[QUOTE=AnywhereInAsia;1579598] We spotted white girls there twice in bars having drinks with girls.
[/QUOTE]This is the kiss of death!
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[QUOTE=AnywhereInAsia;1579598] We spotted white girls there twice in bars having drinks with girls.
[/QUOTE]This is the kiss of death!
[QUOTE=ThatGuy865;1579220]To say things hasn't changed. One has to be blind or out of touch w / reality. Raids occurred in the past. But not at the frequency rate since 2013.4 or 5 raids a year in the past. Vs. 2 or 3 raids a month now. Plus momasans are remaining in jail w / HT charges pending.
There is no blow road any longer. It has been reduced to 1 or 2 bars left. When there used to be 5 or more. And none do on site service any longer. Raymond street bars have been reduced by 1/2.
A few bars maybe 4 or 5 have no take out at all in no fashion. Those that do, each bar has its own process for taking girls out. If not known, a guy can easily be told, No take out. (neither of which happened or was even a thought 5 yrs ago)...[/QUOTE]This is all true. Things have greatly changed. If you are happy w / mid range 6's then there are plenty of those (85%) IMO. I have no axe to grind, this is my opinion based on my 5 trips, the first trip (2010) being perfect w / out any negative pressure and the lookers were everywhere. I have zero reason to exaggerate or lie.
On my first night in AC a month ago I got my seat at Kokomos and enjoyed the view of ladyboys harassing passerby's, about 15 of them a few feet away from me. That was the first sign that something was different in AC. After my burger I went to 5 bars and saw only plain looking dancers, Tao Bar and the Dollhouse were both dirty and lacking in quality dancers, at that point I was really worried but then I went into Atlantis and it had the same feel as prior trips, clean, well kept, and better dancers, (not as good as 2010 but better than the other bars so far) so I found something special there. I felt I was really lucky.
So I totally agree w / ThisGuy, it's drastically different but still worth going to because of price, friendly ladies, and the variety of bars. Maybe the discos have better talent, I stuck w / the bars and in most cases the one or two lookers would play for drinks only. Not many bars had lookers on the premises, IMO.
[QUOTE=NapaSlapper;1579379]Amavida,
Your love for Angeles is heart warming if blinkered, here's some facts.
There has not been one mamasan or bar owner who had fought in court and won far from it, the only bar owner that has tried to fight the establishment has been in jail for the last 2 years, is in very poor health and is begging on all angeles based boards for donations to keep him alive and pay for his legal team, fully expect him to be held in prison for some years to come until he either dies or finally his case comes before a judge who will not look favourably on a foreigner who decided to sell pinay pussy for a living.
If bar owners / mamasans are lucky enough to be raided by the local police forces then a very large payment, usually in access of 2 million pesos paid by the bar owner will see all released and the bar reopened until the next time it is raided for gain.
If the bar owners / mamasuns are unlucky and the big guns from camp crame with help from the American do good brigade come knocking then money won't get you out of jail, Human traffic charges are brought against those arrested which is an unbailable offence which carries a mandatory 20 years jail time.
The most worrying aspect for mongers is the recent bar arrests of foreigners in bar raids..[/QUOTE]Here I also agree, except w / the last line. AC is a good place to monger and have a good time. It's still worth going to IMO, not for top talent though.
I met this young lady in 2011 at Lost In Asia, a stunner (8) in my book. She would only go w / me if I also took her friend so I passed. Needless to say, I so regret that decision, one of my worst mongering moves ever.
The new AC is lacking when it comes to beauties like this one, I hope the pendulum swings back to a better, less stressful time for AC, w / plentiful talent like in 2010/11.
I have recently come into some more free time and have been considering places to visit. The Philippines is one of my old stomping grounds in my 40 odd years of pursuing this hobby. My last visit was in 2007 and as always I was in seventh heaven. I am disheartened to read, not about the raids which have always occurred, but about the decline in quality.
My experience and apparently that of many mongers, from my reading, is that in most countries there has been a decline in quality, quantity and service. This is so in Europe, Latin America and Asia. My experience is that this started from around 2008. My suggestion for this decline is the great influx of punters, especially from the US, to these destinations.
When I hobbied in Asia, Europe, Latin America, the Caribbean and even the US in the 70's, 80's and 90's I got my information from classifieds, word of mouth on the ground and generally just walking around a city. I would enter clubs and casas and I would be the only foreigner in the place; then, I would get super treatment most of the time for the local rate. However, with the ease of obtaining information from the internet many punters who would otherwise not have visited these places would go visit throwing lots of money around and corrupting the environment.
How would this cause a decline?
(1) Most providers I have spoken to over the years are in this business for a short time to earn enough money for specific purposes, e. G. To pay a debt, medical services for a loved one, studies etc. With the influx of punters the good quality girls go with numerous punters per day and earn their money faster and get out of the business sooner.
(2) With girls going with many Johns every day the quality of service provided by a particular girl is bound to decline; in some cases days after entering the business, in others, weeks or months.
(3) Many newbies mesmerized by what they see, romance these girls and take them out of the business.
I am really sorry to read about the decline in Angeles city as this was one of my favorite destinations, if not my favorite, and back in the early 2000's I thought that I should retire here. Now I am not so sure. I think that the only way for there to be an improvement is for there to be less foreigners going to these destinations. Just my opinion. It would be really unfair for me to wish this as I am a foreigner there myself and everyone is entitled to have fun.
[QUOTE=Turgid;1579687]I am really sorry to read about the decline in Angeles city as this was one of my favorite destinations, if not my favorite, and back in the early 2000's I thought that I should retire here. Now I am not so sure. I think that the only way for there to be an improvement is for there to be less foreigners going to these destinations. Just my opinion. It would be really unfair for me to wish this as I am a foreigner there myself and everyone is entitled to have fun.[/QUOTE]AC is receiving the most [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908][CodeWord908][/url] pressure because it has the "over the top" sex industry and a weak, needy political apparatus.
In Thailand they won't tolerate outside intervention, in the PI it's the opposite because they are extremely weak, corrupt and incompetent.
The USA is being turned into the Political Correctness Police of the world by feminist and the leftwing media. They have successfully removed the word, "prostitution" and replaced it w / a much more powerful term, "human traffic victim" in order to get public support, and so far on the surface it is working like a charm. Hence the raids in the PI.
The demand and supply in the sex industry in the PI is fine but the jailing of prostitutes and their employers have had a powerful (negative) impact on places like AC. That is the sole reason AC is deteriorating right now, IMO.
To feminist / US media in the USA there is no such thing as a willing sex worker. To these over bearing prudes no woman in her right mind would go into such a trade, hence, victim of [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908][CodeWord908][/url].
So I don't agree that there are too many mongers. No, there is a real threat of the loss of individual freedom (Jail) if you're in the sex trade in AC. It's a witch hunt emanating from the politically correct (deep pockets) USA.
AC is getting the most attention because of it's notoriety, i/e You Tube, etc.
For me it's interesting to note that there is opposition to this PC pressure but not from mongers themselves. Most mongers buy into the guilt and feeling of wrong doing when they hire a sweet little thing for intimacy. My opinion.
People in Asia, Latin America, etc. Don't have these hangups, it's business, it can and should be fun for all involved. There should not be any stigmatism w / being a hooker or a hooker lover. My hooker money helps a lot of people in very dire situations and I'm happy to be a part of the scene and spread my seed and my wealth. The more the merrier, right?? That's my 2p for what it's worth, probably not much.
[QUOTE=Socker;1579697]AC is receiving the most [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908][CodeWord908][/url] pressure because it has the "over the top" sex industry and a weak, needy political apparatus.
In Thailand they won't tolerate outside intervention, in the PI it's the opposite because they are extremely weak, corrupt and incompetent.
The USA is being turned into the Political Correctness Police of the world by feminist and the leftwing media. They have successfully removed the word, "prostitution" and replaced it w / a much more powerful term, "human traffic victim" in order to get public support, and so far on the surface it is working like a charm. Hence the raids in the PI.
The demand and supply in the sex industry in the PI is fine but the jailing of prostitutes and their employers have had a powerful (negative) impact on places like AC. That is the sole reason AC is deteriorating right now, IMO.
To feminist / US media in the USA there is no such thing as a willing sex worker. To these over bearing prudes no woman in her right mind would go into such a trade, hence, victim of [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908][CodeWord908][/url].
So I don't agree that there are too many mongers. No, there is a real threat of the loss of individual freedom (JAIL) if you're in the sex trade in AC. It's a witch hunt emanating from the politically correct (deep pockets) USA.
AC is getting the most attention because of it's notoriety, i/e You Tube, etc.
For me it's interesting to note that there is opposition to this PC pressure but not from mongers themselves. Most mongers buy into the guilt and feeling of wrong doing when they hire a sweet little thing for intimacy. My opinion.
People in Asia, Latin America, etc. Don't have these hangups, it's business, it can and should be fun for all involved. There should not be any stigmatism w / being a hooker or a hooker lover. My hooker money helps a lot of people in very dire situations and I'm happy to be a part of the scene and spread my seed and my wealth. The more the merrier, right?? That's my 2p for what it's worth, probably not much.[/QUOTE]Your argument is indeed cogent and compelling but I'm not convinced. From my experience in many countries raids occurred when managers / owners of establishments have failed to continue to make certain payments to certain people. I'll not go into too much detail here. NGO's have always been around, their main concern is to get funding from the US government so they have to show that they are earning it. If the Philippines government is for the continuation of the industry these NGOs can do nothing to curtail it. Remember tourism earns money for the country even if it is sex tourism or romance tourism. The only time that there can be a dramatic decline in the industry is if the government gets really serious about shutting it down as has recently happened in China which has led to the annihilation of P4 P in another of my favorite destinations, Chang Ping. There appears to be no possibility of this happening in the Philippines.
[QUOTE=AnywhereInAsia;1579598]Nothing to worry about, I just got back a few days ago. I actually felt it may have improved since my last visit around Feb.
I've been going for last 7 or 8 years, and each time felt it was slowly getting worse, as I felt Pattaya was too. In terms of quality and availability of free and paid. I put this down to more people going there as both places always seemed to get more busy.
It is still one of the easiest places to get laid in asia and I feel its just a mental thing about people saying here and elsewhere online that its coming to an end. The average tourist there seem to know nothing about it, bars all had customers having a good time and bar fining. (first time I went I was the only young guy I saw, half the bars were empty and there wasnt a single white women) We spotted white girls there twice in bars having drinks with girls.
I was with two friends one 28 the same as me and one 29 yo Indian, Indian was a first timer and another who has been going maybe 4-5 times over the past 2 years. Noone had problems bar fining, or told it wasn't allowed. High society had plenty of girls for both free or paid. Paid was generally 1000 although the indian paid 1500 once when getting desperate at 5 am.
Barfines were around 2000-2700. We bar fined at ponytails, lancealot, shooters (I even got a freebie at Shooters), Golden Calpaso, Bunny Ranch, La Bamba, inquired at others and most were ready. In fact I asked Viking out of interest and was told the price (I forgot now) but last trip I asked and was told not allowed here. Alot of the time I had dates during the day and barhoped and got drunk at night not necessarily taking a girl each night, which was still fun here and I can't see it changing soon. Sure they arnt as crazy and BJ in bar but still easy to have a good time.
What I don't like about this place is it makes me sicker than anywhere else in the world, maybe because the cheap alcohol and lack of food. I drink the local vodka, used to drink the rhum but still both seem to make me more sick than usual. Has anyone else noticed this? Where ever I am I drink to excess on holidays but ac seems the worst.[/QUOTE]Glad you had a good time mate & thanks for providing a balanced field report.
AV.
[QUOTE=AnywhereInAsia;1579598].
It is still one of the easiest places to get laid in asia and I feel its just a mental thing about people saying here and elsewhere online that its coming to an end. The average tourist there seem to know nothing about it, bars all had customers having a good time and bar fining. (
What I don't like about this place is it makes me sicker than anywhere else in the world, maybe because the cheap alcohol and lack of food. I drink the local vodka, used to drink the rhum but still both seem to make me more sick than usual. Has anyone else noticed this? Where ever I am I drink to excess on holidays but ac seems the worst.[/QUOTE]Lack of sleep is first cause.
Excessive alcohol second cause.
Cheap excessive alcohol next cause.
Poor diet there.
Lack of vitamin see except from sunshine.
Poor air quality, and smoking in bars.
Plenty of kissing.
Add all these up and for sure I think many get sick. Body can only take so much.
[QUOTE=Socker;1579697]. . . < SNIP > . . .
To feminist / US media in the USA there is no such thing as a willing sex worker. To these over bearing prudes no woman in her right mind would go into such a trade, hence, victim of [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord908][CodeWord908][/url]. . . <SNIP > . . . [/QUOTE]This is a much more complex issue than simply being the opinion of "over-bearing prudes". I am not carrying a flag for these over-zealous anti-prostitution groups but the situation is not as glib as this.
I doubt very much that ANY woman becomes a sex worker by choice. No amount of rationalization can make me believe that any woman would willingly and regularly want to get into the sex business. I am sure that even the most horny nymphomaniac would still rather be earning money in a different manner than having different unknown guys grunting away on top, sideways or underneath her.
It is all a question of need, and until governments can provide an environment where every resident can gain a worthwhile income then prostitution will remain.
The feminist lobby will keep on pushing and they will have some levels of success but at the end of the day there is a reason why prostitution is known as "the world's oldest profession".
I was just there a few weeks ago. I had a great time. At the same time, I know for a fact that many in demand women were being very particular on who'd they bar fine with. Some women obviously can be more choosy than others and can wait out a night by getting drinks and maybe barfining. I think this has been going on for easily a few years now, but more pronounced now. I know a lot of people come on here and say it doesn't matter what you wear or how you act. I don't really believe that's the case so much anymore, and that's my opinion from what I've witnessed and been told by some I've asked. I've seen well dressed and I think decent looking guys get rejected. I asked one why she didn't go with one and she just said she didn't like him like that. She gets drinks easily with her looks. It is what it is. I think the days of getting by on the fact that you are a foreigner and willing to pay are not such an easy ticket anymore. It can work for a good amount, but it's not such a meal ticket to some of the more attractive women I believe. I think it may be ok for the women who just short time, but on average possibly not.
My suggestion for anyone who may be getting the rejection statements more often is to possibly look at oneself a little more and maybe consider some changes to approach. I personally am lucky that I look a lot younger than I am and keep in decent shape. I try to somewhat control my stomach dimensions that they don't start going crazy but it's not easy. I wear clean clothes and personally try not to look like a slob. I am pretty much a gentleman in the bar. I may try to feel them up a little but I take my time if I do do so by gathering signs and signals from the woman to see if she's ok with me or not. I am not saying that this is fool proof, but I think it helps in scoring some points for the more choosy type of woman.
Also, I was witness to this in both Angeles and Subic. And also, of course it is very possible that the woman may really be on menstruation.
[QUOTE=RedKilt;1579898]I doubt very much that ANY woman becomes a sex worker by choice. [/QUOTE]True. The part-timers, too, have limited options and limited business skills. I would never sell my body but then again at this age no one would buy it hhaha but seriously many of us have struggled financially in our lives causing us to do work that we would rather not. Survival. The journey from survival to success. Share the wealth. Enjoy life and the fruits of your labor and the luscious availability of these nubile, loving, passionate creatures.
[QUOTE=KeyMaster;1579899]I was just there a few weeks ago. I had a great time. At the same time, I know for a fact that many in demand women were being very particular on who'd they bar fine with. Some women obviously can be more choosy than others and can wait out a night by getting drinks and maybe barfining. I think this has been going on for easily a few years now, but more pronounced now. I know a lot of people come on here and say it doesn't matter what you wear or how you act. I don't really believe that's the case so much anymore, and that's my opinion from what I've witnessed and been told by some I've asked. I've seen well dressed and I think decent looking guys get rejected. I asked one why she didn't go with one and she just said she didn't like him like that. She gets drinks easily with her looks. It is what it is. I think the days of getting by on the fact that you are a foreigner and willing to pay are not such an easy ticket anymore. It can work for a good amount, but it's not such a meal ticket to some of the more attractive women I believe. I think it may be ok for the women who just short time, but on average possibly not.
My suggestion for anyone who may be getting the rejection statements more often is to possibly look at oneself a little more and maybe consider some changes to approach. I personally am lucky that I look a lot younger than I am and keep in decent shape. I try to somewhat control my stomach dimensions that they don't start going crazy but it's not easy. I wear clean clothes and personally try not to look like a slob. I am pretty much a gentleman in the bar. I may try to feel them up a little but I take my time if I do do so by gathering signs and signals from the woman to see if she's ok with me or not. I am not saying that this is fool proof, but I think it helps in scoring some points for the more choosy type of woman.
Also, I was witness to this in both Angeles and Subic. And also, of course it is very possible that the woman may really be on menstruation.[/QUOTE]A must read for those who think money is all you need to consistently get great service-this has always been the case, EVERYWHERE. Be a BFE to get the best GFE...
Perhaps the most promising outcome for those who are most carried away by the anti-trafficking movement is that most chickens eventually come home to roost. Somaly Mam has of course been one of the best known mouthpieces among true believers. But now the truth is beginning to come out:
[URL]http://www.newsweek.com/2014/05/30/somaly-mam-holy-saint-and-sinner-sex-trafficking-251642.html[/URL]
The 300+ comments after the article contain some, even from the anti-trafficking crowd, that are beginning to offer sober observations. It may also be helpful that donor fatigue and cynicism are gradually taking their toll in the NGO world more generally.
Now we can perhaps hope that the most gullible of personalities and media folks will be embarrassed enough that they learn to temper their hearts with their brains. Unfortunately, NGOs know well and exploit the fact that donors' purses are more tightly coupled to their heartstrings than their gray matter.
[URL]http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/06/10/nicholas-kristof-somaly-mam_n_5479576.html[/URL]
[QUOTE=Socker;1579682]This is all true.
On my first night in AC a month ago I got my seat at Kokomos and enjoyed the view of ladyboys harassing passerby's, about 15 of them a few feet away from me. That was the first sign that something was different in AC. [/QUOTE]Hmmmm. . . . I am sure that you were sitting at Kokomos. But I do sit there regularly also and I would say that 15 ladyboys harrassing passerbys is somewhat a low probability at Kokomos. I can't recall a similar situation nowadays, but then I am NOT there very late at night and can NOT speak about what happens after approx. 11 PM Back a number of years ago, there were 3 or 4 ladyboys that didn't seem to have anything better to do than to stare down the customers at Kokomos, I know I found it very uncomfortable, maybe that was their intent.
On the other hand, the nightly gathering on the corner of Phillies seems to have grown quite a bit and quite often they like to try to engage a conversation as you are leaving Walking Street. They are NOT overly aggressive and simply ignoring them seems to work.
A lot of the bars seem to employ one or more ladyboys now at some level of customer service, whether as choreographers, cleaning staff or whatever. At one or two of the bars, the girls have introduced me to their "mamasans" that were ladyboys.
I DON'T mean to suggest that there are any ladyboys employed as dancers at these clubs.
Years ago, I was sitting at Kokomos (before Walking Street) when there was some sort of parade of ladyboys all dressed in costumes etc. Not sure what the occasion was but there were probably 500 or more out on parade.
In this past year, I have seen more ladyboys with their "boyfriends" out in public than I can ever recall seeing in all the years I have been coming here. And by "boyfriends", I am referring to foreigner boyfriends and not their pinoy boyfriends or pinay friends which has pretty much always been the case.
Another friend was staying at one of the hotels and he was telling me that a couple of the other guests there had a continual stream of ladyboy guests all day long. It only bothered him a little because I think he was mistaken once or twice as being an interested party.
So. . . . things do seem to be changing.
Munch.
[QUOTE=FreebieFan;1579877]Lack of sleep is first cause.
Plenty of kissing. [/QUOTE]FF, I think you missed on one other thing that might be important. People in all the other countries that we visit are exposed to a whole variety of different bacteria or parasites than quite of few of the 1 rst world countries we come from.
I am NOT a scientist but I believe that it has to be a major contributor to the fact we get affected so readily when the locals seem to be healthy. Whether it is from kissing or some other reason, we get exposed.
I have been here quite a few times and I believe you live here also. I began to wonder how much is maybe transmitted by way of some of the extremely dirty money that we handle here in the Philippines or anywhere for that matter.
I can remember years back that a friend came back to USA with an extremely difficult case of a sore throat. Apparently his tonsils / lymph nodes were covered with a white growth (fungal? / bacterial?) that required several rounds of antibiotics.
First time visitors usually end up the first week with the AC sore throat / cough / fever. I have definitely been a victim in my previous trips. But I have been a lot sicker in Mexico and South Korea.
BUT even the locals get affected somewhat, I chat with enough girls that have "a feever" That can only get worse now! Rainy season is upon us and every Filipino / Filipina knows that the rain will cause the fever. (LOL).
SO. . . Kissing is probably what causes the sickness. More research is required!
Munch.
[QUOTE=Psychman;1579924]A must read for those who think money is all you need to consistently get great service-this has always been the case, EVERYWHERE. Be a BFE to get the best GFE...[/QUOTE]They're still women! And women are. Well, if they were easy to figure out then the sex trade wouldn't be a money maker, would it? It's also a business. Who among you doesn't try to steer their workday towards being pleasant? Next time you're watching a guy get rejected, try recalling the last time you heard someone in your office saying "Oh god, here comes what's his name again" and compare the facial expressions. Sure you HAVE to put with someone while you're getting paid, but you don't have to like it. And sometimes you just want to duck out of a boring meeting.