General Info

[Polyamorist]

Polyamorist. I share your heartfelt despair. The hardest thing as a native English speaker is to establish that I should get some respect from the girls. When I initiate contact in English as opposed to (bad) German or Romanian, the reaction is generally worse as it marks me down a a possible rich tourist used to paying inflated prices.

Na uzo billah, Optimist. To me it seems a bit crazy for Romanians to discriminate against non-locals because they themselves are very non-local and usually know little of the local culture- less than you or me.

Maybe the thing to do is speak English in a zany French accent. After all, Sir Ioja seems to have a good time. I'm thinking more Peter Sellers than Steve Martin.

[Chongmal]

So Germans and some kind of locals would use FKKs as washing machine for money?

For sure a majority of clubs are used for washing money, by the owners, not the clients. You missed my point slightly. These days there is not as much illegally earned untaxed cash in the hands of average citizens to spend in clubs. For sure the Dutch and German men found 4+ days per week in the same club have not all suddenly lost their appetites for sex. It's easy to tell a significant other that you are going to play golf with your friends and spend €110 for the golf, food and drinks. Excuses like that start failing when you return home less a couple hundred € every weekend and your significant other starts asking for explanations.

[ExpatLover]

Pistons,

You've been around the scene for some time and seem quite in tune with local trends. I would like to bump a theory from myself and some local friends that we believe has resulted in lower attendance by locals in clubs as well as a reduction in the amount of sessions per visit. I'm willing to hear from any others regarding the theory as well.

Our theory is that there is less untraced money in the hands of local men due to increased effort of local nations to capture black market spending. Many nations have started demanding all purchases above certain prices to be conducted via bank transfers. This results in the government tax authority to be able to trace the money. A secondary effect is that wives now see this money on the husbands books, making it harder for the man to hide spending cash in clubs.

The situation is very complex and there is not only one reason. Less cash probably not the main reason just have a look at what is happening is Phuket, half of the bars are closed and still a lot of cash everywhere. For me we should not forget that most of the German mongers were looking for extreme sex like pooping, fisting, pissing. This was very easy to get from the German girls in the clubs, today very few German girls, also all the clubs are controlled by the Roumania mafia girls who are providing far lower service than the German one. Romanian girls are giving the less from all the nationalities in the clubs. Also like for Thailand a generation of mongers are now getting too old, or married or. To still be as active as 10 years back and the younger man are less prostitute oriented and use more often Tinder. Fucking bitches is okay for a while but not forever it is at least my opinion, I will just session exceptional beauties, 10 years back I was fucking more or less all kind of girls.

[Optimist]

Polyamorist. I share your heartfelt despair. The hardest thing as a native English speaker is to establish that I should get some respect from the girls. When I initiate contact in English as opposed to (bad) German or Romanian, the reaction is generally worse as it marks me down a a possible rich tourist used to paying inflated prices.

In fact I think I might get better service from a sex robot than from some of these girls who behave without humanity LOL.

[Sirioja]

Pistons,

You've been around the scene for some time and seem quite in tune with local trends. I would like to bump a theory from myself and some local friends that we believe has resulted in lower attendance by locals in clubs as well as a reduction in the amount of sessions per visit. I'm willing to hear from any others regarding the theory as well.

Our theory is that there is less untraced money in the hands of local men due to increased effort of local nations to capture black market spending. Many nations have started demanding all purchases above certain prices to be conducted via bank transfers. This results in the government tax authority to be able to trace the money. A secondary effect is that wives now see this money on the husbands books, making it harder for the man to hide spending cash in clubs.

So Germans and some kind of locals would use FKKs as washing machine for money? Not only World for Hells?

My theory is very different, even I don't like to speak with guys in clubs except a very few, I only drive for beauties, but unfortunately for me I'm too known, so what I'm told is castings are down, I respect you enjoy and try to support a club, and I would really prefer to still write what I wrote 1 year ago because it would mean I have a top girl in this club, 1 is enough and the best for me, then no jealousy problems, but this club is more and more empty, even alcohol back, because of casting going down since end of 2017, if you look for beauties with real GFE behavior, it has been but not the good place at the moment if you don't want GND land. Even GT which is number 1 in NRW is average casting on 2018. Oase is also so average for looks, I don t even try anymore World where I had so pretty girls and the most perfect for look care in my whole life, I tasted her everywhere for our many rooms, sometimes 3 rooms on same Saturday, for 1 year, and she gave me my dream when she returned from her Easter 2015 . The only wow girl seen in whole Germany on 2018 , except my exceptional German escort, was at Sharks on mid June, but didn't want to stay in FKK land. A pretty girl also met at Mainhattan on beginning of June, great in bed but so complicated with her. 2 attractive girls met at YY, Fabienne and Geisha. This, working hard every week ends, not being stuck to only 1 club. Only good casting seen was at Sharks on mid June and I was surprised how business was slow for most of girls, even sexy Elen seen waiting for long time, sitting at the bar, even she is a Asians specialist.

I don't know about washing money, my money from working hard doesn't need, I know what worth my money and my behavior with women, so I don't want to pay for girls who are not pretty enough to be my GF in real life, or are not respectful.

For sure, I know Germans use brothels as bar / restaurant to meet other guys, to make saunas, to be massaged, to take sun, to watch football. Many dont give business to girls, like in your favorite club, when I give business when I succeed to find a beauty, and then I work to make her become enjoyable, to repeat with her. I drive for this.

Only my subjective theory of course, from a very different guy who only wants beauties.

[HeyyyyyyPaul]

Ok so I have my itinerary planned, what do you guys think? I have a car so no problems getting around.

Thursday: Babylon.

Friday: Acapulco (or dolce vita?

Saturday: World (or Sharks?

Sunday: Goldentime and maybe Living Room.

Monday: Samya.

I did Sharks before and loved it, I'm thinking of giving world a try! Or is it really bad?

Is there anywhere better in that area on a Friday?

Thanks for all the advice! What is YY and PHG? Will samya be good enough on a Monday?

FYI I had the midnight pizza at LR before, it's just cold hard crisp pizza they leave lying around. But when there is a cook it's very good food.

The best thing about a place like samya is the club atmosphere on a weekend. I suggest you go there on a Saturday night.

[BaltiX]

Hadn't considered increased scrutiny of cash transactions and taxes as a cause for decreased FKK attendance. This theory makes sense for Germans and Italians who have been slow to go cashless, but have been inching toward it the last five years. Germany would be the biggest category of mongers. However, some of the main nationalities represented at FKKs have been quite cashless for a while: https://gomedici.com/which-countries-are-close-to-a-cashless-world/

But I can throw in another technology-related observation: smartphones and 4G networks. Nowadays if the wife or GF is away on business or visiting her parents, she might expect you to video chat. She may want to see your face. What if you are supposed to be at home, but she cannot see the walls of your living room in the background? Level of impact may be different depending on age demographic. This technology may have not penetrated the 50-70 age monger demographic. But the tech-savvy younger mongers, or mongers with younger significant others will see greater impact.

Cash is still popular in Germany IIRC. I don't think governments care much about cash transactions unless it's somewhere in thousands. As for video chats on smartphones a person can always make an excuse for not answering such as phone being turn off. Nothing new really.

[Der Auslander]

I thought English was supposed to be the smart language, the international language. How did it become the you-must-be-a-dumbass language?

I used to think it was a smart language too but lately I have been reading some of the more recent posts on this Board and now I'm not so sure!

[Polyamorist]

Yes indeed, I may be a jaded curmudgeon. But I don't live in dreamland or is that the USA where you dream about sex in other peoples countries because you have wrecked your own! In fact the US is so pussy whipped that websites such as this cannot even be hosted in the country and have to be based in Europe.

Yesterday I was introduced to a new term for baby kisses: "American kissing". As in, "When I said I liked kissing I meant American kissing, not French kissing".

I cancelled the session and was not charged. But I still felt depressed. I kept thinking, "Maybe I shouldn't have spoken to her in English. If I'd stayed talking French or German, she wouldn't have treated me that way".

I thought English was supposed to be the smart language, the international language. How did it become the you-must-be-a-dumbass language? I even see this in the Arab world. You need to speak French to be taken seriously.

In the FKKs what is happening is that the girls are evolving different routines for locals and non-locals. I consider this a form of discriminatory racism, and I blame the FKK managements for allowing it. For now what I find I must do to get good service is act as much as possible like a local. But still, sometimes I will arrive at a room with a girl and get the stupid upselling routines and realize I have been conflated with the dumb tourists.

[Smoke Light]

But I can throw in another technology-related observation: smartphones and 4G networks. Nowadays if the wife or GF is away on business or visiting her parents, she might expect you to video chat. She may want to see your face. What if you are supposed to be at home, but she cannot see the walls of your living room in the background?

That's simple: decorate your living room like FKK Living Room, don't forget James Bond picture like the one behind the reception desk.

Actually, tourist mongers have the same problem: wives calling and wanting to video chat in the evening when your are likely to be just going to your second zimmer of the evening. I tell wife I was reading a book and fell asleep, and left the phone in the car LOL.

[Pistons]

Pistons,

You've been around the scene for some time and seem quite in tune with local trends. I would like to bump a theory from myself and some local friends that we believe has resulted in lower attendance by locals in clubs as well as a reduction in the amount of sessions per visit. I'm willing to hear from any others regarding the theory as well.

Our theory is that there is less untraced money in the hands of local men due to increased effort of local nations to capture black market spending. Many nations have started demanding all purchases above certain prices to be conducted via bank transfers. This results in the government tax authority to be able to trace the money. A secondary effect is that wives now see this money on the husbands books, making it harder for the man to hide spending cash in clubs.

I don't know. Can't they all just use ATM's like before? A second banking account and in some cases transfer through Paypal or something to a secret account to hide from wife? You pay with cash anyway. And what purchase can be traced above a certain amount then?

Unless you have interviewed a local who has this problem, it still seems like a far fetched theory to me.

If you have wives who oogle that much on your finances, you might as well break up due to lack of trust? I have read stories claiming 60% of men and women in relationships hide away money from their partners anyway. And just as much the women as men.

[McAdonis]

Somehow I think I'm the only one who read McA's report and understand it the way I do. My understanding is that the foreign Bears from the US and Asia will continue to fly in until the price in FKK / Sauna Clubs in Germany hits the 250 mark. If that time arrives it's more economical to search elsewhere and less tourists will be found.

Yes, this is what I intended to convey. Each nation has a paid sex scene that varies based on price / quality / availability. Also each nation has different travel costs, travel times, and sometimes exchange rates that need to be taken into consideration when visiting German FKK. So they would each have different price points where it makes sense for them to (a) cut back on FKK, (b) monger closer to home or (c) switch to alternative countries or mediums (escort, RLD).

I would like to bump a theory from myself and some local friends that we believe has resulted in lower attendance by locals in clubs as well as a reduction in the amount of sessions per visit. I'm willing to hear from any others regarding the theory as well.

Our theory is that there is less untraced money in the hands of local men due to increased effort of local nations to capture black market spending. Many nations have started demanding all purchases above certain prices to be conducted via bank transfers. This results in the government tax authority to be able to trace the money. A secondary effect is that wives now see this money on the husbands books, making it harder for the man to hide spending cash in clubs.

Hadn't considered increased scrutiny of cash transactions and taxes as a cause for decreased FKK attendance. This theory makes sense for Germans and Italians who have been slow to go cashless, but have been inching toward it the last five years. Germany would be the biggest category of mongers. However, some of the main nationalities represented at FKKs have been quite cashless for a while: https://gomedici.com/which-countries-are-close-to-a-cashless-world/

But I can throw in another technology-related observation: smartphones and 4G networks. Nowadays if the wife or GF is away on business or visiting her parents, she might expect you to video chat. She may want to see your face. What if you are supposed to be at home, but she cannot see the walls of your living room in the background? Level of impact may be different depending on age demographic. This technology may have not penetrated the 50-70 age monger demographic. But the tech-savvy younger mongers, or mongers with younger significant others will see greater impact.

[Chongmal]

The limit for most of the rest of Europe to travel to FKK's is at around the price level of Wellcum: entry 85 and 70 for half an hour. And at that level lineup needs to be heavy strong with lots of good options, fantastic food, great management and absolutely no upselling. Those are the limits I have calculated. Although a smarter price would be 70/30 min and 120/1 HR. Otherwise nobody will go for the 1 HR rooms unless stupid. Or 70 e entry, and they could up it to 75/30 min and 130/1 HR. Anything less, or with higher prices, and other hobbies / destinations becomes superior in a heartbeat for any European not living within a 1.30 HR driving range.

Pistons,

You've been around the scene for some time and seem quite in tune with local trends. I would like to bump a theory from myself and some local friends that we believe has resulted in lower attendance by locals in clubs as well as a reduction in the amount of sessions per visit. I'm willing to hear from any others regarding the theory as well.

Our theory is that there is less untraced money in the hands of local men due to increased effort of local nations to capture black market spending. Many nations have started demanding all purchases above certain prices to be conducted via bank transfers. This results in the government tax authority to be able to trace the money. A secondary effect is that wives now see this money on the husbands books, making it harder for the man to hide spending cash in clubs.

[Chongmal]

There is a big difference between 150/ HR and 250/ HR. The former is already here -- well almost; at least some Oase girls will not even agree to DFK etc in a 100 E60 M and I wrote up my own mea culpa about how I contributed to price destruction in my session with Adele. Granted 150/ HR is not common yet, but with some guys tipping the effective price with all goodies included is definitely more than 100 an HR.

250/ HR is something else. I don't have any hard numbers to back me up but I would think that would stop a lot of fly in tourists from US (and perhaps Asia). Those who are still passing through DE might take a few hours off and get in a quick fuck or two. But one characteristic that marks a lot of fly in sex tourists is that in a few days they take several sessions. 20 sessions in 5 days at 250 an hour could be a minimum of 2500 E if all of them half HR, and 5000 or more with extras. Of course the fly in tourist can cut down his sessions to just 10 in 5 days, but then he would feel like the fixed costs of airfare and hotel etc were not fully amortized.

However, I don't think the price rises to 250/ HR anytime soon. To me, the prices (averaged over sufficient number of sessions) seem to be rising somewhat gradually and not at several orders of magnitude faster than local inflation. I will leave to the experts if that is true or not.

Somehow I think I'm the only one who read McA's report and understand it the way I do. My understanding is that the foreign Bears from the US and Asia will continue to fly in until the price in FKK / Sauna Clubs in Germany hits the €250 mark. If that time arrives it's more economical to search elsewhere and less tourists will be found.

[Member #4581]

There is a big difference between 150/ HR and 250/ HR. The former is already here -- well almost; at least some Oase girls will not even agree to DFK etc in a 100 E60 M and I wrote up my own mea culpa about how I contributed to price destruction in my session with Adele. Granted 150/ HR is not common yet, but with some guys tipping the effective price with all goodies included is definitely more than 100 an HR.

250/ HR is something else. I don't have any hard numbers to back me up but I would think that would stop a lot of fly in tourists from US (and perhaps Asia). Those who are still passing through DE might take a few hours off and get in a quick fuck or two. But one characteristic that marks a lot of fly in sex tourists is that in a few days they take several sessions. 20 sessions in 5 days at 250 an hour could be a minimum of 2500 E if all of them half HR, and 5000 or more with extras. Of course the fly in tourist can cut down his sessions to just 10 in 5 days, but then he would feel like the fixed costs of airfare and hotel etc were not fully amortized.

However, I don't think the price rises to 250/ HR anytime soon. To me, the prices (averaged over sufficient number of sessions) seem to be rising somewhat gradually and not at several orders of magnitude faster than local inflation. I will leave to the experts if that is true or not.