General Info

[QUOTE=GenevaGuy;2610163]Absolutely true the chinese vaccines are the old style killed virus and clearly they are much less effective, and yep China sent a bunch to PHIL to use.

GG.[/QUOTE]IMHO, "the old style" vaccines still make up almost all of the other vaccines given worldwide. Some originated from methods not allowed today.

If you have vaccine concerns, old style have a long development and testing history. The production is also longer.

IMHO, the problem with the Chinese vaccines are that raw data and vetting and peer review are not available or not possible. Vaccines need to to be tested and reviewed.

Johnson Johnson vaccine has a one dose system but there are issues. Maybe a 2 dose formulation might be better. I am sure many propeller heads are reviewing the options. One dose would be great.

The good thing is that the China vaccine makers claim it prevents death. That is very important. It is claim also made by the major covid vaccines used in the US.

Version 2.0 covid vaccines are coming soon. All the covid vaccine makers want to ultimately get paid for their vaccines. BioNTech got a big boost from the US donation of its vaccine.

[QUOTE=Dg8787;2610156]You assumed they were vaccinated with Pfizer of Moderna. Which is highly unlikely. More likely vaccinated with CCP Sinovax which is not effective at all.[/QUOTE]My girl got the Johnson (pun intended) and her family got AZ. So I guess those 2 are not effective at all either.

A good friend and her two 20 ish kids got their first Moderna jabs in Malabon on the 30th. Another son got Pfizer about two weeks ago.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2610420]My girl got the Johnson (pun intended) and her family got AZ. So I guess those 2 are not effective at all either.[/QUOTE]You can still get Covid even being doubled vaxxed. Just mild symptoms. Cases on this noted in the press. Maybe she is trying the sympathy card and is wanting you to send lots cash as the family very sick, no breadwinner (except you) etc etc.

IMHO more likely as AZ appears to be very effective longer term some studies state (more than Pfizer. But I don't want a debate on this! I have AZ and is effective IHMO.

[QUOTE=PBtoCobra;2610364]My GF from Davao has had 2 of the Chinese vaccine. She knows about the efficacy of the Western ones and is a little bit pissed that the Chinese one may not protect her and her family as well.[/QUOTE]Money. It is always money.

The creators and manufacturers of vaccine need and want to get paid. Even "free" vaccines through COVAX are paid for by money donations from richer countries. The Pfizer / BioNTech vaccine was actually developed by a Turkish immigrant and his wife in Germany. But the US also did a lot of the basic research.

In the past, Malaysia and Thailand did not want to share avian flu virus samples until they got reassurances that they will get access to affordable vaccines later. China had sequenced the DNA of the virus found in Wuhan but did not want to share the data. Those who share information, especially sensitive ones, were subsequently scrubbed.

China donates some but they want to sell. IMHO the news I see also reported some strings attached.

In either case, whatever vaccine that can be acquired need to be used because of the short shelf life. Most importantly, all the US and WHO approved vaccines are supposedly able to lower or prevent death. Again, if you look at antibody levels 6 month later in BioNTech (600) and China (0) vaccine recipients, is it possibly true what the WHO is saying? Maybe.

It was like a long time when Ethiopia was suffering a famine crisis but they rejected US grain donations because they were genetically modified. IMHO, it is better to avoid starvation / death and eat the genetically modified grain.

Merck is coming out with a Covid pill to reduce hospitalization and prevent death. Pretty pricey at US1,000 per treatment. Pfizer is not far behind with their version. What I don't understand is that propeller heads were looking at this in the beginning. Why did it take so long? Most of the stuff in the Covid pills grew from previous AIDs research.

Oh. Some propeller heads got their BioNTech vaccines are were so confident that they got Covid and died. I watch the Covid situation in Israel closely because most got vaccinated and with BioNTech.

Regarding eye dees. In the old days, the hotel / condo guards would accept most any eye dee a girl had (even if it wasn't hers). They would take it, put it in a drawer, and give it back when the girl departed the residence with no troubling issues. But IMHO, things have changed. Previously many of my girl's eye dee was a sheet of paper, possibly a police clearance (b / w pic of the girl from the local PNP), or a laminated card (such as Phil Health), with the girl's photograph taped onto the card and then laminated over. Those are gone now. Most eye dees now look like your home country's driver's license. They are hard plastic and not laminated. They have a picture and signature area, and either a swipe / black rectangle containing info pertinent to you or your account (like a credit card), or bar / QR code. The have the Philippine flag or the Department's circular logo. Or other Phils insignia ghosted onto the card.

During covid I have had girls turned away from a mall and hotels for not having a 'valid' eye dee. One girl presented a recent police clearance and was rejected. One girl presented her laminated college eye dee and was rejected. Other girls have been rejected for previously-accepted eye dees (ie, Brgy eye dee). In the pic (eye dees accepted for passport application), notice the college eye dee. Shown as valid here, it was rejected at a common ST hotel. One of my regulars was turned away for her previous Phil Health eye dee; the hotel staff called if fake (it might have been, but we've used it before).

Valid eye dees are easy to acquire for girls who have a birth certificate. You / she can apply online for eye dees (ie Postal) and have them delivered (cost I think was p800 for a Postal, 1 week delivery fee was about p75, next-day delivery was p500). More than 20 post offices in NCR are now same-day Postal eye dee production (small extra fee) for walk-in.

The old days of girls producing any old eye dee (or alternately, bluffing the guard by saying: "Its ok, I will vouch for her" or such) are gone. Covid rues have made Guards and staff to be strict. The hotel staff that turned away my girl with the Phil Health laminated card said: "If this is real then you to go Phil Health they will replace it with a real Phil Health card". We walked up the street to a pensionne house I have used before and were rejected at the front desk for the same reason (they had never asked a girl for any eye dee before).

Age: Your residence (and ST hotels) at various times might reject anyone under age 21. "Sir the girl is not yet 21. At this time she can not go inside". But, but, but she has an eye dee and DID YOU SEE THAT ASS?

Notice on the bottom of the pic: "NBI Clearnace is just a supporting document and is not a valid eye dee by itself". Also, a birth certificate is not a valid eye dee.

[QUOTE=SoapySmith;2611007]A good friend and her two 20 ish kids got their first Moderna jabs in Malabon on the 30th. Another son got Pfizer about two weeks ago.[/QUOTE]My mate living in Mindanao and his family are currently down with covid. Vaccinations were promised a month ago but the barangay squashed the idea as 'pfizer' was not safe according to their FB buddies. So now they are dealing with a local health crisis. Not much can really be done if anyone gets sick. Nearest hospital is hours away and has limited resources anyway. It's certainly not a hospital more an infirmary.

These local barangay people should not be making health decisions.

Take care everyone. Get vaccinated with whatever you can get.

P.S.: my local city in RWML has a masseuse who has worked 5 days in different parlours possibly spreading the virus. Certainly it's going ot be a thorny problems if lots of punters get contacted and traced to her happy ending parlours.

[QUOTE=Bushes;2611249]Again, if you look at antibody levels 6 month later in BioNTech (600) and China (0) vaccine recipients, is it possibly true what the WHO is saying? Maybe.[/QUOTE]B: Can you share a link for this info? And what is the WHO saying?

I don't have the link now, but a few months ago there was a graphic posted on social media by the Phils government that showed which vaccine brands had been acquired by the government here (about 8 brands), how many doses of each, how many doses of each were gifted vs paid for, and what the government had paid per dose (when purchased). I believe Pfizer and Moderna were about $20 USD per dose, J-J and Astrazenica were about $15 per dose, and the others were much cheaper, under $10/ dose (Sinovac was $2/ dose). I can't remember if I posted it.

Hypothetical: Consider the cost of vaccinating all 110,000,000 pinoy with the most expensive, such as Pfizer. 110,000,000 x $20 x 2 (doses each) = $4. 4 billion USD. Now consider the costs of the lockdowns: Ayuda ($80 USD) to each family, multiple times (at least twice, for around $3 billion). Closed business revenue. Closed taxation revenue. Increased hospital and DOH expenses paid for by the government. And I don't think we are done with ayuda. Isn't it just cheaper to buy the doses?

[QUOTE=WickedRoger;2611185]You can still get Covid even being doubled vaxxed. Just mild symptoms. Cases on this noted in the press. Maybe she is trying the sympathy card and is wanting you to send lots cash as the family very sick, no breadwinner (except you) etc etc.[/QUOTE]LOL. No. She is a university dean and her family is full of doctors and lawyers. No need for me to be a savior. She has never asked me for 1 peso.

Some good news, the USD / peso is back up above 50:1, working well for me.

[QUOTE=WestCoast1;2611555]B: Can you share a link for this info? And what is the WHO saying?

I don't have the link now, but a few months ago there was a graphic posted on social media by the Phils government that showed which vaccine brands had been acquired by the government here (about 8 brands), how many doses of each, how many doses of each were gifted vs paid for, and what the government had paid per dose (when purchased). I believe Pfizer and Moderna were about $20 USD per dose, J-J and Astrazenica were about $15 per dose, and the others were much cheaper, under $10/ dose (Sinovac was $2/ dose). I can't remember if I posted it.

Hypothetical: Consider the cost of vaccinating all 110,000,000 pinoy with the most expensive, such as Pfizer. 110,000,000 x $20 x 2 (doses each) = $4. 4 billion USD. Now consider the costs of the lockdowns: Ayuda ($80 USD) to each family, multiple times (at least twice, for around $3 billion). Closed business revenue. Closed taxation revenue. Increased hospital and DOH expenses paid for by the government. And I don't think we are done with ayuda. Isn't it just cheaper to buy the doses?[/QUOTE]Was an off the cuff remark from news from people requesting Pfizer booster after China vaccine. To be fair, antibodies are only one indicator. We are still learning.

Money. It is the money. Prices are negotiated and supposedly confidential. Except for AZ which is to be public domain and should drop significantly from your numbers. Moderna took government money and I am not sure what is the deal. EU does not want to relax patent rules for Covid.

Nothing is without risks. For me, myocardial infarction is the same as a heart attack. Especially after reading your numbers. There is Boris' answers to them pile up high.

Thanks to the member who sent this link (abs-cbn website). Pics are numbers vaxxed in phils. Types of vaccines procured (brand, donated, purchased / procured). Percentage vaccinated.

[URL]https://news.abs-cbn.com/spotlight/multimedia/infographic/03/23/21/philippines-covid-19-vaccine-tracker[/URL]

[URL]https://currently.att.yahoo.com/att/cm/got-pfizer-protection-drops-below-155502055.html[/URL]

News from the Pfizer front. The timeframe of the effectiveness of the vax. I would like to see this kind of data for all the brands. From the article:

[I]On Oct. 4, The Lancet published a study that examined the Pfizer vaccine's effectiveness over six months. According to the study, the effectiveness of Pfizer at preventing COVID infection dropped to 47 percent from 88 percent six months after the second dose. However, the vaccine's effectiveness at preventing severe outcomes remained high. Pfizer was 90 percent effective at preventing hospitalization and death related to COVID for at least six months, even as the highly transmissible Delta variant became the most dominant strain of the virus.[/I]

SNIP.

[I]Vaccine effectiveness against the Delta variant began at 93 percent after the first month, then dropped to 54 percent after four months. Meanwhile, against other COVID strains, efficacy fell from 97 percent to 67 percent. "To us, that suggests Delta is not an escape variant that is completely evading vaccine protection," study leader Sara Tartof, PhD, told Reuters.[/I]

[QUOTE=WestCoast1;2611897]Pfizer was 90 percent effective at preventing hospitalization and death related to COVID for at least six months, [/QUOTE]And how would they know these 90% would be dead or hospitalized without their vaccine? Johnson asked today that people have to take more of theirs. They say protection is not waning, but just to have extra protection!

[URL]https://edition.cnn.com/2021/10/05/health/johnson-covid-vaccine-boosters-eua-request/?utm_term=1633430330598397a9f857c1c&utm_source=cnn_Breaking+News&utm_medium=email&bt_ee=%2F1aTQUct9rX0BG4Qb%2F3t3iXCkovEgVypMjEkQH%2BxnaINTHyILIsLqQ74uYZgZvR9&bt_ts=1633430330600[/URL]

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2611913]And how would they know these 90% would be dead or hospitalized without their vaccine?[/QUOTE]Er, the usual methods of enrolling a bunch of people who have been vaccinated and a bunch of people who have not been vaccinated, normalize for the usual parameters like age, sex, gender, socio-economic status and ethnicity, and then compare the number of people in both groups who require hospitalization?