General Reports

[QUOTE=Rodwint2;2413387]Thank you our most esteemed senior members for you wise and sage advice. I am a history buff, of sorts, and would like to spend as much time at the museums as possible. Your suggestions are very helpful and I have a couple of months to check things out.

These are some of the tours I found online and want to know if you two had any comments or opinions on them:

[URL]https://www.asia-discovery.com/travel/riverkwai/daytour/death-railway-train-and-hellfire-pass-tour.htm[/URL]

[URL]https://www.getyourguide.com/bangkok-l169/kanchanaburi-river-kwai-hellfire-pass-private-tour-t193535/[/URL]

[URL]https://www.takemetour.com/trip/joined-tour-river-kwai-one-day-tour[/URL]

Again, thank you for your advice.[/QUOTE]You're welcome. Go for it. I hiked through all those sites featured in the photos, walked down a portion of the Hellfire Pass, walked along the train tracks, stopped by the cemetery and so on, but did not take an official tour. However, I was with a Thai girlfriend, her brother, sister and a couple of other Thai friends in their SUV so they already knew the area, how to get there, mostly where to go. The train ride looks fun. We didn't do that.

Again, maybe I am in a small minority but going through that WWII museum that is not even featured in those pics was the highlight of the visit for me. It was the one thing I think I could have spent 2 hours exploring but might not have been able to spend that much time in an official tour. It is almost as though they'd just as soon not many people know about it and go to that museum or spend much time there. They want you to walk around outside instead. LOL. I mean, they can't throw the stuff away, but there seemed to be little effort at keeping it up. Some of those helmets and weaponry (hundreds of items) were in a cage as though they were tossed in there right off the battlefield 75 years ago. For me it was a surprisingly powerful historical experience.

Had 8 sessions in Thailand. Most were in Bangkok. Am posting in the general thread since there are so many sub threads. The bkk thread can be more commentary than reports but do want to "give back". Didn't break new ground but will share nonetheless. Will rank my experience from worst to best. Mostly paid "market" prices stated on the forum.

Noey. Bangkok Dreams - 2 H incall $$.

Pretty lame expoerence. I wanted Bania who is reviewed on a another thread but her agency told me she had diarrhea, so was unavailable. Booked via smoochi. Had a bad attitude to start that she blamed on bkk traffic. Was sore from overtraining at the gym. Very inactive. Nice enough but a dud. YMMV.

Take out from Thermamae. $.

Nothing too exciting but went out of convince and not having the energy see what else was available. My first action in BKK this trip so just wanted to get off some steam. No BBBJ or CBJ! Didn't negotiate services but didn't expect much for the price (2 k).

BBBJ and COF at 7 Heaven $.

Tried this one out of curiosity. Pick the services off the menu and the girl off a tablet. Service was precise and pro. Almost like getting an oil change. The girls who were unattended seemed super concerned for privacy. They covered their faces when I walked by which made me think they were more local (from Bangkok) but I really don't know. Was a decent change and seemed like something I'the try more often if I lived in the area.

MP Soi 23 $.

Darker skinned Thai with some curves caught my attention. Big butt, big boobs (enhanced). English was a little too good in other words too pro but she had my attention. Agreed to come to my hotel. Nice session, but no BBBJ. Boob job was recent and weren't as appealing with the clothes off. Body was still nice and was able to work with it.

Daisy Dreams $ Nuru session.

Was curious about the nuru massage. My 1st time. Wasn't that exciting for me but maybe was do to the SP. Was my 2nd trip to DD. Originally chose one girl from the line up but changed last minute. She was literally a clock watcher, but I gave her a pop on the bum when she looked up at the time. She did seem tired so maybe had to do with me coming later in the day. Still had a decent enough session.

MP near Marriot Marquis $.

Picked the best body / face / attitude combo out the line up. Didn't disappoint. Lady seemed a bit on the older side (relatively) but had a tight strong body. Excellent session.

Daisy Dream $ oil session.

This was my first visit. One with a great smile was on my short lists. Some other Asian patrons were choosing before me. They were deliberating and the mamasan asked me while they were still thinking. I was quick to make my selection. Did not disappoint. Great attitude and skills. Cute, decent body. Maybe wish I had repeated when I went back.

Suzy Wong's (Phuket) $$.

The night started slow but lasted a while. Had a mix of civilian and borderline FKK action in addition to the dancers. Eventually took 1 of the 2 girls who entertained for the eventing to the room upstairs for a session. It was pricey but after all the build up there was no way I wasn't going to get a release. Legit had a great experience and it was a lot of fun. No regrets. I think I would easily session with 95% of the girls there, while I've walked out of other places because the selection wasn't up to par.

Crazy House $$.

Had went earlier in my trip but wasn't sure of how things worked. Returned with the intention of bar fining. Saw a girl with a great natural figure on stage when I waked in. Small natural breasts with wide hips and a phenomenal backside. Her dancing on stage wasn't great but her looks made up for it, she said she was fairly new to that place, who knows but seemed legit. She was very eager to please once back at the hotel. Great experience.

YMMV but just wanted to contribute back to the forum. Stay safe.

Due to numerous conflicts of schedule my travel plans to Thailand this year may bring me over the Songkran dates in either BKK or Pattaya. I would like to obtain an objective review of what to expect during this Thai New Year festival from those who may have experienced it. Therefore, I would really appreciate any response posted or PM on this topic. I enjoy fun like everyone else but if there are water fights "everywhere and all the time" it may put a damper on the holiday- thanks in advance.

[QUOTE=StLouisMo2010;2413936]Due to numerous conflicts of schedule my travel plans to Thailand this year may bring me over the Songkran dates in either BKK or Pattaya. I would like to obtain an objective review of what to expect during this Thai New Year festival from those who may have experienced it. Therefore, I would really appreciate any response posted or PM on this topic. I enjoy fun like everyone else but if there are water fights "everywhere and all the time" it may put a damper on the holiday- thanks in advance.[/QUOTE]Been there for it. I'll simply put it this way. If you are easily upset by water thrown at you, then you might want to consider not going to the areas where you would be getting girls. I don't like fireworks, but it's part of the 4th of July, so hard to be mad if f you are going to someone else's country and get mad at their celebration. Don't wear cloths you're not comfortable getting soaked. Put your phone in something water resistant and enjoy the celebration. It's actually pretty fun and the bar girls are actually in a good mood. Just my thoughts.

[QUOTE=StLouisMo2010;2413936]Due to numerous conflicts of schedule my travel plans to Thailand this year may bring me over the Songkran dates in either BKK or Pattaya. I would like to obtain an objective review of what to expect during this Thai New Year festival from those who may have experienced it. Therefore, I would really appreciate any response posted or PM on this topic. I enjoy fun like everyone else but if there are water fights "everywhere and all the time" it may put a damper on the holiday- thanks in advance.[/QUOTE]You may want to do a search for "songkran" in the various cities for more information. The key piece of information if you are trying to avoid Songkran is that Songkran in Pattaya lasts for 7 days, not 3 days like Bangkok.

I've never been to Songkran in Bangkok but certainly have in Pattaya. If you plan to hobby on Walking Street, LK Metro, Soi Buakhao, Soi 6, Beach Road, Soi 25, etc. be prepared to get soaked day and night for 1 week. Don't even think about riding a baht bus. It's like they have a huge target on them. I don't mind it for a few hours but it wears thin on me. Last April was the first time I bought a super strong accurate squirt gun that I could keep in my shorts. If some guy shot me for no reason at all I went after him until he retreated to his hole. Consider a ziploc pouch if your phone is sensitive to buckets of water thrown on it. Pro tip. Dry wick clothing helps. Use fat Farang as your shield.

[QUOTE=StLouisMo2010;2413936]Due to numerous conflicts of schedule my travel plans to Thailand this year may bring me over the Songkran dates in either BKK or Pattaya. I would like to obtain an objective review of what to expect during this Thai New Year festival from those who may have experienced it. Therefore, I would really appreciate any response posted or PM on this topic. I enjoy fun like everyone else but if there are water fights "everywhere and all the time" it may put a damper on the holiday- thanks in advance.[/QUOTE]Bangkok, you will get 3 days like 13-15th, guys who live there on this board will soon provide more information. But in Pattaya it will be a different story it will last for a good 7 days, and end the 19th of April, 17-18-19 will be the biggest days where traffic will come to a standstill the worse is the 19th. This year 17th-19th falling on the weekend it will be scary.

[QUOTE=StLouisMo2010;2413936]Due to numerous conflicts of schedule my travel plans to Thailand this year may bring me over the Songkran dates in either BKK or Pattaya. I would like to obtain an objective review of what to expect during this Thai New Year festival from those who may have experienced it. Therefore, I would really appreciate any response posted or PM on this topic. I enjoy fun like everyone else but if there are water fights "everywhere and all the time" it may put a damper on the holiday- thanks in advance.[/QUOTE]People say it only lasts 3 days in Bkk but I can't recall a time in the past 7-8 years when it only lasted 3 days. In the places we go to monger, the red light distrcts, that is. Maybe the year the King died the schedule was strictly adhered to, I don't remember now. The tourists and girls will jump ahead and start shooting passers by with water guns and dumping buckets of ice water on their heads a full day or afternoon earlier than the official start day and don't be surprised if there is one loon who hasn't gotten enough enjoyment out of the "joke" to hit you with a garden hose shot walking down a quiet soi the day after it is supposed to end. All it takes is one.

Each day it starts about 10am and generally ends about 10pm. So if you don't limit your exploring Bkk and mongering to before and after those times, expect to get soaked head to toe several times over all day almost everywhere you go in the city.

Personally, I hate Songkran time in Thailand and would never recommend a first timer come here for girls during that time. Nothing regarding P4P will be normal and it won't be "better" than normal during that time. Many of the best or at least most financially successful girls will leave Bkk and retreat to their provinces that week. But if you have been here a few times already and just want to experience it for water fighting fun, fine.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2413981]People say it only lasts 3 days in Bkk but I can't recall a time in the past 7-8 years when it only lasted 3 days. In the places we go to monger, the red light distrcts, that is. [/QUOTE]Agreed. Stay away from Cowboy and Nana and Pat Pong for 12th April (and maybe 11th), and not sure what day is safe again, after 15th. Drunk Farangs likely to be the biggest idiots.

I went to the province village this year, and most of water games were at the temple or nearby. Karaoke party for Songkran was terrible. The villagers only sang Issan songs, which are far from my cup of tea, and not the stuff my Mrs. Listens to for Thai music at all. No Carabao. Ha ha. No Thai pop either. For some reason they cooked up some beef (in addition to pork) but villagers don't eat beef. That left me and one other to try to eat all the beef. Thai beef is a bit different to what we are used to as well.

The Mrs tried to dye her hair pink or purple for Songkran without getting adequate professional help. The colouration failed. Later lots of her hair started breaking off. Shit happens for Songkran. Many motorcyclists get killed or maimed on the roads when dunk, or when the truck driver was drunk. The highway and main roads are not safe. One teenager killed when he crashed into a stationary truck, rushing to see his GF.

Thailand becomes a mad house. For many years I was absent from Thailand at Songkran. Good plan, or stay indoors, or go with care. Sneak to your MP for mongering. Keep phone in a sealed plastic bag, just in case. Yeh, I am a pessimist, in case you did not guess.

Arrived via DMK could not get a grab taxi was about 350 baht 45 minutes. Got a sim with DTAC next True Move booth was cheaper then theirs.

Stayed at the Ibis 4, about $35 usd a night room was clean basic but good. The only dislike was the strong smell of cleaner chemical when checked in. Few hours of running the AC solved that. Its about 3-5 minute walk from NP. There is an amazing food setup on the sidewalk same aide right next door best fried rice and pad Thai 50 baht each. Lots of foreigners and Thai eating there. Also midway there is a lady that sells the best fried chicken I ever had. There's a few she was around or just a bit past Hillary 2.

Checked in and took the BTS to see View at Tulip more in depth posted there but short summary good experience but with so much on offer in BKK I would not go back especially if staying for a few days. She was the only decent looking one.

Later in afternoon hit up Hilary 2 for beers and pool. Best day time bar IMO for atmosphere, location and ladies although More on that later. Met a wingman which was nice as I found it a lot more fun.

Early evening hit up Soi Cowboy. Started with Suzie as I heard there was a ping pong show. Place sucked. Skip it.

Next Kazy Kozy. This is my top GG entertainment wise. Most of the time ot was girls trying to half ass dance around on the stage but when the shoe started, Jesus F Christ. Talking about girls dripping hot candle wax on each other, girl pulling a 10 ft long string of flowers from her puss and the cherry on top a full on fuck fest with a strap on. Wild highly recommended. Lots of hotties.

Then back to Nana check out Spankys, which was good but hard to top Kazy Kozy and perhaps but don't remember so must of been not memorable. My wingman found his friend the night but I wasn't feeling anything decided to make the walk of shame back hotel alone. Decided to stroll by the infamous Nana sign to see what was left. Stumbled across a cutie around 22-25 named Flour then realized she's part of the deaf squad, something I wanted to try as part of some sick craving I had watching some off the bkk112 videos. 1500 baht st didn't bother negotiations as was good for me. The pace she was running to my hotel I could tell she wanted to be over quick. Whatever I was tired and drunk. She was a blast, so tiny I could almost launch her with a hard thrust. Although this is terrible the squeals she made were fantastic. Especially when I unexpectedly blasted over her body. Was a quick but fun session. Then sleep as I had an early start next day doing a bicycle tour which I would also highly recommend. Got back to Nana around 7 of a full day of sun good food and exploring some off beaten parts of Bangkok.

Friend and I decided to hit up Billboard which was pretty good and then butterflies again I wasn't really seeing anything I wanted to barfine and was quite enjoying buying a ld and trying out a girl for a few minutes. Finally mammasan brought me a 22 tall nice tits innocent smile but smile eyes that said fuck me please. No brainer 1200 baht BF 3 k st 5000 LT it was still early and I had nasty plans for her I took her LT. She could definitely be in a tul tuk patrol video. My friend wasn't seeing anything he liked but my dates suggested she knew someone at playskoop the gogo she use to work out but which we found out that it had much less traffic then butterflies she moved. Went down to playskool all the girls recognized her and were eager to have some customers as there only a few. We started buying drinks and the girls there were eager to please getting really down and dirty I would recommend this place to have some fun for throwing a few baht as the girls seemed willing. The shots were flowing and I could tell my 22 year old was starting to get drunk and I said better get out of here before she ends up passing out. Long story short got her to drunk and she had to leave still had a great time and just paid her short time 3 k and was a bit pissed I let her drink so much.

I was still hungry for more so I went for a stroll back to see what was left it was quite late. Found a nice girl early 30's named Pin who had excellent English. After doing the LB inquiry she quoted me 1000 baht as it was last call I took her back and had a good time. Found out after she does A+ or 500 more. I regret not knowing about it earlier.

Last day woke up a bit later and hit up Doki Doki, a solid line up but no names I could find reviews on here. Ended up going with Honey who was full bodied but not fat with perfect size and feel fakes. Took the 90 minutes. Highlight of the trip what fun. Was my first time with Nuru and Honey really took her work seriously and looked after you. She did this leg lock siccsor fuck while I lay on my stomach, blew my mind. Also 2 course rimming for over 10 minutes. My friend who went the day before picked a skinny and tiny girl name unknown and got a+ but when I asked reception was not offered by anyone.

Had dinner at China town, was great with lots of delicious food options and lots of people fun to see.

We decided to BF two ladies 750 baht I think 2 k st I think 3 k LT from Hilary 4, them mine and other don't know name went back to Cowboy to Kazy Kozy check out a LB bar just for shits and giggles and then some dancing at at Country something.

After bars shut headed back to hotel she ended up being super weird and a horrible and disappointing experience for my last conquest in town for most likely a long time. Not sure if her name is them but that's how she pronounced it. She fair skin 36 pretty but I would recommend skipping.

Here's my summary and advice as a first timer for other first timers in this lovely city.

Stay in short walking distance to Nana.

Need money to have fun. I blew my budget by a lot but don't regret it spent where it counts in this order ass, drinks hotel and eating cheap delicious street food. Drinks were not as cheap as I thought and this ate my budget a lot.

The one night me and my buddy took bar girls we were both disappointed. His was super shy and not very fun in bed while I explained mine. The extra cost of the go go is well worth it that and you get an up close inspection with little or no clothes on and girls just seem to be more wild of course doesn't snt mean you could end up getting a starfish in bed.

My experiences with the FL were good and safe although that might not be the case for everyone.

Don't take tuk tuks even short distance they are a rip off, bike, taxi or grab.

Must try Nuru massage at least once.

Thais are so tiny and cute.

Bangkok Nana / Cowboy is definitely the best of all the mongering locations I have been in SEA if not the world.

[QUOTE=YngMong;2414473]Arrived via DMK could not get a grab taxi was about 350 baht 45 minutes. Got a sim with DTAC next True Move booth was cheaper then theirs.

Here's my summary and advice as a first timer for other first timers in this lovely city.

Stay in short walking distance to Nana.

Need money to have fun. I blew my budget by a lot but don't regret it spent where it counts in this order ass, drinks hotel and eating cheap delicious street food. Drinks were not as cheap as I thought and this ate my budget a lot.

The one night me and my buddy took bar girls we were both disappointed. His was super shy and not very fun in bed while I explained mine. The extra cost of the go go is well worth it that and you get an up close inspection with little or no clothes on and girls just seem to be more wild of course doesn't snt mean you could end up getting a starfish in bed.

My experiences with the FL were good and safe although that might not be the case for everyone.

Don't take tuk tuks even short distance they are a rip off, bike, taxi or grab.

Must try Nuru massage at least once.

Thais are so tiny and cute.

Bangkok Nana / Cowboy is definitely the best of all the mongering locations I have been in SEA if not the world.[/QUOTE]Great post. I'm coming to, town after a few years absence and this helped set the lay of the land. Thank you!

[QUOTE=StLouisMo2010;2413936]Due to numerous conflicts of schedule my travel plans to Thailand this year may bring me over the Songkran dates in either BKK or Pattaya. I would like to obtain an objective review of what to expect during this Thai New Year festival from those who may have experienced it. Therefore, I would really appreciate any response posted or PM on this topic. I enjoy fun like everyone else but if there are water fights "everywhere and all the time" it may put a damper on the holiday- thanks in advance.[/QUOTE]I have been in Bangkok with Songkran twice, more or less so. In Bangkok it was only 3 days. First year I spent a whole day getting soaked and liked it. At Si Lom, near Siam BTS station, at Khao San Road. At many places they will throw water at you but not in Lumphini park for example. But. They are fully entitled to do so. After 8 pm or so no water is thrown anymore, but officially people are allowed to throw water but nobody does that anymore. You can just enjoy Cowboy or Nana like any other day. But like Szyzgies said a lack of girls, esp Baccara but Cowboy2 was much better then usual. At Si Lom there was even a street (forgot which one) that had a sign telling they had decided not to throw water there. On some sites it is officially announced that Songkran is 5 days in Bangkok. But on day 5 all had turned back to normal, to my dismay. My advice is to go to Cowboy or Nana after 10 pm. Don't go to Si Lom or Khao San Road if you don't like water. Taxis function just like always, so no problem.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2403479]What about what the bar owner would rather? Don't forget that most times tips are put into a kitty and split up by all the workers at the end of the night; same as it was when I worked in a bar way back when.[/QUOTE]The bar girl will happily keep the tip for herself and not share it.

[URL]https://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-7906281/SARS-like-virus-spreads-China-nearly-140-new-cases.html[/URL]

Currently as related to travel to LOS is concerned, this new disease only bears close monitoring, BUT I would definitely avoid flying any airlines originating or laying over in China. Also considering the large number of Chinese tourists and businessmen flying inter Asian flights these days, I would cut back on those flights too. I remember a few years back sitting in a row directly behind a heavily coughing Chinese businessman on a flight from Manila to Jakarta, I caught his flu and was laid up a few days later. So if you are in Thailand or about to visit, avoid all contact with anyone exhibiting flu like symptoms and if you see a NE Asian guy coughing badly in a Go Go bar or restaurant - get the fuck out!

[QUOTE=Natty Bumpo;2415282] avoid all contact with anyone exhibiting flu like symptoms and if you see a NE Asian guy coughing badly in a Go Go bar or restaurant - get the fuck out![/QUOTE]

Scary part is that you won't know a person was infected until it's too late for you. May take a week after contracting the virus before any symptoms are obvious. This is Chinese New Year so millions and millions of Chinese will be traveling to other countries this week. Surprised no cases in Hong Kong and Taiwan yet but it's already hit South Korea and Japan. Maybe time to go to Germany instead of SE Asia or even Jakarta where not many Chinese tourists visit.

I'm going to be in Thailand late Feb for business reasons and have decided to extend my trip for 3 weeks for pleasure. My initial plan was to split my time between Bangkok and Pattaya to enjoy the sights, ladies, and food. I'm also scouting for potential places to become an expat at. Early retirement, that sort of thing.

As I've began RTFF it is slowly becoming apparent that maybe Thailand no longer is the monger paradise it once was. Comments about quality at the massage places and expansions of clip joints and whatnot. I'm positive there is great fun to be had so I'll still spend sometime there but this leads me into my question:

Any other countries on that side of the world that I should add to my "short list" to RTFF about and research?

South East Asia, Australia, New Zealand, South America, that sort of area. I'm not too concerned with price, within reason, of course. I just want a nice mix of activities and joints to visit. (I'm going to Europe in the summer so I'll hit the other side of the world then).

To the point: where do you think the new monger paradise is? Or what has been your (recent) favorite place?

I can't wait to document my trip for everyone's benefit!

Cheers,

Rojer.

[QUOTE=RojerAims1;2415523]Any other countries on that side of the world that I should add to my "short list" to RTFF about and research?

South East Asia, Australia, New Zealand, South America, that sort of area. I'm not too concerned with price, within reason, of course. I just want a nice mix of activities and joints to visit. (I'm going to Europe in the summer so I'll hit the other side of the world then).[/QUOTE]If you aren't concerned about price why in the world are you considering SE Asia as a retirement hot spot? European countries like Switzerland, Austria, and Germany with their FKK clubs and, more importantly, the fact you aren't living in a 2nd or 3rd world country with a lot of backwards thinking should be where you consider early retirement if you have the funds to do so. Japan would be my pick for retiring in an Asian country. Hobbying is not cheap in Japan but the cost of living is not nearly as expensive as you may think. Getting a Visa may be an issue depending on which country you live in. If you have money, Japan allows 6 month visas for those who can show they have 30 million yen (8.3 million baht, 273,000 USD) in their bank account.

If you are seriously considering Thailand, plan on spending twice as much as you budgeted. The Thai baht continues getting stronger. 10's of thousands of broke ass Farang around Pattaya are living proof that Thailand was way more expensive than they had planned.

[QUOTE=RojerAims1;2415523]As I've began RTFF it is slowly becoming apparent that maybe Thailand no longer is the monger paradise it once was.[/QUOTE]

In SE Asia there is still no other country that offers the abundance of options that Thailand offers. Those of us who have lived in Thailand for some time b1tch about many things but Thailand is still the number 1 place in SE Asia. The only other SE Asia city that can give Thailand a run for its money would be the MUCH cheaper Jakarta, especially for guys who like naturally busty young girls.

Only caveat I would put on this is that I would never recommend Thailand for Indian men. Your brothers who proceeded you ruined it for you. I would recommend Jakarta, Phnom Penh, Angeles City, and even Kuala Lumpur for Indian men.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2415293]Scary part is that you won't know a person was infected until it's too late for you. May take a week after contracting the virus before any symptoms are obvious. This is Chinese New Year so millions and millions of Chinese will be traveling to other countries this week. Surprised no cases in Hong Kong and Taiwan yet but it's already hit South Korea and Japan. Maybe time to go to Germany instead of SE Asia or even Jakarta where not many Chinese tourists visit.[/QUOTE]I stay for about 9 months a year in Wuhan where the virus came from but luckily left about 2 weeks ago for my holiday. The reason for where it has hit is the direct flights fom Wuhan to Seoul and Tokyo. There are very limited direct flights to Taiwan, only a couple of times a week if I recall. I doubt if there are no cases in HK, I'd say they haven't been reported. The train from Wuhan to HK is about 5 hours, so most people would take that rather than fly.

Luckily there are limited direct international flights from Wuhan to anywhere, although they have about 3 flights a day to Thailand, both BKK and Phuket, so expect cases to pop up there.

[QUOTE=RojerAims1;2415523]I'm going to be in Thailand late Feb for business reasons and have decided to extend my trip for 3 weeks for pleasure. My initial plan was to split my time between Bangkok and Pattaya to enjoy the sights, ladies, and food. I'm also scouting for potential places to become an expat at. Early retirement, that sort of thing.
[/QUOTE]Just to address this part: Thailand is still absolutely amazing and at stupidly bargain rates (for westerners). Columbia and Angeles City (Philippines) or other popular budget spots, each for their own reasons.

Don't let the discussions by more connoisseur and very experienced people here dissuade you that Thailand is still an incredible place for this stuff (or let the newbies just getting their DS wet as they figure it out too dissuade you either). We're more arguing the finer points and tactics and tricks to keep the top notch stuff rolling. Sure, the old timers will tell you "it wasn't what it was X years ago". Sure it wasn't, but 15 years ago we were also talking about blackberries can never ever die, they are amazing! Ok really, Thailand has so much stuff going for it in the scene and just in the country overall. Everything is good brother. And the PSE in Thailand, at the price they offer it, pretty much can't be beat anywhere in the world.

The Good news: China has begun locking down those cities most affected by the new virus: "Wuhan to halt all outbound flights and trains as authorities try to stem spread of new pneumonia like illness ahead of Lunar New Year; death toll jumps to at least 17. And in addition to Wuhan, two more Chinese cities were put on lockdown by government authorities, expanding an unprecedented experiment to try to contain a fast-spreading virus that has killed at least 17 people and infected more than 500.

On Thursday, authorities in Huanggang, a city of 7. 5 million people said they won't let long-distance trains and buses run from the urban center and will shut its public transportation system in the lockdown zone, effective midnight Friday local time. Ezhou, another neighboring city with just over a million residents, said it would enact similar restrictions. ".

A word of caution: "Chinese authorities have suggested the coronavirus is spreading between people primarily through coughing, kissing or contact with saliva. " That means stay away from any working girls exhibiting flu like symptoms. Stay safe.

Good post GrapeMan. While I do not think Thailand is a "bargain" anymore, it has not been that for at least 10 or 15 years, I do agree with your main point that LOS is still very very good. I prefer BKK & Pattaya over today's Phnom Penh (cheaper), AC & Cebu City (cheaper). For short visits under 2 or 3 weeks MNL (similar prices) and Jakarta (competitive prices) are very good, but these 2 cities are not as pleasant as BKK for longer stays. Sao Paulo is my favorite city outside of SE Asia and one could easily argue that the girls there are hotter than Thai girls. But Sao Paulo is not cheap either and I prefer the Thai Buddhist culture over any SA culture. Others are free to disagree.

[QUOTE=GrapeMan;2416078]Just to address this part: Thailand is still absolutely amazing and at stupidly bargain rates (for westerners). Columbia and Angeles City (Philippines) or other popular budget spots, each for their own reasons.
[/QUOTE]

It absolutely is not. Thailand has a scene that's more in-your-face and out in the open than in other places, and the atmosphere is a bit more relaxed with occasionally good and friendly service, rather than a typical wham-bam one-and-done in most other spots.

However, the girls are really not easy on the eyes these days, unless ample tattoos, ridiculous nose jobs and ugly thickly painted eyebrows are your thing. Thais (especially working girls from Issan) were never world's best lookers, but they used to have a certain endearing ordinary girl cuteness to compensate, with many coming across as normal and nice people, not hardened working girls. You could easily fall in love and spend a few days with a working girl (and prices were low enough to do so). It even wasn't rare for a punter to marry one. Among the working girls, all that is gone, a simple long time is hard to come by (and one probably wouldn't care to anyway, unless sex starved).

These days, working girls mostly look hard and chewed up, almost always in the lowest 20% by looks (for their age group, compared to a BTS Skytrain sample), and service is getting worse too, both in absolute terms, and in terms of actually needing good service at $100-$150 while not caring much at $30.

These days, even places like Hong Kong or Kuala Lumpur are better for mongering than Thailand in many ways. Service might be crap, but at least they occasionally have some lookers, and prices are not higher either. No idea why and how, but you can actually you can get a Thai in HK for 170 HKD, which is only 700 baht for a quickie (including BBBJ and FS). Not easy to get that price / looks combination in Thailand anymore.

I would still recommend Thailand for a newbie monger, because the scene is so open and easy (albeit not cheap), and because Thailand is still great to visit (good food and sights, easy transportation, tourist infrastructure). However, for a hardcore monger who knows his way around, there are better options than Thailand. Unfortunately, I don't know of a single place with a notable mongering scene in Asia that is the same or better than it used to be 10 years ago. Not sure why, but they all became worse over time.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2416208]The Good news: China has begun locking down those cities most affected by the new virus: "Wuhan to halt all outbound flights and trains as authorities try to stem spread of new pneumonia like illness ahead of Lunar New Year; death toll jumps to at least 17. And in addition to Wuhan, two more Chinese cities were put on lockdown by government authorities, expanding an unprecedented experiment to try to contain a fast-spreading virus that has killed at least 17 people and infected more than 500.

On Thursday, authorities in Huanggang, a city of 7. 5 million people said they won't let long-distance trains and buses run from the urban center and will shut its public transportation system in the lockdown zone, effective midnight Friday local time. Ezhou, another neighboring city with just over a million residents, said it would enact similar restrictions. ".

A word of caution: "Chinese authorities have suggested the coronavirus is spreading between people primarily through coughing, kissing or contact with saliva. " That means stay away from any working girls exhibiting flu like symptoms. Stay safe.[/QUOTE]I'm afraid that this is a sample of what is to come in the near future. It is reported that Wuhan has a population of 11 million. Many Chinese cities are over populated and will have issues as time goes by.

Many of our members on our golf club are from China and they say that rotten meat and food are sold to the poor every day. The merchants do not want to loose money and they will not throw anything away.

As the world keeps over populating things will get worst. Food and water are the most important items in life and they are at the brink. Many cities in the US show high levels of lead poison in the water. We must be optimistic and hope that changes will take effect that can help avoid the dangers that are coming.

There were reports recently that the air in BKK is Toxic or contains Toxic materials. Wear a mask, drink only bottled water and Beer and eat pussy not steak. 555.

RL.

[QUOTE=Crocodilexp;2416407]It absolutely is not. Thailand has a scene that's more in-your-face and out in the open than in other places, and the atmosphere is a bit more relaxed with occasionally good and friendly service, rather than a typical wham-bam one-and-done in most other spots.

However, the girls are really not easy on the eyes these days, unless ample tattoos, ridiculous nose jobs and ugly thickly painted eyebrows are your thing. Thais (especially working girls from Issan) were never world's best lookers, but they used to have a certain endearing ordinary girl cuteness to compensate, with many coming across as normal and nice people, not hardened working girls. You could easily fall in love and spend a few days with a working girl (and prices were low enough to do so). It even wasn't rare for a punter to marry one. Among the working girls, all that is gone, a simple long time is hard to come by (and one probably wouldn't care to anyway, unless sex starved).

These days, even places like Hong Kong or Kuala Lumpur are better for mongering than Thailand in many ways. Service might be crap, but at least they occasionally have some lookers, and prices are not higher either. No idea why and how, but you can actually you can get a Thai in HK for 170 HKD, which is only 700 baht for a quickie (including BBBJ and FS). Not easy to get that price / looks combination in Thailand anymore.

I would still recommend Thailand for a newbie monger, because the scene is so open and easy (albeit not cheap), and because Thailand is still great to visit (good food and sights, easy transportation, tourist infrastructure). However, for a hardcore monger who knows his way around, there are better options than Thailand. Unfortunately, I don't know of a single place with a notable mongering scene in Asia that is the same or better than it used to be 10 years ago. Not sure why, but they all became worse over time.[/QUOTE]You have an interesting perspective Crocodilexp. I can more or less accept your analysis in paragraph 1 & 3 although I still manage to find cute, young, girls in BKK Go Go's.

But I strongly disagree with your suggestion that "Hong Kong (is) better for mongering than Thailand in many ways" even with your caveat that "service might be crap (in HK), but at least they occasionally have some lookers, and prices are not higher either. No, No, No! 555. Once upon a time I used to like the punting scene in HKG. I fondly remember picking up Mongolian, Korean, and Thai STUNNERS in Hari's Bar. It was never cheap, but the quality was amazing. Back then, I am talking 2002 to 20013, the Wan Chai bars were very good too as they were brimming with attractive Viets & Indonesian girls. Again not cheap, but great quality. And then there were the Chinese SW's that hung around Moody Road and the Urbon Council Garden in front of the Regal Kowloon Hotel. I liked them because occasionally I would spot a real attractive girl among the useless. But I was never a fan of Thai Temple Street SW's of which I believe you are referring to in this quote "700 baht for a quickie (including BBBJ and FS). " I mean I respect you opinion and maybe everyone interested should try them street girls at least once just for the slumming experience, but man its pretty low on the totem pole and scuzzy. You are not going to get any GFE, LOL, in this venue and the conditions in the rooms are deplorable, but hey what can you expect in HKG, a very ricco town, for 170 hkd. The Chinese SW's I mentioned are 500 hkd, but at least you take them back to your hotel room.

Anyway, I just wanted to balance out your HKG recommendation. I was last there in November 2017 after a lapse of 4 years. On Friday night I hung out in 2 of the most popular Wan Chai bars. The talent was below dreadful! Friday Night! Ok it was great if you like overweight, 40 year old Filipinas amd don' t mind paying them 2000 HKG. I went back to my hotel around 1:30 am without a girl!. It was that bad. The next night I gave up on the bar scene and picked a very attractive Taiwanese 141 hotel reservation girl. The session in her 3.5 star hotel room was good. Her price was 1700 hkg. I left HKG the next day and I don't plan on returning to HKG for another 10 years. 555. The scene is really bad unless you want to pay up and if you want to pay up you would do a hell of a lot better in Macau where the selection is the highest, but so is the price. As for bottom fishing, you can always go to China Town in BKK. I believe prices begin at 500 baht for a ST there. Good hunting to all.

[QUOTE=Crocodilexp;2416407]However, the girls are really not easy on the eyes these days, unless ample tattoos, ridiculous nose jobs and ugly thickly painted eyebrows are your thing. [/QUOTE]You better get used to it if you plan on doing any fucking these days. I will be the first to tell a chick that she looks like a damn fool. What possesses them to go around looking like that? And these ugly ass out of nowhere tattoos? I mean I have tattoos, but they have significance and are not in view if I do not want them to be. I didn't just hop up one day and decide it would make sense to have some permanent, random bullshit drawn down my entire leg or some letters on my fingers. I, for one, like chicks with natural beauty.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2416579]You better get used to it if you plan on doing any fucking these days. I will be the first to tell a chick that she looks like a damn fool. What possesses them to go around looking like that? And these ugly ass out of nowhere tattoos? I mean I have tattoos, but they have significance and are not in view if I do not want them to be. I didn't just hop up one day and decide it would make sense to have some permanent, random bullshit drawn down my entire leg or some letters on my fingers. I, for one, like chicks with natural beauty.[/QUOTE]3 cheers! Someone who thinks as I do. I frequent KTV's in China and if I see tat's they are not for me. Same goes for a smoker, not for me! I can not understand why a girl with a good body, nice skin, would mess it up with garish tat's? A beautiful woman's body is like a painting, you don't take magic marker and scribble all over it. Not only do you ruin the value, but the beauty is gone!

[QUOTE=MrClen;2416625]3 ...I can not understand why a girl with a good body, nice skin, would mess it up with garish tat's? ...[/QUOTE]No matter how good they think a tatt looks when they're 25, I guarantee they will hate it when they are 40.

[QUOTE=RobertLong;2416412]There were reports recently that the air in BKK is Toxic or contains Toxic materials. Wear a mask, drink only bottled water and Beer and eat pussy not steak. 555.

RL.[/QUOTE]It's the are boys and girls it's the air. If I can't see mm off of the 37th floor of a central condo, and the air is bad. If it's black purple in the NO2 on the web for the entire River valley, then the air is bad. If I walk outside to get myself a lemon tea from the sweet little coffee aunty and the air smells like yesterday's underwear and the SkyTrain looks like it's draped in the smog, then the air is bad.

So like a real American, I take problems right in hand and solve them. I'm not going to be in the cold during the winter or fall months, and I like Asia far better than Spanish countries. While it doesn't really matter except to my smiling bookkeeper, I like to be frugal. Plus, I need interesting things to do. So last week, I got on a plane and rolled into Siem Reap, arrived at 920 pm and was in a bar with a bag of weed and a beer one hour later.

And although there was a bit of burning in the air, and my colleagues told me that there is smoke that ruin certain photography opportunities, generally the air has been pretty clean. However, for the pictures that I was looking for, it's best you be in Siem during rainy season or in the early fall. Okay then, weeds ignored, transport as easy, the air is clean, that sounds like a plan and I rented a luxury condo for a year for 1/4 of the price that it would probably cost in Bangkok and three times the quality. Yes Virginia you can have those old days back, because basically, this is where Thailand was 20 years ago. I'm not going to laud the advantages, or gloss over the myriad of flaws, but it's just about 9 am, and I am on a balcony overlooking a bunch of dirt roads and palm trees drinking a cup of coffee that the maid brought me up since I don't have all my stuff yet, and I'm about to fire up a fatty.

I'll roll him to Bangkok later on tonight, and probably come back here again at the end of the month. Then when my lease is up in Bangkok, I'll just come over here.

Now you guys may or may not choose to debate all this endlessly but the suffice it to say about Bangkok is this. I've got 25 years of Thailand under my belt, I love the country, I love the people, I've never been treated bad by anyone, I have had and will continue to have some great times and made some great friends, the photographic opportunities is great and it's nice and warm. But government of Thailand but:

I'm not a long haired dreadlocked dope-smoking backpacking sex tourist of which there are many here in Cambodia by the way, which will even be better for me too because I can amuse myself by tormenting them intellectually. I had some California dude about 20 years old just lecture me about Thailand yesterday. It's so bad being ignorant like me and thank God for this twenty-year-old to tell me exactly the way how the world works dude. Basically, I'm someone that can afford to comfortably live in two countries so that my old and aching body is preserved. That place in the winters was always Thailand, but pay attention Thailand government, if you want me to let you hold $25,000 of my stash, or pay you a fat $15,000 for an elite Visa just let me know whether you wanted and cash, check, money order or bank transfer. But, in exchange, I really don't want to reporting every 90 days and give me clean air. That's all I want. That's the real problem too, anything else is just whining from internet experts or guys who think they are self-important or who can't handle anything in life. Air. Why would I go to Thailand and pay the same prices as I pay in key West and not be able to breathe the air? Why, because Thai girls are so beautiful and fantastic and cheap? I can do just as good in the West, in point of fact, I can have any woman I want anytime I want and honestly, it doesn't matter what it cost. So as I wander through life, it's the one bottom line of something and for me, it's the air.

Does that mean I hate Thailand? Am my running around message boards gloating that I have gotten out of Thailand and anybody that goes there is stupid? Am I whining about the fact that it's just so expensive and bar fines are so high you can't even have fun? If I were over on the Cambodia side of this board that I pretty much got the lay of the land here and you can get your jollies with a legal girl for 5 bucks as long as you're into the Chicken shack thing, do wonder how many people will send me messages saying yeah dude tell me how to get to the Chicken shack set sounds great. Whatever, and just so it's clear, if you are mongering through life with no focus other than that, welle you're not going to go to Cambodia.

And I suppose it helps that it takes me just about an hour to get to Bangkok. That's great because my crib here is so lifestyle of the Rich and famous, that already my buds back in the big Mango are thinking about what we call condo trading, hey man do you want to go to Bangkok, I'll give you my condo for 3 days if you give me yours. Yeah dude that sounds great, I'm in the mood for Mixx. You better leave me two hundred bucks, because my condo is nicer than yours. Let me know what breakfast you want the maids to give you.

And so it goes. I already started a brief report for you boys over at the Cambodian section, but I only got half done because of this silly system where they have to pre-approve your post. God knows why, there is so much stupidity blasting about maybe it's just like a time thing and no one really reads them. Of course, once I get rid of my distaste for the inability to edit my long reports because they have to be quote moderator close quotes I'll post some really hot Bangkok news that I've gotten. And a new venue.

[QUOTE=MrClen;2416625]3 cheers! Someone who thinks as I do. I frequent KTV's in China and if I see tat's they are not for me. Same goes for a smoker, not for me! I can not understand why a girl with a good body, nice skin, would mess it up with garish tat's? A beautiful woman's body is like a painting, you don't take magic marker and scribble all over it. Not only do you ruin the value, but the beauty is gone![/QUOTE]Us old fuddy duddies better get used to it. Tats is a fashion and hip thing for the younger generation. Then we have piercings as well to deal with. How many beauties aged 20+ have none of these in the modern day? Not many, whether hookers or not. So the term "tramp stamp" is a misnomer, showing prejudices.

I still have some slight phobia about metal shrapnel piercings maybe with diamonds in the delicate pussy area. I did get used to ear rings, belly rings and tongue studs. I have pretty much learned to ignore tats, however I still hate to see them on the tits, if the tits should have a beautiful shape (naturals).

Girls that are hot in bed seem to often be smokers too, unfortunately, although smoking is on the way out of fashion I think. Young smokers may not have really bad smokers breath, if they are careful, but when they get older, they will.

Most girls will say they got tats when they were drunk, so it should be made a criminal offense to put tats on a girl with blood alcohol over some figure. There should be police raids of tattoo parlours. Ha ha. Maybe a minimum age of 21 before tats allowed, same for piercings.

Hi guys,

Just a quick question. Is it ok to buy this stuff from the street vendors along Sukhumvit or can you recommend a better source like a special pharmacy?

Thanks for your help.

K.

[QUOTE=Khundig;2417209]Hi guys,

Just a quick question. Is it ok to buy this stuff from the street vendors along Sukhumvit or can you recommend a better source like a special pharmacy?

Thanks for your help.

K.[/QUOTE]My take: It is recommended by the manufacturers that pharmaceutical products be stored within a range of moderate room temperatures. How do you believe the street vendors store their product? And for how many weeks or months?

The best place (price and selection) I have found to buy legit ED products is the pharamacy in the Foodland on Sukhumvit soi 5. The generic options are quite a bit cheaper, and in my experience work fine.

SL.

[QUOTE=Crocodilexp;2416407]It absolutely is not. Thailand has a scene that's more in-your-face and out in the open than in other places, and the atmosphere is a bit more relaxed with occasionally good and friendly service, rather than a typical wham-bam one-and-done in most other spots.[/QUOTE]

Bull's eye! Props to 'good food, transportation and tourist infrastructure' as hard non-negotiable items for selection.

From your personal experience, within Thailand but outside of BKK, which would be your ONE choice for a weeks' stay, outside of BKK?

Likewise, within Asia, outside of Thailand (and now [coronarelated] China_HK_Macau), which would be your ONE choice for a weeks' stay??

[QUOTE=Dena0;2417855]Bull's eye! Props to 'good food, transportation and tourist infrastructure' as hard non-negotiable items for selection.

From your personal experience, within Thailand but outside of BKK, which would be your ONE choice for a weeks' stay, outside of BKK?

Likewise, within Asia, outside of Thailand (and now coronarelated China_HK_Macau), which would be your ONE choice for a weeks' stay??[/QUOTE]Many experienced Visa runners go to PP. Huge scene and nothing else to do. And cheap.

[QUOTE=Dena0;2417855]From your personal experience, within Thailand but outside of BKK, which would be your ONE choice for a weeks' stay, outside of BKK?
[/QUOTE]Within Thailand clearly Pattaya if mongering is a high priority.

[QUOTE=Dena0;2417855]
Likewise, within Asia, outside of Thailand (and now coronarelated China_HK_Macau), which would be your ONE choice for a weeks' stay??[/QUOTE]This is difficult. If HK or Macau are not an option, I'd personally pick Kuala Lumpur. It's a vibrant city with great food, affordable hotels, decent transportation, enough things to see. KL has a reasonably sized mongering scene, although smaller than Pattaya or Bangkok and clearly not aimed at Farang customers. A large selection of nationalities, but basic service, not much GFE. I'm sure a fair number of people would disagree on this, not the least because drinking is expensive in Malaysia.

A more typical choice for a Farang monger would be Phnom Penh or Angeles, but I'm not a fan of either.

I have been in a 10 week hiatus from mongering already. If the Corona Virus scare gets a lot worse, I may be looking at extending this for quite some time, with possible mongering semi-retirement, outside of my main girls. However see how risky it really gets first. Soon it could be a higher risk than HIV, just speculating.

It seems possible that girls' livelihoods could be absolutely decimated. I mean we have huge scares in Bangkok before, that affected tourism badly, whether bombs, floods, SARS, bird flu, etc. Who will want to be in a crowd in a bar, once plenty of Bangkok cases have been announced.

Immediate problem could be that girls might not want Chinese customers unless they can confirm they have not been to China, or know anyone visiting China. Once many locals including hookers have it, it gets hard to say how drastic the consequences can be. However what we know is there is generally a huge over reaction, to relatively minor risks. So mongering trade can be hit badly by relatively minor risks.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2418283]I have been in a 10 week hiatus from mongering already. If the Corona Virus scare gets a lot worse, I may be looking at extending this for quite some time, with possible mongering semi-retirement, outside of my main girls. However see how risky it really gets first. Soon it could be a higher risk than HIV, just speculating.

It seems possible that girls' livelihoods could be absolutely decimated. I mean we have huge scares in Bangkok before, that affected tourism badly, whether bombs, floods, SARS, bird flu, etc. Who will want to be in a crowd in a bar, once plenty of Bangkok cases have been announced.

Immediate problem could be that girls might not want Chinese customers unless they can confirm they have not been to China, or know anyone visiting China. Once many locals including hookers have it, it gets hard to say how drastic the consequences can be. However what we know is there is generally a huge over reaction, to relatively minor risks. So mongering trade can be hit badly by relatively minor risks.[/QUOTE]The impact on the mongering community is frightening. All it takes is for one working girl to get it. Then she spreads it to other mongers who then spread it to a network of other working girls. I think its better for us not to contemplate that.

[QUOTE=Turgid;2418417]The impact on the mongering community is frightening. All it takes is for one working girl to get it. Then she spreads it to other mongers who then spread it to a network of other working girls. I think its better for us not to contemplate that.[/QUOTE]The only scare if I get it is the quarantaine. It is less dangerous than a normal flu. All unnecessary panic.

[QUOTE=Tiger888;2418428]The only scare if I get it is the quarantaine. It is less dangerous than a normal flu. All unnecessary panic.[/QUOTE]Couldn't agree with you more.

Tens of thousands die in the US alone every year from flu. Over 20,000 died last year on the roads here in Thailand.

Less than 200 have died from the virus all in China with a population of 1,3 billion and it's been reported a lot of those had underlying conditions that could have directly caused or greatly contributed to their deaths.

I know this will increase maybe even exceeding the almost 800 deaths deaths from sars but when a vaccine is found the panic will subside and all will be back to normal in a matter of months.

Personally I am far more concerned about the long term effects of pollution and being run over crossing the street than standing near a Chinaman with a cough.

Sounds crass I know but as an aside I'm taking full advantage of the market buying opportunities presented by the crisis.

There is no need to panic, YET. 555. That said, I would not go to China at this time for love or money. I am not a particular fan of China anyway since the crack down to begin with. China really sucks except for Macau which is very, very expensive, but still pretty damn good. But just to see if the virus has had an effect on Macau Tourism I checked out Macau hotel rates on Agoda last night. Nope, the hotel rates are almost the same as normal. The MGM Grand, for example is still priced at over $200/ night for any night Sunday to Friday and a lot more for the weekend. Like I said, I wouldn't go to Macau right now even if the MGM were under $100/ night. But my point is; apparently the town is full of gamblers and other tourists of which the vast majority are from HKG & Mainland China. Nobody is panicking, at least not the gamblers and the punters. LOL.

Thailand (BKK & Pattaya): Fortunately I am not scheduled to arrive for another 2. 5 months and I expect the virus will be receding and under control by then. If not and by that I mean there would have to be thousands & thousands of current cases in LOS and then I would cancel my planned trip and head for Sao Paulo. It has been a long time since I visited Brazil. Brazilian girls are hot! But sadly there is a lot more silly cone and botox in Brazil than Thailand, although there are still plenty of sexy natural girls to satisfy my wants and needs. I prefer Sao Paulo over Rio. The former is for serious punters. Rio is for tourists. 555.

If I were scheduled to fly into Thailand next week I would still go, perhaps a little reluctantly, but still go. There are currently no refunds on Airline tickets because Thailand is not in a pandemic situation. In fact, the number of cases in Thailand is still extremely low. 14 confirmed cases as of now I think. So, I would take some precautions if I were in BKK or Pat like avoid the bars, restaurants and malls popular with the Chinese and I would stop using the trains. But that's me. Everyone facing an immediate decision to go or not go should make up their own minds based on a rational assessment of the situation and their risk tolerance level. There is always Sao Paulo! But keep in mind that TV news blows everything out of proportion to sell adds. Get your news from reliable sources.

[QUOTE=Tiger888;2418428]The only scare if I get it is the quarantaine. It is less dangerous than a normal flu. All unnecessary panic.[/QUOTE]Yes its far less dangerous than many normal risks (so far), providing you don't have it yet. Only once you have it, is the danger significant.

So the effect of scare is far more than needs to be, as was for bombs, bird flu, Sars, Asian swine flu, etc.

Would be interesting to know if the scare is so bad that Chinese people start to be totally avoided.

My trip will be March to Philippines and Thailand. Hopefully the epidemic would ease and those countries are no unduly affected. In Philippines it can spread like wild fire due to lack of basics. Thailand maybe better equipped to handle. We will see.

Unfortunately most of our targets go with whoever to make money. Case in point is I was sick one day and told this girl I cannot be with her that day and she said she still wants to come and be with me. I had to firmly say no.

Plenty of Chinese go to Philippines and Thailand for cheap vacation just like we do. So far there are no cancelled flights into those countries. If according to WHO virus can be easily transmissible everybody is taking a risk. Face mask or no face mask, sex or no sex. Even eating food may be contaminated. Add pollution to the mix.

Hopefully our immune system is good.

[QUOTE=Sammon;2418626]My trip will be March to Philippines and Thailand. Hopefully the epidemic would ease and those countries are no unduly affected. In Philippines it can spread like wild fire due to lack of basics. Thailand maybe better equipped to handle. We will see.

Unfortunately most of our targets go with whoever to make money. Case in point is I was sick one day and told this girl I cannot be with her that day and she said she still wants to come and be with me. I had to firmly say no.

Plenty of Chinese go to Philippines and Thailand for cheap vacation just like we do. So far there are no cancelled flights into those countries. If according to WHO virus can be easily transmissible everybody is taking a risk. Face mask or no face mask, sex or no sex. Even eating food may be contaminated. Add pollution to the mix.

Hopefully our immune system is good.[/QUOTE]Jeez, virus is less deadly than SARS or MERS and seems to only spread through close contact. You are way more likely to get a nasty influenza type a. It's a great time to travel as prices will be down and people will be scared so less of them will be traveling.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;2418633]It's a great time to travel as prices will be down and people will be scared so less of them will be traveling.[/QUOTE]The problem with travelling there now is that your return flight might get cancelled and you're stuck there. The USA has issued a "Do not travel" warning, so anyone from the US with travel insurance that goes there could void their policy.

I've just looked at flights to Wuhan for March as I have some business to take care of there, couldn't even book a flight online.

[QUOTE=Kerrstar;2418704]The problem with travelling there now is that your return flight might get cancelled and you're stuck there. The USA has issued a "Do not travel" warning, so anyone from the US with travel insurance that goes there could void their policy.

I've just looked at flights to Wuhan for March as I have some business to take care of there, couldn't even book a flight online.[/QUOTE]Even better if the US warns against travel. Would I go to Wuhan? Don't think so. Chengdu or other places in China? I would. Even the locals will be spooked.

You guys should read the German FKK forums. Comedic. There is talk there to ban ALL Asians from FKK clubs. For those who don't know, some of the most popular FKK clubs like Sharks has a ton of Asian customers, mainly from USA and Japan.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2418721]You guys should read the German FKK forums. Comedic. There is talk there to ban ALL Asians from FKK clubs. For those who don't know, some of the most popular FKK clubs like Sharks has a ton of Asian customers, mainly from USA and Japan.[/QUOTE]The hysteria is staggering.

Loved every minute of it. Stayed at hotel on Surawongse, had no problem getting girls to come there but would have had more fun staying near Pier 21 or JW Marriott area. Plenty of cheap hotels in the area.

Had tons of other things to do so only saw 3 girls. Asking rates of anywhere from 2,000 B to 6,000 B for 60-90 minutes. BBBJ, full service condom. Overnights can be had for 4-5,000 B for a good looking girl. Tinder and Line were both respectable sources.

Will repeat, often.

I am in SEA these days. I just spent one week in Pattaya, 5 days in Bangkok, and I am currently in Phnom Penh for 5 days. I noticed a concern among the Thai folks. You cannot even buy a mask these days as they ran out. My FL fav is a nurse at a Bangkok hospital and she claimed that she was able to secure a "superior" mask. She also offered to get me one but I declined. I also noticed that very few farangs were wearing one.

On the other hand, here in PP it's a different story. The Cambodian PM has been bitching about the population being unnecessary scared, read chasing away tourists.

I agree this would be a great opportunity to visit a place like Saõ Paulo. I have not been there in a while, unfortunately, I reserved my trip last November and I had no desire to cancel and start over.

It looks like most airlines have now suspended flights from China. This should of been done 2 weeks ago. Thailand is up to 19 confirmed cases with the most recent being the first human-to-human transmission of the coronavirus to occur inside LOS after a local Thai taxi driver was apparently infected by a Chinese traveller. Still, the suspension of all flights should do it ie contain the virus to China and keep Thailand safe.

https://www.businessinsider.com/airlines-canceling-changing-flights-to-china-amid-coronavirus-fears-2020-1

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2418892]It looks like most airlines have now suspended flights from China. This should of been done 2 weeks ago. Thailand is up to 19 confirmed cases with the most recent being the first human-to-human transmission of the coronavirus to occur inside LOS after a local Thai taxi driver was apparently infected by a Chinese traveller. Still, the suspension of all flights should do it ie contain the virus to China and keep Thailand safe.

https://www.businessinsider.com/airlines-canceling-changing-flights-to-china-amid-coronavirus-fears-2020-1[/QUOTE]Whether there are only 19 cases here and my mind is subject to debate. You know as well as I do how the Thai government operates. I was going to stay here throughout February and then go over to Cambodia, but I'm leaving tomorrow. Mongering scene is horrible in Siem Reap but the air is clean, there's plenty of weed and stuff to take photos of and luxury condos are one-third the price of Bangkok. Hell, I have 10 km of carvings in anchor to photo. I'll come back to Bangkok when this all dies down.

[QUOTE=Nyezhov;2418895]I was going to stay here throughout February and then go over to Cambodia, but I'm leaving tomorrow. Mongering scene is horrible in Siem Reap but the air is clean, there's plenty of weed and stuff to take photos of and luxury condos are one-third the price of Bangkok. Hell, I have 10 km of carvings in anchor to photo. I'll come back to Bangkok when this all dies down.[/QUOTE]The Angkor Wat Archaeological Park is amazing and Siem Reap as a town is actually nicer IMHO than Chain Mai plus this time of year it has cleaner air. But as you note, from a mongering perspective, nothing much is happening. Ha Ha. A week is about as much as I would care to spend there. So if you are at all like me and don't want to go too long without girls, ha ha, you will have to go to Phnom Penh sooner or later for quality boom boom.

I like Phnom and I like Khmer girls. I think they are sweet and kind of funky, but I think you will find the same China risks there in Phnom that you find in BKK and Pat. Up to you how you want to respond to that. Personally I think at this stage the virus outside of China is mostly news hype, although it might become serious and bears close monitoring for sure. So at this moment I would avoid China, HKG, and Macau, but that is all. I also think that even in non-eventful years, the worst time of the year to be in BKK or Pat is Dec / Jan. High Season. Things will get better, a lot better by April / May, but if I am wrong, like I said previously, I am prepared to jump ship and head to Sao Paulo. E tudo de bom!

It's surprising how one's perspective goes out of the window when the news coverage is so intense and emotive. 60 people die on Thai roads every day. This is a substantially higher rate than the death rate from nCoV across the whole of China (current total 259), and no-one has so far died outside China. Yet nobody says "I'm not coming to Thailand because the roads are unsafe".

I have a trip to Pattaya booked in 2 weeks time. I'm not cancelling unless the situation in Thailand spirals dramatically. And I'm looking forward to less Chinese roaming the streets.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2418721]You guys should read the German FKK forums. Comedic. There is talk there to ban ALL Asians from FKK clubs. For those who don't know, some of the most popular FKK clubs like Sharks has a ton of Asian customers, mainly from USA and Japan.[/QUOTE]I am in Frankfurt now and the girls would certainly object to such a ban. The Asian hunters as they are called are very busy chasing after the Asian punters. I have seen it for myself.

Due to the outbreaks, specially Thailand has a lot of Chinese tourist even before the outbreaks become pandemic, so at this present period how many taxi drivers, bar girls, hotel staff have been infected? Nobody knows, the incubation period tooks at 14 days so known outbreaks in China began (officially) January 23rd then its not known how many Thais are already got infected? Specially bar girls, massage girls that come in close contact with any Chinese man during those periods.

So scary, thinking of postponing my trip this month to BKK.

Cheers,

MD.

[QUOTE=JRoberto;2419122]It's surprising how one's perspective goes out of the window when the news coverage is so intense and emotive. 60 people die on Thai roads every day. This is a substantially higher rate than the death rate from nCoV across the whole of China (current total 259), and no-one has so far died outside China. Yet nobody says "I'm not coming to Thailand because the roads are unsafe".[/QUOTE]If you are in a car accident in Thailand you yourself are injured. But if you carry the nCoV home with you there is a risk of infecting your family, friends, acquaintances, and work colleagues. Not to mention the people you come in contact with during transit.

SL.

[QUOTE=Sunlover2;2419592]If you are in a car accident in Thailand you yourself are injured. But if you carry the nCoV home with you there is a risk of infecting your family, friends, acquaintances, and work colleagues. Not to mention the people you come in contact with during transit.

SL.[/QUOTE]With respect I feel you are missing the point Roberto was making. Yes of course if you contact any transmittable condition including incidentally STD'S you are a carrier with the possibility of infecting others. However the likelihood of contacting the corona virus pales into insignificance when compared to the chances of being killed or seriously injured on Thailand's roads and yet this is rarely mentioned or even considered when deciding to holiday here. It's a matter of perspective and balance and the hysteria coming from the way the media is covering the outbreak is wholly over sensationalized. This is in no way to dismiss or trivialise the hundreds of deaths in China but we are talking hundreds in a country of 1,300,000 000 people many of whom would probably have died from underlying medical problems anyhow.

[QUOTE=JRoberto;2419122]It's surprising how one's perspective goes out of the window when the news coverage is so intense and emotive. 60 people die on Thai roads every day. This is a substantially higher rate than the death rate from nCoV across the whole of China (current total 259), and no-one has so far died outside China. Yet nobody says "I'm not coming to Thailand because the roads are unsafe".

I have a trip to Pattaya booked in 2 weeks time. I'm not cancelling unless the situation in Thailand spirals dramatically. And I'm looking forward to less Chinese roaming the streets.[/QUOTE]Yep, you are spot on. The hysteria is amazing. Great time to come to Thailand as there are very few tourists here. And I would imagine hotel prices across the region will be falling along with airfares.

With coronavirus in mind, what's the current attitude of girls towards Chinese or Asians? I'm Chinese-American not that any girl would know that. Haven't stepped foot on Mainland China in many years and have no desire to again. Are massage places going to reject me at the door? Will outcall escorts turn away when I open the door?

[QUOTE=Applesauce;2419652]With coronavirus in mind, what's the current attitude of girls towards Chinese or Asians? I'm Chinese-American not that any girl would know that. Haven't stepped foot on Mainland China in many years and have no desire to again. Are massage places going to reject me at the door? Will outcall escorts turn away when I open the door?[/QUOTE]No not at all I British born Chinese and I have no issues. Benn in BKK for 1 week all is fine.

[QUOTE=Applesauce;2419652]With coronavirus in mind, what's the current attitude of girls towards Chinese or Asians? I'm Chinese-American not that any girl would know that. Haven't stepped foot on Mainland China in many years and have no desire to again. Are massage places going to reject me at the door? Will outcall escorts turn away when I open the door?[/QUOTE]I have American Chinese friend who live in Pattaya and he is having no problem. Ofcourse other mongers and some girls get cautious when they see him in bar, but no massage shop has sent him away, yet. As far as outcall escort, I think you should make it clear before booking that you're American-chinese but not from wuhan region, to avoid any confusion later on.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;2419635]Yep, you are spot on. The hysteria is amazing. Great time to come to Thailand as there are very few tourists here. And I would imagine hotel prices across the region will be falling along with airfares.[/QUOTE]I'm still home but will start my journey tomorrow. I made airline reservations in early November and paid $2250 round trip. Same seats for same dates has varied quite a bit since I purchased. Same ticket was down to $1450 in late November and up to $2900 in mid-December. About 5 days ago price had again dropped to $1450 for a short time and quickly back to $2250. I can't figure out when airline prices will be high or low.

Hotel prices at my destinations are a bit more expensive than I paid through [URL]Hotels.com[/URL] in November.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;2419635]Yep, you are spot on. The hysteria is amazing. Great time to come to Thailand as there are very few tourists here. And I would imagine hotel prices across the region will be falling along with airfares.[/QUOTE]From past experience, when business goes down, girl prices go up. Counter to all logic ha ha, other than the girl needs more money than usual. I wonder if Hotel prices will really drop?

I would not be put off by the Virus just yet unless becomes quite prevalent in Bangkok. Yet business in Chinese districts in my home country (with few virus cases) has been decimated. A shopping centre food court is doing very badly.

My times of sickness are usually directly following international flights, so that is the risk for me for lots of viruses, even if not flying out of China.

I agree with the writer who points out that there are still far bigger risks in Bangkok, than the virus, such as crossing the road, being on a motorcycle, being struck by lightning, salmonella, botulism, even legionaires disease maybe.

Google Maps shows how bad is the traffic for your directions of best route between two places.

To see Bangkok traffic map in general. Try this:

[URL]http://traffic.longdo.com/en/[/URL]

You can even get past flood maps.

I use Longdo Dictionary too, but its only useful to translate Thai to English if you know Thai script. In reverse, there is some Romanised Thai phonetics for English words in the Thai-English-French: Volubilis Dictionary part. However one can see this dictionary is intended for Thai people, or very advanced Thai speakers. Thai-[URL]Language.com[/URL] is good for English speakers.

Volubis [URL]http://belisan-volubilis.blog$spot.com/[/URL] (remove the dollar sign) provides Excel spreadsheets with Thai, Romanised Thai, English, French. There are top 2000, top 5000, top 10000, and 100 K words / phrases database versions. I am soon to complete study of the top 5000, but am working on Lao / Issan words too. Being forced to speak mainly Thai most days has helped me a lot. The Mrs refuses to speak English to me, but will speak Issan sometimes.

Excel spread-sheets can be fed into Flashcard apps to assist study. Flashcards Deluxe is a really good phone App.

Its not always easy to really like all foreign languages equally. I like Thai, but dislike Issan / Lao, German, Vietnamese, Tagalog, to mention a few I have tried studying. Most languages have some annoying features that we find hard to adapt to. E. g for German its the complex grammar that is annoying, where Thai has the simplest grammar imaginable, perhaps. Issan just sounds much more ugly than Thai. Even the Lao people agree that Thai sounds nicer. Written Lao has spelling more simplified than Thai, even though 90% of Thai words have a regular spelling.

[QUOTE=Applesauce;2419652]With coronavirus in mind, what's the current attitude of girls towards Chinese or Asians? I'm Chinese-American not that any girl would know that.[/QUOTE]Damn right they would not know that. There are millions of Chinese Thai. They would just as well assume you were one of their own until you opened your mouth.

[QUOTE=HorseTrader;2419751]I can't figure out when airline prices will be high or low.[/QUOTE]Low: 2am on a Tuesday night. High: Noon on a Friday.

[QUOTE=Sunlover2;2419592]If you are in a car accident in Thailand you yourself are injured. But if you carry the nCoV home with you there is a risk of infecting your family, friends, acquaintances, and work colleagues. Not to mention the people you come in contact with during transit.[/QUOTE]Over the last 10 years there has been widely publicized measles, sars, mers, bird flu, swine flu, dengue, zika, chikungunya, yellow fever, cholera, H1N1, ebola, and whatever else I can't think of right now. This year it is corona. Next year there will be something else. When do you plan to move into a cave for the rest of your life?

[QUOTE=Applesauce;2419652]With coronavirus in mind, what's the current attitude of girls towards Chinese or Asians? I'm Chinese-American not that any girl would know that. Haven't stepped foot on Mainland China in many years and have no desire to again. Are massage places going to reject me at the door? Will outcall escorts turn away when I open the door?[/QUOTE]I was in Bankok this past weekend Thurs-Sun and was also there till mid Jan. When I landed at the airport this time it felt spooky with a lot of staff everywhere with masks and thermal scanners pointed at people. However once you are out and in the city things seemed just normal except for a lot of people now with face masks including all hotel staff. Bars in Nana, Clubs (level, insanity) and gogo bars were humming as usual although less crowded than NYear. I did not venture to Soi see this time nor Thermae due to not finding time. But a previous thermae contact that I sessioned with told me that she and her friends have stopped going to thermae because of the Chinese possibly visiting there.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2420048]Over the last 10 years there has been widely publicized measles, sars, mers, bird flu, swine flu, dengue, zika, chikungunya, yellow fever, cholera, H1N1, ebola, and whatever else I can't think of right now. This year it is corona. Next year there will be something else. When do you plan to move into a cave for the rest of your life?[/QUOTE]Your snark is wholly unnecessary Mr. E but no hard feelings though; as I believe people should do what they enjoy the most.

If you are in Bangkok next week let me know, and I will buy you a drink.

SL.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2420048]Over the last 10 years there has been widely publicized measles, sars, mers, bird flu, swine flu, dengue, zika, chikungunya, yellow fever, cholera, H1N1, ebola, and whatever else I can't think of right now............[/QUOTE]I recall all these outbreaks yet none created as great a scare or resulted in more economic damage than the coronavirus. I wonder why?

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2420048]Over the last 10 years there has been widely publicized measles, sars, mers, bird flu, swine flu, dengue, zika, chikungunya, yellow fever, cholera, H1N1, ebola, and whatever else I can't think of right now. This year it is corona. Next year there will be something else. When do you plan to move into a cave for the rest of your life?[/QUOTE]Good one! Yes I plan to be particularly healthy for the rest of my life by cutting myself off from society, living remotely with very low social contact, not quite a cave, but like a hermit. The one problem is this is not quite compatible with mongering. Ha ha. Can I give it up? Probably not. Maybe for a while, or in patches. My big cut back occurred before the Corona virus, by coincidence.

Airlines could advertise a new class of seating where passengers could pay a little more to be sealed inside a capsule with special air filtering. I seem to remember a Sci Fi book about everyone being sealed off from each other and trying to live to a very old age.

I can hardly remember Mers and H1 N1. Yet I read Thailand had 18 deaths from Swine Flu.

It is hard to fully understand the scare level. 1st factor is how many people have it and where they are located. The death rate of 5% has to be important (Sars was more deadly), since huge numbers of people catch a Flu or Corona Virus of some sort each year. 3nd factor is the level of contagiousness (ease to pass on airborne and surfaces). Number of cases reportedly doubling every 5 days. Will it peak soon? Then there is the insidiousness of symptomless persons passing it on with long incubation period. If you are very close to an infected patient for some time period, are you certain catch it?

Other factors:

Chinese government cover up.

I wonder if the name is relevant? If this was called "bat flu" instead of the Corona Virus, would that be much less scary?

I recall the bird flu time as really silly, with hotels insisting to over cook eggs till they were virtually inedible.

Can the spread be halted, or will it go to all countries? If so, the death toll will be huge.

In a very deadly monkey virus movie with Dustin Hoffman starring, I recall the military planning to drop a nuke on the infected area.

We are all meeting girls wearing masks now. Its a bit like a Hijab. I can't see how good looking they are any more. I am imagining a visit to Crazy House with girls dancing fully nude but with face masks on. Might be a little surreal.

Would guys be happy to fuck girls wearing a mask? Will blow jobs be totally banned as too dangerous?

Terrible tragedy at Terminal 21 in Korat yesterday afternoon. Over 50 shot and 20 dead.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2421390]Terrible tragedy at Terminal 21 in Korat yesterday afternoon. Over 50 shot and 20 dead.[/QUOTE]Yes, it seems Thailand is getting as bad as America. I hope they don't start shooting kids in school like they do in the USA. Terrible sick people.

RL.

A friend of mine who married a Thai lady and retired there responded to my query about the situation in Thailand and why there seemed to be little activity reported there in terms of infections when every other near by country is reporting increased infections every day or so. This is the response I got this morning:

"Everyone here knows that the Thai govt only cares about money and not its people. Why else would they not be harder on China? The China tourist trade has dropped considerably and the Thai govt is freaked over the loss of income.

Adding to their greed and stupidity, they are now seriously considering to implement a new tourist tax. Taxing new visitors to make up for the diminished income of the Chinese.

I am encouraging my friends to stay away until the virus fully blows over. The baht is getting hammered at the moment and the trend might continue. So waiting is a good idea. ".

This is only for informational purposes only. I do not want to open a debate or argument on this situation. Take it for what it is worth.

[QUOTE=Rodwint2;2422126]I am encouraging my friends to stay away until the virus fully blows over. The baht is getting hammered at the moment and the trend might continue. So waiting is a good idea. ".

This is only for informational purposes only. I do not want to open a debate or argument on this situation. Take it for what it is worth.[/QUOTE]Informational purposes? But you said the baht is getting hammered at the moment. How is that? Please elaborate on your information.

And who would stay away at a time like this? The papers are reporting that since Chinese people are not coming, prices have fallen and more focus is on foreingers that are not Chinese. So you recommend waiting until the Chinese return and prices go back up, and the Thais go back to not giving a shit about other foreigners?

[URL]https://www.pattayamail.com/featured/forgotten-tourists-enjoying-chinese-free-pattaya-287400[/URL]

Rodwint2. Gave an opinion. Said as much. And it was logical well thought out and well written. Mr. International blustered arguments against everything Rodwin2 said. Mr. International then should just come and go as he pleases. Quietly.

[QUOTE=PirateMorgan;2422136]Rodwint2. Gave an opinion. Said as much. And it was logical well thought out and well written. Mr. International blustered arguments against everything Rodwin2 said. Mr. International then should just come and go as he pleases. Quietly.[/QUOTE]You are absolutely right that Rodwint2 gave an opinion. As such, Mr E is entirely in his right to give some contrary facts and an opposing opinion. The hole in Rodwint2's case appears to be his assumption and inference: that there is some kind of Thai cover up of the actual number of new cases reported in LOS.

"There seemed to be little activity reported there in terms of infections when every other near by country is reporting increased infections every day or so."

Maybe there is little recorded new activity in Thailand because there is little new activity to record.

My Opinion:

I am guardedly optimistic and I am still planning on going to LOS unless the Bat Virus gets out of control in Japan & Thailand in which case I am sure my flight will be cancelled. My flight is scheduled for late April. I have no contingency back up plan although I could very easily change my travel plans with a couple of hours notice and hit Sao Paulo, Brazil instead. It has been over 10 years since I was last in Brazil. I don't like the culture as much as SE Asia, but the girls are amazing. Maybe it is time for a change. Ha Ha.

On the plus side of going to Thailand in the wake of this virus: I expect the plane will be half full, the girls to be at their most welcoming, and I have no problem with being quarantined in BKK or Pattaya should something happen after I arrive.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2422169]You are absolutely right that Rodwint2 gave an opinion. As such, Mr E is entirely in his right to give some contrary facts and an opposing opinion. The hole in Rodwint2's case appears to be his assumption and inference: that there is some kind of Thai cover up of the actual number of new cases reported in LOS.

"There seemed to be little activity reported there in terms of infections when every other near by country is reporting increased infections every day or so."

Maybe there is little recorded new activity in Thailand because there is little new activity to record.

My Opinion:

I am guardedly optimistic and I am still planning on going to LOS unless the Bat Virus gets out of control in Japan & Thailand in which case I am sure my flight will be cancelled. My flight is scheduled for late April. I have no contingency back up plan although I could very easily change my travel plans with a couple of hours notice and hit Sao Paulo, Brazil instead. It has been over 10 years since I was last in Brazil. I don't like the culture as much as SE Asia, but the girls are amazing. Maybe it is time for a change. Ha Ha.

On the plus side of going to Thailand in the wake of this virus: I expect the plane will be half full, the girls to be at their most welcoming, and I have no problem with being quarantined in BKK or Pattaya should something happen after I arrive.[/QUOTE]I respect NB's opinion, but the point I was trying to make was that there seemed to be an under reporting by the Thai government of the actual cases. Whether it is intentional by the government or just plain incompetence on the part of the agencies responsible for the health of the Thai people, my query to my friend was answered in a round about way in by my friend in his response that the Thai government was more concerned about angering China and the money it represents, than with the health of the people they govern. Both my friend and I are retired financial executives and our experience and knowledge in these areas exceeds the normal monger on this forum regarding reading the financial tea leaves in this situation.

After just watching the Sky News coverage of the one Briton who caught the virus in Singapore and spread it to France and Brighton in the UK, that "Typhoid Mary" has infected at least 11 people since being infected on January 21. So this is a very contagious virus that can be passed on when the infected person does not show any signs of illness, asymptomatic transmission. The cruise ship quarantined in Yokohama, Japan started with only 10 infections 6 days ago and now has 136 infected today. This is not the flu. There is no vaccine. There is no antibodies that can fight a virus that the human body has never encountered. Please do not take this situation lightly.

[QUOTE=Rodwint2;2422193]...............After just watching the Sky News coverage of the one Briton who caught the virus in Singapore and spread it to France and Brighton in the UK, that "Typhoid Mary" has infected at least 11 people since being infected on January 21. So this is a very contagious virus that can be passed on when the infected person does not show any signs of illness, asymptomatic transmission. The cruise ship quarantined in Yokohama, Japan started with only 10 infections 6 days ago and now has 136 infected today. This is not the flu. There is no vaccine. There is no antibodies that can fight a virus that the human body has never encountered. Please do not take this situation lightly.[/QUOTE]The numbers of dead have already surpassed SARS in such a short span of time. This is very scary.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2422169]............ I could very easily change my travel plans with a couple of hours notice and hit Sao Paulo, Brazil instead. It has been over 10 years since I was last in Brazil. I don't like the culture as much as SE Asia, but the girls are amazing. Maybe it is time for a change. Ha Ha.................[/QUOTE]You're not safe anywhere. [URL]https://www.rt.com/news/480495-virus-unknown-origin-brazil/[/URL].

How does being quarantined work? I am in phuket now and depend on restaurants for meals. Would cafes shut down in a quaratine?

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2422169]You are absolutely right that Rodwint2 gave an opinion. As such, Mr E is entirely in his right to give some contrary facts and an opposing opinion....



On the plus side of going to Thailand in the wake of this virus: I expect the plane will be half full, the girls to be at their most welcoming, and I have no problem with being quarantined in BKK or Pattaya should something happen after I arrive.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Turgid;2422196]The numbers of dead have already surpassed SARS in such a short span of time. This is very scary.[/QUOTE]Yeah I would stay home and hide in your closet.

Meanwhile in other news.

[URL]https://twitter.com/i/status/1221856224712495104[/URL]

[QUOTE=Horatio;2422259]How does being quarantined work? I am in phuket now and depend on restaurants for meals. Would cafes shut down in a quaratine?[/QUOTE]LOL. No. You would shut down. Because they would have you somewhere by your damn self. It is like jail. Well the solitary confinement part of jail, not the part where you get to hang out with other prisoners.

I meant more if they close down a city or try to limit movement. If phuket were to become highly contagious how would they deal with tourists who don't have the things needed to stay at hotel and not go out. I would want to head home but question if that would be possible or if flights would be cancelled.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2422274]LOL. No. You would shut down. Because they would have you somewhere by your damn self. It is like jail. Well the solitary confinement part of jail, not the part where you get to hang out with other prisoners.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Horatio;2422275]I meant more if they close down a city or try to limit movement. If phuket were to become highly contagious how would they deal with tourists who don't have the things needed to stay at hotel and not go out. I would want to head home but question if that would be possible or if flights would be cancelled.[/QUOTE]If there was an explosion of cases in any city in Thailand, the entire country would be cut off from the rest of the world. In other words, no one would be allowed to leave or enter Thailand at that point. Much like how China is being treated by the rest of the world now. No planes would be allowed out or in to the airports unless to evacuate citizens of a specific country. Possibly, the larger nations like the US, UK and Japan would arrange for evacuation flights, subject to quarantine upon arrival as they did with the Hubei evacuees. If your country was Mexico or Greece, you may be SOL. If you think you will be partying with all the girls in BKK, take a look at Hubei now and you will not see a sea of happy faces.

[QUOTE=Rodwint2;2422303]If there was an explosion of cases in any city in Thailand, the entire country would be cut off from the rest of the world. In other words, no one would be allowed to leave or enter Thailand at that point. Much like how China is being treated by the rest of the world now. No planes would be allowed out or in to the airports unless to evacuate citizens of a specific country. Possibly, the larger nations like the US, UK and Japan would arrange for evacuation flights, subject to quarantine upon arrival as they did with the Hubei evacuees. If your country was Mexico or Greece, you may be SOL. If you think you will be partying with all the girls in BKK, take a look at Hubei now and you will not see a sea of happy faces.[/QUOTE]Doubt they would ever implement that here. They would have a very hard time enforcing it. This is not China by any means. It would have a much more far reaching effect on the economy.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;2422419]Doubt they would ever implement that here. They would have a very hard time enforcing it. This is not China by any means. It would have a much more far reaching effect on the economy.[/QUOTE]What use is an economy if everybody is dead?

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;2422419]Doubt they would ever implement that here. They would have a very hard time enforcing it. This is not China by any means. It would have a much more far reaching effect on the economy.[/QUOTE]Any quarantine would not be self imposed. The rest of the world would cut off Thailand. The Thai government is playing a very risky game in hoping that there will be no outbreak, or that like China, it would be able to hide it from the rest of the world. Considering the fact that most nations do not trust the PRC to tell the truth about the current situation, Thailand would not be prepared nor is it capable to take the drastic actions that China is now implementing on its citizens.

As an example of the PRC not telling the truth, Hubei area has a significant smog problem over Wuhan city. The CO2 emissions normally are from car exhaust in typical times. However, there are no vehicles running in the Hubei region. The CO2 "smog" appears to be coming from the crematoriums which are supposedly running 24/7 and the workers complaining of not being able to go home. The deaths of 1,000 people would not be creating such a situation. Only if the deaths were in the 10,000's would such a drastic situation be occurring. That is why no one really trusts the China government. For Thailand to emulate that government model would be a big mistake.

[QUOTE=Horatio;2422275] If phuket were to become highly contagious how would they deal with tourists who don't have the things needed to stay at hotel and not go out.[/QUOTE]You would have to live like this for 14+ days.

If you're asymptomatic, hopefully you know enough bar girls that one would bail you out and allow you to stay with her.

Just looked at the coronavirus stats by country. I think it's safe for all you guys to go to Thailand. Look at all the Indian men that go to Pattaya and lesser so to Bangkok and out of all of them India only has 3 cases of coronavirus in a country of 1.4 billion people, likely none stemming from a visit to Thailand either. So keep going to Thailand guys and write those field reports. Totally safe.

Maybe the Indian men can use their low risk of coronavirus to convince previously unwilling Thai girls to go with them. Just tell the Thai girls India has far far fewer CV cases per capita than Japan, Korea, USA, Germany, Australia, Britain, etc.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2422548]Just looked at the coronavirus stats by country. I think it's safe for all you guys to go to Thailand. Look at all the Indian men that go to Pattaya and lesser so to Bangkok and out of all of them India only has 3 cases of coronavirus in a country of 1.4 billion people, likely none stemming from a visit to Thailand either. So keep going to Thailand guys and write those field reports. Totally safe.

Maybe the Indian men can use their low risk of coronavirus to convince previously unwilling Thai girls to go with them. Just tell the Thai girls India has far far fewer CV cases per capita than Japan, Korea, USA, Germany, Australia, Britain, etc.[/QUOTE]The 3 cases in India resulted from mainly students returning to Kerala (state in South India) from Wuhan. BTW FWIW there is a Homeopathic preventive regime for the Coronavirus circulating from renowned sources for those you may want to give alternate meds a shot. Just a couple of drops of "Arsenic album 30" (or maybe the globules form may work too taken directly) dissolved in water on an empty stomach for 3 days. No other intake till 30 mins later.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2422548]Just looked at the coronavirus stats by country. I think it's safe for all you guys to go to Thailand. Look at all the Indian men that go to Pattaya and lesser so to Bangkok and out of all of them India only has 3 cases of coronavirus in a country of 1.4 billion people, likely none stemming from a visit to Thailand either. So keep going to Thailand guys and write those field reports. Totally safe.

Maybe the Indian men can use their low risk of coronavirus to convince previously unwilling Thai girls to go with them. Just tell the Thai girls India has far far fewer CV cases per capita than Japan, Korea, USA, Germany, Australia, Britain, etc.[/QUOTE]A generous assumption is that there is some dark humor in the use of the phrase 'Totally safe".

3 in 1. 4 billion is misleading and unhelpful in this context.

3 in x, where x=number of Indians who went to Wuhan might be more meaningful; 1. 4 billion did not have potential contact with potential carriers by visiting China / any other country at risk.

No evidence suggests that nationality has anything to do with susceptibility to the virus. Not much of a joking matter, IMHO.

[QUOTE=Dena0;2422616]No evidence suggests that nationality has anything to do with susceptibility to the virus. Not much of a joking matter, IMHO.[/QUOTE]Well of course. We know that. And we also know that hookers are not as smart and as analytical as you. That being said, nationality in this case could be used as an advantage with back woods country hookers that do not think the same as you. This is an elementary street game we are playing. We just want to mislead them for a few minutes. You are thinking of being somewhere under lab conditions where every mm and every mg must be precise.

The concern of the coronavirus is spreading. This ship was rejected by the PI, Thailand, Japan and Taiwan because of the widespread Coronavirus fear.

[URL]https://www.yahoo.com/news/cruise-ship-stranded-thailand-coronavirus-133840793.html[/URL]

Globally # of new cases are reducing in the last several days.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2422169]My Opinion:

I am guardedly optimistic and I am still planning on going to LOS unless the Bat Virus gets out of control in Japan & Thailand in which case I am sure my flight will be cancelled. My flight is scheduled for late April. I have no contingency back up plan although I could very easily change my travel plans with a couple of hours notice and hit Sao Paulo, Brazil instead. It has been over 10 years since I was last in Brazil. I don't like the culture as much as SE Asia, but the girls are amazing. Maybe it is time for a change. Ha Ha.

On the plus side of going to Thailand in the wake of this virus: I expect the plane will be half full, the girls to be at their most welcoming, and I have no problem with being quarantined in BKK or Pattaya should something happen after I arrive.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2422637]Well of course. We know that. And we also know that hookers are not as smart and as analytical as you. That being said, nationality in this case could be used as an advantage with back woods country hookers that do not think the same as you. This is an elementary street game we are playing. We just want to mislead them for a few minutes. You are thinking of being somewhere under lab conditions where every mm and every mg must be precise.[/QUOTE]Funny, Mr. E. people, in general, think it should just be common sense a given? But " critical thinking " agreed by nearly all the experts outside and inside of Thailand it is lacking.

Last Friday, with my cousin in town the bunch of us decided to make a visit to Kinnarree in Pattaya. Now as you know I'm Chinese of course made in America while sitting and checking out the scene a girl went up to my cousin they talked a bit then she walks back to the group of girls started talking thereafter no one girl came over to us. One girl though nice personality, overweight bucktooth did come over (desperate?) to my cousin and started to rub his dick my cousin must have needed to clean his pipes bad so he took her.

While waiting one girl recognized my brother came over to talk thereafter went over to the girls and had a discussion she came back later and told my brother the first girl told the group we were Chinese from Wuhan! We didn't speak Cantonese or Mandarin only English! when they realize the mistake it was too late especially for the first girl.

People don't realize as you noted it is a game and it doesn't take much to gain an advantage.

[QUOTE=RunMann;2422709]The concern of the coronavirus is spreading. This ship was rejected by the PI, Thailand, Japan and Taiwan because of the widespread Coronavirus fear.

[URL]https://www.yahoo.com/news/cruise-ship-stranded-thailand-coronavirus-133840793.html[/URL][/QUOTE]To quarantine, provide food, test all, transport to special isolation, get cutting edge medical care, dispose of bodies if someone dies, not to mention the scare caused to locals where the ship docks. These are mammoth undertaking nobody wants and very few countries are equipped to deal with.

I am sure even China will not accept it at its ports.

International efforts on ongoing to find a cure. With modern anti viral drugs I am sure corona virus will be contained. By then many will unfortunately die.

I remember during AIDS crisis. Many had no cure and died. Initially all governments ignored it because it affected only homosexuals. When it became heterosexual disease they found a way to stabilize the disease.

I am sure many Southeast Asian countries are understating the exposure results. Especially those depending on tourism.

[QUOTE=Sammon;2422727]
I remember during AIDS crisis. Many had no cure and died. Initially all governments ignored it because it affected only homosexuals. When it became heterosexual disease they found a way to stabilize the disease.

.[/QUOTE]Equating AIDS to the corona is off the mark, AIDS is primarily sexually transmitted or via blood unlike corona which affects all sexual classifications/orientation. The longer this goes on, the richer some Pharma bros will get.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2422132]And who would stay away at a time like this? The papers are reporting that since Chinese people are not coming, prices have fallen and more focus is on foreingers that are not Chinese. So you recommend waiting until the Chinese return and prices go back up, and the Thais go back to not giving a shit about other foreigners?[/QUOTE]10 K posts! Mr. E, you are a legend!

But are you suggesting monger risk potential death / severe illness just to get cheap hookers? Or was it sarcasm that I failed to get?

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2422548]Just looked at the coronavirus stats by country. I think it's safe for all you guys to go to Thailand. Look at all the Indian men that go to Pattaya and lesser so to Bangkok and out of all of them India only has 3 cases of coronavirus in a country of 1.4 billion people, likely none stemming from a visit to Thailand either. So keep going to Thailand guys and write those field reports. Totally safe.

Maybe the Indian men can use their low risk of coronavirus to convince previously unwilling Thai girls to go with them. Just tell the Thai girls India has far far fewer CV cases per capita than Japan, Korea, USA, Germany, Australia, Britain, etc.[/QUOTE]The there were two recent cases of the virus in the UK this week. The first was the one that is all over the news because he got it in Singapore, transmitted to 5 people in France and a several others in the UK. Infected total from one guy, 11 new patients. What is disturbing is that the second UK virus carrier was a Brit in prison in Thailand and was transferred to the UK to serve his sentence in a UK prison. That guy exposed other prisoners and prison guards to the virus. What is disturbing is, "How did a prisoner in Thailand get the virus? No one in the Thai government responded to that question from the UK health authorities.

[QUOTE=Sammon;2422727]I am sure even China will not accept it at its ports.[/QUOTE]This literally brought tears to my eyes. Now that would really be messed up. We gave you guys the disease fair and square. No backsies!

[QUOTE=RioHeart;2422270]Yeah I would stay home and hide in your closet...............[/QUOTE]Is East Asia the entire world?

[QUOTE=Rodwint2;2422511]
...Only if the deaths were in the 10,000's would such a drastic situation be occurring. That is why no one really trusts the China government..[/QUOTE]Oh my buddha. 555.

[QUOTE=Rodwint2;2422511]Any quarantine would not be self imposed. The rest of the world would cut off Thailand. The Thai government is playing a very risky game in hoping that there will be no outbreak, or that like China, it would be able to hide it from the rest of the world. Considering the fact that most nations do not trust the PRC to tell the truth about the current situation, Thailand would not be prepared nor is it capable to take the drastic actions that China is now implementing on its citizens.

As an example of the PRC not telling the truth, Hubei area has a significant smog problem over Wuhan city. The CO2 emissions normally are from car exhaust in typical times. However, there are no vehicles running in the Hubei region. The CO2 "smog" appears to be coming from the crematoriums which are supposedly running 24/7 and the workers complaining of not being able to go home. The deaths of 1,000 people would not be creating such a situation. Only if the deaths were in the 10,000's would such a drastic situation be occurring. That is why no one really trusts the China government. For Thailand to emulate that government model would be a big mistake.[/QUOTE]In the winter an inversion layer develops. So there is your "smog. " 10,000 deaths and the cremation of those bodies? Sorry, even the Chinese gov would not be able to keep that under wraps. Please don't fabricate or spread rumors that cause unnecessary alarm.

The pollution index for PM 2. 5 in Wuhan has been "mild" recently. It was 68 today.

[QUOTE=Turgid;2422836]Is East Asia the entire world?[/QUOTE][URL]https://skepchick.org/2020/02/coronavirus-myths-pseudoscience-and-racism/[/URL]

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2422548]
Maybe the Indian men can use their low risk of coronavirus to convince previously unwilling Thai girls to go with them. Just tell the Thai girls India has far far fewer CV cases per capita than Japan, Korea, USA, Germany, Australia, Britain, etc.[/QUOTE]Is that because there are much fewer persons returning to India from Hubei? Does India have a high well off Chinese population that can afford trips to China?

Even a small percentage would be a lot in amongst the billion.

You guys missed the point of my post completely.

There was a poster here recently saying no Indian men go back to India with Blue Balls. So if that means 20,000+ Indian men get BBBJ and DFK in Pattaya on a weekly basis and none get the coronavirus, then hobbying in Thailand is safe and there should not be all of this mongering paranoia.

I'd be more afraid of standing in crowded long lines at Immigration at BKK or DMK and flying on a plane with circulated air than getting the virus from a girl in Pattaya or Bangkok.

I'm currently in a country with very very few cases of coronavirus. A regular girl I know has had a runny nose with no other symptoms for 2 days so she is getting tested at a hospital now because she thinks she has coronavirus. I told her she usually gets runny noses this time of year but she is convinced she has the coronavirus.

Here's some news that will make guys happy.....NOT! Because the coronavirus has affected tourism so much the government is considering extending Songkran to bring in more money.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2423416]I'd be more afraid of standing in crowded long lines at Immigration at BKK or DMK and flying on a plane with circulated air than getting the virus from a girl in Pattaya or Bangkok.[/QUOTE]DMK is a place to avoid at all costs even in the best of times. Unless of course if you're PRC.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;2423106]In the winter an inversion layer develops. So there is your "smog. " 10,000 deaths and the cremation of those bodies? Sorry, even the Chinese gov would not be able to keep that under wraps. Please don't fabricate or spread rumors that cause unnecessary alarm.[/QUOTE]I don't deal in fake news or rumors. I review the information with a touch of doubt and do not state information that does not have a strong factual basis.

Regarding the cremations, at the CDC press conference the other day, one news organization there stated that they had spoken with the funeral companies in Wuhan who stated that they were working 24/7. They also said that the cremations from the hospitals were about 30% of the current work and 70% were bodies picked up from private residences. Also, backing up the "smog" created by the cremations, a UK news organization raised this issue recently. See: [URL]https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/1240523/Coronavirus-satellite-image-scale-of-coronavirus-outbreak-infections-coronavirus-cremation[/URL] Additionally, the most recent CNBC report should be of interest as well: [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bf9a_I5kCDk[/URL].

[QUOTE=Rodwint2;2423459]They also said that the cremations from the hospitals were about 30% of the current work and 70% were bodies picked up from private residences.[/QUOTE]It may be because more people choose to use cremation instead of burial even if they not sure if the deceased die of the new virus or not.

[QUOTE=Rodwint2;2423459]I don't deal in fake news or rumors. I review the information with a touch of doubt and do not state information that does not have a strong factual basis.

Regarding the cremations, at the CDC press conference the other day, one news organization there stated that they had spoken with the funeral companies in Wuhan who stated that they were working 24/7. They also said that the cremations from the hospitals were about 30% of the current work and 70% were bodies picked up from private residences. Also, backing up the "smog" created by the cremations, a UK news organization raised this issue recently. See: [URL]https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/1240523/Coronavirus-satellite-image-scale-of-coronavirus-outbreak-infections-coronavirus-cremation[/URL] Additionally, the most recent CNBC report should be of interest as well: [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bf9a_I5kCDk[/URL].[/QUOTE]So by the CNBC stats the death toll is about 2%. Now who is dying? The old, the immunocompromised? That makes a huge difference. I would not put too much stock in what the Express says. A little better than click bait, but not much. I applaud the Chinese gov for implementing curfews. They seem to be making an effort to stop the spread as best they can. Personally, I think it is a great time to travel. Without the Chinese, there will be far fewer crowds throughout Asia and in Europe. Airfares have already tumbled. Saw BKK to Cairo for 15K Baht return on Emirates. BKK to Osaka for less than 6k return. Want to see Angkor Wat? Now is the time.

Has anyone else noticed a strange lull in the number and frequency of Line messages from the girls with reports of sickness, hospital stays and deaths of moms, dads, grandmoms, grandads, babies, brothers, sisters, etc. and asking for money to help pay for it since this coronavirus thing began?

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;2423498]So by the CNBC stats the death toll is about 2%. Now who is dying? The old, the immunocompromised? That makes a huge difference. I would not put too much stock in what the Express says. A little better than click bait, but not much. I applaud the Chinese gov for implementing curfews. They seem to be making an effort to stop the spread as best they can. Personally, I think it is a great time to travel. Without the Chinese, there will be far fewer crowds throughout Asia and in Europe. Airfares have already tumbled. Saw BKK to Cairo for 15K Baht return on Emirates. BKK to Osaka for less than 6k return. Want to see Angkor Wat? Now is the time.[/QUOTE]For sure discounted hotels, air fares complementary upgrades makes this a great time to travel. I see very little risk of contracting anything problematic coronavirus or otherwise although I would certainly avoid visiting China. The understanding of this disease continues to grow and the effects if contracted range from mild to serious. Most people with severe reactions have been older or had significant existing medical conditions similar to what is seen in people who have other respiratory illnesses, such as influenza from which hundreds of thousands die each year. It is not to be underestimated but the media have had a field day in creating a Hollywood pandemic plague like news cycle. The biggest concern is how long before a vaccine is developed and here the forecast ranges from 1 to 2 years. The efforts worldwide to contain it should eventually reduce new infections and fewer which hopefully will ease the minds of those overly concerned. I'm off for my favorite spring break to Japan and with some luck some of that renowned Japanese service.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2423416]You guys missed the point of my post completely.

There was a poster here recently saying no Indian men go back to India with Blue Balls. So if that means 20,000+ Indian men get BBBJ and DFK in Pattaya on a weekly basis and none get the coronavirus, then hobbying in Thailand is safe and there should not be all of this mongering paranoia.

I'd be more afraid of standing in crowded long lines at Immigration at BKK or DMK and flying on a plane with circulated air than getting the virus from a girl in Pattaya or Bangkok.

I'm currently in a country with very very few cases of coronavirus. A regular girl I know has had a runny nose with no other symptoms for 2 days so she is getting tested at a hospital now because she thinks she has coronavirus. I told her she usually gets runny noses this time of year but she is convinced she has the coronavirus.[/QUOTE]Hahaha totally agree with you!

Been RTFF for the last few weeks and I've got a pretty decent game plan for my month in Thailand.

My question is is there good places for meeting other vacationers and other such "nonpros"? I've heard maybe Tinder is an option?

I was contemplating Patong with the hopes of meeting other vacationers (in addition to its decent mongering opportunities). Any other places I should look at? I can't imagine meeting nonpros in Pattaya, for example.

Cheers,

Rojer.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;2423498]Now who is dying? The old, the immunocompromised? That makes a huge difference. [/QUOTE]Last time I saw stats for this it said 80% of those who died were over 60 years old. 75% had pre-existing conditions like diabetes or heart disease.

[QUOTE=RojerAims1;2423663]I was contemplating Patong with the hopes of meeting other vacationers (in addition to its decent mongering opportunities). Any other places I should look at? I can't imagine meeting nonpros in Pattaya, for example.[/QUOTE]Why can't you meet a non pro in Pattaya? Who misinformed you and told you every single girl in Pattaya was a hooker? I met my girlfriend in Pattaya and she was a non pro.

My friend who is a good looking Japanese American in his early 30's picked up a hot young non pro Russian tourist in Pratumnak Hill.

I'd recommend Khaosan Road in Bangkok as one of the better places to pick up drunk Farang tourists. The Full Moon parties would be another place.

You would meet non pros in the same types of places you would meet non pros in your home country. If you're successful at picking up civilian girls in your home country you'll be successful while on vacation.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2423836]Last time I saw stats for this it said 80% of those who died were over 60 years old. 75% had pre-existing conditions like diabetes or heart disease.

[/QUOTE]Just friendly remind you that there are people who were healthy and young and died with this disease. Just t be careful as it is a serious disease and a lot worse than flu.

Stay safe.

Jb.

[QUOTE=Rodwint2;2423459]I don't deal in fake news or rumors. I review the information with a touch of doubt and do not state information that does not have a strong factual basis.

backing up the "smog" created by the cremations, a UK news organization raised this issue recently. See: [URL]https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/1240523/Coronavirus-satellite-image-scale-of-coronavirus-outbreak-infections-coronavirus-cremation[/URL] Additionally, the most recent CNBC report should be of interest as well: [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bf9a_I5kCDk[/URL].[/QUOTE]The news you're quoting about these so called satellite measures has already been proved fake. Yet you choose to quote it deliberatly.

People like you spreading lies to worry others is an illness which affects this planet far worse than this virus.

https://www.euronews.com/2020/02/13/debunked-this-images-doesn-t-show-extent-of-corpse-burning-in-wuhan

[QUOTE=Sinofaguo;2423855]The news you're quoting about these so called satellite measures has already been proved fake. Yet you choose to quote it deliberatly.

People like you spreading lies to worry others is an illness which affects this planet far worse than this virus.

https://www.euronews.com/2020/02/13/debunked-this-images-doesn-t-show-extent-of-corpse-burning-in-wuhan[/QUOTE]

You can choose what you want to believe and I will look at what information I can find that has a semblance of fact. The CNBC story is substantive and the question raised at the CDC press conference is on the record by a valid news organization granted press credentials by the CDC, so I don't think any of the statements made were false or lies as you chose to accuse me of.

If you claim any of the "smog" facts were "disproven", then please state your sources other than "Euronews" who is not a legitimate news organization that is unknown as a genuine news site. In fact, "Euronews" appears to be a purveyor of "fake news" that you claim I am promoting. Since I hit a nerve with you and whom ever you are fronting for (Xinhua?), I believe my statements must be closer to the truth than yours.

Last time I had visited Pattaya was on December'19.

And was completely looking forward to trip again in Feb next week.

However, I postponed my plans in Jan due to cornonavirus situation and thought by March timeline, it would be contained.

Damn virus is still at large, and I guess I will again be rescheduling my trip to April first week.

However, I'm still not sure whether by Apr timeline the virus would be contained.

I believe more in mathematical models of cornovirus than Thai government words and it says the number of infected people to be much higher than the reported 33 people.

In Thailand is the second most vulnerable country next to China with regards to coronavirus infections.

Maybe I should just postpone the Thai trip indefinitely and head over PP / Jarkarta.

[URL]https://www.voanews.com/science-health/coronavirus-outbreak/experts-warn-coronavirus-may-be-spreading-undetected-indonesia[/URL]

What are your views?

[QUOTE=Rodwint2;2424098]You can choose what you want to believe and I will look at what information I can find that has a semblance of fact. The CNBC story is substantive and the question raised at the CDC press conference is on the record by a valid news organization granted press credentials by the CDC, so I don't think any of the statements made were false or lies as you chose to accuse me of.

If you claim any of the "smog" facts were "disproven", then please state your sources other than "Euronews" who is not a legitimate news organization that is unknown as a genuine news site. In fact, "Euronews" appears to be a purveyor of "fake news" that you claim I am promoting. Since I hit a nerve with you and whom ever you are fronting for (Xinhua?), I believe my statements must be closer to the truth than yours.[/QUOTE]A simple search reveals Euronews to be a legitimate organisation with NBC and European public broadcasters amongst the shareholders. You also used a daily express article as part of your claims. A news organisation about as reliable as the daily mail and if you read the express article it doesn't really say anything but rather poses bullshit questions which is par for the course for that rag of a publication.

[QUOTE=Rodwint2;2424098]You can choose what you want to believe and I will look at what information I can find that has a semblance of fact.

If you claim any of the "smog" facts were "disproven", then please state your sources other than "Euronews" who is not a legitimate news organization that is unknown as a genuine news site. In fact, "Euronews" appears to be a purveyor of "fake news" that you claim I am promoting. Since I hit a nerve with you and whom ever you are fronting for (Xinhua?), I believe my statements must be closer to the truth than yours.[/QUOTE]OMG are you for real? Did you even look at the copyright from the so called satellite images? They are tagged [URL]Windy.com[/URL].
Now go to [URL]Windy.com[/URL] twitter feed:

[URL]https://twitter.com/windyforecast/status/1228459766286102528[/URL]

They are the forcasting company who's images have been wrongly interpreted for what they are not. And they actually link themselves to the article I quoted.

You can also look at the english fact checking NGO:
[URL]https://fullfact.org/health/satellites-wuhan-sulphur-dioxide-coronavirus/[/URL]
There is even someone from the NASA explaining how the forecasting model works and how its not based on live data.

Stop taking us for idiots by spamming false news here. Not even sure how its related to Bangkok General reports to start with.

[QUOTE=Sinofaguo;2424222]OMG are you for real? Did you even look at the copyright from the so called satellite images? They are tagged [URL]Windy.com[/URL].
Now go to [URL]Windy.com[/URL] twitter feed:

[URL]https://twitter.com/windyforecast/status/1228459766286102528[/URL]

They are the forcasting company who's images have been wrongly interpreted for what they are not. And they actually link themselves to the article I quoted.

You can also look at the english fact checking NGO:
[URL]https://fullfact.org/health/satellites-wuhan-sulphur-dioxide-coronavirus/[/URL]
There is even someone from the NASA explaining how the forecasting model works and how its not based on live data.

Stop taking us for idiots by spamming false news here. Not even sure how its related to Bangkok General reports to start with.[/QUOTE]If you want to be argumentative and call me a "liar". You have that right. I don't claim or vouch for any website's accuracy as you do. I point out what I have found and the facts that are out there.

Your insistence on prolonging this "debate" and insistence on claiming everything I stated sounds like a persistent effort to discredit everything I write. Either you are psychotic and are in need of some help, or a front for the Chinese Communist Party or one of their official organs like Xinhua. I leave it to the readers to make up their own minds.

[QUOTE=Rodwint2;2424237]If you want to be argumentative and call me a "liar". You have that right. I don't claim or vouch for any website's accuracy as you do. I point out what I have found and the facts that are out there.

Your insistence on prolonging this "debate" and insistence on claiming everything I stated sounds like a persistent effort to discredit everything I write. Either you are psychotic and are in need of some help, or a front for the Chinese Communist Party or one of their official organs like Xinhua. I leave it to the readers to make up their own minds.[/QUOTE]Is covid19 a serious issue. Yes it is as mortality rate appears a lot higher than normal flu but nothing compared to SARS or the far more serious MERS but you are posting mega tin foil hat garbage I'm afraid. Anyone disagreeing works for Xi or is psychotic apparently. People should do their own research from legitimate sources and make their own minds up as to the risk. I was in Bangkok mid January and am back again for a week now. Far less face masks than I expected (except at the airport). I'm due to be in KL mid March if work allows me to fly as they are excessively HSE conscious due to the nature of the industry but only China is a definite no travel with no exception zone.

Here is an actual map of the spread of the virus [URL]https://gisanddata.maps.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html[/URL]#/ bda7594740 fd40299423467 b48 e9 ecf6.

Hey lads,

Do you know if it is possible to get a prepaid debit or similar in Thailand to spring for a Smooci Premium membership? I'm heading to Thailand in a couple days and want to get a membership (can't actually sign up for premium until I have a phone over there), but I don't want to pay with my regular debit or credit cards.

If anyone can offer me advice on how to sign up without using my real cards, I'd appreciate it.

[QUOTE=Sideshow01;2424319]Is covid19 a serious issue. Yes it is as mortality rate appears a lot higher than normal flu but nothing compared to SARS or the far more serious MERS but you are posting mega tin foil hat garbage I'm afraid. Anyone disagreeing works for Xi or is psychotic apparently. People should do their own research from legitimate sources and make their own minds up as to the risk. I was in Bangkok mid January and am back again for a week now. Far less face masks than I expected (except at the airport). I'm due to be in KL mid March if work allows me to fly as they are excessively HSE conscious due to the nature of the industry but only China is a definite no travel with no exception zone.

Here is an actual map of the spread of the virus [URL]https://gisanddata.maps.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html[/URL]#/ bda7594740 fd40299423467 b48 e9 ecf6.[/QUOTE]Far less masks? I just got out of Bangkok and was shocked to see at least 40% donning face masks.

[QUOTE=Omigawd;2428108]Far less masks? I just got out of Bangkok and was shocked to see at least 40% donning face masks.[/QUOTE]Masks are sold out all over BKK.

[QUOTE=Marjun;2424116]Last time I had visited Pattaya was on December'19.

And was completely looking forward to trip again in Feb next week.

However, I postponed my plans in Jan due to cornonavirus situation and thought by March timeline, it would be contained.

Damn virus is still at large, and I guess I will again be rescheduling my trip to April first week.

However, I'm still not sure whether by Apr timeline the virus would be contained.

I believe more in mathematical models of cornovirus than Thai government words and it says the number of infected people to be much higher than the reported 33 people.

In Thailand is the second most vulnerable country next to China with regards to coronavirus infections.

Maybe I should just postpone the Thai trip indefinitely and head over PP / Jarkarta.[/QUOTE]I had booked my trip on Feb 20. After watching a lot of youtube videos of the scenario in Thailand o decided to postpone it. I am planning a trip in April. Hopefully due to the climate by then things should be back to normal. I just can't understand when the whole world is concerned about the virus how come tourists I Thailand are still enjoying freely in pubs and bars and discotheques. Also what scared me was what would happen if I get a freelancer to my room unknowing that she was infected. I'm damn sure the virus would spread thru contact.

I too am hoping for the best till April. Till then I am keeping a close watch of the situation thru posts and YouTube videos.

I guess we are on the same boat. If you would like to chat we me add me on wazzap.

[QUOTE=Omigawd;2428108]Far less masks? I just got out of Bangkok and was shocked to see at least 40% donning face masks.[/QUOTE]I expected more I guess except in the bars / go-gos etc. Guess I wasn't clear.

[QUOTE]List of countries and territories at high risk of the Covid-19 infection: Japan, Germany, South Korea, China (including Hong Kong and Macau), Taiwan, France, Singapore, Italy, and Iran.

All returnees from these nations and territories must self-quarantine for 14 days, he said.

Ministerial announcements specify the following four measures for enforcement:

Visitors and Thai citizens returning from the high risk areas will be subject to 14-days home quarantine, even if they are cleared of the disease, unless they have permission from health officials.

Those who do not have a permanent residence or lodging in Thailand are required to show officials, upon arrival, evidence of where officials can locate them during the 14-day period.[/QUOTE]The final sentence is the big one for tourists. Read the link posted below if you are from one of the listed countries. Would suck to fly to Thailand only to be turned away to fly all the way back home.

Tourists will be required to show where they will be staying for 14 days after arrival. That would mean you will need to book your hotel for 14 days and not book an AirBNB since AirBNB is illegal in Thailand. If you really must use AirBNB in Thailand which I don't, you can book a hotel which has free cancellation, show Thai Immigration you are staying there, and then cancel your hotel. You do take the chance that somehow Thai immigration finds out you are not staying where you said you were and deports you with no return for 5 years on your record. Remember hotels are required to tell Thai Immigration when you check in and check out of their hotel. Imo best to be safe and stay in a hotel your next visit.

These new rules will affect myself since I was planning to do a FKK tour in Germany on my way to Bangkok. Now to get to Bangkok I will have to fly Germany to Jakarta, hobby in Jakarta for a week, then to Bangkok. Since Indonesia does not record the number of coronavirus cases it is a safe destination that will not be subject to the newly imposed Thailand quarantine. Vietnam, Philippines, and Cambodia appear to not report all their cases as well so those would be other options to fly in from. I'll predict that the USA will eventually make it on a Thailand quarantine list with their recent outbreak.

Source: [URL]https://www.thaipbsworld.com/new-anti-virus-measures-for-foreign-visitors-and-thais-returning-from-high-risk-areas/[/URL].

List of countries and territories at high risk of the Covid-19 infection: Japan, Germany, South Korea, China (including Hong Kong and Macau), Taiwan, France, Singapore, Italy, and Iran.

After seeing the above information, I wonder how this may or may not affect Airline Connections coming into BKK. Coming from US West Coast I go thru Taiwan on Eva, will this cause the required quarantine and 14 day health checks?

[QUOTE=StLouisMo2010;2430904]List of countries and territories at high risk of the Covid-19 infection: Japan, Germany, South Korea, China (including Hong Kong and Macau), Taiwan, France, Singapore, Italy, and Iran.

After seeing the above information, I wonder how this may or may not affect Airline Connections coming into BKK. Coming from US West Coast I go thru Taiwan on Eva, will this cause the required quarantine and 14 day health checks?[/QUOTE]I find it difficult to believe that the risk is higher in Germany than in Thailand. The Germans are probably doing a better job at reporting infections than the Thais.

[QUOTE=StLouisMo2010;2430904]After seeing the above information, I wonder how this may or may not affect Airline Connections coming into BKK. Coming from US West Coast I go thru Taiwan on Eva, will this cause the required quarantine and 14 day health checks?[/QUOTE]The Immigration Officer will see 2 immediate things which are your passport and your Arrival Card. My guess would be if either of these are from a restricted entry country you will be under quarantine protocol. This includes a connecting flight from Taiwan since the Arrival Card shows the last flight you took before arrival to Thailand.

[QUOTE=Turgid;2430990]I find it difficult to believe that the risk is higher in Germany than in Thailand. The Germans are probably doing a better job at reporting infections than the Thais.[/QUOTE]

A few Asian countries like Cambodia, Vietnam, Indonesia, and Philippines are doing a "poor job" at reporting the virus but I don't think Thailand is one of them. Thai all wear their masks if they can get their hands on one so not to spread the virus but how many Europeans or Americans walk around everywhere with a mask on? I was in Chicago last week and not a single non-Asian was wearing a mask. Germany's active cases doubled overnight to 545.

imo Thailand is doing the responsible thing. They want to know where to find you for the 14 day period after your arrival so they can contact you in case there may have been a chance you were infected like on your plane or an outbreak that happened at a connecting airport.

Is it time for a separate thread concerning the newest and subsequent viruses?

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2431017]The Immigration Officer will see 2 immediate things which are your passport and your Arrival Card. My guess would be if either of these are from a restricted entry country you will be under quarantine protocol. This includes a connecting flight from Taiwan since the Arrival Card shows the last flight you took before arrival to Thailand.

imo Thailand is doing the responsible thing. They want to know where to find you for the 14 day period after your arrival so they can contact you in case there may have been a chance you were infected like on your plane or an outbreak that happened at a connecting airport.[/QUOTE]This is from the BKK Post March 5:

"Six places defined as dangerous zones".

"The government has defined four countries and two territories as dangerous zones and restrictions may follow to prevent the outbreak of coronavirus.

The announcement, dated Monday and published in the Royal Gazette on Thursday, classified South Korea, China, Macao, Hong Kong, Italy and Iran as "dangerous communicable disease areas".

No quarantine measure has been officially announced, but Public Health Ministry spokesman Rungrueng Kitphati told Reuters on Thursday it would come into effect on Friday.

"Thais and foreigners who came from these places would have to go through self-quarantine for 14 days at home or in a hotel room, where they have to report themselves to the authorities every day or officials will come to check on them," Dr Rungrueng said.

The message here is ominous. No one is going to visit Thailand if a self quarantine is put into effect that means you can't leave your hotel or move around freely and the Thai Government knows this. Fortunately, my flight is through Narita, but this announcement makes me nervous, not the friggin' virus, which is just a bat flu. The odds of my visiting LOS this April just went down a tad, just like the stock market. 555. The odds of my visiting Sao Paulo just went up a tad.

Interestingly, I had dinner tonight with a couple friends at a favorite Italian restaurant in south Florida, USA. There must have been 100 customers in the restaurant drinking, dining, and having a nice night. No panic here. The weather was balmy.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2431017]The Immigration Officer will see 2 immediate things which are your passport and your Arrival Card. My guess would be if either of these are from a restricted entry country you will be under quarantine protocol. This includes a connecting flight from Taiwan since the Arrival Card shows the last flight you took before arrival to Thailand.

A few Asian countries like Cambodia, Vietnam, Indonesia, and Philippines are doing a "poor job" at reporting the virus but I don't think Thailand is one of them. Thai all wear their masks if they can get their hands on one so not to spread the virus but how many Europeans or Americans walk around everywhere with a mask on? I was in Chicago last week and not a single non-Asian was wearing a mask. Germany's active cases doubled overnight to 545.

imo Thailand is doing the responsible thing. They want to know where to find you for the 14 day period after your arrival so they can contact you in case there may have been a chance you were infected like on your plane or an outbreak that happened at a connecting airport.[/QUOTE]Top experts agree there is little point to wearing a mask if you are feeling well. It becomes ineffective after a fairly short time, due to moisture. Washing hands and not touching the face is a far more important measure.

So wearing a mask could identify yourself as sick, or not so smart, or feeling prejudice from non-Asians (assumed to be carriers). If it can effectively stop people from touching their face, it would have a use, but I doubt that somewhat. Maybe we should all wear gloves to remind us not to touch the face. My Thai Mrs has several masks of different types. They could be useful in former times against dust, bugs, smoke (slightly) etc. I suspect I will have to take one of these to keep her happy.

Meanwhile thanks for the warning. I had planned to fly to a remote province on return from Germany. That is looking a bit unlikely now. Might well be disallowed. I might be asked to hole up in a Bangkok Hotel, and no room cleaning service.

The Mrs. Keeps me informed of the total bullshit rumours too. Some are quite funny, like this Corana Virus was manufactured from HIV and other viruses combined, ha ha. Some how that was distorted result of minor DNA similarities and the way virus attacks human cells. Also that USA naturally must have had a major hand in getting this virus out there, including being a party to the Wuhan lab releasing it. These silly rumours must be circulating in Thai media I guess, some originate from dumb politicians. Mrs also seems to believe the Planet Nibiru exists and has had major influence on earth's natural disasters, like floods. She tells me all sorts of things, and I am surprised she thinks I could believe any of it. She knows I am a big skeptic type. Hard enough to even nod a yes to her when hearing about Buddhist re-incarnations in the next life.

I usually catch some sort of virus after a long flight, more often than not, so I expect to be slightly unwell with a normal cold after long flights. Takes a long time to test properly for the new one (e. G. 24 hours), so I don't know how they evaluate who should be tested. I had a sore throat the day before yesterday, 2. 5 days after flights, but so what?

Is this Corona going to be as bad as former Flu pandemics like the Spanish flu 1918 to 1920? Seems unlikely since it was reported to have killed about 1. 7% of the worlds population with death rate of 2 to 3%. Surely modern methods will contain this one better and make it more survivable for the otherwise healthy strong people.

I am somewhat resigned to the Thai fatalist culture, thinking that could easily catch this new virus regardless of precautions, simply because I don't have the option to isolate myself for a long time right now. Have.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2431088]
The announcement, dated Monday and published in the Royal Gazette on Thursday, classified South Korea, China, Macao, Hong Kong, Italy and Iran as "dangerous communicable disease areas".

No quarantine measure has been officially announced, but Public Health Ministry spokesman Rungrueng Kitphati told Reuters on Thursday it would come into effect on Friday.
[/QUOTE]So France, Germany and USA omitted for now. Hundreds instead of 1000's of cases.

"The WHO is recommending that elderly travellers and those with underlying health conditions delay or avoid travel to areas that are experiencing ongoing transmission of COVID-19. That is because the disease, while mild in some 80 percent of cases, can be fatal for people who are above 65 years or who have chronic illnesses.

That list of countries experiencing local transmissions is updated daily by the WHO. In Asia, it currently includes China, South Korea, Japan, Singapore, Malaysia, Vietnam, Thailand and Indonesia.

European countries on the list are Italy, France, Germany, Spain, the United Kingdom, Switzerland, Norway, the Netherlands, Sweden, Croatia, Denmark, Finland, Greece and Romania. Three countries in the Middle East are listed. Iran, the United Arab Emirates and Lebanon.

In the Americas, the United States, Canada and Ecuador have reported transmission of COVID-19 infections.

Only one African country is on the list. Algeria.

Australia in the Oceania region is also on the list.

Governments have also put out their own travel warnings. But this varies from country to country. ".

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2431017] Thai all wear their masks if they can get their hands on one so not to spread the virus but how many Europeans or Americans walk around everywhere with a mask on?[/QUOTE]Wait that the virus come in their own town with confirmed death cases and they will wear these masks as well if they can still find some of them.

"No compulsory quarantine of visitors to Thailand" quote from today's BKK Post:

"Health authorities on Friday said they would not order the compulsory quarantine of visitors from countries hit hard by coronavirus, as the kingdom struggles to balance health fears with the needs of its flatlining economy.

The holidays of possibly tens of thousands of people were cast into doubt on Tuesday when the health minister insisted a quarantine of all entrants from China, including territories of Hong Kong and Macau, Italy, Iran, South Korea, would be imposed.

On Friday health authorities spiked the plan, instead "recommending" arrivals from the four countries stay indoors and report to authorities for monitoring.

"We recommend home quarantine," Sukhum Kanchanapimai, permanent-secretary of the Public Health Ministry told reporters.

Travellers from the four countries will have to "report on their health status daily", said Tanarak Plipat of the Disease Control Department, or risk "punishment" under the law.

Seoul blasts Japan's quarantine decision.

Growth forecast cut, Iran cases surge by 50%: Virus update.

Returning 'little ghosts' face quarantine.

A British man who entered the kingdom from Hong Kong became the country's 48th confirmed case of the virus, health authorities said.

But the number detected has remained surprisingly low, in a country visited by tens of millions of people each year.

Speculation is pointing at a limited testing regime in a country determined not to frighten off visitors.

Friday's announcement, for now, ends a week-long barrage of conflicting information, which baffled holidaymakers hunting winter sun and spotlighted the conundrum posed to a country reliant on tourist dollars and exports.

Thailand attracts some 40 million foreigners a year. But the impact of the virus has seen visitor numbers collapse.

The Tourism Authority of Thailand confirmed Thursday the country could see a loss of six million visitors in 2020.

As a result, the country's tourist-reliant economy has hit the skids, with the impact of Covid-19 crisis hacking back at already sluggish growth forecasts to as low as 2% this year.

With exports seizing up to China and other coronavirus-19 hit nations, experts warn Thailand is facing a hammer blow to its economy. ".

Ok, so the odds of my trip to LOS ticked up a tad today. Ha Ha. Stay tuned for what happens next week.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2431187]"No compulsory quarantine of visitors to Thailand" quote from today's BKK Post:

"Health authorities on Friday said they would not order the compulsory quarantine of visitors from countries hit hard by coronavirus, as the kingdom struggles to balance health fears with the needs of its flatlining economy.

The holidays of possibly tens of thousands of people were cast into doubt on Tuesday when the health minister insisted a quarantine of all entrants from China, including territories of Hong Kong and Macau, Italy, Iran, South Korea, would be imposed.

On Friday health authorities spiked the plan, instead "recommending" arrivals from the four countries stay indoors and report to authorities for monitoring.

"We recommend home quarantine," Sukhum Kanchanapimai, permanent-secretary of the Public Health Ministry told reporters.

Travellers from the four countries will have to "report on their health status daily", said Tanarak Plipat of the Disease Control Department, or risk "punishment" under the law.

Seoul blasts Japan's quarantine decision.

Growth forecast cut, Iran cases surge by 50%: Virus update.

Returning 'little ghosts' face quarantine..[/QUOTE]The shot of suvarnabhoomi is looking very scary and telling. Just 2 weeks ago, things were very quite but this is terrible. I took the plunge considering several factors and remained undecided till about 100 hours before departure.

I would NOT travel now even if I am offered a free ride. No, Thank you.

My Thai-GF flew in from Tokyo / Narita to DMK in March 1 and was put into self-quarantaine for 2 weeks.

[QUOTE=AvocaDick;2428419]I had booked my trip on Feb 20. After watching a lot of youtube videos of the scenario in Thailand o decided to postpone it. I am planning a trip in April. Hopefully due to the climate by then things should be back to normal. I just can't understand when the whole world is concerned about the virus how come tourists I Thailand are still enjoying freely in pubs and bars and discotheques. Also what scared me was what would happen if I get a freelancer to my room unknowing that she was infected. I'm damn sure the virus would spread thru contact.

I too am hoping for the best till April. Till then I am keeping a close watch of the situation thru posts and YouTube videos.

I guess we are on the same boat. If you would like to chat we me add me on wazzap.[/QUOTE]I am also planning to be in Thailand in the middle of April and leaving at the end of the month.

Would be great to discuss the situation and maybe meet up if we have overlapping plans.

PM if you want to exchange digits.

Rgds,

TheTank.

[QUOTE=DaddySan;2431266]My Thai-GF flew in from Tokyo / Narita to DMK in March 1 and was put into self-quarantaine for 2 weeks.[/QUOTE]Curious to how strict they are monitoring her self-quarantine. Is someone calling her at a random time during the day to make sure she is at home? What are the rules regarding her ability to go buy food and necessities for 2 weeks? If I just return from a vacation my fridge is usually quite empty.

Whatever one feels about the possibility of contracting the virus and even if contracting it the likelihood of it being serious there is no denying the effect whether voluntary or forced it has on the lives of people.

Going forward the big news will be out of the US where the response has been criminally slow with a head in the sand attitude about what was happening worldwide. Almost zero testing and an administration believing a miracle will blow it all away.

With over 2 million testing kits coming on stream watch out for an exponential rise in confirmed cases.

How that effects mongering here in Thailand? Fewer high spending yanks travelling depressing still further demand for services.

A semi-regular once or twice a month of mine who works the club circuit and the escort end told me her earnings are down 50% and she no longer refuses offers she would have laughed at months ago. Now she is a relatively expensive trick 5 k up for a couple of hours.

Girls working the lower end of the market such as Thermae seem from posts for some reason to holding firm to 2500 but turning down 2000 and continually later finding themselves going home empty handed cannot last forever.

Whether it has an impact on service levels is a different and I feel more complicated equation.

So good news for us ex-pats I guess even if sadly it's not for the best of reasons.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2431890]Whatever one feels about the possibility of contracting the virus and even if contracting it the likelihood of it being serious there is no denying the effect whether voluntary or forced it has on the lives of people.

Going forward the big news will be out of the US where the response has been criminally slow

So good news for us ex-pats I guess even if sadly it's not for the best of reasons.[/QUOTE]One of my favorite girls went back to Isan. Said she is too worried about the virus to work now. Another Thermae favorite is also scared but continues to work, but I don't know for how much longer.

The guy at the desk at the gym I go to said he could get my visa extension from the immigration office for me and save me the trip. I paid him 2700 baht yesterday. Gave him my passport and photo. I got it back today. I wasnt aware things could be done this way.

[QUOTE=Horatio;2432993]The guy at the desk at the gym I go to said he could get my visa extension from the immigration office for me and save me the trip. I paid him 2700 baht yesterday. Gave him my passport and photo. I got it back today. I wasnt aware things could be done this way.[/QUOTE]Shouldn't be and for a mere 800 baht (2700-1900) very good value to avoid the hassle of hanging around immigration.

[QUOTE=Horatio;2432993]The guy at the desk at the gym I go to said he could get my visa extension from the immigration office for me and save me the trip. I paid him 2700 baht yesterday. Gave him my passport and photo. I got it back today. I wasnt aware things could be done this way.[/QUOTE]Too cheap and too quick IMO. Over here in Pat 12 k for the extension + Multiple entry. Plus (new since last year) a quick visit to the contact at immigration for a pic. Agency gave me the immigration receipts in case police question the validity.

Why didn't you post in the "Retirement visa" thread?

Regarding the corona hysteria, 2 links to put things into perspective:

https://www.medscape.com/answers/219557-3459/what-is-the-global-incidence-of-influenza

https://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2016-05/24/content_25442984.htm

So yearly between 300 000 and 600 000 influenza deaths worldwide and 260 000 road deaths in China (not to mention the wounded since the coronavirus leaves no wounded).

[QUOTE=Horatio;2432993]The guy at the desk at the gym I go to said he could get my visa extension from the immigration office for me and save me the trip. I paid him 2700 baht yesterday. Gave him my passport and photo. I got it back today. I wasnt aware things could be done this way.[/QUOTE]"Gave him my passport and photo. " I suppose this is how "identy fraud" can start; better be carefull with who you give your passport to.

[QUOTE=Horatio;2432993]The guy at the desk at the gym I go to said he could get my visa extension from the immigration office for me and save me the trip. I paid him 2700 baht yesterday. Gave him my passport and photo. I got it back today. I wasnt aware things could be done this way.[/QUOTE]Yeah. It costs 1900 baht. Doesn't matter who goes there to do it. Easy 800 baht for him.

[QUOTE=Horatio;2432993]The guy at the desk at the gym I go to said he could get my visa extension from the immigration office for me and save me the trip. I paid him 2700 baht yesterday. Gave him my passport and photo. I got it back today. I wasnt aware things could be done this way.[/QUOTE]There's lots of tourist / travel places that offer the service to go deal with getting your visa extension for you. Its usually more convenient to just let someone else take care of it for you, but you can always go to the immigration office and do it yourself if you care about saving like 500 baht or so in exchange for a few hours of time, effort, and travel.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2433078]Yeah. It costs 1900 baht. Doesn't matter who goes there to do it. Easy 800 baht for him.[/QUOTE]That's a fair price, I think. In Bangkok, I'd happily pay 800 baht to avoid wasting 6-7 h at Chaengwattana. Just the taxi there and back would cost 300-400.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2433078]Yeah. It costs 1900 baht. Doesn't matter who goes there to do it. Easy 800 baht for him.[/QUOTE]I talked to a guy who had been in Thailand for years and got his visa renewed under the table ignoring any and all restrictions. Your dealing with a corrupt country after all.

BTW Mr. Enternational, did you used to be an airline pilot?

[QUOTE]Visa on Arrival (VoA) will be suspended for nationals of all 19 countries and territories previously eligible, including Bulgaria, Bhutan, China, Cyprus, Ethiopia, Fiji, Georgia, India, Kazakhstan, Malta, Mexico, Nauru, Papua New Guinea, Romania, Russia, Saudi Arabia, Taiwan, Uzbekistan, and Vanuatu, according to a list provided to reporters by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs.

Visa exemptions will be canceled for South Korea, Italy and Hong Kong[/QUOTE]Take note if you are from one of the affected 22 countries.

[QUOTE]all foreign tourists arriving at all international airports in Thailand will be required to download an AOT Airports application onto their mobile phones

Once the app is downloaded, they will have to fill in the required information - name, surname, passport ID , mobile phone number, e-mail address and present them to the immigration officials on duty . The information will be stored for 14 days after arrival.[/QUOTE]Download the App if you're going to Thailand.

[QUOTE=Horatio;2432993]The guy at the desk at the gym I go to said he could get my visa extension from the immigration office for me and save me the trip. I paid him 2700 baht yesterday. Gave him my passport and photo. I got it back today. I wasnt aware things could be done this way.[/QUOTE]Just a word of caution on using a broker. I don't know if it's legit to use one to extend a retirement visa but I was under the impression you had to do this in person. If not then no worries. However is there is any hanky panky going on!!

15 years or so ago before I got my retirement visa I used a broker who when he had collected enough passports got the train to the Malaysian border and had all the passports stamped as going in and out of the country so a new visa for 2 months with another month extension at immigration I. E 3 months till the need to do it again.

All good until a guy called Hambali with links to al Qaeda was nicked with a passport that had taken advantage of this "short cut". What followed was a certain amount of chaotic confusion where anybody who had a stamp from a certain official at the border was unsure what to do and whether they were likely to be questioned about how they got it.

Passports were suddenly lost, stolen, misplaced chewed by the dog or maybe the buffalo and embassies never had so many submissions for new passports.

I never found out if the panic was actually justified but I now pretty much follow the letter of the law when it comes to immigration which for extension of retirement visa plus a reentry permit basically takes me a day at Chang Wattana. If I could use a broker and pay him or her 800 knowing it is perfectly legit I would do so in a heartbeat.

So does anybody know for sure I. E. 100% if one can use a broker and avoid the hassle of going in person.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2433301]Take note if you are from one of the affected 22 countries.

Download the App if you're going to Thailand.[/QUOTE]US citizen here. Just flew from Ho Chi Minh to BKK yesterday. It took all of 15 minutes to clear customs. Plane was 3/4 full but no line at customs. No one checked my temp. No one asked me where I've been. No forms or apps to download. No one even asked me a question. So must not be up and running yet? My luck I was seated next to an Italian couple on the plane. Not sure if they had a problem at customs.

I am feeling perfect but have decided to self quarantine for 72 hours just to be on the safe side. I'm in an apartment near Soi 13. May go back to Nha Trang Vietnam and wait all of this out. Paradise there and didn't want to leave but Visa expired. Just use common sense. BTW I don't wear a flimsy paper mask. Observed all the people wearing masks on the train from the airport and noticed all of them fiddling with their masks multiple times. And that's exactly what you don't want to do. Putting your hands near your mouth!

Hi.

Is this true, some currency exchange boots in Thailand are temporarily suspending it's currency exchange service as a preventive measure against the spread of Convid-19?

Not great news for those of us still planning to visit in the spring of the year of the Corona. I don't know how the Thai Government expects to enforce this eddict. From what I hear their downloadable Visitor Reporting App doesn't work. So I assume visitors from countries with on going local transmissions like the USA, UK, France ect will just fill out Form T8 and that's that ie do what you like, go where you want to go without reporting back.

In any case, I now rate the odds of my flight being cancelled at 50%. Sometimes you can't fight the system and it is useless to try. So if my flight is cancelled, I will rebook for late August after this Wuhan Virus is gone or rather after the worldwide panic subsides.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2433730]Not great news for those of us still planning to visit in the spring of the year of the Corona. I don't know how the Thai Government expects to enforce this eddict. From what I hear their downloadable Visitor Reporting App doesn't work. So I assume visitors from countries with on going local transmissions like the USA, UK, France ect will just fill out Form T8 and that's that ie do what you like, go where you want to go without reporting back.

In any case, I now rate the odds of my flight being cancelled at 50%. Sometimes you can't fight the system and it is useless to try. So if my flight is cancelled, I will rebook for late August after this Wuhan Virus is gone or rather after the worldwide panic subsides.[/QUOTE]Asiana Airlines canceled my flight to Bangkok. After 15+ calls, I finally reached Asiana reservation and they found me another flight carrier (Thai Airways) within their Star Alliance program.

Tried to attached copy of T8 form, but it exceed size limit.

TC.

[QUOTE=Tcvve;2433748]Asiana Airlines canceled my flight to Bangkok. After 15+ calls, I finally reached Asiana reservation and they found me another flight carrier (Thai Airways) within their Star Alliance program.

Tried to attached copy of T8 form, but it exceed size limit. TC.[/QUOTE]Hi TC. I have attached a pdf of the T8 form. I am sure that the airlines or Thai customs will give this form to new arrivals, but it may save you some time to have it filled out and ready to go.

In addition, watch this true life video. This happened today in New Rochelle, NY. Things are getting pretty crazy in the USA. 555.

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LawuQG8Z81w[/URL]

[QUOTE=Tcvve;2433649]Is this true, some currency exchange boots in Thailand are temporarily suspending it's currency exchange service as a preventive measure against the spread of Convid-19?[/QUOTE]I know Kasikorn did. I don't know about any others.

[QUOTE=RioHeart;2433543]US citizen here. Just flew from Ho Chi Minh to BKK yesterday. It took all of 15 minutes to clear customs. Plane was 3/4 full but no line at customs. No one checked my temp. No one asked me where I've been. No forms or apps to download. No one even asked me a question. So must not be up and running yet? [/QUOTE]It was to be effective March 12 but obviously no one has told the Immigration Officers yet. Thanks for the update.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2433751]Hi TC. I have attached a pdf of the T8 form. I am sure that the airlines or Thai customs will give this form to new arrivals, but it may save you some time to have it filled out and ready to go.

In addition, watch this true life video. This happened today in New Rochelle, NY. Things are getting pretty crazy in the USA. 555.

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LawuQG8Z81w[/URL][/QUOTE]New Rochelle currently has 126 cases and rising. It wouldn't surprise me if someone actually goes "homicidal" after being cough on.

I live in New York city.

It's like a ghost town here. Subway cars practically empty.

Went to Champs Sporting Goods to pick up sweat pants (at 10 Times Square) around Noon. Temp upper 60's.

Very few people walking around & about. I think many people are working from home today. TC.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2433757]I know Kasikorn did. I don't know about any others.[/QUOTE]No problem, plenty of takers at T. T. Exchange and the rate is better!

[QUOTE]Thailand's Deputy Prime Minister called "farangs" dirty people who don't shower.

He blamed them for fleeing Europe and coming to Thailand potentially spreading the Covid-19 virus.

He advised his countryfolk to avoid them especially as "not a single one was wearing a mask"

He advised that Thais should be more wary of Westerners than Asians. [/QUOTE]

Greetings from Thailand.

[QUOTE=Tcvve;2433649]Hi.

Is this true, some currency exchange boots in Thailand are temporarily suspending it's currency exchange service as a preventive measure against the spread of Convid-19?[/QUOTE]Yes I've noticed a few around town that are closed with a notice in the window explaining they've closed for that reason. However you can still change currency at many of the smaller booths. I searched around yesterday near Nana and found a group of booths (maybe 8 of them) on Soi Sukhumvit 3/1. They were all open. Also exchanged cash there today.

I am still 30 days away from my flight to LOS and it is getting harder to remain optimistic that my spring 2020 trip is going to happen. The 1st real bad piece of news came out of the PI a couple of days ago. The Philippine government is locking down Manila and closing all the bars. No foreign arrivals will be allowed to leave metro Manila to visit the rest of the country.

The 2nd really bad headline is from today: Cambodia is now closed!

[URL]https://www.nationthailand.com/news/30384094?utm_source=homepage&utm_medium=internal_referral[/URL]

"Cambodian authorities announced a series of measures on Saturday to halt the spread of the deadly Covid-19 disease after more cases were detected in the Kingdom.

Among the measures are an early vacation for schools in Siem Reap town and Phnom Penh, a 30-day entry ban on nationals from Italy, Germany, Spain, France and the US, and a ban on cruise ships and riverboats entering Cambodia. ".

So sadly, it is probably only a matter of a few days before the Thai Government issues a similar decree banning flights from the USA into BKK or shuts down the bars. A couple of weeks ago I thought my April trip was a slam dunk and it was going to be a blast to party in the spring of the corona. Now, I am really not sure it will happen. A couple of weeks ago I had Sao Paulo in mind as a backup plan in case United Airlines cancelled my flight to LOS. Now I think I will punt on Brazil and reschedule my Thai / Indonesian trip for late August thru November if it comes to that ie 1) my flight is cancelled, 2) Thailand restricts US citizens from entry, and / or 3) the bars are shut. You just can't fight the system. I now calculate the odds of my arrival in BKK in late April as 30%. But we shall see what we shall see.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2433751]In addition, watch this true life video. This happened today in New Rochelle, NY. Things are getting pretty crazy in the USA. 555.

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LawuQG8Z81w[/URL][/QUOTE]This video is a sketch from a comedy show. I saw it a week or so ago on a wechat group I'm in. If you can find a better quality video you'll see the writing behind the people is not English.

[QUOTE=Kerrstar;2434125]This video is a sketch from a comedy show. I saw it a week or so ago on a wechat group I'm in. If you can find a better quality video you'll see the writing behind the people is not English.[/QUOTE]Of course it is a sketch. It is funny because there is an element of truth in the wild exaggeration. It kind of reminded me of the old Monty Python sketches and early Saturday Night Live acts with Murray, Belushi, and Aykroyd when that show used to be wild & crazy and fun to watch.

[QUOTE=RioHeart;2433543]US citizen here. Just flew from Ho Chi Minh to BKK yesterday. It took all of 15 minutes to clear customs. Plane was 3/4 full but no line at customs. No one checked my temp. No one asked me where I've been. No forms or apps to download. No one even asked me a question. So must not be up and running yet? My luck I was seated next to an Italian couple on the plane. Not sure if they had a problem at customs.

I am feeling perfect but have decided to self quarantine for 72 hours just to be on the safe side. I'm in an apartment near Soi 13. May go back to Nha Trang Vietnam and wait all of this out. Paradise there and didn't want to leave but Visa expired. Just use common sense. BTW I don't wear a flimsy paper mask. Observed all the people wearing masks on the train from the airport and noticed all of them fiddling with their masks multiple times. And that's exactly what you don't want to do. Putting your hands near your mouth![/QUOTE]After departure for the plane and walking to immigration a lady ask me to remove my hat and carry it. She said the scanners need to check my temp. So we are being monitored.

When I arrived at Phuket the police were scanning each persons temp. Also from what I have heard the convin19 virus is very large and that presently all the masks are ok for use against passage.

Chinese are already healing from the convin19 flu and are going back to work. It's a bad flu but not a plague.

I began feeling the virus was completely overblown as a threat and I'm still sanguine that its going to be contained and not pose a risk to the average Joe but I am no longer seeing it it as just another flu. The following shows it is not a normal flu and if it spreads to any sizable chunk of the population od a country its f**king serious shit.

Dr. Anthony Fauci, director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, and others have said, COVID-19 is deadlier than the flu. It's deadlier for young adults. It's deadlier for older adults. In China, early data shows that it was 10 times deadlier.

The flu kills less than 1% of infected people who are over age 65. By comparison, in China, COVID-19 killed 8% of those infected who were 70-79 and almost 15% of those infected who were age 80 or older. That's a staggering difference.

Even for younger people, the difference was striking. Flu killed. 02% of infected patients age 18-49. It's 10 times that for COVID-19.

In other countries, such as South Korea, the death rate has been far lower.

But if 1 in 12 people age 70-79 who get the virus and 1 in 7 people age 80 or older who get the virus die, and the virus spreads to 20%, 40% or 70% of the population, we're talking massive death tolls, the likes of which we have never seen before in our lives.

"I mean, people always say, well, the flu does this, the flu does that," Fauci said Wednesday during congressional testimony. "The flu has a mortality of 0. 1%. This has a mortality rate of 10 times that. That's the reason I want to emphasize we have to stay ahead of the game in preventing this. "

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2434326]It kind of reminded me of the old Monty Python sketches and early Saturday Night Live acts with Murray, Belushi, and Aykroyd when that show used to be wild & crazy and fun to watch.[/QUOTE]I think the "Bring out your dead" part from Monty Python and the Holy Grail is the most appropriate sketch now.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2434372]I began feeling the virus was completely overblown as a threat and I'm still sanguine that its going to be contained and not pose a risk to the average Joe but I am no longer seeing it it as just another flu. [/QUOTE]I think this is closer to a normal flu than something like Ebola or other hemorrhagic type fever. Flu does have a low mortality rate compared to Covid 19, but I think a lot of people are catching Covid but are asymptomatic. If not, it's difficult to explain how some people are catcing it without any cotach with anyone with symptoms.

I don't know what the depth rate for flu is in China but 52% of men smoke vs 3% of women, and the death toll in China has been skewed towards men. Wuhan gets pretty cold over winter and most of the houses are not properly insulated or heated, I lived there until mid January.

[QUOTE=Kerrstar;2434673]I think this is closer to a normal flu than something like Ebola or other hemorrhagic type fever. Flu does have a low mortality rate compared to Covid 19, but I think a lot of people are catching Covid but are asymptomatic. If not, it's difficult to explain how some people are catcing it without any cotach with anyone with symptoms.

I don't know what the depth rate for flu is in China but 52% of men smoke vs 3% of women, and the death toll in China has been skewed towards men. Wuhan gets pretty cold over winter and most of the houses are not properly insulated or heated, I lived there until mid January.[/QUOTE]Agree K. Its a respiratory illness which Ebola wasn't.

Death rate stats depend on the denominator used and asymptomatic infections are a big part of that. Agree as of now no doubt the common flu is more widespread and kills more people.

There is still a lot not known about then new virus but most experts believe it is more contagious and more lethal than the common flu. Ultimately total deaths depend on containment. Fortunately what we are living through will most probably limit the spread but an out of control contagion until the vaccine comes on line while I still believe is unlikely is nevertheless a scary proposition.

Stay well.

Yesterday when heard that BKK bars & Go Go's are to be closed thanks to Wuhan I went ahead with my plan to postpone my April trip. It was not what I wanted, but you can't fight it when the odds are stacked up against you the way they are.

So after waiting on the phone for 90 minutes I finally got through to a travel representative from my CC rewards travel bureau. My United flight was purchased on points with a third party otherwise I could have just dealt with it online. The rep was very knowledgeable and professional, but it took him another 30 minutes to work out everything with United while I was puttering around in my backyard and watering my palm trees. But all is well now. I have a new round trip flight of less duration scheduled 6 months from now. I will receive a refund of approximately $150 representing the difference in the price United is assigning to the value of the flight even though I paid in points. So I am up $150 cash. In addition United is refunding the cost of my extended legroom seats that I paid for on the old flight, so I am free to purchase new extended legroom seats on the new flight. All good as far as United and I are concerned.

Next, I went to work on the 10 weeks of hotel reservations that I had made for my spring trip. Most of my hotels either allowed a straight change in dates or cancelation without any penalties. But I had a number of reservations involving hotel CC points and vouchers that required my time to reassign them with the help of a hotel agent. Again no real problems, getting through to the hotels by phone was easier and faster than arranging things with United. In fact a lot of my hotel choices are cheaper now so I will be saving money. Even the 2 or 3 hotels that I had a prepaid non cancelable booking allowed me to cancel and receive a full refund and/or reschedule. The only hotel that I am still having a problem with is the Mulia in Jakarta. I can cancel the reservation straight out without penalty, but the deal I have with them is so good that I really want to reschedule and keep the same price. But it can't be done over the internet so I have sent an email request to the hotel reservation department and I am waiting for their response.

So bottom line, all is well. My rescheduled trip is slightly better than the one I was planning to take in terms of it being overall a little cheaper and my new flight has less stops and a shorter duration. In addition, I decided to reward myself for all the corona BS by making my rescheduled trip 8 dalys longer. 555.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2435471]Yesterday when heard that BKK bars & Go Go's are to be closed thanks to Wuhan I went ahead with my plan to postpone my April trip. It was not what I wanted, but you can't fight it when the odds are stacked up against you the way they are.

So after waiting on the phone for 90 minutes I finally got through to a travel representative from my CC rewards travel bureau. My United flight was purchased on points with a third party otherwise I could have just dealt with it online. The rep was very knowledgeable and professional, but it took him another 30 minutes to work out everything with United while I was puttering around in my backyard and watering my palm trees. But all is well now. I have a new round trip flight of less duration scheduled 6 months from now. I will receive a refund of approximately $150 representing the difference in the price United is assigning to the value of the flight even though I paid in points. So I am up $150 cash. In addition United is refunding the cost of my extended legroom seats that I paid for on the old flight, so I am free to purchase new extended legroom seats on the new flight. All good as far as United and I are concerned.

Next, I went to work on the 10 weeks of hotel reservations that I had made for my spring trip. Most of my hotels either allowed a straight change in dates or cancelation without any penalties. But I had a number of reservations involving hotel CC points and vouchers that required my time to reassign them with the help of a hotel agent. Again no real problems, getting through to the hotels by phone was easier and faster than arranging things with United. In fact a lot of my hotel choices are cheaper now so I will be saving money. Even the 2 or 3 hotels that I had a prepaid non cancelable booking allowed me to cancel and receive a full refund and/or reschedule..[/QUOTE]Well Natty that is wonderful news. I was on tenterhooks hoping everything would work out for you. Hopefully this "corona bullshit' will miraculously disappear sometime soon but I worry it may just be a tad more serious than you think and your fall plans could be in disarray again. Hopefully not as I enjoy reading your chatty posts about how your universe is unfolding. Stay safe.

Hi.

Just read this article (see below) USA has now been put on the list to show Airlines 1) Health Certificate free of Convid-19 2) Health Insurance of 100,000.

Anybody from US traveling to Thailand in the next 2-3 weeks. Will you provide your airline with Health Certificate and insurance?

My flight is schedule for April 20th.

[URL]https://www.tatnews.org/2020/03/tat-update-thailand-public-health-ministry-updated-covid-19-control-measures-for-travellers/[/URL]

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2435471]

Next, I went to work on the 10 weeks of hotel reservations that I had made for my spring trip. Most of my hotels either allowed a straight change in dates or cancelation without any penalties. But I had a number of reservations involving hotel CC points and vouchers that required my time to reassign them with the help of a hotel agent. Again no real problems, getting through to the hotels by phone was easier and faster than arranging things with United. In fact a lot of my hotel choices are cheaper now so I will be saving money. Even the 2 or 3 hotels that I had a prepaid non cancelable booking allowed me to cancel and receive a full refund and/or reschedule. The only hotel that I am still having a problem with is the Mulia in Jakarta. I can cancel the reservation straight out without penalty, but the deal I have with them is so good that I really want to reschedule and keep the same price. But it can't be done over the internet so I have sent an email request to the hotel reservation department and I am waiting for their response.

So bottom line, all is well. My rescheduled trip is slightly better than the one I was planning to take in terms of it being overall a little cheaper and my new flight has less stops and a shorter duration. In addition, I decided to reward myself for all the corona BS by making my rescheduled trip 8 dalys longer. 555.[/QUOTE]I lost close to $150 paid to one hotel in Bangkok. All the rest including airfare was refunded. Agoda would not even entertain discussion about refund from this hotel. They said it is impossible to get refund from them.

Philippine airlines was more than willing to refund in full my whole itenary although they have not cancelled any of the flights I booked.

Most disappointed are the girls waiting for me mostly for the remuneration money wise. One is a virgin she says. Not sure when I get the chance to pop her cherry if at all. Well, I still keep in contact on messenger with all the girls but will not shed a tear if they found somebody.

Have to go back to the drawing board whenever the next trip happens. Thought of quick trip Sosua to release my monger tensions but with this heightened problems of foreign travel in USA decided against it.

[QUOTE=Sammon;2435604]I lost close to $150 paid to one hotel in Bangkok. All the rest including airfare was refunded. Agoda would not even entertain discussion about refund from this hotel. They said it is impossible to get refund from them.

Philippine airlines was more than willing to refund in full my whole itenary although they have not cancelled any of the flights I booked.

Most disappointed are the girls waiting for me mostly for the remuneration money wise. One is a virgin she says. Not sure when I get the chance to pop her cherry if at all. Well, I still keep in contact on messenger with all the girls but will not shed a tear if they found somebody.

Have to go back to the drawing board whenever the next trip happens. Thought of quick trip Sosua to release my monger tensions but with this heightened problems of foreign travel in USA decided against it.[/QUOTE]Relax bro, now the condition is getting serious.

[QUOTE=Sammon;2435604]I lost close to $150 paid to one hotel in Bangkok. All the rest including airfare was refunded. Agoda would not even entertain discussion about refund from this hotel. They said it is impossible to get refund from them.[/QUOTE]I had a reservation at the Sofitel that Agoda said I could not cancel without full penalty, but I contacted the hotel and they agreed to change my reservation to a later date.

[QUOTE=Sammon;2435604]Most disappointed are the girls waiting for me mostly for the remuneration money wise. One is a virgin she says. Not sure when I get the chance to pop her cherry if at all. Well, I still keep in contact on messenger with all the girls but will not shed a tear if they found somebody.

Have to go back to the drawing board whenever the next trip happens. Thought of quick trip Sosua to release my monger tensions but with this heightened problems of foreign travel in USA decided against it.[/QUOTE]So far I have only told my top 3 favorite girls of my trip delay. They took it like champs. Each in their own way said: 1) miss you, 2) I am ok / take care of yourself, 3) see you in August, 4) miss you. I will get around to notifying my 2nd tier girls later.

I don't know much about virgins. I met a beautiful cherry girl in an AC bar many years back. We fooled around plenty in a booth so I was floored, as in devastated, when she told me she could not barfine and why. Your virgin will probably be a more experienced gal by the time you see her, ha ha, which is not a bad thing if you ask me.

As to alternative trips: I think this friggin' pandemic has gone too far for guys like us to think about taking a trip especially if it involves the airlines and airports. The whole world is in lock down mode except for some college kids enjoying their spring break here in sunny Florida. I don't blame them for not giving a fuck. They are young and immune more or less. I originally had Sao Paulo as my back up plan, but I think Sao Paulo is in a similar situation as BKK & MNL right now.

Hopefully this thing will pass in a couple of months or we are all fucked.

Visa run is not possible now as Thailand asking corona health certificate.

Gen Z gen why I am too sure what kids are called nowadays but they behave the same way we all did in out teens and twenties. Booze, weed, chemical, festivals, getting laid, it was the sixties, seventies man and we loved it. So it's a little hypocritical to decry their selfishness to day when many of them don't seem to give a shit about getting infected and passing it on. Absolutely no problem for themselves their immune system will see off the virus but it doesn't stop them getting it and passing it on to the more vulnerable. This is a highly contagious motherfucker and while responsibility and partying don't exactly go hand in hand they really should follow the guidelines for this summer break.

[QUOTE=NmExpert;2428614]Pattaya is dead for mongering.

I also live there for 4 years now.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=NmExpert;2436069]What happens when Visa expired

Visa run is not possible now as Thailand asking corona health certificate.[/QUOTE]You advised me before you have lived in Pattaya for 4 years. Let me know which Visa type you are on and I can assist you. Thai Elite? O? OA? OX? B? R? EX?

[QUOTE=NmExpert;2436069]Visa run is not possible now as Thailand asking corona health certificate.[/QUOTE]Going next week to get an extension.

[URL]https://thethaiger.com/coronavirus/phuket-immigration-offers-30-day-extensions-for-stranded-foreigners[/URL]

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2436111]Gen Z gen why I am too sure what kids are called nowadays but they behave the same way we all did in out teens and twenties. Booze, weed, chemical, festivals, getting laid, it was the sixties, seventies man and we loved it. So it's a little hypocritical to decry their selfishness to day when many of them don't seem to give a shit about getting infected and passing it on. Absolutely no problem for themselves their immune system will see off the virus but it doesn't stop them getting it and passing it on to the more vulnerable. This is a highly contagious motherfucker and while responsibility and partying don't exactly go hand in hand they really should follow the guidelines for this summer break.[/QUOTE]I am waiting for the reports of widespread illness and death of grandma and grandpa in the outlying Thai provinces.

They closed all the bars, massage shops and many of the regular restaurants in Bangkok. Venues where girls and workers who would most likely have interacted with tourists that could also be carriers. At least as probable an interaction as for Spring Breakers in Florida.

So guess where all those Thai girls and workers have gone now that their places of employment in Bangkok are closed. Yep. To their provinces to violate the Social Distance recommendations with grandma and grandpa.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2436404]So guess where all those Thai girls and workers have gone now that their places of employment in Bangkok are closed. Yep. To their provinces to violate the Social Distance recommendations with grandma and grandpa.[/QUOTE]And a lot of them are being put in quarantine. I just picked up a girl on Tinder that is in Pattaya. Long story but she works in Malaysia and came to Thailand to renew her passport. Her mom said if she comes to her hometown she will have to do 14 day quarantine at the temple.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2436404]I am waiting for the reports of widespread illness and death of grandma and grandpa in the outlying Thai provinces.

They closed all the bars, massage shops and many of the regular restaurants in Bangkok. Venues where girls and workers who would most likely have interacted with tourists that could also be carriers. At least as probable an interaction as for Spring Breakers in Florida.

So guess where all those Thai girls and workers have gone now that their places of employment in Bangkok are closed. Yep. To their provinces to violate the Social Distance recommendations with grandma and grandpa.[/QUOTE]Hopefully I'm wrong but with testing almost non existent outside Bangkok and here costing 6000 baht which puts it outside the reach of most people the incidences of infection are I feel grossly understated. We are already seeing in the daily numbers the beginning of the wave. How long before it crests and how we get by without restaurants and nightlife will be the challenge. Fortunately ET like yourself I have my little black book to keep me going but I will miss the outdoor strolls looking for the hidden gems.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2434687]Agree K. Its a respiratory illness which Ebola wasn't.

Death rate stats depend on the denominator used and asymptomatic infections are a big part of that. Agree as of now no doubt the common flu is more widespread and kills more people.

There is still a lot not known about then new virus but most experts believe it is more contagious and more lethal than the common flu. Ultimately total deaths depend on containment. Fortunately what we are living through will most probably limit the spread but an out of control contagion until the vaccine comes on line while I still believe is unlikely is nevertheless a scary proposition.

Stay well.[/QUOTE]Allegedly Chinese have the cure.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2436628]Hopefully I'm wrong but with testing almost non existent outside Bangkok and here costing 6000 baht which puts it outside the reach of most people the incidences of infection are I feel grossly understated. We are already seeing in the daily numbers the beginning of the wave. How long before it crests and how we get by without restaurants and nightlife will be the challenge. Fortunately ET like yourself I have my little black book to keep me going but I will miss the outdoor strolls looking for the hidden gems.[/QUOTE]Nope, you are not wrong. Figures quoted have to be greatly understated. Figures through much of SE Asia cannot be trusted.

On one extreme you have Italy with death numbers exceeding the number of cases recovered. Lack of testing of mild cases means their death rate could well be over stated.

A country with likely more realistic figures is Germany with capacity to test 160000 cases per week. This means most can be tested.

On other extreme we have Thailand which had reported just one Covid-19 death (when I checked). It is highly likely that not all dead persons are being tested for the virus.

Sudden deaths due to fevers in the country villages have long been common, precise cause not always known, exposure to contaminated water via an injury just one example.

So Thailand death rate due to this virus could well be greatly understated (not known). Its too expensive to test dead people. Who will pay? Old people are popping off all the time for one reason or another.

Thailand likely has little idea of true numbers of cases, whether mild or deaths or recoveries.

I know examples of persons recovered from bad cough and fever, yet exact type unknown.

Even if high heat and humidity is limiting the speed of spread of the virus in the air and from surfaces and then mainly from those breathing in the sneeze and cough spray of others close, it won't be decreasing the deadliness for those that catch it.

Learn to cook you guys, or buy prepared food and microwave zap it. I have long been able to survive without restaurants.

Always wise to have your regular contacts for a fuck, as long as they are definitely not sneezing or coughing and have no symptoms, its unlikely they will give you something.

Avoid getting faces too close to each other just in case. Getting a fuck is still realistic from a non emotional point of view.

Little point to enter Thailand only to go into quarantine.

Thai word for the day: Kak (sounds like Guk) means to be isolated or quarantined. "Kak dtun" or "Guk dtoon" on other hand means to hoard food, drink, or toilet paper etc. Many of us in Thailand of course don't need toilet paper, since we have the water spray guns.

It just so happens I have been having a holiday from mongering for a few months, so I probably won't break that just now. Not really relevant to the virus.

Gentlemen please follow the latest guidelines.

Thailand just closed its borders to all foreigners unless you have a work permit so if you aren't already in Thailand cancel your trip.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2436856]Learn to cook you guys, or buy prepared food and microwave zap it. I have long been able to survive without restaurants.[/QUOTE]Good idea S. But if your skills don't and are unlikely to go beyond boiling a kettle no real need to.

Although I gather those in malls are totally shut down you can still walk in and get a take away from lots of eateries. I personally use the food hall at Tops Chit Lom.

Apart from the odd Pizza I was never much of a food delivery guy, prefer eating out but now that that's no longer possible I cannot believe how much variety there is in home delivery.

Food delivery services such as Food Panda, Grab Food, Lineman and others are terrific with an amazing variety of goodies.

Another alternative, divide your little black book into those that can cook and those that cannot and make their preparing a meal part of the visit. In my experience not all for sure but lots of Thai girls just love to cook for their man.

However you put food on the table stay safe.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2437569]Thailand just closed its borders to all foreigners unless you have a work permit so if you aren't already in Thailand cancel your trip.[/QUOTE][URL]https://www.bangkokpost.com/thailand/general/1886270/emergency-decree-bans-entry-to-foreigners[/URL]

"The decree bans all foreigners from entry at all entry points. The exceptions being shippers, diplomats, drivers, pilots and others permitted by Prime Minister Prayut Chan-o-cha. ".

"The emergency decree comes into effect at midnight on Wednesday {25th}, and remains in force through April 30. ".

This DOESN'T mean that the borders are certain, or even likely to re-open on 1 May.

[QUOTE=GettingFedUp;2437595][URL]https://www.bangkokpost.com/thailand/general/1886270/emergency-decree-bans-entry-to-foreigners[/URL]

"The decree bans all foreigners from entry at all entry points. The exceptions being shippers, diplomats, drivers, pilots and others permitted by Prime Minister Prayut Chan-o-cha. ".

"The emergency decree comes into effect at midnight on Wednesday {25th}, and remains in force through April 30. ".

This DOESN'T mean that the borders are certain, or even likely to re-open on 1 May.[/QUOTE]Also, it looks like a curfew has not yet been imposed after all. But, according to this report, if one is imposed it might be a rougher one than suggested earlier; possibly a 24 hour curfew. Damn. How does that work after the 4th or 5th day? Or do they mean one 24-hour curfew? Accomplishing what?

[URL]https://www.bangkokpost.com/learning/advanced/1886905/foreigners-banned-from-entry-no-curfew-yet[/URL]
[quote]However, Deputy Prime Minister Wissanu Krea-ngam said a curfew might be imposed later if considered necessary.

He added that if the government does go ahead with imposing a curfew, it will be different from previous curfews which were only imposed at night.

"The curfew for Covid-19 is likely to cover 24 hours, with exceptions for individuals seeking medical treatment, those going to court or those working in broadcasting services."[/quote]

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2436856]Nope, you are not wrong. Figures quoted have to be greatly understated. Figures through much of SE Asia cannot be trusted.

On other extreme we have Thailand which had reported just one Covid-19 death (when I checked). It is highly likely that not all dead persons are being tested for the virus.

Sudden deaths due to fevers in the country villages have long been common, precise cause not always known, exposure to contaminated water via an injury just one example.

So Thailand death rate due to this virus could well be greatly understated (not known). Its too expensive to test dead people. Who will pay? Old people are popping off all the time for one reason or another.

Thailand likely has little idea of true numbers of cases, whether mild or deaths or recoveries.[/QUOTE]I KNOW the reported numbers are wrong. Two days ago an American friend living near Buriram called me. He was in the hospital with the Wuhan virus somewhere in that area. He could barely speak and I couldn't ask him a lot of questions. That same night I went online to read how many cases were in the area. The area Governor (or whatever he is called) was reporting no cases in the area. Total bullshit.

Anyone have recent experience. Yesterday, today. With in country travel? A Brit who maintains a regular Twitter feed cautioned about checkpoints coming in and out of BKK, and urged us not to head off to the seaside.

I have papers, residing legally in Thailand, and a car. I want to know if I can either fly or drive out of BKk without a major headache!

I've got women in Pattaya and Phuket urging me to come see them.

[QUOTE=Chacal60;2437829]Anyone have recent experience. Yesterday, today. With in country travel? A Brit who maintains a regular Twitter feed cautioned about checkpoints coming in and out of BKK, and urged us not to head off to the seaside.

I have papers, residing legally in Thailand, and a car. I want to know if I can either fly or drive out of BKk without a major headache!

I've got women in Pattaya and Phuket urging me to come see them.[/QUOTE]A chick was driving from Surin to Pattaya to see me. She told me about them. Also chicks that have left Pattaya to go to their villages have told me about them.

[URL]https://thethaiger.com/coronavirus/military-checkpoints-set-up-to-monitor-domestic-travel?amp[/URL]

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2437607]Also, it looks like a curfew has not yet been imposed after all. But, according to this report, if one is imposed it might be a rougher one than suggested earlier; possibly a 24 hour curfew. Damn. How does that work after the 4th or 5th day? Or do they mean one 24-hour curfew? Accomplishing what?[/QUOTE]No, they don't mean a single 24 hour curfew.

This weekend is being used as the litmus test for what happens. If people stick to the requirements (social distancing, not using restaurants as makeshift bars, not going out unless they need to, etc.) then the current guidelines remain. If people ignore / flout these guidelines then a 24 hour a day curfew will be introduced, probably for 3 weeks or a month initially.

I am guessing it would follow the UK model (only allowed out for essential shopping, minimal exercise or if they work in essential jobs). Donations to the Royal Thai Police superannuation fund will be collected from offenders, in Thailand not UK obviously!

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2437837]A chick was driving from Surin to Pattaya to see me. She told me about them. Also chicks that have left Pattaya to go to their villages have told me about them.

[URL]https://thethaiger.com/coronavirus/military-checkpoints-set-up-to-monitor-domestic-travel?amp[/URL][/QUOTE]Yea, been confirmed to me by other friends as well. My Phuket gal tells me the beaches are still open, but Thaiger reports that even that window is closing.

It seems likely I will remain inside BKK, mostly inside my own flat. Time for me to let my big brain to tell my little brain to quiet down for now LOL.

Friend in Madrid can only move between his residence, a store, or work. I'll bet the latter has now been removed from the permitted reasons for being out. He's a foreigner but carries a letter in English and Castellano from his employer that he's had to show a few times. I have no doubt it will be similar here.

Keep your passport and visa page handy!

[QUOTE=GettingFedUp;2437847]No, they don't mean a single 24 hour curfew.

This weekend is being used as the litmus test for what happens. If people stick to the requirements (social distancing, not using restaurants as makeshift bars, not going out unless they need to, etc.) then the current guidelines remain. If people ignore / flout these guidelines then a 24 hour a day curfew will be introduced, probably for 3 weeks or a month initially.

I am guessing it would follow the UK model (only allowed out for essential shopping, minimal exercise or if they work in essential jobs). Donations to the Royal Thai Police superannuation fund will be collected from offenders, in Thailand not UK obviously![/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Turgid;2437468]Gentlemen please follow the latest guidelines.[/QUOTE]Google Translate does not translate the text 100% correct, so for those of you who cannot read Dutch (more than 99.9% I guess LOL) the correct translation is: "New guidelines. Make love safer than ever. ".

[QUOTE=Mogwai;2438493]Google Translate does not translate the text 100% correct, so for those of you who cannot read Dutch (more than 99.9% I guess LOL) the correct translation is: "New guidelines. Make love safer than ever. ".[/QUOTE]555.

Now it makes sense!

Pics taken today in a supermarket. Each fruit, each vegetable wrapped in plastic. This way beaches get an nth layer of garbage, and consumers poison themselves with phtalates and bisphenols.

[QUOTE=XXL;2439048]Pics taken today in a supermarket. Each fruit, each vegetable wrapped in plastic. This way beaches get an nth layer of garbage, and consumers poison themselves with phtalates and bisphenols.[/QUOTE]And it doesn't prevent them from being infected.

It's a big waste to do that because we are already supposed to wash these products before consuming them.

[QUOTE=XXL;2439048]Pics taken today in a supermarket. Each fruit, each vegetable wrapped in plastic. This way beaches get an nth layer of garbage, and consumers poison themselves with phtalates and bisphenols.[/QUOTE]Seems a waste of plastic. Good intentions but either way they need to be washed.

I don't read all the science behind the virus I don't think anyone has the real answer to it even the experts' everyone is just kind of winging it especially here in Thailand. It does on the surface lot of work because most of the time in produce or fruit section what does customers do touch and feel them with their hands even it is wrapped it can easily be on the wrapped? If they don't wrap and you ask the customer to use a plastic bag while picking through that bag could also be infected since the customer grabs the roller and tear a bag off. This is the same I noticed when you go into the store, they take your temperature you get some alcohol gel and rub it on your hand then you grab that shopping cart handle not giving it a second thought it is dirty too? No real answer?

If the bars stay closed for a long time, say a year or more, would thai officials use it as a way to end rampant prostitution in thailand? I've read for ages that thai wants to change its image to more family friendly.

I know no one knows the future but many here read thai politics better then I do and might be able to give an informed guess.

[QUOTE=Horatio;2439690]If the bars stay closed for a long time, say a year or more, would thai officials use it as a way to end rampant prostitution in thailand? I've read for ages that thai wants to change its image to more family friendly.[/QUOTE]

Indeed, that seems likely.

There are conservatives who have tried to suppress the prostitution industry since early 2000's (Purachai and co), with a fair bit of success; the scene is already much smaller than it used to be. The crisis presents a perfect opportunity to kill it off completely.

Even if officials do nothing and bars reopen in a few weeks (almost impossible), for a long time there will be no customers, except for a few exceptionally brave expats. Once the first wave is over, Covid will still be around, and PFP sessions are a perfect way to get it. International travel will be depressed for a long time. Until there's a widely deployed vaccine (1-2 years away), we won't get back to normal, and it will be some new normal.

Economic significance of the prostitution industry is far smaller than it used to be, and it's about to drop into the insignificant territory, so officials aiming to suppress it will encounter little or no opposition.

There will still be a few stragglers offering sex (most likely online), but I doubt the industry as we know it stands much of a chance to rebound.

It is good to be the King. Now this is what I call a self-quarantine.

[URL]https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/king-thailand-isolates-luxury-hotel-21782942[/URL]

My Norton security software has beaten off two malicious software attacks when I accessed this site. It seems to have been addressed, but in case it has not, please take note of this alert. Thank you.

[QUOTE=Rodwint2;2439812]My Norton security software has beaten off two malicious software attacks when I accessed this site. It seems to have been addressed, but in case it has not, please take note of this alert. Thank you.[/QUOTE]And why did you feel the need to post this on the Thailand forum?

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2439784]It is good to be the King. Now this is what I call a self-quarantine.
[URL]https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/king-thailand-isolates-luxury-hotel-21782942[/URL][/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Horatio;2439690]If the bars stay closed for a long time, say a year or more, would thai officials use it as a way to end rampant prostitution in thailand?
[/QUOTE]Does that include the king's harem of beautiful concubines?

[QUOTE=Stykler;2439821]And why did you feel the need to post this on the Thailand forum?[/QUOTE]I see nothing wrong with the post right now it is so slow anything is good it is the general thread. I remember 15 plus years back I got my first desktop that is when I found ISG, I had no idea what was what today I still don't! I remember my nephew set everything up for me then it was dial-up didn't know anything about Virus or a need for a protector which most likely I got for the first year. Thereafter I noticed it was running real slow nephew came over found the problem basically using ISG infected the whole computer I was getting spam etc. All from ISG.

ISG, isn't the only site others have all those advertising porn that is where it comes from.

There has never been anything like this that has affected the economy the way it has if the USA, in particular, is having problems just this week close to 10 million unemployed applying for unemployment benefits what you think it will be like in Thailand when so many businesses like bars and Gogo are operating on a day to day bases even before this happened. I wonder what unemployment will be in Thailand.

Right now I think vendors at the local markets are the only ones making money with their education system things will stay the same with ladies wanting to make money quick and easy now I see it worse the poor will survive they are used to not having much. Will the price be higher or lower hard to know but I'm optimistic that there will be a lot of new talent there is no way things will stay the same after this?

[QUOTE=Mogwai;2440221]Does that include the king's harem of beautiful concubines?[/QUOTE]The law does not apply to those who make it.

Thailand has done 23,000 tests with 2,000 cases. Compare this to Russia who has done 639,000 tests with 4700 confirmed cases. USA has done over 1. 5 million tests.

The real scary country is Philippines who have done only 5530 tests and have 3094 positive cases.

[QUOTE=LittleBigMan;2440249]There has never been anything like this that has affected the economy the way it has if the USA, in particular, is having problems just this week close to 10 million unemployed applying for unemployment benefits what you think it will be like in Thailand when so many businesses like bars and Gogo are operating on a day to day bases even before this happened. I wonder what unemployment will be in Thailand. [/QUOTE]It's like this whole virus has knocked us back into the stone ages!. People can't do anything!. Sadly, this is going to get worse before its better. I want to remain optimistic. As of now, I'm at home in 'sex prison USA', binge-watching Bangkok 112, BKKHD and other Pattaya / Bangkok nightlife videos just to get lost in my thoughts. They do help in my mongerish ways.

Here are my Corona Binge Watching Recommendations: Narcos Mexico, Ozark, Better Call Saul (season 4 & 5), Babylon Berlin, BloodLine (season 1), the Rum Diary, zerozerozero, the Saint (all seasons, but the black & white seasons are best - 555), Animal Kingdom, Sneaky Pete, Trapped, Strike Back, and Banshee. Enjoy - all good.

I would rather be in Bangkok getting laid twice a night, but binging helps pass the time. Tonight I am going to have a couple shots of fine Mezcal and continue to watch Ozark season 3. The Wuhan sucks!

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2440366]Corona Binge Watching[/QUOTE]Happy you didn't include Tiger King on your list!

I just started watching Ozark as it was recommended to me. Figured it was going to be a comedy with Jason Bateman. I couldn't have been more wrong.

[QUOTE=MeatMan;2440363]Where's the light at the end of this tunnel?![/QUOTE]Think of all the money you're saving! Imagine how much you'll be able to spend in 2022!

[QUOTE=Turgid;2440292]The law does not apply to those who make it.[/QUOTE]Actually right now he in in an unknown location in baviera Germany.

Bavaria is the strongest region of Germany with the some boundaries aged 500 ys ago.

He have strong $$$ interest between Munich and Zurich.

I would suggest Bodyguard, a five or six part series on Netflix. With apologies to my UK friends, turn on closed captioning as the accents are very thick and difficult for us Yanks to understand. It is one of the best shows I have seen on Netflix. It really gets good starting with the second or third episode.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2440433]

I just started watching Ozark as it was recommended to me. Figured it was going to be a comedy with Jason Bateman. I couldn't have been more wrong.
[/QUOTE]Well it has some elements of dark comedy.

[QUOTE=MeatMan;2440363]........... As of now, I'm at home in 'sex prison USA' ...........[/QUOTE]Covid 19 has made the whole world a sex prison except pockets of Colombia, Mexico and Thailand.

[QUOTE=MeatMan;2440363]It's like this whole virus has knocked us back into the stone ages!. People can't do anything!. Sadly, this is going to get worse before its better. I want to remain optimistic. As of now, I'm at home in 'sex prison USA', binge-watching Bangkok 112, BKKHD and other Pattaya / Bangkok nightlife videos just to get lost in my thoughts. They do help in my mongerish ways.[/QUOTE]Personally, the free market will kick in, I'm pretty optimistic it will turn out better than before like they say " there is no gain without some pain ".

[QUOTE=LittleBigMan;2440775]Personally, the free market will kick in, I'm pretty optimistic it will turn out better than before like they say " there is no gain without some pain ".[/QUOTE]As the majority of the people in the United States are discovering that there is little to protect them from anyone who wants to do them harm, because the police are not going to be around to act as your personal bodyguards as they believed, the Second Amendment is getting a healthy respect from many people as there is a run on firearms and ammunition throughout the nation. Everywhere, even ultra liberal states like California, Oregon, Washington, and Hawaii, the US is finding that gun stores are recording record sales and, in most cases, have run out of inventory.

As the citizens of the US are finding shortages of basic necessities, they have come to realize there is really no meaning behind laws as those lawless persons exploit what ever advantage the can obtain by hook or by crook. So now they have realized that the founding fathers of this nation were very wise in providing the citizens rights like free speech and the right to bear arms.

[QUOTE=Rodwint2;2440997]As the majority of the people in the United States are discovering that there is little to protect them from anyone who wants to do them harm, because the police are not going to be around to act as your personal bodyguards as they believed, the Second Amendment is getting a healthy respect from many people as there is a run on firearms and ammunition throughout the nation. Everywhere, even ultra liberal states like California, Oregon, Washington, and Hawaii, the US is finding that gun stores are recording record sales and, in most cases, have run out of inventory.

As the citizens of the US are finding shortages of basic necessities, they have come to realize there is really no meaning behind laws as those lawless persons exploit what ever advantage the can obtain by hook or by crook. So now they have realized that the founding fathers of this nation were very wise in providing the citizens rights like free speech and the right to bear arms.[/QUOTE]Just goes to show the US is filled with savages. The rest of the world is civilised and people can behave responsibly with each other.

[QUOTE=Horatio;2439690]If the bars stay closed for a long time, say a year or more, would thai officials use it as a way to end rampant prostitution in thailand? I've read for ages that thai wants to change its image to more family friendly.

I know no one knows the future but many here read thai politics better then I do and might be able to give an informed guess.[/QUOTE]Overnight 4 or 5000 ladies from Northern Thailand, Issan, went home to their villages. They are waiting for this to end so that they can return to how they make their living. There will be no change. Everything will return to normal. They have kids and parents that they must care for. School they must pay for. Their husbands ran away and are totally irresponsible as parents. The Thai women take the responsibility. The government has no way to help them.

Thailand is family friendly. I live in Phuket and we are loaded with families on holiday. They do not focus on the meat market but the adventures they can buy that they can never get at home. Well that is if they stay away from Soi Bangla. 555.

RL.

[QUOTE=Rodwint2;2440997]As the majority of the people in the United States are discovering that there is little to protect them from anyone who wants to do them harm, because the police are not going to be around to act as your personal bodyguards as they believed, the Second Amendment is getting a healthy respect from many people as there is a run on firearms and ammunition throughout the nation. Everywhere, even ultra liberal states like California, Oregon, Washington, and Hawaii, the US is finding that gun stores are recording record sales and, in most cases, have run out of inventory.

As the citizens of the US are finding shortages of basic necessities, they have come to realize there is really no meaning behind laws as those lawless persons exploit what ever advantage the can obtain by hook or by crook. So now they have realized that the founding fathers of this nation were very wise in providing the citizens rights like free speech and the right to bear arms.[/QUOTE]What's your hidden agenda? There is no shortage of basic house hold products or food. There is no spike in crime. Matter of fact violent crime is down during this epidemic.

[QUOTE=Confiable;2441070]There is no spike in crime. Matter of fact violent crime is down during this epidemic.[/QUOTE]Exactly. Because everybody and their hamster went to buy weapons and are now loaded to the teeth.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2441073]Exactly. Because everybody and their hamster went to buy weapons and are now loaded to the teeth.[/QUOTE]Fear sells. Paranoia and marketing. tiolet paper companies made a good profit also.

[QUOTE=Confiable;2441075]Fear sells. Paranoia and marketing. tiolet paper companies made a good profit also.[/QUOTE]If the crime went down like you said it did, then it was for the best, no? I miss all 25 of my babies when I am not in the States.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2441092]If the crime went down like you said it did, then it was for the best, no? I miss all 25 of my babies when I am not in the States.[/QUOTE]NO. Your ordinary criminal don't watch the news. People were buying guns and ammo prior to the crime rate going down. Fear sells. People were influence to buy by the pyschological tricks and tactics by companies and marketers / advertisers. Today's technological information uses your personal computer, social media app, and cell phone information to formulate through an algorithm what you might buy and what might influence your behavior. They are using it in sports now but they use the term sports analytics to predict the plays a team might run in certain situations and its success rate.

[QUOTE=Confiable;2441141]NO. People were buying guns and ammo prior to the crime rate going down. Fear sells. [/QUOTE]What?! Exactly. FIRST, many people bought weapons. SECOND, criminals stopped acting an ass due to more people being able to protect themselves now. Who cares why the shit was sold. The good is that there is less crime now that the shit has been sold. So fear of getting a hole put through them also stopped them mfs from committing crimes.

Seems as if you are against things being sold. So car companies have sold all of these cars over the years because people had a fear of walking. MFs sold a shitload of toilet paper because people had a fear of not being able to wipe their asses. MFs buy and use condoms out of fear of catching a disease. People buy medical insurance out of fear of not being able to pay for medical care if they fall sick. Not seeing what is wrong with buying things out of fear.

[QUOTE=Confiable;2441141]Your ordinary criminal don't watch the news.[/QUOTE]Who the heck told you that? I used to be an ordinary criminal and hung with a lot of other ones. EVERYBODY watches the news. People watch the news if they do not watch anything else. Now I think you are just trolling.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2441153]What?! Exactly. FIRST, many people bought weapons. SECOND, criminals stopped acting an ass due to more people being able to protect themselves now. Who cares why the shit was sold. The good is that there is less crime now that the shit has been sold. Seems as if you are against things being sold. So car companies have sold all of these cars over the years because people had a fear of walking. MFs sold a shitload of toilet paper because people had a fear of not being able to wipe their asses. MFs buy and use condoms out of fear of catching a disease. People buy medical insurance out of fear of not being able to pay for medical care if they fall sick. Not seeing what is wrong with that.[/QUOTE]Who said anything is wrong with it? You are agreeing with me. Violent crimes are have decreased because of the curfews that have been taken place. It has nothing to do with the amount of guns that have recently been purchased. Criminals are not sitting at home watching news on TV. A movie, listening to the radio or ipod, or some type of mindless TV entertainment, I would agree with you. LOL Trolling? For who? Poor excuse.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2441153]Seems as if you are against things being sold. So car companies have sold all of these cars over the years because people had a fear of walking. MFs sold a shitload of toilet paper because people had a fear of not being able to wipe their asses. MFs buy and use condoms out of fear of catching a disease. People buy medical insurance out of fear of not being able to pay for medical care if they fall sick. Not seeing what is wrong with buying things out of fear.[/QUOTE]Buying out of fear is a problem if the fear is irrational. Buying 3 months worth of toilet paper out of a fear of not being to wipe your ass is probably acting on an irrational fear hahaha! Oh and me? I wear those pesky condoms mostly because I don't want to have to pay for any "little Canes" LOLOLOL!

[QUOTE=TheCane;2441164]Buying out of fear is a problem if the fear is irrational. Buying 3 months worth of toilet paper out of a fear of not being to wipe your ass is probably acting on an irrational fear hahaha! Oh and me? I wear those pesky condoms mostly because I don't want to have to pay for any "little Canes" LOLOLOL![/QUOTE]That's the word I was looking for and wanted to use. Irrational behavior and that is what is going on in this world. Thank you.

[QUOTE=Confiable;2441141]NO. Your ordinary criminal don't watch the news. People were buying guns and ammo prior to the crime rate going down. Fear sells. People were influence to buy by the pyschological tricks and tactics by companies and marketers / advertisers. Today's technological information uses your personal computer, social media app, and cell phone information to formulate through an algorithm what you might buy and what might influence your behavior. They are using it in sports now but they use the term sports analytics to predict the plays a team might run in certain situations and its success rate.[/QUOTE]Your statement that "ordinary criminals don't watch the news" is totally wrong. They watch the news constantly to find out where and when to commit their next criminal act or enterprise. They learn to steal N95 masks to sell on the black market. They run scams on people waiting for their $1,200 check from the government. Criminals are very smart. That is why there is "organized crime". The Mafia and Triads are not run by total idiots. It takes brains (and violence) to run criminal organizations.

You sound like the typical nitwit who thinks they know everything and everyone else is dumber than you. In other words, a liberal Democrat! I am sorry to disillusion you, but the world does not run by your perception of how things are.

[QUOTE=Rodwint2;2441221]...
You sound like the typical nitwit who thinks they know everything and everyone else is dumber than you. In other words, a liberal Democrat! I am sorry to disillusion you, but the world does not run by your perception of how things are.[/QUOTE]Not to take a political side here, but speaking from all easily observable historical and current evidence, data and results, liberal Democrats can certainly accurately claim to be smarter than conservative Republicans when it comes to expanding and recovering a national economy rather than plunging it into the worst Great Depressions, Great Recessions, massive market crashes and job losses of the past 100 years or so.

So there is that.

It's great to see so much political squabbling here. I can't find it anywhere else.

[QUOTE=Horatio;2441245]It's great to see so much political squabbling here. I can't find it anywhere else.[/QUOTE]Yeah, but you almost never get useful info on when, where, the best hours and how much it costs to fuck and get sucked by young Thai ladies elsewhere on the net. So that makes this site special.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2441092]If the crime went down like you said it did, then it was for the best, no? I miss all 25 of my babies when I am not in the States.[/QUOTE]That is some good stuff a man after my own heart!

[QUOTE=Rodwint2;2440997]As the majority of the people in the United States are discovering that there is little to protect them from anyone who wants to do them harm, because the police are not going to be around to act as your personal bodyguards as they believed, the Second Amendment is getting a healthy respect from many people as there is a run on firearms and ammunition throughout the nation. Everywhere, even ultra liberal states like California, Oregon, Washington, and Hawaii, the US is finding that gun stores are recording record sales and, in most cases, have run out of inventory.

As the citizens of the US are finding shortages of basic necessities, they have come to realize there is really no meaning behind laws as those lawless persons exploit what ever advantage the can obtain by hook or by crook. So now they have realized that the founding fathers of this nation were very wise in providing the citizens rights like free speech and the right to bear arms.[/QUOTE]My comment and opinion " pain no gain " was about P4 P.

When it comes to guns, I've had my share so many spend a lot of time once a year in Vegas with my brother buying and selling. I support the 2nd Amendment, being an Asian American it was hard for others outside my race to understand why we had so many guns. Our lawyer once argue why is it okay For Hells Angel (Sonny be) to have guns but an Asian all of a sudden we are a triads drug dealer.

From my experience, many have no idea what the 2nd amendment was really about in reality it doesn't really apply today just like the bible when it was written. I seriously doubt when both were written they had no idea what it would be like today? Those who talk about the 2nd are living in fantasy land no one is ever going invade the U.S. not even China. The ones who rush out to buy guns now are the same stupid fucks who just loaded up with toilet paper at Walmart? The ones who deal in guns use it as a selling point but the ones I've talk and sold too are nothing but red necks, separatists, who have a hard time buying something from anyone other than another redneck. My brother use to laugh and say " It must kill the cracker to have to buy from us " we can debate this stuff all day and end up agreeing to disagree.

Believe it or not of course in general and experience criminal are stupid or they were in the wrong place at the wrong time, which I consider in my case, otherwise, they wouldn't be doing time. You know the saying " don't do the crime if you can't do the crime " I've not spent my whole life in jail but enough to know the reason majority are in there because they are a bunch of stupid sorry MF! When it comes to an organized crime your got leaders and then a lot of soldiers because they are stupid they can't make it on their own so they follow and being in a group they are protected it is a form of social welfare? If anyone ever done any time you know you need to pick a side or you be picking up the soap a lot the biggest gay MF are the crackers they must be born with sugar in their tank! Just joking fellas!

There was a time they rioted in Oakland, prior we went to protect my Uncle shop armed to the teeth pulled the metal gate down spray painted a few words " you enter you will not leave " end of story! Looters are the most stupid and cowards of them all. Here in Thailand not sure if it will happen like in the West but I would never underestimate anyone when you do that is when something will happen? I use to read and see stories of robberies or murder here and come away how stupid can you get like the guy who robs the gold shop then goes back and sell it to the same shop. Or better yet the school teacher who recently killed a 2-year-old child covers his face but uses his father-in-law motorbike not taking the plate off returns it while the event is all over T. V.

Criminals here are stupid, I tell kids jokingly go to school get smart because of you too stupid to be a criminal. When my son was getting into trouble I said if you want to be a criminal here don't there is no money to be mad if you truly want to travel down this path I will take you to H. K. So you can at least make some good money. Whenever I see a farang in a confrontation I hear " I mafia " even I believe but then I pulled back and thought about it how the hell is he mafia? The guy can't even afford toilet paper to wipe his ass lives in a tin can house same with Muay Thai, many can't even afford a bowl of noodles yet they are going to pay for lessons.

In the end, staying straight and narrow under the radar is the way to go doing so you can enjoy all the P4 P one can handle if you have to stay like me that will keep you in the right frame of mind!

I got a 24 hour window leaving now for a 6-8 hour drive to pick up the family and bring them to Pattaya before we get locked down! See ya enjoy keep you head up life is good!

Kev-In Thailand has sadly passed away. Not sure if any of you knew of his YouTube channel but, I would often gather as much info and updates as I can. Some didn't like his style of vlogging and that comes with the territory but, overall Kev was well-liked and will be sorely missed. RIP

[URL]https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/30/style/sex-coronavirus-questions-answers.html[/URL]

[QUOTE=CzarNicholas;2441383][URL]https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/30/style/sex-coronavirus-questions-answers.html[/URL][/QUOTE]At the end of the day, our five finger friend may be the only "safe" partner. Beyond that, it's Russian Roulette (with THAI bullets in the chamber).

[QUOTE=Chacal60;2441840]At the end of the day, our five finger friend may be the only "safe" partner. Beyond that, it's Russian Roulette (with THAI bullets in the chamber).[/QUOTE]Depressing but this is our new reality. Thanks China. And this will effect the way providers deal with customers as well. This will effect the P4 P industry for a long time, even after we have a vaccine.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;2441851]Depressing but this is our new reality. Thanks China. And this will effect the way providers deal with customers as well. This will effect the P4 P industry for a long time, even after we have a vaccine.[/QUOTE]Before AIDS I never wore a condom, afterwards I never banged a prostitute without it. Will wearing a mask during sex become the new normal? Will that even help?

[QUOTE=Turgid;2441919]Before AIDS I never wore a condom, afterwards I never banged a prostitute without it. Will wearing a mask during sex become the new normal? Will that even help?[/QUOTE]Definitely won't help those who just got to have DFK LOL!

[QUOTE=Turgid;2441919]Before AIDS I never wore a condom, afterwards I never banged a prostitute without it. Will wearing a mask during sex become the new normal? Will that even help?[/QUOTE]This virus is now endemic. If you go out into crowded places you will catch it within the next 2 years. If you have close intimate contacts with enough people you will catch it. Maybe they will have better treatment options but I doubt there will be a vaccine for a while.

[QUOTE=Turgid;2441919]Before AIDS I never wore a condom, afterwards I never banged a prostitute without it. Will wearing a mask during sex become the new normal? Will that even help?[/QUOTE]There are medications which will suppress HIV.

Covid 19 is a novel disease which means nothing concrete is known about it.

Sex is total intimacy. While HIV is transmitted exclusively by sex and sharing needles, Covid 19 can be transmitted by simply being close is what they are saying. Unless you wear a hazmat suite during sex you are not immune. Even otherwise you may want to dip your dick in Clorox after the deed.

Better to wait at least 3-4 months. By then treatment and prophylaxis maybe available. Sex us not enjoyable when there are restrictions.

[QUOTE=Sammon;2441945]............ Sex us not enjoyable when there are restrictions.[/QUOTE]I banged two lovely girls in an FKK in Germany on March 16. I got back home on March 19. After eight days holed up in my residence with no sex I called for some escorts I knew more out of boredom than horniness, the better ones were unavailable so I opted for a rather less than average one I had banged before. It was one of the least enjoyable sessions I have had in my life mainly because apart from the condom there were no restrictions. Thankfully, its two weeks now and I'm ok.

[QUOTE=TheCane;2441921]Definitely won't help those who just got to have DFK LOL![/QUOTE]I have only had one FL make an issue of DFK during this early stage of Post Covid-19 World. But I sessioned very disappointingly with her more than a year ago and never saw her again precisely because of her refusal to engage in DFK or even LFK with me. So this might not really count as a sign of the future. She is one of the deaf girls who stands in front of the Nana Hotel parking lot. One of the average looking ones among them.

Four days ago she Lined me out of the blue, said she had no money, no customers, needed to pay rent and asked if she could please meet me.

Despite my disappointing and aborted mission session with her before, I reluctantly agreed to see her this time out of a sense of sympathy for her plight and on the strength of my memory and appreciation that she had agreed upfront to BBFS+CIP that previous time. She was delighted, so relieved and thanked me profusely in 2-3 followup Line messages. In fact, don't tell anyone but I really wasn't horny that day and figured that if I wasn't inspired to fuck after she got to my room I would pay her the agreed upon amount just for showing up and DATY.

After I wound up the brief negotiation on Line about me paying her 1,500 baht for ST as long as we did not rush, we "boom boom no condom" and (something I failed to negotiate the previous time) we engaged in some kissing on the lips with tongues touching a little bit, she sent this message: "if lip kissing 2000 baht."

Then she quickly unsent that message. But it was too late. I'd seen it already.

I told her nevermind, that I'd seen that message and I was no longer interested in meeting her. All the sympathy I might have felt for her plight evaporated as soon as it was clear she was as likely to pull some kind of bait and switch or "new rules" bullshit in the room this worst of times (for her) as any hardened hooker would at the best of times. And I just wasn't in the mood to have that happen in my room.

I landed back in BKK March 20 and was tongue deep with my regular semi-pro two days later. We are both behind the 14 day period, she has no income with the massage shop closed and (allegedly) no other man to support her. So she's eager for me to return to lock lips, DATY and covered FS. But I'm still reluctant.

I sent another regular a small amount by transfer so she can feed herself and her home bound family member (I've met them both, and I know the situation is genuine), so when this pandemic ever lifts she will be my honey pot for awhile.

These are times to lay low and cultivate your contacts for the post-Covid times. The profession never goes away, nor does sex, so I expect a phenomenal rebound. But maybe not until. July? October?

[QUOTE=Turgid;2441999]I banged two lovely girls in an FKK in Germany on March 16. I got back home on March 19. After eight days holed up in my residence with no sex I called for some escorts I knew more out of boredom than horniness, the better ones were unavailable so I opted for a rather less than average one I had banged before. It was one of the least enjoyable sessions I have had in my life mainly because apart from the condom there were no restrictions. Thankfully, its two weeks now and I'm ok.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Chacal60;2442048].................These are times to lay low and cultivate your contacts for the post-Covid times..........[/QUOTE]Its probably safer to do that in Thailand than in the country with the highest number of infections and approaching the highest number of casualties in the world.

Anyone care to watch some cheesy Thai prison porn movies during this pandemic?. PM me. I'll send a link. The women are kinda hot (plus one 'Tomboy').

[QUOTE=Confiable;2441070]What's your hidden agenda? There is no shortage of basic house hold products or food. There is no spike in crime. Matter of fact violent crime is down during this epidemic.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2441073]Exactly. Because everybody and their hamster went to buy weapons and are now loaded to the teeth.[/QUOTE]The crime drop has little or nothing to do with the number of weapons that people bought. The crime rates have gone down all around the world.

This is a random news item about it: [URL]https://time.com/5819507/crime-drop-coronavirus/[/URL].

Just google "crime drop corona" to find more.

What's your hidden agenda? There is no shortage of basic house hold products or food. There is no spike in crime. Matter of fact violent crime is down during this epidemic.

[URL]https://news.yahoo.com/were-catching-double-amid-coronavirus-162058505.html[/URL]

[QUOTE=Mogwai;2442419].............. The crime rates have gone down all around the world.............[/QUOTE]True but spousal abuse, domestic abuse is up, also penile abuse.

[QUOTE=Turgid;2442523]True but spousal abuse, domestic abuse is up, also penile abuse.[/QUOTE]I wonder if it really is up more, or just being reported more? Who knows.

[QUOTE=Turgid;2442181]Its probably safer to do that in Thailand than in the country with the highest number of infections and approaching the highest number of casualties in the world.[/QUOTE]I'm not so sure about that. I think the numbers reported in the US are more reliable than the numbers reported in Thailand. It's really scary how low the official numbers are in Thailand. It can simply not be true.

[QUOTE=Turgid;2442523]True but spousal abuse, domestic abuse is up, also penile abuse.[/QUOTE]LOL, I wonder if there's a correlation between those three. Men stay at home 24 hours a day because they have to work from home now (or they got fired) and want to have sex more often. Wifes get beaten up because they refuse. Dicks get abused because wifes refuse.

[QUOTE=Mogwai;2442706]I'm not so sure about that. I think the numbers reported in the US are more reliable than the numbers reported in Thailand. It's really scary how low the official numbers are in Thailand. It can simply not be true.[/QUOTE]You got me to undertake a little research. The population of the US is 331 million and they have taken 2,849,648 tests. The population of Thailand is 69.8 million and they undertook 71,860 tests. You just might have something there.

[QUOTE=Turgid;2442811]population of the US is 331 million and they have taken 2,849,648 tests. The population of Thailand is 69.8 million and they undertook 71,860 tests[/QUOTE]Thailand is of the opinion that mass testing is ineffective.

Even with this mindset, Thailand has done 1440 tests per million vs. Japan who has 3x more cases and done less than half the number of tests per million. Indonesia has almost twice as many cases as Thailand and done only 27k tests versus 100,948 tests for Thailand. Brazil has almost 10x more cases and done fewer tests than Thailand. Even a very affluent country like Sweden who has 4x more cases than Thailand has done only about half the tests Thailand has.

Look at some of the European countries like UK, France, Belgium, Netherlands, etc. If you take the total number of tests vs. total number of cases ratio, it's WAY WAY lower than Thailand.

[URL]https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/asia/china-approves-experimental-covid-19-vaccines-clinical-trials-12639116[/URL]

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2442966]
Look at some of the European countries like UK, France, Belgium, Netherlands, etc. If you take the total number of tests vs. total number of cases ratio, it's WAY WAY lower than Thailand.[/QUOTE]I think we all know that the real number of cases is way higher than the cases found by testing, simply because they don't test the entire population. In the European countries the authorities admit this. Do the authorities in Thailand admit this too?

[QUOTE=Mogwai;2443000]I think we all know that the real number of cases is way higher than the cases found by testing, simply because they don't test the entire population. In the European countries the authorities admit this. Do the authorities in Thailand admit this too?[/QUOTE]My understanding is that scientifically one is supposed to test a sample, then derive a forecast for the general population. For example if 10% of the sample test positive, you would then assume 10% of the general population would be positive. At least, that's what I remember from the statistical courses I took in college, many years ago.

[QUOTE=Lefeu;2443004]My understanding is that scientifically one is supposed to test a sample, then derive a forecast for the general population. For example if 10% of the sample test positive, you would then assume 10% of the general population would be positive. At least, that's what I remember from the statistical courses I took in college, many years ago.[/QUOTE]Theoretically it's correct. But in practical it will give just "sensational" results. I read some articles by some statisticians in early March, who "predicted" 10's of millions will die by this virus by June. Based on the sample size they used of people who were tested. But that sample is hugely skewed, because most countries are only testing people who have travel history or are already showing symptoms.

So if in a sample of 100,000 people who got tested, and 80,000 of those people had travel history or were showing symptoms or did come in contact with a positive case, If 10,000 of those resulted as positive case, we can't use same 10% rate for whole population.

[QUOTE=Lefeu;2443004]My understanding is that scientifically one is supposed to test a sample, then derive a forecast for the general population. For example if 10% of the sample test positive, you would then assume 10% of the general population would be positive. At least, that's what I remember from the statistical courses I took in college, many years ago.[/QUOTE]Most Covid-19 infections are mild or asymptomatic and in the absence of testing are never counted. Testing in Thailand is low (1,400 per M) and as a consequence the true rate of infection is simply unknown.

That said the number of deaths of those diagnosed with the virus and hospitalized I believe is accurate and being relatively low is good news.

But even there I do wonder if deaths in the villages and small towns of older people with existing chronic underlying health conditions such as diabetes or hypertension whether hospitalized or not were ever tested. Even in some western countries deaths at home and in care facilities from the virus are not counted in the official stats.

Being positive, it does seem we are either near the top or over the peak of new infections and getting closer to whatever the new normal looks like.

Will be interesting to see what changes if any there will be in P4P, in availability, in quality of providers, in service and changes in where it is accessed.

I have been confined to Paris at home since mid March. I had to cancel a trip to Pattaya in March and I had to leave for the Philippines yesterday. I have other trips to Pattaya planned in May, June and July but I don't know if I will be able to leave. I wanted to thank everyone who posts messages or videos from Thailand or the Philippines at the moment to inform about what's going on at the moment and also about the travel conditions.

I am also quite furious with the incompetence, the lies and the lack of preparation of all French governments since 10 years. France is the most taxed country in the world and we supposedly had the best medicine. The result is that we are managing this crisis by confining people like in the Middle Ages. It's just shame. We will draw the conclusions from this enormous failure later but it makes you want to bring out the guillotine. This era will be pivotal. It will accelerate the pre-eminence of Asia over the West.

I just learned that my Air France flight for May to Bangkok had just been canceled.

[QUOTE=Pimpampoumpipo;2443503]I have been confined to Paris at home since mid March. I had to cancel a trip to Pattaya in March and I had to leave for the Philippines yesterday. I have other trips to Pattaya planned in May, June and July but I don't know if I will be able to leave. I wanted to thank everyone who posts messages or videos from Thailand or the Philippines at the moment to inform about what's going on at the moment and also about the travel conditions.

......

I just learned that my Air France flight for May to Bangkok had just been canceled.[/QUOTE]I do not bank on any semblance of nightlife being restored in Thailand in May.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2443013]...

Even in some western countries deaths at home and in care facilities from the virus are not counted in the official stats....

[/QUOTE]Quite the reverse in some countries like France (from what I've been told) and Belgium (according to the article below, if you can read French).

[URL]https://www.7sur7.be/dossier-coronavirus/la-belgique-est-elle-vraiment-le-deuxieme-pays-le-plus-affecte-au-monde~a1c773ff/[/URL]

Belgium says they're counting ALL deaths in old people's homes as Covid deaths irrespective of the cause of death. This is official policy, not some shortcoming in the counting process.

Then you wonder why people come up with conspiracy theories.

[QUOTE=XXL;2443590]I do not bank on any semblance of nightlife being restored in Thailand in May.

Quite the reverse in some countries like France (from what I've been told) and Belgium (according to the article below, if you can read French).

[URL]https://www.7sur7.be/dossier-coronavirus/la-belgique-est-elle-vraiment-le-deuxieme-pays-le-plus-affecte-au-monde~a1c773ff/[/URL]

Belgium says they're counting ALL deaths in old people's homes as Covid deaths irrespective of the cause of death. This is official policy, not some shortcoming in the counting process.

Then you wonder why people come up with conspiracy theories.[/QUOTE]I am come to the conclusion that people believe what they want to believe and follows their ideological leanings. Right wing versus liberal, xenophobic versus open-minded and so on.

They choose their TV, radio, websites, newspapers, politicians not on their reputation for truth but on what validates their innate beliefs.

An excerpt from a very recent article in the Wall Street Journal which even after Murdoch's take over still retains its journalistic reputation.

"Newly published figures show deaths linked to the new corona virus in the you. K. Have far exceeded preliminary estimates, adding to a growing body of evidence across Europe that closely watched daily death tallies don't reveal the virus's true toll.

Behind the discrepancy are lags in recording some deaths that can stretch to a week or more, as well as deaths in nursing homes and other non-hospital settings that aren't normally captured by rapid-fire estimates used to track the pandemic".

But who knows for sure, maybe just another conspiracy.

[QUOTE=XXL;2443590]I do not bank on any semblance of nightlife being restored in Thailand in May.[/QUOTE]NightWish chick whose crib I went to last night said they would open up on May 1. I laughed at her. She said the owner had the paper from the government. I said they might have a paper but that does not mean shit. I told her like Michael Jackson told Paul McCartney: You keep dreaming. I don't belieeeeve it.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2443611]NightWish chick whose crib I went to last night said they would open up on May 1. I laughed at her. She said the owner had the paper from the government. I said they might have a paper but that does not mean shit. I told her like Michael Jackson told Paul McCartney: You keep dreaming. I don't belieeeeve it.[/QUOTE]I believe they will open May 1st unless the daily reported cases go back to triple digits.

[QUOTE=HoustonPlayer;2443615]I believe they will open May 1st unless the daily reported cases go back to triple digits.[/QUOTE]Everything is possible but it's difficult to believe by the look of things in Pattaya right now. However, water may soon become Pattaya's main concern.

[QUOTE=Pimpampoumpipo;2443503]I am also quite furious with the incompetence, the lies and the lack of preparation of all French governments since 10 years. France is the most taxed country in the world and we supposedly had the best medicine. The result is that we are managing this crisis by confining people like in the Middle Ages. It's just shame. We will draw the conclusions from this enormous failure later but it makes you want to bring out the guillotine. This era will be pivotal.[/QUOTE]Nothing will change except they will put even more taxes.

These lockdowns came at a very good time for Hong Kong and France, protests were huge for months and nothing could stop them except that fucking virus.

Let's see how they can start again once these lockdowns are over.

[QUOTE=HoustonPlayer;2443615]I believe they will open May 1st unless the daily reported cases go back to triple digits.[/QUOTE]Perhaps the activity will restart in Thailand on May 1. I don't know.

Still, the request must also be there. Today Shengen area is closed until further notice (rumors says until September), China fears a second wave, Singapore and Taiwan despite exemplary management of the crisis note an upsurge of new cases and those of the USA continue their exponential curve. These are just a few examples, almost all countries have closed their borders.

Under these conditions I doubt that commercial flights around the world can resume in May. If we can move again in June it will be a miracle. Maybe if we find a treatment by then and that we can find it everywhere in the world (hope gives life).

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2443611]NightWish chick whose crib I went to last night said they would open up on May 1. I laughed at her. She said the owner had the paper from the government. I said they might have a paper but that does not mean shit. I told her like Michael Jackson told Paul McCartney: You keep dreaming. I don't belieeeeve it.[/QUOTE]Rumors sometimes they are just ridiculous but I think they will start to open things up on the 1st of May? When it comes to the Nightwish group the owner is pretty connected with the BIB in Pattaya. I've been hearing stuff along that line along with what I see globally talked about that things will open what is allowed is anyone guess but they will continue many of the CDC guidelines like " social distance " mask, take your temperature and alcohol gel? I heard from a Thai today a few suggestions that would make your eyes roll? Okay To have cockfights, bird singer contest, massages even Softball is on the list?

Every expert opinion I've heard when it opens expect the numbers to go up a bit (consider normal) but they will need to flatten or drop for it to continue.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2443611]NightWish chick whose crib I went to last night said they would open up on May 1. I laughed at her. She said the owner had the paper from the government. I said they might have a paper but that does not mean shit. I told her like Michael Jackson told Paul McCartney: You keep dreaming. I don't belieeeeve it.[/QUOTE]Rumors sometimes they are just ridiculous but I think they will start to open things up on the 1st of May? When it comes to the Nightwish group the owner is pretty connected with the BIB in Pattaya. I've been hearing stuff along that line along with what I see globally talked about that things will open what is allowed is anyone guess but they will continue many of the CDC guidelines like " social distance " mask, take your temperature and alcohol gel? I heard from a Thai today a few suggestions that would make your eyes roll? Okay To have cockfights, bird singer contest, massages even Softball is on the list?

Every expert opinion I've heard when it opens expect the numbers to go up a bit (consider normal) but they will need to flatten or drop for it to continue. As for the nightlife I see the GoGos being hit the most I'll be surprised 30% ever open again. I see BeerBars, massages and Gentlemen clubs doing much better?

[QUOTE=Pimpampoumpipo;2443659]Still, the request must also be there..[/QUOTE]Sorry for the translation. I meant "demand". I think you corrected by yourself.

I'm already here but my buddy's flight here on Emirates mid-May was just cancelled yesterday.

I think that those of us with feet on the ground might find a little more opening up of commercial and entertainment options, international flights will still be down. By May the working girls will be very, very desperate for paid companionship.

[QUOTE=LittleBigMan;2443680]Rumors sometimes they are just ridiculous but I think they will start to open things up on the 1st of May? When it comes to the Nightwish group the owner is pretty connected with the BIB in Pattaya. I've been hearing stuff along that line along with what I see globally talked about that things will open what is allowed is anyone guess but they will continue many of the CDC guidelines like " social distance " mask, take your temperature and alcohol gel? I heard from a Thai today a few suggestions that would make your eyes roll? Okay To have cockfights, bird singer contest, massages even Softball is on the list?

Every expert opinion I've heard when it opens expect the numbers to go up a bit (consider normal) but they will need to flatten or drop for it to continue. As for the nightlife I see the GoGos being hit the most I'll be surprised 30% ever open again. I see BeerBars, massages and Gentlemen clubs doing much better?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Almond812;2443816]
Hey all,
Currently, August round trip flights out of O'Hate are less than $600 during the month of August & September. What are your all's thoughts? Think things will be open for travel by then? Things starting to get back to normal?

I figure if anything, flight can be refunded, voucher given, or credit for the future.

Hope you all are well and staying safe during this trying time.

Warm regards.

Almond.[/QUOTE]Out of Chicago, so I assume you are talking about a United ticket. I rescheduled my original April flight with United for mid August a month ago. Mid August was the farthest out departure date United was willing to reschedule me for at that time.

Know one knows what the situation will be like in Mid August. If flights are still grounded I am sure I will be able to reschedule once again. But if the flight is not cancelled and Thailand has a 14 day quarantine period for new foreign arrivals I will most likely be screwed ie no refund or reschedule.

I don't expect Thailand will be back to it's good old ways by mid August. That is too soon to expect a full return back to normal. I expect many bars will never re-open although some will hopefully be open by mid August. Same Same for massage parlors. I expect many restaurants may not make it either. Social distancing & temperature checks will be enforced at all mall entrances, hotels, brick and mortar restaurants, and nightclubs. I do expect that there will be lots of available girls and not many tourists in mid August. It will be interesting. Adventurous Punters will have to be flexible and adapt under these unusual circumstances.

So bottom line I will go in mid August because I miss the girls and I am getting tired of living in the USA, but I will only go if:

#1. My flight is not cancelled.
#2. The Thai government allows American Citizens in for 30 days with no quarantine.
#3. Both BKK & Pattaya have free mobility intra city and inter city, and
#4. The USA will allow my unfettered return.

Unfortunately all 4 of my criteria are big ifs at this moment, but I am somewhat hopeful things will work out and I will be able to go. I think that although Thailand will be a very different place in Mid August / September and definitely not fully recovered, I think it might be really great and uniquely memorable in many unforeseen ways in the immediate post Pandemic period.

[QUOTE=Chacal60;2444126]By May the working girls will be very, very desperate for paid companionship.[/QUOTE]What makes you say that? As I have pointed out many times, nobody is around here starving. Also, I have pointed out in a couple of reports that some working girls have already been desperate for even free companionship. Women crave dick just as much as men crave pussy.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2444130]
So bottom line I will go in mid August because I miss the girls and I am getting tired of living in the USA, but I will only go if:

#4. The USA will allow my unfettered return.

Unfortunately all 4 of my criteria are big ifs at this moment, but I am somewhat hopeful things will work out and I will be able to go....[/QUOTE]I can't speak for other countries but mine (not USA) is actively discouraging International travel. They have formally said that they will re-open domestic travel and flights well before International holidays. Our local tourism industry has been devastated by the virus and there is no political will to promote funds being spent overseas while local businesses are going bankrupt.

I'm expecting a long wait before I can head off to hunt LBFMs.

Enjoy. G.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2444130] But if the flight is not cancelled and Thailand has a 14 day quarantine period for new foreign arrivals I will most likely be screwed ie no refund or reschedule.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
.... but I will only go if:

#1. My flight is not cancelled.
#2. The Thai government allows American Citizens in for 30 days with no quarantine.
#3. Both BKK & Pattaya have free mobility intra city and inter city, and
#4. The USA will allow my unfettered return.[/QUOTE]It is exactly the fear that I have and the conditions that I set on my return to Thailand (or Philippines).

My booking Air France / KLM Paris Bangkok flight in May was canceled. There are only 2 flights per week maintained for these companies. There are other companies which open about 2 flights per week (Lufthansa / Swiss / Austrian, Qatar.) but I still prefer to book with Air France these months because in case of force majeure only Air France will provide flights repatriation to Paris. There is flights still quite affordable around 380 € - 480 € round trip ticket.

For the same reasons for the moment I hesitate to change my flight and take another one in May. I am waiting for the news of the deconfinement of the French government but especially I await the measures of the Thai government.

There are still couple multi-company flights Paris BKK in April they are all over 6,000 € LOL.

[QUOTE=Goferring;2444195]I can't speak for other countries but mine (not USA) is actively discouraging International travel. They have formally said that they will re-open domestic travel and flights well before International holidays. Our local tourism industry has been devastated by the virus and there is no political will to promote funds being spent overseas while local businesses are going bankrupt.

I'm expecting a long wait before I can head off to hunt LBFMs.

Enjoy. G.[/QUOTE]It's the same in France. The President said that the Schengen borders would remain closed until further notice. Some speak until September.

But as I said before, flights from Europe to Thailand open in May. Not as usual, but there are. Maybe I'm wrong but I think that after the end of confinement date (May 11th planned in France), normally I can go to the airport and if I can go to the airport I can get on the plane. To my knowledge at the moment there is no ban on leaving the country.

The closing of the borders seems to be especially for foreigners who want to enter France.

The only questions that remain are on the entry conditions of the host country. So for me, those of Thailand.

Now, it is true that national governments will prefer that people stay spending their money in their country to get their local economy restarting. Especially considering the pandemic that there has been, the measures of social distancing this summer for example on the beaches, the closed museums and the cultural and sporting events canceled there will not be many foreign tourists to come to France this year.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2444130]Out of Chicago, so I assume you are talking about a United ticket.

#1. My flight is not cancelled.
#2. The Thai government allows American Citizens in for 30 days with no quarantine.
#3. Both BKK & Pattaya have free mobility intra city and inter city, and
#4. The USA will allow my unfettered return.

Unfortunately all 4 of my criteria are big ifs at this moment, but I am somewhat hopeful things will work out and I will be able to go. [/QUOTE]Yes, I also have have hope things will work out. I agree with your criteria. I did also notice flights out of Indianapolis on Delta were comparable in price. I'm in a position where O'Hare and Indy are about equal distant.

Best.

David.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2444130]I will only go if:

#1. My flight is not cancelled.
#2. The Thai government allows American Citizens in for 30 days with no quarantine.
#3. Both BKK & Pattaya have free mobility intra city and inter city, and
#4. The USA will allow my unfettered return.
[/QUOTE]These are sensible criteria, but it's worth pointing out that even if all 4 are true at the time you purchase your ticket, things might change by the time you're about to depart, or worse, during your stay.

Covid situation won't be resolved when the initial lockdowns are loosened. It will stay volatile, especially when it comes to international travel, for a long time to come, up until the point when a vaccine is deployed. People have different risk tolerance and lifestyles, and while some might be ok with the risk of forfeiting the ticket or being unable to go back from their holiday, many would not.

[QUOTE=Crocodilexp;2444626]These are sensible criteria, but it's worth pointing out that even if all 4 are true at the time you purchase your ticket, things might change by the time you're about to depart, or worse, during your stay.
[/QUOTE]Pretty good point. Once lockdown is over, whenever that be, and some clubs start to open and exptas and retirees and few tourists who are able to come starts to gather in clubs. There's a good chance of new surge of cases. It would take couple of deaths before the international pressure is on again to ban flights to and from Thailand. Yes, I am talking about one of the worst case scenario but it's quite possible. Don't forget testing in Thailand has been negligent.

I am expecting things to start open up by Mid May in bkk and pattaya. When will npe / cowboy / walking street and massage shops be open, well it depends on how much risk govt wants to take.

[QUOTE=Crocodilexp;2444626]These are sensible criteria, but it's worth pointing out that even if all 4 are true at the time you purchase your ticket, things might change by the time you're about to depart, or worse, during your stay.

Covid situation won't be resolved when the initial lockdowns are loosened. It will stay volatile, especially when it comes to international travel, for a long time to come, up until the point when a vaccine is deployed. People have different risk tolerance and lifestyles, and while some might be ok with the risk of forfeiting the ticket or being unable to go back from their holiday, many would not.[/QUOTE]You are absolutely right. The scene will not return to normal normal until a vaccine is made widely available to all. But I am a fairly adventurous guy willing to take on a little more calculated risk than many. I am also in pretty good shape for a guy my age, so I will go as scheduled in mid August fully knowing the risks if my 4 basic criteria are met. I plan to bring along the z-pac (Plaquenil + Azithromycin) just in case and I am also prepared for the possibility of getting stuck in LOS should the virus spike again while I am in country. Mr Enternational's entertaining posts of his life in Pattaya under the Corona cloud are a great read. By August the situation on the ground in LOS should be more open and free or I won't go/can't go. We shall see. Mid August is still a long way off.

[QUOTE=Gargano19;2444636]Pretty good point. Once lockdown is over, whenever that be, and some clubs start to open and exptas and retirees and few tourists who are able to come starts to gather in clubs. There's a good chance of new surge of cases.[/QUOTE]This is what happened during the Spanish Flu epidemic. After about 5 million deaths worldwide it started to subside and people thought it was over. They resumed normal life and about FIFTY million died in the second wave.

[QUOTE=KCQuestor;2444684]This is what happened during the Spanish Flu epidemic. After about 5 million deaths worldwide it started to subside and people thought it was over. They resumed normal life and about FIFTY million died in the second wave.[/QUOTE]The slingshot effect of relaxing protection was devastating. We've learned nothing in just over a century.

Not taking sides just another opinion.

I seriously doubt anyone really has an answer to any of this? Right now it seems politics is just as bad as the Virus when things do open up and it will the numbers will rise and then it will taper off but regardless both sides will spin it to their advantage.

A hundred years things have changed then there were no antibiotics nor there the research there is today. Most of all there was no global economy in which everything is so linked whether we believe it or not money today is what makes the world go around.

You have science vs. Economy is there a compromise not for a hundred-year past but for today based on today there is no way things can be shut down until a vaccine is found.

[QUOTE=LittleBigMan;2444716] there is no way things can be shut down until a vaccine is found.[/QUOTE]Right, there is no way things can remain in shut down much longer. We are in the process of killing our economies and thus killing our way of life. At some point soon all the world's various governments will have to open up their respective economies or face civil unrest. The good news is Corona is NOT nearly as lethal as something like the Spanish Flu and the hope is that the world's mitigation strategy has worked well enough that we can all go back to work following certain safety guidelines and not reignite the virus. But regardless of whether this mitigation strategy worked or didn't work we still must get back to work. The world survived, innovated, and began a sustained period of economic growth never seen before following the Spanish Flu scourge with no mitigation attempts whatsoever. History will decide if this lockdown strategy for this particular virus was worth the cost or not. Take note of Sweden's approach. They are the only advanced Western Nation that did not go into lockdown. Their government trusted their people to act rationally and in their own best interests. It may have worked.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2444651]The scene will not return to normal normal until a vaccine is made widely available to all.[/QUOTE]Stickman weekly makes some interesting points on the future of the bar sector of the scene. He reports:

1 - Seven NEP bars have quit and handed back the keys already. They are London Calling (actually closed pre-Covid), Mandarin (closed pre-lockdown), Lollipop, and all four Rainbow bars. He also questions how many other bars can keep paying the rent whilst closed, and will landlords seek to re-purpose their portfolio of premises to non-P4 P and "persuade" those bars that still operate to surrender their leases?

2 - One bar owner has openly admitted that even if restrictions are relaxed in May he won't be opening because the custom just won't be there. The potential business from Expats only would not cover the additional costs (staff, utilities, etc.) of opening.

3 - For those hoping for an influx of herds of young office girls desperate to make the rent having been laid off, think again. By far the majority would go down the Thai P4 P scene rather than the farang / East Asian.

4 - Twenty staff of Hillary 2 on Sukhumvit Soi 4 have tested positive and are in hospital.

On point 4 I should emphasise that anyone who tests positive in Thailand is hospitalised (with the possible exception of famous actors). No information has been given on the quantity of onward transmissions if any.

However, if anyone thinks bars and gogos are going to be allowed to reopen any time soon, think again. The Hillary 2 and Thong Lor clusters will be cited as reasons why bars are high risk and cannot be reopened (my view, not Stick's).

In Pattaya a lot of weight is being given by the vest (singlet to some) wearing unwashed to the Chonburi Governor's aspiration to re-open "all" businesses from 1 May, but little regard taken of the caveat of "with appropriate social distancing measures". My opinion, for what it is worth, is that the view will be taken such measures are not possible in bars and gogos and they will remain closed by Govenrnment order for quite some time.

It's a balance between lives lost and livelihoods. No matter when a country begins to lift restrictions the virus will continue to be infectious and deadly and people will get sick and some will die. The experts say the smart time to ease is when the infections rate drops below 1 that means each infected persons infects less than one other. Until this happens the virus is not sufficiently contained. The key to knowing when this is happening is testing, something with the exception of a few countries is woefully inadequate particularly in the US and UK. The metric to know how good testing is is not many tests but how many tests per capita. When to reopen should be left to science and health experts like Dr Fauci in the US and not to populist politicians who care more about being reelected that the well being of the citizenry and who were criminally negligent in downplaying the virus when it first reared it's ugly head.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2444721]Take note of Sweden's approach. They are the only advanced Western Nation that did not go into lockdown. Their government trusted their people to act rationally and in their own best interests. It may have worked.[/QUOTE]Sweden's Covid deaths 1,540 (15.1 deaths per 100 k of population). Compare this to the neighbours:

Norway 165 deaths (3. 1 / 100 k).

Finland 94 deaths (1. 7 / 100 k).

Denmark 355 deaths (6. 1 / 100 k).

Source: Johns Hopkins University Coronavirus Resource Center [URL]https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/data/mortality[/URL].

Does it really look like it worked?

[QUOTE=GettingFedUp;2444733]Sweden's Covid deaths 1,540 (15.1 deaths per 100 k of population). Compare this to the neighbours:

Norway 165 deaths (3. 1 / 100 k).

Finland 94 deaths (1. 7 / 100 k).

Denmark 355 deaths (6. 1 / 100 k).

Source: Johns Hopkins University Coronavirus Resource Center [URL]https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/data/mortality[/URL].

Does it really look like it worked?[/QUOTE]There is no way to know if it worked or not yet. By completely locking a country down, they are prolonging the spread of the virus. Eventually it will spread. Sweden will build up an immune herd faster than these other countries.

The theory is that in the end, they will all be about equal with the exception being that the countries that went into lockdown destroyed their economies.

With all the talk on the forum lately I just have one contribution as to how things will pan out. Those with a healthy $ availability will flourish, those with minimal $ will flounder. Additionally, things will eventually get back to normal (whatever that is) but it will take some time.

There are all kinds of predictions of what to expect in terms of this epidemic. Some say that the summer will bring about a "burning out" of the virus and the immunities built up by those already infected. Others say that a resurgence will bring about an autumn outbreak that will mimic the "Spanish Flu" that will kill even more people. Speculation of an effective vaccine being produced will save humanity before the end of the year.

All this uncertainty is what is driving the economic decisions on the stock markets around the world and the business decisions by small business owners who will have to decide whether to call it quits or try to stick it out. All governments around the world either understand these facts and make the best decisions possible. Those that fail to comprehend these facts will make decisions that will have disastrous effects on their respective economies and citizens. That is how the real world works. What happens in Thailand is heavily dependent on the decisions that this government makes in the next 10 months. Add to the mix of the situation is how the rest of Southeast Asia handles their own situations. If no man is an island, then even more so for the communities and countries that make up the nations of the world.

So what is the point I am trying to make? It is going to be a wild ride politically and economically for every person on the planet. People will have to live with the uncertainty until the "war" with this virus is won or loss. A "win" is a quick discovery of a vaccine. That will be like the polio vaccine in the 1950's. The scientists who develop the first effective vaccine will be the Jonas Salk of this era. A "loss" would be a resurgence this fall that kills tens of millions like the "Spanish Flu".

[QUOTE=GettingFedUp;2444727]Stickman weekly makes some interesting points on the future of the bar sector of the scene. He reports:

1 - Seven NEP bars have quit and handed back the keys already. They are London Calling (actually closed pre-Covid), Mandarin (closed pre-lockdown), Lollipop, and all four Rainbow bars. He also questions how many other bars can keep paying the rent whilst closed, and will landlords seek to re-purpose their portfolio of premises to non-P4 P and "persuade" those bars that still operate to surrender their leases?

2 - One bar owner has openly admitted that even if restrictions are relaxed in May he won't be opening because the custom just won't be there. The potential business from Expats only would not cover the additional costs (staff, utilities, etc.) of opening.

3 - For those hoping for an influx of herds of young office girls desperate to make the rent having been laid off, think again. By far the majority would go down the Thai P4 P scene rather than the farang / East Asian.[/QUOTE]Yep, it isn't going to be pretty for mongers in LOS. I would also imagine that the gov along with many Thais would love to get rid of the what they consider eyesores, and that is the GoGos and the farang P4 P scene. Especially in the capital city. GoGo bars are an easy target as are the oily massage parlors. Soapies have been dead in the water for years as Thai businessmen no longer frequent them. The gov will use this as a way to finally rid BKK of the sexpat and sex tourist. Regulations will be put in place that make it impossible for many of these places to re-open, even if they can withstand the lockdown financially. The scene will migrate online even more and as you stated the gals that can attract local men will have nothing to do with foreigners. The future for foreign P4 P in Thailand, Bangkok especially, is pretty bleak. Anyone who thinks otherwise is deluding themselves. As far as P4 P goes, I would imagine Angeles City and Jakarta will see few changes coming out of this. HK will be the same as well.

[QUOTE=Rodwint2;2444786] Some say that the summer will bring about a "burning out" of the virus and the immunities built up by those already infected.[/QUOTE]Which I don't get because it is already hot in places like Brazil and Philippines. How is it behaving there?

[QUOTE=GettingFedUp;2444733]Sweden's Covid deaths 1,540 (15.1 deaths per 100 k of population). Compare this to the neighbours:

Norway 165 deaths (3. 1 / 100 k).

Finland 94 deaths (1. 7 / 100 k).

Denmark 355 deaths (6. 1 / 100 k).

Source: Johns Hopkins University Coronavirus Resource Center [URL]https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/data/mortality[/URL].

Does it really look like it worked?[/QUOTE]I have always admired the Swedish social model and to be honest I am surprised at their laissez faire approach.

I agree with you.

If using how many people die from the virus as the yardstick, when compared to similar countries the data shows Sweden has failed and continues to fail with no end in sight.

Covid 19 is highly contagious and until either an effective therapy or a vaccine is found if deaths are to be minimized transmission has to be effectively contained. This can only be done by social distancing, testing and the other measures in place most everywhere else.

[QUOTE=LittleBigMan;2444716]today there is no way things can be shut down until a vaccine is found.[/QUOTE]Until a vaccine is found, a treatment designed specifically for the coronavirus or collective immunity (impossible to obtain with the lockdown).

So not for many months. Maybe at least 1 year.

Difficult for world economies to wait until then because it will be necessary to choose between contracting the coronavirus and to die of hunger in particular in the emerging economies.

We will have to live and return to our occupations with this active virus for several months I think. No doubt with new behaviors such as social distancing or the wearing of masks.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;2444791]I would also imagine that the gov along with many Thais would love to get rid of the what they consider eyesores, and that is the GoGos and the farang P4 P scene.[/QUOTE]Admittedly. But it will also be necessary for the girls to stop being forced to provide for the needs of their entire family and for the men to start working in the provinces. A production of local goods or services will have to manage to emerge a middle class. This is not excluded of course but not for some time and certainly not in a collapsed and recessionary global economy.

On the other hand, the cultural and moral traditions in South East Asia are not as punitive regarding P4P as those of the Christian West.

I don't know if Gogos bars will survive but P4 P still has a bright future, it may have to reinvent itself.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2444808]Which I don't get because it is already hot in places like Brazil and Philippines. How is it behaving there?[/QUOTE][URL]https://www.cnbc.com/2020/04/20/southeast-asia-could-be-the-next-coronavirus-hot-spot-these-charts-show-why.html[/URL]

Poor countries like Mexico, PI and Brazil are in denial. Not even reporting infections or death rates accurately. They don't care primarily because they have no money to treat any sick person anyway. One of the reasons the US has totally shut down border with Mexico. Only commercial traffic coming through.

[QUOTE=Stykler;2444758]......Those with a healthy $ availability will flourish, those with minimal $ will flounder......[/QUOTE]Same same as before covid?

[QUOTE=GettingFedUp;2444733]Sweden's Covid deaths 1,540 (15.1 deaths per 100 k of population). Compare this to the neighbours:

Norway 165 deaths (3. 1 / 100 k).

Finland 94 deaths (1. 7 / 100 k).

Denmark 355 deaths (6. 1 / 100 k).

Source: Johns Hopkins University Coronavirus Resource Center [URL]https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/data/mortality[/URL].

Does it really look like it worked?[/QUOTE]These comparisons are not sufficient unless you know the percentage of the population that has been exposed to the virus. If you assume that 50% of the population in Sweeden has been exposed because of their limited lockdonwn, then you would expect the death toll to eventually double when everyone has been exposed. The more draconian the quarantine, the fewer peope exposed, so the lower the current death rate per 100 K. However, the death rate will go up as all people eventually get exposed. So say Denmark has only 10% of its people exposed, with 355 deaths. At 100% exposure, you would expect 3555 deaths, comparable to Sweeden. Since you cannot get immuniity (absent a vaccine) without exposure to the virus, all the quarantineing does is stretch out the deaths and not overwhelm the medical system, not reduce the number of total deaths.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;2444791]The future for foreign P4 P in Thailand, Bangkok especially, is pretty bleak. [/QUOTE]Bangkok Post put the following article up a couple of hours ago [URL]https://www.bangkokpost.com/thailand/general/1903640/ministry-floats-ideas-on-exit-strategy[/URL].

Some excerpts:

"At a joint meeting between ministry officials and deans of faculties of medicine on how to ease the lockdown, all agreed some measures have to be relaxed although a return to pre-crisis normality is out of the question, said Kamnuan Ungchusak, an adviser to the Disease Control Department and to the public health minister on the Covid-19 situation".

"High-risk businesses will not be allowed to open at this early stage. Medium-risk businesses, which manage to minimise risks, can reopen, he said. He cited as examples of medium-risk businesses hair salons, eateries and department stores".

"he admitted high-risk businesses, such as bars, karaokes, entertainment places and gambling dens, would have to be closed for a long time".

"However, if the situation warrants closures of more businesses in the future, the order will not be universal and apply only to problematic places".

"However, not all 77 provinces will go ahead at the same pace. They will be allowed to reopen based on risks and by area".

"Based on the April 14 data, Dr Kamnuan said, 32 provinces are free of infections. "So 3-4 of these provinces may be opened first by the end of April. If the situation is under control, another 38 provinces with low numbers of cases will be reopened in the following two weeks, or in May. The seven provinces where infections slowly spread but with no large outbreaks will be reopened in June".

My observation. Bangkok, Chonburi (including Pattaya) and Phuket are highly unlikely to be among the circa 50 provinces earmarked for partial reopening in the next couple of months. Expect more gogos and bars to be handing back the keys to their landlords in the near future.

[QUOTE=JimmyBoy99;2444877]These comparisons are not sufficient unless you know the percentage of the population that has been exposed to the virus. If you assume...[/QUOTE]But we don't know the proportion of the populations exposed. So the comparison with the neighbours whilst flawed is the best available, particularly as they have similar climate. For a similar coronavirus (HCV229 E), which is one of the causes of the common cold, climate (both temperature and relative humidity) was found to be a significant driver of the half life of the virus in the environment (Source: US National Library of Medicine National Institutes of Health).

You then make all sorts of unsupported assumptions about proportion exposed in order to justify your initial conjecture. 68.72% of all statistics are completely made up in order to justify an opinion rather than to support a fact (Source: I just made it up to show how easy it is to quote numbers which have no basis in reality).

[QUOTE=JimmyBoy99;2444877]Since you cannot get immuniity (absent a vaccine) without exposure to the virus,[/QUOTE]You obviously missed the caution from the World Health Organisation that there is no evidence yet that previous exposure ensures future immunity (Widely reported BBC / CNBC / Bloomberg to name a few as part of a warning of future over reliance on antibody tests).

[QUOTE=JimmyBoy99;2444877] all the quarantineing does is stretch out the deaths and not overwhelm the medical system, not reduce the number of total deaths.[/QUOTE]But the whole idea of not overwhelming the medical system is so that equipment, staff and facilities are available for those patients who would die without them but might be saved with them. There is a big difference between "No ventilator, will die" and "Yes ventilator, might die or might survive".

Finally, as this is a Thailand thread, it was reported that Bangkok had a total of 120 ICU beds which they hope to increase to 187 by the end of April and 292 by the end of May (Bangkok Post 15 April). This seems odd when the same article says that there are 4,955 ICU beds in the rest of the country. My guess is that the journalist has tapped an extra 5 on the rest of the country number and the total ICU beds for Thailand is well under 1,000. But just a guess, rather like JB99's percentages!

[QUOTE=GettingFedUp;2444878]Bangkok, Chonburi (including Pattaya) and Phuket are highly unlikely to be among the circa 50 provinces earmarked for partial reopening in the next couple of months. Expect more gogos and bars to be handing back the keys to their landlords in the near future.[/QUOTE]Yes.

There are the same kind of measures taken in Europe with the same arguments for the progressive reopening of businesses and those prohibited. Governments seem to take poses by posting the biggest ranting and the most severe restrictions to do like the others and not give the impression of being lax.

We will see how long these positions will last in the face of the economic tsunami which is being prepared and which is spreading absolutely everywhere (the WTI drops by -40% on the single day today because there is a lack of oil consumption for example. Hopefully they will not ignite oil wells like during the Gulf War so as not to have to stop production).

There is a gigantic wave preparing to take everything. And the billions of euros / dollars announced so far are just so that companies don't close immediately and people starve but don't guarantee the future at all.

We will see how the governments of the world (Thais and other ones) put into perspective the damage from covid-19 and those even more appalling from an economic outcry that they will no longer be able to control.

[QUOTE=GettingFedUp;2444733]Sweden's Covid deaths 1,540 (15.1 deaths per 100 k of population). Compare this to the neighbours:

Norway 165 deaths (3. 1 / 100 k).

Finland 94 deaths (1. 7 / 100 k).

Denmark 355 deaths (6. 1 / 100 k).

Does it really look like it worked?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=JimmyBoy99;2444877]These comparisons are not sufficient unless you know the percentage of the population that has been exposed to the virus. If you assume that 50% of the population in Sweeden has been exposed because of their limited lockdonwn, then you would expect the death toll to eventually double when everyone has been exposed. The more draconian the quarantine, the fewer peope exposed, so the lower the current death rate per 100 K. However, the death rate will go up as all people eventually get exposed. So say Denmark has only 10% of its people exposed, with 355 deaths. At 100% exposure, you would expect 3555 deaths, comparable to Sweeden. Since you cannot get immuniity (absent a vaccine) without exposure to the virus, all the quarantineing does is stretch out the deaths and not overwhelm the medical system, not reduce the number of total deaths.[/QUOTE]If you look at cases per million, the numbers in Sweden aren't far off Denmark and Norway.

Sweden 1,463 cases per million.

Denmark 1,297 cases per million.

Norway 1,314 cases per million.

Finland 698 cases per million.

So Sweden has saved $10's of billions in economic loss for not much of an increase in cases per million and the loss of 1000+ extra lives. Harsh to put a dollar value on lives but that is what every country has to decide in the near future. Iran has decided today to reopen the entire country due to economic woes.

As long as Princess Tilde of Sweden is safe..... [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yTAejTT3Iygl[/URL]

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2444899]If you look at cases per million, the numbers in Sweden aren't far off Denmark and Norway.

Sweden 1,463 cases per million.

Denmark 1,297 cases per million.

Norway 1,314 cases per million.

Finland 698 cases per million.
[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yTAejTT3Iygl[/URL][/QUOTE]The OP stated that "Their government trusted their people to act rationally and in their own best interests. It may have worked". Not that the economic benefit was worth it, but that the Swedish public had avoided each other without the intervention of Government. They didn't and it didn't work in those terms.

As to the cases conundrum why is Sweden's mortality rate (cases divided by deaths) so much higher than the neighbours? Actual mortality rate should be similar in countries with similar genetics, climates and health systems.

My money is that the neighbours are conducting more tests, finding more people little affected or asymptomatic (this is the German approach as well). Sweden may be only testing those that require hospital admission and key workers (the model the UK aspires to).

Quite simply if you don't look, you don't find. Someone snuffs it they get noticed, tested and counted (except in Old Folks Homes in certain countries). This is why deaths as a proportion of population is a better indication of the scale of the problem.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2444721]Right, there is no way things can remain in shut down much longer. We are in the process of killing our economies and thus killing our way of life. At some point soon all the world's various governments will have to open up their respective economies or face civil unrest. The good news is Corona is NOT nearly as lethal as something like the Spanish Flu and the hope is that the world's mitigation strategy has worked well enough that we can all go back to work following certain safety guidelines and not reignite the virus. But regardless of whether this mitigation strategy worked or didn't work we still must get back to work. The world survived, innovated, and began a sustained period of economic growth never seen before following the Spanish Flu scourge with no mitigation attempts whatsoever. History will decide if this lockdown strategy for this particular virus was worth the cost or not. Take note of Sweden's approach. They are the only advanced Western Nation that did not go into lockdown. Their government trusted their people to act rationally and in their own best interests. It may have worked.[/QUOTE]A change in our way of life is inexorably dawning upon all of us. At some point in the future <say, under three years , the virus will eventually mutate its way out of our lives. The question is how long will it take and how much of our herd will it cull. As somebody else pointed out in this forum, Sweden is no success story. Until now, the best expert advice seems to be that in the face of the power of exponential contact, the name of the game is social isolation to a point where we reach fourteen consecutive days with zero new cases anywhere in the world. Does not seem likely to happen from what we can see right now.

Having said that, I suspect Natty's pov (which is a mild variant of Trump's pov) will prevail in the short term and as a result, we will likely see another round of surge in the reported cases and the social isolation lockdown process might have to be repeated. Trump's position is hugely influenced by his perception of electoral impact (and to hell with the rest).

[QUOTE=Dena0;2444912] As somebody else pointed out in this forum, Sweden is no success story. Until now, the best expert advice seems to be that in the face of the power of exponential contact, the name of the game is social isolation to a point where we reach fourteen consecutive days with zero new cases anywhere in the world.[/QUOTE]That's the best expert advice according to who? To the people who don't give a shit about the world economy and are willing to have lock down for years? If you live in a dream fantasy world, then that is a possibility. But here in the real world, all that will do is cause the 2nd great depression while the corona cases are stretched out ad infinitum. They will not go to zero even with the lock down. People will die of starvation (especially in third world countries), suicide or drug abuse from depression, etc if they can't earn money.

Sweden most likely did it the right way. Get it over and done with as quickly as possible rather than kill the economy and let it go on for years. We will see in the long run.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;2444791]Yep, it isn't going to be pretty for mongers in LOS. I would also imagine that the gov along with many Thais would love to get rid of the what they consider eyesores, and that is the GoGos and the farang P4 P scene. Especially in the capital city. GoGo bars are an easy target as are the oily massage parlors. Soapies have been dead in the water for years as Thai businessmen no longer frequent them. The gov will use this as a way to finally rid BKK of the sexpat and sex tourist. Regulations will be put in place that make it impossible for many of these places to re-open, even if they can withstand the lockdown financially. The scene will migrate online even more and as you stated the gals that can attract local men will have nothing to do with foreigners. The future for foreign P4 P in Thailand, Bangkok especially, is pretty bleak. Anyone who thinks otherwise is deluding themselves. As far as P4 P goes, I would imagine Angeles City and Jakarta will see few changes coming out of this. HK will be the same as well.[/QUOTE]Well said. This is grim, but realistic. It's highly likely this will be the end of the Farang P4 P scene in Thailand as we know it. The scene has been in decline for a long time, and it's easier to kill off now than ever. Had the pandemic happened in the 1990's when sex tourists mattered to the economy, perhaps it could rebound, but those times are over. As an aside, a few old Asia hands I talked to mentioned how P4 P for foreigners in South Korea was excellent prior to the 1988 Olympics, the event that authorities used to clean it up. A fairly large scene still remains, but only for locals.

Across Thailand, the puritans are already using the chance to ban alcohol, although the link to the risk of spreading the virus is tenuous, far more indirect than with prostitution.

Cultural attitudes towards P4 P around the world have turned sharply negative due to the HIV epidemic in the 80's and 90's, and I suspect they'll go even more negative in the aftermath of Covid-19, even once a vaccine is available. Local scenes that are already halfway underground like Jakarta, KL or HK might survive, albeit in a diminished state. Foreigners in general won't be too popular for a while either in many places, so more girls in those local scenes might refuse foreign customers (some already do).

No idea about Angeles, I've been hearing it's in decline too, but perhaps PI is sufficiently corrupt to allow it to remain, and it might attract enough sex tourists exiled from other places to keep it viable.

I see no positives for our hobby except maybe a short term increase in freelancers due to desperate economic conditions, but this will be short lived and the number of foreign mongers able to tap into it will be limited.

Online mongering scene might expand to some extent, but I personally hate it. Online P4 P basically involves begging, digging and waiting for pussy rather than enjoying the process of choosing among many girls eager to be with me within 20 min of meeting.

[QUOTE=Rodwint2;2444872][URL]https://www.cnbc.com/2020/04/20/southeast-asia-could-be-the-next-coronavirus-hot-spot-these-charts-show-why.html[/URL]

Poor countries like Mexico, PI and Brazil are in denial. Not even reporting infections or death rates accurately. They don't care primarily because they have no money to treat any sick person anyway. One of the reasons the US has totally shut down border with Mexico. Only commercial traffic coming through.[/QUOTE]The Border with Mexico isn't shut down. I was just in Mexico over the weekend to see my regular girl. No questions asked on the way in to Mexico as usual, but I did get additional screening on my way back into the US. I think this is just because the agents on staff were assholes though.

[QUOTE=Crocodilexp;2444968]Well said. This is grim, but realistic. It's highly likely this will be the end of the Farang P4 P scene in Thailand as we know it. The scene has been in decline for a long time, and it's easier to kill off now than ever. Had the pandemic happened in the 1990's when sex tourists mattered to the economy, perhaps it could rebound, but those times are over. As an aside, a few old Asia hands I talked to mentioned how P4 P for foreigners in South Korea was excellent prior to the 1988 Olympics, the event that authorities used to clean it up. A fairly large scene still remains, but only for locals.

Across Thailand, the puritans are already using the chance to ban alcohol, although the link to the risk of spreading the virus is tenuous, far more indirect than with prostitution.

Cultural attitudes towards P4 P around the world have turned sharply negative due to the HIV epidemic in the 80's and 90's, and I suspect they'll go even more negative in the aftermath of Covid-19, even once a vaccine is available. Local scenes that are already halfway underground like Jakarta, KL or HK might survive, albeit in a diminished state. Foreigners in general won't be too popular for a while either in many places, so more girls in those local scenes might refuse foreign customers (some already do).

No idea about Angeles, I've been hearing it's in decline too, but perhaps PI is sufficiently corrupt to allow it to remain, and it might attract enough sex tourists exiled from other places to keep it viable.

I see no positives for our hobby except maybe a short term increase in freelancers due to desperate economic conditions, but this will be short lived and the number of foreign mongers able to tap into it will be limited.

Online mongering scene might expand to some extent, but I personally hate it. Online P4 P basically involves begging, digging and waiting for pussy rather than enjoying the process of choosing among many girls eager to be with me within 20 min of meeting.[/QUOTE]We are in line with both our assessment of the situation and our feelings about the online scene.

It's really a shame, I was hoping my 50's and 60's would be filled with great mongering opportunities. It was one of the reasons I chose to move her. Guess not. Glad I came over here 20 years ago to catch the end of the golden age. Everything prior to this March seems like nostalgia now.

I too have heard about how great Korea was prior to the olympics. One guy who lived there at the time said the bar scene was better than BKK ever was, and it was all gone in an instant. Closed Dec 31st 1987. Here no need for heavy handedness, that is not the Thai way; simply don't allow the places to open for a while longer and make regulations that will be difficult to comply with. And there you have it. Sigh, it really is depressing.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2444951]That's the best expert advice according to who? To the people who don't give a shit about the world economy and are willing to have lock down for years? If you live in a dream fantasy world, then that is a possibility. But here in the real world, all that will do is cause the 2nd great depression while the corona cases are stretched out ad infinitum. They will not go to zero even with the lock down. People will die of starvation (especially in third world countries), suicide or drug abuse from depression, etc if they can't earn money.

Sweden most likely did it the right way. Get it over and done with as quickly as possible rather than kill the economy and let it go on for years. We will see in the long run.[/QUOTE]Best advice according to epidemiologists in confronting a pandemic. However, the horse has already left the Wuhan barn and a global lockdown is unrealistic, which is why the pragmatic approach worldwide is likely to be graduated slackening of the lockdown with controls on localised hotspots.

There is no altering the fact that a depression is already all too likely and the unfortunate term 'culling of the herd' is already well in progress, whether we like it or not. Too many variables at play now. Oil at a negative price, CO2 unavailability leading to likely interruption of clean water and significant parts of the food chain. Who'd have thunk it?

Oil prices crashed today folks. It's being called a Double Black Swan. Has everyone on ISG contacted their epidemiologist relatives to comment?

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;2444978]We are in line with both our assessment of the situation and our feelings about the online scene.

It's really a shame, I was hoping my 50's and 60's would be filled with great mongering opportunities. It was one of the reasons I chose to move her. Guess not. Glad I came over here 20 years ago to catch the end of the golden age. Everything prior to this March seems like nostalgia now.

I too have heard about how great Korea was prior to the olympics. One guy who lived there at the time said the bar scene was better than BKK ever was, and it was all gone in an instant. Closed Dec 31st 1987. Here no need for heavy handedness, that is not the Thai way; simply don't allow the places to open for a while longer and make regulations that will be difficult to comply with. And there you have it. Sigh, it really is depressing.[/QUOTE]I remember some time last year some blokes complaining of high prices and less good looking providers and I remember stating that some time in the future those would be the good old days. Never thought it would be so soon.

[QUOTE=JimmyBoy99;2444877]Since you cannot get immuniity (absent a vaccine) without exposure to the virus, all the quarantineing does is stretch out the deaths and not overwhelm the medical system, not reduce the number of total deaths.[/QUOTE]If Sweden can manage to continue to stay at or just under its medical system capacity for the duration of the pandemic, I think your statement holds true. But if the number of cases spiral out of control, and some Swedish start to die because there were a shortage of ventilators, than needless people might die.

Here is a 44-year old coronavirus survivor who was on a ventilator for six days. This guy is a relatively young marathon runner who has exercise induced asthma but is otherwise healthy, And that ventilator might have been the difference between life and death. [URL]https://www.businessinsider.com/david-lat-coronavirus-harrowing-story-ventilator-2020-4?r=DE&IR=T[/URL].

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2444951]We will see in the long run.[/QUOTE]As the renowned economist John Maynard Keynes wrote nearly a century ago "In the long run we are all dead".

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;2444978]We are in line with both our assessment of the situation and our feelings about the online scene.

It's really a shame, I was hoping my 50's and 60's would be filled with great mongering opportunities. It was one of the reasons I chose to move her. Guess not. Glad I came over here 20 years ago to catch the end of the golden age. Everything prior to this March seems like nostalgia now.

I too have heard about how great Korea was prior to the olympics. One guy who lived there at the time said the bar scene was better than BKK ever was, and it was all gone in an instant. Closed Dec 31st 1987. Here no need for heavy handedness, that is not the Thai way; simply don't allow the places to open for a while longer and make regulations that will be difficult to comply with. And there you have it. Sigh, it really is depressing.[/QUOTE]You guys need to get called out a bit, its still the golden age in Bangkok. This is just nostalgia from the past, we all get it sometimes. The current scene was going extremely strong, it just wasn't as hilariously cheap or perfect as it was 40 years ago (I wasn't there then, but have heard plenty on it). Someone showing up to BKK in 2019 would be having an amazing time and not even know there was something else before. It is still (pre-covid) one of the top and cheapest spots in the world. I've been to a lot of the spots--Thailand is fucking value and a half. Please don't argue that back in the day it was 1000 baht instead of 2000 now. The shit is still quite good. When you can go to Tulip for PSE for 2000 baht or get to walk around Nana looking for your right girl to take home for not too much more, we're in business. Let alone all the escort site prices that are very reasonably priced for a hottie. Yeah, OK that Tulip girl is a bit older, and the bar fine is a little more, and there's more tourists, sure, there is, but everything is still going well.

Hell I would say the scene was even better now than it was 10 years ago. Lots of places have improved, internet and smartphone made stuff even easier. Prices are still dirt cheap.

That being said, its going to take some serious time to recover after all of this, and I do wonder when the tourist market will begin to flourish again in Bangkok (it may in the south before Bangkok), so in that time I wouldn't be surprised if many girls found other stuff to do, went home, or went the thai guys scene instead of asians / farangs.

I'm not gonna argue that we won't see additional regulation after this that puts the scene at risk, thats 100% a possibility the govt could do, I haven't heard any thoughts of that happening, but its happened in plenty of other spots, happening in Thailand wouldn't be too crazy, hell even the Dutch crack down year after year.

[QUOTE=Turgid;2445005]I remember some time last year some blokes complaining of high prices and less good looking providers and I remember stating that some time in the future those would be the good old days. Never thought it would be so soon.[/QUOTE]Well stated. The scene was pretty stable for my first six or so years here. That would be 99-06. Started to wane a bit after the 06 coup. Oilies kicked into gear then, so that was a saving grace. Talent started to slip there about the time of the second coup. The last 5 years have been a rather steep decline. And now, well, sheesh!

[QUOTE=GrapeMan;2445052]You guys need to get called out a bit, its still the golden age in Bangkok. This is just nostalgia from the past, we all get it sometimes. The current scene was going extremely strong, it just wasn't as hilariously cheap or perfect as it was 40 years ago (I wasn't there then, but have heard plenty on it). Someone showing up to BKK in 2019 would be having an amazing time and not even know there was something else before. It is still (pre-covid) one of the top and cheapest spots in the world. I've been to a lot of the spots--Thailand is fucking value and a half. Please don't argue that back in the day it was 1000 baht instead of 2000 now. The shit is still quite good. When you can go to Tulip for PSE for 2000 baht or get to walk around Nana looking for your right girl to take home for not too much more, we're in business. Let alone all the escort site prices that are very reasonably priced for a hottie. Yeah, OK that Tulip girl is a bit older, and the bar fine is a little more, and there's more tourists, sure, there is, but everything is still going well.

Hell I would say the scene was even better now than it was 10 years ago. Lots of places have improved, internet and smartphone made stuff even easier. Prices are still dirt cheap.

That being said, its going to take some serious time to recover after all of this, and I do wonder when the tourist market will begin to flourish again in Bangkok (it may in the south before Bangkok), so in that time I wouldn't be surprised if many girls found other stuff to do, went home, or went the thai guys scene instead of asians / farangs.

I'm not gonna argue that we won't see additional regulation after this that puts the scene at risk, thats 100% a possibility the govt could do, I haven't heard any thoughts of that happening, but its happened in plenty of other spots, happening in Thailand wouldn't be too crazy, hell even the Dutch crack down year after year.[/QUOTE]Well, we can agree to disagree. The oilies peaked in the early '10's, GoGos have not been great since the mid-00's IMHO, and the freelance scene was never the same after the '11 floods. I'm more worried about the attitude of the providers after this. Thais are always afraid of getting sick. One of my friends from the US has a lot of GoGo gals he keeps in touch with. All are asking him for money. He told 'them he has a friend that would gladly meet up with them, but all are too frightened. Most of my friends who have regulars are complaining that their gals are not wanting to kiss and are scared. Afraid this is not going to go away in a few months. Big world events like WWII, The Great Depression, etc leave marks on all that go through them. I'd put forth this pandemic is the biggest world event since WWII and a far bigger health event than HIV. We will be entering into a new "normal. " I'm not happy about it, but that's the way we are headed.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;2445062]Well, we can agree to disagree. The oilies peaked in the early '10's, GoGos have not been great since the mid-00's IMHO, and the freelance scene was never the same after the '11 floods. I'm more worried about the attitude of the providers after this. Thais are always afraid of getting sick. One of my friends from the US has a lot of GoGo gals he keeps in touch with. All are asking him for money. He told 'them he has a friend that would gladly meet up with them, but all are too frightened. Most of my friends who have regulars are complaining that their gals are not wanting to kiss and are scared. Afraid this is not going to go away in a few months. Big world events like WWII, The Great Depression, etc leave marks on all that go through them. I'd put forth this pandemic is the biggest world event since WWII and a far bigger health event than HIV. We will be entering into a new "normal. " I'm not happy about it, but that's the way we are headed.[/QUOTE]Luckily, I have more willing and eager favorite regulars, P4P and non pro, than I can keep happy per week. Five right now, lost a 6th to her province recently but another one is due back in town any day now.

However, if I relied on getting NEW girls in the street or online (I work hard to set aside a free day and night for that every few days) who would fit my specs for youth, looks and fuck and suck skills and willingness, I might not have gotten well laid or sucked off but once out of at least a dozen approaches over the past 3-4 weeks.

That is about the ratio of new takers I've had for "boom boom no condom" OR BBBJ+CIM with or without some minor "kissing on the lips" included during these supposedly economically desperate times. I'm talking about daytime, afternoons or 1-2 hours before the 10pm curfew when I am the only potential customer in any direction as far as the eye can see.

And for the online girls, I'm talking about girls whose opening statements are how they have no job and no money, haven't had either in weeks.

Mind you, I have not approached girls on the street or clicked girls online who are too fat, too old or too homely even for my rather liberal range of acceptability. So maybe times have never been better for guys with a more liberal range of acceptability and certainly for those punters for whom covered sex is just fine and would never choose a CIM finish anyway.

How or if that mindset continues after the lockdown is over is anybody's guess. But until then and perhaps for a couple of years thereafter I am guarding and treasuring my tried, true and reliable regulars like so much top quality gold. Happily, the same way they are treating me.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;2445062]One of my friends from the US has a lot of GoGo gals he keeps in touch with. All are asking him for money. He told 'them he has a friend that would gladly meet up with them, but all are too frightened. Most of my friends who have regulars are complaining that their gals are not wanting to kiss and are scared. [/QUOTE]This maybe true but it is not consistent with the reports we have seen here.

[QUOTE=GettingFedUp;2444727]1 - Seven NEP bars have quit and handed back the keys already. They are London Calling (actually closed pre-Covid), Mandarin (closed pre-lockdown), Lollipop, and all four Rainbow bars. [/QUOTE]Only Rainbow 1 and 3 are closed.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2445075]Luckily, I have more willing and eager favorite regulars, P4P and non pro, than I can keep happy per week. Five right now, lost a 6th to her province recently but another one is due back in town any day now.
[/QUOTE]That's the benefits of regulars. There's obvious downside of fucking same girl, but both sides know what to expect, girl gets way more comfortable, and experience gets more GFE-ish and less mechanical.

All my regulars who left to their hometowns will be back by mid May, unless there's some unusual surge in cases.

Thailand is no doubt one of best place to do easy mongering, girls are easy to find and $30-60 shops to fuck are everywhere. But there's no denying that many clubs are not making same level of profits as they were 10 years ago, from what some owners told me. Maybe internet and option to pick girls online is one reason. Maybe stronger baht or weaker Russian currency or both. Or maybe the fact that girls are making a lot more than they were before. Couple of clubs owners on WS who told me in December during my last trip to Pattaya that if March wasn't a high season, then they will be closing their clubs. Well I don't have to ask them now if they're going to close it or not. By November, the clubs which can withstand this beating or new players who are eager to bet, will be open and running well. No way Thailand will have shortage of mongers. Clubs will be packed. Clubs will still make small profits enough to keep it going. Thailand is like well oiled juggernaut machine, people will come here no matter if there are cheaper options or beautiful girls available elsewhere.

[QUOTE=Gargano19;2445093]That's the benefits of regulars. There's obvious downside of fucking same girl, but both sides know what to expect, girl gets way more comfortable, and experience gets more GFE-ish and less mechanical.

All my regulars who left to their hometowns will be back by mid May, unless there's some unusual surge in cases.[/QUOTE]One of my favorite regulars had fled to her province the week the bars closed. Then she began complaining about being bored, broke and missing me "too mutt" in her province. Said she wanted to come back to Bangkok to live with me until the bars open again. Have to say I was tempted with this one for a hot minute because she pretty much knocks most of my requirements out of the park.

Then I came to my senses and settled on a compromise idea; I told her I would fund her way back to Bangkok, set her up with the required first two months' rent for a room of her own near her sister, friends, wherever she was happy, I really didn't care as long as it was no hassle for her to come to see me once or twice a week. I told I would make sure she had enough income stream to cover her minimal expenses of rent, electric, phone and food as long as we were still happy being together at least one Long Time per week. Knowing that it would occasionally be twice a week.

The rent is 3,500 baht per month with air con use electricity extra. Nothing is in my name. Not a bad room and building really. By my calculation and so far over the past several weeks I am spending way less than I did buying LDs, paying her barfine and keeping her or almost any other bargirl for LT once per week before. And the level of appreciative GFE is well worth the money. I pick and choose which days and nights she comes to my place and she never disappoints. She did have a distracted time or two before when she was busy at her bar. But not now.

[QUOTE=Crocodilexp;2444968]Online mongering scene might expand to some extent, but I personally hate it..[/QUOTE]Yes me either I don't like too much. Between what we see on the screen and what actually happens in general is rather disappointment.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2445125]
Then I came to my senses and settled on a compromise idea; I told her I would fund her way back to Bangkok, set her up with the required first two months' rent for a room of her own near her sister, friends, wherever she was happy, I really didn't care as long as it was no hassle for her to come to see me once or twice a week. I told I would make sure she had enough income stream to cover her minimal expenses of rent, electric, phone and food as long as we were still happy being together at least one Long Time per week. Knowing that it would occasionally be twice a week.
[/QUOTE]That's pretty neat. I had a similar arrangement with a girl earlier last year for 2 months. Instead of paying her rent or bills, I was paying her straight up 1000 b. She used to work at an agency and her fee was 5000 b 2 hours, so it was a great deal. Arrangement was for LTs at my place 2 days a week. She was 32 but I would have never guessed until she told me. She maintained herself really well with regular gym and cautious diet. Sex was awesome with her, one thing she was fit, second she was nympho. We used to fuck multiple times at night, and sometimes whole afternoon. Also she cooked dinner couple of times, which was fun me massaging her boobs from behind while she is cooking something. Obviously after 2 months I got bored and called off the arrangement but I tipped her really well. We never met after that but she went to England with some Brit pfew months ago, so good for her.

After that I never try to make such long term arrangements for 2 reasons, one it is easy to get bored after so much sex with one girl no matter how awesome it is, second I was out of Thailand for 2-3 weeks every month till December last year, so no point.

Now I have 6 regulars (4 pre-covid haha) and I only used to meet 2 out of those 4 every week. Other 2 were twice a month. Now I have extra 2, which makes it complicated. Either someone will gets cut out of my list or I will meet them more because of post-covid restraint service.

Concerning the State of Emergency, the Prime Minister of Thailand will take his decision in 1 Week.

The Thai Prime Minister said today, Tuesday April 21, 2020, that he would decide in 1 week whether the state of emergency should be extended beyond April 30, 2020.

He added that the collaboration of people to fight infections and the updated information from the Ministry of Public Health will be essential to his decision. Although the situation appeared to be improving, he said he did not want to hastily lift the restrictions. He added that he will not be pressured and will rely, first and foremost, on medical information and whether the country would be prepared to handle the situation after the restrictions were lifted.

He said if things got worse after the restrictions were relaxed, all the work to curb the contagion would be a waste of time.

The Prime Minister also called on economic operators to propose measures they would take after the relaxation of the Lock.

For their part, local businesses and businesses hope that the government will loosen some restrictions this week to give them some breathing space after being severely affected by the "Covid-19" epidemic.

As a reminder, the government put the country in a state of emergency from March 26 to April 30,2020 and imposed a curfew from 10 pm To 4 am On April 3, 2020 until further notice.

[QUOTE=Gargano19;2445098]Thailand is no doubt one of best place to do easy mongering, girls are easy to find and $30-60 shops to fuck are everywhere. But there's no denying that many clubs are not making same level of profits as they were 10 years ago, from what some owners told me. Maybe internet and option to pick girls online is one reason. Maybe stronger baht or weaker Russian currency or both. Or maybe the fact that girls are making a lot more than they were before. Couple of clubs owners on WS who told me in December during my last trip to Pattaya that if March wasn't a high season, then they will be closing their clubs. Well I don't have to ask them now if they're going to close it or not. By November, the clubs which can withstand this beating or new players who are eager to bet, will be open and running well. No way Thailand will have shortage of mongers. Clubs will be packed. Clubs will still make small profits enough to keep it going. Thailand is like well oiled juggernaut machine, people will come here no matter if there are cheaper options or beautiful girls available elsewhere.[/QUOTE]The market is just pretty saturated for gogos. Thats a big deal. They used to be investments and bought and sold fairly liquid if the owner wanted, or they could change it up easily to a different format and customer base (to my understanding). The market is just saturated now with them so overall each spot isn't bringing in as much. It'll even itself out and repeat. The internet definitely had an impact, but the club is selling a different experience, its just that the market that was once there for it, the clubs expanded, yet business went down.

I mean, lets also laugh a bit, that the situation they got into is basically the SE Asian copycat business model: Someone opens up a good business that's doing well, and then 4 other people open up completely identical businesses right next to the original, and later, they all wonder why they aren't making enough money, I mean the original business did, who would have thought if we opened up 4 more the customers wouldn't flock 4 X more?

[QUOTE=GrapeMan;2445248]The market is just pretty saturated for gogos. Thats a big deal. They used to be investments and bought and sold fairly liquid if the owner wanted, or they could change it up easily to a different format and customer base (to my understanding). The market is just saturated now with them so overall each spot isn't bringing in as much. It'll even itself out and repeat. The internet definitely had an impact, but the club is selling a different experience, its just that the market that was once there for it, the clubs expanded, yet business went down.

I mean, lets also laugh a bit, that the situation they got into is basically the SE Asian copycat business model: Someone opens up a good business that's doing well, and then 4 other people open up completely identical businesses right next to the original, and later, they all wonder why they aren't making enough money, I mean the original business did, who would have thought if we opened up 4 more the customers wouldn't flock 4 X more?[/QUOTE]Costs of running a GoGo are way higher than they were before, especially when it comes to the gals. Rents are absurd, constantly rising alcohols prices mean most dudes drink less as well. The current model is not sustainable. And when some reopen, many won't, there won't be hordes of guys coming here due to travel restrictions and just not having as much disposable income for a time. Lots of local dudes here, but most just aren't interested in the insane prices.

[QUOTE=Gargano19;2445098]Thailand is no doubt one of best place to do easy mongering, girls are easy to find and $30-60 shops to fuck are everywhere. But there's no denying that many clubs are not making same level of profits as they were 10 years ago, from what some owners told me. Maybe internet and option to pick girls online is one reason. Maybe stronger baht or weaker Russian currency or both. Or maybe the fact that girls are making a lot more than they were before. Couple of clubs owners on WS who told me in December during my last trip to Pattaya that if March wasn't a high season, then they will be closing their clubs. Well I don't have to ask them now if they're going to close it or not. By November, the clubs which can withstand this beating or new players who are eager to bet, will be open and running well. No way Thailand will have shortage of mongers. Clubs will be packed. Clubs will still make small profits enough to keep it going. Thailand is like well oiled juggernaut machine, people will come here no matter if there are cheaper options or beautiful girls available elsewhere.[/QUOTE]I think you might be overlooking the fact that Thai people really dislike the farang P4 P scene and would like to see it gone. Sadly we don't fish in the same pond as the locals and for the most part are not welcome there. If we did, we'd have no worry about venues being pressured. This is the perfect opportunity for the authorities to make it so difficult for these businesses to operate that most just shut. That is the Thai way. Don't go after things directly, do it in an indirect manner. Put in restrictions that make it very difficult for GoGos, oilies, etc to open. Restrictions pertaining to cleanliness, social distancing, etc. All the while making it virtually impossible for these businesses to continue. I can honestly see this happening. Entertainment venues are not going to be opening any time soon. The gov has already said that pubs and the like will the be last to open. So July? Aug? Can't see any movement till then. How many GoGos and oilies can survive till then? And remember many are not getting rent breaks because landlords get key money and deposits, so if the place goes out of business, it just means they can get that initial chunk again. Will there be P4 P? Of course, but it will move even more online. So will guys want to come here to sit in their hotel rooms and spend time making online hookups? I really don't think that many will. So no, I don't believe Thailand will be the same when it comes to P4 P. Far from it.

[QUOTE=Gargano19;2445136] Now I have 6 regulars (4 pre-covid haha) and I only used to meet 2 out of those 4 every week. Other 2 were twice a month. Now I have extra 2, which makes it complicated. Either someone will gets cut out of my list or I will meet them more because of post-covid restraint service.[/QUOTE]I'm impressed with your number of regulars. Seems like you put in the work. Are these from the sugar sites?

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;2445285]Put in restrictions that make it very difficult for GoGos, oilies, etc to open. Restrictions pertaining to cleanliness, social distancing, etc. All the while making it virtually impossible for these businesses to continue.[/QUOTE]This would go for regular massage parlors, discos, and normal bars as well then right? Afterall, how would they differentiate?

I have never been to Thailand but have been following this thread for awhile now. Some very insightful responses here.

I too believe this will have a huge impact on Intl mongering for the short long term if that makes sense. Let's call that a year from now at the very least UNLESS some breakthrough happens. I do also think countries that openly flaunt red-light areas may come under international scrutiny to abide by certain global health codes or face ecomonic sanctions.

Mongering will still exist but more underground and geared towards discreet escort semi pro type situations. A more personal level would be the upside.

Health checks upon landing on foreign soil and maybe more extensive than expected?

These are all opinions obviously. I truly hope that I am wrong with all of these predictions.

I am craving a good mongering trip right about now.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;2445285]I think you might be overlooking the fact that Thai people really dislike the farang P4 P scene and would like to see it gone. Sadly we don't fish in the same pond as the locals and for the most part are not welcome there.[/QUOTE]I'm certainly not an expert in Thai culture, but I expect something different. When it is again safe to travel, many farang punters won't travel because they have less money than prior years due to not working for quite some time. Fewer P4P tourists will be arriving. Meanwhile, many Thai hospitality businesses will have gone a long time without income and they will be eager for just about any source of money. The industry will not recover immediately when safe to travel, but we will be welcome to spend our money in the same kinds of ways that we did pre-COVID19.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;2445285]I think you might be overlooking the fact that Thai people really dislike the farang P4 P scene and would like to see it gone. Sadly we don't fish in the same pond as the locals and for the most part are not welcome there. If we did, we'd have no worry about venues being pressured. This is the perfect opportunity for the authorities to make it so difficult for these businesses to operate that most just shut. That is the Thai way. Don't go after things directly, do it in an indirect manner.
.........
So no, I don't believe Thailand will be the same when it comes to P4 P. Far from it.[/QUOTE]I have heard the Thai authorities wants to close these places but I don't think it's practical. Will anyone come to Thailand if they close NPE, WS or cowboy? Yes I am expecting these to stay close by August.

"Thailand will be same" like pre-covid, well that's subjective. Places change and I'm sure somethings will change, maybe those who Monger here regularly notice the difference but those who come 1-2 times a year, for them it won't matter much. Asians, where will they go, South America, Eastern Europe? They will still come to Thailand and spend huge money in gogos like before. So, "it won't be same" ie very subjective to the person in question.

[QUOTE=Gargano19;2445316]I have heard the Thai authorities wants to close these places but I don't think it's practical. Will anyone come to Thailand if they close NPE, WS or cowboy? Yes I am expecting these to stay close by August.[/QUOTE]When I have been in a plane to and from Thailand it has never been full of mongers. When I have been at immigration coming into or leaving out of Thailand it has never been full of mongers. When I have been in the lobby of Suvarnabhumi it has never been full of mongers. When I see all these double decker tour buses they are never full of mongers. Maybe 1% mongers come to Thailand and 99% of everybody else. So what, if the 1% never comes back? And of that 1% how many actually go to Nana, Walking Street, Cowboy, Patpong, Bangla? The game is on the web now.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2445319]...
Maybe 1% mongers come to Thailand and 99% of everybody else.
...[/QUOTE]You know, the question I have asked myself many times over the years is why DO these non mongers spend the money, fly so many hours and go through the language and culture hassles to come to Thailand.

I get that vacationing families come to sight see, check out the Grand Palace, gawk at a temple or two, eyeball some amazing shopping malls and such. Maybe a trip to the crocodile farm, elephant ride and the floating market. But you can check all those boxes in 2 days. Then what?

I understand Bangkok is usually the top #1 or #2 visited city on Earth, usually competing with London for the top spot. But isn't much of that the result of it being a major airport hub pass through city? And many people who are on their way to another Asian destination decide, what the hell, might as well stay a night or two in Bangkok as long as I need to fly in anyway? And for that reason as well there might be business opportunities or meetings here.

Seriously, I can't think of one reason I would recommend a single man or a group of single men to fly 24+ hours on a plane to get to Bangkok or Thailand in general if it weren't for the girls and P4P action here. To shop in fabulous malls? Ride an elephant? Feed a crocodile frozen chicken parts? Visit a temple? You can do that stuff anywhere. IF you would even want to, that is. Why bother to go all the way to Thailand to do it other than to say you did?

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2445294]This would go for regular massage parlors, discos, and normal bars as well then right? Afterall, how would they differentiate?[/QUOTE]For oilies it would be simple, cleaning requirements for wet areas, sheets on the bed, procedures to clean the room, perhaps removing the doors and making them replace them with curtains. Sitting with customers in a GoGo could be restricted by social distancing rules in the short term, just enough to make it tough to get customers.

[QUOTE=Gargano19;2445316]I have heard the Thai authorities wants to close these places but I don't think it's practical. Will anyone come to Thailand if they close NPE, WS or cowboy? Yes I am expecting these to stay close by August.

"Thailand will be same" like pre-covid, well that's subjective. Places change and I'm sure somethings will change, maybe those who Monger here regularly notice the difference but those who come 1-2 times a year, for them it won't matter much. Asians, where will they go, South America, Eastern Europe? They will still come to Thailand and spend huge money in gogos like before. So, "it won't be same" ie very subjective to the person in question.[/QUOTE]The number of sex tourists has been declining for years. It is a drop in the bucket and the loss of those tourists will not effect the overall tourist economy in most places, with Pattaya being the possible exception, but even then there are vast numbers of tourists in Pattaya who are not looking for P4 P. 20 years ago in Pattaya, that was different. It was basically just mongers.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2445331]You know, the question I have asked myself many times over the years is why DO these non mongers spend the money, fly so many hours and go through the language and culture hassles to come to Thailand.[/QUOTE]A question not directly related to this. Do you know what makes the Q1 Sukhumvit condo so expensive? It is the high rise connected to Nana BTS station. I think the condo is in the million USD range.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;2445332]For oilies it would be simple, cleaning requirements for wet areas, sheets on the bed, procedures to clean the room, perhaps removing the doors and making them replace them with curtains. Sitting with customers in a GoGo could be restricted by social distancing rules in the short term, just enough to make it tough to get customers.[/QUOTE]Wouldn't that kill the regular massage places and spas too?

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;2445333]The number of sex tourists has been declining for years. It is a drop in the bucket and the loss of those tourists will not effect the overall tourist economy in most places, with Pattaya being the possible exception, but even then there are vast numbers of tourists in Pattaya who are not looking for P4 P. 20 years ago in Pattaya, that was different. It was basically just mongers.[/QUOTE]I would agree mongers who come to play as a percentage of overall tourists has fallen but I feel the sex industry is still a significant component of the hospitality segment. Estimates of the numbers of Thais employed or free lancing in the business vary widely but it certainly runs into the hundreds of thousands. Pattaya may not look like the old days as it transformed from a fishing village to an destination for GI'S on leave but I would hazard a guess there are more girls working there now than 20 years ago.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;2445283] and just not having as much disposable income for a time. [/QUOTE]Yes and no. In France we realize that there are 55 billion euros in savings since the beginning of the confinement because people have not been able to spend their money. The government hopes that this financial windfall can be reinvested in the country to restart the economy.

It is also one of the reasons why countries around the world cannot miss the start of the recovery (or let other countries pass before them) when it takes place, otherwise they will miss spending.

[QUOTE=Nounce;2445336]A question not directly related to this. Do you know what makes the Q1 Sukhumvit condo so expensive? It is the high rise connected to Nana BTS station. I think the condo is in the million USD range.[/QUOTE]Yes, and I don't think it is a coincidence that the first two major intersections of the skytrain and subway just happen to be a few minutes' walk from the oldest and biggest tourist go-go bar and red light districts in the city. Which then gave reason to building all those highrise condos, office buildings and shopping malls in the same areas.

I know that was then and this is now. Maybe all those businesses built up around and as close to the bars and brothels as they could get can continue on auto pilot going forward.

But, personally, I would be kind of pissed if I'd spent a million USD or more to live smack dab at BTS Nana and 3 months later all the go-go bars and beer bars around the corner and right down the street disappeared. I mean, Terminal 21 Mall is nice and Monsoon Soi 8 is a fine restaurant and all that. The Tavern on Soi 4 might have the best pancakes and bacon breakfast around. But a million USD to be so close to them?

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2445345]


But, personally, I would be kind of pissed if I'd spent a million USD or more to livemack dab at BTS Nana and 3 months later all the go-go bars and beer bars around the corner and right down the street disappeared. I mean, Terminal 21 Mall is nice and Monsoon Soi 8 is a fine restaurant and all that. The Tavern on Soi 4 might have the best pancakes and bacon breakfast around. But a million USD to be so close to them?[/QUOTE]Haha, that is what I am thinking. Thanks.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2445331]Seriously, I can't think of one reason I would recommend a single man or a group of single men to fly 24+ hours on a plane to get to Bangkok or Thailand in general if it weren't for the girls and P4P action here.[/QUOTE]I am one of those 24+ hours away guys. A few reasons I can think of:

1) Weather: Thailand is among the warmest places on earth in January and February. 95 degrees F is mighty appealing when it is zero degrees F with lots of snow back home.

2) Cost: while not the bargain it used to be Thailand is still relatively inexpensive, especially for a retiree planning a lengthy holiday.

3) Variety: Thailand is likely far different culturally than home base. Think Thai massages and Thai food.

4) The journey: I have only taken flights to BKK in J and F (using airline miles) so spending time in premium cabins and airport lounges makes the time in transit an event unto itself.

That said: without an active P4 P scene Thailand loses most of its appeal for me.

SL.

[QUOTE=Sunlover2;2445351]That said: without an active P4 P scene Thailand loses most of its appeal for me.

SL.[/QUOTE]GoGos may disappear but I am the opposite of many here and don't drink, don't like to talk shit in bars and have been in 6 strip clubs / gogos in my life and would consider maybe going back to one of them. I don't think there will be any less P4P it will just be in a different format.

Just another non-factual opinion?

Based on my opinion about Thailand, the government, culture, and economy I more in the camp things will retract how far is anyone guess? When you look at what the Virus has done to the USA And its economy compare it to Thailand which years ago I read something like 20% of the population actually pay taxes and that is being very liberal. Living here especially in Pattaya from my experience and environment I feel that is a pretty accurate assessment that the majority are poor and this Virus situation has really brought out how poor.

When it comes to the GoGo which I'm a big fan I for some time felt there needed to be some type of correction and this Virus is doing just that. I kind of sense where it was going when foreigners started to group and pool their money to try to monopolize the business especially in Pattaya. I don't have a problem with paying for the service if it is based on normal economics things get more expensive to operate but many of the problems were self-induced in my opinion by these ownerships justifying prices by placing labels like Models, Agency then with the decline of service personally I'm not the type that expects out of the world experience but having to pay premium money and only get attitude and head games?

Even before the Virus many GoGo's owners had no business being in business and was a tick away from closing especially in Pattaya. This should put those wannabes out for good it will be survival of the fittest and that should be in my estimation 30% fewer clubs the free market will take hold and produce a new or old product? That product if the owners are smart will to cut their overhead and hopefully reset the BF to something more realistic since fewer club more girls hopefully better attitude and fewer mind games.

Getting to my real point? With the shattered economy worldwide the one group that will benefit are the ex-pats and retirees of the world who have steady resources and time to travel. Think about it? It will take at least the rest of the year for those still working to get back on track and that includes the Koreans, Japanese, Chinese even Indians people seem to forget all the blame of high prices, girls spoiled seem to come from the first 3 groups without them many of the ex-pats have the place to themselves until things get back to normal?

Once things start to open back up again and it will be soon, of course, being Thailand the girls returning are going to think business as usual but the customer base isn't going to be there with a monkey see monkey do society no customers isn't going to pay the bills so once they see taking less is better than getting nothing it will be monkey see monkey do? It can backfire those being here and stuck once open are so hard up they are willing to pay whatever if that is the case then this time around don't blame the Asians or 2-week millionaires.

Now are prices going back to 1000 LT for GoGo girls dream on! Prices will come down service is no guarantee but I'm putting my money on guys like Mr. Enternational, Eih Tooms, Monkey Paw, other regulars to reset things back a bit for a year at least? Look up not down joy is coming?

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2445331]Seriously, I can't think of one reason I would recommend a single man or a group of single men to fly 24+ hours on a plane to get to Bangkok or Thailand in general if it weren't for the girls and P4P action here. To shop in fabulous malls? Ride an elephant? Feed a crocodile frozen chicken parts? Visit a temple? You can do that stuff anywhere. IF you would even want to, that is. Why bother to go all the way to Thailand to do it other than to say you did?[/QUOTE]Most people that I know who come to Thailand as tourists have Phuket/Phi Phi as number 1, elephant farm as number 2, and food as number 3. They never say anything about any temples or Grand Palace or anything about Bangkok for that matter. And to be fair, you can fuck chicks anywhere as well; no need to fly 24 hours for that either.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2445393]Most people that I know who come to Thailand as tourists have Phuket/Phi Phi as number 1, elephant farm as number 2, and food as number 3. They never say anything about any temples or Grand Palace or anything about Bangkok for that matter. And to be fair, you can fuck chicks anywhere as well; no need to fly 24 hours for that either.[/QUOTE]Well, I will be 67 years old soon. This week as it is virtually every week I need to figure out which slim, fit, cute, clean, non skanky, non drugged out, sweet demeanor, shaved pussy 20 something year old Thai girl I will agree to have come stay with me all night for Real Sex or a CIM (usually + Swallow) Blowjob or both and which night for less than $75 USD per Long Time and often much less than $60 USD in the heart of what ordinarily is a ridiculously comfortable major city.

Granted, the fact that I live here contributes to my dilemma in choosing among a half dozen different girls off the top of my head for which night and in which order. But I know holiday guys, old ones like me, who come here for a week or two at a time and they are often faced with the same dilemma within a day or two.

I can't say any of us think the action we get and the type of girls we get it with anywhere other than perhaps 1-2 other places on Earth, and certainly not our home countries, is anywhere near what we get in Bangkok.

Could we fuck chicks anywhere? Sure. But that's like saying we could sit in a shopping cart and get pushed around a gravel driveway anywhere. Or we could go to Disney World at a super discount price for a somewhat better amusement park experience 😁.

How many of you guys would return to Bangkok / Pattaya if there were no more bars, gogo bars, FL's, or FS massage joints. Online sex like TF still available but not at a low enough price to offset your plane tickets and hotel.

For me I would never return to Pattaya. There would be no reason to. Food is certainly not better than where I live and there is nothing there that would appeal to me as a tourist that I would say I miss and need to see again. Bangkok on the other hand I would return to a month each year. It's a vibrant big city and the variety of quality restaurants there is endless. I would miss places like Jatujak Market and the malls there are huge and decent to walk around in.

As I've been away from Thailand for a while now due to COVID I miss my regular girls but surprisingly am not missing much else. Once the COVID ends my first trip will be to the Germany FKK clubs before Thailand. Now whether or not the Germany FKK clubs will ever reopen again is another debate.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2445319]When I have been in a plane to and from Thailand it has never been full of mongers. When I have been at immigration coming into or leaving out of Thailand it has never been full of mongers. When I have been in the lobby of Suvarnabhumi it has never been full of mongers. When I see all these double decker tour buses they are never full of mongers. Maybe 1% mongers come to Thailand and 99% of everybody else. So what, if the 1% never comes back? And of that 1% how many actually go to Nana, Walking Street, Cowboy, Patpong, Bangla? The game is on the web now.[/QUOTE]None of us have actual number of what percentage of tourists come here are mongers. But it's way higher than 1%. Like ET said, there's no point it coming to Thailand, Bangkok / pattaya which are polluted af and have huge traffic problem. There are way more exotic locations just around Thailand, both from cultural and scenery perspective.

Even if 5-8% of people who visit Thailand are mongers, they spend a shit tone of money. We regulars have a limit usually how much we want to spend, because we pick 3-7 girls every week. Tourists especially Koreans / Japs who come here for week or two, have no such limits. They spend 10 k in club, then 10 k in next. LOL. Closing the reasons they come here makes no sense. And don't forget this is all black money, for which there are many places built to launder the money (uhh Optical shops which are fuckin everywhere), closing those would also affect these. Government would never close such establishments unless riding an elephant and visiting crocodile park also start charging BF and LDs worth 5 k.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2445399]Well, I will be 67 years old soon. This week as it is virtually every week I need to figure out which slim, fit, cute, clean, non skanky, non drugged out, sweet demeanor, shaved pussy 20 something year old Thai girl I will agree to have come stay with me all night for Real Sex or a CIM (usually + Swallow) Blowjob or both and which night for less than $75 USD per Long Time and often much less than $60 USD in the heart of what ordinarily is a ridiculously comfortable major city.

Granted, the fact that I live here contributes to my dilemma in choosing among a half dozen different girls off the top of my head for which night and in which order. But I know holiday guys, old ones like me, who come here for a week or two at a time and they are often faced with the same dilemma within a day or two.

I can't say any of us think the action we get and the type of girls we get it with anywhere other than perhaps 1-2 other places on Earth, and certainly not our home countries, is anywhere near what we get in Bangkok.

Could we fuck chicks anywhere? Sure. But that's like saying we could sit in a shopping cart and get pushed around a gravel driveway anywhere. Or we could go to Disney World at a super discount price for a somewhat better amusement park experience 😁.[/QUOTE]Well, I am 79 and 80 in a few months. I do all my playing in China. Lived in BK during Nam, different time then. I go to China and have a regular set up for the night I arrive, another regular for the next night, then out to KTV on Saturday night and pick a new one or even two. Then go from there to figure out who, when, where. Work schedule and business meetings and dinners have to be in the schedule, but never lonely.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2445400]How many of you guys would return to Bangkok / Pattaya if there were no more bars, gogo bars, FL's, or FS massage joints. Online sex like TF still available but not at a low enough price to offset your plane tickets and hotel.[/QUOTE]The only reason I appreciate Pattaya is the number and ease of finding girls in the gogos, bars and massage shops.

What will remain of Pattaya if they are destroyed? A sad city with buildings with swimming pools and fitness rooms with little interest even for passing tourists. In 1 day maximum I toured tourist attractions around. The beach is not attractive and is polluted, even activities such as diving are not attractive, everything that made the charm of Pattaya from the time when it was still a fishing village has been re-urbanized in any way.

Pattaya's urban plan was to concrete everywhere, difficult to find few places to relax, even the beach promenade is nondescript. Shopping centers have no interest, as long as going to spend my holidays in a city in Asia I prefer 100 times more Hong Kong or Singapore.

If I project myself only as a family vacationer, it's not in a city like where I will spend my vacation. Quite to come in the tropics, I prefer to go to places with beaches and nature that make me dream and really change my scenery.

*There are many much better places in Thailand (Phuket, Koh Tao, Koh Samet, Krabi.), the Philippines or elsewhere.

As for replacing them with Tinder or Thaifriendly, the choice is most often disappointing, as the photos and descriptions often do not correspond to reality.

[QUOTE=Gargano19;2445401]None of us have actual number of what percentage of tourists come here are mongers. But it's way higher than 1%.[/QUOTE]But it is easy to estimate. My figure was based on being on plenty of flights in and out of Bangkok. Look around. The plane holds 150 to 200 people. I am one monger. Sometimes there are 1 or 2 more at best. The rest of the people are mostly families and young couples. Even older couples. There may be some single young ladies coming home to see family. A couple of businessmen.

3 mongers/150 people= 2%. It sure as heck is not 20%, 10%, or even 5% for that matter. What is the makeup of people on the flights other people are on?

[QUOTE=Gargano19;2445401]None of us have actual number of what percentage of tourists come here are mongers. But it's way higher than 1%. Like ET said, there's no point it coming to Thailand, Bangkok / pattaya which are polluted af and have huge traffic problem. There are way more exotic locations just around Thailand, both from cultural and scenery perspective.[/QUOTE]If the entertainment places close, it is likely that Korean, Japanese, Indian and Farang singles will never return.

Tourist buses (Chinese, others, etc.), even if they are numerous, probably not stay more than one maybe two days in Pattaya. They do parasailing and floating bananas once during the day and visit its sulphurous reputation even if they do not fit in the gogos. Walking and taking selfies in Walking Street to post them on Facebook or Instagram is enough for them. And they go on in Thailand. If WS no longer exists, the interest of the city does not exist either.

I would be curious to see the business plan that bets only on family tourists in Pattaya.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2445400].............. Once the COVID ends my first trip will be to the Germany FKK clubs before Thailand. Now whether or not the Germany FKK clubs will ever reopen again is another debate.[/QUOTE]I prefer German FKKs over all else but I don't see them opening anytime in the near or even not so near future. Germans are very organized and disciplined and businesses will be opened on a slow phased basis with FKKs and brothels being the very last. Thailand's flesh pots will be up and running long before Germany's.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2445341]I would agree mongers who come to play as a percentage of overall tourists has fallen but I feel the sex industry is still a significant component of the hospitality segment. Estimates of the numbers of Thais employed or free lancing in the business vary widely but it certainly runs into the hundreds of thousands. Pattaya may not look like the old days as it transformed from a fishing village to an destination for GI'S on leave but I would hazard a guess there are more girls working there now than 20 years ago.[/QUOTE]Speaking of Pattaya as fishing village, I was there in the middle 60's. Nothing there! Stayed at the Chairman of the Thai Senate's home. The only bar I remember was up on a hill (If you were standing on the beach, back to the sea, it was up on the hill to the left but not close. But of course, after 60 years my memory my not be perfect. I remember there was talk of some retired Air Force Officer building a Hotel.

[QUOTE=Pimpampoumpipo;2445421]If the entertainment places close, it is likely that Korean, Japanese, Indian and Farang singles will never return.
[/QUOTE]100% correct. If ever the entertainment places close down, asians, indiams, Farangs have no point to come. There will be Indian families who will come during summer break of their kids because of ease of coming here, there will very old Chinese / Japs group tours who will still come for sake of holiday to new country which is not far and still somewhat culturally similar. Farangs I see no point for them to come here, unless they want to teach English LOL.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2445414]But it is easy to estimate. My figure was based on being on plenty of flights in and out of Bangkok. Look around. The plane holds 150 to 200 people. I am one monger. Sometimes there are 1 or 2 more at best. The rest of the people are mostly families and young couples. Even older couples. There may be some single young ladies coming home to see family. A couple of businessmen.

3 mongers/150 people= 2%. It sure as heck is not 20%, 10%, or even 5% for that matter. What is the makeup of people on the flights other people are on?[/QUOTE]Bangkok is also a very important air transit platform. For other places in Thailand or elsewhere in Asia or the Pacific. Not all passengers on a flight to Bangkok go to Pattaya finaly. Pattaya is a destination with a particular and specific theme. There may be a greater representation of men who come alone than in other places. I think 2% is a largely underestimated proportion. It is true that it is difficult to establish this ratio. But a fairer calculation, even an approximate one, would be more credible for example by taking the number of single men in hotels and condos at Pattaya. If the 3 mongers of all the planes arriving at BKK go to Pattaya and the other passengers in another place we will quickly have a large concentration of mongers in the same place. And there I think that their proportion would be very much higher than in an airplane.

Fair calculation based on personal observation :)

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2445414]But it is easy to estimate. My figure was based on being on plenty of flights in and out of Bangkok. Look around. The plane holds 150 to 200 people. I am one monger. Sometimes there are 1 or 2 more at best. The rest of the people are mostly families and young couples. Even older couples. There may be some single young ladies coming home to see family. A couple of businessmen.

3 mongers/150 people= 2%. It sure as heck is not 20%, 10%, or even 5% for that matter. What is the makeup of people on the flights other people are on?[/QUOTE]3 mongers /150? Few of my flights.

1. From Tokyo to bkk, plane was full of young guys (early 20's to late) and old alone dudes. I'd say 30-40%. And I have seen that ratio a few times.

2. From Delhi to bkk, lots of groups of guys, and ofcourse families too. But still not 3 out of 150, not even close.

3. Singapore and Hong Kong where I have travelled a lot last year, planes are full of Single man (not with anyone, don't know about their relationship status). I'd say 30%. Now how many of them are mongers and how many are here for business reasons (and both ofcourse), no one can tell by just looks.

4. Berlin, all they talk about in plane is about nana and walking street LOL, don't get me started. Obviously exaggerating about "all", but you got my point.

Never been to middle east, so can't comment about there flight demographics, bur maybe others can shed some light.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2445331]You know, the question I have asked myself many times over the years is why DO these non mongers spend the money, fly so many hours and go through the language and culture hassles to come to Thailand.

I get that vacationing families come to sight see, check out the Grand Palace, gawk at a temple or two, eyeball some amazing shopping malls and such. Maybe a trip to the crocodile farm, elephant ride and the floating market. But you can check all those boxes in 2 days. Then what?

I understand Bangkok is usually the top #1 or #2 visited city on Earth, usually competing with London for the top spot. But isn't much of that the result of it being a major airport hub pass through city? And many people who are on their way to another Asian destination decide, what the hell, might as well stay a night or two in Bangkok as long as I need to fly in anyway? And for that reason as well there might be business opportunities or meetings here.

Seriously, I can't think of one reason I would recommend a single man or a group of single men to fly 24+ hours on a plane to get to Bangkok or Thailand in general if it weren't for the girls and P4P action here. To shop in fabulous malls? Ride an elephant? Feed a crocodile frozen chicken parts? Visit a temple? You can do that stuff anywhere. IF you would even want to, that is. Why bother to go all the way to Thailand to do it other than to say you did?[/QUOTE]I remember about 10 years ago when China had a very active P4 P scene. It was centered in southern China in CP and CA. Mostly KTV places with hundreds of girls to choose from. Massage places (not my preference) and almost anything else you can imagine, but not so much "in your face" as Thailand. However it was quite an experience that I got to do a couple of times before the new president and crackdown. The cities were booming, taxi's going night and day, hundreds of restaurants, close golf courses, streets full of people night and day. In other words a real fun time! Then the crack down-streets empty--Restaurants closed--no taxi's running around--hotels empty--in other words, DEAD. It could happen to Thailand also.

[QUOTE=Turgid;2445423]I prefer German FKKs over all else but I don't see them opening anytime in the near or even not so near future. Germans are very organized and disciplined and businesses will be opened on a slow phased basis with FKKs and brothels being the very last. Thailand's flesh pots will be up and running long before Germany's.[/QUOTE]I went an FKK once, not my thing! Yes the germans are very organized! Achtung! You will get hard now! Place tool here! Pump 27 1/2 times! Finish! Pay! Next! (not true but my imagination says it could be).

[QUOTE=MrClen;2445424]Speaking of Pattaya as fishing village, I was there in the middle 60's. Nothing there! Stayed at the Chairman of the Thai Senate's home. The only bar I remember was up on a hill (If you were standing on the beach, back to the sea, it was up on the hill to the left but not close. But of course, after 60 years my memory my not be perfect. I remember there was talk of some retired Air Force Officer building a Hotel.[/QUOTE]I often see pictures and clips of Pattaya of what it was like in the '60's. It looked very quiet and serene for a fishing village. All hell broke loose when servicemen started going to Pattaya for R&R. I wonder who was the guy or guys who started that ball rolling?. Mind you, this was way before my time. I was born in '67.

[QUOTE=MrClen;2445434]I remember about 10 years ago when China had a very active P4 P scene. It was centered in southern China in CP and CA. Mostly KTV places with hundreds of girls to choose from. Massage places (not my preference) and almost anything else you can imagine, but not so much "in your face" as Thailand. However it was quite an experience that I got to do a couple of times before the new president and crackdown. The cities were booming, taxi's going night and day, hundreds of restaurants, close golf courses, streets full of people night and day. In other words a real fun time! Then the crack down-streets empty--Restaurants closed--no taxi's running around--hotels empty--in other words, DEAD. It could happen to Thailand also.[/QUOTE]Well China was never known as mongering location even 10-20 years ago. China always had many other growing sectors, and tourism was never China's focus, even when it hosted Olympics. Thailand is still very dependent on tourism, mongering or non-mongering, they would never do something similar.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2445319]When I have been in a plane to and from Thailand it has never been full of mongers... Maybe 1% mongers come to Thailand and 99% of everybody else. [/QUOTE]

Fully agree with that. For those who want to see what a plane full of mongers actually looks like, check out the Cebu Pacific flight from Bangkok to Clark (Angeles City). I took it a few years back and it was over 50% obvious mongers. No flight to Thailand I ever took (regional or long-haul) has ever been anywhere close, and 1% is a reasonable estimate, maybe 2% to be generous.

It's unsurprising people on this site would overestimate the number and importance of mongers (birds of a feather), but these days we're a drop in the bucket for the Thai tourism numbers and spending. As Goatscrot said, maybe significant to Pattaya, but not anywhere else.

[QUOTE=MrClen;2445436]I went an FKK once, not my thing! Yes the germans are very organized! Achtung! You will get hard now! Place tool here! Pump 27 1/2 times! Finish! Pay! Next! (not true but my imagination says it could be).[/QUOTE]In Mexico, you've a guy with a baseball bat bangs on the door to tell you your time is up.

[QUOTE=MrClen;2445434]I remember about 10 years ago when China had a very active P4 P scene. It was centered in southern China in CP and CA. Mostly KTV places with hundreds of girls to choose from. Massage places (not my preference) and almost anything else you can imagine, but not so much "in your face" as Thailand. However it was quite an experience that I got to do a couple of times before the new president and crackdown. The cities were booming, taxi's going night and day, hundreds of restaurants, close golf courses, streets full of people night and day. In other words a real fun time! Then the crack down-streets empty--Restaurants closed--no taxi's running around--hotels empty--in other words, DEAD. It could happen to Thailand also.[/QUOTE]I always loved my business trips to China in the early 2000's for that reason. Every night I would have at least one hot young Chinese (or Mongolian) girl entertain me back then. Hell, they lined up in the streets looking for guys. Girls would knock on my hotel room door asking if I wanted company and / or would call to my room asking if they could join me. I did learn that if I tell the concierge I don't want the girls to randomly call or come up, the girls would stop bothering me. So obviously the girls were going through the concierge to find out where the single guys were staying. There was no need for that, since there were always lots of girls standing around outside the hotel willing to come to my room. And this was in every city I stayed in China, not just one.

But even back in the early 2000's, there were plenty of Chinese girls who would refuse to go to my hotel. They claimed the hotel would take their name and report it to the government. And that they would be listed as a hooker and would not be able to get a visa to travel outside China after that. I never knew if that was true or if perhaps the hotel was demanding a cut from the girl. Regardless, when they refused to go to my hotel, I would often agree to go to the girl's apartments. (The hard core hookers didn't seem to mind, it was the girls I would meet around town who wouldn't go to my hotel.) Those were some interesting shags. Very GFE. The girls were always so proud to show me their place. Many times I actually spent the night at their little apartment rather than returning to my nice 5 star hotel for the night. Never once was I robbed by the girls who took me to their apartment, nor did I have any troubles. However, I had to watch my belongings with the girls who visited my hotel room. Young, mainland Chinese girls have the best skin on their body of any girls I've been with anywhere in the world. I don't think they have the best faces, but their skin is great.

I haven't been to China since around 2008, but I did go there often in the early 2000's. As far as a mongering spot, it was absolutely awesome. The local karaoke bars were fun as hell. I loved going with a group of local guys from the office and pick a girl each to go into the karaoke room. The games the girls played were good fun. For example, they all wore these outfits with short skirts. They would put a towel over your head, then one by one they take off their underwear, position their pussy over your face, and raise the towel so you can see their pussy. All of the girls do that, then you have to guess which girl was number 1, 2, 3, 4, etc. And they had lots of games like that. The more expensive karaokes like that one in the Sheraton in Beijing (passions), were nowhere near as fun as the down market karaokes, but I liked Passions too since the girls were stunning. The girls working at Passions all drove luxury cars, so they were raking in the bucks. I do hear it's completely changed and is not fun anymore. Damn shame.

Some hotels in Bangkok do not allow working girls inside the hotel, so it's not impossible for Thailand to also get rid of the fun. Enjoy it while it lasts!

[QUOTE=PedroMorales;2445452]In Mexico, you've a guy with a baseball bat bangs on the door to tell you your time is up.[/QUOTE]I experienced the same thing in Playa del Carmen. At the end of the 30 minutes that I had paid a loudspeaker went off in the room to announce that the session was over ^^ (exactly 30 ' not 1 minute more)

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2445456]I always loved my business trips to China in the early 2000's for that reason. Every night I would have at least one hot young Chinese (or Mongolian) girl entertain me back then. Hell, they lined up in the streets looking for guys. Girls would knock on my hotel room door asking if I wanted company and / or would call to my room asking if they could join me. I did learn that if I tell the concierge I don't want the girls to randomly call or come up, the girls would stop bothering me. So obviously the girls were going through the concierge to find out where the single guys were staying. There was no need for that, since there were always lots of girls standing around outside the hotel willing to come to my room. And this was in every city I stayed in China, not just one.

But even back in the early 2000's, there were plenty of Chinese girls who would refuse to go to my hotel. They claimed the hotel would take their name and report it to the government. And that they would be listed as a hooker and would not be able to get a visa to travel outside China after that. I never knew if that was true or if perhaps the hotel was demanding a cut from the girl. Regardless, when they refused to go to my hotel, I would often agree to go to the girl's apartments. (The hard core hookers didn't seem to mind, it was the girls I would meet around town who wouldn't go to my hotel.) Those were some interesting shags. Very GFE. The girls were always so proud to show me their place. Many times I actually spent the night at their little apartment rather than returning to my nice 5 star hotel for the night. Never once was I robbed by the girls who took me to their apartment, nor did I have any troubles. However, I had to watch my belongings with the girls who visited my hotel room. Young, mainland Chinese girls have the best skin on their body of any girls I've been with anywhere in the world. I don't think they have the best faces, but their skin is great.

I haven't been to China since around 2008, but I did go there often in the early 2000's. As far as a mongering spot, it was absolutely awesome. The local karaoke bars were fun as hell. I loved going with a group of local guys from the office and pick a girl each to go into the karaoke room. The games the girls played were good fun. For example, they all wore these outfits with short skirts. They would put a towel over your head, then one by one they take off their underwear, position their pussy over your face, and raise the towel so you can see their pussy. All of the girls do that, then you have to guess which girl was number 1, 2, 3, 4, etc. And they had lots of games like that. The more expensive karaokes like that one in the Sheraton in Beijing (passions), were nowhere near as fun as the down market karaokes, but I liked Passions too since the girls were stunning. The girls working at Passions all drove luxury cars, so they were raking in the bucks. I do hear it's completely changed and is not fun anymore. Damn shame.

Some hotels in Bangkok do not allow working girls inside the hotel, so it's not impossible for Thailand to also get rid of the fun. Enjoy it while it lasts![/QUOTE]Smoothy you dog! Your China experiences sound great. I was fortunate to visit ChangPing in 2011 and Big Swingin Dave showed me around and made sure I was set up good in the various high end KTV's where otherwise I might not have ventured and stuck to the saunas instead. All I can say now is: It was an amazing side trip. So many hot Chinese girls & overflowing Flower Streets. Heaven Above! 555. I wish I could go back in time and do it again and again, but you can't. I have never been anywhere like it or even close to it before or since.

Now I really like Macau because that is where you can still do top quality Chinese girls in the better saunas (at unfortunately astronomical prices), oh well nothing is perfect, but Macau never held a candle to ChangPing in it's former glory days. And then one day the Chinese Communist Government said enough / no more and ChangPing was all over in a heartbeat. Moral of the story: appreciate what you have because everything can change overnight. I really dig tall, thin, light skin Chinese girls. They are very different from Thai girls in body and personality. I have no idea if the Macau saunas will ever reopen after Wuhan. If they are over too, that's it for China and all its satellites and colonies as far as I am concerned. I will never go back. HKG was already on my avoid list for the last 5 years and forget about Shanghai.

[QUOTE=MrClen;2445436]I went an FKK once, not my thing! Yes the germans are very organized! Achtung! You will get hard now! Place tool here! Pump 27 1/2 times! Finish! Pay! Next! (not true but my imagination says it could be).[/QUOTE]Hahaha, you'd be surprised the best fraulein can competently compete in the sack with even the horniest Brazilian garotas.

With regards to China I was fortunate enough to have experienced the famed red rope at 99 in Shanghai. I think they stopped offering it circa 2009. The demise of Chang Ping and Buenos Aires were great blows to me.

[QUOTE=MrClen;2445424]Speaking of Pattaya as fishing village, I was there in the middle 60's. Nothing there! Stayed at the Chairman of the Thai Senate's home. The only bar I remember was up on a hill (If you were standing on the beach, back to the sea, it was up on the hill to the left but not close. But of course, after 60 years my memory my not be perfect. I remember there was talk of some retired Air Force Officer building a Hotel.[/QUOTE]When I first started going to Thailand never went near Pattaya. Only Bangkok. Bars filled with nice girls, cheap barfine and they aim to please. One day walking around found a very pretty girl who worked in a bank who became my GF for a few years. We went to many countries together and had a great time.

She asked me if I ever went to Pattaya. Replied negative we made plans. Met a newly married European couple spending their honeymoon at the buffet breakfast and we did some touristy things together. In the evening they suggested we go to walking street. That was my first introduction to literally hundreds of girls vying to attract men. My GF was amused although she knew about the bars in BKK. But at that time there were no girls soliciting on the sidewalk. European honeymoon couple took all this in their stride although the girl complained that they chose the wrong location for their honeymoon.

After I broke up with my GF because of her insistence that we marry Pattaya became my favorite.

[QUOTE=Crocodilexp;2445448]Fully agree with that. For those who want to see what a plane full of mongers actually looks like, check out the Cebu Pacific flight from Bangkok to Clark (Angeles City). I took it a few years back and it was over 50% obvious mongers. No flight to Thailand I ever took (regional or long-haul) has ever been anywhere close, and 1% is a reasonable estimate, maybe 2% to be generous.

It's unsurprising people on this site would overestimate the number and importance of mongers (birds of a feather), but these days we're a drop in the bucket for the Thai tourism numbers and spending. As Goatscrot said, maybe significant to Pattaya, but not anywhere else.[/QUOTE]I haven't taken a flight into or out of Thailand in about 6 years but I do remember being struck by how few apparent mongers seemed to be on those incoming flights. Then again, there were many flights coming into Thailand from all over the world every hour. And by the time arriving passengers had filtered into the bus/taxi dispatch section, you could always look to your left and right and find guys willing to share a taxi to the same general destination in the lower Sukhumvit area, no problem. Or to Pattaya.

All those obvious mongers flying out of Bangkok on their way to the Philippines must have gotten into Bangkok somehow if not on the particular flights you, Mr. E and I were on.

[QUOTE=MrClen;2445424]Speaking of Pattaya as fishing village, I was there in the middle 60's. Nothing there! Stayed at the Chairman of the Thai Senate's home. The only bar I remember was up on a hill (If you were standing on the beach, back to the sea, it was up on the hill to the left but not close. But of course, after 60 years my memory my not be perfect. I remember there was talk of some retired Air Force Officer building a Hotel.[/QUOTE]You probably remember when Sattahip was a US navy base. It's the Thai Marine base now, and I spent some quality time there as a guest a few years ago. The officer didn't know the history, but he had good bourbon!

Though a very different situation they tried this in Las Vegas 20 years ago in cleaning it up and making it a family destination. It totally failed and they had to rebrand it all "What happens in vegas stays in vegas". However the damage was done. Way less massage places, escorts, and working girls in the casinos. The strip clubs make insane money. I lived there in early 2000's during the transition phase and a cute costa rican girl from Texas would crash at my place while she was in town dancing at spearmint rhino. She worked barley more than 1 weekend a month and was taking in well over 100 k USD and wasn't tricking unless it was more than 1 k, just wasn't worth it to her.

My point is that I don't think you can't shut it down either, but you can damage it beyond anything of interest to most of us on this board. Once it becomes less acceptable and less common it's not that their won't be plenty of SYT out there who would do it, it's just that the channels that would lead them to our beds.

[QUOTE=Pimpampoumpipo;2445421]If the entertainment places close, it is likely that Korean, Japanese, Indian and Farang singles will never return.

Tourist buses (Chinese, others, etc.), even if they are numerous, probably not stay more than one maybe two days in Pattaya. They do parasailing and floating bananas once during the day and visit its sulphurous reputation even if they do not fit in the gogos. Walking and taking selfies in Walking Street to post them on Facebook or Instagram is enough for them. And they go on in Thailand. If WS no longer exists, the interest of the city does not exist either.

I would be curious to see the business plan that bets only on family tourists in Pattaya.[/QUOTE]

I remember about 10 years ago when China had a very active P4P scene. It was centered in southern China in CP and CA. Mostly KTV places with hundreds of girls to choose from. Massage places (not my preference) and almost anything else you can imagine, but not so much "in your face" as Thailand. However it was quite an experience that I got to do a couple of times before the new president and crackdown. The cities were booming, taxi's going night and day, hundreds of restaurants, close golf courses, streets full of people night and day. In other words a real fun time! Then the crack down-streets empty--Restaurants closed--no taxi's running around--hotels empty--in other words, dead. It could happen to Thailand also.

Maybe places like guangdong will re-bloom.

The supply and demand dynamics of the whoor economy has aspects of the game whack-a-mole.

[URL]https://www.businessinsider.com/there-are-42-million-prostitutes-in-the-world-and-heres-where-they-live-2012-1[/URL]

How many mongers are there? 10 per hooker? LOL 100 per hooker? LMAO.

You take a direct flight to Angeles you are with mongers, to you-Tapao, more likely than not you are with fellow mongers, a direct flight to Vegas, Macau you are with gamblers.

I like Macau, the shows make Vegas tolerable, dislike Angeles and can tolerate Pattaya with which I include Jomtien where I hang out whenever I venture thereabouts but these locations have little else to offer other than girls and tables, that's why they exist. Trying to change that is akin to pissing in the wind. If you closed the tables and sent the girls home they would continue no doubt but as a shadow of their former selves.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2444951]That's the best expert advice according to who? To the people who don't give a shit about the world economy and are willing to have lock down for years? If you live in a dream fantasy world, then that is a possibility. But here in the real world, all that will do is cause the 2nd great depression while the corona cases are stretched out ad infinitum. They will not go to zero even with the lock down. People will die of starvation (especially in third world countries), suicide or drug abuse from depression, etc if they can't earn money.

Sweden most likely did it the right way. Get it over and done with as quickly as possible rather than kill the economy and let it go on for years. We will see in the long run.[/QUOTE][QUOTE=Dena0;2444912]A change in our way of life is inexorably dawning upon all of us. At some point in the future <say, under three years , the virus will eventually mutate its way out of our lives. The question is how long will it take and how much of our herd will it cull. As somebody else pointed out in this forum, Sweden is no success story. Until now, the best expert advice seems to be that in the face of the power of exponential contact, the name of the game is social isolation to a point where we reach fourteen consecutive days with zero new cases anywhere in the world. Does not seem likely to happen from what we can see right now.

Having said that, I suspect Natty's pov (which is a mild variant of Trump's pov) will prevail in the short term and as a result, we will likely see another round of surge in the reported cases and the social isolation lockdown process might have to be repeated. Trump's position is hugely influenced by his perception of electoral impact (and to hell with the rest).[/QUOTE]Here's a quote from a Swedish newspaper referring to New York Times:

"In several European countries, data show that around 20-30 percent more people died during the period under. Investigation than normal, the New York Times review shows.

In Spain, 19,700 more deaths were registered than normal during the period 9 March to 5 April, and 12,401. Were confirmed deaths in covid-19. In France, 10,500 more deaths were registered than normal, and 8,059 were cases of covid-19.

Sweden stands out in the magazine's review, with 1,100 more deaths than normal between March 9 and April 12. Compared with 1,160 registered cases of covid-19 during the period."

It does not prove that the Swedish method is good but it shows that the data of deaths related to corona preseted by government in Sweden are accurate. Other countries data may differ as much as 40% from the true amount of covid 19 deaths.

In a month or two there will be reliable data of increase of death to show the real outcome of this pandemic. But when looking at that dataset you have to consider other effects on the number of deaths. For example the lockdown strategies will certainly decrease other causes of unnatural death such as deaths of traffic accidents, deaths in ordinary flu and other contagious diseases, deaths referred to air pollution and maybe also increase of deaths from domestic violence.

[QUOTE=LittleBigMan;2445372]Just another non-factual opinion?

Based on my opinion about Thailand, the government, culture, and economy I more in the camp things will retract how far is anyone guess? When you look at what the Virus has done to the USA And its economy compare it to Thailand which years ago I read something like 20% of the population actually pay taxes and that is being very liberal. Living here especially in Pattaya from my experience and environment I feel that is a pretty accurate assessment that the majority are poor and this Virus situation has really brought out how poor.

When it comes to the GoGo which I'm a big fan I for some time felt there needed to be some type of correction and this Virus is doing just that. I kind of sense where it was going when foreigners started to group and pool their money to try to monopolize the business especially in Pattaya. I don't have a problem with paying for the service if it is based on normal economics things get more expensive to operate but many of the problems were self-induced in my opinion by these ownerships justifying prices by placing labels like Models, Agency then with the decline of service personally I'm not the type that expects out of the world experience but having to pay premium money and only get attitude and head games?.[/QUOTE]Its great to be retired. Its great to have an apartment in Siem Reap. Its great to have money. Open up those borders, or hell, open up the clubs here! I'm an hour away!

This virus story is starting to become completely delusional. Everyday seems like a crazy day.

The virus would have escaped from a poorly managed Wuhan laboratory (which was still considered a conspiracy theory a few days ago), the effects are accumulating and seem much more serious than a simple flu, there is also neuroligic impacts. No vaccine in sight soon and I learn in the newspapers today that there is no vaccine for the 7 known types of human coronavirus. The only vaccines that exist just boost the immune system. People no longer come for treatment because they are afraid of getting coronavirus from the doctor.

We are told to stay at home but also that the virus must be widespread to have collective immunity because we have no treatment. How do we do to have immunity if we stay home ?

Japan, which had reopened the schools, is closing them again. Singapore is restarting the lockdown.

A few days ago you were paid to pick up the barrels of oil that clogged the passage.

The resumption of flights from Europe to BKK recently scheduled for May 1 has once again been postponed to May 18. No return to normal expected before the end of 2021.

The bad economic figures are piling up, the debt is starting to become obese, the stock market is freezing, even the robots are hesitating.

Everyone freaks out, nobody knows what to do, do we stop the lockdown? We stay confined?

I feel like I'm in Disney's Space Montain attraction.

[QUOTE=Pimpampoumpipo;2445647]The virus would have escaped from a poorly managed Wuhan laboratory (which was still considered a conspiracy theory a few days ago)[/QUOTE]And is still a conspiracy theory (as is the Chinese version of this which is that the US Consulate in Wuhan released it).

I say conspiracy theory, I should use the scientific term for such conjectures, which is "complete and utter bollocks".

[QUOTE=GettingFedUp;2445662]as is the Chinese version of this which is that the US Consulate in Wuhan released it.[/QUOTE]So if it is the Chinese version, it's probably true.

Did the US consulate read this too? : ". On February 16, Chinese state media also reported deficiencies. They claimed in particular that researchers threw laboratory materials down the drain, after experimentation and without having subjected them to the specific treatment intended for biological discharges. They also recalled that a number of researchers, to make ends meet, were selling laboratory animals that had undergone experiments in the markets of Wuhan. ".

LE Figaro - 04/20/2020.

[QUOTE=GettingFedUp;2445662]And is still a conspiracy theory (as is the Chinese version of this which is that the US Consulate in Wuhan released it).

I say conspiracy theory, I should use the scientific term for such conjectures, which is "complete and utter bollocks".[/QUOTE]For me most likely it is not man made and it's origins are similar to SARS and MERS but its not impossible it came from the lab.

Like most "news" nowadays what one believes depends on what one reads or listens to. If there is a political dimension which there most certainly is in the US with Covid-19 what you believe can often depend on ideology rather than science.

The US blames China, China retaliates by blaming the US. For me, China most certainly screwed up their initial response when it was critically important to contain the spread and we are all paying the price now.

On the other hand it is not a Chinese virus, virus's have origins but not nationalities.

Anyway it's all the f**king same where it came from or who is to blame, it's here and it's one big pain the ass that doesn't look like it going away anytime soon.

[QUOTE=Eloket;2445610]Here's a quote from a Swedish newspaper referring to New York Times:

"In several European countries, data show that around 20-30 percent more people died during the period under. Investigation than normal, the New York Times review shows.

In Spain, 19,700 more deaths were registered than normal during the period 9 March to 5 April, and 12,401. Were confirmed deaths in covid-19. In France, 10,500 more deaths were registered than normal, and 8,059 were cases of covid-19.

Sweden stands out in the magazine's review, with 1,100 more deaths than normal between March 9 and April 12. Compared with 1,160 registered cases of covid-19 during the period."

It does not prove that the Swedish method is good but it shows that the data of deaths related to corona preseted by government in Sweden are accurate. Other countries data may differ as much as 40% from the true amount of covid 19 deaths.

In a month or two there will be reliable data of increase of death to show the real outcome of this pandemic. But when looking at that dataset you have to consider other effects on the number of deaths. For example the lockdown strategies will certainly decrease other causes of unnatural death such as deaths of traffic accidents, deaths in ordinary flu and other contagious diseases, deaths referred to air pollution and maybe also increase of deaths from domestic violence.[/QUOTE]In coming months countries will have an important decision to make: either no lockdown like Sweden or allow their economies to be further ruined.

[QUOTE=Turgid;2445695]In coming months countries will have an important decision to make: either no lockdown like Sweden or allow their economies to be further ruined.[/QUOTE]Lock downs stop transmission and save lives. Lock downs cause economic hardship especially where there is ineffective government intervention by way of compensatory payouts. Lock downs for most people are emotionally and physically oppressive.

Whenever reopening's start no matter how good social distancing, wearing masks, sanitizing measures work more people will die as a result, the virus is still out there. That's the reality until a vaccine is found.

So where is the point where the trade off in lives meets the requirement for life to return to some semblance of normality, where we can travel, go have a beer, a meal, get a massage have our hair cut, work out at the gym etc etc.

The so called herd immunity response which seems to be the thinking behind the Swedish model and which was the original response in the UK doesn't seem at least so far to have any basis in reality as it would require in excess of 50% infection rates.

You are correct dude. It's f**king complicated.

[QUOTE=Pimpampoumpipo;2445647]This virus story is starting to become completely delusional. Everyday seems like a crazy day.[/QUOTE]Based on Thailand numbers, you're not wrong. I was taking a walk around Sukhumvit last evening around 6 pm, and everything seems normal. People were coming from their offices, traffic was enough (not as usual ofcourse) and girls were standing around typical pickup-points.

Won't be long before all those girls left starts to come back.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2445691]For me most likely it is not man made and it's origins are similar to SARS and MERS but its not impossible it came from the lab.

Like most "news" nowadays what one believes depends on what one reads or listens to. If there is a political dimension which there most certainly is in the US with Covid-19 what you believe can often depend on ideology rather than science.

The US blames China, China retaliates by blaming the US. For me, China most certainly screwed up their initial response when it was critically important to contain the spread and we are all paying the price now.

On the other hand it is not a Chinese virus, virus's have origins but not nationalities.

Anyway it's all the f**king same where it came from or who is to blame, it's here and it's one big pain the ass that doesn't look like it going away anytime soon.[/QUOTE]The world has learnt an important lesson. In future, wherever there is a similar outbreak other countries will immediately prevent nationals from that country from entering their countries. Could you imagine if in December all countries prevented people from China from entering their countries then now we would all be enjoying the company of our favorite hotties all around the world, except China of course.

[QUOTE=Turgid;2445934]The world has learnt an important lesson. In future, wherever there is a similar outbreak other countries will immediately prevent nationals from that country from entering their countries. Could you imagine if in December all countries prevented people from China from entering their countries then now we would all be enjoying the company of our favorite hotties all around the world, except China of course.[/QUOTE]What about expats living in China who may have been exposed to the virus? Should they have been denied the opportunity to come home? I know some countries have forbidden even their own citizens from returning from "hot zones", but this has traditionally been repugnant in the USA where citizens by law cannot be denied entry. And under the right circumstances, lawful permanent residents must be permitted to enter as well. Plenty of other countries approach this like the USA does. In fact, not letting your citizens return is the exception versus the rule. This is a reality that cannot be ignored. In this super connected world, as long as this kind of movement is allowed to happen, then stopping "people from China" from entering is not going to be some fail safe approach to blocking spread of this very contagious virus. Some of those people are not Chinese citizens, but citizens from countries around the globe. And, their governments will let them come back home if they want to, and even arrange for flights to help make that happen. And with that, the virus is going to spread.

[QUOTE=Turgid;2445934]Could you imagine if in December all countries prevented people from China from entering their countries then now we would all be enjoying the company of our favorite hotties all around the world, except China of course.[/QUOTE]Absolutely! I went to Pattaya in February and China was already confined. I went immediately to immigration control because there were no queues. At some of the counters the police were waiting there were no passengers.

Heaven.

[QUOTE=Turgid;2445934]The world has learnt an important lesson. In future, wherever there is a similar outbreak other countries will immediately prevent nationals from that country from entering their countries. Could you imagine if in December all countries prevented people from China from entering their countries then now we would all be enjoying the company of our favorite hotties all around the world, except China of course.[/QUOTE]Of course there are many foreigners living, visiting or transiting China. It pretty difficult to prevent them returning to their home countries, especially when up to 50% show now symptoms when affected. The big difference between this and previous scares is that this virus is highly contagious. Once the genies was out of the bottle it was not going back in.

[QUOTE=Turgid;2445934]Could you imagine if in December all countries prevented people from China from entering their countries then now we would all be enjoying the company of our favorite hotties all around the world, except China of course.[/QUOTE]Absolutely! I went to Pattaya in February and China was already confined. I went immediately to immigration control because there were no queues. At some of the counters the police were waiting there were no passengers.

Heaven.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2445691]On the other hand it is not a Chinese virus, virus's have origins but not nationalities.[/QUOTE]Which is precisely why I have no problem calling this the Chinese Virus or Wuhan Virus. It's about the origin. Bill Maher said it best in the link below.

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dEfDwc2G2_8[/URL]

[QUOTE=Allover;2445974]Which is precisely why I have no problem calling this the Chinese Virus or Wuhan Virus. It's about the origin. Bill Maher said it best in the link below.

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dEfDwc2G2_8[/URL][/QUOTE]Yeah, Bill Maher has apparently had enough of the Left's Political Correctness and phony wok sensitivities. Just give me the facts he states. It is the Wuhan Virus because it comes from Wuhan. Duh! And while we are on the subject check out his "fake News" video.

[URL]https://youtu.be/UcvIQJ-QurQ[/URL].

Interesting! The point being we should all be getting fed up with this "panic porn" "fake news" regardless of which side of the political spectrum we hail from. It is really dumb and dangerous. What the fuck has happened to the 4th estate? Trump is not a justifiable excuse for their dropping long held journalistic standards. The ends do not justify the means except in totalitarian regimes.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2445982]Yeah, Bill Maher has apparently had enough of the Left's Political Correctness and phony wok sensitivities. Just give me the facts he states. It is the Wuhan Virus because it comes from Wuhan. Duh! And while we are on the subject check out his "fake News" video.

[URL]https://youtu.be/UcvIQJ-QurQ[/URL].

Interesting! The point being we should all be getting fed up with this "panic porn" "fake news" regardless of which side of the political spectrum we hail from. It is really dumb and dangerous. What the fuck has happened to the 4th estate? Trump is not a justifiable excuse for their dropping long held journalistic standards. The ends do not justify the means except in totalitarian regimes.[/QUOTE]Is there anyone who still believes these complete country shut downs were a good move?

[URL]https://townhall.com/columnists/kevinmccullough/2020/04/23/antibody-testing-proves-weve-been-had-n2567516[/URL]

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2445982]Yeah, Bill Maher has apparently had enough of the Left's Political Correctness and phony wok sensitivities. Just give me the facts he states. It is the Wuhan Virus because it comes from Wuhan. Duh! And while we are on the subject check out his "fake News" video.

[URL]https://youtu.be/UcvIQJ-QurQ[/URL].

Interesting! The point being we should all be getting fed up with this "panic porn" "fake news" regardless of which side of the political spectrum we hail from. It is really dumb and dangerous. What the fuck has happened to the 4th estate? Trump is not a justifiable excuse for their dropping long held journalistic standards. The ends do not justify the means except in totalitarian regimes.[/QUOTE]Bill Maher is an unfunny comedian, who gets off for attacking Trump et al. The video you linked is just him rambling. He has no part in fighting Covid19, which is its name. Cut down on the Sinophobia as it does not belong here. If you want people to vote for Biden or whoever, post where rhat belongs, not here.

Here is Michael O'Leary of Ryanair, saying air lines will be up and running again in July and there wil be the mother of all price wars in hotels, air tickets etc. O'Leary's opinion is valuable. Maher is a sad and ignorant clown. [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jtccxnEmfeM[/URL].

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2445483]Smoothy you dog! Your China experiences sound great. I was fortunate to visit ChangPing in 2011 and Big Swingin Dave showed me around and made sure I was set up good in the various high end KTV's where otherwise I might not have ventured and stuck to the saunas instead. All I can say now is: It was an amazing side trip. So many hot Chinese girls & overflowing Flower Streets. Heaven Above! 555. I wish I could go back in time and do it again and again, but you can't. I have never been anywhere like it or even close to it before or since.

Now I really like Macau because that is where you can still do top quality Chinese girls in the better saunas (at unfortunately astronomical prices), oh well nothing is perfect, but Macau never held a candle to ChangPing in it's former glory days. And then one day the Chinese Communist Government said enough / no more and ChangPing was all over in a heartbeat. Moral of the story: appreciate what you have because everything can change overnight. I really dig tall, thin, light skin Chinese girls. They are very different from Thai girls in body and personality. I have no idea if the Macau saunas will ever reopen after Wuhan. If they are over too, that's it for China and all its satellites and colonies as far as I am concerned. I will never go back. HKG was already on my avoid list for the last 5 years and forget about Shanghai.[/QUOTE]I also had Big Dave as a guide the times I got to visit CP before the big crackdown. It was a mans paradise on earth in those days!!

[QUOTE=Allover;2445974]Which is precisely why I have no problem calling this the Chinese Virus or Wuhan Virus.[/QUOTE]A descriptive adjective is supposed to give meaning to the noun it precedes. Describing a corona virus as Chinese is misleading. It suggests it has a unique Chinese characteristic whatever that might mean, it does not. To date science has identified hundreds of corona viruses so why not be accurate and call it a coronavirus or use the acronym Covid-19.

Let's be real about what this is about and how it started. It originated at a Trump briefing and is being used as a deflection to his accepted disastrous response to dealing with the virus in the US. It's simple China bashing no more no less and appeals to his xenophobic base.

But hey stop, it's allover, Covid-19 is no longer a problem, a simple injection of Dettol with maybe a splash or two of bleach thrown in and you are good to go.

I hate the grotesque xenophobic caricatures which consist in caricaturing and accusing countries and their people. I know that some journalists or editorialists make it their business.

At this stage there is no certainty. And all directions must be investigated.

Nevertheless I hope that to say that the virus comes from Wuhan in China and that perhaps it appeared following faults or errors is not regarded as sinophobic. It is hoped that the whole world can learn from its mistakes. How to do it if we hide them ? Fortunately we are in a globalized world where speech is destined to be free in all nations or we go directly to the world that George Orwell described in 1984 (unless we are already there ? ).

I think it is not a service to the people of China and to the world to hide the truth. There is a huge desire for free speech in China and it should be encouraged. I remind that the first doctor in China who launched the coronavirus alert and who died from it, Li Wenliang, was first imprisoned by the Chinese authorities for "spreading rumors". He is now considered a national hero in China.

[QUOTE=Pimpampoumpipo;2446112]I hate the grotesque xenophobic caricatures which consist in caricaturing and accusing countries and their people. I know that some journalists or editorialists make it their business.

At this stage there is no certainty. And all directions must be investigated.

Nevertheless I hope that to say that the virus comes from Wuhan in China and that perhaps it appeared following faults or errors is not regarded as sinophobic. It is hoped that the whole world can learn from its mistakes. How to do it if we hide them ? Fortunately we are in a globalized world where speech is destined to be free in all nations or we go directly to the world that George Orwell described in 1984 (unless we are already there ? ).

I think it is not a service to the people of China and to the world to hide the truth. There is a huge desire for free speech in China and it should be encouraged. I remind that the first doctor in China who launched the coronavirus alert and who died from it, Li Wenliang, was first imprisoned by the Chinese authorities for "spreading rumors". He is now considered a national hero in China.[/QUOTE]China is not to blame for the languid and downright criminal responses in Europe and the USA. Stop blaming others, like you are a child.

George Orwell, mr 1984, was a government informant, part of thew 1984 system. A nasty, nasty, little man.

I thought the Ryanair link was good as it showed one major company intends to be around for a few more rounds and that air and hotel price wars on the way, which is good for mongers. However, regarding this site's focus, I don't know if the old days can come back. Much older folk will remember Burgos St in Singapore, which was like Sodom and Gomorah on steroids. Some have mentioned wild places in the PR China, which are now gone.

I figure a lot has to with how the various authorities want to move post lock down. If it was up to me, I would want women as they spend the money and we see that increasingly in Thailand and Pattaya. Guys just spend money on beer and broads.

But it is not my call. I figure the more adventurous and horny Chinese, Indians and Koreans will still want their weasels greased and the market will be thee for them. Maybe a smaller, more discreet and more expensive scene, where the only losers would be Cheap Charlies and the women we pay to love? Cash will be king and I am cash rich, so suggestions post Covid19 please.

[QUOTE=Gargano19;2445860]I was taking a walk around Sukhumvit last evening around 6 pm, and everything seems normal. [/QUOTE][B]Everything[/B] seems normal? Either you lack perception or you walked along a different Sukhumvit road than I did.

Sure, it's not 100% deserted, there are people, there are cars, there's even an occasional freelancer, but normal it is not, by any measure.

The Stones are at it again. May not exactly belong in the Thai Forum, but what else is there to do on a Saturday morning during the lockdown day xx.

[URL]https://twitter.com/i/status/1253350430341554177[/URL]

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=239&v=LNNPNweSbp8&feature=emb_title[/URL]

[QUOTE=PedroMorales;2446006]Bill Maher is an unfunny comedian, who gets off for attacking Trump et al. The video you linked is just him rambling. He has no part in fighting Covid19, which is its name. Cut down on the Sinophobia as it does not belong here. If you want people to vote for Biden or whoever, post where rhat belongs, not here.[/QUOTE]You obviously lack a sense of humour. Maybe you thought Trumps sarcasm about injecting disinfectant funny.

Bill Maher did an excellent interview last night.

[URL]https://www.yahoo.com/news/bill-maher-believes-people-want-063943156.html[/URL]

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2446072]A descriptive adjective is supposed to give meaning to the noun it precedes. Describing a corona virus as Chinese is misleading. It suggests it has a unique Chinese characteristic whatever that might mean, it does not. To date science has identified hundreds of corona viruses so why not be accurate and call it a coronavirus or use the acronym Covid-19.[/QUOTE]If you feel that strongly about it you'd better campaign against the expression Spanish flu. Chinese virus just means a virus that originated in China. Do we really want to accept the authority of the Chinese Communist party to tell us what we can and can't say? They made a fuss about the perfectly reasonable expression Wuhan virus because they want to cover up their responsibility for it.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2446072]A descriptive adjective is supposed to give meaning to the noun it precedes. Describing a corona virus as Chinese is misleading. It suggests it has a unique Chinese characteristic whatever that might mean, it does not. To date science has identified hundreds of corona viruses so why not be accurate and call it a coronavirus or use the acronym Covid-19. It's simple China bashing no more no less .[/QUOTE]Lighten up Franciscass.

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iN-aXzpQUdw[/URL]

Was this Hong Kong bashing?

Hong Kong Flu 1968.

[URL]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hong_Kong_flu[/URL]

Was this Spain bashing?

Spanish Flu 1918.

[URL]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_flu[/URL]

Was this Asian bashing?

Asian Flu 1957.

[URL]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1957%E2%80%9358_influenza_pandemic[/URL]

Here's the link to that Maher video again. You may have missed it. Maher actually got it right. If had started in Milan, it would be called the Milan virus or the Italy virus. I have no doubt.

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dEfDwc2G2_8[/URL]

[QUOTE=*****man;2446165]If you feel that strongly about it you'd better campaign against the expression Spanish flu. Chinese virus just means a virus that originated in China. Do we really want to accept the authority of the Chinese Communist party to tell us what we can and can't say? They made a fuss about the perfectly reasonable expression Wuhan virus because they want to cover up their responsibility for it.[/QUOTE]The Chinese Communist Party is, and has been, engaged in trying to write any "history" from their point of view. In other words, lie about what really happened. The CCP is not just trying to "spin" the whole Wuhan Virus narrative, they want it to go away in the worse way. The fastest and easiest way is to engage in "fake news" and social media to flood the West's internet channels with garbage to confuse the public. To a certain extent, they are getting away with it, because the liberal media is complicit in doing anything it can to end Trump's Presidency. If Obama was still President, the media would be groveling at his feet and never say that the emperor had no clothes. People who are really free and can think for themselves can and do know what bullshit is.

What is most surprising is the African, European and SE Asian "awakening" to the fact that the CCP is not their buddy after all. The fact that the CCP is willing to throw the entire world under the bus so to speak, has brought on the realization that like good vampires, the CCP will drain the economic life blood out of any country. The Belt and Road foreign policy is the prime vehicle in getting the rest of the world under their control. It is cheaper and monetarily more rewarding than trying to build a modern army or navy. One reason the CCP cancelled their last two aircraft carriers that were going to cost them billions of dollars to build and run every year.

The concept of "President For Life" is going to prove a difficult achievement for Putin and Xi. Watch the movie "Death of Stalin" for a humorous take on that concept!

[QUOTE=*****man;2446165]If you feel that strongly about it you'd better campaign against the expression Spanish flu. Chinese virus just means a virus that originated in China. Do we really want to accept the authority of the Chinese Communist party to tell us what we can and can't say? They made a fuss about the perfectly reasonable expression Wuhan virus because they want to cover up their responsibility for it.[/QUOTE]The Spanish flu did not start in Spain.

[QUOTE=GDreams;2446154]You obviously lack a sense of humour. Maybe you thought Trumps sarcasm about injecting disinfectant funny.

Bill Maher did an excellent interview last night.[/QUOTE]Yes, only you ave a sense of humour. I am not interested in anything an uninformed pretend comic has to say. I do not need that bigot Maher to make me form an opinion on Trump or anyone else.

[QUOTE=PedroMorales;2446115] I don't know if the old days can come back[/QUOTE]No vaccine, no treatment. As long as there is none, we will have to stay at home or accept to live with covid-19. The solution to closing the world's borders and confining people will soon reach its limits. The economy is everywhere in free fall. Governments will therefore have to arbitrate. For the moment I feel them hesitate LOL.

Thailand has an open economy. This means that it depends for a lot on the international circuit. However, we will have to choose between covid-19 and the economy. The economy could do much more terrible damage. Tourism is 20% of the GDP in Thailand. There is almost no social safety net in Thailand. The queues for the soup kitchen are getting longer. The social uproar if this government does not relax the confinement rules could reappear, the Thais have already shown that they could easily take to the streets (and not only in Thailand for that matter).

On the other hand I understood that there are not that many cases in Thailand.

The sub-region (Thailand, Laos, Vietnam.) seems relatively spared, the virus does not seem to like the heat, the sun and the humidity I heard.

The short-term solution could be to wear masks, respect social distances and confine people at risk to prevent hospitals from being overwhelmed. Pending treatment. And re-circulate ASAP the money. Is there another solution?

In my opinion the question is not "if the old days can come back" but WHEN it will come back.

--------------------------------------------------

P.S.: "Country of 69 million inhabitants, with a GDP of 504 billion USD, Thailand is the second economy of Southeast Asia.

Thailand's macroeconomic fundamentals are solid. The country experienced sustained economic growth until 2018 (+ 4. 2% but it faltered in 2019 (+ 2. 4%) and the country will enter into recession in 2020 (-5. 3% Its export-oriented economy (50% of GDP) is well integrated into global value chains with an industrial base with regional scope, large solid and internationalized companies, constant tourist attractiveness (20% of GDP) but hard affected by the COVID-19 crisis. The particularly high current account surplus (28 billion USD or 6% of GDP) contributed to the appreciation of the baht.

Indicators and situation.
French government finance.
Updated 04/15/2020 ".

[QUOTE=GDreams;2445955]Of course there are many foreigners living, visiting or transiting China. It pretty difficult to prevent them returning to their home countries, especially when up to 50% show now symptoms when affected. The big difference between this and previous scares is that this virus is highly contagious. Once the genies was out of the bottle it was not going back in.[/QUOTE]I think that after the novel corona virus has been eradicated and if another such virus emerges countries will be well advised to prevent all nationals from the affected country from entering their respective countries and quarantine all returning nationals upon arrival.

Thank you guys for keeping all the COVID discussion to this thread.

[QUOTE=Turgid;2446185]I think that after the novel corona virus has been eradicated...[/QUOTE]There will be no "eradication" any more than cold viruses will be eradicated.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2446170]Lighten up Franciscass.

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iN-aXzpQUdw[/URL]

Was this Hong Kong bashing?

Hong Kong Flu 1968.

[URL]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hong_Kong_flu[/URL]

Was this Spain bashing?

Spanish Flu 1918.

[URL]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_flu[/URL]

Was this Asian bashing?.[/QUOTE]With respect If you want to use the word China or Chinese why not be accurate and say the virus that originated in China or is of Chinese origin.

I have absolutely no doubt that despite the failed efforts of some for obvious reasons to classify it as the Chinese Virus history whether cultural or medical will record and remember it as Covid-19 the name reasonable impartial people now use when referring to it.

Incidentally the Spanish flu did not originate in Spain just one example of the dangers in ascribing a country to a virus.

[QUOTE=Turgid;2445934]The world has learnt an important lesson. In future, wherever there is a similar outbreak other countries will immediately prevent nationals from that country from entering their countries. Could you imagine if in December all countries prevented people from China from entering their countries then now we would all be enjoying the company of our favorite hotties all around the world, except China of course.[/QUOTE][QUOTE=TheCane;2445942]What about expats living in China who may have been exposed to the virus? Should they have been denied the opportunity to come home? I know some countries have forbidden even their own citizens from returning from "hot zones", but this has traditionally been repugnant in the USA where citizens by law cannot be denied entry. And under the right circumstances, lawful permanent residents must be permitted to enter as well. Plenty of other countries approach this like the USA does. In fact, not letting your citizens return is the exception versus the rule. This is a reality that cannot be ignored. In this super connected world, as long as this kind of movement is allowed to happen, then stopping "people from China" from entering is not going to be some fail safe approach to blocking spread of this very contagious virus. Some of those people are not Chinese citizens, but citizens from countries around the globe. And, their governments will let them come back home if they want to, and even arrange for flights to help make that happen. And with that, the virus is going to spread.[/QUOTE]China reported to WHO on December 31st. If 194 countries had all blocked flights from China on December 31st, there still would have been an outbreak. The peaks would have just come later. The transmission would have happened via asymptomatic carriers from December 17th to 31st. If we could look at passenger manifests for international flights from December 17 to 31, I would not be surprised if there was least one Chinese national on 30 percent of all international flights. Cane mentioned expats living in China, but what about all the non-Chinese that would have flight connections in China during that two week period? White backpackers? African and Filipino guest workers? Businessmen? You can have a 72 hour layover in China without a visa.

Let's say I am a NYC resident who went on a business trip to Mumbai the last week of December. While on the cramped metro, I see nothing but a sea of brown faces. Unbeknownst to me, some of the people I am rubbing up against study in Wuhan and had recently returned to Mumbai to spend their winter holiday with family. So let's then say, they spread it to me, but I am one of the lucky ones who never shows symptoms. This means when I fly back to NYC the first week of January, airport security has zero reason to quarantine me, because I never spent a single second in China. I then return to my normal routine of commuting to the office everyday on the sardine-packed NYC metro system. Let also not forget, even in these hypothetical scenarios, I am addicted to mongering! So between my travel from Mumbai to NYC, I schedule a 72 hour layover in Frankfurt, and hole myself up in a FKK. And that leads me to spread it to twenty Romanian WGs. I think you get my point.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2446072]A descriptive adjective is supposed to give meaning to the noun it precedes. Describing a corona virus as Chinese is misleading. It suggests it has a unique Chinese characteristic whatever that might mean, it does not.[/QUOTE]The virus does have a unique Chinese characteristic. It comes from China! This has nothing to do with Trump or Biden. I don't like either. I also doesn't like people throwing words like racist (or in this case Sinophobia) unnecessarily. Nobody in this thread has attacked Chinese people or Chinese culture. But I do wish they would stay away from the wet markets.

Hi guys not sure if this is in the right spot but I'm looking at a new credit card and was wondering if Amex is accepted across the board in Thailand or if I'm better off just going with Visa?

[QUOTE=Rodwint2;2446179]The Chinese Communist Party is, and has been, engaged in trying to write any "history" from their point of view. In other words, lie about what really happened. The CCP is not just trying to "spin" the whole Wuhan Virus narrative, they want it to go away in the worse way. The fastest and easiest way is to engage in "fake news" and social media to flood the West's internet channels with garbage to confuse the public. To a certain extent, they are getting away with it, because the liberal media is complicit in doing anything it can to end Trump's Presidency. If Obama was still President, the media would be groveling at his feet and never say that the emperor had no clothes. People who are really free and can think for themselves can and do know what bullshit is.

What is most surprising is the African, European and SE Asian "awakening" to the fact that the CCP is not their buddy after all. The fact that the CCP is willing to throw the entire world under the bus so to speak, has brought on the realization that like good vampires, the CCP will drain the economic life blood out of any country. The Belt and Road foreign policy is the prime vehicle in getting the rest of the world under their control. It is cheaper and monetarily more rewarding than trying to build a modern army or navy. One reason the CCP cancelled their last two aircraft carriers that were going to cost them billions of dollars to build and run every year.

The concept of "President For Life" is going to prove a difficult achievement for Putin and Xi. Watch the movie "Death of Stalin" for a humorous take on that concept![/QUOTE]Exactly. My understanding is that Wuhan was locked down and its residents not allowed to travel to other parts of China but were still allowed to travel internationally.

[QUOTE=DeepXliv;2446277]Hi guys not sure if this is in the right spot but I'm looking at a new credit card and was wondering if Amex is accepted across the board in Thailand or if I'm better off just going with Visa?[/QUOTE]I wouldn't say across the board, like the states, some business accept it some don't. Mainly just international businesses.

I use my business platinum to book flights and for my hotels, and chase sapphire if I have to use a card when out and about. That said, I personally wouldn't recommend AMX to anyone unless you do a substantial amount of traveling. The 5 x rewards points are insane but the chase sapphire has really solid cash back.

Almond.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2446223]With respect If you want to use the word China or Chinese why not be accurate and say the virus that originated in China or is of Chinese origin.
[/QUOTE]How is that any different than saying Chinese virus? Who says food that originated in Thailand, car of American origin, poodle from France? In English you simply put the adjective in front of the noun. Thai food, American car, French poodle, Chinese virus.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2446338]How is that any different than saying Chinese virus? Who says food that originated in Thailand, car of American origin, poodle from France? In English you simply put the adjective in front of the noun. Thai food, American car, French poodle, Chinese virus.[/QUOTE]Calling it the Chinese Virus is so sweeping as to be counterproductive to an understanding if it.

The problem with the Bill Maher bit mentioned in this discussion is even in that bit his examples of other viruses and diseases associated with their origin (maybe 1 exception) limit it to a reasonable, logical, usefully informative point of origin.

For example, he said people called it "Lyme Disease" because it originated in a small town in Connecticut, USA named Lyme. Fine. Seems reasonable to me. But nobody thought to call it the "Connecticut Disease", "USA Disease", "American Disease" or "North America Disease" even though, sure enough, those geographic locations are where it originated.

"Wuhan Virus" seems reasonable to me and usefully informative to anyone in the furure who hears about it and is inspired to research when, where and how it got started. "China Virus" not so much. "Chinese Virus" even less so.

Imo, choosing either of those latter names strongly suggests an intention to introduce confusion about when, where and how the thing got started in service to some other, far less useful agenda.

[QUOTE=DeepXliv;2446277]Hi guys not sure if this is in the right spot but I'm looking at a new credit card and was wondering if Amex is accepted across the board in Thailand or if I'm better off just going with Visa?[/QUOTE]I don't have Amex but am married to one who does. I think she has more difficulty using it in shops and even online while abroad.

Here are several sites advising on the best cards for international travel. A lot depends on whether you like to accumulate miles / hotel points, or prefer no fee transactions and / or cash back. Me, I have CpitalOne and Chase, one of which I keep for hidden costs related to my hobbies.

[QUOTE=DeepXliv;2446277]Hi guys not sure if this is in the right spot but I'm looking at a new credit card and was wondering if Amex is accepted across the board in Thailand or if I'm better off just going with Visa?[/QUOTE]I have a Visa card and a Mastercard, both are accepted everywhere I go. I used to have an Amex but it got cancelled due to lack of use.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2446338]How is that any different than saying Chinese virus? Who says food that originated in Thailand, car of American origin, poodle from France? In English you simply put the adjective in front of the noun. Thai food, American car, French poodle, Chinese virus.[/QUOTE]Right on Mr. E you got it, it's a descriptive adjective and to describe a virus by its origin is misleading as a description and understanding of what kind of virus it is. However although you got the grammar right you forgot an important element in language, context. Which is just as important.

Digressing from the use of language, in the past viruses were labelled with geographic tags such as Asian flu Hong Kong flu simply because science had not advanced sufficiently to identify the virus by its DNA or RNA. Now that we know so much more we can call each virus by its scientific name such as in this instance Covid -19 so why oh why do we want to use its origin to describe it. Makes no sense, unless!!

Any reasonable person who looks and listens to where and by whom the Chinese tag is used will realize why and it's not for accuracy.

You know it's somewhat ironic that it's mostly in the good old you S of A this tag is used by a minority where by most accounts the data shows Covid-19 first came there from Europe, most likely Italy and not straight from China so perhaps the Italian virus, no.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2446348]Calling it the Chinese Virus is so sweeping as to be counterproductive to an understanding if it.

The problem with the Bill Maher bit mentioned in this discussion is even in that bit his examples of other viruses and diseases associated with their origin (maybe 1 exception) limit it to a reasonable, logical, usefully informative point of origin.

For example, he said people called it "Lyme Disease" because it originated in a small town in Connecticut, USA named Lyme. Fine. Seems reasonable to me. But nobody thought to call it the "Connecticut Disease", "USA Disease", "American Disease" or "North America Disease" even though, sure enough, those geographic locations are where it originated.

"Wuhan Virus" seems reasonable to me and usefully informative to anyone in the furure who hears about it and is inspired to research when, where and how it got started. "China Virus" not so much. "Chinese Virus" even less so..[/QUOTE]It's been called the Wuhan virus since the very start.

"China reports third death from Wuhan virus and new cases of the mystery illness in other cities".

[URL]https://www.scmp.com/news/china/society/article/3046908/new-china-virus-likely-human-transmission-stage-infections[/URL]

[QUOTE=Allover;2446234]The virus does have a unique Chinese characteristic. It comes from China! This has nothing to do with Trump or Biden. I don't like either. I also doesn't like people throwing words like racist (or in this case Sinophobia) unnecessarily. Nobody in this thread has attacked Chinese people or Chinese culture. But I do wish they would stay away from the wet markets.[/QUOTE]Totally agree with you on the continuation of the so called wet markets, the selling of wild animals sometimes still alive for consumption.

It is totally utterly criminally irresponsible as was indeed the initial response in China when the existence of the virus was first made known.

On the use of using China or Chinese in describing the virus we will just have to agree to disagree.

[QUOTE=DeepXliv;2446277]Hi guys not sure if this is in the right spot but I'm looking at a new credit card and was wondering if Amex is accepted across the board in Thailand or if I'm better off just going with Visa?[/QUOTE]In 2017 I tried one time to use my Amex card in BKK. It was refused and I never tried to use it in Thailand again. They accepted my Visa card.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2444951]
Sweden most likely did it the right way. Get it over and done with as quickly as possible rather than kill the economy and let it go on for years. We will see in the long run.[/QUOTE]Sweden is a large, sparsely populated country with only 10 million inhabitants.
If they had done the same thing in densely populated area's like Wuhan, New York and Madrid for example, the consequences would have been disastrous.

[QUOTE=DeepXliv;2446277]Hi guys not sure if this is in the right spot but I'm looking at a new credit card and was wondering if Amex is accepted across the board in Thailand or if I'm better off just going with Visa?[/QUOTE]

I use N26 card. Its a german card. Payments in stores as for a VISA. Outside the euro zone, the fees of the basix card will be 1.7 % of the amount withdrawn with the best bank exchange rate at the time. Which is quite advantageous compared to other banks.

There is a paid option N26 YOU is even more attractive when traveling outside Europe since withdrawals are free and unlimited worldwide in non-euro currencies.

But you still pay the ATM bank fees (200 baths usually) in Thailand.

Revolut (UK card) has the same kind of concept.

[QUOTE=DeepXliv;2446277]Hi guys not sure if this is in the right spot but I'm looking at a new credit card and was wondering if Amex is accepted across the board in Thailand or if I'm better off just going with Visa?[/QUOTE]I don't know what across the board is, but I do use my AMEX Platinum at times with no problem. Depending on where you use any card, they may want to add the fee to your bill that they would otherwise have to pay the card company. At tailors for instance.

I leave my American Express card at home when I travel internationally. Put simply, businesses that accept credit cards always take MasterCard or Visa cards. They don't always take AMEX cards.

[QUOTE=Allover;2446518]I leave my American Express card at home when I travel internationally. Put simply, businesses that accept credit cards always take MasterCard or Visa cards. They don't always take AMEX cards.[/QUOTE]I tend to feel the same way. AMEX just isn't worth the trouble for international most of the time. Get a no fee or low fee visa / mastercard and all set.

Extension of the Emergency Decree in Thailand.

The Center for "Covid-19 Situation Administration" ("CCSA") decided today, Monday, April 27,2020, to extend the Emergency Decree by one month after its Expiration on April 30,2020.

The spokesperson for the "CCSA" said that the Decree would be extended until the end of May 2020.

The primary reason is concern over the return of the Coronavirus, with the Center still struggling to prevent it from spreading further in the Kingdom.

The decision means that the National Night Curfew from 10 pm To 4 am Will continue throughout the month.

No Social Gathering will be authorized and inter-provincial travel will always be limited.

The Meeting was chaired by the Prime Minister, bringing together all the Ministries and Agencies to discuss the impact of the Decree.

The National Security Council said at the meeting that it had surveyed public opinion and that it was in favor of the extension of the decree.

Sources: Bangkok Post.

Extension concerning the Temporary Restriction on the Arrival of Airplanes in Thailand (Text Updated on 04/27/2020).

The Thai Civil Aviation Authority ("CAAT") has decided to extend the Temporary Restriction on International Commercial Flight Arrivals until May 31,2020. With the exception of state and military aircraft, landing emergency, humanitarian aid, medical and rescue flights, repatriations and cargo planes.

The Director of "CAAT" said that the Authority should extend the "anti-Covid-19" measures because the situation in several neighboring countries remains serious.

For the "CAAT", it is still too early, therefore not necessary, to go to the neighboring countries, where the Coronavirus continues to spread, while some nations have no directive to lift their blockages.

The Extension of the International Passenger Ban Prohibition means that Foreigners with a Work Permit or Married to Thai people, or just foreigners in general, will not be able to come to Thailand until June 2020, at least.

In the event that the "Visa" of a foreign person expires outside of Thailand during this period, it is likely that it will be necessary to apply for a new Visa.

Sources: The Nation.

Oh oh no reaction for 2 days.

I hope it's not because of my last posts that have depressed everyone LOL.

At the same time it's true that it's a little creepy.

We swim in full schizophrenia.

On the one hand, the economy plunges vertically and we feel that panic is starting to gain. GDP announcements are even worse than expected and central banks are pouring billions into the economy (when only 2 months ago savings were needed everywhere). Around the world, the new unemployed number (or will count) by tens of millions, companies file for bankruptcy (it's going to be a disaster for the airlines), queues for soup kitchen are starting to form.

And on the other the "health experts" scare everyone, we practically do not move to restart the system so that we do not see the effects with the naked eye between being confined and being deconfined.

What a mess.

[QUOTE=Pimpampoumpipo;2446686]In the event that the "Visa" of a foreign person expires outside of Thailand during this period, it is likely that it will be necessary to apply for a new Visa.

Sources: The Nation.[/QUOTE]I was under the impression that as part of the recent pronouncements from immigration, applications for extension of retirement visas have been without penalty extended to end of July for people who's 12 months are up and are unable to return.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2447281]I was under the impression that as part of the recent pronouncements from immigration, applications for extension of retirement visas have been without penalty extended to end of July for people who's 12 months are up and are unable to return.[/QUOTE]It's a different situation?

If you are stuck in Thailand on a visa, it is automatically extended without applying for the extension. But his post was about people trying to return to Thailand and their visa has expired.

Save our little working girls.

Excuse me, it's me again, I'm aware of abusing the bandwidth of this thread, I promise to make an effort now.

I just wanted to make a call. I say it with my words. Personally I am against support for all the girls who come to ask for it. They always have good reasons. There are certainly legitimate requests but in normal times it looks like abuse. In general I refuse.

Right now I think it's different. The situation is exceptional. Some girls have gone to their province, I hope they are safe in their family, they can still subsist with a bowl of rice.

But for those who stayed in Pattaya, Patong or Manila maybe they have a support, maybe they have clients with Tinder or ThayFriendly. But I think that for the most part they stay in their small room and they are afraid to go out because of the covid-19 or the curfew (I have a few contacts there who make me confirm it).

As well maybe we can do a little gesture to help them, and thus maintain what makes us all happy. If everyone makes a small gesture we can all save ourselves. They have children and parents to help, that's why they are there. We must all stand together in difficult times. I'm sure they will thank you a hundredfold when you see them again (if you know what I mean.

For my part, I sent by western union 100 to a chick in Angeles City. I was to spend a few days with her at a scuba diving destination.

Tomorrow I will send 150 to a Pattaya chick who cannot pay her rent.

So maybe they make the same request to several customers. But I'm not sure that everyone answers.

If we want to preserve our eco system, let's help them all. Let's help each 2 or 3 little hookers that we know and with whom we have a good memory with 100 or 150 for each if you can.

You will see, I am sure that when you see them again, you will fall into each other's arms with tears in your eyes.

Together we will defeat covid-19.

Many thanks for everyone.

[QUOTE=Downandup;2447296]It's a different situation?

If you are stuck in Thailand on a visa, it is automatically extended without applying for the extension. But his post was about people trying to return to Thailand and their visa has expired.[/QUOTE]I am aware there were a number of changes affecting extensions of all visas, suspension of 90 day reporting, work permit applications and one year reentry permits. Again it is my impression and I may be wrong as quite often announcements are vague or incomplete that renewal of retirement visas has been extended to end of July for those currently unable to reenter Thailand. Once the ban on flights is removed they will then issue new details on when those on extended retirement visas will have to return to renew extensions and other possible requirements such as having certificates showing they are virus free and whether they will have to undergo 14 day quarantine periods which could be either self-quarantine or imposed quarantine.

I stand corrected if this is not the situation but I would like to see a credible explanation where it is so stated.

[QUOTE=Pimpampoumpipo;2447315]...Personally I am against support for all the girls who come to ask for it.
...
Right now I think it's different. The situation is exceptional. Some girls have gone to their province, I hope they are safe in their family, they can still subsist with a bowl of rice.
...
For my part, I sent by western union 100 to a chick in Angeles City. I was to spend a few days with her at a scuba diving destination.
...
Tomorrow I will send 150 to a Pattaya chick who cannot pay her rent.
[/QUOTE]I support this position. I've had requests from about half the girls in my Line, but I only send money to one girl. I encourage others to do the same thing. An amount that is almost trivial to us can be huge to them. "My" girl shares a tiny 4000 baht/month apartment with 3 other girls, so her share is about 32 USD per month. The shower/toilet/sink room is so small that she cannot position the camera to give a full length shower show. They are sleeping on the floor and cook very simple meals twice a day. No beds. No air conditioning. No TV. They do have WiFi and they can survive.

If you send money by Western Union, beware of the fees and exchange rates, which vary widely depending on exactly how you send the money. The most economical way to send it is directly from your bank account to hers. There will be no fees and the exchange rate isn't bad. The problem with that system is that it takes about 8 calendar days. Also not recommended if you have a wife that will look at your bank statement.

If you bring happiness to someone, that happiness will return to you.

I've helped two girls here in the LOS, with what is to me a very modest amount. Their government is not following through on promises of assistance, and that 5, 000 be is nothing to me but means everything to them. One of them sends me pictures of the healthy meals she is making for herself and her home bound sis, without appeals that I make it a regular thing.

We are all in this together.

[QUOTE=Pimpampoumpipo;2447315]Save our little working girls.

Excuse me, it's me again, I'm aware of abusing the bandwidth of this thread, I promise to make an effort now.

I just wanted to make a call. I say it with my words. Personally I am against support for all the girls who come to ask for it. They always have good reasons. There are certainly legitimate requests but in normal times it looks like abuse. In general I refuse.

Right now I think it's different. The situation is exceptional. Some girls have gone to their province, I hope they are safe in their family, they can still subsist with a bowl of rice.

But for those who stayed in Pattaya, Patong or Manila maybe they have a support, maybe they have clients with Tinder or ThayFriendly. But I think that for the most part they stay in their small room and they are afraid to go out because of the covid-19 or the curfew (I have a few contacts there who make me confirm it).

As well maybe we can do a little gesture to help them, and thus maintain what makes us all happy. If everyone makes a small gesture we can all save ourselves. They have children and parents to help, that's why they are there. We must all stand together in difficult times. I'm sure they will thank you a hundredfold when you see them again (if you know what I mean.

For my part, I sent by western union 100 to a chick in Angeles City. I was to spend a few days with her at a scuba diving destination.

Tomorrow I will send 150 to a Pattaya chick who cannot pay her rent.

So maybe they make the same request to several customers. But I'm not sure that everyone answers.

If we want to preserve our eco system, let's help them all. Let's help each 2 or 3 little hookers that we know and with whom we have a good memory with 100 or 150 for each if you can.

You will see, I am sure that when you see them again, you will fall into each other's arms with tears in your eyes.

Together we will defeat covid-19.

Many thanks for everyone.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Chacal60;2447389]I've helped two girls here in the LOS, with what is to me a very modest amount. Their government is not following through on promises of assistance, and that 5, 000 be is nothing to me but means everything to them. One of them sends me pictures of the healthy meals she is making for herself and her home bound sis, without appeals that I make it a regular thing.

We are all in this together.[/QUOTE]Yes, people do need to eat. Had a girl reach out to me that I hadn't seen for 3 years. We had message a few times over the years and she had never asked for money. I knew she was desperate to ask this time for money for food. She was probably expecting to get 1 k baht. I sent her 3 k to tide her over for a short while.

For those that asked why would I do that? Because I can!

[QUOTE=Dg8787;2447419]Yes, people do need to eat. Had a girl reach out to me that I hadn't seen for 3 years. We had message a few times over the years and she had never asked for money. I knew she was desperate to ask this time for money for food. She was probably expecting to get 1 k baht. I sent her 3 k to tide her over for a short while.

For those that asked why would I do that? Because I can![/QUOTE]Good for you Dg. It is so gratifying to see the conversation has shifted from "they are all scammers and don't need help" to the realization that there is genuine hardship out there. Girls who have stayed in situ still taking care of regular clients are probably OK but the majority have gone back home. Also important to remember that many of them also take care of their families from their earnings. So, it is good to see more members stepping up and doing their bit to help and as I said before a few hundred bath can make a difference in a poor village.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2447381]Again it is my impression and I may be wrong as quite often announcements are vague or incomplete that renewal of retirement visas has been extended to end of July for those currently unable to reenter Thailand.

...

I stand corrected if this is not the situation but I would like to see a credible explanation where it is so stated.[/QUOTE]I don't know and have not seen anything reported on this. You may want to search on thepattayanews, Bangkok post or thaigers sites to find answers.

[QUOTE=Downandup;2447511]I don't know and have not seen anything reported on this. You may want to search on thepattayanews, Bangkok post or thaigers sites to find answers.[/QUOTE]Here:

[URL]https://thailand.prd.go.th/ewt_news.php?nid=9403&filename=index&fbclid=IwAR3YBYWvTe-kCWYsZjU5n8Zuo4rrgZHGU6IQce_35J1teHZC8mMCE_pT6qQ[/URL]

[QUOTE=HorseTrader;2447385]I support this position. I've had requests from about half the girls in my Line, but I only send money to one girl. I encourage others to do the same thing. An amount that is almost trivial to us can be huge to them. "My" girl shares a tiny 4000 baht/month apartment with 3 other girls, so her share is about 32 USD per month. The shower/toilet/sink room is so small that she cannot position the camera to give a full length shower show. They are sleeping on the floor and cook very simple meals twice a day. No beds. No air conditioning. No TV. They do have WiFi and they can survive.

If you send money by Western Union, beware of the fees and exchange rates, which vary widely depending on exactly how you send the money. The most economical way to send it is directly from your bank account to hers. There will be no fees and the exchange rate isn't bad. The problem with that system is that it takes about 8 calendar days. Also not recommended if you have a wife that will look at your bank statement.

If you bring happiness to someone, that happiness will return to you.[/QUOTE]I too support this position and I have sent 3000 baht a couple of times. I used Transferwise to send and the fee was ridiculously small. The money arrived in about 2 hours.

C4 T.

[QUOTE=XXL;2447512]Here:

[URL]https://thailand.prd.go.th/ewt_news.php?nid=9403&filename=index&fbclid=IwAR3YBYWvTe-kCWYsZjU5n8Zuo4rrgZHGU6IQce_35J1teHZC8mMCE_pT6qQ[/URL][/QUOTE]I've seen that and unfortunately it specifically only mentions permanent residencies not retirement visas. However my understanding is that all visas have been automatically extended to end of July. I'm due in August, hopefully it will have been resolved by then.

Presently I have 4 favorite repeat girls. 2 live in BKK and 2 live in Manila and they have all reached out and asked for monetary help thanks to the Corona.

One of my BKK girls is a great girl and I really like her. I call her Atomic because she had platinum blond hair the night I met her, she is dynamite in bed, and the movie "Atomic Blond" was on HBO later that first night. After we got to know each other a little I introduced her to Syzygies and Atomic tried to fix him up with one of her girlfriends. Anyway, she is a party girl and spends everything she earns. I have known her now for about 2. 5 years. During my last trip she was living in Phuket and I flew her up to BKK to spend a few days with me. I (we) had a great time! Then she went back to Phuket, but decided a couple weeks later to fly back up to BKK (on her own dime) to see me again. The 2nd visit was even better than the 1st. She was the 1st to ask for help back in March. I sent her $100 and told her that was it until I arrive in LOS. She was very appreciative and she has not asked for any more money. So far! 555.

My 2 Manila girls were next to ask and these 2 are close girlfriends. I have known them both since 2015 and have enjoyed many one on one's as well as roughly 30 threesomes together. So I either had to say no to both or send equal amounts to each girl which I did ($200 per girl). They haven't asked for more yet, ha ha, but I am sure they will if the lockdown continues.

My 4th girl is also the one I have known the longest time and I have mentioned Mini quite a few times on the BKK Reports thread. Long story short, I met her back in 2010 when she used to dance on the ground floor in Baccara Soi Cowboy. I can't believe I still see Mini after all these years, but I do. She is now 34 and semi retired. She was very reluctant to ask for help, never asked for money before, and I knew instantly by the sound in her voice when she called that she was in a tough situation and about to be kicked out of her BKK studio apartment. I sent her 3 months rent and food money and I know she appreciated the help.

So all told I have sent a good amount of money to these girls. Atomic, The 1st girl, probably frivolously threw the cash away. The 2 MNL girls probably spent it on food and other necessities for the children and maybe some booze to help pass the time. LOL. I know MNL is in near total lockdown. Mini, the last girl, is using the money to stay afloat in BKK so she does not have to go home to Isan broke after 10 or 11 years in the business.

The Wuhan Pandemic is a once in a lifetime event and these are my favorite girls. I have had a lot of good times with them and all I want is the good times to continue once I can get back to SE Asia. I don't expect anything extra from them. I just want them to be themselves. Michelle, one of my MNL girls, said she would pay me back. Ha Ha. I told her it was not necessary.

A few other girls have asked for money too, but I felt I did not know them well enough or long enough to warrant my helping them out financially. I can't afford to help everybody, but I am in a position to afford what I sent to my favorite girls and I am glad I could help. I have no regrets, in fact, I feel good about it.

[QUOTE=HorseTrader;2447385]I support this position. I've had requests from about half the girls in my Line, but I only send money to one girl. I encourage others to do the same thing. An amount that is almost trivial to us can be huge to them. "My" girl shares a tiny 4000 baht/month apartment with 3 other girls, so her share is about 32 USD per month. The shower/toilet/sink room is so small that she cannot position the camera to give a full length shower show. They are sleeping on the floor and cook very simple meals twice a day. No beds. No air conditioning. No TV. They do have WiFi and they can survive.

If you send money by Western Union, beware of the fees and exchange rates, which vary widely depending on exactly how you send the money. The most economical way to send it is directly from your bank account to hers. There will be no fees and the exchange rate isn't bad. The problem with that system is that it takes about 8 calendar days. Also not recommended if you have a wife that will look at your bank statement.

If you bring happiness to someone, that happiness will return to you.[/QUOTE]I totally agree that sending a small amount of $$$ now is a reasonable thing to do. My girls (regulars) are in China and I have only sent a small amount to one girl, but I am tempted to send some $100? To another who tells how hard it is in Wuhan to live with no money. But she has not asked for any. I am an old guy (79 but don't look it) and I don't mind paying for my time with my girls, after all, why else would spend time with me?. For the one I sent $ to I told her that this was a deposit on our next time together. We'll see how that plays out.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2447545]However my understanding is that all visas have been automatically extended to end of July. I'm due in August, hopefully it will have been resolved by then.[/QUOTE]The extensions are for non-Thais already in Thailand whose visa or visa waiver expired after 26-March.

If my understanding is correct you are outside Thailand with a retirement visa (Non-Imm OA) or 12 month extension of stay to a Non-Imm O. The last I saw on this was:

[URL]https://thepattayanews.com/2020/04/29/thai-government-spokesperson-says-they-are-aware-of-foreigners-with-valid-visas-trying-to-return-to-thailand-looking-at-situation/[/URL]

The emphasis is placed on people with work permits and those who have Thai dependants because at present the Thai dependants may possibly be repatriated but the non-Thai spouse (or whatever) cannot be.

In addition to the question of possible quarantine the requirement for US $100 k of medical coverage for Covid-19 is still in place (technically speaking, although with no foreigners coming in it may have slipped the memory).

August is 3 months away. A lot can change in 3 months and certainly has changed in the last 3 months!

Still have no girls asking me for money. Feeling left out. I guess it pays to look and act like a broke ass bastard when I'm at the gogo bars. Either that or I just don't come across as a "jai dee".

I would consider a nominal amount (5-10k?) to my Freebie Girls but none have asked. Guess their Sponsors are already supporting them well.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2447630]Still have no girls asking me for money. Feeling left out.[/QUOTE]I'm sure we can find some girls to make you feel included.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2447630]

I would consider a nominal amount (5-10k?) to my Freebie Girls but none have asked. Guess their Sponsors are already supporting them well.[/QUOTE]You can ask them if they would like you to send them money. Except for some American girlfriends other girls I am with never refused money, gifts anytime. Usually girls give you better performance for helping them in times of need.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2447545]I've seen that and unfortunately it specifically only mentions permanent residencies not retirement visas. However my understanding is that all visas have been automatically extended to end of July. I'm due in August, hopefully it will have been resolved by then.[/QUOTE]I also took "permanent residencies" to include retirement visas. What is a "permanent residency" anyway? Is there such a thing in TH for foreigners? We're all kicking the can down the road with some type of visa.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2447545]I've seen that and unfortunately it specifically only mentions permanent residencies not retirement visas. However my understanding is that all visas have been automatically extended to end of July. I'm due in August, hopefully it will have been resolved by then.[/QUOTE]Yes, I too notice that link and others do not mention anything specifically about the kind of Non Immigrant OA (annual retirement) visa I have. I am in Thailand now and need to renew that visa before the end of this month, May.

I will not be taking any chances. I will get all my documents together and show up at Chang Wattana Immigration Office as usual, ready to spend the entire day (or two, if necessary) getting it done. Things can change by the day if not by the hour.

My feeling is it doesn't matter what we read on the internet or what our trusted friends in the same situation tell us happened to them at Immigration just yesterday. The only rules that apply are the ones in the mind of the particular Immigration Officer weilding the visa ink stamp at that particular desk at that particular hour on that particular day. Count on it being any other way in Thailand at your peril.

[QUOTE=XXL;2447670]I also took "permanent residencies" to include retirement visas. What is a "permanent residency" anyway? Is there such a thing in TH for foreigners? We're all kicking the can down the road with some type of visa.[/QUOTE]There is permanent residence in Thailand. It is a long process. A "extension of stay based on retirement" is not residency.

Hey folks,

Anyone have a ballpark idea of when were going to be allowed to travel to Thailand? I traveled to Pattaya last year and plan on touring all of SE Asia this time when travel is allowed. I know Pattaya is on lockdown till June but anyone have an idea of when is best to travel? I know everything is just speculation at this point. I am coming from the US and I am worried the Thai government will quarantine me the second I touch foot in Thailand regardless of how long the virus has been away LOL. I hear some people suspect prices will be lower than ever on accommodations and girls but I would appreciate some on the ground feedback or speculation from some of the vets.

This time around I plan to go to Phuket, chang mai and Bangkok, and tour all of SE Asia so any tips on what order or how to plan an extended vacation would be appreciated.

Hard to know for sure if this is so since we read reports and rumors in all directions. But here is the latest. Not bars, massage shops and the like, though. Restaurants, markets and recreation venues such as parks.

[URL]https://www.stickboybkk.com/news/partial-reopening-may-3-as-government-ease-covid-19-restrictions/[/URL]

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2447700]Hard to know for sure if this is so since we read reports and rumors in all directions. But here is the latest. Not bars, massage shops and the like, though. Restaurants, markets and recreation venues such as parks.

[URL]https://www.stickboybkk.com/news/partial-reopening-may-3-as-government-ease-covid-19-restrictions/[/URL][/QUOTE]I am totally lost since most of this shit except the red phase has been opened for the longest already.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2447714]I am totally lost since most of this shit except the red phase has been opened for the longest already.[/QUOTE]In Bangkok these places have not been open except for the few who ignored the directive. I understand that you are in Pattaya and they have been operating differently there but in Bangkok most places have remained closed based on the rules.

My barber texted me that she is opening on Sunday May 4th even though your attachment shows that she should not be allowed to open. I also got a pedicure yesterday as I was walking past TenTen the lady waved me in saying they were opening early. So some shops are starting to ignore the orders.

[QUOTE=HoustonPlayer;2447716]In Bangkok these places have not been open except for the few who ignored the directive. I understand that you are in Pattaya and they have been operating differently there but in Bangkok most places have remained closed based on the rules.[/QUOTE]Ok. Because the article said Thailand and nationwide. It did not even have the word Bangkok in it at all.

[URL]https://pattayaone.news/thailand-to-gradually-restart-businesses/[/URL]

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2447718]Ok. Because the article said Thailand and nationwide. It did not even have the word Bangkok in it at all.

[URL]https://pattayaone.news/thailand-to-gradually-restart-businesses/[/URL][/QUOTE]I was just pointing out that things are being enforced differently in different provinces. You have been able to do some things in Pattaya for awhile that is still not allowed in Bangkok.

[QUOTE=HoustonPlayer;2447719]I was just pointing out that things are being enforced differently in different provinces. You have been able to do some things in Pattaya for awhile that is still not allowed in Bangkok.[/QUOTE]Or the reverse. Right now in Pat we're not even allowed to walk on the beach side of Beach Road. Anyway, what they're planning to reopen right now or later in May will hardly change anything. No swimming pools.

The Bella Italia restaurant in Pattaya from whom I had been sourcing home deliveries have told me they would close until further notice as of May 1st. They must have concluded they can't stay in business in the present circumstances. Instead of some businesses reopening what we may see is in fact further closures.

[QUOTE=GettingFedUp;2447578]The extensions are for non-Thais already in Thailand whose visa or visa waiver expired after 26-March.

If my understanding is correct you are outside Thailand with a retirement visa (Non-Imm OA) or 12 month extension of stay to a Non-Imm O. The last I saw on this was:

[URL]https://thepattayanews.com/2020/04/29/thai-government-spokesperson-says-they-are-aware-of-foreigners-with-valid-visas-trying-to-return-to-thailand-looking-at-situation/[/URL]

The emphasis is placed on people with work permits and those who have Thai dependants because at present the Thai dependants may possibly be repatriated but the non-Thai spouse (or whatever) cannot be.

In addition to the question of possible quarantine the requirement for US $100 k of medical coverage for Covid-19 is still in place (technically speaking, although with no foreigners coming in it may have slipped the memory).

August is 3 months away. A lot can change in 3 months and certainly has changed in the last 3 months![/QUOTE]While the amnesty was introduced primarily to cover visitors stranded here having to queue for hours on end at IO's opinions on whether it covers retirement visas are all over the place. Some say yes, other no. I have spoken to agencies dealing with visas and as of now it's not conclusive one way or the other and comes down to the interpretation of "All" in "extension of all visas" to July 31st. Unless clarified in the meantime It's possible we may not know for sure until the amnesty expires and retirees visit their local IO to renew and even then different offices may treat applications differently.

[QUOTE=XXL;2447735]Or the reverse. Right now in Pat we're not even allowed to walk on the beach side of Beach Road. Anyway, what they're planning to reopen right now or later in May will hardly change anything. No swimming pools.

The Bella Italia restaurant in Pattaya from whom I had been sourcing home deliveries have told me they would close until further notice as of May 1st. They must have concluded they can't stay in business in the present circumstances. Instead of some businesses reopening what we may see is in fact further closures.[/QUOTE]Horror of all horrors no booze anywhere anyhow anytime till end of May. Any help for a part time alcoholic appreciated.

[QUOTE=HoustonPlayer;2447719]I was just pointing out that things are being enforced differently in different provinces. You have been able to do some things in Pattaya for awhile that is still not allowed in Bangkok.[/QUOTE]This isn't just for the Virus, it is the same for everything and I mean everything! The structure of the Thailand government (just my opinion) it is no different than Afghanistan you might be the President of the Country live in the capital but aside from the photo op standing together when it is all said and done the Governor of each province couldn't give a shit, that is trickle down to the City, each district police station. I will concede with the Virus they have been a bit more together but in the end, the rules are all treated differently like the rules for immigration the left doesn't know what the right hand is doing!

With the lockdown, in Pattaya on Sukhumvit even with the same rules the first 2 checkpoints they just check the temperature and let everyone in. At Pattaya Klang, they check everything for the motorbikes but for cars just temperature and you can go through. You look at the current list on the Darkside, all the markets, and they are huge compared to inside town all have been opened packed to the bream each morning and starting again at 3 pm. You got pickup trucks now parked all along the road since they aren't allow to sell in town so they are out there. There are sidecars, food sellers, everywhere.

Half of the stuff listed on the 4 stages is or never been closed. People say Pattaya and Bangkok aren't part of Thailand they might be right.

IF ONE DOESN'T KNOW YET PATTAYA LOCKDOWN CHECKPOINTS ARE SUPPOSED TO BE OPEN AFTER MAY 4TH!

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2447718]Ok. Because the article said Thailand and nationwide. It did not even have the word Bangkok in it at all.

[URL]https://pattayaone.news/thailand-to-gradually-restart-businesses/[/URL][/QUOTE]Bear in mind, the recent report isn't just about restaurants being open starting May 3. Many restaurants in Bangkok have been open all during the lockdown. But they were not allowed to serve seated customers, only serve takeaway or delivery orders.

It is about them being allowed to serve seated customers again.

I am already seeing restaurants around lower Sukhumvit, popular spots on Soi 8, Soi 11, Sukhumvit Road, etc, setting up their tables and chairs to accommodate walk in and seated customers again for the first time in over a month.

I'm guessing some of them are ready to cheat a little bit and start serving seated customers tomorrow.

The Artbox night market on Sukhumvit at Soi 10 can reopen fully if they want starting Sunday. Also the Train Market 2 at mrt Thailand Cultural Center, which has been closed all this time.

Massage shops are not getting an ok to open yet, but it will be interesting to see if girls will set up stools outside of ordinary barber shops and beauty salons for a while. LOL.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2447782]Bear in mind, the recent report isn't just about restaurants being open starting May 3. Many restaurants in Bangkok have been open all during the lockdown. But they were not allowed to serve seated customers, only serve takeaway or delivery orders.

It is about them being allowed to serve seated customers again.

I am already seeing restaurants around lower Sukhumvit, popular spots on Soi 8, Soi 11, Sukhumvit Road, etc, setting up their tables and chairs to accommodate walk in and seated customers again for the first time in over a month.

I'm guessing some of them are ready to cheat a little bit and start serving seated customers tomorrow.

The Artbox night market on Sukhumvit at Soi 10 can reopen fully if they want starting Sunday. Also the Train Market 2 at mrt Thailand Cultural Center, which has been closed all this time.

Massage shops are not getting an ok to open yet, but it will be interesting to see if girls will set up stools outside of ordinary barber shops and beauty salons for a while. LOL.[/QUOTE]I talked to one restaurant owner and he said he can open his place on 1st May, that's today. It's on lower Sukhumvit. But he said he won't open it because there are no tourist and his whole clientele was tourists. So I guess they can open but what's the point when there's not much people to eat.

I also saw couple of salons opened today. Not sure how that's going to work.

[URL]https://www.bangkokpost.com/thailand/general/1911252/booze-sales-back-from-sunday[/URL]

Also reported on The Thaiger.

For those who think this important remember that 6 May (Wednesday) is Visakha Bucha, which is normally a day where alcohol sales are banned.

Restaurants can open with appropriate social distancing, staff masks, hand gel available, etc. But may not serve alcohol.

[QUOTE=GettingFedUp;2447798][URL]https://www.bangkokpost.com/thailand/general/1911252/booze-sales-back-from-sunday[/URL]

Also reported on The Thaiger.

For those who think this important remember that 6 May (Wednesday) is Visakha Bucha, which is normally a day where alcohol sales are banned.

Restaurants can open with appropriate social distancing, staff masks, hand gel available, etc. But may not serve alcohol.[/QUOTE]Just to show how wishy-washy this government is! All on the Bangkok Post the last few days! First they wouldn't celebrate any of the holidays coming up, the next they will, allow liquor sale for two days the next canceled, then liquor sale will continue to banned be decided again May 15th, now as of Sunday you can?

[QUOTE=Gargano19;2447790]But he said he won't open it because there are no tourist and his whole clientele was tourists. So I guess they can open but what's the point when there's not much people to eat.
.[/QUOTE]I am also beginning to wonder what will be the use of reopening restaurants, bars, massage shops, hotels and others in a city like Pattaya since there should not be many tourists at the moment.

The National Alcohol Ban is lifted from Sunday May 3, 2020.

In a surprise turnaround, after extending the National Alcohol Ban from yesterday for the entire month of May 2020, the "CSSA" ("Center for" Covid-19 ″ Situation Administration ") announced that it revoked the National Ban on Alcohol Sales from Sunday May 3, 2020.

However, the provisions stipulate that alcohol can only be purchased and must be taken for consumption at home.

Under no circumstances may you consume alcohol on the premises, in restaurants or bars. Details will be provided on Saturday May 2, 2020 on specific details.

In any case, the Order has been published in the "Royal Gazette", which means that it has already entered into force.

The Revocation of the Liquor Sales Ban coincides with 2 almost simultaneous Holidays, one today, May 1, 2020 (Labor Day) and the other Monday May 4, 2020 (Anniversary of the Coronation of Rama X), making it a long bridge which would have been one of the biggest Holiday Weekends of the year if the "Covid-19" epidemic had not ruined everything.

However, it is possible that the Lifting of the Alcohol Ban will not be on a National scale, the Provincial Governors also having a say on the matter. Let's wait to know more tomorrow. Wait and See.

Sources: Khaosod (Thai web site).

The Chinese are back in July. Enjoy the freedom while you guys can. Imo Thailand will not be opening up to Farang countries for months after that. Thailand has their eyes set solely on China moving forward, followed by India, Singapore, Japan, and Korea.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2447819]The Chinese are back in July. Enjoy the freedom while you guys can. Imo Thailand will not be opening up to Farang countries for months after that. Thailand has their eyes set solely on China moving forward, followed by India, Singapore, Japan, and Korea.[/QUOTE]

I am not sure that Indian or even Chinese tourists meet these criteria: [URL]https://www.bangkokpost.com/business/1909624/long-stay-travel-packages-in-the-pipeline.[/URL].

And even Korean or Japanese tourists who come to spend their 3 days of annual vacation in Thailand.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2447819]The Chinese are back in July. Enjoy the freedom while you guys can. Imo Thailand will not be opening up to Farang countries for months after that. Thailand has their eyes set solely on China moving forward, followed by India, Singapore, Japan, and Korea.[/QUOTE]I am doing my part for fellow punter and working girl health safety by reminding as many Thai P4P girls as possible that every Chinese customer they meet from now on will probably try to pass himself off as Japanese, Korean or Singaporean.

Spread the word.

They can still spend their time and money in the malls though 😁.

[QUOTE=Pimpampoumpipo;2447826]I am not sure that Indian or even Chinese tourists meet these criteria: [URL]https://www.bangkokpost.com/business/1909624/long-stay-travel-packages-in-the-pipeline.[/URL].

And even Korean or Japanese tourists who come to spend their 3 days of annual vacation in Thailand.[/QUOTE]Based on the article, their target demography is farang family or couples and solo female tourists. Not sure mongers would be on their priority but the above demography is hard to get right now. Who would want to travel to Thailand with their family this years with health risk and economy state. Majority of mongers will be desperate to get here and experience the new post-covid Thailand p4 p scene. Pretty sure Thailand tourist ministery is aware of it.

[QUOTE=Gargano19;2447828]Based on the article, their target demography is farang family or couples and solo female tourists. Not sure mongers would be on their priority but the above demography is hard to get right now. Who would want to travel to Thailand with their family this years with health risk and economy state. Majority of mongers will be desperate to get here and experience the new post-covid Thailand p4 p scene. Pretty sure Thailand tourist ministery is aware of it.[/QUOTE]I think that like many cases in the world it will depend on where it is applied. And we will have to make exceptions based on regional specificities. In family vacation clubs we will hope for the return of families. In tourist places to visit temples or beaches too.

But in very specific places like Pattaya it is entire regional economies that are impacted if prostitution activities are not restarted. On the other hand Thai officials (police and others) directly depend on the punctures they make in this parallel economy. They are very influential.

I have a friend who lives in Pattaya. He tells me (which is close to what Bananaboi says and the rumors circulating in Pattaya at the moment) that the farangs will be expelled and the Chinese mafia will take power. I dont know if there is a Chinese mafia ^^. But if the Chinese mafia takes over the business in Pattaya, the first thing they will do will be to reopen gogos and brothels and bring back the farangs because the farangs have money to run their business.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2447827]I am doing my part for fellow punter and working girl health safety by reminding as many Thai P4P girls as possible that every Chinese customer they meet from now on will probably try to pass himself off as Japanese, Korean or Singaporean.

Spread the word.[/QUOTE]It's not Chinese that are the main virus carriers now. It's Americans, Europeans, and Brits. Those are the nationalities who will be kept out the longest from Thailand.

You know that Thai girls can easily tell the difference between Chinese, Japanese, Korean, etc. Asians can differentiate between other Asians. I can't tell the difference between a young Korean and a Japanese guy but a gogo girl will immediately know.

[QUOTE=Pimpampoumpipo;2447850]I dont know if there is a Chinese mafia ^^. But if the Chinese mafia takes over the business in Pattaya, the first thing they will do will be to reopen gogos and brothels [/QUOTE]There is definitely one. But I don't know how interested they would be in gogos. This chick that is with me now was just telling me a story an hour ago about her friend in Bangkok whose boyfriend was a part. She started off telling me about how her friend likes expensive bags. Then it went to the boyfriend that showers her with whatever she wants. Then it gets to the guy is in the Chinese mafia and runs the online gambling shit. He kills people and puts them in suitcases. She said they were at Pattaya Bazaar before and he said something to the girl about killing someone in Philippines but she paid it no mind. Next thing you know they busted his ass for murders in Pattaya. The video is in Thai.

[URL]https://youtu.be/3kXGubwohJk[/URL]

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2447857]You know that Thai girls can easily tell the difference between Chinese, Japanese, Korean, etc. Asians can differentiate between other Asians.[/QUOTE]Thais can not even tell other Thais. I first realized this some years ago watching a Thai movie where Thai people were going on vacation to Korea. A lady bumped into a man and she said excuse me in English. He was like no problem in English. Then whatever else happened and they realized they were both from Thailand and had gone to Seoul on the same flight.

I know many people that live here from countries such as Philippines, Laos, Cambodia and they get mistaken for being Thai by Thai people. Even LBM is Chinese and gets mistaken for Thai.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2447865]Thais can not even tell other Thais. I first realized this some years ago watching a Thai movie where Thai people were going on vacation to Korea. A lady bumped into a man and she said excuse me in English. He was like no problem in English. Then whatever else happened and they realized they were both from Thailand and had gone to Seoul on the same flight.

I know many people that live here from countries such as Philippines, Laos, Cambodia and they get mistaken for being Thai by Thai people. Even LBM is Chinese and gets mistaken for Thai.[/QUOTE]I believe Chinese tourists dress slightly different from your friendly neighborhood variety Thai motorcycle taxi. They can have distinct eye wear and man purses. Plus cameras. J and K pop has a different fashion sense also even if they are wearing knockoffs. The garden variety Soi 6 lass has a trained eye to spot the money train. Their spidey sense isn't perfect but their business acumen 'smells' the trail of foreign baht.

This is not full proof but Chinese can be short. I know their are Yao Ming's at the end of the spectrum or his buddy Sum that has a Laker championship ring. Usually they can expect their Chinese customers to not having Magnum XLs on the night stand.

[QUOTE=Pimpampoumpipo;2447850]I think that like many cases in the world it will depend on where it is applied. And we will have to make exceptions based on regional specificities. In family vacation clubs we will hope for the return of families. In tourist places to visit temples or beaches too.

But in very specific places like Pattaya it is entire regional economies that are impacted if prostitution activities are not restarted. On the other hand Thai officials (police and others) directly depend on the punctures they make in this parallel economy. They are very influential.

I have a friend who lives in Pattaya. He tells me (which is close to what Bananaboi says and the rumors circulating in Pattaya at the moment) that the farangs will be expelled and the Chinese mafia will take power. I dont know if there is a Chinese mafia ^^. But if the Chinese mafia takes over the business in Pattaya, the first thing they will do will be to reopen gogos and brothels and bring back the farangs because the farangs have money to run their business.[/QUOTE]Thais are aware of the damage the Chinese have done to Sihonoukville, Cambodia. They will not let the Chinese mafia take over Pattaya.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;2447895]Thais are aware of the damage the Chinese have done to Sihonoukville, Cambodia. They will not let the Chinese mafia take over Pattaya.[/QUOTE]That will depends on how desperate the Thai gov need Chinese funding.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2447827]I am doing my part for fellow punter and working girl health safety by reminding as many Thai P4P girls as possible that every Chinese customer they meet from now on will probably try to pass himself off as Japanese, Korean or Singaporean.

Spread the word.

They can still spend their time and money in the malls though 😁.[/QUOTE]Thais girls are much smarter than you think. Through internet news, they know the numbers n Europe, America are in worst situation now, while many Asian countries are starting to ease lockdown n flight travels.

[QUOTE=Datiao;2447916]That will depends on how desperate the Thai gov need Chinese funding.[/QUOTE]There's no way any mafia could take over the Thai mafia in Pattaya.

[QUOTE=Datiao;2447917]Thais girls are much smarter than you think. Through internet news, they know the numbers n Europe, America are in worst situation now, while many Asian countries are starting to ease lockdown n flight travels.[/QUOTE]You mean that they are smarter than other SE Asian wg?

I would never have thought that I would read anywhere that these girls are smart.

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[b][u]EDITOR'S NOTE[/u]:[/b] [blue]This report was edited to [u]remove text not in English[/u]. While I encourage contributions from all volunteers, the Forum is an English-only website. Please do not post reports in any language other than English. If you wish to post text in any language other than English, then please include a full English translation.[i]Thanks![/i][/blue]

Funny conversation?

I'm Chinese American, as I've noted even before I got darker no one ever thought of me being Chinese of course that was before they started coming. Even before the virus majority of the time, they had to ask or give me the head and toe go over. A few times particularly at the club Dollhouse the doorman stop me and ask if I was Thai. Whenever I entered into a GC on the Darkside for the first time things kind of come to a stop they usually think I'm Thai police. A number of times I've had to do some business down at Soi 6, I walk into a particular place ask ladies is the boss / manager here since the majority are owned by the Nightwish group usually one or a small group of whites sitting around I know one of them is in charge yet the ladies tell me " not here " or they play dumb.

When it comes to the Chinses Mafia (Triads) they have been here for a long long time already. The Chinese M. O. It isn't to be noticed they blend in and make agreements or partnerships like the Thais you have several levels, the basic motorbike taxi guy is your lowest but the Chinese aren't here in large groups particularly in Pattaya. If one does a bit of research one would find up at the Golden Triangle their history leaders have Chinese blood origin of Hakka. With the opening of the Chinese being able to travel, it is like the wild west many Triads rent homes on the Darkside to run their online gambling and do other business here. In Bangkok, they laundry money through real estate development the lower end Triads particularly from Hong Kong have pretty much brought up Condos in the Bang Na area which there is a huge Taiwan population. The largest present of the Triads in Thailand is the Chinese government who has made huge investments just like they have done in Africa the difference the Chinese / Thai consider themselves brothers whereas Africans aren't allowed to eat at McDonald's.

Mr. E, story I'm not going to confirm but a few years ago pass the dolphin circle at a local club of Thais got into a confrontation because one of their girlfriends was hooked up with a Chinese a fight erupted the Chinese group pretty much wipe the floor with the Thais it was reported in a local paper the Chinese group were Triads this brought attention to their presents for the Chinese that is a big no no.

With the virus, one has to remember the economy has hit everyone in the world it is no different for the West, Korean, Japanese, and Chinese if their economy bounce back quickly and there is income to burn they will return but right now aside from the Thai government Chinese is the main flavor of the day? I wrote before the lockdown I was at Kinnarree with my brother and cousins one girl spoke to my cousin from H. K. The next thing we know we have outcasted a girl who knew my brother later said the girl told everyone we were Chinese from Wuhan. Even my own wife tells me I wouldn't go around telling people you are Chinese although American.

It is all about money and who will have it first? Thais leaders like to come up with white lies July that would be a real stretch they would have to removed the mandates like 14-day quarantine and required insurance to enter. I was reading a report on the Airline industry until an effective vaccine is available and social distant in place that would mean less seating on flights and if the airline decides to operate it still need to break even or make a profit so fewer passengers on the plane even with lower fuel prices don't expect prices to go lower. Example: I checked the fares on Eva prior to May 1st, out of Bangkok 23,000 baht roundtrip this morning it went up to 40,000 baht.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2447630]I would consider a nominal amount (5-10k?) to my Freebie Girls but none have asked. Guess their Sponsors are already supporting them well.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=HorseTrader;2447646]I'm sure we can find some girls to make you feel included.[/QUOTE]Come to think of it it's the girls who are giving me money. Totally forgot I have one gogo girl paying for my monthly storage locker fee and a civilian girl topping up my phone monthly so my Thai number doesn't get cancelled.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2447975]Come to think of it it's the girls who are giving me money. Totally forgot I have one gogo girl paying for my monthly storage locker fee and a civilian girl topping up my phone monthly so my Thai number doesn't get cancelled.[/QUOTE]I'm impressed, you are a gigalo!

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2447975].....civilian girl topping up my phone monthly so my Thai number doesn't get cancelled.[/QUOTE]For those not lucky enough to have a Thai benefactor topping up their phone there is an inexpensive way to extend the expiry of your phone credit to a maximum of 12 months.

Let us say you a going to load THB200. Do it as one transaction and you will get 1 month extension. Do it as 10 transactions of THB20 (which I think was the minimum the terminal allowed) and you get 10 months on the entire balance. Works at the terminals in the telco stores and online top-up's. Family Mart and 7-eleven would probably be less happy to go through the process multiple times. I can only vouch for this for AIS and True Move.

How did I find this out? A very helpful assistant at an AIS store let me in on the "secret".

[QUOTE=Datiao;2447917]Thais girls are much smarter than you think. Through internet news, they know the numbers n Europe, America are in worst situation now, while many Asian countries are starting to ease lockdown n flight travels.[/QUOTE]You may be the only one in the world who believes the Chinese aren't lying about their death totals.

[QUOTE=Paolo99;2447921]There's no way any mafia could take over the Thai mafia in Pattaya.[/QUOTE]Far from expert on the subject, but I won't be this sure of Chinese mafia not trying to strengthen their foothold in Pattaya or government asking China for help. After taking almost complete control of Cambodia's casino industry, it's possible they try to increase their online gambling business in Pattaya.

This just reminded me of 2 girls who I found on tinder, both Chinese, both making excuses to meet and saying they're stuck here because of flight ban and will be back home soon. Both tried to force me to signup for sone "gaming" site called MBK or something. I guess this is online betting site. Obviously I didn't. Either they were part of this mafia and trying to find dudes on Tinder and push them to platform or they were going to get some commission for the number of sign-ups.

So just to warn others if someone came across theae type of girls, be cautious.

[QUOTE=Paolo99;2447922]You mean that they are smarter than other SE Asian wg?

I would never have thought that I would read anywhere that these girls are smart.[/QUOTE]I meant they are not so easy to bluff by mongers w regards to previous post.

Maybe you should try Viet girls if you think all are not smart.

[QUOTE=GettingFedUp;2447982]For those not lucky enough to have a Thai benefactor topping up their phone there is an inexpensive way to extend the expiry of your phone credit to a maximum of 12 months.

Let us say you a going to load THB200. Do it as one transaction and you will get 1 month extension. Do it as 10 transactions of THB20 (which I think was the minimum the terminal allowed) and you get 10 months on the entire balance. Works at the terminals in the telco stores and online top-up's. Family Mart and 7-eleven would probably be less happy to go through the process multiple times. I can only vouch for this for AIS and True Move.

How did I find this out? A very helpful assistant at an AIS store let me in on the "secret".[/QUOTE]Hahaha I'm getting murdered by AIS to the tune of 93 B a week for data roaming in Cambodia so at least I get my extension, I'm good to like May 2021 LOL.

[QUOTE=GettingFedUp;2447982]For those not lucky enough to have a Thai benefactor topping up their phone there is an inexpensive way to extend the expiry of your phone credit to a maximum of 12 months.

Let us say you a going to load THB200. Do it as one transaction and you will get 1 month extension. Do it as 10 transactions of THB20 (which I think was the minimum the terminal allowed) and you get 10 months on the entire balance. Works at the terminals in the telco stores and online top-up's. Family Mart and 7-eleven would probably be less happy to go through the process multiple times. I can only vouch for this for AIS and True Move.

How did I find this out? A very helpful assistant at an AIS store let me in on the "secret".[/QUOTE]I'm in the US and my AIS 1-2-Call Sim card expires in early August, 2020. Due to the virus I won't be returning before August. Can I keep my SIM active beyond August by doing small top ups each month at the AIS website? Also should I install the Thai Sim back into my phone when I do the top up? Any suggestions?

[QUOTE=Allover;2448068]Can I keep my SIM active beyond August by doing small top ups each month at the AIS website? Also should I install the Thai Sim back into my phone when I do the top up?[/QUOTE]Yes you can do top ups online to keep the number active. I think it is 10 baht per month that you need to pay. As has already been said, you have to do separate transactions for each month you want. So if you want it to last 5 months do 10 baht 5 times. There is no need to put the SIM into your phone.

[QUOTE=Allover;2448068]I'm in the US and my AIS 1-2-Call Sim card expires in early August, 2020. Due to the virus I won't be returning before August. Can I keep my SIM active beyond August by doing small top ups each month at the AIS website? Also should I install the Thai Sim back into my phone when I do the top up? Any suggestions?[/QUOTE]It is recommended to do several small top-ups instead of one big top-up if my memory serves me right. Someone told me once after I had (mistakenly) topped up 1000 baht at one go. It was not at all the same as topping up 10 x 100 baht as far as lengthening validity was concerned.

[QUOTE=Datiao;2447917]Thais girls are much smarter than you think. Through internet news, they know the numbers n Europe, America are in worst situation now, while many Asian countries are starting to ease lockdown n flight travels.[/QUOTE]I don't conclude that they are smart or stupid. In general, they lack critical thinking skills like common sense, not everyone born gets in line are given the same amount it has to be nurtured and their education system just doesn't provide it. They hear something and they simply believe and go with it just like they side with family even when they are wrong from my own experience the Thais make fun of the Chinese habits but consider to be closer to them than people from the West.

Even my own wife as far as she has come with me and I with her understand the Virus yet she thinks foreigners are the reason for the virus and it spread. I said yesterday the lockout is coming to an end we can go inside Pattaya, she says I don't want to be around Farangs right now! I'm sitting right there I'm whiter inside than many Americans. At a recent small gathering for my granddaughter's Birthday, one family friend member mentioned the spread in the USA I wanted to get a reaction so I spoke up and explain why and that the USA People are pissed that when all said and done there will be a War Thailand government will have to decide who is their friend China or USA That raised a lot of heads.

When one speaks of Thai people break it down when it comes to WG, in general, I wouldn't say they are smart they are SLICK and know how to play the game. When it comes to the general population tough to say smart when many feel Thailand is basically the center of the earth, a population that doesn't even know where their former K--g was born, where the car or the airplane was invented, can't locate a country outside of the ASEAN group, of course, my comments are a bit bias maybe I've lived here too long?

[QUOTE=LittleBigMan;2448177]I don't conclude that they are smart or stupid. In general, they lack critical thinking skills like common sense, not everyone born gets in line are given the same amount it has to be nurtured and their education system just doesn't provide it. They hear something and they simply believe and go with it just like they side with family even when they are wrong from my own experience the Thais make fun of the Chinese habits but consider to be closer to them than people from the West.
[/QUOTE]Thats a long reply.

My post is definitely in regards to Thai working girls and things associated w mongering.

My experience is Viet working girls are smartest out of the SEA mongering countries. 3 months ago I was asked to put on a mask while doing her. Hardest country to monger.

Bangkok to where?

[QUOTE=LittleBigMan;2447936]Funny conversation?

I'm Chinese American, as I've noted even before I got darker no one ever thought of me being Chinese of course that was before they started coming. Even before the virus majority of the time, they had to ask or give me the head and toe go over. A few times particularly at the club Dollhouse the doorman stop me and ask if I was Thai. Whenever I entered into a GC on the Darkside for the first time things kind of come to a stop they usually think I'm Thai police. A number of times I've had to do some business down at Soi 6, I walk into a particular place ask ladies is the boss / manager here since the majority are owned by the Nightwish group usually one or a small group of whites sitting around I know one of them is in charge yet the ladies tell me " not here " or they play dumb.

When it comes to the Chinses Mafia (Triads) they have been here for a long long time already. The Chinese M. O. It isn't to be noticed they blend in and make agreements or partnerships like the Thais you have several levels, the basic motorbike taxi guy is your lowest but the Chinese aren't here in large groups particularly in Pattaya. If one does a bit of research one would find up at the Golden Triangle their history leaders have Chinese blood origin of Hakka. With the opening of the Chinese being able to travel, it is like the wild west many Triads rent homes on the Darkside to run their online gambling and do other business here. In Bangkok, they laundry money through real estate development the lower end Triads particularly from Hong Kong have pretty much brought up Condos in the Bang Na area which there is a huge Taiwan population. The largest present of the Triads in Thailand is the Chinese government who has made huge investments just like they have done in Africa the difference the Chinese / Thai consider themselves brothers whereas Africans aren't allowed to eat at McDonald's.

Mr. E, story I'm not going to confirm but a few years ago pass the dolphin circle at a local club of Thais got into a confrontation because one of their girlfriends was hooked up with a Chinese a fight erupted the Chinese group pretty much wipe the floor with the Thais it was reported in a local paper the Chinese group were Triads this brought attention to their presents for the Chinese that is a big no no.

With the virus, one has to remember the economy has hit everyone in the world it is no different for the West, Korean, Japanese, and Chinese if their economy bounce back quickly and there is income to burn they will return but right now aside from the Thai government Chinese is the main flavor of the day? I wrote before the lockdown I was at Kinnarree with my brother and cousins one girl spoke to my cousin from H. K. The next thing we know we have outcasted a girl who knew my brother later said the girl told everyone we were Chinese from Wuhan. Even my own wife tells me I wouldn't go around telling people you are Chinese although American.

It is all about money and who will have it first? Thais leaders like to come up with white lies July that would be a real stretch they would have to removed the mandates like 14-day quarantine and required insurance to enter. I was reading a report on the Airline industry until an effective vaccine is available and social distant in place that would mean less seating on flights and if the airline decides to operate it still need to break even or make a profit so fewer passengers on the plane even with lower fuel prices don't expect prices to go lower. Example: I checked the fares on Eva prior to May 1st, out of Bangkok 23,000 baht roundtrip this morning it went up to 40,000 baht.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2447983]You may be the only one in the world who believes the Chinese aren't lying about their death totals.[/QUOTE]I m not interested in politics, I m just a monger interested in only interactions w working girls and their behaviour.

Lets just leave the politicking to the leaders of these countries.

I'm my area, lower Sukhumvit Bangkok, salons, beerhouses, restaurants opened today for sitting inside. One of the massage shop owner was cleaning the place yesterday and I asked him when he is thinking he can open it, he said he is expecting by second week of may.

[QUOTE=Tomasb;2448204]Bangkok to where?[/QUOTE]Bangkok to SFO, in September and Feb 2021 April 20-30th, both were at 22-23,000 baht. My coffee mate BKK to London June went up just a bit but nowhere near my destination. I check from SFO to BKK for end of October to Dec 15th, Coach is just shy of $700 USD.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2447630]Still have no girls asking me for money. Feeling left out. I guess it pays to look and act like a broke ass bastard when I'm at the gogo bars. Either that or I just don't come across as a "jai dee".

I would consider a nominal amount (5-10k?) to my Freebie Girls but none have asked. Guess their Sponsors are already supporting them well.[/QUOTE]As long as it makes you feel warm and fuzzy inside then send it. But don't do it on the pretense that they are hurting. I hit one of my freebie chicks up today and was going to tell her to come by so I could bless her with some money this time. She hit me on video call and was at the damn tattoo shop getting a big ass tattoo. That is the kind of shit your money is going to. Nobody here is starving or getting put out folks.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2448278]As long as it makes you feel warm and fuzzy inside then send it. But don't do it on the pretense that they are hurting. I hit one of my freebie chicks up today and was going to tell her to come by so I could bless her with some money this time. She hit me on video call and was at the damn tattoo shop getting a big ass tattoo. That is the kind of shit your money is going to. Nobody here is starving or getting put out folks.[/QUOTE]The only girls I know who are "freebie" chicks are already supported by their parents and never need any money.

There are absolutely girls out there who do need money right now.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2448315]The only girls I know who are "freebie" chicks are already supported by their parents and never need any money.

There are absolutely girls out there who do need money right now.[/QUOTE]I agree with that. My freebies are not hitting me up for money now same as they didn't before. Even though I have mentioned it since I know their regular job hours and conditions were reduced and changed during the lockdown. But, as you say, they also tend to have more supportive family to lean on.

However, P4P girls who could have worked other jobs in the past if they'd been so inclined were always hitting me up for money one way or another, primarily by wanting to have another session with me asap. Lol. Which is the way I want it to be. The difference currently being there are no other jobs for them to take right now. So I can't exactly brush them off with that recommendation.

Combine that with a crap family situation and that makes it different this time around.

On the other hand, at the very least we should be using these times to demand and expect "more" and "better" than most of these girls are used to doling out in their line of business. If that is the greatest hardship they have to endure during this exceptional time, no big deal and, frankly, that would ultimately be a better trend to start establishing for everyone all around anyway.

After all, Thai/Asian women of child-bearing age survived very difficult times long before Farang mongers showed up in their country, didn't they? So if we are simply the best and most convenient well for them to dip their bucket into these days, they should know and be willing to accept the logical new terms of engagement. My favorite repeats seem to totally understand and are fine with it.

For those who thought I may be fluent in Swahili or Paakantyi I was simply posting cheers in Thai on hearing the alcohol ban had been lifted. My apologizes to our esteemed Editor.

The world against covid-19 (Sorry guys).

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=66BzhRYKPdI[/URL] ("we are at war" ("nous sommes en guerre") President Emmanuel Macron announces lockdown to France - 03/16/2020)

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JXSzyLoRvX8[/URL] (Not on covid-19 but on closing borders)

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GqZyuBIZ_2Q[/URL] (Prime minister of Japan Shinzo Abe)

[QUOTE=Crazy4Thai;2447538]I too support this position and I have sent 3000 baht a couple of times. I used Transferwise to send and the fee was ridiculously small. The money arrived in about 2 hours.

C4 T.[/QUOTE]Also used Transferwise, and was very impressed.

[URL]https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/04/world/asia/china-coronavirus-answers.html?action=click&module=Spotlight&pgtype=Homepage[/URL]

[QUOTE=Chacal60;2448581]Also used Transferwise, and was very impressed.[/QUOTE]Transferwise is the dogs bollocks. 14 seconds today is all it took for a worthy cause charitable donation to transfer from my debit card in Europe to a grateful recipients account in South East Thailand.

She used a tiny portion (obviously) to top up my DTAC Thai SIM at one of the machines (pictured below) which are located outside lots of 7-11 and other stores. Topping up by any amount extends the validity of your SIM by one month, so as mentioned above rather than top up by 100 Baht and get one month extension get your local contact to top up 5 times of 20 Baht each and you get 5 months extension of validity. The machines sometimes (yeah TIT) charge an additional commission of 2 Baht.

LBM, couldn't find the post about where you said that airline seat prices seemingly doubled overnight. This may be the case with some airlines because they have said they will fly half full and there will never be anyone sitting in a seat beside you. Great that you more or less get 2 seats to yourself now.

I did a check on EVA and Cathay flights from where I will most likely be flying to SEA from and prices all seem the same as pre-COVID between now and January, 2021.

[QUOTE=Gargano19;2445430]3 mongers /150? Few of my flights.

1. From Tokyo to bkk, plane was full of young guys (early 20's to late) and old alone dudes. I'd say 30-40%. And I have seen that ratio a few times.

2. From Delhi to bkk, lots of groups of guys, and ofcourse families too. But still not 3 out of 150, not even close.

3. Singapore and Hong Kong where I have travelled a lot last year, planes are full of Single man (not with anyone, don't know about their relationship status). I'd say 30%. Now how many of them are mongers and how many are here for business reasons (and both ofcourse), no one can tell by just looks.

4. Berlin, all they talk about in plane is about nana and walking street LOL, don't get me started. Obviously exaggerating about "all", but you got my point.

Never been to middle east, so can't comment about there flight demographics, bur maybe others can shed some light.[/QUOTE]A huge amount of men on this planet are "single" and will stay forever, so yes, these guys you saw on the plane were most likely "single".

99% of the women on this planet have at least 10 guys who want to get in their pants, even if they are ugly or old. Don't kid yourself.

[QUOTE=EdSetra;2448656]Transferwise is the dogs bollocks. 14 seconds today is all it took for a worthy cause charitable donation to transfer from my debit card in Europe to a grateful recipients account in South East Thailand.

She used a tiny portion (obviously) to top up my DTAC Thai SIM at one of the machines (pictured below) which are located outside lots of 7-11 and other stores. Topping up by any amount extends the validity of your SIM by one month, so as mentioned above rather than top up by 100 Baht and get one month extension get your local contact to top up 5 times of 20 Baht each and you get 5 months extension of validity. The machines sometimes (yeah TIT) charge an additional commission of 2 Baht.[/QUOTE]You seem a bit clueless, firstly for transferring your money like a mug to a woman who is probably earning more money than ever from her other sponsors and secondly because you don't realise you can top up your own simcard using the DTAC smartphone app.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2448698]
I did a check on EVA and Cathay flights from where I will most likely be flying to SEA from and prices all seem the same as pre-COVID between now and January, 2021.[/QUOTE]What date did you check? EVA price is higher than before for me. Nothing below $1000 from west coast starting from June.

[QUOTE=TheNextOne;2448781]99% of the women on this planet have at least 10 guys who want to get in their pants, even if they are ugly or old. Don't kid yourself.[/QUOTE]Sorry for asking but may I ask which planet do you live on? Is it even in The Milky Way or perhaps a galaxy far far away.

[QUOTE=Nounce;2448864]What date did you check? EVA price is higher than before for me. Nothing below $1000 from west coast starting from June.[/QUOTE]I think it's been said a few times before but I would strongly advise not paying for any airline tickets until there is some pronouncements about resumption of visa issuance.

That goes for all countries, not just Thailand. You risk not getting a refund if things do not open up as you hoped.

All airlines are trying to sell tickets now to generate some cash flow. Read the very small print if you book and pay for a ticket within the next few months.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2448698]LBM, couldn't find the post about where you said that airline seat prices seemingly doubled overnight. This may be the case with some airlines because they have said they will fly half full and there will never be anyone sitting in a seat beside you. Great that you more or less get 2 seats to yourself now.

I did a check on EVA and Cathay flights from where I will most likely be flying to SEA from and prices all seem the same as pre-COVID between now and January, 2021.[/QUOTE]I fly Eva exclusively! From Bangkok to SFO, I also check SFO / BKK since I keep track of my cousin who also uses Eva exclusively.

As of BKK / SFO I book a flight back twice a year Sept after Labor Day and Jan / Feb Chinese New Year pretty I pretty much have a book on Eva pattern as to how they structure their pricing and when it starts to drop throughout the year.

Let's take the Booking for Feb 11-21st of 2021, when as soon as it was within a year Feb 10th of 2020 I logged on and the prices cheapest fare in the range of 12,400 BKK / SFO 10,350 SFO / BKK let say total 23,000 baht without paying for the seats. This was a bit unusual for EVA since once the fares are posted a year in advance the fare lasts two years cheapest 52,000 but after two months the fare is reposted usually around 23-25,000 baht and up I usually wait another month and purchased if I can get something 23-25,000. This is the same for September 8-18 right after Labor Day when I look a number of times prior to May 1st, it was round trip 23,000 baht.

I told my brother I sense something isn't right? In thought, April 30th was the set date for some type of announcement plus I had just read and spoken to an old friend who writes articles about the airline industry and things look bleak for the future so I told my brother if the price is still the same on May 1st 23,000 baht I'm booking regardless of the virus situation. May 1st, when I logged on for those dates the price now it is something like 19,000-20,000 round it off 39,000 okay Not exactly double. This is the same price for the September trip, what I've noticed this year since the virus Eva prices seem to be standard which isn't their history in a calendar month. For example, I could run dates like in September the prices will differ each day and week but it is the same every day across the board. Because of this, I think it has something to do with the virus it goes against how airlines market their tickets they know everything to a science because of that I will wait it out and see what happens I cross my fingers it goes down.

As noted the fare still cheap from SFO / BKK the dates I check were Oct 31st-Dec 15th round it out $700.00 before the purchase of seats. Normally, fares on Eva are low March into the middle of May thereafter summer approaches and the fares are high until right after Labor Day the reason I also book after in fact usually right on 9/11 is my departure date. Right around Dec 15th, the prices jump until after New Years' 5th, the price is reduced. That is the pattern I noticed in the last five years.

I track Eva because it is the best airline I've flown to Asia out of SFO, I also received reduce travel on them standby but the last few years due to all the codeshare agreement it has been tough getting on with the fare being low I just do the purchase and make sure my two bags reach 23 Kilos each.

[QUOTE=Nounce;2448864]What date did you check? EVA price is higher than before for me. Nothing below $1000 from west coast starting from June.[/QUOTE]I checked various dates to BKK leaving September / October 2020 and returning January / February 2021.

Totally agree with Red Kilt. I personally will not book a ticket until it is clear that Thailand borders have reopened.

[QUOTE=RedKilt;2448915]I think it's been said a few times before but I would strongly advise not paying for any airline tickets until there is some pronouncements about resumption of visa issuance.

That goes for all countries, not just Thailand. You risk not getting a refund if things do not open up as you hoped.

All airlines are trying to sell tickets now to generate some cash flow. Read the very small print if you book and pay for a ticket within the next few months.[/QUOTE]Right now you can book cheap flights to many destinations. Fine print says there is no cancellation fee and funds can be used till 2022. Problem is Airlines gets to keep the money. And on your next chosen date fare maybe higher and they will hit you for that.

General consensus is to hold off buying anything. In all likelihood there will not be a mad rush of regular as well as monger tourists for some time till medicine and vaccine comes online.

I am one of those who book 6- 8 months ahead to get the best deals for airline and hotel bookings.

[QUOTE=Sammon;2448991]Right now you can book cheap flights to many destinations. Fine print says there is no cancellation fee and funds can be used till 2022. Problem is Airlines gets to keep the money. And on your next chosen date fare maybe higher and they will hit you for that.[/QUOTE]It think RK was referring to the increasing chance that airlines declare bankruptcy before pre booked tickets or credit notes are being used. In this case, unsecured creditors can kiss any money goodbye.

Where I am, we are just starting to see airlines collapse and I'm sure they won't be the last.

Enjoy. G.

Goferring is astute: booking sites are crap, asymmetric risk, your "bargain" is a bit of ink on paper against a company strategically planning Chapter 11 or the local equivalent, meaning you are merely an unsecured creditor with aspirations that complicit management and creditors and bondhlders looking to screw over penny pinching marginal benefit customers (creditors), pension funds, staff and others. USD 15 trillion of corporate debt, bonds, derivatives and so on. Already predicated on fake accounting is yet to be shown up for the lies and deceit it always was.

You will lose!

The sites themselves are incorporated in tropical isles with arbitration clauses etc to maximally transfer risk one-way. As for enforcing against a Thai hotel, good luck with that. Save your cash. It will be not COD but sperm on delivery in a pretty girly mouth.

Where P = 1 hour GFE, you=median utilization rate in T, T=time.

Sound value is UP / T, versus marriage that is fractional you for dubious P over unbounded time x T, aka over subscription in a monopoly or GPS. This is suspect is the root of feminist objections, bypassing the compulsory subscription for the equivalent of a gig economy pussy. The female is a wasting asset and has limited time to sell the oversubscription which the hobby undermines. Their real beef is sex pricing data being transparent versus other value add. Any many have nothing but sex to sell. There are some amazing, high value women worth far beyond pussy. They are unicorns. However, plenty of fat, out of shape beta males too, so they exploit the above.

From Wham (1982) "Go for it" George Micheal:

Young guns, having some fun crazy ladies keep 'them on the run.
Wise guys realize there's danger in emotional ties.
See me, single and free no tears, no fears, what I want to be.
One, two, take a look at you death by matrimony.

CHORUS.

Hey sucker.

(What the hell's got into you?
Hey sucker.
(Now there's nothing you can do.).

I understand the point of not booking for an airline ticket it is a personal choice as what you think might happen. The question to me is the airline going to shut its doors I've been involved with 3 airline bankruptcy that doesn't make me an expert and yes the passengers are the one that will suffer aside from maybe not getting all their money back fast or all of it they fare better than the employees because of one of the objectives of the judge is to keep the airline afloat and keep jobs even if their wages and benefits are cut or even eliminated.

Once out of bankruptcy the first market plan is to get their regulars back with incentives second if they do actually shut their doors for good other airlines usually will come forward to make good whole or part for those stuck with airline or vouchers. Now, this might not sit well with any of you particular as mention if the price is higher and you have to pay more or the remaining airline service aren't up to par with your travel needs. In all the bankruptcy none of the airlines ever stopped operating even for one day in fact if you are a gambler that is when investors are standing by to invest since the operating cost has been lower with that a greater chance of making a quick profit.

The last ten years right after bankruptcy, United merge or buy Continental, Northwest / Delta, USAirways / American West, USAirways / American, of course, none of these are International airlines like Eva or Cathay Pacific regardless of it isn't as bleak as one thinks?

Now of course none of this history really applies today to the Virus, no one has ever seen anything like this before if you are like me the moment you wake up Virus till the moment you put your head on the pillow it is Virus even if you follow all the procedure not to get it your face still itch, there is so much talk of the virus I feel like a virus. When it comes to travel I know when I need to travel it isn't for mongering so I'm going to book ahead even if it is a year in advance I read all the fine print and balance it all out sometimes you come out ahead sometimes you come up short that is just life that includes P4 P too.

The virus has brought a new frontier to traveling and it isn't going to be pretty for the next few years will there be airline closing for good yes contrary to history but the market will still be there those who collapse was already collapsing no different than bars and GoGo. On a personal note, I hope 100% of the monopoly owned places in Pattaya Soi 6, LK Metro all close down and they can take their website and all those clowns who run around Pattaya at night as if they run the town and go home.

[QUOTE=LittleBigMan;2449025]

The last ten years right after bankruptcy, United merge or buy Continental, Northwest / Delta, USAirways / American West, USAirways / American, of course, none of these are International airlines like Eva or Cathay Pacific regardless of it isn't as bleak as one thinks?

[/QUOTE]Outside of the USA, most countries do not have chapter 11 bankruptcy protection. If a airline goes into administration, like Virgin Australia has, they can try to trade out or be sold off, but they are not protected in the same way as companies under Ch 11.

I wouldn't personally book flights now. Even if the airline stays afloat, the route you have bought may be cancelled and a credit note may not be of any use.

[QUOTE=Kerrstar;2449042]Outside of the USA, most countries do not have chapter 11 bankruptcy protection. If a airline goes into administration, like Virgin Australia has, they can try to trade out or be sold off, but they are not protected in the same way as companies under Ch 11.

I wouldn't personally book flights now. Even if the airline stays afloat, the route you have bought may be cancelled and a credit note may not be of any use.[/QUOTE]This is the headache, you will get. You book now. You pay now. The flight that you haven booked is "non guaranteed" as it may be delayed or cancelled. So yeah, it's likely what you see is not what you will get. In case if it's cancelled as the date gets nearer, you are entitled to credit or a refund. Refund will take, um. Err. If you take the credit, your payment will be applied to the next available "for sure" flight plus an increase in airfare. In that case, why didn't you just wait in the first place. Oh because you fell for the old "show them a cheap price, non guaranteed flight during a pandemic with world wide travel restrictions" gimmick. Thanks for helping us pay our bills. Hopefully we left you enough money to buy some Vaseline for the next time you get screwed. Those fine prints keep getting more fine, longer, complex in language, and tinier to read. Why do governments allow this to happen? Two flights have been cancelled on my part. So let me just sit still and take out my aggression my punishing hot wet Thai pussy, maybe a Russian in BTW, and chilling at Pattaya Beach. I'm going to be a sitting duck waiting this out.

[QUOTE=Kerrstar;2449042]Outside of the USA, most countries do not have chapter 11 bankruptcy protection. If a airline goes into administration, like Virgin Australia has, they can try to trade out or be sold off, but they are not protected in the same way as companies under Ch 11.

I wouldn't personally book flights now. Even if the airline stays afloat, the route you have bought may be cancelled and a credit note may not be of any use.[/QUOTE]Thank may be true about Ch 11 outside of the USA But many of the laws or procedure are still the same or close, as you noted if they are traded out or sold the receiver are going to try to make good with the customer they aren't going to screw you and think you are going to come back willingly. If that was the case I wouldn't ever fly with the new owner they can offer all the mileage they want it isn't going to happen. Marketing is the same everywhere get the customer and retain them. You watch Qantas! If Evaair, for example, was going to be traded out or sold China Airline will be contacting me before the ink is dry they will honor the credit the same when Eva overbooked a flight they put me on China and China upgraded me Business.

It all comes down to who you are flying I watch a Bloomberg interview the CEO of Ryan Airline he was complaining about going out of business he treats his customer like shit and if he goes under good and those using them I think in Ryan case yes the credit note will be useless. If you use China Southern they go under expect it up the ass with a red hot poker and they will look you straight in the face like the Wuhan Virus it wasn't us! It is a choice and what you believe when I do book with Eva I'm not going to lose any sleep over them going under.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2448904]Sorry for asking but may I ask which planet do you live on? Is it even in The Milky Way or perhaps a galaxy far far away.[/QUOTE]I live in the real world, unlike you. You're hiding away from the truth because it hurts, but you know I'm right deep down.

If the woman is even remotely attractive, she has a lot of men who want her. Period. If you deny that, you're simply an idiot. That was what my message was trying to get at.

Let me elaborate my point with facts.

- In Quatar, the population is around 3 million.

Amongst the 3 million, a few oligarchs, who have have the best looking women in their harems, and 98% of ugly low skilled workers men from Pakistan, who spend their entire days working construction. They never get any pussy. Trust me.

- In India, the female to male sex ratio is absolutely horrifying. That's why you have, and the entire internet is making fun of Indians trying to find a partner.

In fact, Indians are even made fun of here, because they usually register with pathetic messages like "please help me trying to find a female".

Look at the Indian subforums, the admins of [URL]http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/[/URL] actually BAN this kind of desperate message on this forum.

You never see any woman doing this, because women have unlimited dating choices.

And not all females are attractive.

Once again, the attractive Indian girls have millions of Indians men "in love" with them.

- Same in China. Here are documentaries of all the "single Chinese men" who are left behind:

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u4orQ0p788k[/URL]

[URL]https://www.france24.com/en/20170609-video-reporters-china-millions-single-chinese-men-desperately-seeking-wife[/URL]

- In Europe, it's the same story.

Look for the video "incels spark civil war in Europe" from Black Pigeon Speaks too.

The Female to Male ratio is already bad in Germany. It got even worse in 2015 when Merkel imported millions of low IQ slaves to fill up the factories.

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CuhLRzP2-0Y[/URL]

Everywhere in the world, look at youtube: any remotely attractive girl gets 10 million views, even if her content is sh*t.

Look at this little polish working girl:

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n1V6iMUCPtg[/URL]

She's not even that attractive, but she still gets millions of messages from horny men online; and in fact, she is making fun of them in this video.

You get my point or are you still not getting it? I have plenty of other examples.

You're a regular here right? You must have seen a lot of girls in your years. Why don't you ask girls themselves? I have asked them. Even "average looking" working girls have a lot of regulars who want to fuck them.

Why do only men pay in tinder? Why do women get into any night club easily? Etc. Do I have to keep going?

The Female to Male ratio everywhere is skewed in females's favor, and once again, I'm not even talking about attractive girls.

Attractive healthy slim girls are on another level, they soon will have around 5 billions of men who want to get into their pants.

That's the way it is. I live on Planet earth, and these are my observations after 2 years of studying the Dating Market.

They care about business class, but that's all. Economy passengers are neutral at best and have no loyalty, points etc is just BS marketing for the vast majority, to encourage them to to exchange real cash for Alice in Wonderland marketing babble. Ryan air is more open about it, but make no mistake about the margins and tight cashflow. Even with super cheap oil (JET-A1) and 90% loadings in passengers and cargo, airlines are a risky business, and passengers have short memories.

Their insolvency folks and bondholders know that. I would not be buying hotels and airline tickets, no matter what they promise about no change fees etc. A more accurate description would be a donation to their corrupt and stupid bankers that lent insane amounts of cash for a marginal business.

[QUOTE=TheNextOne;2449104]I live in the real world, unlike you. You're hiding away from the truth because it hurts, but you know I'm right deep down.

If the woman is even remotely attractive, she has a lot of men who want her. Period. If you deny that, you're simply an idiot. That was what my message was trying to get at.

Let me elaborate my point with facts.

- In Quatar, the population is around 3 million.

Amongst the 3 million, a few oligarchs, who have have the best looking women in their harems, and 98% of ugly low skilled workers men from Pakistan, who spend their entire days working construction. They never get any pussy. Trust me.

- In India, the female to male sex ratio is absolutely horrifying. That's why you have, and the entire internet is making fun of Indians trying to find a partner.

In fact, Indians are even made fun of here, because they usually register with pathetic messages like "please help me trying to find a female".

Look at the Indian subforums, the admins of [URL]http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/[/URL] actually BAN this kind of desperate message on this forum.

You never see any woman doing this, because women have unlimited dating choices.

And not all females are attractive.

Once again, the attractive Indian girls have millions of Indians men "in love" with them.

- Same in China. Here are documentaries of all the "single Chinese men" who are left behind:

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u4orQ0p788k[/URL]

[URL]https://www.france24.com/en/20170609-video-reporters-china-millions-single-chinese-men-desperately-seeking-wife[/URL]

- In Europe, it's the same story.

Look for the video "incels spark civil war in Europe" from Black Pigeon Speaks too.

The Female to Male ratio is already bad in Germany. It got even worse in 2015 when Merkel imported millions of low IQ slaves to fill up the factories.

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CuhLRzP2-0Y[/URL]

Everywhere in the world, look at youtube: any remotely attractive girl gets 10 million views, even if her content is sh*t.

Look at this little polish working girl:

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n1V6iMUCPtg[/URL]

She's not even that attractive, but she still gets millions of messages from horny men online; and in fact, she is making fun of them in this video.

You get my point or are you still not getting it? I have plenty of other examples.

You're a regular here right? You must have seen a lot of girls in your years. Why don't you ask girls themselves? I have asked them. Even "average looking" working girls have a lot of regulars who want to fuck them.

Why do only men pay in tinder? Why do women get into any night club easily? Etc. Do I have to keep going?

The Female to Male ratio everywhere is skewed in females's favor, and once again, I'm not even talking about attractive girls.

Attractive healthy slim girls are on another level, they soon will have around 5 billions of men who want to get into their pants.

That's the way it is. I live on Planet earth, and these are my observations after 2 years of studying the Dating Market.[/QUOTE]While your observations have some merit, I think you are leaving out one important factor. The vast majority of these men do not have the ability to travel, do not have the ability to take care of a gal, and are trying to sell themselves on their personality and if they have any, looks alone. As some would say they don't have a pot to piss in or a window to throw it out of. Contrast that with many of men living in and traveling to Thailand who are not wealthy like Qatari princess, but do have the ability to pay, and many are unencumbered by wives or children. Women realize this. They know that 99% of the men that contact them are a no-go.

[QUOTE=PahllusMaximus;2449149]They care about business class, but that's all. Economy passengers are neutral at best and have no loyalty, points etc is just BS marketing for the vast majority, to encourage them to to exchange real cash for Alice in Wonderland marketing babble. Ryan air is more open about it, but make no mistake about the margins and tight cashflow. Even with super cheap oil (JET-A1) and 90% loadings in passengers and cargo, airlines are a risky business, and passengers have short memories.

Their insolvency folks and bondholders know that. I would not be buying hotels and airline tickets, no matter what they promise about no change fees etc. A more accurate description would be a donation to their corrupt and stupid bankers that lent insane amounts of cash for a marginal business.[/QUOTE]As I noted it is really a personal choice as to what one wants to do, I defend myself and my views only and make a decision when I do I live with it. Just like the financial market you can never time it.

Yes, First and Business class is important but even if you charge top price and fill each seat it doesn't provide a large enough profit. Believe it or not, the airlines have stats for everything including what it cost to have a can of coke on the aircraft, every piece of equipment example food cart empty or full has a number, it isn't all about passengers there is also cargo and mail there are even contracts with companies like UPS, FedEx, DHL, what can't be delivered by trucks commercial aircraft are used.

When it comes to Passengers sure more attention is paid to the high flyers all the attractions their clubs, I use Eva because I fly them exclusively but their marketing is the same worldwide, they have programs to attract you back even in economy minimum trips per year gets you to the next level card that gives you the use of some of their clubs, a number of times on a crowded flight I've been moved to Economy plus and Economy plus to Business to show their appreciation when the seats go empty.

In an IATA report recently that social distance wouldn't work on airlines to make a profit since in general even before the virus you need you got to have a 70% load factor to make a profit. That being said I'm no expert but 30 plus years in the industry I've sold tickets, done Cargo, mail and loaded my share of bags manually and by machine, done years of aircraft load planning and seen tons of profit and loss statement in contract negotiation it isn't all about just Business class.

Yes, Airlines are one of the riskiest business in the world, but like every business, it just isn't about the airlines there are thousands of vendors involved into a flight to a spoon, blanket, and pillow that is used the list is endless. There is no loyalty it is about the lowest fare best bang for your money but in 3 bankruptcy whether the program is enough for the passenger who got screwed is enough is to be determined by each traveler but make no mistake they do try whether it is enough for you and everyone that is the big question but it isn't all about Business class.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2448717]I'll guess China, Korea, Japan are first in. USA and UK will be last in. Europe will be just before USA and UK. Even though Russia is going to down the tubes in this they will be ahead of the rest of Europe because Thailand loves the Russians.

There's always been a lot of bickering on a non-hobby board that Farang are unwanted in Thailand. The order Thailand opens up to foreign travelers will speak volumes on who Thailand wants in their country the most and, more importantly, who they don't want.[/QUOTE]So it begins. China and South Korea the first to removed from Thailand's COVID hotspots. Not open to air travel yet but this is the first step.

[QUOTE=TheNextOne;2449104]I live in the real world, unlike you. You're hiding away from the truth because it hurts, but you know I'm right deep down.

If the woman is even remotely attractive, she has a lot of men who want her. Period. If you deny that, you're simply an idiot. That was what my message was trying to get at.

Let me elaborate my point with facts.

- In Quatar, the population is around 3 million.

Amongst the 3 million, a few oligarchs, who have have the best looking women in their harems, and 98% of ugly low skilled workers men from Pakistan, who spend their entire days working construction. They never get any pussy. Trust me.

- In India, the female to male sex ratio is absolutely horrifying. That's why you have, and the entire internet is making fun of Indians trying to find a partner.

In fact, Indians are even made fun of here, because they usually register with pathetic messages like "please help me trying to find a female".

Look at the Indian subforums, the admins of [URL]http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/[/URL] actually BAN this kind of desperate message on this forum.

You never see any woman doing this, because women have unlimited dating choices..[/QUOTE]As a respectful consideration of the time and effort you put into the above I had thought of a longer reply delving into empirically grounded cultural and societal gender disparities in different societies and how it applied to sexual interactions but I felt at the end of the day that would be pointless. So can we leave it that you feel men are so horny that they would get up on a gust of wind, that they want to and will fuck anything that moves, and all women no matter their age or appearance have these men lining up to shag them. Put simply I don't recognize that planet and I have traveled around a lot of it but maybe we just wear different glasses.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2449299]So it begins. China and South Korea the first to removed from Thailand's COVID hotspots. Not open to air travel yet but this is the first step.[/QUOTE]Hmm. Yet the King isn't taking refuge from Covid-19 in China, Japan, South Korea or Singapore. He's in Germany.

Maybe he didn't get the memo.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2449299]So it begins. China and South Korea the first to removed from Thailand's COVID hotspots. Not open to air travel yet but this is the first step.[/QUOTE]Yes, but as CCSA spokesman Dr Taweesilp Visanuyothin pointed out, " Our measures remain the same. Inbound flights are limited. Visitors must have health certificates. If they visit now, they must be quarantined at a state facility for 14 days. ". Then he added "Tourists would not enjoy making a visit with these measures in place. Today, travel is not liberalised. People can rest assured," he said.

And he is right. Who the hell is going to fly into Thailand if it means a 14 day quarantine at a state facility? So I am getting more and more pessimistic about my own travel plans for mid August let alone the rest of 2020 because the Wuhan Virus is not going away. It is most likely that there will be a continuing stream of new cases accompanied by negative press reports until a vaccine is found regardless of the real death rate and actual danger to the general public. The lockdown will end soon because it must, but allowing any foreigners back in without these restrictions is another issue that I do not believe the vast majority of Thais will support. Of course the Thai government can change it's policy in this regard at a moment's notice and there is pressure from the tourist industry to do so, but I don't hold out much hope. To me it is looking more and more like 2020 is gone/wasted except for those lucky few already in LOS. I envy you guys. Stay safe and have a great time.

[QUOTE=TheNextOne;2449104]I live in the real world, unlike you. You're hiding away from the truth because it hurts, but you know I'm right deep down.

If the woman is even remotely attractive, she has a lot of men who want her. Period. If you deny that, you're simply an idiot. That was what my message was trying to get at.

Let me elaborate my point with facts.

- In Quatar, the population is around 3 million.

Amongst the 3 million, a few oligarchs, who have have the best looking women in their harems, and 98% of ugly low skilled workers men from Pakistan, who spend their entire days working construction. They never get any pussy. Trust me.

- In India, the female to male sex ratio is absolutely horrifying. That's why you have, and the entire internet is making fun of Indians trying to find a partner.

In fact, Indians are even made fun of here, because they usually register with pathetic messages like "please help me trying to find a female".

Look at the Indian subforums, the admins of [URL]http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/[/URL] actually BAN this kind of desperate message on this forum.

You never see any woman doing this, because women have unlimited dating choices.

And not all females are attractive.

Once again, the attractive Indian girls have millions of Indians men "in love" with them.

- Same in China. Here are documentaries of all the "single Chinese men" who are left behind:

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u4orQ0p788k[/URL]

[URL]https://www.france24.com/en/20170609-video-reporters-china-millions-single-chinese-men-desperately-seeking-wife[/URL]

- In Europe, it's the same story.

Look for the video "incels spark civil war in Europe" from Black Pigeon Speaks too.

The Female to Male ratio is already bad in Germany. It got even worse in 2015 when Merkel imported millions of low IQ slaves to fill up the factories.

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CuhLRzP2-0Y[/URL]

Everywhere in the world, look at youtube: any remotely attractive girl gets 10 million views, even if her content is sh*t.

Look at this little polish working girl:

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n1V6iMUCPtg[/URL]

She's not even that attractive, but she still gets millions of messages from horny men online; and in fact, she is making fun of them in this video.

You get my point or are you still not getting it? I have plenty of other examples.

You're a regular here right? You must have seen a lot of girls in your years. Why don't you ask girls themselves? I have asked them. Even "average looking" working girls have a lot of regulars who want to fuck them.

Why do only men pay in tinder? Why do women get into any night club easily? Etc. Do I have to keep going?

The Female to Male ratio everywhere is skewed in females's favor, and once again, I'm not even talking about attractive girls.

Attractive healthy slim girls are on another level, they soon will have around 5 billions of men who want to get into their pants.

That's the way it is. I live on Planet earth, and these are my observations after 2 years of studying the Dating Market.[/QUOTE]India, China and the Middle East are wankvilles because their cultures demand male offspring so they abort female fetuses. However, outside these countries it is different. As you ought to be aware men pursue women and not the other way around so yes most girls are pursued my many men but these same men are pursuing many other girls.

Nice observation bro. How do you tilt the scale in your favour? If you're young and handsome, your chances go up, young handsome and rich- You're an alpha male! I can't change my looks or age. What I can do is earn well and be well groomed. You'the find enough pussies. The smart ones look at your watch, your pen, shoes, wallet, credit card, sunglasses etc. If you wear a Rolex, nice suit with a mont blanc, custom shoes, initials ingrained premium wallet, a tumi bag, black card etc you're in for surprises. Add to that a good car. It ups your chances even more. You'the get laid without too much effort. Do the math now bro. How many can comment on YouTube? A million. How many have at least 1 of the 5 things I mentioned above?2 of them? 3 of the 5? It tilts the scale in your favour now. Have hope. Earn well. It's not easy but it's the best way!

I picked a girl in a club in Singapore. She saw my hotel key as I kept it on the bar table. It was 4 seasons. The girl was like 8/10. I ordered a cocktail and had some chit chat. Figured out that she isn't an escort. But I was sceptical. I thought she'the order some crazy drinks and I'll end up with a big bill. She ordered a corona. Next test, I told her that it's on me and I called for the check. She said thanks and asked me where I was heading. I told her some place better. And asked her if she'the join. She said yes. We went to the bar on raffles tower. Hung out and then I said I'm heading back to my hotel. She came with me. Super fun and lots of drinks. Met her again for the weekend and did bareback too. I was lucky. Singapore being a low crime rate place allowed me to take chances. If your stars are aligned you get good chics at no cost. All she wanted was to hang out with a guy who could afford a good life. Don't lose hope bro.

[QUOTE=TheNextOne;2449104]I live in the real world, unlike you. You're hiding away from the truth because it hurts, but you know I'm right deep down.

If the woman is even remotely attractive, she has a lot of men who want her. Period. If you deny that, you're simply an idiot. That was what my message was trying to get at.

Let me elaborate my point with facts.

- In Quatar, the population is around 3 million.

Amongst the 3 million, a few oligarchs, who have have the best looking women in their harems, and 98% of ugly low skilled workers men from Pakistan, who spend their entire days working construction. They never get any pussy. Trust me.

- In India, the female to male sex ratio is absolutely horrifying. That's why you have, and the entire internet is making fun of Indians trying to find a partner.

In fact, Indians are even made fun of here, because they usually register with pathetic messages like "please help me trying to find a female".

Look at the Indian subforums, the admins of [URL]http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/[/URL] actually BAN this kind of desperate message on this forum.

You never see any woman doing this, because women have unlimited dating choices.

And not all females are attractive.

Once again, the attractive Indian girls have millions of Indians men "in love" with them.

- Same in China. Here are documentaries of all the "single Chinese men" who are left behind:

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u4orQ0p788k[/URL]

[URL]https://www.france24.com/en/20170609-video-reporters-china-millions-single-chinese-men-desperately-seeking-wife[/URL]

- In Europe, it's the same story.

Look for the video "incels spark civil war in Europe" from Black Pigeon Speaks too.

The Female to Male ratio is already bad in Germany. It got even worse in 2015 when Merkel imported millions of low IQ slaves to fill up the factories.

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CuhLRzP2-0Y[/URL]

Everywhere in the world, look at youtube: any remotely attractive girl gets 10 million views, even if her content is sh*t.

Look at this little polish working girl:

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n1V6iMUCPtg[/URL]

She's not even that attractive, but she still gets millions of messages from horny men online; and in fact, she is making fun of them in this video.

You get my point or are you still not getting it? I have plenty of other examples.

You're a regular here right? You must have seen a lot of girls in your years. Why don't you ask girls themselves? I have asked them. Even "average looking" working girls have a lot of regulars who want to fuck them.

Why do only men pay in tinder? Why do women get into any night club easily? Etc. Do I have to keep going?

The Female to Male ratio everywhere is skewed in females's favor, and once again, I'm not even talking about attractive girls.

Attractive healthy slim girls are on another level, they soon will have around 5 billions of men who want to get into their pants.

That's the way it is. I live on Planet earth, and these are my observations after 2 years of studying the Dating Market.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=SfoCowboy;2449433]Nice observation bro. How do you tilt the scale in your favour? If you're young and handsome, your chances go up, young handsome and rich- You're an alpha male! I can't change my looks or age. What I can do is earn well and be well groomed. You'the find enough pussies. The smart ones look at your watch, your pen, shoes, wallet, credit card, sunglasses etc. If you wear a Rolex, nice suit with a mont blanc, custom shoes, initials ingrained premium wallet, a tumi bag, black card etc you're in for surprises. Add to that a good car. It ups your chances even more. You'the get laid without too much effort. Do the math now bro. [/QUOTE]Or you can be broke and wear shorts and flip-flops with a scraggly beard like me, and talk a good game.

Everything will open back up on the 17th if the Covid numbers continue to fall.

[URL]https://www.bangkokpost.com/business/1915028/malls-gyms-tipped-to-open-next[/URL]

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2449305]maybe we just wear different glasses.[/QUOTE]To add to Cowboy's comments I should mention I wear Bulgari for daytime dreaming and Chopard for nighttime cruising.

If LOS opens legs, great. I've come to the conclusion seeking arrangement is the gig economy / side hustle of surplus pussy or spot market, the sellers can sell "virtuous" pussy with long term puts to suckers.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2449543]Everything will open back up on the 17th if the Covid numbers continue to fall.

[URL]https://www.bangkokpost.com/business/1915028/malls-gyms-tipped-to-open-next[/URL][/QUOTE]Not everything, this is the next step, a big one to be sure but bars, massages, gogo's and other places still can't open.

And something to watch out for is that each province sets their own rules based on advice from the government. In Pattaya bars, massages, gogo's etc are believed to be unable to open before June 15. The beaches are also closed for the moment.

[URL]https://thepattayanews.com/2020/05/07/thai-government-holding-discussions-around-loosening-covid19-restrictions-earlier-than-mid-month-especially-shopping-malls/[/URL]

[QUOTE=Downandup;2449574]Not everything, this is the next step, a big one to be sure but bars, massages, gogo's and other places still can't open.

[URL]https://thepattayanews.com/2020/05/07/thai-government-holding-discussions-around-loosening-covid19-restrictions-earlier-than-mid-month-especially-shopping-malls/[/URL][/QUOTE]Okay. Almost everything. Did you read the article that I posted? It was from this morning. The one you just referenced was from 2 days ago. I think if amusement parks and water parks will be open, then beaches will be too.

"It resulted in a nod for the reopening of shopping malls, restaurants and food shops in shopping malls, health and wellness businesses [B]including spas and massage parlours[/B], beauty salons, fitness centres and gymnasiums, meeting and seminar convention venues, film production locations, amusement parks and water parks. "

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2449578]Okay. Almost everything. Did you read the article that I posted? It was from this morning. The one you just referenced was from 2 days ago. I think if amusement parks and water parks will be open, then beaches will be too.

"It resulted in a nod for the reopening of shopping malls, restaurants and food shops in shopping malls, health and wellness businesses [B]including spas and massage parlours[/B], beauty salons, fitness centres and gymnasiums, meeting and seminar convention venues, film production locations, amusement parks and water parks. "[/QUOTE]It could be good for those of us who live here if everything opens up with lots of girls and hardly any customers. Not so good for those who live abroad as they're not going to let foreigners in from countries that haven't got their Covid-19 new infections down to single figures. Guys on this forum planning to visit sometime this year are wishful thinking. Thailand has very few cases and wants to keep it that way.

[QUOTE=TheNextOne;2448781]A huge amount of men on this planet are "single" and will stay forever, so yes, these guys you saw on the plane were most likely "single".

99% of the women on this planet have at least 10 guys who want to get in their pants, even if they are ugly or old. Don't kid yourself.[/QUOTE]Obviously you didn't understand my point in the post. My point was about percentage of mongers in a typical flight, not about how many of them are single. Unless you're confused that only singles fuck hookers.

And "will stay forever" (single). That's funny now, just stop making things up.

[QUOTE=TheNextOne;2449104]I
Everywhere in the world, look at youtube: any remotely attractive girl gets 10 million views, even if her content is sh*t.

She's not even that attractive, but she still gets millions of messages from horny men online; and in fact, she is making fun of them in this video.

You get my point or are you still not getting it? I have plenty of other examples.

You're a regular here right? You must have seen a lot of girls in your years. Why don't you ask girls themselves? I have asked them. Even "average looking" working girls have a lot of regulars who want to fuck them.

Why do only men pay in tinder? Why do women get into any night club easily? Etc. Do I have to keep going?

The Female to Male ratio everywhere is skewed in females's favor, and once again, I'm not even talking about attractive girls.

Attractive healthy slim girls are on another level, they soon will have around 5 billions of men who want to get into their pants.

That's the way it is. I live on Planet earth, and these are my observations after 2 years of studying the Dating Market.[/QUOTE]Ohh and on this long post, you mixed lot of points badly.

First of all, let's agree to one thing, girls can find sex easily and in general for men it's harder especially many are either broke, ugly, have-no-game or all of these. So that's why men pays fee on dating sites and in clubs.

Second it seems like your observations are based on just dating and P4 P scene bubble. Dating sites and social media are full of desperate dudes who can't get girls in a club or in real life, so obviously they just send creepy messages to anyone they can. So you using that to come to conclusion that one girl has millions of guys lining up for her pussy, is just absurd and naive.

[QUOTE=SfoCowboy;2449433]The smart ones look at your watch, your pen, shoes, wallet, credit card, sunglasses etc. If you wear a Rolex, nice suit with a mont blanc, custom shoes, initials ingrained premium wallet, a tumi bag, black card etc you're in for surprises. Add to that a good car. [/QUOTE]Yuck. This is a mongering forum. The last thing I want to do is suck up to some hooker or semi-hooker. The point of mongering is that it's easy, show up with some money in hand and off you go. Reverse the roles for a bit, let the women suck up to you.

A chick who needs to be impressed by my "initials ingrained premium wallet" is too much hassle for a fling, and too much of a gold digger for a long-term partner (serious or casual). Let the insecure men with an ego to boost fight over those, there are plenty of them in the world.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2449547]To add to Cowboy's comments I should mention I wear Bulgari for daytime dreaming and Chopard for nighttime cruising.[/QUOTE]Yes like me. I have a pair of flip flops by day and a pair of flip flops by night.

When I go in gogos I want to have touch of class.

[QUOTE=*****man;2449630] Guys on this forum planning to visit sometime this year are wishful thinking[/QUOTE]You say that to try to demoralize us.

But you will not succeed.

[QUOTE=Gargano19;2449635]First of all, let's agree to one thing, girls can find sex easily and in general for men it's harder especially many are either broke, ugly, have-no-game or all of these.[/QUOTE]But I'm not sure it is sex that girls come to Pattaya looking for.

In addition to the money, they rather seek the husband or the sugar daddy, in both cases stable and with money.

And for them it is very difficult to find.

[QUOTE=Pimpampoumpipo;2449680]But I'm not sure it is sex that girls come to Pattaya looking for.

In addition to the money, they rather seek the husband or the sugar daddy, in both cases stable and with money.

And for them it is very difficult to find.[/QUOTE]It's a numbers game. Just as in the west there are a million guys to every girl looking for a quick fuck, in Pattaya and similar the numbers are reversed and all the girls want to find a permanent guy / cash cow / Visa but there are very few of those in town. The vast majority of guys are just there for a pump and run.

Enjoy. G.

[QUOTE=Pimpampoumpipo;2449674]Yes like me. I have a pair of flip flops by day and a pair of flip flops by night.

When I go in gogos I want to have touch of class.[/QUOTE]Nothing wrong with flip flops, I wear my Gucci Men's Web Strap Thong Sandals on occasion not so much to go go's I have to admit more for casual pool parties and the like.

[QUOTE=*****man;2449630]It could be good for those of us who live here if everything opens up with lots of girls and hardly any customers. Not so good for those who live abroad as they're not going to let foreigners in from countries that haven't got their Covid-19 new infections down to single figures. Guys on this forum planning to visit sometime this year are wishful thinking. Thailand has very few cases and wants to keep it that way.[/QUOTE]Agreed. I don't see Thailand as a monger destination for the Western casual tourist until high season 2021 if there is no virus reoccurance. Expect to fight the hordes of Chinese, because its clear that China is going to use tourism as a weapon. Countries that toe the Chinese line about the virus and the world will get the tourists.

I myself am even debating going back to the USA this year.

[QUOTE=Gargano19;2448009]This just reminded me of 2 girls who I found on tinder, both Chinese, both making excuses to meet and saying they're stuck here because of flight ban and will be back home soon. Both tried to force me to signup for sone "gaming" site called MBK or something. I guess this is online betting site. [/QUOTE]I don't get this either. The Chinese chick from my Tinder says she does the stocks. She never tried to push anything on me. It is all me trying to pry stuff out of her to see the scam. She started out by sending me a picture of food. I was like huh? Then she said she was at a restaurant. I asked where she lived because when we matched she was close. Plus back then we could not eat in restaurants here.

Then she said she is in Hong Kong. She sent me a pic of the stockmarket and I was like huh? She said don't you understand. I keep trying to pry info out but she tells me to get an account at Bangkok Bank then get it approved to buy Hong Kong stocks. So whatever she is advising me to do through my own solicitation seems legit, but it is a bit weird.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2449829]I don't get this either. The Chinese chick from my Tinder says she does the stocks. She never tried to push anything on me. It is all me trying to pry stuff out of her to see the scam. She started out by sending me a picture of food. I was like huh? Then she said she was at a restaurant. I asked where she lived because when we matched she was close. Plus back then we could not eat in restaurants here.

Then she said she is in Hong Kong. She sent me a pic of the stockmarket and I was like huh? She said don't you understand. I keep trying to pry info out but she tells me to get an account at Bangkok Bank then get it approved to buy Hong Kong stocks. So whatever she is advising me to do through my own solicitation seems legit, but it is a bit weird.[/QUOTE]Yes they don't really push unless we ask more. I'm sure there are many dudes who will get trapped in these scams.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2449829]I don't get this either. The Chinese chick from my Tinder says she does the stocks. She never tried to push anything on me. It is all me trying to pry stuff out of her to see the scam. She started out by sending me a picture of food. I was like huh? Then she said she was at a restaurant. I asked where she lived because when we matched she was close. Plus back then we could not eat in restaurants here.

Then she said she is in Hong Kong. She sent me a pic of the stockmarket and I was like huh? She said don't you understand. I keep trying to pry info out but she tells me to get an account at Bangkok Bank then get it approved to buy Hong Kong stocks. So whatever she is advising me to do through my own solicitation seems legit, but it is a bit weird.[/QUOTE]There are many variants on that general concept. I used to get them frequently through WeChat People Nearby. Always pictures of beautiful girls who chat for a very few minutes (maybe a bot) and then have a remarkable investment opportunity. Gold. Oil. BitCoin. Start up stock. Ask where they are located and you get fuzzy answers. Remind that they found me on people nearby and they say they have now moved and they won't show their location. Won't do video chat. Probably not chatting with a pretty girl at all, most likely is a fat old man sitting in a smoke filled room in a Chinese slum.

I've gotten many of these through WeChat plus a couple through Line.

If a stranger truly has a great investment opportunity, they won’t be sharing it with strangers.

No need to complicate it. It's simply a variation on the boiler room scam which can be hard sell or soft sell. Sometimes it's an on the side earner by a smart working girl pitched during the pillow talk phase of the session, sometimes it's the 300 lb fatso in the basement who never shows up for the Tinder date. Here's the buzz, when its face to face it can be a lot of fun running with the con when you know it's a con especially with an attractive working girl. Having her believe you are interested and the amount you have to invest is in the millions the thought of all that commission can get you the kind of service that only dreams of.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2449829]I don't get this either. The Chinese chick from my Tinder says she does the stocks. She never tried to push anything on me. It is all me trying to pry stuff out of her to see the scam. She started out by sending me a picture of food. I was like huh? Then she said she was at a restaurant. I asked where she lived because when we matched she was close. Plus back then we could not eat in restaurants here.

Then she said she is in Hong Kong. She sent me a pic of the stockmarket and I was like huh? She said don't you understand. I keep trying to pry info out but she tells me to get an account at Bangkok Bank then get it approved to buy Hong Kong stocks. So whatever she is advising me to do through my own solicitation seems legit, but it is a bit weird.[/QUOTE]Lots of pretty Chinese girls are in online dating sites trying to sell but not their body.

[QUOTE=Sammon;2449906]Lots of pretty Chinese girls are in online dating sites trying to sell but not their body.[/QUOTE]I've read about these exact same kind of tactics before that he described. And from the same part of the world too. Slowly lure them in. It's a scam no doubt.

I've seen this too. If someone on a dating site keeps asking if you "like to do investments," asks you for "stock trading advice," or anything of the sort, run. I was curious, but the process was so tedious I got bored and blocked her before the inevitable "great opportunity" arose. As others have said, this is a slow-paced scam; they wait for the fish to find the bait. If you're dumb enough to send money to someone you don't know in a get rich quick scheme, you're bound to lose your savings sooner or later. But for more coherent guys, just keep an eye out for these "women" so you don't waste your time. Also, if you decide to screw around with one of these scammers, avoid opening any files or clicking any links they send. I'm not sure how the whole scam works, but I wouldn't be surprised they sent out malware along with their stock tips.

[QUOTE=HorseTrader;2449878]There are many variants on that general concept. I used to get them frequently through WeChat People Nearby. Always pictures of beautiful girls who chat for a very few minutes (maybe a bot) and then have a remarkable investment opportunity. Gold. Oil. BitCoin. Start up stock. Ask where they are located and you get fuzzy answers. Remind that they found me on people nearby and they say they have now moved and they won't show their location. Won't do video chat. Probably not chatting with a pretty girl at all, most likely is a fat old man sitting in a smoke filled room in a Chinese slum.

I've gotten many of these through WeChat plus a couple through Line.

If a stranger truly has a great investment opportunity, they wont be sharing it with strangers.[/QUOTE]

Platinum pussies will chase you.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2449547]To add to Cowboy's comments I should mention I wear Bulgari for daytime dreaming and Chopard for nighttime cruising.[/QUOTE]

Money can buy many things.

[QUOTE=Gargano19;2449635]Obviously you didn't understand my point in the post. My point was about percentage of mongers in a typical flight, not about how many of them are single. Unless you're confused that only singles fuck hookers.

And "will stay forever" (single). That's funny now, just stop making things up.

Ohh and on this long post, you mixed lot of points badly.

First of all, let's agree to one thing, girls can find sex easily and in general for men it's harder especially many are either broke, ugly, have-no-game or all of these. So that's why men pays fee on dating sites and in clubs.

Second it seems like your observations are based on just dating and P4 P scene bubble. Dating sites and social media are full of desperate dudes who can't get girls in a club or in real life, so obviously they just send creepy messages to anyone they can. So you using that to come to conclusion that one girl has millions of guys lining up for her pussy, is just absurd and naive.[/QUOTE]

Please see that in the context. I replied to the post that the odds are against men heavily. But if you have money. Odds can change big time.

[QUOTE=Crocodilexp;2449664]Yuck. This is a mongering forum. The last thing I want to do is suck up to some hooker or semi-hooker. The point of mongering is that it's easy, show up with some money in hand and off you go. Reverse the roles for a bit, let the women suck up to you.

A chick who needs to be impressed by my "initials ingrained premium wallet" is too much hassle for a fling, and too much of a gold digger for a long-term partner (serious or casual). Let the insecure men with an ego to boost fight over those, there are plenty of them in the world.[/QUOTE]

I'm stuck in the same loop as you. I had my flight out of BKK cancelled by the airline, a the despite their public assurances of flexibility the most they can say is "a refund might take as long as 90 days".

So each time I download into my latest Thai companion, I imagine her in flight attendant uniform, showing me over and over again how to manually inflate my life vest.

[QUOTE=MonkeyPaw;2449047]This is the headache, you will get. You book now. You pay now. The flight that you haven booked is "non guaranteed" as it may be delayed or cancelled. So yeah, it's likely what you see is not what you will get. In case if it's cancelled as the date gets nearer, you are entitled to credit or a refund. Refund will take, um. Err. If you take the credit, your payment will be applied to the next available "for sure" flight plus an increase in airfare. In that case, why didn't you just wait in the first place. Oh because you fell for the old "show them a cheap price, non guaranteed flight during a pandemic with world wide travel restrictions" gimmick. Thanks for helping us pay our bills. Hopefully we left you enough money to buy some Vaseline for the next time you get screwed. Those fine prints keep getting more fine, longer, complex in language, and tinier to read. Why do governments allow this to happen? Two flights have been cancelled on my part. So let me just sit still and take out my aggression my punishing hot wet Thai pussy, maybe a Russian in BTW, and chilling at Pattaya Beach. I'm going to be a sitting duck waiting this out.[/QUOTE]

And on the list of places to open next week is...

8. Traditional massage shops (foot massage only).

Damn.

[QUOTE=Nyezhov;2449775]Agreed. I don't see Thailand as a monger destination for the Western casual tourist until high season 2021 if there is no virus reoccurance. ...
I myself am even debating going back to the USA this year.[/QUOTE]Going back to USA hoping it is a equal or better monger destination?

[QUOTE=Dena0;2450176]Going back to USA hoping it is a equal or better monger destination?[/QUOTE]I'm a rare monger in the USA, I have a off and on GF. Usually I'll go to Vegas. But, ya can't live overseas without checking in at home once in a while for a real Doctor, talk to the accountant, pretend the biz needs you, smoke some real weed, buy some decent clothes, etc.

[URL]https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/thailand-tourist-arrivals-may-fall-151807335.html[/URL]

In my experience, neighborhood "foot massage" shops often have a semi-private room where you can go for extras. Hold out hope!

[QUOTE=*****man;2450131]And on the list of places to open next week is...

8. Traditional massage shops (foot massage only).

Damn.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Chacal60;2450347]In my experience, neighborhood "foot massage" shops often have a semi-private room where you can go for extras. Hold out hope![/QUOTE]With you on that. Once the doors are open the monthly tea money starts to flow again and all bets are off.

Thailand has announced they will concentrate on Generation Y aged 23-40 for foreign tourism. Looks like MP and Uncle V will have Thailand to themselves as they are the only ISG members I have met who fall in this age category.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2450901]Thailand has announced they will concentrate on Generation Y aged 23-40 for foreign tourism. Looks like MP and Uncle V will have Thailand to themselves as they are the only ISG members I have met who fall in this age category.[/QUOTE]Well, I'm falling in this age category too!

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2450901]Thailand has announced they will concentrate on Generation Y aged 23-40 for foreign tourism. Looks like MP and Uncle V will have Thailand to themselves as they are the only ISG members I have met who fall in this age category.[/QUOTE]Perfect for Full Moon Party at Koh Phangan.

30,000 persons in 2019.

Have fun !

Doesn't exactly jive with the quality over quantity idea. That age group generally has the least amount of disposable income as they are carrying debt loads and early in their careers. That being said at 41 I am on the tail end if they want to cater to me and send some girls to pick me up at the airport I won't complain.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2450901]Thailand has announced they will concentrate on Generation Y aged 23-40 for foreign tourism. Looks like MP and Uncle V will have Thailand to themselves as they are the only ISG members I have met who fall in this age category.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=ChristianG;2450915]Well, I'm falling in this age category too![/QUOTE]My apologies I left you out. Come to think of it Axiata falls into the under 40 age group as well.

[QUOTE=Pimpampoumpipo;2450925]Perfect for Full Moon Party at Koh Phangan.[/QUOTE]Wasn't that the province that said if a tourist doesn't wear a face mask they will be punished by having to do push ups!

[QUOTE=MichaelSamuel;2450927]Doesn't exactly jive with the quality over quantity idea. That age group generally has the least amount of disposable income [/QUOTE]TIT.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2450901]Thailand has announced they will concentrate on Generation Y aged 23-40 for foreign tourism. Looks like MP and Uncle V will have Thailand to themselves as they are the only ISG members I have met who fall in this age category.[/QUOTE]Where did you see this? Curious. I'm looking for it and cannot find it. I fall into that category and am heading there in Jan but would be nice to have a place to see these updates.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2450901]Thailand has announced they will concentrate on Generation Y aged 23-40 for foreign tourism. Looks like MP and Uncle V will have Thailand to themselves as they are the only ISG members I have met who fall in this age category.[/QUOTE]I'm guessing the average age of people on these Thai forums is 50-53 but I doubt anybody knows for sure. I haven't heard from our favorite Uncle in a while. Hope he's doing well. I miss reading about his adventures.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2450901]Thailand has announced they will concentrate on Generation Y aged 23-40 for foreign tourism. Looks like MP and Uncle V will have Thailand to themselves as they are the only ISG members I have met who fall in this age category.[/QUOTE]What part of the Generation why aged 23-40 market? Beach bums, back packers? Families and women are where the money is as they shop. Men just buy beer and broads. I can't see mothers going there if their kids are to risk Covid19. Younger each bums maybe but they are not renowned big spenders.

[QUOTE=Allover;2450962]I'm guessing the average age of people on these Thai forums is 50-53 but I doubt anybody knows for sure. I haven't heard from our favorite Uncle in a while. Hope he's doing well. I miss reading about his adventures.[/QUOTE]If you look around the tourist area in Pattaya imo the average age is well over 60 for Farang, or at least these guys look well over 60 to me. Guys in beer bars looking for cheap beer and cheap girls are the oldest group. The youngest group would easily be the Walking Street gogo bars with most guys being under 30 at gogo bars like Palace. Mainly younger Asian men and older Farang guys. This is the general makeup that I see. Same for the FKK clubs in Germany. Younger Asian guys and older Caucasian guys. The Indian gangs hanging out at the Soapies and along Beach Road in Pattaya are also young.

Uncle V is stuck in Phnom Penh during COVID. Lucky him because the bars have reopened and the girls are starting to return.

I thought the Thais wanted to attract the group that stays in nice hotels and spend money. Not the young backpack crowd renting 4000 baht apartments and eating 30 baht noodles in Chiang Mai. They want the middle class segment versus the crowd that brags they can survive of 18 k baht a month.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2450901]Thailand has announced they will concentrate on Generation Y aged 23-40 for foreign tourism. Looks like MP and Uncle V will have Thailand to themselves as they are the only ISG members I have met who fall in this age category.[/QUOTE]Geez, not if I go to jail for sexual harassment on ThaiFriendly. Propositioning females on social media is punishable, so I guess asking a girl "short time how much?" can lead to our arrest now? Nuts. If you've piss off the wrong chick.

[URL]https://pattayaone.news/three-actresses-lodge-complaint-of-sexual-harassment/[/URL]

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2450901]Thailand has announced they will concentrate on Generation Y aged 23-40 for foreign tourism. Looks like MP and Uncle V will have Thailand to themselves as they are the only ISG members I have met who fall in this age category.[/QUOTE]Haha. I wish!

On the working side of that 40 mark and rapidly approaching the 50 mark)).

I don't get it. I think 30-50 would be a better demographic for people with disposable income that aren't too skinflint.

[QUOTE=UncleVolodya;2451116]Haha. I wish!

On the working side of that 40 mark and rapidly approaching the 50 mark)).

I don't get it. I think 30-50 would be a better demographic for people with disposable income that aren't too skinflint.[/QUOTE]Well it may be time for me to return to Thailand. I was there in the 60's and recently only go to China 4 times per year (I have been to Cambodia once last year). Oh, and I will be 80 this year but I look about 60 or so according to all my friends.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2450901]Thailand has announced[/QUOTE]Do please furnish details of the announcement and by whom it was announced. Ministry of Tourism and Sport (MOTS)? Tourist Authority of Thailand (TAT)?

I am surprised that I overlooked this in the Bangkok Post, The Nation, Pattaya News, Pattaya Mail, The Thaiger, Khaosod English et al. Or maybe they all missed this blockbuster exclusive?

Age will not matter. Only those with "game" will be allowed in, or allowed to stay.

[QUOTE=YyzTravel;2450946]Where did you see this? [/QUOTE]

It was posted as a news story on the TV site but I didn't feel like searching through the site for the official post.

Google searched it. [URL]https://www.bangkokbiznews.com/news/detail/880398[/URL]

That leaves plenty of 28-34 yo single mothers looking for the financial generosity and "good heart" of we boomers who are already inside the country!

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2450901]Thailand has announced they will concentrate on Generation Y aged 23-40 for foreign tourism. Looks like MP and Uncle V will have Thailand to themselves as they are the only ISG members I have met who fall in this age category.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Beijing4987;2451177]Age will not matter. Only those with "game" will be allowed in, or allowed to stay.[/QUOTE]I have a great game, viz: my wallet. I bet you dollars to donuts I could walk into any GoGo or disco and steal some young guys stunner in less time that I can count to how much baby? 10? 20?

In my age group of friends, I don't know anyone who worries about the price of anything.

‪BREAKING: The Civil Aviation Authority of Thailand has just extended the ban on international passenger planes landing in Thailand to June 30. This now means that the earliest foreigners can come to Thailand is in July.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2451339]‪BREAKING: The Civil Aviation Authority of Thailand has just extended the ban on international passenger planes landing in Thailand to June 30. This now means that the earliest foreigners can come to Thailand is in July.[/QUOTE]Maybe that's good news for those of us who want to be left alone in Thailand. Flights are still operated FROM Thailand though. Do they fly in empty?

[QUOTE=XXL;2451371]Maybe that's good news for those of us who want to be left alone in Thailand. Flights are still operated FROM Thailand though. Do they fly in empty?[/QUOTE]Mostly, the few people allowed into Thailand are Thai's returning home, diplomats and a few others.

[QUOTE=Downandup;2451376]Mostly, the few people allowed into Thailand are Thai's returning home, diplomats and a few others.[/QUOTE]Does anyone here have a Thailand Elite visa which costs 500,000 to 2 million baht? Anyone know if people with Elite visas are getting in to Thailand or if they're at least extending the 5 year period for the cheap Elite visa? I came very close to getting one last year because I can't apply for a Retirement Visa as I'm under 50. I'd be p1ssed if I got one and my time was ticking while being denied entry.

Would anyone pay 500k if it allowed you in to Thailand while the borders were still closed? I could visit all my gogo girls and their families in Rayong!

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2451388]Does anyone here have a Thailand Elite visa which costs 500,000 to 2 million baht? Anyone know if people with Elite visas are getting in to Thailand or if they're at least extending the 5 year period for the cheap Elite visa? [/QUOTE]The Thai Civil Aviation Authority of Thailand, or CAAT announced this evening that they have extended a ban on international inbound travel to Thailand until at least the end of June.

This has very limited exceptions, such as repatriation of Thai nationals or supply and cargo. Foreigners, even those with work permits, family or elite visas, even willing to do state quarantines, will remain banned from entry.

[URL]https://thepattayanews.com/2020/05/16/thai-civil-aviation-authority-of-thailand-extends-ban-on-international-inbound-travel-to-thailand-to-end-of-june/[/URL]

I'm just disheartened to wait for a hypothetical opening of the borders.

I will stop postponing my flights and request a final refund. And take care of other business.

This story is starting to take my head. Enough is enough. I am wasting my time.

[URL]https://thethaiger.com/coronavirus/ban-on-international-travel-into-thailand-extended-until-june-30[/URL]

[QUOTE=XXL;2451371]Maybe that's good news for those of us who want to be left alone in Thailand. Flights are still operated FROM Thailand though. Do they fly in empty?[/QUOTE]Empty of passengers but carry cargo instead.

Interesting fact. The billionaire owner of the NBA team Indiana Pacers, Herb Simon is married to an LBFM from LOS. I wonder if the field LBFMs from Isaan look up to her as their role model?

[QUOTE=Pimpampoumpipo;2451444]I'm just disheartened to wait for a hypothetical opening of the borders. I will stop postponing my flights and request a final refund. And take care of other business.[/QUOTE]Last March 2020, I postponed my 2.5 month Thai / Indonesia trip scheduled for April-June to August-November, but as the weeks / months have gone by the prospects for mid August entry into LOS are not looking good. I am not going to do anything about rescheduling my trip a 2nd time, however, until or unless the Thai Government announces no foreign entry thru the entire month of August. If or when they make that announcement I will most likely cancel my trip rather than arrange a 2nd postponement because by that time of the year my theoretical itinerary would be bumping up into high season (December / January) and I don't like travelling to SE Asia at that time of the year. So, if the Thai Government (and Indonesian Government) don't open up their borders to international travelers by the end of July that will effectively end my 2020 travel plans and I will have no choice but to start to think about April 2021 travel. That translates into an entire wasted year of no Asian girls thanks to the Wuhan Virus and the reactions to it by various governments around the world. Obviously I am not happy about this possibility, but I am becoming more and more resigned to it.

What a cluster fuck!

[QUOTE=*****man;2451518]Empty of passengers but carry cargo instead.[/QUOTE]Correct airlines revenues don't just come from passenger check-in wouldn't even account for half the load, you got cargo even cargo from UPS, FedEx, DHL, and even USA Mail as I indicated in one report I use to go standby on one of Eva flights during the summer they usually have two after midnight the 3rd was during the afternoon this was used for all the overflow of cargo and mail they couldn't take on the other two flights which operates mainly for the passenger so I thought I would always have a good chance of getting on standby twice the cargo load was so heavy I got bumped.

I have one more thought about this pandemic: I am really pissed off at the Chinese Communist government. They knew about the virus and hid the facts about it's degree of contagion to the entire world. They even allowed their citizens to travel and spread the disease. I have always been a free marklet comparative advantage guy willing to buy products from any country that could deliver best on a quality and price. No longer! I have made a conscious decision not to buy Chinese made goods anymore. Opening up our markets to the Chinese Communists has been the biggest mistake of the last quarter century.

Now I hear rumours. They are only rumors. That the Thai Government may be ready to permit Chinese Nationals back into Thailand before allowing Americans, Europeans, and Australians back in. If this rumor turns out to be true I will take this as a personal insult from the Thai Government and I will probably boycott Thailand for a long long time perhaps forever.

Interestingly, for the last 15 years or so I have preferred LOS over Brazil and Colombia not because Thai girls are prettier or better in bed, they are not, but because I preferred the relatively peaceful ambiance of Thailand and Thai Culture over their Latin American counterparts. But I will reconsider this opinion if the Thai Government shows a preference for Chinese Nationals in light of the Corona Virus.

Rant Over. Still holding out some hope that I make it to Thailand this August.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2451605]Now I hear rumours. They are only rumors. That the Thai Government may be ready to permit Chinese Nationals back into Thailand before allowing Americans, Europeans, and Australians back in. If this rumor turns out to be true I will take this as a personal insult from the Thai Government and I will probably boycott Thailand for a long long time perhaps forever. [/QUOTE]Maybe this is the cause of the rumor:

[I]"The Public Health Ministry on Friday (May 15) announced that it has removed China, South Korea as well as Hong Kong and Macau from its list of 13 countries with high risk of Covid-19 infection."[/I]

They will want the Chinese to return, almost 11 million of 39 million tourists were from China.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2451605]I have one more thought about this pandemic: I am really pissed off at the Chinese Communist government. They knew about the virus and hid the facts about it's degree of contagion to the entire world. They even allowed their citizens to travel and spread the disease. I have always been a free marklet comparative advantage guy willing to buy products from any country that could deliver best on a quality and price. No longer! I have made a conscious decision not to buy Chinese made goods anymore. Opening up our markets to the Chinese Communists has been the biggest mistake of the last quarter century.

Now I hear rumours. They are only rumors. That the Thai Government may be ready to permit Chinese Nationals back into Thailand before allowing Americans, Europeans, and Australians back in. If this rumor turns out to be true I will take this as a personal insult from the Thai Government and I will probably boycott Thailand for a long long time perhaps forever.

Interestingly, for the last 15 years or so I have preferred LOS over Brazil and Colombia not because Thai girls are prettier or better in bed, they are not, but because I preferred the relatively peaceful ambiance of Thailand and Thai Culture over their Latin American counterparts. But I will reconsider this opinion if the Thai Government shows a preference for Chinese Nationals in light of the Corona Virus.

Rant Over. Still holding out some hope that I make it to Thailand this August.[/QUOTE]One odd thing I noticed when talking to local Thais, they don't like the PRC tourists and see PRC investors driving up the cost of housing / living in Thailand. Small business people and the staff at various hotels and restaurants ask where I am from since I am often mistaken as Chinese. When I tell them I am a US citizen, they smile and explain that the PRC folks are know to be rude and hard to deal with. Sales clerks in high end shopping malls are taken aback when the PRC folks seem to think they can barter the price down on luxury goods.

So even if the Thai government may want the PRC folks back, their citizens do not!

[QUOTE=Rodwint2;2451612]One odd thing I noticed when talking to local Thais, they don't like the PRC tourists and see PRC investors driving up the cost of housing / living in Thailand. Small business people and the staff at various hotels and restaurants ask where I am from since I am often mistaken as Chinese. When I tell them I am a US citizen, they smile and explain that the PRC folks are know to be rude and hard to deal with. Sales clerks in high end shopping malls are taken aback when the PRC folks seem to think they can barter the price down on luxury goods. So even if the Thai government may want the PRC folks back, their citizens do not![/QUOTE]I don't know that it's "odd". It just is. I hired a tour guide to show me around a few places when I was in Thailand, and I was a bit taken aback when she expressed open contempt for Chinese tourists, calling them rude and disrespectful, and saying that she was sick and tired of them. Although, we can surely add that plenty of Thais are sick of "falangs" too.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2451605]I have one more thought about this pandemic: I am really pissed off at the Chinese Communist government. They knew about the virus and hid the facts about it's degree of contagion to the entire world. They even allowed their citizens to travel and spread the disease. I have always been a free marklet comparative advantage guy willing to buy products from any country that could deliver best on a quality and price. No longer! I have made a conscious decision not to buy Chinese made goods anymore. Opening up our markets to the Chinese Communists has been the biggest mistake of the last quarter century.

Now I hear rumours. They are only rumors. That the Thai Government may be ready to permit Chinese Nationals back into Thailand before allowing Americans, Europeans, and Australians back in. If this rumor turns out to be true I will take this as a personal insult from the Thai Government and I will probably boycott Thailand for a long long time perhaps forever.

Interestingly, for the last 15 years or so I have preferred LOS over Brazil and Colombia not because Thai girls are prettier or better in bed, they are not, but because I preferred the relatively peaceful ambiance of Thailand and Thai Culture over their Latin American counterparts. But I will reconsider this opinion if the Thai Government shows a preference for Chinese Nationals in light of the Corona Virus.

Rant Over. Still holding out some hope that I make it to Thailand this August.[/QUOTE]The Chinese were also out nimbly buying up personal protective equipment while the rest of the world was caught flat-footed. If you aren't going to buy Chinese, then at least for now (and for a long time to come) there are a lot of things you won't be buying then. Seems like virtually everything I look at has "made in China" on it.

[QUOTE=Rodwint2;2451612]One odd thing I noticed when talking to local Thais, they don't like the PRC tourists and see PRC investors driving up the cost of housing / living in Thailand. Small business people and the staff at various hotels and restaurants ask where I am from since I am often mistaken as Chinese. When I tell them I am a US citizen, they smile and explain that the PRC folks are know to be rude and hard to deal with. Sales clerks in high end shopping malls are taken aback when the PRC folks seem to think they can barter the price down on luxury goods.

So even if the Thai government may want the PRC folks back, their citizens do not![/QUOTE]Good point. My Mini is not fond of PRC workers either. She has a studio apartment behind the Cultural Center and there are a lot of low level PRC office workers housed in her neighborhood. She is in daily close contact with many of them at the mall, the outdoor night market, and the MRT.

The Thai government doesn't deal with the Chinese directly the Thai people have too, all they see or care about is the money that comes from the visit that being said is the reason they cleared the Chinese and Korea they are free to visit May 16th, then this morning they declare the lockdown for International flights will continue till July.

I'm Chinese American aside from here I don't post negative comments about the Communist leader fuckers the people aren't the blame they have been brainwashed especially the younger generation my Aunt and Uncle left in China too old just go with the flow they still remember what Mao did to them.

Prior to all this, I've been mistaken for Japanese, Korean even a local Thai when I tell them I'm Chinese I always follow with Chinese from America then they think I immigrated I follow with Made in America if it goes beyond and I see them open to more I tell them " China is bad " there is a war coming and your Thai leaders will have to make a decision as to what side they want to be on?

[QUOTE=Rodwint2;2451612]One odd thing I noticed when talking to local Thais, they don't like the PRC tourists and see PRC investors driving up the cost of housing / living in Thailand. Small business people and the staff at various hotels and restaurants ask where I am from since I am often mistaken as Chinese. When I tell them I am a US citizen, they smile and explain that the PRC folks are know to be rude and hard to deal with. Sales clerks in high end shopping malls are taken aback when the PRC folks seem to think they can barter the price down on luxury goods.

So even if the Thai government may want the PRC folks back, their citizens do not![/QUOTE]Chinese tourists are the worst. Most come with tour groups owned by Chinese, stay at Chinese owned hotels, eat Chinese food. They spend money at local markets and shopping but that's it. Koreans by comparison often come in couples / small groups of friends and spend money in Thai owned places.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2451605]I have one more thought about this pandemic: I am really pissed off at the Chinese Communist government. They knew about the virus and hid the facts about it's degree of contagion to the entire world. They even allowed their citizens to travel and spread the disease. I have always been a free marklet comparative advantage guy willing to buy products from any country that could deliver best on a quality and price. No longer! I have made a conscious decision not to buy Chinese made goods anymore. Opening up our markets to the Chinese Communists has been the biggest mistake of the last quarter century.
[/QUOTE]First real signs of the new virus was mid November, by December they were locking down. In January international leaders were made aware of the dangers and your friend Trump was more than happy to dismiss the disease. I don't know how you expected the Chinese to become fully aware of the characteristics of the disease in a few weeks. It is a big slow moving bureaucracy. Of course you are free to buy whatever you want but the reality is that many of the sub components of what you buy will still come from China.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2451605]Now I hear rumours. They are only rumors. That the Thai Government may be ready to permit Chinese Nationals back into Thailand before allowing Americans, Europeans, and Australians back in. If this rumor turns out to be true I will take this as a personal insult from the Thai Government and I will probably boycott Thailand for a long long time perhaps forever. [/QUOTE]It's going to go a lot deeper than just China and Koreans first. Americans and UK will be last in to Thailand for big countries that have many tourists traveling to LOS. I will continue to stand by my earlier prediction. Americans can't even get in to Canada. Trump wanted to reopen the US Canada borders last week and Canada said not a chance in hell.

Lufthansa announced they will recommence flying to the USA beginning in June. Optimistically hoping FKK clubs will reopen soon so I can go to Europe. I predict I'll be allowed in to Europe well before I am allowed in to Thailand.

[QUOTE=LittleBigMan;2451624] they cleared the Chinese and Korea they are free to visit May 16th, then this morning they declare the lockdown for International flights will continue till July.[/QUOTE]For those of you who do still plan on trying to get to Thailand as soon as the borders reopen the above is an example of why you may want to consider flying in to another SE Asia country and not fly in to Thailand directly. All may look fine when you board your 20 hour flight from USA but between leaving USA and arriving in Thailand immigration rules may change and you will be turned away at Thai customs. What this would mean is you have to fly back to your original departure city meaning you get to enjoy another 20 hour flight back to USA. At least if you come in from say Ho Chi Minh or Phnom Penh you will only have to take a 1 hour return flight if you are stopped at Thai customs. Then you can stay there or fly to Jakarta or PI to continue your sexcation.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2451651]Lufthansa announced they will recommence flying to the USA beginning in June. Optimistically hoping FKK clubs will reopen soon so I can go to Europe. I predict I'll be allowed in to Europe well before I am allowed in to Thailand. For those of you who do still plan on trying to get to Thailand as soon as the borders reopen the above is an example of why you may want to consider flying in to another SE Asia country and not fly in to Thailand directly. All may look fine when you board your 20 hour flight from USA but between leaving USA and arriving in Thailand immigration rules may change and you will be turned away at Thai customs. What this would mean is you have to fly back to your original departure city meaning you get to enjoy another 20 hour flight back to USA. At least if you come in from say Ho Chi Minh or Phnom Penh you will only have to take a 1 hour return flight if you are stopped at Thai customs. Then you can stay there or fly to Jakarta or PI to continue your sexcation.[/QUOTE]For those who don't know the FAA downgraded Thailand's airport rating to Category 2 several years ago, meaning no Canadian or United States jets may land in Thailand. Without a category 1 rating Thailand can't operate non stop flights to North America. And we all know how Thai's take the loss of face, there are articles that talk about how this has kept Thailand from fixing any issues and getting the rating reinstated. What I find shocking is Vietnam has a category 1 rating from the FAA. I've flown out of Vietnam and am shocked that Thailand was downgraded while Vietnam was awarded the high rating. Malaysia has also been downgraded. Why Canada follows a US rating is beyond my understanding. I have read that several Vietnam airlines would like to start direct flights to North America but who knows when or if this will happen. Now you can fly direct into Manila and Cebu from North America from LAX, JFK and Toronto to name a few cities on Philippine Airlines (no codeshare options available).

We've all read and experienced the risks of booking an international flight. Rebooking is one thing but what if your destination like Thailand changes their visa requirements and the airline refuses to budge on your flight? You plan out the trip, have a nice working budget and then your stranded in a non hobby city with expensive hotels that kill your trip. I wouldn't mind visiting Tokyo for a day or two but not for three weeks. And who knows what will happen to these budget airlines. They are operating on a shoestring budget as it is, will they be dependable to get you to Thailand and back from say the Philippines?

As to the FKK's. Just can't imagine them getting the green light to re-open. The government went out of its way to restrict them with the new laws, covid gives them the perfect excuse to keep them shut.

[URL]https://www.ainonline.com/aviation-news/air-transport/2019-02-21/thailand-accelerates-push-regain-faa-category-1-rating[/URL]

[URL]https://www.lexology.com/library/detail.aspx?g=29df4886-1190-43f8-a4dd-23709f49695d[/URL]

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2451605]I have one more thought about this pandemic: I am really pissed off at the Chinese Communist government. They knew about the virus and hid the facts about it's degree of contagion to the entire world. They even allowed their citizens to travel and spread the disease. I have always been a free marklet comparative advantage guy willing to buy products from any country that could deliver best on a quality and price. No longer! I have made a conscious decision not to buy Chinese made goods anymore. Opening up our markets to the Chinese Communists has been the biggest mistake of the last quarter century.

Now I hear rumours. They are only rumors. That the Thai Government may be ready to permit Chinese Nationals back into Thailand before allowing Americans, Europeans, and Australians back in. If this rumor turns out to be true I will take this as a personal insult from the Thai Government and I will probably boycott Thailand for a long long time perhaps forever.

Interestingly, for the last 15 years or so I have preferred LOS over Brazil and Colombia not because Thai girls are prettier or better in bed, they are not, but because I preferred the relatively peaceful ambiance of Thailand and Thai Culture over their Latin American counterparts. But I will reconsider this opinion if the Thai Government shows a preference for Chinese Nationals in light of the Corona Virus.

Rant Over. Still holding out some hope that I make it to Thailand this August.[/QUOTE]President Trump was told China was lying about the human to human transmission of the virus and warned about the real threat of a pandemic by his National Security Council, State Department and the Pentagon in early January. And he got further updates on it in his Presidential Daily Briefings all through January and February. Yet he continued to repeat and confirm China's lies about it on the world stage to EVERYONE weeks into it while it spread through many countries and, according to the numbers, most especially through the USA. "We've got this under control." "Thanks to Xi for his transparency." 'It'll be near zero soon."

The Thai government certainly has reason to disbelieve China's claimed cases. But they have just as much reason to disbelieve the USA's claimed cases and theirs are already the highest claimed number of cases on the planet. Trump doesn't even hide the fact that he is pushing in every direction to keep the USA's stated number of cases low and not necessarily factually low. Just "tested" low. It isn't hard for me to understand why America would be among the last places Thailand would want incoming tourists from.

EihTooms, I am not going to get drawn into a political back and forth with you on Trump. I know you dislike his policies and that's putting it mildly, ha ha, but what the fuck does he have to do with Thailand immigration policies and poontang? China let the disease out of its country not Trump and they should be held responsible for the carnage.

Here is a quick time line to perhaps help refresh your memory.

Dec 10 a seafood merchant in this city's Hua'nan market, first started to feel sick. Thinking she was getting a cold, she walked to a small local clinic to get some treatment and then went back to work.

Dec 18 the 57-year-old was barely conscious in a hospital bed, one of the first suspected cases in a coronavirus epidemic.

December 31 2019 China alerted the WHO to several cases of unusual pneumonia in Wuhan.

January 5, Chinese officials ruled out the possibility that this was a recurrence of the severe acute respiratory syndrome (SARS) virus.

January 11, China announced its first death from the new virus.

January 13 The WHO reported the 1st case in Thailand and the first outside of China, in a woman who had arrived from Wuhan.

January 16: CDC says US will screen passengers arriving from Wuhan.

January 17 as a second death was reported in Wuhan, health authorities in the US announced that three airports would start screening passengers arriving from the city. Authorities in the US, Nepal, France, Australia, Malaysia, Singapore, South Korea, Vietnam and Taiwan confirmed cases over the following days.

January 20 China reported a third death and more than 200 infections, with cases also reported outside Hubei province including in Beijing, Shanghai and Shenzhen.

January 21: First US case confirmed.

January 23 The cities of Wuhan, Xiantao and Chibi in Hubei province were placed under effective quarantine as air and rail departures were suspended. By the end of the week, more areas were placed under lockdown affecting a total of 56 million people.

January 23 The WHO said that the outbreak did not yet constitute a public emergency of international concern and there was "no evidence" of the virus spreading between humans outside of China.

January 29 US coronavirus task force created and Dr Anthony Fauci, the head of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, is appointed to the task force.

January 30 the WHO declared the coronavirus a global emergency as the death toll in China jumped to 170, with 7,711 cases reported in the country, where the virus had spread to all 31 provinces. By the end of the week, China reported 304 deaths amid 14,380 infections.

January 31 Trump blocks travel from China and issues an executive order blocking entry to the US from anyone who has been in China in the last 14 days. It does not apply to US residents and family members or spouses of US residents or citizens. The order becomes effective on February 2. Joe Biden accuses the President of being xenophobic.

January 31 Italy declared a state of emergency and announced a ban effective Jan. 31 on all flights to and from China to Italy, with no exceptions.

January 31 Singapore closes its borders to all foreign travellers from China.

February 24 Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi toured San Francisco's Chinatown and said there's no reason tourists or locals should be staying away from the area because of coronavirus concerns. "That's what we're trying to do today is to say everything is fine here," Pelosi said. "Come because precautions have been taken. The city is on top of the situation. ".

End of the time line, but there is more if your want me to go on. But seriously, as one fellow punter to another, LET IT GO! I mean if you want to trash the President, you can, just go to a political website and have at him. It is just not appropriate here on the ISG. You know that this site is an apolitical web site dedicated Thai girls and everything related to nailing them. So let's end this discussion in a good way before it gets out of hand again. I am still willing to bet you a drink at any bar of your choosing in Thailand that Trump beats Biden in the upcoming election. Wuhan virus or no Wuhan virus. Accept the bet and if your guy wins you can wash it down with some fine single malt Scotch or Anejo Tequila and we can then go out and hunt for some nice Thai girls. Just give the Trump thing a rest here.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2451690]EihTooms, I am not going to get drawn into a political back and forth with you on Trump. I know you dislike his policies and that's putting it mildly, ha ha, but what the fuck does he have to do with Thailand immigration policies and poontang? China let the disease out of its country not Trump and they should be held responsible for the carnage.

Here is a quick time line to perhaps help refresh your memory.

Dec 10 a seafood merchant in this city's Hua'nan market, first started to feel sick. Thinking she was getting a cold, she walked to a small local clinic to get some treatment and then went back to work.

Dec 18 the 57-year-old was barely conscious in a hospital bed, one of the first suspected cases in a coronavirus epidemic.

December 31 2019 China alerted the WHO to several cases of unusual pneumonia in Wuhan.

January 5, Chinese officials ruled out the possibility that this was a recurrence of the severe acute respiratory syndrome (SARS) virus.

January 11, China announced its first death from the new virus.

January 13 The WHO reported the 1st case in Thailand and the first outside of China, in a woman who had arrived from Wuhan.

January 16: CDC says US will screen passengers arriving from Wuhan.

January 17 as a second death was reported in Wuhan, health authorities in the US announced that three airports would start screening passengers arriving from the city. Authorities in the US, Nepal, France, Australia, Malaysia, Singapore, South Korea, Vietnam and Taiwan confirmed cases over the following days.

January 20 China reported a third death and more than 200 infections, with cases also reported outside Hubei province including in Beijing, Shanghai and Shenzhen.

January 21: First US case confirmed.

January 23 The cities of Wuhan, Xiantao and Chibi in Hubei province were placed under effective quarantine as air and rail departures were suspended. By the end of the week, more areas were placed under lockdown affecting a total of 56 million people.

January 23 The WHO said that the outbreak did not yet constitute a public emergency of international concern and there was "no evidence" of the virus spreading between humans outside of China.

January 29 US coronavirus task force created and Dr Anthony Fauci, the head of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases, is appointed to the task force.

January 30 the WHO declared the coronavirus a global emergency as the death toll in China jumped to 170, with 7,711 cases reported in the country, where the virus had spread to all 31 provinces. By the end of the week, China reported 304 deaths amid 14,380 infections.

January 31 Trump blocks travel from China and issues an executive order blocking entry to the US from anyone who has been in China in the last 14 days. It does not apply to US residents and family members or spouses of US residents or citizens. The order becomes effective on February 2. Joe Biden accuses the President of being xenophobic.

January 31 Italy declared a state of emergency and announced a ban effective Jan. 31 on all flights to and from China to Italy, with no exceptions.

January 31 Singapore closes its borders to all foreign travellers from China.

February 24 Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi toured San Francisco's Chinatown and said there's no reason tourists or locals should be staying away from the area because of coronavirus concerns. "That's what we're trying to do today is to say everything is fine here," Pelosi said. "Come because precautions have been taken. The city is on top of the situation. ".

End of the time line, but there is more if your want me to go on. But seriously, as one fellow punter to another, LET IT GO! I mean if you want to trash the President, you can, just go to a political website and have at him. It is just not appropriate here on the ISG. You know that this site is an apolitical web site dedicated Thai girls and everything related to nailing them. So let's end this discussion in a good way before it gets out of hand again. I am still willing to bet you a drink at any bar of your choosing in Thailand that Trump beats Biden in the upcoming election. Wuhan virus or no Wuhan virus. Accept the bet and if your guy wins you can wash it down with some fine single malt Scotch or Anejo Tequila and we can then go out and hunt for some nice Thai girls. Just give the Trump thing a rest here.[/QUOTE]NBC News is reporting that France has traced their Patient Zero to December 27,2019. However, there is evidence that goes back to Nov. 16,2019 that the virus was already in France.

See: [URL]https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/new-evidence-race-find-france-s-covid-19-patient-zero-n1207871[/URL].

[QUOTE=Rodwint2;2451713]NBC News is reporting that France has traced their Patient Zero to December 27,2019. However, there is evidence that goes back to Nov. 16,2019 that the virus was already in France.

See: [URL]https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/new-evidence-race-find-france-s-covid-19-patient-zero-n1207871[/URL].[/QUOTE]Right. I didn't want to get too controversial with my time line so I used a very neutral plain vanila source. If truth be told, there is mounting evidence that the virus did not originate in the Wuhan wet market, but rather it escaped from the The Wuhan Institute of Virology Biosafety Level 4 Lab and earlier than officially reported. But regardless of where and when, the incontrovertible fact is that the Chinese Government is 100% responsible and should be held liable for the resulting deaths and financial loss world wide. That is why it would really upset my sense of justice if the Thai Authorities allowed Mainland National Chinese tourists back into Thailand ahead of North Americans, Europeans, and Australians. And that is all I was trying to say in the 1st place.

[QUOTE=Rodwint2;2451713]NBC News is reporting[/QUOTE]There are few news networks more full of shit than NBC. I wouldn't trust anything that came from them.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2451690]EihTooms, I am not going to get drawn into a political back and forth with you on Trump. I know you dislike his policies and that's putting it mildly, ha ha, but what the fuck does he have to do with Thailand immigration policies and poontang? China let the disease out of its country not Trump and they should be held responsible for the carnage.
...[/QUOTE]I love when someone who already posted at least one rant on a topic reads a reply, swears they're not going to get drawn into an exchange on the topic and then launches into their next rant in reply. LOL. But it's all good.

Everything in your timeline that occurred after the middle of January occurred long after Trump had been briefed repeatedly about the the human to human spread that China was lying to everyone about while he promoted and confirmed the lies. Consequently, the people and agencies you mentioned after that were lied to by China and Trump as well, including the WHO, Fauci, Pelosi, Biden, you, me, everyone who was not present in those National Security Council, State Department and Pentagon briefings with Trump and getting his Presidential Daily Briefings.

Being held responsible for starting it is one thing. But some ongiong ban on a country entering Thailand or a longer time relative to other countries as "punishment" because that is where a pandemic started would not be any more practical than banning entry by the USA because it is likely the 1918 Spanish Flu got started in Brooklyn, NY. Thailand needs and has been getting a lot more money, engaged in a much more commerce and tourism from China and South Korea than from the USA and now their posted virus case numbers are way lower than those of the USA. There is no practical reason I know of for Thailand to welcome Americans back sooner or at the same time as China, for understandable financial and health safety reason. As of this writing, China and South Korea do have it "under control" more than the USA does.

Whatever financial hold China has on the world, especially Thailand, even the USA is not immune to cutting them slack if not outright promoting for them. Even Trump defied the early serious warnings he got about China's lies from his own intel agencies and praised Xi for his "transpency" on the status of the virus in China. Last I checked, nobody outside of Trump's inner circle and rabid supporters have praised Trump for his transparency on the matter.

And as far as the poontang part of it goes, if a higher percentage of American tourists into Thailand are known to come here for the poontang than the percentage of Chinese tourists (as well as the general greater commerce engaged in here by the Chinese), then all the MORE reason Thailand would less keen on opening their gates to Americans sooner or at the same time as China. Not because of some sexual issues. Because of the increased likelihood of spreading the virus through those kind of venues rather than from shopping in Central Mall.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2451742]I love when someone who already posted at least one rant on a topic reads a reply, swears they're not going to get drawn into an exchange on the topic and then launches into their next rant in reply. LOL. But it's all good.

[/QUOTE]And I love it when someone purposely takes a word or phrase that I used out of the self deprecating context in which it was originally used and tries to apply a different more negative connotation to the word in an offensive manner to gain an advantage in an argument. But it's all good. We both know where the other is coming from.

The reason I guess the Thai government are considering leaving under 40's visit is because of the lower COIVID19 risk they pose. Once the doors open, they will reconsider as beach bums will not lead a recovery. They should probably go for young families or women but no doubt they will do fine without our input.

Just finished a 48 HR layover in BKK, obviously no foreigners are allowed to enter Thailand at this moment except Airline staff and as my name suggest I am exactly that. Wasn't allowed to leave my hotel room and certainly wasn't allowed any visitors. That meant I had to hold my cock and watch pornhub for my stay there which is utterly depressing. So what have you guys been up too? ...... Oh never mind I'm not getting mixed up in that......

[QUOTE=GDreams;2451644]Of course you are free to buy whatever you want but the reality is that many of the sub components of what you buy will still come from China.[/QUOTE]My family and I are Apple fans. All our devices (Iphones, laptops) are Apple. Like, moreover, an important part of Western consumers. When I return my MacBook air I see: "Designed in California assembled in China".

And it's the same for a large part of the objects manufactured in Europe.

The result is that when we need simple emergency paper masks we can't find them, the whole world is served before us. Even more serious: 80% of the molecules intended for the manufacture of medicines are made in China or India. What will happen when we will find a treatment or a vaccine and we will not able to make it ourselves?

We have abandoned entire sectors of our industry in strategic areas.

We are becoming the new third world.

[QUOTE=AirlineCrew;2451858]Just finished a 48 HR layover in BKK, obviously no foreigners are allowed to enter Thailand at this moment except Airline staff and as my name suggest I am exactly that. Wasn't allowed to leave my hotel room and certainly wasn't allowed any visitors. That meant I had to hold my cock and watch pornhub for my stay there which is utterly depressing. So what have you guys been up too? ...... Oh never mind I'm not getting mixed up in that......[/QUOTE]Welcome to Paradise.

A world without temptations where one can remain chaste. Stay in our room, in our house without being tempted by the forbidden pleasures.

All in all, I think I prefer hell.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2451848]And I love it when someone purposely takes a word or phrase that I used out of the self deprecating context in which it was originally used and tries to apply a different more negative connotation to the word in an offensive manner to gain an advantage in an argument. But it's all good. We both know where the other is coming from.[/QUOTE]Which word or phrase was that? I don't know. I re-read your post and mine but honestly don't see what you are referring to.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2451651]
For those of you who do still plan on trying to get to Thailand as soon as the borders reopen the above is an example of why you may want to consider flying in to another SE Asia country and not fly in to Thailand directly. All may look fine when you board your 20 hour flight from USA but between leaving USA and arriving in Thailand immigration rules may change and you will be turned away at Thai customs. What this would mean is you have to fly back to your original departure city meaning you get to enjoy another 20 hour flight back to USA. At least if you come in from say Ho Chi Minh or Phnom Penh you will only have to take a 1 hour return flight if you are stopped at Thai customs. Then you can stay there or fly to Jakarta or PI to continue your sexcation.[/QUOTE]I fully share this point of view. It's a great suggestion. Nothing says that Thailand will open wide its doors to American and European nationals.

We will therefore have to consider other destinations and plans B (or even plans C) until we can return normally to Thailand.

I'm a bit newbie on the site, I don't know if I say something stupid but maybe ISG could be in this case a platform for exchanging good plans. We could exchange the good alternatives and the wrong destinations within the specific framework of covid-19.

[QUOTE=Pimpampoumpipo;2451878]..............We will therefore have to consider other destinations and plans B (or even plans C) until we can return normally to Thailand.

I'm a bit newbie on the site, I don't know if I say something stupid but maybe ISG could be in this case a platform for exchanging good plans. We could exchange the good alternatives and the wrong destinations within the specific framework of covid-19.[/QUOTE]It seems that most of our preferred destinations have closed their doors to foreigners. I think a major factor in our decision making should be how the particular country has dealt with their covid fighting operations. Vietnam looks increasingly promising with 300 odd cases and no deaths and what about Cambodia with just 122 cases and no deaths.

I had a round trip flight from Tokyo to Bangkok scheduled this month. I was just going to write it off but luckily I decided to Live Chat with AirAsia and see what my options were. AirAsia gave me full credit that I have 730 days to use. Hopefully Thailand international borders will reopen within 2 years so not all is a total loss. Then again, staying longer in Japan would by far not be the worst thing to happen.

[QUOTE=Breadman;2451657]I have read that several Vietnam airlines would like to start direct flights to North America but who knows when or if this will happen. [/QUOTE]

Hope so. Would be great to have a direct flight to SE Asia. I do agree that Ho Chi Minh airport is a mess. I paid extra for one of those Express passes and it still took over an hour to get through Customs. Da Nang airport OTH is great.

[QUOTE=Turgid;2451896]what about Cambodia with just 122 cases and no deaths.[/QUOTE]Cambodia has reported zero active cases. Whether that is true or not doesn't matter. For us who want to monger, bars have reopened in Phnom Penh. Now if they would just reopen international borders.

[QUOTE=Pimpampoumpipo;2451878]I fully share this point of view. It's a great suggestion. Nothing says that Thailand will open wide its doors to American and European nationals.

We will therefore have to consider other destinations and plans B (or even plans C) until we can return normally to Thailand. [/QUOTE]Well you have come to the right place, the INTERNATIONAL Sex Guide, to consider other destinations and back up plans, Pimpampoumpipo. Personally I think all the SE Asian countries that we have an interest in are playing a game of chicken in that no SE Asian country wants to be the 1st country to reopen it's borders to foreigners and then face the possibility that it's Corona numbers spike up again. So what is probably going to happen is a bunch of countries will make similar announcements concerning foreigners returning at approximately the same time. The key question is when will these openings occur and the answer is it's anybody's guess.

In the meantime we can research various other countries here on the ISG platform and think about various back up plans just in case some areas open up sooner than SE Asia. My #1 backup countries are Brazil and Columbia. These are two prime SA mongering destinations and there is a ton of info on them in their respective threads. Other Board Members like Germany a lot and still others are very fond of Kenya and Madagascar. It is a matter of taste. Madagascar is of some interest to me, but I have no desire to go to Kenya. It is anybody's guess when any of these alternative destinations open as well. So international travel as we now experience is on hold and has become a waiting game.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2451899]I had a round trip flight from Tokyo to Bangkok scheduled this month. I was just going to write it off but luckily I decided to Live Chat with AirAsia and see what my options were. AirAsia gave me full credit that I have 730 days to use. Hopefully Thailand international borders will reopen within 2 years so not all is a total loss. [/QUOTE]I still have two Air Asia flights with pending CC refunds. These two CC refunds have been "in progress" since March 22. (555) I had 3rd Air Asia flight that could not be refunded for one mysterious reason or another, but a full Air Asia credit was issued to my BIG Air Asia account within a week after I requested it. (Another big 555)

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2451914]I still have two Air Asia flights with pending CC refunds. [/QUOTE]I was never offered a CC refund at all. I had 2 options. To reschedule and fly by Fall 2020. That's a guaranteed loss of my ticket right there. Second option was the one I took. Credit and 2 years to use it. Since I fly AirAsia at least 12 x per year when I am doing my Thai visa runs I figured it was as good as cash.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2451911]Well you have come to the right place, the INTERNATIONAL Sex Guide, to consider other destinations and back up plans, Pimpampoumpipo. Personally I think all the SE Asian countries that we have an interest in are playing a game of chicken in that no SE Asian country wants to be the 1st country to reopen it's borders to foreigners and then face the possibility that it's Corona numbers spike up again. So what is probably going to happen is a bunch of countries will make similar announcements concerning foreigners returning at approximately the same time. The key question is when will these openings occur and the answer is it's anybody's guess.

In the meantime we can research various other countries here on the ISG platform and think about various back up plans just in case some areas open up sooner than SE Asia. My #1 backup countries are Brazil and Columbia. These are two prime SA mongering destinations and there is a ton of info on them in their respective threads. Other Board Members like Germany a lot and still others are very fond of Kenya and Madagascar. It is a matter of taste. Madagascar is of some interest to me, but I have no desire to go to Kenya. It is anybody's guess when any of these alternative destinations open as well. So international travel as we now experience is on hold and has become a waiting game.[/QUOTE]Thank you Natty Bumpo, I had an idea on sharing information thanks to ISG and I thank you for confirming it.

Given the special situation right now I am ready to share all of my informations that maybe some people would not yet have, of course in the right newsfeed. For Hong Kong, I think that ISG Internet users know even more than I do, even though I worked there. I can share information about Havana dating from my last visit 2 years ago. I also worked as an expatriate in Senegal and Togo but more than 10 years ago. Just like in Havana, even for old people like me (I'm 62). Despite that I hate flirting in the street, it is very easy to have contact in the street just with a smile with beautiful very welcoming Cubans (but beware with the police) and I am a huge fan of fabulous Cuban music. I also know Marrakech, there are very young and pretty girls, but I would only recommend it moderately except for those who like to play cat and mouse with the police. Personally I am a little older.

For the countries that I don't know, I am very tempted by Jakarta and Madagascar. I have a lot of French-speaking relations who fell in love, especially in Nosi Be which seems to have dream beaches (perhaps also interesting for diving enthusiasts).

Ultimately, opportunity will make thieves. Everything will depend on the order in which the borders are opened. Of course while waiting for the situation to normalize in Thailand.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2451914]I still have two Air Asia flights with pending CC refunds. These two CC refunds have been "in progress" since March 22.[/QUOTE]Mine is the exact same date. March 22. Same status. Pending. If they don't go bankrupt, I would guess I'll get the refund eventually.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2451917]I was never offered a CC refund at all. I had 2 options. To reschedule and fly by Fall 2020. That's a guaranteed loss of my ticket right there. Second option was the one I took. Credit and 2 years to use it. Since I fly AirAsia at least 12 x per year when I am doing my Thai visa runs I figured it was as good as cash.[/QUOTE]What a coincidence: I just received the following email from Air Asia concerning my CC refunds, "Dear guest.

We have received your request for a refund of your flight booking, and it is now being processed. Please do note that the refund process may take between 12-16 weeks from the date of this email, due to the overwhelming volume of queries and requests we are handling. ".

So good news. Ha Ha. But I was never that concerned about a refund or account credit except for the possibility that the company might seek bankruptcy protection. I like to fly Air Asia for short inter-Asian flights primarily because I can't stand arriving or departing from Swampy. I always buy a premium 1st or 2nd row seat so I can leave the plane quickly and get through immigration fast. I have never had a problem with Air Asia service. I like their girls.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2451960]What a coincidence: I just received the following email from Air Asia concerning my CC refunds, "Dear guest.

We have received your request for a refund of your flight booking, and it is now being processed. Please do note that the refund process may take between 12-16 weeks from the date of this email, due to the overwhelming volume of queries and requests we are handling. ".

So good news. Ha Ha. But I was never that concerned about a refund or account credit except for the possibility that the company might seek bankruptcy protection. I like to fly Air Asia for short inter-Asian flights primarily because I can't stand arriving or departing from Swampy. I always buy a premium 1st or 2nd row seat so I can leave the plane quickly and get through immigration fast. I have never had a problem with Air Asia service. I like their girls.[/QUOTE]No one company uses the "Bus Gate" more than AA. You pay for Prime time seats and they put you on a crowded bus. Then when you reach the destination, they put you in another bus to the gate. We can hope that with social distancing they will stop the use of the bus gate.

The reason for the Bus Gate is that it saves AA in that they do not pay for the expansion ramp. Keeps airport costs to AA low, at our expense.

Another pet peeves I have is that the exit door seats in the center of the plane are "Prime Seats". You pay more for these seats. But they are usually empty. So you have no one to pull the doors open in case of an emergency. Attendants are always in the front or rear of the plane. This could be a class action if someone wanted to pursue.

RL Trapped in Phuket.

[QUOTE=RobertLong;2452012]The reason for the Bus Gate is that it saves AA in that they do not pay for the expansion ramp. Keeps airport costs to AA low, at our expense.[/QUOTE]Not at all. Some airports do not have enough gate space to accommodate all the planes so some have to park on the pad. Take Avianca, Colombia's flagahip carrier, for example. In Bogota most of their domestic flights operate from the pads so they put you on buses. It has nothing to do with saving money by not paying for gates.

[QUOTE=RobertLong;2452012]Another pet peeves I have is that the exit door seats in the center of the plane are "Prime Seats". You pay more for these seats. But they are usually empty. So you have no one to pull the doors open in case of an emergency. Attendants are always in the front or rear of the plane. This could be a class action if someone wanted to pursue.[/QUOTE]Wrong again. If there was some type of incident where you needed to get out quickly, then you would have to wait until the pilots shut down those engines before you could use those exits anyway. That is unless you would rather get sucked into or blown away by a jet engine. So if someone could not walk to the next row by the time it takes to shut the engine down and being given instructions to leave out that way, then...Those are some of the worst seats in the house by the way. I don't know how they trick people into paying extra for that or those seats where you have a wall directly in front of you. Different does not mean better.

A Nida Poll strongly suggested that Thais, fearing a second wave of cases due to the corona virus pandemic, are strongly in favor or keeping bars and pubs shut.

In fact more than three quarters said keep them closed with less than a fifth in favor of opening.

The poll asked 1,259 people nationwide their opinions under a banner of "Freedom vs Health". The poll was conducted from 11th to 13th May before some changes were enacted.

Some 78.87% chose health over freedom when it came to bars, pubs, clubs and discos.

They cited such places as dangerous dens where close proximity would lead to a resurgence of the virus with potential health problems for non-drinkers.

Only 18.03% said open the bars again.

Maybe ways to unblock the situation and how it could happen at airports.

1 - Paris:

In a note given to Augustin de Romanet, president of ADP, LE Point unveils the main lines on which Aéroports de Paris is working to envisage a deconfinement in complete safety.

Among them: temperature control on departure and arrival, wearing a mask, putting on protections in places with human interaction, neutralization of one seat in two in waiting areas or specific organization for avoid queues.

Aéroports de Paris believes, according to "LE Point" that "air traffic can only resume if the passengers benefit from a sanitary habeas corpus, that is to say the guarantee of not being placed in the fortnight arbitrarily" .

Among the solutions mentioned are also the presentation of a negative test result at Covid-19 or the implementation of screening tests from airports.

Invited by BFM Business, Augustin de Romanet said last week: "The generalization of accessible and rapid tests could allow the moment to test passengers before they take off".

For Alexandre Demaille, associate director of RapideVisa, this solution would greatly facilitate the work of professionals and would meet a double constraint: reassuring travelers and responding to formalities that third countries could put in place to ensure that the virus does not enter not again on their territory.

In a column published at the end of March 2020, the director of RapideVisa already mentioned this line: "Travel agencies and airlines would benefit, because they would not have to repatriate possible refusals of entry.

Such facilities would enable the French to regain, as soon as possible, their freedom to travel, which is essential after a heavy confinement. ".

We would like checks to be made in the terminal before the check-in phase, even outside as far as possible, to make the airport a place of health security.

2 - Emirates already carried out tests in April: "Emirates is already testing its passengers in Dubai.

Others did not wait for access to new generation tests. As of mid-April, Emirates tested Covid-19 passengers at Dubai airport who were boarding a flight to Tunis.

A blood test was performed by the Dubai Health Authority (DHA) and the results were available within 10 minutes, the company said. This screening test was carried out in the check-in area at Terminal 3 of Dubai International Airport.

"We are working to increase screening capabilities in the future and extend them to other flights, which will allow us to conduct on-site testing at the airport and provide immediate response to Emirates passengers traveling to countries that require COVID-19 "test certificates," I said the company in a press release.

3 - Vienna. Austria:

Vienna-Schwechat Airport is now offering passengers a covid-19 test to avoid placing them in the fortnight.

On arrival, passengers who wish can undergo a virological test called PCR, for 190 euros, and obtain the result in two to three hours. The test is not mandatory. Otherwise, those who do not pass the test are placed in the fortnight. Also, passengers who are able to present a health certificate dated at least four days and indicating a negative covid-19 result avoid the fortnight.

The test for covid-19 is also offered to passengers departing from Vienna so that they have a health certificate upon arrival at their destination. As Austria begins its deconfinement, Vienna airport, still almost stationary, operates some regular flights to Doha, Dortmund, theüsseldorf, Frankfurt, Hamburg, Lisbon, Minsk and Sofia, as well as charter flights and business travel.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2452059]Some 78.87% chose health over freedom when it came to bars, pubs, clubs and discos. Only 18.03% said open the bars again.[/QUOTE]I wonder what the support for dens of inebriation, vice and debauchery would have been at normal times, among ordinary Thais (not Pattaya Thais). I reckon not much higher, probably never over 30% if you phrase it innocently enough, or less with a "brothel" association.

Unfortunately, I suspect negative attitudes will continue long after the immediate threat of the epidemic is gone.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2451720]But regardless of where and when, the incontrovertible fact is that the Chinese Government is 100% responsible and should be held liable for the resulting deaths and financial loss world wide. [/QUOTE]That doesn't wash. On that basis the US should be financially liable for the 2008 financial crisis, for not regulating sub prime mortgages, not regulating derivative products based on those, not bailing out Lehman, etc.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2451720]That is why it would really upset my sense of justice if the Thai Authorities allowed Mainland National Chinese tourists back into Thailand ahead of North Americans, Europeans, and Australians. [/QUOTE]Thailand, or indeed any country, will open up its borders first to those countries with least infections, which won't be the US nor (sadly my country) the UK, nor much of Europe.

Pubs, bars and entertainment venues will be allowed to reopen in the coming weeks if the daily count of new virus cases stays in single digits, the government's Centre for Covid-19 Situation Administration (CCSA) announced on Tuesday (May 19).

[QUOTE=JRoberto;2452218]That doesn't wash. On that basis the US should be financially liable for the 2008 financial crisis, for not regulating sub prime mortgages, not regulating derivative products based on those, not bailing out Lehman, etc.

Thailand, or indeed any country, will open up its borders first to those countries with least infections, which won't be the US nor (sadly my country) the UK, nor much of Europe.[/QUOTE]Sorry I don't know about anyone else but that is really a lousy comparison!

[QUOTE=JRoberto;2452218] those countries with least infections, which won't be the US nor (sadly my country) the UK, nor much of Europe.[/QUOTE]Those countries you are listing are about the only ones honestly reporting the numbers. I still don't believe for a second that China has coronovirus under control.

[URL]https://pattayaunplugged.com/western-style-cover-charges/[/URL]

Don't know this site but read this article. Cover charge to bars? 30 minute drink minimums?

Nothing I would hate more than being told I need to order another drink when I'm buying lady drinks. I'll take my 2000 baht and go to a different bar. I can hit 10 gogo bars per night. That certainly would no longer happen if there was 100 baht cover charge for each bar. In Bangkok, I barely go to Baccara any longer because they ask me to buy a beer before I go in. I like the option to at least see if there are any decent girls around or if there are any seats in the bar before I buy a drink.

I understand paying $40 USD cover charge (free for Nevada locals) at a strip club like Rhino or Sapphire in Las Vegas because I know there will be 200-300 girls working on any given night. I'm ok with paying 60+ euro to enter a FKK club like Goldentime, Sharks, or Oase in Germany because I know there will be lots of girls, I will get good free food (and beer), and I will get to relax in a nice garden during the Summer. However, the consistency in quantity and quality of Thai bars is not there. Then again, if it means lots of girls and no other customers during High Season I see the value in a cover charge.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2452352][URL]https://pattayaunplugged.com/western-style-cover-charges/[/URL]

Don't know this site but read this article. Cover charge to bars? 30 minute drink minimums?

Nothing I would hate more than being told I need to order another drink when I'm buying lady drinks. I'll take my 2000 baht and go to a different bar. [/QUOTE]About 12 months ago my drinking buddy was thrown out of a WS beer bar (no a gogo) for not drinking fast enough:

[QUOTE=Goferring;2303955]We grabbed a beer and a barstool at the first beer bar and noticed numerous cuties walking straight past us to the back of the building so we relocated to Utopia Bar down the back near the water front. Lots very cute girls with absolutely no social interaction at all. There were 20 staff around the bar and literally all of them were sitting with their backs to the customers, not saying or doing anything. The guy next to us confirmed that except being asked who he wanted to barfine, they hadn't said anything to him at all. To cap it off, my drinking budy was thrown out for not drinking fast enough!! I guess he was supposed to be slamming down drinks while staring at the backs of motionless statues?? [/QUOTE]Cheers. G.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2452352][URL]https://pattayaunplugged.com/western-style-cover-charges/[/URL]

Don't know this site but read this article. Cover charge to bars? 30 minute drink minimums?[/QUOTE]This is an opinion fluff piece thankfully. Still, I fear that someone will pay attention and while I don't mind buying a new drink every 30 minutes there is no way I am going to pay anything to enter any gogo or bar even on Walking Street.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2452352][URL]https://pattayaunplugged.com/western-style-cover-charges/[/URL]
In Bangkok, I barely go to Baccara any longer because they ask me to buy a beer before I go in. .[/QUOTE]So do I. However it is one of the gogos that I prefer in Thailand. I have always seen a lot of customers at Baccara in Soi CowBoy. I do not know why they make this filter at the entrance.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2452352][URL]https://pattayaunplugged.com/western-style-cover-charges/[/URL]
However, the consistency in quantity and quality of Thai bars is not there. Then again, if it means lots of girls and no other customers during High Season I see the value in a cover charge.[/QUOTE]It is the classic reaction of the gogos or the bars when the turnover decreases. Many have given in to the temptation to raise prices. So we are witnessing a vicious circle: fewer customers > price increases > fewer customers > price increases > bankruptcy.

Hopefully they will have the idea of boosting the money circuit by making big promotions to attract customers (And also a lot of girls of course).

From what I've seen lately in Pattaya, Sapphire maintained a certain influx of customers and offered pints at 99 baths while across the street at What's up when I go there (and I don't almost no longer) I am the only customer in the room and the basic beer is 180 baths. It is not the only gogo of WS to have few customers.

[QUOTE=Downandup;2452368]while I don't mind buying a new drink every 30 minutes there is no way I am going to pay anything to enter any gogo or bar even on Walking Street.[/QUOTE]I would mind big time if I were hustled to buy a new drink every 30 minutes in a Go Go. That's BS. The policy has always been not to hassle the customer. A 1 drink minimum has always a requirement to stay in a Go Go and watch the girls, but more drinks than 1 drink has always been up to the customer. But I do understand the concept behind buying a lady drink (not 2 drinks or a double LD drink) but 1 lady drink every time a Go Go girl is sitting with a customer in between her dance sets. I am ok with that. This is what Go Go's are for.

It is going to be very interesting to see if Go Go's like Crazy House in BKK still insist on customers buying a drink before they are allowed to enter the bar post lockdown. I never put up with that nonsense pre-Corona, but that never stopped the CH doorman from trying to impose the policy on me. I always responded with, "get mamasan out here. She knows me" and they would get her and that was the end of that. But I imagine post Corona everyone is going to be at their friendly best. It is going to be a buyers market for a long time to come post lockdown.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2452374]I would mind big time if I were hustled to buy a new drink every 30 minutes in a Go Go. That's BS. The policy has always been not to hassle the customer. A 1 drink minimum has always a requirement to stay in a Go Go and watch the girls, but more drinks than 1 drink has always been up to the customer. But I do understand the concept behind buying a lady drink (not 2 drinks or a double LD drink) but 1 lady drink every time a Go Go girl is sitting with a customer in between her dance sets. I am ok with that. This is what Go Go's are for.

It is going to be very interesting to see if Go Go's like Crazy House in BKK still insist on customers buying a drink before they are allowed to enter the bar post lockdown. I never put up with that nonsense pre-Corona, but that never stopped the CH doorman from trying to impose the policy on me. I always responded with, "get mamasan out here. She knows me" and they would get her and that was the end of that. But I imagine post Corona everyone is going to be at their friendly best. It is going to be a buyers market for a long time to come post lockdown.[/QUOTE]I am actually quite interested on how p4 p scene plays out once it's allowed to open. I have made my predictions before but it all depends on number of tourists. I would love to see how long gogos can survive with a loss, they pay gigantic rent. Will they be more friendly or try to suck every penny out of you once you're in, with policies like buy drink every X minutes. This all will be interesting!

[QUOTE=Pimpampoumpipo;2452370]So do I. However it is one of the gogos that I prefer in Thailand. I have always seen a lot of customers at Baccara in Soi CowBoy. I do not know why they make this filter at the entrance.[/QUOTE]It's because so many guys like myself walk in to Baccara in Bangkok and Pattaya, Palace, Sensations, and Pinup in Pattaya and there are no seats so we just walk back out. If they make you buy a drink first you're committed even if there is absolutely no where to sit.

As for the entry fee, the popular gogo bars like I have mentioned above would be able to get away with it and the bar would still be full. You can add Sapphire and Windmill to that list as well.

[QUOTE=Pimpampoumpipo;2452370]Sapphire maintained a certain influx of customers and offered pints at 99 baths while across the street at What's up when I go there (and I don't almost no longer) I am the only customer in the room and the basic beer is 180 baths. [/QUOTE]What's Up died as far as I'm concerned around 18 months ago. All the talent left to justify the higher drink and lady drink pricing. IIRC What's Up was the first bar to implement the 3k ST and 5k LT amounts.

[QUOTE=Downandup;2452368]This is an opinion fluff piece thankfully. Still, I fear that someone will pay attention and while I don't mind buying a new drink every 30 minutes there is no way I am going to pay anything to enter any gogo or bar even on Walking Street.[/QUOTE]It's Thailand so if one bar does it they will all do it. Take Soi 6 as an example. Nightwish raised barfine pricing so all Soi 6 bars raised their barfine too even if their girls were inferior lookswise or service wise.

[QUOTE=Gargano19;2452376]I am actually quite interested on how p4 p scene plays out once it's allowed to open. I have made my predictions before but it all depends on number of tourists. I would love to see how long gogos can survive with a loss, they pay gigantic rent. Will they be more friendly or try to suck every penny out of you once you're in, with policies like buy drink every X minutes. This all will be interesting![/QUOTE]Even before Covid-19, when I saw how few customers there were in certain gogos, I wondered how they managed to survive.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2452352][URL]https://pattayaunplugged.com/western-style-cover-charges/[/URL]

Don't know this site but read this article. Cover charge to bars? 30 minute drink minimums?...............[/QUOTE]Not surprising, remember the Thai model is when things get harder charge more.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2452352][URL]https://pattayaunplugged.com/western-style-cover-charges/[/URL]

I understand paying $40 USD cover charge (free for Nevada locals) at a strip club like Rhino or Sapphire in Las Vegas because I know there will be 200-300 girls working on any given night.[/QUOTE]You don't need to be Vegas local to enter Rhino or Sapphire for free. Just call the club and request they send a limo to pick you up. The ride is free and you will enter thru the back door. Just tip the driver five bucks or more if you're a group of guys. The $40 or $60 cover charge that tourists pay at the front door goes right back to the taxi or Uber that brought you there. It's a long standing tradition in Vegas that taxis extort this fee from the strip clubs or else bring their riders to other clubs that will pay the fee.

[QUOTE=RobertLong;2452012]The reason for the Bus Gate is that it saves AA in that they do not pay for the expansion ramp. Keeps airport costs to AA low, at our expense.[/QUOTE]Thanks, now I understand why I had to take a right in Denpasar, away from the Jet bridge to a stairs leading to the tarmac and bus. Same thing happened in Jakarta. But AA is not too bad, all in all.

[QUOTE=RobertLong;2452012]Another pet peeves I have is that the exit door seats in the center of the plane are "Prime Seats"[/QUOTE]So true. But that is not just AA. EVA air does the same. I was late and got a 'Prime Seat'. Another guy paid 100 dollars or so. Before the plane left we were explained procedures in detail in case of a needed emergency exit. We were asked if we were healthy enough to help at a calamity and if we were willing to do so. If not, they would look for other passengers to fill that spot. I had such a seat on a few other flights, in Asia and Europe. Same talk, same procedure. I never paid. I guess I just checked in late and not many people like to pay for such a Prime Seat.

[QUOTE=Pimpampoumpipo;2451868]...

The result is that when we need simple emergency paper masks we can't find them, the whole world is served before us. Even more serious: 80% of the molecules intended for the manufacture of medicines are made in China or India. What will happen when we will find a treatment or a vaccine and we will not able to make it ourselves?

We have abandoned entire sectors of our industry in strategic areas.

We are becoming the new third world.[/QUOTE]Google Serum Inatitute of India. Likely the largest manufacturer of vaccines in the world currently. Odds are the vaccine that will be available to most may well come from them. Long story but a pretty socially responsible pharma company that has already committed to a providing a low cost solution. Their intended price is $13 per dose. Trees.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2452660]I thought political posts were a no go on ISG.

Really wish there was a "Coronavirus and WTF are you talking about!" thread like in the Germany FKK forum.[/QUOTE][URL]http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?4165-Coronavirus-and-WTF-are-you-talking-about[/URL]!&p=2452662#post2452662.

Here you go Boi.

Did they actively control entry and exit of people to your hotel? I ask because many of the escort sites and other venues and independent gals will still do pitfalls, so I assumed hotels were letting visitors in. But I guess airline crew are kept in a special category, and under surveillance by public health people.

I wish I had invested in PornHub stock five months ago!

Cheers.

[QUOTE=AirlineCrew;2451858]Just finished a 48 HR layover in BKK, obviously no foreigners are allowed to enter Thailand at this moment except Airline staff and as my name suggest I am exactly that. Wasn't allowed to leave my hotel room and certainly wasn't allowed any visitors. That meant I had to hold my cock and watch pornhub for my stay there which is utterly depressing. So what have you guys been up too? ...... Oh never mind I'm not getting mixed up in that......[/QUOTE]

State of emergency most likely extending to end of June.

Plus this less than encouraging opinion.

Health ministry advisor Dr Khamnuan suggested at a seminar that the entertainment industry in Thailand should reopen by doing something less risky. Social distancing was impossible at bars and clubs and discos so they should just abandon the business and reassess their future. Damrongkiat Phinitkarn, secretary of Pattaya's entertainment and tourism sector, said it was clear that opening up bars and clubs was a long way off.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2452802]State of emergency most likely extending to end of June.

Plus this less than encouraging opinion.

Health ministry advisor Dr Khamnuan suggested at a seminar that the entertainment industry in Thailand should reopen by doing something less risky. Social distancing was impossible at bars and clubs and discos so they should just abandon the business and reassess their future. Damrongkiat Phinitkarn, secretary of Pattaya's entertainment and tourism sector, said it was clear that opening up bars and clubs was a long way off.[/QUOTE]It makes no sense to me. Curfew will be extended with new timing from midnight to 4 am. What's the point of curfew if all the nightlife is closed. Obviously I am missing something here.

[QUOTE=Gargano19;2453016]It makes no sense to me. Curfew will be extended with new timing from midnight to 4 am. What's the point of curfew if all the nightlife is closed. Obviously I am missing something here.[/QUOTE]To keep people from hanging outside in groups on those mats drinking and eating and spreading corona.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2453019]To keep people from hanging outside in groups on those mats drinking and eating and spreading corona.[/QUOTE]Aren't clubs not supposed to sell drinks "officially"? And what's stopping people from hanging out in groups and drinking and spreading corona, let's say at 9 pm.

[QUOTE=Gargano19;2453016]It makes no sense to me. Curfew will be extended with new timing from midnight to 4 am. What's the point of curfew if all the nightlife is closed. Obviously I am missing something here.[/QUOTE]I've said it once and I'll say it again. How else do you expect the government and police to generate extra revenue? If bars and clubs are closed, there is no key money to be had. Bars and clubs in Pattaya can't even open because there is nobody who will spend that kind on money left. Even Monkeypaw is on a budget of 2500 per day. Where do the locals find the money now that Thailand and the whole world is in a recession? So what the government will do is to keep the restrictions, so it's a rope given to some, to hang themselves. Look at how many they busted last month with the curfew? How much money did it generate for the police? If the curfew is lifted, the extra revenue is gone. These are tough times for the police to make money. If it won't make money for the police or anybody else, it will stay closed, no matter what is lifted. Pattaya malls are only at 10-15% of what I'm used to seeing, and most people are just walking around for free air conditioning and exercise. Most beach road businesses are still closed. Times like this, third world and first world countries start to loot and pawn shops will bank. It's always been about money with the government and most people. So curfew = police dollars.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2452802]State of emergency most likely extending to end of June.

Plus this less than encouraging opinion.

Health ministry advisor Dr Khamnuan suggested at a seminar that the entertainment industry in Thailand should reopen by doing something less risky. Social distancing was impossible at bars and clubs and discos so they should just abandon the business and reassess their future. Damrongkiat Phinitkarn, secretary of Pattaya's entertainment and tourism sector, said it was clear that opening up bars and clubs was a long way off.[/QUOTE]Times of a recession or depression, you want your citizens to spend their dollars in responsible ways so it doesn't further collapse the economy. Imagine a large family going through a financial crisis. The head of household will control where the money is spent and how it's funneled. You don't want your kids to spend it on partying versus food, do you? Now if that money was coming from another family (tourists), that would be different. But that family has left the neighborhood and is not coming back for a long ass time. The entertainment and sex industry had the most profit margin, so they will be the last on the list for help. Those bosses and owners like Night Wish and Rainbow group should be taking care of their low level employees on top of help feeding the poor. Think about that and the income of those in that industry compared to other regular jobs. Not sure why they are still using COVID as an excuse, but most minds are simple and would believe that in a city like BKK, which ranks 12th amongst all in the world in the most pollution and air quality, Thailand cares about your health so much.

[QUOTE=MonkeyPaw;2453060]I've said it once and I'll say it again. How else do you expect the government and police to generate extra revenue? ....
It's always been about money with the government and most people. So curfew = police dollars.[/QUOTE]Well said MonkeyPaw, that makes sense. Exactly what I was missing. Indeed police is taking huge amount of money (whatever in wallet, as long as it's more than 2000) from people found outside during curfew.

Are you in one of these 5 groups? I'm not.

[URL]https://www.thaiexaminer.com/thai-news-foreigners/2020/05/25/new-normal-access-to-thailand-even-after-flights-resume-if-virus-persists/[/URL]

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2453831]Are you in one of these 5 groups? I'm not.[/QUOTE]
I just have my cock to present at the airport checkpoint.

I think I am in group 6 or more who would go 14 days in quarantine on arrival in Thailand and 14 days on return in France, who must have COVID-19 insurance of $ 100,000 (no insurance delivers this option at this time), must provide a fit to fly, a negative covid-19 certificate of less than 72 hours to go to a country or bars, gogos are closed, the sale of alcohol is prohibited, with a curfew, where almost all the girls have returned to their province and where I'm not even sure if a taxi could take me to Pattaya from the airport.

Bienvenue en Thailande.

[QUOTE=Pimpampoumpipo;2453860]Bienvenue en Thailande.[/QUOTE]

imo Thailand is taking the proper precautions. Don't like it then don't go. No one is forcing anyone to go to Thailand.

Yes Thailand has insurance companies that sell COVID insurance.

Japan is taking a totally different approach. They will be announcing a program where they pay tourists to visit Japan by subsidizing part of the trip. If this comes to fruition in July I will be planting myself in Japan for 6 months. Had fun spending last Summer in Japan and Korea.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2453831]Are you in one of these 5 groups? I'm not.

[URL]https://www.thaiexaminer.com/thai-news-foreigners/2020/05/25/new-normal-access-to-thailand-even-after-flights-resume-if-virus-persists/[/URL][/QUOTE]They will eventually wise up when they realize they have such nonsensical conditions nobody is interested in coming.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2453866]imo Thailand is taking the proper precautions. Don't like it then don't go. No one is forcing anyone to go to Thailand..[/QUOTE]No big deal. Instead of the music which bust my balls in gogos bars, since the time I want to listen to wholly Der Ring des Nibelungen quiet at home, this will be the opportunity.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2453866]iYes Thailand has insurance companies that sell COVID insurance.
.[/QUOTE]I do not know how to read Thai well enough for contracts to understand the cases of exclusion of guarantees written in very small print nota bene at the end of insurance contracts lol.

What I read from the travel insurance contracts available in France now about coronavirus paragraph (Europ Assistance - AXA Insurance Public Limited. Final list of the 14 insurances companies "The compulsary health insurance for aliens to apply non-immigrant visa" in Thailand) :

"I have to go to a region advised against by the government, does my insurance cover me if I decide to travel?"

Answer : "We recommend that all clients follow the advice of the government.

If you travel to a region that is not recommended, you will not be protected by your insurance, which excludes intentional acts, in particular risky behavior.

Customers should read the recommendations of government authorities carefully before determining if their trip is deemed essential. Customers must be able to provide documentation that their travel is essential, in line with government directives. ".

I think it only concerns occasional travelers like me and not O-A long stay visas

Travel to Thailand is currently not recommended by the French government foreign affairs....

[QUOTE=Pimpampoumpipo;2453925]Travel to Thailand is currently not recommended by the French government foreign affairs....[/QUOTE]Mostly because they are pushing their citizens to spend their money in their own country instead of wasting it (they think) in a foreign country.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2453890]They will eventually wise up when they realize they have such nonsensical conditions nobody is interested in coming.[/QUOTE]One aspect of this pandemic that perhaps applies to Thailand more than many other countries is the potential for it to reach into and effect the Royal Family. Their well being and safety is probably taken more seriously here than the one in the U.K.

Nobody wants to be in charge of national security if or when one molecule of this virus creates a domino effect of serious illness and death from the top down in the already high risk group of the Royal Family, regardless how popular or not they are compared to previous ones. Not only would you be in deep shit, your entire family line and everyone they ever met might find themselves bannished forever. Zero tolerance will be the rule here more than most other places. Even if it is only "for show."

[QUOTE=Pimpampoumpipo;2453925]Travel to Thailand is currently not recommended by the French government foreign affairs....[/QUOTE]Which in most cases means that even if you did have travel insurance for Thailand it would be void.

So how about Macron? Do you think he's a better politician than Trump? Who has better hair? I'm a Merkel fan myself. Boris J looks like a bum off the streets imo. Maybe we should change this to IPG (International Politics Guide).

Girls busted for using LINE for prostitution in Thailand? Wonder what's back story. This shit happens right in their faces and they bust these 2 chicks?

[URL]https://pattayaone.news/two-lao-women-two-thais-nabbed-over-prostitution-charges/[/URL]

[QUOTE=AssAddict;2453938]Mostly because they are pushing their citizens to spend their money in their own country instead of wasting it (they think) in a foreign country.[/QUOTE]Which is a right thing to do from their pov. Plus with all the strict travel policies I am hearing, traveling to new country for less than a month just not worth for a while

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2453986]Maybe we should change this to IPG (International Politics Guide).[/QUOTE]Was the post you quoted really political? Seemed like related to just travel.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2453986]Boris J looks like a bum off the streets imo.[/QUOTE]He only adopted that persona to "relate" to the regular folk.

Well I'm not going to let you guys talk about politics without jumping in myself. Do any of you find yourself sexually attracted to Jacinda Ardern? I know I am.

[QUOTE=Allover;2454029]Well I'm not going to let you guys talk about politics without jumping in myself. Do any of you find yourself sexually attracted to Jacinda Ardern? I know I am.[/QUOTE]Good God No! But I'd do that young latina US senator in a heart beat.

[QUOTE=Goferring;2454044]Good God No! But I'd do that young latina US senator in a heart beat.[/QUOTE]It's not necessarily the look but it would be cool to tap a Prime Minister.

[QUOTE=Allover;2454060]It's not necessarily the look but it would be cool to tap a Prime Minister.[/QUOTE]Good point. Definitely worth a 200 baht tip just for the thrill.

[QUOTE=Allover;2454029]Well I'm not going to let you guys talk about politics without jumping in myself. Do any of you find yourself sexually attracted to Jacinda Ardern? I know I am.[/QUOTE]Her teeth scare me.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2453890]They will eventually wise up when they realize they have such nonsensical conditions nobody is interested in coming.[/QUOTE]This is what I thought at the beginning but there is so much contradictory informations that I no longer understand anything about their intentions and the dates of opening of their borders to tourists.

My feeling is all countries line up on each other. Thailand will not free its borders on its own while the other countries are in quarantine. And they want to obtain a "certificate" of good behavior and safety in front of covid-19 to reassure tourists and people.

[URL]https://www.ttrweekly.com/site/2020/05/will-the-flight-ban-be-extended-in-july/[/URL]

[QUOTE=Allover;2454029]Well I'm not going to let you guys talk about politics without jumping in myself. Do any of you find yourself sexually attracted to Jacinda Ardern? I know I am.[/QUOTE]Interesting you should bring this up! Was just looking at a picture of her yesterday, and yes I do find her attractive, and I have ever since she became Prime Minister and came to know who she was. I would fuck her LOL! And apparently, again as John Lennon said, but I'm not the only one hahaha!

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2453986]So how about Macron? Do you think he's a better politician than Trump? Who has better hair? I'm a Merkel fan myself. Boris J looks like a bum off the streets imo. Maybe we should change this to IPG (International Politics Guide).[/QUOTE]Banana Boiiiiiiiii.

First FMI what is IMO?

- International Maritime Organization?
- International Mathematical Olympiad?
- International Meteor Organization.
- a state of Nigeria?

Second, except for the politics of France, I NEVER speak about the internal politics of the countries, even in private. I have friends all over the world, in China, in Cuba, in Africa, in some Arab countries and other countries and I don't want them to be in trouble for having raised a political opinion.

Then I respect all the political forms of all the countries even when they seem strange to me like having a king in Great Britain (noooooo I am joking, it's a wink for my British friends that only they will understand. I love Great Britain :)

[QUOTE=Pimpampoumpipo;2454090]My feeling is all countries line up on each other.[/QUOTE]That was my point.

Not sure exactly who Thailand's major competitors are in the tourism sector but probably Vietnam Cambodia Malaysia Laos Indonesia maybe Myanmar down the line but when these countries welcome visitors without putting them through the nonsense rigmarole here they either wise up or forfeit 10 to 20 % of the economy.

Thailand has tremendous brand appeal but tourists have to feel welcome and taken care of. After the chaos of being fined for overstaying and having to queue for hours to get extensions through no fault of their own because there were no flights out of the country is not the way to make that happen. They eventually realized the extra baht they were getting in fines wasn't worth the goodwill they were losing and extended all visa's to the end of July.

We can only hope future policy on expats retirees and tourist is more enlightened than heretofore.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2453866]imo....
Japan is taking a totally different approach. They will be announcing a program where they pay tourists to visit Japan by subsidizing part of the trip. .[/QUOTE]At first I thought that only Japanese people could have such an idea.

But I just learned that certain regions in France offer money too to tourists on 3 conditions:

1 - you must take a room at the hotel.
2 - You have to go to a restaurant.
3 - You have to go to a museum in the region.

Banana Boi it's an opportunity for you to visit France ! I'll take you to visit Le Louvre ! (and Eiffel Tower).

You can come with your Thai, Japanese and Korean girlfriends if you lend me one or 2 (thanks in advance).

And you can invite me to the restaurant :)

[QUOTE=Allover;2454029]Well I'm not going to let you guys talk about politics without jumping in myself. Do any of you find yourself sexually attracted to Jacinda Ardern? I know I am.[/QUOTE]Not only that, she is showing up the weak ass piss ant middle aged male politicians we are burdened with in Australia in how to deal with this bloody virus. I know that her job is easier because she has no individual states to deal with but the direction, clear communications and honest approach she has adopted is text book crisis management. Well done Kiwi's.

[QUOTE=Goferring;2454044]Good God No! But I'd do that young latina US senator in a heart beat.[/QUOTE]AOC? But only with latex thigh highs, pigtails, lots of Red Lipstick and a ball gag so I don't have to listen to her. I know that eliminates one entrance to the journey of love, but she still has two left. Here's my capitalist torpedo baby.

So as long as I wear my captains lid and carry my ships log, they'll allow me to pay for the privilege of 14 days in state managed quarantine. Hmmm.

Good thing I got in before the door slammed shut. It's going to be awhile before tourism is back to normal. If it ever is.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2453831]Are you in one of these 5 groups? I'm not.

[URL]https://www.thaiexaminer.com/thai-news-foreigners/2020/05/25/new-normal-access-to-thailand-even-after-flights-resume-if-virus-persists/[/URL][/QUOTE]

I don't know if these were the first foreign diplomats from any country allowed to fly post ban into Thailand on Monday. But, if they were, it is a bit surprising which countries they came from. Maybe a few Chinese, Japanese, South Korean and Singaporean diplomats were allowed in secretly a few days earlier. Or I just didn't read about it.

[B]Thailand Allowing Foreign Diplomats to Fly In:[/B]
[URL]https://www.stickboybkk.com/news/thailand-allowing-foreign-diplomats-to-fly-in/[/URL]

[QUOTE]2 Danish diplomats, 1 Norwegian diplomat, 1 Swiss diplomat and 1 Czech "traveller" landed at Suvarnabhumi on KLM Airlines flight KL875 and once through the screening process, all were taken to the Movenpick BDMS Wellness Resort on Wireless Road in Bangkok for 14-day quarantine.

Later in the day, 1 Canadian diplomat arrived on All Nippon Airways Flight NH847 from Canada who after passing the screening process was collected by officials and taken to quarantine facilities arranged by the embassy.
...
News that six foreigners have been allowed to enter Thailand this week will bring hope to thousands who work, reside or have families here who have been stranded overseas due to the current travel ban.[/QUOTE]

Bangkok Post is reporting "Complete end to lockdown on July 1".

The report goes on to say, "The government has set July 1 for the lift of all business and activity lockdowns ordered earlier to cope with the coronavirus disease 2019 (Covid-19), said the National Security Council chief.

These include interprovincial and international travel, as well as the end of emergency decree and curfew. ".

So we shall see what this new government policy translates into in practice with regards to international arrivals and bar openings, but on the face of it this is pretty damn good news.

Here is a link to the entire report: [URL]https://www.bangkokpost.com/thailand/general/1925768/complete-end-to-lockdown-on-july-1[/URL].

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2454323]Bangkok Post is reporting "Complete end to lockdown on July 1".

The report goes on to say, "The government has set July 1 for the lift of all business and activity lockdowns ordered earlier to cope with the coronavirus disease 2019 (Covid-19), said the National Security Council chief.

These include interprovincial and international travel, as well as the end of emergency decree and curfew. ".

So we shall see what this new government policy translates into in practice with regards to international arrivals and bar openings, but on the face of it this is pretty damn good news.

Here is a link to the entire report: [URL]https://www.bangkokpost.com/thailand/general/1925768/complete-end-to-lockdown-on-july-1[/URL].[/QUOTE]Good find. Thank you for the update.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2454323] So we shall see what this new government policy translates into in practice with regards to international arrivals and bar openings, but on the face of it this is pretty damn good news.
[/QUOTE]Apparently it seems good news indeed.

However, there is above all this sentence that worries me the most: "Authorities will have serious discussions because after the emergency decree ends, other laws will be used instead," he said.

We will only know the conditions of access in June. For the moment, nothing says that there will be no quarantine on arrival or other delusional measures.

On the other hand, I do not know what measures will be taken from the Schengen area. They may be going to impose tougher measures. We must be fixed for the period to follow this afternoon by the government.

But what is remarkable again is the timing of the announcements. It seems that there is international coordination as we mentioned with Franciscass before. Although not really official it seems completely obvious and necessary.

"Health-oriented massage parlours can reopen for two hours of service at a time. Sex massage parlours, steam and herbal saunas remain closed. ".

It actually says this? But I thought such things did not exist?

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2454557]"Health-oriented massage parlours can reopen for two hours of service at a time. Sex massage parlours, steam and herbal saunas remain closed. ".

It actually says this? But I thought such things did not exist?[/QUOTE] This is just the Bangkok Post's interpretation of something written in Thai but the thing is, the government is actually taking this shit seriously. So anyone hoping for a nudge and a wink and a bit of tea money and everything will be back up and running is in cloud cuckoo land.

[QUOTE=Pimpampoumpipo;2454344]Apparently it seems good news indeed.

However, there is above all this sentence that worries me the most: "Authorities will have serious discussions because after the emergency decree ends, other laws will be used instead," he said.

We will only know the conditions of access in June. For the moment, nothing says that there will be no quarantine on arrival or other delusional measures.

On the other hand, I do not know what measures will be taken from the Schengen area. They may be going to impose tougher measures. We must be fixed for the period to follow this afternoon by the government.

But what is remarkable again is the timing of the announcements. It seems that there is international coordination as we mentioned with Franciscass before. Although not really official it seems completely obvious and necessary.[/QUOTE]Sounds great but lots of restrictions have already been lifted and even though restaurants are open social distancing makes for a somewhat odd experience with either Plexiglas partitions or sitting some distance away from your dinner companion (s) required.

If bars are allowed to reopen one imagines there will something similar in place making go go's unworkable but guess just got to wait and see how it goes.

Seems also likely it will not be completely back to normal for visitors with a country by country lifting depending on status of pandemic in originating country, possibly certificates of being virus free, perhaps insurance cover and whatever else they can dream up.

The economy is really hurting so expediency may diminish some of the silly nonsense that the uniforms keep introducing.

Hope so I miss the buzz and need to find some strange in the not too distant future. Regulars are fine but one does tired of the same old same old.

[QUOTE=*****man;2454559]This is just the Bangkok Post's interpretation of something written in Thai but the thing is, the government is actually taking this shit seriously. So anyone hoping for a nudge and a wink and a bit of tea money and everything will be back up and running is in cloud cuckoo land.[/QUOTE]But hopefully your wrong, LOL!! .

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2454562]Sounds great but lots of restrictions have already been lifted and even though restaurants are open social distancing makes for a somewhat odd experience with either Plexiglas partitions or sitting some distance away from your dinner companion (s) required.

If bars are allowed to reopen one imagines there will something similar in place making go go's unworkable but guess just got to wait and see how it goes.

Seems also likely it will not be completely back to normal for visitors with a country by country lifting depending on status of pandemic in originating country, possibly certificates of being virus free, perhaps insurance cover and whatever else they can dream up.

The economy is really hurting so expediency may diminish some of the silly nonsense that the uniforms keep introducing.

Hope so I miss the buzz and need to find some strange in the not too distant future. Regulars are fine but one does tired of the same old same old.[/QUOTE]
Yes clearly I can hardly imagine the gogos with social distancing measures like wearing a mask, standing at 1 meter or have a plexiglas.

And I laugh when I read that In massage shops "Only one-hour massages are allowed for now, and masseurs cannot work on the area above the shoulders. Extension of the massage period will be considered later," Not serious for the face, as long as I can get my dick massaged, that's fine with me. On the other hand, "both the client and masseur must wear a face mask at all times" is less fun but I hope we will manage when the curtain is pulled lol.
Cf [URL]https://www.nationthailand.com/news/30388678?utm_source=category&utm_medium=internal_referral[/URL].

In Europe the containment measures are lifted very slowly one after the other. In France, it has already been announced that discos or concert venues will be the last to obtain authorization to open, and there is no date yet. I imagine that it will be almost identical in Thailand and for all walking street.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2454562]Sounds great but lots of restrictions have already been lifted and even though restaurants are open social distancing makes for a somewhat odd experience with either Plexiglas partitions or sitting some distance away from your dinner companion (s) required.

If bars are allowed to reopen one imagines there will something similar in place making go go's unworkable but guess just got to wait and see how it goes.

Seems also likely it will not be completely back to normal for visitors with a country by country lifting depending on status of pandemic in originating country, possibly certificates of being virus free, perhaps insurance cover and whatever else they can dream up.

The economy is really hurting so expediency may diminish some of the silly nonsense that the uniforms keep introducing.

Hope so I miss the buzz and need to find some strange in the not too distant future. Regulars are fine but one does tired of the same old same old.[/QUOTE]I have a feeling a storm is coming. Just because it's allow to open doesn't mean they open. And for those who choose to open, they will need to pay rent even if they have little to no business. So most stay closed. Where are the former employees? Hotels? Tours companies? So many unemployed in Pattaya because it's like 95% service industry. Even at Central they don't run the AC in the top 2 floors and Mikes is completely still closed. Pattaya and Phuket needs so me serious help financially soon. Not sure where it comes from. Thailand has a working class of 38 million or so I think and 27 million or so are in in trouble and applied for the 5000 a month bail out. Today saw a group of immigration office and police at Treetown for dinner. Yep they brought their black pouches. They have pretty much clean house on the money in Treetown. It all funnels here, even the hookers. They know what they are doing. Treetown is the new Walking Street for awhile. Meanwhile the Central Food Court is dead at dinner time. Police controlled area, no rules no social distancing. I was chatting with a guy from Miami and Kwan showed up wearing a white see through tank top with her friend and said Hi. If I hadn't fucked her so many times before and if she wasn't so expensive, I'd be all over that now. Oh well bargain hunting on 2500 a day is still the game plan. She might be my #1 all time Thai girl of all time.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2454323]These include interprovincial and international travel, as well as the end of emergency decree and curfew. ".

So we shall see what this new government policy translates into in practice with regards to international arrivals and bar openings, but on the face of it this is pretty damn good news. [/QUOTE]Natty,

Pattaya News has a very different take on the situation, dealing with what was actually said rather than the Chinese whispers on social media.

[URL]https://thepattayanews.com/2020/05/29/fact-check-is-thailand-open-to-all-international-tourists-starting-july-first/[/URL]

Their view is only work permit holders will be allowed from 1 July and will have to conform to ongoing restrictions (14 day quarantine at travellers expense in a state approved facility, USD100,000 medical cover for COVID-19). Their "best guess" is easing of travel for mere mortals will be "mid fall" if there is no spike in cases.

[QUOTE=GettingFedUp;2454746]Natty,

Pattaya News has a very different take on the situation, dealing with what was actually said rather than the Chinese whispers on social media.

[URL]https://thepattayanews.com/2020/05/29/fact-check-is-thailand-open-to-all-international-tourists-starting-july-first/[/URL]

Their view is only work permit holders will be allowed from 1 July and will have to conform to ongoing restrictions (14 day quarantine at travellers expense in a state approved facility, USD100,000 medical cover for COVID-19). Their "best guess" is easing of travel for mere mortals will be "mid fall" if there is no spike in cases.[/QUOTE]Yeah, I am holding out only the slimmest ray of hope I will be allowed in (no quarantine) on my scheduled date of arrival Aug 15. In the meantime I just continue to wait and see what happens like everyone else. From a strictly personal perspective: If I can't fly in mid August I will NOT postpone my trip a 2nd time. 2020 will thus be a total write off for me.

I was thinking, however, about jumping down to Sao Paulo for a 2 week quickie in November to tide me over, but the current situation in Brazil is not looking good, so that idea is on hold for the time being. And if it turns out that I have to cancel my summer 2020 Asian trip in approximately 2 months, I will begin to plan an entirely new, even longer, early spring 2021 SE Asian trip beginning in March even though there is no guarantee international travel will be feasible at that future date either. What can I say? Hope springs eternal. 555.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2454802]If I can't fly in mid August I will NOT postpone my trip a 2nd time. 2020 will then be a total write off for me. I was thinking about a jumping down to Sao Paulo for a 2 week quickie in November to tide me over, but the situation in Brazil is looking bleak. In any case, in a few months I will begin to plan an entirely new, even longer, early spring 2021 SE Asian trip beginning in early March even though there is no guarantee international travel will be back at that future date. What can I say? Hope springs eternal. 555.[/QUOTE]I was lucky to finish my February-March 2020 trip, which was great. I've already given up on my October-November 2020 trip and consider my January-February 2021 trip to be in jeopardy. Everything is dependent on the availability of a successful vaccine. Airplanes are like petri dishes, I won't get in one until I have been vaccinated.

[QUOTE=HorseTrader;2454806]I was lucky to finish my February-March 2020 trip, which was great. I've already given up on my October-November 2020 trip and consider my January-February 2021 trip to be in jeopardy. Everything is dependent on the availability of a successful vaccine. Airplanes are like petri dishes, I won't get in one until I have been vaccinated.[/QUOTE]It is the luck of the draw. If I had only scheduled my original April 2020 trip to have begun 6 weeks earlier I might have just arrived in LOS before the international travel quarantine was put into effect. I would have been stuck inside of Thailand with the Memphis Blues again. Ha Ha. I think I would have enjoyed that.

Oh, the ragman he draws circles
Up and down the block.
I'd ask him what the matter was
But I know that he don't talk.

And the ladies treat me kindly
And they furnish me with tape
But deep inside my heart
I know I can't escape.

Oh, Mama, can this really be the end.
To be stuck inside of Mobile with the Memphis blues again.

-Dylan.

[URL]https://www.traveloffpath.com/thailand-reopening-to-tourists-everything-you-need-to-know/[/URL]

[QUOTE=GettingFedUp;2454746]Natty,

Pattaya News has a very different take on the situation, dealing with what was actually said rather than the Chinese whispers on social media.

[URL]https://thepattayanews.com/2020/05/29/fact-check-is-thailand-open-to-all-international-tourists-starting-july-first/[/URL]

Their view is only work permit holders will be allowed from 1 July and will have to conform to ongoing restrictions (14 day quarantine at travellers expense in a state approved facility, USD100,000 medical cover for COVID-19). Their "best guess" is easing of travel for mere mortals will be "mid fall" if there is no spike in cases.[/QUOTE]I agree it is just too soon to project that things are just going to open particularly with International travel. I would love to be wrong when it comes to the freedom to travel. There are many announcements read between the lines, words like " hint " when it does open expect a ton of strings attached especially with foreigners.

[QUOTE=LittleBigMan;2454936]I agree it is just too soon to project that things are just going to open particularly with International travel. I would love to be wrong when it comes to the freedom to travel. There are many announcements read between the lines, words like " hint " when it does open expect a ton of strings attached especially with foreigners.[/QUOTE]The reverse could also happen to the USA. I wonder if Thailand will restrict the United States travelers, so they don't piss off the Chinese and now Hong Kong.

[URL]https://www.bangkokpost.com/thailand/general/1927132/japan-mulls-easing-entry-limits-for-thailand-3-other-countries-yomiuri[/URL]

"Prime Minister Shinzo Abe's administration remains cautious towards softening the restrictions any time soon on China as any early reopening could trigger a backlash from the United States, which has been critical of the mainland's handling of the disease, the report said."

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2454562]Sounds great but lots of restrictions have already been lifted and even though restaurants are open social distancing makes for a somewhat odd experience with either Plexiglas partitions or sitting some distance away from your dinner companion (s) required.

If bars are allowed to reopen one imagines there will something similar in place making go go's unworkable but guess just got to wait and see how it goes.

Seems also likely it will not be completely back to normal for visitors with a country by country lifting depending on status of pandemic in originating country, possibly certificates of being virus free, perhaps insurance cover and whatever else they can dream up.

The economy is really hurting so expediency may diminish some of the silly nonsense that the uniforms keep introducing.

Hope so I miss the buzz and need to find some strange in the not too distant future. Regulars are fine but one does tired of the same old same old.[/QUOTE]Like I said previously, the tourists traps will likely remain closed until the tourists come back. Question is when is that with the world falling apart. And before you say it's fine or looks better wherever you are at. Remember, it does matter what happens across the other side of the globe. So we were wrong about the price of tea in China not mattering. Now we know it even matters about what's being sold in a wet market in Wuhan. Anyways, just because it's a bar, restaurant, club, massage shop has little to do with opening. Was it a tourist trap? Hooters was allowed to open weeks ago. And yet it remains shut down, not even offering to go orders. What does that say?

This video was uploaded today about the service you can expect in the Monkey House.

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-AB2WAtsAAg[/URL]

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2455289]No, Natty, not one word of what you wrote is a "quote" from my post. I didn't excuse China from anything.
[/QUOTE]Okie dokey. Have it your way. China is to blame for the world wide pandemic. I am glad we agree on something outside of girls and Thai cuisine .

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2455291]Okie dokey. I am glad we agree on something outside of girls and Thai cuisine.[/QUOTE]Girls and Thai cuisine are a fine gourmet mix. Of course, China's lies and mishandling of it are the first deadly sin. But what happened next cannot be dismissed either. It's something akin to a presumed good guy, let's say a cop with a uniform and a badge, assuring you that known (to him) thief isn't really trying to rob you, just relax, he's a friend, doing good work, all while he's going through your jacket searching for your wallet.

As bad as the thief is and he is definitely the perp, the lie that cop told you square in the face arguably caused more harm to you than if he'd just kept his mouth shut. Not to mention how about him instead warning you that guy is a known thief and probably trying to rob you before he gets your wallet, your phone and your Ray Bans.

[QUOTE=MonkeyPaw;2454943]The reverse could also happen to the USA. I wonder if Thailand will restrict the United States travelers, so they don't piss off the Chinese and now Hong Kong.

[URL]https://www.bangkokpost.com/thailand/general/1927132/japan-mulls-easing-entry-limits-for-thailand-3-other-countries-yomiuri[/URL]

"Prime Minister Shinzo Abe's administration remains cautious towards softening the restrictions any time soon on China as any early reopening could trigger a backlash from the United States, which has been critical of the mainland's handling of the disease, the report said."[/QUOTE]As I noted there will be politics involved how much is anyone's guess? When it comes to traveling I feel it is near the bottom of the list the Thai leaders will tiptoe the best they can until a real decision is made? My gut when it comes to the USA With all the things going on if the numbers spike the decision for Thailand is pretty easy even without China interference. The last week China seems to have gone from let's play together to just throwing in the towel and doubling down on their position with Hong Kong and the retraction on phase one of the trade agreement things are starting to heat up.

Outside of this, I continue to keep my option open and track Airline for personal reasons. If my research is correct this might be a factor to consider even when things open back up whether one will travel especially when so much conversation is about prices?

Outside of your post in general, I have been tracking flights and cost it should be noted if one origination point is from Bangkok the price has always been higher than if you originate from the West coast of the USA.

Evaair, in Feb the price for a round trip from BKK-SFO was 23,000 baht, for Sept, that was the same for Feb 2021. April 1st the price went to 37,000 baht. Last night I checked for Sept it has gone to 57,000 baht for Feb it is still at 37,000 baht but it is still too early I suspect it will go up to 57,000 as time goes by. I notice flights are also being cut.

Alternative Airline Cathay BKK-HK-SFO September is at 22,000 baht, and Feb is at 30,000 but I suspect these prices are going to be going up pretty soon. I like Eva but Cathay is also a good choice to SFO I've read the fine print and thinking of making the purchase for Feb 2021 to lock in the price even if I need to cancel and paid the fee I still come out ahead. I understand posters are going to look at this and say too early so and so on and on I fully understand so don't take what I've noted too seriously it is just a pattern.

As for trips coming from the USA SFO / BKK I noticed Eva, in Feb 2020 price was 650 USD now it is 1000 USD.

Good article June 1st, regarding International travel to Thailand on Bloomberg " Travel bubble " I hoping this is wrong but down deep it is pretty much I think will happen when it comes to USA Britain and Europe that bubble is the end of the year at best?

[QUOTE=MonkeyPaw;2454943]"Prime Minister Shinzo Abe's administration remains cautious towards softening the restrictions any time soon on China as any early reopening could trigger a backlash from the United States, which has been critical of the mainland's handling of the disease, the report said."[/QUOTE]

No one would understand that China is one of the first countries to which borders are open when the epidemic comes from home and especially that it took a long time before taking sanitary measures and alerting WHO, that during this time Chinese travelers spread the virus all over the world and the information and figures given by the government since then appear to be truncated or even false.

On this issue, the Chinese government no longer has much credibility now.

Do any of our governments have much credibility now? The US government response was awful. CDC has been blending antibody tests with covid tests to increase the test numbers. The US government reponse to protestors is at best equal to China's in HK, but in reality probably worse, even China never brought the troops in from Shenzen during last summer and didn't do low helo flyovers of the protestors. I am not a fan of Xi, but he also didn't tear gas and assault his people to take a photo.

Anyway my point is that credibility is out the window for most of the world's governments. Reality is China is the biggest tourism customer for Thailand so they are going to be focus for the TAT. This doesn't even consider the economic links and military links Thailand has with the PRC. I suspect Japan and Korea will be next in line.

As far as the US goes most of the world may wait on the sidelines until November and the Trump issue is decided. There is simply no reason for anyone else to make commitments before then. You also have the factor that all of the world's governments that have international tourism cash outflows would rather keep their people locked in and force that money to stay at home than go abroad. Thailand which has a huge tourism trade surplus is even promoting to their own people to spend in country and not abroad. In the states you have always seen this even at a local level with restricted roads between states or municipalities to try to direct tourism dollars to stay local.

The correct academic approach to this is that for any country that has a tourism trade surplus is to get that flowing as quickly as possible through incentive programs and ease of travel, with a possible move also to restrict your own people to increase that gap. Japan I would think has a deficit but is already announced an incentive program to restart foreign tourism. Without knowing what numbers the TAT is operating on you basically have to assign a value to each countries tourist which would be how much they bring in less their cost and then multiply by average count. Due to raw volume China is clearly #1 even if they only spent 2000 THB a day. This would be the same for Japan and Korea due to numbers. Then you get into "quality" tourists that spend a lot more on average but have smaller numbers like UK, US, AUS. They may beat out India based on the large difference in daily spend. However even that can be manipulated with Visa requirements, like enforcing the provisions to prove a certain cash amount and hotel reservations which would filter out the bottom half of a given population.

Also to be clear this is what every government does or is likely to do. In the USA my PRC friend's visa for 10 years was less than $300, now to do the extension for another 6 months since they can't get a flight home is going to cost near $500. Come spend your money, but do it quickly and leave, if you want to stay is going to cost you a lot more.

[QUOTE=Pimpampoumpipo;2455768]No one would understand that China is one of the first countries to which borders are open when the epidemic comes from home and especially that it took a long time before taking sanitary measures and alerting WHO, that during this time Chinese travelers spread the virus all over the world and the information and figures given by the government since then appear to be truncated or even false.

On this issue, the Chinese government no longer has much credibility now.[/QUOTE]

I really hate doing this over and and over again. I've talked with countless of people, and they say from what they heard from the government or what they read, it's not too bad for Thailand. My response is when talking about current situation, imagine it's just like ISG. Avoid those who wear rose colored glasses. Always being optimistic just because, but give you no rationale. They will say "Thailand always recovers." Yeah, but when? And how? And what about other countries since we are talking about international issues affecting Thai people which depends on international dollars.

1. Lots of supposed sex-perts just giving a bunch of opinions.

2. Look at the credentials of who is giving you the opinion.

3. On the ground reporting and in the action supersedes should be the most trusted and look at #2.

Thailand's economy is projected be the worse drop amongst all Asian countries. Thailand is fucked. Why because I am on the ground and I can see the decline and hopelessness in Pattaya. The opening of businesses is doing little to help in Pattaya. For this month, the expenses will be greater than any revenue. It's like opening a restaurant and having little or no customers. You fire staff, and make the few left behind work more, longer, and harder. The service and quality will go down because of tired staff, but you will charge a the same or a higher price because you are short on money. Rent and utilities will be due That is a recipe for doom, but especially on a greater scale. Beach opens in Pattaya. Lots of people, but very few rent chairs or buy from vendors because they like "free. " They bring their own mats and food and leave behind mess and trash. The cost to clean and maintain will be greater than the revenue coming in from opening the beach. The value of the Thai baht is going up, which makes no sense due to state of economy. It's a paradox and that means being manipulated by insider trading and corruption. Your economy is sinking but baht goes up and prices stay same. Not a good recipe. Also as the USA struggles, so will the world and Thailand.

[URL]https://thethaiger.com/hot-news/economy/thailands-central-bank-will-act-to-restrain-soaring-baht[/URL]

[URL]https://pattayaone.news/state-of-economy-worse-than-initially-estimated/[/URL]

I have been chomping at the bit to enjoy a few days of playing golf and female companionship in the LOS for sometime now. I have been in contact with the agency that normally takes care of the bookings, etc and finally today got some kind of info. While I cannot vouch for the veracity of the info, the answer to my "when" question was they are not expecting to be able to accommodate foreign guests prior to 4 Q of this year. I have inquired about going to Vietnam or Cambodia, but it appears no one wants to be the first. I guess we will see!

Read the story here as it's absolutely not certain that this will actually happen: [URL]https://thepattayanews.com/2020/06/04/thai-covid19-situation-administration-confirms-next-phase-of-considering-reopening-closed-businesses-contains-entertainment-venues-like-pubs-and-bars/[/URL].

[QUOTE=SkyRyder;2455941]I have been chomping at the bit to enjoy a few days of playing golf and female companionship in the LOS for sometime now. I have been in contact with the agency that normally takes care of the bookings, etc and finally today got some kind of info. While I cannot vouch for the veracity of the info, the answer to my "when" question was they are not expecting to be able to accommodate foreign guests prior to 4 Q of this year. I have inquired about going to Vietnam or Cambodia, but it appears no one wants to be the first. I guess we will see![/QUOTE]You may be right that no one wants to be the first. However, whichever country is bold enough to be first, will probably have heavy tourism first as well (After 3 months plus of closed Asian destinations, there are many waiting on the sidelines that at this point will gladly go to any of the typical destinations for fun (Thai, Cam, Philly, Viet, Indo, Mal, etc.) I know some may be thing that its not possible because many are hurting financially due to the Covid shutdown world wide. Well, I am just one person, but I know of 3 different friends that are able and willing. So I am sure there are others out there. Once one opens, the others will soon cave in as well. Its going to be interesting to see who jumps in the pool first.

My guess, when big entertainment areas open, they will not open to international tourism for a couple of months after, just to measure and keep track of its impact to the covid numbers. That being said, those owners will be open, but will not have enough customers. That just seems like the last nail in the coffin for many of those businesses. I hope I am wrong.

BTW< thanks for the update with your travel agent. Keep us updated.

[QUOTE=MonkeyPaw;2455886]I really hate doing this over and and over again. I've talked with countless of people, and they say from what they heard from the government or what they read, it's not too bad for Thailand. My response is when talking about current situation, imagine it's just like ISG. Avoid those who wear rose colored glasses. Always being optimistic just because, but give you no rationale. They will say "Thailand always recovers." Yeah, but when? And how? And what about other countries since we are talking about international issues affecting Thai people which depends on international dollars.

1. Lots of supposed sex-perts just giving a bunch of opinions.

2. Look at the credentials of who is giving you the opinion.

3. On the ground reporting and in the action supersedes should be the most trusted and look at #2.

Thailand's economy is projected be the worse drop amongst all Asian countries. Thailand is fucked. Why because I am on the ground and I can see the decline and hopelessness in Pattaya. The opening of businesses is doing little to help in Pattaya. For this month, the expenses will be greater than any revenue. It's like opening a restaurant and having little or no customers. You fire staff, and make the few left behind work more, longer, and harder. The service and quality will go down because of tired staff, but you will charge a the same or a higher price because you are short on money. Rent and utilities will be due That is a recipe for doom, but especially on a greater scale. Beach opens in Pattaya. Lots of people, but very few rent chairs or buy from vendors because they like "free. " They bring their own mats and food and leave behind mess and trash. The cost to clean and maintain will be greater than the revenue coming in from opening the beach. The value of the Thai baht is going up, which makes no sense due to state of economy. It's a paradox and that means being manipulated by insider trading and corruption. Your economy is sinking but baht goes up and prices stay same. Not a good recipe. Also as the USA struggles, so will the world and Thailand.

[URL]https://thethaiger.com/hot-news/economy/thailands-central-bank-will-act-to-restrain-soaring-baht[/URL]

[URL]https://pattayaone.news/state-of-economy-worse-than-initially-estimated/[/URL][/QUOTE]You are right but you can't blame those looking in hoping that what you are saying isn't correct. Now I'm not running around every day looking for pussy like you but I continue to put in 50 KM's every day on my bike doing what I did before the virus. If you are aware of your surrounding you notice things and if you got boots on the ground you can clearly see something just isn't right. You read the articles and between the lines, they stumble stumbling is the Thai leaders lie trying everything they could to make it sound like they got a handle on things when they really don't. When it comes to the economy one day they put up these numbers that all is good they have tons of reserve the next they are trying to borrow money to stimulate their own pockets. Even before the virus the baht was weakening at the beginning of Feb it was 33.10 since it has dropped to 31.50 anyone that knows anything other than pussy can see their economy has already tanked with so many people each day standing in the sun getting food.

Although they have opened things up the only people spending money in town are the ones stuck like yourself and that isn't going to make their economy. You noted that although Hooters can open they haven't this goes with why so many other business aren't going to do so because if they open those doors they have to start paying rent and it isn't rocket science if you got a business on Beach Road with no tourist you got to be really stupid to open.

A case as proof I called my son eye Doctor the other day she has a new shop in Royal Garden she indicated the mall was to open June 1st so 2nd I went down couldn't find it called her and she came down and opened to let us in then shut down behind and explained it all to me. Why opened there is no one around turn the lights on and the clock starts on rent.

You drive through town as I've done day in day out for years there are shops pack up and gone never coming back even when they open fully up it will take a vaccine and a year down the road. The beach is opened but vendors aren't allowed to set up chairs etc until this weekend is what is rumor except I heard down the road towards Bang Seang they have already gone mad and the beach is packed with people I did a drive through last Thursday and it was still roped off today I was on the other end towards Sattahip Bang Saray and still no vendors or food being sold. The economy has already tanked I'm waiting for the baht to fall and fall hard 40-1 would be nice for a change?