Medellin Reports

[QUOTE=MiamiBoy1;2927093]My understanding is the deal was 500 mil for 1 HR of sex, correct? If so, why did you want to check out another club with her? You expected her to hang out with you at some other place for some time, and only after that, head back to your hotel? This doesn't make any sense. Of course she wanted to go straight to your hotel, and once you are done, probably head back to gustos to get another client or just call it a night and go home. Another thing, is that you bailed out once you got out of the club. You could not make up your mind while in the club? I don't get it. Either you are interested in fucking her and make a deal you commit to, or don't make a deal at all. Make up your mind, you are a grown man.[/QUOTE]Thanks for the advice, Miami Boy. I didn't make a deal and no, I could not make up my mind while I was in the club. Maybe after some more flirting and clubbing I could have been convinced to fuck her for 400 k, but at the time we stepped out of the club, it was a definite "no" for me. 500 k was her counteroffer and, although that is a reasonable counter in Gusto's, that was never going to happen no matter how much time we spent together.

So she seemed like a nice enough girl in the club, and I wanted to give her the opportunity to persuade me further to take her to bed, by perhaps accompanying me to other clubs. Her demeanor changed once we got outside the club and that was a big turn off for me. She didn't seem interested in investing more time and energy to convince me to make a deal for sex, which up to that point, I hadn't made. So that's when I made up my mind to walk away. Like a grown man.

Now that I know some on this forum could have construed her counteroffer as proposing 500 k for an hour of doing anything, I am very glad I made the decision I did. Because I could have spent an hour with that girl at another club, thinking she was trying hard to earn my business, and then she could have claimed I owed her 500 k. What a disaster that would have been.

For 400 k, I expect a girl to invest some serious time and energy into getting me into bed. Especially in a high end club with cover and overpriced drinks. It might take half the night for me to decide, and my final decision might be that I'm still not interested.

As for the guys who say "that's not how it works", well, that's how it works with me. Remember the golden rule. He who has the gold makes the rules. If she wants my money badly enough, she'll do what it takes to get me to agree to give it to her. If I want her pussy badly enough, I'll do what she requires for me to get it. But what I won't do is guilt myself into handing out free money that hasn't been earned.

Next time I am in a Colombian club or bar, I'm going to do a little experiment. I am going to ask the girl early on in the conversation whether she expects money for anything other than sex. If she says yes, I will tell her thank you and that will be the end of our conversation. On to the next one. If she says no, we proceed on. I'll then emphasize that the time she spends with me that night may not ultimately lead to sex, and she might not receive any money from spending time with me. Are you ok with that? She either accepts or the conversation ends. I'll be sure to report back on the results.

[QUOTE=TheDerilious;2927109]The important part to note (and how to better handle the situation in the future) is you should just know that walking out of the bar with a chick is an admission that you want to pay for sex and that is the expectation. Yes, you have some leeway to get back to you place and the "clock" doesn't start until you generally get to the apartment, but there is an expectation of paying a chick for time wasted unless she is the one trying to back out. You can't just expect to take a prepago out to bars for hours on end then start the clock / pay for a 30 minute sex session. Again, your situation was an edge case on the other end of the spectrum and some girls might have even let it slide, but it's still the expectation to adhere to.[/QUOTE]Thanks for the kind words and good advice. It's good to know what the general expectations are. Now I know more about when I need to communicate and clarify my way of approaching things which is not in line with those standard expectations, to avoid awkward situations and misunderstanding in the future.

[QUOTE=KapnAmerica;2926979]I respect your view on this and it honestly is something I have never really thought hard about. In my relatively short time mongering, I have always assumed that the clock does not "start" until, at the very earliest, the moment the girl and I step into the hotel room or private room. I generally assume that the clock doesn't start until our clothes start coming off or there is some type of foreplay. And many times I will look at my watch before we get started and confirm that the time has just now started and ends at X time. Then set my watch on the nightstand so I can pace myself. I have never yet had a single girl tell me that the clock started before we walked in the room.

Now you are telling me that, in your view, the clock starts to run from the moment you walk out of the bar / club. If it takes you 20 minutes to get from the bar to the hotel and check-in, then you have only 40 minutes left, is my understanding of what you are saying. That blows my mind.[/QUOTE]Hopefully, others will weigh in here. All I can do is offer my approach and my experience. My perspective: I don't think the time necessarily starts for a 20 minute taxi ride. But if you're going to hang out in other bars for an hour or more, then yes, I think she'd expect to be compensated for that time. Said differently, a taxi ride time is the cost of doing business for her. Going to other clubs is over and above that. But that's just my opinion and we all know about opinions. LOL.

[QUOTE=KapnAmerica;2926979]I totally disagree with you that 5 k is "insulting. " If you tip your Uber driver 5 k for taking you from Laureles to Poblado, he will be very happy and not the least bit insulted. In some cases, he might not make 5 k on the ride itself. And he is performing a very valuable service for you. So why should a chica who has performed zero service for you be "insulted" with a 5 k tip plus a free drink?[/QUOTE]I'll agree to disagree here. I totally get what you are saying. And honestly, I can't come up with the right amount. This is a bad analogy. But one reason I don't do alot of mileroticos, facebook, escort sites is because it's somewhat site unseen. If I agree to an hour with a girl from mileroticos and I end up wanting to back out for whatever reason after she arrives, I think it's fair to throw her 20 k or so for taxi and time wasted. Again, bad analogy because your girl wasn't really out any money. (I frequent Gustos often and I'm calling BS on her not being allowed back in. I know first hand they can go back in, so I think she's lying about that.) Like I said, I'll respectfully disagree because I think 20 k or maybe 40 k feels right to me.

[QUOTE=KapnAmerica;2926979]I really am at loss for how to handle the situation better than I did. Some say I owe her something. But if I offer too little, it's an "insult. " [/QUOTE]I'm stating the obvious. But brother, you don't own any of us anything. It's your money and your decisions. Opinions are like assholes, right? My own included. My only valid piece of advice would be to come to a more firm agreement before leaving with her. You said you shrugged. So yes, I can see where you can say there was no firm agreement.

You make a fair point about "it's only a couple dollars. " For me, I am ok wasting $4 to keep the peace if we're talking about a grey area. You mentioned being treated like a local. Again. Just my opinion. It'll never happen. I think some gringos that live there year round probably get some discounts and benefits. But they still aren't locals. It's a fact I despise but 95% of paisas see green when they see Americans. It takes a long time to overcome that dynamic and it'll never happen unless you're there full time.

I appreciate your response and best of luck, brother.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2927059]You know how many hookers have gone with someone and did not hold up their end? Then what? Does she say I know I promised a blow job without a condom, but I will not do that. Only give me 350 K instead of the 500 K you promised. No she does not. She still wants the 500 K. So whether she holds up her end or not, you are still on the hook for the full money.

Then if he had taken her and things went awry, people would say you should have seen the red flags. I do not know about you, but I am definitely not paying for red flags. Either way the shit goes, people are always going to say the monger is at fault.

She can walk out with 5 dudes per night and start some goofy shit when they get outside. Let some people tell it, each person should still give her 100,000 pesos, so she goes home with 500,000 pesos for doing shit all night except escorting folks outside. Then down the road you got people complaining about how the girls do, when they fostered it by paying them anyway when they did it. Guys are their own worst enemy when it comes to women.[/QUOTE]We're talking about two very different things. In your scenairo, there is a clear agreement. And she didn't hold up her end of the argument. To be honest, I guess I've been lucky but I've never had that come up. Colombia or elsewhere, I've never had a girl not deliever on what we discussed. (Talent level aside. LOL) So I can only answer hypothetically but if she doesn't hold up her end of the deal, neither am I. I'm not paying for services not rendered. Call the police. LOL I realize the bravado I'm able to employ in a hypothetical. But I'd go to the mat if she backs out of services we agree to.

That's very different than what the OP stated. There was a somewhat ambiguous agreement. They hadn't even gone in a taxi. And I'm saying 20 k, not 150 k difference. Listen, I see both sides on this. An argument can be made for either side. In the end, as I said, I think the monger is at fault because they were negotiating TIME. If I'm going to consume a not insignificant amount of her time by going to other clubs, I do think she'd expect to be compensated for that time. He did not consume that time so he doesn't owe her the 500 k. My interpretation was the monger was at fault for the ambiguity and 5 usd seems like a small concession. Is that mandatory? Of course not. But just my opinion. Did my $5 just ruin the price structure? No, it did not.

[QUOTE=KapnAmerica;2926979]Now you are telling me that, in your view, the clock starts to run from the moment you walk out of the bar / club. If it takes you 20 minutes to get from the bar to the hotel and check-in, then you have only 40 minutes left, is my understanding of what you are saying. That blows my mind.

I totally disagree with you that 5 k is "insulting. " If you tip your Uber driver 5 k for taking you from Laureles to Poblado, he will be very happy and not the least bit insulted. In some cases, he might not make 5 k on the ride itself. And he is performing a very valuable service for you. So why should a chica who has performed zero service for you be "insulted" with a 5 k tip plus a free drink?[/QUOTE]Blows my mind too. But you have to understand this is gringo culture that they have brought to Colombia. This is how they have turned the place into Miamillin.

You can go into a strip club or casa where Colombians are and watch them drink and shoot the shit with a girl and touch on her all afternoon or night. When they get up to go home after not fucking the chick, they leave nothing and are expected to leave nothing. But with gringo culture you must even pay the chick for buying her a drink and her having a conversation with you because you are "taking up her time. ".

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2927054]If this is the case then why even go outside of your house? Local goons do not need a hooker that walked outside and did not get paid as an excuse to whoop a foreigner's ass and take his money. They can whoop your ass and take all your money on gp and not have to split it with some random hooker. You guys and these old wives tales.[/QUOTE]I'm not sure what your point was. If, indeed, there was one. I live in Medellin. I haven't gotten my ass kicked, mostly because I am not stupid enough to give anyone a reason. I don't walk out of a contact / meeting bar with a girl and then decide I don't want to go with her after-all AND refuse to give her something that will soothe the situation. Did she deserve it? No, probably not. But a smarter person might think of it as insurance. 10 or 15 dollars worth of COP insures she isn't pissed and I don't have to worry that she might have a primo or ex in the area who would put me in the ICU just for being an asshole.

[QUOTE=Hobo3;2926958]What a clown response. Needlessly aggressive way to spew your silly world view. If a guy wants to take a girl who's has a body count in the triple digits on a several thousand dollar trip instead of finding a non-pro that's on him. Don't get all butt hurt because those of us who can take non-pros on trips find it disgusting and utterly sad for some men, that's their only option. I'm not bragging about spending $40. That's what the experience was worth for 15 minutes of pleasure. It's people like you who feel like there's nothing wrong with spending endless amounts of money on pros. You're part of the reason the prices are going up. With your silly "Hey Guys if you want to spend $500 for one night with a girl who's going to bang 5 other guys that week go ahead and do it" nonsense. Not everybody shares your world view, and I don't appreciate you trying to force that pathetic worldview down my throat. Here we all have different perspectives and you should respect that instead of getting butt hurt and telling people how they should see the world.[/QUOTE]So you get to post the 1 millionth iteration of "why are simps paying girls more than 20 k, they are all Centro rats" but me calling out the behavior is "forcing a worldview"? The snowflake behavior is wild sometimes. I respect people finding the best deal that works for them. Yes, there is a line on overpaying for girls that is frustrating and I, myself, would never pay for a girl's OF unless I was getting a private 1-on-1 meetup from it, but most of these complaints always boil down the perceived injustice of being priced out of a market rather than actually missing out on beautiful women.

If I really did think people should spend whatever they want, I wouldn't be coming to Medellin in August to sample the women. I would just be paying OF models or something. It's just tiring to hear about people crying over oil sheiks paying girls to come to Dubai. Those dudes are rich. Those thousands they spend are worth less to them the 50 k pesos you are spending in Centro. Make peace with it. If you want to talk about price inflation or Lleras pricing, sure, but the rest is just complaining.

[QUOTE=TheDerilious;2927158]So you get to post the 1 millionth iteration of "why are simps paying girls more than 20 k, they are all Centro rats" but me calling out the behavior is "forcing a worldview"? The snowflake behavior is wild sometimes. I respect people finding the best deal that works for them. Yes, there is a line on overpaying for girls that is frustrating and I, myself, would never pay for a girl's OF unless I was getting a private 1-on-1 meetup from it, but most of these complaints always boil down the perceived injustice of being priced out of a market rather than actually missing out on beautiful women.

If I really did think people should spend whatever they want, I wouldn't be coming to Medellin in August to sample the women. I would just be paying OF models or something. It's just tiring to hear about people crying over oil sheiks paying girls to come to Dubai. Those dudes are rich. Those thousands they spend are worth less to them the 50 k pesos you are spending in Centro. Make peace with it. If you want to talk about price inflation or Lleras pricing, sure, but the rest is just complaining.[/QUOTE]The constant beating of the same dead horse from same exact type of monger. You're ruining the price LOL.

The best quote I ever heard to debunk this dumb theory.

"What one pays for his steak will not effect the price of what one pays for his burger ".

[QUOTE=Dcrist0527;2927063]I could be very wrong. But I'm operating on the assumption most of us negotiate in terms of time. That's what the Kapn said, but I do know some negotiate per shot. Why do I negotiate on time? Well, two reasons. One: I'm old. On a good day I get two shots. So I try for a daytime shot and a nighttime option. A second shot won't happen without a couple hours in between. Getting old sucks. Haha But almost as importantly, I do not want to be rushed. In fact, there are few things that are more of a turnoff to me than a chica trying to speed things along. Especially with a condom, I'm pretty lucky if I shoot off in 30 minutes. So generally, I prefer longer dates. Somewhere between 2 and 3 hours is my sweet spot. I like to make some level of connection. I am convinced that is the most important ingredient to a less transactional interaction. I'm just not into wham bam now leave. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that approach, if that's what you enjoy. It's just not me. So, for those reasons, I always negotiate time.[/QUOTE]I am sorta getting on the older side. Tmi my guy needs meds to stay up sometimes esp if I'm on party treats.

So I completely agree with what you said. I also agree making a connections makes the sex more enjoyable for me too.

Oddly enough even though I agree with all your points I still negotiate per shot. At least in my small experience. The girls hurry and rush out but don't hury me as much in the bed.

[QUOTE=KapnAmerica;2927122]Thanks for the advice, Miami Boy. I didn't make a deal and no, I could not make up my mind while I was in the club. Maybe after some more flirting and clubbing I could have been convinced to fuck her for 400 k, but at the time we stepped out of the club, it was a definite "no" for me. 500 k was her counteroffer and, although that is a reasonable counter in Gusto's, that was never going to happen no matter how much time we spent together.

So she seemed like a nice enough girl in the club, and I wanted to give her the opportunity to persuade me further to take her to bed, by perhaps accompanying me to other clubs. Her demeanor changed once we got outside the club and that was a big turn off for me. She didn't seem interested in investing more time and energy to convince me to make a deal for sex, which up to that point, I hadn't made. So that's when I made up my mind to walk away. Like a grown man.

[/QUOTE]Honestly I have no idea what these guys are arguing about with their opinions.

I COMPLETELY agree with what you did.

Once I feel a sudden shift or the thing I "bought" is no longer the product I wanted. I am NOT buying it. Whatever you did after. Who cares. Whatever. You still kept that money in your pocket. Better then paying for buyers remorse. Good report BTW.

[QUOTE=Hobo3;2926783]I'm seeing girls me and my buddies $40 to smash years ago being taken out to France and Switzerland for fancy trips. Are y'all really taking girls who have triple digit body counts to fancy trips around the world? What is wrong with you guys? I texted a few and they said they'd see me as soon as they get back. Wow![/QUOTE]So I see this black girl in Santa Fe once and she is smoking. I am spent but she was the hottest girl I had seen there. On a return trip, I run into it, and she is even better looking up close. She is a workout fiend and has a chiseled body. I think I pay her 50,000 k which is like $12.50 at the time, and she is great in the sack and finishes off with a killer massage. Then we get the fucking knock at the door. I hated it but I really had to go.

I get her number and text her when I return. I ruin things for other guys because this time I ask her, "How much is it so that everyone leaves the fuck alone for a hour?" So we are $25 instead of $12.50. I guess I fucked things up paying that but in reality it was $12.50 for the girl and $12.50 not to be bugged.

The back rub is amazing. I go with that first because I just got off the flight. Then we move onto the main course. We have been texting. She is more comfortable with me and vice versa and she puts me inside her without a condom. Unlike any other time in Santa Fe, the sex is volcanic.

She is so fucking good I start talking about taking her on a trip. Now I mentioned somewhere in Colombia, but if I wanted to go to France and Switzerland, yeah, I would pay her what it took to come. I am not sure what price I would pay but if she was down with taking a trip and asked for $500 a day, I would have done it. What is my alternative? The cost of a woman of that quality in France or Switzerland is $500 an hour and the SF gal would be with me for the day, gives killer massages, fucks me bare, and I happened to like her. The chances of getting better in France or Switzerland is slim to none.

For the life of me, I have never heard a guy balk at fucking a girl with a high body count. I have seen that with relationships but not with just fucking. If any guy with some average looking woman tried to tell me his woman was better because she had a lower body count, I would have laughed in this face.

And then there is the final reason not to do this trip is the market back in Colombia. Are you really asking me or any other guy to give up a week of great sex because of some randos on the internet? LOL. You mean you would give up bareback sex with a women with a killer body for me? LOL. Get the fuck out of here!

[QUOTE=MiamiBoy1;2927093]My understanding is the deal was 500 mil for 1 HR of sex, correct? If so, why did you want to check out another club with her? You expected her to hang out with you at some other place for some time, and only after that, head back to your hotel? This doesn't make any sense. Of course she wanted to go straight to your hotel, and once you are done, probably head back to gustos to get another client or just call it a night and go home. Another thing, is that you bailed out once you got out of the club. You could not make up your mind while in the club? I don't get it. Either you are interested in fucking her and make a deal you commit to, or don't make a deal at all. Make up your mind, you are a grown man.[/QUOTE]If 500 mil is considered high end to people and you're expecting full on GFE treatment from girls in higher end establishments then I think Colombia is not the place for you anymore.

La isla is 550 mil standard price for 45 min for a CBJ and CFS. So idk what people are expecting. Maybe the fb scene or centro scene is better off for ones budget is service is most important requirement.

[QUOTE=KapnAmerica;2927122]Thanks for the advice, Miami Boy. I didn't make a deal and no, I could not make up my mind while I was in the club. Maybe after some more flirting and clubbing I could have been convinced to fuck her for 400 k, but at the time we stepped out of the club, it was a definite "no" for me. 500 k was her counteroffer and, although that is a reasonable counter in Gusto's, that was never going to happen no matter how much time we spent together.

So she seemed like a nice enough girl in the club, and I wanted to give her the opportunity to persuade me further to take her to bed, by perhaps accompanying me to other clubs. Her demeanor changed once we got outside the club and that was a big turn off for me. She didn't seem interested in investing more time and energy to convince me to make a deal for sex, which up to that point, I hadn't made. So that's when I made up my mind to walk away. Like a grown man.

Now that I know some on this forum could have construed her counteroffer as proposing 500 k for an hour of doing anything, I am very glad I made the decision I did. Because I could have spent an hour with that girl at another club, thinking she was trying hard to earn my business, and then she could have claimed I owed her 500 k. What a disaster that would have been.

For 400 k, I expect a girl to invest some serious time and energy into getting me into bed. Especially in a high end club with cover and overpriced drinks. It might take half the night for me to decide, and my final decision might be that I'm still not interested.

As for the guys who say "that's not how it works", well, that's how it works with me. Remember the golden rule. He who has the gold makes the rules. If she wants my money badly enough, she'll do what it takes to get me to agree to give it to her. If I want her pussy badly enough, I'll do what she requires for me to get it. But what I won't do is guilt myself into handing out free money that hasn't been earned.

Next time I am in a Colombian club or bar, I'm going to do a little experiment. I am going to ask the girl early on in the conversation whether she expects money for anything other than sex. If she says yes, I will tell her thank you and that will be the end of our conversation. On to the next one. If she says no, we proceed on. I'll then emphasize that the time she spends with me that night may not ultimately lead to sex, and she might not receive any money from spending time with me. Are you ok with that? She either accepts or the conversation ends. I'll be sure to report back on the results.[/QUOTE]For 400 k in Poblado you want a Gustos girl to seduce you all night and hop around other clubs with the off chance that you're still going to turn her down at the end of the night. And meanwhile if she is hot she is certain to make double or triple that on one night on a weekend.

The issue here is I don't think you understand the logistics of the current state of Medellin.

You're not bringing gold you're bringing a knife to a machine gun fight if you're thinking 400 k is going to get you all that in Gustos. But you were there on a slow night. And I'm with Miami boy. I was understanding that you made the agreement. She wanted 600 you got her down to 500. Then outside she desperately was willing to go down to your 400.

Times have changed. Look at the migracióand line in medellin. When I first started going literally no one was on line. Now it's a 3 hour wait all day with the line running up to walkway. It's common sense. Girls know they have options.

The default expectation I've found for most girls off Facebook or social media is more that they are sticking around for 2 or 3 hours and fucking once, maybe more if they are into it. They will leave faster and only fuck you once if you are lame. But I will write off or have a clarifying conversation with any woman who quotes me per hour in Medellin. Usually when I state I don't do per hour and what my experience has been they agree / back off for the price we had been talking about. Now a casa or Mileroticos girl is different. That's going to be more strictly time based. But the expectation is you are going to go for a second or more polvo if you book an hour. I was doing an hour at Zandalys for 80 k and a couple polvos when I was in Medellin last week (with extras costing a bit more depending).

[QUOTE=Dcrist0527;2927063]I could be very wrong. But I'm operating on the assumption most of us negotiate in terms of time. That's what the Kapn said, but I do know some negotiate per shot. Why do I negotiate on time? Well, two reasons. One: I'm old. On a good day I get two shots. So I try for a daytime shot and a nighttime option. A second shot won't happen without a couple hours in between. Getting old sucks. Haha But almost as importantly, I do not want to be rushed. In fact, there are few things that are more of a turnoff to me than a chica trying to speed things along. Especially with a condom, I'm pretty lucky if I shoot off in 30 minutes. So generally, I prefer longer dates. Somewhere between 2 and 3 hours is my sweet spot. I like to make some level of connection. I am convinced that is the most important ingredient to a less transactional interaction. I'm just not into wham bam now leave. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that approach, if that's what you enjoy. It's just not me. So, for those reasons, I always negotiate time.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Combo;2926618]I love Baroque music, but I think you'll find the women more into Reggaeton in Medellin.[/QUOTE]My experience is that most (chicas about 20 years old) prefer electronica. For my sex sessions I prefer reggaeton and many ask me to change it over to electronica. Even the ones that say it's ok say they prefer electronica.