Kyiv

[QUOTE=LilJoey;1308125]Are none of you fellows visiting Kiev of late going to the nightclubs at all? There hasn't been mention of any exploits. What's the WG scene like now? What are the prices being asked? Which nightclubs have the better and more easy to work scene now? Even if you didn't score when you went, a description of what you saw would be helpful. According to the veterans like Cruiser D, the nightclubs are the best place to pick up the best looking and lower costing girls. Is nobody going? Just wondering why no reports. I will be in Kiev soon again, and look forward to following up on this myself, but why is nobody else doing do? It seems odd.[/QUOTE]I don't think summer is a good time to hit hot and sweaty clubs in Kiev or in EE capital cities. Hot girls are away by the seaside.

How about you and Pedro Toronga hitting the clubs together?

2 is company and with 2 hot club girls in tow, a great foursome.

What do you think?

Go to the beaches and talk to the half naked beauties lying around.

They are mostly all open for a cool ice-cream and a hot conversation!

Dante Park is good for summer. Clubs in the city are slow in summer!

[QUOTE=LilJoey;1308125]Are none of you fellows visiting Kiev of late going to the nightclubs at all? There hasn't been mention of any exploits. What's the WG scene like now? What are the prices being asked? Which nightclubs have the better and more easy to work scene now? Even if you didn't score when you went, a description of what you saw would be helpful. According to the veterans like Cruiser D, the nightclubs are the best place to pick up the best looking and lower costing girls. Is nobody going? Just wondering why no reports. I will be in Kiev soon again, and look forward to following up on this myself, but why is nobody else doing do? It seems odd.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=PedroToronja;1308266]Meet the 18 years old again, for one hour. 4th time.[/QUOTE]By now it is a mission. A quest. Keep it up, mate! Love your posts.

B.

(PI or UA? PI or UA? I can't decide and I can't do both now.)

[QUOTE=LilJoey;1308125]Are none of you fellows visiting Kiev of late going to the nightclubs at all? There hasn't been mention of any exploits. What's the WG scene like now? What are the prices being asked? Which nightclubs have the better and more easy to work scene now? Even if you didn't score when you went, a description of what you saw would be helpful. According to the veterans like Cruiser D, the nightclubs are the best place to pick up the best looking and lower costing girls. Is nobody going? Just wondering why no reports. I will be in Kiev soon again, and look forward to following up on this myself, but why is nobody else doing do? It seems odd.[/QUOTE]I spent a week in Kiev in July right after Euro. Tourists seem to be less this time (thank God) and my experience more fulfilling.

I stopped by 2 other clubs besides Rio. Club Divas and Mandarin. All three have same owners. Mandarin is in Podol on the river on a old boat but very nice inside. Entrance is 150gr, taxi back is quite expensive 200gr if you take the club taxi. Cheaper to call your own taxi. Lots of girls about 35 and nice cabarets too inside. Club Divas on left bank is the cheapest. 80 grivnas entrance fee, girls number about 12 on the night I went. Some good ones. 8 at least I would say. So Club Divas is cheapest, followed by Rio and Mandarin the most expensive but also has good shows, live music and cabarets.

I also called up top-modals and went to 2 different girls to their apartments. Their charge 400grivnas per hour. Photos matched the girls, good environment and great sex. Look wise 6-7 I would give them.

I also got my old contacts. Girls I met before (2 girls for 2000grivnas total) for the night. They also cooked dinner for me (pleasant surprise)

I also went to massage salon Roksolona. Quite good. 2 girls 90 minutes for 800gr. 1 classic and 2 erotic massages.

Hope this helps

[QUOTE=Jojosun; 1308427]I don't think summer is a good time to hit hot and sweaty clubs in Kiev or in EE capital cities. Hot girls are away by the seaside.

How about you and Pedro Toronga hitting the clubs together?

2 is company and with 2 hot club girls in tow, a great foursome.

What do you think?[/QUOTE]Happy to hit the clubs with a wingman. My Kiev visit is likely going to happen in the beginning of September though.

LJ

[QUOTE=Wallyally; 1308438]Go to the beaches and talk to the half naked beauties lying around.

They are mostly all open for a cool ice-cream and a hot conversation!

Dante Park is good for summer. Clubs in the city are slow in summer![/QUOTE]Good point. So if clubs are slow in the summer for regular folks, where do all the WG's and semi pros go fishing at night? Are you saying they aren't working during summer? The beach and park sound delightful as summer daytime activities. But where is the action at night?

LJ

[QUOTE=Miscgk10; 1308634]I spent a week in Kiev in July right after Euro. Tourists seem to be less this time (thank God) and my experience more fulfilling.

I stopped by 2 other clubs besides Rio. Club Divas and Mandarin. All three have same owners. Mandarin is in Podol on the river on a old boat but very nice inside. Entrance is 150gr, taxi back is quite expensive 200gr if you take the club taxi. Cheaper to call your own taxi. Lots of girls about 35 and nice cabarets too inside. Club Divas on left bank is the cheapest. 80 grivnas entrance fee, girls number about 12 on the night I went. Some good ones. 8 at least I would say. So Club Divas is cheapest, followed by Rio and Mandarin the most expensive but also has good shows, live music and cabarets.

I also called up top-modals and went to 2 different girls to their apartments. Their charge 400grivnas per hour. Photos matched the girls, good environment and great sex. Look wise 6-7 I would give them.

I also got my old contacts. Girls I met before (2 girls for 2000grivnas total) for the night. They also cooked dinner for me (pleasant surprise)

I also went to massage salon Roksolona. Quite good. 2 girls 90 minutes for 800gr. 1 classic and 2 erotic massages.

Hope this helps[/QUOTE]Thanks for your reply and input, Miscgk10. I was actually asking about the regular nightclubs and the type of action available in them. The girls in regular nightclubs (WG's or semi pro girls) operate as independents and therefore whatever prices are involved are negotiated with each girl independently, so lower prices can be possible. I was hoping to see reports about what's going on in the regular nightclubs like Carribean, Vodka, Arena, Avalon or D'Lux etc.

However, the clubs you mentioned (Mandarin and Rio) are, strictly speaking, not regular nightclubs, but rather strip clubs, where everything, including the take out prices for the girls, is regulated by the club, and therefore the prices remain at a relatively high rate of 2400 UAH ($300 USD) minimum for three hours. In relation to the whopping take out fee, the entrance fee is really a nominal consideration. I used to like the cabaret shows at the old Mandarin club. Good to hear they reopened with the same type of offerrings. Thanks for also bringing to my attention Club Divas with which I was not familiar, unless it is another name for Club Paradise (a sister club of Rio). Did you sample any of the girls as "take out"?

[QUOTE=Tomux 22; 1307628]Some few women dose not do oral for several reasons. Maybe she was after passion and emotion. Did-int wanted to feel used. Etc.

If you want a sex toy who dose fulfill your every desire in bed, well then I guess you made a good fold. I don't think there will be a problem for you to finding new toy in Kiev. Whom will give what you desire and want.

May the flopp be with you and sometimes check raising all inn is better.[/QUOTE]I dunno, a true poke-her player would find another girl BEFORE jettisoning this near perfect girl. Sounds like you are spoiled, and for this, I am jealous LOL.

[quote=liljoey; 1295119]dear stevie69,

i actually agree with you about not wanting to pay for sleeping with the girl. i was only trying to point out just the sheer raw economic advantage possible in getting many more hours with a top flight girl in the context of a "package deal" price of usually little more than double the initial hour price, for many, many hours.

of course, to the extent those hours are spent sleeping, it's more or less pissing the money away. personally, i am not an easy sleeper, and just as you said, the presence of a very hot girl in my bed all night, did not help at all, and my sleep was very disturbed the few times i did this.

for me, in a package deal for multiple hours booking, i look at the time i will have that can be enjoyed while awake with a beautiful girl, who has a nice personality and with whom i have fun talking with and sharing time with. at night or during the day this can include going out to nightclub dancing, or eating together, or cuddling in bed together and talking, or necking, kissing and petting like teenagers, or sitting in a jacuzzi together playing with each other's bodies, or massaging her and being massaged by the girl, or going to musical or cultural events, or seeing sights, or to cafes and bars to drink, or to the beach, or bowling, or a thousand other ways a man can enjoy time with a beautiful young girl whom he likes and enjoys her company, your own imagination and the horizon of your interests is the limit. so if for such companionship time the price is very low, it becomes something to consider. also, as time passes with a girl, it is not unusual to get aroused again after some hours pass and since she is with you, sex can happen again.

of course i recognize that there is a big difference in hooking up with a girl who charges only $100 for the first hour, versus a high priced girl one might pick up in a nightclub like d'lux or a strip club, who might charge $200 or $300 for the first couple of hours with her as her initial rate.

i always say that each monger should spend according to how he likes to spend. if $100 suits a monger as a reasonable hourly price, then he should focus on girls from mamba or other websites who ask those lower fees or try to find girls in nightclubs who will agree to those lower fees, and be satisfied with their level of good looks. most mongers who report their experiences with those types of girls claim that they were able to get girls who were in their eyes very beautiful. so why spend more?

but if there are mongers who honestly feel they are not finding girls who are really that beautiful at the lower prices of $75 or $100 / hour, and they wish to get to much more beautiful p4p girls they see all around in the nightclubs and strip clubs, who are asking higher prices of $200 or $300 for several hours, and they have money and are willing to pay those prices to get the more beautiful girls they want, what sense does it make to criticize their desires for bedding the hot but expensive wg's just because you might be satisfied with less? there really is no right and wrong in this, and each monger should spend as he desires. as long as everyone knows what options are available and on the table, everyone should be free to choose as they like, no?

so if i tell you that i feel i have gotten girls for the higher prices of $300 who in my eyes were far more beautiful than the girls i could have gotten for $100, and i am satisfied that i got good value for the extra money paid because of the higher level of beauty i experienced according to the way my eyes saw the beauty, then why can't some mongers live with the idea of to each his own? we all know beauty is subjective, and is in the eyes of the beholder, so even if for example they actually saw my $300 girl, and didn't think she was so much hotter than their $100 girl, the most they could say to themselves would be,"hmmmm, not for me. i would rather take the girl for $100". but what they can't say is that i should prefer their $100 girl, because my feeling was that she was much less hot than the beauty who i took for $300, because that was my opinion about how the two girls compared in the looks department. it's really a silly argument. it's like two guys getting incensed at each other while arguing over which color is better, blue or red? one guy insists that blue is more beautiful, while the other guy says he enjoys red more. ridiculous argument. or maybe we can argue over blondes or brunettes? tall girls or petite girls? it's all a matter of taste.

when you read the debate between prosal and cruiser d about what kind of clothing and accessories are best to wear to kiev nightclubs to be successful with freebie chasing of the hottest models, did you not say once to yourself, well i would not spend so much money on clothing or accessories or mink coats like these guys, it's too much. but for some guys, spending and spending on high fashion clothing is a must. to each his own, or don't you really think so.

the honest monger report will state that in kiev it's best to try to meet a reasonable amount of girls from websites like mamba for $100 or less per hour and try to find the type of girl you want at these lower pricesis available in kiev. and to also go take a look at the type of girls available for p4p in the various nightclubs, as the former river palace scene has spread out to the various nightclubs, and check out the talent at the strip clubs too, but be aware of the higher prices there versus the lower prices on mamba, and only spend more than the low prices if you personally have compared the beauty levels of both types and feel it is worth it to spend more. the job of a reporting monger is to make readers aware of all the options, as well as the pros and cons, the advantages and pitfalls inherent in each option, so that an informed choice can be made by each monger according to his tastes and his pocketbook. there are too many guys on this forum who have totalitarian mindsets and feel they must intimidate by insult and smear anyone who may differ with their own opinion and viewpoint. it's unfortunate that democratic thinking is not so prevalent. such people perhaps have issues with controlling behavior in the rest of their personal lives and are acting out here on this forum. but it's not rational discourse, and is very tiresome.

i would also like to address what you wrote about the fkk's. i always go to an fkk with the intention of saving money "this time" and only having half hour sessions. but i always find that when i like a girl i end up spending an hour with her and sometimes 1. 5 hours. none of that time is spent "cleaning up". one of the great advantages of an fkk is that all of the time in the room is available for sexual activities.

how does an hour and a half go by of sexual activities when the guy is in his 50's, and no pornstar? it's really not such a difficult thing to carry out.

the sexual activities spread over a 1. 5 hour session include kissing the girl all over and giving her oral sex (daty). if a girl is very beautiful, i enjoy very much licking and kissing her pussy, and i get very aroused from doing it, especially if she begins to become aroused from the good feelings of pleasure spilling through her body because of the flicks of my tongue across and around her clitoris, and her moans and the shudders i can see in her body as she gets near to an orgasm, are very erotic and greatly turn me on, and needless to say when she reaches a climax and her body convulses in a shattering orgasm, i am immensely pleasured and entertained. but sometimes a girl's mind is not tuned in and then she doesn't get so aroused and so i discontinue my efforts. i can usually spot the fakers and don't continue on with them very long. so with a girl who is into enjoying oral sex, this can go on for some time, maybe 10 to 15 minutes or longer, depending on the girl. maybe after a while, we'll switch roles and she will begin giving me oral sex (bbbj) and i try to make this last as long as i can. usually, unless the girl gets me in just the right way with the right speed, i can outlast any of them and will not be in danger of cumming before the girl says her mouth hurts and she wants to do something else. this too can go on for a nice little whiile, maybe 15 minutes even, depending on the girl. at this point we are usually over the half hour mark and into the next half hour. at some point she wants to stop blowing me, and i usually get her up on top of me cowgirl style so i can allow her to seat herself comfortably on my dick and ride me for a while which is a great turn on as i get to see the sexiness of her body and shape as she fucks me, and i can see the expressions on her face, and any smiles and her signs of arousal that inspire me. maybe then i turn her around for some reverse cowgirl, and a particular version of it which one girl taught me (where the girl is actually on all fours doggie position between your legs facing toward your feet as you lie on your back with your knees up, and she hooks her legs under your legs and backs up until she's able to sit on your dick. this position is of course very easy for you since you are lying on your back, and it is easy for the girl since she is on all fours rocking forward and back, up and down on your dick, giving you an awesome view of your penetration into her nubile pussy, and since she is not doing calisthenics she will not get tired and can continue this for quite some time. i find it easy to control myself in this position and can prevent myself from getting too aroused and cumming. then after a while, one can switch over to the man being on top missionary for a while until tired of it, flip her around for doggie while you are standing, which is another less stress position than a man can continue for quite a while, and etc. etc. before you know it an hour or even an hour and a half has passed, and you have controlled yourself and the positions and the rhythm and speed of the fucking so that you have not fun yet and with your eye on the clock, you increase the pace and fuck her brains out until you cum just about almost on the mark of your session period.

it's so much more satisfying when you are able to enjoy licking and kissing and fucking a young girl's beautiful body for a long and quite memorable time. to go into a session and just fuck like the blazes until you cum inside 15 minutes of the session, is wasting the opportunity of that sperm load, which you could have used in a more long and drawn out sex session. is the point to get off in as quick a time as possible to spend as little as possible? not for me. having traveled quite a distance to put myself into an fkk club, and into a sex session room with a beautiful young girl, my purpose is to enjoy as many minutes of sexual involvement as i can with each girl. and to recharge in between, and do such sessions with as many girls as i can manage each night at the fkk.

but the dynamics inside of an fkk are different than in kiev. my experience has been that because there are sexy naked women all over you all the time in an fkk, that you get aroused to do more sex there. in kiev, i always end up doing much less because after each girl leaves, i will have to go and get another girl. she is not already standing in front of me naked and playing with my dick until i agree to have sex with her like at an fkk. so in between the time i finish with the first girl in kiev and contemplate the next girl, something else usually comes to mind instead, like sleeping or eating or whatever.

in kiev, i would be happy to be with one very beautiful girl every night of my visit and have her for 1. 5 to 2 hours of sexual activity, and then have another hot girl during the daytime for similar. i would like to sleep alone. but i would also like the pretty girl i had sex with to hang around with me when i'm not sleeping, so i can cuddle with her, bathe with her, lick her pussy more, make out with her, maybe fuck her again if i get turned on from the foregoing, go do outdoors stuff with her or whatever, if it can be arranged at a low and reasonable price for companionship time. and the point was that it is possible with a package deal price for long term companionship multiple hours dates.

lj[/quote]sorry to quote the whole thing, but this is a brilliant post. this is my philosophy of mongering almost exactly!

Ok I've done my homework and I've scrolled through the archives like anyone should.

But I still can't find Ukrainian women on Mamba. I want to find women in Kiev, Odessa and Crimea but all I can search for is women in my home country, USA. Help please!

[QUOTE=LilJoey; 1308819]Happy to hit the clubs with a wingman. My Kiev visit is likely going to happen in the beginning of September though.

LJ[/QUOTE]Infiltrate the circle of girls in the clubs by finding yourself a really attractive Bi Wingwoman.

The best way to approach a girl, is through her Social friends.

I had no difficulties taking a girl to my room at Ibis hotel. However, since there are always two or three security guys standing around the lobby and main entrance area, I went downstairs to meet the girls outside the hotel and go up to my room together with them. Afterwards, they left alone and encountered no problems downstairs.

I just got back home after a two week holiday in Kiev. Before arriving in Kiev, I had decided to do some homework and had compiled a list of about 25 telephone numbers mainly from an internet dating site as well as from VK. Com. I went through three dates and as others have mentioned in the forum, my dates were mainly interested in spending as much of my money as possible in fancy restaurants and demand taxi money on top of that. I gave up on dates with anyone who asked me for taxi money. I also met a normal girl who became my girlfriend for a weekend which was also interesting.

I visited RIO a few times and took out my favroite girl twice. I must confirm that the quality of RIO girls has generally gone down as compared to a few years ago. Frankly, I think the general quality of girls in clubs has also gone down but the prices have gone up. I have witnessed this scenario before in other cities in EE including Tallinn and prague in the years past. As the local economy changes and more options become available to the girls, the general quality of available talent to the foreign monger lowers. Expats who live in Ukraine or are otherwise well established in Ukraine or those who speak the local language, may disagree but to me Kiev is becoming less accessible than before for the weekend warrrior monger who speaks no Russian\Ukrainian- regardless of budget. What is worse is that the quality is generally going down.

Per advise of some board memebers, I tried the internet route and called\sent text to about 35 numbers from various websites for an escort. About 5 answered and 4 put the phone down as soon as I said hello in English. I eventually got a return text from one girl who wanted to know how much. I demanded her real photos which she emailed to me. Ofcourse her pictures were completely different to what I expected and I refused meeting her. My verdict: waste of time for me. I am not looking to save money when I visit Kiev and I do not have a real budget that I need to stick to. My time is valuable to me and I do not like it much when girls put the phone down on me.

I met a club girl in Avalon who was fun and introduced me to her friend too who was also fun. I also met some regualr girls in clubs I invited to my table who were a lot of fun to hang out with until 7 in the morning on some days but no action was expected and none received.

I also have a 24 year old from outside Kiev on the internet who I did not meet and does not speak English but wants to meet me in the Crimea for a holiday on my next visit in September. I have asked for details of her proposal but I am not sure how to handle her. Any advise is welcome on this one.

In general, Kiev is still fun and there are many pretty girls around. Somebody reported that Kiev is full of tourists. I am not sure about that. I was at the Caribbean club on a Monday night at 1am and I was the only patron in the club. I find the Ukranian girls emotional and warm in general but I also think they are some of the coldest women you would wish to meet. These girls have been through alot and do not get hurt easily emotionally. My most interesting memory of the trip was when two I saw two girls crying in a club as their dates had bailed on them and the girls were left with the bill to pay. The story seemed to be true; I gave them taxi money too:). I think two weeks a bit too long to stay in Kiev for me becasuse of the simple fact that at my age, I can not have sex multiple times every day and party hard every night so a shorter stint maybe more appropriate for me. I do not like telling you this but the writing is on the wall; this party in ukraine as we know it, will change\end soon. My prediction to a friend of mine was 3-5 years back in may but after this trip, I am thinking closer to 3 years.

Have a good time all and be safe!

Thank you for your note. I am guilty as charged and I do not wish to lead a girl on with emotional stuff. I feared this girl was heading in that direction and I was looking for reasons to bail. I am not looking for long term relationship or a wife. There are always options in Kiev; some more attractive than others. The other point that comes to my mind is that Ukrainian men are really spoiled and I have the general impression that many Ukrainian men do not find it necessary to take their time in bed with their women. I suspect many Ukrainian men have the attitude, you don't like, then leave, and perform in bed as they see fit. As a result, many girls go bananas when they meet a man who actually takes his time and allows them to achieve orgasm. I met yet another girl for one night who was a lot of fun too. She spoke excellent English and was a language teacher. The conversation with her was most interesting. We met at the club, went to my place, ordered sushi and champagne and talked until about 7 am when we went to bed. I was tierd and thought we were about to sleep until without any prompting from me, she took my member in her mouth bez condom. This 24 year old girl claimed she had not had sex for 6 months and I tend to believe her. According to her, she orgasmed 6 times before she left in the afternoon. This is not a reflection of my skills in bed but I suspect is a reflection of Ukrainian men not handling their business with their women all that well. I suspect ukrainian men lack motivation; somebody wrote the girls in Ukraine are like busses, one comes over your way every few minutes.

[QUOTE=Smokhee2003;1308890]I dunno, a true poke-her player would find another girl BEFORE jettisoning this near perfect girl. Sounds like you are spoiled, and for this, I am jealous LOL.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=LilJoey; 1308832]Thanks for your reply and input. I was actually asking about the regular nightclubs and the type of action available in them. The girls in regular nightclubs (WG's or semi pro girls) operate as independents and therefore whatever prices are involved are negotiated with each girl independently, so lower prices can be possible. I was hoping to see reports about what's going on in the regular nightclubs like Carribean, Vodka, Arena, Avalon or D'Lux etc.

However, the clubs you mentioned (Mandarin and Rio) are, strictly speaking, not regular nightclubs, but rather strip clubs, where everything, including the take out prices for the girls, is regulated by the club, and therefore the prices remain at a relatively high rate of 2400 UAH ($300 USD) minimum for three hours. In relation to the whopping take out fee, the entrance fee is really a nominal consideration. I used to like the cabaret shows at the old Mandarin club. Good to hear they reopened with the same type of offerrings. Thanks for also bringing to my attention Club Divas with which I was not familiar, unless it is another name for Club Paradise (a sister club of Rio). Did you sample any of the girls as "take out"?[/QUOTE]Liljoey. I am a great fan of yours because of your level of analysis and experience. And as you say 'to each its own'. You are right about Mandarin and Rio. Club Divas is also sister club to the first two not sure whether it was called Paradise before. I checked out 1 girl from each of this spots, Sofia, Dasha and Diana all for 5 hours. 3200grivnas which boils down to 640grivnas per hour. Even if I had gone to Carribean, Arena or Dlux I had to shell out entrance fee, drinks money for me and the girls, tips, not to mention money for the girls to bring them home. I stopped by Arena and Carribean and the WGs there asked me 800 to 1600 grivnas per hour and they were not much better than the Rios, Mandarins on the days I went. For a short term monger prices are at this level at present. Off course top modals is cheaper 400 grivnas per hour and that is where all the locals go. Difference you have to go the girls apartment which some of you may not like. Get a good taxi driver and you should be ok. The other option is to follow the steps of the more experienced people (Climax, IrishLad, Prosal, Barba, Jojosun) to look for better deals like 800-1600 grivnas per night. But that calls for greater homework. This is my cost / benefit analysis for now.

Ciao