Kyiv

[Desin]

It's always a delight to read stories from a storyteller, whose story takes turns according to the comments the listeners give to him as a reaction to the latest plot twists he has just told.

But about the matter at hand, I just wonder how will all the services that tourists rely on come back to life in Kiev after the war. How soon. Or late. Will restaurants and cafes start to operate, how long will they be able to do their business? I'd suppose the locals would have to revitalize the downtown by their spending, to get things back to normal. And then it could be a place of visit again.

Personally, I think I would feel unease there, being served by people who have either fled their country or served on the front line. And yet, maybe it would the 'back to normal' they'd eventually wish to find.

[HulaHoops]

My group of monger friends includes one African-American man and an Indian man. They are both in their 50's. They use mamba, tinder and seeking to meet women in Ukraine. They are both talking to lots of women, they have women interested in them and they have very positive monger stories to say.

Of course if you open your first message with "Can you come to Germany and I will take care of you", the woman will naturally be suspicious and every single woman will ignore your all messages. One has to ask in a socially intelligent way and of course one must build a relationship with the woman, before asking such a big task of her. I like to have phone and video calls with the woman (without sending them money) and build a relationship with them. Just taking a bit of interest in her and her hobbies. Once I have built rapport then I will ask her to meet. When I left Ukraine, I stayed in Poland for a few weeks before I had to return to Berlin. I used this time to rent an Airbnb near the border. I used the method I described above and was able to meet a beautiful 22 year old Ukrainian woman online, she came to Poland and stayed with me. She did all cleaning, cooking and housework. We had lots of sex and I of course I gave her a generous amount of which she was extremely grateful for it. I had to leave back to Berlin but I gave her a great financial gift, she lives in an accommodation with an elderly Polish couple in Poland, we have video calls everyday, and we are in a semi-relationship. I will be going to visit her in Poland in the upcoming weeks however she does mention that she misses Ukraine and is just waiting for the war to finish so she can return home.

I know others mongers my age offline that are in situations that I was / am in. I know men my age in my 60's who have moved temporarily to Poland and are living with very attractive Ukrainians who they care for. These mongers will never post online about their situations because of course they don't want everyone doing it and they don't want to mess up the good thing they have.

There is gold to be found, one just has to put the work in to find it.

[HessenStud]

All I'm saying is after the war, there will definitely be women open and very willing to meet western men.

I'm sorry to hear that, because it really hurts the feeling of colored people, including all men from Asia and Africa. Considering you have never posted any positive or successful experience in Kiev, I would say you have some strange view.

Nowadays the Ukrainian have the most difficulty time, no money, no job, no education chance, no good sleeping, even no hope! If they are not willing to meet foreigners now, I don't think after war they will change their mind. I tried hard to contact the girls on Mamba and also tried to persuade them to come to Germany, but until now no single reply. Of course I only contacted the above average looking girls. I can see they have read my messages. I just could not figure out why they don't even say a word like 'Thank you! If she is a smart girl, she should have heard or read on Internet, Germany provides very good accommodation for all Ukrainian refugees, not like some country only provides weapon and money but don't accept refugees. If she wants to earn more money by providing relaxation service, in Germany they can visit hotel or their customers, the police doesn't control prostitute's advertisement at all, of course, in Germany they can still find customers via VK, Mamba, Tinder, or Sugardaddy. Maybe some experienced members here can explain a little, why there are still some beauties in Kiev even now? (From Mamba I can see they are indeed in Kiev, one possibility is they are using fake photos.).

[HulaHoops]

We will just have to wait and see, I do hope and think end of may, end of June, the war hopefully should be winding up. Putin's forces are almost depleted and their bank account is surely hurting.

[Jmsuttr]

Moving to a new country with no language is not as rosy as it seems.

If war is over by end of May, latest end of June. Free handouts will stop August. If you'll read the news you'll see that people are beginning to move on from the war of Ukraine, in fact if you read polish news you'll see that:

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/p...nues-rcna25991

People are actually starting to get fed up of all the refugees. It's not all roses and flowers for refugees, most refugees aren't being treated fairly and not all countries in western Europe are easy to access.

Use seeking benefits, tinder, mamba and you will see that the women there are definitely looking for foreign men. A war has devastating effects on a country's economy and no matter what provisions are provided, a Ukrainian person will always try and stay closest to Ukraine or she'll go where her family is and western Europe is so expensive to someone coming from Ukraine with no job. That's why most Ukrainians are currently in Poland. They could go Germany or Netherlands but they stay in Poland. Why, because they want to go home. Not to mention the language barrier.

All I'm saying is after the war, there will definitely be women open and very willing to meet western men.

Do you have an inside source at the Kremlin? What if Putin, without a clear path to victory but unwilling and unable to admit defeat, decides to double-down and escalate? The latest scenario I've seen discussed is a possible invasion of Moldova, using attacks in Transnistria (blamed on Ukraine) as a pretext. If something like that happens, it could have the effect of opening up a new front in this war and it would almost certainly prolong things. Or he could decide to just remain in a stalemated position for a while, along the current lines of demarcation, and continue to lob missiles occasionally at Kyiv, Lviv, Odessa, etc. The point is that there are a large number of factors that will determine how long things continue. And, while we all hope it will end ASAP, it could realistically go on for much longer than expected.

I'm not in the business of predictions, rather I'm more about making observations about events and trends. As for your May and June timeline, while I applaud your optimism, I'd also offer the observation that you might want to retire your crystal ball. It really hasn't served you very well recently, has it?

[HulaHoops]

Moving to a new country with no language is not as rosy as it seems.

If war is over by end of May, latest end of June. Free handouts will stop August. If you'll read the news you'll see that people are beginning to move on from the war of Ukraine, in fact if you read polish news you'll see that:

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/p...nues-rcna25991

People are actually starting to get fed up of all the refugees. It's not all roses and flowers for refugees, most refugees aren't being treated fairly and not all countries in western Europe are easy to access.

Use seeking benefits, tinder, mamba and you will see that the women there are definitely looking for foreign men. A war has devastating effects on a country's economy and no matter what provisions are provided, a Ukrainian person will always try and stay closest to Ukraine or she'll go where her family is and western Europe is so expensive to someone coming from Ukraine with no job. That's why most Ukrainians are currently in Poland. They could go Germany or Netherlands but they stay in Poland. Why, because they want to go home. Not to mention the language barrier.

All I'm saying is after the war, there will definitely be women open and very willing to meet western men.

[Jmsuttr]

It won't be that easy. I don't think that the prices will go down extremely and that masses of willing girls will be available again. It's war at the moment. All the girls who are still in Ukraine have a lack of money. After the war, exactly the opposite will happen. Then greed takes over again.

It is now easier to go to Western Europe. There you can get a legal residence permit. Many girls have already used this. Not much will change immediately after the war. Ukrainians have always had a keen sense of where money can be made.

Why should girls fuck in Kyiv for $50 or $100 after the war? There is an opportunity to go to other countries. Where prostitution is legal. And you can make a lot more money with the job than for cheap prices in Kyiv. The not-so-beautiful women then stay in Ukraine. The beautiful or clever women go abroad, buy an apartment in Ukraine and come back only for vacation. But not to fuck 60+ men for cheap.

In western Ukraine in particular, the opposite is already noticeable. Fucking for food or to pay the rent? There's no reason for that anymore. Food is free everywhere. If you have absolutely nothing, you can go abroad. Female students too. Because unlike in the Ukraine, you can study for free in western Europe in many countries. In Germany there is even money for living expenses from the state.

The post-war situation in Ukraine will be radically different, both in the ways you point out and in other ways we don't yet know. And I think you're spot on to point out the economic advantages of Ukrainian women moving to other, more lucrative, cities in Europe (or further abroad) and sending money back home. While we'll have to wait and see how things develop, it's definitely not going back to "business as usual" and will likely be pretty chaotic.

[HessenStud]

A single woman with a child in Kyiv and without a job was driven into prostitution by the lack of money. Now this woman can live the train or bus to Germany. There is a free apartment, money for furnishing the apartment, free health insurance and at least 600 euros for living expenses. A value of at least 1200 or 1400 euros per month. All without prostituting yourself for it. Everything legal. Which wasn't the case before. Which path will many of these women choose? Fucking in Ukraine for a living or all for free in western Europe?

More than 1000 Euro is a little exaggerating. But 500 Euros is the minimum. I would say 600 to 700 Euro per person per month. I don't know if there is free apartment in Germany. But if a German provide an Ukrainian a room to live, he can get 200 to 300 Euro from the government. The food will cost 150 to 200 Euro per month if you eat meat one time per day. 10 eggs costs about 2 Euro in supermarket, 500 gram bread costs about 80 cents, you can imagine the living cost in Germany. I don't know insurance cost. For a normal worker the insurance will cost at least 300 Euro per month, but for student and refugees it should be much cheaper. Some cities even provide free German courses. Some cities are discussing if they should let Ukrainians have the working permit, because at least they can clean the room or taking care of children.

I tried with Mamba to hook up some women in Kiev, the chance at the moment is extremely low, they just don't reply. I don't think things will get better soon, because the girls in Germany will invite their sisters to come to Germany instead of waiting some foreign prophets.

[HulaHoops]

It's not as easy to leave Ukraine and go to western Europe as it seems.

I am speaking to lots of women that left Ukraine and for those that did not know anyone in the western country, many of them are just waiting for the war to be over so they can go back to Ukraine. A lot of women I am speaking, are being forced to work and clean and are basically at the whims of the people they are staying with.

Not to mention those that can't speak English are in terrible positions in western countries. The media will always portray the best stories or the worst stories. Never the middle ground of the family that took in a refugee and has maid the refugee do all the housework like a maid.

Anyway we will just have to see what happens in the Ukraine when the war finishes and foreigners arrive.

I do still believe it will be a feast for men.

[Jojosun]

"While I certainly hope that your rosy post-war mongering scenario comes to pass, I'm cognizant of many negative factors that could very well present themselves. And I'm also aware of the fact that there are many variables and circumstances we simply don't know about yet, and can't readily predict."

Many Factors will surface in the post _war situation in Ukraine and Kiev in particular. "Because, as we know, there are known knowns; there are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say, there are things that we now know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we do not know we don't know."

[Misterxxx]

All my old posts were made in a state of panic and wondering if I would be stuck and unable to leave an active warzone.

It wasn't that bad and it's definitely improved now. Right now, western Ukraine is pretty peaceful.

Of course, it will be extremely silly to go to Ukraine now. But as soon as the war stop, it's going to be one of the best places on earth. Women that are friendly and seeking comfort, very very open to meeting new guys.

It won't be that easy. I don't think that the prices will go down extremely and that masses of willing girls will be available again. It's war at the moment. All the girls who are still in Ukraine have a lack of money. After the war, exactly the opposite will happen. Then greed takes over again.

It is now easier to go to Western Europe. There you can get a legal residence permit. Many girls have already used this. Not much will change immediately after the war. Ukrainians have always had a keen sense of where money can be made.

Why should girls fuck in Kyiv for $50 or $100 after the war? There is an opportunity to go to other countries. Where prostitution is legal. And you can make a lot more money with the job than for cheap prices in Kyiv. The not-so-beautiful women then stay in Ukraine. The beautiful or clever women go abroad, buy an apartment in Ukraine and come back only for vacation. But not to fuck 60+ men for cheap.

In western Ukraine in particular, the opposite is already noticeable. Fucking for food or to pay the rent? There's no reason for that anymore. Food is free everywhere. If you have absolutely nothing, you can go abroad. Female students too. Because unlike in the Ukraine, you can study for free in western Europe in many countries. In Germany there is even money for living expenses from the state.

A single woman with a child in Kyiv and without a job was driven into prostitution by the lack of money. Now this woman can live the train or bus to Germany. There is a free apartment, money for furnishing the apartment, free health insurance and at least 600 euros for living expenses. A value of at least 1200 or 1400 euros per month. All without prostituting yourself for it. Everything legal. Which wasn't the case before. Which path will many of these women choose? Fucking in Ukraine for a living or all for free in western Europe?

[GDreams]

I have always loved and visited Ukraine, Lviv, Kyiv and all the major cities. I am a man in my 60's, I have travelled all over Eastern Europe. If you name a country in Eastern Europe I have been there and most likely spent a few months living there. I enjoy looking for the best places to monger and find semi / non-pros. Ukraine has always been my crown jewel and a hidden gem for me.

Out of all the countries and cities I have visited in Europe in terms of friendliness and receptive women, the best is hands-down Ukraine. In terms of the most attractive women, most friendly, cheapest, lowest amount of gold-diggers and most open to relationships with men of my age. Ukraine is the country me and my friends had the most fun and had the best reception from the women. If you will speak to most women in Ukraine, you will hear from quite a few of them that their parents relationships had an age-gap so I guess that's why there's not that much of a negative stereotype. In Ukraine, it was easiest for us to arrange mutually beneficial with women and very rare for us to get negative reactions. At least compared to the western sex prison countries that some of us come from.

In Ukraine, you have the benefit of English speakers, a large amount of women so they don't have that small town mentality where they are scared of being seen with a foreigner. Now with the war hopefully coming to an end, there's going to be a large drop in the price of money demanded by women. They will be happy to get whatever they can, even if you use an online dating app you will see that women are very eager to meet foreign men. May / June I aim to be in Kyiv or Lviv.

You think the war will be over then? Like you thought Russia would not invade?

[Jmsuttr]

All my old posts were made in a state of panic and wondering if I would be stuck and unable to leave an active warzone.

It wasn't that bad and it's definitely improved now. Right now, western Ukraine is pretty peaceful.

Of course, it will be extremely silly to go to Ukraine now. But as soon as the war stop, it's going to be one of the best places on earth. Women that are friendly and seeking comfort, very very open to meeting new guys.

In the way that panic is at one end of the emotional pendulum, excessive optimism is at the other. To my mind, statements and predictions made at either extreme are problematic.

So, while I certainly hope that your rosy post-war mongering scenario comes to pass, I'm cognizant of many negative factors that could very well present themselves. And I'm also aware of the fact that there are many variables and circumstances we simply don't know about yet, and can't readily predict.

So I guess the short version of what I'm saying is "hope for the best, but prepare for the worst. " Your posts, however, seem to be implying that there will be no "worst," and no potential negatives at all. I'm not sure that will prove to be accurate and I'd take predictions of an unqualified positive mongering environment with a grain of salt.

[HulaHoops]

I have always loved and visited Ukraine, Lviv, Kyiv and all the major cities. I am a man in my 60's, I have travelled all over Eastern Europe. If you name a country in Eastern Europe I have been there and most likely spent a few months living there. I enjoy looking for the best places to monger and find semi / non-pros. Ukraine has always been my crown jewel and a hidden gem for me.

Out of all the countries and cities I have visited in Europe in terms of friendliness and receptive women, the best is hands-down Ukraine. In terms of the most attractive women, most friendly, cheapest, lowest amount of gold-diggers and most open to relationships with men of my age. Ukraine is the country me and my friends had the most fun and had the best reception from the women. If you will speak to most women in Ukraine, you will hear from quite a few of them that their parents relationships had an age-gap so I guess that's why there's not that much of a negative stereotype. In Ukraine, it was easiest for us to arrange mutually beneficial with women and very rare for us to get negative reactions. At least compared to the western sex prison countries that some of us come from.

In Ukraine, you have the benefit of English speakers, a large amount of women so they don't have that small town mentality where they are scared of being seen with a foreigner. Now with the war hopefully coming to an end, there's going to be a large drop in the price of money demanded by women. They will be happy to get whatever they can, even if you use an online dating app you will see that women are very eager to meet foreign men. May / June I aim to be in Kyiv or Lviv.

[Reiner Otto]

I mentioned Chisinau twice in this forum, but upon further investigation, Chisinau is not good for girls from Kyiv or central Ukraine because Transdniestria has blocked borders.

You can enter MD via Odessa, not crossing PMR.