Bangkok Reports

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1822413]YouTube has a first impression of Hooters Bangkok at Nana: [URL]https://youtu.be/jKqaQmDiJDo[/URL].[/QUOTE]Wow I am impressed. I did not detect much in the way of the Baccara highly modified fake alien look. These appear to be nice real Thai look natural girls for the most part and big boobs not even a requirement. You can expect highly padded bras of course.

I particularly like the straight smooth hair, none of those silly Baccara hairstyles that hide half the face.

I probably generally go for girls a bit skinnier, but a pretty face will do. At least no flabby girls. I would give it a try. Well done to the boss hiring the girls.

I would not spend bulk time there, but I could imagine short visits, when hungry assuming they serve O.K. food. I see Soi 15 has a Hooters too. So not sure why they two of them so quickly.

[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1822193]I suppose the counter argument is taxi drivers in Bangkok really cannot make much money if they stay on meter. If a driver is honest, puts on the meter without any complaints, drives well, and gets me to my destination without any monkey business, I don't see a problem giving a tip, particularly given for most of us a tip to a taxi driver isn't going to put a dent in our wallet. I can live with a hypothetical "stupid farang" sign pinned on me by a taxi driver I would likely never see again although I suspect a "thank you, I appreciate it" sign would present itself as often.

I have a different opinion about excessive tips given to bar girls and the like, because unlike a hard working honest taxi driver who is scraping by, they are for the most part making more money than they ever imagined, and really don't need more.[/QUOTE]I congratulate you on your commonsense approach.

There needs to be more of it and less western rhetoric on these pages sometimes. If people want things to be the same in a foreign land as it is in their home town maybe they should stay there.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;1822500]Let's see: do I want to spend my time and money in a bar that charges more for drinks than any other bar on Soi 4 and does not allow barfines or any real interaction with its bar girls? Its a tough question and I know I will have to make up my mind pretty soon because I do not expect Nana Hooters to last a year. Which reminds me, before Nana there was a Makati Hooters. It went out of business last year. Quelle surprise! What were they thinking?[/QUOTE]Couldn't agree more Natty. I assume these sorts of establishments / brands are funded by venture capitalists (I am open to correction), so I wonder what due diligence went into this one. Not much I assume. But then again they have far deeper pockets and more qualifications hanging on their walls than I do.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1822413]YouTube has a first impression of Hooters Bangkok at Nana: [URL]https://youtu.be/jKqaQmDiJDo[/URL].[/QUOTE]The location is horrible, the girls are plain Janes and the customers are knocking on heaven's door. I skipped it last weekend I was in BKK and will check out the other location on Soi 13. Hopefully the talents are better, if not the wings better be good. Hottest Hooters girls outside the US have been Japan, Korea and China.

I am back in Bangkok again after a few days in Cambodia, staying at Nana Hotel, as usual. I still like this place even though it is kind of rundown. I am a nostalgic kind of fellow and have been mongering here for more than two decades. I like the sinful character, the friendly staff and the guys downstairs who sit around and talk the day away. I am not a big fan of the bar scene with the exception of Crazy House. I spent several evenings there last week and boy are those girls cute, nice and firm young bodies. And they are completely nude! The waitresses are not at all pushy and I had a seat off the stage. Drinks run just over 100 bahts, 150 I think for my whiskey. For the cost of a drink the girls stand in front of you and let you caress their firm tits and asses. I just wish they didn't all have to shave their pussies. I am big fan of a nice Bush and find them far more attractive than the stubbly pussies I usually am confronted with. Now the girls outside in the Nana car park are a different story. I have been very lucky in the past but this year with the exception of Saturday nights I am not impressed by their numbers or quality. There are far fewer girls than in the past and many start out asking for 1500 bahts but will usually go for 1200. A few starfish, very pretty but stuck up if you ask me. Many girls fall into this category these days. They are border line rude when I engage them in polite conversation and inquire about services rendered. I miss the old days when so many of these girls were really cuddly friendly. : "where you go now? I take care of you good. " It is really a hit or miss kind of deal today but I remain optimistic that I will find that rare diamond in the rough tonight. Otherwise I will head to Snow White or Kasalong.

By the way, I saw a post saying Star of Light was closed. Can anyone confirm. I have not been over in the part of town yet.

Cheers

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;1822500]Let's see: do I want to spend my time and money in a bar that charges more for drinks than any other bar on Soi 4 and does not allow barfines or any real interaction with its bar girls? Its a tough question and I know I will have to make up my mind pretty soon because I do not expect Nana Hooters to last a year. Which reminds me, before Nana there was a Makati Hooters. It went out of business last year. Quelle surprise! What were they thinking?[/QUOTE]Let's hope the legion of FL WG discovers Hooters quickly and ply their trade from there. Like a "new Beer Garten" place.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;1822500]Let's see: do I want to spend my time and money in a bar that charges more for drinks than any other bar on Soi 4 and does not allow barfines or any real interaction with its bar girls? Its a tough question and I know I will have to make up my mind pretty soon because I do not expect Nana Hooters to last a year. Which reminds me, before Nana there was a Makati Hooters. It went out of business last year. Quelle surprise! What were they thinking?[/QUOTE]Amen. I was a bit horrified to see that Hooters replaced Golden.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;1822500]Let's see: do I want to spend my time and money in a bar that charges more for drinks than any other bar on Soi 4 and does not allow barfines or any real interaction with its bar girls? Its a tough question and I know I will have to make up my mind pretty soon because I do not expect Nana Hooters to last a year. Which reminds me, before Nana there was a Makati Hooters. It went out of business last year. Quelle surprise! What were they thinking?[/QUOTE]Given I have only been in a Hooters once in my life, I may not have much standing to comment on whether this one is going to succeed. But if I am correct they serve food, I suppose it is possible. I have been amazed at the number of westerners, perhaps most particularly Americans (although this conclusion may reflect that I know more Americans than other westerners), who restrict themselves to places like McDonalds, KFC or other places they can find at home for all their eating needs while overseas. Won't even touch anything unfamiliar or from unfamiliar places. Perhaps such people will frequent the Hooters for food, while at the same time buying some drinks. I doubt though whether there will be many hanging out there long just drinking.

[QUOTE=Stykler;1822529]I congratulate you on your commonsense approach.

There needs to be more of it and less western rhetoric on these pages sometimes. If people want things to be the same in a foreign land as it is in their home town maybe they should stay there.[/QUOTE]Good.

This is the most important tip off all. Everyone should adjust your behavioir to suit Thai social values, at least the good ones.

For me the biggest thing to learm was to maintain Thai levels of politeness where I am naturally a little anti-social, impatient, and contemptuous. Americans are generally very polite and generous so they adjust more easily.

Foul language and disrespect is a particularly noticable fault from some countries, e. G. England lower classes high use of the F and C words loudly im public. Chinese tourists from China or Hong Kong tend to be totally bereft of politeness. Just generalising from observations. Thais will generalise too. Everyone has a chance to be different by adjusting there own behavior.

Was in Bangkok two weeks back! Went to Crazy house, Baccara and Suzie Wong!

1. Crazy House. Being and Indian, the guy stopped me at entry. But I know how to get in and got in with a bang! Packed, totally packed with people. Not even enough space to breath! Saw the lineup and maybe I am the weird one, was just left wondering why is it packed! I didn't like any girls. Maybe I moved out too fast as I had only one night to stay in BKK, so didn't intend to waste my time.

2. Went to Baccara. Met Patrick!! The guy at the door who doesn't allow my countrymen in! Yes, he is a friend and I always get some great treatment at Baccara. But didn't bother to wait long as I wanted to see Suzie wong.

3. Suzie Wong. Got in. There was some show on!! They have good shows!! Anyways spent an hour out there. Bought a couple of drinks for a hottie with fake boobs and braces! But she looked exceptionally good with the be&be! Nice third be too (Booty) . Bought a couple of drinks for the mamasan too while I was there. Told the Mamasan to let the lady know, that she has to make me happy! Barfined. Went to the room. Exceptionally good attitude. Not really GFE but no cribbing on anything. Had some chit chat and started with DFK which went on quite long, didn't see the watch but it was quite some time. And yes. Try taking girls without braces, it does trouble!! Then got BBBJ making her sit on the chair and me standing the edges of the chair!! Yes, didn't use the bed as the mirror was on the side and I wanted to see that face in every angle suck me! Good blowjob! In fact the BBJ was better than Dr. BJ's which I just had a few hours ago! I don't go down on working girls but I think she wouldn't mind. So, no cunnilingus!! Then sex in missionary, doggy and finished in woman on top. After the deed she wasn't in a hurry! But was unwilling to stay all night!! Also, I thought why would I repeat when I am there for such a short time! Headed back to Suzie Wong dropped her, chilled for another hour and picked another girl!! Back to the room all good, I fingered the shit out of her pussy! She was moaning crazy, pure fun! Sex in all positions But I couldn't fucking cum! I guess 3rd session in short while might be the reason but I decided to enjoy the many views which you normally can't see! Banging in all hardcore fashion and felling the tip and tip of her body till I cum! But! Suddenly I realize there is blood on the condom (Outside)! I don't if its because of Banging hard, (she was tight real tight) or because of the fingering but I remember no blood on fingers for sure! Looking at blood I could not continue, thinking of safety, so I stopped the session!

Here I need your suggestions! Condom didn't tear! I checked by filling water to the fullest. Am I at risk? I washed up. She could not speak English, used Google translate on the phone and we communicated.

1. Asked her if she had periods. She said no.

2. Asked her if she has HIV. She said she tested 2 days ago and at the Bar everyone has to test every month. If not tested you don't get the salary (Is this true?).

3. I asked her then why is she bleeding. She told me in Thai which translated as. You tore my flesh that is why!

Anyways, got ready and dropped her back to Soi cowboy. Went to the room and slept!

Is it true that the top Bars get the girls tested regularly? Is it common that girls work in period or I just tore her flesh (Haha) . Should I be worried about health safety?

Ratings.

Girl 1 - 8/10 . Girl 2 - 8/10.

Service both - 8/10.

Barfine - 700 & 2 K for the girls each!

Experience. Too Good.

WIR. YES.

[QUOTE=Mogwai;1818381] It's right under Nana Hotel and it's quite big. [/QUOTE]What's the price of a bottle of beer vs the other bars in the area? Its location is prime seating for people watching. Forget about the food, tons of fantastic food carts all up and down that street.

Somewhat off topic question but I always wondered if there was another way into Nana than that one entrance on soi 4. There's just too many girls working in the gogo's for all of them to come in thru that one entrance.

[QUOTE=LoverboyJerico;1822638]Here I need your suggestions! Condom didn't tear! I checked by filling water to the fullest. Am I at risk? I washed up. She could not speak English, used Google translate on the phone and we communicated.[/QUOTE]As long as the condom didn't tear and no blood got on you where your skin was damaged, you are not at risk for HIV.

[QUOTE=LoverboyJerico;1822638]1. Asked her if she had periods. She said no.[/QUOTE]Interesting to note but not relevant.

[QUOTE=LoverboyJerico;1822638]2. Asked her if she has HIV. She said she tested 2 days ago and at the Bar everyone has to test every month. If not tested you don't get the salary (Is this true?).[/QUOTE]There is no way to make sure if that story is real. Perhaps it is, perhaps it isn't. I seem to remember to have read somewhere that in order to get a massage place or entertainment licence, the venue may only employ girls that are regularly tested. I have no idea if such a rule indeed exist and if so, whether it is actually enforced. Of course it wouldn't cost the bar a penny to require their girls to have regular tests and it would indeed show good business sense, but this is Thailand and their business sense may not always match mine.

[QUOTE=LoverboyJerico;1822638]3. I asked her then why is she bleeding. She told me in Thai which translated as. You tore my flesh that is why![/QUOTE]That is entirely possible. To admonish you with the famous saying of another Member on this forum: "Did you make sure she was well lubricated?"

[QUOTE=LoverboyJerico;1822638]Is it true that the top Bars get the girls tested regularly? Is it common that girls work in period or I just tore her flesh (Haha) . Should I be worried about health safety?[/QUOTE]Top or bottom bars, as I said above you cannot be certain of their actual testing policy.

Girls will work anytime, on or off their period. They have ways of hiding their period (the famous sponge!) and you would not be any wiser most of the time.

Yes, you may have hurt her. These things happen.

Don't worry, unless infected blood gets inside your bloodstream you are not at risk.

LBJ,

The lineup is better at CH generally if you like skinny girls. Perhaps you go for more voluptuous. Most Indians do. I would say SW has a lot more chubby girls and just a few slim ones.

No need to worry about that blood. Has happened to me plenty of times. It means she has an injury. With condom use, you won't catch anything.

Finger in pussy is more dangerous if you rubbed you eyes later before washing your hands. Caught Chlamydia red eye that way once many years ago.

I am back in Bangkok but have not had much luck so far and too tired to go more than maybe once or twice every day. Last night I started out at Crazy House again just to get in the mood and had the seat next to the stair leading to the stage from where I had a nice view of all these lovelies ascending and descending from the stage in an interminable March of pussies, most shaved and a few just with a sprinkle of hair. Great seat! I do wish they did not all shave, but their bodies sure are enticing. Nice and firm all over with for the most part well-sculpted tits. With all these girls—surely 50 or so taking turns on stage—you just have to wonder how the place makes any money. I mean, most guys do not have more than a drink or two and, from what I could see, are not overly generous tippers. I called one girl down to fondle her as she stood in front of me offering her naked body to me and I did enjoy the feel of her pert tits and her firm ass. They are sure are beautiful to look at like this but I wonder if they are any good in the sack? They look like starfish to me, who just want to get the deed over with.

Later that evening I picked up this lovely 19-year old in the Nana Car Park (Mee or Mi) but the experience was not much to brag about. She was very pretty, to be sure, but I just could not perform despite more than a little help from my friend Kamagra. I wonder about those pills some time but perhaps it is just that I am overly tired being on the road for almost a month now. And these FLs have a way of killing the mood by insisting on showering without foreplay and then inspecting your cock every which way until your erection weakens. She let me go down on her for a good long time but she just lay there without any kind of reaction. Definitely a turn off. But she did give me a nice BBBJ and I suddenly could not hold back and came in her mouth. I warned her but she did not seem to care or maybe not understand because but when she felt my love juices inundate her mouth she was startled, gagged and coughed and spit in all directions. I was still only semi-erect and did not recuperate for several hours by which time I was too shagged out to go out looking for more pussy. She relieved me of 1200 baht, down from the 1500 baht they all seem to be asking these days. At least they all seem willing to negotiate, something I am usually reluctant to do because it creates bad vibes from the beginning. But they usually are the first to offer to go for less when they notice that I seem taken aback by the price.

This afternoon I picked up a slightly older FL in the car park but had a similar experience. I was hoping for a better time because older ladies general take better care of you and this one promised "I take care of you," the way I am used to. But alas no. She was in and out in about 30 minutes but, on the other hand, only cost me 1000 baht. Nice be-sized tits and a hairy pussy, just the way I like them. But again no reaction from her to my oral ministrations. So I saved my elixir for Pat at Kasalong or Ann at the other venue around the corner that cannot be mentioned by name. I am on my way there now and will keep you posted. I will be happy if she just lets me eat her out in the cubicle and finish in her mouth. After my lackluster performance I wonder if I should indulge in the expense of the upstairs room? I went upstairs once last year with Nam, who no longer works at Kasalong, and we had a good time, doing all the positions and me straddling her face to finish in her mouth. She had the most beautiful be-size + tits but was a just a little heavy around the waist. They do warm to me, however, so I take a certain satisfaction in that. Mind you, I am not ugly to look at, 6' 4" and only 190 lbs with more than just a little blond (well gray) hair on my head. At 70, I look at least ten years younger and normally can outperform myself, whatever that means.

In the old days I almost always had better luck in the Nana Car park and wonder if my fellow mongers have noticed a similar decline in the services rendered.

The blind girls were at it again last night but who would go with them? Pretty as they are they all communicate only by their phones, making it hard to engage in a little conversation beforehand and a bad omen for a good time. Has anyone here tried them?

Tonight is just beginning and I will keep you posted on my further adventures in the city that never sleeps.

[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1822193] I have a different opinion about excessive tips given to bar girls and the like, because unlike a hard working honest taxi driver who is scraping by, they are for the most part making more money than they ever imagined, and really don't need more.[/QUOTE]There is also a rather consistent and clear across-the-board understanding of what "good" vs "bad" means with regard to a taxi ride. And for service in a restaurant for that matter. But what "good" or "bad" means to me with regard to carnal pleasures vs what other punters around the world and on these message boards consider "good" or "bad" is totally subjective. That's why I try not to promote the concept of giving an unexpected "tip" to a bargirl at the end of a sexual session as some kind of standard practice on message boards like these. If you do, then you are just as likely recommending that readers encourage "bad" service out there as "good". Possibly more likely.

To illustrate; I read field reports on these message boards where guys describe enduring a covered BJ for mere oral foreplay, are refused DFK, wind up finishing with something no better than a handjob, paid over 4,000 baht for it at some soapy and then conclude their field report by hailing the great GFE and PSE they got and how they cannot wait to return. Of course, they also gave the girl an unexpected "tip" afterwards because they had such a memorable experience and want to encourage and reward "good" service.

Punters like that and I are not on the same sheet of music when it comes to what constitutes "good" service vs "bad" service on these matters. Actually, we are not even in the same Concert Hall. Read a truly negative review of some experience with a go-go girl or beer bar girl and I assure you the last 4 times that girl got an unexpected "tip" of 300-500 baht from a customer, she gave them no better service than what that negative reviewer got. The last 3 guys who gave her 1000 baht tip might very well have just gotten WORSE service from her and then offered her a proposal of marriage!

So, there is no standard for which one could recommend the concept of tipping afterwards on message boards like these unless the tip is discussed ahead of time in the bar and is clearly applied to something more specific than her being "good". She is no mind-reader. She has no idea what you think is "good" service, particularly in light of the rave reviews I read and the, without doubt, sizable tips she has gotten from guys who got no better than mediocre service (in my mind) 100 times over before she met me. Something on the order of, "If you do this or that for me, I will give you more" would probably suffice, imo.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1823045]There is also a rather consistent and clear across-the-board understanding of what "good" vs "bad" means with regard to a taxi ride. And for service in a restaurant for that matter. But what "good" or "bad" means to me with regard to carnal pleasures vs what other punters around the world and on these message boards consider "good" or "bad" is totally subjective. That's why I try not to promote the concept of giving an unexpected "tip" to a bargirl at the end of a sexual session as some kind of standard practice on message boards like these. If you do, then you are just as likely recommending that readers encourage "bad" service out there as "good". Possibly more likely.

To illustrate; I read field reports on these message boards where guys describe enduring a covered BJ for mere oral foreplay, are refused DFK, wind up finishing with something no better than a handjob, paid over 4,000 baht for it at some soapy and then conclude their field report by hailing the great GFE and PSE they got and how they cannot wait to return. Of course, they also gave the girl an unexpected "tip" afterwards because they had such a memorable experience and want to encourage and reward "good" service.

Punters like that and I are not on the same sheet of music when it comes to what constitutes "good" service vs "bad" service on these matters. Actually, we are not even in the same Concert Hall. Read a truly negative review of some experience with a go-go girl or beer bar girl and I assure you the last 4 times that girl got an unexpected "tip" of 300-500 baht from a customer, she gave them no better service than what that negative reviewer got. The last 3 guys who gave her 1000 baht tip might very well have just gotten WORSE service from her and then offered her a proposal of marriage!

So, there is no standard for which one could recommend the concept of tipping afterwards on message boards like these unless the tip is discussed ahead of time in the bar and is clearly applied to something more specific than her being "good". She is no mind-reader. She has no idea what you think is "good" service, particularly in light of the rave reviews I read and the, without doubt, sizable tips she has gotten from guys who got no better than mediocre service (in my mind) 100 times over before she met me. Something on the order of, "If you do this or that for me, I will give you more" would probably suffice, imo.[/QUOTE]I hope you were drunk or something when writing this report. Reads pretty much exaggerated, emotional, and non sensible at times.

I can report that I accomplished the mission to bed Pat at Kasalong. I almost did not recognize her with her new hairdo a la Mickey Mouse. We settled into the corner cubicle, which has become like a home away from home for me during the month or so I spend in Thailand every year. Pat's tits are not much to cheer about but she has a good attitude and sucks a mean dick. Actually she seems very sweet and so I shouldn't talk like that. I was curious to see what her pussy looked like (she was on the rag the last time I stopped by) and must report that it is clean shaven. Sad to say, she must have lubed up before joining me in our cubicle because her pussy quite frankly was not that tasty and kind of rubbery. Rather reminds me of the Hausmadchen in the Erlebniswohnung in Berlin. They love to suck and fuck but their pussies taste like something out of a pharmacy. You know what I mean, I think, those of you who have indulged. I will post on Berlin soon, which has always been one of my favorite mongering destinations, ever since I lived there as a child. Hell, there was a Puff on the ground floor of our apartment building in the Sprengelstrasse, an old-fashioned Puff I'm alter Manier, no less (which means that it had 8 mm porno playing non-stop and booths with high wooden backs for privacy so that you could not follow everything your neighbor did with one of the Hausmadchen. Delightful set-up, I must say. I go back there every time I am home and just sit in a corner and wank until one of the girls comes over to relive me of the tension building in my groins. Since the early 1990's they have a two-way mirror in one of the side rooms to accommodate voyeurs like myself. I used to wank like crazy thinking about the nasty shit that went on behind those walls. Occasionally, I would get a peek through one of the windows. More later. It will be good, I promise. I cannot help myself, so let me just add this. While still an aspiring university student this blond haired big breasted Polish appears out of nowhere and pulls me through the door and pretty much raped me in the Klo (loo), telling me she could see me at the window and that she would have to speak to my parents. After that she did not say much; she was too busy sucking on my 8 inch Riesenschwanz, greedily swallowing my seed, which was very abundant at that young age. She wiped a few precious drops that had spilled onto her chin and then gave me one of those little baby burps, confirming that yes "sie hat alles heruntergeschlucken" (down the old hatch) and yes, "das hat geschmeckt" (yummy). The next day I was waiting for her in the Hinterhof (backyard) as she took the trash out and this time it was my turn to surprise her. I reemed her from behind next to the trashcans, where no one could see us and received high marks for my efforts.

Back to Pat at Kasalong; sorry for my long digression on Berlin. I was distressed to learn on this forum that the EW is now closed until the good Mustafa can find a new location; I will post a detailed report on my experiences there and thoughts about the future of this eminent establishment. But like the French novelist Proust I have this thing for scent and taste, though my Madeleine is very different and situated at the apex of a woman's thighs. Anyway Pat and I had a good time in the 45 minutes or so we spent together and I rewarded her with a large tip. After munching on her clean shaven pussy for a while I decided to just settle for a BBBJ even though she was rubbing my now fully erect member around in her in her gaping crack, as if to say "please fuck me. " She told me she goes to doctor for her regular check up, seemingly begging me to fuck her, but I settled for a BBBJCIM. I am beginning to get too old to engage in any protracted fornication, I regret to say. A BBBJ is just a delightful way to end the day and I am glad to report that my Johnson is back to his old horny self, standing to stiff attention whenever, eager to make his master proud (though sometimes I wonder if Dr J. Is not in charge after all). LOL.

Tomorrow I have booked my favorite little fuck from Snow White, Tar. I cannot say enough good things about this girl. Just amazing.

[QUOTE=RoamingViking;1823026]The blind girls were at it again last night but who would go with them? Pretty as they are they all communicate only by their phones, making it hard to engage in a little conversation beforehand and a bad omen for a good time. Has anyone here tried them?
[/QUOTE]Blind girls? I have heard of deaf or mute girls plying their trade, but blind girls are something new.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1823074]I hope you were drunk or something when writing this report. Reads pretty much exaggerated, emotional, and non sensible at times.[/QUOTE]Not at all. And I am quite sure I could defend any specific aspect of what I wrote anytime you care to be more specific about what you object to rather than resorting to sweeping ad hominem insults.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1823045]
So, there is no standard for which one could recommend the concept of tipping afterwards on message boards like these unless the tip is discussed ahead of time in the bar and is clearly applied to something more specific than her being "good". She is no mind-reader. She has no idea what you think is "good" service, particularly in light of the rave reviews I read and the, without doubt, sizable tips she has gotten from guys who got no better than mediocre service (in my mind) 100 times over before she met me. Something on the order of, "If you do this or that for me, I will give you more" would probably suffice, imo.[/QUOTE]If you discuss the pricing structure ("if you do [I]X[/I] then I pay [I]Y[/I]") beforehand (which I heartily recommend everyone) then it is not a tip but a fee. In my book a "tip" is an unrequested gratuity freely given to reward good service.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1823189]If you discuss the pricing structure ("if you do [I]X[/I] then I pay [I]Y[/I]") beforehand (which I heartily recommend everyone) then it is not a tip but a fee. In my book a "tip" is an unrequested gratuity freely given to reward good service.[/QUOTE]Exactly. But my further point was that if we frame the concept of tipping (as you described it and given afterwards) in a P4 P environment as customary, encouraged, expected, the right thing to do and all that, then we have to accept the fact that many punters reading and following that recommendation will be tipping for lousy service as often and perhaps more often than for great service. Which, IMO, very well might be a major contributor to the decline in service overall.

I frequently read posters on these message boards describing how they prefer what would more or less be considered "starfish" behavior from the girl, are just fine with BJs that never end with CIM, make excuses for girls who cover for everything, even oral foreplay. Then they proudly announce that they always or almost always give their girls a decent "tip" afterwards for such good service. Well, IMO, those guys are rewarding and encouraging lousy service among the P4 P girls I will likely meet someday. By my standards, mind you, of course. I realize that many guys do think service like that is fantastic.

Consequently, I would resist promoting the idea of giving an unrequested and mostly unexpected tip afterwards on these message boards because, as far as I know, 80% of the guys reading it and who might follow it will be handing out tips for lousy service, encouraging it time and time again. However, if they negotiate the "tip" at the beginning, before closing the deal, and for more specific kinds of service even if their idea of heaven is "starfish" behavior and no CIM finishes for their BJs and they tell the girl upfront there is more money in it for them if they deliver accordingly, that is a different story entirely. I would very much recommend that, as you do.

[QUOTE=LoverboyJerico;1822638]

Here I need your suggestions! Condom didn't tear! I checked by filling water to the fullest. Am I at risk? I washed up. She could not speak English, used Google translate on the phone and we communicated.

1. Asked her if she had periods. She said no.

2. Asked her if she has HIV. She said she tested 2 days ago and at the Bar everyone has to test every month. If not tested you don't get the salary (Is this true?).[/QUOTE]I've had scares with bleeding from the gals, the latest one a major fright. I looked it up and found gonorrhea or chlamyldia can cause intermittent bleeding in between periods. I visited Bangkok phuket hospital and after a detailed and lengthy explanation to reception staff, nurse and a lady doctor in that sequence at the infectious diseases ward insisted on the CDC treatment guidelines be administered to me -injectable cephalosporin ceftriaxone in the buttocks, plus oral azithromycin 4 x250 MG in a single dosage. I didnt want to wait a few days for the blood test as I would no longer be in Phuket. The doc appreciated my knowledgeable plea and administered it to me. Didn't monger that night because it dampened my drive but the next day I was back in action. I don't want to go into the details about the nature of exposure as it is too gross (which I explained with a straight face to the lady doctor and nurse) but at least I slept well that night. Better than taking 7 day doxycycline course that drains your strength and stamina and rules out mongering for the period of your vacation. This single dosage treatment is reportedly very effective.

But your exposure seems negligible.

Cheers.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1823189]If you discuss the pricing structure ("if you do [I]X[/I] then I pay [I]Y[/I]") beforehand (which I heartily recommend everyone) then it is not a tip but a fee. In my book a "tip" is an unrequested gratuity freely given to reward good service.[/QUOTE]Thanks for that. That is indeed what a tip should be. Its purely up to the giver how he evaluates good or extra special service. He doesn't have to care what someone else expects. E. g. I don't need rimming, and I don't need a real massage. I need significant duration. Girls certainly don't get a tip if the attitude was poor or the fee was too high already, in my case. It's really just a question of how much she deserves to make for the service provided and time provided. I can suspect how badly she needs money but not really relevant.

[QUOTE=PeeMan;1823207]I've had scares with bleeding from the gals, the latest one a major fright. I looked it up and found gonorrhea or chlamyldia can cause intermittent bleeding in between periods. I visited Bangkok phuket hospital and after a detailed and lengthy explanation to reception staff,...[/QUOTE]I guess you must have been BB to get such a fright. With condom, I would not have been slightest bit worried. STDs are not the only cause of bleeds, and probably a minor cause. Hospital name sounds strange. I guess Bangkok Hospital in Phuket?

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1823204]
Consequently, I would resist promoting the idea of giving an unrequested and mostly unexpected tip afterwards on these message boards because, as far as I know, 80% of the guys reading it and who might follow it will be handing out tips for lousy service, encouraging it time and time again. However, if they negotiate the "tip" at the beginning, before closing the deal, and for more specific kinds of service even if their idea of heaven is "starfish" behavior and no CIM finishes for their BJs and they tell the girl upfront there is more money in it for them if they deliver accordingly, that is a different story entirely. I would very much recommend that, as you do.[/QUOTE]Its called the carrot and the stick principal. You can reward a girl for doing good, not for being lousy. That is so obvious.

A negotiated tip, is not a tip at all, it's a negotiated price for a specific service. You can't exactly negotiate for the girl having a good attitude, giving a GFE, working hard, being capable of deep throat etc. I don't bother to negotiate for specific services anyway. Either she is happy to do them as part of good service or she is not. Others want specific things. Fine negotiate for it, not related to tipping.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1823189]If you discuss the pricing structure ("if you do [I]X[/I] then I pay [I]Y[/I]") beforehand (which I heartily recommend everyone) then it is not a tip but a fee. In my book a "tip" is an unrequested gratuity freely given to reward good service.[/QUOTE]Agreeing.

It all goes down to wording. The English poor working girls with limited vocabulary use the word tip as probably originated from years ago with USA Troops.

It sounds nicer than fee or payment.

They feel being gifted and not paid.

So they don't feel being hookers.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1822164]Airport to a hotel somewhere between Nana and Asoke Skytrain stations would be about 400 baht maximum including tolls, even when traffic is dense.

A tip is not necessary, nor expected except for waiving return of some small change.

Only when the driver does something exceptional (carry your very heavy luggage into the hotel or such) can a tip be considered. Otherwise, don't do it. It paints you with a big "stupid farang" sign.[/QUOTE]You won't tip a guy who spent an hour hauling your lard ass but you will tip some ***** in Crazy House who spends 5 minutes bringing you a beer.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1823274] Hospital name sounds strange. I guess Bangkok Hospital in Phuket?[/QUOTE]Yeah in Phuket. I had rented a bike so went all the way there for international quality treatment rather than suffer the local witch doctors.
I posted here on the BKK thread as the context came up and to address the concern of the OP.
P.

[QUOTE=BionicMan;1823314]Agreeing.

It all goes down to wording. The English poor working girls with limited vocabulary use the word tip as probably originated from years ago with USA Troops.

It sounds nicer than fee or payment.

They feel being gifted and not paid.

So they don't feel being hookers.[/QUOTE]There also is some ambiguity in the word "tip. " It is sometimes defined as a "gratuity" yet there are many restaurants in the US That impose a mandatory 17 or 18 percent "gratuity" on parties of five or six or more. Not exactly voluntary. .

But I'm not sure it matters much what a bar girl in a third-world or emerging-economy country whose native language isn't English calls it when speaking English. Just don't put unreasonable pressure on me to give unreasonable whatevers. But as service warrants, I'll give reasonable whatevers after the fact or in some cases negotiate services in advance in exchange for whatevers.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1823274]I guess you must have been BB to get such a fright. With condom, I would not have been slightest bit worried. STDs are not the only cause of bleeds, and probably a minor cause. Hospital name sounds strange. I guess Bangkok Hospital in Phuket?[/QUOTE]Bangkok Hospital has hospitals in 40 locations throughout Thailand. I'm not sure whether they all carry the name Bangkok Hospital though although I would guess some do, including some outside of Bangkok.

[URL]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bangkok_Hospital[/URL]

[QUOTE=RoamingViking;1823026] Later that evening I picked up this lovely 19-year old in the Nana Car Park (Mee or Mi) but the experience was not much to brag about. ... She relieved me of 1200 baht, down from the 1500 baht they all seem to be asking these days. At least they all seem willing to negotiate, something I am usually reluctant to do because it creates bad vibes from the beginning. But they usually are the first to offer to go for less when they notice that I seem taken aback by the price.[/QUOTE]Last couple of times at Nana Car Park I've been quoted for 1000 right away without negotiation. I'm usually there on the later side around 1 am. Last week chose a girl who looked like mid to late 20's, looked mixed-Chinese and said she was from Bangkok and that her name was Lek. Good attitude, great BBBJ and a fun fuck.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1823280]Its called the carrot and the stick principal. You can reward a girl for doing good, not for being lousy. That is so obvious.

A negotiated tip, is not a tip at all, it's a negotiated price for a specific service. You can't exactly negotiate for the girl having a good attitude, giving a GFE, working hard, being capable of deep throat etc. I don't bother to negotiate for specific services anyway. Either she is happy to do them as part of good service or she is not. Others want specific things. Fine negotiate for it, not related to tipping.[/QUOTE]But giving an un-discussed tip afterwards does not work as a carrot since they never knew it was there and had no idea something extra was available to them if they had done this or that or done it better. Not sure what the "stick" is in your analogy either. Is it some kind of punishment for not even going in the direction you wanted? Of course, I understand it with regards to donkeys. But not sure what you mean with regard to the P4 P scene. Elaborate if you wish.

However, you are right in that what I am talking about is unrelated to giving the girl an un-discussed bonus afterwards, what is classically considered a tip, because I don't recommend doing that. Actually, I recommend against it. Note: I am not using your word "negotiated" tip, which simply becomes part of the fee, as you said. An additional amount for certain services discussed upfront or less if those services are refused is what I recommend. That is not the same as a final amount that has been negotiated or settled upfront.

The downsides for the P4 P scene in general and customers individually for handing out un-discussed tips afterwards are far greater than any upsides for doing it that I have ever heard. I fully expect there is a lot more un-discussed, after-the-fact tipping going on out there since the prevalence of personal computers and websites like this one were set up where doing so has been framed as customary or the right thing to do. And I don't believe that the decline in service quality out there during that same time span is purely coincidental. In fact, I would argue that the former is in no small part causal of the latter or at least a major factor in causing and exacerbating it.

On the other hand, discussing with the girl upfront what would earn her more money vs less money has plenty of upsides going for it with no significant downsides that I can see.

[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1823360]Bangkok Hospital has hospitals in 40 locations throughout Thailand. I'm not sure whether they all carry the name Bangkok Hospital though although I would guess some do, including some outside of Bangkok.

[URL]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bangkok_Hospital[/URL][/QUOTE]Excellent Hosp. , meets or even exceeds western standards in terms of decor hygiene and medical equipment. I've been there twice, once due to a minor accident years back.

[QUOTE=JesseJames;1823344]You won't tip a guy who spent an hour hauling your lard ass but you will tip some ***** in Crazy House who spends 5 minutes bringing you a beer.[/QUOTE]I [B]pay[/B] the taxi guy for his service, which is driving me safely to my destination.

I [B]tip[/B] the bar girl if she does more than simply bring me my drink.

The horrible US custom of expected "tips" for waiters or other service people is terrible and should be universally banned. Pay your people a decent wage to start with and they don't have to beg.

[QUOTE=JesseJames;1823344]You won't tip a guy who spent an hour hauling your lard ass but you will tip some ***** in Crazy House who spends 5 minutes bringing you a beer.[/QUOTE]I have a special waitress in CH that looks after me damn good, including arranging to move me to better seating at first opportunity. Yes I tip her. Not a problem for me. She knows its very worthwhile to look after me real special. Obviously some of the other staff are a bit envious. They look forward to a day when my waitress is not there, so someone else gets a chance to look after me special. Some staff blow it by asking for a drink or tip before giving me any special service. I don't go for that at all, and like *****man, I don't like persistent hassling. I also do not like any waitress standing in front of me blocking my view.

My waitress clearly spends a lot more than 5 minutes looking after me. No she doesn't go so far as to suck my cock. She may warn me about bad character girls, though. She is a mother of more than one and older so her body is apparently not good enough to be a dancer, however she does have big tits (purely by coincidence).

I will tip anyone making a special effort for me, or if they are at least very nice and "deserve" more than what they normally receive (in my personal opinion) of course. I am not a very selfish type. Even if I will never see the same taxi driver again, it doesn't hurt me to give a small tip to reward him for his good work, in making my trip pleasurable. That is just me. Anything that I evaluate as rather too expensive, I am unlikely to tip. E. g. Suppose a soapy girl costs 4 K She would have to be very damn good to get an extra tip. I haven't met anyone that good lately. Suppose a BJ bar girl costs 1. 7 K for special room FS. I know she gets only half of that (maybe). Its no big deal to help her with a tip for making my stay so nice. I am sure her service will be at lest equally good next time.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1823722]
The horrible US custom of expected "tips" for waiters or other service people is terrible and should be universally banned. Pay your people a decent wage to start with and they don't have to beg.[/QUOTE]Yes and pay the Thai police force properly so they do not need to be corrupt to make a living.

Useful discussion. Whats the kind of tipping you guys are talking about with a go-go waitress? I've been tipping the 20 B change at times on my recent trip. For nothing and I think I will stop. Unless she does something extra for me.

Sometimes I've had no choice but to tip the gal as I forgot to keep change and only had 2 x 1000 B for a 1500 B service, and the gal only fished out a couple of 100's from her purse with a lame face (hiding her delight of course). At 2 am in the morning not much choice.

P.

[QUOTE=PeeMan;1824092]Useful discussion. Whats the kind of tipping you guys are talking about with a go-go waitress? I've been tipping the 20 B change at times on my recent trip. For nothing and I think I will stop. Unless she does something extra for me.
[/QUOTE]The small change I always leave on the plate, otherwise you are seen as stingy. A *real* tip for a agogo waitress is 50 or 100 baht depending on what she did for you.

[QUOTE=PeeMan;1824092]
Sometimes I've had no choice but to tip the gal as I forgot to keep change and only had 2 x 1000 B for a 1500 B service, and the gal only fished out a couple of 100's from her purse with a lame face (hiding her delight of course). At 2 am in the morning not much choice.
[/QUOTE]That's a matter of Force Majeure or of not being prepared well.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1824011]Yes and pay the Thai police force properly so they do not need to be corrupt to make a living.[/QUOTE]Absolutely and not only the Thai police. But then they will have to raise taxes to pay the police (and other civil servants) a decent wage and that money will also come out of your pocket.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1824011]Yes and pay the Thai police force properly so they do not need to be corrupt to make a living.[/QUOTE]To be honest I don't think corruption will stop if the police gets a decent wage. Lack of means is not the only reason for corruption. The abuse of power will continue.

[QUOTE=Mogwai;1824111]To be honest I don't think corruption will stop if the police gets a decent wage. Lack of means is not the only reason for corruption. The abuse of power will continue.[/QUOTE]A decent wage is a first step, but it will take much more and a few generations to change it.

I used to visit Thailand frequently when I was working in Hanoi and enjoyed myself a lot with girls in their 20's and 30's but now after experiencing some more mature friends I would like to repeat the experience on my next visit to Bangkok. Has anybody and suggestions where its best to look for more mature ladies in their 40's and 50's.

Thanks.

[QUOTE=Riverstar;1824158]I used to visit Thailand frequently when I was working in Hanoi and enjoyed myself a lot with girls in their 20's and 30's but now after experiencing some more mature friends I would like to repeat the experience on my next visit to Bangkok. Has anybody and suggestions where its best to look for more mature ladies in their 40's and 50's.

Thanks.[/QUOTE]Beer Garten or some of the smaller massage shops.

Social Media or dating sites such as ThaiFriendly.

BJ bars also seem to have their share of more mature ladies.

From time to time even an agogo club may have them. They may still look like 35 but are likely to be early 40.

[QUOTE=Riverstar;1824158]I used to visit Thailand frequently when I was working in Hanoi and enjoyed myself a lot with girls in their 20's and 30's but now after experiencing some more mature friends I would like to repeat the experience on my next visit to Bangkok. Has anybody and suggestions where its best to look for more mature ladies in their 40's and 50's.

Thanks.[/QUOTE]Kaintuck seems to have handle on that.

[QUOTE=Riverstar;1824158]I used to visit Thailand frequently when I was working in Hanoi and enjoyed myself a lot with girls in their 20's and 30's but now after experiencing some more mature friends I would like to repeat the experience on my next visit to Bangkok. Has anybody and suggestions where its best to look for more mature ladies in their 40's and 50's.

Thanks.[/QUOTE]Just go to Pattaya: Beach Road, the Beer Bars on Sois 7, 8, Dainba, Bukhao and Lengkee; Red Car Disco on WS. There is no shortage of these girls. You will be in Paradise.

Have fun!

Uncle-V.

PS: if you are still set on doing your mongering in BKK, Beer Garden will be a gold mine for you. Some of the discos like Bangkok Beat, Levels, Insanity, Climaxx, and Mixx are also full of older ladies. You may also want to stop into Oscar's, the bar/restaurant right across the street form Levels for a place for a mellower more mature vibe. Lots of 40 year olds there too.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1823677]But giving an un-discussed tip afterwards does not work as a carrot since they never knew it was there and had no idea something extra was available to them if they had done this or that or done it better.[/QUOTE]In another thread (or was it this one?) there was a discussion of the amazing memories for customers many of these girls have. Now if you are planning on only going to a particular venue once never to return, you are undoubtedly correct that you don't get anything tangible by leaving a tip after the session. However, if you are going to return to the venue, and this is particularly true of the smaller venues, a tip given to one girl there previously could represent "a carrot" even with a different girl because not only do the girls tend to have good memories, but they talk to each other about their customers.

Actually, I don't think about tipping in these terms, I just do it when I feel it is appropriate or well-earned, whether we are talking about in the P4 P arena or elsewhere. But if one is talking theoretically about whether a tip after a session could logically serve as a carrot, the answer is "yes" if one plans on returning to the same venue.

[QUOTE=Kajos;1823468]Last couple of times at Nana Car Park I've been quoted for 1000 right away without negotiation. I'm usually there on the later side around 1 am. Last week chose a girl who looked like mid to late 20's, looked mixed-Chinese and said she was from Bangkok and that her name was Lek. Good attitude, great BBBJ and a fun fuck.[/QUOTE]Indeed, I'm always quoted 1000 at Nana Park.

[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1824886]Snip. Actually, I don't think about tipping in these terms, I just do it when I feel it is appropriate or well-earned, whether we are talking about in the P4 P arena or elsewhere. But if one is talking theoretically about whether a tip after a session could logically serve as a carrot, the answer is "yes" if one plans on returning to the same venue.[/QUOTE]One problem with tipping is that the original price plus the tip becomes the new price of what the girl expects for the service next time. If you don't tip the next time, she will be unhappy, and you will be worse off than if you had never tipped her in the first place.

[QUOTE=JimmyBoy99;1824926]One problem with tipping is that the original price plus the tip becomes the new price of what the girl expects for the service next time. If you don't tip the next time, she will be unhappy, and you will be worse off than if you had never tipped her in the first place.[/QUOTE]Worse off? Not really. I always make it clear to a girl, if giving a tip beyond the agree price, that I don't tip the same amount every time.

It depends on how hard she had to work for me, how hard she tried, and how much money I have on me at the time. I try to make sure I have plenty of not so large notes so that the tip can be adjusted to fair figure. Even a dumb girl can understand that she might get a different tip for a different amount of work. Some days I take a very long time to cum, but not always. If you think you are forced to tip the same amount each time, then you are being manipulated.

If original price is fair, I don't need to tip. I don't always tip as a matter of course. It depends. I rarely tip go go bar girls or high priced Soapy girls, but girls getting a low amount at certain shops, like BJ shops, Annies, etc. , I am much more likely to tip for hard work and a good service.

[QUOTE=Monsieur1875;1824907]Indeed, I'm always quoted 1000 at Nana Park.[/QUOTE]I found one very attractive girl in the Soi (not at the carpark) opposite Hillary 4. She mentioned two prices to me. Seemed to depend on how long the session would be. I gather I would not get two hours for 1 K. She was a lot hotter than most of the girls there. I only found that one that I wanted to talk to, and just collected her number for a future meet, since had just sessioned at Annies and not ready for another round. Was a little hard to check out how good her body was on street with clothes on. So I was slightly concerned in case she had a bigger belly than I imagined, etc. However no worse than picking a girl at over dressed places like Addict MP, for example. Her name appeared to be "Fun" as in good fun, if I heard correctly. I mention the name just in case anyone has tried her. Pretty face. I will probably try her eventually.

Had to be very watchful for possible LBs in this area. Occasionally hard to tell just by looking at girls sitting down, without seeing them walk and hearing the voice.

[QUOTE=Riverstar;1824158]I used to visit Thailand frequently when I was working in Hanoi and enjoyed myself a lot with girls in their 20's and 30's but now after experiencing some more mature friends I would like to repeat the experience on my next visit to Bangkok. Has anybody and suggestions where its best to look for more mature ladies in their 40's and 50's.

Thanks.[/QUOTE]Riverstar, you will hit a jackpot in BKK if mature / old ladies is what you are looking for. You can start from Hillary and all other bars on Soi 4 outside NEP. You can than move on to Soi 11 massage places besides Ambassador Hotel. Along the way you can peek into any sportsbar and will find few mature ones hanging around pool tables. Beergarden is another old and favorite spot to find women in the age range you are looking for.

Queens Entertainment Plaza, cluster of small bars on Soi 22 is full of older women. Also the small bars dotted on the soi hold good potential for you.

Though the list is almost endless you surely won't be disappointed.

[QUOTE=DCups;1824224]Kaintuck seems to have handle on that.[/QUOTE]There is one of his models that is very nice, but the rest are great if you enjoy portly ladies. Build for comfort not for speed. I like the athletic body example, swimmer or tennis player type. I do not care for these skinny spinners. Give me something I can dig my teeth into.

RL.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1824109]Absolutely and not only the Thai police. But then they will have to raise taxes to pay the police (and other civil servants) a decent wage and that money will also come out of your pocket.[/QUOTE]You are touching on a system tradition of police motivation. They won't enforce the laws if they get paid well. They need to be hungry and need money and then they will do there duty as Police officers. This is true is all SEA countries. You can really see it in Bali, where anytime there is a ceremony or religious holiday coming, the Police are out in force looking for extra money.

RL.

I am not sharing all the details here, sorry. It just serves as an example of "if you look, you will find".

I was in a hotel in an even-numbered soi about two years ago. On my way to and from the nearest Skytrain I would regularly walk past a small cluster of ordinary-looking massage parlors.

You know the kind. Several ladies in their late-20's to late-40's outside, mostly dressed in a sort of uniform, a handful of comfy chairs inside for foot massages and manicures.

A floor upstairs for Thai massages and. Oil massages. After a couple of days of passing the same handful of shops I had noticed a nice looking but by no account stunning massage therapist in one of these shops. In the end I relented and said "Yes, how about an oil massage". We went upstairs, which was actually two floors up, with 5 "cubicles" for massages. Wooden partitions about 2 meters / 6. 5 ft high, each with a massage bed. I showered and laid down naked on the bed, getting ready for my massage.

It was a good massage. After about 30 minutes she started teasing me a bit, and I was getting excited. This was at the time she asked me to turn over. We were chatting and having a very pleasant time. Fairly soon after the flip my erection was. Just out there. Nowhere to hide. The lady, whom I had now figured was late-30's and attractive in a plain sort of way, was very playful. She was wearing this uniform which had these traditional Thai trousers held up with a belt made of fabric. I had figured out how the belt worked and yanked at it. Her trousers simply fell to the floor.

Underneath she was just wearing a very nice black g-string. Somewhat unusual in my experience. This also made me think that more was available. After a few minutes of her oiling up my erect penis and some playful talk I started to gently remove her g-string underwear. It was just a matter of seconds until the g-string was on the floor. Then she sat on top of me, and rubbed her pussy against my hard cock. She was neatly trimmed but not shaved. She was getting really wet as she was grinding herself against me. This must have gone on for ten minutes. I was really enjoying it.

Suddenly I just slipped inside. She was wet. And tight. And she rode med like I have never been ridden before. It was all the more exciting since there were people getting regular massages in the cubicles next to ours. We had to be quiet. What can I say. I never meant to bareback her but it just happened. And she was in charge all the time.

So this was two years ago. Since then I have been back numerous times, every 3 or 4 months, most recently two weeks ago. And it's equally exciting every time. A nice, fairly plain looking thai lady with a slim, tight body who was not late 30's but very early 40's. A grandmother.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1824995]Worse off? Not really. I always make it clear to a girl, if giving a tip beyond the agree price, that I don't tip the same amount every time. Snip[/QUOTE]I doubt that most guys are as careful in explaining their tipping policy to the girl as you are; they probably just hand them the money without explanation or suggestion that it may not be repeated, in that amount, or at all.

[QUOTE=JimmyBoy99;1825128]I doubt that most guys are as careful in explaining their tipping policy to the girl as you are; they probably just hand them the money without explanation or suggestion that it may not be repeated, in that amount, or at all.[/QUOTE]I have met the odd girl that reminded me what I tipped last time. I just say that I don't tip exactly the same every time. Only 6 words in Thai required.

Sometimes I might say the reason for the tip, e. G. Thanks for the extra hard work, or I had an extra good time today.

It gets more tricky when there was no agreed price "up to you". I don't even remember what I paid last time always, so may be inconsistent but always fair.

First: Thanks a lot to the members of this forum who graciously commented on my last post, it greatly helped.

[B]Agencies:[/B]

[I]A. Myprincessbangkok: [/I]

1. Toey, tall and sound and friendly, more than decent service although not extremely enthusiastic. 24 h.

2. Toto is lovely, quiet and delicate, but very responsive and persistent if treated like a true princess. 24 h.

3. Jasmin, just 2 hours. Much better than the pictures. I would say she's a 10, though others might have a different opinion. She took command of the situation and I was happy to let her be the boss. Female bosses in other lines of work could take a short course with Jasmin and learn how employees can be made to happily abide to nearly everything.

[I]B. Pure Bangkok Escort: [/I]

4. Kim: We had Indian food, went for a massage, and then a dip in the pool in the hotel garden. In the jacuzzi, the business got increasingly risky, guards pretending not to look but there is a limit even with a swimsuit on. In bed she was quite open-minded. She forgot her swimsuit but I'm taking care of it honey. You'll get it back. 24 h.

[B]Soapies:[/B]

[I]A. The Lord: [/I]

5. Picked the most expensive girl. Model looks, 26, very smooth skin, extraordinarily small and well-shaped butt and impossible not to rim her, the oldest ever for this kind of activity for my part. Went back another day but nothing of interest, very few ladies present.

[I]B. Nataree[/I]

6. Very sweet and kissable 18 year-old.

7. Beautiful, FK girl.

8. An 18 year-old from China, slim, sweet and agreeable. Enjoying all of her really small girly parts. Very slow, very long-lasting.

[I]C. Ceasar:[/I] not much to see.

[I]D. Emanuelle[/I]

9. Jackpot. Nr. 1 XL to be specific. Looked like a Victoria's Secret model. Had worked for a week. Well who knows. What started in the jacuzzi finished in bed. Very comfortable, FK.

[B]Massage parlors[/B]

[I]A. Miku:[/I] A high-end, nearly perfect soapie.

10. I chose May, a small and continuously smiling student girl. An irresistible mix of innocence and eager naughtiness. A very oily massage and as slippery as it can get, and again. Clean surroundings and a very friendly place.

[I]B. Thonglor:[/I] All ladies were 25 or more.

[I]C: Addict:[/I] the talent lined up in their neat air hostess uniforms. Who cannot smile at the sight!

11. Chose Sofia, a tall, slim lady with exotic features, looks different from Sofia at the website. A decent GFE with rimming and cautious FK.

[B]GoGos:[/B]

[I]A: CH[/I]

12: Saw her during my stay in September, she was just as sweet and lovely this time, but the new encounter did not add much.

13. Nazule, brought from the same den, very sweet but new and a little bit nervous and couldn't compare to the ones I had already seen.

14. One of the ladies at CH girl was displaying her bum particularly provocatively. She fell asleep seconds after falling prone to the bed in my hotel room. I admired her bottom, then curled up beside her in the space that was left. Fantastically sweet and slim girl, outlandish, with rimming and much more, before breakfast the next day. She ordered dishes uncritically, but touched very little of it. Born late 1996.

15. Gang Gaew, number 40. A well-known legend. Close to the perfect girl with her small butt and beautiful rounded breasts. Very sweet in every way. I was running out of time so had to rush more than I like. DFK, rimming and everything I could want. Warning: She is being served too many drinks at CH so please order water for her or soon she will become ill, not just regularly sick as is the case now.

[I]B. Dollhouse[/I]

Small girls in birthday suits. Tried to bring a coyote, to no avail. Nearly deserted during my second visit.

[I]C. Baccara:[/I] a lot of pretties to watch, hordes of sweet and small girls.

[I]D. Tilac:[/I] nothing special.

[I]E. Afterskool:[/I] almost nobody during my two visits.

[I]F. Suzie Wong:[/I] Fluorescent, rainbow-colored flowers on female skin, dancing in the dark.

16. Brought another 18 year-old to the hotel, the slimmest of them all. Most memorable moment: When chatting with a coyote and her together in the bar, they both took a good grasp and after a short internal meeting they agreed that the size was acceptable.

Went back the next day for the show only. Worth every minute. Flowers can appear from unexpected places.

Mia Nois:

17. Spent two nights and three days with my sweetheart. Oh, her stories, not 1001 yet but might get there one day.

The success rate of this trip was above 90 percent as far as my knowledge of BKK goes. I can't imagine realistically having a better week there, so why ever go back. Well, come to think about it, I will.

[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1824886]In another thread (or was it this one?) there was a discussion of the amazing memories for customers many of these girls have. Now if you are planning on only going to a particular venue once never to return, you are undoubtedly correct that you don't get anything tangible by leaving a tip after the session. However, if you are going to return to the venue, and this is particularly true of the smaller venues, a tip given to one girl there previously could represent "a carrot" even with a different girl because not only do the girls tend to have good memories, but they talk to each other about their customers.

Actually, I don't think about tipping in these terms, I just do it when I feel it is appropriate or well-earned, whether we are talking about in the P4 P arena or elsewhere. But if one is talking theoretically about whether a tip after a session could logically serve as a carrot, the answer is "yes" if one plans on returning to the same venue.[/QUOTE]Really? I wouldn't put much stock in what a P4 P girl says about a customer and doubt any of the other girls in a particular venue do either. Not saying they don't talk. But there are better ways for the girls to know if the talker felt she got a fair deal or not no matter what impression she tried to give them; rushing to intercept him the next time he enters the bar, for example.

Can't imagine too many bargirls accepting as the truth whatever they hear from a co-worker about a previous customer who walks into a bar again vs the body language she exhibits.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1825324]Really? I wouldn't put much stock in what a P4 P girl says about a customer and doubt any of the other girls in a particular venue do either. Not saying they don't talk. But there are better ways for the girls to know if the talker felt she got a fair deal or not no matter what impression she tried to give them; rushing to intercept him the next time he enters the bar, for example.

Can't imagine too many bargirls accepting as the truth whatever they hear from a co-worker about a previous customer who walks into a bar again vs the body language she exhibits.[/QUOTE]My point that giving a tip to a P4 P girl after a session could at least theoretically represent a "carrot" for some girl on a customer's next visit to the same venue does not depend on whether the girls communicate verbally to each other about their customers, or instead communicate non-verbally about their customers. I don't see what point you are trying to make in differentiating between the two.

[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1825354]My point that giving a tip to a P4 P girl after a session could at least theoretically represent a "carrot" for some girl on a customer's next visit to the same venue does not depend on whether the girls communicate verbally to each other about their customers, or instead communicate non-verbally about their customers. I don't see what point you are trying to make in differentiating between the two.[/QUOTE]And I agree with you. It may not work in Bangkok but I have seen this elsewhere. I have been the lucky recipient of such communications in other mongering places. Therefore, I assume it does not hurt to be generous and it may help your case, even in Bangkok.

[QUOTE=Lysmar;1825171]First: Thanks a lot to the members of this forum who graciously commented on my last post, it greatly helped.

17. Spent two nights and three days with my sweetheart. Oh, her stories, not 1001 yet but might get there one day.

The success rate of this trip was above 90 percent as far as my knowledge of BKK goes. I can't imagine realistically having a better week there, so why ever go back. Well, come to think about it, I will.[/QUOTE]Absolutely perfect report: Keep up the good work mate.

Enjoy life to the fullest like you have just done and write about you maybe 20 years down the line you will just smile reading all this.

Alex

[QUOTE=Lysmar;1825171] Suzie Wong: 16. Brought another 18 year-old to the hotel, the slimmest of them all. Most memorable moment: When chatting with a coyote and her together in the bar, they both took a good grasp and after a short internal meeting they agreed that the size was acceptable.[/QUOTE]Coyotes in Suzie Wong? Damm, my favorite agogo club has gone to the Dark Side!

[QUOTE=Lysmar;1825171]

The success rate of this trip was above 90 percent as far as my knowledge of BKK goes. I can't imagine realistically having a better week there, so why ever go back. Well, come to think about it, I will.[/QUOTE]Wow! This sounds like a trip for the record books. Nicely done! Great report too. Succinct and sweet. Almost as if it was written in in haiku form.

[QUOTE=HarryDude;1825122]I am not sharing all the details here, sorry. It just serves as an example of "if you look, you will find".

I was in a hotel in an even-numbered soi about two years ago. On my way to and from the nearest Skytrain I would regularly walk past a small cluster of ordinary-looking massage parlors.

You know the kind. Several ladies in their late-20's to late-40's outside, mostly dressed in a sort of uniform, a handful of comfy chairs inside for foot massages and manicures.

A floor upstairs for Thai massages and. Oil massages. After a couple of days of passing the same handful of shops I had noticed a nice looking but by no account stunning massage therapist in one of these shops. In the end I relented and said "Yes, how about an oil massage". We went upstairs, which was actually two floors up, with 5 "cubicles" for massages. Wooden partitions about 2 meters / 6. 5 ft high, each with a massage bed. I showered and laid down naked on the bed, getting ready for my massage.

It was a good massage. After about 30 minutes she started teasing me a bit, and I was getting excited. This was at the time she asked me to turn over. We were chatting and having a very pleasant time. Fairly soon after the flip my erection was. Just out there. Nowhere to hide. The lady, whom I had now figured was late-30's and attractive in a plain sort of way, was very playful. She was wearing this uniform which had these traditional Thai trousers held up with a belt made of fabric. I had figured out how the belt worked and yanked at it. Her trousers simply fell to the floor.

Underneath she was just wearing a very nice black g-string. Somewhat unusual in my experience. This also made me think that more was available. After a few minutes of her oiling up my erect penis and some playful talk I started to gently remove her g-string underwear. It was just a matter of seconds until the g-string was on the floor. Then she sat on top of me, and rubbed her pussy against my hard cock. She was neatly trimmed but not shaved. She was getting really wet as she was grinding herself against me. This must have gone on for ten minutes. I was really enjoying it.

Suddenly I just slipped inside. She was wet. And tight. And she rode med like I have never been ridden before. It was all the more exciting since there were people getting regular massages in the cubicles next to ours. We had to be quiet. What can I say. I never meant to bareback her but it just happened. And she was in charge all the time.

So this was two years ago. Since then I have been back numerous times, every 3 or 4 months, most recently two weeks ago. And it's equally exciting every time. A nice, fairly plain looking thai lady with a slim, tight body who was not late 30's but very early 40's. A grandmother.[/QUOTE]I think I know where you are talking about. I used to hit one of those massage places a few years ago and 9 times out of 10 I got FS from the lady. Of course there was a fee. But ever since I started to get twenty-somthings at the line of shops between ski 11 and 13 for 1,000 to 1,400, I stopped going. While I have no comment to make about your practices, I personally would never bareback any of those less than professional ladies where you go because it is often they who have something from a local boyfriend.

Many or perhaps most of the massage places especially from ski 30 back are up for something. I went to a regular massage place, cannot remember where exactly but nowhere near Nana or the sois around 24 - the place gave off a no-extras vibe with large foreigners getting foot massage downstairs and that is what I expected. Upstairs for an oil massage and it appeared that nothing was on offer. The lady was a bit older than I originally thought but the massage was technically excellent as a no-extras version.

I had no expectations of anything extra but then the young guy who had gone ahead of me and booked a real spinner started up in the next cubicle. It was as clear as day what was going on. He did not take long but he shook the whole wooden divider with his thrusting My lady started to giggle, so did I and the pair of us where putting towels and pillows over our mouths trying to suppress our laughter. That broke the ice and what transpired was one of the better slow fucks that I have had in a while for 1,000 baht.

I always wonder about these massage places which are legit or seemingly so. I remember that a few years ago I could always get FS in legit massage places if I went there a few times and put up with a HJ each time until the girl got used to me and trusted me.

My experience is that most places offer specials although they may not advertise it outright. I have had it happen where you go for a regular massage but go extended time such as the two hour massage. If you get a private room and are trusted you should be able to succeed in your conquest. Now, this is in the tourist area I am speaking about but I would assume just about anywhere. I will update this further in the coming months.

[QUOTE=Lysmar;1825171]
15. Gang Gaew, number 40. A well-known legend. Close to the perfect girl with her small butt and beautiful rounded breasts. Very sweet in every way. I was running out of time so had to rush more than I like. DFK, rimming and everything I could want. Warning: She is being served too many drinks at CH so please order water for her or soon she will become ill, not just regularly sick as is the case now.
[/QUOTE]That would be Ging Gaew. Girls have to learn to regulate their drinks themselves. Lady drink can be a Coke or a mix of coke and soda. I have not had a problem with Ging being drunk, nor seen her regularly sick. Could be a new development, or perhaps some customers try to insist on tequilas, I don't know. I have had problems with other girls being drunk sometimes.

Guys should really gauge how much alcohol is ideal for girls to make them wilder. 2 drinks is more than enough for some girls not used to alcohol. A little more for experienced drinkers. Some girls drink Yaa Dong out the front of the bar to cure their inhibitions. Popular girls like Ging would not need to do that. With me, Ging did not always order Tequilas. Did choose some non alcoholic drinks. That was mid December. She had been missing a lot.

Can I ask why 3 girls from My Princess, and one from Pure Escorts? Why was My princess favoured over other agencies? Were Escort girls significantly better than girls from other venues? I could not see a pic of Jasmine on web site. I guess you have high standards for looks, but were all the escorts pretty enough? Toey for example, looks a bit ordinary to me. I prefer Toto's look.

[QUOTE=Lysmar;1825171]First: Thanks a lot to the members of this forum who graciously commented on my last post, it greatly helped.

The success rate of this trip was above 90 percent as far as my knowledge of BKK goes. I can't imagine realistically having a better week there, so why ever go back. Well, come to think about it, I will.[/QUOTE]Outstanding report, thanks. Keep up the great work. 17 hits in 7 days is more than a solid average. Very impressive.

[QUOTE=Lysmar;1825171]

1. Toey, tall and sound and friendly, more than decent service although not extremely enthusiastic. 24 h.

[/QUOTE]Toey looks a lot like a 18 yo cutie I had met in July 2015 at Siam Paragon. The resemblance is spectacular. I carefully looked at all the images on the site. My girl's name was Paphawee Saisema and she was a student at Chulongkorn Univ then studying Pharma Sciences. She stayed with me for 3 days. We keep in touch but I have not been back to BKK since then. Maybe sisters, maybe more. But I must say, Toey looks an excellent choice. Out of curiosity I ask this. The website does not show a tick against Full Service (covered), meaning no sex offered. Surely this is a typo? 5555.

[QUOTE=Lysmar;1825171]
15. Gang Gaew, number 40. A well-known legend. Close to the perfect girl with her small butt and beautiful rounded breasts. Very sweet in every way. I was running out of time so had to rush more than I like. DFK, rimming and everything I could want. Warning: She is being served too many drinks at CH so please order water for her or soon she will become ill, not just regularly sick as is the case now.

[/QUOTE]Ahhhh. Ging Gaew! <3 <3 <3.

[QUOTE=Lysmar;1825171]
[I]A. Miku:[/I] A high-end, nearly perfect soapie.

[/QUOTE]You mean Mitu?

[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1825354]My point that giving a tip to a P4 P girl after a session could at least theoretically represent a "carrot" for some girl on a customer's next visit to the same venue does not depend on whether the girls communicate verbally to each other about their customers, or instead communicate non-verbally about their customers. I don't see what point you are trying to make in differentiating between the two.[/QUOTE]But you said it could represent a "carrot" even with other girls in the same venue because they talk. That was what I resonded to. Not sure what you mean about differentiating between two points.

[QUOTE=Lefeu;1825356]And I agree with you. It may not work in Bangkok but I have seen this elsewhere. I have been the lucky recipient of such communications in other mongering places. Therefore, I assume it does not hurt to be generous and it may help your case, even in Bangkok.[/QUOTE]Wouldn't you think the positive response you got on subsequent visits re money was really about the total amount you gave a girl rather than that a small portion of it came in the form of a surprise, undiscussed bonus amount on her way out the door?

I can not deny that being generous can have its benefits and would work as a "carrot". But I see many more downsides and scant few if any upsides in giving a small portion of it as an after the fact "tip" on the way out.

Mind you, I'm not talking about coming up with a couple hundred baht more in response to a girl's sob story about her family's sick buffalo or how long a taxi ride she has ahead of her, which is an entirely different kind of generosity but some guys catagorize that as a "tip" for good service all the same.

I wrote several weeks ago about my experience with a girl reputedly from Madagascar. I received a number of responses both private and on this thread seeking contact information. I was reluctant to provide, first because this girl seemed a bit flaky and difficult to get ahold of, and I selfishly wanted Round 2 before passing on her contact info. She finally texted me as to her whereabouts a few weeks ago and said she was in Pattaya so perhaps one of you found and took her off Bangkok mean streets?

I did arrange a second visit with her at my apartment on New Year's Eve morning. It was great like the first time and she stayed around a bit though still short term. She is a wild thing, for sure. I had planned on paying her 1500 Baht but did not have the right change so she lucked out with 2.000 baht.

For my last encounter, I decided to try a different tack and invited her to the movie, Star Wars. Remarkably, she had never seen any of the prior movies. We went to an early evening show and shared a comfortable barco lounger seat at the Emporium while we kissed occassionaly and snuggled. In other worlds -- a true GFE. Afterwards, we went down to the next level searching for something to eat and finally decided to have some pork skewed on a stick for a grand total of 100 baht. A cheap date (so far), indeed.

We then adjourned to my apartment where we banged away for quite sometime before falling asleep. Unfortunately, I was awaken at 4 am by my little princess who was staring into her cell phone claiming some kind of an emergency with a girlfriend.

Naturally, she insisted I get up and you can guess why. I then gave her 1500 baht, just enough to pay the minimum amount for the evening but low enough to register my dissatisfaction with the early wake up.

A few days later, I have started to receive miscellaneous short texts from her but have decided to toss this African princess back into the proverbial sea. By the way, she told me that she went to primary school in Kenya though still insists her home country is Madagascar. This may explain her fluency in English. She also said she speaks Swahili, Indo, French, and her native tongue. Mysteriously, her visa departure date continues to change. As with many girls here, their story is always changing to suit the circumstances. My first meeting it was Jan 12, then Jan 18, and the last time her departure date was Jan 25. Instead of returning to Mad, now she says she is traveling to Bali where she has been marketing her wares on previous trips. You may find her later this spring in Paddies Bar in the central Kuta area.

If anyone wants her number, please PM me for further info.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1825527]But you said it could represent a "carrot" even with other girls in the same venue because they talk. That was what I resonded to. Not sure what you mean about differentiating between two points.[/QUOTE]Okay, maybe in anticipation of your post suggesting the girls use nonverbal communication to convey their opinions of their customers rather than verbal communication, I should have said "they communicate about" rather than "they talk about" their customers. Happy now?

[QUOTE=Tomasb;1825572]I wrote several weeks ago about my experience with a girl reputedly from Madagascar.

If anyone wants her number, please PM me for further info.[/QUOTE]I really enjoyed your report on this Mad girl. Kudos to you and I am happy you had a good time with her. I tend to focus on Asian girls when I'm in Thailand. But I am sure if I lived in BKK like you do (you lucky SOB!) I'd want some variety in my mongering diet. I also like mine slimmer then the usual Africans you see. But I agree that some can be gorgeous. I had a black GF in the US that was an absolute doll. I am particularly intrigued to try Madagascar or Ethiopian girls as they have a very exotic look.

I have never been to the African club, but it sounds like great fun! However, I did go to the hip hop club Sugar (on Soi 11) when I was there in December. There were some very attractive African girls there, including some petite ones that did not have the typical sub Saharan look. The place is also friendly and cozy and the music is good and not too loud. Only down side is the 300 baht cover (but you do get a drink for that).

I did not pick up any of the Africans as I was in the mood for Thai home cooking that night and ended up going home with a cute little Kpop spinner.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1825388]Coyotes in Suzie Wong? Damm, my favorite agogo club has gone to the Dark Side![/QUOTE]I'm sorry to hear that Wolvenvacht. May the force be with you.

Maybe they should rename the place to Suzie Wrong.

[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1825610]Okay, maybe in anticipation of your post suggesting the girls use nonverbal communication to convey their opinions of their customers rather than verbal communication, I should have said "they communicate about" rather than "they talk about" their customers. Happy now?[/QUOTE]Actually, I was perfectly happy accepting the concept of "non verbal communication" being the same as "talking about it" in this context. My point was that the stars and planets would have to be aligned just so for one girl in a bar to convince another girl in the same bar that she shouldn't bother accepting a barfine offer from one of her previous customers because he didn't give her a suitable undiscussed surprise "tip" on her way out the door. Or that some other girl should jump at the offer because he did give the previous girl an undiscussed surprise "tip" on her way out the door.

First challenge would be in finding one other girl the bar believing a word the first girl had to say about it, whether it was communicated verbally or non verbally. Second challenge is that customer walking in and choosing the one girl who did fall for whatever the first girl said about him. And there is more after that.

I guess I just don't see an after the fact, undiscussed, surprise "tip" to be a breaking point for whether or not the first girl or any other girl in a bar would go with me anywhere at anytime. An effective "carrot", so to speak. Ok, I agree with you that it is theoretically possible. But so is getting struck by lightening twice in the same week.

However, there is no doubt that the total amount you pay a girl can certainly provide a "carrot" for her jumping on you or avoiding you like the plague the next time you walk in a bar. But I don't see what is magically positive about paying her a small portion of that total amount as an undiscussed "tip" at the end. But I have never argued about whether being generous has more downside than upside (although it might), just that the "tip" as I have described it here is likely to have more downsides than upsides connected to it. It is about the gesture, not about the amount of money given.

For the sake of discussion, though, let's say a girl rocks your world during a Short Time so you decide you will give her more than the discussed / negotiated baht amount, in this example let's say 2,500 baht, in the form of an undiscussed surprise "tip" of 500 baht as she is walking out the door. Then you return to that same bar a week later, she jumps all over you, presumably because this "carrot" idea worked really well, and you take her out a second time. If this time she doesn't do nearly as much for you as the first time, are you still her favorite 3,000 baht customer of the night or have you just become her new 2,500 baht customer of the night?

1. Blanquiceleste: Mitu is the correct name of the soapie. Full, covered service from Toey for sure.

2. Syzygies: I can see Jasmine is not on the website of Myprincess anymore. This agency has several sweet 18 - 22 year olds and my experience with them has always been good.

2 drinks to women is like 3 drinks to a man of equal size and Ging Gaew sure is smaller than many of us.

All girls 1-17 were 7 - 10's, mostly 8 and 9, however those preferring very white skin might have a different opinion.

The name of number 12 was age around 23 I would guess.

Thanks Uncle V. I don't know where this hip hop club Sugar is located on SOI 11. I live close by but don't recall seeing it.

Can you provide approx directions?

As far as African girls go here, they are definitely on the portly side. This girl is an exception to this rule, which was my initial attraction to her. She also has an impressive collection of hair extensions and wigs that can give her a chameleon like appearance from one time to the next.

Overall, I have not seen one African girl that comes close to her body type here. I was in KL last spring and with the exception of one girl who was from Tanzania, it was the same collection of fatties and huge booties.

Some of you may want to read [URL]http://www.internationalsexguide.info/forum/showthread.php?1421-Bangkok-Massage-Parlors-Except-TULIP-and-ANNIES!&p=1537958&viewfull=1#post1537958[/URL], my last year's post on the topic.

[QUOTE=HarryDude;1825122]I am not sharing all the details here, sorry. It just serves as an example of "if you look, you will find".

I was in a hotel in an even-numbered soi about two years ago. On my way to and from the nearest Skytrain I would regularly walk past a small cluster of ordinary-looking massage parlors.

You know the kind. Several ladies in their late-20's to late-40's outside, mostly dressed in a sort of uniform, a handful of comfy chairs inside for foot massages and manicures.

A floor upstairs for Thai massages and. Oil massages. After a couple of days of passing the same handful of shops I had noticed a nice looking but by no account stunning massage therapist in one of these shops. In the end I relented and said "Yes, how about an oil massage". We went upstairs, which was actually two floors up, with 5 "cubicles" for massages. Wooden partitions about 2 meters / 6. 5 ft high, each with a massage bed. I showered and laid down naked on the bed, getting ready for my massage.

It was a good massage. After about 30 minutes she started teasing me a bit, and I was getting excited. This was at the time she asked me to turn over. We were chatting and having a very pleasant time. Fairly soon after the flip my erection was. Just out there. Nowhere to hide. The lady, whom I had now figured was late-30's and attractive in a plain sort of way, was very playful. She was wearing this uniform which had these traditional Thai trousers held up with a belt made of fabric. I had figured out how the belt worked and yanked at it. Her trousers simply fell to the floor.

Underneath she was just wearing a very nice black g-string. Somewhat unusual in my experience. This also made me think that more was available. After a few minutes of her oiling up my erect penis and some playful talk I started to gently remove her g-string underwear. It was just a matter of seconds until the g-string was on the floor. Then she sat on top of me, and rubbed her pussy against my hard cock. She was neatly trimmed but not shaved. She was getting really wet as she was grinding herself against me. This must have gone on for ten minutes. I was really enjoying it.

Suddenly I just slipped inside. She was wet. And tight. And she rode med like I have never been ridden before. It was all the more exciting since there were people getting regular massages in the cubicles next to ours. We had to be quiet. What can I say. I never meant to bareback her but it just happened. And she was in charge all the time.

So this was two years ago. Since then I have been back numerous times, every 3 or 4 months, most recently two weeks ago. And it's equally exciting every time. A nice, fairly plain looking thai lady with a slim, tight body who was not late 30's but very early 40's. A grandmother.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Tomasb;1825697]Thanks Uncle V. I don't know where this hip hop club Sugar is located on SOI 11. I live close by but don't recall seeing it.

Can you provide approx directions?

As far as African girls go here, they are definitely on the portly side. This girl is an exception to this rule, which was my initial attraction to her. She also has an impressive collection of hair extensions and wigs that can give her a chameleon like appearance from one time to the next.

Overall, I have not seen one African girl that comes close to her body type here. I was in KL last spring and with the exception of one girl who was from Tanzania, it was the same collection of fatties and huge booties.[/QUOTE]Sure, NP my friend!

It is on the opposite side of the street from Climax Club. Right next door to the Aussie Pub / restaurant place (where the waitresses wear the yellow / green uniforms). They even have a little velvet rope and podium set up outside in the evening. Kind of funny as there's really no crowd waiting to get in. 555.

Mind you most of the black girls there were on the bigger side (but not fat like the SWs you see in Sukhumvit). There was one Serena Williams type that was very striking but that's just not my type. I also remember a few slimmer one and one particularly nice spinner with lighter skin and curly sandy colored hair that caught my attention. Some cute Thai girls in there too. And it has a nice friendly vibe. So I think its worth a look if you are in the area.

I really like your neighborhood! Climax, Levels, and Bangkok Beat all within reach. I also liked the restaurant bar Oscar's, just opposite Levels Club. A much more mellower and classier pickup scene. Though the girls are a little older and the number of really hot ones is limited. The cocktails there are also really good, as is the food.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1825388]Coyotes in Suzie Wong? Damm, my favorite agogo club has gone to the Dark Side![/QUOTE]Have to be a bit sceptical, but if has just 2 or 3 Coyote girls like Dollhouse, that are bar finable in normal manner and price, no big deal. Just means they would not be fully nude. I have BFed Dollhouse Coyote girl types. They were only Coyote by style of outfit and perhaps prettier than the rest.

Thanks Uncle V. I do remember the Sugar Club as one night I walked by and it was empty so did not enter. Perhaps, I was too early. I enjoy SOI 11 quite a bit and live on an even side SOI across on the other side of Suk. For a time, I stayed in an inexpensive hotel on SOI 11. As such, I am acquainted with Oskars though I have never been to Levels. Perhaps tonight.

I find Climax to be perfectly awful with loud music, too dark (to see the girls), and quite smoky. For me, it is also a huge fire trap with what appears to be only one legitimate exit, which pours into a narrow corridor, followed by an exit to an underground garage. Be aware of your surroundings whilst inside. It's a catastrophe waiting to happen.

Oskars offers some decent prices wine by the glass and sophisticated cocktails and the bar would not be out of place in any contemporary US or Euro city. The only difference being the generally available ladies, though, as you noted, they are a bit older than the girls you will find in Climax. One night I visited Oskars and the Thai gal sitting next to me was enjoying a glass of perfectly prepared Absinthe, which it appears she paid for on her own!

And then we have Bangkok Beat. Lately, I find it to have too many punters and not enough talent to go around. But it's ebb and flow in there sometimes. The bands could learn some new music too as they play the same tunes every night and are almost indistinguishable from one another.

Also, I received a few requests for contact info for the Mad. girl I wrote about in prior reports. I should have noted that I would only provide contact info to board members who have written reports to the forum. Two of the requests I received had written one to three reports (also asking for contact info), respectively. With such little to go on with these 'members', I am not comfortable providing additional contact details.

[QUOTE=Tomasb;1825848]I find Climax to be perfectly awful with loud music, too dark (to see the girls), and quite smoky. For me, it is also a huge fire trap with what appears to be only one legitimate exit, which pours into a narrow corridor, followed by an exit to an underground garage. Be aware of your surroundings whilst inside. It's a catastrophe waiting to happen.[/QUOTE]My hotel was located on Soi 11 during my trip to Thailand, and I stopped in on Climax during my first night in Bangkok. I had all of the same concerns you raise and drew the same conclusions. I didn't stay long because on top of everything else you mention, the place was so over crowded and packed to the gills that you could hardly move in there. God forbid there ever be a fire in that place. We'll turn on the TV one morning and learn that lots of people lost their lives! Do they even have fire marshal regulations with enforcement like we have here in the USA? Sometimes you can even see posted signs indicating the maximum occupancy allowed for a place of business, and the bouncers outside often use hand held click counters to keep track of how many patrons have been admitted. Occasionally an official may even show up to make sure that a business is following the occupancy limits.

[QUOTE=TheCane;1825851] God forbid there ever be a fire in that place. We'll turn on the TV one morning and learn that lots of people lost their lives! Do they even have fire marshal regulations with enforcement like we have here in the USA? [/QUOTE]I'm quite sure there are lots of regulations but as alwayse enforcement is something entirely different.

And speaking of fire traps, what about NEP? With those narrow stairs and only one entry / exit to the street? Imagine fire fighters trying to get in while everyone else is stampeding out? That is of course, if any fire engine can manage to get through the eternal traffic jams of Sukhumvit road.

[QUOTE=Tomasb;1825848]Thanks Uncle V. I do remember the Sugar Club as one night I walked by and it was empty so did not enter. Perhaps, I was too early. I enjoy SOI 11 quite a bit and live on an even side SOI across on the other side of Suk. For a time, I stayed in an inexpensive hotel on SOI 11. As such, I am acquainted with Oskars though I have never been to Levels. Perhaps tonight.[/QUOTE]I think you'll enjoy Levels. Though the girls are a bit older than I like there too. It's no Ibar / Insomnia. But I think it may be the best of the FL pick up spots on Soi 11.

Sugar does not get going until very late. I think it really almost an after hours type of spot.

I agree with you about Clmax. The place really is kind of a dump and most of the girls there are nothing to write home about. However, I got very lucky the night I was there and pulled a very attractive girl that works at Lords.

Happy hunting!

Uncle-V.

[QUOTE=UncleVolodya;1825936]I think you'll enjoy Levels. Though the girls are a bit older than I like there too. It's no Ibar / Insomnia. But I think it may be the best of the FL pick up spots on Soi 11.

Sugar does not get going until very late. I think it really almost an after hours type of spot.

I agree with you about Clmax. The place really is kind of a dump and most of the girls there are nothing to write home about. However, I got very lucky the night I was there and pulled a very attractive girl that works at Lords.

Happy hunting!

Uncle-V.[/QUOTE]Surprised to know that level is still going strong. Definitely it was one of the best club for me till mid 2014. Those were the days when both the rooms used to be packed to capacity on weekend. There use to be more of normal crowed then WG / FL. I have been there and number of time with my regular date Shut doors of Bed club and Q bar added to its popularity. Now I don't see that class of crowed, even the number has thinned down. It seem all want to be crowed is heading to KU DE TA these days cause all the girls I have dated now prefer to fo to KU DE TA instead to going to levels.

I feel really sorry for the club Sugar. I don't know how many time then name and management of that club has changed. Even the level management try to run it as W or WE club (Not sure of name) for few months but they failed to generate enough revenue.

I guess Level is till the king of Soi 11 if you like good music and good ambiance. Hope you enjoy you evening there and write an updated review about the same.

[QUOTE=Tomasb;1825848]Also, I received a few requests for contact info for the Mad. girl I wrote about in prior reports. I should have noted that I would only provide contact info to board members who have written reports to the forum. Two of the requests I received had written one to three reports (also asking for contact info), respectively. With such little to go on with these 'members', I am not comfortable providing additional contact details.[/QUOTE]When I once enabled PMs for the general forum, I also found I got too many annoying requests from unknown people. PMs can be a lot of hassle, unless from your buddies. If someone has a question they should ask the forum, rather than a specific person, in my view.

I never share contact details (it's a private thing). It's easier just to state girl's name and where she can be found, in reports. Bargirls and soapy girls tend to have numbers, but I hardly remember most of them.

[QUOTE=FunFilled;1825964]Surprised to know that level is still going strong...I guess Level is till the king of Soi 11 if you like good music and good ambiance. Hope you enjoy you evening there and write an updated review about the same.[/QUOTE]Thanks man. You really do know your BKK club scene! I will have to try those places you mentioned next trip.

It definitely is a WG / FL spot these days. I was a bit surprised as I had heard that it was more of a "normal" club. However there were still a lot of "normal" looking couples and groups there (including farang girls that were mos definitely not working).

Nevertheless, the quality was not all that great. The girls tended to be a bit older 30's and up. Then again maybe I st the bar a bti too high as I was lookign for something like Ibar / Insomnia in Pattaya. I did enjoy myself there and would go back.

Took some pictures of Soi 4 and Nana plaza few months ago. Golden bar below the Nana hotel is no more and hooters has taken over the spot. I still like to spend a night at Soi 4 and Nana plaza. The plaza has changed a lot during the years. The bars at Soi 4 are crowded early afternoon and fun to have a drink and watch the world go by. Later in the night the bars in the plaza fill up.

[URL]https://youtu.be/1H92-XX4i8o[/URL]

Apparently there is a short film on YouTube called Ricochet featuring David Bowie when he was in Bangkok visiting the naughty boy bars during the early 80's.

I should preface my report by first saying that I am not a big night club fan but thought I would stop in Levels Club in the Aloft Hotel at the end of SOI 11. I arrived at approx 10:30 and the crowd was thin except for the outside area. I had retreated outside to find a seat as there are virtually no seats inside unless you are ordering bottle service and reserve a table. I also left the inside portion of the club to escape the incredible din coming from the speakers, which appeared to be everywhere.

There were a few nominally attractive FL's outside and one kept trying to attract my attention. It's unlikely she was anything but a FL as my 'you so handsome' days are in my rear view mirror.

The club gradually filled up with a mixture of expats, random FL's, fat western girls, and what appeared to be quite a few rejects from the extras cast of Hangover II, plus an odd contingent of Iranians or Pakistanis strutting their stuff like it was 1999. By 11:30, I was over and out and slipped down the elevator. Incidentally, I realized while on their outdoor veranda that the Citadines Hotel sits directly across the street. One night I looked at a room there, which faced the street and the noise was deafening. Now I know where it comes from.

For what's it worth, there was no cover at 10:30 though not certain if there is one later in evening.

I also cruised through Oskars across the street. As I noted in another report, it's a decent looking resto type bar. But it seems everytime I visit that there are no places to sit so it's popular. Also, it always seems there are considerably more dudes than gals.

Finally, I decided to check out Sugar Babes a bit more closely. I stood outside peering into the abyss when an attractive blond came over and said the entry fee was 300 baht with one drink included. Since you can't see what's going on inside that was one investment I was not prepared to make.

After this cruise, I returned to my favorite haunts in 7/1. I will be posting a report in next few days.

[QUOTE=Tomasb;1826289]Apparently there is a short film on YouTube called Ricochet featuring David Bowie when he was in Bangkok visiting the naughty boy bars during the early 80's.[/QUOTE][URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gFrkpZ8i2cI[/URL]

There must be more. But, if so, it probably doesn't make anymore sense than this clip.

It was nice to see Patpong back then. Anybody know which bar that was? It sure looks familiar but I just can't place it.

[QUOTE=Tomasb;1826294]I should preface my report by first saying that I am not a big night club fan but thought I would stop in Levels Club in the Aloft Hotel at the end of SOI 11. I arrived at approx 10:30 and the crowd was thin except for the outside area. I had retreated outside to find a seat as there are virtually no seats inside unless you are ordering bottle service and reserve a table. I also left the inside portion of the club to escape the incredible din coming from the speakers, which appeared to be everywhere.

There were a few nominally attractive FL's outside and one kept trying to attract my attention. It's unlikely she was anything but a FL as my 'you so handsome' days are in my rear view mirror.

The club gradually filled up with a mixture of expats, random FL's, fat western girls, and what appeared to be quite a few rejects from the extras cast of Hangover II, plus an odd contingent of Iranians or Pakistanis strutting their stuff like it was 1999. By 11:30, I was over and out and slipped down the elevator. Incidentally, I realized while on their outdoor veranda that the Citadines Hotel sits directly across the street. One night I looked at a room there, which faced the street and the noise was deafening. Now I know where it comes from.

For what's it worth, there was no cover at 10:30 though not certain if there is one later in evening.

I also cruised through Oskars across the street. As I noted in another report, it's a decent looking resto type bar. But it seems everytime I visit that there are no places to sit so it's popular. Also, it always seems there are considerably more dudes than gals.

Finally, I decided to check out Sugar Babes a bit more closely. I stood outside peering into the abyss when an attractive blond came over and said the entry fee was 300 baht with one drink included. Since you can't see what's going on inside that was one investment I was not prepared to make.

After this cruise, I returned to my favorite haunts in 7/1. I will be posting a report in next few days.[/QUOTE]Thanks for your report Tomasb. I'm sorry that none of those places seemed to work out for you. But I think you may have had a bit better luck if you had hit them in different order: Oskars to start at 10:30, Levels after midnight, and them Sugar for late-late night (2 AM and after).

Oskars is good earlier then seems to fill up with guys as the girls leave for Levels. The other two don't really get started until very late. As for Levels I am sorry for not warning you that there is a lot of dross that you need to wade through there. But gems can be found.

I too am losing patience for the late night club scene. But, like, John Dillinger said when they asked him why he robbed banks -- "Because that's where the money is" -- I suffer through the Clubs because that's where the best FLs congregate.

I look forward to hearing more about your exploits on 7/1.

Stay horny my friend.

Uncle-V.

[QUOTE=Tomasb;1826294]I should preface my report by first saying that I am not a big night club fan but thought I would stop in Levels Club in the Aloft Hotel at the end of SOI 11. I arrived at approx 10:30 and the crowd was thin except for the outside area. I had retreated outside to find a seat as there are virtually no seats inside unless you are ordering bottle service and reserve a table. I also left the inside portion of the club to escape the incredible din coming from the speakers, which appeared to be everywhere.

There were a few nominally attractive FL's outside and one kept trying to attract my attention. It's unlikely she was anything but a FL as my 'you so handsome' days are in my rear view mirror.
[/QUOTE]"Incredible Din" is very typical for a lot of Thai discos, and even music venues like Bangkok Beat has a band too loud and distorted to be really enjoyable for old fuddy duddies like me. My problem is I cannot communicate in extremely noisy environments. Inability to separate sound from different sources. I don't like to monger extremely late at night anyway, rarely going much beyond midnight.

So in general I do not use discos. I have tried them but did not enjoy them much. One girl's favorite disco was one of the very worst for me. (it's not music, it's just thump and noise.

Some friends accompanying me to a bar like Crazy House also complained the music was too loud making the place too unpleasant for them, and therefore they left pretty quickly. I tolerate the loud music at CH (less loud than a disco) but be carefully not to sit in front of thumping speakers these days. The choice of music is far more acceptable to me though, than what we find at the discos. The DJ still spoils it a bit by turning up the thumping bass too much, and blending tracks a bit much.

I guess guys wanting freelancers may find those on the street and in beer gardens, etc. Are not of the highest quality, so then it may be necessary to tolerate clubs or discos.

So its amusing to read your complaints about the incredible din, as I find that applies to so many places in the same way. You just are not cut out to be in those type of places, is my assessment. G Clubs may be much quieter and suit you much better, unless you are trying to save money, of course.

If me, I would look for girls in other places. Temporary bars on the street is a possibility, that I have not yet used extensively. Obvious drawback is that these places are trying to sell drinks, just like any other bar or disco. However, potentially may not chew up too much money and valuable time.

Maybe someone can list some relatively quiet music entertainment venues with freelancers. Not my area of expertise at all.

[QUOTE=Tomasb;1826289]Apparently there is a short film on YouTube called Ricochet featuring David Bowie when he was in Bangkok visiting the naughty boy bars during the early 80's.[/QUOTE]I think these should be called "naughty girl bars" just to be clear. I go there for girls, anyway!

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1826598]"Incredible Din" is very typical for a lot of Thai discos, and even music venues like Bangkok Beat has a band too loud and distorted to be really enjoyable for old fuddy duddies like me. My problem is I cannot communicate in extremely noisy environments. Inability to separate sound from different sources. I don't like to monger extremely late at night anyway, rarely going much beyond midnight.[/QUOTE]And it's just not entertainment venues that are loud in Thailand. Everywhere, malls, outdoor fairs, even in some nicer restaurants, the music, PA, whatever, is way too loud. Thais seem to be able to block this out. Truthfully I have found this all over the developing world. From Latin America to Asia and I am sure the same is true in Africa. Quiet is the realm of developed nations and it is one of the main things I miss about home.

Stickman from his website refers to these bars as 'naughty boy bars' and used that as the reference point.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1826604]I think these should be called "naughty girl bars" just to be clear. I go there for girls, anyway![/QUOTE]

Yes, I lived in Peru for two years (Cusco and Lima) and the noise level everywhere is part of daily life though discos and clubs are the worst The reason I left Levels was also because I could not imagine conducting any kind of conversation in there besides sign language.

Bangkok Beat is bad too but at least it's easy to slip outside on the veranda for a respite. I actually wear earplugs when I go to any of these places and pull them out when I want to converse.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1826611]And it's just not entertainment venues that are loud in Thailand. Everywhere, malls, outdoor fairs, even in some nicer restaurants, the music, PA, whatever, is way too loud. Thais seem to be able to block this out. Truthfully I have found this all over the developing world. From Latin America to Asia and I am sure the same is true in Africa. Quiet is the realm of developed nations and it is one of the main things I miss about home.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1826611]And it's just not entertainment venues that are loud in Thailand. Everywhere, malls, outdoor fairs, even in some nicer restaurants, the music, PA, whatever, is way too loud. Thais seem to be able to block this out. Truthfully I have found this all over the developing world. From Latin America to Asia and I am sure the same is true in Africa. Quiet is the realm of developed nations and it is one of the main things I miss about home.[/QUOTE]In my Thai apartment, there are reasonable levels of quiet some of the time (lower 2 floors is not recommended. I am 4th floor), however sometimes hear the thump thump of sex bed in another room, yelling, door slamming is very common, and the GF particularly complains about someone living the floor above, clomping around his apartment incessantly presumably wearing heavy shoes. As I take shoes or sandals off, I go barefoot in the house and don't make much noise, and I can't imagine what the person above is doing clomping around so continuously. Probably a Farang, I guess. Exercise? GF does not want me to report the noisy people to building manager.

[QUOTE=Tomasb;1826614]Stickman from his website refers to these bars as 'naughty boy bars' and used that as the reference point.[/QUOTE]I was not an avid reader of Stickman, perhaps partly because I did not think much of his bar ratings (very different taste to me). I prefer Bangkok Eyes "The Midnight Hour" still published monthly. [URL]http://www.bangkokeyes.com/.[/URL] The Archives of this can be quite useful. They say you can ask them about the history of Bangkok entertainment too. I found however that their historical knowledge is a bit limited as they have been publishing since 2001. I wanted 32 year old historical info on Soapy parlors and that was too hard to find out. It does have regular reports about what is going on in major bar and MP districts, and Maps (which maybe a bit out of date).

Incidentally they once had a survey to rate go-go bars, but the rating system was silly in my view, with too much emphasis on the price of BFs, drinks, etc. The ratings for the looks of girls treated with importance similar to too many other miscellaneous factors, and girls sex performance did not come into it at all. Rather silly in my view. You have to rate a bar largely by how many customers they have compared to the space available. Bars are full because he customers are liking it. How good is the entertainment for the price you pay. That matters. Some bars are more boring than others. Price of lady drinks is far less important to me. Whether they are 120 Baht or 170 Baht, is just not a big issue. For guys thinking the drinks are too expensive, just buy less. A can of Coke Light costs me 160 Baht I think. However it is the equivalent of at least two drinks in a glass packed with Ice. Can last me for a while. Tequilas are not the best idea as ladies consume these in just a few seconds. You do not go to a go-go bar primarily to drink, nor primarily to converse with mates. It's to be entertained by girls. If the girls are boring, you should leave. Obviously many guys are not entertained at all, and do not attend gogo bars.

After leaving Levels on Friday night, I strolled over to SOI 7/1 to visit my favorite local club, Bangkok Beat. As I have mentioned, it's not the most attractive club in town and the noise level from the scrappy bands can be deafening but it's better than the disco clubs IMO.

However, I decided to continue walking up this small SOI passing several BJ bars of ill repute before reaching the end of the SOI. At the very end on the right is a small British style pub called the Pickled Liver. I have never been so went inside and was pleasantly surprised by the ambience, low volume of music (they were playing My Sweet Lord by George Harrison) and ample selection of beer and and cider on tap. I ordered a Speckled Hen, a personal favorite, while I silently planned my next move.

After finishing, I left this quiet pub for Bangkok Beat.

Shortly after arriving, I noticed a few girls come in I had met before. They were certainly regulars, which I generally avoid though one girl has always struck my fancy mainly due to her haughty attitude and tight little body, and the impression I had that she never leaves with anyone. In fact, her principal role with her chubby gal pals appeared to be shuffling off any approaching guys to her friends.

Several weeks ago, I joined her table and bought these girls a few rounds of drinks in an uncharacteristic bout of generosity. In fact, I was feeling so charitable I almost selected one of her chubster friends for a take out before I came to my senses. I squeezed out of my temporary commitment by saying I did not have enough cash to take her home as I spent it all on drinks. The cute girl peered in my wallet to verify my comments though I had hidden a few thousand baht in a private pocket in the wallet. Nevertheless, they did not seem pleased when I slipped away and did not receive a lot of thanks for the drinks purchased.

Periodically. I would see them in there. She never left with anyone though on occasion one of the chubbettes would get lucky.

So Friday night, it was same deal as I received almost a disdainful look from the cute girl who would then glance away. As they were sitting next to me, the cute girl avoided looking at me until almost closing time. Then, in an attitude reversal, she started dancing near me and I took the hint and started to dance with her as well. The band stopped playing (it was 3 am) and then she said in an abrupt reversal of her attitude 'do you want to go with me? I said that I thought she did not go with anyone though she chuckled and said she did, but she was 'expensive'. I should add that this girl is quite attractive, about 25 yo, with an amazing natural rack in a petite frame. I said 'well, I probably can't afford you' to which she retorted 'how much can you pay me?' I said I never pay more than 2k baht. Then she asked how much time that involved. But I threw her a curve ball and responded 'up to you'. She asked where I lived and when I told her my nearby location, she said lets go.

When we arrived at my Apartment, we sat on my couch for a bit, ate a snack but when I tried to wander my hands towards her Y, she rejected my entreaties much like a girl might do to any of us on a real first date. I stopped for a while and changed my approach and asked her a few questions about her personal life. She told me of a very unusual job she had in BKK until last year when she had a work related injury that prevents her from working in this occupation in the future. Don't want to get into details to protect her but she gave me enough info that I am convinced her story was accurate. She also has a studio apartment on one of the SOI's near Asok and is paying 20k baht a month and was interested in the rental cost of my unit.

I was still getting the same attitude and thought I might have a dud on my hands and went to take a shower at her suggestion. When I came out, she was laying on the couch with a blanket pulled up over her. Thoroughly exasperated, I told her if she wanted to sleep on the couch, I had no problem with that, and I was going to sleep in my room and could come join me if she changed her mind. Naturally, I emphasized that no payment would be forthcoming without sex. Basically, both of us were setting boundaries, which made the whole experience up to this point an interesting diversion from a normal monger ing experience, which does not usually include the thrill of a conquest.

Then she took a shower and I went to my room. After a while, she came in with a towel wrapped around her and layed on the bed. I had a pair of boxer briefs on which I took off as she curled up in a spoon position. She professed shock about my naked now rigid member pressed against her so I started to put the briefs back on as I though perhaps she only wants to sleep with me. At this point, she stopped me from retrieving my briefs and I knew the game was on. The girl has quite a sense of humor.

As an aside, this whole experience was a GFE to the extreme, which also included a measurable amount of seduction and back and forth between us as one would do with a non-working girl.

From this point, I started to slip down between her legs and perform a bit of DATY. After only a minute, she started to explode, writhing and moaning beneath me. After she had an orgasm, she turned over in the flat prone position and I put a condom on banging her in what for me is an unusual position. We ultimately went through several positions until I busted a nut inside her. By now, It was probably 4:30 and we fell asleep for a while. Sometime in the dawn hours, I started stroking the fuzzy down on her public area followed by another round of DATY. This time she gave me spirited directions to bite her clit and inner lips. Then she sprayed some of her pussy juices on my chest as she moaned and contorted. After a time, I had to come but instead of using a condom, I put my cock above her pussy and just stroked and stoked above her lips enjoyed the friction of her partially shaved pussy hair on my cock whereupon I erupted on her stomach a significant measurable amount of baby maker.

So after a bit, I watched some American football on tv while she slept. Finally realizing the game was a repeat, I finally went back to bed and sidled up with her. After a while, it became apparent that Round 3 was on the table and naturally complied. My third orgasm (lord, Thanks to MR. V!) within 8 hours. My new friend finally left the apartment at 1:30. I did not go out Saturday (no reason) but did receive a text and call for her around 3:30 am. A booty call or some other emergency, I am not certain yet.

As a postscript, I should add that it occurred to me that the reason I never saw her leave with anyone is because she waits to closing time to select her partner. Usually. I leave no later than 2am

[QUOTE=Tomasb;1826627]After leaving Levels on Friday night, I strolled over to SOI 7/1 to visit my favorite local club, Bangkok Beat. As I have mentioned, it's not the most attractive club in town and the noise level from the scrappy bands can be deafening but it's better than the disco clubs IMO.

Shortly after arriving, I noticed a few girls come in I had met before. They were certainly regulars, which I generally avoid though one girl has always struck my fancy mainly due to her haughty attitude and tight little body, and the impression I had that she never leaves with anyone. In fact, her principal role with her chubby gal pals appeared to be shuffling off any approaching guys to her friends.
[/QUOTE]What is main reason for liking BB? I am guessing because you can spend a fair bit of time with girls before deciding, and in the end the price will be low, assuming did not buy a lot of drinks. I have been there but I found the line up of girls a bit limited, maybe one or two okay, some chubbies as you say and the odd Ladyboy.

I certainly have met girls before who only sometimes go with customers. I guess means they are a little bit fussy and like to choose rather than be chosen. Also depends on how badly they need the money. I can respect choosy girls. My first experiences at Thermae (20 years ago) saw some pretty girls refusing many guys, and leave empty handed. I don't know of course if the girls simply did not like the guys in question or the price was wrong or maybe a bit of both. I did not get any knockbacks at Thermae until years later, when Asian customers became preferred.

I have met other girls working as bar hostesses that do not go with customers at all, will go for a meal if their friends come too. This means the girl is still considering herself to be pure (no real P4 P) and wants all her peers to consider her NOT to be hooker. One such girl would push up against me with her nice tits (in order to sell drinks) but claimed she doesn't like sex. I don't know of course if she ever had a guy really look after her sexual needs properly, to make it enjoyable. Maybe she could like sex. LOL, but of course cannot take the social stigma of being a P4 P "hooker". Works in a 7 Eleven and studying for a better profession. I keep hoping she will get absolutely desperate for money and have to offer me a chance to make her enjoy it. For sure she is no virgin and quite pretty, and contacts me on LINE App. However I don't have much use for an extra girl who does not fuck. I am already mongering mainly / partly because the GF does not want sex often enough. Hard to be bothered spending time with a girl and buying her a drink, if there are no benefits. LOL. So far, I just call in briefly to this bar for a fun chat late after already fucking some other girl. It's an intimate small group, have music, but not too loud. Customer can choose songs off Youtube. The others mostly at the same bar are willing to fuck, no big problem. Why did I have to like Miss Chastity? May switch my attention to one of the other lookers.

Off on a tangent again:

I don't chat to girls only for sex, but it is a major motivator. P4 P warps our personality. I hardly ever get motivated to go chat with guys unless close friends known a long time, certainly not Thai men, met just one LB that is really fun to chat to. Get bored easily, by girls that are not sex maniacs. Can't do girls my own age (grandmas). GF wants to look after me. Clean the house, wash my clothes, cook me food, cut my nails, etc. But I don't really appreciate much all these things that I can do myself. I appreciate the physical things much more, e. G. Take a shower together.

I wish I could get more bored by P4 P and develop other non work interests.

In answer to the BM who asked about the attraction to Bangkok Beat, I totally understand the question. On the surface, the place does not seem like much. However, I like the ability to talk to the girl first, see how they speak English, their background, and try to determine if there is any chemistry.

My first two times in there last winter were an abject failure as I picked two girls in a row who provided inadequate service and were too pro for me. After that I became a bit more discriminatory. For example, I rarely pick anyone who appears to be a regular, though the one from a few nights ago was an exception, and a good one at that. I met a nurse in there a few nights ago and it was her birthday so I offered to buy her a drink, which she declined as she has to leave due to an early work schedule. We exchanged numbers though an I still hope to meet her at some point.

I also enjoy the thrill of the hunt. I have never been rejected there but don't go up to a girl until we have exchanged some eye contact etc. As an example, last night a girl came in, saw me and strolled immediately to my table, clinked glasses, and then tried to lay a kiss on me which I partially rejected. It took me 15 minutes to fully get rid of her. Almost guaranteed, that kiss would have been our highlight moment in the room.

Some nights I don't see anyone I like, which I am fine with. In fact, one night I left empty handed and stumbled into a girl from Madagascar on Suk who I ended up later bedding -- see my prior report. There always a way in BKK. And yes, the girls in there are not always as good looking as in a go go bar but feel that your experience in the room will generally be better and at considerable less cost. Of course, there is always the gem who come in there too.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1826626]I wanted 32 year old historical info on Soapy parlors and that was too hard to find out.[/QUOTE]Just curious, but why were you interested in this info. Are you doing research for a book?

[QUOTE=Tomasb;1826684]Bangkok Beat.[/QUOTE]I am happy you had a good time at BB and scored a lovely girl. I only peeked in there a few times and could not find anything I liked. But based on your excellent report I am willing to give the place another try next trip.

We all have our regular places that seem to work for us and where we are comfortable and get the best results. For me its Ibar in Pattaya. Unfortunately I really haven't found a regular place like that for myself in Bangkok yet. As a visitor you never really have enough time to invest in a place to really give it a try. I envy you guys that live in the LOS. You can pick and chose and take your time so that you really enjoy. We visitors are always in such a rush to get some girl back to our bed.

Continue your happy hunting and please take pity on US poor SOBs that are stuck outside LOS and grace us with an occasional report.

Stay horny my friend.

Uncle-V.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1826604]I think these should be called "naughty girl bars" just to be clear. I go there for girls, anyway![/QUOTE]Indeed, and that's why you and all of us are naughty boys.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1826598]
I guess guys wanting freelancers may find those on the street and in beer gardens, etc. Are not of the highest quality, so then it may be necessary to tolerate clubs or discos.
[/QUOTE]Not necessarely. You can also find FL's through social media and chat apps on the internet. That's what I'm doing more and more these days anyway. I cannot stand the noise and 'music' either.

[QUOTE=Mogwai;1826723]Not necessarely. You can also find FL's through social media and chat apps on the internet. That's what I'm doing more and more these days anyway. I cannot stand the noise and 'music' either.[/QUOTE]I like to survey a line up of many girls and pick one or two out that appeal. Seems like chat could waste a hell of a lot of time on girls that don't meet my specs and having a GF I don't see how would have time to check out girls on chat. Perhaps I don't understand how it could work efficiently.

[QUOTE=Sum12;1826636]Visiting Bangkok for 2 weeks for some work and looking to stay near Nana plaza (not more than 5 minutes away walking). Any advise which hotel is good? Looking to book Ibis Nana however it has a no smoking policy which I am not sure I can manage for 2 full weeks. My budget is $45-$50 per night. Any help will be much appreciated.[/QUOTE]Does anyone love the Nana Plaza these days? Or perhaps just specific bars? Are any worth visiting regularly.

Seems to me that Nana Plaza is well past its hey day. In the early days (like 20 years ago), I was a Lollipop and Pretty Lady customer, maybe Voodoo a little. Very big turn over of bars lately with many refitted bars not lasting long before a complete changeover. Candyland refit was horrible (bad taste and colour) and the new bar did not last long. Many bars changed names as well. I see famous LB bar Cascade changed as well.

Old bars Billboard, Rainbow group, Angel Witch and Spanky's still going along. All fairly boring for me. Did have one good girl from Spankys in the last year or two (and also one disaster girl). I tend to visit specific girls these days in Nana regardless of which bar they have moved to. Followed one from Dollhouse to Hotlips / Candyland2 to Mercury and another Mercury girl know from Midnite. Mandarin Upstairs seemed more interesting than most bars with some natural girls of a good standard.

Any thoughts on best Nana bars and for what reason?

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1827097]Does anyone love the Nana Plaza these days? Or perhaps just specific bars? Are any worth visiting regularly.

Seems to me that Nana Plaza is well past its hey day. In the early days (like 20 years ago), I was a Lollipop and Pretty Lady customer, maybe Voodoo a little. Very big turn over of bars lately with many refitted bars not lasting long before a complete changeover. Candyland refit was horrible (bad taste and colour) and the new bar did not last long. Many bars changed names as well. I see famous LB bar Cascade changed as well.

Old bars Billboard, Rainbow group, Angel Witch and Spanky's still going along. All fairly boring for me. Did have one good girl from Spankys in the last year or two (and also one disaster girl). I tend to visit specific girls these days in Nana regardless of which bar they have moved to. Followed one from Dollhouse to Hotlips / Candyland2 to Mercury and another Mercury girl know from Midnite. Mandarin Upstairs seemed more interesting than most bars with some natural girls of a good standard.

Any thoughts on best Nana bars and for what reason?[/QUOTE]I am a fan of Mandarin Upstairs for the reason you mentioned. Chilis sometimes has the fresh new farm girl that turns out to be exactly what the traveling salesman wanted (but be mindful of the rare ladyboy in persistent denial here). Bangkok Bunnies' location used to be a favorite when it was called Spellbound, has retained some of the same staff, a few of the same dancers, but I honestly have not made a decent connection in that bar since the name and management / ownership changed.

One of the things I like about Nana Plaza vs Soi Cowboy is, unlike Soi Cowboy, the first order of business is not running the gauntlet of non barfine-able bait-and-switch Coyote scammers, the hot young things we'd hoped to wind up with this night but will instead need to close one eye, squint with the other and convince ourselves we really got a top shelf honey at whatever destination bar has the real deal for rent, be it Crazy House, Baccara or wherever. There are a few stray Coyotes here and there in NP, but nothing like the thick and high wall of them on both sides of Soi Cowboy. You stroll past those scammers and it gets harder and harder to find someone who measures up in our imagination by the time we get into an actual legitimate go-go bar.

Yes, one has to dodge a few more Ladyboys lingering outside their bars in NP, but that kind of "phoniness" (LOL) vs the real deal isn't like the cynical phoniness of the non barfine-able Coyotes one has to wade through on Cowboy. And I don't notice nearly the wide difference in attractiveness between the Nana Plaza Coyotes and the real barfine-able go-go girls as I do on and around Cowboy.

As far as "loving" Nana Plaza, well, all I can say is I have certainly had many more and much better real GFE with the go-go dancers I have barfined out of Nana Plaza than on or around Soi Cowboy over the past couple of years. I still go to a few bars on Cowboy or around the corner from it. But if I am looking for a better GFE, I usually take my search to NP. So I prefer it for that reason, but not "love" it.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1827097]Does anyone love the Nana Plaza these days? Or perhaps just specific bars? Are any worth visiting regularly.

Seems to me that Nana Plaza is well past its hey day. In the early days (like 20 years ago), I was a Lollipop and Pretty Lady customer, maybe Voodoo a little. Very big turn over of bars lately with many refitted bars not lasting long before a complete changeover. Candyland refit was horrible (bad taste and colour) and the new bar did not last long. Many bars changed names as well. I see famous LB bar Cascade changed as well.

Old bars Billboard, Rainbow group, Angel Witch and Spanky's still going along. All fairly boring for me. Did have one good girl from Spankys in the last year or two (and also one disaster girl). I tend to visit specific girls these days in Nana regardless of which bar they have moved to. Followed one from Dollhouse to Hotlips / Candyland2 to Mercury and another Mercury girl know from Midnite. Mandarin Upstairs seemed more interesting than most bars with some natural girls of a good standard.

Any thoughts on best Nana bars and for what reason?[/QUOTE]Rainbow 4 still have some stunners working. But all doing the unenthusiastic gogo girl shuffle. And many won't even make eye contact. I suspect many are starfish. Last I was there, in December, the two girls I fancied completely ignored me so I left after one beer.

The scene at CH is so much better.

[QUOTE=UncleVolodya;1827182]Rainbow 4 still have some stunners working. But all doing the unenthusiastic gogo girl shuffle. And many won't even make eye contact. I suspect many are starfish. Last I was there, in December, the two girls I fancied completely ignored me so I left after one beer.
The scene at CH is so much better.[/QUOTE]Last visit to Nana was many months ago. Stayed 1 week before going to Pattaya. On one night I figured I would check out nana and if I found something I like, great. If not, I will go to Cowboy. I went into 3-4 gogos. At only one place I had a girl that I liked who talked with me and chilled. At the other places, the girls didn't even make eye contact. Even though I was right there near the stage and smiling. Had a beer in each place and left. It's no wonder why the places were pretty empty.

[QUOTE=Mogwai;1826723]Not necessarely. You can also find FL's through social media and chat apps on the internet. That's what I'm doing more and more these days anyway. I cannot stand the noise and 'music' either.[/QUOTE]Too much work and you don't get to see what you are getting.

Heck, even on my last visit, I called some girls from the past to come meet me for a drink. Man oh man has time changed them. I had 2 show up on separate occasions. Both arrived with no make-up and both overweight. Bought them a drink and paid their taxi both ways. Waste of time and a good beer. I stopped calling and just made the usual rounds to the places I like to meet new ones.

[QUOTE=UncleVolodya;1826709] ... We all have our regular places that seem to work for us and where we are comfortable and get the best results. For me its Ibar in Pattaya. Unfortunately I really haven't found a regular place like that for myself in Bangkok yet. As a visitor you never really have enough time to invest in a place to really give it a try. I envy you guys that live in the LOS. You can pick and chose and take your time so that you really enjoy. We visitors are always in such a rush to get some girl back to our bed.
Uncle-V.[/QUOTE]If you like I bar in pattaya, then Bangkok beat should be fine for you. It's hit and miss as most bars / clubs are. Been there plenty of times. Usually the vibe and music is good and plenty of decent lookers. Other times the girls were no so good looking.

Most recent visit almost grabbed a cutie. We had good chemisty, danced, drank together, etc. I was just out to have a good night and cold beer and she seemed to be doing the same thing. She even offered a round of drinks at some point. When it got later, I was ready to leave and told her. I wasn't particularly horny since I spend about 9 months a year in Asia. So I can be picky. In any case, I invited her to come back for some fun. I used to take girls back without even discussing baht and I would just put some money next to their bag when they go shower. Rarely had any issues. Now that has changed in Bangkok and Pattaya. Anyway, this one wanted to know how much. I told her I give 1500. She seemed like she wanted more based on her face. I told her never pay 2000 (almost never because I did give 2000 baht in Bangkok once and that was a hot 24 year old student and I kept her 2 days in a row). I explained that I stay here for a long time and I said well maybe next time we can try, because tonight I can give 1500. I asked her for her number for another night and called a waitress over to pay the bill. She seemed surprised, but that was her chance to take the deal or not. Guess she didn't need 3-4 days worth of pay. The bar was closing soon and I headed to another place.

Another club you will like is over on Soi 12. It used to be called Insomnia for years. Then they changed the name to Insanity (I believe). Again, if you like I bar, you will like Insanity.

Next trip, check out all of them. Climax, Bangkok beat, and Insanity.

Good job with the 1500 offer. That's really what it should be. I have offered that amount
numerous times in BB and it's generally accepted, though sometimes begrudgingly. Virtually all are happy with 2000, which I have bid if I don't want to lose a certain (I. E. Hot) girl over 500 baht or if it's long term. A few weeks ago I offered a girl 2 k baht for LT, which she accepted. She had just arrived for a factory job and that amount equated to prob several days of work. The next week I texted her to come over but said I could only pay 1500. No problem -- she came right over for LT. Had a nice time with her both times and the baht difference did not seem to matter for her. Of course, she was not a hardcore pro and trying to supplement her meager factory salary.
.
For short term -- it's 1500 -- take it or leave it. I have never dropped money into their pocketbook but usually leave it centrally located so she sees it easily. I hate handing it to her directly. It cheapens the experience, at least for me.

The reason for the general price increase to 2000 baht, which girls in most venues seem to be expecting as a minimum is due, I believe, to the rising cost of living in Bangkok. But, if you stick to your guns, most times they will accept a lower amount. It's better than going home with nothing as your prospect did that night.

I have only been to Insomnia once, which occurred last year and that was because some Thai girl dragged me in there. Lot of girls hustling me for drinks, including some of her pals, etc. And not really as laid back as BB but the talent was younger and hipper. Loud and raucous like most discos. It's actually the closest place to me but never think about going. Some night...

[QUOTE=PipeLayer99;1827269]If you like I bar in , then Bangkok beat should be fine for you. It's hit and miss as most bars / clubs are. Been there plenty of times. Usually the vibe and music is good and plenty of decent lookers. Other times the girls were no so good looking.

Most recent visit almost grabbed a cutie. We had good chemisty, danced, drank together, etc. I was just out to have a good night and cold beer and she seemed to be doing the same thing. She even offered a round of drinks at some point. When it got later, I was ready to leave and told her. I wasn't particularly horny since I spend about 9 months a year in Asia. So I can be picky. In any case, I invited her to come back for some fun. I used to take girls back without even discussing baht and I would just put some money next to their bag when they go shower. Rarely had any issues. Now that has changed in Bangkok and Pattaya. Anyway, this one wanted to know how much. I told her I give 1500. She seemed like she wanted more based on her face. I told her never pay 2000 (almost never because I did give 2000 baht in Bangkok once and that was a hot 24 year old student and I kept her 2 days in a row). I explained that I stay here for a long time and I said well maybe next time we can try, because tonight I can give 1500. I asked her for her number for another night and called a waitress over to pay the bill. She seemed surprised, but that was her chance to take the deal or not. Guess she didn't need 3-4 days worth of pay. The bar was closing soon and I headed to another place

[QUOTE=PipeLayer99;1827256]Too much work and you don't get to see what you are getting.

Heck, even on my last visit, I called some girls from the past to come meet me for a drink. Man oh man has time changed them. I had 2 show up on separate occasions. Both arrived with no make-up and both overweight. Bought them a drink and paid their taxi both ways. Waste of time and a good beer. I stopped calling and just made the usual rounds to the places I like to meet new ones.[/QUOTE]As a somewhat prolific visitor of various massage / brothels in Bangkok (current resident), I must concur about the weight issue. I've noticed that it only takes 1-6 months of working for some girls to go from skinny to better formed to just skinny / unfit-fat (like no butt, no muscle and just plain fat). This is girls that I found to be very attractive and want to repeat with for looks / service, but now can't because they gained so much weight and look completely different. Although, it's kind of bitter-sweet. I am happy that they are eating good but sad that they look so unattractive now with regards to mongering.

[QUOTE=UncleVolodya;1827182]Rainbow 4 still have some stunners working. But all doing the unenthusiastic gogo girl shuffle. And many won't even make eye contact. I suspect many are starfish. Last I was there, in December, the two girls I fancied completely ignored me so I left after one beer.

The scene at CH is so much better.[/QUOTE]I suspect that they don't make eye-contact with falangs because it alienates their business prospects with non-Thai Asians (95% of paying gogo clientele for places like Rainbow / Bacarra). Japanese and Korean men have a big insecurity when it comes to Asians who go with white men. The girls who aren't hot (IE: aren't bar-fined within 1 hour of opening) need to make sure they are attractive to 90% of the clientele there, else they will be shut-out of drinks / LT money.

For example, Korean women who date white men are physical assaulted and humiliated in South Korea, and in public (talk about loss of face! A few white men have been beaten to death in South Korea for having public displays of affection with their partner. Basically, Thai's are diplomatic and are just appeasing the majority, which is horny Japanese / Korean men.

Sorry. A newbie question: what is a coyote?

8 days in Bangkok.

I am Single, mid 40's and work very hard all year in Europe.

After a sucessfull year, I treated Myself with a Trip to Bangkok.

Not only Girls, also good Hotels, Restaurants, tailors, Shopping, Looking around.

I have just returned and had a wonderfull Trip! This City is so Great because it is so easy and relaxed to have a good Time with Girls. I treat them well and respectfully, Pay about 3. 000 Baht For LT.

Hotels: Peninsula and Grand Centre Point Hotel Terminal 21 Are Highly recommended. (They Are girlfriendly, no questions asked) Had unforgettable sex with a Freelancer (32 years, good breasts and a friendly and Smart Woman) I Knew from before in my Peninsula Room: Lights dimmed, Whiskey and Soda, on the Sofa, kissing, cuddling, and while Doggy Looking on the Chao Praya. Very Nice memories For Long working days.

Terminal 21 is good For freelancers from Sukhumvit (1. 500 Short Time, usually 1-2 Pops, Girls Loved the Room). And also some Girls I Knew from Former Visits.

Went spontaniously to Star of light, patpong. One guy was busy there on the Sofa With a Girl, I did not find anyone I Liked so I strolled on. When you have had good sex for the Last days, it is so relaxed to just Wander on. Had a Whiskey and Pizza at Madrid Bar, good Chat with a British guy, and just strolled around Bangkok. No appointmemts, no obligations.

Tried a BJ bar in Soi Nana, around the corner from [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord900][CodeWord900][/url], was ok But Nothing to Write home about.

One afternoon I felt like getting a relaxed Blowjob in my Room so I Said to Myself: "this is your Holiday, just Do it! " got a Freelancer, went to my Room, She did her Job, left and I Had a wonderfull nap afterwards. Fantastic.

I am not into gogos (noisy!) at all. Prefer freelancers in the Street or some bars, just went with the Flow and I have Never Had such an easy and relaxing Week like this before!

The Stay in Bangkok Reminded me of an experience I Had about 20 years ago: while staying as a Backpacker in the khao San Road, a Girl Literally picked me up. She was fun, horny and wanted to spend the Night with me, what we did.

We went to a Thai hotel North of khao San and fu**ed our Brains out. She did not want Any money, it was a Nice experience. That Hotel Room Had a mirror over the bed!

My QUESTION: does anyone of you Know a Hotel with mirrors over the bed?

I would like to experience this again, in my hotelroom, Not a Massage parlour. Thank you.

[QUOTE=NamasteParis;1827445]Sorry. A newbie question: what is a coyote?[/QUOTE]Google is my friend. I know now. Forget it!

[QUOTE=Tomasb;1827292]Good job with the 1500 offer. That's really what it should be. I have offered that amount
numerous times in BB and it's generally accepted, though sometimes begrudgingly. Virtually all are happy with 2000, which I have bid if I don't want to lose a certain (I. E. Hot) girl over 500 baht or if it's long term. A few weeks ago I offered a girl 2 k baht for LT, which she accepted. She had just arrived for a factory job and that amount equated to prob several days of work. The next week I texted her to come over but said I could only pay 1500. No problem -- she came right over for LT. Had a nice time with her both times and the baht difference did not seem to matter for her. Of course, she was not a hardcore pro and trying to supplement her meager factory salary.
.
For short term -- it's 1500 -- take it or leave it. I have never dropped money into their pocketbook but usually leave it centrally located so she sees it easily. I hate handing it to her directly. It cheapens the experience, at least for me.

The reason for the general price increase to 2000 baht, which girls in most venues seem to be expecting as a minimum is due, I believe, to the rising cost of living in Bangkok. But, if you stick to your guns, most times they will accept a lower amount. It's better than going home with nothing as your prospect did that night.[/QUOTE]Again, kudos for sticking to your guns. If more punters did this life would be far better for us.

I have a friend in Pattaya that never pays over 1 k. Usually only pays 700. Gets GoGo gals phone numbers and they come over and service him before heading to work.

I would say 2 k price is not due to a recent cost of living increase in BKK, and I have lived here for 16 years, but due simply to the fact that some dudes are willing to pay that. The economy in Thailand is going in the hopper. This will be a very rough year for them and workers in most sectors might experience pay cuts and perhaps even layoffs. A recent article stated that foreign investment was down 78% last years. Could mean an increase in FLs, as gals struggle to pay their ever mounting credit card debt. Should be some bargains to be had. Would be nice to see ST back to 1 k, which is still 10 times the min wage in this country.

[QUOTE=ParkVille;1827407]I suspect that they don't make eye-contact with falangs because it alienates their business prospects with non-Thai Asians (95% of paying gogo clientele for places like Rainbow / Bacarra). Japanese and Korean men have a big insecurity when it comes to Asians who go with white men. The girls who aren't hot (IE: aren't bar-fined within 1 hour of opening) need to make sure they are attractive to 90% of the clientele there, else they will be shut-out of drinks / LT money.

For example, Korean women who date white men are physical assaulted and humiliated in South Korea, and in public (talk about loss of face! A few white men have been beaten to death in South Korea for having public displays of affection with their partner. Basically, Thai's are diplomatic and are just appeasing the majority, which is horny Japanese / Korean men.[/QUOTE]Crazy House has a mix of Japanese and Korean customers as well as Farangs, some Indians I guess.

Even though some girls prefer Koreans, there are plenty that normally get Farangs and some that take a mix. I don't see any evidence that girls don't want to be seen with Farangs. Very few indeed would avoid me and however girls always have the right to favor whichever customer they prefer. I have experiences being totally ignored by a girl having a younger customer. No big deal. He was a Farang too.

Some girls may just assume that Faramgs are a waste of time if that is their normal experience. However if the Farangs are well known, like me, we are not experiencing problems.

I call girls to me if I am interested. I don't wait for them to wave at me frantically. If we potentially want something, we have to make it known we are interested.

Plenty of girls paid me no attention whatsoever until I called them. Subsequently we got on well. Some girls are shy. Some are bored. Some are raunchy. Some are far from that. Some are scared of Farang size.

All this eye contact stuff is greatly over rated. Its not really Thai culture for shyer types of girls to be eyeing off all the customers in a brazen way. Some girls are so shy they just stare into space.

If a girl doesn't look in my direction, I can soon find a way to let her know I am interested. If necessary, I can tell the waitress I am interested and she can tell the girl dancing. I don't just give up easily. Sometimes put a tip in her garter. Sometimes give a signal if her gaze happens to pass by me.

O.K. Once stood next to a girl dancing and started speaking to her in Baccara and she did not answer at all. Soon worked out she had a different customer target. Slightly annoying as her body was really hot but we accept these things.

Warm out in town. Needed a clean up so a nurse massage sounds dedicated good. Picked 10 cute thing. Good rub and slide. Would try again ask get the feeling the ore you good customer the better things would get, usual thing. Need to decide what to do or where to go todayqńmk (.

0.

We never even got the the ST or LT discussion. LOL. When I offered 1500, she didn't know that meant LT for me. That's my usual amount, 1500 for LT (and 1000ST).

But the funny part was her look and her not answering with an ok for 1500. Her loss. We could have done 2 rounds in 2 hours.

Nowadays, since I basically stay long time, I am not horny all the time. So I can take it or leave it. Too many other options available.

I concur. Like you mentioned, if you have a hot girl and the chemistry is there, sure take her for the extra 500 baht. But for us long term guys, she has to be hottt and we have to be horny.

Lastly, good deal with your recent lady. 2000 first. Then the next time 1500. Thats the way you do it. Everybody is happy.

[QUOTE=Tomasb;1827292]Good job with the 1500 offer. That's really what it should be. I have offered that amount
numerous times in BB and it's generally accepted, though sometimes begrudgingly. Virtually all are happy with 2000, which I have bid if I don't want to lose a certain (I. E. Hot) girl over 500 baht or if it's long term. A few weeks ago I offered a girl 2 k baht for LT, which she accepted. She had just arrived for a factory job and that amount equated to prob several days of work. The next week I texted her to come over but said I could only pay 1500. No problem -- she came right over for LT. Had a nice time with her both times and the baht difference did not seem to matter for her. Of course, she was not a hardcore pro and trying to supplement her meager factory salary.
.
For short term -- it's 1500 -- take it or leave it. I have never dropped money into their pocketbook but usually leave it centrally located so she sees it easily. I hate handing it to her directly. It cheapens the experience, at least for me.

The reason for the general price increase to 2000 baht, which girls in most venues seem to be expecting as a minimum is due, I believe, to the rising cost of living in Bangkok. But, if you stick to your guns, most times they will accept a lower amount. It's better than going home with nothing as your prospect did that night. [/QUOTE]

That's what me one particular buddy did all the time. We would meet girls and just take them for 1000 baht in Pattaya. Lately, I have adjusted to 1500. Mainly because I don't want to let a nice one slip away for the extra 500 baht. All depends on the girls attitude and friendliness.

And yes, that's another thing I do a lot. I get phone numbers of girls in gogos, bars, and while out walking around. I let them know that we can get together when it is good for both of us.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1827500]Again, kudos for sticking to your guns. If more punters did this life would be far better for us.

I have a friend in Pattaya that never pays over 1 k. Usually only pays 700. Gets GoGo gals phone numbers and they come over and service him before heading to work.

I would say 2 k price is not due to a recent cost of living increase in BKK, and I have lived here for 16 years, but due simply to the fact that some dudes are willing to pay that. The economy in Thailand is going in the hopper. This will be a very rough year for them and workers in most sectors might experience pay cuts and perhaps even layoffs. A recent article stated that foreign investment was down 78% last years. Could mean an increase in FLs, as gals struggle to pay their ever mounting credit card debt. Should be some bargains to be had. Would be nice to see ST back to 1 k, which is still 10 times the min wage in this country.[/QUOTE]

I visited the gogo-bars in Patpong 1 and 2 recently (November and January), is seems that there are some improvements since my last visit in this area (2012). Although some say that the bars were better one year ago. Some details: Patpong 2 is the best, the bars Electric Blue, Bada Bing and Pink Panther (and maybe Black Pagda) made the best impression with me. In Patpong 1 only Kings Castle 1 is worth a visit. Stages full of stunners, no drink pressure, and the girls are friendly to chat with over a drink. Note that not all of them barfine, and some are coyote dancers. Drink prices are mostly 120-140 and LDs 200, so the same as in the other two gogo-areas. But some bars have draft beer for 90.

I found a really cute girl in Electric Blue, very little English spoken though. 2500 for st and 4000 for LT. But the barfine is 1000, I found that a bit strange since it's usually 600.

Anyway, Patpong is an interesting alternative if your tired of Nana and Cowboy. Sala Daeng Skytrain station, exit 1. Or Silom MRT station, but then it's a longer walk through those silly night markets.

[QUOTE=JohnTraveller;1828238]I visited the gogo-bars in Patpong 1 and 2 [/QUOTE]What would be the quickest and easiest way for 2 guys to reach Patpong from the Sukhumvit road area? I'm guessing a bts would run 60 baht each to go 6 bts stops, a taxi shouldn't run you more than 200 baht (again guessing).

[QUOTE=Breadman;1828260]What would be the quickest and easiest way for 2 guys to reach Patpong from the Sukhumvit road area? I'm guessing a bts would run 60 baht each to go 6 bts stops, a taxi shouldn't run you more than 200 baht (again guessing).[/QUOTE]I think the BTS is 30 or something per person on this route. But, yes taxis are cheap in BKK if you get them to use the meter. When I returned I got a taxi for just 81 baht on the meter.

[QUOTE=Breadman;1828260]What would be the quickest and easiest way for 2 guys to reach Patpong from the Sukhumvit road area? I'm guessing a bts would run 60 baht each to go 6 bts stops, a taxi shouldn't run you more than 200 baht (again guessing).[/QUOTE]The fastest and cheapest way to go to Patpong is to take the BTS and change lines at the Siam Paragon Station. Then get off at the Sala Daeng station. Alternatively, if you are close to Asok and T21, take the MRT directly to the Sala Daeng station.

Always take a taxi to return to your hotel when you are with a girl.

[QUOTE=JohnTraveller;1828272]I think the BTS is 30 or something per person on this route. But, yes taxis are cheap in BKK if you get them to use the meter. When I returned I got a taxi for just 81 baht on the meter.[/QUOTE]My thinking is if my buddy and I are a ten minute walk to a BTS station and a taxi quotes us 150 baht to take us to Patpong, I'd spend a few extra baht for the comfort of a taxi.

Are there any money exchange booths on soi 4? Only one I remember is the currency exchange place on Sukhumvit.

[QUOTE=Breadman;1828297]My thinking is if my buddy and I are a ten minute walk to a BTS station and a taxi quotes us 150 baht to take us to Patpong, I'd spend a few extra baht for the comfort of a taxi.

Are there any money exchange booths on soi 4? Only one I remember is the currency exchange place on Sukhumvit.[/QUOTE]To Breadman.

The traffic is bad most of the day from 5-8 pm it will take forever from Suk to Patong so better just take the BTS.

Fast eddie 48.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1827583]...Even though some girls prefer Koreans, there are plenty that normally get Farangs and some that take a mix. I don't see any evidence that girls don't want to be seen with Farangs. Very few indeed would avoid me and however girls always have the right to favor whichever customer they prefer. I have experiences being totally ignored by a girl having a younger customer. No big deal. He was a Farang too...[/QUOTE]One of my favorite discussion topic with a working girl in Thailand, is to understand how they decide who to go with. Over the years, I have asked that question many many times, usually with girls where a good comfort level was already established. This is the response I get most of the times, as of 3/5 years ago, and I stopped asking that question a while back.

They all told me that they have 3 criteria: 1) They prefer customers who are generous, 2) They prefer those who respect them, and 3) They prefer customers who don't ask them to do too much (for example: no boom-boom all night). As of 5 years ago, Japanese customers were thought of as the best, next was older white customers, and then the rest. Strangely enough, Thai customers were ranked the worst, as they don't seem to respect the working ladies.

[QUOTE=Lefeu;1828313]One of my favorite discussion topic with a working girl in Thailand, is to understand how they decide who to go with. Over the years, I have asked that question many many times, usually with girls where a good comfort level was already established. This is the response I get most of the times, as of 3/5 years ago, and I stopped asking that question a while back.

They all told me that they have 3 criteria: 1) They prefer customers who are generous, 2) They prefer those who respect them, and 3) They prefer customers who don't ask them to do too much (for example: no boom-boom all night). As of 5 years ago, Japanese customers were thought of as the best, next was older white customers, and then the rest. Strangely enough, Thai customers were ranked the worst, as they don't seem to respect the working ladies.[/QUOTE]I think your 3 criteria are pretty good. There may be other slight variations. Girls gossip too, so when a girl sits with me in between dance sets at a bar, it's quite likely that other girls that have been with me, may whisper something to her. I think it becomes known that I appreciate girls that really make an effort to give me a good time, and that they can get drinks from me in the future if they are good to me, where if they are crap, they will be ignored in the future.

I think I enjoy a good reputation for points 1 and 2 but may dip out a bit on point 3. I do fuck too long for many girls' preference, as am very slow to cum. However I need to avoid girls who are wanting a quickie, so if they avoid me for that reason, it's better for me.

Girls appear to generalise about Farangs from certain countries too. We are not purely Farangs to them, we are Americans, English, etc. , just like Koreans and Japanese are considered a bit different in the generalisations.

I would obviously avoid bars where the best looking girls are only wanting to do Japanese quickies. Is Rainbow 4 a bit that way? I think so, since have spoken to girls who gave impression they wanted a lot of money for a very short time, in the past. i.e. I was not going to get 90 mins for my ST. 30 mins is not good enough for me. I prefer 90 minutes or more. Also some RB4 girls wanted to take the ST in the Plaza and not in a better ST Hotel Di Place 200 metres up the road. Some ST spots are trying to kick you out of room in 60 mins or even less at Nana Plaza. At DI Place can request the cost of 90 mins or 2 hours. Increased cost over 1 hour, but not double.

DI Place Hotel
http://www.booking.com/hotel/th/di-place.html

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;1828278]The fastest and cheapest way to go to Patpong is to take the BTS and change lines at the Siam Paragon Station. Then get off at the Sala Daeng station. Alternatively, if you are close to Asok and T21, take the MRT directly to the Sala Daeng station.

Always take a taxi to return to your hotel when you are with a girl.[/QUOTE]I would go with the MRT if you are staying close to Asoke. The MRT station that you would get off at is called Silom, not Sala Daeng. That is the BTS stop. It is four stops from Asoke on the MRT. If you are not close to Asoke then BTS as Natty says.

Beeing stunned by my norwegian GF (half norwegian and half pinay) and her incentive working for "childrens right to play" my GF has now moved us to Bangkok for a while. She feels suddenly bad for the children in need here but as I told her why would you not do the same in your mothers birthcountry (philippines)? She hates the place. Bangkok I guess is a nice place to operate from as they have the best shopping malls in the region and the certain lux brands my GF appreciates. To keep the piece back home I told her its ok we move Bangkok for a while as long as I could choose place to live. We ended up as in a long time residents apt at the Kempinskis (close to Siam Paragorn). Only 320000 bhts a month so not to bad I guess (me, GF and baby with accustomed babysitting ofcourse and nursing program with other intl childs living there).

So basically my GF feels sorry for the unattended children in Thailand, she joined many groupes of people wishing the bad fortuned ones a better future. All the time I wish her the best I can not help but to think what is my GF doing. She got the best opertunity in life, borned and raised in Norway, she met me and we coupled up (I am not to poor and have a dime extra to spare), she looks great and never had to suffer in her life. She is soon to finish her PHD from medical research and funnily she's been studying HRM and its affect when people having known AIDS (social control and beeing tagged).

Mongering: My GF vanished a few days into the bushes of Thailand leaving me and daughter at Kempinskis. I flew down my mom and dad so they could nurse the baby, booked myself a room at shitty Grand President and started firing up the monger engine. Arrived Grand President Tuesday, been fucking 6 girls so far (I have quite an arsenal to choose from also beeing the seedy side of BKK). I skipped out my cabincrew / model girls as they would not like it if they knew I stayed in prime top monger area. I guess I survive a few days leaving my GF in the bushes and myself enjoying other bushes (shaving happens at times).

I am more regular writing in the phil section of this forum but I guess I will be a tad more active here from now on.

I recently came back from a short 8-day trip to SEA, split between Bangkok (4 days) and Manila (4 days). Usually, when I visit Thailand, I spend most of my time in Pattaya, as I prefer it over Bangkok. However, this past October, I became excited about Thermae. Pattaya gogos have been getting on my nerves lately, as the girls / Mamasan seem to go to great length in trying to empty my pocket. Getting tired of all the tricks they use to get free LDs from me. Over the past couple of trips, I have been relying more and more on FLs, and Thermae fits right in that model. Moreover, I was surprised at the amount of eye candy available on my last visit. So, this time with only 4 days to play, I decided to skip Pattaya.

First night, I went to Thermae and met Vivi. She was petite, with a tiny frame, a pretty face, and an inviting smile. We agreed to 2. 5 K baths for ST. I enjoyed her company that first night, even though she was tight. Went back to her again on the 2nd night, but things did not go so well. Due to her tightness, she was not comfortable and she would not speak up. Every time I stopped to ask her if she was OK, she would say that she is fine, yet I could see her squirming.

I went back to Thermae the 3rd night, but tried to pick up a different chick and it was a disaster. This chick was eye candy, but she did not appear eager to go with me. Unfortunately, the small head took over and wanted that pussy, so I kept negotiating hard with her, trying to convince her to go with me. She started asking me whether I was too big, whether I come fast or take too long. Then, she wanted 4 K baths for ST and was not willing to go less that 3 K baths. I failed to head all these signs, as the small head appeared in total control. Back in my hotel room, she would not let me play with her boobs, no kissing, no P2 P, and was willing to do only CBJ. Junior was not interested anymore. After a while, I decided to cut my losses and negotiated with her for a smaller amount, then I let her go.

In this trip, I also visited CH, Baccara, and Shark. CH was packed around 9 pm and the only seat available was next to the center stage. I was not too impressed by their lineup that night. I found 2 or 3 chicks interesting but they were taken. Baccara made me buy a drink in order to get in. They did the same to another monger but he decided to go somewhere else instead. I bought my drink, went inside, and I was not too impressed with their lineup either. The place was full of Asians, the preferred kind, and they did not have to buy a drink at the door. I got the distinct impression that Baccara is trying to go Asians only, with their drink purchase at the door policy. I soon left the place. Shark was relatively empty. A chick invited herself and sat next to me. I offered her a drink, chatted with her for a while, then left. She was not my type.

Recently, I had read a few TRs by Eric Swiss, describing his foray into high end MPs. I remember visiting a few of those back when I first started visiting Thailand, about 10+ years ago. I remember being disappointed and frustrated with the hunt at these places. I have always been a sucker for eye candy and willing to pay for it. So, this time I decided to pay a visit to the Lord. I was there around 5 pm and the place was relatively quiet. They had close to 20+ girls and few customers. A Papasan joined me and gave me the layout of the place. The girls looked good from where I was sitting. After a while I picked this slim girl, who was looking my way and smiling. The Papasan explained to me that the pricing scheme and I was pleased to learn that my girl was among the lowest priced at 4,900 bahts. They had this one other girl sitting next to mine, and the Papa said 10 K for that one. Gosh! And I was debating which one to pick among those two. Basically, the same frustration as before, I don't see, how in the world, they pick the price for these girls, because as far I was concerned, there was no reason in for one to be priced higher than the other. Go figure!

Now, I was starting to wonder whether I was going to get a starfish, as it has happened to me before with high end girls. Luckily, this chick performed with quite a bit of enthusiasm, and I was relieved. But, probably another foray into high end places 10 years from now.

But, overall, it was an FL who saved the day for me. I met Nut on my first day, and liked her. She asked for 1K bahts ST and for me that was a steel. She was so good that I saw her every day. I had a grand total of 4 sessions with her, and all were outstanding. I also stayed 2 nights at Terminal 21 and 2 nights at Dream hotel.

[QUOTE=Lefeu;1828508]I recently came back from a short 8-day trip to SEA, split between Bangkok (4 days) and Manila (4 days). Usually, when I visit Thailand, I spend most of my time in Pattaya, as I prefer it over Bangkok. However, this past October, I became excited about Thermae. Pattaya gogos have been getting on my nerves lately, as the girls / Mamasan seem to go to great length in trying to empty my pocket. Getting tired of all the tricks they use to get free LDs from me. Over the past couple of trips, I have been relying more and more on FLs, and Thermae fits right in that model. Moreover, I was surprised at the amount of eye candy available on my last visit. So, this time with only 4 days to play, I decided to skip Pattaya.
[/QUOTE]Yeah the Pattaya GoGo management model is similar to the Bangkok one now. It's more of a western strip club than a free-range brothel. (Free-range, get it? Because they can walk around and aren't kept in a fish bowl har har). I went to Pattaya a few weeks ago and was really not impressed with the gogo prices at all, nor the availability of girls. Soi cowboy was a waste, more guys than girls at the good ones (Happy and Baccara). And I know well not to step into the other ones because they are just so outright aggressive in stealing drinks and playing so many scams. So I decided to check out LK Metro part of town and bar fined a really high quality girl for about 3 k total. Didn't have to pay for any lady drinks, but the bar fine was 1000-1200 baht after I negotiated it down from something like 1400 baht. It had a greedy mamasan pimp, which is a really annoying business model and I will get the girls number / email and easily work out a better arrangement if I like what I see (and I did).

Anyway, about Pattaya. I only like Soi 6. Most of the girls aren't attractive but there are some really cute 30 year olds around there for 1500 baht ST. And it's got much better hours than gogos, which only open at about 9-10 PM, whereas they open at 2 PM. However, Soi 6 isn't enough to keep me in Pattaya, as the food (actual food) is all bad IMHO (I got sick at least once from it), and food in Bangkok is so much better. Also Bangkok has a few places with great prices: Avita massage and Colonze do ST for 1700 baht. Not sure about Avita, haven't been in awhile but I paid 1800 baht last time in 2012. Also Bangkok has some pretty decent quality and quantity of hot girls in the Soi 22-26 massage shops, and although the prices for FS are about 2200 baht, 700 baht more than Soi 6.

[QUOTE=Lefeu;1828508]And I was debating which one to pick among those two. Basically, the same frustration as before, I don't see, how in the world, they pick the price for these girls, because as far I was concerned, there was no reason in for one to be priced higher than the other. Go figure![/QUOTE]I know it's weird, but it's a cultural difference. Short answer, you are paying for her education / class / cultural-face-ranking. Thai mating habits care a lot about social rank. That is why some lowly uneducated Isaan farm girl can be a hottie physically but the local Bangkok Thai's with money will never want to be seen with her. I have found that the higher end place like Copacabana, Poseidon, and The Lord have some really hot 10/10 women from Isaan / rural-Thailand and I always go for the most psychically beautiful. The times I went and there were only pseudo-Hi-so working girls, I noticed that they spoke English very well, so there was a much closer language and cultural connection. They were more logical, more educated, less religious / superstitious, less scatter-brained, less per-pubescent girl acting, had high value of themselves, but a little snobby. You're paying for the personality and social ranking, believe it or not. You may value the personality of a more educated Thai, and the potential for a meta-physical connection that can be made with their command of English and education. However you're right in the end. Why pay 6 k baht more because her family are pseudo "big people" ? Not worth it.

I am not tighton moneys but yesterday I had an incomming friend from my country. With GF somewhere in the province, helping children, we had to monger some. Went first to this italian eatiry in Soi 11, oposite Grand President Hotel. Had a blasting pepperony pizza and a few btls of wine. Then we hit Bossy. This post maybe be a tad uncalled for bcs I was out of memory, due to heavy drinking, at Bossy. But I do today get information I did have my tounge deep into a certain Thail lady. Lateron my friend viewed her as Katoy. Fuck but shit happens. Luckely I did not go further on.

My friend tells me we tuktukked to Shock69 and this fine morning I was waking up with a pretty Thai girl in my bed. I must have collappsed bcs I have no recollection of where and when I picked this fine speciment up. I must have been charming though as she gave me quite a heads up;.

I've told her I am multi special task force guy (spy), working for the US gvnmt, I saw one pk of condom open and one condom attached to my dick. Seemingly hard I wrapped the condom off and fucked the nice thai lady. She asked during session "why not use condom" and I gave the latent BS of "it gives me no pleasure". After boning her I asked her name and she chuckled "I knew her name allready". I didn't, at least I didn't remember it. She was Meow and 24 yo working as head singer for an unfamous Thaiband of which I not know the name off.

She was giving and caring and only recently she departed (at 3:30 pm). I asked if she wanted any money and she replied "I am not that kind of girl" so for once I bailed out put 2 k in her purse and while she in taxi she found the money and called me bad names as I still paid her. I was and still am happy to contribute bcs yesterday and today I was in no meaning of the word, boyfriend material.

[QUOTE=DonaldSucks;1828520] ... She was giving and caring and only recently she departed (at 3:30 pm). I asked if she wanted any money and she replied "I am not that kind of girl" so for once I bailed out put 2 k in her purse and while she in taxi she found the money and called me bad names as I still paid her. I was and still am happy to contribute bcs yesterday and today I was in no meaning of the word, boyfriend material.[/QUOTE]It's nice to find a good girl every now and then. Good for you.

If the girl was just out having fun when you picked her up, and more importantly she didn't want any money, I would not put her picture on here. My opinion. Plus she even told you she is not that kind of girl. I posted many pics over the years. But only of straight up P4 P girls, not regular girls and freebies.

Just my. 02 cents.

[QUOTE=Lefeu;1828508]I recently came back from a short 8-day trip to SEA, split between Bangkok (4 days) and Manila (4 days). Usually, when I visit Thailand, I spend most of my time in Pattaya, as I prefer it over Bangkok. However, this past October, I became excited about Thermae. [/QUOTE]Buddy,

For upscale FL'are action you should try the gentleman's clubs, one of the best or finest thai ladies can be found here or the night clubs such as Kudeta and Mixx, you will be amazed to see the variety of ladies there. I think its much better than the thermae scene, if you got excited in thermae I hope you don't become super horny in Kudeta. LOL.

Just joking.

Adios cheers.

Alex

[QUOTE=PipeLayer99;1828552]It's nice to find a good girl every now and then. Good for you.

If the girl was just out having fun when you picked her up, and more importantly she didn't want any money, I would not put her picture on here. My opinion. Plus she even told you she is not that kind of girl. I posted many pics over the years. But only of straight up P4 P girls, not regular girls and freebies.

Just my. 02 cents.[/QUOTE]I agree and I regretmy actions. If you follow phil secrion you see loads of pics by me, hehe. I am not destroy purpously kind of a guy so I might be more no no posting pics. Even so I like them all to come out in beauty.

[QUOTE=DonaldSucks;1828617]I agree and I regretmy actions. If you follow phil secrion you see loads of pics by me, hehe. I am not destroy purpously kind of a guy so I might be more no no posting pics. Even so I like them all to come out in beauty.[/QUOTE]Ask Jackson to remove the pictures. I'm sure he would to try to restore the girl's privacy.

[QUOTE=DonaldSucks;1828520]I am not tighton moneys but yesterday I had an incomming friend from my country. With GF somewhere in the province, helping children, we had to monger some.
I was in no meaning of the word, boyfriend material.[/QUOTE]Hey DS,

Is bossy open again, last time I was in BKK it was closed and the taxi took us to shock 39 instead. Do we have some other crazy places like these two clubs except climax and insanity in BKK where there are loads of freelancers available. I haven't seen much FL action in the RCA clubs maybe you are in BKK you can have the latest update. Wish I could come instantly to BKK for some nights of fun. How I hate you guys.

Enjoy.

[QUOTE=JimmyBoy99;1828775]Ask Jackson to remove the pictures. I'm sure he would to try to restore the girl's privacy.[/QUOTE]I wouldn't bet on it. We've had pictures of girls posted here along with their chat ID's and even the company they worked for and despite several requests from multiple board members they were never removed.

Has anyone tried backpage Bangkok? I saw a girl claiming to be an independent (name- me me) which I fancy and was thinking of booking but also discovered 2-3 girls who too claim to be independent however using the same contact number. Any suggestions?

[QUOTE=Lefeu;1828508]I recently came back from a short 8-day trip to SEA, split between Bangkok (4 days) and Manila (4 days). Usually, when I visit Thailand, I spend most of my time in Pattaya, as I prefer it over Bangkok. However, this past October, I became excited about Thermae. Pattaya gogos have been getting on my nerves lately, as the girls / Mamasan seem to go to great length in trying to empty my pocket. Getting tired of all the tricks they use to get free LDs from me. Over the past couple of trips, I have been relying more and more on FLs, and Thermae fits right in that model. Moreover, I was surprised at the amount of eye candy available on my last visit. So, this time with only 4 days to play, I decided to skip Pattaya.

First night, I went to Thermae and met Vivi. She was petite, with a tiny frame, a pretty face, and an inviting smile. We agreed to 2. 5 K baths for ST. I enjoyed her company that first night, even though she was tight. Went back to her again on the 2nd night, but things did not go so well. Due to her tightness, she was not comfortable and she would not speak up. Every time I stopped to ask her if she was OK, she would say that she is fine, yet I could see her squirming.

I went back to Thermae the 3rd night, but tried to pick up a different chick and it was a disaster. This chick was eye candy, but she did not appear eager to go with me...[/QUOTE]Thanks for the great read buddy, sounds like you did fine. You did drop your guard w / the uppity Thermal woman but otherwise it sounds like you did fine. I never heard anyone say the CH was void of talent though, the world must be coming to the end. Overall were you disappointed w / Bangkok? Four days in the PI and 4 days in BKK is not very much time, that might have had a negative effect. Thanks again for the good TR.

[QUOTE=Mogwai;1828843]I wouldn't bet on it. We've had pictures of girls posted here along with their chat ID's and even the company they worked for and despite several requests from multiple board members they were never removed.[/QUOTE]Since removing the photos and other private info I assume is a pretty straight-forward process, I am surprised that it has not and probably will not be done.

[QUOTE=JimmyBoy99;1829019]Since removing the photos and other private info I assume is a pretty straight-forward process, I am surprised that it has not and probably will not be done.[/QUOTE]It is unlikely to be removed unless violates forum rules.

[QUOTE=Sum12;1828889]Has anyone tried backpage Bangkok? I saw a girl claiming to be an independent (name- me me) which I fancy and was thinking of booking but also discovered 2-3 girls who too claim to be independent however using the same contact number. Any suggestions?[/QUOTE]Probably a p. i. m. p. Working the appointments for the girls. Nothing new. Happens all the time on Backpage / Craigslist.

[QUOTE=Alex7J;1828842]Hey DS,

Is bossy open again, last time I was in BKK it was closed and the taxi took us to shock 39 instead. Do we have some other crazy places like these two clubs except climax and insanity in BKK where there are loads of freelancers available. I haven't seen much FL action in the RCA clubs maybe you are in BKK you can have the latest update. Wish I could come instantly to BKK for some nights of fun. How I hate you guys.

Enjoy.[/QUOTE]Bossy was open Wednesday (I admit I was drunk as a sailor when arriving but I recogniced Bossy and its interiour. Shock39 we went to yesterday and I was hitting up a Turkmenistanian girl (later on a found out she was Turkish, the drink sailor rides again), before Shock we went to Spicey and me and the friend was the only one there (we bought one drink and got the hell away). This was Friday and around 00:30/1:00 am. I guess if they can not fill the joint on a Friday it will not be to crowded the rest of week.

Have been to Levels and it has a good girliecrowd (brought one back and boned her). Brought one back from Shock yesterday as well. OMG she fucked me well. I was only partly beeing able to participate as she would spin around, both clock and anti clockwice, up and down, upside down and I don't know all the positions we entered. Quite crazy and she might have had ADHD or slightly abuser of certain drugs. I mean normal girls doesn't come this crazy.

RCA route I find to be almost free for FL's and Thong Lor the same. Here we have to trust our beautiful looks and let faith decide if a girl like you or not. What I find more and more at least in Thong Lor is that decent BKK citygirls are more and more willing to commit the one night stand routine I don't complain.

Hi all,

I am landing at 11:30 PM, so would be lucky to make it to my hotel in Silom by 12:30 or 1. I stay in Sala Daeng, walking distance to PatPong, but usually I am done and sleeping at about 10 pm.

Does anyone know what the possibilities are after 1 am or later? I think PatPong closes up pretty early, and I am flying south the next day, so would love to have a plan for some fun upon arrival.

Thanks.

[QUOTE=DonaldSucks;1829190]Bossy was open Wednesday (I admit I was drunk as a sailor when arriving but I recogniced Bossy and its interiour. Shock39 we went to yesterday and I was hitting up a Turkmenistanian girl (later on a found out she was Turkish, the drink sailor rides again), before Shock we went to Spicey and me and the friend was the only one there (we bought one drink and got the hell away). This was Friday and around 00:30/1:00 am. I guess if they can not fill the joint on a Friday it will not be to crowded the rest of week.

Have been to Levels and it has a good girliecrowd (brought one back and boned her). Brought one back from Shock yesterday as well. OMG she fucked me well. I was only partly beeing able to participate as she would spin around, both clock and anti clockwice, up and down, upside down and I don't know all the positions we entered. Quite crazy and she might have had ADHD or slightly abuser of certain drugs. I mean normal girls doesn't come this crazy.

RCA route I find to be almost free for FL's and Thong Lor the same. Here we have to trust our beautiful looks and let faith decide if a girl like you or not. What I find more and more at least in Thong Lor is that decent BKK citygirls are more and more willing to commit the one night stand routine I don't complain.[/QUOTE]Wish I was handsome or young like you or a Caucasian but I look Lebanese / Latino so good for me LOL, Spicey has always been a dead place before 3 am, just after three when all the normal discos AE closed, sailors like you and me who are fucking drunk and want more beer and ladies which cannot be seen in dark head to the first or second floor disco opposite spicy, I forgot the name it has pool tables and a very small and very dark club more dark than I have seen in my life, but the food at the Thai restaurant on ground floor is good for a change. Shock has some nice CIS ladies I remember picking some horny asses from there.

Tell me about this drug (ADHD or Some abuser drug) or medicine or prescription whatever, I want to try some drug which makes you fucking horny in a club, example you are drunk and the lady with you is also drunk and you take this whatever pill or medicine with alcohol it makes you more or super horny I've asked fellow members in the Pattaya forum also but no concrete answer, pm me if you can't write on the forum no issues but I want to try this thing when I am in BKK next week.

I have tried the RCA scene but with a lady who I picked up the previous night never saw any FL'rs scene there, yes normal girls for 1 night stands many, thonglor have never been will try this time and man you are crazy, you come inside a lady. Fucking Crazy: don't me horny, I've just landed in Dubai for 10 days work will come straight from here to Bkk: Poor me how much I miss LOS.

Adios and Enjoy Dude: and keep inside this seed needs to grow; LOL.

Alex.

Hi guys,

Really enjoy reading all the posts, really intellectual and useful. I'm about to travel to Bangkok for 4 days. Would like to have tips on the hotel selection and place to go for girls. Like to have girl to fcknall nights and of course also enjoy the clubbing scene try my luck to get some nonfl girls as well. Regarding the budgets thinking to spend 1500 $. Any suggestions will be appreciated.

[QUOTE=DonaldSucks;1829190]
Have been to Levels and it has a good girliecrowd (brought one back and boned her). Brought one back from Shock yesterday as well. OMG she fucked me well. I was only partly beeing able to participate as she would spin around, both clock and anti clockwice, up and down, upside down and I don't know all the positions we entered. Quite crazy and she might have had ADHD or slightly abuser of certain drugs. I mean normal girls doesn't come this crazy.

[/QUOTE]Just curious. I haven't had a chance to hit Bossy or Shock. But I know Levels pretty well. How would those two compare to Levels as far as girls' looks?

[QUOTE=DonaldSucks;1828507]To keep the piece back home I told her its ok we move Bangkok for a while as long as I could choose place to live. We ended up as in a long time residents apt at the Kempinskis (close to Siam Paragorn). Only 320000 bhts a month so not to bad I guess (me, GF and baby with accustomed babysitting ofcourse and nursing program with other intl childs living there).


I am more regular writing in the phil section of this forum but I guess I will be a tad more active here from now on.[/QUOTE]Hi Donald,

Is that a typo or are you really paying the equivalent of $9,140 USD / month for a room in Bangkok? It seems a bit expensive even for me and I live in NYC!

In response to a member's questions on my post on handing out "call me" cards which seems to have vanished into the ether, while happy with the results in some ways I was disappointed I only got 7. You got to remember these cards were not handed out randomly. I must have asked directions from 50 girls and surveyed a lot more mostly but not just at terminal 21 and Central World. That along with waitresses and other encounters along the way added up to a lot of hellos. More importantly there had to be some semblance of a connection, an exchange of some sort that indicated they might be interested in meeting again. For some I'm sure it seems an odd way to spend a day but in-between beers and eats I enjoyed it and as with most endeavors in life the more you do it the better you get and the easier it becomes. As luck would have it the girl I have become real fond of was one of the last cards I handed out. What's more important I believe I never would have met her using the usual mongering channels.

Re soapies this time round I have only used Nataree. As in previous visits I pick a cute younger girl. For me the key to success with younger girls is to be super friendly, relaxed and patient. They are usually apprehensive with new customers not knowing what to expect but once they are happy that you are not some kind of wacko they relax and one can then enjoy the pleasure of a beautiful young body. On previous visits to LOS I dropped by a number of other places, La Belle being the best with older more experienced providers but appreciably more expensive.

Bit style on 22 is a Japanese style BJ shop. It's more expensive than other BJ bars but the rooms are better and the ladies are by far the best looking and classiest you will find working this segment of the market.

Re Annie's I can understand with their expertise in marketing why they attract the tourist trade. There were lots of ladies on duty both times I visited but lookers were oddly conspicuous by their absence. During my recent visit I did hang around a while hoping somebody worthwhile would turn up to no avail. Eventually out of curiosity I bought a ticket but frankly and with all due respect to those who frequent this place I find it difficult to understand why anybody with experience of what's on offer in Bangkok would continually drop 2500 plus there but as has been mentioned many times before to each their own.

[QUOTE=MaximusV;1829536]Hi Donald,

Is that a typo or are you really paying the equivalent of $9,140 USD / month for a room in Bangkok? It seems a bit expensive even for me and I live in NYC![/QUOTE]Kempinsky is a 5 star level hotel on world wide basis, and the long time residence surely are matching that standard. That price is 300 $ a night. It is relatively cheap as the hotel rooms are sold for much more.

It is just a matter of being able to afford it on the long period.

Have spent much more for less or equivalent around the world. Be it in big cities or leisure area, NY or CT states.

The guy mentions quite some side services. So all in all. Price is fair, albeit expensive.

[QUOTE=GerryGa;1829565]....
Re Annie's I can understand with their expertise in marketing why they attract the tourist trade. There were lots of ladies on duty both times I visited but lookers were oddly conspicuous by their absence. During my recent visit I did hang around a while hoping somebody worthwhile would turn up to no avail. Eventually out of curiosity I bought a ticket but frankly and with all due respect to those who frequent this place I find it difficult to understand why anybody with experience of what's on offer in Bangkok would continually drop 2500 plus there but as has been mentioned many times before to each their own.[/QUOTE]I doubt that marketing is the cause of Annie's Massage success. Because I've never seen any kind of official advertising from Annie's Massage, except at their website. I've learned about Annie's Massage from some of its happy customers in this forum.

When the customers are happy, then some of them spread the word. And that's what makes it so popular. But I wouldn't call this marketing, unless having good service and many happy customers is marketing.

You need to realize that not every guy is looking for the best-looking woman in the room. I've learned early on that the best-looking woman in the room is often more trouble than she is worth. Because she is used to a lot of attention, and she often doesn't even try to be nice with guys. You get to enjoy her looks alright, but not much else besides that.

I was into women's looks, when I didn't yet have much experience with women. My attraction was based mostly on looks, because I looked at women a lot and didn't do much else with them. My experience with women was mostly looking at them. And that's why my attraction was based on looks.

But after I've spent some time in Thailand and got to nail a good number of sexy ladies, then this experience changed my attraction towards women. Looks became less important for me, because I got so much enjoyment from touching the ladies and having them touch me.

Sex is mostly touching, and not looking. Because your face is so close to the lady, when you are nailing her, that you don't see much of her. Most of your enjoyment comes your physical contact with the lady, rather than from looking at her.

When I look for a lady, then I imagine the sexual touching between me and her, and that's how I choose her. And she is never the best-looking woman in the room. She is just reasonably good-looking and very friendly with me. It's the sincerity of her friendliness that helps me decide to go with her for a ride. Because friendly touching is what you need to enjoy your grappling and coupling with the lady. I need to like the lady's looks too. But I like the looks of most women, which makes it easy for me to find a woman whose looks I like.

I suspect that this kind of change in attraction towards women happens for many guys, when they get to nail a lot of women. Because their experience with women goes from mostly looking at women to mostly nailing them. Your attraction is based on your experience, and that's why accumulating a different experience makes your attraction different.

I'd say that the main reason why Annie's Massage is so popular is because they have a two-cumshot policy for each and every guy. Their lady comes at you and just blows you away with her mouth and hands. She gives you no chance to last. And she welcomes your inevitable cum-blast with a smile. Because now she knows that you are going to last with her for a while.

At a lot of massage places, this would be the end of your fun with the lady, but at Annie's Massage, this is just the beginning. Because this chick rejuvinates your dick and gets you to nail her like a man. Your desire is on fire, but not in a premature ejaculation kind of way. It's going to take a while for you to work up your second cum with this pretty lady, and she knows it too. Because making you last for a long time with her was the whole point of this exercise.

The ladies at Annie's Massage make their guys last for a long time with them. And that's why they are so popular among guys. When you get a lot of pleasure with your lady for a long time, then this can be addictive in a natural kind of way. Perhaps the ladies at Annie's Massage turn their guys into sex-addicts. And that's why some of those guys rave about Annie's Massage in this forum. You can't reason with a sex-addict, not when some sexy Annie's Massage lady makes him last with her for a long time every time.

[QUOTE=Dan7373;1829663]

I'd say that the main reason why Annie's Massage is so popular is because they have a two-cumshot policy for each and every guy. .[/QUOTE]What a load of crap. Girl I picked only allowd one pop and the girl was getting dressed 40 minutes into the session. Don't believe me, look up my review and you can see I posted about heading up there and then posted a review 45 minutes later. Don't waste your money on this place no matter what type of bs senior posters 'advertise' for this place.

[QUOTE=Dan7373;1829663]

Sex is mostly touching, and not looking. Because your face is so close to the lady, when you are nailing her, that you don't see much of her. Most of your enjoyment comes your physical contact with the lady, rather than from looking at her.
.[/QUOTE]

More crap on top of the other crap. Ever try having the girl lay on her side while your 'nailing' her? Gives you access to breasts, ass and a good view of her face. This way you get both the physical while seeing the entire package.

p.s. I find it 'odd' that you spammed the Annies thread about safe sex for what seemed like hundreds of posts and now your glorifying the place.

[QUOTE=Dan7373;1829663]I doubt that marketing is the cause of Annie's Massage success. Because I've never seen any kind of official advertising from Annie's Massage, except at their website. I've learned about Annie's Massage from some of its happy customers in this forum.

The ladies at Annie's Massage make their guys last for a long time with them. And that's why they are so popular among guys. When you get a lot of pleasure with your lady for a long time, then this can be addictive in a natural kind of way. Perhaps the ladies at Annie's Massage turn their guys into sex-addicts. And that's why some of those guys rave about Annie's Massage in this forum. You can't reason with a sex-addict, not when some sexy Annie's Massage lady makes him last with her for a long time every time.[/QUOTE]True, I second what is written when you drill a lot of ladies you want to have a sexually inspiring session than a rookie look session. I am club guy: MP or gogo bars don't give me fascination so I like to feel the lady make some sexual chemistry work her up in the club with alcohol and a bit of dance and touching if she is receptive and responsive we will head further if not I will usually drop it then and there. Most of the times lets say 95% I have always had a rocking session when back but sometimes you face failure also with the hardcore ones.

How much I miss BKK and want to return ASAP.

Adios cheers.

My scheduled trip to LOS in Nov. Had to be postponed until July when it's hot and rainy in BKK from what I read. Is BKK / Pattaya worth a mongering trip in July? Are there other places / countries that are better?

I don't know where this straw man argument came from that plain looking girls are better in bed and put out more than lookers. In my experience, wandering around Asia, it just ain't so i.e. there is no correlation between looks and performance. I think you can find great and not so great performers in each group.

Personally, I have always been attracted to really good looking girls, so that is the group I target whenever I go out and punt. A friend and fellow board member told me recently that I have an eye for "wholesome lookers" and I think that description describes to a "T" many of the girls I like to hook up with. I just naturally go for clean "wholesome" looking girls with tight, smoking hot bodies. What can I say? This is what turns me on. So currently I have 2 smoking hot sexy friends in Makati, 1 sexy friend in Jakarta, 1 sexy friend in Cambodia, and 1 sexy friend in BKK; all of very high quality; approximately 7 to 7. 8 stars IMHO and I think I am a very tough critic. My 7. 8 stars is another guy's 9 stars. 555. I also have a whole bunch of sexy friends in BKK who are just a tad less attractive in the 6 to 6. 8 star range.

The key point is that all the girls that I repeat with have two things in common: they are all very, very good looking and they all give me the GFE. Believe me, there is nothing better than having great sex with a really pretty Asian girl half my age and receiving her GFE every time we get together. I know I could get similar quality sex from plain girls too, but it would not be as much of a turn on for me and since I am paying for it, I feel I might as well satisfy myself to the maximum and get the best that is available.

The trick, if you want to call it a trick, is to screen your prospective girls carefully and audition them (test them out in the bar) before you take them out, all the while being very nice to them, treating them like you really like them and not treating them like they are just fuck holes. Lastly, it is very important to be willing to spend a little money (mostly for tequilas) on them and one or two of their friends to kick start the action. When I do all this I encounter very few bad performers no matter how attractive they are. This works for me because deep down I really love young, pretty Asian girls and I think the girls are able to sense how I feel towards them. So it comes down to a my selection process, my vibe, AND my wallet which results in my wining over the really attractive ones and setting in motion all the great times I have been having in Asia for well over a decade. It just gets better and better. Still, I never lose sight of the fact that no matter how pretty the girl or how great the sex or the GFE, the name of the game is always P4P. I just follow the rules and keep honing my skills in order to play the game as best I can.

Stay thirsty,

NB

[QUOTE=CompactD;1829792]My scheduled trip to LOS in Nov. Had to be postponed until July when it's hot and rainy in BKK from what I read. Is BKK / Pattaya worth a mongering trip in July? Are there other places / countries that are better?[/QUOTE]No need to worry about seasons. I never do.

[QUOTE=Breadman;1829705]What a load of crap. Girl I picked only allowd one pop and the girl was getting dressed 40 minutes into the session. Don't believe me, look up my review and you can see I posted about heading up there and then posted a review 45 minutes later. Don't waste your money on this place no matter what type of bs senior posters 'advertise' for this place.



More crap on top of the other crap. Ever try having the girl lay on her side while your 'nailing' her? Gives you access to breasts, ass and a good view of her face. This way you get both the physical while seeing the entire package.

p.s. I find it 'odd' that you spammed the Annies thread about safe sex for what seemed like hundreds of posts and now your glorifying the place.[/QUOTE]You need to avoid assesing all girls in a place as the same. Its not about the place, its about particular girls liked or disliked. Every place has varying standard.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;1829808]I don't know where this straw man argument came from that plain looking girls are better in bed and put out more than lookers. In my experience, wandering around Asia, it just ain't so i.e. there is no correlation between looks and performance. I think you can find great and not so great performers in each group.

The trick, if you want to call it a trick, is to screen your prospective girls carefully and audition them (test them out in the bar) before you take them out, all the while being very nice to them, treating them like you really like them and not treating them like they are just fuck holes. Lastly, it is very important to be willing to spend a little money (mostly for tequilas) on them and one or two of their friends to kick start the action. When I do all this I encounter very few bad performers no matter how attractive they are. This works for me because deep down I really love young, pretty Asian girls and I think the girls are able to sense how I feel towards them. So it comes down to a my selection process, my vibe, AND my wallet which results in my wining over the really attractive ones and setting in motion all the great times I have been having in Asia for well over a decade. It just gets better and better. Still, I never lose sight of the fact that no matter how pretty the girl or how great the sex or the GFE, the name of the game is always P4P. I just follow the rules and keep honing my skills in order to play the game as best I can.

Stay thirsty,

NB[/QUOTE]You need to treat the lady with respect like a normal girl, even she knows she is a WG but never make her realize like that treat her like your GF if you look for GFE is what I have gained. The best part is always stay thirsty, that hunger for a new lady should never go down, you should always have the appetite for a newer chick the risk of hunting gives me a high so much that I am unable to stay connected to a lady I have humped twice or thrice, The dick just can't stop thinking about new pussy. LOL.

Happy hunting: Be horny.

At Suvarnabhumi airport, when did they install the one way turnstile on the departure level at the taxi lane? Unless you can get airport worker to open the gate, you're going to have to go down to the ground floor and pay the extra 50 Baht to take the meter taxi.

At Don Muang airport, you still can take the meter taxi at the departure level.

[QUOTE=GreenBud;1829920]At Suvarnabhumi airport, when did they install the one way turnstile on the departure level at the taxi lane? Unless you can get airport worker to open the gate, you're going to have to go down to the ground floor and pay the extra 50 Baht to take the meter taxi.

At Don Muang airport, you still can take the meter taxi at the departure level.[/QUOTE]At Don Muang you can take the foot bridge to the train station and take the train to Bangkok Huang Lamphu station for 5 bath. That will save you even more money.

Really, at Suvarnabhumi I cannot get bothered to lug around my luggage until I find someone to open the turnstile, hunt an arriving taxi and then save me 50 baht.

The whole idea to "split" arriving and departing taxis is to make things go more smoothly. If taxis get the idea that they can easily pick up passengers at the arrival level then they wil loiter there and congest the whole area.

Paying extra for a pick up at the airport is not something unique in Bangkok. For instance in France, it is a well established practice that you pay 2 or 3 euro extra if you take a taxi from the cab rank at any airport, port or train station.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1829933]At Don Muang you can take the foot bridge to the train station and take the train to Bangkok Huang Lamphu station for 5 bath. That will save you even more money.
.[/QUOTE]Got a laugh out of me. Getting the name mixed with Bang Lamphu? The main station is called Hua Lamphong. Hua (head) Lamphong (speaker, megaphone, bell). It is a strange name for a railway station.

I guess you are trying to be satirical too. Anyone who cannot afford a taxi from Don Meuang, also cannot afford to monger in Bangkok and should be somewhere else cheaper.

At Suwanaphum I am still leaving from departure level even though officials are trying to prevent us from crossing the road to where the taxis are. At the Thai Inter First Class end (start of International), I could still avoid officals and just lift my bags over the fence, avoiding 50 baht airport surcharge. Still find I have to give taxi drivers directions of how best to get to my place. Taxis love to take a route that is not the shortest for time, sometimes picking normal slow roads (thinking I want to save every last Baht). Actually I just want the quickest route not stuck in traffic.

Greenbud, The one way turnstiles at Departure have been there for quite a long time, more than a year I guess. I still go through in opposite direction but cannot easily get bags through in wrong direction. So I lifted bags over the fence first.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;1829808]
The trick, if you want to call it a trick, is to screen your prospective girls carefully and audition them (test them out in the bar) before you take them out, all the while being very nice to them, treating them like you really like them and not treating them like they are just fuck holes. Lastly, it is very important to be willing to spend a little money (mostly for tequilas) on them and one or two of their friends to kick start the action. When I do all this I encounter very few bad performers no matter how attractive they are. This works for me because deep down I really love young, pretty Asian girls and I think the girls are able to sense how I feel towards them. So it comes down to a my selection process, my vibe, AND my wallet which results in my wining over the really attractive ones and setting in motion all the great times I have been having in Asia for well over a decade. It just gets better and better. Still, I never lose sight of the fact that no matter how pretty the girl or how great the sex or the GFE, the name of the game is always P4P. I just follow the rules and keep honing my skills in order to play the game as best I can.

Stay thirsty,

NB[/QUOTE]Natty! Don't' let our secrets out to everyone! 555.

I agree with you 100%. Even though it's p4 p sex is still a very personal thing (especially for women) and you have to establish some chemistry with the girl beforehand to get the GFE. This takes some effort, charm and money. Also important to cut the girl loose if you see if its its not going anywhere. Sometimes the chemistry is just not there and its better to move on then force it. Though if you are nice, set a fun mood and spend some money 90% of of the time the time and effort do pay off.

And as you say also important that once you've gotten the GFE to keep things in perspective and remember that in the end it is p4 p and not get carried away.

[QUOTE=Dan7373;1829663]I doubt that marketing is the cause of Annie's Massage success. Because I've never seen any kind of official advertising from Annie's Massage, except at their website.



Sex is mostly touching, and not looking. Because your face is so close to the lady, when you are nailing her, that you don't see much of her. Most of your enjoyment comes your physical contact with the lady, rather than from looking at her.[/QUOTE]Actually I like looking. Anyway Dan whatever rocks your boat dude, if it's Annie's ladies go for it. I enjoyed your post on what constitutes a good session and of course if one has to choose between looks and service it's obviously service. What I don't understand though is when you can have both why settle for just one. Re Annie's expertise in marketing along with the web site and friendly posts on ISG you may want to check out their active use of Facebook, Twitter, Instagram among other digital offerings. They have been around for a long time, know how to run a successful P4 P business and I say good luck to them, it's just not for me.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;1829808]
The trick, if you want to call it a trick, is to screen your prospective girls carefully and audition them (test them out in the bar) before you take them out, all the while being very nice to them, treating them like you really like them and not treating them like they are just fuck holes. Lastly, it is very important to be willing to spend a little money (mostly for tequilas) on them and one or two of their friends to kick start the action. When I do all this I encounter very few bad performers no matter how attractive they are. This works for me because deep down I really love young, pretty Asian girls and I think the girls are able to sense how I feel towards them. So it comes down to a my selection process, my vibe, AND my wallet which results in my wining over the really attractive ones and setting in motion all the great times I have been having in Asia for well over a decade. It just gets better and better. Still, I never lose sight of the fact that no matter how pretty the girl or how great the sex or the GFE, the name of the game is always P4P. I just follow the rules and keep honing my skills in order to play the game as best I can.

Stay thirsty,

NB[/QUOTE]Sort of +1 from me. We have similar tastes and methods. However, I don't see it's always getting better and better but I am perhaps more concerned about altered / fake looks than yourself. The proliferation of nose jobs are big worry for me. Twenty years ago bars had very few nose jobs and girls tended to be slimmer overall on average, eating far less westernised junk food. Level of drug use could have been contributing to slim girls too. Bars are recently cracking down on use of Ice and Yaa Baa. Girls still shaking off inhibitions using Yaa Dong alcoholic drink though. I still need to refine my girl screening techniques. I have not found a way to detect girls that will suddenly turn dick scared in the bedroom. Maybe I just have to ask them straight what they like? e.g. How long do you like to take to make love? LOL How long is a reasonable screw? LOL Many are too shy to state they love DATY. Two or three tequilas always useful for the somewhat shy inhibited girls, to forget the inhibitions, not necessary for all of them. Depends on the personality assessment.

I do appreciate that these bars are not the place for guys on a tight budget, though.

At Crazy House, I suggest for you Paeng, a stunning slim girl and good time in the room. I will try to find out her number later. Can send you a pic privately (extracted from LINE profile). She is probably 2nd or 3rd most beautiful girl I ever met at CH, behind only Nat (stunning face and big boobs) gone about 2 years now (rumours were she may have been too young since I saw her tits grow bigger and bigger). May-Lee was probably equal 2nd with Paeng for me. Also gone for now.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1829970]At Crazy House, I suggest for you Paeng, a stunning slim girl and good time in the room.[/QUOTE]Last night, I thought girl number 10 was a stunner, one of the best I've seen at a go-go bar. But I never got her name because she blew me off. It seems she already had a client lined up.

[QUOTE=GerryGa;1829961]Actually I like looking. Anyway Dan whatever rocks your boat dude, if it's Annie's ladies go for it. I enjoyed your post on what constitutes a good session and of course if one has to choose between looks and service it's obviously service. What I don't understand though is when you can have both why settle for just one. Re Annie's expertise in marketing along with the web site and friendly posts on ISG you may want to check out their active use of Facebook, Twitter, Instagram among other digital offerings. They have been around for a long time, know how to run a successful P4 P business and I say good luck to them, it's just not for me.[/QUOTE]The lady's looks are still important for me. It's just that they've become less important than they were before. My experience of physical contact with ladies added for me a new dimension for liking women. I now look for ladies who are good at touching and are nice to touch. It means that I have two reasons for liking a lady, her looks and her touch. And this dilutes the importance of her looks.

And the reason why trying to find both super-looks and super-service often doesn't work well is that the best-looking women usually don't have any reason to be especially nice with guys. Their good looks alone attract more than enough guys, and they might even need to mistreat some guys to avoid having more guys than they can handle.

In theory, it would be nice to have both, good looks and good service. But in practice, there is usually a trade-off between the two.

I doubt your theory about marketing, because I've taken a marketing course not too long ago. And I know that marketing alone, without good service, might work only in the short-term but not in the long-term. Because every business needs repeat customers to do well. And marketing only works to attract new customers. It doesn't work for getting customers to come back. Because people rely on their experience at the business to decide whether to come back or not.

From what I've read here before, Annie's Massage gets a lot of repeat customers. And it has stayed in business for a long time, longer than most other massage places in Bangkok. Which makes your theory about their success due to marketing hard to believe.

Hello,

I am not new to Thailand and Bangkok, but has been few years since the lat time I visited. I was wondering if there is a reliable website or PDF to download as all about Bangkok with all the massage parlors, bars, gogo, brothel, street walker locations, etc. Listed to have like a directory of the so many places that BKK offers, so to keep it on my phone to use when on the road.

Anything like that can be found, or I should start creating it?

Thanks!

For those not here. 3 days of cold weather in Bangkok like has never been seen before. E. g. 17 degrees Celsius/Grad (sorry I don't do Farenheit) at 10 AM with good breeze. Thais are all rugged up. Of course its normal for westerners. Not that cold for us. However you won't see a Thai just in T shirt (for the top).

[QUOTE=Dan7373;1830073]The lady's looks are still important for me. It's just that they've become less important than they were before. My experience of physical contact with ladies added for me a new dimension for liking women. I now look for ladies who are good at touching and are nice to touch. It means that I have two reasons for liking a lady, her looks and her touch. And this dilutes the importance of her looks.

And the reason why trying to find both super-looks and super-service often doesn't work well is that the best-looking women usually don't have any reason to be especially nice with guys. Their good looks alone attract more than enough guys, and they might even need to mistreat some guys to avoid having more guys than they can handle.

In theory, it would be nice to have both, good looks and good service. But in practice, there is usually a trade-off between the two.

I doubt your theory about marketing, because I've taken a marketing course not too long ago. And I know that marketing alone, without good service, might work only in the short-term but not in the long-term. Because every business needs repeat customers to do well. And marketing only works to attract new customers. It doesn't work for getting customers to come back. Because people rely on their experience at the business to decide whether to come back or not.

From what I've read here before, Annie's Massage gets a lot of repeat customers. And it has stayed in business for a long time, longer than most other massage places in Bangkok. Which makes your theory about their success due to marketing hard to believe.[/QUOTE]This topic more correctly belongs in the Annie's tread. However! I guess you would need to talk to the girls or the management to know what the mix is between tourists and residents but I agree of course Annie's has repeat business. How much their marketing contributes to their traffic I am not sure even they know but nowadays most everybody goes online when planning a trip so it is reasonable to assume it has some impact. Logging on to ISG gets you lots of info on Annie's some good, some not so good but with all shared experiences sites (trip advisor comes to mind) one needs to be skeptical of what's posted. Negative and favorable reviews are posted by competitors, begrudgers and friendly surrogates alike and a great deal of what I read about Annie's in particular from both ends of the spectrum I take with a pinch of salt. The only way to know for sure whether it suited my tastes was to check it out which I did and regretably I will not be showing up in the repeat customer marketing stats but then you already know that.

[QUOTE=Martin00;1830088]Hello,

I am not new to Thailand and Bangkok, but has been few years since the lat time I visited. I was wondering if there is a reliable website or PDF to download as all about Bangkok with all the massage parlors, bars, gogo, brothel, street walker locations, etc. Listed to have like a directory of the so many places that BKK offers, so to keep it on my phone to use when on the road.

Anything like that can be found, or I should start creating it?

Thanks![/QUOTE]I think a Wiki would be the best format for this, as it needs to be continuously updated since the scene shifts.

There is the WikiSexGuide website, not terrible, but not particularly great either.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1830335]For those not here. 3 days of cold weather in Bangkok like has never been seen before.[/QUOTE]I have never been cold in Thailand until this trip!

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1830335]Thais are all rugged up. Of course its normal for westerners. Not that cold for us.[/QUOTE]It was pretty cold to me! Monday was the worst. I went out on Monday night with my shorts, but with the breeze, the wind chill factor was nasty. I went back to my hotel room and took out my jacket (first time ever that I wore a jacket in Thailand). Tuesday night was a little better...wasn't that bad, but with the wind, it was still cold.

Strange weather this year. Humid summer in Southern California and cold nights in Bangkok. WTF!

[QUOTE=Martin00;1830088]Hello,

I am not new to Thailand and Bangkok, but has been few years since the lat time I visited. I was wondering if there is a reliable website or PDF to download as all about Bangkok with all the massage parlors, bars, gogo, brothel, street walker locations, etc. Listed to have like a directory of the so many places that BKK offers, so to keep it on my phone to use when on the road.

Anything like that can be found, or I should start creating it?

Thanks![/QUOTE]There are so many that the map would confuse you. There was one circulating here few years ago, but I fear it is out of date.

Suggest you read a bit here in the different sections. Maybe the last ten pages of each.

It is always amazing to see what people does to save 100/200 baht. Equal to 2. 5/5€ or 2. 8/5. 6 $. Is this a deal breaker?

I used to pick is a taxi at departure a few times when arrival was overcrowded, not to save the 50 baht fee.

Once the taximan was stopped by police. And got his licence collected to pick up later paying a fine. Probably my fare was not worth the trouble.

Maybe a map like nan cy Ch and l er where one can monetize the knowledge. The Bali map is great but now has to be centrally updated.

[QUOTE=Martin00;1830088]Hello,

I am not new to Thailand and Bangkok, but has been few years since the lat time I visited. I was wondering if there is a reliable website or PDF to download as all about Bangkok with all the massage parlors, bars, gogo, brothel, street walker locations, etc. Listed to have like a directory of the so many places that BKK offers, so to keep it on my phone to use when on the road.

Anything like that can be found, or I should start creating it?

Thanks![/QUOTE]The ISG coupled with Google Search and Google Maps does just about everything. As others said there is far too much to try everything. That is why we have ISG.

I read Bangkok Eyes "Midnite Hour" web site regularly.

Here is an old Map several years out of date, but its a start:
[url]https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?mid=zSwFcBcbnzww.ktUBr9Cd5bKI&usp=sharing[/url]

You think Bangkok is cold, then try Chiang Mai. Last night it was about 50 degrees or 8 centigrade. People are bundled up like they are at a ski resort. It was last night that I noticed that almost all the bars are open air to one degree or another so there are few places where one can enter and get warmed up. The daytime yesterday featured a chilling hard rain. Today it's cloudy and still cold.

Plus the bars and clubs do close at midnight so the whole atmosphere here reminds me of places we want to escape in the west.

It's difficult to evaluate or compare the women situation here to Bangkok as the weather seems to be keeping girls inside as well.

[QUOTE=GreenBud;1830655]I have never been cold in Thailand until this trip!

It was pretty cold to me! Monday was the worst. I went out on Monday night with my shorts, but with the breeze, the wind chill factor was nasty. I went back to my hotel room and took out my jacket (first time ever that I wore a jacket in Thailand). Tuesday night was a little better...wasn't that bad, but with the wind, it was still cold.

Strange weather this year. Humid summer in Southern California and cold nights in Bangkok. WTF![/QUOTE]

I went to Crazy House twice this week for my type of naked girl art. Both times I saw plenty of slim toned naked girls, and not too much silicone tits and noses. Line ups started weakish at 8 PM and improved up till 9. 30 PM. In the end I did not BF a girl, because my favourites (boths looks and on the bed), Oom, Ging Gaew, and the very beautiful Paeng were missing, and really everyone else was second best or in some cases pretty but already tried in the past. Girls I would like to try in Nan (Naen) and Jane were also missing. Correction Nan spotted first night but already with a customer and got rapidly BFed. CH line up is not always what is was in former times. I just have to pick the right day.

Went to Suzie Wong first time for months Tuesday, and surprised the line up was a bit better than expected. Not as many fatties as I thought. Actually total number of girls was not that high, however bar was busy including group of girls from Brazil on tour. Not many SW girls were still known by me. Just expert pussy licker "Dtom", Lara Croft like enhanced but soft boobs "Anne", and "Noon" built like a tank with coconuts on top (friend of retired girl Nuu Dee). One new girl was quite pretty in the face, name something weird like "Ie-ang". Sisters Knot and Pat missing unfortunately.

Have known Anne for almost 6 years since she first got out of school and arrived in the bar with a stunning figure. Figure is not quite that good any more. Even her pussy is a little bit too tight for me, took her for a good GFE ST. She was horny this time and just enough alcohol to get in the mood and quickly carried away from DATY (not always the case with her). Enthusiastic for the fuck too, at least till I started to take too long. However she knows what I am like.

For guys wanting to take two girls for a threesome, I recommend selecting from those performing the lesbian show. Has been reliable for me. Last night Dtom and Bom-Baem were licking each other out and are clearly into each other. Would make a very good selection if you don't mind small tits. If prefer big tits, Anne also performed in the lesbian show. She is probably not a real lesbian/bisexual but O.K. for threesomes in my experience.

Correction: 50 degree fahrenheit=10 centigrade.

I spent a few days in Bangkok. Last days were special with the low temperatures. Funny to see the girls dancing half naked and then when sittting with a customer they put on something warm or were wrapped in a blanket.

I visited a few soapies like nataree and nearby emanuelle but did not find a girl I liked. So girlswise I focused on Nana Plaza (with least success), Soi Cowboy (Crazy House was best. I think I had a girl named Min. Currently I find Nr. 14 interesting) and Patpong (somehow I like the lineup of Kings Castle 1 although the pricing scheme is a bit strange: half of the girls have a barfine of 600 THB and the other half has a barfine of 2100 THB). Monday was generally not good. Bad lineup everywhere.

Nana was my least favorite. Somehow I spotted only 2 girls I like and the atmosphere was also not that impressive (often lame dancing, unattractive girls). Also one time a Ladyboy stopped me and another one grabbed my dick. I was not amused. Soi Cowboy was best regarding the atmosphere (especially Crazy House) and Nudity. But somehow (many will complain) for me Kings Castle had the best looking girls. No nudity, but if there are lots of Japanese like tonight the atmosphere is good. The other bars around (Kings Corner, Bada Bling, .) are not that good, but are good enough for a drink or two. Drinks here are cheaper than at the other venues (I. E. A water costs 160 THB -or was it 165 THB?- at Crazy House but only 100 THB at Kings Castle).).

I went to Thermae once (around midnight) but did not spot a girl I liked. But lots of Asian guys there (Japanese, Korean, .). I did not venture into the discos although I walked by at Bangkok Beat but did not go inside as it seemed unintersting to me. I think when I come back to Bangkok I will try some bars at Sukhumvit Soi 25-33. A few looked promising when I walked by. Also Christies Club looked good from the outside.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1830823]I went to Crazy House twice this week for my type of naked girl art. Both times I saw plenty of slim toned naked girls, and not too much silicone tits and noses. just have to pick the right day.

Went to Suzie Wong first time for months Tuesday, and surprised the line up was a bit better than expected. Not as many fatties[/QUOTE]Good tips, Syzygies. I am looking forward to checking out the crew at CH again. The count down has begun. I hope my favorite is still there. I have not heard from her in over a month.

I have not been to SW since our favorite gal there entered forced retirement. I still keep in touch with her. She is such a sweet girl and possesses a smoking hot body. Unfortunately I am not going to Cambodia this year. Every other year seems about right for me. When I was visiting SW regularly last March/April, another girl began giving me the eye. She was not as tight as ND, but not bad. I will check to see if she is still around when I get to BKK. I don't know her name.

Cowboy Police Precinct has a new inspector in charge. This apparently is now causing cowboy bars to close at 1 am, including Crazy House. This for the time being, no end in sight. So 1 am the lights go out. Outdoor cart bars stay open till wee small hours.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1831122]Cowboy Police Precinct has a new inspector in charge. This apparently is now causing cowboy bars to close at 1 am, including Crazy House. This for the time being, no end in sight. So 1 am the lights go out. Outdoor cart bars stay open till wee small hours.[/QUOTE]What's the normal time gogo bars usually close? I know, somewhat of an odd question but I've never hit them that late at night, usually already picked a girl for the night by then.

So even after years of doing this I have a tough time with the cutting away after I have already been flirting and feeling the girl out and buying drinks. When I realize it isn't working and want to move on the only thing I have figured out to do is to change bars. I would appreciate some insight on how you cut a girl loose without having to leave the bar? Ask her to go get another girl? I constantly have this problem with girls that attach themselves to me as well. Guess maybe I am too polite. I figure I should be polite at that point cause I am not going to be when I have them bent over later. Haha.

[QUOTE=UncleVolodya;1829956]Natty! Don't' let our secrets out to everyone! 555.

I agree with you 100%. Even though it's p4 p sex is still a very personal thing (especially for women) and you have to establish some chemistry with the girl beforehand to get the GFE. This takes some effort, charm and money. Also important to cut the girl loose if you see if its its not going anywhere. Sometimes the chemistry is just not there and its better to move on then force it. Though if you are nice, set a fun mood and spend some money 90% of of the time the time and effort do pay off.

And as you say also important that once you've gotten the GFE to keep things in perspective and remember that in the end it is p4 p and not get carried away.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=MichaelSamuel;1831138]So even after years of doing this I have a tough time with the cutting away after I have already been flirting and feeling the girl out and buying drinks. When I realize it isn't working and want to move on the only thing I have figured out to do is to change bars. I would appreciate some insight on how you cut a girl loose without having to leave the bar? Ask her to go get another girl? I constantly have this problem with girls that attach themselves to me as well. Guess maybe I am too polite. I figure I should be polite at that point cause I am not going to be when I have them bent over later. Haha.[/QUOTE]Good question!

You are Ok at discos. Just be polite and give the girl a BS excuse ("I need to meet my friend. ") and move on to the other side of the club and work other groups of girls. But I agree that it is awkward at gogos and you are right to be sensitive. You don't want the girl to lose face. It may set things down the wrong path with the next girl (particularly if they are friends) .This does not apply to girls that attach themselves. Them, I politely dismiss right away before they get clingy.

Like you I've always moved on to the next bar after rejecting a gogo girl I've been chummy with. But, in retrospect, I don't think its as big deal at the bigger gogos or where there is a big crowd and the rejected girl can find another customer (like CH). Best to move on if it's a smaller and less crowded bar, though. You don't want that rejected girl sitting in the corner alone giving you the evil eye as you try to whisper sweet nothings into the new candidate's ear.

[QUOTE=MichaelSamuel;1831138]So even after years of doing this I have a tough time with the cutting away after I have already been flirting and feeling the girl out and buying drinks. When I realize it isn't working and want to move on the only thing I have figured out to do is to change bars. I would appreciate some insight on how you cut a girl loose without having to leave the bar? Ask her to go get another girl? I constantly have this problem with girls that attach themselves to me as well. Guess maybe I am too polite. I figure I should be polite at that point cause I am not going to be when I have them bent over later. Haha.[/QUOTE]It's not such a big problem as you may feel. Girls will soon disappear from you, if they see a more favorite more regular customer has arrived that takes precedence.

Buying a girl a drink is not a contract to BF her. I resist groping a girl though, if I am not intending to BF her. I am well known for calling over more than one girl for drinks. Later I will select a girl to BF or maybe not. I don't send girls away, if they have done nothing wrong, but I have no problems to call another one over that is more exciting to me. Once you BF a girl, others will sometimes know this is signal they are no longer required unless specifically invited to stay.

So I don't need to change clubs or even change seats in order to focus on a new girl.

Last night bought a drink for one cute newbie girl at Crazy House. No. 140 Grataay (rabbit). However she had to get up on stage to dance. Suddenly then one of my favourites Ging Gaew (#40) turned up in plain clothes as she was about to go out of club to eat. She soon changed her mind though as I would buy her drinks and agree to BF her. She decided she order food upstairs instead. After her dance set, #140 never returned to me. Must have assumed she had been replaced and too shy to come back. Never got to even drink the drink I ordered for her. No big deal since she was not keen originally when leaning against me that I should touch her waist. Probably as a newbie, she was scared I would progress to groping (unfounded).

Quite a lot of new pretty girls seen at CH last night at 11 pm. Line up much better than previous 2 visits. Line up does vary a lot depending on the day visited. It is getting close to end of month. Girls rent will be due soon. Added incentive to turn up to work and try to make money. Ging Gaew had been away for a month, so was very keen to make some money. She also very much hoped I would return for coming birthday.

Mackin and I decided to visit Pat Pong to see what it was like.

North area of Pat Pong 1 seems to have mostly gay and LB bars. Near foodland have Bada Bing and Electric Blue. All downstairs bars appeared to have girls dressed Coyote style (very much over dressed covering the tits area). You can't tell if girls have good tits or not. Despite dressed as Coyotes, only a very few showed any semblance of dancing Coyote style, for most was still the go go shuffle. Very few good dancers. WTF. I wonder what BF price is for the "coyote" girls. Did not actually ask.

Quality of girls in Bada Bing was reasonably good, but not really anything absolutely stunning. There were a few customers sitting around very quietly. Level of business was well behind Bacarra, Crazy, Suzie Wong, etc. Tried Electric Blue but quality of girls there was a big step down from Bada Bing.

Had a look in Star of Light. BJ bar opens at 9 am. The toilet room has been remodelled and there is much more space in there for those wanting private BJ or screw (but no bed of course). One or two girls doable but most ugly.

In Patpong 2 had a look in some upstairs bars where the famous Pat Pong shows occur, e. G. Pussy Magic, Queen's II. Some girls naked. Very very few customers, and quality of the girls was too low to do more than just peak in the door. Miles behind the standard of Crazy House naked girls.

Went also upstairs to Kangaroo bar. This was my very first BJ bar 24 years ago. I was immediately recognised by Som and she remembered my name. She is the one remaining long term girl in this bar since 14 years ago. She estimated my last visit would be 6 to 8 years ago. 3 or 4 moderately cute young girls. Good enough. BJ price still 700 (unchanged after many years) So if feeling like a bit of an orgy, I think I would come to Kangaroo bar. They have a sizable room to make a party. Open at 3 pm. In days long gone by, I sometimes used to make orgies and fuck several girls in the back room. Plenty of groping in the bar area too. So my assessment is I would prefer the Kangaroo bar over SOL, unless wanting early morning action or unless wanting to fuck in the bar like an exhibitionist in not so dim lighting at SOL.

Overall assessment of Pat Pong? It's not going to drag me away from Cowboy or selected Nana bars. Nothing that special, except for Kangaroo bar being better for multiple girl quality than most BJ bars, and ideal for wild orgies assuming little has changed from it's long past days.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1831247]So my assessment is I would prefer the Kangaroo bar over SOL, unless wanting early morning action or unless wanting to fuck in the bar like an exhibitionist in not so dim lighting at SOL.[/QUOTE]

Nice report. I always felt like Kangaroo bar public area is a bit too cramped and uncomfortable. Those sofas at SOL are far more relaxing. Nan at SOL is also very good at what she does, and friendly too boot (albeit not a looker).

Also, Kangaroo charged me 800 baht last time, not 700 like SOL. Not much of a difference but I hate it when the price is whatever they figure out they can charge a particular customer.

[QUOTE=Crocodilexp;1831257]Nice report. I always felt like Kangaroo bar public area is a bit too cramped and uncomfortable. Those sofas at SOL are far more relaxing. Nan at SOL is also very good at what she does, and friendly too boot (albeit not a looker).

Also, Kangaroo charged me 800 baht last time, not 700 like SOL. Not much of a difference but I hate it when the price is whatever they figure out they can charge a particular customer.[/QUOTE]I was quoted 700 for BJ at Kangaroo. There potentially could be a price adjustment for one of a number of things, be it a drink, lady disrobing, use of the large back room, overtime charge, pussy play, etc. I am sure a fuck costs extra. Just speculating. I can't know of course. I don't know how long a customer gets for the 700 Baht. In the past, I was never too happy with fucking in the public bar at SOL for the reason that the girls wanted to fuck for a very short time. e.g. maybe 10 or 15 minutes. Not nearly enough time for me anyway.

I guess Kangaroo does not have the nice sofas in main bar like SOL. However the big back room does have sofas, if you don't mind NOT being on display to all in the bar. Lighting in Kangaroo was really quite dim. That is a slight drawback for me. If I am playing with pussy, I like to be able to see it properly. However Kangaroo girls on average were significantly better looking than at SOL. That is probably the deciding factor for me, perhaps not for everyone.

I remember years ago an old hag at SOL trying to persuade me to take her BJ and arguing that her BJ ability was far more important than her looks. She assumed the experience was all feeling and no visuals. However I wasn't persuaded. I like to play with naked pretty ladies. I am not big on just receiving a sex service. I want to be more active too.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1831247]

Quality of girls in Bada Bing was reasonably good, but not really anything absolutely stunning. There were a few customers sitting around very quietly. Level of business was well behind Bacarra, Crazy, Suzie Wong, etc. Tried Electric Blue but quality of girls there was a big step down from Bada Bing.

[/QUOTE]Thanks for the nice report.

I had a chance to briefly hit Patpong in December and visited both of these bar and this matches my assessment exactly.

I did have a great BBQ dinner at the Smokin' Pug, though. This may bring me nack to the area. But I wouldn't go out of my way just to go to these two bars.

Hello friends,

I am visiting BKK for the first time starting 6/ Feb for 3 days. Have already booked a girl friendly hotel, need some pointers / guidance / contacts of decent first in-call service that I should get into my hotel. Please share reliable contacts which are already experienced by you, rates, service. Within reasonable budget for ST.

My PM is active and any help will be highly appreciated.

Thank you in advance. I can reciprocate with similar contacts in India.

Normally I have no problems at Crazy House because I have my special waitress that looks after me carefully, but not all waitresses are equally good to check carefully with the customer. My waitress will check with me first to ensure all is right.

Special tips-:

1. Check your bill progress to see all is as expected. Keep a count of total number of drinks so no surprises. Bear in mind tequila and a coke (two drinks) could be written as a single line item 320 baht.

2. Order lady drinks with the waitress. Don't allow girls to order with waitress unless you know them well, since she may request two drinks tequila and coke, without you having agreed to offer her two drinks rather than one.

3. When bar is busy drinks may be slow to arrive.

4. Best to offer lady a drink straight after she gets off dancing stage. Otherwise by the time drink arrives, she may have to have gone off to dance.

5. Keep your drinks and bill clearly separated from other customers.

6. If not by yourself, its easier to request separate bills for each guy so that you don't have to keep track of what your buddie's girls are ordering, only your own spend.

7. Bill will record the number of the lady getting a drink.

8. Don't order more drinks till previous drinks are finished. Have seen a girl order another drink with her previous drink untouched. LOL.

9. Watch out for waitresses taking away unfinished drinks.

Mistakes with bills can occur without deliberate cheating, due to misunderstandings, specially as some bargirls have very bad English. I speak Thai but still have communication difficulties due to the noise level.

Care like I specify above can avoid mistakes.

Thinking of going on March.

Anyone going around that time?

Read some old reports that black folks have a hard time getting into some clubs is this true still?

Something funny today. A ladyboy walks into a gogo bar. Farang LB. Very tall, wavy hair, hook nose, very old and very ugly. WTF? Wanted to watch naked girls dancing? Apparently known to frequent Country Road bar.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1831492]Something funny today. A ladyboy walks into a gogo bar. Farang LB. Very tall, wavy hair, hook nose, very old and very ugly. WTF? Wanted to watch naked girls dancing? Apparently known to frequent Country Road bar.[/QUOTE]Walked around at soi 6 Pattaya and also noticed a ladyboy. From a distance she looked like a really sexy girl but once I got closer and she started to scream I knew I had to run hahaha.

[URL]https://youtu.be/5-hL_d4OsIo[/URL]

[QUOTE=Wanderer31;1831362]Hello friends,

I am visiting BKK for the first time starting 6/ Feb for 3 days. Have already booked a girl friendly hotel, need some pointers / guidance / contacts of decent first in-call service that I should get into my hotel. Please share reliable contacts which are already experienced by you, rates, service. Within reasonable budget for ST.

My PM is active and any help will be highly appreciated.

Thank you in advance. I can reciprocate with similar contacts in India.[/QUOTE]The minute you end up in Nana you will understand all this search for contacts etc is nonsense and useless.

Do you check in advance the menu of a buffet?

Do you go to an hotel with top restaurant and eat room service menu?

Just RTFF and remember a few basic points.

ST is about 1500.

LT is about 2500.

BF can be from 300 to 700.

LT doesn't guarantee you all night fuck.

3-somes are a joke: one stays with you on the bed, the other waits in the bathroom you two finished, then they swap.

ST room is about 3/500.

Don't pay in advance.

Soap massage can look expensive but in 90 minutes you can enjoy more than a LT, no need to pay LD, BF, just tip the girl with what is a real tip, not a fee.

Oil massage is not any different, both slippery than wet.

Anything missing? RTFF!

[QUOTE=BionicMan;1831602]The minute you end up in Nana you will understand all this search for contacts etc is nonsense and useless.

Do you check in advance the menu of a buffet?

Do you go to an hotel with top restaurant and eat room service menu?

Just RTFF and remember a few basic points.

ST is about 1500.

LT is about 2500.

BF can be from 300 to 700.

LT doesn't guarantee you all night fuck.

3-somes are a joke: one stays with you on the bed, the other waits in the bathroom you two finished, then they swap.

ST room is about 3/500.

Don't pay in advance.

Soap massage can look expensive but in 90 minutes you can enjoy more than a LT, no need to pay LD, BF, just tip the girl with what is a real tip, not a fee.

Oil massage is not any different, both slippery than wet.

Anything missing? RTFF![/QUOTE]I agree with the above. Just go to Nana or soi cowboy so you can check out the girls. [URL]https://youtu.be/TXQ5v-7REJ0[/URL].

[QUOTE=BionicMan;1831602]
ST is about 1500.

LT is about 2500.

3-somes are a joke: one stays with you on the bed, the other waits in the bathroom you two finished, ![/QUOTE]The prices quoted are for freelance girls on the street. Will cost more in massage shop or bar.

Good threesomes can be had. Suzie Wong Lesbian show girls always performed well for me including lesbian action.

[QUOTE=BionicMan;1831602]The minute you end up in Nana you will understand all this search for contacts etc is nonsense and useless.

Anything missing? RTFF![/QUOTE]Perfect response!

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1831692]The prices quoted are for freelance girls on the street. Will cost more in massage shop or bar.

Good threesomes can be had. Suzie Wong Lesbian show girls always performed well for me including lesbian action.[/QUOTE]Certainly, bro' (Ahahahahahhaah), but whilst it is expectable to pay more at bars (as you need to add BF LD and their bit higher fee, especially as now the bars have an habit to present you a printed price list for that, making it official and non-negotiable) the FL's might try to screw s newbie as this guy appears to be (only a newbie can out those questions for BKK).

Same is for three some's: the guy looks like the perfect target for the one by one 3-some. So better be aware.

What you describe at SW requires a bit of knowledge of the ground. Not this case.

[QUOTE=BionicMan;1831730]Certainly, bro' (Ahahahahahhaah), but whilst it is expectable to pay more at bars (as you need to add BF LD and their bit higher fee, especially as now the bars have an habit to present you a printed price list for that, making it official and non-negotiable) the FL's might try to screw s newbie as this guy appears to be (only a newbie can out those questions for BKK).

Same is for three some's: the guy looks like the perfect target for the one by one 3-some. So better be aware.

What you describe at SW requires a bit of knowledge of the ground. Not this case.[/QUOTE]I agree its good to make newbies of how things can go badly or not to plan. I also warn that prices can be higher than you state lest they get a bad shock. Good experiences are also possible.

I have not seen the "non negotiable" price boards myself. I guess it's used for newbies. I avoid mamasans at all costs. Newbies should avoid girls that cannot speak English well enough, perhaps, to avoid lots of misunderstandings.

I urge newbies to adjust the way they speak English. Pronounce clearly, speak very slowly, and use simple plain words avoiding slang and euphemisms and words specific to their home country. I am continually amazed in the sports pub hearing customers speaking English to the waitresses in a way that they clearly do not understand. These customers made no effort at all to adjust the way they speak. I sometimes have to translate into simple English to help the staff get the message. The other night I am sitting in a portable street bar with some girls. Bar has one Ladyboy who speaks reasonably good English, yet an American and the LB were having some trouble understanding each other. I could understand both of them perfectly well. Just a case of getting used to accents and vocab used I guess. At first I thought the American was a gay (based on his manner), but then seemed he wanted to go with a chinese looking girl. However Chinese girl's regular Japanese customer had arrived (bad luck). The very good looking ladyboy seemed to be able to communicate better with an Italian guy. His English was easier to understand as he spoke slower. The LB wanted 2000 Baht. The Italian wanted her to go with him for free. Yeh right, like the LB is going to enjoy the experience so much that she would go for free. LOL LB still has a dick I gather (only recently got the tits enhanced). I am always puzzled how guys can go with a LB who still has a dick. I am a pussy man myself.

I agree you have to find the right type of non-shy girls to avoid the one by one threesome that isn't a threesome at all. I don't really understand why one girl has to hide in the toilet. I really only experienced that once and thought (at the time) girl was in the toilet mainly due to drinking too much and feeling sick. When came to her turn, she seemed too sick to do anything much (had been a good screw sober previously). I have never taken her again after that shit performance. Lucky one of the two girls performed well. Was not girls from Suzi.

Surely girl has seen someone fucking before, even if only in porn. Good girls participate. Like fondle or lick your balls while the other girl does your shaft.

[QUOTE=BionicMan;1831730](. . .) and their bit higher fee, especially as now the bars have an habit to present you a printed price list for that, making it official and non-negotiable[/QUOTE]Haha, that's an old trick. Because someone took the effort of printing and laminating it, it must be "official". I have seen it done already 5 or 6 years ago in a club in NEP and then again in a gogo in Walking Street Pattaya. They will also try to convince you that you have to pay up-front in the bar.

Simply smile and say no. Most likely the "tariff" will disappear quickly and all will be normal.

[QUOTE=Wanderer31;1831362]Hello friends,

I am visiting BKK for the first time starting 6/ Feb for 3 days. Have already booked a girl friendly hotel, need some pointers / guidance / contacts of decent first in-call service that I should get into my hotel. Please share reliable contacts which are already experienced by you, rates, service. Within reasonable budget for ST.

My PM is active and any help will be highly appreciated.

Thank you in advance. I can reciprocate with similar contacts in India.[/QUOTE]No need to wait for contacts! Go to sukhamvit area and wander in nana bars, ambassador disco etc. Here is open market so choose and play!

Following is a brief report on my one day in Bangkok.

Been to three places, Nana plaza, VIP club and cowboy.

Nana Plaza was a disappointment. Wasnt allowed entry into are&be, most likely as I am Indian. They should probably just keep a board saying so, saves time for both the parties. Didn't feel like hanging around Nana too long. Had some food at Hillary 2 and got out.

This is my third time at VIP club (don't remember the soi, but in the same Soi as Bangkok Beats and Dr BJ). And it has always performed. Not a large collection, but you will find one or two to your liking. Good thing is if you want to screw a girl, you don't need to BF them. They have rooms within their club itself and they only charge for the service, not for the room. 1 k for a BJ. Picked Mickey, good looking, small tits, loves to please. More on her later.

Third stop. Kiss at soi cowboy. Only girl worthy mentioning, Fai. Extremely cute, well shaped breasts and a great attitude. Wanted to BF her, but unfortunately Kiss doesn't allow that, or so I am told. The club closes at 1 AM, and it was just 1030 PM so figured no point hanging around, as the LD were expensive, at 480 Bhts.

Returned to VIP, BFed Mickey for 1 k, and came back to the hotel. Had three sessions for 3 k. Open to all positions, no Anal, ok for BBBJ, nice tattoo. Pics will follow.

Stayed at Majestic Suites, very convenient on the main road, just off Soi 4.

[QUOTE=Optional1;1832042]Following is a brief report on my one day in Bangkok.

Been to three places, Nana plaza, VIP club and cowboy.

Nana Plaza was a disappointment. Wasnt allowed entry into are&be, most likely as I am Indian. They should probably just keep a board saying so, saves time for both the parties. Didn't feel like hanging around Nana too long. Had some food at Hillary 2 and got out.

This is my third time at VIP club (don't remember the soi, but in the same Soi as Bangkok Beats and Dr BJ). And it has always performed. Not a large collection, but you will find one or two to your liking. Good thing is if you want to screw a girl, you don't need to BF them. They have rooms within their club itself and they only charge for the service, not for the room. 1 k for a BJ. Picked Mickey, good looking, small tits, loves to please. More on her later.

Third stop. Kiss at soi cowboy. Only girl worthy mentioning, Fai. Extremely cute, well shaped breasts and a great attitude. Wanted to BF her, but unfortunately Kiss doesn't allow that, or so I am told. The club closes at 1 AM, and it was just 1030 PM so figured no point hanging around, as the LD were expensive, at 480 Bhts.

Returned to VIP, BFed Mickey for 1 k, and came back to the hotel. Had three sessions for 3 k. Open to all positions, no Anal, ok for BBBJ, nice tattoo. Pics will follow.

Stayed at Majestic Suites, very convenient on the main road, just off Soi 4.[/QUOTE]At Nana there are other bars. I don't go in R&B either and I am not Indian. Have seen plenty of Indians in Mercury as example. Mandarin upstairs has good talent.

In Cowboy you cannot BF Coyote girls except in Cowboy2 or Dollhouse. Suzi Wong would have been a better choice for you.

[QUOTE=Wanderer31;1831362]Hello friends,

I am visiting BKK for the first time starting 6/ Feb for 3 days. Have already booked a girl friendly hotel, need some pointers / guidance / contacts of decent first in-call service that I should get into my hotel. Please share reliable contacts which are already experienced by you, rates, service. Within reasonable budget for ST.

My PM is active and any help will be highly appreciated.

Thank you in advance. I can reciprocate with similar contacts in India.[/QUOTE]Wanderer31,

Its open season in LOS, all you need to do is go to the Clubs, the Go Go's or Beer Bars. Just go out, find someone to your liking and speak to them.

I have RTFF and have been keeping myself updated with all the forums of Thailand and have been planning accordingly for my trip which is coming up very soon.

In India it is a bit difficult to find girls and so exchanging numbers of girls is common but here its different.

Plus someones liking might not match yours, so it would be better to go out and enjoy yourself,

TheTank

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1831750]I agree its good to make newbies of how things can go badly or not to plan. I also warn that prices can be higher than you state lest they get a bad shock. Good experiences are also possible.

[/QUOTE]Nearly all gogo's have the laminated price lists, making them legitimate. Of course they aren't. Still, when they smell the newbie they will stick to it, take it or leave it. The regular mongers either are known or will not even bother to look at the card and go for the market price, the girl will accept it.

At the end of the day it is the same attempt girls on escort website do. Ask for 4000 for a ST when they are happy to cash 1000 when picked up from the street where they work. They know the guys booking on websites are a different kind and do not hit the roads.

Why one of the two waits in the bathroom? Simple. Despite Thailand seems an open air brothel (in specific areas of course) the girls seem easygoing having sex (for money) because of culture (not rated as a drama as it is elsewhere), the still are prude and conservative on sex habits. So a three-some is considered a perversion they are not keen to be part of. Money lures them, so they push for a three some (two will get money with one guy, it is an upselling) but it does not mean they are keen on being or practising bisexual practices. Exceptions are there, of course. The smart ones do play well so the tag team gets popular and more popular, being everyone's dream to have two or more girls taking care of him.

With regard to the language barrier, you well pointed an issue. Non native English speakers do better with the girls than native English speakers. They use more simple expressions, smaller vocabulary kept to essential, no need of elaborated sentences, no slang, no twisted words. Same as the girls, at the end. So the dialogue is on equal basis. Not to mention some thick accents you hear here and there. Most likely it is the same as an up northern British, as a Cumbrian or Scottish and a southern England or cockney accent: world apart, in a way. What happens is often like a dialogue between a deep Texas guy and a old Londoner sticking to his language roots. They might need google to help! LOL.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1832045]At Nana there are other bars. I don't go in R&B either and I am not Indian. Have seen plenty of Indians in Mercury as example. Mandarin upstairs has good talent.

In Cowboy you cannot BF Coyote girls except in Cowboy2 or Dollhouse. Suzi Wong would have been a better choice for you.[/QUOTE]Thanks for the pointers. Yeah, I did try some other bars there too. Found the girls there generally too pushy for tips and lady drinks. I am generalizing based on a couple of bars I visited, so feel free to rip me apart if that's not the case.

[QUOTE=Optional1;1832042] Kiss at soi cowboy.....as the LD were expensive, at 480 Bhts.[/QUOTE]That's insane! That's almost BF for some clubs.

I copied the following from this thread in my Thailand notes.

[QUOTE]AVOID in SOI COWBOY - so called Arab's bars (there are seven of them) Rio, Kiss, Deja Vu, Midnite, Sahara, Rawhide, spice Girls.[/QUOTE]

It has been said many times on this forum. Avoid the Arab's Bars: Rio, Kiss, Deja Vu, Midnite, Sahara, Rawhide, and Spice Girls.

However, they do employ some incredibly cute young girls to stand outside of Midnight and Kiss in particular and try mostly in vain to coax punters into their bars for drinks. I am always drawn to a pretty face and hot body so sometimes when I am in no particular hurry I stop and flirt with an especially enticing good looking shill. It always comes down to a friendly Mexican standoff as the pretty girl tries and fails to pull me into her bar and I faux fail to carry her away to my hotel room. The conversation eventually goes something like this: Cuttie,"Why you no come my bar?" Me, "Why you no come my hotel. You no go my hotel, I no go your bar. " Ha Ha. Too bad. It is such a waste of talent and commercial space. Maybe lightning will strike one day and one of the cuties will ask to see me later after closing. You never know, but I am not holding my breath. Or maybe the so called "Arab" will close up shop and go away, but he has been around for a long time - 5 or 6 years at least. The money laundering and / or real estate speculation business must be doing all right cause hardly anyone goes into his bars.

Dear Seniors,

Me & my friend were planning for a week long trip to BKK / Pattaya, but he dropped himself out due to personal reasons. Now I don't want to lose this plan so planning to continue alone.

I just want to know, for a First time Solo traveler how safe is BKK / Pattaya in terms of Mongering, Transportation, sight seeing & other fun activities. Since it's my first time I'm kind of in dilemma whether to go alone or not.

I read various threads in forum & saw in few reports people with not much experience get cheated or get bad service in other words.

I'm sure the experienced seniors over here will definitely be able to help me out. I'd appreciate if you can mention something specific to keep in mind. TIA.

Regards,

Fellow monger.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;1832253]It has been said many times on this forum. Avoid the Arab's Bars: Rio, Kiss, Deja Vu, Midnite, Sahara, Rawhide, and Spice Girls.

However, they do employ some incredibly cute young girls to stand outside of Midnight and Kiss in particular and try mostly in vain to coax punters into their bars for drinks. I am always drawn to a pretty face and hot body so sometimes when I am in no particular hurry I stop and flirt with an especially enticing good looking shill. It always comes down to a friendly Mexican standoff as the pretty girl tries and fails to pull me into her bar and I faux fail to carry her away to my hotel room. The conversation eventually goes something like this: Cuttie,"Why you no come my bar?" Me, "Why you no come my hotel. You no go my hotel, I no go your bar. " Ha Ha. Too bad. It is such a waste of talent and commercial space. Maybe lightning will strike one day and one of the cuties will ask to see me later after closing. You never know, but I am not holding my breath. Or maybe the so called "Arab" will close up shop and go away, but he has been around for a long time - 5 or 6 years at least. The money laundering and / or real estate speculation business must be doing all right cause hardly anyone goes into his bars.[/QUOTE]Adding the places to avoid to my list also long with ignoring any laminated cards with prices.

Thanks!

Crazy House line up was quite good Wednesday. Today Saturday it seemed to have dropped off.

My favourites Paeng, Ging, Oom were missing. Noi arrived late as I left at 9. 30 PM. Naen was BFed early. Nan & Jane missing. Some girls I know were present but I am not interested in them any longer: Bpoom, Naam, May, Bo, Kafee / Krataen, Mon.

No. 112 was slightly interesting, closest to my spec. Only bought 2 drinks over about 90 minutes but nothing stunning arrived. Generally dull evening. My favourites at an Asoke portable cart bar were missing also.

Ended up helping a waitress at @Corner bar practice her English. She was all natural good looker aged 25 but looked 19.

Hi guys.

This March is going to be in Bangkok for me and I am coming after 10 years.

Guess lot has changed and reading the forum is over whelming.

Anybody wants to join and monger together?

I am almost a newbie in LOS.

Cheers.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;1832253]It has been said many times on this forum. Avoid the Arab's Bars: Rio, Kiss, Deja Vu, Midnite, Sahara, Rawhide, and Spice Girls.

However, they do employ some incredibly cute young girls to stand outside of Midnight and Kiss in particular and try mostly in vain to coax punters into their bars for drinks. I am always drawn to a pretty face and hot body so sometimes when I am in no particular hurry I stop and flirt with an especially enticing good looking shill. It always comes down to a friendly Mexican standoff as the pretty girl tries and fails to pull me into her bar and I faux fail to carry her away to my hotel room. The conversation eventually goes something like this: Cuttie,"Why you no come my bar?" Me, "Why you no come my hotel. You no go my hotel, I no go your bar. " Ha Ha. Too bad. It is such a waste of talent and commercial space. Maybe lightning will strike one day and one of the cuties will ask to see me later after closing. You never know, but I am not holding my breath. [/QUOTE]Once Cowboy bars started employing bait girls and coyotes; it was over for me. The sale of Midnight, a great bar I was usually in 3 to 4 nights a week, in '04 I think, marked the beginning of the end of Cowboy as a great place to hang out IMHO. Before his purchase all drinks were 100 baht, BF was 500 but included the ST room upstairs, and gals were happy with 1k. Once he bought the bar prices increased up and down the soi for drinks, BF, and gals. Up until then BF at Long Gun was 400 baht. And it truly was a hangout for expats. Now really a neon tourist attraction.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1832288]Crazy House line up was quite good Wednesday. Today Saturday it seemed to have dropped off.

My favourites Paeng, Ging, Oom were missing. Noi arrived late as I left at 9. 30 PM. Naen was BFed early. Nan & Jane missing. Some girls I know were present but I am not interested in them any longer: Bpoom, Naam, May, Bo, Kafee / Krataen, Mon.

No. 112 was slightly interesting, closest to my spec. Only bought 2 drinks over about 90 minutes but nothing stunning arrived. Generally dull evening. My favourites at an Asoke portable cart bar were missing also.

Ended up helping a waitress at @Corner bar practice her English. She was all natural good looker aged 25 but looked 19.[/QUOTE]Agree, Crazy House's stage was strangely sparse last night, Saturday, especially considering it was two days before rent is due. I went in with friends who hadn't been there before and I had little to no intention of barfining a girl anyway. But the trend with the girls who approached my group trended toward the worst Crazy House girl tactic of coming off the stage, hitting a guy up for a Lady Drink, then the moment the drink arrives and a single sip has been taken to apologize because "I have to go dance now", but never returning to the stage and more or less disappearing into the abyss.

I have no problem buying Lady Drinks for Crazy House girls I have already taken and enjoyed once already, will buy one as I did last night for a girl new to me when I am really only interested in observing their behavior up close and not necessarily in barfining them. But my absolute best experiences with Crazy House girls with regard to barfining them out and getting treated well in the room is when I don't buy a Lady Drink at all (or perhaps one after a barfine deal has already been struck and settled), cover the key interview questions the moment they approach me for the customary naked brush against me at my seat and, assuming they pass the key interview question or two, tell them I want to pay the barfine now and let's go. LOL. IMO, that is a much better way to ensure quality ST service with a Crazy House girl than to go along with their Lady Drink Sucker Collection program and easing into the interview process after their drink arrives.

Have been struck by the downturn in quality of the girls, looks-wise that is, at Kasalong and L0 lita's BJ bars lately. There used to be several slim or at least average proportioned cuties sitting outside those bars. For a while after the Kasalong Bar opening, there seemed to be a contest between that bar and L0 lita's for lookers. This is the first time I have said this since Kasalong Bar opened, but I do believe slimmer, cuter and sexier girls can be found at Som's Haven now than in either Kasalong or L0 lita's.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1832448]Agree, Crazy House's stage was strangely sparse last night, Saturday, especially considering it was two days before rent is due. I went in with friends who hadn't been there before and I had little to no intention of barfining a girl anyway. But the trend with the girls who approached my group trended toward the worst Crazy House girl tactic of coming off the stage, hitting a guy up for a Lady Drink, then the moment the drink arrives and a single sip has been taken to apologize because "I have to go dance now", but never returning to the stage and more or less disappearing into the abyss.

I have no problem buying Lady Drinks for Crazy House girls I have already taken and enjoyed once already, will buy one as I did last night for a girl new to me when I am really only interested in observing their behavior up close and not necessarily in barfining them. But my absolute best experiences with Crazy House girls with regard to barfining them out and getting treated well in the room is when I don't buy a Lady Drink at all (or perhaps one after a barfine deal has already been struck and settled), cover the key interview questions the moment they approach me for the customary naked brush against me at my seat and, assuming they pass the key interview question or two, tell them I want to pay the barfine now and let's go. LOL. IMO, that is a much better way to ensure quality ST service with a Crazy House girl than to go along with their Lady Drink Sucker Collection program and easing into the interview process after their drink arrives.

Have been struck by the downturn in quality of the girls, looks-wise that is, at Kasalong and L0 lita's BJ bars lately. There used to be several slim or at least average proportioned cuties sitting outside those bars. For a while after the Kasalong Bar opening, there seemed to be a contest between that bar and L0 lita's for lookers. This is the first time I have said this since Kasalong Bar opened, but I do believe slimmer, cuter and sexier girls can be found at Som's Haven now than in either Kasalong or L0 lita's.[/QUOTE]I already warned in a previous post not to buy a lady drink toward the end of a 20 min set. If buying them a tequila, it normally is consumed very quickly. Ladies are 20 minutes on stage and 20 minutes off. Normally ladies return to me. Its not guaranteed though especially if they already have some other regular customer. Naen did not come to me last night due to having a customer about to BF her. She left soon after. Ladies get about 50 Baht from each drink sold. So a 100 Baht tip is like buying them two drinks, but costs you significantly less (100 instead of 320). However I recognise that the bar has to make money too.

I visited Sunday, Tues, Wed, and Sat with only the Wed line up having major interest with some exciting new girls. So CH is in a bit of a slump right now. Some of best girls are not showing up or showing up very late at 9. 30 PM. I guess plenty of hot bodies at 9. 30 PM, but I have to like the face as well. I did not call a single girl over for a drink last night. I have to have a spark first or find the girl rather pretty. I wasn't specially horny anyway, otherwise would have called number 112 who was pretty enough with nice tits. Mainly was looking for favourites who weren't there. Wed 3 Feb will be a good night to attend. Should be Payday.

Two plus years ago, Crazy House was in its early days with a small line up but almost every girl was really hot. Few of those early girls remain. Maybe Kaafee (Krataen) is one, with short hair, very toned slim coffee coloured body and quite a few tats. She arrived late last night at nearly 9. 30 PM.

I am wondering if early closing at 1 PM is having an influence on line ups. Recent visit to Suzi Wong saw somewhat few girls in the total line up. Although that coincided with the very cold weather. Many girls could not shower at home because they don't have hot water and the cold water was far colder than normal.

For BJs, I don't really have any girl to recommend, since I take Anne at Lollitas (double L avoids codeword restrictions) for fuck rather than for BJ, as she has braces on teeth but a very cute ass. I intend to visit Kangaroo again for a multi girl orgy (when feeling powerful).

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1832437]Once Cowboy bars started employing bait girls and coyotes; it was over for me. The sale of Midnight, a great bar I was usually in 3 to 4 nights a week, in '04 I think, marked the beginning of the end of Cowboy as a great place to hang out IMHO. Before his purchase all drinks were 100 baht, BF was 500 but included the ST room upstairs, and gals were happy with 1k. Once he bought the bar prices increased up and down the soi for drinks, BF, and gals. Up until then BF at Long Gun was 400 baht. And it truly was a hangout for expats. Now really a neon tourist attraction.[/QUOTE]I also was a Long Gun customer about 9 to 12 years ago. Very tall nude dancer Noi was very hot for looks but crap on the bed (at least for me). Special show dancer Ning was very skinny but very beautiful and sexy. I would go just to watch her show sometimes.

About 4. 5 years ago, I took Anna, a special show dancer at Midnite, upstairs for a very enthusiastic fuck. She seemed to be a little high and forgot about the time, so we got a pretty long ST. She was very slim and cute. Cost was obviously more than 1 K. I forget how much. So rumours that the Arab was trying to stamp out sex did not make much sense.

She now works at Mercury as a Coyote (easily the best dancer). Rumoured to do BB with some customers. I don't know if its true. Tits are a very small and a little bit saggy. However was still a good fuck this year, without being outstanding. Greedy type of personality. Asks for a lot of drinks. Coyote girls have a very high quota of drinks they have to sell to get their full monthly salary. So I don't usually have much to do with Coyotes. She was an exception due to previously enjoying a fuck with her.

24 years ago, I attended Midnite Upstairs bar run by two Australians at the time. LT girl fee was 400 or 500 Baht. There was a Thai with a share in the business too and he later cheated the Aussies out of their share somehow. The downstairs was later remodelled to take over from the upstairs bar.

I see a lot of the girls outside the Arab bars trying to pull customers, no longer have the traditional Coyote costume, of cut off jeans shorts. They are now wearing tight panties and outfit is somewhat more revealing. Perhaps this is an effort to try to pull more customers, and not be so obviously Coyote.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1832492]I already warned in a previous post not to buy a lady drink toward the end of a 20 min set. Ladies are 20 minutes on stage and 20 minutes off. [/QUOTE]I found that was an issue at both CH and Baccara. Girls leave too often and need to continuously buy drinks. At clubs like Sapphire in Pattaya they rotate 5 groups of 20 girls for stage so if you buy a drink the girl does not leave you for quite some time. I may end up buying the same amount of drinks but it is frustrating at clubs where the girl continuously leaves you to go on stage.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;1832506]I found that was an issue at both CH and Baccara. Need to continuously buy drinks. At clubs like Sapphire they rotate 5 groups of 20 girls for stage so if you buy a drink the girl does not leave you for quite some time.[/QUOTE]Sounds good at Sapphire although I suppose girls are not nude.

No, there is no need to continuously buy drinks. One drink per girl per 20 minutes off the stage is okay Sometimes more drinks if generous, depending if the girl is really worth it. Sometimes losing the girl for 20 minutes after that is a blessing. LOL. If I cannot stand the thought that girl will leave me, and some other guy may call her, the simple remedy is to BF her. Then she does not need to go away to dance any longer. With a girl like Ging Gaew (#40), it is too risky to allow her to go dance with her big luscious tits bouncing and mesmerising other guys who will suddenly be desperate to grab and fondle them. Therefore best to BF her fairly quickly. She prefers that, over being called over by numerous guys who want to molest her without BFing her. Never ever saw Ging spend very much time dancing on the stage. Customers just can't allow that. However cannot drag a girl off the stage without buying her a drink (or BFing or both).

You can imagine that girls get very bored being called over by numerous customers who want to grab. Some will buy her a drink, and some will even try to get out of that. However making just 50 Baht (drink commission) for being molested is not seen as that great by girls.

Hi guys,

I keep transiting from LOS but all time I just have few hours in night like 1 AM till next day 5 PM. I want to make my best of this time.

Interested to checkout nightclubs, take blowjobs, pick up girl specially FL and also want to try LB. Need your help to plan where to stay and what places to go. As time is a constrain need a good planing.

TIA

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1832492]I already warned in a previous post not to buy a lady drink toward the end of a 20 min set. If buying them a tequila, it normally is consumed very quickly. Ladies are 20 minutes on stage and 20 minutes off. [/QUOTE]Sure. But that isn't what I was reporting happening. I am talking about Crazy House girls who spend the 20 minutes dancing on stage making eye contact and encouraging smiles with me and other guys around me, coming off the stage with all the other girls after their 20 minutes dancing time was finished, making a bee line for us to request sitting for Lady Drinks, then taking a single sip and telling us they "have to go dance now" and disappearing into the darkness or upstairs or to the toilet or wherever no more than 5-6 minutes after they had just come off the stage with all the other girls who were dancing on stage after their 20 minute dance time was finished. I am talking about a hardcore Lady Drink hustle and vanish pattern. And I don't mean all of these girls did this at the same time as some sort of team. It happened over the course of two or three different 20 minute set changes, always immediately after their 20 minutes on stage times were finished.

By the third or fourth time it happened at our side of the seating area, we all pretty much concluded "fuck it", settled up our bills and walked out for better drinking and hunting grounds than Crazy House on this night.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1832705]Sure. But that isn't what I was reporting happening. I am talking about Crazy House girls who spend the 20 minutes dancing on stage making eye contact and encouraging smiles with me and other guys around me, coming off the stage with all the other girls after their 20 minutes dancing time was finished, making a bee line for us to request sitting for Lady Drinks, then taking a single sip and telling us they "have to go dance now" and disappearing into the darkness or upstairs or to the toilet or wherever no more than 5-6 minutes after they had just come off the stage with all the other girls who were dancing on stage after their 20 minute dance time was finished. I am talking about a hardcore Lady Drink hustle and vanish pattern. And I don't mean all of these girls did this at the same time as some sort of team. It happened over the course of two or three different 20 minute set changes, always immediately after their 20 minutes on stage times were finished.

By the third or fourth time it happened at our side of the seating area, we all pretty much concluded "fuck it", settled up our bills and walked out for better drinking and hunting grounds than Crazy House on this night.[/QUOTE]I don't see any such pattern like this. So your report is mystifying. There no such conspiracy. Individual girls could behave strangely of course.

I am in there regularly. I see what girls are doing with customers. I don't see what you describe and it makes little sense. What is so special about you that would make you be discrimated against systematically like this.
What made the girls run away so quickly? You are the only common link. Clearly they did not like you?

Why did you buy the girls a drink? Did you call them to you? or did they come of their own decision? It's all a bit confusing. It doesn't to me or anyone else I have noticed.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1832789]I don't see any such pattern like this. So your report is mystifying. There no such conspiracy. Individual girls could behave strangely of course.

I am in there regularly. I see what girls are doing with customers. I don't see what you describe and it makes little sense. What is so special about you that would make you be discrimated against systematically like this.
What made the girls run away so quickly? You are the only common link. Clearly they did not like you?

Why did you buy the girls a drink? Did you call them to you? or did they come of their own decision? It's all a bit confusing. It doesn't to me or anyone else I have noticed.[/QUOTE]Syzygies, if you haven't noticed that happening in Crazy House, not all the time but often, then you are way too focused on who does or doesn't have a nose job to see what is going on. I know a few other expats who are very familiar with that kind of Lady Drink hustle and vanish routine in Crazy House, see it happening to other customers and have it happen to them on occasion as it did with me on Saturday. LOL. No, there isn't anything "special" about me that made it happen "only" to me and other guys around me. And nobody said anything about it being a conspiracy. It is simply one of the most commonly pulled hustles in any bar, no conspiracy required; the girl gets one dude to buy her a Lady Drink, pockets the commission ticket, excuses herself for whatever reason, "have to go dance now" being a convenient one in bars where there is more than one dance area so they can use the second location as an excuse if it comes up later (even though they never stepped on the other stage) and then moves to another part of the bar to get another dude to buy her a Lady Drink. Girls at Crazy House do it just as often and perhaps more so than in any other bar.

I suppose now you're going to tell me you have never heard or seen something like that happening anywhere else either, right? And that of all places, no such thing could ever occur more than once a year or two at Crazy House. And then only under very "special" and understandable circumstances like the customer must have been a very bad man or something like that, right? LOL.

The only thing "special" about what was happening on this Saturday night was none of these girls was pretending to be too drunk to realize what they were doing (a popular tactic for this kind of hustle but usually needs to be later in evening) and it didn't seem these 3-4 girls moved to another part of the ground level bar area to find the second sucker. They were not seen sitting around this or that side of the stage with another customer, I mean. But there are dark sides of the bar near the big speakers in the back where they check in so it was entirely possible that is where they went to get the second or third Lady Drink buyer. It is also entirely possible that one or more of those particular girls spotted a regular customer across the room, signaled to each other and the girl went upstairs to change into their street clothes to leave the bar.

I was sitting in the front right corner (as you walk in) booth seating area, not on a stool on the other side. And, no, neither I nor anyone else I saw this happening to around me got up to go searching for the girls. We just looked around where it was easy to see from our vantage point and did not see them. But the larger point was we could all see the stage very well and didn't see those "have to go dance now" girls dancing either. btw, I have watched girls in Crazy House and other bars step off the stage at the end of a dance session, sit with a customer for the 4-5 minutes it takes to get a Lady Drink agreed to, delivered and the commission ticket pocketed and then almost immediately excuse themselves to walk over to ME as the second Lady Drink target! lol

SmooThiE Eih T,

It must be indeed rare for any guy to have a succession of different girls visit him. I have seen a guy entertained by one girl, seemingly get bored by her and then focus on another, but never saw a guy switching girls a lot. Has happened I have seen the reverse.

One girl Chocolate requested a drink from a guy, got it and quickly moved to another guy. I guess she scammed three or more guys in succession. I refused her. That was a long time ago I saw such behavior. Never saw too many girls do that and certainly not a string of them do it to the sane guy. It is very uncommon in my my view. I only ever saw 1 or two girls with that behavior. Chocolate and maybe Kratae.

Anyway guys normally refuse to buy drinks for girls unless the guy called the girl over. Normally girls will stay with a guy to get further drinks unless they have another customer or target.

I ignore girls coming to me unless I called them to come. Occasionally happens girl tells me she has another customer or has to go to the toilet. Happens but rare.

Its just occured to me what could have happened. If you call a girl iff the stage before her dance set is finished, she may order a drink and then return to the stage to finish her dance set, before returning to the customer. However you clearly wrote that this did not happen.

I have had a girl too shy to return to me after her 20 min set when she saw I had another girl now with me.

Also could happen a girl did not like me due to me being too old or black eyes. Again rare. Girls could run away from bad underarm BO I suppose or very bad breath or pussy gropers.

EihTooms, I am really at a loss. All I can say is [RED] this has NEVER happened to me in Crazy House.[/RED] In fact I have experienced the exact opposite with CH girls not only wanting to keep me company during their entire off stage set, but wanting to return and asking me to stay until they return after their next dance set. And many times I have their best girlfriends and sisters hanging around too. Sometimes its hard to get rid of all them hangers on and I have to cut off their drink supply, temporarily, and suggest they go find a customer of their own. LOL.

I am not trying to discredit your experience or what you are reporting, but it is puzzling. If it had happened to me I would be ticked off at the girl big time. If it happened to me more than one time in a particular Go Go I would stop frequenting that Go Go. And if it happened to me several times in different Go Go's over a short span of time I would begin to question what I was doing wrong to invoke such a response. I am not saying you are doing anything wrong.

A few days ago another BM reported on a similar thing happening to him in Alcatraz Go Go in Pattaya. I posted that this has happened to me only one time in all my Go Go experiences going back to '89. So this "Lady Drink hustle and vanish routine" is just something I am not aware of at all. Indecently, I never bought that girl who ditched me another drink although she did come over to me with a big smile a couple of nights later. Ha Ha.

In conclusion, I always have a pretty good time in CH. I can't wait to go back.

CH is in decline for me. Once was a bar full of young slim naked natural girls. Now seems headed toward Bacarra in that numbers of fake noses is on the rise. Also a few silicones. Number of natural pretty faces dropping.

A hot girl I would like to do, Jane, visited bar with her customer for just a few minutes in plain clothes. She is currently in high demand.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1832934]SmooThiE Eih T,

It must be indeed rare for any guy to have a succession of different girls visit him. I have seen a guy entertained by one girl, seemingly get bored by her and then focus on another, but never saw a guy switching girls a lot. Has happened I have seen the reverse.

[/QUOTE]Not that the scenario you led with here has anything to do with what I wrote, it really doesn't, but are you actually saying now that it is rare for you to notice any guy being visited by a succession of different girls in a go-go bar, specifically Crazy House? If so, I would classify that as a mystifying comment.

However, the last sentence in the quote above is getting dangerously close to vaguely agreeing with what I mentioned happened to me and what I observed in other cases Saturday night. Are you sure you meant to post that? Maybe not too late for you to amend it, you know.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;1832935]EihTooms, I am really at a loss. All I can say is [RED] this has NEVER happened to me in Crazy House.[/RED][/QUOTE]Yes, Natty Bumpo, the only conclusion anyone can come to including me is I am the only customer it has ever happened to in Crazy House since the place opened. Because I am "special". Certainly, no one has ever even seen it happen to another customer. Other than me, that is.

It is a well known fact that, other than with me, every girl in Crazy House steps off the stage, makes a bee line for the nearest customer, convinces him to buy her a Lady Drink and then all of them every single one of them no exceptions always sits dutifully next to the guy for the full 20 minutes' down time without budging or making an excuse to leave their drink virtually untouched while they go to another area of the bar to see if they can negotiate another Lady Drink commission before their time to return to the stage. Been that way with every girl who ever worked in Crazy House from the very beginning. And that is why what happened to me (never mind that it happened to other guys that same night) never happens in Crazy House. Probably never happens in any other Bangkok go-go bar for that matter. Except to me, of course.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1833039]Not that the scenario you led with here has anything to do with what I wrote, it really doesn't, but are you actually saying now that it is rare for you to notice any guy being visited by a succession of different girls in a go-go bar, specifically Crazy House? If so, I would classify that as a mystifying comment.

However, the last sentence in the quote above is getting dangerously close to vaguely agreeing with what I mentioned happened to me and what I observed in other cases Saturday night. Are you sure you meant to post that? Maybe not too late for you to amend it, you know.[/QUOTE]I have seen a bad girl switching guys too often jumping from one ti another. How ever not many girls are that bad so I did not see it often. I did not see same guy scammed by several girls in succession. Does not make it impossible. Just rare in what I am normally seeing.

EihTooms, thanks for your report. I will see if any of this bad behavior happens to me when I return to BKK though I doubt it.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;1832935]EihTooms, I am really at a loss. All I can say is [RED] this has NEVER happened to me in Crazy House.[/RED] In fact I have experienced the exact opposite with CH girls not only wanting to keep me company during their entire off stage set, but wanting to return and asking me to stay until they return after their next dance set. And many times I have their best girlfriends and sisters hanging around too. Sometimes its hard to get rid of all them hangers on and I have to cut off their drink supply, temporarily, and suggest they go find a customer of their own. LOL.
[/QUOTE]Just a friendly comment that yours would have probably been less inflammatory without the red highlighting and capitalization of the word "never. " Just sayin' given the reaction it got.

[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1833157]Just a friendly comment that yours would have probably been less inflammatory without the red highlighting and capitalization of the word "never. " Just sayin' given the reaction it got.[/QUOTE]Perhaps. No offense was intended, but never is my experience. Look, a lot of this remains in mystery. We don't have the full picture of what happened and never will. Think of the great Japanese film "Rashomon" and POV. If I wanted to be inflammatory, I might have questioned the OP's behavior in the bar that night. Oops.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1832512] ..... With a girl like Ging Gaew (#40), it is too risky to allow her to go dance with her big luscious tits bouncing and mesmerising other guys who will suddenly be desperate to grab and fondle them. Therefore best to BF her fairly quickly. She prefers that, over being called over by numerous guys who want to molest her without BFing her. Never ever saw Ging spend very much time dancing on the stage. Customers just can't allow that. However cannot drag a girl off the stage without buying her a drink (or BFing or both).
You can imagine that girls get very bored being called over by numerous customers who want to grab. Some will buy her a drink, and some will even try to get out of that. However making just 50 Baht (drink commission) for being molested is not seen as that great by girls.[/QUOTE]Who cares. Thats what the guy is paying for. He is either paying to see if they are compatiable (for barfine) or he is paying to check the tits. Thats her job. If she is bored then time to look for a new gig. I'm on the side of the guy willing to buy the drink.

[QUOTE=PipeLayer99;1833252]Who cares. Thats what the guy is paying for. He is either paying to see if they are compatiable (for barfine) or he is paying to check the tits. Thats her job. If she is bored then time to look for a new gig. I'm on the side of the guy willing to buy the drink.[/QUOTE]Absolutely agree, especially on the "compatible" aspect of the encounter. I view it as part of her job to sit down with a customer and let him check the goods and whether there is any potential connection. I picked up a girl from Thermae, last month, without doing enough due diligence, thanks to the small head taking over, and it was a disaster in the room. I could not wait to get rid of her. I will not pick a girl any other way for the foreseeable future, or until the small head initiates a take over again.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;1833149]EihTooms, thanks for your report. I will see if any of this bad behavior happens to me when I return to BKK though I doubt it.[/QUOTE]Natty, I doubt that it would happen to you, but it can easily happen to other folks. Sometimes, the girl just does not want to be with someone for a particular reason. The reason could be anything, she does not like his type, or he comes across as a nasty guy, or a bad hair day or whatever. It has happened to me and I am sure it will happen again. Maybe you always come across as a nice guy.

Some folks have that ability of being able to always present a friendly face, just like a salesman. I personally don't have that skill, and presume there are many other folks who don't either.

[QUOTE=Lefeu;1833260]Natty, I doubt that it would happen to you, but it can easily happen to other folks. Sometimes, the girl just does not want to be with someone for a particular reason. [/QUOTE]Yeah, I get that too sometimes. There may be many reasons for it. A girl might have another customer waiting for her on the other side of the bar, she may be Northern Asian-centric and not want to barfine with (fill in the blank) Caucasians in my case, she may be tired, and of course it might be personal ie she might not like the way I look, dress, talk, behave ect ect. But 99.9 percent of the time this is discernible in advance by the way she avoids looking my way or smiling at me. I don't ask girls like this over for a drink in the 1st place. Why bother? Nothing good can come out of it.

Then there is another type situation where I invite a girl over, we have a drink together, and discover that we have no chemistry. In this scenario I usually take the easy way out, make an excuse, and leave the bar to go somewhere else. There are plenty of other bars. The girl is also entitled to feel the same way about me, but common courtesy dictates that she waits a little while until her dance set begins again before she splits or until both parties agree to mutually end the charade.

But what the OP is talking about is a girl that deliberately accepts drinks under a false premise then immediately departs as soon as her drink commission receipt is in hand. This is very bad behavior. A con if you will. And as I alluded to before, shame on the girl that acts this way and shame on the bar that allows its girls to behave this way. Thank Buddha this is a very rare deception IMHO and I have encountered it only one time in all my Asian Go Go years.

And yeah, I always try to come across as a nice guy. In general I like the girls and feel at home in the Go Go setting. I don't take any BS, but I am on holiday, having a good time. There is seldom any reason to get uptight. Just walk if things ain't going your way.

[QUOTE=Lefeu;1833260]Natty, I doubt that it would happen to you, but it can easily happen to other folks. Sometimes, the girl just does not want to be with someone for a particular reason. The reason could be anything, she does not like his type, or he comes across as a nasty guy, or a bad hair day or whatever. It has happened to me and I am sure it will happen again. Maybe you always come across as a nice guy.

Some folks have that ability of being able to always present a friendly face, just like a salesman. I personally don't have that skill, and presume there are many other folks who don't either.[/QUOTE]I haven't met Natty yet but you and I are buds so I can tell you, you have a ton of charm. That's the best way I can put it, I'm sure your batting average at the bars is extremely high.

At the bars the dancers have so many options (more so than punters) so a friendly face is just one consideration for them, of course everyone on this board is smiling when seated at CH, LOL.

The top ladies are fixated on the Ks, Js, etc. But in CH (on my visits a few months ago) there were really hot mid level dancers so it's all good. When dealing w / the very best looking dancers they have a lot more leverage w / tourist so the punter has to be on game and w / funds. They can tell who is a tourist and who is not. They can also tell who you're a Cheap Charlie w / in 10 minutes of sitting w / you.

Bottom line is, water seeks it's own level, a little charm and personality w / a healthy wallet can help mitigate this fact.

If you're lucky enough to live there you would probably not need to step foot in CH for top level action providing you have a little game and money. Last trip in BKK I BFind my 2nd or 3rd options every night because my first choice would not look into my eyes. That's the way it goes, they know who I am (or think they do) from the stage.

My consolation are the Crazy House 2nd and 3rd are pretty freaking nice! I'm back for more Thai punishment in 2 months.

[QUOTE=PipeLayer99;1833252]Who cares. Thats what the guy is paying for. He is either paying to see if they are compatiable (for barfine) or he is paying to check the tits. Thats her job. If she is bored then time to look for a new gig. I'm on the side of the guy willing to buy the drink.[/QUOTE]Its not about making you care. Its explaining that a girl who has has made less than 2 bucks from a 50 Baht drink commission is not yet highly motivated.

If she concludes the guy just wanted a feel up, and is not going to BF her, she may not stay very long, also depending on the level of chemistry or fun between the two of them.

Girls become well aware of cheap Charlies in the bar and the better customers. Popular Girls in high demand may have multiple guys concurrently seeking her to sit with them. She is going to choose the best option. I don't see any scamming behavior from Ging but have noticed her looking frustrated with some customers and have heard her make the odd comment about preferring a customer who will BF her and treat her nicely so she can make some proper money. She is so popular she can choose between multiple guys requesting her presence. The reason is cute, good body, big naturals, bubbly personality. When I first met her, she was a bit hard to get to, but now she is a good chance to come to me having BFed her 3 or 4 times, and she knows I am good for more than 1 drink should I not be BFing.

Once a girl has a good customer to go to, it takes the pressure off her and she can relax better, have fun, chat and joke to customer and her friends. If I want the ongoing presence of a girl, obviously I consider what motivates her to stay with me.

Last time number 5 came to me and I was willing to buy her 1 drink. However while she had a good body her face was irdinary. Soon she was asking fir a tip pleading no money. That was too fast. I did not like her behavior. Hence I did not call her back again. I lost interest. Entertained a different girl. Actually did nit BF anyone in the end. No one was good enough. Favourites absent.

I am not shy to move on to a different girl when the chemistry is poor or I just don't want to fuck a girl. Girl is also free to leave me if a better customer opportunity is available. I do expect her to stay at least 10 to 15 minutes if I buy her a drink though, unless its clear I have lost interest already.

Yes buying a girl a drink is just an act of generosity. It is not a contract to stay with her for a long period of time. It is known I like multiple girls and could buy a drink for more than one. Could be concurrently or serially. I don't show any interest in girls that arrive to me un called for. I prefer to choose who I am entertained by. Ocassionally make an exception for a friend of a girl if I really like the friend. Once Noi introduced me to her stunning friend Paeng. Paeng was too hot to let go. Later BFed Paeng and enjoyed.

If I have got bored with a girl, I don't have to leave and go to another bar. Just stop buying any drinks for the girl. She will get the message.

It is always clear to waitress who I am buying a drink for. Hand movements. Nod of the head. I just point at the recipients. Signals can do it all even if language and noise problems.

I don't really see that the best girls are fixated on Koreans and Japanese. Any good customer treating them well will do. I am Farang and do not feel discriminated against. O.K. Its known some girls are dick scared and prefer Asian size. However they could still look for a drink from Farang. Naturally my favourites are not dick scared girls.

Just concluded 5 days business trip to Bangkok. Stayed in Sukhumvit Suite, just right next to my favorite haunt, Soi Cowboy. Used to stay at 24 Inn near Phrom Phong, but I think with only small difference in price, Sukhumvit Suite is much better value in term of comfort and convenience. Particularly because there is nothing better than seeing Baccara's ass dancing lullaby before I go to bed.

I arrived a bit late in the evening. Was a bit tired from the flight, so just stop by Baccara to say Hello,. Girls are awesome as ever. Stayed for about an hour and strolled to the next Soi for some traditional massage. Can't remember the name of the MP but took a girl named Kathy, Face: 7/10; Body: Slim 7/10; Tits: 6/10 A; Ass: 6/10; Skin: 7/10 (dark but smooth); Pussy: 8/10 (tight, OK to DATY). She is the prettiest in the whole stretch at that time. I had better looking one subsequently, but just thought that want to release some muscle tense. The massage was only 4/10, not enough pressure. But the FJ was good, especially seeing her biting her lips, and closed her mouth during pumping, given there was another customer in the next room. The DFK was marvelous and really feel like making love with your own GF. Total damage THB500 1 HR oil massage + THB1700 (FJ).

The next night, I decided to go for some sensual massage at Phrom Pong. They are all MP but in reality just putas. I dropped by at Addict, but found that even though they have more girls, none are to my liking. I went next door to Club 102. They have lesser girls but their décor is nice, feels like a big luxury sinful mansion. There were about 6 girls at that time, only two looks meet my benchmark. Took Tuk Ta Face: 8/10; Body: 8/10 (curvy); Tits: 8/10 see; Ass: 7/10 (love girl with ass); Skin: 8/10 (fair); Pussy: 7/10 (clean, bushy but bit loose compared to Kathy, OK to DATY). The room is the best compared to other MP in the vicinity. Much much cleaner. Tuk Tak GFE is 9/10. The moment we entered the room, she lap danced on me, sensually lick me while fully clothed. After 5 min of the erotic pretense, we showered and proceed to bed. We start by mish, doggy, side way, doggy and finish in cowgirl. The only minus point is that she doesn't FK. After we showered, we just lied down naked on top of each other whispering sweet nothing. Total damage THB2500 (1 HR shower room).

On the third night, I was actually keen to try the RCA venue. But since I don't facy being alone in a Thai Club, decided to revisit the Soapy MP. Went first to Nataree, Caesar but end up only taking the girl in Emmanuel. The girl in Emmanuel seems prettier at the same price bracket, but on hindsight, I think Nataree girl looks friendlier. Took a girl named Katie, Face: 8/10 (but wearing braces); Body: 8/10 (curvy); Tits: 8/10 see; Ass 8/10; Skin 7/10 (dark); Pussy 7/10 (clean, but bit loose, ok to DATY). Her service is just SOP, nothing memorable. Total damage: THB2600 + THB300 (tips to papasan etc).

On the fourth night, right after Baccara, went again to the traditional MP in the next alley. Went to a different MP on the left side now as more keen for genuine massage. The MP on the left is more decently dressed but I still chose the prettiest. Took Apple Face: 8/10 (very sweet); Body: 8/10 (curvy); Tits: 8/10 be; Ass 8/10; Skin 8/10 (fair); Pussy 8/10 (clean but can't DATY). Her massage is good 7/10 but not enough pressure yet. Love her firm body and her stereo moan. It was her last day as she is going to work in Singapore the week after. We went out for a movie together at Terminal 21 the next day, and had another session at my hotel FOC. Total damage at MP THB3000 (massage + FJ).

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1833391]Its not about making you care. Its explaining that a girl who has has made less than 2 bucks from a 50 Baht drink commission is not yet highly motivated.

If she concludes the guy just wanted a feel up, and is not going to BF her, she may not stay very long, also depending on the level of chemistry or fun between the two of them.

Girls become well aware of cheap Charlies in the bar and the better customers. Popular Girls in high demand may have multiple guys concurrently seeking her to sit with them. She is going to choose the best option. I don't see any scamming behavior from Ging but have noticed her looking frustrated with some customers and have heard her make the odd comment about preferring a customer who will BF her and treat her nicely so she can make some proper money. She is so popular she can choose between multiple guys requesting her presence. The reason is cute, good body, big naturals, bubbly personality. When I first met her, she was a bit hard to get to, but now she is a good chance to come to me having BFed her 3 or 4 times, and she knows I am good for more than 1 drink should I not be BFing.

Once a girl has a good customer to go to, it takes the pressure off her and she can relax better, have fun, chat and joke to customer and her friends. If I want the ongoing presence of a girl, obviously I consider what motivates her to stay with me.

Last time number 5 came to me and I was willing to buy her 1 drink. However while she had a good body her face was irdinary. Soon she was asking fir a tip pleading no money. That was too fast. I did not like her behavior. Hence I did not call her back again. I lost interest. Entertained a different girl. Actually did nit BF anyone in the end. No one was good enough. Favourites absent.

I am not shy to move on to a different girl when the chemistry is poor or I just don't want to fuck a girl. Girl is also free to leave me if a better customer opportunity is available. I do expect her to stay at least 10 to 15 minutes if I buy her a drink though, unless its clear I have lost interest already.

Yes buying a girl a drink is just an act of generosity. It is not a contract to stay with her for a long period of time. It is known I like multiple girls and could buy a drink for more than one. Could be concurrently or serially. I don't show any interest in girls that arrive to me un called for. I prefer to choose who I am entertained by. Ocassionally make an exception for a friend of a girl if I really like the friend. Once Noi introduced me to her stunning friend Paeng. Paeng was too hot to let go. Later BFed Paeng and enjoyed.

If I have got bored with a girl, I don't have to leave and go to another bar. Just stop buying any drinks for the girl. She will get the message.

It is always clear to waitress who I am buying a drink for. Hand movements. Nod of the head. I just point at the recipients. Signals can do it all even if language and noise problems.

I don't really see that the best girls are fixated on Koreans and Japanese. Any good customer treating them well will do. I am Farang and do not feel discriminated against. O.K. Its known some girls are dick scared and prefer Asian size. However they could still look for a drink from Farang. Naturally my favourites are not dick scared girls.[/QUOTE]Reading this just makes me realize even more why I dislike how the GoGo game has to be played these days. Sure is a lot of effort.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1833391]I don't really see that the best girls are fixated on Koreans and Japanese. Any good customer treating them well will do. I am Farang and do not feel discriminated against. O.K. Its known some girls are dick scared and prefer Asian size. However they could still look for a drink from Farang. Naturally my favourites are not dick scared girls.[/QUOTE]So who is fixated on the Ks and Js? LOL The ugly BGs? LOL, and don't say me, LOL! I just want a fair shot at what's on display and I'm not getting it at the CH, Rainbow, etc.

I don't have your experience but I do have an unbiased opinion. When I visit top gogos like CH or Rainbow 4 in BKK, or top gogos in Patts, to gogos in Cebu or AC, more times than not there are a few very particular ladies, particular for Ks. My last visit to CH there were 2 or 3 and they would not make eye contact, zero. I am well dressed and w / decent game for a 63 year old, this only happens in high end gogos.

These very few women have the ability to look right over my shoulder and play for the K dorks behind me. A few minutes later more Ks come and sit to my left and now that's where the hotties attention will be. This is not a coincidence, this is not my imagination, it is a well known fact on most boards there is an allowed discrimination. If you haven't noticed this that's peculiar, good for you. I have 2 weeks in your neck of the woods and I notice everything and then I return a few months later to the same set of circumstances. I do find my way to happiness but not w / the elite beauties, I'm happy you do.

So as for what I said earlier and that is in the best gogos a few dancers always seem to be K only, repeat, a few. That's a constant reality for me and I am not losing out to other Caucasians, no that isn't my experience at all. For the record I don't blame anyone except maybe the bar owners for allowing discrimination in their bars, it's not cool at all.

I do believe the ladies should have freedom of choice and never be forced to do anything. I just think that the owners should hire women who treat all customers fairly. I have had some great ladies from the CH, but never my first choice, excellent nonetheless.

The only place I have not experience the slightest BG discrimination is on Burgos Street, the few lookers there will go w / most punters.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1833073]I did not see same guy scammed by several girls in succession. Does not make it impossible. Just rare in what I am normally seeing.[/QUOTE]I haven't seen that happening either. But what you wrote and what I asked about was that it must be indeed rare for any guy to have a succession of different girls "visit" him, nothing about a succession of different girls "scamming" him.

With regard to the former, I guess I must be "special" in at least two ways because very often I am visited by a succession of different girls in many bars around town, particularly Crazy House, asking me if they can sit with me, if I will buy them a Lady Drink and/or barfine them. Servers too. I have had many slugs of time in Crazy House where at least a half-dozen dancers who have just finished their 20 minutes dance time will visit me, a different one every 2-3 minutes, asking if they can sit with me (on the prospect of a Lady Drink and / or barfine, of course).

However, I can't exactly feel too "special" about that because I usually see a few other men in the bar getting just as much "special" attention like that from the ladies as I get.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1833408]Reading this just makes me realize even more why I dislike how the GoGo game has to be played these days. Sure is a lot of effort.[/QUOTE]LOL. I know what you mean, but the go-go game these days doesn't have to be played in nearly as complicated (or expensive) way as that to get lovely, sexy go-go dancers willing and eager be in your room with you doing just about whatever it is you like, your way, for costs easily competitive to the usual alternatives around town.

[QUOTE=Socker;1833297]If you're lucky enough to live there you would probably not need to step foot in CH for top level action providing you have a little game and money.[/QUOTE]That can definitely be a factor. Once you have gathered a stable of regular, non-P4 P (directly, that is, LOL) girls whose looks, skills and real GFE rivals or beats the best one has ever seen and experienced from the go-go bargirls, including those in Crazy House, there is little need to put up with much of the BS one usually is presented with in those bars. Consequently, there is little risk involved in cutting through it wherever possible with the girls, providing you are mindful to remain polite, pleasant, relaxed and fun about it.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1833408]Reading this just makes me realize even more why I dislike how the GoGo game has to be played these days. Sure is a lot of effort.[/QUOTE]Hear, hear!

First day was both amazing and a letdown. Hooked up with a few attractive girls but couldn't find 3 of my favorites, one is out of the business with what sounds like abdominal pain. The other two I'm hoping are still around but didn't work on Monday.

Have to say the drink hustle does wear on you, turning down ugly women is easy, turning down hot chicks is another. Once you have 3 fucks and a BJ from the BJ bar its hard to justify buying girls drinks if you know you can't fuck for some time. And those drinks do add up compared to the scene at a German FKK club. Yeah you get to have your hands down the girls pants but you know it's just a hustle.

Made it to Rainbow 3, Spanky's and Bangkok bunnies last night. All the clubs had pushy wait staff. Talent was decent in all but few that took my breath away.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1833391]Yes buying a girl a drink is just an act of generosity. It is not a contract to stay with her for a long period of time. [/QUOTE]

In Thai-oriented bars (like Saphan Kwai), as well as many shady karaokes around town, buying a lady drink actually is a contact for a girl to stay at the customer's table for a given amount of time (20 min or so, depending on the venu). Of course, in Farang bars they don't have to do that since most customers are ready to pay for nothing without complaining.

That 50 baht drink commission is not as little as it appears, restaurant workers get paid less (about 40 baht) for a full hour of actual work.

[QUOTE=Crocodilexp;1833452]In Thai-oriented bars (like Saphan Kwai), as well as many shady karaokes around town, buying a lady drink actually is a contact for a girl to stay at the customer's table for a given amount of time (20 min or so, depending on the venu). Of course, in Farang bars they don't have to do that since most customers are ready to pay for nothing without complaining.

That 50 baht drink commission is not as little as it appears, restaurant workers get paid less (about 40 baht) for a full hour of actual work.[/QUOTE]Yes okay But some girls are not that talented at selling drinks so may sell only 4 drinks for the evening. Sometimes a girl told me was her first drink mid evening.

Some lose their entire monthly salary of 10 K or 12 k in fines, usually from arriving late or not arriving at all. These girls make money from being BFed. Some have to ensure they get a good salary due to low number of BFs and low drink sales.

Crazy now starts at 7 PM to compensate for for early close 1 am. That is only 6 hours. Girls would have to be lucky to sell more than 1 drink per hour on average. Really top girls can sell more. Naked dancing starts 7. 30 PM currently.

One girl lives Bang Chak. That is at least 80 Baht taxi ride home. Not surprising several girls want to get together to share taxi.

One girl in another bar lives past Bearing. 150 Baht taxi ride. Sometimes have to get an All Taxi yellowish orange taxi as they don't refuse any rides and always on meter. This girl could make no money for the evening net unless get BFed. She was in an outside portable cart bar. She was not wearing a tight outfit to show off body. Possible big tummy. I would not BF her.

So bars have some girls struggling, and some making very good money indeed. Full spectrum. In my experience, the diligent stunning girls making really big money are few. Some could make over 100k per month if they did not get "sick" and turn up every day.However I notice my favourite girls are missing more often then not. I have no clue how much these girls make per month. It probably varies wildly. Some seem to work only when they need money badly.

If I buy a girl a drink, she usually does stay with me 20 mins till she has to dance, and usually returns after dancing, hoping to get another drink of course. If a girl wants ti leave, she will usually give the reason like toilet or dancing and indicates she will return. It helps I speak Thai.

[QUOTE=Breadman;1833450] And those drinks do add up compared to the scene at a German FKK club. [/QUOTE]I use the 70 euro FKK entry fee budget as my nightly drink budget. Don't usually come close to using that. I'm pretty good at saying no drinks or letting my girl know up front what the limit is for the night. If I feel the drink total getting out of hand I'll BF the girl early.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1833462]Crazy now starts at 7 PM to compensate for for early close 1 am. That is only 6 hours. [/QUOTE] Early closing gives us more time for LT but, more importantly, easier to meet girls after the club closes with no BF.

Last Saturday night Suzie Wong Bar started their popular nightly stage show by at least 9:30 PM when I entered instead of the usual 10 PM or so. By 9:45 PM, the girls were already performing the girl-on-girl clit licking portion of the show. I assume the earlier start time was to compensate for the current 1 AM Soi Cowboy bar closures. Haven't heard about any time changes for the weekend Baccara Bar show and didn't stop in to find out. Does anyone know if that one is starting earlier now, too?

[QUOTE=Breadman;1833450]. And those drinks do add up compared to the scene at a German FKK club. Yeah you get to have your hands down the girls pants but you know it's just a hustle.
[/QUOTE]Enterance to FKK is 50 - 70 Euros or 2600 baht. That's over 10 lady drinks! How many do you buy?

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1833391]Its not about making you care. Its explaining that a girl who has has made less than 2 bucks from a 50 Baht drink commission is not yet highly motivated.
.... [/QUOTE]I am talking about the girl doing her job for whomever is buying her a drink. IMO, if the guy buys a gogo girl a drink, she should stay there and keep him company (at least until she is finished with her drink). She should not just take 2 sips and disappear. Or slam it down in a hot second and disappear until her next stage shift. That's what the original poster was talking about. Shit, after all she is getting 2 things, a free drink and 50 baht. It's not the guy's job to motivate her to come get something for FREE. If she doesn't want to be felt up and / or doesn't want to sit with a paying customer, then she should stay sitting somewhere else.

[QUOTE=PipeLayer99;1833544]I am talking about the girl doing her job for whomever is buying her a drink. IMO, if the guy buys a gogo girl a drink, she should stay there and keep him company (at least until she is finished with her drink). She should not just take 2 sips and disappear. Or slam it down in a hot second and disappear until her next stage shift. That's what the original poster was talking about. Shit, after all she is getting 2 things, a free drink and 50 baht. It's not the guy's job to motivate her to come get something for FREE. If she doesn't want to be felt up and / or doesn't want to sit with a paying customer, then she should stay sitting somewhere else.[/QUOTE]Agreed 100%. The gal should have to sit there at least the duration of one dance rotation. Personally I like the way GoGos operate in the PI much better. Buy the gal a drink and she does not have to dance. When the gal downs the drink or takes two sips and leaves, she is simply ripping off the customer. Shame on her and shame on the bar for allowing this to happen. Ultimately it is the responsibility of management to make and enforce policy on matters such as these. It really is amazing what guys allow these gals and establishments to get away with. Thinking with the little head only.

[QUOTE=PipeLayer99;1833544]I am talking about the girl doing her job for whomever is buying her a drink. IMO, if the guy buys a gogo girl a drink, she should stay there and keep him company (at least until she is finished with her drink). She should not just take 2 sips and disappear. Or slam it down in a hot second and disappear until her next stage shift. That's what the original poster was talking about. Shit, after all she is getting 2 things, a free drink and 50 baht. It's not the guy's job to motivate her to come get something for FREE. If she doesn't want to be felt up and / or doesn't want to sit with a paying customer, then she should stay sitting somewhere else.[/QUOTE]Sure I agree. Anyone would be pissed off if girl takes two sips and disappears.

Happened to me once that I bought a girl a drink, and it was slow to arrive. She had to go dance before her drink even arrived. While she was dancing, my favorite Ging turned up in plain clothes about to exit CH to go eat. Ging soon changed her mind. My previous companion 140 (a newbie) disappeared, presumably too shy to show up now that Ging (40) had arrived. I struggled to remember her number correctly to reconcile the bill. Don't know where 140 disappeared to. I could not find her for a while to call her back for her drink. Could have been in toilet, who knows? I did not regard it as a scam. Just some shy girls don't know what to do when they have been supplanted. I am sure she hoped to be BFed initially and may have been peeved to have been replaced.

Anyway a bit annoying to buy a completely wasted drink. Shit happens sometimes. But not all the time. It's unusual and problem partly caused by buying the drink at the wrong time, since I called her over also at non ideal time. I learn my lesson.

The worst girl I ever saw for jumping customers was "Chocolate" (ex Dollhouse girl) and that was many months ago. Haven't seen her lately. Unusual since she always had a Thai boy (to help support I assume) and used to work every day never arriving late. I certainly have the greatest contempt for her and a small number of other girls. Kratae was one other I can remember trying to maintain multiple concurrent customers (to milk for drinks one assumes). I think her idea of a ST was to go to the disco instead of fucking. Ha Ha. I am not going for that sort of crap. Most girls are not that devious.

However I stress I don't meet the bad behaviours of girls very often. Mostly it's plain sailing and girls stay with me as long as they can unless they have another customer that wants to BF them when I am not doing so.

I try to study girls' behaviours for extended time, before I ever call them to me. Helps to see bad behaviours before it happens to me. I mostly get nice girls this way. With Oom I made a bad mistake. I thought I had her pegged as a semi bad girl as she liked to tease other girls. Months later, I found out she was actually quite nice and just fun loving. Finally BFed her. Fortunately she had ditched her Thai boy as well, and was very active wild on the bed and non-restrictive despite being a bit shy in public. Repeated several times. Lost weight but hasn't been working much lately.

[QUOTE=UncleVolodya;1833506]Enterance to FKK is 50 - 70 Euros or 2600 baht. That's over 10 lady drinks! How many do you buy?[/QUOTE]Don't forget his own drinks too. 2600 is actually going to be about 15 drinks. Lady drinks are typically 160.

Its difficult to spend that much on drinks unless entertaining multiple ladies, or staying a very long time.

I rarely drink more than about 3 drinks unless I am on tequilas (rarely). One night recently bought 2 drinks and no lady drinks at all. Disappointing line up.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1833556]Agreed 100%. The gal should have to sit there at least the duration of one dance rotation. Personally I like the way GoGos operate in the PI much better. Buy the gal a drink and she does not have to dance. When the gal downs the drink or takes two sips and leaves, she is simply ripping off the customer. Shame on her and shame on the bar for allowing this to happen. Ultimately it is the responsibility of management to make and enforce policy on matters such as these. It really is amazing what guys allow these gals and establishments to get away with. Thinking with the little head only.[/QUOTE]Yes. That's what the original post was about. The girl taking a sip from a drink and then gone. That a load of crap (and the guy doesn't need to motivate her to stay for a few minutes). If a girl did that to me, that would be the last drink she will ever get. And I will let mama know about too. Afterall, the guy is paying for her company. IMO, if a guy is buying the girl an drink, she should 'at least' sit with the guy for 5-10 minutes.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1833391] .... I am Farang and do not feel discriminated against. O.K. Its known some girls are dick scared and prefer Asian size. However they could still look for a drink from Farang. Naturally my favourites are not dick scared girls.[/QUOTE]Funny you mention that about a girl being dick scared. That happened to me in Jakarta. I wasn't getting the right girls to come over, vibe not there. Didn't know why. So I was having a beer and talking with an Indo guy sitting near me (he spoke English). We called mama over and .... turns out some were afraid of 'big size'. It's not like they checked my package or anything. They were just dick scared because I am white guy. Finally had her call me over one or two to choose from who weren't afraid. LOL.

Could somebody please Google the from dusk till dawn cheech speach and post it here? The one where he goes on about pussy, feel it's appropriate with the amount on offer here. 36 hours in town, jet lag but still got 13 pops in.

[QUOTE=Breadman;1833589]Could somebody please Google the from dusk till dawn cheech speach and post it here? The one where he goes on about pussy, feel it's appropriate with the amount on offer here. 36 hours in town, jet lag but still got 13 pops in.[/QUOTE]As I'm sitting here waiting for my girl to show up, I looked up the movie. Found it on the first link. Here you go.

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c9FCOAEPHHM[/URL]

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1833462]So bars have some girls struggling, and some making very good money indeed. Full spectrum. In my experience, the diligent stunning girls making really big money are few. Some could make over 100k per month if they did not get "sick" and turn up every day.However I notice my favourite girls are missing more often then not. I have no clue how much these girls make per month. It probably varies wildly. Some seem to work only when they need money badly.[/QUOTE]I know a girl who lives at Lumpini Place (Rama IX) in her own rented condo, drives a Honda Civic, wears really nice branded clothers and accessories to match and goes out for dinner by her self to a nice place once in 2 weeks or so.

She has retired from the GoGo scene so I will not name her. Goes by the initials JJ. So yes, I have no clue how she makes that money but she makes me happy when I visit Bangkok. As you say, old generosities are not forgotten in most cases. Everyone wants to be treated well. Give respect and you will get respect in return.

[QUOTE=PipeLayer99;1833568]Funny you mention that about a girl being dick scared. That happened to me in Jakarta. I wasn't getting the right girls to come over, vibe not there. Didn't know why. So I was having a beer and talking with an Indo guy sitting near me (he spoke English). We called mama over and .... turns out some were afraid of 'big size'. It's not like they checked my package or anything. They were just dick scared because I am white guy. Finally had her call me over one or two to choose from who weren't afraid. LOL.[/QUOTE]Happened to me in Angeles of all places on earth last month. The girl was trembling like a leaf when the tool developed a mind of its own. Apparently, she had been barfined only twice and both time by by K-boys. I was kind to her and let go after the BBBJ attempt also failed.

[QUOTE=UncleVolodya;1833506]Enterance to FKK is 50 - 70 Euros or 2600 baht. That's over 10 lady drinks! How many do you buy?[/QUOTE]The FKK fee entrance is a fee that one pays for use of the facilities, food, and free beers at some FKKs. More important, it's fixed. As for LDs, the longer you stay at any one place, the more you end up spending, unless you are very good at dodging the various requests from the girls, mamasan. Much easier to budget for the entrance fee.

Stop Press. Cowboy bars are now allowed to open till 2 AM. Some bars still closed at 1 AM since they did not know the new rule. I was eating a burger in @Corner as 1AM was passed. Staff asked the police who said then stated the bars stay open till 2am. Not today only.

Crazy House had a lot of girls today at 9.30PM onwards. Not sure why more than the weekend. Maybe girls struggling to have the rent money. Many days I could not find an exciting girl. Today 3 girls of interest. Could have BFed any one of the 3. Tall Oom (91) returned after many weeks away. Therefore she has no salary for the last month. Ging (40) arrived very late. Donut (83) is also tall, slim, curvy and very pretty to my taste. Added to the "to do" list. Believe I previously met her briefly last year. Line up should be even bigger Wednesday since it is pay day. Oom may not show since she will receive no pay whatsoever. Ging may have lost all her salary as well. Donut hasn't been in much either. My other favourite Paeng was still missing.

[QUOTE=Lefeu;1833702]The FKK fee entrance is a fee that one pays for use of the facilities, food, and free beers at some FKKs. More important, it's fixed. As for LDs, the longer you stay at any one place, the more you end up spending, unless you are very good at dodging the various requests from the girls, mamasan. Much easier to budget for the entrance fee.[/QUOTE]The FKK entrance fee is about 60 to 80 EUR, that's about 2300 to 3100 baht. I never reach that amount on drinks, ladydrinks and BF in one evening in Bangkok. And for the price of one hour with one of the ladies in an FKK, I can get a Thai cutie for the whole night in my hotel room.

One cannot compare German FKKs and Thai agogo clubs. In one afternoon and evening in an FKK in Germany, I easily spend aout 300 EUR. That money buys me three nights of fun in Bangkok.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1833806]The FKK entrance fee is about 60 to 80 EUR, that's about 2300 to 3100 baht. I never reach that amount on drinks, ladydrinks and BF in one evening in Bangkok. And for the price of one hour with one of the ladies in an FKK, I can get a Thai cutie for the whole night in my hotel room.

One cannot compare German FKKs and Thai agogo clubs. In one afternoon and evening in an FKK in Germany, I easily spend aout 300 EUR. That money buys me three nights of fun in Bangkok.[/QUOTE]Plus the premium feeling of being in holiday.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1833806]The FKK entrance fee is about 60 to 80 EUR, that's about 2300 to 3100 baht. I never reach that amount on drinks, ladydrinks and BF in one evening in Bangkok. And for the price of one hour with one of the ladies in an FKK, I can get a Thai cutie for the whole night in my hotel room ... 300 EUR. That money buys me three nights of fun in Bangkok.[/QUOTE]Living our life as a movable feast, we enjoy the best situation of what is available wherever we go and wherever we are. There's no comparison or reckoning to be made. If you are where you are because that's all you can afford, no reason to think about what you're missing, much less trying to rationalize it here. Just enjoy yourself with what you have.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1833558]Sure I agree. Anyone would be pissed off if girl takes two sips and disappears.

Happened to me once that I bought a girl a drink, and it was slow to arrive. She had to go dance before her drink even arrived. While she was dancing, my favorite Ging turned up in plain clothes about to exit CH to go eat. Ging soon changed her mind. My previous companion 140 (a newbie) disappeared, presumably too shy to show up now that Ging (40) had arrived. I struggled to remember her number correctly to reconcile the bill. Don't know where 140 disappeared to. I could not find her for a while to call her back for her drink. Could have been in toilet, who knows? I did not regard it as a scam. Just some shy girls don't know what to do when they have been supplanted. I am sure she hoped to be BFed initially and may have been peeved to have been replaced.

Anyway a bit annoying to buy a completely wasted drink. Shit happens sometimes. But not all the time. It's unusual and problem partly caused by buying the drink at the wrong time, since I called her over also at non ideal time. I learn my lesson.
[/QUOTE]If you were prompted to look for the girl so she would actually sit for the Lady Drink you bought for her and you later felt it fair to reconcile your bill to account for her not even touching it, I would say even you knew she should have sat with you with that drink. Your excusing it as shyness rather than her ditching you and abandoning the unwritten agreement between customers and dancers re Lady Drinks, a scam, is merely engaging in a bit of ego-flattering self-deception, which we all engage in often enough.

In fact, I would say we engage in a bit of ego-flattering self-deception when we write off a girl for whom we've just bought a Lady Drink on the basis of "poor chemistry" or even our "lack of interest" and allow or encourage her to move on after a brief few minutes of sitting with her Lady Drink. There was plenty of chemistry when she was smiling at you like a banshee from the stage, plenty of chemistry when you assessed her face, body and demeanor as a prospective P4 P partner for the night or in the future, plenty of chemistry when you called her over, she sat with you and snuggled while you discussed buying her a Lady Drink. So why would there suddenly be such a notable decline in chemistry just because a Lady Drink had been placed on the table in front of her? More often than many of us would like to admit to ourselves, it is because the minute that Lady Drink hit the table she had accomplished virtually everything all that previous chemistry she was exuding meant to accomplish. Now it is time for her to drop the chemistry on the assumption it will be you who "loses interest" in her and lets her go so she can churn up some chemistry with the next potential Lady Drink buyer on the other side of the bar.

That customer has been hit by the same "Lady Drink hustle and vanish" con as the one I described, the only difference being she vanished mentally and with her projected chemistry rather than physically. And I would submit the decision to vanish one way vs another is likely determined by the layout of the bar; saying "have to go dance now" works better when the bar is big enough and has multiple dance areas where it won't be such an obvious Lady Drink hustle when he doesn't see her mounting the stage anytime soon whereas her altering the level of chemistry she exuded prior to the Lady Drink hitting the table works better for her in a smaller bar or when there is only one stage area available.

[QUOTE=Wanderer31;1831362]Hello friends,

I am visiting BKK for the first time starting 6/ Feb for 3 days. Have already booked a girl friendly hotel, need some pointers / guidance / contacts of decent first in-call service that I should get into my hotel. Please share reliable contacts which are already experienced by you, rates, service. Within reasonable budget for ST.

My PM is active and any help will be highly appreciated.

Thank you in advance. I can reciprocate with similar contacts in India.[/QUOTE]Unlike India, most of us don't "pimp". Read the forum and enough info is there. Go out to the various gogo bars, soapys, BJ bars, call the escorts services (yes there a thread for that). Good or bad experiences make you a little wiser and better prepared for your next visit.

My comment about the FKK scene had more to do with being approached non stop and being asked to buy ladydrinks at any bar you sat down at, haven't visited Hooters yet, maybe that's the place to go. And they always have friends in need. Have to say, I really do favor the beer pricing in Pattaya vs Bangkok. 55 baht vs 90 baht at most bars, you walk into a bar past 8 pm in Bangkok and your paying almost triple what the gogo's are offering in Pattaya.

Got to talking with a retired Australian who lives in Thailand (mid 60's) who has a 32 year old Thai girlfriend. He said he tried everything, from dishing out a little money at every request to a weekly amount but settled into giving her 25 k baht per month as spending cash. Had an interesting talk on the concept of 'keeping a hooker' vs 'being married'. Only difference we could come up with is the later one is given a credit card to make said purchases. Either way you are going to end up paying for it. Also got to talking about tipping, he mentioned if the girl did fantastic service and your going to leave a tip "for her" that you should take it out of the folder and put the money in her hand. This way the tip is hers, not to be split up with the other wait staff. He said if a girl is seen taking money from the folder and putting it in her pocket, she would probably be fired.

Hit a few gogo's, rainbow 3, spankies and Bangkok bunnies. My favorite at rainbow 3 isn't working for the last 3 months and the talent is somewhat lacking. The small stage and being constantly bugged by the staff will make this a club I'll avoid the rest of the trip. Spankies on the other hand is just way too crowded although I do enjoy the atmosphere. I did find an old favorite from last trip still working at Bangkok Bunnies, so that visit paid off. Many attractive girls and having two stages with seats that overlook the action is now a favorite of mine. Will probably check out Nataree later tonight and on the way back swing thru soi cowboy.

SmooT hiE,

You believe what you want. If you believe everything is so sinister, so be it. I have a positive attitide and look for evidence and logic. Try to be more serene and less paranoid.

We cannot hope to understand or know all about the experience of another as we were not present.

Bars have well behaved girls and badly behaved girls and newbie girls who don't know how to behave and raunchy girls and shy girls and even scared of being groped girls. Annoying girls yes. Selfish girls are there of course. Honest girls are also there.

We have to assess what types of girls we are dealing with. I have a good time. If I get the wrong type of girl ocassionally, I just move on to the better ones. No big deal. Girls don't all behave in exactly the same way. Most girls I meet are behaving okay Otherwise I would not be there. My biggest problem is only what girls turn out to be dick scared on the bed. Using regular girls avoids that risk.

Likewise bars have a broad range of customers. Stingy or generous. Up tight or laid back relaxed. Aggressive or mild. Those who like girls to come to them or those who like to make their own choice. Those who look down on girls or those who treat them like a human. Clean or stinky. etc. blah blah. Girls evaluate the customer and may behave differently too. Many or most girls know it's useless to come to me unless I gave them the signal. I get pestered by dancing girls fairly rarely. Not so much as I cannot handle. One tactic is I am good at ignoring girls and not making eye contact unless I am really interested in a girl. Also do not go straight into grope mode with girls I have only just met. Even nude girls have to get some level of respect, unless they are acting super raunchy.

The bad fat mamasan was long ago fired. Unfortunately they still have some waitresses that are a bit annoying. That is why I use my special regular short waitress Aem who is totally honest and does not annoy me. A good girl. She can even give hints whether other girls are good character or not.

[QUOTE=Breadman;1833899]Hit a few gogo's, rainbow 3, spankies and Bangkok bunnies. My favorite at rainbow 3 isn't working for the last 3 months and the talent is somewhat lacking. The small stage and being constantly bugged by the staff will make this a club I'll avoid the rest of the trip. Spankies on the other hand is just way too crowded although I do enjoy the atmosphere. I did find an old favorite from last trip still working at Bangkok Bunnies, so that visit paid off. Many attractive girls and having two stages with seats that overlook the action is now a favorite of mine. Will probably check out Nataree later tonight and on the way back swing thru soi cowboy.[/QUOTE]Its a long time since I was in RB3. However I experienced the same constant bugging by waitresses and mamasans to choose a girl, rather than take my time to evaluate them. I never returned since I don't recall any other bars with same level of "bugging". I went to Spankies maybe 3 times. I don't recall the overcrowding problem, right now (bad memory? I did not like the slapping noises, the whole concept of Spankies. Disturbs my ears. Line up of girls a bit small.

BFed two girls from Spankies, different occasions. One was very good. She was vey skinny and braces on teeth. The other had a good body but scammed me in that she got a phone call from another customer or mamasan about her regular showing up, and wanted to return to the bar very quickly. So she wanted my ST to be exceedingly short. That pissed me off. I typically take a long time. The experience was very poor.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1833927]Its a long time since I was in RB3. However I experienced the same constant bugging by waitresses and mamasans to choose a girl, rather than take my time to evaluate them. I never returned since I don't recall any other bars with same level of "bugging". [/QUOTE]On a visit to RB3 a couple of years ago I had a bad experience with a member of the staff also; I am normally quite laidback with the staff, but this night I completely lost my temper. One of the waitress was plain rude and ask me to pick a girl or leave (I had 2 drinks at this point). I shouted to her to "fuck off" and mind her own business. It is very rude to push paying customers to choose a girl from the stage. I sit with my beer the whole night if I want to. On my way out I yelled at the manager to fire this waitress because of rude behavior. Nedless to say I have never enter this bar again. And do not plan to in the future (it was quite bad for line-up anyway). My advise; I understand that sometimes staff is instructed by the bar managers to "push", but as customers it is also our right to draw the line for unacceptable behavior from the staff members. Tell the manager if you are not happy with what is going on.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1832448]But my absolute best experiences with Crazy House girls with regard to barfining them out and getting treated well in the room is when I don't buy a Lady Drink at all (or perhaps one after a barfine deal has already been struck and settled), cover the key interview questions the moment they approach me for the customary naked brush against me at my seat and, assuming they pass the key interview question or two, tell them I want to pay the barfine now and let's go. LOL. IMO, that is a much better way to ensure quality ST service with a Crazy House girl than to go along with their Lady Drink Sucker Collection program and easing into the interview process after their drink arrives.[/QUOTE]I'm sorry, it's probably a stupid question, but what are recommended interview questions?

You Blow Job no-condom? Yes / No.

I like to take time for boom-boom, you rush me? Yes / No.

[QUOTE=Breadman;1833899] Also got to talking about tipping, he mentioned if the girl did fantastic service and your going to leave a tip "for her" that you should take it out of the folder and put the money in her hand. This way the tip is hers, not to be split up with the other wait staff. He said if a girl is seen taking money from the folder and putting it in her pocket, she would probably be fired.[/QUOTE]Guys here for a long time may forget that this is not necessarily well known. Leaving tip in the money folder is a tip to shared among the staff, assuming boss is honest and doesn't take it. This applies to other countries as well, not just a Thai thing. Certainly Thai restaurants in other countries and other places non Thai.

In Thailand, if you intend a tip for a specific person it has to be cash put in the hand and usually done without showing everyone what it is or how much. Sometimes guys tip a dancing girl by putting money in her garter or bra if she has one. No need to be shy about that.

I never give a tip on credit card (e. G. In a Thai restaurant OS) as this will likely be taken by the owner and not given to staff. USA maybe different. I don't live there. I always give tips as cash. If in a group, I keep my tip separate form the group money in the middle, as some guys will underpay if there is too much money in the middle. Effectively some western guys steal from the tip money.

In Thailand P4 P, I am always using cash anyway, and I assume most people do.

[QUOTE=EricSwiss;1833949]I'm sorry, it's probably a stupid question, but what are recommended interview questions?

You Blow Job no-condom? Yes / No.

I like to take time for boom-boom, you rush me? Yes / No.[/QUOTE]"Are you good on the bed?" LOL "Are you good service? "Are you good fun?

Ha ha. I don't have these interview questions, even I can speak to her in Thai. Some girls might have trouble understanding questions in English, or perhaps they have heard same questions so many times.

One assumes the standard questions are: "You kissing, okay?" or "No condom, okay?" or "You take in back door?" LOL I don't bother to ask. My most important question would be "Are you scared of dick, or Anaconda? However quite honestly, I have rarely asked any of these questions. I want girls to be relaxed and fun. Perhaps I should try it to see how girls react.

I guess the girl should answer the questions something like this: "Sometimes Yes, sometimes no, depends on how much I like the customer. YMMV"

The most important question in reality for me is how long does a ST last, or a LT? What time does the girl need to leave? For me ST has to be up to 90 minutes and LT has to be at least 7 hours minimum for me to get value out of it. I can't fuck like a rabbit for many cums in a short time.

I have a license to pay less if girl doesn't deliver full service. How much to dock the fee would be controversial topic. When girls do not negotiate a fee, I already have power to pay according to service level. If she did specify an amount then I might check what she intended to provide for that fee in particular the duration. If she says less than 60 mins then forget it.

Never really thought of asking anything but it was my buddy's first time in Thailand late last night, he arrived at 1 am. Took him for a very short visit of Nana just to see what the scene was, he asked those type of questions "does she kiss? "is she GFE?" etc. Funny thing is once you get the feeling the girl is either comfortable with you (after buying a drink) or so broke that it doesn't matter, she's the one pushing to be barfined. I find it 'amazing' that so many girls are available at the drop of a hat (or 2000 baht) whichever comes first. In the end, if the girl is attractive and I'm horny I'll give her a shot.

There is a strong rumour from Crazy House waitress that owners have bought the Old Dutch restaurant premises next door. Obviously CH expansion is intended some time in the not too distant future.

Crazy House has multiple floors. When busy some girls are dancing on the 2nd floor, e. G. Girls with green numbers. Tends to be older girls or less pretty girls, maybe fatter ones. The best lookers have Orange-red numbers and dance in floor 1. Not sure about yellow number girls. On floor1 girls are also split into the short girls group and the taller girls group. These two groups alternate sets. CH wants best lookers to be on view for customers looking in the front door. That is why the best girls are not dancing on the 2nd floor.

Almost all my girls are from the first floor taller group. From short group I find less girls attractive.

Last night the line up was at its best for Payday. Oom and Ging were there despite no salary for this particular month. I released both these girls to other customers since I wanted to try another girl. Could have been Naen or Jane (both present) however Donut was possibly the tallest girl in the place and also the prettiest, if you like slim, even with teeth braces.

One guy sitting right below the saucy Jane dancing was almost salivating. Donut and I noticed he had his hand in his left pocket and it was shaking. Looked like was wanking himself. He left bar soon after. I expected he would go to the toilet. LOL.

Donut (number 83) was about 21YO, 170 cm tall, slim curvy, high firm Acups. Small face upturned nose. Very cute for me. Rather shy. Beautiful pussy and ass, not just the face. Hard to see a fault except for braces on teeth.

Interview question was whether she was scared of Farangs. She said she particularly liked Farangs and wasn't scared of them any more.

ST was very good, go with the flow, GFE. Light kissing due to braces. No special skills but good attitude to having fun. Light gentle screams / moans during fucking so quite loud during sex. Reacted well to DATY too but I could not get it right to make her cum. Braces made the BJ difficult for her and not a big mouth. No big deal for me. Her pussy was tight but she could take it deep with no problems. No complaints from her and none for me. Doggy got me to cum. Beautiful ass and great feel. Yes definitely repeat, so I collected her contact number. She was on Instagram but not LINE, so I might have to add Instagram to my phone Apps.

Paeng is a similar beauty although a bit shorter, however was missing last night. Seems to have been away for a few days.

I showed up at 8 pm to CH however Donut arrived close to 9. 30 pm. Any later and I might have chosen a different girl. I am aware that the best girls often show up right up till 9. 30 pm. Showing up early allows to get a good seat easily, before it gets too busy. Could have BFed any one of several girls instead if donut did not show, my regulars or try a new one.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1834259]There is a strong rumour from Crazy House waitress that owners have bought the Old Dutch restaurant premises next door. Obviously CH expansion is intended some time in the nit too distant future.
[/QUOTE]This is a smart business move. CH needs more room. They can easily handle the space. Sometimes I have felt cramped in CH sitting along the wall constantly making room for passerbys. There is very little room in certain areas. The 2nd floor is used to handle the overflow especially on Thurs, Fri and Sat. I have seen the mamasan gage the crowd size, determine that conditions are right, and then open up the 2nd floor, ordering some less popular girls upstairs. I have never barfined a 2nd floor girl, but I know a few as my favorite girl(s) each have a couple of 2nd floor friends .

On special nights I have returned to CH after a shag and my favorite girl(s) will suggest we go upstairs where we can party, drink and do more things privately, ha ha. They have lesbian lick lick shows and SM candle dripping shows up there too. It can be entertaining to watch under the right conditions with the right girl taking care of my needs and plenty of Tequila. There is a different atmosphere upstairs, less people, more raunchy, more private, more space, less attractive dancers, but I am ready to go back up again. Can't wait!

Buddy of mine just picked up a cutie from stumble inn, 4 days in town. Didn't know what "barfine" was. Think he hit gold.

[QUOTE=Breadman;1834401]Buddy of mine just picked up a cutie from stumble inn, 4 days in town. Didn't know what "barfine" was. Think he hit gold.[/QUOTE]Reminds me of the girl I met at the bar, brought me a beer with a glass. I asked her: don't you want to drink something yourself?

She went and got another glass for herself. First day of course, unfortunately I was not free to take her.

[QUOTE=EricSwiss;1833949]I'm sorry, it's probably a stupid question, but what are recommended interview questions?

You Blow Job no-condom? Yes / No.

I like to take time for boom-boom, you rush me? Yes / No.[/QUOTE]It is not a stupid question at all. In fact, although it is rarely addressed here, it is at the crux of the P4 P scene. Different circumstances call for a different approach, but for me the circumstances generally fall into one of these 3. And in all cases it is assumed I am attracted to the girl enough to want to be with her, not just responding to any girl approaching me:

1. I am so smitten by the girl there is no need to ask anything specific because I honestly do not care if the only thing I get out of the experience this time is DATY, as long as I get her out of the bar and into my room where the real chemistry for how much GFE will be had and time will be spent is ultimately established. It happens. In a case like that, I might even be the one to ask if she wants to go barfine before she asks me, which is rare because I would much rather the girl ask me first, and most do. If this particular type of girl asks me first, I still would probably not ask her about anything specific, just pretend to give it some thought and eventually say yes. LOL.

2. It matters what I get in the room tonight, the girl asks me to pay her barfine but she does not bring up an amount of money for her. My interview process would go something like this, keeping it fun and playful:

- Pay your barfine? What will we do in the room?

"Ha ha. Everything. Up to you. "

- Everything, up to me? I like everything, up to me. You do good sa-moke?

"Sa-moke?"

- Blowjob. You give good blowjob, cum in mouth everything, no condom? Will you do that for me?

"Yes, I will do that for you. "

End of interview process. If her response is notably negative, I bail. If it is notably positive, I am in.

I don't ask anything more in this regard unless she brings it up and wants to talk about it more. I now have heard everything of value that I could possibly learn in the bar BECAUSE belaboring the subject longer in the bar accomplishes little and all of the more important matters in terms of how good or how long ANYTHING gets will be established as nature takes its course when we are alone in the room and she has really gotten more comfortable with me. It will not be learned when we are both dealing with a ton of distractions and interruptions in the bar. My question about how she would finish a blowjob is asked only to establish a floor, a fall back position below which I do not want to go if our chemistry, the boom-boom conditions, whatever does not go as well as I want in the room. I may have no intention of going for a blowjob with this girl but I ask the question (that her response elicited, btw) anyway. I wind up boom-booming, my way, girls who give that answer about 65% of the time or more. I go for the blowjob the other 35% of the time. Which is a perfect boom-boom to blowjob ratio for me.

3. It matters what I get in the room tonight, the girl asks me to pay her barfine and at some point brings up an amount of money she wants me to pay her. Some guys take this as a sure sign to bail, the girl bringing up how much money she wants, that is. I used to feel that way too. But I have since learned it is actually a nifty opportunity to get a whole host of important issues hammered down and out of the way long before we get to the room. I welcome it now. Recognize that she has thrown a hardball by citing her dream number baht amount she wants me to give her. So it is time for me to throw a hardball right back. But it won't be a hardball about how much money I will give her. It will be a hardball about the level of pleasure I would expect if I paid her dream amount. It would go something like this:

- 3,000 baht? Hmmm. If I pay a lady 3,000 baht I would need her to (and this is where I ask for the world. Fill in with whatever your best P4 P experience would be; Long Time until noon tomorrow, multiple pops, BB this or that, DFK, shaved pussy, you name it.)

"oh no, I cannot do XYZ. But the other things ok. "

- hmmm. Well, if you don't do XYZ, then I can only give you 2,000 baht. You ok?

"ok"

Maybe it will go back and forth a couple more times until she gets me to another number or she agrees to do something more. But this can still be done playfully and fun. I have had plenty of great, hassle free experiences with very good girls this way because a lot of the stuff I'd rather not have a conversation about in the room has already been settled and now we can work on that chemistry to make it all more relaxed, enjoyable and agreeable.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1834454]It is not a stupid question at all. In fact, although it is rarely addressed here, it is at the crux of the P4 P scene.[/QUOTE]Brilliant advice! I shall print it and carry it in my wallet on my 1st time June visit.

Thanks.

I know this has been mentioned here before, but I can't seem to find the post or posts that refer to the name of the street or area in Bangkok where there are a few go go's and P4P bars primarily for Thai men. I was there once, but it was sometime ago and am thinking of returning to check it out again (with a Thai friend who himself is unfamiliar with the area). Any help with the name of the street or area, as well as any up-to-date information (such as whether it is still there with go go's, etc.) would be appreciated.

Crazy house was a letdown, one smoking hot chick #67 who gave my buddy shitty service. No BJ, no kissing. Rest were average. 9 pm visit, left at 10. Went to the best club I found so far. Bangkok bunnies. Good mix of talent, big enough club, enough eye candy to keep it interesting.

Has any one tried this girl from Crazy House?

Tonight I checked out 2 Nana bars.

First Mandarin Upstairs. Approx. 9:45 PM.

Talent was not quite up to previous visit. Bar was pretty boring. Many girls on the stage either doing a little shuffle or just standing there. Dance a bit when a better song comes on. Generally Coyote girls did not know how to dance properly. One Coyote had a bit of the arm horizontal sweeping movement going. Best looking was a Coyote girl with black outfit and orange trim for figure and moderate dance ability, #160 (New), however face was not quite my spec. Did not call any girl over fro a drink. Some girls had Bacarra type crazy hair style but not many. Perhaps 40% of girls had nose jobs, maybe more. Did not notice any silicone tits at all. Bar was only half full of customers, if that, with lots of spare seating. Looks of girls in general was well above average, with a consistent standard, but no girls extremely pretty to really grab the attention. Drinks were cheaper than Crazy House a little bit, but the entertainment was almost non existent. Little reason to return. Very few customers were entertaining a girl next to them.

Then Bangkok Bunnies.

The front section (toward Plaza entrance) was definitely buzzing more than Mandarin upstairs. Girls were dancing more actively. One or two very pretty girls (with customers) and general face standard was high. Naen (ex Crazy House) a short older girl with a really great body was there. Unfortunately her tits and ass were covered spoiling her best assests. Unlike Mandarin U, some girls were topless. This did not help much as no really great tits on display since most girls had silicone tits (maybe 80%) and some others had saggy tits and some may have had nice tits but were covered, and some had fake noses. Bar was half full or a little more, but a lot of vacant seating. Bar will take time to build up the business. Customers were entertaining a reasonable number of girls. Price of drinks was similar to Crazy House. My soda and Naen's shot was 330 Baht.

The back section of this bar had a different type of girl, the ordinary lookers, but no girl in the back section had silicones (while I was watching). Still none were of interest (very average looks), so this section of the bar was very quiet indeed for customers. This stage of more average girls, is probably equivalent to the lesser lookers on second floor of Crazy House.

I would say that Bangkok Bunnies is a silicone paradise but not very entertaining for me to watch them dance, as I prefer slim natural tits naked girls at Crazy House. So no way to drag me away from Crazy. Best bar for Breadman. He must be into Sillies big time. Sillies is not eye candy for me.

Obviously Bacarra and Crazy House remain far more popular bars than these two and are really very full at a similar time of night.

Any Dee Cups, Syz?

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1834569]
Then Bangkok Bunnies.


I would say that Bangkok Bunnies is a silicone paradise but not very entertaining for me to watch them dance, as I prefer slim natural tits naked girls at Crazy House. So no way to drag me away from Crazy. Best bar for Breadman. He must be into Sillies big time.

Obviously Bacarra and Crazy House remain far more popular bars than these two and are really very full at a similar time of night.[/QUOTE].

[QUOTE=DCups;1834572]Any Dee Cups, Syz?

.[/QUOTE]I did not see any D cups. However plenty of Silicone Cs. Did not see any big naturals at all. Bear in mind that I was only in there for about 40 mins total, enough time to do a quick survey of all the girls not missing. Naen has natural Bs I guess.

Even Crazy House doesn't really have any full D cups. Two or three girls are quite good Cs, and 2 or 3 silicone Cs as well.

It's really not easy to find true D cups in general on girls with a good figure. I make do with Ging's big swinging C+ tits at CH and she is quite slim cute.

[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1834498]I know this has been mentioned here before, but I can't seem to find the post or posts that refer to the name of the street or area in Bangkok where there are a few go go's and P4P bars primarily for Thai men. I was there once, but it was sometime ago and am thinking of returning to check it out again (with a Thai friend who himself is unfamiliar with the area). Any help with the name of the street or area, as well as any up-to-date information (such as whether it is still there with go go's, etc.) would be appreciated.[/QUOTE][URL]https://goo.gl/maps/jzV2amcu3p92[/URL]

T. Det 99 (gogo bar).

Corner of Sutthisan Winitchai road and Intamara 2 Alley. Near to Saphan Kwai BTS station.

Went to Lollitas for a fuck with Anne. Unfortunately the special rooms are out of action being refurbished until Saturday. Also unfortunately Anne was a bit sick with a head and a sore pussy. Said she got 3 fucks yesterday and struggled to recover. Looks like it is well known she is a good fuck now more so than a BJ specialist. Cute face and even cuter nude (fabulous ass).

Was offered BJ but that was not what I was looking for. Postponed till another day.

[QUOTE=Markly2;1834471]Brilliant advice! I shall print it and carry it in my wallet on my 1st time June visit.

Thanks.[/QUOTE]Have a great time, Markly2! And have fun with that advice. Bear in mind, my goal is to keep the "negotiation / interview" process in the bar regarding actual or specific sexual activities as brief and as easy to agree to as possible. Asking for a BBBJ CIM is far more likely to get a positive response in the bar than BBFS or Anal, for example. Might even be easier for many girls to agree to that with a first time customer in the bar than going from ST to LT. However, once alone in the room where it truly becomes personal for the first time, these girls very often become far more agreeable to things they would never agree to with a first time customer in the bar. And my knowing the WORST case scenario when I get this girl in my room will be she gives me a BBBJ CIM is not an unpleasant prospect at all (Short of her having outright lied to me about that in the bar, of course, which can happen. But, as has been stated by others, you will at least then have justification to pay the liar quite a bit less or nothing at all for pulling that stunt).

Another point; When I am on a mission to select a good (and new to me) girl for the evening and not just bar hopping around with friends or merely looking for a night of eye candy and giggles, I will get to this "negotiation / interview" bit with the girl who fits my physical and general demeanor requirements as soon as possible. And I mean within minutes, possibly even before buying the girl a single Lady Drink. I certainly might be inspired to consider choosing a girl with whom I was initially only up for having a drink with and a few giggles. But once that shift has occurred in my mind, I am right into the "negotiation / interview" process without delay.

I realize that flies in the face of what many if not most punters think is the way to build "nice guy" chemistry and all that. But I submit that the peak moment when a female, even a P4 P female, is most intrigued and turned on about the prospect of fucking a man before this night is over is within the first minute or so of meeting him. That is the moment when you are new, mysterious, a conquest challenge for the woman, her mind is reeling over what it would take to win you away from every other female in the room. We're talking animal nature here, not civilized society. Do not ignore the power of that. Capitalize on it.

Of course, that is all assuming other basic good first impression conditions have been met; hygiene passes muster, fresh clothes, presenting yourself with a sweet, genuine smile, confidence, fun but not inappropriately silly for your age, etc.

[QUOTE=Breadman;1834548]Crazy house was a letdown, one smoking hot chick #67 who gave my buddy shitty service. No BJ, no kissing. Rest were average. 9 pm visit, left at 10. Went to the best club I found so far. Bangkok bunnies. Good mix of talent, big enough club, enough eye candy to keep it interesting.[/QUOTE]Nana Plaza is not as visible to the visiting tourist as Soi Cowboy, the entrance of which can be seen from the Asoke BTS Skytrain station, at the entrance of the Sukhumvit MRT Subway station and from just about anywhere at the most heavily trafficked intersection in Bangkok. But you need to know where Nana Plaza is to find it without more detailed directions. A casual visitor isn't likely to simply stumble upon the entrance of Nana Plaza down Soi 4 on their way to Central Embassy. Consequently, Soi Cowboy bargirls encounter more of the transient tourist trade (which, IMO, accounts for why it is some Soi Cowboy bar owners' idea of a shrewd decision to populate the Soi with so many bait-and-switch Coyote scammers vs Nana Plaza that has relatively few) while Nana Plaza bargirls encounter more expat Bangkok residents and long time LOS punters.

And, IMO, that is also why one can more likely get a real GFE with Nana Plaza girls than Soi Cowboy girls. The Nana Plaza girl is looking to hook up with a long time boyfriend / supporter. The Soi Cowboy girl is looking to make as fast and easy a buck as possible with this guy she assumes she will never see again. There are exceptions, of course. But I believe that is an important general difference between the two venues.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1834725]Nana Plaza is not as visible to the visiting tourist as Soi Cowboy, the entrance of which can be seen from the Asoke BTS Skytrain station, at the entrance of the Sukhumvit MRT Subway station and from just about anywhere at the most heavily trafficked intersection in Bangkok. But you need to know where Nana Plaza is to find it without more detailed directions. A casual visitor isn't likely to simply stumble upon the entrance of Nana Plaza down Soi 4 on their way to Central Embassy. Consequently, Soi Cowboy bargirls encounter more of the transient tourist trade (which, IMO, accounts for why it is some Soi Cowboy bar owners' idea of a shrewd decision to populate the Soi with so many bait-and-switch Coyote scammers vs Nana Plaza that has relatively few) while Nana Plaza bargirls encounter more expat Bangkok residents and long time LOS punters.

And, IMO, that is also why one can more likely get a real GFE with Nana Plaza girls than Soi Cowboy girls. The Nana Plaza girl is looking to hook up with a long time boyfriend / supporter. The Soi Cowboy girl is looking to make as fast and easy a buck as possible with this guy she assumes she will never see again. There are exceptions, of course. But I believe that is an important general difference between the two venues.[/QUOTE]When I moved to BKK in '99 Soi Cowboy was the expat hangout. Nana was for tourists. I think for the most part both are for tourists these days.

Newbies, if you want a GFE sessions with BKK Go Go girls then I strongly recommend that you do not negotiate their services up front! Do the opposite, but first things first. Take care of your personal hygiene. Shower, brush your teeth, rinse with mouthwash and wear clean clothes before you head out to the bars.

Then once you are in the Go Go, take your time finding the right girl. Don't be in a hurry. Don't act like you NEED to get laid. Be cool and friendly. If you are horny, go to an oilie in the afternoon to take the edge off. Even when I am in one of my favorite Go Go's, if I don't see anybody I like available after 40 to 60 minutes, I will go somewhere else. No big deal. Never act aggressive, vulgar, drunk, or cheap. Be NICE! Be courteous. Be friendly! Treat the girls like you really like them and that they are "good girls". Ha Ha! Buy a girl you are interested in a couple of Tequilas. If her best girl friend comes around, buy her a drink (1 drink is enough). See how your prospective girl responds to you and how well the two of you are getting along. If she passes the audition and seems sexy / friendly; barfine her. If she is too BMD (buy me drink) oriented or not paying proper attention to you, then walk. It is that simple and 95% of the time you will have a great time unless you have certain unrealistic porn fantasies. Thai Go Go girls are kind of conservative.

I am still amazed from time to time with what girls will do in bed without my asking. For example, I met a sexy Crazy House 18 year old in 2015. Back in the loom after a shower and some preliminaries, she got down to business with a very weak BJ. She was very fetching and sexy in the bar so I was a little surprised and somewhat dissatisfied. I sat up and began kissing her small breasts. Then she took my dick in her hand and began rubbing its head on her clit like it was a dildo. It was a very unexpected move. I would not have thought of it myself, but it was so basic and raw. It turned me on and from there we moved on to some great BBFS. Now I don't say this will happen to you if you do not negotiate up front, but I do recommend that you should trust you instincts, relax and rely on the girls you have screened and selected to show you a good time, provided you treated them right from the get go. This is BKK, not Amsterdam and BKK is still very very good.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1834739]When I moved to BKK in '99 Soi Cowboy was the expat hangout. Nana was for tourists. I think for the most part both are for tourists these days.[/QUOTE]Based on my trip during which time I visited both locations frequently while in Bangkok, I would agree with your assessment 100%. Soi Cowboy and Nana are both tourist traps. Nor did I notice any general difference at all in the attitudes of the girls from one location to the other. And I interacted with lots and lots of girls in lots and lots of go-go bars. I don't believe that the distinctions drawn by the OP hold true one bit.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1834739]When I moved to BKK in '99 Soi Cowboy was the expat hangout. Nana was for tourists. I think for the most part both are for tourists these days.[/QUOTE]I rely on only a couple of Go Go's in Nana and Cowboy. I prefer Soi Cowboy over Nana. I wish there were more quality Go Go's, but the sad truth is what it is. CH, Baccara, Mandarin, and RB4 (or whatever they are calling themselves now, RnB?) are the best. So where have all the good girls gone? 555. Have they migrated over to Social media (chat apps) or now work in Gentlemen s Clubs? If I lived in BKK, I think I would be better positioned to take advantage of these alternative sources. In the meantime I find oilies, soapies, and Go Go's are sufficient for my current needs and recreational fun, No complaints really.

As you know, I like to travel to Jakarta and Manila too. They have some great girls in those locations, but those two towns have their problems too. Quality girls in Jakarta and MNL are more expensive than similar quality in BKK. In addition, Jakarta and MNL are not as easy to get around in or as safe as BKK and comparable hotels are more expensive. Then over in Phnom Penh, the nightlife has really declined over the last 10 years. It is a much more severe decline than the one you speak of in BKK. So we are left with BKK. It is not as good as it once was, but it is still pretty good. IMHO.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1834739]When I moved to BKK in '99 Soi Cowboy was the expat hangout. Nana was for tourists. I think for the most part both are for tourists these days.[/QUOTE]Yes, they are both for tourists. But back in '99 there was no BTS Skytrain station, MRT Subway Station and Terminal 21 shopping mall just spitting distance from the banner sign entrance of Soi Cowboy. In 2016, there is still no BTS Skytrain / MRT Subway / Mega Shopping Mall just spitting distance from the entrance of Nana Plaza. It is actually possible for a newbie to walk down Soi 4 from Sukhumvit, unavoidably be aware of the outdoor beer bars along the way, but be distracted just enough by the line up of freelancers standing in front of the Nana Hotel sign and parking lot on the opposite side of the soi to totally miss the entrance of Nana Plaza and walk right past it! LOL. I have met young guys in Soi Cowboy who said they walked along Sukhumvit around that area and could not find Nana Plaza.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;1834751]I rely on only a couple of Go Go's in Nana and Cowboy. I prefer Soi Cowboy over Nana. I wish there were more quality Go Go's, but the sad truth is what it is. CH, Baccara, Mandarin, and RB4 (or whatever they are calling themselves now, RnB?) are the best. So where have all the good girls gone? 555. Have they migrated over to Social media (chat apps) or now work in Gentlemen s Clubs? If I lived in BKK, I think I would be better positioned to take advantage of these alternative sources. In the meantime I find oilies, soapies, and Go Go's are sufficient for my current needs and recreational fun, No complaints really.[/QUOTE]I think there are many, many quality girls to be fucked and blown by in go-go bars other than the four you mentioned. But your stated recommendation for how to hook up with them and determine whether they are good or not seems to me to be way too time consuming and expensive to move through the dreck and get to the gold very efficiently and effectively. It also seems to be geared to give potentially great performers permission to be somewhat mediocre in the room rather than inspiring them to give you their best. Just my humble opinion only too, of course.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1834725]
And, IMO, that is also why one can more likely get a real GFE with Nana Plaza girls than Soi Cowboy girls. The Nana Plaza girl is looking to hook up with a long time boyfriend / supporter. The Soi Cowboy girl is looking to make as fast and easy a buck as possible with this guy she assumes she will never see again. There are exceptions, of course. But I believe that is an important general difference between the two venues.[/QUOTE]Purely depends on the bar and the particular girls, and skill in choosing. I have had an excellent success rate choosing girls from the former Sheba and Suzie Wong. The most difficult bar of all to find girls giving a good session was Rainbow 4. Many of best lookers there were looking for a super quickie not suited to me at all. Did get one really good LT girl there.

Bacarra, I found it difficult to find girls I really liked, but the girls I did BF actually performed pretty well. Only ever about 3 or 4 girls. I agree that CH is not the best bar for BFing girls. My success rate with new girls that I want to repeat is only about 50 percent. Regular girls are safe bet of course. CH is a good bar to go if not intending to BF a girl. Plenty of times recently, I went there and did not take a girl because regulars missing and nothing really outstanding that I just could not resist. So no need to waste money on a girl that is not quite stunning.

It has always been hard to predict in advance dick scared girls, no matter what location. However girls with a baby already or older girls are a safer pick for me. Very tiny girls with no baby are a bit risky, and I tend to avoid very small girls anyway, as they tend to remind me of children. Still meet plenty of taller dick scared girls though.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1834739]When I moved to BKK in '99 Soi Cowboy was the expat hangout. Nana was for tourists. I think for the most part both are for tourists these days.[/QUOTE]Yes absolutely for tourists, and also for guys like me somehow addicted to naked slim beauties. I knew one guy who lived in Thailand for over 25 years yet I still used to see him turn up to Suzie Wong quite regularly when it was the best nudie bar. He did not spend much on drinks and rarely BFed a girl, but still turned up. A bit surprising. I am a bit stated now, so my visits could drop off until I am missing specific beauties, like the stunning tall Donut. I can call to make sure she is working before bothering to go. I can also message to check why beauty Paeng has not been showing up.

I don't think gogos are really suitable for expat hangouts. Drinks too expensive and bar music is too loud. You can't have a decent conversation with a buddy easily. If you want a naked girl with nice tits on your lap, not necessarily to fuck, then that is a reason to go.

Yesterday called in to Hooters to see what it was about. Some very good looking waitresses of course. However looking at the menu, was shocked. The prices were rather steep both for drinks and food. I could drink much cheaper in Crazy House. Had a list of Gins on the menu but not Gordon's, my favorite. I suspect my favorite sports pub (near to CH) has better quality food (its unusual quality for a sports bar) and still at a better price than hooters, even though it is not cheap. I like the staff at my sports pub even if not as stunning as hooters girls. Problem at Hooters, you can look but not touch. At CH can look, perve, and touch.

Hooters was no where near to full but had a few customers so doing some business. I left as the prices were too mind boggling for me, without the sufficient fringe benefits.

I would be more happy playing up with a nice girl across the road in Stumble Inn. Whoever loses in pool has to do something as a forfeit. Could be have the tits fondled as an example, or a tongue kiss. If I lost, some girls wanted to pull down my pants and see and even touch. LOL Beware though bar has cameras and boss doesn't like very risqu games.

I found that many expats hang out in the Hillary chain of bars. I hated it due to waitresses competing to sell you a drink (they get commission on the man drinks), and therefore getting hassled continually. A faulty business model, to my way of thinking.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;1834741]Newbies, if you want a GFE sessions with BKK Go Go girls then I strongly recommend that you do not negotiate their services up front! Do the opposite, but first things first. Take care of your personal hygiene. Shower, brush your teeth, rinse with mouthwash and wear clean clothes before you head out to the bars.

Then once you are in the Go Go, take your time finding the right girl. Don't be in a hurry. Don't act like you NEED to get laid. Be cool and friendly. If you are horny, go to an oilie in the afternoon to take the edge off. Even when I am in one of my favorite Go Go's, if I don't see anybody I like available after 40 to 60 minutes, I will go somewhere else. No big deal. Never act aggressive, vulgar, drunk, or cheap. Be NICE! Be courteous. Be friendly! Treat the girls like you really like them and that they are "good girls". Ha Ha! Buy a girl you are interested in a couple of Tequilas. If her best girl friend comes around, buy her a drink (1 drink is enough). See how your prospective girl responds to you and how well the two of you are getting along. If she passes the audition and seems sexy / friendly; barfine her. If she is too BMD (buy me drink) oriented or not paying proper attention to you, then walk. It is that simple and 95% of the time you will have a great time unless you have certain unrealistic porn fantasies. Thai Go Go girls are kind of conservative.
[/QUOTE]My thoughts are virtually identical. So a big +1. I keep my interview questions to a very polite minimum, like how much time the girl has for me. Nothing too sordid that might spoil the chemistry and make her think she is just performing a mechanical chore. I want the girl to think she can have some fun. Indeed sometimes girls turn out to be horny too and can't resist the DATY stimulation, for example. If you happen to get a girl at the right time of month, or she has been away and did not get one for a while, she can be really horny. Perhaps she can shut her eyes and imagine I am Brad Pitt. LOL When a girl is really into it, it improves my enjoyment greatly too, helps me to cum more easily.

It is not as cheap as the Oily option but we are looking for really pretty girls (completely natural girls for me) that are harder to find in Oilies, and the opportunity to check out the personality and particularly the body fully before choosing. Its no more expensive than the top end Soapies. Chances of getting a dud girl are about the same as top end Soapies. There is much less chance of getting a dud girl in Annies and PSE shops, but there top lookers are very few.

New massage places with a big line up like Addict are becoming a very good middle ground option. However I would not regard Addict as a PSE shop. Also any massage shops with pretty girls on display.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1834772]I think there are many, many quality girls to be fucked and blown by in go-go bars other than the four you mentioned. [/QUOTE]All very well, but you could be more specific about which bars you are liking, starting with the very best, and why. Specifics over vagueness is more useful. I like to talk specific bars, specific qualities, and specific girls.

I will go to virtually any bar if the right girl is there. I only started going to Mercury sometimes because one hot girl (known for years) moved there. There turned out to be two others that I quite like too. I ignore all the chubbies there. They are for other customers.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1834797]All very well, but you could be more specific about which bars you are liking, starting with the very best, and why. Specifics over vagueness is more useful. I like to talk specific bars, specific qualities, and specific girls.[/QUOTE]You mean like, "Try #2 at Slobbers Go-Go Bar. She gave me a great BJ and BBFS last week"? Hardly useful at all, particularly if the first impression and approach is totally different from mine as is yours and Natty Bumpo's.

Besides, I have no doubt that if I were to cite a girl's number, sordid details about our sexual activities and how that must mean something about the way she is with every customer and about the bar where she works in general, that would only prompt someone to chime in with a lecture about how we cannot make sweeping statements about all bargirls or bars, that each girl is an individual soul unto her own, some are raunchy with this customer, innocent with that one, etc. , that one cannot condemn or praise any bar based on one or two experiences and so on along with a reminder that it all purely depends on the bar and the particular girls, and skill in choosing.

The statement I made about there being many, many quality girls worth the time and money in bars other than the four mentioned by Natty Bumpo cannot possibly need specific numbers and sordid details of results to be proven true to anyone who has spent so much as a single night making the rounds. Really?

I do have certain bars I don't like to go to because I have not had very good results in them. But only a tiny handful. And I could easily change my mind about those on any given night with any given girl who just started working there yesterday. Otherwise, I have no reason to deny that there are quality girls worth the time and money all over the place, in and out of the bars, just waiting for me to stop long enough to meet them. And ask.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1834788]Yes absolutely for tourists, and also for guys like me somehow addicted to naked slim beauties. I knew one guy who lived in Thailand for over 25 years yet I still used to see him turn up to Suzie Wong quite regularly when it was the best nudie bar. He did not spend much on drinks and rarely BFed a girl, but still turned up. A bit surprising. I am a bit stated now, so my visits could drop off until I am missing specific beauties, like the stunning tall Donut. I can call to make sure she is working before bothering to go. I can also message to check why beauty Paeng has not been showing up.

I don't think gogos are really suitable for expat hangouts. Drinks too expensive and bar music is too loud. You can't have a decent conversation with a buddy easily. If you want a naked girl with nice tits on your lap, not necessarily to fuck, then that is a reason to go.

Yesterday called in to Hooters to see what it was about. Some very good looking waitresses of course. However looking at the menu, was shocked. The prices were rather steep both for drinks and food. I could drink much cheaper in Crazy House. Had a list of Gins on the menu but not Gordon's, my favorite. I suspect my favorite sports pub (near to CH) has better quality food (its unusual quality for a sports bar) and still at a better price than hooters, even though it is not cheap. I like the staff at my sports pub even if not as stunning as hooters girls. Problem at Hooters, you can look but not touch. At CH can look, perve, and touch.

Hooters was no where near to full but had a few customers so doing some business. I left as the prices were too mind boggling for me, without the sufficient fringe benefits.

I would be more happy playing up with a nice girl across the road in Stumble Inn. Whoever loses in pool has to do something as a forfeit. Could be have the tits fondled as an example, or a tongue kiss. If I lost, some girls wanted to pull down my pants and see and even touch. LOL Beware though bar has cameras and boss doesn't like very risqu games.

I found that many expats hang out in the Hillary chain of bars. I hated it due to waitresses competing to sell you a drink (they get commission on the man drinks), and therefore getting hassled continually. A faulty business model, to my way of thinking.[/QUOTE]The longer one lives here the less and less one goes to the GoGos or to bars like Hillary. There are a few exceptions to that, mainly being some of the old alcoholics that I have seen around for years. Soi 4 is especially depressing in daylight hours seeing the old drunks sucking down their morning beers.

I never really feel the need to go see naked gals at the GoGos. I get plenty of nudity at oilies and I don't have to pretend to be interested in what the gals have to say.

Though really I used to love Cowboy. I was there 3 or 4 times a week for my first 7 plus years here. First as a bar-hopping newbie, then as a regular at Midnight, and after it was sold as a regular at Cactus. Probably only make it to Cowboy once or twice a year now. As you stated, high prices for weak drinks and the loud awful music are a real turnoff.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1834833]There are a few exceptions to that, mainly being some of the old alcoholics that I have seen around for years. Soi 4 is especially depressing in daylight hours seeing the old drunks sucking down their morning beers.[/QUOTE]Yes! That's the main reason I wasn't sorry to see Golden Beer Bar go. :D

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1834833]As you stated, high prices for weak drinks and the loud awful music are a real turnoff.[/QUOTE]I can understand well as I get bored quickly enough if my favorite girls are not there. The thrill of naked girls wears off. Even bare pussy is not exciting any more. Naked beauties have more artistic value for me now. Not really sexual lust thoughts. Hardly go to Suzie W any more as my favourites disappeared.

The music is too loud and some gogo bar DJs are really bad. I find the music chosen at some bars okay Sheba had a good DJ before it closed and music at CH is tolerable. I find the "music" at most discos intolerable, with Shock 39 being appalling bad and also Spicy being appalling low quality noise and thumping, not music at all. Discos are too loud for me to be able to talk to anyone at all. Can't separate sound well.

My chat with bar girls is limited to seeking basic information and a few jokes or smartass comments. Nothing too important. I don't need to chat constantly nor talk about myself, other than answering her questions. If a girl asks me too many personal questions I soon want her to shut up though. I don't bullshit girls. It's easier to be honest and consistent. Just leave out topics I don't want to talk about.

Recently at Mandarin Upstairs, I could see the songs being played by the DJ did not always motivate girls to dance at all and some just stood there for boring songs. Probably a sign of poor management. Some bars have poor lighting where cannot really see the girls' faces clearly when they dance. Again poor management, unless the girls are all ugly.

Some bars were decorated very poorly. Candyland failed immediately as the refurbish was a hideous colour and layout poor.

I enjoyed day time bar Stumble Inn well enough, but the experience was not good enough to justify the expenditure, basically staying there too long. Also I was concerned about picking up another GF that I did not need. Breadman commented that his buddy just quickly picked up a GF? there rather quickly.

To save wasted money, stay away from gogo bars, very definitely. Also stay away from all bars, pubs, restaurants. I know I can save a lot at home. I have a nice cheap and compact induction cooker to quickly prepare my own quality food. Today got a nice sex with GF, so hopefully can stay home and use no money at all, except for the 7 Eleven. Considering trying some freelancers to save money too. Have met the odd one on the street that looked appealing.

In 2 weeks I BFed 4 gogo bar girls. 3 long term favourites where I know what to expect. Just one new girl Donut. All were satisfying to varying degrees. My MP experiences in the last week were no better overall, with standard of looks a little bit lower on average, with one exception having a stunning body and great GFE. Prettiest face was new gogo girl Donut and her body is like flawless (for A cups). That is what motivates me. Dream girls. Sure I know I can get cheaper and more PSE type girls.

I don't drink much alcohol at all. Don't see the need. Just one vice is enough for me.

I'm running low on Cialis and leaving town soon. I've never bought Cialis here in BKK. I use 5 MG and was quoted $4,100 baht for a box of 28 at the pharmacy I frequent. That seemed a little high to me though not outrageous. Anyone with the skinny on how much I ought to be shelling out? Much thanks for a pointer.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1834847]Also stay away from all bars, pubs, restaurants. I know I can save a lot at home. I have a nice cheap and compact induction cooker to quickly prepare my own quality food. Today got a nice sex with GF, so hopefully can stay home and use no money at all, except for the 7 Eleven. Considering trying some freelancers to save money too. Have met the odd one on the street that looked appealing.

In 2 weeks I BFed 4 gogo bar girls. 3 long term favourites where I know what to expect. Just one new girl Donut. All were satisfying to varying degrees. My MP experiences in the last week were no better overall, with standard of looks a little bit lower on average, with one exception having a stunning body and great GFE. Prettiest face was new gogo girl Donut and her body is like flawless (for A cups). That is what motivates me. Dream girls. Sure I know I can get cheaper and more PSE type girls.

I don't drink much alcohol at all. Don't see the need. Just one vice is enough for me.[/QUOTE]I don't drink much either. Two beers two or three times a week. And I have a slew of local restaurants out of the tourist areas where I eat. Thai, Japanese, Middle Eastern, Northern Chinese. One can eat so well on so little here if you are able to venture about. Having a motorbike really opens up the city. I have put 70 K on mine just out and about on the streets of BKK over the last 10 years.

[QUOTE=Catbird;1834854]I'm running low on Cialis and leaving town soon. I've never bought Cialis here in BKK. I use 5 MG and was quoted $4,100 baht for a box of 28 at the pharmacy I frequent. That seemed a little high to me though not outrageous. Anyone with the skinny on how much I ought to be shelling out? Much thanks for a pointer.[/QUOTE]Firstly that would be a generic tadalafil copy of brand name Cialis since the genuine original stuff should be considerably more expensive than that and comes in a box of 4. I believe generic Tadalafil should be getable for a quite a bit less than that. I have tried Tadalafil (including Cialis brand) but it does not reliably make a significant difference for me over a normal unassisted hard on, so I don't bother with it. I have heard it's great for others but just doesn't work well for me.

Go to petrol station on the corner of Sukhumvit Soi 4. From there, head west on Sukhumvit road away from Soi 4 (towards Soi 2). Go in the large 2nd Pharmacy before Kinaree. They are very honest in there and a fair price although I cannot guarantee absolute cheapest. I use them for almost all my medications (without prescription). They will probably give discount for larger order. Ask them about both original Cialis and generic copies like Apcalis, and ask about the dosages available. You will find the generic copy is many times cheaper than the original. I don't know if they stock 5 MG. From memory 20 MG is the standard tablet sold. You can buy a higher dose tablet, saving money, and split the tablets into pieces. Consider that as a money saving method. I believe 20 MG tablets might be about 100 Baht each per tablet (400 for pack of 4), or perhaps less.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1834920]Firstly that would be a generic tadalafil copy of brand name Cialis since the genuine original stuff should be considerably more expensive than that and comes in a box of 4. I believe generic Tadalafil should be getable for a quite a bit less than that. I have tried Tadalafil (including Cialis brand) but it does not reliably make a significant difference for me over a normal unassisted hard on, so I don't bother with it. I have heard it's great for others but just doesn't work well for me.

Go to petrol station on the corner of Sukhumvit Soi 4. From there, head west on Sukhumvit road away from Soi 4 (towards Soi 2). Go in the large 2nd Pharmacy before Kinaree. They are very honest in there and a fair price although I cannot guarantee absolute cheapest. I use them for almost all my medications (without prescription). They will probably give discount for larger order. Ask them about both original Cialis and generic copies like Apcalis, and ask about the dosages available. You will find the generic copy is many times cheaper than the original. I don't know if they stock 5 MG. From memory 20 MG is the standard tablet sold. You can buy a higher dose tablet, saving money, and split the tablets into pieces. Consider that as a money saving method. I believe 20 MG tablets might be about 100 Baht each per tablet (400 for pack of 4), or perhaps less.[/QUOTE]Much thanks for the detailed response. I believe the pharmacy you mention is where I picked up some half decent lube a while back.

Actually I think the $4,100 baht quoted me for the 5 MG was not the generic. Same box of the real stuff I usually get in Argentina. At any rate I'll check out the pharmacy you've mentioned.

Yikes. Maybe I am getting picky but it's getting harder and harder to find gals who fit the bill these days. And by the bill I mean mix of looks, attitude, and performance. Went around to all the PSE joints this evening and found nothing suited my eye. Hit the BG Soi 7 and that was a bust; must admit I was not expecting much although I did talk to a gal or two but did not get the right vibe. Even hit the BJ bars on the way home and spotted some decent eye candy, but gave her a grab on the way in and lo and behold a pad; period time. Second time this week that has happened to me at the BJ bars. Had to pass through Thermae but each time I do I am met by a vibe that really kills my mood. I did so love that place. Hell, I took way over 100 gals out of there between 00 and 05.

Guess I am feeling more and more nostalgic for the "good ole days" when there was far far more to choose from. Sukhumvit is really a shadow of its former self numbers wise. There is just no getting around that. Walking down the street and hearing "go with you" every 20 meters is just a thing of the past. It was not a matter of finding one you liked, but of deciding between one of many. Now I am hard pressed to find one.

Hanging out in Sukhhumvit, Nana Ent, Patpong, I had a hard time finding girls good-looking enough to excite me.

I am planning to go to other towns, like Danok, Sadao, Hatyai, Huahin ect. I heard a lot of good-looking local and PRC girls work the towns bordering Malaysia.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1834977]Yikes. Maybe I am getting picky but it's getting harder and harder to find gals who fit the bill these days. And by the bill I mean mix of looks, attitude, and performance.

Guess I am feeling more and more nostalgic for the "good ole days" when there was far far more to choose from. Sukhumvit is really a shadow of its former self numbers wise. There is just no getting around that. Walking down the street and hearing "go with you" every 20 meters is just a thing of the past. It was not a matter of finding one you liked, but of deciding between one of many. Now I am hard pressed to find one.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Catbird;1834961]Much thanks for the detailed response. I believe the pharmacy you mention is where I picked up some half decent lube a while back.

Actually I think the $4,100 baht quoted me for the 5 MG was not the generic. Same box of the real stuff I usually get in Argentina. At any rate I'll check out the pharmacy you've mentioned.[/QUOTE]The copies are incredibly accurate. Ask in my Pharmacy what the real stuff costs. You will find the price is a lot higher I am sure. If you want to believe its genuine Cialis, its up to you, but I don't believe it easily. The pharmacy can tell you if that price for genuine article is really possible or not.

In the end a quality generic is just as good but costs less than what you quoted.

Anyway this is a no bullshit Pharmacy.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1834977]Yikes. Maybe I am getting picky but it's getting harder and harder to find gals who fit the bill these days. And by the bill I mean mix of looks, attitude, and performance. Went around to all the PSE joints this evening and found nothing suited my eye. Hit the BG Soi 7 and that was a bust; must admit I was not expecting much although I did talk to a gal or two but did not get the right vibe. Even hit the BJ bars on the way home and spotted some decent eye candy, but gave her a grab on the way in and lo and behold a pad; period time. Second time this week that has happened to me at the BJ bars. Had to pass through Thermae but each time I do I am met by a vibe that really kills my mood. I did so love that place. Hell, I took way over 100 gals out of there between 00 and 05.

Guess I am feeling more and more nostalgic for the "good ole days" when there was far far more to choose from. Sukhumvit is really a shadow of its former self numbers wise. There is just no getting around that. Walking down the street and hearing "go with you" every 20 meters is just a thing of the past. It was not a matter of finding one you liked, but of deciding between one of many. Now I am hard pressed to find one.[/QUOTE]I don't find what you say surprising at all. Nice girls exist but could be already booked. That is why I am surprised by someone who has looked at an MP line up once or twice and has written the place off.

My Thermae experiences were few but great in early 90's. Still remember fondly a couple of the girls, one with big expansive tits, and my early grappling with Thai language. Was very sad to lose contact with those girls.

I was in the former Thermae premises very close to Soi 13 before it moved. Every girl was LT of course. Can't really remember prices but I assume probably 500 baht or so in 1991.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1834793]My thoughts are virtually identical. So a big +1. I keep my interview questions to a very polite minimum, like how much time the girl has for me. Nothing too sordid that might spoil the chemistry and make her think she is just performing a mechanical chore. I want the girl to think she can have some fun. Indeed sometimes girls turn out to be horny too and can't resist the DATY stimulation, for example. If you happen to get a girl at the right time of month, or she has been away and did not get one for a while, she can be really horny. Perhaps she can shut her eyes and imagine I am Brad Pitt. LOL When a girl is really into it, it improves my enjoyment greatly too, helps me to cum more easily.
[/QUOTE]Syzy, you are a 65 year old geezer who looks like Robert Englund. It requires a few tequilas (a dozen) for a young Isaan bar girl to drink you to be Brad Pitt. LOL.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1834977]Yikes. Maybe I am getting picky but it's getting harder and harder to find gals who fit the bill these days. And by the bill I mean mix of looks, attitude, and performance. Went around to all the PSE joints this evening and found nothing suited my eye. Hit the BG Soi 7 and that was a bust; must admit I was not expecting much although I did talk to a gal or two but did not get the right vibe. Even hit the BJ bars on the way home and spotted some decent eye candy, but gave her a grab on the way in and lo and behold a pad; period time. Second time this week that has happened to me at the BJ bars. Had to pass through Thermae but each time I do I am met by a vibe that really kills my mood. I did so love that place. Hell, I took way over 100 gals out of there between 00 and 05.

Guess I am feeling more and more nostalgic for the "good ole days" when there was far far more to choose from. Sukhumvit is really a shadow of its former self numbers wise. There is just no getting around that. Walking down the street and hearing "go with you" every 20 meters is just a thing of the past. It was not a matter of finding one you liked, but of deciding between one of many. Now I am hard pressed to find one.[/QUOTE]Goatscrot, have you looked into the new chrome pole go-go bar on Sukhumvit Road, The Hot Links, between Soi 5 and Soi 7? hmm. I think it is the only chrome pole go-go bar on Sukhumvit Road anywhere near the Nana and Soi Cowboy area. Unless I am forgetting about one.

It has been opened for about a month so I must have walked past it a couple of dozen times without noticing it. Curtained entrance, next to that long corridor entrance massage shop. Tiny lower floor stage and bar as you enter but when the upstairs gets into full swing, they say in a year or so, they will have a few more platform stages in a much bigger bar area. Now there are 3-4 pool tables upstairs in operation. Couple of cute young things working in there last night. Don't know if they would fit your bill though. I was there for a while, played a couple of games of pool with a little lady. Didn't even ask about barfines as I have a sex starved regular date type girl lined up today and needed to conserve for this one. I never saw the girls wearing anything less than bikinis. But I doubt they will show more on that lower floor stage since only a loosely closed curtain keeps passersby from looking in on the proceedings.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1835120]Goatscrot, have you looked into the new chrome pole go-go bar on Sukhumvit Road, The Hot Links, between Soi 5 and Soi 7? hmm. I think it is the only chrome pole go-go bar on Sukhumvit Road anywhere near the Nana and Soi Cowboy area. Unless I am forgetting about one.

It has been opened for about a month so I must have walked past it a couple of dozen times without noticing it. Curtained entrance, next to that long corridor entrance massage shop. Tiny lower floor stage and bar as you enter but when the upstairs gets into full swing, they say in a year or so, they will have a few more platform stages in a much bigger bar area. Now there are 3-4 pool tables upstairs in operation. Couple of cute young things working in there last night. Don't know if they would fit your bill though. I was there for a while, played a couple of games of pool with a little lady. Didn't even ask about barfines as I have a sex starved regular date type girl lined up today and needed to conserve for this one. I never saw the girls wearing anything less than bikinis. But I doubt they will show more on that lower floor stage since only a loosely closed curtain keeps passersby from looking in on the proceedings.[/QUOTE]Always worth a shot. Thanks for the recommendation.

[QUOTE=FinnishFucker;1835089]Syzy, you are a 65 year old geezer who looks like Robert Englund. It requires a few tequilas (a dozen) for a young Isaan bar girl to drink you to be Brad Pitt. LOL.[/QUOTE]Thanks fir the complement. I had to look him up but think he looks quite good when not pulling a silly face.

Suppose you call a girl to come over and sit with you and entertain you a little. She probably does not want to do this for free and the bar has to sell drinks to make money. She will ask for a drink soon enough. E. g. At CH a tequila now costs 170 baht and girl makes 60 baht commission. That is about 2 bucks. Hopefully the girl will stay with you for a while.

Maybe the remainder of her time before she has to dance. She will often say that she will come back after she dances and hope to get another drink later.

However there is no cast iron contract. If the girl already has another custoner, she should mention from the start. Also the customer has to motivate the girl to stay rather than run away to some extent. If the girl doesn't want to be there she will possibly not stay for a long time. Mostly girls stay with me for a long time because they feel I am a nice customer, treat the girl well, don't act weird, am clean, etc.

Last night was a chance to study behavior of a girl for a short time without fully understanding what was going on. Donut was dancing on the stage and she eventually spotted me and smiled. We have intimate knowledge of each other already. When came time to get off the stage she did not immediately come to me. Her friend Noi came. We could see Donut was standing with another customer not too far away. So I guessed maybe she was with him before she started dancing. After a period of just a small number of minutes she left him and headed off to the lift, probably to go to toilet. I don't know. When she came back she did not return to her customer but was just hanging around in the middle. I waved to her and she came to me. Sat on my lap completely nude. A shy girl but not too shy with me.

I signaled for her and Noi to get a drink. Her previous customer could now see she was with me and was annoyed because he had bought her 1 drink and she had obviously not stayed with him for 20 minutes. He started to complain with a mamasan. I couldn't hear the conversation but he wasn't happy.

I asked Donut what happened. She was shy to go into detail but I gathered he bought her a drink. I understood that he had laughed at her in a sickening manner acting weird perhaps when asked if he wanted to BF the girl. Its not uncommon for girls to ask for if a customer has BF intentions when more than one customer in the house is interested in her, to see which customer is going to be the better option. Anyway the main point is Donut did not like the customer even though younger than me and better looking. He could speak Thai somewhat as I heard a simple phrase or two loudly.

My waitress asked me if I wanted to take over the drink that he bought for Donut. I said yes, if Donut does not want to go back to him for whatever reason, refund him the cost of the lady drink and add it to my bill. That would be fair to him since I have no right to tell donut who she must sit with. He left fairly quickly as expected.

It's rare I see such an incident but does happen that girls run away from a customer, either because she doesn't like him or because an important customer has arrived. Girls have left me to go to another customer too. If she is my regular girl, she would normally tell me she is leaving out of politeness and give the reason, checking if I am OK with it, as I would then have opportunity to say I wanted to BF her if that was desired. I might say fine, go ahead to her other custoner if I had no intention of BFing her or not ready to make a decision.

Last night I told the girls I did not intend to BF anyone. However Donut was still happy to sit on my lap for extended time. She got more than one drink in total over the period of my stay. Probably some other guys indicated they had interest in her too. She is very pretty and tall model type with good body so should be popular.

Girls are free to go to who they want in the bar. We don't realky own them after buying one drink. Sure we expect the girl to stay for a reasonable time, but she has to like the customer to feel she can handle to be with him. I believe long time experienced girls are more likely to put up with strange custoners for a longer time. A newbie very shy girl maybe very timid and not want to be with customers unless is feeling happy that they are nice. Donut tends to hide after her dance bracket rather than try to find a customer unless she really feels confident with a customer, despite being a stunner. Definitely a tiimid girl. Not compatible with the more aggressive type customers.

In the bar, we are competing with other customers to get the very best in demand girls. I believe I have to act in a way that gives me a chance of winning, but accept sometimes I lose out. I remember one very hot girl in Bacarra who would not even answer me (not a single word) when I spoke to her and asked if she was free/available. I soon saw her make a beeline for a young handsome Farang. She probably knew him already. These things happen. Tough luck. girls will come to me when I am the best option.

Girls sometimes prefer to work in bars over MPs. In MPs, girls get stuck with customers choosing them. Sometimes the girl loathes the customer. I remember cute Cat at Mango telling she actually disliked well over 50% of her regular customers, saying they were sick perverts or too rough and too aggressive. She obviously should not have been working a PSE shop. In bars, girls don't have to fuck a customer they don't like and don't really have to spend time getting groped by him either, if don't like him or he is cheap charlie. Girls have ability to choose or accept the customer.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1835196]snip

It's rare I see such an incident but does happen that girls run away from a customer, either because she doesn't like him or because an important customer has arrived. Girls have left me to go to another customer too. If she is my regular girl, she would normally tell me she is leaving out of politeness and give the reason, checking if I am OK with it, as I would then have opportunity to say I wanted to BF her if that was desired. I might say fine, go ahead to her other custoner if I had no intention of BFing her or not ready to make a decision.

snip

Girls are free to go to who they want in the bar. We don't realky own them after buying one drink. Sure we expect the girl to stay for a reasonable time, but she has to like the customer to feel she can handle to be with him. I believe long time experienced girls are more likely to put up with strange custoners for a longer time. A newbie very shy girl maybe very timid and not want to be with customers unless is feeling happy that they are nice. Donut tends to hide after her dance bracket rather than try to find a customer unless she really feels confident with a customer, despite being a stunner. Definitely a tiimid girl. Not compatible with the more aggressive type customers.[/QUOTE]Why must it only be that girls leave a customer shortly after a Lady Drink has been bought because the customer acts weird, is strange, isn't a nice guy, isn't nice to her, is too aggressive, isn't important enough, or that she doesn't like him? Surely you don't believe those are the only or, for that matter, the most likely reasons a girl hops up and leaves a customer for whatever excuse shortly after a Lady Drink has been bought just because that is what the girls tell you when they leave that customer and are now hoping you will buy them a Lady Drink.

Going out on a limb here. But I am guessing a whole bunch of bargirls, even girls in Crazy House, even girls who tell you otherwise all the time, even girls who excuse themselves from you shortly after you have bought them a Lady Drink, or even two Lady Drinks, are simply not interested in barfining with anyone at this time but instead are keenly interested in racking up as many Lady Drink quota credits and commissions as possible before their 20 minute off stage time is up.

Just sayin'.

If that is the reason, and I suspect it is the real reason many more times than the suspiciously universally self-serving reasons you hear from the girls, it makes total sense to me for them to try to do it. Their short term gain being the motivation, that is.

Meanwhile, nobody's night is ruined or ego destroyed over it. There are too many tasty options and pleasures to be had in all directions for very little time and money for it to do such a thing. However, I support anyone here reporting it happening because one never knows if it is a one off or a trend that others have experienced lately as well and, therefore, something that must be noted regarding a particular venue. Talking about a potential pattern that might turn out to be either widely encouraged or ignored and allowed by management in a given bar.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1835204]Why must it only be that girls leave a customer shortly after a Lady Drink has been bought because the customer acts weird, is strange, isn't nice to her, is too aggressive, isn't important enough, or that she doesn't like him? Surely you don't think those are the only or, for that matter, the most likely reasons a girl hops up and leaves a customer for whatever excuse after a Lady Drink has been bought just because that is what the girls tell you when they leave that customer and are now hoping you will buy them a Lady Drink.
[/QUOTE]Sure I don't see ladies jumping ship quickly so often so she is either not liking the customer or a bit of a scammer, or going to her regular. I haven't detected very many scammers. I don't find Donut is a scammer. She is far too timid. She doesn't even approach guys, looking for a drink.

Girls have an imperative to make money for the evening, not just sit around lazy and make zero money. So without a reasonable flow of drink commissions, she is working for free. Some girls did not attend the bar enough times in January to get any monthly salary at all, so leaves only drink commissions and barfines, yet the girl may not want to fuck absolutely anyone. Girls presumably stay with me, because they see me as the best option at the time. They know staying with me will get a drink every "off stage" cycle.

I do hear the odd complaint from girls that many customers want to call the girl, buy just one drink for her, have their fun, feel up her tits etc., and no BF. i.e. the customers want plenty for very small expenditure. Girls are looking for the better customers of course.

The girl's primary objective to make money is to get BFed by a nice customer. 2nd objective if to sell a lot of drinks, so the night is not totally wasted for her. Sometimes see girls too tired to work that don't want to be there (when they did not get enough sleep), but still turn up to work to try get a bit of money.

Anyway the girl's objective to sell drinks is clashing with customers whose objective is to spend as little as possible. I get treated well mostly because I am not cheap Charlie and I behave well. If I was cheap Charlie, I have no illusions. Girls would lose interest quickly enough. If my behaviour was not nice for them, they would run away too. If I should have underarm stench, I am sure girls would run away. I try to be better than the average customer. Fortunately that is not too hard, even competing against popular Japanese and Korean customers.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1835204]Going out on a limb here. But I am guessing a whole bunch of bargirls, even girls in Crazy House, even girls who tell you otherwise all the time, even girls who excuse themselves from you shortly after you have bought them a Lady Drink, or even two Lady Drinks, are simply not interested in barfining with anyone at this time but instead are keenly interested in racking up as many Lady Drink quota credits and commissions as possible before their 20 minute off stage time is up.[/QUOTE]I went to Crazy House recently and the lady drink scamming level is higher than all the other go-go bars I have ever tried. Guy next to me offered one to one girl, and she insisted he also buy one for her friend. So far, pretty standard. But then the girl immediately turned around and started speaking with somebody else.

As for me, the girl said she wanted whisky and coca cola. Barmaid brought 2 drinks: 1 whisky and 1 coca cola. I complained, because that is twice the price. That's a new scam I haven't heard before. I was so pissed I paid anyway and just left, leaving no tip which is unusual. Be careful! By contrast, Mandarin Upstairs in Nana and Baccara had normal behavior patterns.

I feel it makes sense to suggest the matrix of a romantic relationship is complex but becomes more so when there are diverse cultures involved. It works only if there are zones of compatibility or at least crossroads of similar interest. I have always believed the best way to find out if these exist is to go on holidays with your lady which is what I did with my uni student from Terminal 21. We had great sex, affectionate and passionate, she was so easy to be with, no problem with her English but by day 4 I found we had absolutely nothing to say to each other. I didn't set out looking for a life partner but I have been amazed how the initial infatuation was so quickly replaced with an I want to move on feeling. While I know the age difference 26 v 54 is partly to blame I feel cultural incompatibilities also come into play. I envy those who know how to make these relationships work. .

On another sad note my massage oasis on 53 has closed. It was raided by no less than 8 plain clothes no I'm not kidding as farcical as it sounds there were 8 of them looking for licenses, most of which the owner had but was missing one. She was hauled off to the station, appeared in court two days later, was fined 15000 baht. Later she was told she would in future have to "pay" three different "agencies" if she wanted to stay in business. Since it was not financially viable to reopen under these conditions she is understandably devastated.

I've been here on my third visit for about a month, have met and spoken with a number of people who are way more familiar with what goes on here than I am. I love the country, the people, the food, the massages, the nightlife but boy is there a lot that goes on here that is truly and I mean truly scary.

[QUOTE=EricSwiss;1835243]I went to Crazy House recently and the lady drink scamming level is higher than all the other go-go bars I have ever tried. Guy next to me offered one to one girl, and she insisted he also buy one for her friend. So far, pretty standard. But then the girl immediately turned around and started speaking with somebody else.

As for me, the girl said she wanted whisky and coca cola. Barmaid brought 2 drinks: 1 whisky and 1 coca cola. I complained, because that is twice the price. That's a new scam I haven't heard before. I was so pissed I paid anyway and just left, leaving no tip which is unusual. Be careful! By contrast, Mandarin Upstairs in Nana and Baccara had normal behavior patterns.[/QUOTE]Girl can suggest or insist to buy a drink for her friend all she likes. I ignore this type of behavior, unless I just happen to like her friend a lot. I can just say a straight no. I girl is annoying I tell her to go away, or just 100% ignore her.

I have not heard of Whiskey and coke being two drinks. Never saw a girl drink just a Whiskey unmixed. However a girl requesting two drinks is not that unusual. It is normally Tequila & coke. Obviously Tequila / coke is two drinks. Never saw anyone mix them. As far as I am aware the lady drinks at CH that she gets commission on, are either Tequilas or Cokes or Coke equivalents like Fanta. Nothing else much occurs with my experience there.

Again if the girl asks for two drinks, I can easily say "no just one". I admit I am assisted by speaking good Thai, being a regular, and having a good waitress to look after me. Also I am mainly using girls that I know well already. I almost never take on a new girl without having studied her behavior for some time, reducing my chances of getting a bad girl.

I suggest to guys to look carefully for a nice girl, call that one to you if you like and buy her just one drink to start with till see if there is really good chemistry going on. Take it slowly.

Guys can hate this bar just like I am not at all keen on Bacarra set up. However CH remains popular for many, and I am doing just fine there.

[QUOTE=GerryGa;1835263]I feel it makes sense to suggest the matrix of a romantic relationship is complex but becomes more so when there are diverse cultures involved. It works only if there are zones of compatibility or at least crossroads of similar interest. I have always believed the best way to find out if these exist is to go on holidays with your lady which is what I did with my uni student from Terminal 21. We had great sex, affectionate and passionate, she was so easy to be with, no problem with her English but by day 4 I found we had absolutely nothing to say to each other. I didn't set out looking for a life partner but I have been amazed how the initial infatuation was so quickly replaced with an I want to move on feeling. While I know the age difference 26 v 54 is partly to blame I feel cultural incompatibilities also come into play. I envy those who know how to make these relationships work. .

I've been here on my third visit for about a month, have met and spoken with a number of people who are way more familiar with what goes on here than I am. I love the country, the people, the food, the massages, the nightlife but boy is there a lot that goes on here that is truly and I mean truly scary.[/QUOTE]In my early days, I found some problems with taking certain girls away for several days. Not all girls. Some were very forgiving, others not. Thais have standards of behavior and etiquette that we don't know about and have to adjust to. I would recommend not taking a girl away for several days unless you have known her very well for some time. Build up to it. First ST, then LT, then 24 hours, then 2 days, then longer. However never jump to several days trip in one hit. Things can go sour.

I had a steep learning curve initially to assess exactly how high class a girl was and how I had to adjust myself. E. g. You cannot kiss a girl in public, and she won't even like you to put your arm around her waist, maybe holding her hand maybe acceptable in some places. She doesn't want to look very obviously like a hooker, even if she is one. Also you have know what quality of Hotel room is acceptable to a girl. Some can want an el cheapo, and others can want a high class room.

Suppose you have a bad cold and need to blow your nose. You need to run away to a toilet to do this. However if you are stuck sitting next to her on a bus can be a bit impractical. The sound of nose blowing is considered very rude in Thailand, even if not in a restaurant. Picking your nose in public, surprisingly is seen quite often and more accepted by Thais.

If you eat in a restaurant and indicate you did not like the food, suddenly girl could be upset and you are mystified as to why. Problem was she chose the restaurant and any criticism of anything could be viewed as criticising her selection. So great care with what is criticised and how it is done is important in Thai culture.

Yes, what do you have in common with the girl to talk about? Wanting to fuck her all the time, is not enough to keep her entertained. Is it important to yack yack to the her all the time? Perhaps not as long as are visiting some interesting places, conversation can be over rated. In my early days I spent time with Thai girls with little or no English the communication was a struggle but while I used it to learn Thai, could be tiresome for the girl, with me not understanding some very basic Thai expressions.

Some Thai girls can get incredibly pissed off if you keep reminding them how many minutes remain before the transport departs when she is doing her makeup, getting ready, etc. I have found certain holidays with a girlfriend got spoiled because the program of events was too hectic for her, and she had no concept of hurrying when time remaining was short.

Once a girl gets annoyed, she can stop talking to you, or go off somewhere and ignore you.

Once I had a lot of Thailand experience, things got a lot easier, but still make mistakes due to different standards of behavior.

20+ years ago, one girl was very upset that I did not give her a happy new year card and present. The fact I had just given her a Christmas card and present several days earlier did not count. She knew nothing about Christmas. I knew nothing about Thai system for New Year.

In Thailand, you must not use a typical Farang upward pointing finger curling movement to call a girl to come to you. Turn your hand upside down, and its suddenly more acceptable. Who knows why? Using your foot to point at an object or move it is very rude too. Westerners don't understand. So many traps for a newbie to do something quite unacceptable without realising it. A book on Thai etiquette is absolutely essential.

Speaking of CH, has anyone barfined #60 recently? She's absolutely gorgeous (well, at least to me)! I wanted to barfine her a couple nights ago, but I spoke to two mamasans there and both of them told me she was no good. So that dissuaded me from taking her. I was quite surprised that they would say this. I'm not a frequent customer, but I go there enough that a couple of the girls / mamasans recognize me. I wonder if #60 really has a bad rep, or the mamas just didn't like her for personal reasons?

[QUOTE=EricSwiss;1835243]I went to Crazy House recently and the lady drink scamming level is higher than all the other go-go bars I have ever tried. Guy next to me offered one to one girl, and she insisted he also buy one for her friend. So far, pretty standard. But then the girl immediately turned around and started speaking with somebody else.

As for me, the girl said she wanted whisky and coca cola. Barmaid brought 2 drinks: 1 whisky and 1 coca cola. I complained, because that is twice the price. That's a new scam I haven't heard before. I was so pissed I paid anyway and just left, leaving no tip which is unusual. Be careful! By contrast, Mandarin Upstairs in Nana and Baccara had normal behavior patterns.[/QUOTE]Usually, when I decide to buy a girl a drink, I like to ask the girl WHAT she wants to drink first. Then I order the drink. This way there is no 'mistake' (or bullshit). I don't like when anyone tries to scam. So I try my best to stop any of that before it can even happen. Funny part is the girl always just tries to order anyway. I smile and say, no honey, WHAT do you want? You want beer, whiskey, vodka? Then half of them still try to order directly with the server. Once I find out what she wants, I give the drink order. That usually prevents any issues. No one likes to be taken for a fool. That's one way that stuff can be prevented. Another thing a guy can do is simply confirm the order with the server. Now you and the server know exactly what is being ordered.

Good time in Som's Heaven again. The girls looks are nice for what you'd expect in a BJ bar, couple are cute (though nowhere near the GoGo level of course). Som is fun to chat with and makes sure you feel welcomed.

I'm very inexperienced with GoGo scene, though in CH I've noticed for the guy sitting next to me the waitress was bringing a ladydrink for the girl and for herself every time your man ordered his beer. He even tried to protest as in he didn't ask for it, but the waitress dismissed him with like "ah cmon you can afford this" attitude. Not sure if that's a norm, certainly didn't seem so.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1835275]In Thailand, you must not use a typical Farang upward pointing finger curling movement to call a girl to come to you. Turn your hand upside down, and its suddenly more acceptable. Who knows why? [/QUOTE]I hate the upward finger curl beckon back in Britain and don't do it myself. I put that down to years of travel around Asia and having adapted to the other one.

The former really does come across to me now as being used to arrogantly beckon another person like they are a naughty little dog, whereas the later doesn't somehow.

But again, perhaps just travel in Asia creates that distinction in me now between them, the former intends to wreck face but the later is far less so (or not at all).

My first crap session of my 2 weeks here. Was a free lancer from an outside cart bar.

9 pm checked CH. Waitress quickly told me all my girls were missing for Chinese new year so I stayed just 30 minutes to ensure they were not arriving late, 1 drink and left. Next booked number 14 Pheung at Annies. When I arrived turned out she had sore back and could not work. Booking staff did not know. She suggested Sunday.

Next went to a portable cart bar. Freelancer Apple had a cute face and cute ass. Have met her before. With clothes on I could not see her tits were small and very saggy.

Kissed nicely but could not handle DATY saying it was dirty (despite a long shower). No BJ given. Mish was OK for a while. However I got almost zero feeling from her pussy. Turns out she is a mother of 3 kids. Not much stretch marks but pussy was just a no feeling one. Not sure if there was sonething wrong with me today or not. After a while the dick started to flag.

Managed to fuck a total of maybe 20 minutes in various positions but was not getting anywhere close to a cum at all before going limp.

Real bombout. Cheap but useless. All other sessions for last two weeks have been good enough through to excellent. I actually only tried 3 new girls. Only today was a complete bomb out. The remainder of girls were repeats.

Sometimes shit happens and everything goes wrong. You can find a bad session almost anywhere. Any new girl is always a risk.

Puts a bit of a dampener on choosing girls where cannot see the body properly. Wished I could have done one of my fabulous body pretty girls: Ging, Donut, or Pheung. Ging has best feeling pussy of all. These girls are not mothers as far as I know, but normally I do have great fun with mothers.

I have fucked plenty of mothers happily before including GF, however not sure if I ever fucked a girl with 3 kids before. Possibly I would not know.

My post of 20 Aug 2013 (my 1st maybe ever visit appeared to be 12 Aug 2013):
[QUOTE=Syzygies;1460974]Return to Crazy House. Lineup was even better than Sunday. Arrived at 11PM. Many good lookers. This place is already significantly better than Baccara. Faces better, bodies better. Not so much fake stuff. Okay Some mammoth enhanced tits. Many very nice naturals. Completely nude girls with shaven pussy dancing quite raunchy. Some of the pussy is looking real fine. I fancied very pretty No. 91 (not a totally nude one). Problem was she was right near bickering over the price with a younger guy with beard. He would not go high enough and she would not go low enough. In the end they kept trying and not sure if the deal finally got done.

I then decided I fancied another girl. A shy type. Cute face in an Isaan way. Not too dark despite from Buriram. Turned out she was new and just only her 5th day. Had never been with Farang and actually done it. Has a few things to learn yet of course. I might just train her up. Took a LT with her.

Ate Phat Thai on the 4th floor restaurant. Air con was a bit cold on 4th.

This place has a standard. There are no really plain or ugly girls, like there are at Baccara. The girls with fatter legs seemed to be relegated to dancing upstairs. Downstairs had almost all acceptable bodies. There was a Ladyboy or two present who may have been waitresses (not dancing as far as I know). I did not pay attention to them. BF was 700. Place was popular with both Farangs and Japanese. Naked girls wandering round the bar at times or giving lap dances.

At Suzi Wong there are a lot of girl with no good bodies and just a few nice bodies. Crazy House has a high percentage of good bodies and good faces. This makes this place a cut above the other bars. Recently I have been liking Dollhouse but CH has better lineup overall. Wasn't pestered that much by the staff either.

The problem with this place is going to be just being packed out and not enough space, very soon. Don't know how they recruited the girls but they have done darn well.[/QUOTE]Here is one of my early posts about Crazy House. August 2013. It was probably my 3rd or 4th visit to the place (approx.) and I finally called a girl Mint over for a drink and barfined her. Indicates that, as a person non experienced to the place, I really took my time before getting interested in any girl at all. Interestingly number 91 (Oom) referred to, later became one of my favourites, much later. In the early days I developed a favorite waitress Noi, and often she was the only one I would buy a drink for, and chat to her a little when she wasn't too busy, sometimes buy a drink for Mint if she was working. Mint is long gone now.

Guys are reporting problems at this place with certain girls. I recommend for a guy new to CH, to really take your time. Don't be too fast to interact with girls till get a fair idea what they are like. I was very slow to have girls come to me for my first few visits, really trying hard to see which girls appeared to have the better character. I found Mint a good character girl (when sober) eventually. Took me a very long time to be game to try Oom (91). A good girl. She surprised me. Once get experienced in CH, I don't have lots of problems at all.

Some girls are very nice for me and Donut a stunner to my taste. Many are not. The overall standard has declined but still some girls excite me. Originally very few ugly girls. Now the average standard is still very good, but quite a few girls are a bit too average.

Lots of customers in CH are sitting without a girl. This is allowed. You are not forced to buy a drink for a girl. A girl was sitting on my right (with no relevance to me - I wasn't interested in her). Another customer was on my left (alone). The girl managed to catch his attention and signalled to him she would like a drink. She did not signal to me at all. Pehaps I show my disinterest too obviously, hardly even glancing at her. He smirked and staired off into space for 3 seconds, then suddenly nodded yes to her. I was stunned. He had not noticed her before and just made a snap decision. I would not do that. It looks like newbie behaviour to me. Any girl will do? I want to study all the girls, look for the best few, then study them for extended time in detail to see how they behave before considering calling one to me. If girls I know well, I could call them straight away. That is different.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1835180]Thanks fir the complement. I had to look him up but think he looks quite good when not pulling a silly face.[/QUOTE]That wasn't a compliment.

[QUOTE=FinnishFucker;1835746]That wasn't a compliment.[/QUOTE]My GF says she is not really into super handsome guys except for Antonio Banderas who getting a bit old too. Only slightly younger than me. Unfortunately lack his latin looks and nose.

She prefers good hearted guys that are tolerant.

Fortunately for us rather ordinary looking guys, we can find gorgeous young dream girls, see them naked, and get 90 mins of fun and GFE for an amazing price. All night is possible. Several days holiday is possible. None of these things was really feasible back home. Girls were too expensive for just 30 mins and mostly not very good. Tabletop eats money far too fast and you get no fuck.

Thailand and FKK totally cured me of visiting Tabletop back home to play with the young girls.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1835764]My GF says she is not really into super handsome guys except for Antonio Banderas who getting a bit old too. Only slightly younger than me. Unfortunately lack his latin looks and nose.
She prefers good hearted guys that are tolerant

Fortunately for us rather ordinary looking guys, we can find gorgeous young dream girls, see them naked, and get 90 mins of fun and GFE for an amazing price. All night is possible. Several days holiday is possible. None of these things was really feasible back home. Girls were too expensive for just 30 mins and mostly not very good. Tabletop eats money far too fast and you get no fuck.

[/QUOTE]You can buy Antonio Banderas mask for your bedroom activities, LOL.

Older women like older men. Younger girls generally prefer younger handsome guys. Hookers are a race of their own. They fuck customers in all shapes, ages and sizes as long as the guy has a pulse.

I had plenty of GFE for free for 2 decades from young hot finnish girls when I was younger geezer. I just went to a bar / disco and came back with a catch of the day. Fantastic times! I can never compare those girls and experiences with hookers. I don't need the bullshit GFE-acting from working girls. I know many punters require GFE, to each his own. All I need is some nice tight pussy to plunge my cock in and ample tits to play with. Simple stuff for a simple guy, not too much thinking or philosophizing.

[QUOTE=EricSwiss;1835243]I went to Crazy House recently and the lady drink scamming level is higher than all the other go-go bars I have ever tried. Guy next to me offered one to one girl, and she insisted he also buy one for her friend. So far, pretty standard. But then the girl immediately turned around and started speaking with somebody else.

As for me, the girl said she wanted whisky and coca cola. Barmaid brought 2 drinks: 1 whisky and 1 coca cola. I complained, because that is twice the price. That's a new scam I haven't heard before. I was so pissed I paid anyway and just left, leaving no tip which is unusual. Be careful! By contrast, Mandarin Upstairs in Nana and Baccara had normal behavior patterns.[/QUOTE]This seems to be the hot topic these days. I will tell you my experience and how I dealt with it. I'm not a regular here but I go enough for some of the staff to recognize me. One night I spotted a real young hottie about 18-20. Invited her to sit down with me. She climbed down off the stage and sat next to me and I offered her a drink. While waiting for our drinks we discussed the bar fine and time. Agreed to LT for 3,500. Drinks came and she abruptly told me after downing hers in one gulp she couldn't go with me anymore. I asked why and she stood up and walked away. She was clearly too drunk but I was angry at this point. I called the momason over and told her what happened and refused to pay for the LD, I only paid for mine. I then asked her to introduce me to a hot girl which she did. We agreed on the deal and 2 drinks later we were off. In the meantime the momason called over the other girl and made her pay the full price for her lady drink. I was shocked but happily mouthed the Thai words (Som nam Na) which means " you got what you deserved" in Thai. Guys, learn to stand up to these little monsters and things might change.

[QUOTE=FinnishFucker;1835746]That wasn't a compliment.[/QUOTE]How can being compared to Robert Englund not being a compliment? I have seen far much worse human wreckage trawl the drinking holes of Bangkok and Pattaya and still being serviced by the bargirls.

About a year ago I was in Suzi Wong and at the booth next to me was this old guy, well past the age of 70 I think. He was entertaining 3 girls at the same time: DFK-ing the first, one hand on the naked boob of another and one hand in the panties of a third.

He got more attention than the dancers on stage and after about 15 minutes or so barfined two of the girls and went out.

Age still commands a lot of respect in South East Asia.

Age. . . And money of course.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1835785]How can being compared to Robert Englund not being a compliment? I have seen far much worse human wreckage trawl the drinking holes of Bangkok and Pattaya and still being serviced by the bargirls.

About a year ago I was in Suzi Wong and at the booth next to me was this old guy, well past the age of 70 I think. He was entertaining 3 girls at the same time: DFK-ing the first, one hand on the naked boob of another and one hand in the panties of a third.

He got more attention than the dancers on stage and after about 15 minutes or so barfined two of the girls and went out.

Age still commands a lot of respect in South East Asia.

Age. . . And money of course.[/QUOTE]Ha ha for a moment I thought it was me. LOL. In 10 years time. However I probably don't bother to put hand in the girl's panties very often unless she is a very raunchy girl.

I suppose we develop a sense if how nasty to play depending on the girl.

I miss SW's very raunchy girls like Ma from early 2013. She was a damn good fuck.

Not sure I will have the stamina for two girls at age 70. Good luck to him. Vitamin V can make sure almost every old man can be virile. Sometimes the women complain about this. LOL

[QUOTE=Bkkdog;1835781]This seems to be the hot topic these days. I will tell you my experience and how I dealt with it. I'm not a regular here but I go enough for some of the staff to recognize me. One night I spotted a real young hottie about 18-20. Invited her to sit down with me. She climbed down off the stage and sat next to me and I offered her a drink. While waiting for our drinks we discussed the bar fine and time. Agreed to LT for 3,500. Drinks came and she abruptly told me after downing hers in one gulp she couldn't go with me anymore. I asked why and she stood up and walked away. She was clearly too drunk but I was angry at this point. I called the momason over and told her what happened and refused to pay for the LD, I only paid for mine. I then asked her to introduce me to a hot girl which she did. We agreed on the deal and 2 drinks later we were off. In the meantime the momason called over the other girl and made her pay the full price for her lady drink. I was shocked but happily mouthed the Thai words (Som nam Na) which means " you got what you deserved" in Thai. Guys, learn to stand up to these little monsters and things might change.[/QUOTE]I guess you had moved to LT negotiation too quickly. She clearly had no intention of doing LT for that price.

I always say, move very slowly. Bad girls exist for sure. Moving very slowly helps avoid them or identify them.

I rarely do LT at all unless feel I can really trust a girl to be good. I have not had a LT since early last year and then I knew the girl exceedingly well. That was a secret liason her shop did not know about. So she did not have to share with the shop what I paid. Wasn't a bargirl.

Was fortunate you found a good mamasan. An old one that got fired was very bad. I like mamasan Paeng the most. Par is okay Maybe? And the others I don't know at all.

[QUOTE=Dart13;1835388]Good time in Som's Heaven again. The girls looks are nice for what you'd expect in a BJ bar, couple are cute (though nowhere near the GoGo level of course). Som is fun to chat with and makes sure you feel welcomed.

I'm very inexperienced with GoGo scene, though in CH I've noticed for the guy sitting next to me the waitress was bringing a ladydrink for the girl and for herself every time your man ordered his beer. He even tried to protest as in he didn't ask for it, but the waitress dismissed him with like "ah cmon you can afford this" attitude. Not sure if that's a norm, certainly didn't seem so.[/QUOTE]You are right. What makes them think we're all suckers? Last time I carried exact change because they think you'll forget or get impatient and walk out without change. I'll forget to go to CH ever again. There's too much to do in BKK to put up with that crap.

[QUOTE=JesseJames;1835856]You are right. What makes them think we're all suckers? Last time I carried exact change because they think you'll forget or get impatient and walk out without change. I'll forget to go to CH ever again. There's too much to do in BKK to put up with that crap.[/QUOTE]They also wasted about 5 minutes of my time with giving me back my change. Hoping I would get confused and just wander off maybe? If they don't respect my time, I'm not going to patronize their place. Although, I am not going to any gogo's at all. The whole scene is changing. It used to just be a glorified brothel with naked chicks dancing, not much to complain about with that format. However now, they are all turning into the western "money bomb" model. Where you just go to gain face by appeasing the club with your endless supply of bank roll. I tell you what Thai gogo's, move your business into a spacious, clean and modern facility, then you can ask for money bombs and wealthy types. In the meantime, anybody who pays more to gogo (on housed in a decrepit-rat-infested-moldy-ex-brothel) than the bare minimum is a sucker and just contributing to their displaced greed. Less tips for honest waitresses, however I suspect that the owners get some of that tip money somehow (by paying them less wages).

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1835785]
Age still commands a lot of respect in South East Asia.

Age. . . And money of course.[/QUOTE]SE Asia is popular area for western guys to spend their retirement days. That is what I am planning to do when I turn 65, if I still have a beating heart then.

A lot of great info here guys, thank you! Was hoping I could ask a couple of general questions please. I'm flying into BKK from NY and staying 2 weeks. Is this long enough or will I be a mess after I get back. I don't drink and am not interested in overnights with these girls. I prefer to sleep alone. How much can I expect to pay for a couple of hours with a girl and what's the best plan of attack? Would like to take two at a time at least once too.

Thanks fellas!

[QUOTE=JesseJames;1835856]You are right. What makes them think we're all suckers? Last time I carried exact change because they think you'll forget or get impatient and walk out without change. I'll forget to go to CH ever again. There's too much to do in BKK to put up with that crap.[/QUOTE]Good idea with the exact change. I spent some time in Spanky's in Nana which was amazing, but it took here about 15 minutes / maybe 4 songs to come back with the change when I was done. I waited it out and got the proper change though. Too bad for me the timing wasn't right as I just finished up with some ST fun elsewhere in the plaza before I gave Spanky's a try. Tons of beautiful girls here. I asked to speak with one and she sat on my lap the whole time with lots good honest fun. After a bit, she asked me to take her out, but since I was spent and had to meet up with someone, I couldn't. We had a few drinks and then I was off. She had a fun bubbly attitude. I'm about 90% sure it was the girl in the bottom right of this picture with the blond hair. Her hair was lighter, she had glasses, and she was cuter than the picture portrays. Actually, pretty much all of the ladies were hot that night.

[IMG]http://www.stickmanbangkok.com/images/Spankys-Bangkok-2015-6.jpg[/IMG]

[QUOTE=ParkVille;1835864]They also wasted about 5 minutes of my time with giving me back my change. Hoping I would get confused and just wander off maybe? If they don't respect my time, I'm not going to patronize their place. Although, I am not going to any gogo's at all. The whole scene is changing. It used to just be a glorified brothel with naked chicks dancing, not much to complain about with that format. However now, they are all turning into the western "money bomb" model. Where you just go to gain face by appeasing the club with your endless supply of bank roll. I tell you what Thai gogo's, move your business into a spacious, clean and modern facility, then you can ask for money bombs and wealthy types. In the meantime, anybody who pays more to gogo (on housed in a decrepit-rat-infested-moldy-ex-brothel) than the bare minimum is a sucker and just contributing to their displaced greed. Less tips for honest waitresses, however I suspect that the owners get some of that tip money somehow (by paying them less wages).[/QUOTE]Ah, so true. And it is not just in the P4 P industry. You have described many aspects of the tourist industry in today's Thailand. Success has led to arrogance and things have been headed downhill for a time now. And it has really accelerated in the last two years. Fewer and fewer Western tourists and more and more Asian tourists. Mind you, not top notch Asian tourists, but those whose expectations are not very high. Right now we are infested with hordes of mainland Chinese. The locals are very perceptive and figured out very quickly that these folks will pay more for less and not complain. I have seen a real decline in the level of services here. Not in the branded hotels for example but in locally owned accommodations. Food wise we steer far clear of the Nana area (with the exception of Arab food on Soi 3/1) as the service and quality is not so good.

[QUOTE=Mongo69;1835970]A lot of great info here guys, thank you! Was hoping I could ask a couple of general questions please. I'm flying into BKK from NY and staying 2 weeks. Is this long enough or will I be a mess after I get back. I don't drink and am not interested in overnights with these girls. I prefer to sleep alone. How much can I expect to pay for a couple of hours with a girl and what's the best plan of attack? Would like to take two at a time at least once too.

Thanks fellas![/QUOTE]The great thing about BKK is that even for a new visitor, it's pretty easy to arrange anything you want. I am actually flying to BKK tomorrow and I have spent so much time there in the last 20 years I've come to know it pretty well.

Two weeks is great. It's up to you whether you exhaust yourself with girls, but you probably won't. There is lots to do and with that much time there is plenty of time to take some excursions.

I also prefer to sleep alone, so generally I enjoy soapies or oil massage places. It's very hard to find a reputable and reliable escort service, but I know a good one (expensive but discreet and great). To take two, you can try a service or just finding girls at gogo bars or whatever, but it's not easy. A lot of them will agree but won't be interested in each other or be giggling the whole time. There are also options like Eden club, which a lot of people dislike but I don't mind if for an occasional different experience.

The same thing goes in Thailand as everywhere else. If you can connect with the girls, be super nice, be comfortable, and don't be overly demanding you will get great service as long as you are careful to actually choose girls that seem friendly and interested. Have fun!

Any buddy has Number or Line ID of Yaya from Candy massage? Please PM me.

Shall be obliged.

Thanks,

[QUOTE=Raju1974;1836077]Any buddy has Number or Line ID of Yaya from Candy massage? Please PM me.

Shall be obliged.

Thanks,[/QUOTE]Why would anyone want to give you more or less private info?

Be nice to Yaya and she may give it to you- or not.

You can also ask the mamasan Candy. She will probably not give it to you, but she is too polite to tell you to fuck off!

[QUOTE=Mongo69;1835970]A lot of great info here guys, thank you! Was hoping I could ask a couple of general questions please. I'm flying into BKK from NY and staying 2 weeks. Is this long enough or will I be a mess after I get back. I don't drink and am not interested in overnights with these girls. I prefer to sleep alone. How much can I expect to pay for a couple of hours with a girl and what's the best plan of attack? Would like to take two at a time at least once too.

Thanks fellas![/QUOTE]2 weeks is plenty of Bangkok could be even too much. Can always try Pattaya as well.

For two girls I recommend looking at the lesbian show performers in Suzi Wong bar. Always worked well for me.

Make it clear to girls that you want 2 gours to avoid misundersta dings. Many assume a short is iver when you pop. Use Massage parlors recommended here to get 2 hour bookings.

[QUOTE=DaddySan;1836114]Why would anyone want to give you more or less private info?
![/QUOTE]+1.

Have to agree with that. Private numbers are private.

[QUOTE=ParkVille;1835864]They also wasted about 5 minutes of my time with giving me back my change. Hoping I would get confused and just wander off maybe?[/QUOTE]This is Asia. Time flows differently here.

[QUOTE=ParkVille;1835864]Less tips for honest waitresses, however I suspect that the owners get some of that tip money somehow (by paying them less wages).[/QUOTE]In that business model they are only following the (in) glorious shining example of the USA.

[QUOTE=JesseJames;1835856]You are right. What makes them think we're all suckers? Last time I carried exact change because they think you'll forget or get impatient and walk out without change. I'll forget to go to CH ever again. There's too much to do in BKK to put up with that crap.[/QUOTE]There is a particular danger close to closing time. I once got scammed by a mamasan who did not come back with the change from BF. 300 Baht stolen. She just disappeared and presumably left the bar or was hiding in the toilet.

She got fired not too long after this, quite expected.

Great idea to have exact money prepared or to have very close to bill sum if don't trust the staff.

Last Saturday, my ex legit-MP (outwardly shy, but fucking me almost to death) girl after dinner, expressed her secret wish to go to Soi Cowboy, for the first time in her life.

Wanting to show her the best, I took her to Crazy House. After 5 minutes, she said 'Is that all?' and was ready to leave. So you see, tastes differ.

We then walked Soi Cowboy towards Asoke. Right at the end on the right (north) side there is a music club, I forget the name, with a live band and singer, playing oldies.

We went in and had a blast. Fantastic atmosphere. Everybody dancing. Best to BYO.

Highly recommended!

[QUOTE=Bkkdog;1835781]This seems to be the hot topic these days. I will tell you my experience and how I dealt with it. I'm not a regular here but I go enough for some of the staff to recognize me. One night I spotted a real young hottie about 18-20. Invited her to sit down with me. She climbed down off the stage and sat next to me and I offered her a drink. While waiting for our drinks we discussed the bar fine and time. Agreed to LT for 3,500. Drinks came and she abruptly told me after downing hers in one gulp she couldn't go with me anymore. I asked why and she stood up and walked away. She was clearly too drunk but I was angry at this point. I called the momason over and told her what happened and refused to pay for the LD, I only paid for mine. I then asked her to introduce me to a hot girl which she did. We agreed on the deal and 2 drinks later we were off. In the meantime the momason called over the other girl and made her pay the full price for her lady drink. I was shocked but happily mouthed the Thai words (Som nam Na) which means " you got what you deserved" in Thai. Guys, learn to stand up to these little monsters and things might change.[/QUOTE]I think you did the right thing. So did the mamasan. And, for that matter, so did the girl you eventually wound up with! LOL. I did something similar the one previous time a Crazy House girl pulled the Lady Drink Hustle and Vanish routine on me a couple of months ago prior to the one other time a couple of Saturdays ago. At least with regard to making it somewhat dramatically known that the girl in question was a scammer. She banked her LD commission ticket, wandered off to sit with another customer, no explanation, and started lobbying him for a LD, pretending to be too drunk to know what she was doing. But she wasn't too drunk to wind her way through the crowd, chat it up for a moment, order her drink, collect the commission ticket and hit up another customer. So I stood up, walked over to her and handed her the drink, which she took in her hand and held as steady and sober as a priest. Told her new con target to save himself the 160 baht since she already had a drink. A mamasan came over, heard the girl's lame excuse, sorted it all out and all was well again.

In subsequent visits, including the very next week, I have not seen that girl working in Crazy House again. I do believe it matters to complain when the details are so obviously on our side. So, on behalf of myself as a fellow male and a fellow punter, thank you for standing up and doing the right thing. It won't revolutionize anything. But it is still worthwhile to be part of the solution rather than part of the problem whenever possible. The second time it happened to me there, just a couple of Saturday's ago, I didn't stand up and make it known to the mamasan or anything. I should have. My only excuse is I only gestured for the girl to come on over for a LD because she was making such a spectacle of herself to get my attention, she was cute, but otherwise I wasn't in the market for barfining anyone or even talking about barfining anyone anyway. But she wouldn't have known that.

I have seen Crazy House girls engage in various Lady Drink hustles over the years. Lady Drink hustling seems to be more pronounced in Crazy House than other places. I suspect the girls early on discovered that such an abundance of naked, young flesh kind of dazzles many of us, fogs our thinking and makes us way too eager to buy one and then way too eager to forget about what just happened regarding a LD Hustle and Vanish that might have occurred, make excuses for it, and then our attention shifts to the very next naked, young girl who is rubbing up against us. LOL.

I have found that making the dramatic gesture to at least point out to a mamasan that you just got scammed can help weed out at least the clumsiest scammers and does nothing to reduce the other girls' interest in convincing you to barfine them or to deliver very good service when you do. I have had several very good experiences with other Crazy House girls since that previous incident a couple of months ago. And I had a very, very good one just last night. Downstairs stage dancer, flawless slender body, cute face, reminded me of a Japanese girl who used to live with me back in the states. I'd never met her before, might not have even seen her before at Crazy House. As soon as the one and only LD I bought her hit the bar, she asked me if I would pay her barfine, which prompted me to immediately swing into my #2 response in my POST #33419 in this thread. Then, the instant she mentioned "how much" she wanted me to pay her for LT (4000 baht), I immediately shifted quite naturally into my #3 response. It all worked out beautifully well and I had one of the sweetest-feeling real GFE boom-booms to a glorious finish I have ever had with a pro or an amateur.

She was upstairs changing into her street clothes no more than 10 minutes after we met. I decided early on that the Lady Drink hustle in Crazy House was so commonplace and often so thick, relying as they do on your being dazzled into a lack of preparedness by all the naked, young flesh with virtually zero improvement on the in room experience if you go along with it and, more likely, nothing but downside introduced from doing so, that the best way to get the most from a girl with whom you make a connection there is to Always Be Closing, even getting to an agreement without buying a single Lady Drink if it is at all practical.

[QUOTE=FinnishFucker;1835962]SE Asia is popular area for western guys to spend their retirement days. That is what I am planning to do when I turn 65, if I still have a beating heart then.[/QUOTE]I don't intend to retire for quite a few years yet also, and may leave Bangkok.

It's a bit hot for Sauna here, and you might have to be lenient in your tits size requirements down to just Ccups, even then a bit scarce, unless you are happy with some bars and other places that are silicone paradise. Even I take tits from zero to large, choice is still difficult for me.

I am not liking the highly adjusted alien looks. Today saw a girl with very large irises (eye darker coloured area). I guess was coloured contact lenses, but already made her look weird unnatural to me. Fake noses are getting more and more popular like an explosion. 90% plus of the fake noses are ugly to me. Thais just are not meant to have high bridge of the nose. Its not a plus for beauty.

So many young fatties around in the modern day. I really hope some of these trends do not continue at the same rate in the next 10 years.

[QUOTE=Mongo69;1835970]A lot of great info here guys, thank you! Was hoping I could ask a couple of general questions please. I'm flying into BKK from NY and staying 2 weeks. Is this long enough or will I be a mess after I get back. I don't drink and am not interested in overnights with these girls. I prefer to sleep alone. How much can I expect to pay for a couple of hours with a girl and what's the best plan of attack? Would like to take two at a time at least once too.

Thanks fellas![/QUOTE]Personally, I think two weeks a long time just to monger. I would suggest you plan toursity things to do in between. Sukhumvit gets old pretty quick. You may want to think about going to Chang Mai just for a change of pace. Plenty of tourist stuff in Bangkok also. Take a day trip to Kanchanaburi. You should not be paying more than 1000 baht for short time. If you're looking for freelancers, you can go to Beer Garden or Gullivers during day time and Bangkok beat at night. If you want professional 3-some, go to the brothel (can't recall name) on Soi 11?

Thank you Ken, Syz, and Crypt, and anyone else who chimes in. I wasn't planning on 2 weeks of mongering, but I was concerned with 25 hours of travel time and hoping two weeks was enough stay before the 25 hours back!! Will def mix it up. So for a couple hours with a little cute I'm looking at 1000 baht? What about bar fine? Or should I stick to freelancers and massage girls? Was hoping to take back to my hotel. It was hard to figure on here, overwhelming info.

Thank you thank you guys.

[QUOTE=Crypton;1836454]Personally, I think two weeks a long time just to monger. I would suggest you plan toursity things to do in between. Sukhumvit gets old pretty quick. You may want to think about going to Chang Mai just for a change of pace. Plenty of tourist stuff in Bangkok also. Take a day trip to Kanchanaburi. You should not be paying more than 1000 baht for short time. If you're looking for freelancers, you can go to Beer Garden or Gullivers during day time and Bangkok beat at night. If you want professional 3-some, go to the brothel (can't recall name) on Soi 11?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Crypton;1836454]Personally, I think two weeks a long time just to monger. I would suggest you plan toursity things to do in between. Sukhumvit gets old pretty quick. You may want to think about going to Chang Mai just for a change of pace. Plenty of tourist stuff in Bangkok also. Take a day trip to Kanchanaburi. You should not be paying more than 1000 baht for short time. If you're looking for freelancers, you can go to Beer Garden or Gullivers during day time and Bangkok beat at night. If you want professional 3-some, go to the brothel (can't recall name) on Soi 11?[/QUOTE]Day time freelancers at Gulivers? The place on Soi 5? Good to know.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1836316]So many young fatties around in the modern day. I really hope some of these trends do not continue at the same rate in the next 10 years.[/QUOTE]That's all over the world. I do miss the days when most Thai women were thin. For sure a thing of the past. The diet has changed drastically since the 90's. Too many eating junk food at 7/11. Cakes and pastries abound now. And 5 kilos on a short girl changes her shape completely.

[QUOTE=Mongo69;1836467]Thank you Ken, Syz, and Crypt, and anyone else who chimes in. I wasn't planning on 2 weeks of mongering, but I was concerned with 25 hours of travel time and hoping two weeks was enough stay before the 25 hours back!! Will def mix it up. So for a couple hours with a little cute I'm looking at 1000 baht? What about bar fine? Or should I stick to freelancers and massage girls? Was hoping to take back to my hotel. It was hard to figure on here, overwhelming info.

Thank you thank you guys.[/QUOTE]You only get freelancers for 1000 Baht. Even some of those maybe not. Oily massage costs more. Bargirls and soapy girls even more again.

I am not in habit of taking freelancers. When I met a pretty one a few weeks back, she was quoting 1. 5 K I believe. I asked how much time she gave for that? It clearly wasn't 2 hours and she indicated for 2 hours she would increase the fee. I did not bargain with her as did not actually want a screw at all having just completed one.

I am very sceptical that lots of pretty girls will give 2 hours for 1 K. However not a freelancers expert. My only recent freelancer was a really crap session and did not like her tits. She did not specify a price. Probably figured I knew the prices. Ha ha.

It is worth pointing out that in a massage shop like Snow White or Mango, 2 hours will cost you a bit over 2000 Baht, and higher in sone other places.

After several weeks of bizzare events the majority partner of Dollhouse meets a gory end. I wonder what was on his mind when he decided to retrieve the keys to his apartment in such a novel manner. Why not call a locksmith?

[URL]http://www.bangkokpost.com/news/general/856216/troubled-soi-cowboy-bar-owner-falls-to-death-from-39th-floor-condo[/URL]

It's very sad Ding one of my favorites on Cowboy just got a nose job and completely spoiled the symmetry between her lips and eyes. I cannot ever be with her again. It's amazing how a nose job can affect a look, prior to the change her ears looked beautifully crescent shaped, ear length greater than ear width almost oval but now the upper part appears wider. It's sad, really sad her tits to ass ratio are perfect, natural see cups to go with a butt midway between an inverted v and a round see. Along with having a perfect gap she has the cutest belly button, a small vertical innie with an ideal 46:54 midline horizontal position between breastbone and vulvar cleft. Her hands are classical oriental more Chinese courtesan than Thai mia noi and while some might find her toes a little on the small size I find as I get older I can overlook the odd imperfection unless of course I visit Annie's where once I see an average face I don't even worry about checking the body, it's for some odd reason like an irrelevancy.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1836506]That's all over the world. I do miss the days when most Thai women were thin. For sure a thing of the past. The diet has changed drastically since the 90's. Too many eating junk food at 7/11. Cakes and pastries abound now. And 5 kilos on a short girl changes her shape completely.[/QUOTE]Not all are fatties out there.

[QUOTE=Jgm005;1836623]Not all are fatties out there.[/QUOTE]Yes agreed.

What's going on with the light yellow-green folded card seemly floating on the first girl's right side? Yes she is nice and slim.

2nd girl shot is perhaps not the most flattering for this girl. Can't tell how slim she is. Maybe a bit puffy?

No trouble to find plenty of skinny natural girls in Crazy House. The last bastion? So it is the place suited my personal specs, but sometimes I still find no one really interesting there (I am picky and only 50% of girls tried not dick scared and worth repeating for a guy easy to please). I would be interested to learn of any other places with a high proportion of natural skinnies (not dominated by sillies and nose jobs). Nothing obvious comes to my mind. E. g. Addict has a fairly good line up, but percentage of nose jobs is quite high (80% ? Bacarra packed out with nose jobs and / or sillies. RB4 has a lot of fake girls too. Hard to find a hot natural good girl there.

In the old days (for me), a higher percentage of bargirls were slim, fewer had sillies and very few had nose jobs. It was easier hunting in those days, and any one of several bars was okay For me 20 years ago. Others with different requirements and smaller budget have quit bar scene completely. Finding nice natural experienced girls in Soapies became much harder as well, with me not having a great deal of luck with girl selection at Nataree, and most of my Soapy favourites long gone. I did not start Oilies till 9 years ago, so no significant decline in that area for me.

Despite all these whinges, enjoyable girls to suit my specs can be found, but no one that super special right now, to really dominate my attention.

[QUOTE=Blanquiceleste;1836565]After several weeks of bizzare events the majority partner of Dollhouse meets a gory end. I wonder what was on his mind when he decided to retrieve the keys to his apartment in such a novel manner. Why not call a locksmith?

[URL]http://www.bangkokpost.com/news/general/856216/troubled-soi-cowboy-bar-owner-falls-to-death-from-39th-floor-condo[/URL][/QUOTE]I have heard from staff that him and his friends were not necessarily well liked. I wonder if such an accident was the true story, without having any knowledge? Don't believe everything in the media too easily. I should ask my ex dollhouse girl for her thoughts.

I hear rumours that many cases that police right off as accidents or suicides, can actually be murders. There is the Pattaya Flying Club of Farangs going off tall buildings to their deaths not being uncommon.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1836630]

What's going on with the light yellow-green folded card seemly floating on the first girl's right side? Yes she is nice and slim.[/QUOTE]It's a bikini label. She's in a change room trying on bikinis. Agree she has cuteness potential.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;1836636]It's a bikini label. She's in a change room trying on bikinis. Agree she has cuteness potential.[/QUOTE]Thanks. So obvious now. Can see another price tag in the picture as well. Sort of never occurred to me for girls to try on outfits for the purpose of a photo more so than to buy them. LOL I guess some would have hidden the price tag.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1836630]
In the old days (for me), a higher percentage of bargirls were slim, fewer had sillies and very few had nose jobs. It was easier hunting in those days, and any one of several bars was okay For me 20 years ago. Others with different requirements and smaller budget have quit bar scene completely. Finding nice natural experienced girls in Soapies became much harder as well, with me not having a great deal of luck with girl selection at Nataree, and most of my Soapy favourites long gone. I did not start Oilies till 9 years ago, so no significant decline in that area for me.[/QUOTE]Would it not be a reasonable assumption that you also were a different guy 20 years ago? I only have 5-6 years of mongering experience in Bangkok / Pattaya but I find sexy girls in most bars! I see a lot of boobs and nose jobs of course. With some exceptions I think it benefits the girl; make them more pretty. I understand others might disagree, but I really wonder if the general quality was better 20 years ago? With more influx of fast food etc. There is probably more fat bellies around, but as far as I can see it is not a big problem. 70% of the girls still have good bodies. We still have the privilege to choose our own little gem in a bar and that is what makes this hobby so interesting.

[QUOTE=Aviator12;1836657]Would it not be a reasonable assumption that you also were a different guy 20 years ago? I only have 5-6 years of mongering experience in Bangkok / Pattaya but I find sexy girls in most bars! I see a lot of boobs and nose jobs of course. With some exceptions I think it benefits the girl; make them more pretty. I understand others might disagree, but I really wonder if the general quality was better 20 years ago? With more influx of fast food etc. There is probably more fat bellies around, but as far as I can see it is not a big problem. 70% of the girls still have good bodies. We still have the privilege to choose our own little gem in a bar and that is what makes this hobby so interesting.[/QUOTE]If you only started coming 5 or 6 years ago then you did not see the quality that was here before. I would say that by '10 there was a marked decrease in the looks of P4 P gals in BKK. Yes, Syz is spot on. The quality was quite a bit better. Part of it had to do with volume. There are just far fewer gals available now. In the early '00's you could not make it 15 meters on Suk at night without hearing "Go with you. " And that is not an exaggeration. The bars and freelancer spots were just heaving with gals. Nana Disco at the turn of the century was unreal. Every night packed to the gills. Not to mention the Nana hotel lobby. Same with Thermae, and not a Japanese guy in sight. You'd walk around the bar and gals would just grab your package. They were all partying and having fun; which I might add is the main ingredient missing in today's FL scene. Oh, and at Thermae and Nana the none of the gals would turn down 1 k Baht.

Closing time at Nana and Cowboy was a gas as well. Hundreds of gals who did not get a customer heading out of their bars looking to make some money. You could pick 'them off like flies. It was just amazing. Now, they want to go party with their friends because they are making plenty.

BKK was really paradise. And don't get me started on how good Pattaya was. 90% of the tourists were mongers. Low season was amazing. You could have the town and all the hookers almost to yourself. A riot. Sorry today's scene does not even begin to compare.

Do we wax on about the "good ole days?" You bet we do. I miss the hell out of them. It will never be that way again. So glad I was able to experience them.

[QUOTE=Jgm005;1836623]Not all are fatties out there.[/QUOTE]True, but you are hard pressed to find thin ones these days.

So where did all these girls go? Is it because they can make a living working normal jobs now? Too many Cheap Charlie's around to not make it worth their while any longer? I have to say I was very disappointed in soi 4. I was hoping it would be more of a scene that Goats described where I could pick hot girls off like flies.

As Thailand becomes more Westernized, prices are bound to increase over the years and girls will get fatter with unhealthy Westernized fast food, much to Syzy's dismay.

The good ole days are gone in many monger countries, including Germany. Are there any countries that are actually better monger destinations now than they were 5 or 10 years ago?

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1836682]
BKK was really paradise. And don't get me started on how good Pattaya was. 90% of the tourists were mongers. Low season was amazing. You could have the town and all the hookers almost to yourself. A riot. Sorry today's scene does not even begin to compare.
[/QUOTE]Total agree. I started coming in Thai just 10 years ago, so I'm not a 20-30 years old vet on the ground, but I can see the different between today and 10 years ago very well.

[QUOTE=Aviator12;1836657]Would it not be a reasonable assumption that you also were a different guy 20 years ago? I only have 5-6 years of mongering experience in Bangkok / Pattaya but I find sexy girls in most bars! I see a lot of boobs and nose jobs of course. With some exceptions I think it benefits the girl; make them more pretty. I understand others might disagree, but I really wonder if the general quality was better 20 years ago? With more influx of fast food etc. There is probably more fat bellies around, but as far as I can see it is not a big problem. 70% of the girls still have good bodies. We still have the privilege to choose our own little gem in a bar and that is what makes this hobby so interesting.[/QUOTE]I do think that the level of change is often exaggerated. I can still find some sexy girls in many bars on occasions. I accept that I am much more fussy than when first arriving in Bangkok for mongering 25 years ago. I can look at a photo of some girl from the past and be mystified that I actually selected her somehow. Must have been dark. LOL I guess tastes change a bit.

I still hot Thai girls out on the street or shopping every day. Wow, the girlfriend of the owner of a restaurant "The Blend" I saw the other day in her restaurant and again another time shopping at the Villa Markt.

So I accept that more bargirls were my spec many years ago because I was less fussy in addition to less fakes and less fatties. Combination of reasons. Also not enough experience with girls to have massive expectations of hookers initially.

So what bars have 70% of girls with good bodies? Not many bars do that for my specs. My requirements for slim and natural are a bit too tough? Also I like bars where can see "most" of the girls without too much problem. I object to highly covered up tits too (like what the Coyotes do), when have no idea what the girl's tits are really like.

Used to frequent Sheba (closed), Suzie Wong, Doll House and Long Gun but lost interest in them. Many years back used to frequent Lollipop, Pretty Lady, Voodoo and Hollywood.

Where did all the good girls go? I think it's more a case of the same types of girls but they now fatter, or have nose jobs, or have tit jobs, where in old times they were more natural. Maybe stunners have moved to high price soapies and escort work. Bangkok always had lots of crappy ordinary single mother looking girls in any era.

I was wondering which section would be best for me to post some info about Nonthaburi, Muang Thong Thani, Chaeng Wattana, Pakkred, Laksi, and more. There is the other areas thread, even though these spots are still in the Bangkok metro area. There's also general reports. Let me know where you guys think I should post where it would be most effective.

I have benefited from all the info posted on ISG. I come into Bangkok several times a week and make the best of my time with that info. So I appreciate the contributions. So I'll try and make some of my own that might cover other areas beside the usual. I know that there have to be other guys besides me that want to find some good alternatives closer to home. I haven't found much information online. I've pieced a few things together from random websites that aren't active anymore. But I've found most things through word of mouth and legwork.

To make a long story short, I've found soapies (both I have never seen referenced online), a whole street of MP's (maybe 15 in a row, but the services vary wildly from shop to shop and girl to girl), karaoke, cayote bars, kapoo clubs (very hot girls, and they do a lot more than the HJ with multiple shots as standard). I was actually very surprised as to what I was getting out of the kapoo clubs after what I had read to expect. Maybe it's a bit different up here. You guys just tell me where to post, and I'll get to work.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1836684]True, but you are hard pressed to find thin ones these days.[/QUOTE]One of the smaller bars on SC has 2/3 fatties.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1836316]
It's a bit hot for Sauna here, and you might have to be lenient in your tits size requirements down to just Ccups, even then a bit scarce, unless you are happy with some bars and other places that are silicone paradise. Even I take tits from zero to large, choice is still difficult for me.
[/QUOTE]The whole Thailand is a huge outdoor sauna. Hot and humid weather is good for my respiratory system and future old bones.

If I was to select the country to live my retirement days, just based on the looks of best girls and tits, I would go to Russia or Brazil. But these countries have their own issues. Russia is no country for old men unless you have a shitload of money, I don't. Brazil has some great looking girls and big natural tits but the country is not the safest and I am not the biggest fan of the latin mentality. Asia suits me fine. Nicely done silicones suit slim asian girls well, I have no problem with sillies there.

I still have 20+ years to play with big natural tits all around the world. Should be enough to get an overdose so I can concentrate on other things as an old man.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;1836686]So where did all these girls go? Is it because they can make a living working normal jobs now? Too many Cheap Charlie's around to not make it worth their while any longer? I have to say I was very disappointed in soi 4. I was hoping it would be more of a scene that Goats described where I could pick hot girls off ....[/QUOTE]No it was never that good, however it was a massive contrast to the home country. In the old days o used ti think one in 3 Thai girls in the age group were doable. Probably was not that good. Stunners were still relatively few. Now there are far less than 1 in 3 doable unless you are in the right place for your special type of girls.

For guys that like silucone and nose jobs or more weighty girls, its still damn good I guess.

[QUOTE=FinnishFucker;1836779]The whole country is a huge outdoor sauna. Hot and humid weather is good for my respiratory system and future old bones.

If I was to select the country to live my retirement days, just based on the looks of best girls and tits, I would go to Russia or Brazil. But these countries have their own issues. Russia is no country for old men unless you have a shitload of money, I don't. Brazil has some great looking girls and big natural tits but the country is not the safest and I am not the biggest fan of the latin mentality. Asia suits me fine. Nicely done silicones suit slim asian girls well, I have no problem with sillies there.

I still have 20+ years to play with big natural tits all around the world. Should be enough to get an overdose so I can concentrate on other things as an old man.[/QUOTE]Wow, FF can only follow your words, I also loving the easy way to enjoy These Asian B, because no hassle to enjoy the fun.

[QUOTE=Zeus9;1836751]I was wondering which section would be best for me to post some info about Nonthaburi, Muang Thong Thani, Chaeng Wattana, Pakkred, Laksi, and more. There is the other areas thread, even though these spots are still in the Bangkok metro area. There's also general reports. Let me know where you guys think I should post where it would be most effective.

I have benefited from all the info posted on ISG. I come into Bangkok several times a week and make the best of my time with that info. So I appreciate the contributions. So I'll try and make some of my own that might cover other areas beside the usual. I know that there have to be other guys besides me that want to find some good alternatives closer to home. I haven't found much information online. I've pieced a few things together from random websites that aren't active anymore. But I've found most things through word of mouth and legwork.

To make a long story short, I've found soapies (both I have never seen referenced online), a whole street of MP's (maybe 15 in a row, but the services vary wildly from shop to shop and girl to girl), karaoke, cayote bars, kapoo clubs (very hot girls, and they do a lot more than the HJ with multiple shots as standard). I was actually very surprised as to what I was getting out of the kapoo clubs after what I had read to expect. Maybe it's a bit different up here. You guys just tell me where to post, and I'll get to work.[/QUOTE]I guess the Other Areas thread would be most appropriate. Put it down anywhere really, but do it! Waiting for the reports.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;1836686]So where did all these girls go? Is it because they can make a living working normal jobs now? Too many Cheap Charlie's around to not make it worth their while any longer? I have to say I was very disappointed in soi 4. I was hoping it would be more of a scene that Goats described where I could pick hot girls off like flies.

As Thailand becomes more Westernized, prices are bound to increase over the years and girls will get fatter with unhealthy Westernized fast food, much to Syzy's dismay.

The good ole days are gone in many monger countries, including Germany. Are there any countries that are actually better monger destinations now than they were 5 or 10 years ago?[/QUOTE]When you look at average salaries in Thailand over the past 15 years, you will see a huge increase, especially among uni grads. Also restaurant workers are making a lot more than they used to. It's really all a function of development. Sadly I don't think there is any place that is as good as it "was. " I would have loved to have been able to monger in Eastern Europe in the very early 90's or in Brazil in the 80's.

I agree with you about Soi 4. It is just depressing. What used to be "charmingly sleazy" is now just gross.

[QUOTE=Zeus9;1836751]I was wondering which section would be best for me to post some info about Nonthaburi, Muang Thong Thani, Chaeng Wattana, Pakkred, Laksi, and more. There is the other areas thread, even though these spots are still in the Bangkok metro area. There's also general reports. Let me know where you guys think I should post where it would be most effective.

I have benefited from all the info posted on ISG. I come into Bangkok several times a week and make the best of my time with that info. So I appreciate the contributions. So I'll try and make some of my own that might cover other areas beside the usual. I know that there have to be other guys besides me that want to find some good alternatives closer to home. I haven't found much information online. I've pieced a few things together from random websites that aren't active anymore. But I've found most things through word of mouth and legwork.

To make a long story short, I've found soapies (both I have never seen referenced online), a whole street of MP's (maybe 15 in a row, but the services vary wildly from shop to shop and girl to girl), karaoke, cayote bars, kapoo clubs (very hot girls, and they do a lot more than the HJ with multiple shots as standard). I was actually very surprised as to what I was getting out of the kapoo clubs after what I had read to expect. Maybe it's a bit different up here. You guys just tell me where to post, and I'll get to work.[/QUOTE]Wow. Can't wait to read your reports. I smell a road trip.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1836692]I do think that the level of change is often exaggerated. I can still find some sexy girls in many bars on occasions. I accept that I am much more fussy than when first arriving in Bangkok for mongering 25 years ago. I can look at a photo of some girl from the past and be mystified that I actually selected her somehow. Must have been dark. LOL I guess tastes change a bit.


So I accept that more bargirls were my spec many years ago because I was less fussy in addition to less fakes and less fatties. Combination of reasons. Also not enough experience with girls to have massive expectations of hookers initially.

. Bangkok always had lots of crappy ordinary single mother looking girls in any era.[/QUOTE]Mr. Syzgies. Thanks for your input. I am trying to plan my first trip the LOS here in the next month. But, the constant persistent theme I keep seeing here is complaints about how things are not what they used to be. Constant whining / moaning / bitching about how things have gone downhill. However, if we look at the rest of the forums covering different regions, we see the same thing. If you were to believe everything you read here, you'd think things were perfect / peachy 10/20/30 years ago and that mongering is a waste of time now. Right?

Of course, this is all subjective. Perspective and experience is everything. People complain about how much more expensive the cost of mongering is from 20 years ago. I have to ask, what else is the same price as it was 20 years? Do you make the same income as you did 20 years ago? My income has doubled in the past 20 years. I don't know of anyone, except for retirees or people who have derailed their lives, or were downsized out of a exceptional job, who are earning less now than they did a decade ago.

And as you mention, age is a factor. We were easier to please in some matters when were younger. We are more jaded and experienced now (OTOH, I am less picky about other things as I get older, especially women who are much younger than I am). And too often mature adults are busy chasing their youth. That is a problem there for some people. Also note that we feel better when we are younger, we had more energy, and we could take in more things. Not to mention we looked better. I think too many mongers ignore the impact of their appearance on the working girls. As your appearance goes downhill, the chances of a GFE with a younger woman decline, regardless of how much you pay them.

Common sense should tell us we can't expect to repeat the same experiences. We need to move on, and try new experiences. Just because we had a good experience in one brothel during one vacation, doesn't mean we can expect that experience to be repeated every time we show up. I recently visited Berlin and had two encounters with freelancers in their own apartments (feel free to check out my trip reports). Both were excellent service providers and I paid less than 100 Euros for the hour I spent with them. I've love to try that again with both of them. However, something inside tells me I need to try some other girls. I might have just caught those girls on a good day. But, they could be ineffectual on the next visit. Their enthusiasm for their job might have waned. Luck and chance are always going to play into the situation. If you don't go back you won't be disappointed by the next visit.

And of course, I do think what you get out of anything, including mongering, is what you put into it. It has come to my attention that working girls around the globe don't like drunk patrons, unless they are out to take advantage of them. When I read about guys getting plastered in the clubs and then trying to engage the women, I can't visualize an optimum sexual encounter. And I am completely with you guys who say they don't drink alcohol in the clubs.

Okay, I've said my piece. So, Mr. Syzgies, in your opinion, is there any reason why a first time visitor / monger to the LOS can't have an awesome time on a reasonable budget?

[QUOTE=Eszpresszo;1836816]Okay, I've said my piece. So, Mr. Syzgies, in your opinion, is there any reason why a first time visitor / monger to the LOS can't have an awesome time on a reasonable budget?[/QUOTE]I'll jump in here and offer unsolicited opinion.

Of course a first-timer can have a great time. Obviously you have no basis for comparison, so it has every chance of being great. A reasonable budget is very subjective, so you may or may not receive value for money.

The issue that most of us old-timers have, when you boil it down, is that there is no longer an attitude of sanuk. That's the undefinable quality of "fun" that the Thais used to be famous for. You went to your favorite bar and the girls wanted to have fun. Yes, they were there to make money, but it tended to take a back seat to fun. The girl could have fun, and still get paid. Some of my best memories are of the times when there was a bit of chemistry between me and a lady, we went long-time and hit local clubs, local eateries, discos, whatever, and had a great time all night and into the next day. That's much harder to do these days.

The attitudes today (and I'm speaking generally, as individual exceptions exist) tend to be far more mercenary. Long-time is quickly becoming a thing of the past. Short-time has degenerated into 30 minutes in extreme cases. Basically, much of the sanuk is gone and I think that's what most guys miss the most. Yes, we all become more jaded. But, objectively, the attitudes of the girls are not the same.

Of course the clientele has changed, too. Hordes of package tourists, with lists of thing to do and places to see, busily checking each off the list and moving on to the next, have replaced the "traveler" who had a few weeks, or more, in-country and no fixed agenda. Short-time tourists tend to breed short-time girls, if you follow my meaning.

But, yes, as a first-timer you can have a blast. Especially if your reason for going isn't solely to screw as many girls as possible. It's a fascinating country and offers a lot more than simply girly bars.

One must consider the cost, too. By reading these boards you'll see that a short-time encounter with a go-go girl will probably set you back around $100 USD when you factor in a couple of drinks, a bar fine, etc. , etc. And that encounter may be about an hour, maybe less, maybe a bit more. YMMV. Factor in the cost of airfare and the time involved. If your reason for going is to screw, you may have better alternatives, depending on where you live. If you're going there to travel around, take in the culture, and have a bit of fun on the side, well, IMHO, SEA in general, and Thailand in particular, is hard to beat.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1836634]I have heard from staff that him and his friends were not necessarily well liked. I wonder if such an accident was the true story, without having any knowledge? Don't believe everything in the media too easily. I should ask my ex dollhouse girl for her thoughts.

I hear rumours that many cases that police right off as accidents or suicides, can actually be murders. There is the Pattaya Flying Club of Farangs going off tall buildings to their deaths not being uncommon.[/QUOTE]On the other hand, don't cry "malice" what can easily be explained by stupidity.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1836861]On the other hand, don't cry "malice" what can easily be explained by stupidity.[/QUOTE]I don't claim anything.

Could be an accident. Its just that many guys going off buildings are not accidents or suicides. I just keep an open mind to possibilities. Open and shut case maybe.

Espresszo,

I don't mean to be overly negative. Indeed most of my reports are about having a good time. I do find girls to have fun with.

It obviously costs more than the old days.

The ISG can guide you in things to try where a good time is likely. When I first arrived I had no ISG to guide me. I did have a buddy that knew a few places.

The bar scene is more difficult in that there are a lot less bars that interest me. However a newbie might find some more interesting.

In the old days we always took a bar girl for the whole night and sometimes was hard to get rid of her. In the modern day its more likely to take a girl for a short time but long time may be possible.

I really can't remember was percentage of mistake girls I had in the old days. Probably lower.

I still have a good time because I know where to go that suits me. I don't have to have a girl every single day anymore and rarely have two on same day any more.

Its not really more difficult to afford because my earnings per year is better and the exchange rate is also better.

Having a Thai GF is more expensive if she is not self supporting.

If tou are not an experienced monger, can still be a wonderland.

Read ISG posts regularly and try to learn from. Bear in mind that posters attitudes vary a lot.

I moan about the increasing numbers if nose jobs but many guys just don"t care about trivial mattters like that.

[QUOTE=Eszpresszo;1836816]And as you mention, age is a factor. We were easier to please in some matters when were younger. We are more jaded and experienced now (OTOH, I am less picky about other things as I get older, especially women who are much younger than I am). And too often mature adults are busy chasing their youth. That is a problem there for some people. Also note that we feel better when we are younger, we had more energy, and we could take in more things. Not to mention we looked better. I think too many mongers ignore the impact of their appearance on the working girls. As your appearance goes downhill, the chances of a GFE with a younger woman decline, regardless of how much you pay them.[/QUOTE]As Syz will attest the opposite is true for many of us. I have become way more picky as I have aged. I have to find the "right duck" these days. Of course living here changes your perspective. Living here for 16 years really changes your perspective. One of the reasons I chose to move here in the late 90's was seeing all the 60 plus dudes with really hot 20 something gals. Now you really don't see that. You see the 60 plus crowd with 40 plus women. It has really changed.

[QUOTE=Phordphan;1836839]I'll jump in here and offer unsolicited opinion.

Of course a first-timer can have a great time. Obviously you have no basis for comparison, so it has every chance of being great. A reasonable budget is very subjective, so you may or may not receive value for money.

The issue that most of us old-timers have, when you boil it down, is that there is no longer an attitude of sanuk. That's the undefinable quality of "fun" that the Thais used to be famous for. You went to your favorite bar and the girls wanted to have fun. Yes, they were there to make money, but it tended to take a back seat to fun. The girl could have fun, and still get paid. Some of my best memories are of the times when there was a bit of chemistry between me and a lady, we went long-time and hit local clubs, local eateries, discos, whatever, and had a great time all night and into the next day. That's much harder to do these days.

The attitudes today (and I'm speaking generally, as individual exceptions exist) tend to be far more mercenary. Long-time is quickly becoming a thing of the past. Short-time has degenerated into 30 minutes in extreme cases. Basically, much of the sanuk is gone and I think that's what most guys miss the most. Yes, we all become more jaded. But, objectively, the attitudes of the girls are not the same.

Of course the clientele has changed, too. Hordes of package tourists, with lists of thing to do and places to see, busily checking each off the list and moving on to the next, have replaced the "traveler" who had a few weeks, or more, in-country and no fixed agenda. Short-time tourists tend to breed short-time girls, if you follow my meaning.

But, yes, as a first-timer you can have a blast. Especially if your reason for going isn't solely to screw as many girls as possible. It's a fascinating country and offers a lot more than simply girly bars.

One must consider the cost, too. By reading these boards you'll see that a short-time encounter with a go-go girl will probably set you back around $100 USD when you factor in a couple of drinks, a bar fine, etc. , etc. And that encounter may be about an hour, maybe less, maybe a bit more. YMMV. Factor in the cost of airfare and the time involved. If your reason for going is to screw, you may have better alternatives, depending on where you live. If you're going there to travel around, take in the culture, and have a bit of fun on the side, well, IMHO, SEA in general, and Thailand in particular, is hard to beat.[/QUOTE]Phordphan sums it up very nicely. One thing I did not think about was the duration of most folk's visits. When I first moved here most mongers would be in for a month or so. Very few short trips. Of course economies were different then. And yes, the "fun" factor is way less. Every venue was a party every night. From Cowboy, to Nana, to Thermae, to Nana Disco. All the gal were drinking and looking for money and a good time. We all talk about the disappearing fun factor.

As a first time visitor you will have a good time.

[QUOTE=Phordphan;1836839] Some of my best memories are of the times when there was a bit of chemistry between me and a lady, we went long-time and hit local clubs, local eateries, discos, whatever, and had a great time all night and into the next day. That's much harder to do these days.[/QUOTE]All my LT with gogo girls followed a similar pattern. I thought this was the norm. My girls would leave around 3 or 4 pm the next day to get ready for work. If not, what is the norm for LT with no chemistry?

[QUOTE=Phordphan;1836839]I'll jump in here and offer unsolicited opinion.

Of course a first-timer can have a great time. Obviously you have no basis for comparison, so it has every chance of being great. .[/QUOTE]All very well said.

Girls in the past had nothing else to do than build the chemistry with the customer and all have a good time. Vand make money.

Now the customer is a break during the smartphone usage.

Once customers could be found mainly through the bars.

Now social media, websites, chatting apps, do the marketing. Sophisticated make up, cosmetic surgeries do the rest, together with intense use of Photoshop.

Once the customer enjoyed the hunt after months spent at home dreaming of the dream holiday: exotic country, sandy beaches, warm temperature, the feeling of a sex paradise.

Now they prepare the trip like a marketing campaign to search for new products. Winter is spent with strategies, checks on Internet, Q&A on the web.

[QUOTE=Zeus9;1836751]I was wondering which section would be best for me to post some info about Nonthaburi, Muang Thong Thani, Chaeng Wattana, Pakkred, Laksi, and more. There is the other areas thread, even though these spots are still in the Bangkok metro area. There's also general reports.[/QUOTE]I would not use General Reports Thread. That is more for things pertaining to the whole of Thailand (or the world), and may well be on non-sexual topics.

It would indeed be good to have a Bangkok Outskirts Thread as Nonthaburi is officially a separate province. Laksi, Chaeng Wattana, and Don Meuang are part of Bangkok, but there is no need to be to technical about the province boundaries.

Could use the Bangkok Thread but would mean specialised reports would get mixed in the whole lot of other guff. Bangkok already fills up with reports that are not really Bangkok and not even related to mongering.

Would be good to hear about Soapy massage of the north like "Ocean" is it? somewhere near the road to Nonthaburi.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;1836926]All my LT with gogo girls followed a similar pattern. I thought this was the norm. My girls would leave around 3 or 4 pm the next day to get ready for work. If not, what is the norm for LT with no chemistry?[/QUOTE]Many girls have commitments, like a child for example, so have to leave early like 6 AM to beat the traffic. Also some of them want to leave in order to get some decent sleep. Some girls claim they don't sleep at all well in a strange bed. Some are used to sleeping only in the daytime. They may have things to do in their own personal life. Always important to know what time a girl absolutely must leave.

Having to leave early is not always about an absence of chemistry, but could be. I think 6 to 8 hours is the most normal type of LT, but I prefer girls who will stay to breakfast at least. I see little point in a LT with a girl if there is no sex session in the morning.

[QUOTE=Phordphan;1836839]
The issue that most of us old-timers have, when you boil it down, is that there is no longer an attitude of sanuk. That's the undefinable quality of "fun" that the Thais used to be famous for. You went to your favorite bar and the girls wanted to have fun. Yes, they were there to make money, but it tended to take a back seat to fun. The girl could have fun, and still get paid. Some of my best memories are of the times when there was a bit of chemistry between me and a lady, we went long-time and hit local clubs, local eateries, discos, whatever, and had a great time all night and into the next day. That's much harder to do these days.

The attitudes today (and I'm speaking generally, as individual exceptions exist) tend to be far more mercenary. [/QUOTE]I don't think Thai girls have forgotten how to have fun if the customer makes it fun.

However girls maybe a bit less wild (if not on drugs and sober). Still girls get very drunk, but I prefer girls to be a most a little tipsy. Soi 23 next to Cowboy at 3 am is a horror zone with many girls so drunk they can hardly stand. Bad for their health to be like this repeatedly. All the Thai boy pimps waiting around with motorcycle to pick up their girl. I guess these girls don't do LT generally. I hate to see this stuff.

As times have gone by, I detect an increase is the selfishness streak of people. That is a major cause of degradation in the fun. Everyone wants to get so much but give so little. It works both ways for the girls and the customers. The "up to you" type of girls of the past are fading away. They want far more. It is not quite the same buyers' market of yester-year. I do recall part time freelancer girls in the Thermae 24 years ago giving many potential customers the knock back, presumably looking for the guy they would be happy to be with (or maybe the right money too - I forget). I did not get rejected at that time, but I doubt I was at all handsome, so something else must have been working. I did have a little bit of Thai and was nice to them so that may have helped.

The Thai concept of "Greng Jai" (opposite of selfishness or imposition) is fading away. They know the word well but do not feel or practice it. Farangs have no such word but only may have the feeling, depending on the guy.

It's hard to avoid living in the past just a little. Just one year ago I had a P4P girl that I was really heavily hooked on. She gave me extra special service and was like a 2nd GF. She has retired now. We are still in touch, but she is not available now. Impossible to replace, so everything else in P4P seems a bit mediocre.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1837009]Many girls have commitments, like a child for example, so have to leave early like 6 AM to beat the traffic. Also some of them want to leave in order to get some decent sleep. Some girls claim they don't sleep at all well in a strange bed. Some are used to sleeping only in the daytime. They may have things to do in their own personal life. Always important to know what time a girl absolutely must leave.

Having to leave early is not always about an absence of chemistry, but could be. I think 6 to 8 hours is the most normal type of LT, but I prefer girls who will stay to breakfast at least. I see little point in a LT with a girl if there is no sex session in the morning.[/QUOTE]I always offer them a breakfast option, but few take it. I'm already happy if they have a "sausage and protein shake" breakfast in the morning. ;)

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;1836926]All my LT with gogo girls followed a similar pattern. I thought this was the norm. My girls would leave around 3 or 4 pm the next day to get ready for work. If not, what is the norm for LT with no chemistry?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1837009]Many girls have commitments, like a child for example, so have to leave early like 6 AM to beat the traffic. Also some of them want to leave in order to get some decent sleep. Some girls claim they don't sleep at all well in a strange bed. Some are used to sleeping only in the daytime. They may have things to do in their own personal life. Always important to know what time a girl absolutely must leave.

Having to leave early is not always about an absence of chemistry, but could be. I think 6 to 8 hours is the most normal type of LT, but I prefer girls who will stay to breakfast at least. I see little point in a LT with a girl if there is no sex session in the morning.[/QUOTE]Early in my mongering career I used to think that a girl leaving early (8 am - 10 am, never before that and never without morning sex) was simply because there was little chemistry. But back in the day I had little patience to hear out the girl's stories. But as time passed by I think I have become more empathetic to the girls and their conditions. Some have even told me they could not sleep all night because of my snoring but they never left without morning sex and a big smile.

I make it a part of the interview process to determine what time a girl will leave. And I make it clear that time is money and money is time. You stay less I pay less. Simple.

Personally I like my girls to stay till lunch time and not beyond that unless I have decided to keep her for a few days in a row. Invariably, after lunch I like a nice foot massage, a sound nap and then a ST hop in the sack with a new girl.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1836869]Espresszo,

I don't mean to be overly negative. [/QUOTE]Oh, but you weren't Syzgies. And I am sorry for not being more clear. I latched onto your comment "I do think that the level of change is often exaggerated" because you hinted at the negative or jaded perspective of some posts. I was asking a purely rhetorical question when I said "is there any reason why a first time visitor / monger to the LOS can't have an awesome time on a reasonable budget?" Again I apologize to everyone else for not being more clear. I just wanted to sort out the reality from what some posters seem to perceive as a negative.

I am pretty confident I can have a great time in the LOS, with the right attitude, reasonable expectations, and common sense. I just wanted to chime in on how some mongers' perspectives don't paint an accurate picture of the situation for the rest of us. And by no means is it restricted to this forum. I found another site that focused on Pattaya, and the forum them was populated by people complaining about how it wasn't what it used to be. They complained about the popularity of the place, without realizing how they were contributing to the situation, as if their participation didn't matter. It was kind of silly, I thought.

I will go off-topic briefly (at least as far as Thailand goes) and refer to an area I do have experience in. If you check out the Germany forums, you can read people complaining about the FKK clubs, and how they aren't what some mongers think they can be. Heck, when I first really visited Germany, as a student doing a semester abroad, there was no such thing as an FKK or any kind of public sex club. It was at the beginning of 1980. In my quiet University town, there was an secluded alcove of maybe three or four houses, where the WG would sit in the window (though there was usually only one sitting in her window at any give time). That's what you had to choose from then. Go down to Stuttgart and there was a good Laufhaus that a Croatian friend of mine liked an awful lot (he was a monger at a young age). Up in Frankfurt, there was sort of a red light district across the river in Sachsenhausen. Mature women working on the street, while more upscale girls would cruise the streets in a sedan, pick up the customer and drive to a secluded spot for a quickie in the car. The girls were pretty much German then. Hamburg always had the Davidwachte and the Reeperbahn. But that was Hamburg. In Bavaria, prostitution was illegal. The working girls were pretty much German girls, and of course, the prettiest German girls are not going to be involved in open prostitution. Nowadays, the town I lived supposedly has a decent FKK and once hosted a notorious all-inclusive club. Sex clubs are all over Germany now, and there is a huge choice of women of different nationalities or races to choose from. Some hookers openly work the rest stops on the autobahn and advertise when and where they will be on their website. Yet for all this variety and free market competitiveness, mongers complain. They complain about the predominance of Romanian girls or the lack of German girls (truth is, the Romanians are better looking than the German working girls. You think the prettiest Germans will work in an FKK?)

Its all a lot of complaining from people who have unrealistic expectations. People who have no concept of what it REALLY used to be like in Germany. And this is my point. A lot of negative posting comes from unrealistic expectations, because they have the wrong attitude or they expect things to always be how they want them to be (which never really happens in real life.) And that doesn't help people who are new to the scene. What some monger thinks how things should work, won't always jibe with what the newcomer to the scene can experience.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1837019]It's hard to avoid living in the past just a little. Just one year ago I had a P4P girl that I was really heavily hooked on. She gave me extra special service and was like a 2nd GF. She has retired now. We are still in touch, but she is not available now. Impossible to replace, so everything else in P4P seems a bit mediocre.[/QUOTE]Amen. My two regulars are gone and I have not been able to find replacements. One I had about once every month to six weeks for 5 years and the other once a month or so for 3 years. Both just "did it" for me for some reason. But, got to keep looking.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1837019]

The Thai concept of "Greng Jai" (opposite of selfishness or imposition) is fading away. They know the word well but do not feel or practice it. Farangs have no such word but only may have the feeling, depending on the guy.
[/QUOTE]The word in English would be "considerate" or "unimposing". These two translations work in 99.9% of cases. I don't know where this notion of เกรงใจ being untranslatable came from. Silly rabbits.

I'm a non-alcohol drinker. I'll be hitting BKK / Pattaya this April for a week & it's my first time.

Correct me if I'm wrong, I assume soft drinks are available in all Beer / A Go Go Bars and considered as normal drink. It might be a real noob question, but I want to make sure that they consider even soft drinks as normal drinks & don't ask to buy alcoholic drinks. To be actual, I even don't take soft drinks like coke in any day due to it's high calorie content, which imbalances my gym diet plan. Now this is being said I'd also like to ask "Would it be okay if I don't buy any drink for me (except mineral water & Lady drinks) in any Club" ?

Any advice from senior & experience folks would be most welcome.

[QUOTE=MusicalToM;1837281]I'm a non-alcohol drinker. I'll be hitting BKK / Pattaya this April for a week & it's my first time.

Correct me if I'm wrong, I assume soft drinks are available in all Beer / A Go Go Bars and considered as normal drink. It might be a real noob question, but I want to make sure that they consider even soft drinks as normal drinks & don't ask to buy alcoholic drinks. To be actual, I even don't take soft drinks like coke in any day due to it's high calorie content, which imbalances my gym diet plan. Now this is being said I'd also like to ask "Would it be okay if I don't buy any drink for me (except mineral water & Lady drinks) in any Club" ?

Any advice from senior & experience folks would be most welcome.[/QUOTE]To be a little but up market you may order manao soda. Anywhere in Asia you will get a can of Schweppes Soda with a slice of lemon and ice cubes. In Thailand you will get a bottle of lcal sparkling water. Still very drinkable if you get used to it, and accepted in any bar everywhere. No worries.

[QUOTE=MusicalToM;1837281]I'm a non-alcohol drinker. I'll be hitting BKK / Pattaya this April for a week & it's my first time.

Correct me if I'm wrong, I assume soft drinks are available in all Beer / A Go Go Bars and considered as normal drink. It might be a real noob question, but I want to make sure that they consider even soft drinks as normal drinks & don't ask to buy alcoholic drinks. To be actual, I even don't take soft drinks like coke in any day due to it's high calorie content, which imbalances my gym diet plan. Now this is being said I'd also like to ask "Would it be okay if I don't buy any drink for me (except mineral water & Lady drinks) in any Club" ?

Any advice from senior & experience folks would be most welcome.[/QUOTE]Any venue where buying at least one drink for yourself is expected in order to have a seat and enjoy the view or entertainment will consider a Coke, Coke Zero, Coke Light, bottled water, ice tea, ice coffee, fruit juice or anything of the kind to qualify as that drink. That includes go-go bars, beer bars, freelancer bars, whatever. I am not aware of any exceptions to that observation and experience, but maybe someone else knows of one.

[QUOTE=MusicalToM;1837281]I'm a non-alcohol drinker. I'll be hitting BKK / Pattaya this April for a week & it's my first time.

Correct me if I'm wrong, I assume soft drinks are available in all Beer / A Go Go Bars and considered as normal drink. It might be a real noob question, but I want to make sure that they consider even soft drinks as normal drinks & don't ask to buy alcoholic drinks. To be actual, I even don't take soft drinks like coke in any day due to it's high calorie content, which imbalances my gym diet plan. Now this is being said I'd also like to ask "Would it be okay if I don't buy any drink for me (except mineral water & Lady drinks) in any Club" ?

Any advice from senior & experience folks would be most welcome.[/QUOTE]I am also mostly a non-alcoholic drinker and trying to avoid sugar. In bars I order Soda, Coke Light, Tomato juice, Pineapple juice, or mineral water. Not a problem. You probably have to buy at least one drink to be entitled to watch the entertainment (if any) and justify your seat.

Once you are buying drinks for ladies, a drink order need not include one for yourself. I would suggest to you not to finish a drink or even be close to finished, as will cause waitresses to start bugging for your next drink. Keep watch of your drink to avoid stupid waitresses thinking it is nearly finished and taking it away.

[QUOTE=Ixgzca;1837254]The word in English would be "considerate" or "unimposing". These two translations work in 99.9% of cases. I don't know where this notion of เกรงใจ being untranslatable came from. Silly rabbits.[/QUOTE]Unimposing is an okay Translation or better still "not wishing to impose". Considerate is a bit too vague with multiple meanings, IMHO.

Anyway "Unimposing" does not really come up in Farang conversation, so much. Sounds clumsy. It is more that westerners do not speak the word, rather than being untranslatable. If a word is rarely used, then a person may not be able to think of it as well.

When "grengjai" is used as a verb in Thai, we can't really say unimpose in English. I don't think such a negated verb exists. So in English a several word expression is needed.

Many Thais speak about "grengjai" but do not feel it. Westerners feel "grengjai" but do not say so.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1837239]Amen. My two regulars are gone and I have not been able to find replacements. One I had about once every month to six weeks for 5 years and the other once a month or so for 3 years. Both just "did it" for me for some reason. But, got to keep looking.[/QUOTE]I was far more hooked than that. I was seeing her privately as often as possible, sometimes 3 times per week, and including a multi day holiday. I wished I had met her years earlier when she was young, so that by last year, I could have been a bit bored by her already, or failing that, have got married. LOL Anyway clearly she had multiple suitors and both of us already had "official" GF / BFs. Eventually some younger handsome very rich guy got her, but I am sure she took time and chose very carefully, and got better than me.

I wasn't keen on her silicones, the one defect, but she had them removed for a big improvement, with Bcups remaining. Expensive but very expert job.

I can find girls as good looking, but the playful sexy character and overall package cannot be replaced easily. Sometimes, but very rarely, we find something that is just too good, and blows all the competition away.

My usual Crazy House visit thoughts.

Recent visit saw all my regular or prospective girls missing Donut, Ging, Oom, Noi, Naen, and Jane (last two yet to be tried). I realised that girls are in 3 groups: Yellow badge are the little girls who have good bodies and dance downstairs. Red badge are tall models who dance downstairs. Green badge are the older or fatter girls who dance upstairs when place gets too busy downstairs.

Virtually all my girls are red badge. Last night I noticed quite a few yellow badge girls with excellent bodies, number 5, 13, 99 (or 66), 130, 140, 145. Yet not one was really my spec. The body was just fine (excellent). Each girl dipped out slightly from the face (I am very fussy), in some cases due to nose jobs. 140 had a good enough face almost, but chemistry wasn't there. She came on a bit too strong, and I felt her character was a little false. Wanted to play handies with me in a rather childish manner (weird). I got bored with her very quickly. Maybe she did not want her tits touched so did not find out how good her tits were, wearing a bra.

The stand out looker for me was red badge 36. Light skin, great body and importantly really great face. By the time I spotted her, she had been called by another customer. I guess I will meet her another day.

One customer near to me was groping a girl's pussy. This is possible with some of the very raunchy girls but many girls either do not allow or are not happy about it. The raunchy girl goes with it because her body is too straight from waist to thigh and her face is puffy swollen ugly for me. She has to be wild to get customers. Other guys don't seem to notice her lack of beauty as are very pussy focussed. LOL She is popular despite being a very ugly girl to my taste.

My favorite waitress was also missing. I was asked to sign each drink bill slip so as to avoid any misunderstandings with the bill. I did order a drink for Som number 140. As with many girls, they try to get 2 drinks at a time, like Tequila coke. I don't fall for it. When waitress arrives I point at the girl, and then raise one finger to indicate one drink for the girl. Girl can decide if it is coke or tequila or whatever. Makes little difference.

At one time a passing girl tried to just sit on my lap. I closed my knees together to stop her, and the waitress ticked her off. Telling her that I am known and I don't take any girls that just show up, but rather choose for myself carefully, sometimes after long delay. Number 140 got called, but as the chemistry was not there, I lost interest in her very quickly. Would have replaced her with red 36, if she was available, a very superior looking girl with interesting braided hairstyle. Don't know yet whether I would have BFed her, but a good chance being so good looking. Number 36 eventually left her customer but I am not sure where she went. Could not see her. Could have used my normal waitress to find out. Possibly she went to the toilet. This can take time as there maybe a queue of girls waiting and some are too shy to use the men's toilets. The customer of 36 seemed to moved to now groping the highly tattooed (full ass tattoos) and highly pierced girl, one of the most ugly girls for me, saggy tits and big "masculine" jaw. She reminds me of a Ladyboy. Not very feminine at all, but raunchy.

My total bill was 2 drinks for myself and one for girl. I did not get scammed. I managed to avoid it as is usually the case. Said Hello, to the mamasan that I like, chubby Paeng. Seems nice to me. Not to sure about any of the other ones, although I know the longer term one Par (Phaa) a little. I moved on to somewhere else.

Summary is, a huge number of girls with outstanding natural bodies. A good view of plenty of bare tits, ass, and pussy. Just a very small number with outstanding natural face to my picky taste. Another day, most of my regulars might be there.

One customer sitting near me at the start was weird. He sat on a bench sofa. One and a half free spaces to his right and one and a half free spaces to his left. He was right in the middle of a space big enough for 4. Two Asian men were looking for space to sit, so waitress asked the Farang to move slightly either to the left or to the right, so that 2 Asian guys could sit together. He refused to co-operate. That is what you call a Royal Asshole, in my opinion. Later he was in the toilet same time as me and skipped washing his hands. No wonder many girls don't want their pussy groped. Can't tell easily if a guy is clean, gentle and well behaved. I wonder if he reads the ISG.

[QUOTE=MusicalToM;1837281]I'm a non-alcohol drinker. I'll be hitting BKK / Pattaya this April for a week & it's my first time.

Correct me if I'm wrong, I assume soft drinks are available in all Beer / A Go Go Bars and considered as normal drink. It might be a real noob question, but I want to make sure that they consider even soft drinks as normal drinks & don't ask to buy alcoholic drinks. To be actual, I even don't take soft drinks like coke in any day due to it's high calorie content, which imbalances my gym diet plan. Now this is being said I'd also like to ask "Would it be okay if I don't buy any drink for me (except mineral water & Lady drinks) in any Club" ?

Any advice from senior & experience folks would be most welcome.[/QUOTE]A drink is a drink and I have noticed that during "happy hour" only beers are discounted with soft drinks sold at their usual price. So the soft drinks are sometimes even more expensive than alcohol.

Many times I saw the girls express happiness when I ordered a soft drink as then they could have a soft drink for their LD as well. Only one looked at me suspiciously and asked if I was a Muslim.

30 Nov 2015 (Crazy House):

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1807587]My buddy Noi spotted me and came over and asked would I like her friend to come over. Normally I am not into girls dragging a friend along, however today was different. Her friend was stunning, and just a 2 second glance told me she was the best looker in the shop. Why not meet her at least?

Name turned out to be Paeng meaning "powder" (not Phaeng meaning "expensive" - pronounced differently). Was appropriate, she was delicate and white skin. Tall, maybe 167 cm, slim, good waist to thigh ratio, slim thighs, high curvy taunt ass, only Acups but they were very beautiful to look at and touch. Braces on teeth and aged just 21. Long straight black hair which she tied up at some point later on. Small face and very cute slightly upturned nose. Everything natural except for the teeth straightening apparatus. Did not intend to BF any girl originally, but Paeng jiggled around on my lap for a bit and got me starting to feel rather horny, even though she is new and quite shy.

Took her for short time. ......Blah Blah ......

Don't really have a clue what her number is but I described her pretty well. She doesn't yet have confidence to dance naked but believe me there are absolutely no body faults being hidden. Seems to be a good friend of Noi (very white skin) number 78, who does dance nude these days. Paeng has studies so doesn't work everyday. [/QUOTE]Turned out this year that this girl uses working name Donut and is number 83. Wears quite high heels and so looks very tall indeed now. She does dance naked this year too. Immaculate curvy but slim hot model type. Can't wait to do her again (only two times to date). Failing that I could try number 36.

Someone mentioned number 60 the other day. I have being keeping a casual eye out for number 60, but have not yet seen her. Could be away for a few days or longer period. If she has a green number and upstairs, the chance of spotting her is less.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1837453]
Many times I saw the girls express happiness when I ordered a soft drink as then they could have a soft drink for their LD as well. Only one looked at me suspiciously and asked if I was a Muslim.[/QUOTE]I don't quite understand. How does lady drink have any relevance to the drink you ordered for yourself? Normally I am drinking soda and lady takes tequila, or soft depending on her preference. Usually if I take Tequilla, the lady does also, but there exist teetotaller ladies who never ever drink alcohol, so even I take tequila, she can drink soft. For ladies becoming drunk, it is better if they stop the alcohol too.

If a muslim was secretly in Crazy House, the chances are he would drink alcohol too. Muslims have to behave when they are at home. LOL Elsewhere they can party like others. Just like Buddhists don't follow the 5 principles very well at all. Mai Pen Rai. I have been to parties with plenty muslims dancing and drinking and listening to sinful music/songs but at the house of a Buddhist lady, in Satun province (south of Thailand) where there are no troubles at all (except price of fuel and rubber and floods). Satun, Songkhla and Hat Yai muslims are scared to go to Pattani, Yala, Narathiwat just like any one else is scared to go there. One muslim lady at the party told me how she had two boyfriends. Shock horror. The Bangkok BF did not know about the Pattani Policeman BF. The Buddhist lady was one I met in Thermae Massage 24 years ago, so is now a bit too old for me. LOL

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1837420]
When "grengjai" is used as a verb in Thai, we can't really say unimpose in English. I don't think such a negated verb exists. So in English a several word expression is needed. [/QUOTE] No, we would say something like " I didn't want to impose" in that case. But I can think of several uses of "greng jai" where considerate would be the direct translation and many more cases where inconsiderate or imposing would be the direct tranlslation "ไม่กรงใจ", especially when describing another person. It's easily translated as long as the person translating is aware of the context. English is another language where the meaning of words can change slightly or drastically depending on the context. This doesn't mean the words are untranslatable though.

[QUOTE=Ixgzca;1837461]No, we would say something like " I didn't want to impose" in that case. But I can think of several uses of "greng jai" where considerate would be the direct translation and many more cases where inconsiderate or imposing would be the direct tranlslation "ไม่กรงใจ", especially when describing another person. It's easily translated as long as the person translating is aware of the context. English is another language where the meaning of words can change slightly or drastically depending on the context. This doesn't mean the words are untranslatable though.[/QUOTE]Yes fine. We are on same wavelength.

Being very technical, as a language student, "Considerate" often means, depending on context:

"jai dee" (good hearted).

"ao jai sai" (considering the wishes or desires of another).

Variations of meaning rather different to "grengjai". That is the only reason I don't like "Considerate" as a translation, without showing a context.

In general dictionaries that translate a single Thai word to a single English word, or visa versa, are quite useless. A phrase or sentence is often / usually needed to explain the meaning clearly. This is simply due to words having multiple meanings in one of the languages. The only really good English to Thai dictionary / phrasebook, I could find in my early days, was Robertson's dictionary phrase book with a yellow paper sleave cover, because it explained meaning well and showed usage for a Western person. That was before I could read Thai script. It may be still possible to get it, but not easy. I believe the update of it was taken over by the Goldings couple Mike and Benjawan. For phone or computer App I recommend Thai-English English-Thai Talking Dictionary (Paiboon). I used to use that a lot on my old iphone, but have other free dictionaries now, suited to advanced use only (Intended for Thai people - meanings can be in Thai script).

The funny one is the Thai word "maa" (flat tone) meaning to "come" to the place where the speaker is located. When a guy wants to ask the girl, did she come (cum or orgasm), he cannot use the Thai word "maa", yet Thai word "maa" also can mean dog, horse, or chinese mother, depending on if rising, high, or falling tones. Met one bargirl called "Maa" at Suzi Wong 2 or 3 years ago I guess. Important to get the right tone. LOL Obviously was not Maa (dog).

Other Thai words have multiple meanings without any tone change as well. "Chaa" (flat tone) means either tea (to drink) or numb. Exact same spelling.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1837416]I am also mostly a non-alcoholic drinker and trying to avoid sugar. In bars I order Soda, Coke Light, Tomato juice, Pineapple juice, or mineral water. Not a problem. You probably have to buy at least one drink to be entitled to watch the entertainment (if any) and justify your seat.[/QUOTE]Despite the fact that it does contain sugar, which I also try to avoid as much as possible, I would pay 200 baht for a non-alcoholic beer like O'Doul's or even Sharp's if the go-go bars and beer bars would import and stock it. Sometimes I get a bit sick of sweet drinks like sodas (even artificially sweetened) and fruit juice and long for the taste of beer as an alternative with pizza, burgers, spicy Thai food, et al or to just sip from when viewing the passing parade. But I really don't like the short term or long term effects of drinking a regular beer, especially when the pattern is usually not just one beer at one go-go bar for the whole night but more than one beer at several go-go bars. So a non-alcoholic beer would do the trick. However, I assume the idea of selling a beer that does not get someone buzzed or drunk enough to make more foolish choices than usual is out of the question in Thailand.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1837482]Despite the fact that it does contain sugar, which I also try to avoid as much as possible, I would pay 200 baht for a non-alcoholic beer like O'Doul's or even Sharp's if the go-go bars and beer bars would import and stock it. Sometimes I get a bit sick of sweet drinks like sodas (even artificially sweetened) and fruit juice and long for the taste of beer as an alternative with pizza, burgers, spicy Thai food, et al or to just sip from when viewing the passing parade. But I really don't like the short term or long term effects of drinking a regular beer, especially when the pattern is usually not just one beer at one go-go bar for the whole night but more than one beer at several go-go bars. So a non-alcoholic beer would do the trick. However, I assume the idea of selling a beer that does not get someone buzzed or drunk enough to make more foolish choices than usual is out of the question in Thailand.[/QUOTE]Ha ha. Sugar, if overdone, is one of the worlds most insidious poisons, and a major cause of bad health (forget low fat diets) in addition to being rather fattening, I believe. Extreme moderation called for.

Yes non-alcoholic beer seems foolish to many, just like can be hard to get a good decaffeinated coffee. My local pub doesn't have it. Thai oriented coffee shops do not have it, despite the fact they will adulterate their coffees with all sorts of gimmicky things like whipped cream, caramel, sugar syrup, etc. Etc. (can't think of them all). I have to make my own night time coffee at home with a good quality 100% Arabica Decaf (I usually import to Thailand in my suitcase), which can retain a pretty excellent taste without keeping me awake all night. I happen to be semi-addicted to coffee without necessarily needing the Caffeine fix all the time. It's a bit like being semi-addicted to hot naked girls.

Since I cum with great difficulty, and alcohol only makes that worse, I drink alcohol in extreme moderation before sex fun. Drinking after sex fun is already done suits me better. I can imagine, that for guys that cum too quick, a few drinks before to numb the dick sensitivity just a little, could be a big help, rather than hindrance. Thick condoms could also help. LOL (but not for me). One Japanese buddy always drinks before mongering to help last longer.

[QUOTE=MusicalToM;1837281]I'm a non-alcohol drinker. I'll be hitting BKK / Pattaya this April for a week & it's my first time.

Correct me if I'm wrong, I assume soft drinks are available in all Beer / A Go Go Bars and considered as normal drink. It might be a real noob question, but I want to make sure that they consider even soft drinks as normal drinks & don't ask to buy alcoholic drinks. To be actual, I even don't take soft drinks like coke in any day due to it's high calorie content, which imbalances my gym diet plan. Now this is being said I'd also like to ask "Would it be okay if I don't buy any drink for me (except mineral water & Lady drinks) in any Club" ?

Any advice from senior & experience folks would be most welcome.[/QUOTE]While you will get non alcoholic drinks at all bars, you might get the odd stare or snide remark from a cheeky waitress. I got one at Pattaya in Baccara last week. I got pissed and I simply paid for the water I ordered and left. I am not tolerant about bad attitude from waitresses. But if that does not derail you, you will be fine.

P.S. - In most places just normal water is fine too.

[QUOTE=Blanquiceleste;1837543]While you will get non alcoholic drinks at all bars, you might get the odd stare or snide remark from a cheeky waitress. I got one at Pattaya in Baccara last week. I got pissed and I simply paid for the water I ordered and left. I am not tolerant about bad attitude from waitresses. But if that does not derail you, you will be fine.

P.S. - In most places just normal water is fine too.[/QUOTE]I wonder what remark makes a guy pissed so easily. I don't let the odd smartass spoil my fun.

In Thailand we should learn to be cool.

Nice to hear from you all. To be a bit technical I would like to mention that a normal Coke / Pepsi / Artificial fruit juice of 200 ML. Contains around 200-210 cals, which is same as running for 35 minutes at 6 km / HR. I consider these drinks are bad for health if you care about your good health.

I think I'll stick to mineral water or fruit juices at these places. And I believe these clubs / bars offer sugarless juices as well.

And for the Lady drink part, "What would be the best way to tell a lady that I prefer non-alcoholic drinker, meaning I don't want her to drink alcohol since it may create a bad smell / taste for me while having kisses later in the night" ? And I do understand that some soft drinks are even more expensive than beers, but that's okay with me.

At Wolvenvacht: I couldn't stop my laugh after reading this. No offense to anybody but I believe this Muslims not drinking alcohol tradition (or whatever you call it) exists only in golf countries. People living in States / UK / Europe / India & in other major countries drink alcohol irrespective of their religion.

I personally don't drink alcohol since I don't like neither it's taste nor it's smell & I believe it exposes someone fake (sometimes original) personality in front of others. It's like alcohol speaks for you but not you.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1837435]My usual Crazy House visit thoughts.

Recent visit saw all my regular or prospective girls missing Donut, Ging, Oom, Noi, Naen, and Jane (last two yet to be tried). I realised that girls are in 3 groups: Yellow badge are the little girls who have good bodies and dance downstairs. Red badge are tall models who dance downstairs. Green badge are the older or fatter girls who dance upstairs when place gets too busy downstairs.
[/QUOTE]I have never taken a girl who was dancing upstairs although I have sat up there a couple of times when there were no seats available downstairs. It seemed to me there are times when a girl has been sent up there because she is too new, too inexperienced, or isn't cutting it on the Lady Drink sales downstairs. One time when I sat up there I watched a couple of very young looking girls being "taught" how to move their asses and work the pole by the other, more experienced girls. Dancing, that is. LOL.

[QUOTE=Blanquiceleste;1837543]While you will get non alcoholic drinks at all bars, you might get the odd stare or snide remark from a cheeky waitress. I got one at Pattaya in Baccara last week. I got pissed and I simply paid for the water I ordered and left. I am not tolerant about bad attitude from waitresses. But if that does not derail you, you will be fine.

P.S. - In most places just normal water is fine too.[/QUOTE]I got the smartass remark, eye-rolling, very showy so all could see disgusted look of dismay (seriously) from a downstairs waitress and another time from an upstairs waitress at Crazy House when I ordered bottled water. And this was after I had been going there, buying plenty of Lady Drinks, and barfining several girls multiple times. I cancelled my order right there on the spot with a smile and took my good times and money with me to another bar. That was months and months ago.

Now, I never get a crossed eye or a negative reaction to my ordering water, Coke Zero or whatever I want from any waitress at Crazy House. And I suspect that might be the case with other customers now as well. I think my earlier reaction, the one they apparently wanted me to have by their idiotic behavior, did exactly what I wanted it to do. Couldn't care less how they "felt" about my reaction deep down inside as Thais and all that. All I care about is how they behave now, which is much better with me at least than they behaved before. Mission accomplished.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1837568]I wonder what remark makes a guy pissed so easily. I don't let the odd smartass spoil my fun.

In Thailand we should learn to be cool.[/QUOTE]There is no bar or venue in Thailand where ones "fun is spoiled" if they leave there and go somewhere else, usually right next door or around the corner at most.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1837455]I don't quite understand. How does lady drink have any relevance to the drink you ordered for yourself? Normally I am drinking soda and lady takes tequila, or soft depending on her preference. Usually if I take Tequilla, the lady does also, but there exist teetotaller ladies who never ever drink alcohol, so even I take tequila, she can drink soft. For ladies becoming drunk, it is better if they stop the alcohol too.
[/QUOTE]I can only guess but perhaps some punters will think they are "swindled" if the LD does not contain alcohol and cause trouble. I remember a discussion on the forum here about someone finding out that the "whisky-cola" LD he (thought he) paid for was just watered-down cola.

The Thai girls with their desire to "take care", not give offence and "save face" may feel themselves somehow obliged to follow their guest in his drinking style.

But that is just my guess. Or maybe I have the looks of an old drunkard and they are surprised that I am only old.

[QUOTE=Blanquiceleste;1837543]While you will get non alcoholic drinks at all bars, you might get the odd stare or snide remark from a cheeky waitress. I got one at Pattaya in Baccara last week. I got pissed and I simply paid for the water I ordered and left. I am not tolerant about bad attitude from waitresses. But if that does not derail you, you will be fine.

P.S. - In most places just normal water is fine too.[/QUOTE]In some cases. Non alcohol drinks are the same or more expensive than alcoholic drinks! You can order whatever you want. Is is your money and holiday! And if a waitress made a snide remark, I just chuckle and tell her I have been out for hours already drinking all day and just taking a break. Most of the time, it's actually true.

[QUOTE=MusicalToM;1837586]Nice to hear from you all. To be a bit technical I would like to mention that a normal Coke / Pepsi / Artificial fruit juice of 200 ML. Contains around 200-210 cals, which is same as running for 35 minutes at 6 km / HR. I consider these drinks are bad for health if you care about your good health.

I think I'll stick to mineral water or fruit juices at these places. And I believe these clubs / bars offer sugarless juices as well.

And for the Lady drink part, "What would be the best way to tell a lady that I prefer non-alcoholic drinker, meaning I don't want her to drink alcohol since it may create a bad smell / taste for me while having kisses later in the night" ? And I do understand that some soft drinks are even more expensive than beers, but that's okay with me.

At Wolvenvacht: I couldn't stop my laugh after reading this. No offense to anybody but I believe this Muslims not drinking alcohol tradition (or whatever you call it) exists only in golf countries. People living in States / UK / Europe / India & in other major countries drink alcohol irrespective of their religion.

I personally don't drink alcohol since I don't like neither it's taste nor it's smell & I believe it exposes someone fake (sometimes original) personality in front of others. It's like alcohol speaks for you but not you.[/QUOTE]You can't control what a lady does or does not drink. You can refuse to buy her a certain drink. Think about it. Hasn't she probably drank throughout the night already? If you are really worried about her smell, stock mouth wash in your room and have her rinse her mouth.

[QUOTE=MusicalToM;1837586]Nice to hear from you all. To be a bit technical I would like to mention that a normal Coke / Pepsi / Artificial fruit juice of 200 ML. Contains around 200-210 cals, which is same as running for 35 minutes at 6 km / HR. I consider these drinks are bad for health if you care about your good health.

I think I'll stick to mineral water or fruit juices at these places. And I believe these clubs / bars offer sugarless juices as well.

And for the Lady drink part, "What would be the best way to tell a lady that I prefer non-alcoholic drinker, meaning I don't want her to drink alcohol since it may create a bad smell / taste for me while having kisses later in the night" ? And I do understand that some soft drinks are even more expensive than beers, but that's okay with me.

I personally don't drink alcohol since I don't like neither it's taste nor it's smell & I believe it exposes someone fake (sometimes original) personality in front of others. It's like alcohol speaks for you but not you.[/QUOTE]I avoid high calorie (high sugar drinks). Sex is not going to work it off. You may think alcohol is bad for the lady, and the high calories can be too.

If the lady is drinking Tequilas, the usual alcoholic lady drink, I don't find it results in bad breath that I can tell. Sometimes the lady can have something from food on her breath. I don't like drunk ladies though. The lady has limited choices for her lady drink. A lady coke is usually watered down to decrease her sugar intake. Nothing strange about that. Whiskey Coke is not a typical lady drink at Crazy House. It may be at some bars.

A tequila for lady costs 170 Baht (at Crazy House) and she gets 60 Baht from that. Not sure if a coke / fanta is exactly the same, but Tequila and coke may have costed less than 340 Baht. I seem to recall either 320 or 330 for that. I think a waitress coke drink is 160 Baht. Not sure if commission on that is 50 or 60 Baht.

When I shout my special waitress a drink (S1 - service lady number 1), she is drinking something that looks watered down. I don't really care what it is. Probably part coke, part soda. She looks after me very special so she gets something special from me. Other staff sometimes make mistakes with calculator or put a bill in wrong holder while customer is at the toilet. My waitress does not mistakes in my experience. We now have to sign each sheet to prove it is our bill page. If you have an unsigned bill page, and do not recognise the number of the girl who drinks were bought for, you would know that a page was mistakenly put in your holder. Can happen. Not all waitresses have same levels of concentration and ability. I can recommend for anyone little waitress S1 if happen to spot her working in your area.

In my opinion alcohol exposes the real personality of people moreso than a fake personality. I never like to get a girlfriend without having seen her behavior drunk. If her drunk behavior is really bad, then I am afraid that is a personality trait that would be exposed over time anyway. Happy silly drunks are okay For me. Nasty evil drunks are not on. Run amok drunks are also not to be accepted. For a casual acquaintance like a bargirl, its better she is not drunk, however a few drinks can loosen a girl up so she is able to have fun despite normal timidness.

I never check to see if the LD's are watered down or not. My regular at Windmill can't weigh more than 45 kg. I buy her 10 tequilas for 1000 baht which is quite the deal for 30 songs of DFK and lap dances. If the tequilas weren't watered down my girl would be hammered. In reality, she doesn't even look like she had a single drink. Doesn't bother me imo the LD's are a symbol of me buying her time.

Ging 40 arrives at the bar late. She doesn't come to me immediately, has hassles to deal with. I go upstairs to the toilet. She is waiting in girl queue to pish most likely. I tell her I have guessed she has more than just me as a regular customer today. "a crash of trains" we call it in Thai. Little do I know just how many guys are wanting her to come to them. I tell her straight off, I will bar fine her if she chooses me. So she knows she can make money. She indicates one other customer did not come to her birthday but today would just like to buy her some drinks. I say no problem, I will hang around and she can still come to me after that.

I have been watching various girls dance and no other special option turns up. Eventually Ging comes to me, but indicates while she will accept my barfine of her to go for ST, she does not want to be BFed immediately. Ah Ha. I understand. I say okay I am not in a hurry. I tell her she can go entertain some other regular customers for a while and come back to me. She sits with me for one period before going off to dance. Coming off dancing another customer has grabbed her. I don't know everything that is going on, but I have given her permission to do her best to look after her best regulars and return to me later. Some customers are going to be annoyed that Ging will not go with them as she has already agreed to go with me. Despite this some guys are buying her several drinks and giving cash tips as well. I don't want to interfere with her potential to make money, and meanwhile I don't have to buy many drinks. She speaks to my waitress to pass on a message to me to wait and she will return. I am trusting her and eventually she does return. I hope she already told guys she was booked, but how can I know for sure. She was straight with me because she knows I am a good cool non jealous guy that she can trust.

Girls cannot trust all customers that are unknown to them. Ging claims that especially when she was quite new, some time back, several different guys took her for ST and then did not pay afterwards. Girls always consider its possible a new customer will dupe them, or even occasionally steal from the girl. Girls naturally prefer regular guys that they know can be trusted, and are very wary of new guys. Ging also comments that some customers are hassling the girl to go bareback since the guys will state that some other girls do it. She doesn't need that sort of shit. I am always stressing to girls the importance of ensuring they do not get pregnant under any circumstances and that just the pill is not 100% reliable. Some girls do not take the pill anyway.

Later she told me she had 7 potential customers, and some were regulars. One just flew in from overseas and wanted her badly, but he had not pre booked and she had promised me already. Also she commented he tries too hard to get her to bareback. She ended up making money from three customers (at least) for the night including from me. Because of myself being willing to wait patiently, she could make extra money. She indicated that the previous Friday, none of her regulars showed. But today several. Impossible for her to juggle them all and try to keep them all happy. I probably won out over the others, by being the most accommodating understanding guy of the lot and having a reliable track record. Other customers are not like me. If I had lost out today, too bad. Most guys did lose out, could have been me too, but I assume some were willing to buy drinks anyway even if BF was not possible.

Ging admonished me for not sending her a LINE message first to say I was attending this night. Later asked if I would come back for her tomorrow. Looks like I can get a booking if I want it. I never sent Ging a LINE message before CH starting time this occasion, because initially I was thinking about Donut (who did not show up). LOL Actually I like them both a lot.

Another hot girl Jane (Jaeng) number 4, I saw her dance for one set and then go straight to her regular customer, and shortly get her plain clothes on. She never lasts long. Just too sexy. I never got a chance to BF her yet. With some girls you have to be damn quick to have a chance and even then they may be expecting their regular customer.

Other ordinary girls are very very available. It's not an even playing field.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;1837726]I never check to see if the LD's are watered down or not. My regular at Windmill can't weigh more than 45 kg. I buy her 10 tequilas for 1000 baht which is quite the deal for 30 songs of DFK and lap dances. If the tequilas weren't watered down my girl would be hammered. In reality, she doesn't even look like she had a single drink. Doesn't bother me imo the LD's are a symbol of me buying her time.[/QUOTE]At some bars lady tequilas and customer tequilas are not at all the same. You know why obviously.

At Crazy House they are exactly the same. May not be the absolute strongest tequila on the market, but when the tequilas come, the customer can select whichever one he chooses. They are identical, unless one is slightly fuller than another.

So I would certainly not buy a girl 10 tequilas. If not BFing a girl, I may give her a small cash tip in addition to a few drinks. Some girls have ordered exclusively Tequilas, and others have mixed it up between sometimes Tequila and sometimes soft. Occasionally meet a girl who doesn't drink alcohol at all. I hate to see really drunk girls, but it happens sometimes. We don't know how many she had earlier and if had any of the Yaa Dong (strong drink) out front of bar, unless she tells the detail.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1837734]Ging 40 arrives at the bar late. She doesn't come to me immediately, has hassles to deal with. I go upstairs to the toilet. She is waiting in girl queue to pish most likely. I tell her I have guessed she has more than just me as a regular customer today. "a crash of trains" we call it in Thai. Little do I know just how many guys are wanting her to come to them. I tell her straight off, I will bar fine her if she chooses me. So she knows she can make money. She indicates one other customer did not come to her birthday but today would just like to buy her some drinks. I say no problem, I will hang around and she can still come to me after that.

I have been watching various girls dance and no other special option turns up. Eventually Ging comes to me, but indicates while she will accept my barfine of her to go for ST, she does not want to be BFed immediately. Ah Ha. I understand. I say okay I am not in a hurry. I tell her she can go entertain some other regular customers for a while and come back to me. She sits with me for one period before going off to dance. Coming off dancing another customer has grabbed her. I don't know everything that is going on, but I have given her permission to do her best to look after her best regulars and return to me later. Some customers are going to be annoyed that Ging will not go with them as she has already agreed to go with me. Despite this some guys are buying her several drinks and giving cash tips as well. I don't want to interfere with her potential to make money, and meanwhile I don't have to buy many drinks. She speaks to my waitress to pass on a message to me to wait and she will return. I am trusting her and eventually she does return. I hope she already told guys she was booked, but how can I know for sure. She was straight with me because she knows I am a good cool non jealous guy that she can trust.

Girls cannot trust all customers that are unknown to them. Ging claims that especially when she was quite new, some time back, several different guys took her for ST and then did not pay afterwards. Girls always consider its possible a new customer will dupe them, or even occasionally steal from the girl. Girls naturally prefer regular guys that they know can be trusted, and are very wary of new guys. Ging also comments that some customers are hassling the girl to go bareback since the guys will state that some other girls do it. She doesn't need that sort of shit. I am always stressing to girls the importance of ensuring they do not get pregnant under any circumstances and that just the pill is not 100% reliable. Some girls do not take the pill anyway.

Later she told me she had 7 potential customers, and some were regulars. One just flew in from overseas and wanted her badly, but he had not pre booked and she had promised me already. Also she commented he tries too hard to get her to bareback. She ended up making money from three customers (at least) for the night including from me. Because of myself being willing to wait patiently, she could make extra money. She indicated that the previous Friday, none of her regulars showed. But today several. Impossible for her to juggle them all and try to keep them all happy. I probably won out over the others, by being the most accommodating understanding guy of the lot and having a reliable track record. Other customers are not like me. If I had lost out today, too bad. Most guys did lose out, could have been me too, but I assume some were willing to buy drinks anyway even if BF was not possible.

Ging admonished me for not sending her a LINE message first to say I was attending this night. Later asked if I would come back for her tomorrow. Looks like I can get a booking if I want it. I never sent Ging a LINE message before CH starting time this occasion, because initially I was thinking about Donut (who did not show up). LOL Actually I like them both a lot.

Another hot girl Jane (Jaeng) number 4, I saw her dance for one set and then go straight to her regular customer, and shortly get her plain clothes on. She never lasts long. Just too sexy. I never got a chance to BF her yet. With some girls you have to be damn quick to have a chance and even then they may be expecting their regular customer.

Other ordinary girls are very very available. It's not an even playing field.[/QUOTE]I admire your patience. I really have no desire to get that involved in a working girls business or the politics of a GoGo bar. I would find it very tedious. The only think I really care about is how skilled they are in the sack.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1837774]I admire your patience. I really have no desire to get that involved in a working girls business or the politics of a GoGo bar. I would find it very tedious. The only think I really care about is how skilled they are in the sack.[/QUOTE]On the other hand, I am not that concerned about girl having wonderful skills. It's only an extra bonus for me, and of course rarely found with bar girls. As long as she is hot, pretty, can go with the flow, have fun, and have a reasonable GFE, that is enough for me. I take some girls with rather weak blowjobs. Not a big deal for me. Even some expert MP girls BJ technique is not right for me, being too fast or too strong.

I think some bargirls are doing extremely well on looks, sexiness, and attitude. That means they don't have to be that concerned with developing wonderful skills. May not even occur to them. For ordinary looking girls, they may need to build skills to really hook regulars, with attitude possibly not enough, I am not sure. Even in massage joints, I am still going for looks, GFE, and fun attitude, feel of the pussy, with maybe a slightly higher skills expectation.

Some special things I like, I can easily train the girl to do for me, such as ball tickling and tits brushing balls. However what are the skills that a skilled girl brings? The only ones that occur to me are: DFK (not difficult at all), soft slow body slide (unskilled girls go too fast and hard. Less sexy), soft slow BBBJ, deepthroat is added bonus, cowgirl grind movements (that should come naturally to a girl). That is about it for me. Perhaps there are plenty of skills I forget. There is the pussy squeeze of dick that I get from one favorite bargirl, but not many girls are doing that very well.

Do we say a girl is really skilled if her blowjob is superb, or is there more to it than that? Okay I recall many guys have ass rimming as a big requirement. However that is not difficult to do (I do for girls if they like it). Is it just about if girl likes to do it or not? I don't have girls sticking anything up my ass. Also I am not into massage at all. I guess I forgot handjob, but again I do not take HJ. Little interest in that. Maybe blowjob, deepthroat, and squeezing pussy are the only skills really that useful to me, but I don't assume I will get more than some sort of BJ. Very expert BJ I find quite rarely as well, and maybe my expert BJ is not the same as for other guys.

Something else that occurs to me. Some girls like to fuck in a fairly powerful manner, and I expect many guys like it. This is not really suited to me, perhaps relating to me taking a long time to cum. Obviously no one likes a starfish fuck. Orgasmic girls are more fun, but its not a skill.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1837737]At some bars lady tequilas and customer tequilas are not at all the same. You know why obviously.

At Crazy House they are exactly the same. May not be the absolute strongest tequila on the market, but when the tequilas come, the customer can select whichever one he chooses. They are identical, unless one is slightly fuller than another.

So I would certainly not buy a girl 10 tequilas. If not BFing a girl, I may give her a small cash tip in addition to a few drinks. Some girls have ordered exclusively Tequilas, and others have mixed it up between sometimes Tequila and sometimes soft. Occasionally meet a girl who doesn't drink alcohol at all. I hate to see really drunk girls, but it happens sometimes. We don't know how many she had earlier and if had any of the Yaa Dong (strong drink) out front of bar, unless she tells the detail.[/QUOTE]Make her clean up her puke in the morning.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1837899]On the other hand, I am not that concerned about girl having wonderful skills. It's only an extra bonus for me, and of course rarely found with bar girls. As long as she is hot, pretty, can go with the flow, have fun, and have a reasonable GFE, that is enough for me. I take some girls with rather weak blowjobs. Not a big deal for me. Even some expert MP girls BJ technique is not right for me, being too fast or too strong.

I think some bargirls are doing extremely well on looks, sexiness, and attitude. That means they don't have to be that concerned with developing wonderful skills. May not even occur to them. For ordinary looking girls, they may need to build skills to really hook regulars, with attitude possibly not enough, I am not sure. Even in massage joints, I am still going for looks, GFE, and fun attitude, feel of the pussy, with maybe a slightly higher skills expectation.

Some special things I like, I can easily train the girl to do for me, such as ball tickling and tits brushing balls. However what are the skills that a skilled girl brings? The only ones that occur to me are: DFK (not difficult at all), soft slow body slide (unskilled girls go too fast and hard. Less sexy), soft slow BBBJ, deepthroat is added bonus, cowgirl grind movements (that should come naturally to a girl). That is about it for me. Perhaps there are plenty of skills I forget. There is the pussy squeeze of dick that I get from one favorite bargirl, but not many girls are doing that very well.

Do we say a girl is really skilled if her blowjob is superb, or is there more to it than that? Okay I recall many guys have ass rimming as a big requirement. However that is not difficult to do (I do for girls if they like it). Is it just about if girl likes to do it or not? I don't have girls sticking anything up my ass. Also I am not into massage at all. I guess I forgot handjob, but again I do not take HJ. Little interest in that. Maybe blowjob, deepthroat, and squeezing pussy are the only skills really that useful to me, but I don't assume I will get more than some sort of BJ. Very expert BJ I find quite rarely as well, and maybe my expert BJ is not the same as for other guys.

Something else that occurs to me. Some girls like to fuck in a fairly powerful manner, and I expect many guys like it. This is not really suited to me, perhaps relating to me taking a long time to cum. Obviously no one likes a starfish fuck. Orgasmic girls are more fun, but its not a skill.[/QUOTE]It is amazing how our likes vary so much; but I am sure that is true for all of us on this board.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1837568]I wonder what remark makes a guy pissed so easily. I don't let the odd smartass spoil my fun.

In Thailand we should learn to be cool.[/QUOTE]Yeah! I guess I need to work on my inner peace. 5555.

I reported on this on the Pattaya thread but in short here is what happened: I had already consumed 5 drinks when I entered Baccara. So I ordered just plain water. The lady made a face and got me abottle of water and put it on the table and turned away. I called her and asked for a glass with ice. She turned away like she was being asked to move a mountain, came back with it and put it down a bit harder than usual and said "You no want to drink ah mister?

That is it!

[QUOTE=Blanquiceleste;1837980] I called her and asked for a glass with ice. She turned away like she was being asked to move a mountain, came back with it and put it down a bit harder than usual and said "You no want to drink ah mister?
[/QUOTE]Well, you know every bar probably has some crap waitresses. Some have brain floating away, too slow, forgot who ordered the drink, can't calculate a bill correctly, take too long to total bill when you need to leave in a hurry, hassle customer for drinks, make wrong assumptions, etc. Shit happens everywhere.

Some staff have seen a past pattern of cheap Charlie sitting on a bottle of water all night, a waste of space. The problem is just that she may assume the worst before that is actually justified.

If me, I would not be too pissed off with faulty assumptions. Some Crazy House dancing girls commented to me that they were scared of me when I first started to go to Crazy House due to dark rings around eye sockets, and maybe deadpan expression (not smiling constantly). Soon they learned from waitresses that in fact I was a nice guy. I proved the assumptions to be wrong.

[QUOTE=Blanquiceleste;1837980]I had already consumed 5 drinks when I entered Baccara. So I ordered just plain water. The lady made a face and got me abottle of water and put it on the table and turned away. I called her and asked for a glass with ice. She turned away like she was being asked to move a mountain, came back with it and put it down a bit harder than usual and said "You no want to drink ah mister?
[/QUOTE]LOL. It's business everywhere & it's their (waitresses) job to get it done somehow. They simply don't care whether you want it or not. Perhaps it's an attitude they have built over time. I wonder how they handle it in their initial days as an amateur, may be they get some training of some sort. And this is the same story everywhere in the world (more in developing countries though).

Anyway we go their for something else, drink is just a part of it. And till the time a mineral water is considered as drink we can ignore these annoying remarks. Anyway nice to hear your experience, will use it as an feedback in my trip.

[QUOTE=MusicalToM;1838117]LOL. It's business everywhere & it's their (waitresses) job to get it done somehow. They simply don't care whether you want it or not. Perhaps it's an attitude they have built over time. I wonder how they handle it in their initial days as an amateur, may be they get some training of some sort. And this is the same story everywhere in the world (more in developing countries though).

Anyway we go their for something else, drink is just a part of it. And till the time a mineral water is considered as drink we can ignore these annoying remarks. Anyway nice to hear your experience, will use it as an feedback in my trip.[/QUOTE]I jusr order Manao Soda (soda water with a slice of lemon) everywhere, never get a complain, sometimes a question from a girl why I only drink water. But that is all. Unfortunately the soda in Thailand is just purified local water where in all surrounding countries a can of Schweppes is served. Occasionally I finish with a Jack Daniels & Coke, and then you see the surprises, but again never a complain.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1838013]Well, you know every bar probably has some crap waitresses. Some have brain floating away, too slow, forgot who ordered the drink, can't calculate a bill correctly, take too long to total bill when you need to leave in a hurry, hassle customer for drinks, make wrong assumptions, etc. Shit happens everywhere.

Some staff have seen a past pattern of cheap Charlie sitting on a bottle of water all night, a waste of space. The problem is just that she may assume the worst before that is actually justified.

If me, I would not be too pissed off with faulty assumptions. Some Crazy House dancing girls commented to me that they were scared of me when I first started to go to Crazy House due to dark rings around eye sockets, and maybe deadpan expression (not smiling constantly). Soon they learned from waitresses that in fact I was a nice guy. I proved the assumptions to be wrong.[/QUOTE]Service in general in LOS is really not all that great IMHO. There are some very noted exceptions, but overall one cannot expect Western style service here. I think this is especially off-putting to Americans who are used to superb service in restaurants and bars where most employees work for tips.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1838191]Service in general in LOS is really not all that great IMHO. There are some very noted exceptions, but overall one cannot expect Western style service here. I think this is especially off-putting to Americans who are used to superb service in restaurants and bars where most employees work for tips.[/QUOTE]Exactly! And that's why we don't care about their motivation for doing their jobs.
Same goes for gogo girls. We expect them to get off their ass and take care of the customer. When they don't do their job, they lose $.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1837774]I admire your patience. I really have no desire to get that involved in a working girls business or the politics of a GoGo bar. I would find it very tedious. The only think I really care about is how skilled they are in the sack.[/QUOTE]That's a sucker. Waiting for a working girl to come. That's a joke.

If I am willing to pay the barfine, she is coming NOW. Otherwise, I'm out of there and going to get another one. I'm not waiting for a prostitute.

[QUOTE=PipeLayer99;1838197]That's a sucker. Waiting for a working girl to come. That's a joke.

If I am willing to pay the barfine, she is coming NOW. Otherwise, I'm out of there and going to get another one. I'm not waiting for a prostitute.[/QUOTE]Amen. At the end of the day I am the customer and expect to be catered to. I am not going to "*****mance," wait around or cater to her whims. Methinks that is one of the big problems and one of the reasons the scene has declined so much. Mongers 15-20 years ago were a different breed. More demanding and with higher expectations. A gal that pulled that crap would not make a thing. Dudes would just not stand for it. That has all changed. If I have to cater to them I might as well move back home. Of course I feel the same about the ridiculous prices. Have a buddy who is friends with the owner of Baccara. His top earners are making close to 300 K Baht per month. Really guys, let that sink in. Do you really know how much money that is in Thailand? I don't blame the gals at all. It is the sucker customers that are dishing out big bucks for 15 min of action. Amazing really, but yes, it screws it up for all of us. Now don't get me wrong, there were 15 min quickies back in the day, but you paid between 500 and 1k Baht for them and at the time that was 12.50 - 25 USD and that is still about what a 15 min quickie is worth.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1838202]Amen. At the end of the day I am the customer and expect to be catered to. I am not going to "*****mance," wait around or cater to her whims. Methinks that is one of the big problems and one of the reasons the scene has declined so much. Mongers 15-20 years ago were a different breed. More demanding and with higher expectations. A gal that pulled that crap would not make a thing. Dudes would just not stand for it. That has all changed. If I have to cater to them I might as well move back home. Of course I feel the same about the ridiculous prices. Have a buddy who is friends with the owner of Baccara. His top earners are making close to 300 K Baht per month. Really guys, let that sink in. Do you really know how much money that is in Thailand? I don't blame the gals at all. It is the sucker customers that are dishing out big bucks for 15 min of action. Amazing really, but yes, it screws it up for all of us.[/QUOTE]Too many suckers out there putting up with that crap. I treat the ladies right. But at the same time I'm a paying customer. I expect her to take care of me (now). If you can't, you lose. Bye bye.

I told a girl to come tonight via message. She said, I just came to the club 5 minutes. I replied ok, Come to my room? (as if I care that she just went to the club). She said, I wait for my friend to come. I replied, I don't wait for you long time. I want you come soon. You come now you win money.
8 minutes later she replies asking if I can wait 1. 5 hours. I didn't answer that message. I already told her I am not waiting. (no I am not waiting for her to come. She needs to come now. If she wants to work).
5 minutes after that she asks where is my room now. And she wants to know if I want her to come now. (How many times do I need to tell her to come now?)

I didn't answer. Why? She is in the club looking for a man. I told her to come. She wants to wait for a friend. Yeah right. IMO she can tell her friend she has a customer and get on that motorbike. She lost money.
I don't play that crap.
In the meantime, during those 15 minutes, I already called 2-3 more and the first one to reply won.

[QUOTE=MusicalToM;1838117]LOL. It's business everywhere & it's their (waitresses) job to get it done somehow. They simply don't care whether you want it or not. Perhaps it's an attitude they have built over time. I wonder how they handle it in their initial days as an amateur, may be they get some training of some sort. And this is the same story everywhere in the world (more in developing countries though).
[/QUOTE]The management of many bars is not great. The waiting staff can be pretty shit. Some need to be fired, however maybe they are not paid well enough to hire better ones. If I find a good waitress that looks after me, I hang on to her.

In Mandarin Upstairs, the whole place was slack. Girls supposed to be dancing were just standing there half the time. If the music is no good fire the DJ. Otherwise fine the girls for not dancing. Some places have very poor lighting, some have very poor music. Some very poor or annoying waiting staff.

It may not be rocket science to improve the bar overall experience.

[QUOTE=PipeLayer99;1838208]Too many suckers out there putting up with that crap. I treat the ladies right. But at the same time I'm a paying customer. I expect her to take care of me (now). If you can't, you lose. Bye bye.

I told a girl to come tonight via message. She said, I just came to the club 5 minutes. I replied ok, Come to my room? (as if I care that she just went to the club). She said, I wait for my friend to come. I replied, I don't wait for you long time. I want you come soon. You come now you win money.
8 minutes later she replies asking if I can wait 1. 5 hours. I didn't answer that message. I already told her I am not waiting. (no I am not waiting for her to come. She needs to come now. If she wants to work).
5 minutes after that she asks where is my room now. And she wants to know if I want her to come now. (How many times do I need to tell her to come now?)

I didn't answer. Why? She is in the club looking for a man. I told her to come. She wants to wait for a friend. Yeah right. IMO she can tell her friend she has a customer and get on that motorbike. She lost money.
I don't play that crap.
In the meantime, during those 15 minutes, I already called 2-3 more and the first one to reply won.[/QUOTE]If the majority of mongers took this approach we would all receive better service and see better attitudes, like we did in the past. Sadly, I don't think that is going to happen. Dudes have brought their Western ways to LOS.

[QUOTE=PipeLayer99;1838208]
In the meantime, during those 15 minutes, I already called 2-3 more and the first one to reply won.[/QUOTE]Thais cannot be on time even if money depends on it. Maybe they are just not desperate enough.

Plenty of bar girls will not come to work purely because its raining and more difficult to get a taxi organised to pick her up at her front door, even if they know they will miss out on some good money.

My GF takes hours to get ready to go somewhere, e. G. Out to dinner, entertainment, etc. Pushing her to be quick just makes her angry and then she won't go at all, so it's useless. Don't expect to Thais to work by Farang values of punctuality. Just won't happen for working girls.

Just try going into a Thai oriented Coffee shop, and tell them you are in a hurry for your order. Even so they can be incredibly slow and mucking around, despite no other customers to serve. A western oriented coffee shop has to be better or the customers will not come back. How many Thais and how much time does it take to buy a simple item in a department store?

In my local sports pub, one girl was incredibly efficient. She was from Myanmar. The Thai staff varied from medium fast to one incredibly slow and only able to do one thing at a time. That one should have been fired for slowness in my opinion. She was considered to have good English, her only asset.

After a very long time in Thailand, you get used to Thai slowness but find places and staff who are better. Sure if a P4 P girl cannot come at the right time, she misses out if have a good option. Sometimes we have no time. Sometimes we have plenty of time. I remember well a girl that was very slow to show up (too busy partying with friends or whatever), so did not bother to contact her any more. It's much easier to go to place and take something available than make appointments with girls. Rather few are on time.

Lollitas shop makes it difficult to book a girl. Fortunately 90% of the time my girl is available, otherwise I could not be bothered to go there.

[QUOTE=PipeLayer99;1838208]Too many suckers out there putting up with that crap. I treat the ladies right. But at the same time I'm a paying customer. I expect her to take care of me (now). If you can't, you lose. Bye bye.
.......
I didn't answer. Why? She is in the club looking for a man. I told her to come. She wants to wait for a friend. Yeah right. IMO she can tell her friend she has a customer and get on that motorbike. She lost money.
I don't play that crap.
In the meantime, during those 15 minutes, I already called 2-3 more and the first one to reply won.[/QUOTE]I total agree with your approach and usually do the same. Yeah she lost money, up to her. In the last years it seems that many girls prefer to spend time in party drinking with friends first and looking for customer later, up to them. I'm paying customer and I don't waiting for their schedules.

I've been to Soi Cowboy before, as well as Nana plaza, but for this trip, I decided to try something different.

So instead of going to those places, I walked towards Phrom Phong skytrain station. About midway between Asoke and Phrom Phong, there are a few bars. I stopped at the "penalty spot", good place to watch a football game surrounded by girls.

Girls working there are waitresses, but are available for pick up, bar fine 600 baths.

I left with a girl called Miaouw (like a cat begging for food). Not the prettiest, but very GFE.

Paid 1500 baths for short time, but since it was late, she stayed overnight.

It was good fun with all my fav. Positions (BBBJ, DATY, doggy, etc.). To my surprise, she gave me a really good BBBJ when we woke up in the morning, so that was a plus.

I thought that it was a nice experience, a good change from the more famous (and aggressive) bars in cowboy and Nana.

[QUOTE=ChristianG;1838412]I total agree with your approach and usually do the same. Yeah she lost money, up to her. In the last years it seems that many girls prefer to spend time in party drinking with friends first and looking for customer later, up to them. I'm paying customer and I don't waiting for their schedules.[/QUOTE]That's been going on for quite a few years now. The gals make enough money to only work when they feel like it. And hey, good on on 'them. That's what happens when they can make 5-15 times the daily minimum wage in 15 minutes. Blame the punters for that. I remember fondly just a decade ago when being on Cowboy or right outside Nana at closing time was just amazing. You were confronted with literally hundreds of gals approaching you asking, "go with you?" Like being a bear during a salmon upstream spawning run. But once the ST fees and salaries started creeping up, this ended. Gals would rather party with their friends.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1838013] Some Crazy House dancing girls commented to me that they were scared of me when I first started to go to Crazy House due to dark rings around eye sockets, and maybe deadpan expression (not smiling constantly). Soon they learned from waitresses that in fact I was a nice guy. I proved the assumptions to be wrong.[/QUOTE]Man, from the physical condition and demeanor of some of the guys I've seen the girls at Crazy House walk out with (me too, who knows?), including the top lookers dancing there, I would say mere dark rings around the eyes and not smiling constantly should be a welcome relief! LOL.

Geez, it must be contagious. Went into one of the Suk BJ bars (I will not name it as I think this is a one off issue), grabbed the best looking gal and headed upstairs. She was all smiles and I was anticipating a great little sesh. Started to attempt to disrobe her and she immediately started with, "I take off you tip 500 Baht. " What? Really? I was a bit taken aback as I have never had an issue getting a BJ gal to disrobe. When I said, no, but you will get a tip, she continued to press me for the amount I would tip her. When I told her it depended on her service her mood soured even more. At this point I was done and I headed for the exit and I made sure to relay my experience to the owner on the way out. In the real world treating a customer like this would get you fired.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1838750]Geez, it must be contagious. Went into one of the Suk BJ bars (I will not name it as I think this is a one off issue), grabbed the best looking gal and headed upstairs. She was all smiles and I was anticipating a great little sesh. Started to attempt to disrobe her and she immediately started with, "I take off you tip 500 Baht. " What? Really? I was a bit taken aback as I have never had an issue getting a BJ gal to disrobe. When I said, no, but you will get a tip, she continued to press me for the amount I would tip her. When I told her it depended on her service her mood soured even more. At this point I was done and I headed for the exit and I made sure to relay my experience to the owner on the way out. In the real world treating a customer like this would get you fired.[/QUOTE]Many now have the attitude that they make so little from a BJ, half the fee or less, that you won't won't get anything extra at all without paying something more. That is how they make make money.

Girl's first BJ of the day could be the boss gets 500 and girl 300. That is only 10 bucks. The ratio may improve if she does more BJs, I can't know precisely for every shop.

You could offer her at least something to take to the gear off. Maybe not 500, but not zero. Even 200 would be a significant increase for some girls that are stuggling.

In my case, I almost always want the girl to be nude and fuck her as well. So its always going to cost me extra, however the extra isn't split with the boss if only pay for BJ up front.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1838750]Geez, it must be contagious. Went into one of the Suk BJ bars (I will not name it as I think this is a one off issue), grabbed the best looking gal and headed upstairs. She was all smiles and I was anticipating a great little sesh. Started to attempt to disrobe her and she immediately started with, "I take off you tip 500 Baht. " What? Really? I was a bit taken aback as I have never had an issue getting a BJ gal to disrobe. When I said, no, but you will get a tip, she continued to press me for the amount I would tip her. When I told her it depended on her service her mood soured even more. At this point I was done and I headed for the exit and I made sure to relay my experience to the owner on the way out. In the real world treating a customer like this would get you fired.[/QUOTE]I have seen similar actions at other BJ bars. I inform the management and more importantly I inform the other girls downstairs that their colleague is no good and will drive away customers if she continues. Usually doesn't happen again.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1838813]Many now have the attitude that they make so little from a BJ, half the fee or less, that you won't won't get anything extra at all without paying something more. That is how they make make money.

Girl's first BJ of the day could be the boss gets 500 and girl 300. That is only 10 bucks. The ratio may improve if she does more BJs, I can't know precisely for every shop.

You could offer her at least something to take to the gear off. Maybe not 500, but not zero. Even 200 would be a significant increase for some girls that are stuggling.

In my case, I almost always want the girl to be nude and fuck her as well. So its always going to cost me extra, however the extra isn't split with the boss if only pay for BJ up front.[/QUOTE]I always tip a bit, even if the gal is not so skilled. But a bigger tip has to be earned.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1838750]Geez, it must be contagious. Went into one of the Suk BJ bars (I will not name it as I think this is a one off issue), grabbed the best looking gal and headed upstairs. She was all smiles and I was anticipating a great little sesh. Started to attempt to disrobe her and she immediately started with, "I take off you tip 500 Baht. " What? Really? I was a bit taken aback as I have never had an issue getting a BJ gal to disrobe. When I said, no, but you will get a tip, she continued to press me for the amount I would tip her. When I told her it depended on her service her mood soured even more. At this point I was done and I headed for the exit and I made sure to relay my experience to the owner on the way out. In the real world treating a customer like this would get you fired.[/QUOTE]Goatscrot, you didn't specify but I assume you and your girl were using one of the BJ bar's cubicles or curtained booths instead of one of their Short Time rooms? If so, I can't say full nudity has ever been a given in the BJ cubicles / booths for me over the years. I only tried to unbutton a blouse or unhook a bra a couple of times in the past when using those locations and both times it was met with resistence so I stopped. No tip in exchange was even mentioned at the time. And I am talking about starting from a few years back with the more seasoned, better performers I had in those bars, girls with whom I became a repeat customer, not some one week wonder who made up her own rules contrary to house rules and was gone by the following weekend.

When I have wanted full nudity and / or FS along with more time with a girl at a BJ bar, I pop for the typically 1700 baht or so Short Time room. Of course, I have never seen a menu at Dr BJ, L0 lita's, Kasalong, Lolipop1 or Som's Haven stipulating exactly what should be expected in the BJ cubicles / booths, I. E. BBBJ CIM, nudity, FS, whatever, but always assumed the only givens for the BJ cubicles / booths, especially in places where the girls wear theme uniforms, were BBBJ CIM while still in uniform. Isn't that why that experience is only 700-800 baht vs 1700 baht? I never assumed full nudity with or without FS was a realistic much less an expected option in a location where there is no shower and bath towels as there is in the Short Time rooms.

However, if what you described happened in one of their Short Time rooms that you chose and were paying more for, then that was truly inappropriate behavior on the girl's part.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1838750] .... she immediately started with, "I take off you tip 500 Baht. " What? Really? I was a bit taken aback as I have never had an issue getting a BJ gal to disrobe. When I said, no, but you will get a tip, she continued to press me for the amount I would tip her. When I told her it depended on her service her mood soured even more. At this point I was done and I headed for the exit and I made sure to relay my experience to the owner on the way out. In the real world treating a customer like this would get you fired.[/QUOTE]Good on you. I'm glad you have the balls to walk out. She won't last long.
So where did you go next. One of the places right next door! ;)

[QUOTE=PipeLayer99;1839161]Good on you. I'm glad you have the balls to walk out. She won't last long.
So where did you go next. One of the places right next door! ;)[/QUOTE]Actually right up the street!

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1839058]Goatscrot, you didn't specify but I assume you and your girl were using one of the BJ bar's cubicles or curtained booths instead of one of their Short Time rooms? If so, I can't say full nudity has ever been a given in the BJ cubicles / booths for me over the years. I only tried to unbutton a blouse or unhook a bra a couple of times in the past when using those locations and both times it was met with resistence so I stopped. No tip in exchange was even mentioned at the time. And I am talking about starting from a few years back with the more seasoned, better performers I had in those bars, girls with whom I became a repeat customer, not some one week wonder who made up her own rules contrary to house rules and was gone by the following weekend.

When I have wanted full nudity and / or FS along with more time with a girl at a BJ bar, I pop for the typically 1700 baht or so Short Time room. Of course, I have never seen a menu at Dr BJ, L0 lita's, Kasalong, Lolipop1 or Som's Haven stipulating exactly what should be expected in the BJ cubicles / booths, I. E. BBBJ CIM, nudity, FS, whatever, but always assumed the only givens for the BJ cubicles / booths, especially in places where the girls wear theme uniforms, were BBBJ CIM while still in uniform. Isn't that why that experience is only 700-800 baht vs 1700 baht? I never assumed full nudity with or without FS was a realistic much less an expected option in a location where there is no shower and bath towels as there is in the Short Time rooms.

However, if what you described happened in one of their Short Time rooms that you chose and were paying more for, then that was truly inappropriate behavior on the girl's part.[/QUOTE]In a cubicle, and this was the first time I have ever had this issue in my many years of going to BJ bars. And I am not expecting full sex, although on more than one occasion that did occur and the required sum was given.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1839199]In a cubicle, and this was the first time I have ever had this issue in my many years of going to BJ bars. And I am not expecting full sex, although on more than one occasion that did occur and the required sum was given.[/QUOTE]Interesting. I have had BJ bar girls in cubicles / booths initiate DFK, encourage me to take them to the Short Time rooms for more and better action than what usually occurs in the cubicles / booths, and swallow on occasion. But I have never had a girl in one of those lower cost BJ rooms voluntarily remove any clothing, ask if I wanted her to remove any clothing with or without an additional fee or respond positively to my gentle attempts to remove any of their clothing with or without a discussion about an extra fee. But, as I said, I only tried that a couple of times a few years ago and it was met with something like, "Oh no, honey, cannot", end of story so I never bothered to try it again on subsequent visits.

And I have had dozens of girls in just about all of the BJ bars around town over the years. However, I would not discount the distinct possibility that those two early "refusals" were just very unlucky draws for me that set me up for not bothering to bring up the subject ever again.

The only exception for me was once at Som's Haven where it was agreed upfront that FS would take place in one of the BJ rooms on the couch at the 1200 baht price for that option because the Short Time rooms had just been occupied.

The other thing is I rarely use the cubicles / booths in the BJ bars anymore and much prefer the Short Time room experience.

I don't see you mention it, but did you also refuse to pay the 800 baht? Sounds like one of the most annoying things was a Jeykll and Hyde change in her demeanor once you were alone in the cubicle. I have aborted missions for that alone. It never bodes well for anything that follows.

Brothers in Sin!

Is there a pharmacy at Suvarnabhumi airport that sells vitamin "V" and "C" (generic forms by preference, if available)?

I will be passing through BKK airport on my way to Hongkong and will stay in a hotel close to the airport before my early flight out again, so I have no time to go to my usual pharmacy on Sukhumvit Road (I'm arriving too late for that).

Wolvenvacht.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1839466]Brothers in Sin!

Is there a pharmacy at Suvarnabhumi airport that sells vitamin "V" and "C" (generic forms by preference, if available)?

I will be passing through BKK airport on my way to Hongkong and will stay in a hotel close to the airport before my early flight out again, so I have no time to go to my usual pharmacy on Sukhumvit Road (I'm arriving too late for that).

Wolvenvacht.[/QUOTE]I don't think so. But why to worry, your vitamin C or V you can get at almost every street corner in Kowloon.

[QUOTE=Mongo69;1836467]Thank you Ken, Syz, and Crypt, and anyone else who chimes in. I wasn't planning on 2 weeks of mongering, but I was concerned with 25 hours of travel time and hoping two weeks was enough stay before the 25 hours back!! Will def mix it up. So for a couple hours with a little cute I'm looking at 1000 baht? What about bar fine? Or should I stick to freelancers and massage girls? Was hoping to take back to my hotel. It was hard to figure on here, overwhelming info.

Thank you thank you guys.[/QUOTE]I don't think you'll get 2 hours for 1000 baht. One hour probably. I prefer freelancers. No bar fine in any of the bars I mentioned. Of course, it's been a few years since I have been to Bangkok. So I don't know if the prices have risen. But the exchange rate is the same.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1839443]Interesting. I have had BJ bar girls in cubicles / booths initiate DFK, encourage me to take them to the Short Time rooms for more and better action than what usually occurs in the cubicles / booths, and swallow on occasion. But I have never had a girl in one of those lower cost BJ rooms voluntarily remove any clothing, ask if I wanted her to remove any clothing with or without an additional fee or respond positively to my gentle attempts to remove any of their clothing with or without a discussion about an extra fee. But, as I said, I only tried that a couple of times a few years ago and it was met with something like, "Oh no, honey, cannot", end of story so I never bothered to try it again on subsequent visits.

And I have had dozens of girls in just about all of the BJ bars around town over the years. However, I would not discount the distinct possibility that those two early "refusals" were just very unlucky draws for me that set me up for not bothering to bring up the subject ever again.

The only exception for me was once at Som's Haven where it was agreed upfront that FS would take place in one of the BJ rooms on the couch at the 1200 baht price for that option because the Short Time rooms had just been occupied.

The other thing is I rarely use the cubicles / booths in the BJ bars anymore and much prefer the Short Time room experience.

I don't see you mention it, but did you also refuse to pay the 800 baht? Sounds like one of the most annoying things was a Jeykll and Hyde change in her demeanor once you were alone in the cubicle. I have aborted missions for that alone. It never bodes well for anything that follows.[/QUOTE]First of all heading up the stair I always grab the gals ass and check for a pad. If I find one I put on that disappointed face and ask in Thai if she has her "men. " If the answer is yes the session is a no-go and I am out of there. When I get to the room before she even goes out to get her stuff I go in for a DFK and start to unbutton the shirt. Most of the time I get "cha-cha. " But at that point she knows my intentions for her to disrobe. Sometimes they will say "tip for me?" And of course I say yes. "Oh no, honey, cannot" would be fine with me. Up to her. If they don't want to do something more power to them. The experience the other day was very different. The gal pulled away and in a very aggressive and belligerent tone demanded 500 Baht to take anything off. But you are correct. It was a Jekyll and Hyde experience. 800 Baht? I barely got my shoes off. Nothing occurred. And BTW, most of the time I have no issues not only with gals getting naked, climbing on for a 69, fingering, DFK, etc. Usually tip the leftover 200 out of the 1 K as well. Considering you only spend about 15-20 min there, I think that is a fair price. Especially when compared to 1900 at an oily for an hour where it is anything you want as many times as you want.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1839520]...It was a Jekyll and Hyde experience. 800 Baht? I barely got my shoes off. Nothing occurred. [/QUOTE]Ah, that is the beauty of venues and options where you pay all of it after! Good. She didn't still profit in any way from the Jeykll and Hyde routine and instead was left to explain why a girl whose behavior drives paying customers away should still be allowed to sit there and haunt the place.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1839058]
When I have wanted full nudity and / or FS along with more time with a girl at a BJ bar, I pop for the typically 1700 baht or so Short Time room. Of course, I have never seen a menu at Dr BJ, L0 lita's, Kasalong, Lolipop1 or Som's Haven stipulating exactly what should be expected in the BJ cubicles / booths, I. E. BBBJ CIM, nudity, FS, whatever, but always assumed the only givens for the BJ cubicles / booths, especially in places where the girls wear theme uniforms, were BBBJ CIM while still in uniform. Isn't that why that experience is only 700-800 baht vs 1700 baht? I never assumed full nudity with or without FS was a realistic much less an expected option in a location where there is no shower and bath towels as there is in the Short Time rooms.
[/QUOTE]ET Smooth,

I also prefer the comfort of the special rooms, however sometimes these are not available when desperate and have limited time. Having girl naked and fucking her has been my experience as quite possible at Lollytas with couch and curtain, a little less practical to fuck at Dr. BJ due to cubicle set up, but still possible. Have not tried Kasalong or Som's.

There may be a problem of course: Girl is on "mehn" (menses, menstruation), "prajum duean" (monthly period); Girl pussy out of action (sore, swollen inflamed from previous usage or fungal infection); girl just does not fuck; the tip offered is not considered good enough to be worthwhile for her. Mostly I have been able to overcome the last problem (the suitable tip). It obviously costs less to tip the girl to fuck on the couch since don't have to share funds with the greedy boss, and not getting the benefit of a nice room. A period typically lasts for 4 days per month, and girls are not normally taking that time off, so hitting period time is not that unusual. 12% chance, at least.

I have sometimes been able to convince girls during last stages of a period, if not painful, to take out the sponge and fuck me anyway. I am not very afraid of small quantities of colour (wearing a condom of course). One girl did offer her ass as a backup when pussy was out of action but did want an extra tip for it (a while back now so I struggle to remember if I got to fuck her anyway). I don't normally want anal, if it costs extra above the fuck price.

Hello,

I will be staying near junction of Ratchaprarop road and Phetchaburi road early next month. Was wondering if there are any full service MP around this area and what would be the approximate rates for such services. Any help will be much appreciated.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1840026]ET Smooth,

I also prefer the comfort of the special rooms, however sometimes these are not available when desperate and have limited time. Having girl naked and fucking her has been my experience as quite possible at Lollytas with couch and curtain, a little less practical to fuck at Dr. BJ due to cubicle set up, but still possible. Have not tried Kasalong or Som's.
[/QUOTE]Syzygies, I believe fucking in the cubicles at Som's or Kasalong would be much more practical than in either Dr BJ's Salon or the curtained booths in L0 lita's if for no other reason than that the formers' cubicles have enough carpeted floorspace for it. Sure, you can also use their couches. But, in my case, although I enjoy indulging in a variety of positions during fucking, I cum almost exclusively in missionary position. So for my finish I need a more literally level playing field so to speak than what you get on a couch or in a chair.

BTW, it seems as though you know but other readers might not know that if you don't tip the girl enough extra to upgrade from BJ to FS in the cubicles or curtain booths at the BJ bars on the assumption it will remain a secret between the two of you that you have saved some meaningful amount of baht by not going for the 1700 baht Short Time room from the get go, the girl will in all probability mention the upgrade from BJ to FS finish to the cashier when you settle your bill and they will increase the amount anyway. But they will not take it all the way to 1700 baht since you didn't use their shower, towels or muss up the sheets on the bed in the Short Time room. In Som's the amount for FS in a BJ cubicle used to be 1200 baht. Not sure if that is still the case or if it is a similar amount at Kasalong and L0 lita's.

[QUOTE=SimpleGuy85;1840063]Hello,

I will be staying near junction of Ratchaprarop road and Phetchaburi road early next month. Was wondering if there are any full service MP around this area and what would be the approximate rates for such services. Any help will be much appreciated.[/QUOTE]Looking at the map, where you will be staying is a short walk to the Chit Lom BTS station. From there it's only 2 stops to Nana or 4 stops to Phrom Phong. If I recall correctly from the Bangkok Massage forum, one of those 2 stops should put you within range of anything you might be looking for.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1840196]Syzygies, I believe fucking in the cubicles at Som's or Kasalong would be much more practical than in either Dr BJ's Salon or the curtained booths in L0 lita's if for no other reason than that the formers' cubicles have enough carpeted floorspace for it. Sure, you can also use their couches. But, in my case, although I enjoy indulging in a variety of positions during fucking, I cum almost exclusively in missionary position. So for my finish I need a more literally level playing field so to speak than what you get on a couch or in a chair.
[/QUOTE]Okay That makes sense. I come usually in doggy, so no problem for me. Mish is not so important for me. Even in mish I can be upright to see her pussy better. Then there is reverse mish with her prone and me vertical from behind. Then there is spooning. Lots of positions I like. Recall one Thai girl who wanted me to fuck her on a chair when a perfectly good bed was available. Just variety.

I should have a look in Som's som day. LOL. I presume it is the famous Som from SOL, that is the owner? I did try Lollipop was it on Soi 12 a long time ago, but girls were ugly at the time. Have to get lucky with best looking girls available, as always. I like beauties that provide adequate service these days, either BJ or sex.

Som would not pass of course, if she was still working, for looks. I got a lot more fussy in old age. Still remember a threesome with Som and Aey from SOL, many years back. Aey later quit and went to work in Central Chitlom. Maybe she had a BF, she did not say, but was still O.K. to play up. Its a long time ago now. I probably still have her old number and should try it one day.

A different Som in Kangaroo bar still remembers me by name, after I did not visit there for 6 to 8 years. LOL Maybe because of my extravagant orgies with two or three girls in the old days. Apparently this Som has been there 12 years, but Kangaroo and Annies Rose in Pat Pong were my first BJ shops, dating back 24 years ago, when I was relatively young. It was really an anything goes place in daytime back then. Can't remember the prices. Could have been 500 to each girl. Fucking did happen too. Have vague memories of one Thai girl with light skin and very large naturals. She wasn't really my spec totally, as not quite skinny, but her face tits and pussy were really good. An absolute doll like girl. As we entered the Kangaroo bar 24 years ago, it was dark inside coming from bright sunshine outside, so I wanted to slow the girls down slightly till I could see which looked good and which were ugly. They had other ideas. Would be attacked by multiple girls typically three, who would be trying to get my dick in their mouths as quickly as possible. Tag team. No discussion of the charges first. LOL You would soon be playing with their tits and pussies while getting sucked off. A girl could stand over you to allow DATY too. Lying horizontal was not usually a big requirement but they did have a small back room for that.
Kangaroo bar is now in a slightly different location to back then but only moved a short distance.

I would still like to find a place where wild orgies are still as possible, even not in a private room, with crazy girls. Lollytas is definitely not it. You have to be very well behaved downstairs. Does anyone know if Toy Bar still has wild behaviour in the public bar or have they cleaned up their act? Haven't had a wild session in there for a few years too. Need to find a good looking girl or two first, of course, not easy.

[QUOTE=SimpleGuy85;1840063]Hello,

I will be staying near junction of Ratchaprarop road and Phetchaburi road early next month. Was wondering if there are any full service MP around this area and what would be the approximate rates for such services. Any help will be much appreciated.[/QUOTE]Most places are not close.

However easy walk north under skytrain (to the airport), and turn left at next main road (Chaturathit / Sri Ayutthaya). A big place on the right is Chao praya 2 Soapy massage. Further a long a small massage joint Chawala / Chavala may still be there. I advise against J One massage on left side. They will try to rip you off most likely.

In the distant past Chao Praya 2 was my favorite place but is in decline. Don't know how many girls in the fishbowl. Try it at 6 PM. The older ladies typically do full Thai Massage as well as sex, and the young models don't do massage but bath you, and sex. Rates at Chao Praya 2 should be fair and include cost of sex. I would guess not more than 3000 and could be closer to 2000 Baht. I have not been there for several years so forget the last prices. At J One, the prices may be a lot higher so cheer person can pocket the extra charged to non Thais.

Venus mentioned by another poster is not far away, but I have never visited it, so cannot recommend.

Suggest you also check out some other Soapy places like Nataree (huge numbers of young girls) and Amsterdam (more up market) for comparison. Nataree is near to subway station Huay Kwang and Amsterdam near to Rama 9 station (Phra Ram 9). Try the Sukumvit Oily Massage too, but its hard to get too. Motorcycle is quickest, but added danger, so not always the best idea.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1840370]Most places are not close.

However easy walk north under skytrain (to the airport), and turn left at next main road (Chaturathit / Sri Ayutthaya). A big place on the right is Chao praya 2 Soapy massage. [/QUOTE]On google Maps search for "Chaophya 2 Bath & Massage" Sometimes the English has crazy spelling. Sounds like Jao-pra-yar.

Hi everyone,

Not too sure if this is the right place to post this. I needed to see a Dr. Google search showed Bumrungrad hospital nearby. There are more than one building, you need to go to the clinic one. Info downstairs refer first timers to 10th floor for registration. Filed paperwork, asked to see a dermatologist, they asked more questions and issued a Hospital card which has a hospital number plus a wrist bracelet (you will need the number to access the hospital WiFi). Skin section is on the 12th floor. You give them your registration papers and wait. They call your name, take some basic measurements eg weight, hight, BP etc. Back to waiting. Call your name again to see Dr. I knew what I had already but expressed my concern about bleeding. Biopsy advised. Accepted advice and back to waiting, paying and giving more information to be emailed the results. And. Be. You will need your passport or a copy. Bill before test takes place (I guess they wanted to make sure you have the money) I have been told consult would be 1000-2000 Baht and I thought that is equivalent to gap payment back home so no dramas. Bill came after test 7500 Baht 312 AUD, far out. I didn't want to look like a dick so, I paid and biopsy was done. Some antibiotics cream after settlement (I got back 150 Baht!

All in all the hospital and Service are five stars. However I found it to be a tad expensive especially with no travel insurance. They seem to cater for lots of Arabs (Arabic language signs are everywhere beside Thai and English) maybe that is why!

I work close to the medical field and aware of the guidelines and biopsy is not recommended in my case as cryotherapy is more common; that is why I felt the Dr want to do it for hospital profit. I felt ripped off in a way.

I am not too sure how much a full STI screen would cost but I would be really interested to know.

What I found interesting that they don't give you a script for your medication but rather they send it electronically to the in-patient pharmacy. I guess to keep all money in house but once again it could be a good thing for you if you have insurance, this way you claim once.

Moral of the story: always wear a hat).

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1840363]Okay That makes sense. I come usually in doggy, so no problem for me. Mish is not so important for me. Even in mish I can be upright to see her pussy better. Then there is reverse mish with her prone and me vertical from behind. Then there is spooning. Lots of positions I like. Recall one Thai girl who wanted me to fuck her on a chair when a perfectly good bed was available. Just variety.
[/QUOTE]For me, mish allows the girl much easier access to my balls for the ball tickling that I also like leading up to and all during my orgasm. One hand, not both. Laying on her back with her legs up and wrapped around the small of my back, she doesn't reach for my balls over her thigh with her arm between her thigh and my crotch. That is too awkward and requires too much space between my crotch and her pussy to allow room for her hand and/or arm while I am thrusting in and out of her pussy. No, she reaches under her buttock and thigh and makes contact with my balls from underneath and more or less from behind from that angle. I have no problem lasting virtually forever when I am in other positions. And could last a very long time in this kind of mish position as well. But when it is time for me to cum, I get into that kind of mish position with her tickling my balls from underneath and behind and I can make it last as long or as short as I want. Could cum within a very few minutes if desired. Or not, if desired. But in other positions, I will almost certainly never cum. Meanwhile, in this particular position she is laying comfortably on her back, her hand is on my balls and she never seems to mind even if I choose to enjoy that feeling for quite a long time rather than let go within a very few minutes.

I am surprised you like to cum doggie as often as you say since you have mentioned several times you like to get your balls tickled. As do I. However, isn't it more difficult for the girl to tickle a man's balls in doggie position? I mean, it isn't difficult for her to reach between her legs and get to them, of course. But that means she has to support her upper body with only one free arm if she is going to do that while in doggie position. And under those circumstances, I would be concerned about taking too long because that means she either drops the ball tickling rather soon in the experience so she can support her upper body with both arms/hands (or switch arms often) or she develops the muscles in one arm to the point of resembling a fiddler crab. LOL. Am I missing a key element here with regard to ball tickling combined with prolonged doggie style fucking?

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1840705]For me, mish allows the girl much easier access to my balls for the ball tickling that I also like leading up to and all during my orgasm. One hand, not both. Laying on her back with her legs up and wrapped around the small of my back, she doesn't reach for my balls over her thigh with her arm between her thigh and my crotch. That is too awkward and requires too much space between my crotch and her pussy to allow room for her hand and/or arm while I am thrusting in and out of her pussy. No, she reaches under her buttock and thigh and makes contact with my balls from underneath and more or less from behind from that angle. I have no problem lasting virtually forever when I am in other positions. And could last a very long time in this kind of mish position as well. But when it is time for me to cum, I get into that kind of mish position with her tickling my balls from underneath and behind and I can make it last as long or as short as I want. Could cum within a very few minutes if desired. Or not, if desired. But in other positions, I will almost certainly never cum. Meanwhile, in this particular position she is laying comfortably on her back, her hand is on my balls and she never seems to mind even if I choose to enjoy that feeling for quite a long time rather than let go within a very few minutes.

I am surprised you like to cum doggie as often as you say since you have mentioned several times you like to get your balls tickled. As do I. However, isn't it more difficult for the girl to tickle a man's balls in doggie position? I mean, it isn't difficult for her to reach between her legs and get to them, of course. But that means she has to support her upper body with only one free arm if she is going to do that while in doggie position. And under those circumstances, I would be concerned about taking too long because that means she either drops the ball tickling rather soon in the experience so she can support her upper body with both arms/hands (or switch arms often) or she develops the muscles in one arm to the point of resembling a fiddler crab. LOL. Am I missing a key element here with regard to ball tickling combined with prolonged doggie style fucking?[/QUOTE]Well I am the same for the balls touching, however it's actually easier in doggy position, reaching underneath, except she has to support herself with just one remaining arm, so she better be a lightweight girl. LOL She can switch arms from time to time. Girls have not complained that it is too difficult, even the GF.

[QUOTE=Amorbasha;1840648]Hi everyone,

Not too sure if this is the right place to post this. I needed to see a Dr. Google search showed Bumrungrad hospital nearby.

All in all the hospital and Service are five stars. However I found it to be a tad expensive especially with no travel insurance. They seem to cater for lots of Arabs (Arabic language signs are everywhere beside Thai and English) maybe that is why!

I work close to the medical field and aware of the guidelines and biopsy is not recommended in my case as cryotherapy is more common; that is why I felt the Dr want to do it for hospital profit. I felt ripped off in a way.

I am not too sure how much a full STI screen would cost but I would be really interested to know.

What I found interesting that they don't give you a script for your medication but rather they send it electronically to the in-patient pharmacy. I guess to keep all money in house but once again it could be a good thing for you if you have insurance, this way you claim once.

Moral of the story: always wear a hat).[/QUOTE]Yes this hospital is known to be a rip off. An International private Hospital. They don't want you to buy your medicine at a fraction of the cost somewhere else. Any private hospital can charge a fortune (unwarranted) even for Thais. I use Sukhumvit Hospital at Ekkamai.

[QUOTE=Amorbasha;1840648]they don't give you a script for your medication but rather they send it electronically to the in-patient pharmacy.[/QUOTE]

This is common practice at private hospitals. Medicines at the in-house pharmacy tend to cost 2-5 times the equivalent generics at an outside one.

You can always ask for a prescription / list of medicines (either ask the doctor, or if they already sent it down, ask the pharmacist) and purchase outside. It's your right, and in my experience they always comply, politely and without any issue. Obviously, they won't be advertising that you can do this, since they stand to gain a fair bit of money if you're unaware.

The only exception is a handful of restricted medications (like Xanax), which you can only legally obtain at hospitals, not regular pharmacies. It's a fairly brief list, and the doctor should warn you about these.

As an aside, "General Reports" section is probably more suitable for this (as it's not Bangkok mongering specific).

[QUOTE=Crocodilexp;1840913]This is common practice at private hospitals. Medicines at the in-house pharmacy tend to cost 2-5 times the equivalent generics at an outside one.

You can always ask for a prescription / list of medicines (either ask the doctor, or if they already sent it down, ask the pharmacist) and purchase outside. It's your right, and in my experience they always comply, politely and without any issue. Obviously, they won't be advertising that you can do this, since they stand to gain a fair bit of money if you're unaware.

The only exception is a handful of restricted medications (like Xanax), which you can only legally obtain at hospitals, not regular pharmacies. It's a fairly brief list, and the doctor should warn you about these.

As an aside, "General Reports" section is probably more suitable for this (as it's not Bangkok mongering specific).[/QUOTE]I recall paying a price for some medication for step daughter at the hospital. Later found out was Ibuprofen. Ha Ha. Have that at home already. Mostly Thais do not known what medication they are taking. Even normal doctors do not tell the patient what the medication is, so as to force the patient to keep returning to the doctor to get more pills / Medicine. Could be sugar pills for all they know.

This is the Thai way, which is of course totally unacceptable to us foreigners.

An doctors are horrified that we start to get into self medication. LOL

One doctor was treating my GF for asthma for some time (many years ago), when it was clear to everyone else she did not have Asthma. Turned out to be a chronic sinus infection.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1840854]Well I am the same for the balls touching, however it's actually easier in doggy position, reaching underneath, except she has to support herself with just one remaining arm, so she better be a lightweight girl. LOL She can switch arms from time to time. Girls have not complained that it is too difficult, even the GF.[/QUOTE]Yes, the girl switching arms from time to time was what I assumed would be a likely solution. But if the girl is concerned that you might take a long time to cum, wouldn't the strain of a one arm support during prolonged doggie position be a factor in her concern? I mean, it might not just be the potential for a sore pussy. Maybe she is as much if not more concerned about a sore arm, no?

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1840856]Yes this hospital is known to be a rip off. An International private Hospital. They don't want you to buy your medicine at a fraction of the cost somewhere else. Any private hospital can charge a fortune (unwarranted) even for Thais. I use Sukhumvit Hospital at Ekkamai.[/QUOTE]My hospital of choice is St Louis. Private, but non-profit. Drs really take their time with you. And the cost is at least 40% or more less than Bummy or the other boutique privates.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1840986]Yes, the girl switching arms from time to time was what I assumed would be a likely solution. But if the girl is concerned that you might take a long time to cum, wouldn't the strain of a one arm support during prolonged doggie position be a factor in her concern? I mean, it might not just be the potential for a sore pussy. Maybe she is as much if not more concerned about a sore arm, no?[/QUOTE]Ha ha.

No no not at all. The girl does not have to use the one arm constantly. Switching is allowed. She gets criticised if her nails touch my balls too. Cannot stand nails. It has to be delicate. No curling the fingers. Lube or oil can be used. Girls can put pillows under their chest to support their body.

I have heard sore pussy complaint far more often than sore arm. Sore arm usually is associated with handjobs I believe, but I don't really like handjobs for the most part, and avoid them. Very few girls are sufficiently skilled at HJ the way I might like it. Hate a fast moving hand or a hand that rubs against the skin. Even I struggle to enjoy my own hand plenty of times, but can be useful to get it back hard after a rest break (always left hand) while right hand plays with her body, preferably pussy. BJ is better but that assumes her BJ skills are really good.

Digits in pussy while getting a super BBBJ is one of my favourite things. Normally she lies down on her side and I am vertical on knees in front of her mouth. This is the position that suits me best for getting to CIM these days, given I don't cum easily. Sometimes 69 can work well too and be quiet blissful. I think of my 69 with JJ at Addict. I did not want to cum however as wanted to do other positions first. She must have the technique that suited me, or I was exceptionally horny.

Many things are possible for me at a BJ bar provided they have a couch of a reasonable width where at least girl can lie on it. A chair only, is bit limiting for me, then I would automatically go for the special room. While I have been to Dr. BJ for a BJ only, it is probably not going to happen like that any more. I am greedy and always get frustrated if I am restricted in what can be done, and I need options in case the BJ was weak or just ordinary for me.

[QUOTE=Amorbasha;1840648]Hi everyone,

Not too sure if this is the right place to post this. I needed to see a Dr. Google search showed Bumrungrad hospital nearby. There are more than one building, you need to go to the clinic one. Info downstairs refer first timers to 10th floor for registration. Filed paperwork, asked to see a dermatologist, they asked more questions and issued a Hospital card which has a hospital number plus a wrist bracelet (you will need the number to access the hospital WiFi). Skin section is on the 12th floor. You give them your registration papers and wait. They call your name, take some basic measurements eg weight, hight, BP etc. Back to waiting. Call your name again to see Dr. I knew what I had already but expressed my concern about bleeding. Biopsy advised. Accepted advice and back to waiting, paying and giving more information to be emailed the results. And. Be. You will need your passport or a copy. Bill before test takes place (I guess they wanted to make sure you have the money) I have been told consult would be 1000-2000 Baht and I thought that is equivalent to gap payment back home so no dramas. Bill came after test 7500 Baht 312 AUD, far out. I didn't want to look like a dick so, I paid and biopsy was done..[/QUOTE]Avoid Bumrungrad and mos international hospitals. In the past 2 years, they have all gone completely profit. I was charged 23,000 baht for routine bloodwork and a sinus infection. They also intentionally withheld information about how / why / what I was sick with (I had to learn about why I was sick later, and they withhold test results until you pay their crazy price). I went to a better hospital and was treated at a price of 2000 baht.

Having spent a lot of time in go-go's in Bangkok and Pattaya over the past 10 days, there are some things that surprise me. And some details that I find more and more annoying:

1) Girls not dancing or trying to make eye contact; they seems to be little interested in making money and do not create a good wibe in the club. Too shy? Or instructed by the managers? Lazy?

2) Lack of basic English. Can really not blame the girls. But still very annoying.

3) Some constantly pad my belly. Very annoying. I hate it!. I am a fairly athletic built man and I do not have a big belly at all. The girls seems to do it to "make funny" but it just gets me in a bad mood. I would never dream of poking a girl in their belly the same way they do to customers.

4) Pushy waiters. We all hate it I guess. Some are plain rude and should find another job.

5) [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord109][CodeWord109][/url] smell and dirt. Amazing to witness how some bars can not even keep a basic sanitary standard.

6) Bad managed bars. Some bars can not even basic stuff like instructing their girls or staff members. Why are the floor managers there?

7) Fat, ugly girls. What is the point? Don't the bar owner see them?

Look at bars like Happy, Baccara and Beach Club (Pattaya. Same group); well run. No bullshit. Nice girls. Making money, but maybe too "effective" for some punters that care for a more laidback style. In the end the most important factor for a bar is to have pretty girls. As punters we always look for this quality and I guess most of us are willing to put up with a lot of the other shit just to settle in with sexy, cute dancers on stage. However, amazingly many bars fall short on very basic details. How difficult can it be to run a go-go properly?

[QUOTE=ParkVille;1841071]Avoid Bumrungrad and mos international hospitals. In the past 2 years, they have all gone completely profit. I was charged 23,000 baht for routine bloodwork and a sinus infection. They also intentionally withheld information about how / why / what I was sick with (I had to learn about why I was sick later, and they withhold test results until you pay their crazy price). I went to a better hospital and was treated at a price of 2000 baht.[/QUOTE]I haven't used these 2 myself but a big thanks for the warning. I have heard similar stories for private hospitals even for a Thai bargirl being treated for ridiculous prices.

[QUOTE=Aviator12;1841130]Having spent a lot of time in go-go's in Bangkok and Pattaya over the past 10 days, there are some things that surprise me. And some details that I find more and more annoying:

1) Girls not dancing or trying to make eye contact; they seems to be little interested in making money and do not create a good wibe in the club. Too shy? Or instructed by the managers? Lazy?

2) Lack of basic English. Can really not blame the girls. But still very annoying.

3) Some constantly pad my belly. Very annoying. I hate it!. I am a fairly athletic built man and I do not have a big belly at all. The girls seems to do it to "make funny" but it just gets me in a bad mood. I would never dream of poking a girl in their belly the same way they do to customers.

4) Pushy waiters.We all hate it I guess. Some are plain rude and should find another job.

5) smell and dirt. Amazing to witness how some bars can not even keep a basic sanitary standard.

6) Bad managed bars. Some bars can not even basic stuff like instructing their girls or staff members. Why are the floor managers there?

7) Fat, ugly girls. What is the point? Don't the bar owner see them?

Look at bars like Happy, Baccara and Beach Club (Pattaya. Same group); well run. No bullshit. Nice girls. Making money, but maybe too "effective" for some punters that care for a more laidback style. In the end the most important factor for a bar is to have pretty girls. As punters we always look for this quality and I guess most of us are willing to put up with a lot of the other shit just to settle in with sexy, cute dancers on stage. However, amazingly many bars fall short on very basic details. How difficult can it be to run a go-go properly?[/QUOTE]Wow all of these are common complaints. You could add that the manager seems to know best and doesn't want to know what the customer thinks.

Causes can be corruption, nepotism, arrogance. Etc.

1. Simply bad management possibly contributed to by having a DJ that does not choose really music good to dance to. Girls not making eye contact is only a problem in your mind. Some are too shy, some have a mind elsewhere, e. G. In Baccara can be looking into space bored out of their brains. I don't have a problem. I don't expect girls to eyeing me off like I was Brad Pitt or something. If I want a girl I will soon enough do whatever it takes to get her attention. I prefer to be the persuer.

2. Good English is not seen as a requirement. She will learn soon enough, is the attitude. Mamasans are go between so they have to have good English.

3. Maybe girls are checking if you have a six pack. LOL For me its usually asking how many months pregnant I am especially if any change in my weight. No big deal for me.

4. Annoying waitresses exist in any bar. I just try to find a good one and ignore the bad ones. Sometimes management causes every staff member to be too pushy. I could not stand a visit to Rainbow 3 a few years back. All the staff seemed to be relentlessly annoying. That is bad management. Maybe I just needed to chill a bit longer till I found a better staff member.

5. Bad smell not uncommon in Thailand. Drain ppes are notorious. If its only in the toilet, I can probably stand it, however regular cleaning needs to occur.

6. Bad management. What can I say. Arrogance, not willing to listen, nepotism, lazyiness etc.

7. fat girls. If did not take fat girls some bars would have no girls at all. The monthly salary can be too low. Sometimes a group of female friends arrives at a bar. If the bar does not take every girl in the group, the entire group will move to apply for work in a different bar. This can be overcome by offering a better salary. That is how Crazy House got started with a small but very good line up. Now rhe numbers have risen it is hard to maintain the standard, but still have few fatties.

You can always vote with your feet of you are really pissed off. Won't help anything.

For me the bar firstly has to have some real lookers. I have to be able to find fun natural girls and avoid being hassled constantly. I have found ways to do that. Having a favourite waitress helps me a lot.

[QUOTE=Aviator12;1841130]However, amazingly many bars fall short on very basic details. How difficult can it be to run a go-go properly? [/QUOTE]I have no idea how difficult it can be. Did you ever try to run an agogo club in Thailand?

I will try to make a few (very) late reports from my last visit in BKK. I have been a few more times before so I wasn't a newbie.

First night, just got off the plane, went to my hotel in Sukhumvit and hit the streets. As it was already 2 am, the bars were closed, but it was OK, as I am not so much of a big fan of taking girls from bars.

As I was walking along Sukhumvit I was kind of surprised of seeing so many African WG and their Pimps. I mean, every year there were a few, but now it seemed they were a lot. You could even say they were kind of exclusive after a certain hour in the area. As I was going to find out later, their number increased a lot, and they filled the street bars along Sukhumvit.

I just wanted to start my trip with some Asian lady so I just went down Soi 4. There were a lot more Asian girl but, I was thinking because is was so late, there wasn't any stunner. I wanted one for a short time only so I would accept just as any OK looks girl but with good attitude.

As I passed the Rajak (I'm not sure about the spelling) , one lady approached me and showed me on her mobile phone a movie. That intrigued me as my biggest fetish are amateur movies. She showed me how good she is at deep throat. Well, as her looks were OK and I liked the attitude I decided to proceed. I just asked her if she will allow me to take a video while we are fucking (only for my personal use of course) . After a short moment of reluctance, she accepted.

We went back to the hotel, agreeing a 2200 baht price for 2 pops oral, normal, anal, COF and video. As she got the money, she suddenly lost her friendliness and GFE disappeared. She sucked me, than I fucked her, we did some anal as well, but not so much and then I finished in her face. The second pop was mainly the same except the finish that was COB. In between she showed me some movies of her having sex with customers and told me a lot of bullshit about her life. I found out that she has a website and that she is into dominations, [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord100][CodeWord100][/url] and our things, and she (allegedly) works the street only when she doesn't have any customers. Kind of hard to believe as I've seen her almost every night out there.

Looks 6.5.

GFE 3 (at start it was around 7, still a little bit aggressive).

Sex 7 (good DT, nothing special about the rest of it, extra point for Video and for COF).

P.S. This is my first post so please don't start trowing with stones if I did anything wrong. I am happy to adapt my other reports from my holiday to the rules, maybe a little shorter?

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1841170]I haven't used these 2 myself but a big thanks for the warning. I have heard similar stories for private hospitals even for a Thai bargirl being treated for ridiculous prices.[/QUOTE]My single experience at Bumrungrad was excellent. I went to visit a cardiologist there for a routine exam, including a stress test. My total bill, including medication was about $200, and the service was completely professional, very efficient and friendly.

GE.

[QUOTE=Aviator12;1841130]Having spent a lot of time in go-go's in Bangkok and Pattaya over the past 10 days, there are some things that surprise me. And some details that I find more and more annoying:

1) Girls not dancing or trying to make eye contact; they seems to be little interested in making money and do not create a good wibe in the club. Too shy? Or instructed by the managers? Lazy?[/QUOTE]There are a few possible reasons, the first, she isn't interested in you. The good part, you're not wasting money buying her a drink. Another reason, it may still all be new to her. She hasn't been there long enough to learn how to milk the last baht out of the customers.

[QUOTE]
2) Lack of basic English. Can really not blame the girls. But still very annoying.[/QUOTE]It's Thailand.

[QUOTE]
3) Some constantly pad my belly. Very annoying. I hate it!. I am a fairly athletic built man and I do not have a big belly at all. The girls seems to do it to "make funny" but it just gets me in a bad mood. I would never dream of poking a girl in their belly the same way they do to customers.[/QUOTE]They probably figure the belly is a safe spot.

[QUOTE]
4) Pushy waiters. We all hate it I guess. Some are plain rude and should find another job.[/QUOTE]Management wants to make a profit, selling drinks helps. Without pushy waiters half the seats would be filled with old punters who just want to see some young flesh, but don't want to spend any money.

[QUOTE]
5) ... smell and dirt. Amazing to witness how some bars can not even keep a basic sanitary standard.[/QUOTE]It's Thailand. Sanitary and sewage systems are probably not the greatest. But if the bar is too dirty, move on until you find a clean one.

[QUOTE]
6) Bad managed bars. Some bars can not even basic stuff like instructing their girls or staff members. Why are the floor managers there?[/QUOTE]Floor managers are there either to keep things running smoothly or because someone's worthless cousin needed a job.

[QUOTE]
7) Fat, ugly girls. What is the point? Don't the bar owner see them?[/QUOTE]For some of the customers, the fatter the better. It's not my preference, but there are plenty who like them chubby. As for ugly, everyone has different preferences. Should every club only bring in girls that meet your specifications?

[QUOTE]
Look at bars like Happy, Baccara and Beach Club (Pattaya. Same group); well run. No bullshit. Nice girls. Making money, but maybe too "effective" for some punters that care for a more laidback style. In the end the most important factor for a bar is to have pretty girls. As punters we always look for this quality and I guess most of us are willing to put up with a lot of the other shit just to settle in with sexy, cute dancers on stage. However, amazingly many bars fall short on very basic details. How difficult can it be to run a go-go properly?[/QUOTE]In the end, the most important thing is for the bar to turn a profit. If a bar doesn't meet your requirements, spend your money at one that does. Review the bars and let people know which ones you like or dislike and why. This will cut the profits of the bad and boost profits of the good. Eventually the bad places may improve.

How difficult can it be to run a gogo properly?

Let's see, there's vendors to deal with to make sure they aren't shorting on deliveries, employees to watch to make sure they aren't stealing, facilities to monitor for cleanliness and maintenance issues, scheduling, training, advising and supervising girls, managing personality conflicts between employees, customers to watch, assist, advise or remove, police and other officials to pay off, and a few dozen other things to deal with. Doesn't seem hard at all.

[QUOTE=Aviator12;1841130]Having spent a lot of time in go-go's in Bangkok and Pattaya over the past 10 days, there are some things that surprise me. And some details that I find more and more annoying:

1) Girls not dancing or trying to make eye contact; they seems to be little interested in making money and do not create a good wibe in the club. Too shy? Or instructed by the managers? Lazy?

2) Lack of basic English. Can really not blame the girls. But still very annoying.

3) Some constantly pad my belly. Very annoying. I hate it!. I am a fairly athletic built man and I do not have a big belly at all. The girls seems to do it to "make funny" but it just gets me in a bad mood. I would never dream of poking a girl in their belly the same way they do to customers.

4) Pushy waiters. We all hate it I guess. Some are plain rude and should find another job.

5) smell and dirt. Amazing to witness how some bars can not even keep a basic sanitary standard.

6) Bad managed bars. Some bars can not even basic stuff like instructing their girls or staff members. Why are the floor managers there?

7) Fat, ugly girls. What is the point? Don't the bar owner see them?

Look at bars like Happy, Baccara and Beach Club (Pattaya. Same group); well run. No bullshit. Nice girls. Making money, but maybe too "effective" for some punters that care for a more laidback style. In the end the most important factor for a bar is to have pretty girls. As punters we always look for this quality and I guess most of us are willing to put up with a lot of the other shit just to settle in with sexy, cute dancers on stage. However, amazingly many bars fall short on very basic details. How difficult can it be to run a go-go properly?[/QUOTE]Very good post. And spot on as to how most bars are lacking. Truth be told when drinks were 80 Baht (2 USD at the time), BF was 400- 500 Baht (10-12.50 USD at the time), and the gal was 1000 Baht (25 USD), then it really didn't matter. Getting a bit of a buzz and getting laid would cost you all of 50 USD. You were paying peanuts so these issues were kind of charming in a way. Now that you are paying way over 100 USD for the privilege, it's not cute at all.

Just FYI, a few years back I had a some STD tests done at the Thai Red Cross on Ratchadamri Rd. You can probably get your STI panel done here very cheaply. Its also completely anonymous if I remember correctly.

[QUOTE=Amorbasha;1840648]Hi everyone,

Not too sure if this is the right place to post this. I needed to see a Dr. Google search showed Bumrungrad hospital nearby. There are more than one building, you need to go to the clinic one. Info downstairs refer first timers to 10th floor for registration. Filed paperwork, asked to see a dermatologist, they asked more questions and issued a Hospital card which has a hospital number plus a wrist bracelet (you will need the number to access the hospital WiFi). Skin section is on the 12th floor. You give them your registration papers and wait. They call your name, take some basic measurements eg weight, hight, BP etc. Back to waiting. Call your name again to see Dr. I knew what I had already but expressed my concern about bleeding. Biopsy advised. Accepted advice and back to waiting, paying and giving more information to be emailed the results. And. Be. You will need your passport or a copy. Bill before test takes place (I guess they wanted to make sure you have the money) I have been told consult would be 1000-2000 Baht and I thought that is equivalent to gap payment back home so no dramas. Bill came after test 7500 Baht 312 AUD, far out. I didn't want to look like a dick so, I paid and biopsy was done. Some antibiotics cream after settlement (I got back 150 Baht!.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=JjBee62;1841313]There are a few possible reasons, the first, she isn't interested in you. The good part, you're not wasting money buying her a drink. Another reason, it may still all be new to her. She hasn't been there long enough to learn how to milk the last baht out of the customers.

Management wants to make a profit, selling drinks helps. Without pushy waiters half the seats would be filled with old punters who just want to see some young flesh, but don't want to spend any money.

For some of the customers, the fatter the better. It's not my preference, but there are plenty who like them chubby. As for ugly, everyone has different preferences. Should every club only bring in girls that meet your specifications?[/QUOTE]Yes I agree with all of these. Why does anyone complain that a girl does not make eye contact. Thailand is a prudish country and newbie girls are too fucking shy. Some of the most ugly girls are also the most raunchy and get customers by doing things like eyeing the customer, and dancing with her pussy almost in the customers face. I dislike these girls that are coming on too strong (especially as they are usually ugly). The are a very small number of pretty girls that are not so shy and play up to her customer just a little in a sexy way without being too low class. Jane / Jaeng number 4 at CH is one such girl who is constantly booked out with new and repeat customers. Not much tits, brown skin, but cute face, cute ass, and shows off her cute crotch nicely.

The bar has to make a profit and if its got a good line up the monthly salaries will be high. This and the waiting staff have to be paid. Without guys buying drinks regularly, it cannot work. A guy sitting for 2 or 3 hours on a single bottle of water is a waste of space, and staff will know they have a duty to get such a customer pissed off, so he will leave in a bad mood. This type of customer is not wanted. Even so some waitresses are too eager to get next drink order too soon, and before last drink is close to finished. Just find a sensible moderate waitress.

In Mercury bar, I found that all of the gogo girls were far too chubby for me except two girls, and the coyote girls were generally slim enough, yet Indian or similar customers would come into the bar and choose the ones too chubby for me, possibly with big sillies. They probably thought my girls were suffering malnutrition. One of my best buddies always took voluptuous (chubby) girls and called my girls bag of bones or skeleton girls.

[QUOTE=OneRose;1841272]I will try to make a few (very) late reports from my last visit in BKK. I have been a few more times before so I wasn't a newbie.

SNIP

As I passed the Rajak (I'm not sure about the spelling) , one lady approached me and showed me on her mobile phone a movie.

We went back to the hotel, agreeing a 2200 baht price for 2 pops oral, normal, anal, COF and video. As she got the money, she suddenly lost her friendliness and GFE disappeared.

SNIP

P.S. This is my first post so please don't start trowing with stones if I did anything wrong. I am happy to adapt my other reports from my holiday to the rules, maybe a little shorter?[/QUOTE]You say you are not a newbie and I assume you have read the forum properly. Paying upfront before the agreed upon services are delivered is one of the worst rookie mistakes to make.

No other comments, we all learn more by sharing so keep the reports coming pal.

She caught my eye as perhaps the best looking girl in CH, certainly with the nicest rack.

But she was tricky and hustled me for a double ladies drink--and I am not easily hustled.

I asked her first whether she had a customer and could be barfined (in Thai). She said no, no customer yet, and yes, she could barfine no problem. So I sprung for the overpriced tequila + coke, with the understanding that we would pay bar and go back to my place after for ST.

She started checking out my package and acting scared of my size. I am not small, but this gal is a hardened pro, it was just an act. When it came time to pay bar, mamasan came over and said she'd need to collect the ST fee in addition to the barfine. I told her no way, I pay the girl later, not now in the bar. Mamasan at first tried to tell me this is standard operating procedure, but when I explained to her that I'd lived in Thailand for years and never paid for a girl's services in advance at the bar, she backed off and acknowledged that Ging was making that demand. I cut bait. Ging acted very fishy and could not be trusted. I made peace with mamasan and explained to her that Ging just cost her a tip by wasting my time and money. Her looks are no way worth the attitude and the attempt to grab my cash without providing any service is not appreciated.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1841360]
The bar has to make a profit and if its got a good line up the monthly salaries will be high. This and the waiting staff have to be paid. Without guys buying drinks regularly, it cannot work. A guy sitting for 2 or 3 hours on a single bottle of water is a waste of space, and staff will know they have a duty to get such a customer pissed off, so he will leave in a bad mood. This type of customer is not wanted. Even so some waitresses are too eager to get next drink order too soon, and before last drink is close to finished. Just find a sensible moderate waitress.[/QUOTE]Agree on this. My comment on pushy waiters was related to pushing for choosing a girl on stage. In some bars I see this is common, Rainbow Bar in Nana is one of them. I do not care if they ask me to buy a new drink for myself, that is their job. I drink a lot but cannot drink with both hands. It seems more difficult to find a good waiter than to find a good girl. LOL. Bars need to make profit but there is different strategies to obtain this. In a bar like Rainbow 4 (Or Rainbow are&be now?) it seems like the girls are instructed to be very composed and not overly "play" with customers from the stage. Does anybody know if this is a clear instruction from the bar management or just a "tradition"? In some bars the girls are very active. And in some others they do not interact. My guess is that it is all instructed, but I don't know.

I have been to a massage place where I see a regular. While waiting for her another provider made a long eye contact with a spark that gave me immediate hard-on. The question is weather to take the new, younger girl with the promising wink and risking upsetting my regular or stick to my guns and choose the the lady I came for who provide super duper service. Decisions decisions!

[QUOTE=OneRose;1841272]I will try to make a few (very) late reports from my last visit in BKK. I have been a few more times before so I wasn't a newbie.
P.S. This is my first post so please don't start trowing with stones if I did anything wrong. I am happy to adapt my other reports from my holiday to the rules, maybe a little shorter?[/QUOTE]Report was perfect, has all ingredients. If taken, a picture would be icing on the cake.

Only remark to be made is 2200 for 2 pops at that time of the night. She should have been happy with 1500 for an extended ST.

On the other hand you ended spending what you would have spent if taking her from a bar (fee, barfine, drinks, maybe a top).

[QUOTE=Zuperfly;1841495]She caught my eye as perhaps the best looking girl in CH, certainly with the nicest rack.

But she was tricky and hustled me for a double ladies drink--and I am not easily hustled. I told her no way, I pay the girl later, not now in the bar. Mamasan at first tried to tell me this is standard operating procedure, but when I explained to her that I'd lived in Thailand for years and never paid for a girl's services in advance at the bar, she backed off and acknowledged that Ging was making that demand. I cut bait. Ging acted very fishy and could not be trusted. I made peace with mamasan and explained to her that Ging just cost her a tip by wasting my time and money. Her looks are no way worth the attitude and the attempt to grab my cash without providing any service is not appreciated.[/QUOTE]Well managed! The way to go.

Second lady had to be an African babe. Had to be because I was really into some chocolate for the night.

As I was saying, there is a lot of black beauty along Sukhumvit. I had a little bit of trouble trying to ignore the 'protectors' but I found a few that were not sitting at tables in the end. I had to ask a few until I found one that agreed to let me take a video of the deed and we went back to the room.

We agreed a 2500 baht price for long time, oral normal COF and video. She was a beautiful 23-24 yo lady, with very dark skin, small tits and very big bubble butt. She was clean, shaved, and quite friendly. Her English was average, way over the normal Thai WG level. She was Ugandan, as most of the girls on the streets of BKK.

As we proceeded to the deed, I found out that her breast were saggy in an unpleasant way but, at least, the ass was great. She was very submissive but cold in the same time. The lack of initiative was somehow bothering me but I guess for 50 euros a night you can't really expect more. She blew me covered, than I fucked her in a lot of positions and I finished on her face. In the morning we repeated.

I would rate it as a good experience, except from one thing that made me wonder my whole trip: after we went to sleep she spoke on her phone with someone (no idea if man or woman) and told her / him in a very easy to understand code (I guess she thought I was asleep) in which hotel she is and the room. Call me paranoid but I didn't close an eye that night as I was waiting for someone to come and steal from the room (even though the hotel has quite a reasonable security despite it's low price, and my belongings were anyway in the safe box).

I might be crazy but, it really woke me up to reality, realizing the kind of danger at which we are exposing ourselves during a LT. Even though I am doing this since many years now, I always underestimated the dangers of it. We trust our safety and our belongings in the hands of some (easy corruptible) hotel clerks.

Maybe I am just getting older, but that night, while listening to my girl snoring as I couldn't sleep, I decided to drastically reduce the number of LT that I'm going to do in the next years.

Back to the lady, in the morning, after the second round, she got her money, we kissed good bye and way she went.

Looks: 7.5 (ass was great, face was cute, tits were really bad).

Service: 8 (good suck but no DT, good fuck but lack of initiative, extra point for submissiveness, COF and video).

[QUOTE=Zuperfly;1841495]She caught my eye as perhaps the best looking girl in CH, certainly with the nicest rack.

But she was tricky and hustled me for a double ladies drink--and I am not easily hustled.

I asked her first whether she had a customer and could be barfined (in Thai). She said no, no customer yet, and yes, she could barfine no problem. So I sprung for the overpriced tequila + coke, with the understanding that we would pay bar and go back to my place after for ST.

She started checking out my package and acting scared of my size. I am not small, but this gal is a hardened pro, it was just an act. When it came time to pay bar, mamasan came over and said she'd need to collect the ST fee in addition to the barfine. I told her no way, I pay the girl later, not now in the bar. Mamasan at first tried to tell me this is standard operating procedure, but when I explained to her that I'd lived in Thailand for years and never paid for a girl's services in advance at the bar, she backed off and acknowledged that Ging was making that demand. I cut bait. Ging acted very fishy and could not be trusted. I made peace with mamasan and explained to her that Ging just cost her a tip by wasting my time and money. Her looks are no way worth the attitude and the attempt to grab my cash without providing any service is not appreciated.[/QUOTE]I am smiling ear to ear. Most awesome sir. If more punters took your attitude we would all be getting better service.

[QUOTE=BionicMan;1841605]Report was perfect, has all ingredients. If taken, a picture would be icing on the cake.

Only remark to be made is 2200 for 2 pops at that time of the night. She should have been happy with 1500 for an extended ST.

On the other hand you ended spending what you would have spent if taking her from a bar (fee, barfine, drinks, maybe a top).[/QUOTE]You are right, but all the bars were closed and there wasn't too much of a choice. And it was the first night in TH after a long time, I still had to adapt to the local prices.

[QUOTE=Zuperfly;1841495]She caught my eye as perhaps the best looking girl in CH, certainly with the nicest rack.

But she was tricky and hustled me for a double ladies drink--and I am not easily hustled.

I asked her first whether she had a customer and could be barfined (in Thai). She said no, no customer yet, and yes, she could barfine no problem. So I sprung for the overpriced tequila + coke, with the understanding that we would pay bar and go back to my place after for ST.

She started checking out my package and acting scared of my size. I am not small, but this gal is a hardened pro, it was just an act. When it came time to pay bar, mamasan came over and said she'd need to collect the ST fee in addition to the barfine. I told her no way, I pay the girl later, not now in the bar. Mamasan at first tried to tell me this is standard operating procedure, but when I explained to her that I'd lived in Thailand for years and never paid for a girl's services in advance at the bar, she backed off and acknowledged that Ging was making that demand. I cut bait. Ging acted very fishy and could not be trusted. I made peace with mamasan and explained to her that Ging just cost her a tip by wasting my time and money. Her looks are no way worth the attitude and the attempt to grab my cash without providing any service is not appreciated.[/QUOTE]Its standard practice for girls to try it on to get two drinks. Doesn't mean the customer has to agree. I have agreed on occasions if I know where I am going with the girl. A new girl, no way.

Ging has been ripped off by several customers that did not pay for the ST at all. Hence girls get very scared of being ripped off and has become common to request payment in advance. They don't want to fuck for free. I have never paid in advance myself but as I am well known at the bar, it's not a problem. It's standard for mamasans to ask for payment in advance, never mind whether they are blaming the girl or not. I talk to girls first and just give her the barfine to take to mamasan. I don't need a mamasan involved. However I am not typical.

My first ever CH girl Mint was trying to insist on up front payment for a LT. No way. She could have been a disaster and need to be sent packing with only a ST fee.

So mutual distrust is serious problem in a bar. Ging has plenty of regulars though. Young girls can be a little on the selfish side of course, but she gets away with it through popularity and very happy personality.

I have been with Ging maybe 4 times and found her to be responsive on the bed, and very nice feeling pussy. Kissing okay And BJ okay Not magnificent skills but she can be hot for it. Sensitive. Yes a bit scared of large size, but no where near as much as many other girls. If you are above average and a hard bang bang fucker, many young girls will have a problem. It's normal. Some girls say O.K. but go gentle and not too long duration. Unfortuantely I am long duration. Oom is a girl liking strong fucking unlike most girls. Hard for her to make it.

"Hardened Pro"? Not really. Although she may have started a couple of years back, she has been missing for very long periods frequently. I never even met her till 2nd half of last year, despite being a long term regular.

Only Donut in the bar, would I possibly choose sometimes in preference to Ging. Do have other favourites though.

Maybe bad luck for you that you decided to miss out. YMMV. She wouldn't be too concerned . Too many alternative options show up in within first hour or two of work. One of the very busiest girls possibly behind No. 4 Jane/Jaeng.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1841633]Its standard practice for girls to try it on to get two drinks. Doesn't mean the customer has to agree. I have agreed on occasions if I know where I am going with the girl. A new girl, no way.

Ging has been ripped off by several customers that did not pay for the ST at all. Hence girls get very scared of being ripped off and has become common to request payment in advance. They don't want to fuck for free. I have never paid in advance myself but as I am well known at the bar, it's not a problem. It's standard for mamasans to ask for payment in advance, never mind whether they are blaming the girl or not. I talk to girls first and just give her the barfine to take to mamasan. I don't need a mamasan involved. However I am not typical.

My first ever CH girl Mint was trying to insist on up front payment for a LT. No way. She could have been a disaster and need to be sent packing with only a ST fee.

So mutual distrust is serious problem in a bar. Ging has plenty of regulars though. Young girls can be a little on the selfish side of course, but she gets away with it through popularity and very happy personality.

I have been with Ging maybe 4 times and found her to be responsive on the bed, and very nice feeling pussy. Kissing okay And BJ okay Not magnificent skills but she can be hot for it. Sensitive. Yes a bit scared of large size, but no where near as much as many other girls.

"Hardened Pro"? Not really. Although she may have started a couple of years back, she has been missing for very long periods frequently. I never even met her till 2nd half of last year, despite being a long term regular.

Only Donut in the bar, would I possibly choose sometimes in preference to Ging. Do have other favourites though.[/QUOTE]Never in my time in BKK has it been standard practice to pay upfront to the Momason in a Suk area go go, Nana or Soi Cowboy. I can think of only one reason she chose this and it's that CH is becoming the most popular bar on Soi Cowboy and they are testing the waters now to see what they can get away with. However paying upfront in the bar is common practice at the Thai go go bars frequented by the locals. I have been spending a great deal of time in the Sephan Kwai bars recently and always pay 2000ST or 2600 LT at the bar and not once did I have a problem with bad service. I can speak mediocor Thai and I always make friends with the staff and tip well. This scene is great. 2600 LT, 1,000 for Lady drinks and my beers, and 500 tip for the moma. 4,100 for a night out drinking and sex with a white skinned 22 year old hottie. On Nana or Soi cowboy I would have been in for about 6,000-8,000 for the same. Love it!

[QUOTE=Bkkdog;1841639]Never in my time in BKK has it been standard practice to pay upfront to the Momason in a Suk area go go, Nana or Soi Cowboy. I can think of only one reason she chose this and it's that CH is becoming the most popular bar on Soi Cowboy and they are testing the waters now to see what they can get away with. However paying upfront in the bar is common practice at the Thai go go bars frequented by the locals. I have been spending a great deal of time in the Sephan Kwai bars recently and always pay 2000ST or 2600 LT at the bar and not once did I have a problem with bad service. I can speak mediocor Thai and I always make friends with the staff and tip well. This scene is great. 2600 LT, 1,000 for Lady drinks and my beers, and 500 tip for the moma. 4,100 for a night out drinking and sex with a white skinned 22 year old hottie. On Nana or Soi cowboy I would have been in for about 6,000-8,000 for the same. Love it![/QUOTE]Thais can't be trusted. Likewise certain foreigners seem not be trusted too. Most MPs have changed to up front payment.

Girls being ripped off became all too common. Even in places like Tulip, mango, SW etc. Ask any of the girls.

[QUOTE=Amorbasha;1841589]I have been to a massage place where I see a regular. While waiting for her another provider made a long eye contact with a spark that gave me immediate hard-on. The question is weather to take the new, younger girl with the promising wink and risking upsetting my regular or stick to my guns and choose the the lady I came for who provide super duper service. Decisions decisions![/QUOTE]Easy. Next time you go there with no plan and hope to bump into the young one. If not you can ask the reception about her name and if she is bookable (of course she is. But pretend you are inquiring). Maybe receptionist will tell your regular one, but hey,. That's life, and they know the don't and can't have exclusivity on customers.

Another way is to ask yo regular if she does 4-hand massage with somebody else, hinting you saw one who is new and maybe not fully experience. A good investment t check the skills of the young one.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1841633] Ging has been ripped off by several customers that did not pay for the ST at all. Hence girls get very scared of being ripped off and has become common to request payment in advance. They don't want to fuck for free. [/QUOTE]I have never heard this story from the girls I have been with. But it seems other customers hear these stories from the girls they have been with, so I suppose there are such stories to tell. I know there are assholes out there. But how often would a man who wants to find a beautiful girl for the night who treats him well in the room decide upon striking gold with that damned hard to find combination that this is the perfect opportunity to save 2000-2500 baht, never be treated to her treasures and service again and most certainly be marked lousy in that bar forever by dodging payment entirely? Something just doesn't smell right about this story some bargirls tell other customers but have never told me.

This Ging girl is beautiful, supposedly the best looking girl in one of the hottest go-go bars in Asia if not the entire world and apparently gives decent service in the room worth the money she demands. Yet she has managed with only a few months off and on in the business over a couple of years to be plagued by enough (several?) guys willing to scoff at the presumably utterly disposable combination of fabulous looks and worthy service / performance in the room to rip her off that her standard policy now with any newcomers is to get the mamasan to collect it all upfront? Seriously?

Something doesn't compute. Either she has discovered she really isn't worth the money once the hotel room door closes and she is alone with the customer or that girl has the worst luck in all of Thailand's go-go bars in choosing new customers.

Personally, if a mamasan or a girl in one of the most popular, standing room only go-go bars on the planet told me that the reason she needs to collect the money upfront is because "several customers did not pay for (her) ST at all", I would take that as a flashing red warning sign to move on to another girl. I mean, there has got to be a reason for that beyond that there are a lot of assholes out there and/or that she is that unlucky to have been targeted by so many of them in the past and fully expects to be targeted by more of them from now on. One customer who just up and ran out without paying a beautiful girl for decent service, ok. Two customers who shorted her by trying to get away with only paying her 1000 baht or something like that, sure. But SEVERAL customers over the course of a few months during a couple of years who didn't pay her anything at all?! I don't know, man. I guess I'd like to hear those customers' side of the story before I only blame them and not her for that so often recurring outcome.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1841645]Thais can't be trusted. Likewise certain foreigners seem not be trusted too. Most MPs have changed to up front payment.

Girls being ripped off became all too common. Even in places like Tulip, mango, SW etc. Ask any of the girls.[/QUOTE]Not that it matters, but I've never paid upfront in any Suk MP, however it is standard practice to pay upfront in the Ratchada MPs.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1841658]I have never heard this story from the girls I have been with. But it seems other customers hear these stories from the girls they have been with, so I suppose there are such stories to tell. I know there are assholes out there. But how often would a man who wants to find a beautiful girl for the night who treats him well in the room decide upon striking gold with that damned hard to find combination that this is the perfect opportunity to save 2000-2500 baht, never be treated to her treasures and service again and most certainly be marked lousy in that bar forever by dodging payment entirely? Something just doesn't smell right about this story some bargirls tell other customers but have never told me.

This Ging girl is beautiful, supposedly the best looking girl in one of the hottest go-go bars in Asia if not the entire world and apparently gives decent service in the room worth the money she demands. Yet she has managed with only a few months off and on in the business over a couple of years to be plagued by enough (several?) guys willing to scoff at the presumably utterly disposable combination of fabulous looks and worthy service / performance in the room to rip her off that her standard policy now with any newcomers is to get the mamasan to collect it all upfront? Seriously?

Something doesn't compute. Either she has discovered she really isn't worth the money once the hotel room door closes and she is alone with the customer or that girl has the worst luck in all of Thailand's go-go bars in choosing new customers.

Personally, if a mamasan or a girl in one of the most popular, standing room only go-go bars on the planet told me that the reason she needs to collect the money upfront is because "several customers did not pay for (her) ST at all", I would take that as a flashing red warning sign to move on to another girl. I mean, there has got to be a reason for that beyond that there are a lot of assholes out there and/or that she is that unlucky to have been targeted by so many of them. One customer who just up and ran out without paying a beautiful girl for decent service, ok. Two customers who shorted her by trying to get away with only paying her 1000 baht or something like that, sure. But SEVERAL customers over the course of a few months during a couple of years who didn't pay her anything at all?! I don't know, man. I guess I'd like to hear those customers' side of the story before I only blame them and not her for that outcome.[/QUOTE]If it wasn't for Sygs I would completely agree with you, so in this case I will give this provider the benefit of the doubt, enough that I will plan on making a special trip just to snage her.

[QUOTE=Bkkdog;1841667]If it wasn't for Sygs I would completely agree with you, so in this case I will give this provider the benefit of the doubt, enough that I will plan on making a special trip just to snage her.[/QUOTE]Of course, I'm not saying the girls don't tell Syzygies that story. And I have certainly heard girls say "a customer" didn't pay or tried not to pay once upon a time. Girls who have been at it for several years, that is. But as I think back to the very few times either the girl or the mamasan tried more than a little bit to get me to pay upfront in a Thai go-go bar, which I never did but forged ahead and took the girl anyway with a pay after agreement, I also remember thinking at the end of the experience that I understood entirely why this girl wanted the money upfront. And I can't think of one time where I would blame it on evil customers who just didn't appreciate this girl's terrific effort or skills in the room and must have tried to rip her off. It always seemed to make sense that a lot of guys would balk at paying her nearly as much as the mamasan tried to collect upfront considering the minimal effort she put out. LOL.

[QUOTE=Bkkdog;1841665]Not that it matters, but I've never paid upfront in any Suk MP, however it is standard practice to pay upfront in the Ratchada MPs.[/QUOTE]You do pay in advance At Annies. You usually pay after in any legitimate MP where, then, girl still offers some HJ, nude or not nude. The girl sometimes tries to cash before the service but I always say after.

I pay on arrival at Dubai MP once I set the length and pay the girls later, even if they too to ask for their fee before the service.

[QUOTE=Bkkdog;1841665]Not that it matters, but I've never paid upfront in any Suk MP, however it is standard practice to pay upfront in the Ratchada MPs.[/QUOTE]Some of the Suk PSE oilies have gone to upfront payment (room charge + lady fee) I can remember Mango Massage and Candy Massage from my last trip. It also gives the provider the opportunity to better differentiate a "tip" at the end of the session as that is traditionally where money changed hands.

Not really liking it personally and not the way it used to be.

SL.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1841658]I have never heard this story from the girls I have been with. But it seems other customers hear these stories from the girls they have been with, so I suppose there are such stories to tell. I know there are assholes out there. But how often would a man who wants to find a beautiful girl for the night who treats him well in the room decide upon striking gold with that damned hard to find combination that this is the perfect opportunity to save 2000-2500 baht, never be treated to her treasures and service again and most certainly be marked lousy in that bar forever by dodging payment entirely? Something just doesn't smell right about this story some bargirls tell other customers but have never told me.

This Ging girl is beautiful, supposedly the best looking girl in one of the hottest go-go bars in Asia if not the entire world and apparently gives decent service in the room worth the money she demands. Yet she has managed with only a few months off and on in the business over a couple of years to be plagued by enough (several?) guys willing to scoff at the presumably utterly disposable combination of fabulous looks and worthy service / performance in the room to rip her off that her standard policy now with any newcomers is to get the mamasan to collect it all upfront? Seriously?

Something doesn't compute. Either she has discovered she really isn't worth the money once the hotel room door closes and she is alone with the customer or that girl has the worst luck in all of Thailand's go-go bars in choosing new customers.

Personally, if a mamasan or a girl in one of the most popular, standing room only go-go bars on the planet told me that the reason she needs to collect the money upfront is because "several customers did not pay for (her) ST at all", I would take that as a flashing red warning sign to move on to another girl. I mean, there has got to be a reason for that beyond that there are a lot of assholes out there and/or that she is that unlucky to have been targeted by so many of them in the past and fully expects to be targeted by more of them from now on. One customer who just up and ran out without paying a beautiful girl for decent service, ok. Two customers who shorted her by trying to get away with only paying her 1000 baht or something like that, sure. But SEVERAL customers over the course of a few months during a couple of years who didn't pay her anything at all?! I don't know, man. I guess I'd like to hear those customers' side of the story before I only blame them and not her for that so often recurring outcome.[/QUOTE]Your sarcastic tone and exagerration do not not make a convincing story. Just reads like mocking mocking.

Girls getting ripped off by the customer is not related to their looks or popularity.

You would not hear of these things for two reasons. You don't come across as someone sympathetic to the girls problems, and two you probably never asked any girls how bad the customers can be.

I have asked a variety of girls over the years what tjey thought of the customers. E. the. Tulip Yok, mango Cat, etc. Etc. MP girls have had customers with no money to pay.

What I have heard from various girls has been fairly consistent, so I don't assume they make up lies. What would be the point in that? There is no benefit to them. It's not going to change anything.

Bargirls and in particular newbie inexperienced bargirls get ripped off quite requrlarly, at least this was a major complaint when asked about problems with customers. Not as frequent as guys wanting bareback but still significant. Do you really believe that all customers are honest? Ha ha. Some guys are known to break the condom slyly on purpose.

I have heard many things about bad customers, because I was interested to understand something about the problems of the job.

Possibly very experienced bargirls are better able to suss out which guys are likely not to pay, and hence just refuse them. MP girls don't have same luxury to knock back all the customers that do not appeal to them.

I am also keen not to pay in advance if possible. My worry would be the possibility that with an unknown girl, once she got her money, if she was a bad girl, then could take the slightest oportunity to do a runner. With girls I know and trust, that would not be an issue.

I do recall at a new year's eve party, a freelance type of girl agreed to go with me long time, but actually she had no intention of that. Just wanted a quickie, get the money and head of with her friend somewhere for the new year. A lesson to be learned.

In the end, if neither bargirl nor customer trust each other, then no deal. It's that simple. One of the two has to be persuaded to trust the other, for something to be able to proceed.

It may well be that all of the girls in the bar are not worth what they charge for yourself and many othersm However they demand what they can get away with based on their popularity and may adjust it a bit depending on the particular customer being difficult or easy. All bargirls are over priced right?
The ugly ones go for less I am sure, but I don't bother with those ones.

I have seen reports of very high bargirl prices in Pattaya too now, that shocked me as I thought Pattaya was supposed to be a lot cheaper.

I agree with everything Syz says. He knows what he's talking about. And I understand the attempt to explain Ging's behavior, since he's had positive experiences with her.

But I've logged more hours in Bangkok gogos than I care to remember over the years. And clearly a girl who has been selling pussy for two years on Soi Cowboy is lying if she says she's never been fucked by a big dick. Also it was clear that she and the mamasan were lying about the need to pre-pay.

Yes, I would have liked to fuck her, but since I have already fucked my share of hotties at the bars when they were better looking and performed better, I was not interested in putting my money at risk. I don't feel I missed out. I had every reason to suspect that a crummy session or a runner was in store, and I had done nothing to give the girl or mamasan any reason to suspect I was not going to pay. Quite the contrary, two nights earlier I had barfined a girl from CH and everything was cool. Plus, several of their wait staff used to work at Tilac, where I was a notorious regular for years, so I am not exactly an 'unknown quantity'.

I am not going to speculate why Ging adopted this strategy. It is true that girls sometimes get ripped off, even the 'superstars'.

My report was meant as a 'buyer beware', and also as my only recourse to what I considered squirrelly behavior that cost me money and valuable time at a bar where you got to jump on your prey early and fast.

I realize this discussion won't have any effect on this girl's ability to snag customers, but maybe it will save some board members time and money.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1841784]Your sarcastic tone and exagerration do not not make a convincing story. Just reads like mocking mocking.

Girls getting ripped off by the customer is not related to their looks or popularity.

You would not hear of these things for two reasons. You don't come across as someone sympathetic to the girls problems, and two you probably never asked any girls how bad the customers can be.
[/QUOTE]I have no doubt that if I routinely asked the girls, "Please tell me how bad the customers can be," they would not be stumped for tales of terror to keep me entertained as requested. How embellished and self-serving to their position those stories would be as well as how juicy and entertaining they can be to comply with my request would probably only be limited by their imagination.

I have had two bargirls from two separate bars cry on my shoulder about the difficulty of doing their job over the past 6 months. I suppose you might expect it was because they had gotten ripped off by several customers who didn't pay them anything at all for ST or that they had been forced to do something icky with a bad customer they didn't like and all that. Nope. It was about how much they hated their mamasan / owner for upping the Lady Drink quota and how sick they get when they have to drink so damn much alcohol every night of their working lives. Not one word about how bad their other customers are. Then again, I didn't ask them to supply me with stories about how bad the other customers are and, therefore, how they don't know how to treat them as well as I do.

Btw, I don't think I exaggerated. The words I used and responded to are the ones posted about this already. If it sounds like sarcasm and mockery to you, I can't help that. There just doesn't seem to be any other way to challenge a remarkable pattern of either bad luck or at least SOME level of justifiable non payment the girls who tell you these stories are plagued by.

[QUOTE=Sunlover2;1841728]Some of the Suk PSE oilies have gone to upfront payment (room charge + lady fee) I can remember Mango Massage and Candy Massage from my last trip. It also gives the provider the opportunity to better differentiate a "tip" at the end of the session as that is traditionally where money changed hands.

Not really liking it personally and not the way it used to be.

SL.[/QUOTE]I began noticing this trend maybe a couple of years ago. It seems many of the places ask for the money upfront if they don't recognize you as a customer, and still let you pay later if they know who you are. There have been some instances where someone who didn't know me was at the payment counter, and when they have asked for the money upfront I just told them I would pay later as I always did. That usually has worked but I wouldn't try it at a place I had never frequented previously, like Mitu, which is new enough (I believe) that it likely never in the past had a pay-at-the-end-of-the-session policy (but in fairness probably also is in a different category than what we often refer to as PSE oilies).

I've never heard of these Sephan Kwai bars. Can you elaborate a little on this area? Are there a lot of bars there? How does it compare to Soi cowboy?

[QUOTE=Bkkdog;1841639]Never in my time in BKK has it been standard practice to pay upfront to the Momason in a Suk area go go, Nana or Soi Cowboy. I can think of only one reason she chose this and it's that CH is becoming the most popular bar on Soi Cowboy and they are testing the waters now to see what they can get away with. However paying upfront in the bar is common practice at the Thai go go bars frequented by the locals. I have been spending a great deal of time in the Sephan Kwai bars recently and always pay 2000ST or 2600 LT at the bar and not once did I have a problem with bad service. I can speak mediocor Thai and I always make friends with the staff and tip well. This scene is great. 2600 LT, 1,000 for Lady drinks and my beers, and 500 tip for the moma. 4,100 for a night out drinking and sex with a white skinned 22 year old hottie. On Nana or Soi cowboy I would have been in for about 6,000-8,000 for the same. Love it![/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1841799]I have no doubt that if I routinely asked the girls, "Please tell me how bad the customers can be," they would not be stumped for tales of terror to keep me entertained as requested. How embellished and self-serving to their position those stories would be as well as how juicy and entertaining they can be to comply with my request would probably only be limited by their imagination.

I have had two bargirls from two separate bars cry on my shoulder about the difficulty of doing their job over the past 6 months. I suppose you might expect it was because they had gotten ripped off by several customers who didn't pay them anything at all for ST or that they had been forced to do something icky with a bad customer they didn't like and all that. Nope. It was about how much they hated their mamasan / owner for upping the Lady Drink quota and how sick they get when they have to drink so damn much alcohol every night of their working lives. Not one word about how bad their other customers are. Then again, I didn't ask them to supply me with stories about how bad the other customers are and, therefore, how they don't know how to treat them as well as I do.
[/QUOTE]Your first paragraph is just your knowledgeable fantasizing. You always know would happen if you did something. You cannot accept real information that is contrary to your fantasies. Must always be lies. I report what I see and hear from actual experiences, not imaginings.

Bargirls particular gripe on the day was the mamasan. So what. That is just one example of the problems they face.

Sure all bargirls are liars and tell us nothing but fantasies. Have it your way. So don't go to any bars. Do you like any working girls at all or are they just a piece of meat?

Some of us are trying much harder to understand what is going on, and be able to have our fun, without making girls hate us.

Anyway the reason for upfront payment is very clear, whether at bars or MPs. Episodes of the customer not paying the girl at all, and also episodes of the customer agreeing to pay 2. 5 K (even he did not think the girl could possibly be worth it), and after the deed giving her a vastly reduced sum, saying she wasn't worth the original price, or just taxi money, saying he did not enjoy it. Unfortunately there are no money back guarantees that you will enjoy the fuck. It's a gamble. A contract is a contract but plenty of customers are reneging. It's not like the very old days when nearly all the girls just said it's up to you how much you pay them. That used to be a system that worked out O.K. for them on average as some would underpay and some would overpay. These days, with so much information on the internet guys are more empowered to be always paying bottom prices when they do pay.

So paying up front is simply the way they see to avoid the customer altering the contract after the event. This is really pretty obvious. I am doubtful that each shop will be thinking this is the ideal method for the girl to renege on her duties, although they do realise it can happen too.

As others have said, valued and regular customers at various shops are still given the option to pay later, as those customers already have a reputation for not being a cheat. Many places are thinking we don't need the business of cheats, which are only potential cheats, since they cannot know for sure in advance.

Some guys proudly report on ISG how they sent the girl packing with just taxi money, because she wasn't up to scratch. They just announce themselves as cheats. I am sorry but if you fucked the girl, you have to pay. There is no other option. I am not referring to special cases like she promised two pops and couldn't get you to a second pop or was too tired. I would still pay her provided no clear intent to cheat me. That is tricky, but I am referring to a simple ST booking. If I had a 2 pop agreement with every girl, hell I would never have to pay, right? since I never get to two pops, almost never. Of course this would be the path of a cheat. I am O.K. if a guy negoitiates two prices with the girl, a one pop price and a two pop price, and reasonable time limits. If the girl did her best to get the 2nd pop, she still deserves to be paid for it. Payment for sex is not dependent on a pop. If I don't cum at all, I still pay. With a recent freelancer, her Bj was poor (no experience I guess), and her pussy had no feel at all. Definitely no pop. Bad luck for me. Still have to pay. Still fucked her.

So many cheats exist in society, like the mamasan who refuses to give change, or guy that steals the tip money from the centre pot at a group meal in a restaurant, thinking the tip amount was too high, or just doesn't pay when bill is already covered by tips of others. Sure girls can be cheats too, fortunately has rarely happened to me. I don't trust freelancers too much. They are the most untrustworthy.

The trend towards demanding payment upfront is worrying.

In most service businesses where quality is variable, you pay after the fact. Take restaurants, for instance: you only pay ahead at fast food chains (where you know exactly what you're getting), while in any place with variable quality (even street food if you sit down), they'll let you pay after eating. Most customers don't run away without paying, there is a punishment for that.

In the sex industry, those most at risk of customer not paying are freelancers, and yet, they are rarely in a position to demand money upfront. Bars hire security staff and have police on a retainer, MPs also have doors that can be locked until the customer pays. Sure, there are cheaters and psychopaths out there and non-payment happens, but I don't believe it's too frequent.

In my experience (and it's fairly broad), prostitutes usually insist on upfront payment when they intend to deliver a subpar service for a (relatively) high price, knowing that the customer will contemplate paying less. When they intend to provide standard or good GFE service, they are OK with the customer paying afterwards too. Some take a gamble with "up to you" pricing, and often win big (at least in the old day when sex was cheap and a typical session amazing value from a western perspective).

Most venues with sex on the premises demand payment upfront. It's still a somewhat bad sign (basically that service is borderline value for most customers), but it might be OK at PSE oilies since they have a good reputation for service. Do note that decent oilies give refunds too, I had a flake once at Snow White, and got a full refund (of course, we haven't fucked yet, but did take a shower with some touching and the session went downhill in the first 10 min), so props to them. For whatever reason, that girl no longer works there.

Paying upfront shifts all the risk to the customer, and they're doing it because they can get away with it. In the old times, (a) they couldn't get away with it due to competition and (b) service for the price was generally good enough that not many customers had any misgivings about paying even more than the going rate.

[QUOTE=Crocodilexp;1841897]In my experience (and it's fairly broad), prostitutes usually insist on upfront payment when they intend to deliver a subpar service for a (relatively) high price, knowing that the customer will contemplate paying less. When they intend to provide standard or good GFE service, they are OK with the customer paying afterwards too. Some take a gamble with "up to you" pricing, and often win big (at least in the old day when sex was cheap and a typical session amazing value from a western perspective).

Most venues with sex on the premises demand payment upfront. It's still a somewhat bad sign (basically that service is borderline value for most customers), but it might be OK at PSE oilies since they have a good reputation for service. Do note that decent oilies give refunds too, I had a flake once at Snow White, and got a full refund (of course, we haven't fucked yet, but did take a shower with some touching and the session went downhill in the first 10 min), so props to them. For whatever reason, that girl no longer works there.[/QUOTE]Totaly agree with you! Pay upfront is a big risk for the customer, in fact I never paid upfront any freelancers and avoid the gogo have this rule. If some girl ask for the payment upfront I kindly ask her to leave the room. The only places where sometimes I paid in advance was in PSE oils, but first I talk with the girl and mamasan about which services I want.

[QUOTE=Sunlover2;1841728]Some of the Suk PSE oilies have gone to upfront payment (room charge + lady fee) I can remember Mango Massage and Candy Massage from my last trip. It also gives the provider the opportunity to better differentiate a "tip" at the end of the session as that is traditionally where money changed hands.

Not really liking it personally and not the way it used to be.

SL.[/QUOTE]I was at Mango last week and I always tell them I'll pay after if asked to pay upfront. I've never been refused.

[QUOTE=Bkkdog;1841925]I was at Mango last week and I always tell them I'll pay after if asked to pay upfront. I've never been refused.[/QUOTE]Surely pays being a regular. I feel that other might not get the same experience, bro' Ahahahah.

[QUOTE=BionicMan;1841951]Surely pays being a regular. I feel that other might not get the same experience, bro' Ahahahah.[/QUOTE]I frequent many of the shops in the area on a random and definatly not regular basis, and the only suk MP shop that insists on paymet upfront is Annies. I had actually forgotten about Annies until another poster mentioned it. I normally will hit the same spot for a few times in a row and then move on and repeat the same pattern. I won't end up back at the same shop again for maybe 3 months after I decide to change it up. You don't need to be a regular. You just need to insist on not paying upfront and not look like a broke dick with no money. Smell good, enough with the flip flops, and tank tops. Honestly I work in BKK, speak moderate Thai, and wear a suit everyday so maybe it helps.

[QUOTE=ChristianG;1841906]Totaly agree with you! Pay upfront is a big risk for the customer, in fact I never paid upfront any freelancers and avoid the gogo have this rule. If some girl ask for the payment upfront I kindly ask her to leave the room. The only places where sometimes I paid in advance was in PSE oils, but first I talk with the girl and mamasan about which services I want.[/QUOTE]Actually, paying upfront at most Bangkok MPs is not risky at all, especially if it is a reputable shop that has been around for many years such as Mango, Annies, and Snow White. However go go girls and especially freelancers who demand payment upfront are a clear sign of scam or lousy service. A classic example is paying for LT and then some emergency arises and she promises she will be back or continue the following night. I don't mean paying the go go girl upfront at her bar, but actually after the bar fine and in your room I still refuse to pay her until after the deed. I have lost a few bar fines that way but so be it. Once I was even able to get the BF back from Baccara but I turned around an hour later and Bar fined another lady so it all evened out in the end. On the other hand as I mentioned in a previous post, paying upfront in the bar to the momason and then taking the girl to my room from the local Thai go go's has proven to be ok. I was told if there was a problem, I could come back and change the girl.

What is a good place to buy sex toys in Bangkok?

The street vendors on Suk between Nana and Asoke have only cheap junk.

[QUOTE=DaddySan;1841982]What is a good place to buy sex toys in Bangkok?

The street vendors on Suk between Nana and Asoke have only cheap junk.[/QUOTE]There really isn't. Bring them with you.

[QUOTE=Crocodilexp;1841897]The trend towards demanding payment upfront is worrying.

In most service businesses where quality is variable, you pay after the fact. Take restaurants, for instance: you only pay ahead at fast food chains (where you know exactly what you're getting), while in any place with variable quality (even street food if you sit down), they'll let you pay after eating. Most customers don't run away without paying, there is a punishment for that.

In the sex industry, those most at risk of customer not paying are freelancers, and yet, they are rarely in a position to demand money upfront. Bars hire security staff and have police on a retainer, MPs also have doors that can be locked until the customer pays. Sure, there are cheaters and psychopaths out there and non-payment happens, but I don't believe it's too frequent.

In my experience (and it's fairly broad), prostitutes usually insist on upfront payment when they intend to deliver a subpar service for a (relatively) high price, knowing that the customer will contemplate paying less. When they intend to provide standard or good GFE service, they are OK with the customer paying afterwards too. Some take a gamble with "up to you" pricing, and often win big (at least in the old day when sex was cheap and a typical session amazing value from a western perspective).

Most venues with sex on the premises demand payment upfront. It's still a somewhat bad sign (basically that service is borderline value for most customers), but it might be OK at PSE oilies since they have a good reputation for service. Do note that decent oilies give refunds too, I had a flake once at Snow White, and got a full refund (of course, we haven't fucked yet, but did take a shower with some touching and the session went downhill in the first 10 min), so props to them. For whatever reason, that girl no longer works there.

Paying upfront shifts all the risk to the customer, and they're doing it because they can get away with it. In the old times, (a) they couldn't get away with it due to competition and (b) service for the price was generally good enough that not many customers had any misgivings about paying even more than the going rate.[/QUOTE]Just to play devil's advocate here, there may be another reason for the change to pay first. In recent years the tourist demographics have changed, with an increase of Asian tourists. Most westerners will pay without argument or problem, regardless of the service quality.

However, there are groups with a reputation for being more argumentative, especially when money is involved. Is it possible, there have been a few too many problems with arguments over payment, after the fact, recently?

Just thinking out loud.

[QUOTE=Bkkdog;1841974]I frequent many of the shops in the area on a random and definatly not regular basis, and the only suk MP shop that insists on paymet upfront is Annies. I had actually forgotten about Annies until another poster mentioned it. I normally will hit the same spot for a few times in a row and then move on and repeat the same pattern. I won't end up back at the same shop again for maybe 3 months after I decide to change it up. You don't need to be a regular. You just need to insist on not paying upfront and not look like a broke dick with no money. Smell good, enough with the flip flops, and tank tops. Honestly I work in BKK, speak moderate Thai, and wear a suit everyday so maybe it helps.[/QUOTE]You surprise me. I don't know about insist, but most MPs where I am not well known are taking payment up front. Anyway it makes no difference. The price is all inclusive at many shops and you are expected to pay regardless of on the way in or way out. Probably only Mango knows me well enough to allow me to pay whenever. All soapies take all inclusive payment up front in the modern day, Annies is no exception.

So interesting you would insist to pay afterwards. Don't see the advantage in doing that, unless you intend to cancel after 5 minutes or something. Can you explain?

[QUOTE=JjBee62;1842018]Just to play devil's advocate here, there may be another reason for the change to pay first. In recent years the tourist demographics have changed, with an increase of Asian tourists. Most westerners will pay without argument or problem, regardless of the service quality.

However, there are groups with a reputation for being more argumentative, especially when money is involved. Is it possible, there have been a few too many problems with arguments over payment, after the fact, recently?

Just thinking out loud.[/QUOTE]I don't see the difference between this reason and the others I gave.

I don't know the exact racial demographic of guys that want a free fuck or get angry that service wasn't all they expected. However I assure you that westerners are some of them.

Certainly a common problem with Thais at Soapies. I remember the old days when some soapies had a separate Thai Booran massage fee paid up front and girl was paid separately for the special. I was quite close to a soapy girl 15 years ago, even I dislike Thai massage. LOL. She commented on being cheated by the Thai customers plenty of times. Wasn't too long before they changed to all inclusive fee. It then became clear you could not just go get an "ancient healing massage" alone any more. You had to pay for more than that up front.

I am sure Indians and Chinese, and the full spectrum, suddenly found themselves with no money to pay the girl when girl and massage payments were separate. So shops decided to bring in all inclusive charges.

Is there one super trustworthy race or nationality? I don't know of one, but maybe.

I thought I might share my recent trip to Bangkok although I have a few more days here. Went to Annies the first day but the selection was not to my liking, mostly older women or simply did not fit my taster. Although a number of you pointed out Thailand for Thais, CIS in Russia or Europe, I do not have the necessary means to travel there. For me CIS was to be the highlight of my trip while I would definitely stick to more Thais. So I thought about trying the Rajah and Grace. Went to Rajah at after 10 as instructed by a few members here and as per my previous trip to Bangkok where I was fortunately enough to get a line up of 7-8 looking CIS. The doorman approached me but told me 'no more no more'. What a pity. Is its possible he did so cause I look a bit Indian? I am young, decent looking, dressed smartly but he still did so. I tried looking inside Rajah a few time too but never did I see any CIS in the lobby or coming out to smoke. I presume either they do not have them anymore or because of the reason I mentioned earlier because I did see a few girls turn down Indian clients, my bad. Any other places where we can get CIS? I also tried Grace a couple of times around 12 am but the quality is seriously lacking.

Visited Nana, Spankies too crowded but great shows, Angelwitch no show and girls lacking quality, Bangkok Bunnies was alright but I picked up twice from Rainbow 3 and both times were better to be forgotten. Visited Mitu Japanese Massage (not the no hands massage) soi33 and booked for 70 minutes, service was the same and half the time she was on her phone pretending to massage me when the deed was done, no second round and CBJ. Nyan Nyan soi 33 was amazing and was eager to please but cannot recall her name. Went to EZMassage 1 and though she was not a looker had an amazing conversation, CBJ and decent time. Also tried the Bangkok backpage and booked Kate who claims to be a model, 170 cm tall but she was a good looker though not the same as her picture. Again the service was horrible, CBJ but popped twice in 1 hour and sent her off as she could not hold a decent conversation though I booked her for 2 hours. Booked Bovi from new Bangkok escorts Picture was heavily photoshopped but it was her and had an amazing session with her, BBBJ and great conversation.

Thinking of checking out Crazy House tonight. Will keep you all posted. Any help on where I can find CIS?

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1841658]I have never heard this story from the girls I have been with. But it seems other customers hear these stories from the girls they have been with, so I suppose there are such stories to tell. I know there are assholes out there. But how often would a man who wants to find a beautiful girl for the night who treats him well in the room decide upon striking gold with that damned hard to find combination that this is the perfect opportunity to save 2000-2500 baht, never be treated to her treasures and service again and most certainly be marked lousy in that bar forever by dodging payment entirely? Something just doesn't smell right about this story some bargirls tell other customers but have never told me.

This Ging girl is beautiful, supposedly the best looking girl in one of the hottest go-go bars in Asia if not the entire world and apparently gives decent service in the room worth the money she demands. Yet she has managed with only a few months off and on in the business over a couple of years to be plagued by enough (several?) guys willing to scoff at the presumably utterly disposable combination of fabulous looks and worthy service / performance in the room to rip her off that her standard policy now with any newcomers is to get the mamasan to collect it all upfront? Seriously?

Something doesn't compute. Either she has discovered she really isn't worth the money once the hotel room door closes and she is alone with the customer or that girl has the worst luck in all of Thailand's go-go bars in choosing new customers.

Personally, if a mamasan or a girl in one of the most popular, standing room only go-go bars on the planet told me that the reason she needs to collect the money upfront is because "several customers did not pay for (her) ST at all", I would take that as a flashing red warning sign to move on to another girl. I mean, there has got to be a reason for that beyond that there are a lot of assholes out there and/or that she is that unlucky to have been targeted by so many of them in the past and fully expects to be targeted by more of them from now on. One customer who just up and ran out without paying a beautiful girl for decent service, ok. Two customers who shorted her by trying to get away with only paying her 1000 baht or something like that, sure. But SEVERAL customers over the course of a few months during a couple of years who didn't pay her anything at all?! I don't know, man. I guess I'd like to hear those customers' side of the story before I only blame them and not her for that so often recurring outcome.[/QUOTE]Agreed wholeheartedly. If lots of customers aren't paying then there is something wrong with the service and we are right to be wary. At the prices these gals are charging I expect that door to close and for them to have sex with me like they are with a BF they really like or as if they are starring in a porn flick. No ifs, ands, or buts about it. Now, if I am paying 1 k Baht my service standards would be very different, but if you want 100 USD or close to it honey, then you better well perform. And no trying to skip out with 15 min of sex and then begging me to "finish. " Of course I can normally tell in the first few minutes how the session will go. The second that door closes I am DFKing the gal like a horny young man. Groping and getting with it. If she responds favorably, I know that I am in business. If she pushes me away and says, "shower, shower," then trouble might be afoot. I still proceed though. Once we are done with the shower if she refuses DFK, does not want to be fingered, and refuses DATY, then the session is over. I get up, get dressed, leave a couple of hundred Baht and am out of there. Sorry, no one should be compensated the full amount for poor service. What really gets me is how this kind of service has become acceptable with so many punters, and in fact they will defend gals who do not perform. When I moved here it was the kiss of death for a gal to get a reputation as a non-performer. Dudes just would not take them.

So, pay upfront? No way. And I never pay upfront in oilies and have never been asked. Of course you never run the risk of extremely awful service at any of the PSE shops. Just sometimes extremely awful looks.

[QUOTE=Crocodilexp;1841897]The trend towards demanding payment upfront is worrying.

In most service businesses where quality is variable, you pay after the fact. Take restaurants, for instance: you only pay ahead at fast food chains (where you know exactly what you're getting), while in any place with variable quality (even street food if you sit down), they'll let you pay after eating. Most customers don't run away without paying, there is a punishment for that.

In the sex industry, those most at risk of customer not paying are freelancers, and yet, they are rarely in a position to demand money upfront. Bars hire security staff and have police on a retainer, MPs also have doors that can be locked until the customer pays. Sure, there are cheaters and psychopaths out there and non-payment happens, but I don't believe it's too frequent.

In my experience (and it's fairly broad), prostitutes usually insist on upfront payment when they intend to deliver a subpar service for a (relatively) high price, knowing that the customer will contemplate paying less. When they intend to provide standard or good GFE service, they are OK with the customer paying afterwards too. Some take a gamble with "up to you" pricing, and often win big (at least in the old day when sex was cheap and a typical session amazing value from a western perspective).

Most venues with sex on the premises demand payment upfront. It's still a somewhat bad sign (basically that service is borderline value for most customers), but it might be OK at PSE oilies since they have a good reputation for service. Do note that decent oilies give refunds too, I had a flake once at Snow White, and got a full refund (of course, we haven't fucked yet, but did take a shower with some touching and the session went downhill in the first 10 min), so props to them. For whatever reason, that girl no longer works there.

Paying upfront shifts all the risk to the customer, and they're doing it because they can get away with it. In the old times, (a) they couldn't get away with it due to competition and (b) service for the price was generally good enough that not many customers had any misgivings about paying even more than the going rate.[/QUOTE]We are purchasing a service. When I purchase other services I pay when the service has been completed. I don't pay for my car repair beforehand and I don't pay for sexual services beforehand. Guys, it is important to keep the tide on our side. There is enough of it against us with as has been stated changing demographics, etc. Having the money be the reward for a good time given is the power we need to keep. Stick to your guns.

3rd Night: Thai girl from Sukhumvit soi 4.

After a few drinks in Angelwitch and Spanky s, I decided to go out for a walk on soi 4. In a few minutes a beautiful, sexy body white skin girl caught my eye. She looked very chang maish. She was wearing a very tight pair of blue shorts and a very nice top.

We went to the room, and we did as we agreed a short time session with blow job uncovered, sex, COF and video. She was quite friendly, a little bit fake during the sex but her pussy was very tight. A quite average GFE. In a word, a good experience.

Looks: 8.5 (she looked great, except for a big scar on her belly, her red lipstick was amazing, and her perfectly shave tight pussy was a delight).

Sex: 7 5 nothing extraordinary (she did all that we agreed, she smiled to the camera, she was friendly, no initiative).

[QUOTE=DaddySan;1841982]What is a good place to buy sex toys in Bangkok? The street vendors on Suk between Nana and Asoke have only cheap junk.[/QUOTE]

There are no real legal sex shops, since sex toys might be technically illegal (like porn is illegal, one of those absurd laws).

In addition to vendors on Sukhumvit, there are also street vendors at Silom who have cheap junk at very expensive prices, and won't come down.

Khlong Thom market (at Worachak Road in Chinatown) used to be a decent place for this. Cheap junk at cheap prices after you negotiate a bit.

For instance, the same vibrator I paid 300 baht for at Khlong Thom has the asking price of 1200 at Silom, and they won't come below 600.

[QUOTE=Sum12;1842083]I thought I might share my recent trip to.

Thinking of checking out Crazy House tonight. Will keep you all posted. Any help on where I can find CIS?[/QUOTE]I've seen a few non Thai girls around Rajak. 3 of them were Uzbek, a few said they were from Iran (don t think so) - if you are in fucking a woman in hijab.

One night I've seen an amazing looking tall one leaving Rajak and heading to Sukhumvit. I immediately approached and asked her about the price. She told me she only worked for dollars. She quoted me 300 dollars at first, than went down to 200. She was so beautiful, that I would be willing to pay 300 , but she refused letting me to take a video so I declined the offer. She told me she is from Colombia, which I don't really believe, but she was Latina for sure.

I've looked myself sometimes inside the Rajak hotel (from outside, didn't got inside) but never saw anyone else that would look like a WG.

At the end of my trip, I found an Indian nice girl on Sukhumvit around McDonald's but I'll write about that a complete review later.

Enjoy your holiday! We are waiting for your reports!

4th girl was a bar girl, even though I didn't technically got her from the bar.

So I went out for some drinks and ended up in Angel witch. Somehow I find it the only bar that still has a few beautiful girls, and I still like the show. The show has decreased in quality in the last years but it's still good. As I really don't like Soi Cowboy and Patpong (even though the latter is making a come back) , I had to choose from the one in Nana. And my personal top is (since a few years now): Angewitch, Spanky's and mandarin (the top one).

As I was saying, I stopped in Angelwitch for the show. One of the dancing girls caught my eye as I haven't seen her in the previous nights. I asked the mamasan that I trust as we go way back, and she told me it was the first day for the girl and that she didn't really work anywhere else before. Hard to believe of course, but whatever, she was a newbie. I am very into farm fresh, naive, willing to do anything girls so I liked her. I bought her some drinks but her total lack of English (I mean, she couldn't even quote a price) made me a little reluctant. At the end of the night, I was kind of tired and not really in the mood for fucking, I was fully feeling my jet lagged so I decided to go home. As it was almost closing time there weren't really a lot of customers left and only a few girls. My company for the night was still not barfined. The mamasan told me that she will go for 3000 baht for LT (which is strange as the others girl charge 4000 baht, but I thought she was new and maybe she had a lower starting price). I payed my bill, thanked everyone and left. Her beautiful Chinese eyes were following me and looking in such a special way I wouldn't forget. I went out of the bar but she followed me. She showed me her phone and basically told me in a gesture language to give her my phone number. I was intrigued. I added her on line immediately. Google translate transformed her non existing English skills and she started telling me that she likes me and so on. I told her good night and went to sleep.

Next morning she started texting me, telling me how much she likes me and how much she wants to meet me. As any other john, I love a woman with initiative, so I offered her 2000 baht for the whole day and next night (so about 24 hours) which she, surprisingly, accepted. She only told me that I have to pay for the bar as well the 700 baht bar fine, which I happily agreed.

In less than one hour she came to me. In the sun of BKK and without my drinks, half of the beauty that she had in the bar faded away. She was smiling so beautiful, she seemed so happy to see me, that I totally fell for it. We went straight to the room where she blew me covered and then I fucked her hard. She was very opened to everything from the first moment. The only thing that made her reluctant was taking a little video, but I explained her (good old Google translate) that it's only for my personal use so she agreed. She even gave me a great rimming and than I finished in her face and mouth. It was marvelous.

We went out to eat something and I was amazed that I didn't got bored immediately with someone with whom I couldn't basically communicate. We used Google translate a few times, but most of the time we just sat and enjoyed the time. That was surprisingly enjoyable.

We went back to the room, we had another session with a lot of rimming and fucking and sucking and of course another finish in her face, which made a great video memory.

At this point (around 8 pm) I was kind of bored. I wasn't in the mood for one more session, I would rather go out drinking and hitting some more bars. So I told her I have something to do. After a lot of explanations via Google translate she left (again, I was totally surprised that she was really sad to leave, even though she got the full 2000 that she would get if she would spend the night with me) .

The next day I left to Pattaya so I haven't seen her for a couple of weeks but we kept texting. When I came back, I stopped regularly at the bar but she changed. She was always really drunk, to a point at which no one wanted to bar fine her, the light in her eyes had faded away and she was colder (I guess that's what a few weeks will do to a girl) .

In my last night I wanted to bar fine her but she asked me for 3000 which I found to be too much given the fact that she came with me for 2000. I don't regret the decision, as I barfined another girl in that particular night and a blast she was (I'll make a separate review for her).

Back to the girl:

Looks: 8 in the bar, 6 at the hotel (rarely have I seen such a difference) , her eyes were great, and her innocent looks was so arousing.

GFE: 9 (as much as you can get from someone that can not speak your language, but I really had a great non sexual time with her).

Sex: 8 (good initiative, great rimming, she even finished at some point, she enjoyed it, extra points for COF, rimming and video).

[QUOTE=Crocodilexp;1842181]There are no real legal sex shops, since sex toys might be technically illegal (like porn is illegal, one of those absurd laws).

In addition to vendors on Sukhumvit, there are also street vendors at Silom who have cheap junk at very expensive prices, and won't come down.

Khlong Thom market (at Worachak Road in Chinatown) used to be a decent place for this. Cheap junk at cheap prices after you negotiate a bit.

For instance, the same vibrator I paid 300 baht for at Khlong Thom has the asking price of 1200 at Silom, and they won't come below 600.[/QUOTE]I agree, everything in Thailand is made dirt cheap in China or similar and quality is crap. You have to buy these things in a western country and put in your suitcase. Germany has particularly good range of quality stuff.

Thai girls like Vibes (not all girls).

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1842121]We are purchasing a service. When I purchase other services I pay when the service has been completed. I don't pay for my car repair beforehand and I don't pay for sexual services beforehand. Guys, it is important to keep the tide on our side. There is enough of it against us with as has been stated changing demographics, etc. Having the money be the reward for a good time given is the power we need to keep. Stick to your guns.[/QUOTE]In my home country brothels charge for sex in advance. In many you don't even get to go inside without paying first. Why? Its simply a statement about the perceived reliability of the customers. BTW, the service of the girls is generally pretty crap for my taste. No GFE.

Really, getting your car serviced has no relevance whatsoever. If you don't pay, you don't get your car back.

In my country, very late at night, some petrol pumps require the customer to prepay, before getting their fuel. It's simply a reaction to cheats. If you are well trusted, you don't have these problems.

Please explain why it is so important to pay afterward in an MP. I usually pay up front and many Oily MPs expect that. They certainly ask me to pay before I go upstairs. It means that you intend to maintain the right not to pay or dicker over the final price or what?

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1842275]In my home country brothels charge for sex in advance. In many you don't even get to go inside without paying first. Why? Its simply a statement about the perceived reliability of the customers. BTW, the service of the girls is generally pretty crap for my taste. No GFE.

Really, getting your car serviced has no relevance whatsoever. If you don't pay, you don't get your car back.

In my country, very late at night, some petrol pumps require the customer to prepay, before getting their fuel. It's simply a reaction to cheats. If you are well trusted, you don't have these problems.

Please explain why it is so important to pay afterward in an MP. I usually pay up front and many Oily MPs expect that. They certainly ask me to pay before I go upstairs. It means that you intend to maintain the right not to pay or dicker over the final price or what?[/QUOTE]If the service to you car is rendered and it is not completed or the car is not fixed, you can take it back. And again, you don't pay till it is completed. And yes, you pay in advance in your home country and the service is mostly crap. That is exactly the point. Why is is so important? Because it allows for the degradation of service. They have your money and you are not getting it back no matter how crappy the service it. Would you accept that from a car repair place? Pay us up front; we'll take a shot at fixing your car; if we can't then your out of luck and out of money. Don't think you would take that deal. I view P4 P in the same way. Yes, there are cheats, but a service business needs to be based around good customers, not cheats. The cheats are the exception, not the rule. Take soapies. Do you get the same service level you get at oilies? Nope, and my guess is because the gals know they really don't have to earn that money. My guess is that if all massage shops go pre-pay we will see service like your home country overall very quickly. Why? Humans do as little as possible. It is just our nature. With that money already in pocket, well I don't think I need to elaborate any more.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1842292]If the service to you car is rendered and it is not completed or the car is not fixed, you can take it back. And again, you don't pay till it is completed. And yes, you pay in advance in your home country and the service is mostly crap. That is exactly the point. Why is is so important? Because it allows for the degradation of service. They have your money and you are not getting it back no matter how crappy the service it. Would you accept that from a car repair place? Pay us up front; we'll take a shot at fixing your car; if we can't then your out of luck and out of money. Don't think you would take that deal. I view P4 P in the same way. Yes, there are cheats, but a service business needs to be based around good customers, not cheats. The cheats are the exception, not the rule. Take soapies. Do you get the same service level you get at oilies? Nope, and my guess is because the gals know they really don't have to earn that money. My guess is that if all massage shops go pre-pay we will see service like your home country overall very quickly. Why? Humans do as little as possible. It is just our nature. With that money already in pocket, well I don't think I need to elaborate any more.[/QUOTE]Although at oilies I usually tell them I'll pay afterwards, mainly because that is how it has been historically at these places, I'm not so sure whether one pays in advance at places like the oilies and MPs is that predictive of the service one will get. In these places, it really depends on whether management gives a s**t how the girls perform. And what constitutes good service in the eyes of the management may also be influenced by which nationalities the place cater to primarily (e.g., different target customers at Nataree and the PSE oilies). The girls know at well-managed places that if they do not perform to the standards management expects there will be consequences.

Moreover, if some place like Nataree allowed men to pay after the sessions, I doubt many would consider not paying an option as I suspect one might end up in a similar state as would one who refused to pay a second-floor bar in Patpong.

All in all then, I'm not sure paying up front or afterwards matters much at the tightly run businesses, such as soapies and oilies.

However, where I agree is with go-go dancers and freelancers. Although go-go dancers [I]should be[/I] accountable to their mama-sans and management, often mama-sans and management only care about getting their payments without really caring about the service provided (there are, of course, exceptions). So the level of accountability is less. And with freelancers there essentially is no accountability. So, yeah, for go-go dancers and freelancers, payment afterwards is greatly preferred. Although even here there are exceptions: one of my best go go sessions was at a bar in Patpong where they required payment in advance to the mama-san; this had no negative impact at all on the session although I'm sure if I paid in advance as a matter of course, at some point it would catch up with me.

[QUOTE=DaddySan;1841982]What is a good place to buy sex toys in Bangkok?

The street vendors on Suk between Nana and Asoke have only cheap junk.[/QUOTE]I have never seen any shop in Bangkok (other than steet vendors) selling sex toys. Perhaps there are some places where they are available "under the counter", but you will need to be very local to get access to those.

If you are in need of some good quaity sex toys, bring some from you home country.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1842292]If the service to you car is rendered and it is not completed or the car is not fixed, you can take it back. And again, you don't pay till it is completed. And yes, you pay in advance in your home country and the service is mostly crap. That is exactly the point. Why is is so important? Because it allows for the degradation of service. They have your money and you are not getting it back no matter how crappy the service it. Would you accept that from a car repair place? Pay us up front; we'll take a shot at fixing your car; if we can't then your out of luck and out of money. Don't think you would take that deal. I view P4 P in the same way. Yes, there are cheats, but a service business needs to be based around good customers, not cheats. The cheats are the exception, not the rule. Take soapies. Do you get the same service level you get at oilies? Nope, and my guess is because the gals know they really don't have to earn that money. My guess is that if all massage shops go pre-pay we will see service like your home country overall very quickly. Why? Humans do as little as possible. It is just our nature. With that money already in pocket, well I don't think I need to elaborate any more.[/QUOTE]You keep on with your car servicing crap. Its not relevant. You didn't answer the question about why you need the power to pay afterwards. Or maybe you justt hinted at it "money back". What is the power you want?

[QUOTE=OneRose;1842182]I've seen a few non Thai girls around Rajak. [/QUOTE]Interesting reports OneRose. FYI the hotel's name is RAJAH. Many people spell it as you have because the signage appears like a K but in reality its a H.

[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1842298]
Moreover, if some place like Nataree allowed men to pay after the sessions, I doubt many would consider not paying an option as I suspect one might end up in a similar state as would one who refused to pay a second-floor bar in Patpong.

All in all then, I'm not sure paying up front or afterwards matters much at the tightly run businesses, such as soapies and oilies.[/QUOTE]Your specualtion about what would happen at Nataree is pointless. Nataree requires guys tonpay upfront. As do other soapies. In past girls in soapies did fail to get paid for aex and there was little they could do about. Most soapies did nor hire a team of bouncers ro belt the crap out of the customers.

Indeed 24 years ago a buddy and I visited a 2nd floor Pat Ping bar. My buddy had to leave in a hurry before me. I got presented with a bill for all sorts of shows we did not intend to pay for and despite a couple of menacing guys, I refused to pay for it and indicated I would pay for the deinks only. We had been guaranteed no cover charge by the outside staff. They asked what badge number of the doir guys were who said no cover charge? Ha Ha. I don't remember now if I had sufficient money to pay their bill or not. I kbviously did nor look too scared since the standover guys let me leave. I don't know if anyone ever got seriously bashed if they remained calm. I think many people paid up assuming the worst. Obviously if physical harm happenwd, the police would have got involved as well. I don't know if the tourist police were good or not.

They maybe better than the normal police.

Both Soapy girls and Tulip girls have told me of cuatomers who did not pay for the sex when the payment was seperated. These were girls that provided the very best service in my opinion.

Tightly run? I do agree though that paying first or paying the same amount after obviously makes no difference unless the customer intends not to pay when he did not like the service provided. Otherwise he is just psychologically fooling himself.

Of course each guy's view of good service varies so much as well. What I like and what Goatscrot likes are completely different, it seems.

I am not a campaigner in favour of paying up front. It makes no difference to me for oilies and soapies. It would make a huge difference for freelancers that I don't trust at all. I just explain the reasons places have changed to pay all in and to payment up front. There is no allowance for the customer not to pay, and you don't get your money back in nirmal circumstances.

Sometimes the money is blown. The girl was pathetic. E.g. Vodka at Candy was totally pathetic for me. I have no idea why. Money was paid. I did not have the gall to ask for it back. I may have made an off comment on the way out. Cannot remember. What is the point? The girl can always make up some excuse why we terminated so quick like I was demanding bareback. It would just be my word against hers.

[QUOTE=Kazeu;1841835]I've never heard of these Sephan Kwai bars. Can you elaborate a little on this area? Are there a lot of bars there? How does it compare to Soi cowboy?[/QUOTE]Simply put, Saphan Kwai means Buffalo Bridge. Experts can correct me if I am wrong.

Google "Saphan Kwai" and you will come across plenty of information. I am not sure the forum has a lot on SK gogo bars. Take the Green line towards Mo Chit, get off at Saphan Kwai and take a short walk. You will get to the stretch of 150 m to 200 m that has around 10 to 12 bars. Small establishments mostly. Take a chance. Not many Farangs there. But all are welcome. One word of advice, travel extremely light and do not get into any sort of argument. It is simply not like Nana or Cowboy or Patpong.

[QUOTE=Bkkdog;1841639]Never in my time in BKK has it been standard practice to pay upfront to the Momason in a Suk area go go, Nana or Soi Cowboy. I can think of only one reason she chose this and it's that CH is becoming the most popular bar on Soi Cowboy and they are testing the waters now to see what they can get away with. However paying upfront in the bar is common practice at the Thai go go bars frequented by the locals. I have been spending a great deal of time in the Sephan Kwai bars recently and always pay 2000ST or 2600 LT at the bar and not once did I have a problem with bad service. I can speak mediocor Thai and I always make friends with the staff and tip well. This scene is great. 2600 LT, 1,000 for Lady drinks and my beers, and 500 tip for the moma. 4,100 for a night out drinking and sex with a white skinned 22 year old hottie. On Nana or Soi cowboy I would have been in for about 6,000-8,000 for the same. Love it![/QUOTE]I don't quite understand. Why is the difference between ST and LT so low? Is this basically due to girl only having the chance to make one ST per night? Does the girl keep all the 2000 ST or is someone taking a cut out of that? since you aren't paying that to her directly. Is this a set fee?

Why so much as 500 ti the moma. She must be raking it in?

I have been to T Det. My buddy took a short time but I did not. I found it a bit less easy to get to the most desirable girl than at cowboy. I. e. She was busy or assigned to other tables. I didn't find the next best level good enough to my taste.

Do you often end up getting your first choce girl easily? I guess there is always returning another night, but I couldn't be bothered, as not immediately hooked by the setup.

I suppose I did not know the system on how to get a lap dance from the most desired girl when she was not in the vicinity. Most of the customers sit politely and don't run around chasing a girl like I was tempted to do but resisted.

Its too spread out for me. This limits. the girls that are dancing nearby. If I like a girl, I would like to be near where she is dancing but this is not practical.

I guess this place is designed for guys that are not fussy and should like all the girls equally well. Not how I operate. I like a very small portion of the girls and ignore all the rest. You take a long time to see all the girls there wirh their rotation system and then by the time you have worked out which one you like, she is bound to be busy already with a customer.

Perhaps there are ways for a regular to overcome this?

In a bar, I am not a hard netotiator of a price, but I prefer to discuss it only with the girl. I don't want to discuss with a girl and a mamasan interfering as well. Sone girls actually agree to go with me without a price negotiation. It definitely is not paid upfront in this case. Nor have I ever had to pay up front as yet in a bar. Although I know it is happening in Crazy House.

So I never let a mamsan get invovled in it even if that is what they are for. If the girl and I cannot reach agreement by ourselves, end of story for me. I give the bar fine to the girl directly to pass on to a mamasan. Its a good idea to have correct money for a barfine but I don't always have it. I have been known to tip the mamasan if she is okay And doesn't hassle me.

Dollhouse has a really great mamasan last I checked. She was recently promoted from being a waitress. I really liked that particular waitress.

Don't know what will happen there with the owner dead from that building fall.

I guess my avoidance of mamasan involvement is also related to question of paying up front. I never have paid up front and would be concerned about mamasan jacking the price up. I don't see that all girls should be the same price. There are champaigne class girls and there are cheap wine class.

I don't go with girls if we are not happy about anything. I don't believe a girl can be in the right frame of mind if she is not really happy about the price. So no protracted negotiation. She sometimes asks for too much possibly. I counter with my top amount and that is it. I am not interested in negotiation. If I must have her, she will win of course within reason. Depends on level of desperation.

You can't effectively negotiate the price with the most popular girls. They have too many potential customers. You can be lucky to get to her.

With Number 4 Jaeng / Jane, she sat with me briefly once, I was too slow to get to Bfing her before one of her regulars arrived, so after her dance set, she did not return. So never had a chance to fuck het as yet. Wasn't my first choice when I first met her anyway. By the time I thought would like to try, never found her available at all. Its like she has a customer lined up for every night. No big deal. Hasn't got much tits but very popualr anyway.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1842519]You keep on with your car servicing crap. Its not relevant. You didn't answer the question about why you need the power to pay afterwards. Or maybe you justt hinted at it "money back". What is the power you want?[/QUOTE]It's very relevant. P4 P is purchasing a service, same as any other service. Why do we need to pay after? Because if the money has changed hands before the service is rendered there is no need to provide good service. The incentive is gone. This is especially true in Thailand where almost no one is concerned with tomorrow or repeat business. And you yourself say the mamasans don't care and they don't. The power that we have is our wallets. So if the service is not what has been agreed upon then less money is paid, which is only fair.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1842526] Tightly run? I do agree though that paying first or paying the same amount after obviously makes no difference unless the customer intends not to pay when he did not like the service provided. Otherwise he is just psychologically fooling himself.

Of course each guy's view of good service varies so much as well. What I like and what Goatscrot likes are completely different, it seems.

Sometimes the money is blown. The girl was pathetic. E.g. Vodka at Candy was totally pathetic for me. I have no idea why. Money was paid. I did not have the gall to ask for it back. I may have made an off comment on the way out. Cannot remember. What is the point? The girl can always make up some excuse why we terminated so quick like I was demanding bareback. It would just be my word against hers.[/QUOTE]Was at Annie's once and the gal was a complete dud. I was only in the room for about 15 min and went out and asked for my money back. Mamasan asked if I had "finished" and the answer was no. She gave me a complete refund. I always have stones to ask for money back if services promised are not delivered. And yes, we have every right to do that. Yes, paying after makes a psychological difference to the provider. She is then more apt to perform with the knowledge that good service might result in more money and less service might present her with a problem. And as well it should be.

What's the point? I am sure you are not the only one who received poor service from her. If guys tell the mamasan and ask for money back and this gal has it happen several times the mamasan will do something about it. An excuse from the gal may work once, but if she continues to do that she will be "found out. " Don't complain and she will continue to get away with poor service.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1841851]Your first paragraph is just your knowledgeable fantasizing. You always know would happen if you did something. You cannot accept real information that is contrary to your fantasies. Must always be lies. I report what I see and hear from actual experiences, not imaginings.[/QUOTE]Syzygies, the only way you could report from what you actually saw and heard about a bargirl deliverying decent service as negotiated or agreed upon yet still being ripped off several times over the course of a few months by customers who paid her nothing at all for ST is if you were in the room at the time as either that customer or as a witness.

Were you that customer who ripped off the girls? Were you a witness to everything that happened in the room?

Neither you nor I nor the mamasan nor that girl's best friend nor her closest blood relative could possibly know what you say you know from what you saw and heard. It is all opinion and, at most, informed judgement. Including yours.

And my opinion and informed judgement tells me that if a Thai P4 P girl is plagued by a significant pattern of 100% non payment of any money at all for her services, the best advice she could get for how to solve that problem would have much to do with improving her service level. Going to a pay upfront system would only exacerbate the most likely problems rather than solve them.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1842567]Was at Annie's once and the gal was a complete dud. I was only in the room for about 15 min and went out and asked for my money back. Mamasan asked if I had "finished" and the answer was no. She gave me a complete refund. I always have stones to ask for money back if services promised are not delivered. And yes, we have every right to do that. Yes, paying after makes a psychological difference to the provider. She is then more apt to perform with the knowledge that good service might result in more money and less service might present her with a problem. And as well it should be.

What's the point? I am sure you are not the only one who received poor service from her. If guys tell the mamasan and ask for money back and this gal has it happen several times the mamasan will do something about it. An excuse from the gal may work once, but if she continues to do that she will be "found out. " Don't complain and she will continue to get away with poor service.[/QUOTE]Agree. Also, a customer who shrugs off being scammed by a P4 P provider when the situation clearly calls for a complaint or at least the request for a refund is essentially a passive contributor to the economic hardship of the "honest" and conscientious providers in that venue. We are the only quality control agents in the system. Low demand customers armed with one excuse after another for it is the bane of any P4 P destination. Far more damaging to it than overpaying, IMO.

[QUOTE=KenDavis03;1836488]Day time freelancers at Gulivers? The place on Soi 5? Good to know.[/QUOTE]Back in the US now after a nice trip to BKK. I can confirm that day time freelancers are happening at Gullivers. I haven't been there in years, and it was pretty quiet when I went in at around 4. But, there were a handful of girls hanging around and at least 2 or 3 of them were obviously pros. One was extremely nice looking!

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1842662]Agree. Also, a customer who shrugs off being scammed by a P4 P provider when the situation clearly calls for a complaint or at least the request for a refund is essentially a passive contributor to the economic hardship of the "honest" and conscientious providers in that venue. We are the only quality control agents in the system. Low demand customers armed with one excuse after another for it is the bane of any P4 P destination. Far more damaging to it than overpaying, IMO.[/QUOTE]Very well stated. Same goes for any service or product one purchases. When I have a bad meal in a restaurant, I tell them. And hey, it's not just for my satisfaction but it is doing them a favor as well. If they want to be successful they need to improve. If they don't they might be out of business. Business owners want to make money and want to know. I have found that the owners at most PSE places are quite interested in ensuring that the customer is happy and will be back. If a gal needs a bit more training or has some holes in her skill set I will tell the mamasan nicely. The only time I "complain" is if there is no effort on the part of the gal and / or if she does not deliver what was agreed upon.

The amount of money a P4 P gal can earn almost anywhere in the world is astronomical compared to average wages. For the punter to "feel sorry" for or as the Thais say "song san" the worker is really ludicrous. The top two earners at Baccarat are pulling in about 300 K Baht per month. And folks that is a lot of money; that puts them way into the top 1% in Thailand. And I'll just bet that's a lot of money in your home nation as well. A mediocre looking gal who provides great service can bank as well. I know quite a few oily gals who are just a 6 or so on the looks scale and average about 4 to 5 bookings a day. And that's over 150 K per month. So feel sorry for them and cut them slack when they don't perform? A thousand times no. I am spending my hard earned and saved money. If I don't get value I will let them know.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1842730]The amount of money a P4 P gal can earn almost anywhere in the world is astronomical compared to average wages. The top two earners at Baccarat are pulling in about 300 K Baht per month. And folks that is a lot of money; that puts them way into the top 1% in Thailand. And I'll just bet that's a lot of money in your home nation as well. I am spending my hard earned and saved money. [/QUOTE]Why does this topic keep coming up? And from this guy who says he lives here and keeps posting over and over about more or less the same things?

For what these girls have to do for their money, there is no comparison to 'average wage. ' No comparison. The only comparison would be to Mister Scrot who talks about his 'hard earned' cash and for whom $7000 usd (equivalent) a month in his home nation is 'a lot'.

Buddy and I were walking along Sukhumvit and this short middle eastern guy came down some stairs and bumped into me. Luckily all my stuff was in the other pockets and I always wear shorts with velcro closers. Anyway, he starts to follow behind us so I tell my buddy to wait a minute and we walk into a hotel drive. The guy was coming up fast behind us and since I didn't look back before deciding to change our direction he went right past us. We then continued on and the guy tried again to get behind us. After several glances back he went the other way. We then turn a corner and see another middle eastern guy on some steps scoping out our pockets as we passed.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1842565]It's very relevant. P4 P is purchasing a service, same as any other service. Why do we need to pay after? Because if the money has changed hands before the service is rendered there is no need to provide good service. The incentive is gone. This is especially true in Thailand where almost no one is concerned with tomorrow or repeat business. And you yourself say the mamasans don't care and they don't. The power that we have is our wallets. So if the service is not what has been agreed upon then less money is paid, which is only fair.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1842567]Was at Annie's once and the gal was a complete dud. I was only in the room for about 15 min and went out and asked for my money back. Mamasan asked if I had "finished" and the answer was no. She gave me a complete refund. I always have stones to ask for money back if services promised are not delivered. And yes, we have every right to do that. Yes, paying after makes a psychological difference to the provider. She is then more apt to perform with the knowledge that good service might result in more money and less service might present her with a problem. And as well it should be.

What's the point? I am sure you are not the only one who received poor service from her. If guys tell the mamasan and ask for money back and this gal has it happen several times the mamasan will do something about it. An excuse from the gal may work once, but if she continues to do that she will be "found out. " Don't complain and she will continue to get away with poor service.[/QUOTE]There is a bit of tension between your two posts Goatscrot. On the one hand you relate an experience where 15 minutes into the session you knew it was a dud and the mamasan then gave you your money back (and I'm sure this did not redound well to the girl's standing with her employer), but in the other post you state that if we pay before a session the girl will have no incentive to give good service. The fact is if a girl knows she will for bad service receive complaints, or bad internet reviews, or what have you, there still maybe an incentive to perform well (although perhaps it doesn't register with some girls).

I earlier suggested the danger of paying in advance correlates with the type of establishment you are dealing with. For example, I don't think there is a big risk paying in advance at a PSE Oily, particularly if well-managed, but there would be a big risk paying in advance at a go-go that has mama-sans who don't give a s**t so long as they get their barfines that day. And there are, of course, situations between these two extremes.

So, I'm not sure there are strict rules to follow; rather one should assess the particular situation and let that guide what you are willing to do. And although if one is particularly low-risk insisting on never paying in advance in every situation might work, it also will mean missing some good opportunities, at least that would have been the case in my experience where I have had a few fantastic sessions where I paid in advance.

[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1842798]There is a bit of tension between your two posts Goatscrot. On the one hand you relate an experience where 15 minutes into the session you knew it was a dud and the mamasan then gave you your money back (and I'm sure this did not redound well to the girl's standing with her employer), but in the other post you state that if we pay before a session the girl will have no incentive to give good service.

I earlier suggested the danger of paying in advance correlates with the type of establishment you are dealing with. For example, I don't think there is a big risk paying in advance at a PSE Oily, particularly if well-managed, but there would be a big risk paying in advance at a go-go that has mama-sans who don't give a s**t so long as they get their barfines that day. And there are, of course, situations between these two extremes.

So, I'm not sure there are strict rules to follow; rather one should access the particular situation and let that guide what you are willing to do. And although if one is particularly low-risk insisting on never paying in advance in every situation might work, it also will mean missing some good opportunities, at least that would have been the case in my experience where I have had a few fantastic sessions where I paid in advance.[/QUOTE]LA Guy, point taken, although I really don't see tension in the posts. And yes, the mamasan at Annie's actually cares about repeat business. Many, dare I say most, do not, and that is why I made the point that I did.

Perhaps my worst experience was at Nancy about 6 or 7 years ago. Took a gal, paid, and went to the room. No kissing, no fingering, no BBBJ. Got dressed, went out, spoke to the papasan, and got no satisfaction. Dude just shrugged his shoulders. Never went back. In hindsight I should have never gotten dressed, rather called the papasan to the room. Think at that point I would have at least gotten a change of gals.

[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1842798]I earlier suggested the danger of paying in advance correlates with the type of establishment you are dealing with. For example, I don't think there is a big risk paying in advance at a PSE Oily, particularly if well-managed, but there would be a big risk paying in advance at a go-go that has mama-sans who don't give a s**t so long as they get their barfines that day. And there are, of course, situations between these two extremes.[/QUOTE]One the risks of paying upfront in almost any venue, including some so-called PSE oilies, but particularly with go-go girls, beer bar girls and so on is something I don't think I have seen anyone mention here during this particular discussion. And this is one case where I am 100% certain no P4 P girls encouraged to supply tales of woe about their customers' bad behavior would ever voluntarily admit they have ever done when it stands to reason they have done it in at least some cases.

But there are many times when these girls deserve to be shorted on their pay by a large percentage if not reduced right down to nothing but taxi fare EVEN THOUGH Full Service with you was very much on offer in the room and arguably even if she has performed a BBBJ for you.

That would be when a private discussion between the two of you in the bar established that she would be fine with BBFS or BBBJ CIM with you but that isn't the way it turned out in the room at all after she pulls one of those infamous Jekyll & Hyde transformations or threw the "Yes in the bar-No in the room" bit at you. Sure, she can change her mind right up to the moment of truth. No problem. We're not talking about forcing her to do anything. But that means you can also change your mind about how much you will pay her as well. If you have paid some mamasan all of it upfront, you've got nothing but thin air on your side when it comes to getting some or all of that money back and discouraging the lies.

Of course, the only part of it the girls are likely to fill a sympathetic ear to those tales of woe with is the part where "He wanted me to boom boom without condom!" or "He wanted to cum in my mouth! I cannot do!!", followed by, "Then he refused to pay me anything!!!"

But my guess is none of them will ever admit that one or both of those activities was precisely what she agreed to in the bar in order to convince him to pay her barfine in the first place and maybe buy her a couple of extra Lady Drinks while we're at it.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1842817]One the risks of paying upfront in almost any venue, including some so-called PSE oilies, but particularly with go-go girls, beer bar girls and so on is something I don't think I have seen anyone mention here during this particular discussion. And this is one case where I am 100% certain no P4 P girls encouraged to supply tales of woe about their customers' bad behavior would ever admit they have ever done when it stands to reason they have done it in at least some cases.

But there are many times when these girls deserve to be shorted on their pay by a large percentage if not reduced right down to nothing but taxi fare EVEN THOUGH Full Service with you was very much on offer in the room and arguably even if she has performed a BBBJ for you.

That would be when a private discussion between the two of you in the bar established that she would be fine with BBFS or BBBJ CIM with you but that isn't the way it turned out in the room at all after she pulls one of those infamous Jekyll & Hyde transformations or threw the "Yes in the bar-No in the room" bit at you. Sure, she can change her mind right up to the moment of truth. No problem. We're not talking about forcing her to do anything. But that means you can also change your mind about how much you will pay her as well. If you have paid some mamasan all of it upfront, you've got nothing but thin air on your side when it comes to getting some or all of that money back and discouraging the lies.

The only part of it the girls are likely to fill a sympathetic ear to those tales of woe is the part where "He wanted me to boom boom without condom!" or "He wanted to cum in my mouth! I cannot do!!", followed by, "Then he refused to pay me anything!!!"

But my guess is none of them will ever admit that one or both of those activities was precisely what she agreed to in the bar in order to convince him to pay her barfine in the first place and maybe an extra Lady Drink or two while we're at it.[/QUOTE]Well out of curiosity, and since you mentioned this example among others in your post, have you actually negotiated BBFS at any PSE oily in advance of the session? My question is not to be confused with whether you have gotten BBFS at a PSE oily, rather whether you actually raised this before taking the girl upstairs. It seems to me that probably wouldn't work out too well, but maybe I'm wrong.

[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1842824]Well out of curiosity, and since you mentioned this example among others in your post, have you actually negotiated BBFS at any PSE oily in advance of the session? My question is not to be confused with whether you have gotten BBFS at a PSE oily, rather whether you actually raised this before taking the girl upstairs. It seems to me that probably wouldn't work out too well, but maybe I'm wrong.[/QUOTE]I have gotten agreements for BBFS and BBBJ CIM with girls sitting outside MPs / PSE oilies and not even gone into the shop, just paid their barfine and taken them back to my apartment. Have to say, those have been the only note-worthy times I have ever spent with MP girls. I have never had an experience worth repeating inside their shops and most have been downright horrible. I have gone to PSE oilies and been assured by the mamasan that BBBJ CIM is "standard, all the girls do that" when in one case the girl said within 2 minutes of walking into the VIP room that, BTW, CIM is NOT something she ever does and won't be doing this time either. lol

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1842730]
The amount of money a P4 P gal can earn almost anywhere in the world is astronomical compared to average wages. For the punter to "feel sorry" for or as the Thais say "song san" the worker is really ludicrous. The top two earners at Baccarat are pulling in about 300 K Baht per month. And folks that is a lot of money; that puts them way into the top 1% in Thailand. And I'll just bet that's a lot of money in your home nation as well. A mediocre looking gal who provides great service can bank as well. I know quite a few oily gals who are just a 6 or so on the looks scale and average about 4 to 5 bookings a day. And that's over 150 K per month. So feel sorry for them and cut them slack when they don't perform? A thousand times no. I am spending my hard earned and saved money. If I don't get value I will let them know.[/QUOTE]Can earn and does earn are not exactly the same. I believe a very low percentage of Bangkok working girls are getting over 150 K per month consistently. I don't see many girls getting multiple Barfines per night. I don't see so many girls are getting lots of bookings per day in Oilies. Most Oilies seem to be very quiet. Even a busy shop like addict has a large number of girls to share the customers.

What about girls doing LT? They would need to make 5 K, 30 days per month to get to 150 K. Ha ha. No that is unreasonable. They just don't make it to that amount. They need time off. Okay I neglected her monthly salary which could be 14 K if she was reliable and did not get docked earnings at all. Many girls lose large parts of monthly salary and often get no salary at all. A few diligent ones retain most of the salary. I also neglected her drink commissions. If she sold 100 drinks at 60 baht each, that is another 6 K (not huge) and difficult to achieve for girls doing a lot of LT bookings. They often arrive at bar with the customer in tow, or already waiting, and get barfined almost immediately and soon head off.

Plenty of girls got no fuck for their day's work. Lucky if they managed more than money for taxi home on some days. In one portable bar on the street I saw that one girl was getting barfined consistently each night and one ladyboy the same, and the others struggled somewhat. One or two don't go with customers at all, just trying to sell drinks.

Sure there are the big earners. But what percentage of girls are in that category? 5% or less? Well done to those who make big money despite some what average looks. That is not easy.

I believe only the "Super Stars" are making 150 K per month, and I haven't found so many of them.

I do see the motivation to get business get a bit more desperate in bars when coming time to pay the rent. LOL

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1842835]Can earn and does earn are not exactly the same. I believe a very low percentage of Bangkok working girls are getting over 150 K per month consistently. I don't see many girls getting multiple Barfines per night. I don't see so many girls are getting lots of bookings per day in Oilies. Most Oilies seem to be very quiet. Even a busy shop like addict has a large number of girls to share the customers.

What about girls doing LT? They would need to make 5 K, 30 days per month to get to 150 K. Ha ha. No that is unreasonable. They just don't make it to that amount. They need time off. Okay I neglected her monthly salary which could be 14 K if she was reliable and did not get docked earnings at all. Many girls lose large parts of monthly salary and often get no salary at all. A few diligent ones retain most of the salary. I also neglected her drink commissions. If she sold 100 drinks at 60 baht each, that is another 6 K (not huge) and difficult to achieve for girls doing a lot of LT bookings. They often arrive at bar with the customer in tow, or already waiting, and get barfined almost immediately and soon head off.

Plenty of girls got no fuck for their day's work. Lucky if they managed more than money for taxi home on some days. In one portable bar on the street I saw that one girl was getting barfined consistently each night and one ladyboy the same, and the others struggled somewhat. One or two don't go with customers at all, just trying to sell drinks.

Sure there are the big earners. But what percentage of girls are in that category? 5% or less? Well done to those who make big money despite some what average looks. That is not easy.

I believe only the "Super Stars" are making 150 K per month, and I haven't found so many of them.

I do see the motivation to get business get a bit more desperate in bars when coming time to pay the rent. LOL[/QUOTE]I think there are far more gals earning quite a bit of money than you think Syz. And hey, it is really up to the gal. As I stated if she is mediocre looking but knows how to hustles and gives great service, she will be very busy. I know quite a few oily gals who aren't so pretty, but are booking 4 customers per day. Why? They know how to dish it out and that keeps 'them coming back. GoGo gals have to be a bit better looking. But as I said, the top two earners at Baccara are pulling in close to 300 k per month. I would imagine a decent looking one can easily make 100 k plus if she is dedicated to her job. If not, that is her loss. The customer's money is there for the taking. It is up to her to provide good service with a smile.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1842817]One the risks of paying upfront in almost any venue, including some so-called PSE oilies, but particularly with go-go girls, beer bar girls and so on is something I don't think I have seen anyone mention here during this particular discussion. And this is one case where I am 100% certain no P4 P girls encouraged to supply tales of woe about their customers' bad behavior would ever voluntarily admit they have ever done when it stands to reason they have done it in at least some cases.

But there are many times when these girls deserve to be shorted on their pay by a large percentage if not reduced right down to nothing but taxi fare EVEN THOUGH Full Service with you was very much on offer in the room and arguably even if she has performed a BBBJ for you.

That would be when a private discussion between the two of you in the bar established that she would be fine with BBFS or BBBJ CIM with you but that isn't the way it turned out in the room at all after she pulls one of those infamous Jekyll & Hyde transformations or threw the "Yes in the bar-No in the room" bit at you. Sure, she can change her mind right up to the moment of truth. No problem. We're not talking about forcing her to do anything. But that means you can also change your mind about how much you will pay her as well. If you have paid some mamasan all of it upfront, you've got nothing but thin air on your side when it comes to getting some or all of that money back and discouraging the lies.

Of course, the only part of it the girls are likely to fill a sympathetic ear to those tales of woe with is the part where "He wanted me to boom boom without condom!" or "He wanted to cum in my mouth! I cannot do!!", followed by, "Then he refused to pay me anything!!!"

But my guess is none of them will ever admit that one or both of those activities was precisely what she agreed to in the bar in order to convince him to pay her barfine in the first place and maybe buy her a couple of extra Lady Drinks while we're at it.[/QUOTE]Although I am not into BBFS, I am with you on your point completely. If she agrees and then reneges, then she deserves less than the amount agreed upon. In order for her to pull this stunt in the first place there must have been plenty of dudes who let her get away with it. Many punters just don't have the stones to express their displeasure to a working girl. I really don't get that. First of all when she agree and then refuses it completely kills the mood. Second of all it is bad business and a rip-off. Sorry, I will not take a mai pen rai attitude towards either. Of course I never show anger when this happens. I just get up, get dressed, and if she asks I tell her why I am calling the session short, and then I leave what I think is fair for services rendered. Most of the time this is met with a look of complete astonishment, again because most dudes accept whatever is given to them. Of course this is also one reason many gals don't like going with locals or guys who have visited many times. The best times are when you meet gals that really like sex. But they not so large in number here. I have a few of those in the oilies. They just love doing the nasty. They are indeed a treasure.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1842863]Although I am not into BBFS, I am with you on your point completely. If she agrees and then reneges, then she deserves less than the amount agreed upon. In order for her to pull this stunt in the first place there must have been plenty of dudes who let her get away with it. Many punters just don't have the stones to express their displeasure to a working girl. I really don't get that. First of all when she agree and then refuses it completely kills the mood. Second of all it is bad business and a rip-off. Sorry, I will not take a mai pen rai attitude towards either. Of course I never show anger when this happens. I just get up, get dressed, and if she asks I tell her why I am calling the session short, and then I leave what I think is fair for services rendered. Most of the time this is met with a look of complete astonishment, again because most dudes accept whatever is given to them. Of course this is also one reason many gals don't like going with locals or guys who have visited many times. The best times are when you meet gals that really like sex. But they not so large in number here. I have a few of those in the oilies. They just love doing the nasty. They are indeed a treasure.[/QUOTE]So true on all counts. Pay upfront would put the "Yes in the bar-No in the Room" con / scam on steroids. Why not say anything in the bar to get the customer to pony up the full amount and hand it to a third party (who was not part of the verbal agreement) when you know from experience it would take the extremely rare customer with stones as big as the Rockies to return to that bar and ask for some or all of the "money back"? That is assuming he even knows he has just been conned / scammed.

And when he is going overboard trying to show what a a "good heart" he has in this regard she knows damn well most guys would rather walk away telling themselves and anyone else who will listen that, for example, he just got a fine BJ from this hot go-go girl when the reality is he just got a lame handjob with a bit of oral foreplay thrown in for 2,500 baht++ or whatever. Or, for another example, that he just had the most memorable GFE with that top looker at such-and-such Massage Shop even though she refused to engage in DFK or uncovered oral foreplay. For a customer like that to even make a ripple of displeasure or confront a classic cum-dodger would be admitting something out loud that he would rather not admit out loud, even to himself.

Bear in mind that the slickest cons never leave their marks thinking they have just been conned. Only the clumsy ones do. The slickest cons leave the mark feeling like he just saved a damsel in distress, helped feed a child or heal a sick mother, gave a girl (or guy) down on their luck a boost up, has added another notch to his achievements in understanding the exotic culture better than the rest of us and so on. The goal is to make sure the mark walks away feeling good about just having been conned. But mostly that damsel in distress stuff is so much hogwash. What actually happened was that customer just got beautifully conned by an expert in the field of man / woman dynamics regarding sex and money.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1842903]So true on all counts. Pay upfront would put the "Yes in the bar-No in the Room" con / scam on steroids. Why not say anything in the bar to get the customer to pony up the full amount and hand it to a third party (who was not part of the verbal agreement) when you know from experience it would take the extremely rare customer with stones as big as the Rockies to return to that bar and ask for some or all of the "money back"? That is assuming he even knows he has just been conned / scammed.

And when he is going overboard trying to show what a a "good heart" he has in this regard she knows damn well most guys would rather walk away telling themselves and anyone else who will listen that, for example, he just got a fine BJ from this hot go-go girl when the reality is he just got a lame handjob with a bit of oral foreplay thrown in for 2,500 baht++ or whatever. Or, for another example, that he just had the most memorable GFE with that top looker at such-and-such Massage Shop even though she refused to engage in DFK or uncovered oral foreplay. For a customer like that to even make a ripple of displeasure or confront a classic cum-dodger would be admitting something out loud that he would rather not admit out loud, even to himself.

Bear in mind that the slickest cons never leave their marks thinking they have just been conned. Only the clumsy ones do. The slickest cons leave the mark feeling like he just saved a damsel in distress, helped feed a child or heal a sick mother, gave a girl (or guy) down on their luck a boost up, has added another notch to his achievements in understanding the exotic culture better than the rest of us and so on. The goal is to make sure the mark walks away feeling good about just having been conned. But mostly that damsel in distress stuff is so much hogwash. What actually happened was that customer just got beautifully conned by an expert in the field of man / woman dynamics regarding sex and money.[/QUOTE]Don't you know it. And these gals know it to. It is their job. They are very convincing, but it is an act. Merely an act. They know what to say to make punters feel for them on many different levels. That is why so many avoid long timers like the plague. One thing that I always liked to do was tell GoGo gals and FLs that I lived in On Nut when they would inevitably ask. That would help to weed out the chaff. Now of course I lived in Asoke and had no intention of taking them anywhere but to a ST Hotel close by, but if the gal was willing to go to On Nut, then chances are she was not going to be in a hurry. If she blew me off then; well I knew her game.

Syz often mentions how much a gal can make in one night rattling off multiple short times. Good for her, but personally I am not at all interested in gals with that business plan, no matter how good looking they are.

I am planning a trip to BKK in may or June. In preparation I have been chatting up a number of ladies on Thai friendly. I will only be in town a couple weeks. What are my chances with these ladies? Am I wasting my time? Or do most Thai women like to bang on a first date?

[QUOTE=FallenMamber;1843020]I am planning a trip to BKK in may or June. In preparation I have been chatting up a number of ladies on Thai friendly. I will only be in town a couple weeks. What are my chances with these ladies?[/QUOTE]That depends on your definition of "my chances" and your and her profile. Many girls on ThaiFriendly are genuinely looking for a friend, a lover or perhaps even a husband.

If your and her actual profiles and intentions match, then it is very likely you will get what you expected. On the other hand if she expects future marriage material and you are only looking for a free one night stand then things may go awry soon. I had good success on ThaiFriendly and Date-In-Asia, but I always made my intentions very clear so there was no misunderstanding when we met.

[QUOTE=FallenMamber;1843020] Am I wasting my time? Or do most Thai women like to bang on a first date?[/QUOTE]I can only offer personal anecdotal evidence, but I had sex on the first night with every girl I met through these dating sites and it was their initiative to engage in making love.

I was walking around Asoke near Soi Cowboy late last night and early morning. In the past, I just rushed past on my way to
Soi Cowboy but a cute non pro looking girl caught my eye at one of the carts. So for the first time, I stopped and ordered a drink. The girl sat down with me at a nearby table and figuring that a waitress would ask if I wanted to buy her a drink, I immediately asked her if she leaves with guys. This was because several weeks ago I sat down with a cute university aged girl around a Soi 19 Alcocart and bought her a drink only to find she does not go out.

This SYT said she did go out and provided a brief bio. Lives in Bang Na area and a taxi from there to Asok cost 150 bt, attends a university studying hotel management, borderline English, and finally available for short or long term. Also, dressed modestly in a sort of Girl Scout looking blouse and shorts. Also, pretty, no babies with this one and a nice spinner body. How much? I asked. She hesitated briefly and then said 3000 bt, not specifying the duration, whereupon I asked if that was long term. No, she said it was 4000 baht for long term.

Then she asked how much I could pay and stated my usual limit for short term is 2000. I also noted long term depends on how well short term would go. She kind of chuckled, not budging on her price, and I found myself in a stalemate as I finished my drink. No attempt on her part at negotiation. She was definitely a hottie but would it not cost around 3000 bt for a girl at one of the go-go's? I never BF but I think this forum is replete with stories of 2000 bt for short term and 700 for the BF in go go's. Throw in a few drinks and you are paying a minimum of 3000. However, I wonder if 3000 bt is a common rate at the alcocarts or was this girl attempting to get a premium based on her looks? I suspected that other girls don't ask nearly that much but wondering if anyone has any comments about rates at the alcocarts? The other factor for me in not pursuing this girl was her overall demeanor suggested starfish in the room.

Basically, she just sat there and did not take the initiative in any way. Also, before I get flamed, yes, it could just be she was not interested in me. I found most of the girls at the alcocarts below average in looks and in a few isolated cases LB's so did not pursue it further. If I am going to pay 3000 bt, then, I might as well go the clubs.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1843162]I can only offer personal anecdotal evidence, but I had sex on the first night with every girl I met through these dating sites and it was their initiative to engage in making love.[/QUOTE]I concur. Although I think there might have been one or two out of a couple of dozen who couldn't immediately go to my apartment after the first afternoon coffee meeting due to prior commitments, a second meeting most certainly ended there. In my case, I had better results with ThaiCupid than ThaiFriendly. Making my intentions clear, as you did, and those intentions being to pretty much wind up naked and enjoying each other's minds, bodies and souls ASAP doesn't seem to deter most of the women on those sites that clicked "Interest" in me first even if their profiles say they are looking for "Serious Relationship, Marriage" while mine only says I am interested in, "Romance, Dating".

I read worries all over the 'net about the decline of the usual venues like go-go bars, beer bars, street walking freelancers and the like because of the increase in smartphone use, among other reasons. But I have to say that between the dating sites, just meeting girls at the mall or on the bts / mrt, in restaurants and so on with smartphone at the ready, I'm not sure my already full schedule of bedding down sweet, healthy, young, lovely Thai girls would be altered much if all the go-go bars, beer bars, blowjob bars and MPs in the city were shut down tomorrow. It wouldn't be as much fun because I do like the go-go bar scene for the most part. But it would be cheaper and the fresh 20-something pussy would still be on parade and easily available. The emotional maneuvering downsides to dating "amateur" girls vs the emotional ease of dealing with "pros" certainly exist, of course. But they can be dealt with and the "amateurs" will still love you despite knowing you're a confirmed hound dog. Or maybe because of it. LOL.

[QUOTE=Tomasb;1843259]I was walking around Asoke near Soi Cowboy late last night and early morning. In the past, I just rushed past on my way to
Soi Cowboy but a cute non pro looking girl caught my eye at one of the carts. So for the first time, I stopped and ordered a drink. The girl sat down with me at a nearby table and figuring that a waitress would ask if I wanted to buy her a drink, I immediately asked her if she leaves with guys. This was because several weeks ago I sat down with a cute university aged girl around a Soi 19 Alcocart and bought her a drink only to find she does not go out.

This SYT said she did go out and provided a brief bio. Lives in Bang Na area and a taxi from there to Asok cost 150 bt, attends a university studying hotel management, borderline English, and finally available for short or long term. Also, dressed modestly in a sort of Girl Scout looking blouse and shorts. Also, pretty, no babies with this one and a nice spinner body. How much? I asked. She hesitated briefly and then said 3000 bt, not specifying the duration, whereupon I asked if that was long term. No, she said it was 4000 baht for long term.

Then she asked how much I could pay and stated my usual limit for short term is 2000. I also noted long term depends on how well short term would go. She kind of chuckled, not budging on her price, and I found myself in a stalemate as I finished my drink. No attempt on her part at negotiation. She was definitely a hottie but would it not cost around 3000 bt for a girl at one of the go-go's? I never BF but I think this forum is replete with stories of 2000 bt for short term and 700 for the BF in go go's. Throw in a few drinks and you are paying a minimum of 3000. However, I wonder if 3000 bt is a common rate at the alcocarts or was this girl attempting to get a premium based on her looks? I suspected that other girls don't ask nearly that much but wondering if anyone has any comments about rates at the alcocarts? The other factor for me in not pursuing this girl was her overall demeanor suggested starfish in the room.

Basically, she just sat there and did not take the initiative in any way. Also, before I get flamed, yes, it could just be she was not interested in me. I found most of the girls at the alcocarts below average in looks and in a few isolated cases LB's so did not pursue it further. If I am going to pay 3000 bt, then, I might as well go the clubs.[/QUOTE]I would say 3,000 baht for ST with one of those portable bar bargirls is a bit high unless she is a special case and the performance level is high and, as much as possible, certain. Sounds to me like you found her to be special, at least in looks. But your numbers vs the go-go girls are about right. You could get a ST with a cute or better go-go girl, whose body you see more of beforehand, for around 3,000 total or maybe a couple of hundred baht more depending on the drink costs. BTW, if she was not just standing around but working at the portable bar, which it sounds like she was, there would be a barfine to pay them as well. Maybe 500 baht. It isn't like the 3,000 baht she cited would include the barfine and the drink costs, right? So she was essentially asking a top end ST rate, even for a go-go dancer. Barfine, drinks and her 3,000 baht asking price was already tickling around the 4,000 baht range. For Short Time.

But that doesn't mean she wouldn't be worth it any more than it would mean a certain go-go dancer isn't worth it. My style would have been not to balk or negotiate on price at all. Not directly, that is. First I wouldn't have asked her "how much?", I would have left that for her to mention first, if at all. But once the 3,000 number was out there, I would have told her what I would expect of her if I paid her 3,000 baht. And I wouldn't have held back on any dream sexual activities and finishes in my head (including turning the ST into a LT for that 3,000). If she hadn't flinched about making good on my expectations, I might very well have been fine with paying her the amount she expected. But if she balked at fulfilling all my ST dream desires, then that is when I would start chipping away at that 3,000 baht price. But, you see, then there is a REASON for chipping away at it beyond my simply either not having the money, maintaining some weird across the board rule or immediately suggesting she doesn't deserve 3,000 baht for the use of her time and body no matter what she did for me.

[QUOTE=Blanquiceleste;1842528]Simply put, Saphan Kwai means Buffalo Bridge. Experts can correct me if I am wrong.

Google "Saphan Kwai" and you will come across plenty of information. I am not sure the forum has a lot on SK gogo bars. Take the Green line towards Mo Chit, get off at Saphan Kwai and take a short walk. You will get to the stretch of 150 m to 200 m that has around 10 to 12 bars. Small establishments mostly. Take a chance. Not many Farangs there. But all are welcome. One word of advice, travel extremely light and do not get into any sort of argument. It is simply not like Nana or Cowboy or Patpong.[/QUOTE]Why does he need to travel extremely light? Your advice regarding arguments would also be relevant to Nana, Soi Cowboy, or any other bar in the world. You are implying that these bars are not safe, but actually I feel 1000% safer at a Sephan Kwai bar than in a farang oriented Go Go like Nana, Patpong, or Soi Cowboy. Why do you ask? It's simple. No toots trying to rip you off, no padded bar bills, no drunk farangs falling all over the place, no pushy bouncers refusing entry or demanding entry fees, no Lady drink scams, no coyote dancers with 2000 Baht bar fines, no taxis refusing you or refusing to use the metre, and 99% percent of the time when other customers hear me speaking some Thai, they come over to cheers a few drinks. Thais in these places keep to themselves if they see a farang who can't speak Thai, they will not even give you a second look or be a danger to your money, so no need to travel heavier or lighter than what you would normally do.

[QUOTE=Bkkdog;1843351]Why does he need to travel extremely light? Your advice regarding arguments would also be relevant to Nana, Soi Cowboy, or any other bar in the world. You are implying that these bars are not safe, but actually I feel 1000% safer at a Sephan Kwai bar than in a farang oriented Go Go like Nana, Patpong, or Soi Cowboy. Why do you ask? It's simple. No toots trying to rip you off, no padded bar bills, no drunk farangs falling all over the place, no pushy bouncers refusing entry or demanding entry fees, no Lady drink scams, no coyote dancers with 2000 Baht bar fines, no taxis refusing you or refusing to use the metre, and 99% percent of the time when other customers hear me speaking some Thai, they come over to cheers a few drinks. Thais in these places keep to themselves if they see a farang who can't speak Thai, they will not even give you a second look or be a danger to your money, so no need to travel heavier or lighter than what you would normally do.[/QUOTE]Never been to saphan Kwai, but I can certainly chime in and say Soi Cowboy isn't safe. There are various news reports of falangs getting mugged there. I once saw an asian man (not sure origin nation) just beating the crap out of some white guy who clearly had no intentions of fighting at all, not even defensively. This was at Afterskool, on the outdoor patio area. He was bleeding from his eyes after getting hit so hard. There didn't seem to be anything he could do (he was alone), and the guy who beat the shit out of him was never arrested or asked to leave. He just stayed there, bragging to the girls.

Actually, it never occurred to me that the alcocarts had barfines but I guess they do. When she caught my eye walking by, she was sitting at a stool at the bar. As soon as I asked for a drink, she came over and sat down. Thought she may have been an FL just hanging at the bar except the waitress came over immediately to see if I wanted to buy her a drink. Upon reflection, this prob means she is employed as bait at bar but a BF was not mentioned.

Your right, if I wanted to pursue it, I could have asked all the standard questions but don't like to do it as I always forget something (DATY, DFK? Etc.). I think my intuition told me I would be disappointed so let it go. If her personality was a bit saucier I may have been more inclined but as she sat there like a bump on a log, I quickly lost interest But, yeah, with a BF, that's a tad high for a street girl. I.

[QUOTE=Bkkdog;1843351]Why does he need to travel extremely light? Your advice regarding arguments would also be relevant to Nana, Soi Cowboy, or any other bar in the world. You are implying that these bars are not safe, but actually I feel 1000% safer at a Sephan Kwai bar than in a farang oriented Go Go like Nana, Patpong, or Soi Cowboy. Why do you ask? It's simple. No toots trying to rip you off, no padded bar bills, no drunk farangs falling all over the place, no pushy bouncers refusing entry or demanding entry fees, no Lady drink scams[/QUOTE]One thing different about Saphan Kawai gogo is that they will bring whole bunch of things even you don't order or even you say no, they will bring them anyways. Things like peanuts, fruit plates, wet towels, ice buckets, ect, all these are almost automatic, these things add up. My experiences there was if you go alone, expect to pay around minimum 300-400 for one entry without lady sitting. So to me it is sort of padded bill. Girls usually drink from your drink, or they may ask you for lady drink, but you don't have to buy, there you pay them a sitting fee only, this is one of the good things of these SK bars as compared to SC.

About the farang customers, recently, there seem to be more and more farang and east Asian customers coming to these places. But you need some extend of Thai language to have fun, because all these girls are basically speak no words in English. I think these areas are still safe for foreigners as long as they do not make any issues with the shops even they are scammed on the bill, they write all the items on bill all in Thais so there is no way to check them correctly also there is not enough light to see the bill, when I get a bill which I think they added a hundred or two, I just pay and leave, I would never take a risk argue in these Thai dominated areas, in past 15 years of occasionally coming here, have seen Thai fights two times. Both times group against group. I would be very careful in both SK and SC.

Guys,

This coming March I would be heading to bkk. I booked a hotel at tulip in. I think it would be around 5 minutes from nana and maybe 15 minutes from sow cowboi. In this case if I were to take a girl for short time from nana or cowboi will I need to take a taxi or would the lady walk with me to the hotel. I honestly don't want to waste money on cabs.

My second question was tht I read thr now the ongoing rate for mediocre to good looking gurls are 3000 bht for 1 hour short time. Is negotiating a norm especially for a farang? Or is it in general girls would only accept 3000 baht for short time. By the way is time taken walking / going to your hotel is considered as part of your short time? By the way are CIM and anal considered as extra and if yes what are the rates? Where can I find good looking girls in eithet nana or cowboi that does anal and CIM.

[QUOTE=CaptCabins;1843475]Guys,

This coming March I would be heading to bkk. I booked a hotel at tulip in. I think it would be around 5 minutes from nana and maybe 15 minutes from sow cowboi. In this case if I were to take a girl for short time from nana or cowboi will I need to take a taxi or would the lady walk with me to the hotel. I honestly don't want to waste money on cabs.

My second question was tht I read thr now the ongoing rate for mediocre to good looking gurls are 3000 bht for 1 hour short time. Is negotiating a norm especially for a farang? Or is it in general girls would only accept 3000 baht for short time. By the way is time taken walking / going to your hotel is considered as part of your short time? By the way are CIM and anal considered as extra and if yes what are the rates? Where can I find good looking girls in either Nana or Cowboi that does anal and CIM.[/QUOTE]Rates seem to be all over the place as more Russians, Chinese, and yet more Japanese invade BKK over the recent years. One thing for sure is that learning basic Thai numbers and discussing price in Thai (even if you only know the numbers!) somehow makes a difference in pricing. It also seems to distinguish you as 'at least not a totally newbie farang' which helps the service!

[QUOTE=Tomasb;1843259]I was walking around Asoke near Soi Cowboy late last night and early morning. In the past, I just rushed past on my way to
Soi Cowboy but a cute non pro looking girl caught my eye at one of the carts. So for the first time, I stopped and ordered a drink. The girl sat down with me at a nearby table and figuring that a waitress would ask if I wanted to buy her a drink, I immediately asked her if she leaves with guys. This was because several weeks ago I sat down with a cute university aged girl around a Soi 19 Alcocart and bought her a drink only to find she does not go out.

This SYT said she did go out and provided a brief bio. Lives in Bang Na area and a taxi from there to Asok cost 150 bt, attends a university studying hotel management, borderline English, and finally available for short or long term. Also, dressed modestly in a sort of Girl Scout looking blouse and shorts. Also, pretty, no babies with this one and a nice spinner body. How much? I asked. She hesitated briefly and then said 3000 bt, not specifying the duration, whereupon I asked if that was long term. No, she said it was 4000 baht for long term.

Then she asked how much I could pay and stated my usual limit for short term is 2000. I also noted long term depends on how well short term would go. She kind of chuckled, not budging on her price, and I found myself in a stalemate as I finished my drink. No attempt on her part at negotiation. She was definitely a hottie but would it not cost around 3000 bt for a girl at one of the go-go's? I never BF but I think this forum is replete with stories of 2000 bt for short term and 700 for the BF in go go's. Throw in a few drinks and you are paying a minimum of 3000. However, I wonder if 3000 bt is a common rate at the alcocarts or was this girl attempting to get a premium based on her looks? I suspected that other girls don't ask nearly that much but wondering if anyone has any comments about rates at the alcocarts? The other factor for me in not pursuing this girl was her overall demeanor suggested starfish in the room.

Basically, she just sat there and did not take the initiative in any way. Also, before I get flamed, yes, it could just be she was not interested in me. I found most of the girls at the alcocarts below average in looks and in a few isolated cases LB's so did not pursue it further. If I am going to pay 3000 bt, then, I might as well go the clubs.[/QUOTE]I believe that most of these portable cart girls will go ST for 2 K baht, and some won't even negotiate a price. Some guys are trying to get much less than 2 K and I don't know if they manage it.

I am surprised by the girl wanting 3 K. I went with one of these girls similar to how you describe. I did not enjoy it at all. She had 3 babies, very saggy tits and no-feel pussy, and very little sex and kissing ability at all despite her sex experience with Thai men. I paid her 2 K but was a complete waste of money in this particular case. She acted very nice and very honest and was very cute (with clothes on). All those things were not enough to make it work for me at all. I would rather have paid more for one of my favorite hot hot gogo girls. YMMV.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1842936]
Syz often mentions how much a gal can make in one night rattling off multiple short times. Good for her, but personally I am not at all interested in gals with that business plan, no matter how good looking they are.[/QUOTE]That was only 1 particularly diligent girl that I knew (she is retired now) that hooked customers very easily. I don't see many girls getting multiple STs per night even though I know it exists at Bacarra and Rainbow type bars.

Don't know why such a girl puts you off so badly. It purely depends how well she treats the customers, just like top girls in Oilies doing 5 to 10 customers per day.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1842535]I don't quite understand. Why is the difference between ST and LT so low? Is this basically due to girl only having the chance to make one ST per night? Does the girl keep all the 2000 ST or is someone taking a cut out of that? Since you aren't paying that to her directly. Is this a set fee?

Why so much as 500 to the momasan? She must be raking it in?

I have been to T Det. My buddy took a short time but I did not. I found it a bit less easy to get to the most desirable girl than at cowboy. I. e. She was busy or assigned to other tables. I didn't find the next best level good enough to my taste.

Do you often end up getting your first choice girl easily? I guess there is always returning another night, but I couldn't be bothered, as not immediately hooked by the setup.

I suppose I did not know the system on how to get a lap dance from the most desired girl when she was not in the vicinity. Most of the customers sit politely and don't run around chasing a girl like I was tempted to do but resisted.

Its too spread out for me. This limits. the girls that are dancing nearby. If I like a girl, I would like to be near where she is dancing but this is not practical.

I guess this place is designed for guys that are not fussy and should like all the girls equally well. Not how I operate. I like a very small portion of the girls and ignore all the rest. You take a long time to see all the girls there wirh their rotation system and then by the time you have worked out which one you like, she is bound to be busy already with a customer.

Perhaps there are ways for a regular to overcome this?[/QUOTE]BKKDog,

Any chance to enlighten us on any of these questions? I thought perhaps some questions could be answered easily. Of course I can understand if you don't like the questions for one reason or another. Just that my one visit there did not give me enough knowledge to understand the workings that well myself?

Syzy.

A few more things I want to mention about Saphan Kawai gogos, after all these years going there occasionally, I still do not get much fun from there. One really annoying thing is that the concierge will try to push you with all these most least attractive ones constantly, one that tip concierge to find customers for them. They will simply sit the girl down next to you and coerce you to take her. You really have to be brave to turn them away one by one, until the concierge get pissed. This happen to me constantly there in Dted as well. Maybe I can kind of answer some of the questions by other poster. You would be very lucky to get the cuter girl as a newbie customer, these cuter ones are all taken or reserved by their Thai regular VIPs who tip their regular concierge very well, a few times I asked to bring some cuties over, the concierge always say things like she is with customer, or she is waiting for her customer, in my memory I never got the one I wanted, almost always have to compromise with what's left or accept what concierge force you to take.

Another annoying thing is these waiter and waitress constantly try to persuade you to order food and drinks, I always end up order a very overpriced fried rice or fried chicken to keep them away. At the end, I always end up sitting with someone I don't have much interest, and then be persuaded to get a lap dance, another 100 gone to the drain for 3 min which you don't even get excited to hug and touch with. SK is always a bit frustrated experience for me. Maybe these SK pros may have different experience. A few weeks ago, I was in BKK for a transit and went to Rainbow in SK, I think no relation to Rainbow in Nana, it was another frustrated experience there, saw a few semi cuties, asked 3 different ladies to go ST, but got rejected by all, saying they don't do outing or saying only go dance or drink or eat okay, WTF. These girls in some of the shops like Rainbow really play hard games.

[QUOTE=ShinShin;1843658]A few more things I want to mention about Saphan Kawai gogos, after all these years going there occasionally, I still do not get much fun from there. One really annoying thing is that the concierge will try to push you with all these most least attractive ones constantly, one that tip concierge to find customers for them. They will simply sit the girl down next to you and coerce you to take her. You really have to be brave to turn them away one by one, until the concierge get pissed. This happen to me constantly there in Dted as well. Maybe I can kind of answer some of the questions by other poster. You would be very lucky to get the cuter girl as a newbie customer, these cuter ones are all taken or reserved by their Thai regular VIPs who tip their regular concierge very well, a few times I asked to bring some cuties over, the concierge always say things like she is with customer, or she is waiting for her customer, in my memory I never got the one I wanted, almost always have to compromise with what's left or accept what concierge force you to take.
[/QUOTE]Saying no to rubbish food is not hard for me, I don't really do "gup gaam" too often, and I believe I also told them don't bother bringing girls to me, as I am far too fussy, and that I would point out any girls of interest. So I would not even be polite enough to allow some random girl to sit with me. I would simply say no thanks. However I take your point about the few hot girls being booked by regular Thais already. The rest were of little interest. It seems very weird to Thais that I don't drink alcohol, like beers or whiskey, and they are quite surprised I speak Thai well.

So I ended up with some medium good girl sitting with me, but not that exciting. Seemed to get charged for somewhat more time than she was actually with me, as she would come and go for various reasons. So a bit of a con job really, and yes probably charged for various silly things that were never ordered. I don't need wet towels, and other blah blah. They probably had no diet drinks other than water or soda. That was my experience from a one off visit. I used my girl mainly to chat and find out how the place worked somewhat. Of course quite a few things forgotten, was too long ago (1 year?).

In a Cowboy bar, I am more aware of how much is spent on a girl. 160 Baht times the number of drinks. If I really like the girl and she is truly my choice, that is not a big deal for me. In Crazy House I can often get to the girls I like by being quite pro active. Like just get my waitress to go tell the girl I would like to buy her a drink, if I haven't managed to catch her eye and signal myself. This is as soon as possible after she starts working. Sometimes fails. Sometimes too slow. LOL. Like Number 4 Jane / Jaeng rarely is available. Usually arrives with her customer already in tow, just to get the BF arrangements done etc. She is not the best looking but not from from it, very cute and very sexy. I can only assume she must be good for her customers, since she is so booked out.

At T Det, we arrived very early, but girls did not parade around past guys as they arrived. Seemed to be much more oriented towards having girls foisted on you, as Sin Shin described. So I would love to know how to get to the good ones. Probably there were no than 3 or girls in 150 that really interested me, given my desires for real Thai looks without surgeries.

The place is pretty huge. I might be better off in a much smaller bar where girls were not far away. Cowboy bars are too cramped. There it was very much the opposite. Too spread out. The whole place is really boring till the dancing got started some time after 11PM, so clearly we had arrived to early, but that did not help to get the good girls. I like when a bar has girls start dancing at 7.30PM or 8PM. What am I going to do waiting around till 11:30 PM, to really get going? If you don't find something, end up getting back to Sukhumvit far too late for my liking.

Perhaps with early closing times, they may start up a bit quicker now?

I speak Thai but clearly do not act like a Thai. I have much preferred a Thai entertainment venue with bands, singers, dancers on a stage such as Tawan Daeng, or Saeng Jun, even though everything is far too loud to have any conversation. I don't like Thai entertainment venues that alternate bands with Coyote Dancers much. Usually the "music" does not suit my generation. At T Det the dancing entertainment was pretty boring to me. I am more used to naked girls or g-strings.

Thanks for the response. I'd love to try this area out, as I usually enjoy venturing off the beaten path, but I did some research further back in the thread, and correct me if I'm wrong but it seems like this area is mostly for Thai speaking folk only. I speak very very little Thai.

[QUOTE=Blanquiceleste;1842528]Simply put, Saphan Kwai means Buffalo Bridge. Experts can correct me if I am wrong.

Google "Saphan Kwai" and you will come across plenty of information. I am not sure the forum has a lot on SK gogo bars. Take the Green line towards Mo Chit, get off at Saphan Kwai and take a short walk. You will get to the stretch of 150 m to 200 m that has around 10 to 12 bars. Small establishments mostly. Take a chance. Not many Farangs there. But all are welcome. One word of advice, travel extremely light and do not get into any sort of argument. It is simply not like Nana or Cowboy or Patpong.[/QUOTE]

I think its all about lack of competition and options. I think the number of girls out there has gone down from a few years ago. At best, it's stayed the same. I remember Bangkok in 2012 ish. You would see portable drinking carts all along Suhkumvit. Now a days you only see a few near Soi Cowboy / Asok. Three years ago I pulled a cart girl for 1200 plus 300 cart fine. Cute, and young with braces, no kids. She was great, I miss her. Lost her number unfortunately.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1843645]I believe that most of these portable cart girls will go ST for 2 K baht, and some won't even negotiate a price. Some guys are trying to get much less than 2 K and I don't know if they manage it.

I am surprised by the girl wanting 3 K. I went with one of these girls similar to how you describe. I did not enjoy it at all. She had 3 babies, very saggy tits and no-feel pussy, and very little sex and kissing ability at all despite her sex experience with Thai men. I paid her 2 K but was a complete waste of money in this particular case. She acted very nice and very honest and was very cute (with clothes on). All those things were not enough to make it work for me at all. I would rather have paid more for one of my favorite hot hot gogo girls. YMMV.[/QUOTE]

Anyone know what happened to stumble inn? Prime location and used to be packed day and night. Girl I know quit and went to work at Hillary, something must have happened. New owners?

Spent a little less than an hour at CH last night as some friends insisted we go there. Guys, honestly, I don't see the attraction. It is very crowded, loud, with horrid music, and they allow smoking. Can't see how it is in anyway fun. The gals are just not all that. Quite a few are plastic surgery nightmares, looking like they had their noses and breasts done by Somchai the plastic surgeon on a street corner in Ubon. Their attitudes are very lacking; almost all of them will smile when looking at their "customer" and then give a blank stare or even a scowl when looking away or at their friends. I used to love GoGos. But jeez, if this is the best BKK has to offer, I'm glad the biz is flagging. Saw only one or two that I would even think about paying 1500ST and not a single one would I even consider to pay the insane prices they are asking. I mean honestly, dudes pay 4 k when all is added in for ST with these gals? Huh? Really I don't see what many of you guys are raving about.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1843742]Spent a little less than an hour at CH last night as some friends insisted we go there. Guys, honestly, I don't see the attraction. It is very crowded, loud, with horrid music, and they allow smoking. Can't see how it is in anyway fun. The gals are just not all that. Quite a few are plastic surgery nightmares, looking like they had their noses and breasts done by Somchai the plastic surgeon on a street corner in Ubon. Their attitudes are very lacking; almost all of them will smile when looking at their "customer" and then give a blank stare or even a scowl when looking away or at their friends. I used to love GoGos. But jeez, if this is the best BKK has to offer, I'm glad the biz is flagging. Saw only one or two that I would even think about paying 1500ST and not a single one would I even consider to pay the insane prices they are asking. I mean honestly, dudes pay 4 k when all is added in for ST with these gals? Huh? Really I don't see what many of you guys are raving about.[/QUOTE]I've been there 3 times this trip, once when I first arrived and they had a smoking hot chick (who I didn't see the last 2 times). Then the second visit there was another smoking hot chick who looked to be 16 years old (but its hard to guess the age of these girls). And then last night. Last night pure and simple sucked. We were there from 7:20 until 9 pm, there was no huge rush of gorgeous girls being barfined by a ton of guys and being led out of the bar (one excuse guys post here to explain why it was lame). Another excuse is we arrived too early (ohhh, all of the girls show up at 9:30 on the dot. Fact of the matter is the nudity attracts guys, not the quality of the girls. My buddy paid 4 k short time for one smoking hot chick, there's no way any of the other girls get half that.

What really sucks about the gogo scene in Bangkok is the whopping price for drinks. Doesn't matter what you order, your always going to be paying 150 baht or more for a beer. Even the regular dive bars along the nana strip charge 140 baht after 8 pm. One reason I love the Pattaya gogo's, their drink specials (45 to 65 baht for a draft) blow away Bangkok prices.

[QUOTE=CaptCabins;1843475]Guys,

This coming March I would be heading to bkk. I booked a hotel at tulip in. I think it would be around 5 minutes from nana and maybe 15 minutes from sow cowboi. In this case if I were to take a girl for short time from nana or cowboi will I need to take a taxi or would the lady walk with me to the hotel. I honestly don't want to waste money on cabs.

My second question was tht I read thr now the ongoing rate for mediocre to good looking gurls are 3000 bht for 1 hour short time. Is negotiating a norm especially for a farang? Or is it in general girls would only accept 3000 baht for short time. By the way is time taken walking / going to your hotel is considered as part of your short time? By the way are CIM and anal considered as extra and if yes what are the rates? Where can I find good looking girls in eithet nana or cowboi that does anal and CIM.[/QUOTE]I am not familiar with Tulip Inn near Nana / Soi Cowboy, but if it is really as close as you say it is to those locations, you shouldn't have a problem getting a girl to walk 5-15 minutes with you to go to your room for ST. 20 minutes is pushing it. It might even be faster to walk a 10-15 minute distance than to take a taxi depending on time of day / night. The girl will usually ask you "Where you stay?" if you are taking her out and one of the many reasons she asks that question is so she'll know whether to change into heels (taxi) or flat shoes (walking). So even if she doesn't ask and you are expecting her to walk 15 minutes with you, you might want to mention, "Oh, we go to Tulip Inn, about 15 minute walk. You ok?

BTW, even if traffic is very thick, a taxi ride (with meter running) to what would ordinarily be a 15 minute walk would probably only be about 50 baht, at most. That is about $1. 45 at today's exchange rate, no tip expected. Not really enough to alter your budget, right? Just make sure you walk the short distance across Sukhumvit Road to or from either Soi 4/ Nana or Asoke / Soi Cowboy and to or from your hotel so the taxi you flag down is already heading in the direction you're going. Where the taxi fares start stacking up is when you hop into a taxi right outside your hotel or outside the bar in either location and then the driver has to circle the Earth in bumper to bumper traffic just to get back to square one facing the right direction you are headed, which happened to be only a 3 minute walk from where you started. Know your location enough to at least catch a taxi heading in the right direction on Sukhumvit Road and simply walk to that spot from the hotel or from the bar where you can do it.

The girl will totally get why you are doing that, why you didn't just hop into the first taxi where the driver approached you at the entrance to Soi Cowboy, for instance. She will totally understand why you walked with her across Asoke (or through the MRT passway) to the escalator up to the BTS Skywalk, then crossed Sukhumvit Road on the BTS Skywalk, walked down the stairs and THEN flagged down a taxi on the proper side of Sukhumvit Road to get you back to your hotel heading in the direction toward Nana or wherever. Just do it that way. She will be with you on that. She will not think you are being silly to pass up those first taxi offers. She will understand why you want to walk to the other side of Sukhumvit Road before hailing a taxi, as in this example.

On your other questions, 2000-2500 baht is certainly do-able for STs with perfectly attractive Soi Cowboy / Nana go-go girls. Plus 700-800 baht barfine and whatever you spend on Lady Drinks, of course. There will be exceptions. But that is what they are; exceptions. And, yes, for that amount you will find go-go girls who will perform BBBJ CIM for you. Just ask before committing to paying the barfine. I am not into anal or any other butt play so I cannot speak from experience on that. Others might know.

IMO, for those of us who CARE if a BJ from a go-go girl is uncovered / no condom rather than covered / condom and that the BBBJ leads to CIM and isn't converted into a Hand Job with a bit of oral foreplay thrown in, the best way to negotiate with the girl in the bar is NOT to negotiate on price exactly. In other words, if the girl says something like, "You pay me 2,500? Don't start naming lower prices like 1500 baht or something like that. That is what most guys do and, again IMO, that is exactly the wrong way to wind up with a go-go girl giving you a real blowjob in your room later. Instead, with a big smile and a pleasant, playful demeanor YOU tell her that if you pay a lady 2,500 baht for ST you would need to get a very sweet blowjob (or "sa-moke" if she doesn't understand the word "blowjob") that finishes 100% inside (point to her mouth). Will you do that for me?" And then wait for a clear "yes" response, not a head nod, not raised eyebrows and a big smile. Only a clear and unambiguous "yes" will do here.

Apply your own style of fun and playful "negotiation" to this, but the point is to make whatever amount of payment she mentions to you (within reason) conditional on her DOING what you want her to do (also within reason). In my examples, 2,500 baht for an unrushed Short Time with a cute or better go-go dancer giving you a BBBJ CIM is "reasonable" as far as I am concerned. Getting a BBBJ CIM with a near stunner go-go dancer for, say, 3,000 baht might also be totally reasonable. Very subjective.

Oh, and reasonable, say 5-15 minute travel time one-way, is not going to count against your hour, 90 minute or two hour Short Time agreement.

Can anyone suggest a guest friendly hotel between Nana and Cowboy? By the way if you use your own hotel as a short time will the girl walk with you to the hotel or insist on using a cab? Is anal and CIM considered as extra or inclusive in short time? Which bar can I go to final light skin anal providers?

[QUOTE=Tomasb;1843259]I was walking around Asoke near Soi Cowboy late last night and early morning. In the past, I just rushed past on my way to
Soi Cowboy but a cute non pro looking girl caught my eye at one of the carts. So for the first time, I stopped and ordered a drink. The girl sat down with me at a nearby table and figuring that a waitress would ask if I wanted to buy her a drink, I immediately asked her if she leaves with guys. This was because several weeks ago I sat down with a cute university aged girl around a Soi 19 Alcocart and bought her a drink only to find she does not go out....
Then she asked how much I could pay and stated my usual limit for short term is 2000. I also noted long term depends on how well short term would go. She kind of chuckled, not budging on her price, and I found myself in a stalemate as I finished my drink. No attempt on her part at negotiation. She was definitely a hottie but would it not cost around 3000 bt for a girl at one of the go-go's? I never BF but I think this forum is replete with stories of 2000 bt for short term and 700 for the BF in go go's. Throw in a few drinks and you are paying a minimum of 3000. However, I wonder if 3000 bt is a common rate at the alcocarts or was this girl attempting to get a premium based on her looks? I suspected that other girls don't ask nearly that much but wondering if anyone has any comments about rates at the alcocarts? The other factor for me in not pursuing this girl was her overall demeanor suggested starfish in the room.....[/QUOTE]Best thing to do is just ask them right upfront if they can go with you. If they aren't working, nothing lost.

As for prices, the three that I have taken from one the carts were 1000 (for 2 girls) and one for 1500. All three stayed LT.

IMO 2000 for a girl working outside is high.

[QUOTE=CaptCabins;1843475]Guys,

This coming March I would be heading to bkk. I booked a hotel at tulip in. I think it would be around 5 minutes from nana and maybe 15 minutes from sow cowboi. In this case if I were to take a girl for short time from nana or cowboi will I need to take a taxi or would the lady walk with me to the hotel. I honestly don't want to waste money on cabs.
[/QUOTE]"I booked a hotel at tulip in" doesn't make good sense. Golden Tulip or something else?

Naturally a girl doesn't want to walk that far. Quite likely has high heels. Sometime a girl agreed to walk 5 minutes to my Hotel sometimes we took a very short taxi ride anyway. 15 minutes? Forget it. You might like walking and walk very fast. 9 times out of 10 the girl doesn't.

300 metres is the maximum walk for the girl unless she knows where she is going and has stated she wants to walk.

You are going to be flashing you gold chain and fancy watch, right? Just kidding. Hope I am wrong. However you can afford a taxi.

There maybe a special case if your Hotel is very close, but very difficult to get to by taxi.

Pre prepare where you will catch the taxi and where you will get off to make it real easy. E. g. Taxis cannot turn right out of Sukhumvit Soi 4, so you might want to cross Sukhumvit before catching a taxi, if going to the odd numbered Soi side, unless the walk is like only 300 or 400 hundred metres. Taxis can exit out of Sukkhumvit Soi 6 or Soi 10 if necessary if you are going to the even numbered Soi side.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1843742]Spent a little less than an hour at CH last night as some friends insisted we go there. Guys, honestly, I don't see the attraction. It is very crowded, loud, with horrid music, and they allow smoking. Can't see how it is in anyway fun. The gals are just not all that. Quite a few are plastic surgery nightmares, looking like they had their noses and breasts done by Somchai the plastic surgeon on a street corner in Ubon. Their attitudes are very lacking; almost all of them will smile when looking at their "customer" and then give a blank stare or even a scowl when looking away or at their friends. I used to love GoGos. But jeez, if this is the best BKK has to offer, I'm glad the biz is flagging. Saw only one or two that I would even think about paying 1500ST and not a single one would I even consider to pay the insane prices they are asking. I mean honestly, dudes pay 4 k when all is added in for ST with these gals? Huh? Really I don't see what many of you guys are raving about.[/QUOTE]The plastic surgery nightmares are in every bar but less in some like CH, unfortunately on the rise. Nice to be able to see them clearly and avoid. Surgeries are also there in the Oilies, e. G. Addict packed with fake noses, and lots of silly tits I am sure, without being able to see all the tits properly. I like no surgery girls, which is why I use CH. Majority of girls still don't have. Nosejobs is on the rise. Worrying.

The line up varies considerably. Very ordinary some days. Hot girls show up sometimes. Have to be there early for best chance to catch them when they arrive. That is my opinion. Girls like Jane and Donut are not seen that often.

No, the business is not flagging. You said it was packed. Bar is going so well, they are intending an expansion, probably into the Dutch Ship restaurant next door. Yes music is too loud. Cannot sit in some locations. Young people like too loud.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1843833]...300 metres is the maximum walk for the girl unless she knows where she is going and has stated she wants to walk.[/QUOTE]What are my chances to take a Soi Cowboy girl out to Hotel Mermaid? Is still considered to be an acceptable walking distance or should I look for a closer by hotel?

Are there better options than bringing a Go-Go girl "home" at night?

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1843833]"I booked a hotel at tulip in" doesn't make good sense. Golden Tulip or something else?

Naturally a girl doesn't want to walk that far. Quite likely has high heels. Sometime a girl agreed to walk 5 minutes to my Hotel sometimes we took a very short taxi ride anyway. 15 minutes? Forget it. You might like walking and walk very fast. 9 times out of 10 the girl doesn't.

300 metres is the maximum walk for the girl unless she knows where she is going and has stated she wants to walk.

You are going to be flashing you gold chain and fancy watch, right? Just kidding. Hope I am wrong. However you can afford a taxi.[/QUOTE]If it is Golden Tulip then it is too far to walk from Soi Cowboy, not necessarily too far to walk from Nana.

My experience with girls willing, scratch that, choosing to walk with me to my apartment from Nana or Soi Cowboy is very different from yours. Some girls love to be outdoors for several minutes for a change, not rush out of an AC bar, hop into an AC taxi and hurry into an AC hotel or apartment every time. Depending on several factors, they might enjoy walking with a customer.

My apartment is a good 12-15 minute walk minimum for me from both Nana and Soi Cowboy, might even approach 20 minutes (but not more) depending on how slow the girl wants to walk. It isn't difficult to guage ones walking speed to suit a lady in heels. It is way more than 300 metres from those bar areas for sure.

For me, the ratio would easily be reversed; 9 times out of 10 I tell a new girl where I live, she is well aware how far it is but insists on not taking a taxi but walking instead. But not walking fast of course. Plenty o' smiles on that hand-in-hand walk. Doesn't do any harm and might improve conditions in the room, too, us having those 12-15 minutes or a bit more to chat it up and play tickle ribs on the way to the room. I never notice discomfort or displeasure in the experience on the girl's part. There is something to be said for a bit of fun and communication, blissfully outside that noisy bar, in anticipation for what is to cum I believe.

Girls I have taken to my apartment multiple times from those bar areas generally have to be convinced to take a taxi or motor bike taxi (which would be faster but usually double the cost of an auto taxi) instead of taking that 15 minute stroll to my room with me when I have preferred to ride instead of walk.

Hmm. Maybe those poor girls just want to delay a fate worse than death by an extra 10 minutes or so by walking with me to my room instead of riding. .

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1843742]Spent a little less than an hour at CH last night as some friends insisted we go there. Guys, honestly, I don't see the attraction. It is very crowded, loud, with horrid music, and they allow smoking. Can't see how it is in anyway fun. The gals are just not all that. Quite a few are plastic surgery nightmares, looking like they had their noses and breasts done by Somchai the plastic surgeon on a street corner in Ubon. Their attitudes are very lacking; almost all of them will smile when looking at their "customer" and then give a blank stare or even a scowl when looking away or at their friends. I used to love GoGos. But jeez, if this is the best BKK has to offer, I'm glad the biz is flagging. Saw only one or two that I would even think about paying 1500ST and not a single one would I even consider to pay the insane prices they are asking. I mean honestly, dudes pay 4 k when all is added in for ST with these gals? Huh? Really I don't see what many of you guys are raving about.[/QUOTE]I don't get that hot beautiful girls are 1000 to 1,5000 Bt on Soi 4 sidewalk and suckers pay LD, BF, tips, & 4000 Bt+ in those stupid bars.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1843837]No, the business is not flagging.[/QUOTE]Very few GoGos do a good biz these days. CH is one of the few exceptions, though for the life of me I can't see why. Poke your head into most GoGos and they are quite empty. The GoGo biz is on the decline in BKK. Can't speak for Pattaya as I have only been there for three nights in the past three years.

How are things at the Biergarten? Anyone getting lucky there?

[QUOTE=JesseJames;1843891]I don't get that hot beautiful girls are 1000 to 1,5000 Bt on Soi 4 sidewalk and suckers pay LD, BF, tips, & 4000 Bt+ in those stupid bars.[/QUOTE]It cost more so it must be better.

[QUOTE=CaptCabins;1843774]Can anyone suggest a guest friendly hotel between Nana and Cowboy? By the way if you use your own hotel as a short time will the girl walk with you to the hotel or insist on using a cab?[/QUOTE]I like Citypoint Hotel a lot ([URL]https://www.booking.com/hotel/th/citypoint.en-gb.html[/URL]) when I stay a few days in Bangkok. For a longer stay, I'd rather book a studio at Citadines Soi 23. Both places are within easy walking distance from Soi Cowboy and none of the girls I brought there complained or wanted a taxi.

Of course, both places are guest-friendly and will take a photocopy of the girl's ID-card.

[QUOTE=CaptCabins;1843774]Is anal and CIM considered as extra or inclusive in short time?[/QUOTE]You will have to negotiate that with the girl before you barfine her. Some will do, some won't, some may ask extra money.

[QUOTE=CaptCabins;1843774]Which bar can I go to find light skin anal providers?[/QUOTE]Cockatoo in Soi Cowboy? .

I'm reading all the posts related to Freelancers from some time spread across various pages both in BKK / Pattaya forums.

What I understood form the reports is "Never bargain / consider a Freelancer for LT even if she is looking like a stunner". The reason behind this is obvious & known to all. Instead bargain with them for ST and while bargaining surely mention that you might continue LT with them if they perform well in ST. This option gives flexibility in terms of examining the girl based on her body & performance. It also somehow indicates the girl that she can earn for the whole night if perform well. Not sure whether all Freelancers agree to these kind of terms but I believe it's possible.

This is just my view, anyone have any better way to deal with Freelancers feel free to suggest.

[QUOTE=CaptCabins;1843774]Can anyone suggest a guest friendly hotel between Nana and Cowboy? [/QUOTE]I like Salil Hotel on soi 11, because you can bring 2 girls for a threesome without pay any extra charge for second guest.

[QUOTE=CaptCabins;1843774] By the way if you use your own hotel as a short time will the girl walk with you to the hotel or insist on using a cab? [/QUOTE]I found many girls that are lazy to walk for 10 minutes and this is a bad sign for me.

[QUOTE=CaptCabins;1843774] Is anal and CIM considered as extra or inclusive in short time? [/QUOTE]Always ask in advance what you want.

[QUOTE=CaptCabins;1843774] Which bar can I go to final light skin anal providers?[/QUOTE]For be sure about anal you can go to Eden Club on soi 7/1 or check the PSE oils massage around soi 24/26.

[QUOTE=DCups;1843912]How are things at the Biergarten? Anyone getting lucky there?[/QUOTE]I was there in October and very satisfied. Thai women, even being 30 old or more, keep thin bodies and all provided self-evidently BBBJ and CIM (one even anal, but I don't like). Had 3 women in 2 days, all very nice, handsome and. ;cheap. For me it is necessarily my 1st destination when going back. AT Nataree, you will see plenty of really beautiful girls but you will pay at least 2500 and even not get a BBBJ! So think about.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1843967]Cockatoo in Soi Cowboy? .[/QUOTE]555555555.

[QUOTE=DCups;1843912]How are things at the Biergarten? Anyone getting lucky there?[/QUOTE]Was there last night. Almost all of the women are old. I would say the average age in the evenings is over 40 with some clocking in at well over 50. Pretty scary actually. There is always a few gals worth taking though.

Thanks. That sounds more like it and more in tune with Nana parking lot girls. Can't say that I saw many good looking girls in and around the Alcocarts on my visit but timing is everything -- same as in Nana. As much as I hate to admit this, it's possible the Alcocart girl I interacted with simply did not want to go with me and quoted a high price to discourage me. Be*.

[QUOTE=PipeLayer99;1843800]Best thing to do is just ask them right upfront if they can go with you. If they aren't working, nothing lost.

As for prices, the three that I have taken from one the carts were 1000 (for 2 girls) and one for 1500. All three stayed LT.

IMO 2000 for a girl working outside is high.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Hiete;1843865]What are my chances to take a Soi Cowboy girl out to Hotel Mermaid? Is still considered to be an acceptable walking distance or should I look for a closer by hotel?

Are there better options than bringing a Go-Go girl "home" at night?[/QUOTE]Unless the girl is wearing spike heels or is wobbly on her feet from alcohol, I wouldn't waste the time trying to flag down a taxi who will agree to take me to Hotel Mermaid. I would just walk there with her. Go by way of Soi 23 where Crazy House is rather than back toward Asoke and it couldn't take you more than 6-8 minutes.

[QUOTE=JesseJames;1843891]I don't get that hot beautiful girls are 1000 to 1,5000 Bt on Soi 4 sidewalk and suckers pay LD, BF, tips, & 4000 Bt+ in those stupid bars.[/QUOTE]I would say that if the top 20% better looking girls working in many if not most of the Nana / Soi Cowboy go-go bars didn't show up for work at their bar tonight but instead began to stand on Sukhumvit Road and Soi 4 looking for customers at 1,000-1,500 baht per ST, this night would go down in history as one of the most remarkable buyer's opportunities of the past decade.

You can find diamonds in the rough on those streets. But the reality is you will find a much more concentrated selection of good bodies, attractive faces, young and healthy girls as well as better performance level in the go-go bars than in any other option in the city. And it isn't as though you are getting nothing of value by paying those additional charges. You are sitting in an air-conditioned bar, can order something to drink while you scan the ladies, see the girls much more in the flesh rather than bundled up hiding all the usual problem areas, watch how they move their bodies (or not), she will sit next to you nearly naked for a time so you can find out if there is a critical body-to-body chemistry going between the two of you before you say let's go and so on.

So, yes, it can be a cheaper option to just pick a girl standing on Soi 4 and go to your hotel room. But I don't think customers are suckers for looking for a girl in a go-go bar instead. They are getting something of value in those go-go bars that the freelancer customer is not getting. Where they fall into the sucker category, IMO, is in the way they do or do not choose to negotiate and communicate with the girls what they want in exchange for what the girl expects them to pay. But that can be the case with the freelancer customer just as well as with the go-go bar customer.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1844057]as well as better performance level in the go-go bars than in any other option in the city. [/QUOTE]I beg to differ. GoGo gal's performance pales in comparison to what you get at oilies, where a well polished skill set, rimming, CIM, DFK, MSOG, good attitudes, getting performance for the full time you pay for is standard. And in many cases A+ is available. I frequented GoGos back in the "Good Ole Days" and even then the best gals were not up to the performance standards one gets in the PSE oilies today.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1844069]I beg to differ. GoGo gal's performance pales in comparison to what you get at oilies, where a well polished skill set, rimming, CIM, DFK, MSOG, good attitudes, getting performance for the full time you pay for is standard. And in many cases A+ is available. I frequented GoGos back in the "Good Ole Days" and even then the best gals were not up to the performance standards one gets in the PSE oilies today.[/QUOTE]You're talking about specific acts, not level or maybe I should have said quality of performance. I have found that the quality of FS and BBBJ CIM I have gotten with go-go girls is WAY better than the best of either I have ever gotten in an oily, most of which were mechanical, misguided auto-pilot disasters.

But, yes, if I were looking for a girl to rim my butt with her tongue (doubtful that I ever would, but just saying), I would go to an oily to find her, not a go-go bar.

[QUOTE=MusicalToM;1843972]What I understood form the reports is "Never bargain / consider a Freelancer for LT even if she is looking like a stunner". The reason behind this is obvious & known to all. Instead bargain with them for ST and while bargaining surely mention that you might continue LT with them if they perform well in ST. [/QUOTE]I don't know dude. In all of these years I can not really remember having a bad performing FL in Thailand. And in general all I do is FL and LT. Just to give a margin of error I will say there have been 2 bad performers out of hundreds in the last 11 years. Now if we were talking about Dominican Republic then that would be good advice. But in my experience bad performance from a Thai FL is few and far between.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1844042]Was there last night. Almost all of the women are old. I would say the average age in the evenings is over 40 with some clocking in at well over 50. Pretty scary actually. There is always a few gals worth taking though.[/QUOTE]Without even thinking too much about age, I have visited Biergarten several times, but never actually took a girl from there. May have visited at non ideal time. Maybe found the place a little boring. Probably my fruitless search for a stunner interfered with relaxing and enjoying myself properly.

I have enjoyed spending a bit of time at a bar like Stumble Inn a bit more so, but did find that spending any length of time there used up money with limited rewards. Its okay For guys needing a bit of female company I guess.

I have had some really pathetic experiences with freelancers, and only a very small number of free lancers were ever worth repeating. This is quite the opposite of Mr Enternational, who never had a bad one. Maybe his selection method is far better than mine and I am too looks oriented (not that I can really see the body properly).

I have also met some freelancers of amazingly nice character. One or two from Thermae many years ago come to mind. Not necessarily best bodies but very superior attitude. The real part timers, just a bit short of money at some point, were probably the best for attitutude. I would be doubtful about free lancers that work every day at the same spot. In that case, probably just looking for quick Baht could be the norm.

The only time I ever met a really stunning freelancer, she was outside my Hotel after midnight, I had just returned from a fuck, and badly needed some sleep before catching a very early flight. Worst possible scenario, so I passed. Recently have met a good looking free lancer or two. Don't like the pushiness of one of them, and whining if did not buy her a drink. The other was no fun on the bed.

My overall view of freelance. Can be very cheap, but the quality ain't there. It's easier to just go to an Oily MP and view the line up, unless you want to spend a lot of time chatting girls up first.

I am always thinking, what sort of disaster will greet me when the FL takes her clothes off. I don't expect perfection, however would be a nice surprise.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1843903]Very few GoGos do a good biz these days. CH is one of the few exceptions, though for the life of me I can't see why. Poke your head into most GoGos and they are quite empty. The GoGo biz is on the decline in BKK. Can't speak for Pattaya as I have only been there for three nights in the past three years.[/QUOTE]Agreed. Bargirls have got too expensive. The punter wants a cheap freelancer to cut the overheads. I don't want cheap. I want stunning dream girls if possible. I am also not looking for the so called "skill" sets that are really just service sets provided. Some of the well trained Oily "super" girls for me give weak kissing, weak BJ, and weak GFE. I just like it differently. Probably some girls are happier with the man that just lies back and does nothing, and lets her run the show. I don't care where a girl works, I just want her to be adaptable to me, not running to a script.

Different bars have to know exactly what they are catering for to pull the customer. Bacarra undeniably works very well, just not for me. I don't go for all the fake surgeried girls, and the place is too crowded (can't see the girls properly in the throng). It's also a bit too boring.

CH works as well but for a slightly different set of customers. Those who are not so keen on the surgeries, even I have to admit nose jobs are badly on the rise and boob jobs too. The music is a bit more danceable for the girls, the stage is less crowded, you can see the overall line up a bit better. Doesn't take that long to see all the top girls are missing on certain occasions. Nudity is useful for making bar less boring, and being able to fully evaluate a girl's body.

Suzi Wong still struggles along and has tried to boost customer by going the ugly Pat Pong shows route in addition to their sexy shows. Too many fatty girls in the modern day however a recent visit showed reduced fatties. I guess only the shows keeps them going.

Long Gun became a boring bar after they lost their fabulous Cabaret shows a few years back, in my opinion. Business is low. Doll House has had a refit, but failing to draw customers much. Some girls are nude.

Essentially there is only one way to succeed. The bar has to find ways to pull lots of new girls that are good looking. CH initially did this by paying girl much higher monthly salaries than other bars. The CH quality now has dropped off. The supply of stunning girls wanting to work gogo is just not high enough. Some girls don't want to be nude. Its against social values. Girls often change later to nude, if they get body into shape, or overcome their shyness.

Many of the young good looking girls want to become Coyotes, even they don't have the Coyote dancing ability. A high proportion of young girls are being wrecked by: junk food, babies, surgeries, and taken by other roles like Coyotes. What is left for pretty girls, is getting so scarce. Now new lawas have excluded the under 20 YO girls. In the old days a large portion of young beauties did not meet this rule, and some of the girls were not even really Thai nationals.

Bars are mainly for the tourists, but I still use them. I don't really give a shit about shops or establishments. I go purely where I have found a girl or girls that I like and are well above the average surgeried looks. A single girl can pull me to a place, but in that case, I would usually contact her by LINE, first.

Any place that consistently delivers me something, is worth calling in for a quick look. If don't find it, move on.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1844109]Agreed. Bargirls have got too expensive. The punter wants a cheap freelancer to cut the overheads. I don't want cheap. I want stunning dream girls if possible. I am also not looking for the so called "skill" sets that are really just service sets provided. Some of the well trained Oily "super" girls for me give weak kissing, weak BJ, and weak GFE. I just like it differently. Probably some girls are happier with the man that just lies back and does nothing, and lets her run the show. I don't care where a girl works, I just want her to be adaptable to me, not running to a script.

Many of the young good looking girls want to become Coyotes, even they don't have the Coyote dancing ability. A high proportion of young girls are being wrecked by: junk food, babies, surgeries, and taken by other roles like Coyotes. What is left for pretty girls, is getting so scarce. Now new lawas have excluded the under 20 YO girls. In the old days a large portion of young beauties did not meet this rule, and some of the girls were not even really Thai nationals.[/QUOTE]Agreed! I hate scripts and that is why I have found oily gals to be so great. They seem to adapt to what I want, hell, even to what mood I am in that day very quickly. Sometimes I want to be the aggressor and sometimes I want to lay back and be serviced. Most of the gals I take in the oilies can monitor and adjust.

And honestly, if I saw a "stunning dream girl" who performed like a porn star or a girlfriend I would have no problem at all paying top dollar for it. But honestly, I don't see any of those in any establishments.

Guys,

How do you be discrete for our activities in Thailand. I booked my ticket and my hotel together to get cheaper rates but now I am guessing the hotel staff would have my my full name and passport and etc. If I were to bring a girl to the hotel wouldn't they know? On another note I believe in Thailand you have to carry your passport everywhere so how do you guys make sure the lady does not open your passport and find out your identity? Could you guys share some tips on how to remain discrete and make sure nothing gets stolen? By the way I did a quite search on youtubr and it seems there is a poster who takes video and exposes guys soliciting ladies. He would sit in front of the short time hotel and switch on his camera. You can see mostly farang with younger ladies and etc. Am I being paranoid here?

[QUOTE=CaptCabins;1844179]
How do you be discrete for our activities in Thailand.[/QUOTE]I just visit the places with rooms, such as oillies, massage shops and soapies. If I go to a gogo, I just get a ST room, or ask the girl if she knows of a LT room. There are rooms that provide LT for pretty reasonable rates. I think there is one on Soi 33, maybe the compact hotel or behind it.

[QUOTE=CaptCabins;1844179]
If I were to bring a girl to the hotel wouldn't they know?
[/QUOTE]They don't care the slightest. It's not like in the west, where sex / nudity is somehow worse than violence. (EG: America prohibits the slightest nipple slip on television, but viewing decapitation is somehow acceptable.).

[QUOTE=CaptCabins;1844179]
On another note I believe in Thailand you have to carry your passport everywhere so how do you guys make sure the lady does not open your passport and find out your identity?
[/QUOTE]Simply not true, and very, very bad idea to carry your passport. It must be kept locked in your safe. On my first trip, I originally thought I had to carry my passport with me. And got drunk, and I thought I lost my passport on my first trip. I didn't as it was in my room.

[QUOTE=CaptCabins;1844179]
Could you guys share some tips on how to remain discrete and make sure nothing gets stolen?
[/QUOTE]Well, I can tell you are new. And if I can, a hooker can spot it a mile away. But you seem to have some smarts if you are planning things out so you'll probably be fine. Just a few rules: 1. Don't drink anything in the room 2. Don't let girls buy drinks for you. 3. Keep your drink in your hand or very nearby, to prevent a girl from spiking it in a club. 4. If you're new, and alone, better to avoid meeting in clubs (freelancers). In fact, some say better to avoid freelancers for a number of reasons (quality, looks and price are all bad in Bangkok freelancer market it seems?

[QUOTE=CaptCabins;1844179]
By the way I did a quite search on youtubr and it seems there is a poster who takes video and exposes guys soliciting ladies.
[/QUOTE]Everything is on youtube these days. That's just the world we live in now. A lot of noise really, nobody really hones in on that particular video of something so boring. A lot of people put random crap on youtube just to try to make money. Wouldn't be surprised if the guy who uploaded that video was also a frequenter of the same brothels he was video taping.

[QUOTE=CaptCabins;1844179] Am I being paranoid here?[/QUOTE]Yes, too much.

[QUOTE=ParkVille;1844377]
Simply not true, and very, very bad idea to carry your passport. It must be kept locked in your safe. [/QUOTE]Are you sure? [URL]http://pattayaone.net/pattaya-news/221631/30-foreigners-detained-during-id-checks-in-pattaya-nightclubs/[/URL].

[QUOTE=ParkVille;1844377] In fact, some say better to avoid freelancers for a number of reasons [/QUOTE]In fact is very difficult get scammed from freelancers. With a little care, avoiding to be too much drunk and use a hotel where the staff check girl's ID and call you in the room when you finish the session is enough for not have problem with a freelancers.

Recommend to avoid freelancers is a simply no sense, IMHO.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1844109]Agreed. Bargirls have got too expensive. The punter wants a cheap freelancer to cut the overheads. I don't want cheap. I want stunning dream girls if possible. I am also not looking for the so called "skill" sets that are really just service sets provided. Some of the well trained Oily "super" girls for me give weak kissing, weak BJ, and weak GFE. I just like it differently. Probably some girls are happier with the man that just lies back and does nothing, and lets her run the show. I don't care where a girl works, I just want her to be adaptable to me, not running to a script.

Different bars have to know exactly what they are catering for to pull the customer. Bacarra undeniably works very well, just not for me. I don't go for all the fake surgeried girls, and the place is too crowded (can't see the girls properly in the throng). It's also a bit too boring.

CH works as well but for a slightly different set of customers. Those who are not so keen on the surgeries, even I have to admit nose jobs are badly on the rise and boob jobs too. The music is a bit more danceable for the girls, the stage is less crowded, you can see the overall line up a bit better. Doesn't take that long to see all the top girls are missing on certain occasions. Nudity is useful for making bar less boring, and being able to fully evaluate a girl's body.

Suzi Wong still struggles along and has tried to boost customer by going the ugly Pat Pong shows route in addition to their sexy shows. Too many fatty girls in the modern day however a recent visit showed reduced fatties. I guess only the shows keeps them going.

Long Gun became a boring bar after they lost their fabulous Cabaret shows a few years back, in my opinion. Business is low. Doll House has had a refit, but failing to draw customers much. Some girls are nude.

Essentially there is only one way to succeed. The bar has to find ways to pull lots of new girls that are good looking. CH initially did this by paying girl much higher monthly salaries than other bars. The CH quality now has dropped off. The supply of stunning girls wanting to work gogo is just not high enough. Some girls don't want to be nude. Its against social values. Girls often change later to nude, if they get body into shape, or overcome their shyness.

Many of the young good looking girls want to become Coyotes, even they don't have the Coyote dancing ability. A high proportion of young girls are being wrecked by: junk food, babies, surgeries, and taken by other roles like Coyotes. What is left for pretty girls, is getting so scarce. Now new lawas have excluded the under 20 YO girls. In the old days a large portion of young beauties did not meet this rule, and some of the girls were not even really Thai nationals.

Bars are mainly for the tourists, but I still use them. I don't really give a shit about shops or establishments. I go purely where I have found a girl or girls that I like and are well above the average surgeried looks. A single girl can pull me to a place, but in that case, I would usually contact her by LINE, first.

Any place that consistently delivers me something, is worth calling in for a quick look. If don't find it, move on.[/QUOTE]Go over and read the first few posts in the Angeles City forum. Same same as Thailand. High prices, bad attitudes, and poor service. Our hobby is morphing into something that we all won't enjoy so much.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1844452]Go over and read the first few posts in the Angeles City forum. Same same as Thailand. High prices, bad attitudes, and poor service. Our hobby is morphing into something that we all won't enjoy so much.[/QUOTE]Actually my biggest problems are different: Surgeries, increase in over weight young girls, and dick scared girls with no stamina, lack of stunners, and sometimes poor GFE. In terms of price, I woud prefer to say many girls are not really good value for money, specially in Soapies and bars. If the girl is fabulous, I don't mind paying a bit more, but alas the fabulous ones are less common. Hard to build up a set of favorite girls. Hard to find the special ones.

The biggest problem is we get harder to please and like a much narrower range of girls. I always have to compare to my GF, who Is still pretty hot to look at, at least. Her attitude is not so hot as I would like. If only she was horny very often and acted provocative. She remains far too shy to be provocative.

I guess by bad attitude you mean wanting easy money and not being very service oriented, which sort of goes with high prices and poor service.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1844486]Actually my biggest problems are different: Surgeries, increase in over weight young girls, and dick scared girls with no stamina, lack of stunners, and sometimes poor GFE. In terms of price, I woud prefer to say many girls are not really good value for money, specially in Soapies and bars. If the girl is fabulous, I don't mind paying a bit more, but alas the fabulous ones are less common. Hard to build up a set of favorite girls. Hard to find the special ones.

The biggest problem is we get harder to please and like a much narrower range of girls. I always have to compare to my GF, who Is still pretty hot to look at, at least. Her attitude is not so hot as I would like. If only she was horny very often and acted provocative. She remains far too shy to be provocative.

I guess by bad attitude you mean wanting easy money and not being very service oriented, which sort of goes with high prices and poor service.[/QUOTE]Very good post Syz. I would agree. I have no problem paying more money for top notch looks and top notch service. It is very hard to find gals that "float my boat" these days. Had a nice one last night. A FL I have not seen for about 8 years. Late 30's, no kid, rocking body, light skin, pink nips, wonderfully pleasant attitude, no rush, and great performance. Saw her on Suk, she said, "Pay duay" and we were off to the ST Hotel. Great sesh of about 45 min - 1 h, paid her 1 K. She was happy, and so was I. I remember when that was the norm. Sigh.

[QUOTE=CaptCabins;1844179]Guys,

How do you be discrete for our activities in Thailand. I booked my ticket and my hotel together to get cheaper rates but now I am guessing the hotel staff would have my my full name and passport and etc.[/QUOTE]All hotels in Thailand are required by law to take down name and passport details of all their guests. It doesn't matter whether you bought a package holiday or booked directly with the hotel or through a web-site or even simply walked in and got yourself a room.

Some "short time hotels" may be a bit more lenient on the registration requirement, but actually nobody cares.

Contrary to what many seem to believe, Thai people are friendly and not out to take advantage of you or scam you or black-mail you. And actually they don't care who you bring to your room: your wife, your girlfriend, your "mia noi", a hooker or your maiden aunt. Even those very cute reception desk girls don't loose their smiles if you bring yet another lady to your room.

[QUOTE=CaptCabins;1844179]If I were to bring a girl to the hotel wouldn't they know?[/QUOTE]Of course they know and I think it amuses them to no end if you somehow try to hide it, like trying to sneak past reception without showing her ID. I always walk up boldly to the reception desk and ask my companion to show her ID card. In some hotels they take a copy, in other they keep the ID card. If anything, the reception girls seem to appreciate your honesty and openeness and making it more easy on them to process "guest" registration.

[QUOTE=CaptCabins;1844179]On another note I believe in Thailand you have to carry your pasport everywhere so how do you guys make sure the lady does not open your passport and find out your identity?[/QUOTE]Huh? Why would she do that? I must say I never heard stories about nosy girls trying to find out the identity of their customers. Yes, I do use a nickname when in Thailand, but mainly because my real name is unpronounceable for Thais. Even my Thai GF uses my nickname rather then my real name.

I know that on many sites it is advised to only carry a copy of your passport when going out. I find this a bad advice, at least in Thailand. I always carry my passport with me, just as I always carry my ID-card in my home country. What's the difference? Thai people carry their ID-cards too al the time. If it's OK for them, it will be OK for us too.

[QUOTE=CaptCabins;1844179] Could you guys share some tips on how to remain discrete and make sure nothing gets stolen?[/QUOTE]You are probably more likely to get mugged in an average big Western city than in Thailand, but pick-pockets are everywhere unfortunately. Just don't carry more money than you actually need, pay most things with your credit card so you limit the amount of cash you need. In your room, keep the real valuable stuff (spare cash, tablet, camera) in the safe box and don't bring unecessary luxuries: a Casio watch keeps the time at least as well, if not better than your expensive Rolex. Gold necklaces, diamond rings, rubies and emeralds are best kept at home.

[QUOTE=CaptCabins;1844179]By the way I did a quite search on youtubr and it seems there is a poster who takes video and exposes guys soliciting ladies. He would sit in front of the short time hotel and switch on his camera. You can see mostly farang with younger ladies and etc. Am I being paranoid here?[/QUOTE]Yes, you are. And that guy is the best reason to take the girls to your normal hotel rather than a short time hotel. He is not going to video all hotels in Bangkok, is he?. Besides, every second, hours of video footage is being uploaded on YouTube. You and and your temporary girlfriend will "drown" in a sea of cute internet kittens and badly filmed holiday pictures.

[QUOTE=ShinShin;1843658]A few more things I want to mention about Saphan Kawai gogos, after all these years going there occasionally, I still do not get much fun from there. One really annoying thing is that the concierge will try to push you with all these most least attractive ones constantly, one that tip concierge to find customers for them. They will simply sit the girl down next to you and coerce you to take her. You really have to be brave to turn them away one by one, until the concierge get pissed. This happen to me constantly there in Dted as well. Maybe I can kind of answer some of the questions by other poster. You would be very lucky to get the cuter girl as a newbie customer, these cuter ones are all taken or reserved by their Thai regular VIPs who tip their regular concierge very well, a few times I asked to bring some cuties over, the concierge always say things like she is with customer, or she is waiting for her customer, in my memory I never got the one I wanted, almost always have to compromise with what's left or accept what concierge force you to take.

Another annoying thing is these waiter and waitress constantly try to persuade you to order food and drinks, I always end up order a very overpriced fried rice or fried chicken to keep them away. At the end, I always end up sitting with someone I don't have much interest, and then be persuaded to get a lap dance, another 100 gone to the drain for 3 min which you don't even get excited to hug and touch with. SK is always a bit frustrated experience for me. Maybe these SK pros may have different experience. A few weeks ago, I was in BKK for a transit and went to Rainbow in SK, I think no relation to Rainbow in Nana, it was another frustrated experience there, saw a few semi cuties, asked 3 different ladies to go ST, but got rejected by all, saying they don't do outing or saying only go dance or drink or eat okay, WTF. These girls in some of the shops like Rainbow really play hard games.[/QUOTE]I think the problem might be you my brother. Every time I go, if I'm not hungry, I decline the food. Beer is much cheaper than Soi cowboy or Nana, I just tell them I'm not hungry and keep ordering beer. If you don't want to drink and you sit there and order 1 beer every hour, then of course, any bar won't be happy. Think about it, it's common sense.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1844546]Very good post Syz. I would agree. I have no problem paying more money for top notch looks and top notch service. It is very hard to find gals that "float my boat" these days. Had a nice one last night. A FL I have not seen for about 8 years. Late 30's, no kid, rocking body, light skin, pink nips, wonderfully pleasant attitude, no rush, and great performance. Saw her on Suk, she said, "Pay duay" and we were off to the ST Hotel. Great sesh of about 45 min - 1 h, paid her 1 K. She was happy, and so was I. I remember when that was the norm. Sigh.[/QUOTE]I seldom pick up a FL due to safety concerns. Always heard that it's better to have a bar girl because you know where to track her down. Also, I like to have drinks and chat with someone before I decide whether she will be fun in bed too.

[QUOTE=ChristianG;1844383]Yes, too much.

Are you sure? [URL]http://pattayaone.net/pattaya-news/221631/30-foreigners-detained-during-id-checks-in-pattaya-nightclubs/[/URL].

In fact is very difficult get scammed from freelancers. With a little care, avoiding to be too much drunk and use a hotel where the staff check girl's ID and call you in the room when you finish the session is enough for not have problem with a freelancers.

Recommend to avoid freelancers is a simply no sense, IMHO.[/QUOTE]It's very much worth noting that nothing reported on pattayaone is credible. Horrible source of information. They always spin the story leaving only 20% of it accurate. The people who are victims in some of those stories will show up in the comments and clearly explain how wrong and biased that website is, giving an account of the events that is so different than what was "reported". However, that doesn't mean it didn't happen according to what they say, in this particular case. Just depends on how much they feel the need to fabricate reality, since their so concerned with Pattaya's tourist image.

So "detained" doesn't mean arrested. It usually just means that the police stopped you for some duration, asking questions, or maybe you had to sit in a waiting room in the police station. Going to a club with your real passport is a horrible idea. It's so easy for it to just fall out of your pockets.

So, the article says (which is hard to believe what they say, given their past / recent screw ups):

[QUOTE]On this occasion 30 foreign nationals were briefly detained at the Tourist Police Station until they were able to produce their passports.[/QUOTE]Which is exactly why I keep my passport safe. In the event I am detained, I can have it produced within mere hours. If I lose it however, I am stuck dealing with my consulate in proving my identity, which is difficult, and requires original birth certificates. Furthermore, the consulates in Thailand are very corrupt. The US consulate has connections with the boiler room mafia and even had 2 American citizens, who the mafia feared would snitch, falsely arrested (silenced): [URL]http://www.andrew-drummond.com/2015/02/bangkok-boiler-rooms-part-2-exclusive.html[/URL].

[QUOTE=ChristianG;1844383]
Recommend to avoid freelancers is a simply no sense, IMHO.
[/QUOTE]It is quite logical. For a newbie, simply avoid freelancers, if they are so timid and concerned. Let them get their feet wet with all the other options, which will still be sensory overload for them anyway. There are many reports (not in the corrupt media) of men being drugged and robbed. Sometimes they are dosed too high and die in their room.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1844564]Thai people carry their ID-cards too al the time. If it's OK for them, it will be OK for us too.[/QUOTE]Thais can replace their ID cards in their own country, within a reasonable process. They have access to plenty of paperwork and trust (family farm for example). Passports on the other hand, are way more difficult to replace while abroad. Maybe your country and their Thai consulate, this is easy. But for say a country like America, it is not a simple process. It requires: "an original or certified copy of a USA Birth certificate, or a previous or expired passport. " Good luck trying to get your original birth certificate IN A FOREIGN COUNTRY. You can have it mailed to you, but pray to the gods that isn't lost in transit or you will be screwed.

Basically, what it comes down to, is, for Americans. Carry your passport with you, if you don't mind going thru the hassles of replacing it. If you have a previously expired passport, you are in pretty good shape, although you may still have quite a migraine with the process anyway. If you don't have a previous passport, you're going to have a pretty bad time if you lose your current passport.

Source: [URL]http://bangkok.usembassy.gov/lost_stolen_passports.html[/URL].

[QUOTE=CaptCabins;1844179]Guys,

How do you be discrete for our activities in Thailand. I booked my ticket and my hotel together to get cheaper rates but now I am guessing the hotel staff would have my my full name and passport and etc. If I were to bring a girl to the hotel wouldn't they know? On another note I believe in Thailand you have to carry your passport everywhere so how do you guys make sure the lady does not open your passport and find out your identity? Could you guys share some tips on how to remain discrete and make sure nothing gets stolen? By the way I did a quite search on youtubr and it seems there is a poster who takes video and exposes guys soliciting ladies. He would sit in front of the short time hotel and switch on his camera. You can see mostly farang with younger ladies and etc. Am I being paranoid here?[/QUOTE]Yeah. There is a food degree of paranoid in this. Do you think an hotel will bother about your identity linked to bringing a girl or two? They just want to make nothing bad occurs to the hotel and to the hotel guests. So they collect the girl ID for your safety. Do you think they then call your wife? Just carry a photocopy of your passport in your wallet and, again, nobody will bother on who are you. Do you think they are so sophisticated? Even the worst Shangai scams, aim to drag money from you or, eventually put you in troubles with police if you go to police. Nobdiy at home will even know unless you are in jail, mbut even then. Most likely they kick you out of the country and never allow you back.

[QUOTE=ParkVille;1844739]Passports on the other hand, are way more difficult to replace while abroad. Maybe your country and their Thai consulate, this is easy. But for say a country like America, it is not a simple process. It requires: "an original or certified copy of a USA Birth certificate, or a previous or expired passport. " Good luck trying to get your original birth certificate IN A FOREIGN COUNTRY. You can have it mailed to you, but pray to the gods that isn't lost in transit or you will be screwed.[/QUOTE]Not true at all. My buddy arrived in Thailand and when he was dropped off in Pattaya he realized he had left his passport in the taxi. Ordinarily a taxi guy would have brought it back, but my boy had had it out with this driver for some reason. The next day he took the bus to Bangkok and went to the US Embassy for a replacement passport. He did not have any of that fancy certified birth certificate stuff that you speak of. If nothing else they can give you a temporary passport to travel on until you get back home. I think those are good for 1 year.

[QUOTE=CaptCabins;1844179]How do you be discrete for our activities in Thailand. By the way I did a quite search on youtubr and it seems there is a poster who takes video and exposes guys soliciting ladies. He would sit in front of the short time hotel and switch on his camera. You can see mostly farang with younger ladies and etc. Am I being paranoid here?[/QUOTE]Why do you need to be discrete? This is Thailand.

If you mean exposes by posting a video on youtube don't walk down Walking Street since tourists are taking videos everywhere. You can always wear a Donald Trump mask.

[QUOTE=Bkkdog;1844575]I think the problem might be you my brother. Every time I go, if I'm not hungry, I decline the food. Beer is much cheaper than Soi cowboy or Nana, I just tell them I'm not hungry and keep ordering beer. If you don't want to drink and you sit there and order 1 beer every hour, then of course, any bar won't be happy. Think about it, it's common sense.[/QUOTE]Sounds like a plan. But we all have to eat. We all need to eat when we arein party mode.

If the prices are fair and they don't push drinks on you or the girls don't push lady drinks on you its sounds preferable to the loud and expensive venues th at cater to foreigners. Any reason not to enjoy a snack at these types of places? I've read other opinions from other places on the net which suggest one should seek out bars and clubs that appeal to locals and not just tourists. Maybe you expound more on this area and some of the specifics. Thanks.

[QUOTE=CaptCabins;1844179]Guys,

How do you be discrete for our activities in Thailand. I booked my ticket and my hotel together to get cheaper rates but now I am guessing the hotel staff would have my my full name and passport and etc. If I were to bring a girl to the hotel wouldn't they know? On another note I believe in Thailand you have to carry your passport everywhere so how do you guys make sure the lady does not open your passport and find out your identity? Could you guys share some tips on how to remain discrete and make sure nothing gets stolen? By the way I did a quite search on youtubr and it seems there is a poster who takes video and exposes guys soliciting ladies. He would sit in front of the short time hotel and switch on his camera. You can see mostly farang with younger ladies and etc. Am I being paranoid here?[/QUOTE]You can control your level of discreteness when you need to, if their is a reason. Firstly, you do not take bargirls or freelancer to your Hotel if your wife or colleagues stay at same Hotel. Likewise I do not monger at my home apartment. Blabber mouths and gossipers are very strong in Thailand. I have made the error of being a regular customer at a Sports Pub that is a little too close to Cowboy. One staff from the pub have seen me outside a ST Hotel and just outside Cowboy area with an very attractive young lady, who clearly was not my GF. Expect soon everyone to hear about it. Fortunately my GF keeps away from Sports Pub.

Fortunately I am a nobody but always risk being seen by someone who knows my girlfriend if mongering in public. So best to keep activities indoors, inside an Oily MP, inside a bar (don't use outside bars if risk someone could see you), travel with your girl by taxi to your Hotel to minimise visibility. Have particular Hotels where all your liaisons with girls will happen. I have concerns about Hotels reporting my behavior to someone. Does not happen as far as I know. Who would be interested? If I have mongered at a Hotel, would never take a Girlfriend or wife there.

I advise against carrying your Passport with you. A copy yes. I have lost a bag in a supermarket containing my passport on one occasion. Critical very very costly error. Caused some Visas to be terminated. You just cannot afford to lose your passport. Loss of phone, camera etc. In same bag paled into insignificance.

I have never been too concerned about a girl finding out who I am, they just aren't interested. However I am not famous. I have contact with some girls on LINE App. I tend not to include my surname on the details of my profile. They my know my nick names. No big deal. Never ever seen a girl trying to look in my wallet. Free Lancers are the least trustworthy and Ladyboys even less trustworthy.

Occasionally I have seen people using cameras in Soi Cowboy and am a bit wary of those.

Customers have been thrown out of the bar after they tried to take pictures on phone or otherwise. Usually it is Asian customers that try this. Never seen a Farang apprehended for this.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;1844774]Not true at all. My buddy arrived in Thailand and when he was dropped off in Pattaya he realized he had left his passport in the taxi. Ordinarily a taxi guy would have brought it back, but my boy had had it out with this driver for some reason. The next day he took the bus to Bangkok and went to the US Embassy for a replacement passport. He did not have any of that fancy certified birth certificate stuff that you speak of. If nothing else they can give you a temporary passport to travel on until you get back home. I think those are good for 1 year.[/QUOTE]That is correct. This would be considered a emergency and a appointment wouldn't be necessary.

[QUOTE=LittleBigMan;1844935]That is correct. This would be considered a emergency and a appointment wouldn't be necessary.[/QUOTE]Agreed. And the notion you would need to present a USA Consulate with your birth certificate in order to get an emergency passport after losing the original doesn't make sense anyway, unless loss of passport is to be penalized by permanent banishment from the USA.

I don't carry my passport in Thailand, but do so in Jakarta where there are police blockades looking for, among other things, foreigners without passports that can be shaken down for bribes (before beginning to carry around my passport, I had two such incidents with corrupt police officers). In the Jakarta thread one of the senior citizens (or perhaps a "senile citizen") criticized me for carrying my passport and suggested that I therefore had no credibility on the forum on any topic. I suppose I also would have lost points with him had I revealed I also carry my driver's license on me while in my home country.

In any event, I put my passport in a passport holder that has a clip that attaches to one of my front belt loops while the passport is in my front pocket. This makes it virtually impossible to lose by pickpocket or it simply falling out of my pocket. I suppose if someone put a gun to may head I would have to give it up, but at that point losing my passport would likely be the least of my problems. In any event, carrying one's passport in a passport holder that attaches to a belt loop is one way to lower the risks inherent in carrying one's passport around town. It may be a bit inconvenient, but less so than dealing with situations where a police officer, particularly a corrupt one, asks for a passport and you don't have it on you. And although one might counter that a corrupt police officer will find something else to use against you, somehow even corrupt police have rules they abide by and in my experience showing that you have your passport generally will get them off your back.

[QUOTE=Eszpresszo;1844892]Sounds like a plan. But we all have to eat. We all need to eat when we arein party mode.

If the prices are fair and they don't push drinks on you or the girls don't push lady drinks on you its sounds preferable to the loud and expensive venues th at cater to foreigners. Any reason not to enjoy a snack at these types of places? I've read other opinions from other places on the net which suggest one should seek out bars and clubs that appeal to locals and not just tourists. Maybe you expound more on this area and some of the specifics. Thanks.[/QUOTE]I have ordered food from a gogo bar, but very rarely. Most of us do not need to eat, other than the desire to eat pussy.

Thai entertainment venues are more for groups of people to eat, drink, and be merry, enjoy music and dancing. However, when I attend a gogo bar, I am usually arriving alone (did take a buddy to Saphan Kwai and could help being an interpreter), and am not there for eating, socialising with buddies, music not so much (although really bad non-music irritates), and don't even drink alcohol usually. It's purely for naked girls, and some regulars or new stunners hopefully. I can be in party mode (with girls) but do not require food and alcohol. I usually eat a small meal before arriving, unless time has run out and may eat a snack very late instead. I think I am more like Natty Bumpo. We prefer to party a little with girls. Other guys are quite unnecessary.

I imagine that Thai men at Sapahn Kwai venues would come in groups or join groups, typically.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1844958]I have ordered food from a gogo bar, but very rarely. Most of us do not need to eat, other than the desire to eat pussy.

Thai entertainment venues are more for groups of people to eat, drink, and be merry, enjoy music and dancing. However, when I attend a gogo bar, I am usually arriving alone (did take a buddy to Saphan Kwai and could help being an interpreter), and am not there for eating, socialising with buddies, music not so much (although really bad non-music irritates), and don't even drink alcohol usually. It's purely for naked girls, and some regulars or new stunners hopefully. I can be in party mode (with girls) but do not require food and alcohol. I usually eat a small meal before arriving, unless time has run out and may eat a snack very late instead. I think I am more like Natty Bumpo. We prefer to party a little with girls. Other guys are quite unnecessary.

I imagine that Thai men at Sapahn Kwai venues would come in groups or join groups, typically.[/QUOTE]So right. Thai entertainment venues all have food. It is just part of the culture. If they did not have food the locals would not go. It's a group thing and is about socializing as much as anything else. Thais go out in groups; they rarely go out alone.

[QUOTE=LittleBigMan;1844935]That is correct. This would be considered a emergency and a appointment wouldn't be necessary.[/QUOTE]Now you guys who are US citizens should be aware that there is such a thing as a "Passport Card". Its basically a small, driver's license size travel document that allows you to travel through North America in countries that previously only required a driver's license as ID (Canada, Mexico, much of the Caribbean.) This isn't going to get you into Thailand, but it is acceptable ID for the US consulate. These are cheap and they fit in your wallet. I carry one with me abroad, when I can't take my passport on the streets with me. It doesn't hurt to carry both (albeit not in the same place). You will see this document discussed in the forums about Mexico. Not sure what the rest of the world has that is an equivalent, but I wouldn't be surprised if there is some form of national ID card that would suffice at your consulate, in the event of a lost passport.

[QUOTE=Eszpresszo;1845135]Now you guys who are US citizens should be aware that there is such a thing as a "Passport Card". Its basically a small, driver's license size travel document that allows you to travel through North America in countries that previously only required a driver's license as ID (Canada, Mexico, much of the Caribbean.) This isn't going to get you into Thailand, but it is acceptable ID for the US consulate. These are cheap and they fit in your wallet. I carry one with me abroad, when I can't take my passport on the streets with me. It doesn't hurt to carry both (albeit not in the same place). You will see this document discussed in the forums about Mexico. Not sure what the rest of the world has that is an equivalent, but I wouldn't be surprised if there is some form of national ID card that would suffice at your consulate, in the event of a lost passport.[/QUOTE]Lots of countries nearby accept EU ID cards (France, Spain, Germany, Italy all have one of their own, maybe others too) accept the national ID to enter their countries. It has been changing a bit though, recently, but I do recall Egypt and turkey did accept the national ID card to enter them. The national ID card is a fully legitimate ID card that your own authorities (consulate for one) HAVE to accept as identification mean. Has been good for me once in USA and Australia, when my passport picture was not making the immigration too happy (was badly passed at origin) and I showed them my ID card as a further proof of identification.

[QUOTE=Breadman;1843735]Anyone know what happened to stumble inn? Prime location and used to be packed day and night. Girl I know quit and went to work at Hillary, something must have happened. New owners?[/QUOTE]Hmmm. I think you should ask the girl you know who quit and went to work at Hillary. She might know, don't ya think?

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1842535]I don't quite understand. Why is the difference between ST and LT so low? Is this basically due to girl only having the chance to make one ST per night? Does the girl keep all the 2000 ST or is someone taking a cut out of that? since you aren't paying that to her directly. Is this a set fee?

Why so much as 500 ti the moma. She must be raking it in?

I have been to T Det. My buddy took a short time but I did not. I found it a bit less easy to get to the most desirable girl than at cowboy. I. e. She was busy or assigned to other tables. I didn't find the next best level good enough to my taste.

Do you often end up getting your first choce girl easily? I guess there is always returning another night, but I couldn't be bothered, as not immediately hooked by the setup.

I suppose I did not know the system on how to get a lap dance from the most desired girl when she was not in the vicinity. Most of the customers sit politely and don't run around chasing a girl like I was tempted to do but resisted.

Its too spread out for me. This limits. the girls that are dancing nearby. If I like a girl, I would like to be near where she is dancing but this is not practical.

I guess this place is designed for guys that are not fussy and should like all the girls equally well. Not how I operate. I like a very small portion of the girls and ignore all the rest. You take a long time to see all the girls there wirh their rotation system and then by the time you have worked out which one you like, she is bound to be busy already with a customer.

Perhaps there are ways for a regular to overcome this?[/QUOTE]Let me try and help you with this. I have been to all the bars in the SK area. It's set up like most of the bars in nana or Soi cowboy. If you want a girl, it does not matter if you are Thai or Farang, the best and only way to do it is to call a MoMA son over and ask them to go and collect the girl. If you need time in any bar to decide, there is always a chance the girl will be busy. Your posts about CH prove that theory. There are 2 bars opposite each other at the beginning of the street. The one on the left is huge and seems to be the most popular, if you don't find a girl quick, she will be taken. The bar opposite is more a place to sing, eat and drink with your lady and is more laid back. As you comtinue around the corner there are 4 more bars. The largest is on the right side with 2 entrances. One entrance is down the Soi and the other on the main road. This one is also very popular with many girls spread out. However there are 2 smaller bars that are perfect for you. One is to the left of this bar, and the other is opposite. Both are small venues and not spread out. You can easily get the lay of the land and chill out until you can choose your girl.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1843649]BKKDog,

Any chance to enlighten us on any of these questions? I thought perhaps some questions could be answered easily. Of course I can understand if you don't like the questions for one reason or another. Just that my one visit there did not give me enough knowledge to understand the workings that well myself?

Syzy.[/QUOTE]Syzy. Anytime you would like to meet up for a night in SK, let me know. I tried to send you a PM but for some reason you have turned your PM function off or it has been revoked. I can PM other members so it's not a problem on my end.

[QUOTE=Eszpresszo;1845135]Now you guys who are US citizens should be aware that there is such a thing as a "Passport Card". Its basically a small, driver's license size travel document that allows you to travel through North America in countries that previously only required a driver's license as ID (Canada, Mexico, much of the Caribbean.) This isn't going to get you into Thailand, but it is acceptable ID for the US consulate. These are cheap and they fit in your wallet. I carry one with me abroad, when I can't take my passport on the streets with me. It doesn't hurt to carry both (albeit not in the same place). You will see this document discussed in the forums about Mexico. Not sure what the rest of the world has that is an equivalent, but I wouldn't be surprised if there is some form of national ID card that would suffice at your consulate, in the event of a lost passport.[/QUOTE]Once I was stopped in Jakarta for a passport check. I had a photocopy of my passport along with my USA -based driver's license and my friend had his passport card but not his passport. The policeman, who was obviously fishing for bribes, told me the copy of my passport and state ID. Were insufficient (even though I had earlier been told the opposite by an Indonesian lawyer, but he was probably wrong). When the police officer saw my friend's passport card he became a bit befuddled but then focused on me to get his bribe. In other words the passport card sort of worked although if my friend had been traveling alone without a better bribe prospect (I. E. , me with my photocopy) it might not have. In any case, it is not a bad idea to have one to carry around, although in situations where one might be vulnerable to being asked for one's passport, e. G. , North Jakarta at night, it may not be enough.

Edit: Usually I edit out the errors introduced by the auto-incorrector on this site, but there are just too many here so I'm leaving it alone.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1844958]I have ordered food from a gogo bar, but very rarely. Most of us do not need to eat, other than the desire to eat pussy.

Thai entertainment venues are more for groups of people to eat, drink, and be merry, enjoy music and dancing. However, when I attend a gogo bar, I am usually arriving alone (did take a buddy to Saphan Kwai and could help being an interpreter), and am not there for eating, socialising with buddies, music not so much (although really bad non-music irritates), and don't even drink alcohol usually. It's purely for naked girls, and some regulars or new stunners hopefully. I can be in party mode (with girls) but do not require food and alcohol. I usually eat a small meal before arriving, unless time has run out and may eat a snack very late instead. I think I am more like Natty Bumpo. We prefer to party a little with girls. Other guys are quite unnecessary.

I imagine that Thai men at Sapahn Kwai venues would come in groups or join groups, typically.[/QUOTE]In the 2 larger bars the Thais come in groups but there are often single men in their too.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1844920]You can control your level of discreteness when you need to, if their is a reason. Firstly, you do not take bargirls or freelancer to your Hotel if your wife or colleagues stay at same Hotel. Likewise I do not monger at my home apartment. Blabber mouths and gossipers are very strong in Thailand. I have made the error of being a regular customer at a Sports Pub that is a little too close to Cowboy. One staff from the pub have seen me outside a ST Hotel and just outside Cowboy area with an very attractive young lady, who clearly was not my GF. Expect soon everyone to hear about it. Fortunately my GF keeps away from Sports Pub.

Fortunately I am a nobody but always risk being seen by someone who knows my girlfriend if mongering in public. So best to keep activities indoors, inside an Oily MP, inside a bar (don't use outside bars if risk someone could see you), travel with your girl by taxi to your Hotel to minimise visibility. Have particular Hotels where all your liaisons with girls will happen. I have concerns about Hotels reporting my behavior to someone. Does not happen as far as I know. Who would be interested? If I have mongered at a Hotel, would never take a Girlfriend or wife there.

I advise against carrying your Passport with you. A copy yes. I have lost a bag in a supermarket containing my passport on one occasion. Critical very very costly error. Caused some Visas to be terminated. You just cannot afford to lose your passport. Loss of phone, camera etc. [/QUOTE]Syzgies,

Thanks for the reply. Syzgies if I wanted girl who look like Chinese or Korean rather than brown skin Thai look which is better Nana plaza or Soi Cowboy? Could you suggest a club that has light skin or more Chinese or Korean looks?

By the way if you were by accident to take out ladyboy from an agogo club back are they dangerous. Will they hit you or something if you decide not to proceed with them in the hotel. From the youtube video it seems that the ladyboys really do like girls. My friend accidentally weren't to spanky and took a lb by mistake. It wad a bad experience for him I fuess as he refuse to talk in detail about it. I think maybe the lb roughed him up or something.

On another note if I had on eday which is better Nana plaza or sow c9 wboy. Ia 2500 baht a reasonable rate for short time?

After I had a go with the popular Ying from Tulip I headed to Mermaid Hotel for a short pit-stop and continued my journey to Soi Cowboy.

I think it was something before 10 PM that I reached CH and off I went in not really knowing what to expect. Even though I have been reading stories about CH I was not expecting that practically all women were naked. Let's say from all the women on stage which was about 12 to 15 ladies there were maybe two that still had 'something' on. As for me being a newbie here I have to say that there were quite some of them who were attractive with one that was very attractive (again, for me I would go for an overall 7,5/8 out of 10 even though the 8 might be a tiny bit too optimistic). A slim short haired tattooed woman with a small handful of tits. Not an inch of fat visible from where I was sitting (sat on a couch on the right side when you come in the place). It might even be that she has a piercing in her nipple (s) but I might be wrong. Forgot her number so I can't share which one I mean exactly. Don't mix it up with another heavily tattooed women that had maybe about 10 to 15 piercings in her face and pussy. Anyway, I enjoyed the various scenes and you could tell that I wasn't the only persons that was her favorite. On the other hand I'm not sure that she always came back to dance after sitting with her potential customers. Maybe her price was too high, I don't know and I didn't asked her for it nor was I planning to buy a ladies drink firstly as I wasn't sure I would take somebody with me and secondly I wanted to broaden my GoGo experiences now that I had the opportunity. The mamasan's weren't pushy at all. I seriously did liked this place. A bit on the darkish side, women walking by naked, in bikini or kimono's, not an establishment that tried to push you which is quite important for me. As for the music I'm not sure that the music was loud or not. Let's say that I was too much distracted to share an opinion about this. In all due honesty I don't really give a shit what kind of music they play. If the beat is alright she will dance all night. Drank two Singah beers. If I'm not mistaken then the price was 180 a beer although it could have been 160.

So went on and went directly into Baccara. Now the place was packed (just like CH) with a big amount of girls on stage. In all due honesty, the quality that I have seen there was below average. It might have been better not to have started with CH though. Just the place wasn't really for me with mediocre girls who were dancing if this is what you want to call it. (not that they danced that much better in CH but at least there were some efforts over there). Anyway, I didn't stayed longer than a minute I think. Maybe I should give it another go next time. Who knows my timing was bad but then there were a lot of people who didn't shared the same feeling as I did. Otherwise you don't want to spend your cash.

Tilac was number 3 on my list. Went inside and sat down like a regular. The girls dancing on stage were from a better caliber than Baccara but didn't reached the heels of the girls I have seen in CH. The mamasan was quite a pain in the ass though. Luckily there was punter who was sitting next to me who didn't really mind that she was talking his ears off. One girl somehow drew my attention. It was number 9. Name was something like Phieuw and even though I couldn't remember her name that well, I do remember her nearly perfect ass. Under the fabric I think that she had a nice rack but I can't confirm it and whether that were fake or not. But the ass definitely did the trick. Even though the dancing wasn't all that great she delivered me some twitches in my knob. That was enough for me to let her sit down with me and paid for her lady drink and I took another beer. To keep things short and again I can be a bit wrong with the numbers I believe that the bar fine was 600 or 800 Bath and 3000 for ST. When I told her where I stayed I could tell that she would not have been that keen to walk until there. She mentioned that it would be possible to have ST for 2500 Bath and we play some chess for one hour in a nearby hotel. At least that is what I understood from what she was telling in my ear. Oh well, I paid my bill (two SM Light and a tequila shot. Forgot the exact price) I thanked her for the info and I left with the thing in mind that I wanted some relief and adventure before going to sleep. Apparently the place to be for some this kind of experience is Afterskool.

Opened the sliding doors and I notice that the place is rather small with two girls dancing on stage. You might have the chance to add another girl on it but it might lead to accidents if you ask me. Anyway, I think that the stage only consisted of two poles so who cares. Even though I wasn't expecting to see such a place like this (thought that all gogo bars would have a stage in the middle) so my newbie mind made me realize I was wrong. The place looks more like a small ordinary bar if you ask me with couches facing the bar instead of having chairs. I forgot how many WG's were there mainly due to the fact that most of them were probably outside as inside I had the impression that you would rather freeze to death if you sit with a customer. I think that these might be the opportunity to let a punter touch you in order to warm up a bit if I would have been a WG. Let's say that I was lucky to be greeted by a girl by the name of Apple (Sorry, forgot her number) who asked that it would be allowed to sit next to me. As I said I don't like the pushy ones so I appreciated her tactics and let her sit with me. She ordered a coke while I was having a SM Light and we started to chit chat. Seems that she was working first for 6 months in another place in front owned by the same German owner and now she was working for one month in AS. While I was having an entertaining talk with the lady I was thinking about the dark corner and where that could be. For sure it could not be right next to the far at the far end. It didn't seemed to be dark enough. Mistake. Again. That was exactly the place where they clean pipes. Then there was another mistake made, the girl I was sitting with did not had the schoolgirl uniform on and she told me that she's not giving any BJ's which cost a 1000 Bath by the way. Actually there was a man who had a go surrounded by I believe three ugly ladies in school uniform. My lovely lady also told me that if I want to take her out I will have to pay 2000 Bath as she's, . She said something but from what I've read from you guys it seemed that she's probably a coyote? I was also starting to be afraid to that coca cola was topped with gold so I had a look at the bill but the rate was safe. The truth is that I had a great time talking about nothing with Apple. She was a sweet girl and I felt at ease. Paid for 2 cokes and 2 SM Light and gave her a tip for her company went home and choked the chicken.

Not sure where to go to tonight but probably I will be heading to Suzie Wong at 10 even though I know that the quality of women there isn't the best or we even might have to say terrible. You will most likely hear more about it later. Overall I had a good first night combined with Ying who emptied my ball sack twice. Not the prettiest girl in town but a sweetheart that makes you feel comfortable. Not that anybody have to tell me how I should write and I know that I have a mind like a sieve but let me know in case I have missed something out or where I have been making mistakes.

[QUOTE=Bkkdog;1845367]Syzy. Anytime you would like to meet up for a night in SK, let me know. I tried to send you a PM but for some reason you have turned your PM function off or it has been revoked. I can PM other members so it's not a problem on my end.[/QUOTE]Thanks not on Bangkok right now, but will return before long (2 or 3 weeks at a guess) and switch PM back on. Right now have to concentrate on work.

[QUOTE=Hiete;1845524]After I had a go with the popular Ying from Tulip I headed to Mermaid Hotel for a short pit-stop and continued my journey to Soi Cowboy.

I think it was something before 10 PM that I reached CH and off I went in not really knowing what to expect. Even though I have been reading stories about CH I was not expecting that practically all women were naked. Let's say from all the women on stage which was about 12 to 15 ladies there were maybe two that still had 'something' on. As for me being a newbie here I have to say that there were quite some of them who were attractive with one that was very attractive (again, for me I would go for an overall 7,5/8 out of 10 even though the 8 might be a tiny bit too optimistic). A slim short haired tattooed woman with a small handful of tits. Not an inch of fat visible from where I was sitting (sat on a couch on the right side when you come in the place). It might even be that she has a piercing in her nipple (s) but I might be wrong. Forgot her number so I can't share which one I mean exactly. Don't mix it up with another heavily tattooed women that had maybe about 10 to 15 piercings in her face and pussy. Anyway, I enjoyed the various scenes and you could tell that I wasn't the only persons that was her favorite. On the other hand I'm not sure that she always came back to dance after sitting with her potential customers. Maybe her price was too high, I don't know and I didn't asked her for it nor was I planning to buy a ladies drink firstly as I wasn't sure I would take somebody with me and secondly I wanted to broaden my GoGo experiences now that I had the opportunity. The mamasan's weren't pushy at all. I seriously did liked this place. A bit on the darkish side, women walking by naked, in bikini or kimono's, not an establishment that tried to push you which is quite important for me. As for the music I'm not sure that the music was loud or not. Let's say that I was too much distracted to share an opinion about this. In all due honesty I don't really give a shit what kind of music they play. If the beat is alright she will dance all night. Drank two Singah beers. If I'm not mistaken then the price was 180 a beer although it could have been 160.

So went on and went directly into Baccara. Now the place was packed (just like CH) with a big amount of girls on stage. In all due honesty, the quality that I have seen there was below average. It might have been better not to have started with CH though. Just the place wasn't really for me with mediocre girls who were dancing if this is what you want to call it. (not that they danced that much better in CH but at least there were some efforts over there). Anyway, I didn't stayed longer than a minute I think. Maybe I should give it another go next time. Who knows my timing was bad but then there were a lot of people who didn't shared the same feeling as I did. Otherwise you don't want to spend your cash.

Tilac was number 3 on my list. Went inside and sat down like a regular. The girls dancing on stage were from a better caliber than Baccara but didn't reached the heels of the girls I have seen in CH. The mamasan was quite a pain in the ass though. Luckily there was punter who was sitting next to me who didn't really mind that she was talking his ears off. One girl somehow drew my attention. It was number 9. Name was something like Phieuw and even though I couldn't remember her name that well, I do remember her nearly perfect ass. Under the fabric I think that she had a nice rack but I can't confirm it and whether that were fake or not. But the ass definitely did the trick. Even though the dancing wasn't all that great she delivered me some twitches in my knob. That was enough for me to let her sit down with me and paid for her lady drink and I took another beer. To keep things short and again I can be a bit wrong with the numbers I believe that the bar fine was 600 or 800 Bath and 3000 for ST. When I told her where I stayed I could tell that she would not have been that keen to walk until there. She mentioned that it would be possible to have ST for 2500 Bath and we play some chess for one hour in a nearby hotel. At least that is what I understood from what she was telling in my ear. Oh well, I paid my bill (two SM Light and a tequila shot. Forgot the exact price) I thanked her for the info and I left with the thing in mind that I wanted some relief and adventure before going to sleep. Apparently the place to be for some this kind of experience is Afterskool.

Opened the sliding doors and I notice that the place is rather small with two girls dancing on stage. You might have the chance to add another girl on it but it might lead to accidents if you ask me. Anyway, I think that the stage only consisted of two poles so who cares. Even though I wasn't expecting to see such a place like this (thought that all gogo bars would have a stage in the middle) so my newbie mind made me realize I was wrong. The place looks more like a small ordinary bar if you ask me with couches facing the bar instead of having chairs. I forgot how many WG's were there mainly due to the fact that most of them were probably outside as inside I had the impression that you would rather freeze to death if you sit with a customer. I think that these might be the opportunity to let a punter touch you in order to warm up a bit if I would have been a WG. Let's say that I was lucky to be greeted by a girl by the name of Apple (Sorry, forgot her number) who asked that it would be allowed to sit next to me. As I said I don't like the pushy ones so I appreciated her tactics and let her sit with me. She ordered a coke while I was having a SM Light and we started to chit chat. Seems that she was working first for 6 months in another place in front owned by the same German owner and now she was working for one month in AS. While I was having an entertaining talk with the lady I was thinking about the dark corner and where that could be. For sure it could not be right next to the far at the far end. It didn't seemed to be dark enough. Mistake. Again. That was exactly the place where they clean pipes. Then there was another mistake made, the girl I was sitting with did not had the schoolgirl uniform on and she told me that she's not giving any BJ's which cost a 1000 Bath by the way. Actually there was a man who had a go surrounded by I believe three ugly ladies in school uniform. My lovely lady also told me that if I want to take her out I will have to pay 2000 Bath as she's, . She said something but from what I've read from you guys it seemed that she's probably a coyote? I was also starting to be afraid to that coca cola was topped with gold so I had a look at the bill but the rate was safe. The truth is that I had a great time talking about nothing with Apple. She was a sweet girl and I felt at ease. Paid for 2 cokes and 2 SM Light and gave her a tip for her company went home and choked the chicken.

Not sure where to go to tonight but probably I will be heading to Suzie Wong at 10 even though I know that the quality of women there isn't the best or we even might have to say terrible. You will most likely hear more about it later. Overall I had a good first night combined with Ying who emptied my ball sack twice. Not the prettiest girl in town but a sweetheart that makes you feel comfortable. Not that anybody have to tell me how I should write and I know that I have a mind like a sieve but let me know in case I have missed something out or where I have been making mistakes.[/QUOTE]I'm baffled you decided to call in a night. Mit seems you were afraid. I would have headed back to CH.

[QUOTE=CaptCabins;1845450]Syzgies,

Thanks for the reply. Syzgies if I wanted girl who look like Chinese or Korean rather than brown skin Thai look which is better Nana plaza or Soi Cowboy? Could you suggest a club that has light skin or more Chinese or Korean looks?

By the way if you were by accident to take out ladyboy from an agogo club back are they dangerous. Will they hit you or something if you decide not to proceed with them in the hotel. From the youtube video it seems that the ladyboys really do like girls. My friend accidentally weren't to spanky and took a lb by mistake. It wad a bad experience for him I fuess as he refuse to talk in detail about it. I think maybe the lb roughed him up or something.

On another note if I had on eday which is better Nana plaza or sow c9 wboy. Ia 2500 baht a reasonable rate for short time?[/QUOTE]I can chime in for Syzgs here. Go to Rainbow 4. Plenty of white skin girls there. If you want to go to a club then head to Ratchada. The massage shops have some Karaoke rooms where you can chill with the girls. Lately would be the G clubs like the Pimp for example. Lots of info here and a user blog thread below. Many of the Japanese bars cater to this style of lady. Search online to find them but some are on ekamie.

[QUOTE=CaptCabins;1845450]Thanks for the reply. Syzgies if I wanted girl who look like Chinese or Korean rather than brown skin Thai look which is better Nana plaza or Soi Cowboy? Could you suggest a club that has light skin or more Chinese or Korean looks?
[/QUOTE]"Soi Dead Artists" (Sukhumvit Soi 33) used to have many bars and clubs that have hostesses dressed up as Japanese girls. It is also an area where many Japanese men go Probably the prices are accordingly.

It is not Chinese or Korean, but it comes close I think.

It is a few years ago I went there, in the days when Livingstone Lodge was still active.

[QUOTE=Bkkdog;1845803]I'm baffled you decided to call in a night. Mit seems you were afraid. I would have headed back to CH.[/QUOTE]Thanks for the reply Dog.

In fact after Afterkool I passed by CH and popped my head inside which was at about 2:15 AM I believe. It seems that the tenderloin was sold out and I'm no in the mood to take a mediocre girl to my room. For me it's just a new adventure without the need to have sex. Of course if the chemistry is perfect with a top looker I wouldn't say no.

Went yesterday to Suzie Wong to watch the show (waste of time), went over to NEP in are&be (lot of fake noses and silicone tits), had a look around in the BJ bars of soi 6, 8 and 10 if I'm not mistaken (unattractive women) and went back to the girl in Afterskool. Apple is sweet, doesn't mean that I would fuck her so again, no sex this time and didn't even bothered to stick my head in CH as I wasn't in the mood. That same day I checked that Sandy (Addict Massage) was available but unfortunately she's on a holiday so I left it for what it is. It doesn't mean that I'm afraid. I just know what I want.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1845952]"Soi Dead Artists" (Sukhumvit Soi 33) used to have many bars and clubs that have hostesses dressed up as Japanese girls. It is also an area where many Japanese men go Probably the prices are accordingly.

It is not Chinese or Korean, but it comes close I think.

It is a few years ago I went there, in the days when Livingstone Lodge was still active.[/QUOTE]Actually initially the Art Bars were not really Chinese, Japanese, or Korean. Back in the 90's they were the hangout of expats who did not like to frequent the GoGo areas. Drink price were always higher (with the exception of the damn good happy hours all the bars had) and the gals were always about 2 k as opposed to 1 k in Cowboy. The girls were really not any better looking. Same Isaan girls, but in dresses. The Asian influx started about '04.

[QUOTE=Hiete;1846049]Thanks for the reply Dog.

In fact after Afterkool I passed by CH and popped my head inside which was at about 2:15 AM I believe. It seems that the tenderloin was sold out and I'm no in the mood to take a mediocre girl to my room. For me it's just a new adventure without the need to have sex. Of course if the chemistry is perfect with a top looker I wouldn't say no.

Went yesterday to Suzie Wong to watch the show (waste of time), went over to NEP in are&be (lot of fake noses and silicone tits), had a look around in the BJ bars of soi 6, 8 and 10 if I'm not mistaken (unattractive women) and went back to the girl in Afterskool. Apple is sweet, doesn't mean that I would fuck her so again, no sex this time and didn't even bothered to stick my head in CH as I wasn't in the mood. That same day I checked that Sandy (Addict Massage) was available but unfortunately she's on a holiday so I left it for what it is. It doesn't mean that I'm afraid. I just know what I want.[/QUOTE]2:15 am is a very weak time for CH. Just dregs left mostly. 11 Pm can be OK some days but unreliable. I prefer to arrive no later than 9 PM max with some girls just arriving late. Even then, line up is very variable. My favorite girls seem to show up rarely, these days. One of them may have had an issue with the new 20 rule.

I find I am better off to check with them on LINE app first.

I also get very fussy with the looks and know what I want. You need to build a collection of girls.so there are plenty of options. Otherwise can go empty handed.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1846535]2:15 am is a very weak time for CH. Just dregs left mostly. 11 Pm can be OK some days but unreliable. I prefer to arrive no later than 9 PM max with some girls just arriving late. Even then, line up is very variable. My favorite girls seem to show up rarely, these days. One of them may have had an issue with the new 20 rule.

I find I am better off to check with them on LINE app first.

I also get very fussy with the looks and know what I want. You need to build a collection of girls.so there are plenty of options. Otherwise can go empty handed.[/QUOTE]As I have been reading a lot of the posts I wasn't expecting to find that much that early in the morning but it was worth a try.

On my last night in BKK I went to CH at around 9 PM but there wasn't anybody that sticked out the bunch. You're right that the line up varies. Unfortunately the one I saw on my first appearance a couple of days before wasn't there either. All looked pretty much similar to my opinion. It's not that I have a specific ideal in my mind. She may be tall or short, big tits or not. For me the whole package has to match. That short haired tattooed vixen met my requirements back then and I would give her a solid 8 for her looks. I only could wish that she would be a bit of a more active dancer but then again if you are on stage for hours I can imagine that it's not easy to keep performing. Still it would be an indicator for me to choose her even more. All others I have seen in CH are below the tattooed one but still attractive enough if I compare it with the few other bars I have checked out. Of course this is according to my taste which is relative. For the newbies amongst us please make sure that when you pick a girl and buy her a lady drink, ask her what she wants and order it for her. I took one lady who ordered a drink which was a shot and something else. I read about it but I didn't thought about it while I had two perky tits in my hands and a tongue my mouth. My bad.

Sorry Syzygies but can you please explain about the 20 rule? Or if you can let me know where to find the info back as I have not read about it.

As for LINE I assume you need to have her ID number already or can you do a search what's around in the neighborhood? I'm not used to utilise LINE but I have noticed that this is the app that people use in BKK.

I have been using Tinder while I was there just to check it out and I had the impression that there are quite some FL available. Have been chatting with some of them but didn't went going out dating with them. Knowing the fact that I was only there for a few days I thought it was not worth the risk also due to the fact that I haven't been reading a lot about it on this forum.

Only having been there for a couple of days it's hard to tell that the success rate is higher with a WG from a massage joint or a gogo bar. At the end my best experience was my last fuck in NEP. Fake tits and fake nose which didn't turned me off but a great chemistry, no pushing and boy she knew how to give a DT. Best hour I've spend (600 bar fine / 350 for the I would say nice room /1500 for sex) during my short stay in BKK.

I thought about trying number 14 in Annie's but never made it. Having this said it gives me a good reason to return if she's still around that is.

As the heading says.

These Thai women seem to have their phones stitched on to their ears! It's very unappealing.

Once the deal is agreed with your lady de jour, does anyone here implement a cell / mobile phone policy? What is it?

Thanks.

Styk.

I have been to Thailand many times during the last decade. Will be visiting again soon. Have a couple of questions. Is the short time price still 1000 THB for freelancers? How is the Beer Garden these days? And what is a good place to pick up freelancers in the evening? Is Bangkok Beat still going strong? How about the disco in the Nana Hotel? Any other info you can provide to this returning veteran would be much appreciated! Cheers!

[QUOTE=Crypton;1846851]

Is the short time price still 1000 THB for freelancers? How is the Beer Garden these days? And what is a good place to pick up freelancers in the evening? Is Bangkok Beat still going strong? How about the disco in the Nana Hotel? Cheers![/QUOTE]When have you last been? In my opinion, Bangkok freelancer scene has nosedived in both looks, numbers and quality of service since around 2010 or so. Yes, many freelancers will still go for 1000 baht, but they might be reluctant to go far, or stay long. That used to be the no-hassle going rate, now it's a lower bound for most. The better looking ones might ask for 1500-2000 and only accept 1000 if the evening is slow.

Beer Garden still has the usual not-so-gracefully-aged pros, minus a few good ones who moved one (why is it always the good ones who get out of the scene? Disco in the Nana Hotel has changed format so many times that I have no idea what's going on there right now. At one point it was ladyboy-friendly and named "Equality", not sure if that's still on.

Influx of decent looking new girls into the freelancer scene is minimal. I find that girls who looked slightly better than mediocre 5-10 years ago are now the ones that look the best of the meager choice available, despite the extra age, wear & tear.

The semi-pros, girls who have day jobs or study, but supplement earnings by occasional freelancing on Sukhumvit, are almost totally extinct. There are occasional reports of sightings (often by people who can't tell them apart from pros), but they're like the Yeti now.

Along Sukhumvit, you'll still find more freelancers than in most other cities, but don't come with the expectations that it will be anything like the good not-that-old times.

[QUOTE=Crocodilexp;1846934]When have you last been? In my opinion, Bangkok freelancer scene has nosedived in both looks, numbers and quality of service since around 2010 or so. Yes, many freelancers will still go for 1000 baht, but they might be reluctant to go far, or stay long. That used to be the no-hassle going rate, now it's a lower bound for most. The better looking ones might ask for 1500-2000 and only accept 1000 if the evening is slow.

Beer Garden still has the usual not-so-gracefully-aged pros, minus a few good ones who moved one (why is it always the good ones who get out of the scene? Disco in the Nana Hotel has changed format so many times that I have no idea what's going on there right now. At one point it was ladyboy-friendly and named "Equality", not sure if that's still on.

Influx of decent looking new girls into the freelancer scene is minimal. I find that girls who looked slightly better than mediocre 5-10 years ago are now the ones that look the best of the meager choice available, despite the extra age, wear & tear.

The semi-pros, girls who have day jobs or study, but supplement earnings by occasional freelancing on Sukhumvit, are almost totally extinct. There are occasional reports of sightings (often by people who can't tell them apart from pros), but they're like the Yeti now.

Along Sukhumvit, you'll still find more freelancers than in most other cities, but don't come with the expectations that it will be anything like the good not-that-old times.[/QUOTE]Thanks so much for the response, Croc!!

Wow. Things sure have gone south from what you say! Now I am not sure I want to go! The last time I was there was definitely before 2010 (2007-8?)

I wonder what caused the disappearance of the FLs. If you don't mind me asking, what are the options now (yes, I have been reading the reports here. And most seem to be going go-gos). I am not a big fan of nudie bars, even if the quality seems nice. The like illusion of sitting at Beer Garden or where ever, chat with the girls, and take one for an hour or two at leisure.

Thanks again, Croc.

[QUOTE=Crocodilexp;1846934]When have you last been? In my opinion, Bangkok freelancer scene has nosedived in both looks, numbers and quality of service since around 2010 or so. Yes, many freelancers will still go for 1000 baht, but they might be reluctant to go far, or stay long. That used to be the no-hassle going rate, now it's a lower bound for most. The better looking ones might ask for 1500-2000 and only accept 1000 if the evening is slow.

Beer Garden still has the usual not-so-gracefully-aged pros, minus a few good ones who moved one (why is it always the good ones who get out of the scene? Disco in the Nana Hotel has changed format so many times that I have no idea what's going on there right now. At one point it was ladyboy-friendly and named "Equality", not sure if that's still on.

Influx of decent looking new girls into the freelancer scene is minimal. I find that girls who looked slightly better than mediocre 5-10 years ago are now the ones that look the best of the meager choice available, despite the extra age, wear & tear.

The semi-pros, girls who have day jobs or study, but supplement earnings by occasional freelancing on Sukhumvit, are almost totally extinct. There are occasional reports of sightings (often by people who can't tell them apart from pros), but they're like the Yeti now.

Along Sukhumvit, you'll still find more freelancers than in most other cities, but don't come with the expectations that it will be anything like the good not-that-old times.[/QUOTE]Excellent assessment. Yes, the BG is pretty dismal most nights. The gals are very old (as are most of the guys) and a majority need to hang it up. I certainly feel for old P4 P gals, but then again if they were the least bit resourceful they could have snagged a dude when they were younger and hung onto him. But too many worry more about their parasitic families as opposed to taking care of themselves. Either that or they were way too greedy in their younger days and thought they could always get better.

[QUOTE=Crypton;1847002]

I wonder what caused the disappearance of the FLs. [/QUOTE]Social Network like Thaifriendly, Badoo, Tinder, WeChat, BeeTalk, ecc. Girls can open a profile easy, upload some sexy pics (photoshop help) and find alot of customer without waiting for them along the sidewalks of Sukhumvit Road, Soi 4, ecc. Exchange some message and plan to meet customer in hotel or somewhere for dinner or party.

[QUOTE=ChristianG;1847070]Social Network like Thaifriendly, Badoo, Tinder, WeChat, BeeTalk, ecc. Girls can open a profile easy, upload some sexy pics (photoshop help) and find alot of customer without waiting for them along the sidewalks of Sukhumvit Road, Soi 4, ecc. Exchange some message and plan to meet customer in hotel or somewhere for dinner or party.[/QUOTE]That is certainly a big part of it. The other is rising salaries in Thailand. Average salary has risen by quite a bit over the past decade. Gals don't have to supplement any more.

[QUOTE=ChristianG;1847070]Social Network like Thaifriendly, Badoo, Tinder, WeChat, BeeTalk, ecc. Girls can open a profile easy, upload some sexy pics (photoshop help) and find alot of customer without waiting for them along the sidewalks [/QUOTE]

People say that all the time, but there's little similarity. None of those networks are an efficient venue for picking up a working girl. They don't allow girls to explicitly identify as hookers, nor customers to search for them explicitly. It takes a fair bit of sifting through, pointless time-wasting chatting, scheduling / arranging and waiting to meet one. At that point, it's as much work / time / hassle as a proper date, so I might well get a proper decent girl for a date (which can occasionally be way more rewarding), rather than going through the same inconvenience and then paying for a half-arssed sex session. Perhaps as you approach 60 the math changes (more tolerance for the hassle since regular under-35 girls are more difficult).

General dating sites in Thailand are 2% hookers, 10% maybe but should I ask, 88% regular girls. I with Thailand had a real online hooker exchange like Hong Kong 141 where you can clearly browse hookers, see prices and locations.

[QUOTE=Crypton;1847002]
Wow. Things sure have gone south from what you say! Now I am not sure I want to go! The last time I was there was definitely before 2010 (2007-8?)
[/QUOTE]There is still a fair number of freelancers on Sukhumvit, you just need to revise your expectations sharply downwards compared to 2008.

As for alternatives, I'd go to Pattaya. The scene there is also not as good as before, but at this point clearly better than Bangkok, and cheaper too.

[QUOTE=Crypton;1847002]
I wonder what caused the disappearance of the FLs.
[/QUOTE]I think it was caused by low unemployment, improved wages (minimum wage is now good enough to live on), demographics (birth rate fell sharply in the 1980's and now we're seeing it) and the proliferation of smartphones. Hardcore hookers who are too greedy, stuck in the lifestyle, or too lazy to be doing anything else are still around, but the sweet regular girls dipping in the scene to supplement their meager day job income are a thing of the past.

In the past, a good number of working girls often had in the back of their minds the option of snagging a husband / boyfriend / sponsor, or at least a multiple-day customer, so service was accordingly nicer. Now they just want to finish the job, get the money and go back to get another one.

[QUOTE=Crocodilexp;1847259] In the past, a good number of working girls often had in the back of their minds the option of snagging a husband / boyfriend / sponsor, or at least a multiple-day customer, so service was accordingly nicer. Now they just want to finish the job, get the money and go back to get another one.[/QUOTE]And from reading some other forums that is the case in other countries as well. Not just confined to Thailand. Jeez, what's the hobby going to be like in 15 years when I'm 65? FFS, one of the reasons for choosing Thailand was seeing all the older dudes with hot chicks back in '99. Now older dudes are with gals in their 40's. Urgh! And to top it off many of those gals have very lofty expectations.

Hello all,

Will be my first time mongering outside of my home city in Canada. I'll be in Bangkok for my birthday later in March and am looking for something a bit specific.

I'm looking for a duo (4 hand) oil massage with body slides. I'm not looking for FS, just HJ / BJ from both girls after the massage / slide. In terms of the women, I want bust sizes at least see or bigger. Natural or fake doesn't matter.

I'm willing to pay more for higher quality providers. Can any of you give any suggestions? I don't have a location for my accommodation yet but am very flexible.

Thanks in advance.

[QUOTE=Ttongs;1847357]Hello all,

Will be my first time mongering outside of my home city in Canada. I'll be in Bangkok for my birthday later in March and am looking for something a bit specific.

I'm looking for a duo (4 hand) oil massage with body slides. I'm not looking for FS, just HJ / BJ from both girls after the massage / slide. In terms of the women, I want bust sizes at least see or bigger. Natural or fake doesn't matter.

I'm willing to pay more for higher quality providers. Can any of you give any suggestions? I don't have a location for my accommodation yet but am very flexible.

Thanks in advance.[/QUOTE]Happy 18th birthday. Look and research under BKK / massage 4 hands with slide BJ / HJ see+forum.

[QUOTE=Dg8787;1847502]Happy 18th birthday. Look and research under BKK / massage 4 hands with slide BJ / HJ see+forum.[/QUOTE]Good one! LMAO. 18th be-day!

[QUOTE=Crypton;1847002]I wonder what caused the disappearance of the FLs.[/QUOTE]Social media. Why sit in a bar for hours or walk the streets when you can sit at home or at an air conditioned Starbucks and respond to emails. Oh and BTW charge double or more what a SW does while your at it.

SL.

Hey guys,

Final question for this forum before I depart next week for my first Thailand / Singapore trip. I am very excited. My question is: can I get the generic Viagra (sideagra) at any Bangkok Rx? I'm, not worried about price so I don't need to know how much, just if I can buy them without a Rx. Thanks for all your reviews and advice.

[QUOTE=BigRig2007;1847560]Hey guys,

Final question for this forum before I depart next week for my first Thailand / Singapore trip. I am very excited. My question is: can I get the generic Viagra (sideagra) at any Bangkok Rx? I'm, not worried about price so I don't need to know how much, just if I can buy them without a Rx. Thanks for all your reviews and advice.[/QUOTE]The answer to your question is "yes" and "no. " Many of the "first-tier" pharmacies require a prescription and won't budge on this. But what might be called "second-tier" pharmacies will have generic viagra (sildenafil) available without a prescription and possibly the brand-name stuff.

Others here should be able to direct you to specific pharmacies; unless things have changed recently there should be a lot of them that offer this without a prescription in the Sukhumvit area.

[QUOTE=BigRig2007;1847560]Hey guys,

Final question for this forum before I depart next week for my first Thailand / Singapore trip. I am very excited. My question is: can I get the generic Viagra (sideagra) at any Bangkok Rx? I'm, not worried about price so I don't need to know how much, just if I can buy them without a Rx. Thanks for all your reviews and advice.[/QUOTE]Yes you can. You can also get the original too (imported from Australia I think).

[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1847597]The answer to your question is "yes" and "no. " Many of the "first-tier" pharmacies require a prescription and won't budge on this. But what might be called "second-tier" pharmacies will have generic viagra (sildenafil) available without a prescription and possibly the brand-name stuff.

Others here should be able to direct you to specific pharmacies; unless things have changed recently there should be a lot of them that offer this without a prescription in the Sukhumvit area.[/QUOTE]Thai generic available at 2nd pharmacy on Sukhumvit heading from petrol station Soi4 towards Soi 2. Price should be around 200 to 300 Baht for pack of 4 100 MG tablets.

Original Viagra can be bought too, but what is the point. Far too expensive. Cheap original genuine Viagra elsewhere are not really genuine at all, so don't kid yourself.

Lots of other stuff available too.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1847634]Thai generic available at 2nd pharmacy on Sukhumvit heading from petrol station Soi4 towards Soi 2. Price should be around 200 to 300 Baht for pack of 4 100 MG tablets.

Original Viagra can be bought too, but what is the point. Far too expensive. Cheap original genuine Viagra elsewhere are not really genuine at all, so don't kid yourself.

Lots of other stuff available too.[/QUOTE]If you are staying out of the main Farang tourist area you can get the Thai generic, Sidegra, for a very good price. Usually 100 Baht for 4 50's or 150 Baht for 4 100's. Consistent and good.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;1847690]If you are staying out of the main Farang tourist area you can get the Thai generic, Sidegra, for a very good price. Usually 100 Baht for 4 50's or 150 Baht for 4 100's. Consistent and good.[/QUOTE]Sidegra official price, 100 bahts for 4 x50 MG, and 180 bahts for 4 x100 MG. In Sukumvit in Pattaya in Patong they all try to sell 30-50 above the real price. If they do, tell them the real price, or you can buy in local areas at official price.

[QUOTE=Crocodilexp;1847256]I with Thailand had a real online hooker exchange like Hong Kong 141 where you can clearly browse hookers, see prices and locations.[/QUOTE]Why would Thailand need that? It is already so easy to get a P4P-date and besides, although prostitution is not illegal in Thailand, advertising it too openly (i.e. "solliciting") might run afoul of the law.

[QUOTE=UncleVolodya;1847598]Yes you can. You can also get the original too (imported from Australia I think).[/QUOTE]I once bought Vitamin "V" in a regular pharmacy in Bangkok and it was imported from Austria. I found that very funny.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1847705]Why would Thailand need that? It is already so easy to get a P4P-date and besides, although prostitution is not illegal in Thailand, advertising it too openly (i.e. "solliciting") might run afoul of the law.[/QUOTE]One wonders if Thailand will take the cue from Indonesia and start closing P4 P venues. Personally I think this a real possibility under the current regime. I would not be surprised if things were far different a few years from now.