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  1. #32

    Thai Word in the Picture

    Does anyone know what this Thai word means?

    Maybe Mr. Syzygies?
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 20190630_161039 - thai 3.jpg‎  

  2. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Paolo99  [View Original Post]
    I agree that I also struggle to put a clear definition on many words.
    I still cannot put a clear definition on some bad words, for example the word "kwanteen". I think I saw some reference to a foot in a dictionnary but it has to be something else.

    There are also some not nice ways to call someone, I suspect that the word "bak" (probably only spoken by eesan girls) put just before the name is one of them (let's say your name is David and the girl call you bak David when she talk about you) but I never found a way to put a definition on this word.

  3. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Syzygies  [View Original Post]
    "Dtolae" is a word used by girls, that got me into trouble early on. Essentially guys cannot use it. I thought it means "bullshit artist". It is very offensive when spoken to girls. We might never understand why. Thais have gender double standards.
    I heard that word a lot in my first trips (late 1990's), I wonder if it's used mostly by bar girls, because nowadays I almost never interact with bargirls and I never hear that word anymore. For us if we want to confront someone who keep lying, we would be better at saying he or she "choop gohok maak".

    I also could not say "ngian" (horny) with her.
    I still find it difficult to understand the difference betwin "ngian" and 'siaoo". I think I was told "ngian" is more intense that "siaoo" (and it might be used only by girls also).

    The definition that I might come close to it would be that "ngian" applies to a girl that is very excited and would like to have sex (applies even if she is alone) and "siaoo" would be an excitement that comes after being stimulated by her partner.

    "Hee" essentially means "c*nt" so I would not use it. "hoi" is slightly softer ("clam") and "jim" is softer still (so advisable).
    I like to point at it by calling it "nong saao" to say it in a cute way.

    GF uses an Issan expletive "huu daak" (sounds like "who dark" and means "asshole" literally).
    Didn't know that word myself but a few years back I read a review on a blog dedicated to Thailand where that word was used in an interesting way. There was a pack of gogo girls that were outside in the Nana complex before the opening of their bars, a customer went to one of the girls (obviously he already knew her) and she welcomed him by saying "oh my daak ling" . The guy thought that she said "oh my darling" when in fact she was saying "oh my monkey's ass", everybody around was laughing, and the guy didn't know they were all laughing at him. So it's good to know it just to understand it clearly when your being played by one of these girls.

    "ee dork thong" seems to be calling a girl a "golden flower" but is very offensive. I am not totally clear of the real meaning. Seems to be close to "b*tch". Important to know the danger words and avoid them.
    This is also the definition that I came out with that word (eedork=*****). Almost all the girls in Pattaya call their close friends by this word, even used by cute girls in Bkk. We should never use it, it's just a word that they use by themselves.

    I have to avoid using "dting dtong" which I once thought was a playful word. Seems the meaning ranges from "Crazy" to "Son of a b*tch".
    Since now I never thought it could be something like "son of a be*tch", I always thought it was something like calling someone "crazy" but in a funny way (a guy or girl that likes to do crazy stuff but in a funny way).

    Other very bad words (to absolutely never use) are:

    "Ay heea" (addressed to man) or "ee heea" (when addressed to a girl) would have a definition close to "mother fucker, or son of a WG (even though it doesn't literally translate in son of a be*tch but it's a very very bad word).

    "ay sat" or "ee sat" , basically translate as "someone who is an animal, or subhuman (very very bad word also in Thai).

    The very commonly known "kwaay" to designate someone that is very very stupid.

    I agree that I also struggle to put a clear definition on many words.

    Another expression that was used a lot before was "top salop salai" with the girl making the gesture (giving a slap on one side of the face and then coming back with the back of the same hand and slapping the other side of the face). I understood it as "slapping one's face" but it was always accompanied by the same gesture even when it was different girls saying it.

  4. #29
    I just swear in English. Everyone seems to understand the foul language I use just fine.

    Isn't the whole purpose of swearing and bad mouthing supposed to p1ss someone off?

  5. #28

    Danger Words.

    We hear girls using ugly talk. If we use what we heard them say, we are in danger of looking really bad.

    So I advise guys not to use the foul language or ugly talk vocab without an in depth understanding, which does not come immediately.

    Paiboon Talking Dictionary, has a skull and cross bones mark for words that should not be used at all, or with extreme care.

    And knowledge of what is acceptable to the person listening.

    "Dtolae" is a word used by girls, that got me into trouble early on. Essentially guys cannot use it. I thought it means "bullshit artist". It is very offensive when spoken to girls. We might never understand why. Thais have gender double standards.

    One ex GF was pissed off I used the word "moi" for pubic hair. Her standards were too high to accept dirty talk. I needed to use a euphemism instead (softer) "khon phet" (literally means "diamond hair". I also could not say "ngian" (horny) with her. Some girls cannot accept such crude talk. Current GF has no problem with it, but I have known her a long time.

    "Hee" essentially means "c*nt" so I would not use it. "hoi" is slightly softer ("clam") and "jim" is softer still (so advisable).

    When we hear Thai swear words, we won't know the deep feeling attached to them.

    GF uses an Issan expletive "huu daak" (sounds like "who dark" and means "asshole" literally). In normal Thai it might be "ruu dtuut". However she does not use it in the western way. It seems to be equivalent to how we would use the expletive "fucking hell", since seems to be using it without referring to a person. Maybe one day I will understand it better.

    Some Thai cuss words sound innocent enough but can't be used (safely), e. G. "ee dork thong" seems to be calling a girl a "golden flower" but is very offensive. I am not totally clear of the real meaning. Seems to be close to "b*tch". Important to know the danger words and avoid them.

    Even in English I don't fully understand cuss words. "Bastard" seems to be not a strong cuss word any more. Maybe even "mother fuckers" does not sound so bad any more, after Bruce Willis used it such a lot.

    I have to avoid using "dting dtong" which I once thought was a playful word. Seems the meaning ranges from "Crazy" to "Son of a b*tch".

  6. #27
    One of my early learning tools for English to Thai was Robertson's Practical English to Thai Dictionary. Out of print now but still available as an electronic book (PDF I guess). Was revised by Mike and Benjawan Golding. My copy is old and rather beaten up. It had a yellow paper jacket originally.

    I used this a lot when I need to say something to a Thai girl. Had little phrases and showed which meaning of English words was referred to. Reading Thai script was not needed and at the time I could not read Thai script.

    This was the best guide going when wanted to say something beyond my early weak range.

    It has 5000 Thai words apparently. That might be about what I have. I should do a 2 to 3 pages a day to make sure I know them all, or fill in any gaps.

    Most English to Thai dictionaries were hopeless. Most were written for Thais. I think the Paiboon Thai-English-Thai Talking dictionary is now very good. Run that on the smart phone. Was not around back when I was learning. There are always some words missing from books. Could be euphemisms or expletives. Ha ha.

    Advanced Thai students can use Longdo online Dictionary. Not suited to beginners at all.

    Find Thais to talk to, who speak very clear, precise and slower Thai. Lazily pronounced fast Thai is quite hard to follow. I really struggled with Bangkok Tuk Tuk drivers in 1991. They spoke shitty Thai (or Issan maybe). I found a southern Thai girl who spoke very clear central Thai slowly. That helped a lot.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 1468.jpg‎   1469.jpg‎  

  7. #26
    Some Thai words have multiple meanings depending on context. Some meanings are rarely used, some common. Tones added change the word to a different word and with different meanings.

    Here I have an extreme example, of several meanings with just 3 tones. 5 tones are possible.
    Get the tone wrong and the person may not understand.

    A good example:
    คอน

    (khawn) rhymes with lawn (flat tone)
    Meanings:
    1. (verb) to carry a single load at the end of a pole held across the shoulder
    2. (adjective) is askew; lopsided
    3. (noun) roost; perch; landing
    4. (verb) to paddle; to row

    Then with a tone mark added takes a different tone and different meanings (falling tone mark):
    ค่อน

    1. (adjective, adverb) is almost; nearly; somewhat; rather
    2. (verb) to carp or cavil at
    3. (adjective) is more than half; almost full

    Then with a different tone mark added takes a different tone and different meanings (high tone mark):
    ค้อน

    1. (noun) hammer; mallet; gavel
    2. (verb) to glance sideways; look askance at

  8. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Raphael92  [View Original Post]
    Thailand has become my second home in my heart and I love it. I've been there 8 times till now and I've watched a few videos to learn basic words but I need to learn more so that I can start a conversation on my own in Thai.

    (I live in Bangalore, India. Could not find any tutors or institutions to learn Thai).

    *If there is a self learning book, could anyone help me with the name? I will be glad to purchase it.

    *Online courses / Watching videos helped a bit, but I'm old school and need a book to learn and practice.

    *I agree it takes a long time to learn a language, but I'm curious as to how long would it generally talk. People who have learnt the language and live in Thailand, could you tell me how long does it take?

    Thanks!
    Thai will be easier for Indians than for Farangs (Westerners). The reason is Thai originates from Sanskrit. Thai pronunciation is not so weird for Indians I guess. Not totally different I am guessing.

    You cannot learn Thai purely from a book, because you will stuff up the pronunciation. You can learn Thai with a private teacher over Skype if you can afford it. Bangkok has Thai language schools that advertise possibility to learn using Skype Video session. I have used Skype to learn a language myself. Private lessons. The problem with private lessons is they can be too expensive to get enough hours study per week.

    I learned initially from old AUA books with a teacher. The books were good, but I don't know if still available. AUA changed its teaching to the full immersion method where teachers speak only Thai. I personally do not recommend this method if you wants results in a hurry. I also learned to read and write Thai from an AUA book by myself. So you need a teacher for the speaking part, at least in the early stages. It is important that bad habits are corrected by the teacher before become ingrained. I recommend to find a teacher quite strict on correct pronunciation.

    You can use modern methods to listen to Thai on the web or using Thai Talking dictionary (by Paiboon). The problem is we are not used to hearing Thai. So if you say something out loud to yourself, you won't even hear the difference from the talking Dictionary speaker's pronunciation. So a tough teacher to correct you becomes important. You also have to learn what mouth shape is needed to make the sounds correctly.

    I learn vocab from a Flashcards App, but that is because I have mastered pronunciation already. So I can get by without a teacher.

    I have thousands of words in Thai script with meanings in English in a spreadsheet loadable into the App. I use Flashcards Deluxe a very good flashcards app.

    When I studied Thai intensively in a class, it was 6 hours per week, with 10 to 20 students. For 3 years. Also if you want to progress well, you should self study / practice every day. That includes saying phrases in Thai out loud to hear yourself. If you study silently you will kid yourself that you know how to say it, but actually might sound silly. Another technique used by classes is to record your own voice and then play it back. It sounds different to what you thought.

    Learning a language is based on endless spaced repetition till things become programmed in. To progress fast, you need to put time in every day.

    I would say focus very heavily on pronunciation and simple phrases for the first 6 months. Don't worry too much about vocab until the pronunciation is getting good. Trickiest parts of pronunciation are firstly the 5 tones (easy to stuff up the sound and the meaning), secondly the vowels are not like English vowels mostly (only some in common), and lastly some strange unaspirated consonants.

    In my early days my Thai improved most when I was stuck with Thai girls 24 hours per day, who did not speak English (in 1991). That forced me to speak Thai, and try to improve. I recommend it if the opportunity arises, even if just a several weeks holiday. Tough to do in Bangalore. Ha ha.

    So learn from books if you can but you have to have a native Thai teacher at times to fix your pronunciation, before it is too late. I hear guys at the pub, who probably never had a proper teacher, and have really bad laughable pronunciation. I trust my own is a bit better. I have met an Indian guy with absolute perfect Thai. He is a rich property owner and was probably born here.

    Any specific questions about ways to learn, I would try to help, based on my experience. I am now learning Issan dialect and Lao language which is very close to that. I can read Lao script now because is so similar to Thai (and self teaching is possible).

    Thai is actually one of the easiest languages on the planet to learn to speak, once you get a hold of the difficult pronunciation aspects. Grammar is very simple. Thai script has an alphabet too and 90% of words have regular spellings, so also not that incredibly difficult. Easier than script from various Indian languages I am sure.

    I have seen web sites that rate Thai as a difficult language. I believe they just don't have any understanding at all, of how easy Thai actually is. English is harder, I would believe.

    I agree you can't learn just from Videos, paper books or electronic books or website with text become important, and better if sound is available. I believe the Paiboon Thai books come with a CD for sound or a modern equivalent. I am not clear if there are better books or not, I did not use Paiboon to learn myself, but they are well accepted. I used the very old AUA books.

    Finding a good book to get from English phrases to Thai, when you are not sure how to say something, is very hard. I used this one:
    https://www.bookdepository.com/Rober.../9780804833851 Maybe hard to get (sold out). Maybe it can be obtained electronically. I don't know. I have a very old one.
    This website suggest you can get in e-book form then I guess use it on your phone perhaps:
    https://ponkitsu.ml/reviews/e-book-d...lding-pdf.html

    Paiboon Talking dictionary Thai-English-Thai is as good as any (have not seen better) and can be loaded to your phone.

    So there I have done my best to recommend things suitable for beginners, that I have used myself or would use.

  9. #24

    Tips Required.

    Thailand has become my second home in my heart and I love it. I've been there 8 times till now and I've watched a few videos to learn basic words but I need to learn more so that I can start a conversation on my own in Thai.

    (I live in Bangalore, India. Could not find any tutors or institutions to learn Thai).

    *If there is a self learning book, could anyone help me with the name? I will be glad to purchase it.

    *Online courses / Watching videos helped a bit, but I'm old school and need a book to learn and practice.

    *I agree it takes a long time to learn a language, but I'm curious as to how long would it generally talk. People who have learnt the language and live in Thailand, could you tell me how long does it take?

    Thanks!

  10. #23

    กะปู๋คลับ Kapuu Club

    กะปู๋คลับ Kapuu Club (sounds like ga-bpoo rising tone). Does not sound like Cap-poo at all. LOL Both the K and P should be unaspirated.

    Kabuu/Kapoo is supposed to be a euphemism for penis.

    There is a Thai word Krabpohk meaning testicles and another Krajuu meaning boy's dick, so an amalgamation could come out like Kapoo. Maybe? Letter R often gets dropped.

    Seems to be a place to get a very over priced massage by hot white skinned young students with probable HJ thrown in. Anything more not guaranteed and girl probably does not want to get naked. I have not really tried these clubs, so no expert, but was wondering about the name.. 27 years ago I tried Chawala, with massage therapists with white uniforms. All manner of groping was allowed but they did not get their shorts off, so sex on premises was not possible. However only a few of the girls were pretty. These type of hand relief massage joint seems to have evolved into Kapoo clubs, mainly for Thais, as expats probably want fully nude porn stars with guaranteed FS, BBBJ, CIM and maybe even anal, more so.

    When you see Kapoo, think so ga-boo (rising tone on boo) and that will sound closer to the Thai word.

  11. #22

    Resist one word translations.

    Quote Originally Posted by Syzygies  [View Original Post]
    When making notes about Thai words or phrases, explain the meaning, a single English word is generally not enough to make the meaning absolutely clear.
    Cases where one Thai word equals one English word exist but mostly for very specific nouns.

    E. g.

    Chaang (high tone) = Elephant.

    Chang with other tones has other meanings, e. G. A technician, to weigh something, etc.

    However many English words may still have multiple alternatives in Thai, could have informal, scientific, or technical words.

    Sunak = Dog (formal Thai).

    Maa = Dog (informal Thai).

    For English words with many meanings, an English word to a Thai word won't work.

    So always use a phrase or several words to describe the precise meaning.

    Similarly multiple entries are needed to cover each meaning for Thai words with multiple meanings.

    Can = Dai (meaning to be able to).

    Can = Krabong (meaning tin can).

    Can = Suam (toilet).

    Etc.

    Amusingly the other day, I learned that the English word "carry" can have maybe twelve different Thai words for carry, depending the exact way something is carried.

    Carry goods by truck, or transport something "Khon Song".

    Carry in the hands "Theu".

    Carry a bag or suitcase by handle "Hiw".

    Carry baby in your arms "oom".

    Carry in your pocket "Phok".

    Hold in the mouth. LOL "Om".

    Carry out = "damnoen".

    Carry off = "lak".

    Carry slung over the shoulder, carry across shoulder, carry at the hip, Carry in a sack, carry on a pole, two persons carry a handle each, carry on the head, carried out to sea, carried on the wind, etc.

    In Thai you have to know the right carry word for the occasion. LOL Not sure there is any very general one like English Carry.

    The wrong one could sound a bit silly.

    So the conveyor belt carried the Japanese Suschi dish to me. I have no clue which "Carry" can be used. LOL Maybe "Khon" rising tone to transport something (could be silly). Maybe "Phaa" to take something to some place. I settle on this last word until have time to ask a Thai person, who probably won't use a carry word at all.

    In basic Thai 101 we learned maybe only "Theu" for carry. We could use it and Thais could be confused unless we carried something in our hand only. "Ao pai" is the basic phrase we learn for to take something away to somewhere, and "ao maa" to bring something. These are fortunately more general.

  12. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Rick Rock  [View Original Post]
    No, not the same. The official name of "Deutschland" in English is Germany, Nippon is Japan, Espania is officially Spain, etc.

    The Thais called their lands "Mueang Thai" going way back. Siamese was a name attached to them by outsiders -- various theories exist for the meaning. Cambodians say it meant something like thief, and "Siem Reap" is famously named to mean "Thais defeated" even today. "Siem" is still what many Khmers call the Thais. Northern Khmers do too, and it sounds exactly like "siem," but they only say it in private usually for obvious reasons. Others say "siam" is from a Portuguese mispronunciation of "Xian," a name the area was given by the Chinese. Still others say it was from the Sanskrit word "syama" meaning dark, which could be reasonable since the Thai pronunciation is very close to that. The Thai word would actually be transliterated "syama" under ISO 11940. I have no idea where you get your transliterations with lots of extra letters.
    Yes it is similar. On any English Map you will find the word Laos. Just accept that English used fucked up spellings. In former times you could also find Siam (which was also a misspelling of a word Sayaam which originally meant something like "brown race" apparently). You can't use Lao things to be the official way to spell things in English, and Lao People (or Lao Language) is not the same as the country known as Laos. Union of Soviet Socialists Republic did not stop English people using the word Russia.

    From Wikipedia: "In 1938, Phibunsongkhram, an open supporter of Mussolini and Hitler, began moving the government towards the right. By 1942 he had issued a series of cultural decrees' '(ratthaniyom)' or Thai cultural mandates, which reflected the desire for social modernization, but also an authoritarian and exaggerated nationalist spirit. First, in 1939 he changed the country's name of Siam to Thailand (Prathet Thai) (Thai: ประเทศไทย). This was directed against the ethnic diversity in the country (Malay, Chinese, Lao, Shan, etc.) and is based on the idea of a "Thai race", a Pan-Thai nationalism whose program is the integration of the Shan, the Lao and other Tai peoples, such as those in Vietnam, Burma and South China, into a "Great Kingdom of Thailand" (Thai: มหาอาณาจักรไทย). "

    Thanks, I did not known that the term Meuang Thai had been used for far longer than "Prathet Thai" when Farangs were using the stupidly spelled term Siam. Thai people tell me the name Sayaam (in local language) was used even before Meuang Thai. So an older term. At least that is what they get taught at school. History is known to be unreliable when very old.

  13. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Syzygies  [View Original Post]
    This is a slightly silly argument. In English it is known as Laos (with a silent S. Maybe crazy coming from French. Who cares). Similarly you could have argue there is no Germany, its really Deutschland, and there is no Spain (only Espania), no Italy (only Italia), Morroco is spelled wrong too.
    No, not the same. The official name of "Deutschland" in English is Germany, Nippon is Japan, Espania is officially Spain, etc.

    The Thais called their lands "Mueang Thai" going way back. Siamese was a name attached to them by outsiders -- various theories exist for the meaning. Cambodians say it meant something like thief, and "Siem Reap" is famously named to mean "Thais defeated" even today. "Siem" is still what many Khmers call the Thais. Northern Khmers do too, and it sounds exactly like "siem," but they only say it in private usually for obvious reasons. Others say "siam" is from a Portuguese mispronunciation of "Xian," a name the area was given by the Chinese. Still others say it was from the Sanskrit word "syama" meaning dark, which could be reasonable since the Thai pronunciation is very close to that. The Thai word would actually be transliterated "syama" under ISO 11940. I have no idea where you get your transliterations with lots of extra letters.

    The Thais never hid from the name Siam originally. Monarchs up until Mongkut signed their orders "King of Siam. " The same thing happened with Koreans who call themselves Hangukin. Westerners started calling them "Koreans" which was a mistaken way of interpreting the name of one of their dynasties called "Goryeo. " So now while "Hanminguk" is still the name in Korean, in English it is officially the Republic of Korea. Similar story for the Japanese.

    Thailand had a nationalist revolution in the 1930's and they changed the name to Thailand. Nationalists argue "Thai" means free people, while most experts agree it was actually just a local word for "people. " Regardless, the Thai passport says "Thailand" because that's the official English name of the country.

    "Laos" is not the official name of anything anywhere. It's just an oft repeated mistake made mostly by people who have no clue about the millions of Lao people in Lao and Isan. It's not on money, it's not on government seals, it's not on official documents, and it's not on the passports they use to interact with the outside world. See attached.

    Doubt you'll accept this though, as you don't seem to accept anything that runs counter to your preconceived notions, facts to back it up or otherwise.

    Have fun learning "Laos" or is it "Isan"?
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails pp.jpg‎  

  14. #19
    Some time I might publish a list of most common few hundred Thai words (those that should be learned as a priority), and most common hundred or so Isaan words, since that would cover enough to get by with, and could be learned using a flash cards App, although correct understanding of pronunciation would need a teacher most likely. Too much effort to include sound, but perhaps links to sound available online is feasible. Paiboon App Thai-English-Thai Talking Dic is very good. Highly recommended. Early days was missing some Thai words, but quite comprehensive these days. Not much cannot be found. Also has some phrases that are useful.

    I doubt there is any equivalent for Lao / Isaan, so a list of common Isaan words with English and Thai equivalent is something I am working on.

  15. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by RickRock  [View Original Post]
    There is no "Laos" and never has been. That's just a farang (literally French in this case) invention. The country is called the Lao People's Democratic Republic, or "Pathet Lao" in Lao. (This sounds a lot like "Brates Khmer" in Khmer or "Prathes Thai" in Thai, doesn't it?) The people are called Lao people. The language is called the Lao language.
    This is a slightly silly argument. In English it is known as Laos (with a silent S. Maybe crazy coming from French. Who cares). Similarly you could have argue there is no Germany, its really Deutschland, and there is no Spain (only Espania), no Italy (only Italia), Morroco is spelled wrong too. There was never really any Siam before, it was really Sayaam. Siam led to gross mispronunciation (and unrecognisable to Thai people), but that is what westerners used for unknown reasons.

    Thailand is internally known as "Phrathet Thai" but impossible to spell absolutely correctly in English really, so hence Thailand. You can write "Phrathes" if you want but final letter is pronounced like "T", not like "S". Lao/Isaan drops the "R" sound.

    Thai words/syllables ending in CH, SH, S, D, TH, T, J are all pronounced like a T. Phad Thai is really Phat Thai (sounds like Putt Thai - never like Pad Thai).
    Thai words ending in L, R, N are pronounced like N. Words ending in F are pronounced P. Fortunately some ending sounds stay the same, like K, P, T (only 3 cut off stop ending sounds), W, M, N, NG, Y, and words ending in a vowel.

    In addition Thai has many words with a silent final letter. So no big deal to me if Laos name has a silent "S". Pity that many English speakers would not know though, so Lao would be better or Laoland LOL. Perhaps is done to make a distinction between the country and the language, since normally English does not use same name for both the country and the language, e.g Myanmar and Burmese. Are there any exceptions? We do use the same for naming the people and the language, e.g. Russian.

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