Bfsie: I agree on your points, but you left out the competitive regional and global factor where guys are very mobile and can travel the world for p6, as well as the global supply of p6 girls.
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Bfsie: I agree on your points, but you left out the competitive regional and global factor where guys are very mobile and can travel the world for p6, as well as the global supply of p6 girls.
[QUOTE=Bfsie;2202389]Legalizing prostitution in US will remains to be a dream and illusion. I think that talking about it is a waste of time and legalizing prostitution in US is not going to happen probably in our lifetime. I would like to use this opportunity to talk about prostitutes' pricing which is complex issue and I should talk in some of my previous posts, but I was too lazy to do that until now I have some time.
In my opinion, the main fundamentals and determining factors of prostitute's price are:
1. How difficult a man can get sex with a girl in real life in a society this girl grew up. For example, in real life in the USA, a man usually has to have at least two dates (could be more) with an American girl before he would have sex with this girl. Let's say each date costs the man $50 and the man has to spend minimum $100 (for two dates) on the girl to get sex with her, so this American girl would set her fundamental price $100. If a girl comes from a poor country in South America where average income of people is much lower and a man there could get sex with this girl after spending minimum $40 on her and is working in US, she would set her fundamental price $40, instead of $100 which a local American girl would set..[/QUOTE]You make some interesting points, but I feel the fact prostitution is illegal in the US is the main point that keeps the price inflated. Remember, university costs a lot. If you come from a poor family the dream of higher education seems so unreachable. A majority of university graduates finish with debts greater than one years salary. One of the largest recruiting insentives for the US military is the promise of a place to live, food and assistance with repayment of university costs. Let's not forget the occasional one year tour to war zones to help build character. There are many beauties, working minimum wage. If it was not illegal, I'm sure that many would choose $100-150 per hour. After all, as I read about the trends in the US, it is now acceptable for young women to date several generous older men who provide expensive gifts.
I'm sure the trick is finding the balance between the $10 drug addict WG and the $500 and higher overpriced WG.
My opinion on legalization falls along the far fetched side. There is too much money to be made due to prostitution being illegal and this price point keeps the rich people in power from having to share women with the commoners.
[QUOTE=Polyamorist;2202303]But the FKK concept is not as dependent on economic inequality as many here assume. FKK Atlantis had a roaring business long before Romania joined the EU, and before that Bernds was doing well off local girls.[/QUOTE]It is. That were times (15 years ago) when there were few clubs in Germany, 50 EUR were still worth something and when average income in Poland, Czech and Hungary was a lot lower than now. So girls came to Atlantis and German FKKs. And German girls were still seeing it as a good income. Economy was roaring, many guys spent a lot of money on girls. Many girls were making 2 k or more per day.
Some girls from Asia, Africa, South America, Latvia, Estonia and Lithuania. Some of them married to EU members to get papers, other have been working illegally. That was one of the reasons why Atlantis was closed. Then things changed dramatically when Ro and Bu joined the EU. At least regarding the mix of nations at the clubs.
[QUOTE=Bfsie;2202389]Legalizing prostitution in US will remains to be a dream and illusion. I think that talking about it is a waste of time and legalizing prostitution in US is not going to happen probably in our lifetime. I would like to use this opportunity to talk about prostitutes' pricing which is complex issue and I should talk in some of my previous posts, but I was too lazy to do that until now I have some time.
In my opinion, the main fundamentals and determining factors of prostitute's price are:
1. How difficult a man can get sex with a girl in real life in a society this girl grew up. For example, in real life in the USA, a man usually has to have at least two dates (could be more) with an American girl before he would have sex with this girl. Let's say each date costs the man $50 and the man has to spend minimum $100 (for two dates) on the girl to get sex with her, so this American girl would set her fundamental price $100..[/QUOTE]If men in America shoot freely with their sperm in such format as German FKK, then there will be less shooting with guns.
I really do think there is relation between good sex and anger management etc. I mean let say after good sex with beauty, the last thing you want is any kind of disturbance related to violence or negative things.
[QUOTE=Jnpr30;2201833] KK posted about sugar babies who are willing to sleep for $300 an hour or more and it can still be hit and miss.[/QUOTE]For any fellow Americans headed the way of sugar babies, seeking P4 P arrangements on those type sites cover your tracks as always better safe than sorry. I can not verify if true or not but one guy stateside thinks he had a possible encounter with law enforcement and another claims of an Oregon bust on one of these sites. Real or imagined? To be determined. Probably paranoia but you never know.
I am not sure, just passing it along. It wouldn't shock me if they are using these other sites to try to make a name and flex their muscle to eliminate the mass wave of prostitutes now on them in light of recent legislation here. Those sites are infested with them now, matter of time until those sites prune profiles.
[QUOTE=RogueNation;2202440]It is. That were times (15 years ago) when there were few clubs in Germany, 50 EUR were still worth something and when average income in Poland, Czech and Hungary was a lot lower than now. So girls came to Atlantis and German FKKs. And German girls were still seeing it as a good income. Economy was roaring, many guys spent a lot of money on girls. Many girls were making 2 k or more per day.
Some girls from Asia, Africa, South America, Latvia, Estonia and Lithuania. Some of them married to EU members to get papers, other have been working illegally. That was one of the reasons why Atlantis was closed. Then things changed dramatically when Ro and Bu joined the EU. At least regarding the mix of nations at the clubs.[/QUOTE]More EU joining by Eastern European countries are better for FKK line up, I wonder which country is next to join EU and FKK line up.
Thanks god that Eastern European countries are among the most beautiful girls concentrated area to my taste.
[QUOTE=Pistons;2202391]But then the dogmatic change wouldn't have been dogmatic enough. Even Germany has a long way to go in order to liberalise it more. It is just the lesser of the worst evils.[/QUOTE]I think we had the peak of sexual liberation in Germany till last July when new law kicked in. It was paradise for men and even AO was allowed. For such low price.
I hope Germany will bring back the whole thing to as it was before last July, but I unfortunately doubt they will or make the whole thing worst, thanks to feminist and me too movement kinda organizations.
Aren't we all fortunate to experience over 10 years of mongering at its peak of liberation in Germany or I would say even in recent history. I mean only king and some other real privileged figure has such Harem like environment and we monger had it for reasonable price for such Harem like set up. This was the peak I unfortunately think.
Sunny side is that we still have it kind of and in surrounding nations to Germany we still have few places as it was in Germany till last July. So sun set has not come yet.
[QUOTE=Chongmal;2202424] I feel the fact prostitution is illegal in the US is the main point that keeps the price inflated. [/QUOTE]I wrote in my post:
[QUOTE=Bfsie;2202389]
4. If the prostitution is illegal in the country where the girl works. She would add X amount to her price for legal risk.
[/QUOTE]It depends on how severe legal punishment in a country is for prostitutes if they get caught. More severe the legal punishment is, higher risk premium (amount) the prostitutes would add to their prices. I don't think that the fact prostitution is illegal in the USA is main reason to drive the price inflated in the US because the legal punishment for prostitutes in US is not severe at all. I would like to quote a part of Takedown's post as follows as a part of my response to you:
[QUOTE=Takedown;2202026]Prostitution is legal in the state of Nevada and prices are still inflated at a minimum of 300/ hour for girls who are 6's and 7's. It's $500+ for the few girls who even would be in the top 25% of FKKs.
[/QUOTE]My sense is that the stigma towards prostitutes in USA is the main force to inflate the price in the US.
In 1984 had I said phones in your shirt pocket and so on, people would laugh at me as a crank. Just look at the last 10 years of changes. Serious foreign and economic policy as a brain fart on twitter. There is a lot of fragility in the US social contract and institutions and the states are in direct competition to survive as is the population as the permanent reality of mass structural unemployment, weak wages and poverty dawns on the population. As will be the reality of unfunded pensions. Morality. Or ideology. Rapidly changes in the face of undeniable economic realities. I for one can see changes coming, such as implicit encouragement of soft drugs to keep the population stoned and docile when they figure out the lifestyle they ordered is out of stock. The social / economic Darwinism is yet to play its logical conclusion. It will start small, like Indian reservations or somewhere with nada like Louisiana or the now ecologically destroyed Dakotas. The addiction to tax is that great. There are no blushes in congress.
Sex globalization already exists and will continue as the futility of forming a viable traditional 2. 1 births per female economic household dawns on most people is a passport to crushing poverty. This suits the 1% who can get rid of troublesome and possibly dangerous, resource draining surplus people save for a minimal service staff and a few pretty things for entertainment.
The educated here may ponder when the Yuan and Greenback are seen as the worthless symbols they are. Water, food, oil and sex will be the real currency. Even land is mostly worthless without the financial instruments that monetizes it and the economy. Compare Detroit say 1960 and 2018. Shanghai was a village in 1984. Traditional hydrocarbon based 1 person to 1 car is already soon be obsolete, and eventually women will demand the right to sell whatever they have to sell openly. I would not be so sure. The alcohol prohibition ended. The drug prohibition is slowly ending or unenforceable and hookers I think will be next. The need to get money flowing is the same reason gambling is OK. Hooker spend locally. Las Vegas money is sent straight to Wall Street and from there to feckless capital markets.
Uber for pussy. Searchable ratings, geolocation, reliable money exchange and no need for pimps.
Not going to mention many examples, but illegal / legal is definitely not a price mover. I have seen prices drop in places it got illegal, and vice versa. One thing that can affect prices is institutionalising it in brothels, and slapping taxes on it. Although I still feel the tax thingy is a bit fringe and easy to avoid unless I missed something.
[QUOTE=PahllusMaximus;2202652]The educated here may ponder when the Yuan and Greenback are seen as the worthless symbols they are. Water, food, oil and sex will be the real currency. Even land is mostly worthless without the financial instruments that monetizes it and the economy. Compare Detroit say 1960 and 2018. Shanghai was a village in 1984. Traditional hydrocarbon based 1 person to 1 car is already soon be obsolete, and eventually women will demand the right to sell whatever they have to sell openly. I would not be so sure. The alcohol prohibition ended. The drug prohibition is slowly ending or unenforceable and hookers I think will be next. The need to get money flowing is the same reason gambling is OK. Hooker spend locally. Las Vegas money is sent straight to Wall Street and from there to feckless capital markets.
Uber for pussy. Searchable ratings, geolocation, reliable money exchange and no need for pimps.[/QUOTE]Possibe? Yes. Will it happen in your mongering life time? I give it a 10% probability, max.
Interesting discussion about FKKs and prostitution in the USA. I was in California last year on business and I signed up with a sugar daddy website as I heard its a big thing I the States. Within hours of signing up I was getting numbers of beautiful college girls who were willing to be my 'companion' for an evening or the weekend. I decided to go with one girl, an art student in San Francisco, about 20, a 8 by FKK standards, for 300's for the evening. After chatting on Whatsapp we went for dinner at a vegan restaurant, she was one of those hippy types! And then back to my hotel room where we called in room service and I was shocked when alcohol was not allowed to be ordered as part of it! So I popped down to the local store and bought a bottle of Veuve Clicquot champagne and ordered in sushi using Uber food service to my hotel room.
After drinking we fucked, including BBBJ and anal, DFK and then had sushi in bed. The girl slept in my bed and left early in the morning. All for 300 dollars.
I also had offers from girls who were 9's, including beautiful Armenian and Persian girls, and also a blonde from Texas but they wanted 500 $ (the Texan 700's) for 24 hours. One girl I agreed 24 hours for 1000 $ with and she was a blonde 10 and leggy but unfortunately she bailed on me and left me hanging at the steak house where we were meant to meet. The point is I didn't find it hard to get P4P in the USA as long as you call it sugar dating. According to an article I read in one of the US papers online most girls who use Sugar Dating are college girls.
I think it's the new 'normal' in dating and will be become increasingly so with the year 2000 born and laters.
I.
I can see it happening in USA actually. Just not in our generation. But perhaps in 30 years. Just looking at liberalization trends across Europe and other parts of the world when it comes to atheism should be an indicator. In this sense USA is lagging behind. And there could also be setbacks, but we can all hope.
Very interesting stories. I am sure all of these USA Ladies can't wait for there to be an FKK in the USA where they can live where they work, walk around naked the entire time, and get $50, $100, $150 or so a session, fuck several different guys during the long shift, and hope the guy she just fucked says good things about her to the other guys on the floor.
I can't believe this was really a topic. The German FKKs work due to a convergence of low-income women from Eastern Europe who face a weak local market for their services in their home countries, and the close proximity of Germany and its acceptance of immigrant labor. It works well in Germany and the surrounding countries, but doesn't export well.
North America and other parts of Western Europe have a fine system of commercial sex. It is just expensive. Guys who can't, or won't, pay the market prices are certainly free to travel to much lower cost places, including Germany and South America. Many US guys on the east coast choose to travel to Montreal and a lot of Californians do Tijuana. A lot of guys do a little of everything. They occasionally monger in their home markets, and certainly look forward to business and vacation trips to lower cost locales.
Really folks, what would be the advantage of big FKKs in the USA? Nothing is stopping a USA Guy from answering the multitudes of sex worker ads and sugar baby in the USA Reasonable screening and research can assure both parties that law enforcement is not involved. Does the government really need to approve a great big facility and give a stamp of approval for sex? Should the USA Government really allow female temporary workers from very low-income countries to work at the hypothetical US FKKs to keep the prices low so that a low-income guy can get affordable sex without traveling?
I just can't get myself to think that way.
[QUOTE=Sybarite2006;2202713]Interesting discussion about FKKs and prostitution in the USA. I was in California last year on business and I signed up with a sugar daddy website as I heard its a big thing I the States. Within hours of signing up I was getting numbers of beautiful college girls who were willing to be my 'companion' for an evening or the weekend. I decided to go with one girl, an art student in San Francisco, about 20, a 8 by FKK standards, for 300's for the evening. After chatting on Whatsapp we went for dinner at a vegan restaurant, she was one of those hippy types! And then back to my hotel room where we called in room service and I was shocked when alcohol was not allowed to be ordered as part of it! So I popped down to the local store and bought a bottle of Veuve Clicquot champagne and ordered in sushi using Uber food service to my hotel room..[/QUOTE]