Kyiv

[Kozerog]

Another summer in Kyiv comes to an end. I saw same escort girl as previous two summers, 24 meetings (twice weekly) of about 4 hours each. Her standard rate for 4 hours is $150 uah (or $110 for 2 hours, $80 for 1 hour, rates unchanged since two years ago) but I raised to $190 in June plus gave $2000 bonus at final meeting (bonus not promised or discussed prior to final meeting), so total of about $6450, or much more than standard rate, especially if calculated on basis of 24 shorter length meetings. Based on ATM withdrawals and difference between cash on hand at arrival and departure, additional cash expenses of $3305 over 87 days: $28/ night for apartment, $10/ day for food, medical tests, entertainment, local transportation.

I paid girl extra for several reasons: incentivize her to continue seeing me in the future even if she stops seeing other clients (I can sense she is already reducing her escort work); prospect of bonus encourages reliable service (she has indeed been very reliable, possibly because of smaller bonuses at end of previous two summers); take her off market to some extent, by raising price for anyone who wants to sponsor her full-time; better to give excess money to someone I like while alive than let distant relatives inherit it when I die (no children of my own). Instead of raising rate and giving big bonus, I could have simply arranged more meetings. However, I get bored seeing her more than twice weekly. In fact, if living year-round in Kyiv, once a week would be plenty.

Several weeks ago, girl removed her Viber photo and also set Viber to private mode so I can't tell when she last logged in. When I first noticed these changes, I thought she was going ghost, maybe because she met a boyfriend her own age, or maybe just tired of escorting. I felt sad at losing her and disgusted at prospect of having to seek a replacement. Turned out to be a false alarm, as she responded as usual to my message setting up our next meeting. At that meeting, she explained that someone from her native village, who isn't supposed to know she is an escort, somehow discovered her escort work number, which is why she removed the photo. She also said she doesn't have a boyfriend currently and her last boyfriend had no job and no money, lived with his parents, was jealous and controlling and younger than her, and similar story with all her ex-boyfriends. I think she has become spoiled by associating with wealthy older foreign men as clients.

Sex with current girl is routine at this point and we have little to say to one another. On the other hand, sex is consistently good, like a well-oiled machine, she has never done or said anything to annoy me (other than occasionally forgetting to set her smartphone to "do not disturb" mode), I feel comfortable with her in my bed and sad at the idea of losing her. Compare with every other escort, sugar baby or ordinary unpaid girlfriend I've been with for the past 15 years, who I soon grew tired of, plus more than half the time I was impotent with these other women. Overall, she makes me feel sexually content, in the sense that the sexual part of my life is taken care of, even during remaining nine months of year. None of the nagging sexual discontent I used to feel, because of either no sex or else bad sex with women I didn't really like. Contented but slightly bored is much better than discontented.

From what I can see, girl's primary goal right now is financial security (growing her internet business and buying real estate) rather than getting married or having children, which suggests she'll continue seeing me for at least several more years, if I want. At one time, I considered inviting her to spend a week or so with me outside Ukraine. But as noted above, I get bored seeing her more often than twice weekly and even then we have little to say to one another, so a full week together probably not a good idea. Probably not a good idea with any woman, in fact: I'm too used to being alone most of the time.

[NorskKing]

Next level are show-around girls. Just like all of the above, they sell the promise, the ever so elusive pursuit of happiness. They never commit verbally to anything solid. Showing night life, being your wingwoman. Is as far as it gets

There are two sides of this game with showaround girls when thinking only from our (not girl's) perspective.

1. Desperately hoping that something will happen and behave strange around that girl and give her an upper hand and a chance for her to easily deny the offer and help her prove to herself that she is "not that kind of girl".

2. Accept already that nothing is going to happen, enjoy the night clubs and her being your wing woman. Confuse her to the hell as to why we don't flirt with her and use all her knowledge and language to get to know other girls and bring their guards down. I would think that are good 20 $ per spent on first day + few drinks on her. But remember, some of us are adventurous and like to have a game before getting in between their legs.

I appreciate the discussions here, Kiev thread is very much alive and full of great thinkers.

[PhotoSlider]

This is what I wanted to know. The probability does not seem to worth the time and money. I will anyhow try this once just to scratch it off my list. Thanks for the inputs.

As others have explained, there is an attitude gradient with respect to girls considering themselves "I am not a prostitute!

It starts with semi-pros, indies and mamba girls sleeping for compensation, and not thinking of themselves as hardcore prostitutes.

Then there are erotic masseuses, few more grades down. They jerk off customers to the happy ending, allow for an occasional cuni and even DFK, but no penetration on premises. No fucking, and no BJ. Outcalls may result in sex. Building relationship is also possible.

Next level are show-around girls. Just like all of the above, they sell the promise, the ever so elusive pursuit of happiness. They never commit verbally to anything solid. Showing night life, being your wingwoman is as far as it goes. I do see some $50 an hour ladies. Maybe those fuck. I also know that at least one Ukrainian show around girl flew out to Italy with expenses paid, and refused to provide. She in fact threw a tantrum when one of the hobbyists assumed she would, and especially when the guy expressed displeasure with her refusal. She insisted that she is an honest young lady, and he was gravely mistaken. She told me that story herself, and took great pride in punishing the guy.

[SFNative]

Have any members here experienced the saunas?

[Curious12]

Also what is KEC?

Thanks.

Escort agency.

https://escort.vc/news

[BCTravel]

Hey everyone,

I am booked to go to Kiev in mid September. I am not a fan of doing the online thing to meet girls. I would rather do in person. Can you tell me, is there certain bars and clubs the working girls hang out at? I would rather meet them at a bar that way than online. Any help would be appreciated. Also what is KEC?

Thanks.

[Mnp25]

Hello IST fellows,

I will visit Kiev for a week (9/7-9/14). Do you have any contacts or tips that you could share via PM? If you are also in Kiev, let's meet up for a drink. Thanks!

[SFNative]

Broski.

Thanks for all the info that this this thread has shared. Can't wait to have a blast sightseeing and hopefully find my match on Tinder or Mamba. Expectations is to have fun. All be in Ukraine from 13-2. I'll be staying at near Independence Square. Would be awesome to meet some peeps at this forum for a drink.

[The Mercy Seat]

Here is my perspective on the Girls in Kiev today. Some background on me. I first came to Kiev 7 years ago. I kind of early found a keeper and was With her for 5 years before ending. Have had a "special" friend in Kiev the last 2 years. The first 5 years I was in Kiev about 4 times a year. The last 2 years I have been in Ukraine about 2 times a year. I usually stay 7-14 days on each trip.

My last trip to Kiev was at the end of May this year. I had free time, it was weekend (both Saturday and Sunday) og the weather was very Nice. I sat on Khreschatyk and watched Girls for atleast 3-4 hours both days.

What did I see? There was a lot of Girls. I will say I say 2 hot 10's, one With a Rich boyfriend and one With exspensive gatgets and cloths. They where clearly spoken for and had high demands. I saw about 8 Girls that I would give a rating of 9. This doesn't say much in general since we all have different taste. But if I did the same Experiment within the first 3 years I went to Kiev (I often then also took time to watch Girls on Khreschatyk), I would have seen atleast 20-30 Girls I would classify as 10's. And basically most Girls would have been hot and in Nice cloths. Now? More fat, uglier and don't care as much about how they look it seems.

I have also gotten in touch With some New Girls the last 2 years. The trend seems to be the same. They are not so pretty as before and they cost more. Would I today if I started mongering in Kiev like it as much so that I will keep coming back? Maybe since I don't know better, but I would check out lot of other Places also for sure. So many hit and miss theses days. 7 years ago it was a no brainer. It was Nice and easy even thou I have never experienced River Palace. I had no need to go other Places. Even thou most People speak shitty English. If you are New in Kiev and starting mongering now With no contacts, you have a lot of work Ahead of you to find a reasonable priced gem. When / If my relationship With my friend ends and I have lost contact With most of the few Girls I do know there, I don't think I will visit Ukraine that much. The plus side is still that Ukraine is a cheap country to have a vacation in. Girls are normally cheaper here than other Places. But now very difficult to find a good girl since basically all Girls use fake Pictures.

[Jojosun]

I used it in 2017 specifically to get a partner to walk around city together for free, not even for flirt. I would expect it may proceed as far as enjoyable flirting, and perhaps no more than 1 out of 20 with our primary objective. Not to say it's impossible. Maybe things have changed in two years.

I never used any Guides in Kiev but I do remember back in 2010 I suggested using a Night Guide to a senior, Asian Chaos, when he asked about Clubs and reserving tables at the best clubs. It was a bit of banter one of few other suggestions on Kiev's Nightlife at the time.

He later posted a long report on his experiences and his success with one such Night Guide.

Can't remember the name of the agency or guides at the time but a quick search here shows a link to Kiev Night Guides.

Nightlife Tour Guide Prices.

General Prices are US $ 65 for 5 hours long Tour. Payable beginning of the Tour. If you need a booking table in a club or airport taxi booking, you required to pay 15 US $ in advance.

[Tomster99]

It won't make sense for me at least to keep book with many until I succeed. You point is very valid. That is the reason I was asking this forum to shred some knowledge on trying to understand the mindset of these girls.

My initial thoughts was that some girls would like to tag themselves away from being called as sluts / working girls. Hence I saw that this show around thing gives them a very proper excuse to convince themselves to keep their dignity and what happens on the tours is just being adults. Since they already made some money after the tour, having their guards completely down, it should be easy to approach or walk away. But listening to you seniors make me think that probably they are not in this mindset (Question)?

Well, times have changed also there. No girl in Kiev was ever proud to be making pocket money on the side. You always had to give them the feeling of appreciation.

I just think the portal you mention offers reviews of clients etc that are all around the tours itself. The girls definitely want to make their way as a guide rather than a prostitute and they earn pretty well with those tours.

Keep in mind: average montly pay is in the 300 Euros. So. Offering a 2 hours tour for 60 Euros ist great. Also: if you go to a massage place you'll end up with a girl making herself (after paying the place) way less than this per hour.

So the choice is obvious.

[NorskKing]

Well, yes. But how do you get to hook up for more than just the tour" .

Booking half a dozen tours to eventually get luck? .

It won't make sense for me at least to keep book with many until I succeed. You point is very valid. That is the reason I was asking this forum to shred some knowledge on trying to understand the mindset of these girls.

My initial thoughts was that some girls would like to tag themselves away from being called as sluts / working girls. Hence I saw that this show around thing gives them a very proper excuse to convince themselves to keep their dignity and what happens on the tours is just being adults. Since they already made some money after the tour, having their guards completely down, it should be easy to approach or walk away. But listening to you seniors make me think that probably they are not in this mindset (Question)?

[NorskKing]

perhaps no more than 1 out of 20 with our primary objective. Not to say it's impossible. Maybe things have changed in two years.

This is what I wanted to know. The probability does not seem to worth the time and money. I will anyhow try this once just to scratch it off my list. Thanks for the inputs.

[DramaFree11]

You can post the link.

I agree with you, for new guys and those without contacts I don't think its worth it to travel to Kiev anymore.

Strip clubs: like Rio are rip offs.

Escort agencies: post fake photos, only KEC posts real photos but photoshopped and girls are overpriced, look at Nina $300 for a fuked up pussy, she's been working there for at least 5-6 yrs.

Reg clubs: lucky to find a good looking girl with reasonable price.

Apartments: seems takes too much time to find a hit girl, read recent reports.

Better to stay the fuk home or travel some where else, its not worth it any more, its easy for good looking Ukrainian girls to travel abroad and work there.

Wow, finally sone honesty and someone that deals in the real world!

Great report!

[Muddy7]

I was in Kiev last September after 10 years.

I remember the Kiev of River Palace and I was deceived.

I just found a good, maybe very good pro trough travelgirls before to go.

300 dollars for a couple of hour but it worth.

Then I found one trough tinder but was 100 dollars wasted.

For me Kiev if somebody know the old Kiev has no reason to go anymore.

I would like to post the ig profile of the good girl or her link to travelgirls but I don't know if I am allowed to do it for privacy rules.

You can post the link.

I agree with you, for new guys and those without contacts I don't think its worth it to travel to Kiev anymore.

Strip clubs: like Rio are rip offs.

Escort agencies: post fake photos, only KEC posts real photos but photoshopped and girls are overpriced, look at Nina $300 for a fuked up pussy, she's been working there for at least 5-6 yrs.

Reg clubs: lucky to find a good looking girl with reasonable price.

Apartments: seems takes too much time to find a hit girl, read recent reports.

Better to stay the fuk home or travel some where else, its not worth it any more, its easy for good looking Ukrainian girls to travel abroad and work there.