Pattaya Reports

[EihTooms]

Drinking law and hotel rules? She is not hanging out drinking nor in and out of hotels. She is just a regular Thai person. But okay, you think she is confused about the laws of her own country. Thai people don't know shit about Thailand.

Well, unless she has read Title IX of the Thai Penal Code and The Prevention and Suppression of Prostitution Act, how would she know what the law really says about prostitution in Thailand? How would anyone know? Do they cover that topic in detail in school here?

There are highly motivated researchers here on this website who read that Title and those Sections and still get it wrong. Cops certainly can't be relied upon to get it right, no more than I know for a fact how often they get it wrong about Rules of the Road for bicycles. At least, not as far as responding to a civilian's question about it goes.

If these laws are not available for review, and I assure you I have tried to review everything written by the Thai Authorities on the topic, yet they are keeping that "age 20" qualifier and big secret except to inform only cops and bar-owners about it, then that kind of turns the whole concept of "ignorance of the law is no excuse" on its head; there is no way for any of us to know the law.

At this point, I have no idea where the cops and bar owner got that "age 20" qualifier regarding prostitution into their minds enough to expect anyone to pay a fine for violating it. It sure isn't mentioned in the Thai Penal Code or The Prevention and Suppression of Prostitution Act. Not in any version of it I have read or seen quoted from.

Can your girlfriend enlighten us on where she read it? Or was it just because that was what the cops told the bar owner and the prostitute so they would pay them a fine on the spot?

BTW, does she know how much the fine for that was?

Was it the same silly fine "not exceeding 1,000 baht" a prostitute supposedly has to pay if she "solicits, induces, introduces herself or himself to, follows or implores a person in a street or a public place, or commit such acts in any other place, in an open and shameful manner or causes nuisance to the public", as cited in Section 5 of The Prevention and Suppression of Prostitution Act?

Which means it could be as low as 200 baht. Or less.

And which also begs the hypothetical question, IF there was a law or rule in the Act making it illegal to solicit for the purposes of prostitution in a "quiet and discrete manner so as to cause zero public nuisance", which there is NO such law in the Code or the Act, but somehow and in someway it was overheard by a cop anyway, how silly small would the fine be then?

"not exceeding 100 baht"? Which means it could be as low as 10 baht? LOL.

Fellas, help these girls out. Always keep some loose change in your pocket to gallantly pay the fine for them if Thailand should ever happen to pass a law making that aspect of Prostitution illegal and the lady gets busted by an ambitious cop or two for being overheard soliciting you for it "quietly and discretely". LOL.

[UnkSoldier]

Legal age is 18 but if the girl is 18 to 20 the parents can come after you. Just telling you what my girl told me yesterday.

[UnkSoldier]

Just arrived at this pink baby agogo 15 minutes ago. Had a drink with a beautiful young lady probably 22.7/10. Asked about st rooms and 700 fee for room 3000 baht for the girl. Expensive but all ago go are about the same. Maybe 10 girls here and 50 percent are at least 6 or 7 going to an 8. Bodies are fucking smoking.

[Werqweq]

I hope that I am not going to start another dumb argument about what's legal and not legal.

The legal age is 18 and I have been hearing that from bar owners who work hard to ensure that none are underage. None of them are willing to risk the heavy consequences of that. They also comment that it's strange that a girl can work in a bar but cannot drink alcohol until the age of 20. Finally, most hotels will impose a house rule limiting girls to over 20 but it's not the law. The drinking law and hotel rules may be the reason your girlfriend thinks it's 20 for everything.

Unlike that other debate, this is more interesting. I too have heard many references to 20 as being the legal age for p4p, or perhaps, the "not illegal age", though none of those I've heard it from are legal scholars.

For what it's worth, the now apparently defunct fiwfans site, which was a p4p site for thais, only let you search for girls from 20 and up. Not 18 and up. I'm thinking there was probably a reason for that. I also remember reading reports here from guys denied entry in the hotel to their p4p-girl because she was only 18 or 19.

[EihTooms]

You are opening a different can of worms here. Nobody has ever argued whether soliciting a prostitute is legal or illegal. So far the argument has only been about if being a prostitute is legal or not.

Hmm. I think the "trust us, it is illegal / not legal / a crime" crowd has been arguing that soliciting for the purposes of prostitution is illegal / not legal / a crime. As in "you could get arrested, charged, convicted, substantially sentenced and fined for it but that law is rarely enforced".

Isn't that what you have been seeing as their position?

But they have not been able to produce a quote or a link from a legally enforceable Penal Code, Act or Edict to support that argument.

And if they had ever been arguing that "being a prostitute is illegal", then they are really fighting a losing battle. The Thai Penal Code and / or The Prevention and Suppression of Prostitution Act is clear about it being illegal for anyone over the age of 16 to live off the money a prostitute earns UNLESS the prostitute is responsible for supporting such a person.

Which makes it blatantly obvious that, as far as the Thai government is concerned:

1. It is fine and dandy to BE a prostitute.

2. It is fine and dandy to EARN MONEY as a prostitute.

3. In fact, we, the Thai Government, want to make sure YOU, the prostitute, gets to keep and spend all the money you earn and aren't getting ripped off by some lazy freeloader or "manager" who isn't doing the fucking and sucking.

4. In further fact, we, the Thai Government, are so supportive of the idea of you BEING a prostitute and EARNING MONEY as a prostitute, we have actually and literally memorialized the concept officially in the Thai Penal Code and The Prevention and Suppression of Prostitution Act by literally spelling out that you can spend the money you earn by fucking and sucking on anyone in your charge for which you are responsible for their survival or livelihood. Knock yourself out. No problem. We're fine with that.

[Mr Enternational]

The drinking law and hotel rules may be the reason your girlfriend thinks it's 20 for everything.

Drinking law and hotel rules? She is not hanging out drinking nor in and out of hotels. She is just a regular Thai person. But okay, you think she is confused about the laws of her own country. Thai people don't know shit about Thailand.

[Downandup]

I just asked my girlfriend and she said it is legal as long as the lady is at least 20 years old.

I hope that I am not going to start another dumb argument about what's legal and not legal.

The legal age is 18 and I have been hearing that from bar owners who work hard to ensure that none are underage. None of them are willing to risk the heavy consequences of that. They also comment that it's strange that a girl can work in a bar but cannot drink alcohol until the age of 20. Finally, most hotels will impose a house rule limiting girls to over 20 but it's not the law. The drinking law and hotel rules may be the reason your girlfriend thinks it's 20 for everything.

[EihTooms]

I just asked my girlfriend and she said it is legal as long as the lady is at least 20 years old.

She knows of a case where a guy was walking with a chick and the police stopped him and asked how old she was. She was 18. The police wanted to know what bar he got her from. They went and arrested the owner and the owner and the guy with the girl had to pay.

Interesting. Unless your girlfriend got the cited ages wrong, misremembered it or it had more to do with age limits related to working or just being in a bar, there is nothing in the Thai Penal Code, see Title IX in the link below, or in the Prevention and Suppression of Prostitution Act, see further link below, that sets age 20 as anything different from "not yet over eighteen years of age".

https://www.thailandlawonline.com/ta...and-penal-code

It turns out that some law firms, opinion pieces and other sources with an agenda or incentive to convince everyone that consenting adults engaging in a discrete act of exchanging sex for money is illegal in Thailand tend to add a creative spin on the actual wording or, worse, omit critical wording, in the Prevention and Suppression of Prostitution Act in order to create that false impression.

That is particularly so on the issue of Section 5 in the Prevention and Suppression of Prostitution Act, which comes closer to almost, kind of, sort of suggesting that it is illegal than anything else in the Act or the Thai Penal Code.

However, even in that case and with a maximum penalty for it being a silly 1,000 baht fine and only for the prostitute, it still doesn't quite get there in the actual wording of it:

http://www.dwf.go.th/uploads/Downloa...0BE%202539.pdf

Section 5. Any person who, for the purpose of prostitution, solicits, induces, introduces herself or himself to, follows or implores a person in a street or a public place, or commit such acts in any other place, in an open and shameful manner or causes nuisance to the public, shall be liable to a fine not exceeding one thousand baht.

"In an open and shameful manner or causes nuisance to the public" being the quite clear and specific critical qualifier for the entire Section 5 that those with an agenda invariably omit.

[Philip Marlow]

There is not one enforceable Thai Penal Code section nor any statement in the Prevention and Suppression of Prostitution Act that states that the act of exchanging money for sex, Prostitution, is "illegal" in private and between consenting adults in Thailand. None. Nor has there ever been one....

Thank you. A very well written post.

[Philip Marlow]

Well, no harm as long as it won't lead to pointless blaming or flame wars that online arguments easily lead to. Maybe should move to some general Thai thread though.

BTW was there a final verdict about the topic, or still two camps without agreement? Kinda curious whether or not, among other violations of pointless laws that have zero enforcement and thus without any practical worries about my illegal acts, I will continue breaking the law when ladies come by and I give them baht when they leave.

Anyway, talking about legal issues, another potential legal concern for mongers (at least in theory) is fucking a married lady and getting caught by husband. I recall reading somewhere that according to Thai law that is not only a valid reason for unvoluntary (on wife's side) divorce, but in addition in such case the husband could also sue the punter for damages. No idea what the level of compensation could be (average ST rate in town per estimated fuck multiplied by number of shots?), and whether there is any real case that something like this would have ever happened, especially among Patttaya hookers. Anyway, few girls around who are technically married, I also have one among my regulars.

There are not many here who engage in pointless blaming and start and fan flame wars, and I'm not responsible for what others do. As long as I don't engage in them I'm good.

Well, the answer has been clear for some time, but some refuse to let it go. They keep doubling down. You're not violating the law when your ladies come by and you compensate them when they leave. I like discussions / arguments like these, as long as they're civil. I try to not read what those who aren't civil write.

That is an interesting law. Yeah, how do they fix the level of compensation. Hahaha, your way seems to be as good as any other. It seems that in other violations of the law in Thailand, compensation from the perpetrator to the victim or victim's family is common. I wonder how they are calculated.

A related law in the Philippines says that if a spouse catches their spouse in bed with another person, and if the first spouse kills or seriously injures one or both, all he will suffer is being banished from where he lives. If the damage is less than serious, there is no penalty.

[SubCmdr]

It takes a thick skin to post pics as there are guys who want us to think that they bang really hot girls. You could cut and paste a photo of Panida Khueanjinda saying you banged her and they will say she's ugly LOL.

Does not surprise me. We have posters that say I go with ugly girls just because I happen to report on the price I actually pay to fuck Thai girls.

[SubCmdr]

It takes a thick skin to post pics as there are guys who want us to think that they bang really hot girls. You could cut and paste a photo of Panida Khueanjinda saying you banged her and they will say she's ugly LOL.

The only people that comment on pictures of others: 1. Don't post pictures themselves. 2. They are not fucking so they are jealous.

[Turgid]

.......On ISG it takes a thick skin sometimes to post here.......

It takes a thick skin to post pics as there are guys who want us to think that they bang really hot girls. You could cut and paste a photo of Panida Khueanjinda saying you banged her and they will say she's ugly LOL.

[EverythingThai]

From a guy who within the last few days wrote almost 1900 words defending his completely incorrect thesis. Such condescension.

I was not going to comment but alas, the Pattaya thread is pretty much gone now so I guess it does not matter. On ISG it takes a thick skin sometimes to post here. Fire of all, your words of praise on some of my mongering posts. Thanks for that. Im glad you find them useful. That is really what this forum is about. However, when the topic switches to the legalities of prostitution, you become so sensitive and stand-off ish. Yes I posted 1 large post on the topic. I did it in the chats thread though and you got so triggered about me saying the topic does not belong in the Pattaya threads. Here is some friendly advice.

You should be able to have an online debate without getting triggered. For example, it's very clear to me that Tooms and I don't share the same opinion on this topic. But at the end of the day we debate about the topic without creating a flame war. Then we move on and continue to be civil to each other. This is what long term senior members of the forum should do. Same as Allover and I. Even Explorer and I. We don't hold grudges. Mr. E as well. As for some of the others in the rants thread, they are not on the same level as Allover, Explorer, MR. E, Sub, Goats, Fernando Alongso and a few others. These are the real OG vets who are the reason this forum exists.

Also dont take the rants thread seriously at all. Its just a shit show and thats it. Everything said there you can take it with a grain of salt.

Take care.

Oh and By the way. The incorrect thesis you refer to comes from true knowledge and dare I say experience in the Thai legal system. How can I say this? Because it’s my job lol. Not in the US, but in Thailand. I’m happy to discuss it with you over a beer anytime you are back in Thailand.

[EihTooms]

Well, no harm as long as it won't lead to pointless blaming or flame wars that online arguments easily lead to. Maybe should move to some general Thai thread though.

BTW was there a final verdict about the topic, or still two camps without agreement? Kinda curious whether or not, among other violations of pointless laws that have zero enforcement and thus without any practical worries about my illegal acts, I will continue breaking the law when ladies come by and I give them baht when they leave.

Anyway, talking about legal issues, another potential legal concern for mongers (at least in theory) is fucking a married lady and getting caught by husband.

There is not one enforceable Thai Penal Code section nor any statement in the Prevention and Suppression of Prostitution Act that states that the act of exchanging money for sex, Prostitution, is "illegal" in private and between consenting adults in Thailand. None. Nor has there ever been one.

That is why the "just trust us, it is illegal" crowd have never been able to quote or link to one.

Nor has anyone in the history of Thailand ever been arrested, charged, convicted and / or sentenced for that exact behavior. Not one. And for a very good reason; Thai culture and society would never tolerate such a law being put on the books. Only for tangential behaviors related to prostitution that are clearly spelled out and described in the Code and Act that every punter and prostitute can easily avoid by simply being mindful not to shout negotiations for it from one side of the soi to another, don't flaunt or advertise the behavior openly and shamefully in public, do confine it to consenting adults and a maybe couple of other small details that the customer is rarely if ever at risk of "committing" anyway; visa, work permit, loitering or creating a public nuisance issues and such.

But we are still open to read and evaluate any quote or link from any legally enforceable Code, Act or Edict that shows it is illegal. However, as of this moment nobody has ever produced and posted one.