[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1818277]It only means that for dimwits.[/QUOTE]Oh my my. What an adult response. Graduated nursery recently?
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[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1818277]It only means that for dimwits.[/QUOTE]Oh my my. What an adult response. Graduated nursery recently?
[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1817898]Pray tell me, if the transmission rate is so extremely unrealistically low where do all the HIV / AIDS infected people come from (other than in Africa)? Or are they all homosexual IV drug users?
The error in your reasoning is that you are looking at individual statistics whereas the "Cabbages and Condoms" point of view is from a public health perspective. If you can reduce the transmissions rate of STI (not only HIV, but all the other nasties too) by 90% by propagating condom use, then their campaign is a perfectly good example of how to do it.
It is far more science based than 99% of all the "big pharma" campaigns to sell you useless vitamin and mineral supplements.
Furthermore their campaign aims go deeper. One of the key links in the chain to a more wealthy society is reducing the birthrate. Contrary to what you say, one does not need 7 children to replace a missing or failing social security system (the USA is a perfecly good example in that respect). Lower birthrates allow for better education for more children, especially for women. That in its turn gives them better chances to obtain a paying job (rather than only being housewives for a big family) and the (relative) lack of an inexhaustible pool of uneducated workers willing to do dangerous work for a pittance, increases the quality (and price) of the work offered.
Educating (mainly) women and making condoms as easily available as cabbages on the local market (hence the name of their restaurants) was the simple but effective way to achieve their aim.
In that respect "Cabbages and Condoms" has done a sterling job. Perhaps the Pope should grant them sainthood rather than Mother Theresa, who did far less (if anything at all) to attack the root causes of poverty. [/QUOTE]The studies and stats show that people are infected with HIV via the introduction of HIV-tainted blood into the blood stream, most easily by injecting it directly with a needle, but also possible during sex acts where there is a tear in the skin large enough to provide a viable entry point for the virus. Which would need to be quite large. We're not talking shaving nics here. For the latter, anal sex is the most likely act that would provide such an entry point because the inner lining of the anus is thinner than the lining of a vagina. There have been rare instances over the past 35+ years since HIV/AIDS was first noticed and studied where the virus appears to have gotten past the protective chemistry found in a normally lubricated vagina to infect a woman and the viral load in the man's semen was large enough to transmit it without there being a blood stream introduction opportunity, but those are the unlucky extreme exceptions rather than the overwhelming rule. This was well understood in the medical and HIV / AIDS research community by 1992.
The only reason fewer contributors in the USA version of Social Security won't mean it goes belly up in the foreseeable future is because the USA has a working Social Security system already. As the pool of contributors shrinks and the pool of recipients expands, tweaking the current system by simply raising the cap on earned income taxed for the purpose will keep it fully solvent for decades and decades, long after the last of the Baby Boom Generation has died.
But that isn't the case in Thailand. They have no working and effective Social Security system. Over the past 25 years, they were too busy selling and distributing condoms along with terrorizing young people about how we're all going to die a horrible death if we engage in BBFS and BBBJs to set one up. Consequently, it is going to be quite a challenge for that 1. 5 adult child to house, support and provide the basic needs for his (and his spouse's) dad, mom, old-maid aunt and drunk uncle throughout their old age while he and his spouse are also trying to raise their own 1. 5 kid.
[QUOTE=TheCane;1816063]Prior to my trip to Thailand, I had read quite a bit on ISG about racist door policies at some of the go-go clubs. With that knowledge in hand, I was very curious to find out how I would be treated. Overall it was good, but here is a summary of some memorable things that happened.
One night I decided to hit all of the Rainbow clubs at the Nana Entertainment Plaza (NEP). I was going to make it a "Rainbow night". For me, it was to be sort of an experiment since I heard that there were racist door policies at some of those clubs. So, I wanted to see what would happen, and if it was really true. Let me tell you. It's really true. I had no problems getting into Rainbow 1 and 3. It was Rainbow 2 and 4 where there were issues. Rainbow 4 is now actually called are&be, and when I tried to enter the club they told me "members only", which is exactly the kind of thing I read about on ISG. It was "racist code" and nothing more than that!
They told me members only, and that I could only come in if I paid a "membership fee" of 1,200 baht! There were no other customers attempting to enter the club, so I couldn't see if they were telling them the same thing, but I knew it was all bullshit. I didn't want to pay it at first, but I decided to go ahead with the full "experiment". I found it ironic that I was having problems getting into a place called the are&be (Rhythm & Blues) Club!
So I pay the money, and I get in there and the guy puts a card down on my table (photo attached). I call it my honorary "East Asian / Caucasian Card" because that's the kind of customers I saw in there. Once in, things were fine. The waiters / waitresses and girls were friendly, but I have to say there was nothing special about the place at all. Nothing! Also, I found most of the girls to be unattractive! It was nowhere near the best I'd seen in Bangkok. I picked the card up off of my table and put it in my wallet with the intention of filing this report. One drink came with my honorary East Asian / Caucasian Card. I ordered a beer, finished it, and experiment over decided to leave. As I was leaving, I saw the guys out front give a big welcome to Rainbow 4! It was to east Asians who didn't pay shit to get in! The staff inside are&be (Rainbow 4) were cool. It was the door men who were the assholes. Well, I see my honorary card has no expiration date, so I guess I'm east Asian / Caucasian for life!
At Rainbow 2, I couldn't even get in no matter what I did. I got the same "members only" bullshit, and they didn't "offer" any payment of a "membership fee" as a means of gaining access to the club. I asked why I couldn't go in and said was it the color of my skin. They got quiet and one looked down for a second. I asked again pointing to my skin, which is a well-done brown like Obama. Then the one guy doing all the talking nodded silently. I said, "Fuck it! No problem!" There was no need for me to go inside their club when there are so, so many choices in Bangkok. Choices better than theirs. Besides, I didn't want to get too belligerent and have 25 short motherfuckers show up out of nowhere and take me down LOL!
A couple of similar occurrences went down in Pattaya. One was on Walking Street at a club called Lighthouse. I was told "members only", and that I could gain admission by paying 300 baht in advance. By this time during my trip, my "experiments" over, I told the guy to go fuck himself and walked away. At What's Up on Soi 15 in Pattaya, I was denied admission altogether with no "option" of purchasing a "membership". I went to a place right across the street where their doormen had witnessed what had just happened. They were extra courteous and welcomed me in. When I left, again extra courtesy and giving me back slaps knowing that I had been treated with great disrespect across the street.
But here's the pisser about What's Up. So, I take Soi 15 back up to Walking Street and there are two barkers or touts there for What's Up. They have signs and they stop me and encourage me to go check the place out, obviously not knowing what happened before! Unbelievable! I explained to the two guys how I had been denied admission and was told "members only" and all that bullshit. They understood, and then stood there looking a bit dumbfounded and incredulous. I looked back down Soi 15 towards What's Up, put two birds (middle fingers) up into the air and yelled, "Yeah, What's Up? What's Up? Fuck you!" I did it again, and then me and the two guys had a laugh about it. And then I moved on. Evidently, What's Up's racist door policy hasn't been disseminated all the down to the rank and file working the streets.
I have to say that this was an aspect of mongering in Thailand (along with the lady boy flavor) that was something I really did not like. Both are relative small parts of the scene, but both are also still large enough that you're going to notice them, and maybe even be impacted by them, whether you want to be or not. The sons of bitches telling me "members only" at the door are lucky if they earn even 10% of what I do on an annual basis. I don't say that to be arrogant, but it really has to stick in your craw when you show up well-behaved with your pockets loaded with cash (and freely spending it) and somebody who doesn't know you from the man in the moon is going to tell you that you're not good enough to enter their club because of the color of your skin! I should cut the door guys a little bit of a break since I'm sure they're only doing what the boss man told them to do, but still. The only reason I can think of for why I was not admitted to a handful of clubs is perhaps because they thought I was Indian. Now strangely enough, I had three Thai girls totally unrelated to each other in any way ask me if I was Malaysian! So something about me was making Thais think that maybe I was Malaysian. WTF?
At the end of the day, what I was was a decent customer with plenty of money to spend who deserved to be treated with respect. That's what I was. I've never been denied admission to any mongering establishment in Brazil. I've never been denied admission to any mongering establishment in Germany (although I didn't like the vibe of Golden Time and have never returned). In fact, the only country where I have been denied admission is Thailand! In this respect, Thailand earns a solid grade of an "F". Now, I won't be going to Thailand to monger again. And it's not because of having been denied admission to a handful of clubs. Like I said, the choice in Thailand is so huge that these clubs make up only a tiny percentage of the whole. My decision not to return is more because I just don't like Asian women enough to be traveling way off to Thailand repeatedly to monger. I'm glad I went once, but I know I'm much more attracted to the Latinas and the white girls who fuck a monger the way I like it. So, no returns to Thailand for me. Not specifically to monger anyway.
For the record, I would like to state that no club in Phuket denied me, and I patronized many. That's another plus for Phuket in my books, which I liked better than Bangkok or Pattaya anyway. I would also like to state that unlike in Pattaya, the Lighthouse in Bangkok on Soi Cowboy welcomed me with open arms. Also, apologies for the text editor changing the commonly accepted abbreviation for rhythm & blues to are&be. Geez![/QUOTE]Sorry you had to go through that shit. Heading for Thailand / Philippines in July for 6 weeks. I African American and have been to the Philippines but never Thailand. Originally I was thinking of spending 4 weeks in Thailand and 2 weeks in the Philippines. Because of the continuing reports of.
Racist incidences in Thailand I will spend 2 weeks in Thailand and 4 weeks in the Philippines. Most of that time will be in Phuket. I know there is racism everywhere, but the Filipinos showed me much love. The girls speak English and are fun. Will definitely not patronize Rainbow Bangkok and Lighthouse.
Pattaya. I will be traveling with 3 other African Americans and 4 Indian born guys. Thailand and those racism establishments will miss out on money that would have been spent by 8 individuals. The 8 of us know many other mongers who will actively boycott those places.
I have mongered in about 10 countries and have never heard of bullshit like this.
Check out the Philippines if you get a chance. Filipinos have Spanish blood, so many of them resemble Latinas; without the sexiness. Tons of cute girls who are playful and love to joke around.
Will provide a report when I return.
[QUOTE=TheCane;1816063]Prior to my trip to Thailand, I had read quite a bit on ISG about racist door policies at some of the go-go clubs. With that knowledge in hand, I was very curious to find out how I would be treated. Overall it was good, but here is a summary of some memorable things that happened.
One night I decided to hit all of the Rainbow clubs at the Nana Entertainment Plaza (NEP). I was going to make it a "Rainbow night". For me, it was to be sort of an experiment since I heard that there were racist door policies at some of those clubs. So, I wanted to see what would happen, and if it was really true. Let me tell you. It's really true. I had no problems getting into Rainbow 1 and 3. It was Rainbow 2 and 4 where there were issues. Rainbow 4 is now actually called are&be, and when I tried to enter the club they told me "members only", which is exactly the kind of thing I read about on ISG. It was "racist code" and nothing more than that!
They told me members only, and that I could only come in if I paid a "membership fee" of 1,200 baht! There were no other customers attempting to enter the club, so I couldn't see if they were telling them the same thing, but I knew it was all bullshit. I didn't want to pay it at first, but I decided to go ahead with the full "experiment". I found it ironic that I was having problems getting into a place called the are&be (Rhythm & Blues) Club!
So I pay the money, and I get in there and the guy puts a card down on my table (photo attached). I call it my honorary "East Asian / Caucasian Card" because that's the kind of customers I saw in there. Once in, things were fine. The waiters / waitresses and girls were friendly, but I have to say there was nothing special about the place at all. Nothing! Also, I found most of the girls to be unattractive! It was nowhere near the best I'd seen in Bangkok. I picked the card up off of my table and put it in my wallet with the intention of filing this report. One drink came with my honorary East Asian / Caucasian Card. I ordered a beer, finished it, and experiment over decided to leave. As I was leaving, I saw the guys out front give a big welcome to Rainbow 4! It was to east Asians who didn't pay shit to get in! The staff inside are&be (Rainbow 4) were cool. It was the door men who were the assholes. Well, I see my honorary card has no expiration date, so I guess I'm east Asian / Caucasian for life!
At Rainbow 2, I couldn't even get in no matter what I did. I got the same "members only" bullshit, and they didn't "offer" any payment of a "membership fee" as a means of gaining access to the club. I asked why I couldn't go in and said was it the color of my skin. They got quiet and one looked down for a second. I asked again pointing to my skin, which is a well-done brown like Obama. Then the one guy doing all the talking nodded silently. I said, "Fuck it! No problem!" There was no need for me to go inside their club when there are so, so many choices in Bangkok. Choices better than theirs. Besides, I didn't want to get too belligerent and have 25 short motherfuckers show up out of nowhere and take me down LOL!
A couple of similar occurrences went down in Pattaya. One was on Walking Street at a club called Lighthouse. I was told "members only", and that I could gain admission by paying 300 baht in advance. By this time during my trip, my "experiments" over, I told the guy to go fuck himself and walked away. At What's Up on Soi 15 in Pattaya, I was denied admission altogether with no "option" of purchasing a "membership". I went to a place right across the street where their doormen had witnessed what had just happened. They were extra courteous and welcomed me in. When I left, again extra courtesy and giving me back slaps knowing that I had been treated with great disrespect across the street.
But here's the pisser about What's Up. So, I take Soi 15 back up to Walking Street and there are two barkers or touts there for What's Up. They have signs and they stop me and encourage me to go check the place out, obviously not knowing what happened before! Unbelievable! I explained to the two guys how I had been denied admission and was told "members only" and all that bullshit. They understood, and then stood there looking a bit dumbfounded and incredulous. I looked back down Soi 15 towards What's Up, put two birds (middle fingers) up into the air and yelled, "Yeah, What's Up? What's Up? Fuck you!" I did it again, and then me and the two guys had a laugh about it. And then I moved on. Evidently, What's Up's racist door policy hasn't been disseminated all the down to the rank and file working the streets.
I have to say that this was an aspect of mongering in Thailand (along with the lady boy flavor) that was something I really did not like. Both are relative small parts of the scene, but both are also still large enough that you're going to notice them, and maybe even be impacted by them, whether you want to be or not. The sons of bitches telling me "members only" at the door are lucky if they earn even 10% of what I do on an annual basis. I don't say that to be arrogant, but it really has to stick in your craw when you show up well-behaved with your pockets loaded with cash (and freely spending it) and somebody who doesn't know you from the man in the moon is going to tell you that you're not good enough to enter their club because of the color of your skin! I should cut the door guys a little bit of a break since I'm sure they're only doing what the boss man told them to do, but still. The only reason I can think of for why I was not admitted to a handful of clubs is perhaps because they thought I was Indian. Now strangely enough, I had three Thai girls totally unrelated to each other in any way ask me if I was Malaysian! So something about me was making Thais think that maybe I was Malaysian. WTF?
At the end of the day, what I was was a decent customer with plenty of money to spend who deserved to be treated with respect. That's what I was. I've never been denied admission to any mongering establishment in Brazil. I've never been denied admission to any mongering establishment in Germany (although I didn't like the vibe of Golden Time and have never returned). In fact, the only country where I have been denied admission is Thailand! In this respect, Thailand earns a solid grade of an "F". Now, I won't be going to Thailand to monger again. And it's not because of having been denied admission to a handful of clubs. Like I said, the choice in Thailand is so huge that these clubs make up only a tiny percentage of the whole. My decision not to return is more because I just don't like Asian women enough to be traveling way off to Thailand repeatedly to monger. I'm glad I went once, but I know I'm much more attracted to the Latinas and the white girls who fuck a monger the way I like it. So, no returns to Thailand for me. Not specifically to monger anyway.
For the record, I would like to state that no club in Phuket denied me, and I patronized many. That's another plus for Phuket in my books, which I liked better than Bangkok or Pattaya anyway. I would also like to state that unlike in Pattaya, the Lighthouse in Bangkok on Soi Cowboy welcomed me with open arms. Also, apologies for the text editor changing the commonly accepted abbreviation for rhythm & blues to are&be. Geez![/QUOTE]Does anyone know who owns the Rainbow go-gos? My understanding, although I very well could be wrong, is many of the NEP bars are either effectively owned or managed by farangs. If so, the racism at these bars is more a reflection of farang racism than it is Thai racism, although like in most of Asia, I don't doubt there is enough of the latter to go around.
In any case, I would be interested in knowing what type of people (crudely put, what race of people) is behind the racism at some of the NEP bars.
[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1819052]Does anyone know who owns the Rainbow go-gos? My understanding, although I very well could be wrong, is many of the NEP bars are either effectively owned or managed by farangs. If so, the racism at these bars is more a reflection of farang racism than it is Thai racism, although like in most of Asia, I don't doubt there is enough of the latter to go around.
In any case, I would be interested in knowing what type of people (crudely put, what race of people) is behind the racism at some of the NEP bars.[/QUOTE]Unlikely "many " are owned by farangs. Many in cowboy are owned by middle eastern men from my understanding.
[QUOTE=Breadman;1819206]Unlikely "many " are owned by farangs. Many in cowboy are owned by middle eastern men from my understanding.[/QUOTE]Many on the right side when walking from soi 23 toward are owned by the guy they call the Arab. Not sure he is Arab but is a middle eastern guy I understand. His bars are a rip off. Try to avoid them. They usually don't have many customers in them when I looked. coyotes dancers if i remember correctly Now this is mostly hear say except the part I have actually seen. Names have changed according to google maps.
[QUOTE=Mackin;1819291]Many on the right side when walking from soi 23 toward are owned by the guy they call the Arab. Not sure he is Arab but is a middle eastern guy I understand. His bars are a rip off. Try to avoid them. They usually don't have many customers in them when I looked. coyotes dancers if i remember correctly Now this is mostly hear say except the part I have actually seen. Names have changed according to google maps.[/QUOTE]My understanding is the guy who ruined Soi Cowboy, while often referred to as "the Arab," is actually Iranian, not an Arab.
But I remember hearing a guy named Matt, who I thought was a farang, owned a couple of the NEP places, and I thought other farangs owned some others. Not meaning they own the land, but rather the businesses. Does anyone know any specifics as to whether most of the businesses within NEP are farang-owned, owned by Thais, or something else? And given the Rainbow bars may be the most racist, I would particularly be interested in who owns those businesses.
[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1819296]My understanding is the guy who ruined Soi Cowboy, while often referred to as "the Arab," is actually Iranian, not an Arab.
But I remember hearing a guy named Matt, who I thought was a farang, owned a couple of the NEP places, and I thought other farangs owned some others. Not meaning they own the land, but rather the businesses. Does anyone know any specifics as to whether most of the businesses within NEP are farang-owned, owned by Thais, or something else? And given the Rainbow bars may be the most racist, I would particularly be interested in who owns those businesses.[/QUOTE]Here is the link to a Stickman Weekly article on the subject from July 26, 2015:
The Big Boys of the Bangkok Bar Industry
[URL]http://www.stickmanbangkok.com/StickmanWeeklyColumn2015/Bangkok-bar-industry.htm[/URL]
As I read it, Stickman reveals the Rainbow Group of bars is Thai-owned.
[QUOTE=EihTooms;1819378]Here is the link to a Stickman Weekly article on the subject from July 26, 2015:
The Big Boys of the Bangkok Bar Industry
[URL]http://www.stickmanbangkok.com/StickmanWeeklyColumn2015/Bangkok-bar-industry.htm[/URL]
As I read it, Stickman reveals the Rainbow Group of bars is Thai-owned.[/QUOTE]Thanks for the link. It made for interesting reading.
[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1819383]Thanks for the link. It made for interesting reading.[/QUOTE]You're welcome. Regarding the Thai family-owned Rainbow Group, their formula as Stickman describes it is not about partying or gimmicks, but all about finding someone to barfine. Yet, I rarely find anyone in a Rainbow bar I want to barfine. That is especially so in the most successful one, Rainbow 4 (renamed to something else now, R&B Bar or something like that). Tons of silicone, a couple of suspected ladyboys in the mix that might be convincing enough to fool someone with a few drinks in them, and the vibe from the girls there is just too dreary and downbeat to interest me. Then again, I am not Japanese. Maybe that environment and vibe is just right for their preferred Japanese barfine customer.
[QUOTE=EihTooms;1819388]You're welcome. Regarding the Thai family-owned Rainbow Group, their formula as Stickman describes it is not about partying or gimmicks, but all about finding someone to barfine. Yet, I rarely find anyone in a Rainbow bar I want to barfine. That is especially so in the most successful one, Rainbow 4 (renamed to something else now, R&B Bar or something like that). Tons of silicone, a couple of suspected ladyboys in the mix that might be convincing enough to fool someone with a few drinks in them, and the vibe from the girls there is just too dreary and downbeat to interest me. Then again, I am not Japanese. Maybe that environment and vibe is just right for their preferred Japanese barfine customer.[/QUOTE]Have to admit I have a very simmilar view of RB4. Plus met some girls that were just far too aggresive. There maybe some nice girls there, but few with nice looks and fun personality.
CH is very different. More natural girls. More shy girls. Not so many quickie oriented girls.
In my history at RB4 only had one really nice girl. She stayed LT and was rather skinny, a little too skinny. Not much padding for comfortable sex. Did not repeat her even she was nice character.
RB4 was a biring bar for me. So was Bacarra. Girls jigging slightly on the stage eyes staring into space thinking of being sonewhere else.. Bored out of their brains. Highly altered aliens. That was my feeling.
[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1819296]My understanding is the guy who ruined Soi Cowboy, while often referred to as "the Arab," is actually Iranian, not an Arab.[/QUOTE]In the context of discrimination of black people, it is interesting to note that the very first "bar" in what is now called "Soi Cowboy" was opened by an African American ex-US Airforce guy T. G. "Cowboy" Edwards who usually wore a cowboy hat, hence the name of the soi now.
He owned a few bars there and even a restaurant but sadly then lost everything in the divorce from his Thai wife and died a poor man.
Legend has it that he taught his bar girls to "dance". Is he the inventor of the "Bangkok Shuffle"?
Can some of you ex-pats refer me to the more trustworthy real estate agencies in Pattaya?
Are there many scams or things I should be looking out for as a first time home buyer in Thailand? I know things like there are only certain properties available to Farang.
[QUOTE=BananaBoi;1828371]Can some of you ex-pats refer me to the more trustworthy real estate agencies in Pattaya? Are there many scams or things I should be looking out for as a first time home buyer in Thailand?[/QUOTE]As a Foreigner, you can't privately own land in Thailand, so you should be looking for a Condo apartment. Companies can own land but officially need over 50% Thai ownership I believe. I don't have knowledge about scams.
[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1819460]In the context of discrimination of black people, it is interesting to note that the very first "bar" in what is now called "Soi Cowboy" was opened by an African American ex-US Airforce guy T. G. "Cowboy" Edwards who usually wore a cowboy hat, hence the name of the soi now.
He owned a few bars there and even a restaurant but sadly then lost everything in the divorce from his Thai wife and died a poor man.
Legend has it that he taught his bar girls to "dance". Is he the inventor of the "Bangkok Shuffle"?[/QUOTE]A little of the History.
[URL]http://www.bangkokeyes.com/2012jul01.html[/URL]
also
[URL]http://www.bangkokeyes.com/mapsoic.html#HISTORY[/URL]
Cowboy was "the" go-go bar area in the 80's and early 90's till eventually Nana Plaza started to compete. Meanwhile much older Pat Pong was known for aggressive touts and rip off bars, (I still went there for the extra raunchy nude bars many years back). Cowboy was the laid back place. In early 90's I was introduced to Midnite Upstairs bar (and maybe Butterfly bar) due to a buddy's uncle having a share in it. However my big interest in Cowboy developed much later when a buddy pointed out that Suzie Wong had introduced full nudity, taking over from Nana Plaza where the former full nudity had been stamped out. Pat Pong was a great place to visit lunchtime or early afternoon in the early 90s for really raunchy misbehaviour in Kangaroo or Annie's Rose, since bar was not at all busy and could have several girls all to yourself. Also had some fun in Queen's Castle or Pussy Galore bars at night (odd visits to Kiss, Firecat, Lipstick). I don't know when the Star of Light arrived. Seems it was around well before my first visit in about 2007.
Unfortunately Cowboy bars have generally gone downhill in recent years with the introduction of The Arab's (Iranian's) Coyote no-go bars. Also Long Gun, Sharks, Dollhouse, Suzie Wong, Deja Vu, even Toy bar have all gone downhill, with less exciting girls than before, more young fatties and much more fake stuff. Closures of good bars like Sheba (was my favorite for a while).
Baccara and Crazy House still going strong and Country Road I guess. Of course plenty of bars in Nana Plaza went downhill or disappeared also. I once liked Angel Witch but bores me these days. I failed to develop a liking for Spankies or any of the Rainbow bars or Billboard. It's a tough business. I guess I changed too. I was a Nana Plaza customer in the long ago years when full nudity was there, e.g. Lollypop and Pretty Lady. Maybe Hollywood.
Baccara downstairs and Sharks should be famous for their Bangkok Shuffle or lack of sexy erotic dancing. At least Suzie Wong used to have some sexy erotic dancers. Crazy House has a mix of raunchy dancers, erotic dancers, and shufflers. I prefer the in between erotic category. I prefer naked beauty and sexy rather than raunchy-ugly. However I see many customers pick the raunchiest dancer, no matter she has a plain face or crap body. I guess they believe the raunchiest perform the best on the bed or they can touch her up the most.
The only advantage I get from choosing girls in bars over other places, is to be able to see the entire package properly, meaning tits need to be uncovered or very skimpily adorned. None of these highly padded bras used by Coyotes. Also I need to be able to see the ass properly. So without nudity in the bars, the ability to see the full package is downgraded and not much use to me. I also largely avoid very fake looking girls, which rules out many in some bars. My favourite bars have always been the ones with full nudity and hot slim natural girls (and not over doing the hip-hop or rap).
A history of nude dancing go-gos (as at 2008):
[url]http://www.bangkokeyes.com/2008apr01.html[/url]