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  1. #3178
    Quote Originally Posted by Travv  [View Original Post]
    Quote The outcome is basically the same as similar places where restrictions are imposed. ".

    The country of Belarus, which imposed no legal lockdown at all throughout the entire pandemic, has released COVID mortality figures which are broadly in line with other nearby countries which imposed draconian lockdowns.

    After authorities in Belarus refused to put their citizens under lockdown, the global media had a collective hissy fit, with one headline declaring, "One leader looks hell-bent on turning COVID-19 into a catastrophe for his country."

    However, while managing to avoid all the negative impacts of lockdown, the outcome of Belarus' no lockdown policy is far from a "catastrophe..
    Very true! Now, I do think we need to be careful making comparisons between countries. Whether it is social norms, population density, etc. , there are a lot of variables. But yes, studies like Belarus and Sweden should be given consideration. But this is where politics get in the way. We all blame the "other side". That's more important than the truth.

    Here again, I think we (as a people) feel like we have to do something. In reality, what did the shutdowns do? At the onset, I don't think it was a terrible idea. There were real shortage issues with ventilators and PPE. We quickly overcame that. That is about the only thing I'll give the government credit for in this whole mess. (And no, I'm not a big Trump fan.) But slowing the spread made sense early on. But that is all the lockdown did. Slowed the spread. It slowed the inevitable. And frankly, it robbed all of us of months and now years of, well, we all know. This is why I say we have have to learn to live with it. That's not a rosy picture. But I think it's more realistic than believing a shutdown or a mask will actually stop this.

  2. #3177
    Quote Originally Posted by SeaBeeJoe  [View Original Post]
    Your right I misquoted, what i meant to say is that 99.5 percent of Covid deaths are among the unvaccinated.

    https://www.pbs.org/newshour/health/...inated-at-risk

    When scientists developed vaccines to slow the spread of the coronavirus pandemic, their vaccine candidates were judged effective based on whether or not people were hospitalized or died after getting immunized.

    Even with delta, almost everyone who dies from COVID-19 99.5 percent of known cases are unvaccinated people, along with 97 percent of people hospitalized for the illness. That suggests that the vaccines are still highly effective, said USA Surgeon General and Dr. Vivek Murthy during a recent press briefing.

    The CDC is counting vaccinated people who have been hospitalized or died from the coronavirus. Based on data available so far, that very rarely happens.
    I agree with that 100%. That's why I got the vaccine. And barring real complications, I do not understand the hesitancy some have. I stop short of supporting mandates. And showing how heartless I am, I don't lose a lot of sleep worrying about those that choose to avoid the vaccine. (Obviously, those with conditions that prevent them from getting the shot is painfully tragic.).

    But I do think we were misled. Our politicians and our leaders all said this would end the pandemic. Reality is that it might slow the spread for a time but it is crystal clear that it will not stop it. I suspect we're heading to an annual flu shot type approach. And I'm fine with that. What I'm not ok with is forever altering our lives to masks and shutdowns. I will not be held responsible for deaths of those that don't want to help themselves, particularly when there is no real end in sight.

  3. #3176

    99.5 percent of Covid deaths among the unvaccinated

    Quote Originally Posted by Dcrist0527  [View Original Post]
    Respectfully, your 99.5% figure is wrong. You are confusing the percent of vaccinated that have tested positive with the percent of new infections. While it sounds like I am splitting hairs, in fact, those figures tell very different stories.

    The 99% figure represents the number of vaccinated that have not tested positive. That number, however, is very misleading. Most breakthrough cases are asymptomatic. So we have no way of knowing the real number because the vast majority of asymptomatic, vaccinated people are not getting tested. And why would they.

    As for new infections: that metric is not readily available. The CDC is not providing a lot of hard data, which is curious. But a few weeks ago, they estimated about 35,000 breakthrough positive tests every week. If we take that as fact, over 10% of new infections were breakthrough cases. Two very important considerations:

    1-That 35,000 figure does not represent any asymptomatic cases. Again, when vaxxed and exhibiting no symptoms, they just aren't testing.

    2-This is a game changer when you look at it from transmission standpoint.

    To your larger point, I agree. People should get vaccinated. It greatly improves their situation should they contract Covid. But I just don't want people to misinterpret the misleading math being pushed. (Pushed by our so called experts, not you, SeaBee).
    Your right I misquoted, what i meant to say is that 99.5 percent of Covid deaths are among the unvaccinated.

    https://www.pbs.org/newshour/health/...inated-at-risk

    When scientists developed vaccines to slow the spread of the coronavirus pandemic, their vaccine candidates were judged effective based on whether or not people were hospitalized or died after getting immunized.

    Even with delta, almost everyone who dies from COVID-19 99.5 percent of known cases are unvaccinated people, along with 97 percent of people hospitalized for the illness. That suggests that the vaccines are still highly effective, said USA Surgeon General and Dr. Vivek Murthy during a recent press briefing.

    The CDC is counting vaccinated people who have been hospitalized or died from the coronavirus. Based on data available so far, that very rarely happens.

    Seems the numbers have fallen some on vaccine protection against the delta variant, but at least they do protect against hospitalization.

    https://www.reuters.com/business/healthcare-pharmaceuticals/moderna-may-be-superior-pfizer-against-delta-breakthrough-odds-rise-with-time-2021-08-09/

    The mRNA vaccine from Pfizer (PFE.N) and BioNTech (22UAy.DE) may be less effective than Moderna's against the Delta variant of the coronavirus, according to two reports posted on medRxiv on Sunday ahead of peer review. In a study of more than 50,000 patients in the Mayo Clinic Health System, researchers found the effectiveness of Moderna's vaccine against infection had dropped to 76% in July - when the Delta variant was predominant - from 86% in early 2021. Over the same period, the effectiveness of the Pfizer/BioNTech vaccine had fallen to 42% from 76%, researchers said. While both vaccines remain effective at preventing COVID hospitalization, a Moderna booster shot may be necessary soon for anyone who got the Pfizer or Moderna vaccines earlier this year, said Dr. Venky Soundararajan of Massachusetts data analytics company nference, who led the Mayo study.

  4. #3175
    Quote Originally Posted by Travv  [View Original Post]
    Quote The outcome is basically the same as similar places where restrictions are imposed. ".

    The country of Belarus, which imposed no legal lockdown at all throughout the entire pandemic, has released COVID mortality figures which are broadly in line with other nearby countries which imposed draconian lockdowns.

    After authorities in Belarus refused to put their citizens under lockdown, the global media had a collective hissy fit, with one headline declaring, "One leader looks hell-bent on turning COVID-19 into a catastrophe for his country."

    However, while managing to avoid all the negative impacts of lockdown, the outcome of Belarus' no lockdown policy is far from a "catastrophe.".
    On 1 November, Belarusian borders were closed for foreign citizens, with the exception of diplomats, persons entering Belarus through the Minsk National Airport, Russian citizens transiting Belarus on their way to Russia and a number of other categories of people related to transportation of goods, mail, organ transplants, functioning of the Chernobyl Nuclear Power Plant and the Chernobyl Exclusion Zone.

    On 5 November, Mogilev became the first city in Belarus to introduce compulsory use of facial masks in public places.

    On 9 November, compulsory use of facial masks was introduced in Gomel Region.

    According to the 11 November Ministry of Health decree, PCR-based tests were no longer conducted for first-level contacts with an asymptomatic infection course.

    On 12 November, compulsory use of facial masks was introduced in Minsk. As of date, besides Minsk, Gomel Region and Mogilev, such measure was reported to had been employed in Babruisk, Asipovichy, Klichev, Krichev, Chavusy District, Cherykaw District, Polotsk District and Novopolotsk.

    On 16 November, compulsory use of facial masks was introduced in Vitebsk Region.

    On 18 November, compulsory use of facial masks was introduced in Brest Region.

    On 7 December, an epidemiologically motivated partial closure of Belarusian borders was announced in the governmental decree No. 705, according to which, since 21 December, Belarusian citizens and residents of Belarus were to be temporarily prohibited from leaving Belarus via land, except for a limited number of cases. Duration of the prohibition was not specified in the document.

    Suspected statistics falsification.

    According to the Gomel Region media resource "Flaghshtok" citing a relative of a deceased COVID-19 patient, as of July, 2021, around 60 intensive care unit COVID-19 patients were buried in Gomel daily by a single burial services company. It was also reported that the death certificate of the mentioned patient indicated "heart failure" as the main cause of death and had no mention of COVID-19 despite the patients' medical history.

    According to the data obtained by the Belarusian "Cyberpartisans" hacker group via the Belarusian Ministry of Internal Affairs' passport database, excess mortality in Belarus in the March, 2020, to March, 2021, period comprised more than 32,000 deaths (14 times the official statistics for the same period), with approximately 25,000 deaths having had happened during 2020.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COVID-...mic_in_Belarus

  5. #3174

    No Lockdown. Belarus Reports COVID Mortality Rates Similar to Countries W Lockdowns

    Quote The outcome is basically the same as similar places where restrictions are imposed. ".

    The country of Belarus, which imposed no legal lockdown at all throughout the entire pandemic, has released COVID mortality figures which are broadly in line with other nearby countries which imposed draconian lockdowns.

    After authorities in Belarus refused to put their citizens under lockdown, the global media had a collective hissy fit, with one headline declaring, "One leader looks hell-bent on turning COVID-19 into a catastrophe for his country."

    However, while managing to avoid all the negative impacts of lockdown, the outcome of Belarus' no lockdown policy is far from a "catastrophe."

    Newly released overall death statistics from the start of the pandemic up to March 2021 show that the death rate is similar to neighboring countries such as Latvia, Russia and Ukraine which imposed full lockdowns. Indeed, when compared to Poland, which imposed a particularly harsh lockdown, Belarus' mortality rate in March 2021 was significantly lower. . . Belarus is similar to Sweden, which has suffered fewer than 15,000 COVID deaths despite refusing to impose a lockdown. Figures show that cases and deaths tend to fall in waves whether a lockdown is imposed or not, proving that lockdowns are totally pointless. Quote.

    John Paul Watson.

    Definitely. Need more vaccinations and more lockdowns! Believe Fauci! Yeah! LOL.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dcrist0527  [View Original Post]
    Respectfully, your 99.5% figure is wrong. You are confusing the percent of vaccinated that have tested positive with the percent of new infections. While it sounds like I am splitting hairs, in fact, those figures tell very different stories.

    The 99% figure represents the number of vaccinated that have not tested positive. That number, however, is very misleading. Most breakthrough cases are asymptomatic. So we have no way of knowing the real number because the vast majority of asymptomatic, vaccinated people are not getting tested. And why would they.

    As for new infections: that metric is not readily available. The CDC is not providing a lot of hard data, which is curious. But a few weeks ago, they estimated about 35,000 breakthrough positive tests every week. If we take that as fact, over 10% of new infections were breakthrough cases. Two very important considerations:
    .

  6. #3173
    Quote Originally Posted by SeaBeeJoe  [View Original Post]
    Just get vaccinated it is 88% percent effective against hospitalization. (99.5 percent of new infections of Covid in the US are among the unvaccinated.
    Respectfully, your 99.5% figure is wrong. You are confusing the percent of vaccinated that have tested positive with the percent of new infections. While it sounds like I am splitting hairs, in fact, those figures tell very different stories.

    The 99% figure represents the number of vaccinated that have not tested positive. That number, however, is very misleading. Most breakthrough cases are asymptomatic. So we have no way of knowing the real number because the vast majority of asymptomatic, vaccinated people are not getting tested. And why would they.

    As for new infections: that metric is not readily available. The CDC is not providing a lot of hard data, which is curious. But a few weeks ago, they estimated about 35,000 breakthrough positive tests every week. If we take that as fact, over 10% of new infections were breakthrough cases. Two very important considerations:

    1-That 35,000 figure does not represent any asymptomatic cases. Again, when vaxxed and exhibiting no symptoms, they just aren't testing.

    2-This is a game changer when you look at it from transmission standpoint.

    To your larger point, I agree. People should get vaccinated. It greatly improves their situation should they contract Covid. But I just don't want people to misinterpret the misleading math being pushed. (Pushed by our so called experts, not you, SeaBee).

  7. #3172
    Quote Originally Posted by KoolBeans  [View Original Post]
    Agree! Should conduct basic hygiene and hope the lady does as well. I usually see the pros just wash pussy and ass and then head back down. I don't think they clean their breasts after they've been salivated all over. Also probably should provide mouth wash just in case the tongue got it on the back of their throats. As long as you keep it doggy with her head in the hallway, then should be safe. You definitely dont want to be face to face as it is cat 5 biohazard and might be carrying the next variant from Brazil or Russia. Everyone should carry their antigen kits to test on the spot and costs $140 a pop. Makes for a super fun night I heard.
    Just get vaccinated it is 88% percent effective against hospitalization. (99.5 percent of new infections of Covid in the US are among the unvaccinated.

  8. #3171
    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainSolo  [View Original Post]
    For over 200 years, doctors, nurses, hospital workers all over the world have been scrubbing their hands and arms, wearing masks, gloves, sterilized garments ect to minimize catching or spreading infection.

    Why are we now doubting these basic hygiene measures?

    The ease of transmission and high risks of CoVid infection, with lots of unknown long-term effects, pain, death, high costs of hospitalization to everyone in the world, dictates that everyone must do everything using all means they can at individual level to contain its spread.

    Wombat is right. It's not a difficult choice. When in doubt err on the safe side. Mask up, glove on, scrub your hands after picking on bar girls' anus and kittles, pucker up and hope the virus won't' kill you, your bar GFs, friends, family, children.
    Agree! Should conduct basic hygiene and hope the lady does as well. I usually see the pros just wash pussy and ass and then head back down. I don't think they clean their breasts after they've been salivated all over. Also probably should provide mouth wash just in case the tongue got it on the back of their throats. As long as you keep it doggy with her head in the hallway, then should be safe. You definitely dont want to be face to face as it is cat 5 biohazard and might be carrying the next variant from Brazil or Russia. Everyone should carry their antigen kits to test on the spot and costs $140 a pop. Makes for a super fun night I heard.

  9. #3170
    Quote Originally Posted by WombatEd2  [View Original Post]
    Whether to believe what pretty much all the doctors, scientists, and health officials are telling me, or to believe what some self-appointed pundit on a monger website is telling me. (No, I'm not talking about you; I'm talking about that OTHER self-appointed pundit!) (grin).

    Given that my life, and the lives of those I care about, are on the line, I'm going to err on the side of caution.

    Wearing a mask may not exactly be the "silver bullet". But I have every reason to believe that it's a good bit safer than NOT wearing one.
    Hey man,

    I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything. I have no medical expertise. My biggest claim to fame in that field may be passing high school Biology. If anyone takes any medical advice from me, God help them!

    I get the err on the side of caution. As I've said, I got to believe masks help to some degree.

    My purpose for opening my pie hole was not to claim any virology expertise. My hope is that people really start to think and challenge what the group think is. You are absolutely right. Virtually all doctors, scientists, etc agree. But what have those experts accomplished? We've done it their way and we are literally no better off right now.

    I'll tell you why I do not believe pretty much anything they say. My quote from Fauci is accurate. Everyone will say 'circumstances change' and of course they do. But Fauci has directly contradicted himself more times than I can count.

    What's coming? Not exactly a bold prediction here. But this will be so telling. For the last few weeks, Fauci is telling us how the booster shot is unnecessary. But we follow the science, right? The data, Pfizer, Moderna. The science tells us that Fauci is wrong. Soon, Fauci will change his mind yet again and tell us we will all die without that booster shot. I would bet a year's salary on this. It's predictable. So he's either lying to us now, or he's an idiot and not following the science. Or both. But this is the leader of that group of all doctors, scientists. This is the guy that so many follow blindly. I don't care if it's a scientist, a car salesman or a plumber. I run from someone with a track record like his.

    I'm done talking about this topic. Sadly, we're all entrenched in our beliefs. But I do hope we all start to think for ourselves and evaluate our so called experts on their results. It's a scary proposition because, honestly, I don't think we have answers.

  10. #3169
    Quote Originally Posted by Dcrist0527  [View Original Post]
    LOL Because I don't agree that the molecular size of Covid doesn't equate to "spray paint fumes"?

    Or because I look at facts. Sweden deaths have outperformed most nations, without implementing mask mandates. That's just a fact.

    As a nation, case counts were the highest when mask compliance was at its peak.

    But don't take my word for it. Let's see what God's gift to science has to say about it:

    "wearing a mask might make people feel a little bit better and it might even block a droplet, but it's not providing the perfect protection that people think that it is."

    Perhaps science isn't for Lord Fauci either?
    Sure. Whatever. I'll send a note to the American Medical Association telling them the entire medical establishment is wrong with masking because of your personal theories and perception of data.

  11. #3168

    Not A Difficult COVID Choice

    For over 200 years, doctors, nurses, hospital workers all over the world have been scrubbing their hands and arms, wearing masks, gloves, sterilized garments ect to minimize catching or spreading infection.

    Why are we now doubting these basic hygiene measures?

    The ease of transmission and high risks of CoVid infection, with lots of unknown long-term effects, pain, death, high costs of hospitalization to everyone in the world, dictates that everyone must do everything using all means they can at individual level to contain its spread.

    Wombat is right. It's not a difficult choice. When in doubt err on the safe side. Mask up, glove on, scrub your hands after picking on bar girls' anus and kittles, pucker up and hope the virus won't' kill you, your bar GFs, friends, family, children.

  12. #3167

    A Difficult COVID Choice

    Whether to believe what pretty much all the doctors, scientists, and health officials are telling me, or to believe what some self-appointed pundit on a monger website is telling me. (No, I'm not talking about you; I'm talking about that OTHER self-appointed pundit!) (grin).

    Given that my life, and the lives of those I care about, are on the line, I'm going to err on the side of caution.

    Wearing a mask may not exactly be the "silver bullet". But I have every reason to believe that it's a good bit safer than NOT wearing one.

  13. #3166
    Quote Originally Posted by Jackie888  [View Original Post]
    I don't think science is for you.
    LOL Because I don't agree that the molecular size of Covid doesn't equate to "spray paint fumes"?

    Or because I look at facts. Sweden deaths have outperformed most nations, without implementing mask mandates. That's just a fact.

    As a nation, case counts were the highest when mask compliance was at its peak.

    But don't take my word for it. Let's see what God's gift to science has to say about it:

    "wearing a mask might make people feel a little bit better and it might even block a droplet, but it's not providing the perfect protection that people think that it is."

    Perhaps science isn't for Lord Fauci either?

  14. #3165
    Quote Originally Posted by Sol12  [View Original Post]
    Really you are trying to compare the mask for spray painting droplets to the droplets of this virus? So basically you are just going to wear a mask for the rest of your life because you are paranoid about getting sick? So I guess if I have a peanut allergy I just need to let the while work know not to eat nuts around me and they must do as I wish. I have no responsibility for protecting my life at all. That's a great way to go thru life.
    I'm afraid that no one will be able to explain it to you. To maximize your survivability, it is best if you host a Covid party while California hospitals are not at full capacity so that you are ensured a hospital bed.

  15. #3164
    Quote Originally Posted by Dcrist0527  [View Original Post]
    Well, how do you explain Sweeden?

    Or how do you explain the San Francisco hospital outbreak? If hospital staff, who are, in theory, experts at controlling viral spread, have an outbreak with their PPE availability, a cloth face covering is our answer? Not buying it. Does it help? Of course it does! Would it have stopped Covid? No. No way in hell. Even Lord Fauci admitted as much.

    I believe we know very little about this virus, as evidenced by the results. But our experts have to say something, right? Wear a mask! Get vaxxed! But yet on it rages. And I would feel very differently if we didn't have breakthrough cases. But our experts sold us this vaccine as something it is not. If we take the CDC figures as fact, we have at least, and very conservatively, 10% of new cases are breakthrough cases. But again, they tell us most of the breakthrough cases are asymptomatic. Which means we don't have a clue how many carriers are out there because there is no reason for an asymptomatic vaccinated person to be tested.

    I realize I sound like a conspiracy theorist. But damn, our leaders have been wrong at every turn. We're no closer to a solution yet we still hang on their every word? No thank you.
    I don't think science is for you.

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