Moscow

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]OK...

I thought I would try Assorti tonight. It's a massage parlor that has been reported on before and sounded like a good prospect for my first night in town. Assorti used to be located near Barrikadnaya, but it has recently moved to a new location on Zemlyanoi Val, which is in the same neighborhood as Hot Dog's.

More to come...[/QUOTE]Strav,

Thanks for sharing. I have yet to try the house of happy finish; it sounds interesting.

Keep it coming.

Jake

Outstanding report, Stravinsky. I made a visit to the sister kv <<Kapriz back in December and had a similar experience. Actually almost every time I go to one of these places I leave happy.- that is to say happy that I didn't blow an extra 7500r at Nightflight or some such place.

Kapriz is right down the street from the Chistiye Prudy metro and I was able to negotiate fairly well even with my limited Russian, though I had a tough time figuring out the podyez. I went at about 1pm and had about 5 girls to choose from, all shapes and sizes. I think I paid about 1200r for the hour and it's still the best bargain in town.

I'll drive down this weekend for another visit. Hopefully this shitass weather will break by then.

[QUOTE=Chezz]Actually almost every time I go to one of these places I leave happy.- that is to say happy that I didn't blow an extra 7500r at Nightflight or some such place.[/QUOTE]There has been big increase in the number of massage parlors that work "bez intime" without sex. I think the local guys are also feeling the pinch of higher prices for full service, which for them, are approaching 4000r.

I noticed last time I took a girl from Boarhouse that the girl requested me 1000r. She payed that to somebody in the corner of the bar. I saw more girls doing this as they left with the customers.

Is this normal practice. In thailand you pay barfine for the girls in the gogo bars. But this is a normal bar. Do the girls try to rip you off an extra 1000r. My friend took a girl back to his hotel but she kept complaining that she wanted more money even before reaching the hotel. He then sent her back but lost of course his 1000r.

To me 1000r is quite a lot for this (about 30 euro). I can get a nice Russian girl in Germany already for this price. Just the barfine of 1000r, what''s going on here.

Tiffany

[QUOTE=Member #2096]I noticed last time I took a girl from Boarhouse that the girl requested me 1000r. She payed that to somebody in the corner of the bar. I saw more girls doing this as they left with the customers.[/QUOTE]I had some girls tell me this too, but only when it was busy. Late night and off-nights, it doesn't seem to be an issue. Also, I picked up a regular girl there a week ago and the okhraniki didn't say a word to either one of us on the way out.

BTW, what's to stop the girl from leaving alone and meeting you later in a nearby cafe or your hotel room? I've done that in other countries where the girl had to pay a fee to leave the bar (also in stripclubs where it was verboten to ever leave with a customer). After being stung a couple times, I will NEVER pay a girl in advance, no matter how hot she is.

[QUOTE=Member #2096]To me 1000r is quite a lot for this (about 30 euro). I can get a nice Russian girl in Germany already for this price. Just the barfine of 1000r, what''s going on here.[/QUOTE]30 euro for a nice Russian girl in DE? Ah, come on... Anyway, as everyone on this forum has been complaining about, the price for pussy in Mow-town has been affected by inflation as much as everything else (if not more).

[QUOTE=Jake993]You can always try the high end clubs but they are too loud for me and the girls seem to be trolling for oligarchs these days (not that I blame them) so forget about inexpensive.[/QUOTE]There's also a good chance that you'll get "faced" at the elite clubs on good nights, even if you're a good looking, well-dressed guy.

Here are some of my favorite "regular girl" pick-up joints:

- Etazh (I've written about this already with respect to off-duty NF girls, but in general this is a great place to meet cute young things before and after clubbing)
- Papa John's (like Real McCoy, filled with lots of extremely drunk and easy girls, albeit not the best looking)
- Karma Bar (demokratichny club that is foreigner friendly, particularly good on HipHop Sundays)
- Tema (usually packed with drunk sluts, but stick to something simple to drink, as I've found the bartenders are horrible)

Also bear in mind that the high female:male ratios in clubs are essentially a thing of the past. Cute girls will have lots of attention and are accustomed to the "caveman" pickup style that is popular among the local men, so if your approach is the suave and subtle one, you won't have much of a chance. Be strong and confident and don't be afraid to cop a feel on the way in. Assuming her boyfriend isn't standing next to her, the worst you'll receive in return is a dirty look.

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]Ppt,


I am curious about a couple of things…. did you negotiate your way into the salon by speaking English, or do you speak Russian? Also, the sextalk review reported the price paid as 4000r. I’m wondering if they have raised their prices??


Счастливо[/QUOTE]

I negociated my way in russian as i speak some russian, but 100% sure they understood that i was a foreigner... So probably they have increased the price a little bit for this reason?

[QUOTE=Passepartout]I negociated my way in russian as i speak some russian, but 100% sure they understood that i was a foreigner... So probably they have increased the price a little bit for this reason?[/QUOTE]Wow, that sucks. I've never been charged more than 4K/hr, and I definitely speak Russian "s aktsentom". Sounds like the girl took advantage of you.

On the other hand, I usually tip 500R/hr if the service rocks (and it often does there).

I will be staying at the Sheraton Moscow, any suggestions of bars, MP's, etc will be appreciated. I did some research, the hotel is girl freindly, information was old, is this still the case?

Paying in advance is one of the oldest stripper/escort scams in the book. 95% of the time it doesn't work out well - why else would the girl be asking for the money upfront. ;)

In all my experiences in the FSU I've always paid when the girl was leaving. When I took a girl home from River Palace in Kyiv this winter she actually forgot the money. I had to call after her when she had left the apartment. :) However, I don't think it's too unreasonable for a girl to ask for the money when you get back to your place. Generally not a good sign in the FSU but not unreasonable.

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]
BTW, what's to stop the girl from leaving alone and meeting you later in a nearby cafe or your hotel room? I've done that in other countries where the girl had to pay a fee to leave the bar (also in stripclubs where it was verboten to ever leave with a customer). After being stung a couple times, I will NEVER pay a girl in advance, no matter how hot she is.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Cruiser D]Paying in advance is one of the oldest stripper/escort scams in the book. 95% of the time it doesn't work out well - why else would the girl be asking for the money upfront. ;)

In all my experiences in the FSU I've always paid when the girl was leaving. When I took a girl home from River Palace in Kyiv this winter she actually forgot the money. I had to call after her when she had left the apartment. :) However, I don't think it's too unreasonable for a girl to ask for the money when you get back to your place. Generally not a good sign in the FSU but not unreasonable.[/QUOTE]Paying on exit is the best, of course. But I can understand that these girls want to ensure they actually get paid. Of course everyone on this forum is a total gentleman but no doubt there are deadbeats who fuck the girls, then fuck them twice by not paying in the end.

I never experienced a no-show or disappearing act, but rather a LT= ST conversion, which wouldn't have been aided by paying the girl upon entry.

Of course the BIG exception in this case are the tochki. No other way to play than to pay up front.

[QUOTE=Victoria2005]Hotel(Izmailovo Gamam/Delta and Alfa )

What for you to recommend the most bad and not friendly Hotel? The Hotel works in communistic style. Worse the Hotel is not present in Moscow.[/QUOTE]

I know it's still a hotel with different levels of rooms (in comunist style)... but if you book for two and the girl has proper documents there is no problem at all, never got any hassle nor at Alfa nor at Delta/Gamma... most of my pics and sponsored girls are done there... May be later I will post some room pics (are on the laptop).

May be the matter is that the hotel is not friendly for 1-2 hours girls. But I'm not interested in these... I like overnighters and longer time sponsoring... And paper registering (done for free).

Have a long list of girls nailed in one or the other... just some: Valentina, Ludmilla, Iriska, Lena, Sveta and many others... If they do not have proper docs... just go over with 1.000 RUR... but I do it rarely.

Bars, restaurants shops, in and outside are open mostly 24 hour, you get food room service from restaurant 24 hours. In my room usually there is a big three place jacuzzi... internet etc etc... Do really not understand what's the problem... That the fridge usually is empty? There are plenty of shops where buying.

What I get with 150-200 EUR (including huge breakfast for two) is a two room suite (two baths, sleeping room, living room/office, entrance) with king bed, PC, internet copier, fax, fridge etc etc... (in delta in alfa you bring your own PC). I wonder where in the central Moscow I can get such things. Of course If you take the budget rooms they are ugly I know...

Then you just take the metro... Frankly speaking I have no time to travel Moscow on the day by taxi! I thae the metro and maybe the taxi for the last 1-3 km...

IT

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]Paying on exit is the best, of course. But I can understand that these girls want to ensure they actually get paid. Of course everyone on this forum is a total gentleman but no doubt there are deadbeats who fuck the girls, then fuck them twice by not paying in the end.

I never experienced a no-show or disappearing act, but rather a LT= ST conversion, which wouldn't have been aided by paying the girl upon entry.

Of course the BIG exception in this case are the tochki. No other way to play than to pay up front.[/QUOTE]I'd never pay a girl in the club, but if she really wants to see money before sex once she's back in the apartment she can have it. Some ask, curiously most don't. Haven't found that it makes a difference on performance, but I generally avoid the kind of girls that seem in a rush in the first place. You can gauge that behavior even in the club... usually.

[QUOTE=Victoria2005]Now it is clear, why your girls such obedient and They do that you wish.Because they are afraid. In hotel it is a lot of militia which checks registration. Girls from other cities or from other states. Living in Moscow constantly feel fear. Because meetings with militia once again are not necessary to them. Will do therefore all as you wish. I think, that the normal woman will not want to meet you, even for money. Only such women. Everyone makes the choice (the Hotel, the woman)[/QUOTE]

I really wonder if you have ever been there... ah ah There is no militia in alfa at all and they just go through in winter in Gamma Delta... never seen them stopping anybody in the hotel...

IT

[QUOTE=Johntodd]I will be staying at the Sheraton Moscow, any suggestions of bars, MP's, etc will be appreciated. I did some research, the hotel is girl freindly, information was old, is this still the case?[/QUOTE]

The Sheraton in Moscow is about as "friendly" as it gets. It's been a few months but last time I went for drinks in the lobby bar, the place was crawling with working girls. Having said that, I have no idea how the management feels about bringing in your own girl. Being an American style hotel I would imagine that they would not object.

As far as other bars, clubs, etc - plenty of info on this site. Just dig a little.

[QUOTE=Jake993]The Sheraton in Moscow is about as "friendly" as it gets. It's been a few months but last time I went for drinks in the lobby bar, the place was crawling with working girls. Having said that, I have no idea how the management feels about bringing in your own girl. Being an American style hotel I would imagine that they would not object.

As far as other bars, clubs, etc - plenty of info on this site. Just dig a little.[/QUOTE]They're girl-friendly for regular gfs as well or girls from other clubs.

Some of the lobby girls looked quite ok, no current idea on prices but imagine starting $300-500 but will settle for $200 if there is "love" in the air.

[QUOTE=Member #2096]I noticed last time I took a girl from Boarhouse that the girl requested me 1000r. She payed that to somebody in the corner of the bar. I saw more girls doing this as they left with the customers.

Is this normal practice. In thailand you pay barfine for the girls in the gogo bars. But this is a normal bar. Do the girls try to rip you off an extra 1000r. My friend took a girl back to his hotel but she kept complaining that she wanted more money even before reaching the hotel. He then sent her back but lost of course his 1000r.

To me 1000r is quite a lot for this (about 30 euro). I can get a nice Russian girl in Germany already for this price. Just the barfine of 1000r, what''s going on here.

Tiffany[/QUOTE]

I was there in April and had "take out" twice from hot dogs and both times there was no Bar Fine per se. In the past when it was Boarhouse I specifically remember girls asking for 1,000 Rubles to pay the exit. Perhaps they have re-instituted the practice?

OK, inquiring minds want to know... what's the point of driving a car that can travel at 300 KpH, when the world before you is a sea of brake lights??

The surface transit in Moscow is slowly grinding to a halt. The traffic has become so bad that no one can predict at what time they will be anywhere. Fridays are no-drive days, simply because it's impossible to move. Everyone is on their way out of town to the dacha.

New Russian vocabulary word: probkah (traffic jam)

I wanted to see what a night club would be like outside of the city center, so I thought I'd give Strekozah (dragonfly) a try. It's a strip club on ulitsa Grina, near Dmitri Donskovo, the last stop on the Grey line. It's actually just beyond MKAD. Took me 45 minutes to get there, and that was on the metro. When you get off, take the u. Grina exit and head south, towards the McDonalds (yes, they even have a McDonalds out here).

When I arrived at Grina, I couldn't see any obvious signs of activity, but I did spy a taxi, so I walked over to ask directions. The taxist didn't recognize the name of the club off hand, but he made an open ended offer to help me find it for 100r. So, we are definately not in Kansas anymore. On Tverskaya, it costs a 100r just to get into the taxi.

We drove down to one end of the street and then back down to the other, looking for No. 3, but no luck. Then the taxist started asking directions of the locals and it turns out the club is right back where we started. I think the taxist was very embarrassed by this and he refused to take the 100r I offered. So I had to compel the taxist to take my money. That was definately a first!

The reason I couldn't see the club right away is because it's in the basement of a larger complex of buildings and the sign is behind a bunch of trees. Once inside, it's 500r entry and then down the stairs and through a bunch of curtains into the club. It's not a big place, but plenty of room to be comfortable. There's a stage in the center and there are couches that run around the walls of the club with coffee tables at regular intervals. Some of the tables are masked by curtains on either side to create a private booth, and the rest are open. It reminds me of Mister XXX a little bit, except Strekozah is smaller. The color scheme is even red and black.

It's about midnight, and the place is busy but not crowded. The ofitsanka (waitress) greets me immediately and ushers me into one of the private booths. I order a drink (50ml of Jack Daniels is 300r) and some zakuski and settle back to enjoy the show. There are 6 or 7 dancers who rotate every 3 songs. When they are done, they wade out into the audience and offer lap dances at the tables for 100r tips. This is basically an audition for the 1000r privat tanyets. After a couple of rotations, it becomes clear that the level of talent here is pretty good, much better than I had expected. In fact, it's excellent. There are a couple of real stunners. What are they doing way out here?

The dancers are strictly topless, but I like the 100r lap dance regime, I could do this all night. Each girl has her own style. Some will stay at your table longer and some are more particular about where you can touch them. It takes me a couple rotations to figure out that Masha and Olga are the least protive (against). They are pretty comfortable with where ever your hands might wander.

Having picked out 2 good prospects, the next thing to do is try the privat tanyets. Private dances are done behind closed curtains and the dancers are completely nude. Masha and Olga don't seem to have any problem with where I touch them, as long as my fingers are on their body and not in it (hey, you can't blame a fella for trying).

So, the lap dances and the private dances have been a lot of fun, but, they leave me strangely unsatisified. If I'm reading this Crazy Menu correctly, it looks like they want 6000r to rent one of the VIP kabinyets for 1 hr. and another 10,000r to excuse one of the girls for an hour, to meet me in the kabinyet. That's a little too expensive for me, although, I have to admit, those dancers bodies are mighty fine.

I settle up my tab with the ofitsanka and head back out to the street. It's about 02:30 and my taxi is waiting for me. Not the 1st one I met coming in, but another one is there, waiting for a fare. I tell him I'm going back to tsentrom gorodye (city center) and he pauses for a moment and asks what I'm offering. I say 600, he says 800, which sounds OK by me, since he's holding all the cards. It's a long way back home.

[QUOTE=Jake993]I was there in April and had "take out" twice from hot dogs and both times there was no Bar Fine per se. In the past when it was Boarhouse I specifically remember girls asking for 1,000 Rubles to pay the exit. Perhaps they have re-instituted the practice?[/QUOTE]It's much simpler... security is THEIR problem not yours. Tell them to worry about it, their pussy is expensive enough.

BTW, great report Strav!

[QUOTE=Jake993]I was there in April and had "take out" twice from hot dogs and both times there was no Bar Fine per se. In the past when it was Boarhouse I specifically remember girls asking for 1,000 Rubles to pay the exit. Perhaps they have re-instituted the practice?[/QUOTE]Was at HotDog last night with a couple friends. We arrive LATE after dinner and drinks at a couple of clubs. I mean well past 3am. The place isn't exactly jumpin' but there are at least 40 guys and 40 girls there, with a handful on the dance floor, most of the action towards the bathrooms and the pool table. The male population seems, um, "darker" than usual, and one of the girls there confirmed my hunch. Side note: one of the hilarious things about Russian is that they consider Caucasians (literally, people from the Caucasus mountains) to be "chyornie" (which means "black" in English). This includes all those guys you see on the news recently (Georgians, Ossetians, Abkhazis) as well as Armenians, Azeris, Chechens, Dagestanis, Turkmen, well, you get the idea. Anyway, for whatever reason there were a disproportionate number of those guys there last night. And since your average Slavic Russian girl is usually a more than a little prejudiced against them, it meant that the odds were definitely in our favor.

Unfortunately, the talent pool at that hour on a Tuesday is pretty dismal. The hot/doable/pass split probably 5/25/70. We get some drive-bys, but nothing of interest. One Asian-looking girl comes up to our table and sits down without saying a word. She's a 5, even after 10 beers (meaning, probably closer to a 4 or 3). Nevertheless, I'm a decent guy, more than a little buzzed, and nothing better to do, so figure I'll talk with her: Me: "Privet" (hey) Her: "Kheeloh" Me: "Otkuda ty? " (where are you from? ) Her: <glare Me: "Ty ne govorish po-russky? " (you don't speak Russian? ) Her: <glare Me: "You don't speak Russian? " Her: "Ty govorish po-russky poetomu ya ushla! " (you speak Russian, so I'm outta here! ) And she storms off. Nothing like a little early morning drama to sober you up.

Anyway, my buddy rounds up the 3 best girls he could find and brings them back to our table. Sveta is a tall 26-year-old from Minsk with slightly fucked teeth, a Roman nose but nice brown eyes (she's part gypsy), sandy brown hair and a nice, fit body. Since she speaks little/no English, she sits with me which was fine since she's my favorite of the bunch. Her friend Vika is a short brunette with a cherubic face, big tits and a bit of a paunch, probably around the same age, and speaks decent English, so she sits with my visiting friend who speaks little/no Russian. And the third girl (forgot her name) is a blonde who I would have rated a 4 or lower, but my friend (the one who rounded the girls up) is waaay into her for whatever reason. We proceed to drink a lot more and talk with the girls. At some point, we figure we should get going, and invite the girls to come with us to our buddy's pad where we can continue the party. Without any negotiating, we get into a couple taxis and head out (with a brief detour to the apteka for some condoms and Vitamin C).

Once we get there, we keep drinking and getting even more wasted. The girls then start "schooling" us that they're WGs (duh) and they want to know how much we'll pay for the night. In my drunken state, I agreed to pay them 10K each. Thinking back, I must have been really fucked up to agree to so much, especially since it was almost morning by then.

Anyway, we move into our respective rooms and I start kissing Sveta. She wants me to take a shower before we even kiss. I'm asking her what difference it makes, then she says that we need to, and then starts getting bossy with me, demanding the money now. I told her that she can leave if that's the attitude she'll take, and that I'm paying a lot of money for good service, not to hear some lecture. I toss her out of the room, and a minute later one of my friends comes in and tells me that she's trying to get all the girls to leave with her. Not wanting to screw up their time, I apologize to her, bring her back in and pay her. Now she's much nicer and more accommodating, so I may have done the right thing to "break" her. In bed, I got to fully inspect her hot, 175cm body (astonishingly, she has a 4 year old kid, but a totally flat stomach and not a single stretch mark anywhere on her body). In general though, the service was so-so: CBJ, DATY, FS, but great DFK. After an hour, she claims to have "finished" twice, and wants a break. Shortly after, she then starts the high-pressure "you need to finish now! " routine (does that EVER work? ) and after another 30 minutes, I've had enough of her whining. So, while she's taking a smoke break, I ask her if there is a bar fine at HotDog. She said that girls pay 1500R cover to get in, but nothing to leave. So I'm guessing that the girls that pay on the way out are essentially get the cover "loaned" to them, and they're paying with a portion of their advance on exit.

At 7:30am, the morning light is painfully bright and we proceed onto the street to stagger home and get a couple hours of sleep before we need to start the workday. Ah. Moscow.

[size=-2][b][u]EDITOR'S NOTE[/u]:[/b] [blue]I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please [url=http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?]Click Here[/url] for more information.[/blue][/size]

Haha! That's the first time I've seen a strip club with a summer terrace! Can you get lapdances on the picnic tables too? :)

Seriously good report, Strav! Keep em coming!

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]Once we get there, we keep drinking and getting even more wasted. The girls then start "schooling" us that they're WGs (duh) and they want to know how much we'll pay for the night. In my drunken state, I agreed to pay them 10K each. Thinking back, I must have been really fucked up to agree to so much, especially since it was almost morning by then.
[/QUOTE]Great story from the front, but if you don't mind my saying, ball was in your court if they were at your pad. You could have likely gotten away paying a LOT less, especially considering the un-hotness of at least two out of the three.

But I'm armchair mongering here, was your call.

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]I ask her if there is a bar fine at HotDog. She said that girls pay 1500R cover to get in, but nothing to leave. So I'm guessing that the girls that pay on the way out are essentially get the cover "loaned" to them, and they're paying with a portion of their advance on exit.
[/QUOTE]

Good work Pizdyets!
You cracked the mystery. I wondered what the deal was. Thinking back, both girls last April were from out of town (Gorky and Tula) and probably not "sly" enough to play that game. Hmmmm...... might explain why they were so enthusiastic.

BTW - Always remember Jake's Trifecta - divorced, single mom, from out of town. Best combo for maximum performance at a reasonable price. The only problem is that sometimes it takes a week to get rid of them......

Pizdyets,

[i]Ah, Moscow! Russia's favorite daughter. Where is your equal to be found?[/i] Dmitriev, from Onegin. What would really be interesting... would be to hear about how you made it through the following day. ;) [QUOTE=Pizdyets]Her: "Ty govorish po-russky poetomu ya ushla! " (you speak Russian, so I'm outta here! ) And she storms off.[/QUOTE]Ochyn intyeresno. She's not interested in a man who speaks Russian. I imagine because she knows that she won't be able to manipulate you as easily as a foreign tourist who doesn't speak the lingo.

Nice reports on this page!! Well done guys!

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]They're girl-friendly for regular gfs as well or girls from other clubs.

Some of the lobby girls looked quite ok, no current idea on prices but imagine starting $300-500 but will settle for $200 if there is "love" in the air.[/QUOTE]

In Sheraton? 200$? For "love in the air"? =))) Good fantasy. Some guys can believe.


[QUOTE=It Travel]I really wonder if you have ever been there... ah ah There is no militia in alfa at all and they just go through in winter in Gamma Delta... never seen them stopping anybody in the hotel...

IT[/QUOTE]

IT, Victoria is right. I also don't understand why you still mislead the others promoting this place full of problems. May be they hired you...

Guys, Izmailovo and Crown Plaza (Mezdunarodnaya) are the most difficult places in Moscow for inviting guests. If possible, better avoid them. If you still deside to stay there, remember that you should take girls with you earlier than 20.00-21.00 and pay for them as for additional persons in the room. Sometimes you will be unable to fix the problem at all, depends on a shift. And forget about discretion, because you'll have to move with a girl everywhere - when she is in, when she is out, ect. And each time you appear together, a lot of security's attention is guaranteed.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Great story from the front, but if you don't mind my saying, ball was in your court if they were at your pad. You could have likely gotten away paying a LOT less, especially considering the un-hotness of at least two out of the three.

But I'm armchair mongering here, was your call.[/QUOTE]20/20 hindsight, Doc. 20/20 hindsight.

Seriously, I'd had like 5L of pivo and a half dozen shots of tequila by that point, so I was doing good just to manage a woody with my 20 mg of Vitamin C.

In general, I monger the most when I'm wasted, but with the worst results. Eto ironiya sud'by. :)

[QUOTE=Stravinsky][i]Ah, Moscow! Russia's favorite daughter. Where is your equal to be found?[/i] Dmitriev, from Onegin. What would really be interesting... would be to hear about how you made it through the following day. ;) Ochyn intyeresno. She's not interested in a man who speaks Russian. I imagine because she knows that she won't be able to manipulate you as easily as a foreign tourist who doesn't speak the lingo.[/QUOTE]I had an hour of sleep, then worked for the next 14 hours. No mercy for the wicked.

As for the strange girl, she was actually staring me down for the rest of the evening. I don't think they get a lot of foreigners who speak Russian there, honestly.

Another interesting thing I got from Sveta was the WG's perspective on our favorite Moscow whoring venues:

NF - cheaper (!) than HotDog, richer clientele, but stricter face-control, and has recently been swamped with Novie Russkie

HotDog - high cover, lots of traffic, easy to pick up customers, but recently swamped with chyornie

Metelitsa and Golden Palace - wealthy clientele, but swamped with "solidnie" types (you know who I'm talking about)

Also of note. She said that all WGs in NF must give their passports to be scanned by the management. So, boyz, if you're ever ripped off by a NF girl, go and talk to them. They should at least be able to identify her. But good luck in motivating the Moskovskaya militsia in doing anything other than extracting bribes from pedestrians and motorists.

Had another weird night tonight. My buddy texts me around midnight to tell me that he's out with 2 total hotties and needs a wingman. Now understand, I'm not one to turn down such random acts of kindness, but guys, I'd only had an hour of sleep (see my previous HotDog report) and was still finishing up my work for the night. After some coffee and a shower, I was ready to go and only needed to know where. He handed the phone to his driver and I got the address: Olympic Stadium. What sort of club or bar, I was wondering, would be in the Olympic Stadium? So I grabbed a gypsy cab and headed to Olympisky Prospect in search of my friend and his two dyevushki. I hook up with his driver in the parking lot, and he directs me to a door of a club called "Ko Ko" (at least that's what's above the door). Inside, it's clearly a strip club and has "Show Girls" plastered everywhere. I wonder if I have the right place, as it looks like a cross between Hot Dog, a strip club and a sports bar. So, I pay the 1000R cover and immediately see my friend and his "hotties". One is truly quite good looking (a brunette), but her blonde friend doesn't do it for me at all. Anyway, it's clear that neither of these girls is interested in me either (I barely got a "hello"), so I direct my attention to the talent within the club. Roughly 40 girls of all shape, color and size. And I counted at least 5 girls that were truly stunning, with the majority squarely in the "hot" category. The format is Deja Vu style, with more of a burlesque element (theatrical and musical shows punctuate the stripteases on stage). Like Deja Vu, there are no lapdances, and you must got to a curtained area on the sides or back to have a 1500R private dance (for which they often were having 2-for-1 promotions). That was still too rich for my cheap ass, so I just jacked off in situ (kidding). If I had been in a strip club mood, it would have been much better, but this just wasn't the night for me. Didn't see any "crazy menu", but as with anywhere in Moscow, FS is usually just a matter of negotiating.

[QUOTE=Helena Moscow]In Sheraton? 200$? For "love in the air"? =))) Good fantasy. Some guys can believe.[/QUOTE]I'm with Helena on this one, unless you're talking about ST (which is typically a lobby girl's MO anyway) or a follow-up date. My info for LT in a good hotel is that they start at $400, and move quickly up from there. Of course there are so many variables (particular hotel, season, time of night, day of week, level of attraction, sugar daddy potential), that the standard deviation is probably pretty damn high. Who's signing up for the chi-square analysis? :P

Hi,

I would like to receive some updated replies about these important questions, I am sure they are easy for the master mongers of Moscow thread:

- Hotel vs. flat: is actually a dangerous choice to rent a flat in Moscow????? I mean, for example, in Kiev it is cheap and safe. What is the real difference of a flat rent between Moscow and Kiev?

- Quality of sex: on "moslove" site, I found a lot of girls agreeing deep throat blowjobs and anal sex, I wonder: are they more liar than Ukrainian girls or is that the reality?

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]I'm with Helena on this one, [/QUOTE]

Ditto. The girls there are about volume and high utilization rate. I was in Sheraton about a year ago with a friend who was staying there. I inquired about pricing and the first thing she asked was whether I was a guest at the Sheraton or not. I told her I was not and that I had an apartment near Pushkinskaya. She told me $800 and I thought she was joking and tried to negotiate but she would not budge.

It was only about 10:00 PM and since I was not prepared to pay $800 we decided to stay put and track the comings and going of Miss Hottie. When we left the bar at 2:00 AM, we had watched her leave and come back three times with three different guys for an average of about 40 minutes a shift. Of course, she made a point of waving at us each time she returned to the bar and then ignored us. Sort of a "screw you" gesture I think. While I did not follow her to any rooms, logic would suggest that she turned at least three tricks with hotel guests in a four hour period. At $300 - $400 a pop, that made for a petty respectable night I would say.

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]I'm with Helena on this one, unless you're talking about ST (which is typically a lobby girl's MO anyway) or a follow-up date. My info for LT in a good hotel is that they start at $400, and move quickly up from there. Of course there are so many variables (particular hotel, season, time of night, day of week, level of attraction, sugar daddy potential), that the standard deviation is probably pretty damn high. Who's signing up for the chi-square analysis? :P[/QUOTE][QUOTE=Jake993] I told her I was not and that I had an apartment near Pushkinskaya. She told me $800 and I thought she was joking and tried to negotiate but she would not budge.
[/QUOTE]In theory I am ALSO with Helena on this, but I have no reason to exaggerate to give anyone false hope. That's just the way it went down. I've got even stranger stories I may post someday. My point being, it doesn't hurt to ask with a smile.
[QUOTE=Helena Moscow]In Sheraton? 200$? For "love in the air"? =))) Good fantasy. Some guys can believe.
[/QUOTE]Helena, about 2 years ago I offered a girl $150 and she accepted. We'd seen each other the day before there as well, but didn't leave just chatted. Dropping off the same friend the next day as I wasn't staying at the hotel, we spoke just briefly agreed on price and left together.

And by "love is in the air" I am being sarcastic, i.e. it means she was getting nothing else that night and had nowhere else to go, so she took what was offered. I didn't even have to bargain that hard, it was my first offer. I know very well it didn't have anything to do with "love" or my blue eyes.

Like I posted, I am sure they are ASKING $300-500. It doesn't hurt to try, I'm sure they get it sometimes... maybe even often and by now probably even more.

Doesn't hurt for us to try and get a more appropriate price either. Accept the fact that for a lot of people sex with prostitutes is not worth what the lobby girl/escort market is asking right now. I know you are selling yourself for as much as you can get and I fully understand that, but don't feel insulted when some of us aren't interested.

By the way, it's not just us. Many of my Russian friends, most of them "direktors" 35-45 years old are also not going to prostitutes anymore. They earn good money, but can't justify paying so much for simple pussy. They'd rather buy some new shoes or use the money as a down payment on a weekend holiday to Sochi.

On a side note for reference, I was quoted $500 at Peter 1 a couple weeks back... was really funny too, because the girl was a "5" at best. When dropping people off at hotels I often ask the WGs how much just to hear what they say and the usual prices are $300-500. Nobody has yet had the nerve to ask for $800, but then again I've never asked anybody at the Ritz yet... ))

You probably won't tell us Helena, but what was the MOST anybody ever gave you and what were the circumstances? One girl in St.Pete told me a guy regularly gave her something like $1000 just to chat. She thought that would somehow impress me or make me pay more. I just felt sorry for the guy. She was a horrible conversationalist. ))[QUOTE=Jake993]When we left the bar at 2:00 AM, we had watched her leave and come back three times with three different guys for an average of about 40 minutes a shift. Of course, she made a point of waving at us each time she returned to the bar and then ignored us. Sort of a "screw you" gesture I think. While I did not follow her to any rooms, logic would suggest that she turned at least three tricks with hotel guests in a four hour period. At $300 - $400 a pop, that made for a petty respectable night I would say.[/QUOTE]If she was actually banging these guys and had a 40 minute turn around time, she wasn't even SHOWERING between knob jobs and pokes. Could also be she didn't actually score. I've observed a lot of bar action at hotels and girls often talk a long time to the Russian guests without scoring. They chat and chat, maybe even take a stroll and eventually he leaves alone. These are guests. I think the Russians have a different attitude to the game, they feel no obligation to go with the girl just because they talked with her. Western guys are often different in this sense, accepting the girl's "Time is money, you're wasting mine." attitude.

Pizdyets,

Great enlightining report :)

Pyzdiest:

I think that we should have a beer or 2 one day together :-)

After the great firsttime in saloon Charmel, I decided to return there.

I confirm again that the price was 4500 - told on the phone, asked straight by the girl... no doubt that they have increased their prices.

I arrived but girls were not ready so i had to wait 10 minutes in the street with the guy who pick you up... Btw quite a sympathic man.

Then i went in, as usual 10 girls, all great, and guys it starts to frighten me, it could easily becomes a drug hard to resist...

Anyway, my choice went on Nadia...
[url]http://www.charmel.biz/girl_page.phtml?tbl=pict&id=112&gid=7[/url]

Quite a weird choice as she was probably one of the less attractive women, but I wanted big breast and she had, and I don't know, she got something in her face that looked like a promise.

She is quite like on the pictures, with some more kilos, but also with some bigger boobs.

I paid my 4500, then the shower, then we lied on the bed, and then I have received one of the best blow job i had in moscow in one year, maybe even the best one. I specially like how she put slightly her boobs on your nuts, while taking the entire bone in her mouth... just amazing....
Then fuck was good.

All in all, a nice session, and I have decided to test all the girls of this saloon before the end of the year.

Defenetly a must.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Helena, about 2 years ago I offered a girl $150 and she accepted.[/QUOTE]Skank, 2 years ago was 2 years ago. It's 2008 now. Cost of living changed. But even 2 years ago girls payed for the possibility to work in a hotel, they payed for drinks in the bar and restaurant food when get hungry. Plus transport. No discounts for girls. To arrange a working day in a hotel is about 70-100$ per day. Just for a chance to make some money. Count yourself how much the girl should charge to cover the risk and get profit. A hint: clients are not guaranteed. There are empty days, too. And in these days expences remain.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]You probably won't tell us Helena, but what was the MOST anybody ever gave you and what were the circumstances? One girl in St.Pete told me a guy regularly gave her something like $1000 just to chat. She thought that would somehow impress me or make me pay more.[/QUOTE]The biggest amount for the evening was 5000$. In 1995. No special conditions. The guy was a prince. I know a girl in NF who after one night got an apartment from a chineese guy. In 1993. Not a regular thing, but possible. I believe that someone gives to St.Pete's girl 1000$ for a chart. Especially if the guy is Russian. But "regularly" can be once a month, or once in half a year, or once a year.

[QUOTE=Helena Moscow]Skank, 2 years ago was 2 years ago. It's 2008 now. Cost of living changed. But even 2 years ago girls payed for the possibility to work in a hotel, they payed for drinks in the bar and food when get hungry. Plus transport. No discounts for girls. Calculate yourself how much it would become. I don't want to argue if you had this girl for this rate or not. Probably she went with you for 150 our of charity, or may be you hypnotised her with your charms about which you write all the time, or she was probably desperate... This is an exeption, not a regular thing. I don't understand why you should give others false expectations. For this rate guys will hardly find someone even in tochka. And later they will come on this forum and write that Moscow girls became crazy bitches and tried to cheat them. Your stories are interesting, but they are fairytales. Din't mean to offend you...[/QUOTE]You haven't offended me Helena and I certainly don't write fairy tales. I never said that it was in anyway normal and certainly said that normal price was at least $300.

Nobody expects charity in Moscow or anywhere else for that matter, but I still don't mind if I relate stories to the forum of things that actually happened.

And no, I didn't do any hypnotizing. Maybe she was just bored or frustrated. Maybe she was desperate for cash and had to cut her losses. Who knows.

In Germany I have met FKK girls outside of the club and screwed them for free. One of them even asked the manager if we could use the facilities for our own games after hours and she let us. Romped from 2-6am with a pro, no cash involved. Even filmed it on video.

Met the manager of a bar in St.Petersburg about three weeks ago and drank for free two nights straight, taking home very cute 21 year olds on both nights for free. They've never asked for anything except that I come back really soon. We only talked about life, art, Kundera and photography. For some reason that seems to turn girls on.

Maybe nobody wants to believe that either, but that's not my problem. It happened.

Life has less rules than you think.[QUOTE=Helena Moscow]I know a girl in NF who after one night got an apartment from a chineese guy. In 1993. Not a regular thing, but possible.[/QUOTE]With today's prices, I'd fuck a Chinese guy for an apartment in Moscow. But it would have to be Chisty Prudi. ))

By the way, apartment construction down 58% in first 2 quarters of 2008. Real estate may level out soon.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]
Life has less rules than you think.[/QUOTE]

Not to insult you Skank, but I don't want you giving Helena any bad habits about the use of the English language. Therefore, at the risk of patronizing you, I would like to share a lesson I learned in high school English class.

There are two words that can often mean the same thing but are often used incorrectly. They are "less" and "fewer".

When you are referring to something that cannot be easily measured, like grains of sand on the beach, the number of stars in the sky, or the amount of bullshit being written on this site, it is considered proper to use the word "less". For example, "Dr. Skank writes less bullshit on ISG than Jake993".

However, when you refer to something that can easily be counted like the number of beers you had last night, the number of orgasms she had this evening, or the number of girls you slept with last year, it is considered appropriate to use the word "fewer". For example, "Life has fewer rules than you think".

Mind you, in your case I suppose that when referring to the number of girls you slept with last year, it might well be appropriate to use the word "less".

Sorry for busting your chops....

[QUOTE=Passepartout]
Pyzdiest [sic],
I think that we should have a beer or 2 one day together :-)
[/QUOTE]

Sure, go ahead and PM me. I'm still weighing my options for tonight (Friday).

[QUOTE=Passepartout]
After the great firsttime in saloon Charmel, I decided to return there.
[/QUOTE]

Not to patronize, but I was like you about 2 years ago - a wide-eyed kid in the candy store. But similar to my ennui of strip clubs, salons lost their glamour and novelty after a few visits. Not that I don't still visit occasionally (esp after a long night of drinking and/or striking out), but it just doesn't have the same level of anticipation and mystery.

[QUOTE=Passepartout]
I confirm again that the price was 4500 - told on the phone, asked straight by the girl... no doubt that they have increased their prices.
[/QUOTE]

Strange that Fantasy's and Charmel would have different pay scales. And the fact that they're advertising on several websites as still having 4000R/hr. Warrants some research. :)


[QUOTE=Passepartout]
Anyway, my choice went on Nadia...
[/QUOTE]

Nadia was my first choice on the internet as well, but for some reason she just doesn't strike a chord in real life. That said, one of my colleagues tapped her exclusively on every visit and claimed she was the best. Glad you had a similar experience!

[QUOTE=Helena Moscow]
The biggest amount for the evening was 5000$. In 1995. No special conditions. The guy was a prince.
[/QUOTE]

Doc, you're asking Helena for the maximum she made in an evening, whereas I'd be asking how little (ie how [B]few[/B] dollars, Jake) she demanded for an evening's services recently. Now that's something she wouldn't want to admit to, especially on this forum. :)

No one's prince,
Pizdyets

Jake

Smoothly put………..


Doc

Enough with the 3 years foreplay between you and Helena.

Shell out a few rubles and enjoy one of the few RU Devs you have not yet tasted. Or not:

300 Euros is simply too much for any pussy in a country full of national treasures. Then again you know that already. That’s why you have enjoyed so many Devs for free or in a reasonable price range.


Helena

Welcome to the world of capitalism combined with commission sales.

Most mongers may not have much sympathy for your plight as Moscow has one of the best economies in the world at the moment.

Shame that your marketing costs exceed your comfort level. It’s a harsh reality for all of us when daily costs interfere with monthly gross profits.

Between your life experience, connections made, command of the English language and your intelligence combined with the future of Russia there are quite a range of possibilities aside from the working life open to you. IMHO

Might be time to make better use of your skills.

Attempting to convince us that an evening with any female is worth a $5,000 or an apartment is a joke. AKA propaganda………….

Please stay out of the comedy business.


Guido88

Well after reading all the reports I decided to focus on free girls. There are lots of free girls to have; join the internet, chat in bars.

If you want good sex with a Russian girl, take a plane to Germany. In the FKK clubs you can have sex with all the girls for a fixed rate of 100 euro, including food and drinks. I would rather save my money on Russian pros in Moscow and fly to Germany once or twice a month.

The prices Helena mentioned are payed by some people who do not care about money at all. But even most rich guys do not overpay (one of the reasons they got rich) and last time I was in boarhouse there were enough girls willing to go for 200$. Of course they may ask more but in the weekdays and late at night most of them do not get a customer at all and are happy to go for 200$.

Do not overpay and spoil the market.

It is not different than any other business. If there is a lot of offer the prices go down. If nobody wants to pay this rediculous prices the price has to go down.

The reports on the carmel clubs sound like fair business to me. These girls are much better looking than the average hotdog or lobby girl and they are even cheaper. And if their service sucks you can always complain to the manager. Less change of scam here.

Tiffany

[QUOTE=Helena Moscow]In Sheraton? 200$? For "love in the air"? =))) Good fantasy. Some guys can believe.




IT, Victoria is right. I also don't understand why you still mislead the others promoting this place full of problems. May be they hired you...

Guys, Izmailovo and Crown Plaza (Mezdunarodnaya) are the most difficult places in Moscow.[/QUOTE]


It is probably on ground on a different view...

A) I have the copy of the girls passport home (because they are always the same)... The room is already booked for two so I pay no addition.
B) They get a room card as all guest because they are normally registered in a double room with their documents (proper ones).
C) Beeing an hotel guest she goes and does exactly what I do...

Very simple ;) Any one who thinks I'm hired by the hotel is a little strange.

A same standard room (of course not really "same standard" but it works for me) goes in the city for 7-900 USD or more. For what shall I pay this... just for living in the Sheraton or at the Hayatt (where it goes for 1.200?).

I have never had problems alaso with normal gests during the day I take up for meetings, male or female makes no difference, they just register the ID when they get in and when they get out as it was in any Russian hotel.

The problem is simply that you get girls with unproper or no documents. By the way if you booked for one and you want to register for two you just have to go to the Recepion (not the security) at any time. If you just want the girl up register at the security before 23.00 at 23.30 they will knock at your door and tell you she has to go, or... just bribe 1000 RUR.

The thing is done for YOUR safety... nobody will steal anyting here because all is registered! That is the matter, perhaps something is a little bit fancy but I do not care of that.

[url]http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showpost.php?p=471670&postcount=912[/url]

Images from June 2006 of the classic working suite at Izmailovo Gamma /Delta the ones at Alfa in some aspect are better in some worse (Wi Fi not cable) better sofa and better minibar, no fax... But they have a good business centre (better than the Delta one).

IT

I just want to point out this.

I’m a self employed and may be Helena and Victoria do not look at money (for sure they look at the one they get)… so I have done a little search…

I book via a well known agency organizing my trips (hotel, train, cars, etc. since more than 10 years) so I get an invoice, and just pay within EU with a bank draft and get the regular paid invoice in Moscow. Last time for six nights in Alfa with the suites on the 28th floor, two transfers from DME, four transfers in the city (already planned with hired cars with drivers, usually I use the Metro otherwise) I paid 1370 € (visa application if needed is free of charge and if you want done for more days). Booked for two breakfast included, all transfer, registration and taxes. Internet, PC, photocopier, fax etc is all included. You have to pay only for non Moscow calls which I do from my Russian mobile.

Same situation working suite will be.. (on the cheap expedia)

Golden Ring: 1930 Euro excl transfer, breakfast, visa
Budapest: 2260, only breakfast included
SAS: 4.400!
Renaissance (normal room only) 2.300
Hyatt (normal room only) 4.000 and you pay even for Internet!
Etc etc… You get cheaper only more in outskirts and not well served by the metro.

I am travelling approx 35 weeks a year (not only in Russia of course!)… and get from the companies the fly tickets (Business) and a fixed amount per day (as it is in use in some companies in my country) for hotel and food, not of course if I take out customers or so… with the price difference, if you are careful, it makes around 50.000 € a year should I scrap them just because Victoria and Helena (too old for me in any case) do not like the hotel I’m living in?

In the last ten years of travel this made me approx. 500.000 € or… I mongered ten years from Ukraine to Brasil, from China to Romania for free… and got left at least 300.000 € eh eh eh

Bye bye and stop polemics on Izmailovo, if you see the report there are some mongers… been there… of course it’s not a five star but I’m not so sophisticated as Helena and Victoria and I do not care! For sure they get a lot more money than me… so!

Bye IT

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]Doc, you're asking Helena for the maximum she made in an evening, whereas I'd be asking how little (ie how [B]few[/B] dollars, Jake) she demanded for an evening's services recently.

No one's prince,

Pizdyets[/QUOTE]Pizdets, my rates are not a secret. Visit my site and read. They are non-negociable, as I prefer clients who can and want to afford them. If it's not you, fine. The matter of taste.

[QUOTE=It Travel]It is probably on ground on a different view.

A) I have the copy of the girls passport home (because they are always the same)... The room is already booked for two so I pay no addition.

B) They get a room card as all guest because they are normally registered in a double room with their documents (proper ones).

C) Beeing an hotel guest she goes and does exactly what I do.[/QUOTE]IT, I think you should always add this part of your posting when recommend Izmailovo. Otherwise these recommendatopns really create mess. Most of guys who call from there don't guess to book a room for two and get very much surprised at extra costs later.

[QUOTE=Helena Moscow]Pizdets, my rates are not a secret. Visit my site and read. They are non-negociable, as I prefer clients who can and want to afford them. If it's not you, fine. The matter of taste.

.[/QUOTE]


I will report this post to the administrator.

I have already expressed what I think about helena and her messages here:

- this forum is made by mongers for mongers. We shouldn't let someone who proposes her services post outside the "classified ads" threat.
- moreover it is not the first time we Can see Helena posting some quite agressive answers or ideas.

[QUOTE=Passepartout]I will report this post to the administrator.

I have already expressed what I think about helena and her messages here:

- this forum is made by mongers for mongers. We shouldn't let someone who proposes her services post outside the "classified ads" threat.
- moreover it is not the first time we Can see Helena posting some quite agressive answers or ideas.[/QUOTE]


Don't forget to complain to you mommy, too =))))

i thought i would try club pegas. it's website looked interesting; it's billed as a combination sauna/massage/strip club ( [url]http://club-pegas.ru[/url] ). never heard of one of those before. pegas is located at 31 ulitsa bratislavskaya, which is the 2nd to the last stop on the light green/lime metro line, south of the center.

i get to bratislavskaya station about 22:30 and have the good fortune to come up from the metro right onto the main street. i flag down a passing zhiguli (yes, old zhigulis never die, they just move to the suburbs) and i tell him where i'm going. he waves me into the car without even asking what i will pay.

it's a saturday night and bratislavskaya is lit up like a christmas tree. there are shopping centers, casinos, restaurants, night clubs, even a mcdonalds. it almost looks like the arbat, except on a smaller scale. as i travel around town, it occurs to me that, like all major world cities, moscow is not one city. there are dozens of cities in moscow, each neighborhood has a life of its own and is completely self-contained, with its own character.

dom 31 is located at the very end of the street, almost to the river. we pull into the parking lot and drive around the building, looking for some kind of sign, but nothing to be found. my driver stops and asks several people if they know where is club pegas, but no one has heard of it. so, this doesn't look good. i call the club and the woman confirms that we are in the right place. she tells me to look for the arka (arch) and then i have to go cherez arkoo (through the arch). looks like i will have to find this place pyeshkom (on foot), so i thank my driver and give him 100r, which he seems to be happy with and i set out to find the arka.

there are a lot of arkas in this town. it seems that i always have to go "cherez arkoo" when i'm hunting down dyevooshki. i finally find it, in the middle of the building. it was hidden in the dark, which is why we didn't see it before. so, i walk through the arka and on the other side i find... more darkness, nothing. i call pegas again to find out what's going on and the woman tells me that they are in the podvahl (basement). sure enough, there is a door attached to the side of the building, under the arka,
that leads to the basement.

at the bottom of the stairs, i am greeted by a young woman, maybe mid 20's, who is the administrator. she welcomes me in and asks me to follow her down the hall. this place is big, and strangely quiet, for a strip club. she ushers me into a big room and offers me a seat at one of the divans. looking around, i can see that there is a sauna built into one corner, and a big jacuzzi in the center of the room. the room has been tiled with white marble and looks like a turkish bath.

the administrator begins to rattle off my options. i can have 2 girls for 1.5 hours, the use of the sauna and jacuzzi, klassicheski massage and eroticheski massage, but no sex. so, i'm thinking this sounds like a good uption, until she tells me it's 7,500r. which is probably why no one is using the sauna on a saturday night. i guess they never heard about market pricing. i ask her what else is available and she offers 1 girl, for 1.5 hours, klassicheski and eroticheski massage, for 2250r. this sounds more like it.

but, i'm still curious about the strip club. the administrator tells me that the strip club "nye rabotaiyet" (it's not working). this happens a lot in russia, things nye rabotaiyet. no one can ever seem to explain why, they just don't. it's a russian thing. people start out with the best of intentions, but ultimately, it all falls apart and all you have is "nye rabotaiyet". i pay her and she leaves to fetch the dyeffki.

she returns with an even dozen girls, who line up and introduce themselves. i have to admit the selection is impressive. there are short ones, tall ones, blondes and brunettes and all definately do-able, if that were an option. i end up picking nissa, she's short, with a tight compact figure, almost buff. if nothing else, i should get a good massage. she also has a nice smile, always important.

nissa leads me into one of the massage rooms. there is a foam mattress on the floor, subdued lighting and a boom box for music. the room and the whole club is decorated in a sort of middle eastern motif. we head off to the shower and nissa guards the door while i am inside. they do a good job here of making sure that the customers don't bump into each other.

back to the room. nissa puts on the some music and it's basically the same deal as assorti. hand job to start, hand job to finish with a massage in between. nissa works diligently, both on the erotic and classic massage. she's from sotchi and she lives here with her 5 year old daughter. not married, no family, she had a job working in one of the casinos as a bartender, but couldn't make enough money to support her daughter, so here she is tugging on my knob. so much the better for me. she tells me that she's not too happy with the work, mainly because of the clientele. apparently, this neighborhood is mainly georgian and avkazian, so that's who her customers are. never met an amerikanyetz before.

when the 90 minutes are up, there is a knock at the door, which is interesting since there is no door, just a curtain draped over the entrance to the room. shower, dress, and the adminstrator seems to be genuinely concerned that i had a good time, "vsyo otlichnah" everything was excellent.

back up in the parking lot, i'm wondering how i will find a cab out here, but as luck has it, a taxi pulls into the lot to drop off some people and i approach the driver to tell him that i need to go back to tsentrom gorodye. he asks what i'm offering and i say 600r. he rolls his eyes and gives me a thumbs up, to the sky, as if to say, this is goona cost you. i say 800r, he says tuisach (1000r) and i'm on my way home.

hopefully i won't get an english lesson from jake! :))

[QUOTE=Passepartout]I will report this post to the administrator.

I have already expressed what I think about helena and her messages here:

- this forum is made by mongers for mongers. We shouldn't let someone who proposes her services post outside the "classified ads" threat.

- moreover it is not the first time we Can see Helena posting some quite agressive answers or ideas.[/QUOTE]I always enjoy Helena's reports and comments. She is in many ways a very interesting addition and correction to this forum. She adds another dimension! And when I go to Moscow next time I am happy to see her more intimately for the first time.

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]

Hopefully I won't get an English lesson from Jake! :))[/QUOTE]
Why do I get the feeling that I'm never going live this one down?

Thanks for the travelogue Strav - you are quite the adventurer these days.

[QUOTE=Helena Moscow]Don't forget to complain to you mommy, too =))))[/QUOTE]

Haha! BTW, Lenichka, to say that correctly po-anglisky, you'd say:
"Don't forget to complain to your mommy either." "Too" is always in the affirmative, "either" in the negative. Though your English seems to be quite good, that nuance is often lost by Russians. Just wanted to beat Jake to the punch. :P

Also, I was in no way offended by your post. We're all in the flesh trade here, whether buyer or seller, and it all comes down to economics. By all means, you should try and charge the very highest you can. You just need to balance volume with gross margin to maximize your profit.

[QUOTE=Pizdyets] Though your English seems to be quite good, that nuance is often lost by Russians. Just wanted to beat Jake to the punch. :P
[/QUOTE]

OK - you got me.
But you bring up an interesting point. English is so counter intuitive as a second or third language for most people especially in those little nuances. And the only way to get those little nuances is to practice and interact with native English speakers.

At Skank's suggestion I put up an ad on one of the dating sites (looking for free pussy of course) and suggested I would be willing to trade English lessons for sex. Well, not exactly in those words - I was a little more subtle than that. But I got all kinds of responses from girls who had a respectable command of the English language but wanted conversation in order to practice the nuances and colloquialisms. Didn't do much for my Russian skills but it led to one or two sexual encounters.

Russian is such an efficient language when compared to English. I seem to recall a saying about languages;

If you want to confuse someone - say it in English.
If you want to romance someone - say it in French.
If you want to insult someone - say it in German.
But if you want to say something efficiently - say it in Russian.

I'm sure I butchered the saying but you get the idea. English has a lot of rules and breaks them all so a novice in easily confused.

French, well, French is the language of love, n'est-ce pas?

The Germans have this wonderful ability to string together all sorts of obscenities and call it a word. A "motherfucking-son-of-a-Dresden-prostitute-with-a-wart-on-her-nose" is a legitimate word. Not only that, but everything sounds so offensive.

And then there's Russian. It seems to dispense with a lot of the excess baggage of many modern languages. Not that it's easy to learn with it's Cyrillic alphabet and interesting combination of sounds, but you just sort of throw the words out there and people just seem to understand what you are trying to say. Try the same thing in English and people look at you like you are from another planet.

[QUOTE=Explorer69]I always enjoy Helena's reports and comments. She is in many ways a very interesting addition and correction to this forum. She adds another dimension![/QUOTE]
Me too, couldn't agree more. She's an asset to this forum ;) (or is it "she's an asset for this forum", or "she's an asset in this forum"? :D). Anyway, she's great.

I'm more a St-Pete's guy than a Moscow's guy but, for the few times I was in Moscow, I found some of her comments quite accurate and useful (I say "some", no need to reply and correct me for the times she was exagerating a little).

Keep on the good work, Helena.

Jim

[QUOTE=Jake993]Why do I get the feeling that I'm never going live this one down?
[/QUOTE]You won't. You're on my grammar shit list. You'd better be on your best grammar game. If you even screw up your punctuation I am coming down on you like the fist of an angry grammar god.

)))

Now get back to fucking.

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]Haha! BTW, Lenichka, to say that correctly po-anglisky, you'd say:
"Don't forget to complain to your mommy either." "Too" is always in the affirmative, "either" in the negative. Though your English seems to be quite good, that nuance is often lost by Russians. Just wanted to beat Jake to the punch. :P

Also, I was in no way offended by your post. We're all in the flesh trade here, whether buyer or seller, and it all comes down to economics. By all means, you should try and charge the very highest you can. You just need to balance volume with gross margin to maximize your profit.[/QUOTE]


WOW! 2 lessons in one post ;)) Anyway, thank you for the hint in English. Always glad to improve.

[QUOTE=It Travel]I'll be soon in Moscow for a week and tried to responsor some little pig I did not nail properly anally...

Like Iriska...

But she told me she is married now! :(

Wonder if the guy has seen the pics....

[url]http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showpost.php?p=448069&postcount=870[/url]

Ah ah ah ;)

But I managed to get in touch with Piggy no pants (Sveta) ... nice blonde BBW just 23 or so now... one of the best cum swallower even had... so maybe I'll take her for a tour...

IT[/QUOTE]

I have to quote myself... just chatted via ICQ with the little pig... she has no time for fucking, but in this exceptional case she could come some hours (let's say four or so), but she wants 300 USD for her little pink hole, she says she is still virgin (may be in the ears)... think to the husband ah ah :eek:

IT

I am posting my lichnii kabinyet from intimcity.ru. These are all girls that I selected because they had enthusiastic review(s) from the local guys on sextalk (4+ or better). I cannot recommend any of them personally, because, unfortunately, I never got to meet any of them. That's what comes of mixing too much business with pleasure on my last trip, but, maybe someone else can profit from this.

These are real girls, who really will answer the door when you arrive and some may even answer the phone when you call. If I were in Moscow right now, these are the girls I would call.

Nota bene: The shelf life on these is very short, maybe 3 to 6 months, and some are almost at their sell-by date.

I posted a comprehensive view of Moscow on the internet page of the forum, but it's full of chit chat now so maybe somebody do not see it, so I post a link here.

I think It's very useful. :)

[url]http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showpost.php?p=778997&postcount=139[/url]

IT

IT,

I think we all saw your post. I hate to break your bubble, but most of the sites you listed are a waste of time. The main sites for Mosow are; imtimcity.ru and it's sister site rusdosug.nu, and dosug.nu, 95% of the dyeffki advertising themselves are on these sites. The rest aren't worth looking at.

Unless, of course, you are looking for sponsorship opportunities, which is a whole different subject. But most guys don't have enough time in Moscow, or the patience, for that game.

Of course, the ulitmate source of current and accurate info about P4P in Moscow is sextalk.ru, but you gotta speak the lingo to access it.

всего доброго

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]
Of course, the ulitmate source of current and accurate info about P4P in Moscow is sextalk.ru, but you gotta speak the lingo to access it.
[/QUOTE]

Amen to that, Brother Stravinsky. sextalk.ru is the motherlode of all that is whoring in Moscow. I suppose those who aren't govoryashy russky could use an online translator, but I fear that the lexicon used (sexual/slang) would leave them scratching their heads when they get to the good parts. Nevertheless, it's easy to look at the pics and ratings. Heavily recommended.

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]IT,

I think we all saw your post. I hate to break your bubble, but most of the sites you listed are a waste of time. The main sites for Mosow are; imtimcity.ru and it's sister site rusdosug.nu, and dosug.nu, 95% of the dyeffki advertising themselves are on these sites. The rest aren't worth looking at.

Unless, of course, you are looking for sponsorship opportunities, which is a whole different subject. But most guys don't have enough time in Moscow, or the patience, for that game.

Of course, the ulitmate source of current and accurate info about P4P in Moscow is sextalk.ru, but you gotta speak the lingo to access it.

всего доброго[/QUOTE]

Thanks I know most are a waste of time, and the big sitesa re at least at 60& replicas and several girls are making 3-6 ads... just wanted to show what was on the net on ground Jackson opened that thread on my request ;) and I got a lot of help from my fellow mongers!!!

IT

By the way now I'm more in sponsoring (I have ehough time) and I wanto to go back also to all small brothel you could find in the 90s... just for a two-three hour relax in the afternoon.. I like girls lineup! :p

Just to throw my hat in the ring when talking about politics, economics and prostitution (the older I get the more I realize they are one in the same), three of my favorite subjects. This is all actually Dr Skanks fault. I knew he had been recently terrorizing Moscow and I came here looking for a report or two from him. I think someone forgot his viagra at home. :P

First off let me preface everything by saying, I think a girl should make whatever she can, without of course scamming anyone.

The economy in Russia and Moscow in particular is such a classic bubble I'm sure economist for years will be studying it after it pops. We can all agree, I think on one thing, the Russian economy is basically a one pony show – petrol. Can the Russian economy survive $30/barrel oil? Methinks not. Now before the Greek chorus starts chanting, Cruiser! Oil will never drop below $100 or $50 barrel every again! The Chinese! The Indians! I’m sure you are the same people who five years ago would say, oil? $150/barrel are you insane? The economy has ran in manufactured cycles for a long time. Some resource, commodity or even an ‘idea’ (the tech bubble of the 90’s) gets manipulated, pushed to the forefront and milked for all it is worth. Then it disappears, the middle class can rest for a while then the next cycle of economic buffoonery hits. Petrol is a fossil fuel, and as that name implies it is very old – the internal combustion engine is nearing the end of it life cycle (like all great inventions) and this latest round of commodity manipulation is starting to dig it’s grave. OPEC who one would think would be doing cartwheels has been nothing but uneasy about this whole situation. When the petrol President is out of office early next year the ‘alternative’ energy boom is going to hit like a shock wave. When faced with situations like this – the embargo of the ‘70’s, the tech development of the early 90’s OPEC response by slashing oil prices to nothing to crush any competition or suffocate any emerging tech. It’s a-coming again. Anyone willing to guess what this will do to the huge bubble of hot air that is the Russian economy? My guess is it will make the ruble crash of 98 look like an all night rave at your favorite Moscow hot spot.

For all of you playing the market and making money off of Cruiser D’s grousings I’ll be sure to leave a numbered offshore account you can make your guilt donations to. ;)

Now, back to the present. I’ve said this before and I’ll say it again. However I will tone it down to our Russian readers who might get offended. 90% of Moscow (it used to be 95% before the recent oil fueled building boom) is a somewhat less then desirable location (generally I would use a word that starts with a ‘c’ and ends with a ‘hole’. The rest of Russian is even worse. Why anyone in their right mind (yes, yes I understand traveling, married and/or older businessmen don’t have choice) would pay $300/hr for Natalia in Moscow when they can pay $200-$300/hr for Natalia in Paris, Rome, London, NYC, Vegas (please excuse my whitecentricness). And sorry to the Russian working girls who frequent this forum, but saying real men overpay for their prostitutes isn’t going to get much traction here.

I’m sorry to all you readers looking for a ‘yeah, I got drunk and ended up fucking last years Russian Playboy calendar’ story with names, numbers, pictures, video and a blow by blow (pun intended). If you want those reports from me I posted some in the Kyiv forum about 4 years ago. :)

[QUOTE=Cruiser D]The economy in Russia and Moscow in particular is such a classic bubble I'm sure economist for years will be studying it after it pops. We can all agree, I think on one thing, the Russian economy is basically a one pony show – petrol. [/QUOTE]You have to believe! )

Personally I think the economy is more balanced than you believe, as it isn't only oil but also gas (with stable prices), natural resources such as titanium, aluminium etc. (worldwide consumption with no end in sight), construction on a massive scale, the service industry etc. etc.

I do agree that the economy isn't secure however, something Russians are also aware of. Moreover, the quality of life is still lower than in most parts of Europe and the US, no matter how many sushi bars and fitness clubs open in Moscow. That is all just superficial cosmetics Moreover, if the bubble does burst or even deflate, the average Russian and the growing middle class will suffer again, as they have been taking a lot of loans to pay off those cars, apartments and lifestyles. The rich.. at least the clever ones... are investing their money in other places, such as Europe and the US.

I was in Moscow for 3 nights... all I can say is that girls absolutely love the SwissOtel. )))

Me? I believe in the economy... it pays my bills. But if it does blow, I'll be around to watch the fireworks without getting burned.

Yup, the Russian economy before the petrol boom was metals. Well, that and flipping Soviet industries. :) One advantage Putin does have (oops, he's #2 now, right? :) is if he wanted to build 200 new nuclear power plants they would start ground breaking tomorrow. Of course considering Russia's nuclear track record that really isn't a good idea.

Maybe the air will leak slowly out of the bubble. Doubtful, but we shall see. The upper class is tiny, the middle class is small, then there is the rest of the country. Geez, sounds like Tsarist Russia, doesn't it. :)

[QUOTE=Cruiser D]Y
Maybe the air will leak slowly out of the bubble. Doubtful, but we shall see. The upper class is tiny, the middle class is small, then there is the rest of the country. Geez, sounds like Tsarist Russia, doesn't it. :)[/QUOTE]

I am re-reading a great book on the Russian civil war (1918 - 1921) called "A people's Tragedy" by Orlando Figes. Very readable and breaks the time line leading into the revolution into small digestible events starting about 1891. What is interesting (for me anyhow) is the way he describes the massive class rivalry that existed at the time and how the Bolsheviks were able to capitalize on the tremendous resentment of the landless peasants towards the relatively tiny land owning aristocracy.

It will be interesting to see how the current regime is able to trickle down enough wealth to the masses in the provinces in order to diffuse a possible rise in discontent and (dare I say) resentment towards the power elite?

To paraphrase Churchill, "if you don't learn from history, you are doomed to repeat it".

But I digress - As Dr. Skank points out, the booming Russian economy is not solely being fueled by oil (no pun intended), but at $140 or even $100 a barrel there is plenty of cash flowing into Russia. That cash can be used for all sorts of cool things - just use you imagination. Without getting into specifics, I think Russia with oil at $40 a barrel would look a little different that it does now.

So, it leads me pose two questions. Does Russia benefit from high oil prices? If so, what is she prepared to do to keep them high?

[QUOTE=Jake993]To paraphrase Churchill, "if you don't learn from history, you are doomed to repeat it".[/QUOTE]I think maybe you are confusing Churchill will Santayana???

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]I think maybe you are confusing Churchill will Santayana???[/QUOTE]
At my age, we are easily confused.
I have been confused before and will likely be confused again.

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]I think maybe you are confusing Churchill will Santayana???[/QUOTE]


My mistake:
Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.
George Santayana, The Life of Reason, Volume 1, 1905

However, after looking over Churchill's famous quotes, I did find one I liked quite a lot:

The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.
Winston Churchill

Any updated infos about tochka ? Prices and so on.

And btw is it possible to take tochka if you are in hotel ? I mean they have they own ID to get into hotel security or the only way is to stay in a flat ?

[QUOTE=Lukasek]Any updated infos about tochka ? Prices and so on.

And btw is it possible to take tochka if you are in hotel ? I mean they have they own ID to get into hotel security or the only way is to stay in a flat ?[/QUOTE]Security in some hotels allow to get tochka`s girls into hotel. But you must pay about 1000 Rub. Maybe more.

[QUOTE=Rus Love]Security in some hotels allow to get tochka`s girls into hotel. But you must pay about 1000 Rub. Maybe more.[/QUOTE]

For example which hotels Rus Love ?

[QUOTE=Lukasek]For example which hotels Rus Love ?[/QUOTE]Izmailovo (Delta, Vega)

[QUOTE=Rus Love]Izmailovo (Delta, Vega)[/QUOTE]Sorry but I was in flat my last time, so... Hotel Izmailovo but Delta and Vega?

P.S. Hotel Ukraina is devuchka friendly?

Hello guys,

I'm really happy come back to Moscow, it's my motherland and love it.

During 3 weeks I was in UK and spend all this time with very beautiful, nice and intelligent female Renata. I hired her at London escort agency.

Firstly, I was thinking that she is Russian or Eastern European, may be similar for me to Russian name, but she is German.

Spending time with such a gorgeous lady is a good experience, it was rather expensive :(But I wonna pay more, if I know that she will be so intelligent, hot and pleasant.)

Thanks, London escorts for such a great GFE experience.

[QUOTE=Lukasek]Sorry but I was in flat my last time, so... Hotel Izmailovo but Delta and Vega ?!

P.S. Hotel Ukraina is devuchka friendly ?[/QUOTE]I was in Delta and payed 1000 Rur.

I think hotel Ukraina is still closed.

[QUOTE=Lukasek]Hotel Ukraina is devuchka friendly ?[/QUOTE]

Hotel Ukraine has been closed for over a year, and given its current look won't be open for some time either.

[QUOTE=Lukasek]Any updated infos about tochka ? Prices and so on.
[/QUOTE]

I was at several last month, and they all seemed to have the same priced tiers: 5K, 10K, 15K. Of course their locations always change, so you need to get a taxist who's "in the know". Also, I suspect prices are negotiable depending upon time of day, day of week, inventory levels and so on. It's a suppy and demand world, no matter what's being traded...

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]I was at several last month, and they all seemed to have the same priced tiers: 5K, 10K, 15K. Of course their locations always change, so you need to get a taxist who's "in the know". Also, I suspect prices are negotiable depending upon time of day, day of week, inventory levels and so on. It's a suppy and demand world, no matter what's being traded...[/QUOTE]

Thanks and they stay till morning as usually ? 5k rubles are ugly or it is possible to find at this price a '6 too ? Do you negotiate the services with mamasun or how to choose one who will do bbbj+anal ?

No problem to find car who's in the know, the problem is besides izmailovo which other hotel will allow tochka to bedroom ?

Spasibo... ;)

Yeah, Winnie wasn't exactly the sharpest too in the shed. Ask the Aussie boys at Gallipoli. Even in WW2 he couldn't get over the 'soft underbelly of Europe' crap. Winnie rolled over for Uncle Joe because he wanted to feel like he was a player. FDR did it because his mind was marshmellow fluff at the time. (had to add Uncle Joe to make it topical.: )

[QUOTE=Jake993] The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.
Winston Churchill[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Lukasek]Thanks and they stay till morning as usually ? 5k rubles are ugly or it is possible to find at this price a '6 too ? Do you negotiate the services with mamasun or how to choose one who will do bbbj+anal ?

No problem to find car who's in the know, the problem is besides izmailovo which other hotel will allow tochka to bedroom ?

Spasibo... ;)[/QUOTE]

Lukasek,
All of the US hotel chains will allow girls to room. Sheraton, Hilton, Marriott, Raddisson, Holiday Inn, etc. plus Golden Apple (Malya Dmitrovka) and some others I can't think of right now. I think Helena has a list of girl friendly hotels on her web site.
When are you gong to Moscow?
Jake

[QUOTE=Jake993]Lukasek,
All of the US hotel chains will allow girls to room. Sheraton, Hilton, Marriott, Raddisson, Holiday Inn, etc. plus Golden Apple (Malya Dmitrovka) and some others I can't think of right now. I think Helena has a list of girl friendly hotels on her web site.
When are you gong to Moscow?
Jake[/QUOTE]

Thanks Jake, I will check the list of friendly hotels in Helena's web page and check also the one with the best rates.

It seems I will be in Russia from beginning of october, I simply cannot wait for be back again in the heaven...

[QUOTE=Lukasek]Thanks Jake, I will check the list of friendly hotels in Helena's web page and check also the one with the best rates.

It seems I will be in Russia from beginning of october, I simply cannot wait for be back again in the heaven...[/QUOTE]You might want to try "Katerina City". It's girl-friendly and close to the Pavelets train and metro stations, and should be fairly affordable. Be forewarned however that hotel prices are EXTREMELY high in Moscow now. The "cheapest" Western hotels are at least 200 € a night and often much more.

Also, I am not sure if Holiday Inns are girl-friendly, since I believe Helena reported they weren't.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]You might want to try "Katerina City". It's girl-friendly and close to the Pavelets train and metro stations, and should be fairly affordable. Be forewarned however that hotel prices are EXTREMELY high in Moscow now. The "cheapest" Western hotels are at least 200 € a night and often much more.

Also, I am not sure if Holiday Inns are girl-friendly, since I believe Helena reported they weren't.[/QUOTE]

Hi and thanks Doc...

I found the web page of Katerina City, but there is no rates there.

I thought to stay for the first time in hotel in Russia, cause I will be in Moscow only couple of days between my tour of cities outside Moscow, so I thought it doesn't worth to rent a flat for 2-3 days, but with friendly Western hotel at least 200e, I think rent a flat it surely worth it...specially considering flat is always friendly ;)

Any examples of agencies renting fairly affordable flats in Moscow ?

Some pal here has already sponosred these two pigs?

They are a little bit over age for me (both 26) and their names are Marina (the light coloured hair onre) and Inna (the black one)... On ground they do all and seem nice, one speaks also English...

Just asking info for my next trip...

IT

[QUOTE=Lukasek]Sorry but I was in flat my last time, so... Hotel Izmailovo but Delta and Vega?

P.S. Hotel Ukraina is devuchka friendly?[/QUOTE]


they are both girl "friendly" and safe... if you bring one or two upstairs before 23.00 you have to register her docs at the security desk (wich in my opinion is good for you...)

At 23.30 they will knock on your door... the fee is 1.000 RUR per girl... If she has no proper docs or papers just go in and when you are stopped by the security just show openly your room card and discretly a 1.000 RUR note... If she stays only daytime (a quick fuck) may be she has to tip somebody with 300-500 RUR just escort her out and it's all...

The best way for overnighters is that you just book for two and then register her as a guest on ground of strange price policies this will cost you nothing (apart breakfast of course) at Delta Gamma and 10 USD at Alfa.

IT

[QUOTE=It Travel]Some pal here has already sponosred these two pigs?
IT[/QUOTE]
No, but I think I might like to. And very nice little piggies they appear to be!

[QUOTE=It Travel]Some pal here has already sponosred these two pigs?

They are a little bit over age for me (both 26) and their names are Marina (the light coloured hair onre) and Inna (the black one)... On ground they do all and seem nice, one speaks also English...

Just asking info for my next trip...

IT[/QUOTE]Inna's a cutie whereas Marina... she better have a lot of personality.

[QUOTE=Lukasek]Thanks Jake, I will check the list of friendly hotels in Helena's web page and check also the one with the best rates.

It seems I will be in Russia from beginning of october, I simply cannot wait for be back again in the heaven...[/QUOTE]


Also try Pokrovka, Tatiana, Tiflis and Sretenka. They are girl-friendly and close to the center. I'm just not sure about the rates. Sputnik is now newly-renovated. Not super-luxurious, but neat and more or less quiet.

[QUOTE=Helena Moscow]Also try Pokrovka, Tatiana, Tiflis and Sretenka. They are girl-friendly and close to the center. I'm just not sure about the rates. Sputnik is now newly-renovated. Not super-luxurious, but neat and more or less quiet.[/QUOTE]

Privetik i spasibo Hely, I will check it for sure... It Travel I sent you pm

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Inna's a cutie whereas Marina... she better have a lot of personality.[/QUOTE]

So... what they do? and what they charge... I'm just delaing with them...
Let me know your experience... if they are pigs enough may be I'll take both to a vacation in Turkey or so...

IT

[QUOTE=It Travel]So... what they do? and what they charge... I'm just delaing with them...
Let me know your experience... if they are pigs enough may be I'll take both to a vacation in Turkey or so...

IT[/QUOTE]Don't know them IT, sorry. Was just being coy. But Inna does look cute for sure.

I would like to report a very bad experience I had with [url]www.elit.tv[/url]

I went there last week around 23.00, and first of all, it is a little bit in the middle of nowhere.
Very poor choice of girls: only 3, 2 of them fuckable. I took the most smiling one - even if I know that it is not a criteria or a warranty of something.

Her name is veronika if I remember well, and I can't find here on the website.

Her body - a 10 without any doubt.

But things turn bad quickly. She started to ask for a massage...well with such body I was OK to do that, I found the experience quite interestign and I started tp try to warm her up... Instead of that; she felt asleep in 10 minutes!

Then I almost wake up her, she gave me a 30 seconds blow job and then ask for a fuck...So bad... during the fuck she turned her face to watch TV... and I couldn't get hard anymore.

Then, I put out the condom and asked her to give a hand... but then, after 1 minute she put a condom and started to suck.... and felt asleep with my dick inside her mouth after 5 minutes!!!

No need to say that I would never return to that place. Poor choice, far away, bad experience.

[QUOTE=Passepartout]... but then, after 1 minute she put a condom and started to suck.... and felt asleep with my dick inside her mouth after 5 minutes!!!...[/QUOTE]

Too bad Passepartout :) I never experienced thing like that and it looks funny for me now at home reading this, but I know it was pretty sad and bad for you went there to get real fun.

If I was you I told all this to the boss or mamasun, cause they cannot imagine their girls sleep instead of work, maybe the mamasun or boss, could also thank you and give such an half hour with somebody else, cause the only way to know if they have to kick off one girl, is from complaints from customers.

Never be shy to report things like this, it is just the true you are gonna to report.

However thanks to share this with us.

[QUOTE=Passepartout]Then, I put out the condom and asked her to give a hand... but then, after 1 minute she put a condom and started to suck.... and felt asleep with my dick inside her mouth after 5 minutes!!!

No need to say that I would never return to that place. Poor choice, far away, bad experience.[/QUOTE]Poor girl... what was it, like her 3rd shift in a row? Or was she on a 3 day cocaine bender?

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Poor girl... what was it, like her 3rd shift in a row? Or was she on a 3 day cocaine bender?[/QUOTE]

Or like that one I got in privat in Prague in maj...she was so tired that at the end of the session I asked her why.... she said I went to disco with friends drinking and dance till the morning....she joked telling me was thinking to pay one hour to her boss so she could sleep...but at least I got quite good sex :)

[url]http://www.ulanskaya.com/Hotel.Home.php?lang=en[/url]

Renovated, quiet. Single from 5450 RUR . For guiests after eleven you should pay officially 1500RUR (as they say on web-site), but on practice it can be 600RUR (have no idea why, may be they count half-day). This includes breakfast. Nice food. In a reataurant during the day also possible to eat. Simple menu, but the cook is really nice. A portion of decent meat for 200RUR ;)) Internet in the room. Location - metro Chistiye Prudi, 2 minutes walking from Lukoil building.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Poor girl... what was it, like her 3rd shift in a row? Or was she on a 3 day cocaine bender?[/QUOTE]

This is what I was wondering... I don't know but even when you are absolutly tired, you can't get asleep like that...So i guess it was more too much cocaine...

I didn't report to the management for 2 reasons:

- my poor russian
- and i had some pity for the girl... I know I shouldn't but, well...I consider that paying for sex is always the luck of the draw... It was not my day, that's it. I don't care too much. But just avoid this place in the future.

Guys,

I would like to share with you a terrible news that I just had tonight. I have just discover, at 300 meters far from where I live, same street, same adress, just a different "podbiezd", a new massage saloon that had just open!!!

It means that i can get laid for 1500 /2000 rubles when I want, 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. The only thing I have to do is make a call - put my shoes on - walk 300 meters - and that's it!

The problem is that I am not the kind of man who knows how to resist to another beer in a bar if it is offered gently. I am not the kind of man who would order a green salad in a top end restaurant. No.

My plans for the next years were to become rich and make a lot of money. I think I need to redefine with myself a new BP.

:-)


For those who are interested it is this saloon:

[url]http://relaxi.ru/[/url]

Not bad. usual things.

[quote=passepartout]
it means that i can get laid for 1500 /2000 rubles when i want, 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. the only thing i have to do is make a call - put my shoes on - walk 300 meters - and that's it!
[/quote]

so, you've been there, passepartout? cuz on their website, they don't mention anything about laying pipe (fs); just 15 different types of massage, peep show, lesbo show, etc, etc... so, appears to be your typical rub-n-tug, at least by the website.

nevertheless, good location and prices, and several of the girls appear to have killer bods. definitely worth scouting out!

Ppt,

I hate to burst your bubble, but I have to agree with Pizdyets. This place is strictly a run-n-tug joint. There are a couple reviews on sextalk; one of the guys said he was greeted at the door by 3 goblina (goblins). Doesn't sound promising, no matter how convenient.

It seems there are fewer and fewer temptations in Moscow nowadays.

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]Ppt,

I hate to burst your bubble, but I have to agree with Pizdyets. This place is strictly a run-n-tug joint. There are a couple reviews on sextalk; one of the guys said he was greeted at the door by 3 goblina (goblins). Doesn't sound promising, no matter how convenient.

It seems there are fewer and fewer temptations in Moscow nowadays.[/QUOTE]

In downtown Moscow (which I loosely classify as anything inside 3rd Ring), there must be at least 60 salons. In the same area, there are roughly 30 distinct metro stations (lumping together the ones where you transfer). You're rarely further than a 10 minute walk from the closest station in downtown. Assuming the salons are also more-or-less uniformly distributed, that would imply that you'd rarely be further than 7 minutes from one, which is about the limit of your sight in downtown. So, at pretty much any point in Moscow, you should be within sight of a salon.

To think of it another way, the highest density of Starbucks anywhere in the world is Manhattan with 170 within a 5 mile radius. If you were to apply the same density to the area within the 3rd Ring, you'd get approximately the same number as salons (65).

In other words, though there may be a salon in every dark alley way, it doesn't mean that each and every one will deliver the goods. Caveat emptor.

[QUOTE=It Travel]Some pal here has already sponosred these two pigs?

They are a little bit over age for me (both 26) and their names are Marina (the light coloured hair onre) and Inna (the black one)... On ground they do all and seem nice, one speaks also English...

Just asking info for my next trip...

IT[/QUOTE]


... but these two pigs for a sponsorship from Fridaay evening to Monday morning asked for 3.000 EUR for both... plus resturants, clubs, presents... so the total will go at 4.000-4.500 Crazy!!!

IT

IT,

If the girls wanted 3000r and you spent a total of 4,500r, then this means that you spent 1,500r for a weekend of clubs, restaurants and gifts.

So, basically, you took them to Yolki Palki and then bought them a matrioshka doll???

Guys,

don't misunderstand me.

The fact that the saloon was only 300 meters away from home is a big chance, as i could be drunk, tired, coudl eb frozen, etc...

That's it. For the quality itself:

- no sex, only massage with a hand job to finish
- i found the appartment / bedroom / bathroom not very clean
- 2 girls only: 1 gobblins, and the 1 i have chosen with an amazing body
- massage was bad, as well as hand job. The intersting part was that she alloed my to touch her a lot, and i make her cum, which was nice.

I would not specially recommend to forum members to go, but for me, as it is really convenient, I would probably return!

Passepartout, about your experience with that girl, how can i understand if a girl (in general) is a cocaine addicted or not?

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]IT,

If the girls wanted 3000r and you spent a total of 4,500r, then this means that you spent 1,500r for a weekend of clubs, restaurants and gifts.

So, basically, you took them to Yolki Palki and then bought them a matrioshka doll???[/QUOTE]

The figures are correct but for two nice beauties and they are not RUR they are EUR and I think it's tooo much!!!! and I'm just putting out experiences... I will not go with two 26 y.o. for 3000 € for a weekend :eek: , when standard sponsorization fee in Moscow for a teen beauty is 100.000-150.000 RUR month...

They told me they want to go to exclusive restaurants clubs etc for three days and in moscow it will be 500 € a day... simple... and for 500 € day I can get two teens and do their little pink rear hole!

By the way I go to Yelki Palki and it's good ;) the grill is good... and you see what you get!
IT

[QUOTE=It Travel]The figures are correct but for two nice beauties and they are not RUR they are EUR and I think it's tooo much!!!! and I'm just putting out experiences... I will not go with two 26 y.o. for 3000 € for a weekend :eek: , when standard sponsorization fee in Moscow for a teen beauty is 100.000-150.000 RUR month...

They told me they want to go to exclusive restaurants clubs etc for three days and in moscow it will be 500 € a day... simple... and for 500 € day I can get two teens and do their little pink rear hole!

By the way I go to Yelki Palki and it's good ;) the grill is good... and you see what you get!
IT[/QUOTE]I don't want to offend you IT, but I think the girls were just having a good laugh and playing on the internet. Like "let's see how far this will go..."

A girlfriend of mine had a profile on destiny.com.ua and was getting offers from men all the time, so sometimes to just play around she'd act interested. She was getting some pretty strange offers. One Italian guy was willing to pay 500 € IIRC if she would [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140][CodeWord140][/url] in his mouth. Hope it wasn't you making the offer IT... :) Or maybe she took you up on the offer after I left town? ))

But yes, 3000 € is an insane price for average teen pussy. This quality of girl is available in droves at any medium-level disco on any given weekend. They aren't "elite class" by any means and probably wouldn't even be able to get into one of the elite clubs without somebody escorting them in.

You should be able to rent the entire 1st year class at cosmetology institute for that price, including the teacher. At the very least 3000 € should be for the whole month of oncall service for those 2.

IT,

So.. what are you saying, exactly??

Was your post a theoretical exercise? Or did you actually have these two girls for an entire weekend???

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]IT,

So.. what are you saying, exactly??

Was your post a theoretical exercise? Or did you actually have these two girls for an entire weekend???[/QUOTE]

I'm just making an economic deal with them but they asked 3000 EUR not RUR for a weekend it seems a little bit too much...

IT

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]I don't want to offend you IT, but I think the girls were just having a good laugh and playing on the internet. Like "let's see how far this will go..."

A girlfriend of mine had a profile on destiny.com.ua and was getting offers from men all the time, so sometimes to just play around she'd act interested. She was getting some pretty strange offers. One Italian guy was willing to pay 500 € IIRC if she would [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140][CodeWord140][/url] in his mouth. Hope it wasn't you making the offer IT... :) Or maybe she took you up on the offer after I left town? ))

But yes, 3000 € is an insane price for average teen pussy. This quality of girl is available in droves at any medium-level disco on any given weekend. They aren't "elite class" by any means and probably wouldn't even be able to get into one of the elite clubs without somebody escorting them in.

You should be able to rent the entire 1st year class at cosmetology institute for that price, including the teacher. At the very least 3000 € should be for the whole month of oncall service for those 2.[/QUOTE]

Agree totally I think that a fair price for a fine teen (max 20) Russian blondinka for three days and nights of sponsorship is something in 1000 USD area... unlimited cumming of course! ;)

a promise is a promise. so especially for you pidziets and passepartout, here is a report about the 5 days i recently passed in russia. this was only my 3rd visit to russia so i'm still a real newbie. having started to learn the lingo has proved useful but i realize that i will need much more vocabulary to get the best out of this country.

saturday. day 1.

arrived in shem'vo mid pm, checked in at royal meridien national 3 hours later (i don't know how people living there cope with the traffic.) and rushed to a business dinner. pretended i was exhausted so i escaped about midnight. didn't know exactly where to go first. remembering the precious advice from pizdyets, i thought eye-candying would be a good start and so i walked to night flight. cover 900 rb which i ended up not paying as i introduced myself to the gm. he even offered me a drink. lots of hot dievushki around, some really stunning, most of them more than doable, but i wasn't ready to pay $400 for short time and god knows how much for an all-nighter, which was my goal. still i fully agree that it is a must-go place for a first visit, just to have an idea of the talent available in moscow. i considered going to a strip-club but thought it'd be more fun with a wingman so went to a place where i had a fairly good time before, namely hot dog. plus i had to see the renovated toilet which had been mentioned in this forum. found a taxi for "treestah" (300, originally 500, basically i ended up negotiating every taxi, probably not enough though) and arrived around 1 am. i first checked #34 to see if i could find assorti but without a phone number i realized this was not possible.

so off to hot dog. well the place may be freshly painted and shiny but boy the toilets still stink really bad. you better hold your breath while you [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord134][CodeWord134][/url] if old [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord109][CodeWord109][/url] smell is not your cup of tea (we'll come back to that later. .). anyway even if the talent was no match to nf, there were a couple of potential preys (or is it predators? ) among the fairly large crowd. i may have waited a bit too long as when i felt like it was time to go (about 3:30 am) the crowd was thinner. the best-looking blondinka was still asking for 400 euros though and wouldn't bulge so i chatted with olga, as her square features and long legs attracted me. and she was only asking for 200 euros plus 1000 rb to get out. back to the hotel (no question asked, totally girl-friendly) where i found out she wanted 300 euros. i told her we agreed for 200, she said i had misunderstood her, and as that stage i didn't want to [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140][CodeWord140][/url] her off so i counted 250 to which she agreed. well i did overpay considering her talents and her sagging tits which were well hidden by her lovely top at hd. she started the session by a "sex massage" (she spoke a bit of english), but all in all the session was average, short bj, didn't allow daty (said she preferred dick. .), finished her doggy so that i didn't see her tits i wasn't excited enough for a repeat so i slept for a few hours. she woke me up by massaging me again and initiated a second session, she rode me well but i could have done without it. retrospectively found her quite friendly (and not pushy at all as the two other visits to hd proved it), with a nice face, but her breasts and her lack of passion in bed didn't really do it for me.

sunday. day 2.

had an early pm meeting that day with a cutie contacted through mamba. i have had a few interesting contacts through the site but it is time consuming, and i am sure it can yield to good results if you are ready to invest the time. although we had exchanged a lot, i quickly had a feeling that this would never materialize in sex and this turned out to be the case. but natalia was indeed very cute, and a nice guide to show me around moscow. her complete lack of english and my limited russian didn't make it very easy, and we kissed each other goodbye after a few hours knowing this couldn't go anywhere. it was 8 pm by now and i decided to check club che and raise souvenirs of a fun evening with the doc a few months earlier. had some nachos (food's ok, in case you wonder, though i doubt), the live band not bad but the crowd was a bit thin. chatted with svetlana, but i wasn't interested in her and threw away her number after having promised to call her back. too many better options in russia. che is definitely a place to go if you have the opportunity to see the dievushka on a second date, since they are not shy about giving their phone number. passepartout and docteur skank will reckon, i'm sure. scoring on first night is not impossible (as a matter of fact i am pretty sure that a tall dane who was making out pretty heavily with a little spinner nailed her that night) but not easy. called it a night shortly after midnight as i had to get a few hours of sleep in anticipation of monday night. funny thing is that pizdyets whom i had contacted to meet on the said monday night stopped by around that time and left when he saw that a fat and ugly drunk blond was the only person dancing.

monday – day 3.

after a full business day that ended late evening with an excellent dinner (but man fancy restaurants ain't cheap here) i finally got the opportunity to meet with pizdyets and a friend of his. we started to get warm up at etazh, which is indeed a good place to hang out and eye the short-dressed babes before they go to work just across, at nf. we nailed down quite a few large beers. a little mistake considering that we then went to hot dog where each session to the bathroom proved a real challenge smell-wise. so you've been warned, guys! anyway we had a great time talking about russian girls (what else? ) and scouted the talent around. a group of non-pros proved to pizdyets friend and myself, as we thought that a few of them seemed doable, that either pizdyets has much more acute eyes, or higher standards (also) or less affected by the beer goggles. it was getting late now and there was a particularly cute little thing who attracted mongers like honey do to bears but strangely enough hadn't been picked up yet. so i pretended that my friend was very interested to chat her up. i forgot her name but not her price. she quoted me a "good price": $1000 for the night (or whatever was left of it) and $700 for short time! this left me so speechless that i didn't even ask what it included. time was running, options were getting slimmer and i wanted to try something new, so pizdyets suggested a salon to which i wasn't going to object. off to fantasy's ([url]http://www.fantasys. nu[/url]). arrived in the street, a few calls made, guy comes out to pick us up (obviously everything takes place in russki yezik so you better have a little command of the language to go through these steps), up the stairs and bingo, 12 or so girls in lingerie on display. pizdyets didn't have the choice since tanya ([url]http://www.fantasys. nu/girls. phtml? id=40[/url]) grabbed him immediately but he didn't seem to mind i had a hard time making up my mind but eventually choose the tallest girl, a bit more fleshy than i normally like but with a very cute face. her name was innessa [url]http://www.fantasys. nu/girls. phtml? id=2[/url]. piz wisely ordered whisky to get the girls in the mood. i hadn't realized yet that we would be fucking in the same room but that didn't deter us from having fun. a quick shower and inna pushed me on the bed and started to give me a nice bj. i reciprocated and licked inna' shaved pussy, as i enjoy and i wanted to prove her that frenchman live up to their reputation. interestingly she didn't seem to respond a lot, she was very directive in fact as up to where to put pressure. while my ego did get hurt (i thought i was skilled.), i didn't forget why i was here for and started banging her on a chair. she squeezed my dick and i came after a few minutes, a bit too early to my taste. forgot to get confirmation but are salons' policy "one-shot only"? in the meantime on the bed piz was fisting tanya like there was no tomorrow. she seems to really like him, although she wasn't against the idea of me doing her on a next visit. i guess i'll have to go without you, pizdyets anyway a fun session well worth the 10000 roubles (girls and drinks, for both of us), if i remember well.

tuesday – day 4

the lack of sleep made it difficult to recover fully but i was excited because of a business trip to krasnodar. my russian business partner promised me that we would go to a strip-club after dinner, so i had high expectations. well, well, unfortunately the dinner finished very late, and the guy wanted to sleep. fuck that! i briefly considered going by myself to the said club but then the fatigue hit me and i said to myself that tomorrow would be a better day.

wednesday – day 5

and it was indeed! i was free for dinner so invited another mamba potential freebie – a flight attendant. she looked mighty fine on pictures but she must be a photoshop expert. bad skin complexion, a few extra kilos around the waist, strong legs, i thought standards would be way higher in that industry! hopefully her friend was samara was much cuter and the dinner ended up being not a total waste. the mamba girl kissed me goodbye, gave me her # and ask me to call her back but this won't obviously happen. now the real night could start in great style: we'd meet with pizdyets and passepartout. we wanted to hit garazh first but it was a busy evening and despite our cool looks we were not let in. short walk to etazh on tverskaya, a few drinks to get to know each other and discuss options. btw, there were a few really good looking babes, notably a blond sitting next to us that must have been a devil in bed, as pizdyets guessed by her attitude. i wouldn't disagree. club che seemed to be a good way to start, so club che it was. many drinks, plenty of chatting and dancing, we easily spent 2 hours there and had fun. not too many girls, but a few doables. a brunette with a girl-next-door faced and attitude was particularly attractive, but upon further investigation she turned out to be married. and her husband was there and watching her. but for my last night in moscow i wanted an all-nighter so hot dog sounded like the best option. a short ride in a stinky car and we arrived safely. it was much busier than on monday and there was plenty of talent. more drinks (i don't even recall what i was drinking at that point), my two isg colleagues chatted some of the african girls (cute but i wasn’t in russia for that! ). can't remember how much they were asking but pizdyets will, i think. i asked a few blondinkas around and they were all asking 15k for lt, some even 20k. of course there was room for discussion. that's when pizdyets convinced me about a beautiful brunette that looked very sweet. half greek half russia, beautiful eyes, i was quickly sold. she quoted 15k first, quickly agreed for 10k and upon leaving the club where my 2 team mates were still drinking, piz told me to talk her down to 8k. i'm sure it was possible but i stopped at 9k. i thought she was worth it. btw, she didn't ask for 1k to get out, so i feel like i got cheated by the first girl i picked up here.

during the ride back to the hotel, elena was holding me hand, gently kissed me so i thought i was in for a good time. it was better than that. we had some wine back at the hotel (pokrovka, btw a great hotel, each room is a suite dotted with a kitchen and a living room, not too expensive, a bit away from the main centres of interests maybe but overall a great value in that range), listen to music and started to make out on the sofa. a quick shower and than 2 rounds of non-stop gfe treatment. i am not sure she would treat everybody like she did me because we really clicked. in fact we didn't have sex but we made love passionately. i am not a veteran at p4p, but i can't recall having such gfe with a pro. i turn the alarm on so that this would leave us enough time for a third round in the morning. after sleeping in each other arms, i woke up and started to gently caress her. first her arms, then her back, her legs, reached for her pussy, she then started to gently stroke my cock. i started to be pretty aroused, and i checked my watch to make sure that i would have plenty of time. fuck! i had only 15 minutes left before my driver would pick me up and take me to the airport! got confused with time difference and i fucked up with the alarm needless to say i was mad at myself. elena seemed genuinely sorry for me as well. we kissed each other good-bye and i checked-out with a hard-on in my jeans and a smile on my face.

if you've been though all this you know i'll be back. i'm hooked. thanks again to pizdyets and passepartout for your energy, your advice and your company. the world wouldn't be as much fun without isg. so thank you also jackson!

[size=-2][b][u]editor's note[/u]:[/b] [blue]i would suggest that the author or another forum member consider posting a link to this report in the reports of distinction thread. please [url=http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?]click here[/url] for more information.[/blue][/size]

Have no idea if she has already been Skanked or Bezzared... ;) but frankly for my taste she is close to perfection...

21/164/44, really skinny, superb mouth, brown/red hair, freckled skin... I suppose that pink is really pink there! Two problems... no anal and 15.000 RUR/night (expensive but not crazy)... and she told photos are real.

[url]http://flirt.com.ua/kubrina2008/[/url]
(you can see her also if you have pw of moslove and all the others with the same database)

Some member already nailed her? Because if she is a log in bed it's nothing to have... In some aspects she reminds me on Lol.... in Kiev...

IT

[QUOTE=It Travel]Have no idea if she has already been Skanked or Bezzared... ;) ...[/QUOTE]

She is beautiful...so I wish you she will be soon IT Travelled ;)

In my opinion with a good work with wise and smart words, you will be able to convince her to get anal, from my experience most of girls do not want anal or never tried before, so they are at least a bit curious to try it..., or they had anal with a man that did not use lube, so with enough patience, you should be able to convince her to try, at least this is what I wish you :)

Hey Mindighet Lechat,

It was great hanging out with you and Passepartout for sure.

Some clarifications below:

[QUOTE=Mindighet Lechat]I hadn't realized yet that we would be fucking in the same room but that didn't deter us from having fun. [/QUOTE]Yeah, since they have a dozen sources of revenue, yet only 4 rooms, they try and make guys double up. If you threaten to walk out, you might get separate rooms, but not always.

[QUOTE]A quick shower and Inna pushed me on the bed and started to give me a nice BJ. I reciprocated and licked Inna' shaved pussy, as I enjoy and I wanted to prove her that Frenchman live up to their reputation. Interestingly she didn't seem to respond a lot, she was very directive in fact as up to where to put pressure. While my ego did get hurt (I thought I was skilled.), I didn't forget why I was here for and started banging her on a chair. She squeezed my dick and I came after a few minutes, a bit too early to my taste. [/QUOTE]You were thinking with your little head that night. I've had my eye on Inna for a while now, but I've found that she looks totally "sterva" (like a cold-hearted B-I-T-C-H) and I tend to go for the girls who look genuinely interested in getting it on with me. For example. Like Tanya.

[QUOTE]Forgot to get confirmation but are salons' policy "one-shot only"? [/QUOTE]At the ones I've been to (including the Elit/Charm/Fantasy cartel), it's totally based on time. If you can squeeze off 3 in an hour, it's still 4K. Extra services (lesbo, anal, double/tag team) have additional fees associated with them, but I've never gone there, so can't report as to rates.

[QUOTE]In the meantime on the bed Piz was fisting Tanya like there was no tomorrow. She seems to really like him, although she wasn't against the idea of me doing her on a next visit. I guess I'll have to go without you, Pizdyets [/QUOTE]I'd recommend her to anyone. She's a total animal. Not the smallest girl by any stretch of the imagination, but her face is beautiful and her attitude is a nice balance between playful and lusty.

[QUOTE]Anyway a fun session well worth the 10000 roubles (girls and drinks, for both of us), if I remember well. [/QUOTE]Yes, you remembered well. 2 girls at 4K/hr + 4 whiskys at 500R. I find that service is almost always good at these places if you buy the girls a drink, sit and chat for a few minutes to get to know them a little before getting to business.

[QUOTE]my two ISG colleagues chatted some of the African girls (cute but I wasn’t in Russia for that! ). Can't remember how much they were asking but Pizdyets will, I think. [/QUOTE]I was blitzed by that point, but as I recall it was the typical bullshit of asking 15K and me talking her down to 8K. Passepartout might remember. After the lights came up around 5am, I wanted to take one to breakfast to decide if I really wanted to go there or not (while sobering up), but she wanted to go straight to business. So I told her it was her choice: free breakfast with a good chance for closing the deal after, or go home alone. She insisted on going back immediately and I walked.

[QUOTE]Btw, she didn't ask for 1K to get out, so I feel like I got cheated by the first girl I picked up here. [/QUOTE]Jake and I have been discussing HD's female cover policy for a while now. My theory is that the okhraniki charge the girls somewhat arbitarily based upon looks, frequency of being in the club, time and day of the week, and if they hook up or not. Unlike NF, not all the girls in HD are working, and they seem to not charge those girls. Yet some WGs are trying to fly under the radar and not get charged cover. Case in point. A frumpy blondinka who I've seen there on a couple occassions told my buddy that she dresses in "plain clothes" in order to avoid paying cover. But I think she avoids getting paying customers that way too.

[QUOTE]I am not sure she would treat everybody like she did me because we really clicked. [/QUOTE]I don't know either, BB, but I'm willing to try and find out. : P

I mean, someone will need to take care of her until your next trip!

Can anybody provide any recommendations for reliable escorts in Moscow?

(good value for money, don't bait and switch, what you see on their website is what you get!)

Thanks!

[QUOTE=Wasser66]Can anybody provide any recommendations for reliable escorts in Moscow?

(good value for money, don't bait and switch, what you see on their website is what you get!)

Thanks![/QUOTE]

I'm tempted to say RTFF, but it's not like I'm a tenured member of ISG either. Instead, I'd suggest you take what's been put out there, and report back your own findings (which I see you've done in the past). Here's Stravinsky's "private office" which has girls verified from the Russian forums:
[url]http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showpost.php?p=779473&postcount=2105[/url]

It'd also help if you'd describe what you're looking for. Are you planning to bring this girl to business functions? Set up a customer with a plausible "studentka" who wants to "practice her English"? Or is it more just dinner, dancing, and gettin' down and dirty?

Hey BB what a report!

Great night for sure we had all together.

I have slept until 13.00 and arrived at work still drunk from the night... For you ISG members, if you meet BB or Pyzdiets, be careful as these guys never stop to drink!

Hi guys, (and maybe girls)

I've not been to Moscow for a while. With all the recent currency fluctuations what is the going rate for a NF girl? You would think that the price would remain the same, but I was surprised how well the more educated pro's and strippers monitor the exchange rate. I had a stripper in Atlanta tell me I could afford to pay more because of the strong pound at the time. WTF

Also is the old Boar House now called Hotdog? What are the going prices there now? I ask because I don't want to poison the water and pay too much, otherwise it makes it more expensive for everyone.

Cheers,

Anthony

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]
I'm still recovering from a long weekend which continued right into Monday morning with Jake993's return to Moskva. [/QUOTE]
This is stop #1 of a three city, three country tour including Moscow, Ashgabat (Turkmenistan) and Kiev. Unfortunately, I booked a flight to Moscow that arrived at SVO at 2:00 AM. I checked with Mr. P ahead of time to see if he wanted to get together upon my arrival for a least a drinks and perhaps even some debauchery. I gave him plenty of opportunities to pass but he hung in there and agreed to meet me regardless of how late it was. What a party animal. It was 4:00 AM by the time I got to my apartment which is VERY conveniently located very near to Itazh which gave me just enough time to drop my stuff, brush my teeth and go over to meet Pizdyets.

As he stated in an earlier post, there were actually about a half dozen girls in Itazh at that hour a few of which were working girls who may have just gotten off shift at Night Flight. After a few drinks and smoking a little “Hubbly Bubbly, Mr. P was a good enough local host to take me personally down to Charm’el ([url]http://www.charmel.biz/[/url]) , which was just 10 minutes walk down Tverkoye Bulvar. Pizdyets made the usual phone call to arrange our audience with the girls and within minutes a smiling fellow came out to meet us and guided us in. We were led to a nicely decorated room and about a half dozen girls came in for us to choose from.

Being the gentleman that he is, Mr. P let me have first pick and I chose Eva who, while not THE hottest looking girl in the room, she gave a knowing little wink when I scanned the line-up remembering Pizdyet’s experience in his previous post on the subject.

The clock was ticking and she led me off to the shower. As Pizdyet pointed out, they do a really good job of patrolling the halls making sure that two clients never run in to each other in the hall coming and going to and from the bathroom – quite unlike the locker room atmosphere of your typical Brazilian Termas.

Once back in the room, we got down to business. Eva appeared to have lost a little weight from when her picture was take for the web site. She was really a hot little thing considering the hour and quite energetic and enthusiastic. CBJ which, though not ideal, was decent and considering that I had been on a plane less than four hours earlier I didn’t feel like lobbying for a BBBJ. We went around the bases in terms of positions and when we only had a few minutes left I noticed that she has pre-lubed her back side so I am sure that anal would have been on the menu had I pursued it. Note to self for next time. BTW, both Eva and I had drinks (cognac and single malt) which added considerably to the bill, but what the heck. First time in a Moscow salon so why not get the full treatment?

When we emerged into the light of day after the hour in paradise, the streets were buzzing with the activity of commuters heading to work on a sunny Monday morning. We strolled back to Tverskaya and caught some breakfast at the Café House. The waitress gave us a knowing smirk as she probably guessed what we had been doing.

My head hit the pillow at 8:00 AM on the dot and I slept like a log until noon. Welcome to Moscow. As I am typing this, I am getting ready to pack a bag and head off to the airport for a few days in Ashgabat, the second stop on our little “tour”.

[QUOTE=Jake993]
Mr. P was a good enough local host to take me personally down to Charm’el ([url]http://www.charmel.biz/[/url]) , which was just 10 minutes walk down Tverskoy Bulvar. Pizdyets made the usual phone call to arrange our audience with the girls and within minutes a smiling fellow came out to meet us and guided us in. We were led to a nicely decorated room and about a half dozen girls came in for us to choose from.
[/QUOTE]

Let me also mention that Passepartout's reporting of Charmel's recent rate hike was 100% correct. When asked why they charge 4500R/hr vs Fantasy's/Elit's 4000R/hr, they succinctly answered "Because we're better." To which I replied "And more modest too!" That got a laugh. Drinks are also 50% more expensive, BTW.

Time to wean myself from the P4P and get back to nailing freebies. Any potential wingmen out there up to the task? :)

[QUOTE=AnthonyUK]With all the recent currency fluctuations what is the going rate for a NF girl?[/QUOTE]I don't go that often (read: virtually never), but I'm hearing $300-$500 ST, $500-$1000 LT. Of course it also depends on time, day... and you.

[QUOTE]Also is the old Boar House now called Hotdog?[/QUOTE]Yes - read Mindighet Lechat 's recent report, including a vivid description of the toilets there.

[QUOTE]What are the going prices there now?[/QUOTE]I can state this with a little more authority. Inexplicably, even the ugly hos at HD are asking 10K rubles for LT. Cuties start at 15K and gorgeous model-types (yes, there are some there) are asking 20K or more. That said, you can usually talk the cuties down to 8K. But, as always, YMMV. And tell her in advance that you're not going to pay any penalty fee "to the house" for her to leave with you.

[QUOTE=Mindighet Lechat]Having started to learn the lingo has proved useful but I realize that I will need much more vocabulary to get the best out of this country.[/QUOTE][QUOTE]Her complete lack of English and my limited Russian didn't make it very easy[/QUOTE][QUOTE]obviously everything takes place in Russki yezik so you better have a little command of the language to go through these steps[/QUOTE]Mindighet Lechat,

Sounds like you had a grand time in Moskva. But then, with a good friend like Pizdyets to guide you, it's hard to go wrong.

What interested me were your comments about how helpful a knowledge of the Russian language can be and how difficult it is to get the full benefit of a trip to Russia without it.

Your post is one of the best arguments yet for a separate thread for the Russian language. I have suggested to Jackson several times that everyone here could benefit from a separate thread for "Russian Language Phrases", or something similar, as have many other members who visit Russia and eastern Europe and post on this board.

Unfortunately, Jackson has always refused to give us one.

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]Your post is one of the best arguments yet for a separate thread for the Russian language. I have suggested to Jackson several times that everyone here could benefit from a separate thread for "Russian Language Phrases", or something similar, as have many other members who visit Russia and eastern Europe and post on this board.

Unfortunately, Jackson has always refused to give us one.[/QUOTE]That thread and the "dating Russian women" thread are both missing. Both would be a great boon to us all.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]That thread and the "dating Russian women" thread are both missing. Both would be a great boon to us all.[/QUOTE]

Well, the China board has "Chinese Words and Phrases" as well as "Chinese Women - Opinions and Advice", so there is precedent. I can see the argument that the Chinese language is more difficult than Russian, but I'd argue that Russian women are far more complex than Chinese women...

Buying a Russian phrasebook is essential. Key elements missed by the book would include processes involving:

1. Calling an escort agency

2. Relaying your address

3. Telling the ladies how to get to the door of your flat

These are essential survival skills when getting *****s ex-Moscow. Doing things like buying train tickets and fiddling with registrations are best handled with the assistance of a friendly ugly girl or camslut.

Moscow and Saint Petersburg are capital cities for good sex in the world.

I would like to merge Russian good sex with beautiful Sunny places. I know a lot of Russian girls like to have a holiday for example in Dubai, in Caribbean islands, etc.

Which are the holiday places outside Russia where we can find nice Russian girls easily?

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]Moscow and Saint Petersburg are capital cities for good sex in the world.

I would like to merge Russian good sex with beautiful Sunny places. I know a lot of Russian girls like to have a holiday for example in Dubai, in Caribbean islands, etc.

Which are the holiday places outside Russia where we can find nice Russian girls easily?[/QUOTE]Prague, Alanya, Antalya,Hurghada, Varna, Golden Sands, Paralia, Chalkidiki, Lindos etc.

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]Which are the holiday places outside Russia where we can find nice Russian girls easily?[/QUOTE]Try Antalya, Turkey.

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]Try Antalya, Turkey.[/QUOTE]

I've travelled to Turkey, Egypt and Cyprus - all popular vacation destinations due to the fact that they're cheap and don't require Russians to get a visa in advance. But all these places have poor reputations (in Moscow, at least), and it's not "cool" for a top-notch dyev to tell her girlfriends that she's going to Antalya or Sharm al Sheik on vacation. They are essentially the vacation destination equivalent of Papa John's or Karma Bar, and though plenty of interested (and loose) Russian girls are guaranteed, the quality of the girls will be markedly lower than in locations in the EU such as Ibiza, Mallorca or Mykonos.

Not saying Antalya is bad for picking up - just wanted to give the full picture.

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]I've travelled to Turkey, Egypt and Cyprus - all popular vacation destinations due to the fact that they're cheap and don't require Russians to get a visa in advance. But all these places have poor reputations (in Moscow, at least), and it's not "cool" for a top-notch dyev to tell her girlfriends that she's going to Antalya or Sharm al Sheik on vacation. They are essentially the vacation destination equivalent of Papa John's or Karma Bar, and though plenty of interested (and loose) Russian girls are guaranteed, the quality of the girls will be markedly lower than in locations in the EU such as Ibiza, Mallorca or Mykonos.

Not saying Antalya is bad for picking up - just wanted to give the full picture.[/QUOTE]I agree that russian women abroad tend to be very careful and follow guidelines.It is much better to meet them in their home country.

In Turkey, Russian dyevs like to bang the locals, I even once saw a Russian forum for girls discussing how good various hotel employees were in bed (sorry, can't remember the name, or give a link).
Egypt (Sharm El Sheikh, especially) is a better bet in that respect because most Russian girls steer clear of the Egyptians. But remember it's a beach holiday, and on a beach holiday girls of all origins want to get a bang for their buck, and not a buck for their bang ;)
For Russian freebies, Moscow remains the best place. There is no other place on Earth where I have scored freebies nine nights in a row. The advantage is that in Moscow, there are places where the good girls go, places where the prostitutes go, places where the freebie sluts go. In a holiday resort, you get the good girls along with the bad girls and thus, waste a lot of time. Also you cannot easily have more than one girl at a time because you can't say you are "busy this evening".
Holidays are generally excellent though for scoring unsatisfied horny Russian women aged 30-40, holidaying without their husbands (if that's your cup of tea of course). Pretty typical example: Hilton, Sharm El Sheikh, I meet a bunch of 35-year olds at the all-inclusive bar, after 30 seconds one tells me she wants to "read me bed-time stories tonight". We head for the club, another one is quick to take me by the hand and does not let go till she tells me, 1 1/2 hours later, that "we should get out of here" ;)

When choosing a hotel, go to tophotel.ru and check how many reviews there are for any given hotel in a particular city, which compared to hotel size tells you how many Russians go there. Then check which ones of these are party places, and try to get an all-inclusive package holiday there with a Western agency.
If the hotel is full of Russians your chances are excellent: a) less competition from foreigners, b) hot dyevs everywhere you look, c) the dyevs get drunk from the early afternoon as it's all inclusive and d) there is very little competition from Russian men, as they either arrive with their girlfriends or else get drunk as skunks day and night, again because of the all-inclusive concept. ;)

[QUOTE=Hecker]I agree that russian women abroad tend to be very careful and follow guidelines.It is much better to meet them in their home country.[/QUOTE]

A problem in Egypt, apart from all inclusive hotels, is alcohol - if you buy a cocktail in a club there is often hardly any alcohol in it, and if there is, it is usually very expensive. That means the girls don't get as drunk as they would back home. Also, I don't think you can just get a bottle of vodka and drink it on the street glubinka-style :)

Actually Kemer and Marmaris in Turkey are very good places for freebies. Marmaris is a party town and it attracts not only Russians but women from all over Europe. I stayed there 3 nights and scored a Polish and a German girl...

Kemer is a bit calmer and it is full of poor Russians. In general quality of clientele there is pretty low. But it has pretty good nightlife. In Kemer, for clubbing try Inferno or Aura, they are next to each other. Pretty high fakhie factor. You won't regret!

Most Turks despise vacationing along the Russians and they stay away from Antalya and the surroundings. More upscale and boutique resorts can be found in Bodrum, Ceshme and Alachatı. Alachatı is excellent for surfing. If you want to hunt Russian dyevs, then Bodrum is a better option, almost no Russians in Ceshme and Alachatı.

It is true that Turkey and Egypt cater to the low income segment of the Russian tourist market, that makes sense business wise. After all most Russians are poor. However, there are plenty of luxury holiday villages which have a fair amount of affluent Russian customers.

Check out:
[url]http://www.adamevehotels.com/hotel.php?lang=en&folder=&file=[/url]
[url]http://www.hillsidebeachclub.com/main.php?sLang=EN[/url]

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]
Time to wean myself from the P4P and get back to nailing freebies. Any potential wingmen out there up to the task? :)[/QUOTE]
Absolutely Dr. Skank,
I just back from Turkmenistan this morning and will be heading to Kiev this afternoon for the weekend. However I am back in Moscow Monday night and staying until Saturday so if you want to hook up for a little freebie hunting, PM me and we can make a plan. I think I remember seeing that you will be in Moscow next week.
Jake

PS - Will write a detailed report about Turkmenistan in the appropriate thread. Very Interesting place. Plenty of ethic Russian girls "on the job" in Ashgabat but if you fancy a Turkmen girl (and some of them are VERY exotic) you can pretty much forget it. I understand that they are brought up in a very conservative environment and pre-marital sex is taboo. See the whole story on the Turkmenistan thread.

So,

A couple of friends of mine, for purposes we shall call Mr. Pink and Mr. Green, started our night at the Real McCoy, (Is there a fake McCoy somewhere else? ) Pink has been, over a year ago, and Green is. Green.

So we are barely in the door when some pug-troll tries to give us a stand up BJ, I'm ignoring her, but its obvious that this place is where the freebies are, provided you've have your beer goggles on.

I used to be a pretty nice guy back in Oz, but have had to learn the Russian way over the last couple of years, which involves up front, abusive, sexual assault, style approaches. Tone it down a notch with Oz style humour, and it works a treat.

So, a couple of 5's and 6's start past us. Making the vulture rounds, I grab each ass in turn, just a gentle squeeze, no response. Then they pass again, squeeze again, no response again. Cool. Girls are on the bar, on the tables, one girl, a little plump, but toned plump, is pulling her top down for me to see her nipples, and pinches herself to make sure I have her attention. WTF!

Anyway, green is back from a week long appointment with the porcelain god, so he's being tame, but he wants revenge cause pink did his ho a few days back while green was laid up in bed (she was nice looking, a great conversationalist and funny, I can see why they both like her), so he starts giving us Long Island Ice Teas. Half litre varieties. And boy did they go down too well. 3 LIIT's later and Pink and I have the attention of the hotties (7's at best) and those two that I grabbed before, they were in our proverbial laps, Pinks dancing up a tea-cup storm, and really getting it on with both girls, sisters, and I'm getting some attention from a blond bombshell (post explosion).

Then it starts to get ugly. 4th LIIT down, the black dressed sister starts getting snooty with Pink, spills her drink on him, and then WHACK! , a full bitchslap! , pinks mentally floored, standing there dumbfounded, and ready for another before my hand grabs hers from the air, now. Aussie girls get into fights as often as Aussie guys, my sisters especially, so I have no qualms whacking a girl, thankfully never had to do it. But she gets all huffy. And the BIG bouncer looking 8ft brick shit-house, steps up to let me know this is not going to happen. Cept, he wasn't, he was just walking past.

Anyway. We down the 5th LIIT, and decide to leave. Pink gets left behind somehow, and green and I go to Che (dead) then PJ's (not bad but not good) green says f-this, HD for some straight forward fun.

Pink joins us, though he has little recollection of it, and we amble in. I have to say. Liit as I was, I saw some quite attractive honeys, all $800-$1000, some average honeys, $500-$600 and some mother fugly ho bags. For. $600-$800. ! WTF

Green gets all bird hunter goo-gaa over some big breasted flesh beast, and wants to take her. Not wanting to be alone, he tells me I have to take one too back to his place. Dang it.

I grab the cutest I could afford, and drag her along, taxi ride back to greens place. Pink follows us out the door and disappears.

We're not even 5 minutes in greens place, when his girl storms out of his room, prepping to go. Me, thinking that she's doing a runner, grabs the keys from the door and check. Greens unconscious, possibly asleep possibly not. I ask him. He says 'nah, fuck her off'

Green is totally green, no Russian, so I ask the girl in my. Barely 5 words Russian. Whats going on.

We argue about misunderstandings, I think she says 60, 000 she's saying 16, 000, I know thats far too much, I say, no thats not going to happen, 10 is normal, she gets all bitchy and starts fucking with me, . I don't know if this girl has just robbed my mate green or not. So I tell her she has to wait while I check

Honestly I have no clue if green had 10k or 20k rubles before, and if she did or didn't take something. He's passed out on the bed.

But she's freaking out at the door, going bunta ballistic, cause its locked. So I go back to her. Ask her whats going on, she starts pushing me around and saying she has friends in the FSB. Whoa. I snap

I hold her head again the door with my elbow/forearm, and tell her in a quiet tone, straight to her eyes, "Ya Rabotayou na FSB, gavarish yesha kto ti znaesh" which is my terrible Russian for. I work in the FSB, say again who you know?

She goes white, I unlock the door, and physically boot her ass out the door. Single turn push with the heel of my foot, she stumbles but does not fall, I lock the door.

The door bell. RING RING RING RING RING.

MY girl comes out of the bathroom, starts asking whats going on.

I turn off the bell, and start the 'panicked foreigner' act, "oh my gawd, she just started demanding money, started saying that she was calling the police and the military, I didn't know what to do. I think she had a knife, she stole all my friends money. I pushed her out of the apartment in time before she might have stabbed me.

Is this your friend? " I ask. In horror, She assures me she is not, calms me down, rings the taxi driver waiting outside to see if she's there. She is. Gets on the phone to her (shit) I start claiming, . "I couldn't understand her, she scared me, started getting all crazy". It works. She talks to the other girl, but decides that the foreigners word is more truthful than the *****,

She calms me down with some kissing, and an attempted BJ, mounts me rides me. , but then I say that I can't, I'm not in the mood now that this happened. (actually I know I'm too wasted to even get close to getting off) I need some sort of assurance.

This kind sweet girl, suggests that she goes, but wants me to call her, go to the movies and hang out with her. I get her number. And she leaves. No cash paid. !

Gawd I love Moscow. And now Pink, my bet is paid, Posted!

[size=-2][b][u]EDITOR'S NOTE[/u]:[/b] [blue]I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please [url=http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?]Click Here[/url] for more information.[/blue][/size]

For Russian freebies, Moscow remains the best place. There is no other place on Earth where I have scored freebies nine nights in a row. The advantage is that in Moscow, there are places where the good girls go, places where the prostitutes go, places where the freebie sluts go.

Interesting comments. Out of curiosity what bars/venues/hang-outs would you recommend for, erm, "good girls" and "freebie sluts"?

[QUOTE=Solntsa Yada]
Then it starts to get ugly. 4th LIIT down, the black dressed sister starts getting snooty with Pink, spills her drink on him, and then WHACK! , a full bitchslap! , pinks mentally floored, standing there dumbfounded, and ready for another before my hand grabs hers from the air, now. Aussie girls get into fights as often as Aussie guys, my sisters especially, so I have no qualms whacking a girl, thankfully never had to do it. But she gets all huffy. And the BIG bouncer looking 8ft brick shit-house, steps up to let me know this is not going to happen. Cept, he wasn't, he was just walking past.[/QUOTE]

SY - great debut posting, but you didn't get that *quite* right. She didn't spill her drink on me. This is how it went down...

The little sister, Vera, (not that little - 23 but looks more like 19) is a bit timid but drunk off her ass, as is often the case in McCoy's. As I recall (which doesn't mean much after that much to drink), she's a solid 7, petite brunette, nice B cups, firm ass, with a sprinkling of freckles on her cute face. She's more than receptive to my advances and we drink, dance and make out a little. The older sister, Olya, is prettier (IMO), a bit taller brunette, but seems a little perturbed that I'm giving that much attention to Vera. She comes up to me and asks to have some of my Long Island. Being the penultimate gentleman that I am, I oblige immediately. Taking a large swig, she then proceeds to blow the entire mouthful into my face, coating me as well as my Zegna suit. I'm completely dumbfounded. What did I do to this girl to deserve this? Out loud, I say, "That's never happened to me before." Olya's smug smile transforms into an intent stare right before she bitchslaps me across the face, cutting my lip in the process. That's when SY comes to the rescue and saves me from any more abuse from this psycho suchka from hell.

Licking my wounds, I regroup at the bar, still in shock. Vera comes over and apologizes, and I ask why her sister hates me. She shrugs her shoulders and says only "Pyanaya..." (she's just drunk). After another Long Island, I start dancing again, and low and behold who comes up and starts grinding her crotch and ass against me but Olya... As they say, there's a fine line between love and hate. I originally thought that she was being protective of her younger sister, but now I realize it was just jealousy. Ah, ya gotta love them Russians!

[QUOTE=Gergiev]Out of curiosity what bars/venues/hang-outs would you recommend for, erm, "good girls" and "freebie sluts"?[/QUOTE]

There are so many bars/clubs in Moscow, that it's hard if not impossible to give a comprehensive list. For freebie sluts, my expat-friendly suggestions with reasonable face control would be Che, Tunnel, Papa's, Karma, Real McCoy and B2. The first four are within easy walking distance from each other, so it's easy to hop from one to another. There should be an ample number of 7s in each of those places, though the majority will be 6s and under (but pathetically easy to pick up). Outside the center of the city, you'll find cheaper places with easier (and lower-rent) girls, but I don't have a lot of experience in that sphere, since I live and work in downtown. Sorry Babuskha and Fabrique are both nice dance clubs with better looking girls, but might be hard for you to get in after midnight due to face control. They're also extremely loud, so harder to get acquainted, not to mention closing the deal. Good girls can be picked up in cafes such as Etazh, Coffee House, Shokoladnitsa, etc... As Doc Skank has proven to good effect, parks are also a good place to pickup.

Udachi!

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]Moscow and Saint Petersburg are capital cities for good sex in the world.

I would like to merge Russian good sex with beautiful Sunny places. I know a lot of Russian girls like to have a holiday for example in Dubai, in Caribbean islands, etc.

Which are the holiday places outside Russia where we can find nice Russian girls easily?[/QUOTE]

Basically: Egypt, Turkey and Thailand.

Also you can go to Sotchi in Russia: sunny and for sure full of russians!

[QUOTE=Pizdyets] For freebie sluts, my expat-friendly suggestions with reasonable face control would be Che, Tunnel, Papa's, Karma, Real McCoy and B2.
[/QUOTE]

What would you suggest on weekdays?
2 years ago, when I was last there, the best order seemed to be

Sun - Karma Bar
Mon - Parizhskaya Zhizn'
Tue - Papa's
Wed - Parizhskaya Zhizn'
Thu - Real McCoy

Is that still up to date? Also, if yes, what are good alternatives to Parizhskaya Zhizn' on Mons and Weds?

[QUOTE=SlutLover]What would you suggest on weekdays?
2 years ago, when I was last there, the best order seemed to be

Sun - Karma Bar
Mon - Parizhskaya Zhizn'
Tue - Papa's
Wed - Parizhskaya Zhizn'
Thu - Real McCoy

Is that still up to date? Also, if yes, what are good alternatives to Parizhskaya Zhizn' on Mons and Weds?[/QUOTE]

I'd suggest Garazh on Weds. Go early (before 11pm) or you might well get faced. Che also isn't too bad on Weds. I know this cuz Bubbly Boy and I got faced at Garazh when arriving after midnight and we needed a Plan B. :)

Propoganda used to be pretty good on Sundays, but haven't been there in for a while.

Guys can you please recommend a couple of sites where it's possible to meet girls that seek sponsorship (an amount of money in a regular basis in exchange for sex)? If you can recommend a couple of escort site it will be helpful also.

Also do you know if it is possible for a girl with litte or no breast to take some medication (under medical supervision of course) or hormones in order to develop at least avarage size breast without surgery or without putting her health at risk? I recently have a new "friend" she amazing tall but sadly with no breast (I'm a breast man).

Thanks, interesting reply. I think it is useful to go in-deep about Sotchi&C. , what is your opinion about:

- is Sotchi good in Autumn and Spring too?

- is there any nudist beach in Sotchi?

- is there any danger in Sotchi because it is near Georgia war?

- I see, near Sotchi, the towns of Tuapse and Novorossyisk, are they good like Sotchi?

- by Google, I read the best nudist beach is near Saint Petersburg, maybe for Russians, but I think it is cold in Summer too. .

- and about sex scene, are Sotchi&C. Open to Western tourists or do they prefer Russian people?

[QUOTE=Passepartout]Basically: Egypt, Turkey and Thailand.

Also you can go to Sotchi in Russia: sunny and for sure full of russians![/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Strike 69]Guys can you please recommend a couple of sites where it's possible to meet girls that seek sponsorship (an amount of money in a regular basis in exchange for sex)? If you can recommend a couple of escort site it will be helpful also.[/QUOTE]

If you speak Russian then mamba.ru is your best bet. If you pay a couple of bucks for the advanced search function you can specifically look for girls in search of sponsorship. If you don't speak Russian, you may be able to cope using automatic translation.

- is Sotchi good in Autumn and Spring too?

I think there will already/still be a lot of tourists in June and September, and also during the Russian holiday period in early May.
(It's Sochi, without the t.)

- is there any nudist beach in Sotchi?

There is one in Adler, close to Sochi airport, and there seem to be some other locations throughout Greater Sochi (which is a VERY long stretch of coast, see [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sochi[/url]).
[url]http://forum.allsochi.info/showthread.php?t=1070[/url]

- is there any danger in Sotchi because it is near Georgia war?

The danger from the Georgia war is overrated. I doubt the Georgians have the military capability to attack Sochi. If they had both the capability (e.g. rockets) and willingness they would have done so already.

- I see, near Sotchi, the towns of Tuapse and Novorossyisk, are they good like Sotchi?

Sochi is famous as a holiday resort, Tuapse and Novorossyisk aren't. From what I can see on the Net these are port cities, but nearby Gelendzhik is an important resort, too.

- by Google, I read the best nudist beach is near Saint Petersburg, maybe for Russians, but I think it is cold in Summer too.

Many Communist leaders used to go to the Baltic coast in summer (esp. near Riga), so I guess somewhere near St. Petersburg would probably be sort of acceptable in July/August, too, in terms of water temperature (no problem with air temperature). I haven't heard about the nudist beach, though.

- and about sex scene, are Sotchi&C. Open to Western tourists or do they prefer Russian people?[/QUOTE]

If you don't speak Russian I wouldn't recommend it. Some girls will speak English but you'll be better off in Moscow, or even in Turkey, as they will question your motivation behind coming to Sochi. Since it is actually cheaper to go to Turkey or Egypt than to go to Sochi, the girls who go there have usually made a conscious decision to stay in a Russian-speaking environment.

[QUOTE=Strike 69]Guys can you please recommend a couple of sites where it's possible to meet girls that seek sponsorship (an amount of money in a regular basis in exchange for sex)? If you can recommend a couple of escort site it will be helpful also.

Also do you know if it is possible for a girl with litte or no breast to take some medication (under medical supervision of course) or hormones in order to develop at least avarage size breast without surgery or without putting her health at risk? I recently have a new "friend" she amazing tall but sadly with no breast (I'm a breast man).[/QUOTE]No.

It is not possible.

[QUOTE=SlutLover]
Since it is actually cheaper to go to Turkey or Egypt than to go to Sochi, the girls who go there have usually made a conscious decision to stay in a Russian-speaking environment.[/QUOTE]

Or they don't have their international passports.

In any case, why is this being discussed in the Moscow thread? Should move it to Other Areas.

[QUOTE=SlutLover]What would you suggest on weekdays?

2 years ago, when I was last there, the best order seemed to be

Sun - Karma Bar
Mon - Parizhskaya Zhizn'
Tue - Papa's
Wed - Parizhskaya Zhizn'
Thu - Real McCoy

Is that still up to date? Also, if yes, what are good alternatives to Parizhskaya Zhizn' on Mons and Weds?[/QUOTE]Thank you very much for the replies. I'm wondering which bars particularly are suitable for a gentleman of mid-40s vintage? Noisy or face-controlled clubs probably not the best option, I daresay?

[QUOTE=Gergiev]Thank you very much for the replies. I'm wondering which bars particularly are suitable for a gentleman of mid-40s vintage? Noisy or face-controlled clubs probably not the best option, I daresay?[/QUOTE]

I'm in that age range and have never had a lack of female attention at any of these places. That said, I do take care of how I present myself (eventhough I'm hardly Brad Pitt). If you do the same, you should haven't any problems.

Of course all popular clubs filled with deffki are noisy, and if the girls are remotely attractive then face-control is a potential issue. I recently got faced with some friends at Che *and* Etazh on the same night (though it was late on a Saturday - weeknights aren't as much of an issue). If you're worried about getting in, go early. Sure, it might be a ghosttown, but it'll allow you to post up in a good location to maximize your view of the talent as it trickles in. That, and you'll have ample opportunity to lube yourself up, cast away all your inhibitions, and effectively execute the Moscow club mating ritual - walking up and grabbing a deffka's ass uninvited.

Sorry for the blind post and I have started doing some reading but was hoping some of you could just give me direct recommendations.

I am staying in SAS Radisson and looking for sensual massage with HJ / BJ. I am not a full service guy.

Can anyone give recommended providers for in-room service?

Expected pricing?

Being able to "see" what I am ordering is important to me too! I've had too many "surprises" show up at the door so a pic is mandatory.

Thanks guys!

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]Of course all popular clubs filled with deffki are noisy, and if the girls are remotely attractive then face-control is a potential issue. I recently got faced with some friends at Che *and* Etazh on the same night (though it was late on a Saturday - weeknights aren't as much of an issue). If you're worried about getting in, go early. Sure, it might be a ghosttown, but it'll allow you to post up in a good location to maximize your view of the talent as it trickles in. That, and you'll have ample opportunity to lube yourself up, cast away all your inhibitions, and effectively execute the Moscow club mating ritual - walking up and grabbing a deffka's ass uninvited.[/QUOTE]Cough cough. It happens. I recently got faced at Che and Etazh on a Saturday night too, but I am pretty sure it was because of the guys I was with. :)

There is no sure method to "beat" face control. Sometimes the security just doesn't like your face. I remember once I was talking on my phone outside Karma Bar and watched the doormen face a group of babes and then let a group pf trolls in. Huh?

Also, larger groups may have it harder than smaller groups, especially if the club is full or the male-female ratio is askew. 4 guys trying to get in will have it harder than 2 groups of 2. In my opinion the best mix is 2 guys.

2 guys = will spend money.

BTW, on that Saturday night Tunnel, PJs and from what I could tell from the OUTSIDE Che were all pretty terrible in terms of girl quality. Sorry Babushka was a little better, but basically every club we went to was a sausage fest. Unfortunately this is getting to be more and more the case in Moscow. The days of 75-80% women are over. In most cases, the best you can hope for now is 50-50, and this seems to be true for all clubs from demokratichny to elitny.

Thursday is still my favorite club night.[QUOTE=Pizdyets]Taking a large swig, she then proceeds to blow the entire mouthful into my face, coating me as well as my Zegna suit. I'm completely dumbfounded. What did I do to this girl to deserve this? Out loud, I say, "That's never happened to me before." Olya's smug smile transforms into an intent stare right before she bitchslaps me across the face, cutting my lip in the process. [/QUOTE]That's beautiful. You handled it better than I would have. I think I would have cried. Or kneed her in the twat.

Hello Gents.

Any of you destinguished gentlemen know of any hot, smoking AND delicious duos working in Moscow.

It would be a first for me and if I try it - it just HAS to be in Moscow. Know what I mean?

There are some here: [url]http://www.intimlife.ru/podrugki/[/url]

Don't understand Russian though - and they need to speak at least a little English. Any exp. on the site?

Help will be much appreciated.

Black Bltjones

I was wandering through sextalk.ru and stumbled upon a discussion thread for Night Flight. This was interesting because the local guys hardly ever write about NF, it's a little like Disneyland for them. Reading through the discussion, I discovered there was a post on the thread from a Moderator for sextalk.ru, so I imagine this guy speaks with some authority. I thought he offered some interesting observations and insight into a place that we all know about and most of us have been to at least once or twice.

This report was posted on Jan. 9, 2008. Editor's note: the local guys in Moscow refer to a working girl as a "fairy".

[i]Hardly more than two months ago, my girlfriend and I, along with one of our acquaintances, were leaving a club upon the termination of one of our glamorous evenings and were temporarily puzzled as to what we should do next. We did not think long, however, since our acquaintance, having taken an interest, asked how long it had been since we were in "Night Flight", and suggested we try it out. No sooner said than done, 15 minutes later, we were entering the club.

We encountered the club as usual. Once inside, we had a few beers, and shared our impressions with each other of the evening so far. So, after our 3rd (or 4th?) 0.5-liter, our acquaintance, enjoying the surrounding atmosphere (and it is possible, duly influenced by it) declared his desire, without hesitation, to take away a fairy from this "legendary" night club. A minute or two later, a very beautiful asiatochka (and I have seen them in my life - the same and even more beautiful) was already smartly carrying on the negotiations with him. We only had time to finish off our 5th (or 4th?) 0.5 liters of beer as our friend with the asiatochka has come to an agreement for 8,000 rubles for the night. Having made payment, we leave the club. I, with my girl friend, went to "Byelii Medvyed" and our acquaintance has carried away the asiatochka to his home.

He called in the morning to give me a long sob story that this daughter of the Korean and the Uzbek (or Kirghizes, the Kazakh woman - any more I do not remember) gave him a blow job exclusively with a condom on. She assumed the position for sex half-heartedly and in general, after 1,5 - 2 hours began to gather together her things to go home. In answer to his very reasonable question, "What the hell do you think you're doing?", she responds that the whole night costs 1,500 green ones [dollars] and not a kopeck less.

So, it is ever thus. Therefore, it is necessary to remember that it is better to stipulate everything in detail and in advance - specifying all of your preferences (perversions, needs and so forth) so that they will be executed properly by the "Night Flight" fairy. Whether your understanding is correct and the price accepted by you is the price for the whole night. I understand that from the above-stated situation, nobody is insured - but nevertheless.

And still - a little bit, IMHO, about the situation in "Night Flight" (it is exclusive from my personal experience). The place ("central", "legendary", supported mainly by foreigners, with the rigid face-control of the avenue [Tverskaya]) promotes that, the prices, which the local fairies are reporting to sextalk.ru , have not even the slightest relation to the quality of service they provide. Most likely, these prices develop exclusively from the fairies' own level of conceit or vanity and their particular individual understanding of that, and correspond with how much each one considers she can charge at any given point in time (I suppose that, day by day, this parameter is capable of changing).

There is, in general, a very big risk that the concept of "the fairy of the higher price category", with reference to the fairies of "Night Flight", will more likely indicate the COMPLETE OPPOSITE - the higher the declared price, the greater the conceit of the fairy, and consequently, the lower quality of service.

Certainly, exceptions happen. But they are rare (For example, it is possible to negotiate for 300 green ones, instead of for 500). But, first - it is necessary to negotiate, secondly (as the experience of my acquaintance has shown) this too is not the fact...). Yes, into the account of the starting price - be ready for this, that they are completely able to declare 500 Euros instead of Dollars (which is exactly how they began to negotiate with my acquaintance).

You should try "Night Flight" once or twice, because then, you will quickly realize that there is nothing present in this club that is out of the ordinary. It will particularly reinforce your understanding after that, of how you compare the quality and services of the "Night Flight" fairies with the fairies who charge 2500 - 3000 rubles for an hour (reports of which are more than enough on sextalk.ru).

But this is my personal point of view and I impose it on no one.[/i]

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]I was wandering through sextalk.ru and stumbled upon a discussion thread for Night Flight. This was interesting because the local guys hardly ever write about NF, it's a little like Disneyland for them. Reading through the discussion, I discovered there was a post on the thread from a Moderator for sextalk.ru, so I imagine this guy speaks with some authority. I thought he offered some interesting observations and insight into a place that we all know about and most of us have been to at least once or twice.

This report was posted on Jan. 9, 2008. Editor's note: the local guys in Moscow refer to a working girl as a "fairy".

[i]Hardly more than two months ago, my girlfriend and I, along with one of our acquaintances, were leaving a club upon the termination of one of our glamorous evenings and were temporarily puzzled as to what we should do next. We did not think long, however, since our acquaintance, having taken an interest, asked how long it had been since we were in "Night Flight", and suggested we try it out. No sooner said than done, 15 minutes later, we were entering the club.

We encountered the club as usual. Once inside, we had a few beers, and shared our impressions with each other of the evening so far. So, after our 3rd (or 4th?) 0.5-liter, our acquaintance, enjoying the surrounding atmosphere (and it is possible, duly influenced by it) declared his desire, without hesitation, to take away a fairy from this "legendary" night club. A minute or two later, a very beautiful asiatochka (and I have seen them in my life - the same and even more beautiful) was already smartly carrying on the negotiations with him. We only had time to finish off our 5th (or 4th?) 0.5 liters of beer as our friend with the asiatochka has come to an agreement for 8,000 rubles for the night. Having made payment, we leave the club. I, with my girl friend, went to "Byelii Medvyed" and our acquaintance has carried away the asiatochka to his home.

He called in the morning to give me a long sob story that this daughter of the Korean and the Uzbek (or Kirghizes, the Kazakh woman - any more I do not remember) gave him a blow job exclusively with a condom on. She assumed the position for sex half-heartedly and in general, after 1,5 - 2 hours began to gather together her things to go home. In answer to his very reasonable question, "What the hell do you think you're doing?", she responds that the whole night costs 1,500 green ones [dollars] and not a kopeck less.

So, it is ever thus. Therefore, it is necessary to remember that it is better to stipulate everything in detail and in advance - specifying all of your preferences (perversions, needs and so forth) so that they will be executed properly by the "Night Flight" fairy. Whether your understanding is correct and the price accepted by you is the price for the whole night. I understand that from the above-stated situation, nobody is insured - but nevertheless.

And still - a little bit, IMHO, about the situation in "Night Flight" (it is exclusive from my personal experience). The place ("central", "legendary", supported mainly by foreigners, with the rigid face-control of the avenue [Tverskaya]) promotes that, the prices, which the local fairies are reporting to sextalk.ru , have not even the slightest relation to the quality of service they provide. Most likely, these prices develop exclusively from the fairies' own level of conceit or vanity and their particular individual understanding of that, and correspond with how much each one considers she can charge at any given point in time (I suppose that, day by day, this parameter is capable of changing).

There is, in general, a very big risk that the concept of "the fairy of the higher price category", with reference to the fairies of "Night Flight", will more likely indicate the COMPLETE OPPOSITE - the higher the declared price, the greater the conceit of the fairy, and consequently, the lower quality of service.

Certainly, exceptions happen. But they are rare (For example, it is possible to negotiate for 300 green ones, instead of for 500). But, first - it is necessary to negotiate, secondly (as the experience of my acquaintance has shown) this too is not the fact...). Yes, into the account of the starting price - be ready for this, that they are completely able to declare 500 Euros instead of Dollars (which is exactly how they began to negotiate with my acquaintance).

You should try "Night Flight" once or twice, because then, you will quickly realize that there is nothing present in this club that is out of the ordinary. It will particularly reinforce your understanding after that, of how you compare the quality and services of the "Night Flight" fairies with the fairies who charge 2500 - 3000 rubles for an hour (reports of which are more than enough on sextalk.ru).

But this is my personal point of view and I impose it on no one.[/i][/QUOTE]Fantastic find Strav. I just RoD'd it.

Maybe Vika and Lena ought to have a read?

So it is finally happening, the great financial meltdown has reached Russia.
The stock market has lost 64% of its value and oil prices are down 35%
since July. That has got to hurt somebody, especially oligarchs! Well done, Vlad & Dmitri!

I just wonder how much ordinary or middle-class Russians are leveraged through credit? I have the impression that is not nearly so common in Russia as in the US. If so, then the ordinary Russian executive/salaryman is not going to be losing his shirt, but perhaps will no longer be able to afford to buy new clothes for girlfriends. And I guess they always had the "live for today" approach, so there will little security to help them weather the storm.

Hopefully this is the first step to a cooling of the overheated Russian economy that will trickle down to the price of dyevs (eventually).

Even so, I agree with Skank, that dyevs will not be immediately price-sensitive, if they have been pedalling themselves for $X (in cash or presents) they are not suddenly going to start going down-market for $½X, at least not until they are cold and hungry and reduced to wearing last year's fashions.

But they may be reminded that the reason their sisters were chasing Western men (and the prospect of a new life in the West) a few years ago was not all about money, but about personal and financial security, as well. They can see now how fragile their economic bubble was...

[QUOTE=Gentleman Travel on 12 Dec 07]Surely we should praise Comrade Putin for bringing mutual fear and loathing back to East-West relations? This will scare all the weak-kneed romance tourists away and leave the field free for hard-core mongers!

Also, I think Russia may be in for a downturn. I was at a really interesting conference last week that linked the anticipated slowdown in the US real estate market to a general American/western slowdown, spilling over into China & India which export 90% of their finished goods to the US, taking the heat out of Russian oil & gas (and other resource) demand/markets. Result? Minting fewer new Russian millionaires and billionaires (and surely many of those must be houses of cards) and leaving more starving dyevs for the rest of us...[/QUOTE]

Doc,

I thought it was interesting that even the local guys can get burned in NF. So, what chance does some poor schmuck have, in Moscow for the first time, no fluency in Russian, no idea of how the game is played and yet dazzled by his first vision of the NF babes? They will clean him to the bone like piranhas...

GT,

My last couple of trips to Moscow, I have been amazed at the number of new cars on the roads. The Volgas, Zhigulis and Ladas have been relegated to the suburbs and replaced by a brand new fleet of foreign cars. My Muscovite friends tell me this is all because of the advent of credit. The car loan has become very popular in Moscow, and, most of the cars on the road today are bought with borrowed money.

I doubt if the guys at the top will feel anything more than a light breeze from the banking crisis. They are much too well insulated from these kinds of events. But, we can always hope that if the babes at NF are faced with the repossession of their beautiful new Merc, they may decide that any cash in hand is better than nothing. At that point, hopefully, sex will become a volume business again.

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]Doc,

I thought it was interesting that even the local guys can get burned in NF. So, what chance does some poor schmuck have, in Moscow for the first time, no fluency in Russian, no idea of how the game is played and yet dazzled by his first vision of the NF babes? They will clean him to the bone like piranhas...
[/QUOTE]QFT.

I think even more interesting is the fact that the experienced Russian monger:

A) assumed negotiated price was for all night
B) assumed the BBBJ was standard
C) came to the conclusion often posted on this board that more $$$ doesn't mean better service

It suggests that NF is the anamoly we here have always claimed it to be.

Also found it interesting that 8000 rubles was the negotiated price, which is fairly low for NF standards (roughly $300).

BTW, from what I hear there is a very large amount of boobjob girls plying their trade at NF. Popularity of plastic surgery in Moscow supposedly rivals Southern California now. Can't say that is progress, let's hope they keep it low key.

But since when did Russians ever do anything low key? )))[QUOTE=Gentleman Travel]I just wonder how much ordinary or middle-class Russians are leveraged through credit? I have the impression that is not nearly so common in Russia as in the US. If so, then the ordinary Russian executive/salaryman is not going to be losing his shirt, but perhaps will no longer be able to afford to buy new clothes for girlfriends. And I guess they always had the "live for today" approach, so there will little security to help them weather the storm....[/QUOTE]Strav is right, getting credit for cars and apartments is very easy in Russia and "everybody" is doing it.

And no... saving for a rainy day is not a Russian concept. There are a lot of people living above their means in Russia. In many ways, Russians are very American in their lack of financial caution. That and the new found love of boobjobs.

Curiously enough, pretty much ONLY the super rich and oligarchs are the ones with financial sense. They were the first to switch from savings in dollars to Euros and they are the ones putting a large chunk of their investments and personal fortunes into investments outside of Russia. A collapsing economy will paradoxically affect them the least. At the most, it'll make their lives in Russia cheaper and give them even more financial clout.

A collapse would however (as you previously stated) eventually mean more humane prices for us.

Guys,

I wrote a report on NF few months ago on the same girl, mi-korean mo-uzbeck or kazakh, with a really bad attitude, who also told me (i was a newbie in moscow) that the price was for the night;
Same awful covered blow-job, same 1 position only, same departure after 1 hour...

If someone knows or goes to NF it would be nice to report this fact to the owner.

[QUOTE=Helena Moscow]Skank as always thinks he is clever and the rest are stupid... Come down to Earth. You hang about the country for so many years and still have no glue about what people here are.[/QUOTE]I really have no glue, it's true.[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Curiously enough, pretty much ONLY the super rich and oligarchs are the ones with financial sense. They were the first to switch from savings in dollars to Euros and they are the ones putting a large chunk of their investments and personal fortunes into investments outside of Russia. A collapsing economy will paradoxically affect them the least. At the most, it'll make their lives in Russia cheaper and give them even more financial clout.[/QUOTE]And you think this isn't the case? Explain.

[QUOTE=Helena Moscow]Skank as always thinks he is clever and the rest are stupid... Come down to Earth. You hang about the country for so many years and still have no glue about what people here are.[/QUOTE]What happened? I thought you and Doc Skank were pals. Anyway, I'm impressed you can understand Doc's economical analysis in English, as it's not your first language.

Doc - work on that glue.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]I really have no glue, it's true.And you think this isn't the case? Explain.[/QUOTE]

We learned a lot from the past. Most of Russians are well prepared for the crisis and well aware of possible problems as well as possible benefits. We were even waiting for it, each year asked: when? when? We are even happy about it ;) So many people know that there was time to make money and after crisis comes time to buy that I'm afraid life will probably not get too cheap here any more... (we still hope it will). By the way, huge persentage of Russians on average level have property, bank accounts and residenships in other coutries. Many people after 1998 didn't keep money in one currency, but in 3 or 4, and in payments long ago switched to euro. I stayed a lot abroad and can't say that average forigners have more financial sense than most of Russians I know. In a way European system is more comfortable than ours, we lack some instruments, it's true, but people are not stupid and no more live just "today".

[QUOTE=Helena Moscow]We learned a lot from the past. Most of Russians are well-prepared for the crisis and well-aware of possible problems as well as possibilities. We even were waiting for it, each year asked: when? when? We are even happy about it ;) Because there was time to work and after crisis comes time to buy. By the way, huge persentage of Russians on average level have property, bank accounts and residenships in other coutries. Many of people after 1998 didn't keep money in one currency, but in 3 or four, and in payments switched to euro. I stayed a lot abroad and can't say that forigners have more financial sense than most of Russians I know. We lack some instruments, it's true, but people are not stupid and no more live just "today".[/QUOTE]I hope you are right, but speaking of my Russian friends, many of them took out large loans, for local property in particular. Very few have property in foreign countries, and they are what you would call upper middle class. 30-40 years old, top management. Typical BMW and Mercedes drivers, going to fancy restaurants to show off, taking elaborate holidays. But yet not really rich, just with good cash flow.

Among my oligarch/millionaire contacts/friends with serious money, ALL of them have invested significantly in foreign countries. Property. Stock. Kids even sent to schools in Europe or the US.

I agree that Russians are very cautious in the sense that they believe that another collapse could possibly come, however as a Muscovite you must know that it is easy to get credit for cars, holidays, furniture, property... and many people do. Should the economy slow down, property values fall and investment slow, many people will have problems keeping up with their payments. It isn't a Russian problem per se, but rather one in any modern economy.[QUOTE=Helena Moscow]but people are not stupid and no more live just "today".[/QUOTE]I know a lot of Russian people, particularly the young 20-25, who live for today. They literally wear hyper-expensive clothes but need to beg for money to buy phone credit. They won't be faced with serious debt at that age, but are developing bad habits in terms of credit and financial foresight. Again, by no means just a Russian problem, but one that Russia is not immune to as well.

Is it just me? Or are we missing a post from Helena, somewhere...

[QUOTE=Helena Moscow]Skank as always thinks he is clever and the rest are stupid... Come down to Earth. You hang about the country for so many years and still have no glue about what people here are.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]Is it just me? Or are we missing a post from Helena, somewhere...[/QUOTE]Yeah, it mysteriously disappeared, but thankfully it will forever be preserved for posterity as a quote.

I suppose the Russian tendency to overspend is being heightened by the current financial crisis. If banks and shares are collapsing, you're far better off being the debtor than the asset owner. When bankruptcy comes, you don't care as you just spent other people's cash having a great time.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]... That and the new found love of boobjobs ...

[/QUOTE]

This could be a serious investment, not just consumer spending :)

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Cough cough. It happens. I recently got faced at Che and Etazh on a Saturday night too, but I am pretty sure it was because of the guys I was with. :)

There is no sure method to "beat" face control. Sometimes the security just doesn't like your face. I remember once I was talking on my phone outside Karma Bar and watched the doormen face a group of babes and then let a group pf trolls in. Huh?

Also, larger groups may have it harder than smaller groups, especially if the club is full or the male-female ratio is askew. 4 guys trying to get in will have it harder than 2 groups of 2. In my opinion the best mix is 2 guys.

2 guys = will spend money.
[/QUOTE]

I rarely get faced - usually only when I have a date in tow who looks provincial, or I arrive with more than 2 people in my crew.

There's no sure way to beat face control, but I usually employ the following method with success:
- approach with confidence, like you fully expect to get in
- if they give you the "tolko po klubnoy kartochke" bullshit, then strike up a conversation with the okhranik and try to show you have some game (humor, etc)
- if that fails, discreetly slip the guy a 500R note

On my last visit to Che (after midnight on a Friday), I had to employ the last technique, but with 1000R instead (I was out of 500s - ouch). But the joint was packed with cuties, so in the end, it was worth it. IMO - Che these days is superior to PJ's, Karma or RMC in terms of talent. And the tight confines lend itself to picking up easily. Last visit, I was grinding on the dance floor with a big-titted hottie within 2 minutes of arrival.

Ilona is an amazing woman!

First I was really surprised by her similarity with the photo: very slim waist, long slender legs, sporty beautiful body, pleasant soft skin, model looks. I was astonished by her beauty and height, she seemed a model, as she said her height was 180 meters high, and she looked like that. To all that she was very playful, sweet and attentive to me, real diamond I need to say, We met for a night and she came to my hotel in a beautiful evening dress, so that I even needed to change as she was very elegant and stunning. She was fantastic in bed and as a smart interesting woman. To all this she has very beautiful big eyes, sexy lips, which she can use very skillfully, as I discovered later. We had a trip by her car, she told me a lot about Moscow, then we ate in a restaurant and when we came back, she gave me fabulous massage, I got excited at the very beginning of the meeting and couldn’t wait to be close, that was fun, she was very passionate and temperament, seemed really enjoying our sex, not just working. Also very tender, has a soft and erotic touch, in general, the best escort girl I have ever met, I decided at once to write about this diamond, such a beauty and sweetie and working in escort, that’s amazing!

Her site is : [url]http://www.vipelegantescort.org[/url]

[QUOTE=Ash1001]I suppose the Russian tendency to overspend is being heightened by the current financial crisis. If banks and shares are collapsing, you're far better off being the debtor than the asset owner. When bankruptcy comes, you don't care as you just spent other people's cash having a great time.[/QUOTE]

As it stands, the crisis seems to be mostly restricted to the stock market. The problem for companies is, liquidity is drying up as the risk managers at the major banks rarely have an understanding of Russia that goes beyond the pathetically biased CNN coverage of the Ossetian conflict. I understand there is a global financial crisis, but there is no justification for the likes of Gazprom trading at 4 times P/E and sometimes even less. (Gazprom may not be the best example because of its appetite for bonds, but there are even better offers for top-20 outfits at 3 times P/E.)
That is unparalleled even within the Emerging Markets context, and despite the falling oil price the Russian economy is much safer than many others. Russia has enormous foreign currency reserves, healthy growth, political stability (which, I know, comes at a price) and consumer spending remains high. The RF govt even adapts the tax on oil exports to market conditions, with a higher percentage charged when oil prices are high and a discount when they are low.
The problem, as I see it, are not Russian debtors. The problem is American mortgages and clueless investment bankers (and this comes from someone within the financial profession). Just look what the IMF and World Bank, with zero understanding of local culture, did to the Russian economy in the early 90s.
In short, as a FT reader recently put it, "the cause is clear: one group of people with no idea what they were dealing with christened their output 'asset'; a second group with even less than no idea rated it; and then it was sold not only to harmless customers, but even within the first group itself."

Rant over. :)

Now for a question. Can someone currently within Russia tell me the number for a SMS to Mamba to get extended search? (If you are outside Russia, the number is not displayed on the site. I want to try to send that SMS from Skype. From what I remember all you have to put into the SMS is your personal numerical code, which I will be able to find out.)
Webmoney and Yandex are a real pain to use when you are outside of Russia (no paying in by card). I wonder how others handle that problem.
If Skype won't work out, and if anyone currently within Russia/the Ukraine wants to get membership, I can pay for that if they send a few SMS (below cost of membership of course) on my behalf.

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]I rarely get faced - usually only when I have a date in tow who looks provincial, or I arrive with more than 2 people in my crew.[/QUOTE]

At least back in the autumn/winter of 2006, I mostly went on my own, and rarely had problems. Big difference to places like London, where single guys were viewed with a great deal of suspicion.

Is there a general consensus that face control has become stricter over the last two years?

Why on earth would a place like Che have face control? I can understand the glam clubs like Diaghilev and Krisha having it, but isn't Che essentially a student hang out?

Hi guys,

I need a very important confirmation about our favourite game:

in your real experiences in Moscow and in Russia, please only real statistics, the deepthroat swallow blowjob is usual with Russian girls and prostitutes? Because I found a lot of agencies offering that but I don't trust much in their replies!

Please, help because this is very important for all us!

[QUOTE=Ash1001]Why on earth would a place like Che have face control? I can understand the glam clubs like Diaghilev and Krisha having it, but isn't Che essentially a student hang out?[/QUOTE]

Face control is done to make a target group feel comfortable. If the club is designed as a student hang out, the stuff will probably limitate the amount of guys in suits. Just not to break the atmosphere. May be not exactly like that, but a sort of...

Has anyone been to a Moscow swinger club?

[QUOTE=Ash1001]Why on earth would a place like Che have face control? I can understand the glam clubs like Diaghilev and Krisha having it, but isn't Che essentially a student hang out?[/QUOTE]Che isn't a student hangout, it's target audience is the emerging middle class. They let in foreigners usually without much trouble, but deny just enough to make the place "desirably semi-elite".

Most Russians in there (and the majority of patrons are Russian) are working normal jobs with decent incomes. I would guess average age of patrons to be between 25-40.

Once when I went with a girlfriend there she had to show ID to prove her age, they thought she was too young, so they seem to target a more mature crowd then the clubs that let in everybody.

There are any number of reasons for clubs to have face control, the main ones being security, getting the right mix of type of person, getting the right mix of men and women and most importantly, maintaining the club's status.

Essentially EVERY club has some sort of face control and as previously stated, it can be very unpredictable. Even at elite clubs you'll find trolls or people where you ask yourself "how the hell did he/she/it get in here".

CHE face control is logical as the club is rather small.

To be honest, I know a little the doormen, so I have never been faced unless I arrive after 1.00PM when the club is already crowded and full. But I have also to admit that the face control is more and more difficult here.

It is not such an issue since this is the best pre-party club in town.

Action starts with the live concert at 23.30 and if at 1.30 i didn't score, i consider that i have to go to another club like vodka bar, fabrique, or... hot dog.

So my advice for che is to arrive just a little before 23.30 and you won'tegt any problem to get in.

"I don't care to belong to a club that accepts people like me as members."
-Groucho Marx

Just a thought... :)

"When I was in Moscow, I balled a Russian babe in my pajamas.
How she got in my pajamas, I'll never know..."

Groucho Marxa

(sorry, couldn't resist)

May I chime in with a question ? :)

How much do a mojito or a Corona cost in a place like Che ?

Do people (girls) drink Baltika or vodka in this kind of middle-to-upper class venues or only cocktails and imported beers ?

[QUOTE=Prosal]May I chime in with a question ? :)

How much do a mojito or a Corona cost in a place like Che ?

Do people (girls) drink Baltika or vodka in this kind of middle-to-upper class venues or only cocktails and imported beers ?[/QUOTE]I cannot remember specifically about Che, however here are my general observations.

* Corona will cost an average of 150-250 rubles per bottle.
* A cocktail will usually run about 250-350 rubles.
* Local beer averages 100-150 rubles for 0,5 l.

Depending on the venue, you may or may not find women drinking local beer, or beer at all. Generally speaking, the more upscale the place the less beer will be drunk by girls. Personally I love it when girls drink beer, but regrettably less and less do. The more studenty, the more beer (or cheap alternatives for getting drunk) will be popular.

Vodka isn't particularly popular among girls as it is considered a low-class or uncool drink by many (particularly Moscuvites, provincial girls haven't been brainwashed against vodka yet), however if you want to go with hard liquor they do like just about anything else. Especially tequila and Sambuca are popular, but so is whisky, rum or cognac. Cocktails are as expected the most popular... and most expensive. Probably the most important factor in a girl's drink choice is "who's buying?". Girls on their own will often "milk" a single drink for a long time to save money until a generous "real man" comes along to assist. ))) Some groups of girls have enough free cash to have their own party however and you'll find many groups of girls getting tipsy. Here again they seem to choose just about any drink except beer and vodka.

There are ways to try to save money when going out to bars, cafes and clubs in Moscow, but there is no avoiding spending money.

Here some average costs:

* meeting in cafe for two, coffee and either salad or dessert: 1200 rubles ($50)
* light dinner for two with drinks: 3000 rubles ($120)
* heavy dinner for two with drinks and additional courses: 4500 rubles ($180)
* night clubbing at one club with average volume drinks for self and occasional drinks bought for others, taxis, entrance fee: 2500 rubles ($100)
* heavy night clubbing at multiple clubs with multiple drinks for self, some drinks for others, taxis and entrance fees: 4500 rubles ($180)

So yes, freebies aren't free. )))

Some tips to save money:

* don't order wine at dinner, or if you do make sure you choose and she doesn't automatically go for the most expensive one
* do your dating at cafes and not at dinners
* use the metro for your daytime and evening travelling, at night taxi only real option
* don't drink so much... :)

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank] here are my general observations.[/QUOTE]
Doc, thanks for the elaborate answer. For a heavy club drinker and a incurable late-night partier such as myself Moscow seems financially suicidal. :(

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank] Personally I love it when girls drink beer, but regrettably less and less do.[/QUOTE]
One of the GREAT things about Tashkent is that girls almost never drink LIITs, B52s, Flying Bikinis, Mojitos or other expensive shits but beer or vodka, and are perfectly happy with that. Even in the most upscale and hippest venues like Basha or KTKomba I've never been asked for anything else than Baltika (they don't care about imported beers), vodka shots plus fruit juice or soda, or the occasional Red Bull.

Nothing is more sexy and appealing than a 8 or a 9 drinking Baltika from the bottle !! :)

Long-neck beer costs 5000 soums ($3.5) in Tashkent glam clubs BTW, and vodka shot 2000 soums.

[QUOTE=Prosal]Doc, thanks for the elaborate answer. For a heavy drinker and a incurable late-night partier such as myself Moscow seems financially suicidal. :(


One of the GREAT things about Tashkent is that girls almost never drink LIITs, B52s, Flying Bikinis, imported beer or other expensive shit but Baltika or vodka, and are perfectly happy with that. Even in the most upscale and hippest venues like basha or KTKomba I've never been asked for anything else than beer or vodka shots.

Nothing is more sexy and appealing than a 8 or a 9 drinking Baltika from the bottle !! :)[/QUOTE]I agree with you 110%, and in Russian provinces it is essentially the same... however according to my observations in Moscow (at least in the middle to upper class clubs/bars) beer and vodka are out, at least among girls.

I'm a fairly heavy club drinker myself, so lesser thirsty party-goers may spend less than me...

I'm not sure whether or not it is because they don't like it or if it is because when in public they'd rather drink something more fashionable.

In my experience the same non-beer and non-vodka drinking girls are happy to drink beer or vodka while cuddling on the sofa in pre-poking grope-time.

I'll try not to lose sleep over it and continue to stock my fridge with beer and vodka.... :)

Monday in Kiev was back to back business meetings. My stomach was feeling much better and I was getting my strength back [after a bad case of Turkmenbashi's revenge]. I got the airport at 7:30 PM for a 9:40 PM flight and soon on my way back to Moscow. On the plane, I met a gorgeous blond named Vika who got on and sat in the window seat in my row just before the door closed. My initial thought was, “oh sure, another rich spoiled Russian Blondnika” who prances onto the plane at the last moment and think she owns the place. I had the aisle so there was just the two of us. She was really stunning and Ilar, who was sitting in the aisle seat across from me, kept needling me to make a move on her. That’s not usually my style so I just sort of laughed it off. When the drinks cart came around she ordered a shot of Garilka (Ukrainian vodka) so I followed suit and just before drinking I offered a toast just to be polite. This turned out to be a great ice breaker as she got very chatty. She said she did not speak any English but could understand some as she is an international lawyer working for a firm in Moscow. I asked if she had been in Kiev for the weekend as well, but she told me that she had been in Tbilisi (Republic of Georgia) for the weekend and that direct travel between Georgia and Russia was pretty limited these days, hence the connection in Kiev. One shot led to two, and two led to three and pretty soon we were both pretty chatty.

She was a Russian citizen as she declined the usual landing card for foreigners so I am guessing that she might have Georgian relatives. In any case, we started chatting about Moscow and asked her which her favorite night club was. She said she didn’t do night clubs much and preferred Jazz clubs. On the subject of restaurants she told me her favorite was Ginitsvalli, so there MUST have been some sort of Georgian connection. One thing led to another and she agreed to have dinner with me on Tuesday night as she did not go back to work until Wednesday. She gave me her phone number and agreed to the date. When we landed, we walked together down to the immigration in SVO-1 and split as she walked into the line for Russian citizens. All this time Ildar has his mouth hanging open and offering new found respect for my pick up abilities.

The flight arrived just after 12:00 midnight and immigration was quick and easy. Ildar’s driver was waiting outside so in moments we were headed into town. Ildar had an early meeting on Tuesday so he declined my offer to hook up with Pizdyets at Itazsh. It wasn’t until I got out of the car that I realized that I had left my Russian mobile phone on the fucking plane. Damnit. I still had my US Blackberry with me so I wasn’t incommunicado, but Vika’s number was on that phone!!!!!! Double damnit.

Pizdyets and I had a few drinks back at Itazsh and decided to relocate to Hot Dogs to check out the action. I honestly can’t remember the name of the girl I dragged home that night or what I paid her because I was so pissed off that I lost my stupid phone with Vika’s number on it. She probably sat home Tuesday night and cursed that stupid Americanits for not calling her.

But speaking of Hot Dogs, it was pretty dead on that Monday night. Pizdyets and I agreed that we would have one beer (maybe two) and then give some serious thought to hitting one of the salons. There was a brunette sitting next to us at the bar that I gave a passing glance and a smile to but that was about it. The rugby was on TV so we chatted and laughed about my “shitty” weekend in Kiev and decided one more beer would not hurt. For no particular reason, I turned to the gal next to me and asked if I could buy her a drink. She asked for a shot of Red Label which immediately got my attention as most of the girls (as you all know) tend to shy away from whiskey while they are working. There was something a bit shy and non-aggressive about this girl, which was not what I was in the mood for considering how pissed off I was about losing Vika’s number. Screw the phone – I wanted that NUMBER!!!!

Luckily, a stereotypical “dirty girl” materialized and soon Pizdyets and I were sitting at the table with the two of them discussing the price of tea in China. Dirty Girl kept telling me “pashlee, pashlee” (let’s get outta here) so when Pizdyets and Whisky Girl got up to dance we made a move to my apartment and she punished me for losing Vika’s phone number. Whip me – beat me – make me write bad checks…….

NOTE: I will post this in both the Ukraine thread and the Moscow thread as it’s a lead-in to the rest of the week in Moscow.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]however according to my observations in Moscow (at least in the middle to upper class clubs/bars) beer and vodka are out, at least among girls.[/QUOTE]

I totally concur. If you're walking in a park, they'll agree to drink beer with you, but both vodka/beer are eschewed in the club unless there are no other options.

BTW, a mojito in Chikivara (local speak for Che) costs 400R, at least on weekends.

[QUOTE]
I'm a fairly heavy club drinker myself, so lesser thirsty party-goers may spend less than me...
[/QUOTE]

Yup... I don't leave home without at least 15K in my pocket, and that's with no intention for p4p. Forget about my liver - that's reason enough to stop drinking.

Recently had a first date with a 20 y.o. ballerina/studentka (we met at Che). She's tall, blonde, super tight body, great legs, shapely ass, cute face with rosy cheeks and has a super smile. I really wanted to get into her pants, so went for a walk in the park, then took her to a high-end seafood restaurant, ordered just about the cheapest wine on the menu (2800R), 2 starters, 2 mains, then proceeded to a trendy bar for postprandial cocktails. Total was 12K ($480) but I still didn't close the deal. Mind you that I can afford it and the 7 hours of conversation was surprisingly scintillating, but it has made me reassess the meaning of "freebie" when I could have outcalled a HotDog girl I met previously and spent half of that.

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]
Recently had a first date with a 20 y.o. ballerina/studentka (we met at Che). She's tall, blonde, super tight body, great legs, shapely ass, cute face with rosy cheeks and has a super smile. [/QUOTE]

Yes, I can corroborate the physical description if she's the same on from Wednesday night. I was wondering how all of that went. You're full invested now buddy - stay the course until you close the deal. In for a penny - in for pound.

After an uneventful pub crawl with some expat Brits, I hooked up with Pizdyets and Solntsa Yada last Wednesday night at Che around midnight. I was my first time in Che and it was shoulder to shoulder standing room. Within a few minutes, this girl in her late 20's makes eye contact with me and starts coming my way. Solntsa Yada intercepts her and she tells him in English that she wants to meet me but SY decides that she's a "3" at best and sends her on her way. The fact of the matter is that there were quite a few girls there that night you would not exactly consider pretty. And they had to be there for only one reason.

For the rest on the night she's giving me the eye from across the bar and, while I agree with Solnsta Yada, she wasn't very good looking but there was something strangely attractive about her. It's like looking at a solar eclipse - you know it's not going to be good for you, but you can't look away. She had jet black hair with dark eyes and really full lips - almost like they had been injected.

Once Pizdyets and Solntsa Yada got tangled up with the Blond Beauty and her friend - The troll made a bee line to me and starts up some conversation. Turns out, her name was Nyuka and she's originally from Turkmenistan. She ran away from home several years ago in disgrace because she fucked a Russian boy and got pregnant. I told her that I had just been in Turkmenistan the previous week and that I thought that Turkmen girls were sexy because they were so unavailable. That seemed to have done the trick because were were out the door in record time. It was clear that this girl had been rejected by the most of the guys in the bar and needed sex badly.

I don't normally like to get into details but this girl was wild. Single Mom, from outta town, yada, yada, yada. She insisted on CBJ but at the very last moment rips off the condom and insists that I give her a "mask", as in "glaze the face". Holy cow, THAT was a little unexpected. Anyhow - it was clear that she had a itch that needed scratching. The funny thing was that she ate me out of house and home. My food supplies were dwindling but she damn near ate everything in the fridge. She was not fat (quite the contrary) but had one hell of an appetite (sexually and otherwise).

Anyhow - the moral of the story is that even the (seemingly) ugly girls need love too. There is a reason they don't get faced at Che.

You can get angry and violent with the girl and insist on the night if you're renting a flat. It's not like she can call the cops. Personally I wouldn't pay 8,000 rubles to fuck an Asian, unless they were Belarusian rubles. Taking her home gives you a bit of leeway that you would lack if you went to a place like Charmel.


[QUOTE=Stravinsky]I was wandering through sextalk.ru and stumbled upon a discussion thread for Night Flight. This was interesting because the local guys hardly ever write about NF, it's a little like Disneyland for them. Reading through the discussion, I discovered there was a post on the thread from a Moderator for sextalk.ru, so I imagine this guy speaks with some authority. I thought he offered some interesting observations and insight into a place that we all know about and most of us have been to at least once or twice.

This report was posted on Jan. 9, 2008. Editor's note: the local guys in Moscow refer to a working girl as a "fairy".

[i]Hardly more than two months ago, my girlfriend and I, along with one of our acquaintances, were leaving a club upon the termination of one of our glamorous evenings and were temporarily puzzled as to what we should do next. We did not think long, however, since our acquaintance, having taken an interest, asked how long it had been since we were in "Night Flight", and suggested we try it out. No sooner said than done, 15 minutes later, we were entering the club.

We encountered the club as usual. Once inside, we had a few beers, and shared our impressions with each other of the evening so far. So, after our 3rd (or 4th?) 0.5-liter, our acquaintance, enjoying the surrounding atmosphere (and it is possible, duly influenced by it) declared his desire, without hesitation, to take away a fairy from this "legendary" night club. A minute or two later, a very beautiful asiatochka (and I have seen them in my life - the same and even more beautiful) was already smartly carrying on the negotiations with him. We only had time to finish off our 5th (or 4th?) 0.5 liters of beer as our friend with the asiatochka has come to an agreement for 8,000 rubles for the night. Having made payment, we leave the club. I, with my girl friend, went to "Byelii Medvyed" and our acquaintance has carried away the asiatochka to his home.

He called in the morning to give me a long sob story that this daughter of the Korean and the Uzbek (or Kirghizes, the Kazakh woman - any more I do not remember) gave him a blow job exclusively with a condom on. She assumed the position for sex half-heartedly and in general, after 1,5 - 2 hours began to gather together her things to go home. In answer to his very reasonable question, "What the hell do you think you're doing?", she responds that the whole night costs 1,500 green ones [dollars] and not a kopeck less.

So, it is ever thus. Therefore, it is necessary to remember that it is better to stipulate everything in detail and in advance - specifying all of your preferences (perversions, needs and so forth) so that they will be executed properly by the "Night Flight" fairy. Whether your understanding is correct and the price accepted by you is the price for the whole night. I understand that from the above-stated situation, nobody is insured - but nevertheless.

And still - a little bit, IMHO, about the situation in "Night Flight" (it is exclusive from my personal experience). The place ("central", "legendary", supported mainly by foreigners, with the rigid face-control of the avenue [Tverskaya]) promotes that, the prices, which the local fairies are reporting to sextalk.ru , have not even the slightest relation to the quality of service they provide. Most likely, these prices develop exclusively from the fairies' own level of conceit or vanity and their particular individual understanding of that, and correspond with how much each one considers she can charge at any given point in time (I suppose that, day by day, this parameter is capable of changing).

There is, in general, a very big risk that the concept of "the fairy of the higher price category", with reference to the fairies of "Night Flight", will more likely indicate the COMPLETE OPPOSITE - the higher the declared price, the greater the conceit of the fairy, and consequently, the lower quality of service.

Certainly, exceptions happen. But they are rare (For example, it is possible to negotiate for 300 green ones, instead of for 500). But, first - it is necessary to negotiate, secondly (as the experience of my acquaintance has shown) this too is not the fact...). Yes, into the account of the starting price - be ready for this, that they are completely able to declare 500 Euros instead of Dollars (which is exactly how they began to negotiate with my acquaintance).

You should try "Night Flight" once or twice, because then, you will quickly realize that there is nothing present in this club that is out of the ordinary. It will particularly reinforce your understanding after that, of how you compare the quality and services of the "Night Flight" fairies with the fairies who charge 2500 - 3000 rubles for an hour (reports of which are more than enough on sextalk.ru).

But this is my personal point of view and I impose it on no one.[/i][/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Blaked]You can get angry and violent with the girl and insist on the night if you're renting a flat. It's not like she can call the cops. Personally I wouldn't pay 8,000 rubles to fuck an Asian, unless they were Belarusian rubles. Taking her home gives you a bit of leeway that you would lack if you went to a place like Charmel.[/QUOTE]

Blaked - you should really lay off the Max Hardcore videos for a while, man. That shit ain't healthy. And don't be thinking you're immune to Russian krysha either. Sure, many of the NF girls are true freelancers, but you rough up the wrong girl, and you're in for a world o' hurt, [B]precisely[/B] if you're renting a flat instead of staying in a hotel.

[quote=acolonizer]hi guys,

i need a very important confirmation about our favourite game:

in your real experiences in moscow and in russia, please only real statistics, the deepthroat swallow blowjob is usual with russian girls and prostitutes? because i found a lot of agencies offering that but i don't trust much in their replies!

please, help because this is very important for all us![/quote]hard to find for real, for dt i inquire each time, yet, little to no success, and when they say they can and try, they barely get halfway. as for swallowing, yes its more common, but problematic, you ask them to do so up front, they wont even give you the bbbj, you dont ask, and you'll watch it jet along your crab ladder or she'll have a tissue handy (or bolt for the bathroom)

[quote=slutlover]has anyone been to a moscow swinger club?[/quote]i can't say i have personal experience from joining in the fun, but i did attend a place at a request of a friend, to find out if it was indeed a swingers club or a fancy restaurant. it was a central bed, around 12ft diameter. with a balustrade around, a walk way around that, and approx 14 smaller rooms, with see through curtains, to watch the central show, or thick curtains to keep out peeps. cost was 5000rubs a guy, strict face control, 2500 a couple, free for women. food and drinks served by waitresses (25k for waitress participation) very indian/arabian look to the place, like a harem. near red gate metro.

[QUOTE=Jake993]Yes, I can corroborate the physical description if she's the same on from Wednesday night. I was wondering how all of that went. You're full invested now buddy - stay the course until you close the deal. In for a penny - in for pound.[/QUOTE]I find that the concept of freebee only works if you 'dont' include the first 2 dates.. I'm sitting pretty with a couple of nice 7's, if I have nothing to do, I message them around 9, that I'm coming home from work, I'd like to cuddle them before falling asleep, I stress.. no sex. I'm too tired, they NEVER let me get away with that. no cafe, no nightclub, no cost.

[QUOTE=Jake993] Solntsa Yada intercepts her and she tells him in English that she wants to meet me but SY decides that she's a "3" at best and sends her on her way. The fact of the matter is that there were quite a few girls there that night you would not exactly consider pretty. And they had to be there for only one reason.[/QUOTE] Sorry mate, didn't notice that she had her eye on you, I just turned her away from the group, as unattractive attention usually sets other girls a standard by which the rest of us get judged. That was rude of me.

[QUOTE=Jake993] I told her that I had just been in Turkmenistan the previous week and that I thought that Turkmen girls were sexy because they were so unavailable. That seemed to have done the trick because were were out the door in record time.[/QUOTE]Well done, getting what your keen on is more fun that getting the best in the place. I should have ignored Piz's advice and just taken the blonde 40yr old, she could have taught me something..

[QUOTE=Solntsa Yada]
Well done, getting what your keen on is more fun that getting the best in the place. I should have ignored Piz's advice and just taken the blonde 40yr old, she could have taught me something..[/QUOTE]

Egad. I had tried to expunge her from my mental record but here you are bringing her up again. Ironically, she had her eye (and sad to admit - briefly her paws as well) on me, not you.

That is one hazard of Chikivara and other demokratichnie clubs - the 30ish single-mom secretaries/administrators who frequent the place are quite aggressive, often work in packs, and will actually cock-block if they get pissed enough (in both US and UK senses). As with encountering a stray dog in the park, it's best to avoid eye-contact with them entirely.

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]Egad. I had tried to expunge her from my mental record but here you are bringing her up again. Ironically, she had her eye (and sad to admit - briefly her paws as well) on me, not you.
.[/QUOTE]
Ohhhh - Pizdyets you are sooo right. She wanted you bad. When you and SY first took the Banger Sisters up to dance, you should have seen the daggers from her eyes. I tried to stifle a laugh but she caught me she and wagged her finger at me. She would have hurt you bro.....

[QUOTE=Solntsa Yada]
Sorry mate, didn't notice that she had her eye on you, I just turned her away from the group, as unattractive attention usually sets other girls a standard by which the rest of us get judged. That was rude of me.
[/QUOTE]No worries mate. But you forgot one of the cardinal rules of clubbing, when the ugly one comes over, let the old guy have her. It shows the younger girls that we have group compassion.

The one nice thing about taking the ugly ones home is that they KNOW what is expected.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank] I'm not sure whether or not it is because they don't like it or if it is because when in public they'd rather drink something more fashionable.[/QUOTE]
I think you are on to something here. I was out Friday (and and Thursday) night on a date with a Mamba-girl and she told me she NEVER drinks beer or vodka in public. For the Russian nouveau riche, it is far too common. We were in Cafe Don Pedro on 9, Pevchesky Per. around 1:00 AM cuddling on one of the couches upstairs when a group of Russians came in and ordered Vodka. They quickly got very loud and obnoxious really spoiling the ambiance. We decided to go somewhere else and as we got our coats, she whispered, "that's why I don't like to drink vodka in public".

BTW - Cafe Don Pedro is a VERY nice little spot for a an intimate dinner or drinks. Very cozy with a wood burning fireplace. Great ambiance. Very romantic place if you are looking for one. We had dinner at Michael's on Tverskoye Bulvar and this was a great place to have late night drinks and have a little kissy face time.

Just found this site which appears to be a Moscow-based version of OpenTable. For those of you who aren't fluent in Russian, it looks to be an easy way to set up a restaurant reservation without having to lose face by asking your date to do it for you (assuming you're not staying in the Ritz or the Hyatt and can have your concierge do it for you - ha ha).

[url]http://www.bestnfast.ru/[/url]

And no, I'm in no way affiliated with these guys. In fact, I haven't even tried it.

Guys it is possible to find some girls to sponsor in this contacts page??? Or maybe occasional sex ?

[url]http://www.odnoklassniki.ru/[/url]

I'm asking because I see a couple of profiles with very hot women located in Moscow and they pictures were very sexual (a pretty blonde took a shot of her huge tits for example, and another hot brunnette is showing her wonderful long legs and magnificent ass). And some profiles state that their location is: Moscow never sleep's (I suppose is an adult webpage or something like that)

Any information of can we take advantage of this page to enjoy more Russian pussies is welcome.

[QUOTE=Strike 69]Guys it is possible to find some girls to sponsor in this contacts page??? Or maybe occasional sex ?

[url]http://www.odnoklassniki.ru/[/url]

I'm asking because I see a couple of profiles with very hot women located in Moscow and they pictures were very sexual (a pretty blonde took a shot of her huge tits for example, and another hot brunnette is showing her wonderful long legs and magnificent ass). And some profiles state that their location is: Moscow never sleep's (I suppose is an adult webpage or something like that)

Any information of can we take advantage of this page to enjoy more Russian pussies is welcome.[/QUOTE]

Odnoklassniki is a social networking site, originally designed to find people that attended the same school, so girls would be suspicious why you would be on it (surely you haven't been to a Russian school). Better to use mamba.ru (personals).
"Moscow never sleeps" is part of an eponymous song that has come out fairly recently. The main lines are "Москва, люблю тебя" (Russian, meaning: Moscow, I love you) and "Moscow never sleeps" (in English). To see the video, search for "DJ Smash - Moscow never sleeps" on YouTube.
Speaking of Moscow songs, personally, I love Rammstein's "Moskau" - the lyrics are brilliant (and some mongering-related). A mix of German and Russian though.

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]Just found this site which appears to be a Moscow-based version of OpenTable. For those of you who aren't fluent in Russian, it looks to be an easy way to set up a restaurant reservation without having to lose face by asking your date to do it for you (assuming you're not staying in the Ritz or the Hyatt and can have your concierge do it for you - ha ha).

[url]http://www.bestnfast.ru/[/url]

And no, I'm in no way affiliated with these guys. In fact, I haven't even tried it.[/QUOTE]

In countries where I don't speak the local language (I am fluent in Russian though), I tend to find male friends who can help me with things like that. They often make for good conversation and are invaluable sources of male-interest information.

[QUOTE=Strike 69]Guys it is possible to find some girls to sponsor in this contacts page??? Or maybe occasional sex ?

[url]http://www.odnoklassniki.ru/[/url]
[/QUOTE]

I don't have personal experience at picking up on odnoklassniki, but many friends have had good luck there. As good as mamba, at least.

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]I don't have personal experience at picking up on odnoklassniki, but many friends have had good luck there. As good as mamba, at least.[/QUOTE]
Ditto - Mamba is not bad at all. Out of three dates with three girls, one has led to sex and another one is looking good so far. It takes a bit of work, but it will lead to results.

[QUOTE=Strike 69]Guys it is possible to find some girls to sponsor in this contacts page??? Or maybe occasional sex ?

[url]http://www.odnoklassniki.ru/[/url]

I'm asking because I see a couple of profiles with very hot women located in Moscow and they pictures were very sexual (a pretty blonde took a shot of her huge tits for example, and another hot brunnette is showing her wonderful long legs and magnificent ass). And some profiles state that their location is: Moscow never sleep's (I suppose is an adult webpage or something like that)

Any information of can we take advantage of this page to enjoy more Russian pussies is welcome.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Jake993]Ditto - Mamba is not bad at all. Out of three dates with three girls, one has led to sex and another one is looking good so far. It takes a bit of work, but it will lead to results.[/QUOTE]Odnoklassniki and Mamba are completely different and have different functions.

Mamba is purely a dating "znakomstva" site, complete with *****s, sluts and girls just looking for attention.

Odnoklassniki literally translates as "classmates" and is roughly equivalent to facebook, although not as cheesy.

Although it CAN be used for dating and certainly is by some, Odnoklassniki is primarily a communications and networking platform for social and business circles. Whereas in Mamba it is no crime to ask a girl "how much?" or write "nice tits b1tch", it would be considered bad form to do so on OK, at least as an opening line... :)

Many of the girls on OK are very normal, many married or in relationships and many not looking for dating contacts at all but rather just communication with friends. On Mamba everybody is out to meet somebody.

That isn't saying you can't meet anybody on OK to screw, just the dynamics are different. Maybe imagine it as Mamba being a bar or disco where everybody can talk with anybody and Odnoklassniki being a restaurant where people generally wish to be with their friends.

Another thing to note, if you build a network of friends on OK, EVERYBODY can see who you call a friend or contact. I've had a lot of male friends of the girl friends check me out too... and I am sure it wasn't to check out my package in my surfboard shots. Moreover if your conquests end up as friends on OK, everybody can see who you put your dick in to. Security is an issue and every Russian will tell you that the FSB (formerly KGB) just LOVES Odnoklassniki. Perfect way to see who is with whom.

[url]www.vkontakte.ru[/url] is essentially the same as OK, although primarily for St.Petersburg whereas odnoklassniki is more popular in Moscow and other cities.

For mongering, casual dating and easy sex Mamba is superior in my opinion. Odnoklassniki really only makes sense if you have got at least one foot planted in Moscow.

I also think if too many foreigners start flooding OK, there may be some nationalistic backlash, especially from the Russian guys sick of foreigners slobbering all over their friends, girlfriends, wives and sisters.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Odnoklassniki and Mamba are completely different and have different functions.


Odnoklassniki literally translates as "classmates" and is roughly equivalent to facebook, although not as cheesy.

Although it CAN be used for dating and certainly is by some, Odnoklassniki is primarily a communications and networking platform for social and business circles. Whereas in Mamba it is no crime to ask a girl "how much?" or write "nice tits b1tch", it would be considered bad form to do so on OK, at least as an opening line... :)

Many of the girls on OK are very normal, many married or in relationships and many not looking for dating contacts at all but rather just communication with friends. On Mamba everybody is out to meet somebody.

That isn't saying you can't meet anybody on OK to screw, just the dynamics are different. Maybe imagine it as Mamba being a bar or disco where everybody can talk with anybody and Odnoklassniki being a restaurant where people generally wish to be with their friends.

Another thing to note, if you build a network of friends on OK, EVERYBODY can see who you call a friend or contact. I've had a lot of male friends of the girl friends check me out too... and I am sure it wasn't to check out my package in my surfboard shots. Moreover if your conquests end up as friends on OK, everybody can see who you put your dick in to. Security is an issue and every Russian will tell you that the FSB (formerly KGB) just LOVES Odnoklassniki. Perfect way to see who is with whom.

For mongering, casual dating and easy sex Mamba is superior in my opinion. Odnoklassniki really only makes sense if you have got at least one foot planted in Moscow.

I also think if too many foreigners start flooding OK, there may be some nationalistic backlash, especially from the Russian guys sick of foreigners slobbering all over their friends, girlfriends, wives and sisters.[/QUOTE]


I've continued to check Odnoklassniki and found a profile of a female friend (not based in Moscow) which whom I'm writing and she has at least 3 dozens of only male contacts (only one female friend) the majority of her male friends are based in Moscow or in other countries (Netherlands, Estonia) not in her city (Saratov) but I was surprised because she presented herself to me as a very shy, nerd withouth friends type of girl, also I saw some very hot pics of her with a bikini and microshorts (hooker type shorts) in very suggesting positions. Some of her friends are so much older guys (she's only 18) and many of her pics are rate by her male friends around 30 - 36, and even 49. Lol and she only used to send me "innocent pics" of her holding her cat or walking in the fountains.

I guess she told me some lies here and it's in reality a semi pro because she sweared that she didn't have too many friends... if she's a semi pro then better for me I will try to find out.

I wonder if pictures and sex services in Mamba sites, such as [url]www.moslove.ru[/url], are real and genuine or not? For example, if a girl replies "yes" to a swallow blowjob request, is that true or a way to cheat customers?

Thanks

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]I wonder if pictures and sex services in Mamba sites, such as [url]www.moslove.ru[/url], are real and genuine or not? For example, if a girl replies "yes" to a swallow blowjob request, is that true or a way to cheat customers?

Thanks[/QUOTE] I don't know about Moslove, but the three girls that I have met from Mamba all had accurate photos. Well, one of them stretched the truth a little and posted a photo that was probably 5 years old, but other than that it was all reasonably accurate.

Mamba is a group of sites with the same programming and database. It is interesting how moderators work there.

Anyway, about our business, I contacted a lot of prostitutes but I am sure most of them are agencies. Therefore I am not very trustly about pictures.

In your experience, did you meet freebie or prostitutes?

And if you met prostitutes too, all pictures were genuine?

The most important question is about quality of sex: when prostitutes or agencies reply "yes, I make swallow blowjobs", this reply is reliable or it is just a lie to attract customers?

[QUOTE=Jake993]I don't know about Moslove, but the three girls that I have met from Mamba all had accurate photos. Well, one of them stretched the truth a little and posted a photo that was probably 5 years old, but other than that it was all reasonably accurate.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]Mamba is a group of sites with the same programming and database. It is interesting how moderators work there.

Anyway, about our business, I contacted a lot of prostitutes but I am sure most of them are agencies. Therefore I am not very trustly about pictures.

In your experience, did you meet freebie or prostitutes?

And if you met prostitutes too, all pictures were genuine?

The most important question is about quality of sex: when prostitutes or agencies reply "yes, I make swallow blowjobs", this reply is reliable or it is just a lie to attract customers?[/QUOTE]If you are talking about Moscow, lately most of the pros I have been contacted by or contacted on Mamba are working in salons, at least all of the afforadably priced ones.

Whether or not they do swallow blowjobs is ultimately up to them, but generally most salons ask their girls to do CBJ, so I wouldn't count on the salon always having a girl who looks like the picture and also wouldn't count on them always telling the truth.

Best resource to check is [url]www.sextalk.ru[/url]

Of of dosug.nu, you can get in direct contact with the real girl (and pictures geneally real). Perhaps you can get a more accurate picture there.

In terms of freebies met on Mamba, I've NEVER met a girl who didn't look like her picture. Often they look better than their pictures.

For those of you (like me) who wonder about the possibilities for cheap sex in the most expensive city in the world, here is a humorous report from a Moderator on sextalk that pretty much sums up the situation at the bottom end of the market.

The author seems to be using ducks as a metaphor for working girls. MBR is local slang for BBBJ.

[i]Autumn... it's getting cold. It would seem the DUCKS should be migrating to warmer climates... On the contrary - with approach of cold, the DUCKS, in my opinion, only increase! At least on Kutuza!

Here's the thing... Until recently, Kutuza, despite the central location and abundance of cars costing in excess of $100K, remained the last outpost in the city where, without negotiation, you could get a BJ for 500r, but now, the situation is completely screwed up, practically everywhere they ask for 1,000[BJ] / 1,500[sex] and even (!!!!) 1,500/2,000!!!!!!!!!!!!!

But all is not so bad on the Main Line of Russia!

Not more than 2 hours ago (at 19:00 Moscow Time) I am driving home, and on crossing Kutuza and Old Rubleffki, at the flower stalls (where only a few days ago a new metro station has opened - "Slavic Parkway"), I see the working maiden in a suspiciously short skirt and high boots. I brake, roll down the window…

"You're hoping for a blow job?", she asks.

"How much?", I ask (already expecting to hear her say 1,000r and inhaling air into my lungs to yell at her, "GET OUT OF HERE!!! YOU!!! B!!!!".

"300", she replies.

"How much???", I ask.

"THREE HUNDRED", she answers.

"Get in!", I tell her.

Well, what to say about this maiden? About 30 years old, average height, reddish-brown hair, thick legs, big wide ass, tits - size 1.5, but excellent compared to the majority of DUCKS - they are fresh and do not sag. She calls herself Olga.

Location for the process - nearby, in the bushes at Old Rubleffki, near the garages. She doesn't take off her skirt and bare her ass. Worse than that, she doesn't even unbutton her bra and her tits (pleasant enough to the touch) I had to reach for in order to grope.

She has no condoms!!!!! She takes it into her mouth without a rubber, this is so MBR lovers can try playing Russian roulette. Naturally, she has no napkins. But this impression of the addict, which she already appears to be - is no less like the needy local resident who is earning, in a similar way, their meal.

She sucks mechanically, like a sewing machine, without any variety. She doesn't lick my balls, but she can suck for a long time - I'm pretty tired after work, and I am tormented for 20 minutes.

She says that she works this location "now and then, it depends". And so, with pleasure, leaves her phone number, and a message "want to relax? - call 15 minutes in advance, and I will meet you here." In this connection I publish her phone in the report.[/i]

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]Not more than 2 hours ago (at 19:00 Moscow Time) I am driving home, and on crossing Kutuza and Old Rubleffki, at the flower stalls (where only a few days ago a new metro station has opened - "Slavic Parkway"), I see the working maiden in a suspiciously short skirt and high boots. I brake, roll down the window…[/QUOTE]

LOL! Good find, Strav! I'd seen girls there many times before, but had just assumed they were waiting for someone (boyfriend maybe?) to pick them up. I (wrongly) figured it'd be way too central of a location for WGs to set up shop. Unlike the major shosses just outside MKAD where the tochki are obvious (and expected).

Hmm. Time to borrow my buddy's car and make a try for it? :)

Pizdyets,

You're on! I'll get her phone number. LOL

Thanks for reply!

This is a big enigma. Until one year ago, all Ukrainian and Russian road prostitutes in Italy had made swallow blowjobs on request, maybe they didn't made them with bad mood, but in general Ukrainian and Hungarian prostitutes mean swallow blowjobs for 20/30/50 euros. Therefore I thought "I shall go to Ukraine and Russia, the countries of masters in swallow blowjobs", instead. In Kiev it is very hard to find good sex providers. In Moscow I read more opportunities but I am afraid Russians lie much more than Ukrainians. In Kiev the first prostitute I met was also the better (she gave me more than I expected) and I remember her profile management in Internet was identical to Moscow profile management in Internet. Ukraine and Russia are border countries but their people seem to come from two different worlds!

Moreover, I had an experience with a hardcore Ukrainian young prostitute (but with some Russian/Siberian/Tartar blood), she started prostitution at 13 years old at salons in Kharkov and she was used to do EVERYTHING, also without condom. Therefore I am very doubtful about protected sex: protected or unprotected sex is just a lie to keep prices high!

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]If you are talking about Moscow, lately most of the pros I have been contacted by or contacted on Mamba are working in salons, at least all of the afforadably priced ones.

Whether or not they do swallow blowjobs is ultimately up to them, but generally most salons ask their girls to do CBJ, so I wouldn't count on the salon always having a girl who looks like the picture and also wouldn't count on them always telling the truth.

Best resource to check is [url]www.sextalk.ru[/url]

Of of dosug.nu, you can get in direct contact with the real girl (and pictures geneally real). Perhaps you can get a more accurate picture there.

In terms of freebies met on Mamba, I've NEVER met a girl who didn't look like her picture. Often they look better than their pictures.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]Therefore I am very doubtful about protected sex: protected or unprotected sex is just a lie to keep prices high![/QUOTE]Seems to me protected sex is a reasonable precaution to keep oneself from dying a slow, withering death.

Just a thought. :)

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]Therefore I am very doubtful about protected sex: protected or unprotected sex is just a lie to keep prices high![/QUOTE]Who knows, although I think that it is obvious that the rougher the ho is in terms of lifestyle (drugs, coercion etc.) the more likely it is she will voluntarily participate in unprotected sex and be forced to do it. In any case, in terms of vaginal sex I wouldn't take any chances.

Now BBBJ... that's hard to resist. Still wouldn't do it with a street ho that blows truckdrivers for 300 rubles though.

Generally speaking though, I think price levels are independent of protected vs. non-protected. By that logic, non-protected would be MORE expensive, as many mongers want it and are willing to pay it. In reality though, the more expensive pros are more likely to demand CBJ and certainly wish to avoid BB (bareback) sex.

Also, high traffic (salons, brothels etc.) seem to insist more on CBJ, at least at the mid to high level.

Street hos, no matter which country they are in, are the lowest end of the totem pole. They are, and I mean no offense to them directly especially considering the fact that many aren't working the streets voluntarily, the trash of the prostitution industry. I shudder to think about their lives, even though I have screwed a lot of tochka hos back in the day. I chose not to think too much about their lives, even though I did once have a semi-relationship with one for a short while. It proved to be impossible. Hope she is OK, but I am quite certain any innocence in her was robbed by the life she led.

BBBJ... interestingly enough, contrary to supposedly "lawless Russia", very high traffic brothels in hyper-regulated Germany (FKK) are virtually ALL with BBBJ as standard service, and some of the women there have been in the business for 10 years or more.

If you read the following document, it will keep you away from Russian street prostitutes forever: [url]http://www.popline.org/docs/193315[/url] .
According to this, 48% of street prostitutes in St. Petersburg are HIV positive (and 96% of the HIV+ prostitutes are IV drug users). In Moscow, 15% of the street prostitutes are HIV+.

The statistics in Moscow are like Russian roulette with one bullet in the gun. The statistics in St. Petersburg are like playing with three bullets in a six-shooter.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Who knows, although I think that it is obvious that the rougher the ho is in terms of lifestyle (drugs, coercion etc.) the more likely it is she will voluntarily participate in unprotected sex and be forced to do it. In any case, in terms of vaginal sex I wouldn't take any chances.

Now BBBJ... that's hard to resist. Still wouldn't do it with a street ho that blows truckdrivers for 300 rubles though.

Generally speaking though, I think price levels are independent of protected vs. non-protected. By that logic, non-protected would be MORE expensive, as many mongers want it and are willing to pay it. In reality though, the more expensive pros are more likely to demand CBJ and certainly wish to avoid BB (bareback) sex.

Also, high traffic (salons, brothels etc.) seem to insist more on CBJ, at least at the mid to high level.

Street hos, no matter which country they are in, are the lowest end of the totem pole. They are, and I mean no offense to them directly especially considering the fact that many aren't working the streets voluntarily, the trash of the prostitution industry. I shudder to think about their lives, even though I have screwed a lot of tochka hos back in the day. I chose not to think too much about their lives, even though I did once have a semi-relationship with one for a short while. It proved to be impossible. Hope she is OK, but I am quite certain any innocence in her was robbed by the life she led.

BBBJ... interestingly enough, contrary to supposedly "lawless Russia", very high traffic brothels in hyper-regulated Germany (FKK) are virtually ALL with BBBJ as standard service, and some of the women there have been in the business for 10 years or more.[/QUOTE]

Doctor Skank,

It seems we had a similar life experience with a street walker, but our opinions are pretty different:

- Until one year ago, non-UE prostitutes could work on roads only, because an hypocritical Italian law leaves all prostitution to criminal organizations. Therefore street walkers in Italy were the only real choice. We could find any kind of girls, young or old, beautiful or ugly, lovely or unpolite, passioned or mechanical, vaginal fuck or extreme sex, cheap or expensive. About prices, prices are often connected to girl's mood and pimp's management. I can't explain everything here, but there is no direct connection between price and quality of sex: cheap price doesn't mean bad sex and expensive price doesn't mean good sex!

Moreover, the other prostitutes, working in flats, are almost all frauds because very expensive prices for unprofessional mechanical sex.

- Yes, I am afraid about the decision of my former friend to become an hardcore prostitute at 13 years old (this is horrible! ), but I see with my eyes, she has a dangerous work but she enjoys her adventurous life better than my regular life. Yes, she lives only for money and the good girl was dead 8 years ago:.(In my experience, there was no violence by pimps, there was girl' greed only!

[QUOTE=Shelbysbaker]If you read the following document, it will keep you away from Russian street prostitutes forever: [url]http://www.popline.org/docs/193315[/url] .
According to this, 48% of street prostitutes in St. Petersburg are HIV positive (and 96% of the HIV+ prostitutes are IV drug users). In Moscow, 15% of the street prostitutes are HIV+.

The statistics in Moscow are like Russian roulette with one bullet in the gun. The statistics in St. Petersburg are like playing with three bullets in a six-shooter.[/QUOTE]Ouch, pretty scary stats even if I am not a firm believer in statistics, they do indicate a general trend. Nonetheless, why would anybody screw a street ho bareback in the first place? There is a degree of risk in any sex, but there are some risks just too extreme to be taken.

Even scarier than the prostitute statistic is the fact that official numbers put 10% of Russia's HIV positive in St.Petersburg.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Ouch, pretty scary stats even if I am not a firm believer in statistics, they do indicate a general trend. Nonetheless, why would anybody screw a street ho bareback in the first place? There is a degree of risk in any sex, but there are some risks just too extreme to be taken.

Even scarier than the prostitute statistic is the fact that official numbers put 10% of Russia's HIV positive in St.Petersburg.[/QUOTE]

Condoms occassionally break...

Definitely makes me think twice about hitting a tochka - [B]especially[/B] in Piter.

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]
Definitely makes me think twice about hitting a tochka - [B]especially[/B] in Piter.[/QUOTE]

Maybe this question is more suited to the St. Petersburg forum. But I heard that tochkas were unique to Moscow, and that they didn't exist in Piter. (At least not the kind where the parade of girls stands in front of the headlights.) Is that true?

[QUOTE=Shelbysbaker]Maybe this question is more suited to the St. Petersburg forum. But I heard that tochkas were unique to Moscow, and that they didn't exist in Piter. (At least not the kind where the parade of girls stands in front of the headlights.) Is that true?[/QUOTE]

Hmm, from a quick scan on sextalk, it appears you're correct. Now I know why my colleagues in Piter always invited me to banya and not tochka! Not that tochkas are usually my cup of tea even in Moscow...

[QUOTE=Shelbysbaker]Maybe this question is more suited to the St. Petersburg forum. But I heard that tochkas were unique to Moscow, and that they didn't exist in Piter. (At least not the kind where the parade of girls stands in front of the headlights.) Is that true?[/QUOTE]Tochkas exist everywhere in some form AFAIK. In any case, it seems that local mamachkas can drum up a few girls to stand in line and choose from whether you are in Ryazan or Pskov. Finding these mamachkas is another challenge entirely, but that is another story.

Tochka is also a relative term, a bunch of girls lined up along side the highway giving blowjobs for $20 or quick sex in the car/truck for $70 aren't the same as Moscow's tochka girls whose prices can reach low end Night Flight level ($300-500) and are for the night. One man's tochka is another man's 3 girls standing infront of a Toyota Hiace at 2 am outside the train station in Novosibirsk. I also haven't tochka'ed in a long time, not because of risk per se but more because of cost. P4P is less and less a part of my mongering, especially in Moscow.

Risks? There is always risk in sex. The girl you pick up at Hot Dog or the freebie you pick up at Opera could also have AIDS, herpes, syphillis, gonorrhea. Broken condom can happen of course and has happened to me on a few occasions. I remember every incident vividly as they were dramatic in one way or another. I switched brands and hasn't happened since, but that is also another story.

I think as a monger/man-wh0re every individual has to judge risks for themselves.

Bareback sex with freebies/girlfriends?
Bareback sex with pros?
BBBJ with freebies/girlfriends?
BBBJ with pros?
Sex with multiple partners?

I've actually gotten more cautious with age, but anybody out there doing a lot of fucking puts himself in a higher risk category than those who are only occasionally having sex. I think that is fair to say and something mongers accept as part of the entertainment package.

All I can say about the subject is play as safe as you see fit and get yourself checked regularly.

[QUOTE=Shelbysbaker]If you read the following document, it will keep you away from Russian street prostitutes forever: [url]http://www.popline.org/docs/193315[/url] .
According to this, 48% of street prostitutes in St. Petersburg are HIV positive (and 96% of the HIV+ prostitutes are IV drug users). In Moscow, 15% of the street prostitutes are HIV+.[/QUOTE]

So, Shelby, we should all insulate ourselves from this awsome risk by sticking to the online services that you recommend? Well... maybe. But, when I was a child out in hillbilly country, Denmark my old gran used to tell me:"Talk is cheap." I'm not tempted by this site Mixphoto and, frankly, I think it's a trap site to make foreigners overpay for what they could have had down on the next corner.

i'm not advocating anything. everyone should make their own decisions. the riskiest thing you could probably do is have unprotected receptive anal sex with a male homosexual street prostitute who has track marks from iv drug use. the safest thing you can do is become a monk and join a monastery... on second thought, maybe it isn't (especially if you're a little boy:-)). most of in the forum find ourselves somewhere between these two extremes.

i think that doctor_skank put it most succinctly (look down a couple of posts):
[quote=doctor_skank]all i can say about the subject is play as safe as you see fit and get yourself checked regularly.[/quote]

regarding mixphoto: i'm not affiliated with mixphoto in any way. i'm just a satisfied customer who is reporting on his experiences. it's up to you to decide if it's safer (or less safe) than anything else you might be doing.

and if you can find ample girls "on the next corner" who will come into a studio setting and pose for pictures they swap cum with their girlfriends, suck my creampie out of their girlfriend's pussy, get gangbanged by 4 guys, [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord134][CodeWord134][/url] in a bathtub, shave their pussy, or stick a vibrator in their ass while i creampie them, then by all means, please tell me which street corner. that's what the forum is all about: free exchange of information.

[quote=priamos]so, shelby, we should all insulate ourselves from this awsome risk by sticking to the online services that you recommend? well... maybe. but, when i was a child out in hillbilly country, denmark my old gran used to tell me:"talk is cheap." i'm not tempted by this site mixphoto and, frankly, i think it's a trap site to make foreigners overpay for what they could have had down on the next corner.[/quote]

Guys I cannot get the website of mamba translated from Russian into English using google or altavista, any suggestions?

Yeah, learn Russian.

[QUOTE=Uke Boy]Yeah, learn Russian.[/QUOTE]

I'm on it already.....

Sorry, but does anyone have experiences with emailing escort providers in Moscow? And, why do I ask such a silly question? Well, I'm preparing a trip to Moscow a few weeks from now - on business with only an evening plus an afternoon to myself, so I need to use my time efficiently. Since about one fifth of the girls on public sites such as intimcity and ston give their email address I figured the best way would be to mail some providers and ask if they are available on those days. But...

...zilch! Nobody can be bothered to answer emails, even as they provided the address themselves. I may have made a mistake in writing in English (I don't speak Russian but could easily have translated online), because one suspects that these girls are deluged with mails from foreign time wasters. Does anyone have other, and better, experiences with this? If not, could someone recommend a phone-based agency with an English speaking reception and reasonsable rates? I'm not cheap & perfectly willing to pay the going rates, but some of the English language sites offering working girls in Moscow look truly extortionate.

You seem to be an another absolute beginner. (do you remember that movie? ). The first trick is: always speak Russian, you can't? This is the biggest trouble for you. Meanwhile, if you are ready to pay everything (this is silly! ), try to look for very high quality sex, not just a vaginal fuck with a "beautie".

[QUOTE=Priamos]Sorry, but does anyone have experiences with emailing escort providers in Moscow? And, why do I ask such a silly question? Well, I'm preparing a trip to Moscow a few weeks from now - on business with only an evening plus an afternoon to myself, so I need to use my time efficiently. Since about one fifth of the girls on public sites such as intimcity and ston give their email address I figured the best way would be to mail some providers and ask if they are available on those days. But...

...zilch! Nobody can be bothered to answer emails, even as they provided the address themselves. I may have made a mistake in writing in English (I don't speak Russian but could easily have translated online), because one suspects that these girls are deluged with mails from foreign time wasters. Does anyone have other, and better, experiences with this? If not, could someone recommend a phone-based agency with an English speaking reception and reasonsable rates? I'm not cheap & perfectly willing to pay the going rates, but some of the English language sites offering working girls in Moscow look truly extortionate.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]You seem to be an another absolute beginner. (do you remember that movie? ). The first trick is: always speak Russian, you can't? This is the biggest trouble for you. Meanwhile, if you are ready to pay everything (this is silly! ), try to look for very high quality sex, not just a vaginal fuck with a "beautie".[/QUOTE]

Look, there's no reason to get nasty. First, I'm not an absolute beginner: I have plenty of mongering experience in Western Europe, Turkey and such more "exotic" places to which my business trips have brought me. For reference, see my previous 200+ postings. Secondly, I sometimes feel that I should be walking around with a little badge on my chest saying "English is not my first language". (In fact, it's my third.) Having learned four languages back in high school I have little time for arrogant people who think mastering their native tounge is totally enough - and into this category I include "nasty Americans" alongside with "post-Stalinist Russians", "chauvinist French" and a lot of other people. That said, I don't speak all the 480 recognised, official languages of the globe and, frankly, think it would be appropriate if people in the Moscow nightlife would (also) be capable of speaking a couple of foreign languages. I myself can offer French and German in addition to English, plus a bit of Spanish and a bit of Polish alongside with my native Danish and the two other Scandinavian languages.

Priamos,

I think your situation is probably fairly common; in Moscow for a day or two and you don't speak Russian.

You should probably forget about the internet escorts if you don't speak Russian. Your best bet (as much as I hate to admit it) will be the expat clubs. You can waste a lot of time, and money, chasing freebies, so you might want to go straight for the working girls at Hot Dog's or Night Flight.

You could also try the salons, which have been discussed here in great detail. They would be perfect for your free afternoon.

[QUOTE=Strike 69]Guys I cannot get the website of mamba translated from Russian into English using google or altavista, any suggestions?[/QUOTE]Try translate.ru

Priamos, sorry for misunderstanding, I just said in few words what you (we) need to go in Russia. I am sure you need effective advises and not sweet dreams (do you remember Eurythmics?) Congratulations for your languages, I am sure it will be easy to learn Russian too: just a full immersion in Moscow for some weeks.
P.S. maybe my humour is hard to understand.

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]
You should probably forget about the internet escorts if you don't speak Russian. Your best bet (as much as I hate to admit it) will be the expat clubs. You can waste a lot of time, and money, chasing freebies, so you might want to go straight for the working girls at Hot Dog's or Night Flight.

You could also try the salons, which have been discussed here in great detail. They would be perfect for your free afternoon.[/QUOTE]
First, let me say that I haven't been back to Moscow for more than a year, so my information may not be as up-to-date as the other posts. However, my experience is the opposite of Strav's one: I had better chances with escort than with salons in Moscow when I didn't speak a single word in Russian (but we may not be talking about the same category of escort though).

Concerning salons, I'm not sure they all speak English and, to find their address, you need to be able to read the street name plaques in cyrillic. I needed to learn Russian to go to salons.

Concerning escorts, I have used a few which spoke English:

[url=http://www.girls-students.ru/enter.php]Girls Students [/url]
[url=http://www.diana-escort.ru/enter.php]Diana Escort[/url]

Not the same thing as intimcity and ston, more expensive, but best option as far as I'm concerned if you don't speak Russian.

A few years ago, photos of girls are real and telephonist speaks fluent English, as well as some of the girls. However, I haven't use them for some years now and things may have changed. I think I've read somewhere that there are some bait-and-switch now, so you must emphasize that it's the girl you choose that you want, and be prepared to send the girl back home if she's not the right one.

It would be a shame if things have changed, because I was very satisfied with their services before.

Good luck,
Jim

[QUOTE=GandJim]....
Concerning escorts, I have used a few which spoke English:

[url=http://www.girls-students.ru/enter.php]Girls Students [/url]
[url=http://www.diana-escort.ru/enter.php]Diana Escort[/url]

...Jim[/QUOTE]

Thanks Jim for the links, you or anybody knows actually how much is the price for one hour of escort to hotel ?

Are they the same agency ? Their web pages look very similar.

[QUOTE=Priamos]So, Shelby, we should all insulate ourselves from this awsome risk by sticking to the online services that you recommend? Well... maybe. But, when I was a child out in hillbilly country, Denmark my old gran used to tell me:"Talk is cheap." I'm not tempted by this site Mixphoto and, frankly, I think it's a trap site to make foreigners overpay for what they could have had down on the next corner.[/QUOTE]

Priamos


Second trick is you might want to RTFF.

Value is in the eyes of the shopper; it’s all there in the forums.

Shelbybaker simply shared his fulfilling a porno fantasy with forum members. Few members research to that extent or take the time to share. He has no ownership or benefit with mixphoto.

You might want to get actual knowledge of a city/country prior to becoming so well informed.

If you are concerned with “Awesome risk” best to stay on your grannies farm in Denmark.

With the exception of keeping it in your pants there is no safe haven in our hobby.

Guido88

[QUOTE=Guido88]Priamos
Second trick is you might want to RTFF.
[/QUOTE]

The problem is, I did. If you take much of the FF at face value you'd think the Moscow P2P scene has prices that are twice as high as Germany and the Netherlands (countries with about five times the average income, I may add). Strictly as an outsider, it would seem to indicate an "expensive taste" on the of many of the self-declared Moscow experts.

[QUOTE=Guido88]
If you are concerned with “Awesome risk” best to stay on your grannies farm in Denmark.

With the exception of keeping it in your pants there is no safe haven in our hobby.
Guido88[/QUOTE]

OMG, what have you been smoking? My remarks were dripping with sarchasm, alluding to the risks that Shelby seems to think is such a big problem. Kindly don't turn it back on me.

I wonder if anybody could inform about prices and services and pictures and girls in:

[url]http://www.girls-students.ru/enter.php[/url]

[url]http://www.diana-escort.ru/enter.php[/url]

Are they reliable? what is difference? what about the description of sex sessions?

[QUOTE=Priamos]The problem is, I did. If you take much of the FF at face value you'd think the Moscow P2P scene has prices that are twice as high as Germany and the Netherlands (countries with about five times the average income, I may add). Strictly as an outsider, it would seem to indicate an "expensive taste" on the of many of the self-declared Moscow experts.[/QUOTE]There are basically 2 levels of hobbyists in Moscow; the guys who live/work there or visit on a regular basis and know their way around and have some basic facility with the Russian language. For guys like this, who have the "game", sex is basically free, if you exclude all the associated costs of; club entry, drinks, taxis, gifts, etc. Or, it is very minimal, because they can negotiate directly with the local girls.

And then there are guys like yourself; never been to Moscow, don't speak the lingo, are totally clueless and expect to be catered to. For guys like yourself, there are places like Night Flight and internet escort sites where you can talk to someone in English. You can distinguish these sites from the internet escort sites that cater to local guys by the dialing code on the phone number. The girls on the local sites prefix their numbers with an 8, which is the internal dialing code for Russia. They expect to get calls from local guys, who speak Russian, and their fees are set accordingly. Typically, these girls are looking for cash in hand, not a long term virtual email relationship. If the dialing code begins with a 7, this is the external prefix for dialing Russia, so you know they are expecting calls from foreign customers. For these, the prices will be about twice as high as in Germany and the Netherlands, because, well, they know there are guys like you who have no choice but to pay them. :)

[QUOTE=Priamos]The problem is, I did. If you take much of the FF at face value you'd think the Moscow P2P scene has prices that are twice as high as Germany and the Netherlands (countries with about five times the average income, I may add). Strictly as an outsider, it would seem to indicate an "expensive taste" on the of many of the self-declared Moscow experts. [/QUOTE]

Okay, Priamos, I know you're trolling, but lest you confuse others, let's look at the relative prices between these.

Let's take the Palace in Frankfurt, for example. It's not exactly cheap, as I recall. 90E entrance + 50E per half hour? So, let's assume you go twice for an hour each. That's 290E.

Now you take a reputable salon such as Fantasy's in Moscow. It's 4000R/hr. At 2 hours (during which time you can have at least 2 different girls), that's 8000R, or around 220E. Cheaper and a helluvalot more discreet.

If you want take-out, I can guarantee that you can find cheaper in Moscow, as long as you take the time and have reasonable game. One strategy is to go to HotDog on a Friday/Saturday (when it's packed with dyeffki) and drink with a number of the girls you find attractive and to get their digits for future use. Understand that they pay $60 just to get in the door. Including taxi and drinks, that comes to around $100 total expenses per night because these girls typically live far from downtown. That has to come from somewhere, especially since many don't pick up every night. However, if you call them on another night (especially on, say, weeknights where their chances of picking up are lower), you have leverage to close a much better deal. And if you treat them to dinner and a nice night on the town, it may turn into a freebie. It's certainly worked for me in the past. Maybe you can find that in Frankfurt, but I haven't found it.

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]Okay, Priamos, I know you're trolling, but lest you confuse others, let's look at the relative prices between these.

Let's take the Palace in Frankfurt, for example. It's not exactly cheap, as I recall. 90E entrance + 50E per half hour? So, let's assume you go twice for an hour each. That's 290E.[/QUOTE]

Let me start in the opposite corner, Pizdyets. For guys like me who (in the delicate phrasology of Stravinsky) are "totally clueless and expect to be catered for" the Moscow section of ISG is perhaps a bit of a disappointment. If you've gone over my past postings (as your reference to FKK Frankfurt seems to indicate) you should know that I have over the years tried to be helpful toward beginners, taking the time to explain the local scene even when people could have read this information for themselves further down on the tread, in my favourite haunt Istanbul as well as my local playgrounds Paris and Brussels.

Please let me share with you the following comparison: a few years ago I landed a business trip to that favourite mongering destination, Bangkok. ISG was enormously useful to me. Upon reading 20-30 postings I had a complete picture of the major watering holes, as well as the going rates - 2,500 to 3,000 bath for a night in those days - that one should expect to pay. (I realise that the word "should" here may grate some nerves; it is conditioned on a North European notion of "fair prices" that people from more individualistic countries such as the Wild West and the Wild East would probably refute.) Following this it was very easy for me to discard a few online escort agencies offering "company for the low price of 5,000 baht - 10,000 for the whole night" as the tourist traps they were.

In the Moscow department the tables appear to be turned. I can go on a Russian integrator portal (I read Russian even if I don't speak it) and establish my own market prices: two hours outcall mostly fall in the price fork of 200-300 USD. A night is upward of 400 USD. However, if I ask my fellow mongers for directions I receive private emails (and postings) directing me to service providers charging upward of 200 Euros per hour and, in one case, intimating that if I'm not willing to pay that then I'm a pathetic cheapskate. It does look, Pizdyets, as if this part of the board is in the hands of people (expats, locals...) who are not motivated by fraternal feelings towards fellow mongers but rather a combination of classic Russian chauvinism ("foreigners in Russia should PAY!") and the nouveau riche excesses of the Wild East ("Flaunt it baby! Yeah!").

Finally, let me respond directly to the point you raised. The entrance of FKK Palace in Frankfurt (why is this of interest, BTW?) is 75 Euros. An hour costs 100 Euros, that is true, but if you want only one pop the price is 50 Euros. This amount is - almost always, that is - inclusive of French kissing and blowjob without condom. So, unless you overpay (which I have often done, as you know if you've read my postings: for instance I often slip the girl another 50 Euros for CIM), you can have two girls offering GFE or at least near-GFE spend 2-3 hours, or as long as you please, having free drinks, free meals, sauna, jacuzzi, porn cinema... for 175 Euros. Voila.

[QUOTE=Lukasek]Thanks Jim for the links, you or anybody knows actually how much is the price for one hour of escort to hotel ? [/QUOTE]
I haven't used Girls-Students and Diana Escort for years, it was back in the time I spoke not a word in Russian (and price can double in a couple of years). I think Guido88 has used them more recently so maybe he can chime in. Or you can do a search, a few other members of this board (or similar boards) have used them.

Concerning cost and services in general, FKKs are nowadays a better option than Moscow if you're new to the scene and don't speak Russian. I've been to Russia for years, and time have changed. The golden age of Moscow is over as far as I'm concerned. The time where you can get a tochka girl for overnight for less than 100 USD, with BBBJ, kissing and even anal, are definitely gone. It's harder and harder to get BBBJ and "anal included" in Russia today (OK, last year, haven't been back since but I doubt the trend has reversed direction). You can't even find a decent looking girl in a tochka now, and an overnight with a pick-up girl from a club doesn't last more than 3-4 hours.

Jim

Gandjim,

The flight club in moscow, the girls there were asking as much as $600 for the night. And its the same in st petersburgh. why the girls there are asking for so much is beyond me, and on top of all that you have to have a visa and an invitation form for the Hotel you book to go to Russia. So the same for me, the one time and only time i ever went to Russia.

[QUOTE=Priamos]The problem is, I did. If you take much of the FF at face value you'd think the Moscow P2P scene has prices that are twice as high as Germany and the Netherlands (countries with about five times the average income, I may add). Strictly as an outsider, it would seem to indicate an "expensive taste" on the of many of the self-declared Moscow experts.



OMG, what have you been smoking? My remarks were dripping with sarchasm, alluding to the risks that Shelby seems to think is such a big problem. Kindly don't turn it back on me.[/QUOTE]

Priamos


The problem with Pay 4 Play in Moscow is that in a few short years pricing has skyrocketed, along with diminished performance by the girls. They now believe they can charge ridicules rates, provide shitty service and leave early.

This has changed by mongers now throwing piles of cash for something the old timers were paying $75.00- 150.00 a night for prime pussy as recently as 2005

At this point Moscow is much pricier than Western Europe. Part of it is too much money in Moscow, the other is that mongers are neither shopping nor negotiating to get the best deals.

As Strav pointed out if you take the easy path it will cost more. Even on my 1st trip speaking zero Russian I got on the computer and phone and shopped until I found what I was looking for. Out of 20 calls 18 may have been unsuccessful but the other 2 were awesome.

By nature the Russian women have IMHO been subservient and quite willing to please. The newbies overpay and let the girls get away with things that an experienced monger or Russian man would not.

P4P in Moscow is now a very expensive addiction. It is a shame to see it deteriorate so quickly.

As to what I have been smoking. Well it is harvest season….. I am guilty on that one.

Apologies for missing your sarcasm.

It did irritate me that there was a lack of appreciation for Shelby’s input.

Guido88

[QUOTE=GandJim]I haven't used Girls-Students and Diana Escort for years, it was back in the time I spoke not a word in Russian (and price can double in a couple of years). I think Guido88 has used them more recently so maybe he can chime in. Or you can do a search, a few other members of this board (or similar boards) have used them.

Concerning cost and services in general, FKKs are nowadays a better option than Moscow if you're new to the scene and don't speak Russian. I've been to Russia for years, and time have changed. The golden age of Moscow is over as far as I'm concerned. The time where you can get a tochka girl for overnight for less than 100 USD, with BBBJ, kissing and even anal, are definitely gone. It's harder and harder to get BBBJ and "anal included" in Russia today (OK, last year, haven't been back since but I doubt the trend has reversed direction). You can't even find a decent looking girl in a tochka now, and an overnight with a pick-up girl from a club doesn't last more than 3-4 hours.

Jim[/QUOTE]

Jim

At this point P4P in Moscow is out of my price range. Last trip I substituted Thailand for Moscow and found good values. It’s hard for me to pay ludicrous amounts of money for a woman.

My most recent reports came from Firebird and I think Jake or one of his buddies may have used them. Firebird spoke highly of the experience. If I remember right Jake did as well.

Sounds as though the website may not be quite as reliable as it once was. There have been complaints of short time, false photos and bait and switch.

Key thing for the newbies to remember is if the girl at the door is not what you ordered send her back with cab fare and move on.

Make it clear to the girl that leaving early is simply not an option.

Guido88

[QUOTE=Guido88]As to what I have been smoking. Well it is harvest season….. I am guilty on that one.

Apologies for missing your sarcasm.

It did irritate me that there was a lack of appreciation for Shelby’s input.[/QUOTE]

Your're probably quite right that, as a newcomer, I walked into that one on my big feet. Just "between the two of us", I had a bruising discussion some time ago on another country thread with a gentleman who was actively promoting one, expensive, set of services (nothing wrong with that, of course) to the point of ranting against anybody who would recommend anything else. I never came to realise whether that guy was simply obsessive or financially interested in the services he proffered. When I saw Shelby criticising alternative service providers I thought "f***, there we go again!" obviously without properly recognising the man's role and past contributions to this thread.

Sorry about that.

[QUOTE=Guido88]It did irritate me that there was a lack of appreciation for Shelby’s input.

Guido88[/QUOTE]There's a lot of appreciation for Shelby's work, he obviously put a lot of effort into it.

And I feel no shame in being jealous.

:)

Guys can anybody please recommend me a couple of pretty Russian Blondinkas that provides good service? Preferently with big tits and/or ass (no obligatory but desirable)

Thanks

If you are not an oligarch Moscow is not, IMHO, the place for P4P. In that respect Germany is a lot more value for money, and easier to reach. Thailand and the Philippines are cheap, I suppose, if you are into Oriental women.

Moscow is, however, a place for freebies if you know where to go, what Russian girls want, and ideally, speak Russian. But hunting freebies is still expensive: you'll spend over $100/night just for accommodation. Hence, unless you have special ties with Russia or a lot of money, I would not recommend it.
Sorry to disappoint ...


[QUOTE=Guido88]Jim

At this point P4P in Moscow is out of my price range. Last trip I substituted Thailand for Moscow and found good values. It’s hard for me to pay ludicrous amounts of money for a woman.

My most recent reports came from Firebird and I think Jake or one of his buddies may have used them. Firebird spoke highly of the experience. If I remember right Jake did as well.

Sounds as though the website may not be quite as reliable as it once was. There have been complaints of short time, false photos and bait and switch.

Key thing for the newbies to remember is if the girl at the door is not what you ordered send her back with cab fare and move on.

Make it clear to the girl that leaving early is simply not an option.

Guido88[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=SlutLover]
Moscow is, however, a place for freebies if you know where to go, what Russian girls want, and ideally, speak Russian. But hunting freebies is still expensive: you'll spend over $100/night just for accommodation. Hence, unless you have special ties with Russia or a lot of money, I would not recommend it.
Sorry to disappoint ...[/QUOTE]

I have to agree with you. Moscow is not for the "faint of heart" or the "slim of wallet". If you do not have business in Moscow that can subsidize your airfare and accommodation, you can burn through money faster that you know.

As far as freebies goes, it's still an expensive proposition in Moscow when you consider cost of living. It's is also one that requires an investment of time and effort. But oh it can pay back handsome dividends.

[QUOTE=Priamos]Your're probably quite right that, as a newcomer, I walked into that one on my big feet. Just "between the two of us", I had a bruising discussion some time ago on another country thread with a gentleman who was actively promoting one, expensive, set of services (nothing wrong with that, of course) to the point of ranting against anybody who would recommend anything else. I never came to realise whether that guy was simply obsessive or financially interested in the services he proffered. When I saw Shelby criticising alternative service providers I thought "f***, there we go again!" obviously without properly recognising the man's role and past contributions to this thread.

Sorry about that.[/QUOTE]


Priamos

Our discussion was centered on P4P in Moscow, which is as most agree a rich mans pursuit nowadays.

Even Doc with his gift of Russian gab has given up on Moscow for P4P.

However freebies are another topic. Difficult for a short stay mongers; those with time and language seem to do quite well.

Lucky bastards…..

Doc leaves a long trail of empty condom wrappers. :)

Another option would be Piter. Easier for the 1st trip in many respects with pricing still better than Moscow.

No shortage of great looking women and many think freebies are easier there. P4P is plentiful and somewhat reasonable compared to Moscow.

For either city work the dating sites. Omen, Mheart ect…

Most have a section for intime or erotic services. Expect more than a few that speak no English. Keep dialing and you will find ones that do.

Then ask them to bring a friend.

As Jake mentioned it is well worth the effort.

Good hunting

Guido88

[QUOTE=Priamos]It does look, Pizdyets, as if this part of the board is in the hands of people (expats, locals.) who are not motivated by fraternal feelings towards fellow mongers but rather a combination of classic Russian chauvinism ("foreigners in Russia should PAY! ") and the nouveau riche excesses of the Wild East ("Flaunt it baby! Yeah! "). [/QUOTE] I'd like to jump in on this.

I do get your point on this myself. But its possibly more perception than you realise.

When I first got to Russia I could not go beyond the Girls-students site, due to the language barrier, but after one particular girl, Ira, asked me why I didn't yet have a girlfriend, and offered herself, to practice her english, get free meals, a place to stay from time to time (she stayed outside of moscow, and would call around 6am to crash/shower at my place) She helped me to understand some of the 'goings on' of such sites, and the fact that the real street value was far cheaper than the expat-catering salons.

The real interesting point was, she would help me find other girls on occasions, but when I tried to copy her, I was barely able to get anywhere.

I have literally stood in podezds (front halls) of buildings, lost, the wrong address, the girl cancelling because I can't find her place, at the very last minute, after a taxi there and a taxi back, costing me a few hundred rubles, gone to places with ugly/fat/WTF girls, More than half of the times I've gone looking for some of the lesser expensive places.

Sure, I was (and still am) cheap, so I don't mind looking 2-3 times to get a decent girl, who, for 2000 ryb will give me a decent time, and if she's decent enough I give her repeat business for the next 2-3 times to make up for the cancelled/lost times. Some of these girls would come meet me, away from the 'apartment/goblin boss" for only the price of a romantic dinner. A. K. A freebee.

But coming into town from outside, your unlikely to be able to get this kind of service, no matter what anyone reports on the site. That kind of work costs time and money. Which you pay for by going for the easy expat-friendly sites.

So in conclusion, its not that we're hiding anything, we just know its alot harder than it looks in Moscow.

[size=-2][b][u]EDITOR'S NOTE[/u]:[/b] [blue]I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please [url=http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?]Click Here[/url] for more information.[/blue][/size]

[QUOTE=Jake993]I have to agree with you. Moscow is not for the "faint of heart" or the "slim of wallet". If you do not have business in Moscow that can subsidize your airfare and accommodation, you can burn through money faster that you know.

As far as freebies goes, it's still an expensive proposition in Moscow when you consider cost of living. It's is also one that requires an investment of time and effort. But oh it can pay back handsome dividends.[/QUOTE]Unfortunately this is simply true.

No matter which way you bend the rules or no matter how much charm and skillz one possesses, women simply cost money.

Pros, freebies, club sluts.

There is no way to avoid it. Mongering is an expensive hobby, but I think most here will agree that it is worth it.

OK, it's then settled. During my stay in Moscow I'll stay away from "temptations" and limit myself to a bit of sightseeing and dinner at my hotel. I don't want to pay significantly more than I would in Belgium, Bulgaria, Germany, Greece and the Netherlands simply for the "pleasure" of being in the city of Nikolai I... ;)

One question, though: what has, in your view, led to this extreme explosion of prices? Yeah sure, the oil-induced boom has made Moscow awash with quick cash. Hence, demand for p4p services has increased, but this has an upward effect on prices if and only if supply is curtailed. I would have thought, seeing the still extremely low incomes across Russia, that there would be sufficient additional supply to keep prices low. - A bit like in Shanghai, where new girls are bussed in from the rural area every day. Or, are we all paying a dear price for the infamous Moscovite "propizhka"?

[QUOTE=Priamos]
One question, though: what has, in your view, led to this extreme explosion of prices? Yeah sure, the oil-induced boom has made Moscow awash with quick cash. Hence, demand for p4p services has increased, but this has an upward effect on prices if and only if supply is curtailed. I would have thought, seeing the still extremely low incomes across Russia, that there would be sufficient additional supply to keep prices low. [/QUOTE]

Let me TRY to answer your question with a question. "What goods or services ARE relatively cheap in London, Tokyo, Paris, New York City, or Zurich?" Answer: None.

Since Moscow has been back on the scene in terms of being a world class city, I think P4P has found its place. Sad but true. I would suggest that similar caliber P4P in those cities is not a whole lot less than in Moscow. Not to say that you cannot get laid for an hour for 2500 rubles because you can. In fact you can get it for less. But you need to be able to speak Russian. Let's face it, drop dead gorgeous English speaking working girls in Moscow are a "SPECIALTY" and therefore don't follow traditional rules of "price elasticity of demand". Since non-Russian speaking foreigners don't have much choice except to pay the going price or find something else to do on a cold night. I would suggest to you that if those same foreigners stopped paying the high prices altogether, the supply would dry up long before the price went down. Girls have more choices today and would find somewhere else to work.

I think that during the post Perestroika period, Moscow was in a tremendous state of transition. Prostitution was as much about survival then as anything. I don't think a girl in Moscow who speaks perfect English and charges $500 for an hour or two is too worried about basic survival. It's more of a career choice. The Tochka girls is probably another matter and I'm not sure I understand the economics of that phenomenon except perhaps greed on the part of the police getting payoffs and maybe the expenses of the Mamochkas. Prices in the provinces ARE relatively low. Moscow and Saint Petersburg are anomalous.

Dobre Diem,

Not to interrupt this wonderful string of "remember when" and bitching but...

I am on a short stay this time (5 days) in Moscow and wouldn't mind a little local help. I am RTFF but in the interest of time I would like specific info on the following from you experts:

1) Anyone want to meet up and show a newbie around?

2) Anyone know of a "tour guide" who can show me the city and her tits? Approximate cost?

3) Anything that can get me dead? Neighborhoods, places, people to avoid?

4) English speaking or at least friendly places (bars, websites, etc)

Thanks and dasvidanya.

[QUOTE=Priamos]One question, though: what has, in your view, led to this extreme explosion of prices? [/QUOTE][QUOTE=Jake993]Let me TRY to answer your question with a question. "What goods or services ARE relatively cheap in London, Tokyo, Paris, New York City, or Zurich?" Answer: None.

Since Moscow has been back on the scene in terms of being a world class city, I think P4P has found its place. Sad but true. I would suggest that similar caliber P4P in those cities is not a whole lot less than in Moscow. Not to say that you cannot get laid for an hour for 2500 rubles because you can. In fact you can get it for less. But you need to be able to speak Russian. Let's face it, drop dead gorgeous English speaking working girls in Moscow are a "SPECIALTY" and therefore don't follow traditional rules of "price elasticity of demand". Since non-Russian speaking foreigners don't have much choice except to pay the going price or find something else to do on a cold night. I would suggest to you that if those same foreigners stopped paying the high prices altogether, the supply would dry up long before the price went down. Girls have more choices today and would find somewhere else to work.

I think that during the post Perestroika period, Moscow was in a tremendous state of transition. Prostitution was as much about survival then as anything. I don't think a girl in Moscow who speaks perfect English and charges $500 for an hour or two is too worried about basic survival. It's more of a career choice. The Tochka girls is probably another matter and I'm not sure I understand the economics of that phenomenon except perhaps greed on the part of the police getting payoffs and maybe the expenses of the Mamochkas. Prices in the provinces ARE relatively low. Moscow and Saint Petersburg are anomalous.[/QUOTE]Jake is absolutely right.

Despite the fact that much of the city still resembles 2nd or 3rd world shithole and despite the fact that Moscow is still decades away from being a world class city in terms of cultural substance or infrastructure, it is already world class in terms of cash flow and women. It is in many ways a singular anomoly. Unfortunately, Moscow money is also making St.Petersburg and ultimately other cities more expensive.

Moreover, I'll stick with my thesis that although English-speaking foreigners pay too much in Moscow, so do most Russians. Their prices are not substantially cheaper, especially in terms of take out/outcall.

The Russian is not paying $150 for the same girl you paid $300 for. He's also paying $300.

The central difference is that there ARE cheaper forms of prostitution in Moscow, however with limited Russian knowledge you'll either need a ton of patience or a lot of luck to access them. Locals can and do access these with ease... however even for experienced mongers finding a salon with affordable and hot babes can sometimes be a real nerve-wracking nightmare, with no guarantee of success.

An analogy.

A couple of weeks ago I was fucking a girl in the mouth, with the promise that I wouldn't come in her mouth but would rather pull out and jizz on her chest. Normally I am a man of my word, however it just felt too damn good and I shot 3 days worth of jizz build up down her throat. When she realized what had just happened she coughed and sputtered and ran to the bathroom spitting all over herself.

I followed her a minute later and she glared unbelievingly at me with big doe eyes, asking in a sweet hurt voice:

"Pochemu?/why?"

I answered coldly:

"Because I can."

She didn't reply and 5 minutes later she was cuddling up to me in bed and purring like a kitten.

Why do English-speaking pros at Night Flight or Hot Dog charge $500 for an hour or two of sex?

Because they can. You would too.[QUOTE=Priamos]I would have thought, seeing the still extremely low incomes across Russia, that there would be sufficient additional supply to keep prices low. - A[/QUOTE]There is truth to this of course, depsite the fact that young Russians can make more money than you think. Don't forget that they pay almost no tax, many live for free with their parents, don't own a car and usually eat at home. Their TAKE HOME income or pocket cash is often on equal level with Europeans of the same age. Girls from the provinces who have to pay for an apartment are worse off, which makes them more likely to become prostitutes or be easy to lay for small presents or vague promises.

[QUOTE=Priamos]It does look, Pizdyets, as if this part of the board is in the hands of people (expats, locals...) who are not motivated by fraternal feelings towards fellow mongers but rather a combination of classic Russian chauvinism ("foreigners in Russia should PAY!") and the nouveau riche excesses of the Wild East ("Flaunt it baby! Yeah!").
[/QUOTE]

Priamos, if you had bothered to read my posts (as I did yours), you'd see that that is not my attitude. To the contrary, I've tried to help my fellow mongers not only by my postings, but by my personal actions.

[QUOTE]
Finally, let me respond directly to the point you raised. The entrance of FKK Palace in Frankfurt (why is this of interest, BTW?) is 75 Euros. An hour costs 100 Euros, that is true, but if you want only one pop the price is 50 Euros. This amount is - almost always, that is - inclusive of French kissing and blowjob without condom. So, unless you overpay (which I have often done, as you know if you've read my postings: for instance I often slip the girl another 50 Euros for CIM), you can have two girls offering GFE or at least near-GFE spend 2-3 hours, or as long as you please, having free drinks, free meals, sauna, jacuzzi, porn cinema... for 175 Euros. Voila.[/QUOTE]

It's of interest because you brought up the comparison with Western Europe yourself. My experience - though BBBJ is standard in the FKKs, DFK is negotiable. The opposite is true in salons here - DFK is standard but BBBJ is negotiable. Also, not all FKKs serve alcohol - salons do. All I'm saying is that it's a matter of personal preference.

Finally, if your target price is 175E (just over 6K rubles), then you can also have 2 great looking and passionate girls in a salon in Moscow and I can nearly guarantee it'll be a nice experience. And just recently, I had a girl in HotDog ask me for 5K for the night (I ended up giving her 7K). It's not like all girls are asking for $400. Sure, p4p is expensive in Moscow, but don't make it sound like it's that much more than Western Europe.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]
Why do English-speaking pros at Night Flight or Hot Dog charge $500 for an hour or two of sex?

Because they can. You would too.There is truth to this of course, depsite the fact that young Russians can make more money than you think. Don't forget that they pay almost no tax, many live for free with their parents, don't own a car and usually eat at home. Their TAKE HOME income or pocket cash is often on equal level with Europeans of the same age. Girls from the provinces who have to pay for an apartment are worse off, which makes them more likely to become prostitutes or be easy to lay for small presents or vague promises.[/QUOTE]

So, I've thought about this a bit. For one thing, rent is high for everyone who doesn't own their own flat. My experience has been that 99% of the WGs I meet are from outside of Moscow, meaning they have to pay rent. It's hard to find even a shithole apartment in Moscow these days for less than $1000/month. Go even further out, and you're paying for additional transport and time. This affects salons, apartment girls and WGs at NF/HD all the same. Secondly, prostitution - unlike in Germany - is officially illegal in Russia. That spells big payoffs to greedy police to make sure their operations (whether NF, HD, salons, apartmenty, tochki, etc) stay open. And then there's the cost of living in Moscow, which is just about the highest of anywhere in the world. All those costs are passed directly to us, the consumers.

Honestly, I think the whole system is heading for a major correction. Last time I was at HotDog, I saw very few guys leaving with girls, eventhough the place was packed. In fact, the cutest girl there was getting very little attention since she pretty much priced herself out of the market (she was asking $500/night). Some Russian guys I was chatting with wouldn't take anyone over 6K, and then they expected the girl to pull a train as well (when I left, they were still looking!) Sure, girls can afford to go a night or two without hooking up, but after that, it's prohibitively expensive (at roughly $100/night for expenses). You'd figure that more and more girls would be trying to pick up "dates" in regular clubs, but at reduced prices. The problem there is that they have to compete with girls with similar/better looks, but not demanding any payment. I think all these point to why sites like mamba are increasingly popular with WGs: police involvement is minimal, expenses are minimal, and the girls are reasonably assured that they're not getting hooked up with a Jack-the-Ripper/Ted Bundy type.

[QUOTE=Jake993]Let me TRY to answer your question with a question. "What goods or services ARE relatively cheap in London, Tokyo, Paris, New York City, or Zurich?" Answer: None.
[/QUOTE]

That's mostly true. Though, when it comes to P4P I put a question mark around NYC. If you avoid the pricier agencies and pick a private provider from Craigslist or some such site you come off comfortably compared with Paris, London... and Moscow. I didn't mention London, Paris and Tokyo in my posting partly for this reason, and partly because the comparison seems unreasonable to start with: the incomes per head in Russia are these days at par with Mexico and Brazil. In France, Japan and the UK people earn on average 3 times more. (And that's in purchasing power terms; cash incomes are about 5 times higher.)

Thus, the status of Moscow as a haven of high life and high prices is, as Doctor Skank correctly said, an anomaly. I attribute it to the fact that the country is so centralised (few business people in, say, Germany care to waste time in Berlin; few Russian business people can allow themselves NOT to be in Moscow...). To this comes that access to Moscow from poorer parts of Russia is restricted. People are held back by the infamous propizhka; businesses are held back by mayor Luzhkov's machinations. But then again...

... that's the way it is. Sitting around wishing things were different is perhaps not a very productive use of one's time.

Pizdyets,

Не кормите троллей... ;)

(don't feed the troll)

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]
And then there are guys like yourself; never been to Moscow, don't speak the lingo, are totally clueless and expect to be catered to. For guys like yourself, there are places like Night Flight and internet escort sites where you can talk to someone in English. You can distinguish these sites from the internet escort sites that cater to local guys by the dialing code on the phone number. The girls on the local sites prefix their numbers with an 8, which is the internal dialing code for Russia. They expect to get calls from local guys, who speak Russian, and their fees are set accordingly. Typically, these girls are looking for cash in hand, not a long term virtual email relationship. If the dialing code begins with a 7, this is the external prefix for dialing Russia, so you know they are expecting calls from foreign customers. For these, the prices will be about twice as high as in Germany and the Netherlands, because, well, they know there are guys like you who have no choice but to pay them. :)[/QUOTE]

Thanks Strav for the "Insider Info"..I always wondered why 7 international code for Russia is confused with 8 in Intimcity while Rusdosug the English sister site has 7 dialing code :)

Hi,

I will go in Moscow next mounth, I will stay in hotel Milan, can anybody let me know if there is any action there or if I can bring easily a lady inside?

Thanks!

Guys are those sites [url]www.bad-russian-girls.com[/url] and [url]www.russiansexbombs.com[/url] legitimate?

Strike,

It doesn't look good; the sites are designed in English and phone numbers and rates are only available if you become a member. I doubt if you will get much out of these sites, but then, miracles can happen.

The main escort sites for Moscow are intimcity.ru and dosug.nu. Rusdosug.com is a sister site to intimcity, but it also offers an English version. There is also a site called dosug.sextalk.ru, which is sponsored by sextalk, but it is exclusively in Russian.

Bad Russian Girls has been discussed many times in this forum. Girls are the same as the ones available on other FREE sites such as the ones Strav mentionned. In addition, they do not remove girls who have stopped working and probably 80% of the database is obsolete.

I have paid them once several years ago for a visit to Kiev, as I saw they have girls from Gia and another site I forgot the name, which I knew were real. So I paid as I saw some other nice girls not on Gia. It turned out that these "other" girls were in fact old girls from Gia who have stopped working for years, which Gia has removed from their website long time ago.

Same for Moscow, girls are either also on other FREE websites, or have stopped working long ago.

Jim

I have just abruptly ended a session with Helena. I chose her based on her participation in this forum, her English capability, and the pictures posted on her website: [url]http://www.moscow-affair.com/picture4.html[/url]

I don't' mind shelling out some coin for a good massage, HJ/cbj in the comfort of my room. Girl gets paid for low risk and I get what I pay for. Usually.

I contacted her via phone and arranged a meeting, she could meet me in about an hour. I informed her that I was not a full service client and that I would be looking for a chat, massage, and see where it went form there. She thought that sounded great. 2 hours 200 EU. She arrived as arranged and dressed in a black dress. We chatted for about a 45 min while she sipped tea and we chatted about Moscow nightlife, her life, etc.

When it came time to move to the massage portion she undressed and I will only say that her pictures on the website are either not recent or photoshopped. She is I suppose what one would expect of a 35 year old provider in Moscow who has been in the game for quite some time. It was not something that I could not accept but it certainly was not what I expected based on her website.

This is where it all began to go sideways. Her cell began to ring which she asked if she could answer. So of course. Fine. Drunk guy. She hung up on him and about 3 minutes later he called back. Again rude exchange and a hang up. Okay. No problem. I can come back from that.

She then proceeded to give me one of the worst massages I have received. Which lasted maybe 10. 15 minutes. She then laid down on my back and said that she was tired and not a "specialist in this" but that she knew masseuses that could do 12 a day. So I thought this was pretty weak and not really relevant and wished that one of them was there then.

So, I flip over and she lays down beside me. So we lay like that for maybe 5 or 10 min while we caressed each other. At this point I'm wondering WTF is going on. So I kind of begin hinting with body posturing that maybe she could give some attention to a little lower. Which she would occasionally dip down to. But not linger. Finally I sat up and began to "make out" a bit with her kissing her neck and ear and she finally began to give me some attention. At this point we hit the wall.

I laid back waiting for a nice CBJ (I RTFF and knew she was supposedly a CBJ only girl which I personally like from the risk/reward standpoint). What happened instead was she said. And I quote "What would you like me to do now. " So. I said well I would like a blowjob and added that I was not full service. She responded to this as some sort of escalation or added service. She then said. And I quote, "Don't act like you are doing me some great favor by allowing me to give you a blowjob". Now. I have heard some crazy ass shit but never have I heard a prostitute complain about giving a CBJ to a client for 200 euro.

Of course I wanted my monies worth so I asked what the problem was. Which she said was that I had "confused" her and that now I wanted something that she did not expect. So I said well that is what I want. She then crossed the final line when she looked at me, sighed, and said that this was unusual, she was not used to this one way street. WTF? ! ? ! We are not talking about an 18 yr old hottie on her first mission here. I had no emotional or physical desire to have sex or perform oral sex on this woman. I was a client paying money for a service. If she wanted me to get her off then maybe it was time to renegotiate!

I got up incredulous and left the room to [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140][CodeWord140][/url] and figure out wtf just happened. I decided then and there to end the date and asked her to leave. I also informed her of my disappointment, why I was disappointed, and that I felt she was unprofessional. Her defense was that she was not a machine. Huh. I was nice, paid her 200EU, and was insulted and unsatisfied but she was the one who was wronged.

Whatever.

Buyer beware on this one.

Someone give me some decent recon on a PROFESSIONAL provider who speaks English and is willing to provide a chat, massage, and HJ / cbj for a 2 hour / 200 EU or less.

[size=-2][b][u]EDITOR'S NOTE[/u]:[/b] [blue]I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please [url=http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?]Click Here[/url] for more information.[/blue][/size]

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]Strike,

It doesn't look good; the sites are designed in English and phone numbers and rates are only available if you become a member. I doubt if you will get much out of these sites, but then, miracles can happen.

The main escort sites for Moscow are intimcity.ru and dosug.nu. Rusdosug.com is a sister site to intimcity, but it also offers an English version. There is also a site called dosug.sextalk.ru, which is sponsored by sextalk, but it is exclusively in Russian.[/QUOTE]

Thanks for the info. How about some of the girls in this site:

[url]http://www.x-love.ru/[/url]

Are they legitimate? Some of the girls looks very hot and they offer incalls services but in one profile I saw some pics that belongs to a Hungarian Pornstar called Sophie Moone in one profile too bad.

Maybe I can find more info on: sextalk.ru

El Kapitan,

Well, this is a first! We now have 2 members of the forum having sex with each other! Did Helena know that you are a member of the ISG forum? You'd think she would want to be on her best behaviour.

You might want to try Natasha [url]http://companion-escortmoscow.com[/url]. She is the other girl who advertises here.

Other than that, maybe find a copy of the Moscow Times? They should have some in your hotel, or they can probably get a copy for you. There are some escort agencies that advertise in the back and they cater to foreign (english speaking) tourists.

How long will you be in Moscow?

[QUOTE=Pizdyets] I think all these point to why sites like mamba are increasingly popular with WGs: police involvement is minimal, expenses are minimal,


and the girls are reasonably assured that they're not getting hooked up with a Jack-the-Ripper/Ted Bundy type.[/QUOTE]

What kind of logic are you using to figure that one out? I agree with the first part..but the second.

to el kapitan

i expected that you could write something like that. all was, of course, totally different, but it's ok. you written your opinion and can keep it as long as you wish. i'll keep mine about you. just a small advise. next time if you want to get service, don't say to a provider in advance that you don't want to get it. if on the phone you say very clearly that you only want companionship and massage i bet 90% of providers will not guess that you want to be raped or seduced or have some other hidden fantasy. i asked you for the second time what exactly you meant by saying that "you were not a full-service client", and you repeated again that you were not interested in anything else than massage and companionship. there was nothing said by you about "we see where it leads", this you added for the forum. about massage, for which i was really prepared and which to tell you the truth i know well how to do, you also changed your mind in the process several times and just left me no chance to make it properly. no one can give you a proper massage if you move around, have no towels at home and so on... as for the rest... you are not satisfied. ok. because you expected one thing but ordered totally the opposite. why you acted this way i don't know. anyway, thanks for allowing me to make a cup of tea. such a big favor...

[quote=helena moscow]if on the phone you say very clearly that you only want companionship and massage i bet 90% of providers will not guess that you want to be raped or seduced or have some other hidden fantasy. i asked you for the second time what exactly you meant by saying that "you were not a full-service client", and you repeated again that you were not interested in anything else than massage and companionship. there was nothing said by you about "we see where it leads", this you added for the forum. [/quote]200 euro for massage and companionship?

you two really didn't communicate very well... that was doomed to end in frustration. you should have at least let him titty fuck you, helena. you know guys can't get a massage from a woman without wanting to blow our load. we are very basic creatures in that sense. not very kind at all babe.

el kapitan... did you really say you wanted a blowjob for the agreed price, or just assume that was part of the massage? come to think of it, at least a hj is usually part of the massage price...

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]200 Euro for massage and companionship?

You two really didn't communicate very well... that was doomed to end in frustration. You should have at least let him titty fuck you, Helena. You know guys can't get a massage from a woman without wanting to blow our load. We are very basic creatures in that sense. Not very kind at all babe.

El Kapitan... did you really say you wanted a blowjob for the agreed price, or just assume that was part of the massage? Come to think of it, at least a HJ IS usually part of the massage price...[/QUOTE]

Oh, the gratest judge of all times came to teach eveyone how to live. May be you let El Kapitan titty fuck you, if you feel so sorry for him? 200 for massage and companionship is not something huge now. In the day time (not at 1 o'clock in the night) in a medium class beauty salon (where you come on your own feet and massauser has no transport costs) in Moscow for 45 minutes of normal medical massage we pay 2000-4000 rubles. Without any companionship and HJs. By the way, it's written on the first page of my site that I only offer my time and companionship. The rest is the matter of mutual choice. Noone cheated anyone and I never said that I could read thoughts. And believe me, knowing that El Kapitan was ISG member, I wasn't searching for troubles. By the way, I tried to fix things piecefully, but the guy had his own performance. Probably his desire to write a bad report was higher than the desire to get any service at all. Shit happens, that's it. I'm not an angel, sure, I never even pretended. Neither he was an angel. And let's not play these kindergarden games like: "I'm so innocent and she is so evel, upset me, poor little guy..." The guy is not so little and well-understood what exactly happened. He wanted a little revenge, ok, he got it. Fellow-mongers had little fun of the situation. Done. Let's go further. Any other news?

[QUOTE=Helena Moscow]Oh, the gratest judge of all times came to teach eveyone how to live. May be you let El Kapitan titty fuck you, if you feel so sorry for him?[/QUOTE]And you think 200 Euros for a shyte massage and some conversation really speaks for your service Helena? You really believe he got his money's worth?

You really thought he'd want nothing but some touchy feely and a pat on the ass?

Service providers get judged by their service, that's the nature of the beast.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]And you think 200 Euros for a shyte massage and some conversation really speaks for your service Helena? You really believe he got his money's worth?

You really thought he'd want nothing but some touchy feely and a pat on the ass?

Service providers get judged by their service, that's the nature of the beast.[/QUOTE]

Skank, please, read the previous post. I added a bit to it and during the same time you already responded. I tell you, it was at first misunderstanding, and then the guy played his own game. Shit happens. Not always not everything goes right. And don't make from me a monster. My only fault in this situation is that I'm not a machine and I can't smile happily when I see that some ugly tricks start in front of me. You were not there, you don't know the whole situation, you can't judge. None of the forum guys can, because they were not there and they don't know what really happened. El Kapitan can't proove anyway thet he is telling the truth, by the way. And it's very easy to write shit about me, because everybody here knows my face and noone knows his. I didn't want to go into details, because it's unpleasant for me to take them out. And I don't want to write more shit than already written.

[QUOTE=Helena Moscow]You were not there[/QUOTE]True enough, I wasn't there and I am not judging anybody. Nonetheless, as I previously wrote, there seems to have been a breakdown of communications either way.

I don't really understand the notion of meeting a pro for anything other than sex, but that's just me. Nor have I ever heard of pros performing massages without a least a HJ.

I'm confused. )

[QUOTE=Helena Moscow]Skank, please, read the previous post. I added a bit to it and during the same time you already responded. I tell you, it was at first misunderstanding, and then the guy played his own game. Shit happens. Not always not everything goes right. And don't make from me a monster. My only fault in this situation is that I'm not a machine and I can't smile happily when I see that some ugly tricks start in front of me. You were not there, you don't know the whole situation, you can't judge. None of the forum guys can, because they were not there and they don't know what really happened. El Kapitan can't proove anyway thet he is telling the truth, by the way. And it's very easy to write shit about me, because everybody here knows my face and noone knows his. I didn't want to go into details, because it's unpleasant for me to take them out. And I don't want to write more shit than already written.[/QUOTE]I was there. My wallet is 200 Euros lighter to prove it. What possible reason I would have to randomly write shit about you I can only guess.

This forum is for clients (mongers) to share information with each other regarding locations, pricing, and services. I don't know anyone in Moscow so my popularity is not an issue and I have no clue as to why a negative report about you would increase my popularity in this forum.

I do not wish to make this some sort of personal vendetta as I could give a shit less about Helena. In fact the entire point of service providers is to avoid drama and "personal" relationships. It is a business and should be treated as such. Should we happen across others we click with and develop a relationship then so be it.

Helena, you like to use that word "favor". People do not pay for favors.

As to my ability to communicate in English, it is my native tongue so I think I have an okay handle on it. I can assure this forum that Helena's command and grasp of the English language also is more than adequate to arrange a chat, massage, and hj/cbj. She seemed to find the place okay and certainly understood 200 EU.

As to Helena's desire to "fix the misunderstanding" I cannot say as I am not sure what she did in that regard other than offer that, and I quote "I was not mentally prepared to give you a blowjob, I thought this was only a chat and massage, I am not a machine."

The bottom line here is not that she was confused, nor was it that we had to discuss it further. The problem in fact did not occur until when she said "I thought you were not full service" to which I responded I am not. She then said "Tell me specifically what you want" and I responded that yes I would like a blowjob but I did not desire full service. That is when the sighs and shrugging and childlike behavior started. When I pressed her about what the problem was she then started with the whole "you said only chat and massage" and "this is very strange, this one way street". I mean seriously..WTF?!?! I rarely if ever go into explicit extreme detail on the telephone prior to seeing a provider. This is for two reasons; 1) I don't know what is going to show up at me door so I am not sure how far I am going to let ANYTHING go and 2) In most countries (Russia included) selling sex is illegal and I do not wish to discuss this with someone I have not met.

Any PROFESSIONAL provider working in the sex industry for more than 10 years who needs to go through an intense amount of mental preparation to perform what most would consider one of the most basic sex acts is quite possibly in the wrong industry.

Women are not machines or pieces of meat. They should be treated with respect, just as all humans should. A professional sex provider is a business and should conduct herself accordingly.

I have nothing further to say about this. What happened is what happened. There was no yelling, arguing, or anything else. There were no tricks and certainly no treats. I ended the session as soon as I felt there was no longer any positive outcome likely, a decision which is not made lightly as I knew I was going to be out 200EU either way. There was no ugliness at the end when I asked her to go ahead and leave and no need for it now.

I heard a lot about Helena's life and how expensive Prague was, got a shit massage from what I would consider a 5/10 at best, a huge drama act when I confirmed that this would be a one way only affair, and decided to call it a night for a 200 Euro lesson. Nothing more, nothing less.

Helena is right in saying that sometimes things just don't go right. This is obviously one of those times. I am sure she has hundreds of positive reviews from other forum members so my one report about the experience I had should be nothing (in fact I know there is at least one as I read it prior to booking, hence my utter surprise). I do not wish her any ill will. I however think I should fulfill the purpose of this forum in REPORTING my experience. Other members can be the judge as I cannot "prove" what did or didn't happen.

Again, I am done with this and will not discuss it further.

Fool me once, shame on me.

I think if sb wants sth especially with Russians, he has to tell it beforehand. Not during or after the act because the Russians feel betrayed and there is sth more they feel that you tried to fool them or that you blackmail them or that you try to gain extra gain from them while you should lose and not them, anyway I cannot explain it in english. For example if you pay for HJ and demand BJ, then you try to gain extra profit on their expense, so that they lose which means no respect in first place unless they really like you which is not possible if you are a love buyer because most likely they feel condemn for you because you have no gf and wife or you betray your wife with them, so you are second class in their eyes.

Anyway I tried to present the frame why a punter is always second class in Russian pro eyes. Only that he demanded services of a pro means to them that he is second class. This is my opinion how they view the interaction.

A second class playing games and doing tricks is further unacceptable. For example what does ''not full service'' mean? Why not define it? Does it mean massage + HJ, massage + HJ + BJ, massage + HJ + BJ + DFK, or sth else? You have to define it. Noone is expected to know beforehand what the other means by the expression ''not full service'' which is supposed to cause positive thoughts in escort's mind (I will be paid by sb who wants only to talk, sth which happens in some cases of escorts' clients).

In my opinion it is not necessary to cause any positive thoughts in escort's minds. You just tell what you have in mind and see if she agrees. For example ''anal is possible? '', ''is it possible to [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140][CodeWord140][/url] you? '', ''is it possible that you lick my anus? '' etc, so they agree or not and you know the prices and the possibilities. Of course they can steal you afterwards in terms of time, for example by appearing late but usually what is agreed beforehand is carried out the way it was agreed.

[QUOTE=Hecker]Anyway I tried to present the frame why a punter is always second class in Russian pro eyes. Only that he demanded services of a pro means to them that he is second class. This is my opinion how they view the interaction.
[/QUOTE]Although I agree with much that you wrote about clarifying what you want beforehand, I do not believe that Russian pros automatically believe that their clients are lower or second class. They deal with... and fuck... people from various social strata, class, intelligence and wealth. Although some pros may go cold at some point and certainly we are all "wallets" to them, I believe that in the end your individual behavior will make a difference in their opinion of you and ideally, in their performance or the general mood and "success" of the encounter.

Of course sometimes things simply do not go well, the human factor involved plays a vital role. Sometimes one gets a dud, or a girl with a bad attitude, one in a bad mood, one that is incredibly stupid, one that isn't what you wanted or expected or one that just doesn't match up with you well. There is little you can do, except maybe try to send her back. This isn't always possible, but depending on the arrangement it sometimes is.

As I've stated before, in my experience when a pro encounter went bad it was often just as much my fault as hers. Even in a pro encounter some sort of mood or vibe develops, whether positive, neutral or negative. Sometimes MY mood, my vibe or my attitude just wasn't right. Especially in an atmosphere in which vocal communication is either not possible or limited by language, other factors such as body language and non-verbal communication are even more important than they would be in a normal encounter in which there was a language basis.

Just my 2 cents.

To Hecker

I agree with what you written in everything but the fact that clients are treated like a second-class just for being clients. This is not so. Skank made right comments on this and I join them.

El Kapitan had a bad night, largely because of El Kapitan. Man, in all your posts on ISG in a number of cities, including in Dubai, you ask for contact details for sex providers, but you make it clear in your posts don't want actually want sex. (Talk to the hand, El Kapitan).

This approach leads to confusion for the WG (Helena in this case) who must think to herself over an hour or two of uncomfortable mixed-messages from El Kapitan: "What does this guy actually want."

El Kapitan is simply wrong in saying that paying for intimate time with a woman is only a business transaction. No need for me to explain - he already knows this, which is clear from his last few posts.

Get outta here with all this philosophical BS about disclaimers etc.

Bottomline she ripped him off because she thought she could!!

That kind of crap wouldn't hunt in Moscow for sure cause you never know who knows who. But in Prague, it's anonymous. Now we know why she got booted from working NF in Moscow years ago.

[QUOTE=Ffmbud]... Bottomline she ripped him off because she thought she could!![/QUOTE]I doubt it. Helena knew he's an ISG member and that he would probably report here, so for things to go so wrong, there's clearly more to the story. Let's face it, El Kapitan has issues, and he should switch from ISG to the Discovery Channel.[QUOTE=Ffmbud]Now we know why she got booted from working NF in Moscow years ago. [/QUOTE]Interesting. Tell us more, if you are genuine.

[QUOTE=Piper1]

El Kapitan is simply wrong in saying that paying for intimate time with a woman is only a business transaction. No need for me to explain - he already knows this, which is clear from his last few posts.[/QUOTE]

Piper

I have to disagree with this statement

It is clearly a business transaction in the girl’s minds.

Why else would they call us “Wallets” and spend time with men when the only interest is money.

Don’t get me wrong, personally I love this setup. I can have sex with a gorgeous service oriented woman ½ my age, and then be free to go drink beer with the boys. Life is good.

It’s a bad sign that as Moscow becomes more westernized the service provided appears to be slipping. Many more complaints in the past couple of years.

If we mongers get ripped off in Russia its because we allowed it to happen. “NO” is a very effective word in this type of a situation.

El Kapitan made a mistake in paying, the service rendered was a rip off. He should have ended the session and spent his 200-euro on one of the many thousands of other girls that are available and more than willing to please.

We can find overpriced, difficult bitchy women at our homes.

No reason to travel for that.

In the area I call home a new trend is some hookers are now refusing getting naked, touching, blow jobs or sex with all clients. They do however provide the opportunity to spend $300-500 an hour. It’s a joke……

I hate to see Moscow pussy heaven moving that direction.

This is not the first negative report I have heard on Helana.

The other monger felt that both quality and value were lacking and would not repeat the experience.


Helana

You know why we men travel long distances to Russia.

It’s not to hear you speak English.

Bottom line is we go for great looking, serviced oriented women who will deliver as requested. It’s all about the women’s attitude. IMHO

Perhaps you are tired of the working life and would be better suited taking your language skills into another profession. Just a thought…..

Guido88

I Totally Agree With You!

Just three underlines:

- Always and anyway, all females like just cock and/or money, in different ways, but this is an universal law.

- There is the "woman trouble" where American/Western culture has arrived. Woman is a trouble in USA (see the thread), woman is a trouble in Europe, woman is becoming a trouble in Kiev and woman is becoming a trouble in Russia too.

- I often said to mongers "don't inflationate pussy market", but everybody doesn't mind that and now an easy pussy fucking is expensive: this is our end thanks to mongers' foolinesh.

[QUOTE=Guido88]Piper

I have to disagree with this statement

It is clearly a business transaction in the girl’s minds.

Why else would they call us “Wallets” and spend time with men when the only interest is money.

Don’t get me wrong, personally I love this setup. I can have sex with a gorgeous service oriented woman ½ my age, and then be free to go drink beer with the boys. Life is good.

It’s a bad sign that as Moscow becomes more westernized the service provided appears to be slipping. Many more complaints in the past couple of years.

If we mongers get ripped off in Russia its because we allowed it to happen. “NO” is a very effective word in this type of a situation.

El Kapitan made a mistake in paying, the service rendered was a rip off. He should have ended the session and spent his 200-euro on one of the many thousands of other girls that are available and more than willing to please.

We can find overpriced, difficult bitchy women at our homes.

No reason to travel for that.

In the area I call home a new trend is some hookers are now refusing getting naked, touching, blow jobs or sex with all clients. They do however provide the opportunity to spend $300-500 an hour. It’s a joke……

I hate to see Moscow pussy heaven moving that direction.

This is not the first negative report I have heard on Helana.

The other monger felt that both quality and value were lacking and would not repeat the experience.


Helana

You know why we men travel long distances to Russia.

It’s not to hear you speak English.

Bottom line is we go for great looking, serviced oriented women who will deliver as requested. It’s all about the women’s attitude. IMHO

Perhaps you are tired of the working life and would be better suited taking your language skills into another profession. Just a thought…..

Guido88[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Guido88]We can find overpriced, difficult bitchy hookers at our homes.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, and no need to be very intuitive nor very smart to guess that Helena stands high in this category.

Anyone who has read more two lines of her controvertial, opinionated and embittered posts knows what I'm talking about.

[QUOTE=Cruiser D]What kind of logic are you using to figure that one out? I agree with the first part..but the second.[/QUOTE]

Good point, Cruiser. I used a bad example. Ted Bundy was an outlier when it comes to serial killers, because he was indeed charming and good looking. Most of them look/behave more like Brad Pitt in Kalifornia. :)

But when one has the opportunity to trade emails/chat with someone for a while, one can sense at least a hint of their personality.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]As I've stated before, in my experience when a pro encounter went bad it was often just as much my fault as hers. Even in a pro encounter some sort of mood or vibe develops, whether positive, neutral or negative. Sometimes MY mood, my vibe or my attitude just wasn't right. Especially in an atmosphere in which vocal communication is either not possible or limited by language, other factors such as body language and non-verbal communication are even more important than they would be in a normal encounter in which there was a language basis.
[/QUOTE]

Doc - agree with you 100% here. I've only had a handful of bad experiences with WGs, but most of them I chalk up to either a) excessive alcohol imparing my selection process or b) lack of communication up-front on what both of us can expect. What knowledge I've gleaned from years of whoring really boils down to that - effective selection and setting clear expectations. Used to be that I would pick a girl based entirely on looks and once I got her home, I would find she didn't want to kiss me, rejected DATY, etc... It's perfectly fine to discuss all that in advance, especially if you're in a bar/club, and in fact it often arouses the girl to do so. Ad if you're doing salons, out-call, or in-call, you can also clarify all that in advance.

[QUOTE=Hecker]A second class playing games and doing tricks is further unacceptable. For example what does ''not full service'' mean? Why not define it? Does it mean massage + HJ, massage + HJ + BJ, massage + HJ + BJ + DFK, or sth else? You have to define it. Noone is expected to know beforehand what the other means by the expression ''not full service'' which is supposed to cause positive thoughts in escort's mind (I will be paid by sb who wants only to talk, sth which happens in some cases of escorts' clients).

In my opinion it is not necessary to cause any positive thoughts in escort's minds. You just tell what you have in mind and see if she agrees. For example ''anal is possible? '', ''is it possible to [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140][CodeWord140][/url] you? '', ''is it possible that you lick my anus? '' etc, so they agree or not and you know the prices and the possibilities. Of course they can steal you afterwards in terms of time, for example by appearing late but usually what is agreed beforehand is carried out the way it was agreed.[/QUOTE]

Hecker, yes, I do agree with you, but... hell, there's just something about my Protestant upbringing. You can talk till you're blue in the face, but in each kind of transaction there are certain, basic minimum standards of service that the client has a right to expect and that cannot be explained away through "...oh, you should have specified". If you pay 200 bucks to a pro then you have a right to expect that a simple BJ is included. End of story.

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]It's perfectly fine to discuss all that in advance, especially if you're in a bar/club, and in fact it often arouses the girl to do so. And if you're doing salons, out-call, or in-call, you can also clarify all that in advance.[/QUOTE]We probably should correct a statement that El Kapitan made in his post. Despite what he said, prostitution is not illegal in Russia. It's OK to discuss prices and services freely with women, whether over the phone or over the internet or in person. The vice squad is not going to jump you and haul you away.

One of the wonderful things about Russian women is that they typically have very few "complexes" about sex, at least not if you're in the proper venue.

If you walk into a strip club and you're not sure if sex is possible on the premises, just ask the hostess or offitsanka, "Can I have sex in here?". She will respond very matter-of-factly; either, "No, that's not possible here", or, "Yes, of course", and proceed to outline all the of the various possibilities and prices. If one of the dancers strikes your fancy and you'd like to fuck her, then all you have to do is ask her, "Can I fuck you?", and she will respond very matter-of-factly; either, "No, I'm not here for sex, I just dance", or she will say, "Yes, of course, what would like?" If you want anal sex, then just ask her, "Can I fuck you in the ass?", and she might say, "No, I'm not into that", or she might say "OK, but I charge an extra 1000 rubles for that service."

For someone who is accustomed to living in sex prison, it takes a little getting used to, but, as Pizdyets has pointed out, once you get used to the idea, just the process of negotiation can be a turn on.

[QUOTE=Helena Moscow]Freddy, if I say here what sort of client YOU are, how you look, smell and behave, if Victoria comfirms this, you will shut your mouth for a long time. We all remember your shitty reports about almost each provider you met, and I'm sure that in most most cases the only reason for them was your shitty character and personality. [/QUOTE]

Execuse me, Helena, but this is not good enough. If people dare to disagree with you, or godforbid criticise you, then that's because they're not right in their heads??? What happened to the old adage "the client is king"? Sam Walton famously once said "My attitude toward the client must be, oh, don't mind me. I'm just the owner". It seems your attitude is "Hey, I'm the owner! I demand respect! If you're not satisfied you can just eff off!!"

Will someone please stick a fork in this thread? I think it's done.

For any of you who are not native English speakers, this is a late 20th century colloquialism for suggesting that a topic has been discussed to the point where it will yield no more useful information.

I think we have reached this point in this thread after 26 (including mine) posts (#2314 - #2339) where all that is to follow is name calling and accusations. Clearly there are differences in values and opinions and I doubt very much whether additional discussion is going to change anyone's mind one way or the other.

I know this is not a formal meeting but I would like to make a motion that this current topic come to and end. Let's move on.......

Anyone want to second the motion?

[QUOTE=Jake993]Will someone please stick a fork in this thread? I think it's done.

For any of you who are not native English speakers, this is a late 20th century colloquialism for suggesting that a topic has been discussed to the point where it will yield no more useful information.

I think we have reached this point in this thread after 26 (including mine) posts (#2314 - #2339) where all that is to follow is name calling and accusations. Clearly there are differences in values and opinions and I doubt very much whether additional discussion is going to change anyone's mind one way or the other.

I know this is not a formal meeting but I would like to make a motion that this current topic come to and end. Let's move on.......

Anyone want to second the motion?[/QUOTE]Golden words, Jake ;) Do you have any news?

Please forgive if this is the wrong area

I will stay 5/6 days in Moscow next week (3rd time in my life) and me and my friend (that lives in M and speaks a bit of russian and I understand a bit too) want to go 'outiside Moscow' just for the weekend (max 1/2/3 train hours): where can we go to enjoy local girls? I think that prices will drop outside Moscow.

Thank you

[QUOTE=Helena Moscow]Priamos, king is a person born in a royal family and sitting in a trone. Client is a person who pays for service. See the difference? Client is in the same position with a person offering service. Because they exchange equivalent things. Client doesn't pay more than service costs and he doesn't pay less. He pays as agreed. Both client and provider can be right or wrong, there is no previllage for anyone. This is not a vertical transaction, but straigtly horizontal. As for this "It seems your attitude is "Hey, I'm the owner! I demand respect! If you're not satisfied you can just eff off!!" - I don't understand what surprises you. I own my time, business, body, mind and so on. If you come to me for service, from the beginning I treat you with respect for granted. Not for being a client, but because I have no reason for other sort of attitude to a person I don't know. I do expect the same in return. From the beginning I don't cheat you and try to make things clear. And I do expect the same in return. If to respect a person and being honest for you is a problem, we will never find common language. Search for someone who accepts the attitude "Serve me, I'm a king because I pay", "I treat you like shit because I pay", "I don't have to respect you because I pay". You are also the owner of your time, body, money and other stuff. May be with this attitude you manage to come to agreement with some slave from BDSM community, but I bet even he (or she) will insist on discussing the game from beginning to end and setting up the limits. Paying agreed price doesn't give you the right to rise your self-esteem on another person't expence. It only gives you the right to receive the agreed service on the conditions matching both sides. Try to say you are a king somewhere else, let's say in a private club or shop and see what happens ;))) It's same anywhere.[/QUOTE]Very good description of the russian concept of service.

[QUOTE=Helena Moscow]Golden words, Jake ;) Do you have any news?[/QUOTE]
Well, during the month of September, I spent 7 nights at home and the rest of the month in Moscow, Kiev, Ashgabat, Sao Paulo, and Rio de Janeiro. Hey! that's sex on four continents in one month.

News? Heck yes! I'd say that's news!

[QUOTE=Jake993]Will someone please stick a fork in this thread? I think it's done.

For any of you who are not native English speakers, this is a late 20th century colloquialism for suggesting that a topic has been discussed to the point where it will yield no more useful information.

I think we have reached this point in this thread after 26 (including mine) posts (#2314 - #2339) where all that is to follow is name calling and accusations. Clearly there are differences in values and opinions and I doubt very much whether additional discussion is going to change anyone's mind one way or the other.

I know this is not a formal meeting but I would like to make a motion that this current topic come to and end. Let's move on.......

Anyone want to second the motion?[/QUOTE]


Second on the motion


Strav’s and Pizdyets comments on how to negotiate the best service with “ANY” provider are spot on. Posts 2335 and 2337.

Part of the problem are mongers coming from sex prison “USA” who are unaccustomed to being so straightforward on their needs.

From my experience you can say almost anything to a Russian woman without offending them. The more direct the better.

However this is a lesson I had to learn as well.

Reminds of the evening when Lukasek asks 15 women lined up in a in salon

“Who takes it in the ass? “

Classic moment you could not get away with in many locations in the world.

Overall my satisfaction rate in Russia is 99%, far better than anywhere else in the world.

Guido88

I just came back to Moscow to read what has transpired...interesting.

I was in Berlin had had two wonderful meetings for a great massage with a very happy and satisfied endings.

So now that I'm back on the land of Lenin where can I go or who I can see to repeat this experience?

To Stravinsky, I'll be in MOW off and on for at least another 2 weeks.

I look forward to the responses.

EK,

Do you speak Russian at all? You know, more than just "da" and "nyet"?

[QUOTE=El Kapitan]I just came back to Moscow to read what has transpired...interesting.

I was in Berlin had had two wonderful meetings for a great massage with a very happy and satisfied endings.

So now that I'm back on the land of Lenin where can I go or who I can see to repeat this experience?

To Stravinsky, I'll be in MOW off and on for at least another 2 weeks.

I look forward to the responses.[/QUOTE]

I'm American. Our economy is so much in the crapper right now, I might even consider doing it for 200 Euro if things get any more desperate.

What the Hell. You said you just want a great massage and there's no sex involved :-). According to the reports I read, it won't be much different than your last Russian experience :-)

I speak fluent English by the way.

[QUOTE=El Kapitan]I just came back to Moscow to read what has transpired...interesting.

I was in Berlin had had two wonderful meetings for a great massage with a very happy and satisfied endings.

So now that I'm back on the land of Lenin where can I go or who I can see to repeat this experience?

To Stravinsky, I'll be in MOW off and on for at least another 2 weeks.

I look forward to the responses.[/QUOTE]


[url]http://www.rusdosug.com/index.php?type=1[/url]

Please turn on your PM capability if you want us to give you additional assistance.

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]EK,

Do you speak Russian at all? You know, more than just "da" and "nyet"?[/QUOTE]Nyet.

I am working on it but certainly not capable in any meaningful way. I can ride the metro and find my way out. That is about it.

[QUOTE=Shelbysbaker]I'm American. Our economy is so much in the crapper right now, I might even consider doing it for 200 Euro if things get any more desperate.

What the Hell. You said you just want a great massage and there's no sex involved :-). According to the reports I read, it won't be much different than your last Russian experience :-)

I speak fluent English by the way.[/QUOTE]

Captain - how about a SSB/Pizdyets double-team? I'm well versed on Russian history, culture and architecture and speak flawless English. SSB can even film the encounter for your grandkids. Think "My Dinner with Andre" moved from NYC to Moscow...

Seriously, Strav has posted on a number of rug-n-tugs which should deliver the goods and at significantly lower prices than Lenechka's. Udachi tebe.

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]Captain. How about a SSB/Pizdyets double-team? I'm well versed on Russian history, culture and architecture and speak flawless English. SSB can even film the encounter for your grandkids. Think "My Dinner with Andre" moved from NYC to Moscow.

Seriously, Strav has posted on a number of rug-n-tugs which should deliver the goods and at significantly lower prices than Lenechka's. Udachi tebe. [/QUOTE]I am RTFF for Strav's info.

I think I'll have to pass on your most generous offer Pizdyets for some 4 hands fun. Regardless of what you may have heard I (please choose from one of the following):

A) was young and needed the money

B) was drunk

C) was not aware they were filming and never signed a release

D) thought you were my wife

I will probably try Night Flight, Che, and The Real McCoy. At this point I think I'm more interested in exploring the "non-pro" night life and getting the full Moscow experience.

If any of you are going to be heading out feel free to hit me up.

Cheers

[QUOTE=Piper1]I doubt it. Helena knew he's an ISG member and that he would probably report here, so for things to go so wrong, there's clearly more to the story. Let's face it, El Kapitan has issues, and he should switch from ISG to the Discovery Channel.Interesting. Tell us more, if you are genuine.[/QUOTE]I am not sure what my "issues" are other than I prefer a massage and HJ/cbj to throwing my junk up in the ass of any WG willing to sell it. Everyone must make decisions that reconcile their desire, their knowledge of things that can go wrong, and set their comfort level for risk. My preference is born of a comfort level for risk vs. Reward. I have met many a WG who I would like nothing better than to lock myself away with for a weekend. But in the end my personal comfort level is not there for this activity.

I have no issue with other hobbyists who have a greater tolerance for risk or greater sexual adventure. To each his own. This is one of the last places I would expect to find a lot of "holier than thou" and judgmental behavior.

I remember seeing your name quite a bit in the Dubai forum where I have spent some time myself so I reviewed it. I pulled some girls out of Rockafella's and Rattle Snake myself for exactly what I wanted. Which was a nice massage and CBJ from a hot girl at a good price.

I don't wish to re-energize this dead thread but I also don't wish to be insulted by a stranger. Especially one I am not paying.

I respect your knowledge and experience in the wild world of mongering Piper. I really enjoy your reports and humor and don't wish to enter into a cyber pissing match.

Perhaps I should have let your comments float on by but I don't think this is a place any of us should be afraid to report on our experiences or our preferences.

PS. I also believe that if anyone cares to check I am consistent on what I look for and have only ever given 1 bad review.

I will accept equal responsibility for the bad experience I had with Helena.

I assumed that if an escort charges 200EU / 2 hr that this would normally include the usual chat, sex, etc. The fact that I did not wish to have intercourse or perform oral sex on the escort I would have thought if anything would constitute a DECREASE in provided services, not an increase or unusual "non-standad" request such as anal, bareback, etc.

Assumptions are always bad and especially so when crossing cultural lines. I should not have said "chat, massage, and we will see where it goes". As someone else pointed out I was misinformed that prostitution in Russia is illegal. The feedback this forum has provided as led me to develop my new standard request phrasing:

"I want a thorough full body massage followed by a combination of manual digital manipulation of my genitalia (handjob) and oral sex (blowjob) with a condom to ejaculation. My asshole is off limits. I expect your pictures to be recent and accurate with no photoshopping. I expect the time that we agree to will be honored and there will be no limit as to the number of times I may ejaculate. I expect a good attitude and professional behavior during the session. If any of these expectation are not met I will not honor the agreed to price".

I have realized the error of my ways and will adjust my negotiations accordingly.

On on a side note if Rusdosug.com had not been offline or if Natasha had answered her cell then it may very well have been a different evening altogether. I should have exercised patience and waited for one of my higher choices. Always trust your gut.

Enough said.

[QUOTE=El Kapitan]I am RTFF for Strav's info.

I think I'll have to pass on your most generous offer Pizdyets for some 4 hands fun. Regardless of what you may have heard I (please choose from one of the following):

A) was young and needed the money

B) was drunk

C) was not aware they were filming and never signed a release

D) thought you were my wife

I will probably try Night Flight, Che, and The Real McCoy. At this point I think I'm more interested in exploring the "non-pro" night life and getting the full Moscow experience.

If any of you are going to be heading out feel free to hit me up.

Cheers[/QUOTE]

LOL!

Yes, I strongly suggest Che. Make a dinner reservation if you want to guarantee admission (food ain't half bad).

Tunnel can also be fun - I usually drop by there around 5am to see what sluts are left alone or are willing to dump their dork-for-a-night "boyfriends". But it's bottom trawling at best, and I'm not talking Patagonian Toothfish.

[quote=helena moscow]priamos, king is a person born in a royal family and sitting in a trone. client is a person who pays for service. see the difference? client is in the same position with a person offering service. because they exchange equivalent things. client doesn't pay more than service costs and he doesn't pay less. he pays as agreed. both client and provider can be right or wrong, there is no previllage for anyone. [/quote]

yeah, well, sorry for "flogging a dead horse" but i really don't understand why you're being so aggressive, helena. the words i proffered, "the client is king", are not an assertive claim of superiority that i personally have devised. in fact, they are an american figure of speech that you hear all the time in the united states, repeated more or less as the "creed" of their client oriented commercial economy. if you have a problem with that, fine, who am i to judge people? however, some of your staunch supporters on this thread are - if i can judge from their english - americans, and "the client is king" will be (using another yank colloquialism) "like motherhood and apple pie" to them.

[QUOTE=El Kapitan]

"I want a thorough full body massage followed by a combination of manual digital manipulation of my genitalia (handjob) and oral sex (blowjob) with a condom to ejaculation. My asshole is off limits. I expect your pictures to be recent and accurate with no photoshopping. I expect the time that we agree to will be honored and there will be no limit as to the number of times I may ejaculate. I expect a good attitude and professional behavior during the session. If any of these expectation are not met I will not honor the agreed to price".[/QUOTE]

El Kap

To learn the lay of the land in Moscow you need to either hook up with either fellow experienced ISG members or expats living in Moscow.

For expats try the Hot Dog or other venues that cater to that client base. Irish pubs are also good.

Then meet people and pick their brains for suggestions. Works well for me.

As to your other criteria its’ going to get lost in the lengthy presentation.

Solution is simple. Act like the true dog you are and approach as a Russian man would.

#1- 1st is “I have paid and bought for your ass.” You will do as requested and take pride in what you do. They know that but like children will test boundaries.

#2- Show up at my door looking like your picture or you will be sent home.

#3- Payment will be after service is provided. Those insisting on upfront are usually the worst performers. Refer to #2. Show them money; do not release it until you finish with full satisfaction.

If it’s a salon leave a good tip visible and they will perform, as will the other girls when you return already known as a good tipper.

I always tip for good performance and find it helps for future sessions or in the same salon or escort service.

The amazing thing here is that these rules are what the RU girls are accustomed to. RU women are second-class citizens and have been for thousands of years. Take advantage of that.

It’s the pussy whipped sex starved Western tourists that have fucked things up.

Be firm, be a man and be demanding and all will be fine. The RU women respect a firm man and will walk all over a weak one.

You might want to reconsider your prostate hesitations, makes for one hell of an intense finish. :) IMHO Halfway kidding…..

Long as you are confirmed straight it’s no big deal.

Guido88

[QUOTE=Guido88]Long as you are confirmed straight it’s no big deal.

Guido88[/QUOTE]If you enjoy having something shoved into your ass I am not sure how you can confirm you are straight! :)

I actually have tried it on a couple of occasions (not so fast...with women that I trusted) and found it uncomfortable and got no pleasure from it. If anything was a little painful. So not my cup of tea.

I appreciate the rest of your advice and will try to put it to good use.

[QUOTE=El Kapitan]If you enjoy having something shoved into your ass I am not sure how you can confirm you are straight! :)

I actually have tried it on a couple of occasions (not so fast...with women that I trusted) and found it uncomfortable and got no pleasure from it. If anything was a little painful. So not my cup of tea.

I appreciate the rest of your advice and will try to put it to good use.[/QUOTE]
I think you are misunderstanding Guido's recommendation about what get's placed where. Clear communications are essential in this business.

Reminds me of a funny story about a guy heading out to Dubai the first time, stop me if you have heard this one before...

The new guy, we will call him Piper, arrives in a isolated construction camp in the desert. The project manager shows him around, housing, dining, recreational facilities, with satellite TV, etc. Piper looks around at the all-male crew and says, "Sure, this is all very nice, but what do you do ... you know ... about sex?"

"Oh, that's not a problem, when we get horny, we just go down behind the shed there, and use that camel," the project manager explains, pointing out a rather mangy looking animal tied up to a palm tree.

Piper just shakes his head and says to himself, "No way I will ever get that desperate!"

But the work is hard and the days are hot and the nights are long and after a couple of weeks Piper is getting hornier and hornier and the camel is looking better and better...

So finally one day Piper breaks down and runs over to the camel, drops his pants and starts shagging the bleating beast. When he is finished he looks around and sees the rest of the crew staring and snickering at him.

"What are you all looking at!" Piper shouts, "You said you all use the camel when you get horny!"

The project manager shakes his head and says, "When we get horny, we use the camel ... to ride to the *****house in town!"

Nice!

However,

[QUOTE=Gentleman Travel]I think you are misunderstanding Guido's recommendation about what get's placed where. Clear communications are essential in this business.
[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Guido88] You might want to reconsider your prostate hesitations, makes for one hell of an intense finish. IMHO Halfway kidding…..[/QUOTE]

I was pretty sure Guido88 was talking about having a finger inserted in your ass for a "prostate massage" which supposedly creates a very intense orgasm. As Austin Powers said, "It's not my bag baby."

GT,

HA! Good one, never heard that before.

Okay so I need a good recommendation for Saturday in MOW.

From the forum it seems Karma, Real McCoy, and Che are good places that are semi English friendly and provide some "normal" girls. Any thoughts on these?

Also anyone have feedback on live music venues? I was thinking the Dom u Dorogi, B.B.King, or Arbat Blues Club.

Thanks for the info.

So far I have hit:

Night Flight - last Sunday had dinner (very good filet) and and hung in the bar. Lots of 7's to 9's. All quoted $500 (agree with the "union" comment). I left alone but enjoyed the experience.

Hit Che on Sat (no reso so turned away as expected) Real McCoy (good swing band but full and no tables and I needed food, women were not looking strong anyway), ended up at Papa John's. Some really nice looking girls but a full joint and I had an early Sun anyway so I didn't stay long. Pretty fair pizza though and watching some of the crazy Russian guys dance was VERY entertaining...

Hit Karma on Sunday. I enjoyed the club but the women were not as hot as expected. 5 - 8's. As someone mentioned it is Hip-Hop oriented on Sun at least and it seemed the majority of girls there were looking for dark meat.

I think I will try Parizhskaya Zhizn' today (Mon) and if that sucks not sure where to head...maybe head to Hot Dog's to check the box.

Tour of duty ends this coming Saturday so any recommendations of other places for Tue, Wed, Thur, Fri are appreciated.

Food too!

[QUOTE=El Kapitan]
Tour of duty ends this coming Saturday so any recommendations of other places for Tue, Wed, Thur, Fri are appreciated.
Food too![/QUOTE]

Good choice on NF for dinner. Tough to beat their fillet.

Michael's on Tverskoye Bulvar (south of Tverskaya near Nikitskaya) is an excellent place (albeit pricey) for a great meal. Interesting crowd. Both times I have been there there's a mix of upscale Russians and (non-American) foreigners. Date and I got invited to a private party afterward by the folks at the table next to us - so that was pretty cool.

There also an interesting Peruvian Restaurant called El Inka. It's located on the third level of the shopping mall called 5th Avenue. It's a 10- minute walk from the Oktyaberskoye Pole metro. Food is ok, but they have a live latin band on weekends (and I think on Thursdays). If you like to latin dance you can most certainly pull a non-pro out of there after a few dances and few drinks. Lots of beautiful girls dancing together - always a good sign.

If you have not tried it, Cafe Pushkin is worth going to (once) just for the experience. Expensive but very nicely put together restaurant. Food is excellent but not memorable. It's more for the experience of the place.

[QUOTE=Jake993]Good choice on NF for dinner. Tough to beat their fillet.

Michael's on Tverskoye Bulvar (south of Tverskaya near Nikitskaya) is an excellent place (albeit pricey) for a great meal. Interesting crowd. Both times I have been there there's a mix of upscale Russians and (non-American) foreigners. Date and I got invited to a private party afterward by the folks at the table next to us - so that was pretty cool.

There also an interesting Peruvian Restaurant called El Inka. It's located on the third level of the shopping mall called 5th Avenue. It's a 10- minute walk from the Oktyaberskoye Pole metro. Food is ok, but they have a live latin band on weekends (and I think on Thursdays). If you like to latin dance you can most certainly pull a non-pro out of there after a few dances and few drinks. Lots of beautiful girls dancing together - always a good sign.

If you have not tried it, Cafe Pushkin is worth going to (once) just for the experience. Expensive but very nicely put together restaurant. Food is excellent but not memorable. It's more for the experience of the place.[/QUOTE]El Inka sounds cool...

Other recommendations:

CitySpace Bar on top floor of SwissOtel Kransye Holmy. Go at dusk and order a single drink.... anything else is too expensive. But the view is awesome. That bar has gotten me laid many times... but also cost me a small fortune. BTW... it's a BRING a date place. It would be pretty awkward trying to pick someone up there... single girls don't go there because it's too expensive. BTW, did I mention it's expensive?

If you are only interested in quality of food, the chow at "Scandanavia" is great. Excellent meat, the mixed grill is superb as is the fried salmon or herring starter. OK place for date, but not really romantic. Too cool and Scandanavian for romance... I only go there with girls I have already bagged.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]El Inka sounds cool...[/QUOTE]
It is indeed. Check it out.
[url]http://www.afisha.ru/msk/club/12105/[/url]
But be warned, I heard that they now close at midnight because the mall owners were concerned about people roaming the upscale mall at 3:00 AM.
BUT - if you show up at 2200 and move fast, you can either bag one early or hook up with a group of devs going to he the next dance club.

I ask for your reviews about:

[url]http://www.putana.nu[/url]

At last, there are a lot of prostitutes' sites but nobody reports experiences here. One of the purposes of this forum is to review girls and agencies to avoid mistakes and frauds.

[QUOTE=El Kapitan]If you enjoy having something shoved into your ass I am not sure how you can confirm you are straight! :)

I actually have tried it on a couple of occasions (not so fast...with women that I trusted) and found it uncomfortable and got no pleasure from it. If anything was a little painful. So not my cup of tea.

I appreciate the rest of your advice and will try to put it to good use.[/QUOTE]


El Kap

I was teasing you… Most guys are inhibited exploring such activities.

Actually I do enjoy prostate stimulation. The orgasms are a 10 on the Richter scale and make for a huge load on some stunning woman’s face.

Alas I am not only straight but a confirmed Lesbian as well. :)

GT is right as well, delivery in a cute female ass is more than pleasing.

Now about that camel……

Guido88

[QUOTE=El Kapitan]So far I have hit:

Night Flight - last Sunday had dinner (very good filet) and and hung in the bar. Lots of 7's to 9's. All quoted $500 (agree with the "union" comment). I left alone but enjoyed the experience.

Hit Che on Sat (no reso so turned away as expected) Real McCoy (good swing band but full and no tables and I needed food, women were not looking strong anyway), ended up at Papa John's. Some really nice looking girls but a full joint and I had an early Sun anyway so I didn't stay long. Pretty fair pizza though and watching some of the crazy Russian guys dance was VERY entertaining...

Hit Karma on Sunday. I enjoyed the club but the women were not as hot as expected. 5 - 8's. As someone mentioned it is Hip-Hop oriented on Sun at least and it seemed the majority of girls there were looking for dark meat.

I think I will try Parizhskaya Zhizn' today (Mon) and if that sucks not sure where to head...maybe head to Hot Dog's to check the box.

Tour of duty ends this coming Saturday so any recommendations of other places for Tue, Wed, Thur, Fri are appreciated.

Food too![/QUOTE]

Well I hit Parizhskaya Zhizn' on Monday. I had dinner (not great) and then went upstairs. I entered at 2330. Total of 5 girls and one guy. I remembered my forum info though and decided to stick it out and see what transpired since it was "early". It was a decent crowd by 0100 with a few decent girls but about a 50/50 mix girls to guys. Id di see one of the funniest things so far in MOW...a guy by lonesome decided his dress shirt was just too much so he decided to unbotton it and tie it into a "half shirt" while dancing on the elevated stage. I was highly entertained.

So true to my word I headed for Hot Dogs/Boarhouse/Chesterfields at 0300. 200 rub to get in, 100 rub for the jacket...and I stayed about 15 min. The girls looked pretty used up...I did test the urinals though...just to check the box. Not as bad as I expected but the bleach burns in my lungs may have affected my sense of smell!

So bailed out and let the cabbie talk me into a place called Bordello (?). I should have bailed as soon as they asked for 1000 rub to enter...I didn't realize it was a strip club until too late. About 50 girls (all pretty hot) and 3 guys. I was mobbed and my dance nyet seemed to fall on deaf ears. I bailed after about 10 min and in that time I already had a stripper tell me I was a "bad man" for not paying her for mauling me.

I decided to check out Gharzh (sp?) near Puskinskaya. At this point it was about 0345 and the doorman said "club card". I asked how much was membership to which he said something in Russian which I of course did not understand. I decided to bail so no idea on there. I dug Papa's the other night so I thought I may try there....it looked empty from the outside so I bailed and just headed back to the apartment.

Overall a fairly disappointing night. I am hoping that Wed will be better.

[QUOTE=Jake993]Good choice on NF for dinner. Tough to beat their fillet.

Michael's on Tverskoye Bulvar (south of Tverskaya near Nikitskaya) is an excellent place (albeit pricey) for a great meal. Interesting crowd. Both times I have been there there's a mix of upscale Russians and (non-American) foreigners. Date and I got invited to a private party afterward by the folks at the table next to us - so that was pretty cool.

There also an interesting Peruvian Restaurant called El Inka. It's located on the third level of the shopping mall called 5th Avenue. It's a 10- minute walk from the Oktyaberskoye Pole metro. Food is ok, but they have a live latin band on weekends (and I think on Thursdays). If you like to latin dance you can most certainly pull a non-pro out of there after a few dances and few drinks. Lots of beautiful girls dancing together - always a good sign.

If you have not tried it, Cafe Pushkin is worth going to (once) just for the experience. Expensive but very nicely put together restaurant. Food is excellent but not memorable. It's more for the experience of the place.[/QUOTE]

Thanks to Dr. Skank, Jake and Guido for the tips and suggestions.

[quote=el kapitan]thanks to dr. skank, jake and guido for the tips and suggestions.[/quote]

ek,

keep this one in the back of your mind. down on novy arbat (near arbatskaya metro) is a bar / restaurant called zhiguli (like the car) . it's known for being a brezhnev era bar. very plain with concrete floors and wooden benches - proletarian is the look they were going for i think.

if you come in the door, the bar is to the right and the restaurant is to the left. they normally have a live band during the week after 9:00 pm that play a wide variety of dance music. early in the week, (tues, wed) it seems to be a popular place for office colleagues to go for a happy hour after work. eat some food, drink some beer (and maybe a little vodka) and do some dancing.

i was there in june on a tuesday night with a date and saw a table with about 12 beautiful girls and only 3 rather dopey looking guys. by 10 pm, the girls were trashed and hitting on all of the guys in the restaurant to come and dance with them. when my date went to use the ladies room, one of the girls literally dragged my up onto the dance floor during a slow dance and proceeded to grind her crotch into my leg. of course, when my date came back, i just about had to break up a cat fight, but i digress.

this may have been an isolated incident but in talking with expat friends who live in moscow, they often make a swing past zhiguli just to see what's available. hey - it's worth a peek. i don't think an elitny muscovite girl would be caught dead in the place, but who fucking cares? it seems to be a popular spot with the office girls so i think it's one to keep handy.

good luck,

jake

[quote=jake993]ek,

keep this one in the back of your mind. down on novy arbat (near arbatskaya metro) is a bar / restaurant called zhiguli (like the car) . it's known for being a brezhnev era bar. hey - it's worth a peek. i don't think an elitny muscovite girl would be caught dead in the place, but who fucking cares? it seems to be a popular spot with the office girls so i think it's one to keep handy. [/quote]nice call jake.

s1ut factor:
office girls>elitny muscovites

go for it. and sometimes they even have their own car.

and guess what, skank has a good jedi mind trick ploy for that.

lena: "doc, i can't drink tonight. i have a car."

doc: "lenochka, it's cold outside. you should have a vodka. we'll drink to a holiday together in a warm place.*"

lena: "but doc, i am scared of militia. they are everywhere. i can't afford to lose my licence."

doc: "you're right lena, you'd better stay at my place tonight. it's very close and warm there and you can drive to work in the morning. i'll be nice and sleep on the couch and not try to fuck you, or even stick a finger in you. promise.**"




* a fucking lie!
** another fucking lie!

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]

* a fucking lie!
** another fucking lie![/QUOTE]

[i]Spoken in the voice of Babu Bhat from an episode of "Seinfeld"[/i]

"You are a bad man, Dr. Skank, a VERY bad man....."

To be in Ufa on monday evening is so boring, nobody in the city, even the lobby bar at hotel Baskortostan was empty of girls, so now I am in my bedroom killling the time writing my report....

Friday 3 october

I flight with Aereoflot, not bad, even if the plane looked very old, arrived to Sheremetyevo, passport control was so crowded, I guess about 2-300 people,but I noticed almost nobody to the check of electronic passport, I went there and in 10 minutes I was out where my friend sent me the regular taxi that for only 1400 rubles took me to hotel Zolotoj Kolos.
Zolotoj it is the cheapest hotel I found, actually they are in total in 8 differents buildings very close to hotel Cosmos. When I arrived I had immediately to afford the typical russian service, cause they told me I will stay not in the main building but in the other one, so they,only in russian, described me the street to do to get to my building....imagine...such tired, with almost 35kg of suitcases walking in the night searching for an address nobody knows....and I really did not found the other building, so I went back to the main building where they described me one more time in russian where I will stay.....it was really a bad beginning after 4 years from my last time in Russia...

I found my building after about one hour, fast shower and I met with my russian friend and his wife, we went to simple pleasures restaurant, couple of salads and beers and.... 4,500 rubles (121 euro)....I was already tired of Moscow...so used to the price of year 2004......

Then they went to sleep and I wanted to try Karma bar, it was about 2:00 and...obviously I did not passed the strict face control, nevermind, I stopped few cars just to be able to find one driver that knows where is hot dog.....once where I drunk couple of beer and start to look to the girls....

It was enough to just blink an eyes and they came to me one after one, they asked 12.000 rubles (320 euro) and I obviously said no. I was tired and not really in mood to get sex, surely not at such insane prices. What I noticed that till 3:00 all the girls were alone, nobody took out no one of them.
One came to me and said, 10.000 rubles (270 euro), still too much. Later another one came and said to me 5.000 rubles ( 135 euro), not bad but she looked bad....

I was there till 5:00 am and very few girls went away with somebody, it seems they do not want to negotiate, they prefer to not work instead to work for cheaper price, their problem,surely not mine.


Saturday 4 october

I was so tired I slept almost all the day, evening I got a dinner at hot dog and more or less there it was as the evening of the previous day. I was waiting for my travel to Ufa so I did not care so much about to get sex in the so insane expensive Moscow.
But I remember....in 2004 I got so much fun and so great sex getting tochka together guido88, that I went out of hot dog and try to find a driver that could find me a good tochka.
I found one, we were to search,but it was almost morning, so we found nothing really good, however the good thing, he wanted only 1500 rubles ( 40 euro) for almost 1 hour of driving, not so bad price I guess.


Sunday 5 october

I spent the day in the red square with my friend, evening I went to hot dog again, cause I was not in mood to test again strict face control, but this time at 22:00 I called my friend to search tochka. He told me he was busy, so I found another driver, he was from Daghestan and when I asked his price for tochka he told me, he charged 1km 40 rubles (1 euro), it seem to me so great price I said, let's go.
The only problem,he spoke only russian,but as I understood later, instead to search to somebody that speaks english,better to try to speak russian,cause my good knowledge of czech language together with many hours spent listen Pimsleour lesson course,made my russian better than I could even imagine.

To make long short, we went only few km far from hotel Cosmos and there were really many tochkas, enough cheap and even if they were not a top notch,they were much better than many girls you see in hot dog.

I took one blonde from Tula, she was 20yo, about 160cm for 50kg for 8.000 rubles ( 215 euro) till morning. We sit in the back of the taxi kissing each other as two lovers, the only problem was the security of the hotel....but she surprised me, she had passport,so I neither bribed the security, the reception woman just wrote her name and we were in bedroom.

It was nothing wonderful, but very nice friendly passionate sex, no anal, but bbbj and fk and for only 8.000 in moscow was very good, think she stayed about 9 hours and I had sex 3 times.
Ah...how much wanted my driver ? He really count the number of km he drove and 1kmX40 rubles, so just 1.100 rubles (30 euro).....

These were my 3 days in Moscow, just a couple of lines to write that it is really too big city for a normal guy as me that it is used to live in a city with only 200.000 inhabitants, Moscow and the non speakers Moscovits eat you.....specially at the first day till you do not get used how it all works and to be alone surely not help you....

I could not wait to go to Ufa and to be in smaller city, in about a week I will post a report about my 14 days in Ufa in other section, so far, udachu....

Several of you will remember that I asked for advice on contacting Moscow girls via email a couple of weeks ago. At least one person adviced me back then, as a foreigner with only the flimsiest command of Russian, to "stick to the glossy, expensive escort services catering to visiting foreigners". I thought, at the time, that this was silly and condescending, but I've come around to realise that it was probably a well intended warning. I share with you the following little story about my preparations for a visit to Moscow next week. There's nothing awfully new there, just some facts that I find mildly amusing and perhaps instructive for newcomers like myself.

I went on the dating site maw.ru and came across a young woman called Kristina, 21 years old, located in the centre of Moscow. She wasn't awfully pretty but, as I've always said, if I can't find a stunner I prefer "the neighbour's chubby daughter" to a somwhat-pretty girl who considers herself god's gift to the mongers. I relied on PROMPT to give my emails a reasonably good skin of Russian.

Kristina was perfectly willing to come to my room for a couple of hours. Her prices were 1500 rubles for an hour of Oral plus Classic; 1000 for BBBJ; 1500 for Anal. Yes, I wanted to know, but how much is a package? Two hours with Classic plus BBBJ. Ah that, she told me, is 1500+1500 = 3000 roubles - with no extra for BBBJ. This is obviously a suspiciously low price, but - idiot that I am - I congratulated myself that I'd finally located a provider with "correct prices" like the ones I paid in May in Rio de Janeiro (a city of similar size and income levels as Moscow).

After the deal was stitched Kristina predictably told me to phone her and confirm once I'd arrived to my hotel. Well, I told her, my Russian is almost non-existent, but I'll send you an email as soon as I'm there. This flustered her enormously: "You don't speak Russian??? But... but..." I told her to calm down "I do speak about 100 words of Russian, I just don't feel confident phoning people". She rambled on, "Er... maybe you could send me a photo? Fotki please???" I thought this silly, but hey, maybe she thought I was just some internet time waster? I sent her a recent holiday snap of myself. Since then, total silence.

For a day I was flummoxed. We had the deal stitched up, with price, service, time and meeting place. Why was my Russian speaking abilities a problem? Also, it's not like the photo I sent her would have made her bolt: I'm a youngish, sprighty and quite muscular and athletic 40+ guy. So why???

Then I put on my Russian hat. The deal that I thought I had negotiated would have rested in itself. Kristria would simply have had to come to my hotel room, take the money, undress, and get on with it. However, if she was NOT willing to do those things. If she was in on a bait-and-switch routine according to which I would have to pay at least 2X for basic services then it all makes sense. In that case, not being able to communicate with me for a secondary negotiation would blow the scheme out of the water. Then comes the back-up plan: at least she can pocket my 3000 rubles and do a bunk? But... what kind of a person am I? My photo shows her that, far from being a geek or a dear old man, I'm a physical person who could get nasty if crossed. Since then, silence.

Well, there are some very savvy operators out there on the Russian znakomstva sites. And, as the Russians have it, "The Woolf from Tambov is Their Mate!" :)

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Nice call Jake.

s1ut factor:
Office girls>elitny Muscovites

Go for it. And sometimes they even have their own car.

And guess what, Skank has a good Jedi Mind Trick ploy for that.

Lena: "Doc, I can't drink tonight. I have a car."

Doc: "Lenochka, it's cold outside. You should have a vodka. We'll drink to a holiday together in a warm place.*"

Lena: "But Doc, I am scared of militia. They are everywhere. I can't afford to lose my licence."

Doc: "You're right Lena, you'd better stay at my place tonight. It's very close and warm there and you can drive to work in the morning. I'll be nice and sleep on the couch and not try to fuck you, or even stick a finger in you. Promise.**"




* a fucking lie!
** another fucking lie![/QUOTE]

Doc,

I am always glad to hear you are using your powers for evil instead of good.

[quote=jake993]ek,

keep this one in the back of your mind. down on novy arbat (near arbatskaya metro) is a bar / restaurant called zhiguli (like the car) . it's known for being a brezhnev era bar. very plain with concrete floors and wooden benches - proletarian is the look they were going for i think.

if you come in the door, the bar is to the right and the restaurant is to the left. they normally have a live band during the week after 9:00 pm that play a wide variety of dance music. early in the week, (tues, wed) it seems to be a popular place for office colleagues to go for a happy hour after work. eat some food, drink some beer (and maybe a little vodka) and do some dancing.

i was there in june on a tuesday night with a date and saw a table with about 12 beautiful girls and only 3 rather dopey looking guys. by 10 pm, the girls were trashed and hitting on all of the guys in the restaurant to come and dance with them. when my date went to use the ladies room, one of the girls literally dragged my up onto the dance floor during a slow dance and proceeded to grind her crotch into my leg. of course, when my date came back, i just about had to break up a cat fight, but i digress.

this may have been an isolated incident but in talking with expat friends who live in moscow, they often make a swing past zhiguli just to see what's available. hey - it's worth a peek. i don't think an elitny muscovite girl would be caught dead in the place, but who fucking cares? it seems to be a popular spot with the office girls so i think it's one to keep handy.

good luck,

jake[/quote]

thanks!

i second someone else's vote for a cute "normal" girl always trumps an elitny muscovite.

[QUOTE=Lukasek]we went to simple pleasures restaurant, couple of salads and beers and.... 4,500 rubles (121 euro)....It was enough to just blink an eyes and they came to me one after one, they asked 12.000 rubles (320 euro) One came to me and said, 10.000 rubles (270 euro), still too much. Later another one came and said to me 5.000 rubles ( 135 euro) he wanted only 1500 rubles ( 40 euro) for almost 1 hour of driving, 160cm for 50kg for 8.000 rubles ( 215 euro) so just 1.100 rubles (30 euro).....I could not wait to go to Ufa...[/QUOTE]Welcome to Moscow Luka! I admire your spirit and drive... I think I would have died after the suitcase/search for hotel bit.. :) Looking forward to your Ufa reports!

[QUOTE=Priamos]Then I put on my Russian hat. The deal that I thought I had negotiated would have rested in itself. Kristria would simply have had to come to my hotel room, take the money, undress, and get on with it. However, if she was NOT willing to do those things. If she was in on a bait-and-switch routine according to which I would have to pay at least 2X for basic services then it all makes sense. In that case, not being able to communicate with me for a secondary negotiation would blow the scheme out of the water. Then comes the back-up plan: at least she can pocket my 3000 rubles and do a bunk? But... what kind of a person am I? My photo shows her that, far from being a geek or a dear old man, I'm a physical person who could get nasty if crossed. Since then, silence.

Well, there are some very savvy operators out there on the Russian znakomstva sites. And, as the Russians have it, "The Woolf from Tambov is Their Mate!" :)[/QUOTE]I think you are reading too much into it. I think she just got scared when she realized you weren't who she thought you were and got skittish.

It isn't abnormal for girls to go totally silent anyway. Maybe she found a better john for the night. Or got her period. Could also be her boyfriend read her email and beat the shit out of her. Who knows.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]I think you are reading too much into it. I think she just got scared when she realized you weren't who she thought you were and got skittish.

It isn't abnormal for girls to go totally silent anyway. Maybe she found a better john for the night. Or got her period. Could also be her boyfriend read her email and beat the shit out of her. Who knows.[/QUOTE]

Yeah, I suppose it could be true. Mind you, she knew I was a foreigner and a total newcomer to the Moscow scene, so the "skittish" part doesn't apply. But any one of your other points of course do. I'd like to have said that "in my part of the world these things work much better" but... well, it's easier to negotiate a full deal online in West Europe. - And that's a fact. But... whether or not the girl is going to ultimately honour the terms of that deal...? O Tempora, O Mores! :)

Priamos,

Are you some sort of university professor? Maybe a nuclear physicist? Or a rocket scientist? I'm sorry, please don't take this the wrong way, but my head is spinning trying to understand the logic of your approach. I think I finally understand why you are having so much difficulty: you think too much. It's always very dangerous to over-analyze Russian behaviour. If you try to apply the calm, rational calculating mind of the Nordic race to Russians, you will only drive yourself crazy.

Russians have a unique logic all their own, and they're not telling. You can't understand it intellectually, you simply have to experience it: it's an heuristic process.

To be honest, while reading your report, I assumed that you were actually in Moscow, communicating with this dyevchonka. If [i][b]I[/b][/i] was surprised to discover that you were not in Moscow, imagine how surprised [i][b]she[/b][/i] must have been!

And the idea that you can compare Rio with Moscow simply because they are "cities of similar sizes and income levels" is, I'm sorry to say, simply naive.

There is no way to plan a trip to Russia. Go get yourself a visa, get on a plane and go, already!

Don't worry, we'll all be here, urging you on. ;)

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]It's always very dangerous to over-analyze Russian behaviour. If you try to apply the calm, rational calculating mind of the Nordic race to Russians, you will only drive yourself crazy.

Russians have a unique logic all their own, and they're not telling. You can't understand it intellectually, you simply have to experience it: it's an heuristic process.[/QUOTE]Words of wisdom, Strav.[QUOTE=Priamos] And that's a fact. But... whether or not the girl is going to ultimately honour the terms of that deal...? O Tempora, O Mores! :)[/QUOTE]And another point... don't go into paranoia mode. Of course one should be watchful and inherently cautious. But generally speaking, nobody in Moscow is "out to get you". As Lukasek eloquently stated, in fact the thing about Moscow is NOBODY GIVES A FUCK ABOUT YOU.

You're on your own, and even though it can be a grind, ultimately it's a challenge that if met can yield great rewards.

Happy hunting!

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]
And the idea that you can compare Rio with Moscow simply because they are "cities of similar sizes and income levels" is, I'm sorry to say, simply naive.)[/QUOTE]
Not to beat a dead horse, but having been in both Rio and Moscow within a two week period, I can [b] [i] categorically [/i][/b] confirm that comparing girls from those cities is like comparing potatoes and acerola. I am sure there are things in this world that are more different, but I can't imagine what they might be. Sure they have the same physical attributes, but while the Brasileiras are predictable in their own chaotic sort of way, I have found the moods, emotions (or lack thereof), and decision process of Russian women to be as unpredictable and non-linear as the Moscow weather. Come to think of it, my Ukrainian Babusha was equally as erratic.

[QUOTE=Stravinsky] I think I finally understand why you are having so much difficulty: you think too much. It's always very dangerous to over-analyze Russian behaviour. If you try to apply the calm, rational calculating mind of the Nordic race to Russians, you will only drive yourself crazy.[/QUOTE]

Yeah. The UK Prime Minister Palmerstone went into the same trap prior to the Crimean War. He was convinced that the Czar's propaganda machine had shot itself in the foot: "Going to war to drive the Turks out of the Holy City?? Such Messianic twaddle! For Pete's sake, this is the 19th century!" Some of his Russia advisors DID tell him that he hadn't understood the mind of the Russian Muchik... :)

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]To be honest, while reading your report, I assumed that you were actually in Moscow, communicating with this dyevchonka. If [i][b]I[/b][/i] was surprised to discover that you were not in Moscow, imagine how surprised [i][b]she[/b][/i] must have been! [/QUOTE]

Not so. I told her up front that I am currently abroad and coming to Russia next week. The only point I'm making is that it's strange to have a deal stitched up with all information in hand and THEN bolt over a bagatelle like my foreignness AFTER having extracted a photo that would, other things equal, have reassured her that I'm a bone fide client and (wearing expensive clothes) a quite wealthy man. But... maybe foreigners in general just make her freak out and, if she's not exactly a rocket scientist herself, needed 24 hours to connect the dots.


[QUOTE=Stravinsky]And the idea that you can compare Rio with Moscow simply because they are "cities of similar sizes and income levels" is, I'm sorry to say, simply naive.[/QUOTE]

Well, being naive and thinking too much is clearly a bad combination. So much effort for so little effect. :)

That said, I'm afraid that what we have here is my being worse than naive - I'm being judgemental! I also compare my experiences at Swiss skiing resorts with my experiences at French skiing resorts. And, as these invariably fall out to Swiss advantage, rub assorted French noses with my conclusions. On the face of it, this is also naive. How can you compare an arch-protestant shop assistant who considers failure a personal affront with a Gallic fatalist whose attitude is "Oh la la, it's not my fault. I only work here"? Logically you cannot. But if one doesn't make this comparison, if one jumps into moral relativism of the kind "well, that's just the way things work here" then one is on that slippery slope toward nihilism. And...

... as even, F.M.Dostoyevskij would tell you, that's never the right place to be. :)

[QUOTE=Priamos]That said, I'm afraid that what we have here is my being worse than naive - I'm being judgemental! I also compare my experiences at Swiss skiing resorts with my experiences at French skiing resorts. And, as these invariably fall out to Swiss advantage, rub assorted French noses with my conclusions.[/QUOTE]
Much more interesting than your musings on Dostoyevski would be hearing whether you have tried luring dyevs to join you on these ski expeditions?
I have been contemplating such a thing for Switzerland this winter.
I am sure it cannot be cheap to fly a girl in from Moscow or Kyiv, but it is hopeless to try to bed local Swiss girls...

Priamos,

It's not the Russkii muzhik you have to watch out for, it's the Russkaya zhyenshina.[QUOTE=Priamos]then one is on that slippery slope toward nihilism.[/QUOTE]Yeah, I know exactly how you feel, that's a constant concern in my life as well. God forbid we should start down that slippery slope to nihilism! :)

So tell me, what do you like to do to have fun? You know, between studying the history of the Ottoman empire, re-reading Kant and provoking French ski resort shop clerks?

Priamos,

Europe has no monopoly on elitism, it's a part of human nature, you can find it anywhere: in Denmark, in Russia, even in Texas! Yii-haaa! :D
[QUOTE=Priamos]Well, a normal girl (applying again my strictly subjective standards) would have had the decency to communicate this fact.[/QUOTE]Well, this is what it all comes down to doesn't it? You're not dealing with normal girls, you're dealing with russian dyeffki. And that, after all, is why we're here, isn't it? Stop trying to figure them out and just enjoy them, like the rest of us. ;)

If you're looking for normal girls, spend your weekends in Germany... bitte. :)

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]You're not dealing with normal girls, you're dealing with russian dyeffki. And that, after all, is why we're here, isn't it? Stop trying to figure them out and just enjoy them, like the rest of us. ;)

If you're looking for normal girls, spend your weekends in Germany... bitte. :)[/QUOTE]

Ah, now we're back to the core of your argument, aren't we? A defence plaidoyer based on the insightful observation that "that's just the way it is".
Well, Stravinsky, answering an earlier question of yours, I WAS offered a teaching chair (in social sciences) at a university in my younger days. I refused because I wanted to earn some money instead. - And a good thing that I did; I should have had to give you an E- for the quality of your sociological analysis: "Moscow cannot be compared with other cities of similar size, income and demographic characteristics." Well why not? "Because... uhm... Russia is different!"

Eh...? :)

[QUOTE=Gentleman Travel]I am sure it cannot be cheap to fly a girl in from Moscow or Kyiv, but it is hopeless to try to bed local Swiss girls...[/QUOTE]

Really? I've met a ton of girls (online and in person) who hint that they'll give it up immediately if I take them on vacation. Of course you need to negotiate testing the goods in advance, but this shouldn't cost you more than airfare, visa and a modicum of spending money.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]CitySpace Bar on top floor of SwissOtel Kransye Holmy. Go at dusk and order a single drink.... anything else is too expensive. But the view is awesome. That bar has gotten me laid many times... but also cost me a small fortune. BTW... it's a BRING a date place. It would be pretty awkward trying to pick someone up there... single girls don't go there because it's too expensive. BTW, did I mention it's expensive?
[/QUOTE]

Put Kalina Bar and Red Bar in the same bucket as CitySpace. Cocktail prices are directly proportional to elevation, without a doubt (which is probably why I prefer places in the podval). But yeah, laying out that kinda dough you need to seriously weigh whether or not it will get you laid. My last trip to Kalina Bar impressed the hell out of my date, but left me with a bed as empty as my wallet.

Priamos,

E minus ??? Is that, like, between a D-sharp and an E-flat?

My conclusions about Russia and Russians are based on the empirical evidence: mainly my own, but also that of many other people I have known over the years and some that I have read about.

Lighten up, my defence de fumer is simply to say that it is difficult to understand anything completely by observing it from a distance. Don't take my word for it, go there and see for yourself. I'm sure you will agree.

If you do, can I have a chance to re-take that test? You know... if I fail this class, my whole life will be ruined! :(

всего доброго

[QUOTE=Priamos]"Moscow cannot be compared with other cities of similar size, income and demographic characteristics." Well why not? "Because... uhm... Russia is different!"

Eh...? :)[/QUOTE]Guess what? Strav's right. And not only is Russia different, Moscow is different from Russia. I wouldn't trade it for any other city in the world.

Let me guess though, Brazil is different than every where else to.. or do I know Brazil because I saw some things about it on TV?

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]E minus ??? Is that, like, between a D-sharp and an E-flat?

My conclusions about Russia and Russians are based on the empirical evidence: mainly my own, but also that of many other people I have known over the years and some that I have read about.

Lighten up, my defence de fumer is simply to say that it is difficult to understand anything completely by observing it from a distance. Don't take my word for it, go there and see for yourself. [/QUOTE]

Stravinsky, your response is music to my ears (so to speak). :)

Anyway, you and the Doctor seem to assume that I've never been to Russia? That's wrong: I've visited twice, but admittedly to St.Petersburg both times rather than Moscow. Skank's point about Moscow being a state in the state is relevant here - that's also what I've (!) heard - and anyway I have relatives in Piter who nannied me incredibly so it's not the same thing.

But, more to the point: my wife is Russian. Mais oui! We didn't meet in Russia, but she still has the passport. And she, I have to admit, rather agrees with you. She keeps telling me "Priam, your western Liberal do-something-good-for-the-world attitude will come across to Russians as weak and naive. They'll eat you for breakfast." And...

...like you she keeps telling me to go and see for myself. Well, next week I will! :)

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]Really? I've met a ton of girls (online and in person) who hint that they'll give it up immediately if I take them on vacation. Of course you need to negotiate testing the goods in advance, but this shouldn't cost you more than airfare, visa and a modicum of spending money.[/QUOTE]
Are you saying normal Swiss girls will put out for a ski vacation?
Or are we both talking about importing Russian girls?
I find it hard enough to make inroads with Russian girls already in Europe,
to hit up European girls (I am 50) seems as hopeless as back home (NA).
And the ISG forums for most European cities are all about P4P, not freebies.
So if you have a formula for success, please share...

Hi,

I am going to Zelenograd next Monday for 6 weeks. I heard it is an absolute shithole, nothing to do, no restaurants, no bars, no girls.

Is there anything to do in Zelenograd. According to the customer you can take a train to Moscow but then you need to take a bus from the hotel to the train station, take a train to Moscow and then in Moscow take another bus or Metro. I think impossible if you do not speak eany Russian and can also not read it.

Are there any cheap hotels in Moscow. How about Cosmos. My company normally books sovietzky which is about 200 euro but the hotel in Zelenograd is only 100 euro.

I guess it will be the most boring 6 weeks of my life, only seeing the factory and the hotel and nowhere to eat and drink except in the hotel.

Is it easy to drive in Moscow. If I take a rental car is it then easy to find your way.

Tiffany

Guys besides Odnoklassniki.ru there is another social Russian website like facebook or hi5??. A lady friend of mine told me that she has profile in such site but I forget the name. Does anyone knows it?

Hi!

Moscow seems to be a real paradise to hire prostitutes. I found a lot of prostitutes' sites, maybe too many

My first query is about pictures: most pictures seem fake, don't they? How can we book the girl whom we want (blonde, brunette, clear eyes, dark eyes, small, tall, slim, fat, etc.)?

[QUOTE=Strike 69]Guys besides Odnoklassniki.ru there is another social Russian website like facebook or hi5??. A lady friend of mine told me that she has profile in such site but I forget the name. Does anyone knows it?[/QUOTE]Maybe [url]www.vkontakte.ru[/url]

Generally vkontakte is mostly used by people from St.Petersburg and the rest uses Odnoklassniki. However vkontakte is gaining popularity.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Maybe [url]www.vkontakte.ru[/url]

Generally vkontakte is mostly used by people from St.Petersburg and the rest uses Odnoklassniki. However vkontakte is gaining popularity.[/QUOTE]

Thanks Doctor I've found her profile you were right

[QUOTE=Member #2096]I guess it will be the most boring 6 weeks of my life, only seeing the factory and the hotel and nowhere to eat and drink except in the hotel.[/QUOTE]2096,

I'm not sure it's a good idea to try and drive into Moscow. If you speak no Russian and the ГАИ flag you over for a bribe, it could be a tense moment. Plus, the traffic is a nightmare and if you don't know where you are going, you will be lost.

There is a train from Zelenograd that will take you into Moscow, where you can transfer to a Metro station. If you plan your trip, no need to read Russian, just get off at the 8th stop (or 9th or 10th). The real problem will be that the public transit shuts down at 01:00, so you would be stuck in Moscow overnight. Unless you could find a taxist to take you back out to Zelenograd. Highly unlikely.

It's possible that you could find someone with a car in Z who would be willing to drive you into the city and back for a reasonable price. That's your most likely option.

If you will not be working on the weekend, then you could take the train into Moscow and take a hotel room for a night or two before returning to Zelenograd.

I know it's tough, being so close and yet so far.

I have been an avid reader of ISG for a couple of years by now, being a pretty frequent traveller to former USSR countries, and I enjoyed the valuable advices of many of you, especially Resident and Senior Members.

I am not so fool to rank myself as a cross between Brad Pitt and Tom Cruise but I have to say I never found it hard to establish a "contact" with a girl in places like shopping centers, banks, streets, ending with some date the same evening without showing a glittering roll of 500 Euros notes packed in my pocket.

As a matter of fact, I succeeded in establishing a pretty highly rewarding small network of gf in early 20s (I am 38) around Eastern Europe, in towns where my business frequently drives me, let's say once per 1-1,5 months.

I am used to bring some presents to them (nothing spectacular indeed..), I am deeply convinced most of them just need something that most (not all) local guys can't even imagine: attention.

Of course the game has to be played differently in places where it happens to me to go much more rarely, like Moscow.

It's no use for me to spend time and energy to build some sort of "long term gf relation" in vkontakte, omen or similar dating sites, but since Slavonic DNA has a such strong influence on me (causing Massive Temporary Blood Displacement..) I am asking for some suggestions.

As suggested by previous posts I surfed sites like intimcity, dosug…then I explored rusdosug.com more carefully, there's a section where english speaking girls are highlighted. One of my biggest drawbacks is that I speak only few dozens of words in Russian (I know I should improve….).

Since I am going to Big M in approx 2 weeks, I sent few emails to some of them making outcall (surely not the ones pictured lying on a sports car or seeming just out of a Penthouse page, there are plenty of more "natural" yet gorgeous girls in the pond to fish) and I got replies to 5 out of 10 messages so far.

Judging upon your past experience, which is the reliability of these email correspondence, i.e. the chance that the portrayed (and not photoshopped..) girl will really knock at my door?

One more question about salons. Do you rank Fantasy and Charmel as possible rewarding, safe spots even for a lone foreigner barely speaking few words in Russian (I read some nice reports about such places) or would you suggest to stick to outcalls?

[QUOTE=Gentleman Travel]Are you saying normal Swiss girls will put out for a ski vacation?
Or are we both talking about importing Russian girls?
I find it hard enough to make inroads with Russian girls already in Europe,
to hit up European girls (I am 50) seems as hopeless as back home (NA).
And the ISG forums for most European cities are all about P4P, not freebies.
So if you have a formula for success, please share...[/QUOTE]

Hey GT,

Actually, I don't recall fucking a Swiss girl before. French - yes. German? Check. Spanish? Yup - more than once. Italian? Ticked that box. But never a Swiss Miss... Another thing to put on my Bucket List.

I was talking about meeting a Russian girl [B]in Russia[/B] and inviting her to vacation with you in der Schweiz. As for tips hitting up Russian girls, there are tons on them on the forum. I prefer the face-to-face approach (bars, cafes, etc), but most of the guys here hook up online via mamba, brides.ru, etc...

Udachi...

[QUOTE=Raspberry]
One more question about salons. Do you rank Fantasy and Charmel as possible rewarding, safe spots even for a lone foreigner barely speaking few words in Russian (I read some nice reports about such places) or would you suggest to stick to outcalls?[/QUOTE]

Malina,

I think it's about the safest possible place to get laid in Moscow. Pick a reliable girl (like Tanya from Fantasy's or Rimma from Charmel) and she will fuck the shit out of you - guaranteed. You can outcall them too, but it's expensive (3 hours min). If you're intimidated with your limited Russian, have a friend or colleague set up the meeting for you.

Enjoy!

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]
I'm not sure it's a good idea to try and drive into Moscow. If you speak no Russian and the ГАИ flag you over for a bribe, it could be a tense moment. Plus, the traffic is a nightmare and if you don't know where you are going, you will be lost.[/QUOTE]

True - the only thing you want to rent in Moscow is lodging and pussy. Very few signs are in English, so unless you have a GPS (and/or read Russian), you're fucked.

Only thing I don't agree with Strav on is on avoiding bribes to GAI. My personal experience is the less Russian you speak - the better. But then again, his Russian is better than mine...

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]Malina,

I think it's about the safest possible place to get laid in Moscow. Pick a reliable girl (like Tanya from Fantasy's or Rimma from Charmel) and she will fuck the shit out of you - guaranteed. You can outcall them too, but it's expensive (3 hours min). If you're intimidated with your limited Russian, have a friend or colleague set up the meeting for you.

Enjoy![/QUOTE]

Framboesa,
I second Pizdyet's remarks about Charm'el and Fantasys. Low risk, high quality, moderate price though.

Regarding the girls on Rusdosug and Intimcity, the one or two I have actually met did fall short of the photos, but not by much. It's a great way to "stack the deck" in advance so that you are not caught floundering and wasting time when you arrive. I have found that their command of English is all over the map however. Some are more confident over a keyboard but are shy in their spoken English and vice versa. No big deal though.

Having said all that, there is no substitute for the "interview" as you well know. the first Russian girl I communicated with over the Internet (with the intention of a sexual encounter) was disappointing because there was no "sexual chemistry" between us. Gorgeous girl but there was no "spark". Not her fault, but it's not something you can judge over cyberspace. However, the second was completely the opposite so there you are - it's still a gamble. Again, nothing you don't already know but permit me to reinforce it.

The real "GRAB BAG" for value are the "Pink-border-mamba" girls who run working apartments. If you treat it like a "mystery date", it can be fantastic value and a wonderful adventure. It can also be a so-so screw for 2500 rubles. But you need to be comfortable navigating the Moscow metro and be comfortable communicating in Russian, otherwise it was be a real wild goose chase.

Good luck,

Jake

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]Only thing I don't agree with Strav on is on avoiding bribes to GAI. My personal experience is the less Russian you speak - the better. But then again, his Russian is better than mine...[/QUOTE]Pizdyets,
I never drove in Moscow, but I have been riding in cars many times when the driver was flagged over. There never seems to be any sense as to why, they are just as likely to flag down a Lada as a Beemer. I have some friends who keep cash stashed inside the folder with their documenti, for the inevitable shake-down.

You're right, when confronted with law enforcement of any kind, it's best to play the part of the dumb American/tourist. It's a stereotype of which they have already persauaded themselves. Although, one of the most difficult things I've ever had to do was to pretend that I didn't speak Russian.

But you spend much more time there than I am able to, so I think your Russkii dolzhno buit sovershyenii (must be perfect).

Pizdyets, Jake, thank you for your valuable set of information, I guess I will give a chance to a salon, Fantasys looks closer to my accomodation (hotel in Belorusskaya area).

As for chemistry, I totally agree with you, Jake, I also like something more than picking a specimen at the flesh market. This can be enough to get "short-term" horny but doesn't leave this special taste in the mouth after you zip up your pants after the show.

I've always succeeded in igniting a sparkle while contacting gilrs in dating sites (not escort sites) in my other, more frequent, destinations (Baltics) but in such places it's definitely easier to find "everyday, next-door" girls with remarkable command of English. On the other hand, such Baltic girls are more distrustful and tend to disregard foreigners as unreliable, so from a certain point of view it's a more difficult environment.

Moscow is more challenging from a language point of view of course, but I am going on "talking" by email with one girl I found in dosug, I feel she can offer more than a couple of holes to fill.

I still have 2, 5 weeks before my trip to Moscow to light the fire with her, I am not in a hurry and I want to try to set up a valuable stage for the performance.

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]Pizdyets,
I never drove in Moscow, but I have been riding in cars many times when the driver was flagged over. There never seems to be any sense as to why, they are just as likely to flag down a Lada as a Beemer. I have some friends who keep cash stashed inside the folder with their documenti, for the inevitable shake-down.
[/QUOTE]

GAI most definintely has a few profiles for pulling people over, all geared towards maximizing their bribes:
- trucks of any sort (these guys have more document requirements than cars, and thus more likely to be able to extract a bribe)
- clean, high-end cars without government (OOO, EKX, MP, etc) plates (probably have docs in order, but the potential payoff is higher than a Zhiguli)
- "chyornie" (darker skinned non-Slavics) of any sort (just like on foot, these guys are 20x more likely to be pulled over on the street too)
- just about anyone from 2am to 8am on a Saturday or Sunday morning (likely to have had something to drink, no matter who they are, or what they're driving)

[QUOTE]
You're right, when confronted with law enforcement of any kind, it's best to play the part of the dumb American/tourist. It's a stereotype of which they have already persauaded themselves. Although, one of the most difficult things I've ever had to do was to pretend that I didn't speak Russian.
[/QUOTE]

это - искусство. :)

[QUOTE]
But you spend much more time there than I am able to, so I think your Russkii dolzhno buit sovershyenii (must be perfect).[/QUOTE]

Should be perfect, but in actuality a far cry from it! What can I say... it's a difficult language!

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]GAI most definintely has a few profiles for pulling people over, all geared towards maximizing their bribes:
- trucks of any sort (these guys have more document requirements than cars, and thus more likely to be able to extract a bribe)
- clean, high-end cars without government (OOO, EKX, MP, etc) plates (probably have docs in order, but the potential payoff is higher than a Zhiguli)
- "chyornie" (darker skinned non-Slavics) of any sort (just like on foot, these guys are 20x more likely to be pulled over on the street too)
- just about anyone from 2am to 8am on a Saturday or Sunday morning (likely to have had something to drink, no matter who they are, or what they're driving)[/QUOTE]

That's basically what I was thinking of when I decided to buy a Nissan Almera Classic. Almeras are like Focuses here - every apartment building has a few of them. In retrospect I might have gone for a Lancer - the engine is smaller but the girls think it's a sportscar because of the design. :)

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Maybe [url]www.vkontakte.ru[/url]

Generally vkontakte is mostly used by people from St.Petersburg and the rest uses Odnoklassniki. However vkontakte is gaining popularity.[/QUOTE]


There's also one that mail.ru has. Mail.ru is good because you can go to 'moy mir' and also to the romance section, which always features a wide variety of P4P. You just text the girls in pink boxes and they'll respond with prices.

[QUOTE=Blaked]There's also one that mail.ru has. Mail.ru is good because you can go to 'moy mir' and also to the romance section, which always features a wide variety of P4P. You just text the girls in pink boxes and they'll respond with prices.[/QUOTE]Will check it out, even though the last thing I need is another social networking site to maintain.. :)

I am looking a trustable agency renting flat in Moscow for foreigners for 4-5 days, I prefer the owner should be foreigner,cause I already had troubles renting flat from russians.....

And possibile not at 300 euro per day.....

Thanks.....

[QUOTE=Lukasek]I am looking a trustable agency renting flat in Moscow for foreigners for 4-5 days, I prefer the owner should be foreigner,cause I already had troubles renting flat from russians.....

And possibile not at 300 euro per day.....

Thanks.....[/QUOTE]

Call Rick at +7-495-741-7606
American guy married to Russian woman. Owns several apartments.

[QUOTE=Jake993]Call Rick at +7-495-741-7606
American guy married to Russian woman. Owns several apartments.[/QUOTE]


Lukasek already knows Rick who rented him a shitty apartment back in 2004.

Maybe you could call Rick trustworthy? Best skill is he speaks English, but service is lacking in several areas. Flaky, slow to respond to inquiries with a staff that may rip you off given the opportunity as happened last time I stayed with him.

Another option is [url]http://www.moscow-comfort.com/[/url] although it is Russian run.

Run By Ca Travs' former assistant Sveta who is an absolute stunner might be a better option.

Just a thought

Guido88

Rick is a good guy, I've never had any problems with renting from him.

It is true that he does leave a lot to be desired in terms of communication, but somehow, everything seems to work out in the end. Sort of like life in Russia in general. I think maybe he's been doing business in Russia for so long that he just assumes that is the standard.

I've never been able to call him directly, best way to contact him is by email: [email]rick@moscow-star.com[/email]. That usually does the trick.

[QUOTE=Lukasek]I am looking a trustable agency renting flat in Moscow for foreigners for 4-5 days, I prefer the owner should be foreigner,cause I already had troubles renting flat from russians.....

And possibile not at 300 euro per day.....

Thanks.....[/QUOTE]What days? If same time as I'm there we can split costs... :)

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]What days? If same time as I'm there we can split costs... :)[/QUOTE]Sirs,

May I know the cost of renting for 1 month, fully furnished, 1 BR apartment, fully furnished with internet connection/tv/ gym...in a average locality close to metro station.

What will be the cost per month?? I will like to stay in moscow for 2-3 months.

Also, how about learning Russian language in a language school. Is it too expensive??

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]Rick is a good guy, I've never had any problems with renting from him.

It is true that he does leave a lot to be desired in terms of communication, but somehow, everything seems to work out in the end. Sort of like life in Russia in general. I think maybe he's been doing business in Russia for so long that he just assumes that is the standard.

I've never been able to call him directly, best way to contact him is by email: [email]rick@moscow-star.com[/email]. That usually does the trick.[/QUOTE]

Strav

We are in agreement that Rick is a good guy.

Where I have concerns is how he does business along with the trustworthiness of employees.

Compare how Oksana in Piter runs her Apt Biz or Moscow Star when CT had it and the difference is night and day. Rick markets USA standards on both websites; he might want to fulfill that agenda.

I think the best explanation is that Rick can be flaky and less than organized. Or perhaps he is too busy banging the RU Devs. IMHO

Guido88

Has anyone been to the Club-Pegas on Bratislavskaya ?
[url]http://club-pegas.ru/[/url]

Thanks

Mattador,

Yes, in August. RTFF

Guys,

On the last 4 or 5 times i have been in Moscow i have used a company called Pullford and they have been very helpful and not overly expensive.

The apartments are basic but the ones i have been in have all been very well located and reasonably priced as compared to hotels.

[url]http://www.pulford.com/[/url]

Tony

[QUOTE=Guido88]Strav

We are in agreement that Rick is a good guy.

Where I have concerns is how he does business along with the trustworthiness of employees.

Compare how Oksana in Piter runs her Apt Biz or Moscow Star when CT had it and the difference is night and day. Rick markets USA standards on both websites; he might want to fulfill that agenda.

I think the best explanation is that Rick can be flaky and less than organized. Or perhaps he is too busy banging the RU Devs. IMHO

Guido88[/QUOTE]

I forgot to mention I have used Rick on a couple of occasions too and the only reason I had to find an alternative was the lack or any replies to emails. It seems I am not alone in finding this.

I even remember coming across one of the apartments I used in a couple of pics posted here which brought a smile.

Tony

had a short to moscow (just three days). First night met with a girl that i got off of Omen.ru and it went great. Dinner in Pushkin Cafe and then walk to hotel to Shag.... not the prettiest but amazing body and tight holes.....

2nd night, got a little delayed in a business meeting and afterwords, tried to find Safari lounge to no avail. ended in Oh la la strip club; loads of sharks and shit services. Ended up with a bbbj in a booth behind the strip floor for a 100 euros. was quite filthy though :-)

at 5 a.m went to Casino Metelitsa; and it was a ghost town..... are there any hotties there earlier???

third night, the reliable Night flight did the job and went home with a cute ukrainian who stayed the night for $400.

all the best, still love moscow.

I have used Moscow Rick and I will never use him again. His "renovated" apartments were in bad condition. When I realized that there were no towels in the apartment, I called him. He told me that he was at McDonalds with his daughter and he would call me later. He never did. When I asked him for a place to buy a domestic airline ticket, he gave me the name and number of the agency and the name of the woman to talk to. "Tell her Ricky told you to call," he said. I did this, and the woman said she never heard of him before. He either never returned my calls or called me back not very promptly. And some of the prices that he quoted me for services were higher than were on his website. His excuse was that he was not the person who updated the website. I would NEVER use him again.

Riggo

Just back from the city of the czars and I have to agree with the fellow mongers who warned me that there's not a lot to do for foreigners who don't speak Russian. In the end I just gave it a miss.

I arrived to Moscow armed with 9 phone numbers from rusdosug of providers who - according to this site - are certified English speakers. I phoned all of them early on Saturday evening. Four of the ladies answered their phones, one of whom told me "sure honey, the prices start at 15,000 roubles for two hours" (her website said 200 dollars). I told her to go boil her head, obviously. I don't negotiate with terrorists... :) The three others told me "Sto? Nie, nie!! I... no... speak Englees". Ah well, bad luck. But... I have to confess I DO find it bloody annoying to be bamboozled by dishonest people such as those who are behind rusdosug.

Following advice by Jake I finally went to Night Flight. (OK, I also went to Hot Dog's - but only to watch Liverpool-Chelsea and receive an earful from the resident neo-n**i girl, Milla, who happened to be sitting next to me.) I guess with time I shall get used to pay prices topping 300 euros for a short time in my hotel, but... can someone PLEASE tell me if I am going crazy??? It looked to me as if almost half the "girls" at NF were clapped-out old nags who've had cosmetic surgery and botox injections. Well... some might find that attractive, but not I. :(

P.

молодец! (jolly good fellow)

You made it to Moskva. Sorry to hear your trip was not a success. I agree with you about Night Flight in general, although it is possible to find a cutie in there once in a while.

Take heart, the general consensus is that prices should be coming down. In the meantime, you can brush up on your Russian.

Stravinsky,

On the Russian front I'm doing better than you think! Walking back from NF I came across a square, featuring a big statue of a short man with sideburns standing in front of a theatre building. I continued, and five minutes later my sleeve was pulled by an anxious (it was 1 am) young Russian tourist couple who wanted to know if I please, please know the way to the Pushkinskaya? I nodded reassuringly and pointed back in the direction I'd come from: "Da, da... tam!" So, you see? After a day in Moscow I was already giving the locals directions... in Russian. :)

As for the rest, well, I agree that prices will come down. The Moscow economy is a "one trick pony" which has been feeding off the resource price boom. Now the party is over. Maybe I should study some Russian? In the meantime I'm bound for Berlin next week. The prices are lower, and I speak the lingo. :)

[QUOTE=Priamos]As for the rest, well, I agree that prices will come down. The Moscow economy is a "one trick pony" which has been feeding off the resource price boom. Now the party is over.[/QUOTE]

I wouldn't bet on a sharp correction. Mind you that price of oil has dropped significantly from its high, but still trading at around the level it was back in mid-2007. And p4p wasn't exactly cheap in Moscow "way back then" either. We can all still hope though... :)

So, Priamos, why didn't you try out a salon? No Russian speaking wingman available, I guess?

As for learning Russian, I can speak from experience and guarantee that it will help you a) score more with freebies b) negotiate better with pros and c) have more fun when you're doing the deed. And those skills will help you in any economy.

[QUOTE=Boofer]had a short to moscow (just three days). First night met with a girl that i got off of Omen.ru and it went great. Dinner in Pushkin Cafe and then walk to hotel to Shag.... not the prettiest but amazing body and tight holes.....

2nd night, got a little delayed in a business meeting and afterwords, tried to find Safari lounge to no avail. ended in Oh la la strip club; loads of sharks and shit services. Ended up with a bbbj in a booth behind the strip floor for a 100 euros. was quite filthy though :-)

at 5 a.m went to Casino Metelitsa; and it was a ghost town..... are there any hotties there earlier?

third night, the reliable Night flight did the job and went home with a cute ukrainian who stayed the night for $400.

all the best, still love moscow.[/QUOTE]Nice to hear that.

I'm a little bit scared, but I'll use Omen.ru too : I hope to find a lady (not free of charge, of course) for my next trip to Moscow.

Let me see what will happen!

Any suggestion will be apreciated!

[QUOTE=Zacchio]I'm a little bit scared, but I'll use Omen.ru too : I hope to find a lady (not free of charge, of course) for my next trip to Moscow.
[/QUOTE]

Am I the only one who thinks "seed of Satan meets Russkie blyati" when they see Omen.ru? :)

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]So, Priamos, why didn't you try out a salon? No Russian speaking wingman available, I guess?[/QUOTE]

C'est que... I'm not THAT much of a non-Russian speaker: For instance, on several occasions I've been communicating with Russian (erm... OK, Ukrainian and Kyrgyz) women in the hostess bars of Istanbul relying on my 100+ words of pidgin Russian. All I say is, my Russian is not good enough for phone conversations, etc. As for the salons, it's not mainly about language. I simply don't like those places. This is also how I live my everyday life in Paris - which is, frankly, depressing since Pres. Sarkozy has discontinued almost any other kind of mongering service.

I DID, however, try my luck in a striptease bar - the Platinum. The place had pretty girls, a delightfully decadent ambiance that one rarely finds in Western Europe these days, and more-than-usually enticing lap dances. - To say nothing of the fact that it was close to my hotel. But, alas, close but no cigar. :)

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]As for learning Russian, I can speak from experience and guarantee that it will help you a) score more with freebies b) negotiate better with pros and c) have more fun when you're doing the deed. And those skills will help you in any economy.[/QUOTE]

True, perfectly true. Though the interesting thing is what happens when you try to speak to the locals in a foreign language that they don't understand. In such diverse places as Stockholm, Tokyo and Zurich people will look exceedingly embarassed because they feel they should be able to speak foreign languages. In Moscow many people (or, this is my impression) "throw you over their right shoulder" as a non-Russian and a nuisance.

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]Am I the only one who thinks "seed of Satan meets Russkie blyati" when they see Omen.ru? :)[/QUOTE]Hmm...
It's not [i]that[/i] bad! It's true Omen is not like mail/mamba.ru, chock full of hotties, willing to toss out prices and phone numbers at the slighest provocation. But, I sort of like that. It's a little more relaxed, the girls are a little more normal, you can actually engage them in a conversation. It just takes a little more time, a little more patience, and patience is, after all, a virtue. :)

And they are definately not all blyati, some of them are real cuties. Plus, there are a couple hundred working girls who advertise there, in the НЮ (nude) section, and plenty more who will respond if you advertise yourself as a sponsor.

We know most P4P girls in [url]www.moslove.com[/url] are "salons" or "agencies". On my agreements by Moslove, it seems they provide good services at good prices. I haven't verified them in person yet.

But why do you mistrust girls from "salons" and "agencies" in Moscow?

I am interested in deepthroat swallow blowjobs (better if face fucking) and I have collected hundreds of affirmative replies from prostitutes (individuals and agencies) about that.

In your opinions and experiences:

Are deepthroat swallow blowjobs always provided when previously agreed???

Is 2500/3000/3500 rubles a real price for real hard sex session of an hour???

Guys does anyone knows if LIGA it is a dance academy or something like that? I saw some pictures of very hot women dancing in a night club and in dancing classes with very sexy mini micro skirt (you can see every and each part of their feminity) and they t-shirts said were black and say something like "LIGA".

By the way how can I send SMS messages for example to Mamba and Odnoklassniki if I am outside Russia?

[QUOTE=Strike 69]By the way how can I send SMS messages for example to Mamba and Odnoklassniki if I am outside Russia?[/QUOTE]

[url]http://www.skype.com/help/guides/sms.html[/url]

You'll have to provide your personal mobile phone # for replies. Not sure if that'll work for you or not, but might be worth a try.

[QUOTE=Strike 69]Guys does anyone knows if LIGA it is a dance academy or something like that? I saw some pictures of very hot women dancing in a night club and in dancing classes with very sexy mini micro skirt (you can see every and each part of their feminity) and they t-shirts said were black and say something like "LIGA". [/QUOTE]Link?

You can send SMSs to Russia with your normal phone.... but AFAIK can only "boost" with a Russian phone/sim card.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Link?

You can send SMSs to Russia with your normal phone.... but AFAIK can only "boost" with a Russian phone/sim card.[/QUOTE]

I talk with my local cell phone company and sadly they told me that I can only send SMS messages to certain companies in Russia (the ones with they have an agreement) I wanted to send SMS in odnoklassniki to "boost" like you said and unfortunately some of my ladies friends uses Megafon as a cell phone operator which does not have an agreement with my local cell phone company so I cannot send SMS messages to them I can only call them in a normal cell phone call.

I will try Skype to send some SMS messages to Mamba and see how it works. Next time I'm in Russia (in less than 1 month) I will buy a local cell phone.

By the way in odnoklassniki.ru I saw with some of my lady friends that I cannot get jealous of thier legions of male admirers with whom they exchange from lovely messages to explicit sexual ones becacause they do not like a jelous guy but if I do the same with other Russian girls in the site they (my female friends) get instantly mad. It seems jealous works in your favor when they (RW) are the ones who have them otherwise they will be against you.

By the way before going to Penza I will be in Moscow for some days, can you please recommend me a couple of young pretty blondinki there? preferently tall or with big tits, thanks in advance.

[QUOTE=Strike 69]I wanted to send SMS in odnoklassniki to "boost" like you said and unfortunately some of my ladies friends uses Megafon as a cell phone operator which does not have an agreement with my local cell phone company so I cannot send SMS messages to them I can only call them in a normal cell phone call.

I will try Skype to send some SMS messages to Mamba and see how it works. Next time I'm in Russia (in less than 1 month) I will buy a local cell phone.

By the way in odnoklassniki.ru I saw with some of my lady friends that I cannot get jealous of thier legions of male admirers with whom they exchange from lovely messages to explicit sexual ones becacause they do not like a jelous guy but if I do the same with other Russian girls in the site they (my female friends) get instantly mad. It seems jealous works in your favor when they (RW) are the ones who have them otherwise they will be against you.

By the way before going to Penza I will be in Moscow for some days, can you please recommend me a couple of young pretty blondinki there? preferently tall or with big tits, thanks in advance.[/QUOTE]What kind of "boosting" are you talking about on odnoklassniki? I never noticed that feature... I've only seen it on mamba.

And no... you shouldn't get jealous of girl's network of friends. There'S no point. Actually, I rarely even look at it. The only thing I observe is how they reply or behave with such contacts. In theory it doesn't matter with those girls you are only interested in having sex with one or two times, but if she is an investment project you might want to make sure you are the one benefitting from your investment.

As far as jealousy goes, all Russian girls WANT you to be jealous, they just don't want you to show it in childish ways if you know what I mean. It's admittedly a trap and a bit of a stumbling block if one isn't careful. Best counter-action? Make THEM jealous.

As for recommendations of big-titted blondes in Moscow, if you are refering to pros I don't have any contacts, regrettably. I don't keep contacts (generally) because I only fuck pros once. Moreover, I pretty much don't screw pros in Moscow at all anymore due to the price. It's a freebie market for me.

Sorry Doc my mistake I mean the 5 + rate for photos in Odnoklassniki not in Mamba. You need to send a SMS message in order to give that rate to the pictures.

Recently I was Hosting a Business Traveller, Who'd barely seen Moscow, but wanted to see the sights, have delights and not pay thrice the norm, but instead pay norm, plus my fee to make sure its norm.

I Just wanted to add some key information to here that seemed appropriate.

Firstly, Hot Dogs, prior to 10. 30 seems actually like a real bar, as I'd personally never been before 11. 30, I had no idea. And was able to hook up with a few cute girls, probably just showing off.

Next we went onwards to Oh La La, . My Guest was Overtly surprised as we walked in, pre-midnight, and encountered 30+ ready and eager girls, who all jumped up for our arrival. Ouch! I tell you what that was worth the 300 rubs they stiffed us on the entrance fee.

Take note: They DO NOT HAVE CHANGE. And what ever you 'over pay' will be pocketed.

When talking to a nice half azerbajini girl, she told me the prices for dancing had gone up, yet the prices for other activities dropped.

Last time I was there, it was 100rubs tips, 2000 for a private dance 3 songs, fun is included, based on the girl, and 15, 000 for 30 minutes of sex.

This time, they wanted 300 for the tip, I had to beat them off with a stick to NOT dance on my lap, then 3, 000 for private dance, and 9, 000 for an hours sex.

But, Being a crafty bastard, I know that the girl only gets 30% if she's lucky, I offered her to drop me her number, and come get some at the hotel for 5k, she's up for it, after 6. 00am.

My mate is overloaded, so I get rid of some of the girls, pick out three and let them have the 1k note, to split (they can figure out the change) so they give us a dance, Azerbi won't let me cross the line, but her friend allows, nipple licking, but grabbing and a penetrative little finger, right infront of my guest.

We tell the guards to get our door entrance change as their friggin 'Present' they kept demanding, and we leave within the hour.

Oh, and the Reason the prices were so high? Can you imagine.

"The crisis"

Go study 1:1 economics baby, Sheesh.

[QUOTE=Strike 69]Sorry Doc my mistake I mean the 5 + rate for photos in Odnoklassniki not in Mamba. You need to send a SMS message in order to give that rate to the pictures.[/QUOTE]OK... but why would you want to? Waste of money if you ask me.

The crisis man, the CRISIS! :)

Actually I love this crisis, it's going to be my excuse to be even more stingy than before!

Solnishko,

Interesting... 3,000r for one privat tanyets, ouch!

I'm curious, I assume they have VIP Kabinyeta on premises for sex. Do you also have to pay for the Kabinyet, in addition to the 9,000 for the dyev? Or is the Kabinyet included?

Russkii economics makes perfect sense to me. If you need more money, just raise your prices! :)

I met this beautiful and unusual girl

[url]http://www.vipelegantescort.org/gallery.html[/url]

Several days ago, she is beautiful and intelligent, with wonderful taste, I got the impression I met my beautiful and sexy business partner, she was perfect in maintaining the talk, bright and with fabulous sense of humor, we met for the evening so notwithstanding I got excited from the first minute I saw her, I decide to prolong pleasure and be a gentleman and waited patiently till the night, was rewarded afterwards. In bed she was perfect, under a beautiful evening dress in which she came into my room there appeared to be perfect long slim legs, sporty body with wonderful smooth a bit sun-tanned skin, perfect waist.

I was captured by her beautiful big almond-shaped eyes, wonderful smile and very pleasant soft Russian accent. She was so female and tender in bed, so playful that I prayed not to got in love with my fairy. She also gave wonderful exciting message and touched me in such a caring manner that I understood that this night we will hardly sleep, She is a really professional well-groomed courtesan, very caring hot and loving sex.

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]Solnishko,

Interesting... 3,000r for one privat tanyets, ouch!

I'm curious, I assume they have VIP Kabinyeta on premises for sex. Do you also have to pay for the Kabinyet, in addition to the 9,000 for the dyev? Or is the Kabinyet included?

Russkii economics makes perfect sense to me. If you need more money, just raise your prices! :)[/QUOTE]Actually I forgot to check. But since it was 15, 000 all up before, I guessed it was also 9k all up. But considering everything else went up, maybe not.

Never bothered to check after all the hassles we had in the place.

[QUOTE=Master 2008]I met this beautiful and unusual girl

[url]http://www.vipelegantescort.org/gallery.html[/url]

several days ago, she is beautiful and intelligent, with wonderful taste, I got the impression I met my beautiful and sexy business partner, she was perfect in maintaining the talk, bright and with fabulous sense of humor, we met for the evening so notwithstanding I got excited from the first minute I saw her, I decide to prolong pleasure and be a gentleman and waited patiently till the night, was rewarded afterwards. In bed she was perfect, under a beautiful evening dress in which she came into my room there appeared to be perfect long slim legs, sporty body with wonderful smooth a bit sun-tanned skin, perfect waist.

I was captured by her beautiful big almond-shaped eyes, wonderful smile and very pleasant soft Russian accent. She was so female and tender in bed, so playful that I prayed not to got in love with my fairy. She also gave wonderful exciting message and touched me in such a caring manner that I understood that this night we will hardly sleep, She is a really professional well-groomed courtesan, very caring hot and loving sex.[/QUOTE]Hmmm, it seems you really hit it off.

Almost as if you were staring into a mirror?

[QUOTE=Fijiman]Hmmm, it seems you really hit it off.

Almost as if you were staring into a mirror?[/QUOTE]Maybe some of these real professional girls should get some real guys from the site, to have a 'session' and see how good they actually are. We'll give them a REAL report, for the site, which will improve their business if they are any good, and give them a good idea what was wrong, so they can improve their business. If they're not.

And being foriegners. We won't take bribes, nor be colluded into giving false reports.

That is an advertisement only! Look at Western-style rates! I saw that girl in several escort sites. She is the typical dreamed Russian girl. I guess instead she is a model in somewhere sites. A good fucking/blowing hour is for 2000/3500rubles, not more! Run away from this advertisement!

[QUOTE=Master 2008]I met this beautiful and unusual girl

[url]http://www.vipelegantescort.org/gallery.html[/url]

Several days ago, she is beautiful and intelligent, with wonderful taste, I got the impression I met my beautiful and sexy business partner, she was perfect in maintaining the talk, bright and with fabulous sense of humor, we met for the evening so notwithstanding I got excited from the first minute I saw her, I decide to prolong pleasure and be a gentleman and waited patiently till the night, was rewarded afterwards. In bed she was perfect, under a beautiful evening dress in which she came into my room there appeared to be perfect long slim legs, sporty body with wonderful smooth a bit sun-tanned skin, perfect waist.

I was captured by her beautiful big almond-shaped eyes, wonderful smile and very pleasant soft Russian accent. She was so female and tender in bed, so playful that I prayed not to got in love with my fairy. She also gave wonderful exciting message and touched me in such a caring manner that I understood that this night we will hardly sleep, She is a really professional well-groomed courtesan, very caring hot and loving sex.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Solntsa Yada]And being foriegners. We won't take bribes, nor be colluded into giving false reports.[/QUOTE]

Maybe I won't take bribes, but if any of these girls gives up her ass to me for free, I do hereby swear to give her a [B]stunning[/B] report. You know where to PM me. ;)

[I]"My penis is small... look."[/I]
- Pierre Woodman, before he fucks a hottie's virgin ass

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]Pierre Woodman[/QUOTE]A god among men.

[url]http://www.spankwire.com/search/straight/keyword/pierre+woodman[/url]

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]Maybe I won't take bribes, but if any of these girls gives up her ass to me for free, I do hereby swear to give her a [B]stunning[/B] report. You know where to PM me. ;)

[I]"My penis is small... look."[/I]
- Pierre Woodman, before he fucks a hottie's virgin ass[/QUOTE]


I second that option. If any of these girls give me her ass (and pussy) for free I will give hear an absolutetly stunning report. PM if interested.

Apologies, since this is unequivocally off-topic.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]A god among men.

[url]http://www.spankwire.com/search/straight/keyword/pierre+woodman[/url][/QUOTE]

He is my idol. Not as a porn director, mind you... his direction and cinematography leave a lot to be desired compared to even Rocco or Christophe Clark. But as a guy able to work a girl psychologically and then sexually, he is king. His Casting series should be required viewing for any man wanting to gain insight into the female psyche. Sure, he's paying these girls to fuck his ugly self. But in 9/10 cases, they're fucking loving it by the time he's done with them. That says something. That says a lot, actually.

Here's some interesting reading...

[url]http://www.kapelovitz.com/pierre.htm[/url]

Love him or hate him, that fucker deserves some respect.

I will be in Moscow and would like to know what possibilities I have in the hotel itself. Which hotel (preferably a top end) has in-house service provider?

If there is no such hotel, what can I do? The safest and the easiest way. My preference is erotic massage leading to full service.

[QUOTE=Great Wall]I will be in Moscow and would like to know what possibilities I have in the hotel itself. Which hotel (preferably a top end) has in-house service provider?

If there is no such hotel, what can I do? The safest and the easiest way. My preference is erotic massage leading to full service.[/QUOTE]
The Sheraton Palace on Tverskaya ALWAYS has working girls in the lobby available for "room service". I have also heard that the Radisson also has such girls but cannot confirm first hand.

[QUOTE=Great Wall]I will be in Moscow and would like to know what possibilities I have in the hotel itself. Which hotel (preferably a top end) has in-house service provider?

If there is no such hotel, what can I do? The safest and the easiest way. My preference is erotic massage leading to full service.[/QUOTE]Hotel "Peter I" also has girls in the lobby... average quality, mega price.

[QUOTE=Great Wall]I will be in Moscow and would like to know what possibilities I have in the hotel itself. Which hotel (preferably a top end) has in-house service provider?

If there is no such hotel, what can I do? The safest and the easiest way. My preference is erotic massage leading to full service.[/QUOTE]

Hyatt Ararat has its stable, some of whom are total babes. LT will run you at least 4 bens.

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]Hyatt Ararat has its stable, some of whom are total babes. LT will run you at least 4 bens.[/QUOTE]For the not English-speaking: what is "bens"?

Has anyone actually taken the new(ish) Aero Express train from SVO-2 to Savelovsky Station? How far is the walk from the arrivals area to the train terminus at SVO-2?

I am arriving in Moscow in a few weeks on a Friday afternoon at about 5:40 PM and the thought of making the trip into the center of town by car gives me the shakes. I was thinking of just catching the train and have the driver meet me at Savelovsky rather than sitting in a car for 2+ hours.

Any opinions and/or experiences? Perhaps the traffic from SVO on a Friday afternoon at this time of year is not so bad? (Ha, ha) Last time I took a car from SVO it took the better part of 2.5 hours. Mind you, that was a few years ago and it was in June.

Thanks.

[QUOTE=Jake993]Has anyone actually taken the new(ish) Aero Express train from SVO-2 to Savelovsky Station? How far is the walk from the arrivals area to the train terminus at SVO-2?

I am arriving in Moscow in a few weeks on a Friday afternoon at about 5:40 PM and the thought of making the trip into the center of town by car gives me the shakes. I was thinking of just catching the train and have the driver meet me at Savelovsky rather than sitting in a car for 2+ hours.

Any opinions and/or experiences? Perhaps the traffic from SVO on a Friday afternoon at this time of year is not so bad? (Ha, ha) Last time I took a car from SVO it took the better part of 2.5 hours. Mind you, that was a few years ago and it was in June.

Thanks.[/QUOTE]I just dropped off a mate to the Train, it was a 15 minute walk from the end of the train to the Airport, but he also said they seemed almost ready to finish the last bit.. so the Majority of its done.

I stayed at the Sheraton early September for five nights, I checked out the lobby Bar area nightly, I did not see any tallent. I did order room service, the lady was a no show, I am not sure if she encountered a security problem? I attempted to call her, but no answer.
The latest I cheched the bar was around 11:00pm, perhaps that was too early?

[QUOTE=Johntodd]I stayed at the Sheraton early September for five nights, I checked out the lobby Bar area nightly, I did not see any tallent. I did order room service, the lady was a no show, I am not sure if she encountered a security problem? I attempted to call her, but no answer.
The latest I cheched the bar was around 11:00pm, perhaps that was too early?[/QUOTE]Wow, that's a surprise although it may have been a tad early. Last time I was there it was a Thursday night and by 11:00 PM the place was crawling.

[QUOTE=Explorer69]

For the not English-speaking: what is "bens"?

[/QUOTE]

As in Benjamin Franklin, as in A Girl's Best Friend, as in, the Dead Presidents, as in, that old guy that Barack Obama DOESN'T look like, as in, the guy on the Hundred Dollar bill. ;)

So at least four 'bens', is gonna run ya four hundred bucks, to fuck one of the lobby girls at the Hyatt Ararat.

So as not to be confused with, "The beetch stole my Benz!" , as in when your girlfriend drives off in your fine luxury german automobile.

For those rambling on in 'monger-speak'.

The crazy-horse.ru website ( a sister site of erotic-massage.ru ) features this notice.

[i]ВНИМАНИЕ! С 17 ноября действует антикризисная СКИДКА! Цена полной программы составляет 2500 руб. [/i]

ATTENTION! From November 17th, the anti-crisis DISCOUNT operates! The price of the full program [1 hr. erotic massage + sex] makes 2500 rbl.

The price for the full program was 3000r. Shadows of things to come??

[QUOTE=Victoria2005]On Friday it is better to go by train. Who that will wait for you also to you better to arrive faster.

[url]http://www.sheremetyevo-airport.ru/?act=part&pid=549[/url]

[url]http://www.sheremetyevo-airport.ru/?act=part&pid=512[/url][/QUOTE]

Thanks Victoria!!

[QUOTE=Solntsa Yada]I just dropped off a mate to the Train, it was a 15 minute walk from the end of the train to the Airport, but he also said they seemed almost ready to finish the last bit.. so the Majority of its done.[/QUOTE]Thanks SY,
Hmmmm.... "almost ready". Maybe a bit premature to attempt with any amount luggage?

Jake993,

I am coming to Moscow for pleasure and fun. Planing to stay a week.

But I need a car to pick me up from the airport, my former driver was away.

[url]www.mycarinmoscow.com[/url]

Is it still on business? Trustworhty?

thnx

[QUOTE=Big Bro AJ]Jake993,
I am coming to Moscow for pleasure and fun. Planing to stay a week.
But I need a car to pick me up from the airport, my former driver was away.
Is it still on business? Trustworhty?
thnx[/QUOTE] As of September still in business. Good car. Good driver. Very reliable.

[QUOTE=Solntsa Yada]I just dropped off a mate to the Train, it was a 15 minute walk from the end of the train to the Airport, but he also said they seemed almost ready to finish the last bit.. so the Majority of its done.[/QUOTE]

SN,
Hey - coming to Moscow week of December 7th. I see you are not receiving PM's. Tell Mr. Piz to send me your cell phone # or email address.
Paka.
Jake

[QUOTE=Jake993]SN,
Hey - coming to Moscow week of December 7th. I see you are not receiving PM's. Tell Mr. Piz to send me your cell phone # or email address.
Paka.
Jake[/QUOTE]I arrive Dec 6 and in town until the 10th. You free on Saturday (6th) or Sunday (7th)? Monday or Tuesday OK too, but I have a gf in tow then.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]I arrive Dec 6 and in town until the 10th. You free on Saturday (6th) or Sunday (7th)? Monday or Tuesday OK too, but I have a gf in tow then.[/QUOTE]

When do you NOT have a GF in town, Doc? :P

Jake - I will PM you SY's koordinats.

I will be in town on Dec 9 and stay till 14.

ANy last minute news from the scene?? (new clubs, changes on going rates, etc)

I'm finding a slight increase in 'ex-office-workers' in some clubs, concentrating their skills on picking up free drinks, ran into a couple on a sarge night with some friend, they got laid off recently and went out on the town to celebrate? Anyway long story short, digits from them all and took home the last woman standing.

Oh, and I noticed, the % of women telling their g-friends about whats going on. Much less than I've ever experienced in western society, as a result, I can date two girls that are friends yet they won't even tell each other? Cool!

Solnishko,

Interesting... did you get a sense from any of these newly unemployed office workers about how they plan to support themselves? I mean, beyond hustling free drinks.

Anyone up for some club/disco action on Saturday night?

[QUOTE=Jake993]Has anyone actually taken the new(ish) Aero Express train from SVO-2 to Savelovsky Station? How far is the walk from the arrivals area to the train terminus at SVO-2?[QUOTE]I did. It takes about 15 minutes to walk within the airport (under the roof, not in the wet street) from station to terminal. Better take a bit more time because on the way you may come in the mood to take a cup of coffe or something stronger in one of the local coffe-shops. The train itself is comfortable and gies in time.

[QUOTE=Helena Moscow]. The train itself is comfortable and gies in time.[/QUOTE]Is SVO-3 open yet? DME is becoming more and more a zoo.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Is SVO-3 open yet? DME is becoming more and more a zoo.[/QUOTE]No idea. Never saw anymals in DME, I guess you were extremely lucky ;) Vnukovo is worse in any case, but closer to the city.

Doc,

Not sure, but if the construction project next to SVO-2 is supposed to be the new SVO-3, we could all grow old and die waiting for it to open.

That's assuming, of course, that they still have financing to finish it.

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]Doc,

Not sure, but if the construction project next to SVO-2 is supposed to be the new SVO-3, we could all grow old and die waiting for it to open.

That's assuming, of course, that they still have financing to finish it.[/QUOTE]

Nope, Terminal 3 isn't open yet, but they've reorganized Terminal 2 so that you hit security check right after check-in. So now it's like every other sane airport in the world, with the exception of the ad hoc homeless shelter in the corridors of the second floor.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Anyone up for some club/disco action on Saturday night?[/QUOTE] Just arrived in Moscow last night after the "trip from hell" to Turkmenistan last week. Air France one lost bag and Turkish Airlines lost the other. But when I arrived in SVO last night - both bags were sitting there. Amazing. Hey - the Bez was right - the pussy in Turkmen land really is spicy.
Send me a PM and let me know where and when.
Cheers,
Jake

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]I arrive Dec 6 and in town until the 10th. You free on Saturday (6th) or Sunday (7th)? Monday or Tuesday OK too, but I have a gf in tow then.[/QUOTE]
Just saw this - I have been "off the net" in T-stan. Damn they REALLY have to do something about that. They are CRYING for a foreign Internet Service Provider (ISP).

[QUOTE]I did. It takes about 15 minutes to walk within the airport (under the roof, not in the wet street) from station to terminal. Better take a bit more time because on the way you may come in the mood to take a cup of coffe or something stronger in one of the local coffe-shops. The train itself is comfortable and gies in time.[/QUOTE] Helena speaks the truth. The Aeroexpress terminal is GORGEOUS compared with SVO2. I had a few hours to kill when I came through on Monday night on the way to Turkmenistan so I took a stroll over to check it out. The walkway from the SVO2 terminal (departures level) is a 5 minute walk so if you don't have too much luggage it's a breeze. The walkway itself is covered with a temporary structure but you can see that they have plans for a permanent connection. There are all kinds of shops and cafes (even a Starbucks!!!!!!) and the place is DESERTED. Don't think it will stay that way though. When I came in last night, I had ordered a car so I didn't take the train itself. But the fucker parked the car underneath the Aeroexpress terminal so we had to walk all that way anyhow!!!!! Ha, ha. But the traffic was light last night at 8:00 PM so it was no biggie. But if you are coming or going from SVO during the rush hour, I would STRONGLY suggest that you consider taking the train from Savelovsky station....... unless of course you enjoy sitting in a car for an hour.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Is SVO-3 open yet? DME is becoming more and more a zoo.[/QUOTE] You want to talk about a zoo? Try going to Ashgabat.

I tried to take the train this week having seen the shiny new terminal on my way into Moscow. After making my to the station i found that I had missed the 11am train and the next one was not till after 2pm. If you are going to use this service be careful and check the timing of trains.

[QUOTE=Helena Moscow][QUOTE=Jake993]Has anyone actually taken the new(ish) Aero Express train from SVO-2 to Savelovsky Station? How far is the walk from the arrivals area to the train terminus at SVO-2?[QUOTE]I did. It takes about 15 minutes to walk within the airport (under the roof, not in the wet street) from station to terminal. Better take a bit more time because on the way you may come in the mood to take a cup of coffe or something stronger in one of the local coffe-shops. The train itself is comfortable and gies in time.[/QUOTE]

...Enough about the bloody trains and SIM cards!!

This is not the tourist office after all?

Back to the pussy!

Fox,

You can't get to the pussy without the trains and the SIM cards. :)

Damn jet lag can be a *****. It's 4:06 AM in Moscow and I just woke up 20 minutes ago. I went to bed early (2200) because the jet lag finally caught up with me after a week of denial. Could not keep my eyes open. So what do a I see when I turn on my mobilnik? A Message from a previous hottie gf (freebie) who sent me 4 SMS's from 2230 until 0100 wanting to know where the hell I was and if I wanted to come fuck her brains out.

But wait, it's gets better. She says, hey if you can't see me tonight, I am free Tuesday night but am leaving town on Wednesday to go to Vietnam. She tough part is that I have scheduled a new recruit for Tuesday night!!!!!

Do I DARE pull a "Dr. Skank maneuver" and schedule them both so that if one turns out to be a "dud" I can have one for backup? I mean, vacation girls is going to be up all night packing her suitcase so what the hell?

[QUOTE=Jake993]Do I DARE pull a "Dr. Skank maneuver" and schedule them both so that if one turns out to be a "dud" I can have one for backup? I mean, vacation girls is going to be up all night packing her suitcase so what the hell?[/QUOTE]

Pozdravlyayu tebya, Jake!

But what's this about the dud and backup? True Skank-style is to have a conveyor belt of girls operational during all waking moments. If you're gonna attempt to imitate, need to do it faithfully.

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]Pozdravlyayu tebya, Jake!

But what's this about the dud and backup? True Skank-style is to have a conveyor belt of girls operational during all waking moments. If you're gonna attempt to imitate, need to do it faithfully.[/QUOTE] You're right - I will be bold.

Before I completely forget the details, need to tell you guys about my experience in Ashgabat last week. I will spare you the rant about my lost luggage but go straight to the part about the pussy.

3 nights - 2 different girls. Both pick up in Grand Turkmen Hotel (formerly Sheraton)
Disco - I met Shemsha at about 1:20 AM. She was on the dance floor groov'in by herself and I was checking SMS's on my Blackberry ( no BB service in Turkmenistan yet) . She was making faces at me and eventually came over to see what I was doing. Cute little impish Turkmen girl from Mary (pronounced Ma-Rhree) could NOT have been more than 45 Kg. Classic spinner. Dark hair, dark eyes. I will post a photo once I figure out how to get if off my BB.

After some Fred and Ginger action on the dance floor we headed to my room and got the usual scrutiny from Okranky who were friendly and discreet. Got to my room and 5 minutes later Shemsha was knocking at the door. She came in and I ask her old she was and she told me that she had just turned 18. Gulp - now I feel creepy. I asked how long she had been doing this and she said it was her second week. Ah, a rookie.

Couple of drinks - touchy feely, grabby grabby and the clothes come off. Quick rinse in the shower and she gets down to BBBJ. Getting ready for round 2, and she asks if I had any condoms. Well, normally I would but since my luggage was lost I was without. She looked at me and said, "OK, no problem it will be ok we can do it without". After a millisecond of thought I told her to get dressed, go downstairs to the lounge and get one from one of her friends. After 5 minutes she was back and we were at it. Quite a wild ride. The BBBJ was not great as she was clearly not very experienced. But the in-out was very enthusiastic. Did not ask for anal but I am sure it was on the menu. Two hours - $100 plus 30,000 Manat (about $2.15) for cab fare!!!!!!!!

Next night I was a bit early for the disco which normally does not get going until midnight so I went to the lounge bar on the second floor. There were 3 or four girls at the bar and another 3 or 4 in the chairs. I sat at the bar and ordered a vodka and tonic. BTW – the local vodka, Ashgabatskaya, is quite good and much cheaper than the Russian Standard they try to push on you. One of the girls at the bar was on the phone and the taller of the two went the ladies room. The one left was a Turkmen girl (the other two were clearly ethnic Russians) and her name was Mely-sa. What a peach. 27 recently divorced, on the job for two months now. Dark hair but not what you would think of as Asian. On first glance you might have said she was Italian. Relatively light skin but she swears she is pure Turkmen. Petite figure, big smile, and spoke reasonable English. I sat and drank with her and her friends for a few hours with the intention of going to the disco but that did not materialize and I went upstairs with Melysa. Their program was different and according to Melysa, it’s a standard program for $150 with very little room for negotiation. They pay the security about $30 for each trick. The girls in the lounge are more of a fixture and are well known to security. The girls in the disco are more hit and miss.

Melysa was spectacular. Full three holer with major enthusiasm in all departments. Probably the best BBBJ I have ever had. Very slow, sensual, seemed to go on forever. Like a kid with a lolly pop. No joke. Definitely a keeper. She spent almost 2 hours with me but the program is technically an hour.

Final night, I thought about going to the disco or picking something up from the British Pub across the street but I just had to tag Melysa one more time. Called her at 9:00 PM and she was on her way to the hotel in minutes. This time it was a full three hours (same price) and it was mind numbing. I am sure she would have stayed but I had an early flight so I released her.

I suppose I should have posted this in the Turkmenistan section but I didn't want the Moscow aficionados to miss this report.

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]Hyatt Ararat has its stable, some of whom are total babes. LT will run you at least 4 bens.[/QUOTE]

Most likely I will be put up in Hotel IZMAILOVO. Is this a girl friendly hotel? The website says this has massage facility. Does massage in Russia mean massage only or something extra? Any suggestions what option I have while staying there.

GW,

Izmailovo is way beyond the city center. It's main advantage seems to be price. There has already been a fair amount of discussion about its positive and negative aspects. You might want to search for posts by IT Travel, he likes to stay there.

[QUOTE=El Kapitan]I have just abruptly ended a session with Helena. I chose her based on her participation in this forum, her English capability, and the pictures posted on her website: [url]http://www.moscow-affair.com/picture4.html[/url]

I don't' mind shelling out some coin for a good massage, HJ/cbj in the comfort of my room. Girl gets paid for low risk and I get what I pay for. Usually.

I contacted her via phone and arranged a meeting, she could meet me in about an hour. I informed her that I was not a full service client and that I would be looking for a chat, massage, and see where it went form there. She thought that sounded great. 2 hours 200 EU. She arrived as arranged and dressed in a black dress. We chatted for about a 45 min while she sipped tea and we chatted about Moscow nightlife, her life, etc.

When it came time to move to the massage portion she undressed and I will only say that her pictures on the website are either not recent or photoshopped. She is I suppose what one would expect of a 35 year old provider in Moscow who has been in the game for quite some time. It was not something that I could not accept but it certainly was not what I expected based on her website.

This is where it all began to go sideways. Her cell began to ring which she asked if she could answer. So of course. Fine. Drunk guy. She hung up on him and about 3 minutes later he called back. Again rude exchange and a hang up. Okay. No problem. I can come back from that.

She then proceeded to give me one of the worst massages I have received. Which lasted maybe 10. 15 minutes. She then laid down on my back and said that she was tired and not a "specialist in this" but that she knew masseuses that could do 12 a day. So I thought this was pretty weak and not really relevant and wished that one of them was there then.

So, I flip over and she lays down beside me. So we lay like that for maybe 5 or 10 min while we caressed each other. At this point I'm wondering WTF is going on. So I kind of begin hinting with body posturing that maybe she could give some attention to a little lower. Which she would occasionally dip down to. But not linger. Finally I sat up and began to "make out" a bit with her kissing her neck and ear and she finally began to give me some attention. At this point we hit the wall.

I laid back waiting for a nice CBJ (I RTFF and knew she was supposedly a CBJ only girl which I personally like from the risk/reward standpoint). What happened instead was she said. And I quote "What would you like me to do now. " So. I said well I would like a blowjob and added that I was not full service. She responded to this as some sort of escalation or added service. She then said. And I quote, "Don't act like you are doing me some great favor by allowing me to give you a blowjob". Now. I have heard some crazy ass shit but never have I heard a prostitute complain about giving a CBJ to a client for 200 euro.

Of course I wanted my monies worth so I asked what the problem was. Which she said was that I had "confused" her and that now I wanted something that she did not expect. So I said well that is what I want. She then crossed the final line when she looked at me, sighed, and said that this was unusual, she was not used to this one way street. WTF? ! ? ! We are not talking about an 18 yr old hottie on her first mission here. I had no emotional or physical desire to have sex or perform oral sex on this woman. I was a client paying money for a service. If she wanted me to get her off then maybe it was time to renegotiate!

I got up incredulous and left the room to [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord140][CodeWord140][/url] and figure out wtf just happened. I decided then and there to end the date and asked her to leave. I also informed her of my disappointment, why I was disappointed, and that I felt she was unprofessional. Her defense was that she was not a machine. Huh. I was nice, paid her 200EU, and was insulted and unsatisfied but she was the one who was wronged.

Whatever.

Buyer beware on this one.

Someone give me some decent recon on a PROFESSIONAL provider who speaks English and is willing to provide a chat, massage, and HJ / cbj for a 2 hour / 200 EU or less.

[size=-2][b][u]EDITOR'S NOTE[/u]:[/b] [blue]I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please [url=http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?]Click Here[/url] for more information.[/blue][/size][/QUOTE]

Your experience is an eye opener.

As a rule of thumb, I always avoid anyone who advertises on this board. I notice Helena and Victoria are engaged in advertising themselves on this board and they should be avoided.

How do you write their address in English and how to reach them from Hotel Izmailovo?

GW,

No need to quote ancient history, it just wastes valuable disk space.

We have 1 report on Helena and 0 reports on Victoria (as I recollect), so it's probably a little too soon to be making judgements about them.

Assorti is at 34 Zemlyanoi Val. Get yourself a good map of Moscow and you will see how far away it is from Izmailovo.

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]GW,

No need to quote ancient history, it just wastes valuable disk space.

We have 1 report on Helena and 0 reports on Victoria (as I recollect), so it's probably a little too soon to be making judgements about them.

Assorti is at 34 Zemlyanoi Val. Get yourself a good map of Moscow and you will see how far away it is from Izmailovo.[/QUOTE]All is far from Izmailovo, just take the metro. 20 minutes to the Red Square.

At 30 cents. Or 30 dollars (by taxi. And one or two hours).

IT

Dear friends,

I just come from the Bar Hod Dog (Former Chesterfied, etc.) and I hav the impression that the sceme has changed. It has become a normal bar without "working girls". Can anybody confirm it? . Or maybe I was on the worng day. Hod Dog was in the past a very good alternative of NF that from my personal taste I preferred. I confirm as well that the prices in NF remain the same as before so the higest quality of girls and the higest prices (but nevertheless overpriced) so crisis is not affecting yet.

BR from Moscow

Ice man,

The scene at Hot Dog's is the same as always. Maybe you were there on a slow night, or just got there too early.

The working girls are there.

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]GW,


Assorti is at 34 Zemlyanoi Val. [/QUOTE]


What is the flat number ?
I've been to the address, but there was no obvious sign as to which bell to ring.
Thanks in advance mate.

Mattador,

As you are facing the building, you will see a 24 Hr. apteka on your left. On your right you will see some cement steps that lead up from the street level. Walk up the steps and into the dvor around back.

That's as far as I will take you. If you want the podyezd and apt. then get their phone number from the website and give them a call. It's best to call first, since it's a small place and they can fill up fast if they get busy.

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]Maybe you were there on a slow night, or just got there too early.

The working girls are there.[/QUOTE]

I tend to believe the latter. I've personally never been before midnight (usually don't show up until 3, as hitting HD is typically one of those last minute acts of drunken desperation), but one of SY's recent outings confirmed that it's a regular bar before 10:30pm or so, when the WGs show up.

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]I tend to believe the latter. I've personally never been before midnight (usually don't show up until 3, as hitting HD is typically one of those last minute acts of drunken desperation), but one of SY's recent outings confirmed that it's a regular bar before 10:30pm or so, when the WGs show up.[/QUOTE] I have been to HD at 10:00 PM with a mixed crowd on a Tursday night after social sauna which is in the area. After the sauna we decided to catch a drink or six at HD. The Russian girls wanted to stay late enough to watch the "Robotniki" under the protection of us expat guys - stupid girls. Wasn't until 11:30 PM that the storm clouds started to gather and well after midnight until after the real talent showed up. Quite the transformation.

Just a sidebar - but one of the Russian non-pros in our group was making eyes at one fo the expat guys in our group. Not much was happening until the roboniki started making advances at our good friend. That seemed to have turned out little devushka on because he ended up bringing her home and they have since ended up living together. Hmmmm - I wonder who got the better end of that deal?

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]Mattador,

As you are facing the building, you will see a 24 Hr. apteka on your left. On your right you will see some cement steps that lead up from the street level. Walk up the steps and into the dvor around back.

That's as far as I will take you. If you want the podyezd and apt. then get their phone number from the website and give them a call. It's best to call first, since it's a small place and they can fill up fast if they get busy.[/QUOTE]


Just out of curiosity : Is there a particular reason why flat numbers are not shared/publicized ? I checked few web-sites, and all you can get is the building number. This usually don't help much for non-russian speakers.

Mattador,

Most salons and massage parlors are very small; typically a private apartment with 2 or 3 bedrooms. They are not designed to take unannounced visitors. As I said, they can fill up very quickly so it's really in your best interest to call in advance to make sure they know that you are coming. Also, because they are operating in a private apartment building, they need to maintain some appearance of decorum. If the situation gets too out of hand, then they have to move.

I made the mistake, once, of giving out the podyezd and kvartira to someone by PM and 4 months later my favorite salon had closed. I don't know for a fact that it was my action that caused that, but it's too much of a coincidence to try it again.

On sextalk, the website for the local guys, posting too much specific info is zapreshcheno (forbidden) and they will ban you for that.

However, I understand this makes it almost impossible for a non-speaking tourist to access these places, which is unfortunate since they provide good value and are an alternative to the tourist traps.

This is probably a good topic for the Russian Language Words and Phrases thread.

Jake,

ochyen interyesno... what's the derivation of robotniki?

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]Jake,

ochyen interyesno... what's the derivation of robotniki?[/QUOTE]

I think he meant rAbotniki (работники). As in "workers".

[QUOTE=Jake993]Just a sidebar - but one of the Russian non-pros in our group was making eyes at one fo the expat guys in our group. Not much was happening until the roboniki started making advances at our good friend. That seemed to have turned out little devushka on because he ended up bringing her home and they have since ended up living together. Hmmmm - I wonder who got the better end of that deal?[/QUOTE]

You can't underestimate how competitive girls can be. I've been to strip clubs in the US in mixed (business) company and had a female colleague give me a lap dance with full bump-n-grind because she needed to prove that she was as sexually charged as any professional stripper could be.

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]I think he meant rAbotniki (работники )[/QUOTE]Oh, работники... OK, now I understand. I thought maybe they had robotic women working at HD. :)

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]Oh, работники... OK, now I understand. I thought maybe they had robotic women working at HD. :)[/QUOTE]

Nah, you gotta go to Japan for that. ;)

I was in Moscow for a week and visited a number of strip clubs during my stay. Since the last rundown is a couple of years old, thought you guys would appreciate an update. Note: I am living in a Russian-speaking country and can converse in the language. Don't think many of the girls in the clubs speak English, so your experience is going to be quite different if you can't manage some Russian.

Let's start with the on-site full-service places, shall we?...

[b]Bordo[/b], 4 Pevchesky Per., Metro: Kitai-Gorod, Tel. 917-4545

Cover: 1000r

On-site sex: 9000r half-hour, 15000r one hour, plus room rental, of which cheapest is 1300r half-hour.

Packed wall-to-wall with 50 girls, many pretty, with a wide mix of looks and nationalities. The girls outnumbered the clients by 10:1 on the night I was there, but it was during the early days of the “crisis”. Almost nobody here speaks our tongue, save for a couple of black cuties from English-speaking Africa.

I invited a delicious Ukrainka out on her night off for dinner and all-nighter. On a cold and snowy night, she was warm and the experience was memorable. BTW - the restaurant ‘Nedalny Vostok’ on Tverskoi Blv. is very expensive, but worth it.

[b]Violete[/b], 4/5 Raushskaya Nab., Metro: Nonokuznetskaya, Tel. 238-8614
Cover: 500r

A dozen girls, none very pretty. Seedy. Unfriendly, with constant hassle for post-dance tips. Despite the live singer providing entertainment, I didn’t stay here long.

[b]Chou Chou[/b], 2/8 Bol. Zlatoustinsky Per., Metro: Lubyanka, Tel. 628-6368
Cover: 500r

A bit seedy, but hosting maybe a dozen mostly-friendly girls. On-site sex for a reasonable price, around 8000r all-in if I remember.

[b]Babylone[/b], 8a Strastnoi near Pushkinskaya Pl.
Cover: 700r

Last time I was in town, the lovely and friendly Ira was working here. Seems she has moved on. Nevertheless, not at all bad. 20 girls of decent quality. On-site sex: 8000r, including the room. This club is just around the corner from NF, but what a difference! Don’t think anyone here speaks a word of English. I was the only non-Russian in the room, save for a couple of Turkish guys living in Moscow.

Now, on to the "normal" strip-tease clubs...

[b]Rasputin[/b], 25 Zubovsky Bul., Metro: Park Kultury, Tel. 245-5135
Cover: 3000r (!)
Uvol'nenie (take-out): 9000r + EUR500 to the girl. Few go out.

This used to be Moscow’s high-end, but seems to have faded despite the high prices. Only a dozen girls on a Thursday night, but good quality. No action in the “hard room”, though the cover was supposed to pay for that.

Enjoyed chatting with Tanya, a friendly “massage girl” with a gymnast’s body. If you were to splurge for a take out, she would be the one.

[b]911[/b], 15 Kosyguina (in the Korston hotel casino), Leninsky Prospekt
Cover: 1000r
Uvol'nenie (take out): 19000r, which includes the girl’s fee
Private room for massage only, AFAIK

This looks to be Moscow’s current class act. Two halls, both full nude. 40 very pretty girls - only a few of which have sex, AFAIK. They were celebrating some kind of anniversary, so had a special program with the girls all nude and onstage at the same time. In the same lovely state, they were occasionally dancing with the clients…

Surprisingly reasonable drink prices, given the club’s level.

[b]Divas[/b], Strastnoi Blvd, 10 / 2
Cover: 700r
Private room for massage only, 3000r

30 girls, all pretty. Friendly. But only a few have sex, seems. Two rooms, one full nude and the other topless.

Nice, reasonably priced club, with class-act girls who can hold their end of a conversation. One was reading a weighty psychology book at the bar between dances.

This club was my favorite of the bunch, but my high opinion is probably influenced by the fact that two girls gave me their phone numbers for later rendez-vous...

[b]Mister XXX[/b], Novy Arbat 12. Positively reviewed here in the past, so went to check it out. Now closed.

[b]Night Flight[/b], Tverskaya 17
On my last night, succumbed to the urge to catch-up on NF, which was my first Moscow mongering experience many years ago. You guys here know the drill...

Settled on Svetlana, who claimed she works only a night or two per month when she needs the cash. Talked a good game about how she only goes with men she really likes and then gives her all, she's not really a pro, etc. Started at EUR 1000 (!), ended at 500 for an all-night. (Yeah, I know...)

After the first go, she fell fast asleep. In the morning, she awoke, showered, and was on her way out when I came-to and asked her what she was doing. No amount of coaxing would get her back into bed. Said I should have paid 1000 if I wanted two times. Typical NF story, as I gather from other posts.

[size=-2][b][u]EDITOR'S NOTE[/u]:[/b] [blue]I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please [url=http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?]Click Here[/url] for more information.[/blue][/size]

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]Oh, работники... OK, now I understand. I thought maybe they had robotic women working at HD. :)[/QUOTE]Fembots anyone?

Careful Doc, you're dating yourself. I think I'm the only one old enough to remember Fembots. :)

I thank Local Hero, but I want to remind forum members to describe services in sex session because "she was hot" or "memorable meeting" don't mean anything.

Moreover, the Svetlana' trick is usual and I want to keep aware men about no respect from women, in general.

I hope, with you, the new global recession put some respect in female minds but I am not sure because bad habits are very hard to change.

[QUOTE=Local Hero]

Settled on Svetlana, who claimed she works only a night or two per month when she needs the cash. Talked a good game about how she only goes with men she really likes and then gives her all, she's not really a pro, etc. Started at EUR 1000 (!), ended at 500 for an all-night. (Yeah, I know...)

After the first go, she fell fast asleep. In the morning, she awoke, showered, and was on her way out when I came-to and asked her what she was doing. No amount of coaxing would get her back into bed. Said I should have paid 1000 if I wanted two times. Typical NF story, as I gather from other posts [/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]Jake,

ochyen interyesno... what's the derivation of robotniki?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]I think he meant rAbotniki (работники). As in "workers".[/QUOTE]
Quite right Pizdyets - I successfully butchered a reference to "Rabotnitsa", which was actually a newspaper published by the Bolsheviks meaning "Working Woman". I have been reading "RED VICTORY - The history of the Russian Civil War 1918 - 1921" by Bruce Lincoln. In the section which deals with sexuality of women during the revolution he refers to the publication. It's a heavy reading but packed with all sorts of interesting information. Chapter 10, page 337, paragraph 1, line 6.

Anyhow, I came across that term and I thought "Rabotnitsa" was a cute way of referring to the dyeffki who unabashedly ply their trade with little pretense. As opposed to the "Sponsorfils" who pretend to not do it for the money. Incidentally, I picked up the term "sponsorfil" from sextalk.ru.
And speaking of sponsorship I think this is topic that bears some more detailed discussion but probably more appropriately in the "Dating Russian Women" category. I will collect my thoughts and post a thread on a topic which has recently become one of some interest to me.

Was in Moscow last week and can confirm that nothing changed in Hotdog, because I read a recent report who questioned that. Business as usual. Hotdog has developed over the past year as often reported here and had upgradad its image. The girls are much better than in the past but still two classes under NF. The same goes for the prices. You will find lower medium girls to nearly stunners here. The prices for drinks are cheap (130 RUR for a beer).Girls go for $ 200-250 up to your negotiation skill. The overall atmosphere is ok. Professionals are lined up all along the bar and easy to contact. My experiences with the middle class girls are better than with the good looking, because they attitude is not customer oriented.

Another story in NF, because the ratio is totally different and the stunners are the majority of the girls. A perfect place for me since 10 years. If you are lucky, find Alicia, a blond 26 year old stunner, who looks spectaluar. They all ask for € 500 in the beginning and go for € 300 in the majority of the cases.

In both places the mafia taxis outside are a real pain in the ass. To find a girl with a car helps.

Local Hero

You do keep the door locked and keep the key hidden?

Dual purpose here:

One to check valuables prior to the Dev leaving.

The second to insure the Dev performs as per agreement.

The reason the Dev’s pull this Shit is because mongers let them.

The Russian men have spent thousands of years training their women to be obedient and did a great job of it.

In a little over a decade mongers have fucked up a great thing with the nice Western attitudes.

RU women expect to be told what to do. Demands or even commands are not out of line, leave the Western attitudes at home and things get simple.

No coaxing, tell them sternly what to do. They understand and will comply.

You may even ……..Get what you want.

IMHO

Guido88

Local Hero - thanks for an outstanding first post with your high-end strip club update. I'll be honest and say that I only go to these places when entertaining foreign partners who want to remain "faithful" to their wives. As such, I found it curious that you didn't mention even a single lap-dance rate, since lap-dances and drinks are the only things my posse and I purchase in such establishments. As I've written before, strip club pussy is just about the most expensive you can find in Moscow, and even NightFlight can seem inexpensive in comparison. But you did well to point out that "dating" (arranging to meet a girl the next day, etc) is much more cost-effective than strict "take-out" where the rates will be higher and the club must also be paid.

Guido - totally with you on locking the door from the inside and hiding the key. And it's yet another reason why staying in an apartment is better than a hotel.

[QUOTE=Local Hero]I was in Moscow for a week and visited a number of strip clubs during my stay. Since the last rundown is a couple of years old, thought you guys would appreciate an update. Note: I am living in a Russian-speaking country and can converse in the language. Don't think many of the girls in the clubs speak English, so your experience is going to be quite different if you can't manage some Russian.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]
Guido - totally with you on locking the door from the inside and hiding the key. And it's yet another reason why staying in an apartment is better than a hotel.[/QUOTE] Modebly Pizdyets. My recent favorite hiding spot is in the freezer in the ice cube tray.

Funny story - there's still a pretty dev in SPB named Ksenia who is still laughing her head off at the stupid Amerikanits who hit the key so well that he could not find it the next morning. Doh! I wonder who THAT was!!!!!!

I spent 5 nights and 6 days at beloved Moscow and unfortunately seen that most of the clubs lost their magic.

XXX was shut down.

They closed some sections of the White Bear and the show was poor.

Rasputin was a disaster, they charged 1300Rb for dancing girls (slightly topless) and the action was terrible. They charged 800Rb for Jack (It costs 430 Rb at NF)

Kamasutra was closed.

Bordo was a popular spot for expats and tourists. The managers know how to run the club, reasonable prices friendly and hot girls. Tacik and Kazak girls pretended that they were from Chine, I saw one girl from Kamerun and lots of blondikas…

Pena Club (Truckers Strip club) on Kolomenskaya was my favorite club for this time. There are only two stages; the club itself is S shaped and very small. 8 girls from Africa, 2 oriental girls and 5-6 blondikas. Two hours long sauna sex cost 8000Rb. If you pay 15000Rb, you may take the girls for 6 hours. [url]http://pena-club.ru[/url] Basement is strip club upstairs is regular club.

Beloved Night Flight lost its magic. First we went there on Thursday night around 23, nearly no clients, lots of and lots of plastic girl (fake lips, fake boobs) I tried to find a natural beauty I found one but she asked 400 Euro for one pop. Secondly we went there on Saturday night after 01, even at that hour there were no customers and girls were chatting each other. They still asked 400 Euro for one pop.

I met 9 girls in 6 days. Instead of spending the nights with girls, I usually met them after 18 for two hour sessions.

Elya is an oriental looking 32 years old Russian girl who has lots of friends and has two secure and clean apartments in Mayakoskaya and Serpukhoovskaya(Brown line). She asks 200$ for two hours. Anal sex is possible and there are no limits. Through her contacts I met 8 more girls. They ask 400$ for all night, 500$ for threesome (2-3 hours long). Most of the girls are late 20s but one girl was barely 18 and another one was 42 years old. I also did mother daughter fantasy with these two. Lesbi show and strap on show was included to the threesome.

Elya speaks English but her friends can't.


Goodman on Tverskaya is a great place for steak dinner. I also love Mama Tao (Chinese restaurant) on Novokuznetskaya. Starlight diner is an American style diner on Mayakoskaya. Molly Gwen’s on Novy Arbat is an expat friendly spot.

There are two Starbucks at Arbat, both crowed and not permitted to smoke.

[QUOTE=Big Bro AJ]

I met 9 girls, usually for two hour sessions.

Elya is 32 years and asks 200$ for two hours.

Through her contacts I met 8 more girls.

0ne girl was 18.

[/QUOTE]

You guys can say all you want about Moscow Moscow Moscow, but meeting students who wish to have the sponsor, 18, or 19, is not big problem for me in the provinces. No I did not sleep with every girl I met, but out of 9 that I did meet, only one was NOT 18 or 19.

But meeting them would be a problem, if I did not have and use all the contacts that I've been fortunate to amke over the years, and certainly there have been times, when I do have some problems arranging introductions. Investing time, energy, and resources, to develop these relationships, is what has helped me, to get introduced.

But some of you guys prefer the 42 year olds, right?

[QUOTE=Bez Bezarra]You guys.

But some of you guys prefer the 42 year olds, right? [/QUOTE]And she was SUPER! I have had 'manicurists' 3 times in a row now. I like the mentality of these ladies. They take care of ALL parts of their bodies.

She had a 'brilliant' implant in her tooth, nice small 'tat' at the top of her 'crack' AND what she called a surprise for me.

A nice SEXY temporary glitter 'tat' at the base of her pubic bone just before the waxed. Baby smooth. Pussy!

She gave me the best body massage I have ever felt! Hard nipples and wett pussy. Ochen Klasna!

She arrived 10pm and we literally stayed in the bedroom until she left 64 hours later.

Ummmm, she just sms'd me at wants to arrive Friday! Let me think. OK!

[QUOTE=Bez Bezarra] Investing time, energy, and resources, to develop these relationships, is what has helped me, to get introduced.[/QUOTE]

is what we all need but I am usually lazy...One of my friend got the number of the waitres' at Mama Tao and they will meet sometime this week (He works in Moscow so he has time and resources for such relations.)

Anyway, as they said Cash is King, Sky is the limit...:)

[QUOTE=Big Bro AJ]XXX was shut down.[/QUOTE]

They've been undergoing "remont" for forever. In this economic climate, I wouldn't be too hopeful that it'll ever reopen. Anyway - wasn't ever my favorite place anyway, though they did have kalyan...

[QUOTE]
Rasputin was a disaster, they charged 1300Rb for dancing girls (slightly topless) and the action was terrible. They charged 800Rb for Jack (It costs 430 Rb at NF)
[/QUOTE]

Rasputin has been a disaster as long as I can remember (read: many years). Greedy bitches and horrible management. Avoid at all costs.

[QUOTE]
Bordo was a popular spot for expats and tourists. The managers know how to run the club, reasonable prices friendly and hot girls. Tacik and Kazak girls pretended that they were from Chine, I saw one girl from Kamerun and lots of blondikas…
[/QUOTE]

AJ, you must make a good deal more than I do, cuz I did not find Bordo's prices reasonable. Russian-brewed "imported" beer for a ruble a gram? It should be a crime. Quality of the girls there is best I've seen in town, though. And like you said, shapes and sizes to please almost anyone. Reminds me of the old Spearmint Rhino (where Deja Vu is now). Speaking of Deja Vu, I kinda like its chill-out vibe, but it's not cheap. 1K to enter, and 1K per private dance (only 1 song, though 2-for-1, 3-for-1 promotions offered as "stimulus packages" to free up vital monetary liquidity). No lap dances offered in situ, and privates dances are what you negotiate: kissing, titty sucking standard, but HJ, DATY even BBBJ if the tip is big enough. Only wish you could do the waitresses, because they're by far the cutest girls in the place.

[QUOTE]
Pena Club (Truckers Strip club) on Kolomenskaya was my favorite club for this time. There are only two stages; the club itself is S shaped and very small. 8 girls from Africa, 2 oriental girls and 5-6 blondikas. Two hours long sauna sex cost 8000Rb. If you pay 15000Rb, you may take the girls for 6 hours. [url]http://pena-club.ru[/url] Basement is strip club upstairs is regular club.
[/QUOTE]

I've seen this place so many times and always tempted to hit it, just cuz it looks soooo seedy. Now I [B]must[/B] visit!

[QUOTE]
Beloved Night Flight lost its magic. First we went there on Thursday night around 23, nearly no clients, lots of and lots of plastic girl (fake lips, fake boobs) I tried to find a natural beauty I found one but she asked 400 Euro for one pop. Secondly we went there on Saturday night after 01, even at that hour there were no customers and girls were chatting each other. They still asked 400 Euro for one pop.
[/QUOTE]

Yeah, I went for dinner the other night with clients. LOTS of plastic, and very little turnover. Back in the day, you'd see a steady steam of guys leaving with girls. Now it's pretty much only sightseers.

Surprised no one mentioned Oh La La. I went a few times this year and it was decent. Drinks, at least, are cheap as my job in such places is typically drinking, translating for my clients, and telling uglies to get the fuck off my lap.

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]They've been undergoing "remont" for forever. In this economic climate, I wouldn't be too hopeful that it'll ever reopen. Anyway - wasn't ever my favorite place anyway, though they did have kalyan...



Rasputin has been a disaster as long as I can remember (read: many years). Greedy bitches and horrible management. Avoid at all costs.



AJ, you must make a good deal more than I do, cuz I did not find Bordo's prices reasonable. Russian-brewed "imported" beer for a ruble a gram? It should be a crime. Quality of the girls there is best I've seen in town, though. And like you said, shapes and sizes to please almost anyone. Reminds me of the old Spearmint Rhino (where Deja Vu is now). Speaking of Deja Vu, I kinda like its chill-out vibe, but it's not cheap. 1K to enter, and 1K per private dance (only 1 song, though 2-for-1, 3-for-1 promotions offered as "stimulus packages" to free up vital monetary liquidity). No lap dances offered in situ, and privates dances are what you negotiate: kissing, titty sucking standard, but HJ, DATY even BBBJ if the tip is big enough. Only wish you could do the waitresses, because they're by far the cutest girls in the place.



I've seen this place so many times and always tempted to hit it, just cuz it looks soooo seedy. Now I [B]must[/B] visit!



Yeah, I went for dinner the other night with clients. LOTS of plastic, and very little turnover. Back in the day, you'd see a steady steam of guys leaving with girls. Now it's pretty much only sightseers.

Surprised no one mentioned Oh La La. I went a few times this year and it was decent. Drinks, at least, are cheap as my job in such places is typically drinking, translating for my clients, and telling uglies to get the fuck off my lap.[/QUOTE]

Anyone hit the New Safari Lodge? I meant to go check it out last week but ran out of time. Too many dates with 49 year olds (that's for Bez's benefit).

[QUOTE=Jake993]Modebly Pizdyets. My recent favorite hiding spot is in the freezer in the ice cube tray.

Funny story - there's still a pretty dev in SPB named Ksenia who is still laughing her head off at the stupid Amerikanits who hit the key so well that he could not find it the next morning. Doh! I wonder who THAT was!!!!!![/QUOTE]


Hey I know that girl…


Kidding, but will admit to on occasion with the proper amount of alcohol and lack of sleep to being geographically challenged as to the exact location of the key for a few minutes in the morning.

Normally kept in the safe but in apartments without safes sometimes things happen.

What’s funny is the Dev’s reaction. Evidently this happens quite a bit, never anger only humor. Again??????

The Dev’s know their role in the game: provide as negotiated, pride in service ability, have orgasms, get paid and leave when directed. Not before, like I said simple.



Pizdeyets

Been in Oh La La, found good quality and full service in a private room with views of the strip show. Not all girls will provide sex but all in all pretty enjoyable.

Still I miss the old Safari.

Guido88

[quote=guido88]kidding, but will admit to on occasion with the proper amount of alcohol and lack of sleep to being geographically challenged as to the exact location of the key for a few minutes in the morning.

guido88[/quote]no kidding, it can be no joke. try being awake for well over 72 hours, running on empty after having downed the umpteenth red bull, having a tobacco & hangover induced headache that fells like your head is about to explode, and then realize, as you pull into a car rental drop-off garage at the airport having just gotten photographed by two speed cameras in a vain attempt to make it to the airport on time, that you entered the wrong airport into your car navigation as the destination.

that is what i call being geographically challenged- arriving an hour before scheduled departure time at a wrong airport and coming to terms with the fact that you have been fucking women for three days straight and now you are royally fucked because your plane departs from an airport some 35 km away. ah, the life of a sex monger.

Hallo folks,

For the greatest online resource of hookers with quality pictures, description of services and rates, check [url]www.dosvg.nu[/url]. They have now added the English version. Translation is somewhat awkward in most cases, but at least you get the idea. Most of the ads are for Moscow. But there are hundreds of wonderful chicks to choose from, you will definitely find what you are looking for. Prices generally range from USD 100 to USD 1,000 per hour, although shown in Russian Roubles. There are also sections for many other Russian cities and Ukraine, so this website is a truly valuable resource. The only shortcoming here is that most of the girls do not speak English, so you just try your luck. I used this websites many times and can recommend it to anybody. Also, you can find reviews for each girl from other monkers, but this function works only in the Russian section.

Enjoy!

[QUOTE=Guido88]You do keep the door locked and keep the key hidden? [/QUOTE]Hah! Thanks for the idea. I've never had to go to that length before. Anyway, this time it wouldn't have worked. The hotel (Pakrovka. Recommended, BTW) has one of those modern keycard systems. Maybe there is some hack to keep it closed from the inside, but I don't know it.

[QUOTE]No coaxing, tell them sternly what to do. They understand and will comply. [/QUOTE]Usually. Having lived with one for a few years, meeting her friends and relatives, etc, I know Russian women pretty well. Some respond to no-nonsense commands, as you say. But others are quite strong-willed. This particular fairy had fingernails filed to sharp points. Not saying this would have been a physical problem, but tells you something about her character. (And now you know which NF Svetlana to avoid.)

BTW. Someone mentioned Oh La La. Good club from my memory of past visits, but missed it this time. Only one night per day, unfortunately.

Yeah, I just noticed that they started offering an English translation too.

But bear in mind that the most valuable portion (feedback from other, um, users) is NOT translated. You have to go to the Russian portion for that.

Hint: if you create an account on the site, you can see the number of user comments a girl has rejected for publication. If the girl is decent, she'll usually have few (or zero) rejected comments. To read the rejected comments, you need to pay though.

[btw, I corrected the spelling on your website link...]

[QUOTE=Dj Psycho 11]Hallo folks,

For the greatest online resource of hookers with quality pictures, description of services and rates, check [url]www.dosug.nu[/url]. They have now added the English version. Translation is somewhat awkward in most cases, but at least you get the idea. Most of the ads are for Moscow. But there are hundreds of wonderful chicks to choose from, you will definitely find what you are looking for. Prices generally range from USD 100 to USD 1,000 per hour, although shown in Russian Roubles. There are also sections for many other Russian cities and Ukraine, so this website is a truly valuable resource. The only shortcoming here is that most of the girls do not speak English, so you just try your luck. I used this websites many times and can recommend it to anybody. Also, you can find reviews for each girl from other monkers, but this function works only in the Russian section.

Enjoy![/QUOTE]

Usually the hotels will be kind enough to help you out. I noticed that in Saratov - I was in two hotels - Bratislava and another one - and both were courteous enough to call and offer girls. Utah in Yaroslavl offers an average selection for 2000. dosug.ru offers a lot of provincial listings, although many are overpriced. Many girls seem to be using love.mail.ru and its sister sites to advertize. In Kiev, many girls do this while sitting around in the internet cafe at Bessarabski Rynok! Ukraine is really the best place for P4P right now because Gryvni are effectively 9-10/dollar. Given that they were 5/dollar forever, it seems as if everything is half-priced. That means that the love.mail.ru girls are going for less than 50 bucks (write them and they'll write back with prices, which are between 400 and 500 per hour).


[QUOTE=Bez Bezarra]You guys can say all you want about Moscow Moscow Moscow, but meeting students who wish to have the sponsor, 18, or 19, is not big problem for me in the provinces. No I did not sleep with every girl I met, but out of 9 that I did meet, only one was NOT 18 or 19.

But meeting them would be a problem, if I did not have and use all the contacts that I've been fortunate to amke over the years, and certainly there have been times, when I do have some problems arranging introductions. Investing time, energy, and resources, to develop these relationships, is what has helped me, to get introduced.

But some of you guys prefer the 42 year olds, right?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]GW,
Assorti is at 34 Zemlyanoi Val. Get yourself a good map of Moscow and you will see how far away it is from Izmailovo.[/QUOTE]

What is a top end hotel near this location?

[QUOTE=Great Wall]What is a top end hotel near this location?[/QUOTE]

Swissotel is probably the closest 5*

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]Swissotel is probably the closest 5*[/QUOTE]Pokrovka Suites would also be ballpark. Katerina is a nice 4* alternative to SwissOtel.

It is not easy to understand the real reason of this post, because I have hunted in Kiev for a year and now I am keeping updated by mamba sites and I see the Kiev scene has not changed yet.

Yes, Ukrainian grivna is going down but all girls, "freebies" or full-time prostitutes, in Kiev want just dollars, and crazy prices.

Moreover, it seems there are very few independent girls and 95% prostitutes are managed by "agencies": it is very strange most mongers don't report about these "agencies".

The worst about these "agencies" is they supply very unprofessional girls with no respect for men.

I have already written in Kiev thread: I could provide mongering lessons for beginners, to avoid men waste their money and feelings.

[QUOTE=Blaked]Usually the hotels will be kind enough to help you out. I noticed that in Saratov - I was in two hotels - Bratislava and another one - and both were courteous enough to call and offer girls. Utah in Yaroslavl offers an average selection for 2000. dosug.ru offers a lot of provincial listings, although many are overpriced. Many girls seem to be using love.mail.ru and its sister sites to advertize. In Kiev, many girls do this while sitting around in the internet cafe at Bessarabski Rynok! Ukraine is really the best place for P4P right now because Gryvni are effectively 9-10/dollar. Given that they were 5/dollar forever, it seems as if everything is half-priced. That means that the love.mail.ru girls are going for less than 50 bucks (write them and they'll write back with prices, which are between 400 and 500 per hour).[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]It is not easy to understand the real reason of this post, because I have hunted in Kiev for a year and now I am keeping updated by mamba sites and I see the Kiev scene has not changed yet.

Yes, Ukrainian grivna is going down but all girls, "freebies" or full-time prostitutes, in Kiev want just dollars, and crazy prices.

Moreover, it seems there are very few independent girls and 95% prostitutes are managed by "agencies": it is very strange most mongers don't report about these "agencies".

The worst about these "agencies" is they supply very unprofessional girls with no respect for men.

I have already written in Kiev thread: I could provide mongering lessons for beginners, to avoid men waste their money and feelings.[/QUOTE]Why do you write about Ukrain? Isn't it Moscow forum?

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Pokrovka Suites would also be ballpark. Katerina is a nice 4* alternative to SwissOtel.[/QUOTE]There is also Tatiana near this place

[url]http://www.hotel-tatiana.ru[/url]

Ah ah ah but Blake talked about Kiev, read his post. Be aware of your reports.

[QUOTE=Helena Moscow]Why do you write about Ukrain? Isn't it Moscow forum?[/QUOTE]

Do people think dosug. Nu is legit?

The pics look amazing and the prices seem very low.

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]Yeah, I just noticed that they started offering an English translation too.

But bear in mind that the most valuable portion (feedback from other, um, users) is NOT translated. You have to go to the Russian portion for that.

Hint: if you create an account on the site, you can see the number of user comments a girl has rejected for publication. If the girl is decent, she'll usually have few (or zero) rejected comments. To read the rejected comments, you need to pay though.

[btw, I corrected the spelling on your website link. ][/QUOTE]

Yes, very good question! Could anybody help us?

[QUOTE=Humperdink 2008]Do people think dosug. Nu is legit?

The pics look amazing and the prices seem very low.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]Yes, very good question! Could anybody help us?[/QUOTE]

There's plenty about this on the forum already, so please read what's there first.

If you have questions about a particular girl, I suggest:
- searching on the Russian site for reviews (no need to register)
- looking at # of positive vs. negative reviews (you will need to register but not pay)
- putting her phone number thru sextalk.ru to see if there are reviews there

For all of these, you'll need to read Russian or use an online translator. And good luck with the "zhargon" (slang) because it can be difficult even for those of us who've been studying Russian for years.

I am sure, the best reviews should be here written by forum users, with a hints&tricks section.

Moreover, a lot of girls have no review in Russian sites, and they are often the girls with the best pictures.

Positive and negative don't mean anything, because it is necessary to explain which are performances and prices. For example: men often write: "that fuck was passioned" but what does it means? For my work colleagues, the best fuck is a multiple fisting!

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]There's plenty about this on the forum already, so please read what's there first.

If you have questions about a particular girl, I suggest:
- searching on the Russian site for reviews (no need to register)
- looking at # of positive vs. negative reviews (you will need to register but not pay)
- putting her phone number thru sextalk.ru to see if there are reviews there

For all of these, you'll need to read Russian or use an online translator. And good luck with the "zhargon" (slang) because it can be difficult even for those of us who've been studying Russian for years.[/QUOTE]

Hi,

Sorry for the off-topic post.

I will be in Moscow for 36 hours and need to have a cell number. I remember that it is difficult to obtain sim cards in Russia for short-term stays. Is it possible to rent a cell at the airport or from a hotel? Thanks.

DD

[QUOTE=DirkDingy]Hi,

Sorry for the off-topic post.

I will be in Moscow for 36 hours and need to have a cell number. I remember that it is difficult to obtain sim cards in Russia for short-term stays. Is it possible to rent a cell at the airport or from a hotel? Thanks.

DD[/QUOTE]It's not difficult to get a SIM card, you don't need registration or anything. At the very most you'll just have to list a bogus address. Phone shops are everywhere, AFAIK also at the airports.

Why are you so agressive? I just wanted to leave here my opinion and instead come back and see this crazy shit!

Instead of saying thank you for a review about the queen that I met, I see these funny things!

Ilona is a real goddess and I really met her,

She is worthy every euro I gave to her.

She was dressed in a stunning evening dress with beautiful face and long very beautiful hair one can die for. I have never met a girl like her.

She has european rates but I cannot understand how people can fuck a woman who earns 100 euro per hour, it's a crazry slot machine, not a woman.

Ilona is a personality and my good friend, I am meeting her again very soon and will present to her 3, 000 euro, just because she is Ilona, a stunning beautiful intellectual woman. I just like to make beautiful women happy and give to them what they deserve, that's all. And I would never pay 100 euro per one hour or 200 euro per 5 hours or. Per. Hours as it is a shame for me.

[QUOTE=Fijiman]Hmmm, it seems you really hit it off.

Almost as if you were staring into a mirror?
................................

That is an advertisement only! Look at Western-style rates! I saw that girl in several escort sites. She is the typical dreamed Russian girl. I guess instead she is a model in somewhere sites. A good fucking/blowing hour is for 2000/3500rubles, not more! Run away from this advertisement![/QUOTE]Originally Posted by Master 2008
I met this beautiful and unusual girl

[url]http://www.vipelegantescort.org/gallery.html[/url]

Several days ago, she is beautiful and intelligent, with wonderful taste, I got the impression I met my beautiful and sexy business partner, she was perfect in maintaining the talk, bright and with fabulous sense of humor, we met for the evening so notwithstanding I got excited from the first minute I saw her, I decide to prolong pleasure and be a gentleman and waited patiently till the night, was rewarded afterwards. In bed she was perfect, under a beautiful evening dress in which she came into my room there appeared to be perfect long slim legs, sporty body with wonderful smooth a bit sun-tanned skin, perfect waist.

I was captured by her beautiful big almond-shaped eyes, wonderful smile and very pleasant soft Russian accent. She was so female and tender in bed, so playful that I prayed not to got in love with my fairy. She also gave wonderful exciting message and touched me in such a caring manner that I understood that this night we will hardly sleep, She is a really professional well-groomed courtesan, very caring hot and loving sex.

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]For my work colleagues, the best fuck is a multiple fisting![/QUOTE]I hope few girls meet your work collegues!

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]I am sure, the best reviews should be here written by forum users, with a hints&tricks section.
[/QUOTE]

Should be? You mean that you wish they were?

I love ISG and all, but the fact is that the traffic on a site like sextalk is many times what it is here. Because this is Russia, where Russian people live who speak Russian...

[QUOTE]
Moreover, a lot of girls have no review in Russian sites, and they are often the girls with the best pictures.
[/QUOTE]

Ah, it's a two-edged knife, isn't it? The girls with the most reviews also have the most miles. And the newbies fresh off the train from Omsk, Vitebsk or some other provincial backwater -- no reviews at all. It all depends on how you want to play the odds.

[QUOTE]
Positive and negative don't mean anything, because it is necessary to explain which are performances and prices. For example: men often write: "that fuck was passioned" but what does it means? For my work colleagues, the best fuck is a multiple fisting![/QUOTE]

There's a statistical norm to pretty much everything occurring in nature, including sexual likes/dislikes. Given a choice between equally attractive girls on dosug.nu - one with 10 published reports and 0 unpublished reports, and another with 5 published reports and 20 unpublished reports, I'll take the first one.

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]The girls with the most reviews also have the most miles. And the newbies fresh off the train from Omsk, Vitebsk or some other provincial backwater -- no reviews at all.[/QUOTE]If some guy(s) has got a good thing going, he may not want to share, so some of the "best" girls have no reviews.

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]If some guy(s) has got a good thing going, he may not want to share, so some of the "best" girls have no reviews.[/QUOTE]Sad but true my friends. ;)

May be the girl is fantastic... but 1000 € a night wich are 41.000 RUR now seems me really too much, it's cheaper in Germany or in Italy or even France and England now...

for 20.000, which is a lot of money, you can get some fabolous beauties from mamba... but of course in most cases thy do not speak a word of English.


IT...


[QUOTE=Master 2008]Why are you so agressive? I just wanted to leave here my opinion and instead come back and see this crazy shit!

Instead of saying thank you for a review about the queen that I met, I see these funny things!

Ilona is a real goddess and I really met her,

She is worthy every euro I gave to her.

She was dressed in a stunning evening dress with beautiful face and long very beautiful hair one can die for. I have never met a girl like her.

She has european rates but I cannot understand how people can fuck a woman who earns 100 euro per hour, it's a crazry slot machine, not a woman.

Ilona is a personality and my good friend, I am meeting her again very soon and will present to her 3, 000 euro, just because she is Ilona, a stunning beautiful intellectual woman. I just like to make beautiful women happy and give to them what they deserve, that's all. And I would never pay 100 euro per one hour or 200 euro per 5 hours or. Per. Hours as it is a shame for me.

Originally Posted by Master 2008
I met this beautiful and unusual girl

[url]http://www.vipelegantescort.org/gallery.html[/url]

Several days ago, she is beautiful and intelligent, with wonderful taste, I got the impression I met my beautiful and sexy business partner, she was perfect in maintaining the talk, bright and with fabulous sense of humor, we met for the evening so notwithstanding I got excited from the first minute I saw her, I decide to prolong pleasure and be a gentleman and waited patiently till the night, was rewarded afterwards. In bed she was perfect, under a beautiful evening dress in which she came into my room there appeared to be perfect long slim legs, sporty body with wonderful smooth a bit sun-tanned skin, perfect waist.

I was captured by her beautiful big almond-shaped eyes, wonderful smile and very pleasant soft Russian accent. She was so female and tender in bed, so playful that I prayed not to got in love with my fairy. She also gave wonderful exciting message and touched me in such a caring manner that I understood that this night we will hardly sleep, She is a really professional well-groomed courtesan, very caring hot and loving sex.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Master 2008]She is worthy every euro I gave to her.

She has european rates but I cannot understand how people can fuck a woman who earns 100 euro per hour, it's a crazry slot machine, not a woman.

Ilona is a personality and my good friend, I am meeting her again very soon and will present to her 3, 000 euro, just because she is Ilona, a stunning beautiful intellectual woman. I just like to make beautiful women happy and give to them what they deserve, that's all. And I would never pay 100 euro per one hour or 200 euro per 5 hours or. Per. Hours as it is a shame for me.

Originally Posted by Master 2008
I met this beautiful and unusual girl

[url]http://www.vipelegantescort.org/gallery.html[/url]
[/QUOTE]So you like to play the expensive slot machines... news flash: a ***** is a ***** is a ***** is a *****.

Your money. Or actually, Ilona's money now. Or rather, her greasy, hairy pimp Vlad's money now. Perhaps he'll buy himself some new shoes.

Congratulations Master, it's love. Vlad will think of you everytime he wears them.

Which are her services? in detail, please.

[QUOTE]Originally Posted by Master 2008
She is worthy every euro I gave to her.

She has european rates but I cannot understand how people can fuck a woman who earns 100 euro per hour, it's a crazry slot machine, not a woman.

Ilona is a personality and my good friend, I am meeting her again very soon and will present to her 3, 000 euro, just because she is Ilona, a stunning beautiful intellectual woman. I just like to make beautiful women happy and give to them what they deserve, that's all. And I would never pay 100 euro per one hour or 200 euro per 5 hours or. Per. Hours as it is a shame for me.

Originally Posted by Master 2008
I met this beautiful and unusual girl

[url]http://www.vipelegantescort.org/gallery.html[/url][/QUOTE]

OK, enough is enough.

Master2008 is nothing but a scam. These are advertisements masquerading as posts. I know for a fact that some of these photos are at least 5 years old, maybe older, and are all over the internet.

If you believe that this woman is real and is worth 1,000 or 2,000 or 3,000 Euro then you are just a sucker and I can only feel sorry for you.

Happy 2009 gentlemen,

I would like to bring up a topic that does not seem to get written about much on this forum and that is the one of "working apartments". Not to be confused with "salons", which usually have several girls who may "live" there when they are working, I am referring to the kind of apartment where one or tow girls actually live there on a (more or less) full time basis and conducts the world's oldest profession - well, second oldest (someone had to print the money, right?).

If you read [url]www.sextalk.ru[/url], I think you will agree with me that the majority of the posts there are about "incall only" girls who work out of their homes. Personally, I have only visited these working apartments a handful of times and probably the first 3 or 4 times was with the assistance of a local Moscow friend who negotiated the transaction, took the location details, and even help me find the place.

The the experience was certainly different than what you might experience from a Salon or a HD girls and CERTAINLY different from what you will find a girl who work at Night Flight.

Now, I know that this subject has been beaten to death, but permit me to start the year off with a rant about NF. Recalling my last experience at Night Flight, I would hesitate to call some of these girls pros at all. While I didn't take one home that night because I was playing tour guide to a first timer, the suggestion of BBBJ brought a look of surprise from more than one dyev working that night and the mention of anal made another one blanche with a look of horror. For a minute I thought she would run from the bar screaming. What the hell are these girls here for? Or more to the point, what do they think WE are there for? Tiddly-winks and witty repartee? OK - I'm done. No more about NF. Back to working apartments.

The experiences I have had with "working apartments" have been mostly positive. Some have been recommendations from friends and other have come from sextalk. I have even found one or two on Mamba. But they always start out quite friendly and cordial and involve a cup of tea with some chit chat. Of course if you don't speak any Russian the conversation is a bit one sided but you know what I mean.

From there, the young lady will offer you a towel and suggest you get cleaned up. And this is where the experience can vary. Some girls have a really nicely appointed bathroom with new towels, fragrant soaps, etc while others can be downright dingy. The one I remember best was with Irina who was a darling. She was a 24 year old University student studying business. She was a former ballet dancer and had a rock hard body. She had an apartment in the Chisty Prudy area. The apartment was light and cheery and had a great bathroom with a good shower, big bathmat, thick towels a place for you to hang your clothes. I came out wearing my towel and she went in for a shower after me. She came out with a towel around her waist with her wonderful breasts displayed. Wow.

She invited me to the bed which had a nicely covered sort of duvet on the top for us to "conduct business" on. The sex was excellent. Clearly knew her way around the male body and provided BBBJ and was keen to try out several positions (many were rather athletic) and took her time making sure that I was pleased. I offered to help bring her to orgasm, but she declined. she told me that after orgasm she wants to sleep and had another client coming in a few hours. Very upfront - very professional but not at all crass. Very classy attitude.

The GFE was pretty good overall. Not fantastic, but very nice just the same. She had some good basic English skills so we chatted a while afterward. I knew she had another appointment later, but she did not make me feel rushed at all.

This particular assignation was arranged by a local friend who never did quote a price. So when the time came for me to leave, I asked her how much I should give her and she said that I should just give how ever much I felt it was worth to me. Damn - I hate it when they do that.

Since then I have visited a few working apartments and as my Russian language skills improve I feel more confident to venture further afield. What I have noticed from the girls on Mamba who "work from home", is that they are open minded about being visited by foreigners and some will have basic English skills. Of course, qualification is a MUST. I ask them directly of they are working in a salon and that if I do come to their apartment and it is a salon that I will leave immediately. If they are in a salon then they usually don't answer the message and the problem is solved.

I just realized that I do not have a photo of Irina on this computer but will post a few of the ones that were posted thru sextalk last year. I am assuming that since I don't much on this forum about it, that there are not many guys who visit these kind of apartments, but I have to tell you that I am impressed with what I have found and consider it a pretty good deal all the way around.

[QUOTE=Jake993]I just realized that I do not have a photo of Irina on this computer but will post a few of the ones that were posted thru sextalk last year. I am assuming that since I don't much on this forum about it, that there are not many guys who visit these kind of apartments, but I have to tell you that I am impressed with what I have found and consider it a pretty good deal all the way around.[/QUOTE] OK, I found them and they are off of Dosug. Enjoy.

[QUOTE=Jake993]OK, I found them and they are off of Dosug. Enjoy.[/QUOTE]Can you PM me the internet address or contact details of Irina?

Hi guys! Urge question! I have jumped from my chair when I read:

Возможен выезд.
Возможно все...
Интересует тема зоо...
Фото мои.

translation:
outcall meeting
every service
interested in zoo . . . matter
my picture

But what does she mean with "interested in zoo. Matter"?

Anyone up for action tonight?

DD

Hi folks,

I am an newbie to Moscow and I would like to ask for advice. A couple of friends and I will visit Moscow in June this year and are looking foward to some mongering. I understood from previous threads that some knowledge of Russian would be favourable, but I don't think I will learn enough to perform any smart small talk. Therefore incalls to apartments are excluded due to communication barriers. Preferrably I would like to visit a club with decent girls where there are rooms available and where we don't get scammed.

I have read about "Nightflight". expensive, questionable service from the girls, better just for window shopping?

Hot Dog: any recommendations?

What about the hotel bar: are there any dyevs available? I have not yet booked the hotel, but my plan is to to stay at some 5 star hotel near to inner city limits. Maybe 2-3 km from kremlin.

Any strip clubs from where you can take a girl to the hotel. I always prefer seeing the girl live intead of booking one from any website.

Comments and recommendations are thankfully appreciated.

Tacitus

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]Hi guys! Urge question! I have jumped from my chair when I read:

Возможен выезд.
Возможно все...
Интересует тема зоо...
Фото мои.

translation:
outcall meeting
every service
interested in zoo . . . matter
my picture

But what does she mean with "interested in zoo. Matter"?[/QUOTE]Maybe it means Horses, Dogs and Donkeys?

[QUOTE=Gentleman Travel]Surely we should praise Comrade Putin for bringing mutual fear and loathing back to East-West relations? This will scare all the weak-kneed romance tourists away and leave the field free for hard-core mongers!

Also, I think Russia may be in for a downturn. I was at a really interesting conference last week that linked the anticipated slowdown in the US real estate market to a general American/western slowdown, spilling over into China & India which export 90% of their finished goods to the US, taking the heat out of Russian oil & gas (and other resource) demand/markets. Result? Minting fewer new Russian millionaires and billionaires (and surely many of those must be houses of cards) and leaving more starving dyevs for the rest of us...[/QUOTE]

A prescient statement. Only trouble is the downturn is so bad even us hardcore mongers are feeling it a bit.

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]Hi guys! Urge question! I have jumped from my chair when I read:

Возможен выезд.
Возможно все...
Интересует тема зоо...
Фото мои.

translation:
outcall meeting
every service
interested in zoo . . . matter
my picture

But what does she mean with "interested in zoo. Matter"?[/QUOTE]


I think it means that this "person" is interested in the topics related to sex between humans and animals?

Thanks,

There was no need to tell me to RTFF. I did. My question wasn't about individual members, it was about the *site as a whole*. Not a single girl I've looked at has any reviews (looking at Yekaterinburg). And I don't read enough cyrillic to use sextalk. Ru. I've searched for the numbers in Google and nothing has come up.

So I guess it'll have to be trial and error in Yekat then.

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]There's plenty about this on the forum already, so please read what's there first.

If you have questions about a particular girl, I suggest:
- searching on the Russian site for reviews (no need to register)
- looking at # of positive vs. negative reviews (you will need to register but not pay)
- putting her phone number thru sextalk.ru to see if there are reviews there

For all of these, you'll need to read Russian or use an online translator. And good luck with the "zhargon" (slang) because it can be difficult even for those of us who've been studying Russian for years.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Tacitus]Hi folks,

I am an newbie to Moscow and I would like to ask for advice. A couple of friends and I will visit Moscow in June this year and are looking foward to some mongering. I understood from previous threads that some knowledge of Russian would be favourable, but I don't think I will learn enough to perform any smart small talk. Therefore incalls to apartments are excluded due to communication barriers. Preferrably I would like to visit a club with decent girls where there are rooms available and where we don't get scammed.

I have read about "Nightflight". expensive, questionable service from the girls, better just for window shopping?

Hot Dog: any recommendations?

What about the hotel bar: are there any dyevs available? I have not yet booked the hotel, but my plan is to to stay at some 5 star hotel near to inner city limits. Maybe 2-3 km from kremlin.

Any strip clubs from where you can take a girl to the hotel. I always prefer seeing the girl live intead of booking one from any website.

Comments and recommendations are thankfully appreciated.

Tacitus[/QUOTE]
Tacitus,
Like most of my ISG brethren, my knee-jerk reaction to your post is "RTFF" (read the fucking forum) but since it is the holiday season (and I am trapped with my relatives for the afternoon) I will, in the spirit of giving, be happy to send you a PM with some thoughts on your topic to spare everyone additional detail that's been hashed over ad infinitum.

5 Star hotel? Yikes - I hope you have deep pockets. Mind you, come June I wonder what the rates will be like.

BTW - if you have six months, you should try learning some Russian. There are countless podcasts and youtube videos to help you so I suggest you invest a little time. You will be glad you did.

Happy New Year,

Jake

[QUOTE=Acolonizer]But what does she mean with "interested in zoo... Matter"?[/QUOTE]Best take this to the Russian Words and Phrases thread.
We need to know the entire statement. I assume there is something after the "..." that you left out.

[QUOTE=Humperdink 2008]Thanks, there was no need to tell me to RTFF. I did. My question wasn't about individual members, it was about the *site as a whole*. Not a single girl I've looked at has any reviews (looking at Yekaterinburg). And I don't read enough cyrillic to use sextalk. Ru. I've searched for the numbers in Google and nothing has come up.[/QUOTE]Use a web page translator and follow this link for Yekaterinburg
[url]http://sextalk.ru/postlist.php?Cat=0&Board=clsr_ekat[/url]
[QUOTE]So I guess it'll have to be trial and error in Yekat then.[/QUOTE]Yes, of course, what else would you do in Russia? That's half the fun: adapt, improvise and overcome. That's what the rest of do.

[QUOTE=Tacitus]I am an newbie to Moscow and I would like to ask for advice.[/QUOTE]Five star hotels in the city center start at $600-$700/night, so I assume you have more money than you know what to do with (any chance of giving some to me?). This is good, because you will need LOTS of money. If you don't speak Russian, then you will have to find women in Moscow who speak English. They exist, and they also know that they are a rare and valuable commodity and will charge you accordingly.

You will have to stick to the expat clubs like NF or Hot Dog's and will be limited to the selection you find there. If you are staying in a first class hotel, then there will also be working girls in the hotel lobby or bar, expensive but you pay for the convenience.

Strip clubs are also a possibility for the Cyrillicly challenged, no verbal communication is necessary. When the girl holds out her hand, you put some money in it. If it's not enough, she will let you know. Just keep on giving the girls money and they keep dancing. What could be easier?

The strip clubs also have private rooms, but on-premises sex is the most expensive in Moscow. The cost of a private room for an hour is around 5 to 7,000 rubles. If you also want a girl who will get naked and do nasty things with you in your private room, prices start at around 6 - 8,000 rubles (in addition to the room) and can go to 15 or 20,000 rubles.

It is possible to take a girl out of a club, but this is also expensive and will require some negotiation with the girl. There are girls in the clubs who might be willing to meet with you "off the clock", but, again, negotiation will be required.

I would take Jake's advice if I were you. Use the next 6 months to learn a little Russian. You should at least learn how to read the Cyrillic alphabet and how to count.

Otherwise, you may as well go to Vegas. You'll enjoy it just as much for a fraction of the cost.

the reply was exactly that, in russian:

КЛАССИКА-МИНЕТ-АНАЛ
Возможен выезд.
Возможно все...
Интересует тема зоо...
Фото мои.
for jackson's rules, english translation:
vaginal sex, blowjob, anal sex
i can come to you
i can everything
interested in zoo... topic
my own picture

i know hardcore prostitutes (tochka and similar) are engaged in all kinds of filthy things (fisting, pissing, rep001ting etc.) but i couldn't guess zoophilia is widespreading in a such way!

[quote=stravinsky]best take this to the russian words and phrases thread.
we need to know the entire statement. i assume there is something after the "..." that you left out.[/quote]

Does anybody has visited this club?

[url]http://yulia-varra.ru/ev/[/url]

Thanks for the feedback

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]Five star hotels in the city center start at $600-$700/night, .[/QUOTE]

I actually Orbitzed the Ritz (5 star) for $521 and the Holiday Inn for $367 (4 Star). I stayed in both for the few nights that I was there. I was shocked at the prices in Moscow and befuddled how so many people there earn such a (relatively) low wage and can survive.

Hats off to all those that can afford to play in Moscow. I will stick to Stans for my fun.

[QUOTE=DirkDingy]I actually Orbitzed the Ritz (5 star) for $521 and the Holiday Inn for $367 (4 Star). I stayed in both for the few nights that I was there. I was shocked at the prices in Moscow and befuddled how so many people there earn such a (relatively) low wage and can survive.

Hats off to all those that can afford to play in Moscow. I will stick to Stans for my fun.[/QUOTE]

When the Ritz opened last year, it was the most expensive rack rate in the world at over $1000 dollars for a standard room. But this time of year is always low for business travel, so it's hard to make any conclusions based on it.

Hotels Moskva, Ukraine and Rossiya should be coming back online this year, so I'm expecting the supply of 5* hotels to far outstrip demand and prices to be halved by this time next year.

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]When the Ritz opened last year, it was the most expensive rack rate in the world at over $1000 dollars for a standard room. But this time of year is always low for business travel, so it's hard to make any conclusions based on it.

Hotels Moskva, Ukraine and Rossiya should be coming back online this year, so I'm expecting the supply of 5* hotels to far outstrip demand and prices to be halved by this time next year.[/QUOTE]Moskva and Ukraina towards the end of the year, but Rossia won't be back before 2011 or 2012... if at all. There is still a legal battle going on over the plot of land where Rossia once was... no construction started. They are thinking of turning it into a pedestrian zone ala "old Moscow" with bars, restaurants and smaller hotels. Would be awesome... )

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Moskva and Ukraina towards the end of the year, but Rossia won't be back before 2011 or 2012... if at all. There is still a legal battle going on over the plot of land where Rossia once was... no construction started. They are thinking of turning it into a pedestrian zone ala "old Moscow" with bars, restaurants and smaller hotels. Would be awesome... )[/QUOTE]

Thanks for the info, Doc!

An "Old Moscow" would be awesome, but in reality I'd predict it'd be as soul-less as Arbat.

I heared that the tochkas on Leningradski Chausee in Khimki have all been closed down: does anybody have an update on tochkas in Moscow (location/prices).


Thanks a lot in advance.

A lot has been made of the rise in P4P prices in Moscow during the past 24 months. Places like NF and HD has seen the floor price come up substantially despite recent reports that prices are starting to soften.

Still, we have often convinced ourselves that no matter how ridiculous the prices, they are still cheaper than anything you would get for the same quality in the good old US of A...... right? Wrong.

I am in Dallas, Texas this week on a business trip with Russian colleagues. The Big D, home of big silicone boobs and Dallas Cowboys Cheerleaders. I know were not supposed to talk about girls and prices in the USA but since I am here with Russians it's sort of relevant.

After dinner last night with Russian business colleagues, we went to a VERY trendy bar in a VERY trendy part of town. Apparently it's THE place to be on a Wednesday night. The place filled up by 23:30 and and by midnight it was shoulder to shoulder. And as you would expect it was packed with gorgeous girls.

I was standing at the bar ordering a round of drinks for the guys and two stunning babes walked up and starting chatting me up. They cut to the chase quickly and asked if we wanted some "entertainment". Big surprise these girls were strippers who wanted to come back to the hotel for a little party.

I will spare you all of the details but once we got back to the hotel with the girls the negotiations for "extra" services started and here's what the going rate was:

$200 Massage with happy finish.
$300 as above but with CJB and possibly BBBJ depending on the girl.
$400 as above but vaginal sex.

The issue of time came up and they giggled and said that as long as we could "get it up" and perform they would stay but they needed to be gone before the sun came up.

So after the strip show in my room, the two girls went off with Sergei and Vadim to their rooms. What kind of host would I have been to take one for myself? I thought you guys might be interested to know what the prices were for what I consider to be fairly high end girls. Seems quite reasonable to me considering some of the quotes we have been hearing in Moscow. Granted there was enough silicon to.... to.....to.... well hell I don't know what else you can do with great gobs of silicone but you get the idea. These girls were 170 cm, about 50 Kg and very, very fit. Oh and they were bi-sexual judging from the show they put on for us.

It's 9:15 AM in Dallas and I have yet to get a report from the boys but they seemed to be quite taken with the blonds so I guess we'll see. It's the first trip to Dallas for both guys. Welcome to America.

[QUOTE=Jake993]A lot has been made of the rise in P4P prices in Moscow during the past 24 months. Places like NF and HD has seen the floor price come up substantially despite recent reports that prices are starting to soften.

...............................

I will spare you all of the details but once we got back to the hotel with the girls the negotiations for "extra" services started and here's what the going rate was:

$200 Massage with happy finish.
$300 as above but with CJB and possibly BBBJ depending on the girl.
$400 as above but vaginal sex.

The issue of time came up and they giggled and said that as long as we could "get it up" and perform they would stay but they needed to be gone before the sun came up.

So after the strip show in my room, the two girls went off with Sergei and Vadim to their rooms. What kind of host would I have been to take one for myself? I thought you guys might be interested to know what the prices were for what I consider to be fairly high end girls. Seems quite reasonable to me considering some of the quotes we have been hearing in Moscow. Granted there was enough silicon to.... to.....to.... well hell I don't know what else you can do with great gobs of silicone but you get the idea. These girls were 170 cm, about 50 Kg and very, very fit. Oh and they were bi-sexual judging from the show they put on for us.

It's 9:15 AM in Dallas and I have yet to get a report from the boys but they seemed to be quite taken with the blonds so I guess we'll see. It's the first trip to Dallas for both guys. Welcome to America.[/QUOTE]This was quite interesting and funny! I would love to know what the Russians thought of the girls. I have usually had good sex in USA, but the Russian girls are on the average far better in BJs. So what did the Russians think about that?

[QUOTE=Explorer69]This was quite interesting and funny! I would love to know what the Russians thought of the girls. I have usually had good sex in USA, but the Russian girls are on the average far better in BJs. So what did the Russians think about that?[/QUOTE] Well, Vadim was not impressed at all. His girl (Nicole) would not do BBBJ and what's worse, she would not let him lick her pussy. She said that she would only let her girlfriend do that!!!! Apparently she did the starfish routine and just laid there while Vadim pounded her. And she was out the door in 59 minutes. Vadim suspects that she was gay and just doing the deed for the money.

Sergei fared a little better. His girl (Jana) was a little more into it and did remove the condom after he complained that he could not feel anything. She would would not let him CIM but he said she was not bad at it. He paid $400 for the hour and she stayed for almost two hours. In fact, she probably would have stayed longer but Nicole was waiting for her in the car and called her cell phone. She was pissed off that Jana was taking so long.

Vadim said they tried all positions and she was pretty frisky but she almost knocked him out cold with one of her silicone filled boobs. He thought her boob job was over done, but I reminded him that he was in Texas!!! (Everything's bigger) He asked her if she would do anal but she wanted to charge him double so he told her to forget it.

Both Russians said they want to go down market tonight and find some women who were "more ugly". They think gorgeous Dallas girls are like gorgeous Moscow girls - too expensive and poor service!!!! To quote Vadim - "Beautiful girls think that they shit ice cream, but the ugly girls know what they have to do". Words to live by.

[QUOTE=Jake993]"Beautiful girls think that they shit ice cream, but the ugly girls know what they have to do".[/QUOTE]молодец Вадим! That pretty much sums it up.

Too bad he ended up on the wrong side of a love triangle, but with that practical perspective he should do fine.

Any more stories about Vadim and Sergei in America??

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]молодец Вадим! That pretty much sums it up.

Too bad he ended up on the wrong side of a love triangle, but with that practical perspective he should do fine.

Any more stories about Vadim and Sergei in America??[/QUOTE] After the experience at the Candle Room, those two clowns got it in their heads that prostitution in America must be legal. We were watching the BCS (OU & Florida) final at a sports bar in Uptown Dallas on Thursday night when Vadim propositioned a girl and just about got us thrown out! But the night wasn't a total loss - we ended up at a strip club later that night and found a girl to fulfill Vadim's fantasies.

Poured those two onto a plane for Moscow this afternoon. I think I'll need the weekend for my liver to recover. They've invited me to come to Gelendzhik (Black Sea) in late April with them and their friends - they say they are going to show me how to have some real fun. Why I am I not surprised?

[QUOTE=Jake993]those two clowns got it in their heads that prostitution in America must be legal[/QUOTE]HA!
and why not? It makes perfect sense, to a Russian....

[QUOTE=Stravinsky]HA!
and why not? It makes perfect sense, to a Russian....[/QUOTE]

Even though it's legal in only a tiny fraction of the US, it is at least condoned in the remaining 99.999% [B]if[/B] kept on the DL.

I recently met up with another ISG member who related an interesting story to me about a business dinner he'd just had in Vegas. It was your typical corporate meet-n-greet and one of the attendees was a sexy, slightly "enhanced" 30-ish real estate broker who'd taken a keen interest in our ISG brother. Flirting led to kissing which led to a little groping and then she dropped the bomb... she [I]really[/I] wanted to be with him, but it'll cost him. Usually she charges $1500/night, but "since he's so nice", he'll get over a 50% discount. Now, understand, our brother is no stranger to p4p, but on the other hand, he started off thinking this was a freebie. He thought for a moment about bidding her down to Moscow prices, but given his work schedule the following morning, decided to punt. Considering this occurred back at the beginning of the crisis, and her ostensible career was in real estate, it's not too unlikely that her rates have since been cut as much as the US prime (which would put her in the same ballpark as Jake's Dallas Cowgirls).

Now let's return to originally scheduled program... :)

Dr. Skank,

I have read many of your posts and have to admit that I'm very much intrigued by them. In fact, I believe that your achievements that you relay to the readers of this forum are extraordinary:
1. You meet plenty of gorgeous 18-20 y.o. freebie girls in Moscow.
2. You have mostly a first-rate experiences with them.
3. Your exploits make the paid sex feel like a meager substitue for the less fortunate.

Frankly, this is exactly what my personal fantasy would be: come to Moscow, go to a club or otherwise meet an 18 y.o. gorgeous Moscovite, make passionate love to her for few days for free, move on.

This is such a nice fantasy that I started to think that your reports are too good to be true. My personal inability to replicate your success (see my post of my unsuccessful exploits in Moscow) certainly add to the doubt. I really don't want to doubt your achievements (hopes die last, don't they?), but I honestly (perhaps, naively) ask - how do you do it? I have to be in Moscow in the near future, so my question has a practical aspect to it. Aibolit

[QUOTE=Aibolit]Dr. Skank,

I have read many of your posts and have to admit that I'm very much intrigued by them. In fact, I believe that your achievements that you relay to the readers of this forum are extraordinary:
1. You meet plenty of gorgeous 18-20 y.o. freebie girls in Moscow.
2. You have mostly a first-rate experiences with them.
3. Your exploits make the paid sex feel like a meager substitue for the less fortunate.

Frankly, this is exactly what my personal fantasy would be: come to Moscow, go to a club or otherwise meet an 18 y.o. gorgeous Moscovite, make passionate love to her for few days for free, move on.

This is such a nice fantasy that I started to think that your reports are too good to be true. My personal inability to replicate your success (see my post of my unsuccessful exploits in Moscow) certainly add to the doubt. I really don't want to doubt your achievements (hopes die last, don't they?), but I honestly (perhaps, naively) ask - how do you do it? I have to be in Moscow in the near future, so my question has a practical aspect to it. Aibolit[/QUOTE]

It's not just Skank who's getting it on here with young, beautiful dyevs. I have other friends who have an equal or greater number of girlfriends, but don't care to write about their exploits (even if some are ISG members).

Of course it helps immensely if you have some of the following qualities (NOT in order of importance): handsome, well-built, well-dressed, well-mannered, well-read, interesting, passionate, communicative, successful, flirtatious, empathetic, intelligent, confident...

Really, there's no secret. There's a ton of ways to meet girls, all detailed here in ISG. After that, it's all [I]you[/I].

[QUOTE=Jake993]Dallas ... VERY trendy bar in a VERY trendy part of town ...[/QUOTE]

Ghost bar? W Hotel bar?

I'm curious, as I don't think it's just Wednesdays. You didn't get to meet the gorgeous Linsey by any chance? :) (Myself and OK Farm Boy know her)

[QUOTE=Jake993]I thought you guys might be interested to know what the prices were for what I consider to be fairly high end girls[/QUOTE]

It's worth remembering that NYC is to Dallas what Moscow is to, say, Nizhny Novgorod.

[QUOTE=Aibolit]Dr. Skank,

I have read many of your posts and have to admit that I'm very much intrigued by them. In fact, I believe that your achievements that you relay to the readers of this forum are extraordinary:
1. You meet plenty of gorgeous 18-20 y.o. freebie girls in Moscow.
2. You have mostly a first-rate experiences with them.
3. Your exploits make the paid sex feel like a meager substitue for the less fortunate.

Frankly, this is exactly what my personal fantasy would be: come to Moscow, go to a club or otherwise meet an 18 y.o. gorgeous Moscovite, make passionate love to her for few days for free, move on.

This is such a nice fantasy that I started to think that your reports are too good to be true. My personal inability to replicate your success (see my post of my unsuccessful exploits in Moscow) certainly add to the doubt. I really don't want to doubt your achievements (hopes die last, don't they?), but I honestly (perhaps, naively) ask - how do you do it? I have to be in Moscow in the near future, so my question has a practical aspect to it. Aibolit[/QUOTE][QUOTE=Pizdyets]It's not just Skank who's getting it on here with young, beautiful dyevs. I have other friends who have an equal or greater number of girlfriends, but don't care to write about their exploits (even if some are ISG members).

Of course it helps immensely if you have some of the following qualities (NOT in order of importance): handsome, well-built, well-dressed, well-mannered, well-read, interesting, passionate, communicative, successful, flirtatious, empathetic, intelligent, confident...

Really, there's no secret. There's a ton of ways to meet girls, all detailed here in ISG. After that, it's all [I]you[/I].[/QUOTE]What Pizdyets said is correct, there are many ways to meet girls and they do go for many kinds of guys for any number of reasons.

A lot of the basics have already been addressed here and if you've read the posts as you say, you'll have understood the fundementals of wooing the slavic female.

Here's 3 things I think are very important:

1) girls like successful guys, period. It doesn't even really matter what you are successful in, but you should be able to get the message across to her. This is true of all societies, but particularly so in Russia.

2) don't wait for things to happen, make them happen.

3) make it understood you'll be a regular visitor to Moscow or live here. makes a big difference. Tourists can get laid too and do, but their chances are reduced. Girls do look for guys that they'll see more than once or twice.

[QUOTE=Aibolit]Dr. Skank, ...
Frankly, this is exactly what my personal fantasy would be: come to Moscow, go to a club or otherwise meet an 18 y.o. gorgeous Moscovite, make passionate love to her for few days for free, move on.

[/QUOTE]

There's part of your problem right there in your question. You dont aim to come to Moscow and meet ONE girl. Don't aim to be poking the same girl for a few days - thats soft. If thats your attitude, you will end up trying too hard for each chick you hit on.

Moscow girls smell that, and it will smell like weakness and boredom.

They dont go for that.

Thanks to all who provided comments to my post. I would agree with most of them. But, you guys are forgetting few important things that, I'm sure, are an impediment to many of us:
1. I am completely alone, when I am in Moscow.
2. I have no idea where to go to meet young gorgeous freebies.
3. I don't have time to invest in Mamba etc to prepare for months the potential dates for my visit.
4. I am in Moscow only for 1-2 weeks maximum.

I don't think I have any problem with other "must haves" that you guys listed: success, charm, visit Moscow often, well mannered, etc. But, I wonder how you suggest to overcome the 4 above-mentioned impediments?
Again, I'm sure this is a generic problem that is not specific just to me.

[QUOTE=Aibolit]Thanks to all who provided comments to my post. I would agree with most of them. But, you guys are forgetting few important things that, I'm sure, are an impediment to many of us:
1. I am completely alone, when I am in Moscow.
2. I have no idea where to go to meet young gorgeous freebies.
3. I don't have time to invest in Mamba etc to prepare for months the potential dates for my visit.
4. I am in Moscow only for 1-2 weeks maximum.

I don't think I have any problem with other "must haves" that you guys listed: success, charm, visit Moscow often, well mannered, etc. But, I wonder how you suggest to overcome the 4 above-mentioned impediments?
Again, I'm sure this is a generic problem that is not specific just to me.[/QUOTE]1) Being alone is not a problem. Going to clubs with a wingman is more fun than alone that is for sure, but I actually do better when I am alone. If you don't want to go to a club alone, just make mamba dates and go from there.

2) [url]www.afisha.ru[/url]... in addition to all the places we've talked about here.

3) that's your problem. Like I said, you have to make things happen. Sometimes things fall in your lap, but it's rare. Mamba IS work, but you'll have to invest some effort in your project or it won't happen. I don't use Mamba much anymore personally for exactly that reason. I prefer street game, or meeting girls in clubs or meeting girls through social circles. For you however I do believe Mamba is a good start.

4) 1-2 weeks is enough time, but you will have to make an effort. Sometimes great things happen on day 1, sometimes it takes longer.

[QUOTE=Aibolit]Thanks to all who provided comments to my post. I would agree with most of them. But, you guys are forgetting few important things that, I'm sure, are an impediment to many of us:
1. I am completely alone, when I am in Moscow.
[/QUOTE]

I score best when I'm solo. Success is inversely proportional to the size of your posse. But I'm pretty sure one of the local guys here would be willing to show you around in exchange for dinner and/or drinks.

[QUOTE]
2. I have no idea where to go to meet young gorgeous freebies.
[/QUOTE]

Huh? Have you not read the forum? If you're unwilling to go online, then any club or bar will do. I'd suggest demokratichny places which are expat-friendly: Che, Real McCoy, Karma, Tema, Fabrique, Papa's, Tunnel, B2, Vinograd, Etazh - man, the list goes on and on...

[QUOTE]
3. I don't have time to invest in Mamba etc to prepare for months the potential dates for my visit.
[/QUOTE]

No problem, but you'd better have enough balls to approach a cutie in a bar.

[QUOTE]
4. I am in Moscow only for 1-2 weeks maximum.
[/QUOTE]

Many of my visiting work colleagues are only here for 2-3 [B]days[/B] and poke an equal number of girls during that time.

[QUOTE]
I don't think I have any problem with other "must haves" that you guys listed: success, charm, visit Moscow often, well mannered, etc. But, I wonder how you suggest to overcome the 4 above-mentioned impediments?
Again, I'm sure this is a generic problem that is not specific just to me.[/QUOTE]

You need some tough love, brother. Quit your bitching, put on your best club clothes and cologne, make a point to chat up each cute girl you see (even if she's just sitting in a park) and don't stop until you hit paydirt.

The most important thing about Russia, or eastern Europe in general, is don't try to plan, predict or second-guess it. If you try to study it from and intellectual perspective, it will defeat you every time. If you're sitting in the U.S. or western Europe and reading this board (or any other about eastern Europe) and scratching your head wondering how you can participate, you should understand that crossing into eastern Europe is a little like stepping through the looking glass.

Beautiful young women who probably wouldn't have given you the time of day anywhere else, even if you paid them, will suddenly take you seriously, even if you don't pay them. It's a strange phenomenon and one that has to be experienced to be understood.

Of course, you have to present yourself properly; well dressed, well spoken, with an air of confidence and success (smell good). But men do this all over the world and won't necessarily get the same results as they will in Moscow.

So, study what's been written in this forum, grab your passport, buy a plane ticket and follow the rabbit down the hole! It will take some time for you to figure it out, just like it did for everyone else. Strange things may happen, the caterpillar might give you a puff on his hookah, or the Mad Hatter might spit in your face, but that's OK, it's half the fun.

счастливо!

[QUOTE=Roger Mellie]There's part of your problem right there in your question. You dont aim to come to Moscow and meet ONE girl. Don't aim to be poking the same girl for a few days - thats soft. If thats your attitude, you will end up trying too hard for each chick you hit on.

Moscow girls smell that, and it will smell like weakness and boredom.

They dont go for that.[/QUOTE]RM brings up an important point. Not only is it very beneficial to have an aire of mystery around you to keep her fascinated and motivated to please, it is important to understand one vital fact:

When a Russian girl thinks that you are REALLY serious about her and you have sent her these signals or even gone out of the way to make her feel that way, the rules change completely. You go from lover to marriage candidate. This may or may not have a positive effect on your sexual relations. I've been at both ends of the spectrum over the years and if I had to choose, I'd say it's ultimately better to be the lover. This is good, because it also gives you a license to be a jerk. Believe it or not, many girls eat it up. They need and crave the drama and it keeps them passionate.

Being the "really good guy" as many of us Westerners tend to be is effective only long-term... meaning they'll need months if not years to appreciate it. If ever.

Drawing upon a recent example from St.Petersburg, I was meeting a super cute 20-year old party girl. Frankly, she was a tease. We had made out in a club about 10 minutes after meeting. I just grabbed her and we started kissing. I was wearing the white shoes if anybody remembers those. I didn't take her home that night, but nonetheless we hit it off and an emotional connection ensued over a couple of weeks of internet communication. She came over one afternoon when I was in Petes and we were talking and she was raving about what a great guy I was. Nice, but where did that get me? Certainly not inside that tight puss of hers. I stopped her mid-sentence and put it on the line. I told her that I wasn't interested in being friends and that if we were going to keep seeing each other, it would have to be on a romantic, sexual level. My feelings for her were passionate and erotic and not merely friendly. I didn't need or want her merely as a friend. I told her to leave and think about it.

She left in a state of mild shock as I shut the door behind her. She called me the next day and we've been fucking ever since.

It's not a bad method and quite frankly, unless you are looking for "just a friend" you have nothing to lose. In a target-rich environment it pays to think this way, even if it goes against your Western upbringing.

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank] In a target-rich environment it pays to think this way, even if it goes against your Western upbringing.[/QUOTE] You are soooo right. Being the nice guy is going to get you no where. They don't expect it, they don't understand it, and they don't necessarily want it. And you sure better not expect reciprocal treatment because Moscow Dyevs are about as flaky as they come. I'm not saying you need to be an asshole, but doing the attentive, considerate, thoughtful boyfriend thing is probably going to raise suspicion rather than appreciation. And let's not kid ourselves, we only want appreciation that morphs into sex right? Want a friend? Get a dog.

And Skank nailed it when he says "Western Upbringing" because it's the natural instinct that most socially acceptable guys from the west had drilled into their heads since they were 13 years old. Treating the ladies "right" was a pre-requisite to sex........ unless of course you were dealing with a bad girl and that's a whole different animal.

In similar fashion to Skank, I was getting nowhere with a girl until I laid it on the line. We screwed like rabbits for 2 days and then she disappeared................ but that's beside the point.

[QUOTE=Pizdyets]I score best when I'm solo. Success is inversely proportional to the size of your posse. But I'm pretty sure one of the local guys here would be willing to show you around in exchange for dinner and/or drinks.

Many of my visiting work colleagues are only here for 2-3 [B]days[/B] and poke an equal number of girls during that time.

You need some tough love, brother. Quit your bitching, put on your best club clothes and cologne, make a point to chat up each cute girl you see (even if she's just sitting in a park) and don't stop until you hit paydirt.[/QUOTE]

Well that pretty much sums it up in my book

a) Like Skank and Pizdets, I love being out with the boys, you relax and get a good buzz happening. But as they both said, you will do better solo, UNLESS you are on a prearranged double date. In which regard, Skank will have to write up a post on optimized team play during a double date.

A couple of co-ordinated guys on a prearranged double date is a surefire double poke, as Skank and I have proved on countless occasions. A double date which (inevitably) evolves into a double bang is a doubly satisfying thing. To hear your mate's hot date moaning in the next room (while you try to picture what she looks like naked) at 5am is matched only by the embarrassment on your own lovers face, once the flurry of activity and moaning in your own bed stops, as she realises she can suddenly hear her best girlfriend (or sister) getting whacked in the next room.

Typically, a lot of high fiving (and photo viewing) goes on between the boys at lunch the next day. There is a team spirit and cameraderie that you dont get flying solo, but it really only works well if you play as a team.

b) Re-emphasising, you dont want to be aiming for 1 girl on a 1-2 week trip. If you aim low, you will achieve low, and may end up with nothing but frustrated p4p. The handful of guys I know who are regular freebie playing visitors to the big M are usually aiming for 2-3 new face pokes plus 2-3 regulars on a 3-4 day trip. Not being too close to any of them gives you that distance and aire of mystery that really works particularly well in the FSU. It actually makes it easier, not harder, once you know what distance to maintain.

c) Again Pizdets nails it here ... you need some tough love. A slap in a face, a slick shirt, some nice aftershave and just go out there and play ball - and dont even think about being a "nice guy". To paraphrase God (or was it Cruijff .... doesnt matter, they are interchangeable) ... "You wont score, if you dont shoot."

Ever played Pool, on the big 15 foot tables, even worse, anyone played Russian Snooker? The balls are only a few milimetres smaller than the pocket. Its hard, VERY hard.

But then gone back to American tables? Or even the little bar tables little 6 footers? You play like a frickin professional all of a sudden.

Alot of the 'skills' and 'attitude' that everyone is talking about, it works on all ladies, but you just have to increase the humour angle for the western girls.

I've been playing around with a few freebees, always keeping 2-3 on the go, picking up numbers, getting first and second dates, rotating my calander, but I'm looking for something specific, and having fun while looking. But its still hard work figuring out the dyev and her mindset.

Recently I find myself visiting America for the first time, and gawd I feel like I'm playing on the 6ft tables.

I was in Vegas, picked up three girls, would have taken them back to the same hotel room, save for my cock blocking idiot friends, within 2 hours, I have 2 girls, ready for a party, again cock blocked. So going Solo has its advantages if you don't have a team that 'knows' how to play the scene.

In Tahoe, I managed to get to second base, with some random chick, on the top of a mountain, during snowboarding lessons.

In S. F. I picked up a girl on the street, after 2 minutes conversation, she's wanting to move to Moscow, hook up with me.

Its all Attitude, Confidence, Humour and Balls. Nothing more. Russian Dyevs are damn good training, but now, American chicks are just no challenge, its too frickin easy.

I can suggest some good reading for anyone who's interested in what I'm reading, on how to get game. Cause I had to unlearn the Western femnazism bullshit that locked me out of girls pants for nigh on 15 years.

[size=-2][b][u]EDITOR'S NOTE[/u]:[/b] [blue]I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please [url=http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?]Click Here[/url] for more information.[/blue][/size]

Proving once again that things don't always go according to plan...

So ISG sex commandos, riddle me this:

How do you deal with a sobbing out of town dev staying overnight who just got a call from her mother that babushka died?

You know these Russian girls, it's more than just worrying about where she's going to get borsht now, they take this stuff seriously. Beyond getting up at 6 to go to the monastir for early morning prayers to the ikon... I've got other problems.

My guess is that I am not getting any ass tonight.

RIP babushka. Really pretty sad stuff having a sobbing 20-year old around the house. :(

[QUOTE=Solntsa Yada]

I can suggest some good reading for anyone who's interested in what I'm reading, on how to get game. Cause I had to unlearn the Western femnazism bullshit that locked me out of girls pants for nigh on 15 years.

[size=-2][b][u]EDITOR'S NOTE[/u]:[/b] [blue]I would suggest that the author or another Forum Member consider posting a link to this report in the Reports of Distinction thread. Please [url=http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/announcement-reportsofdistinction.php?]Click Here[/url] for more information.[/blue][/size][/QUOTE]
Very interested in some of the reading material you mentioned in the post. You can never have too much "game".

[QUOTE=Doctor_Skank]Proving once again that things don't always go according to plan...

So ISG sex commandos, riddle me this:

How do you deal with a sobbing out of town dev staying overnight who just got a call from her mother that babushka died?

You know these Russian girls, it's more than just worrying about where she's going to get borsht now, they take this stuff seriously. Beyond getting up at 6 to go to the monastir for early morning prayers to the ikon... I've got other problems.

My guess is that I am not getting any ass tonight.

RIP babushka. Really pretty sad stuff having a sobbing 20-year old around the house. :([/QUOTE]
Skank,
My condolences - having a sobbing 20 year old is not fun. Oh, too bad about the babushka as well.

I know it's not your thing, but you might want to consider dropping in to Fantasys or Charmel under the guise of going out to buy groceries.

Failing that pal, you are on consoling boyfriend duty tonight. But don't rule out consolation sex either. It's not going to be as hot as regular carnival sex like you usually have but if you dig into your bad of tricks and pretend for a moment that you are dealing with a western girl you might have a chance. Remember - her "game" will be off so she's not going to respond to the normal animal stimulus. This is going to be all about her and her grieving. Get some soup, watch a light romantic comedy on TV, and (God dare I say it?) HOLD her in such a way that reassures her she is safe with you and that sex is the last thing on your mind. Reassure her that Babushka is in peace and reflect on the tremendous times that she had seen in her life time and how she is now in a better place with <<and here's the punch line>> the recently departed Patriarch. Once you get in the sack for some badly needed sleep, you need no more than 30 seconds before she's ready to feel you pain. Or you to feel her pain..... you get what I mean. This shit works every time. Besides, it's the only card you have to play my friend - go boldly.

[QUOTE=Jake993]Failing that pal, you are on consoling boyfriend duty tonight. But don't rule out consolation sex either. It's not going to be as hot as regular carnival sex like you usually have but if you dig into your bad of tricks and pretend for a moment that you are dealing with a western girl you might have a chance. Remember - her "game" will be off so she's not going to respond to the normal animal stimulus. This is going to be all about her and her grieving. Get some soup, watch a light romantic comedy on TV, and (God dare I say it?) HOLD her in such a way that reassures her she is safe with you and that sex is the last thing on your mind. Reassure her that Babushka is in peace and reflect on the tremendous times that she had seen in her life time and how she is now in a better place with <<and here's the punch line>> the recently departed Patriarch. Once you get in the sack for some badly needed sleep, you need no more than 30 seconds before she's ready to feel you pain. Or you to feel her pain..... you get what I mean. This shit works every time. Besides, it's the only card you have to play my friend - go boldly.[/QUOTE]I'm being "horroshi" tonight. It's really the only option and it's the only thing I feel like doing. She's really sad, feeling totally guilty that she isn't at home "where she should be".

Oh well.

As for sex, I really really really doubt I'm getting any... but we're going to dinner... maybe drinks will help. She'll either turn into a crying wreck or something may happen after all. I'm not pushing it, but you never how she'll be.

Actually it's odd, we've gotten really close in the last 2 hours, just talking and softly touching. She's resting now while I type, but we haven't talked like that ever before. It was like a dam broke, she was pouring out the emotion. She really laid it on thick.

Crazy day.