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[QUOTE=Helena Moscow]- I imagine what sort of girls they were :) Guess they still cost the same.
Russians are much more generous than you, dear. Just for information.[/quote]
Russian guys more generous, oh my gosh, I ve heard it all now, give me a fucxxxx break, if you like the spending habbits of the russian guys, why the hell do you advert so much on this site, which as far as I can see, no Russian guys participate?
Doc! How dare you! Russian girls have always gotten top dollar! They are the best in the world and deserve to be paid the most out of all working girls. If you don't agree with this then you are greedy! All men always pay at least two to three times what they should! This is normal! If you can not afford to pay more then you should then you are poor! You should probably stay home and just fuck your desperate cheap girls from the village! Do not insult the poor Russian girls by being so greedy! It is normal to over pay if you are a real man.
Did I miss anything? :D
Really Helena, Victoria, do you think we are simple? We aren't New Russians you can shame by calling us greedy or cheap. And most of us have the experience to remember/know what it was like in Moscow even if you can't/don't want to.
It is several messages where I read helena qualifying us or laughing at us as "little dick"
Guys, next time you will be on the point to pay for her too expensive services don't forget that she will smile to you but think "another boring small dick man" ...
Nevertheless, to get back to price discussions, Moscow is the most expensive city in the world. So, why p4p activity should be cheap? It makes no sense.
If you are on a budget, just go to Pattaya where you will find on the beach asian beauties for 10 / 15 euros 1 hour of good sex.
But i guess that if you live in Moscow, most of us as expatriate, your salary allows you to pay 150 USD for a 1 hour sex with a truly beautiful russian dievouchka. imha russian girls remains the most beautiful girsl on the earth and i am glad to pay for that. I know people in Paris who pays the same price as us for an almost ugly 40 years old black mama.
Last point, dating a deivouchka here is very easy. I probably need to pay less than in any other country due to that. So, if the unit price is higher, finally, who cares?
Russian guys are more generous than Westerners indeed.Westerners are considered to be cheap.There are Russians for example who buy an expensive car for their girlfriend on first date or even an apartment.Or they buy gold jewlery that costs doznes of thousands of dollars.Some even tip the waiter with 1000$ in restaurant to show their girlfriends their generousness.
Russian girls are present in every place with high concentration of wealthy men like London City,NY etc and they get lots of rich boyfriends who provide them for their needs.In fact they have become fabulous for doing that.
Anyway from an average western point of view,what these girls ask for and what some Russians provide seems absolutely irrational.
[QUOTE=Helena Moscow]
Russians are much more generous than you, dear. Just for information.
[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Hecker]Russian guys are more generous than Westerners indeed.Westerners are considered to be cheap.There are Russians for example who buy an expensive car for their girlfriend on first date or even an apartment.Or they buy gold jewlery that costs doznes of thousands of dollars.Some even tip the waiter with 1000$ in restaurant to show their girlfriends their generousness.
Russian girls are present in every place with high concentration of wealthy men like London City,NY etc and they get lots of rich boyfriends who provide them for their needs.In fact they have become fabulous for doing that.
Anyway from an average western point of view,what these girls ask for and what some Russians provide seems absolutely irrational.[/QUOTE]
There is a degree of truth to this, but can be only understood correctly by separating "Russian men" from "New Russians".
The average Russian man isn't particularly generous because he doesn't have much money. This goes for young and old. These men aren't going to pay top dollar for *****s because they don't have the money. They can afford the occasional trip to the salon, but that's about it.
The "new middle class" is developing quickly in Moscow and have a very decent income, but these men are much like us in the sense that they work hard for the money they have and pay attention on how they spend it. They can pay a bit more, but like us they aren't going to throw their money out the window. I've talked about this subject with many Russian friends in the "new middle class", guys who drive Lexus jeeps and Audi sedans, and they think pros have gotten too expensive. They usually get their girls at salons, order them into the sauna or pick them up at Russian hotels who have girls. They aren't paying $300 for a girl, more like $100-150 for an hour or two at a salon or sauna.
Besides the oligarchs whom most of you will never meet and never see and when they are not in Europe are bunkered outside of town behind 3 meter walls in 20-room mansions, there are also thousands upon thousands of super rich men in Moscow, who unlike most of the super rich in the West who are also super old, the rich Russian is still fairly young, usually between 35-50 and "earned" his money in a very short time. These guys love to show off their money and subsequently do spoil their women, often to an extreme that we cannot understand or quite frankly from a Western perspective would even consider emasculating. Although there are many true rent-a-beauties on the arms of the hyper-rich and the semi-rich, the women that are the beneficiaries of this cash flashing are just often disappointingly plain or even common, especially when they hit about 30. Quite often it is not a pretty sight. Gabbana and Dior do not a beauty make, especially when combined in a haphazard fashion. The way money is spent demonstrates that money can't buy you taste or class, something Moscow proves over and over again every day.
But money can buy you women, and the more you have the more options you have.
For the super rich, $500 is pocket change. They don't get their girls at Night Flight or CF however, and certainly not at a tochka. Their women come from casinos, restaurants, elite night clubs, agents, strip clubs, dating sites, salons etc. etc.
[QUOTE=Cruiser D]
Really Helena, Victoria, do you think we are simple? We aren't New Russians you can shame by calling us greedy or cheap. And most of us have the experience to remember/know what it was like in Moscow even if you can't/don't want to.[/QUOTE]
That's exactly the point Cruiser, the New Russian can be easily manipulated by women... all you have to do is question his masculinity, which is directly connected to his bank account.
Something the overpriced pro in Moscow also tends to forget, many of us are international travellers and know what $200 is worth in Germany, Brazil, Hong Kong or Dubai. $500? That's 2 days and 6 women hotter than most NF girls in a top flight German FKK. Everything is relative.
There is NO point in trying to argue about prices in Moscow, Moscow is laden with cash right now and there is no correlation between quality and price. This is not only true of the prostitution business but most other service-oriented businesses in Moscow in general.
If a girl can make $500 instead of $200, of course she is going to do it and I don't blame her... that's just business. The point is we don't have to be the ones giving her our business. There are so many other options in Russia and even in Moscow that there is no reason to be a chump and succumb to their propaganda.
[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Something the overpriced pro in Moscow also tends to forget, many of us are international travellers and know what $200 is worth in Brazil[/QUOTE]
Seconded.
Personally some the best sex I've had in my life has been with 200 reals ($100, the average price) brasilian putas in Sao Paulo.
[url]http://www.mclass.com.br/scripts/mclass.dll/main[/url]
The russian hoes arguing about their rates in this thread very largely overvalue their pussy. IMO they also very largely overvalue their attractiveness.
There's many clubs in Sao Paulo where girls like Helena and Victoria could hardly fit in. And I mean just fit in, not even stand out.
Another option for travellers who don't speak russian, wants to see many girls at the same place, and are ready to pay a little bit more than other complicated options (at least for travellers.)
This place is called "hot dog" according to my friends by I wasn't able to check by myself the name.
It is located on the 26 zelioni val street, on the "calcio", very easy to reach by metro: go to Kurskaya metro station, go out, then your are on a place, and then go straight: you arrrive on a quite big street. Yes it is the calcio. Then you see a big big spor bar on the other side of the street, so take the stairs to walk under the street, and you will exit just in front of the bar.
As I said, it is a sport bar during the day so I you enjoy looking at premiership football matchs on giant screen while drinking beers, that's a good place too.
When football match are over, around 11. 00 (at least on Saturday night) the place become crowded by around 30 girls.
Some of them are absolutly tuning, some of them just average. I spoke with many of them and that's my report:
- the most beautiful girl in the bar. Rated 9. 5 over 10. Asked 13 000 rubles for 4 hours of sex at home. No way to bargain, at least at the beginning of the night.
- some amazing girls. Rated between 7. 5 to 9 over 10. May ask between 7000 to 10 000 rubles, negociations started from 13 000 to 8 000. Sama, for 2 to 4 hours sex athome.
- on the average girls, expect to pay 5000 rubles.
I recognise it may be too pricey for moscovite mongerers; but I live here, speak some russian too, but I find this place intersting for the choice and the easy going atmosphere, as the bar itself could be a pub and not a sex joint.
For those who get only few nights, doesnmt speak english, just pick a taxi or take the metro, and you won't regret it. Most of the girls I spoke with had some quite basic english or average english.
Ребята,
Enough already. We all know what we spent, when we spent it, to whom it was paid and what we received in return. Try as she may, Helena cannot change history. Let's get back to exchanging information on where to meet women for sex.
Passepartout's post rang a bell; Hot Dog is the old Boarhouse! It may have been made over and renamed, but as the saying goes, the more things change, the more they stay the same.
[url]http://elementmoscow.ru/articles.php?i=307000&s=10-night-life[/url]
[QUOTE=Passepartout]Another option for travellers who don't speak russian, wants to see many girls at the same place, and are ready to pay a little bit more than other complicated options (at least for travellers.)
This place is called "hot dog" according to my friends by I wasn't able to check by myself the name.
[/QUOTE]
You live in Moscow and couldn't figure out that this "new place" is actually just CF/Boarhouse in disguise? :) The address "Zemlenoi Val 26" should be deeply ingrained into every Moscow monger's psyche!
[url]http://www.boarhouse.ru/boarhouse/main.html[/url]
In any case, thanks for the info... I will have to check it out myself sometime soon... even if I doubt there will be "9s" and "10s" there as you report... but will be happy if I am proved wrong!
[QUOTE=Stravinsky]
Passepartout's post rang a bell; Hot Dog is the old Boarhouse! It may have been made over and renamed, but as the saying goes, the more things change, the more they stay the same.
[url]http://elementmoscow.ru/articles.php?i=307000&s=10-night-life[/url][/QUOTE]
In the article linked by Strav, the author writes:
"BATHROOMS: It is not the clientele, not the menu and not the main interior which have altered most in the transition. No, it is the bathrooms. While our last visit to the Boarhouse W.C. saw used condoms strewn wantonly over the floor, a trip this time round found the conveniences delectably clean. The pop-art design theme continues here, with sinks and doors done out in bold primary colors."
What? Were lonely guys buggering each other in the bathrooms? I've never seen any women in the toilet doing quickies and never heard of it either.
Anybody else hear anything along that line? Sounds like a fairy tale to me.
[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]You live in Moscow and couldn't figure out that this "place" is actually just CF/Boarhouse in disguise?[/QUOTE]I have never been to CF/Boarhouse before, that's true. Is it a crime?
By the way, I am glad to know now that I was in the mythic place.
And it is good for readers of this tread to know that the name has changed and to get a report on this almost new opening.
Let's call it now Hot-dog to avoid confusion?
It is true, the Boarhouse is history as far as inexpensive P4P is concerned. The girls tell me that they are asking for 1500 rubles up front from the girls (500 entrance, 1000 security) whether or not the girls find a customer. Net result is that the P4P prices start at 12000 rubles or so now. None of the previous girls are there anymore and the place is deserted -- Mostly rich Russian men hanging out with one or 2 devuchkas.
The girls are looking for a new home as far as I can see. Saw a few at Molly Gwynns on Novy Arbat, and they claim that some of them are trying to get back to NF. With Boarhouse of CF or Hot Dog or whatever going upscale, choices for the expat with limited resources are becoming even more limited in Moscow.
Sorry but not all girls asked for 12,000 rubles.
2 blonds, on which one was very good looking, offered to me and my friends for a "group sex" of 8000 rubles by person. After negocations they proposed 7000.
And there was dozen of girls on a saturday night.
I will return there a night to try to get a nice girl back home for 7000. Yes it is overpriced, but the girl come to your place and I appreciate that.
doc,
somebody took literary license in that bs article.
you have probably spent more time in the boarhouse than any of us. not a good quickie place period unless people like crowds and [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord109][CodeWord109][/url].
now the old hungry duck might be a better story. remember my 1st time there with customers stripping naked on the bar, watching women having sex in a booth next to me along with the bathroom sex action. that’s good clean fun.
safari and the boarhouse being closed is a loss in pure old-fashioned debauchery.
shame to see things becoming more civilized. i have always enjoyed the russians blatantly expressing their sexuality.
no doubt there is still plenty of sin to be found. just need to look harder and bring more cash or travel to less mongered locations.
still it beats most areas in the world for those that prefer tight bodied, light skinned petite women.
guido88
[quote=guido88]doc,
somebody took literary license in that bs article.
you have probably spent more time in the boarhouse than any of us. not a good quickie place period unless people like crowds and [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord109][CodeWord109][/url].
now the old hungry duck might be a better story. remember my 1st time there with customers stripping naked on the bar, watching women having sex in a booth next to me along with the bathroom sex action. that’s good clean fun.
safari and the boarhouse being closed is a loss in pure old-fashioned debauchery.
shame to see things becoming more civilized. i have always enjoyed the russians blatantly expressing their sexuality.
no doubt there is still plenty of sin to be found. just need to look harder and bring more cash or travel to less mongered locations.
still it beats most areas in the world for those that prefer tight bodied, light skinned petite women.
guido88[/quote]
out of curiousity or perhaps desperation in the fact that all 4 of my possible dates for wednesday night cancelled with various semi-plausible excuses and the rerun that did show i didn't feel like fucking, i decided to check out the "new" boarhouse, "hot dog". (or "hot dog's" if i read the sign right)
the good news... nothing has changed! it's still boarhouse!
the bad news.... nothing has changed! it's still boarhouse!
basically the interior has been revamped a bit, a couple of tables added and the pool table gone. the crowd of lonely hearts is the same, although they added some out of place looking central asian immigrant guys to mix up the monger crowd, even if none of them looked like they had enough for anything but a beer or two. the girls actually looked good including some 8+s that may have even been 9s.... you never can tell in the dim lighting and alcoholic air. didn't have a chance to check prices though, as fate had other plans for me.
i was recruted into helping an english guy and a waifish brunette at the bar communicating by translating for them and within about 5 minutes the girl had abandoned him and ended up latched on to me. not sure if this was a good thing or a bad thing, as despite the fact that she was passably cute (20 years old, petite frame, ok mousy face) she was quite drunk and kept drifting between really happy and flirty and moody, aggressive or glum. at one point she explained her life story to me, which seemed to be "dad an alcoholic", "gang-raped by her boyfriend and 2 other guys" and various other unpleasantries. to top things off, she seemed to be quite a rascist and russian "white power" nationalist. we argued about things for awhile and she told me she hates america and americans, but just like the other girl who told me that on tuesday night, i ended up fucking her too. somehow it did add an extra kick.
the sex itself was quite ok and what the hell, it was free. she seemed to like it a lot and kept asking me to go faster and harder, screaming out "ti super!" and then asking me how to say "ti super !" in english. um, "you're super"? i guess she wasn't one of the better students in her class, but i did get her to manage to say "yes, yes, fuck me again and again" in english, even though she kept screwing it up. she also kept telling me not to come inside her even though i had a condom on, my cautious nature when it comes to girls of questionable social status being excercised, claiming that russian condoms are not dependable... as if i would ever use a russian condom...
despite some sweet moments and the wild sex, her wild mood swings and drunkeness were driving me crazy and i was forced to be uncharacteristically un-gentlemanly, so i ended up giving her 500 rubles for taxi/beer/cigarettes and kicked her out of my apartment at 3am so i could get some sleep without worrying about my stuff getting stolen or my throat getting slit when she had another moment of emotional imbalance.
she wasn't happy about it and it was certainly not a shining moment in skank-i-storia, but i was really glad when she left.
Dr. S,
Thanks for the report on the NEW (old) Boarhouse. Not sure I'll check it out after your report. Although curiosity is a powerful motivator.
Gotta tell you I'm also curious as heck to know how you are making out with the former Miss Moscow Virgin. You have been conspicuously light on reports about her which can only mean that things are going "swimmingly". Hope it's all good.
I'm in Denver this week on business and just had dinner at a popular place on the 16th Avenue Mall. As luck would have it, I had a lovely little waitress who happens to be from Moscow. Well, I haven't "had" her yet but we're getting together for drinks after her shift so we'll see how it goes.
What I did get out of her was that her friends back home keep complaining about the lack of "fuckable" guys in Moscow. I don't know if she was just working me for a bigger tip, but the way she was talking any Western guy who wasn't a troll could get laid for free these days in Moscow.
What the hell's going on over there? According to Lilia's friends, all of the Moscow-bros are either gay, drunk, or overly-abusive. Or maybe the Moscow girls are just getting infected with Ameri-chick expectations?
WTF. Over?