General Info

[QUOTE=Fastpiston] Hold-ups in buses, jeepneys, banks, hotels, murders are common. Drugs are the cause of most problems, or just sheer poverty. If one is still unconvinced on the need for great care, check out the Philippine TV[/QUOTE]

Last nite TV showed pictures from a crime scene where 2 snatchers had been killed by the police in QC. Good. At least the filipinos have the good taste to kill off these lowlifes. Recurrent targeted campaigns against holdappers often produce similarly positive results.

In so many meek western countries (esp in W. Europe) the criminals are treated with soft gloves, getting cable TV in their cells and what not.

gentlemen there are many things in asheron's post that i agree with one hundred percent. he is correct concerning manila being the razor artist capitol of the world, they are noted for this and usually get vicitms who sit on the curb side of a jeepney it takes them a few seconds to slit a rear pocket and collect a wallet, if anyone is foolish enough to carry his wallet there, same with the cell phone snatchers and chain grabbers, they mainly target women and smaller kids. and he is correct about the beggars, many cities have enacted ordinance against this due primarily to the fact that most organized beggars use children (they train them and "rent' them out for the day in different parts of the city.) the reason is the u.n. made a big stink over this. i know for a fact that in davao, mr. dirty harry himself told beggars he would arrest any of them he saw using children and he ordered people not to give them money. however i have never heard of any one getting arrested for giving them money. in cebu they tried to clean them up, for the asean summit, the ones who stop traffic and ask for money, once the summit was over they came back, every once in awhile i see the citcom guys run them off.

as far as ho's shouting [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123][CodeWord123][/url], this is an old scam, it is done a lot by the lower class ones who are ****, sometimes they are in cahoots with the cops, i also know that in vietnam this is a big time con, more so than the pi.

the post illustrates a few things i've been harping on for some time, the first is that manila is much more dangerous per se to foreigners than anywhere else in the phils. the second is that it depends where you go and who you run with being more of a determining factor regarding your being a vicitim of a crime, that goes for the pi, thailand, jakarta, los angles nyc or wash d.c., any country. it sounds like asheron was running with a frisky crowd, i also wonder if any of this took place in tondo, probably the highest crime rate in the pi, controlled by armed gangs sort of like compton in la.

as far as piracy he is right, sailing your yacht in the sulu sea is a good way to find how many pirates operate there. back about three years ago the imo weekly piracy report named the sulu and north celebes sea as the third most incidence of piracy, the straits of malacca the first and west coast of africa second. pirates in that region were targeting the tuna fleets out of gen santos, putting armed guards on the boats seems to have lessened the problem. the sulu is also home to the abu sayeff, who once operated with impunity there, they also kidnapped several foreigners from malaysia, an italian priest in marawi and the celebrated los palmas raid which captured two american missionaries and a guy with his fiance. (oddly enough these foreigners were not the target but rather a chinese businessman was). once again gentlemen pinoy kfr gangs target chinese businessmen, primarily because they pay, at present, the talk among the bad guys is that if you kidnap a foreigner, you can expect guys in dark jump suits and mp 5's to come knocking on your door.

outside of those incidents, i know of two, count 'em two cases in the last six years in which a foreigner was kidnapped in mindanao, one canadian was set up by his wife as he met with his hooker gf for an all night tryst in a digos beach front hotel, she had some toughs carry him off to teach him a lesson,(remember that one guys, never [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140][CodeWord140][/url] off a filipina wife too much) they got raided two days later and shot full of holes by police commandos. the other was some idiot korean guy who went into milf territory with a suitcase full of money to buy "yamashita treasure". not real smart. i could go on about foreigners being robbed, beat up or being vicitms of crime and in each case they were doing something illegal, being stupid or being in a place they shouldn't have been.

i defy anyone, the u.s. embassy included to produce statisical or factual accounts where foreigners were kidnapped on a such a scale as to warrant
some of the mass hysteria over the matter.

anyhow, every once in awhile we need to be aware of such things, what can really happen and does, who it happens to and what they were doing at the time it happened, if you research it, get the facts and not give in to hysteria and listen to paranoid, easily frightened filipinos you will see what i'm talking about.

use common sense, dont get too drunk and if you do dont be a tough guy get back to your room (alone) and sleep it off.


regards

spamhog

thanks for flushing out the details. SO true what you said about Manila being the most dangerous place in the PI for foreigners, despite their PERCEPTION that Mindanao is where the real risks lie. Also not surprising that most foreigners who got themselves into trouble with criminals were doing something they shouldn't have been or otherwise showed poor judgment.

Re the begging thing, correct me if I'm wrong but I think the syndicates that use children are mostly in Manila, Cebu and Angeles (where the foreigners are as Filipinos tend not to be overly generous with beggars). Re an ordinance banning GIVING (as opposed to begging), that is both constitutionally unsound (not that that stops them in the PI as Mayor Lim proved time and again) and of VERY dubious morality. I do not give to the kids or mothers holding babies, but I do give to amputees or others with obvious physical deformities or disabilities. Believing in the principle of ethical egoism (everything we do is really for ourselves despite any appearance of philanthropy), I confess to feeling better about my own privileged station in life when I do this. I will SEEK OUT the disabled, rather than responding to those who approach me, and give them a pocketfull of coins. If anybody, including Mayor Duterte or Asheron, is bothered by that charity too bad because I know I have the angels on my side.

[QUOTE=Surfer]thanks for flushing out the details. SO true what you said about Manila being the most dangerous place in the PI for foreigners, despite their PERCEPTION that Mindanao is where the real risks lie. Also not surprising that most foreigners who got themselves into trouble with criminals were doing something they shouldn't have been or otherwise showed poor judgment.

Re the begging thing, correct me if I'm wrong but I think the syndicates that use children are mostly in Manila, Cebu and Angeles (where the foreigners are as Filipinos tend not to be overly generous with beggars). Re an ordinance banning GIVING (as opposed to begging), that is both constitutionally unsound (not that that stops them in the PI as Mayor Lim proved time and again) and of VERY dubious morality. I do not give to the kids or mothers holding babies, but I do give to amputees or others with obvious physical deformities or disabilities. Believing in the principle of ethical egoism (everything we do is really for ourselves despite any appearance of philanthropy), I confess to feeling better about my own privileged station in life when I do this. I will SEEK OUT the disabled, rather than responding to those who approach me, and give them a pocketfull of coins. If anybody, including Mayor Duterte or Asheron, is bothered by that charity too bad because I know I have the angels on my side.[/QUOTE]

You have a good heart. Please do not go to India where you will really feel bad, where kids are actually maimed purposely to become beggars. Very Very Sick, but true. I truly do not think that happens in the Philippines.

never been to india, and never felt any great urge to go frankly. i would doubt intentional maiming to increase donations would occur in the pi (but anything is possible).

cambodia was plenty depressing. the killing fields and kr torture center tuol sleng were bad, but the worst was climbing the stairs of wat phnom and seeing a different malady or amputee. cambodia's land mine problem has created the largest proportion of amputees in the world. truly like peering into the gates of hell it was.

if india is even worse, that would tax my capacity for seeing people suffer.

[QUOTE=Surfer]thanks for ......

Re the begging thing, correct me if I'm wrong but I think the syndicates that use children are mostly in Manila, Cebu and Angeles (where the foreigners are as Filipinos tend not to be overly generous with beggars). Re an ordinance banning GIVING (as opposed to begging), that is both constitutionally unsound (not that that stops them in the PI as Mayor Lim proved time and again) and of VERY dubious morality. I do not give to the kids or mothers holding babies, but I do give to amputees or others with obvious physical deformities or disabilities. Believing in the principle of ethical egoism (everything we do is really for ourselves despite any appearance of philanthropy), I confess to feeling better about my own privileged station in life when I do this. I will SEEK OUT the disabled, rather than responding to those who approach me, and give them a pocketfull of coins. If anybody, including Mayor Duterte or Asheron, is bothered by that charity too bad because I know I have the angels on my side.[/QUOTE]I agree with you on the begging and giving. I have 4 or 5 beggers I give to everyday. I make sure they get enough money from me to have at least one meal. Normally I give them 20peso but If I have not been around for a few days I will give 50 or more to make up. All of these have deformities. They are old timers here. Meaning I have seen them for over a year. They see me, and smile and do not ask anything else from me that day, even though I have never asked them to leave me alone.

I know that they make more than the average wage earner does, but they also miss out on most of what is good in life.

We have a great deal of new beggers show up for awhile and then vanish. One has to wonder why there is this constant turn over of beggers. I can only suspect, but believe it is controled begging for someone's profit. I can not prove this, and giving is up to one's conscience. My standard is to give only to those who I clearly see have a deformity, never to the kids unless they seem extremely dirty and hungry. If there is someone making profit, kids would be the way to scam us.

That being said, several times at Sub Delicious I have offered a begging kid my left over food, such as half a sub or my rice, and everytime, the kid or kids ate the food as if they were starving. Several times when this has happen, I have ordered cokes for them, and I always rethink my position on giving to kids. So far I am sticking to my guns and not give money. I am never sure I am right and it does bother my conscience to the point of wet eyes sometime. Food yes sometimes, money not yet anyways.

[QUOTE=Congerww]I agree with you on the begging and giving. I have 4 or 5 beggers I give to everyday. I make sure they get enough money from me to have at least one meal. Normally I give them 20peso but If I have not been around for a few days I will give 50 or more to make up. [/QUOTE]

Thanks a million. So you're one of the soft hearts feeding this disgusting industry. This ensures that we will have so many beggars living the "meaningful lifes" in the polluted cesspool called Fields, instead of doing something useful in their hometown. Only because congerww and his friends simply pay better for their Fields freak show.

The good news is that Lazatin has announced that the beggar kids will be taken off the street and put in detention centers, where their parent/s can pick them up. Repeat offenders will face charges. Let's see how well this will be implemented, the PNP and "props police" (police aids) are not doing much at all, except touting guns and riding their motorcycles and van with flashing lights. Both soliciting (mostly done by baklas, who often double as poor pickpockets) and begging are criminal acts in the Phils.

I have never ever given one single peso to beggars in the Philippines, but I gladly buy stuff from ambitious street hawkers (who are not too makulit). Check out the hard working flower lady walking around Balibago for instance. Flowers Sir? Looks like she's at it for almost 24/7.

I guess Im a soft touch, coz I DO GIVE TO BEGGARS occassionally. I dont always give them money, for example I usually get hit up by some of the old women in the market place. I usually give them some produce I've bought, a mango or two, once in awhile a coin if that makes me a chump so be it. I sometimes give to the blind guys in the street being led around by a kid when the come to my car usually my change or something. Surfer is correct about the syndicates using the kids, but it is NOT limited to Manila, it was getting out of hand in Davao so the big D stepped in. I dont see that many in Cebu. I've got mixed emotions about handing out to kids, I have at times given them some of my food if I'm coming out of McD's (At my age I shouldn't be eating fries anyhow) or a roll or two if I'm coming out of the bakery, but I balk at money, Mrs spamhog assures me they spend it for rugby.

Regards tipping I usually DO tip, maybe not much but I usually leave something. I'm a great believer in spreading the wealth around. Of course most of that is in places most of the brethern don''t go and the people are shy and even embarassed to ask or take it. The strong exception I have is with an obvious hustler or somebody trying to play me for a fool. Of course during my mongering days I tipped sweetie according to performace/technique etc.

I have never heard of intentional maiming of children in the PI, there are enough polio vicitms and amputees due to lack of antibiotics for normally easily treated infections. However, I have seen some examples of this in Thailand where they have well organized beggar clans and a "king". But you must understand the Thai and the Cambodians have a totally different atitude towards the issue. One makes merit (Tham boon) in the eyes of Bhudda even if its a scam (like those guys in front of the Wat who have the birds you pay to release, then the little prick is trained to fly back in its cage).

regards

Spamhog

[quote=surfer]cambodia was plenty depressing. the killing fields and kr torture center tuol sleng were bad, but the worst was climbing the stairs of wat phnom and seeing a different malady or amputee. cambodia's land mine problem has created the largest proportion of amputees in the world. truly like peering into the gates of hell it was.
[/quote]

the depressing thing about cambodia, surfer, is not poverty, genocide, or amputations, but that the forces of social control closed k11.

personally i give only to one begger - the old man at soi yamoto and beach road in pattaya who pretends to have an amputated hand. it is obviously fake, which i like. i only give him less than five baht for the gag though.

[QUOTE=Spam Hog]I guess Im a soft touch, coz I DO GIVE TO BEGGARS occassionally. I dont always give them money, for example I usually get hit up by some of the old women in the market place.[/QUOTE]

Yeah, OK I have to admit I sometimes give a little food to the kids, if I'm munching on something. This way they can't use is for rugby etc.

As for tipping I usually tip P20 for good service w/ a smile. If they screw up (which is pretty often) or if they are just lazy and ignorant (often too) they get zip, period.

Case in point. The waitress screwed up my order at Salvatores, despite my asking her "have you completely understood my order?" (providing her with an excellent opportunity to re-check anything not clear, and of course any further explaining by me after her affirmative answer equals calling her dumb).

When the pizza arrives it's messed up with the wrong ingredients in the right place or vice versa lol. No apology, no discount, no free drink, no nothing (I asked, mostly to prove my point that PI businesses enjoys screwing their customers and get away with it). The waitress suggested they'd "rework" the pizza (no thanks). Zero tip and just another "costumer service" experience in PI ;)

[QUOTE=Surfer]Pricing is a controversial topic as YMMV, so I will give you RANGES (and your post talks ST rates so I assume that is you preference):

1. BKK has nothing like LA Cafe where you can get freelancers for ST as low as 500, more likely 1000, and never more than 1500. No bar fine.

2. EDSA Complex: Barfine=1,000 Piso and for ST between 1K & 2K tip to girl.

3. Makati/PBurgos: have not been up there in almost as long that I have not been back to Angeles, but generally 50% higher than EDSA if not more.

4. Internet: join either Cherryblossoms or Filipinaheart for a month BEFORE you go, then line up girls than run the gamut from HCH (hard Core Hos) to virgins seeking a husband to EVERYTHING in between. You can do Yahoo messenger for free BUT WAY more scams and less lucrative (this is secondhand though as I have never done it as I do SO well on the other two).

5. Shopping malls: freelancers abound.

6. Get AWAY from tourist areas and you'll see TONS of possibilities. Get hooked up with a good local procurer and you'll have more than you can handle.[/QUOTE]

Hello Surfer

I have seen your fight in the Thailand Forum and I can only say that you have my support and try to forget this fighting guy.

Thanks again for you valuable info regarding Manila / PHI. For sure you are much better member than this guy in this Forum. Bye

[QUOTE=Pute Nut]Thanks a million. So you're one of the soft hearts feeding this disgusting industry. This ensures that we will have so many beggars living the "meaningful lifes" in the polluted cesspool called Fields, instead of doing something useful in their hometown.[/QUOTE]Let me see if I understand you. All the Girls are here in Angeles because they rather fuck an old guy like me than live the full rich useful life back home. Wow, Now I really feel great. Did not know I was such a good lover!

[QUOTE=Congerww]Let me see if I understand you. All the Girls are here in Angeles because they rather fuck an old guy like me than live the full rich useful life back home. Wow, Now I really feel great. Did not know I was such a good lover![/QUOTE]

Good on you if you feel great, but I am afraid you are mixing up working girls and beggars here. I know AC can do these things to you, but I certainly hope you do not fuck the beggars.

[QUOTE=Pute Nut]Thanks a million. So you're one of the soft hearts feeding this disgusting industry. This ensures that we will have so many beggars living the "meaningful lifes" in the polluted cesspool called Fields, instead of doing something useful in their hometown. Only because congerww and his friends simply pay better for their Fields freak show.[/QUOTE]

He was talking about people with deformities and disabilities. How can you expect those people to lead a meaningful life. Most of them can't hold or do a regular job. Or aren't hired by any employers. And as there is no system in place in the phils to help these people they don't have any real choice. I don't like beggars that look like they can work a normal job, but feel pity for those that are deformed and sometimes give to them.

[QUOTE=White Wolf]He was talking about people with deformities and disabilities. How can you expect those people to lead a meaningful life. Most of them can't hold or do a regular job. Or aren't hired by any employers. And as there is no system in place in the phils to help these people they don't have any real choice. I don't like beggars that look like they can work a normal job, but feel pity for those that are deformed and sometimes give to them.[/QUOTE]

Actually, there is a lot you can do with what you've still got. Your life certainly doesn't end with your deformation, accidental or deliberate. I know first hand of one guy who is blind and makes an OK living selling cellphone loads, for instance.

The beggars are in Fields because the soft hearts simply pay them better to lie in the gutter dirty asking for handouts than doing something more productive elsewhere.

Moreover, by steering your funds to amputees and deformed beggars you certainly provide economic incentive for various schemes that are very unpleasant. I am not claiming this is common in Phils, but it certainly is elsewhere. I don't want to feed such an industry. Never, ever.