Bangkok Reports

[Goatscrot]

And Mr. Tooms knows this is true, I am merely an occasional visitor and it did not take me long to learn this. He knows better.

When reading Tooms post, what stands out to me is that he was ok with a BBBJCIM as "everything. " And he was even patient and tried to actually communicate and show the gal what he wanted. She still didn't get it. I think he was well within to do what he did. And he was quite clear about it from the start. I'll take the opposite view of some on this thread. If we all demanded better performance and were willing to walk and pay less than agreed upon if we didn't get it, then we be getting better service overall. The gals are going to try to get away with providing as little as possible, especially FLs. I pretty much stopped taking FLs quite some time ago as I had a string of non-performers, and yes I make it known what I expect up front. I tell them in Thai, I expect you to f#ck me the way you f#ck your gig / BF or like we are in a "sex movie. ".

[Goatscrot]

Exactly. These guys who enjoy DATY (licking another guy's cum out of a girl's pussy) and DFK (licking another guy's cum out of a girl's mouth) with prostitutes have a different mindset.

A quick shower and she might as well be a virgin. For me, sex is about the entire experience. DFK, DATY, rimming the gal, etc, are all part of the experience. I enjoy all of them, just as much as I enjoy them being done to me. Sometimes it is nice to lay back and get "serviced," but for me that is not often. I like taking the lead and directing the session.

[Turgid]

I have to say of all the posts that I have read through the years yours has been the only one that I thought upsetting enough to register just to answer it. I've been scammed by girls not delivering on what was promised with really shit attitudes, poor service, doing the runners etc but I've just accepted it as a part of life and carried on. That's going with the flow. You learn to be smart by not paying the girls upfront and negotiating quite clearly what they are up for and the consequences if they don't perform. Seeing how you behaved I can understand why girls want upfront payment now.

Not only wanting full upfront payment but providing bad service to farangs. A scammed girl will tell her friends who will tell others. Who knows in the future there may be many more ISG reports of poor service by Thai hookers and longing for the good old days.

[EihTooms]

...

Re Mr. Tooms and the discussion with Mr. Croc, I'm sorry Mr. Tooms, though I am in some ways a "fellow traveler", I think you are being at least somewhat disingenuous.

You, more than anyone else should really know that "do everything for you". (a very common line) means "do everything, but you wear a condom and you don't put it in my butt".

(frankly, I actually assume, oral or an attempt at such, a massage, and standard vaginal but covered sex in positions you want) (that's what a typical Thai girl would consider "everything")

Cannot comment on CIM, but I'll take Mr. Tooms word for it.

So, when I hear "make you happy, do everything for you", and all such and related lines I already KNOW that it means covered (sometimes even for oral, so I would immediately check on that) and I know it means no anal.

Many of these girls speak limited English, this is a standard line, they all learn from each other.

I will often playfully raise my eyebrow and say "anything / everything " ???? And then often the qualifications come out and I laugh and say "but I thought you said "everything". And the girls with a sense of humor will chuckle about it as well. Sometimes when so challenged they will nonetheless will repeat "everything", and being the skeptic that I am, I will of course say, "anal"?? and that is immediately shot down. LOL

So please, everyone. When you hear "everything for you, to make you happy", blah blah, it means covered and it means no anal. Or best said. Assume that, and if you want more, then very directly and specifically inquire about "additional service (s)".

And Mr. Tooms knows this is true, I am merely an occasional visitor and it did not take me long to learn this. He knows better.

Sorry, Catire, but I do not agree with that at all. Sure, I have playfully engaged in the "Everything?" exchange with the girls, too, and many times I have still heard no mention of condom. I suppose we could devote an entire thread to what, subjectively in each and every case, is taken by some mongers and hookers as "standard service" in Thailand.

These girls know very well the little scam they hope they are pulling when they pitch themselves as giving you "Everything" for the money in order to get you to take them and then start laying out rules in the room, especially with regard to condom or no condom. Which, as I said, the girls will tell you is one of if not the most often requested service.

How do I know the girls know they are pulling a little scam with that "Everything, up to you" bit? It is right there in my initial report, although I can understand why many might miss it because I did not highlight the point.

The girls always give away a "tell" as big as a city bus that they know they tried to pull a little scam. I have done what I described in that report several times over the years and in every case the "tell" is the same. And here it is; Not one time did the girl make the argument or even allude to the argument that the reason I should give her more money, the full 2,500 baht agreed upon, is because I had told her that is what I would pay her in the bar. Not once. Instead, the only argument she had for me giving her more than the 1,000 baht I had already given her was "for taxi" (which happens even when we give them every baht that was agreed upon) and simply because she needed more money.

In other words, as she continued to ask me for more money on the way down the soi afterwards, she was really only asking me to give her a "gift" of more money, not to pay "what you said" in the bar. She knew very well what she'd hoped I would infer by her "Everything" pitch. Not once did she make that other point or even vaguely allude to it. As has been the case with all of the others who pulled that little scam and got a reduced payment for it, she never expressed even the least bit of anger, never raised her voice, not even the slightest emotional outburst about my not paying the full amount I agreed to pay her to "make me happy". She got busted on her scam, that's all. And she knew it. Her problem was I held her to what she knew I would think I was buying when she "sold" that idea to me in the bar. And she was fully aware that was her problem.

When we get scammed by the girls in the bars who ask for a Ladydrink and then order a non-existent "coke and tequila" cocktail, but it turns out they just ordered two Ladydinks for themselves, we have the right, some might say a duty, to protest and demand the amount be adjusted downward when the bill is handed to us afterwards, correct? I have done that. I know others have as well. Again, in NO case has the girl who pulled that scam dared to "act dumb" about it and try to make a passionate case that, "Hey, mister! You SAID you'd buy me drink!! Why you not pay all?" LOL. Of course not. Because they know they are the ones who pulled a scam, not the customer, not me. The customer is not acting in "bad faith" or stiffing the girl or the bar by getting that bill amount adjusted downward after that little scam has been pulled on him. And everyone involved knows it.

The "Everything, up to you, I will make you happy" bit is no different. Some of you nice fellows are way under estimating these Thai hookers' understanding of the word games they play in order to bait and switch or otherwise scam a customer into paying more and getting less. Many times it is done by them only for sport, not even for desperate need for money, btw.

[Smoothy]

Pronunciation lessons in Bangkok thread. Great.

Use a translator as it will phonetically spell it out and likely more accurate than what you'll find here.

Who said we were going for phoneticall precision? "So what the crap" works when it's said quickly and without much annunciation. I think that's awesome. I don't say it like that in the office, but at bars I do.

[Smoothy]

[Deleted by Admin]

EDITOR'S NOTE: This report was redacted or deleted to remove sections of the report that were largely argumentative. Please read the Forum FAQ and the Forum's Posting Guidelines for more information. Thank You!

[Catire]

Completely agree with Mr. Chizzle re "Caveat Emptor". It seems that many people constantly forget this iron law of P4 P, along with YMMV.

Re Mr. Tooms and the discussion with Mr. Croc, I'm sorry Mr. Tooms, though I am in some ways a "fellow traveler", I think you are being at least somewhat disingenuous.

You, more than anyone else should really know that "do everything for you". (a very common line) means "do everything, but you wear a condom and you don't put it in my butt".

(frankly, I actually assume, oral or an attempt at such, a massage, and standard vaginal but covered sex in positions you want) (that's what a typical Thai girl would consider "everything")

Cannot comment on CIM, but I'll take Mr. Tooms word for it.

So, when I hear "make you happy, do everything for you", and all such and related lines I already KNOW that it means covered (sometimes even for oral, so I would immediately check on that) and I know it means no anal.

Many of these girls speak limited English, this is a standard line, they all learn from each other.

I will often playfully raise my eyebrow and say "anything / everything " ???? And then often the qualifications come out and I laugh and say "but I thought you said "everything". And the girls with a sense of humor will chuckle about it as well. Sometimes when so challenged they will nonetheless will repeat "everything", and being the skeptic that I am, I will of course say, "anal"?? and that is immediately shot down. LOL

So please, everyone. When you hear "everything for you, to make you happy", blah blah, it means covered and it means no anal. Or best said. Assume that, and if you want more, then very directly and specifically inquire about "additional service (s)".

And Mr. Tooms knows this is true, I am merely an occasional visitor and it did not take me long to learn this. He knows better.

[Byron2001]

Not surprisingly, I disagree that I broke the deal and stiffed her. In terms of sexual satisfaction, she broke the deal with me. She said she would make me happy for 2,500 baht without asking what that meant to me. As far as I could tell anything and everything I wanted, up to me, was on the menu. She had plenty of time to say otherwise before we left the bar, outside the bar and on the taxi ride to my room. I was willing to forego FS entirely without pressuring her by accepting a conventional option, BBBJ+CIM, which she agreed to do, quite enthusiastically I might add.

Is BBBJ+CIM considered standard service among Thai hookers? I would say the majority of Thai hookers I have met in go-go bars, in the clubs, on the street, etc include BBBJ+CIM on their menu. And, once agreed upon, I submit only half-assed pretending to give a BJ for 6-7 minutes, ignoring or refusing to adjust to some simple motor skill moves to accommodate what works for me and clearly trying to change the subject every other minute would not be defined by most as "good faith" or keeping her side of the deal.

Aside from that particular incident, the girls tell me punters are constantly asking them for BBFS. I have no doubt the girl I took from Thermae has been hit up for it many, many times. I would therefore submit that as long as the girls know that is a service much desired and likely to be asked for by their customers who want to be "made happy", it is 100% on them to start addressing it before or during their sales pitch or else they are playing games with the issue and not presenting their offer to "make you happy" in good faith..

I have to say of all the posts that I have read through the years yours has been the only one that I thought upsetting enough to register just to answer it. I've been scammed by girls not delivering on what was promised with really shit attitudes, poor service, doing the runners etc but I've just accepted it as a part of life and carried on. That's going with the flow. You learn to be smart by not paying the girls upfront and negotiating quite clearly what they are up for and the consequences if they don't perform. Seeing how you behaved I can understand why girls want upfront payment now.

[Kickoffs]

Pronunciation lessons in Bangkok thread. Great.

Use a translator as it will phonetically spell it out and likely more accurate than what you'll find here.

[T Chizzle]

Gents,

TLDR; Farangs not that high in the clientele chain; one action of another could cause disagreeable effects for others; hate barfines; Thermae 2.5 k average price; you should be able to find someone in Bangkok.

Here are some insights based on my recent discussions with some working girls here in Bangkok. Some of you who are pros in the city may agree and are probably aware already; some of you may have differing opinions. This is just my personal observation and Bangkok report based on my recent time here in the city.

Based on my impression from what I gather, the pecking order for how the Thai girls would prefer the ethnicity of their foreign clients are (in order): Japanese, Korean, Westerners (farangs), Chinese / Arabs / Indians; Westerners are unfortunately just slightly better than the Chinese. Strange; considering the majority of tourists here are the Chinese, but I guess these Thai girls still don't see them in good of a light as you would think. And I'm not certain whether or not the Arabs / Indians would fall below or above the Chinese; their issue seems be related to lack of personal hygiene.

Unfortunately, any past negative encounters caused by a certain race of clients causes future repercussions and possible negative assessments for future clients from whatever ethnicity that caused the negative experiences. Just as we (mongerers) have an avenue to 'gossip' online and on these forums, these Thai girls also like to gossip and relay feedback to their friends about their experiences with different types of clients. I hate to get myself stereotyped for possibly being a potentially bad client based on a previously bad experience that someone else (who happens to be of the same ethnicity) has caused on a girl; and now her friends' friends' friends might have the same prejudice. But this is the reality here it would seem; getting prejudged based on other experiences unrelated to you. And something that I learned here in Bangkok is that if the girl quotes you anything more than 3 k, then most likely she is not that interested in going with you.

I've always approached this hobby with a 'caveat emptor'-like mentality. Although I can't control mutual chemistry or a girl's performance (and have encountered several bad experiences in the past in different parts of the world), some things that I can control are my personal attitude and respect towards the girl and choosing someone that physically attracts me. By only choosing attractive girls, I know that I've limited my potential to find more good performers. What I mean is it's in the same way that someone using Tinder swipes right to all photos; they've increased their odds for mutual connection. Whereas I would only swipe right to only girls that I actually find attractive; my odds become less. In the same way with connecting with pros, I'd like to have both attractiveness and good performance. Though based on the great number of pros working in Bangkok, there's definitely potential to find those hidden gems that provide both attractiveness and good performance. So far in Bangkok, I've only had a couple bad experiences. But for those bad experiences, I think I was able to leave a neutral to positive impression for the girl (even though my experience wasn't all that great). There's only so much I can control.

Something that I'm not too fond of here is this gogo barfine system; seems rather pimp-ish to me. I'm coming from the German FKK system of things. And with the FKK way of things, paying an entrance fee to use a facility (sauna, pool, etc.) seems more reasonable. Whereas here, I'm paying some fee that seems ridiculous (at least I feel like it's ridiculous). Maybe if by paying the barfine also meant free alcoholic beverages or something, then I'd probably be okay with it.

Another visit to Thermae gave me a chance to casually talk with some of the girls. Anytime a girl approached me, I would say that I was married and was only there to drink and observe. This allowed some time to have some simple conversations with the girls. 2 k-3 k is what I was being quoted by the girls I talked with and I tried to hit all areas of the room to determine if there were any great pricing gaps. I don't know if getting one of these girls (initially) under 2 k is possible. I think you would have to establish some kind of long-term rapport with the girl and become her regular before that's possible. From what I've seen on the 'Sideline'Finfin' sites, the girls are offering services (to their Thai natives) at an average of 1. 5 k. Also the clientele at Thermae is definitely close to 98 percent Asian. If you're a Farang, I would say that going to Thermae would make you definitely stand out in the crowd and you may be considered lower in the pecking order as an ideal client.

But overall and based on the great number of pros working in Bangkok, there's definitely potential to find those hidden gems here in the city that should meet your expectations.

TC.

[D Cups]

You dared to challenge Syzygies?

He has more than 12000 posts and he knows.

What are you thinking Smoothy?

People say what D cup to me all the time!

[Ixgzca]

Yeh they get very used Farangs that cannot even pronounce Sawat Dee Khup. Its actually far closer if you say "What Dee Cup?" "Crap" does just not cut it and sounds quite silly.

Can be "Cup" or Crup but Crap is clearly bad pronunciation to the Thai listener, even if not to you. Subtle vowel changes are unnoticed in English, but destroy Thai words.

Farangs can't even pronounce Pattaya or Phuket.

Is it news that foreigners have an accent when saying Thai words and that Thais have an accent when saying foreign words? What's the world coming to? 😂😂😂

[EihTooms]

Props to you for not giving her all the money in advance. That never works out well.

On the other hand, BBFS is NOT a standard service. IMHO, pressuring a young woman to risk her health (and possibly life) for sake of a few minutes of your pleasure is just plain wrong. If you agree to it in advance, I guess that's fine, but if you don't, you can't expect it. As for the BBBJ, she seems like she had the will, but no skills. She did give you a BBBJ, crappy as it was, and she did not try to back out of the deal, you're the one who finished the session after she refused BBFS.

Personally, I think 1000 baht is more than enough for what you received. However, if you agreed on 2500 baht, I think she acted in good faith (albeit was not a good performer), you broke the deal and stiffed her. The experience will certainly encourage her to insist on money in advance from other punters.

Not surprisingly, I disagree that I broke the deal and stiffed her. In terms of sexual satisfaction, she broke the deal with me. She said she would make me happy for 2,500 baht without asking what that meant to me. As far as I could tell anything and everything I wanted, up to me, was on the menu. She had plenty of time to say otherwise before we left the bar, outside the bar and on the taxi ride to my room. I was willing to forego FS entirely without pressuring her by accepting a conventional option, BBBJ+CIM, which she agreed to do, quite enthusiastically I might add.

Is BBBJ+CIM considered standard service among Thai hookers? I would say the majority of Thai hookers I have met in go-go bars, in the clubs, on the street, etc include BBBJ+CIM on their menu. And, once agreed upon, I submit only half-assed pretending to give a BJ for 6-7 minutes, ignoring or refusing to adjust to some simple motor skill moves to accommodate what works for me and clearly trying to change the subject every other minute would not be defined by most as "good faith" or keeping her side of the deal.

Aside from that particular incident, the girls tell me punters are constantly asking them for BBFS. I have no doubt the girl I took from Thermae has been hit up for it many, many times. I would therefore submit that as long as the girls know that is a service much desired and likely to be asked for by their customers who want to be "made happy", it is 100% on them to start addressing it before or during their sales pitch or else they are playing games with the issue and not presenting their offer to "make you happy" in good faith.

In a world where they know one of if not the most desired and asked for services among their customers is BBFS, Thai hookers who pitch their wares with stuff like, "I will make you happy, no problem, anything, everything, up to you, don't worry", and just leave it at that without clarification and then do NOT offer a means to provide BBFS in the room are not acting in good faith. They are scammers.

I have had several girls say, "Everything, except BUTT SEX!" lol. Good for them. It proves they really do know how to include or exclude anything from their "Everything" sales pitch if it really does matter to them. If they don't also say, "Oh, and must wear condom for boom boom", then I am going to assume those girls aren't all that concerned about it. At the very least, I will conclude they want me to assume the most often requested service (by their own testimony), BBFS, is on the menu.

Let those scammers ask for all the money upfront. Only the suckers will comply and those suckers will get educated pretty fast. The rest of us will either try to help the little lady feel a bit better about proceeding by paying a much smaller amount upfront or (the really smart ones) will refuse to pay them anything at all and boot them out with nothing. Not the worst possible outcome for all concerned, imo.

[Crocodilexp]

I just did not feel like getting into the whole condom condom condom discussion on such a pleasant, relaxed evening with the weather so comfortable and all (I can fuck only without a condom). So I just smiled back and said ok. She said, "3,000 baht". I said 2,000. She said, "2,500". I said ok.

In the room, she sat on my couch, opened her purse and asked me for the 2,500 baht now. Nope. I'll pay after, jing jing, really.

Big smile, "Yes, I can suck you no condom. But must wear condom for boom boom" Oh, I understand. And you will finish me inside your mouth? "Yes, no problem. I want to make you happy. You are a good man and hansum. I like you very much. Suck no condom ok, but must wear condom for boom boom." Yes, got it, really, I am really ok with that. Then we don't need to talk about condoms anymore, right?

Props to you for not giving her all the money in advance. That never works out well.

On the other hand, BBFS is NOT a standard service. IMHO, pressuring a young woman to risk her health (and possibly life) for sake of a few minutes of your pleasure is just plain wrong. If you agree to it in advance, I guess that's fine, but if you don't, you can't expect it. As for the BBBJ, she seems like she had the will, but no skills. She did give you a BBBJ, crappy as it was, and she did not try to back out of the deal, you're the one who finished the session after she refused BBFS.

Personally, I think 1000 baht is more than enough for what you received. However, if you agreed on 2500 baht, I think she acted in good faith (albeit was not a good performer), you broke the deal and stiffed her. The experience will certainly encourage her to insist on money in advance from other punters.

[EihTooms]

Kudos to you for sticking to your guns. If more punters did, we'd all have a much better time of it. Too many dudes would just pay her the 2500 and she'd continue to hock that poor skill set.

Thanks. I believe most punters she has encountered must have been fine with fully covered FS and nothing more. To each his own. And for them, I suppose they wouldn't see anything "poor" about her skill set. If I had been fine with covered FS, I might never have noticed or taken it to a point where her poor skill set was an issue.

But I felt it necessary to start sticking to my guns on this bit where the girl pitches herself with things like, "I am very good, I will be good for you, I will make you happy, agree to pay me 2,500 baht and I will show you." LOL. Great! Nothing more needs to be said, then, right? Count me in for that.

Why is it now on me or any other punter for whom what happens in the room really does matter to negotiate further, to parse every word and syllable, to list, review, compare and contrast every act and move in detail just to make sure her idea of "happy" and "good for you" isn't miles away from what I am sure she hopes I will assume she means? Sure, if she had then said in the bar, "I mean I am good, will be good for you and will make you happy as long as you are happy wearing a condom for fucking and don't want me to do anything else," I would not have agreed to those terms. And I am guessing she knows all but the lowest demand customers would not agree to those terms. But she didn't say that.

Of course, this particular method of sticking to my guns in order to either be "made happy" in the room for the agreed upon amount of money or I will only pay a notably reduced amount for what I did get works best in a FL situation like Thermae. It isn't going to work that well if at all in a venue where it is Pay Upfront. It isn't going to work that well where you have already laid out an 800-1,000+ baht barfine and bought 800 baht worth of ladydrinks for a girl. If I give a girl in a situation like that another 1,000 baht for the same thing I gave the Thermae girl 1,000 baht, now I am out almost 3,000 baht if not more just to DATY and feel the inside of her mouth with my dick for 5 minutes. Not a good plan or a risk worth taking, imo. lol.

Before I commit to taking a girl from a place like that I would generally have to negotiate more details upfront and stick to my guns about not paying her fee in full if she doesn't deliver. Wish I didn't have to do it that way. But these days I do.