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[QUOTE=Sirioja;3078554]Zelensky is not illegal according to Ukrainian constitution and despite corruption, Ukrainians know he has balls since more than 4 years versus war criminal and dictator Putin. Incredible how Ukraine is resisting versus big powerful Russia of Putin who loves deaths.[/QUOTE]Ukraine will get destroyed while 'resisting'. I guess the EU and the collective west is okay with that.
Until the last Ukrainian, right?
[QUOTE=BloodRed;3078610]Funny thing is, Ukraine will never ever join NATO.[/QUOTE]But Finlands (now NATO) border with RF is longer than UAs.
Thus, Putler "succeeded" already to extend Russias borders with NATO members.
Or will he attack Finland, next, because of joining NATO?
But probably he remembers Russias imperialistic fights against them in the past, and how hard that was.
Why is the kremlin wasting the money it doesn't have to keep disseminating ridiculous two-bit lies?
I think four reasons.
1. the kremlin is dumb. Like really, seriously dumb. Something, the Rusophiles here and everywhere simply can't comprehend.
2. The worse their 4. 5-year-old idiotic war is going (remember Kyiv in three days, LOL?) -- the more needs to scare the "collective West".
3. Six weeks till their so-called elections.
4. Upcoming fall mobilization is coming right after the elections. More distractions are needed so the meatballs don't roll away before they come for them.
But why would they pay their dedicated propacondoms to spread their BS on the fucking mongering forum, of all places, you ask?
Number 1 is why.
[QUOTE=BloodRed;3078776]Ukraine will get destroyed while 'resisting'. I guess the EU and the collective west is okay with that.
Until the last Ukrainian, right?[/QUOTE]You prefer Ukraine under dictator, criminal Putin? But Ukrainians don t, when they are so courageous.
[QUOTE=ReinerOtto;3078824]But Finlands (now NATO) border with RF is longer than UAs.
Thus, Putler "succeeded" already to extend Russias borders with NATO members.
Or will he attack Finland, next, because of joining NATO?
But probably he remembers Russias imperialistic fights against them in the past, and how hard that was.[/QUOTE]I said Ukraine will never join NATO and you bring up Finland. Ukraine joining NATO is what brought this whole tragic war on. And Ukraine will end up a destroyed dysfunctional rump state that never joins NATO. So why was neutrality so bad? If Ukraine had stayed neutral, if the collective west hadn't imposed the coup in 2014, Ukraine would be intact. Crimea would be with Ukraine. All of the Donbas and Kherson and Zaporizhia would be with Ukraine. There would be no war.
[QUOTE=BloodRed;3079112]if the collective west hadn't imposed the coup in 2014, Ukraine would be intact. Crimea would be with Ukraine. All of the Donbas and Kherson and Zaporizhia would be with Ukraine. There would be no war.[/QUOTE]Yanukovych fled Kyiv after signing an EU deal for early elections. Parliament, including members of his own party, voted three hundred twenty-eight to zero to remove him the next day because he'd abandoned his post. That's not a coup, it's what happens when a president runs away.
[QUOTE=BloodRed;3079112]I said Ukraine will never join NATO and you bring up Finland. Ukraine joining NATO is what brought this whole tragic war on. And Ukraine will end up a destroyed dysfunctional rump state that never joins NATO. So why was neutrality so bad? If Ukraine had stayed neutral, if the collective west hadn't imposed the coup in 2014, Ukraine would be intact. Crimea would be with Ukraine. All of the Donbas and Kherson and Zaporizhia would be with Ukraine. There would be no war.[/QUOTE]This is pure Russian disinformation. Every statement in this is a lie. The poster is paid by Russian IRA or ASD.
[QUOTE=JohnClayton;3079145]This is pure Russian disinformation. Every statement in this is a lie. The poster is paid by Russian IRA or ASD.[/QUOTE]You have no argument.
[QUOTE=BloodRed;3079112]I said Ukraine will never join NATO and you bring up Finland. Ukraine joining NATO is what brought this whole tragic war on. And Ukraine will end up a destroyed dysfunctional rump state that never joins NATO. So why was neutrality so bad? If Ukraine had stayed neutral, if the collective west hadn't imposed the coup in 2014, Ukraine would be intact. Crimea would be with Ukraine. All of the Donbas and Kherson and Zaporizhia would be with Ukraine. There would be no war.[/QUOTE]Putin dream to make again USSR. He didn't respect what he signed. We can t trust him, same than for Trump.
[QUOTE=BloodRed;3079112] Ukraine joining NATO is what brought this whole tragic war on. [/QUOTE]Sounds like you are paving the path for aggression of Russia towards Finland, because it gave up neutrality.
Oh, but Finland now in NATO, thus Putin might buckle down. UA was not fast enough to join NATO, obviously.
[QUOTE=ReinerOtto;3079196]Sounds like you are paving the path for aggression of Russia towards Finland, because it gave up neutrality.
Oh, but Finland now in NATO, thus Putin might buckle down. UA was not fast enough to join NATO, obviously.[/QUOTE]Nice selective quoting.
Read up on history. How many times did NATO expand post 1991? How many expansions did the Russians tolerate, despite the assurance that there would be no NATO expansion before the SU collapsed?
What were the red lines? Clearly Georgia was one. Look what happened to Georgia in 2008. Today there are 2 independent republics in Georgia, and the government in power now is smart and realizes the mistake that was made in the past. Russia clobbered Georgia in 2008.
The brightest of all red lines was Ukraine joining NATO. That would have meant war and that's exactly what happened. So I don't know why you like to bring up Finland. Pay attention to what the red lines were.
And like I said, Ukraine will never ever join NATO.
So again I ask, was all this worth it for Ukraine? Can any Pro Ukrainian here honestly answer that?
[QUOTE=Sirioja;3079063]You prefer Ukraine under dictator, criminal Putin? But Ukrainians don t, when they are so courageous.[/QUOTE]I have nothing but respect for Ukrainians. They are brave and fight valiantly with honor and dignity. I am opposed to the filthy Nazi regime in Kiev and the beggar in Kiev whose term has long expired.
I would like to see a neutral, prosperous Ukraine, like it was before the western backed coup in 2014. When Ukraine was intact. When Crimea was with Ukraine. When there was no war.
[QUOTE=BloodRed;3079201] Can any Pro Ukrainian here honestly answer that?[/QUOTE]No. Only the Ukrainian citizen can. And they do it with rifles in their hands.
Only minor difference between Hitler and Putin:
When Hitler brought Sudetenland to Germany, the Wehrmacht was greeted with flowers.
[QUOTE=BloodRed;3079201] Nice selective quoting.
Read up on history. How many times did NATO expand post 1991? How many expansions did the Russians tolerate, despite the assurance that there would be no NATO expansion before the SU collapsed [/QUOTE]The "not one inch eastward" assurance was verbal, limited to East Germany during unification talks, and never written into the Two Plus Four Treaty or any binding agreement. Also cut the spin BS. Many former Eastern Block countries freely and gleefully expanded into NATO because they reject your way of life.
[QUOTE=BloodRed;3079202]I have nothing but respect for Ukrainians. They are brave and fight valiantly with honor and dignity. I am opposed to the filthy Nazi regime in Kiev and the beggar in Kiev whose term has long expired.[/QUOTE]Zelensky is serving under martial law as elections are suspended during wartime. This is a common practice that is consistent with the Ukrainian constitution. It's also ironic that you question legitimacy while Putin has murdered or jailed his most credible political opposition.
And calling Ukraine's government Nazi is pathetic. Zelensky is Jewish, and his family lost members in the Holocaust. Azov is a fringe group, and polls show Ukrainians strongly support their government and president. Russia has its own Nazi problem, with groups like Rusich fighting in Ukraine.
Also the "I respect the people but not the government" line is a lazy false dichotomy. The Ukrainian people strongly support their government, so your fake respect is just empty words typed from safety.