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[QUOTE=Retired Army]Clark is the Old American Airbase in Angeles City about two hours outside of Manila. I imagine it's even longer now because of the increase in traffic.[/QUOTE]
Thanks,
Clarify:As the original question pertains to Airasia, What I meant to say was based only where Airasia flies to and this budget airline (along with others) considers Clark airport (outside of Manila) as Manila itself (or as close to Manila as they can fly to).
PT
Hi Guys,
I am back in Bangkok in a few days I just wanted a bit of info on Eden It will be a long awaited first visit.
Firstly is it open 7 days a week ? because my best option for a visit will be Sunday I am guessing from what I,ve read that a good time to go is around 12.30 midday if anybody was there recently and is a regular then feel free to recomend any particular girls.
Regards,
Mr Cabbage
[QUOTE=Track Cabbage]Hi Guys,
I am back in Bangkok in a few days I just wanted a bit of info on Eden It will be a long awaited first visit.
Firstly is it open 7 days a week ? because my best option for a visit will be Sunday I am guessing from what I,ve read that a good time to go is around 12.30 midday if anybody was there recently and is a regular then feel free to recomend any particular girls.
Regards,
Mr Cabbage[/QUOTE]
There is plenty of info in these and the massage parlour pages about Eden. Have a scout around for those reports, some are very recent.
As for opeing hours it is 7 days but I think you will find it opens around 1pm and closes around midnight. The best time, many say mid afternoon.
There was some report earlier about CIS girls being available in Grace and Rajah hotels for reasonable prices (under 2K for ST) due to lessened demand. What is their service like? Do they do BBBJ or CIM? Are they available at all during the day time and if so when and where? Thanks in advance for all the help.
[QUOTE=Track Cabbage]Hi Guys,
Firstly is it open 7 days a week ? because my best option for a visit will be Sunday I am guessing from what I,ve read that a good time to go is around 12.30 midday if anybody was there recently and is a regular then feel free to recomend any particular girls.
[/QUOTE]
Eden is definitely open seven days a week. The "best time" to visit can be a bit tricky. A lot of girls arrive between 12.30 p.m. and 12.45 p.m., but some will come in right up to 1.00 p.m.
This does present something of a dilemma to the first-time visitor. If you wait until 1.00 p.m. in hopes of seeing every single girl so you have the broadest possible choice, the one you want may be choosen by someone else before the first full line-up of the day. I'm not exaggerating - I've seen 14 ladies disappear from the line-up with 60 seconds around opening time. Some VIP members will come by as soon as Eden opens and ask for a lady by name, whether or not she's physically there at that moment.
My advice is to get there at 12.40 p.m. and if you see a lady you like, pick her right away and let her pick her partner. Don't worry about seeing the entire line-up. If things are happening too fast and furious around opening time, speak to the manager about coming back later when the lady you want will be available. Remember, you are under absolutely no pressure to select a lady. Anybody who claims otherwise is giving deliberate misinformation. Just say, "No thank you, I'll be back later," or "No thank you, not today." Edenpapa (Marc) has stated on many occasions that first-time visitors are welcome just to drop by for a drink and get an understaning of what the club is all about. What you can't do is sit for hours dawdling over a beer.
It's difficult - and may even be pointless - to try to recommend specific Eden ladies. The service is uniformly good from any Eden lady. There aren't any starfish or unenthusiastic performers at Eden. Which one you choose becomes a matter of personal preference. Trust your intuition or ask the manager's advice if you have special wishes. You can't go wrong in either case.
Evil
Hi Evil - I'm not knocking Eden or its girls (I've never been there), but the "procedure" is not my cup of Tom Yum. The idea of having to turn up at a certain window of opportunity (as you say, 12:40pm), and choosing within 60 seconds or missing out on your choice to several other frantic guys just doesn't appeal to me. Just a bit too rushed. To each his own, I guess.
My own preference is to chat and have a drink (or two) in a club with a girl (or two) ;), and see how the chemsitry is. If all is well, then I take them back to the suite to create my own Eden experience (and not limited to 90 minutes). Still, next chance I get, I'll try Eden and hopefully disconfirm my beliefs. (I doubt it, as I rarely go for a midday nookie unless it's a continuation of the night before).
Piper-
There is an alternative. You can also take one or several ladies overnight, usually 10.p.m. to 6.00 a.m. the following morning. Nowadays I either take Eden ladies 24 hours or overnight rather than have sessions in the club. The OP was specifically asking about visiting Eden around opening time for an inhouse session.
But it is true you don't have the opportunity to "chat up" the ladies before you select one. You either go with intuition or trust a recommendation. The setup and concept at Eden are different from most venues in LOS. I understand and appreciate that some punters favor an entirely different approach that allows for more interaction with the lady before making a choice.
I was trying to offer tips to maximize the OP's chances of an enjoyable, rather than frustrating, first-time visit. In a sense, Eden is a bit of a victim of its own success. It has a strong and very loyal "return customer" base - guys who understand the Club and how it works - and they tend to snap up the most desirable ladies quickly. I'm visiting BKK at the end of October and I booked an Eden lady at the end of July to be sure I got my first choice.
But of course a lot of luck is involved. I've seen line-ups of 25 to 30 ladies not only at 1.00 p.m., but also at 8.00 p.m. and all hours in between. And the choice a first-time visitor gets can vary from day to day. One day I saw a full line-up at 1.00 p.m., the very next day less than 10 ladies at 1.00 p.m. Much also depends on how highly the individual punter values a two-lady session or wants to indulge in some of more exotic activities available at Eden.
For me, what's important is the skill some of the ladies have in English, plus the "surefire" service, as I often don't have a lot of time to hunt for freelancers/bar girls who may turn out to be starfish. Everyone has his own priority and it's great that BKK offers something for everyone.
Evil
Sorry, a question guys.
Being new to this forum I am busy looking at threads, trying to familiarize myself with the overall feel of this. One thing I noticed is that no one really comments on the ‘good’ girl situation. I mean all those little sweethearts I see in my office, or swarming the streets at lunch hour, dressed in their cute office uniforms, short skirted with oh that white skin.
Over the years I had quite a number of interesting encounters. The sweet thing was and still is to turn a casual encounter – i.e. run into female in elevators, BTS etc.. – into a temp. second wife routine (or at least great afternoon sex).
Not saying that I am not visiting MP’s. It’s just that all those ‘innocent good girls’ are certainly willing and able.
Thanks
[QUOTE=Jungle Bluebird]Sorry, a question guys.
Being new to this forum I am busy looking at threads, trying to familiarize myself with the overall feel of this. One thing I noticed is that no one really comments on the ‘good’ girl situation. I mean all those little sweethearts I see in my office, or swarming the streets at lunch hour, dressed in their cute office uniforms, short skirted with oh that white skin.
Over the years I had quite a number of interesting encounters. The sweet thing was and still is to turn a casual encounter – i.e. run into female in elevators, BTS etc.. – into a temp. second wife routine (or at least great afternoon sex).
Not saying that I am not visiting MP’s. It’s just that all those ‘innocent good girls’ are certainly willing and able.
Thanks[/QUOTE]
Why would they comment on them? This forum is all about payed sex, those girls you talk about are most certainly not hookers.
There is one section on this board, called Thai Women- Opinions and Advice where some are discussed, but as said this thread is all about the hookers.
[QUOTE=Jc373]Why would they comment on them? This forum is all about payed sex, those girls you talk about are most certainly not hookers.
There is one section on this board, called Thai Women- Opinions and Advice where some are discussed, but as said this thread is all about the hookers.[/QUOTE]
Having been involved with "good girls" over the years, I can say that while they would kill you if you ever called them hookers, they do a better job of extracting money from you then most hookers. My experience is that P4P is much cheaper. A real Thai girlfriend can be very expensive very quickly. Just ask anyone that has ever walked through a shopping mall with a "good" thai girl. While they would not be caught dead asking money for sex, they expect you will cater to their every whim.
Marc is so famous that he gets a lot of P.R.
Glad for him as his business is a real EDen for me at least.
I did not know about this story of the Irish man nor about the Doctor. You have to see it to believe it I guess.
This interview answwer most of the questions you have guys.
Enjoy
Quote :
He Is Known As Mr EdenPapa
The first time we met, myself and my trusty assistant Whosyourdaddy wandered in merely for a look and a drink. We had no intention of going upstairs, but simply wanted to sit and watch the action - and see what all of the fuss was about. After all the press it was getting online, I wanted to check out and then write something about the venue.
The manager sized us up the moment we walked through the door. We said we wanted to order a drink to which he countered with a question to see if we were interested in ladies. Just a drink, we said. He leapt up from his seat, went to the door, opened it, and politely told us we could find a drink elsewhere.
I was startled, a bar manager who didn't want paying customers! We wandered outside, had a laugh to ourselves, and went elsewhere for a drink.
My first impressions of the Eden club were not good, and of the manager, Marc, were not good at all. He had asked me to leave a bar where I was a willing customer, that is, I would have bought some drinks. Being asked to leave a bar, that's the first and only time it has ever happened.
Truth be told, Marc and I should never have developed a friendship, but the total opposite happened. Marc and I grew to be friends. I went back to the club many times to chat with him and then we started to dine out and about around town, always a treat, for Marc is a Frenchman who knows and loves good food.
This week we got together and had a good chat about life, Eden, and of course, fine French food.
Can you remember that first time we met?!
The club was becoming so famous 5 - 6 years ago, that we had to make a choice. No way to have 50 guys in a so small place, so we just cut off the drinking part. Some guys don't even order one drink. Who cares? The beer is the same everywhere, not the ladies.
There still is a little misunderstanding about this rule. Everybody is welcome the first time to buy one drink and understand the concept, if the guy comes back then he knows why. A guy coming to enjoy ladies can have drinks before, during and after. If someone wants just to get drunk then he is for sure not in the right place.
Do you have any idea of how many shy guys come to Thailand? In the club it is easy for them to choose a girl when they are alone. If they see people watching them, they will go into themselves and never choose ladies. It is even worst when a couple is coming. You can not mix sex and a public place. If you do that, you will always have one side of your customers feeling bad. You cannot please everyone. You are either a brothel or a bar. You cannot be both. Our concept is to always have an empty bar area.
Can you run us by a small history of the Eden Club, when you first opened, whose vision it was, and any highlights or milestones along the way?
Very quickly, when I took it over it was already open since 2 years by two friends (French). It was just a regular bar, when they hired me 7 years ago as a manager, before making me partner a few months later by offering me some free shares. Then I used 8 years of experience as a customer in Bangkok's nightlife to make something a little bit different. A common dream, for many guys is to enjoy 2 ladies at the same time. Most of the time it will finish by one lady in the bed, the second one in the bathroom (or 2 meters away in the bed), then we change. To find the real ménage a 3 isn't so easy. Trust me, I know what I am talking about.
A lot of changes happened over time. I spent my time learning and changing and improving, up to the point where it has become to my idea difficult to improve much more.
Surely this is the most boring job in the world, sitting in a small, dark bar lobby, dealing with people of different nationality coming through your door every day?
You have no idea how many guys have told me that I have the best job in the world. Wrong! If I was drinking and playing the ladies for 12 hours a day, then it would be true. But I am not. On the other hand people coming worldwide you meet a lot of interesting guys, a (very) few stupids too.
Can you give me an idea of some your customers and who they are.
Mister everybody, but we have been visited by : soccer stars, Formula 1 people, movie makers and so on... I cannot say names. You know that. We have some big boys from big business too! Many guys use the club for business too. "Marc, this is my boss or my customer - take care of him!" The same way when you send friends for food to Le Beaulieu, when a guy sends another guy to the club for fun he will not lose face either. Everyone is happy!
So in general, what is it like to run this club?
It is difficult, very difficult. If it was so easy you would have 20 or 30 other similar clubs in Bangkok but we still the only one. Everyone who tried to copy us went down. The last one was the cleverest. He opened a bar taking as a partner one lady who was in the club for over 3 years, but it lasted just a few months and they went down. Then you had the guy who openly tried to copy us. Now it is a guesthouse internet place and they are selling sandwiches <He laughs> Not the kind of sandwiches they had in mind when they opened.
If you really want to take care of everything and do things properly then it is a non-stop job.
Are you friendly with other bar owners?
I don't have any problem with them. Some of them are even enjoying the club or sending close friends. Firstly, people never see me outside (except in restaurants). I am no longer a bar guy. Secondly, we are no competition for anyone. We are in a niche market.
What is the record number of girls a guy has taken upstairs, or out?
Inside the club, 20. An Irish guy! We still have the picture to be seen in the club. At this time we used the room with the 13 square metre bed!
Outside the club, 11. We used to call this guy The Doctor. He was spending 50 to 100,000 baht at least a day throughout Bangkok making everybody believe that he was very rich. That day 3 Mercedes Benzes from a famous Bangkok hotel came to pick up the ladies in front of the club. It came out later that this guy was just spending his life savings.
That's the guy who had 580 girls?
Yes, in 8 months!
That is incredible!
It's true! You ask any of the ladies who are still in the club today if they remember the Doctor and believe me, they will remember him!
This poor guy, drinking a lot, abusing 2 to 300mg of Viagra everyday, just finished in a Bangkok Hospital where some member of his family came to take him back to the States.
I have always found myself in a quandary over the industry. I know that a lot of guys enjoy it and pay the girls handsomely, but the industry doesn't just hurt the girls, it can ruin lives. What do you think about that?
I am not feeling guilty at all. This club gives a living to hundreds of people up country, where the ladies sent their earnings I think that the ladies in the club have the best conditions to do this kind of job. They do that and only that. They are not amateurs, they know what they have to do. They are free to come and go as they want. Some ladies have been in the club for 3, 4, 5, 6 years and so on and this means something.
No one can play with them, kissing, feeling their breast, fondling and so on just by buying a mere lady drink (40 baht to the lady), then leaving. How do you think the lady feels after that? No way! Treat them like human beings first, make them feel good, feel real and after they can treat people well.
If a guy wants the real thing, he is welcome. If a guy just wants to play, there are so many places to do it in Bangkok.
5 - 6 years ago an American guy who came quite a few times told me that he loved the club, comparing it to a very famous American fast food joint. You know exactly what you pay and you know exactly what you get. You come, you choose, you enjoy.
There must have been some funny stories of comings and goings over the years. Without naming anyone or giving too much away, what stories spring to mind.
Like better to talk about an outside story. One of our regular talking with his friend who was in his car was explaining his situation in the club with most details, not knowing that he was listened by everybody (wife and kids) in the car (Bluetooth system).
At one time the club had a website but that got taken down. Why was that?
I shut it down myself. It was at the time of the APEC meeting. Someone close to me in an influential position advised me that it would be a good idea to shut it down.
No plans to open it up again?
Umm, in Bangkok, no more. In Pattaya, there will be a website run by John, Eden Club Bangkok's former webmaster who will become Eden Club Pattaya's manager too
I have heard the term Pattaya disease mentioned in the UK for guys who are addicted to Pattaya, who sit in the UK dreaming of their next trip to Fun City. Do you think there are guys with Eden Club disease? I mean there are a number of readers who have told me that they cannot get enough of the place, and that they book in advance before even arriving in the country.
We have lot of regulars and lot of people booking in advance. Even some guys buying the VIP membership before coming.
What does a VIP card get a customer?
Basically it is a bit more expensive than for regular customer, which is opposite to most places, but the member is sure to get the ladies he wants. A VIP's booking supersedes the booking of someone who is not a VIP. Instead of 1,800 for a lady the guy will pay 2,000 for the lady. 15% discount off drinks too but since we are not a bar it is not really a big thing. The main thing is that it gives first choice on the ladies. Now we have a lot of regulars who also have their own regular ladies so VIP cards work well for them.
How many girls do you have?
We did open with 6 ladies and right now around 40, meaning around 30 and over present a day.
You have a new Pattaya operation about to open shortly. Will it be different to the Bangkok operation or will it simply be a new version of your club transplanted down there?
Exactly the same thing in Pattaya. Same concept, same prices. Everyone is asking me about when it will open (around beginning of December) and they get disappointed when I tell them that it is after they have been in town. Many guys want to be in the first 50 customers!
The club has a money back guarantee where any guy who is not satisfied can request his money back. Does that happen often?
It is not even money back because people don't pay until after so if you find a good reason then you do not have to pay. It did happen but not often. Maybe one time every few months, not often at all. The last time it happened was when the guy took two ladies, the ladies did the lesbian thing and one of them tried to get the guy (still with his clothes on) involved and he got nervous and they asked him jokingly if he was gay and then the guy went a bit crazy and came downstairs. I cancelled the session and he left without paying.
What about sexually transmitted diseases?
Each week there is a test for STDs. Each month there is a blood test for HIV and syphilis. This is a proper check, made by a ISO 9001 laboratory, nominative and computerized check, not a hand written piece of paper. This is the real thing.
Each 4 or 5 months we test for drugs. We've got proper kits for the girls to be checked for drugs. I have had some ladies who wanted to be hired but were HIV+ already. Quite a few. Any lady doing anything (except oral) without a condom is fired on the spot. No pity. They even put condoms on the dildos. When you change lady you change of condom too.
There is no way to do it safer.
I believe that you really do not have any real competition. Why is that?
Because you have no idea how difficult it is to run a place like this. All the guys who tried went down. I know why but I am not going to tell you.
It is hard work. What can I say? It is like making a tower with playing cards. If one of your cards is wrong then everything goes down. It is very much like that.
Without giving any secrets away, what are some of the things that you attribute your success to?
My understanding and love of the Thai people helps me a lot because it gives me their respect.
Give the guy what he is coming for and he will not only come back but tell his friends. So many times you get cheated in Thailand. I know what it is like. I was a customer of many bars for 8 years before I started. This is a business and like all business there is only one rule : Value for money.
My main rule is no bullshit!
Is it true that you are no longer involved with the club? What is that?
I have just been hospitalized and got a heart bypass. I need to take it more easy. That's why I put a manager in the club and I have taught him everything. Let's say that now I am more a kind of supervisor, and it will be the same for Pattaya.
Do you think the club can succeed without you? You are an integral part of the business.
I tried to let it go but it didn't work. Now I oblige myself with 2 days in Bangkok a week. In Pattaya, I will be there for 2 - 3 months a lot and then 2 days a week. I have other businesses to run too.
You love your food. What are your favourite places for food in Thailand?
Very good food too at Serge in Le Bouchon in Patpong. Marriot Hotel's buffet and for sure here (Le Beaulieu) and before Charlie's, which has sadly gone.
So the future you? What do you do these days with less time in the bars?
I take care of my other businesses and I take care of my family. I run an import / export business. We will have a car and motorbike website coming, and a latex (clothes) business starting soon, both being done with 2 different partners. I also have a wife and two adopted kids to take care of. That is enough to fill a life. Trust me!
To finish I would like to add: We are the only place in Asia where people can complain when they have finished, and not pay. If something was really wrong just let us know.
There are a few (always the same) individuals who for some reasons hate us for many years and spread false rumours on the Net, always using a different name. It has already been proven and recognised. It is so easy to feel and play God hidden behind a keyboard. As of today the only site I am answering on is : Bangoktonight, Speciality Bars.
The day people will have to post under their real name and with their real picture will be the day you will see less fake info posted on the net. Trust me on that.
I am not saying we are perfect I am just saying that we are trying to do our best. Nobody is perfect.
Eden club is located on Sukhumvit Soi 7/1 and is open from 12:30 PM until midnight, at which time they take last call. Visa, MasterCard and Amex are accepted without extra charges.
Unquote
[QUOTE=Thor93]Having been involved with "good girls" over the years, I can say that while they would kill you if you ever called them hookers, they do a better job of extracting money from you then most hookers. My experience is that P4P is much cheaper. A real Thai girlfriend can be very expensive very quickly. Just ask anyone that has ever walked through a shopping mall with a "good" thai girl. While they would not be caught dead asking money for sex, they expect you will cater to their every whim.[/QUOTE]
This is a gross generalization and quite wrong in my experience.
I have been out with far more non-P4P than P4P (particularly in recent years) over the last 10 years and would say that in almost all cases it was cheaper and a much better experience than any P4P I ever had.
You would have us believe that the minute a "good" TG is in a Mall she goes shopping mad and spends all your money. Bullshit!! With my current GF, I have given her maybe at the most 16,000 baht in actual cash in 5 1/2 months. Sure she lives with me and I pay for food and take her to see a movie most weeks and have bought her the odd trinket, or piece of clothing. But, if one is inclined to be mercenary enough to measure this cost against the daily sex I get, not to mention the companionship, it is a far better deal. For one thing, it is based on genuine feelings and a real relationship versus the pseudo-GFE that many crave and waffle on so much about.
However, I don't really think about it in the first place in terms of comparing it to P4P because you really can't logically compare the two situations. It is really apples and oranges. There's nothing wrong with pursuing a life of meaningless debauchery if that is your desire. Then P4P is the perfect venue for you. But, don't say it's better because you think it's cheaper because, in fact it simply isn't cheaper, nor is it better than a real relationship with a "good" TG.
Just as an aside...and here I'll probably get flamed again...The girls that Jungle Bluebird is talking about are also cuter, sweeter, certainly of better character and just overall better looking than the P4P girls (IMHO). There's something much more pleasant and rewarding in shagging a regular TG than a P4P. It most certainly has to do with male pride and feeding the ego in having a conquest which is made even better within a culture where "good" TGs don't do that sort of thing.
They're also a lot hotter in bed.
JC...
This board is about finding women for sex, not necessarily just hookers.
Now, it is my kind of thing for sure.
"There's nothing wrong with pursuing a life of meaningless debauchery if that is your desire. Then P4P is the perfect venue for you."
I do differ in that I have found the "good girl" theory is really true and universal. I see no different behavior between Thai, Russian, Bosnian, Aussie, Mexican, and American "good girls."
[QUOTE=Jc373]Why would they comment on them? This forum is all about payed sex, those girls you talk about are most certainly not hookers.
There is one section on this board, called Thai Women- Opinions and Advice where some are discussed, but as said this thread is all about the hookers.[/QUOTE]
With all due respect, Jc373, I would disagree: the forums are about consensual sex with women - regardless of the financial arrangements.
While I will grant you most of the talk is about P4P, many of us also engage in "good girl" pursuits. For me, it was a question of learning enough Thai and actually spending enough time there (am in London as I write this) to enable it.
Cheers,
-Y, looking forward to getting back to Bangkok
[QUOTE=Yi Ren]With all due respect, Jc373, I would disagree: the forums are about consensual sex with women - regardless of the financial arrangements.
While I will grant you most of the talk is about P4P, many of us also engage in "good girl" pursuits. For me, it was a question of learning enough Thai and actually spending enough time there (am in London as I write this) to enable it.
Cheers,
-Y, looking forward to getting back to Bangkok[/QUOTE]
Yi Ren is right.
And btw, what group does 'freebies' fall into: P4P or good girls?
:)