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  1. #46860

    An Octogenarian on the Prowl in Medellin.

    This is the second of three posts. See "The Sex Life of a Geezer" (posted yesterday) in which I shared how at least one 80-year old is faring in the sack as his testosterone and sex drive ebbs and flows (heavy on the "ebb" In this second post, I recap my overall impressions of Medellin as my preferred mongering venue. I'm posting now, because I've just completed a three month stay in Paisa PussyLand (my third such sojourn) and am feeling some obligation to contribute at length, given how much I've benefitted from other BM posts in negotiating the Happy Hunting Grounds of Parque Lleras, El Centro, and the plethora of local casas, spas, and nightclubs.

    By way of background, as someone now semi-retired, about six years ago I began trying out different Latin American cities (Puebla in Mexico, San Juan in Costa Rica, Sosua in the DR, Cartagena, Bogota, Quito, Buenos Aires) as venues for sitting out the dreariest winter months in Hometown USA. I spent several weeks in Medellin for the first time early in 2019, and soon settled on this Ciudad de Eterna Primavera as the destination of choice (based on a combination of climate, tennis facilities, culture, overall ambiance, and, needless to say, mongering opportunities). I say this despite the fact that Medellin (with the one, gouge-the-gringo, exception of "Your greenbacks, please" Gustos) lacks my favorite form of venue for scouting the ladies: that is, a relatively crowded bar or discotheque, populated with independent, working girls and semi-pros (not necessarily exclusively—as often as not also with couples / friends out for a good time as well). A place where one can readily check the talent out (especially their dance floor moves), but that also has a quiet spot (such as Gusto's balcony or, better yet, an outdoor patio) where one can have a normal conversation removed from mega-decibel music. A while ago, I spent a couple of years working in Nairobi, Kenya and Kampala, Uganda--cities that each boasted a number of such clubs from the upscale to the raw and raunchy.

    Also, as additional preface, a few words on how I roll. Per my prior post, at my advanced age, I'm only game for sex 2 to 3 times per week (one shot per session), which inclines me to patiently seek out the chica superstars rather than to spring for the "doable". On arriving in a new city for an extended stay, my aim is to accrue a rotating stable of at least four to six "keepers", while leaving time to freshen up the talent pool, and, in the process, to enjoy the never-grows-old, turn- on of novel, first-time encounters in the sack.

    As some of you may deduce from my user name, I'm definitely of the "to each his own" school when it comes to our hobby. I respect both those who have the patience to screen chicas through Facebook and SA, and those who habituate El Centro, happily pulling any number of "doable" chicas a day (12 by one dubious BM's account), with far less obsession than me with culling for beauty and some (admittedly very subjective, and at times, delusional) sense of chemistry.

    As for myself I much prefer to check the talent out face-to-face for both the looks and overt sexuality increasingly needed to get my aging juices flowing (I. E. To get it up and keep it up)—a highly selective (and subjective) threshold to be sure. In respect to looks: at least an 8 --by my strict calibration that reserves 10's for the once-in-a-lifetime, if you're so lucky, encounter with a young Sophia Loren / Catherine Deneuve (I'm dating myself with these examples), a 9 for a gal boasting some genuine, cover-girl model / starlet potential, and an 8 for the hottest girl in your high-school class, or close, say the captain of the cheerleader squad. By this standard, I've yet to spot a genuine 10 in Medellin, but have found a rare 9 and usually a couple of 8's at the upper-end strip clubs or Gustos, an 8 or two at most in the best of the casas / spas during some but not all visits, and an occasional 7 (and just maybe a rare 8) while making laps in El Centro--though I haven't given up on finding a true hidden, diamond-in-the rough loitering about in Plaza Botero or one of the down and dirty bars off of Raudal. In the recent (June 9th) exchange here on this subject, I'm in basic agreement with Vitrea and Colombia Lover, but perhaps a bit more generous in my ratings than the super-severe M Sanchez. And all hats off to those better human beings among the BMs here who are less obsessed with physical beauty and would never think of assigning a rating number to the women in their live.

    In respect to personality, in addition to Latina warmth and vivacity (much truth in the stereotype), I'm most turned on by ladies who have confidence in their sexual attractiveness, who genuinely enjoy a little, good-humored, flirtatious banter, and, to some extent, seem to get off on their power to turn guys on (the stars of the strip club stage, or the bar girl, who, over an introductory drink, volunteers a prolonged lap dance or fondles your groin under the table) as well as those that pelvic dance in place even when a club is half deserted and no one is looking. In my experience, these qualities (admittedly somewhat on the sluttish side) promise more proactive inventiveness in the sack than the more demure, girl-next-door personae and looks some BM prefer. A further screening criteria of mine for a "keeper" is genuine GFE service -- for those familiar with The Erotic Review (***) rating system, an 8 or 9 by ***'s performance scale. Most importantly for me (when deciding on a "keeper" enthusiastic DFK and FIV (old-fashioned, making out), skillful / prolonged mamada natural (BBBJ), and responsiveness to DATY (vocal enjoyment, pussy juices flowing / orgasms--or at least convincing imitations of ones).

    Given the above, here in Medellin, the strip clubs (despite their deserved reputation as clip joints) have proven to be my most productive hunting ground: the chance to spot the occasional, standout, acrobat / twerker of the on-stage, strip pole routine, the opportunity to chat the ladies up at leisure, the bare midriff outfits that allow one to screen for baby damage and muscle tone. If instead, I'm looking to pick someone up in Parque Lleras or El Centro, I'll find a park bench for a chat or take them to someplace nearby for a beer, before deciding whether to head for a hotel or collect a WhatsApp contact. And, as I wrote in a post here some time ago, at the casas I've found the mamasans willing to let me chat in private with whatever girl I pick from the line-up, before I commit to time together in a room.

    Unlike some posters, I prefer to get agreement on price and services upfront. But, when doing so, I always first try to establish some rapport (get them laughing, lay on a little flattery) and then mention the need for GFE as "una experiencia carinoso and descansado en la cama" before adding in that this includes DFK / BBBJ as part of the package. "Es posible contigo?" Then, depending on the vibe, I may throw in the possibility of a good propina (no promises) if we have a genuine "trato de novia" (GFE) and dangle the prospect of repeat visits to my apartment (no split fee with club / casa). Explicit up charges for BBBJ, etc. Annoy me, but I overlook them, recognizing that, especially in the clubs and casas, this may be the manager's Standard Operating Procedure, not the chica's personal style of doing business.

    Despite my screening interviews, a few of the trial-run fuck sessions in the clubs and casas have proved to be a bust—too mechanical in the sack or, on disrobing, excess poundage / baby damage revealed. One casa chica (at Amigas Sexy) performed to my "keeper" expectations but lacked the cedulla required by my building's management. However, in recruiting "keepers" for multiple repeats, I'm batting 1,000 on ladies that I've opted to have come visit me for a more leisurely visit in my apartment after a tryout tumble in a casa or club, or at least following on a relaxed, private chat--admittedly a success rate that's much easier to achieve if you're not trying to get laid multiple times a day.

    When I left Medellin a few days ago, I had an active stable of five ladies who visited my apartment on a rotating basis (only the names have been changed to protect the not-so-innocent): whyésica, a Venezuelan, found on the strip stage in Conejitos (Playmate Bar Show) in El Centro one weekday at 5 pm, back in 2020; Valentina, an Afro-Colombiano from the Pacific coast, met in Club Luna Lunera, also early last year; Stefani, picked up in Parque Lleras with a try-out tumble in nearby Hotel Olympia; Cristal, a lone standout from the line-up one morning at casa Zandalay; and Serena, auditioned during a curfew day when Luna Lunera was operating as a casa on the second floor with the nightclub darkened below.

    Each of these ladies rates a solid 8 on the above scale for looks (in one case perhaps a 9) while using make-up sparingly, and each provides an inventive, enthusiastic GFE; three (to my surprise) after some patient DATY on the first or second date, slipped me in bareback without being asked; one of the others (compared to almost any woman I've known, pro or non-pro) is nympho-level intense on her own pleasure in addition to mine (exploding multiple-times in DATY, eagerly massaging her clit to climax throughout our sessions, and on occasion, fingering-on after I've come and am just a rapt spectator to her multiple orgasms); and, three of the five are lively conversationalists with whom I enjoy hanging out (up to a point—there's some wisdom in the cynical adage, "We pay them to leave".

    My payments to them per session vary between 200 to 300 k pesos each (including transportation) for no clock-watching sessions of 1.5 to 3 hours—perhaps in some cases 50 k more than could have been obtained by more patient back and forth negotiation. When I first returned to the US in March, 2020, as the pandemic took hold and I had cancelled farewell sessions with my then two favorite chicas (Yésica and Valentina), I sent them each an unsolicited 200 k to help them out. Predictably, they tried to hit me up again for repeat, Western Union transfers premised on poignant sob stories (contradicted by WhatsApp photos of their reportedly, near starvation selves, looking fit and toned in fancy new outfits). But, even though I refused more financial help, they continued to provide me with lively sex shows via WhatsApp video from time to time until I returned to Medellin in February of this year.

    With all of the above by way of an (overlong?) prologue, my third post, to follow (tomorrow? Will provide my personal take on the main mongering venues in town: the Mansion, Gustos, the strip clubs, the casas, and two major streetwalker locations—Parque Lleras and El Centro.

  2. #46859

    Farewell To Colombia

    I arrived the middle of last month, and am departing today.

    Almost a month of bliss, spending long weekends with my Tomboy at the beach and in the mountains, and during the week banging all my darlings in El Centro.

    Got to go with about ten different girls from my past forays in El Centro, and did some new ones as well.

    Mind blowing how many Chicas are available there with so many new ones showing up everyday.

    Life is good, and hopefully I will be back in about three weeks.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails m2.jpg‎   m4.jpg‎  

  3. #46858

    Backdoor Man

    Quote Originally Posted by MarquisdeSade1  [View Original Post]
    If you want to try some intense sex that will give incredibly intense orgasms.

    Find a hot 18-20 yo that wants to learn bareback anal sex, its incredible, I've never met chicas that love anal sex more than Colombianas (best orgasms I've ever experienced, Ill be 54 soon).
    I guess your what they call a "backdoor man", reminds me of the Rolling Stones song from about 50 years ago.

    So being the newbie I am with no back door expereince under my belt, is the rear door really better than the front door.

    Is it tighter and wetter, or perhaps something else that I don't want to know about.

    Surely you jest in proposing bareback anal sex!

  4. #46857
    Quote Originally Posted by NilAdmirari  [View Original Post]
    Perhaps the main, bummer symptom of aging, has been a noticeable decline in the intensity of orgasm and, especially, the amount of come, if any ("poca leche", in the parlance of Latinas). When with a hot chick who's gotten me highly aroused during foreplay, I sometimes feel that, if I wished to let go, I could climax early in the session, either while she's giving BBBJ or when we first start fucking. However, if (as I almost always do) I hold off for more than five to ten minutes, then many times I couldn't climax inside her even if I would want to, and instead need to finish with BBBJ / CIM or a good, lubed-up HJ. (Still, what's not to like?) On a few occasions, even that hasn't gotten me over the finish line, and I have had to jerk myself off while having my partner show me some pink and masturbate herself (for me a real turn-on).
    I love the honesty in the post. Every once in a while, you read something on line that you swear is not going to work, but it does. Anyway, a guy on line was saying that celery and fresh veggies gave him mucho leche, much cum. He posted that he juiced celery on his own, but I am a lazy fuck in the kitchen, found Celery juice on Amazon, and tried it. It worked. The volume of cum like tripled. So I bought a few cases. My mother was over one time and remarked on the quantities of celery juice I had and asked why I had it, and I said, "Uh, I like the taste, mom. ".

    I had done my fair share of pounding in Mexico and was poca leche too but had no celery juice at hand. I bought some Clamato and V8 to see if it worked the same, and it did and was cheaper to boot. Everyone I have told has had similar results. The irony is that some have made improvements. Celery juice on ice was my first improvement. Then someone got the V8, low sodium for health purposes donchaknow, and mixed it with Diet Sprite. Again, this makes the V8 go from vomit inducing to tolerable.

    The irony is that I could not find V8 or Clamato in Colombia even at the big grocery stores. I had to call room service one time and asked if they could do a veggie juice or jugo verde, and they did. I think it was $5 a glass but I was desperate; I had an all nighter, and it was worth it.

    Maybe if someone on here could get a stable supplier of veggie juice it would be helpful. I do not know why it is so damned hard to find in Colombia.

  5. #46856

    Appreciate the unabashed honesty

    Quote Originally Posted by NilAdmirari  [View Original Post]
    I'm writing this post as a certifiable, unabashed Dirty Old Man.
    There are two kinds of younger adult girls, those who like older men (daddy issues) and those who don't. In the states, early in the first conversation with a younger girl I will ask her what her relationship was like with her parents, emphasizing the paternal side. When she starts talking about a dysfunctional, broken home with an absent father, I know I am half-way home before I even get started, jajaja. Not pretty, but true. If I've had a few drinks first I will sometimes cut the chase and open with, "Are there any unresolved daddy issues I can help you with?" Jajaja. That is also one of the side effects of dating and mongering in Medellin. I don't like to waste any time on the formalities.

    In Colombia, it's easy enough to find girls with a genuine affection for someone old enough to be their father or older, and pass on the others. Or not worry about it. But if I don't get the vibe or a signal that she's into me, then I quickly move on.

    Silky sent me the foto of her in the bikini yesterday, she probably sent it out to a 100 Gringos. She is looking great. Her bathing suit top is too small and upside down, but I am not complaining. I love fucking this chica. The rest of the fotos are repeats I took from earlier this year. She will be one of the first five girls I fuck when I arrive. Super clean with a pudding pussy, soft and silky inside and out. And a sweet, soft personality to match.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Silky prone in bed.jpg‎   Silky breasts.jpg‎   Silky pussy.jpg‎   Silky spread ass.jpg‎   Silky butt up, finger in.jpg‎  

    Silky inked.jpg‎  

  6. #46855

    4 x1000 tax (0. 4%) on local bank transactions / transfers

    Taxation without representation! This post mainly applies to people who have or planning to have local Colombian bank accounts (Bancolombia, BBVA, Davivienda, etc) or those thinking of buying property here or perform any local bank transactions. Basically, there's this tax they call 4 x1000, which is essentially 0. 4%. It's a government tax and they take 0. 4% on many types of bank transactions done with local bank accounts, including withdrawing money from an ATM. They take 4 pesos for every 1,000 pesos. You can be exempt from this when you open an account, just make sure to ask for it. Only one account can be exempt, trust me the fees add up. Also, I didn't realize my $80 k USD transfer from my Alianza account to the seller's Bancolombia account was subject to this fucking tax! So I had to pay little over 1 million pesos (about $320 USD). There's also a way to avoid this, but I found out too late. It's not as much about the money as it is the principle. Just always ask your local account manager regarding avoiding paying this tax. Hopefully, I saved some future mongers who plan to move or live in Colombia some coin.

  7. #46854
    Quote Originally Posted by mojobandit  [View Original Post]
    are they still required online immigration form?
    Yes. Still required even to exit.

  8. #46853
    Quote Originally Posted by NilAdmirari  [View Original Post]
    I'm writing this post as a certifiable, unabashed Dirty Old Man and then some (just celebrated the big 80)....
    I want to be like you when I grow up.

  9. #46852

    Great post!

    Quote Originally Posted by NilAdmirari  [View Original Post]
    I'm writing this post as a certifiable, unabashed Dirty Old Man and then some (just celebrated the big 80) in the expectation that any other mongers out there in my advanced age cohort may enjoy comparing experiences, and that this account may also prove of some interest to those of you relatively younger honchos who may be wondering how long you'll be able to keep it up (literally and figuratively). I'll be following this post up with another two that chronicle my experiences in Medellin in happy pursuit of the Pussy Paisa. (Perhaps this first post might better belong in a more general I. S. G. Thread, put I'm uploading it here because Medellin for now remains my monger destination of choice: I've just concluded a third, annual visit, and, for the most part, I limit my own I. S. G. Perusals to this Medellin thread.)..
    I appreciate your candor and telling us about these experiences. I hope to be fucking hotties when I am 80! Heck, I hope to just make it to 80! Hell, I'd be happy with 60 at this point LOL.

    May us all have threesomes until well into our 90's!

  10. #46851
    Quote Originally Posted by MojoBandit  [View Original Post]
    Are they still required online Immigration Form?
    Yes, although Delta in Atlanta was the only one who asked about it.

    There have been some changes to the form. You can now fill it out up to 48 hours before. It also asks if you're vaccinated, along with several other questions. Still is pretty quick and easy to do.

  11. #46850

    Your An Inspiration

    Quote Originally Posted by NilAdmirari  [View Original Post]
    No doubt some working girls welcome ancient guys like me as clients, expecting an easy pay-day for a minimal pounding. In this I like to think that any such providers who've frolicked with me have returned home disappointed.I hope that on balance this candid chronicle encourages, more than it may bum out, you younger studs as you contemplate the decades aheadand some inevitable decline in libido.
    I don't think any thing you have written will bum anyone out. There's a lot of younger whipper snappers on this board whom which you refer to as younger studs that don't nearly have the sex drive you do at half of your age, and some whom think that sex ends after 60. I have a friend of mine here in Medellin who is 75 and has reported some of what you described as you age, and he is in El Centro frequently, and has no problem getting young women to service him. And sounds like you are still administering poundings albeit you may not think so. Continue with the chronicles!

  12. #46849

    Amazing post

    Quote Originally Posted by NilAdmirari  [View Original Post]
    I'm writing this post as a certifiable, unabashed Dirty Old Man and then some (just celebrated the big 80) in the expectation that any other mongers out there in my advanced age cohort may enjoy comparing experiences, and that this account may also prove of some interest to those of you relatively younger honchos who may be wondering how long you'll be able to keep it up (literally and figuratively). I'll be following this post up with another two that chronicle my experiences in Medellin in happy pursuit of the Pussy Paisa. (Perhaps this first post might better belong in a more general I. S. G. Thread, put I'm uploading it here because Medellin for now remains my monger destination of choice: I've just concluded a third, annual visit, and, for the most part, I limit my own I. S. G. Perusals to this Medellin thread.).

    By way of preface, I'm someone fortunate to still be in relatively good physical / mental shape for an octogenarian: (no daily medications; regular exercisemountain hiking, singles tennis; still working a bit part-time). In respect to my sex life: On getting divorced about 15 plus years ago after a three-decade plus (and faithful on my part; perhaps on hers) marriage to a much younger woman, I soon came to the realization that, on the one hand, I couldn't get turned on by the prospect of sex with a woman of "appropriate age" (I. E. Someone likely to consider me as either mating or hook-up material) and, on the other hand, was unlikely to score with any hot, younger chick (given that I wasn't mega-rich and / or a gray-at-the-temples, Cary Grant look alike). On accepting this reality, I took up our monger hobby in my sixties, and, soon after discovering the rich resources of ISG and The Erotic Review, was happily off and humping.

    So, to cut to the chase, the answers to three questions you might have if we met for drinks: at my age, "How often?" and "For how long at one go"? And does my advanced age pose a problem in finding hot chicas to share my bed, even if on a P4P basis?

    First, the "How often?" query: When in countries where the price of P4 P is not a constraint (e. G. Africa or Latin America; I haven't been in the Far East since my youth), I'll usually have paid sex two to three times a week. I imagine that, if I wished, I could indulge more frequently. I say this with some confidence, since, when back in hometown USA (where I only spring for escorts once or twice a month), I will jerk-off to quality porn for several days in a row. And, on rare occasion (albeit, more just to see if I still can get it up and orgasm, rather than out of any strong urge to do so) will spank the monkey 2 or 3 times in one day, or late one night / early morning the next. As perhaps another confirmation that all the moving parts remain in good working order: more often than not, I still wake up sporting rock-hard, morning wood. That said, I feel more confident about being able to perform if I've had a day or two off between sessions, and am leery of hooking up two days in a row. And have long been a one pop / session guy.

    Moving on to Question # 2: "How Long at One Go? Increasingly, I find that I have to be really turned on to be able to perform. I'm patient in screening chicas in advance, and, happily, over the years, have become quite adept at finding girls that meet my expectations in the sack. (More on this in my next post.).

    I now almost always pop a blue pill (or the "weekender") in advance, but perhaps doing so is just a psychological crutch (much like the feather that Dumbo clutched in his trunk before taking flight), rather than a necessity for getting it on. Hard to say, since I haven't indulged in sex for some time now without first priming the pump with a generic Viagra or Cialis.

    Assuming a hot-looking partner and good sensual chemistry, I have no problem getting a solid boner and spending somewhere from 45 minutes to an hour and a half in the sack: foreplay (making out, FIP, BBBJ, DATY), banging away for say half that time, and most often finishing off with HJ or CIM. That said, except for sessions with the hottest providers, I'll often find myself going limp once or twice during the proceedings, and in need of some restorative head or HJ attention before continuing on. Most often, this may happen if I'm giving more than 10 or so minutes of DATY (especially if the lady's not particularly vocal and responsive) and / or during sex with a condom. (Condoms are increasingly my main bug-a-boo). The times that I have risked going bareback (or had a partner pre-tested for STDs) I generally have had no trouble keeping erect and pounding away, non-stop, for as long as 30 minutes.

    Perhaps the main, bummer symptom of aging, has been a noticeable decline in the intensity of orgasm and, especially, the amount of come, if any ("poca leche", in the parlance of Latinas). When with a hot chick who's gotten me highly aroused during foreplay, I sometimes feel that, if I wished to let go, I could climax early in the session, either while she's giving BBBJ or when we first start fucking. However, if (as I almost always do) I hold off for more than five to ten minutes, then many times I couldn't climax inside her even if I would want to, and instead need to finish with BBBJ / CIM or a good, lubed-up HJ. (Still, what's not to like?) On a few occasions, even that hasn't gotten me over the finish line, and I have had to jerk myself off while having my partner show me some pink and masturbate herself (for me a real turn-on).

    One final question / answer. Have I been turned down by working girls based on my age? Never overtly, but a few times girls at Gustos or strip clubs have been disinterested when approached, and no doubt in some instances this has been due to my obvious age (even if I flatter myself on looking a youthful 69 instead of 80 and counting). But this is the exception--and I certainly can't blame those ladies who do reject me. It still seems miraculous that a hot, 20-year old (with plenty of other clients) can willingly get into sex with a geezer of my ageand, even more of a miracle, that she can then convincingly seem to enjoy itjuices flowing freely and believable big-Os (though, as Jerry Seinfeld learned from Elaine, whoever knows for sure). Viva Colombia and the amorous Paisas!

    When asked my age up front, I usually just evade the question. However, once we've had a good romp in the sack, I'll fess up to my actual age if asked. At that point in a relationship, this candor about my age hasn't seemed to turn anyone off. Perhaps one reason I've avoided on-line (Facebook, SA, SB, Tinder) hookups (other than the time-consuming hassle and my preference for in-person, test drives), is the suspicion that listing my real age would discourage many (perhaps most any) responses, but, at the same time, my not wanting to lie about my age. No doubt some working girls welcome ancient guys like me as clients, expecting an easy pay-day for a minimal pounding. In this I like to think that any such providers who've frolicked with me have returned home disappointed.

    I hope that on balance this candid chronicle encourages, more than it may bum out, you younger studs as you contemplate the decades aheadand some inevitable decline in libido.
    Thanks you so much.

    I hope this can go into the reports of distinction thread #1 post of 2021.

    Post-script.

    If you want to try some intense sex that will give incredibly intense orgasms.

    Find a hot 18-20 yo that wants to learn bareback anal sex, its incredible, I've never met chicas that love anal sex more than Colombianas (best orgasms I've ever experienced, Ill be 54 soon).

    Sorry Mexicanas you've been demoted to #2.

    Again thank you so much!

  13. #46848

    Lol?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kafka  [View Original Post]
    LOL some people like to live on the edge
    Please do tell this adventure " some people "live by, most people would of learned from the first time, would really like to here about his 3 times bad luck, it would help many board members out by knowing not what to do!, is he at the moment working on his 4th time?

  14. #46847
    Quote Originally Posted by SurfLooker  [View Original Post]
    Does she still play? Puta?

    Assuming all her friends are available too?

    https://instagram.com/paz___paz

    Paz_paz.

    https://instagram.com/mavel03

    Mavel03.

    Who else has been around?
    If not into her so do not know her current relationship status but if she ain't got a gringo / foreign boyfriend she is available.

  15. #46846
    LOL some people like to live on the edge

    Quote Originally Posted by RacShack  [View Original Post]
    3 times? Very hard to believe unless maybe Ray Charles touring through Colombia? Please tell his situation each of the three times, it sound be interesting at the least, or is it like when a girl says she only fucked once this month? IE; 1 = 6 kind of math! Please do tell, and I'm not making light of people getting drugged at all, but something not adding up.

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