QUOTE]I am curious to see responses to this one as I will be out there towards end of September. I am assuming Bratislava which is about an hour from Vienna may be a better place to connect but I may be wrong.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2990556]I'm not sure if this was address to someone specific, or a general question. But one important thing is to not give out your personal info. If you never want to see her again, you can just say "Sorry, but things are no longer working out" Then block her.[/QUOTE]If you are not using a burner phone use one. Just say sorry, block and go. Everyone has their own life to deal with and unless you have someone that is super pissed you will be fine.

[QUOTE=KrisMonger;2992437]I am curious to see responses to this one as I will be out there towards end of September. I am assuming Bratislava which is about an hour from Vienna may be a better place to connect but I may be wrong.[/QUOTE]Thanks for the feedback gents. I will definitely let you know how this turns out in the end and will detail my experiences.

Stirling.

[QUOTE=Nachoy;2990495]How did you end a relationship with a SB without too much drama and backlash response from her?[/QUOTE]Say you are out of money. Or just ghost her, block her number and let someone else have her.

[QUOTE=Nachoy;2990495]How did you end a relationship with a SB without to much drama and backlash response from her?[/QUOTE]Tell her an old girlfriend just contacted you and is offering herself for free.

Claim you are experimenting with the gay sex lifestyle, tell her if she wanted to do anal with you it might be the same! LOL.

[QUOTE=HumbleHal;2992585]Claim you are experimenting with the gay sex lifestyle[/QUOTE]That's the first time I've heard of that. Very interesting, and it could prove to be quite effective.

[QUOTE=Nachoy;2990495]How did you end a relationship with a SB without to much drama and backlash response from her?[/QUOTE]"hey, I'm currently going through a lot of things in life, and would need to keep us on pause. Hopefully we should reconnect at some point in the future! I appreciate you, and hope you stay as lovely as you are".

Don't go the negative route. Don't want anyone pissed off at you for any reason.

I only use Seeking abroad, but had some left over time on my membership and decided to take a look at the NYC options. Let me just say my feelings for not using it in the US we're validated because you get the same shit as online dating here: time wasting, fickle, and not knowing what they want. Like my time is limited and I'm not renewing my membership until I'm planning another trip. Many of these women have been on the site for years still asking for stupid ass demands like they're the prize on a site where they want you to finance their empty lifestyles. Now that's not to say I have a few true hits and will see where they take me, but American women are such a pain to deal with even on Seeking.

[QUOTE=ForTheRealm;2992712]"hey, I'm currently going through a lot of things in life, and would need to keep us on pause. Hopefully we should reconnect at some point in the future! I appreciate you, and hope you stay as lovely as you are".

Don't go the negative route. Don't want anyone pissed off at you for any reason.[/QUOTE]Interesting you should mention that. Some years ago I was referred to a real estate agent who was a buffoon. I tried to work with him for a little while, but he wanted to do things his way, rather than catering to the customer. So I fired the idiot, and found another realtor. The 2nd realtor handled my closing. Now, the 2nd guy was much younger and less experienced than the first. So my initial inclination was to send the first realtor some screen shots showing what would have been his commission, being paid to fledgling, junior agent. But, before doing so, I stopped and thought "Yeah, this guy is a fag, but what if one day I get a flat tire and my cell phone battery is dead. What if he happens to be the only person who drives down the deserted road I'm stranded on?" Of course, that's an incredibly unlikely scenario. Point being, if somebody is not a sworn enemy already, it's probably better not to make them one. Of course if they are, feel free to take revenge on them. But that whole thing about "hell hath no fury like a woman scorned". If the girl is not really on your bad side, I don't see what benefit could come from pissing off a woman who might be mentally unstable, and inclined to retaliate, even if they don't have your personal info at the moment.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2992839] Some years ago I was referred to a real estate agent who was a buffoon. I tried to work with him for a little while, but he wanted to do things his way, rather than catering to the customer. So I fired the idiot, and found another realtor. The 2nd realtor handled my closing.... So my initial inclination was to send the first realtor some screen shots showing what would have been his commission, being paid to fledgling, junior agent. [/QUOTE]Short answer is you owe a 3% real estate commission to each or your realtors. The first real estate agent had a listing agreement with you that said, as long as the agreement was in force he gets paid if it sells even if you fire him. 6 months is the standard duration for a listing contract, if it sells during that time period he gets paid based upon the contract.

Then the second realtor gets paid because he was the "procuring factor" that got the sale to closing. Finally the buyer's agent gets 3% commission because he bought the buyer.

So you now owe 9% to the realtors instead of the standard 6%.

[QUOTE=ForTheRealm;2992712]"hey, I'm currently going through a lot of things in life, and would need to keep us on pause. Hopefully we should reconnect at some point in the future! I appreciate you, and hope you stay as lovely as you are".

Don't go the negative route. Don't want anyone pissed off at you for any reason.[/QUOTE]This tactic has worked for me many times, I've been a Seeking member for 15 years and use it almost exclusively, I still hit up full time hoes but rarely now as my Seeking roster has filled out quite nicely but Seeking takes work to utilize it to its fullest so anyone using it often will have to let a girl go quite regularly and the above advise is a good way to do it in my opinion.

[QUOTE=Stirling;2992363]Heading back to Vienna in a couple of weeks. I've used Seeking in a few European cities before with some success, and typically reactivate my account when I know I'll be traveling. I've been chatting to 2 ladies in Vienna, both early 30's. The response has not been what I expected. Tonight one of then asked for 2000 Euros for the evening and the other one 1500. WTF. Am I missing something here. No way am I going that high.

Stirling.[/QUOTE]Your mistake was asking them to quote you a price. Tell them what you pay, you're the captain of the ship.

[QUOTE=Manizales911;2993005]Your mistake was asking them to quote you a price. Tell them what you pay, you're the captain of the ship.[/QUOTE]I didn't ask LOL. They quoted that quite quickly. No issues, cut them loose.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2992839]Point being, if somebody is not a sworn enemy already, it's probably better not to make them one. Of course if they are, feel free to take revenge on them. But that whole thing about "hell hath no fury like a woman scorned". If the girl is not really on your bad side, I don't see what benefit could come from pissing off a woman who might be mentally unstable, and inclined to retaliate, even if they don't have your personal info at the moment.[/QUOTE]I preach this on the regular here. Totally agree. In this day and age women can make accusations and it's guilty till proven innocent in practice. Don't do it.

I got stood up twice this past week in seeking. Know what I did? Wrote each one saying more or less: sorry I didn't get to see you. I assume something must've happened and I hope it turned out ok. No hard feelings and best of luck to you.

And then I cut them off and never contact them again.

Another one: I try to message girls after dates that I enjoyed time with them and such and look for a response. Why? To get in writing that they had a good time and all ended well. So no friend can ever pull her aside and be like "heyyyyy, ever thought of saying XYZ and getting some money out of this guy?" Call me paranoid but I've never had an issue.

Is it wrong that I kind of like it when girls have daddy issues? I always ask on first date: who do you live with, how's your relationship with your parents? And when I find out a girl has daddy issues (dad left when she was x, don't know dad, dad lives in another state) I know quite a bit about her. Usually those girls are approval seeking, have poor boundaries, more willing to take direction. They are the least likely to put their foot down and say things like I don't X on the first date. They are the most likely to assume that if you're suggesting it confidently it's what we should be doing right now.

(PSA to Dads: don't leave your daughters. It's awful and it messes then up.)

Agree 💯 with Pi that girls with Daddy issues are a whole lotta fun. And I don't feel bad about that because your fulfilling a need for them also. It's a win win. This girl def has serious daddy issues and a handful of more! Quite the kinky little wildcat and yet one of the smartest girls I've ever met. And a ton of fun to just hang with. Read on.

Wow. I have met the most interesting girl of my illustrious career! She is sharp as a tack. Perfect English. Kinky and adventurous. Great sense of humor. Seeking Arrangement of course.

I had been looking for about 6 weeks in CDMX and found several suitable prospects. Had prices negotiated and everything. But as my trip approached I of course kept looking. Hit a very hot girl who had just joined but didn't have anything in her profile but keywords. But no harm sending a Hi. Turns out it was the Hi that would rock my world!

We chatted only briefly and since my trip was only a week away I moved right to WhatsApp. Well damn we hit it off. We chatted for six hours (that first day. And probably another ten or more hours the rest of that week. I hadn't had a chat vibe like this since Valentina six years ago.

Although early on I wasn't sure if she was real (too good to be true?) we got progressively closer and eventually she was sending me short videos of her face or clothes. The one of her showing me her little short skirts for me to pick from will always be a highlight.

My plan was to see her just three hours after landing as we were both so stoked. And it came off without a hitch. Drinks at 5. Dinner at 7 and back in the room by 9.

The bar I chose was inside the St Regis so it was super high end. She bounced in in her red heels all five ft nothing of her, and in her recently purchased Zara Teen 13-14 yr old jeans. LOL. Quite the petite hottie.

We had a couch on the terrace and a beautiful view of the plaza reforma as we sipped our drinks and had appetizers. The conversation flowed a little less well than our amazing chat vibe but we got going after a bit and suddenly almost two hours had flown by. Light touching and hand holding meant it was game on.

Dinner too was effortless. We were a little lit by then and the flow was so easy. We had some lovely Italian and cocktails just a few blocks down from the St Regis. We talked and laughed, and discussed how monogamy is a sham and I am married and she has a BF and yet here we are.

We are so comfy together that it's not a problem when her boyfriend calls and she chats with him while holding my hand and making doe eyes at me! She mentions her boyfriend is very open minded and even likes to listen in when she has sex with other guys!

Before we knew it we were 4 hours into our date; but the early start meant it was still early.

Back in the room the easy chemistry continued. It was like we'the known each other for weeks. We started with a kiss but soon I was on my back on the bed with her straddling me. She was wearing a black top that was basically a tube top (but classy). So I started kneading her tits and then pulled it down to reveal an amazing set of firm be cups top five all time!

The sex was amazing and passionate with all the usual trimmings. An interesting note was that she had never done BLS before. But she took to it like a fish to water. So much so that I asked her if she wanted another BJ tip and I showed her harmonica. Damn she catches on fast. A few minutes later she was giving a top notch BJ. She later said she loves to BJ and that was no lie because man we did a lot.

After quite a bit of fucking she did BJ on her knees at the side of the bed. And she says she wants to video it! I have done a bit of video before but never had a girl initiate. She actually does it as a selfie video and damn it's sexy. Musta done another 15 minutes but I fail to blow and instead finish in mish while kissing. Ooooh so good.

Well if the video didn't add enough kink, stay tuned. After cumming like a big dog we are crashed sideways on the bed when a call from her boyfriend comes in. I'm in a post sex haze but eventually muster enough sense to realize I can start playing with her while her BF is on the phone!

So I start sucking her tits and kneading them and she is cooing and moaning, all as she carries on an otherwise normal conversation in Spanish. Hahaha. Then I start fingering her. And she indicates two fingers. Then she indicates faster and harder and is eventually driving my fingers in and out of her pussy at light speed and the moans and gasps are louder and more frequent.

As much fun as this is, I realize hey I could get in on this. So I pull her into Steve position and mount up. I am fucking her hard and fast as her boyfriend listens in and she is getting very loud and has trouble keeping the convo going! It is sooooo naughty.

After a bit we switch it up to kneeling BJ at the side of the bed and she is deep throat gagging and extra sloppy for her BFs benefit. After maybe 15 minutes she packs it in and flops on her back on the bed. I of course still want to get my nut, so I straddle her and jerk off while feeling those amazing tits. Before long I shoot out a nice second load (unheard of at my age) on her tits, resulting in a very sexy selfie of her and her cum-laden tits for her BF. LOL.

Wow. This girl is one wildcat of a woman. And so fun just at the dinner table or text chat as well. Never met anyone like her. Stay tuned for our day two adventurewhich was actually sexless but the most fun you can have with your clothes on. And don't worry. Sex is on the table for day three. Her lady parts just needed a day of rest after our night one fuckfest.

Gents, arrived in Vienna yesterday. Had originally planned to see girl "A" but that fell through several days ago and moved on to Girl "be". Note, I've been trolling the Vienna page for about 3 weeks and had 3-4 potential possibilities. I open with dinner and 400 E. She countered with 600 and we split the difference 500 E. Easy negotiations. She had sent me plenty of pics and gave me access to her instagram so I knew what I was getting.

We met for dinner, Restaurant Kornat, and as the meal progressed we became quite comfortable with each other. I'm 62, she's 34. I did laugh (internally) and some of the conversation when we danced around why we were on the site. As she spent great lengths to make sure I understood she's not a hooker. Of course not I thought. I don't bring hookers to expensive restaurants.

In any event, we taxied back to my hotel. She did want the money at that point and I acquiesced. No issues. She took a shower and came out in just her panties. No complaints. A 2 hour session and then we fell asleep. We woke up about 7:30 am and she initiated contact again. I didn't complain. An hour later she was gone.

All in all, a success in my books. Will I see her again? Likely not as I have other plans, (read Babylon Club) but I wouldn't be opposed to it.

Stirling.

[QUOTE=Stirling;2996636] I open with dinner and 400 E. She countered with 600 and we split the difference 500 E. Easy negotiations.

In any event, we taxied back to my hotel. She did want the money at that point and I acquiesced. No issues....
[/QUOTE]Women play men by starting high. Just like list price on a car. Then the men think they got a bargain and are a good negotiator because they got a break from their first offer. I can quickly value the woman based upon appearance, personality and if they are ghetto trash. Then that's it. Often I find out in the bedroom they have trashy tattoos from jail / gang culture, or their tits sag from baby suckage, or they have scars from boob jobs, tummy tucks, breast lifts, etc that make the adventure a site for blind eyes. All one can do is not repeat, it does no good to try to renegotiate at that point, they will demand their money for "their time" and you have no options because they will start screaming bloody murder and threaten to turn you in to the police, but rarely will they do so.

Again, once you give the woman the money up front you are asking for problems, bro! I never, never pay / reward the woman up front. Does the boss pay his workers on Monday and see if they show up the rest of the week and work hard? No, the boss pays his workers on Friday after a hard worked week. You give up CONTROL and the girl can run away. Does it happen? 50% of the time. Its called Reinforcement Theory. Once the mouse has the cheese do you think it will then run the maze? Heck no, it will eat the cheese right away and then look for a new game to play elsewhere with another piece of cheese offered and remember how stupid you were.

I simply tell them no, and they can go it they do not like it, bye! I have walked out of the door to their hotel room several times when they ask for money up front, do NOT do it. Ever. Never!!

Was in Mexico city for a week and really didn't have issues finding arrangements via seeking. Most of them were into PPM and most of them had no issues video chatting. Prices were around 3500 to 5000 MXN for a date night, but one (Marianna I think) asked for 15000 MXN (I laughed her off). Going above 30 gets you in the 3500 mxn range. Stayed in an airbnb and didn't have any issue with bringing folks in.

[QUOTE=HumbleHal;2996640]Women play men by starting high. Just like list price on a car. Then the men think they got a bargain and are a good negotiator because they got a break from their first offer. I can quickly value the woman based upon appearance, personality and if they are ghetto trash. Then that's it. Often I find out in the bedroom they have trashy tattoos from jail / gang culture, or their tits sag from baby suckage, or they have scars from boob jobs, tummy tucks, breast lifts, etc that make the adventure a site for blind eyes. All one can do is not repeat, it does no good to try to renegotiate at that point, they will demand their money for "their time" and you have no options because they will start screaming bloody murder and threaten to turn you in to the police, but rarely will they do so.

Again, once you give the woman the money up front you are asking for problems, bro! I never, never pay / reward the woman up front. Does the boss pay his workers on Monday and see if they show up the rest of the week and work hard? No, the boss pays his workers on Friday after a hard worked week. You give up CONTROL and the girl can run away. Does it happen? 50% of the time. Its called Reinforcement Theory. Once the mouse has the cheese do you think it will then run the maze? Heck no, it will eat the cheese right away and then look for a new game to play elsewhere with another piece of cheese offered and remember how stupid you were.

I simply tell them no, and they can go it they do not like it, bye! I have walked out of the door to their hotel room several times when they ask for money up front, do NOT do it. Ever. Never!![/QUOTE]I don't necessarily disagree with your comments. I, like you am wary of the trouble that one can find themselves in if not careful. That said, I do evaluate each situation as it comes along. I had surmised based on our conversations prior to our date that she was what she claimed to be. Even so, we met for dinner first and I was certainly not going to hand over any money at that point. Over dinner it became apparent that she was on the higher end of the spectrum and I felt comfortable handing her an envelope once we returned to my hotel. Could she have flaked out and left at that point? I suppose yes, but I accept there's some inherent risk to this game and I elected to go with my gut. If I had truly sensed she wasn't kosher, I would left her at the restaurant. I'm old enough and experienced enough to usually suss out the flakes etc, but recognize that at some point I might get taken. Sometimes it's worth the risk.

Stirling.

So now that I no longer have a paid Seeking membership, all of a sudden women supposedly in my area are making the first move by sending me messages. Messages that I of course can't read without a paid membership! That rarely ever happened when I had a paid membership. So why now? Nope! Seeking isn't getting any more of my money. Not ever! Overall it mostly proved to be a huge waste of time and definitely a waste of money for me using Seeking in the States. And I don't need it overseas so good riddance! Lure another sucker into re-subscribing just to read a "fake" message like "Hi" waiting for you LOL!

[QUOTE=TheCane;2996857]So now that I no longer have a paid Seeking membership, all of a sudden women supposedly in my area are making the first move by sending me messages. Messages that I of course can't read without a paid membership! That rarely ever happened when I had a paid membership. So why now? Nope! Seeking isn't getting any more of my money. Not ever! Overall it mostly proved to be a huge waste of time and definitely a waste of money for me using Seeking in the States. And I don't need it overseas so good riddance! Lure another sucker into re-subscribing just to read a "fake" message like "Hi" waiting for you LOL![/QUOTE]They feature your photo all around the 2 days before and then after your membership has expired. To motivate you to come back again. If you come back you will find out all the messages and views were from continents away, by people you could not meet in person, time wasters. All the dating websites do this. Fake.

[QUOTE=HumbleHal;2997072]They feature your photo all around the 2 days before and then after your membership has expired. To motivate you to come back again. If you come back you will find out all the messages and views were from continents away, by people you could not meet in person, time wasters. All the dating websites do this. Fake.[/QUOTE]Yes, I noticed the same thing with [URL]SugarDaddyMeet.com[/URL] (SDM), but at least it's not those fake bot messages you get from Secret Benefits. Generally had good experiences on SDM too. Even if there's less ladies on it, I like the lower cost and not getting kicked off for negotiating prices on the site.

[QUOTE=TheCane;2996857]So now that I no longer have a paid Seeking membership, all of a sudden women supposedly in my area are making the first move by sending me messages. Messages that I of course can't read without a paid membership! That rarely ever happened when I had a paid membership. So why now? Nope! Seeking isn't getting any more of my money. Not ever! Overall it mostly proved to be a huge waste of time and definitely a waste of money for me using Seeking in the States. And I don't need it overseas so good riddance! Lure another sucker into re-subscribing just to read a "fake" message like "Hi" waiting for you LOL![/QUOTE]That's going to happen if you have your location (city) set to the USA. I NEVER use the seeking app, or seeking from the browser on my phone, because the site will ask for location permission. Which might conflict with the location you specify. I ONLY use seeking from a desktop computer, which I will not be prompted for location access, and can set my city to wherever I goddamn well please, without a VPN.

With all the experience I have in life now, it is beyond me why anyone would pursue a gringa woman in this day and age.

"Successful" members are now required to list a weight in pounds or kilograms. Now, it will be interesting to see if they attempt to enforce this. What if a woman sends them a complaint saying "he put down in his profile that he's 180 pounds. But when I got to the date I could tell he was 300 without him even stepping on the scale!" Well, I guess it's time to bring a portable scale to the restaurant.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;3003822]"Successful" members are now required to list a weight in pounds or kilograms. Now, it will be interesting to see if they attempt to enforce this. What if a woman sends them a complaint saying "he put down in his profile that he's 180 pounds. But when I got to the date I could tell he was 300 without him even stepping on the scale!" Well, I guess it's time to bring a portable scale to the restaurant.[/QUOTE]The only weight the girls care about is the weight of your wallet.

[QUOTE=Manizales911;3003837]The only weight the girls care about is the weight of your wallet.[/QUOTE]Some, but not all girls.

Also, I don't know if they are making this mandatory "attractive" members too (the women, remember men are called "successful" members). It might be that they making this new requirement for men only, and not the women of the site. Someone else might be able to confirm or deny.

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2995357]Is it wrong that I kind of like it when girls have daddy issues? I always ask on first date: who do you live with, how's your relationship with your parents? And when I find out a girl has daddy issues (dad left when she was x, don't know dad, dad lives in another state) I know quite a bit about her. Usually those girls are approval seeking, have poor boundaries, more willing to take direction. They are the least likely to put their foot down and say things like I don't X on the first date. They are the most likely to assume that if you're suggesting it confidently it's what we should be doing right now.

(PSA to Dads: don't leave your daughters. It's awful and it messes then up.)[/QUOTE]Back many moons ago when SA in the US was full of normal girls rather than pro, I met this mid 20's girl who had serious daddy and other issues. But she was one of the most submissive compliant girls I have ever met. She did everything and anything (lots of hard spanking, slapping, spitting, piss in mouth) and pleasing me was her life's mission. I took her to sex clubs and used her up, down and sideways in pubic and she would still be begging to give me a BJ on the drive home. She was adopted from Russia as a child where apparently her dad tried to burn the house down with her in it (or so she told me) so, yeah damaged goods for sure.

I never even paid her a lot of cash, I paid her phone bill, bought her some groceries now and then and she was happy with it. Then she got a "BF" who turned out to be a pimp and he put her on the motel hooking circuit and I saw her ads online. Have no idea where she may be now but probably nowhere good.

I don't know how I feel about it now. Maybe I was filling some "need" in her as well but I'm sure it wasn't a healthy one. But at the time it seemed we were both getting something out of it.

[QUOTE=ExpatAmerican;3003898]Back many moons ago when SA in the US was full of normal girls rather than pro, I met this mid 20's girl who had serious daddy and other issues. But she was one of the most submissive compliant girls I have ever met. She did everything and anything (lots of hard spanking, slapping, spitting, piss in mouth) and pleasing me was her life's mission. I took her to sex clubs and used her up, down and sideways in pubic and she would still be begging to give me a BJ on the drive home. She was adopted from Russia as a child where apparently her dad tried to burn the house down with her in it (or so she told me) so, yeah damaged goods for sure.

I never even paid her a lot of cash, I paid her phone bill, bought her some groceries now and then and she was happy with it. Then she got a "BF" who turned out to be a pimp and he put her on the motel hooking circuit and I saw her ads online. Have no idea where she may be now but probably nowhere good..[/QUOTE]Just got back from a week abroad. Met 4 girls. Every one I ask about their family. Because I want to get to the part about dad, and when it comes I think "OK there it is."

One dad has a new wife 2 years older than her and lives abroad.

One dad lives in another city and is pretty absent. But as she says he's still my dad so I still love him.

One also has a dad in another city. Parents divorced and mom took the kids and moved away.

It's sad that it makes me horny because I see this beautiful weak gazelle. I know she'll be banging me in 90 minutes and part of it is unresolved daddy issues.

Dads, again, don't abandon your daughters. Assholes like me are just around the corner.

[QUOTE=ExpatAmerican;3003898]Back many moons ago when SA in the US was full of normal girls rather than pro, I met this mid 20's girl who had serious daddy and other issues. But she was one of the most submissive compliant girls I have ever met. She did everything and anything (lots of hard spanking, slapping, spitting, piss in mouth) and pleasing me was her life's mission. I took her to sex clubs and used her up, down and sideways in pubic and she would still be begging to give me a BJ on the drive home. She was adopted from Russia as a child where apparently her dad tried to burn the house down with her in it (or so she told me) so, yeah damaged goods for sure.
Then she got a "BF" who turned out to be a pimp and he put her on the motel hooking circuit and I saw her ads online. Have no idea where she may be now but probably nowhere good..[/QUOTE]Sounds like the 29-year-old Russian adoptee I am now porking. All the Russian girls like to fuck. That is the "need" you are fulfilling as well as paying them off for the fuck.

[QUOTE=HumbleHal;3004864]Sounds like the 29-year-old Russian adoptee I am now porking. All the Russian girls like to fuck. That is the "need" you are fulfilling as well as paying them off for the fuck.[/QUOTE]I have found Russian girls to be really good fucks too. Just not through Seeking LOL. Has me thinking about taking another trip to the UAE. I find them in Germany too, but not in the concentration that exists in the UAE.

[URL]https://www.foxnews.com/us/las-vegas-woman-allegedly-robs-sugar-daddy-after-sin-city-weekend-report[/URL]

Overpaid and still doesn't get to have sex instead gets robbed. I don't get showing off wealth to paid sex workers.

P.S.: girl in the photo looks below average to me when compared to EU girls hence the use of "overpaid".

[QUOTE=DwayneJohnson;3006311][URL]https://www.foxnews.com/us/las-vegas-woman-allegedly-robs-sugar-daddy-after-sin-city-weekend-report[/URL]

Overpaid and still doesn't get to have sex instead gets robbed. I don't get showing off wealth to paid sex workers.

P.S.: girl in the photo looks below average to me when compared to EU girls hence the use of "overpaid".[/QUOTE]$2500. HaHaHaHa. And people wonder why we travel. If I was Elon Musk I'm not paying 2500 for pussy, ID be sick just thinking what I paid.

It just happened the other day. Not only did they remove income and assets, but prices are going up as well, as long mandatory weight. They claim that weight can be hidden, but that doesn't stop the female members from putting it into their search criteria. Even if it's not visible on the profile, they can still filter out.

[URL]https://blog.seeking.com/why-we-removed-net-worth-and-income-fields-and-introduced-new-changes?utm_source=onsite&utm_campaign=reasonswhy[/URL]

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;3006912]It just happened the other day. Not only did they remove income and assets, but prices are going up as well, as long mandatory weight. They claim that weight can be hidden, but that doesn't stop the female members from putting it into their search criteria. Even if it's not visible on the profile, they can still filter out.

[URL]https://blog.seeking.com/why-we-removed-net-worth-and-income-fields-and-introduced-new-changes?utm_source=onsite&utm_campaign=reasonswhy[/URL][/QUOTE]Interesting. I actually find the weight helpful. More for girl weights. I was browsing and saw an attractive girl. No body shots. Then read her weight was 180-190. Ok time saved! Thank you Seeking!

I don't really have a problem with the pricing. If your going to date girls at $500/ pop in USA who gives a fuck whether it's $110 or $130/ Mon. If you don't have that coin then fish elsewhere.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;3006932]Interesting. I actually find the weight helpful. More for girl weights. I wa browsing and saw an attractive girl. No body shots. Then read her weight was 180-190. Ok time saved! Thank you Seeking!

I don't really have a problem with the pricing. If your going to date girls at $500/ pop in USA who gives a fuck whether it's $110 or $130/ Mon. If you don't have that coin then fish elsewhere.[/QUOTE]And what makes you think the women won't lie about their weight like they do about their age, their looks (posting old pics), etc? Sounds like a fatty told you the truth, but you know plenty of others will lie. As far as I see, it's just the same old same old as long as people are being people. Regarding the price, I have that kind of coin and then some. It's not just about the money. It's about [B]the return[/B] I'm getting on my money (and my time). Again, acknowledging the States is the only place I ever used Seeking, just too many fakes, flakes, fraudsters, and scammers! And I don't do $500/ pop in the USA with average looking girls either. I'll be sticking exclusively to overseas trips to Brazil, Germany, and other countries. With some of those trips being up to a month at a time. Combining a love of travel with a lust for fucking attractive girls at favorable prices. That's how I do. Look for future field reports.

Ever since they removed income and assets, far fewer women have been contacting me, despite the number of profile views, jajajaja. Money talks.

Anybody know when the price increase is taking effect, or how much it's going to be?

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;2995357]Is it wrong that I kind of like it when girls have daddy issues?[/QUOTE]Well, it's abusing another person's developmental trauma, which she is re-enacting again and again. A girl who believes to be fundamentally bad and worthless (for Dad / men) will do things that keep that belief of her self-worth (lesness) alive and well.

Question is, would one wish that to be done for himself? One's own sister? Children?

I think one can feel for these individuals and enjoy their company, but it has to be sexless. Just appreciation, admiration and humane love. That is what heals them. But the requirement is to sacrifice one's own sexual urges.

Plenty of girls out there who just want to abuse us to get paid.

[QUOTE=Desin;3007714]Well, it's abusing another person's developmental trauma, which she is re-enacting again and again. A girl who believes to be fundamentally bad and worthless (for Dad / men) will do things that keep that belief of her self-worth (lesness) alive and well.

Question is, would one wish that to be done for himself? One's own sister? Children?

I think one can feel for these individuals and enjoy their company, but it has to be sexless. Just appreciation, admiration and humane love. That is what heals them. But the requirement is to sacrifice one's own sexual urges.

Plenty of girls out there who just want to abuse us to get paid.[/QUOTE]Is it wrong to just say, hey, not my problem. Everyone is abusing everyone else to some degree. Everyone acts in self interest alone. This whole site is about how to "abuse" women. And in turn the women "abuse" us. She's a women with "daddy" issues. We're all men with "sex" issues. Who's abusing who more? Are her daddy issues worse for her than my addiciton to sex is for me? She should have the self awareness not to sell herself for money just as we should have the self awareness that all this empty sex that we buy isn't going to fill the void in our souls. My issues are not her problem, her issues are not mine.

[QUOTE=TheCane;3006940]And what makes you think the women won't lie about their weight like they do about their age, their looks (posting old pics), etc? Sounds like a fatty told you the truth, but you know plenty of others will lie. As far as I see, it's just the same old same old as long as people are being people. Regarding the price, I have that kind of coin and then some. It's not just about the money. It's about [B]the return[/B] I'm getting on my money (and my time). Again, acknowledging the States is the only place I ever used Seeking, just too many fakes, flakes, fraudsters, and scammers! And I don't do $500/ pop in the USA with average looking girls either. I'll be sticking exclusively to overseas trips to Brazil, Germany, and other countries. With some of those trips being up to a month at a time. Combining a love of travel with a lust for fucking attractive girls at favorable prices. That's how I do. Look for future field reports.[/QUOTE]I'm waiting for seeking to implement mandatory videos like fatalmodel does in Brazil. But I imagine that now with advanced AI, there will some be a way to fake videos of oneself very soon.

[QUOTE=Kazeu;3007729]I'm waiting for seeking to implement mandatory videos like fatalmodel does in Brazil. But I imagine that now with advanced AI, there will some be a way to fake videos of oneself very soon.[/QUOTE]That's already happening it's already happening!

[QUOTE=Desin;3007714]Well, it's abusing another person's developmental trauma, which she is re-enacting again and again. A girl who believes to be fundamentally bad and worthless (for Dad / men) will do things that keep that belief of her self-worth (lesness) alive and well.

Question is, would one wish that to be done for himself? One's own sister? Children?

I think one can feel for these individuals and enjoy their company, but it has to be sexless. Just appreciation, admiration and humane love. That is what heals them. But the requirement is to sacrifice one's own sexual urges.

Plenty of girls out there who just want to abuse us to get paid.[/QUOTE]The "father complex" idea was invented by one sigmund freud. Mr. Freud's heyday was in the late 1800's. A time in history where the scientific community had very little understanding of the human mind. We no longer live in 1890. Most psychologists who have graduated during the past decade VEHEMENTLY condemn nearly all of the theories presented freud, with the possible exception of defense mechanisms. The idea of "daddy issues" came from an individual who is now recognized as a KNOWN PERVERT! Today we can treat people with cognitive behavioral therapy, and do not rely on retarded concepts such as the oedipus complex.

Tell me something. Let's say that a woman is born to a father who divorced the mom during pregnancy because he found out she was cheating. So the dad raises the girl by himself for the first 8 years, doing an excellent job. The girl is doing very well in school, and shows promising signs of becoming a very productive and capable adult. But then the dad suddenly dies unexpectedly, so she goes to live with her mom. And by now the mom is a crack addict, so the girl is either neglected, abused, or whatever it is you think happens to girls who have daddy issues. If the girl drops out of school and goes to live on the streets, are you all the sudden going to say she has "mommy issues" instead? Get real. Anything can cause childhood trauma; don't blame it solely on fathers who are losers.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;3007793]The "father complex" idea was invented by one Sigmund freud. [/QUOTE]All you need to understand about Sigmund Freud is his theory about "Penis Envy. " Women wish they had a penis- because they envy yours, so be sure to give it to them. Long, hard, fast, slow. Put it in and take it out. Turn it all about, that's the hokey pokey!

Lovely rant, VanessasClient. But I see you lack any understanding about the issue you are raving about.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;3007793]...retarded concepts such as the oedipus complex.[/QUOTE]And definitely let's not talk about Madonna / working girl-complex. On a *****monger forum. No sexual deviants here!

About the issue of Seeking, is there a country in Europe or nearby that would provide university aged girls with 100-150 euros per hour or 200-250 for 2-3 hours?

I'd like to spend holiday on a country where it's cheaper than the local 200/250 per hour tax. I'm quite interested in Prague, but I guess that place would be 200+ per hour.

[QUOTE=Desin;3008052]
About the issue of Seeking, is there a country in Europe or nearby that would provide university aged girls with 100-150 euros per hour or 200-250 for 2-3 hours?

I'd like to spend holiday on a country where it's cheaper than the local 200/250 per hour tax. I'm quite interested in Prague, but I guess that place would be 200+ per hour.[/QUOTE]Athens is full of Ukrainian girls, escort rates are around 150 euro. Filis street "wham bam thank you mam" privats are cheaper but that also means escort rates do not explode like rest of Europe. However if you only hunt on seeking then rates are very similar in most of the Europe. Barcelona is slightly cheaper for escorts than Athens but girls are less taller than Athens and slightly more percentage of brunettes to blonde or ginger.

I recently saw a travel show where the host encouraged connecting with locals. It made me think about how that's an unexpected benefit of sa. I had great experiences a few years ago in bcn, and really enjoyed practicing my spanish with locals. My favorite experience was with a girl I don't think I would've picked on paper (more alt looking, bi, vegan) but who was super fun to hang out with and great in bed. I even liked the vegan places we went LOL. It didn't hurt my hotel had a nice rooftop pool and bar so we'the hang out there and have a few cocktails before going in. I'll never forget her carrying a large purse with all her sex toys in it to dinner so we could use them later LOL or fucking her in fishnets.

Going back to bcn in a few months with sb I've been seeing and probably going to stay at the same hotel. Last time I found a fun spot to fuck outside at the hotel. Sb would be down for it but wondering if showing her will make her ask questions LOL.

[QUOTE=DwayneJohnson;3008057]Athens is full of Ukrainian girls, escort rates are around 150 euro. Filis street "wham bam thank you mam" privats are cheaper but that also means escort rates do not explode like rest of Europe. However if you only hunt on seeking then rates are very similar in most of the Europe. Barcelona is slightly cheaper for escorts than Athens but girls are less taller than Athens and slightly more percentage of brunettes to blonde or ginger.[/QUOTE]I've been reading the forum and checking out the escort sites of Athens, among other countries. After a trip to Barcelona I noticed that I would like to stick to "non-pros", as they have been the best experience in my home country. Thus, the escort sites and massage parlor reviews won't give valid information about what to expect and where to go for. I've used other platforms than Seeking, which seems to be getting more and more negative comments from hobbyists, but it's probably the best way that there is. Other ways I've used have been really demanding for time and not even efficient. Real pictures are essential, or at least to be able to get them before meeting. I'm quite a scrutinizer for body and face, even though I don't look for the miss universe type.

All I'd really want is to find one, two or three natural, cute semi-fit 20 something to cover up the sex part for a few week trip and pay them like 150 euro per meeting. Could this be achieved through Seeking in Portugal, Spain, Czech or Greece? Or is the SEA or South America the only way to fulfill this ideal arrangement?

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;3007793] retarded concepts such as the Oedipus complex.
[/QUOTE]I usually eat-a-puss complexly if allowed.

[QUOTE=DwayneJohnson;3008057]Athens is full of Ukrainian girls, escort rates are around 150 euro [/QUOTE]What's a good site or agency for escorts in Athens?

[QUOTE=Desin;3008196]I've been reading the forum and checking out the escort sites of Athens, among other countries. After a trip to Barcelona I noticed that I would like to stick to "non-pros", as they have been the best experience in my home country. Thus, the escort sites and massage parlor reviews won't give valid information about what to expect and where to go for. I've used other platforms than Seeking, which seems to be getting more and more negative comments from hobbyists, but it's probably the best way that there is. Other ways I've used have been really demanding for time and not even efficient. Real pictures are essential, or at least to be able to get them before meeting. I'm quite a scrutinizer for body and face, even though I don't look for the miss universe type.

All I'd really want is to find one, two or three natural, cute semi-fit 20 something to cover up the sex part for a few week trip and pay them like 150 euro per meeting. Could this be achieved through Seeking in Portugal, Spain, Czech or Greece? Or is the SEA or South America the only way to fulfill this ideal arrangement?[/QUOTE]Non-pro price range depends more on physical attractiveness and flirting skills of buyer than the location. Even after that $150 per meeting is too low for a client without long term prospect in most of the Europe. You might get some pro's pretending as Non-pro at that price. I see lot of pros also making profile as Non-pro on seeking in prague, I use local Czech version similar to seeking (hledamsponzora dot cz) but it's not worth the hassle for tourists. SEA or South America are far better option for your requirements.

[QUOTE=Desin;3008196]I've been reading the forum and checking out the escort sites of Athens, among other countries. After a trip to Barcelona I noticed that I would like to stick to "non-pros", as they have been the best experience in my home country. Thus, the escort sites and massage parlor reviews won't give valid information about what to expect and where to go for. I've used other platforms than Seeking, which seems to be getting more and more negative comments from hobbyists, but it's probably the best way that there is. Other ways I've used have been really demanding for time and not even efficient. Real pictures are essential, or at least to be able to get them before meeting. I'm quite a scrutinizer for body and face, even though I don't look for the miss universe type.

All I'd really want is to find one, two or three natural, cute semi-fit 20 something to cover up the sex part for a few week trip and pay them like 150 euro per meeting. Could this be achieved through Seeking in Portugal, Spain, Czech or Greece? Or is the SEA or South America the only way to fulfill this ideal arrangement?[/QUOTE]I really don't think you are going to find a Seeking girl for 150 in Europe that meets your bar. The economy simply doesn't support such a low number. I've been able to find a couple GND girls in Spain at 250 but even that is not easy girls in Spain (a second tier economy) seem locked in at 300-350. Others may have deeper Euro experience than me but I doubt 150 is happening.

On the other hand finding that in Brazil is easy. I've had a few great and stunning girls at 500 R ($90) even. One became long term and travel girl.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;3008364]I really don't think you are going to find a Seeking girl for 150 in Europe that meets your bar. The economy simply doesn't support such a low number. I've been able to find a couple GND girls in Spain at 250 but even that is not easy girls in Spain (a second tier economy) seem locked in at 300-350. Others may have deeper Euro experience than me but I doubt 150 is happening.

On the other hand finding that in Brazil is easy. I've had a few great and stunning girls at 500 R ($90) even. One became long term and travel girl.[/QUOTE]Yep, in CDMX I am paying between $225-300 in CDMX. A little less in MTY.

Guys, I want to fly a provider to meet me in Europe. Most of these girls I met in Brazil.

I would like advice on how much I should pay (roughly) and advice on how to set up the behavior I expect. Would love to hear from those who have actually done it and can give advice based on experience. What I mean is how to inoculate against possible problems such as her saying she has a headache, her period started early (I'll still want to fuck). Basically how to install the frame that even though we're going to have fun she needs to be PROFESSIONAL and behave like a professional.

I want her to hang with me a few days in my hometown, then travel a bit around Italy and probably Spain and Portugal. I want sex 2 x a day and of course I would want a nice fun attitude and no whining.

I only want to bring a girl I've already fucked, which leaves me with these choices. UNLESS you think I can do it successfully without knowing the girl beforehand. There are a lot of girls in Brazil and Colombia!

The girls I know:

1 - fantastic girl, sweet and we really had good chemistry, 25 yo. My top choice, but she is replying less and less to my messages and didn't say much to my offer of flying her to Europe, other than saying she was afraid of long flights. So I can't count on her.

2 - Nice enough girl, 22, but very Gen Z. A little moody, a bit quiet, a bit slow to respond, her IG is nothing but anime memes. She seems the most interested. I'm slightly concerned that she wouldn't be 100 percent compliant.

3- Nice girl, 28, a bit dumb but that's probably a bonus. Does not have a passport. Not sure she can get her act together and get an expedited passport in time.

4- a real pro, she's already done 2 tours of Europe working as an independent escort. She would do it but will probably ask too much. She's smart with her money (and good for her).

So any advice is welcome.

[QUOTE=DwayneJohnson;3008314]Non-pro price range depends more on physical attractiveness and flirting skills of buyer than the location. Even after that $150 per meeting is too low for a client without long term prospect in most of the Europe. You might get some pro's pretending as Non-pro at that price. I see lot of pros also making profile as Non-pro on seeking in prague, I use local Czech version similar to seeking (hledamsponzora dot cz) but it's not worth the hassle for tourists. SEA or South America are far better option for your requirements.[/QUOTE]Interesting about the Czech version. Currently in Prague, and it's filled with Ukrainian hotties. Had a fair share of them so far in the massage parlours, all model quality. Been searching for some on Seeking, can't find any. Can't be bothered with Czech women, wondering if this site you mentioned has any Ukrainian girls on there? 'Sponsor' culture is quite normalised and common with Russian and Ukrainian girls, just can't seem to find a way to access them in Prague. I've seen a few foreign older guys waking around with Ukrainian hotties too, so definitely feel like I'm missing out on something. Would appreciate some intel on this.

[QUOTE=CherchezFemme;3008439]Guys, I want to fly a provider to meet me in Europe. Most of these girls I met in Brazil.

I would like advice on how much I should pay (roughly) and advice on how to set up the behavior I expect. Would love to hear from those who have actually done it and can give advice based on experience. What I mean is how to inoculate against possible problems such as her saying she has a headache, her period started early (I'll still want to fuck). Basically how to install the frame that even though we're going to have fun she needs to be PROFESSIONAL and behave like a professional.

I want her to hang with me a few days in my hometown, then travel a bit around Italy and probably Spain and Portugal. I want sex 2 x a day and of course I would want a nice fun attitude and no whining.

I only want to bring a girl I've already fucked, which leaves me with these choices. UNLESS you think I can do it successfully without knowing the girl beforehand. There are a lot of girls in Brazil and Colombia!

The girls I know:

1 - fantastic girl, sweet and we really had good chemistry, 25 yo. My top choice, but she is replying less and less to my messages and didn't say much to my offer of flying her to Europe, other than saying she was afraid of long flights. So I can't count on her.

2 - Nice enough girl, 22, but very Gen Z. A little moody, a bit quiet, a bit slow to respond, her IG is nothing but anime memes. She seems the most interested. I'm slightly concerned that she wouldn't be 100 percent compliant.

3- Nice girl, 28, a bit dumb but that's probably a bonus. Does not have a passport. Not sure she can get her act together and get an expedited passport in time.

4- a real pro, she's already done 2 tours of Europe working as an independent escort. She would do it but will probably ask too much. She's smart with her money (and good for her).

So any advice is welcome.[/QUOTE]I've done it before, but won't do it anymore, unless the girl shows initiative; and 90% + of girls will not. I had success on 3 occasions in a row, with the same girl that I would continue to see. Were it not for the fact that she inadvertently got pregnant with another man's baby. She's going to keep the baby and attempt to start a family with the man; I have no clue whether it will work. Regardless.

There's another girl I tried it with last year. Like the other girl, she is someone I had spent time with before. First time she bailed because she claimed her grandmother was in the hospital. Lucky for me I had a refundable ticket with LatAm, so they covered me. I spoke to the hotel manager, and he also covered me on her room. But, I still lost money on some of the tours I had scheduled for she and I. The 2nd time I was willing to take much less risk, given my prior experience with her. So I said "if you want to see me and go on this vacation, you'll need to ride the bus" So I got her a bus ticket that cost $40 USD. She failed to get to the bus station on time, and blamed it on the rain. So from here on out, if she wants something from me, she's going to have to pay off her debt with the only bodily organ she has of any value; and quit hint, it's not her brain.

Anyway, there's another girl I can think of that I get along pretty well with. But, she has asthma and is prone to unexpected health problems. And the last thing I want is to get a call 2 hours before her flight telling me she's stuck in the emergency room. Because I don't always have a fully refundable flight.

Basically the conclusion I came to was that if you setup an arrangement like this, it is completely dependent on the other person upholding their end of the bargain. If they get into a car accident on the way to the airport, you are out of money. If they forgot it was their sister's wedding or birthday party the day of the flight, you are out of money. Or if they just change their mind and decide to mess with you for whatever reason, you are also at a loss. Women in general are far more volatile and far less reliable than men, and in the end I just decided it wasn't worth the risk anymore.

Even the girl I struck gold with on those 3 occasions didn't provide sex quite as often as I would have preferred on 2 out of the 3 trips. Granted, there are legit reasons for not being in "the mood", such as a near fatal binge drinking episode resulting in a catastrophic hangover. But, even if I had pressured her or refused to pay what I agreed to, I 100% guarantee you that would have very bitterly ended that connection at bare minimum, but likely could have resulted in other repercussions. Remember, even if this woman doesn't have your room key, they know your room number. And there are few things foreign law enforcement love more than aggressively pursuing a gringo they perceive as wealthy. I wouldn't have pushed her for more sex anyhow after she already declined. Not only because it's inappropriate, but we didn't specify a specific number of times we were going to fuck before the trip; she just understood that sex was expected. Still, if you're going to take the risk on this kind of travel arrange, definitely do not pay any compensation until the very last day of the trip, ideally right before going to the airport.

I don't advise it; too risky for my taste. I'll just find a girl at my target destination. And if there are none to my liking, I'll just go alone, and with any luck I might meet someone while I'm over there. On that note, there was another girl I was talking to who had the money to pay for her own flight, and I told her I would reimburse her if her behavior on the trip was satisfactory. She declined. And that's where you'll get that 90+ % number from. More than likely 99% or higher.

Great tip on the location, thanks.

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;2998817]That's going to happen if you have your location (city) set to the USA. I NEVER use the seeking app, or seeking from the browser on my phone, because the site will ask for location permission. Which might conflict with the location you specify. I ONLY use seeking from a desktop computer, which I will not be prompted for location access, and can set my city to wherever I goddamn well please, without a VPN.

With all the experience I have in life now, it is beyond me why anyone would pursue a gringa woman in this day and age.[/QUOTE]

VanessasClient.

Your reply is depressing but rings of truth. There are no guarantees are there? Plus women are far less reliable than men. Add in the fact that these girls are pros and most pros IME are average intelligence at best, and tend towards the dumb side of the bell curve. It's crazy how slow some of them are to respond. With most you can't send them a long message with multiple ideas and questions because they won't reply to 90% of it.

Let's see if someone else chimes in.

[QUOTE=CherchezFemme;3008465]VanessasClient.

Your reply is depressing but rings of truth. There are no guarantees are there? Plus women are far less reliable than men. Add in the fact that these girls are pros and most pros IME are average intelligence at best, and tend towards the dumb side of the bell curve. It's crazy how slow some of them are to respond. With most you can't send them a long message with multiple ideas and questions because they won't reply to 90% of it.

Let's see if someone else chimes in.[/QUOTE]It's a total cliche but some stereotypes are true.

I very often have experiences with these girls, observe general stupidity, and think this is the reason I'm in a position to pay this money and you're in the position to work for it.

Just constant random things. You ask 2 questions on text but they can only answer one at a time. You ask them their life plans and they're retarded stuff like to be an influencer. You ask about their interests and they all revolve around stupid vapid nonsense.

I often look at them and think, wow either some guy is going to rescue you or you're going to spend your life working retail because you don't seem to have the cognitive power or base ambition to really do anything more than what you're doing now.

(Mind you I'm only talking about the majority. Yes exceptions exist).

[QUOTE=CherchezFemme;3008465]VanessasClient.

Your reply is depressing but rings of truth. There are no guarantees are there? Plus women are far less reliable than men. Add in the fact that these girls are pros and most pros IME are average intelligence at best, and tend towards the dumb side of the bell curve. It's crazy how slow some of them are to respond. With most you can't send them a long message with multiple ideas and questions because they won't reply to 90% of it.

Let's see if someone else chimes in.[/QUOTE]I've prob flown girls 15 times and been pretty lucky but been burned twice. In no case du I know the girl more than fucked once or maybe twice.

Interestingly all girls that I've flown from US city A to US city B have not flaked and been great. Las Vegas to Miami. Philly to Dallas. That kind of thing.

I have successfully flown Brazilians to Europe twice. And it was AMAZING. But also two fails. One time I flew a girl from Buenos Aires to London and she dumped me and fucked other guys! Fuck that hurt. More recently I have had two Brazilian girls bail because their mother was worried and put her foot down. One I lost Airfare and the other (just yesterday!) got cold feet before I booked. Her mom was worried about her being trafficked by this guy she didn't know well.

So def be careful. It can be wonderful or tank. Def pay attention to the strong mother daughter vibe in Brazil. The momma trumps all!

[QUOTE=Jbob084;3008443]Interesting about the Czech version. Currently in Prague, and it's filled with Ukrainian hotties. Had a fair share of them so far in the massage parlours, all model quality. Been searching for some on Seeking, can't find any. Can't be bothered with Czech women, wondering if this site you mentioned has any Ukrainian girls on there? 'Sponsor' culture is quite normalised and common with Russian and Ukrainian girls, just can't seem to find a way to access them in Prague. I've seen a few foreign older guys waking around with Ukrainian hotties too, so definitely feel like I'm missing out on something. Would appreciate some intel on this.[/QUOTE]Ukrainian girls are mostly found in massage parlors or privats. Seeking doesn't get same level of Ukrainian inflow as those in privats due to language barrier or lack of popularity. Those older guys with hot girls probably picked them up from privats or Showpark.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;3008584]I've prob flown girls 15 times and been pretty lucky ;.[/QUOTE]Thanks for the anecdote, that's what I was looking for.

How much money did you give the Brazilians and for how long?

My top choice says both of her parents have passed so no mama drama there.

I'm waiting to get some positive signals from them. Maybe I'll mention the money, specifically, and see if they show more interest.

I'm leaning towards not doing this.

[QUOTE=CherchezFemme;3008640]Thanks for the anecdote, that's what I was looking for.

How much money did you give the Brazilians and for how long?

My top choice says both of her parents have passed so no mama drama there.

I'm waiting to get some positive signals from them. Maybe I'll mention the money, specifically, and see if they show more interest.

I'm leaning towards not doing this.[/QUOTE]Generally when I stay with a girl for a few days I give them the same PPM per day as I gave them on our first date. So if I gave a girl 500 R and our date was 3 hrs I also give her 500 R per day. This is whether I visit their city and stay together or I fly them somewhere.

I might try to bring it down a bit based on the travel expense and her getting several days in a row. Like the most recent girl I was flying to Europe propose. I was giving her 1500-2000 R / night (if you met her you would see this is 100% worth it) and she said how about 3500 R for our four day trip.

Hopefully that gives you some framework.

[QUOTE=CherchezFemme;3008640]Thanks for the anecdote, that's what I was looking for.

How much money did you give the Brazilians and for how long?

My top choice says both of her parents have passed so no mama drama there.

I'm waiting to get some positive signals from them. Maybe I'll mention the money, specifically, and see if they show more interest.

I'm leaning towards not doing this.[/QUOTE]I have flown girls from Colombia to Mexico. IMO if you think there is a chance they are not coming or will not make it through customs, then I would not bother. If you are sure she is coming, then send her the ticket. If you think there is a good chance she wants to go, there is a 3rd option.

I had one gal that I was pretty sure really wanted to come to Mexico but I was worried about her making it through Mexican customs, so I flew with her from Colombia to Mexico. For you, I know it is a hassle and an expense, but if you really want a Brazilian girl to go with you, you should fly to Brazil and take the flight to Europe with her.

There are all these rules and regs we guys take for granted that these women do not know like no perfume in your carry on and do not be decked out in jewelery. I have had that and other issues when traveling with a sugar baby.

Then there is just the overall conduct of people not knowing you have virtually no rights when traveling. We all to know as agreeable as possible when traveling. Many women do not. I had one idiot woman slam her passport in front of a customs agent once. I was so embarrassed. I was like this guy has like 10 X the power of a cop and you just pissed him off. She was dead to me after that trip.

You should read the Mann Act. I do not know of the USA government doing anything with bringing a woman across international borders, and I doubt this will be a problem, but you should have some plausible deniability if the issue were to come up.

It does not appear as if Europe is anywhere near as anal as the Americas on trafficking, but the profile of the trafficked woman is a single young attractive woman travelling on her own, and the airline itself can deny her entry. No one questioned me and this SB about anything. When we got to Mexico, we were thoroughly searched as were other passengers but I think customs was looking for drugs as we were coming from Colombia after all.

Elvis brought up a good point. The Colombian I used to see was worried about getting past immigration in Mexico. They have "requirements" for entry. Sometimes they are not evenly enforced access the board, depending on the agent at the desk that particular day. Even if no visa is required, you usually have to show proof of where you will be staying, a return ticket proving when you will leave, as well as sufficient funds to support yourself during your visit. Some countries require a card showing proof of yellow fever vaccine if you are arriving from South America, the Caribbean, and certain other places.

Anyway, I guess she had every right to be worried. I gave her suggestions on how to behave. I told her that the very moment she approaches the agent at the desk, before they have even have a chance to ask for her passport, she should loudly announce "Hola, como estas? And offer to shake their hand through the glass window. I told her not to say it so loud that it sounds like a scream or a shout, and that she should also appear bubbly and have a huge smile on her face. I tried to explain to her that drug smugglers and other visitors with ill intentions are trying to maintain as low of a profile as possible. And that if she is jumping up and down, behaving all lively and excited, she's going to draw attention to herself. But the important thing is that she's going to look like a tourist, which is exactly what we want. If you show up to the desk wearing a Lei around your neck and have sun screen smeared all over your cheeks, the agent is more likely to think "Oh great, just another annoying tourist. Let me hurry them through and maybe they will go spend some money in gaudy gift shops. ".

She told me "yes yes, of course, I am always very polite with people in the airport. " Anyway, I had an internet signal on my flight, and I get a Whatsapp from her that they are detaining her. Not sending her back to Colombia, but just pulling her aside from further review. I don't remember the exact amount of time they held her, but it was at least a couple of hours, because my flight was scheduled to land after hers. Anyway, they verified her hotel and return flight, but said there was an issue with her passport. So they literally gave her a new passport on the spot, with a new picture. I was shocked, I didn't even know the Mexican government had a laminating machine to print passports for another country (Colombia) inside of the airport. I thought passports were only manufactured in consular centers for the country in question.

The agent wrote a note next to her passport stamp saying "This woman is to be gone by xx date, and not a day later" which coincided with the date of her return flight. When I met her inside of the airport, she told me she was scared when they held her in the room like that.

Anyway, that's one more thing to consider. Just because a visa is not required, doesn't mean they are going to let her in. The girl in question has to know how to follow instructions.

Also, I had a girl with asthma ask me to buy her a vape pen one time, but I didn't know she had breathing trouble before I bought it. Let's suppose I had declined. Or, maybe she wants you to take her to the mall to buy expensive jewelry or designer hand bags. What if you refuse because that wasn't included in the original plans? Now you have a woman traveling with you that is maybe pissed at you because you didn't get her everything her little heart desired. If you are going to do it, I would also have a backup plan in case something like this happens.

[QUOTE=Elvis2008;3008790]I have flown girls from Colombia to Mexico. IMO if you think there is a chance they are not coming or will not make it through customs, then I would not bother. If you are sure she is coming, then send her the ticket. If you think there is a good chance she wants to go, there is a 3rd option.

I had one gal that I was pretty sure really wanted to come to Mexico but I was worried about her making it through Mexican customs, so I flew with her from Colombia to Mexico. For you, I know it is a hassle and an expense, but if you really want a Brazilian girl to go with you, you should fly to Brazil and take the flight to Europe with her.

There are all these rules and regs we guys take for granted that these women do not know like no perfume in your carry on and do not be decked out in jewelery. I have had that and other issues when traveling with a sugar baby.

Then there is just the overall conduct of people not knowing you have virtually no rights when traveling. We all to know as agreeable as possible when traveling. Many women do not. I had one idiot woman slam her passport in front of a customs agent once. I was so embarrassed. I was like this guy has like 10 X the power of a cop and you just pissed him off. She was dead to me after that trip.

You should read the Mann Act. I do not know of the USA government doing anything with bringing a woman across international borders, and I doubt this will be a problem, but you should have some plausible deniability if the issue were to come up.

It does not appear as if Europe is anywhere near as anal as the Americas on trafficking, but the profile of the trafficked woman is a single young attractive woman travelling on her own, and the airline itself can deny her entry. No one questioned me and this SB about anything. When we got to Mexico, we were thoroughly searched as were other passengers but I think customs was looking for drugs as we were coming from Colombia after all.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=VanessasClient;3008965]

She told me "yes yes, of course, I am always very polite with people in the airport. " Anyway, I had an internet signal on my flight, and I get a Whatsapp from her that they are detaining her. Not sending her back to Colombia, but just pulling her aside from further review. I don't remember the exact amount of time they held her, but it was at least a couple of hours, because my flight was scheduled to land after hers. Anyway, they verified her hotel and return flight, but said there was an issue with her passport. So they literally gave her a new passport on the spot, with a new picture. I was shocked, I didn't even know the Mexican government had a laminating machine to print passports for another country (Colombia) inside of the airport. I thought passports were only manufactured in consular centers for the country in question.

The agent wrote a note next to her passport stamp saying "This woman is to be gone by xx date, and not a day later" which coincided with the date of her return flight. When I met her inside of the airport, she told me she was scared when they held her in the room like that.

[/QUOTE]Somebody is bullshitting somebody here because there is ZERO chance of the Mexican authorities printing a new passport onsite and CERTAINLY no chance of them printing a passport for a country other than Mexico.

[QUOTE=Manizales911;3008978]Somebody is bullshitting somebody here because there is ZERO chance of the Mexican authorities printing a new passport onsite and CERTAINLY no chance of them printing a passport for a country other than Mexico.[/QUOTE]Good thing for me that you are so knowledgeable, and that I'm in the business of justifying my personal affairs with other people.

Despite all the ridiculous BS of the search and vetting process, Seeking still rules. And for one simple reason. True GFE. I don't mean just kissing and BBBJ but a true girlfriend feeling like real affection and shared moments outside the bedroom.

I had met Ariana on Seekibg back in January. And we had just the best vibe. Felt 100% real. Went from a single date to staying together three days. The complete GFE where the money part really does feel like a gift you are giving your GF.

We live about 3000 miles apart so I hadn't see her since January. I arrived the restaurant a few minutes early and was sitting outside. When she saw me from afar she literally ran to me and threw her arms around me. That true affection just can't be replicated with a pro.

After an amazing dinner and drinks (fuck that girl can talk!) back at the room the sex was amazing. She'd been a cautious girl last time due to pregnancy concerns and we had suited up. But since I've had my vasectomy the gloves came off and fuck wow it was epic for both of us.

Absolutely adore hanging out with such a smart, sweet, and affectionate girl. Makes all the rest of the BS totally worth it.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;3010067] Seeking still rules. And for one simple reason. True GFE. I don't mean just kissing and BBBJ but a true girlfriend feeling like real affection and shared moments outside the bedroom. I had met Ariana on Seekibg back in January. And we had just the best vibe. Felt 100% real. [/QUOTE]Ime, this feeling can be bought directly. Many girls in East Asia do this naturally well even though they are pros. Sometimes I directly ask a girl to "play girlfriend. " Just explain what I want, eye contact, hand holding and so on. Ask her to act like she's completely in love with me. Feels 100% real, as you put it. It's a natural and easy performance to most women. Just need to be explicit that you want this because many mongers don't.

[QUOTE=Manizales911;3008978]Somebody is bullshitting somebody here because there is ZERO chance of the Mexican authorities printing a new passport onsite and CERTAINLY no chance of them printing a passport for a country other than Mexico.[/QUOTE]Probably meant Visa. If there was an issue with a Colombian visa, Colombian immigration could print a new one. Probably lost in translation.

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;3010370]Ime, this feeling can be bought directly. Many girls in East Asia do this naturally well even though they are pros. Sometimes I directly ask a girl to "play girlfriend. " Just explain what I want, eye contact, hand holding and so on. Ask her to act like she's completely in love with me. Feels 100% real, as you put it. It's a natural and easy performance to most women. Just need to be explicit that you want this because many mongers don't.[/QUOTE]That is a good point and true enough if you want an hour or two of GFE. But gets untenably expensive for extended periods. My approach is that I have a Seeking date and PPM. Let's say $300. I don't specify time limit and the dates vary from 4 hrs to overnight depending on how much she wants to hang w me.

If I truly dig a girl I will fly her to me when on business or I will spend a "mini vacation" with her in her city. I never pay more than the PPM for 24 hrs. So I am getting GFE for for four days for $1200! That's isn't happening with a pro. No way.

But yeah if you just want a couple hours a pro can provide the illusion.

Ps I have learned to treat shopping as u would a girlfriend not part of cost per fuck. It’s so much more fun. Yes I spent another $200 or so on shopping but it was fun for both of us.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;3010444]If I truly dig a girl I will fly her to me when on business or I will spend a "mini vacation" with her in her city. I never pay more than the PPM for 24 hrs. So I am getting GFE for for four days for $1200! That's isn't happening with a pro. No way.
But yeah if you just want a couple hours a pro can provide the illusion.
Ps I have learned to treat shopping as u would a girlfriend not part of cost per fuck. Its so much more fun. Yes I spent another $200 or so on shopping but it was fun for both of us.[/QUOTE]I went to Dallas for a weekend, used frequent flier miles, to meet a woman I met online. Talked about getting together for a couple weeks on the phone, I cancelled once and then came through. She picked me up at the airport and drove me around, I took her shopping at the mall twice and spent $300 at Victoria Secret and another store. Took her out for meals. Got a good fuck from her but that was it. Gave her 450 cash. Total damage about $750 and $300 for hotel.

Ok for a diversion but would not repeat with this woman. Bossy personality, sells videos of herself, and slightly large in the belly. You appreciate getting away after 2-3 days with a woman, almost like a nagging wife. I posted photos of her on the Medellin site when the discussion was about buying underwear at VC.

[QUOTE=Steve9696;3010444] So I am getting GFE for for four days for $1200! That's isn't happening with a pro. No way. [/QUOTE]Agreed -- for what you described, Seeking is great esp in the US. The downside is average looks. Very few girls on Seeking would be competitive at a top club like Scandallo.

The 1 in a 1000 that are hot tend to be escort-like in terms of attitude, except sex is worse. If one can meet them at all, it won't be cheap. Multiday trips and keeping in touch are unlikely because they have so many other options. And they are not interested in a regular relationship or marriage.

This is primarily my $. 02 for the new guys who might be learning about Seeking from this forum.

Some guys I know advise spending no more than 48 or max 72 hours with a girl. And I generally agree. You run out of small talk. Something gets on your nerves (or hers). But here I am four days in with Ariana. And one more to go and still adore her. So smart. So witty. Amazing meaningful sex with urgent hot tongue tangling and shared breaths. A real sweetheart find. The unicorn. Def going to be my Euro GF.

1. Girls who are age 18-21. They are not experienced, you will waste a lot of time trying to go back and forth with them, all they will want to do is kiss and collect money, etc.

2. Women who ask or hint they want a $$ fee to meet you at a restaurant. Need to pay a babysitter or gas money. Some want the money by paypay, cashapp. They ask if you have these apps. They are seasoned pros and want to negotiate a price before you have even met them, based upon a few photos that are old. In reality they are fatties or prostitutes who know the routine and how to play you. They will say "I want to make sure we are on the same page before travelling to meet you" or "My time is valuable, I need to see if we are in the same expectation level" They are trying to get you to commit to them before even meeting. These are standard phrases. When you meet them their body will be much less in value and you have already been the sucker who committed to a price, which they will demand you honor.

3. Women from other cities. If you go there, you are in their ball park and at their mercy. Photos may be old or they will be aggressive about getting your money and pounce on your wallet because you are a one-time sucker. Extreme caution. You will likely waste your money. There are enough women within an hour of your city.

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;3010493]Agreed -- for what you described, Seeking is great esp in the US. The downside is average looks. Very few girls on Seeking would be competitive at a top club like Scandallo.

The 1 in a 1000 that are hot tend to be escort-like in terms of attitude, except sex is worse.[/QUOTE]Yeah, that is why you keep the seeking women around that are better in bed. On average, I agree that seeking women are less skilled than escorts but when you get a good one, whoa!

Thing is the number of hot women on seeking explodes where there is economic distress. In 2009, I bagged a woman whose friends compared her to a super model. In Mexico City, I never scored better than an 7 or 8 on three previous trips and then the pandemic hit. In one trip once the pandemic started, I scored four 9-10 types in one trip.

And we are coming due for our next crisis. I am not going to go into too much detail here. China has been pushing the world's growth particularly 3rd world growth in the last 20 years, and their currency is pegged to the dollar and Euro for the most part. As long as China keeps the amount of its currency supply in line with what the EU and USA are doing then, their currency will be fine, but China is pulling the same stunt so many countries do and is printing at an unprecedented rate to pay for stuff. [URL]https://www.voronoiapp.com/money/-Chinas-Broad-Money-Reaches-the-US-Euro-Area-and-UK-Combined-1289[/URL].

Between 2000 and 2023, China's broad money supply expanded by a factor seven times greater than the combined increases observed in the United States, the Euro Area, and the United Kingdom. By the first quarter of 2024, China's total broad money supply equaled that of these economies. And so China has more money in its system than the USA and EU combined.

So it is simple supply and demand, if you print more money, your money will go down in value if you let your currency float, but China like I said has a fixed currency. Because the government sets its value and not the market, it is not going to float down but get crushed as no government not even one as big as China is immune to market forces. China will be forced to devalue its currency which means a ton of wealth in the world is going to blow up.

Thing about supply and demand is that people ignore it in the short run. I remember with oil. There was no new supply and demand was inelastic. With housing, American housing never went down, and now we will have all the excuses about why China can keep printing up money with no repercussions.

I am always early to these things and the China crash is not going to happen until we get away from people talking about the China miracle to how bad things are in China, and they are bad, really bad there right now.

When these economic calamites hit, it is monger heaven. Argentina was monger gold when their economy collapsed in 2002. Russia was gold the first ten years of this century. Most of the world was hit in 2008 and 2009 and it was monger paradise even in the USA if you had money. Ironically, Brazil was pretty good in 2008 and 2009. I was in Universal Studios in 2009 and there were no lines, and the few people there were mostly Brazilians. The real was 1. 6 to the dollar back then.

And then you had the pandemic. That was monger manna from heaven if you stayed in the game.

Brazil was probably the country that was the biggest beneficiary of the China boom. When China blows up, and supply and demand says that is inevitable, it is going to be monger paradise once again maybe better than even during the pandemic. And I would include other countries that have done well with the China boom which is most of South America, much of Africa, and Australia will be hit hard as well. And that is when you will see the 9-10 types back on the market.

Seeking is just full of prostitutes using a different marketing plan.[blue][Deleted by Admin][/blue].

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;3010370]Ime, this feeling can be bought directly. Many girls in East Asia do this naturally well even though they are pros. Sometimes I directly ask a girl to "play girlfriend. " Just explain what I want, eye contact, hand holding and so on. Ask her to act like she's completely in love with me. Feels 100% real, as you put it. It's a natural and easy performance to most women. Just need to be explicit that you want this because many mongers don't.[/QUOTE]This is pretty sad dude. I know I can be dismissive to sugar girls at times and just see them as a means to an end (casual sex with no strings) but it feels honest. You don't feel awkward asking a girl to role play liking you?

[QUOTE=AmericanPi;3010836]This is pretty sad dude. I know I can be dismissive to sugar girls at times and just see them as a means to an end (casual sex with no strings) but it feels honest. You don't feel awkward asking a girl to role play liking you?[/QUOTE]Why do you think it's sad or not honest, can you elaborate?

It's a service / role play like any other. From her POV it's emotional labor. All companionship work revolves around the same variables of time, money, looks, emotional labor, sexual labor. You just need to be clear what you want to buy.

Avoid women who start off with saying, "I know my worth". Generally speaking they absolutely don't know their worth but have "golden pussy syndrome" instead. To be avoided!

[QUOTE=TheCane;3011105]Avoid women who start off with saying, "I know my worth". Generally speaking they absolutely don't know their worth but have "golden pussy syndrome" instead. To be avoided![/QUOTE]Amen to that. Some don't understand that the market sets the prices, not the vendor. I typically avoid girls that start with a recognition of value. That being said, I do like to get it out of the way early on in order not to waste time. I typically tell them what I'm used to and they then agree or counter. I don't like to negotiate because what I offer is usually solid with no ceiling. Something along the lines of of "at least x amount of euros, sometimes more, but never less", etc.

02.

[QUOTE=LshRoomer;3011161] I typically avoid girls that start with a recognition of value. That being said, I do like to get it out of the way early on in order not to waste time. I typically tell them what I'm used to and they then agree or counter.[/QUOTE]Basically, you cowered to their demands to negotiate to their price level before meeting. Sad. I always say, based upon a few photos, all women start at $0 and if I meet them in person and like them, I value them more highly. This is the truth.

Would you buy a car or rent an apartment without looking at the vehicle, or the neighborhood of the apartment? No.

Sadly, the last 3 women I have met in person at a restaurant I turned down because they were 20+ pounds over the weight of their photos. True! When I meet I say, I thought you were more slim. Then they say they needed to lose 10-20+ pounds, and we can reset their value as an overweight cow. I do not want some old cow that has saggy tits and already gave birth to 3 kids, and has a fat belly. But these women want to lock you in to their price, get a commitment, and scold you if you do not honor their inflated price from 10 year old photos.

[QUOTE=LshRoomer;3011161]Amen to that. Some don't understand that the market sets the prices, not the vendor. I typically avoid girls that start with a recognition of value. That being said, I do like to get it out of the way early on in order not to waste time. I typically tell them what I'm used to and they then agree or counter. I don't like to negotiate because what I offer is usually solid with no ceiling. Something along the lines of of "at least x amount of euros, sometimes more, but never less", etc..[/QUOTE]Well, let's define what the market is first. If she were that great, a guy would swoop her off her feet and take care of her. If she is a hooker and has repeat clients, then she does not need to say what she is worth, her clients know. Now that is the next question, how many women have you repeated with or gone back to a 2nd or 3rd time out of desire because she was awesome versus being cheap / available? For me, that number is really low. And how does a woman know if she is good in bed? Hell, they all think they are great because guys want to fuck them when some are terrible. So when a girl says she knows what she is worth, what she really means is the amount of money someone as great as her will take to fuck a loser like you. Instead of being insulted, the guy negotiates, "Okay, maybe a hundred more. "

One of the issues with seeing hookers is that it makes you think all women are out for a buck, and the hookers do all they can to trample on your self esteem because it is profitable for them. I get that seeking can be dry as a bone and guys are horny and may be stuck settling for that fat chick or overpaying but it should never be at the expense of a guy's ego. A woman who says she knows what she is worth is basically nothing more than a fuck doll.

I do not get why guys cannot see the difference between a gift for a woman you like versus paying a woman for a task. If you are having sex with a woman who likes you and is good in bed, you will only see hookers when they fill a need. The sex is so much better with the woman who desires to be with you.

If you pay a plumber $200, it is different than having a friend do plumbing work for you and you spend $200 buying him dinner or a gift, but guys here insist a wage and a gift for women are the same thing.

If you are not getting bites on seeking, consider changing where you are fishing. For me, Colombia was better than Mexico which was better than the USA. A lot of guys will settle for the pigs in their back yard versus the beauties abroad. I do not get moving to greener pastures if you can.

In Colombia, the neighborhoods are rated 1 to 6 by the government with the best neighborhoods being a six. An ISG on here said guys could not get a girl in above level 4 housing. That was news to me because I had banged several in the 5-6 range before he said that.

One guy said he saw this level 6 girl come to a park in a SUV looking all hot with her perfect manicured dogs. He thought she was a level 6 girl with a rich stunning 20 something husband. The apartment I stay at in Colombia is level 6 and yes, there are women who fit that mold. Thing is I have never seen some 20 something Adonis in the apartment complex. The better looking guys usually are in their 30's with kids in tow but the majority are middle aged men with dad bods. This guy was putting other guys on a pedestal that I do not know exist.

One of my American SBs was with an Adonis like guy. He was handsome, smart, rich, and apparently had this huge dick. Thing is he did not need to pay to get women. When he and my SB went to a club in his Lambo or Maserati, everyone stared, and she loved it. He is in jail now. She broke it off with him not when he went to jail but when she learned he was sleeping with half the state. It turns out he was getting all his money by ripping people off. The "cool guys" he hung out with were there because he brought their drugs. One apparently snitched him out, and the others had nothing to do with him once he went to jail. If the Adonis is not locked down, there is a pretty good chance he is a narcisstic psychopath like this guy.

It is hard for a woman to find a guy to support her. Like I said, how many women have you repeated with? How many have you just been with and not just for sex or beauty?

Rich Cooper has a YouTube channel and he is spot on when he says guys should only see women who have a genuine burning desire to be with them. Here are two videos worth watching: [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fTq0Q3GId_4[/URL].

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gGxzl_KyBr8[/URL]

After watching these videos, I was kicking myself. God, I was so stupid. I thought when a woman said I want to take it slow, I was being considerate versus her leading me on. I want to get comfortable with you is I want to see if I can find a man who disgusts me less than you. I have these rules about when I go to bed with a man means you need to spend a lot of money on dates with me before I bang you. Then there were the lack of responses, the no shows, the stupid excuses (I cannot make it my father died). LOL.

I think that is what got me about seeking. I treated the normal girls like hookers. If I had a girl not mention price and bang the shit out of me bare, I thought she must have been doing it with other guys versus she had GBD for me. Now I know the tells of a woman with GBD and if I were to venture out again, I would only see the fuck dolls to fill a need.

If you really buy the notion that there is no chance the hottie may like you for you over your money, then the hookers have beaten you!

[QUOTE=SubCmdr;3010663]Seeking is just full of prostitutes using a different marketing plan.[/QUOTE]If you are paying a girl to have sex with you after you have left your country of origin then you are [B]International Trick[/B] and she is a prostitute. Any attempts to define it any differently means you are engaged in self-delusion. Real men don't do that. They look in the mirror and take responsibility for what they are doing and what they have done.

Every man when they are young should learn game and how to talk an attractive girls that he likes out of her panties. Pussy is Pussy!

For me the objective is to nut. Girl who likes me. Girl who I am paying. All the same thing. Only difference is how much I am paying for it. Remember to get a girl to like you requires time. Time for me is the most expensive thing that I own.

I have never ventured in sugar dating but I'm curious but the learning curve as we all know can push a man back by thousands and thousands of dollars and probably not have much to show for it either. So the experienced SDs any guidance would be greatly appreciated.

I rotate between Warsaw & Budapest, and my disposable sugar baby money would be maximum 1000 EU per month. Which seems decent after RTFF but I don't want to be a sucker who paid 300 Euros for her "great company over dinner" which I paid for so 500 Euros and going back home with my dick in hand sounds terrible but for a boy to swim he must risk drowning so I'm going to go forward with seeking arrangement (open to other platforms if the seniors here recommend). Also what is baller money in a city? This is more economic than sugar dating question I suppose basically a rule of thumb to know the economic reality of the city (I think it's 2 X the rent of a city center room which makes baller money in Warsaw around 2000 Euros for example).

P.S. - Read around 5 pages of this forum and made interesting notes and learned a lot.

[QUOTE=Gsi2810;3011233]I have never ventured in sugar dating but I'm curious but the learning curve as we all know can push a man back by thousands and thousands of dollars and probably not have much to show for it either.[/QUOTE]Well, that is easily solved. You do not give her a penny until after you have had sex.

[QUOTE=Gsi2810;3011233]I don't want to be a sucker who paid 300 Euros for her "great company over dinner" which I paid for so 500 Euros.[/QUOTE]Again, I would not pay for dinner until I had sex. I usually knew within 5 minutes whether the girl was a hooker I wanted to bang, was SB material, or someone I was not interested in. So in the USA, I did coffee dates and would meet the girl at a later date. In other countries where time was short, I would meet for a drink and if we hit it off, we went to bed that day.

I met one girl for dinner who looked nothing like her pics and it was very awkward to have to wait for a meal, so dinner is a bad idea for a first meet.

[QUOTE=Gsi2810;3011233]I rotate between Warsaw & Budapest, and my disposable sugar baby money would be maximum 1000 EU per month.[/QUOTE]I looked at salaries in those places and escort fees. That is more than enough although it seemed like Poland was more than Hungary.

The reason seeking has more attractive women than other dating sites is because women are allowed to admit they are after money and guys are after sex, and that is the initial attractant: sex for men and money for women. However, that is just the sugar part of it. The daddy part is overlooked. Do you remember when you were in your 20's and how naive you were and how many stupid moves you made that you would never make today? Your goal is to make her life better by taking care of her needs. A lot of these women think they need all this money when what they really need is a plan and executing that plan.

Money is a minimum motivator. When you say that you will do something for X amount of Euros or dollars, what you are really saying is you do not want to do it for any reason outside of money. That is a hooker, and most of the women come into a meet thinking like a hooker. You are the one who is older with knowledge. You need to educate them on what a good SD and SB are supposed to be. They do not know what to expect. If after you try to explain what a good SB is supposed to be, and they are just interested in money and nothing else, it is your choice to pay or play, but that is not the desired end game.

With a hooker, it is the hour is up and if you want me to stay, it will be more. The blowjob is usually 3 to 5 minutes and it is on to sex. When you have a SB whose life you have made better, you will have to tell them to stop because they will not stop sucking. With the best SBs, they will initiate the sex and their primary motivation is not money but making you feel good because you have cared that they feel good. Hell, I had this nympho SB who literally wanted sex 6 X or more a day.

But before you get there, you have to project wealth. The best looking women have had so many men try to trap them in bullshit schemes. You have got to get beyond that first hurdle by dressing well and showing them that you are not a financial loser by projecting wealth.

So with the SB, get over that first hurdle and then focus on her needs not how much she is going to cost. If she really has desire for you, it will work out.

[QUOTE=Gsi2810;3011233]I rotate between Warsaw & Budapest, and my disposable sugar baby money would be maximum 1000 EU per month. Which seems decent after RTFF but I don't want to be a sucker who paid 300 Euros for her "great company over dinner" which I paid for so 500 Euros and going back home with my dick in hand sounds terrible but for a boy to swim he must risk drowning so I'm going to go forward with seeking arrangement (open to other platforms if the seniors here recommend). Also what is baller money in a city? This is more economic than sugar dating question I suppose basically a rule of thumb to know the economic reality of the city (I think it's 2 X the rent of a city center room which makes baller money in Warsaw around 2000 Euros for example).

P.S. - Read around 5 pages of this forum and made interesting notes and learned a lot.[/QUOTE]Europe rates are screwed due to freedom of movement within schengen region and not really dependent on economic reality of the city. If you are attractive and not too old then you can keep rate below 400 Euro per meeting for pretty girls almost anywhere in Europe. Girls tend to charge more if they do not feel attraction.

At DwayneJohnson- thanks good to know the rates 400 Euros is a lot in EE but definitely low in WE so that's a double edged sword I guess unfortunately I stick to EE for long term stays. So I guess 1000 Euros get me sex twice a month with some miscellaneous expenses (best case scenario?

At Elvis 2008- thanks for a very detailed guidelines / principles, inspired by them I have mapped out a MO feel free to correct and modify me.

1. I match with a girl and start talking.

2. I do some screening and vetting- do you have some tips in this department? Are there any red flags or tips you can give to filter girls faster? Like at Steve9696 said most problems can be solved at this stage and you can find a vfm gem. I was actually on Seeking (first and only time) couple of months back but was only able to be active for a week due to some sudden workload, some profiles were huge red flags, a girl actually had written in her bio please understand the difference between sugar dating and prostitution I don't have sex for money. Well ***** what you here for then XD. I like submissive girls that's why plain old p4 p is boring compared to normal sex and hookups that's why I think seeking and sugar will help me fill that void.

3. After vetting first date in a coffee shop / drinks. She going to be angling for money I'm going to be angling for chemistry hopefully the girl isn't hardened or a pro so I can see beneath what she wants me to see.

4. bounce to your location she going to ask for money (new to sugaring but not new to mongering. Even with some prostitutes I pay around half and pay the remaining half later).

5. long term- I see the way you talk you have probably had relationships with some of these girls that go deeper than sex which is great, I want that for me too but I can also compartmentalize and cut her off, are there times when a SB really likes you that she says you know what screw the money I just want to spend time with you.

[QUOTE=Gsi2810;3011391]At DwayneJohnson- thanks good to know the rates 400 Euros is a lot in EE but definitely low in WE so that's a double edged sword I guess unfortunately I stick to EE for long term stays. So I guess 1000 Euros get me sex twice a month with some miscellaneous expenses (best case scenario?.[/QUOTE]Elvis generally has good advice. And I love and agree with his POV about value urself. You are a catch for these girls if you have charm and money. Don't underestimate how attractive that is. The main area we disagree is on the coffee date. I've had a couple success that way but more often fails. Rather, I strongly advocate taking it to the room night 1. You have attraction and flow and girls want to be lead. Just lead them to the bedroom and it's on!

I recently update my guide to Seeking game and enclose it below. Note that it was originally written for USA and you can be more direct outside USA. But I still find that finding the true GF vibe requires this approach. My ultimate goal is to have an SB per region and one at home. I haven't always achieved that but right now I've got Europe, Mexico, Brazil, and at home, with a a true GFE feel with each. So I can say w confidence this approach works at least for me. Hope it works for you.

So how do you do it properly? I suppose this could vary widely depending on what you are after. But I am after a girl who FEELS like a girlfriend. She's affectionate, appreciates an evening above her usual stature in life, and is able to actually enjoy herself with you. She views the allowance / gift (I. E. Money!) as a bonus. Not the only thing she is after. Any girl where I feel money is the primary motivation and she will go with anyone for a high enough price, gets kicked straight to the curb. She's got to be a girlfriend first, and any "benefits" come second.

Knowing that this is the kind of girl I want to attract (and other guys I have talked to also find this persona the most attractive), there is a set of rules you have to play by. Understand that SA is NOT AT ALL like picking up hookers. It is much more like meeting a girl in a bar and seducing her to leave with you. It's just an online bar. Sure you need money, but you also need some texting game and you need to treat her with respect. If you do, you have a chance of closing the deal. However, the moment you disrespect her, she will be gone.

The most important rule when vibing with a girl and getting a meeting set up is: never discuss sex or money. These things will be implied and they will be done offline. Never discuss sex or money on the Seeking Arrangements platform and really never discuss sex at all. As soon as you are that explicit, the kind of girl you are after will feel disrespected and ghost you in no time flat. Plus, it can get you booted from SA for life if you are reported. Don't worry, there are ways to have this conversation properly, explained below.

Start your engagement with a girl with some light chat and flirt. Your opener should be something specific to her that you read in her profile -- not something generic. And ALWAYS end every message with a question. This prompts her to respond. If you don't ask a question, she will not take the initiative and the conversation will just die. You have to drive it; and you drive with questions. Get her to tell you a few things about herself: what she likes to eat, her favorite wine, dog or cat person. It doesn't really matter what you discuss; just something that will get her to engage a bit.

At some point you will establish that you like each other reasonably well and one or the other will suggest taking the conversation off of SA and over to text. If tries to take you offline right away, she is probably a hooker. With the kind of girls I want, often I am the one to suggest going over to private phone text. You can keep it pretty innocuous, saying you notice she is not on often and it might be easier to connect up by text or WhatsApp. I usually do it after a day or two of chat but some guys pull the trigger sooner.

Once you are texting, pick up the thread you had going and continue a little friendly chat. At some point, you will suggest that you think you vibe well and should meet up. Most often she will agree and now it's time to establish that you will have sex (without saying it!) and how much is the agreed price (without saying it's a price! Some guys cover the price discussion in person, but I find that awkward and always set it ahead of time. I've done a few dates where we don't discuss it at all and I just pay her what I think fair; but this definitely runs a risk of disappointment, so I don't really do that anymore.

Once she's said "yeah, lets meetup" I say I want to describe our date to her (this is how I introduce the sex topic without getting explicit.) I usually say something about going out for dinner or drinks and having an epic time, laughing a lot and if the chemistry is right spending some private time (or intimate time or adult time -- insert your favorite euphemism -- but never say SEX!) or on the off chance we don't vibe, we can part after dinner no harm no foul. And ask if that sounds about right to them. Most often, if they are the kind of girl you are after, they will be down with this description and say, sure that sounds good.

This opens the door for the pricing discussion. I usually say something like "Of course I'd want to give you a gift / allowance. Did you have something in mind?" and the negotiation is underway. Never ever say "what's your price" or "how much do you charge for PPM". Always use the approach above, that you want to give them something. Sometimes, she will say she doesn't know and get you to give the first figure (good negotiating tactic on her part, but often they are in fact new). I am OK with this and say "well, what I've done before is 400. I hope that works for you. " (note no $ sign, and adjust for geography).

As far as what you should pay, I've found a strong correlation between what a pretty hooker charges for an hour (in a given city) to be what an SA girl will take for an evening. I'd say (pre-pandemic) most big US cities $400 was reasonable for a pretty girl, but it's definitely gone up since then. As of 2024, I'd say getting a US-based girl for $500 is par for the course, if you are good at this game, but with gems found for less than that. Many girls asking 800-1000, but I never pay more than $500 worldwide, with US and Europe being most likely to hit that number. But the gems are out there I have a repeat girl in Brazil who is $100/ meet (yep!) and gem in the US that is $300/ meet. But most are higher in both geographies.

Once you have said "we are going to have sex, right" -- without saying it -- and money discussion out of the way, you should be good to go. Just keep on with the flirty texts without being too frequent, clingy or annoying and then meet up at the appointed day and time. More often than not, if you are not terribly objectionable looking, have a little bit of charm, and follow the "let's get out of here" model you might use with a regular pickup, you will end up in the room with your girl and have a rocking time.

Having done this a lot (more than 50 times in many different cities), I've found that having sex on the first date is super important. The few times I've had a platonic date (especially a non-alcoholic one) to be followed by sex on the second date it never happens. You have to take the momentum on that first date and take it all the way to the bedroom. Remember girls are submissive and will largely follow your lead even if that lead is to the hotel room.

Finally, I should note that how much time you spend with her is largely up to her and how well you vibe. It's not something you negotiate, like you would with a hooker. I highly recommend you never discuss the amount of time because you want to treat her like a girlfriend, not a hooker. Most times it will probably be 3-4 hours including dinner and sex, after which she might say she needs to get home. But, in my experience, about 50% of girls sleep over. It's not something you discuss. It just happens. You cuddle after sex and next thing you know she's taking off her necklace to the bedside table. Bingo!

The other great thing about Seeking as you advance in the game is that some girls are true girlfriend material not in the long term "I want to marry you" sense, but in the sense that you would spend a good chunk of time with them. These are the girls that I fly to be with me when I am on business. This is advanced Seeking game, but I highly recommend it. If you vibe really well with a girl (I crush pretty hard! Then they are sooooo down to fly to some fun city. Spending a few days with a girl playing true BFGF is just great fun. More than just the sex cuddling, shopping, sightseeing it's a full experience and "falling a little in love" without any strings attached is just the best. And of course you don't have to limit this to one girl. I tend to have at least one real crush-girl per continent and sometimes more.

Recently guys have been asking me about when I fly a girl to be with me in some other city and what I pay them. I have found that once you establish chemistry and you would like each other 24/7 they are fully satisfied with the PPM price covering a full day. Like when you first met, it was $400 for the date and maybe it was 3-5 hours. So then when you fly them somewhere nice, you can give them $400/ day and they are cool with that.

Seeking is absolutely the best, if you take the time to find the gems amongst the bullshit and follow the above guide.

Ps never ever pay for a non-sex date. If after dinner she says she’s enjoyed her evening but wants to head home that’s her prerogative. But that’s zero dollars for her. Don’t ever violate this rule. She’s choosing to make zero. Tough choice!

And never ever pay her ahead of time. The right Seeking girl won’t even want to discuss money or explicitly receive it. I usually put it in an envelope in plain site but under the ice bucket or something. Some girls know this is the drill and some totally won’t even ask for money at end and u have to give them their gift or slip it in their purse. The best girls don’t wanna feel like a pro and it’s ur job to never make them feel that way.

[QUOTE=Gsi2810;3011391] I like submissive girls that's why plain old p4 p is boring compared to normal sex and hookups that's why I think seeking and sugar will help me fill that void.[/QUOTE]

In comparison to p4 p, an important factor is her age and what Seeking calls "ethnicity. " Steve says he goes for mixed / black girls and what he called "jungle Asians. " This is easier in the West. But to some guys, it makes no sense to for example travel to Warsaw to find a Thai sugar baby when you can travel to Pattaya instead.

Elvis is in Colombia and Mexico. It's easier there too.

But if you want an attractive and young blonde / blue local Euro girl, Seeking gets much harder. Meanwhile, you can fairly easily find an escort with those looks for 500.

Some guys can also hook up with average looking girls on vanilla apps so they come to Seeking looking to date a 10 long-term for 400 euros. This will be difficult.

[QUOTE=NoBuglyFitches;3011520]In comparison to p4 p, an important factor is her age and what Seeking calls "ethnicity. Steve says he goes for mixed / black girls and what he called "jungle Asians. This is easier in the West. Elvis is in Colombia and Mexico. It's easier there too. But if you want an attractive and young blonde / blue local Euro girl, Seeking gets much harder.[/QUOTE]That which I seek (Steve calls them "pasty") is much, much harder to find on Seeking, especially in the States. The first three months I used the site, I scored a grand slam, walk off home run! But after that mostly frustration and a waste of time and money.

[QUOTE=Gsi2810;3011391]

1. I match with a girl and start talking.[/QUOTE]I usually look through the women I am attracted to and send a generic message casting a wide net with a generic question like how is it going on the site or have any luck? And then for the women I was really attracted to, I would add more personalized notes and / or remarks.

Thing is I have looked at a hot woman's responses on seeking. She got hundreds and mostly were from losers trying to bang for her free. I could not believe how crude some of the responses were. She knew they were bullshit, but a more naive girl might let that number go to her head.

I kept the talk on the site brief and do all I could to move over to text if in the USA or Whatsapp everywhere else. That is where I would get talking about more of what are you looking for ETC. The women were pretty direct and it was kind of comical. Well, how much am I going to get? When you have a woman mostly focused on money, and that is it, I might go for a fling but the woman is a hooker. That is most of them and in the USA, it is discouraging, but I think you will have more luck in Poland or Hungary.

You are not really a person even when chatting to them on line. You are like some telemarketer fleebag voice in their ear, and many women will be very, very obnoxious. Do not let it get you down! They have been dealing with SO MANY loses! But hopefully, it goes well and then you finally go to a meet.

The reason I usually did not have sex on the first date in the USA was the comfort level of the women. That does not apply to you. The USA is the sex prison with its insane prostitution and trafficking laws, and Europe is much freer. As for dinner versus coffee, I do not know. Maybe that is me. For whatever reason, I put women at ease, and I do not need much time to close the deal if I am really interested in the woman. I have sorted into the hooker, SB, or not interested in category.

Even women on seeking are not great risk takers. They are meeting a stranger who could rape, beat them ETC. The number one thing to do when starting is to soothe their fears. Advertise in your profile why you are not like that. I am a professional ETC. The second fear they have is if their time is being wasted by the loser trying to bang her for free. That is why you dress well and show them you are a man of means. I stayed at a cheap hotel and a nicer one and the cheap one made the woman very uncomfortable and there were a lot more of the "how much" questions I had. Nobody asked that when I was at a nicer place and met them when dressed well.

[QUOTE=Gsi2810;3011391]Are there any red flags or tips you can give to filter girls faster?[/QUOTE]For what part? For getting a SB, that is just assessing if they are in it for money. As Steve says, they should have faith in you that you are going to take care of them. Even if you have never had a SB, act like you have. The smart SB is looking for the long term. In general, you will probably have better luck looking at the woman who are new to the site and has not had a SD. When you have a SB who has had a daddy, most of the time her greed and lack of effort probably turned him off. The women will give you this song and dance about how great it was, but usually the guy ends it for those reasons. That type of girl should be kept on a strict P4 P basis kind of a sugar escort, an acquiantance you bang as opposed to a GF like SB or completely impersonal hooker.

As for longer tem, look if she has successful longer term relationships with her friends, her work, her school ETC. The other huge thing is the relationship with their father. A lot of this disgust with I hate men is because they have a bad relationshp with their father. IMO a lot of this is because mom talks shit about dad, but if she does not like her dad, she probably is just looking for a reason to be disappointed. Ideally, she has had a great group of friends she has had for years and loves her father intensely.

I asked myself why the hell I spent so much time and money on women and what I wanted. Like Steve said, it was simple. I want to make a woman make me feel good. And there was a point that the pleasure of seeing a hooker after sex practically running out of the room when we were done was bugging me. It was okay in the begininning and I get that the women are ashamed of what they have done, but after a while, the pleasure of sex was often wiped out by that feeling. Or what was even worse was paying for lousy sex with a woman I did not even like.

[QUOTE=Gsi2810;3011391]
3. After vetting first date in a coffee shop / drinks. She going to be angling for money I'm going to be angling for chemistry hopefully the girl isn't hardened or a pro so I can see beneath what she wants me to see.[/QUOTE]Well, usually she is motivated by money to meet you for sure but not always. The woman I am with was on the site because it worked out great for a friend of hers who is engaged to a guy she met on the site. Still, your job is to be so fun, so wise, and such good company that money should be a secondary issue. It has been said that the women on seeking who are less interested in money get the most, and in my experience, it is true. As for why, it comes back to the wage or helping a friend. If it is a wage, I am going to negotiate. With a friend, I am going to help them out. Yes, most of the women are going to be focused on money and only that. You want to focus on the minority of women who think, "Hey, this Gsi guy is pretty cool, I want to hang with him. " That is the hard part with seeking, weeding out all the hookers and women with unrealistic expectations.

I do not want this to sound like bragging, but my current woman has a daughter, and I have been taking a friend or two of hers along when we go on our trips. I am just doing that because I know that when I was a kid I wish I had a friend versus just hanging with the parents. So many of these Colombian girls have never been out of the country, but my reason was for the daughter to have fun and yes, I think it is more fun when she has her friends along too. But that is all I thought it was. My God was I wrong. The parents, the friends, even the teachers in her school know about me. They see how I deal with things, make decisions, have fun with my woman (some of these girls have never seen a couple not fight), and enjoy having a good time. I swear some have never seen a happy adult as well. My gal has said I have been this huge influence and I was like, with what? But then I thought about the circumstances of these women, and I got it.

Even less than with my SB when I want sex, these women know the only agenda I had with them was fun. I want nothing from them outside of their having a good time and care that they feel good. As such, if anyone of them said, hey, I am thinking being an English major, and I was serious and said, "No, do not that. ", and expalined why, they probably would not do it. Thing is these are smart girls at the top of the Colombian education system. If they were to come to the USA half would be in the top 0. 1% of all women here when they turn 18. That speaks volumes about how shitty the pool of American women is though, doesn't it?

What I am going to tell you is hard advice to take because you have to feel it more than know it but I feel / know that any woman who is just interested in me for my money then is pretty fucking stupid. Instead of worrying about what the woman feels like and getting laid, look at who she is. If you are a quality guy and all she wants is money, what does that say about her?

At NBF- thanks for the reality check. How about dating an 8 for 400 Euros, or sometimes even a young college 6 girl for a 100 euros how deep is the market because I get in the mood to taste different foods and sometimes I feel cheap LOL (I know tinder boost is cheaper but a date can still leave you with blue balls and I often wish you know what 100 Euros was better than this even if the quality is 6/7).

At Steve- impressive man I'm creating a document where I'm collecting all of this data to apply. I think a lot boils down to your vetting, I'm sure you have developed some internal systems that you use to separate wheat from the chaff effectively and speedily and I totally understand you wouldn't want to share that deep knowledge with a random guy on the forum who started posting a couple of days ago but if you're feeling generous about your vetting tactics to find the right girl a girl who will follow your lead, isn't a ball buster, who won't get bratty? BTW everyone? How do you deal with girls who get bratty with you on dates or during sex?

Hi Gents -.

I went to Rio de Janeiro and Salvador earlier this year and had great success with getting chicas via MeuPatrocinio to show me around and stay with me for 4-5 days for around $500-700 reis (About $100-125 USD) a day.

I'd like to try the same thing in Bogota / Buenos Aires / Quito, but I'm unaware of what is considered a solid offer price for those locations. Can anyone give me a known range of acceptable prices for these places? Obviously it'll be via Seeking since its spanish speaking countries and not Brazil.

Thanks again.

[QUOTE=FuriousFire73;3011587]Hi Gents -.

I went to Rio de Janeiro and Salvador earlier this year and had great success with getting chicas via MeuPatrocinio to show me around and stay with me for 4-5 days for around $500-700 reis (About $100-125 USD) a day.

I'd like to try the same thing in Bogota / Buenos Aires / Quito, but I'm unaware of what is considered a solid offer price for those locations. Can anyone give me a known range of acceptable prices for these places? Obviously it'll be via Seeking since its spanish speaking countries and not Brazil.

Thanks again.[/QUOTE]Other guys may have more recent advice. My experience in BA is a couple years old. I found it to be def in the expensive side but worth it. My dates were like $200-300 USD. But real stunners and lots of fun. Good luck!

Haven't been on ISG in a while. I'm heading to LOS Angeles soon. SA any good there?

[QUOTE=Gsi2810;3011585] BTW everyone? How do you deal with girls who get bratty with you on dates or during sex?[/QUOTE]I firmly and politely put them in their place. I had a girl in Vietnam, hot as shit, not a SB but like to be taken to nice places. One night I was late meeting her because I had a shitty taxi driver who tried to rip me off etc. When I finally met her and we headed out she had an attitude. I told her look, I didn't come all the way here (from the US at that time) to deal with a girl in a bad mood. So she had a choice. Be nice and happy and we would have a fun night or I would leave now and go meet my other friends. Her choice. She quickly changed her tune and went out of her way to please me from that point on. This approach in general works for me with women everywhere, but especially in Asia. Another time I met a girl in China, also very hot, not a SB, who after a nice dinner came up to my room. She was acting coy and asked me "how badly do you want to have sex with me?" I said, actually I am tired so I can take it or leave it. Up to you. She turned in the most compliant submissive girl I have ever met in my life. Now these were girls I was not paying so if I was paying I would have even less patience with bratty attitude or drama.

Hey friends, I just saw this thread. I guess I should have written and asked for advise & guidance earlier. I am usually not into online stuff but found seeking extremely helpful in my last 2 trips. I do understand seeking returns may vary from city to city monger to monger. My queries below, please feel free to reply and argue, absolutely no sweat.

1. How does one identify and stay away from scammer profiles. I sometimes see same similar photos with 2 or more profiles.

2. What are the red flags in a profile.

3. I used seeking 3-4 months back, got matched with a great looking girl and also did VC with her a few times. She used filters so smartly that I couldn't make out. When we met she turned out to be a MILF with 2 kids, also a little more on the age and body. But that did not stop me from fucking her, I banged the hell out of her but the whole experience got jammed as I was travelling just for her from a nearby city. How does one eradicate this going forward.

4. How does a monger make his profile more attractive.

5. What kind of female profiles should one be careful of.

6. How do you limit the meeting to FWB and not bring money into the equation, I am sure not all girls on seeking are looking for financial benefits.

7. I don't do dinner dates as my trips are usually time bound so I like to shoot or perhaps go straight to the point.

8. How do you not overpay or know what is the right thing and max the favours.

I am sure this could be helpful to all of us here.

[QUOTE=Midwestern;3011646]Haven't been on ISG in a while. I'm heading to LOS Angeles soon. SA any good there?[/QUOTE]Ah our founding father! Midwestern. So good to see you. LA is a tough slog due to price. Lots of GPS. Last I looked I was able to find a great GND black girl studying film there for $500. But finding 500 in LA is tough. And I refuse to pay more. I think since your taste runs to Asians (black? Latina?) maybe you can find a gem. But its def going to be work. Very inflated egos and prices there.

[QUOTE=FuriousFire73;3011587] Bogota / Buenos Aires / Quito, Can anyone give me a known range of acceptable prices for these places? [/QUOTE] 200-300 usd in BAires for me too. Average gnd looks.

[QUOTE=Gsi2810;3011585] How about dating an 8 for 400 Euros, or sometimes even a young college 6 girl for a 100 euros how deep is the market because I get in the mood to taste different foods and sometimes I feel cheap LOL (I know tinder boost is cheaper [/QUOTE]Imo, if you can score on vanilla apps like tinder and you've got time because you're local, and your budget is $1 k a month, I wouldn't bother with seeking and sugar at all. I'd devote all my time to vanilla game, with escorts for backup.

Can't get a college 6 for 100 because to someone else she's an 8 and because some rich old tourist would usually outbid you with 500 plus dinner.

If you played seeking for like a year, then after all this time and membership money, you have a good chance to land an 8 for 400, but it won't repeat because again someone will quickly offer her more and / or sex is meh, so you don't even want to repeat.

A disproportionate number of the hot profiles on Seeking are fake. Obviously scammers, online-only, platonics, private club parties etc all use 18-22 blonde college girl photos to lure guys.

At Expat- polite and firm. Good going!

At NFB- I do score from tinder, but it's like once in a month or so my appetite is surely much larger also I get a bunch of dates that end up going no where so it's extra frustrating mostly 6's sometimes 7's. I don't mind spending some money to be an add on to vanilla dating but not it's replacement. Escorts don't really give their feminine side to you I'm just a client to them, it's very clinical not that I don't indulge in them from time to time.

P.S. - not a local, wish I was life would have been smoother.

Just returned from a week in LA. I had thought of going the escort route, but one is looking at $600-1000 if you don't want a drug addled crack working girl. As such, I elected to go the SA route, knowing it wasn't going to be cheaper, but I'd get an evening out of it instead of an hour. Saw 3 ladies.

1) SA #1 is an Iranian actress. Probably about 40 and has seen better days, but still looks ok. Wanted $800 for the evening. She didn't care about dinner, drinks etc, she just wanted to fuck. She warned me she was "naughty". That was an understatement. Probably the nastiest, most depraved woman I've ever been with. If I had let her, she would have taken a dump on my chest. I'm not vanilla by any stretch, but FFS, I have some limits. I don't regret seeing her, but I wouldn't go there again. In any event, this one was a win, albeit never again.

2) A Canadian student attending UCLA, 30 yrs old. A bigger girl than her photos would indicate. And TALL. She just moved to LA and I don't think she appreciates the going rate. She wanted $400. Took her for a casual dinner and then back to my room. I have to give the girl credit, she's an artist with a cock in her mouth. Unfortunately she is a horrible lay. One of those that try to stop you achieving any depth. Nice enough girl, but really a waste of time. This one was a loss.

3) 47 yr old brunette, exceedingly well preserved and good looking. She wanted $700 (plus uber) and would appreciate dinner. Or drinks. As I had already had my fill of "fine dining" that week with business, I told her just something casual. She was fine with that. We had a great chat over dinner. She's divorced and I suspect really does want male company and making $$ on the side helps as well. She ended up staying the night. Great sex, not wild, but very girlfriend like. Definite win and would repeat.

Stirling.

You won't always know which profiles are scammers. Positive signs are profiles that have been registered for more than a year, those with multiple verification badges, and those with descriptions which logically share specific things about them, as well as what they are and are not looking for.

The profiles I tend to skip over are those that list she is looking for a very narrow age range. Let's say the profile says she is looking for men aged 30 to 45. That to me is a signal that what she's really looking for is a hunk. Not only a guy who is rich, but also one who is the proverbial tall, dark, and handsome. Translation: trim, heavily muscular, and whatever other attributes these women are looking for. So if you have a mole or birthmark on your face, that might disqualify you even if you are in their age bracket. If you can pick up girls with looks alone, then you don't need to bring money to the table.

You really have to pay attention to communication to find out who is either a scammer, or less than ideal. Look for things like impatience and flakiness.

What I always do is make sure to tell her prior to meeting that I've had bad experiences in the past. I will say something like "I've had girls show up who were not the same girl as in the picture, or using photos that were 5 years out of date, so I had to cancel the date without any financial compensation. I'm glad to know I'll be meeting someone who is actually using accurate pictures. " If they think they won't get paid due to using misleading photos, they might just cancel the appointment, as they are investing their time, and expect something in return.

To make your profile stand out more, get as many verification badges as possible, and upload as many pictures as you are comfortable with, even if most of them are private. Fill out the descriptions and use the tags.

[QUOTE=SuperLove;3011658]Hey friends, I just saw this thread. I guess I should have written and asked for advise & guidance earlier. I am usually not into online stuff but found seeking extremely helpful in my last 2 trips. I do understand seeking returns may vary from city to city monger to monger. My queries below, please feel free to reply and argue, absolutely no sweat.

1. How does one identify and stay away from scammer profiles. I sometimes see same similar photos with 2 or more profiles.

2. What are the red flags in a profile.

3. I used seeking 3-4 months back, got matched with a great looking girl and also did VC with her a few times. She used filters so smartly that I couldn't make out. When we met she turned out to be a MILF with 2 kids, also a little more on the age and body. But that did not stop me from fucking her, I banged the hell out of her but the whole experience got jammed as I was travelling just for her from a nearby city. How does one eradicate this going forward.

4. How does a monger make his profile more attractive.

5. What kind of female profiles should one be careful of.

6. How do you limit the meeting to FWB and not bring money into the equation, I am sure not all girls on seeking are looking for financial benefits.

7. I don't do dinner dates as my trips are usually time bound so I like to shoot or perhaps go straight to the point.

8. How do you not overpay or know what is the right thing and max the favours.

I am sure this could be helpful to all of us here.[/QUOTE]