Moscow

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]The roads are still jammed with commuters going to and from work. The streets and the stores are still jammed with people spending money. It seems to me nothing has changed from last summer. Prices have not gone down, only some of the more ridiculous excesses have been eliminated: the $3 tomato at Azbuka Vkusa is now the $2 tomato. It seems prices for sex have pretty much stayed the same and in some cases even increased. In 2007 the massage parlor at Avtozavodskaya was charging 1800 руб. for a 90 minute massage with 2 girls, now a 90 minute massage with 1 girl is 2900 руб.

The only advantage we have is the exchange rate with the Dollar, and even that is evaporating. In just the last week, it went from 32 to 31.

There is no joy in Mudville, I'm afraid.[/QUOTE] Damn, I better start saving my pennies for my upcoming trip in June!!! Either that or I had better get busy on Mamba and start lining up some freebie talent.

Both Jake993 and DS are basically right.

Plus there are some other things introduced by Russian government.

Students for have a state help for studing in Moscow and were hoping to work at government institutions in Moscow, well most likely they will not see it but they can go back to their native cities and get a job at local administration there.

Government is offering relocation program which means if there's no job for you in Moscow government will find it for you outside of Moscow. At the state companies where money is pumped by the government.

Guy I know was a manager at private IT company which went down and now he's putting bolts in buses somewhere around Moscow at the state company. Many people are accepting this (old, young, females too). Just like in good old soviet times. Russian government even reconstructed more than 70 so called "workers hotels" for workers who come from different city and live in this hotels paying very small amounts.

Strav there's a crisis in Moscow do not worry. Only this is typical Russian thing not to accept it. Most people in Moscow think of crisis as "something from capitalist west, it will not hit us". Most of them forgot 1998 it seems. So people are still spending their money without problems, with typical Russian we will spend money untill we have it and when we spend it we will see what to do. No body is thinking to save money. Last year there were more than 350 building sites in Moscow, today there are less than 50 of them active. Many foreign companies are reducing their activities some even closing. Foreign banks pulled out much of their money from Moscow, and today they arew very careful and picky who will get a credit if they get it at all. Oligarch Prohorov lost 6 billion Euros in 3 days, number of millionares in Russia in March 2009 decreased by 38% compared to March 2008. Easy come easy go.

Foreigners coming to Moscow are far less then in last 2 years so there's no fresh money also. If we look at the posts from like 5-6 months ago many were hoping prices will drop in Moscow (p4p including). It seems there's nothing out of it. Most probably it will be the thinking: there are less customers so we will work less but to keep the same money in our pockets we will increase the prices. As Strav reports with massage parlor.

Most probably this summer in Moscow will not be cheap but in StP it will be even higher becuase of those Scandinavian tourists there.

[size=-2][b][u]EDITOR'S NOTE[/u]:[/b] [blue]I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please [url=http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?]Click Here[/url] for more information.[/blue][/size]

[QUOTE=Jake993]....
Anyone?[/QUOTE]

Yes Jake993.... tochka ! ;)

Joking aside, in my 3 days in Moscow, 3 times at Hot dog and I did not pick, or not so that beautiful or too high price, so I went to tochka and I was not disappointed.

Even in 2004, when Hot dog was Chesterfield, and much better, I took tochka 6 times in 10 days, it is all night long and most of times much more friendly than hardcore pro and if you pay a price close to what you end to pay at Hot Dog, you get real a young, fresh, no drug addict girl and what was funny in october 08 that I was the only foreigner between russian men hunting tochka and yes, the fun to search the right one, is something you will never get in Hot Dog, something that it will worth to do it and something I still miss LOL

The only "bad" thing is tochka does not dress nice and expensive clothes as the girls in HD or NF, she does not impress you at firsth sight, but once she is naked, for the fact is most of times about 20yo, she is much better looking than half of old chickens of clubs :)

[QUOTE=Lukasek] .........once she is naked, for the fact is most of times about 20yo, she is much better looking than half of old chickens of clubs :)[/QUOTE] Lukasek,
That's probably good advice. I have only done Tochka once but you are right, it was lots of fun. And yes, she was about 20 y.o. and fresh off the train from Krasnoyarsk. In fact, I went to give her a little DATY and she thought I was some sort of pervert. She did enjoy it once she got over the initial shock..... but that's another story.

Maybe it's time to make a return trip to the Tochka. I have a Muscovite friend that has what appears to be a broken down Zhiguli. In fact, while it looks like a piece of shit, it runs like a sports car. He's always offering to take me to the Tochka with him acting as taxi driver. Time to take him up on the offer....

Jake993,

please... do it second and third time tochka... for you and for us too lol

Specially if you have even a driver offered you a tour to tochka, it is unbelievable great offer, you really cannot deny !

And if somebody here thinks tochka is only good way to get great sex... keep on reading....

Take a while now please and let's go back in 2004, my first time to Russia, alone as a dog in Moscow, I got the lucky to meet Guido88 at Hungry Duck (great club in that period.....) that read from Ca_T or from Doc Skank here about tochka.......my little vocabolary did not have this word, so what could it really means ?

It was january and -16C.,I was so afraid to go out of Hungry Duck and take the first ordinary car,( Guido88 let it to me to say with my basic russian if the driver knows tochka LOL ) afraid cause it was something totally strange and new to go with normal car in the middle of night looking for....an old woman at some cross road with a red star on her hat.... snow everywhere, the city looked so dark, in some part far from center Moscow is so ugly and dark you cannot imagine, if you never been there....

Afraid when the driver stopped the car and got from the woman the instructions hot to get where tochka was, another couple of streets smaller and smaller and smaller between suburbs in Moscow to end inside a small parking where I was sure they could easily kidnapp both us and Guido88 is a big guy lol but... there was 3 sort of minibus or very little camion with black windows..... another old woman smiling to us and writing on piece of paper 50, 100, 200 ($) and once you choose one number and showed her with your finger, she screamed out loud in that dark night at the parking the number and suddendly all the girls of that range of prices got out of the cars and in front of us opened their coats showing us their lingierie....at -16C.....

Suddenly you lost the fear and the biggest problem is to choose one girl between many nice girls all smiling to you cause they saw you are foreigner and they know very well how usually a foreigner is gonna to behave with them....

Yes, dear Jake993 in some way you really need a truly spirit of adventure to do all that long and complicated process that take you to get a truly gem from provincies without the need to go till Jet Club ;) ;) ;)

But once you avoid the security at your hotel or once you bribe him, if you not have a flat, you end to be in your bedroom with somebody speaks only russian, that she is more afraid than you and that you have to pay attention to behave with her good, but not too good, or she really can fall in love with you, cause, I saw it very well, they never had the lucky to meet a man polite during their so hard work as tochka. ( Doc Skank wrote a great report about it... )

Another great thing is when you not jump on her once you close the door, but when you open vodka and start to have conversation with her, in 2004 with vocabolary, without last time, you get really to know a story of ordinary special girl so brave, most of times sad story about her life, you discover the person that almost not decide to became a pro, she just had to do it, cause she born where, thousands km so far from Moscow, there is the fucking nothing, the kind of pro will never think to spend the hard money she earns to buy.....Iphone....

You really cannot compare as Person, tochka VS pro at Hot Dog or NF...

You really enjoy that slowly way to communicate and you end to get drunk with her and most of all, drunk for her, you could also feel so sorry listening her life, that you almost forget you buy her body to have sex with, but when after a couple of hours, you realize it is only midnight and you have a lot of time till morning.... you can decide to be "crazy" for the second time in the same night and to invite her out for a late dinner AS IF she was a normal girl.... and you become closer and closer to her sooo quickly, you start to appreciate how sweet her heart truly is and more than the need to fuck her, you desire....to kiss her.... after couple of hours like this, she feel wonderful with you, cause you are the strange foreigner searching on the vocabulary one more word and speaking her native russian with such a funny sound makes her smile all the times and you love so much the way now so far from the place you picked her up she smiles and you are the one was interested to listen her life and indeed it helps so much to her, to open up a little and to join with you her unlucky life, you maybe will see her to smile for the first time after you try to joke in russian and her eyes....shine as well and still no sex....

You go back to your flat or hotel and you still have 5-6 hours to spent with her and at this time, you can even decide to not have sex with her, no matter, she feels in need to give the best GFE you ever had, cause you... just listened her !

Think.....after making love with her, to have her holding you and falling asleep as a child.... you will thank Russia to exist, you will thank yourself you decided to go through the long process to get visa, book flight and get inside Russia, thank yourself to try tochka and you will wish her from the deep of your heart, real and truly good luck, cause she indeed deserves it all !

When at the morning she leaves, you wish to have in future one life just to spend with her, cause she gave you in one night much more than your ex-wife or girlfriend in....YEARS, you hold her one more never ending time, you-I....I went out in the white streets, I start to smoke my cigarette looking for where to have breakfast getting frozen cause mabye was even colder the day before and maybe for the first time as monger feeling so, so great, cause for some hours you gave to a totally uknown girl the feeling to be loved and appreciated as human being, something we ALL sooner or later need and something maybe she never tried before and mabye she will never have the lucky to live again....

Jake993.... try tochka please or I come to Moscow and we will try it together Stravinsky and the "fault" of such a great adventure will be, I know....only mine ;)

P.S. Second option.... let's go all three to 4x4 together, it worth it too but you already know it ;)

Nice story Lukasek.

But please don't get so emotional. In Russia every tochka/pro/freebie have some sad story about her life and she's doing what she's doing because of her hard life. I just don't buy that crap. Those tochkas are doing that mostly for the money of course. They come to Moscow for any reason see the big city with bright lights and want everything what it offers. But it costs money.

For fresh tochkas the best time is September. Many of them come to Moscow in September to start their university and you can be shure some (bigger or smaller) part of them will become tochkas. Many of them are already tochkas in their home town. Once I was riding the train from Ekaterinburg to Moscow and in my car there were 5 girls going to Moscow to start their university, they were all 19 years old. And they were openly talking how they will start their tochka careers as soon as they arrive in Moscow. They alredy contacted another girl from Ekaterinburg who was in Moscow for one year and was a tochka of course and she will show them how to get money "in the suburbs". And they were talking how they will spend their money on Gucci this, Prada that, this shopping center, this night club, etc. I was sure they already have tochka experiance from Ekaterinburg, on the road to Tyumen. Who knows maybe they started when they were 14.

For a typical Russian tochka is w***e and nothing else and she will be treated like one. Russian police is pushing tochkas further and further away and even now there are reports of how gang of tochkas robbed some russian guy but he's afraid to report to police becuase his wife will hear about it.

These last posts represent my same questions when I came for the first time in Moscow about one month ago: where is crisis in Moscow? where are the high percentage of beautiful girls in Moscow?

I visited dozens of salons and I found just one 10+++ girl but an outrageous fraud. I discovered just one nice place called Aurora club. I hadn't time to try tochkas and discos. I didn't see a good scene about salons, at all. I fucked my waitress and started a relation with a barwoman.

About Lukasek's experience in 2004, he was lucky to be at that time, I am sure Russian people are very different now.

From 1998 (first Russian/global economic crisis) to now, the world has changed completely and not in better, and I don't see anything good in our future.

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]
From 1998 (first Russian/global economic crisis) to now, the world has changed completely and not in better, and I don't see anything good in our future.[/QUOTE] Aco,
Clearly you do not paint a rosy picture. And maybe you are right. But as Dr. Skank point out, the game has changed and if we want to have fun with it we too must change tactics. And that's a shame because I really liked going to HD and NF to scope out the babes, interview carefully and make a selection. But today? I think not. Those days are over. Pizdyets was good enough to introduce me to a salon a while back and that was a much better use of funds.

Unlike a lot of the girls in the underdeveloped world, Moskvitchkas are very technologically sophisticated. The Internet is here and if you are a smoking hot girl looking to make money fucking some guy are you going to hang around in a crappy bar, spend your hard earned money and compete with 50 other girls looking to do the same thing? Or are you going to use the Internet to get business to come to you? And if you speak and type some English? forget about it - the Internet is the way to go.

Spend a little time on Mamba and you can recognize the signs very quickly. I will stick my neck out and say that 30% - 40% of the girls between 19 - 28 on Mamba are working the site for business. The shorter the bio - the more likely they are to be working. Direct correlation.

Having said that, as the good Doctor and others will attest to, there is plenty of semi pro and amateur action to be had in the clubs and bars. True, it does not have the "sure thing" aspect of an HD or NF, but it's there none-the-less.

If you compare Moscow today to the 90's, you are seeing a very different place socioeconomically. Respectability is back vogue, social standing is important again and hanging out in a bar turning tricks is not cool. But Gucci shoes and Prada bags are expensive and sponsorship is possible if you play the game right. Sure there are plenty of Provincalkas coming to town for school or the bright lights, but they too catch on that the scene has changed and even they can hook up with a sponsor. Even if it's for only a few hundred $$ a month for a date every other week.

Check out Explorer69's post in the Saint Petersburg section. I think it's a good illustration of where we are today.

Prostitution is an interesting study in itself. In a stable society, it occupies a predictable place in the social strata and carries certain social stigmas that tend to relegate it to the dark alleys and the seedy bars. Oh, yes, don't let me forget about the personal ads and the massage parlors. Even in authoritarian regimes, (as any USSR comrade would have told you) it has a place but people just don't talk openly about it.

But in transitional society, it comes out into the open. Not just for foreigners but for anyone with money. People looking to make money from people who have it. Read enough history and you will see that right after any major war, pestilence, or natural disaster the bartering for the most basic human needs begins.

I think we are seeing the very end of a phase in Moscow (The provinces of course are another matter). Crisis or no crisis, Moscow society has developed to the point where people have options and don't really need to change their lifestyles that drastically. On my first trip to Moscow in 2005, my host told me that a recent TV poll of 15 year old school kids showed that most girls wanted to be high class prostitutes and boys wanted to be gangsters. I think the same poll today would yield a dramatically different result.

So if you want to get the really hot chicks and you have some "game" (not to mention time and money) there's plenty of action to be had. Otherwise, look to the Internet my friend, look to the Internet.

[QUOTE=Jake993]Unlike a lot of the girls in the underdeveloped world, Moskvitchkas are very technologically sophisticated. The Internet is here and if you are a smoking hot girl looking to make money fucking some guy are you going to hang around in a crappy bar, spend your hard earned money and compete with 50 other girls looking to do the same thing? Or are you going to use the Internet to get business to come to you? And if you speak and type some English? forget about it - the Internet is the way to go.

Spend a little time on Mamba and you can recognize the signs very quickly. I will stick my neck out and say that 30% - 40% of the girls between 19 - 28 on Mamba are working the site for business. The shorter the bio - the more likely they are to be working. Direct correlation.

.......................................................................................................

Check out Explorer69's post in the Saint Petersburg section. I think it's a good illustration of where we are today.

.......................................................................................................

So if you want to get the really hot chicks and you have some "game" (not to mention time and money) there's plenty of action to be had. Otherwise, look to the Internet my friend, look to the Internet.[/QUOTE]

I perfectly agree, I was amazed by the number of girls open for sponsorship. And I am limited to the English speaking girls! Surprisingly many girls have computer at home. I will for the future use the internet option as the main source. But you will loose some on the way, when you get there some will not answer the phone etc.

Kurenda, I understand well your point, but I like sometime with the right one to be emotional and romantic, I saw it worth if you choose the good one.

Actually I am much less emotional but 5 years ago, specially during the first time to motherland, was hard to stay cold, I know you understand me :)

Jake993,

You seem to be a new in Moscow coming for the first time in 2005. When talking to people in Moscow they all agree the wildest time in Moscow were in the early '90-ies under Yeltsin and today things are more or less normal. Moscow is no different from any other mageapolis in the world. Everything is the same there are some differences due to local people, mentality, etc. Prostitution didn't came to Moscow with fall of the SSSR it was present there much much before. With the fall of SSSR it only came into open sight, from Moscow subburbs it came down town. I was livinig in Moscow in the early '80-ies and sex for money was very available. From local soviet women to woman from "distant but frendly countries" as they were called. Meaning girls from Africa, Vietnam, North Korea you name it. It was enough to make a trip to International friendship university "Patris Lumumba" and make your pick. This was then and it's the same today. Only in soviet times no body were talking aboutb prostitutes, junkies and drunkards. They were called "people with socially unacceptable behaviour". In 1932 comrade Stalin simply said: "We can not count on 30% of soviet citizens not because they don't like our SSSR and our soviet system. But because they are criminals, easy women, drunkards, etc. They are on the bottom and they should stay there and we must not do anything to help them coming from the bottom". Many people took this for granted. In Russia today people don't care about prostitues, junkies, criminals, drunkards they just let them end their life cycle. Opposit to the west where there are those counceling for the prostitutes (too bring them back to the right track), for the junkies and drunkards (too keep them clean), for criminals in prisons (to make them reform), etc. In Russia it's simple. If a child leave a home a became a prostitute or a junkie the parents in most cases simply forgot about it. In Russian prisons 90% of inmates are never visited by their families and not even receiving letters. It's just like that. In Moscow it's just a endless circle. If we talk about girls who offer sexula service for exchange of any kind (no matter they are pros/freebies/looking for sponsor) there will be those who will do it for some time, then they will stop it because they want a marriage/family/whatever and on their place will come some other. Prostitution is simple thing in Moscow as well as any other place. As long as there are those who want to pay for sex there will be those who will sell sex. As long as there are those who sell sex there will be those who will pay for sex. After all it's a historical category existing almost the same time as human kind exist and it will not go away. The poll Jake mantioned well most probably there will be young girl who will think the same because they think high class prostitutes do nothing and have big money. They see on their TV a high class prostitute who was on Dom 2 reality show and she became celebrity talking about her high class prostitute life. But when they see that same high class prostitute being brutally murdered they most probalby change their opinion.

It's the same everywhere, recently I watched a poll in UK where great majority of girls in high schools who wante to be a "celebrity" no matter of what kind and they will do anything to become one.

In Russian provinces situation is different. I've been to about 80 Russian towns and when compared to Moscow sompe places are the same, some are worse and some are better. In provinces there are two types of people. Those who are enchanted by Moscow and can't wait to move there for any reson they can think of and those who despise Moscow and never went there and they will not let their children go there. In anyway Moscow is (and will be probably) good destination under condition you have enough money and time. But this is the same with most other destinations exept your home town.

For Lukases and all others interesting in tochkas I highly reccomed Russian movie from 2006 called "Tochka". Directed by Yuri Moroz based on the novel by Grigory Ryazhsky. This novelist was interwieving more than 300 tochaks in Moscow over some period of time and everything he heard became the part of the book so movie is very realistic. Everybody in Russia know about tochkas but many charachterized this movie as "shocking". As the under title of the movie says "Tochkas. They are worse than you thought". The movie will show you how tochaks think and operate even gives tips where and how to find tochaks and how to negotiate your price. Also it gives a dark side of tochkas, how they become one and how they are treated by their customers and police. If you can see this movie do so. Here's the poster of the movie.

Thanks Kurenda, I am actually downloading Tochka from emule, but it is a pity, it seems it exists only in russian...we will see what I will understand and then I will report...

Your knowledge of Russia is amazing...

I agree about all considerations (these are similar to my posts).

Just an important addition.

I went very in-deep in hardcore prostitutes' mindset. The main problem is that hardcore prostitutes DON'T want ordinary life with ordinary people: this is a problem for us, ordinary people, and not for hardcore prostitutes. They met dozens of good and wealthy and young men whom to live with, but they prefer to be objects of thousands and thousands of men.

At last, Stalin said the truth about the feature of his people. Yes, "Tochkas. They are worse than you thought"!

[QUOTE=Kurenda]For Lukases and all others interesting in tochkas I highly reccomed Russian movie from 2006 called "Tochka". Directed by Yuri Moroz based on the novel by Grigory Ryazhsky. This novelist was interwieving more than 300 tochaks in Moscow over some period of time and everything he heard became the part of the book so movie is very realistic. Everybody in Russia know about tochkas but many charachterized this movie as "shocking". As the under title of the movie says "Tochkas. They are worse than you thought". The movie will show you how tochaks think and operate even gives tips where and how to find tochaks and how to negotiate your price. Also it gives a dark side of tochkas, how they become one and how they are treated by their customers and police. If you can see this movie do so. Here's the poster of the movie.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Kurenda]Jake993,

You seem to be a new in Moscow coming for the first time in 2005. When talking to people in Moscow they all agree the wildest time in Moscow were in the early '90-ies under Yeltsin and today things are more or less normal. [/QUOTE] Kurenda,
You are correct, before my first visit in 2005 I was completely ignorant of Moscow and the rest of Russia for that matter. I nearly got transferred to Moscow in 1992 but instead ended up in Rio de Janeiro. Hmmm - I can't say really which would have been better.

In any case, I really do appreciate your insight on prostitution in general during Soviet times. No one seem to want to talk about it but based on your comments, it does sound like it was pretty much like any other megalopolis. In particular, your point about migration from the suburbs to downtown explains some of the comments I have heard from people in Moscow. It now makes more sense to me.

That's why I like these forums, there's always someone who knows more about a particular topic than I do.

Thanks for taking the time to write such a detailed explanation.

Jake

PS - I will try to find this film!!!!!!

[QUOTE=Kurenda]

In Russian provinces situation is different.

I've been to about 80 Russian towns and when compared to Moscow some places are the same, some are worse and some are better.

[/QUOTE]

And please don't leave out your reasons for why you think so.

(This should NOT include Sankt Pitr)