Tallinn

OK, went to Tallinn for a long weekend, within 20 minutes I remembered why I love this town. Even if you take out the mongering aspect, it's still a lovely town and there's still lots of beautiful girls just walking around.

3 negatives:

Last year when I was in the Old Town, it still felt pretty undiscovered. This year it's heaving with tourists, far more than last year, the EU accession must really have made a difference. I saw what many of us from the UK try to avoid, the standard drunken English louts who get hammered, stick to themselves and go to bars where they expect everyone to speak English so fluently that they understand regional accents that even people from London have problems understanding. Also lots of "Marthas and Hanks" from Midwest USA, "Oh my God, isn't that so PRETTY!" Plus busloads of Japanese tourists. And of course the American college kids "doing Europe" who look like they escaped from a Limp Bizkit concert!

So thankfully I hardly spent any time in the Old Town, because I hooked up with another member, Maximus, who knows the country like the back of his hand. If it hadn't been for him I think I would have been quite lost, so cheers Max. He and a group of us mongers hit other bars, restaurants, even made a day trip to Parnu where I had a picture taken with a group of foxy Russian girls on a bachelorette party who made any English hen party look absolutely drab in comparison. Being Russian they of course demanded money to take a photo with them :)! LOVE this country! I may post the photo since it's a harmless non-sexual one, not sure what the guidelines are on this.

OK negative 2. Part of the fun on my previous 2 pre-EU visits was that I was able to visit a variety of houses and chill and have a good time. Unfortunately the government is cracking down, and there was only one which I visited while I was there. Fortunately Max is on hand and knows a few houses, and he also has contacts available who work freelance. I appreciate his efforts and say to any mongers, even with the houses out of commission, you can still find girls and places, but I'd suggest you get in touch with someone like Max who knows the town.

Negative 3. Joining the EU seems to have tightened visa controls, because all the girls in the house were Estonian Russians, generally from smaller towns. Unlike the Russian girls last year who had come over from St Petersburg or wherever and were out to make as much money as possible while they were there, and were willing to be more flexible (I got BBBJ's and CIM) the local girls, while still looking to make money, are not quite as - I don't like to use this word but...desperate. Still 3 nights of good experience, but to this day the best experiences I had were with visiting Russian girls last year. But then you would have had to experience Tallinn in previous years to notice the difference. If you haven't gone, you still find an amazing variety of lovely 18-22 year old girls working in these places.

One positive, I didn't think costs in the houses had gone up. €100 last year per hour, €100 this year. Of course there are probably still "privates" like Pronski in operation where you can get it for €35 but I guess you'd have to look for them. I went once last year and while the service was okay, it was pretty standard, you got what you paid for.

Most of the well-known houses will close September 1st so if you are thinking of going, you have a month to take full advantage!

Don't know about picking up non-pros, still have the impression you have to be there for a while and you've got to seem sincere. I'm of Indian origin and while I got some looks last year, this year there were so many minorities from UK, France Germany that I was no longer so exotic :-( Funnily enough I did get checked out and smiled at invitingly by a couple of girls in the street but unfortunately they were in the 14-15 year range which is a little too young for my liking!

There you have it folks, how a country has changed since my report of a visit 11 months ago. Still a fantastic, clean and safe place, but probably far more enjoyable if you can meet up with a local contact and avoid tourist traps.

art68 - where did you hear that the houses are closing on sept 1? can any other punters verify this, max?

tiger

Guys,

yes, it is true, houses will be closed as we know them now. Probably owners will set up similiar places but they will be membership based or at least driver have to talk you in. This might also mean increase to the prices.

Seems it will be even more important to know people in near future- public and open offer will come to minimum - working girls itself will not disappear.

Current brothels will be closed. The action is taken against pimps. Apartments shared by girls will continue and as there is nothing to stop people renting a room for short periods, my guess is that the existing places will close and reopen on the basis that the punter pays to rent a room from the managment and selects a gril to whom he pays a fee.

In appearance at least there is no pimpage and the system carries on.

Was talking with a girl about this matter earlier today. Also, expect to see an expansion in sites such as Secretary Academy (sihiteeriopisto.fi) I have probably not got the name right, can a Finnish guy correct me? Thanks.

My guess is that prices will be a bit up and down to start with, but will generally end up higher. Perhaps not a bad thing, some of the girls do not exactly earn a fortune for shagging us ugly, drunken buggers!

DB,

"some of the girls do not exactly earn a fortune for shagging us ugly, drunken buggers!"

I resent your description of us above.

I ALWAYS tip well! :)

Right address is www.sihteeriopisto.net. Starting from August escort advertisement has been illegal in Finland (publishing contact information of working girls is considered pimping) so they have closed big parts of the site for time being.

Art68
I have noticed the same as you. Tallinn is being destroyed. Last year - and the year before - was fantastic. This year everything has changed (i've been there tree times this summer).
My girlfriends (and girls i meet when i'm going out) are constantly talking in anger about the "touristmen who are coming to Tallinn just to get laid and then go home".
They are also beginning to notice the same thing that girls in the west have noticed in many years: how sleasy and dirty the minority-boys from Uk, Germany, etc are. Not to mention what they say about the Italians! No wonder that you received less smiles this year, even if you where behaving nice.

I will avoid Tallinn from now on. I know exactly where to go next time to get that "Tallinn-feeling" again. And thats not in Estonia. Tallinn are destroyed. And now the houses are closing down. It cant be worse.
I love Tallinn, but my advice to fellow mongers: choose other cities.

Well, that was a bit of a surprise to the girls... I just spoke with a girl who advertises with them. She said to me that she now understood why her phone had stopped ringing the last few days.

According to the info, they are selling the site. My guess is moving the server to Estonia or Russia more like...

The tourism thing is getting a bit silly, I agree, but not in quite the way that others suggest. What has actually happened is that the market is meeting demand, so now when I go out, it is bloody hard to tell the civilians from professionals, especially when they do not let on for some time. Also, the places to go are now having to change. Frankly, neither I nor other residents are over chuffed when girls are continually approached by Italians, Germans and to a degree Britons. At least the Britons have some money, want to spend it and there are relatively few of them. Other travellers often seem to be members of the 'travelling poor'. So now, we seek new places and leave the old haunts to tourists. I expect that dress codes will start to make an appearance and a few more members clubs. I find myself looking forward to the winter months once more.

HRCHRISTER: I didn't say I got less or more smiles this year, I just said that nobody even looked at me twice this year because now they are so used to seeing different people. This means that whereas before you would get checked out because you were unique, and maybe you could start a conversation from that, now you can't. (People would come up to me last summer and start conversations, now they didn't). I also wouldn't say it's necessarily that you're in a minority they think you're dirty or sleazy, but unfortunately they can tell automatically that you are not from there, therefore chances are you are a tourist, and as a male tourist on his own, they probably automatically assume you're a sex tourist... so you must be dirty and sleazy just like all the other tourists! The only difference really is that they can identify you as a tourist a lot faster! Probably also true of people from mediterranean countries like Spain or Italy or Portugal who often don't look like the average Estonian.

But I never got that feeling anyway, people were always nice. Then again, I made it a point to learn some basic estonian phrases the first time I went and I always try and say "hello" and "please" in estonian, it's amazing how far that takes you (unlike, say, France).

DUSTY BIN: From what I saw in the expat bars this year, I can only imagine how pissed off resident foreigners are now that the "floods" are coming in. I don't even live there and I was pissed off! The first time I went, I basically went out with some Brits and Irish people from the consulates there and in St Petersburg. This year, even though there were tons of Brits I stayed as far away as possible. The only good thing about the Brits is that yes, they do seem to want to spend their money, and also, as drunk as they get, there's still some sort of repression thing happening, they won't as blatantly approach girls for paid sex - I don't think they've really gained this reputation in a lot of countries.

But the good news about Estonia is that really, outside the old town and centre, most tourists don't seem to want to venture (ok the Finns, but they have a longer history with Estonia and they have a language advantage). I think this means there are still lots of places in Estonia to see and adventure in. Just trying to work out my finances to see how I could spend a year there!

Art68. mmmh...i would be a little bit careful living other places than Tallinn in Estonia if your not nordic looking. In the west part you got Pärnu, where it is a lot of rasism against all foreigners. I have been there a lot, and i can't count how many times local men has made trouble just because i have lot of girlfriends there (i'm kinda big, so they just send me ugly sights and comments, but i have seen other tourist been beaten the hell of).
And in the eastern part, like Tartu and other cities, you got skinheads, and a lot of skeptism towards minorities. This is in general. Use you money in other countries.

HRCHRISTER,

I appreciate what you are saying, but I wouldn't think of living anywhere but Tallinn just purely because I think most of the jobs (for non-Estonians) are in Tallinn. But Parnu seemed a nice place to visit. Anyway, there's a lot of towns in the UK I wouldn't choose to live either (and I'm sure there are towns in Eastern Germany I would not choose to live either). Local arseholes are local arseholes anywhere.

I'm sure there are problems like what you are describing but I do not believe it is anywhere near as say Russia.

Yes,

Their skinheads hate germans and mostly Swedish and Finish guys. I have seen Swedish and Finish guys beeing badly beaten of Skinheads. They dont like Nordic people because they come and take their women. Its better if you look like indian, black or russian or english look, but not Scandinavian or worse look like germs. But dont worry, in tallin even Swedish and other nordic people have no problem if they are not alone at nights and alone in Discos.

Compare with other cities in Baltic girls at least talk english, and its more secure place. just avoid other cities in baltic coutries. In wintertime Thallin will be better but still never be as it was in 1990-1995. Forget it guys! Other bigger cities in baltic are even worse. If you want experience Estonia as it was 10 years ago, go to belurussia, or Russia. Its little truble with visa but its worse it.

'Their skinheads hate germans and mostly Swedish and Finish guys. I have seen Swedish and Finish guys beeing badly beaten of Skinheads. They dont like Nordic people because they come and take their women. Its better if you look like indian, black or russian or english look, but not Scandinavian or worse look like germs.'

Milky Boy,

With all due respect, I kindly disagree with you on the racial hatred. Probably their skinheads don't like Swedes, Finns or Germans but local Estonian people are genetically close to them. Basically they don't like people of black (black dick is sth different for the local women), Asian, Arab or maybe Hispanic looks. Its a pure biological thing and its got nothing to do with alien culture. Although I have never been to Estonia, I do believe what you have experienced is very unusual. posting the words 'Its better if you look.' is somewhat misleading for the nonwhite participants on the forum. I lived in the Scandinavia for more than 7 yrs and I do know whats on their minds. Skinheads are virtually the same all over East Europe and there is no reason for skinheads in Estonia to do sth radical against white while their conterparts in Russia do the minorities.

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Somebody is talking out of his bum...

For some reason that I do not know, a poster is writing inaccurate stuff about skinheads, violence and discrimination.

I live here.

I do not see skinheads, but I am not blind.

Among some groups it is fashionable to have very cropped hair. Some of these guys belong to 'sporting clubs' and some of these groups are racist.

But, they are not skinheads in the sense that a Briton or German might recognise. Nor is there any great degree of street crime or violence, other than the normal puppy fights between drunk teenagers that provide more amusement and spectacle for both locals and tourists than threat to anyone.

It is true that if you get drunk enough that you can not control yourself, or that you make yourself a victim, then you may, just as anywhere else, find yourself in unpleasant circumstances, but then the same would apply in any city in any part of the world.

BTW, I do not live in an expat ghetto, I live in a working class suburb, I am safe from harm, even though I am the only foreigner living within a kilometer in any direction.

While it is true that the recent influx of European travellers has changed the character of the city's social scene (for the worse -IMHO) the place is friendly and fun.

BTW - notes to Italian guys!
1) Not all women in clubs are prostitutes! Most are not!
2) Spend some money guys, this is a relatively poor country, but you guys make it look like you are coming from a third world nation.
3) Please do a reality check--- when you are hitting on a woman why make the women laugh at you by trying to pull a woman old enough to be your mother?
4) In Europe, men commonly use an item of male grooming called a razor. They can be bought in many shops and kiosks, try using one sometimes!
5) Stay in an hotel, not a hostel. That one letter makes a lot of difference between being a member of the travelling poor and being a respectable traveller!

These notes bought to you by a guy who was out clubbing last night and saw Italians getting a giggle from women at every turn. The tarts will take your money (while laughing), the rest were just laughing!