Manila

3rd night hit the bar opposite to PP disc before moving on to Cocalips again. Today as well was pushed a gal Samantha by another mamasan. I loved her 5'4" build with curvy and not skinny frame. She has her hair dyed partly blonde with a typical looks of one you see in p0 rn movies and with a slightly receded chin. Said she had worked as a maid in Dubai and was back waiting for her next contract. Now with the FL option In was wondering if I should have spent time at apple scouting for one. I already have an FL lined up for today whom I had met and promised the evening before over a drink. But I decided to enjoy the bar scene on a weekend / Sunday Rather than a Monday and leave the FL for a quiet day following. Also I was suspicious that 3 k was a bar fine for dancers but the gals sitting around could be had for less. So I negotiated it down to 2. 5 k with 1. 5 k bar fine and 1 k for gal in the room.

This one was a surprise in bed. Perfectly slutty skills in BJ and HJ just the way I love it. I secretly laughed at how she had told me she didn't like her house owner at dubai because he wanted to kiss her. She was such a p0 rn starlet in her actions I wanted to hire her as a maid for myself. We laughed about it. But like all gals too loose for a normal sized Indian dick- if you are thicker than 5.5" circumference you might enjoy her. So I decided to finish off with a HJ and loved it. The twist came soon after.

She went to the bathroom to clean up and came back fully dressed. I said what? She said I go. Then it struck me I had never discussed ST or LT. I said very firmly and assertively that LT was understood and she had to make it clear if it was ST when taking the money. Hearing my angry tone she started whining and pleading I have baby etc. I let her go with 500 instead of 1 k and thought that was the end of it. But wait. What follows is only a brief gist of a vocal half an hour of arguing - (mobile and typing dont go well I am sorry.)

In the morning I hear a knock and the resort manager tells me the mamasan is waiting for me to discuss the matter. He offered to explain on my behalf about the LT / ST thing and I agreed. But 15 minutes later he calls back saying she wants to discuss with you. I head to the reception and the mamasan is waiting with the gal and another housemaid type of friend. The mamasan, a very fair intellectual looking bespectacled lady, is extremely apologetic to me but insists I wanted ass which she didn't like and so she wanted to go. I said I only spoken to her about it and did not push it. Then she claimed I shooed her away. I said I only opened the door for her while she was sobbing and whining and told her to go as I did not want a reluctant female in bed all night. Then I insisted she not keep her part of the agreement. So the gal repeated what she had told me in the bar last night that she was only 3 days old and did not know the regulations and rules of the game. But she was still acting cocky. She threatened to call the police and walked away with her assistant. I let her go while I firmly argued with the mamasan in the hot sun. She comes back 15 mins later with no cop because my resort is at the far end of the beach. Again we argue and she is is not willing to let go of that 500. She tells me fck you you are just tourist I am local I will make you pay more than 500. I tell her go call the cops and try what you want. She walks away a second time saying she will go all the way this time until she reaches a barangay police station. I continue arguing with the mamasan and tell her I ruin her reputation on the internet because everyone discover Sabang via Internet and my bad experience with her will be known by everyone in the US and Europe. And that people would sart avoiding her bar. It seems to bother her a bit. Then after she had walked a good distance, I suddenly flipped and offered to pay the balance 500 and close the matter. I know they are bluffing from their tone and apologetic stance. Yet I decide to do it as its meant to be a pleasure vacation and what's 500 given the amount I am spending. Besides I have one more night of bar hopping to do and don't want to encounter the issue at night when I just want to be pleasantly drunk looking for the latest hottie. She yells out and calls them back from the distance. She quietly t

FYI. Landed in MNL at terminal 2 on Friday, May 22nd. Was through immigration and in the taxi line in about 5 minutes. There were 20 people waiting, no taxis. Went up to the departure area by way of the stairs. Immediately jumped into a waiting taxi whose gracious driver immediately turned on his meter and off we went to Heritage Hotel. Upon arrival the fare was. Drumroll please. 99.50 p. I gave him an extra 20 pesos and he was happy. And that was with all the damn traffic. So, now you know what the price should be.

[QUOTE=PeeMan;1728456]Also I was suspicious that 3 k was a bar fine for dancers but the gals sitting around could be had for less. So I negotiated it down to 2. 5 k with 1. 5 k bar fine and 1 k for gal in the room.

[...]

She went to the bathroom to clean up and came back fully dressed. I said what? She said I go. Then it struck me I had never discussed ST or LT. [b]I said very firmly and assertively that LT was understood and she had to make it clear if it was ST when taking the money[/b]. Hearing my angry tone she started whining and pleading I have baby etc. I let her go with 500 instead of 1 k and thought that was the end of it. But wait. What follows is only a brief gist of a vocal half an hour of arguing.

[...]

Then after she had walked a good distance, I suddenly flipped and offered to pay the balance 500 and close the matter. I know they are bluffing from their tone and apologetic stance. Yet I decide to do it as its meant to be a pleasure vacation and what's 500 given the amount I am spending. Besides I have one more night of bar hopping to do and don't want to encounter the issue at night when I just want to be pleasantly drunk looking for the latest hottie.[/QUOTE]

What a mess. I don't understand how one has his wits about him to negotiate a barfine (not merely accept the initial price) but fails to discuss the details of the deal. But hey, different people's noggins work differently. When left vague what is understood between both parties can differ significantly, as seen here. Adding more complexity is the expectation that the other party is obliged to make things clear. In my life experience when I assigned unstated obligations to others, especially those who are strangers, it hasn't led to a satisfactory outcome usually. Better to make such demands of yourself by telling others exactly what you want; you'll be less likely to left disappointed or, worse, spend hours bickering and hear threats of police intervention. Implicit is rarely better than explicit. How some people choose to spend their precious vacation time...

In reading other FRs I know there who are some here who advocate not going over the details prior to paying a barfine. This FR shows the risks of this clearly. What one gains by leaving things unclear has never been explained to me compellingly.

[QUOTE=Hutsori;1728498]What a mess. SNIP

In reading other FRs I know there who are some here who advocate not going over the details prior to paying a barfine. This FR shows the risks of this clearly. What one gains by leaving things unclear has never been explained to me compellingly.[/QUOTE]Those who prefer not to discuss details prior to payment tell me that it "destroys the mood" and "is not romantic". To each his own, but I'm with you on this Huts. From the girl's point there is rarely a mood or romance that the gent himself is experiencing. It is a biz transaction that ups her romanticism.

These gents (and guys chatted sitting at bars in the area) also often use the word 'date'; I think there is often in AC / Burgos an untrue belief that they are taking the girl out of the bar for the evening on a date (because she's willing to go drinking / eating); hence the idea of romance. Nothing could be further from the truth: Just try taking the girl on that 'date' without paying the barfine.

[QUOTE=Hutsori;1728498] . <SNIP>

In reading other FRs I know there who are some here who advocate not going over the details prior to paying a barfine. This FR shows the risks of this clearly. What one gains by leaving things unclear has never been explained to me compellingly.[/QUOTE]Well said Huts, and as we both know, there is a daily need to make things absolutely clear and specific in everything you do in the Philippines.

For example: if you don't want mayonnaise on your sandwich you need to be very explicit, say it clearly, repeat it, and then listen carefully when the waiter repeats your order back to you. Same rule applies to planning the BF. Be very explicit, and don't move until there is clear mutual undertanding.

As WC says, forget about the "romance" aspect if it is a barfine; for the girl it is a business deal no matter how much you sugarcoat it. You should treat it as such too.

[QUOTE=EngineDriver;1727627]I can confirm it's very easy to pick up a girl at Robinson Mall, Ermita for ST action. I was approached twice at the entrance to the mall before going to the security line. I walked straight past one girl and the other one looked unclean and untidy so I said no. Inside the mall, within a few minutes a girl smiled, but I was on a mission to get something so smiled back and kept walking. About half-an-hour later another MILF in her 30's makes eye contact and smiles. I invited her over and bought her a bubble cup coconut drink. We got talking and she said 2,500 for ST. I said let's make it 2,000 and she agreed. So off we go to the Diamond Hotel at 12.00 noon and get down to business. Service was quite mechanical and with none of the passion or enthusiasm I was expecting (after being spoiled in AC). She showered at the start, but there was a bit of mucus discharge in her pussy, so I passed on DATY. But it wasn't too bad overall. DFK, CBJ and came doggie while playing with her A cup tits. We showered again and she was out by 12.40 pm. She asked me if I wanted a companion for the next day, but I said I was leaving that evening.

If you don't want to go to LA Cafe and be forced to drink one more SML and fight off the back massage bandits, then Robinson is an option but with limited choice.[/QUOTE]I used to hang out in that area at Jamba Juice and / or Starbucks. Yes, everyone has different tastes, but I found the quality hanging out in that area less the low. I guess at that time the selection is going to be limited at either place.

(I'm not one to penny pinch, but seems like an overpay for that area / quality.).

[QUOTE=Random99;1728830]I used to hang out in that area at Jamba Juice and / or Starbucks. Yes, everyone has different tastes, but I found the quality hanging out in that area less the low. I guess at that time the selection is going to be limited at either place.

(I'm not one to penny pinch, but seems like an overpay for that area / quality.).[/QUOTE]Yeah I've now learnt that the price for ST action from the mall is around 1000 PHP. When you are on vacation with limited time, you tend not to worry about overpaying. I was leaving that evening and wanted to squeeze in one more fuck before checking out of my room. Quality is not great, but better than the white whales I am used to seeing in Australian malls and you can't pick those up. LOL.

[QUOTE=RedKilt;1728631]Well said Huts, and as we both know, there is a daily need to make things absolutely clear and specific in everything you do in the Philippines.

For example: if you don't want mayonnaise on your sandwich you need to be very explicit, say it clearly, repeat it, and then listen carefully when the waiter repeats your order back to you. Same rule applies to planning the BF. Be very explicit, and don't move until there is clear mutual undertanding.

As WC says, forget about the "romance" aspect if it is a barfine; for the girl it is a business deal no matter how much you sugarcoat it. You should treat it as such too.[/QUOTE]In fairness to the Filipino people, I find their level of comprehension far better than say the Indonesians. You need to repeat many times to be assured an Indonesian has understood what you are saying and then they will still go and stuff up your order. Being exposed to American and Spanish cultures, Christianity and knowing English has certainly put the Filipons at the top of the tree when it comes to communication.

[QUOTE=EngineDriver;1728860]. Being exposed to American and Spanish cultures, Christianity and knowing English has certainly put the Filipons at the top of the tree when it comes to communication.[/QUOTE]Hmm not sure I would totally agree on that. Many people have problems in Philippines because they generally receive a reply of " yes " or something equally affirmative to a question. That makes them assume that they were understood. Nothing can be further from the truth sometimes. The "yes" was just acknowledging what was said, but had nothing to do with actually comprehending its contents. Many problems occur in Philippines because someone says " do you understand me " and the reply is "yes".

[QUOTE=RedKilt;1728631]As WC says, forget about the "romance" aspect if it is a barfine; for the girl it is a business deal no matter how much you sugarcoat it. You should treat it as such too.[/QUOTE]Respectfully I disagree. Although money exchanges hands, my modus operandi is to make it as little like a business transaction as possible. I chat and get to know my girl, make her laugh and feel comfortable in my company and some time later, after I tell her how much I'll pay her (including tip if she makes me smile), I'll take her back to my hotel. It's not just about the sex for me, it's about the intimate moments, holding hands, talking till late, the kisses and cuddles and falling asleep arm in arm. I love the fact that I always walk out of the bar hand-in-hand and we always exchange mobile numbers next morning. I crave the 'girlfriend experience' when I travel and find that if I treat girls nicely, with respect, and don't make them feel like hookers, there can be a certain romance to proceedings. Especially in Philippines.

The girls are after money, of course they are, but while I would suggest that newcomers always establish terms and conditions in the bar, I think experience can bring an unspoken understanding with the girls. I do find it incredible for example that people believe they will get the same level of service from a girl they ask 'do you do anal?' within minutes of meeting her. Make her feel like a prostitute and she'll act like one in my experience but invest time and effort in getting to know a girl and she will give you what you want without the need for you going through a tick-list of requirements in the bar.

[QUOTE=SirLancelot;1728874] <SNIP> Make her feel like a prostitute and she'll act like one in my experience but invest time and effort in getting to know a girl and she will give you what you want without the need for you going through a tick-list of requirements in the bar.[/QUOTE]In the final analysis, you are setting out to deceive her into getting what you want.

You know she is a prostitute.

She knows she is prostituting herself but is trying to deceive herself into thinking she's not.

It's all just a big charade, by both parties, and it ends up with the same result.

Guy gets his kicks and girl gets her money, despite all the deceptive processes that go on in between (from both sides).

[QUOTE=FreebieFan;1728870]Hmm not sure I would totally agree on that. Many people have problems in Philippines because they generally receive a reply of " yes " or something equally affirmative to a question. That makes them assume that they were understood. Nothing can be further from the truth sometimes. The "yes" was just acknowledging what was said, but had nothing to do with actually comprehending its contents. Many problems occur in Philippines because someone says " do you understand me " and the reply is "yes".[/QUOTE]Compared to Indonesia, Vietnam, Cambodia and Laos, the Filipinos seem a lot sharper and communicate much better. Have you ever tried getting anything done in Cambodia? It's a fuckin' nightmare just trying to check into your hotel. Pol Pot killed off anyone with an education. The only people allowed to live were illiterate rice farmers. They are the people now running the country.

[QUOTE=EngineDriver;1728913]Compared to Indonesia, Vietnam, Cambodia and Laos, the Filipinos seem a lot sharper and communicate much better. Have you ever tried getting anything done in Cambodia? It's a fuckin' nightmare just trying to check into your hotel. Pol Pot killed off anyone with an education. The only people allowed to live were illiterate rice farmers. They are the people now running the country.[/QUOTE]Blue Tongue staff in PP treated me great. The only mix up I had was communicating that I was extending my stay. And in a strange twist of fate or irony or whatever. The receptionist happened to be a Filipina working there. LOL.

[QUOTE=RedKilt;1728880]In the final analysis, you are setting out to deceive her into getting what you want. You know she is a prostitute. She knows she is prostituting herself but is trying to deceive herself into thinking she's not.
It's all just a big charade, by both parties, and it ends up with the same result.[/QUOTE]I would like to disagree with you my friend. Treating a working girl like a girlfriend has worked wonder for me. I suggest you try this approach. You may be pleasantly surprised.

[QUOTE=EngineDriver;1728913]Compared to Indonesia, Vietnam, Cambodia and Laos, the Filipinos seem a lot sharper and communicate much better. Have you ever tried getting anything done in Cambodia? It's a fuckin' nightmare just trying to check into your hotel.[/QUOTE]Frankly this is more of a function of familiarity with the english language. Filipinos take english classes all through school and virtually all who graduate high school will be relatively fluent in english whether they realize it or not. The Indochina countries you compare and Indonesia don't have nearly a strong English speaking component to thier society.

Its a matter of language comprehension not brightness. Pinoy are certainly no more bright than Cambodians there I met I feel confident in that.