Pattaya Reports

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2969915]That law firm link references The Prevention and Supression of Prostitution Act and "summarizes" it as in your quote. But, aside from the question of whether or not that Act is enforceable, we have seen the actual wording of the Act here and it does not specifically state what that law firm grandly announces that it states.

I can see that the 1996 Act was hoping to "Prevent" and "Supress" prostitution by largely re-stating an array of qualifiers that have been present in the Thai Penal Code for years and years. However, despite that law firm's claim, it does nothing to affirm or confirm that the act of exchanging sex for money among consenting adults without all those qualifiers present is "illegal" or "a crime".

I give them a dubious credit for trying though.[/QUOTE]Below is a specific quote from the very website stating that prostitution is illegal.

"The Penal Code, while not explicitly labeling prostitution as illegal, does penalize those profiting from a prostitute's earnings."

Here they say prostituion is not illegal.

[QUOTE=Explorer8939;2969924]Bottom line: there is virtually zero chance of a monger being arrested for prostitution in Thailand. Or a lady.[/QUOTE]If that changes, the entire tourist economy also changes. My typical trip to Thailand probably costs about $16,000 for 6 weeks. Perhaps $4,000 on P4P plus $12,000 on hotels, food, taxi, tours, airlines, 7-11, mall purchases, etc. I'm sure Thai government realizes that P4P draws a lot of international tourists, but most money is spent in more traditional hospitality businesses. I expect hassle free P4P to continue for years to come.

[QUOTE=PassionSR;2969941]So no.

Nothing you cited specifically says that or implies it at all. There's pages worth of debunking exactly what you just said that supposedly ties prositution itself to being illegal. Just because pimping, trafficking and public disorder through indecency is illegal, does not mean prositution is illegal.[/QUOTE]I disagree, and multiple sources disagree with you.

"Prostitution is illegal in Thailand, but the laws are ambiguous and often unenforced. As a result, red-light districts, massage parlors, go-go bars, and sex-focused karaoke bars are common sights. Sex work in Thailand is a significant economic incentive for many citizens, especially rural, unskilled women with financial burdens. ".
[URL]https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/countries-where-prostitution-is-legal[/URL]

Someone asked for sources and I provided multiple sources.

Four Africans held for prostitution in Phuket.
[url]https://www.bangkokpost.com/thailand/general/2902227/four-africans-held-for-prostitution-in-phuket[/url]
[QUOTE=Houston Player;2969960]Here they say prostituion is not illegal.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=EihTooms;2969915]I give them a dubious credit for trying though.[/QUOTE]
Ask the Africans in phuket who got arrested for it.

[url]https://www.bangkokpost.com/thailand/general/2902227/four-africans-held-for-prostitution-in-phuket[/url]
[QUOTE=Explorer8939;2969924]Bottom line: there is virtually zero chance of a monger being arrested for prostitution in Thailand. Or a lady.[/QUOTE]
See link above. Are the thai police going to bust down your door? No. Can they arbitrarily decide to arrest some street workers if someone files a complaint? Yes. If they can arrest Africans in Phuket for prostitution, they can do it for anyone else. How many Africans are on beach road right now standing right in front of the police station? Plenty.

[QUOTE=Rocko20;2970008]

Someone asked for sources and I provided multiple sources.
[/QUOTE]Good sources in a discussion about whether something is illegal aren't newspaper articles about arrests. You have no idea what they were actually arrested for, or whether the people authorizing the arrest know the law.

And you don't know whether the reporters or editors know the law.

Other sources that shouldn't be referenced are poorly written law firm summaries, like the one from Siam Legal.

Provide citations. A citation is "a quotation from or reference to a book, paper, or author, especially in a scholarly work. ".

Better yet, quote the law itself.

Quoting newspaper articles to support an argument about whether something is illegal is like quoting a forum post to support a point about best STD prevention practices.

[QUOTE=PhilipMarlow;2970019]Good sources in a discussion about whether something is illegal aren't newspaper articles about arrests. [/QUOTE]Then you should've read the actual law that led to the arrests (1996 Prevention and Suppression of Prostitution Act). If prostitution was legal in Thailand, prostitutes would have legal status like in Germany and the Netherlands.

The plan to decriminalize prostitution in Thailand has not been passed. Which is why Africans in Phuket still get arrested for it in 2024.

"Technically, the sex they sell is illegal, but a new government-led plan aims to change that. It calls for repealing the 1996 Prevention and Suppression of Prostitution Act, which makes most sex work a crime, and replacing it with a new law, the Protection of Sex Work Act, affirming the rights of sex workers and their places of business to sell sex. ".
[URL]https://www.voanews.com/a/thailand-drafts-bill-to-decriminalize-its-billion-dollar-sex-trade/7040409.html[/URL]

If you don't like facts and real world examples of arrests, simply call the local Thai police and ask them if prostitution is legal.

Another thai source for those looking for more sources, straight from a veteran Thai sex worker:

"She pointed out that owners of venues where sex is traded must themselves pay officials under the table, as prostitution remains illegal in Thailand. ".

"And since prostitution is illegal, venues providing sexual services are not registered and therefore not subject to regulations on hygiene and safety. ".

[URL]https://world.thaipbs.or.th/detail/thailands-exploited-vulnerable-sex-workers-could-soon-be-protected-by-law/48316[/URL]

I've proven my stance with multiple sources and I'm not discussing it anymore. Anyone is free to do their own research.

It is funny, start a needless conversation then say I said my piece I don't want to o talk about it anymore.

Personally it never should have started legal or illegal.

None of these so call research have anything to o do with reality here there is like less than a 1 % chance this applies to anyone who comes to playland if it does don't come. To end I don't want to talk about it anymore LOL.

[QUOTE=HoustonPlayer;2969960]Below is a specific quote from the very website stating that prostitution is illegal.

"The Penal Code, while not explicitly labeling prostitution as illegal, does penalize those profiting from a prostitute's earnings. ".

Here they say prostituion is not illegal.[/QUOTE]There are some who are so adamant about wanting it to be illegal they so far have only been posting links that literally tell us it is NOT illegal and asserting that as more proof that it is illegal. Weird.

And not just that law firm's link but the Thai Penal Code link and whatever we have seen so far from the nice try but unenforceable The Prosititution Prevention and Supression Act, where they have had since 1996 to reword it and move into the Thai Penal Code as a clear statement about prostitution being illegal but haven't.

None of it states the simple, clear and unambiguous words all of us know could be stated to make the basic act of exchanging sex for money or money for sex among consenting adults illegal.

Also, what's with all these reports about foreigners from Africa getting busted for advertising sexual services on publicly viewable social networks or online, clearly stated as illegal in the Thai Penal Code, and where it is obvious their visa issues are at play?

Notice there is so far no mention of any of their customers being busted for anything. Presumably because their visa status is fine and unquestionable. But most certainly because their customers have not committed a crime that can be cited anywhere in the Thai Penal Code and charged!

And, after all, isn't that the issue at hand for any of us on this website? Is this discussion about our worry that African Thai visa holders might get hassled for whatever tangential infractions the police want to conjure up or is it about whether or not there is an actual law that puts us, the customers, at risk of any criminal infraction and penalty?

Have any of these reports about Africans getting busted for anything included a mention of any of their prostitution service customers being hassled, arrested or charged with a crime? So far I have not seen it. Nor have I ever met someone who was arrested and charged with a crime for engaging in sex for money services here in Thailand. Nor met anyone who ever met anyone who has been through that. Not as long as everyone involved was a consenting adult.

Of course, the police can drum up any reason to hassle and arrest anyone at any time. That has always been so. But in terms of an actual crime as stated in the Thai Penal Code that can be cited, charged and tried for, the words might as well be "Twinkle Twinkle Little Star" far as any rogue cops are concerned. They can arrest you for "smiling while driving" if they want. So the risk of being targeted by rogue cops has nothing specifically to do with crimes and arrests for mongering.

[QUOTE=Rocko20;2970058]Another thai source for those looking for more sources, straight from a veteran Thai sex worker:

"She pointed out that owners of venues where sex is traded must themselves pay officials under the table, as prostitution remains illegal in Thailand. ".

"And since prostitution is illegal, venues providing sexual services are not registered and therefore not subject to regulations on hygiene and safety. ".

[URL]https://world.thaipbs.or.th/detail/thailands-exploited-vulnerable-sex-workers-could-soon-be-protected-by-law/48316[/URL]

I've proven my stance with multiple sources and I'm not discussing it anymore. Anyone is free to do their own research.[/QUOTE]"Legalizing" and making legitimate something that is not a crime is not the question at discussion here.

For one thing, we all know the real reason "owners of venues where sex is traded must themselves pay officials under the table" even if she and the authors of that article are confused about it; because the Thai Penal Code clearly states that running such a business as a business is illegal. Why doesn't she herself have to pay officials anything under the table or any freelancers working the streets or on Thai Friendly who connect with customers pay anything to officials to look the other way?

Do I really have to repeat the reason why not?

I agree with her that she and her co-workers' chosen profession should be clearly and unambiguously declared "legal" and made legitimate for the purposes of then installing government-sanctioned and sponsored legal protections from exploitation by rogue cops, abusive customers and so on.

But that is a separate question than the one at discussion here.

BTW, in all her years as a prostitute she has no horror stories about any of her customers being hassled or abused by her line of worknnot being made "legal and legitimate"?

Not even one among the thousands of customers she must have had by now?

Again, do I really have to repeat the reason why not?

[QUOTE=Rocko20;2970008]I disagree, and multiple sources disagree with you.

"Prostitution is illegal in Thailand, but the laws are ambiguous and often unenforced. As a result, red-light districts, massage parlors, go-go bars, and sex-focused karaoke bars are common sights. Sex work in Thailand is a significant economic incentive for many citizens, especially rural, unskilled women with financial burdens. ".
[URL]https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/countries-where-prostitution-is-legal[/URL]

Someone asked for sources and I provided multiple sources.

Four Africans held for prostitution in Phuket.
[url]https://www.bangkokpost.com/thailand/general/2902227/four-africans-held-for-prostitution-in-phuket[/url]


Ask the Africans in phuket who got arrested for it.

[url]https://www.bangkokpost.com/thailand/general/2902227/four-africans-held-for-prostitution-in-phuket[/url]

See link above. Are the thai police going to bust down your door? No. Can they arbitrarily decide to arrest some street workers if someone files a complaint? Yes. If they can arrest Africans in Phuket for prostitution, they can do it for anyone else. How many Africans are on beach road right now standing right in front of the police station? Plenty.[/QUOTE]I would ask the police why none of those Africans' customers were arrested for anything.

I would ask why are they only arresting foreigners with likely visa violation issues at play while thousands more prostitutes with no potential visa issues at all stroll right past their police stations and sidewalk tables before their very eyes day and night. Often with customers in tow.

I would ask the police to please show me the Section in the Thai Penal Code that makes prostitution between consenting adults illegal. And if they won't do that I will bring up the Title IX Sections of The Thai Penal Code on my smart phone and educate them on what the law actually does and does not state.

LOL. The same as I do with the cops and Men In Brown who hassle me about my electric bicycle when they are absolutely certain (but wrong and shown to be wrong by me) about something I have done on a bicycle being illegal when it is not illegal.

That has transpired more than a dozen times over the past 3 years. And I have never been arrested for it nor paid so much as a single baht fine to anyone.

[QUOTE=Rocko20;2969909]Quick update from my trip.

Russian clip joints:

Decided to peak inside a few of them to see if anything has changed and they're just as worthless as they've always been. 500 baht for a beer, 1000 baht for a lady drink, 10,000 baht for a shower (no sex). Ugly strippers. Many of the "Russian" ladies begging for lady drinks are not even scantily clad or half naked, they're fully clothed so there is zero point to visit these scam joints.

Discos:

Panda: Loud as hell, not for the faint of heart, largely chinese only club but plenty of fair skinned freelance stunners if you can stomach the intense environment.

Republic: same as Panda, but a few more westerners. I saw several decent freelancers but was with a WG at the time. Cool enough to revisit.

Insomnia / Ibar: I could not find a damn thing in here. Nothing notable at all but I do like eating at The Diner.

808: Only worth it if you like fat chicks. I've been going to 808 daily on the off chance I see something good, but more times than not its not the case.

Beach road: I generally despise beach roach but I had some free time and found a decent freelancer. She wanted 1500ST, which I was fine with because she had some nice natural knockers. She said "condom everything" but was fine with a bareback blowjob.

Gogos:

I only went to shark yesterday, barfined a decent stunner for ST and ended up spending the rest of the night with her as a GFE. She told me she has to sell 6 drinks or pay the difference (she said its different for salary workers), said pre-covid the money was flowing, now post covid people don't spend money. She said Chinese people are mainly the ones still spending money in the WS go-gos, followed by Americans / Europeans in lower numbers. She said Indians do not spend money in WS gogos as well as local Thai men.

Soapy massages:

Decided not to go on this trip.

Dating apps / bumble / tinder:

Could not find anything I liked.

Indian clubs:

I counted atleast 6 of them on WS. Not worth it for mongering. Too many heavy makeup, middle aged, pushup bra, single mother, overcharging Thai WGs and Azerbaijan women. But good to visit if you want to see something new.

Overall its been a solid trip. I had some good bar girls as well as freelancers.[/QUOTE]Please disclose Sharks Pricing.

My intelligence on Palace.

Barfine 2,500 prime time.

Girl Fee 4%.

Shocker. She say Kong Time is 6,ooo.

Since we're all talking about this I'll add my 2 cents. I've found through my decades of hobbying around the world that where it's actually legal, like in New Zealand or the Netherlands, it's not as good and definitely more expensive. Whatever moral or ethical issues aside, when it's in a legal grey zone like in Thailand, the chicks tend to perform better and of course are more affordable. The exception to that rule might just be Singapore's Geylang, but that was years ago, who knows what it's like now. Even FKK's today are no where near as good as they used to be. With how expensive things have become, legality has made prostitution even more cost prohibitive than it already was, in the very few countries where it's legal. That's why we must support Thailand and how it's running this whole thing, cause it's the only way us old, ugly, Danny Devito types can get any pussy, anywhere on the planet. Thailand was made for people like me to get laid. And that's that. What a paradise. People living in Thailand, local or farang have no idea how lucky they are. Only those idiot youtuber digital nomad fucks seem to know how lucky they are with all their ridiculous videos.

[QUOTE=Rocko20;2970008]-snip-
Four Africans held for prostitution in Phuket.
[url]https://www.bangkokpost.com/thailand/general/2902227/four-africans-held-for-prostitution-in-phuket[/url]


Ask the Africans in phuket who got arrested for it.

[url]https://www.bangkokpost.com/thailand/general/2902227/four-africans-held-for-prostitution-in-phuket[/url]

See link above. Are the thai police going to bust down your door? No. Can they arbitrarily decide to arrest some street workers if someone files a complaint? Yes. If they can arrest Africans in Phuket for prostitution, they can do it for anyone else. How many Africans are on beach road right now standing right in front of the police station? Plenty.[/QUOTE]Without even asking the police why they didn't arrest any of those Africans' customers for anything, the report you linked provided most of the reasons for it:

[QUOTE]Police were responding to a [b]report[/b] that some foreign women were offering sexual services in the Patong area, said Pol Col Kriangkrai Arayaying, the chief of the Phuket [b]Immigration[/b] office.

Police found several foreign women talking with other tourists on Bangla Road on Wednesday. The officers [b]observed[/b] their behaviour until they were [b]certain[/b] the women were offering sex for money.[/QUOTE]Lessons learned:

1. Don't be a visibly evident foreigner interloping on legal Thai prostitutes' territory.

2. Don't offer sex in exchange for money so publicly, openly and shamefully that your Thai competitors, nearby business owners and the Immigration police they lodge a complaint with as well as the police who respond to that complaint can so plainly observe what you are doing publicly, openly and shamefully that they can be certain that behavior is the specific crime for which you could and will be arrested.

3. The customers were not the ones being open and shameful about the public negotiation. Only the African prostitutes were. Therefore, there was no violation of Thai law that those customers could be arrested and charged with violating.

[QUOTE=LittleBigMan;2970076]It is funny, start a needless conversation then say I said my piece I don't want to o talk about it anymore.

Personally it never should have started legal or illegal.

None of these so call research have anything to o do with reality here there is like less than a 1 % chance this applies to anyone who comes to playland if it does don't come. To end I don't want to talk about it anymore LOL.[/QUOTE]Maybe you need to read my initial post that quoted the OP's that started this conversation. It was not me. Kindly read and you will see.

Hi Guys,

Need one help, can anyone give a feedback on the Base Apartment in Pattaya from Air BnB.

TIA.