Thailand Lounge and Chat area

Off topic and chat room area to help clean up the other threads.

My understanding.

US citizens can stay in Thailand for 30 days every six months without a visa, simply with a passport.

So if you want to stay longer, you can get a tourist visa and extend your stay to 60 days today (another 30 days).

So for those that want to stay longer, you fall into 2 categories.

1. Those under 50 years of age.

2. Those over 50 years of age.

Those over 50 can apply for a Visa O and with certain income requirements and / or deposit in bank can stay longer 1 year.

Those under 50 years old, I see only 3 ways to stay.

1. Marry a Thai.

2. Get employed and sponsor from a Thai business.

3. Somehow start a business.

Other than that, an American under 50 has got to go.

Overstaying can cost 500 baht per day.

Would this be accurate?

Yes, very accurate and concise. I just renewed my initial 30 day visa I received at the Bangkok airport upon arrival on Jan 18 for 30 more days. My visa is now good until March 20. The cost was $1900 baht or about $60. One can also apply in advance for a 60 day visa through a Thai embassy or consulate. However, I don't think you save any money this way as there are application costs involved. You only avoid the hassle of going to the immigration office in Bangkok or elsewhere. Unlike in PHP, they don't start the new visa date based on your application date so you get the full 60 days.

My experience extending my visa was quite good and I was in and out of the office in a half hour or so. However, the visa office is located in a warren of government offices and buildings outside of Bangkok proper. It took me a while to get there. For most people, one needs to take the Skyway to the end of the line at MoChit. When I did, I was distressed to find no taxis would take me to the immigration office due to heavy morning traffic. The taxis said it would an hour or two drive! Instead, I opted to take a motorcycle taxi. The trip took about 45 minutes through harrowing traffic, back soi's and bumpy lanes, etc. They do offer you a helmet for what it is worth. One can find similar moto taxis on your return and apparently there is a cheaper bus outside the complex. If you are traveling outside of Bangkok and come across an immigration office, I recommend you do the extension there. All of them, by the way, close for lunch from 12-1.

I also have a friend who is over 50 and annually applies and receives a retirement visa. This gives him a full year in country, whereupon he has to reapply. One has to deposit either a combination of money in a Thai bank or show proof of income, (social security, pensions). These amounts are detailed in the immigration office website.

I will be leaving the country for Cambodia on March 20 to comply with my visa expiration, however, I can renter for another 30 days at any time thereafter.

[QUOTE=TwoTimeTed;1685465]My understanding.

US citizens can stay in Thailand for 30 days every six months without a visa, simply with a passport.

So if you want to stay longer, you can get a tourist visa and extend your stay to 60 days today (another 30 days).

So for those that want to stay longer, you fall into 2 categories.

1. Those under 50 years of age.

2. Those over 50 years of age.

Those over 50 can apply for a Visa O and with certain income requirements and / or deposit in bank can stay longer 1 year.

Those under 50 years old, I see only 3 ways to stay.

1. Marry a Thai.

2. Get employed and sponsor from a Thai business.

3. Somehow start a business.

Other than that, an American under 50 has got to go.

Overstaying can cost 500 baht per day.

Would this be accurate?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=TwoTimeTed;1685465]My understanding.

US citizens can stay in Thailand for 30 days every six months without a visa, simply with a passport.

So if you want to stay longer, you can get a tourist visa and extend your stay to 60 days today (another 30 days).

So for those that want to stay longer, you fall into 2 categories.

1. Those under 50 years of age.

2. Those over 50 years of age.

Those over 50 can apply for a Visa O and with certain income requirements and / or deposit in bank can stay longer 1 year.

Those under 50 years old, I see only 3 ways to stay.

1. Marry a Thai.

2. Get employed and sponsor from a Thai business.

3. Somehow start a business.

Other than that, an American under 50 has got to go.

Overstaying can cost 500 baht per day.

Would this be accurate?[/QUOTE]That is about right, except it is under 55 and over 55.

If you are under 55, aside from the points you mentioned you can get residence in Thailand if you invest a minimum of 10,000,000 Baht, I. E. Buy a luxurious apartment.

If you are over 55, you can apply for a retirement visa. You need to open a local bank account with a Thai Bank and show a balance of at least 800,000 Baht for at least 3 Months. The visa fees are around 10,000 Baht and if you employ a reputable lawyer you can add another 30 - 40,000 Baht legal fees. The retirement visa is valid for one year and extensions require the same bank balance for at least 3 months before renewal.

[QUOTE=BkkMick;1685484]That is about right, except it is under 55 and over 55.

If you are under 55, aside from the points you mentioned you can get residence in Thailand if you invest a minimum of 10,000,000 Baht, I. E. Buy a luxurious apartment.

If you are over 55, you can apply for a retirement visa. You need to open a local bank account with a Thai Bank and show a balance of at least 800,000 Baht for at least 3 Months. The visa fees are around 10,000 Baht and if you employ a reputable lawyer you can add another 30 - 40,000 Baht legal fees. The retirement visa is valid for one year and extensions require the same bank balance for at least 3 months before renewal.[/QUOTE]I guess this website is out of date? [URL]http://www.thaiembassydc.org/?page_id=286[/URL].

That's where I got the age 50. Where did you get age 55?

[QUOTE=TwoTimeTed;1685486]I guess this website is out of date? [URL]http://www.thaiembassydc.org/?page_id=286[/URL].

That's where I got the age 50. Where did you get age 55?[/QUOTE]You are right, it is over 50 for a retirement visa. I got mine through a kind of legal office I found on the web for 25,000 baht. The only requirement is the 800000 baht in your bank account. But I understand the legal office could also help with that, of course for a fee.

Also, if you are not over 50 it is not enough to invest millions of bath in an apartment, you have to create jobs for Thai people.

I wanted to add that I drank a lot of beers while in Thailand and I got buzzed everyday and drunk many days. But my take-away from this is I never had a hangover all vacation.

I even drank the Thai whisky and didn't have a hangover at all.

I drink in the states certain liquors and I can easily have a headache or hangover the next day.

But the beer fairy must have been hanging over my shoulder letting me drink mass quantities without that burden.

My choice of beer were: LEO, Chang, San Miguel Light.

Liquors were: Thai Whisky, Black Label.

I think I got the travel bug. I am already trying to figure out when I can go back to Thailand, although I dread the weather.

I got to thinking, I want to go to the Philippines maybe a week and then over to Thailand. I can go to Thailand by myself, but I don't wish to go to Philippines by myself, too dangerous.

If I go, I want to hit up Angeles City. Most resembles Thailand scene.

Prices seem to be about the same. A little cheaper in Philippines it seems.

[QUOTE=TwoTimeTed;1685734]My choice of beer were: LEO, Chang, San Miguel Light.

Liquors were: Thai Whisky, Black Label.[/QUOTE]Leo is OK, a lot of locals drink it. I don't recall ever NOT having it over ice. :D Chang is very strong and would be Malt Liquor in the states. Personally, my favorite is Beer Lao (when you can find it) or Tiger.

I actually rather like Thai whiskey. But, just to be pedantic, it's not whiskey, despite what they call it. It's actually rum, which may explain why I like it. It's made from sugar cane, not grain.

[QUOTE=TwoTimeTed;1686644]I think I got the travel bug. I am already trying to figure out when I can go back to Thailand, although I dread the weather.

[/QUOTE]I'm packing more carefully for my 2nd trip, everything is going to be lightweight and quick drying. More than half of the stuff I packed on my first trip, though suitable for hot summer weather in the states, didn't last 20 minutes in Thailand.

I visited Thailand during high season Dec to March (winter; LOL).

So what happens in the low season? Obviously, less mongers. However since there are less mongers, do the ladies lower their rates because of the increased competition with the remaining mongers?

Do the Chinese and Japanese still come in droves during this time too?

Even though I'm from a desert in the states, I could barely take the sweaty stickiness of Thailand in Jan-Feb. So must be ten times worse.

On a unrelated subject: The BKK Post doesn't mind offending Thais: [URL]http://www.bangkokpost.com/news/world/487721/thai-men-come-up-short-in-1st-scientific-penis-length-study[/URL].

I'm just curious about what the average cost of a bottle of booze from 7/11 runs? And if 7/11 is the best place to buy such an item?

[QUOTE=Breadman;1693098]I'm just curious about what the average cost of a bottle of booze from 7/11 runs? And if 7/11 is the best place to buy such an item?[/QUOTE]

You may find 'booze' at various prices in Thailand, but you will get better deals at a hypermarket (such as Big C or Tesco-Lotus for instance) than at a 7-Eleven convenience store (where you probably pay about 10-20% more for the same stuff on average).

Bringing your own antibiotics on a hobby trip is the topic of discussion here. I've talked to a few posters who do this religiously. What are the benefits and risks of doing this? It also depends on how easy said antibiotics are to get in your country, in the States you can buy pretty much anything on the internet and have it shipped to your house without needing a doctors prescription. In many cases your buying the same drugs doctors prescribe when you show up on their doorstep with a problem. I've been told Doxycycline and Zithromax are the two main antibiotics that are prescribed and that both can be taken together. If you do self medicate (or at least bring along antibiotics just in case), how do you use them? Before symptoms show or after? And what about the guys who've never considered this approach? Arguments can be that any bug you might catch might become resistant to said antibiotic. Another is that your knocking off the infection before it takes hold.

[URL]http://www.drugs.com/doxycycline.html[/URL]

[URL]http://www.drugs.com/zithromax.html[/URL]

[QUOTE=Breadman;1687566]I'm packing more carefully for my 2nd trip, everything is going to be lightweight and quick drying. More than half of the stuff I packed on my first trip, though suitable for hot summer weather in the states, didn't last 20 minutes in Thailand.[/QUOTE]If you go often enough you get used to the weather. At least somewhat. As long as you get used to walking around in a state of perpetual moistness.

I find it best to wear loose-fitting clothing. Cargo shorts or jeans, depending on where I am, where I'm going, and what the GF thinks is appropriate. And a loose-fitting Hawaiian shirt. Loose T-shirts when touring the countryside. No matter what you bring it won't last 20 minutes. Just try to avoid too much direct sunlight and stay hydrated.

Whats BTS stand for? It's not under abbreviations.

[QUOTE=Dinotrex;1697392]Whats BTS stand for? It's not under abbreviations.[/QUOTE]BTS is the skytrain in Bangkok [URL]http://www.bts.co.th/customer/en/main.aspx[/URL].

[QUOTE=ChristianG;1697466]BTS is the skytrain in Bangkok [URL]http://www.bts.co.th/customer/en/main.aspx[/URL].[/QUOTE]Thanks Christian G. There are hundreds of pages so I'm not about to RTFF to find out what the heck is a Soi? I see like Soi followed by a number. Do those mean anything? I really want to visit either Bangkok or Pattaya, but can't decide which is better. Any Advice for a guy who doesn't really like the bar scenes? Just want to visit the fishbowls and maybe bring a lady back to the hotel for the night. Any help?

A Soi is a side street from a main road.

[QUOTE=Dinotrex;1697607]Thanks Christian G. There are hundreds of pages so I'm not about to RTFF to find out what the heck is a Soi? I see like Soi followed by a number. Do those mean anything? I really want to visit either Bangkok or Pattaya, but can't decide which is better. Any Advice for a guy who doesn't really like the bar scenes? Just want to visit the fishbowls and maybe bring a lady back to the hotel for the night. Any help?[/QUOTE]Soi is name for street. I had the same questions for awhile.

The Sois are numbered north side odd numbered and south side even numbered (BKK).

For the rest of your questions just scroll the pages, not far and you will surely find your answers.

The long and short of it is:

Fishbowl women, plenty, take one to your hotel: go to Nana or Cowboy (in BKK) or in between and you get the over-night prize.

In Pattaya. Its basically just one big bar. Everything and everywhere is a bar. Its the bar scene, but so what. There are girls everywhere waiting for your money!

I went to both places, both are good!

[QUOTE=Dinotrex;1697607]Thanks Christian G. There are hundreds of pages so I'm not about to RTFF to find out what the heck is a Soi? I see like Soi followed by a number. Do those mean anything? I really want to visit either Bangkok or Pattaya, but can't decide which is better. Any Advice for a guy who doesn't really like the bar scenes? Just want to visit the fishbowls and maybe bring a lady back to the hotel for the night. Any help?[/QUOTE]Hey Dino,

Soi means 'street / road'.

So Soi 10,11 . Are like street numbers.

If you choose BKK you can stay in Sukhumvit. Its like the centre point for everything you want to do in BKK. Nana and Cowboy are close. Good, cheap hotels. Connected by the metro. Couple of clubs near by you can check out by just walking around. Turkish baths, BJ parlours everything here.

Haven't been to Pattaya so can't help you there.

Thanks brothers.

[QUOTE=Traceur;1697651]Hey Dino,

Soi means 'street / road'.

So Soi 10,11 . Are like street numbers.

If you choose BKK you can stay in Sukhumvit. Its like the centre point for everything you want to do in BKK. Nana and Cowboy are close. Good, cheap hotels. Connected by the metro. Couple of clubs near by you can check out by just walking around. Turkish baths, BJ parlours everything here.

Haven't been to Pattaya so can't help you there.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Breadman;1696308]<much deleted> If you do self medicate (or at least bring along antibiotics just in case), how do you use them? Before symptoms show or after? And what about the guys who've never considered this approach? Arguments can be that any bug you might catch might become resistant to said antibiotic. Another is that your knocking off the infection before it takes hold.[/QUOTE]Drug resistance comes into play, in part, when people fail to take their prescribed course of antibiotics and fail to actually kill the bug that made them sick. This happen when people stop taking the drug when they start to feel better. If they still have the bacteria, some of the tougher bugs remain behind and will reproduce with their newer resistance. If they spread that to someone else and especially if they don't take a full course of antibiotics, the cycle continues and you have a super bug.

Anyway, if you take a prophylactic treatment to 'prevent' from getting sick, make sure you take a full course of treatment. Some treatments only require a single dose, so that is OK. If, like for doxycycline, you need to take it for several days, don't take it for one day and then think you are fine and don't need to take anymore.

Remember, antibiotics don't work on viruses. Don't think you can have unprotected sex, take a course of antibiotics, and all will be fine. It may kill the bacterial infections such as chlamydia and gonorrhea, but if she had HIV, HPV or HSV, you are out of luck.

Hello to the Forum. I am new to the Forum, just subscribed 2 day but did some reading on it before. I am also brand new to Thailand. Will be coming next week on the 23rd and I started looking for good accommodation. From what I have read, a good area is Sukhumvit. Also I have pretty much read that you kinda get what you pay for in Thailand, so then my concern arises because of the big difference in prices, in places that look very much the same. I would appreciate some advice on this, also from the friendliness of the hotel towards the girls I will bring back to the room. Maybe it would be ok to add that I am not bathing in $$$ so I won't be looking towards luxury, rather something nice, airy, decent with AC and a Safe Box would pretty much do. Many thanks to anyone that would point me into a good direction!!

Here's probably a rookie question that can probably be answered by the seasoned mongers. I'm RTFF and curious about these popular massage places. I. e. Tulip, Annie's and Cowboy. I see they have their own forums so they must be pretty popular. Can someone tell me what happens in them? I see in their respective forums of all the reviews of the girls. But can some explain how the whole process works?

Back in California, If I step into a asian massage parlor, I'd walk into the establishment, pay the entrance fee, the mamasan takes me to a room and a girl comes in to massage me (if I don't know the girls that work there by name then a random girl just comes in) with the possibility of FS (or HJ at minimum). Is this how the process works in BKK?

Also some clarifications of fishbowls please. Are these the same as massage parlors? Or are there popular fishbowl places? The way I imagine a fishbowl establishment is that you'd walk in, see a bunch of WG's woth numbers on their hip and you tell the mamasan or papasan the number of the girl you want. Head upstairs and just get FS? Is this how a fishbowl works?

[QUOTE=Dinotrex;1708877]Tulip, Annie's and Cowboy. I see they have their own forums so they must be pretty popular. Can someone tell me what happens in them?[/QUOTE]Naked backgammon.

No, seriously. It's all very straightforward, regardless of whether you're at an oily (Tulip) or a soapy (Annie's). Full service is assumed. Pricing can be discussed up front. Tipping is optional.

A fishbowl is usually a soapy massage parlor with a fairly large group of woman behind a window. The oily massage places tend to be smaller and focused on straightforward sex rather than playing around in a tub or on an air mattress first, but the end result is similar.

Throughout Thailand there are "legitimate" massage parlors, obviously sex-focused operations, and many in between that are more like what you may have experienced in the US, where you might get a regular massage and then negotiate a happy ending.

Cowboy is a street (Soi), not a massage place. There are no massage places on it, but plenty of bars offering takeout services. The takeout fee is called a "barfine" and is due to the establishment. The fee for services is discussed between you and the provider.

[QUOTE=Traceur;1697651]
If you choose BKK you can stay in Sukhumvit. Its like the centre point for everything you want to do in BKK. Nana and Cowboy are close. Good, cheap hotels. Connected by the metro. Couple of clubs near by you can check out by just walking around. Turkish baths, BJ parlours everything here.
[/QUOTE]I think you need to narrow this down a bit for a newbie.

Sukhumvit is not a CENTRE but a fairly long road. There are various "centres" along it, and Traceur is probably referring to the area between Soi 4 (Nana) and Soi 21 (Asok) as the centre that gets most mentions on ISG Thailand, with the bars, soapies, oilies and BJB's. Soi Cowboy is adjacent to Soi 21 and Soi 23.

Though it looks like a relatively short distance between Soi 4 and Soi 21 on the map, it is actually a decent hike if you don't enjoy a good walk or you sweat a lot, especially when you factor in all the street markets, food stalls and general street hazards like low hanging canopies and electric light wires that impede walking. However, as Traceur says, these areas are linked by the "metro" although not all night.

However, there are other areas that are equally attractive, like Soi 33, one that I used to frequent often, with its "Artist's Bars", and Soi 38 (known as the best street food area in Bkk) near to Soi Thonglor 55 (adjacent to BTS Thonglor station). Further out is Soi Ekkamai 63, another interesting area with some out of the way bars.

Another tip. Soi numbers are odd on one side and even on the other, but they are not necessarily "opposite" each other along Sukhumvit. For example, Soi 55 (Thonglor) is virtually opposite Soi 38, and both intersect with Sukhumvit close to BTS Thonglor.

[QUOTE=RedKilt;1710823]I think you need to narrow this down a bit for a newbie.



However, there are other areas that are equally attractive, like Soi 33, one that I used to frequent often, with its "Artist's Bars", and Soi 38 (known as the best street food area in Bkk) near to Soi Thonglor 55 (adjacent to BTS Thonglor station). Further out is Soi Ekkamai 63, another interesting area with some out of the way bars.

[/QUOTE]Soi 33 has deteriorated over the last five years and is not worth visiting. None, maybe one of the old Artist' bars remain, Livingstones has gone, there is a proliferation of japanese MPs.

Explaore the even numbered streets. Now they are developing.

[QUOTE=Scorchin;1710824]Soi 33 has deteriorated over the last five years and is not worth visiting. None, maybe one of the old Artist' bars remain, Livingstones has gone, there is a proliferation of japanese MPs.

Explaore the even numbered streets. Now they are developing.[/QUOTE]Thanks for the update Scorchin. I last visited Soi 33 in 2013, so updates like yours are helpful.

For Bangkok and Pattaya, what are the worst times for traffic in the morning and afternoon?

Thanks Etaoin! Best response ever. Looking forward to my trip in September.

[QUOTE=Etaoin2003;1710695]Naked backgammon.

No, seriously. It's all very straightforward, regardless of whether you're at an oily (Tulip) or a soapy (Annie's). Full service is assumed. Pricing can be discussed up front. Tipping is optional.

A fishbowl is usually a soapy massage parlor with a fairly large group of woman behind a window. The oily massage places tend to be smaller and focused on straightforward sex rather than playing around in a tub or on an air mattress first, but the end result is similar.

Throughout Thailand there are "legitimate" massage parlors, obviously sex-focused operations, and many in between that are more like what you may have experienced in the US, where you might get a regular massage and then negotiate a happy ending.

Cowboy is a street (Soi), not a massage place. There are no massage places on it, but plenty of bars offering takeout services. The takeout fee is called a "barfine" and is due to the establishment. The fee for services is discussed between you and the provider.[/QUOTE]

So what destination is better? Should one visit both cities or stick to just one? I'm torn, I love Pattaya but Bangkok does have some hot ladies. Bangkok will cost you more in the long run, everything is a bit more expensive. Having most of the gogo's in Pattaya crammed into walking street has forced the drink prices on draft beer to come down, allowing you to stop into many gogo's without dropping more than 80 baht at a time (including a small tip). Bangkok on the other hand will run you double to visit the gogo's. As to barfining the ladies, each city has different gogo's with different prices. You pay for what you get. I've walked out with a gogo girl in both cities for 2600 baht and have been quoted anywhere from 3600 to 4000 short time in gogo's in both cities.

Who has the best gogo's? My vote is for Pattaya by a hair. Its a close call but I do like the ease of having so many so close to each other. Beer bars abound in Pattaya and their barfine is half the price of Bangkok. But in slow season girls will jump at any reasonable offer, especially if they are closer to broke than normal. Things are just at a slower pace down south. But I'd never do a trip to Thailand without throwing in a visit to Bangkok for a third of the trip. Just too much going on to give any one of these cities a pass.

[QUOTE=Breadman;1724295]Who has the best gogo's? My vote is for Pattaya by a hair. [/QUOTE]Which gogo clubs did you like the best in BKK?

(and read your email! LOL).

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;1724300]Which gogo clubs did you like the best in BKK?[/QUOTE]What are Breadman's top go-to go-go's at Nana and Soi Cowboy? Also, any good scoops on any of the oilies or soapies? And what's a "good" LT / ST price in Bangkok versus Pattaya? We understand it depends, but what's a good starting point or guide so we can fend against being fleeced?

I met one babe in Emanuele who is from a affluent family. She was very frequent in Moon bar at Banyan tree (always with family and dressed decent). I saw her 3-4 times during my week stay at Banyan tree. She is one weird lady and I could not figure out her reason. She gives some weird answer that she was working with a foreign company and lost her job so instead of telling this at home she started working in MP. I will not reveal her identity as she begged me to keep this a secret. Are thai girls this crazy that they sell themselves for chanel and prada?

[QUOTE=DwayneJohnson;1724704]Are thai girls this crazy that they sell themselves for chanel and prada?[/QUOTE]Why would that be specific for Thai ladies? I'd say you will find that everywhere. It is all about the money and what that money can buy you.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;1716641]For Bangkok and Pattaya, what are the worst times for traffic in the morning and afternoon?[/QUOTE]Bangkok is bad for traffic all the time. I have been stuck in traffic there at any moment of the day.

Patttaya is different. If the traffic gets stuck, just get out of the bahtbus and walk: distances are small enough there to do that.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1724719]Why would that be specific for Thai ladies? I'd say you will find that everywhere. It is all about the money and what that money can buy you.[/QUOTE]Nope, I have lived in Helsinki, Brussels and Mumbai. I rarely met any working girl who belonged to higher class or affluent families. On the contrary I know quite a few thai girls who has good financial backing from family still involved in MP and gogo.

[QUOTE=KevinSBo;1708388]Hello to the Forum. I am new to the Forum, just subscribed 2 day but did some reading on it before. I am also brand new to Thailand. Will be coming next week on the 23rd and I started looking for good accommodation. [/QUOTE]Where's your report about the end of April trip, so you pay back the forum for answering to all your questions?

[QUOTE=Breadman;1724295]So what destination is better? Should one visit both cities or stick to just one? I'm torn, I love Pattaya but Bangkok does have some hot ladies. Bangkok will cost you more in the long run, everything is a bit more expensive. Having most of the gogo's in Pattaya crammed into walking street has forced the drink prices on draft beer to come down, allowing you to stop into many gogo's without dropping more than 80 baht at a time (including a small tip). Bangkok on the other hand will run you double to visit the gogo's. As to barfining the ladies, each city has different gogo's with different prices. You pay for what you get. I've walked out with a gogo girl in both cities for 2600 baht and have been quoted anywhere from 3600 to 4000 short time in gogo's in both cities.

Who has the best gogo's? My vote is for Pattaya by a hair. Its a close call but I do like the ease of having so many so close to each other. Beer bars abound in Pattaya and their barfine is half the price of Bangkok. But in slow season girls will jump at any reasonable offer, especially if they are closer to broke than normal. Things are just at a slower pace down south. But I'd never do a trip to Thailand without throwing in a visit to Bangkok for a third of the trip. Just too much going on to give any one of these cities a pass.[/QUOTE]Breadman basis of my experience, If one Likes the Soapies and Oilies set up then Bangkok would be the obvious choice.

Pattaya offers the open bar set up which is extremely good, Simon complexes for example, tons to choose from, not mentioning the other bar complexes all over the city. FL scene is also very good in Discos and WS or Beach road. I am not a big fan of gogos hence wouldn't comment.

Its would boil down to an individual preference though both cities offer each type of entertainment.

I am in desperate need of advice from senior mongers (senior with respect to life not just mongering).

It's not just world's most amazing women that attract me to Thailand; I am in love with Thai culture, Thai food, Weather and Thai people. This farang has a thai heart beating inside. Therefore I am seriously considering permanent move to Thailand (also my passport is running out of pages because of Thailand travel).

I am in information technology sector and it will not be very difficult for me to secure a job (then corporate lawyers will take care of obtaining work permit). Only barrier at the moment is pathetic thai payscale. All this comes at sacrificing few thousand Euro each month. I am 30 and career has just begun accelerating upwards. If you were at my position would you give up a fraction of earning for your passion and increasing thai freebie potential (I have pulled up so hot freebie which I would not have thought possible before visiting LOS)? My heart tells something else but my mind says chase the money and honeys will chase you. I'd really appreciate any advice.

[QUOTE=DwayneJohnson;1737959]I am in desperate need of advice from senior mongers (senior with respect to life not just mongering).

It's not just world's most amazing women that attract me to Thailand; I am in love with Thai culture, Thai food, Weather and Thai people. This farang has a thai heart beating inside. Therefore I am seriously considering permanent move to Thailand (also my passport is running out of pages because of Thailand travel).

I am in information technology sector and it will not be very difficult for me to secure a job (then corporate lawyers will take care of obtaining work permit). Only barrier at the moment is pathetic thai payscale. All this comes at sacrificing few thousand Euro each month. I am 30 and career has just begun accelerating upwards. If you were at my position would you give up a fraction of earning for your passion and increasing thai freebie potential (I have pulled up so hot freebie which I would not have thought possible before visiting LOS)? My heart tells something else but my mind says chase the money and honeys will chase you. I'd really appreciate any advice.[/QUOTE]Don't do it. Come for a holiday and have fun. Actually you won't have much luck finding a job unless your company back in EU sends you here. Local Thais can and will do your job much cheaper. On the other hand a complete career change may allow for this move.

I have had many questions about my blog. If you did not know there is a bottom section of the forum where you can start a user blog. Shamefully most are started by accident. Many members have clicked on start a new thread from the main Thailand forum screen by accident and their report needed up in the user blog section. They forgot to click on a specific thread, for example general reports, so there post ended up in the user blog section. This section is number 1 used for user blogs, number 2 used for members who have been caged in their own thread by Jackson and number 3 this section houses the archived reports from the past. Here is the link to my blog for anyone who is interested!

[QUOTE=DwayneJohnson;1737959]I am in desperate need of advice from senior mongers (senior with respect to life not just mongering).

It's not just world's most amazing women that attract me to Thailand; I am in love with Thai culture, Thai food, Weather and Thai people. This farang has a thai heart beating inside. Therefore I am seriously considering permanent move to Thailand (also my passport is running out of pages because of Thailand travel).

I am in information technology sector and it will not be very difficult for me to secure a job (then corporate lawyers will take care of obtaining work permit). Only barrier at the moment is pathetic thai payscale. All this comes at sacrificing few thousand Euro each month. I am 30 and career has just begun accelerating upwards. If you were at my position would you give up a fraction of earning for your passion and increasing thai freebie potential (I have pulled up so hot freebie which I would not have thought possible before visiting LOS)? My heart tells something else but my mind says chase the money and honeys will chase you. I'd really appreciate any advice.[/QUOTE]I second the recommendation below: do not do it unless you can hook up with an international company paying on an international scale. Like you, I first came to Thailand in my 30's and was totally captivated, but trust me, as you get a bit older your perspective will change. So travel there as often as you can and take full advantage of what the country has to offer, but do not fall into the trap of forsaking a Western salery in exchange for what you now believe will be a magical transfer, action in the quality of your life.

GETTING.

[QUOTE=DwayneJohnson;1737959]I am in desperate need of advice from senior mongers (senior with respect to life not just mongering).

It's not just world's most amazing women that attract me to Thailand; I am in love with Thai culture, Thai food, Weather and Thai people. This farang has a thai heart beating inside. Therefore I am seriously considering permanent move to Thailand (also my passport is running out of pages because of Thailand travel).

I am in information technology sector and it will not be very difficult for me to secure a job (then corporate lawyers will take care of obtaining work permit). Only barrier at the moment is pathetic thai payscale. All this comes at sacrificing few thousand Euro each month. I am 30 and career has just begun accelerating upwards. If you were at my position would you give up a fraction of earning for your passion and increasing thai freebie potential (I have pulled up so hot freebie which I would not have thought possible before visiting LOS)? My heart tells something else but my mind says chase the money and honeys will chase you. I'd really appreciate any advice.[/QUOTE]Stop and take a deep breath.

I'm in my Fifties and live in Thailand now part time. Make the money first. The only Farangs I see working in Thailand doing well is the ones working for International western companies.

Even with that I would say if you are on a good carreer path where you are, stay there.

You seem to be to enamoured with the LOS. Would hate to see you crash and burn like so many others.

In the end there is a lot good and a lot bad about Thailand and you should make your money before you come not try to make it after.

Does NHL GameCentre Live work in Thailand?

I hope this doesn't sound like a dumb question, but I would like some perspective from someone who has spent time and Thailand and maybe other parts of Asia, as well. I was recently planning MY FIRST TRIP to the LOS. I've wanted to visit Thailand forever, but always got diverted to Europe because I have long had connections there. After my last trip to Berlin (you can feel free to check my trip reports), my longtime friend in Berlin said "Before you come back here, you should visit Asia, first. ".

Naturally, I've been reading up on Thailand here and on other sites. But, I also checked out some Thai dating sites (I have a background in "shoring") and WOW. The first thing that struck me was that the women look much, much younger than their age. Some women in their 30's I've seen, and even chatted with, look like they are in their teens. Some in their forties look like 20-somethings. So naturally the red flag goes up. Can this be true?

I'm not totally unfamiliar with Asian people. I live in a Dallas suburb where maybe a third of the people are Asian. However, these are mostly Viet Namese and Chinese, and not an attractive bunch. I never noticed any lack of aging or youthfulness. A lot of them do look really old, actually. I had a douchebag boss, who dated a Vietnamese girl (apparently a much younger woman) and he said "Asians all look like they are 16 until they turn 40". I didn't give it much thought, because he was such a douchebag.

So what is the opinion from you guys who have been in Thailand? Am I looking at digitally altered photos? Are these scammers, maybe. Or does youth pervade the Land of Smiles. If so, won't that also mean that mongers may not be engaging with such young girls after all?

Thanks for your feedback.

[QUOTE=Eszpresszo;1807478]I hope this doesn't sound like a dumb question, but I would like some perspective from someone who has spent time and Thailand and maybe other parts of Asia, as well. I was recently planning MY FIRST TRIP to the LOS. I've wanted to visit Thailand forever, but always got diverted to Europe because I have long had connections there. After my last trip to Berlin (you can feel free to check my trip reports), my longtime friend in Berlin said "Before you come back here, you should visit Asia, first. ".

Naturally, I've been reading up on Thailand here and on other sites. But, I also checked out some Thai dating sites (I have a background in "shoring") and WOW. The first thing that struck me was that the women look much, much younger than their age. Some women in their 30's I've seen, and even chatted with, look like they are in their teens. Some in their forties look like 20-somethings. So naturally the red flag goes up. Can this be true?

I'm not totally unfamiliar with Asian people. I live in a Dallas suburb where maybe a third of the people are Asian. However, these are mostly Viet Namese and Chinese, and not an attractive bunch. I never noticed any lack of aging or youthfulness. A lot of them do look really old, actually. I had a douchebag boss, who dated a Vietnamese girl (apparently a much younger woman) and he said "Asians all look like they are 16 until they turn 40". I didn't give it much thought, because he was such a douchebag.

So what is the opinion from you guys who have been in Thailand? Am I looking at digitally altered photos? Are these scammers, maybe. Or does youth pervade the Land of Smiles. If so, won't that also mean that mongers may not be engaging with such young girls after all?

Thanks for your feedback.[/QUOTE]Simple answer is YES, Thai girls can look much younger than they actually are, up to nearly 20 years younger in extreme cases.

I also am not attracted by the majority of Vietnamese and Chinese girls in my home country. Generally they have a different look to Thais. Chinese originating from certain areas often tend to have round puffy face, very slanty eyes and relatively straight bodies at the waist to thigh area. Some gorgeous girl exceptions like movie star Shu Gi (probably spelled wrong) in "The Transporter". Thais can be very ugly also or can be quite cute. Personally I prefer Thai, Japanese and Philippine looks over Chinese and Vietnamese in general. There are always exceptions.

Thai girls that look after themselves, don't go to fat, use the right face creams, etc. , can have almost no face skin wrinkles at age 50. I know one such girl very well. She is 49 now. No face wrinkles. I had plenty of wrinkles at 35. She is slim, petite, small face, perfect nose, and could pass for 30 to 35. Even other Thais that are much younger than her, think they are older. When she was nearly 40 years old, on entering a disco, they would want to check her ID to make sure she was at least 18. That is how little that westeners could tell about her age.

So the simple answer is, Asian girls in particular can hold their looks with extreme longevity in some cases. Sometimes people have thought mother and daughter, were sisters. That is all without any face lift operations. My GF is 40. With makeup on, she could maybe look as young as 30. Without makeup, possibly not looking that young, as needs a bit more flesh on the face perhaps, but her figure is still perfection. No fat, no noticeable sag. Naked still looks damn hot. I am not bored with her looks at all. She is somewhat smaller than her teenage daughter, who is a bigger build. Another Thai girl I have known over 20 years is just about 43. Her body is not perfect but still quite good. Unfortunately her face has deteriorated quite a bit, looking at bit patchy in colouring these days. Who knows why different girls deteriorate at different rates, but her looks are well behind those of my GF even she was very cute 20 years ago. She could not afford the expensive face creams but I have no idea if that is relevant or not. Some Thai girls have let themselves go and deteriorated quite badly at the age of just 25. There is no one pattern for all.

I recall being amazed when in Sweden. Some of the young girls looked extremely stunning, and yet most of the middle aged women seemed to have aged very badly. No idea why this is the case. Perhaps western people get too much sun while Asians know better and try to stay out of the sun. The suns rays have a very severe aging effect. My example young looking girl aged 49 is a chef. Sleeps through most of the day and works from afternoon to night time. Sees very little sun. Uses Lancome to look after her skin. Doesn't eat that much.

Other day I fucked this very cute Coyote dancer about to turn 28. Looked about 19 very easily. No signs of age at all.

Personally I don't care about the age as long as sge is old enough and mature enough. If she looks damn good I don't care if she is older than her look.

[QUOTE=Eszpresszo;1807478]I hope this doesn't sound like a dumb question, but I would like some perspective from someone who has spent time and Thailand and maybe other parts of Asia, as well. I was recently planning MY FIRST TRIP to the LOS. I've wanted to visit Thailand forever, but always got diverted to Europe because I have long had connections there. After my last trip to Berlin (you can feel free to check my trip reports), my longtime friend in Berlin said "Before you come back here, you should visit Asia, first. ".

Naturally, I've been reading up on Thailand here and on other sites. But, I also checked out some Thai dating sites (I have a background in "shoring") and WOW. The first thing that struck me was that the women look much, much younger than their age. Some women in their 30's I've seen, and even chatted with, look like they are in their teens. Some in their forties look like 20-somethings. So naturally the red flag goes up. Can this be true?

I'm not totally unfamiliar with Asian people. I live in a Dallas suburb where maybe a third of the people are Asian. However, these are mostly Viet Namese and Chinese, and not an attractive bunch. I never noticed any lack of aging or youthfulness. A lot of them do look really old, actually. I had a douchebag boss, who dated a Vietnamese girl (apparently a much younger woman) and he said "Asians all look like they are 16 until they turn 40". I didn't give it much thought, because he was such a douchebag.

So what is the opinion from you guys who have been in Thailand? Am I looking at digitally altered photos? Are these scammers, maybe. Or does youth pervade the Land of Smiles. If so, won't that also mean that mongers may not be engaging with such young girls after all?

Thanks for your feedback.[/QUOTE]Of course I don't know at which photo's you have been looking and it might very well be possible that the photos have been "shopped" or (more likely) that they have been taken a few (or even several few) years ago. You never can be certain.

However, it is so that Asian women keep a youthful appearance for a long time. My Thai GFs are now 40 and 41 but will have no trouble to pass as women in their early 30's and that is even without wearing make-up!

The only way to make certain with the dating site girls is to ask them to do a cam session. Then you immediately know if they are "real" or not, but I'm quite sure the odds will be in your favor. At least that has been my experience until now.

Thanks Wolvenvacht and Syzygies for your input and experiences. I am sure this will benefit other readers curious about Thai women. I had a bit of skepticism that these women could look so much younger than their years. I am from the school of thought that rationalizes "if it seems too good to be true, it probably isn't true". But sometimes there is an exception.
As to Wolvenvacht's suggestion that I cam them to see what they really look like - some women I have connected with are already wanting to the same. They want to see what I really look like. It seems to work both ways. Its so easy to steal other's photos off the internet.

Now I have to wonder, why do so many of these women online post photos at the beach, where they are wearing t-shirts and shorts in the water? Do Thais often wear clothes when wading into the ocean (as they do in Mexico and Oklahoma)?

[QUOTE=Eszpresszo;1807934]Now I have to wonder, why do so many of these women online post photos at the beach, where they are wearing t-shirts and shorts in the water? Do Thais often wear clothes when wading into the ocean (as they do in Mexico and Oklahoma)?[/QUOTE]A very cultural thing. Thais are in love with white skin. Tanned skin means farmers and lower-class workers who work outside.

Actually the very first thing my previous Thai GF did when she met me, was apologizing for her tanned skin and I had a lot of explaining to do why I really love her tanned skin.

So on the beach and in the water, wearing a t-shirt is quite a normal thing to do for them. Can you believe I never managed my Thai GFs to wear a bikini?

So I did the next best thing and bought them some sexy underwear. At least they wear that in the bedroom. And it made my reputation of being "jai dee" ("good heart") as it appeared that none of her previous (Thai) BFs ever bought her underwear. The fact that I really went into a lingerie store and bought underwear for hem still has her amazed to no end.

Just to say that one can use the difference in culture to your benefit as well.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1808014]A very cultural thing. Thais are in love with white skin. Tanned skin means farmers and lower-class workers who work outside.

Actually the very first thing my previous Thai GF did when she met me, was apologizing for her tanned skin and I had a lot of explaining to do why I really love her tanned skin.


Just to say that one can use the difference in culture to your benefit as well.[/QUOTE]Thanks for your insight. I am in contact with a few girls already. If we meet up, maybe I should take her to the mall, stroll past a lingerie shop and ask if she wants to look around.

I wondered if modesty was an issue in Thai culture. Another ex-pat monger on his blog commented that the "nice girls" good girl type don't show so much flesh, don't wear tops with bare shoulders, and probably never have a tattoo. That was his take on how to recognize a "bad girl" slutty girl. Not that he was being judgmental or anything, just giving hints. Any truth to that?

Yes it does sound odd that they are fixated on light skin. Another poster here commented recently on how he picked up an Isaan girl in a club and she apologized for her dark skin. Personally, I like the caramel skin.

[QUOTE=Eszpresszo;1808431]I wondered if modesty was an issue in Thai culture. Another ex-pat monger on his blog commented that the "nice girls" good girl type don't show so much flesh, don't wear tops with bare shoulders, and probably never have a tattoo. That was his take on how to recognize a "bad girl" slutty girl. Not that he was being judgmental or anything, just giving hints. Any truth to that?
[/QUOTE]I think calling tattoos the "tramp stamp" or thinking girls with them are low class is a rather old fashioned attitude just not up with the times.

Seriously, are there any hot girls out there with zero tattoos? I have met Thai girls with probably no tattoos, and one ex GF definitely none, but this tended to be the very most prim and proper type that you would have little chance to get it on with.

Us old generation have to be bit more broad minded with the younger generation. I have found it hard to find really hot girls that do not smoke as well. Yes some but a minority. If the tattoos and piercings are not too advanced, I can take it. Face full of shrapnel, no.

Tattooed definitely does not equal "slutty". Tattoos are very unfortunately quite the modern fashion.

Skin tone doesn't bother me for girls within reason. Whitest white and blackest black may look weird for me. Thais do not have that. Black girls are O.K. for me. What I do find very ugly, are the dark skin guys in the Arab quarter of Bangkok that have black 3 day plus beard growths as well, and sometimes fairly severe body odour. Guess I am just not used to it. I am probably fucking girls just as dark skinned but smell lovely and not hairy of course.

[QUOTE=Eszpresszo;1808431]Thanks for your insight. I am in contact with a few girls already. If we meet up, maybe I should take her to the mall, stroll past a lingerie shop and ask if she wants to look around.
[/QUOTE]A good idea to bring her to the shop and have her fit the stuff you want to give her. It is difficult to gauge their sizes, even when you have seen them in the nude So I asked the GF whom I wanted to buy some hot lingerie about her sizes. "Bra 34 be and bikini size 'medium'" (with "bikini" she means panties) I would have sized her panties to be "small", but I could have beeen wrong so I Bought her some "medium" sized strings and see-through lacy bottoms. Sure enough they were too big as her size is indeed "small". So why did she say "medium"? Because she thought that men like bigger "popo" (bum) and that I would be disappointed by her being only "small". No darling, I like a big bum but only on Africans. My Asian ladies are nicer in smaller packages.

In the end it turned out very good! I pulled out my sewing kit (never leave home without one!) and on the spot made her panties smaller. She never saw a man do that and my score increased by a good count of bonus points. Yes, always be prepared to make the best of any situation. It goes without saying that my good score translated later that night into a hot session of sex.

[QUOTE=Eszpresszo;1808431]
I wondered if modesty was an issue in Thai culture. Another ex-pat monger on his blog commented that the "nice girls" good girl type don't show so much flesh, don't wear tops with bare shoulders, and probably never have a tattoo. That was his take on how to recognize a "bad girl" slutty girl. Not that he was being judgmental or anything, just giving hints. Any truth to that?
[/QUOTE]It is not an absolute. My GF is admin-staff and assistant nurse in a government hospital and yet has two tattoos: one on her breast whch shows when she wears a lower-cut dress and one above her pussy. She's 40, never married and still lives at home with her parents, taking care of them. WHen she goes out she wears conservative dress, no bare shoulders, no shorty shorts, no skimpy mini-skirts and for swimming a one-piece swimsuit. Even agogo girls who 10 minutes ago were dancing on the stage in the nude in front of many men, will change into jeans and a demure t-shirt when they come with you to your hotel. Less than 5 minutes in your room and she'll be naked again and you will be fucking like rabbits, but "public face" has been saved.

In the same vein, after having taken a shower, she'll come in the room totally wrapped in a towel and might even get under the sheets still wearing the towel. If asked why, their answer almost always is "I'm shy" after which she grabs your one-eyed trouser snake and give you a BBBJ while you finger her pussy. "Shy"? Indeed!

[QUOTE=Eszpresszo;1808431]

Yes it does sound odd that they are fixated on light skin. Another poster here commented recently on how he picked up an Isaan girl in a club and she apologized for her dark skin. Personally, I like the caramel skin.[/QUOTE]"Honey coloured" is their name for tanned skin. I think it describes it very well.

Thanks again to all you guys for your comments and feedback. I think these topics are important subjects to discuss for someone preparing to visit the LOS, if one is to take full advantage of Thai girls, beyond the usual P4 P scenarios. It seems that mongering in Thailand is easier than shooting fish in a barrel, and that is about as far as guys get. As mentioned before, I had been researching Thai girls on another monger friendly website, and read an article about meeting and dating Thai girls via internet dating sites and I checked them out for the heck of it. (I have a background of "shoring" girls in Europe back in the 90's using pen and paper, and airmail stamps. Dang the internet makes things easy). To my surprise I got a lot of Thai women reaching out to me. The dominant chat tool in Thailand appears to be LINE, since they launched a Thai language interface. More than once, I ended up having three chicks trying to chat me up at once. Not that I am putting the mongering experience aside. But, some legitimate dating sure seems a lot easier than I would have thought for a 58 year old divorced farang with an 11-year old son (product of the much younger Hungarian ex-wife I bagged during a trip in Eastern Europe).

No surprise, its mature women (40 and up) who seem to be most eager, as well as SINGLE MOMS that seem to be interested in me. But, I actually had a 22-year old student, who looked stunning in her photos (in a nice elegant party gown) ping me for a chat today. What would she want in me? I'm 36 years her senior. But hey -I read about the "sideline girls" - the university girls who often do P4 P to get some rent money or play money. However, I didn't broach that topic with her just yet. The rest of the girls seemed to excited about having a guy just 20 years their senior chat them up.

A few of these have let me cam them and they just seem elated by the experience, though they can barely speak. Most others have listed web cam as "no go" on their profiles. Apparently some of the knuckle draggers out there have pissed off the Thai girls by asking for cam shows, or showing off their junk, etc. Ruining it for the rest of us. Yet a few have insisted on camming me first. I assume to see what I really look like. I had to go out buy a new webcam *(ex-wife didn't like the one I had, assuming the worst, and made it disappear) after assuming web cams were a no-no.

A few women have indicated they are widows and complained on their profiles that Thai society looks poorly on widows and that they are looking specifically to date a "farang". A few others have indicated that they specifically want to marry a Westerner and have a "mixed-race" baby. Any prestige to that? I had long heard about the mistreated "Amerasian" kids left over from the Nam-era troops. Apparently, Eurasian kids might be a point of pride now. BUT, most promimently in the girls profiles is their suspicion and warnings. Most of them say they are honest, and not a prostitute and assert they don't want to a girlfriend just for some guy on holiday. It seems I have to tread carefully here. But, I made myself clear in my profile that I am not out to get married again having just gottne out of a marriage. It has not scared too many of them off.

That said, can anyone comment on their experience using internet sites and how they panned out? Did you root out many P4 P opportunities? Any experience with these "sideline girls"? Any comments on social attitudes regarding widows, singles moms dating older men, (or older farang men), half-breed children. Discuss!

[QUOTE=Eszpresszo;1808520]That said, can anyone comment on their experience using internet sites and how they panned out? Did you root out many P4 P opportunities? Any experience with these "sideline girls"? Any comments on social attitudes regarding widows, singles moms dating older men, (or older farang men), half-breed children. Discuss![/QUOTE]I can only speak from my own experience but both my previous and present Thai GF I have found through dating websites, "Date in Asia" and "Thai Friendly" to be exact.

My first GF was 35 when I met her and my present GF is now 40. I'm 56 myself.

Indeed Thai society considers a woman that is 35+ or so to be past her "sell by" date and she will have difficulties to find a Thai husband. The same goes for single mothers, widows or divorced women. They are somehow "damaged goods" in Thai traditional culture.

Hence their general interest in farang men, by preference somewhat older than they are. Age is held in good regard in Asian culture, although really young girls (early 20's or so) will not quickly go with a grandfatherly type. An age difference of 10 to 20 years however is generally not a big problem.

Of course we can only guess about their real motives for dating an older farang. A form of social security? Do they really believe elder farang are more loving and caring? Young guys are perhaps more "butterfly" and nice for a short while before they disappear for even greener pasture and an older man is more likely to remain in a stable relationship.

I have never been able to work out their reasons and actually it does not really matter. "This is Thailand" after all and you better go with the flow. Anything else will be stress.

One last advice: don't rely too much on their profiles in the dating sites and chat applications. My present GF wrote she was not looking to be a "holiday GF" but litterally pulled off my clothes at the second date and would stroke my dick while I was sleeping so when I woke up I was balls deep inside her wet pussy and a few more days later she told me "I want to eat your sperm" and started to suck me off until I finished inside her mouth and she swallowed all. But on her profile she seemed all "prim and proper" and the archetype of a "good girl".

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1808651] An age difference of 10 to 20 years however is generally not a big problem.[/QUOTE]When I first moved here 16 years ago, that type of age spread was not really an issue. As Thailand continues to develop, it is becoming more and more so. With gals who already have kids it is far less of an issue as they realize their marketability is less. But gals in their early to mid-30's not without kids are looking for guys with means around their age.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1807615]
I recall being amazed when in Sweden. Some of the young girls looked extremely stunning, and yet most of the middle aged women seemed to have aged very badly. No idea why this is the case. Perhaps western people get too much sun while Asians know better and try to stay out of the sun.[/QUOTE]It is not all about the sun, the sun does not make you fat. It is in the genes and lifestyle. Brazilians get also a lot of sun but still they look good because taking better care of themselves. And I am now talking about the whole body, not just face.

In Russia the contrast is very bad. Young girls are one of the best looking babes in the world but after 40 they age very badly. Same in Finland mostly. Actually this is the case in all over Europe. I don't know any country where the women look generally nice when 40-50 or more.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1808471]. In the end it turned out very good! I pulled out my sewing kit (never leave home without one!) and on the spot made her panties smaller. She never saw a man do that and my score increased by a good count of bonus points. . [ / UOTE].

W, you really need to open up a tailoring shop in BKK catering to the lingerie market. :)

[QUOTE=Eszpresszo;1808520]A few of these have let me cam them and they just seem elated by the experience, though they can barely speak. Most others have listed web cam as "no go" on their profiles. Apparently some of the knuckle draggers out there have pissed off the Thai girls by asking for cam shows, or showing off their junk, etc. Ruining it for the rest of us. Yet a few have insisted on camming me first. I assume to see what I really look like. I had to go out buy a new webcam *(ex-wife didn't like the one I had, assuming the worst, and made it disappear) after assuming web cams were a no-no.

A few women have indicated they are widows and complained on their profiles that Thai society looks poorly on widows and that they are looking specifically to date a "farang". A few others have indicated that they specifically want to marry a Westerner and have a "mixed-race" baby. Any prestige to that? I had long heard about the mistreated "Amerasian" kids left over from the Nam-era troops. Apparently, Eurasian kids might be a point of pride now. BUT, most promimently in the girls profiles is their suspicion and warnings. Most of them say they are honest, and not a prostitute and assert they don't want to a girlfriend just for some guy on holiday. It seems I have to tread carefully here. But, I made myself clear in my profile that I am not out to get married again having just gottne out of a marriage. It has not scared too many of them off.

That said, can anyone comment on their experience using internet sites and how they panned out? Did you root out many P4 P opportunities? Any experience with these "sideline girls"? Any comments on social attitudes regarding widows, singles moms dating older men, (or older farang men), half-breed children. Discuss![/QUOTE]I met several nice "mature" ladies on the Internet. I was looking for ladies from mid-30's to late-40's. I chatted with a crapload, and met several. All were nice. In fact, it got to the point, like the old Lovin' Spoonful song says, "Did you ever have to make up your mind? Pick up on one and leave the other (s) behind?

The biggest single gripe the ladies had was the bazillions of farang cretins trolling the sites simply looking for cam sex, to show off their dick, and look for free pussy. Major turn off for them. Some certainly enjoyed cam sex, but only after you had gotten to know them quite well.

Yes, "older" ladies, widows, single moms, etc. , have a difficult time finding a Thai husband. All Thai men seem to want to marry a young virgin, or some such. They don't seem to be exactly Don Juan in bed, either. One lady, who had been divorced for quite some time, confessed, after a rousing time in the sack, that she had never had an orgasm with her husband. He just did his business and rolled over. The point is that many farang have a reputation for being more "considerate" in the sack.

Farang men also have much less of a problem raising other peoples' kids. I've seen that not only in Thailand but in Mexico, and other places as well. Many have told me that a farang / gringo makes a better husband for this reason.

Amerasian kids may have had problems in hard-line communist places like VN (not sure if that's still true there today), but certainly not in Thailand. I think everybody here has had some girl ask about having his baby in order to get a blue-eyed, big-nosed kid. He'll be the next pop sensation, or something like that. My point is that many famous Thais have a farang parent. Having mixed-race kids with a Thai certainly doesn't appear to be an issue.

The age gap is interesting. All of the women I met wanted an "older" mate, usually because an older man is more experienced and can "teach" the lady something (for lack of a better expression). However, rarely did that age gap extend beyond 15 years, or so. I noted that girls from more modest origins (read poor Isaan girls) tended to be OK with a larger age gap. Middle-class ladies with their own careers tended to want smaller gaps. The younger the girl, the smaller the gap. As Goat said, these days girls in their early 30's tend to prefer guys no older than about 40.

[QUOTE=Eszpresszo;1807934]
Now I have to wonder, why do so many of these women online post photos at the beach, where they are wearing t-shirts and shorts in the water? Do Thais often wear clothes when wading into the ocean (as they do in Mexico and Oklahoma)?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Eszpresszo;1808431]Thanks for your insight. I am in contact with a few girls already. If we meet up, maybe I should take her to the mall, stroll past a lingerie shop and ask if she wants to look around.

I wondered if modesty was an issue in Thai culture. Another ex-pat monger on his blog commented that the "nice girls" good girl type don't show so much flesh, don't wear tops with bare shoulders, and probably never have a tattoo. That was his take on how to recognize a "bad girl" slutty girl. Not that he was being judgmental or anything, just giving hints. Any truth to that?

Yes it does sound odd that they are fixated on light skin. Another poster here commented recently on how he picked up an Isaan girl in a club and she apologized for her dark skin. Personally, I like the caramel skin.[/QUOTE]As others have said, the Thais are in love with white skin. You'll note that many Thai contestants in international beauty contests aren't all that pretty (IMHO) but have very fair skin. My GF is more "honey" colored, or, in Mexico she would be morena clara. But she always jokes about her being black and me being so very white. And I don't tan much, but when she goes into the sun she turns 2 or 3 shades darker instantly. She's not too happy about that.

However, cultural modesty plays a big part. Go to a beach in Myanmar, for instance. All of the local ladies are covered from head to knees. Not only do they want no sun tan, but prancing around in a bikini is just not done in some cultures.

In my case, my GF considers tattoos to look "dirty. " She is death on them. I have met others who feel much the same. One lady I used to know believed that the prototypical bar girl had heels, a tattoo and a cigarette. That is changing, but many ladies still hold those feelings. While it's no longer universal, a tat still screams BG.

Yes, "good girls" tend to dress modestly. As Mr. S said, it's a public face thing. My GF won't wear jeans because it's the standard uniform for off-duty bar girls. She doesn't show much flesh when we go out, and probably wouldn't if I asked. She actually has a stupendous set of knockers which, sadly, she tends to hide. Of course, this is changing, especially with the young girls. They all want to dress like the models in the fashion mags, and most of those models dress like sluts. So, often you'll see young girls dressed exactly like hookers. But the more "mature" ones still tend to dress conservatively.

[QUOTE=Phordphan;1808911]I met several nice "mature" ladies on the Internet. I was looking for ladies from mid-30's to late-40's. I chatted with a crapload, and met several. All were nice. In fact, it got to the point, like the old Lovin' Spoonful song says, "Did you ever have to make up your mind? Pick up on one and leave the other (s) behind?

The biggest single gripe the ladies had was the bazillions of farang cretins trolling the sites simply looking for cam sex, to show off their dick, and look for free pussy. Major turn off for them. Some certainly enjoyed cam sex, but only after you had gotten to know them quite well.

[/QUOTE]YES! I'm not only old enough to remember that song, but its exactly what is happening now. I upgraded to the premium member plan at ThaiFriendly and its been like they are coming at me, hitting me with chats. Women whose profiles I've never looked at. They want to get on LINE immediately and start chatting. At one point today, I had two on LINE, another on SKYPE and another chatting at me on the TF website, all while trying to respond to messages from others who were offline. It was stressful to be honest, but they were the ones initiating the chat. It was like a feeding frenzy of goldfish in a Koi pond (really, that was the image that actually came into my head.) Heck, I might be disabling my account at ThaiFriendly, less than a week after paying for a full, premium membership. One of them, is already talking like she is my next wife! All I did is tell her that she looked real cute in her photos, and she looked like a teenager (which was true). Others are very aggressive, even if you have no interest in them. A few open ladyboys and "ladies" who look more like ladyboys are also hitting on me online. However I just found out I can make myself invisible to the open ladyboys (FYI. Thai Friendly includes "Ladyboy" as legit gender.) Not being judgmental, but they are not my cup of tea. Real women have a uterus.

I have realized that I would need months in Thailand to personally sort through the ones I have met already. In fact, enough to kill the monger tour program, unless some are really P4 P. After all, pursuing women is time consuming. Unless the woman charge you for their time (and then its not long enough). Erstwhile mongers with limited patience and energy might want to stick with P4 P girls. However, you experience will be different, I am certain. As Bob Luman sang back in 1972, "Lonely women. Make good lovers. There all at the mercy of a smooth tallkin', good lookin' maaaann. ".

Yes, I think one must tread carefully regarding webcam chats with girls you have just met. Some of the mature babes have been very aggressive about wanting to see me on cam very quickly. However, I inquired about a webchat with a few other girls I met, and they just plain stopped communicating after I mentioned it. One of them had said, "I meet so many CRAZY guys online. From everywhere". She didn't give details of what she meant, but I think I know what she meant. After I asked if she if she wanted a web chat, she asked "Why are you really on ThaiFriendly? And she hasn't communicated with me since.

But hey, thanks for all of the great responses to my questions. It can be useful to others, and unlike mongering info concerning working girls, their prices and hookup locations, this info isn't going to be dated or "stale" in a year. Social attitudes change slowly. The internet has just let us exploit the most desirable situations even quicker. Anyone else have an opinion?

So many guys have different tastes in Thai women, its hard to judge just exactly who they might go for. Here's a photo with 6 cute Thai girls in bikini's, from left to right we'll number them 1 thru 6. You can only pick one, no rating the girls from best to worse. If you ran across all of these girls in a gogo bar and could only chose one, which one?

My answer would be number 5.

[QUOTE=Breadman;1810484]So many guys have different tastes in Thai women, its hard to judge just exactly who they might go for. Here's a photo with 6 cute Thai girls in bikini's, from left to right we'll number them 1 thru 6. You can only pick one, no rating the girls from best to worse. If you ran across all of these girls in a gogo bar and could only chose one, which one?

My answer would be number 5.[/QUOTE]I would pick Number 4.

[QUOTE=Breadman;1810484]If you ran across all of these girls in a gogo bar and could only chose one, which one? My answer would be number 5.[/QUOTE]I would buy # 4 a Tequila and see what happens. I think she is cute.

[QUOTE=Breadman;1810484]So many guys have different tastes in Thai women, its hard to judge just exactly who they might go for. Here's a photo with 6 cute Thai girls in bikini's, from left to right we'll number them 1 thru 6. You can only pick one, no rating the girls from best to worse. If you ran across all of these girls in a gogo bar and could only chose one, which one?

My answer would be number 5.[/QUOTE]Only have attraction to #3. Maybe. When it comes to Asian women, you already know I'm a hard, hard, hard judge. No attraction whatsoever to any of the rest and would not consider them at all. It's the face that's always the deal killer for me. I don't like most of their faces. But when I get the face with the body look out! But until then. Next! Hahaha!

#3 would be my choice by a narrow margin. #4 and #5 would also be getting drinks from me and the one I take home will be the one who is the most fun.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;1810516]#3 would be my choice by a narrow margin. #4 and #5 would also be getting drinks from me and the one I take home will be the one who is the most fun.[/QUOTE]Sorry, the owner of the gogo kicked you out for not keeping to the rules, you'd have to rub one out yourself.

[QUOTE=Breadman;1810484]So many guys have different tastes in Thai women, its hard to judge just exactly who they might go for. Here's a photo with 6 cute Thai girls in bikini's, from left to right we'll number them 1 thru 6. You can only pick one, no rating the girls from best to worse. If you ran across all of these girls in a gogo bar and could only chose one, which one?

My answer would be number 5.[/QUOTE]I will take number 4. Just how I like them.

Number 6 for me. LOL.

[QUOTE=Breadman;1810484]So many guys have different tastes in Thai women, its hard to judge just exactly who they might go for. Here's a photo with 6 cute Thai girls in bikini's, from left to right we'll number them 1 thru 6. You can only pick one, no rating the girls from best to worse. If you ran across all of these girls in a gogo bar and could only chose one, which one?

My answer would be number 5.[/QUOTE]Number 3 counting from the left. I'll cheat and give a second choice: 4 although a little long in the trunk department for my tastes. I just hope this isn't some sort of trick where they are all well-disguised lady boys or something!

No 3. I am a sucker for PYTs. As LA Guy pointed out hope these are not LBs or Post ops. Guess will need to reduce my drinking in next trip. 555

[QUOTE=Breadman;1810484]So many guys have different tastes in Thai women, its hard to judge just exactly who they might go for. Here's a photo with 6 cute Thai girls in bikini's, from left to right we'll number them 1 thru 6. You can only pick one, no rating the girls from best to worse. If you ran across all of these girls in a gogo bar and could only chose one, which one?

My answer would be number 5.[/QUOTE]I thought this was a trick question because #1 looks like a ladyboy. But Wikimedia says it's from a Singapore photo shoot in 2009.

So, #3 for me.

[QUOTE=Phordphan;1810623]I thought this was a trick question because #1 looks like a ladyboy. But Wikimedia says it's from a Singapore photo shoot in 2009.

So, #3 for me.[/QUOTE]Number 2 looks busty but number 3 is the cutest.

RL.

#5 for me please, hope the carpet matches the drapes 555!!

[QUOTE=Breadman;1810484] If you ran across all of these girls in a gogo bar and could only chose one, which one?

[/QUOTE]#4 - Cute as hell.

[QUOTE=Breadman;1810484]SIf you ran across all of these girls in a gogo bar and could only chose one, which one?[/QUOTE]Nobody seems to choose no. 2. I will choose her and she will be so grateful I did that she'll spend the whole night with me and only charges me the ST price. The next day we will hang out together and we will repeat a night of hot lovemaking, but this time it is free.

This one is for the PI lovers as well as the general group. From left to right. #2 is my wish.
RL

[QUOTE=RobertLong;1811010]This one is for the PI lovers as well as the general group. From left to right. #2 is my wish.
RL[/QUOTE]Problem is the photo is really too small to get an up close look of the girls. Can you upload a larger photo of this group?

[QUOTE=Breadman;1811022]Problem is the photo is really too small to get an up close look of the girls. Can you upload a larger photo of this group?[/QUOTE]Still small - but. . . . .

Ikksman

[QUOTE=Ikksman;1811032]Still small - but. . . . .

Ikksman[/QUOTE]I would not choose any of those women. Number 6 comes close, but the face is a fail, and that's where I have the most difficulty with Asian women. I don't like most of their faces. But when I see a face that I like combined with the body then boom! Or rather "boom boom" LOL!

[QUOTE=Ikksman;1811032]Still small - but. . . . .

Ikksman[/QUOTE]#2 from the left.

#5 from left again for me.

I hope this looks better and bigger.

No 3 for the Thaigirlpic and no 2 for Pinaypic.

[QUOTE=TheCane;1810493]Only have attraction to #3. Maybe. When it comes to Asian women, you already know I'm a hard, hard, hard judge. No attraction whatsoever to any of the rest and would not consider them at all. It's the face that's always the deal killer for me. I don't like most of their faces. But when I get the face with the body look out! But until then. Next! Hahaha![/QUOTE]Geez! How can you deny any of these women? You obviously spend more time alone in LOS talking like that about any of these beauties. The way the 7 and above cuties get snatched up by expats in Patt, only thing that's left are just that-used up leftovers.

[QUOTE=NakedGunz;1811085]Geez! How can you deny any of these women? You obviously spend more time alone in LOS talking like that about any of these beauties. The way the 7 and above cuties get snatched up by expats in Patt, only thing that's left are just that-used up leftovers.[/QUOTE]Different strokes for different folks dude. That's what makes the world go round. You like what you like, and I like what I like. And, I actually have had quite a bit of company in LOS. Company wanting to "boom boom". I'm just picky like that wink, wink!

[QUOTE=NakedGunz;1811085] The way the 7 and above cuties ....[/QUOTE]Just where did you get 7 in any of those two photo's? Both photo's only have 6 girls. Looks like NG here is standing outside the gogo's pleading to get in with his lazy eye screaming "I want number 7".

No 4 is to my liking. Body not visible but the smile has got my attention.

[QUOTE=NakedGunz;1811085]The way the 7 and above cuties get snatched up by expats in Patt, only thing that's left are just that-used up leftovers.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Breadman;1811094]Just where did you get 7 in any of those two photo's? [/QUOTE]He meant a rating of 7+.

[QUOTE=RobertLong;1811074]I hope this looks better and bigger.[/QUOTE]I got to say #6.

[QUOTE=RobertLong;1811074]I hope this looks better and bigger.[/QUOTE]I had no trouble picking no. 3 from the Thais picture. But on this one am I allowed to say "none of the above"? I suspect if they posed differently I might find one or more of them attractive, but from the picture I can't really pick any as particularly desirable.

[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1811136]I had no trouble picking no. 3 from the Thais picture. But on this one am I allowed to say "none of the above"? I suspect if they posed differently I might find one or more of them attractive, but from the picture I can't really pick any as particularly desirable.[/QUOTE]My sentiments exactly. Although, I don't think different poses would change anything as far as I am concerned.

Rather than let us guess, which one we'd prefer, Robert would better tell us where we can find these cuties in real life. I have no problem taking them all. One after the other, of course.

[QUOTE=Wonderer;1811156]Rather than let us guess, which one we'd prefer, Robert would better tell us where we can find these cuties in real life. I have no problem taking them all. One after the other, of course.[/QUOTE]Sabang Island is off the north coast of Sumatra. These carnivores patrol the beaches looking for bules to devour. Proceed at your own risk, and take lots of money.

RL.

[QUOTE=RobertLong;1811589]Sabang Island is off the north coast of Sumatra. These carnivores patrol the beaches looking for bules to devour. Proceed at your own risk, and take lots of money.
RL.[/QUOTE]I wonder if the voters would still pick the same girls today, as they are probably now in their 30's with 3 or 4 kids?

Went to Baccara last night on Soi Cowboy in Bangkok and noticed something I had yet to see during my stay in Thailand so far. East Asians were being waived in with a welcome while everybody else was required to purchase a drink before going in. This included Caucasians. Anybody who did not appear to be East Asian was being asked to step to the side and purchase a drink. I saw the same thing going down when I departed about an hour later (two Caucasians being asked to purchase drinks before being permitted to enter). There were two Thai women with menus who were taking orders. Place your order, and then you have your selection provided to you. I just don't get the erratic door / face control policies at some of these places. I went to this same Baccarra a week ago and was permitted to walk right in. I have noticed that the Baccara on Soi Cowboy caters heavily to Japanese clients, and the place was super duper crowded last night with Japanese men. Could barely move, both downstairs and upstairs. Maybe that had something to do with it? Still, I found the whole scene at the door to be weird.

While exploring around Bangkok, I stumbled upon the above-referenced restaurant and just had to snap a few photos! Has anybody ever eaten at this place? The combination doesn't sound very appetizing LOL!

[URL]http://www.pda.or.th/restaurant/home.html[/URL]

Prior to my trip to Thailand, I had read quite a bit on ISG about racist door policies at some of the go-go clubs. With that knowledge in hand, I was very curious to find out how I would be treated. Overall it was good, but here is a summary of some memorable things that happened.

One night I decided to hit all of the Rainbow clubs at the Nana Entertainment Plaza (NEP). I was going to make it a "Rainbow night". For me, it was to be sort of an experiment since I heard that there were racist door policies at some of those clubs. So, I wanted to see what would happen, and if it was really true. Let me tell you. It's really true. I had no problems getting into Rainbow 1 and 3. It was Rainbow 2 and 4 where there were issues. Rainbow 4 is now actually called are&be, and when I tried to enter the club they told me "members only", which is exactly the kind of thing I read about on ISG. It was "racist code" and nothing more than that!

They told me members only, and that I could only come in if I paid a "membership fee" of 1,200 baht! There were no other customers attempting to enter the club, so I couldn't see if they were telling them the same thing, but I knew it was all bullshit. I didn't want to pay it at first, but I decided to go ahead with the full "experiment". I found it ironic that I was having problems getting into a place called the are&be (Rhythm & Blues) Club!

So I pay the money, and I get in there and the guy puts a card down on my table (photo attached). I call it my honorary "East Asian / Caucasian Card" because that's the kind of customers I saw in there. Once in, things were fine. The waiters / waitresses and girls were friendly, but I have to say there was nothing special about the place at all. Nothing! Also, I found most of the girls to be unattractive! It was nowhere near the best I'd seen in Bangkok. I picked the card up off of my table and put it in my wallet with the intention of filing this report. One drink came with my honorary East Asian / Caucasian Card. I ordered a beer, finished it, and experiment over decided to leave. As I was leaving, I saw the guys out front give a big welcome to Rainbow 4! It was to east Asians who didn't pay shit to get in! The staff inside are&be (Rainbow 4) were cool. It was the door men who were the assholes. Well, I see my honorary card has no expiration date, so I guess I'm east Asian / Caucasian for life!

At Rainbow 2, I couldn't even get in no matter what I did. I got the same "members only" bullshit, and they didn't "offer" any payment of a "membership fee" as a means of gaining access to the club. I asked why I couldn't go in and said was it the color of my skin. They got quiet and one looked down for a second. I asked again pointing to my skin, which is a well-done brown like Obama. Then the one guy doing all the talking nodded silently. I said, "Fuck it! No problem!" There was no need for me to go inside their club when there are so, so many choices in Bangkok. Choices better than theirs. Besides, I didn't want to get too belligerent and have 25 short motherfuckers show up out of nowhere and take me down LOL!

A couple of similar occurrences went down in Pattaya. One was on Walking Street at a club called Lighthouse. I was told "members only", and that I could gain admission by paying 300 baht in advance. By this time during my trip, my "experiments" over, I told the guy to go fuck himself and walked away. At What's Up on Soi 15 in Pattaya, I was denied admission altogether with no "option" of purchasing a "membership". I went to a place right across the street where their doormen had witnessed what had just happened. They were extra courteous and welcomed me in. When I left, again extra courtesy and giving me back slaps knowing that I had been treated with great disrespect across the street.

But here's the pisser about What's Up. So, I take Soi 15 back up to Walking Street and there are two barkers or touts there for What's Up. They have signs and they stop me and encourage me to go check the place out, obviously not knowing what happened before! Unbelievable! I explained to the two guys how I had been denied admission and was told "members only" and all that bullshit. They understood, and then stood there looking a bit dumbfounded and incredulous. I looked back down Soi 15 towards What's Up, put two birds (middle fingers) up into the air and yelled, "Yeah, What's Up? What's Up? Fuck you!" I did it again, and then me and the two guys had a laugh about it. And then I moved on. Evidently, What's Up's racist door policy hasn't been disseminated all the down to the rank and file working the streets.

I have to say that this was an aspect of mongering in Thailand (along with the lady boy flavor) that was something I really did not like. Both are relative small parts of the scene, but both are also still large enough that you're going to notice them, and maybe even be impacted by them, whether you want to be or not. The sons of bitches telling me "members only" at the door are lucky if they earn even 10% of what I do on an annual basis. I don't say that to be arrogant, but it really has to stick in your craw when you show up well-behaved with your pockets loaded with cash (and freely spending it) and somebody who doesn't know you from the man in the moon is going to tell you that you're not good enough to enter their club because of the color of your skin! I should cut the door guys a little bit of a break since I'm sure they're only doing what the boss man told them to do, but still. The only reason I can think of for why I was not admitted to a handful of clubs is perhaps because they thought I was Indian. Now strangely enough, I had three Thai girls totally unrelated to each other in any way ask me if I was Malaysian! So something about me was making Thais think that maybe I was Malaysian. WTF?

At the end of the day, what I was was a decent customer with plenty of money to spend who deserved to be treated with respect. That's what I was. I've never been denied admission to any mongering establishment in Brazil. I've never been denied admission to any mongering establishment in Germany (although I didn't like the vibe of Golden Time and have never returned). In fact, the only country where I have been denied admission is Thailand! In this respect, Thailand earns a solid grade of an "F". Now, I won't be going to Thailand to monger again. And it's not because of having been denied admission to a handful of clubs. Like I said, the choice in Thailand is so huge that these clubs make up only a tiny percentage of the whole. My decision not to return is more because I just don't like Asian women enough to be traveling way off to Thailand repeatedly to monger. I'm glad I went once, but I know I'm much more attracted to the Latinas and the white girls who fuck a monger the way I like it. So, no returns to Thailand for me. Not specifically to monger anyway.

For the record, I would like to state that no club in Phuket denied me, and I patronized many. That's another plus for Phuket in my books, which I liked better than Bangkok or Pattaya anyway. I would also like to state that unlike in Pattaya, the Lighthouse in Bangkok on Soi Cowboy welcomed me with open arms. Also, apologies for the text editor changing the commonly accepted abbreviation for rhythm & blues to are&be. Geez!

[QUOTE=TheCane;1816063]Prior to my trip to Thailand, I had read quite a bit on ISG about racist door policies at some of the go-go clubs. With that knowledge in hand, I was very curious to find out how I would be treated. Overall it was good, but here is a summary of some memorable things that happened.

One night I decided to hit all of the Rainbow clubs at the Nana Entertainment Plaza (NEP). I was going to make it a "Rainbow night". For me, it was to be sort of an experiment since I heard that there were racist door policies at some of those clubs. So, I wanted to see what would happen, and if it was really true. Let me tell you. It's really true. I had no problems getting into Rainbow 1 and 3. It was Rainbow 2 and 4 where there were issues. Rainbow 4 is now actually called are&be, and when I tried to enter the club they told me "members only", which is exactly the kind of thing I read about on ISG. It was "racist code" and nothing more than that!

They told me members only, and that I could only come in if I paid a "membership fee" of 1,200 baht! There were no other customers attempting to enter the club, so I couldn't see if they were telling them the same thing, but I knew it was all bullshit. I didn't want to pay it at first, but I decided to go ahead with the full "experiment". I found it ironic that I was having problems getting into a place called the are&be (Rhythm & Blues) Club!

So I pay the money, and I get in there and the guy puts a card down on my table (photo attached). I call it my honorary "East Asian / Caucasian Card" because that's the kind of customers I saw in there. Once in, things were fine. The waiters / waitresses and girls were friendly, but I have to say there was nothing special about the place at all. Nothing! Also, I found most of the girls to be unattractive! It was nowhere near the best I'd seen in Bangkok. I picked the card up off of my table and put it in my wallet with the intention of filing this report. One drink came with my honorary East Asian / Caucasian Card. I ordered a beer, finished it, and experiment over decided to leave. As I was leaving, I saw the guys out front give a big welcome to Rainbow 4! It was to east Asians who didn't pay shit to get in! The staff inside are&be (Rainbow 4) were cool. It was the door men who were the assholes. Well, I see my honorary card has no expiration date, so I guess I'm east Asian / Caucasian for life!

At Rainbow 2, I couldn't even get in no matter what I did. I got the same "members only" bullshit, and they didn't "offer" any payment of a "membership fee" as a means of gaining access to the club. I asked why I couldn't go in and said was it the color of my skin. They got quiet and one looked down for a second. I asked again pointing to my skin, which is a well-done brown like Obama. Then the one guy doing all the talking nodded silently. I said, "Fuck it! No problem!" There was no need for me to go inside their club when there are so, so many choices in Bangkok. Choices better than theirs. Besides, I didn't want to get too belligerent and have 25 short motherfuckers show up out of nowhere and take me down LOL!

A couple of similar occurrences went down in Pattaya. One was on Walking Street at a club called Lighthouse. I was told "members only", and that I could gain admission by paying 300 baht in advance. By this time during my trip, my "experiments" over, I told the guy to go fuck himself and walked away. At What's Up on Soi 15 in Pattaya, I was denied admission altogether with no "option" of purchasing a "membership". I went to a place right across the street where their doormen had witnessed what had just happened. They were extra courteous and welcomed me in. When I left, again extra courtesy and giving me back slaps knowing that I had been treated with great disrespect across the street.

But here's the pisser about What's Up. So, I take Soi 15 back up to Walking Street and there are two barkers or touts there for What's Up. They have signs and they stop me and encourage me to go check the place out, obviously not knowing what happened before! Unbelievable! I explained to the two guys how I had been denied admission and was told "members only" and all that bullshit. They understood, and then stood there looking a bit dumbfounded and incredulous. I looked back down Soi 15 towards What's Up, put two birds (middle fingers) up into the air and yelled, "Yeah, What's Up? What's Up? Fuck you!" I did it again, and then me and the two guys had a laugh about it. And then I moved on. Evidently, What's Up's racist door policy hasn't been disseminated all the down to the rank and file working the streets.

I have to say that this was an aspect of mongering in Thailand (along with the lady boy flavor) that was something I really did not like. Both are relative small parts of the scene, but both are also still large enough that you're going to notice them, and maybe even be impacted by them, whether you want to be or not. The sons of bitches telling me "members only" at the door are lucky if they earn even 10% of what I do on an annual basis. I don't say that to be arrogant, but it really has to stick in your craw when you show up well-behaved with your pockets loaded with cash (and freely spending it) and somebody who doesn't know you from the man in the moon is going to tell you that you're not good enough to enter their club because of the color of your skin! I should cut the door guys a little bit of a break since I'm sure they're only doing what the boss man told them to do, but still. The only reason I can think of for why I was not admitted to a handful of clubs is perhaps because they thought I was Indian. Now strangely enough, I had three Thai girls totally unrelated to each other in any way ask me if I was Malaysian! So something about me was making Thais think that maybe I was Malaysian. WTF?

At the end of the day, what I was was a decent customer with plenty of money to spend who deserved to be treated with respect. That's what I was. I've never been denied admission to any mongering establishment in Brazil. I've never been denied admission to any mongering establishment in Germany (although I didn't like the vibe of Golden Time and have never returned). In fact, the only country where I have been denied admission is Thailand! In this respect, Thailand earns a solid grade of an "F". Now, I won't be going to Thailand to monger again. And it's not because of having been denied admission to a handful of clubs. Like I said, the choice in Thailand is so huge that these clubs make up only a tiny percentage of the whole. My decision not to return is more because I just don't like Asian women enough to be traveling way off to Thailand repeatedly to monger. I'm glad I went once, but I know I'm much more attracted to the Latinas and the white girls who fuck a monger the way I like it. So, no returns to Thailand for me. Not specifically to monger anyway.

For the record, I would like to state that no club in Phuket denied me, and I patronized many. That's another plus for Phuket in my books, which I liked better than Bangkok or Pattaya anyway. I would also like to state that unlike in Pattaya, the Lighthouse in Bangkok on Soi Cowboy welcomed me with open arms. Also, apologies for the text editor changing the commonly accepted abbreviation for rhythm & blues to are&be. Geez![/QUOTE]Ever hobby in Malaysia?

[QUOTE=Breadman;1816418]Ever hobby in Malaysia?[/QUOTE]No, but I see it like this right here. A real Malaysian would be able to spot another real Malaysian with ease. So with my cover blown immediately upon stepping off of the plane in Kuala Lumpur, I would most likely be treated like an Indian and required to pay extra for admission, or be denied admission altogether all over again! Better to just stick with Thailand! They seemed to like Malaysians OK LOL! At least better than our Indian brothers in mongering.

No wonder we couldn't find Rainbow 4. We walked around NEP thinking we were blind. Surprised you went in but good for you to experiment.

Which club across from What's Up let you in, Sapphire? Too bad cause What's Up has a pretty good lineup. I see why you dislike Pattaya. Stuff like that would leave a sour taste in my mouth too.

Oddly you can get in to the allegedly racist Goldentime in Germany but not some Thailand gogo clubs.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;1816471]No wonder we couldn't find Rainbow 4. We walked around NEP thinking we were blind. Surprised you went in but good for you to experiment.

Which club across from What's Up let you in, Sapphire? Too bad cause What's Up has a pretty good lineup. I see why you dislike Pattaya. Stuff like that would leave a sour taste in my mouth too.

Oddly you can get in to the allegedly racist Goldentime in Germany but not some Thailand gogo clubs.[/QUOTE]I'm glad I went in because I got that card, which I did not expect. It helped add credibility to my field report. Another reason why I put the card in my wallet is because I felt embarrassed. I looked around and nobody else had a "member card". So why the hell did I need one? I could see a waiter watching intently as I put the card away.

And yes, I did visit Sapphire on another night, but the name of the club I went to on the night in question is Babydolls. Here's a link: [URL]http://www.babydollspattaya.com/Babydolls-Location.html[/URL]. Interestingly, Babydolls is co-managed by a fellow American who I spent a few minutes chatting with.

For the record, I liked Pattaya better than Bangkok. And Phuket was even better than Pattaya as far as I'm concerned.

[QUOTE=TheCane;1816036]While exploring around Bangkok, I stumbled upon the above-referenced restaurant and just had to snap a few photos! Has anybody ever eaten at this place? The combination doesn't sound very appetizing LOL!

[URL]http://www.pda.or.th/restaurant/home.html[/URL][/QUOTE]Yes, I have eaten there many times, in fact every time I visited Bangkok, I stopped there. The food is excellent and it is a family oriented restaurant, I. E. You will see Thai families dining there. One time, I went in with a working girl and they gave us a table relatively secluded, which was ok by me. The staff were friendly and courteous.

[QUOTE=TheCane;1816036]While exploring around Bangkok, I stumbled upon the above-referenced restaurant and just had to snap a few photos! Has anybody ever eaten at this place? The combination doesn't sound very appetizing LOL!

[URL]http://www.pda.or.th/restaurant/home.html[/URL][/QUOTE]The founder of this chain of restaurants wanted "condoms" to become as easy to buy and be as acceptable as "cabbages" on the local market.

It is actually run by "Population and Community Development Association" a Thai NGO (see [URL]http://www.cabbagesandcondoms.com/about_background.php[/URL]). One of its first actions was in promoting family planning in urban and rural areas of Thailand, where knowledge of and access to such services were scarce.

[QUOTE=TheCane;1816480]I'm glad I went in because I got that card, which I did not expect. It helped add credibility to my field report. Another reason why I put the card in my wallet is because I felt embarrassed. I looked around and nobody else had a "member card". So why the hell did I need one? I could see a waiter watching intently as I put the card away.

And yes, I did visit Sapphire on another night, but the name of the club I went to on the night in question is Babydolls. Here's a link: [URL]http://www.babydollspattaya.com/Babydolls-Location.html[/URL]. Interestingly, Babydolls is co-managed by a fellow American who I spent a few minutes chatting with.

For the record, I liked Pattaya better than Bangkok. And Phuket was even better than Pattaya as far as I'm concerned.[/QUOTE]Don't feel too alone, there are Japanese-only clubs in BKK that we honkeys can't get into, either. In fact, the last time I walked down Soi Thaniya at night, with loads of very pretty women sitting along the street, one and only one even acknowledged my existence. I was literally the invisible man. And I was once refused entry into a western-owned bar / restaurant (Angkor What!) in Siem Reap because they didn't allow Cambodian women after 7:00 pm. Go figure.

Thais are very color conscious, as you have figured out. They may have thought you were Indian, but I suspect they figured you were African. There are lots of issues with Africans in lower Suk. Now you and I can tell the difference between a black American and a black African, but I doubt many Thais can. It's certainly interesting being in a country where what we consider blatant discrimination is tolerated without a murmur.

[QUOTE=TheCane;1816036]While exploring around Bangkok, I stumbled upon the above-referenced restaurant and just had to snap a few photos! Has anybody ever eaten at this place? The combination doesn't sound very appetizing LOL!

[URL]http://www.pda.or.th/restaurant/home.html[/URL][/QUOTE]There's also a Cabbages and Condoms in Pattaya, as part of the "Bees and Birds" resort, at the beach end of a soi of Pratamnak road. Really good food (both Thai and International) and a great beach view at night. It seemed popular with both tourists and Thai's (probably also tourists) when I was there with a Thai GF.

There's a romantic feel to eating at the terrace, so my GF wanted me to fuck her again when we were back at the hotel.

Which I did, bareback as usual!

[QUOTE=TheCane;1816036]While exploring around Bangkok, I stumbled upon the above-referenced restaurant and just had to snap a few photos! Has anybody ever eaten at this place? The combination doesn't sound very appetizing LOL!

[URL]http://www.pda.or.th/restaurant/home.html[/URL][/QUOTE]That's because you have no clue to the origin of this place. It is a decent enough restaurant started by a Thai who founded this place to raise awareness about AIDS and other STDs and promote the use of condoms among the SWs and gogo girls that you come to fuck here. So have some respect even if you don't agree with the name and find it funny.

[QUOTE=Duniawala;1816680]That's because you have no clue to the origin of this place. It is a decent enough restaurant started by a Thai who founded this place to raise awareness about AIDS and other STDs and promote the use of condoms among the SWs and gogo girls that you come to fuck here. So have some respect even if you don't agree with the name and find it funny.[/QUOTE]Dude,

Take a powder. I was only joking around and had actually done a little back research on my own, which you had no clue of yourself. Lighten up and stop taking yourself so seriously. I'm a world traveler who understands the importance of treating other peoples and cultures with respect.

[QUOTE=Phordphan;1816639]Thais are very color conscious, as you have figured out. They may have thought you were Indian, but I suspect they figured you were African. There are lots of issues with Africans in lower Suk. Now you and I can tell the difference between a black American and a black African, but I doubt many Thais can. It's certainly interesting being in a country where what we consider blatant discrimination is tolerated without a murmur.[/QUOTE]I have traveled extensively around the world, and as I explained to another member by PM, the one thing that people rarely ever, ever, ever assume I am is African! I just told you how several Thais thought I was Malaysian! I've been mistaken by Jordanians to be Jordanian. People have thought I was either Indian or Emirati from the United Arab Emirates! I've been mistaken for being Colombian or Dominican because I speak Spanish. Walking down the street in Brazil I'm easily Brazilian, that is until I open my mouth. I've even been mistaken for being native American! People often feel a need to "place" other people, which allows an opening for their ignorance to take over.

Bottom line, overseas the only two things I know I will never be mistaken for are east Asian or Caucasian, thus no admission to Rainbow 2 or What's Up! When it comes to mongering and admission to clubs, I say judge not by the color of one's skin, but buy the contents of one's wallet! And you may assume nothing is out of character until proven otherwise. If 5 cheap bastards show up and sit down and sip out of one drink, then the club has a problem with them and not me. The fact that their color may be the same or similar to mine does not extend their behaviors to me. End the ignorance! Maybe the next time I'll show my fucking passport? Oh yeah, there won't be a next time! I'll be sticking to the chicks with the tits, curves, and ass LOL!

[QUOTE=Duniawala;1816680] founded this place to raise awareness about AIDS and other STDs and promote the use of condoms among the SWs and gogo girls that you come to fuck here. [/QUOTE]Thanks for the info. I'm going to support this restaurant because of this.

[QUOTE=Duniawala;1816680]That's because you have no clue to the origin of this place. It is a decent enough restaurant started by a Thai who founded this place to raise awareness about AIDS and other STDs and promote the use of condoms among the SWs and gogo girls that you come to fuck here. So have some respect even if you don't agree with the name and find it funny.[/QUOTE]I agree with The Cane. The name does sound damn funny. No need to be so serious. I have never been interested enough to visit this place. So I have no opinion other than its an ugly name, even if intended to achieve publicity for something. Cabbages is equally weird. A really boring food item.

I have been to this restaurant exactly 2 times. My first and last time. It is not that it is a bad restaurant. The food is wholesome and prepared with quality ingredients, but it is what I would consider Thai Farang cuisine. For example the curries are too rich (sugar). I prefer more authentic Thai restaurants where Thais mainly eat. You will find many really good ones the further you get away from Sukhumvit. BKK is a great foodie destination. It is worth checking out.

[QUOTE=TheCane;1816732]When it comes to mongering and admission to clubs, I say judge not by the color of one's skin, but buy the contents of one's wallet! And you may assume nothing is out of character until proven otherwise. If 5 cheap bastards show up and sit down and sip out of one drink, then the club has a problem with them and not me. The fact that their color may be the same or similar to mine does not extend their behaviors to me. End the ignorance! Maybe the next time I'll show my fucking passport? Oh yeah, there won't be a next time! I'll be sticking to the chicks with the tits, curves, and ass LOL![/QUOTE]I agree, but this is Asia, not America or the West in general. The same rules don't apply. Outward appearances count for a whole lot more. What you or I say doesn't amount to jack. Knowledge is the most expensive of commodities, and often the Asians don't have the time or inclination to get more of it. So, yes, if a particular group exhibits bad behavior everybody who looks like members of said group get tarred with the same brush. If the club has had bad experiences with Indians, or maybe a belligerent black US sailor, or whatever, then it's possible that anybody who resembles a member of said group gets the cold shoulder. It sucks. That's one reason why I usually wear jeans or khakis, and a collared shirt, when in BKK (shorts sometimes, with a special dispensation from the GF), no backwards baseball cap, regular showers, cologne, etc. I don't want to be lumped in with the obnoxious farang kee nok. It's why my GF rarely wears jeans because that's the uniform of the off-duty bar girl. Silly? Yes. But it's reality.

My personal theory as to why some clubs don't make more of an effort to simply weed out the bad apples is that few clubs have anything resembling a bouncer. In the West, there is usually some guy (or several) who appear to use all of their salaries on steroids. They are happy to show a cheap or belligerent customer the fastest way out of the club. Thais, however, tend to hate confrontation. I've seen wait staff dither and dither over how to remove an obnoxious guest when, in the west, he would have been unceremoniously given the boot. So, it's probably a whole lot easier to simply deny entrance to "the usual suspects" than to let them in, and then toss the bad ones. We've probably all been on the receiving end of this ignorance at one time or another, and it can be frustrating, at least to Westerners. But we're guests in a society where the terms "racism" and "discrimination" don't carry any weight.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;1816850]I have been to this restaurant exactly 2 times. My first and last time. It is not that it is a bad restaurant. The food is wholesome and prepared with quality ingredients, but it is what I would consider Thai Farang cuisine. For example the curries are too rich (sugar). I prefer more authentic Thai restaurants where Thais mainly eat. You will find many really good ones the further you get away from Sukhumvit. BKK is a great foodie destination. It is worth checking out.[/QUOTE]My first time in BKK I tried mightily to find this place. I apparently had the wrong soi number. I looked all over. I finally asked a tuk-tuk driver where to find Cabbages and Condoms. He didn't speak English, and just looked at me oddly and said "Condoms?" LOL.

I agree with you. I never eat Thai food in a place with a bunch of Farang. Many Farang = bad food. The only partial exception I've found is Lemongrass on Suk soi 24.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1816840]I agree with The Cane. The name does sound damn funny. No need to be so serious. I have never been interested enough to visit this place. So I have no opinion other than its an ugly name, even if intended to achieve publicity for something. Cabbages is equally weird. A really boring food item.[/QUOTE]FWIW, the reason for including "cabbages" in the name is the founder wanted condoms to be as widespread as cabbages so he chose that name. Has nothing to do with cabbage as a food item at the restaurant.

Okay guys, since you got on the theme of restaurants for Farangs. What is an interesting restaurant for WESTERN food that would be a good place to take a DATE? Yes, I know Thai food is delicious. Its one of the reasons I've long wanted to visit Thailand. But. To add a bit of culinary variety and to give a Thai girl a chance to do something out of the routine, what could be some good options that a Thai lady, girl or WG (if that be the case) would appreciate? I've been chatting with a lot of chicks I met on ThaiFriendly and I got a shitload of contacts. But, when you ask them where they like to go, or what they like to do, they draw a blank. I sense money is a big factor here, so they could be easy to impress if you took them to some place they'd never been to.

Thanks for your feedback.

[QUOTE=Eszpresszo;1817398]Okay guys, since you got on the theme of restaurants for Farangs. What is an interesting restaurant for WESTERN food that would be a good place to take a DATE? Yes, I know Thai food is delicious. Its one of the reasons I've long wanted to visit Thailand. But. To add a bit of culinary variety and to give a Thai girl a chance to do something out of the routine, what could be some good options that a Thai lady, girl or WG (if that be the case) would appreciate? I've been chatting with a lot of chicks I met on ThaiFriendly and I got a shitload of contacts. But, when you ask them where they like to go, or what they like to do, they draw a blank. I sense money is a big factor here, so they could be easy to impress if you took them to some place they'd never been to.

Thanks for your feedback.[/QUOTE]Most upmarket shopping malls have a lot of "foreign" restaurants. Siam Paragon, Terminal 21 and the very new Quartier (in front of Emporium) are good examples. I brought my GF to the latter and she was duly impressed.

Another nice place to go to is "Asiatique" on the riverside. Very romantic in the evening.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;1816850]I have been to this restaurant exactly 2 times. My first and last time. It is not that it is a bad restaurant. The food is wholesome and prepared with quality ingredients, but it is what I would consider Thai Farang cuisine. For example the curries are too rich (sugar). I prefer more authentic Thai restaurants where Thais mainly eat. You will find many really good ones the further you get away from Sukhumvit. BKK is a great foodie destination. It is worth checking out.[/QUOTE]Why does someone go there? Is it like supporting a cause, or is it recommended by someone? I would find eating at Love Scene less embarrassing than going to something called "Cabbages and Condoms". From the name you can already guess the food will be something weird, perhaps. Anyway at least its a gimmick.

Putting a lot of sugar and MSG in food is something the real Thai people do. I don't see that as less authentic, unless you are saying its a lot more than normal. Just its not for me. Do Farangs like savoury food to be sweater than Thais like it? I am doubtful. I see girls spooning the sugar on their Laat Naa noodles. I like less sugar than Thais, less salt, less chili, and yet I don't like really bland Farang food. I like to get strong flavours from the real food not so much from the additives. Mushrooms (western type), onions, fish, oysters, a good quality steak, etc. I don't eat bland starch like rice, noodles, potatoes, etc. Useless calories. I have greatly reduced ice in my drinks unless its just water, because I don't want the flavour too diluted.

I took Thais to Shakariki Japanese and they liked it a lot. Good quality and fast service. I used to have a good regular Italian but the chef left. French food is too rich for Thais to understand and appreciate. Not a good idea. I have a pub for good western food when I feel like a roast lamb dinner. Thais don't eat lamb because they have never tried it. It's rare I have cause to get a western meal with other Farangs or with Thais. That is why a superior sports pub is fine for me.

Thais like to eat Pizza Thai style. The Thai Pizzas are terrible to me and include ketchup and Mayo. Yuck. Hard to understand what Thais are doing in Mackas, Kentucky Fried, and Pizza Hut. Is this a contributor to all the young fat girls or is it the sticky rice? Is it the sweet ice shakes with super sticky sweet donuts? I don't know they eat that stuff. I think the western fast food influence on Thais is a pretty bad one.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1817625]Why does someone go there? Is it like supporting a cause, or is it recommended by someone? I would find eating at Love Scene less embarrassing than going to something called "Cabbages and Condoms". From the name you can already guess the food will be something weird, perhaps. Anyway at least its a gimmick.

Putting a lot of sugar and MSG in food is something the real Thai people do. I don't see that as less authentic, unless you are saying its a lot more than normal. Just its not for me. Do Farangs like savoury food to be sweater than Thais like it? I am doubtful. I see girls spooning the sugar on their Laat Naa noodles. I like less sugar than Thais, less salt, less chili, and yet I don't like really bland Farang food. I like to get strong flavours from the real food not so much from the additives. Mushrooms (western type), onions, fish, oysters, a good quality steak, etc. I don't eat bland starch like rice, noodles, potatoes, etc. Useless calories. I have greatly reduced ice in my drinks unless its just water, because I don't want the flavour too diluted.

I took Thais to Shakariki Japanese and they liked it a lot. Good quality and fast service. I used to have a good regular Italian but the chef left. French food is too rich for Thais to understand and appreciate. Not a good idea. I have a pub for good western food when I feel like a roast lamb dinner. Thais don't eat lamb because they have never tried it. It's rare I have cause to get a western meal with other Farangs or with Thais. That is why a superior sports pub is fine for me.

Thais like to eat Pizza Thai style. The Thai Pizzas are terrible to me and include ketchup and Mayo. Yuck. Hard to understand what Thais are doing in Mackas, Kentucky Fried, and Pizza Hut. Is this a contributor to all the young fat girls or is it the sticky rice? Is it the sweet ice shakes with super sticky sweet donuts? I don't know they eat that stuff. I think the western fast food influence on Thais is a pretty bad one.[/QUOTE]I have eaten there a few times and found the food reasonably good, and the atmosphere relaxing. I know a few others who also like the place.

The founder of the restaurant is a very interesting guy, and it is also satisfying to know the money earned by the restaurant goes to a good cause. Of course anything it earns out of my pocket pales in contrast to the grant the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation gave to the NGO headed by the restaurant's founder. His Wikipedia bio is interesting as are many of the links at the end of the bio. [URL]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mechai_Viravaidya[/URL], including a link to his TED talk, [URL]http://www.ted.com/talks/mechai_viravaidya_how_mr_condom_made_thailand_a_better_place[/URL], and a short article about his efforts and the restaurant in the New York Times, [URL]http://thelede.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/05/29/cabbages-and-condoms-a-winning-idea/?_r=0.[/URL].

[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1817078]FWIW, the reason for including "cabbages" in the name is the founder wanted condoms to be as widespread as cabbages so he chose that name. Has nothing to do with cabbage as a food item at the restaurant.[/QUOTE]I think cabbage comes from the old say that when you are a kid they tell you babes are born by finding them under a cabbage.

Condom is birth control and cabbage is birth.

[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1817654]I have eaten there a few times and found the food reasonably good, and the atmosphere relaxing. I know a few others who also like the place.

The founder of the restaurant is a very interesting guy, and it is also satisfying to know the money earned by the restaurant goes to a good cause. Of course anything it earns out of my pocket pales in contrast to the grant the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation gave to the NGO headed by the restaurant's founder. His Wikipedia bio is interesting as are many of the links at the end of the bio. [URL]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mechai_Viravaidya[/URL], including a link to his TED talk, [URL]http://www.ted.com/talks/mechai_viravaidya_how_mr_condom_made_thailand_a_better_place[/URL], and a short article about his efforts and the restaurant in the New York Times, [URL]http://thelede.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/05/29/cabbages-and-condoms-a-winning-idea/?_r=0.[/URL].[/QUOTE]It's too bad that in the midst of his many good works he did a grave disservice to Thailand if not all of Asia by continually promoting the misconception that HIV transmission is just as likely to occur through ordinary vaginal or oral sex as it is through anal sex. I saw him doing it in that linked video and his authorized biographer does the same thing in the only book on his life sold in the Cabbages and Condoms restaurant, "From Condoms to Cabbages".

Somewhere soon after page 300 or so of his authorized biography it cites statistics on how many Thai homosexuals and I. V. drug users were found to be HIV-positive before his pro-condom campaign got underway. But after his major condom campaign has had a few years to take hold, statistics that differentiate between heterosexuals and homosexuals is dropped and no longer mentioned. Only the overly general terms "sex workers" or "prostitutes" are used. Consequently, when it cites how the rate of HIV infection dropped after his widespread pro-condom campaign had been in effect for a while, the reader is supposed to think the rate of HIV infection had once or ever been high among female sex workers and female prostitutes who engaged primarily in vaginal or oral sex instead of understanding they are probably ONLY talking about statistically significant numbers of male sex workers and male prostitutes who far, far more frequently engaged in anal sex.

Whenever the water is muddied in that way and there is no distinction made between typically "hetero" sex like vaginal or oral sex and typically "homo" sex like anal sex, it is clear evidence of fear-mongering sleight-of-hand at its finest, IMO.

Here is an interesting sub link in one of the links provided above:

Conversations / Mechai Viravaidya; Brash and Unabashed, Mr. Condom Takes on Sex and Death in Thailand.

By PHILIP SHENON.

Published: December 20,1992.

[URL]http://www.nytimes.com/1992/12/20/weekinreview/conversations-mechai-viravaidya-brash-unabashed-mr-condom-takes-sex-death.html[/URL]

[QUOTE]Criticized by some Thais as a brash, fear-mongering self-promoter who has crippled the nation's tourism industry, Mr. Mechai is likely to be remembered in the annals of AIDS prevention as one of the few Asian leaders who tried to educate the public early about the scourge that now seems likely to devastate the continent. Asia Looks the Other Way[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Eszpresszo;1817398]Okay guys, since you got on the theme of restaurants for Farangs. What is an interesting restaurant for WESTERN food that would be a good place to take a DATE? Yes, I know Thai food is delicious. Its one of the reasons I've long wanted to visit Thailand. But. To add a bit of culinary variety and to give a Thai girl a chance to do something out of the routine, what could be some good options that a Thai lady, girl or WG (if that be the case) would appreciate? I've been chatting with a lot of chicks I met on ThaiFriendly and I got a shitload of contacts. But, when you ask them where they like to go, or what they like to do, they draw a blank. I sense money is a big factor here, so they could be easy to impress if you took them to some place they'd never been to.

Thanks for your feedback.[/QUOTE]I've eaten at the place at the top of State Tower and the food is good, way overpriced, service ranging from good to slipshod, but the view and ambience are incredible.

The Italian place on the corner of Suk and soi 19 used to be some of the best I've had outside of Italy, but that may have changed. The prices (partially due to a bad exchange rate) began to exceed anything in LA.

My GF likes Indus, an Indian place near Suk and soi 26. Good service, decent Indian food.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1817730]It's too bad that in the midst of his many good works he did a grave disservice to Thailand if not all of Asia by continually promoting the misconception that HIV transmission is just as likely to occur through ordinary vaginal or oral sex as it is through anal sex. I saw him doing it in that linked video and his authorized biographer does the same thing in the only book on his life sold in the Cabbages and Condoms restaurant, "From Condoms to Cabbages".

Somewhere soon after page 300 or so of his authorized biography it cites statistics on how many Thai homosexuals and I. V. drug users were found to be HIV-positive before his pro-condom campaign got underway. But after his major condom campaign has had a few years to take hold, statistics that differentiate between heterosexuals and homosexuals is dropped and no longer mentioned. Only the overly general terms "sex workers" or "prostitutes" are used. Consequently, when it cites how the rate of HIV infection dropped after his widespread pro-condom campaign had been in effect for a while, the reader is supposed to think the rate of HIV infection had once or ever been high among female sex workers and female prostitutes who engaged primarily in vaginal or oral sex instead of understanding they are probably ONLY talking about statistically significant numbers of male sex workers and male prostitutes who far, far more frequently engaged in anal sex.

Whenever the water is muddied in that way and there is no distinction made between typically "hetero" sex like vaginal or oral sex and typically "homo" sex like anal sex, it is clear evidence of fear-mongering sleight-of-hand at its finest, IMO.

Here is an interesting sub link in one of the links provided above:

Conversations / Mechai Viravaidya; Brash and Unabashed, Mr. Condom Takes on Sex and Death in Thailand.

By PHILIP SHENON.

Published: December 20,1992.

[URL]http://www.nytimes.com/1992/12/20/weekinreview/conversations-mechai-viravaidya-brash-unabashed-mr-condom-takes-sex-death.html[/URL][/QUOTE]The article you link to is from 1992 when there was much less knowledge than now about HIV and AIDS and there was a legitimate fear of a massive worldwide AIDS epidemic (along the lines of what was happening in Africa where there was no question of heterosexual transmission of the virus, albeit primarily of a different strain). The article says some called Mechai a fear mongerer, and you seem to characterize him that way as well. But this is the same guy who made a point of publicly drinking water out of a glass that an HIV positive person drank out of to demonstrate HIV/AIDS could not be spread by this type of casual contact. Hardly the type of demonstration a fear mongerer would engage in.

He may have over-stated the risk of heterosexual transmission, just as many might say you have under-stated it. In fact, even today it is not an easy issue to unequivocally resolve. And when it comes to issues of public health, it is probably better to overstate a risk than to ignore or understate a real risk. In any event, from where I am sitting he acted in good faith and did more good than any harm, particularly at a time when there was a lot of scientific uncertainty about the conditions under which HIV was transmitted. . And, of course, a great amount of his work focused on family planning issues, not just AIDS/HIV.

[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1817835]The article you link to is from 1992 when there was much less knowledge than now about HIV and AIDS and there was a legitimate fear of a massive worldwide AIDS epidemic (along the lines of what was happening in Africa where there was no question of heterosexual transmission of the virus, albeit primarily of a different strain). The article says some called Mechai a fear mongerer, and you seem to characterize him that way as well. But this is the same guy who made a point of publicly drinking water out of a glass that an HIV positive person drank out of to demonstrate HIV/AIDS could not be spread by this type of casual contact. Hardly the type of demonstration a fear mongerer would engage in.

He may have over-stated the risk of heterosexual transmission, just as many might say you have under-stated it. In fact, even today it is not an easy issue to unequivocally resolve. And when it comes to issues of public health, it is probably better to overstate a risk than to ignore or understate a real risk. In any event, from where I am sitting he acted in good faith and did more good than any harm, particularly at a time when there was a lot of scientific uncertainty about the conditions under which HIV was transmitted. And, of course, a great amount of his work focused on family planning issues, not just AIDS/HIV.[/QUOTE]He could just as well have gotten a bareback blowjob from a dozen HIV infected "sex workers" as well and proven you can't get HIV that way either. Instead, he indoctrinated children with horror stories about how they will get HIV and die a horrible death for merely engaging in ordinary vaginal and oral sex as though that was every bit as risky as engaging in receptive anal sex.

He is still misrepresenting the dangers today, not just in 1992 when "we didn't know". Has he amended any of his prior statements and suggestions to the effect of, say, "Oh, it turns out it is extremely difficult and rare for a man to contract HIV from a vagina or a mouth, most difficult for a circumcised man. So I guess we can lighten up on that horror story going forward, particularly for those men who have been circumcised"? I haven't seen that. Yet, in the absence of the kind of bizarre bloodletting marital rituals and sex practices in some Sub-Saharan African cultures, we know very well that it is extremely difficult and rare for a man to get HIV from an infected woman via her vagina or mouth. BTW, we knew a great deal more by 1992 than he and his organization let on.

One of the main reasons fear mongering of that sort, twisting the science and known statistics supposedly "for the greater good", is a grave disservice to society is because when the overwhelming empirical evidence ultimately sets in, as it has in the case of extremely low risk of transmission from women to men, through oral sex and so on, young people who he campaigned so hard to indoctrinate begin to call bullshit on it. They look around, cannot find a single man who can conclusively say he got HIV from a vagina or a mouth despite knowing full well that still a very small percentage of Thai men use condoms all that often, and then they begin to slack off on the idea of wearing condoms even for the more dangerous acts, receptive anal sex or receptive sex with a known I. V. drug user.

I would liken it to the mistake and disservice supposedly well-meaning fear-mongerers made by demonizing the use of marijuana in the largely failed "War on Drugs" as though smoking a joint was no different than shooting heroin directly into your veins. Inevitably, it does not serve "the greater good" at all. It only invites suspicion toward everything promoted by the so-called "authorities".

Meanwhile, condom use in the Philippines is still as much a non issue now as it was before and during the whole HIV / AIDS hysteria years yet the Philippines has one of the lowest rates of HIV in all of Asia.

The guy's campaign on condoms was originally about reducing the birth rate in Thailand re poverty. But he apparently missed the point that the reason Thai people had so many kids isn't because they didn't know how babies got made or how to prevent that from happening. It was because they needed children to take care of them in their old age! The more, the better! He should have directed more of his wit, charm and those amusing public appearances to promoting a USA-style Social Security program for Thailand instead. That would very likely have produced a decline in birth rate as well. Having kids is an expensive proposition on the front end, the early years. So if you don't need to rack up a brood to provide the basics for you in your old age, you've got another good reason not to have so many in the first place.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1817850]in the absence of the kind of bizarre bloodletting marital rituals and sex practices in some Sub-Saharan African cultures, we know very well that it is extremely difficult and rare for a man to get HIV from an infected woman via her vagina or mouth..[/QUOTE]I'm not fully familiar with these African practices, but unless they involve subjecting the penis to blood or other bodily fluids it would be difficult to explain in these terms why male circumcision lowers the risk of contracting HIV there by 40 to 60 percent according to the latest estimates.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1817850]One of the main reasons fear mongering of that sort, twisting the science and known statistics supposedly "for the greater good", is a grave disservice to society is because when the overwhelming empirical evidence ultimately sets in, as it has in the case of extremely low risk of transmission from women to men, through oral sex and so on, young people who he campaigned so hard to indoctrinate begin to call bullshit on it. They look around, cannot find a single man who can conclusively say he got HIV from a vagina or a mouth despite knowing full well that still a very small percentage of Thai men use condoms all that often, and then they begin to slack off on the idea of wearing condoms even for the more dangerous acts, receptive anal sex or receptive sex with a known I. V. drug user.[/QUOTE]Over one million people have contracted HIV in Thailand according to what I have read, with an estimated adult prevalence rate currently of more than one percent. Even using the "first world" CDC estimate that the chance of a woman contracting HIV from vaginal sex with an infected individual is around 1 out of 1,000 [B]per sex act[/B], when one works the numbers, and also takes into account estimates of transmission seem to be significantly higher in non first-world countries (presumably because of the lower standards of health in less developed countries) it is not irrational from a public health standpoint for the population to use condoms so as to keep the spread of the disease from multiplying.

I'm also not clear why you only refer to the female to male transmission rate while ignoring the male to female transmission rate if the discussion is about whether as a matter of public policy condom usage should be encouraged. On the other hand, if the discussion were about the risk members of this forum would be subjected to by not wearing a condom, that would be a different matter that is separate from a discussion of what constitutes good public policy. Incidentally, in my experience the use of condoms by sex workers in Bangkok is still the norm, albeit not uniformly (it never was) and I'm not sure I have seen a lot of change in this over the last ten or fifteen years. Maybe others have had different experiences in this regard.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1817850]Has he amended any of his prior statements and suggestions to the effect of, say, "Oh, it turns out it is extremely difficult and rare for a man to contract HIV from a vagina or a mouth, most difficult for a circumcised man. So I guess we can lighten up on that horror story going forward, particularly for those men who have been circumcised"?[/QUOTE]
I don't think many Thai men are circumcised. But the fact there are studies showing circumcision lowers the risk of female to male HIV transmission also demonstrates it does occur at a rate high enough to show up in studies.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1817850]The guy's campaign on condoms was originally about reducing the birth rate in Thailand re poverty. But he apparently missed the point that the reason Thai people had so many kids isn't because they didn't know how babies got made or how to prevent that from happening. It was because they needed children to take care of them in their old age! The more, the better! He should have directed more of his wit, charm and those amusing public appearances to promoting a USA-style Social Security program for Thailand instead. That would very likely have produced a decline in birth rate as well. Having kids is an expensive proposition on the front end, the early years. So if you don't need to rack up a brood to provide the basics for you in your old age, you've got another good reason not to have so many in the first place.[/QUOTE]The family birthrate in 1975 in Thailand was about seven kids per family, which was about the time he started his family planning efforts from what I understand. It is now about 1.5 kids per family, a decrease of nearly eighty percent. I grant the possibility there may be other reasons for this (although I know of none), but it certainly wasn't a USA-style social security program.

Perhaps this discussion is evolving into one that more appropriately should be in the safe sex thread. However, I'm not so interested in joining that discussion; rather I just feel the Cabbages and Condom guy shouldn't get a bad rap for what I consider the good work he is doing and am posting for that reason as well as that I like his restaurants.

[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1817874]
Over one million people have contracted HIV in Thailand according to what I have read, with an estimated adult prevalence rate currently of more than one percent. Even using the "first world" CDC estimate that the chance of a woman contracting HIV from vaginal sex with an infected individual is around 1 out of 1,000 per sex act, when one works the numbers, and also takes into account estimates of transmission seem to be significantly higher in non first-world countries (presumably because of the lower standards of health in less developed countries) it is not irrational from a public health standpoint for the population to use condoms so as to keep the spread of the disease from multiplying.

I'm also not clear why you only refer to the female to male transmission rate while ignoring the male to female transmission rate if the discussion is about whether as a matter of public policy condom usage should be encouraged. On the other hand, if the discussion were about the risk members of this forum would be subjected to by not wearing a condom, that would be a different matter that is separate from a discussion of what constitutes good public policy. [/QUOTE]Actually, the way the CDC puts it, the chances of HIV contraction via receptive penile-vaginal intercourse is 8 out of 10,000 exposures to HIV-infected partners. Which makes it more like 1 out of 1,250 exposures.

http://www.cdc.gov/hiv/policies/law/risk.html

And that is a worldwide figure, which means it factors in Sub-Saharan Africa wherein some cultures so highly prize a woman being a virgin on her wedding day, they stitch up her vagina so there is sure to be tearing and bleeding on insertion. They are also known to highly prize dry vagina's rather than naturally lubricated ones during the marriage in order to assure the husband that his wife / property is not "sex crazed" and can be trusted not to screw his neighbor while he is off to work. Consequently, women go to great lengths to make sure their vaginas are dry during sex, applying clay, animal dung compounds and the like. Of course, the dryness also encourages tearing and bleeding, of the male as well as the female, an extraordinarily welcoming environment for transmission of HIV and all other kinds of diseases. How many of those "8 out of 10,000 exposures" do you suppose apply to those Sub-Saharan African cultures instead of men and women engaging in sex for free or for money in Thailand? I'm going to go out on a limb and say the same 70-75% of new HIV transmission cases that apply to Sub-Saharan Africa already. So now we're down to about 2 out of 10,000 exposures to HIV infected partners for everyone else on the planet.

Female to male transmission is very much pertinent to the overall subject of forums like this one rather than male to female transmission because the likelihood of a needle-sharing I. V. drug user or a man who has engaged in enough receptive anal sex with other men to have contracted HIV from them traveling to Thailand in order to spend money having vaginal or oral sex with women would have to be extremely low, to the point of being statistically insignificant. If the punters reading this are not likely by any stretch to be HIV-positive then I assure you they pose none or as near to zero risk of transmitting HIV to a female partner as you can get. In this regard, male to female transmission just isn't pertinent. However, IF it were easy or remotely likely for a man to contract HIV from a woman absent the extraordinary bloodletting practices mentioned above, which we know it isn't (and likely even less so for circumcised males, as the above CDC link states), then of course he could get it from a woman on Monday and then transmit it into a bargirl on Wednesday (for the purposes of illustration, that is). But we know that is about as like to happen as getting struck my lightening twice in the same week during the Hot Season.

I am not saying any of those outcomes is impossible. I am saying it just isn't probable by any realistic view of the universe as we can easily observe it. There are airplane crashes every year. Some of them crash into homes. But nobody advocates wearing full body armor while sitting in their living rooms to watch tv every night on the chance that tonight might be your night. Unless, of course, someone sees an opportunity to make a name for himself and establish a nice ongoing income stream for himself and his organization by promoting the sale and wearing of full body armor for anyone and everyone at all times.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1817882]
I am not saying any of those outcomes is impossible. I am saying it just isn't probable by any realistic view of the universe as we can easily observe it.[/QUOTE]Pray tell me, if the transmission rate is so extremely unrealistically low where do all the HIV / AIDS infected people come from (other than in Africa)? Or are they all homosexual IV drug users?

The error in your reasoning is that you are looking at individual statistics whereas the "Cabbages and Condoms" point of view is from a public health perspective. If you can reduce the transmissions rate of STI (not only HIV, but all the other nasties too) by 90% by propagating condom use, then their campaign is a perfectly good example of how to do it.

It is far more science based than 99% of all the "big pharma" campaigns to sell you useless vitamin and mineral supplements.

Furthermore their campaign aims go deeper. One of the key links in the chain to a more wealthy society is reducing the birthrate. Contrary to what you say, one does not need 7 children to replace a missing or failing social security system (the USA is a perfecly good example in that respect). Lower birthrates allow for better education for more children, especially for women. That in its turn gives them better chances to obtain a paying job (rather than only being housewives for a big family) and the (relative) lack of an inexhaustible pool of uneducated workers willing to do dangerous work for a pittance, increases the quality (and price) of the work offered.

Educating (mainly) women and making condoms as easily available as cabbages on the local market (hence the name of their restaurants) was the simple but effective way to achieve their aim.

In that respect "Cabbages and Condoms" has done a sterling job. Perhaps the Pope should grant them sainthood rather than Mother Theresa, who did far less (if anything at all) to attack the root causes of poverty.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1817882]Actually, the way the CDC puts it, the chances of HIV contraction via receptive penile-vaginal intercourse is 8 out of 10,000 exposures to HIV-infected partners. Which makes it more like 1 out of 1,250 exposures.

http://www.cdc.gov/hiv/policies/law/risk.html

And that is a worldwide figure, which means it factors in Sub-Saharan Africa[/QUOTE]You are wrong about this being a worldwide average that includes sub-Sahara Africa, as much as I wish you weren't. According to the study upon which the CDC estimates rely:

"We highlighted data from developed regions to more closely reflect the US epidemic; this strategy was consistent with that used for the relevant meta-analyses, which did not pool data from developed and developing countries due to heterogeneity among studies, except for the per-act HIV-transmission risk from parenteral exposures, which is less geographically dependent. ".

For the complete study: [URL]http://journals.lww.com/aidsonline/Fulltext/2014/06190/Estimating_per_act_HIV_transmission_risk___a.14.aspx[/URL].

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1817882]Actually, the way the CDC puts it, the chances of HIV contraction via receptive penile-vaginal intercourse is 8 out of 10,000.................[/QUOTE]1. Utterly confused. Are you saying that when a woman fucks a man the risks are much lower than when a man fucks a woman? Isn't than an oxymoron statement?

2. If as you say, the risks of catching AIDS / HIV are extremely low, there is still a risk. It's fine for you to be one of the 8. HIV is not the only STD, you know.

3. You may be dismissive of the guy who started the campaign, but at least he had the courage to do what he did, and I applaud him for that. If you come up with something else which do as good or better, my applause to you too.

[QUOTE=Duniawala;1818100]1. Utterly confused. Are you saying that when a woman fucks a man the risks are much lower than when a man fucks a woman? Isn't than an oxymoron statement?[/QUOTE]

I don't know if the numbers are correct, but it is not an oxymoron.

When it comes to unprotected vaginal sex, a HIV- woman has a higher chance of getting infected from a HIV+ man than the other way around (HIV- man from a HIV+ woman). This is due to differences in anatomy. For instance, sperm carries the virus, and remains in the woman's body, whereas vaginal fluids would wash away (and perhaps not infect unless there's a tiny break in skin).

There is a similar disparity in risk between a receptive and insertive partner in anal sex, but obviously anal sex itself is far more risky to start with.

Of course, all of this means nothing. Even if you assume a low risk per exposure, it goes up fairly fast with the number of exposures. For instance, assuming 1 in 1000 risk (.999% safe), 100 sex acts (not much in Thailand) give you a 9.5% chance of getting it. Not that low.

[QUOTE=Crocodilexp;1818127]I don't know if the numbers are correct, but it is not an oxymoron.

When it comes to unprotected vaginal sex, a HIV- woman has a higher chance of getting infected from a HIV+ man than the other way around (HIV- man from a HIV+ woman). This is due to differences in anatomy. For instance, sperm carries the virus, and remains in the woman's body, whereas vaginal fluids would wash away (and perhaps not infect unless there's a tiny break in skin).

There is a similar disparity in risk between a receptive and insertive partner in anal sex, but obviously anal sex itself is far more risky to start with.

Of course, all of this means nothing. Even if you assume a low risk per exposure, it goes up fairly fast with the number of exposures. For instance, assuming 1 in 1000 risk (.999% safe), 100 sex acts (not much in Thailand) give you a 9.5% chance of getting it. Not that low.[/QUOTE]Just to add a clarifying detail, the CDC statistics refer to risk per unprotected exposure with an HIV-infected person, not risk per sex act with a random person.

[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1818260]Just to add a clarifying detail, the CDC statistics refer to risk per unprotected exposure with an HIV-infected person, not risk per sex act with a random person.[/QUOTE]So that means like a handshake between the two?

[QUOTE=Duniawala;1818273]So that means like a handshake between the two?[/QUOTE]It only means that for dimwits.

[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1817904]You are wrong about this being a worldwide average that includes sub-Sahara Africa, as much as I wish you weren't. According to the study upon which the CDC estimates rely:

"We highlighted data from developed regions to more closely reflect the US epidemic; this strategy was consistent with that used for the relevant meta-analyses, which did not pool data from developed and developing countries due to heterogeneity among studies, except for the per-act HIV-transmission risk from parenteral exposures, which is less geographically dependent. ".

For the complete study: [URL]http://journals.lww.com/aidsonline/Fulltext/2014/06190/Estimating_per_act_HIV_transmission_risk___a.14.aspx[/URL].[/QUOTE]Thanks for the clarification. I searched all over the CDC page and did not see a mention of that aspect of the methodology, despite the fact that they do mention other factors. But that doesn't change the fact of extremely low risk for a man contracting HIV via vaginal or oral sex.

[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1818277]It only means that for dimwits.[/QUOTE]Oh my my. What an adult response. Graduated nursery recently?

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1817898]Pray tell me, if the transmission rate is so extremely unrealistically low where do all the HIV / AIDS infected people come from (other than in Africa)? Or are they all homosexual IV drug users?

The error in your reasoning is that you are looking at individual statistics whereas the "Cabbages and Condoms" point of view is from a public health perspective. If you can reduce the transmissions rate of STI (not only HIV, but all the other nasties too) by 90% by propagating condom use, then their campaign is a perfectly good example of how to do it.

It is far more science based than 99% of all the "big pharma" campaigns to sell you useless vitamin and mineral supplements.

Furthermore their campaign aims go deeper. One of the key links in the chain to a more wealthy society is reducing the birthrate. Contrary to what you say, one does not need 7 children to replace a missing or failing social security system (the USA is a perfecly good example in that respect). Lower birthrates allow for better education for more children, especially for women. That in its turn gives them better chances to obtain a paying job (rather than only being housewives for a big family) and the (relative) lack of an inexhaustible pool of uneducated workers willing to do dangerous work for a pittance, increases the quality (and price) of the work offered.

Educating (mainly) women and making condoms as easily available as cabbages on the local market (hence the name of their restaurants) was the simple but effective way to achieve their aim.

In that respect "Cabbages and Condoms" has done a sterling job. Perhaps the Pope should grant them sainthood rather than Mother Theresa, who did far less (if anything at all) to attack the root causes of poverty. [/QUOTE]The studies and stats show that people are infected with HIV via the introduction of HIV-tainted blood into the blood stream, most easily by injecting it directly with a needle, but also possible during sex acts where there is a tear in the skin large enough to provide a viable entry point for the virus. Which would need to be quite large. We're not talking shaving nics here. For the latter, anal sex is the most likely act that would provide such an entry point because the inner lining of the anus is thinner than the lining of a vagina. There have been rare instances over the past 35+ years since HIV/AIDS was first noticed and studied where the virus appears to have gotten past the protective chemistry found in a normally lubricated vagina to infect a woman and the viral load in the man's semen was large enough to transmit it without there being a blood stream introduction opportunity, but those are the unlucky extreme exceptions rather than the overwhelming rule. This was well understood in the medical and HIV / AIDS research community by 1992.

The only reason fewer contributors in the USA version of Social Security won't mean it goes belly up in the foreseeable future is because the USA has a working Social Security system already. As the pool of contributors shrinks and the pool of recipients expands, tweaking the current system by simply raising the cap on earned income taxed for the purpose will keep it fully solvent for decades and decades, long after the last of the Baby Boom Generation has died.

But that isn't the case in Thailand. They have no working and effective Social Security system. Over the past 25 years, they were too busy selling and distributing condoms along with terrorizing young people about how we're all going to die a horrible death if we engage in BBFS and BBBJs to set one up. Consequently, it is going to be quite a challenge for that 1. 5 adult child to house, support and provide the basic needs for his (and his spouse's) dad, mom, old-maid aunt and drunk uncle throughout their old age while he and his spouse are also trying to raise their own 1. 5 kid.

[QUOTE=TheCane;1816063]Prior to my trip to Thailand, I had read quite a bit on ISG about racist door policies at some of the go-go clubs. With that knowledge in hand, I was very curious to find out how I would be treated. Overall it was good, but here is a summary of some memorable things that happened.

One night I decided to hit all of the Rainbow clubs at the Nana Entertainment Plaza (NEP). I was going to make it a "Rainbow night". For me, it was to be sort of an experiment since I heard that there were racist door policies at some of those clubs. So, I wanted to see what would happen, and if it was really true. Let me tell you. It's really true. I had no problems getting into Rainbow 1 and 3. It was Rainbow 2 and 4 where there were issues. Rainbow 4 is now actually called are&be, and when I tried to enter the club they told me "members only", which is exactly the kind of thing I read about on ISG. It was "racist code" and nothing more than that!

They told me members only, and that I could only come in if I paid a "membership fee" of 1,200 baht! There were no other customers attempting to enter the club, so I couldn't see if they were telling them the same thing, but I knew it was all bullshit. I didn't want to pay it at first, but I decided to go ahead with the full "experiment". I found it ironic that I was having problems getting into a place called the are&be (Rhythm & Blues) Club!

So I pay the money, and I get in there and the guy puts a card down on my table (photo attached). I call it my honorary "East Asian / Caucasian Card" because that's the kind of customers I saw in there. Once in, things were fine. The waiters / waitresses and girls were friendly, but I have to say there was nothing special about the place at all. Nothing! Also, I found most of the girls to be unattractive! It was nowhere near the best I'd seen in Bangkok. I picked the card up off of my table and put it in my wallet with the intention of filing this report. One drink came with my honorary East Asian / Caucasian Card. I ordered a beer, finished it, and experiment over decided to leave. As I was leaving, I saw the guys out front give a big welcome to Rainbow 4! It was to east Asians who didn't pay shit to get in! The staff inside are&be (Rainbow 4) were cool. It was the door men who were the assholes. Well, I see my honorary card has no expiration date, so I guess I'm east Asian / Caucasian for life!

At Rainbow 2, I couldn't even get in no matter what I did. I got the same "members only" bullshit, and they didn't "offer" any payment of a "membership fee" as a means of gaining access to the club. I asked why I couldn't go in and said was it the color of my skin. They got quiet and one looked down for a second. I asked again pointing to my skin, which is a well-done brown like Obama. Then the one guy doing all the talking nodded silently. I said, "Fuck it! No problem!" There was no need for me to go inside their club when there are so, so many choices in Bangkok. Choices better than theirs. Besides, I didn't want to get too belligerent and have 25 short motherfuckers show up out of nowhere and take me down LOL!

A couple of similar occurrences went down in Pattaya. One was on Walking Street at a club called Lighthouse. I was told "members only", and that I could gain admission by paying 300 baht in advance. By this time during my trip, my "experiments" over, I told the guy to go fuck himself and walked away. At What's Up on Soi 15 in Pattaya, I was denied admission altogether with no "option" of purchasing a "membership". I went to a place right across the street where their doormen had witnessed what had just happened. They were extra courteous and welcomed me in. When I left, again extra courtesy and giving me back slaps knowing that I had been treated with great disrespect across the street.

But here's the pisser about What's Up. So, I take Soi 15 back up to Walking Street and there are two barkers or touts there for What's Up. They have signs and they stop me and encourage me to go check the place out, obviously not knowing what happened before! Unbelievable! I explained to the two guys how I had been denied admission and was told "members only" and all that bullshit. They understood, and then stood there looking a bit dumbfounded and incredulous. I looked back down Soi 15 towards What's Up, put two birds (middle fingers) up into the air and yelled, "Yeah, What's Up? What's Up? Fuck you!" I did it again, and then me and the two guys had a laugh about it. And then I moved on. Evidently, What's Up's racist door policy hasn't been disseminated all the down to the rank and file working the streets.

I have to say that this was an aspect of mongering in Thailand (along with the lady boy flavor) that was something I really did not like. Both are relative small parts of the scene, but both are also still large enough that you're going to notice them, and maybe even be impacted by them, whether you want to be or not. The sons of bitches telling me "members only" at the door are lucky if they earn even 10% of what I do on an annual basis. I don't say that to be arrogant, but it really has to stick in your craw when you show up well-behaved with your pockets loaded with cash (and freely spending it) and somebody who doesn't know you from the man in the moon is going to tell you that you're not good enough to enter their club because of the color of your skin! I should cut the door guys a little bit of a break since I'm sure they're only doing what the boss man told them to do, but still. The only reason I can think of for why I was not admitted to a handful of clubs is perhaps because they thought I was Indian. Now strangely enough, I had three Thai girls totally unrelated to each other in any way ask me if I was Malaysian! So something about me was making Thais think that maybe I was Malaysian. WTF?

At the end of the day, what I was was a decent customer with plenty of money to spend who deserved to be treated with respect. That's what I was. I've never been denied admission to any mongering establishment in Brazil. I've never been denied admission to any mongering establishment in Germany (although I didn't like the vibe of Golden Time and have never returned). In fact, the only country where I have been denied admission is Thailand! In this respect, Thailand earns a solid grade of an "F". Now, I won't be going to Thailand to monger again. And it's not because of having been denied admission to a handful of clubs. Like I said, the choice in Thailand is so huge that these clubs make up only a tiny percentage of the whole. My decision not to return is more because I just don't like Asian women enough to be traveling way off to Thailand repeatedly to monger. I'm glad I went once, but I know I'm much more attracted to the Latinas and the white girls who fuck a monger the way I like it. So, no returns to Thailand for me. Not specifically to monger anyway.

For the record, I would like to state that no club in Phuket denied me, and I patronized many. That's another plus for Phuket in my books, which I liked better than Bangkok or Pattaya anyway. I would also like to state that unlike in Pattaya, the Lighthouse in Bangkok on Soi Cowboy welcomed me with open arms. Also, apologies for the text editor changing the commonly accepted abbreviation for rhythm & blues to are&be. Geez![/QUOTE]Sorry you had to go through that shit. Heading for Thailand / Philippines in July for 6 weeks. I African American and have been to the Philippines but never Thailand. Originally I was thinking of spending 4 weeks in Thailand and 2 weeks in the Philippines. Because of the continuing reports of.

Racist incidences in Thailand I will spend 2 weeks in Thailand and 4 weeks in the Philippines. Most of that time will be in Phuket. I know there is racism everywhere, but the Filipinos showed me much love. The girls speak English and are fun. Will definitely not patronize Rainbow Bangkok and Lighthouse.

Pattaya. I will be traveling with 3 other African Americans and 4 Indian born guys. Thailand and those racism establishments will miss out on money that would have been spent by 8 individuals. The 8 of us know many other mongers who will actively boycott those places.

I have mongered in about 10 countries and have never heard of bullshit like this.

Check out the Philippines if you get a chance. Filipinos have Spanish blood, so many of them resemble Latinas; without the sexiness. Tons of cute girls who are playful and love to joke around.

Will provide a report when I return.

[QUOTE=TheCane;1816063]Prior to my trip to Thailand, I had read quite a bit on ISG about racist door policies at some of the go-go clubs. With that knowledge in hand, I was very curious to find out how I would be treated. Overall it was good, but here is a summary of some memorable things that happened.

One night I decided to hit all of the Rainbow clubs at the Nana Entertainment Plaza (NEP). I was going to make it a "Rainbow night". For me, it was to be sort of an experiment since I heard that there were racist door policies at some of those clubs. So, I wanted to see what would happen, and if it was really true. Let me tell you. It's really true. I had no problems getting into Rainbow 1 and 3. It was Rainbow 2 and 4 where there were issues. Rainbow 4 is now actually called are&be, and when I tried to enter the club they told me "members only", which is exactly the kind of thing I read about on ISG. It was "racist code" and nothing more than that!

They told me members only, and that I could only come in if I paid a "membership fee" of 1,200 baht! There were no other customers attempting to enter the club, so I couldn't see if they were telling them the same thing, but I knew it was all bullshit. I didn't want to pay it at first, but I decided to go ahead with the full "experiment". I found it ironic that I was having problems getting into a place called the are&be (Rhythm & Blues) Club!

So I pay the money, and I get in there and the guy puts a card down on my table (photo attached). I call it my honorary "East Asian / Caucasian Card" because that's the kind of customers I saw in there. Once in, things were fine. The waiters / waitresses and girls were friendly, but I have to say there was nothing special about the place at all. Nothing! Also, I found most of the girls to be unattractive! It was nowhere near the best I'd seen in Bangkok. I picked the card up off of my table and put it in my wallet with the intention of filing this report. One drink came with my honorary East Asian / Caucasian Card. I ordered a beer, finished it, and experiment over decided to leave. As I was leaving, I saw the guys out front give a big welcome to Rainbow 4! It was to east Asians who didn't pay shit to get in! The staff inside are&be (Rainbow 4) were cool. It was the door men who were the assholes. Well, I see my honorary card has no expiration date, so I guess I'm east Asian / Caucasian for life!

At Rainbow 2, I couldn't even get in no matter what I did. I got the same "members only" bullshit, and they didn't "offer" any payment of a "membership fee" as a means of gaining access to the club. I asked why I couldn't go in and said was it the color of my skin. They got quiet and one looked down for a second. I asked again pointing to my skin, which is a well-done brown like Obama. Then the one guy doing all the talking nodded silently. I said, "Fuck it! No problem!" There was no need for me to go inside their club when there are so, so many choices in Bangkok. Choices better than theirs. Besides, I didn't want to get too belligerent and have 25 short motherfuckers show up out of nowhere and take me down LOL!

A couple of similar occurrences went down in Pattaya. One was on Walking Street at a club called Lighthouse. I was told "members only", and that I could gain admission by paying 300 baht in advance. By this time during my trip, my "experiments" over, I told the guy to go fuck himself and walked away. At What's Up on Soi 15 in Pattaya, I was denied admission altogether with no "option" of purchasing a "membership". I went to a place right across the street where their doormen had witnessed what had just happened. They were extra courteous and welcomed me in. When I left, again extra courtesy and giving me back slaps knowing that I had been treated with great disrespect across the street.

But here's the pisser about What's Up. So, I take Soi 15 back up to Walking Street and there are two barkers or touts there for What's Up. They have signs and they stop me and encourage me to go check the place out, obviously not knowing what happened before! Unbelievable! I explained to the two guys how I had been denied admission and was told "members only" and all that bullshit. They understood, and then stood there looking a bit dumbfounded and incredulous. I looked back down Soi 15 towards What's Up, put two birds (middle fingers) up into the air and yelled, "Yeah, What's Up? What's Up? Fuck you!" I did it again, and then me and the two guys had a laugh about it. And then I moved on. Evidently, What's Up's racist door policy hasn't been disseminated all the down to the rank and file working the streets.

I have to say that this was an aspect of mongering in Thailand (along with the lady boy flavor) that was something I really did not like. Both are relative small parts of the scene, but both are also still large enough that you're going to notice them, and maybe even be impacted by them, whether you want to be or not. The sons of bitches telling me "members only" at the door are lucky if they earn even 10% of what I do on an annual basis. I don't say that to be arrogant, but it really has to stick in your craw when you show up well-behaved with your pockets loaded with cash (and freely spending it) and somebody who doesn't know you from the man in the moon is going to tell you that you're not good enough to enter their club because of the color of your skin! I should cut the door guys a little bit of a break since I'm sure they're only doing what the boss man told them to do, but still. The only reason I can think of for why I was not admitted to a handful of clubs is perhaps because they thought I was Indian. Now strangely enough, I had three Thai girls totally unrelated to each other in any way ask me if I was Malaysian! So something about me was making Thais think that maybe I was Malaysian. WTF?

At the end of the day, what I was was a decent customer with plenty of money to spend who deserved to be treated with respect. That's what I was. I've never been denied admission to any mongering establishment in Brazil. I've never been denied admission to any mongering establishment in Germany (although I didn't like the vibe of Golden Time and have never returned). In fact, the only country where I have been denied admission is Thailand! In this respect, Thailand earns a solid grade of an "F". Now, I won't be going to Thailand to monger again. And it's not because of having been denied admission to a handful of clubs. Like I said, the choice in Thailand is so huge that these clubs make up only a tiny percentage of the whole. My decision not to return is more because I just don't like Asian women enough to be traveling way off to Thailand repeatedly to monger. I'm glad I went once, but I know I'm much more attracted to the Latinas and the white girls who fuck a monger the way I like it. So, no returns to Thailand for me. Not specifically to monger anyway.

For the record, I would like to state that no club in Phuket denied me, and I patronized many. That's another plus for Phuket in my books, which I liked better than Bangkok or Pattaya anyway. I would also like to state that unlike in Pattaya, the Lighthouse in Bangkok on Soi Cowboy welcomed me with open arms. Also, apologies for the text editor changing the commonly accepted abbreviation for rhythm & blues to are&be. Geez![/QUOTE]Does anyone know who owns the Rainbow go-gos? My understanding, although I very well could be wrong, is many of the NEP bars are either effectively owned or managed by farangs. If so, the racism at these bars is more a reflection of farang racism than it is Thai racism, although like in most of Asia, I don't doubt there is enough of the latter to go around.

In any case, I would be interested in knowing what type of people (crudely put, what race of people) is behind the racism at some of the NEP bars.

[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1819052]Does anyone know who owns the Rainbow go-gos? My understanding, although I very well could be wrong, is many of the NEP bars are either effectively owned or managed by farangs. If so, the racism at these bars is more a reflection of farang racism than it is Thai racism, although like in most of Asia, I don't doubt there is enough of the latter to go around.

In any case, I would be interested in knowing what type of people (crudely put, what race of people) is behind the racism at some of the NEP bars.[/QUOTE]Unlikely "many " are owned by farangs. Many in cowboy are owned by middle eastern men from my understanding.

[QUOTE=Breadman;1819206]Unlikely "many " are owned by farangs. Many in cowboy are owned by middle eastern men from my understanding.[/QUOTE]Many on the right side when walking from soi 23 toward are owned by the guy they call the Arab. Not sure he is Arab but is a middle eastern guy I understand. His bars are a rip off. Try to avoid them. They usually don't have many customers in them when I looked. coyotes dancers if i remember correctly Now this is mostly hear say except the part I have actually seen. Names have changed according to google maps.

[QUOTE=Mackin;1819291]Many on the right side when walking from soi 23 toward are owned by the guy they call the Arab. Not sure he is Arab but is a middle eastern guy I understand. His bars are a rip off. Try to avoid them. They usually don't have many customers in them when I looked. coyotes dancers if i remember correctly Now this is mostly hear say except the part I have actually seen. Names have changed according to google maps.[/QUOTE]My understanding is the guy who ruined Soi Cowboy, while often referred to as "the Arab," is actually Iranian, not an Arab.

But I remember hearing a guy named Matt, who I thought was a farang, owned a couple of the NEP places, and I thought other farangs owned some others. Not meaning they own the land, but rather the businesses. Does anyone know any specifics as to whether most of the businesses within NEP are farang-owned, owned by Thais, or something else? And given the Rainbow bars may be the most racist, I would particularly be interested in who owns those businesses.

[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1819296]My understanding is the guy who ruined Soi Cowboy, while often referred to as "the Arab," is actually Iranian, not an Arab.

But I remember hearing a guy named Matt, who I thought was a farang, owned a couple of the NEP places, and I thought other farangs owned some others. Not meaning they own the land, but rather the businesses. Does anyone know any specifics as to whether most of the businesses within NEP are farang-owned, owned by Thais, or something else? And given the Rainbow bars may be the most racist, I would particularly be interested in who owns those businesses.[/QUOTE]Here is the link to a Stickman Weekly article on the subject from July 26, 2015:

The Big Boys of the Bangkok Bar Industry
[URL]http://www.stickmanbangkok.com/StickmanWeeklyColumn2015/Bangkok-bar-industry.htm[/URL]

As I read it, Stickman reveals the Rainbow Group of bars is Thai-owned.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1819378]Here is the link to a Stickman Weekly article on the subject from July 26, 2015:

The Big Boys of the Bangkok Bar Industry
[URL]http://www.stickmanbangkok.com/StickmanWeeklyColumn2015/Bangkok-bar-industry.htm[/URL]

As I read it, Stickman reveals the Rainbow Group of bars is Thai-owned.[/QUOTE]Thanks for the link. It made for interesting reading.

[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1819383]Thanks for the link. It made for interesting reading.[/QUOTE]You're welcome. Regarding the Thai family-owned Rainbow Group, their formula as Stickman describes it is not about partying or gimmicks, but all about finding someone to barfine. Yet, I rarely find anyone in a Rainbow bar I want to barfine. That is especially so in the most successful one, Rainbow 4 (renamed to something else now, R&B Bar or something like that). Tons of silicone, a couple of suspected ladyboys in the mix that might be convincing enough to fool someone with a few drinks in them, and the vibe from the girls there is just too dreary and downbeat to interest me. Then again, I am not Japanese. Maybe that environment and vibe is just right for their preferred Japanese barfine customer.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1819388]You're welcome. Regarding the Thai family-owned Rainbow Group, their formula as Stickman describes it is not about partying or gimmicks, but all about finding someone to barfine. Yet, I rarely find anyone in a Rainbow bar I want to barfine. That is especially so in the most successful one, Rainbow 4 (renamed to something else now, R&B Bar or something like that). Tons of silicone, a couple of suspected ladyboys in the mix that might be convincing enough to fool someone with a few drinks in them, and the vibe from the girls there is just too dreary and downbeat to interest me. Then again, I am not Japanese. Maybe that environment and vibe is just right for their preferred Japanese barfine customer.[/QUOTE]Have to admit I have a very simmilar view of RB4. Plus met some girls that were just far too aggresive. There maybe some nice girls there, but few with nice looks and fun personality.

CH is very different. More natural girls. More shy girls. Not so many quickie oriented girls.

In my history at RB4 only had one really nice girl. She stayed LT and was rather skinny, a little too skinny. Not much padding for comfortable sex. Did not repeat her even she was nice character.

RB4 was a biring bar for me. So was Bacarra. Girls jigging slightly on the stage eyes staring into space thinking of being sonewhere else.. Bored out of their brains. Highly altered aliens. That was my feeling.

[QUOTE=LAGuy5;1819296]My understanding is the guy who ruined Soi Cowboy, while often referred to as "the Arab," is actually Iranian, not an Arab.[/QUOTE]In the context of discrimination of black people, it is interesting to note that the very first "bar" in what is now called "Soi Cowboy" was opened by an African American ex-US Airforce guy T. G. "Cowboy" Edwards who usually wore a cowboy hat, hence the name of the soi now.

He owned a few bars there and even a restaurant but sadly then lost everything in the divorce from his Thai wife and died a poor man.

Legend has it that he taught his bar girls to "dance". Is he the inventor of the "Bangkok Shuffle"?

Can some of you ex-pats refer me to the more trustworthy real estate agencies in Pattaya?

Are there many scams or things I should be looking out for as a first time home buyer in Thailand? I know things like there are only certain properties available to Farang.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;1828371]Can some of you ex-pats refer me to the more trustworthy real estate agencies in Pattaya? Are there many scams or things I should be looking out for as a first time home buyer in Thailand?[/QUOTE]As a Foreigner, you can't privately own land in Thailand, so you should be looking for a Condo apartment. Companies can own land but officially need over 50% Thai ownership I believe. I don't have knowledge about scams.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1819460]In the context of discrimination of black people, it is interesting to note that the very first "bar" in what is now called "Soi Cowboy" was opened by an African American ex-US Airforce guy T. G. "Cowboy" Edwards who usually wore a cowboy hat, hence the name of the soi now.

He owned a few bars there and even a restaurant but sadly then lost everything in the divorce from his Thai wife and died a poor man.

Legend has it that he taught his bar girls to "dance". Is he the inventor of the "Bangkok Shuffle"?[/QUOTE]A little of the History.

[URL]http://www.bangkokeyes.com/2012jul01.html[/URL]
also
[URL]http://www.bangkokeyes.com/mapsoic.html#HISTORY[/URL]

Cowboy was "the" go-go bar area in the 80's and early 90's till eventually Nana Plaza started to compete. Meanwhile much older Pat Pong was known for aggressive touts and rip off bars, (I still went there for the extra raunchy nude bars many years back). Cowboy was the laid back place. In early 90's I was introduced to Midnite Upstairs bar (and maybe Butterfly bar) due to a buddy's uncle having a share in it. However my big interest in Cowboy developed much later when a buddy pointed out that Suzie Wong had introduced full nudity, taking over from Nana Plaza where the former full nudity had been stamped out. Pat Pong was a great place to visit lunchtime or early afternoon in the early 90s for really raunchy misbehaviour in Kangaroo or Annie's Rose, since bar was not at all busy and could have several girls all to yourself. Also had some fun in Queen's Castle or Pussy Galore bars at night (odd visits to Kiss, Firecat, Lipstick). I don't know when the Star of Light arrived. Seems it was around well before my first visit in about 2007.

Unfortunately Cowboy bars have generally gone downhill in recent years with the introduction of The Arab's (Iranian's) Coyote no-go bars. Also Long Gun, Sharks, Dollhouse, Suzie Wong, Deja Vu, even Toy bar have all gone downhill, with less exciting girls than before, more young fatties and much more fake stuff. Closures of good bars like Sheba (was my favorite for a while).

Baccara and Crazy House still going strong and Country Road I guess. Of course plenty of bars in Nana Plaza went downhill or disappeared also. I once liked Angel Witch but bores me these days. I failed to develop a liking for Spankies or any of the Rainbow bars or Billboard. It's a tough business. I guess I changed too. I was a Nana Plaza customer in the long ago years when full nudity was there, e.g. Lollypop and Pretty Lady. Maybe Hollywood.

Baccara downstairs and Sharks should be famous for their Bangkok Shuffle or lack of sexy erotic dancing. At least Suzie Wong used to have some sexy erotic dancers. Crazy House has a mix of raunchy dancers, erotic dancers, and shufflers. I prefer the in between erotic category. I prefer naked beauty and sexy rather than raunchy-ugly. However I see many customers pick the raunchiest dancer, no matter she has a plain face or crap body. I guess they believe the raunchiest perform the best on the bed or they can touch her up the most.

The only advantage I get from choosing girls in bars over other places, is to be able to see the entire package properly, meaning tits need to be uncovered or very skimpily adorned. None of these highly padded bras used by Coyotes. Also I need to be able to see the ass properly. So without nudity in the bars, the ability to see the full package is downgraded and not much use to me. I also largely avoid very fake looking girls, which rules out many in some bars. My favourite bars have always been the ones with full nudity and hot slim natural girls (and not over doing the hip-hop or rap).

A history of nude dancing go-gos (as at 2008):
[url]http://www.bangkokeyes.com/2008apr01.html[/url]

I appreciate the efforts taken by you to experiment and then writing it down in so detail for all.

Thank you so much.

What you have written is very true indeed. Some of the gogos do discriminate with Indians.

It's heartening to know that Germany doesn't have this type of discriminatory policies in FKK clubs I think.

I was also thinking of visiting Germany as I too like European women more than Asians, but doe to lack of company I couldn't plan. I have heard that the so called Russians at pattaya / Bangkok robs you off and it's better to be away from these places.

I intend to visit Germany FKK clubs someday. Are there any travel agents in India arranging such trips for us mongers?

[QUOTE=TheCane;1816063]Prior to my trip to Thailand, I had read quite a bit on ISG about racist door policies at some of the go-go clubs. With that knowledge in hand, I was very curious to find out how I would be treated. Overall it was good, but here is a summary of some memorable things that happened.

One night I decided to hit all of the Rainbow clubs at the Nana Entertainment Plaza (NEP). I was going to make it a "Rainbow night". For me, it was to be sort of an experiment since I heard that there were racist door policies at some of those clubs. So, I wanted to see what would happen, and if it was really true. Let me tell you. It's really true. I had no problems getting into Rainbow 1 and 3. It was Rainbow 2 and 4 where there were issues. Rainbow 4 is now actually called are&be, and when I tried to enter the club they told me "members only", which is exactly the kind of thing I read about on ISG. It was "racist code" and nothing more than that!

They told me members only, and that I could only come in if I paid a "membership fee" of 1,200 baht! There were no other customers attempting to enter the club, so I couldn't see if they were telling them the same thing, but I knew it was all bullshit. I didn't want to pay it at first, but I decided to go ahead with the full "experiment". I found it ironic that I was having problems getting into a place called the are&be (Rhythm & Blues) Club!

So I pay the money, and I get in there and the guy puts a card down on my table (photo attached). I call it my honorary "East Asian / Caucasian Card" because that's the kind of customers I saw in there. Once in, things were fine. The waiters / waitresses and girls were friendly, but I have to say there was nothing special about the place at all. Nothing! Also, I found most of the girls to be unattractive! It was nowhere near the best I'd seen in Bangkok. I picked the card up off of my table and put it in my wallet with the intention of filing this report. One drink came with my honorary East Asian / Caucasian Card. I ordered a beer, finished it, and experiment over decided to leave. As I was leaving, I saw the guys out front give a big welcome to Rainbow 4! It was to east Asians who didn't pay shit to get in! The staff inside are&be (Rainbow 4) were cool. It was the door men who were the assholes. Well, I see my honorary card has no expiration date, so I guess I'm east Asian / Caucasian for life!

At Rainbow 2, I couldn't even get in no matter what I did. I got the same "members only" bullshit, and they didn't "offer" any payment of a "membership fee" as a means of gaining access to the club. I asked why I couldn't go in and said was it the color of my skin. They got quiet and one looked down for a second. I asked again pointing to my skin, which is a well-done brown like Obama. Then the one guy doing all the talking nodded silently. I said, "Fuck it! No problem!" There was no need for me to go inside their club when there are so, so many choices in Bangkok. Choices better than theirs. Besides, I didn't want to get too belligerent and have 25 short motherfuckers show up out of nowhere and take me down LOL!

A couple of similar occurrences went down in Pattaya. One was on Walking Street at a club called Lighthouse. I was told "members only", and that I could gain admission by paying 300 baht in advance. By this time during my trip, my "experiments" over, I told the guy to go fuck himself and walked away. At What's Up on Soi 15 in Pattaya, I was denied admission altogether with no "option" of purchasing a "membership". I went to a place right across the street where their doormen had witnessed what had just happened. They were extra courteous and welcomed me in. When I left, again extra courtesy and giving me back slaps knowing that I had been treated with great disrespect across the street.

But here's the pisser about What's Up. So, I take Soi 15 back up to Walking Street and there are two barkers or touts there for What's Up. They have signs and they stop me and encourage me to go check the place out, obviously not knowing what happened before! Unbelievable! I explained to the two guys how I had been denied admission and was told "members only" and all that bullshit. They understood, and then stood there looking a bit dumbfounded and incredulous. I looked back down Soi 15 towards What's Up, put two birds (middle fingers) up into the air and yelled, "Yeah, What's Up? What's Up? Fuck you!" I did it again, and then me and the two guys had a laugh about it. And then I moved on. Evidently, What's Up's racist door policy hasn't been disseminated all the down to the rank and file working the streets.

I have to say that this was an aspect of mongering in Thailand (along with the lady boy flavor) that was something I really did not like. Both are relative small parts of the scene, but both are also still large enough that you're going to notice them, and maybe even be impacted by them, whether you want to be or not. The sons of bitches telling me "members only" at the door are lucky if they earn even 10% of what I do on an annual basis. I don't say that to be arrogant, but it really has to stick in your craw when you show up well-behaved with your pockets loaded with cash (and freely spending it) and somebody who doesn't know you from the man in the moon is going to tell you that you're not good enough to enter their club because of the color of your skin! I should cut the door guys a little bit of a break since I'm sure they're only doing what the boss man told them to do, but still. The only reason I can think of for why I was not admitted to a handful of clubs is perhaps because they thought I was Indian. Now strangely enough, I had three Thai girls totally unrelated to each other in any way ask me if I was Malaysian! So something about me was making Thais think that maybe I was Malaysian. WTF?

At the end of the day, what I was was a decent customer with plenty of money to spend who deserved to be treated with respect. That's what I was. I've never been denied admission to any mongering establishment in Brazil. I've never been denied admission to any mongering establishment in Germany (although I didn't like the vibe of Golden Time and have never returned). In fact, the only country where I have been denied admission is Thailand! In this respect, Thailand earns a solid grade of an "F". Now, I won't be going to Thailand to monger again. And it's not because of having been denied admission to a handful of clubs. Like I said, the choice in Thailand is so huge that these clubs make up only a tiny percentage of the whole. My decision not to return is more because I just don't like Asian women enough to be traveling way off to Thailand repeatedly to monger. I'm glad I went once, but I know I'm much more attracted to the Latinas and the white girls who fuck a monger the way I like it. So, no returns to Thailand for me. Not specifically to monger anyway.

For the record, I would like to state that no club in Phuket denied me, and I patronized many. That's another plus for Phuket in my books, which I liked better than Bangkok or Pattaya anyway. I would also like to state that unlike in Pattaya, the Lighthouse in Bangkok on Soi Cowboy welcomed me with open arms. Also, apologies for the text editor changing the commonly accepted abbreviation for rhythm & blues to are&be. Geez![/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Raju1974;1830994] Some of the gogos do discriminate with Indians.

It's heartening to know that Germany doesn't have this type of discriminatory policies in FKK clubs I think.

I was also thinking of visiting Germany as I too like European women more than Asians, but doe to lack of company I couldn't plan. I have heard that the so called Russians at pattaya / Bangkok robs you off and it's better to be away from these places.

I intend to visit Germany FKK clubs someday. Are there any travel agents in India arranging such trips for us mongers?[/QUOTE]Not all clubs in Germany let you in if you have dark skin or look like an Arab. And clubs are spread all over the country, not in one location like gogo's. You'd either have to rent a car or pay up for taxi's and public transportation. There are 'FKK tour' companies here and there but they want a few thousand euro's to show you around.

So can somebody explain this to me: Why do Thai women stick their tongue out of the corner of their mouths in their photos? I am cruising profiles on ThaiFriendly and I notice that the women do this frequently. At first glance, it comes off as sexual. But, I received a photo from a more mature woman doing the same thing, even though she is conservatively dressed. Can somebody clarify the meaning of this, lest I have some misunderstanding about their motives.

Thanks,

[QUOTE=Eszpresszo;1833855]So can somebody explain this to me: Why do Thai women stick their tongue out of the corner of their mouths in their photos? I am cruising profiles on ThaiFriendly and I notice that the women do this frequently. At first glance, it comes off as sexual. But, I received a photo from a more mature woman doing the same thing, even though she is conservatively dressed. Can somebody clarify the meaning of this, lest I have some misunderstanding about their motives.

Thanks,[/QUOTE]I always thought they were just making a funny face, perhaps emulating some (Japanese?) emoji.

And of course even conservatively dressed mature women can be horny and wanting to engage you in a sexual manner.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1833941]I always thought they were just making a funny face, perhaps emulating some (Japanese?) emoji.

And of course even conservatively dressed mature women can be horny and wanting to engage you in a sexual manner.[/QUOTE]Is it really a sexual expression? Skeptical.

I have not noticed this so often on girl's facebook pages or Instagram or similar, but have noticed that Thai girls do like to make funny faces at times. One girl I liked would exaggerate her lip pout for fun. Another common one is making a hand shape like a gun, then point it way from side of the face with thumb resting on the side of the chin. I have heard the term "gek lor" for this action, but don't fully understand the meaning or why.

Thai girls love to make special poses for photos rather than try to look very casual natural.

Hi,

I'm flying in to BKK and out of BKK to LPQ Luang Prabang, Laos.

Coming in on Philippine Airlines, going out on Thai Airways. My flights are books so that.

I only have a 2 1/2 hour window between flight times. Will I have to clear customs into Thailand and then exit security and re enter the airport?

Thoughts, comments, suggestions?

Thanks

[QUOTE=NutsM;1837105]Hi,

I'm flying in to BKK and out of BKK to LPQ Luang Prabang, Laos.

Coming in on Philippine Airlines, going out on Thai Airways. My flights are books so that.

I only have a 2 1/2 hour window between flight times. Will I have to clear customs into Thailand and then exit security and re enter the airport?
[/QUOTE]Hmmm, well, it depends.

Firstly are you on a through ticket or two separate tickets?

I have transited through BKK without going landside, but I have also chosen to go landside when I did not have to (longer layover).

I would suggest you ask the 1st airline of your journey or at the airport of first departure.

[QUOTE=EdSetra;1837285]Hmmm, well, it depends.

Firstly are you on a through ticket or two separate tickets?

I have transited through BKK without going landside, but I have also chosen to go landside when I did not have to (longer layover).

I would suggest you ask the 1st airline of your journey or at the airport of first departure.[/QUOTE]It will depend.

If you already have your boarding pass for the second leg of your trip and your luggage is booked through, you will stay airside.

If you have to collect your bags and check in again then you have to cleaar immigration and customs in Bangkok. It may be possible to check in airside at the transfer desks, but I would not know how your luggage is handled there.

[QUOTE=NutsM;1837105]Hi,

I'm flying in to BKK and out of BKK to LPQ Luang Prabang, Laos.

Coming in on Philippine Airlines, going out on Thai Airways. My flights are books so that.

I only have a 2 1/2 hour window between flight times. Will I have to clear customs into Thailand and then exit security and re enter the airport?

Thoughts, comments, suggestions?

Thanks[/QUOTE]I travel many times per year, and sometimes have to transfer at an airport from one ticket to another. Sometimes wish to stop over.

Normally you would check your luggage through to final destination, I would have thought, and then would not go through Thai immigration, and just go via normal airport transit procedures. I don't recall if I have ever had to do otherwise. Maybe once in LOS Angeles (many years ago), when the time between flights was too long like 5 hours, I could not do so. I recall one occasion where I did not want to check all baggage through to final destination, keeping some in an airport locker, but that was different.

So its important to ask to check your baggage through to final destination, on initial check in, showing all your bookings. If they cannot give you a boarding pass for the 2nd leg at the start, you would normally get one in the BKK airport transit procedure.

If I was flying to Bangkok, I would always want to stop over, at least one night. LOL unless you consider Luang Prabang is much better than Bangkok for some reason, or truly have no time. For this reason, I have no actual experience of transiting at Bangkok airport. That would be silly (for me). Only at other airports.

[QUOTE=NutsM;1837105]Hi,

I'm flying in to BKK and out of BKK to LPQ Luang Prabang, Laos.

Coming in on Philippine Airlines, going out on Thai Airways. My flights are books so that.

I only have a 2 1/2 hour window between flight times. Will I have to clear customs into Thailand and then exit security and re enter the airport?

Thoughts, comments, suggestions?

Thanks[/QUOTE]The key point is to have your luggage checked through. As you might have two tickets it is important that the agency puts all under one file and adds note in both tickets.

It depends whether the two airlines have check through agreement for the transit luggage.

If you have a chance go day before to departing airport and see the matter with airline office.

2. 5 hrs is ok if you have to go through immigration, collect your luggage, go to departures and check in again for next flight.

But just about. Good thing is you leave with Thai airways and BKK is their home ground, so you can get better support.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;1828371]Can some of you ex-pats refer me to the more trustworthy real estate agencies in Pattaya?

Are there many scams or things I should be looking out for as a first time home buyer in Thailand? I know things like there are only certain properties available to Farang.[/QUOTE]Be very careful here with property, probably the best company to buy from would be matrix, they have very good reputation, and a lot of money behind them.

[QUOTE=Raju1974;1830994]I appreciate the efforts taken by you to experiment and then writing it down in so detail for all.

Thank you so much.

What you have written is very true indeed. Some of the gogos do discriminate with Indians.

It's heartening to know that Germany doesn't have this type of discriminatory policies in FKK clubs I think.

I was also thinking of visiting Germany as I too like European women more than Asians, but doe to lack of company I couldn't plan. I have heard that the so called Russians at pattaya / Bangkok robs you off and it's better to be away from these places.

I intend to visit Germany FKK clubs someday. Are there any travel agents in India arranging such trips for us mongers?[/QUOTE]I have not discovered any discrimination at go go bars for Indians. This may happen because some of us do not behave properly at these joints and most of the times people from our country tend to go in bathes of 4 to 6 . I have not come across such discrimination in FKK Clubs in Germany either but I think it largerly depends on our own behavior. There are quite a few tour organizers ofFKK clubs. Visit [URL]http://fkktours.com/[/URL] for details. Ofcourse, these tours are expensive. You will have the advantage of seeing girls completely naked and chose the girl of your choice. Further, the rates are fixed at Euro 50 for 30 minutes, Euro 60 for 60 minutes and so on as also other services like massage etc. There are outstanding FKK clubs located around Stuttgart and Frankfurt and simply Thailand cannot match the same.

[QUOTE=FunExplorer;1838399]There are outstanding FKK clubs located around Stuttgart and Frankfurt and simply Thailand cannot match the same.[/QUOTE]You forgot the 100+ clubs around Dusseldorf / NRW? Goldentime in Bruggen, Living Room, and Acapulco being the best of them.

Thailand is just different. It's a lot more expensive to take a FKK girl for an all nighter. FKK girls are beautiful though.

[QUOTE=How14;1837906]Be very careful here with property, probably the best company to buy from would be matrix, they have very good reputation, and a lot of money behind them.[/QUOTE]Thanks. I quickly discovered this after doing more research. No need to own a condo that I can't sell down the road. Better to rent in Thailand.

[QUOTE=NutsM;1837105]Hi,

I'm flying in to BKK and out of BKK to LPQ Luang Prabang, Laos.

Coming in on Philippine Airlines, going out on Thai Airways. My flights are books so that.

I only have a 2 1/2 hour window between flight times. Will I have to clear customs into Thailand and then exit security and re enter the airport?

Thoughts, comments, suggestions?

Thanks[/QUOTE]I just went thru Bkk and on to Hatyai. I flew in on China Air and retrieved by 1 checked bag and went upstairs to the little Thai Airways ticket office and bought a ticket to Hatyai. Went over to the domestic lanes, I think it was area 11, and checked in my bag and received a boarding pass. I had 2 hours between arrival and departure.

My point is that why take a chance with missing luggage when you are using 2 different airlines? It's not worth the hassle. It's safer to do yourself.

In a previous trip to Bkk, I flew China Air and had to transfer in Taipei. The transfer was fast so my bag did not make the plane to Bkk. Still in Taipei.

When I arrived in Bkk at the conveyor a rep from China air was waiting for me with a sign with my name on it. He informed me that my bag was on it's way tomorrow and he would bring it to my hotel. And I would receive $50.00 for the inconvenience when I went back to Hnl. They delivered my bag the next day at 17:00. I had a date and she was in a taxi on the way to my hotel to pick me up. It all worked out as I got off the elevator she pulled up in a taxi.

RL.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1834813]Is it really a sexual expression? Skeptical.

I have not noticed this so often on girl's facebook pages or Instagram or similar, but have noticed that Thai girls do like to make funny faces at times. One girl I liked would exaggerate her lip pout for fun. Another common one is making a hand shape like a gun, then point it way from side of the face with thumb resting on the side of the chin. I have heard the term "gek lor" for this action, but don't fully understand the meaning or why.

Thai girls love to make special poses for photos rather than try to look very casual natural.[/QUOTE]Okay guys, I appreciate your feedback. But, I was able to get an answer direct from a Thai girl I enjoyed a webcam chat with recently. The protuding tongue, is simply a way to look cute, and is popular the way that American bimbos do the silly "duckface". She assured me it was nothing sexual, though it wasn't anything she would do herself (she came off as a bit educated, though she was only a hairdresser).

That said, I learned a few lessons about how you can misread Thai women on the dating sites. I had flagged some girls I'd seen on ThaiFriendly, as possible P4 P candidates (and those are on there to be sure) based on their scanty clothing and provocative poses, as well as lacking a profile giving their objectives. One young lady, had a bounty of pictures posted in lingerie, cleavage promient and her aureola peering out from her top. I checked her profile recently and her profile was an angry rant about her being mistaken as a FL. She posted something like "If you want to fuck, go to Pattaya and get a bargirl". She wasn't the only one who had updated her description after posting rather provocative pictures on TF. Another, I had flagged, posted a similar angry rant and said "If you don't want to marry me, don't contact me" In their desperation to get attention and attract a mate, it seems these girls might have sent out the wrong message. I can understand why. The competition is formidable.

The point to us is, not to rush to make judgement on appearances alone. Otherwise, we make a case for those bimbos who promote "SLUTWALK". I'm sure those of you on the ground in the LOS or those who have ample experience there, might chime in on how to better get a read on the ordinary girls.

[QUOTE=Eszpresszo;1839314]Okay guys, I appreciate your feedback. But, I was able to get an answer direct from a Thai girl I enjoyed a webcam chat with recently. The protuding tongue, is simply a way to look cute, and is popular the way that American bimbos do the silly "duckface". She assured me it was nothing sexual, though it wasn't anything she would do herself (she came off as a bit educated, though she was only a hairdresser).

That said, I learned a few lessons about how you can misread Thai women on the dating sites. I had flagged some girls I'd seen on ThaiFriendly, as possible P4 P candidates (and those are on there to be sure) based on their scanty clothing and provocative poses, as well as lacking a profile giving their objectives. One young lady, had a bounty of pictures posted in lingerie, cleavage promient and her aureola peering out from her top. I checked her profile recently and her profile was an angry rant about her being mistaken as a FL. She posted something like "If you want to fuck, go to Pattaya and get a bargirl". She wasn't the only one who had updated her description after posting rather provocative pictures on TF. Another, I had flagged, posted a similar angry rant and said "If you don't want to marry me, don't contact me" In their desperation to get attention and attract a mate, it seems these girls might have sent out the wrong message. I can understand why. The competition is formidable.

The point to us is, not to rush to make judgement on appearances alone. Otherwise, we make a case for those bimbos who promote "SLUTWALK". I'm sure those of you on the ground in the LOS or those who have ample experience there, might chime in on how to better get a read on the ordinary girls.[/QUOTE]I found both my previous Thai GF and my present Thai GF on dating sites (respectively Date-in-Asia and ThaiFriendly). It is indeed very difficult to gauge their intentions based upon the photos they post. Even their profiles, or lack thereof, are not to be taken as scripture.

Going slowly slowly and sending them many messages is the best way forward and even then nothing is certain.

Maybe I was just lucky, but both of them stayed the night in my room after we first met and had dinner. By letting her in control and not rushing things, she did not feel threathened and after a while melted in my arms and we had good sex.

I guess they get so many blunt and sexually-tinted messages, they really appreciate someone who they can first see as a friend rather than a sex-partner.

Of course that takes time and it would be bad to abuse their thrust. If you are not looking for a GF, but rather for a one-night stand then the bars and discos of Pattaya are a better hunting ground.

Yes, I'm sure there must be professional girls on these websites, but frankly I find it a waste of time and effort to try and find them there as it is so easy to find them in any bar or club in Thailand.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1839436]I found both my previous Thai GF and my present Thai GF on dating sites (respectively Date-in-Asia and ThaiFriendly). It is indeed very difficult to gauge their intentions based upon the photos they post. Even their profiles, or lack thereof, are not to be taken as scripture.



Of course that takes time and it would be bad to abuse their thrust. If you are not looking for a GF, but rather for a one-night stand then the bars and discos of Pattaya are a better hunting ground.

[/QUOTE]Well, I definitely appreciate the GFE that comes from a real girlfriend (even if she is your girlfriend for a few days only). But, I also appreciate the skills and services that you can enjoy with total selfishness, that come with a real professional wh*re. There is a place for both, and I have figured out how to work it into my plans. I wouldn't want to abuse their trust, but I am also aware they are likely playing the field as well. I took my profile of TF down, after building a portfolio of contacts. Did any of them remove their profiles after I told I was going to do that? No, of course not and I won't fault them for that.

Now as you commented earlier in a different thread, its easy to meet lots of girls on Thai dating sites and you have to cut them loose at some point. I've met a bunch of girls online but as you have probably noticed. And I was also advised of this on another Thai dating site. The girls will lose interest very quickly, even if you are on your best behavior. That dwindles the numbers down. There are some who communicate erratically but you have to question their interest and how sincere they are, as well.

One young cutie, who is from far up north in Isaan, and working in a mall way down South (a short distance from Pattaya) has been obsessively web cam chatting with me, but is also very secretive. Often looking over her shoulder when we web cam, or ending calls abrubtly. Once I noticed a large photo on her wall. A wedding photo of a bride and groom. I asked her who the couple were. She ended the call abruptly. She is excited about me visiting her. I just asked if I should stay with her. Her response was her place wasn't very nice, so I absolutely couldn't stay there, but a hotel on the beach would be great. I'm not anticipating much guilt about anything I'm about to do with her. 555.

That said, I am sure there are some truly "nice girls" I can meet. But if they don't want to have me over, or come up to my hotel room, I don't need to pressure them nor do I need to seduce them if I find there is no chemistry. As you said, I have so many options for easy sex. Maybe the young lady wants to have a second date, but its later in the week (I'm looking to stay three weeks), then I can entertain myself with my "short-term" options, right? As you said, not rushing things and letting the woman be in control is a good strategy. And what better way to relax and take it easy, than to know you have so many other options. I'm seeing the LOS as a great place for a man who is confident with women, but not afraid to pay for their company. We have our choices at least. As we should all know by now, sex costs money no matter who provides it. Dates can be as expensive as hiring a working girl, and gifts for your girlfriend can get expensive. Honestly, I don't see myself spending much money on a hotel if I am only out mongering, whereas you don't take your date to a budget hotel and expect her to be impressed. I can see the cost of lodging spiking when you are out to impress your date. So, I won't be hooking up with girlfriend-material girls for the purpose of "free" sex.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1839436]Yes, I'm sure there must be professional girls on these websites, but frankly I find it a waste of time and effort to try and find them there as it is so easy to find them in any bar or club in Thailand.[/QUOTE]+1 to that. I have a GF already. I don't need two. It is either one or nothing. Much easier to monger with no pretence of being single. I also make it clear that it doesn't matter to me if the girl has one or 3 boyfriends already.

P4 p girls and semi-P4 P really appreciate being able to have a close friendly relationship with a guy, with sex, without the guy prying into her personal business, and putting pressure on her. I was having regular sex with one P4 P girl, who had a BF knowing nothing about her P4 P activity, yet I was somehow hooked on her. Later she dumped the BF (he put her under too much pressure). I had no clue of course, how many other suitors there were. I was disappointed when she retired and it all stopped, however thankful the reasonable period of great experiences. I could have been after if I had no GF, potentially. She was a hell of a lot of fun, even on a short holiday.

Spending one night in Bangkok for a visa run. I've been through there before and done the whole Nana Plaza / Soi Cowboy thing. I'm wondering what else is out there. Flying into Suvarnabhumi in the afternoon and back out the next. Don't want to spend half my time chatting up a girl that might not be looking for a LT encounter. Anything close to the airport worth staying at or checking out? I always liked Phuket more than BKK. Dark skin, shaved, and never got refused back door service. Any good options for that anyone can recommend? Basically hoping for a LT GFE with no boundaries.

I like watching Thailand vids on youtube, some interesting stuff being shown for all to see. Been watching this guy who's youtube handle is '20 seconds in Thailand', one of his first video's was him saying how bad life was becoming back home in the states and how he lost his job and decided to move to Thailand. How does one who's lost one's job just get up and move across the world and continue to find money to survive in a foreign country? Yeah, youtube's giving him some cash with views but it can't be much. I also undertand that you can live on alot less but you still need money coming in. Unemployment checks from the states paying for him to live in the land of smiles?

[QUOTE=Breadman;1888654]I like watching Thailand vids on youtube, some interesting stuff being shown for all to see. Been watching this guy who's youtube handle is '20 seconds in Thailand', one of his first video's was him saying how bad life was becoming back home in the states and how he lost his job and decided to move to Thailand. How does one who's lost one's job just get up and move across the world and continue to find money to survive in a foreign country? Yeah, youtube's giving him some cash with views but it can't be much. I also undertand that you can live on alot less but you still need money coming in. Unemployment checks from the states paying for him to live in the land of smiles?[/QUOTE]Not sure how he began, but 20 seconds dude now has a Patreon that's close to cracking $1,000 per month. That's what most teachers make! Ah, where did I go wrong.

[QUOTE=ThingStick;1888809]Not sure how he began, but 20 seconds dude now has a Patreon that's close to cracking $1,000 per month. That's what most teachers make! Ah, where did I go wrong.[/QUOTE]In one of his first dozen or so video's he mentioned someone told him to move to Thailand if his job didn't work out. He then got laid off and decided to move to Thailand. Didn't sound like he had much if any savings so I'm guessing some for of unemployment was (or is) paying his way. Youtube pays based on views and his views aren't high enough to make him more than a few bucks here and there. It takes balls though to move to a country without a means of support, not like you can get a job at the local seven eleven. And you can't depend on one person's donations for long before that source of income dries up.

So what's the lowest amout of usd's needed to live in Thailand. Rent, food, transportion, the occasional visa run. I'm going to guess $600 usd per month would be the absolute minimum. That would give you just over 21000 baht. 4 k to 7 k on rent would leave you with 400 baht per day spending money.

[QUOTE=Breadman;1889034]In one of his first dozen or so video's he mentioned someone told him to move to Thailand if his job didn't work out. He then got laid off and decided to move to Thailand. Didn't sound like he had much if any savings so I'm guessing some for of unemployment was (or is) paying his way. Youtube pays based on views and his views aren't high enough to make him more than a few bucks here and there. It takes balls though to move to a country without a means of support, not like you can get a job at the local seven eleven. And you can't depend on one person's donations for long before that source of income dries up.

So what's the lowest amout of usd's needed to live in Thailand. Rent, food, transportion, the occasional visa run. I'm going to guess $600 usd per month would be the absolute minimum. That would give you just over 21000 baht. 4 k to 7 k on rent would leave you with 400 baht per day spending money.[/QUOTE]The lowest (minimally comfortable) amount of USD I calculated out of curiosity just a few days ago was about $750 per month. That included what you mentioned but I added electricity (occasional aircon) and at least a smartphone with internet access. If you pushed it to $1000-$1100 per month you could include a couple of visits to a BJ bar per week or a ST or two with a Sukhumvit freelancer per week.

This wouldn't be living in some rat infested apartment in the outlying shanty town areas of Bangkok either. It could be no more than a 10-15 minute walk or 10 baht motorcycle taxi ride to Sukhumvit and Asok.

[QUOTE=Breadman;1889034]Rent, food, transportion, the occasional visa run.[/QUOTE]Be aware the entire visa situation has been cracked down since 3 years or so. There is no more 2 or 3 entry tourist visa, only single or multiple, the latter last for 6 months in country as before but requires extensive qualifications (varies by country) to be had, 2 border runs and 3 extension at Bt 1,900 each. Student visa require a lot of hours and attendance / proficiency is verified. Repeated visa exempt entries is out of question. The only ones doing relatively easy are married people (which need to show Bt 400,000 in bank) or over 50 (show 800,000).

[QUOTE=Breadman]Youtube pays based on views and his views aren't high enough to make him more than a few bucks here and there.[/QUOTE]Patreon is different. You are paid monthly per supporter, which you can identify and interact directly. As long you can keep them satisfied and/or get new ones, you're OK. I know one guy which recently started with it, to be honest his content is truly awesome and suited.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1889130]The lowest (minimally comfortable) amount of USD I calculated out of curiosity just a few days ago was about $750 per month. That included what you mentioned but I added electricity (occasional aircon) and at least a smartphone with internet access. If you pushed it to $1000-$1100 per month you could include a couple of visits to a BJ bar per week or a ST or two with a Sukhumvit freelancer per week.

This wouldn't be living in some rat infested apartment in the outlying shanty town areas of Bangkok either. It could be no more than a 10-15 minute walk or 10 baht motorcycle taxi ride to Sukhumvit and Asok.[/QUOTE]The guy lives in phuket, saw a video where he said he's paying 7000 baht per month for a brand new condo. Phuket or pattaya would be the cheapest options, rent and electric for under $250 per month if not less.

[QUOTE=OldNewGuy;1889250]Be aware the entire visa situation has been cracked down since 3 years or so. There is no more 2 or 3 entry tourist visa, only single or multiple, the latter last for 6 months in country as before but requires extensive qualifications (varies by country) to be had, 2 border runs and 3 extension at Bt 1,900 each. Student visa require a lot of hours and attendance / proficiency is verified. Repeated visa exempt entries is out of question. The only ones doing relatively easy are married people (which need to show Bt 400,000 in bank) or over 50 (show 800,000).

Patreon is different. You are paid monthly per supporter, which you can identify and interact directly. As long you can keep them satisfied and/or get new ones, you're OK. I know one guy which recently started with it, to be honest his content is truly awesome and suited.[/QUOTE]That's almost $23,000. That seems very high. So if I marry a Thai lady and move to Thailand, I need to keep a balance that high in a bank account? That weeds out the freeloaders. Do you also need a special permanent Visa?

RL.

[QUOTE=RobertLong;1889451]That's almost $23,000. That seems very high. So if I marry a Thai lady and move to Thailand, I need to keep a balance that high in a bank account? That weeds out the freeloaders. Do you also need a special permanent Visa?
[/QUOTE]If married, either 400,000 Bt. deposited, or an embassy-certified 40,000 Bt / month income. I called these visa but the correct name (when obtained in Thailand at Immigration) is "extension of stay", which is renewed every year, indefinitely. See attached.

[QUOTE=Breadman;1889412]The guy lives in phuket, saw a video where he said he's paying 7000 baht per month for a brand new condo. Phuket or pattaya would be the cheapest options, rent and electric for under $250 per month if not less.[/QUOTE]On the side topic of what the minimum monthly USD amount one would want or need to live in Thailand, yes, location is one of the main variables. My calculations were assuming living in Bangkok under reasonably comfortable conditions. Although rent (easily doable at 7000-8000 THB per month for an aircon room, no kitchen, even in the Sukhumvit / Asok area) and your smartphone or tablet data / internet access package are predictable monthly expenses, utility / electric expenses are only somewhat predictable within a given range. Then there are other less predictable variables that can make a big difference; food, "dating", if any, and the THB to USD exchange rate. You can eat more western style meals and enjoy a few more or higher quality "dates" per week/month when the THB to USD rate is closer to 35 than 30.

And on the visa issue, I admit I was assuming the over age 50 annual retirement visa that I have; 1900 THB annual at Thai Immigration plus $50 USD annual at the USA Embassy for a notarized income verification letter.

Also, it turns out that first issued income verification statement, possibly from the Thai consulate in your home USA state or city, is very likely (but certainly not guaranteed) the only time you will need to show documentation of the equivalent of 800,000 THB on hand or an income stream of 65,000 THB per month (Social Security, pension, rental property income, whatever) or a combination of the two that supports that general level of solvency. At least at the USA Embassy, in order to renew that visa every year, a notarized income verification letter, which is the only income verification document asked for at Thai Immigration any of the several times I have renewed my annual visa including just last month, has been issued to me without any documentation required and based soley on what I state on a very simple form is my monthly income in USD.

[QUOTE=Breadman;1889412]The guy lives in phuket, saw a video where he said he's paying 7000 baht per month for a brand new condo. Phuket or pattaya would be the cheapest options, rent and electric for under $250 per month if not less.[/QUOTE]In the past Patong, Phuket was always a lot more expensive for equivalent standard Hotel accommodation compared to Sukhumvit Bangkok.

If he can get a new condo for 7000 baht per month, it must be small basic or inconveniently located, or have times really changed? I don't go to Patong any more, but always used to be an expensive place.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1889789]If he can get a new condo for 7000 baht per month, it must be small basic or inconveniently located, or have times really changed? I don't go to Patong any more, but always used to be an expensive place.[/QUOTE]I did some research for a friend for an house in Bangkok, and there were great deals, but I would never be interested living there myself. Just 4 yrs ago I rented a brand new (never lived in before) furnished bungalow in Phuket, a very quiet location near to the Zoo. It was really a small single-family home with large bedroom, living room, kitchen, carport, front and back door, garden backyard. Pretty good finishing and friendly, reasonable landlord. After having been decorated a little, it was a lovely and cozy place to live in. THB 10,000 a month. Thailand is cheap if one can look outside the beaten path.

[QUOTE=OldNewGuy;1889804]I did some research for a friend for an house in Bangkok, and there were great deals, but I would never be interested living there myself. Just 4 yrs ago I rented a brand new (never lived in before) furnished bungalow in Phuket, a very quiet location near to the Zoo. It was really a small single-family home with large bedroom, living room, kitchen, carport, front and back door, garden backyard. Pretty good finishing and friendly, reasonable landlord. After having been decorated a little, it was a lovely and cozy place to live in. THB 10,000 a month. Thailand is cheap if one can look outside the beaten path.[/QUOTE]Phuket is a big Island and I am not familiar with the Zoo. Perhaps you mean Phuket Town rather than Phuket Province? What is the attraction of the location?

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1889848]Phuket is a big Island and I am not familiar with the Zoo. Perhaps you mean Phuket Town rather than Phuket Province? What is the attraction of the location?[/QUOTE]Driving south from Town before Chalong. To be honest, for me a great attraction of it was being far from tourists.

[QUOTE=OldNewGuy;1889458]If married, either 400,000 Bt. deposited, or an embassy-certified 40,000 Bt / month income. I called these visa but the correct name (when obtained in Thailand at Immigration) is "extension of stay", which is renewed every year, indefinitely. See attached.[/QUOTE]So around $1500.00 US a month income, as in social security or pension payments wired to a Thai bank on a monthly basis. That makes more sense than having $23,000. In a bank account on a continuous basis. This gets rid of the deadbeat farangs and creates stability.

RL.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1889789]In the past Patong, Phuket was always a lot more expensive for equivalent standard Hotel accommodation compared to Sukhumvit Bangkok.

If he can get a new condo for 7000 baht per month, it must be small basic or inconveniently located, or have times really changed? I don't go to Patong any more, but always used to be an expensive place.[/QUOTE]Here's the video showing his condo, its basically just a one room setup. For the size of that room I'd assume you could get that much cheaper in Pattaya.

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MXw3qN_T5nU[/URL]

[QUOTE=RobertLong;1889928]So around $1500.00 US a month income, as in social security or pension payments wired to a Thai bank on a monthly basis. That makes more sense than having $23,000. In a bank account on a continuous basis. This gets rid of the deadbeat farangs and creates stability.
[/QUOTE]Correct, but various countries like the US and Australia require no proof to issue the income affidavit (attached). You can bet that many people exploits this fact. No shortage of deadbed foreigners in Thailand.

[QUOTE=OldNewGuy;1890148]Correct, but various countries like the US and Australia require no proof to issue the income affidavit (attached). You can bet that many people exploits this fact. No shortage of deadbed foreigners in Thailand.[/QUOTE]The form is freely available, but you can't get a counselor signature on it w / o showing the documentation and paying 50 bucks. I've not applied for the visa but I need counselor signatures for various business activities.

The $50 is a real rip-off because a notary signature is free from multiple places (including Walmart.) in the USA. TTG.

[QUOTE=TimTimGuy;1890200]The form is freely available, but you can't get a counselor signature on it w / o showing the documentation and paying 50 bucks. I've not applied for the visa but I need counselor signatures for various business activities.[/QUOTE]There is no documentation to show. They only certify to have received your affirmations. That's why is called an affidavit.

[QUOTE]The $50 is a real rip-off because a notary signature is free from multiple places (including Walmart.) in the USA. TTG.[/QUOTE]A public notary is not a Government authority. Some countries charge even more for similar certifications. It's even fortunate that in this case it's accepted without an official translation or backup documents. (although some immigration offices have started asking for them).

I plan to visit Bangkok in couple months for 2 weeks. This will be my first trip like this. I hoped to find a friend to travel with but the friends that want to go can not afford it and my friends that can afford it have no interest.

With that said, I will most likely travel alone. I have a passport, but my questions are:

1. Can I just get on a plane and arrive on Bangkok and get a room at a hotel? Or do I need something from the US or Thailand to visit.

2. Do I need any shots if I stay in the city?

3. Do I carry Bt or dollars or both?

4. I have felony convictions from my youth (25 years ago) for weed. Does anyone ask about this when you enter the country? How would they check anyways?

5. How much can I expect to spend for 13 days stay at standard hotel (I do not need 5 star, just clean) , I imagine I would like 1 or 2 girls a. Day and maybe overnight, I do not drink, I am fit enough to walk a few blocks (no need to be driven everywhere) maybe train or bus rides sound fun for people watching. ?

6. Language? I speak no Thai. Is this a small or major problem?

Mandos

[QUOTE=IAmGine;1891035]I plan to visit Bangkok in couple months for 2 weeks. This will be my first trip like this. I hoped to find a friend to travel with but the friends that want to go can not afford it and my friends that can afford it have no interest.

With that said, I will most likely travel alone. I have a passport, but my questions are:

1. Can I just get on a plane and arrive on Bangkok and get a room at a hotel? Or do I need something from the US or Thailand to visit.

2. Do I need any shots if I stay in the city?

3. Do I carry Bt or dollars or both?

4. I have felony convictions from my youth (25 years ago) for weed. Does anyone ask about this when you enter the country? How would they check anyways?

5. How much can I expect to spend for 13 days stay at standard hotel (I do not need 5 star, just clean) , I imagine I would like 1 or 2 girls a. Day and maybe overnight, I do not drink, I am fit enough to walk a few blocks (no need to be driven everywhere) maybe train or bus rides sound fun for people watching. ?

6. Language? I speak no Thai. Is this a small or major problem?

Mandos[/QUOTE]No problem with passport for 30 day free visa.

Bring C card that can withdraw money or cash. If cash only, change about 300 or so at airport. Hotel can tell you where to change money.

No Thai, no problem No shots needed.

Advance booking at hotel recommended. Used Booking. Com, Agoda or another web sight. Read the threads. Stay around main road Sukhumvet between soi 2 and soi 26.

As far as having a felony I would contact Thai embassy for the answer. You can google them for phone number. Just don't give them your real name when asking the question.

[QUOTE=IAmGine;1891035]4. I have felony convictions from my youth (25 years ago) for weed. Does anyone ask about this when you enter the country? How would they check anyways?
[/QUOTE]That would be a problem if you were applying for a long-stay visa like a retirement visa since you would have to provide proof of a clean criminal record and if your country doesn't give you one (if your crime is not time-barred) that would be a problem.

I remember reading on some German forum that the Thais didn't give shit about whether you did drugs outside Thailand, as long as you don't do any in Thailand. Someone on that forum had enquired about track marks.

You could inquire from the authorities in your country or from a lawyer if you have the money to spend on one whether your country exchanges that kind of criminal record info with Thailand. Many Western countries don't especially given the kind of law enforcement they have in Thailand for that kind of crime (human rights issue).

Read this thread (same situation as yours): https://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowTopic-g293920-i5037-k5349135-Travel_from_Aust_with_criminal_record-Phuket.html

[QUOTE=Mackin;1891232]No Thai, no problem ..[/QUOTE]No Thai, no problem?

So is English common in BKK then? Or at least enough yo get around? Good news for me then I don't speak. I do have a translator on my phone in a pinch.

[QUOTE=IAmGine;1891253]No Thai, no problem?

So is English common in BKK then? Or at least enough yo get around? Good news for me then I don't speak. I do have a translator on my phone in a pinch.[/QUOTE] No, the language is Thai, but many will speak English in the tourist area. Read this forum for further information and get a map to see where things are located. Also use google translate or google maps if those can help.

[QUOTE=IAmGine;1891035]I plan to visit Bangkok in couple months for 2 weeks. This will be my first trip like this. I hoped to find a friend to travel with but the friends that want to go can not afford it and my friends that can afford it have no interest.

With that said, I will most likely travel alone. I have a passport, but my questions are:

1. Can I just get on a plane and arrive on Bangkok and get a room at a hotel? Or do I need something from the US or Thailand to visit.[/QUOTE]Of course you can, but it is easier to pre-book your hotel through the usual websites ([URL]booking.com[/URL], [URL]agoda.com[/URL], [URL]tripadvisor.com[/URL], . . .). You don't want to walk from one hotel to another in the tropical heat with all your luggage to find the best deal.

[QUOTE=IAmGine;1891035]2. Do I need any shots if I stay in the city?[/QUOTE]No shots are necessary even outside of the big cities, but the usual anti-hepatitis shots and tetanus vaccine shots are always advisable anywhere, even if you are not travelling.

[QUOTE=IAmGine;1891035]3. Do I carry Bt or dollars or both?[/QUOTE]Bring dollars and exchange at the SuperRich currency exchange booths. There is one at the lowest level of the airport. Avoid the exchange booths of the banks (either in the airport or in the city): their rates are the worst.

[QUOTE=IAmGine;1891035]4. I have felony convictions from my youth (25 years ago) for weed. Does anyone ask about this when you enter the country? How would they check anyways?[/QUOTE]US Citizens are on a visa waiver scheme. You can stay for 30 days simply by presenting your passport at the immigration check. Nobody ever asked me about criminal convictions, nor does the immigration form you have to complete.

[QUOTE=IAmGine;1891035]5. How much can I expect to spend for 13 days stay at standard hotel (I do not need 5 star, just clean) , I imagine I would like 1 or 2 girls a. Day and maybe overnight, I do not drink, I am fit enough to walk a few blocks (no need to be driven everywhere) maybe train or bus rides sound fun for people watching. ?[/QUOTE]You will easily find good standard hotels in the center of BKK for USD 50 or less per night. As a first time visitor, estimate USD 30 per day for food. Picking up girls from the girlie bars will set you back about USD 80 per (short time) session, including the barfine and some drinks for you and her. "Long time" (overnight) will be more expensive, say about USD 120, but then you get at least two pops before sleeping and one in the morning. Once you get more experienced you can get better deals (or you discover the more high end places and pay more for those). A total budget of about USD 2500 will see you through 13 days. For transportation, your budget can be small: even the longest rides on the Skytrain or Metro will only set you back a few dollars. Taxis are quite cheap too (ALWAYS use the meter in Bangkok; there are NO EXCEPTIONS to this rule!) but avoid using tuk-tuks in Bangkok. If any "friendly" Thai suggest you something that involves a tuk-tuk, 99% chances that it is a scam. Smile and walk away and take a taxi.

[QUOTE=IAmGine;1891035]6. Language? I speak no Thai. Is this a small or major problem?[/QUOTE]No problem, provided you stay in the more touristy areas. Outside of those, a few words of Thai come in handy, but even without you can manage to get serviced for food and drinks.

If I could get the right visa I old be very tempted to move to LOS, but as I am not 50 this is not possible. Stay the in Jomtien last year for 6 months. I have spoken to the embassy in 2 countries. Question is, where can I go live that has weather & cost of living similar to LOS but without the visa hassles. I like Asian women but prefer the South American look, a little junk in the trunk & some kind of a decent chest.

Thanks.

[QUOTE=Dasisextra;1899811]If I could get the right visa I old be very tempted to move to LOS, but as I am not 50 this is not possible. Stay the in Jomtien last year for 6 months. I have spoken to the embassy in 2 countries. Question is, where can I go live that has weather & cost of living similar to LOS but without the visa hassles. I like Asian women but prefer the South American look, a little junk in the trunk & some kind of a decent chest.

Thanks.[/QUOTE]There is also something called an "educational visa". You can apply for it if you want to study Thai language and culture.

[URL]http://thaiembdc.org/consular-services/non-immigrant-visas/non-immigrant-visa-category-ed/[/URL]

In essence you pay some educational institute a "tuition fee" and they give you an invitation letter and (later) confirmation that you attended the classes. Wash, rince, repeat for as long as necessary.

Some years ago the tuition fee used to be about USD 1000. I have no idea what they charge now.

[QUOTE=Dasisextra;1899811]If I could get the right visa I old be very tempted to move to LOS, but as I am not 50 this is not possible. Stay the in Jomtien last year for 6 months. I have spoken to the embassy in 2 countries. Question is, where can I go live that has weather & cost of living similar to LOS but without the visa hassles. I like Asian women but prefer the South American look, a little junk in the trunk & some kind of a decent chest.

Thanks.[/QUOTE]You can go to Cambodia. Very cheap for a visa for 1 year. Cambodia is one of the easiest countries in the world to emigrate to, visa-wise. Once you have your first 30-day ordinary visa for Cambodia, you can extend it from inside the country for 1, 3, 6, or 12 months.

[URL]http://www.movetocambodia.com/planning-your-move-to-cambodia/cambodia-visas/[/URL]

My apologies if this has been asked before but what is really considered ST and LT in terms of time?

The reason I ask if that I've had a few ST girls stay as long as LT girls, if not even much longer. For that reason I tell every girl ST now.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;1904800]My apologies if this has been asked before but what is really considered ST and LT in terms of time?

The reason I ask if that I've had a few ST girls stay as long as LT girls, if not even much longer. For that reason I tell every girl ST now.[/QUOTE]Its gone rapid time now as they screw more guys per night for more money and rates are more near 5000 bahts for a quick screw, you can get cheaper in Pattaya but not BKK nowadays.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;1904800]My apologies if this has been asked before but what is really considered ST and LT in terms of time?

The reason I ask if that I've had a few ST girls stay as long as LT girls, if not even much longer. For that reason I tell every girl ST now.[/QUOTE]ST is usually a few hours or one pop whichever comes first.

LT is traditionally overnight and 2 pops before sleeping and one more to deal with the morning wood.

But nothing is writ in stone! Negotiation skills will trump any "tradition" and you are always best off if you clearly explain what you expect of her.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1905089]ST is usually a few hours or one pop whichever comes first.[/QUOTE]Thanks Wolv. Appears that my ST from say 10 pm to 7 am is not uncommon then as I am getting in 1 pop either up front or after a night of partying.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;1905461]Thanks Wolv. Appears that my ST from say 10 pm to 7 am is not uncommon then as I am getting in 1 pop either up front or after a night of partying.[/QUOTE]I don't think that is the norm, but it just sometimes so happens that she likes to sleep in a nice well ariconditioned room with someone who isn't going to ravage her all night. Even bargirls can get tired and if she already reached her dayly / weekly / monthly quotum of barfines and ladydrinks, she might want to have some fun times and then take it easy in the bed of a nice guy.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;1905461]Thanks Wolv. Appears that my ST from say 10 pm to 7 am is not uncommon then as I am getting in 1 pop either up front or after a night of partying.[/QUOTE]It appears that you are getting Long Time then. You are asking for Short Time but the girls are probably liking you (especially if you are taking them out to party?) and just staying longer. ST definitely does not last 9 hours. For the most part, Short Time is when you take the girl to fuck, bust off, then go your separate ways. A quickie.

Trackable SIM cards for foreigners possibly on its way.

[URL]http://pattayaone.net/pattaya-news/229640/new-sim-cards-will-trace-foreigners-proposed/[/URL]

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;1920384]Trackable SIM cards for foreigners possibly on its way.

[URL]http://pattayaone.net/pattaya-news/229640/new-sim-cards-will-trace-foreigners-proposed/[/URL][/QUOTE]What a load of utter nonsense. All sim-cards are tracked. That's how the mobile network works. If the provider doesn't know where you are, he cannot connect the call to you.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1920426]What a load of utter nonsense. All sim-cards are tracked. That's how the mobile network works. If the provider doesn't know where you are, he cannot connect the call to you.[/QUOTE]I think this has something to do with the SIM Card being registered to an individual, thus liking the two for whatever purposes the government wishes.

[QUOTE=SirWilliam4;1920554]I think this has something to do with the SIM Card being registered to an individual, thus liking the two for whatever purposes the government wishes.[/QUOTE]That's not what the article says. It was mentioning tracking. You are talking about registration.

The minister seemed to say that foreigners can buy sim cards in Thailand now without registration, whereas Thai need to register when they buy a card.

Of course a foreigner (and even a Thai) can always bring in a foreign pre-paid sim card bought in a country that doesn't require registration.

So the whole scheme is failing before it is even implemented.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1920670]That's not what the article says. It was mentioning tracking. You are talking about registration.

The minister seemed to say that foreigners can buy sim cards in Thailand now without registration, whereas Thai need to register when they buy a card.

Of course a foreigner (and even a Thai) can always bring in a foreign pre-paid sim card bought in a country that doesn't require registration.

So the whole scheme is failing before it is even implemented.[/QUOTE]Are you sure that foreign pre paid SIMs will work here? I would have suspected that they would not have any International Roaming (without actually knowing anything). My foreign SIMs can work but they are registered with monthly accounts and have international roaming enabled.

My old unregistered SIMs in Thailand, all ceased working at some point, requiring me to register who I am. I don't say I really see the point in it.

Does anybody know where to buy the ED drug Stendra (anavafil) in Bangkok?

It's easy to get Viagra or Cialis without prescription, for example at certain pharmacies in the Silom / Sala Daeng / Patpong area.

But I've been to quite a few and none of them have Stendra.

The advantage of Stendra is that it acts fast (15 minutes).

The viagra (kamigra) gel will act quicker than the pill, just an option if you strike out on the Stendra. The pharmacy next to bullys has a few flavors.

[QUOTE=EricSwiss;1923478]Does anybody know where to buy the ED drug Stendra (anavafil) in Bangkok?

It's easy to get Viagra or Cialis without prescription, for example at certain pharmacies in the Silom / Sala Daeng / Patpong area.

But I've been to quite a few and none of them have Stendra.

The advantage of Stendra is that it acts fast (15 minutes).[/QUOTE]

I still haven't ever been asked for ID when getting a SIM at the airport DTAC kiosk. This seems like another all talk and only an occasional show of action when needed for the news. Given the issues BMA has had even keeping closed circuit cameras up and running I can't imagine any mobile surveillance is going to be particularly effective. The part of surveillance that gets often over looked is that it isn't about collecting information anymore, it's storing it and analyzing it. Everyone casts such a wide net now they collect way more than would ever be of use. Data collection is significantly outpacing both processing and storage now. Sure they might get lucky, but unless you know you are doing something shady and under suspicion already you have nothing to worry about. Sure some idiot with no life in a bunker may be reading your emails or watching your sex tape but honestly if that makes some poor soul happy they can have it. Don't need to track me, I will be wherever the hot thai girls are, look for the farang with the big ass smile on his face, hahaha.

I will give them this, when you announce your surveillance program you don't need to worry about a snowden problem. Makes it a lot easier to implement.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1923326]Are you sure that foreign pre paid SIMs will work here? I would have suspected that they would not have any International Roaming (without actually knowing anything). My foreign SIMs can work but they are registered with monthly accounts and have international roaming enabled.

My old unregistered SIMs in Thailand, all ceased working at some point, requiring me to register who I am. I don't say I really see the point in it.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=MichaelSamuel;1923489]The viagra (kamigra) gel will act quicker than the pill, just an option if you strike out on the Stendra. The pharmacy next to bullys has a few flavors.[/QUOTE]I'm not really into gels, I prefer popping pills, but thanks for the recommendation about the pharmacies near Bully's Pub at Nana. I haven't checked them out yet, but I imagine that they are not the sort to ask for a prescription.

[QUOTE=EricSwiss;1923478]Does anybody know where to buy the ED drug Stendra (anavafil) in Bangkok?

It's easy to get Viagra or Cialis without prescription, for example at certain pharmacies in the Silom / Sala Daeng / Patpong area.

But I've been to quite a few and none of them have Stendra.The advantage of Stendra is that it acts fast (15 minutes).[/QUOTE]Eric, It's a second generation ED drug. And like most second generation drugs it has both advantages and disadvantages. It's positive side is a quicker onset and not affected by food intake; additionally no unique side effects like low back pain (I wonder if it could be related to all that pelvic thrusting?) or visual changes (beer goggles). It's negative side is shorter half-life so it's duration of action is shorter, 6 h vs 12 h for sidenafil. Time to onset can be improved with gels / liquid preparations. Ranked from fast to last. Liquids, capsules, pills. Avanafil is a niche product and without significant advantage for most users. Usually only the blockbuster drugs provide enough financial incentive for a manufacturer to copy them.

[QUOTE=MichaelSamuel;1923492]I still haven't ever been asked for ID when getting a SIM at the airport DTAC kiosk. [/QUOTE]Did a quick search and could not find the answer. Have a buddy coming in next week and want to give him directions. Which gate is the DTAC phone kiosk located at at Suvarnabhumi?

In the arrivals hall after you clear customs it's about in the middle. Next to ais and true is a bit further down. Is big booth so should be easy to find. Ais and dtac are exact same price. So users choice. One thing I did pick up last time is that there is more baht on the card then you may realize. I got a 7 day card last time when had a 10 day stay. Then day 8,9,10 I got a txt with a code to rely yes for another day service for 500 mb for 24 hours at 19 hb. Don't know how much was left on card but at least 60 since I did it for 3 days before I left. So in summary of you are staying more than 7 but less than 14 probably better to just do 7 then pay as you go. If you run it down just pop into any 7-11 and ask to put another Dx20 thb for whatever you have left. This was dtac at least.

Also just FYI for anyone who may get a free card from airline (quatar) after activating just go into any 7-11 to add funds. My first trip took me 2 days to figure out any 7-11 can add value to all the big carriers.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;1923510]Did a quick search and could not find the answer. Have a buddy coming in next week and want to give him directions. Which gate is the DTAC phone kiosk located at at Suvarnabhumi?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;1923510]Did a quick search and could not find the answer. Have a buddy coming in next week and want to give him directions. Which gate is the DTAC phone kiosk located at at Suvarnabhumi?[/QUOTE]I think AIS, DTAC, True are all near each other close to Gate / door 5 to 7, i.e. Roughly in the middle. Impossible to miss them, even without knowing the door number precisely.

At AIS I had to show Passport to get a new number. I am surprised to hear this is not the case at DTAC, however its no big deal.

[QUOTE=EricSwiss;1923495]I'm not really into gels, I prefer popping pills, but thanks for the recommendation about the pharmacies near Bully's Pub at Nana. I haven't checked them out yet, but I imagine that they are not the sort to ask for a prescription.[/QUOTE]I'm not at all sure Viagra and its friends is on the "prescription only" list in Thailand.

[QUOTE=EricSwiss;1923495]I'm not really into gels, I prefer popping pills, but thanks for the recommendation about the pharmacies near Bully's Pub at Nana. I haven't checked them out yet, but I imagine that they are not the sort to ask for a prescription.[/QUOTE]This is the pharmacy.

A box of 50 kamagra gels at 1500 baht.

[QUOTE=RandyMurican;1923502]Eric, It's a second generation ED drug. And like most second generation drugs it has both advantages and disadvantages. It's positive side is a quicker onset and not affected by food intake; additionally no unique side effects like low back pain (I wonder if it could be related to all that pelvic thrusting?) or visual changes (beer goggles). It's negative side is shorter half-life so it's duration of action is shorter, 6 h vs 12 h for sidenafil. Time to onset can be improved with gels / liquid preparations. Ranked from fast to last. Liquids, capsules, pills. Avanafil is a niche product and without significant advantage for most users. Usually only the blockbuster drugs provide enough financial incentive for a manufacturer to copy them.[/QUOTE]I am certain I read that Sildenafil half life is 4 hours. No idea where 12 comes in. Perhaps a different one. Action time is about 20 to 30 minutes.

To EricSwiss, the pharmacy is the 2nd one from the petrol pump near Bully's. I never heard of Anavafil so can't comment on that.

It seems to me if you decide you will fuck a girl, you have much more than 15 minutes to BF her, get her to Hotel, shower etc. If its not to 30 minutes yet, start with kissing and DATY. I don't see a problem.

If you decide to go to an Oily, take pill well before you leave home. However if you are having too many fucks in the day, just take the pill sufficiently in advance of actually putting the dick in. Once I know I will fuck I always take a lot more time than 15 minutes before actually get started. I believe I read Sildenafil is not recommended for more than one use per day, however probably still works OK.

Scripts not needed in Thailand at Pharmacy recommended for this type of thing. Scripts may be needed for Valium or may not even be available.

Hi guys,

Checked the abbreviations list, but can someone explain to me the difference between an 'oily' and a 'soapy' please?

Another one. What's a 'coyote'?

Thanks.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1923798]I'm not at all sure Viagra and its friends is on the "prescription only" list in Thailand.[/QUOTE]I have been refused Viagra at some of the chain pharmacies because I did not have a prescription. I'm fairly certain that is the law, but one that seems to have a low compliance rate, particularly among non-chain pharmacies.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1923950]I am certain I read that Sildenafil half life is 4 hours. No idea where 12 comes in. Perhaps a different one. Action time is about 20 to 30 minutes.
[/QUOTE]Found this graph. Shows Sildenafil works to some degree quite quickly provided no food was eaten. Slower after food.

[URL]http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1874258/figure/fig02/[/URL]

Personally I don't like to eat food before sex. It is going to detrimental to the energy levels.

Dick should have some reasonable levels of natural workings early in a session without the booster fully kicking in yet. So I doubt any great problems from workings time delay providing food was not taken before or during the dose time. Could be useful to have an alternate medication not thought to be affected by food, in cases where food was eaten.

This is really powerful stuff, Sildenafil. A little dose goes a loooong way. Seems there are a lot of different opinions about which medications work better. Avanafil I read was rated as much weaker by some and better by others.
I found Cialis to make very little noticeable difference for me (just normal erections) and perhaps cause indgestion, and Sildenafil to be very powerful, and never tried any others. I don't like gel forms.
So it seems that it should be a case of each person to their own, whatever works for them and gives the effect looking for. Others prefer Cialis.

In my case I am very non sensitive person who takes long time to cum, specially for multiple sex sessions in a day. No real issues with GF (bareback) and never more than one session.
So I find Sildenafil assists for long session sex when have been fucking a bit too much and taking too long to cum. In particular it assists with regaining an erection very quickly after stopping sex activity completely for 5 to 10 minutes to allow time for sensitivity to return. Stopping for several minutes and restarting is my major technique for any cases where I was having difficulty to orgasm. It helps a lot. Obviously irrelevant for all those guys with very sensitive dicks who cum very easily.

J.R. Pharmacy as pictured by Bionicman near to Bully's is my go to place for all types of medications, without prescription. I first heard about it from Giotto on this forum years ago. There are some dangerous things they refuse to sell. There are also some fake stuff believed not to actually work, that they will not sell, as would spoil their reputation. They do very large volumes of business and pretty fair prices. Maybe not the absolute cheapest but very reliable. They have cheap generics and also sell more expensive brand names. So be careful what you ask for. Right now, I have no meds at all except for indigestion Ranitidine (for emergency use), so need to pay them a visit soon, to stock up on various meds, handy, on occasion.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1924033]
J.R. Pharmacy as pictured by Bionicman near to Bully's is my go to place for all types of medications, without prescription. I first heard about it from Giotto on this forum years ago. There are some dangerous things they refuse to sell. There are also some fake stuff believed not to actually work, that they will not sell, as would spoil their reputation. They do very large volumes of business and pretty fair prices. Maybe not the absolute cheapest but very reliable. They have cheap generics and also sell more expensive brand names. So be careful what you ask for. Right now, I have no meds at all except for indigestion Ranitidine (for emergency use), so need to pay them a visit soon, to stock up on various meds, handy, on occasion.[/QUOTE]Very true, despite the facts they are easy going, they do take care and the qualified pharmacist in there doesn't give out drugs just because you ask for them.

Friend of mine was looking for some testerone and there were issues about the dosage etc. She discouraged him to buy it as might have been not appropriate. Recommending he refers to his doctor back in Udon.

On the other hand they sell kamagra and sidenafil just as you ask for it.

Taking into account one can buy as much as he wants from uncontrolled street vendors, with no issues on quanto row one buys (the more, the merrier), they even represent a safety net for the consumers. Better you buy the genuine from them. Regardless of quantities possibly exceeding the "normal" - then buy whatever fake from a street vendor.

They are also aware that farang buying a full box or two are often for other people back home and / or to have some stock as BKK is not around the corner from the residence place of the farang.

[QUOTE=Bunnies;1923998]Hi guys,

Checked the abbreviations list, but can someone explain to me the difference between an 'oily' and a 'soapy' please?

Another one. What's a 'coyote'?

Thanks.[/QUOTE]An "oiy" is the archetypical naughty massage place which offers different types of massage from the classic Thai massage to the oil or lotion massages. The fun start when the massage lady after treating your legs, arms and back tells you to "turn over please". That is when the offer for a happy ending is made. HJ and BJ are almost always on offer. Many will even do FS. Some oilies are of course only thinly disguised brothels where the massage part is skipped and the fun starts right away.

A "soapy" is a place that gives you a bath service. Think of the venerable "Annies". There they start with showering you, then putting you on a plastic (air) mattress and the girl will "soap up" and slither her body all over you. A real body-to-body experience. A titjob, handjob or blowjob is usually part of this performance. Next you take a bath with her. It either allows you to recover from your first cum on the mattress or she'll make you finish now. Then you are showered again and toweled off. The session finishes with FS on the bed. Soapies do not hide at all that you are here for the sex, whereas "oilies" are a bit more secretive.

A "coyote" (also sometimes called "agency girl") is usually a better than average looking girl in an agogo club who will dance on stage and sit with the customers (when offered a laydrink) but who will (usually) not be barfinable. In other words, you cannot take her out and her main task is to make you drink more (and offer more ladydrinks) than you intended. Lately however, it seems that many "coyotes" can be taken home too but at high prices. Even their barfine is much higher.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1924366]An "oiy" is the archetypical naughty massage place which offers different types of massage from the classic Thai massage to the oil or lotion massages. The fun start when the massage lady after treating your legs, arms and back tells you to "turn over please". That is when the offer for a happy ending is made. HJ and BJ are almost always on offer. Many will even do FS. Some oilies are of course only thinly disguised brothels where the massage part is skipped and the fun starts right away.

A "soapy" is a place that gives you a bath service. Think of the venerable "Annies". There they start with showering you, then putting you on a plastic (air) mattress and the girl will "soap up" and slither her body all over you. A real body-to-body experience. A titjob, handjob or blowjob is usually part of this performance. Next you take a bath with her. It either allows you to recover from your first cum on the mattress or she'll make you finish now. Then you are showered again and toweled off. The session finishes with FS on the bed. Soapies do not hide at all that you are here for the sex, whereas "oilies" are a bit more secretive.

A "coyote" (also sometimes called "agency girl") is usually a better than average looking girl in an agogo club who will dance on stage and sit with the customers (when offered a laydrink) but who will (usually) not be barfinable. In other words, you cannot take her out and her main task is to make you drink more (and offer more ladydrinks) than you intended. Lately however, it seems that many "coyotes" can be taken home too but at high prices. Even their barfine is much higher.[/QUOTE]Now here is an example of what ISG is all about. Helping out the newbies, providing some foundational information for an aspiring monger. Good on you Wolvenvacht.

And Bunnies, I hope you repay the favor with plenty of field reports.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1924366]An "oiy" is the archetypical naughty massage place which offers different types of massage from the classic Thai massage to the oil or lotion massages. The fun start when the massage lady after treating your legs, arms and back tells you to "turn over please". That is when the offer for a happy ending is made. HJ and BJ are almost always on offer. Many will even do FS. Some oilies are of course only thinly disguised brothels where the massage part is skipped and the fun starts right away.

A "soapy" is a place that gives you a bath service. Think of the venerable "Annies". There they start with showering you, then putting you on a plastic (air) mattress and the girl will "soap up" and slither her body all over you. A real body-to-body experience. A titjob, handjob or blowjob is usually part of this performance. Next you take a bath with her. It either allows you to recover from your first cum on the mattress or she'll make you finish now. Then you are showered again and toweled off. The session finishes with FS on the bed. Soapies do not hide at all that you are here for the sex, whereas "oilies" are a bit more secretive.

A "coyote" (also sometimes called "agency girl") is usually a better than average looking girl in an agogo club who will dance on stage and sit with the customers (when offered a laydrink) but who will (usually) not be barfinable. In other words, you cannot take her out and her main task is to make you drink more (and offer more ladydrinks) than you intended. Lately however, it seems that many "coyotes" can be taken home too but at high prices. Even their barfine is much higher.[/QUOTE]Nothing to add for Oilies.

"Soapies" are officially called "Aap Op Nuat" which means bathe, bake or steam, and massage. Sometimes called Turkish bath house. Main characteristics of a normal Soapy in Thailand:
* An area where girls group to be chosen usually with tiers and sometimes behind glass like a fishbowl. Girls sit patiently for long periods of time till chosen or called out. Multiple areas for girls of different price ranges.
* An area where customers can sit to take time to choose the girl, often drinks and food can be taken while relaxing and making a decision. Maybe the odd place has standing only. Not good.
* Rooms with large bathtub / Jacuzzi for bathing very thoroughly with naked girl, also with couch and TV, also with doublebed for sex, and whoops also potentially for Thai massage. LOL.
* Not many places remain that provide body slide massage on an air mattress. Just a very few.

At some Oilies, you can be bathed by the girl in the bath but still are far more like Oilies than like Soapies. Its a grey area for me. Even Annies is like a cross between a Soapy and an Oily in my view. Not in true Soapy style. You cannot sit and eat and drink while viewing girls in the fishbowl, and rooms are too small, lacking a proper bed. You can get a room with bath at Addict. Not much difference in style except that Addict has showers as well. You are better off without the bath at an Oily, as the bath just wastes too much time filling. Alternatively take your other activities while the bath fills.

Coyote refers to a particular type of dancer and style of sexy dancing in bars and clubs and there is a standard outfit where girls wear, a top that covers the breasts sometimes totally, sometimes with cleavage showing, and they wear very short cutoff shorts, sometimes wear braces, and usually boots rather than shoes. Originally Coyote girls were not officially available for sex, but some may have been unofficially. They did not want to be classified as hookers. Yes High barfines to take them away from the club in places where barfinable, but need to check if they are willing to go for sex or not. Cowboy and Nana have many girls referred to as Coyotes that clearly are not. They may not dress in correct style and even if they do, don't know how to dance Coyote style at all. Just trying to appear higher class than a standard bargirl, which does not necessarily work.

J are Pharmacy next to Bully's,can someone Please give me some directions to this place? I do not know where or what Bullys is?

Thanks.

[QUOTE=Chukar;1924439]J are Pharmacy next to Bully's,can someone Please give me some directions to this place? I do not know where or what Bullys is?

Thanks.[/QUOTE]OMG!

Get your Google Map and walk from Soi 4 to Soi 2, keep your head turned left and if still can't find it, you better Goolge for a Specsavers shop, or Top Charoen of course.

[QUOTE=Chukar;1924439]J are Pharmacy next to Bully's,can someone Please give me some directions to this place? I do not know where or what Bullys is?

Thanks.[/QUOTE]If you can use the web and ISG, you had better learn to use Google Maps as well.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1924033]J.R. Pharmacy as pictured by Bionicman near to Bully's is my go to place for all types of medications, without prescription. I first heard about it from Giotto on this forum years ago. There are some dangerous things they refuse to sell. There are also some fake stuff believed not to actually work, that they will not sell, as would spoil their reputation. They do very large volumes of business and pretty fair prices. Maybe not the absolute cheapest but very reliable. They have cheap generics and also sell more expensive brand names. So be careful what you ask for. Right now, I have no meds at all except for indigestion Ranitidine (for emergency use), so need to pay them a visit soon, to stock up on various meds, handy, on occasion.[/QUOTE]Apologies, and a correction.

The correct Pharmacy Name for all your erectile boost and other medications is Charoen Pharmacy. Its right next to J. R. Pharmacy and closest to Bully's.

I asked about Esomeprazole (Beta Blocker) but they did not have a generic, as yet. Nexium brand name was expensive (845 Baht for a pack), so better to buy O. S. Omeprazole (the previous generation) is much cheaper as is Ranitidine.

Sidegra 100 MG pack of 4 tablets was 200 Baht (probably discount if you buy a lot). Note that most people do not need a whole 100 MG tablet. It is very strong. Many will find as little as a quarter of a tablet can have a strong effect. Others may find half a tablet is right for them. Depends on whether food was eaten what dose is suitable. You can buy 50 Mg tablets a different colour code, but it is cheaper to buy 100mg and split them in two.

Suppose you use half a tablet per occasion. That will work out to 25 Baht each time. Less than a dollar. That is pretty good since Genuine brand name Viagra tablet originally cost maybe 10 to 20 times that amount.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1925011]Apologies, and a correction.

The correct Pharmacy Name for all your erectile boost and other medications is Charoen Pharmacy. Its right next to J. R. Pharmacy and closest to Bully's.

I asked about Esomeprazole (Beta Blocker) but they did not have a generic, as yet. Nexium brand name was expensive (845 Baht for a pack), so better to buy O. S. Omeprazole (the previous generation) is much cheaper as is Ranitidine.

Sidegra 100 MG pack of 4 tablets was 200 Baht (probably discount if you buy a lot). Note that most people do not need a whole 100 MG tablet. It is very strong. Many will find as little as a quarter of a tablet can have a strong effect. Others may find half a tablet is right for them. Depends on whether food was eaten what dose is suitable. You can buy 50 Mg tablets a different colour code, but it is cheaper to buy 100mg and split them in two.

Suppose you use half a tablet per occasion. That will work out to 25 Baht each time. Less than a dollar. That is pretty good since Genuine brand name Viagra tablet originally cost maybe 10 to 20 times that amount.[/QUOTE]Not to get too far in the weeds but. Esomeprazole and omeprazole are classified as PPI's (Proton Pump Inhibitors). Beta-blockers are cardiac meds used for rate control and high blood pressure (not great for that purpose). Metoprolol and atenolol are examples of this group. On the other hand, an older group of drugs used for reflux (GERD) are the H2 blockers. This group reduces gastric acidity but not so profoundly as PPI's. Don't take a beta-blocker for your heartburn as it won't help and you could find your heart rate in the 60's plus a blunted response to exercise. They can also make erectile dysfunction worse. My last pass through BKK I did stop in Charoen Pharm and picked up some sidegra which had been hard to obtain in the other pharmacy's I had been using. So thanks for the tip! I'll be back in town shortly and doing a bulk purchase and I'll make an attempt to negotiate a better price. If it is a significant discount I'll post a pricing update.

Randy 'Murican.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1925011]Apologies, and a correction.

The correct Pharmacy Name for all your erectile boost and other medications is Charoen Pharmacy. Its right next to J. R. Pharmacy and closest to Bully's.

Sidegra 100 MG pack of 4 tablets was 200 Baht (probably discount if you buy a lot). Note that most people do not need a whole 100 MG tablet. It is very strong. Many will find as little as a quarter of a tablet can have a strong effect. Others may find half a tablet is right for them. Depends on whether food was eaten what dose is suitable. You can buy 50 Mg tablets a different colour code, but it is cheaper to buy 100mg and split them in two.

Suppose you use half a tablet per occasion. That will work out to 25 Baht each time. Less than a dollar. That is pretty good since Genuine brand name Viagra tablet originally cost maybe 10 to 20 times that amount.[/QUOTE]Thank you for the precision about Charoen Pharmacy vs. JR pharmacy at Nana. It is true that Viagra / sildenafil takes about 30 minutes to kick in on an empty stomach. In case the pharmacy doesn't have the one that acts in 15 minutes, Stendra / Avanafil, which seems pretty hard to find at least in Thailand, that's probably the best solution.

[QUOTE=RandyMurican;1925045]Not to get too far in the weeds but. Esomeprazole and omeprazole are classified as PPI's (Proton Pump Inhibitors). Beta-blockers are cardiac meds used for rate control and high blood pressure (not great for that purpose).
Randy 'Murican.[/QUOTE]Yep thanks for that. The fancy names of the purpose got me mixed up. I did want Proton Pump, in layman's terms Indigestion medicine. I occasionally get Indigestion from too much lemon juice or Caiparinhas.

[QUOTE=EricSwiss;1925115]Thank you for the precision about Charoen Pharmacy vs. JR pharmacy at Nana. It is true that Viagra / sildenafil takes about 30 minutes to kick in on an empty stomach. In case the pharmacy doesn't have the one that acts in 15 minutes, Stendra / Avanafil, which seems pretty hard to find at least in Thailand, that's probably the best solution.[/QUOTE]I have never seen Stendra / Avanafil but read the lead time varies a bit not always as quick as 15 minutes. Okay If its 15 minutes for you.

I never really need as little as 15 minutes warning. The only girl I get sex with without the warning, is the GF, and I don't use meds with her as she does not like to go beyond 40 minutes sex sessions, by which time she usually managed multiple orgasms as is extremely sensitive, and claims to be exhausted. LOL She knows my dick too well. She would know something is strange if it was too rock hard too quickly, which would be the case for me if medicated. She is supposed to believe I never have any use for meds any more at all, so they are well hidden. Occasionally my hard on is less than excellent if very tired, or too much fucking recently. However I try to get GF to do sex in the daytime, not so much late at night.

Experienced hookers will possibly suspect when guys are on meds too based on how fast dick goes up and how long it stays up, even though guys vary a lot. Hookers hate guys taking meds because allows them to fuck for too long. LOL

If in a bar and I want a med boost, I simply take the fragment, finish my last drink, while waiting for girl to go get changed, pay the bill, head to Hotel, both get showered, then kissing and DATY foreplay. Good kissing always makes me hard quickly, assuming not totally fucked out already. All of this easily consumes 30 minutes, before I even get to a blowjob or sex. Usually I can feel the start of something, a fuzziness in my head at 20 to 25 min mark, so I know its already working by then. This usually happens before I get to the Hotel, as I try to remember not to eat food before sex.

If I want a boost for a marathon sex at Oily visit, I simply take it before I leave home. Half life is 4 hours so problem for it to last, even if take time to find the right place and girl.

My recommendation for boosting your sex energy, is simply to lose weight. I lost 14 kilos and made a huge difference, simply by Carbohydrate restriction and total meal size restriction over several months. Girlfriend stopped calling me Moo Uan ("fat piggy"). Also greatly cutting down or eliminating wanking is a big help. I don't take HJ from girls either.

[QUOTE=EricSwiss;1925115] It is true that Viagra / sildenafil takes about 30 minutes to kick in on an empty stomach. In case the pharmacy doesn't have the one that acts in 15 minutes, Stendra / Avanafil, which seems pretty hard to find at least in Thailand, that's probably the best solution.[/QUOTE]Even though the write-ups on the erection aid meds I usually use, Cialis or generic, states it doesn't matter if it is taken with or without food, with whatever drink, alcohol or non, I have noticed it does work faster (15-20 minutes max) and more effectively on a relatively empty stomach, maybe 3-4 hours since my previous meal, and when I take it with liquid no colder than room tempurature, preferably plain water.

I suspect the tempurature of the liquid with which one takes these meds, not only Cialis or generic, as a potential factor in how quickly and effectively it works is a detail that has not been fully or officially researched or mentioned. However, I have noticed the manufacurer's fairly common recommendation for emergency relief in the case of prolonged erection (lasting more than 4 hours or something like that) is to drink lots of ice cold water.

So is that an indication that there is a known inhibiting factor to mixing ice cold liquids with the meds? Could be. I know my personal experience has been it kicks in faster when I have downed the tablet with liquid that is more room tempurature rather than ice cold. Unfortunately, that is not typically what is sitting before us on the table when we take the tabs in Bangkok, is it? Lol

[QUOTE=EihTooms;1925590]
I suspect the tempurature of the liquid with which one takes these meds, not only Cialis or generic, as a potential factor in how quickly and effectively it works is a detail that has not been fully or officially researched or mentioned. However, I have noticed the manufacurer's fairly common recommendation for emergency relief in the case of prolonged erection (lasting more than 4 hours or something like that) is to drink lots of ice cold water.
[/QUOTE]I am surprised, since cold water or other liquid should warm up in the stomach reasonably quickly. Obviously tablets dissolve a bit quicker in hot water. We could recommend taking meds with a glass of hot water. LOL Might shave a few minutes off the time to be effective. I will ask at the bar for a glass of hot water. LOL (if they have it) and see how many minutes till my head feels fuzzy. Could be as little as 15 to 20 minutes.

I think gel is supposed to be faster due to lack of needing dissolve time. I have taken med fragments with no liquid relying on saliva only. Seems to work okay Crushed Kamagra tablets can taste bad but Cialis taste is okay I could just chew on them, although they were not very worthwhile for me. So never buy them anymore. Kamagra was far more powerful for me, being a guy that takes a long time to cum, and caused less indigestion.

I think guys should try several ones to see which is best for them and least side effects (like indigestion and headaches).

I'm a fan of Vardenafil (Levitra in America) though it is expensive in the states. I like the fact that it gives me rock hard erections, and the kind of length and girth that I had in my youth. Also, it seems to stay in the system longer than Sildenafil. If I pop one for the evenings festivities, I always awake with a rock hard erection the next morning, if not in the middle of the night. Any suggestions regarding availability in BKK or Pattaya?

I've tried Tadalafil (Cialis) and have mixed feelings about it. It lacks the unpleasant side effects of Vardenafil and Sildenafil. But, it also gives mediocre results. Erections, but not spectacular or on demand. It gets you there, but slowly. A good choice if you have a girlfriend or enjoying a relaxing weekend with someone pleasant. But, not raging a hard on. Not a good choice for a short-time experience which requires a quick response. I wonder if I need a stronger dose.

One thing I don't like about Levitra is the unpleasant rush you can sometimes get. I popped one on the way to Energia in Medellin last April and chased it down with a Red Bull. Maybe the Red Bull was the problem but as I approached the brothel I felt my heart pumping hard and felt uncomfortable. I took a long walk around the block until the edge kind of came off and I felt normal. Once I got inside Energia, I ordered a double Scotch and I was good. I did the same thing last year in Berlin. Chased a Levitra down with a Red Bull before meeting a freelance escort. I felt great, not to mention my experience with her was awesome. But, it went awry that night in Medellin, so I popped those benign Cialis for the next three days. BTW, Sildenafil is dirt cheap in Colombia. About $1 for two 50 MG pills. Available without no hassle at any farmacia, based on the experience of others as well as my own.

[QUOTE=Eszpresszo;1926495]I'm a fan of Vardenafil (Levitra in America) though it is expensive in the states. I like the fact that it gives me rock hard erections, and the kind of length and girth that I had in my youth. Also, it seems to stay in the system longer than Sildenafil. If I pop one for the evenings festivities, I always awake with a rock hard erection the next morning, if not in the middle of the night. Any suggestions regarding availability in BKK or Pattaya?

I've tried Tadalafil (Cialis) and have mixed feelings about it. It lacks the unpleasant side effects of Vardenafil and Sildenafil. But, it also gives mediocre results. Erections, but not spectacular or on demand. It gets you there, but slowly. A good choice if you have a girlfriend or enjoying a relaxing weekend with someone pleasant. But, not raging a hard on. Not a good choice for a short-time experience which requires a quick response. I wonder if I need a stronger dose.

One thing I don't like about Levitra is the unpleasant rush you can sometimes get. I popped one on the way to Energia in Medellin last April and chased it down with a Red Bull. Maybe the Red Bull was the problem but as I approached the brothel I felt my heart pumping hard and felt uncomfortable. I took a long walk around the block until the edge kind of came off and I felt normal. Once I got inside Energia, I ordered a double Scotch and I was good. I did the same thing last year in Berlin. Chased a Levitra down with a Red Bull before meeting a freelance escort. I felt great, not to mention my experience with her was awesome. But, it went awry that night in Medellin, so I popped those benign Cialis for the next three days. BTW, Sildenafil is dirt cheap in Colombia. About $1 for two 50 MG pills. Available without no hassle at any farmacia, based on the experience of others as well as my own.[/QUOTE]My Doc gives me a mixture of Vardenafil 75 MG and Yohimbi 2 MG, in the form of a sublingual troche. Works great and lasts 18 hours. Never any residual effects like headaches or acid stomach. And I am no spring chicken at 70. But it works and that is what counts. Yes expensive as I buy in the US as a scrip.

When you absorb sublingual you get the full effects of the drug. When take with a drink the dilution factor kicks in and then the stomach has to break down. You loose a lot of the strength of the drug.

I have tried the gel but that is not that good for some reason. You can get at any vendor on the Suk. 50 baht.

RL.

Trying to decide where to go for next Visa run. Last time I visited Singapore. This time trying to decide between Ho Chi Minh, Jakarta (free accommodations downtown), Phnom Penh, or back to Singapore. I left Kuala Lumpur off as I will be going there another time. Not interested in Philippines.

Good looking girls over price is the main criteria since I will only be there 3-4 days. I prefer cute faces and to look under 25. I prefer light skinned girls. I have a thing for Vietnamese girls. I prefer window shopping in a gogo club like Baccara over iBar. I enjoy brothels / laufhaus.

Suggestions?

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;1926867]Trying to decide where to go for next Visa run. Last time I visited Singapore. This time trying to decide between Ho Chi Minh, Jakarta (free accommodations downtown), Phnom Penh, or back to Singapore. I left Kuala Lumpur off as I will be going there another time. Not interested in Philippines.

Good looking girls over price is the main criteria since I will only be there 3-4 days. I prefer cute faces and to look under 25. I prefer light skinned girls. I have a thing for Vietnamese girls. I prefer window shopping in a gogo club like Baccara over iBar. I enjoy brothels / laufhaus.

Suggestions?[/QUOTE]I have always had good success in pulling some cute Vetnamese SYT from Ipanema bar in Orchard Tower at Orchard Road in Singapore. If I remember well, 300 SGD for a whole night.

Agreed. I found 2 Vietnamese girls at Ipanema. 200 SGD 2 hour ST. I am willing to return to Singapore for my next Visa run but was hoping on of the other places I listed had hot girls. They do not have to be Vietnamese.

It's a different experience, but I always stop a couple days in Macao on my trips and there are multiple direct flights from Bangkok. You have viets and prc girls in abundance. Go during the week and hotels are cheap, or choose one of the saunas that will give you a private room for sleeping like familia nobre and you have no cost at all.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;1926867]Trying to decide where to go for next Visa run. Last time I visited Singapore. This time trying to decide between Ho Chi Minh, Jakarta (free accommodations downtown), Phnom Penh, or back to Singapore. I left Kuala Lumpur off as I will be going there another time. Not interested in Philippines.

Good looking girls over price is the main criteria since I will only be there 3-4 days. I prefer cute faces and to look under 25. I prefer light skinned girls. I have a thing for Vietnamese girls. I prefer window shopping in a gogo club like Baccara over iBar. I enjoy brothels / laufhaus.

Suggestions?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=RobertLong;1926865]My Doc gives me a mixture of Vardenafil 75 MG and Yohimbi 2 MG, in the form of a sublingual troche. Works great and lasts 18 hours. Never any residual effects like headaches or acid stomach. And I am no spring chicken at 70. But it works and that is what counts. Yes expensive as I buy in the US as a scrip.[/QUOTE]Wow! Now is this from a compounding pharmacy? I can't find that online. If so, that has got to be expensive. Also, I've got the 20 MG tabs, which I split in half. I might even get good results with a quarter of a tab. I got my Levitra cheap using a once-in-a-lifetime promo coupon from at Walmart, but otherwise the cost of the tab would greatly exceed the price of an hour of sex in Medellin.

[QUOTE=Eszpresszo;1927305]Wow! Now is this from a compounding pharmacy? I can't find that online. If so, that has got to be expensive. Also, I've got the 20 MG tabs, which I split in half. I might even get good results with a quarter of a tab. I got my Levitra cheap using a once-in-a-lifetime promo coupon from at Walmart, but otherwise the cost of the tab would greatly exceed the price of an hour of sex in Medellin.[/QUOTE]I have been disappointed many times by the different tablet forms on the market. They don't work or you have to wait a few hours after taking to have dinner. I get my prescription from my Doctor at a male clinic. I also take testosterone shots once a week. I have never been "let down" by the formula that he prescribes.

He takes blood samples every 6 months and does toxicity studies of the liver. I figure at 70, what the fuck do I have loose? Go with what works and enjoy the results.

RL.

[QUOTE=RobertLong;1927606]I have been disappointed many times by the different tablet forms on the market. They don't work or you have to wait a few hours after taking to have dinner. I get my prescription from my Doctor at a male clinic. I also take testosterone shots once a week. I have never been "let down" by the formula that he prescribes.
[/QUOTE]Slightly strange comment. I thought Cialis (Tadenafil) was supposed to be effective with or without food and work for up to 36 hours.

Also for Viagra (sildenafil) or Vardenafil, normally would be taken 30 minutes before sex. So would not be taking dinner after taking the pill but before sex.

Vardenafil and Sildenafil are supposed to be inhibited somewhat by food especially highly fatty food.

You are taking Vardenafil which is supposed to have an effective half life of 4-6 hours, no where near to 18 hours, but fairly high dose. After 18 hours you would have maybe only 10 to 12% of the dose remaining in your system. Is something else working for you?

It is thought that under the tongue medication is partly absorbed there in mouth but maybe 50% still will go with saliva to stomach and still be inhibited by too much food taken concurrently. So high dose could compensate for this. However taking under the tongue sounds a bit gimmicky to me.

So I don't understand why your medication is supposed to work differently to what the normal data suggests and why you would be so disappointed with tablets if was same ingredient, which is supposed to work quickly after taking.

What does Yohimbi do? Is it critical?

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1927942]What does Yohimbi do? Is it critical?[/QUOTE][URL]https://www.wikiwand.com/en/Yohimbine[/URL]

It looks like snake oil to me, as far as it is used for ED.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1928002][URL]https://www.wikiwand.com/en/Yohimbine[/URL]

It looks like snake oil to me, as far as it is used for ED.[/QUOTE]Snake oil or not it works for me. Everyone has their favorite drug and I have tried all of the others and have been disappointed many times. This scrip works and has not failed once. As far as Viagra working in a half hour, hats off to your system. I never had that pleasure. Just a lot of bad and uncomfortable after effects.

As an analogy to the under the tongue absorption, I would assume that it is the same as the anal consumption of alcohol that collage students are into that gets you stoned in minutes. I am shocked that you would even doubt that, but everybody to their own opinion.

Regards RL.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1927942]It is thought that under the tongue medication is partly absorbed there in mouth but maybe 50% still will go with saliva to stomach and still be inhibited by too much food taken concurrently. So high dose could compensate for this. However taking under the tongue sounds a bit gimmicky to me.[/QUOTE]Nothing gimmicky about that. Sublingual and bucal (between gums and cheek) medication has it advantages. It is absorbed faster, and by going through the mouth and into the abundant capillaries under the skin, it avoids the digestive system and the liver. Though in theory it should mean a lower dosage. Sublingual and bucal medications are common for some kinds of treatments, nitroglycerin for heart patients is one. STAXYN is vardenafil in a sublingual dosage. I understand Sildenafil and Tadalafil is also available in sublingual form, though not everywhere.

[QUOTE=Eszpresszo;1928834]Nothing gimmicky about that. Sublingual and bucal (between gums and cheek) medication has it advantages. It is absorbed faster, and by going through the mouth and into the abundant capillaries under the skin, it avoids the digestive system and the liver. Though in theory it should mean a lower dosage. [/QUOTE]I am sceptical about how significant the benefits are. I have read that it only reduces amount going through digestive system and liver (perhaps by 50%) The guy reported a fairly high dose anyway. I don't need these things to work faster.

It is not clear which part of the process works so well for him. He only knows the total effect.

Girls are not going wild ripping my clothes off frequently enough. LOL

Anyway I am not experiencing any massive problems with my digestive system, specific to taking medications. Too many Caiparinhas or Gin and Tonics could be a problem more so.

I have no problems fucking GF unmedicated, so perhaps my need for medication is only for marathon or too much sex. This maybe why Sildenafil seems so high powered to me and starts working after 30 mins or less. Cialis results were disappointing. Perhaps I got sold a fake one years ago when tried it, although I am sure I would have tried it from more than one source.

[QUOTE=Breadman;1810484]So many guys have different tastes in Thai women, its hard to judge just exactly who they might go for. Here's a photo with 6 cute Thai girls in bikini's, from left to right we'll number them 1 thru 6. You can only pick one, no rating the girls from best to worse. If you ran across all of these girls in a gogo bar and could only chose one, which one?

My answer would be number 5.[/QUOTE]#3 is prettiest / cutest IMO, but it would be #2 for me.

Prefer her brown skin shade and body.

March 2017 will be my first trip to Pattaya and possibly BKK, so I have a few curiosities and interests I'd like opinion on.

For the Bar girl experience and play, I get the "drill" regarding LD, BF and all as, I have been to PI many years ago and played hard there.

Do most be-girls wear panties when strolling the fronts and playing in the bar (trying to get you to pony up $).

What about Bush verses bare? I prefer a nice smooth pussy to play with. I'm guessing 50/50?

GoGo's don't grab my interest too much from what pics and videos I've seen, but if it was raunchy naked dancing & flirting, I might get into it.

Any GoGo's go to extreme raunchy play?

Do the girls discriminate much? I have a few years under my belt (approaching 60) fit and not bad looking. I know its all about $ for them, but ideally I want to party and have fun, not just mechanical sex. Crap shoot?

I am quick to cum on first pop, so thinking maybe I should hit a massage parlor for that first one, then go hit up a bar girl for #2, and eventually pickup a LT lady for the night in my room.

I am sure after 1st day and night, the first pop will be a little more cooperative and last a while.

Will the tiny petite ladies like my small cock, and charge less for less wear and tear? (just joking on this one).

Thanks for any comments.

[QUOTE=PopNCim;1947765]#3 is prettiest / cutest IMO, but it would be #2 for me.

Prefer her brown skin shade and body.[/QUOTE]#2 has some meat on her bones. The others look anorexic and childish. I guess it's my age but I need a young woman not a teen model. These all look to young to work in any bar or club.

#3 is the best looking and I think her hair is what turns me on.

Any more photos?

RL.

[QUOTE=RobertLong;1947830]#2 has some meat on her bones. The others look anorexic and childish. I guess it's my age but I need a young woman not a teen model. These all look to young to work in any bar or club.

#3 is the best looking and I think her hair is what turns me on.

Any more photos?

RL.[/QUOTE]I agree No. 3 is easily the best looking and my choice. Breadman's No. 5 is a good backup although has a slight "smart ass" or smug look. She would definitely have a chance to prove to me she was nice though. Interesting some guys picked No. 4, who I would pass on due to swollen nose and probable fake tits.

The rest I would not even consider including number 2. No. 2 had bad nose so I don't even look at the tits. Skinny is fine for me.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1947919]I agree No. 3 is easily the best looking and my choice. Breadman's No. 5 is a good backup although has a slight "smart ass" or smug look. She would definitely have a chance to prove to me she was nice though. Interesting some guys picked No. 4, who I would pass on due to swollen nose and probable fake tits.

The rest I would not even consider including number 2. No. 2 had bad nose so I don't even look at the tits. Skinny is fine for me.[/QUOTE]Pretty much agree with you on this; #3 and #5, in that order. I would pass on the others, although I would be open to seeing how #6 looks with a genuine smile. At least she is sporting some nice "man-pleasing" lips. LOL.

If you haven't been hiding, you will know the Kinf of Thailand just died.

I took a look to see what happened to the Thai Baht. It looks like it started crashing a day or 2 before he died.

Is this a conspiracy or powerful elite insiders making the trades before the public knew what was upcoming?

[QUOTE=Gagoo;1948962]If you haven't been hiding, you will know the Kinf of Thailand just died.

I took a look to see what happened to the Thai Baht. It looks like it started crashing a day or 2 before he died.

Is this a conspiracy or powerful elite insiders making the trades before the public knew what was upcoming?[/QUOTE]No need to go all "conspiracy theory". There have been some rumours of the quickly decilining health situation of the King for a few days before he died already.

[QUOTE=Gagoo;1948962]If you haven't been hiding, you will know the Kinf of Thailand just died.

I took a look to see what happened to the Thai Baht. It looks like it started crashing a day or 2 before he died.

Is this a conspiracy or powerful elite insiders making the trades before the public knew what was upcoming?[/QUOTE]No. It is not exactly crashing. Other currencies that I watch (Dominican Peso, Philippine Peso, Colombian Peso, and Peruvian Sol) have all done the same thing in the same time period.

[QUOTE=PopNCim;1947775]March 2017 will be my first trip to Pattaya and possibly BKK, so I have a few curiosities and interests I'd like opinion on.

For the Bar girl experience and play, I get the "drill" regarding LD, BF and all as, I have been to PI many years ago and played hard there.

Do most be-girls wear panties when strolling the fronts and playing in the bar (trying to get you to pony up $).[/QUOTE]That depends. In some clubs the girls dance naked. In other they wear bikinis or lingerie or short skirts with or without panties. Just do your rounds of the clubs and see what is the flavour of the day.

In a (beer)bar however, things are more subdued, if only for the simple reason that many are open to the street and in full view of all passers-by. Soi 6 bars are different, but there you generally only go inside when you have already chosen your lady. You can play a bit with here inside the bar, but as you are likely to retire to the upstairs room anyhow, why delay?

[QUOTE=PopNCim;1947775]
What about Bush verses bare? I prefer a nice smooth pussy to play with. I'm guessing 50/50?[/QUOTE]Mostly smooth or at least nicely trimmed. You will find more "Bush" with non-pros or semi-pros.

[QUOTE=PopNCim;1947775]
GoGo's don't grab my interest too much from what pics and videos I've seen, but if it was raunchy naked dancing & flirting, I might get into it.

Any GoGo's go to extreme raunchy play?[/QUOTE]There are some clubs that have girls take a bath together and even invite audience participation. Again, have a look as it may be different from one day to another in the same club.

[QUOTE=PopNCim;1947775]

Do the girls discriminate much? I have a few years under my belt (approaching 60) fit and not bad looking. I know its all about $ for them, but ideally I want to party and have fun, not just mechanical sex. Crap shoot?[/QUOTE]Thai society has great respect for age. I'm about your age and never had any problem to engage a companion. But of course how she will respond once in your bed is difficult to predict.

[QUOTE=PopNCim;1947775]
I am quick to cum on first pop, so thinking maybe I should hit a massage parlor for that first one, then go hit up a bar girl for #2, and eventually pickup a LT lady for the night in my room.

I am sure after 1st day and night, the first pop will be a little more cooperative and last a while.[/QUOTE]That seems a realistic scenario.

[QUOTE=PopNCim;1947775]

Will the tiny petite ladies like my small cock, and charge less for less wear and tear? (just joking on this one).

Thanks for any comments.[/QUOTE]You are funny! And that is exactly the way to approach the girls. Thai are a big believer in the principle that even work should be "sanuk" (fun).

As we should all know by now, the King is dead and the nation is in mourning. All of the girls I have contacted via TF are in mourning, even admitting they are in tears. Needless to say, this is not the right time to be in the Land of Smiles.

I have read reports in the news that suggests that tourists wear black or somber clothes outdoors. I don't own anything black except some black socks. I don't don't do black. I am anti-black clothing, and I am not going to go out shopping for a new wardrobe to take on vacation so I can feel miserable with the rest of the natives.

Unfortunately, I have a reservation to fly to BKK via ICN on Korean Airlines, this Sunday the 16th. That's right. Bad timing. I've decided to postpone my journey. That's been an ordeal in itself, because KAL uses customer support in India and not only are their reps unable to assist, you can't really understand them, either. They keep saying they will need to have someone call me back and gave the cost of changing my reservation and of course, seat availability. I'm asking for a refund, and they can't handle that so they will also need to get someone to call me back to discuss a refund on my ticket. Seriously, in 2016 how is it possible that an airline serving such a technologically advanced nation (allegedly) not have customer service who can answer simple but critical questions regarding reservations? But, I digress.

I think those of you on the ground would do us a favor and give us feedback on what is going on, and when it will be a good time to come back. This would be my first trip to Asia, period, and I think going now is the wrong introduction to the Land of Smiles.

I'm heading to LOS on 19th November, I'm really hoping things will be back to normal by then (and a crash in the value of baht and / or recovery for the £ wouldn't be unwelcome!) Re-scheduling long vacations just isn't practical for me (cost and getting time off work) so really hope things go well, the crash in the value of £ has already eaten into my budget and I'm dreading that when the gogos re-open they might be charging more to recoup their losses!

Espresszo & DarkSmurf, yeah bad luck on the timing of your respective trips, but if getting a refund from the airlines is too difficult, or too expensive, or changing your travel dates is not optimal; I suggest you go anyway. My thinking is this: play it loose for a day or two in BKK/Pattaya and see if the Go Go's and massage shops are operating and you are able to connect with some nice Thai girls. The country will be in mourning all month, but everything might still be acceptable. No one really knows how it is going to be a week from now. The only thing that matters is if you are having a good time. So if you are not having a good time after giving it a try for 2 nights, then execute Plan B (backup plan) and fly to either 1) Phnom Penh (50 air minutes from BKK), or 2) Manila (3 plus hours from BKK), or 2.B) AC (an additional 90 minutes by limo from Manila), or 3) Jakarta (3 hours from BKK). There are great girls in all these wonderful alternative destinations and an amazing time awaits you in S. E Asia no matter what is going on in LOS. So for this reason, I do not believe there is any reason to call off your trip or pay onerous cancellation fees in order to do so. Go with the flow & enjoy.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;1949366]I do not believe there is any reason to call off your trip or pay onerous cancellation fees in order to do so. Go with the flow & enjoy.[/QUOTE]I concur with Natty, no need to cancel your trip. Having come back today as it was my planned exit date I would recommend you to proceed with your itinerary. You will find avenues for company and as some gogos in Pattaya have posted on their FB page life might resuscitate from Saturday onwards. Insomnia sure will be open on Monday, they have announced on their FB page as well. Am sure other bars and venues will follow. Music or lights might be missing but nightlife will region strength soon.

DarkSmurf, I think you will be absolutely fine for mongering purposes, other than losing girls who have decided to use this period as a good time to visit family before high season begins.

Ezspresso, I think you will see some things be normal starting on the 18th. Many places still open but from my understanding not with any authorization they are allowed to remain open. Not sure how long your vacation is for. Natty's suggestions are good. Have a Plan B and consider other destinations. I am in Phnom Penh now and am loving it. Uncle Volodya has switched to Plan B and will be joining me today. Airfare is about $140 US. Hotels same price as Pattaya. Girls much cheaper and many very pretty on Street 136,130, 104. Maybe not as convincing as Thai girls but really not far off. The big difference is it is not on the same scale as Pattaya. More like on BKK scale.

[QUOTE=DarkSmurf;1949358]I'm heading to LOS on 19th November, I'm really hoping things will be back to normal by then (and a crash in the value of baht and / or recovery for the wouldn't be unwelcome!) Re-scheduling long vacations just isn't practical for me (cost and getting time off work) so really hope things go well, the crash in the value of has already eaten into my budget and I'm dreading that when the gogos re-open they might be charging more to recoup their losses![/QUOTE]There is a lot to be said for wait and see. Within a few days everything will appear normal for mongering most likely. Thai Baht has already devalued a little. Would have been useful to me if that happened a few months ago. Perhaps you can benefit.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;1949590]DarkSmurf, I think you will be absolutely fine for mongering purposes, other than losing girls who have decided to use this period as a good time to visit family before high season begins.

Ezspresso, I think you will see some things be normal starting on the 18th. Many places still open but from my understanding not with any authorization they are allowed to remain open. Not sure how long your vacation is for. Natty's suggestions are good. Have a Plan B and consider other destinations. I am in Phnom Penh now and am loving it. Uncle Volodya has switched to Plan B and will be joining me today. Airfare is about $140 US. Hotels same price as Pattaya. Girls much cheaper and many very pretty on Street 136,130, 104. Maybe not as convincing as Thai girls but really not far off. The big difference is it is not on the same scale as Pattaya. More like on BKK scale.[/QUOTE]Send us some pics man. I have seen quite a few pics of PP girls but never was really convinced they were that pretty. Cheap yes. Dare I ask a typical rate? I once heard that if you go out of town to where girls can't speak English, experienced guys might get a fuck for as little as $10 just a few years back.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;1949725]Send us some pics man. I have seen quite a few pics of PP girls but never was really convinced they were that pretty. Cheap yes. Dare I ask a typical rate?[/QUOTE]You can find the info you are looking for in the PP thread. But when I was there a couple of years ago I was paying $13ST and $28 LT freelance. The bars were pretty much a rip off. Girls would want you to buy drinks before they would discuss leaving. Then after you bought the drinks they would say they don't leave.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;1949753]You can find the info you are looking for in the PP thread. But when I was there a couple of years ago I was paying $13ST and $28 LT freelance. The bars were pretty much a rip off. Girls would want you to buy drinks before they would discuss leaving. Then after you bought the drinks they would say they don't leave.[/QUOTE]$28? Did you give them $30 and get $2 change?

That price seems about right taking into account inflation as when I was there 10 years ago you could get a nice young freelancer with a tight body for $20 all night at the Walkabout, Sharky, Martini or Heart of Darkness. I hear those places have all declined now.

Back then the bars were also rubbish.

Thanks for the feedback and advice guys. As I posted in another forum, I did cancel my flight and incur a cancellation fee. Oddly enough I seem to have found some even cheaper flights a month from now, as we head into high season, which offsets the loss. Then again, I should known better than to buy a ticket in August for two months out. International airfares tend to slump in the fall.

I downloaded the app for Momondo and was surprised at the features it offered to track down the lowest fare. I still found the best flight for convenient flight times on plain-old Faretracker. That said, what is your favorite site or app for cruising airfare to the LOS?

So I locked down the trip to Bangkok and pattaya I will be having Thai turkey and stuffing it as much as I can, So I have plotted 5 days in Bangkok and 6 days in Pattaya I will be staying at the Majestic suites Bangkok and The pattaya Blue sky, what do you Thai veterans think of the time split and the hotel picks for a first trip to LOS.

Thanks Panhead.

[QUOTE=Panhead;1951820]So I locked down the trip to Bangkok and pattaya I will be having Thai turkey and stuffing it as much as I can, So I have plotted 5 days in Bangkok and 6 days in Pattaya I will be staying at the Majestic suites Bangkok and The pattaya Blue sky, what do you Thai veterans think of the time split and the hotel picks for a first trip to LOS.

Thanks Panhead.[/QUOTE]Majestic suites is a good value hotel in a very convenient location. Definitely the best 3 star I've ever stayed in.

I'd say you've split your time well if your trip is mostly for mongering. If you wanted to do more diverse activities I'd suggest more time in Bangkok.

Panhead, regarding a time split between the 2 cities, imo the best would be to stay in Bangkok for 2-3 days since you land there, then head to Pattaya. Stay in Pattaya until you are sick of it whether it be 2 or 7 days, then head back to BKK.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;1949753] Then after you bought the drinks they would say they don't leave.[/QUOTE]Quite possibly because you only want to pay them $13 ST and $28 LT?

I never had a girl say no in Phnom Penh.

Need to store some of my stuff for a while. Looking for an easily accessible place near Sukhumvit Asok station. Otherwise not too far by taxi. Thank you.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;1953851]Need to store some of my stuff for a while. Looking for an easily accessible place near Sukhumvit Asok station. Otherwise not too far by taxi. Thank you.[/QUOTE]In the future I may need luggage storage in Bangkok also, since my main residence will move far out into the country. So an interesting topic. I currently rent in BKK by the month. But may discontinue that if country life is okay Hopefully will then take a Hotel as close to 2nd GF as possible, for BKK visits.

This one maybe the go. [url]http://bangkokselfstorage.com/home[/url]

WTF?! Guy kills wife so he can meet a Thai girl he chatted with online.

[QUOTE]A computer geek who was desperate for a sex-fueled holiday in Pattaya, Thailand confessed he murdered his wife to get her out of the way.

Cops say Horst Koenig, 53, murdered his wife of 10 years, Grace, 37, before cutting her body into tiny pieces.

Then, he admittedly cleared out her bank accounts to pay for a booze-soaked hooker binge in Pattaya.

A German court was told that Koenig had been a philandering fritz throughout his marriage. Last November, he allegedly bashed her brains in with a hammer while she was sleeping.

Using a reciprocating saw, Koenig grimly cut his wifes body into eight pieces, put them in garbage bags and dumped them in a warehouse, court heard.

Making matters worse, Koenig allegedly sent emails to his wifes friends claiming she had left him and returned to the Philippines. He vowed to win her back.

Kinky Koenig told the court he hooked up with a Thai woman he met online.

What she promised, seemed exciting, and many of my secret desires seemed to come true. I wanted to be with this woman, he said.

When arrested back in Germany, Koenig was carrying photos of a young Asian woman.

This was a person with whom I got distracted with on the Internet from my gloomy daily life, Koenig said. My wife increasingly lived on her mobile phone to the extent that she once burned a pot on the stove.

Koenig said he wanted to commit suicide but chickened out. Broke and desperate after three weeks he returned to Germany.

He faces a life sentence if convicted.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;1954861]WTF?! Guys kills wife so he can meet a Thai girl he chatted with online.[/QUOTE]I'm not worried. It's just a European thing!

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;1953851]Need to store some of my stuff for a while. Looking for an easily accessible place near Sukhumvit Asok station. Otherwise not too far by taxi. Thank you.[/QUOTE]The smaller hotels used to offer this service to anyone passing by, not just to guests only.

But perhaps with all the terrorism scare, they may now be reluctant to do so. It can do no harm though to ask around a bit and see what is still available.

Here are the first girls I met at the Thermae late one night in 1991. My buddy was showing me the place. At the time Thermae was located very close to Miami Hotel, and Thermae Soapy was upstairs.

I chose the right hand girl for LT mainly because she did not smoke. In truth I should have tried to take both of them, since we waited around a long time for 2nd girl to try to get a hook up, mind you she was refusing plenty. I believe the price was 500 Baht LT as standard, However I don't believe the price was discussed. My basic Thai was something like: what's your name, where do you come from? Do you smoke? Where do you work? and would you like to go to my Hotel for the night. I imagine the small talk at Thermae today is similar but more business like and in English.

My girl turned out to have magnificent Cee Cups. She spoke to me in Thai language but with English pronouns thrown in. Was confusing since I had been studying Thai for less than a year.

In the end I took her LT 3 nights running until she and her friend went back to Phitsanulok. My girl was really passionate in the sack, and I loved her fabulous tits. She did not know how to use a western toilet so squatted on top of the seat.

At the time I thought the 2 girls were extremely pretty. Today, I still like them now but they don't seem so stunning. It's my theory that over the years we get more picky. Its not so much about the standard of looks dropping.

Some of my early girls were pretty. Some seem very plain now. Some pics, I think, How did I choose that girl? I am not going to post the ugly ones though.

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I know it's a spessiel situation in Thailand now, but my friends who are much in Thailand says it is no longer as great as it used to for mongering.

I wonder what you, who have been around a lot in asia mean. Where is the best place for mongering now?

I considered south Korea, China, India, Indonesia or perhaps elsewhere.

I have not been in Thailand for a few years and finally I have the finances and time to a 4-week trip.

Where to get the most out of the money. I like to hear your assessment before I buy my ticket.

So I will be in Thailand on Dec 1 I understand the New King will be coreanated that day. How do you guys feel that will affect us tourist I will be in Pattaya on the first.

[QUOTE=Dick1;1957469]I know it's a spessiel situation in Thailand now, but my friends who are much in Thailand says it is no longer as great as it used to for mongering.

I wonder what you, who have been around a lot in asia mean. Where is the best place for mongering now?

I considered south Korea, China, India, Indonesia or perhaps elsewhere.

I have not been in Thailand for a few years and finally I have the finances and time to a 4-week trip.

Where to get the most out of the money. I like to hear your assessment before I buy my ticket.[/QUOTE]I've lived long-term in 3 of the 4 countries you give, and traveled in India. I live in Bangkok now. I would choose to fly into Thailand, and then if I want a change of scenery, get a low cost regional flight to any other SE Asian destination. You will be coming here after the situation has somewhat normalized, and there will be no shortage of good options. You may benefit from reading Natty Bumpo's excellent posts, as he travels around the region and has a good, balanced view of the pros and cons of each place.

[QUOTE=Panhead;1957596]So I will be in Thailand on Dec 1 I understand the New King will be coreanated that day. How do you guys feel that will affect us tourist I will be in Pattaya on the first.[/QUOTE]Where did you hear about the coronation on 1st of December?

Barely two weeks ago there was an official announcement that the coronation would be delayed for about one year.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;1957766]Where did you hear about the coronation on 1st of December?

Barely two weeks ago there was an official announcement that the coronation would be delayed for about one year.[/QUOTE]Hi Wolvenvacht. Report on several int'l news stations (outside of LOS!

[URL]http://www.ibtimes.com/thailand-new-king-crown-prince-maha-vajiralongkorn-could-take-throne-dec-1-2439399[/URL]

[QUOTE=TimTimGuy;1957785]Hi Wolvenvacht. Report on several int'l news stations (outside of LOS!

[URL]http://www.ibtimes.com/thailand-new-king-crown-prince-maha-vajiralongkorn-could-take-throne-dec-1-2439399[/URL][/QUOTE]The article seems to indicate the date is not exactly set in concrete as yet, although perhaps highly likely.

Has anyone heard if the bars in Thailand will be closed on Dec. 1 for the new King's coronation and Dec. 5 for the late King's birthday?

Does anyone know if Naltrexone is available by prescription in proper hospitals in Bangkok like Sukhumvit hospital?

Long time lurker and first time poster. So, Hi all and thanks in anticipation for the advice for my first trip to BKK.

I met a WG in HK last year. Great fun, but felt I overpaid a little after three days of quality shenanigans. I'm aiming to repeat in BKK (she's Thai), but wanted to get a feel for the "gift" I should provide. I'm looking at 3 days with her. What would be your collective advice for the tip?

[QUOTE=VipGoose;2002871]Long time lurker and first time poster. So, Hi all and thanks in anticipation for the advice for my first trip to BKK.

I met a WG in HK last year. Great fun, but felt I overpaid a little after three days of quality shenanigans. I'm aiming to repeat in BKK (she's Thai), but wanted to get a feel for the "gift" I should provide. I'm looking at 3 days with her. What would be your collective advice for the tip?[/QUOTE]Find another girl. I don't know where you are at, but you are probably traveling a long ways to hook up with the same girl, in a place where the options are infinite. If you want to find a girl and overpay her for 3 days, you will have thousands of girls to choose from. It might make sense if she was coming to visit you, or you were meeting up in some other place where pussy isn't throwing itself at you. But, in the land of plenty?

Never mongered in HK, but by most accounts it is more expensive than Thailand. And you felt you overpaid there? Do you think your lady friend is going to want to scale her expectations based on the local economy? I think this arrangement has a high premium built into the costs.

[QUOTE=AmericanThief;1987936]Does anyone know if Naltrexone is available by prescription in proper hospitals in Bangkok like Sukhumvit hospital?[/QUOTE]That's pretty heavy stuff.

If I were you I'd first check out some pharmacies and see what they have.

[QUOTE=VipGoose;2002871]Long time lurker and first time poster. So, Hi all and thanks in anticipation for the advice for my first trip to BKK.

I met a WG in HK last year. Great fun, but felt I overpaid a little after three days of quality shenanigans. I'm aiming to repeat in BKK (she's Thai), but wanted to get a feel for the "gift" I should provide. I'm looking at 3 days with her. What would be your collective advice for the tip?[/QUOTE]15000 baht seems about right unless she is model quality. Remember that you will also have to take care of the usual living expenses (food, drink, lodging, entertainment, transport, . . .).

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;2003111]15000 baht seems about right unless she is model quality. Remember that you will also have to take care of the usual living expenses (food, drink, lodging, entertainment, transport, . . .).[/QUOTE]Sorry Wolvenvacht. Is that Bt 15 k total, or per day? All the other stuff is sorted.

[QUOTE=VipGoose;2003165]Sorry Wolvenvacht. Is that Bt 15 k total, or per day? All the other stuff is sorted.[/QUOTE]He definitely meant in total. LOL.

[QUOTE=VipGoose;2003165]Sorry Wolvenvacht. Is that Bt 15 k total, or per day? All the other stuff is sorted.[/QUOTE]Total.

A long time (LT) is about 4000 baht, so I added another 1000 baht to get a fair price for one day.

[QUOTE=VipGoose;2002871]Long time lurker and first time poster. So, Hi all and thanks in anticipation for the advice for my first trip to BKK.

I met a WG in HK last year. Great fun, but felt I overpaid a little after three days of quality shenanigans. I'm aiming to repeat in BKK (she's Thai), but wanted to get a feel for the "gift" I should provide. I'm looking at 3 days with her. What would be your collective advice for the tip?[/QUOTE]"Fish as well as Friends begin to smell after 3 days". Ben Franklin. In my opinion WG's begin to smell even sooner. As one of the proud seniors mentioned "we pay them to leave, not for the service". It's hard enough to carry on a conversation for 1 day, let alone for 3. IMHO, do not commit to any more than 1 day at a time.

RL.

[QUOTE=RobertLong;2003524]"Fish as well as Friends begin to smell after 3 days". Ben Franklin. In my opinion WG's begin to smell even sooner. As one of the proud seniors mentioned "we pay them to leave, not for the service". It's hard enough to carry on a conversation for 1 day, let alone for 3. IMHO, do not commit to any more than 1 day at a time.

RL.[/QUOTE]That is generally true, but in this case he already enjoyed her three days in Hongkong and that seemed to have gone well.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;2003512]Total.

A long time (LT) is about 4000 baht, so I added another 1000 baht to get a fair price for one day.[/QUOTE]So LT is 8+ hours and worth 4 K, 24 hours is worth 5 K? Or do you mean something else?

I don't think 5K is a universally fair price for a day for all girls. Depends a lot on how keen she is. It obviously has to be at least as high as what she would normally make in a working day.

First time I ever took a soapy girl away with me for several days, it turned out she only agreed to go, because she has some rash problem that she believed would make her unable to work, however she could still fuck. If she could have worked normally, she would have lost too much money to go away, as I had no idea what a fair figure for her actually was.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2003903]It obviously has to be at least as high as what she would normally make in a working day. [/QUOTE]I agree with this. If she normally would pull in 500 for drinks and can fetch 3000ST /5000 LT, then 5000 is clearly not enough for a day. However, if she normally pulls in 500 for drinks and 1500ST /2500 LT, then 5000 would be more than a fair price for 24 hours. I'd try to arrange something for 2 x ST or 1. 5 x LT.

It would also depend on what you do with the girl. If you are taking her to a nice dinner and / or buying her some small 100 baht items at a market, then your price should be lower than you pay for banging a girl for 24 hours.

imo if you are taking a girl away on a trip to somewhere nice (Singapore, Hong Kong, Seoul, Tokyo, Europe, etc.) and paying her airfare, accommodations, food, and some nominal shopping, she should not be paid much if anything. That's assuming you already know the girl enjoys your company and, as Syzy mentions, is keen on going.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2003951]I agree with this. If she normally would pull in 500 for drinks and can fetch 3000ST /5000 LT, then 5000 is clearly not enough for a day. However, if she normally pulls in 500 for drinks and 1500ST /2500 LT, then 5000 would be more than a fair price for 24 hours. I'd try to arrange something for 2 x ST or 1. 5 x LT.
[/QUOTE]Girls in an MP could be making somewhat more than 5 K per day if very popular, and gogo girls that do several STs per day could also be making big money. However both may welcome a period where they only have to do 2 or 3 fucks per day.

Another factor, is how much she has to pay to BF herself out so she does not have to turn up to the normal job. Its easier with free lancers who can show up for work when they please.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2003903]So LT is 8+ hours and worth 4 K, 24 hours is worth 5 K? Or do you mean something else?

I don't think 5K is a universally fair price for a day for all girls. Depends a lot on how keen she is. It obviously has to be at least as high as what she would normally make in a working day.[/QUOTE]I don't think the average agogo girl makes 5000 baht per day. That should mean they have an LT or several STs every day. Some stunners may do that, but most will not. So 5000 baht plus living expenses seems entirely fair, unless of course you keep her awake all the time and fuck her continuously.

[QUOTE=RobertLong;2003524]"Fish as well as Friends begin to smell after 3 days". Ben Franklin. In my opinion WG's begin to smell even sooner. As one of the proud seniors mentioned "we pay them to leave, not for the service". It's hard enough to carry on a conversation for 1 day, let alone for 3. IMHO, do not commit to any more than 1 day at a time.

RL.[/QUOTE]Up to him. I also enjoy sometimes take a girl for a small vaccation. Some girls enjoy a break from the bar. I never tried in Thailand, but in Cambodia I paid 30 to 40 dollar a day. That is 1. 000 to 1. 400 baht a day.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;2004141]I don't think the average agogo girl makes 5000 baht per day. That should mean they have an LT or several STs every day. Some stunners may do that, but most will not. So 5000 baht plus living expenses seems entirely fair, unless of course you keep her awake all the time and fuck her continuously.[/QUOTE]I would use this as a reference. There is web page call Thai sex holiday ([URL]http://www.thai-sexy-holiday.com/prices/[/URL]). They offer 7 days all inclusive including lodging and one girl all the time for 999 euro, that is about 5000 per day.

Jb.

[QUOTE=JudeBright;2004265]I would use this as a reference. There is web page call Thai sex holiday ([URL]http://www.thai-sexy-holiday.com/prices/[/URL]). They offer 7 days all inclusive including lodging and one girl all the time for 999 euro, that is about 5000 per day.

Jb.[/QUOTE]If that is the case, when you deduct the accommodation cost and agency profit, the girl may only get 3,000-3,500 bhat per day, so that is what he should pay her. However, she is going to expect whatever he paid her in HK, so there may be an issue if he wants to pay less.

[QUOTE=Wolvenvacht;2004141]I don't think the average agogo girl makes 5000 baht per day. That should mean they have an LT or several STs every day. Some stunners may do that, but most will not. So 5000 baht plus living expenses seems entirely fair, unless of course you keep her awake all the time and fuck her continuously.[/QUOTE]There is a big difference between working 10 hours for 5 K for LT (if that) and working 24 hours with no free time to yourself for 5 K. None of us have ever tried working 24 hours a day. So therefore, a great deal depends on whether the girl is having a good time, and able to regard the 24 hours as fun or not.

Some girls claim they cannot sleep in a strange bed with a strange guy. Many can't sleep with me, because I am not a consistently quiet sleeper.

Some better gogo girls can make significantly more than 5 K on a good day with 3 STs, and then still get to go home to sleep in there own bed and have free time to themselves.

I think it is very hard to find a price that is fair for every girl. Obviously discussions needed to see what sort of a price sounds good to the girl.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2006208]Some better gogo girls can make significantly more than 5 K on a good day with 3 STs, [/QUOTE]Is this common in BKK? I think I know a fair number of busy gogo girls in several Pattaya clubs and I don't know any who do multiple ST's in a night. Once they're done with the first ST they go home to relax or go out with their friends since someone has paid their BF. The majority of gogo girls are lucky to get 1-2 barfines per week.

I am wondering whether cohabiting in Thailand means the woman acquires right after she's been living with you for 6/12/24 months?. If she doesn't, would her sense of entitlement drive her to frame you up or blackmail you (like in the Phillipines) if you want to get rid of her?

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2006233]Is this common in BKK? I think I know a fair number of busy gogo girls in several Pattaya clubs and I don't know any who do multiple ST's in a night. Once they're done with the first ST they go home to relax or go out with their friends since someone has paid their BF. The majority of gogo girls are lucky to get 1-2 barfines per week.[/QUOTE]Yes common in Bangkok, especially with top rated girls in Baccara, Crazy House, Rainbow 4 (in the past) , etc. Girls have pointed out the number one girl in certain bars, and indicated it is based on the number of barfines per month, or average number per night. I was surprised by the No. 1 girl in Baccara with plenty of BFs, as she did not appeal to me at all.

Some girls in Rainbow 4 were so keen to get in a lot of STs, that they would go out for a 20 min quickie and race back to the bar to get the next customer. Not suited to me at all since I need at least a full hour. Surely you have seen that sort of thing happen?

I used to use a girl in Suzi Wong who would try for at least 3 STs, sometimes more, on a busy night like Friday, Saturday. She would do LTs for her really preferred customers, but was generally trying to avoid it. She was financing to build a large "mansion" back in her home town. She had the looks charm and body to get customers very easily and quickly.

This girl was always keen to see me, because I would take her ST at 6. 30 PM before the bar had hardly got started, so this enabled her to get in an extra ST beyond the normal.

Obviously less popular girls are not trying for multiple BFs, and will be happy enough to have just had one. The variation in average earnings per night worked for bargirls, is extreme. Some girls hardly get BFed at all, and rely on drink sales.

Some girls sell so many drinks in an evening, that they may not even wish to go and be fucked.

I guess bargirl ST prices have become very high in Bangkok due to so many girls having to make do with only one fuck per night (or one customer) and often no customer, however the girls that do multiple STs per night are not giving a big discount. LOL

We all know there is a huge difference in quality of looks from the best to worst girls in many bars, and also in ability to hook a customer.

[QUOTE=XXL;2006524]I am wondering whether cohabiting in Thailand means the woman acquires right after she's been living with you for 6/12/24 months?. If she doesn't, would her sense of entitlement drive her to frame you up or blackmail you (like in the Phillipines) if you want to get rid of her?[/QUOTE]In Thailand, girls are considered to be your wife if they live with you, regardless of having a marriage certificate or not. However does not mean they can get all your money from bank accounts in your name.

Thai men regularly dump their wives, leaving the wife to support the children on their own. The man just moves on to the next woman he will impregnate, and then dump them. He is not forced to support them. There are plenty of Thai guys that are serial impregnators, always moving on to the next woman, once he gets sick of them, and never being responsible. I have heard of Thai men with several children by various successive wives, and no longer supporting any of the wives or children. Not sure why the next wife thought she would be different to the previous ones.

Thai women are sometimes looking for a Farang man for a permanent relationship who will be more responsible than her previous Thai men. However what guarantees that the Farang will be more responsible?

I have met Thai girls that always preferred non Thai men as well. Reason not clear.

It is considered quite difficult for a Thai woman to just decide to leave her Thai man, unless she can make sure he can't find her. The man can pursue her and try to force her without police intervention. It is like the man has ownership in Thai society.

When there is a marriage certificate, if one partner wants a divorce, the other can ask for money before signing the divorce. My GF had to pay to get divorced from her previous husband. So I don't advise officially marrying a Thai girl with marriage certificate in a big hurry. Best to cohabit for a long time first to be sure it is "real".

Fellow mongers,

I'm around for a few days at the start of April. Would anyone fancy a welcome beer or twelve?

[QUOTE=VipGoose;2010512]Fellow mongers,

I'm around for a few days at the start of April. Would anyone fancy a welcome beer or twelve?[/QUOTE]Your too early for the best time of your life. Songkran is a riot of fun and water. If you have time, go to Chaing Mai where they get wild. I think a lot of ladies go back to their village for a few weeks around this time. Maybe some of the sages of this forum can weigh in on that subject.

RL.

[QUOTE=RobertLong;2010734]Your too early for the best time of your life. Songkran is a riot of fun and water. If you have time, go to Chaing Mai where they get wild. I think a lot of ladies go back to their village for a few weeks around this time. Maybe some of the sages of this forum can weigh in on that subject.

RL.[/QUOTE]Not a fan. Why not? Because it's not voluntary. Participation is forced. One of my favorite times to leave the country. Penang or KL provide great get-aways.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;2010806]Not a fan. Why not? Because it's not voluntary. Participation is forced. One of my favorite times to leave the country. Penang or KL provide great get-aways.[/QUOTE]Looking at the dates, I should be there before songkran (which I believe starts in 14th Apr).

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;2010806]Not a fan. Why not? Because it's not voluntary. Participation is forced. One of my favorite times to leave the country. [/QUOTE]I also know girls who are leaving during Songkran. Good time to visit their families.

[QUOTE=VipGoose;2010822]Looking at the dates, I should be there before songkran (which I believe starts in 14th Apr).[/QUOTE]I thought starting 13th April was well known or freely avail by internet search. Officially goes 3 days, but in practice goes a bit longer for some. Some eager youth could be starting early too.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;2010806]Not a fan. Why not? Because it's not voluntary. Participation is forced. One of my favorite times to leave the country. Penang or KL provide great get-aways.[/QUOTE]Can you expand on what you are trying to say by it not being Voluntary? I don't see the police marching people down the streets and making them throw water? This is an event to enjoy and participate with the locals.

This makes me wonder if you are an older man and not really into the excitement? I'm 70 and I enjoy the fun. But I am a young 70.

RL.

[QUOTE=RobertLong;2011978]Can you expand on what you are trying to say by it not being Voluntary? I don't see the police marching people down the streets and making them throw water? This is an event to enjoy and participate with the locals.

This makes me wonder if you are an older man and not really into the excitement? I'm 70 and I enjoy the fun. But I am a young 70.

RL.[/QUOTE]Being doused with liquid at any time and in any manner is not everyone's cup of tea. Nothing to do with age.

And I do say 'liquid' because are you [I]sure[/I] that it is only [I]water[/I] that was just sprayed in your face? LOL to that.

SL.

[QUOTE=RobertLong;2011978]Can you expand on what you are trying to say by it not being Voluntary? I don't see the police marching people down the streets and making them throw water? This is an event to enjoy and participate with the locals.
[/QUOTE]The non voluntary part is being on the receiving end of being sprayed by a water pistol (minor), or having a bucket of filthy canal water with ice dumped on you, or possibly hit by flying ice that can cause injury. You have to keep your wallet and phones in water tight plastic bags just in case. I imagine plenty of people become sick from Songkran participation, willing or not.

Most adults over the age of 25 to 30 are not really into it. It's mostly for the children and immature adults or the tourists especially drunk ones. If you are still a somewhat crazy teenager at heart, might be fun.

Most people like voluntary fun, where they have a choice to participate or not.

The death toll for drunks is very high during Songkran, mostly associated with motor vehicles.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2012073]The non voluntary part is being on the receiving end of being sprayed by a water pistol (minor), or having a bucket of filthy canal water with ice dumped on you, or possibly hit by flying ice that can cause injury. You have to keep your wallet and phones in water tight plastic bags just in case. I imagine plenty of people become sick from Songkran participation, willing or not.

Most adults over the age of 25 to 30 are not really into it. It's mostly for the children and immature adults or the tourists especially drunk ones. If you are still a somewhat crazy teenager at heart, might be fun.

Most people like voluntary fun, where they have a choice to participate or not.

The death toll for drunks is very high during Songkran, mostly associated with motor vehicles.[/QUOTE]These are good points to consider. I hadn't looked at the negative side of being sprayed with water that might not be clean. I assumed that most are not into pissing in the water gun or bucket. They give out the plastic bags for phones and wallets also sell in some cases. But it's great fun in the hottest time of the year.

RL.

[QUOTE=RobertLong;2012200]These are good points to consider. I hadn't looked at the negative side of being sprayed with water that might not be clean. I assumed that most are not into pissing in the water gun or bucket. They give out the plastic bags for phones and wallets also sell in some cases. But it's great fun in the hottest time of the year.

RL.[/QUOTE]Pissing water sounds really bad, but it is not really the worst possible water to be subjected to. Anyhow, you just don't know what some idiots will use.

I don't know actually as have never participated. Managed to be never here on exactly the 13th. I believe flew out on 13th last year but some people had already started on the 12th around Cowboy.

My GF is 38 (much younger than me) and she does not like to participate either so I take her guide. However she has an "ancient head" (a Thai expression translated to English. Perhaps it doesn't work) which really means a bit old fashioned or not too crazy. She takes a long time to do her makeup and dress up at times, so she would not want that spoiled. LOL. Her daughter aged 16 is into Tae Kwon Do and is into Songkran play and pranks as is a somewhat strong type of girl who loved pillow fights when she was very young, and fighting boys when got older.

Any concerns booking or taking flights that fly over Korea or that land in Seoul?

[QUOTE=Breadman;2030514]Any concerns booking or taking flights that fly over Korea or that land in Seoul?[/QUOTE]I know some airlines are changing their routings on overflights of the Korean peninsula at this time, but as far as I know, no one has expressed any real concern about operating into and out of ICN. It's biz as usual.

Hope this isn't too far off topic! I haven't been to Thailand in about a year. I kept my sim card that I have used the last two trips, but wasn't sure if the number is still active or will I need to get a new card? It is a Thai Smile sim. TIA.

I think I can buy one in HK before I leave or at least get a data card, almost never use voice anyway!

Sky.

[QUOTE=SkyRyder;2030593]Hope this isn't too far off topic! I haven't been to Thailand in about a year. I kept my sim card that I have used the last two trips, but wasn't sure if the number is still active or will I need to get a new card? It is a Thai Smile sim. TIA.

I think I can buy one in HK before I leave or at least get a data card, almost never use voice anyway!

Sky.[/QUOTE]Perhaps you refer to the DTAC Happy SIM?

Just go to the counter of the phone provider at the airport when you arrive, and ask them to check your SIM. They will tell you if is cancelled, and will sell you another based on speed and how much data you want. SIMs have to be registered in the modern day. If not registered will have been cancelled. I don't know the period of non use that will cause cancellation.

It's very unlikely your old tourist SIM is still going to work. No big deal.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2030606]Perhaps you refer to the DTAC Happy SIM?

Just go to the counter of the phone provider at the airport when you arrive, and ask them to check your SIM. They will tell you if is cancelled, and will sell you another based on speed and how much data you want. SIMs have to be registered in the modern day. If not registered will have been cancelled. I don't know the period of non use that will cause cancellation.

It's very unlikely your old tourist SIM is still going to work. No big deal.[/QUOTE]I appreciate the help.

[QUOTE=HorseTrader;2031061]This sort of behavior can stay with Thai women even when they move to USA and become USA citizens. I dated one such widow for 3 years, with her living with me for the final 10 months. Then she started becoming unreliable, just like described above. After one weekend when she missed all planned activities I told her not to come to my house that evening and stay at her daughter's house. The next day I changed my house locks and hauled all her things to the front door for her pickup.

Her priorities were (1) whatever she felt like doing even if it wasn't what she previously agreed to do. (2) activities with her adult USA citizen children, (3) activities with her Thai girlfriends who are living in USA, and (4) pre planned activities with me, the man who owns the house she has been living in for free. I tossed her out of my house 1. 5 years ago. Last month I got a call from her girlfriend asking for a place to stay at my house since her husband kicked her to the he curb.

This unreliable nature of Thai women is causing me problems again. I'm working on thaifriendly and line to select a girl to accompany me on my next trip to Koh Samui. It's easy to find girls to agree, but how many yes answers do I need to get one that will actually get on that airplane with me? 2? 4? 6?[/QUOTE]There is a problem with Western men and not adapting to Thai women. I have heard plenty of stories about black hearted German men who expected their Thai woman to be a housewife, stay home, not go out on the town with her friends, etc. When the man found he could not control the girl and get her to stay home and follow orders, he would kick out destitute onto the street with no means of support. Some were forced to become hookers (assuming they had not been hookers before. Who knows).

So if you are a controlling type, perhaps a Thai woman is not for you. LOL Back home I had a Philippina GF for a while, before I had any Thai GFs. I eventually gave her up, because she was far too unreliable, with mood swings and changing her mind all the time, such that you never knew if anything agreed was actually going to happen. She would always pull out of planned events, at some point, not necessarily unpersuadable to come back to the plan. Sound familiar. I could not cope with the uncertainty of every single day. She even decided to leave me (about 10 times), and always changed her mind on that at as well. After 9 times, I just said to her that next time she decides to quit, I won't be coming back to her. I didn't I then moved on to Thai women, not exactly wonderfully reliable.

My Thai GF now is extremely independent. Makes lots of wrong decisions without consulting me. Does her own thing. No one can understand her behavior and priorities, not even her own relatives can understand her behaviours. I got used it. Always have something else to do in case she is doing her own thing.

Hi, I am not sure if this is the right venue for my question. Tonight, I tried to go out for dinner at this Spanish tapas restaurant, tucked in an alley off soy 11. As I arrived at the entrance of the alley, it looked deserted and it appeared there was a fire which destroyed most of the buildings in that alley. My question: Does anyone know whether that Spanish restaurant has relocated somewhere? And where? Thanks.

I ended up having my dinner at Viva, on soy 8, a nice restaurant with decent food, and conveniently located close to Dynasty Grande, where I am staying.

I am here in Bangkok for 4 days only, but spent a week in Pattaya and 3 days in Hua Hin. I plan to submit a report on BKK and Hua Hin upon my return to the states, this coming Sunday. I submitted a brief report on Pattaya while I was there, and I may add to it.

I have eaten at another Tapas place betweeb Soi 19 and 21. I suggest do a Google Maps search or consult Trip Advisor.

I loaded We Chat for first time, since previously I did not see myself opening myself to enter society of have miscellaneous unknown persons contacting me. LOL.

I have to get my brain out of the dinosaur actual physically meeting programming. Ha ha. Likewise I am yet to get into escorts for same reason.

Did the location search, and I must admit to being surprised that 3 relatively gorgeous girls showed up close by (Sathorn) with fab natural upturned noses, at least within 2 km. Like Wow. I did not expect that good. My next problems to deal with, will be seeing the body of the girl, I suppose can ask for video call? The pros for WeChat (or any other good alternative) could perhaps give advice. Also how wide is the price range for ST girls. Are real stunners likely to be expensive?

Are the girl photos typically very realistic or somewhat shopped?

I was a little disappointed with filters. I see can filter to females only, but that does not exclude Ladyboys. I was hoping the App would have more advanced filters like should me black girls for example or non Thai girls, or set the age range, or exclude silicones, ha ha. Just kidding on that one. I select Females only and still males show up. Perhaps they never specified what gender they are. Also many person show as close by yet region is in China or far away. Can these all be tourists here?

One very pretty girl Pim's comment is "Single". Is this a clue she is not a hooker?

I can see that on a night out in Bangkok, having struck out at all the places I intended to check, I can just do the vicinity check to see what pops up, somewhere not too far from the ST Hotels.

[QUOTE=Lefeu;2031705]Hi, I am not sure if this is the right venue for my question. Tonight, I tried to go out for dinner at this Spanish tapas restaurant, tucked in an alley off soy 11. As I arrived at the entrance of the alley, it looked deserted and it appeared there was a fire which destroyed most of the buildings in that alley. My question: Does anyone know whether that Spanish restaurant has relocated somewhere? And where? Thanks.

I ended up having my dinner at Viva, on soy 8, a nice restaurant with decent food, and conveniently located close to Dynasty Grande, where I am staying.

I am here in Bangkok for 4 days only, but spent a week in Pattaya and 3 days in Hua Hin. I plan to submit a report on BKK and Hua Hin upon my return to the states, this coming Sunday. I submitted a brief report on Pattaya while I was there, and I may add to it.[/QUOTE]Don't really think I've come across a Spanish Tapas restaurant. If you like mexican food, the Monsoon restaurant almost across the street from Viva in Soi 8 have that. It is quite a good restaurant actually, but at a price. Rates very high on tripadvisor.

[QUOTE=Carpaccio18;2032039]Don't really think I've come across a Spanish Tapas restaurant. .[/QUOTE]Actually I think there are plenty, I just have not tried them, e. G. Barcelona Gaudi on Suk Soi 23. I did try Big Mamas Tapas Sukhumvit 21 Soi 1. Not the best Tapas I ever had though.

Here is a suitable Trip Advisor Link:

[URL]https://www.tripadvisor.com/Restaurants-g293916-c36-Bangkok.html[/URL]

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2032045]Actually I think there are plenty, I just have not tried them, e. G. Barcelona Gaudi on Suk Soi 23. I did try Big Mamas Tapas Sukhumvit 21 Soi 1. Not the best Tapas I ever had though.

Here is a suitable Trip Advisor Link:

[URL]https://www.tripadvisor.com/Restaurants-g293916-c36-Bangkok.html[/URL][/QUOTE]Wow, you're right, there are indeed plenty of them. Never realized. Guess I like Thai food so much I almost feel guilty for having a Pizza or a Burger when here.

So I fired up wechat for the first time, at 12:30 midnight, Saturday night. And so onn Sukhumvit 15, It's 85% ladyboys, 10% massage shops and 5% ugly women over 30 (over 30 *and* ugly). I guess because I'm near Nana or this is a lady boy area. I should try this app at a better time / location. However, I am not super far from Climax though, so it should be picking up better options right?

[QUOTE=ParkVille;2032197]So I fired up wechat for the first time, at 12:30 midnight, Saturday night. And so onn Sukhumvit 15, It's 85% ladyboys, 10% massage shops and 5% ugly women over 30 (over 30 *and* ugly). I guess because I'm near Nana or this is a lady boy area. I should try this app at a better time / location. However, I am not super far from Climax though, so it should be picking up better options right?[/QUOTE]Pretty much the same demographic from my place in Pattaya.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2032031]I loaded We Chat for first time ...,Also many person show as close by yet region is in China or far away. Can these all be tourists here?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=ParkVille;2032197]So I fired up wechat for the first time, at 12:30 midnight, Saturday night. And so onn Sukhumvit 15, It's 85% ladyboys, 10% massage shops and 5% ugly women over 30 (over 30 *and* ugly). I guess because I'm near Nana or this is a lady boy area. I should try this app at a better time / location. However, I am not super far from Climax though, so it should be picking up better options right?[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2032203]Pretty much the same demographic from my place in Pattaya.[/QUOTE]I don't know how they do it, but an expert WeChat user can appear to be near you while she is on the other side of the planet. Maybe proxy server? Maybe something else. I'm not an expert.

Be aware that there are scams out there, you might think you are texting the pretty girl in the picture, but in reality there is some sweaty old man who is working on some sort of scam. One scam that I encountered was that during text sessions over the period of 2 weeks she occasionally told me how she made a lot of money that day by trading commodities. Her English during texting sessions was quick and flawless. But, when doing video chats with the pretty girl in the picture she could barely speak a word of understandable English. Probably not the same person. After about 3 such claims during text sessions she said she would help me make money in commodity trading, all I needed to do was open an account with her. Hahaha.

While in Bangkok I also encountered many old hags from various massage places and too many ladyboys. But, there were also plenty of other girls looking to hook up with a generous man. While in a Thai resort area, the percentage of regular girls increased quite a bit. I also met a non-working Thai girl who joined me for a few days with no money exchanged (I did buy her meals and various forms of entertainment, which we both enjoyed).

Next trip I will either have something prearranged with a [URL]ThaiFriendly.com[/URL] girl or I will arrange more meetings with WeChat girls.

[QUOTE=ParkVille;2032197]So I fired up wechat for the first time, at 12:30 midnight, Saturday night. And so on Sukhumvit 15, It's 85% ladyboys, 10% massage shops and 5% ugly women over 30 (over 30 *and* ugly). I guess because I'm near Nana or this is a lady boy area. I should try this app at a better time / location. However, I am not super far from Climax though, so it should be picking up better options right?[/QUOTE]Damn, 50% ladyboys I could [I]maybe[/I] deal with, but 85% is way too much.

One advantage of online services is supposed to be easier filtering than in real life (leading to a more targeted selection). Unfortunately, on WeChat this seems not to be the case at all. In addition, WeChat app is horrid (slow, battery-killer, requiring access to all your personal data). I tried it a few years back and gave up, but I thought it got better, at least for mongering, in the meantime. Apparently, this is not the case.

[QUOTE=Crocodilexp;2032427]Damn, 50% ladyboys I could [I]maybe[/I] deal with, but 85% is way too much.
[/QUOTE]I fired it up in Sathorn area, and quite a few girls came up within 2 km, 3 looked excellent if pics are for real. Percentage of Ladyboys looked lower than 50% at first glance, of course I only expanded thumbnails that looked promising so not a comprehensive count of LBs. I would have preferred the App to separate Ladyboys from females though. I guess the problem is that LBs see themselves as being female, so that is why they are in the female category. Unfortunately we pussy lovers don't see those with a dick as female.

I'm considering renting in Bangkok for 6-12 months, preferably near Sukhumvit. Which are the best rental websites in Bangkok?

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2032758]I'm considering renting in Bangkok for 6-12 months, preferably near Sukhumvit. Which are the best rental websites in Bangkok?[/QUOTE]I prefer to stay at a place for 1 week or 1 month to try it out first. I use AirBnB and if I like it I can either contact the host about a good monthly price or just find someone in the complex who rents for 6-12 months. It's a buyers market so you can get a decent deal on airbnb and shop around and really even bargain while you are just staying via airbnb temporarily.

[QUOTE=ParkVille;2032197]So I fired up wechat for the first time, at 12:30 midnight, Saturday night. And so onn Sukhumvit 15, It's 85% ladyboys, 10% massage shops and 5% ugly women over 30 (over 30 *and* ugly). I guess because I'm near Nana or this is a lady boy area. I should try this app at a better time / location. However, I am not super far from Climax though, so it should be picking up better options right?[/QUOTE]Honestly, I find the best girls on Ratchada but have found decent ones on Soi 11 as well. It depends how many are online to determine how far away the app shows you who's onlin.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2032031]I loaded We Chat for first time, since previously I did not see myself opening myself to enter society of have miscellaneous unknown persons contacting me. LOL.

I have to get my brain out of the dinosaur actual physically meeting programming. Ha ha. Likewise I am yet to get into escorts for same reason.

Did the location search, and I must admit to being surprised that 3 relatively gorgeous girls showed up close by (Sathorn) with fab natural upturned noses, at least within 2 km. Like Wow. I did not expect that good. My next problems to deal with, will be seeing the body of the girl, I suppose can ask for video call? The pros for WeChat (or any other good alternative) could perhaps give advice. Also how wide is the price range for ST girls. Are real stunners likely to be expensive?

Are the girl photos typically very realistic or somewhat shopped?

I was a little disappointed with filters. I see can filter to females only, but that does not exclude Ladyboys. I was hoping the App would have more advanced filters like should me black girls for example or non Thai girls, or set the age range, or exclude silicones, ha ha. Just kidding on that one. I select Females only and still males show up. Perhaps they never specified what gender they are. Also many person show as close by yet region is in China or far away. Can these all be tourists here?

One very pretty girl Pim's comment is "Single". Is this a clue she is not a hooker?

I can see that on a night out in Bangkok, having struck out at all the places I intended to check, I can just do the vicinity check to see what pops up, somewhere not too far from the ST Hotels.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Bkkdog;2033235]Depending on the number of ladies who are using the people nearby feature at any on e given time, it could be only 2 KM or up to 10 KM. AR peak times in the Suk area, it may only be 2 KM but there will be many ladies. Other times in the early mornings it will be 5 KM or more. Outside Bangkok I have seen up to 20 KM.

There is no real way to judge the bodies of the ladies accept by whatever photos they provide. However, what you could do is ask them to do a video call with you. This may help you to decide. I never bother with this since I can just go and meet them to check them out. I generally choose the ladies within 2 KM of my location so if I go to meet them and I don't like what I see, I can call off the encounter. Being so close to me, it's no big deal.

To keep in the spirit of this thread being for massage, I can relate this post. Most of the shops in Sukhumvit have asked the ladies to play we chat to help find customers. I would say about 50% play at one time or another depending on how busy they are. I've negotiated many services with massage ladies in shops like the old Boss massage. It saved me walking in to do it. If the lady does not agree, I don't need to waste a trip inside. I've also tried this on Ratchada where there are many ladies playing as well. May of the punters on Ratchada are Chinese and they use We Chat exclusively and the ladies know it so they play as well.[/QUOTE]Not sure if you saw my reply so here it is again for you here.

The single in their profile means they want attention in some form or another. 80% of the ladies will offer P4P.

"Anyone heard of this? Worse than the USA? "In Thailand, because of Thai law, all property is wife's name. In Thailand, you have no right to property. There is more and more western men who end up homeless because they are evicted from their land and apartments by their loving wifes and GF's. What is disturbing for me, many blue pill, go to these places and invest into business like hotels or fishfarms, hoping for good life with good wife or girlfriend, just to loose 100% of their investment. No wonder Thailand is booming. The whole country is basically running a scam on western, naive men, who failed to understand their legal position in Thailand.

So it's not even 50% divorce [url=http://isgprohibitedwords.info?CodeWord=CodeWord123][CodeWord123][/url], in Thailand you loose 100% if you are foreign man. You are legally robbed by these vultures. Being robbed isn't really that bad in Thailand. Some loving girlfriends and wives go one step further and hire assassins to finish you off to inherit your property you may have left in your home country. There is disturbing huge amount of foreign men who jump off balcony in Thailand. So many 'suicides' happen in Thailand, there is even funny name for such men - 'flying Farangs'. If you are married with property or money to inherit you may signed death on yourself on your wedding day. If you have something precious in your condo your GF may tip you up to local thugs and you may end up murdered or robbed. So many western men end up dead in Thailand there is even website tracking these deaths:

[URL]https://www.reddit.com/r/MGTOW/comme...ilipino_women/[/URL]

Sounds like getting married in Thailand to a local Thai girl might be a free way to get "Flying Lessons" from a skyscraper balcony from her local boyfriends!

37 yrs old virgin and finally gathered the balls to go to Bangkok tonight with two of my close buddies. Over the last two days a cyst / whitehead developed at the place where my leg meets the groin:

It was hard and painless first and now from the last twenty four hours it hurts and is very tender. I had so many dreams and hopes. I don't think its right on my part to seek a provider with this cyst / whitehead. They don't even believe me if I tell them its a whitehead. I don't know if it will subside or go away in the next 4 days. I'm using Benzoyl Peroxide cream to treat it. Can't go to any doctor now also because its a Sunday and this isn't an emergency. Can't say how disappointed I am. The trip is on and my buddies (We've planned this for long) will get hurt if I don't come along. I just told my buddies about it and they are sad and are hoping it will subside. I guess I'll just enjoy the hotel and the food in BKK. I leave to BKK in the next 5 hours. Somewhat hoping that I will find some acne bandages in Pharmacies in and out Sukhimvit Area and hoping it will go away.

[QUOTE=Travv;2049570]In Thailand, because of Thai law, all property is wife's name. In Thailand, you have no right to property. [/QUOTE]Not entirely true. Landed (freehold) properties cannot be owned by foreigners but some condos can.

[QUOTE=Kerrstar;2066887]Not entirely true. Landed (freehold) properties cannot be owned by foreigners but some condos can.[/QUOTE]Land can also of freehold type be owned by Americans. I think the big issue is how inheritance of Condominium freehold is that its not guaranteed despite my will. If you invest in another persons name that is a big risk. Don't do that with money you can't lose. I don't go to Vegas with my last paycheck.

[QUOTE=MakeItOrBreak;2067014]Land can also of freehold type be owned by Americans.[/QUOTE]Really, I did not know that. I'm Australian. I think one of the biggest issues with buying condos off the plan is that the developers are pretty dodgy. If I was ever going to buy in Thailand I would do it throug an offshore company, then inheritance shouldn't be an issue.

Isn't there a new rule that freehold land can now be purchased by a non Thai can but ownership returns to Thailand in 90 years? I may be totally off on this statement. Just what I think I read last year.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2067144]Isn't there a new rule that freehold land can now be purchased by a non Thai can but ownership returns to Thailand in 90 years? I may be totally off on this statement. Just what I think I read last year.[/QUOTE]I read a post on another forum written by a farang living in LOS for around 4 years. He has outlined the process. If there is no conflict of interest posting the link here, I would. But I might just as well PM you.

[QUOTE=DesertFox1;2066669]37 yrs old virgin and finally gathered the balls to go to Bangkok tonight with two of my close buddies. Over the last two days a cyst / whitehead developed at the place where my leg meets the groin:

It was hard and painless first and now from the last twenty four hours it hurts and is very tender. I had so many dreams and hopes. I don't think its right on my part to seek a provider with this cyst / whitehead. They don't even believe me if I tell them its a whitehead. I don't know if it will subside or go away in the next 4 days. I'm using Benzoyl Peroxide cream to treat it. Can't go to any doctor now also because its a Sunday and this isn't an emergency. Can't say how disappointed I am. The trip is on and my buddies (We've planned this for long) will get hurt if I don't come along. I just told my buddies about it and they are sad and are hoping it will subside. I guess I'll just enjoy the hotel and the food in BKK. I leave to BKK in the next 5 hours. Somewhat hoping that I will find some acne bandages in Pharmacies in and out Sukhimvit Area and hoping it will go away.[/QUOTE]Is this just a blemish / pimple or something benign you are familiar with from prior occurrence? Possibly an in-grown hair? If so, take a tip from the girls when they get a blemish or pimple on their face, which often happens when they get their period or soon will get their period; tap and blend in a small dab of "concealer" on the critter and watch it disappear. Visually disappear, that is. It will still be felt if touched, of course.

You can buy this kind of make-up at Boots or Watsons, Big C, all over the place. It is usually a liquidy type product only about 150-200 baht, comes in small containers like a lipstick. Look for as clean and healthy, less oily, version of it you can find. Yes, it will wash off in a shower, but keep the small container in your pants pocket and apply another dab of it after showering. So this time you will not take a shower with a girl. But with this kind of make up product and somewhat dim lighting, I doubt she will see or be bothered by your blemish / pimple.

[QUOTE=DesertFox1;2066669]37 yrs old virgin and finally gathered the balls to go to Bangkok tonight with two of my close buddies. Over the last two days a cyst / whitehead developed at the place where my leg meets the groin:

It was hard and painless first and now from the last twenty four hours it hurts and is very tender. I had so many dreams and hopes. I don't think its right on my part to seek a provider with this cyst / whitehead. They don't even believe me if I tell them its a whitehead. I don't know if it will subside or go away in the next 4 days. I'm using Benzoyl Peroxide cream to treat it. Can't go to any doctor now also because its a Sunday and this isn't an emergency. Can't say how disappointed I am. The trip is on and my buddies (We've planned this for long) will get hurt if I don't come along. I just told my buddies about it and they are sad and are hoping it will subside. I guess I'll just enjoy the hotel and the food in BKK. I leave to BKK in the next 5 hours. Somewhat hoping that I will find some acne bandages in Pharmacies in and out Sukhimvit Area and hoping it will go away.[/QUOTE]Hope you got it lanced by doctor to aid fast recovery. Anti-biotics are available. Last time I had something like this, it did not spoil my life completely. I probably stayed home for a couple of days and girls did not comment on it, even could be felt if balls massaged (smaller at that time). Subsequently there is nothing.

You go to the clinic to get certificate of having no sex diseases. Obviously can't get a Virgin's certificate. LOL.

Find the right Thai girl to teach you all about sex and how to do the girl right. LOL At 35, one Thai girl trained me how to do better oral on her pussy.

[QUOTE=Travv;2049570]Anyone heard of this? Worse than the USA? "In Thailand, because of Thai law, all property is wife's name. In Thailand, you have no right to property. There is more and more western men who end up homeless because they are evicted from their land and apartments by their loving wifes and GF's.[/QUOTE]

That is simply not true. In Thailand, a foreigner cannot own land. You can still rent, own a condo (under certain conditions), own a car, a bank account, and so on, entirely in your name and with sole control over it. In case of a divorce, marital property should legally be split 50:50, but in practice, the wife doesn't get much of that, let alone future payments for child support or alimony. It's worth a mention that countries like Thailand don't have strong rule of law, so in case of a dispute you might be up for a long and dirty battle. Anyone with half a brain would keep most of their assets abroad.

The men who are evicted are usually elderly idiots who use all their savings to buy land "in the name" of an ex-hooker (sometimes just a girlfriend), and build a house on it, assuming they'll have control or fully trusting their faithful gold-digger not to take what's legally her own property.

[QUOTE=DesertFox1;2066669]37 yrs old virgin and finally gathered the balls to go to Bangkok tonight with two of my close buddies. Over the last two days a cyst / whitehead developed at the place where my leg meets the groin:

It was hard and painless first and now from the last twenty four hours it hurts and is very tender. I had so many dreams and hopes. I don't think its right on my part to seek a provider with this cyst / whitehead. They don't even believe me if I tell them its a whitehead. I don't know if it will subside or go away in the next 4 days. I'm using Benzoyl Peroxide cream to treat it. Can't go to any doctor now also because its a Sunday and this isn't an emergency. Can't say how disappointed I am. The trip is on and my buddies (We've planned this for long) will get hurt if I don't come along. I just told my buddies about it and they are sad and are hoping it will subside. I guess I'll just enjoy the hotel and the food in BKK. I leave to BKK in the next 5 hours. Somewhat hoping that I will find some acne bandages in Pharmacies in and out Sukhimvit Area and hoping it will go away.[/QUOTE]Just buy some anti-biotics while you're here. It's easy and cheap to buy over the counter. Doxycycline in particular should clear up your skin pretty quickly. I was prescribed it for a non STI skin infection (it is prescribed also for a lot of different STI's), but a good benefit is that it will clear up your acne or skin infections pretty quickly. You will also still be able to drink alchohol without it affecting the effectiveness of the medication.

[QUOTE=Crocodilexp;2068866]That is simply not true. In Thailand, a foreigner cannot own land. You can still rent, own a condo (under certain conditions)[/QUOTE]Other than marrying a Thai wife or starting a Thai company, a foreigner can not own but can lease land for 30 years.

From Siam Legal:

"Option 2: Leasehold Agreements.

Buying Thai real estate under a leasehold interest is a very popular and preferred way for foreigners to acquire property in Thailand.

Why is it the favored alternative?

It is simple and straightforward.

Foreigners can obtain full interest on a lease in Thailand throughout the specified lease term.

This is preferred over purchasing through a limited company where you have several shareholders who may have interests that are different from yours.

You can transfer the leasehold interest or even sell it the same as you would for any other freehold title conveyance in Thailand.

The maximum lease term is 30 years.

An option to renew will not be automatic and an additional 30 year periods will depend on careful drafting and discretion of the Registrar at the Land Office. ".

I'm looking for some guidance on where to go to for some vacation I did Phuket twice and really enjoyed it there. Since it has been a few years since those trips and I have been there I'm looking for suggestions. Should be a place to relax and shutoff but not too far away from the available pussy. BKK is not it except for a day or so during travel. All suggestions for a middle between orgy and family vacation are welcome. Possible traveling alone maybe with a friend if he can get some vacation planning to leave in the next two weeks and staying for two to three weeks.

[QUOTE=TheDoc007;2069782]I'm looking for some guidance on where to go to for some vacation I did Phuket twice and really enjoyed it there. Since it has been a few years since those trips and I have been there I'm looking for suggestions. Should be a place to relax and shutoff but not too far away from the available pussy. BKK is not it except for a day or so during travel. All suggestions for a middle between orgy and family vacation are welcome. Possible traveling alone maybe with a friend if he can get some vacation planning to leave in the next two weeks and staying for two to three weeks.[/QUOTE]If you are specifically set out for Thailand do you want to be in the same place all the time? Anyways Samui seems to fit the bill your looking for in all departments. It's a big island so possible to explore some nice views and sights.

Good luck!

If you want anything to do with hobbying, the obvious answer is Pattaya.

To TheDoc007, you could also spend some time RTFF named Other Areas and or Reports of Distinction and see what you discover. There are numerous places with a smaller to much smaller scene. Is your emphasis on pussy or on chillin?

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2070129]If you want anything to do with hobbying, the obvious answer is Pattaya.[/QUOTE]After 29 hours straight in Pattaya as I write, and after becoming totally drained (I could not agree more. Some very useful recent trip reports are available including a 5 day guide to Bkk and Pattaya by a poster.

Pattaya taxis were told about a week ago that they MUST turn on their meters. This has been a law for about a year now but no taxi I have ever been in Pattaya turns on their meters. Has anyone come across one who did?

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2091798]Pattaya taxis were told about a week ago that they MUST turn on their meters. This has been a law for about a year now but no taxi I have ever been in Pattaya turns on their meters. Has anyone come across one who did?[/QUOTE]What is the perfect central location to be in, in Pattaya, to minimise need to use taxis? Is it practical to try to mostly avoid taxis? Not having been in Pattaya for many years I don't know much about operating hours for the "Song Thaews" (sometimes known as Baht bus but definitely no bus).

I am sure no one enjoys paying ridiculous amounts to the taxis but is there always a good option? In Bangkok coming home from Cowboy 5 km by taxi is a good option at under 80 Baht. However I could see that in Pattaya you might want to be a lot closer to the action.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2091811]What is the perfect central location to be in, in Pattaya, to minimise need to use taxis? Is it practical to try to mostly avoid taxis? Not having been in Pattaya for many years I don't know much about operating hours for the "Song Thaews" (sometimes known as Baht bus but definitely no bus).

I am sure no one enjoys paying ridiculous amounts to the taxis but is there always a good option? In Bangkok coming home from Cowboy 5 km by taxi is a good option at under 80 Baht. However I could see that in Pattaya you might want to be a lot closer to the action.[/QUOTE]For me the best area to stay in the area between Beach Road and Soi Bukhao and Walking street and Pattaya Central. That's a pretty large swath of territory and there are plenty of options to choose from as far as Hotels, Condos, etc. LK Metro would kind of put you right in the middle of where you want to be and its a good point of reference.

The Songtaws (Baht Buses) are really easy to use and are running pretty much constantly up 2nd and Beach road and up and down Soi Bukhao (you hardly ever have to wait more than a minute or two for one). So very easy to get to and from Soi 6, LK Metro or Walking Street.

I rarely use regular taxis in Patts. Motorbike taxis are great and I use them frequently. It's 60 baht from my Condo to Soi 6 (which is about 2 km). Uber is good if you want to get to locations that are farther away like some of the G Clubs. Though I have been left stranded waiting for Uber on a couple of occasions coming back from the Drinking Street Beerbar complex.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2091811]What is the perfect central location to be in, in Pattaya, to minimise need to use taxis? Is it practical to try to mostly avoid taxis? Not having been in Pattaya for many years I don't know much about operating hours for the "Song Thaews" (sometimes known as Baht bus but definitely no bus). [/QUOTE]Uncle V. already mentioned the perfect central location. As for the operating hours of the song thaews: they are running 24 hours a day in this area.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2091811]What is the perfect central location to be in, in Pattaya, to minimise need to use taxis? Is it practical to try to mostly avoid taxis? Not having been in Pattaya for many years I don't know much about operating hours for the "Song Thaews" (sometimes known as Baht bus but definitely no bus).

I am sure no one enjoys paying ridiculous amounts to the taxis but is there always a good option? In Bangkok coming home from Cowboy 5 km by taxi is a good option at under 80 Baht. However I could see that in Pattaya you might want to be a lot closer to the action.[/QUOTE]Unless it's a block or two no taxi will take you anywhere for under 200 baht. The taxi mafia refuses to use taxi meters even though they have recently been told again that they must use meters.

Depends what your budget is for a hotel and what you plan on doing in Pattaya. This has been discussed in the Pattaya hotel thread. Since I believe you are mainly a gogo guy you can stay at places near Walking Street like Baywalk Residence, Aya Boutique Hotel, or LK Empress. If you want to stay at a place you can get home easily with your gogo date you can stay at Baraquda or Avani Hotel. If you want to be conveniently located to both Walking Street and LK Metro I would recommend LK Residence or LK Metropole, both are steps from the LK Metro gogo bars. Quick to get to and from Walking Street using the Soi Buakhao baht bus to go to Walking Street and returning home on 2nd Road. These hotels are all in the area Uncle V mentioned.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2092090]Since I believe you are mainly a gogo guy you can stay at places near Walking Street like Baywalk Residence, Aya Boutique Hotel, or LK Empress. If you want to stay at a place you can get home easily with your gogo date you can stay at Baraquda or Avani Hotel. If you want to be conveniently located to both Walking Street and LK Metro I would recommend LK Residence or LK Metropole, both are steps from the LK Metro gogo bars. Quick to get to and from Walking Street using the Soi Buakhao baht bus to go to Walking Street and returning home on 2nd Road. These hotels are all in the area Uncle V mentioned.[/QUOTE]Thanks for info.

I am not really "a mainly gogo" guy, however I just go anywhere I can find pretty girls with really great bodies (limited defects) that are really into Farangs more so than other types of guys. It just happens that a bar is place where can check out thoroughly the body of the girl and the check the vibe between the two people. I don't usually buy if unsure. Can spend time and ask her questions to discover her attitudes. Can determine if she might be a GFE and into DFK. I don't need pornstars so much. I presume you don't also. I have to admit to liking girls better when they have no clothes on. LOL I would like to cut back on bargirls where I can find cheaper alternatives. I only have one regular who spends the whole night with me (more value), and she was never a bargirl.

In the past I used to be mainly a Soapies guy. Then about 10 years ago I was doing Oilies quite heavily. Never been that big on freelancers and SWs as get too many shocks when they take the clothes off and most of them are not planning on fucking for well over 30 minutes (Low success rate for me), where I am a 60 to 90 minute guy (even two hours for really experienced and high stamina girls).

Soapies vastly deteriorated over the years due to Surgeries and due to declining girl attitudes and increase in dick scared girls used to doing Asian customers. Became hard to find real natural beauties that were also GFE and horny, but still possible. With Oilies, well it is just so hard to find pretty girls there, and they don't seem to last long. Hell I can even do BJ bars if I can find a girl with good enough face and body. Just does not excite me to fuck very average type of girls, when GF has a very hot curvy body.

The other thing I like is when a lot of monger venues are real close to each other. Then can move from one to another till find something I like. Plenty of times entered several massage shops in succession not quite finding the girl hot enough for me. Sometimes looked in several bars in succession and even walked up and down a Soi looking for a pretty freelancer (are there any?) LOL

So clearly the best aspect of Pattaya has to be the concentration of monger venues close to each other.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2091811]What is the perfect central location to be in, in Pattaya, to minimise need to use taxis? Is it practical to try to mostly avoid taxis? Not having been in Pattaya for many years I don't know much about operating hours for the "Song Thaews" (sometimes known as Baht bus but definitely no bus).

I am sure no one enjoys paying ridiculous amounts to the taxis but is there always a good option? In Bangkok coming home from Cowboy 5 km by taxi is a good option at under 80 Baht. However I could see that in Pattaya you might want to be a lot closer to the action.[/QUOTE]I am in Phuket, but my experience with motor bike taxies, is after one gives me a ride, I hand him my phone and have him put in his number. If you are doing the same trip several times you know the price before you call. Have a few to call in case he is busy.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2091811]What is the perfect central location to be in, in Pattaya, to minimise need to use taxis? Is it practical to try to mostly avoid taxis? Not having been in Pattaya for many years I don't know much about operating hours for the "Song Thaews" (sometimes known as Baht bus but definitely no bus). [/QUOTE]Anywhere close to Beach Road or Second Road. The most reliable, 24/7 songtaew line goes loops from Dolphin Monument to Walking Street along Beach Road, and then back along Second Road. There are other lines, of course, but less frequent, and perhaps not active at night.

I stay in that area and virtually never use taxis in Pattaya. To be honest, I don't see much of interest beyond the Third Road to the east and North Pattaya Road, though I know there are some venues that way.

Jomtien is also served by songtaew, but requires changing near South Pattaya intersection. Same line serves the bus station with buses to Suvarnabhumi (near Thepprasit v Thappraya junction), which is more convenient than the station on and Pattaya Road. Seems like the powers that be removed public songtaews along that road (to the main bus station there), in order to maximize extortion opportunities (songteaw departing from bus station charges 50 baht for a ride that costs 10 baht everywhere else, and there isn't one going the other way).

Bangkokroughguide? Sorry. Not trying to advertise another site here but it seems to have disappeared without a trace. This was a busy site too. I know several posters here posted there too. Anyone know what happened?

Hi!

I live on the north side of Bangkok off Ladprao Rd between Ratchadapisek and Phahonyothin. While I've found a couple good MP's for a regular massage, I'm not having any luck finding a place that offers extras. The closest would be further down Ratchadapisek, which is fine. Some days I just don't feel like dealing with the mrt!

Can anyone recommend a MP offering extras in that area of Ladprao Road, or anywhere close. I'm often near the intersection of Ratchada / Phahonyothin near Major Ratchada. Is there any along Phahonyothin north of that intersection?

Many thanks!

Other than Pattaya and Bangkok, which SEA cities are the best to go to with gogo style clubs or maybe INDOOR bars like those near Riverside 136/130 in Phnom Penh? I DO NOT enjoy outdoor bars.

I am not interested in places like iBar / Insomnia in Pattaya or other pick up bars where the music is so loud I can't easily speak with the girl or it is so crowded with guys where my girl and I don't have our own space. Places like Beach Club and Thai Club in Kuala Lumpur are ok. Ipanema in Singapore is bearable. I'd prefer to have my girl in my arms by 9 pm and go out with them all night rather than wait until 3 am to pick up a girl.

Any ideas appreciated. Ho Chi Minh? Kuala Lumpur? Singapore? Jakarta? Phuket? Angeles City? Anywhere else?

[QUOTE=DaysOff;2095743]Hi!

I live on the north side of Bangkok off Ladprao Rd between Ratchadapisek and Phahonyothin. While I've found a couple good MP's for a regular massage, I'm not having any luck finding a place that offers extras. The closest would be further down Ratchadapisek, which is fine. Some days I just don't feel like dealing with the mrt!

Can anyone recommend a MP offering extras in that area of Ladprao Road, or anywhere close. I'm often near the intersection of Ratchada / Phahonyothin near Major Ratchada. Is there any along Phahonyothin north of that intersection?

Many thanks![/QUOTE]Many that know something maybe lazy to answer since you give a very lazy impression from your post. I don't have the personal experience (not in the area) but can still find stuff easy enough.

Even Poseidon Soapy is not that far away. I travel several km to monger so why not you too, or live closer to the action.

[URL]https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?mid=1ISbrDE74nTvobhywbnRF6BxyM2Y&hl=en_US&ll=13.815478255301876%2C100.5625662829284&z=16[/URL]

[URL]http://www.nurugelexport.com/nuru-massage-locations/thailand/6[/URL]

[URL]http://www.kapooclub.com/?s=Lad[/URL]+Prao.

Perhaps you can drive the translate of Thai to English on Google.

Also you can feed in Chatuchak for search functions.

Hmmm. Sorry to give you the idea that I'm lazy. I've done quite a bit of searching prior to posting my question. This searching included a number of visits to local MP's. I will continue investigating the area. My guess is I will have to travel if I want these services. However, seeking something closer and more convenient isn't lazy. Just simply logical.

Thanks for taking the time to reply.

DO.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2100107]Many that know something maybe lazy to answer since you give a very lazy impression from your post. I don't have the personal experience (not in the area) but can still find stuff easy enough.

Even Poseidon Soapy is not that far away. I travel several km to monger so why not you too, or live closer to the action.

[URL]https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?mid=1ISbrDE74nTvobhywbnRF6BxyM2Y&hl=en_US&ll=13.815478255301876%2C100.5625662829284&z=16[/URL]

[URL]http://www.nurugelexport.com/nuru-massage-locations/thailand/6[/URL]

[URL]http://www.kapooclub.com/?s=Lad[/URL]+Prao.

Perhaps you can drive the translate of Thai to English on Google.

Also you can feed in Chatuchak for search functions.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=DaysOff;2100331]Hmmm. Sorry to give you the idea that I'm lazy. I've done quite a bit of searching prior to posting my question. This searching included a number of visits to local MP's. I will continue investigating the area. My guess is I will have to travel if I want these services. However, seeking something closer and more convenient isn't lazy. Just simply logical.

Thanks for taking the time to reply.

DO.[/QUOTE]Yes, you may well not be as lazy as your prior post suggests. LOL One needs to be careful how we word things these days. So would help if you posted some detail about what places you tried nearby. The info you give, the more you might inspire someone who lives in your area to give up some knowledge. It isn't me that knows the area at all.

To me it is not quite logical to go looking for action in the nearest place that might provide. I prefer to go to best places with girls to suit my style and spec. Probably very Thai oriented places are not going to suit me (Thais normally pop so quick). That (my style) could require more effort but also reward better. My most regular Gik lives in a district that is 14 km away from me. This requires a 20 to 25 min taxi ride late at night and worse in daytime. I just have to accept it. I keep hoping she will move to my side of town. I have thought about what would happen if we were in the same apartment block. LOL I might get bored with her.

What is logical for me is to travel to a location where some sure thing girls are available, even if not close by.

Maybe the difference is I am very picky about who is a good or adequate fuck, to be worth actually spending any money on it. Quality of looks stamina and attitude is required for me. Others may just want a HJ and any girl will do. Put a bag over her head. LOL.

I once lived near to Udom Suk but never checked out the local Thai oriented monger venues. Perhaps I was wrong not to do that, however just feared a lot of wasted money finding unsuitable girls.

Have a weekend free in Asia when going to China, and wondering if it's worth taking the trip to Pattaya just for 2 or 3 days. I know the mongering scene in BKK very well but I've never been in Pattaya.

[QUOTE=Petzno;2106075]Have a weekend free in Asia when going to China, and wondering if it's worth taking the trip to Pattaya just for 2 or 3 days. I know the mongering scene in BKK very well but I've never been in Pattaya.[/QUOTE]If you know the BKK scene so well, why have you not posted anything?

Pattaya is fun also.

[QUOTE=Petzno;2106075]Have a weekend free in Asia when going to China, and wondering if it's worth taking the trip to Pattaya just for 2 or 3 days. I know the mongering scene in BKK very well but I've never been in Pattaya.[/QUOTE]It is worth it because the vibe is very different from BKK and a cool thing to experience. However, you need to decide whether you want to devote X-hours just on travel (time to the airport in China, flight to BKK, commute to Pattaya, and then back again). If coming from South China then more bearable but flying in from Shanghai or Beijing, you're looking at close to 20 hours all-in just on the travel for a weekend!

Fact: I love BKK and Patty and have been there a couple of times.

Problem: Supervisor at home that would really question a single guy trip to Patty. I need the best fking excuse in the world to go to BKK for another 5-7 days and then escape to Patty with the bus. A business opportunity, my best friends wedding / funeral or helping an old friend become sober would work. (I have been looking for jobs that require frequent travelling to BKK just for this).

I need your help guys, what excuse could I have to go to BKK, or even to Patty? Give me all your ideas!

[QUOTE=Andersson25;2108504]Fact: I love BKK and Patty and have been there a couple of times.

Problem: Supervisor at home that would really question a single guy trip to Patty. I need the best fking excuse in the world to go to BKK for another 5-7 days and then escape to Patty with the bus. A business opportunity, my best friends wedding / funeral or helping an old friend become sober would work. (I have been looking for jobs that require frequent travelling to BKK just for this).

I need your help guys, what excuse could I have to go to BKK, or even to Patty? Give me all your ideas![/QUOTE]Wow excellent reports for the couple of times you been their, keep up the hard and good work, be a man and say I'm going to Thailand, or write it 150 times on blackboard and keep being a sixed grader! See problem easily solved!

Keep a poker face and say this.

A college time buddy of mine lives in Australia and he is visiting Thailand for work for a week, and he is asking us to join him there for a get together. Some of my other friends are working in the vicinity as well, so to make it easy for them I am traveling there.

It worked for me and hopefully will work for you as well.

[QUOTE=Andersson25;2108504]Fact: I love BKK and Patty and have been there a couple of times.

Problem: Supervisor at home that would really question a single guy trip to Patty. I need the best fking excuse in the world to go to BKK for another 5-7 days and then escape to Patty with the bus. A business opportunity, my best friends wedding / funeral or helping an old friend become sober would work. (I have been looking for jobs that require frequent travelling to BKK just for this).

I need your help guys, what excuse could I have to go to BKK, or even to Patty? Give me all your ideas![/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=LoneWolff;2108623]Keep a poker face and say this.

A college time buddy of mine lives in Australia and he is visiting Thailand for work for a week, and he is asking us to join him there for a get together. Some of my other friends are working in the vicinity as well, so to make it easy for them I am traveling there.

It worked for me and hopefully will work for you as well.[/QUOTE]I'm assuming the supervisor at home is the wife? My work is in the automotive industry and fortunately for me there are a lot of factories around Pattaya and Bangkok so I have a good reason to go even though my position doesn't need me top go LOL. Unfortunately my wife would not allow me to go if it involved a friend in any circumstances because she knows there will be trouble afoot.

Good luck.

[QUOTE=Andersson25;2108504]Fact: I love BKK and Patty and have been there a couple of times.

Problem: Supervisor at home that would really question a single guy trip to Patty. I need the best fking excuse in the world to go to BKK for another 5-7 days and then escape to Patty with the bus. A business opportunity, my best friends wedding / funeral or helping an old friend become sober would work. (I have been looking for jobs that require frequent travelling to BKK just for this).

I need your help guys, what excuse could I have to go to BKK, or even to Patty? Give me all your ideas![/QUOTE]Just say you want to go sailing. There's a Yacht Club in Pattaya and they accept day visitors.

For those in Thailand this week remember there are 3 National holidays on December 5, 10, and 11.

I know some gogo bars are shutting down in LK Metro in Pattaya. Now sure what will be open and closed. I'm assuming Walking Street remains open I didn't ask. I use these National Holidays as a day of rest.

[QUOTE=Andersson25;2108504]Fact: I love BKK and Patty and have been there a couple of times.

Problem: Supervisor at home that would really question a single guy trip to Patty. I need the best fking excuse in the world to go to BKK for another 5-7 days and then escape to Patty with the bus. A business opportunity, my best friends wedding / funeral or helping an old friend become sober would work. (I have been looking for jobs that require frequent travelling to BKK just for this).

I need your help guys, what excuse could I have to go to BKK, or even to Patty? Give me all your ideas![/QUOTE]Ummm. Why does your boss need to worry where you are going? Are you employed at the Southern Baptist Convention or your local diocese? If you really must tell them where you are going, then tell them you are visiting the nation where your plane stops (not a lot of direct flights to Thailand from the Western world so I imagine you will connect somewhere). EVA airlines via Taipei? JAL via Tokyo? I've seen flights to SE Asia, that required a change of airport and / or an overnight stay in Tokyo. Text your colleagues a photo from your layover in Japan.

Take a trip to Ankorwat in Cambodia. It's a renowned World Heritage Site. But, you will find Siem Reap's airport is connected to a limited number of foreign airports. And two of them happen to be in Bangkok. In fact, most of the flights seem to REP seem to originate in the Big Mango / You don't have to tell anyone your layover in Thailand lasted until you couldn't fuck any more, so you visited a major cultural attraction in Scambodia while you allowed your "chi" to recharge. Nor do you tell them you spent your final layover in Pattaya before you caught your flight back home.

BTW, I got a great deal on Qatar Airways. DFW to KUL for $654. I told my family and colleagues I was going to Malaysia, so I could try that exotic cuisine and check out historic Georgetown. Completely true. That is part of my agenda. What I didn't tell them was I was also going to take the bus up to Dannok to experience the lowest prices for mongering in Thailand or catch a cheap flight to Bali and experience the X-houses of Sanur. Don't forget. What happens in Asia, stays in Asia.

I have an 18 hour layover in Bangkok tomorrow before I go to UAE which is my final destination. This would be my 4th time but my first time alone. So I have booked a hotel near the action, on Soi 7/1 and have planned on hitting the streets as soon as I arrive. I will be arriving in BKK at 10:30 PM.

Any particular places that I should visit?

[QUOTE=ShadowTech;2134385]I have an 18 hour layover in Bangkok tomorrow before I go to UAE which is my final destination. This would be my 4th time but my first time alone. So I have booked a hotel near the action, on Soi 7/1 and have planned on hitting the streets as soon as I arrive. I will be arriving in BKK at 10:30 PM.

Any particular places that I should visit?[/QUOTE]Obviously Nana Plaza (short walk from where you're staying) plus there are a few good bars on Soi 7/1 that are worth a visit eg. Wood Bar and Dr BJ's. If you're staying in that area you have a huge amount of options within walking distance.

Facial scanning now required to get a SIM card in Thailand. Coinciding with this, another headline in the news today is "7-Eleven in Thailand to start scanning customer's faces".

[QUOTE]BIOMETRIC DATA NOW REQUIRED TO BUY A SIM CARD IN THAILAND

According to reports the governments new laws surrounding the purchase of SIM cards here in the kingdom has now gone into force meaning people wishing to purchase one now need to either have their fingerprints recorded or their face scanned, the new measures have caused quite a stir among privacy advocates.

According to the National Broadcasting Telecommunications Commission head Supakarn Boonjan the biometric measures are the final phase of new SIM card registration which came into effect in February.

Speaking about the new registration procedures a spokesman for the NBTC also said it is the governments wish that everyone who has purchased a SIM card prior to the new measures being in place also submit their data, however a means of carrying this out has yet to be established.

The government claims the new measures are to improve security and stability in the kingdom in the wake of unrest in parts of the kingdom over recent years where SIM cards purchased anonymously have been used to carry out crimes and in extreme cases used to detonate bombs such as the Erawan Shrine bomb in 2015.

Many have stressed concerns over privacy of users as a result of the new regulations with some stating authorities could monitor a user’s movements using GPS from their device, though the government has stressed this is not their intention.

According to Supakarn all Pattaya based vendors of SIM cards are now equipped with devices capable of recording the necessary biometric data of both Thai and foreign customers.

Thai citizens will have their fingerprints checked with those taken for their national identification card or their face scanned and checked against the picture on their ID card.

Foreign citizens will have their face scanned and matched against their passport to prove their identity.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=ShadowTech;2134385]I have an 18 hour layover in Bangkok tomorrow before I go to UAE which is my final destination. [/QUOTE]You could have got better answers by asking well in advance. Tomorrow is very last minute.

There's an urban myth that Thailand has the second highest annual sales rate for Mercedes Benz cars in the world. This myth has been circulating for over 30 years. It's spread to make Thailand look like a rich country. The sales figure for Mercedes cars in Thailand is only a few thousand units a year and they have an assembly plant in the country. The leading countries for Mercedes sales are China, Germany and USA.

Thailand does sell a high number of pickups, second only to the USA.

[QUOTE=EngineDriver;2159019]There's an urban myth that Thailand has the second highest annual sales rate for Mercedes Benz cars in the world. This myth has been circulating for over 30 years. It's spread to make Thailand look like a rich country. The sales figure for Mercedes cars in Thailand is only a few thousand units a year and they have an assembly plant in the country. The leading countries for Mercedes sales are China, Germany and USA.

Thailand does sell a high number of pickups, second only to the USA.[/QUOTE]You might want to factor in the population, and so sales rate per million persons, otherwise it is a nonsense to compare to China. LOL.

Maybe Thailand does have a lot of wealthy people per million. Not like my country where there is a huge percentage of in between people neither very rich not very poor.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2159080]You might want to factor in the population, and so sales rate per million persons, otherwise it is a nonsense to compare to China. LOL.

Maybe Thailand does have a lot of wealthy people per million. Not like my country where there is a huge percentage of in between people neither very rich not very poor.[/QUOTE]The myth promotes absolute numbers, not per capita.

Can someone tell me why Thais have no commonsense, logic, general knowledge or intellectual curiosity. Is it their poor schooling, culture, laziness or what? Their average IQ of 90 is around 10 points below the average American, which is a lot.

[QUOTE=EngineDriver;2159087]Can someone tell me why Thais have no commonsense, logic, general knowledge or intellectual curiosity. Is it their poor schooling, culture, laziness or what? Their average IQ of 90 is around 10 points below the average American, which is a lot.[/QUOTE]555. You might be meeting the lower educated part of the population. My dentist clinic had guys with US Qualifications.

I must admit I get astonished by how slow and inefficient Thai workers are, e.g. in the coffee shop, so it is part of the culture.

Thais may only get a distorted view of the world from Farang movies dubbed into Thai. Also where the princess was visiting today, and prime minister's propaganda.

Can you tell me why Americans know so little about other countries? LOL OS News used to be exclusively focussed on where president was visiting today. LOL.
"Do the beaches in my country have any sand? One asked me.

Plenty of posters on this forum could be accused of being quite illogical, and over imaginative of extremes that might happen (but don't).

One bad girl met, and the poster says he will never return to that place. Ha ha. That is what I call emotional and illogical. Can get a bad experience absolutely anywhere. Tempers interfere with sensible thought processes.

Imagine what Thai people think of men in other countries given the quality, or lack thereof, of men visiting Thailand, especially Pattaya.

[QUOTE=EngineDriver;2159087]Can someone tell me why Thais have no commonsense, logic, general knowledge or intellectual curiosity. Is it their poor schooling, culture, laziness or what? Their average IQ of 90 is around 10 points below the average American, which is a lot.[/QUOTE]I would not venture into such a debate.

Similarly I might not be impressed by the average education and culture in your country.

Thais, and other so called third world, suffer of a wide spread poorness that doesn't help in the development and improvement of the average status, social, economic, cultural.

Nevertheless there are tons of well educated Thais running corporate, establishing businesses, investing into entrepreneurship and sophisticated industries or activities.

The same in other poor countries.

Some sort of laziness belongs to "climate areas". Maybe, a scientist can tell better, a natural defence for the local human kind.

How do you fight the effects of super high humidity, very hot temperatures, if not by slowing down and reduce the resources needed by the body for not challenging it?

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2159605]Imagine what Thai people think of men in other countries given the quality, or lack thereof, of men visiting Thailand, especially Pattaya.[/QUOTE]👏128079;128079;128079;128079;128079;128079;.

[QUOTE=BionicMan;2160211]👏👏👏👏👏👏👏.[/QUOTE]I this what you intended? Auto corrector stuffs it up.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2159605]Imagine what Thai people think of men in other countries given the quality, or lack thereof, of men visiting Thailand, especially Pattaya.[/QUOTE]They're probably very envious of them. Able to travel to warm climates, pockets full cash, banging an endless number of hot, young girls, drinking and generally leading a very decadent life!

No seriously, I get what you mean. They would seem to be low class people with no morals, shamelessly and openly cavorting with prostitutes.

[QUOTE=Eszpresszo;2112738]Don't forget. What happens in Asia, stays in Asia.[/QUOTE]Unless perhaps you are British. A number of them seem to make the news periodically.

[QUOTE=EngineDriver;2160317]
No seriously, I get what you mean. They would seem to be low class people with no morals, shamelessly and openly cavorting with prostitutes.[/QUOTE]You got it wrong. Thai men have no qualms about cavorting with prostitutes and low standard of morals (for some views), however more behind closed doors. It is the standard of behaviour of Farangs (and way they dress) that makes them looks bad. Lacking politeness, arrogance, looking for trouble, very loud discussion of things not suitable in public, and the British are champions of loud foul language in my experience here. Then there is the issue of how often foreigners might take a shower to get rid of their stink.

Americans can also be very loud as can the Thais, however it tends to be when having fun and choice of words matters.

I have had to learn to try to be more polite than normal, when someone irritates me.

I saw some footage of the Womens World Cup qualifier match between Thailand and Australia. My god those Thai women were ugly. A team full of butch lesbians. Yikes.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2167512]You got it wrong. Thai men have no qualms about cavorting with prostitutes and low standard of morals (for some views), however more behind closed doors. It is the standard of behaviour of Farangs (and way they dress) that makes them looks bad. Lacking politeness, arrogance, looking for trouble, very loud discussion of things not suitable in public, and the British are champions of loud foul language in my experience here. Then there is the issue of how often foreigners might take a shower to get rid of their stink.
[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=EngineDriver;2160317]
No seriously, I get what you mean. They would seem to be low class people with no morals, shamelessly and openly cavorting with prostitutes.[/QUOTE]I don't know why you corrected me. The key word was "openly" in my statement. I suggest you kindly RTFF properly before being critical of a native English speakers post.

[QUOTE=EngineDriver;2169145]I saw some footage of the Womens World Cup qualifier match between Thailand and Australia. My god those Thai women were ugly. A team full of butch lesbians. Yikes.[/QUOTE]Could be katoey. And still couldn't best ghe Aussies LOL.

[QUOTE=EngineDriver;2159087]Can someone tell me why Thais have no commonsense, logic, general knowledge or intellectual curiosity. Is it their poor schooling, culture, laziness or what? Their average IQ of 90 is around 10 points below the average American, which is a lot.[/QUOTE]Can someone tell me why some men walk hand in hand with the girls half their age. It's something for teenagers and looks ridiculous.

[QUOTE=Nordico;2169162]Can someone tell me why some men walk hand in hand with the girls half their age. It's something for teenagers and looks ridiculous.[/QUOTE]Because they do look the same to me and I don't want take the wrong one home LOL. Who cares! Different people like to show different levels of intimacy, do you kiss the girls or let them hug you pre or post coitus? I think you are a younger man and you do not possess the insight to understand. My question to you is why are you looking at old man and not looking at young women?

[QUOTE=Nordico;2169162]Can someone tell me why some men walk hand in hand with the girls half their age. It's something for teenagers and looks ridiculous.[/QUOTE]When I walk around town I leave it to the girl to take my hand, indicate she wants to walk holding hands or not, up to her. 90%+ of the time they transfer whatever they were carrying in the hand on my side to the other hand in order to free it up and reach over to take my hand in theirs. I can't see myself jerking my hand away, recoiling in horror or waving off the attempt because of how it might look to anyone else.

Of course, I will go ahead and initiate it after I have been with a girl 2-3 times and she has made it clear doing it is very much her preference.

So you'd have to ask the girls why they want to be seen walking hand in hand with a man at least twice their age but far more often closer to three times their age.

[QUOTE=RobJones;2169166]Because they do look the same to me and I don't want take the wrong one home LOL. Who cares! Different people like to show different levels of intimacy, do you kiss the girls or let them hug you pre or post coitus? I think you are a younger man and you do not possess the insight to understand. My question to you is why are you looking at old man and not looking at young women?[/QUOTE]"Who cares. " I don't care, but it still looks ridiculous to me (could be a cultural thing). Doesn't even need to be a man twice her age. Walking hand in hand is for young people who are desperately in love. I hope you guys don't fall in love with the girls in Pattaya or you end up buying a herd of water buffaloes.

"I think you are a younger man. " Well, I feel young, but I was born in the 60's.

Why am I "looking at old man and not looking at young women?" There must be something wrong with my eyes, because I see them both and many other things at the same time.

"Because they do look the same to me and I don't want take the wrong one home. " This is a good excuse to walk hand in hand with your rental girlfriend.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2169178]So you'd have to ask the girls why they want to be seen walking hand in hand with a man at least twice their age but far more often closer to three times their age.[/QUOTE]Must be the same reason I always need to know where my wallet is and I don't want to lose it.

[QUOTE=Nordico;2169179]"Who cares. " I don't care, but it still looks ridiculous to me (could be a cultural thing). Doesn't even need to be a man twice her age. Walking hand in hand is for young people who are desperately in love. I hope you guys don't fall in love with the girls in Pattaya or you end up buying a herd of water buffaloes.

"I think you are a younger man. " Well, I feel young, but I was born in the 60's.

Why am I "looking at old man and not looking at young women?" There must be something wrong with my eyes, because I see them both and many other things at the same time.

"Because they do look the same to me and I don't want take the wrong one home. " This is a good excuse to walk hand in hand with your rental girlfriend.[/QUOTE]I don't get the "desperately in love" thing. I think it merely establishes for any potentially interested third parties that we are a romantically involved couple, on a date and not just friends, neighbors or co-workers out for a stroll. Otherwise one or both of you might get hit on with one in-your-face unsolicited hello from an interested third party every 10 minutes.

Which is why doing it is more often the girl's idea than the man's in my opinion. See the wallet comment below. Lol

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2169186]I don't get the "desperately in love" thing. I think it merely establishes for any potentially interested third parties that we are a romantically involved couple, on a date and not just friends, neighbors or co-workers out for a stroll. Otherwise one or both of you might get hit on with one in-your-face unsolicited hello from an interested third party every 10 minutes.

Which is why doing it is more often the girl's idea than the man's in my opinion. See the wallet comment below. Lol[/QUOTE]Ha ha. Not quite establishing a romantic involvement. LOL Maybe a sexual one. However I basically agree.

25 years ago, many Thai girls would not like to hold a Farang's hand. They were shy and it looked too obvious they were hookers. Thai girls walked hand in hand with each other and even Thai guys could walk hand in hand no big deal. Thai guys can share a double bed no big deal even they are not gay and nothing sexual will happen. LOL Two Farang guys, no way! It is just a cultural thing. I have slept in a double bed with a Thai girl (not girlfriend) like brother and sister with no sexual involvement also. Usually this means you know each other very well though.

So, I hit it off online (dating app) w a Thai girl to the point she sent me pretty sexy pics and we even got each other off once via video chat. I was eager to meet her a few months later, when I arrived. Hired a car and driver and picked her up at a public place, we had coffee, then went for lunch and then a long walk and talk by the seaside.

The strange thing was that when we were in the car she held my hand, even played with the hair on my calves in a cute, affectionate way (curious about these hairy farang). I was being very cautious, no intention to fuck her on the first date but sure, assumed it would happen.

When we dropped her close to her house (she didn't yet want me to see her house), I tried to hug her and she recoiled. Texted me later that it was very inappropriate to do that in public! I was dumbstruck: my driver had surely seen her caressing my legs and us holding hands in the car, but not even a hug in public?

This was only two years ago, and she was 29 w an eight year old kid. Long story short she ended up meeting some toothless butterfly Swede in Pattaya and I found out and told her to fuck off. Probably didn't help that I was married and she knoew I wouldn't change that situation for her!

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2169178]When I walk around town I leave it to the girl to take my hand, indicate she wants to walk holding hands or not, up to her. 90%+ of the time they transfer whatever they were carrying in the hand on my side to the other hand in order to free it up and reach over to take my hand in theirs. I can't see myself jerking my hand away, recoiling in horror or waving off the attempt because of how it might look to anyone else.

Of course, I will go ahead and initiate it after I have been with a girl 2-3 times and she has made it clear doing it is very much her preference.

So you'd have to ask the girls why they want to be seen walking hand in hand with a man at least twice their age but far more often closer to three times their age.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Chacal60;2169605]So, I hit it off online (dating app) w a Thai girl to the point she sent me pretty sexy pics and we even got each other off once via video chat. I was eager to meet her a few months later, when I arrived. Hired a car and driver and picked her up at a public place, we had coffee, then went for lunch and then a long walk and talk by the seaside.

The strange thing was that when we were in the car she held my hand, even played with the hair on my calves in a cute, affectionate way (curious about these hairy farang). I was being very cautious, no intention to fuck her on the first date but sure, assumed it would happen.

When we dropped her close to her house (she didn't yet want me to see her house), I tried to hug her and she recoiled. Texted me later that it was very inappropriate to do that in public! I was dumbstruck: my driver had surely seen her caressing my legs and us holding hands in the car, but not even a hug in public?

This was only two years ago, and she was 29 w an eight year old kid. Long story short she ended up meeting some toothless butterfly Swede in Pattaya and I found out and told her to fuck off. Probably didn't help that I was married and she knoew I wouldn't change that situation for her![/QUOTE]You know, it's a funny thing about women in general and especially Thai women I believe in that they are actually telegraphing the very weakness they know they are most prone to fall victim to by what they warn men against doing. Can't tell you how often the Thai dating site girl who goes on and on in her profile that she is not here for fun, not here to be our "holiday girlfriend", wants to save herself for that one special serious longterm relationship and so on is quite often the absolute easiest one to get into my room and naked on my bed on the very first meeting, even a midday coffee meeting!

It seems they know very well how easy they are to bed down and therefore try their best to convince you not to go there with them precisely because they know how easily they would fall if you tried. Like it has happened to them time and time again, they know how they are and the only way they might be able to keep up that prim and proper front is if the guy they just met doesn't even try because she has so sternly warned him not to. LOL.

So here is this 29 year old single mom since she was 21 lecturing you on how prim and proper she is about hugging in public yet she meets some toothless monger in Pattaya of all places and flies right into that flame without hesitation. LOL.

[QUOTE=Chacal60;2169605]So, I hit it off online (dating app) w a Thai girl to the point she sent me pretty sexy pics and we even got each other off once via video chat. I was eager to meet her a few months later, when I arrived. Hired a car and driver and picked her up at a public place, we had coffee, then went for lunch and then a long walk and talk by the seaside.

The strange thing was that when we were in the car she held my hand, even played with the hair on my calves in a cute, affectionate way (curious about these hairy farang). I was being very cautious, no intention to fuck her on the first date but sure, assumed it would happen.

When we dropped her close to her house (she didn't yet want me to see her house), I tried to hug her and she recoiled. Texted me later that it was very inappropriate to do that in public! I was dumbstruck: my driver had surely seen her caressing my legs and us holding hands in the car, but not even a hug in public?

This was only two years ago, and she was 29 w an eight year old kid. Long story short she ended up meeting some toothless butterfly Swede in Pattaya and I found out and told her to fuck off. Probably didn't help that I was married and she knoew I wouldn't change that situation for her![/QUOTE]It is totally normal for a Thai girl not to want to hug in public. Your driver seeing you is nothing but she did not want the neighbours to all start gossiping that she is a hooker.

Thai girl with Farang can be assumed to be a hooker. 80%+ of time that will be correct. Not always.

I similarly are reticent to be seen misbehaving with Thai girls where I live. Other Thais do not know how to mind their own business.

Pattaya is a special place where wayward behaviour becomes the norm. She does not care what she is seen doing in Pattaya perhaps. Many Thais like Pattaya because they feel free not to be proper and let their hair down.

Thanks for sharing this. Was thinking a lot about this. Would be really nice, for many reasons, to have a work that required business trips to a nice, friendly and warm place. What kind of automotive jobs is good for traveling here? What kind of companies or positions to work in? (you can just hint what company, there aren't to many manufacturers or suppliers I guess).

[QUOTE=RobJones;2108655]I'm assuming the supervisor at home is the wife? My work is in the automotive industry and fortunately for me there are a lot of factories around Pattaya and Bangkok so I have a good reason to go even though my position doesn't need me top go LOL. Unfortunately my wife would not allow me to go if it involved a friend in any circumstances because she knows there will be trouble afoot.

Good luck.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Andersson25;2181270]Thanks for sharing this. Was thinking a lot about this. Would be really nice, for many reasons, to have a work that required business trips to a nice, friendly and warm place. What kind of automotive jobs is good for traveling here? What kind of companies or positions to work in? (you can just hint what company, there aren't to many manufacturers or suppliers I guess).[/QUOTE]Hi.

Sorry for the late answer as I don't usually come to this chat. My position is in new car sales and manufactors will have trips to variius locations O / S. For example some of my colleagues have been to Vegas and Paris and Thailand is one of them as well due to a lot os SUVs and Utility vehicles being manufactored there. I tell my wife that I qualified and I'm off for 7 to 8 days with her blessing and I don't have be aware of time zones etc.

I'm gettingvaway this time for only 6 due to changing companies and I have told her I need to go to another majir city here for product training so I have to be on my game regarding time zones etc. If the desire is there you can find a way.

I hooe this helps.

Rob.

This is the most bizarre scene I can recall from all of Anthony Bourdain's many travels. Check out how he checks out the Thai honey in his "dreams" hehehe. RIP Tony!

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SOIVI3U5B4Y[/URL]

[QUOTE]
Translated from Thai language, these forms are available in Pattaya to ALL newbies from Isaan. They are handed out as soon as the girls arrive in Sin City. This is how the Thai girls view foreigners. (Known as the White Book). Thai bar girls commandments.

1. When looking for customers, it is very important to ensure you pick your customer correctly. Thailand have many people who don’t have a lot of money.

2. You have customer, forget all, not worry if he is very ugly, over weight, smells very bad. Always tell your customer that he makes you happy and he is handsome. Important to remember that he has paid the bar, the rest is easy.

3. If customer go home, it’s not the end of your work with them. Get his e-mail address’s and keep in contact with him. This is easy for you to get the customer again when he comes back. If you have contact with him, you can request money from the Farang when he be home. Most Farang have a soft heart. A good way to ask for money is to say you have a sick buffalo. Failing that your mother/father been sick or been pregnant is the best way to ask for money.

4. Farangs are soft, tears from the eyes can make them easy softer. It is important to be able to cry on queue. This will give you a chance getting more presents or money from the Farang. Thai girls need to be a pro and producing crocodile tears on command.

5. Your customer stay longer then 2 nights, you request he take you out for shopping. Gold is an excellent item to get. Makes your customer happy you wear it while he is in Thailand. As soon as he leaves you can sell it at the gold shop.

6. If you working in the bar, and local ex-pats are there, speak in your local dialect. Many Farangs can speak Thai which it make not easy for us. Important that the Thai local and Thai regional dialects remain just for Thai people.

7. Your customer leaving Thailand, go with him to the airport. Many times he will have thousands of baht left over. The Farang be happy to give it to you as he can’t use in his country. When you say good bye, start to cry and ask him for email addresses.

8. You can better have Asian customers. They understand our love to gamble and that we have many sisters and brothers at home who need food. They generally pay more then a Farang do. (Japanese/Korean’s pay very well). –

9. When you leave your customer, ask for Taxi money. Even when you live next door. This help you for another 200-300 baht easily. The Farang complains about your taxi paying, remember the cry on command. This will be your ticket for more money. Explain it is dangerous to walk and you live far away.

10. If you not make money in your chosen city, it’s time to move. Pattaya, Bangkok and Phuket are choices to find the Walking ATM’s, Farangs with money.
[/QUOTE]This is so funny. Guess some white knight or pimp wrote this up for all the girls now it's their playbook.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2244871]This is so funny. Guess some white knight or pimp wrote this up for all the girls now it's their playbook.[/QUOTE]Wow! This is unbelievable. Can't believe somebody actually put this in writing.

Natty, clear your PM's please.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2169631]It is totally normal for a Thai girl not to want to hug in public. Your driver seeing you is nothing but she did not want the neighbours to all start gossiping that she is a hooker.

Thai girl with Farang can be assumed to be a hooker. 80%+ of time that will be correct. Not always.

I similarly are reticent to be seen misbehaving with Thai girls where I live. Other Thais do not know how to mind their own business.

Pattaya is a special place where wayward behaviour becomes the norm. She does not care what she is seen doing in Pattaya perhaps. Many Thais like Pattaya because they feel free not to be proper and let their hair down.[/QUOTE]Just my opinion but, when nightfalls comes to Bangkok, Thailands' rules on affection in public can be thrown out the window. I met two women who have 'let their hair down". One was named 'Jit'. We were out one night after drinks and dinner. We crossed some bridge near Ploen Chit (or was it Chit Lom?) where she actually grabbed my dick and started stroking it outside my pants. It was a bit after midnight and there was no one hardly in the area. Met another who went by 'Supanya'. She and I left Spice Bar after drinks and getting plastered, We frenched kissed in the taxi all the way to my place. These two women have self-respecting jobs. One works for an embassy, the other works for a travel agency. I tell ya, when nightfall comes to Bangkok, some of these so-called "self-respecting women" REALLY show their true form.

[QUOTE=MeatMan;2245416]Just my opinion but, when nightfalls comes to Bangkok, Thailands' rules on affection in public can be thrown out the window. I met two women who have 'let their hair down". One was named 'Jit'. We were out one night after drinks and dinner. We crossed some bridge near Ploen Chit (or was it Chit Lom?) where she actually grabbed my dick and started stroking it outside my pants. It was a bit after midnight and there was no one hardly in the area. Met another who went by 'Supanya'. She and I left Spice Bar after drinks and getting plastered, We frenched kissed in the taxi all the way to my place. These two women have self-respecting jobs. One works for an embassy, the other works for a travel agency. I tell ya, when nightfall comes to Bangkok, some of these so-called "self-respecting women" REALLY show their true form.[/QUOTE]However, they do these things in semi "private" under cover of darkness or in a taxi, not for their co workers or neighbours to see what they are doing. Thais can change from prim and proper to raunchy, especially after consuming a few drinks. Alcohol can transform Thai girls to completely different character.

25 years ago, Thai women dressed modestly and behaved very modestly in public, with Pattaya being the wayward place. Things are clearly changing with modern dress being quite sexy to show off the figure. You will still find plenty of Thai girls act rather shyly out on the street though.

Also many Thai girls are shy to take their clothes off with you watching them with lights on. Some are known to undress in the toilet, or wrap a towel around them before taking off bra and panties. They were trained to do this from childhood.

Agree, they still like to respect the world around them. On TF the girls don't seem to mind if you are married as long as the wife isn't Thai. My semi-regular girl from CM will always overnight with me in Bangkok but never wants to leave the room for fear of being judged. My minibar and room service bill is always high when I see her.

I.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2245587]However, they do these things in semi "private" under cover of darkness or in a taxi, not for their co workers or neighbours to see what they are doing. Thais can change from prim and proper to raunchy, especially after consuming a few drinks. Alcohol can transform Thai girls to completely different character.

25 years ago, Thai women dressed modestly and behaved very modestly in public, with Pattaya being the wayward place. Things are clearly changing with modern dress being quite sexy to show off the figure. You will still find plenty of Thai girls act rather shyly out on the street though.

Also many Thai girls are shy to take their clothes off with you watching them with lights on. Some are known to undress in the toilet, or wrap a towel around them before taking off bra and panties. They were trained to do this from childhood.[/QUOTE].

[QUOTE=Chacal60;2245605]Agree, they still like to respect the world around them. On TF the girls don't seem to mind if you are married as long as the wife isn't Thai. My semi-regular girl from CM will always overnight with me in Bangkok but never wants to leave the room for fear of being judged. My minibar and room service bill is always high when I see her.

I.

.[/QUOTE]I have found the main concern with Thai girls (dating site or regular, non P4P girls) about your wife being Thai or not is fear that the wife will show up unexpectedly and incite violence. Once I assure them she lives in another part of Bangkok, never comes around without my inviting her over and in fact we almost never see each other for any reason, the new Thai girl relaxes and becomes indifferent about the issue.

I just tell them she's European (true) and they say "good".

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2245612]I have found the main concern with Thai girls (dating site or regular, non P4P girls) about your wife being Thai or not is fear that the wife will show up unexpectedly and incite violence. Once I assure them she lives in another part of Bangkok, never comes around without my inviting her over and in fact we almost never see each other for any reason, the new Thai girl relaxes and becomes indifferent about the issue.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2245612]I have found the main concern with Thai girls (dating site or regular, non P4P girls) about your wife being Thai or not is fear that the wife will show up unexpectedly and incite violence. Once I assure them she lives in another part of Bangkok, never comes around without my inviting her over and in fact we almost never see each other for any reason, the new Thai girl relaxes and becomes indifferent about the issue.[/QUOTE]Absolutely! Gik is scared my Thai GF will show up. I explain GF is in another province and cannot possibly come here. She is scared in case GF knows where I am staying, and will make the long trip to catch me. She is not scared about her BF showing up since she does not think about the possibility of being followed by a hired dectective. That is actually the more likely scenario, relatively speaking.

I think Thai girls are considered more scary than Farangs though, whether warranted or not.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2245587]However, they do these things in semi "private" under cover of darkness or in a taxi, not for their co workers or neighbours to see what they are doing. Thais can change from prim and proper to raunchy, especially after consuming a few drinks. Alcohol can transform Thai girls to completely different character.

25 years ago, Thai women dressed modestly and behaved very modestly in public, with Pattaya being the wayward place. Things are clearly changing with modern dress being quite sexy to show off the figure. You will still find plenty of Thai girls act rather shyly out on the street though.

Also many Thai girls are shy to take their clothes off with you watching them with lights on. Some are known to undress in the toilet, or wrap a towel around them before taking off bra and panties. They were trained to do this from childhood.[/QUOTE]I still remember a showgirl years ago I took who did the lesbian show, back in the room, lights off and towel on LOL.

Only a week left before I go to Thailand. Is the following airport arrival process correct?

BTW I'm American flying roundtrip form JFK to BKK on airchina for a weeks duration.

Before I land I'm given a immigration form that I fill out.

Plane disembarks, I walk to immigration show them my passport and form.

I show them my proof of onward travel (Would my flight itinerary suffice?) and he gives me a stamp on my passport.

Since I'm only staying for a week and American I don't have to worry about visa on arrival, health control, or showing my proof of income.

Then I go find my luggage and buy a sim card.

Is there anything I'm missing or that I have to do before arriving to Thailand?

[QUOTE=PonkeyMaw;2246398]I show them my proof of onward travel (Would my flight itinerary suffice?) and he gives me a stamp on my passport.

Since I'm only staying for a week and American I don't have to worry about visa on arrival, health control, or showing my proof of income.

Is there anything I'm missing or that I have to do before arriving to Thailand?[/QUOTE]I've never been asked to show proof of a flight leaving Thailand. Never been asked this either but you may need to show proof of where you are staying for at least the first night. If you have chosen to stay at an AirBNB be prepared to book a cheap hostel in the middle of nowhere for a night. There is free wifi at BKK. I don't know anyone who has been asked this but technically you are supposed to be carrying 20,000 Thai baht on you when you enter Thailand. Showing money in a bank account is not proof enough if someone does not want you to enter Thailand. Be prepared to tell them an elaborate story like your cousin Monkeypaw does if you get hassled. If you are only staying a week I suggest getting a 399 baht prepaid travel SIM from AIS that is good for 8 days. Prebook your taxi if you are coming to Pattaya. RTFF if you have questions about taxis or buses. No need to ask on here again.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2246836]I've never been asked to show proof of a flight leaving Thailand. Never been asked this either but you may need to show proof of where you are staying for at least the first night. If you have chosen to stay at an AirBNB be prepared to book a cheap hostel in the middle of nowhere for a night. There is free wifi at BKK. I don't know anyone who has been asked this but technically you are supposed to be carrying 20,000 Thai baht on you when you enter Thailand. Showing money in a bank account is not proof enough if someone does not want you to enter Thailand. Be prepared to tell them an elaborate story like your cousin Monkeypaw does if you get hassled. If you are only staying a week I suggest getting a 399 baht prepaid travel SIM from AIS that is good for 8 days. Prebook your taxi if you are coming to Pattaya. RTFF if you have questions about taxis or buses. No need to ask on here again.[/QUOTE]It is common place in the city you are flying to Thailand from, to need evidence that you have a return flight out of Thailand, if it is not on same ticket. Mine usually isn't on same ticket. Itinerary is usually good enough. Same at Bangkok airport. Their computer will show your return leg, unless its on a separate ticket.

Normally tourists get two free entries per year where no evidence of money, accommodation, or anything is required. However they could potentially want to see these things if you do far too many free 30 day entries per year. I am on my 3rd for the last year, also some Visa entries, but next time back home, will apply for a 6 month multi entry Visa, to be safer. What questions get asked depends a lot on luck of which person is encountered at the airport immigration check.

30 day entries can be extended to 60 at Immigration in Chaeng Wattana for 1900 Baht.

The real reason for crack down on number of free entries per year, is just to make us pay for a Visa.

For the land border crossings, the reasons for crackdown are maybe a little different.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2246840]
Normally tourists get two free entries per year [/QUOTE]I thought it was six times. Has this changed (once again)?

[QUOTE=Mogwai;2247091]I thought it was six times. Has this changed (once again)?[/QUOTE]I sure hope it's still 6 times.

When I left Thailand about 8 or 10 days ago it was my 4th visit this year.

I'm going back next week for a shorter visit and then back again around Christmas.

When I arrive at Christmas it will be the 6th entry this year, but I plan to stay for 90 days so Visa is required.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2246836]I've never been asked to show proof of a flight leaving Thailand. Never been asked this either but you may need to show proof of where you are staying for at least the first night. If you have chosen to stay at an AirBNB be prepared to book a cheap hostel in the middle of nowhere for a night. There is free wifi at BKK. I don't know anyone who has been asked this but technically you are supposed to be carrying 20,000 Thai baht on you when you enter Thailand.[/QUOTE]I've never been asked to show proof of where I'm staying. Be aware though, if it's your first time visiting Thailand, that you have to fill in the name and address of the (first) place where you're staying on the immigration form. So be sure you have that information somewhere (on your phone or printed out) as you enter the plane.

I've never been asked to show I'm carrying 20,000 baht either, or the equivalent of that in another currency.

If you have round trip ticket flying into Bangkok, they will not ask you because it is round trip. My experience is that the airline will not let you board the plan if you don't have return ticket.

The arrival card has a question about where you are staying. I just put down something like "Hilton, Bangkok" and that is sufficient. There are usually a few ladies in front of the custom queue checking for this. One time, I only wrote down "Hilton" and the custom official asked which city.

[QUOTE=Mogwai;2247091]I thought it was six times. Has this changed (once again)?[/QUOTE]The 2 times limit does not apply to entry by air.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2246836] I don't know anyone who has been asked this but technically you are supposed to be carrying 20,000 Thai baht on you when you enter Thailand. Showing money in a bank account is not proof enough if someone does not want you to enter Thailand.[/QUOTE]The last 15 years I've been coming to Thailand, I have NEVER been required to carry that large amount of cash on me. That's 600 USD!.

[QUOTE=MeatMan;2247263]The last 15 years I've been coming to Thailand, I have NEVER been required to carry that large amount of cash on me. That's 600 USD!.[/QUOTE]Well if they ask you what are you going to do. And folks are getting asked and turned away. Especially frequent travelers.

[QUOTE=MeatMan;2247263]The last 15 years I've been coming to Thailand, I have NEVER been required to carry that large amount of cash on me. That's 600 USD!.[/QUOTE]Because this rule only came in to effect last year. As Nyezhov says, it has been enforced when the immigration officer wants it to be and there are actually many stories of people being turned away. Don't you have to bring at least 600 USD for your vacation anyways?

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2247329]Because this rule only came in to effect last year. As Nyezhov says, it has been enforced when the immigration officer wants it to be and there are actually many stories of people being turned away. Don't you have to bring at least 600 USD for your vacation anyways?[/QUOTE]I'm assuming that cash in any currency equilivent to US $ 600 is sufficient? In almost 20 years traveling to Asia have I been asked for proof of funds and rarely for hotel name.

[QUOTE=RobJones;2247330]I'm assuming that cash in any currency equilivent to US $ 600 is sufficient? In almost 20 years traveling to Asia have I been asked for proof of funds and rarely for hotel name.[/QUOTE]That is correct. If you follow some other forums that are about visas etc, you will see that being turned away is happening with some frequency. I was having a beer next to a guy who had just arrived from London. All was in order, including the minimum cash topic. They pulled him aside and told him he could not get in. They were not specific as to why. It was a long drawn out process of going through every page of his passport. Then the "good cop" took him aside and said "I would let you in but my co-workers will be mad at me" (I have read this very same thing before) Ultimately they deported him after 10 or 12 hours in detention. The reason marked in his passport was insufficient funds. As he tries to understand what happened he thinks perhaps the "good cop" was indirectly asking for a bribe. Which would have been a bargain compared to booking another flight and all the BS. He entered with no drama the 2nd time.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2247329]Because this rule only came in to effect last year. As Nyezhov says, it has been enforced when the immigration officer wants it to be and there are actually many stories of people being turned away. Don't you have to bring at least 600 USD for your vacation anyways?[/QUOTE]I always have but it's on my VISA and MC. I'm just surprised NOW that this has been brought to my attention after all this time!. I honestly did not know.

[QUOTE=Nyezhov;2247265]Well if they ask you what are you going to do. And folks are getting asked and turned away. Especially frequent travelers.[/QUOTE]Well, after reading all the info about the requirements to enter Thailand, I guess I'll have too. Seems the issue is with frequent travelers as well as the 'begpackers' and illegals. I have been humbled on simply not knowing.

Thank you both for the heads up on this matter.

Speaking of visas, it was well reported that the U. K. Embassy will no longer issue notarized income verification forms for long stay/retirement visas. But note that, as of January 1, 2019, neither will the USA Embassy.

I have not yet read what one must bring to Thai Immigration in order to prove to them that you are receiving the minimum about of baht per month (65,000 as of this writing). But for those choosing the, I think, 800,000 baht deposited in a Thai bank option, I suppose showing up with your Thai bank passbook will suffice. Again, I have not yet read what documents do or do not need to be notarized or brought to Thai Immigration since this change has been made.

Anybody else read what needs to be done or shown to prove your income now? Tax reports? How far back? Notarized or not? Letters from USA?

[QUOTE=Crazy4Thai;2247349]That is correct. If you follow some other forums that are about visas etc, you will see that being turned away is happening with some frequency. I was having a beer next to a guy who had just arrived from London. All was in order, including the minimum cash topic. They pulled him aside and told him he could not get in. They were not specific as to why. It was a long drawn out process of going through every page of his passport. Then the "good cop" took him aside and said "I would let you in but my co-workers will be mad at me" (I have read this very same thing before) Ultimately they deported him after 10 or 12 hours in detention. The reason marked in his passport was insufficient funds. As he tries to understand what happened he thinks perhaps the "good cop" was indirectly asking for a bribe. Which would have been a bargain compared to booking another flight and all the BS. He entered with no drama the 2nd time.[/QUOTE]3rd visit in 12 months coming up in February. Probably not excessive but I will keep some $10 and $20 notes just in case a cop needs a "drink".

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2247376]

Anybody else read what needs to be done or shown to prove your income now? Tax reports? How far back? Notarized or not? Letters from USA?[/QUOTE]Got my one-year extension in March through an agency. Agency fee 12k including multiple entry. Only document needed was a letter from my thai bank stating I had had the 800k on my account for 2 months. Passbook didn't suffice as it might not be up to date. Bank letter had to be from the same day the application reached immigration.

Better for embassies not to be involved as it might put ideas into the head of the taxman in one's home country.

[QUOTE=Mogwai;2247091]I thought it was six times. Has this changed (once again)?[/QUOTE]Yes it has changed. Consulates in other countries are using the 2 free entries per year line. Obviously applies to flying since there is no other way from my consulate location. Previously I used to do 7 entries in a year no problem (all by air).

Then they started asking questions at BKK airport and suggesting I apply for a Visa in future, which I did. Got 6 month multi-entry VISAs which are unfortunately available only from the country of your passport.

Since my 6 month VISA expired and I did not want to go home, I have had 2 free entries. Consulate in Djakarta actually advised me not to apply for a VISA because takes them several days and they need proof of Hotel booking, money in bank etc. Stupid really since I did not know how many days would take them and when I would be able to fly back in. Had to take my chances with another freebie.

Technically there is no law to say we cannot get another free entry. Best to have evidence of outward flight inside the 30 days, hotel booking, 20000 Baht in cash. Should not be kicked out if all is in order.

Once in for 30 day, can apply for the extension to 60 days (cost 1900 baht), but must be done before 30 days expires and must be aware office is closed on govt official public holidays and weekends.

Official advise though is apply for VISAs (single entry 60 days extendable to 90), or multi-entry 6 month, or longer term, if want to come in more than 2 times per year. They want our money.

I am aware of a guy who says he keeps coming in again without a VISA from Laos, but carrying suitable evidence. He hasn't been stopped from entering as YET. However we get into areas of uncertainty.

I will probably apply for a new VISA for next entry, to be safe.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2247405]Yes it has changed. Consulates in other countries are using the 2 free entries per year line. Obviously applies to flying since there is no other way from my consulate location. Previously I used to do 7 entries in a year no problem (all by air).[/QUOTE]I am already over the limit this year and I have not been questioned. I stayed only a few days each time which can be the difference.

I think the limit is designed to limit visa runs. It does not make sense to limit the number of entries for people who just want to spend the weekends. Plenty of Japanese and Koreans are doing it this way.

[QUOTE=Nounce;2247439]I am already over the limit this year and I have not been questioned. I stayed only a few days each time which can be the difference.

I think the limit is designed to limit visa runs. It does not make sense to limit the number of entries for people who just want to spend the weekends. Plenty of Japanese and Koreans are doing it this way.[/QUOTE]Yes I agree. Very short stays maybe be scarcely counted, especially brief transit stopovers. Others are staying 60 days at a time. Coming in on a return ticket helps as others mentioned.

My understanding is the government wants to make some VISA money out of us types that stay for long periods (in total), and prevent any foreigners who have no visible means of support other than by criminal activities. Not everything the military govt. Does, has to really make sense.

I heard that Lao persons here whose passport ran out (very common), can go to the Laos embassy and get (same day) a permit to exit back to Laos. Supposedly extremely busy despite charging 5000 Baht for it, and then they have to pay police extra on both sides of the border. So Laos embassy is ripping off their own people.

A lot of illegal Laos workers here, Cambodian, Myanmar, etc. Some legal ones too. My Hotel seemed to be hiring Cambodians to clean the rooms.

Just read that G7 (Canada, France, Germany, Italy, Japan, United Kingdom, United States) countries can get 30 days free on entry by land or sea, or air. Some other countries only get 30 days by air and 15 by land.

I believe I read about a limit to land crossings per year, before will be deemed excessive "Visa Runs", and then future entry banned. Therefore recommend all Visa Runs or re-entries be by air. This is probably to keep out rif raf with no visible means of support likely to be working illegally. Maybe be possible to avoid these difficulties with bribes for border police.

Bernie Sanders says if he's elected president he will decriminalize sex work in the US. Who's for Bernie? That will have a significant effect on the tourism industry in third world countries, especially Thailand. Think of Thailand without US mongers. Imagine publicly advertised and widely available brothels in every town and city in the US. Imagine a concomitant significantly reduced price per hour due to competition (US $100 per hour?). Can the good old days return?

[QUOTE=Turgid;2345059]Bernie Sanders says if he's elected president he will decriminalize sex work in the US. Who's for Bernie? That will have a significant effect on the tourism industry in third world countries, especially Thailand. Think of Thailand without US mongers. Imagine publicly advertised and widely available brothels in every town and city in the US. Imagine a concomitant significantly reduced price per hour due to competition (US $100 per hour?). Can the good old days return?[/QUOTE]My tax bracket in the US is 28% right now with Trump. With Bernie, it would likely jump to over 50%. Sorry, but money saved on paying less tax is more important to me than something trivial like legalized brothels in the USA. Sex work in Australia is legal. Have you ever been to an Aussie brothel? Sucks. It would suck in the USA as well. I do believe that sex work should be decriminalized in the USA, but it's not worth voting for Bernie or any Democrat (or socialist, or democratic socialist) in order to get it. And it would still be better to use the money you save on taxes to fly to Thailand than to utilize the services of a brothel in the USA or Australia. You haven't noticed a lack of Aussies visiting Thailand for sex have you?

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2345070]My tax bracket in the US is 28% right now with Trump. With Bernie, it would likely jump to over 50%. Sorry, but money saved on paying less tax is more important to me than something trivial like legalized brothels in the USA. Sex work in Australia is legal. Have you ever been to an Aussie brothel? Sucks. It would suck in the USA as well. I do believe that sex work should be decriminalized in the USA, but it's not worth voting for Bernie or any Democrat (or socialist, or democratic socialist) in order to get it. And it would still be better to use the money you save on taxes to fly to Thailand than to utilize the services of a brothel in the USA or Australia. You haven't noticed a lack of Aussies visiting Thailand for sex have you?[/QUOTE]Your tax bracket is irrelevant, It is what is your standard of living that is important. Believe it or not people in many countries have no desire to live in the US because they have standards of living that are equal to or higher or even lower without the crime, social inequality and downright pettiness of US politics.

[QUOTE=GDreams;2345140]Your tax bracket is irrelevant, It is what is your standard of living that is important. Believe it or not people in many countries have no desire to live in the US because they have standards of living that are equal to or higher or even lower without the crime, social inequality and downright pettiness of US politics.[/QUOTE]Please name one of these countries. And keep in mind they need to have a population of at least close to 300 million like the USA and as diverse a population as the USA. Small countries, and countries with little diversification in their population have far less issues to deal with.

There is no better country in the world to live right now than the USA under the Trump administration. The economy is rocking! I took an extra trip to Thailand this year with my tax break.

I agree with you about disliking the pettiness of US politics, but at the moment, almost all of the pettiness is on the Democrat side of things.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2345200]Please name one of these countries. And keep in mind they need to have a population of at least close to 300 million like the USA and as diverse a population as the USA. Small countries, and countries with little diversification in their population have far less issues to deal with.

There is no better country in the world to live right now than the USA under the Trump administration. The economy is rocking! I took an extra trip to Thailand this year with my tax break.

I agree with you about disliking the pettiness of US politics, but at the moment, almost all of the pettiness is on the Democrat side of things.[/QUOTE]Right on, Smoothy!

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2345211]Well, I do agree with that.

To stay on topic, here's a girl I had sex with recently in Thailand with my tax refund.[/QUOTE]I feel ya. Thanks to the Trump economy, my Investment advisor tells me I can do a Penthouse if I want when I show up for the staying-in-Thailand-season. The exchange rate sucks but hey, its the good with the bad.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2345211]Well, I do agree with that.

To stay on topic, here's a girl I had sex with recently in Thailand with my tax refund.[/QUOTE]Nice. Do you have any photos if the girls you had sex with in Thailand during the various massive Republican administration Recessions, property and stock market Crashes? I would include the massive Democratic administration Recessions and Crashes, but as I am pushing 70 in a few years, it turns out there haven't been any in my lifetime except for a very short one, barely 2 quarters long, in early 1980. Otherwise, they have produced mostly recoveries and expansions from the Recessions and Crashes they invariably inherited from the outgoing Republican administrations. Not being petty, really. Just looking at the remarkably consistent historical record on those things.

BTW, I am not a Bernie fan, but his proposed tax plan kicks in at 28%, your top rate, at the same income level it is today. The 52% rate does not kick in until you reach $10,000,001 of taxable income. So anyone who can now afford to travel to Thailand to have sex ought to be able to swing it from 2021 forward and make plans accordingly even if Bernie wins and gets his way with the tax code. Not factoring in whatever massive Recession and Crash history strongly suggests he might inherit, that is.

Here we go again. Someone on your side started it up again for no Goddamn reason. Then someone on my side responded, then someone on your side, and now you have responded to their responses.

The time before it was a different BM on your team who started it over in the PI forum and finally after way too much back and forth BS everything was deleted as will be the case here.

So can we just cut to the chase and not go there again? Is that not possible? Or does it have to get dumb and stupid first? I don't care what side you are on. Stay on topic!

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2345200]There is no better country in the world to live right now than the USA under the Trump administration. s.[/QUOTE]No better country "to live" in? No better country to make money in! So long as that money continues to be spendable elsewhere. But, best to live? Not so much.

[QUOTE=Nyezhov;2345227]I feel ya. Thanks to the Trump economy, my Investment advisor tells me I can do a Penthouse if I want when I show up for the staying-in-Thailand-season. The exchange rate sucks but hey, its the good with the bad.[/QUOTE]Have you seen the price of a Penthouse in Bkk? A simple condo unit, 30 sq meters is 12.5-16 million THB. I stayed in one on Soi 24. They are still selling the units so I asked at the sales counter. This is not a penthouse. 30 sq meters is an insult to most of us from the west. BTW 15 M thb is $484,000.

I asked her who is buying these? She said Thai businessmen that have houses outside of Bkk and do not want to commute except for weekends. I think Chinese are buying also. In Honolulu we have many new condo towers with condos that run as high as $35,000,000.00 and they say they are almost sold out. But at night only a few have lights on. Speculators that are hoping to make a profit when the price goes up.

And think about the Thb at an all time high. Penthouses as well as Pussy is at a Premium.

RL.

[QUOTE=Nyezhov;2345227]I feel ya. Thanks to the Trump economy, my Investment advisor tells me I can do a Penthouse if I want when I show up for the staying-in-Thailand-season. The exchange rate sucks but hey, its the good with the bad.[/QUOTE]Oh, please don't tell us your investment advisor was advising you to steer clear of buying and investing at the beginning of the Clinton and Obama economies. If so, you need to dump him and find a better investment advisor.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2345301]Here we go again. Someone on your side started it up again for no Goddamn reason. Then someone on my side responded, then someone on your side, and now you have responded to their responses.

The time before it was a different BM on your team who started it over in the PI forum and finally after way too much back and forth BS everything was deleted as will be the case here.

So can we just cut to the chase and not go there again? Is that not possible? Or does it have to get dumb and stupid first? I don't care what side you are on. Stay on topic![/QUOTE]Good luck to anybody trying to police the forum.

Supposedly ISG is an open platform for guidance and sharing information on sex services in different countries. Let's be honest it's often a soapbox for members airing their opinions on a wide variety of issues, political, social and cultural.

Personally I use the ignore button to filter out what I know from experience will be mere navel gazing, misogynistic or a doom and gloom view of the world.

I do enjoy reading some member's posts even when there are not on message because they can be entertainingly humorous and well written.

The current conversation on Trump is interesting in how it divides his supporters and detractors and their corresponding views on P4P.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2345200]Please name one of these countries. And keep in mind they need to have a population of at least close to 300 million like the USA and as diverse a population as the USA. Small countries, and countries with little diversification in their population have far less issues to deal with.

There is no better country in the world to live right now than the USA under the Trump administration. The economy is rocking! I took an extra trip to Thailand this year with my tax break.

I agree with you about disliking the pettiness of US politics, but at the moment, almost all of the pettiness is on the Democrat side of things.[/QUOTE]Australia, Canada, half of Europe.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2345301]Here we go again. ...... I don't care what side you are on. Stay on topic![/QUOTE]Well said.

+1.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2345385]Oh, please don't tell us your investment advisor was advising you to steer clear of buying and investing at the beginning of the Clinton and Obama economies. If so, you need to dump him and find a better investment advisor.[/QUOTE]The end of Obama's first term was the best time to buy a house in the USA because housing prices were at their lowest. But as far as having surplus money to invest internationally, that just happened recently under Trump due to his tax breaks and lifting regulations on businesses (unless you already had a bunch of cash in the stock market). Now is not a good time to invest in real estate in the USA because housing prices have sky rocketed since Trump was elected, but it is a good time to invest Internationally.

Here's a pic of a chick I met in front of Nana hotel recently.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2345385]Oh, please don't tell us your investment advisor was advising you to steer clear of buying and investing at the beginning of the Clinton and Obama economies. If so, you need to dump him and find a better investment advisor.[/QUOTE]I did good under Clinton and crappy under Obama. I don't let other peoples TDS take the smile off my face, enjoy yourself! Oh and thanks for your advice, perhaps you have a good private banker to recommend to me?

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2345473]The end of Obama's first term was the best time to buy a house in the USA because housing prices were at their lowest. But as far as having surplus money to invest internationally, that just happened recently under Trump due to his tax breaks and lifting regulations on businesses (unless you already had a bunch of cash in the stock market). Now is not a good time to invest in real estate in the USA because housing prices have sky rocketed since Trump was elected, but it is a good time to invest Internationally.

Here's a pic of a chick I met in front of Nana hotel recently.[/QUOTE]Why are people investing internationally rather than in the USA with all that surplus money they got from those USA tax breaks and eliminating regulations? As of this writing, the USA Stock Market has only gained a paltry annualized 6% or so since that tax cut legislation was passed 1 1/2 years ago and only an annualized 13% or so since January 20, 2017. Maybe it is because the USA created almost 1 million fewer jobs in the past 29 months vs the previous 29 months and annualized real GDP growth is not meaningfully improved in the past couple of years despite adding $2+Trillion to the deficit trying to buy an improvement.

It can't really be because illegal immigration crossings have skyrocketed in the past couple of years vs what they were in the 8 years prior, can it?

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2345484]I don't know who is buying all these new Condominiums in BKK and Pattaya. The developers must be making a fortune. But it looks like a real estate bubble in the making to me. Too much supply at too high a cost. Of course no one knows when the market will top out. I sure don't want to be left holding the bag (any Thai real estate) when the market collapses. But in the meantime, it looks like there are lot of excellent rental opportunities in these new buildings with all the amenities and in great neighborhoods. Time to rent if you ask me.[/QUOTE]+1. That has been my observation, too. Plus, prognostications re the birth rate suggests there will be fewer people living in Thailand 20 years from now than today. The population is declining while all these condo projects are being built. Of course, more and more Thais will likely be moving from the outer provinces into Bangkok as education and income levels improve, I suppose. I have not bought in Thailand. For one thing, I don't want to be saddled with what to do with a condo that might stand empty for months if not years without a renter should I decide to live somewhere else. And I still have rental property in the USA that I'd rather deal with and profit from in that regard.

Guys, good to have as many different sources of income as possible if you're going to weather all kinds of possible goofiness in markets and the economy on your way to a comfy retirement boffing 20 something year olds in Thailand.

Thailand has high strategic value to the Chinese government. As such, the Chinese have been launching a charm offensive in Thailand for quite some time now. Chinese money has been flooding Bangkok in the form of tourists, students and investors. I suspect the Chinese government has even made it easier for Chinese investors to invest in Thai properties.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2345512]Why are people investing internationally rather than in the USA with all that surplus money they got from those USA tax breaks and eliminating regulations? As of this writing, the USA Stock Market has only gained a paltry annualized 6% or so since that tax cut legislation was passed 1 1/2 years ago and only an annualized 13% or so since January 20, 2017. Maybe it is because the USA created almost 1 million fewer jobs in the past 29 months vs the previous 29 months and annualized real GDP growth is not meaningfully improved in the past couple of years despite adding $2+Trillion to the deficit trying to buy an improvement.

It can't really be because illegal immigration crossings have skyrocketed in the past couple of years vs what they were in the 8 years prior, can it?[/QUOTE]Have things really gotten worse in the US under Trump? Back to mongering, our hobby has certainly deteriorated in the US under Trump although I thought it would have improved given his history. I guess I'm being naive in my hopefulness for the decriminalization of sex work in the US and would just follow up on my plans to live in Thailand.

[QUOTE=Turgid;2345564]Have things really gotten worse in the US under Trump? Back to mongering, our hobby has certainly deteriorated in the US under Trump although I thought it would have improved given his history. I guess I'm being naive in my hopefulness for the decriminalization of sex work in the US and would just follow up on my plans to live in Thailand.[/QUOTE]Worse? That isn'tt the word I would use regarding the general USA economy. We're in the 11th year of the longest bull market and uninterrupted economic expansion and job growth in USA history. They began in early March 2009 and June of that same year, respectively.

We are not in the 3rd year of either one. We are in the 11th year of them. The trajectory of those metrics did not change dramatically on January 20, 2017 or, more pertinent in terms of judging the effectiveness or not of an administration's stewardship, December 22, 2017. That was when their first and so far only significant economic legislation was signed and passed. They have so far underperformed what came before on the important metrics I cited, but we are still doing okay.

However, I would say other factors that might or might not have an impact on funding our hobby in the near term or in retirement, such as foreign relations and diplomacy, national security, trade deals and border control are faring worse.

Western countries economic influence on mongering doesn't hinge on the daily financial or stock markets.

An unfavorable exchange rate has an immediate affect.

Higher airline tickets will have an immediate affect.

Aging mongers unable to get it up will have an immediate affect.

Long term down stock market will adversely affect retirement money, thus lack of mongers in the future.

[QUOTE=Dg8787;2345605]Western countries economic influence on mongering doesn't hinge on the daily financial or stock markets.

An unfavorable exchange rate has an immediate affect.

Higher airline tickets will have an immediate affect.

Aging mongers unable to get it up will have an immediate affect.

Long term down stock market will adversely affect retirement money, thus lack of mongers in the future.[/QUOTE]From Thai Visa.

A leading tourism official has confirmed what many Pattaya residents have suspected for a long time.

The days of Europeans visiting Pattaya in large numbers for the entertainment industry are gone.

The strength of the baht, alternatives elsewhere and the rise of Chinese and now Indian tourism has seen a marked shift on who is coming to Pattaya and what they are doing there.

Secretary of the Entertainment Industry and Tourism Association of Pattaya Damrongkiat Phinitkarn gave Sophon TV some frank and damning statistics about the low season in Pattaya this year. Down 20% to 30%.

[QUOTE=Nyezhov;2345490]I did good under Clinton and crappy under Obama. I don't let other peoples TDS take the smile off my face, enjoy yourself! Oh and thanks for your advice, perhaps you have a good private banker to recommend to me?[/QUOTE]No, I don't use a private banker or investment advisor for these things. But if I did I would keep it fee only, not commission based. To have done crappy during the Obama years would have required serious effort in my opinion. Those first couple of months before his first proposed major economic legislation was passed were certainly painful since, as is always the case with a new incoming administration, the economy and markets continue to go in the same direction they were already going until shortly after that first major legislation is passed.

But after that, early in his presidency, you would have had to ignore almost every important economic report and believe the self-serving blather of his political opposition for the next 8 years to have missed some massive gains. Even the critical housing market, which finally found a floor below which overall prices did not continue to freefall in the Crash by March 2011, was a great place to invest. It sounds as though your advisor kept you on the sidelines watching gains on almost all fronts for about 10 years until just now. Or maybe he advised you to jump out at the bottom, a move a lot of people made. Recovery from a disastrous move like that is very difficult.

I don't see another massive Recession and Crash on the near horizon. So there is still some life left in this bull market, imo. Corrections possible, yes. But there is nothing in the economy we had as of January or December 2017 to reasonably suggest a Recession or Crash is right around the corner.The slow and steady recovery from a very scary historic downturn made the current economy quite strong and resilient. Thankfully. And stock markets tend to grow just fine in the absence of Recessions. Of couse, anyone in a position of power with a determination to drive us into another economic and market Crash can certainly do so or at least inflict plenty of damage in the effort. That is what we need to be mindful of now more than ever, imo.

[QUOTE=Golfinho;2345318]No better country "to live" in? No better country to make money in! So long as that money continues to be spendable elsewhere. But, best to live? Not so much.[/QUOTE]Haha, I'm with ya! Only because of the girl situation.

Just wondering, has anybody else had these thoughts.

Some 20 years ago I cashed out and moved here at around 50 to the Euro. Now I can buy back for less than 35. That together with accumulated capital gains which excepting property (even there its more than manageable) are mostly tax free I have considered moving back better heeled, where there is no immigration rigmarole, good health care is free and the air is cleaner but then I think of what I would be leaving, the ladies, the massages, the food, the warmth and spirituality of the people and the buzz of Bangkok and I say nay not now maybe later.

Hi guys,

An older (45) thai lady hit me up on Thai Cupid for a date. Actually she wants to marry but I said one thing at a time. Ordinarily I would ignore her based on age alone but she looks pretty good for 45 (I'm 63) and she showed me her gorgeous 40 Eee tits on skype. She owns some beach property in Prachaud and wants to know if I marry her am I interested in building a house there when I retire in three years. I swear I am not making this up. I will meet her in Bangkok where she works in September. Regular Thai ladies are very bossy though, aren't they? And like to control the money and everything. At least that's what I've seen on youtube testimonials. I think I prefer the more docile Filipinas which I know much more about because I go there more often. However J am curious if anyone has run into a situation like this and has any advice other than go slow and ask a lot of questions. Cheers.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2345687]No, I don't use a private banker or investment advisor for these things. But if I did I would keep it fee only, not commission based. To have done crappy during the Obama years would have required serious effort in my opinion. [/QUOTE]Well your opinion pales to the professional advice I receive and the results of said advice both now and then. But hey, lets just all Enjoy Thailand, some I reckon more extravagantly than others.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2345687]To have done crappy during the Obama years would have required serious effort in my opinion. [/QUOTE]The industry I am in suffered greatly during the Obama admin due to the superfluous regulations he instituted via executive order. Our company had to fire all non essential staff back then. Many of my buddies who worked as consultants were considering retirement back then. Now business is great.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2345930]The industry I am in suffered greatly during the Obama admin due to the superfluous regulations he instituted via executive order. Our company had to fire all non essential staff back then. Many of my buddies who worked as consultants were considering retirement back then. Now business is great.[/QUOTE]Not to downplay your company's plight, but I am sure some industries suffered as a result of the measures FDR took while pulling the rest of the country out of The Great Depression and setting up conditions that put markets back on track for gains rather than continued losses. That is not as dissimilar to the challenge Obama faced on January 20, 2009 as some seem to think. There will always be industries that suffer when drastic measures are called for.

I don't know what kind of regulations were put in place, but I am guessing they were put in there for a reason having to do with a greater economc (or environmental?) goal and not just for the hell of it.

And looking at it another way; now that your industry's regulations in question were eliminated (presumably by a Trump Executive Order) along with hundreds if not thousands of others, there is no evidence in the data that our overall economy is roaring along better and far surpassing what we were experiencing when those regulations were in place. If anything, the data show we are doing less well now on most economic fronts, jobs creation being one of them. Your industry being among the exceptions.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2345946]Not to downplay your company's plight, but I am sure some industries suffered as a result of the measures FDR took while pulling the rest of the country out of The Great Depression and setting up conditions that put markets back on track for gains rather than continued losses. That is not as dissimilar to the challenge Obama faced on January 20, 2009 as some seem to think. There will always be industries that suffer when drastic measures are called for.

I don't know what kind of regulations were put in place, but I am guessing they were put in there for a reason having to do with a greater economc (or environmental?) goal and not just for the hell of it.

And looking at it another way; now that your industry's regulations in question were eliminated (presumably by a Trump Executive Order) along with hundreds if not thousands of others, there is no evidence in the data that our overall economy is roaring along better and far surpassing what we were experiencing when those regulations were in place. If anything, the data show we are doing less well now on most economic fronts, jobs creation being one of them. Your industry being among the exceptions.[/QUOTE]I think you may be off with that one. The job market now is better than it has ever been and salaries are going up now over what they were prior to Trump. Salaries were stagnating during the Obama years and the jobs he was "creating" were government funded and minimum wage jobs. Trump's policies are actually helping the private sector. Recent college graduates can now get a job fresh out of school much more easily than they could just a few years ago.

If you seriously don't know what regulations where put in place, you might want to check that out. It was absurd. I think he may actually have been anti-American. His policies helped the rest of the world more than they helped the USA.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2345987]I think you may be off with that one. The job market now is better than it has ever been and salaries are going up now over what they were prior to Trump. Salaries were stagnating during the Obama years and the jobs he was "creating" were government funded and minimum wage jobs. Trump's policies are actually helping the private sector. Recent college graduates can now get a job fresh out of school much more easily than they could just a few years ago.

If you seriously don't know what regulations where put in place, you might want to check that out. It was absurd. I think he may actually have been anti-American. His policies helped the rest of the world more than they helped the USA.[/QUOTE]

https://www.forbes.com/sites/chuckjones/2019/07/05/trump-is-falling-almost-1-million-jobs-short-vs-obama/#648d27b98caa

"Trump Is Falling Almost 1 Million Jobs Short Vs. Obama"

"Job growth is slowing down"
(see chart)

"Not the best economy ever

The underlying economy is weaker than perceived when you look at March quarters GDP numbers and railroad traffic taking a significant downward move over the past month."

Fake news?

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2345987]...salaries are going up now over what they were prior to Trump.[/QUOTE]Yes, and particularly among lower wage workers. On the one hand because we entered the range of "Full Employment" generally considered to be in the area of a 6% Unemployment Rate or less by late 2014. If it remains there and improves, which it did steadily ever since and dipped into the upper 4% range by January 2016, wage inflation is bound to follow. But that rate didn't suddenly drop to the 4% range in January 2017. Not even in November 2016 for anyone who wants to go there.

And then there is this:

States With $15 Minimum Wage Laws Doubled This Year
Posted May 23, 2019
[URL]https://news.bloomberglaw.com/daily-labor-report/states-with-15-minimum-wage-laws-doubled-this-year[/URL]

That is definitely a factor in raising lower paying jobs wages overall as well. Btw, that is a policy that has been opposed by the Trump Administration, the now outgoing Secretary of Labor, Alex Acosta and their Party, even while they have been touting and taking credit for the inevitable overall wage increase stats results.

Has anybody who owns their own residence been to Chjang Wattana recently for the 1 year extension of a retirement visa and if so may I ask if they required a completed TM 30 along with the usual documents.

I have looked online e. G. Thai Visa without finding a definite answer. Even tried at Chang Wattana last week when doing a 90 day without success.

Would be more than grateful for some help on this.

[QUOTE=DCups;2345881]Hi guys,

An older (45) thai lady hit me up on Thai Cupid for a date. Actually she wants to marry but I said one thing at a time. Ordinarily I would ignore her based on age alone but she looks pretty good for 45 (I'm 63) and she showed me her gorgeous 40 Eee tits on skype. She owns some beach property in Prachaud and wants to know if I marry her am I interested in building a house there when I retire in three years. I swear I am not making this up. I will meet her in Bangkok where she works in September. Regular Thai ladies are very bossy though, aren't they? And like to control the money and everything. At least that's what I've seen on youtube testimonials. I think I prefer the more docile Filipinas which I know much more about because I go there more often. However J am curious if anyone has run into a situation like this and has any advice other than go slow and ask a lot of questions. Cheers.[/QUOTE]The Cups,

Yes there are lots of middle aged Thai ladies available and looking for Farang husband. So your age 63 is about right for her, but her age is borderline. She maybe in good shape now, but consider in 5 to 10 years. Normal rule for ideal age is your_age /2 + 7, so approx. 40 years is perfect. Just so happens my Mrs is coming up to 40 next birthday. In 5 to 10 years I might start to find her a bit old. She is still easily hot enough for me now way above average looks, not quite skinny any more (filled out a bit). She does not have quite to E cups but big enough for me.

The main thing is, you can try, but it takes at least 2 years to really know the person if you are with them nearly every day. Most ladies are after a guy, fully or at least partially for economic reasons, hardly for the sex, ha ha. So if you build a house on her land in Prajuap (I spell it how it sounds. Thais may strangely write ch in place of English J sound), does not matter to her if you split up later. Takes time to find out if she is really single, for example. Takes time to find out if she gets angry and bad moods a lot and for no reason. Takes time to reveal Psycho elements. My Mrs has her blow ups, when I need to stay away a bit, but fortunately not too often. No point trying to reason with an angry woman. I have decided I can tolerate the odd blow up. Just pretend nothing happened.

Next question, is do you want a partner at all, and if so, what are you looking for. Most women do not act exactly how we dream they might, especially after the first year. My Mrs has improved a lot in recent years, but early days were somewhat difficult, once we got past just being casual.

Most of us on here should be sex maniacs, so I think it is important that any prospective wife is a good fuck and is horny often enough. My Mrs has only started to become really horny enough in last 2 years assisted by alcohol and the bong, and freed up from a lot of former stresses. So that has meant I can cut back on mongering hugely.

Thai women tell lies but hate men who lie. Ha Ha. If you need to be telling your woman loads of lies all the time, you are better off not to have one. I tend to omit information or say nothing more often than making direct lies, that could be detected, these days. I learned this technique from smart Thai girls. I. e. Tell the truth but not the whole truth.

There has to be a development of a large degree of trust over time. My Mrs and I would be very confident that the other is not going to suddenly leave the relationship, and we can rely on each other. My Mrs needs to be fairly sure that I am not going to run off with some young floosy for example, and that she is the one that matters.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2346188]She maybe in good shape now, but consider in 5 to 10 years. [/QUOTE]Don't forget that you have to also add on 5 to 10 years to your own age and shape when you're trying to predict the future.

For DCups, he will be 73 when she is 55.

She may well also be menopausal by that age.

Remember that there is a tipping point where no amount or type of ED meds will make much difference, so you just have to hope that you can defy statistics and will still be "performing" well into your 70's.

[QUOTE=RedKilt;2346210]Don't forget that you have to also add on 5 to 10 years to your own age and shape when you're trying to predict the future.

For DCups, he will be 73 when she is 55.

She may well also be menopausal by that age.

Remember that there is a tipping point where no amount or type of ED meds will make much difference, so you just have to hope that you can defy statistics and will still be "performing" well into your 70's.[/QUOTE]That's the most depressing post I've ever read on this forum.

Please help if you are well-versed in the Thai language.

Thank you.

[URL]http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/forum/showthread.php?3935-Tips-for-Learning-Thai-Language&p=2345826&viewfull=1[/URL]#post2345826.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2346188]The Cups,So your age 63 is about right for her, but her age is borderline. She maybe in good shape now, but consider in 5 to 10 years. Normal rule for ideal age is your_age /2 + 7, so approx. 40 years is perfect. The main thing is, you can try, but it takes at least 2 years to really know the person if you are with them nearly every day. Most ladies are after a guy, fully or at least partially for economic reasons. Takes time to find out if she is really single, for example. Takes time to find out if she gets angry and bad moods a lot and for no reason. Takes time to reveal Psycho elements. My Mrs has her blow ups, when I need to stay away a bit, but fortunately not too often. No point trying to reason with an angry woman. I have decided I can tolerate the odd blow up. Just pretend nothing happened.

Next question, is do you want a partner at all, and if so, what are you looking for. Most women do not act exactly how we dream they might, especially after the first year. My Mrs has improved a lot in recent years, but early days were somewhat difficult, once we got past just being casual..[/QUOTE]Syz,

I greatly appreciate your insights and questions. Truth is I am a sex maniac and I have never been married so maybe it's not for me but glad to hear you (and others) have figured out the marriage thing. The equation for right age makes sense to me. I am also dating an extremely sexy and beautiful 28 year old singer in the Dominican Republic who has never hooked. But her English is sparse. Nevertheless, if I could manage to rotate between that one and another exceptional, educated and busty woman in the Philippines or Thailand (with an occasional discreet fling) that would probably work for me. But that is a big "IF". Even though I am 63 I could easily pass for 53 with my long hair, healthy libido and youthful, guitar-playing, basically carefree existence. Cheers, buddy. If our paths cross the beer's on me. I'll be in PI and Thailand all of September. I'll PM you.

[QUOTE=RedKilt;2346210]Don't forget that you have to also add on 5 to 10 years to your own age and shape when you're trying to predict the future.

For DCups, he will be 73 when she is 55.

She may well also be menopausal by that age.

Remember that there is a tipping point where no amount or type of ED meds will make much difference, so you just have to hope that you can defy statistics and will still be "performing" well into your 70's.[/QUOTE]Yes, RK. I am hoping super Viagra will be invented by then! Cheers, mate.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2346222]That's the most depressing post I've ever read on this forum.[/QUOTE]Sad but true Smoothy.

It's the number 1 reason why those guys seeking to re-locate to SE Asia because of their current libido levels need to have a good think about it because you definitely need something else to keep you amused.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2346051]https://www.forbes.com/sites/chuckjones/2019/07/05/trump-is-falling-almost-1-million-jobs-short-vs-obama/#648d27b98caa

"Trump Is Falling Almost 1 Million Jobs Short Vs. Obama"

"Job growth is slowing down"
(see chart)

"Not the best economy ever

The underlying economy is weaker than perceived when you look at March quarters GDP numbers and railroad traffic taking a significant downward move over the past month."

Fake news?[/QUOTE]My two cents.

I am not a doom and gloom merchant. I have around 50% of the portfolio in Thai equities down from 65% a week or so ago and now moving to overweight in cash and corporate bonds. Crashes are never expected yet they continuously happen. Last December was a scary reminder but thankfully was contained. I would say US markets now are either fully priced or perhaps 5% to 10% overpriced as they respond to expected cuts by the FED.

I don't foresee a market crash on the scale of '08 '09 which was caused by reckless US subprime property lending followed by mispricing of that lending but there are a number of signals out there that all is not well, not the least of which is the $13 trillion in negative yielding government debt a phenomenon Japan notwithstanding never seen before alongside the level of US debt over 100% and heading to 110%. A greater danger may be the irrational behavior of Trump who will do whatever it takes to get reelected and could bring about a collapse of the dollar in the process.

My point is nobody knows with any degree of certainty what's around the corner.

But what the hell, the sun is shining and the girls are waiting.

[QUOTE=RedKilt;2346542]Sad but true Smoothy.

It's the number 1 reason why those guys seeking to re-locate to SE Asia because of their current libido levels need to have a good think about it because you definitely need something else to keep you amused.[/QUOTE]Yes, for me it will be raising a family and making music. Maybe an occasional speaking engagement. I plan on importing all my music equipment and starting a light rock band (just for fun). As you know the Filipinos are quite musical. And I'm hoping to get a nice beejay every day no matter how long I live. A beejay a day keeps the doctor away! Cheers!

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2346051]Fake news?[/QUOTE]Yes. Now can we please get back to pussy?

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2346568]I don't foresee a market crash on the scale of '08 '09 which was caused by reckless US subprime property lending followed by mispricing of that lending but there are a number of signals out there that all is not well, not the least of which is the $13 trillion in negative yielding government debt a phenomenon Japan notwithstanding never seen before alongside the level of US debt over 100% and heading to 110%.
But what the hell, the sun is shining and the girls are waiting.[/QUOTE]Yes and who was president of the USA then?

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2346568] greater danger may be the irrational behavior of Trump who will do whatever it takes to get reelected and could bring about a collapse of the dollar in the process.[/QUOTE]I'm not sure what that even means. However, if Trump is re-elected, I fully expect the good times to continue. If Trump somehow loses the election to any of the Democrats currently running (all idiots), I fully expect a market crash.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2345656]From Thai Visa.

A leading tourism official has confirmed what many Pattaya residents have suspected for a long time.

The days of Europeans visiting Pattaya in large numbers for the entertainment industry are gone.

The strength of the baht, alternatives elsewhere and the rise of Chinese and now Indian tourism has seen a marked shift on who is coming to Pattaya and what they are doing there.

Secretary of the Entertainment Industry and Tourism Association of Pattaya Damrongkiat Phinitkarn gave Sophon TV some frank and damning statistics about the low season in Pattaya this year. Down 20% to 30%.[/QUOTE]Don't forget the shaming of the western monger has taken a toll.

[QUOTE=DCups;2347490]Yes. Now can we please get back to pussy?[/QUOTE]This is a thread where we can talk about these issues instead of pussy. See, if you think the links I posted were "Fake News", that was your cue to post similarly credible links showing, say, that Trump's economy has created almost 1,000,000 more jobs during the comparable timeframe than Obama's insread of almost 1,000,000 fewer jobs and that the economy is accelerating rather than slowing under Trump vs Obama.

Recommending we quickly change the subject to pussy doesn't exactly refute what is cited in detail in those links or prove they report "Fake News", which I assume was your intention, but instead looks a wee bit like even you know you cannot do that.

[QUOTE=DCups;2347498]Yes and who was president of the USA then?[/QUOTE]Well, as far as who was president for the most recent USA stock market crash, that would be George W. Bush. The stock market had hovered within a few percentage points up or down of a traditional Correction (at or less than a 20% decline from the previous all time high) and not a Bear for most of 2008, weathering some scary venerable investment institution collapses like Bear Sterns and Lehman Bros. along the way. It had stubbornly resisted dipping well into Bear territory without bouncing back into Correction territory within a few days.

But it finally gave way and crashed demonstrably into Bear territory beginning on the afternoon of September 29, 2008, in response to a handful of House Republicans suddenly reneging on their already "whipped" Yes votes needed to pass the original TARP, causing it to fail to pass. According to them, they did that because their feelings were hurt by something rather ordinary and innocuous then Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi said that morning before the vote. I am not joking about that.

It was that particular straw on the camel's back that triggered a massive panic selloff that sent worldwide markets crashing and our economy into paralysis on the reasonable assumption that the then current Republican influence in government left America without the political will and smarts to do what was necessary to avert another Great Depression. Indeed, that little stunt to cause the original TARP to fail passage looked very much like the exact wrong moves Herbert Hoover and his fellow Republicans made in response to their Crash in 1929 that exacerbated and deepened the Great Depression.

From that afternoon on, the USA stock market would not find a floor and begin to recover until the Republican presence and influence was switched in the White House and tilted more toward Democrats in Congress and their first major economic recovery legislation was passed with practically no Republican votes.

What followed was the longest uninterrupted economic recovery and Bull Market in USA history. Even better than the previous Dem recoveries from Republican economic downturns or crashes under FDR, JFK / LBJ, Carter and Clinton. Obama's was even better and, considering the near unified Republican opposition to his and the Dems' efforts to pull us out of yet another in a long list of major Republican downturns over the past 85-90 years, I would say a more impressive accomplishment than those as well.

Btw, there was no Crash in 2009. Only a continuation of the panic selloff Crash that began on September 29, 2008 until about March 9, 2009, a couple of weeks after that American Recovery and Reinvestment Act was signed and passed.

I don't believe there has been a >20% decline/Crash triggering a Bear in the USA stock market with a Dem in the White House since before FDR. Beginning with Herbert Hoover roughly 90 years ago, Crashes or Bear markets have all begun under Republican presidents. That trend might even go back to 1907 under Teddy Roosevelt.

[QUOTE=DCups;2347498]Yes and who was president of the USA then?[/QUOTE]The crash of 08 and 09 was a result of what was going on for years during the Bush 43 presidency in the mispricing by the rating agencies of collateralized reckless mortgage lending which was making billions for the banking industry. Even so it would be wrong to blame this on Bush who was busy screwing up in Iraq having being played by Cheney and Rumsfeld.

The responsibility properly rests with the banks, the rating agencies and the asleep at the wheel regulators.

As a matter of record not opinion a comparison of stock market performance for similar periods of the Obama and Trump presidencies show from inauguration and May 31st of their third year under Obama the S&P was up 56.4% Dow Jones Average was up 50.6% and the Nasdaq 92.9%. For Trump the numbers are 21.4%, 25.2% and 34.2%.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2347715]The crash of 08 and 09 was a result of what was going on for years during the Bush 43 presidency in the mispricing by the rating agencies of collateralized reckless mortgage lending which was making billions for the banking industry. Even so it would be wrong to blame this on Bush who was busy screwing up in Iraq having being played by Cheney and Rumsfeld.

The responsibility properly rests with the banks, the rating agencies and the asleep at the wheel regulators.

As a matter of record not opinion a comparison of stock market performance for similar periods of the Obama and Trump presidencies show from inauguration and May 31st of their third year under Obama the S&P was up 56.4% Dow Jones Average was up 50.6% and the Nasdaq 92.9%. For Trump the numbers are 21.4%, 25.2% and 34.2%.[/QUOTE]If the interest rate was still zero, the numbers would be even higher for Trump. Interest rates remained zero for the entire Obama Presidency and would still be zero if Obama was President because he would not have invigorated the economy with jobs like Trump has to allow the interest rates to raise above zero. The interest rates remaining at zero for so long was borderline criminal.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2347715]The crash of 08 and 09 was a result of what was going on for years during the Bush 43 presidency in the mispricing by the rating agencies of collateralized reckless mortgage lending which was making billions for the banking industry. Even so it would be wrong to blame this on Bush who was busy screwing up in Iraq having being played by Cheney and Rumsfeld.

The responsibility properly rests with the banks, the rating agencies and the asleep at the wheel regulators.

As a matter of record not opinion a comparison of stock market performance for similar periods of the Obama and Trump presidencies show from inauguration and May 31st of their third year under Obama the S&P was up 56.4% Dow Jones Average was up 50.6% and the Nasdaq 92.9%. For Trump the numbers are 21.4%, 25.2% and 34.2%.[/QUOTE]I agree that was the reason for the financial/housing crash. But I don't believe that was the reason the stock market crashed.

The stock market remained largely out of a Bear for months, almost a year during the revelations that the banks, rating agencies, regulators and, most importantly, Bush's Office of Thrift Supervision were not doing their job. It was stubbornly holding on within Correction territory through a whole slew of disastrous news and venerable investment institution collapses. The S&P 500 Index only fell about 3.5% on the news of Lehman Bros. declaring bankruptcy around Sept. 15 of 2008 and rebounded into Correction territory over the next few days on the assumption that America had learned and knew how to avert a Great Depression and was about to do the first most important thing in keeping bank's doors open when they passed the first TARP, scheduled for a vote two weeks later.

The world of stock market investors naturally assumed no Party could be idiotic enough to repeat the mistakes Republicans made back in 1929. But then that handful of House Republicans shocked the world by pulling that last minute political stunt, TARP failed to pass and the panic selloff promptly began, proving the world wrong. The S&P 500 Index fell about 8% that day and kept falling for weeks and months afterwards, no bounce back, not even a dead cat bounce.

Based on the behavior of the market leading up to that fateful day, it is very likely the stock market would have recovered quite nicely, perhaps even soared and never entered serious Crash/Bear Market territory had that initial TARP legislation passed on Sept. 29,2008.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2347730]If the interest rate was still zero, the numbers would be even higher for Trump. Interest rates remained zero for the entire Obama Presidency and would still be zero if Obama was President because he would not have invigorated the economy with jobs like Trump has to allow the interest rates to raise above zero. The interest rates remaining at zero for so long was borderline criminal.[/QUOTE]The Fed doubled the Fed Funds Rate from 0.25% to 0.5% roughly a year after the unemployment rate reached 6% and showed definite signs of continuing to fall and not rising. Considering the depth of the economic decline Obama inherited from Bush, it was prudent to give it a year to see if it sticks.

The unemployment rate reached and fell below 6% in less than half the time under Obama than Mitt Romney promised his (Mitt's) policies would get it there in his 2012 presidential campaign bid. That is essentially the rate the Fed had established as being "Full Employment" for this era, when we historically begin to see more jobs available than applicants to take them and wage inflation becomes a risk. It was in December 2015, a few months after Donald Trump first announced his run for the presidency when almost no one predicted he would be the Republican nominee much less the president.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2347706]...

I don't believe there has been a >20% decline/Crash triggering a Bear in the USA stock market with a Dem in the White House since before FDR. Beginning with Herbert Hoover roughly 90 years ago, Crashes or Bear markets have all begun under Republican presidents. That trend might even go back to 1907 under Teddy Roosevelt.[/QUOTE]BTW, I should add that this current president has continued the Republican tradition of presiding over Bear market downturns or crashes, at least technically. In 2018, the USA stock market as measured by the Wilshire 5000 Total Market Index (essentially every stock in most of the other major Indexes combined) fell and closed 20.75% from its previous high, traditionally considered Bear territory. However, the S&P 500 Index, the one most often used to measure for this purpose, only fell and closed down 19.78%. So it depends on how traditional one wants to measure Bulls and Bears, either by the Total USA Stock Market or by the S&P 500 alone.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2347749]I agree that was the reason for the financial/housing crash. But I don't believe that was the reason the stock market crashed.

The stock market remained largely out of a Bear for months, almost a year during the revelations that the banks, rating agencies, regulators and, most importantly, Bush's Office of Thrift Supervision were not doing their job. It was stubbornly holding on within Correction territory through a whole slew of disastrous news and venerable investment institution collapses..[/QUOTE]It is always a matter of speculation as to whether the outcome of a situation would have been different had this or that happened or not particularly one as complicated as a world economic crisis, we simply don't know.

I do accept markets are at times driven just as much by physiology as fundamentals and I agree the September 29th shenanigans in the house did not help but that said the bill was passed 4 days later.

I guess you are saying that delay made all the difference to what followed. Possible I suppose but in my opinion unlikely and so I stand by my contention and the commonly accepted explanation of the crash of '08 '09 being caused by a housing crisis that first began to appear back in 2006.

At a bare minimum I think you have to agree that had there not been this housing crisis in the first place there would have been no need for a TARP making whether it passed on Sept 29th or Oct 3rd irrelevant.

If not then ET let's agree to disagree.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2347730]If the interest rate was still zero, the numbers would be even higher for Trump. Interest rates remained zero for the entire Obama Presidency and would still be zero if Obama was President because he would not have invigorated the economy with jobs like Trump has to allow the interest rates to raise above zero. The interest rates remaining at zero for so long was borderline criminal.[/QUOTE]I suppose Smoothy this comes down to whether one is a Trump supporter or not.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2346051]
Fake news?[/QUOTE]Yep, most of the mainstream media can't be trusted. I was at this particular rally chanting CNN sucks. Good fun. CNN the next day made it seem like it was an angry mob and that Jim Acosta was in danger, but in reality we were having a good laugh. Then again, CNN is fake news so it wasn't surprising. They don't report the news anymore, they report their narrative.
[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LMzJsw3eFRQ[/URL]

CNN fake Muslim protests.
[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B1gR37Wwakw[/URL]

Top 4 reasons CNN is called fake news.
[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=igfW_ogd0ZM[/URL]

Top 10 fake news of 2016.
[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=REPFH2V_EYo[/URL]

How about the current one where the Dems are calling Trump a racist?
[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sCkt57w3Uu0[/URL]

ABC fakes crime scene.
[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-YwIkknxE8E[/URL]

This one just makes me laugh since Don Lemon is such a hypocrite.
[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LulNAEeTsrc[/URL]

NBC blows up truck for fake news story.
[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7fslEpQGw0M[/URL]

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2347900]Yep, most of the mainstream media can't be trusted. I was at this particular rally chanting CNN sucks. Good fun. CNN the next day made it seem like it was an angry mob and that Jim Acosta was in danger, but in reality we were having a good laugh. Then again, CNN is fake news so it wasn't surprising. They don't report the news anymore, they report their narrative.[/QUOTE]Right on Smoothy, got to go to Fox to get accurate news these days. Mainstream media are just Trump haters and fake news platforms. Same goes for the Washington Post and The New York times.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2347833]It is always a matter of speculation as to whether the outcome of a situation would have been different had this or that happened or not particularly one as complicated as a world economic crisis, we simply don't know.

I do accept markets are at times driven just as much by physiology as fundamentals and I agree the September 29th shenanigans in the house did not help but that said the bill was passed 4 days later.

I guess you are saying that delay made all the difference to what followed. Possible I suppose but in my opinion unlikely and so I stand by my contention and the commonly accepted explanation of the crash of '08 '09 being caused by a housing crisis that first began to appear back in 2006.

At a bare minimum I think you have to agree that had there not been this housing crisis in the first place there would have been no need for a TARP making whether it passed on Sept 29th or Oct 3rd irrelevant.

If not then ET let's agree to disagree.[/QUOTE]I call that Sept. 29,2009 event the trigger for the panic selloff that followed because all evidence points to it being that. It was not a well-reasoned decision by forward thinking stock market investors considering the state of the country's finances and housing. They had almost a year of incremental, almost weekly awareness of that situation in the economy to bail out of the market in large numbers, but they didn't. I believe they didn't because it was assumed there would no "shenanigans" when the time came for the White House and Congress to do what is necessary to prevent another 1929. Housing, financial, banking, savings and loan crises, even (on rare occasion) deep Recessions can exist side-by-side with stock markets that continue on without a major, prolonged crash as long as there is ample reason to think there are enough clear heads willing to do the right thing to prevent a major Crash. We had all of those things during the Reagan and Bush1 years, but only one short term crash into 20% decline that only lasted a few days before recovering and nothing was done differently in terms of legislation in those few days.

That assumption came to a shocking halt on Sept. 29,2008. It doesn't matter that 3-4 days later Bush and his fellow Republicans came out and said, "Hey, folks, come on back! We were only kidding. We'll pass it this time, no kidding." Once panic sets in and the mob is racing for the exits, you don't reel them back in with immediate, largely improvised do-overs. Fed Chairman Paulson had been working since early 2008 on that bailout. Due diligence was baked in the market for why it was on the table for a vote and what it would likely mean. That quickly cobbled together do-over 3-4 days later, was not the same bill. Changes had been made in as much of a panic as the stock market investors running for the exits. And nobody thought this one legislation is all we'll need to pull us out of this crisis. It was merely the first one. There would be others. And more "shenanigans" when their time came? No thanks. I'm OUT.

It required a complete change in the political make-up of the Federal Government, replacing the one party well known throughout decades and decades of history for presiding over major economic declines and stock market crashes with the one that is as well known for pulling us out of them. In fact, the "shenanigans" did not even end from that former side. At virtually every step of the follow up measures required to pull us out of the Great Recession and get the stock market back on track for historic gains, the "shenanigans" side slow-walked, obfuscated, delayed, denied, blocked and obstructed them. It is one of the reasons this particular Dem recovery from a Rep decline was slower than the others. So, in a very real sense, the mob that ran for the exits in a panic starting Sept. 29,2008 and did not believe the calls to "come back, everything will be ok" 3-4 days later had it right as long as the Federal Government was in that side's control.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2347900]Yep, most of the mainstream media can't be trusted. I was at this particular rally chanting CNN sucks. Good fun. CNN the next day made it seem like it was an angry mob and that Jim Acosta was in danger, but in reality we were having a good laugh. Then again, CNN is fake news so it wasn't surprising. They don't report the news anymore, they report their narrative.
[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LMzJsw3eFRQ[/URL]

CNN fake Muslim protests.
[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B1gR37Wwakw[/URL]

Top 4 reasons CNN is called fake news.
[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=igfW_ogd0ZM[/URL]

Top 10 fake news of 2016.
[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=REPFH2V_EYo[/URL]

How about the current one where the Dems are calling Trump a racist?
[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sCkt57w3Uu0[/URL]

ABC fakes crime scene.
[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-YwIkknxE8E[/URL]

This one just makes me laugh since Don Lemon is such a hypocrite.
[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LulNAEeTsrc[/URL]

NBC blows up truck for fake news story.
[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7fslEpQGw0M[/URL][/QUOTE]No doubt, mainstream media and niche media can and do shade and spin to fit an agenda. The agenda is more often than not just to attract more eyes and ears to their product, not to promote a political side. But economic data isn't a matter of mood, political bias or opinion. Someone can shade and spin all they want. But until the data is shown to be false, having been fabricated for some reason, it is what it is.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2347900]Yep, most of the mainstream media can't be trusted.

...[/QUOTE]BTW, are those linked sources really where you go to sort out the Fake News from the Real News?

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2348159] It doesn't matter that 3-4 days later Bush and his fellow Republicans came out and said, "Hey, folks, come on back! We were only kidding. [/QUOTE]I am not an American although I follow its politics and as an investor its imperative to know what is happening to the markets there.

I am apolitical although one cannot but be disgusted by the behavior and values of some individuals who get elected to the highest ranks of public office.

ET I feel when discussing consequences of a particular event it is prudent to leave political partisanship out of the discussion as it clouds sound reasoning. I may be wrong but in your somewhat not easy to follow post it seems that you are blaming Bush and the republicans for the shenanigans of Monday Sept 29 when in fact the bill failed to pass because a third of the democratic members of the house voted against it. Don't forget they held the majority after the 2006 midterms 233 to 202.

It was only 2 days to the Wednesday when the senate passed the bill at which time it was generally accepted with the revisions the house would pass it too.

While some details were changed the objective of the bill remained the same to put a floor under the financial system to stop it from collapsing altogether with the ensuing possibility of another great depression.

Was what happened in this relatively small time frame in a crisis which had been brewing for months and months on end, years if you go back to the beginning of the housing collapse the cause of the subsequent fall in stock markets worldwide?

On that ET we will have to agree to disagree.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2348209]BTW, are those linked sources really where you go to sort out the Fake News from the Real News?[/QUOTE]In my opinion, it's pretty easy to pick out what is actual news and what is just narrative regardless of the source. Unfortunately, CNN is almost all narrative these days and very little true factual news. MSNBC has always been just narrative pushing their liberal agenda, but at least they make no secret of that. CNN actually tries to pose as a factual news network, which they are not. Foxnews has shows like hannity which just push the conservative narrative, but they do have some unbiased shows as well which I don't see on the other major cable networks. I prefer watching full raw footage of events, listening to debates and discussions from both sides of the argument, then making my own decisions rather than listening to how any of the news outlets try to spin things.

I find these types of interviews and debates interesting because they actually present both points of view. A channel like CNN never presents the conservative point of view in an educated manner.

Munk debate
[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GxYimeaoea0[/URL]

Politicon debate
[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H2SDFwu_JR8[/URL]

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2348307]In my opinion, it's pretty easy to pick out what is actual news and what is just narrative regardless of the source. Unfortunately, CNN is almost all narrative these days and very little true factual news. MSNBC has always been just narrative pushing their liberal agenda, but at least they make no secret of that. CNN actually tries to pose as a factual news network, which they are not. Foxnews has shows like hannity which just push the conservative narrative, but they do have some unbiased shows as well which I don't see on the other major cable networks. I prefer watching full raw footage of events, listening to debates and discussions from both sides of the argument, then making my own decisions rather than listening to how any of the news outlets try to spin things.

I find these types of interviews and debates interesting because they actually present both points of view. A channel like CNN never presents the conservative point of view in an educated manner.

Munk debate
[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GxYimeaoea0[/URL]

Politicon debate
[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H2SDFwu_JR8[/URL][/QUOTE]The US media is corporate and serves corporate interests. I don't consider any US media to be truly left leaning. When you compare them to media outlets in other developed nations CNN and MSNBC are center right at best. FFS, the Dems in the US are a center right party. I'm certainly hoping the new progressives can push the US a bit more towards the center soon. By far the worst channel for "fake news" in the US is Fox; that is if you can even call it news. It's like listening to Howard Stern. It's amazing entertainment.
We live in a post-truth world.

[QUOTE=Goatscrot;2348416]By far the worst channel for "fake news" in the US is Fox.[/QUOTE]You obviously don't watch foxnews because that's inaccurate. As I mentioned, they do have ridiculous shows like Hannity. However, there are lots of shows on Foxnews that report the news from both sides. I don't see that on any other network.

I like watching "The Five" on foxnews. I liked The Five better when Kimberly Guilfoyle was on there (hotty), but it's still a light hearted way of reporting and debating the news and I enjoy that. It sounds like you would like Shephard Smith.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2348574]You obviously don't watch foxnews because that's inaccurate. As I mentioned, they do have ridiculous shows like Hannity. However, there are lots of shows on Foxnews that report the news from both sides. I don't see that on any other network.

I like watching "The Five" on foxnews. I liked The Five better when Kimberly Guilfoyle was on there (hotty), but it's still a light hearted way of reporting and debating the news and I enjoy that. It sounds like you would like Shephard Smith.[/QUOTE]I don't mind that the prime time FOX NEWS programming is dominated by ultra wingnut spin and easily debunked fake news. There is certainly a market for that on cable news and buyer beware. But they obviously make an effort to fool their viewers into thinking they are watching Real News instead of Trump/GOP campaign lies and blather whenever Hannity and the others open their mouth.

That is not what CNN, MSNBC and regular broadcast news services on ABC, CBS and NBC do.

Notice that there is a bug in the lower left corner of the screen telling the viewer that what they are watching is "NEWS" through every one of those pundit/opinion programs 24/7.

The other channels don't do that. They just identify their channel with their call letters and do not insist you take everything you see and hear on every program to be ABC NEWS, CABLE NEWS or anything of the kind.

But that isn't what FOX NEWS does when they could simply place FN in the lower left corner of the screen as its channel call letters.

That decision was, imo, an obvious a early Roger Ailes concept designed to mislead viewers with an ever present lie placed on their tv screen.

And I guess I am puzzled why Real News needs to be given "both sides" unless there is an interest in promoting and elevating some lie or falsehood as equal to the reportable facts. FOX NEWS' biggest audiences are watching shows being promoted as NEWS that will likely never report much negative news about their favorite GOP figures, even when it is rather unprecedented news. And if they can't avoid it, there will be some noodnik there with no facts but only a rabid opinion that everyone else is lying as though that is an admirable effort to present "both sides" to credible, verified facts.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2348593]And I guess I am puzzled why Real News needs to be given "both sides" unless there is an interest in promoting and elevating some lie or falsehood as equal to the reportable facts. FOX NEWS' biggest audiences are watching shows being promoted as NEWS that will likely never report much negative news about their favorite GOP figures, even when it is rather unprecedented news.[/QUOTE]Although Hannity is absurdly biased, so are MSNBC's Rachel Maddow and CNN's Don Lemon. All three are fake news. Hannity says nothing negative about the President and Maddow and Lemon say nothing positive about the President. It's ridiculous.

But The Five is a pretty good show. I have yet to find any show on the other networks that presents issues with appropriate discussions from both sides like that. If you can name one on CNN like that please let me know. Of course MSNBC won't have one, but that's a given.

I also like the Gutfeld show. It's a comedy, but they come up with some good points on occasion.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2348614]Although Hannity is absurdly biased, so are MSNBC's Rachel Maddow and CNN's Don Lemon. All three are fake news. Hannity says nothing negative about the President and Maddow and Lemon say nothing positive about the President. It's ridiculous.

But The Five is a pretty good show. I have yet to find any show on the other networks that presents issues with appropriate discussions from both sides like that. If you can name one on CNN like that please let me know. Of course MSNBC won't have one, but that's a given.

I also like the Gutfeld show. It's a comedy, but they come up with some good points on occasion.[/QUOTE]But Hannity's show is the only one in that group above with the word "NEWS" ever present on the bottom of the screen. And I assume The Five does, too.

FOX has always misled its audience in that way. And not only visually, but in words as well. When Hannity and O'Reilly before him touted their ratings, they blasted all other news programming as inferior to theirs because they ere the only "Fair and Balanced" news shows. But call them out on their lies and they retreat to "Oh, we're only an entertainment show, we're just expressing our opinion!"

I appreciate that The Five is an opinion/pundit show on Fox that allows a non GOP voice to be heard and express an opinion, although I still question the motives for presenting "both sides" of verifiable news items. But MSNBC's Morning Joe Show is hosted by a former GOP Congressman who led the charge and voted to impeach Bill Clinton and rarely had a good word for Hillary Clinton. I am sure when he sees or hears Trump doing or saying something positive, he gives him props for it. I have heard him do it. And Maddow always cites the name of the "other side" of an important news item that was invited on her show to give his or her version of it. Sometimes they show up, sometimes they don't.

Btw, the reason MSNBC doesn't have a straight news only show is because their parent company, NBC, already has a national evening news program for that. But Fox does not. There is no Fox Evening News on the regular national Fox broadcast channel at those times. Probably showing Jeopardy or reruns of Hogan's Heroes then. They do not want to be subject to the same standards of scrutiny for credibility as the ABC, CBS and NBC networks. If they were, their national news reports would naturally fly in the face and contradict what is being said about that exact same news item on their cable channel. Awkward.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2348627]
But MSNBC's Morning Joe Show is hosted by a former GOP Congressman who led the charge and voted to impeach Bill Clinton and rarely had a good word for Hillary Clinton.[/QUOTE]Joke Scarborough has basically lost any credibility. He was Trump's biggest supporter prior to the election. Both CNN and MSNBC had Trump on their shows quite often prior to the election. That was when they didn't expect him to win. I can't even watch Morning Joe anymore because all they do is spew hate. Donny Deutsch is flat out insane. I don't think any of the morning cable news shows are worth watching.

Here's a discussion of Scarborough making an announcement about him leaving the Republican party in a effort to boost sales for a record he made.

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6-_FRmd7d7c[/URL]

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2348651]Joke Scarborough has basically lost any credibility. He was Trump's biggest supporter prior to the election. Both CNN and MSNBC had Trump on their shows quite often prior to the election. That was when they didn't expect him to win. I can't even watch Morning Joe anymore because all they do is spew hate. Donny Deutsch is flat out insane. I don't think any of the morning cable news shows are worth watching.

Here's a discussion of Scarborough making an announcement about him leaving the Republican party in a effort to boost sales for a record he made.

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6-_FRmd7d7c[/URL][/QUOTE]Post of the year. Whenever I need to build up my self esteem I just YouTube election night videos from MSNBC and the Young Turks.

Fuggin comedy gold.

Here are some precitions for you:

1. Trump and the Repubs will win in 2020. Then the fun starts.

2. The US economy will be gangbusters through the second Trump term.

3. Ruth Bader Ginsburg will have a stroke and be comatose, but she won't resign. Never mind, Breyer dies and Trump appoints another judge.

4. Anything pending about Immigration hits the Sup Ct and the Trump Admin wins. Plus the Court prohibits nationwide injunctions.

5. Five more states legalize weed.

6. Xi is forced out and China starts playing nice.

7. The Brits join a trade market with the USA, Canada and Mexico.

8. The baht hits 35.

9. I'll be in Thailand 7 months of each year.

Hey is the Intercontinental or the Grand Hyatt girl friendly? I need 6 nights in a hotel before I move in, might as well use the benefits of the Trump economy Looks like the Orange Mussolini is getting me an Elite Visa too, thanks Badger Hair! Keep it up!

[QUOTE=Nyezhov;2353234]Here are some precitions for you:

1. Trump and the Repubs will win in 2020. Then the fun starts.

2. The US economy will be gangbusters through the second Trump term.

3. Ruth Bader Ginsburg will have a stroke and be comatose, but she won't resign. Never mind, Breyer dies and Trump appoints another judge.

4. Anything pending about Immigration hits the Sup Ct and the Trump Admin wins. Plus the Court prohibits nationwide injunctions.

5. Five more states legalize weed.

6. Xi is forced out and China starts playing nice.

7. The Brits join a trade market with the USA, Canada and Mexico.

8. The baht hits 35.

9. I'll be in Thailand 7 months of each year.

Hey is the Intercontinental or the Grand Hyatt girl friendly? I need 6 nights in a hotel before I move in, might as well use the benefits of the Trump economy Looks like the Orange Mussolini is getting me an Elite Visa too, thanks Badger Hair! Keep it up![/QUOTE]Yeah right. If Trump wins 2020 expect another 4 years of divide and rule for sure. With 1 trillion tax cut for the top 1% & corporations deficit is already projected to grow 4 trillion with this clown. And many middle class taxes actually went up because they put limits on the deductions for primary homes! This guy has run so many of his companies into the ground & filed bankruptcy many times. Who runs a casino into bankruptcy? Real talent needed there for that. I first hand know of old couples who lost their savings listening to BS advice from Trump university. I'm an independent basically but surely would like to know what his supporters are smoking. Haha And sure there was supposed to be the best health plan ever but then "who knew it would be so complicated" and let's not even mention the stupid medieval wall that Mexico is supposedly paying for.

[QUOTE=SexIsLove;2353346]Yeah right. If Trump wins 2020 expect another 4 years of divide and rule for sure. With 1 trillion tax cut for the top 1% & corporations deficit is already projected to grow 4 trillion with this clown. And many middle class taxes actually went up because they put limits on the deductions for primary homes! This guy has run so many of his companies into the ground & filed bankruptcy many times. Who runs a casino into bankruptcy? Real talent needed there for that. I first hand know of old couples who lost their savings listening to BS advice from Trump university. I'm an independent basically but surely would like to know what his supporters are smoking. Haha And sure there was supposed to be the best health plan ever but then "who knew it would be so complicated" and let's not even mention the stupid medieval wall that Mexico is supposedly paying for.[/QUOTE]Trump will not win, he only has his deplorables and even the repubs in Congress will not support him once they see their constituents are against Trump. Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me.

No one will be fooled twice. The economy started it's roll in 2011 before this bimbo was elected. The jobs he brags about are Mcjobs, shitty low paying jobs that most have to work 2 or 3 jobs to make ends meet.

Everything the man says are lies. This is his style, he has lied to subcontractors and everyone in New York. He owes everyone money, which he will try to get out of paying by connecting them with someone in government.

His tax break for the rich has failed, they kept the money and bought their own stock back. The tariffs and duty deal with China is a failure, all of our soybean farmers are now on subsidies (welfare). Factories are closing in China because of the stoppage of exports due to the tariffs.

Everything this man touches turns to shit. DO NOT BELIEVE any of his lies.

RL.

[QUOTE=Nyezhov;2353234]Here are some precitions for you:

1. Trump and the Repubs will win in 2020. Then the fun starts.

2. The US economy will be gangbusters through the second Trump term.

3. Ruth Bader Ginsburg will have a stroke and be comatose, but she won't resign. Never mind, Breyer dies and Trump appoints another judge.

4. Anything pending about Immigration hits the Sup Ct and the Trump Admin wins. Plus the Court prohibits nationwide injunctions.

5. Five more states legalize weed.

6. Xi is forced out and China starts playing nice.

7. The Brits join a trade market with the USA, Canada and Mexico.

8. The baht hits 35.

9. I'll be in Thailand 7 months of each year.

Hey is the Intercontinental or the Grand Hyatt girl friendly? I need 6 nights in a hotel before I move in, might as well use the benefits of the Trump economy Looks like the Orange Mussolini is getting me an Elite Visa too, thanks Badger Hair! Keep it up![/QUOTE]Yeah right. If Trump wins 2020 expect another 4 years of divide and rule for sure. With 1 trillion tax cut for the top 1% & corporations deficit is already projected to grow 4 trillion with this clown. And many middle class taxes actually went up because they put limits on the deductions for primary homes! This guy has run so many of his companies into the ground & filed bankruptcy many times. Who runs a casino into bankruptcy? Real talent needed there for that. I first hand know of old couples who lost their savings listening to BS advice from Trump university. I'm an independent basically but surely would like to know what his supporters are smoking. Haha And sure there was supposed to be the best health plan ever but then "who knew it would be so complicated" and let's not even mention the stupid medieval wall that Mexico is supposedly paying for.

[QUOTE=Nyezhov;2353234]Hey is the Intercontinental or the Grand Hyatt girl friendly? I need 6 nights in a hotel before I move in[/QUOTE]All 4 Hyatt hotels in BKK are girl friendly.

[QUOTE=RobertLong;2353419]Trump will not win, he only has his deplorables and even the repubs in Congress will not support him once they see their constituents are against Trump. Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me.

No one will be fooled twice. The economy started it's roll in 2011 before this bimbo was elected. The jobs he brags about are Mcjobs, shitty low paying jobs that most have to work 2 or 3 jobs to make ends meet.

Everything the man says are lies. This is his style, he has lied to subcontractors and everyone in New York. He owes everyone money, which he will try to get out of paying by connecting them with someone in government.

His tax break for the rich has failed, they kept the money and bought their own stock back. The tariffs and duty deal with China is a failure, all of our soybean farmers are now on subsidies (welfare). Factories are closing in China because of the stoppage of exports due to the tariffs.

Everything this man touches turns to shit. DO NOT BELIEVE any of his lies.

RL.[/QUOTE]Myself and almost everyone I know will be voting Trump again next election. I don't know anyone who voted for Trump last election who doesn't think he is a good President. They will also happily vote for him again this next election. Of the relatively few people I know personally who do not support Trump, they didn't vote for him last election either. You can stick your head in the sand if you want, but he is going to win in 2020. Not only did I support him in 2016, I support him even more now. I think he's a huge upgrade over Obama. None of the Dem candidates are worth a damn.

I disagree with almost everything you just said in your post.

I bet you thought Hillary Clinton was going to win the last election. The reality is that Trump has a lot of support in the USA and the liberal media doesn't report it. One look at his rallies compared to the rallies of his competitors tells you all you need to know. His rallies are jam packed while his rivals rallies are sparse.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qtrrZUOU_UU

[QUOTE=Nyezhov;2353234]Here are some precitions for you:

1. Trump and the Repubs will win in 2020. Then the fun starts.

2. The US economy will be gangbusters through the second Trump term.

3. Ruth Bader Ginsburg will have a stroke and be comatose, but she won't resign. Never mind, Breyer dies and Trump appoints another judge.

4. Anything pending about Immigration hits the Sup Ct and the Trump Admin wins. Plus the Court prohibits nationwide injunctions.

5. Five more states legalize weed.

6. Xi is forced out and China starts playing nice.

7. The Brits join a trade market with the USA, Canada and Mexico.

8. The baht hits 35.

9. I'll be in Thailand 7 months of each year.

Hey is the Intercontinental or the Grand Hyatt girl friendly? I need 6 nights in a hotel before I move in, might as well use the benefits of the Trump economy Looks like the Orange Mussolini is getting me an Elite Visa too, thanks Badger Hair! Keep it up![/QUOTE]Very accurate post. I think you are spot on there. I am also enjoying the extra cash in my bank account due to the Trump tax cuts and Trump economy.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2353535]Myself and almost everyone I know will be voting Trump again next election. I don't know anyone who voted for Trump last election who doesn't think he is a good President. [/QUOTE]That is because you do not know me. I am of neither party and vote for the candidate that I think is best. I voted for him last time because he wasn't the usual candidate and I wanted an outsider to shake things up. And that is exactly what he has done not knowing jack shit about trade.

I would vote for him again if it was not his treatment of the Central Park 5 deal. I do notice more money in my paycheck. Although others complain that richer people are getting more rich and we are only getting temporary scraps. A sure way for him to win is to legalize weed.

Sometimes I wish certain deceased commentators were still around. Hitchens, Hicks, Zappa. They'd have a field day with Trump.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2353541]Very accurate post. I think you are spot on there. I am also enjoying the extra cash in my bank account due to the Trump tax cuts and Trump economy.[/QUOTE]In sync with Trump's pleading for them to do so, the Fed just came to the rescue for his economy, cutting rates to help bolster a shaky outlook for economic growth for the first time since the 2008 Financial Crisis:

[URL]https://www.economist.com/finance-and-economics/2019/07/31/the-fed-cuts-rates-for-the-first-time-in-over-a-decade[/URL]

[QUOTE]INTEREST RATES set by the Federal Reserve have been rising since 2015. The gradual approach, explained the Feds chairman, Jerome Powell, last September was intended to leave time to see how well the economy could absorb each hike. So far the economy has performed very well, and very much in keeping with our expectations, he said back then.

Now America is being treated to what some are calling Powells pirouette. On July 31st Mr Powell announced Americas first interest-rate cut in over a decade, of 0.25 percentage points. [b]At the press conference after the announcement he blamed weak global growth, trade policy uncertainty and muted inflation. Were trying to sustain the expansion, he said.[/b][/QUOTE]I have been enjoying the extra cash in my real estate equity and my stock market gains for at least 4 years before Trump became president. I am pretty sure they both added more income to my household wealth than the middling tax cut I likely would have barely noticed. Especially if I'd needed to purchase an item targeted by his tariffs and paid the consumer tax on it.

Can't say I have noticed an improvement rather than a slowing down on the trajectory of the most important economic metrics since Obama left office and Trump took over. If anything, those metrics have been showing signs of slowing down lately. For the first time in almost a decade. Which is why the Fed just cut the Funds Rate yesterday. And to think Trump had to add $2 Trillion+ to the deficit just to buy that nothingness! Score another really bad deal for the worst negotiator ever to enter the White House.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2353557]A sure way for him to win is to legalize weed.[/QUOTE]LOL. That issue isn't even top 1000 in my mind. But I do think legalizing weed is just common sense.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2353557]That is because you do not know me. I am of neither party and vote for the candidate that I think is best. I voted for him last time because he wasn't the usual candidate and I wanted an outsider to shake things up. And that is exactly what he has done not knowing jack shit about trade.

I would vote for him again if it was not his treatment of the Central Park 5 deal. I do notice more money in my paycheck. Although others complain that richer people are getting more rich and we are only getting temporary scraps. A sure way for him to win is to legalize weed.[/QUOTE]But the Central Park 5 deal was years before the 2016 election. The extra cash in your paycheck was front loaded for you to notice it until soon after the 2020 election. Then it will be phased out while the corporate tax cuts will go on and on adding further trillions to the deficit.

Remember when Trump suddenly announced about 10 days before the 2018 midterm elections that he was going to pass a "10% Middle Class Tax Cut!" before that 2018 election even though Congress was already long gone to their home states and districts and passing anything, especially a mythical "10% Middle Class Tax Cut!" was impossible because, well, the midterm election was going to happen in about 10 days? Yeah, THAT is how little to zero notice most Americans took of their grand tax cuts from the 2017 Tax Cuts and Jobs Act. He had to lie, I mean promise them another one out of the blue in order to try to salvage the thumping his party took in that election. And we're talking about the first couple of years of the tax cuts, the only years you and everyone else who is not super wealthy was even likely to notice them.

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2353557]A sure way for him to win is to legalize weed.[/QUOTE]Pretty sure this is a state issue as some states have legalised it. A federal law wouldn't have much effect on the states unless the federal gov pursued them to make the change.

The biggest issue WRT legalising weed is the ban on banks dealing with the proceeds of drugs. That's the problem that medical cannabis companies are having, they can't use the banking system.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2353595]ICan't say I have noticed an improvement rather than a slowing down on the trajectory or most important economic metrics since Obama left office and Trump took over. If anything, those metrics have been been showing signs of slowing down lately. For the first time in almost a decade. Which is why the Fed just cut the Funds Rate yesterday. And to think Trump had to add $2 Trillion+ to the deficit just to buy that nothingness! Score another really bad deal for the worst negotiator ever to enter the White House.[/QUOTE]Not being presumptuous but perhaps something we can agree on ET.

Trump is not the least bit interested in the well being of Americans either financially or in their quality of life. What motivates him is for God only knows what reason to dismantle the legacy of Obama aka the Affordable health Care Act, the Paris Climate Accord and the Iran Deal.

To indulge his narcissism his racism and his ego he appeals to the lowest instincts of human behavior. Just look at his so called base. White under educated old male disgruntled bigots and that is being kind to them.

Who would have thought America had so many. They are far from being a majority but enough with the vagaries of the Electoral College and the 60% only who vote in elections resulted in him becoming president.

He ballooned up the national debt by giving more to the already disproportionately rich. Wow, very clever idea Donald, why didn't anybody else figure that one out.

He picked fights with Canada and the EU friends of the US to show his manly chops when in reality he was too cowardly to fight for his country in Vietnam.

His falling in love with Kim Jong Un arguably the most psychopathic violent dictator on the planet while cozying up to Saudis after they butchered Khashoggi, his fondness for Putin and his pathological lying all show who he is.

I'm not an American but if I were I would be so embarrassed that these world despots all know how to play this guy like a puppet on a string. To get a photo op he gives up the prestige and influence that the US has enjoyed on the world stage since WW2.

Oh did I mention he still denies man made climate change that is already beginning to negatively impact millions of lives, that asset values improved more under Obama at the same time in their presidencies.

None of this means anything to his followers who think he loves them as patriots and fine people but who in reality looks down on them as losers as he shits in his gold plated bathroom while watching Fox News.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2353535]Myself and almost everyone I know will be voting Trump again next election. I don't know anyone who voted for Trump last election who doesn't think he is a good President. They will also happily vote for him again this next election. Of the relatively few people I know personally who do not support Trump, they didn't vote for him last election either. You can stick your head in the sand if you want, but he is going to win in 2020. Not only did I support him in 2016, I support him even more now. I think he's a huge upgrade over Obama. None of the Dem candidates are worth a damn.

I disagree with almost everything you just said in your post.[/QUOTE]What is 60' long and has 12 teeth?

The front row at a Trump rally.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2353615]Just look at his so called base. White under educated old male disgruntled bigots and that is being kind to them.[/QUOTE]The old saying "ignorance is bliss" certainly comes to mind when I read your post. You refer to them as bigots, then act as a bigot yourself.

Bigot - a person who is intolerant towards those holding different opinions.

Trump supporters are just normal Americans who hold a different opinion from yours. I've been to Trump rallies and although you are in line with the way the liberal media likes to portray things, you are way off. The Trump supporters I know personally are well educated and far from "bigots". They are educated business professionals who have successful careers and lives. And they are very accepting of all races and religions as long as those races and religions are accepting of them and respectful of the USA. However, they do have enough common sense to realize when political correctness and special interest groups had garnered an absurd level of attention. The country needed a change of direction and Trump provided that.

Even us Trump supporters realize that Trump says ridiculous things often, that he's bombastic and egotistical, that he has very little filter (political correctness) in his comments. However, he's a breath of fresh air in my mind. I much prefer him over the slick talking lawyer types we normally see in politics.

Go to a Trump rally, I bet you find the people there to be good-hearted people, very civil (even if you are yelling negative comments and acting like a fool), and far more well educated than the media would have you believe.

If you do try to go to a Trump rally, get your tickets and get in line early because those rallies fill quickly and you might be left outside to watch on a huge movie theater size screen they put outside for those who couldn't get in to watch the rally inside.

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RNJxA9hCcgA[/URL]

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2353826]The old saying "ignorance is bliss" certainly comes to mind when I read your post. You refer to them as bigots, then act as a bigot yourself.

Bigot - a person who is intolerant towards those holding different opinions.

Trump supporters are just normal Americans who hold a different opinion from yours. I've been to Trump rallies and although you are in line with the way the liberal media likes to portray things, you are way off. The Trump supporters I know personally are well educated and far from "bigots". They are educated business professionals who have successful careers and lives. And they are very accepting of all races and religions as long as those races and religions are accepting of them and respectful of the USA. However, they do have enough common sense to realize when political correctness and special interest groups had garnered an absurd level of attention. The country needed a change of direction and Trump provided that.

Even us Trump supporters realize that Trump says ridiculous things often, that he's bombastic and egotistical, that he has very little filter (political correctness) in his comments. However, he's a breath of fresh air in my mind. I much prefer him over the slick talking lawyer types we normally see in politics.[/QUOTE]I get the argument that the so called political establishment are mostly self-serving elites, ruling classes who cater more to vested interests rather than the average citizen. I get it when somebody comes along who runs on a platform of "I'm not one of them I'm different" it's very appealing. It works for me. What I don't get is how this is then used to excuse the most outrageous behavior, the lying, the bullying the racism, the stoking of fear and divisiveness saying oh well its OK that's just Trump being Trump he's different.

As to his rallies I accept I haven't been to any of them but I imagine they are fun events with lots of camaraderie and enthusiasm but as I understand who goes to them I will quote the man himself. There are bigots, there are racists, and some I assume are good people including Smoothy.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2353615]Not being presumptuous but perhaps something we can agree on ET.

Trump is not the least bit interested in the well being of Americans either financially or in their quality of life. What motivates him is for God only knows what reason to dismantle the legacy of Obama aka the Affordable health Care Act, the Paris Climate Accord and the Iran Deal.

...[/QUOTE]You presume correctly, Franciscass. As Mark Twain said, "It is easier to fool somebody than to convince them they've been fooled." Consequently, there must be a lot of Trump supporters still convinced he has kept a single major campaign promise or has outperformed his predecessor on any major economic and/or national security metric, which he has not. Or maybe they still think the voice of a shameless con man sounds like a breath of fresh air compared with the way people sound when they know what they're talking about and are working hard to improve conditions and institutions rather than tearing them down. The latter is so boring compared with the former. To paraphrase another observation, bringing a horse into a hospital and leaving him there for 4 years would "shake things up", too. But not exactly in a good way.

GDP growth for 2018, which had been celebrated by Trump and his supporters as being the first of many 3%+ growth years, supposedly besting what Obama presided over, was just revised downward to 2.9%. Therefore, despite jacking up the deficit by an unnecessary $2 Trillion+ in order to BUY a better annual GDP growth rate than Obama presided over, Trump still failed to do so. Obama had an annual GDP growth rate of 2.9% during the three years prior to Trump taking over. I see no reason to expect this year, Trump's third year in office, to produce a 3% or greater GDP growth rate. I think we'll be lucky to see it top 2% for this year.

Private sector jobs creation in the first 2 1/2 years of the Trump administration has so far under-performed Obama's last 2 1/2 years by at least 500,000 private sector jobs.

The unemployment rate has not declined any faster nor the trajectory of that decline fallen any sharper under Trump than it did under Obama. And it is impossible for Trump to (truthfully) take legislative or policy credit for turning a skyrocketing unemployment rate into a deeply and consistently declining one because, unlike Obama, he did not take over during a period of skyrocketing unemployment.

Wages are ticking up under Trump (as they were beginning to under Obama) because Obama's economy took us from that skyrocketing unemployment rate he inherited into the level of "Full Employment" well before the 2016 election and because several of the most populace and largely Blue/Dem states have passed minimum wage laws raising it to or near $15 per hour, typically doubling it in a single year. It has nothing whatsoever to do with a Trump or GOP Congressional economic policy or legislation. In fact, they oppose those moves and delight in slamming them as "Socialism! while at the same time they work very hard to take credit for the outcome.

Trump loves to take credit for wages rising among "Blacks, Hispanics and women!" on his watch. But he will never mention the minimum wage jobs those state laws he and his party philosophically oppose have been giving relatively huge hourly wage raises to Blacks, Hispanics and women because those kind of jobs are disproportionately occupied by them. That is why their wages are going up. It certainly hasn't got a thing to do with giving large tax cuts to the top 1% Elite wealthiest and corporations in some never-seen-before Supply-Side/Trickle-Down miracle or because he eliminated regulations in some industries.

The average annual gains in the stock market under Trump have not surpassed Obama's average annual gains even if we factor in the massive losses in the market that were just cresting and cascading into a Niagara Falls plunge months before the 2008 election and continued in that same downward plunge for a couple of months after his inauguration.

Some of the Leading Economic Indicators are declining under Trump for the first time in several years. The Fed does not lower the Funds Rate because an economy is roaring into "the greatest in USA History." On the contrary, if there is indication of such an improvement in the economy on the horizon, they RAISE rates, which is what they did under Obama almost a year before the 2016 election and again under Obama a month before the January 2017 inauguration. When they lower rates, as they did just this week, it is because the economy is in decline or they see the risk of an economic slowdown or a decline ahead.

I can only assume Trump is too clueless about that most basic Fed Funds Rate principle to know his pleading for them to cut rates was nothing more than a tacit admission that his economy needed the help, that the "greatest economy in USA History" could not handle a measly 2.5% Fed Funds rate and they'd better lower it for him quick. Well, the other possibility is he knows better than anyone his base is too clueless to know anything about that.

[QUOTE=PVMonger;2353654]What is 60' long and has 12 teeth?

The front row at a Trump rally.[/QUOTE]What's 20 feet long and has an IQ of 20?

The lineup of Democrat presidential candidates.

Ka-ching!

[QUOTE=MrEnternational;2353557]the Central Park 5 deal. [/QUOTE]I'm no expert on that topic, but I do have a lot of respect for Brandon Tatum's perspectives. This is his take on it.

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7krMErdyxhk[/URL]

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2353913]"It is easier to fool somebody than to convince them they've been fooled." [/QUOTE]I will admit I was fooled into voting for Obama and that was a mistake back then. However, I'm very satisfied with the current President.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2354308]I will admit I was fooled into voting for Obama and that was a mistake back then. However, I'm very satisfied with the current President.[/QUOTE]Interesting. On a related topic, is there a version of Patpong's BarBar Fetish Club in Jarkarta to keep you happy and satisfied at home, too?

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2354322]is there a version of Patpong's BarBar Fetish Club in Jarkarta?[/QUOTE]If I were into that, I'd have voted for Hillary Clinton.

As far as a place like that in Jakarta, I have heard tell of such a place. I've never been to it, but I hear they may have converted Obama's old house in Menteng into a place like that and it's run by Larry Sinclair. Supposedly they also serve nasi goreng.

I'm rather glad this thread has been revived and ghettoized for the political 'discussion'. Was a bit ridiculous being in General or BKK Reports. Now I know which to ignore.

Quantum randomness and Jung's theory of synchronicity can be used explain coincidences in hate crimes by right wing white supremacists but if a cause can be defined, then there is no coincidence.

This lunatic that want on a rampage in El Paso drove 1000 clicks to a city on the front line of the immigration crisis. This was no coincidence. No it was where hordes of infested gang banger invaders were attempting to enter the US and he as a good patriot had a duty to do something about it.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2354682]Quantum randomness and Jung's theory of synchronicity can be used explain coincidences in hate crimes by right wing white supremacists but if a cause can be defined, then there is no coincidence.

This lunatic that want on a rampage in El Paso drove 1000 clicks to a city on the front line of the immigration crisis. This was no coincidence. No it was where hordes of infested gang banger invaders were attempting to enter the US and he as a good patriot had a duty to do something about it.[/QUOTE]A lot of them congregate in Trump rallies and feed off the BS that Trump speaks there and then of course his mega tweets. Let's not kid ourselves everyone (at least in his rallies) knows what MAGA really stands for. They are mostly disenfranchised and blame immigrants, non whites & the so called swamp in Washington for all their economic woes. Yeah a few rich guys are there but that's all politics. The "swamp" is now real after this guy took office. Many of his cronies turned out to be criminals now serving time in jail. Every worthy cabinet member who has left has called him a moron or worse. National debt is ballooning like never before. Had it not been for the US federalized system & the strong institutions, the country would have turned into a shithole by now. This potus has rolled back economic, environmental & consumer protections especially if they were enacted under the previous guy. Farmers & coal companies are going bankrupt. This guy had promised to save them. Haha. There is no healthcare reform even though he had a majority in both houses for his initial two years of his term.

Everything is Trump's fault. More left wing clap trap, SexishateTrump. I am really surprised the ISG permits this divisive shit to be posted on it's web pages. For example, posts about Ladyboy pickups are not permitted here primarily because pro ladyboy posts are considered divisive, but these hate posts exhibiting full blown Trump derangement syndrome are not considered divisive? Really! This makes no sense. To the point: what does a BM's American political viewpoint, left or right, extreme radical or middle of the road, have to do with girls, sex, and Thailand? Nothing! The ISG should be apolitical and therefore it should outlaw ALL political posts.

So I ask that the ISG to put an end to these irrelevant, angry, argumentative and hateful, posts once and for all or I predict the ISG will lose half its contributors. Guys like SexishateTrump, you can't have a serious political discussion with them, but they can find plenty of other outlets on the internet to spew their garbage and vent among like minded people. I am tired of the malice and hate on this web site.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2354952]Everything is Trump's fault. More left wing clap trap, SexishateTrump. I am really surprised the ISG permits this divisive shit to be posted on it's web pages. For example, posts about Ladyboy pickups are not permitted here primarily because pro ladyboy posts are considered divisive, but these hate posts exhibiting full blown Trump derangement syndrome are not considered divisive? Really! This makes no sense. To the point: what does a BM's American political viewpoint, left or right, extreme radical or middle of the road, have to do with girls, sex, and Thailand? Nothing! The ISG should be apolitical and therefore it should outlaw ALL political posts.

So I ask that the ISG to put an end to these irrelevant, angry, argumentative and hateful, posts once and for all or I predict the ISG will lose half its contributors. Guys like SexishateTrump, you can't have a serious political discussion with them, but they can find plenty of other outlets on the internet to spew their garbage and vent among like minded people. I am tired of the malice and hate on this web site.[/QUOTE]You are perfectly correct Natty is pointing out posts on US politics have nothing to do with the purpose of the Forum and I guess that's why admin created The Thailand Lounge and Chat area. In truth US politics aside a large part of what's posted on the forum adds nothing to P4P in Thailand. This doesn't bother me though as I simply use the ignore button to filter members I know are usually navel gazing.

While as I said I see where you are coming from on the Trump posts I may be wrong but it would appear from the anger in your post that what really caused you to vent was the criticism of the dear leader himself rather than its irrelevancy. Possible?.

[QUOTE=SexIsLove;2354943]A lot of them congregate in Trump rallies and feed off the BS that Trump speaks there and then of course his mega tweets. Let's not kid ourselves everyone (at least in his rallies) knows what MAGA really stands for.[/QUOTE]I have been to a few Trump rallies, they are harmless good fun and have good people attending. The only people acting like jerks at those rallies are the anti-Trump idiots. MAGA simply stands for Make America Great Again. Trump has already done that, so his next slogan will be Keep America Great. And that means great for all Americans, not just certain ones. If you read any more than that into it, you are quite possibly a racist yourself.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2354952]Everything is Trump's fault.[/QUOTE]To be fair, everything was Obama's fault when she was President as well.

For fun, I have been passing out these t-shirts to Indo girls. If you see one wearing this shirt, you will know she slept with me at least once. LOL.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2355005]To be fair, everything was Obama's fault when she was President as well.

For fun, I have been passing out these t-shirts to Indo girls. If you see one wearing this shirt, you will know she slept with me at least once. LOL.[/QUOTE]It's all very well for "the Left" to be routed in the US, but what about men's rights for a change? Or to be more on topic with this forum, what about men's sexual rights? Prostitution is as criminalized as before. Family courts still have a licence to steal. Men must still massively travel abroad if they want sex with real women. Sex prison as usual.

Black and hispano victimhood have been dealt a blow but female victimhood stands as strong as ever.

Name me a single item on the misandric legal arsenal that has been repealed, a single female privilege taken away under Trump. Trump in power, overwhelmingly supported by men, yet the parasitic hypergamous lying female still runs the plantation. Pathetic.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2354952]Everything is Trump's fault. More left wing clap trap, SexishateTrump. I am really surprised the ISG permits this divisive shit to be posted on it's web pages. For example, posts about Ladyboy pickups are not permitted here primarily because pro ladyboy posts are considered divisive, but these hate posts exhibiting full blown Trump derangement syndrome are not considered divisive? Really! This makes no sense. To the point: what does a BM's American political viewpoint, left or right, extreme radical or middle of the road, have to do with girls, sex, and Thailand? Nothing! The ISG should be apolitical and therefore it should outlaw ALL political posts.

So I ask that the ISG to put an end to these irrelevant, angry, argumentative and hateful, posts once and for all or I predict the ISG will lose half its contributors. Guys like SexishateTrump, you can't have a serious political discussion with them, but they can find plenty of other outlets on the internet to spew their garbage and vent among like minded people. I am tired of the malice and hate on this web site.[/QUOTE]Funny, but my impression was there have been a lot more interesting girls, sex and Thailand reports from different posters over the past few weeks.

I am not saying that is [I]because[/I] those newer posters feel comfortable knowing there are at least a few others here with a grip on reality and a basic understanding of things like the near across the board economic underperformance of this current administration vs the previous one, the embarrassingly failed foreign policy, the bully pulpit-inspired uptick in hate crimes and mass shootings and so on (perhaps what you consider "full blown Trump derangement syndrome"?). I am just saying the presence of those topics and posts in this particular thread has not appeared to be chasing new and good ISG contributors away at all.

Good point XXL. I too am disappointed with the slow pace of the roll out of the Trump agenda. But he has made some progress and think of the alternative ie a Hillary regime.

EihTooms, I know you are not one of the haters. Your arguments against Trump and Reagan are grounded in Socialist Economic Theory and Alternative History. You would be arguing with equal conviction against the policies and ideas of Jeb Bush, Mitt Romney, or more importantly Milton Friedman. I don't want to put words in your mouth, but I would not be surprised if you consider the Obama Presidency a disappointment in that he did not go far enough when he had the opportunity. I choose not to debate you on the ISG pages because I don't see the point. I will never convince you of the value of the free market or minimum government intrusion into the private sector and you will never convince me of the virtues of central planning and government control. The only persons I strongly object to are the irrational haters and their handlers - the Saul Alinsky's of the world who spell disaster.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2355163]Good point XXL. I too am disappointed with the slow pace of the roll out of the Trump agenda. But he has made some progress and think of the alternative ie a Hillary regime.

EihTooms, I know you are not one of the haters. Your arguments against Trump and Reagan are grounded in Socialist Economic Theory and Alternative History. You would be arguing with equal conviction against the policies and ideas of Jeb Bush, Mitt Romney, or more importantly Milton Friedman. I don't want to put words in your mouth, but I would not be surprised if you consider the Obama Presidency a disappointment in that he did not go far enough when he had the opportunity. I choose not to debate you on the ISG pages because I don't see the point. I will never convince you of the value of the free market or minimum government intrusion into the private sector and you will never convince me of the virtues of central planning and government control. The only persons I strongly object to are the irrational haters and their handlers - the Saul Alinsky's of the world who spell disaster.[/QUOTE]"The ISG should be apolitical and therefore it should outlaw ALL political posts".

Oh oh Natty if the above is not a political post what is.

May be wrong but it seems you want to ban those who find Trump a racist demigod because it runs contrary to your own views on his presidency.

I have to say I find this disappointing as I always took you for a liberal open minded tolerant chappie.

Anyway isn't it way more interesting to be exchanging views on Trump than talking about the shape of post op lady boy's vaginas or is it?

Either way best not trying to police the forum, live and let live I say.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2355163]Good point XXL. I too am disappointed with the slow pace of the roll out of the Trump agenda. [/QUOTE]That should change after the 2020 election when the Republicans have full control of the White House, Senate, and the House or Reps. Trump was naive when he first started, now he is much more aware of how to handle things politically. Also gone are the guys like Paul Ryan who were doing nothing but obstructing progress behind the scenes.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2355192]That should change after the 2020 election when the Republicans have full control of the White House, Senate, and the House or Reps. Trump was naive when he first started, now he is much more aware of how to handle things politically. Also gone are the guys like Paul Ryan who were doing nothing but obstructing progress behind the scenes.[/QUOTE]Thank you Smoothy and Natty. Jackson refuses to post my comments on the matter but I am glad he allows yours. I am eternally moderated / punished because of my long time ago incendiary responses.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2355163]Good point XXL. I too am disappointed with the slow pace of the roll out of the Trump agenda. But he has made some progress and think of the alternative ie a Hillary regime.

EihTooms, I know you are not one of the haters. Your arguments against Trump and Reagan are grounded in Socialist Economic Theory and Alternative History. You would be arguing with equal conviction against the policies and ideas of Jeb Bush, Mitt Romney, or more importantly Milton Friedman. I don't want to put words in your mouth, but I would not be surprised if you consider the Obama Presidency a disappointment in that he did not go far enough when he had the opportunity. I choose not to debate you on the ISG pages because I don't see the point. I will never convince you of the value of the free market or minimum government intrusion into the private sector and you will never convince me of the virtues of central planning and government control. The only persons I strongly object to are the irrational haters and their handlers - the Saul Alinsky's of the world who spell disaster.[/QUOTE]No, none of those things apply to me really. Easily researched and accessible historical data and records of results do not lend themselves to Socialist Economic Theory and Alternative History or any other excuses for consistent and repeated economic under performance by one political party vs another over the course of 100 years.

Favorite Republican policy economic results under perform those of Democratic policies, more often than not disastrously so, because they are inferior ideas for how to grow and expand a complex national economy like the usa. Maybe they work ok for small nuclear families, their usual simplistic go-to analogy for what great ideas they are. But not for the entire nation.

If Trump didn't have his shit together to at least match the economic results of the Obama administration, he probably should have admitted that to himself and bowed out before he lost his party majority in the House. One (1) ineffectual economic legislation passed in two long, long years when he had majorities in both houses of Congress does not bode well for what will follow even if the Russians and other enemies of America both foreign and domestic hack every precinct polling place in the country and give him a second term.

Btw, Trump himself pointed out that the economy always seems to do much better when Democrats are in charge. But that was before he decided making fools of Republican presidential nomination candidates would make for a terrific year long Trump Brand infomercial and unexpectedly found himself being carried over the finish line by Russian campaign support and fellow Republicans in the FBI.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2355163]Good point XXL. I too am disappointed with the slow pace of the roll out of the Trump agenda. But he has made some progress and think of the alternative ie a Hillary regime.

EihTooms, I know you are not one of the haters. Your arguments against Trump and Reagan are grounded in Socialist Economic Theory and Alternative History. You would be arguing with equal conviction against the policies and ideas of Jeb Bush, Mitt Romney, or more importantly Milton Friedman. I don't want to put words in your mouth, but I would not be surprised if you consider the Obama Presidency a disappointment in that he did not go far enough when he had the opportunity. I choose not to debate you on the ISG pages because I don't see the point. I will never convince you of the value of the free market or minimum government intrusion into the private sector and you will never convince me of the virtues of central planning and government control. The only persons I strongly object to are the irrational haters and their handlers - the Saul Alinsky's of the world who spell disaster.[/QUOTE]Wow we sure have it going now Natty. So much for no political chit chat.

You are a welcome addition to the discussion albeit on the wrong side but that's OK.

I got an idea why don't we ET Smoothy yourself and myself meet for an evening get pissed and end up wrecking a go go when the disagreements on Trump get really out of hand, then shake hands and agree to do it all again the next night.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2355231]
If Trump didn't have his shit together to at least match the economic results of the Obama administration, he probably should have admitted that to himself and bowed out before he lost his party majority in the House. One (1) ineffectual economic legislation passed in two long, long years when he had majorities in both houses of Congress does not bode well for what will follow even if the Russians and other enemies of America both foreign and domestic hack every precinct polling place in the country and give him a second term.[/QUOTE]There you go again. The economic results of the Trump administration far exceed the economic results of the Obama administration if you are honest about the time period of comparison and use the same relevant yardsticks. I think you just like to argue.

The following quote is from the Washington Post, not exactly a pro Trump news outfit; " President Obama is the only president since Herbert Hoover to not have guided the US economy to 3 percent growth in any year he was in office." That was Obama's new normal in a nutshell. The weakest economic recovery since WW 2.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2355243]There you go again. The economic results of the Trump administration far exceed the economic results of the Obama administration if you are honest about the time period of comparison and use the same relevant yardsticks. I think you just like to argue.[/QUOTE]I'll give you one; at least a half million more private sector jobs were created in the last 2 1/2 years of the Obama presidency than in the first 2 1/2 years of the Trump presidency. A simple Google Search on the subject and focus on the Bureau of Labor Statistucs will tell you that.

Ok, your turn.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2355247]I'll give you one; at least a half million more private sector jobs were created in the last 2 1/2 years of the Obama presidency than in the first 2 1/2 years of the Trump presidency. A simple Google Search on the subject and focus on the Bureau of Labor Statistucs will tell you that.

Ok, your turn.[/QUOTE]No, I have more important matters to attend to. I just got a Viper text from Yangon Sally. I want to see what she is up to. I am planning to visit her in Yangon for a few days and then take her back with me to BKK for a little holiday. I know it's like bringing sand to the beach, but I think it will be fun showing her around BKK. She is a GFE (by your definition & by mine).

Perhaps some one else wants to carry on the economic discussion.

BTW, since my thought waves are now focused on a girl and where to take her when we are in BKK: on one of my last nights in town last June, I took Mini to Kinnaree by Vanessa WU for an elegant dinner. This was based on your recommendation. We both really liked the place - both the ambiance and the food. I ordered a glass of Thai red wine from Hua Hin provence and surprisingly it was very good. I would order it again.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2355252]No, I have more important matters to attend to. I just got a Viper text from Yangon Sally. I want to see what she is up to. I am planning to visit her in Yangon for a few days and then take her back with me to BKK for a little holiday. I know it's like taking sand to the beach, but I think it will be fun showing her around BKK. She is a GFE (by your definition & by mine).

Perhaps some one else wants to carry on the discussion.[/QUOTE]LOL. Good move. Actually, I have already posted links to some of the important data results here over the past 2-3 weeks. Better to respond to her Viper text. You will not be nearly as rewarded by what you will most certainly discover when or if you do a side by side comparison for any reasonably similar timeline between the Obama administration and the Trump administration for key economic metrics like private sector jobs creation, GDP growth, the trajectory of the unemployment rate, stock market gains and so on.

On a more positive note for you and others re Trump's chances in 2020, mainstream media and especially financial media are typically too lazy to delve into those critical details and are instead apt to merely parrot the recommendation that Trump ought to be talking about "his" very good economy instead of tweeting all his nonsense as though the still good conditions coasting along on the blood, sweat and hard work Obama, Pelosi, Reid and other Dems put into it in years past has much of anything to do with what he and his GOP have done without even bothering to flash a simple 10 year chart on the screen that would pretty much destroy that pro Trump election spin.

For instance, this:
https://data.bls.gov/timeseries/LNS14000000

Trump will never be able to match much less surpass the dramatic trajectory inflection in the unemployment rate that ocurred after Obama's first policies were put in place by the end of 2009. And then there was that deep decline in it from 2013 to 2016. Nothing like either of those decline trajectories has occurred under Trump.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2355258]LOL. Good move. <snip> Better to respond to her Viper text. You will not be nearly as rewarded by what you will most certainly discover when or if you do a side by side comparison <snip>[/QUOTE]OK, I will offer you the same wager I offered you before the 2016 election: I will bet you $1. 00 (a gentleman's wager) that Trump wins the 2020 election and I will offer you an additional $1.00 bet that should Trump win, he wins by a wider margin than he did in 2016.

Now, I really have to go. Atomic Blond is LINE video calling from Phuket. She is planning another of her North Asian tours and she wants to make sure it won't interfere with our reunion plans. She is a GFE super star. That's why I call her my Atomic Blond.

Politics aside (Mr. Jackson refuses to post my entries on this) can anyone tell me what "line" is? Another app? Some of my Thai Cupid contacts are giving me this and I don't know what it is. Thanks.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2355236]I got an idea why don't we ET Smoothy yourself and myself meet for an evening get pissed and end up wrecking a go go when the disagreements on Trump get really out of hand, then shake hands and agree to do it all again the next night.[/QUOTE]I would be up for that. A discussion on politics while gogo dancers are grinding on each of our laps to keep things civil.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2355264]OK, I will offer you the same wager I offered you before the 2016 election: I will bet you $1. 00 (a gentleman's wager) that Trump wins the 2020 election and I will offer you an additional $1.00 bet that should Trump win, he wins by a wider margin than he did in 2016.

Now, I really have to go. Atomic Blond is LINE video calling from Phuket. She is planning another of her North Asian tours and she wants to make sure it won't interfere with our reunion plans. She is a GFE super star. That's why I call her my Atomic Blond.[/QUOTE]Considering there isn't even one decent Democrat candidate out there, I doubt Tooms would want to throw his dollar away like that. That dollar could be used towards purchasing a burger at Big Dogs.

Any photos of the atomic blonde?

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2355264]OK, I will offer you the same wager I offered you before the 2016 election: I will bet you $1. 00 (a gentleman's wager) that Trump wins the 2020 election and I will offer you an additional $1.00 bet that should Trump win, he wins by a wider margin than he did in 2016.

Now, I really have to go. Atomic Blond is LINE video calling from Phuket. She is planning another of her North Asian tours and she wants to make sure it won't interfere with our reunion plans. She is a GFE super star. That's why I call her my Atomic Blond.[/QUOTE]Oh, yeah as I recall you wanted to bet that we would see 3%+ annual GDP growth every year or every quarter for a few years or something like that after Trump passed his brilliant (joke) tax bill, right? I would have won money on that bet if I'd taken it. The first and likely best GDP growth year since that deficit-busting legislation was passed, 2018, came in at 2.9%, the same rate we saw in 2015 under Obama and without his adding $2 Trillion+ to the deficit to buy it.

But my reason for not taking the bet then applies to your new proposal; Not interested in betting on election outcomes and things like that. If Trump is appointed president again, how does that prove his results were better than anyone's including Obama's? Obama won twice and with a clear majority of the vote each time. So?

But it's interesting how Trumpsters can never show how his policies' economic results matched much less surpassed those of his predecessor while their guy has spent years telling us how disastrous everybody elses results were but his are the greatest of all time. You would think it would be easy to do that unless their guy has been lying his ass off about those things and his Trumpsters have fallen for it.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2355325]Considering there isn't even one decent Democrat candidate out there, I doubt Tooms would want to throw his dollar away like that. That dollar could be used towards purchasing a burger at Big Dogs.

Any photos of the atomic blonde?[/QUOTE]Hey, I generally get a whole dollar discount on those burgers at Big Dogs with my exclusive membership card! But I harbor a superstition about friendly side bets on important matters like election outcomes and the USA Economy. Better to make serious bets on serious outcomes like that with IRA money and major asset allocation moves.

[QUOTE=DCups;2355311]Politics aside (Mr. Jackson refuses to post my entries on this) can anyone tell me what "line" is? Another app? Some of my Thai Cupid contacts are giving me this and I don't know what it is. Thanks.[/QUOTE]It is an app that allows you to communicate with each other, much like wechat, very easy to use, better than facebook, you creat you own ID, then you add others as friends, can text, chat, call, and video call as well.

Jb.

[QUOTE=DCups;2355311]Politics aside (Mr. Jackson refuses to post my entries on this) can anyone tell me what "line" is? Another app? Some of my Thai Cupid contacts are giving me this and I don't know what it is. Thanks.[/QUOTE]Yeah, LINE is another communication app for the PC and cell phone. Thai girls are very fond of LINE. Filipinas prefer Viper. Chinese girls like WeChat. If you are planning a trip to Thailand I recommend adding the LINE app to your phone.

[URL]https://line.me/en/[/URL]

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2355388]Yeah, LINE is another communication app for the PC and cell phone. Thai girls are very fond of LINE. Filipinas prefer Viper. Chinese girls like WeChat. If you are planning a trip to Thailand I recommend adding the LINE app to your phone.

[URL]https://line.me/en/[/URL][/QUOTE]Many thanks, Natty and JB.

Things that are attractive to Thais, Americans, and the rest of the world.

1. Wealth is a high part of being attractive.

Seems to be true for Americans and Thais but not for me and not for my country (I guess). How much money a girl had or earned never concerned me.

2. Skin colour. Americans and some other countries love to get tanned. Thais hate it, and most of Asia is trying to have white skin.

Too much sun and too little are both not healthy. I just don't care if the girl is somewhat white or somewhat brown. Maybe don't go for extremes.

3. Surgeries. I read that 17.9% of the world's cosmetic surgeries are in USA. 10% in Brazil. High in Thailand too, but low in my country.

Can this be part of the reason, that obvious unnatural shape surgeries disturb me? Perhaps they are more acceptable to Thais and Americans.

I notice that even porn has a lot of surgeries girls, but I prefer to avoid that unless the surgeries are not very noticeable.

4. Americans are supposedly obsessed with being slim, but the reality is they are more obsessed with junk food and eating too much and antibiotics (upsetting the gut function), too much beer, resulting in, Obesity, Insulin resistance and all the associated diseases. I think their are almost two distinct categories. The normal sized people (with control or lucky metabolism) and the grossly overweight (out of control). In my country there are far more in between people, somewhat overweight to fat, but not so many massively obese (yeh some of course). Thai girls seem to be letting themselves get fat once they are married since many years ago, but these days even the teenage Thai girls are getting fat from bad diets. I am attracted to quite skinny girls ranging to below average size, but not to blubber. Even I could get sex from fat girls in the past, I was not interested. I try to maintain a more healthy diet myself, which means more veg, and low sugar / starch. In 2015 there was a comedy movie "Spy". It was totally cringe worthy for me, because the female lead was not only very fat, but an accident disaster area with zero brain. It seemed unfortunate, in fact so bad, that I could not actually watch it. I greatly preferred Rowan Atkins as a spy and I could watch it. Was it purely that he was skinnier? Maybe there was some other reason, like the script being somewhat less brainless.

It amazes me that Bangkok has successful McDonalds, KFC, Pizza Hut, etc. Not sure why people want to eat such junky food. Thais are also eating a lot noodles with fish balls or beef balls. I don't touch that stuff, nor French Fries etc. I have levels of food control to avoid stacking on the kilos too fast. I like to live longer too, so some control is needed (in my case).

I know others don't find skinny girls at all attractive and particularly want big tits. Indians like voluptuous girls, right? Not for me. I can take big naturals on a slim girl okay Ha ha. Quite rare.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2355502]Things that are attractive to Thais, Americans, and the rest of the world.

1. Wealth is a high part of being attractive.

Seems to be true for Americans and Thais but not for me and not for my country (I guess). How much money a girl had or earned never concerned me.

...[/QUOTE]I don't think the amount of money a girl has is of much interest to American men. I mean, other than guys looking to scam her out of her money. Otherwise, I have never met or talked to an American man who was [I]sexually[/I] attracted to a woman because she was rich, if that is what you meant by "being attractive." Of course, that can often be the case with American women being attracted to men because they are wealthy.

Like you, I am surprised how popular McDs, KFC, Pizza Hut, now Taco Bell, etc. are with Thais. I was also struck by how many pastry, bread, donut, cake and cookie shops thrive in Thailand when I moved here several years ago. On my earlier visits 25-30 years ago I don't recall Thais being into that kind of food. About 20 years ago when I met my Thai girlfriend in the USA who then became my wife, she was never interested in desserts and sweets. She said it was not popular in her country, which matched my impression of Thailand at the time. She remained slim all her life and, at 54 years old today, is still slim. Which can not be said for many Thai women of that age here in Thailand these days.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2355517]Like you, I am surprised how popular McDs, KFC, Pizza Hut, now Taco Bell, etc. are with Thais. I was also struck by how many pastry, bread, donut, cake and cookie shops thrive in Thailand when I moved here several years ago. On my earlier visits 25-30 years ago I don't recall Thais being into that kind of food. [/QUOTE]The place that really surprises me is Swensen's ice cream. Those are all over the place and really popular. Even during the big fat free yogurt craze, Swensen's extremely fattening real ice cream was more popular in Thailand.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2355553]The place that really surprises me is Swensen's ice cream. Those are all over the place and really popular. Even during the big fat free yogurt craze, Swensen's extremely fattening real ice cream was more popular in Thailand.[/QUOTE]I found that the true sugar nightmare was found on the ground floor of Icon Siam. Folks with diabetes shouldn't even breathe the air in there. I'm moving out of Thonburi to get away from that place.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2355517]Of course, that can often be the case with American women being attracted to men because they are wealthy.[/QUOTE]Not only American women and not only to wealthy men. Sometimes they are attracted to the social rank, or the power that comes from his rank.

I knew a Thai girl who told me that the prince of Dubai is very handsome. She then told me that there are hundreds of girls that are queuing to become his GF, and finally that I don't understand which guy is handsome from a woman's perspective.

[QUOTE]Like you, I am surprised how popular McDs, KFC, Pizza Hut, now Taco Bell, etc. are with Thais.[/QUOTE]They probably still don't realise these products are very low quality foods and most of the Thais I've known that use these products go their only once in a while for a change.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2355553]The place that really surprises me is Swensen's ice cream. Those are all over the place and really popular. Even during the big fat free yogurt craze, Swensen's extremely fattening real ice cream was more popular in Thailand.[/QUOTE]Swensen's is pretty good and Cold Stone Creamery is another purveyor that is not too shabby. I like Cold Creamery's Chocolate Peanut Butter flavor. I had a scoop of it in Glorietta 3, Makati recently. Ha Ha. But have you ever tried Godiva soft Chocolate Ice Cream? HOLY MOTHER OF GOD! I have never tasted a richer, more decadent chocolate ice cream. The sugar/calorie content must be thru the roof, but it is the best tasting ice cream in the world, IMHO. LOL. Sadly or maybe fortunately, it is not sold in Godiva Chocolate stores in the USA as far as I know. So I have only found two Godiva Stores; one in Macau opposite the Grand Emperor Hotel and the other one in Jakarta in the Plaza Indonesia ground floor, that sell this ice cream. I don't usually go on and on about ice cream. I like it on somewhat rare occasions as much as the next guy or gal to satisfy a sugar craving, it's no big deal, but this Godiva stuff is truly something else and it is very addictive. Give it a taste next time you are in Plaza Indonesia and you will know what I mean.

P.S. I liked your recent report on Ruth Chris Steak House. I know a great one about 5 miles from my home in Florida, but not all Ruth Chris restaurants are good. That is why I took note of your recent post.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2355792]have you ever tried Godiva soft Chocolate Ice Cream? HOLY MOTHER OF GOD! I have never tasted a richer, more decadent chocolate ice cream. The sugar/calorie content must be thru the roof, but it is the best tasting ice cream in the world, IMHO. LOL. Sadly or maybe fortunately, it is not sold in Godiva Chocolate stores in the USA as far as I know. So I have only found two Godiva Stores; one in Macau opposite the Grand Emperor Hotel and the other one in Jakarta in the Plaza Indonesia ground floor, that sell this ice cream. I don't usually go on and on about ice cream. I like it occasionally as much as the next guy or gal, it's no big deal, but this Godiva stuff is truly something else and it is very addictive. Give it a taste next time you are in Jakarta and you will know what I mean.

P.S. I liked your recent report on the Ruth Chris Steak house. I know a great one about 5 miles from my home in Florida, but not all Ruth Chris restaurants are great. That is why I took note of your recent post.[/QUOTE]My niece's first job ever was working at the mall at a Godiva chocolate shop. She got a big discount, so, yes, I have tried the ice cream and every chocolate in the place. LOL. I used to get the milkshake there with that ice cream. Delicious.

Take the Jakarta Ruth's Chris post cautiously. This last visit last week it was absolutely great, the time before that a year ago it was not.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2355792]But have you ever tried Godiva soft Chocolate Ice Cream? HOLY MOTHER OF GOD! I have never tasted a richer, more decadent chocolate ice cream. The sugar/calorie content must be thru the roof, but it is the best tasting ice cream in the world, IMHO. LOL. Sadly or maybe fortunately, it is not sold in Godiva Chocolate stores in the USA as far as I know. So I have only found two Godiva Stores; one in Macau opposite the Grand Emperor Hotel and the other one in Jakarta in the Plaza Indonesia ground floor, that sell this ice cream. I don't usually go on and on about ice cream. I like it on somewhat rare occasions as much as the next guy or gal to satisfy a sugar craving, it's no big deal, but this Godiva stuff is truly something else and it is very addictive. Give it a taste next time you are in Plaza Indonesia and you will know what I mean. [/QUOTE]There is a Godiva store in China where I live, I haven't been into it but now I'll go and see if they have ice cream. Otherwise I'll be in Macau on Saturday so I'll give it a try.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2355792]Swensen's is pretty good and Cold Stone Creamery is another purveyor that is not too shabby. I like Cold Creamery's Chocolate Peanut Butter flavor. I had a scoop of it in Glorietta 3, Makati recently. Ha Ha. But have you ever tried Godiva soft Chocolate Ice Cream? HOLY MOTHER OF GOD! I have never tasted a richer, more decadent chocolate ice cream. The sugar/calorie content must be thru the roof, but it is the best tasting ice cream in the world, IMHO. LOL. Sadly or maybe fortunately, it is not sold in Godiva Chocolate stores in the USA as far as I know. So I have only found two Godiva Stores; one in Macau opposite the Grand Emperor Hotel and the other one in Jakarta in the Plaza Indonesia ground floor, that sell this ice cream. I don't usually go on and on about ice cream. I like it on somewhat rare occasions as much as the next guy or gal to satisfy a sugar craving, it's no big deal, but this Godiva stuff is truly something else and it is very addictive. Give it a taste next time you are in Plaza Indonesia and you will know what I mean.

P.S. I liked your recent report on Ruth Chris Steak House. I know a great one about 5 miles from my home in Florida, but not all Ruth Chris restaurants are good. That is why I took note of your recent post.[/QUOTE]There was a Godiva branch in Central world now moved to Central Chit Lom. May also be one in Paragon. No better scoop if you are a chocoholic. Not an ice cream treat but another excellent Belgium chocolate at The Duc De Praslin RSU Tower Soi 31.

As I see it, some interesting situations for the risk takers among us. Need an offshore account to execute.

Take 2.6 on the exchanges on a no deal Brexit in 2019 hedged with shorting the pound against the Swissie. On current December '19 contract pricing it should give a 10% return assuming a 5% move either way.

A little further out Trump is evens to get reelected and a position on the dollar against the yen assuming a similar 5% shift should yield similar returns.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2355236]I got an idea why don't we ET Smoothy yourself and myself meet for an evening get pissed and end up wrecking a go go when the disagreements on Trump get really out of hand, then shake hands and agree to do it all again the next night.[/QUOTE]Leave out the politics and you can count me in.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2355941]Leave out the politics and you can count me in.[/QUOTE]OK but can we still wreck the go go.

Just curious if any of you guys have flown Nok Airlines and if so did you hit on the infamous stewardesses and have any luck. I'm flying Nok DMK (Bangkok) to HKT (Phuket) next month for that expressed purpose. Nok Nok. Who's there?

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2355243]...

The following quote is from the Washington Post, not exactly a pro Trump news outfit; " President Obama is the only president since Herbert Hoover to not have guided the US economy to 3 percent growth in any year he was in office." That was Obama's new normal in a nutshell. The weakest economic recovery since WW 2.[/QUOTE]I must have missed this added comment earlier.

First of all, Obama was the first president challenged with recovering an economy that was the worst decline SINCE (R) Herbert Hoover's disastrous Great Depression contributions.

Second, Trump has not yet produced or presided over a better than 2.9% GDP growth year either and likely never will. Particularly since Trump's front loaded spending of $2 Trillion+ to buy one has already shot its wad and failed to do so. And it is doubtful any Congress will give him the go ahead to make that mistake again unless the spending looks a whole lot like a Dem infrastructure expenditure and nothing like another Repub Supply-Side/Trickle-Down waste of serious money.

Third, I love that oft repeated criticism of Obama's historic (and still somewhat ongoing) economic recovery. Especially from seemingly anti Dem, pro Repub folks. LOL. So HIS latest Dem economic recovery from the latest Great Repub Depression/Recession was not nearly as strong and fast as all the previous Dem economic recoveries from all the previous Great Repub Depressions/Recessions, huh?

Really? That's the big criticism of it considering this time and for the first time ever the Congressional Repubs vowed on Obama's first inauguration night in the midst of the Niagara Falls plunge in that latest Great Repub Depression/Recession to remain as unified as possible in blocking, thwarting and slow-walking his and the other Dems' every effort to pull the country out of it?

For shame, for shame. What is the consistent, historical, century-long pattern of Dem economic recoveries from Great Repub Depressions/Recessions coming to! Lol.

Yet he and the Dems still managed to produce another remarkable Dem economic recovery from another Great Repub Depression/Recession anyway. Damn, that really rankled the Congressional Repubs and Repubs in general, didn't it?

Btw, in another example of lazy Main Stream and financial media, I see those charts appear to credit those particular upticks to the November 2016 election result. But I see no mention that a 2.3% GDP growth rate for 2017 was already projected by the Congressional Budget Office months before that election and on the assumption that no new major economic law or legislation would be passed. Which is exactly what happened in 2017; no new major economic legislation was passed until the last week of the year and the U.S. economy was therefore still moving on the economic legislation that was in place prior to the election.

With Trump's magnificent presence in the White House? Oops. It looks like 2017 came in UNDER the CBO's already (made in early/mid 2016) projected 2.3% GDP growth rate for 2017 and came in at 2.2% instead. Another UNDER performance from the economy handed to him for Trump.

Let's face it, if anyone is complaining about the current US economy under the Trump admin, they are just anti Trump politically.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2356210]Let's face it, if anyone is complaining about the current US economy under the Trump admin, they are just anti Trump politically.[/QUOTE]Dude, look at the long / short term US bond yield curve. Just sayin'. However, this discussion doesn't belong in this thread.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2356210]Let's face it, if anyone is complaining about the current US economy under the Trump admin, they are just anti Trump politically.[/QUOTE]I'm not complaining about it in general. It just isn't as good on almost any important economic measure as the economy Obama produced, presided over and handed Trump on January 20, 2017. Or as good as any number of Dem administrations before him. So he ought to just take it and STFU about how all of their results were crap but his are "the greatest ever." When someone does that, they are de facto discouraging superior economic policy and stewardship in the future and encouraging crappy economic policy and stewardship instead. "Hey, let's do more of this dumb thing I did that cost and wasted a ton of money and under performed what came before! MAGA!" That is a problem that ought to be pointed out early and often.

I don't see a classic, patented Great Repub Depression/Recession on the near horizon. Yet. Although Trump is certainly doing his best to trigger one with his trade war and tariff taxes on the American consumer.

[QUOTE=JohnClayton;2356216]Dude, look at the long / short term US bond yield curve. Just sayin'. However, this discussion doesn't belong in this thread.[/QUOTE]Who said this discussion doesn't belong in this thread? I mean, unless Smoothy's post and yours were just now moved from another thread to this one, which I haven't seen was the case unless I missed it.

Admin moved these discussions to this thread. So I'm guessing they do belong here.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2356219]Who said this discussion doesn't belong in this thread? I mean, unless Smoothy's post and yours were just now moved from another thread to this one, which I haven't seen was the case unless I missed it.

Admin moved these discussions to this thread. So I'm guessing they do belong here.[/QUOTE]Are Smoothy and Eihtooms the same person? I have noticed Eihtooms is backwards Smoothie. Thank you in advance, and sincerely Notyalc Nhoj.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2356176]...

Btw, in another example of lazy Main Stream and financial media, I see those charts appear to credit those particular upticks to the November 2016 election result. But I see no mention that a 2.3% GDP growth rate for 2017 was already projected by the Congressional Budget Office months before that election and on the assumption that no new major economic law or legislation would be passed. Which is exactly what happened in 2017; no new major economic legislation was passed until the last week of the year and the U.S. economy was therefore still moving on the economic legislation that was in place prior to the election.

With Trump's magnificent presence in the White House? Oops. It looks like 2017 came in UNDER the CBO's already (made in early/mid 2016) projected 2.3% GDP growth rate for 2017 and came in at 2.2% instead. Another UNDER performance from the economy handed to him for Trump.[/QUOTE]I like to correct the numbers if my memory is off by much. So, for those who might not even know periodic non partisan Congressional Budget Office economic projections are "a thing", these are good sources to know about:

[B]An Update to the Budget and Economic Outlook: 2016 to 2026
August 23, 2016[/B]
[URL]https://www.cbo.gov/publication/51908[/URL]
[QUOTE]...
[b]Economic Growth[/b]
In real terms (that is, with adjustments to exclude the effects of inflation), GDP rose at an annual rate of 1.0 percent in the first half of calendar year 2016. However, CBO expects that the economy will expand more rapidly in the coming months, with GDP growing by 2.0 percent over the whole of 2016 and by 2.4 percent in 2017 mainly because the major forces restraining the growth of investment, such as a decline in oil prices, have begun to subside (see figure below). Economic growth is expected to slow in 2018 and fall below but remain close to the growth of potential (maximum sustainable) GDP in 2019 and 2020. Most of the growth in output during the coming years will be driven by consumers, businesses, and home builders, CBO anticipates.[/QUOTE]Mind you, these projections can only be done on the assumption that no new law or economic legislation is passed in the interim. Once a new, major economic law is passed, all projections change accordingly.

So, in August 2016, months before the November election, the projection was for a 2.4% Real Growth rate in GDP for 2017. Since Trump spent that entire first year doing nothing but playing golf, thinking up insulting nicknames for his critics, tweeting hateful, divisive directives to his slavish supporters and eating buckets of KFC at Midnight (similar to his second and third year so far), no new economic legislation was passed until the last week of 2017.

Actually, even though there is no chance in the world Trump knew these kinds of routine, periodic and largely accurate projections by the CBO were "a thing", I have no doubt that Moscow Mitch McConnell, the Repub Senate Majority Leader, knew all about them. Therefore, it was probably his idea to slow-walk and delay any economic legislation on the table to be passed by them until AFTER they locked in that projected 2.4% Growth rate for that first year of the Trump presidency that was already handed to them by Obama since it was quite likely to be higher and less costly than anything his Majority and Trump could produce anyway. And they could then take credit for it as far as low information voters were concerned.

Eventually, this was the actual Real GDP Growth rate for 2017:

[URL]https://www.google.com/search?q=Real[/URL]+GDP+growth+for+the+USA +economy+for+2017&oq=Real+GDP+growth+for+the+USA +economy+for+2017+&aqs=chrome. 69 i57.22429 j1 j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8.

[QUOTE]2.3% annual change (2017)[/QUOTE]I just wanted to correct my earlier memory of 2017's Real GDP Growth Rate coming in at 2.2% under Trump's nothingness that year vs the 2.3% that was projected by the CBO long before the election. The actual numbers were that it came in at 2.3% Real Growth vs the projected 2.4%. And I thought it might be useful for everyone here to know those kinds of projections exist.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2356217] It just isn't as good on almost any important economic measure [/QUOTE]Bullshit. My wallet is fatter due to Trump's tax plan. That's the most important to me economically. (and the stock market is still soaring, so what's to complain about these days? nothing)

I paid 3,000 usd less tax this past year under Trump's tax plan than I did with Obama's. That's 3 grand more I can spend. Bottom line.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2356258]Bullshit. My wallet is fatter due to Trump's tax plan. That's the most important to me economically. (and the stock market is still soaring, so what's to complain about these days? nothing)

I paid 3,000 usd less tax this past year under Trump's tax plan than I did with Obama's. That's 3 grand more I can spend. Bottom line.[/QUOTE]That would be the bottom line to most tax payers. 47%ers did not get a tax cut. I will agree that things are getting done, crass mouth and all.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2356258]Bullshit. My wallet is fatter due to Trump's tax plan. That's the most important to me economically. (and the stock market is still soaring, so what's to complain about these days? nothing)

I paid 3,000 usd less tax this past year under Trump's tax plan than I did with Obama's. That's 3 grand more I can spend. Bottom line.[/QUOTE]Anecdotal only. That is simply not reflected in the general economic data. The stock market is not "soaring". Unless by "soaring", you mean making smaller average percentage gains per year under Trump than Obama's average annual gains even if you apply the deep losses in the market he inherited from Bush.

A poorly trained chimp could have put an extra $3,000 in your income tax returns with a massive tax cut. Massive tax cuts are NOT the same as "economic results."

[QUOTE=Dg8787;2356265]That would be the bottom line to most tax payers. 47%ers did not get a tax cut. I will agree that things are getting done, crass mouth and all.[/QUOTE]The problem with anecdotal testimonials is I could say I paid about $900 less in taxes for last year than the year before, but my property values dropped about $60,000 as well. Then I ought to be on this thread shouting that Trump's economy has been a total disaster, an utter failure, run for your lives! But I know my case is merely anecdotal and not reflected in the general economy. Although I suspect there is a lot more of that kind of trade-off happening than Trump supporters are willing to admit.

See how the incomes of farmers have been doing in the Trump economy. He's cutting them welfare checks to make up for their deep losses thanks to his trade war. The "cash gift" from that tax bill was so minor and went so unnoticed across the country, Trump in a panic suddenly announced a non-existent "Middle Class Tax Cut!" would be enacted in the two weeks before the 2018 mid-term elections in hopes of reducing the thumpin' he and his party got. Which of course never happened since Congress wasn't even in session anymore at that point in time. That "Middle Class Tax Cut!" still hasn't happened AFTER those mid-term elections either. lol.

A "soaring" stock market? The USA Stock market as measured by the S&P 500 Index is up only 27% since Trump took office. Divided by 2.6 years, that produces an annualized return of 10.38%, no more than the average annual return the USA Stock market has produced since that measure started being taken back in 1926. And it is notably less than the 22.75% per year average annual gain logged in under Obama from the day he took office until Trump took over. And, yep, that is even when you apply those deep losses in the market for the first couple of months to him and not to Bush. Which isn't even fair to Obama's economic record.

I'd happily trade my $900 reduction in taxes and anybody else's $3000 reduction in taxes for an annual average 22.75% increase in my stock portfolio over the past couple of years instead of a measly 10.38%. Trust me, that's worth a LOT more to me than $3,000 or even many times that amount. Not even counting the property value losses.

For anybody interested, my experience Thursday last getting extension of temporary stay based on retirement at Chang Wattana.

Background. I have lived in the same apartment I purchased some 20 years back. For a period I wasn't here all year round and got by on extensions, visa runs and broker's services. When I hit 50 I got a retirement visa extending it yearly since.

For the first time ever today the TM 30 was required. Even as an owner it's required. Anticipating the possibility had all the docs with me, title and accompanying paperwork. Got the TM 30 but paid 800 baht fine because I hadn't filed it within 24 of moving in all those 20 years ago. I kid you not. Judging by the number of 800 bahts they were raking in its a huge huge earner.

My advice. Make sure you have a copy of notification of filing TM 30 from the owner if you are renting. If it's your pad and you haven't filed bring the docs and you can file on the spot. Counter G. Extremely busy. Bring a book or whatever gets you through boredom.

Speed of service, all told 6 hours including reentry permit. 10 30 to 4 30 with a lunch break from 12 to 1.

[QUOTE=Smoothy;2356258]Bullshit. My wallet is fatter due to Trump's tax plan. That's the most important to me economically. (and the stock market is still soaring, so what's to complain about these days? nothing)

I paid 3,000 usd less tax this past year under Trump's tax plan than I did with Obama's. That's 3 grand more I can spend. Bottom line.[/QUOTE]Smoothy old chap a 3000 cut means you were already doing more than ok not necessarily in the top 1% but definitely not short of coin to meet your needs.

The problem with the tax cut as has been explained ad nauseam was it had minimal effect on the majority of Americans as most of it was directed at corporations and the top 20% of taxpayers who were already doing just fine under loopholes such as the earned interest tax credit.

Supply side economics argues tax cuts more than pay for themselves. Lots of economists question this theory. It's complicated and depends on how the cuts are distributed but what is not in doubt is that the Trump cuts after a initial sugar high have done little for demand (other than Smoothy spending all of his 3 K) but has had a negative impact on Debt to GDP which is heading towards 110%.

I don't hate anybody but denigrating people as Trump haters as if this is somehow a mental abnormality always amuses me. Of course there are people who hate Trump and what he stands for. They value compassion, honesty, tolerance and inclusiveness. To be honest for me it's the Trump lovers who need to examine their values.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2356219]
Admin moved these discussions to this thread. So I'm guessing they do belong here.[/QUOTE]Trump and tax are very uninteresting to non Americans like me I guess. However yeh these posts have to go somewhere, for us to skip reading them.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2356432]Trump and tax are very uninteresting to non Americans like me I guess. However yeh these posts have to go somewhere, for us to skip reading them.[/QUOTE]You and anyone else who finds those topics very uninteresting and skip reading them can also skip commenting on them. Really. We won't miss it.

As the attached chart clearly shows, Obama's economic recovery was the weakest in the last 75 years or longer. One of the things I really dislike about Obama is that by 2010 HE KNEW HIS ECONOMIC POLICIES WERE NOT WORKING ie the recovery was not as robust as it should have been/could have been and instead of listening to his honest critics that he should lighten up on his government economic restrictions (executive orders) and lower the cost of investment in the private sector, Obama doubled down on his neo Keynesian policies and he began to play the race card in order to stay in office. IMHO he is a very bad man although I admit that he is also a very shrewd master politician. The fanatical left wing group think insanity that we see among all the Democratic politicians running for President in America today owe a lot to President Obama's successful tactic of divide and conquer along racial & ethnic lines, although none of them measure up to his political abilities.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2356487]As the attached chart clearly shows, Obama's economic recovery was the weakest in the last 75 years or longer. One of the things I really dislike about Obama is that by 2010 HE KNEW HIS ECONOMIC POLICIES WERE NOT WORKING ie the recovery was not as robust as it should have been/could have been and instead of listening to his honest critics that he should lighten up on his government economic restrictions (executive orders) and lower the cost of investment in the private sector, Obama doubled down on his neo Keynesian policies and he began to play the race card in order to stay in office. IMHO he is a very bad man although I admit that he is also a very shrewd master politician. The fanatical left wing group think insanity that we see among all the Democratic politicians running for President in America today owe a lot to President Obama's successful tactic of divide and conquer along racial & ethnic lines, although none of them measure up to his political abilities.[/QUOTE]You forget that most of the time Obama was dealing with a Republican Congress that basically opposed him on every economic measure he wanted to take. Trump handed out a huge tax break for the rich and it lasted a whole 12 months. Now growth is back to 2% with many indicators pointing to recession. No rational person would think that you should be expanding deficits when employment is high and you are getting sustained growth. This is a guy who sent 6 companies to bankruptcy, defrauded thousands of contractors and consumers and only stayed solvent through tax evasion and money laundering. Trump is toxic, just look at the Staff turnover and what they say about him.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2356487]As the attached chart clearly shows, Obama's economic recovery was the weakest in the last 75 years or longer. One of the things I really dislike about Obama is that by 2010 HE KNEW HIS ECONOMIC POLICIES WERE NOT WORKING ie the recovery was not as robust as it should have been/could have been and instead of listening to his honest critics that he should lighten up on his government economic restrictions (executive orders) and lower the cost of investment in the private sector, Obama doubled down on his neo Keynesian policies and he began to play the race card in order to stay in office. IMHO he is a very bad man although I admit that he is also a very shrewd master politician. The fanatical left wing group think insanity that we see among all the Democratic politicians running for President in America today owe a lot to President Obama's successful tactic of divide and conquer along racial & ethnic lines, although none of them measure up to his political abilities.[/QUOTE]Surely you are not suggesting that the only spectacular recovery from the three Great Republican Depressions/Recessions cited on that chart (1933,1982 and 2009), the one stewarded by FDR and his overwhelmingly Dem Majority House and Senate beginning in 1933 (the other two are not even significantly different from each other by comparison), should have been the model Obama followed for his recovery from a Great Republican Depression/Recession.

Good lord. FDR was gifted by the 1932 electorate with a huge Dem Majority in the House and at one point as many as 75 actual Dems in the Senate out of a possible 96 Senate seats beginning in 1933. That was a total turnaround in Party control after 10 years of across the board Republican rule in the federal government bent on driving us into that colossal Depression.

And at that time they had been using the same "brilliant" Republican economic philosophy and agenda they applied in 1981-1982 and 2001-2008, requiring those historic Dem recoveries as well. Oh, and the same ones Trump and his fellow Republicans are applying to the economy right now, BTW.

Obama never had a single hour of a single day as president with 60 real Dems in the Senate, the minimum Senate votes required to produce a cloture vote to even put a proposal and bill on the table for consideration. That being the case and considering the Repubs had decided there was something "different" about this particular middle aged Christian male in the White House (gee, I wonder what that could have been?) that gave them licence with their base to block, thwart and slow-walk his and the Dems every effort to pull us out of it, Obama's recovery from that particular Great Repub Depression/Recession was more impressive than FDR's.

After all, in addition to his massive advantage in having that overwhelming Dem Majority Congress, especially in the Senate, FDR didn't come into office on day one to tackle and recover us from that Great Repub Depression while we were also waging 3 poorly managed quagmire wars in Afghanistan, Iraq and against something amorphous and potentially worldwide by the name of "terror".

Over 15 trillion in negative yielding bonds, an inverted yield curve and record low thirty years. It has to signify something.

Even Trump is getting the wind up and backing down on the scale of tariffs on Chinese imports under the laughable guise of not wanting to be the grinch that spoiled Christmas.

What's all this got to with the price of a shag? Nothing I guess but who knows.

My gut tells me while those at the high end are still doing fine it's getting tougher for most girls to make a living.

A recent visit to Cowboy makes me feel business is way down.

As we know the normal supply and demand principle affecting price doesn't necessarily follow in Thailand's P4P.

Quite the opposite.

Fewer punters, no problem, increase margins by jacking up the prices.

Well maybe not going to work this time.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2358535]Over 15 trillion in negative yielding bonds, an inverted yield curve and record low thirty years. It has to signify something.

Even Trump is getting the wind up and backing down on the scale of tariffs on Chinese imports under the laughable guise of not wanting to be the grinch that spoiled Christmas.
...[/QUOTE]Explaining his cave on initiating those tariffs, in the course of one minute he suggested he did not want to make it tough for American consumers during the Christmas season AND repeated a favorite lie about how great it is that the $60 Billion added to America's coffers from the tariff taxes so far was put there by China and not the American consumer.

Huh?

B-B-But if China is the one paying the tariff taxes instead of American consumers, wouldn't it be a wonderful Christmas gift FOR Americans to initiate those tariffs ASAP? Hey, I'd be happy with another $60 Billion added to America's coffers by China. Why not? Unless, oh no, it turns out that isn't how it would get there after all.

Either he hasn't got a clue what he is talking about or he is certain his supporters would never have a clue what he is talking about. Or both.

Check out the new book, "Koch Land" by Christopher Leonard. Koch's are not fans of Fat Nixon, mostly on ideological grounds. Still, they are getting over 90% of their economic just desserts.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2358608]Either he hasn't got a clue what he is talking about or he is certain his supporters would never have a clue what he is talking about. Or both.[/QUOTE]The Donald is smart enough to know using the red meat of fearing immigrants to rally his base is not going to be enough to get him reelected. He is smart enough to know it requires a continuation of the good economy he inherited to get him another 4 years. Mnuchin and Kudlow have most likely told him there are storm clouds on the horizon. Because he notoriously hates getting bad news I can picture a scene when as soon as they mentioned this to him they ran out of the room. So he is already preparing to find a boogey man to blame for the negative consequences of his trade wars in the form of Fed chair Powell. It's a standard sometimes successful play, take credit for everything good but find somebody to point the finger at when it goes belly up. Problem this time round is anybody with half a brain knows what's really happening and who is to blame. Watch for some wacky moves in the months ahead if the economy starts to slow.

Have any of you wealthier mongers bought your girlfriend a silicone enhancement? I have a GF in PI with #36 C that might be interested in upgraded bolt-ons. Details appreciated.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2358749]... So he is already preparing to find a boogey man to blame for the negative consequences of his trade wars in the form of Fed chair Powell. It's a standard sometimes successful play, take credit for everything good but find somebody to point the finger at when it goes belly up. Problem this time round is anybody with half a brain knows what's really happening and who is to blame. Watch for some wacky moves in the months ahead if the economy starts to slow.[/QUOTE]About five years before he became president, Trump took out hundreds of millions of dollars in variable rate loans from the only bank on Earth that would lend him a penny due to his many business failures and deadbeat history of not paying back loans, Deutsche Bank. That means when Powell raises the Fed Funds Rate, his loan liability goes up and he has to pay millions more but when Powell lowers the rate his loan liability goes down and he saves millions. Where America has put itself in a real bind with Trump in this regard is the Fed (Powell) raises rates when the economy is doing well and lowers them when the economy is behaving poorly and needs a boost.

Powell is Trump's enemy whenever he appears to be ready to raise the Fed Funds Rate a tad. And he is apt to do that if or when the USA economy looks like it is steadily improving.

Connecting the dots here isn't exactly rocket science. Well, maybe it is to Trump supporters.

The challenge Trump faces every day is what kind of counterproductive legislation proposal, idiotic trade war move, ignorant tariff assertion or whimsical silly statement can he make this hour of this day that could drive down the USA economy, cause Powell to lower the Fed Funds Rate and thereby save him millions of dollars on those huge loans of he took out a few years back.

How his doing that might effect his chances of re-election is somewhat irrelevant. He has never been interested in expanding his support beyond his base and his base is not going anywhere. They have apparently begun to love out of control skyrocketing deficits and taken a genuine liking to underperformance vs Obama on virtually every important economic and policy metric they used to enjoy slamming Obama over; jobs creation, stock market gains, housing value gains, manufacturing sector expansion, trade and corporate profits, border control, foreign relations, national security, etc.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2364699]About five years before he became president, Trump took out hundreds of millions of dollars in variable rate loans .[/QUOTE]I hadn't known interest on his loans were variable, usually for developers it's fixed. It does cast a new light though on why he accuses Powell who incidentally he appointed to the Fed as the enemy of the country.

One thing I am in no doubt of he is still running Trump Incorporated as dumb and dumber couldn't organize an orgy in Nana.

It's almost impossible to imagine Americans would want 4 more years of a narcissistic deranged demigod but the odds on him being reelected are actually 50/50.

This is mostly down I believe to the continuation of the good economy he inherited and his heightening fear and loathing of immigrants and minorities among most of his base (Smoothy being an exception) that gives them an excuse for their sad unhappy lives. .

It's also a reflection of the lack of a Democrat who broad popular appeal.

Joe will get eaten alive in the debates and Warren will be handicapped by the cost of her Medicare for all. Bernie is a one trick millionaires and billionaires pony and Harris doesn't seem to be able to gain traction after her lackluster performance during the last debate.

November 3rd '20 will be a defining moment in showing the world what the US stands for.

More divisive American political claptrap in the Thai Lounge that has nothing to do with Thailand or girls. Why does the ISG allow this? After being a member since 2008, I am strongly considering dropping this web site. All I read here is negative shit about Thailand being too expensive from guys who can't afford it anymore, bull shit about Thai girls (PI girls too) not being any good anymore, and the political hate Trump crap. I used to enjoy reading this web site in the morning knowing it would have interesting and informative posts. Obviously the ISG is not what it used to be ie an informative web site dedicated to the world wide pursuit of girls. Nowadays I rarely find anything worth reading here. And that really is too bad.

P.S. I know I am not the only one who feels this way.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2364943]More divisive American political claptrap in the Thai Lounge that has nothing to do with Thailand or girls. Why does the ISG allow this? After being a member since 2008, I am strongly considering dropping this web site. All I read here is negative shit about Thailand being too expensive from guys who can't afford it anymore, bull shit about Thai girls (PI girls too) not being any good anymore, and the political hate Trump crap. I used to enjoy reading this web site in the morning knowing it would have interesting and informative posts. Obviously the ISG is not what it used to be ie an informative web site dedicated to the world wide pursuit of girls. Nowadays I rarely find anything worth reading here. And that really is too bad.

P.S. I know I am not the only one who feels this way.[/QUOTE]Strongly agree with you Natty. Especially about the USA Election. Many posters here are not American and don't care about it. The vitriol from both the Trumpers and socialistas is completely out of hand. I'm hoping these forums will be an escape from that stuff.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2364805]...

Joe will get eaten alive in the debates and Warren will be handicapped by the cost of her Medicare for all. Bernie is a one trick millionaires and billionaires pony and Harris doesn't seem to be able to gain traction after her lackluster performance during the last debate.

November 3rd '20 will be a defining moment in showing the world what the US stands for.[/QUOTE]Why would you say Biden will get eaten alive in the debates? Against Trump? According to the polls conducted by Gallup, Fox, NBC, CNN, Politico, YouGov and Public Policy Polling, Trump didn't win any of his debates against Hillary Clinton by anywhere from a 5 to 40-point margin. It's just that debates don't matter all that much.

BTW, some of you Thai punters might start caring and paying attention to these things. Not only does Trump's trade war and "horse in a hospital" approach to global economics threaten many more countries than just the USA, several manufacturers are looking at Thailand as an alternative location for their factories should the Trumped up situation with China become too complicated. And if you don't think that will negatively effect the lifespan of go-go bars and brothels as we have known them for the past several decades, then you don't know how some of these international conglomerates like to perform their "civic responsibility" to close down as many of those as possible in order to give young girls fewer options than to work in their sweatshops 16 hours a day, 7 days a week.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2364943]More divisive American political claptrap in the Thai Lounge that has nothing to do with Thailand or girls. Why does the ISG allow this? After being a member since 2008, I am strongly considering dropping this web site. All I read here is negative shit about Thailand being too expensive from guys who can't afford it anymore, bull shit about Thai girls (PI girls too) not being any good anymore, and the political hate Trump crap. I used to enjoy reading this web site in the morning knowing it would have interesting and informative posts. Obviously the ISG is not what it used to be ie an informative web site dedicated to the world wide pursuit of girls. Nowadays I rarely find anything worth reading here. And that really is too bad.

P.S. I know I am not the only one who feels this way.[/QUOTE]I totally agree. Add long-winded boring posts about people's personal taste in girls, and the way it was 20 years ago and how Nat was better than Nit. There is very little information to help newbies anymore and that's sad. And then when you add all the snide comments about President Trump, it's ridiculous. Especially when 90% of the stuff is based on press reports which are totally worthless. And top it off when you make a factual report, you got all sorts of experts questioning it, probably guys that don't even live here or haven't been here in 10 years.

But to follow up on your post, I personally think that any political discussions should be banned. It's just an excuse for some Euros to bash the US anyway.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2365008]Why would you say Biden will get eaten alive in the debates? Against Trump? According to the polls conducted by Gallup, Fox, NBC, CNN, Politico, YouGov and Public Policy Polling, Trump didn't win any of his debates against Hillary Clinton by anywhere from a 5 to 40-point margin. It's just that debates don't matter all that much.

BTW, some of you Thai punters might start caring and paying attention to these things. Not only does Trump's trade war and "horse in a hospital" approach to global economics threaten many more countries than just the USA, several manufacturers are looking at Thailand as an alternative location for their factories should the Trumped up situation with China become too complicated. And if you don't think that will negatively effect the lifespan of go-go bars and brothels as we have known them for the past several decades, then you don't know how some of these international conglomerates like to perform their "civic responsibility" to close down as many of those as possible in order to give young girls fewer options than to work in their sweatshops 16 hours a day, 7 days a week.[/QUOTE]Looks like our conversation has touched a nerve with some folk who are happy to chat about all sorts of non P4P [blue][Deleted by Admin][/blue]. My advice to these sensitive souls, take a deep breath try to calm down or simply use the ignore button.

OK, do the debates matter? Its complicated but I feel they do. Question is to what extent. Agreed Trump lost the debates on nationwide polling but don't forget he also lost the popular vote by 3 million. But where it mattered in states such as Florida Pennsylvania Michigan and Ohio where he won by small margins I feel that what he represented during the debates and his overarching message of demonizing immigrants got him elected. On a historical note it is now commonly accepted Nixon lost to Kennedy because of the sweating 5 o'clock shadow visual he portrayed on TV.

Your other point on Trump's trade war affecting the P4P scene in Thailand, that's a stretch ET.

[QUOTE=Nyezhov;2365023]... And then when you add all the snide comments about President Trump, it's ridiculous. Especially when 90% of the stuff is based on press reports which are totally worthless. And top it off when you make a factual report, you got all sorts of experts questioning it, probably guys that don't even live here or haven't been here in 10 years.
...[/QUOTE]Just to make sure nobody thinks my assertions land among your estimated "90%", I will post this link:

[B]'Refugees' of Trump's trade war are scrambling to move business to Vietnam and Thailand as China tariffs hit hard[/B]
[URL]https://www.businessinsider.com/r-supply-chain-reaction-trade-war-refugees-race-to-relocate-to-vietnam-thailand-2018-11[/URL]
[quote]-Companies are moving supply networks and production from China to other Far East nations as a direct result of President Trump's trade war.

-Industry experts say the movement is the biggest shift in cross-border supply chains since China joined the World Trade Organisation in 2001.

-The scramble is driven by the risk of more, and higher, U.S. tariffs on China, and fears that nearby emerging economies can only accommodate new businesses on a "first come, first served" basis.

...In Thailand, SVI Pcl , which provides electronics and manufacturing solutions, said it has just selected four new deals worth about $100 million with existing customers who have operations in China.

"The trade war is good for us," CEO Pongsak Lothongkam said. "We have been approached by so many companies that we have to prioritize."
[/quote]

I would not consider Business Insider to be a worthless press outfit.

If Trump "wins" his trade war with China this way, I don't know of a scenario where a dozen more mega factories popping up in Isaan increases the number of hot, young Thai girls coming to Bangkok or Pattaya to work in go-go bars, massage shops, soapies, in a club, on the street or to share a lower Sukhumvit area room with 2 others and work the dating site FL scene.

Even if the factories hire their dads, brothers, boyfriends or husbands and not them, the girls will have a very good reason not to move away from their families or babies to make a living the old fashioned way most of us visit or live in Thailand to patronize.

This is more of a "Thai P4P" topic than some of you guys realize. It might be the most important P4P-related topic on any Thai thread. It certainly qualifies as local Thai politics and business as it affects the P4P scene.

Where did you guys think those factories would go when they left China? Nebraska, Australia, U.K., Germany, France, Norway? Nope.

[URL]https://www.nytimes.com/2019/08/30/opinion/trump-china-trade-war.html?action=click&module=Opinion&pgtype=Homepage[/URL]

Tropical Cyclones Podun and Katiji followed in quick succession last few days and caused significant flooding of low lying farm lands, and river overflows. Roads damaged in several provinces.

Sukothai in the north, through to Nakhorn Panom in the East (home of many Tulip girls), through to Ubon in the NE.

Tulip girls best be working in Bangkok, rather than having water problems back on the farm.

I have had to wade through flood waters myself, fortunately below crotch level. Floods went down almost a foot today, where I passed, but waters could be coming from more northern provinces in following days. The flood gates get opened as they say.

Now a big cyclone LingLing heads towards Korea.

Thailand rains should be more moderate the next few days.

The following weather link is good for Thai speakers (only):

[URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hkJKB8YaVg[/URL]

"There could be more upward pressure if firms relocate production to Thailand to skirt US tariffs on China-made products, according to Fukaya."

[b]Surging Thai Baht Shatters Expat Dreams of Easy Retirement.[/b]
[URL]https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-10-03/thailand-s-surging-baht-shatters-expat-dreams-of-easy-retirement[/URL]

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2378176]"There could be more upward pressure if firms relocate production to Thailand to skirt US tariffs on China-made products, according to Fukaya."

[b]Surging Thai Baht Shatters Expat Dreams of Easy Retirement.[/b]
[URL]https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-10-03/thailand-s-surging-baht-shatters-expat-dreams-of-easy-retirement[/URL][/QUOTE]I think the cost of living has risen dramatically in Bangkok in the last year or two. Food ordered by roadside cart could be almost double the price I used to pay, although price is location dependent too. Japanese frequented area is extra expensive.

Hotel prices are unexpectedly high at times.

Exchange rates have deteriorated badly for some countries. Obviously the super exchange rates during the crash were not going to last, but is getting ridiculous now nearly back to early 90's levels.

Bargirls too. Even MP prices on the move in some shops.

I suppose the monger wants economy in Thailand to be very weak in order to get a better exchange rate.

Relocating Chinese production is moving to countries where labor is cheap. It was already happening before the tariffs. Most of it goes to Vietnam Cambodia Bangladesh and other countries with lower labor costs than Thailand. It follows that those that do come here will most likely pay no more than the 300 Baht minimum wage. Thai girls who decide to enter the P4P business already have the opportunity to work in factories in construction, in retail, in hospitality and other segments of the economy. There is actually a shortage of Thai people available or willing to fill these positions as evidenced by the millions of Cambodians Laotians and Burmese working here. I don't see how the limited number of Chinese factories moving here will change that mindset. I agree yes the principal reason girls enter the P4P business is money. What I don't agree it is because they cannot find work in a Chinese factory.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2378232]I think the cost of living has risen dramatically in Bangkok in the last year or two. Food ordered by roadside cart could be almost double the price I used to pay, although price is location dependent too. Japanese frequented area is extra expensive.[/QUOTE]Well if you are in the Tourist Ghetto or Pattaya prices may have risen (and I would dispute that cart prices are up, but I don't eat the disgusting street food in Nana anyway), but everywhere outside prices have remained the same for almost the past 5 years.

Thermae just raised their prices by 10 baht though. That's 30 cents to you Americans. That means if you pound down 20 drinks at thermae you paid an extra $6. I'm sure that some folks who post here are squealing about it.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2378237]Relocating Chinese production is moving to countries where labor is cheap. It was already happening before the tariffs. Most of it goes to Vietnam Cambodia Bangladesh and other countries with lower labor costs than Thailand. It follows that those that do come here will most likely pay no more than the 300 Baht minimum wage. Thai girls who decide to enter the P4P business already have the opportunity to work in factories in construction, in retail, in hospitality and other segments of the economy. There is actually a shortage of Thai people available or willing to fill these positions as evidenced by the millions of Cambodians Laotians and Burmese working here. I don't see how the limited number of Chinese factories moving here will change that mindset. I agree yes the principal reason girls enter the P4P business is money. What I don't agree it is because they cannot find work in a Chinese factory.[/QUOTE]The ripple effect from more industry choosing Thailand over China due to the trade war as stated in the article does not only move between the factory and the girls. Brothers, sisters, dads, mothers, boyfriends, husbands and baby daddies also have more jobs and alternate income opportunities. Businesses near the factories fare better and expand. New business opportunities arise in those areas. Thai men who do well in those areas can add 2 more mia nois and gfs to their rounds and those girls will not have to even see much less suck a farang dick until they are well past their Sell By date.

There really is no scenario where more industry choosing Thailand in order to avoid potential trade war hassle in China improves the chances of an 18 year old Thai hottie in the factory areas leaving her friends, family and baby, hopping on a bus to go to Bkk or Pattaya or anywhere else in the country and wade through the increasing number of ethnic undesirables (to Thais) in order to fuck and suck foreigners for money. Or to even leave that option uneffected negatively.

Yes, factories were moving into Thailand before the USA-China trade war. And I think we have seen the choices diminish, service levels decline and prices rise for getting less right along. So now the USA-China trade war has motivated MORE international conglomerates to look at, consider and decide to move to Thailand sooner and faster. Not just for now but in order to avoid future potential USA-China antagonism.

Elections have consequences. And, very often, not just for the people in the country where those elections take place.

[QUOTE=Nyezhov;2378356]Well if you are in the Tourist Ghetto or Pattaya prices may have risen (and I would dispute that cart prices are up, but I don't eat the disgusting street food in Nana anyway), but everywhere outside prices have remained the same for almost the past 5 years.

Thermae just raised their prices by 10 baht though. That's 30 cents to you Americans. That means if you pound down 20 drinks at thermae you paid an extra $6. I'm sure that some folks who post here are squealing about it.[/QUOTE]Nana and Thermae were not mentioned. One does not go to Thermae to eat. I don't get cart food in Nana for various reasons. The hamburger stand went to really poor quality several years ago. Grilled chicken is pricey. Can't say if most stuff is disgusting there since have not been eating it.

The cost of grilled chicken and deep fried chicken has risen a lot, even carts selling fruit seem pricey. Could be the Sukhumvit tourist area has much higher prices as vendors may pay a lot for their spot on a touristy street. I can still buy some veg at the Supermarket in the province cheaply. 3 large carrots cost me just under 8 Baht. Wow! Raw chicken pieces were about 67 Baht per Kilo. I cooked it myself.

Its a terrible exchange rate hurting me most these days.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2364943]More divisive American political claptrap in the Thai Lounge that has nothing to do with Thailand or girls. Why does the ISG allow this? After being a member since 2008, I am strongly considering dropping this web site. All I read here is negative shit about Thailand being too expensive from guys who can't afford it anymore, bull shit about Thai girls (PI girls too) not being any good anymore, and the political hate Trump crap. I used to enjoy reading this web site in the morning knowing it would have interesting and informative posts. Obviously the ISG is not what it used to be ie an informative web site dedicated to the world wide pursuit of girls. Nowadays I rarely find anything worth reading here. And that really is too bad.

P.S. I know I am not the only one who feels this way.[/QUOTE]Yes, I feel this way, too, Natty, but won't drop ISG because there is still good intel sometimes on other threads. Let me acknowledge the fine posts of Syz, Goferring, Wicked Roger, Red Kilt (don't see too much any more), Smoothy and of course, you.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2378232]...
I suppose the monger wants economy in Thailand to be very weak in order to get a better exchange rate.[/QUOTE]Truth be told, that is the basis for all or most P4P customer advantages anywhere in the world, not just Thailand. It won't happen if we only count on lazy girls who don't want to work 8 am-8 pm 6 days a week to show up at the venues or on the street.

Yes, there will be some who fit that profile. But it requires a depressed economy for whole families in order to get armies of young, good looking girls showing up to give high level sex services to strangers every night. Witness the economic conditions that existed during the oft mentioned heydays of great Thai P4P in the late 1990's and early 2000's.

Still, on the issue of an expat's ability to retire and live in Thailand, unrelated to the issue of more highly motivated P4P girls showing up for the job, I would say Thailand is still a much better deal than living in retirement in the USA. Including in Bangkok.

I can't speak for other countries. But if you can meet the 65,000 THB per month income requirement or similar annual deposit kept in a Thai bank, you should be able to rent a better than average Western-suitable apartment in the most popular expat areas of the city, eat whatever you want every day, get out and around on public transportation, enjoy high speed internet at home and on the go and even afford decent catastrophic health care coverage. And you can pick up the meal tab and more for a girlfriend or two much of the time as well.

Here is what was said about a retiree from the U. K. at the start of that linked article:

"The former aircraft technician easily bought a townhouse, pickup truck and motorcycle when he arrived at the age of 55 two decades ago. Back then the pound bought about 60 baht, but now it fetches a little less than 38 baht."

He was foolish to have counted on the exchange rate and economic conditions to remain the same as they were during one of the worst downturns in modern Thai history. And it appears he is trying to duplicate all the amenities and toys of a gainfully employed man in his home country.

In my case, two of the biggest cost saving advantages to retirement in Bangkok vs staying in the USA was that I can rent a decent place for very little money (and while the property I own in the USA is generating rental income in USD) and have no need to own a car with all the attendent purchase, insurance, fuel and maintenance costs.

Those two factors alone offset at least $1,500-$2,000USD in retirement costs per month compared to staying in the USA.

[QUOTE=DCups;2378718]Yes, I feel this way, too, Natty, but won't drop ISG because there is still good intel sometimes on other threads. Let me acknowledge the fine posts of Syz, Goferring, Wicked Roger, Red Kilt (don't see too much any more), Smoothy and of course, you.[/QUOTE]Which part of this current discussion about the inevitable detrimental effects of a USA-China trade war on Thai mongering has "nothing to do with Thailand or girls"? It has a great deal to do with both.

There might have been a mildly interesting carrot dangling in front of some companies thinking about moving out of China to set up factories in Thailand and thereby improve its economy before. Or to choose Thailand over China in the first place. But this current politically motivated tariff and trade war declared by the USA added a big paddle on the butts of companies to do it sooner, faster and in greater numbers.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2378653]Nana and Thermae were not mentioned. One does not go to Thermae to eat. I don't get cart food in Nana for various reasons. The hamburger stand went to really poor quality several years ago. Grilled chicken is pricey. Can't say if most stuff is disgusting there since have not been eating it.

The cost of grilled chicken and deep fried chicken has risen a lot, even carts selling fruit seem pricey. Could be the Sukhumvit tourist area has much higher prices as vendors may pay a lot for their spot on a touristy street. I can still buy some veg at the Supermarket in the province cheaply. 3 large carrots cost me just under 8 Baht. Wow! Raw chicken pieces were about 67 Baht per Kilo. I cooked it myself.

Its a terrible exchange rate hurting me most these days.[/QUOTE]The price of carrots wasn't mentioned. And if you leave the farang ghetto once in a while, prices are the same. And I wasn't talking about the food in termae, I was mentioning the fact that you're drinking there went up to 10 baht. Is that why you don't like the place?

The exchange rate doesn't hurt me. In fact, if it was 10 b to the buck, it wouldn't matter in the slightest.

The food has always been decent and cheap in thermae by the way.

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2378770]Which part of this current discussion about the inevitable detrimental effects of a USA-China trade war on Thai mongering has "nothing to do with Thailand or girls"? It has a great deal to do with both.

There might have been a mildly interesting carrot dangling in front of some companies thinking about moving out of China to set up factories in Thailand and thereby improve its economy before. Or to choose Thailand over China in the first place. But this current politically motivated tariff and trade war declared by the USA added a big paddle on the butts of companies to do it sooner, faster and in greater numbers.[/QUOTE]In a scenario where a country girl has absolutely no job opportunities close to her town or village she is more likely to join her friends in the city and start a career in P4P. This situation exists more in Laos Myanmar Cambodia and Vietnam but in my opinion less so in Thailand. Here it is the relatively higher earnings from working at the go go that is the primary reason she works there.

As to her family members having jobs from Chinese relocated businesses this will only happen if the new factories are situated close to where they live. Its possible incentives will lure then to Essan but supply chain and logistic infrastructure will be more important making the EEC more suitable.

I would agree increased job opportunities influences the number of working girls available, the question becomes by how much. There are other factors at play. Increasing numbers of girls working abroad, more girls not lured by the easy money wanting instead to get a degree and pursue a career and quite possibly more girls better understanding that selling sex is maybe not such a smart choice to make.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2379024]In a scenario where a country girl has absolutely no job opportunities close to her town or village she is more likely to join her friends in the city and start a career in P4P. This situation exists more in Laos Myanmar Cambodia and Vietnam but in my opinion less so in Thailand. Here it is the relatively higher earnings from working at the go go that is the primary reason she works there.
[/QUOTE]Lets assume a girl has weak education. Parents could not afford to school a girl when she would probably become a housewife mother.

Thai girls can sell vegies, pineapples or durians in the province for extreme low money. They can go to Bangkok and work a factory, food stall, waitress, paint fingernails, or become a hooker. If they have to get enough money to support poor parents, sisters, and try to have the child get a decent education (unlike the mother), then the low level jobs are not going to pay enough. Many are single mothers. No husband to help out. If she is at all good looking, hooking becomes an option, even if part time. Could hope to hook a sponsor.

I know a young Lao girl like this, pretty and would love me to be her old sugar daddy, but I have a Mrs already. Her financial struggles are severe. She needs an operation but can't afford it (at least so I heard). Probably 100 K baht or more. Hard for her to hook a good guy when she has no English. Her brother is stuck in prison with medical problems, from dealing drugs most likely (she does not know or tell. But guys don't have the hooking option). Meanwhile the levels of customers in the MPs and bars, etc. Are quite low. I heard from more than one MP girl, can go several days with no customer. Same for bar girls not getting a customer every day, especially those with poor English.

If the girl had English, she could probably do very well standing on Soi 4 because hers looks are superior. Probably needs to use smart phone to translate messages similar to what the deaf girls do.

I just give example of girl whose health is not the best and education very poor, and her work options to make money to save for operation are quite limited. Also she is just not used to working really hard. Tires easily.

She tried learning fingernail care (but I don't see that as having much earning potential). She tried being a waitress but was too demanding based on the physical health. I advised to try to learn English quickly and hook a rich Farang sponsor. Can't see any other way out for her future. She is a really nice enthusiastic fuck and good looking. That is one plus. Her circumstances are extremely shitty.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2379268]Lets assume a girl has weak education. Parents could not afford to school a girl when she would probably become a housewife mother.

Thai girls can sell vegies, pineapples or durians in the province for extreme low money. They can go to Bangkok and work a factory, food stall, waitress, paint fingernails, or become a hooker. If they have to get enough money to support poor parents, sisters, and try to have the child get a decent education (unlike the mother), then the low level jobs are not going to pay enough. Many are single mothers. No husband to help out. If she is at all good looking, hooking becomes an option, even if part time. Could hope to hook a sponsor.

I know a young Lao girl like this, pretty and would love me to be her old sugar daddy, but I have a Mrs already. Her financial struggles are severe. She needs an operation but can't afford it (at least so I heard). Probably 100 K baht or more. Hard for her to hook a good guy when she has no English. Her brother is stuck in prison with medical problems, from dealing drugs most likely (she does not know or tell. But guys don't have the hooking option). Meanwhile the levels of customers in the MPs and bars, etc. Are quite low. I heard from more than one MP girl, can go several days with no customer. Same for bar girls not getting a customer every day, especially those with poor English.

If the girl had English, she could probably do very well standing on Soi 4 because hers looks are superior. Probably needs to use smart phone to translate messages similar to what the deaf girls do.

I just give example of girl whose health is not the best and education very poor, and her work options to make money to save for operation are quite limited. Also she is just not used to working really hard. Tires easily. .[/QUOTE]A sad tale and so typical. Seems a sweet girl. One can only hope her looks and personality are enough to catch somebody's attention but as you mention her lack of English makes that less likely. Perhaps a mention on ISG on how to meet up with her would help her out.

[QUOTE=Franciscass;2379316]Perhaps a mention on ISG on how to meet up with her would help her out.[/QUOTE]It might bring her a few good guys bit most likely a lot of weirdos that would take advantage of her instead of helping her.

[QUOTE=Paolo99;2379597]It might bring her a few good guys bit most likely a lot of weirdos that would take advantage of her instead of helping her.[/QUOTE]Nutjobs are an occupational hazard unfortunately working girls have to contend with. They are out there for sure, some even appear on the forum from time to time. Girls need to take whatever precautions they can. Working in oilies and soapies or as booked excorts where the customer is exposed gives them a certain degree of safety but working the streets and the bars exposes them to the greatest danger. While even one experience is enough for a girl to quit the business I get the impression the abuse is relatively occasional. Hopefully so.

Are poppers illegal in Thailand? Don't want to risk bringing anything in that could get me in trouble. I've seen conflicting comments online. Some say illegal, some guys say they've had no issue even showing them in suitcases at Customs. Does anyone know the actual position please?

Bangkok jumps up cost-of-living table.
Strong baht pushes capital into top 50 globally in survey of expat living costs.
12 DEC 2019
[URL]https://www.bangkokpost.com/business/1814124/bangkok-jumps-up-cost-of-living-table[/URL]

However:
"Certain living costs, such as accommodation rental, utilities, car purchases and school fees are usually covered by separate allowances. Data for these costs are collected separately and are not included in ECA's cost of living basket."

[QUOTE=EihTooms;2402331]Bangkok jumps up cost-of-living table.
Strong baht pushes capital into top 50 globally in survey of expat living costs.
12 DEC 2019
[URL]https://www.bangkokpost.com/business/1814124/bangkok-jumps-up-cost-of-living-table[/URL]

However:
"Certain living costs, such as accommodation rental, utilities, car purchases and school fees are usually covered by separate allowances. Data for these costs are collected separately and are not included in ECA's cost of living basket."[/QUOTE]Naturally rental and utilities is a part of the cost of living. Even in Baht money, the cost for a bowl of noodles on a street stall has gone up a lot or the bowl shrunk to such an extent that more than 1 bowl is needed. Cost of buying fruit from street cart or grilled chicken has certainly jumped up over the years too. Fuel costs much more than it used to. Even Thais complain a lot about rise of cost of gas for cooking jumped a lot when Yingluck came to power (before Baht was so strong), affecting heavily even the poor rural folk. However they don't complain about candidates handing out 1000 Baht to vote for them. Jump in for that. I don't see Prayut has done much about corruption at all. Its all improving the Image for him, is my impression. Real improvements not really.

[QUOTE=PayForIt;2402230]Are poppers illegal in Thailand? Don't want to risk bringing anything in that could get me in trouble. I've seen conflicting comments online. Some say illegal, some guys say they've had no issue even showing them in suitcases at Customs. Does anyone know the actual position please?[/QUOTE]Amphetamines known locally as yaba (thai translation for crazy) is illegal, many times the coppers attend a club and administer piss tests on everyone, just because the law is not enforced does not mean the law no longer exists. If as a farang you get caught, you will definitely wind up in the monkey house, the locals like to blame all their ills on foreigners. It's the same with finding any pedo who is a farang, headline news, but allows them to ignore the locals who the coppers find distasteful stuff to deal with, so better they ignore it, and blame the farangs.

[QUOTE=AussieDoug;2402632]Amphetamines known locally as yaba (thai translation for crazy) is illegal, many times the coppers attend a club and administer piss tests on everyone, just because the law is not enforced does not mean the law no longer exists. If as a farang you get caught, you will definitely wind up in the monkey house, the locals like to blame all their ills on foreigners. It's the same with finding any pedo who is a farang, headline news, but allows them to ignore the locals who the coppers find distasteful stuff to deal with, so better they ignore it, and blame the farangs.[/QUOTE]Poppers are not Amphetamines like speed etc. Obviously don't want to take ANY risks at all. So likely just to skip it but have read some reports on the net about this not being an issue. Would be great to get some clarity without which. As you say. No point in taking any chance.

[QUOTE=AussieDoug;2402632]Amphetamines known locally as yaba (thai translation for crazy) is illegal, many times the coppers attend a club and administer piss tests on everyone, just because the law is not enforced does not mean the law no longer exists. If as a farang you get caught, you will definitely wind up in the monkey house, the locals like to blame all their ills on foreigners. It's the same with finding any pedo who is a farang, headline news, but allows them to ignore the locals who the coppers find distasteful stuff to deal with, so better they ignore it, and blame the farangs.[/QUOTE]Have you actually experienced Police coming and pee testing everyone? I never saw it in many years. Police raids are more commonly concerned about several things: Underage girls, girls not Thai citizens, perhaps drugs found on them, Yaa Baa (Yaba) or Ice, and perhaps testing girls that seem spaced out. Would they really test all the customers too?

One guy I knew, took on a girl addicted to Ice, no clue why he accepted this, since she was total unsuitable, far too young and untrustworthy. He admitted to trying it himself, so he would know what it is like. Subsequently she would steal his valuables. E. g. Phone, and sell them to finance her drug purchases. As if he would not know this would be likely. Idiot. Eventually he died probably prematurely.

I had no idea what poopers are so had to look it up being inhaled Amyl Nitrates. Apparently can act as an anal relaxant. Ha ha. Suitable for gays and girls in PSE shops.

I quote this I read on a medical site:

"Taking the drug in this way can cause irregular and rapid heart rhythms and result in a syndrome called "sudden sniffing death".
Also, poppers can have other complications that are potentially fatal. For example, researchTrusted Source in rats indicates that the chemicals in poppers may be toxic to the brain and inhibit learning and memory".

So definitely not a safe recreation.

I read that you cannot buy poppers in Thailand and is banned. So not legal. Not worth the risk I am sure.

As a traveller in Thailand, you carry ID with you at all times? My last trip when trying to enter Crazy House I was asked for my passport. I didn't have the original or a copy on me. The doorman was asking all Asians. No bother for me but I prefer to keep my pockets light and hence don't carry my passport.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2402904]are so had to look it up being inhaled Amyl Nitrates. Apparently can act as an anal relaxant. Ha ha. Suitable for gays and girls in PSE shops.

I quote this I read on a medical site:

"Taking the drug in this way can cause irregular and rapid heart rhythms and result in a syndrome called "sudden sniffing death".
Also, poppers can have other complications that are potentially fatal. For example, researchTrusted Source in rats indicates that the chemicals in poppers may be toxic to the brain and inhibit learning and memory".

So definitely not a safe recreation.

I read that you cannot buy poppers in Thailand and is banned. So not legal. Not worth the risk I am sure.[/QUOTE]I am not guy or a girl in a PSE shop (though your comment did make me giggle). I'm sure heavy use of poppers is seriously not a good idea. But the are excellent for short heightened enjoyment of sex. They are on sale in Spain, Germany, UK, USA, Australia without any restriction or prescription. A lot of things are dangerous if used excessively. I don't use poppers more than a couple of times a month but if you find a girl you click with they inject great fun.

But given the apparent lack of knowledge about them being legal or not in Thailand from senior members of this forum, I agree it is just not worth the risk and will skip. They aren't that important but a shame. Bit like saying thin condoms are illegal. You can still have a lot of fun without them but perhaps more fun with them.

[QUOTE=Applesauce;2402916]As a traveller in Thailand, you carry ID with you at all times? My last trip when trying to enter Crazy House I was asked for my passport. I didn't have the original or a copy on me. The doorman was asking all Asians. No bother for me but I prefer to keep my pockets light and hence don't carry my passport.[/QUOTE]Only a digital copy. A photocopy could be an option as well. Losing my passport far outweighs the hassle of not having a real passport on my body. FYI never been asked for a passport in over 4 years living in Pattaya and Bangkok.

As for CH did all the Asians look young and the Farangs look old or are you saying even 50 year old Asians were checked and 20 year old Farang were not. I'd just walk away of any gogo bar asked me for my passport. Never seen any bar I've been at in Thailand ever asking to see a passport though.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2403001]As for CH did all the Asians look young and the Farangs look old or are you saying even 50 year old Asians were checked and 20 year old Farang were not.[/QUOTE]While I was there the doorman checked all East Asians for ID regardless of age. I may have posted about it here at the time last Sep 2018. Other forums said it was to make sure I wasn't Thai.

I'll be in Bangkok in about a month. I'm mostly not looking to monger (not that into Asian women) but I would like to see this infamous side of the city.

I was hoping why'all could help me put together a sampler of a night. I was actually thinking of checking out something like this: [URL]https://bizarrebangkoktours.com/tours/red-light-bangkok/[/URL].

Maybe I should just use their itinerary as a guide and visit the establishments myself? I'm straight but I'm open to seeing how the gay and katoey clubs work. Also what clubs are for Japanese salarymen, and what clubs are for old Westerners hooking up with girls from the countryside? Will there be an entry fee or drink minimum at these clubs?

I know there are three main areas: Soi Cowboy, Nana Plaza and Patpong. Which of the three is best for just casual observers? Which of the three is best for finding a girl?

[QUOTE=Jmioffe;2403076]I'll be in Bangkok in about a month. I'm mostly not looking to monger (not that into Asian women) but I would like to see this infamous side of the city.

I was hoping why'all could help me put together a sampler of a night. I was actually thinking of checking out something like this: [URL]https://bizarrebangkoktours.com/tours/red-light-bangkok/[/URL].

Maybe I should just use their itinerary as a guide and visit the establishments myself? I'm straight but I'm open to seeing how the gay and katoey clubs work. Also what clubs are for Japanese salarymen, and what clubs are for old Westerners hooking up with girls from the countryside? Will there be an entry fee or drink minimum at these clubs?

I know there are three main areas: Soi Cowboy, Nana Plaza and Patpong. Which of the three is best for just casual observers? Which of the three is best for finding a girl?[/QUOTE]You better not use European non English words hear. "Demimonde" ha ha.

A month in Bangkok is too long if you won't be mongering much, unless you have to work there. Travelling to other places would be a must for most.

Thaniya is for Japanese near Pat Pong, and there is a Gay Soi nearby. Pat Pong, Nana Plaza and Cowboy have several LB clubs (not difficult find) but some like DC10 maybe risky, and we are not permitted to get into non hetero things on this forum. Most gogo bars are for old guys meeting country Thai girls, however some bars have 98% South East Asian customers these days, and very few western guys.

For Nana Plaza I recommend Billboard. Some others may like Rainbow bar. For Cowboy, worth looking at Crazy House, Baccarat, Dollhouse, Kazy to see what you like. I don't really like any particular clubs, it depends only on particular girls.

You may as well try Oily Massage places, Soapy Massage, Street walkers, Thermae Caf, Discos, Nightclubs. Look at everything and see what you like. Possible to find poor girls anywhere so be cautious.

You will be used beautiful women in Europe so most of the Russian and similar types in Thailand, will just not be good enough. Very ordinary looking Russians seen now and then. Most of us don't bother to go there.

<moved from the Pattaya Reports thread since topic is not Pattaya specific.>

[QUOTE=NakedGunz;2405353]What an idiot! Don't be this fool. [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=foGtGPc27kk[/URL].

He being so badly played by a Thai, not even worth anybody's time for the world to see.[/QUOTE]48, unemployed, overweight, and balding with no money. A winning combination. Can barely afford a 50 k baht dowry. Couldn't afford to buy gold for $6800 USD and convinced the girl he would buy buy about $1000 USD in gold for now and buy more over time. Of course the girl has major concerns if this guy can support her.

I know zero about this topic but what is the norm to pay for a dowry and a couple of wedding rings in Thailand?

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2405555]48, unemployed, overweight, and balding with no money. A winning combination. Can barely afford a 50 k baht dowry. Couldn't afford to buy gold for $6800 USD and convinced the girl he would buy buy about $1000 USD in gold for now and buy more over time. Of course the girl has major concerns if this guy can support her. [/QUOTE]I don't think the video is real. I mean who the hell hires a cameraman to video such a humiliating experience. The dufus must be really hard up for cash. What a great idea: film a fake story about his new life in LOS with a real Thai woman and make a name for himself on youtube. The only question I have, after watching the video, is who would give his supposed fiance 2000 baht for ST? Not me, although she is a pretty good actress. 555.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2403229]You better not use European non English words hear. "Demimonde" ha ha.[/QUOTE]I'm all for using demimondes, isn't that what this site is for?

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2405585]I don't think the video is real. I mean who the hell hires a cameraman to video such a humiliating experience. The dufus must be really hard up for cash. What a great idea: film a fake story about his new life in LOS with a real Thai woman and make a name for himself on youtube. The only question I have, after watching the video, is who would give his supposed fiance 2000 baht for ST? Not me, although she is a pretty good actress. 555.[/QUOTE]I agree it's not likely to be real. The points she says I say goodbye if you don't have money I'the have been packing her off the boat. And to answer your question, I wouldn't pay 200 let alone 2000 for ST with her.

Took a quick look at the video and it ws too long didn't watch (tl: dw). I admit to being ignorant of the outcome of the documentary.

Its barely watchable. Any idiot can upload a YouTube video and call themselves a YouTube celebrity. It's a cynical video of no merit. Everyone comes off in a bad light (if real) or if fake, it's even more cynical. Is it like the bachelor designed to make us guffaw at the loser and his money grubbing thai bride.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2405585]I don't think the video is real. I mean who the hell hires a cameraman to video such a humiliating experience. The dufus must be really hard up for cash. What a great idea: film a fake story about his new life in LOS with a real Thai woman and make a name for himself on youtube. The only question I have, after watching the video, is who would give his supposed fiance 2000 baht for ST? Not me, although she is a pretty good actress. 555.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2405585]I don't think the video is real. I mean who the hell hires a cameraman to video such a humiliating experience. The dufus must be really hard up for cash. What a great idea: film a fake story about his new life in LOS with a real Thai woman and make a name for himself on youtube. The only question I have, after watching the video, is who would give his supposed fiance 2000 baht for ST? Not me, although she is a pretty good actress. 555.[/QUOTE]The show is called 90 Day Fiance. That couple was from 2 seasons ago.

[url]https://www.tlc.com/tv-shows/90-day-fiance/[/url]

[QUOTE=Supmam;2405624]Took a quick look at the video and it ws too long didn't watch (tl: dw). I admit to being ignorant of the outcome of the documentary.

Its barely watchable. Any idiot can upload a YouTube video and call themselves a YouTube celebrity. It's a cynical video of no merit. Everyone comes off in a bad light (if real) or if fake, it's even more cynical. Is it like the bachelor designed to make us guffaw at the loser and his money grubbing thai bride.[/QUOTE]That video is about two years old and its not a YouTube video, it is from a top rated "reality show" on TLC called 90 day Fiance. David and his ho, I mean his wife are now paid commentators on other 90 day shows as they have become two of the more popular characters from that show. Not bad for a former unemployed but still overweight dunce and an ex bar girl with the charisma of Opebo.

So just like The bachelor then. How fucking painful.

Thanks for saving me from watching the "content".

[QUOTE=RunMann;2405643]That video is about two years old and its not a YouTube video, it is from a top rated "reality show" on TLC called 90 day Fiance. David and his ho, I mean his wife are now paid commentators on other 90 day shows as they have become two of the more popular characters from that show. Not bad for a former unemployed but still overweight dunce and an ex bar girl with the charisma of Opebo.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Supmam;2405657]So just like The bachelor then. How fucking painful.

Thanks for saving me from watching the "content".[/QUOTE]I have a relative that is working on that show and has worked on many other reality shows. The scripts on these shows are embellished to make them interesting to the viewing public. Events don't happen in sequence, scenes are reshot, and dialogue is changed / made up for entertainment purposes. This happens on nearly every reality show. They are largely fake.

[QUOTE=RunMann;2405643]That video is about two years old and its not a YouTube video, it is from a top rated "reality show" on TLC called 90 day Fiance. David and his ho, I mean his wife are now paid commentators on other 90 day shows as they have become two of the more popular characters from that show. Not bad for a former unemployed but still overweight dunce and an ex bar girl with the charisma of Opebo.[/QUOTE]Hey speaking of " Opebo " didn't there use to be a board member called " Opebo "?

[QUOTE=LittleBigMan;2405768]Hey speaking of " Opebo " didn't there use to be a board member called " Opebo "?[/QUOTE]Yes, he only comes out every so often to tell us how bad the BR scene is and that the end is near, he should be along soon.

I'm due to be in Thailand in Jan 2020 for only 6 nights (managed to squeeze these in on business trip outside of Thailand).

I have first night booked in Bangkok. I'm not a great fan of the city, have been many times but fancied Thermae as not been and read a lot of good reports in the recent forums. That said I have a penchant for bar girls rather than FLs but let's see. Intend to travel to Pattaya then for night 2 and 3. That leaves me 3 nights. I have been to Phuket / Samui / Krabi / but not to Hua Hin (which I like the look of). So my options are to pick one of them for all three nights (in which case Phuket probably has most choice but then I find Bangla all a bit over the top). Hence wondering if I should try quieter Hua Hin (easy to get to from Pattaya / Bangkok. Obviously Samui / Phuket involve a couple more hours of travel. Would be interested to get some views from senior members of this forum on where you would recommend I spend those last three nights. Mongering if first priority over hotel / beach / tourist attractions! Would appreciate your help please guys. Nice to have these options. Would have been better to have more nights but even the 6 is a bonus.

[QUOTE=PayForIt;2407265]I'm due to be in Thailand in Jan 2020 for only 6 nights (managed to squeeze these in on business trip outside of Thailand).

I have first night booked in Bangkok. I'm not a great fan of the city, have been many times but fancied Thermae as not been and read a lot of good reports in the recent forums. That said I have a penchant for bar girls rather than FLs but let's see. Intend to travel to Pattaya then for night 2 and 3. That leaves me 3 nights. I have been to Phuket / Samui / Krabi / but not to Hua Hin (which I like the look of). So my options are to pick one of them for all three nights (in which case Phuket probably has most choice but then I find Bangla all a bit over the top). Hence wondering if I should try quieter Hua Hin (easy to get to from Pattaya / Bangkok. Obviously Samui / Phuket involve a couple more hours of travel. Would be interested to get some views from senior members of this forum on where you would recommend I spend those last three nights. Mongering if first priority over hotel / beach / tourist attractions! Would appreciate your help please guys. Nice to have these options. Would have been better to have more nights but even the 6 is a bonus.[/QUOTE]Such a short time, I would merely suggest not to try to do too many different locations, especially if mongering is your priority. If was me, would skip Hua Hin. Is it exciting enough? Don't bother to decide ahead of time. See if you are bored with Bangkok and Pattaya first. Go with the flow.

I think Bargirls are better than FLs overall, but there is the cost problem. FLs in the Thermae may act like they are on a tight schedule (not always) but depends how busy they are. Bargirls can rush customers too, but I rarely meet those types these days. You have more time in a bar to assess the girl's attitude. I have been lucky on occasions with attitude of FLs on Soi 4, (far more lucky than in Thermae). Also Soi 4 girls are more likely to prefer Farangs, and less dick scared.

I'd take an hour flight to Phnom Penh vs. Flying to tourist trap Phuket or driving 3 hours Bangkok to Hua Hin. Didn't even realize Hua Hin had a worthwhile hobby scene.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2407325]Didn't even realize Hua Hin had a worthwhile hobby scene.[/QUOTE]Hua hin surely has bars but quality is really bad. I never saw a single doable girl outside massage shops. I only go to hua hin for chilling out on beach because it's so close from BKK.

[QUOTE=Gargano19;2407347]Hua hin surely has bars but quality is really bad. I never saw a single doable girl outside massage shops. I only go to hua hin for chilling out on beach because it's so close from BKK.[/QUOTE]Never been there. Some traveler on the web wrote the beach is full of huge jelly fish and has big sewage pipes running into it. Is that the case?

Many thanks for the replies gents. I have a feeling Syzgies is right about cutting travel down.

Have never been to Phi Phi so might do Phuket then head to the island for one day total rest and chill but I also like the go with the flow idea and just see where it takes me.

Had seriously contemplated Phnom Phen but then it would mean all cities and no beach at all.

Really appreciated the feedback.

Nobody commented on Samui which was a little surprising.

[QUOTE=PayForIt;2407265] Mongering if first priority over hotel / beach / tourist attractions! [/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=PayForIt;2407431]Have never been to Phi Phi so might do Phuket then head to the island for one day total rest and chill but I also like the go with the flow idea and just see where it takes me.

Had seriously contemplated Phnom Phen but then it would mean all cities and no beach at all.
[/QUOTE]I misunderstood the goal of your 6 days trip. I read mongering over beaches which is why I recommended PP over Phuket. If you really want a mongering and beach combination I think Jakarta and Bali would be a much better choice.

Funny we are considering other places for a good beach since the Thai officials believe Pattaya is a world class beach resort.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2407500]I misunderstood the goal of your 6 days trip. I read mongering over beaches which is why I recommended PP over Phuket. If you really want a mongering and beach combination I think Jakarta and Bali would be a much better choice.

Funny we are considering other places for a good beach since the Thai officials believe Pattaya is a world class beach resort.[/QUOTE]I understand. Sorry for the confusion. Main goal is good mongering. So for example, I'd like to go to Koh Lanta but don't believe it would have much in the way of mongering options. So despite the apparent beauty I'll skip it. Same applied to Langkawi.

If there are none, or poor mongering options, that would rule it out. I contemplated Hua Hin due to Redcat site suggesting it was really good but the forum doesn't suggest so. I also thought the beach there was good but apparently not presently. If I can get a combo of a really nice place to visit with good mongering options that would be best. But really nice place to visit doesn't have to be beach. You post made me seriously look again at PP and the flights are both cheap and easy from BKK. I'd like to experience Cambodia and / or Vietnam. I've arranged already 2 days in the mayhem of Pattaya- not because it is pretty. I guess it won't be. But because (1) I've never been so have to try once and (2) the options appear to be many. I'll do one night in BKK despite not loving the city as I like the sound of Thermae. I'm fortunate not to be on a budget so I would hope I would do well there. Looked at the PP forum and I like the sound of the KTVs which sound great fun.

But not sure I want to spend all three of my spare nights in PP. I've been to Bali but not Jakarta and as I need to head back to Europe after the 6 days and have my return flight booked back to FRA from LK that sort of rules out Jakarta and Bali as it is just going too far east.

I like the idea of PP over Phuket as I'm not a big fan of Bangla / Phuket. I liked Samui as not as much mayhem as Phuket but PP has definitely opened another avenue and I like trying places I've never been to. And not been there. I like to have something interesting to see in the daytime (touristy) and PP looks like a cool city.

[QUOTE=PayForIt;2407431]
Have never been to Phi Phi so might do Phuket then head to the island for one day total rest and chill but I also like the go with the flow idea and just see where it takes me.
[/QUOTE]Phuket is a big Island. Patong Beech is the main touristy and mongering area. There are many quieter spots in Phuket, but still touristy.

If intending Phi Phi, one can combine it with Ao Nang, Krabi (which is what I did) and that can be a bit cheaper than Phuket. I took a hot Thai girl with me since I did not expect much mongering on Phi Phi (I would not really know). This meant I had a great time. Small scale mongering is available in bars at Ao Nang Krabi.

To do Phuket and Phi Phi (or Krabi and Phi Phi) really requires at least 4 days I think, but you are pushed for time. Yes you can stay in Phi Phi just one night. It's possible but rushed. So only if you are hating Bangkok and Pattaya. Personally, I don't like to be in a huge rush.

At Phi Phi, you hire snorkelling gear and a long tailed boat to go to the beautiful bays with coloured tropical coral fish to see. Better still if you have a sexy Thai girl along with you. If she can't swim, no matter, they have bouyancy vests and flippers available to give non swimmers confidence. Snorkelling trips are available from Ao Nang as well (without going far to Phi Phi).

I did PP for one night (too rushed). Found that most PP girls were a bit different to Thais and not quite as appealing to me. The girls that came from places close to the border of Thailand, looked much more similar to Thais. Hardly surprising. Need to try again some day.

Not sure why Bali was recommended. I would never go there again. O.K. as a beech resort, but Balinese girls for the most part are not that pretty for my taste, especially once they get over 20 years old. They seemed to decline rapidly with age (too much sun and hard work maybe) and looked very old at 30. Also the more rounded face shapes did not appeal. I am biased towards slim face shape and narrow jaw. The good looking girls in Bali were usually Javanese.

[QUOTE=PayForIt;2407627]I contemplated Hua Hin due to Redcat site suggesting it was really good but the forum doesn't suggest so. I also thought the beach there was good but apparently not presently. [/QUOTE]The beach in Hua Hin is ok. The water can be a bit murky some times during the year and they do have jellyfish. I've been 3 times but always with family so I haven't checked out the mongering scene. I was there in October and the city had grown a lot since I wa there about 5 years ago. I've read, but cannot confirm, that there are more bars for P4 P these days.

If you want to do Pattaya and Hua Hin then I would go straight from the airport to Pattaya and then over to Hua Hin, I sure there is a direct ferry between the 2. Then return to Bangkok. Heaps of accommodation available everywhere so you may only want to book a night or 2 to start. If you like Pattaya then you can skip Hua Hin and stay there or just go back to BKK.

[QUOTE=PayForIt;2407627]...I contemplated Hua Hin due to Redcat site suggesting it was really good but the forum doesn't suggest so. I also thought the beach there was good but apparently not presently...[/QUOTE]A few years ago, I spent 4 days in Hua Hin and I really liked it. I was coming from Pattaya and I liked the laid back atmosphere there. I found many nice restaurants, nice beaches, and the mongering was pretty good. I would go back there in a heartbeat. It is definitely a change from Pattaya.

[QUOTE=Lefeu;2408127]A few years ago, I spent 4 days in Hua Hin and I really liked it. I was coming from Pattaya and I liked the laid back atmosphere there. I found many nice restaurants, nice beaches, and the mongering was pretty good. I would go back there in a heartbeat. It is definitely a change from Pattaya.[/QUOTE]Thanks for this and all the replies. What a really helpful forum this is. The contrast with the Kuala Lumpur forum is marked!

So I think my trip is finally sorted. I probably don't have time for HH now I'm headed also to PP. Which looks different and fun. But if I find Pattaya too much (v possible as I don't like the mayhem of Bangla / Phuket) I may head to HH even if only for a day and night.

Thanks guys. Much appreciated.

I will get my visa extended at the immigration office before my first month expires. Right before 2 months I want to fly to PhnomPenh for a week then fly back to Bangkok. Will flying back in allow me another month? In the past I used a visa run company to get third month. We went to an embassy, I think, in Malaysia.

Thanks for any advice or help.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2407314]Such a short time, I would merely suggest not to try to do too many different locations, especially if mongering is your priority. If was me, would skip Hua Hin. Is it exciting enough? Don't bother to decide ahead of time. See if you are bored with Bangkok and Pattaya first. Go with the flow.

I think Bargirls are better than FLs overall, but there is the cost problem. FLs in the Thermae may act like they are on a tight schedule (not always) but depends how busy they are. Bargirls can rush customers too, but I rarely meet those types these days. You have more time in a bar to assess the girl's attitude. I have been lucky on occasions with attitude of FLs on Soi 4, (far more lucky than in Thermae). Also Soi 4 girls are more likely to prefer Farangs, and less dick scared.[/QUOTE]It has been over 55 years (Nam) since I have been in Thailand, but I was stationed there and lived close to the Soldiers Monument. Anyway me and my mates went to Thermae's many many times. It basically was a small coffee shop then and normally we would get there after a night of bar hoping. This was where the bar girls would gather after their work in the various clubs. In those days a club would have many girls just dancing together on a dance floor or hanging out and you could pick one and the waiter would shine his flashlight on her and she would come over. The club we went to most was Hollywood (if I remember the name), and it had a swimming pool out back that wasn't really open to the public, but many WG's would hang out by the pool in the day. It was a good place to get a beer and some noodles and just hang out with the girls if you were a regular! Just wondering what Thermae's is like now?

[QUOTE=MrClen;2409330]It has been over 55 years (Nam) since I have been in Thailand, but I was stationed there and lived close to the Soldiers Monument. Anyway me and my mates went to Thermae's many many times. It basically was a small coffee shop then and normally we would get there after a night of bar hoping. This was where the bar girls would gather after their work in the various clubs. In those days a club would have many girls just dancing together on a dance floor or hanging out and you could pick one and the waiter would shine his flashlight on her and she would come over. [/QUOTE]This is the first post about the Good Old Days that I enjoyed reading. 55 years ago must have really been the good old days!

Thermae these days is 100-200 girls standing like zombies along the perimeter of the bar. 100's of horny Japanese men circling and pointing at girls and discussing their opinion of each girl right in front of the girl's face! It's hilarious. There is absolutely no dancing except in the girls' heads when a guy agrees to overpay the girl 3000 baht or more. Price should be 2500 baht and a few recent reports of girls going for 2000 baht. There may or may not still be coffee there but there is food which is actually not half bad given this is a hole in the wall bar in the basement of a 2 star hotel.

More stories of the Good Old Days of 1965 please!

[QUOTE=Horatio;2409327]I will get my visa extended at the immigration office before my first month expires. Right before 2 months I want to fly to PhnomPenh for a week then fly back to Bangkok. Will flying back in allow me another month? [/QUOTE]You should ask this on [URL]thaivisa.com[/URL].

Technically you should be allowed another 30 day stay upon return from PP. However, this is all up to the Immigration officer and there is absolutely no consistency in Thailand. Thailand does not want a person to be allowed in many times per year on a free visa. They want the person to pay for a multi entry visa or a Retirement Visa.

[QUOTE=Horatio;2409327]I will get my visa extended at the immigration office before my first month expires. Right before 2 months I want to fly to PhnomPenh for a week then fly back to Bangkok. Will flying back in allow me another month? In the past I used a visa run company to get third month. We went to an embassy, I think, in Malaysia.

Thanks for any advice or help.[/QUOTE]Your post is confusing because I don't know which country you come from nor if you had a Visa and what type. Did you ever get an automatic 30 days on arrival without a Visa? If you did, next time you will get one again. Any arrival is normally extendable by 30 days more if you pay at immigration, before you are required to leave. There is a limit to how many 30 day free entries are allowed per year. Consulates advise that 2 free entries are allowed. In practice, 6 per year may be feasible.

I assume your current Visa, if you have one, is not a multi entry Visa. A visa takes a whole page in passport. If you enter on no Visa or Visa waiver, then it may be just a smaller entry stamp.

On my last Visa run to Jakarta, I found it was far too difficult to apply for a Visa there and took days, so was easier just to enter Thailand again on a 30 day no Visa entry.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2409420]This is the first post about the Good Old Days that I enjoyed reading. 55 years ago must have really been the good old days!

Thermae these days is 100-200 girls standing like zombies along the perimeter of the bar. 100's of horny Japanese men circling and pointing at girls and discussing their opinion of each girl right in front of the girl's face! It's hilarious. There is absolutely no dancing except in the girls' heads when a guy agrees to overpay the girl 3000 baht or more. [/QUOTE]When he talked about dancing in the clubs, I don't think he was referring to Thermae, although dancing did occur there I believe for any who felt like it with music going. 30 years ago Thermae Café was not that small and it wasn't so dark as the girls could not be seen clearly without a flashlight. It was located at the mouth of Soi 13 very close to Miami Hotel and Thermae Soapy was upstairs (at ground level). Was it ever small? I am a little sceptical, but its possible, especially if there was some other location before that. Thermae was the place of last resort at 2 am, if guys had failed to get a girl else where and all the bars had closed. Even bar girls with no customer would possibly migrate to Thermae or The Grace. It was certainly very different to now, with mostly Farang customers.

I have a buddy who may have been to Thermae 40 years ago, so will ask his thoughts too. We would all love a time machine to go back, and I would certainly like to try 55 years ago. Its hard to imagine with my first time there being a mere 37 years ago. Must have been incredible and girls costing maybe 100 to 200 Baht for the whole night. They probably had no English and probably no surgeries and all big Bush no shaved pussies Ha ha. I should check what year the Baht was first used. They once had Ticals I believe. Just kidding! If I had first gone to Thailand at age 20 for example, my whole life might have been totally changed, I might not have married a Farang girl.

It would be great to read a lot more about 55 years ago, seeing we don't have the time machine. I don't want to see the future!

[QUOTE=MrClen;2409330]It has been over 55 years (Nam) since I have been in Thailand, but I was stationed there and lived close to the Soldiers Monument. Anyway me and my mates went to Thermae's many many times. It basically was a small coffee shop then and normally we would get there after a night of bar hoping. This was where the bar girls would gather after their work in the various clubs. In those days a club would have many girls just dancing together on a dance floor or hanging out and you could pick one and the waiter would shine his flashlight on her and she would come over. The club we went to most was Hollywood (if I remember the name), and it had a swimming pool out back that wasn't really open to the public, but many WG's would hang out by the pool in the day. It was a good place to get a beer and some noodles and just hang out with the girls if you were a regular! Just wondering what Thermae's is like now?[/QUOTE]Wow.

Was Thermae at Soi 13 near Miami in those days? Can you tell us about other mongering experiences, like Soapy Massage places visited, etc. Where was the Hollywood Club? If you can remember of course. It is a long time ago. What did a Thai girl cost for the whole night?

37 years ago I was in a Soapy MP in Sukhumvit Soi 2 or 4 and girl was naked, but I had no idea what cost for sex would have been. She had zero English. I did not take much money with me, and no credit cards because I was just going for a jog for exercise and found the place accidentally. I don't know if sex was included in the initial price too. I was totally mystified and clueless but scared of catching an STD. Ha ha. No condoms I guess. I had to return to the wife unfucked. What a waste.

Hey bros and ISGians. I like to know any experience of the ISGians regarding the fullnight. My questions are below.

1.) how many shots you are able to do for night call? 7 PM TO MORNING 5 AM.

2.) pleasantries given by you mostly?

3.) enchangers will be useful for increasing shots on nights?

4.) Uses of vodha during the night call?

5.) Any other tips for night call?

Yes I have been planning for night call. Let me know your suggesstions bro.

Suggestions are welcome on PM too.

[QUOTE=Rajaa;2410010] how many shots you are able to do for night call? 7 PM TO MORNING 5 AM.[/QUOTE]As many as you can negotiate with the girl and / or you can do. Of course even if the girl agrees to do 4 SOGs for LT, that may be fairly reduced to 1 or 2 if you jackhammer her pussy to death.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2409420]This is the first post about the Good Old Days that I enjoyed reading. 55 years ago must have really been the good old days!

Thermae these days is 100-200 girls standing like zombies along the perimeter of the bar. 100's of horny Japanese men circling and pointing at girls and discussing their opinion of each girl right in front of the girl's face! It's hilarious. There is absolutely no dancing except in the girls' heads when a guy agrees to overpay the girl 3000 baht or more. Price should be 2500 baht and a few recent reports of girls going for 2000 baht. There may or may not still be coffee there but there is food which is actually not half bad given this is a hole in the wall bar in the basement of a 2 star hotel.

More stories of the Good Old Days of 1965 please!

You should ask this on [URL]thaivisa.com[/URL].

Technically you should be allowed another 30 day stay upon return from PP. However, this is all up to the Immigration officer and there is absolutely no consistency in Thailand. Thailand does not want a person to be allowed in many times per year on a free visa. They want the person to pay for a multi entry visa or a Retirement Visa.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2410004]Wow.

Was Thermae at Soi 13 near Miami in those days? Can you tell us about other mongering experiences, like Soapy Massage places visited, etc. Where was the Hollywood Club? If you can remember of course. It is a long time ago. What did a Thai girl cost for the whole night?

37 years ago I was in a Soapy MP in Sukhumvit Soi 2 or 4 and girl was naked, but I had no idea what cost for sex would have been. She had zero English. I did not take much money with me, and no credit cards because I was just going for a jog for exercise and found the place accidentally. I don't know if sex was included in the initial price too. I was totally mystified and clueless but scared of catching an STD. Ha ha. No condoms I guess. I had to return to the wife unfucked. What a waste.[/QUOTE]Well I will try and remember what it was like 55 years ago! Note that this was during the Vietnam War and we hated to see the Grunts come in for RR. They would have lots of money and lots of built up pressure, hence, they would tend to go a bit crazy. Spoiling it for us locals. I was stationed at the Airport Air Base (Don Maung?) and had quarters ay the Trocadero Hotel (I see on line that it's closed now and a real dump), but as it was a military hotel, you couldn't bring in girls. However my friend and I rented a very small apartment near the Monument I mentioned earlier, I don't remember the cost, but it wasn't much. Girls! I don't think I ever paid one, (but if I did, and I must have, it wasn't much as I really didn't have much money), as mostly they were just hoping for a clean place to sleep and shower. Being a local had certain benefits as we were well known by the local places and many of the girls. As there was no AIDS at that time, I always went BB. Did get the clap one time but a shot took care of that. No idea what a Soapy was.

We had an unofficial award called the "Blue Max", you had to do 50 verified different girls in your tour (1 year) to qualify. I didn't get it but a couple managed.

The small apartment I shared was basically two rooms, with the upstairs the bedroom with two single beds. Tight fit with a girl but so what! My buddy and I worked different shifts and sometimes he or I would go out (what we called "running them") and bring an extra back to the apartment as a "Birthday present". I guess I must have been a bit naive in those days as I never thought of keeping them both for myself!

A couple small clubs not on "bar Street" as they are called now, that we went to were Red & Blue and Thai Younk (spelling on this is probably wrong). Not so many girls but the ones that were there were usually great.

When feeling adventurous, we would go to the waterfront bars with many merchant marine, (in the reg's it was told that you should never go there, too dangerous). Mind your manners and you could have a really great time. Girls there were more professional however and were normally with a mama.

[QUOTE=MrClen;2410606]
The small apartment I shared was basically two rooms, with the upstairs the bedroom with two single beds. Tight fit with a girl but so what! My buddy and I worked different shifts and sometimes he or I would go out (what we called "running them") and bring an extra back to the apartment as a "Birthday present". I guess I must have been a bit naive in those days as I never thought of keeping them both for myself!
[/QUOTE]Thanks for the info about old times. The monument is called Chaisamoraphoom (Victory Monument). I used to live near there in Soi Rang Naam for a few years in early 2000s, right on the park Suan Santhipaap. However was not cheap any more 20K Baht per month I think I paid (maybe a bit less) for furnished room with aircon. Don Meuang airport was still being used Internationally.

No worries about being Naive. I was too. My first visit to Thermae I met two hot girls and both well above average looks. Could not find any better than this pair. I had a great deal of difficulty deciding which one of the two, and in the end the non smoker won the tie breaker. Days later my buddy said I was stupid and should have taken both of them. I was so happy with my choice for the night (she had amazing tits as a bonus), I actually took her several days running, till she had made enough extra money to go home to Phitsanulok (with her friend). Best of all, she was passionate in bed. Each night, I wasted considerable time in the Thermae, while my girl waited to see if her friend could get some guy. Seemed that her friend knocked back most guys and not sure of the reason. Her looks were easily good enough (and I liked her). I might have saved a lot of wasted time by taking both of them several nights running. Then again, the pair might have reached their money target sooner and therefore went away sooner.

Sorry to some. I have posted that story before.

I had to try to follow Thai (with my very basic knowledge) with the girl since she had almost no English, other than using English pronouns "I" and "You" in a Thai sentence. That was doubly confusing.

I may have used condoms with Thermae girl, I can't remember. Maybe not. Certainly did some bare backing that first trip. Aids was known (Rock Hudson died 1985), although initially information was supressed in Thailand for fear of affecting tourism. I think it wasn't many years after the big scare in my home country was Herpes.

There were no blue Viagra pills in those days. I recall one Thai girl said the reason she gave me bareback (normally she used condoms) was because my dick stayed hard for much longer with bareback, so a nice long fuck was possible. She reckoned My dick could start to droop as soon as I saw a condom. Ha ha. So my aversion to condoms had already started aged 35. Many years later blue pill fragments became my condom antidote if you like, so that I could tolerate condom fucks for extended duration (since very slow to cum). These days, I am becoming more and more reluctant to use a condom, just isn't the same feel and enjoyment, this seems to be a sign of getting old. Once have been doing BB with a girl regularly, it is hard to go back to a condom, and still enjoy it enough. Still not as extreme as some guys who never fuck with a condom, but maybe heading that way.

Not sure what year the Viagra copies first came to Thailand. I guess 1999 or so. So before the turn of century we all had to survive with lots of nice fucking but no blue pill assist. Before then I had a Thai GF who had no stamina and she could only handle short sex sessions, and not that frequent, and BB, so not a problem. I never got enough.

I attach pics of my first thermae girl (photo of a photo 1991). I thought she was really cute at the time (big natural tits helped too). Today I would not rate her face that high. Got fussier in my old age. Yesteryear probably took many average looking girls thinking they were pretty at the time. When guys tell you they used to get a lot more pretty girls years ago, take that with a grain of salt. I want to see the pics as evidence. Maybe no one else is game to post their very old pics.

2nd pic is inside the Thermae. Sorry its a bit dark and can't see much. I doubt they would allow us to take a pic these days.

Stickman: "A little history: the Thermae massage parlour first opened its doors in 1966, and the 'coffee shop' below it quickly became a money-spinner. Open for 24 hours year around (barring official holidays and military coups) it was what American journalist Bernard Trink (The 'night Owl' of the Bangkok Post) called a 'constellation': a meeting place selling alcohol that was not subject to official bar working hours. Women from many surrounding bars flocked there after the official closing time of 2 AM to enjoy a drink with friends before heading home, or perhaps meet a rich farang. Unlike the infamous Coffee Shop at the Grace Hotel (Sukhumvit soi 3), the Thermae was a friendly place, in spite of the grubby surroundings newcomers entering the 'Grace' often sense a vaguely threatening atmosphere. ".

[URL]https://www.stickmanbangkok.com/readers-submissions/2013/01/the-legend-of-thermae/[/URL]

My buddy that showed me the Thermae, first went there in about 1977. Hope to get a copy of some of his old photos soon. He reckons moving Thermae 50 metres in 1996 to under Ruamchit was the start of the death of it from an Expats point of view, however others still enjoyed it till early 2000's.

In it early days, Thermae was not necessarily for hookers, but also girls wanting a pick up (perhaps for free). Girls went for the whole night almost always. It gradually increased part time casual hookers needing a bit of extra money, toward hookers with high client turn over in the modern day (many wanting quickie jobs).

Early 90's Thermae was less crowded but may have had less seating too.

I guess Thermae is pronounced something like 'tur-may' (or tur-mare). In between those two.

In Thai:
เธอร์เม

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2411093]He reckons moving Thermae 50 metres in 1996 to under Ruamchit was the start of the death of it from an Expats point of view, however others still enjoyed it till early 2000's.[/QUOTE]Didn't thermae move twice around that time? I was spending a far bit of time in BKK in the 90's and kind of recall it moving, shutting down quickly and then reopening. I could be completely mistaken, those days were the pretty full-on party times of my youth.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2410685]
I attach pics of my first thermae girl (photo of a photo 1991). I thought she was really cute at the time (big natural tits helped too). Today I would not rate her face that high. Got fussier in my old age. Yesteryear probably took many average looking girls thinking they were pretty at the time. When guys tell you they used to get a lot more pretty girls years ago, take that with a grain of salt. I want to see the pics as evidence. Maybe no one else is game to post their very old pics.

2nd pic is inside the Thermae. Sorry its a bit dark and can't see much. I doubt they would allow us to take a pic these days.[/QUOTE]BB was never an issue in the late 90's in Thailand.

Interesting. I think I have seen that girl before (not personally, just that the face looks interestingly familiar).

I also find her quite attractive. Her friend too.

They have that natural look that one finds less and less in BKK these days.

[QUOTE=Catire;2411225]BB was never an issue in the late 90's in Thailand.

Interesting. I think I have seen that girl before (not personally, just that the face looks interestingly familiar).

I also find her quite attractive. Her friend too.

They have that natural look that one finds less and less in BKK these days.[/QUOTE]So you understand choosing was hard at first. I really liked both girls.

Yes in those days almost all the girls looked natural. Noses tended to be broader than what I go for now. My girl had a cheeky look too, like she knew she was "hot" with amazing high and wide slung natural almost Dee cup tits no sag. To use a western toilet, she perched / squated on the seat to pee. Ha ha. It was a sexy look too.

The two girls were the best looking in the place for my taste at the time, I think. I certainly would not have chased any average ones. Not stunning for the faces, but very acceptable for those that like a real Thai look which is what I was getting used to. Today's Thermae girls don't have this look, for the hair, for the nose, and tend to have a lot of surgeries and a more fake / plastic look, certainly looking closer to western looks.

[QUOTE=Kerrstar;2411218]Didn't thermae move twice around that time? I was spending a far bit of time in BKK in the 90's and kind of recall it moving, shutting down quickly and then reopening. I could be completely mistaken, those days were the pretty full-on party times of my youth.[/QUOTE]I wasn't really around at the time of the move, but my buddy who first went in about 1977 suggests it only moved once. You would need to specify the other location that is not just outside of Soi 13 and next to Miami Hotel.

It is possible there was an interim place for a short time, after mouth of Soi 13 closure, but I have no info on that, and the histories don't seem to mention it.

Lao girl tells me she had a deal with a possibly German Farang for 10 K Baht presumably 2 or 3 days (I don't know detail), an he stiffed her, failing to pay at the end. I would have advised her to accept payment day by day only, if she had consulted with me first. Hope he has extreme bad luck to make up for his black heart. Like to get robbed and bashed by ladyboys. Some guys are so proud to stiff a defenceless girl and end up with days of free sex. I would regard it as a freebie only if I handed over the money and the girl gave it back to me.

She is supposedly down to her last 200 Baht now. Can't pay the rent. Already has a child to support.

Now the killer blow. She can't work much longer as is pregnant. Mid December period failed to arrive, and she forgot her pill just once (maybe) early December. Doesn't deny copping a CIP. She could have got morning after pill if occurred to her but forgetting is forgetting I suppose. Maybe complacent. Unlike a western girl, she can't get an abortion due to religious beliefs, and the law. We don't even know if the baby will be white or black. She has no husband or BF and extremely weak English.

If she knows the likely father, did not tell. It is not me. I was not around at the relevant time, and I do not do CIP anyway, due to high danger. I plan a vasectomy soon.

All she has going for her right now is she is pretty. Maybe there are many guys wanting to do a pregnant girl. I am not warped that way.

Incredible tales of woe are so common, yet knowing her for 2 years plus, she is not generally giving big bullshit, so it is just possible her story is true, maybe embellished, hard to tell. She did not try to doctor the facts to make it look like I was the culprit.

I have my own set of dependents already, so I can't take on every hooker I happen to like. She needs incredible luck now to find a sponsor.

Reminds me slightly of the bad luck when a certain Tulip girl got accidentally pregnant with twins, after innocently picking wrong guy to be her partner and retiring from MPs, and that relationship failing. However she had good English and more chances to find a new guy maybe. Inside got twins by accident.

All the talk of STDs seems somewhat inconsequential to me. The big danger for girls is getting pregnant when abortion is not an option. I commend ET for his snip and intend to get done too this year. I don't want to be the cause of a girl disaster. Could happen to any nice guy or to assholes alike.

If you like to CIP guys, consider a vasectomy. That is the responsible thing. Unfortunately birth control methods are not totally reliable, most common weakness being to not take the pill when supposed to. At my age, I certainly don't need to making any babies.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2411093]Stickman: "A little history: the Thermae massage parlour first opened its doors in 1966, and the 'coffee shop' below it quickly became a money-spinner. Open for 24 hours year around (barring official holidays and military coups) it was what American journalist Bernard Trink (The 'night Owl' of the Bangkok Post) called a 'constellation': a meeting place selling alcohol that was not subject to official bar working hours. Women from many surrounding bars flocked there after the official closing time of 2 AM to enjoy a drink with friends before heading home, or perhaps meet a rich farang. Unlike the infamous Coffee Shop at the Grace Hotel (Sukhumvit soi 3), the Thermae was a friendly place, in spite of the grubby surroundings newcomers entering the 'Grace' often sense a vaguely threatening atmosphere. ".

[URL]https://www.stickmanbangkok.com/readers-submissions/2013/01/the-legend-of-thermae/[/URL]

My buddy that showed me the Thermae, first went there in about 1977. Hope to get a copy of some of his old photos soon. He reckons moving Thermae 50 metres in 1996 to under Ruamchit was the start of the death of it from an Expats point of view, however others still enjoyed it till early 2000's.

In it early days, Thermae was not necessarily for hookers, but also girls wanting a pick up (perhaps for free). Girls went for the whole night almost always. It gradually increased part time casual hookers needing a bit of extra money, toward hookers with high client turn over in the modern day (many wanting quickie jobs).

Early 90's Thermae was less crowded but may have had less seating too.

I guess Thermae is pronounced something like 'tur-may' (or tur-mare). In between those two.

In Thai:
เธอร์เม[/QUOTE]I think I got the "clap" from a girl in the massage parlor upstairs, but not sure. Anyway, Thermae's at the time as I remember was exactly like your post. Yes it was small, (had booths in those days), I remember them well. I still have a scar on my head from being hit with a beer bottle from a deaf girl who I been with before who thought I was hers. Never went to the "Grace" that I remember, of course some of those days are a blur. Many nights after bar hours, there were so many girls that Thermae was crowded with only standing room. While definitely not a "rich Farang" there was never a problem finding a girl for the night, the only problems was remembering which you had taken before and trying not to piss them off if you didn't ask again. Several nights I left alone as it just got too questionable and confrontational to pick one.

Going back a long way to remember so may not be exact! As you went in there were booths to the left and we usually sat in the second booth. If girls happened to be in the booth they made room or the "boy" would tell them to get up for us. Regulars had a few perks in those days!

Quote from Syzygies.

"All the talk of STDs seems somewhat inconsequential to me. The big danger for girls is getting pregnant when abortion is not an option. I commend ET for his snip and intend to get done too this year. I don't want to be the cause of a girl disaster. Could happen to any nice guy or to assholes alike.

If you like to CIP guys, consider a vasectomy. That is the responsible thing. Unfortunately birth control methods are not totally reliable, most common weakness being to not take the pill when supposed to. At my age, I certainly don't need to making any babies. ".

I had the snip 26 years ago and the best thing I ever did. No difference in performance but so much safer regarding unwanted pregnancies. I have been told by a mate who has had prostate cancer that having a vasectomy is advantageous as well. I had it due to 2 unplanned kids with my ex missus and she didn't want a third and was probably planning her exit from our relationship at stage as well. I have had a third child sue to IVF.

I wonder though if I would have had the sense to have one if under different circumstances due to all the opinions regarding not cumming, can't get an erection and losing your libido, BTW all wrong.

[QUOTE=MrClen;2411325]I think I got the "clap" from a girl in the massage parlor upstairs, but not sure. Anyway, Thermae's at the time as I remember was exactly like your post. Yes it was small, (had booths in those days), I remember them well. I still have a scar on my head from being hit with a beer bottle from a deaf girl who I been with before who thought I was hers. Never went to the "Grace" that I remember, of course some of those days are a blur. Many nights after bar hours, there were so many girls that Thermae was crowded with only standing room. While definitely not a "rich Farang" there was never a problem finding a girl for the night, the only problems was remembering which you had taken before and trying not to piss them off if you didn't ask again. Several nights I left alone as it just got too questionable and confrontational to pick one.

Going back a long way to remember so may not be exact! As you went in there were booths to the left and we usually sat in the second booth. If girls happened to be in the booth they made room or the "boy" would tell them to get up for us. Regulars had a few perks in those days![/QUOTE]I had fun with Thermae Soapy girls, once taking out 4 girls from Southern Thailand to an entertainment venue: Neung, Noi, Ew, and? My god they were extremely rowdy when drunk in the taxi. I had trouble to follow their southern dialect. Also attended the Thermae Soapy New Year party in late 1991 (like a Christmas party). Many regulars were Thais or Chinese.

I don't remember the old Thermae Coffee shop being small, but I guess certainly smaller than the current location. Wasn't cramped. I was usually standing up in there. Usually entered from the toilets area at the back. I do remember many times a guy would approach a girl and then go away (1991). Seemed to be slow to get a match and the deal done, or maybe guys were approaching but as yet undecided. I might ask my buddy why that was. Were the girls choosy, or guys stingy? I did not seem to have problems myself in those days but get plenty of non interested girls in the modern day. Maybe just an old sour face.

I liked repeating great girls, so no problems with switching girls. More disappointed when desired girls did not show up, having got enough money for their urgent need.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2411252]I wasn't really around at the time of the move, but my buddy who first went in about 1977 suggests it only moved once. You would need to specify the other location that is not just outside of Soi 13 and next to Miami Hotel.

It is possible there was an interim place for a short time, after mouth of Soi 13 closure, but I have no info on that, and the histories don't seem to mention it.[/QUOTE]I was mainly staying and partying around Patpong in those days so only went to Suk occasionally, so I wasn't really familiar with the soi setup back then. It was just one of those thoughts that popped into my head when I read about Thermae moving. I strangely recall it may have been in Clinton plaza for a bit, that was the place the was built and pulled down after 18 months or so.

Anyone, been spending most of the past 20+ years travelling ad living in SEA, so the old times (and me getting older) are becoming more of a blur.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2411248]So you understand choosing was hard at first. I really liked both girls.

Yes in those days almost all the girls looked natural. Noses tended to be broader than what I go for now. My girl had a cheeky look too, like she knew she was "hot" with amazing high and wide slung natural almost Dee cup tits no sag. To use a western toilet, she perched / squated on the seat to pee. Ha ha. It was a sexy look too.

The two girls were the best looking in the place for my taste at the time, I think. I certainly would not have chased any average ones. Not stunning for the faces, but very acceptable for those that like a real Thai look which is what I was getting used to. Today's Thermae girls don't have this look, for the hair, for the nose, and tend to have a lot of surgeries and a more fake / plastic look, certainly looking closer to western looks.[/QUOTE]Those two girls would be the best looking girls in Thermae today. (for my taste).

Yes, I heavily lean toward natural look and both of these girls are naturally very pretty. If one or both had a great natural rack, then you achieved Thai Valhalla.

I used to know a guy (alas passed away) who was an expat in BKK and specialized in finding Thai girls with big natural breasts.

The way the girls style themselves and put makeup on for the Asian mongers in Thermae is a big turnoff for me. But hey, I understand. They're not dressing for ME.... But for Haruto or Jin Ho.

interestingly enough.. my one Thermae girl who is very popular with Japanese clients.. is actually very natural looking, very little makeup but she is not Isaan farmgirl, has more Chinese features, slightly westernized and white skin.... though she has a big silicone rack.

Just goes to show when someone says there are lots of good looking girls in a place or the place is full of dogs always take that statement with a HUGE grain of salt.

If those 2 girls resembled the best looking Thai girls in the Good Old Days in the 1990's then I would have been going home alone and reminiscing about the Good Old Days in the 1960's! Not my type at all. I am a face guy and those 2 girls have extremely flat, wide African noses. No thanks. I prefer girls who have more of an European, JAV, or KPOP look.

This is an example of a natural looking Asian girl I would have went for in the late 1980s and early 1990s.

[QUOTE=BananaBoi;2411782]If those 2 girls resembled the best looking Thai girls in the Good Old Days in the 1990's then I would have been going home alone and reminiscing about the Good Old Days in the 1960's! Not my type at all. [/QUOTE]It was an example of the real Thai look (we got used it), and broad noses would have been common in the 1960's too, not much different. I was less fussy in those days coming from being used to average girls in home country.

The two girls were from Phitsanulok (mid North of Thailand).

They were the best for my taste at the time, but not for my Buddy who was with me. He had a different taste altogether. He liked voluptuous girls that I would call fat. Maybe some other girl in the room would have looked okay For your taste, who knows? I am much more fussy about nose shape these days, and GF does not have a broad nose nor nose surgery. Small upturned. I also never liked hook noses which are common in the modern day, with surgeries.

The girl in your pic, has a somewhat broad nose possibly reduced by surgery. Very few girls had nose jobs in 1991, I guess. Maybe your spec would have been difficult to find. Unfortunately your pic was very over exposed (washed out) losing a lot of detail so nose can only be seen very vaguely. Is it a girl you did from Thermae?

Many posters supposedly don't care about noses too much. Ha ha.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2411254]
If she knows the likely father, did not tell. It is not me. I was not around at the relevant time, and I do not do CIP anyway, due to high danger. I plan a vasectomy soon.
[/QUOTE]Vasectomy is highly recommended for every man who is certain that they don't want any more children. I got a vasectomy 20 years ago after my steady girlfriend secretly pulled off my condom while changing from missionary to cowgirl. Although she had 2 previous abortions, she told me she would keep the baby if I should get her pregnant because I'm such a nice guy. The next day I called a urologist and scheduled a vasectomy.

For those who have had vasectomies, you need to have them checked occasionally. It turns out that my first vasectomy failed after 1 or 2 years and I needed a second vasectomy. I learned of my problem through testing, nobody got pregnant.

The vasectomy procedure is simple. Very little agony, perhaps a little worse than having a small cavity filled, not nearly as much agony as having a tooth pulled.

I don't know whether I should post this report here or in the Stupid Things on the Internet thread. 555.

For the last 2 days I have been unable to open the ISG. I assumed it was a small connectivity problem on the other end and ISG would be back in business soon. I was experiencing no problems opening any of the other girly sites I like visit so I just went about my business.

Then 5 minutes ago after not getting through to the ISG once AGAIN, I logged onto NordVPN, my VPN app and chose the USA as my location and bingo: here I am. So what the fuck is going on? IS my internet provider suddenly censoring the ISG. That would be very peculiar since only the ISG is singled out. Additionally this lock out occurred on Chrome, Edge, and FireFox. Anybody got any ideas or experiencing the same issue?

Normally I only use NordVPN when I am traveling or when I am planning to download some porn and I want to sort of hide my location and identity. But if this ISG fail to connect BS is the new normal on my machine in my home, I guess I will use NordVPM all the time until I figure out what is going on. It is good to be back!

Natty,

Can't comment on USA of course but some Internet providers in Thailand disable ISG as well, and some Hotels. Generally I get worse internet service in Hotels, so I just use my phone Internet which is now MyCat, supposedly getting up to 6 Mbps non controlled and unlimited. Strangely my home internet (also CAT) in remote location is faster for magnet downloads (I don't use a normal TV in Thailand anymore), but weaker for interactive response time to another country. Don't quite understand, but just use the phone internet mostly. Its amazingly good even very remote.

Internet providers should be minding their own business.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2412429]I don't know whether I should post this report here or in the Stupid Things on the Internet thread. 555.

For the last 2 days I have been unable to open the ISG. I assumed it was a small connectivity problem on the other end and ISG would be back in business soon. I was experiencing no problems opening any of the other girly sites I like visit so I just went about my business.

Then 5 minutes ago after not getting through to the ISG once AGAIN, I logged onto NordVPN, my VPN app and chose the USA as my location and bingo: here I am. So what the fuck is going on? IS my internet provider suddenly censoring the ISG. That would be very peculiar since only the ISG is singled out. Additionally this lock out occurred on Chrome, Edge, and FireFox. Anybody got any ideas or experiencing the same issue?

Normally I only use NordVPN when I am traveling or when I am planning to download some porn and I want to sort of hide my location and identity. But if this ISG fail to connect BS is the new normal on my machine in my home, I guess I will use NordVPM all the time until I figure out what is going on. It is good to be back![/QUOTE]The only time I use a VPN is to fool Amazon or watch NBC or Fox Sports. Or when I am in China. It matters not to me about porn, I leave my location history on and don't hide my searches so my heirs can review same and understand exactly how much of a low life I really am.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2412429]For the last 2 days I have been unable to open the ISG. I assumed it was a small connectivity problem on the other end and ISG would be back in business soon. I was experiencing no problems opening any of the other girly sites I like visit so I just went about my business.[/QUOTE]I had simmilar issue in the USA. There was at least 24 hours where ISG was not available through my laptop, iPhone, or iPad. I tried the iPhone using both my home WiFi and my cellular data plan. Nothing worked. No VPN was used. At the same time, the sister site, USASexGuide.nl, was working fine. Now, everything works fine.

[QUOTE=Syzygies;2412455]
Internet providers should be minding their own business.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=HorseTrader;2412536]I had simmilar issue in the USA. There was at least 24 hours where ISG was not available through my laptop, iPhone, or iPad. I tried the iPhone using both my home WiFi and my cellular data plan. Nothing worked. No VPN was used. At the same time, the sister site, USASexGuide.nl, was working fine. Now, everything works fine.[/QUOTE]This is the error message I was receiving when I tried to connect to the ISG:

Internationalsexguide. NL took too long to respond.

Try:

Checking the connection.

Checking the proxy and the firewall.

Running Windows Network Diagnostics.

ERR_CONNECTION_TIMED_OUT.

As I reported, the problem disappeared immediately after I signed onto my VPN app and chose a different IP address. But later that night, it came to me that somehow my real IP address had been flagged or blacklisted for this particular site. That sounds crazy, but what other explanation could there be? Anyway, before I was about to call AT&T tech support, my internet provider, to report the problem and ask them to switch my port and / or assign me a new dynamic IP, I decided to unplug my AT&T gateway modem for 30 minutes to flush its memory, which I did. Then when I powered the damn thing back up, voila, the connect problem was gone and I was able to connect to ISG without using the VPN app. Case Closed. Happy Happy Happy!

[QUOTE=Nyezhov;2412468]The only time I use a VPN is to fool Amazon or watch NBC or Fox Sports. Or when I am in China. It matters not to me about porn, I leave my location history on and don't hide my searches so my heirs can review same and understand exactly how much of a low life I really am.[/QUOTE]555! I don't care what my heirs think about my infatuation with young Asian hookers or my preference for Japanese Lesbian porn as they spend their inheritances which I will eventually leave them. I am pretty sure my tastes and life style is way beyond what they can even imagine, the poor, beguiled, confused, little woke-tards, bless their tiny weeny California hearts. Ha Ha. But I am cautious about revealing where I go and what I do on the internet to unknown dark lurkers out there. VPN apps and other apps designed to help surf the web as anonymously as possible are a good thing, IMHO, although nothing is foolproof.

But you are right, in practical terms one of the most useful things about VPN apps is their ability to get around local government censorship like the one in Communist China. I wouldn't leave home without a VPN app on my phone or laptop.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2412771]That sounds crazy, but what other explanation could there be?[/QUOTE]The server is in Malaysia, we were having a DDoS issue for awhile. I haven't been in the US for ages and I was having the same issue. Sometimes VPN's just work better, I dunno why, sometimes they make it slow as shit too.

I have seen it for awhile so I think whatever anti prostitution group that was hitting us stopped.

On a separate issue I have an old style little head 100 dollar bill that I can't change anywhere (haven't been in the US in ages) which anybody could use or deposit anywhere in the land of the big PX. If you're headed back that way and want to do me a solid I'll come to you and take baht (or a new 100 bill). There's nothing wrong with the bill, it's not even marked up, it's just old style and nobody wants it anywhere.

You can PM me at Admin2 if you can hook a brother up. I (actually secretary) will come to you, all you need do is have 3000 baht.

A2.

[QUOTE=NattyBumpo;2412429]I don't know whether I should post this report here or in the Stupid Things on the Internet thread. 555.

For the last 2 days I have been unable to open the ISG. I assumed it was a small connectivity problem on the other end and ISG would be back in business soon. I was experiencing no problems opening any of the other girly sites I like visit so I just went about my business.

Then 5 minutes ago after not getting through to the ISG once AGAIN, I logged onto NordVPN, my VPN app and chose the USA as my location and bingo: here I am. So what the fuck is going on? IS my internet provider suddenly censoring the ISG. That would be very peculiar since only the ISG is singled out. Additionally this lock out occurred on Chrome, Edge, and FireFox. Anybody got any ideas or experiencing the same issue?

Normally I only use NordVPN when I am traveling or when I am planning to download some porn and I want to sort of hide my location and identity. But if this ISG fail to connect BS is the new normal on my machine in my home, I guess I will use NordVPM all the time until I figure out what is going on. It is good to be back![/QUOTE]Not sure where you tried ISG from but it is indeed censored in many countries. My country, Bangladesh has it censored, I faced similar issue last time I visited Singapore and also Indonesia. Fortunately I have 2 good VPNs (Proton and Pure), both work fine if I select USA or Ozzie server.

Hey all,

I figure this might be the best sub forum to post this discussion in. I've seen similar discussions in the report sections, but thought the lounge might be a better place given it's not a report.

Currently, August round trip flights out of O'Hate are less than $600 during the month of August & September.

What are your all's thoughts? Think things will be open for travel by then? Things starting to get back to normal?

I figure if anything, flight can be refunded, voucher given, or credit for the future.

Hope you all are well and staying safe during this trying time.

Warm regards.

Almond.

[QUOTE=Almond812;2443816]..
Currently, August round trip flights out of O'Hate are less than $600 during the month of August & September.

What are your all's thoughts? Think things will be open for travel by then? Things starting to get back to normal?

I figure if anything, flight can be refunded, voucher given, or credit for the future.

[/QUOTE]I noticed something similar for my location to Bangkok in October. Price was low, so I was tempted to buy now. Unlimited schedule changes were allowed, but, there was a time limit when all your flights had to be completed (I think maybe January). If things aren't better by then, you could get stuck with unusable airline tickets. Be sure to check the details for refunds. I didn't buy.

I also worry that some of the airlines may not survive.

[QUOTE=ArifBD;2424572]Not sure where you tried ISG from but it is indeed censored in many countries. My country, Bangladesh has it censored, I faced similar issue last time I visited Singapore and also Indonesia. Fortunately I have 2 good VPNs (Proton and Pure), both work fine if I select USA or Ozzie server.[/QUOTE]Indeed, I'm in the LOS and left an ISG tab open on my tablet. The next morning I had one of those messages asking me to complete a captcha as a result of "suspicious activity detected on your network".

Thai authorities disapprove of certain content and actively monitor traffic to detect such. Use those VPNs!

[QUOTE=Almond812;2443816]Hey all,
Currently, August round trip flights out of O'Hate are less than $600 during the month of August & September. What are your all's thoughts? Think things will be open for travel by then? Things starting to get back to normal?

I figure if anything, flight can be refunded, voucher given, or credit for the future.

Hope you all are well and staying safe during this trying time.

Warm regards.

Almond.[/QUOTE]Out of Chicago, so I assume you are talking about a United ticket. I rescheduled my original April flight with United for mid August a month ago. Mid August was the farthest out departure date United was willing to reschedule me for at that time.

Know one knows what the situation will be like in Mid August. If flights are still grounded I am sure I will be able to reschedule once again. But if the flight is not cancelled and Thailand has a 14 day quarantine period for new foreign arrivals I will most likely be screwed ie no refund or reschedule.

I don't expect Thailand will be back to it's good old ways by mid August. That is too soon to expect a full return back to normal. I expect many bars will never re-open although some will hopefully be open again by mid August. Same Same for massage parlors. I expect many restaurants may not make it either. Social distancing & temperature checks will be enforced at all mall entrances, hotels, brick and mortar restaurants, and nightclubs. I do expect that there will be lots of available girls and not many tourists in mid August. It will be interesting. Adventurous Punters will have to be flexible and adapt under these unusual circumstances.

So bottom line I will go in mid August because I miss the girls and I am getting tired of living in the USA, but I will only go if:
#1. My flight is not cancelled
#2. The Thai government allows American Citizens in for 30 days with no quarantine,
#3. Both BKK & Pattaya have free mobility intra city and inter city, and
#4. The USA will allow my unfettered return.

Unfortunately all 4 of my criteria are big ifs at this moment, but I am somewhat hopeful things will work out and I will be able to go. I think that although Thailand will be a very different place in Mid August / September and definitely not fully recovered, I think it might be really great and uniquely memorable in many unforeseen ways in the immediate post Pandemic period.

[QUOTE=HorseTrader;2444115]If things aren't better by then, you could get stuck with unusable airline tickets. Be sure to check the details for refunds..[/QUOTE]Yeah I learned that the hard way years ago. Now I book everything through American Express Travel. If there's an issue they deal with it. I called and asked and it's a guaranteed refund if the airline cancels, or I can do a credit voucher.

Best.

Almond.

I have Proton and others, but for ease of use, I really have grown to like Surf Shark, which has a browser extension for my laptop and tablet. One click, and it's running.

[QUOTE=Chacal60;2444119]Indeed, I'm in the LOS and left an ISG tab open on my tablet. The next morning I had one of those messages asking me to complete a captcha as a result of "suspicious activity detected on your network".

Thai authorities disapprove of certain content and actively monitor traffic to detect such. Use those VPNs![/QUOTE]

Can I visit the Bangkok Thai Immigration Bureau office and pay the 1900 baht fee to extend my visa another 30 days the same day I arrive Thailand resulting in a 60 day total? Or only at the tail end of the first 30 days winding down? Can anyone speak from experience how long the process takes at the Bureau office?

Is there health insurance that can be acquired that would allow you to move from country to country without having to sign up for different policies? For example if you wanted to stay in Thailand for three months and then move to the Philippines for three months and then move back to Thailand for a short time.

[QUOTE=Breadman;2451221]Is there health insurance that can be acquired that would allow you to move from country to country without having to sign up for different policies? For example if you wanted to stay in Thailand for three months and then move to the Philippines for three months and then move back to Thailand for a short time.[/QUOTE]Yes. Look for policies geared towards resident expat workers who travel.

Cheers. G.

[QUOTE=Goferring;2451239]Yes. Look for policies geared towards resident expat workers who travel.[/QUOTE]I have Cigna expat insurance but it isn't cheap. I have evacuation coverage included in mine which is quite a bit of the premium but you may not need it. World Nomads is a popular one.

Alright, so I came across some videos on PornHub of these guys who made these videos about mongering in BKK and Pattaya in the 90's and they were selling tours and teaching people how to retire there. They were cheesy as hell, but they were probably about as good as it got for a mid-90's indie project in Thailand. Interesting to look back on what things were like 20-30 years ago before everyone had a camera. Anyhow, I'm curious, what happened to these guys? I did some Google searching and I can hardly find any information. It looks like there was a 60 Minutes interview with one of the guys in 1996 about his book, but other than that, it looks like there were some crusaders out for their heads and then nothing. Does anybody know anything about these dudes?

Peter V. Stanton aka Mac Horn aka the Asia Answerman (His Santa Monica company was PVS Publishing. The address is a UPS Store now.) Wrote the book: A Gentleman's Guide to the Exotic Women of Southeast Asia and maybe another one called Thailand 2000.

Eric Dexter is the guy in the videos explaining things.

Not sure if they had anything to do with ExoticThaiVacations (it's watermarked on their PH videos) or TheManTour, but it was the same business idea.

I'm just curious what happened. They seem to have just vanished. Did they just abandon the business? Did the crusaders get them? Were they into nefarious things and get arrested? Something else interesting?

[QUOTE=Paco1013;2470168]Alright, so I came across some videos on PornHub of these guys who made these videos about mongering in BKK and Pattaya in the 90's and they were selling tours and teaching people how to retire there. They were cheesy as hell, but they were probably about as good as it got for a mid-90's indie project in Thailand. Interesting to look back on what things were like 20-30 years ago before everyone had a camera. Anyhow, I'm curious, what happened to these guys? I did some Google searching and I can hardly find any information. It looks like there was a 60 Minutes interview with one of the guys in 1996 about his book, but other than that, it looks like there were some crusaders out for their heads and then nothing. Does anybody know anything about these dudes?

Peter V. Stanton aka Mac Horn aka the Asia Answerman (His Santa Monica company was PVS Publishing. The address is a UPS Store now.) Wrote the book: A Gentleman's Guide to the Exotic Women of Southeast Asia and maybe another one called Thailand 2000.

Eric Dexter is the guy in the videos explaining things.

Not sure if they had anything to do with ExoticThaiVacations (it's watermarked on their PH videos) or TheManTour, but it was the same business idea.

I'm just curious what happened. They seem to have just vanished. Did they just abandon the business? Did the crusaders get them? Were they into nefarious things and get arrested? Something else interesting?[/QUOTE]I've never been to Pornhub and don't know the guys you mentioned. My guess is they just got old, got tired of the p4 p scene every night, maybe made their money, and got out. My Thailand experience started with visiting a now defunct website called Travel and the Single Male (TSM) back in the mid-late 90's. They would occasionally schedule meet ups in Thailand. I attended one of those on my first trip and met some of the guys to hit the gogos together. Best trip ever. Do we have any TSMers on ISG? The website owner made a ton of money (I believe) on that website but got into trouble over some negative reporting that was false and misleading. He was permanently barred from returning to Thailand. He is the only one I know that got into trouble but surely there were others.

[QUOTE=Allover;2470246]I've never been to Pornhub and don't know the guys you mentioned. My guess is they just got old, got tired of the p4 p scene every night, maybe made their money, and got out. [/QUOTE]Unfortunately, most of the really old trailblazers died out. Either litterally from drinking themselves to death or figuratively from making enemies of the wrong people and being forced away. A significant number also found them selves on the wrong side of the law and in jail or banished for good. Drugs, gangbang rings or too much of a good thing feature highly.

This a shame that not many lasted to tell their stories because I'm sure they would have had many to tell. 😁.

G.

[QUOTE=Paco1013;2470168]Alright, so I came across some videos on PornHub of these guys who made these videos about mongering in BKK and Pattaya in the 90's and they were selling tours and teaching people how to retire there. They were cheesy as hell, but they were probably about as good as it got for a mid-90's indie project in Thailand. Interesting to look back on what things were like 20-30 years ago before everyone had a camera. Anyhow, I'm curious, what happened to these guys? I did some Google searching and I can hardly find any information. It looks like there was a 60 Minutes interview with one of the guys in 1996 about his book, but other than that, it looks like there were some crusaders out for their heads and then nothing. Does anybody know anything about these dudes?

Peter V. Stanton aka Mac Horn aka the Asia Answerman (His Santa Monica company was PVS Publishing. The address is a UPS Store now.) Wrote the book: A Gentleman's Guide to the Exotic Women of Southeast Asia and maybe another one called Thailand 2000.

Eric Dexter is the guy in the videos explaining things.

Not sure if they had anything to do with ExoticThaiVacations (it's watermarked on their PH videos) or TheManTour, but it was the same business idea.

I'm just curious what happened. They seem to have just vanished. Did they just abandon the business? Did the crusaders get them? Were they into nefarious things and get arrested? Something else interesting?[/QUOTE]I bought some of their books and VHS videos when I was vacationing and mongering regularly in Asia during the 90's and already planning to retire early and live here. I didn't pack and bring the books with me when I finally did move to Thailand about 8 years ago but I did think to transfer some of my favorite VHS videos of theirs to DVD. I suppose I still have them somewhere in a storage box in a closet or cabinet around here.

I enjoyed them. I would often see "Beautiful Asian Girls" pop up and featured in their videos that I had fucked on one of my recent vacations to the Philippines or Thailand in those days.

I happened to run into both of those guys in Angeles City around that time, sitting in Margarita Station cafe on Field Ave. Just enough to tell them I was a fan of their books and videos, chat a bit about the scene at the moment and so on.

As I recall, either one or both of them got banned from Thailand for what they showed in those videos. Or almost were. I could be wrong about that. But I assumed the trouble was one reason they stopped producing any videos because they both were trying to live a life of leisure in Asia.

Oh, the other thing was the funny, chubby one with a mustache (don't remember the name he used) pitched a plan to live for the rest of your life in the Philippines or Thailand in one of those videos. And the centerpiece of the plan was to get together $100,000 USD and put it in an interest bearing account or stock market fund of your choice, whatever. Then all you had to do was pull out about $10,000 USD per year, which in those days was enough to squeak by on rent, food and some GF and paid pussy in those countries. In fact, maybe just $90,000 USD would be enough.

Of course, in his scenario the bank interest, stock market or whatever would always grow to replace that $10,000 USD every year, your initial $100,000 or maybe $90,000 USD would never really diminish much, costs in those countries would never really rise much, you'd never need to fly out of those countries or pay for medical issues in your old age and viola, you're set for life! Easy Peasy! LOL.

That was in the mid 1990's, before the Bear Market Crash of 2001, the bigger Bear Market Crash of 2008, etc.

Actually, those guys did cross my mind in the 2000's because I honestly wondered how their initial $100,000/$90,000 USD Life Retirement Income base was working for them by then. And by now since the USA stock market has had 2 Bear Market Crashes and essentially gone nowhere over the past 2 1/2 years.