Angeles City

[QUOTE=Rick Rock; 1462385]J.

What about my off the radar spots? I know at least 50 that aren't mentioned anywhere on this board in South Korea, Japan, Dominican Republic, Myanmar and Laos. Less than 10 of those are lower quality. At least a dozen are what I'd call top quality mongering destinations. A few helpful posters who have PM'd me can tell you. Unfortunately I can't share the information publicly, which is why I rarely mention it.[/QUOTE]Yes it's best to keep the gems private and not to post them in public. Secret spots should only be discussed in private messages with trusted members. There's now reason to invite idiots and japs to good spots so they can ruin them. Rick Rock understands this and that's why he is a good mongerer!

[QUOTE=Amjeck;1462448]Yes it's best to keep the gems private and not to post them in public. Secret spots should only be discussed in private messages with trusted members. There's now reason to invite idiots and japs to good spots so they can ruin them. Rick Rock understands this and that's why he is a good mongerer![/QUOTE]Seems to me he is just a complainer.

What I can't understand. RR knows so many secret cheap unspoiled locations. He knows 40 plus cheap unspoiled locations to choose from. He says he doesn't tip as much nor making it rain. And the girls respect him for it. Since he says the girls ridicule those that tip big and make it rain. From what I have witness, if they call that ridicule (the treatment big spenders get). Then I am all for being ridiculed.

So RR says he knows many cheap places besides AC, . When In AC he doesn't spend crazy and the girls respect him more becos of it and he's getting the same service as the big spenders. So he says.

So my question. Why is he complaining. No one should care what or how another person spends money unless you made it for them.

Rule #1. Mongering is not a team sport.

[QUOTE=Ekspat;1462190]Maybe a new, unknown brothel between Kampung Cham and Kampung Thom. RR, again, feel free to enjoy it.[/QUOTE]Cool. I live less than two miles from 71.

[QUOTE=TaipeiD;1462186]Oh and by the way plenty of complaining 10 years ago about high bar fines and tipping too much. I guess some things never change.[/QUOTE]And it was just as boring to read then as it is now. Bottom line, know what the market rate is and then pay whatever you want. And if the barfines seem too expensive, then go elsewhere or take up a new hobby. Nobody ever promised that Asian mongering was going to be cheap forever.

[QUOTE=Betong;1462531]And it was just as boring to read then as it is now. Bottom line, know what the market rate is and then pay whatever you want. And if the barfines seem too expensive, then go elsewhere or take up a new hobby. Nobody ever promised that Asian mongering was going to be cheap forever.[/QUOTE]We don't want the prices to jump. Look at the prices on some of the other boards (I find it interesting that men fly to the FSR to pay as much or more for girls than they would pay in their own country). Of course nobody promised that it would be cheap forever, but we are not looking for a promise. We are looking for our own to police itself somewhat. I'm with RR here, at least somewhat:

* Tipping in a place where tipping is not the norm (I do it too) brings an outside cultural influence to a place when we shouldn't bring it.

* Tipping for service that is not exceptional is tipping for tipping's sake. If she went above and beyond, yes of course give her something. If not, then you are pushing your culture on hers (hard to argue otherwise). Many of us have a habit of tipping no matter what.

* Weekend millionaires will always be around.

* Only (the combined group of) punters control the inflation.

* The argument can be good for the board.

[QUOTE=Rick Rock; 1462400]Oh really?

From Wikipedia: "The economy of Japan is the third largest in the world by nominal GDP, the fourth largest by Purchasing Power Parity and is the world's second largest developed economy."

"The Japanese sex industry prospers and earns an estimated 2. 3 trillion yen (US$24 billion) a year."

Could do the same for South Korea, Hong Kong, Germany, Singapore, etc, which are also top income countries.

Places where prostitution is almost impossible to come by?

From Wikipedia:

"With a GDP per capita of less than $2, 000 in the late 1990s and early 21st century, North Korea remains as one of the world's poorest and least developed countries."

Guess your thesis is blown to bits brother man.[/QUOTE]Very interesting point. I had never thought of that fact, and had always non-chalantly generalized that prostitution was simply correlated to poverty, but its more than that. I think that the women themselves come from poorer areas, but flourishing of the institution of P4P is completely dependent on the culture and how liberal it is. You named some very wealthy industrialized countries: Germany, Hong Kong, Singapore, and not to forget the Netherlands, where it is tolerated (with certain limits) as part of a "live and let live" libertarian philosophy.

[QUOTE=Rick Rock; 1462385]Japanese yes, Koreans not so much. This is a common mistake on these boards. I know plenty of Koreans and know that they are tighter than me when it comes to spending on girls, and much else. As to prices: Korea is a high income country but most things, from food to housing to transportation to mongering is much more inexpensive there than it is in the West. Very easy to score short time in South Korea for 50, 000 won, which is now less than $45. And indeed that's what most Korean guys do when they want to get laid. In and out. They go to girlie bars to hang out with girls more than to buy sex.

All groups have their show offs and idiots. The difference with guys in Asia, Latin America and Africa is that they are more likely to show their wealth to everyone else by buying lots of drinks, making it rain cash, etc (of course Western guys do this too, I've seen countless white men "ring the bell" in several countries).

Korean and Japanese guys are most likely to travel in groups and spend a lot for group drinking or partying. They're not good at talking to women, especially alone, since they've rarely had the chance to do it in their cultures. There are no pubs in Korea where a guy would go to drink alone. Just doesn't exist (except for a select few aimed at foreigners). It's all group seating. That's why they're more likely to drop 100 or 200 buying drinks for ladies only to go home drunk alone.

Western guys are more likely to wander into bars looking like creepy loners, stare at women for a while before buying one a drink-just like they do at home. The difference is in a place like AC they can take out with them instead of going back alone to jack off to porn. They spend their 100 or 200 back in the room where their white Western guilt makes them feel like they need to give a 500% tip.

What about my off the radar spots? I know at least 50 that aren't mentioned anywhere on this board in South Korea, Japan, Dominican Republic, Myanmar and Laos. Less than 10 of those are lower quality. At least a dozen are what I'd call top quality mongering destinations. A few helpful posters who have PM'd me can tell you. Unfortunately I can't share the information publicly, which is why I rarely mention it.

I have introduced plenty of spots to this board like the BJ bar in Otsuka where you get BBBJCIM from two girls in a row for $20. Didn't take long for that to be ruined. A few months after I posted it (and several members visited, at least 6 made field reports) they were running a notice on their website that said "no foreigners." Don't know what happened, but someone messed it up. I can still get in with my frequent customer card, but many others can't. Easy to see how things get ruined.

Or look at the Vietnam threads where guys insisted on tipping $15-30 at places where BBJCIM had been $10 total price for 10 years. Prices were inflated and girls got used to asking for the "new rate" which was purely invented by Western guys with more money than brains or balls.

Barfines at many places in AC are now 2250 for "standard girls." Not even a decade back barfines were going for 1000. 125% increase in a handful of years is reason for alarm in my book.

Yea guys were complaining 10 years ago that the big spenders were going to jack up the prices. That's indeed exactly what happened, so looks like they were right. Others will continue to ignore the advice of seasoned hobbyists until the prices in places like AC come to match Bangkok and then the US and Europe.

Congratulations.[/QUOTE]Very insightful post, that summarizes things well. I particularly appreciate how you understand the Asian cultures. I lived in SF for a long time and have many Korean friends. That group dynamic is just how they party. And it extends beyond that. I once visited Korea and found that it was hard to get a table in a restaurant if you were travelling solo. They found a lone diner to be strange. Their society is more community oriented, whereas our American society is more individualistic.

As for the rising prices, that it just a consequence of a shrinking world. The internet is making the world smaller and smaller. Everybody watches CNN now, and travel is up, despite rising costs of airline tickets. Its a world market. The best we can do is foster online communities like ISG to keep up price solidarity, but eventually, if demand goes up, so do the prices. To get better prices, experienced P4Pers will have to travel to more out of the way places. Romania anyone?

Tipping is one of the least factors which influence the rise in prices. Angeles is just getting more expensive period.

Rents for Bars have risen. Electricity has increased, every bar has backup generators for Brown outs as opposed to the 90s / early 2000s. Taxes on beer recently were increased. The ever increasing rising "Fees / Payoffs" to the powers that be to avoid raids. Wage increases for the girls."Stay Inn" quarters rents have increased.

These factors weigh more on Bar Fine increase way more than big tippers. Which have existed since P4P has.

[QUOTE=Rick Rock;1462393]Wrong. The value is set by the market.[/QUOTE]RR, I am the 'Market' and the value is set by me not you. You are not part of my transactions at all and I decide how much I will pay, period. The same goes for any other individual in this hobby. No one person or group will ever be able to set prices and expect others to follow it. This age old argument will never end and I suspect most of the people complaining are the ones who don't have money to throw around. Don't expect me or anyone else to come down to your level. You can pay what you want but rest assured I'll be paying what I want and I don't care if that pisses you or anyone else off. I fly halfway around the planet to have a great time, not to count pocket change.

RR, I would virtually guarantee you are paying 2 to 5 times as much as I do if you look at it from the perspective as a percentage of yearly salary. Does that make you a fool for spending a higher percentage of your income on tail than I do?

I'm not sure how you could possibly validate the argument you get better service than someone who pays more. These girls are there for one reason; to make money, not to pay 'respect' to you. Yes, you are the one who needs to get a grip. Neither you nor anyone else will ever change what I pay these girls and you're wasting your time trying.

[QUOTE=Rick Rock;1462393]I absolutely guarantee not one of those guys gets better service than me.[/QUOTE]I absolutely guarantee I am getting better service than you.

[QUOTE=OralFanatic;1462783]I am the 'Market' and the value is set by me not you.[/QUOTE]Well said, OF.

I am coming to Angeles in October. First timer. Any bars that have women with fake boobs. I have a thing for fake boobs. But not trannies.

I tried to rtff. Didn't see anything.

I appreciate the help.

Once in a while I have to remind everyone on the forum that those members who insists on paying above market price are obviously commissioned by the girls to say so. For one reason and one reason only. Let them say however much they want to pay. Let them say however more service that they will get. Nuff said.

Spaceman

Actually, it's pretty terribly said. You either have no understanding of basic economic terms or are purposely misusing them to make yourself feel important.

Here, let Wikipedia help you:

"The market rate (or 'going rate') for goods or services is the usual price charged for them in a free market."

In AC (unlike say, Pattaya) the bar fine is all inclusive, which means the market rate is whatever the bar fine is. At the moment, the going rate is 1000-3000 pesos.

You can pay more than that if you have some sort of mental condition, but it doesn't mean it's not the market rate. That's like insisting on giving a car dealership 50000 for a car that normally goes for 40000 and then saying "I'm the market. The market rate is now 50000." No it's not. You overpaid.

Same goes for guys who pay 3 or 4 times more than the going rate for taxis in places like the Philippines. They're not setting new market rates. They're getting ripped off. They get to the same destination me and millions of others do, they just pay more for it because they have more money than brains. Of course taxi drivers will be more likely to try to rip off people who look like those morons in the future, and that's the problem.

Yes yes, some guys will always be assholes who think flaunting money gets them some kind of respect. I've seen enough Mercedes key chains to know that. I write for the consideration of the many others who fall in the middle of the road. Especially the newbies who might read the board and then think giving 100% or 500% tips is the norm. It's not.

[quote]I'm not sure how you could possibly validate the argument you get better service than someone who pays more. These girls are there for one reason; to make money, not to pay 'respect' to you.[/quote]Not surprised that you have this mentality. It usually comes along with big spenders who have never earned real respect or compassion at any time in their life and thus connect everything to money.

I've never had any trouble at all getting laid. If I'm good at anything outside of economics and statistics (my professional fields) , it's bedding women. For the last several years I've been married to a very adventurous bisexual woman who makes getting pussy even easier. When I resort to P4P, which is usually around 100 times a year, it's for the sake of pure convenience. I like going to a place like AC because I can see the bodies before I move. When dealing with civilians you may put in 12 hours. 2 days to get laid only to find out their bodies are no good or they can't fuck. Then you have to go through the process all over again. In AC, I can find someone nice and tight to fuck for a day or two. If she's no good I can replace her in the hour. At the same time I talk to them and treat them like human beings and it goes a long, long way.

How do I know it's not all about money? Because I've fucked a number of working girls without spending a penny. I've had them take me out to dinner and insist on paying for it. I even had a kyabajo take me shopping at an upscale menswear outlet in Tokyo because she liked "dressing me up." She ended up spending close to 1000 US. I only spent about 300 for her services when we met the first time. I've lost count of the number of times I've been in bed with a Filipina, Thai, Cambodian or Chinese girl while they talked on their cellphones with their foreign benefactors about sending them money. Last time I was in AC I had one bar girl sneaking out of work to come sleep with me when her shift ended, while at work she told the guys that tried to take her out that she was on her mens. Paid her 0 pesos (on her insistence). She didn't want me to pay as she didn't want our thing to be based on money. Yep, it happens like that. There was a girl in Sosua back in 1999 who was famous for her sexual skills. If I showed her picture people who monger there would instantly recognize her. Her going rate was 1500 Dominican pesos a pop. She stayed with me for free for a month, making me promise not to tell the Westerner she worked for.

If you don't believe me, no problem. There's plenty of other evidence, like the millions of working girls in Japan, Korea, Dominican Republic, Costa Rica, Thailand, Cambodia, Philippines, etc, who charge guys with money to bang them for an hour only to turn around and hand the money over to their flat-broke boyfriends and husbands. I'd say 25 percent of working girls around the world have significant others with little to know money who they not only bang for free, but also cook and clean for. A lot of the Thai and Filipina girls working in places like Hong Kong and Japan are sending money back to their boyfriends in their home countries even.

When you throw money around you have lots of girls all over you, just like you have lots of friends. Why not? If I saw a balloon dropping money from the sky I'd probably gravitate toward it too. I've also been around enough working girls (I mean really around them; eating at local spots together during their off time; going to their houses, even when those were wooden shacks on stilts in the Cambodian and Laotian provinces; etc) to know that big spenders are seen as nothing more than cash cows. When my wife used to bring strippers from Scores in NYC back to our apartment to party they would often make fun on the pretentious guys who would drop $2000 on private dances and spend the whole time telling the girls how much money they had, how good their jobs were, how much their shoes cost, how nice their boat was, etc. After we laughed we'd throw an Eva Angelina porn on the big screen and have threesomes and foursomes.

What do you when you're out of money? Maybe that won't happen. A lot of people found out in 2008 that it can happen even to the most well off. I know I'll still be okay as far as pussy goes at least.

Money is a great lubricant but it only takes you so far. And for guys like me who monger on an almost daily basis it starts to add up. I'm doing well enough, but I'd rather not drop the equivalent of a few brand new cars each year on getting my nuts off. I especially don't want to see prices double and triple every 5 years for services that are no better than they were before. Maybe you like paying more than you need to. I imagine for most people that sounds ridiculous. Do you insist on paying more than the going rate for food, clothes, tailors, airplane travel, etc? Do you walk around with a BMW hat and pull your sleeve up to show your Rolex to girls from families that subsist on $200 a month? Why?

It's odd.

I can hit other areas. I can hit up my contacts for 1000 p long times. But I still like the convenience of places like AC and even Pattaya where I can sample the wares beforehand. It's definitely convenient. If it gets to the point where I'm paying as much as I would in a top-10 income country though, I'll wipe it off my radar. Many others will too. AC was built by underpaid GIs with little in the way of expendable income. Never forget that.

[QUOTE=Rick Rock;1462871]Money is a great lubricant but it only takes you so far. And for guys like me who monger on an almost daily basis it starts to add up. I'm doing well enough, but I'd rather not drop the equivalent of a few brand new cars each year on getting my nuts off. I especially don't want to see prices double and triple every 5 years for services that are no better than they were before.[/QUOTE]

I have been reading this discussion and I think this is the major difference between people who don't monger as frequently compared to those who do. People who happily pay more and tip big don't see the effects because they are not around long enough. It is their money and they are free to do what they want, but to deny it has an affect on the market is far reaching in my opinion. It is definitely a contributing factor, along with others.

As for me, quality of service has always been in correlation with how I treat the girl opposed to how much money I throw at them.

I think it is easy for a person who only on occasion mongers to not see an issue with tipping. Let's be honest, the service being offered to us is not one we would ever offer ourselves. So for some I think it becomes a moral thing to tip for feeling bad after.

I do believe however, that if some are willing to tip big and pay more without argument, or not care because they like to throw money around, then it will instill the belief in the girls that more are willing to do that and they will ask for more. Whether or not they will back down if you negotiate, the starting market price will be higher.

Those are just some of my thoughts.

FLT.

[QUOTE=Rick Rock;1462871]When my wife used to bring strippers from Scores in NYC back to our apartment to party they would often make fun on the pretentious guys who would drop $2000 on private dances and spend the whole time telling the girls how much money they had, how good their jobs were, how much their shoes cost, how nice their boat was, etc. After we laughed we'd throw an Eva Angelina porn on the big screen and have threesomes and foursomes.[/QUOTE]Ok I read some of your past posts and some other black posters and I have to admit you black guys are the biggest pimps and I try to learn from. But why every time I see a black dude with a chick in Asia she is ugly as fuck. Maybe she will have a decent big ass but it's not impressive when it's attached to a Santa Clause belly and a grand mom face. It makes me wonder if you guys are having impressive results with unimpressive looking women that would lick the first ass that came their way and we all know that stuff is much harder to do with the good looking ones.