I emailed the Hotel Elizabeth through their Baguio branch and they did not answer.
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I emailed the Hotel Elizabeth through their Baguio branch and they did not answer.
Werner -- you are getting some good guidance here on the forum. You should take it seriously and don't waste your money on a "service."
First, while you seem like a nice fellow, you seem extremely naive. The best thing you could do to save yourself a ton of money and a lot of heartache is visit the country for as much time as your vacation and money allows.
Then GO HOME alone and visit a second time.
This is called "experience." You surely need some. If you think you are going to go there for a 10 day swing and simply pluck the perfect virginal goddess off the street or out of a gogo club - or through a SERVICE - I have a condo for you in Florida (USA). That's a joke. It means I am going to take advantage of you.
Here is the main problem with men from the West who visit the Asia and other 3rd world areas.
We are wealthy. Compared against the blinding, life-long crushing poverty of our little brown friends in the third world, we are all rich -- whether you are a mechanic in Stutgart or a Banker in Boise. And as a result, you really can not comprehend where these people are coming from. Some forum members say "these girls are all money grubbing, avaricious, blah blah blah."
That is a judgment anybody from the West is unqualified to make - unless you have been that poor; and believe me, nobody here has ever been as poor as they are in these places. Even if you are homeless living in a stolen car - you are vastly more rich than anybody in the places we mongers visit. Why?
Because you are in AMERICA. (Or Western Europe or Japan, etc.) You are a couple of paychecks away from getting your car out of hock and roof over your head and used TV. Two weeks later you are signing up for cable.
While these girls may come across like thieves -- it is survival. It is all they know: get money. When they try to get as much money from you as they can, it's not for a new TV or a payment on the Boat. It is for food and shelter - exclusively; for them or the family or the kid back in the Lean-to. You, Werner, can not possibly comprehend what that means. That is not an insult, it's a warning. It is a warning as to just how far apart you are from any of the girls you are likely to meet.
Only certain sophisticated mongers know what I'm talking about -- the ones who have visited the Shanty towns inside the Land-fills, or the Favelas in Brazil. The rest are vaguely aware of what they think they understand as "poverty," but whoever complains about some gogo girl's attitude -- they are naive.
Anyway, Werner -- a little off topic. In summary, you should take a YEAR of investigation and learning before you jump in here. For you, it would be like visiting the American-Canadian border and jumping in to the Niagra "River." Let me be the first to warn you: there is big surprise waiting for you just a little bit downstream. Stay close to shore at first, Kid, OK?
The opening phrase of the 50,000 pages of the US IRS Code starts out like this: "Investigate before you Invest." Think about it, Werner, and save yourself a bundle. Auf-wider-hussein! j
Sure Red Kilt,
I was mainly thinking of the bargirls and girls from DiA and Tagged that most of us frequently meet.
I have been around (the Philippines) since the late 80'ties and we have an office in Manila with educated ladies, but those girls are more or less working 12 hours a day, and at least 6 hours on Saturdays and are not likely to hang out with mongers like us.
This means that Werner2727 may not expect to meet ladies like this on a dating site, in the mall, or even through through socalled experts promoting the Love2. To meet and date them, you surely need to either live here or visit frequently for longer periods (not just a week every two year :) ).
Agree on the latter?
[QUOTE=Red Kilt]This comment must be based on the cross-section of uneducated girls that you encounter Marco.
I have worked here for 14 years with educated filipinas.
These girls are certainly very mature and could talk the rug out from under many Aussie girls.
It is just not sensible to make such a sweeping statement without qualifying it in some way.
If your sample of girls are from bars or freelancers in malls or off the street then it might well be correct.
If you are talking about the whole sample of filipinas including the teachers, nurses, secretaries etc etc then your comment is just not true.[/QUOTE]
Clarification -
What I here mean is -- guys like us meet some girl they think is perfect. And she MAY BE perfect! So the guy starts thinking and talking out loud:
"...then I'll get you a visa, and I'll come back and you will love my house, and I'll buy you a car and I'll teach you how to drive -- you are going to love driving -- and maybe you can go to the community college in my County. It'll be great, Sweetheart!"
Meanwhile - this girl is thinking about a $20 dollar bill. That's it. Or maybe two 20's making in total, $40. "Wouldn't it be great if I could get a smooth Hundred out of this guy. He seems very nice." She likes you. And she is nice.
There is nothing wrong with either of these people. They are simply coming at the world from two very different universes. Different goals and objectives. Different lives. He is lonely. She is poor. He has money to satisfy her poverty; she has affection to sooth his loneliness.
But 99 times out of 100, Werner, this is not the basis for a successful marriage. It is, however, the perfect basis for an affair, a tryst or a transaction. I usually opt for a transaction.
Very impressive couple of reports here, Jacksonian. I particularly appreciate the balance shown and the wisdom of your observations. I guess the key thing here is PERSPECTIVE. Most of us, most of the time, tend to rely only upon our own narrow values, outlooks and experiences. We are fortunate to have several 'National Treasures' on the P I Forum who dispense a lot of excellent advice. Welcome to that exclusive club!
BTW, you mentioned The Cebu Grand(e) If you are indeed referring to the hotel on N. Escario, be sure to request a mountainview room on the upper floors. 503, 505, through 511, or sixth floor, the same. It's a very comfortable 3 star hotel with 5 star service.
[QUOTE=Jackzonian]Clarification - guys like us meet some girl they think is perfect. And she MAY BE perfect! So the guy starts thinking... There is nothing wrong with either of these people. They are simply coming at the world from two very different universes. Different goals and objectives. Different lives. He is lonely. She is poor. He has money to satisfy her poverty; she has affection to sooth his loneliness.
But 99 times out of 100, this is not the basis for a successful marriage. It is, however, the perfect basis for an affair, a tryst or a transaction. I usually opt for a transaction.[/QUOTE]
Mutualism is defined as any relationship between individuals of different species where both individuals derive a benefit. As long as we mongers understand this relationship, we can have a gas and at the same time not only do no harm to the ladies, but help them. I love my Asian gf’s, but I never allow myself to fall in love with them. I know it will not work in the long run and it will just cause me pain later on down the road. Every year I meet one or two girls that are just a little cuter than the others, or a little nicer, or have a sweeter pussy, ect, ect, ect. And I admit that at times I feel myself falling. That’s when I know I got to move on.
But hey, I know there is a never ending line of western guys that want to believe “love” can happen. When “love” enters the picture the mutualistic symbiotic relationship all too often turns into a parasitic symbiotic relationship in which one member of the association benefits while the other is harmed. Don’t say you were not warned.
[QUOTE=Jackzonian]Clarification -
What I here mean is -- guys like us meet some girl they think is perfect. And she MAY BE perfect! So the guy starts thinking and talking out loud:
"...then I'll get you a visa, and I'll come back and you will love my house, and I'll buy you a car and I'll teach you how to drive -- you are going to love driving -- and maybe you can go to the community college in my County. It'll be great, Sweetheart!"
Meanwhile - this girl is thinking about a $20 dollar bill. That's it. Or maybe two 20's making in total, $40. "Wouldn't it be great if I could get a smooth Hundred out of this guy. He seems very nice." She likes you. And she is nice.
There is nothing wrong with either of these people. They are simply coming at the world from two very different universes. Different goals and objectives. Different lives. He is lonely. She is poor. He has money to satisfy her poverty; she has affection to sooth his loneliness.
But 99 times out of 100, Werner, this is not the basis for a successful marriage. It is, however, the perfect basis for an affair, a tryst or a transaction. I usually opt for a transaction.[/QUOTE]Total generalization on your part. I hear it all the time.
You and the majority here just want to screw. Why do you think you know everything?
Sorry mister but I know quite a few that have succeeded. Keep talking with your "little head" and don't try to pretend you have all the answers.
[QUOTE=Jackzonian]Clarification.
What I here mean is. Guys like us meet some girl they think is perfect. And she MAY BE perfect! So the guy starts thinking and talking out loud:
". Then I'll get you a visa, and I'll come back and you will love my house, and I'll buy you a car and I'll teach you how to drive. You are going to love driving. And maybe you can go to the community college in my County. It'll be great, Sweetheart! "
Meanwhile. This girl is thinking about a $20 dollar bill. That's it. Or maybe two 20's making in total, $40. "Wouldn't it be great if I could get a smooth Hundred out of this guy. He seems very nice. " She likes you. And she is nice.
There is nothing wrong with either of these people. They are simply coming at the world from two very different universes. Different goals and objectives. Different lives. He is lonely. She is poor. He has money to satisfy her poverty; she has affection to sooth his loneliness.
But 99 times out of 100, Werner, this is not the basis for a successful marriage. It is, however, the perfect basis for an affair, a tryst or a transaction. I usually opt for a transaction.[/QUOTE]Very wise man here listen to him.
[QUOTE=Tungsten Chef]Total generalization on your part. I hear it all the time.
You and the majority here just want to screw. Why do you think you know everything?
Sorry mister but I know quite a few that have succeeded. Keep talking with your "little head" and don't try to pretend you have all the answers.[/QUOTE]
Like Tungsten, I know quite a few relationships, including my own, that have succeeded. In almost all cases however, the success stories concern guys who actually live here, and who have already been through it all, and have thus clarified what they want and how to get what they want. It's rare that I've met short-time travelers, most of whom know and understand little about the country despite their smug certainty that they do, who have established and maintained fulfilling relationships. It's not that those who live here are necessarily smarter than those who don't, it's that knowledge and accurate perceptions are cumulative, and depend more on time in country and experience than any other factors.
Also, of course, something happens to the brain of some guys when deplaning here, and they become enveloped in a willing suspension of disbelief, that allows them to believe that the girl they picked up in a bar on their first night here, and who provided cataclysmic sex, is really the love of their life. Usually, several months and several of thousands of dollars later the mists of fantasy part, and they come crashing into the hard stone wall of reality.
I've tried to explain many times, via PMs, emails, and the occasional face-to-face meeting, that there's a huge difference between the endless, profuse sex that's readily on offer, and the building of a relationship with a more substantial basis, and with a different kind of woman. Though most profess to understand (and often insist that "this one is different"), most don't really get it.
GE
[QUOTE=Marconista]Sure Red Kilt,
I was mainly thinking of the bargirls and girls from DiA and Tagged that most of us frequently meet.
..............To meet and date them, you surely need to either live here or visit frequently for longer periods (not just a week every two year :) ).
Agree on the latter?[/QUOTE]
Yep.
Agree Marco.
That's EXACTLY what I meant when I said
(quote) it is just not sensible to make such a sweeping statement without qualifying it in some way (unquote).
You just added the qualification, and that's cool.
[QUOTE=GoodEnough]Like Tungsten, I know quite a few relationships, including my own, that have succeeded. In almost all cases however, the success stories concern guys who actually live here, and who have already been through it all, and have thus clarified what they want and how to get what they want. It's rare that I've met short-time travelers, most of whom know and understand little about the country despite their smug certainty that they do, who have established and maintained fulfilling relationships. It's not that those who live here are necessarily smarter than those who don't, it's that knowledge and accurate perceptions are cumulative, and depend more on time in country and experience than any other factors.
Also, of course, something happens to the brain of some guys when deplaning here, and they become enveloped in a willing suspension of disbelief, that allows them to believe that the girl they picked up in a bar on their first night here, and who provided cataclysmic sex, is really the love of their life. Usually, several months and several of thousands of dollars later the mists of fantasy part, and they come crashing into the hard stone wall of reality.
I've tried to explain many times, via PMs, emails, and the occasional face-to-face meeting, that there's a huge difference between the endless, profuse sex that's readily on offer, and the building of a relationship with a more substantial basis, and with a different kind of woman. Though most profess to understand (and often insist that "this one is different"), most don't really get it.
GE[/QUOTE]
Excellent post GE. Very very well-expressed.
Definitely worth inclusion on the "Reports of Distinction"
I hope some of the "less-enlightened" brother mongers read it and comprehend too.
yes, i generalized. and for the guys who make it work, good on ya. i wrote that stuff to werner to be a bit funny but also to slow him down. you must admit he's heading into a curve at high speed. i didn't write to insult anybody. note, i did qualify it by saying 99 out of 100, right? you guys with good relationships or good marriages to local girls are the minority. i have great affection for and empathy with girls in these places - but somebody accused me of going there to screw. ummm...? is it just me? please. i've never jammed a chica down on price nor never forced it in any situation. rather, i view every girl i've ever hooked up with in asia as a mini-relationship - like a year with a western chick but condensed into one night or two. you meet, you share a laugh, you have a drink or two, you get excited, you go back to your room, you tussle the sheets a bit, you get sick of each other after 48 hours so you end it! like a love affair! in the west, it just takes a more time and a lot more money -- but in the end, you end up in the same place. you spent a few bucks and you busted a nut once or twice. j
I used to own a company in Cebu for about 3 years. 1/2 my time was spent living there. I'm thinking of going back, this time to work at a university as a professor. Yes, the pay is horrible and I don't know how I'd get by (maybe 50K Peso a month and then some side income) but life in the US kinda sucks now for many of us.
Any of you know of someone that did this? When I had the company I had rock star status with Filipinas. I'd imagine being in the education system provides an opportunity to meet a lot of students and there friends, etc.
Of course, this is not the ONLY reason to make such a big leap, but it's important. FYI, I'm in my mid 40s and have good looks, but woman in the US are no longer interested in me because I lost all my money with my start-up in Cebu! I now live like someone in the Philippines so why not be there with others that have no money like me!
Plus, work I've done since the outsourcing computer services company in Cebu has screwed up my career in the US where there are little job opportunities. With an MS degree and experience working a cebu, a WSG member might get a job as above. I have the connections to do it, but don't know how difficult it is in general.
If you prefer to PM about this, please do.
Also, sorry for the ignorance after being away so long, but what is DIA that everyone mentions?
[QUOTE=D Cups]Ya, she's says all the right things. Too good to be true.[/QUOTE]Just to confirm your suspicions, yes, a foreign man is Jade's "marketing agent", wrote her profile, checks her incoming messages, and answers messages for her. I have first-hand experience with her over a few months, and the eloquent, fabricated profile was followed by her giving me a STD and other unpleasant experiences. All in all, the worst value for money invested I've encountered over 25 years of Asia mongering and 4 months of this time in PH. I could have bar-fined a much hotter bar gi.
[QUOTE=D Cups]Ya, she's says all the right things. Too good to be true.[/QUOTE]Just to confirm your suspicions, yes, a foreign man is Jade's "marketing agent", wrote her eloquent, fabricated profile, checks her incoming messages, and answers messages for her. I have first-hand experience with her over a few months, and the was followed by her giving me a STD and other unpleasant experiences. All in all, the worst value for money invested I've encountered over 25 years of Asia mongering and 4 months of this time in PH. I could have bar-fined a much hotter bar girl for the same amount of money, with fewer headaches, less drama, and less risk of a STD since Jade is a freelance and doesn't get tested.