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  1. #25
    Thanks for your advice, Jake.

    I already understood that a trip, also as short as 7-10-14 days maximum, to Russia is not good value for money, especially for mongering, for the overall actually, as far as I'm concerned. The thing I mind first, about my holidays, is the cost, then the ratio with sex, obviously with as beautiful as possible girls (in my likes Eastern Europeans) , and then the easiness of the mission. Russia busts up by far all my parameters, it was quite tough in the past, it's hopeless now. I "missed the train" many years ago, postponing too much. Now I'm definitely aware and ready to cancel the mongering purpose, but still want to visit it somewhere somehow. It would be the first holiday of my life non-sex-oriented, maybe I'm aging, LOL.

    Currently I'm busy planning this year's trips, all in "easy" and reasonably cheap places (apart from Germany) , I do all the work by myself (accommodations, flights, etc.). Eventually I'll check about cruises and travel agencies for Russia, I know I'll need to book in advance of maybe 2-3 months, but summertime is still far. I got some 3-4 trips scheduled before the supposed Russian one, so I must take care of their organization first, because they are "sure to happen", the "dream" might slip again into second line and undefined future. When I have news about the "research" I'll post.

    Cheers

  2. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by EastGoing  [View Original Post]
    Not joking, one day, in a probably far future, I'd like to take the Transiberian train from Moscow to Vladivostok, another "Russian dream" I've always had.
    My dream-trip also, but with stops of three to ten days in each interesting city crossed. Which means a three-months journey. (smile)

    I think that people who do the route "directly" (just with a few stops) do it with an underlying wish to brag about the fact that they traveled this distance, as a priori little of the route between Moscow and Vladivostok is stunning scenery, save Baikal and Ural.

    Anyway there is some 90 possible stops (count at least two scheduled dates, therefore fucks, per stop). Lingering, exploring and roaming this route must be a FABULOUS trip. I would kill for the chance to do it.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by EastGoing  [View Original Post]
    I agree on the value of visiting Russia, it has always been a dream to fulfill for me, but I'm wondering if, how and for how much I will ever lay a Russian girl in her own country. I've read the reports of a spanish guy, about one week in both Moscow and STPB, and zero score! LOL!
    EG,

    So much depends on attitude. If you come to Moscow with the idea that you are going to have sex with a runway model for $100, then don't bother coming to Moscow. Not going to happen. In fact, if you are going to come to Moscow for a "sex vacation", save your money. Far better places to go in terms of value for $$$. Having said that, the chances of "laying a Russian girl in her own country" (as you put it) are excellent if you are willing to invest a little time and effort. Moscow is a large city of 16+ million people where the ratio of "fuckable" women is clearly in our favor. It has got to be the "one night stand" capital of world. OK, maybe that's a bit of a ridiculous statement. But Moscow gals have to be some of the most sexually liberated and open minded women anywhere. If you read these pages, pay particular attention to the exploits of our dearly departed comrade, Dr. Skank (I don't mean dead, I just mean departed from this board) who made an art form of screwing Moscow chicks. And I am not talking about prostitutes, I mean "normal" girls. Not that there's anything wrong with pros, it's just that if you are intent on pros, Moscow is the WRONG CITY in terms of value for $$$$.

    Don't give up on the dream, just temper your expectations. I know that's easy for me to say because I live here, but every city has it's "secret code", you just need to figure out what works for you. And the only way to do that, I am afraid, is to come here and give it a try.

    Jake

  4. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Stravinsky  [View Original Post]
    Tiny little apartments. 50/60 sq. Meters, are going for 200 to 300K USD. And this is outside the MKAD. The prices only go up as you get closer to the center.
    Just for the record.

    Accidentaly, I bumped today on an article that said that the cheapest apartment sold in 2012 in Moscow was a 22 square meters studio, located Khimki prospect, very near the Ring Road and near the metro Skhodnenskaïa, at a price of 3, 5 millions rubles (which is about 86 000 €, so about 4 000 € per square meter).

  5. #21

    Better to travel by Google Earth? LOL

    strav,

    i finally bothered to read some pages of a few russia threads. i've read posts of you and monsieur prosal already saying, in march 2011, two years ago, that russia had got too expensive and stuff like that, including a former referement to the recently mentioned here tashkent. i also learnt that in saint petersburg normally you get covered bj! i'm speechless! for that much money also! i don't know if i must laugh or weep!

    i agree on the value of visiting russia, it has always been a dream to fulfill for me, but i'm wondering if, how and for how much i will ever lay a russian girl in her own country. i've read the reports of a spanish guy, about one week in both moscow and stpb, and zero score! lol! could i tolerate that? probably an organized tour from an agency, or a cruise, would also help me to "find an excuse" for not scoring, due to short time available to be there, and even less to be alone. to make you laugh, i "declared" poland a place mongers should avoid for much less, my reports from there were a mixture of disillusion and desperation, i didn't expect it to be so bad, and know i'm still planning to go to russia inspite of already knowing the overwhelming difficulties and the sure total failure of the mission, at least mongering-related. as i wrote previously, my russian is pratically an absolute zero. i don't want to hire interpreters, nor to pay outrageous (adjective properly used by prosal when talking abot the cost of his visa) prices for a girl (it's against my principles before than against my wallet) , an accommodation or whatever else, so my chances to comply with my "obligations" are really low, not only referring to mongering.

    about cruises, i was thinking to one in the baltic sea, just to see more places in one go and have the chance to put the flag on the "motherland". in the past i had discharged the cruises from moscow to stpb (or viceverse) because i thought i would have had many troubles for hunting and scoring, which at that time was the main purpose of the trip. but now that i've reached the peace of mind, heart and (unfortunately) dick about sex on the russian field i'll give this option priority in my searches, even if i remember that this was (i'm not updated) by far more expensive. not joking, one day, in a probably far future, i'd like to take the transiberian train from moscow to vladivostok, another "russian dream" i've always had.

    thanks for your kind attention

  6. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Stravinsky  [View Original Post]
    And while rents may not have increased, the cost of buying an apartment in Moscow is absolutely amazing, IMHO. Tiny little apartments. 50/60 sq. Meters, are going for 200 to 300K USD. And this is outside the MKAD. The prices only go up as you get closer to the center.
    Don't know about the prices outside the Ring Road, but inside it's more like 10 000 us$/square meter, and up to 20 000-25 000 us$/square meter for high-end buildings and prime location.

  7. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by EastGoing  [View Original Post]
    Russia has become a country for wealthy tourists or money-splashers. I haven't even bothered to read Russia threads knowing that I would lose the will to even only try.
    EG,

    This is sort of true, and it sort of isn't.

    A good part of that $5, 000 is what I call the "tourist premium". If you speak no Russian, or perhaps more correctly, if you have no interest in speaking Russian, then your options will be limited and you will have to pay a significant premium to provide the accommodation you need to be comfortable while you are in Moscow.

    However...

    Moscow is a galaxy of sexual possibilities. If you can speak a little Russian, then it's something akin to stepping through the looking glass, into a whole 'nother world that is invisible to most tourists. And I'm not talking about reading Война и Мир (War and Peace).

    If you can carry on a simple phone conversation, and can find your way into a salon like Fantasys or Charmel, then you will find women of the same quality at Aurora 911 or Night Flight for a fraction of the price. And if you can navigate your way through a website like sextalk.ru or intimcity.nl, then you can find women for less than what you will pay at an FKK in Germany.

    In any event, you should visit Russia, sex or no sex. It's a beautiful, fascinating country and culture, absolutely unique. I have always wanted to take one of the river cruises from Piter to Moscow. You will have 3 or 4 days in each city, with the onus of visas and registration on someone else's head. Plus, on the way, you will stop in places that most tourists will never see. Who knows what you will find there?

    If I only had the time. (sigh)

    счастливо

  8. #18
    Jake,

    You are the man-on-the-ground in Moscow, so I will defer to your experience. I'm sure you are right about the average office or clerical worker.

    My info comes from personal friends and associates who live and work in Moscow. These are people who own their own business or manage a business and, from what they tell me, they are doing as well as anyone here in the U.S., maybe better. Of course, that's not saying much, nowadays.

    And while rents may not have increased, the cost of buying an apartment in Moscow is absolutely amazing, IMHO. Tiny little apartments. 50/60 sq. Meters, are going for 200 to 300K USD. And this is outside the MKAD. The prices only go up as you get closer to the center.

    So, it seems to me that a lot really has changed in the last 12 years. Be that as it may, I'm sure we can both agree: the days when you could impress a Moscow girl by buying her a "Tveeks" bar are long gone and are never coming back.

  9. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Stravinsky  [View Original Post]
    A lot has changed in the last 12-odd years. The typical salary for a professional person, living and working in Moscow, is the same, or maybe more, than in the USA or Western Europe.
    Strav,

    I have to take issue with ONLY this point. Salaries in Moscow are still significantly below those of similar professionals working in Western Europe and certainly America. And clerical staff? Forget-about-it. Very low by Western standards. Rents and food are about the same as they have been over the past few years making Moscow one of the most expensive places to live. Just an FYI.

    Jake

  10. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Prosal  [View Original Post]
    Airbnb is IMO a better option (and more humanly priced) that has made the rental agencies outdated
    You're right, there are a lot of ways to rent a perfectly nice apartment in Moscow for half the price, but. . . None of these apartments will be located on Tverskaya, across the street from Night Flight, around the corner from Fantasys and within stumbling distance of Aurora 911.

    For you and me, it's not a problem. But someone who can't even read the street signs will need all the help they can get.

  11. #15
    [QUOTE=EastGoing; 1371066]

    Quote Originally Posted by Stravinsky  [View Original Post]
    With 5000$ I can afford many holidays, great time and little or no hassle.
    With 5000 us$ you can spend one month to live like a king in Tashkent (accommodation, fine dinners, multiples drinks in strip bars and clubs every night, daily P4P, ect). Granted, this is not Russia, but it's still FSU.

  12. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Stravinsky  [View Original Post]
    Your best bet is to forget about the hotels and stay in an apartment. Moscow-star. Com is a reliable apartment rental agency that caters to Western tourists. You should be able to get a nice apartment with an excellent location in the center of town for around $200 a night, maybe less.
    Airbnb is IMO a better option (and more humanly priced) that has made the rental agencies outdated (whatever the destination). Owners seem all aware of the registration process, and most even offer to help for the invitation. I had to cancel my January trip to Ekaterinburg but made a reservation through Airbnb, very simple process. And when I cancelled, I had a full refund (minus fees).

    https://www.airbnb.com/s/Russia--Moscow

  13. #13

    Alternative solutions

    [QUOTE=Stravinsky; 1371010]Sorry to tell you, but your best chance to visit Russia was probably in 2005. There are a lot of guys who will argue this, but the Golden Age of mongering in Russia is over. The choice is yours.

    I fully agree with you, Strav. Russia has become a country for wealthy tourists or money-splashers. I haven't even bothered to read Russia threads knowing that I would lose the will to even only try. With 5000$ I can afford many holidays, great time and little or no hassle. There is no city and no accommodation on earth I'd pay 200$ a night in the same way as I'd never (or nearly never) pay a girl 500$ for 1 or 2 hours, especially when I could have had them for a ridiculous amount. I already exposed here my considerations about Ukraine and Cuba, I can add that I'll go to Germany in a couple of months, and I think I'll go only once in a FKK, just to see what they are like by my own eyes, I can't imagine to fork out 80 euros just to enter and not touch a girl yet! Instead, I'll head to flatrate clubs or normal P4P places. This just to give you a clue of my "maximizing mentality" about investing money for getting laid.

    You guessed right about my knowledges of culture and language, very close to absolute zero, I can hardly "read" cyrillic (another obstacle) , and I only know a few phrases. But I'd love to visit Russia for itself and for my "collection", not just for mongering, which I can do indeed without going up there. Furthermore, I have already laid many Russian girls out of their motherland.

    Since it seems too tough to do everything alone, I considered two alternative solutions:

    1) Travel agencies. The last time I tried, in 2005, there were travel agencies offering to group tourists 7, maybe even 10 days, flight + accommodation + city visits for close to 2000 euros, which I judged too expensive, and still would have to budget for girls. I'll check some to see updated offers;

    2) In summertime there are cruise ships in the Baltic Sea, I may not get acquainted with Russian culture and living, but I would have the possibility to put my flag on the land, in Saint Petersburg, and during my visit I might even score a girl, obviously for an acceptable price!

    I don't know when, I don't know how, but I'm sure that soon or later, in a way that I'll reckon "fair", I will!

    As of now, thanks for your infos and suggestions. Carry on posting useful stuff.

    Pribet (couldn't manage to get cyrillic letters posted)

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by EastGoing  [View Original Post]
    But I see my final conclusions have not been questioned, which means they are not too wrong.
    EG,

    Sorry to tell you, but your best chance to visit Russia was probably in 2005. There are a lot of guys who will argue this, but the Golden Age of mongering in Russia is over. Doesn't mean Russia isn't still full of gorgeous babes and plenty of opportunities to meet them, but you will have to work a lot harder and pay a lot more, for everything. A lot has changed in the last 12-odd years. The typical salary for a professional person, living and working in Moscow, is the same, or maybe more, than in the USA or Western Europe.

    I imagine that you are like most Western tourists: know nothing about Russian culture or history and don't speak a word of Russian. That said, probably best to start with a trip to Moscow. There are more opportunites there to meet women for sex and it's a city that is more accustomed to accommodating foreigners.

    Your best bet is to forget about the hotels and stay in an apartment. Moscow-star. Com is a reliable apartment rental agency that caters to Western tourists. You should be able to get a nice apartment with an excellent location in the center of town for around $200 a night, maybe less. They can also help with all of your visa processing needs and registration once you are there, if you need to do that.

    Of course, if you don't speak Russian, you will be relegated to the clubs that cater to foreigners, places like Hot Dog's and the dreaded (gulp) Night Flight. Aurora 911 is another club to try. You may be limited by your lack of Russian, but the strip club format is pretty much a no-brainer: you pays your money and you makes your choice. Just grab the girl and head for the room. I believe the Penthouse Club also has sex-on-premises.

    There can be some real stunners in Night Flight and Aurora 911, and depending on the night, the selection, your own character, personality and negotiating skills, you should expect to pay anywhere from 300 to 500 USD an hour (or 2) of disinterested service. Hot Dog's is a little cheaper, but the selection will not be as good, plus you will have to put up with the surly bartenders.

    A week in Moscow, staying in an apartment, buying groceries at the local supermarket and cooking in your kitchen, plus 1 girl a night at any of the above clubs should run you about 5, 000 USD, all-in. Of course, you could spend 2x, or 3x, or 4x that amount, without even a thought. You could also spend less, but I wouldn't advise it.

    So, I think that's everything you need to know about mongering in Russia. Now you have a choice: you can arise now and go to Russia, or you can spend the rest of your life wondering why you never went.

    The choice is yours.

    счастливо

  15. #11
    Prosal, I agree, LOL! After reading what I wrote I thought the same thing! To be honest, I still hope to manage, I hope I'll find precious and useful infos, also in this thread, there is still time, I would go in summer. It's just that, while I was writing, all the troubles I had been through about this trip in the past gathered in my mind, pratically I was talking to myself, the side in favour of the trip and the side against. But I see my final conclusions have not been questioned, which means they are not too wrong.

    I don't want to go as far as Borderline, whose nice romantic novel unfortunately wasn't finished. I don't have time enough and I already consider every trip an adventure, plus I'm not too keen on non pros, I just want it straight, not only for laziness but also for reasons of results,"efficiency", time, etc.

    What I meant was that you can find stunners, Russian or not, in many places, so it's the overall effort to reach them that makes the difference. My first time in Ukraine was in 1999, I remember dealing for one dollar out of 14, my last time was in 2001, I was asked from 30 to 50 dollars, when I read the threads now, I'm glad I already cast the flag over there and I don't even think of going there anymore. Anyway, I promise I'll do what I can to fulfill my desire to add a flag by conquering Russia!

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