American Politics

[SubCmdr]

I've said from the start that I am a beginner rider looking for the best starter bike for the money.

Google is weird here (Thailand). Six dealerships have is listed they sell CFMoto. None of them did. So, after learning I not going to actually buy the moto of my choice I have come back to: Royal Enfield - Guerrilla 450.

But it was hard for me to make a final decision. So I am also going to get a sport bike for the track and either a tourer or a scrambler and set them up with luggage for my long trips. I have zero interest in going off road here in Thailand (at least until I take my off-road riding course).

How does this relate to politics?

I find it interesting that the China Man is in the Dis-United States of America but is not here in Thailand. At least you can get good bourbon here. Individuals in the Dis-United States of America think they are the center of the world. They have the biggest market but there is an entire world out there. Everyday they are busting their asses to build lives like the once citizens of the Dis-United States of America take for granted. The underdog is counting on not being paid attention to until they start kicking ass and taking names. I read where someone says industries decline is part of the economic cycle. Maybe it is time that the Dis-United States of America recognizes it is on the decline. The Republican Morons are the cause. Time to either do something about it or goes softly in to the night.

Until Harley-Davidson designs and builds a reliable motorcycle for a beginner under 10 K USD, I will not be representing the Dis-United States of America nor voting for their products.

[EihTooms]

There Are Two Chinas, and America Must Understand Both.

The technological success that has captured the attention of many in the United States is one aspect of the Chinese economy. There's another, gloomy one.

Listen to this article 8:25 min Learn more.

Share full article.

404.

In an illustration, shadowy sharks gather under a speedboat tethered to a large ship whose red hull is painted as the Chinese flag. The speedboat carries four people, one of them holding a large Chinese flag.

Credit. Dongyan Xu.

Li Yuan.

By Li Yuan.

May 13,2025.

Updated 1:16 am ET.

Two Chinas inhabit the American imagination: One is a technology and manufacturing superpower poised to lead the world. The other is an economy that's on the verge of collapse.

Each reflects a real aspect of China.

One China let's call it hopeful China is defined by companies like the A. I. Start-up DeepSeek, the electric vehicle giant BYD and the tech powerhouse Huawei. All are innovation leaders.

Jensen Huang, the chief executive of the Silicon Valley chip giant Nvidia, said China was "not behind" the United States in artificial intelligence development. Quite a few pundits have declared that China would dominate the 21st century.

The other China gloomy China tells a different story: sluggish consumer spending, rising unemployment, a chronic housing crisis and a business community bracing for the impact of the trade war.

President Trump, as he tries to negotiate a resolution of a trade war, must reckon with both versions of America's arch geopolitical rival.

The stakes have never been higher to understand China. It's not enough to fear its successes, or take solace in its economic hardships. To know America's biggest rival requires seeing how the two Chinas are able to coexist.

"Americans have too many imagined notions about China," said Dong Jielin, a former Silicon Valley executive who recently moved back to San Francisco after spending 14 years in China teaching and researching the country's science and technology policies. "Some of them hope to solve American problems using Chinese methods, but that clearly won't work. They don't realize that China's solutions come with a lot of pain. ".

Image.

Two factory employees working on elevated vehicles, both partially built, on a vehicle assembly line.

The vehicle assembly lines of Geely Automobile's Zeekr Factory in Ningbo, China. Credit. Qilai Shen for The New York Times.

Just like the United States, China is a giant country full of disparities: coastal vs. Inland, north vs. South, urban vs. Rural, rich vs. Poor, state-owned vs. Private sector, Gen X vs. Gen Z. The ruling Communist Party itself is full of contradictions. It avows socialism, but recoils from giving its citizens a strong social safety net.

Chinese people, too, grapple with these contradictions.

Despite the trade war, the Chinese tech entrepreneurs and investors I talked to over the past few weeks were more upbeat than any time in the past three years. Their hope started with DeepSeek's breakthrough in January. Two venture capitalists told me that they planned to come out of a period of hibernation they started after Beijing's crackdown on the tech sector in 2021. Both said they were looking to invest in Chinese A. I. Applications and robotics.

Want to stay updated on what's happening in China? Sign up for Your Places: Global Update, and we'll send our latest coverage to your inbox.

But they are much less optimistic about the economy the gloomy China.

The 10 executives, investors and economists I interviewed said they believed that China's advances in tech would not be enough to pull the country out of its economic slump. Advanced manufacturing makes up about only 6 percent of China's output, much smaller than real estate, which contributes about 17 percent of gross domestic product even after a sharp slowdown.

When I asked them whether China could beat the United States in the trade war, nobody said yes. But they all agreed that China's pain threshold was much higher.

It's not hard to understand the anxiety felt by Americans frustrated with their country's struggles to build and manufacture. China has constructed more high-speed rail lines than the rest of the world, deployed more industrial robots per 10,000 manufacturing workers than any country except South Korea and Singapore and now leads globally in electric vehicles, solar panels, drones and several other advanced industries.

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Image.

A long field of solar panels, nine rows across and going far into the distance.

Solar panels in Ningbo, China. Credit. Gilles Sabri for The New York Times.

Many of China's most successful companies have gained resilience from the economic downturn and are better prepared for the bad days ahead. "They've been DOGE-ing for a long time," said Eric Wong, the founder of the New York hedge fund Stillpoint who visits China every quarter, referring to the Trump administration's cost-cutting effort known as the Department of Government Efficiency. "By comparison, the USA Has been living in excess for a long time. ".

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But as we marvel at China's so-called miracles, it is necessary to ask: At what cost? Not just financial, but human.

China's top-down innovation model, heavily reliant on government subsidies and investment, has proved to be both inefficient and wasteful. Much like the overbuilding in the real estate sector that triggered a crisis and erased much of Chinese household wealth, excessive industrial capacity has deepened imbalances in the economy and raised questions about the model's sustainability, particularly if broader conditions worsen.

Trump Administration: Live Updates.

Updated.

May 13,2025, 1:41 pm ET2 hours ago.

Trump Administration Cuts Additional $450 Million in Grants to Harvard.

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The electric vehicle industry shows the force of the two Chinas. In 2018, the country had nearly 500 E. V. Makers. By 2024, about 70 remained. Among the casualties was Singulato Motors, a start-up that raised $2. 3 billion from investors, including local governments in three provinces. Over eight years, the company failed to deliver a single car and filed for bankruptcy in 2023.

The Chinese government tolerates wasteful investment in its chosen initiatives, helping fuel overcapacity. But it is reluctant to make the kind of substantial investments in rural pensions and health insurance that would help lift consumption.

"Technological innovation alone cannot resolve China's structural economic imbalances or cyclical deflationary pressures," Robin Xing, the chief China economist at Morgan Stanley, said in a research note. "In fact," he wrote, "recent advances in technology may reinforce policymakers' confidence in the current path, increasing the risk of resource and capital misallocation. ".

The Chinese leadership's obsession with technological self-reliance and industrial capacity is not helping its biggest challenges: unemployment, weak consumption and a reliance on exports, not to mention the housing crisis.

Officially, China's urban unemployment rate stands at 5 percent, excluding jobless migrant workers. Youth unemployment is 17 percent. The real numbers are believed to be much higher. This summer alone, China's colleges will graduate more than 12 million new job seekers.

Mr. Trump was not wrong in saying factories are closing and people are losing their jobs in China.

In 2020 Li Keqiang, then the premier, said the foreign trade sector, directly or indirectly, accounted for the employment of 180 million Chinese. "A downturn in foreign trade will almost certainly hit the job market hard," he said at the onset of the pandemic. Tariffs could be much more devastating.

Beijing is playing down the effect of the trade war, but as negotiators held talks last weekend with their USA Counterparts, its impact was obvious. In April, Chinese factories experienced the sharpest monthly slowdown in more than a year while shipments to the United States plunged 21 percent from a year earlier.

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All of the economic fallout will be shouldered by people like a man I spoke to, with the surname Chen, a former university librarian in a megacity in southern China. He asked that I not use his full name and where he lived to shield his identity from the authorities.

Mr. Chen lives in the gloomy China. He stopped taking the vaunted high-speed trains because they cost five times as much as a bus. Flying is often cheaper, too.

He lost his job last year because the university, one of the top ones in the country, was facing a budget shortfall. Many state-run institutions have had to let people go because many local governments, even in the wealthiest cities, are deeply in debt.

Because he's in his late 30's, Mr. Chen is considered too old for most jobs. He and his wife had given up on buying a home. Now with the trade war, he expects that the economy will weaken further and that his job prospects will be dimmer.

"I've become even more cautious with spending," he said. "I weigh every penny. ".

GOD (AKA Donald J Trump) is FUCKING GREAT.

The China I am referring to is the one on which numbskull Trump imposed a 145% Tariff on everything along with grandly warning the Whole Wide World that any retribution or retaliation would be met with WORSE and HIGHER Trump Tariffs.

Followed by the Whole Wide World watching that China's retribution and retaliation right back onto America with even WORSE Tariffs.

Followed by the Whole Wide World watching Trump buckling, caving, grabbing his knees and taking it up the ass without KY-Jelly directly from Xi and THAT China until now he will only add a 10-30% Numbskull Trump Tariiff Additional Tax on the American Consumer onto everything they want and need to buy from China.

And this is after Xi and THAT China kicked Trump's ass up into his empty skull the first time around when Trump's failed Tariffs and Trade War with China resulted in THAT China getting damn near everything they wanted in exchange for giving virtually NOTHING to America while Trump plunged the USA Manufacturing and Agriculture sectors into a Recession so deep he had to issue emergency welfare checks just to keep them afloat.

Oh and all while American farmers lost global customers to THAT China, never to return to American farmers again.

That is the China I and the rest of the Whole Wide World have been watching ream Trump's by now raw and bleeding ass since at least 2017.

Sort out whichever one you want it to be in order to sleep better at night in the new Woke Pope's old neighborhood you live in.

[Sirioja]

Even Murdoch's Wall Street Journal had to admit Trump essentially bent over, grabbed his knees, unable to touch his calves much less his ankles, and took it up the ass without KY-Jelly from Xi and All Of China:

The Great Trump Tariff Rollback.
The President started a trade war with Adam Smith. He lost.

https://www.wsj.com/opinion/u-s-chin...nping-a561d16b

You know, it might be marginally ok for him to jerk himself and everyone else off when he is buying or selling one of his failed golf resorts from or to a gaggle of drunks.

But all of this in, out, confusion, incoherence, blithering blather, feigned or genuine incompetence doesn't work when he's dealing with real world businesses, the national and global economy.

Now, your dangerous Trump is dealing with djihadhists, with new air force from Qatar, when Boeing are not able. And with Syria?

[RamDavidson84]

The best motorcycle is the one you swing your leg over and are riding at the moment.

Which one do you own? You need to define best. Why do you think those models or best? I suspect you don't ride. You have never mentioned it. Only your hate of all things EV. I actually bought a AJEV scooter for running errands around town.

I am a poor (insert color of your choice here) man trying to make it in a (insert color of your choice here) man's world. Cash rules everything around me since I don't have much. I am looking to get the most for my dollar. Right now that is looking like CF Moto. The China Man is fucking the market up. In a good way! More tech, more power, less cost. That is why this topic is political. I see mother fucks posting about China this and China that. But those same mother fucks have exactly zero experience with Chinese motorcycles. That's cool. If they want to speak from a base that shows they have no knowledge on the issue that is fine.

I would like a BMW but that is a pure vanity purchase to have the symbol on my tank. No real reason to spend the money. I would argue from my personal research that Chinese are making the best bikes in the world market today.

But you haven't ridden a Chinese Bike but you have an opinion on it. Exactly how did you form your opinion?

It is my choice how as a grown man I spend my hard earned dollars RamDavison. That is magnanimous of you to grant me your permission to spend my money how I choose. It's called the pursuit of happiness. I suggest you check the Declaration of Independence (your country of origin) for further details.

ROTFLMAO!

I have made the mistake of trying to save a few bucks by going with a newer unproven brand and usually I end up regretting it, so for me personally I wouldn't gamble on a chinese bike. They may be great as I hear the evs coming out China are as good as teslas. I personally wouldn't know. For my money, if I was going to get a budget bike, I would go with used low mileage Jap bike, honda suzuke or a kawi. I grew up on atvs and dirt bikes and them Japs make a fuckin great reliable product that delivers. Also a huge dealer net work, good resale value, easy to find a mechanic who can work on it.

I would gamble on a royal enfield as I have heard good things about them and they are a budget friendly do it all bike. Great if you will be taking it on rough old roads or dirt trails.

[MarquisdeSade1]

Even Murdoch's Wall Street Journal had to admit Trump essentially bent over, grabbed his knees, unable to touch his calves much less his ankles, and took it up the ass without KY-Jelly from Xi and All Of China:

The Great Trump Tariff Rollback.
The President started a trade war with Adam Smith. He lost.

https://www.wsj.com/opinion/u-s-chin...nping-a561d16b

You know, it might be marginally ok for him to jerk himself and everyone else off when he is buying or selling one of his failed golf resorts from or to a gaggle of drunks.

But all of this in, out, confusion, incoherence, blithering blather, feigned or genuine incompetence doesn't work when he's dealing with real world businesses, the national and global economy.

There Are Two Chinas, and America Must Understand Both.

The technological success that has captured the attention of many in the United States is one aspect of the Chinese economy. There's another, gloomy one.

Listen to this article · 8:25 min Learn more.

Share full article.

404.

In an illustration, shadowy sharks gather under a speedboat tethered to a large ship whose red hull is painted as the Chinese flag. The speedboat carries four people, one of them holding a large Chinese flag.

Credit. Dongyan Xu.

Li Yuan.

By Li Yuan.

May 13,2025.

Updated 1:16 am ET.

Two Chinas inhabit the American imagination: One is a technology and manufacturing superpower poised to lead the world. The other is an economy that's on the verge of collapse.

Each reflects a real aspect of China.

One China — let's call it hopeful China — is defined by companies like the A. I. Start-up DeepSeek, the electric vehicle giant BYD and the tech powerhouse Huawei. All are innovation leaders.

Jensen Huang, the chief executive of the Silicon Valley chip giant Nvidia, said China was "not behind" the United States in artificial intelligence development. Quite a few pundits have declared that China would dominate the 21st century.

The other China — gloomy China — tells a different story: sluggish consumer spending, rising unemployment, a chronic housing crisis and a business community bracing for the impact of the trade war.

President Trump, as he tries to negotiate a resolution of a trade war, must reckon with both versions of America's arch geopolitical rival.

The stakes have never been higher to understand China. It's not enough to fear its successes, or take solace in its economic hardships. To know America's biggest rival requires seeing how the two Chinas are able to coexist.

"Americans have too many imagined notions about China," said Dong Jielin, a former Silicon Valley executive who recently moved back to San Francisco after spending 14 years in China teaching and researching the country's science and technology policies. "Some of them hope to solve American problems using Chinese methods, but that clearly won't work. They don't realize that China's solutions come with a lot of pain. ".

Image.

Two factory employees working on elevated vehicles, both partially built, on a vehicle assembly line.

The vehicle assembly lines of Geely Automobile's Zeekr Factory in Ningbo, China. Credit. Qilai Shen for The New York Times.

Just like the United States, China is a giant country full of disparities: coastal vs. Inland, north vs. South, urban vs. Rural, rich vs. Poor, state-owned vs. Private sector, Gen X vs. Gen Z. The ruling Communist Party itself is full of contradictions. It avows socialism, but recoils from giving its citizens a strong social safety net.

Chinese people, too, grapple with these contradictions.

Despite the trade war, the Chinese tech entrepreneurs and investors I talked to over the past few weeks were more upbeat than any time in the past three years. Their hope started with DeepSeek's breakthrough in January. Two venture capitalists told me that they planned to come out of a period of hibernation they started after Beijing's crackdown on the tech sector in 2021. Both said they were looking to invest in Chinese A. I. Applications and robotics.

Want to stay updated on what's happening in China? Sign up for Your Places: Global Update, and we'll send our latest coverage to your inbox.

But they are much less optimistic about the economy — the gloomy China.

The 10 executives, investors and economists I interviewed said they believed that China's advances in tech would not be enough to pull the country out of its economic slump. Advanced manufacturing makes up about only 6 percent of China's output, much smaller than real estate, which contributes about 17 percent of gross domestic product even after a sharp slowdown.

When I asked them whether China could beat the United States in the trade war, nobody said yes. But they all agreed that China's pain threshold was much higher.

It's not hard to understand the anxiety felt by Americans frustrated with their country's struggles to build and manufacture. China has constructed more high-speed rail lines than the rest of the world, deployed more industrial robots per 10,000 manufacturing workers than any country except South Korea and Singapore and now leads globally in electric vehicles, solar panels, drones and several other advanced industries.

Editors' Picks.

I'm Dating My Friend's Ex. Is That Wrong?

A New Biography of Mark Twain Doesn't Have Much of What Made Him Great.

Remarrying in Retirement? It Can Make Money Management Tricky.

Image.

A long field of solar panels, nine rows across and going far into the distance.

Solar panels in Ningbo, China. Credit. Gilles Sabrié for The New York Times.

Many of China's most successful companies have gained resilience from the economic downturn and are better prepared for the bad days ahead. "They've been DOGE-ing for a long time," said Eric Wong, the founder of the New York hedge fund Stillpoint who visits China every quarter, referring to the Trump administration's cost-cutting effort known as the Department of Government Efficiency. "By comparison, the USA Has been living in excess for a long time. ".

Advertisement.

SKIP ADVERTISEMENT.

But as we marvel at China's so-called miracles, it is necessary to ask: At what cost? Not just financial, but human.

China's top-down innovation model, heavily reliant on government subsidies and investment, has proved to be both inefficient and wasteful. Much like the overbuilding in the real estate sector that triggered a crisis and erased much of Chinese household wealth, excessive industrial capacity has deepened imbalances in the economy and raised questions about the model's sustainability, particularly if broader conditions worsen.

Trump Administration: Live Updates.

Updated.

May 13,2025, 1:41 pm ET2 hours ago.

Trump Administration Cuts Additional $450 Million in Grants to Harvard.

Saudi Arabia's King Salman has been absent so far from Trump state visit.

Trump aims to use more F. Be. I. , drug and gun agents to pursue immigrants.

The electric vehicle industry shows the force of the two Chinas. In 2018, the country had nearly 500 E. V. Makers. By 2024, about 70 remained. Among the casualties was Singulato Motors, a start-up that raised $2. 3 billion from investors, including local governments in three provinces. Over eight years, the company failed to deliver a single car and filed for bankruptcy in 2023.

The Chinese government tolerates wasteful investment in its chosen initiatives, helping fuel overcapacity. But it is reluctant to make the kind of substantial investments in rural pensions and health insurance that would help lift consumption.

"Technological innovation alone cannot resolve China's structural economic imbalances or cyclical deflationary pressures," Robin Xing, the chief China economist at Morgan Stanley, said in a research note. "In fact," he wrote, "recent advances in technology may reinforce policymakers' confidence in the current path, increasing the risk of resource and capital misallocation. ".

The Chinese leadership's obsession with technological self-reliance and industrial capacity is not helping its biggest challenges: unemployment, weak consumption and a reliance on exports, not to mention the housing crisis.

Officially, China's urban unemployment rate stands at 5 percent, excluding jobless migrant workers. Youth unemployment is 17 percent. The real numbers are believed to be much higher. This summer alone, China's colleges will graduate more than 12 million new job seekers.

Mr. Trump was not wrong in saying factories are closing and people are losing their jobs in China.

In 2020 Li Keqiang, then the premier, said the foreign trade sector, directly or indirectly, accounted for the employment of 180 million Chinese. "A downturn in foreign trade will almost certainly hit the job market hard," he said at the onset of the pandemic. Tariffs could be much more devastating.

Beijing is playing down the effect of the trade war, but as negotiators held talks last weekend with their USA Counterparts, its impact was obvious. In April, Chinese factories experienced the sharpest monthly slowdown in more than a year while shipments to the United States plunged 21 percent from a year earlier.

Advertisement.

SKIP ADVERTISEMENT.

All of the economic fallout will be shouldered by people like a man I spoke to, with the surname Chen, a former university librarian in a megacity in southern China. He asked that I not use his full name and where he lived to shield his identity from the authorities.

Mr. Chen lives in the gloomy China. He stopped taking the vaunted high-speed trains because they cost five times as much as a bus. Flying is often cheaper, too.

He lost his job last year because the university, one of the top ones in the country, was facing a budget shortfall. Many state-run institutions have had to let people go because many local governments, even in the wealthiest cities, are deeply in debt.

Because he's in his late 30's, Mr. Chen is considered too old for most jobs. He and his wife had given up on buying a home. Now with the trade war, he expects that the economy will weaken further and that his job prospects will be dimmer.

"I've become even more cautious with spending," he said. "I weigh every penny. ".

GOD (AKA Donald J Trump) is FUCKING GREAT.

[EihTooms]

Almost no more tax for Chinese products. Trump is really a dangerous, ridiculous clown. Bullshiting with no balls. Many Chinese toys are dangerous for children.

Even Murdoch's Wall Street Journal had to admit Trump essentially bent over, grabbed his knees, unable to touch his calves much less his ankles, and took it up the ass without KY-Jelly from Xi and All Of China:

The Great Trump Tariff Rollback.
The President started a trade war with Adam Smith. He lost.

https://www.wsj.com/opinion/u-s-chin...nping-a561d16b

You know, it might be marginally ok for him to jerk himself and everyone else off when he is buying or selling one of his failed golf resorts from or to a gaggle of drunks.

But all of this in, out, confusion, incoherence, blithering blather, feigned or genuine incompetence doesn't work when he's dealing with real world businesses, the national and global economy.

[EihTooms]

Nah, Bill Maher just tells like it is and calls people out on their bullshit. If anything I would say for the longest time he leaned strong left, then left went to extreme for even him.

The right loves him because he lies about the Dems every week on his shows, repeats the most ridiculous MAGA-fabricated nonsense about them. I would say MAGAs should really love him considering the margin of victory for Trump in the only three swing states that mattered was so razor-thin it very likely could have hinged on just those MAGA lies Bill Maher repeated for them to his audience every week for the past two years.

Aside from the debunked lies he continued to repeat about the Dems, his criticism of what he objects to with Trump and the Repubs is emotionally detached, amused, delivered in a way so it would not be taken too seriously vs the criticism he has for the Dems, mostly lies, delivered with venom and disgust.

He has been practically 100% MAGA for a couple of years.

[EihTooms]

Your lame attempts to gaslight ISG are absurdly weak, give it up you're just wasting your electricity.

https://www.breitbart.com/europe/202...-pakistan-war/

India rejects Trump's claim his trade concessions de-escalated India-Pakistan tensions.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/india-rej...BaEvSqCX5GQcgc

NEW DELHI (AP) The Indian government on Tuesday rejected U.S. President Donald Trumps claim that he helped broker a ceasefire between India and Pakistan in exchange for trade concessions.
..........
New Delhi also rejected Trump's offer for mediation on Tuesday.

We have a longstanding national position that any issues related to the federally controlled union territory of Jammu and Kashmir must be addressed by India and Pakistan bilaterally. There has been no change to the stated policy, Jaiswal said.

Wringing your hands and begging, "Come on you guys, just stop it" rarely wins anyone a Nobel Peace Prize.

Maybe Trump can buy one by lowering his ilegally-enacted tariffs on Norway.

[Sirioja]

Almost no more tax for Chinese products. Trump is really a dangerous, ridiculous clown. Bullshiting with no balls. Many Chinese toys are dangerous for children.

[MarquisdeSade1]

But but but Donnie Two Dolls is stealing all those Billions and Billions and Billions of dollars China was going to give us to pay for everything we want and need like Childcare because Childcare is Childcare and groceries, god I'm glad Trump invented that word, and make all Americans rich from those Trump Tariffs!

He denies America those Billions and Billions and Billions of free money from other countries every time he buckles and caves on 1 Tariff percentage point!

USA And China agree to slash tariffs for 90 days in major trade breakthrough.

https://www.cnbc.com/2025/05/12/us-a...ndroidappshare

Oh, BTW, has somebody finally explained to Donnie Two Dolls than an illegally-enacted presidential Executive Order to raise, lower, raise, lower, buckle and cave, raise, lower, raise, buckle and cave, etc etc tariffs is not a "Trade Deal", whether it is enacted on goods from the United Kingdom, China, Mars, The Moon or anywhere else?

Your lame attempts to gaslight ISG are absurdly weak, give it up you're just wasting your electricity.

https://www.breitbart.com/europe/202...-pakistan-war/

[RamDavidson84]

But now, best motos are Ducati, Aprilia and BMW, not anymore Japanese, nor US.

Especially adventure bikes. I think for everyday cost effective transportation, still can't beat them Japs though. A lot of really good bikes are being made these days. I would die to ride that V4 through Italy.

[SubCmdr]

The best motorcycle is the one you swing your leg over and are riding at the moment.

But now, best motos are Ducati, Aprilia and BMW, not anymore Japanese, nor US.

Which one do you own? You need to define best. Why do you think those models or best? I suspect you don't ride. You have never mentioned it. Only your hate of all things EV. I actually bought a AJEV scooter for running errands around town.

I am a poor (insert color of your choice here) man trying to make it in a (insert color of your choice here) man's world. Cash rules everything around me since I don't have much. I am looking to get the most for my dollar. Right now that is looking like CF Moto. The China Man is fucking the market up. In a good way! More tech, more power, less cost. That is why this topic is political. I see mother fucks posting about China this and China that. But those same mother fucks have exactly zero experience with Chinese motorcycles. That's cool. If they want to speak from a base that shows they have no knowledge on the issue that is fine.

I would like a BMW but that is a pure vanity purchase to have the symbol on my tank. No real reason to spend the money. I would argue from my personal research that Chinese are making the best bikes in the world market today.

Personally I would risk a Chinese bike, but that is your choice. I am not the expert but have driven a lot of bikes, just my two cents.

But you haven't ridden a Chinese Bike but you have an opinion on it. Exactly how did you form your opinion?

It is my choice how as a grown man I spend my hard earned dollars RamDavison. That is magnanimous of you to grant me your permission to spend my money how I choose. It's called the pursuit of happiness. I suggest you check the Declaration of Independence (your country of origin) for further details.

ROTFLMAO!

[Spidy]

I respect Buffett's investing wisdom, but I think he is a nut job politically. As for being hood winked, you are being hood winked if you think Buffett is a political genius.

As for not minding paying taxes, that is the biggest load of bullshit I have ever heard. I know someone in partnership with Buffett and he said Buffett was a cheap ass mother fucker.

WOW!...you must REALLY be, in some kind of excruciating PAIN?

What I mean is, after finding out, one of YOUR BIGGEST financial investor heroes, is in prefect alignment with what I'm saying, w/r to the billionaires and corporations paying their fair of taxes, for the social good and benefit of a well functioning society, must REALLY just eat you up inside! Arhhh...you poor thing!

As for the bullshit on raising taxes, he is just towing the Democratic company line. Someone who does math as well as he does knows you cannot tax your way out of the debt / deficit problem. The numbers do not add up. ...

To solve the deficit issue, all Americans are going to have to come together and sacrifice. For me, that means more in taxes. For you, that means lower handouts. I am willing to do my part if everyone else is willing to do theirs but not you. You keep making up these bogeymen. MAGA people need to make more. Corporations need to pay more. It is everybody but you, and I do not need to know anything else about you other than that to know what a loser you really are.

Get this, Elvis 2008:

A group of wealthy Canadians calling themselves 'Patriotic Millionaires' (May 11th, 2025) is banding together to lobby governments to increase the amount of taxes they must pay. https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/pat...axes-1.7530936

Yes, some Canadian millionaires are lobbying for a tax change! Why?...They want to pay more!

So even Canadians, are arguing and speaking up to the injustice that "...the system is rigged to tax wages more than wealth and the present inequality in taxes, don't benefit a proper balance in society as a whole". They truly understand and "get it", that "...good social services make Canada a better place to build businesses"

When one of the world's richest men and Canadian 'Patriotic Millionaires' (for example) are speaking out against unfair tax system and want to pay more, it obviously is not something, the so called, Elvis 2008 "Paycheck Superheroes", are EVER going to understand.

But by all means continue, to live in the self-inflicted myth, of the Repub "American Cowboy" and the nonsensical associated culture-wars, perpetrated by this toxic myth.

[RamDavidson84]

Bill Maher has never met an adult who thinks "a man can get pregnant. "

Nor has he ever met a Democratic Party leader pushing to "Defund the Police". Certainly not the way Repubs have tried to do that over and over again.

Bill Maher is a typically pro Repub "bothsider" MSM pundit happy to serve as a Public Relations tool for Trump and any other Repub if doing so will help Repubs win elections.

He has been that way at least since he was more responsible than any other pundit with a weekly GOP Election Rally tv show for getting the 2nd Worst President in USA History elected, GW Bush, back in 2000. His cuddly and lovable dinner date Donald J. Trump being The Worst.

Nah, Bill Maher just tells like it is and calls people out on their bullshit. If anything I would say for the longest time he leaned strong left, then left went to extreme for even him.

[RamDavidson84]

Republican Morons are like the owners of Harley-Davisons

The reason why they think they cannot open up their bikes on the twisties is because they don't know how to control their motorcycles. They know how to ride fast in a straight line.

I took a course to learn how to control my motorcycle. It concluded with a half day on there track. Where we put all of our lessons we learned in the control setting (acceleration, shifting, braking, hitting the apex of the curve by getting your body into the proper position for the lean.

Republican Morons cannot do that. All of the work that is done in that situation is done by the rider. There is not way for a Republican Moron to pay someone to do the work for them. Unless they are the owner of a race team. No, a Republican Moron cannot do the work for themselves to control the motorcycle and that is why they buy big, loud, heavy, overpriced machines in order to feel cool and go really fast in a straight line. A individual that knows how to ride really puts the work in themselves. There is simply no way around it. That is simply not in the character of Republican Moron.

Now tell me: How did Harley-Davison screw up a market where they had a monopoly? Because they failed to recognize the changing market in the Dis-United States of America.

- Credit AI.

Politics aside, I am speaking purely riding here. You can own a Harley / cruiser in Europe and you will get by just fine. Now if you want the best riding experience possible for cities and areas that have winding curvy roads and shorts areas to accelerate in, then a standard motorcycle or a sport bike is going to be immensely more enjoyable. You can burn through corners and winding roads all day, you simply can't do that with the lean angle and peg position of a Harley cruiser or even worse a bagger. The downside is after 30 minutes sitting on a sport bike your back and ass is going to be killing you. They are not set up for long rides, some are more than others. See the Kawsaki Versys 1100. Its the main reason why Harleys barely sell in Europe, its not the Tariffs, its a bike designed for American Highways. I ll buy a Triumph all day over a Harley if I lived in UK. That bike is perfectly suited for the roads of UK. You can be the greatest rider on Earth, but its still going to be a shitty ride taking a Harley through urban streets compared to a sport or standard bike.

Again, if your doing mostly highway miles, the cruiser set up is unmatched. The low rev torque and power of the engines will run strong all day and day after day. Its perfect for touring the country like many riders do. Its also designed to be as stable as possible at highway speeds for long periods of time. You can run a Harley for 500 miles straight at 90 mph with one hand. I have, its awesome. You can't do that on a sport bike, engine revs too high and will burn out prematurely as well as it will be super uncomfortable after your first tank of gas.

Decide what type of riding you want to do and where you want to do it and then choose a bike, but hey your money, do what you want at the end of the day.

As for Harley, they def dropped the ball not changing with the market, but sometimes shit just goes downhill and it is out of your control. No matter what, Americans just aren't getting into riding like they used to. Same thing happened to trains and whale oil once upon a time. Industries rise and fall as technology and societal needs and values evolve. American men ain't what they used to be.