General Info

[QUOTE=Jnpr30;2061344]

Then magically, a day after July 1, it was "no more open reports, or else BBBJ will end". By the same member being in the lead, except 180 deg reversal now. No more "wait and see, don't speculate". It became "discussion and open reports lead to xyz (what ever that dire consequence is)". I guess certain members have acquired superlative prognosticative abilities which were not evident earlier.

[/QUOTE]It was wait and see before July. In July I saw what effect the law and open discussion about BBBJ had. So the consequence for me was: no more reporting about it. Makes sense to me.

HB.

[QUOTE=HessenBub;2061376]It was wait and see before July. In July I saw what effect the law and open discussion about BBBJ had...[/QUOTE]July is not even over and you've already seen open discussion make BB services disappear? And you are certain of a causal linkage? Please explain.

I have just spent a very busy and long day checking out what is available in an FKK, three apartments and one street walker.

I am not going to report on which girl did what where, but just that at the moment there is a wide range of services available to anyone who wants to find it for themselves.

I will not give details as I believe that reporting that a girl did an act which was against the law for her customer could lead to that girl being thrown out of the club as the clubs try to preserve their moneymaking business. And thumbing in the face of the law is likely to lead to calls for tougher enforcement by the fanatical members of the SPD.

Please, nobody tell me I should post details about anything which might have been illegal.

I will report on where I went and service levels in the appropriate threads if I get time

Right. So despite high profile politicians pontificating, laws being debated, unenforceable fines being touted, and general fear and uncertainty being spread among Germans, BB services are still available. But a few posts on an English language board will bring the whole thing tumbling down? Really?

[QUOTE=DrPoon;2061298]LE shutting down agencies in the USA actually ended up being a benefit. Prices lowered and the quality of women improved because independent women in the USA are a better deal.[/QUOTE]One important (missing) point to remember is that the German law on prostitution (the old one, not just the new one) bans prostitution except in especially designated areas. Working as an "independent" woman has been illegal for as long as I can remember. If I'm not mistaken having an "escort" over to your home or hotel room is technically illegal unless you happen to live outside the "Sperrbezirk" (the "no-prostitution" area which normally enclosed two thirds of the city). So clubs disbanding for girls to fan out to set up shop in a myriad of apartments is unlikely to happen unless prostitution becomes illegal period. I guess girls who advertise in the papers for outcalls call themselves "masseuses" for the prostitution case to boil down to one of happy ending or not if there is trouble.

[QUOTE=DrPoon;2061298]LE shutting down agencies in the USA actually ended up being a benefit. Prices lowered and the quality of women improved because independent women in the USA are a better deal.[/QUOTE]As with your Vegas post, I am not quite sure where you go to get your American hookers. It is a big market that defies stereotyping. The current group of high end independents provide excellent service usually including BBBJ, but in most big cities the prices are $400 - $600 an hour on the review board we are not allowed to mention. You are correct that after the demise of multi-state agencies, the backpage and backpage-type market proliferated and there are many more $200 or so an hour providers, but many are skanks, druggies, and law enforcement fake ads. Not all, certainly, but many. When big agencies like Miami Companions had a touring lady in every big city, a person got a high quality lady and good service almost always for $300-$350 an hour. A lot of guys liked that market and we're sorry to see the federal government end it. I realize that is ridiculously expensive compared to Europe, but every country is different. I do wonder how much online reviews contributed to the federal givernment's actions against the big multi-state agencies.

[QUOTE=Mongerer88;2061412]As with your Vegas post, I am not quite sure where you go to get your American hookers. It is a big market that defies stereotyping. The current group of high end independents provide excellent service usually including BBBJ, but in most big cities the prices are $400 - $600 an hour on the review board we are not allowed to mention. You are correct that after the demise of multi-state agencies, the backpage and backpage-type market proliferated and there are many more $200 or so an hour providers, but many are skanks, druggies, and law enforcement fake ads. Not all, certainly, but many. When big agencies like Miami Companions had a touring lady in every big city, a person got a high quality lady and good service almost always for $300-$350 an hour. A lot of guys liked that market and we're sorry to see the federal government end it. I realize that is ridiculously expensive compared to Europe, but every country is different. I do wonder how much online reviews contributed to the federal givernment's actions against the big multi-state agencies.[/QUOTE]I don't know anyone that pays that much.

There are many many local small agencies.

With great polish / Russian talent.

And backpage is alive and well.

Despite reports of its demise, many gems for 100 usd.

That doesn't even scratch the surface, if you include every strip club.

I get my info from the fact that in the USA one can go on backpage or craigslist and regularly find women for $60 us dollars for a 15 minute quick visit and / or if properly negotiated a BBBJ with CIM. Proper research and focus on new beginners is required. Intermediate or long term providers become jaded and raise their rates until they get to the point they are too old and become physically undesirable but at that time they can get on retirement benefits anyway at age 62.

Also it is relatively easy for USA local LE to shut down almost any agency in its jurisdiction and not even needing the FBI. Most local agencies are easily taken down by the local LE. All they need to do is book an appointment and or get fake references which is easy to get. A fake reference is obtained by fabricating screen names on hobby websites, fabricating employment background information or getting a fake drivers license and then getting a prostitution contract with one of the girls from the agency. Then all the girls associated with the agency plus the agency operator (legally considered a pimp under USA laws) are indicted and then usually they all eventually plead guilty and the agency is shut down. If they go to trial they loose 99 percent of the time.

By spreading and scattering independent providers usually in rapidly changed hotel rooms (not fixed apartment locations) it becomes impossible for the USA government to stop prostitution. By centrally locating, they become a target easily taken out.

Just like a car chase full of four criminals. If they bail out of the car at a stop, and run in a group they are easily caught. But if they split and run in four different directions and scatter they increase their odds.

[QUOTE=Mongerer88;2061412]As with your Vegas post, I am not quite sure where you go to get your American hookers. It is a big market that defies stereotyping. The current group of high end independents provide excellent service usually including BBBJ, but in most big cities the prices are $400 - $600 an hour on the review board we are not allowed to mention. You are correct that after the demise of multi-state agencies, the backpage and backpage-type market proliferated and there are many more $200 or so an hour providers, but many are skanks, druggies, and law enforcement fake ads. Not all, certainly, but many. When big agencies like Miami Companions had a touring lady in every big city, a person got a high quality lady and good service almost always for $300-$350 an hour. A lot of guys liked that market and we're sorry to see the federal government end it. I realize that is ridiculously expensive compared to Europe, but every country is different. I do wonder how much online reviews contributed to the federal givernment's actions against the big multi-state agencies.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Jnpr30;2061344]"Missing" - how about other people are not missing anything, but just disagreeing with that view?[/QUOTE]I am just baffled why people insist on focusing on "laws", when "club rules" are the more immediate concern. In other words, no individual monger is being cock-blocked by the German authorities. Individual mongers are getting cock-blocked by FKK club management. If in the future, a monger does 15 sessions during a 5-day trip, and all 15 WGs tell the customer that they can only offer CBJ because it violates club rules, then the law becomes a moot point.

[QUOTE=Bitumen;2061114]Threesome with two girls is good when the goods work well together so nake sure they know each other or ask the girl which friend she like to work with.[/QUOTE]Thanks! What / how do the rates normally work for 2 girls? 1 hour rate (so 100 E) x 2? And yes, will take my time to make sure they get along.

[QUOTE=Sirioja;2061119]For FRA, straight to Sharks for breakfast at 11 am.

Many girls say Monday is a quite good day for business at Sharks.[/QUOTE]Best to take the taxi straight from the airport to Sharks? Probably get there closer to 1 pm. Stay for 5 hours, and head to downtown? Or head to Sharks around 2 pm to stay till 7?

I respect your view that club rules are the gate keeper or cock blocker as you say, but that's not yet a fact, it is a view. If it was a fact which was universally true, none of us would be debating it.

And club rules are dependent on the law. They changed presumably, because of the change in the law. Would the club rules be changed and stay that way permanently, regardless of how the law is being enforced in the rest of the land?

In any case, these are all prognostications and your guess is as good as mine (or perhaps as you believe, better than mine). Fine. But what I will not do is ask you to change the way you communicate based on what I think will happen. But somehow your side is so convinced in the merit of your argument that you are willing to go to the mats against the other side. No one is stupid around here, and if and when people see a direct, causal link between something typed here and a bad outcome in the club, many of us would self moderate.

[QUOTE=Jnpr30;2061478]I respect your view that club rules are the gate keeper or cock blocker as you say, but that's not yet a fact, it is a view. If it was a fact which was universally true, none of us would be debating it.
[/QUOTE]The statement that new "club rules" have been established has not been refuted by anyone to my knowledge. According to news articles, German authorities have yet to mobilize at all, so who else could be the cock blocker at Rom, World and possibly a few more.

[QUOTE=Jnpr30;2061478]
And club rules are dependent on the law. They changed presumably, because of the change in the law. Would the club rules be changed and stay that way permanently, regardless of how the law is being enforced in the rest of the land?
[/QUOTE]Yes, the law indirectly influenced the drafting of the new club rules. The hope is that the rule will be loosely enforced as time goes on. My point is the authorities do not have the resources to enforce anything themselves. So if the clubs can be convinced to look the other way, then 95% of the problem is solved.

I had sex as a teenager, and where I grew up sex between two minors is illegal (even if it is consexual). But guess what there are too many horny, misbehaving teenagers and not enough cops, so for all practical intents and purposes, the anti-sex laws were unenforceable. The only obstacles were the rules of our strict parents, not laws that were on the books. They were the only ones with the time and resources to really monitor us, therefore we worried only about our parents, not the cops.

[QUOTE=Jnpr30;2061478]I respect your view that club rules are the gate keeper or cock blocker as you say, but that's not yet a fact, it is a view. If it was a fact which was universally true, none of us would be debating it.

And club rules are dependent on the law. They changed presumably, because of the change in the law. Would the club rules be changed and stay that way permanently, regardless of how the law is being enforced in the rest of the land?

In any case, these are all prognostications and your guess is as good as mine (or perhaps as you believe, better than mine). Fine. But what I will not do is ask you to change the way you communicate based on what I think will happen. But somehow your side is so convinced in the merit of your argument that you are willing to go to the mats against the other side. No one is stupid around here, and if and when people see a direct, causal link between something typed here and a bad outcome in the club, many of us would self moderate.[/QUOTE]Agreed.

Until there is a causal link as opposed to idle arm chair speculation then no need to be impolite and call other members names (you know who you are) and censor reporting that is within the bounds of the forum rules.

I know from all my visits post 1 July that the new law has never been mentioned by any girl or even club management (except before 1 July). The only people discussing the new law are German mongers who are having a laugh about it. So first hand experience.

I do hear though the future consequences as well but once again these have not happened yet since the authorities have not even got their act together. This is from locals.

[QUOTE=Neurosynth;2061403]Right. So despite high profile politicians pontificating, laws being debated, unenforceable fines being touted, and general fear and uncertainty being spread among Germans, BB services are still available. But a few posts on an English language board will bring the whole thing tumbling down? Really?[/QUOTE]I am aware of your views as you are posting them in several threads saying the same thing. You misrepresent part my view and ignore part of it: a few posts will not change everything. I have explained several times why I will not report in detail about illegal activities. Your campaign to get detailed reporting on this has made me even more reluctant to post as any detail will be blown out of proportion.

Anyway, anyone who read my post will see that it is almost the only first hand experience post recently and it gives a general picture. As I said I will write more when I have time.