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[QUOTE=HessenBub;2059883]I'm all with you. The issue is that pressure from club management on the girls could lead to CBJ only. Because club management fear to get in trouble with the authorities.
HB.[/QUOTE]This is exactly what is already starting to happen in some clubs.
[QUOTE=HessenBub;2059883]I'm all with you. The issue is that pressure from club management on the girls could lead to CBJ only. Because club management fear to get in trouble with the authorities.
HB.[/QUOTE]I agree with that.
It's not the police to fear, any less you are [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord125][CodeWord125][/url] a WG against her own will, adversiting AO / BBBJ, or public gang AO, otherwise the police and law will never intervene.
As they said the worst it can get is you getting thrown out of the club, that's it. If clubs would inform the police for any mongers asking for that service then they are committing suicide as they will lose many customers, same with WG they will not do anything higher than informing the club managements (which will be so rare).
What I fear isn't the law itself or the police, what I fear is as follows:
1) Clubs seriously force girls for covered service out of fear.
2) WG using the law as an excuse to upsell or demand longer sessions.
3) WGs that hate doing BBBJ will stop doing it (and this is the only acceptable and fair reason).
4) Lack of public display of uncovered blowjob (as some mongers like myself love to do it anywhere everywhere not caring about who's watching).
5) You need to ask for it everytime prior to your session, which is lame and mood killing, compared to Pre-July which you never had to ask and you knew you will get it +99%.
6) Inside the room if the WG is a total *****, the uncovered service can be shorter in duration even if promised for longer duration, bad service in general as you can't go to management and speak about the WG bad uncovered service.
Guys chill. The new law will not be directly enforced even the authorities say so. Most of the local authorities are pissed that this law was even forced on them. I don't know if it was already discussed here, but there was an article in the German Newspaper Bild two weeks ago about how they are enforcing this law. Let me translate for you what the responsible authorities in each of the cities stated: (as good as my English allows me to).
Cologne: "If controls are performed, the regulatory agencies can check, if there is clearly visible information regarding the mandatory use of condoms. We cannot go any further than that".
Hannover: "The check of the mandatory use of condoms is, hardly surprising, difficult. A direct check is, of course, out of the question. It is likely that just the presence of unused condoms is checked on the spot, and also if there are any used condoms. ".
Dresden:" So far, it is not yet clear how the mandatory use of condoms should be checked. It is also questionable whether this is at all checkable".
Dortmund: "The mandatory use of condoms cannot be checked, however, the city of Dortmund checks whether the operators is undertaking efforts to ensure the mandatory use of condoms".
Stuttgart: "We are still waiting for the execution law of the state of Baden-Wrttemberg. The state capital Stuttgart does not yet have any jurisdiction. ".
The only two problems we are facing is:
1) The club managements that actually tells the girls to only do CBJ, this seams to be the case in some clubs. Too bad for those clubs, they will lose a lot of business.
2) Girls are now free to not provide or upsell BBBJ, like some already did with DFK.
Also I want to mention that while the fines for violating this law are high, it will not lead to a criminal record, as it's just a "Ordnungswidrigkeit" (same as getting a speeding ticket)
[QUOTE=Nil69;2059972]Guys chill. The new law will not be directly enforced; even the authorities say so. [/QUOTE]Finally. An informed, sensible post based on actual information and not panic, hysteria, and wild conjecture.
Thank you!
[QUOTE=Nil69;2059972]Guys chill. The new law will not be directly enforced even the authorities say so.
Also I want to mention that while the fines for violating this law are high, it will not lead to a criminal record, as it's just a "Ordnungswidrigkeit" (same as getting a speeding ticket)[/QUOTE]I echo the applause from UH. Not sure if Bild spoke to all of the local authorities to get these quotes but they clearly indicate an acceptance that enforcement is just impossible.
The encouragement to "chill" is spot on. No need for any panic. Nothing will change.
[QUOTE=Nil69;2059972]Guys chill. The new law will not be directly enforced even the authorities say so. Most of the local authorities are pissed that this law was even forced on them. I don't know if it was already discussed here, but there was an article in the German Newspaper Bild two weeks ago about how they are enforcing this law. Let me translate for you what the responsible authorities in each of the cities stated: (as good as my English allows me to).
Cologne: "If controls are performed, the regulatory agencies can check, if there is clearly visible information regarding the mandatory use of condoms. We cannot go any further than that".
Hannover: "The check of the mandatory use of condoms is, hardly surprising, difficult. A direct check is, of course, out of the question. It is likely that just the presence of unused condoms is checked on the spot, and also if there are any used condoms. ".
Dresden:" So far, it is not yet clear how the mandatory use of condoms should be checked. It is also questionable whether this is at all checkable".
Dortmund: "The mandatory use of condoms cannot be checked, however, the city of Dortmund checks whether the operators is undertaking efforts to ensure the mandatory use of condoms".[/QUOTE]The problem is not to be fined, just because the controls are quite impossible but this new law will progressively reduce the offer of BBBJ. Also we should not forget that some girls already left definitively the clubs and the registration process will reduce the number of new comers.
Those comments are general, not related to FKK clubs specifically. So this is still a valid argument:
[QUOTE=HessenBub;2059883]The issue is that pressure from club management on the girls could lead to CBJ only. Because club management fear to get in trouble with the authorities.
[/QUOTE]HB.
[QUOTE=HessenBub;2059999]Those comments are general, not related to FKK clubs specifically. So this is still a valid argument:
HB.[/QUOTE]The translated Bild article is much more telling than all the speculation here. Obviously *public authorities* are making it clear that enforcement simply isn't going to happen other than silly inspections for signage or whatever.
As soon as owners figure this out, they will play along, and a don't ask don't tell attitude will dominate. The only way this law works is to create unfounded fear. Spreading those kinds of fears on a board like this is the only way to prop up the new law, not overcome it.
[QUOTE=Nil69;2059972]Cologne: "If controls are performed, the regulatory agencies can check, if there is clearly visible information regarding the mandatory use of condoms. We cannot go any further than that".[/QUOTE]Visible information such as punters posting about it on public forums.
[QUOTE=Neurosynth;2060003]The translated Bild article is much more telling than all the speculation here. Obviously *public authorities* are making it clear that enforcement simply isn't going to happen other than silly inspections for signage or whatever.
As soon as owners figure this out, they will play along, and a don't ask don't tell attitude will dominate. The only way this law works is to create unfounded fear. Spreading those kinds of fears on a board like this is the only way to prop up the new law, not overcome it.[/QUOTE]Wrong in France, Italy, Spain etc. It is very difficult to get a BBBJ so why this will not be the case with the support of this new law, past is past nostalgia leads nowhere.
[QUOTE=Nil69;2059972]Guys chill. The new law will not be directly enforced even the authorities say so.
..............
Dortmund: "The mandatory use of condoms cannot be checked, however, the city of Dortmund checks whether the operators is undertaking efforts to ensure the mandatory use of condoms".
...............
The only two problems we are facing is:
1) The club managements that actually tells the girls to only do CBJ, this seams to be the case in some clubs. Too bad for those clubs, they will lose a lot of business.
2) Girls are now free to not provide or upsell BBBJ, like some already did with DFK.
[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=MythoVirus;2059964]
It's not the police to fear, any less you are a WG against her own will, adversiting AO / BBBJ, or public gang AO, otherwise the police and law will never intervene.
As they said the worst it can get is you getting thrown out of the club, that's it. If clubs would inform the police for any mongers asking for that service then they are committing suicide as they will lose many customers, same with WG they will not do anything higher than informing the club managements (which will be so rare).
What I fear isn't the law itself or the police, what I fear is as follows:
1) Clubs seriously force girls for covered service out of fear.
2) WG using the law as an excuse to upsell or demand longer sessions.
3) WGs that hate doing BBBJ will stop doing it (and this is the only acceptable and fair reason).
4) Lack of public display of uncovered blowjob (as some mongers like myself love to do it anywhere everywhere not caring about who's watching).
5) You need to ask for it everytime prior to your session, which is lame and mood killing, compared to Pre-July which you never had to ask and you knew you will get it +99%.
6) Inside the room if the WG is a total *****, the uncovered service can be shorter in duration even if promised for longer duration, bad service in general as you can't go to management and speak about the WG bad uncovered service.[/QUOTE]Finally some posts about this matter that make sense and do reflect reality in most of the clubs now (after July 1st): you (as a monger) don't have to fear the police, or any fine (only theoretical), BUT most club operators fear to lose their busines and therefore strictly enforce the girls to do CBJ, and the girls fear their job (and the police) and default to CBJ, especially with new / unkown men (and not so freshly showered men). Only when you are a regular (and clean) you might get the BBBJ and / or at a premium price (risk premium upselling) and most of time under strict non-disclosure!
This is how it now works in most German clubs, exceptions aside of course (no speculation, but real life experiences from several regulars, including myself, the last 2 weeks). So better get used to it, and be lucky if you get BBBJ with some of the WGs you know. The most pityfull is the fact that pre-sales and first sexual activities is not fully relaxed anymore, since this pink elephant clearly is in the room every time. Pity but true.
[QUOTE=Neurosynth;2060003]
As soon as owners figure this out, they will play along, and a don't ask don't tell attitude will dominate. The only way this law works is to create unfounded fear. Spreading those kinds of fears on a board like this is the only way to prop up the new law, not overcome it.[/QUOTE]Bild is the German sun. Boulevard press. Great source.
I'm with Maxime.
HB.
This lobby is particularly vocal against the New Law: [URL]https://www.donacarmen.de[/URL].
It has strong words, like: "Der Verein fordert Rechte statt Razzien fuer auslaendische Prostituierte. Eine institutionalisierte Kooperation mit der Polizei lehnt Dona Carmen entschieden ab" (translation: Our Organization demands rights, not police raids for foreign prostitutes. We are radically opposed to any form of institutionalized cooperation with the police").
The address of the Organization is Elbenstrasse in Frankfurt, a street that should ring a bell here.
Beside a general donation account, it has a special donation account for the appeal before the German Supreme Court:
"SPENDENKONTO FUER VERFASSUNGSKLAGE GEGEN DAS PROSTITUIERTENSCHUTZGESETZ".
Dona Carmen e. V.
Frankfurter Sparkasse.
IBAN: DE44 5005 0201 1245 8863 61.
BIC: HELADEF1822.
I propose the following: instead of giving the next upsell 50 euro to a girl for BBBJ, let's give it to those guys.
It might turn out to be the best spent BBBJ 50 euro ever.
[QUOTE=HessenBub;2060052]Bild is the German sun. Boulevard press. Great source.
I'm with Maxime.
HB.[/QUOTE]Are you saying the quotes were made up and officials never said them? They certainly sound authentic. The politicians posture, but it's the civil servants who get stuck with implementation. They are going to resent getting extra work so politicians can puff themselves up. They have no incentive to do anything beyond the minimum.
[QUOTE=Neurosynth;2060096]Are you saying the quotes were made up and officials never said them? They certainly sound authentic. The politicians posture, but it's the civil servants who get stuck with implementation. They are going to resent getting extra work so politicians can puff themselves up. They have no incentive to do anything beyond the minimum.[/QUOTE]Sometimes you have to thank the Civil Service and the Bureaucracy in the execution of the will of the legislative power.