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[QUOTE=Tansak KTV]First Date? Shoot.. I've had some that go long long long time without getting any type of sexual action.[/QUOTE]
Like my wife. Took me a long time to convience her that as a Farang I didn't have two heads and wasn't going to eat children.
I know many Thai women pushing forty that haven't encountered the 'one eyed trouser snake" yet and probably never will.
[QUOTE=Retired Army]Like my wife. Took me a long time to convience her that as a Farang I didn't have two heads and wasn't going to eat children.
I know many Thai women pushing forty that haven't encountered the 'one eyed trouser snake" yet and probably never will.[/QUOTE]
I agree 100% and 99.9999999% of the people that read this board do not get to know traditional thai women. I now know, after many years working and making mistakes in BKK, many women that share intimate details with me, we do things with, talk all the time, but no way are they putting out until after marriage and many are older already and are OK with working and staying single.
Now saying this there are many ladies on web sites that will put out first date no problem. But these I would not classify as traditional girls. If they are advertising on the web I would have a hard time as considering them normal or traditional thai girls still.
The problem for me, is that I'm a fucking horn dog / bastard and need a nympho. Looks are important but the nympho aspect is the most important. I haven't found a traditional thai girl that can hump all the time and haven't found a traditional girl I want to invest the time with to try to get into the sack. So I'm inclined to think I'm stuck with bar girls or ex bar girls in different countries for the rest of my life.
NOW... I do know a lot of ex bar girls that have been good wives, act like traditional wives, etc... But I know a lot more that cheat and ko hok to their sponsors. The older they get, the more they've learned and value a good guy so getting young bar girls as your TGF you are asking for trouble.
And shit but I like them young so I'm screwed no matter what I do. I admire you for finding a good wife and staying with it.
Hello Neil,
I wrote you a long reply about this last night, but somehow I clicked the wrong button and lost it.
But I suggest you go to [url]www.thailandguru.com[/url] there is lots of advice there.
Look on the left, towards the bottom, for Thai girlfriends or something like that.
For me, the rules are simple.
Treat them like you would treat a first date in your own country.
Dress well, I prefer to meet them in a neutral plac like a coffee shop or restaurant near my hotel.
Be courteous, be attentive. Many Thai women do not drink alcohol, so don't press it if she says no.
There gets to be a point in the meeting where conversation dies out, and you are both just sitting there. At this time I ask her "what do you want to do now?". Often she will say go to your room. or maybe if you think she is really interested, ask if she wants to watch some TV in your room. Move slowly, by this time she is pretty much committed, but will still be very nervous. Don't push her.
And Thai women tend to not take the initiatie - it is part of their culture. So you will have to initiate everything.
Remember, if she is a regular Thai woman, this is probably her first experience with a farang, so she is probably a bit nervous too. And she has heard all sorts of stories about farang monsters, or farangs eating babies, etc.
But I have had them come with me on the first date. very nervous about penis size, and if you will hurt them.
One spoke very little English, but I had been introduced by a friend, who came with us to dinner, and acted as interpreter for that evening. She came with me first time, and stayed overnight. It was lovely, once she got going, she was vry attentive. And we still get together when I am there in Thailand with some time to spare.
I have not had sex with a Thai virgin.
Oh, also, be prepared that she may turn up with a friend. This is part of their culture, a chaperone, so don't bag it. The second person may be a brother, a friend, sister, cousin. This person is there to protect her in situations of distress. be courteous, accept it. If you shape up as OK, this person will excuse themselves. If they do this, you know you have passed the test, and you are in. It is a good sign.
And remember, in Asia, "nothing is as it seems"
Good luck,
G
Thank you guys for your condescendent and useless advices like : "don't consider them as prostitutes".
Of course I won't, I have been with many thai prostitutes already.
The idea here is to get out of this scheme and date regular girls with a regular behaviour.
Anyway, thanks Gangles for giving me real advices.
So they are stories about farang eating babies, that's so hilarious.
You know, I'm really starting to love this country.
[QUOTE=Mbx0710]
Well anyway, I need to clarify some things about my ex-thai-girlfriend.
- She NEVER lived on a farm (except holidays)
- She IS from a middleclass Bangkok family (her father and mother are divorced, but both live in their own fairly big townhouses in the city center)
- They STILL ask for money. Even at middleclass level. They must have thought that I was ULTRA rich.
[/QUOTE]
Mbx0710,
Does the asking for money only apply to farangs? I asked my driver on the way from Pattaya to BKK airport last week if he sent any money to his in-laws. He is middle-aged, married with 2 grown kids. He told me that other than a few gifts he brings when he visits them upcountry, he has not given them any money since he paid the 40,000 baht dowry when he got married. He told me the in-laws are just OK financially so it is not necessary. And, he has not taken any money from his kids even though they are both working in good jobs.
I met up with LBM in Pattaya recently and he suggested that I read "Thailand Fever" since I am contemplating a relationship with a TG. Although I was already familiar with most of the content having lived in and visited Thailand for nearly 30 years, it offers good insight for a newbie on the scene. A lot of the book talks about the "generousity" concept and how family support is an integral part of any relationship with a TG. It was interesting to hear that my driver did not support his in-laws, build a house, put the brother-in-law in business, etc. I do not have many normal close Thai friends now since I am just in and out for the most part in recent years. I would be curious to know if the same applies in normal Thai society with Thai-Thai relationships nowadays.
OAH
Hi OldAsiaHand,
Aologise for answering but would love to read Mbx0710's views.
You truly have raised a keypoint when it comes to deciding on a close relationaship with a TG.
Have lived many years in the kingdom and can tell you there are only two classes of society in Thailand. The normal, hardworking, moderate and satisfied and the other being vulture culture, sanook, I. E live to have fun.(whatever that takes to get there)
There is nothing like Rich, middle or poor.
Family values exist but should be seen and learnt from the former and surely not from the latter.
The males are more docile, unfaithful and cold in the latter category and the males are responsible, caring and providing in the former category.
Probably decades of easy money via tourism has created an easy channel for the females in the latter class and they will take advantage of this to the hilt. Probably this economic downturn might give them a wakeup call but all said and done they will be back to their old ways when things get back to normal.
To get into a relationship with a TG (those that one encounters as freelancers or whatover) is like trying to make a horse drink water!
The horse could be guided to the water but will only drink when its thirsty!
Cheers
[QUOTE=OldAsiaHand]Mbx0710,
Does the asking for money only apply to farangs? I asked my driver on the way from Pattaya to BKK airport last week if he sent any money to his in-laws. He is middle-aged, married with 2 grown kids. He told me that other than a few gifts he brings when he visits them upcountry, he has not given them any money since he paid the 40,000 baht dowry when he got married. He told me the in-laws are just OK financially so it is not necessary. And, he has not taken any money from his kids even though they are both working in good jobs.
I met up with LBM in Pattaya recently and he suggested that I read "Thailand Fever" since I am contemplating a relationship with a TG. Although I was already familiar with most of the content having lived in and visited Thailand for nearly 30 years, it offers good insight for a newbie on the scene. A lot of the book talks about the "generousity" concept and how family support is an integral part of any relationship with a TG. It was interesting to hear that my driver did not support his in-laws, build a house, put the brother-in-law in business, etc. I do not have many normal close Thai friends now since I am just in and out for the most part in recent years. I would be curious to know if the same applies in normal Thai society with Thai-Thai relationships nowadays.
OAH[/QUOTE]
OAH,
You should have ask me the question last week and I would have told you these two stories that I got from my wife just this year and I have known this two Thai guys for many years and sit with them at least once a week over a Leo beer.
Thai guy number #1, works in a body shop and has a wife from Issan, this is her second marriage she has already 1 kid. The kid is being raised by her mother and sister while she lives in Pattaya. Everytime she gets a small job or comes up with a idea to make some money for herself, the husband degrades her. That why waste your time doing this or that the job doesn't pay enough you should be getting more. They both sleep in a small room at the body shop and pay nothing. The place is so dirty you couldn't pay me to stay there even for one night. After his shift, he goes play snooker and drink beer everynight although he makes around 10,000 baht per month. Recently the wife had to return back to Issan to take care of the mother since she has cancer. The husband even before the mother got sick has never given his wife any money to help with her family. I was told he even complains that his wife isn't taking care of his manly needs instead left to take care of the mother. After a year of this she finally dumped him and he has a new girlfriend.
Thai guy number #2, This guy is the owner of the body shop and his wife runs a local snooker hangout and they both live in the back of the snooker parlor. This guy I have known for 8 years and I always felt he was a good straight up guy that I though was pretty responsible. They are our closest Thai friends their son is my son best friends and we share many outings together and he always pays his fair share. This April, when I was invited to visit the wife parents home I noticed some tension between the husband and his inlaws. I got this from the half ass Wat that the father-inlaw gave to his son-inlaw. I learn later that he got their daughter pregnant and refuses even today to marry her legally and the son doesn't even have his name. Everything he makes he keeps to himself and everything she makes from the snooker parlor she keeps and help her own family.
These two stories are just stories in general and I have been told that not all Thai's are like this but personally I have not met one!
From my own personal experiences I'm starting to think that helping out everyone in the family only applies to Farangs. There is a double standard going on here if a Farang say no and doesn't do it, they are cheap, and don't care about their family even if the Farang is telling the truth that their broke. When Farangs come to Thailand on holidays and ring up bar taps, have money for a nice cup of coffee at Starbucks, spend 500 baht at MK, just for lunch when the average poor Thai, average a 100 baht for meals a day! When you tell them you don't have money they just smile and deep down under their breath they're saying and thinking YEH RIGHT! YOU CHEAP FUCKING BASTARD!
LBM
[QUOTE=OldAsiaHand]Mbx0710,
Does the asking for money only apply to farangs? I asked my driver on the way from Pattaya to BKK airport last week if he sent any money to his in-laws. He is middle-aged, married with 2 grown kids. He told me that other than a few gifts he brings when he visits them upcountry, he has not given them any money since he paid the 40,000 baht dowry when he got married. He told me the in-laws are just OK financially so it is not necessary. And, he has not taken any money from his kids even though they are both working in good jobs.
I met up with LBM in Pattaya recently and he suggested that I read "Thailand Fever" since I am contemplating a relationship with a TG. Although I was already familiar with most of the content having lived in and visited Thailand for nearly 30 years, it offers good insight for a newbie on the scene. A lot of the book talks about the "generousity" concept and how family support is an integral part of any relationship with a TG. It was interesting to hear that my driver did not support his in-laws, build a house, put the brother-in-law in business, etc. I do not have many normal close Thai friends now since I am just in and out for the most part in recent years. I would be curious to know if the same applies in normal Thai society with Thai-Thai relationships nowadays.
OAH[/QUOTE]Hey OAH and Soapy Fuk,
I don't have any Thai friends so I am not sure if the support thing is a purely farang-only feature. But with that said, I am sure that Farangs are viewed as being billionaires and therefore it is quite natural that we are cheeap charlies when we don't pay up what is expected of us.
Each time I was in BKK to visit my GF's family we went out to a restaurant the whole family, about 6-7 people, where the tab off course landed in front of me everytime. I didn't really care, cause the 7-8000 baht tab was nothing compared to a normal dinner for 2 in scandinavia. And the food was good, my GF was proud and happy and her family seemed happy. Her mother would constantly ask for money for her temple (1-2000 baht) and I payed her, well knowing that her mother would gamble the money away as soon as I turned my back to her. All this I considered payment to spend some "respect" time with her family and what the hell. I got to bang her 23 yr old daughter. So I guess I never thought further about that. Her father was more direct in demanding money (cash) from me. So I categorily declined. As a principle.
Her Thai friends also expected me to pay for entrance fees, booze and food when we entered nightclubs etc. But again a small cost, I thought, to bang her when we came home.
My GF never asked for money to send home to her family. And I never gave her any. She was also the youngest child of 4 so she did not have the big sister" responsibility, I guess.
The TGF I had before this one was quite different, because she was the big sister in her family and had to support her lazy father, grandfather, brothers and sisters. But she was open about this and told me too. I hate lazy people, so I could see my frustations in the future about sendning money to her family.
To sum up, with my very limited experiences, and what has said before many times on this board. TGF view farangs as ATM's and as lottery tickets with a guaranteed prize. Some of these girls have obligations to support their family, some don't. You can choose to accept that or not. So the point is probably that we (including me) kid ourselves by thinking that they really love us, but the truth is that they need the money for various reasons and they will love us "TGF style" to get it. (and not to get too generalizing about this type of relationship I would think this will almost apply to any relationship were the age difference is +10 yrs, no matter what country we are in? ! )
I once tried to explain simple scandinvian living costs to my TGF. Such as personal tax 58%, 25%VAT, gasoline prices, etc etc. It simply didn't get in. But if you were standing in a market in BKK it took 2 secs for her to calculate the price of 7 different items she had collected with and without discounts.
[QUOTE=LittleBigMan]OAH,
From my own personal experiences I'm starting to think that helping out everyone in the family only applies to Farangs. There is a double standard going on here if a Farang say no and doesn't do it, they are cheap, and don't care about their family even if the Farang is telling the truth that their broke. When Farangs come to Thailand on holidays and ring up bar taps, have money for a nice cup of coffee at Starbucks, spend 500 baht at MK, just for lunch when the average poor Thai, average a 100 baht for meals a day! When you tell them you don't have money they just smile and deep down under their breath they're saying and thinking YEH RIGHT! YOU CHEAP FUCKING BASTARD!
LBM[/QUOTE]Little Big Man,
That is the best opinion I have read about LOS allover ISG. I tried to marry a thai girl once and that was the same conclusion I arrived to
The kinds of Isan TG we punters are able to meet have -on average- maybe an IQ between 60 and 70. (Yes, you may give up the thought that an elderly Farang, even if educated, and neither too fat and ugly nor entirely poor, is able to hook up with a 29-32yr. old Bangkok CEO of an IT company. I know what you are trying to point out: That we won’t be able to meet the said roster of girls at Beergarden; but I once was spending my Saturday and Sunday afternoons as a pilot at the Thai Flying Club in Bang Phra, Sri Racha, meeting grounds of the Thai military, corporate and political elite. Still to no avail.)
This needs to be taken into consideration in case you intend to stay with one of the local lasses for longer than the recommended three days because inadvertently you will face a condition when she engages you in a heated argument, most likely because of unjustified jealousy. You will then find the mix of limited intellectual capabilities, entirely irrational behavior and a totally different thought process either amusing or, at worst and when alcohol plays a role, dangerous and nightmarish. Mutual language incapacities are added to the dangerous mix.
My best wishes go out to all the guys who –more or less successfully- are able to live together with a bar beer Isan girl with three or some more years of Buffalo University under her belt. I couldn’t, not because of a lack of education or intellect on her part but because of this latent and potentially violent irrationality which can be a result of a lack of culture and education.
Christopher G. Moore described it well in one of his books, I forgot which one: Spending the night with a TG is sleeping with a sharp knife at your throat.
[QUOTE=Frankfurter]The kinds of Isan TG we punters are able to meet have -on average- maybe an IQ between 60 and 70. (Yes, you may give up the thought that an elderly Farang, even if educated, and neither too fat and ugly nor entirely poor, is able to hook up with a 29-32yr. old Bangkok CEO of an IT company. I know what you are trying to point out: That we won’t be able to meet the said roster of girls at Beergarden; but I once was spending my Saturday and Sunday afternoons as a pilot at the Thai Flying Club in Bang Phra, Sri Racha, meeting grounds of the Thai military, corporate and political elite. Still to no avail.)
This needs to be taken into consideration in case you intend to stay with one of the local lasses for longer than the recommended three days because inadvertently you will face a condition when she engages you in a heated argument, most likely because of unjustified jealousy. You will then find the mix of limited intellectual capabilities, entirely irrational behavior and a totally different thought process either amusing or, at worst and when alcohol plays a role, dangerous and nightmarish. Mutual language incapacities are added to the dangerous mix.
My best wishes go out to all the guys who –more or less successfully- are able to live together with a bar beer Isan girl with three or some more years of Buffalo University under her belt. I couldn’t, not because of a lack of education or intellect on her part but because of this latent and potentially violent irrationality which can be a result of a lack of culture and education.
Christopher G. Moore described it well in one of his books, I forgot which one: Spending the night with a TG is sleeping with a sharp knife at your throat.[/QUOTE]
So true. This time in LOS I took a girl from a bar in a very quiet beach place I was staying at (not many bars, even fewer pretty girls). I barfined her every other day for a week, and she had come to think of me as a bf of sorts, becoming very jealous and upset when I mentioned I would be going back to my country soon. She would also send tons of SMS and called me every day etc,...She was very upset when she met me by chance at a disco when I was with some other TGs (she stormed away!) What a hassle! Those girls don't understand we like P4P because we don't want any emotional attachment, only fun! I experienced this "jealousy" from some other bar girls too and was not really prepared for it from reading ISG and being new to the bar scene...Maybe times have changed because there are fewer customers?
I also saw someone who was the direct victim of an unknown drunken bar girl who started to fight with her customer in a disco (accusing him of having too many girlfriends! the irony...) and became collateral damage and had to go to the ER to get his face stitched up. It could have been much worse...but what the hell? Sharp knives indeed!
It seems that with the bar girls it's difficult. If you meet a Thai lady outside the bar scene, I've noticed a lot of differences.
My, now, wife, was a teacher, married a Thai guy who brought her to the US. He died and we met.
She has worked two jobs (one full time, one part) until only recently, and has found time to go to school part time.
Her Mom does live with us, but does all the cooking, laundry and cleaning. We each give her $100 per month and of course take her when we go out to dinner (usually).
She pays part of our household bills, and times out, and buys stuff for the house.
She has gotten requests for some money from family in Thailand (Father, brothers) and has sent a few hundred a year from her money, not asking me for any.
When we go over to Thailand we do generally pick up joint meals, etc, but we do earn a lot more. Her family does pick up taxi fares, lunches, etc.
Now she has never been to a bar in Thailand until our visit last year when I finally convinced her to visit Nana (she was embarrased).
So guys it's easy to meet the Ladies from the bars, but if you are thinking long term relations, look around at regular businesses, etc.
Keep in mind also that there is the issue of loss of face, which is very important.
When she comes across you with other bargirls, it is major loss of face, because you choose someone else rather than her.
If she does not see you, then no loss of face.
G
To add to Gangles' post, this is a one way street.
She can be seen with as many men as she wants, after all it is her job.
But you cannot be seen with another girl, as that means she is no longer wanted by you, hence loss of face.
Amazing Thailand.
[QUOTE=Gangles]Keep in mind also that there is the issue of loss of face, which is very important.[/QUOTE]
You know what? who gives a fuck? as a tourist you should not care.
The "loss of face" is very convenient for her, she will play this card to make dumb punters feel bad! trust me, there is no such think as loss of face in Thai oriented venue... you know why? because they understand the concept of a purchased service ;)