Bangkok Reports

[quote=thulolado;1592630]only been in town a few days. last visit was during the coup and not much is changed.

had a slimmer's lunch at star of light today. at least a year since my last visit. they've upgraded the toilet a bit with some corner cushions where there used to be storage. service in the bar but they are paranoid about 'checking' by authorities, so one has to go to the head for service and then only if you promise to finish quickly. they tried to huddle me to a st hotel nearby, but i wanted nothing doing as i had my plans for a quick lunch. same level of providers as always.

few days ago went so som's haven on soi 14. nice place and pretty clean private rooms all with a sink attached. about the same level of provider as [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord901][CodeWord901][/url]'s but more convenient location right next to asok bts. oral is standard 700 and was offered fs for 1200. might make this my go-to when i'm in the neighborhood and want something quick.[/quote]always try to.

visit the star when in town. seem if they know you a bit they aren't quite so paranoid. there is 1 gal there, can't remember her name, bit on the heavy side but big tits. she.

always jumps me as soon as i walk in the door. always takes me in the back and starts with a good bj and then wants more action. end up banging her there every time. only charges me for the bj.

tried dr. bj's on soi 7/1 recently and had a good time there with a gal named jane. very friendly nice body, smallish tits and cute face and not rushed. enjoyed dr. bj's a lot more than [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord900][CodeWord900][/url] as they seem way to mechanical there. had 1 gal there actually get annoyed that i was taking too long. will have to give som's heaven a go next trip.

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[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1592617]Who would have ever throught that HotShaneHot is probably the last of the Travellers on this board?[/QUOTE]Now THAT is funny! It's also disturbingly accurate. :)

[QUOTE=Skogis;1592733]That beeing said I still have a blast in the BKK's FL pick up clubs for the same price as in 07/08 (3 K LT and allways real LT, hell sometimes even to long LT) so I am not at all affected by this BF and bar downtalking stuffs. Why go there if it is so bad? Why not change MO? Just asking.
[/QUOTE]Well, many of us don't go there anymore. I haven't been to a go-go in years. $200 for 30 minutes? I can do that in Tijuana for half the price and save $2,000 in airfare.

Yes, I think the FL market is the way to go in many locations now. In April I was surprised at the overall quality in, of all places, the Soi 7 Biergarten. So, as you said, the FL venues are much more interesting hunting grounds. However, these sorts of places take a bit more effort and time. The Tourist isn't going to bother if it can be spoon-fed to him elsewhere.

[QUOTE=Phordphan;1592828]In April I was surprised at the overall quality in, of all places, the Soi 7 Biergarten. So, as you said, the FL venues are much more interesting hunting grounds. However, these sorts of places take a bit more effort and time. The Tourist isn't going to bother if it can be spoon-fed to him elsewhere.[/QUOTE]Hell yes on the same day as I did the Climax routine I was stralling around and stopped by Biergarten (BG) for a cold brew. I guess it was like 2 pm. Never have I seen so many ladies inside at these hours and the quality also averagely quite decent to good with one or two possible describe as stunners. I put normal BG standards when evaluating. Almost so I broke my own promise to myself not bringing a girl back. I downed my beer all in a hurry, paid up and left in a hurry before my hormones took charge.

[QUOTE=DRRonin;1592685]That's just not correct. I've been coming here since 1993 and over that time 99% of my exchanges were for short time. One of the few English phrases girls knew back in those early days was "short time long time? [/QUOTE]Nominally yes, but back in the day (before 2008 or so, the longer ago the better), the customary short time was different.

In my experience, majority of the girls would hang out, talk to you a bit, have sex, then linger for some time and maybe have another shot if you're up for it (sure, this would carry an expectation of a small tip, but they would almost never mention it, or oh, lord, bargain hard). It was rare that a girl would stay for much under an hour for ST unless you chase them out.

These days, the standard seems to be to immediately jump in the shower, do the act, then after the deed jump to shower and start dressing and putting on makeup before the customer is even out of the shower. Not quite Amsterdam RLD yet, well on the way.

There were some interesting comments in a 2014 Stickman column re the nose diving value of Bangkok gogos & a recent visit to Thermae coffee shop. Also secret cameras taking video in the short time room & the age of girls during the 1990's Siam HIV heyday:

"I'm not sure what everyone's moaning about. I visited the much-maligned Thermae for the first time this week and could barely fight them off. And my name's not Tojo".

[URL]http://www.stickmanbangkok.com/StickmanWeeklyColumn2013/Bangkok-bar-stories.htm[/URL]

Prices more now than 20 or 30 years ago? To put that in perspective, generally everything in the entire world is way more, including wages. You didn't have the internet with oceans full of free porn or sites like ISG in 1990, either.

Girls used to chat & hang around after STs? I pay them to leave, not act like clingy GFs. But if that's your thing, you can still find them FOTF in LOS & elsewhere in SEA.

[QUOTE=PinkPearl;1592994]There were some interesting comments in a 2014 Stickman column re the nose diving value of Bangkok gogos & a recent visit to Thermae coffee shop. Also secret cameras taking video in the short time room & the age of girls during the 1990's Siam HIV heyday:

"I'm not sure what everyone's moaning about. I visited the much-maligned Thermae for the first time this week and could barely fight them off. And my name's not Tojo".

[URL]http://www.stickmanbangkok.com/StickmanWeeklyColumn2013/Bangkok-bar-stories.htm[/URL]

Prices more now than 20 or 30 years ago? To put that in perspective, generally everything in the entire world is way more, including wages. You didn't have the internet with oceans full of free porn or sites like ISG in 1990, either.

Girls used to chat & hang around after STs? I pay them to leave, not act like clingy GFs. But if that's your thing, you can still find them FOTF in LOS & elsewhere in SEA.[/QUOTE]I don't want to hang out with them either, but I want skilled un-rushed service.

Prices are far more than double what they were 15 years ago. Can't point to many things that have inflated that much. And most wages are not that much more, see the shrinking middle class.

[QUOTE=Kerrstar;1592659]Nope, even in the mid 90's when I used to mainly drink / bang in Patpong the girls were all LT. If I wanted a quicky I'd go to the Kangaroo bar, otherwise I'd just get a girl from a bar. I don't ever remember even discussing ST or LT way back then.

I haven't been to Patpong for years, these days I'm too lazy to go too far from Soi Cowboy.[/QUOTE]No worries. My memory fades of exactly what year I first got STs in Phat Pong. Definitely before was prevalent in Cowboy. Could have been very late 90's, could have been earlier. All of us are suffering from slightly fuzzy memories.

I also have not been to Phat Phong much in recent years, not even to SOL for years, since Som and Ae left.

[QUOTE=Phordphan;1592828]Well, many of us don't go there anymore. I haven't been to a go-go in years. $200 for 30 minutes? [/QUOTE]No idea why you wrote $200 for 30 minutes. I don't see anything that crazy going on. I have seen super hot girls asking for 3 K for ST, but most are lower, and its up to the punter how long he takes, unless we talk about rip off type girls in Rainbow 4.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1593062]
Prices are far more than double what they were 15 years ago. Can't point to many things that have inflated that much. And most wages are not that much more, see the shrinking middle class.[/QUOTE]These days you get a lot more Baht for your dollar than 15 years ago. So real cost is different to perceived cost. I reckon a bowl of soup noodles probably also doubled in 15 years and got smaller. I am guessing a bit since I generally don't eat noodles, but I have heard Thais complaining about cost of noodles and how small is the serve.

I think you will find that sex prices inflated very rapidly in the 90's and early part of the 2000's but more slowly for at least the last 10 years. 12 years ago I was paying 1 K to the girl direct in an MP for sex on top of the massage. Now the price for sex in Oily is still basically 1500, even though most places have switched to all inclusive price (girls typically get 1400 now). Gogo bar prices no doubt went up far more. 23 years ago, Cowboy standard price for LT girl was 500. I am not sure precisely when LT price escalated dramatically, since I was not doing any LTs for quite a few years. Would be interesting to see the timeline of both ST and LT prices over the years.

Certainly LT is not such a bargain in the modern day, especially with girls " too hot", and I am mostly taking STs, or MP quick visits. I even found that could get a girl for ST in the evening and get her to agree to re visit again in the morning, without needing to stay the whole night. I am quite used to sleeping alone.

LT is not much available or too expensive, no matter. Collect girls phone numbers and arrange for them to make a ST visit at a non-conventional time of day.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1593083]These days you get a lot more Baht for your dollar than 15 years ago. So real cost is different to perceived cost. I reckon a bowl of soup noodles probably also doubled in 15 years and got smaller. I am guessing a bit since I generally don't eat noodles, but I have heard Thais complaining about cost of noodles and how small is the serve.

I think you will find that sex prices inflated very rapidly in the 90's and early part of the 2000's but more slowly for at least the last 10 years. 12 years ago I was paying 1 K to the girl direct in an MP for sex on top of the massage. Now the price for sex in Oily is still basically 1500, even though most places have switched to all inclusive price (girls typically get 1400 now). Gogo bar prices no doubt went up far more. 23 years ago, Cowboy standard price for LT girl was 500. I am not sure precisely when LT price escalated dramatically, since I was not doing any LTs for quite a few years. Would be interesting to see the timeline of both ST and LT prices over the years..[/QUOTE]Actually it is the opposite. 15 years ago the exchange rate to the USD was 40 plus to 1. Now it is 32 and change. Prices are also up. So when you combine the two it is quite an increase.

I found prices to be very stable till about '06.1 k ST no matter what gogo, FL joint, or where ever I was pulling from. Exceptions were Spasos and CM2, where you had to part with 2 k and street gals who were 500 baht. Since the coup in 06 things started to increase in price rapidly and after the big floods many gals just did not come back to "work" and there has been a bit of a shortage so to speak ever since.

True that oily and soapy prices have remained quite stable. They used to be poor value but now great value compared to gogos and many free lance venues.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1593111]Actually it is the opposite. 15 years ago the exchange rate to the USD was 40 plus to 1. Now it is 32 and change. Prices are also up. So when you combine the two it is quite an increase.

I found prices to be very stable till about '06.1 k ST no matter what gogo, FL joint, or where ever I was pulling from. Exceptions were Spasos and CM2, where you had to part with 2 k and street gals who were 500 baht. Since the coup in 06 things started to increase in price rapidly and after the big floods many gals just did not come back to "work" and there has been a bit of a shortage so to speak ever since.

True that oily and soapy prices have remained quite stable. They used to be poor value but now great value compared to gogos and many free lance venues.[/QUOTE]Back in 1992 B300ST / B500 LT was standard at B25/$1, but that eroded quite a bit not long after, to where it was more like B500/1,000 from many of the better lookers. Baht crash was July 1997 with lowest trough around Jan. 1998 (a few days at 54 but more likely 46). Then 1999/2000-ish suddenly all go-go girls wanted B1,000ST around that era, I believe, with some on street and Thermae's still B500. Some wanted B1500ST / B2000-2500 LT starting around 2006, as mentioned, with pricing even worse today (B2000ST from some in go-gos, maybe more).

Even though 32.3 or whatever it is isn't 25, it's still way up in constant dollar terms, thanks to both a stronger baht and price hikes in baht. As a general rule most things are twice as expensive now as in 1999 if converted to US $, with a few exceptions like hotels (still a good deal), but with the boom-boom going up even faster than inflation.

If you can get a decent performer at a place like Biergarten at B1000 it's a good thing to utilize. Have also noticed some go-gos seem to be pushing upstairs STs, though I haven't investigated pricing. Obviously they want less downtime for girls and more potential cycles, but sometimes it works out more expensively for the customer (barfine vs. Loom, vs. Barfine) and Thais aren't always good at looking at that angle. OTOH, if you take her off the mamasan could start calling (I had that happen even at 1 am On a weeknight).

With soapies I was around B900-1200 all-in if I went to one of the places near Phetchburi Rd. On foot without any taxi driver around. Last time I was at Nataree they started around 2,000 from the bowl, and 2,000-2,500 for girls sitting around. The big change seems to be that before you could assume they'd do the raft routine, whereas nowadays you have to make sure you'll get that and many girls don't do it. Maybe the newer customers are none the wiser and pick totally based on age / looks / lack of experience (pricing on sidelines would indicate that), but those who haven't gotten the full soapy course don't know what they're missing.

You've also got Korean or even Japanese influence over pricing at select places like Thermae's or Baccara, whereas before that was a Thaniya Plaza thing.

Maybe health care and college tuitions have gone up faster, but wages in the west definitely haven't.

Obvious answer for now is to try other places like Pattaya that started at lower price points and aren't up quite as badly (though are definitely up), if you can. But I'm "captive" to Bangkok for business reasons for at least 7-10 days a trip, and I'm sure others are in the same boat.

[QUOTE=Ploughman;1593120]
Even though 32.3 or whatever it is isn't 25, it's still way up in constant dollar terms, thanks to both a stronger baht and price hikes in baht. As a general rule most things are twice as expensive now as in 1999 if converted to US $, with a few exceptions like hotels (still a good deal), but with the boom-boom going up even faster than inflation.
[/QUOTE]Agree. Everything is 100% more except for hotels. 3 k used to provide a rock star lifestyle in BKK with travel to other countries at least every other month. Now that is just getting by.

[QUOTE=Ploughman;1593120]Back in 1992 B300ST / B500 LT was standard at B25/$1, but that eroded quite a bit not long after, to where it was more like B500/1,000 from many of the better lookers. Baht crash was July 1997 with lowest trough around Jan. 1998 (a few days at 54 but more likely 46). Then 1999/2000-ish suddenly all go-go girls wanted B1,000ST around that era, I believe, with some on street and Thermae's still B500. Some wanted B1500ST / B2000-2500 LT starting around 2006, as mentioned, with pricing even worse today (B2000ST from some in go-gos, maybe more).

Even though 32.3 or whatever it is isn't 25, it's still way up in constant dollar terms, thanks to both a stronger baht and price hikes in baht. As a general rule most things are twice as expensive now as in 1999 if converted to US $, with a few exceptions like hotels (still a good deal), but with the boom-boom going up even faster than inflation.
[/QUOTE]Wow, thanks for the detail. Interesting that prices may have gone up the most when the Baht crashed. I had not thought of that possibility. I probably started at Chao Praya II Soapy in the late 90's and price was probably a little higher than your super cheap ones in Petchburi. When the Baht crashed, these Soapies seemed a hell of a lot cheaper. My currency was not in sync with US dollar, so my currency still buys a hell of a lot more Baht than my early times in Thailand.

You do confirm my suspicion that the really steep price rises in go-gos may have been more in the 90's than since 2000.

2 K is a common price for ST these days, but there are plenty of girls (in the top gogos) initially asking to get 2. 5 K (negotiable), and some even going to 3 K depending on the popularity of the establishment, the "hotness" of the girl, and the types of customer the girl typically manages to get. You can imagine that Japanese customers are probably paying the highest prices in general as they are seen as wealthy.

So if for example, in Bacarra, a highly altered girl who looks like a Ladyboy (ugly plastic looking to me), may well be in sufficient demand with Japanese customers as to manage to get 3 K regularly. Once a girl manages 3 K regularly, she will not see a reason to drop to less, unless customer is known to be really easy to satisfy.

On the other hand I am still finding girls in go-gos who are not discussing the price with me, and are either too shy, or trust my judgement. I do like to take a girl without negotiation, where possible, and I do vary the payment depending on how good she was, how much time spent fucking, etc. , effort, looks etc.

In Crazy House, there has been an occasional request for me to pay full fee up front. I have not ever done that, and since they know my face, there is no problem. Its entirely possible, having paid, that a bad girl could take any opportunity to do a runner without the sex. There are a lot of casual girls not working every day. On the other hand girls have been burned by customers who fuck and then mysteriously seem to have no money. That is why MPs are largely changing to "all in" prices.

Its clear to me that Japanese form a much larger portion of the go-go customers than what we saw 15 to 20 years ago. This would have affected the price, especially in bars with a lot of Japanese. So a typical ST in Suzi Wong, Doll House and Long Gun might be 2 K, but Shark, Baccarat, and Crazy House is likely to see 2. 5 K as typical price, with Japanese customers dominating. Some girls in Crazy House that are very popular with young Japanese, don't show any interest in me, whatsoever. They would assume I will be much more difficult (want extended fuck) and pay less. Some girls are even scared of Farang size.

Its lucky for me, that the Japanese usually don't like the brown girls, leaving them wide open for me. I don't care what the skin colour is.

Its very interesting that guys have generally always seen LT price as being less than double the ST price, and yet the modern day popular bargirl is considering that LT price should be double ST price, or even more. This causes girls to seem very reluctant to take LT at all, if they believe they can get 3 STs without much difficulty.

I hope everyone remembers that is Buddhist Asaalaha day (wien thien) today (11 July). So I guess bars may not be open, and Khao Phansaa day tomorrow (definitely no alcohol allowed for the holy day), where monks go into retreat.

Hope you all have fun with MPs instead, or have the girl phone numbers. I arrive back in Bangkok to see the bargirls on Monday, just missing the holidays.